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Speaker 1: This is Unbreakable with Jay Glacier, a mental health podcast

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Speaker 1: helping you out of the gray and into the blue.

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Speaker 1: Now here's Jay Glacier.

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Speaker 2: Welcome in Unbreakable, a mental health podcast with Jay Glazer.

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Speaker 2: I'm Jay Glazer, and I love to have returning guests

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Speaker 2: because it means we didn't mess up the first time,

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Speaker 2: so we haven't returning gifts here. But before I get

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Speaker 2: into that, I feel like many people. You may be

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Speaker 2: surprised to learn that one in five adults in this

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Speaker 2: country experienced mental illness last year, yet far too many

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Speaker 2: fail to receive the support they need. Carolyn, Behavioral Health

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Speaker 2: is doing something about it. They understand that behavioral health

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Speaker 2: is a key part of all health, delivering compassionate care

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Speaker 2: that treats physical, mental, emotional.

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Speaker 3: And social needs in tandem. Carolyn, behavioral health raising the

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Speaker 3: quality of life through empathy and action.

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Speaker 2: All right, with that, we welcome you into Unbreakable, a

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Speaker 2: mental health podcast.

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Speaker 3: With Jay Glazer.

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Speaker 2: And Today's with Jay Glazier and doctor Michael Travais.

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Speaker 3: And I say it right this.

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Speaker 4: Time, you got it?

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Speaker 3: I did you got me last time?

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Speaker 2: And then listen you're I think I'm probably one of

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Speaker 2: your many friends with ADHD, so easy for me to

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Speaker 2: I mess up my own friends names constantly and I

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Speaker 2: always talk about I said, well, guys, I've been hitting

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Speaker 2: the head a lot. And I don't know if the

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Speaker 2: stat or it's the ADHD or I'm.

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Speaker 3: Just a knucklehead.

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Speaker 2: But I'm so happy to have you on again because

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Speaker 2: I have you on here and it's so funny. You

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Speaker 2: and I've been friends for a long time, and you know,

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Speaker 2: helped coach the Seattle Seahawks and that's how I first

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Speaker 2: met you, John Schneider and Pete Carroll and you just

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Speaker 2: came out with your first written book, which blew my

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Speaker 2: mind and it was falled right, the first rule of mastery,

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Speaker 2: Stop worrying about what people think of you, and man,

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Speaker 2: I want to dive into this with you.

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Speaker 4: Appreciate you, Jay. It's fun to be here with you.

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Speaker 4: And I think when when folks get names wrong or whatever, like,

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Speaker 4: I know that feeling. At the same time, it's only

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Speaker 4: a problem for people to have big egos. It's like,

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Speaker 4: don't you know my name? So I shed that ego

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Speaker 4: stuff long ago. It was too heavy to carry around.

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Speaker 3: No no, but it's bad for me when I'm on TV.

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Speaker 3: And I'm screwing up to someone's name, and you know,

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Speaker 3: it's just and I know the guy's name. I clearly know.

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Speaker 2: This human BIG's name. I covered the NFL. I know

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Speaker 2: that I did it with Puka the other day with the.

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Speaker 3: Kind of name. Yeah yeah, but I clearly know his name.

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Speaker 4: I was introducing Damar de Rosan and we're doing it.

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Speaker 4: We did a panel together on mental health and I

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Speaker 4: couldn't get Derosan out. I said, and you know, and

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Speaker 4: I'm here with Tamar uh uh. There's a lot of audience,

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Speaker 4: like a thousand people, and I just couldn't get the rosa.

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Speaker 3: My god, man. I did that once and to speak engagement.

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Speaker 2: Also when I was somebody and who's a famous actor,

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Speaker 2: and I just had a brain fart and I.

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Speaker 3: Just turned I said, of course everybody.

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Speaker 2: You know him, you know, mister yea, if I did that.

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Speaker 4: Hold on, it's actually a point of anxiety, and it

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Speaker 4: can trigger panic attacks for people in social settings, and

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Speaker 4: so it's an on to We should talk about that

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Speaker 4: because it's an on ramp to pank attacks and anxiety

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Speaker 4: for folks is the tip of the tongue syndrome, or

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Speaker 4: it's on the tip of the tongue, but you can't

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Speaker 4: quite get it out.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I mean here it is. I know exactly

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Speaker 3: what I'm talking about.

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Speaker 2: Also, and I'm just But also I will say this

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Speaker 2: in my defense, my training partners for years are great, so.

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Speaker 3: I haven't hit that. An awful lot I have done

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Speaker 3: on top of that also, so that's my defense. I'm

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Speaker 3: a really good coach.

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Speaker 2: I'm not a very good fighter, so I have gotten

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Speaker 2: my head beating quite a bit, so I could use that.

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Speaker 3: All right, I want to dive into your book here,

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Speaker 3: because man, to even think about this, stop worrying.

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Speaker 2: About what people think of you? How is that even possible?

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Speaker 2: How do we get to listen? I'm you know, I

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Speaker 2: come across I think on TV so a mess.

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Speaker 3: Guy's so confident, But no, I'm.

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Speaker 2: So incredibly insecure me because of course I want people

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Speaker 2: to like me. And I've brought this up in many

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Speaker 2: times in many interviews that and my feelings get hurt easily.

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Speaker 3: So how are you to.

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Speaker 2: Coach me to get myself to stop worrying about what

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Speaker 2: people think of me?

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Speaker 4: Well, let's first, let's open it up just a little bit.

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Speaker 4: And this obsessive worry that we have with how we're

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Speaker 4: doing makes perfect sense when you understand the biology and

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Speaker 4: the development of the brain. And so I'll open that

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Speaker 4: up in just a second. But this obsession that we have,

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Speaker 4: it is one of the great constrictors. It's one of

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Speaker 4: the great mechanisms that we have that keeps us safe

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Speaker 4: but keeps us small. And so it's this fear of

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Speaker 4: rejection and this need for approval that's taking place all

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Speaker 4: the time in real time that is part of the

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Speaker 4: latent filter, this filter right underneath the surface about the

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Speaker 4: choices that you make with words, the ways that you

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Speaker 4: take action. Am I going to be accepted or rejected?

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Speaker 4: Am I going to look stupid? Or are they going

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Speaker 4: to like it? And it sounds like it's not a

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Speaker 4: big deal, but your brain is designed for survival. Two

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Speaker 4: hundred thousand years ago, our ancestry were perfectly fined and

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Speaker 4: skilled at avoiding or running from or hunting. Will the

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Speaker 4: bees and saber two tickers, and you know, like they

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Speaker 4: figured it out, that's why we're here. But there's another

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Speaker 4: thing that was a real survival threat, and that was

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Speaker 4: if we were going to be kicked out of the tribe.

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Speaker 4: Getting kicked out of the tribe was a near death sentence,

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Speaker 4: and so our ancestry also became highly skilled and they

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Speaker 4: passed that down to us. Is being able to interpret

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Speaker 4: just micro expressions, am I in the center or am

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Speaker 4: I getting kicked out of the tribe? And come to

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Speaker 4: find out, it's not talked about very often, but it

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Speaker 4: is one of the great restrictors, constrictors of your potential

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Speaker 4: because people are playing it safe to belong, and that's

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Speaker 4: what the tribe requires, belonging, play by the rules, authenticity,

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Speaker 4: getting to the edge, going and pushing limits. We don't

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Speaker 4: need that, not unless you've been knighted, or unless you've

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Speaker 4: been crowned to do that. So and there is no

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Speaker 4: real formal crowning or nighting for most people. So what

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Speaker 4: most of us are trying to do is follow the

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Speaker 4: dictum of the brain fit in belong, be safe, have approval,

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Speaker 4: don't screw it up, don't get rejected. And the way

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Speaker 4: through that jay is to make a fundamental commitment which

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Speaker 4: you have, which is to work from the inside out

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Speaker 4: to understand how your thoughts and feelings and emotions work

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Speaker 4: together and how thought, feelings and emotions uniquely yours, impact

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Speaker 4: your performance and impact the way you show up in

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Speaker 4: the world, and until you make that fundamental commitment to

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Speaker 4: work from the inside out, you and I we will

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Speaker 4: be whipped around by the external stressors of the world.

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Speaker 4: And one of the great stressors in modern times is

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Speaker 4: not dark alley. The great stressors are do I belong?

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Speaker 4: Evidence by asking it? Certainly in the West, what is

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Speaker 4: the number one fear for most people? They don't say snakes,

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Speaker 4: they don't say wraths. They say public speaking. Doing your job,

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Speaker 4: basically getting on stage and presenting ideas in front of

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Speaker 4: a live audience is one of the greatest fears. So

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Speaker 4: that means the most dangerous thing are the eyeballs because

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Speaker 4: usually there's not a sniper in row twelve or you know,

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Speaker 4: some sort of stavage in the front row. Like it's

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Speaker 4: it's the eyeballs with people.

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Speaker 3: You know, it's interesting because you're right, like a dark

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Speaker 3: alley for me, sign me the fuck up. I'm good, right,

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Speaker 3: there's nothing wrong with that.

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Speaker 2: But the fear that one of my teammates is upset

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Speaker 2: with me, Yeah, it overwhelms me, even like you and

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Speaker 2: I just talking about it right now is bringing up

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Speaker 2: a ton of anxiety for me.

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Speaker 3: And I was just talking to my fiance rose about.

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Speaker 2: This, and I said, you know, I still create conflict

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Speaker 2: in my in between my own ears, which probably isn't there.

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Speaker 2: So it's it's really what your book is about, right,

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Speaker 2: that anxiety if man, my teammates are upset with me,

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Speaker 2: or I let someone down, or everything I've done in

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Speaker 2: life is wipe clean. You know, I'm going to be

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Speaker 2: judged based on just these two seconds in front of me.

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Speaker 4: That's exactly it. And so there's three phases to what

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Speaker 4: we coined as fauxpo. The great constrictor of view of

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Speaker 4: potential is fear of people's opinions. Right, And in the

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Speaker 4: book we get into the biology and the neurok chemistry

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Speaker 4: and all that kind of mechanical stuff. But here's how

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Speaker 4: FOCO shows up for people. It's like laughing at a

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Speaker 4: joke that you don't really find funny, but you don't

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Speaker 4: want to be the weird one out, you know, holding

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Speaker 4: a cup at a party, like holding a cocktail at

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Speaker 4: a party, even though you don't really want to drink,

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Speaker 4: but you don't want to be the odd one out again,

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Speaker 4: you know, pretending to know a song or a movie

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Speaker 4: that everyone's laughing about or talking about. It shows up

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Speaker 4: in these very slippery ways, pulling out your phone so

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Speaker 4: that you look like you've got something going on or

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Speaker 4: you've got your phone out because you're kind of intimidated

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Speaker 4: to get into the mix with people. And it doesn't

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Speaker 4: mean it's pervasive and it always happens, and you're hold

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Speaker 4: up in your home or your office, it doesn't mean that.

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Speaker 4: It means that there's just this tension about what are

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Speaker 4: they thinking about me? And if you're honest with yourself,

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Speaker 4: it shapes oftentimes the way that you think, the way

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Speaker 4: that you respond, the way that you engage. And I

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Speaker 4: thought I was alone in this. Jay. I didn't know

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Speaker 4: that when I was a kid and growing up like

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Speaker 4: I didn't want to look stupid and I don't want

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Speaker 4: to let people down. Well, that's all about their opinion,

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Speaker 4: and it was changing the way that I was conforming

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Speaker 4: in the world. And then come to find out when

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Speaker 4: I spent time with the lead athletes over the last

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Speaker 4: twenty five years, they've got it too, and they look

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Speaker 4: a certain way you would never think. But when you

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Speaker 4: get just like you're talking about, when you get in

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Speaker 4: a private conversation or an honest conversation, letting people down

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Speaker 4: is a problem nowah, and they don't want to look

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Speaker 4: stupid in front of other people, so they show up

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Speaker 4: and that can lead you to be even one of

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Speaker 4: the greatest in the world. But at what you do,

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Speaker 4: I should say, but there's a hollowness to it because

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Speaker 4: you abandon your first principles and the way that you

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Speaker 4: want to be for the approval or the fear of

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Speaker 4: rejection of other people.

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Speaker 2: I am just to talk of this and what's great

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Speaker 2: about this podcast.

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Speaker 3: I'm having a full blown panic attack right now as we.

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Speaker 4: Speak, So come on, are you just saying that or

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Speaker 4: you feeling it?

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Speaker 3: Good serves.

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Speaker 2: I'm sweating as are all over the place the hardest,

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Speaker 2: you know. It feels like it's jumping out of my chest.

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Speaker 2: So I'm realizing, like, man.

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Speaker 4: Well, hold on, hold on, Jay, you're in good hands.

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Speaker 4: Let's let you want to do something with that.

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Speaker 3: I'm trying to kind of figure it out because I

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Speaker 3: think what made me who I.

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Speaker 5: Am got you to where I was, is I didn't

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Speaker 5: give a fuck what do you want to I was

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Speaker 5: just going right, so I didn't have this fear of rejection,

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Speaker 5: and I was rejected for eleven years trying to get

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Speaker 5: me where I am, and now here we are talking

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Speaker 5: about man, what do people think of me?

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Speaker 3: And it's caused this full blown panic attack? And yeah,

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Speaker 3: I'm kind of.

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Speaker 4: Why do you think that is? Why do you think

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Speaker 4: that you've changed your model? Like, we could deal with

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Speaker 4: your physiological response right now, I could. I could walk

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Speaker 4: you through a handful of tools, you know, the tools,

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Speaker 4: though you got to breathe right now, ye know, and

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Speaker 4: just be right here in this conversation and listen.

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Speaker 2: I'm for the fact that I can have full blown

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Speaker 2: panic attacks and still function now.

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Speaker 4: And even talk about it, and now, right now, I'm

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Speaker 4: proud of it. This is the market leadership, by the way.

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Speaker 4: It's like saying the hard thing when you're in the

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Speaker 4: hard thing, and it's completely honest. This is modern leadership,

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Speaker 4: Jay right here. And but let's just pull out of

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Speaker 4: this for a moment, because you could.

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Speaker 3: Sweat right here on my forehead, like, yeah.

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Speaker 4: So your community, but your community respects you because they

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Speaker 4: know what it's like to be in a panic attack.

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Speaker 4: They know what it's like to have anxiety. And let's

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Speaker 4: just talk about it for a minute. There's two ways

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Speaker 4: to manage a full blown panic attack physiologically and psychologically.

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Speaker 4: So physiologically, you breathe, you come back into your body,

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Speaker 4: you focus your mind on the present moment, and you

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Speaker 4: become tactile, and it's like doing exactly what you're saying, like, oh,

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Speaker 4: it's interesting that I'm sweating. My body's just trying to

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Speaker 4: cool off. So that's the physiological breathing is the big one.

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Speaker 4: And once you have a full blown a panic.

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Speaker 3: If you hear me doing I'm kind of I'm doing it, yes.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, so just for tutorial reasons, it's big breath in

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Speaker 4: through your nose, take an actual sip at the top,

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Speaker 4: and then a long exhale.

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Speaker 3: Yep, yeah, yeah, so I'm doing that as you're talking

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Speaker 3: to me. That's what I'm doing.

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Speaker 4: That's exactly so what I have to say.

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Speaker 3: On Sundays, I do that.

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Speaker 2: When Kurt asked me something, I'll slowly or quickly do

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Speaker 2: it without the world realizing one.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, that's that's all of us are managing this type

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Speaker 4: of it. Not panic attacks necessarily, but anxiousness about how's

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Speaker 4: this going to go? And what sits underneath of it?

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Speaker 4: Is like am I good enough? Am I good enough?

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Speaker 4: In the eyes of others? That's what faux po is

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Speaker 4: that's what the fear of people's opinions is. And then

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Speaker 4: the other thing not to belabor this too much day,

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Speaker 4: but then we start to use our minds. So we

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Speaker 4: talked about the physiological down regulating and by the way,

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Speaker 4: once a panic attack is on, and I know what

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Speaker 4: these feel like as well. For me, it takes like

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Speaker 4: forty five minutes to fully clear the mechanism. So a

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Speaker 4: couple breaths will settle you in, but there's still an

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Speaker 4: agitated state because you've got quarters all in there, you've

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Speaker 4: got adrenaline rolling through you, you've got stuff happening, So

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Speaker 4: it's just you're just trying to manage the edge a

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Speaker 4: little bit, but not return to like this zen. You

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Speaker 4: know that takes time to get to. Then the other

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Speaker 4: side of the psychological side, it is like is that

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Speaker 4: you instead of like what are they going to think

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Speaker 4: of me? You just focus as deeply as you can

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Speaker 4: on the task at hand. You can pick the task

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Speaker 4: at hand, or that you can you can just listen

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Speaker 4: to the unfolding moment around you. So deep focus and

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Speaker 4: breathing are the two and that's the way through panic attacks.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you're right, and it's also it's look, I got

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Speaker 2: a task. I got a job too, and that's all

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Speaker 2: I focus. And at the same time I do tell myself.

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Speaker 2: I convince myself you're safe, you're safe, You're right.

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Speaker 4: That's right here, right now, Let's.

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Speaker 2: Get back to the interesting part of this. The whole

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Speaker 2: thing was triggered on man, what people think of me?

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Speaker 4: Right, and yeah, so why did you have that shift?

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Speaker 4: Why did you go from I don't give a rat's

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Speaker 4: ass to like, man, I think I'm caring.

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Speaker 3: Well, I cared so much grown up.

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Speaker 2: Then it changed in this question of mind to get

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Speaker 2: to where I am. It became I don't give a fuck.

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Speaker 2: I got just that task hand. But I also I

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Speaker 2: had nothing to lose. I was making nine thousand, one

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Speaker 2: hundred and fifty bucks a year. And people sit there

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Speaker 2: and they go, oh, man, once you make it, everything's

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Speaker 2: great and rainbows and you're in court.

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Speaker 3: No no, no, no, Now you have shit to lose.

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Speaker 2: It's totally different. When you have things to lose. That's

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Speaker 2: when the fear really becomes overwhelming.

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Speaker 4: And so yeah, we're talking about it, jack, right, yeah, yeah, right, yeah,

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Speaker 4: that's what happens.

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Speaker 2: You have something to lose, and for me, my job

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Speaker 2: is to be like to respect it.

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Speaker 4: So let me hit that, because that is where that

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Speaker 4: that thinking is what led to even the five minutes

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Speaker 4: ago panicasack. And you're probably feeling a little bit better

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Speaker 4: by now.

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Speaker 3: Yeah I'm a little bit.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I gets talking to you.

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Speaker 3: Which is great, and that's the whole point of Hey,

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Speaker 3: there's why we talk about it. People. If we don't

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Speaker 3: talk about it, we cave in even more. I get

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Speaker 3: talking about it.

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Speaker 2: I'm talking to you all publicly as i'm having and

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Speaker 2: you can even here a wheezing a little bit.

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Speaker 3: I'm having you publicly.

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Speaker 2: I never would have talked about this years ago and

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Speaker 2: never would acknowledge. The fact that I could do this

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Speaker 2: with you makes me feel better. And that's why I

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Speaker 2: want people to open up to each other. So that's

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Speaker 2: how you get through.

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Speaker 4: But Jay, this is freedom. What you're modeling right now

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Speaker 4: is full freedom. Even in the midst of the messy

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Speaker 4: edge that you're feeling right now. This is full freedom

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Speaker 4: because you're naming it in an honest way. You're working

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Speaker 4: from truth and so you're not trying to bend or

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Speaker 4: manipulate reality. You're working from the ground source. And when

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Speaker 4: you do that, you put yourself back in a position

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Speaker 4: of power, which is radical. So the idea that like,

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Speaker 4: because you're a public personality and you're on TV, this

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Speaker 4: idea that I can only stay here if I'm liked

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Speaker 4: is a bit of a poison, and there is some

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Speaker 4: truth to it because if ratings go down, and ratings

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Speaker 4: are basically I'm rating you, I'm critiquing you, and I'm

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Speaker 4: voting with my channel clicker if I'm going to turn

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Speaker 4: off when Jay comes on, well that message is loud

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Speaker 4: and clear to people making decisions to keep you in

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Speaker 4: your position. So there is some truth to it. People's

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Speaker 4: opinions actually materially do matter, okay, But the thing that

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Speaker 4: we're pointing to is that your actual job is to

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Speaker 4: get to the truth, just like you're practicing right now

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Speaker 4: when you're on stage and on air, that you are

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Speaker 4: listening deeply, you're responding with a point of view that

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Speaker 4: unique to you, and you thought deeply about it, or

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Speaker 4: you just let it roll because your body of work

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Speaker 4: speaks for itself, and you've been in this industry for

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Speaker 4: thirty years you understand it. So but it's to be

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Speaker 4: true to oneself. Is the anecdote to the poison. I

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Speaker 4: have to be good enough for them, right, And it

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Speaker 4: sounds easy. I mean, it's rare for a reason, Jay.

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Speaker 3: And this you just write a book on it.

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Speaker 2: By the way, I've sweated through my shirts. I've sweated

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Speaker 2: through my shirt.

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Speaker 4: So now you're going to get Now you're gonna get you.

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Speaker 4: I love this for you, not for me. But so

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Speaker 4: you're you're going to thanks a lot for you. Well,

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Speaker 4: then I'll tell you why, because now we're we're actually

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Speaker 4: to capture this is awesome because it's yeah. So here's

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Speaker 4: the here's the thing is like you can actually work

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Speaker 4: with it right now with somebody that understands it. And

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Speaker 4: so here's what's going to happen.

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Speaker 2: Next.

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Speaker 4: You're going to start to get cold because your temperature

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Speaker 4: has heat it up in such a way your body

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Speaker 4: automatically responded to a sweat, which is to cool you down.

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Speaker 4: And now you're going to start to get just a

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Speaker 4: little cold. And then so that's physiological the psychology. You're

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Speaker 4: going to start to say, should I have mentioned anything?

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Speaker 4: Maybe no one would have noticed, why am I doing this?

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Speaker 4: So it's kind of like the second hit that takes

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Speaker 4: place of doubt for people, or you slide right into like,

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Speaker 4: this is fucking awesome, Like, are you kidding me? I'm

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Speaker 4: the freest dude alive because I'm working from truth. So

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Speaker 4: you get on one of those two trains are familiar

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Speaker 4: trains to people that have had panic attacks. I'd suggest

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Speaker 4: just stay on the train of like I.

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Speaker 3: Am me yeah, and I'm I'm never ashamed of it.

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Speaker 4: That's awesome day.

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Speaker 3: And I actually had a bad day.

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Speaker 2: It was kind of weird, and that's I think my

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Speaker 2: schedule has just kind of been off and kind of whatever.

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Speaker 3: So and you know, this was one of the rare weekends.

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Speaker 2: Actually, halfway through the day, I just told, oh no, man,

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Speaker 2: I'm starting to go in that dark gray. And then

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Speaker 2: I told Terry Bradshaw because that's who the one I

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Speaker 2: learned about it from.

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Speaker 4: So I listened to it and the gray, we talk

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Speaker 4: about the gray.

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Speaker 3: The gray. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, this was a in the middle of Sunday's boxing

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Speaker 2: vile Sunday our day. You know, we're watching football and

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Speaker 2: it couldn't be better. I got my teammates around me

400
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Speaker 2: were laughing.

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Speaker 3: I just had one. It just it just came on

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Speaker 3: and it hit and I was off the air for

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Speaker 3: the rest of the day. I was just man, just hit.

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Speaker 3: But I was able to tell Curtin Terry, which again

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Speaker 3: to talk about right here. So I leaned into it.

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Speaker 3: I didn't run away from it.

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Speaker 2: I'm like, okay, I got to tell these guys and

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Speaker 2: it's a little bit more liberating.

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Speaker 3: But again, let's let's get back to this, this whole

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Speaker 3: thing what you wrote about. By the way, this is

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Speaker 3: about Terry. That's Terry's whole thing.

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Speaker 2: Also, it was always man, he's he has the same

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Speaker 2: fear of being rejected and and oh man, it's gonna

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Speaker 2: be you know, this is my my last year, he says,

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Speaker 2: he said this for thirty years, this will be my

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Speaker 2: last year.

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Speaker 3: I said, also, it's gonna be the it's gonna be it.

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Speaker 3: The sky's always falling.

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Speaker 2: But it's you know, I think, no matter what my

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Speaker 2: insecurity sends and securities, everybody's insecurities are based on the

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Speaker 2: root of exactly what you're.

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Speaker 3: Writing about, of that fear not being liked.

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Speaker 2: So give me your book, Like, give us if I

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Speaker 2: could turn around and teach something to my teammates, Terry

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Speaker 2: and everybody else that I work with right now, give

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Speaker 2: me some bullet points that kind of get us through

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Speaker 2: the art I guess if you will, of being liked

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Speaker 2: and not caring that.

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Speaker 3: What people say about us.

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Speaker 4: Okay, So I'm glad you brought up caring because the

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Speaker 4: subtitle is stop worrying. The subtitle is not stop caring.

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Speaker 4: So people's opinions, Some people's opinions materially matter. So we

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Speaker 4: need to first identify whose opinions matter to you. And

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Speaker 4: for me, I've got a roundtable and it's eight people.

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Speaker 4: And to have a seat at that roundtable, two things

436
00:19:43,640 --> 00:19:46,720
Speaker 4: that've had to take place. One is they've they've had

437
00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:49,520
Speaker 4: time under tension with me and for them to demonstrate

438
00:19:49,560 --> 00:19:52,680
Speaker 4: that they care about me and my growth and who

439
00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:56,960
Speaker 4: I am, my struggles and my ambitions and you know

440
00:19:57,080 --> 00:19:59,520
Speaker 4: what flourishing as a human looks like for me, Like

441
00:19:59,560 --> 00:20:02,800
Speaker 4: they re care and I've got time under tension with them.

442
00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:05,160
Speaker 4: The second thing is that they've been in the arena.

443
00:20:05,359 --> 00:20:09,040
Speaker 4: They understand pressure, they understand what it takes to get

444
00:20:09,040 --> 00:20:12,600
Speaker 4: to the edge publicly or privately and stay in that

445
00:20:12,680 --> 00:20:16,280
Speaker 4: agitated state in an honest way, because that's what's required

446
00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:18,879
Speaker 4: for breakthroughs. So to get on my roundtable, for me

447
00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:22,760
Speaker 4: to care about your opinion, there's an earned scar tissue together,

448
00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:26,960
Speaker 4: and it's that tenderness of caring that they've demonstrated and

449
00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:29,440
Speaker 4: in return, hopefully I'm doing the same gift for them.

450
00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:32,840
Speaker 4: And they've been in it, they understand quote unquote it.

451
00:20:33,760 --> 00:20:36,520
Speaker 4: So I do think that people's opinions do matter now

452
00:20:36,560 --> 00:20:39,560
Speaker 4: outside of the roundtable, if you will, And that's a

453
00:20:39,600 --> 00:20:42,640
Speaker 4: good exercise. Who's at your roundtable? It's a really good

454
00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:45,520
Speaker 4: exercise just to go through that. And I think you'd

455
00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:48,359
Speaker 4: be surprised some of the people at the roundtable. You

456
00:20:48,440 --> 00:20:51,119
Speaker 4: might feel like, Wow, that person should be there because

457
00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:55,520
Speaker 4: it's my parent. But if there's only eight seats, who

458
00:20:55,520 --> 00:20:59,040
Speaker 4: are the ones that you really care about? So it's

459
00:20:59,040 --> 00:21:01,520
Speaker 4: a hard, good exercise. And then second, you know, the

460
00:21:01,560 --> 00:21:04,639
Speaker 4: second layer is where it gets tricky, which is like

461
00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:10,199
Speaker 4: the college admissions advisor, the producer, or who's ever responsible

462
00:21:10,200 --> 00:21:13,960
Speaker 4: for budget negotiation. Those opinions do matter, but if you're

463
00:21:13,960 --> 00:21:17,600
Speaker 4: not true to yourself, you're playing their game and for

464
00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:21,080
Speaker 4: their approval as opposed to working from the inside out

465
00:21:21,320 --> 00:21:23,359
Speaker 4: and being true to your ideas, being true to the

466
00:21:23,400 --> 00:21:25,919
Speaker 4: way that you are wanting to experience the world. So

467
00:21:26,280 --> 00:21:29,040
Speaker 4: I want that back to your eight people here, Okay, people.

468
00:21:28,960 --> 00:21:29,480
Speaker 3: Round table.

469
00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:33,439
Speaker 2: Are these eight people that you look at and go, Okay,

470
00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:36,399
Speaker 2: no matter what I know, I'm walking this walk together

471
00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:38,560
Speaker 2: and they got my fucking back or is it? Hey,

472
00:21:38,800 --> 00:21:42,040
Speaker 2: I got eight people and they may be screwed up too,

473
00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:45,000
Speaker 2: but they're still at that table. I may not get

474
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:47,200
Speaker 2: what I need back from them, but I love them

475
00:21:47,600 --> 00:21:49,359
Speaker 2: this much that they're at that table.

476
00:21:50,119 --> 00:21:52,320
Speaker 4: You can make up the rules. The purpose is is like,

477
00:21:52,400 --> 00:21:56,399
Speaker 4: whose opinions are you going to deeply value? And I

478
00:21:56,440 --> 00:22:00,080
Speaker 4: need some sturdiness for me. I need to know that

479
00:22:00,520 --> 00:22:02,800
Speaker 4: their opinion is not going to be flippant, It's going

480
00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:05,639
Speaker 4: to be honest, it's real. It's in context of my

481
00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:10,200
Speaker 4: unique history and all of my pain and the brilliance

482
00:22:10,200 --> 00:22:12,240
Speaker 4: of how I'm trying to see the future. I need

483
00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:15,119
Speaker 4: them to have context because I could walk down the

484
00:22:15,119 --> 00:22:17,720
Speaker 4: street and say, a j black shirt. Really you wear

485
00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:20,639
Speaker 4: black shirt again? Like come on, man, But you're like,

486
00:22:20,960 --> 00:22:23,560
Speaker 4: I don't know if you've been traumatized by your bullied

487
00:22:23,560 --> 00:22:26,719
Speaker 4: because you wore purple and pink and blue shirts when

488
00:22:26,760 --> 00:22:29,720
Speaker 4: you're young, like so, like the opinion shouldn't hold much

489
00:22:29,720 --> 00:22:32,680
Speaker 4: weight because I don't know your traumas and histories and

490
00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:37,560
Speaker 4: unique life experiences. So for me, those people those eight, yes,

491
00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:40,440
Speaker 4: they have my back, meaning that they under they put

492
00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:43,640
Speaker 4: in time, under tension to demonstrate how much they actually care.

493
00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:47,040
Speaker 4: So I'm going to in return, hopefully be able to

494
00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:49,480
Speaker 4: honor the opinions that they're sharing.

495
00:22:49,680 --> 00:22:51,480
Speaker 2: Those are the eight for me, which also so also

496
00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:53,240
Speaker 2: people are going to call me I'm like my shit.

497
00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:57,000
Speaker 4: Basically, that's it, That's exactly it. Yeah, and just calling

498
00:22:57,040 --> 00:22:59,560
Speaker 4: it out of context is like kind of weak, right,

499
00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:02,359
Speaker 4: know you and that you've built the relationship where they

500
00:23:02,359 --> 00:23:04,000
Speaker 4: can be honest with you, you might put them at

501
00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:04,600
Speaker 4: the round table.

502
00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:06,600
Speaker 2: But I think it's also people who just say some

503
00:23:06,640 --> 00:23:09,240
Speaker 2: people I just need unconditional love from Some people say

504
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:10,320
Speaker 2: not need call me on my shop.

505
00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:12,040
Speaker 3: I just need that love, right, And that's right.

506
00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:14,119
Speaker 2: It's interesting you're saying the eight because I used to

507
00:23:14,119 --> 00:23:17,199
Speaker 2: always look life like, hey, who are the four legs

508
00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:17,919
Speaker 2: of my table?

509
00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:21,160
Speaker 3: That's cool and it's going to be a cool exercise

510
00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:23,080
Speaker 3: for me to do to try to expand it to eight.

511
00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:26,080
Speaker 2: And I kind of you know, the four legs of

512
00:23:26,119 --> 00:23:31,159
Speaker 2: my table I've probably changed interchanged here and there throughout.

513
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:34,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, and you know you can you can also add

514
00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:37,240
Speaker 4: you could add Jesus if you wanted, you could add Buddha.

515
00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:40,040
Speaker 4: You could add you know, you could add someone you

516
00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:42,199
Speaker 4: don't really know, but you feel like you have a

517
00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:44,960
Speaker 4: relationship with them. I have one spot reserved for that

518
00:23:45,040 --> 00:23:48,240
Speaker 4: as well on my aide. So you know, I just

519
00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:51,119
Speaker 4: don't get to hear their opinion, you know. So it's

520
00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:52,800
Speaker 4: a little it's a little bit more complicated.

521
00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:55,840
Speaker 3: It's interesting. Yeah, I'm a big I'm a big God guy.

522
00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:58,560
Speaker 2: But I've always right. I've never put God at the table.

523
00:23:58,600 --> 00:24:01,119
Speaker 2: I've always been like and for me, it's my relationship

524
00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:03,359
Speaker 2: with faith. There's always been like I've always punished as

525
00:24:03,359 --> 00:24:05,760
Speaker 2: a little kid. I got brought upstairs this dark room

526
00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:07,720
Speaker 2: all the time, and I just started talking talking to God,

527
00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:09,520
Speaker 2: and I just started looking God as my best friend,

528
00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:11,040
Speaker 2: and like a best friend to have parent, Who do

529
00:24:11,040 --> 00:24:12,200
Speaker 2: you what do you want a best friend?

530
00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:13,960
Speaker 3: Really? You just wants someone to listen, to be there

531
00:24:13,960 --> 00:24:14,080
Speaker 3: for you.

532
00:24:14,359 --> 00:24:16,440
Speaker 2: I'm not trying to use God to like, hey, get

533
00:24:16,520 --> 00:24:18,920
Speaker 2: this job, or hey, you know, make this happen for me,

534
00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:20,600
Speaker 2: or if you don't make this happen for me, I'm

535
00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:22,920
Speaker 2: gonna stop believing in you. I don't have that relationship

536
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:26,440
Speaker 2: my relationship is more just I'll do it, I'll get

537
00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:27,080
Speaker 2: where I need to go.

538
00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:29,040
Speaker 3: Just pick me up, brush me off, and let's keep

539
00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:29,960
Speaker 3: walking this walk together.

540
00:24:30,200 --> 00:24:34,200
Speaker 2: I never viewed faith as being a part of that table.

541
00:24:34,240 --> 00:24:36,040
Speaker 2: If you will, whether it's by four or my eight,

542
00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:38,840
Speaker 2: it's pretty interested. I'm going to add that today.

543
00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:39,840
Speaker 3: I love that. Yeah. Cool.

544
00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:42,080
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a good exercise. It's a really good exercise.

545
00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:42,639
Speaker 3: Yeah.

546
00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:45,040
Speaker 4: And then the other thing is like when you're doing

547
00:24:45,080 --> 00:24:48,960
Speaker 4: the exercise, you'll recognize, like, man, I don't want to

548
00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:51,679
Speaker 4: send this to like a parent, maybe because they're not

549
00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:54,200
Speaker 4: on the list. Let's just say that for example. And

550
00:24:54,240 --> 00:24:56,960
Speaker 4: then it's this weird thing like, well, I'm caring about

551
00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:59,000
Speaker 4: their opinion, but I don't even want them on the

552
00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:01,400
Speaker 4: list of eight at the round table. Like that's how

553
00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:05,440
Speaker 4: slippery this thing is. And here's the origins of it.

554
00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:09,719
Speaker 4: Your brain is designed to care about fitting in. Like

555
00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:12,920
Speaker 4: we talked about. The second piece is that our culture,

556
00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:17,000
Speaker 4: certainly in the West, is obsessed with performance, and it

557
00:25:17,040 --> 00:25:19,720
Speaker 4: would make perfect sense that we would raise handfuls of

558
00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:23,680
Speaker 4: generations yours and mind included, where we would fit into

559
00:25:23,720 --> 00:25:28,320
Speaker 4: what's called a or develop what's called a performance based identity. Now,

560
00:25:28,400 --> 00:25:31,119
Speaker 4: let me explain that. Okay, So the culture values performance,

561
00:25:31,320 --> 00:25:33,280
Speaker 4: how you fit and stack rank and how.

562
00:25:33,119 --> 00:25:33,800
Speaker 3: Well you're doing.

563
00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:36,720
Speaker 4: We're obsessed with it. So then we build a performance

564
00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:40,159
Speaker 4: based identity, and the definition is that I am not

565
00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:44,560
Speaker 4: who I am. I am what I do relative to

566
00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:48,280
Speaker 4: how well I do it compared to other people. So

567
00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:52,160
Speaker 4: my identity becomes how well I do something. So when

568
00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:54,480
Speaker 4: I go on the mound, or when I go onto

569
00:25:54,480 --> 00:25:56,600
Speaker 4: the pitch, or when I go on to the you know,

570
00:25:56,640 --> 00:25:59,800
Speaker 4: the stage, whatever the thing is for somebody. This is

571
00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:02,040
Speaker 4: why it's so hard for so many of us is

572
00:26:02,080 --> 00:26:05,800
Speaker 4: because it's not just public speaking, it's not just sharing

573
00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:09,600
Speaker 4: the ideas. It's the fact that they are judging all

574
00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:14,000
Speaker 4: of me. My entire identity is at stake. People say

575
00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:16,199
Speaker 4: round ball and round bat is a very one of

576
00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:18,879
Speaker 4: the hardest things to do in sport. I disagree. I'malk.

577
00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:21,359
Speaker 4: I'm going to point the surfing, but okay, that's a

578
00:26:21,359 --> 00:26:24,040
Speaker 4: different story. But round ball, round bat just to you know,

579
00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:26,199
Speaker 4: kind of make it easy for folks to relate to.

580
00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:30,520
Speaker 4: What's incredibly hard is that you have to deeply focus. Okay,

581
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:33,359
Speaker 4: and it is a challenging task. But what happens for

582
00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:36,439
Speaker 4: most people. When you've got I don't know, millions watching,

583
00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:39,840
Speaker 4: you know, sixty thousand that or whatever the stadium is

584
00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:42,880
Speaker 4: holding eyeballs on you. Is that you're trying to manage

585
00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:45,600
Speaker 4: your identity. You're trying to manage your ego, You're trying

586
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:49,440
Speaker 4: to manage approval and not look stupid at the same time.

587
00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:51,239
Speaker 4: What you need to do is drive all of your

588
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:53,719
Speaker 4: attention to picking up the laces, so your mind can

589
00:26:53,760 --> 00:26:55,520
Speaker 4: only focus on one thing at a time. And if

590
00:26:55,560 --> 00:27:00,160
Speaker 4: it's trying to manage looking good versus deep focus, I'll

591
00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:03,159
Speaker 4: never see the ball. It's too fast. It's happening to

592
00:27:03,520 --> 00:27:06,159
Speaker 4: same with on stage, same with whatever. The thing that

593
00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:09,160
Speaker 4: you matter is that matters to you. Our mind can

594
00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:12,719
Speaker 4: only focus on one thing at a time well, and

595
00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:15,840
Speaker 4: so having the skill, the psychological skill to have deep

596
00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:20,400
Speaker 4: focus is one worth investing in. Hands down, Is.

597
00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:24,240
Speaker 2: There also a way do you have tactics in whether

598
00:27:24,320 --> 00:27:26,119
Speaker 2: this book or other teachings as well?

599
00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:29,520
Speaker 3: Where I could start, how do you get yourself.

600
00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:32,920
Speaker 2: To shift for you to care more about what your

601
00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:35,359
Speaker 2: opinion is of you than others?

602
00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:36,560
Speaker 3: But that is of you?

603
00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:40,480
Speaker 4: Yeah, I love that. And before I directly answer that

604
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:43,439
Speaker 4: I'm going to give you maybe something that's going to

605
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:46,960
Speaker 4: add material context is that so to go from a

606
00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:53,000
Speaker 4: performance based identity to a purpose based identity. So this

607
00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:56,359
Speaker 4: is no longer about your opinion of yourself here, this

608
00:27:56,480 --> 00:27:59,560
Speaker 4: is about how true are you to the purpose that

609
00:27:59,560 --> 00:28:03,640
Speaker 4: matters most to you? And that is the escape hatch,

610
00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:08,080
Speaker 4: that's the relief valve to go from performance based like man,

611
00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:11,720
Speaker 4: what do they think of me? To your point, which

612
00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:14,640
Speaker 4: is like, well, how am I being true to me? Okay,

613
00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:17,800
Speaker 4: they're kind of in the same bucket. Not really, they're

614
00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:20,880
Speaker 4: materially different. But the entirely different game is when you're

615
00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:23,720
Speaker 4: clear about your purpose in life. This podcast, for example,

616
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:26,760
Speaker 4: for you, right, there's a purpose underneath of it. And

617
00:28:26,800 --> 00:28:30,040
Speaker 4: then so you're measuring how true you are to the purpose,

618
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:32,720
Speaker 4: how much you're actually giving to the purpose. Because you

619
00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:34,840
Speaker 4: had a choice, Jay, this is why I have such

620
00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:37,560
Speaker 4: respect for you. You could have held back and not

621
00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:41,240
Speaker 4: said anything about a panic attack. You could have said, hey, guys,

622
00:28:41,280 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 4: I need to go to the bathroom, say hey, my

623
00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:46,440
Speaker 4: camera's not working, hold on, give me a minute. You

624
00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:49,000
Speaker 4: had a choice or just to not say anything at all,

625
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:52,200
Speaker 4: and maybe no one ever notices. But the choice you

626
00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:54,200
Speaker 4: made was to be honest, to get to the truth,

627
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:58,200
Speaker 4: because that is what this podcast is about, and you're

628
00:28:58,200 --> 00:28:59,440
Speaker 4: not going to hide from it. You're going to be

629
00:28:59,480 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 4: about it. So you actually are living here the evidence

630
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:05,400
Speaker 4: of a purpose based identity.

631
00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:15,160
Speaker 2: You who better to have a panic attack with than you?

632
00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:18,080
Speaker 2: Can't be better than that? Like, it's so good, Hey man,

633
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:20,440
Speaker 2: I'm having pitching problems. I'm hanging out with Nolan Ryan. Like,

634
00:29:20,480 --> 00:29:22,480
Speaker 2: I'm good. It's a perfect guy.

635
00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:26,120
Speaker 4: Oh that's so funny. Yeah.

636
00:29:26,320 --> 00:29:28,239
Speaker 3: And I'm proud of my scars. That's the whole thing.

637
00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:30,400
Speaker 3: I try and get people to understand. My scars are

638
00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:31,760
Speaker 3: my superpowers. It's not.

639
00:29:32,560 --> 00:29:34,480
Speaker 2: And we're talking to hear about purpose, right, It's not

640
00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:38,880
Speaker 2: the successes, it's the scars. It's what I've overcome. When

641
00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:40,120
Speaker 2: I walk in the room, I look at it, and

642
00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:41,880
Speaker 2: I look at everybody in there. I go, y'ell, I

643
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:44,200
Speaker 2: ain't like me. I'm different, and not because of what

644
00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:46,200
Speaker 2: I've achieved, but because of what I've overcome.

645
00:29:46,800 --> 00:29:50,360
Speaker 4: I love that, And everybody's face down something like we

646
00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:53,040
Speaker 4: all have our stars and we need the cool kids

647
00:29:53,120 --> 00:29:55,800
Speaker 4: like you to be about it and to raise your

648
00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:59,400
Speaker 4: hand and to say hey, listen, I got scars, and

649
00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:01,440
Speaker 4: you know what, I'm done with them. I'm a work

650
00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:03,680
Speaker 4: in progress, and be nice if I was perfect, but

651
00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:05,840
Speaker 4: I'm leaving that for the enlightened. I'm still trying to

652
00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:09,360
Speaker 4: figure it out, you know. So nobody does the extraordinary

653
00:30:09,440 --> 00:30:12,680
Speaker 4: loan Jay like. We need each other. We really do

654
00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:15,040
Speaker 4: need each other. We're more like we're designed more like

655
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:17,200
Speaker 4: a core reef, but we don't act that way. We

656
00:30:17,240 --> 00:30:21,680
Speaker 4: act like we're individual contributors. We're unique unicorns, you know,

657
00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:24,480
Speaker 4: but we are really deeply connected and we need each other.

658
00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:27,360
Speaker 2: So also, going back to you were saying, because you're

659
00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 2: going to answer my question, but then new veered.

660
00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:32,200
Speaker 3: Yes, right, so I can't pay the ad D guys

661
00:30:32,200 --> 00:30:33,040
Speaker 3: making you go back.

662
00:30:32,880 --> 00:30:38,520
Speaker 4: To all how about that? See we need yeah it together.

663
00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:43,640
Speaker 4: So purpose base, I'm sorry, performance based to purpose space.

664
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:46,800
Speaker 4: And your question is like, how do you know if

665
00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:50,120
Speaker 4: you how does your opinion of yourself become louder than

666
00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:52,960
Speaker 4: the opinions of others? Right, And the sleight of hand

667
00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:56,160
Speaker 4: that I was making is instead of doing that, be

668
00:30:56,320 --> 00:31:00,440
Speaker 4: true to a purpose. So that's that is your your gauge, right,

669
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:03,920
Speaker 4: is that know your purpose? And that takes time to

670
00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:07,240
Speaker 4: identify that. If you're not clear what your purpose is,

671
00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:09,840
Speaker 4: I would say that that's the biggest piece of work

672
00:31:09,840 --> 00:31:12,960
Speaker 4: to do, next to the roundtable of eight. Okay, all right.

673
00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:15,560
Speaker 4: And then to answer your question though, if you're not

674
00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:17,440
Speaker 4: down with doing either of those and you're saying, no,

675
00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:20,240
Speaker 4: I just want to know my opinion matters about me, okay,

676
00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:23,520
Speaker 4: So then you need to be incredibly clear about what

677
00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:27,080
Speaker 4: your core virtues and values are that matter to you.

678
00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:31,400
Speaker 4: So you're not mapping it to your performance. You're mapping

679
00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:34,800
Speaker 4: it to how the quality and the character of the

680
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:39,600
Speaker 4: human that you are. So that's the foundation. Then on

681
00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:42,560
Speaker 4: top of that you can layer your standards for performance.

682
00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 4: So you could be a great performer. But if you

683
00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:49,680
Speaker 4: are lying, cheating, getting over, sneaking one through and your

684
00:31:49,760 --> 00:31:54,960
Speaker 4: virtues are suspect, it's unsustainable. It gets found out and

685
00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:58,160
Speaker 4: you know that what you're doing is playing a shell game.

686
00:31:58,640 --> 00:32:00,400
Speaker 4: So what I'm saying is build a foundation. And the

687
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:03,360
Speaker 4: foundation is the virtues, the values that matter to you,

688
00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:06,320
Speaker 4: the things that you're going to stack your performance standards on.

689
00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:09,800
Speaker 4: So first do the deep work, there's no shortcuts, Okay,

690
00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:14,160
Speaker 4: Then you can have some real opinions about your performance standards.

691
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:16,760
Speaker 4: My standards are crazy high. I'm sure yours on. But

692
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:20,520
Speaker 4: if they're high standards without having foundation, they just end

693
00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:23,280
Speaker 4: up getting really flimsy and it's hard to repeat them.

694
00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:26,440
Speaker 4: So then the way that we have opinions of ourselves.

695
00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:29,800
Speaker 4: Now we're getting into the art of coaching. So actually, technically,

696
00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:32,840
Speaker 4: how do you do it? Coach yourself like you are

697
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:36,960
Speaker 4: one of your greatest friends or your greatest athletes that

698
00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:39,280
Speaker 4: you would ever love to work with, are a great partner.

699
00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:42,800
Speaker 4: Back yourself, coach yourself, build yourself, be productive in the

700
00:32:42,840 --> 00:32:45,320
Speaker 4: way you speak to yourself. Let go of the old

701
00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:48,800
Speaker 4: narrative like you suck. What's wrong with you? Man, You're

702
00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:51,080
Speaker 4: never going to get this shit done. Like back down

703
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:54,880
Speaker 4: the critique and the judgment. That does not create a

704
00:32:55,400 --> 00:33:00,680
Speaker 4: sustainable approach to flourishing the fun to what you might

705
00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:01,240
Speaker 4: get the girl.

706
00:33:02,040 --> 00:33:03,520
Speaker 3: You don't need to be hard on your walls.

707
00:33:03,800 --> 00:33:06,280
Speaker 4: Yeah, Like you might get good that way, but you're

708
00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:10,280
Speaker 4: not gonna feel very good. Right, So so there is

709
00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:12,480
Speaker 4: a better way, is my point? Right, that's the old

710
00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:14,800
Speaker 4: school way, Like because they didn't really know better, they

711
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:17,600
Speaker 4: didn't know the science of excellence. The science of excellence

712
00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:22,200
Speaker 4: doesn't point to like just be happy, be positive. It's

713
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:25,680
Speaker 4: a productive way of backing yourself with your own self

714
00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:29,000
Speaker 4: talk like okay, glad, I figure that out. Now, let's

715
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:30,880
Speaker 4: figure this shit out. Let's go back to the woodshed,

716
00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:33,440
Speaker 4: let's go to work. Come on, be honest with yourself,

717
00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:36,040
Speaker 4: get down into it, figure it out. Like you got

718
00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:38,480
Speaker 4: more and you let's go. That's a whole different way

719
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:42,200
Speaker 4: of speaking to yourself. And like, man, everyone's watching, You're

720
00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 4: gonna look like a fool. This is crazy. What's wrong

721
00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:48,200
Speaker 4: with him? Why get what's what's his problem? What's her problem?

722
00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:50,520
Speaker 4: Like now we're in the critique game of others and

723
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:54,240
Speaker 4: it's it's just a complicated little mix. So let me

724
00:33:54,320 --> 00:33:57,680
Speaker 4: just back up virtues and values first. Then hold high standards.

725
00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:01,360
Speaker 4: Then be very clear about how you speak to yourself

726
00:34:01,640 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 4: about approaching those standards. If you're not doing the hard

727
00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:08,600
Speaker 4: work in practice, it doesn't show up in game day

728
00:34:08,640 --> 00:34:11,160
Speaker 4: the way that you would hope. So the messy edge,

729
00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:15,719
Speaker 4: the emotional messy edge in practice is what great athletes

730
00:34:15,800 --> 00:34:18,319
Speaker 4: do consistently, and that's what the rest of us can

731
00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:21,240
Speaker 4: learn from, not just the entertainment of athletics. It's cool,

732
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:23,680
Speaker 4: don't get me wrong. I love it. But what they

733
00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:26,680
Speaker 4: do is they fundamentally organize their life in front of

734
00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:29,480
Speaker 4: their peers, their friends, people that are trying to take

735
00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:33,040
Speaker 4: their job, and their coaches, people who decide if they're

736
00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:36,319
Speaker 4: going to play or not. They fundamentally decide that they're

737
00:34:36,320 --> 00:34:38,000
Speaker 4: going to get to the messy edge where it doesn't

738
00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:40,319
Speaker 4: look good. And they do it on Monday, and they

739
00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:43,640
Speaker 4: do it on Wednesday and Thursday and Friday, and then

740
00:34:43,680 --> 00:34:47,000
Speaker 4: Sunday they let it rip. But to look messy and

741
00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:51,000
Speaker 4: dishoveled amongst your friends and peers and people try to

742
00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:52,799
Speaker 4: take your job and coaches that hold the keys to

743
00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:55,480
Speaker 4: your job, to get messy and be a bit of

744
00:34:55,520 --> 00:34:58,640
Speaker 4: a mess there, that's fucking hard to do. And that's

745
00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:01,480
Speaker 4: what the greats do. Push to that edge because there's

746
00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:05,000
Speaker 4: a purpose, and that purpose can be a narcissistic purpose.

747
00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:07,279
Speaker 4: I just want to be my best, or there can

748
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:10,800
Speaker 4: be a greater purpose. House for them, my parents, homes

749
00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:13,480
Speaker 4: for people that don't have it, shelters for dogs, running

750
00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:16,360
Speaker 4: waters for whatever. Like, if you can upgrade the purpose,

751
00:35:17,040 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 4: that the whole thing gets a little bit easier. So anyways,

752
00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:21,720
Speaker 4: I'll stop talking because I get animated about this stuff

753
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:22,600
Speaker 4: and I love it.

754
00:35:22,640 --> 00:35:25,399
Speaker 3: I appreciate it. And just to let you know we are.

755
00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:27,640
Speaker 2: I only got a couple minutes left, but we're about

756
00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:30,759
Speaker 2: thirty five minutes since that panic attack happened, and your

757
00:35:30,920 --> 00:35:34,520
Speaker 2: everything we talked about has happened. I'm sure it's dried out,

758
00:35:34,520 --> 00:35:37,000
Speaker 2: it's gotten colder, but you can hear everything's kind of

759
00:35:37,239 --> 00:35:37,680
Speaker 2: calm down.

760
00:35:37,719 --> 00:35:39,720
Speaker 3: My breathing has gotten back to normal.

761
00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:42,600
Speaker 2: So more than anything, I want to show you some

762
00:35:42,640 --> 00:35:47,560
Speaker 2: gratitude for helping me walk through this minefield of anxiety.

763
00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:50,319
Speaker 2: It's really cool and that's that's a special bond, and

764
00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:52,880
Speaker 2: that's you know I always like to share with my people.

765
00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:55,319
Speaker 3: We walked this walk together. I always say, man, walk

766
00:35:55,400 --> 00:35:56,080
Speaker 3: this walk together.

767
00:35:56,320 --> 00:35:59,080
Speaker 2: And you truly walk that walk with me together right here,

768
00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:00,759
Speaker 2: And I just want to tell you I'm grateful for you.

769
00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:03,520
Speaker 4: I appreciate it, I appreciate you, and I know we're

770
00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:05,359
Speaker 4: turning home base here. I just want to say one thing.

771
00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:08,600
Speaker 4: I really was looking forward to this conversation with you

772
00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:12,000
Speaker 4: because of the realness, because of the authenticity, the groundedness

773
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:15,080
Speaker 4: to get to truth. And man, you did not hold

774
00:36:15,120 --> 00:36:18,480
Speaker 4: back and I'm so real matter. I can't get more

775
00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:20,440
Speaker 4: real and the second thing is I want you to

776
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:22,520
Speaker 4: not look. Look you see the shirt, I've got like

777
00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:25,240
Speaker 4: a shirt underneath the shirt. I wore that because sometimes

778
00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:27,719
Speaker 4: I swept during interviews too, and so I had a

779
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:30,719
Speaker 4: second layer. Just okay, so.

780
00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:38,120
Speaker 3: Just in case, Yeah, that was that was a water.

781
00:36:38,680 --> 00:36:39,319
Speaker 3: That's so cool.

782
00:36:39,600 --> 00:36:41,359
Speaker 2: You don't you know a couple of years ago, you

783
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:43,000
Speaker 2: never nobody would have talked about this.

784
00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:45,200
Speaker 4: But that's how you're leading the way, Jay, And then

785
00:36:45,239 --> 00:36:48,439
Speaker 4: come on, I appreciate that from the front.

786
00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:52,799
Speaker 2: Hey, these are my scars, are my accomplishments, and you

787
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:55,000
Speaker 2: know there's just I guess this kind of goes.

788
00:36:54,880 --> 00:36:55,960
Speaker 3: Back to what you're writing about.

789
00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:59,640
Speaker 2: You can't have shame in it, and you know that's

790
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:03,120
Speaker 2: me taking out the shame means, Hey, I'm I'm not

791
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:06,840
Speaker 2: caring about negative thoughts of what that may bring about

792
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:09,279
Speaker 2: of me talking about these issues that I have.

793
00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:11,840
Speaker 4: One hundred percent. And when we give more value to

794
00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:14,520
Speaker 4: other people's opinions than our own, we live life on

795
00:37:14,640 --> 00:37:18,080
Speaker 4: their terms, not ours. And so you're showing the way.

796
00:37:18,080 --> 00:37:18,360
Speaker 3: Again.

797
00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:20,200
Speaker 4: Appreciate you, brother.

798
00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:22,839
Speaker 3: I appreciate it so much. Thank you for joining me. Man.

799
00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:25,239
Speaker 3: How cool is this? I just say, how cool is this?

800
00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:28,920
Speaker 3: Have a pandict attack with doctor Michael Travais. He walks

801
00:37:29,000 --> 00:37:30,799
Speaker 3: me through it. Oh, real quick before I let you go,

802
00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:32,520
Speaker 3: real quick. I never knew this about you.

803
00:37:33,040 --> 00:37:35,319
Speaker 2: This is the first book you've written, but you did

804
00:37:35,360 --> 00:37:38,799
Speaker 2: an audiobook with Pete Carroll. Why did you do an

805
00:37:38,840 --> 00:37:42,160
Speaker 2: audio book instead of a written book?

806
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:43,840
Speaker 3: I'm just fascinated by it.

807
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:47,239
Speaker 4: So I just valued the audio form. You know, I've

808
00:37:47,239 --> 00:37:49,799
Speaker 4: got a podcast myself, and I'd really value that. And

809
00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:52,480
Speaker 4: we thought, let's say, let's save some trees, let's go

810
00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:53,400
Speaker 4: to the audio route.

811
00:37:53,719 --> 00:37:54,680
Speaker 3: And it was just it.

812
00:37:54,600 --> 00:37:56,799
Speaker 4: Was really fun to be able to do it that way. Yet,

813
00:37:56,880 --> 00:37:59,440
Speaker 4: so that's called compete to create. Uh a guide to

814
00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:03,160
Speaker 4: living authentically? Leading and living authentically? How about it? And

815
00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:05,560
Speaker 4: so yeah, so that's an audio form only.

816
00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:06,680
Speaker 3: That's incredible.

817
00:38:06,760 --> 00:38:09,239
Speaker 2: So again, this book right here, folks, go out and

818
00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:11,479
Speaker 2: get it a thready you hit the top ten list.

819
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:15,920
Speaker 3: The first rule of mastery. Stop worrying about what people

820
00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:20,439
Speaker 3: think of you. Just incredible. Doc. I appreciate brother, And hey,

821
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:23,080
Speaker 3: you owe me a day in Malibu. Hey, how about it?

822
00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:25,040
Speaker 4: That's an easy that's an easy one, all right, man,

823
00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:25,680
Speaker 4: I appreciate you.

824
00:38:26,160 --> 00:38:27,840
Speaker 3: Like I said, let's keep walk on this walk together