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Speaker 1: And to continue our focus on new voices. I'm joined

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Speaker 1: by Maya King. She's a politics reporter for the New

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Speaker 1: York Times. I'll let her tell me the exact number

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Speaker 1: of years, but was a political reporter based in Atlanta

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Speaker 1: and the Southeast Bureau covering politics in the Southeast, which

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Speaker 1: is an incredible beat, except she just got promoted. It

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Speaker 1: even better beat these days as far as the New

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Speaker 1: York Times Masteret is concerned, which is New York politics,

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Speaker 1: which includes the mayor's race. So the timing is also wonderful.

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Speaker 1: My King, it's nice to meet you. Welcome to the podcast.

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Speaker 2: Great to meet you. Thank you for having me.

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Speaker 1: So before we dive into what is potentially an historic

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Speaker 1: race that you're covering that I hope you save notes

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Speaker 1: on because it may be the makings of a book

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Speaker 1: at some point, give me your origin story. What got

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Speaker 1: you into political journalism? And because these days I am

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Speaker 1: concerned that fewer people under the age of thirty or

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Speaker 1: are considering journalism and you're you know, you're on one

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Speaker 1: of the great paths that you can have in the

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Speaker 1: world of journalism. So tell me your origin story. How'd

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Speaker 1: you get sure?

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Speaker 2: Sure?

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Speaker 3: Well, I'll start by saying I grew up in a

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Speaker 3: sixty minutes household, so already I've sort of booked a

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Speaker 3: lot of the tradition of people my age. My parents

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Speaker 3: were huge political junkies and watched a lot a lot

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Speaker 3: of cable news, and I remember in middle and high

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Speaker 3: school watching these segments on Sunday nights and thinking, I

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Speaker 3: would actually really love to do this. I'd love to

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Speaker 3: write about these things. And so that was sort of

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Speaker 3: the path that I started myself on. I went to

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Speaker 3: school in Washington, d C. At Howard University and decided

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Speaker 3: to study journalism there and also got involved just kind

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Speaker 3: of following all of the political changes that were taking place,

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Speaker 3: the election of President Trump's first term, and a lot

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Speaker 3: of activism both on and off campus and around the

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Speaker 3: DC air. I found that I was less interested in

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Speaker 3: engaging in the activism than I wasn't actually covering it

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Speaker 3: and talking to the folks there and kind of understanding

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Speaker 3: what makes people take to the streets, but also what

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Speaker 3: makes people want to push for legislation and change. And

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Speaker 3: so that was sort of what started me on my

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Speaker 3: path to journalism. And after I graduated, I started reporting

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Speaker 3: on politics for Politico and that was the rest is history.

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Speaker 2: I suppose.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's interesting. I'm fascinated because I had a

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Speaker 1: similar moment where I was working on a campaign and

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Speaker 1: I didn't really like the experience. And then I got

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Speaker 1: an internship at a journalism publication. At the time, it

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Speaker 1: was a trade publication, frankly the political of its day,

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Speaker 1: the Hotline back in the early nineties, and I found

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Speaker 1: that I found covering it more stimulating and more interesting,

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Speaker 1: and sort of as I realized, now I'm kind of

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Speaker 1: an anthropologist. I don't know, I wouldn't have described myself

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Speaker 1: that way then, but now I sort of. That's how

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Speaker 1: I try to look at the American electorate these days,

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Speaker 1: almost the way an anthropologists would go to another country.

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Speaker 1: And you know, because you want to be dispassionate on

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Speaker 1: this explo you know, I try to have this conversation

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Speaker 1: with younger people in journalism because I'll have to talk

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Speaker 1: to some who say I'm in it because I want

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Speaker 1: to I want to change things. And I went, well,

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Speaker 1: you sure journalism is the path you want to take.

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Speaker 1: What do you say if when when somebody in college

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Speaker 1: asked you, why do you why did you not go

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Speaker 1: down the activist road? What do you say to them?

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Speaker 2: That was really never something that I wanted to do.

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Speaker 2: I've always been.

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Speaker 3: Interested in reporting, and I've always been interested in sort

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Speaker 3: of knowing what's going on on both sides, and I

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Speaker 3: felt like being an organizer and an activist, you have

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Speaker 3: to understand, you know, the forces that you're up against,

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Speaker 3: but you have to spend a lot of time also

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Speaker 3: talking with your own people. And I found that I

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Speaker 3: was really having more fun talking with the organizers and

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Speaker 3: also the people that they were protesting and understanding where

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Speaker 3: both people are coming from and being able to communicate

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Speaker 3: that to folks.

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Speaker 2: Who were not involved at all.

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Speaker 3: And so, you know, it's not necessarily a matter of

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Speaker 3: affecting change, though that's very important, but I think informing

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Speaker 3: people is a way of affecting change. And I think

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Speaker 3: that's something that you just have to learn with more experience,

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Speaker 3: is that really telling the truth and letting people know

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Speaker 3: what's happening is actually like a very impactful tool. And

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Speaker 3: it took me being on campus and sort of talking

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Speaker 3: to different people reporting for the campus paper and then

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Speaker 3: reporting for our wider news service and seeing the response

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Speaker 3: to my reporting to understand that I actually did have

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Speaker 3: a level of influence but also a level of responsibility.

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Speaker 1: What's interesting to me about your experience is that your

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Speaker 1: professional experience has largely been in the Trump era. Right.

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Speaker 1: Did you cover politics pre Trump?

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Speaker 2: Not professionally now?

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Speaker 1: Yeah. And the reason I find that interesting is that

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Speaker 1: I think, you know, I wonder how much of a

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Speaker 1: handicap it is to me and somebody older who I'm

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Speaker 1: sort of caught in the pre Trump Republican Party. I'm

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Speaker 1: caught in the pre Trump rules, right, I'm caught And

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Speaker 1: and you know, look, we all have this. Every generation

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Speaker 1: has this where they think, you know, how it was

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Speaker 1: in the majority of their lifespan should be how it

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Speaker 1: always is, right when it's like, no, that isn't the way.

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Speaker 1: That isn't the way life works. But I often you know,

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Speaker 1: but I'm curious you you started professionally in Trump one

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Speaker 1: point oh. Now here you are in Trump two point zero.

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Speaker 1: And again you're right now the New York City mayors

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Speaker 1: races is. Look, Trump hovers over every story in politics, right.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't matter if you're in a city council in Milton,

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Speaker 1: Florida or New York City. So there's two we know this.

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Speaker 1: Your experience is covering both sides here changed just in

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Speaker 1: you for you in the last ten years, and what

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Speaker 1: changes have you noticed in your sources and how they

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Speaker 1: treat you.

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Speaker 3: Sure, I'll say a few things. The first is I

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Speaker 3: had a unique understanding. I think I am my colleagues

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Speaker 3: who covered poke cover politics under Trump have a much

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Speaker 3: more visceral understanding of the role of the press and

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Speaker 3: the fourth estate in a democracy.

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Speaker 2: I think we think of.

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Speaker 3: Our work as much more fraught, where when you have

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Speaker 3: a president who, if he doesn't like a question, is

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Speaker 3: calling you a very evil person, and then of course

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Speaker 3: what the vitriol of his followers what that entails.

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Speaker 2: So there's a lot.

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Speaker 3: More thinking about the stakes not just for our work,

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Speaker 3: but for our safety and for our democracy. I also

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Speaker 3: think a lot more about the concept of independence and

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Speaker 3: the independent press, and I think that's where the rub

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Speaker 3: takes place a lot more in covering Democrats, because there

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Speaker 3: is this expectation, I think wrongfully that the Democratic Party

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Speaker 3: has often of the media that because they're not explicitly

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Speaker 3: attacking journalists constantly, that our coverage should be a bit

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Speaker 3: softer or friendlier towards Democrats.

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Speaker 1: Well, I've had the left get mad at me, like,

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Speaker 1: what for that reason, you're supposed to be with us?

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Speaker 1: What are you talking about?

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Speaker 3: Right? And you're to cover a story, And this concept

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Speaker 3: of accountability then changes and sort of the definition of

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Speaker 3: what accountability reporting means for Democrats and Republicans. I think

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Speaker 3: there's this belief that it's different when it's really not.

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Speaker 3: We have to hold both sides accountable even now, and

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Speaker 3: so that's definitely more difficult, and I think it colors

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Speaker 3: the kind of source relationships that we have because we're

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Speaker 3: not just talking about what a candidate did. I mean,

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Speaker 3: especially during the twenty twenty four election, when we're doing

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Speaker 3: tough reporting on Kamala Harris and her campaign, We're not

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Speaker 3: only getting pushed back for the nature.

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Speaker 2: Of the story, but also for the stakes.

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Speaker 1: Of your health. Being the other side, how dare you right?

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Speaker 2: Right?

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Speaker 3: And so it's been we really really I will speak

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Speaker 3: for myself and saying I've really had to thicken my

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Speaker 3: skin when it comes to that kind of reporting, because

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Speaker 3: I'm not only defending the good work that we're doing,

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Speaker 3: but I'm also saying, look, this is fair game.

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Speaker 1: You know. I find Look, I've going through this transition

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Speaker 1: in the Trump Wars and then going through what I

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Speaker 1: went through in the first Trump one point out which

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Speaker 1: I've had had others say that, you know, I've that

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Speaker 1: it is. It is an experience they didn't want to repeat.

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Speaker 1: Right in that seat, I understood this, and it's just like, no,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's funny when you say my skin thick

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Speaker 1: and so much. I worried I was cynical, right, And

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Speaker 1: that is something that I think we fight all the time.

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Speaker 1: I certainly, you know, am constantly trying to check that

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Speaker 1: in my head. How do you check it? How do

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Speaker 1: you check it in your own head?

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Speaker 3: Talking to more people, that's really I mean, I think,

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Speaker 3: especially in covering this New York mayoral race, most of

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Speaker 3: us went into primary night in June fully expecting Andrew

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Speaker 3: Cuomo to be the Democratic.

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Speaker 2: Nominee for mayor and the next mayor of New York.

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Speaker 3: But if you talk to more of Mamdanni's supporters, I

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Speaker 3: will say, even the Friday before the election, watchings are

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Speaker 3: on Mamdannie walk the length of Manhattan and seeing the

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Speaker 3: response to such an audacious act made me think, not

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Speaker 3: only is this someone who may win, but the to

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Speaker 3: someone who was sort of rewriting the rules of New

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Speaker 3: York politics and of democratic politics. But if I hadn't

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Speaker 3: spoken to people like regular folks and not necessarily the

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Speaker 3: operatives who do make us a little bit dated, sometimes

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Speaker 3: I may have been even.

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Speaker 2: More surprised that Tuesday night.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, that's great to hear, because I wonder,

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Speaker 1: did you have editors, you know, did you come in thinking, hey,

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Speaker 1: you know what, if we were just looking at this

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Speaker 1: through the through the lens of talking everyday New Yorkers,

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Speaker 1: it looks like the race is going this way. Yet

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Speaker 1: you know, all of your editors, because this is such

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Speaker 1: a local and personal story for everybody, all of your

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Speaker 1: editors are also talking to some of your sources just

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Speaker 1: because it's right. They've been around for a long time,

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Speaker 1: and they hear certain things and they're like, well, yeah,

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Speaker 1: we've been through this before, but we know it's going

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Speaker 1: to end this way. And you know, I got to

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Speaker 1: I wonder when when you saw the actual result, what

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Speaker 1: reaffirmation did that tell you about your pre election reporting?

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Speaker 2: That's an interesting question.

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Speaker 3: The first thing that I remember thinking was I cannot

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Speaker 3: apply the same rules of national reporting that I learned

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Speaker 3: in Atlanta to politics in New York, where you have

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Speaker 3: to have this many black voters, this many white Jewish voters,

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Speaker 3: this many white liberal Brooklyn voters, this many you know,

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Speaker 3: Asian American Latino voters. Like that was sort of all

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Speaker 3: out of the window. And the nature of the sort

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Speaker 3: of like the kinds of sources that we're speaking to

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Speaker 3: who are giving us the information, they weren't even picking

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Speaker 3: up on some of these moves that we were seeing

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Speaker 3: closer to the ground. And so that we came out

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Speaker 3: of election night realizing, Okay, we need to just be

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Speaker 3: out in New York more, and we need to be

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Speaker 3: talking to more regular folks, and we need to realize

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Speaker 3: that the new power players don't look the way they

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Speaker 3: did even four years ago in the city. And so

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Speaker 3: that's an exciting opportunity honestly, because you get to know

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Speaker 3: new people and it just makes the story more interesting,

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Speaker 3: I think from a reporting standpoint.

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Speaker 2: It also just means our work is really cut out

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Speaker 2: for us between now and November four.

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Speaker 1: No, I mean it's sort of like, look, I'm thankful

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Speaker 1: for the New York Times and that they're not an

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Speaker 1: institution that's shrinking, right, They're not an institution that is

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Speaker 1: I mean, thank goodness, but it is literally they're the

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Speaker 1: last institution that's trying to protect independence and journalism. And

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Speaker 1: I've been just really disappointed in some of the places

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Speaker 1: I've worked out over the years and worked with over

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Speaker 1: the years that there has been a silence, right there's

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Speaker 1: this fear of speaking out and protecting the independence and

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Speaker 1: it's not there. But you get in another issue, which is,

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Speaker 1: as we've seen a contraction of reporting resources throughout the industry,

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Speaker 1: that in this moment where I think that political consultants

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Speaker 1: and the political and the actual American electorate have never

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Speaker 1: been more mismatched, like I think the consultant community is

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Speaker 1: stuck in an identity politics world. Yes, and I mean

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Speaker 1: this meaning that they I've been thinking about this a lot,

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Speaker 1: which is the result of the twenty twelve election convinced

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Speaker 1: operatives on the left and the right that I demographics

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Speaker 1: for destiny and that is not true, and it's actually

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Speaker 1: never been true. We think it is, But ultimately a

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Speaker 1: demographic ends up going in one direction because of a

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Speaker 1: persuasion message of some sort that works in a moment

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Speaker 1: in time, and then I think we forget that persuasion

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Speaker 1: still matters and that voters are more independent minded than

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Speaker 1: we sit here, and we spend. In some ways, this

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Speaker 1: is the tyranny of too much data, right, we look

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Speaker 1: at it through the lens of data, not through the

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Speaker 1: lens of people. Yes, And let me just look at

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Speaker 1: the what you just pointed out in the in the

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Speaker 1: makeup of Mom Danni's winning coalition, that would not have

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Speaker 1: been the coalition that every consultant said was a winning

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Speaker 1: was a coalition that you could have put together for him.

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Speaker 1: And it's like, Okay, the consultants who have been the

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Speaker 1: sources for a lot of political reporters for the last

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Speaker 1: decade maybe the least informed about the electorate out there

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Speaker 1: because they don't go out anymore. They're doing everything digitally,

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Speaker 1: everything digitally, and they're seeing it through the prism of

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Speaker 1: a database, not through the prism of people.

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Speaker 3: And I think your point about persuasion is so important,

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Speaker 3: Like that was I think what we saw happen in

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Speaker 3: twenty twenty four there was not a persuasive enough message

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Speaker 3: to galvanize Democratic base voters and bring new voters into

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Speaker 3: the fold. And I think also what we had to

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Speaker 3: realize here in New York is that class is a

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Speaker 3: much bigger driving force now for people's politics than race

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Speaker 3: and representation.

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Speaker 1: I can make a dirty little secret. Class has always

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Speaker 1: been more important, And I said that, yeah, it has

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Speaker 1: always been. I mean, go back to the New Deal Coalition.

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Speaker 1: If people want to remember what it looked like, it

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Speaker 1: was a class. Go back to the civil you know,

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Speaker 1: you know the thing that people forget about the March

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Speaker 1: on Washington. It was a socioeconomic argument. Yes there was

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Speaker 1: civil rights in there, but it was it was a

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Speaker 1: socioeconomic argument. It's why labor unions that were mostly white

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Speaker 1: people were supportive of it. Right. It was a jobs

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Speaker 1: of It was this in some ways. It was a

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Speaker 1: jobs event.

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Speaker 3: And there's no bog a place to look at how

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Speaker 3: this is happening than New York City, where rents are

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Speaker 3: in the threes and fours and three.

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Speaker 1: Fast to damn Hi Maya, I miss that guy.

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Speaker 3: Look, I'm living it, and it's it's really a lot.

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Speaker 3: The MTA is getting more expensive. And here you have

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Speaker 3: a candidate in Mom Donnie who is unrelenting in a

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Speaker 3: message on affordability and making New York a place that

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Speaker 3: people can afford to live and raise their kids, and

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Speaker 3: is really speaking about it in very practical terms. And

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Speaker 3: that's just bringing a whole broad swath of new voters

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Speaker 3: into the fold, young people who were never politically involved.

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Speaker 3: Thousands canvassing across the city, you know, and this is

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Speaker 3: not something that New Yorkers have seen in a long time.

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Speaker 3: It's also created, of course, problems for Mom Donnie and

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Speaker 3: sort of the appearance of his coalition.

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Speaker 2: But it's clear that this is something that works here.

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Speaker 1: Before I jump into more on the Mom Donnie race,

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Speaker 1: I imagine I would love people to understand the editing

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Speaker 1: process and the copy editing process and the fact checking

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Speaker 1: process that you have to go through at the New

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Speaker 1: York Times, because I don't think even true political consumers,

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Speaker 1: who who who might be the most likely folks watching

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Speaker 1: our conversation right now, fully appreciate the levels you've got

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Speaker 1: to go through and the stuff that gets checked on

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Speaker 1: your reporting. And I do want to disparage the other

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Speaker 1: outlet you work at, but it's just not the same level.

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Speaker 1: I know this. It's just the amount of money the

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Speaker 1: Times puts into this, and the Wall Street Journal is

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Speaker 1: frankly just as good at this and have these layers

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Speaker 1: of copy editors and fact checkers. But walk me through

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Speaker 1: a process on that, because I think this is a

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Speaker 1: process that people should know more about.

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Speaker 3: I'm very glad you asked, because I think sometimes folks

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Speaker 3: think that we play it really fast and loose with the.

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Speaker 1: Facts, especially the times, not.

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Speaker 3: At the times, and especially not when we're covering politics

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Speaker 3: and we're talking about real people, policies and priorities. Of course,

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Speaker 3: it starts with a general fact or fact finding mission,

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Speaker 3: you know, when we're talking about, say, a story that

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Speaker 3: my colleagues wrote recently about Mamdani and his relationship to

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Speaker 3: the Democratic Socialists of America, involves just talking to a

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Speaker 3: broad slew of people who are in that organization, getting

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Speaker 3: as much information as possible. Then comes actually, you know,

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Speaker 3: talking with colleagues and with editors to figure out what

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Speaker 3: is the actual story here. How can we streamline the

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Speaker 3: facts that we've gotten and put that into a coherent

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Speaker 3: piece that you know, millions of people will read. Once

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Speaker 3: you have a first draft, editor takes a look at it,

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Speaker 3: you know, make sure that everything is in place.

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Speaker 2: But as the editor is going through it, reporters are also.

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Speaker 3: Going through it line by line, fact checking names, ages, locations,

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Speaker 3: double triple checking, making sure we did have this conversation

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Speaker 3: on this day at this place, and they told us.

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Speaker 3: Often I'm going back to sources and calling them and saying,

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Speaker 3: you know, I want to make sure this is right.

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Speaker 3: I want to make sure that I'm characterizing these situation correctly,

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Speaker 3: and there is a little push and pull, you know,

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Speaker 3: sometimes if people don't like the carry of the characterization

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Speaker 3: is not always favorable. I'm not really there to have

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Speaker 3: that conversation. I'm more just making sure that this is accurate.

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Speaker 3: And that's often the rub there too, where people are

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Speaker 3: upset about stories about.

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Speaker 1: It's the subjective part, yeah, exactly.

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Speaker 2: Like is this a correction or is this just a conversation.

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Speaker 3: And then you know, after a first edit, when we're

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Speaker 3: actually getting ready to publish, not only do usually two

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Speaker 3: editors look at the story, then there is a second

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Speaker 3: editor who has probably not even looked at the story before,

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Speaker 3: which is pretty helpful because they're just going in completely

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Speaker 3: clean and they're giving it a much more robust copy edit,

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Speaker 3: making sure that you know, we're remaining and keeping with

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Speaker 3: ap style, everything is spelled correctly, and also sometimes they're

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Speaker 3: asking questions to make sure things are accurate. We even

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Speaker 3: have a fact checking tool in our our writing system

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Speaker 3: that we use where we can literally underline and say.

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Speaker 2: This has been fact checked. This has been fact checked,

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Speaker 2: and that.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it's a really robust process, but it's important,

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Speaker 3: and that's why when we do get corrections, we're always devastated.

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Speaker 3: Reporters are like just so upset. And it's actually a

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Speaker 3: really extensive process to get a correction where you're not

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Speaker 3: only going through an editor, you're going through a third

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Speaker 3: party that's looking at it and making sure.

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Speaker 2: And then of course we're putting that on the story

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Speaker 2: to say.

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Speaker 1: Can you estimate how many people go through your story

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Speaker 1: before it before it's published.

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Speaker 3: It depends, you know, for a daily story, it might

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Speaker 3: be two or three, but for a bigger story that's

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Speaker 3: going on the front page, could be a dozen editors.

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Speaker 3: We also have a standards team that looks at the

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Speaker 3: tone and tenor, and then sometimes legal looks at our

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Speaker 3: stories too, to make sure we're not, you know, going

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Speaker 3: to be sued for anything.

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Speaker 1: It's interesting you said the words front page was the

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Speaker 1: last time you had a newspaper delivered to your house?

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Speaker 2: Oh check, don't expose me. I love no.

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Speaker 1: I say this like so the reporters I grew up

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Speaker 1: with so well. I always say, my big break came

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Speaker 1: in ninety five ninety six. At the time, the small

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Speaker 1: publication I was working with partnered with the Washington Post

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Speaker 1: and ABC News to create the first ever political website.

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Speaker 1: It's called Politics Now. And the idea was, all these

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Speaker 1: great political reporters for Newsweek and Washington Post and ABC News,

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Speaker 1: We're all going to contribute to this one website. Well,

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Speaker 1: guess what. None of them wanted to write for the

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Speaker 1: Internet because they didn't think anybody was reading right, and

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Speaker 1: they all wanted to write for their own publications. Howard

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Speaker 1: Fireman recipes he did at the time. You know, hey,

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Speaker 1: I want to be in the magazine. I don't care

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Speaker 1: if I'm on the Internet. And David brought her in

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Speaker 1: Dan Balls, you know, And so it was a break

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Speaker 1: for a twenty four year old like me because nobody

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Speaker 1: else and I'm writing for you know suddenly. And I

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Speaker 1: always say, one of the lessons I learned, don't be

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Speaker 1: a snob about new technology, right, you know it is

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Speaker 1: and I say that and I'm a snob about TikTok,

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Speaker 1: but anyway, but I digress. But the being on the

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Speaker 1: front page, it is the equivalent of it. At NBC

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Speaker 1: was getting on the Today show we're getting there. Okay,

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Speaker 1: that's the front page that be seen and it is

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Speaker 1: it is the editor. I'm just curious, is it still

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Speaker 1: seen as a prestigious thing anymore? Because how and what

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Speaker 1: does the front page mean? Is it the front page

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Speaker 1: of the app? Does it mean it's in an you

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Speaker 1: know what I mean? Like, I'm just curious now, being

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Speaker 1: at the Times for as long as you have when

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Speaker 1: you hear front page piece, because you just use the language, Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: what does that mean in the modern era at the.

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Speaker 3: Time, and there are different definitions of it now even internally,

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Speaker 3: so I think you know, a front page story is

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Speaker 3: also going to usually lead the site or be pretty

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Speaker 3: high up on the site or on the app. However,

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Speaker 3: you receive the digital product, and that matters a lot

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Speaker 3: because millions and millions of people are going to see it.

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Speaker 3: I will say, personally, I really value still being on

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Speaker 3: the front page. I remember when I got my first

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Speaker 3: a one plate, which is the printing plate that they

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Speaker 3: use for the page. They usually gifted to you if

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Speaker 3: you for your first year, your first front page story.

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Speaker 3: It's like one of my most prized Times possessions. But

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Speaker 3: I also had a similar feeling of pride the first

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Speaker 3: time I got push alerted, the first time my story

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Speaker 3: was a New York Times Push alert, and I realized, Okay,

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Speaker 3: I'm really living in the digital age because this matters

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Speaker 3: almost way more in terms of reach than being on

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Speaker 3: the front page of.

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Speaker 1: The physical So when I left NBC, I was a

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Speaker 1: New York Times Push alert and I didn't yes, you were,

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Speaker 1: And I had people say to me, oh my god,

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Speaker 1: you were a New York Times Push alert. That I

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Speaker 1: went great. So now more people I have to talk

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Speaker 1: about this more, like you know, it was more, But

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Speaker 1: it was like, I didn't realize that that was Like,

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Speaker 1: is that the new front page? The push alert?

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Speaker 3: It's a point of pride, for sure, I think in

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Speaker 3: terms of prestige and just like wow factor being a

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Speaker 3: push alert, especially on a big story.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I'm sure the.

439
00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:51,320
Speaker 3: Reporter who broke your story was pretty proud of themselves

440
00:21:51,359 --> 00:21:52,600
Speaker 3: to happen because they want to put it right.

441
00:21:52,640 --> 00:21:55,120
Speaker 1: You want to feel like, hey, was it worth my time? Right?

442
00:21:55,240 --> 00:21:56,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally totally.

443
00:21:56,600 --> 00:22:07,280
Speaker 1: I know I get that. So let's dig into mom

444
00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:13,359
Speaker 1: Donnie here a little bit. And you've talked about the disconnect.

445
00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:17,199
Speaker 1: Have you seen so you were covering the Cuomo campaign.

446
00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:19,640
Speaker 1: Have you seen them change? Are they a different campaign

447
00:22:19,680 --> 00:22:23,440
Speaker 1: now or are they trying to run the same play

448
00:22:23,560 --> 00:22:24,760
Speaker 1: just with a different electorate.

449
00:22:25,560 --> 00:22:28,480
Speaker 3: You know, Clomo's primary campaign we described as a rose

450
00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:33,679
Speaker 3: Garden strategy, meaning very limited appearances, very few interviews, and

451
00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:37,040
Speaker 3: very tightly controlled narrative around who the candidate is and

452
00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:37,680
Speaker 3: what he's doing.

453
00:22:37,840 --> 00:22:40,840
Speaker 1: The fact that the bagel news was the biggest news

454
00:22:40,920 --> 00:22:43,920
Speaker 1: right when he didn't need a bagel, And I remember

455
00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:46,280
Speaker 1: he finally and it was like the New York Times

456
00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:49,800
Speaker 1: first interview with Cuomo was this weird style section type

457
00:22:49,800 --> 00:22:52,600
Speaker 1: of interview, right, because he didn't want to engage with

458
00:22:52,760 --> 00:22:55,320
Speaker 1: the reporters that knew the campaign, right, and he.

459
00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:57,399
Speaker 2: Just came across as someone who had not lived in

460
00:22:57,400 --> 00:22:59,720
Speaker 2: New York since the ages or the nineties.

461
00:23:00,119 --> 00:23:00,639
Speaker 1: True.

462
00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:04,719
Speaker 3: Wow, Now he's everywhere. I mean, we're staffing him at

463
00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:06,639
Speaker 3: an event in about an hour. He's going to make

464
00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:10,880
Speaker 3: an announcement that his campaign hasn't yet shared, but it'll

465
00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:13,440
Speaker 3: be something related to his campaign. I'm sure he'll take

466
00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:18,119
Speaker 3: interviews after that. He's inviting reporters along him to just

467
00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:20,720
Speaker 3: spend time with him when he's in the field. He's

468
00:23:20,760 --> 00:23:23,359
Speaker 3: not just going to union halls in black churches. He

469
00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:26,840
Speaker 3: was actually at a Hindu temple over the weekend, and

470
00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:31,440
Speaker 3: he's trying his best to seem more personable and more

471
00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:33,880
Speaker 3: accessible to press and to voters.

472
00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:35,320
Speaker 2: The challenge he's up.

473
00:23:35,280 --> 00:23:38,200
Speaker 3: Against, though, is he still has a very limited coalition

474
00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:42,800
Speaker 3: where Mom Donnie is expanding the coalition or expanding the electorate,

475
00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:46,320
Speaker 3: and it's going to be the biggest challenge for everyone

476
00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:49,920
Speaker 3: who's not in this campaign, especially Adams and Cuomo, who

477
00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:52,600
Speaker 3: are still very well known. And we'll probably get you know,

478
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:56,000
Speaker 3: a sizeable number of voters, but it just may not

479
00:23:56,119 --> 00:23:58,679
Speaker 3: be enough because again, that would be operating from the

480
00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:01,360
Speaker 3: same set of assumptions that were in twenty twenty one

481
00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:03,800
Speaker 3: or even twenty seventeen, and not twenty twenty five.

482
00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:06,679
Speaker 1: No, I mean, that's the it is. The question is

483
00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:10,679
Speaker 1: how much does you know? The joke is, you know,

484
00:24:10,720 --> 00:24:13,040
Speaker 1: too much of politics is always running the last campaign,

485
00:24:13,160 --> 00:24:16,760
Speaker 1: and the campaigns that win are the ones that in

486
00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:20,640
Speaker 1: some ways don't allow the past to get in the way, right,

487
00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:28,119
Speaker 1: don't do that? What kind of is Eric Adams running

488
00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:31,880
Speaker 1: a full fledged campaign or is it you know, he's

489
00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:34,280
Speaker 1: serving as mayor and it's more of the infrastructure of

490
00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:37,520
Speaker 1: the office that is his campaign. How would you assess that.

491
00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:40,399
Speaker 3: I think it's more of the latter, though Adams himself

492
00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:42,720
Speaker 3: would tell you he's running a full fledged campaign and

493
00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:45,080
Speaker 3: it's full speed ahead. But you know, all of his

494
00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:47,720
Speaker 3: former allies who ran his last campaign, who know him

495
00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:50,320
Speaker 3: the best, have largely abandoned them, have left the campaign.

496
00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:53,040
Speaker 1: Where are they going? Kwama or Mom Donnie are a

497
00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:53,680
Speaker 1: little bit of both.

498
00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:55,360
Speaker 3: Some of them have just struck out on their own.

499
00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:57,520
Speaker 3: They're taking a moment to breathe, and they're not on

500
00:24:57,560 --> 00:25:00,520
Speaker 3: any of the campaigns. I think people feel like he

501
00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:04,040
Speaker 3: is just too much of an unknown. There's still real

502
00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:08,000
Speaker 3: questions about his relationship to the Trump administration and what

503
00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:12,320
Speaker 3: a possible second mayoral tenure for him would really look

504
00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:15,560
Speaker 3: like for the city. And even you know, I was

505
00:25:16,280 --> 00:25:19,480
Speaker 3: at a black church in Southeast Queens which was like

506
00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:22,520
Speaker 3: the heart of Adams's support in twenty twenty one, and

507
00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:24,960
Speaker 3: people have really turned their back on him, and so

508
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:27,320
Speaker 3: he has a lot of work to do that I

509
00:25:27,320 --> 00:25:31,080
Speaker 3: think will go beyond just events and staffing, but actually

510
00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:35,359
Speaker 3: rebuilding trust and being able to re establish really really

511
00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:40,600
Speaker 3: important communal relationships. And I'm not sure that staffing is

512
00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:43,320
Speaker 3: going to be enough for him in that way.

513
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:46,199
Speaker 2: But some people, some people are still hanging on.

514
00:25:46,960 --> 00:25:51,680
Speaker 3: And I think the specter of a black mayor after

515
00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:54,280
Speaker 3: Dinkins it was only just a one term black mayor

516
00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:58,520
Speaker 3: trying to sort of be a two term mayor and

517
00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:02,680
Speaker 3: sort of bug history is appealing to some people. It's

518
00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:05,560
Speaker 3: just he has a lot speaking to your point about

519
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:08,359
Speaker 3: the past, it's getting hard for him to outrun it.

520
00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:12,920
Speaker 1: That's interesting. I'm there. I'm curious when you dove into

521
00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:14,879
Speaker 1: this race and you saw Curtis Lee while with the

522
00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:17,560
Speaker 1: Red Fedora, did you know what the Guardian Angels were?

523
00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:20,800
Speaker 2: No, I'll admit I did not. I did not, But no,

524
00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:22,480
Speaker 2: I think this is a huge.

525
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:25,119
Speaker 1: Right, I think this is a huge problem. I mean,

526
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:28,720
Speaker 1: you have to be my age to know the Guardian Angels, Like,

527
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:31,200
Speaker 1: I don't think it's a are they. I don't feel

528
00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:34,160
Speaker 1: like their presence in New York City anymore. They were

529
00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:36,879
Speaker 1: in the late seventies, early eighties. You know, it was

530
00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:38,879
Speaker 1: a thing. I mean, it was for a brief period

531
00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:42,040
Speaker 1: of thing. And he was he had had a moment, right,

532
00:26:42,080 --> 00:26:45,240
Speaker 1: everybody gets a moment, you know, I mean, my goodness,

533
00:26:45,400 --> 00:26:49,280
Speaker 1: Andy Warhol was so right. He had no idea social media. Everybody.

534
00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:52,879
Speaker 1: Everybody's going to get there fifteen seconds, then they're fifteen minutes.

535
00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:56,040
Speaker 1: And he got it in the eighties and he sort

536
00:26:56,040 --> 00:26:59,080
Speaker 1: of has been, you know, in some ways, you know,

537
00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:01,399
Speaker 1: living off the fumes of that, and I mean that

538
00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:03,479
Speaker 1: with no, he's not alone and that you know, somebody

539
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:06,040
Speaker 1: makes makes a mark in a moment, and you know,

540
00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:10,400
Speaker 1: sort of continues to live with it. Are you seeing

541
00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:13,320
Speaker 1: a campaign? Is it is it? Is it starting to

542
00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 1: resemble something that might be that we should be taking

543
00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:18,399
Speaker 1: more seriously or is it still feel tixotic?

544
00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:21,199
Speaker 3: Well I will I will point you to my colleague

545
00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:23,480
Speaker 3: Nick Fandos, who actually wrote a great story this morning

546
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:26,679
Speaker 3: about Sleewa and the ways he's actually taking the beret

547
00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:28,720
Speaker 3: off to appear a little bit more.

548
00:27:28,880 --> 00:27:31,440
Speaker 1: I saw that anecdote about how, hey, he actually took

549
00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:33,600
Speaker 1: it off for a meeting, like, hey, take me more

550
00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:34,600
Speaker 1: seriously this time.

551
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:36,439
Speaker 2: And that's the message. That's the message.

552
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:38,960
Speaker 3: And I think, you know, people don't know who the

553
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:42,560
Speaker 3: Guardian Angels are, but the concerns about public safety certainly

554
00:27:42,560 --> 00:27:45,160
Speaker 3: do still persist. And I think that's what he's going

555
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:48,880
Speaker 3: to be leaning into and Republicans still see an opening.

556
00:27:49,359 --> 00:27:51,320
Speaker 3: I think just given the fact that there are real

557
00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:55,000
Speaker 3: concerns about mom. Donnie Adams is sort of flailing right now.

558
00:27:55,760 --> 00:27:58,439
Speaker 3: People don't know what Como's going to do. So if

559
00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:01,680
Speaker 3: enough for publican voters turn out and coalesce behind him

560
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:04,520
Speaker 3: and it does indeed turn into a two person race,

561
00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:05,680
Speaker 3: these are all huge ifs.

562
00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:07,480
Speaker 2: By the way, likes may not happen at all.

563
00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:10,080
Speaker 3: No, there's a lot of that has to happen before

564
00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:11,280
Speaker 3: any of this becomes real.

565
00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:13,040
Speaker 2: But I think should that happen?

566
00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:15,719
Speaker 3: I mean, New York politics are so unpredictable that you know,

567
00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:18,400
Speaker 3: this year, Sleewa feels like I take the beret off,

568
00:28:18,680 --> 00:28:20,919
Speaker 3: I lean into the issues that people really care about,

569
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:23,840
Speaker 3: and you know, the fears and concerns they may have

570
00:28:23,880 --> 00:28:26,320
Speaker 3: about my opponents, and see what happens.

571
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:30,440
Speaker 1: Look. I remember on September tenth, two thousand and one,

572
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:31,960
Speaker 1: Freddy Ferrer was going to be the next mayor of

573
00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:35,960
Speaker 1: New York City. Okay, it just was going to be.

574
00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:38,480
Speaker 1: He was going to win the primary. He was going

575
00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:41,120
Speaker 1: to be the next mayor, and every and when you

576
00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:43,560
Speaker 1: literally when they say everything changed, that was one of

577
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:47,400
Speaker 1: the races where everything changed. Michael Bloomberg was seen as

578
00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:51,320
Speaker 1: a Oh that's nice, this rich billionaire that's never going

579
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:53,840
Speaker 1: to happen, and all of a sudden it did so

580
00:28:54,200 --> 00:28:57,880
Speaker 1: and this is you know, so anything can happen, anything

581
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:02,560
Speaker 1: can change. Should we take the Walden independent candidacy seriously?

582
00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:06,040
Speaker 1: Have you guys rethought it in the in the wake

583
00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:08,360
Speaker 1: of Mom Donnie or has he not gotten any traction?

584
00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:10,000
Speaker 3: I will say this, the one thing that we have

585
00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:13,600
Speaker 3: taken seriously about the Walden candidacy is his call for

586
00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:19,720
Speaker 3: coalesce coalescing behind one candidate. So he said that if

587
00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:23,360
Speaker 3: I think after Labor Day, you know, whoever's doing the

588
00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:25,960
Speaker 3: best or who seems best poised to defeat Mom Donnie,

589
00:29:26,040 --> 00:29:29,560
Speaker 3: everyone else should drop out, coalesce behind that person, make

590
00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:31,480
Speaker 3: it a two man race. Sliwa has already said he

591
00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:35,080
Speaker 3: will not do this. Cuomo has said he's open to it. Adams,

592
00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:37,120
Speaker 3: I think, has also said he won't but we'll see.

593
00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:40,200
Speaker 3: But it's an interesting idea, and I think of course

594
00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:42,440
Speaker 3: he's proposed it because he believes he'll be that person.

595
00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:44,200
Speaker 1: You know.

596
00:29:44,280 --> 00:29:47,760
Speaker 3: Again, we'll see, uh, But that that is is one

597
00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:49,560
Speaker 3: of the things that actually could really change this race.

598
00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:50,720
Speaker 2: If if it's successful.

599
00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:55,320
Speaker 1: Well, it's interesting we've seen you know, this kind of

600
00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:57,960
Speaker 1: happened in Buffalo, right where there was a coalisting around

601
00:29:57,920 --> 00:30:01,360
Speaker 1: around the incumbent mayor primary and then he was able.

602
00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:04,360
Speaker 1: But you know, he didn't have the baggage of Eric Adams,

603
00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:06,920
Speaker 1: he didn't have the baggage of the Republican Party. Where

604
00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:09,400
Speaker 1: I just don't know if New York City and a

605
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:13,360
Speaker 1: Trump led, you know, a Bush led Republican Party, I

606
00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:16,320
Speaker 1: could see New York City voters more open to that,

607
00:30:16,440 --> 00:30:20,120
Speaker 1: right the Bloomberg version. I just don't know if the

608
00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:22,600
Speaker 1: Trump version of the Republican Party is something that New

609
00:30:22,680 --> 00:30:25,600
Speaker 1: York City would would would rally around. But you know

610
00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:27,760
Speaker 1: that's why, that's why they play the game. That's why

611
00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:30,719
Speaker 1: that's the election that's right on this front. In our

612
00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:33,400
Speaker 1: last few minutes here, I'm curious of what you learned

613
00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:38,000
Speaker 1: in Atlanta. I find and I mean this, I find

614
00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:42,120
Speaker 1: that what's happening in Georgia I still think we don't

615
00:30:42,400 --> 00:30:45,640
Speaker 1: you know, is it is it similar to what we

616
00:30:45,640 --> 00:30:50,160
Speaker 1: saw in Virginia where one giant metro area redefined the

617
00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:53,760
Speaker 1: politics of a state, which Northern Virginia did. Northern Virginia

618
00:30:53,840 --> 00:30:58,240
Speaker 1: is totally redefine what Virginia is. Over the last twenty years,

619
00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:03,720
Speaker 1: the Denver suburbs totally changed Colorado. The Phoenix suburbs have

620
00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:08,400
Speaker 1: totally Phoenix. And it's in this giant megapolis, right. Atlanta

621
00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:13,400
Speaker 1: is similarly doing this to Georgia. Yeah, you were there

622
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:16,320
Speaker 1: sort of in the middle of it happening. And one

623
00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:17,960
Speaker 1: of the things I always like to say that the

624
00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:21,120
Speaker 1: weird thing about our divide in America today versus say,

625
00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 1: one hundred and twenty years ago, is how it's isn't geographic,

626
00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:27,040
Speaker 1: but it really is on class and it is on

627
00:31:27,080 --> 00:31:30,560
Speaker 1: where you live. That Atlanta and its suburbs has more

628
00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:33,880
Speaker 1: in common with northern New Jersey in the suburbs of

629
00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:38,320
Speaker 1: New York than it does with Marjorie Taylor's Greens District

630
00:31:38,920 --> 00:31:42,600
Speaker 1: in northwest Georgia. Ye, that your experience is that, I mean,

631
00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:45,600
Speaker 1: how would you describe being in the in the Atlanta

632
00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:49,320
Speaker 1: metro area, which of course arguably meant you were thirty

633
00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:50,160
Speaker 1: minutes from Georgia.

634
00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 3: Yes, and I grew up in the Florida Panhandle, which, oh,

635
00:31:54,680 --> 00:32:00,000
Speaker 3: in some ways I never left Georgia. Colsey, No, that's right, Tallahassee,

636
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:01,880
Speaker 3: Tifton Georgia, right was that's very.

637
00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:05,360
Speaker 1: Closest down and Thomas Mills. I'm U Floridian, so you know, yep,

638
00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:08,160
Speaker 1: so you already know, yes, you know what Tipton, Georgia

639
00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:11,760
Speaker 1: what just a this will age me. It was the

640
00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:14,000
Speaker 1: closest Wendy's to the state of Florida. When I was

641
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:16,040
Speaker 1: a kid, my dad and I used to do this

642
00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:18,840
Speaker 1: road trip every year. We didn't have baseball in Miami

643
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:20,239
Speaker 1: at the time, and we do a road trip every

644
00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:22,720
Speaker 1: year to Atlanta in August. And we did this about

645
00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:25,920
Speaker 1: four straight years and we always stopped at that Wendy's.

646
00:32:25,920 --> 00:32:28,040
Speaker 1: He was really excited. He's like, oh, there's this when

647
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:30,560
Speaker 1: you know. Then of course Wendy's, you know, became national.

648
00:32:30,800 --> 00:32:31,600
Speaker 1: But it was Tifton.

649
00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:34,200
Speaker 2: That is so interesting. I wonder why they chose Tifton.

650
00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:36,640
Speaker 1: Well, it was just like you know, like Eddie, it

651
00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:40,560
Speaker 1: was I guess, you know, as they were expanding south right, yeah, edging,

652
00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:44,920
Speaker 1: edging down and then eventually we finally got one. But anyway,

653
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:46,800
Speaker 1: go ahead, sorry about the difference.

654
00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:49,000
Speaker 3: That No, no, I'll just say really quickly, you know,

655
00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:52,840
Speaker 3: I think that Georgia in the Atlanta metro area for

656
00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:56,080
Speaker 3: me was the perfect and biggest stress test of this idea,

657
00:32:56,120 --> 00:33:00,000
Speaker 3: whether demographics or destiny, because it was expanding so much.

658
00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:03,600
Speaker 3: She had this influx of younger families, many people of

659
00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:06,720
Speaker 3: color groups that you would consider Democratic voters.

660
00:33:07,400 --> 00:33:09,400
Speaker 1: And so there was this lot of Southeast Asian, right,

661
00:33:09,440 --> 00:33:09,840
Speaker 1: which is.

662
00:33:09,760 --> 00:33:11,560
Speaker 3: A lot of Southeast Asia, a lot of East Asian

663
00:33:11,680 --> 00:33:14,440
Speaker 3: as well, a lot of train folks, a lot of

664
00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:17,520
Speaker 3: Latino folks. Like there's this expectation then that all these

665
00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 3: black voters, all these new Asian voters, all these new

666
00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:24,040
Speaker 3: young people, white folks from places like California, New York,

667
00:33:24,320 --> 00:33:28,240
Speaker 3: that means that as Atlanta expands, Georgia will be purple

668
00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:29,719
Speaker 3: and blue and eventually blue.

669
00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:31,120
Speaker 2: But that really was not the case.

670
00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:33,800
Speaker 3: I mean, the work that Abrams and the New Georgia

671
00:33:33,840 --> 00:33:36,400
Speaker 3: Project and many of her allies in the Democratic Party

672
00:33:36,400 --> 00:33:40,600
Speaker 3: did to galvanize voters was very expensive and very intense.

673
00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:43,280
Speaker 2: It took a lot. It just was not solely a

674
00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:44,880
Speaker 2: reliance on demographics.

675
00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:47,600
Speaker 3: And then what we saw in twenty twenty four, where

676
00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 3: Trump won Georgia by two points, felt like almost a

677
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:52,960
Speaker 3: reversion to the mean because that infrastructure was not as

678
00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:56,160
Speaker 3: well in place. I think, you know, Harris was able

679
00:33:56,160 --> 00:33:58,800
Speaker 3: to galvanize a lot of base voters. She did expand

680
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:03,440
Speaker 3: her coalition there but wasn't enough. And you know, these

681
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:06,600
Speaker 3: sort of red pockets in Georgia, in the north and

682
00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:09,480
Speaker 3: in the south, these are still really active and engaged

683
00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:12,240
Speaker 3: base voters. And you also have these sort of reddish,

684
00:34:12,320 --> 00:34:15,520
Speaker 3: purplish areas in North Fulton, still in the Atlanta area,

685
00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:18,759
Speaker 3: but still pretty conservative. So Democrats have been able to

686
00:34:18,800 --> 00:34:21,800
Speaker 3: be successful at the federal level, of course, with Biden's

687
00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:24,200
Speaker 3: win in twenty twenty and the two Democratic Senate seats,

688
00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:28,480
Speaker 3: but state politics, the governor's mansion and the entire sort

689
00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:31,960
Speaker 3: of executive branch in Georgia, even the state.

690
00:34:31,719 --> 00:34:33,120
Speaker 2: House is still very red.

691
00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:35,960
Speaker 3: And there there's still i mean, a Georgia Democrat is

692
00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:38,480
Speaker 3: not a New York Democrat. There's still a level of

693
00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:41,960
Speaker 3: conservatism and moderation there that doesn't really exist in a little.

694
00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:45,520
Speaker 1: More cultural conservatism, it's absolutely And so the messages they

695
00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:48,480
Speaker 1: more church going probably than much more church Democrat.

696
00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:49,440
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah.

697
00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:52,880
Speaker 3: And also you know this this to the point about class,

698
00:34:53,040 --> 00:34:55,680
Speaker 3: you know, speaking to these sort of blue collar issues

699
00:34:56,000 --> 00:34:58,919
Speaker 3: really matters in an agricultural state like Georgia as well.

700
00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:01,879
Speaker 3: And so you know, I think that the state will

701
00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:04,200
Speaker 3: still be in play very much. I'm looking watching the

702
00:35:04,360 --> 00:35:07,759
Speaker 3: ASoft Senate race with a lot of interest because it's

703
00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:11,960
Speaker 3: not just again going to be reliant upon the expansion

704
00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:13,840
Speaker 3: of this blue area. It's also going to be a

705
00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:16,239
Speaker 3: matter of getting these folks out, giving them something to

706
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 3: vote for. But I do think Democrats are right to

707
00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:22,120
Speaker 3: believe they have real opportunities in the South, not just

708
00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:24,360
Speaker 3: in Georgia, but in other places where they can really

709
00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:29,160
Speaker 3: spend the money to galvanize folks. It's just a longer process,

710
00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:31,200
Speaker 3: and it's it's I think it's just going to continue

711
00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:31,479
Speaker 3: to swing.

712
00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:34,080
Speaker 1: Well, there's an inherent like it is amazing to me.

713
00:35:34,120 --> 00:35:36,319
Speaker 1: I think Democrats are always looking for a shortcut to win,

714
00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:39,319
Speaker 1: and so they think they think metro areas and demographics

715
00:35:39,360 --> 00:35:42,400
Speaker 1: are the way to do it when you got to

716
00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:45,040
Speaker 1: run an operation in every county, even if you're going

717
00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:47,480
Speaker 1: to lose seventy thirty, because if you lose sixty nine

718
00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 1: to thirty one, that's better than losing seventy one twenty eight.

719
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:56,080
Speaker 1: You know, seventy one twenty nine. It matters, like incremental

720
00:35:56,160 --> 00:35:58,960
Speaker 1: gains matter. And this doesn't seem like a party that

721
00:35:59,000 --> 00:36:02,839
Speaker 1: thinks that way right now. Not yet, Yeah, yeah, as

722
00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:06,520
Speaker 1: I say, they haven't lost enough. You know, Look that's

723
00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:08,640
Speaker 1: the irony. The Republic has lost a bunch of elections

724
00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:11,759
Speaker 1: and they said, you know, we're started campaigning in the

725
00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:15,920
Speaker 1: Bronx in New York City and people would laugh at them.

726
00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:19,399
Speaker 1: But he cut their Trump cut these margins and metro

727
00:36:19,440 --> 00:36:22,320
Speaker 1: areas all over the country, and look what happened. He

728
00:36:22,360 --> 00:36:24,640
Speaker 1: won the popular vote and that mattered for him as

729
00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:28,560
Speaker 1: far as governing and legitimacy. So you know, but it

730
00:36:28,640 --> 00:36:31,719
Speaker 1: took losing, right, you got to you know, you don't

731
00:36:31,719 --> 00:36:34,120
Speaker 1: think about changing your strategy until you've lost enough. And

732
00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:36,080
Speaker 1: that's the question I've had in my head. Have the

733
00:36:36,120 --> 00:36:39,279
Speaker 1: Democrats lost enough changed the change their mindset? I don't

734
00:36:39,320 --> 00:36:42,640
Speaker 1: know right That's where it's an open question. Maya, this

735
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:45,759
Speaker 1: was terrific. Did you end up up? Did you end

736
00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:46,920
Speaker 1: up Florida State Seminole?

737
00:36:47,640 --> 00:36:48,080
Speaker 2: I did not?

738
00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:50,160
Speaker 1: Or a fam you rattler or like what?

739
00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:54,120
Speaker 3: My dad was a family employee for many years, so

740
00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:56,480
Speaker 3: I spent a lot of time on the highest society.

741
00:36:56,520 --> 00:36:58,520
Speaker 1: I have the right colors. I always say green and

742
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:01,799
Speaker 1: orange is a darker orange. And my beloved Miami and Hurricanes,

743
00:37:01,840 --> 00:37:04,720
Speaker 1: but I always Florida and M was my other Florida

744
00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:06,600
Speaker 1: team because we shared the same call. I was like, yes,

745
00:37:06,960 --> 00:37:08,759
Speaker 1: you know, and I was kind of a marching band

746
00:37:08,760 --> 00:37:12,000
Speaker 1: geek and close friend of mine, close friend of mine

747
00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:15,560
Speaker 1: in high school was a drum major of family.

748
00:37:15,840 --> 00:37:16,680
Speaker 2: Oh that's incredible.

749
00:37:16,800 --> 00:37:17,000
Speaker 1: Yeah.

750
00:37:17,120 --> 00:37:18,920
Speaker 3: Growing up, we used to get five dollars tickets to

751
00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:21,719
Speaker 3: the Nosebleeds in the in Brack Stadium, a family just

752
00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:23,520
Speaker 3: getting there at halftime to watch the one hundred.

753
00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:25,360
Speaker 1: I was just going to say, nobody, you know, the

754
00:37:25,360 --> 00:37:30,239
Speaker 1: probably the easiest ticket in town was the third quarter yep. Yeah, Oh,

755
00:37:30,360 --> 00:37:32,320
Speaker 1: I mean I'd see it. A Bibi would host Florida

756
00:37:32,360 --> 00:37:35,680
Speaker 1: A and M and literally halftime would end, you know, the

757
00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:38,880
Speaker 1: poor Miami band like you almost like, don't perform this week,

758
00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:42,280
Speaker 1: just just stay up the field, right and then literally

759
00:37:42,560 --> 00:37:45,359
Speaker 1: the band finishes and you'd see everybody leave. Yep.

760
00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:49,399
Speaker 2: I was often in the crown. Yeah.

761
00:37:49,400 --> 00:37:52,160
Speaker 1: Anyway, May it's great to get to know you, and

762
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:53,920
Speaker 1: O can't wait till to see you in the Washington

763
00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:54,439
Speaker 1: Bureau soon.

764
00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:56,400
Speaker 2: Oh, thank you, Chuck, thank you for this. This was

765
00:37:56,400 --> 00:37:57,320
Speaker 2: a wonderful conversation.

766
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:01,240
Speaker 1: Hey,