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Speaker 1: From the dark corners of the web. An emerging mindset.

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Speaker 2: I am a loser if also we know wouldn't pay

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Speaker 2: me either.

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Speaker 3: A hidden world of resentment, cynicism, anger against women at

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Speaker 3: a deadly tipping point.

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Speaker 4: In Cells will be added to the Terrorism Guide.

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Speaker 2: I see literally zero hope.

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Speaker 1: This is In Cells, a production of Kat's Studios and iHeartRadio,

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Speaker 1: Season one, episode six, The Manosphere.

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Speaker 2: The guy who invented Graham Crackers invented graham Crackers to

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Speaker 2: keep boys from masturbating. I kid you not.

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Speaker 5: In the then diagram of in Cells and Tate, the

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Speaker 5: circle where they intersect is rather large.

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Speaker 6: Andrew Tate, I got a lot of thoughts on him.

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Speaker 7: Well, none of the role models that in Cells have

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Speaker 7: are positive.

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Speaker 1: I'm Courtney Armstrong, a producer at Kat's Studios with Stephanie Leideger,

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Speaker 1: Gabriel Castillo, Connor Powell, and Carolyn Miller. There's five point

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Speaker 1: five billion people online and nearly as many on social media.

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Speaker 1: It's how we get news, buy things, and connect with friends.

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Speaker 1: For the two point seven billion men online, It's also

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Speaker 1: where hate, abuse and misogyny spreads. It's seeping rampantly onto

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Speaker 1: school yards and into our homes. Thankfully, the manosphere is

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Speaker 1: coming to the forefront of conversations, even on daytime TV.

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Speaker 1: Here's a snippet from The Tammer and Hall Show, which

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Speaker 1: aired on Monday, April twenty first, twenty twenty five.

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Speaker 8: According to the anti hate organization the Anti Defamation League,

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Speaker 8: the Menisphere is an online network aimed at men and boys,

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Speaker 8: often promoting harmful, rigid expectations of men, extreme misogyny, and

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Speaker 8: aggressive in cell culture. In cells are men who identify

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Speaker 8: as quote involuntary celibate and blame female empowerment for their

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Speaker 8: lack of sexual experience, and as a result, whose hatred

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Speaker 8: and sometimes even violent against women.

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Speaker 1: Here's another excerpt. It's from The Late Show with Stephen Colbert.

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Speaker 1: It aired on Tuesday, June third, twenty five.

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Speaker 9: Men may be lonely, but modern society has a solution,

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Speaker 9: and you'll never get's the Internet.

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Speaker 4: It's the Internet.

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Speaker 9: Lately, I've been hitting the old doom swipe bees over here,

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Speaker 9: and my mangorithm has introduced me to all sorts of

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Speaker 9: new alpha friends, a wide world of podcasters and social

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Speaker 9: media influencers, and roided out in man cubes that comprise

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Speaker 9: the media landscape. That has been dubbed the manosphere, where

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Speaker 9: we men get to together to discuss professional sports, gambling, weightlifting, drinking,

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Speaker 9: drug use, and women.

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Speaker 1: The manosphere is a collection of digital spaces that claim

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Speaker 1: to support men's challenges in areas like dating, fitness, and fatherhood. However,

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Speaker 1: many of these communities spread harmful narratives and advice. According

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Speaker 1: to the United Nations Secretary General's Report on Violenced against

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Speaker 1: Women and Girls, these groups share a common thread opposing

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Speaker 1: women and framing men as victims. Victimhood is something we've

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Speaker 1: spoken about in depth as it becomes one of the

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Speaker 1: most defining characteristics of many in cells personal identities. Here's

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Speaker 1: clinical psychologist, sex therapist and author doctor David Lay.

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Speaker 3: Manisphere is the term being used to describe these online

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Speaker 3: influencer types that are speaking directly to man and that

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Speaker 3: have larger audiences of men. Joe Rogan is one that

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Speaker 3: we can see has a tremendous amount of influence. We've

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Speaker 3: also got folks like Andrew Taate. And what's unfortunate is

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Speaker 3: that lots of these men are out there talking to

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Speaker 3: young males. They're not oftentimes putting out the healthiest messages.

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Speaker 3: They are oftentimes you know, talking about your more manly,

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Speaker 3: by being physically violent, by treating women in a dominant manner,

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Speaker 3: by not caring what women think. Unfortunately, they are encouraging

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Speaker 3: much more what we would you know, typically classify, as

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Speaker 3: you know, hostile masculinity. It is a sad, circular, self

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Speaker 3: fulfilling prophecy that puts these young meals at risk.

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Speaker 1: A lot of the messaging in the manosphere is hostile

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Speaker 1: and violent, but it's worth stating again that the absolutely

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Speaker 1: overwhelming majority of in cells are nonviolent. It's also worth

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Speaker 1: stating how pivotal it is to understand just what kind

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Speaker 1: of content and messaging is filling the minds of men

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Speaker 1: and shaping a new generation of boys. But it's not

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Speaker 1: just the men who are impacted. The effects on girls

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Speaker 1: and women is very real and very concerning.

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Speaker 3: In real life, there's a growing number of examples of

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Speaker 3: manisphere culture affecting interactions between boys and girls. It's like

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Speaker 3: little things like oh, you should be back in the kitchen,

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Speaker 3: and even though it's a joke, some people take it

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Speaker 3: really far.

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Speaker 10: There are games that I've stopped playing because every single

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Speaker 10: time I joined, I'd receive a rape threat.

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Speaker 11: Me and my former roommate were chased on campus by

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Speaker 11: two different men saying that they were going to have

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Speaker 11: a lot of fun with us that night. Those kinds

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Speaker 11: of things have migrated from online worlds into real life,

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Speaker 11: sometimes in ways that boys are just trying to be provocative,

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Speaker 11: sometimes in ways that are really dangerous stepping stones on

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Speaker 11: the way to more harmful and violent content and behaviors.

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Speaker 1: Here's criminologist and in cell expert doctor Sarah Daily.

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Speaker 10: So the manisphere is a collection of online sites and

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Speaker 10: communities where they prioritize men's issues. They can range from

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Speaker 10: in cells all the way up to men's rights activists.

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Speaker 10: You have pick up artists who try to manipulate potential

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Speaker 10: romantic partners. You have men going their own way who

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Speaker 10: just want nothing to do with women. They won't work

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Speaker 10: for them, with them, marry them, date them. Andrew Tait

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Speaker 10: would dislike everything about in cells. They are beta weak

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Speaker 10: men in his mind. They're just sitting around and whining

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Speaker 10: and crying, and that's against everything that he stands for.

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Speaker 1: The hashtag Andrew Tate has garnered billions of views, and

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Speaker 1: he was the third most searched person on Google in

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty three. You may not know who he is,

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Speaker 1: but ask any twelve to eighteen year old boy in

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Speaker 1: your life. Here's crime analyst Body Moven and Stephanie filling

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Speaker 1: us in on Andrew Tate, the King of the Manosphere.

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Speaker 5: A new study published in the Journal of Gender and

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Speaker 5: Education out of Canada is finding that boys are adopting

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Speaker 5: Andrew Tate's misogynistic views and bringing them into class, which

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Speaker 5: is quite alarming. Teachers worry that the rise in Tate

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Speaker 5: inspired misogynistic rhetoric will lead to tangible safety threats like

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Speaker 5: gender based violence in schools. So, who are the Tate brothers?

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Speaker 5: You've never heard of him?

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Speaker 10: Right?

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Speaker 5: So, Andrew Tate. He is a former four time kickboxing

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Speaker 5: world champion. He was on Big Brother in twenty sixteen

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Speaker 5: and he was kicked off because, as he was like

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Speaker 5: on the show, charges were being filed against him in

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Speaker 5: the UK for rape. The UK authorities have cited his

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Speaker 5: influence as terrifying, particularly in the context of radicalizing boys online.

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Speaker 5: And that's exactly what's happening.

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Speaker 12: Young boys too, middle schoolers in theory, right, middle I

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Speaker 12: would say probably starts around seventh or eighth grade.

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Speaker 5: Around that time, he moved to Romania in twenty seventeen,

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Speaker 5: saying in a now deleted YouTube post that forty percent

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Speaker 5: of the reason he chose Eastern Europe was because he

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Speaker 5: believed that sexual assault cases were less likely to be

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Speaker 5: in investigated there. He openly declares himself a misogynist dating

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Speaker 5: an interview, I'm absolutely a misogynist. There's no way you

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Speaker 5: can be rooted in reality and not be sexist.

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Speaker 1: Tate had a podcast on Spotify that was taken down

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Speaker 1: after ninety two thousand people signed a petition complaining about

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Speaker 1: the degree course he was offering. The title of the course,

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Speaker 1: pimping Hose Crime analyst Body Moven continues.

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Speaker 5: He's gotten banned from almost every single platform, Facebook, Instagram, YouTube, TikTok.

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Speaker 5: He continues on X because X is kind of like

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Speaker 5: the wild wild West, Right, everybody can be on X,

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Speaker 5: but it's due to this promotion of this misogyny and

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Speaker 5: statements such as women should bear responsibility for being sexually assaulted.

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Speaker 7: Tate and his money making subscription channels have been pulled off.

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Speaker 5: YouTube and other platforms, with TikTok citing his hateful ideology.

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Speaker 5: He runs a webcam company, and he would show other

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Speaker 5: men or talk to other men about how to be

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Speaker 5: a sex trafficker and how to scam money out girls

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Speaker 5: in how women are your property and yes, you absolutely

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Speaker 5: should be making money and stealing from them. He moved

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Speaker 5: to Romania in twenty seventeen, right, and he was arrested

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Speaker 5: in twenty twenty two for sex trafficking seven women and

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Speaker 5: money laundering and rape. The Romanian courts abruptly reversed the

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Speaker 5: charges and allowed Tate to leave the country after several

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Speaker 5: high level Trump administrators took an official interest in this case.

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Speaker 5: Andrew Tate is a US citizen. He's got dual citizenship

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Speaker 5: with the United States. In Britain, a lot.

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Speaker 1: Of people think that Tate brothers tell it like it is,

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Speaker 1: that the younger generation needs role models like them to

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Speaker 1: be men, and that women overreact to tates messaging, and honestly,

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Speaker 1: it's pretty easy to understand what is so alluring about them. Specifically,

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Speaker 1: Andrew Tate is athletic, confident, and re He's often seen

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Speaker 1: with a bevy of women. And if you're sitting in

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Speaker 1: your room trying to sort through hormones in middle school,

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Speaker 1: or you're older and having trouble with confidence and women,

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Speaker 1: all of these things are appealing here again, body Movin,

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Speaker 1: followed by Stephanie.

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Speaker 5: I'd love to have a conversation about why, like what

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Speaker 5: specifically about the Andrew Tate ideology is helping young men

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Speaker 5: become men, because right now I don't think it's helping

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Speaker 5: at all, And I think that if fathers were more

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Speaker 5: involved in their children's life, they wouldn't need Andrew Tate

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Speaker 5: to help them become men.

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Speaker 12: Is Andrew Tate messaging something that is equal to saying, hey,

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Speaker 12: look yeah, sexually assault people ain't no thing right. That's

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Speaker 12: the scary part because even confident, well spoken, rich, affluent

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Speaker 12: people can still be extremely degrading and violent. It's in

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Speaker 12: the bones ideologically. How do we keep this conversation going

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Speaker 12: without shutting it down and being myopic about it?

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Speaker 1: I asked Boddy about Andrew Tate's brother, Tristan Tate. He's

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Speaker 1: thirty seven years old, just one year younger than Andrew,

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Speaker 1: and the two live very intertwined lives.

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Speaker 5: He runs the business with Andrew Tate. They have a

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Speaker 5: webcam studio where they employ as many as seventy five models,

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Speaker 5: and what they do is they just scam in out

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Speaker 5: of their money an online membership to the platform which

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Speaker 5: teaches men how to get rich quick. It's called Hustler's University,

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Speaker 5: and the other one is called the Real World that

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Speaker 5: serves like a really similar purpose.

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Speaker 1: Let's stop here for a break. We'll be back in

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Speaker 1: a moment. We went to Hustler University's website. You can

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Speaker 1: get access to the services for forty nine dollars a month.

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Speaker 1: The website states we have proven results from members who

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Speaker 1: used to be just like you. The only difference is

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Speaker 1: that they took action, while most of you are still hesitant,

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Speaker 1: being afraid, and worrying that you may waste forty nine

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Speaker 1: dollars which you can spend on a night at the

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Speaker 1: bar with your broke friends. The first question in the

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Speaker 1: fac section is and I quote A, am I too

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Speaker 1: young to join the community? Answer? No, as long as

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Speaker 1: you have a device that connects to the Internet, you

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Speaker 1: can join us. Crime Analyzed Body Moven continues on how

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Speaker 1: affle Mail's Andrew and Tristan Tate collide with the in

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Speaker 1: cell community for reference, as many see the male hierarchy,

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Speaker 1: alphas are at the top, beta's below them in cells,

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Speaker 1: often placing themselves below the betas.

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Speaker 5: And he self describes himself Christian Tate as a pimp.

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Speaker 5: I mean, they're not hiding it. These guys are not

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Speaker 5: hiding that they're pimps. But I want to quickly let

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Speaker 5: everybody know that Tape Brothers are not in cells. But

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Speaker 5: what is important to know is that they share like

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Speaker 5: really similar ideology. They're all kind of misogynistic, and you know,

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Speaker 5: some in cels admire Tate, seeing him as somebody who's

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Speaker 5: escaped this powerless male role that they feel trapped in.

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Speaker 5: So Andrew Tate and the Tape Brothers are not in cells,

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Speaker 5: but again they're in the then diagram of in cells

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Speaker 5: and Tate. The circle where they intersect is rather large.

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Speaker 1: Investigative producer Connor Powell spoke with Brian, a self described

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Speaker 1: in cell we've heard from in an earlier episode. Here's

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Speaker 1: Connor followed by Brian.

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Speaker 4: I'm curious, are there certain people within the community that

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Speaker 4: everybody looks to or thinks about good or bad?

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Speaker 10: Like?

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Speaker 8: I mean, are there are there.

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Speaker 4: Any positive real models or are there any really destructive

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Speaker 4: role models?

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Speaker 6: I entretate, I got a lot of thoughts on him.

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Speaker 7: Well, none of the role models that in cells have

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Speaker 7: are positive. I'm thirty nine years old, so I'm one

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Speaker 7: of the older guys, and I've lived more life and

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Speaker 7: I'm a lot more calmer. So I have a better

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Speaker 7: moral and ethical compass than most of them do. And

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Speaker 7: none of them are positive. Andrewtates admired because even though

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Speaker 7: that in Cells are not like him, he speaks to them.

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Speaker 1: Brian's audio got garbled here, but this is verbatim what

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Speaker 1: he said. He basically is a light at the end

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Speaker 1: of the tunnel of like, well, I was a nerd

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Speaker 1: in the geek too, but I became a kickboxing champion

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Speaker 1: and now I'm rich, and now women mean nothing to me.

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Speaker 13: Brian continues, So, even though he's nothing like us, he

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Speaker 13: knows how to appeal to us, and he's not real.

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Speaker 7: People make him look at sound like he's a genius

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Speaker 7: and this and that, but largely he made his money unethically.

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Speaker 7: He is totally toxic. There is no positive role models

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Speaker 7: for in cells. They all kind of cling to this

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Speaker 7: alpha male archetype that isn't even real. And if you

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Speaker 7: look at all that alpha melbs on the internet, you're

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Speaker 7: probably thinking.

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Speaker 6: How are these guys getting paid? Who is funding their lifestyle?

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Speaker 6: Who believes any of the bullshit that they're saying, well,

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Speaker 6: in Cells believe them, and in Cells funded, and because

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Speaker 6: we're so miserable, we'll pay four thousand and five thousand,

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Speaker 6: ten thousand for their program.

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Speaker 7: In hopes that we can have a small portion of

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Speaker 7: the success that they have.

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Speaker 1: Brian is talking about the businesses Body mentioned earlier. According

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Speaker 1: to a twenty twenty three BBC article, the Tape Brothers

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Speaker 1: appeared to be bringing in around five million dollars a

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Speaker 1: month in membership fees.

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Speaker 4: Here's Connor, the relationship with Tate is kind of fascinating

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Speaker 4: because on one hand, it sort of speaks to that

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Speaker 4: young male mindset, which is like, I want to be

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Speaker 4: able to do what I want to do. In so

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Speaker 4: many ways, he doesn't line up with the culture of

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Speaker 4: Insel community because you know, he gets women, he has women,

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Speaker 4: he has money, and he has opportunity. But like you said,

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Speaker 4: he speaks to them. It is just sort of he

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Speaker 4: speaks to them as I can do whatever I want.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 7: He's made outrageous claims and some people believe it, and

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Speaker 7: smarter people like myself know it's not true. Like he's

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Speaker 7: a billionaire or he's going to be a billionaire. Is

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Speaker 7: Hustler's University. I know about him only because in the

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Speaker 7: in cell space, he's unavoidable, you know what I mean,

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Speaker 7: Like we fund his lifestyle basically, not we fund it,

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Speaker 7: but like, let's be honest, half of his money comes

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Speaker 7: probably from his sex cam business. I think he does

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Speaker 7: have a broader appeal to young men. People look at

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Speaker 7: him and they see that basically he can do whatever

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Speaker 7: he wants.

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Speaker 6: But mostly we kind of chase that dream. We see

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Speaker 6: him on gods and revolve as women. Guys like him,

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Speaker 6: guys like Dan Bolzarian, they're popular with us.

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Speaker 7: But the point is that there is no positive role

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Speaker 7: model for an in cell. Either it's an alpha male

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Speaker 7: guy who's who's conning us for money and views to

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Speaker 7: promote their message, or it's guys like Elliott Rogers who

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Speaker 7: got so frustrated and just annihilated a bunch of people.

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Speaker 6: You know.

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Speaker 7: That's kind of the two role models for in cells,

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Speaker 7: which is which is terrible.

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Speaker 4: Do you see in your communities any sort of hope

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Speaker 4: in the sense that, like, are there older people your age,

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Speaker 4: your generation that are offering at least some positive guidance

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Speaker 4: or ways to approach these kids lives, especially for the

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Speaker 4: younger ones. Or does that not exist at all?

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Speaker 7: Absolutely not, it doesn't exist. Being an in cell is

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Speaker 7: a dead zone of negativity. There are in cells my age,

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Speaker 7: and they're stupid too. I don't know if you know

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Speaker 7: this one, but being an in cell at my age

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Speaker 7: is a bit different because, like Andrew Tate appeals to

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Speaker 7: younger people, but a guy my age, a boot camp

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Speaker 7: might appeal to them, where you pay twenty thousand dollars

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Speaker 7: to go off to Guatemala or whatever and go through

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Speaker 7: grueling military training and you pay this twenty thousand dollars

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Speaker 7: basically to get tortured for a week and dehumanized by

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Speaker 7: life coaches in the hopes that after only a week

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Speaker 7: it's going to change your life and you're going to

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Speaker 7: be a better man and then you can get women

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Speaker 7: and stuff like that. There's no one positive in the

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Speaker 7: in cell community, and it's unfortunate because all we have

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Speaker 7: does each other. Really, because most men, and I say most,

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Speaker 7: I mean ninety percent of men don't know what it's

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Speaker 7: like to be me.

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Speaker 1: We ask criminologist and in cell expert doctor Sarah Daily

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Speaker 1: why she thinks Andrew Tate, the self deemed king of

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Speaker 1: toxic masculinity, is so successful.

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Speaker 10: I think that he can certainly be a gateway, but

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Speaker 10: once you jump into the manisphere, you can find endless

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Speaker 10: issues or paths to take through it, and it's like

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Speaker 10: a choose your own adventure, like where the algorithm gets you.

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Speaker 10: But I think this approach and his business strategy is

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Speaker 10: one that we're going to see through a number of

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Speaker 10: other ideologies, and that makes me very nervous. Unfortunately, the

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Speaker 10: most successful movements that aforce generally had a leader or

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Speaker 10: a symbolic figurehead to lead them, and with Andrew Taate,

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Speaker 10: you have that in a very symbolic figure of hyper masculinity.

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Speaker 10: That he is very athletic, he's toned, he leads a

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Speaker 10: luxurious lifestyle. But interestingly, this kind of is dissonant against

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Speaker 10: in cells because he's more of a chad that's having

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Speaker 10: sex with women. So they're kind of railing against him

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Speaker 10: because they can't have what he has and they can't

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Speaker 10: be who he is.

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Speaker 1: What doctor Daly's describing is the contradiction at the heart

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Speaker 1: of Andrew Tate's appeal. He's everything the typical in cell

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Speaker 1: claims to resent, successful, muscular, confident, yet he becomes a

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Speaker 1: kind of mascot for the same movement that rejects him.

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Speaker 1: The image he projects isn't about connection or empathy. It's

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Speaker 1: about dominance and control, and for some men already feeling

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Speaker 1: unseen or powerless, that image can become magnetic.

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Speaker 10: He has a very clear audience and a very clear

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Speaker 10: goal of sharing this ideology or his worldview. Given everything

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Speaker 10: that he has said about himself, his target audience is

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Speaker 10: not women, right, So there he goes with He's got

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Speaker 10: fifty percent of the world that's a target audience and

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Speaker 10: trying to show them the benefits of his lifestyle, right

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Speaker 10: and of this mentality. And I think, regardless of how

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Speaker 10: much I disagree with or dislike his message, he has

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Speaker 10: had a very clear, focused campaign and done a lot

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Speaker 10: of things to make himself pervasive for better or for worse,

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Speaker 10: around the world and influential. And so yeah, he's a kickboxer.

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Speaker 10: He has all this sex with women. Whether or not

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Speaker 10: it's consensual is still being debated. He believes men to

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Speaker 10: have a whole host of advantages and he has made

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Speaker 10: for many people a compelling case is to why this

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Speaker 10: notion of the alpha male and how toxic masculinity can

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Speaker 10: benefit men and men.

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Speaker 1: Only takes message lands at a time when many people,

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Speaker 1: especially young men, already feel left behind. Online comparison and

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Speaker 1: shifting gender roles have blurred what success or stability even

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Speaker 1: looks like. For some, confusion turns into resentment, and voices

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Speaker 1: like Tates offer an easy outlet for that anger. It's

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Speaker 1: not just about one influencer, It's about the emotional vacuum

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Speaker 1: his message fills.

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Speaker 10: We are living in dark times where everybody is consistently overwhelmed, overstimulated, overworked.

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Speaker 10: Everybody is exhausted. I think most people in the country

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Speaker 10: right now are just working to survive. But I think

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Speaker 10: for men specifically, who were once told that the world

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Speaker 10: was their oyster, for those who believed that they were

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Speaker 10: entitled to a very comfortable life, who if they did

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Speaker 10: everything the right way, they would get married, their wife

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Speaker 10: would go dinner for them, into their laundry. They feel

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Speaker 10: like they're losing things that they expected, so having this

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Speaker 10: societal scapegoat is easier for them than admitting their shortcomings.

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Speaker 10: It's easier to get mad at women for not cooking

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Speaker 10: them dinner anymore or not dating them anymore than it

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Speaker 10: is to say maybe my career in the coal mines

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Speaker 10: didn't pan out the way that I wanted it to,

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Speaker 10: and that's I should learn a new trade. So I

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Speaker 10: think it's much easier for men to be angry because

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Speaker 10: Andrew take told them to be. It's easier for men

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Speaker 10: to send their blame outward and blame society and women

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Speaker 10: and feminism than it is to better themselves and do

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Speaker 10: that work.

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Speaker 1: Let's stop here for another break. We'll be back in

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Speaker 1: a moment. We wanted to know whether this kind of

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Speaker 1: gender backlash, the kind that feels so loud right now,

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Speaker 1: has happened before. Doctor Michael Kimmel, Professor emeritith of Sociology

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Speaker 1: and Gender Studies at Stonybrook University and author of books

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Speaker 1: including Manhood in America, Guyland, and Angry White Men, says

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Speaker 1: it has. In fact, he points to a long history

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Speaker 1: of what he calls profits of masculinity, figures like Andrew Tate,

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Speaker 1: who've appeared again and again.

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Speaker 2: At the turn of the last century, men were equally

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Speaker 2: confused about dramatic social and economic changes. No longer did

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Speaker 2: you go into your little workshop and work with your hands.

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Speaker 2: You went to factories, you went to offices. White collar

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Speaker 2: work became one of the dominant modes of employment. And

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Speaker 2: we were concerned at the turn of the century that

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Speaker 2: young boys were turning into you know, molly coddles, as

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Speaker 2: the word was, And so there was a boy a

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Speaker 2: boy's liberation movement at the turn of the last century.

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Speaker 2: The Boy Scouts, the YMCA all designed gymss proliferated in

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Speaker 2: cities to help men work out, get stronger, get more fit.

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Speaker 2: All of this was an effort to stem the tide

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Speaker 2: of feminization of boys. At the time. Men were confused

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Speaker 2: about these buffeting changes, but the same questions, what's going

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Speaker 2: to happen to us as men? And there were all

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Speaker 2: kinds of false prophets preaching all kinds of crazy ideas

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Speaker 2: about physical culture.

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Speaker 6: They called it.

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Speaker 2: Sylvester Graham, the guy who invented Graham crackers, invented Graham

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Speaker 2: crackers to keep boys from masturbating. I kid you not,

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Speaker 2: that was the goal because men were diluting their potency,

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Speaker 2: men were diluting their energy, So we had to keep

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Speaker 2: them from doing that. And Graham believed that you could

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Speaker 2: do that by helping them keep their bowels open and

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Speaker 2: flowing and that wouldn't be corrupted.

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Speaker 8: And J. H.

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Speaker 2: Kellogg was so concerned about this that He actually wrote

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Speaker 2: books about how to keep your boys from masturbating and

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Speaker 2: all kinds of you know, crazy solutions, like a wet

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Speaker 2: girdle was what you would put on your twelve thirteen

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Speaker 2: year old boy. I'm not joking. So the crisis for

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Speaker 2: boys then was that there were all kinds of people.

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Speaker 2: Whether it was Baden Powell and Ernest Thompson seton founding

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Speaker 2: the Boy Scouts in Britain and the United States, or

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Speaker 2: the Boone and Crockett Club, or Young Boys Go Trooping

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Speaker 2: Off to the Woods, or any of these movements. These

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Speaker 2: were false prophets, peddling new ideas to remedy a perceived

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Speaker 2: feminization of boys. Doesn't that sound familiar, Andrew Tait, Doesn't

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Speaker 2: that sound familiar? These are the false prophets of our era.

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Speaker 1: Throughout history, moments of social change have often sparked anxiety

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Speaker 1: about what it means to be a man. From the

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Speaker 1: Boy Scouts to modern influencers, new profits emerged promising to

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Speaker 1: restore order, each claiming to have the answer to masculinity

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Speaker 1: in crisis.

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Speaker 2: And it's not the wrong confusion, they are saying to themselves.

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Speaker 2: In a world of greater equality, in a world of

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00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:17,119
Speaker 2: greater racial equality, sexual equality, gender equality. Where do I

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00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:21,240
Speaker 2: fit in? The ideas about manhood that I inherited from

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00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 2: my father, from my grandfather do not work anymore, And

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00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:28,080
Speaker 2: so that means you are going to have to enter

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00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:31,320
Speaker 2: a world that you're unprepared for, and that's going to

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00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:33,880
Speaker 2: take some work. And you can have these false prophits

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00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:37,879
Speaker 2: telling you, ah, it's the great replacement. Ah, it's women's fault.

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00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:40,080
Speaker 2: But truly, we're not going back.

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00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:47,800
Speaker 1: Kimmel says that anxiety is real and in many ways

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00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:51,840
Speaker 1: understandable for young men. The roles have shifted faster than

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00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:54,719
Speaker 1: they can adapt. The world their fathers prepared them for

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00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:59,320
Speaker 1: doesn't exist anymore, and that loss of clarity can feel personal.

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00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:04,280
Speaker 2: I think it would be a major mistake to assume

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00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:07,199
Speaker 2: that all in cells are alike. I think large numbers

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00:28:07,240 --> 00:28:09,920
Speaker 2: of the young guys go to the in cell community

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00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:14,040
Speaker 2: for support, and you know, they've not had success yet

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00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:18,200
Speaker 2: in the dating world. They're looking for support, for camaraderie,

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00:28:18,200 --> 00:28:22,800
Speaker 2: for validation. That's not a bad thing. The most likely

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00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:25,399
Speaker 2: outcome of in cell culture is they're going to be sad,

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00:28:25,680 --> 00:28:28,720
Speaker 2: They're going to blame others, They're going to remain ill,

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00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:31,280
Speaker 2: prepared for the world that they are entering.

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Speaker 1: The manosphere isn't one voice. It's amaze of them. For some,

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00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:39,880
Speaker 1: it's noise for others, a lifetime that turns into a

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00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:43,640
Speaker 1: dead end. Beneath the slogans and algorithms are real people,

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00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:48,200
Speaker 1: men sorting through loneliness, shame, and a changing idea of manhood.

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00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 1: The stories and role models we amplify matter, especially to

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00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:55,160
Speaker 1: boys trying to figure out who they are. If we

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Speaker 1: want something better, it starts with what we show. As example,

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00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:02,520
Speaker 1: the voices of them manisphere will keep shouting. We don't

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00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:05,960
Speaker 1: have to echo them. The real questions are who will

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00:29:05,960 --> 00:29:11,920
Speaker 1: shape book comes next? And what will it be. For

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00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:15,080
Speaker 1: more information on the case and relevant photos, follow us

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00:29:15,080 --> 00:29:19,959
Speaker 1: on Instagram at kt Underscore Studios. In Cells is produced

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00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:25,600
Speaker 1: by Stephanie Leideger, Gabriel Castillo and me Courtney Armstrong. Additional

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Speaker 1: producing by Connor Powell and Caroline Miller, editing by Jeff

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Speaker 1: Tooi music by Vanicore Studios. In Cells is a production

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00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:40,320
Speaker 1: of Kat's Studios and iHeart Radio. For more podcasts like this,

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Speaker 1: visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen

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Speaker 1: to your favorite shows.