1 00:00:03,560 --> 00:00:09,360 Speaker 1: So I've had someone on my mind lately, actually not 2 00:00:09,720 --> 00:00:15,240 Speaker 1: one person, but a whole group of people. It's our men, 3 00:00:15,800 --> 00:00:20,560 Speaker 1: Latino men. I've been thinking about them a lot, especially 4 00:00:20,960 --> 00:00:25,040 Speaker 1: after the election, and especially after hearing what the media 5 00:00:25,160 --> 00:00:26,320 Speaker 1: had to say about them. 6 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:29,760 Speaker 2: Latinos in Texas, a district that's ninety seven percent Latino 7 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:32,360 Speaker 2: went seventy five percentage points for Donald Trump. 8 00:00:32,440 --> 00:00:35,000 Speaker 1: Why misogyny and the mill was on the border. 9 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:39,720 Speaker 3: There's misogyny, but it's not just misogyny for white men. 10 00:00:40,680 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 4: It's misogyny from Hispanic men. Might be race issues with Hispanics. 11 00:00:47,360 --> 00:00:48,440 Speaker 4: They don't want a black woman. 12 00:00:48,479 --> 00:00:51,480 Speaker 2: Also, Latino man, y'all voted with Steven Miller and David 13 00:00:51,520 --> 00:00:54,520 Speaker 2: Duke and against your own sisters who chose Kamala Harris 14 00:00:54,680 --> 00:00:58,160 Speaker 2: with sixty percent of their votes. So you own everything 15 00:00:58,400 --> 00:01:02,200 Speaker 2: that happens to your mixed status and to your wives, sisters, 16 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 2: and of wells. 17 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:06,319 Speaker 1: From here on in, what's the root here and how 18 00:01:06,360 --> 00:01:10,600 Speaker 1: do we understand what's going on with Latino men and 19 00:01:10,760 --> 00:01:15,520 Speaker 1: their decisions? So today we are starting a new series 20 00:01:15,560 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 1: here on Latino USA. It's called Ombre Understanding Latino Men, 21 00:01:21,240 --> 00:01:25,319 Speaker 1: and so we are aiming to have deep curious conversations 22 00:01:25,720 --> 00:01:28,479 Speaker 1: about what it's like to be a Latino man in 23 00:01:28,520 --> 00:01:31,600 Speaker 1: this moment in the United States. And to start off 24 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:34,240 Speaker 1: our series, we have someone who can talk about all 25 00:01:34,280 --> 00:01:37,120 Speaker 1: of this from a political level, but also from a 26 00:01:37,160 --> 00:01:39,920 Speaker 1: pretty personal one as well, and all of it comes 27 00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:41,920 Speaker 1: with his signature Texas twang. 28 00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:43,360 Speaker 4: Some nice digs up in here. 29 00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:45,319 Speaker 3: I wish I could afford a place over Quien just 30 00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:47,840 Speaker 3: like so nice up in here to see you. 31 00:01:48,360 --> 00:01:49,120 Speaker 4: Oh my god. 32 00:01:49,360 --> 00:01:54,080 Speaker 1: That's DC based political consultant and Democratic strategist Chuck Roachel. 33 00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:57,080 Speaker 4: You know, people looked at me strange when I got 34 00:01:57,080 --> 00:01:57,600 Speaker 4: out of the car. 35 00:01:58,080 --> 00:02:02,800 Speaker 1: Respect On a cold, early December morning in twenty twenty four, 36 00:02:03,360 --> 00:02:06,840 Speaker 1: Chuck arrived to Latino USA's studio in New York City 37 00:02:06,960 --> 00:02:10,920 Speaker 1: in Harlem, and of course he was wearing his big 38 00:02:11,280 --> 00:02:12,760 Speaker 1: Texas cowboy hat. 39 00:02:12,880 --> 00:02:13,920 Speaker 4: People like, oh you wear that hat. 40 00:02:13,960 --> 00:02:15,680 Speaker 3: I'm like, yeah, I'm ball headed and this is warm. 41 00:02:15,720 --> 00:02:18,280 Speaker 4: I bore this my whole life. This ain't an act. 42 00:02:18,480 --> 00:02:20,520 Speaker 1: Well, yea man, what part of East Texas? 43 00:02:20,520 --> 00:02:20,880 Speaker 2: Exactly? 44 00:02:24,520 --> 00:02:28,200 Speaker 1: From Fuduro Media and PRX, It's Latino USA. I'm Maria 45 00:02:28,240 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 1: in Josa today the premiere of our new series Ombre 46 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:45,400 Speaker 1: Understanding Latino men with our first guest, Chuck Roacha. You 47 00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:48,800 Speaker 1: might have seen people in the media on television after 48 00:02:48,840 --> 00:02:53,239 Speaker 1: the presidential election saying that it was Latino men who 49 00:02:53,360 --> 00:02:57,160 Speaker 1: cost the Democrats the election, despite the fact that the 50 00:02:57,160 --> 00:03:00,240 Speaker 1: majority of voters who came out for Donald Trump were 51 00:03:00,440 --> 00:03:06,440 Speaker 1: white men and white women. Still people were confused, right 52 00:03:06,520 --> 00:03:10,080 Speaker 1: even outraged, as to why Latino men had shifted further 53 00:03:10,280 --> 00:03:12,919 Speaker 1: right in twenty twenty four and how to explain that. 54 00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:16,760 Speaker 1: According to the Brookings Institution's support for Donald Trump was 55 00:03:16,919 --> 00:03:21,800 Speaker 1: highest among younger Latino men, with forty eight percent of 56 00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:25,239 Speaker 1: Latino men under the age of forty voting for Trump. 57 00:03:25,760 --> 00:03:30,360 Speaker 1: One in five of them was a first time voter. So, 58 00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:33,120 Speaker 1: dear listener, of course there's a caveat because we know 59 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:36,600 Speaker 1: that there's not one single kind of Latino man, right, 60 00:03:36,640 --> 00:03:39,840 Speaker 1: and it gets really tricky to define men from such 61 00:03:40,040 --> 00:03:44,040 Speaker 1: different cultures and Latin American roots into one category. We 62 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:48,440 Speaker 1: get this Chicano men or Mexican American men, and Cuban 63 00:03:48,480 --> 00:03:51,640 Speaker 1: American men or Puerto Rican men. They all have very 64 00:03:51,880 --> 00:03:56,680 Speaker 1: distinct experiences that inform how they live and therefore how 65 00:03:56,680 --> 00:04:01,280 Speaker 1: they vote. But we do hope that in conversation with 66 00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:04,520 Speaker 1: a diverse set of Latino man that we might come 67 00:04:04,560 --> 00:04:08,600 Speaker 1: to better understand why as a block they did vote 68 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 1: differently than in previous generations. And here's where Chuck Roache 69 00:04:13,160 --> 00:04:16,480 Speaker 1: comes in to help us understand this shift and how 70 00:04:16,520 --> 00:04:27,080 Speaker 1: the Democrats failed to reach these important Latino mail voters. 71 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:31,040 Speaker 1: Chuck grew up in East Texas, in what he calls 72 00:04:31,240 --> 00:04:34,800 Speaker 1: the middle of nowhere. He says he's a real man's man, 73 00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 1: a proud product of the working class, who loves hunting, fishing, boxing, 74 00:04:40,240 --> 00:04:42,800 Speaker 1: and he says he hasn't missed a workout in over 75 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:47,040 Speaker 1: thirty years. His political career started decades ago when he 76 00:04:47,120 --> 00:04:50,440 Speaker 1: was a union official and that's where he cut his teeth. 77 00:04:51,880 --> 00:04:55,720 Speaker 1: In twenty ten, he founded his own political consulting firm, 78 00:04:55,839 --> 00:04:59,159 Speaker 1: Solidarity Strategies, and he went on to become the first 79 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:04,240 Speaker 1: Latino to run a presidential campaign. Omrich, let's get to 80 00:05:04,279 --> 00:05:11,960 Speaker 1: our conversation now. So the whole impetus behind this series, Chuck, right, 81 00:05:12,200 --> 00:05:15,279 Speaker 1: is that we want to have a conversation with Latino men, 82 00:05:15,720 --> 00:05:20,200 Speaker 1: about Latino men, about Latino manhood, about the experience of 83 00:05:20,240 --> 00:05:24,120 Speaker 1: being Latino in the United States. And you know, just 84 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:27,599 Speaker 1: maybe in an attempt to understand what just happened in 85 00:05:27,600 --> 00:05:30,680 Speaker 1: the year twenty twenty four, Right, what did it mean 86 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:33,960 Speaker 1: for you growing up as a young Latino kid in 87 00:05:34,000 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 1: East Texas? 88 00:05:35,320 --> 00:05:37,400 Speaker 3: Look in the seventies. I can't grow up around a 89 00:05:37,440 --> 00:05:39,960 Speaker 3: lot of Latinos who weren't named Rocha. I grew up 90 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:41,800 Speaker 3: in the middle of the country, in the middle of 91 00:05:41,839 --> 00:05:45,440 Speaker 3: the woods, in a trailer house next to my white grandparents' farm. 92 00:05:45,880 --> 00:05:47,560 Speaker 3: So when my book, when I wrote about my two 93 00:05:47,640 --> 00:05:49,880 Speaker 3: grandmothers who really influenced my life, there was this white 94 00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:53,039 Speaker 3: grandmother named Evelyn Bussell, who cooked in a cash down skillet. 95 00:05:53,040 --> 00:05:55,320 Speaker 3: We farmed, we raised cattle, we did all the things. 96 00:05:55,360 --> 00:05:56,560 Speaker 3: And then there was Carmen. 97 00:05:56,360 --> 00:05:57,239 Speaker 4: Who lived in the city. 98 00:05:57,240 --> 00:05:58,960 Speaker 3: And I would drive fourteen miles in the city and 99 00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:01,800 Speaker 3: see Carmen Rocha, and I would talk about walking into 100 00:06:01,800 --> 00:06:03,640 Speaker 3: her house and your nose would burn a little bit 101 00:06:03,640 --> 00:06:06,159 Speaker 3: because she'd have the mogihete and she chopped in grind 102 00:06:06,160 --> 00:06:09,360 Speaker 3: peppers every morning and made tortillas every day, made sausa 103 00:06:09,520 --> 00:06:11,320 Speaker 3: every day. And you couldn't walk in that house and 104 00:06:11,360 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 3: not be fed like every other grandmother. Right, So there's 105 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:16,120 Speaker 3: a reason why I weighed three hundred pounds when I 106 00:06:16,160 --> 00:06:17,039 Speaker 3: graduated high school. 107 00:06:17,080 --> 00:06:20,600 Speaker 1: As I was getting good food on both ends, and 108 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:23,320 Speaker 1: you're talking about growing up, what were the messages that 109 00:06:23,360 --> 00:06:30,039 Speaker 1: you were getting about? Specifically? Latino manhood was the male message. 110 00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:34,040 Speaker 1: It is macho, you know, you're a strong Texas man. 111 00:06:34,600 --> 00:06:37,960 Speaker 1: Or manhood is about being really good to women. 112 00:06:38,400 --> 00:06:40,920 Speaker 3: You know. I would discover the Latino manhood later when 113 00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:42,640 Speaker 3: I went to work in the factory with my dad. 114 00:06:42,720 --> 00:06:44,359 Speaker 3: My dad left when I was five, and I would 115 00:06:44,720 --> 00:06:46,240 Speaker 3: we would reconnect and I'd go to work in a 116 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:49,479 Speaker 3: tire factory making tires when I'm nineteen. But growing up, 117 00:06:49,520 --> 00:06:51,599 Speaker 3: I was raised by this old white man who was 118 00:06:51,640 --> 00:06:53,960 Speaker 3: my white grandfather and his two kids who were my 119 00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:56,839 Speaker 3: two uncles. So hunting and fishing and be a man 120 00:06:57,000 --> 00:06:59,040 Speaker 3: was just ingrained in what you did. You worked with 121 00:06:59,080 --> 00:07:02,239 Speaker 3: your hands, you protect your woman, you fought for things 122 00:07:02,240 --> 00:07:05,800 Speaker 3: that were right. And as I got older and realized, 123 00:07:06,279 --> 00:07:08,680 Speaker 3: you know, was there a Latino piece of this. It 124 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:11,560 Speaker 3: was my father in the factory and five of his 125 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:13,640 Speaker 3: brothers who also worked in the factory with me, like 126 00:07:13,680 --> 00:07:16,320 Speaker 3: eight of my cousins, every Mexican in that factory, and 127 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:19,920 Speaker 3: watching these men do manly things as what the stereotypical 128 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:20,720 Speaker 3: reporter would think of. 129 00:07:20,760 --> 00:07:21,960 Speaker 4: It's like driving a fork truck. 130 00:07:22,240 --> 00:07:24,600 Speaker 3: Having I had two hay hooks that I used to 131 00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:27,360 Speaker 3: throw seventy pound bales of rubber onto a moving conveyer 132 00:07:27,440 --> 00:07:29,040 Speaker 3: belt every fifty seconds. 133 00:07:29,080 --> 00:07:32,239 Speaker 1: Wait a second, what in each hand? 134 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 4: So you would at hooks, so I would lift it 135 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:36,120 Speaker 4: and throw it. 136 00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:38,640 Speaker 3: So I was a big old boy in that stereotype 137 00:07:38,680 --> 00:07:41,120 Speaker 3: me into giving me a tough job in the dirtiest 138 00:07:41,120 --> 00:07:44,080 Speaker 3: apartment in the factory, because that's where ironically all the 139 00:07:44,120 --> 00:07:46,760 Speaker 3: black and latinos worked, was the dirtiest part of the factory. 140 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:50,240 Speaker 1: And so you started having some questions around the messaging 141 00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:51,080 Speaker 1: around manhood. 142 00:07:51,160 --> 00:07:53,200 Speaker 3: Is that what you're saying you reflect back on that, 143 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:55,600 Speaker 3: I think becoming a father at the same time, I'd 144 00:07:55,640 --> 00:07:59,040 Speaker 3: just become a father at nineteen twenty, and I just 145 00:07:59,040 --> 00:08:01,800 Speaker 3: got in full custom of son and he wasn't three 146 00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:04,760 Speaker 3: months old yet, so it was something very unusual. So 147 00:08:04,800 --> 00:08:06,800 Speaker 3: I understood what it was like to have a baby 148 00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:08,560 Speaker 3: and be fully responsible. 149 00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:08,480 Speaker 4: For that baby. 150 00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:11,440 Speaker 3: Thank God for my grandmother and my family. There was 151 00:08:11,480 --> 00:08:13,600 Speaker 3: lots of family to help me raise this boy of mine. 152 00:08:13,640 --> 00:08:16,640 Speaker 3: But becoming a father is really when I think a 153 00:08:16,720 --> 00:08:18,840 Speaker 3: boy becomes a man and you understand what man it 154 00:08:19,000 --> 00:08:20,760 Speaker 3: is because you'll never love a thing like you love 155 00:08:20,800 --> 00:08:23,080 Speaker 3: your child. There's just no other love like that. They're 156 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:25,160 Speaker 3: going to mess up. But there's things that you would 157 00:08:25,200 --> 00:08:27,760 Speaker 3: do and you feel that you've never felt before. Of literally, 158 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:29,720 Speaker 3: I would kill somebody for that boy if somebody tried 159 00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:31,240 Speaker 3: to hurt him. 160 00:08:31,320 --> 00:08:37,239 Speaker 1: So I'm trying to understand how that chuck ROACHA becomes 161 00:08:37,280 --> 00:08:41,840 Speaker 1: the chuck ROACHA that then understands how to message. 162 00:08:43,000 --> 00:08:44,120 Speaker 4: There's a direct line. 163 00:08:44,280 --> 00:08:47,120 Speaker 1: What is that direct line? Because you become an expert 164 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:51,600 Speaker 1: in political messaging specifically to Latinos and Latinas, and I 165 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:53,640 Speaker 1: would say, you know, Latino men. 166 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:54,160 Speaker 4: Sure. 167 00:08:54,720 --> 00:08:57,520 Speaker 3: What people don't understand is that the way modern campaigns 168 00:08:57,520 --> 00:09:00,480 Speaker 3: are run is there's a small group of consultants control 169 00:09:00,559 --> 00:09:02,920 Speaker 3: most of the messaging and the strategy of how campaign 170 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:05,640 Speaker 3: is run. And because we've made this kind of an industry, 171 00:09:05,640 --> 00:09:07,360 Speaker 3: it's all run out of a box where you all 172 00:09:07,360 --> 00:09:09,280 Speaker 3: do the same thing. You reach into your box, you 173 00:09:09,320 --> 00:09:11,960 Speaker 3: do your poll, you do your message testing, you raise 174 00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:14,200 Speaker 3: your money, and you buy TV and digital advertising and 175 00:09:14,200 --> 00:09:17,040 Speaker 3: pretty much call it today. But there's very few Latinos 176 00:09:17,120 --> 00:09:19,439 Speaker 3: or very few Latino men or Latinos or black people 177 00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:21,640 Speaker 3: for that matter, who do this work at that level 178 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:24,360 Speaker 3: where you really listened to the part of the story 179 00:09:24,400 --> 00:09:26,560 Speaker 3: that I just told that connects that dot and that 180 00:09:26,640 --> 00:09:29,680 Speaker 3: through line is I also remember going to a payday 181 00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:32,480 Speaker 3: lender when I was twenty one twenty two to get 182 00:09:32,559 --> 00:09:35,040 Speaker 3: forty bucks to buy diapers to get me to payday. 183 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:39,160 Speaker 3: I remember after I became an organizer with the union 184 00:09:39,679 --> 00:09:43,040 Speaker 3: and falling behind on my truck payment, my truck getting repolled, 185 00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:45,960 Speaker 3: and understanding that they actually would come and get your truck. 186 00:09:46,720 --> 00:09:50,439 Speaker 3: And I remember watching my mother who was fifteen when 187 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:52,000 Speaker 3: I was born, so a really young mother in my 188 00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:53,880 Speaker 3: whole life, like me having to fight grown men when 189 00:09:53,880 --> 00:09:56,800 Speaker 3: I'm fifteen or sixteen and learn how bad men can 190 00:09:56,840 --> 00:10:00,400 Speaker 3: be with women. All those things happened to me. And 191 00:10:00,440 --> 00:10:02,280 Speaker 3: at no point in this story is it that Chuck 192 00:10:02,360 --> 00:10:04,480 Speaker 3: goes off to college. I've never been to college a 193 00:10:04,559 --> 00:10:06,880 Speaker 3: day in my life, but I've lived all these real 194 00:10:06,920 --> 00:10:09,960 Speaker 3: life experiences that make me way more closer to people 195 00:10:10,080 --> 00:10:12,320 Speaker 3: that we want to talk to and get to vote 196 00:10:12,320 --> 00:10:13,920 Speaker 3: for us. So when I write an ad, it looks 197 00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:16,960 Speaker 3: much different than a guy who's well intentioned who's got 198 00:10:16,960 --> 00:10:20,880 Speaker 3: a Latino studies degree, who mama and daddy probably immigrated 199 00:10:20,880 --> 00:10:23,480 Speaker 3: to their grandparents and he got the luxuries of getting 200 00:10:23,480 --> 00:10:26,200 Speaker 3: a great education. And they're well meaning and great people. 201 00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:28,800 Speaker 3: They don't understand the life that I've lived, So it 202 00:10:28,840 --> 00:10:32,480 Speaker 3: makes my creative experience a little different. And then if 203 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:35,160 Speaker 3: you really live in the elite part of consulting that 204 00:10:35,200 --> 00:10:36,840 Speaker 3: I do, you have a little bit of a chip 205 00:10:36,880 --> 00:10:39,680 Speaker 3: on your shoulder and you're a little mouthy. And because 206 00:10:39,720 --> 00:10:42,120 Speaker 3: I'm six foot tall and two hundred pounds and don't 207 00:10:42,120 --> 00:10:44,199 Speaker 3: take a lot of shit, I can also be known 208 00:10:44,200 --> 00:10:47,520 Speaker 3: as quote unquote like being too loud and too aggressive. 209 00:10:47,120 --> 00:10:47,760 Speaker 1: That rebel guy. 210 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:50,680 Speaker 3: That's right, that radical, right, very radical, Like you're trying 211 00:10:50,679 --> 00:10:52,320 Speaker 3: to do things that are going to hurt our campaign 212 00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:54,640 Speaker 3: if we do something crazy like this and put Ruben 213 00:10:54,679 --> 00:10:57,600 Speaker 3: Diego in a rodeo the friday before the election. 214 00:10:57,440 --> 00:10:59,120 Speaker 4: Who won Ruben Gego? 215 00:11:07,080 --> 00:11:10,559 Speaker 1: So what is your sense of Is there a chip 216 00:11:10,600 --> 00:11:14,880 Speaker 1: on Latino men's shoulders that we need to talk about. 217 00:11:15,280 --> 00:11:16,720 Speaker 4: You have to separate them in two ways. 218 00:11:16,760 --> 00:11:20,400 Speaker 3: One is Latino men in general and Latino men who 219 00:11:21,000 --> 00:11:22,760 Speaker 3: are coming of age. 220 00:11:22,520 --> 00:11:23,280 Speaker 4: And who are voters. 221 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:25,319 Speaker 3: There's a lot of Latino men who just don't participate 222 00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:27,760 Speaker 3: in the process, who feel so left behind, and they 223 00:11:27,760 --> 00:11:30,120 Speaker 3: work their butts off just trying to give out voting 224 00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:32,800 Speaker 3: is the last thing on their mind. That's almost a 225 00:11:32,840 --> 00:11:35,920 Speaker 3: majority of Latino men now. The Latino men who are voting, 226 00:11:36,280 --> 00:11:39,480 Speaker 3: who have some appetite for voting, are younger than they 227 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:41,920 Speaker 3: were ten years ago when they were voting for Democrats 228 00:11:41,920 --> 00:11:45,040 Speaker 3: at seventy percent. What people miss in the conversation about 229 00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:47,680 Speaker 3: our people is that because we are so young and 230 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:50,400 Speaker 3: coming of age so quickly, it's a much different demographic 231 00:11:50,400 --> 00:11:52,560 Speaker 3: than when I came of age. There were three TV 232 00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:54,719 Speaker 3: stations when I grew up, and if the president was on, 233 00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:57,079 Speaker 3: you're not was ruined because he was on all three channels. 234 00:11:57,120 --> 00:12:00,160 Speaker 3: You couldn't watch cartoons or wrestling or nothing else. It's 235 00:12:00,200 --> 00:12:03,120 Speaker 3: a different time. My son now is thirty five. I've 236 00:12:03,120 --> 00:12:06,599 Speaker 3: got twenty eight year old grandkids that live in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. 237 00:12:07,040 --> 00:12:09,800 Speaker 3: He's followed in my footsteps and is a union steam fitter. 238 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:11,839 Speaker 3: He's got a pension, he's got health care. But when 239 00:12:11,880 --> 00:12:13,640 Speaker 3: you think about the way he thinks about being a 240 00:12:13,640 --> 00:12:16,120 Speaker 3: man and the way I thought about being a man, 241 00:12:16,480 --> 00:12:19,040 Speaker 3: it's really more similar than you would think because he 242 00:12:19,080 --> 00:12:21,160 Speaker 3: didn't go to college either, and he works with his 243 00:12:21,240 --> 00:12:23,840 Speaker 3: hands every day, and because he's a single father, his 244 00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:26,240 Speaker 3: sole purpose is taking care of those two little boys. 245 00:12:26,920 --> 00:12:28,640 Speaker 4: And so when you think about. 246 00:12:28,600 --> 00:12:31,320 Speaker 3: What is manhood, what does that look like and having 247 00:12:31,320 --> 00:12:35,320 Speaker 3: a chip on your shoulder? Men today feel like these 248 00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:39,160 Speaker 3: younger men most second generation, third generation, not newly immigrants 249 00:12:39,240 --> 00:12:42,000 Speaker 3: like they were in the sixties and seventies. That's a 250 00:12:42,040 --> 00:12:44,559 Speaker 3: big difference. And when you add in social media to that, 251 00:12:45,040 --> 00:12:47,760 Speaker 3: then there's a whole group of men who have never 252 00:12:47,800 --> 00:12:50,960 Speaker 3: been told what the Democratic Party is or what we 253 00:12:51,040 --> 00:12:54,319 Speaker 3: stand for, and if we did, we promise them things 254 00:12:54,559 --> 00:12:57,559 Speaker 3: and never got delivered on, whether it was immigration or 255 00:12:57,640 --> 00:13:01,040 Speaker 3: minimum wage or health care for everybody or whatever that 256 00:13:01,120 --> 00:13:03,960 Speaker 3: thing was. That's why you didn't see this happen overnight, 257 00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:07,400 Speaker 3: but you saw a slow erosion of that. And a 258 00:13:07,440 --> 00:13:09,360 Speaker 3: lot of it has to do with Donald Trump. Donald 259 00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:12,319 Speaker 3: Trump is such a unique story because people at least 260 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:14,720 Speaker 3: knew his name and they knew who he was. And 261 00:13:14,760 --> 00:13:17,520 Speaker 3: in politics, that's where so much money to just have 262 00:13:17,640 --> 00:13:19,000 Speaker 3: name idea where people know you. 263 00:13:20,160 --> 00:13:24,440 Speaker 1: So can you link that imagery of Donald Trump name 264 00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:29,160 Speaker 1: recognition to his connection to Latino men. 265 00:13:29,400 --> 00:13:31,960 Speaker 3: Sure, and that is going back to what I just 266 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:34,240 Speaker 3: said about the age. Let's start there, because people miss 267 00:13:34,320 --> 00:13:36,199 Speaker 3: the most crucial part of this argument is that I'm 268 00:13:36,200 --> 00:13:39,160 Speaker 3: not talking about a fifty five year old Mexican who's 269 00:13:39,200 --> 00:13:42,240 Speaker 3: got grandkids that is Chuck Roache. Most of people in 270 00:13:42,320 --> 00:13:45,480 Speaker 3: my category are still voting Democrat. It's all of our 271 00:13:45,559 --> 00:13:48,920 Speaker 3: kids and our grandkids, and they knew Donald Trump as 272 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:50,760 Speaker 3: this character caricature. 273 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:52,880 Speaker 4: And then I would add to that. 274 00:13:52,840 --> 00:13:55,360 Speaker 3: Point when it comes specifically to Latino men, let me 275 00:13:55,360 --> 00:13:57,240 Speaker 3: connect this and this is going to blow people's mind. 276 00:13:57,360 --> 00:14:01,160 Speaker 3: To Bernie Sanders. I ran Bernie's and presidential campaign in 277 00:14:01,160 --> 00:14:03,680 Speaker 3: twenty twenty. We had historic support because I was not 278 00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:06,360 Speaker 3: the Latino consultant. I ran the whole damn thing. I 279 00:14:06,400 --> 00:14:08,200 Speaker 3: was in charge of a two hundred million dollar budget, 280 00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:10,960 Speaker 3: so I made sure we were fully funded. And you 281 00:14:11,000 --> 00:14:12,080 Speaker 3: know what we talked about. 282 00:14:12,720 --> 00:14:17,960 Speaker 5: We're looking at young people leaving school deeply in debt. 283 00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:23,080 Speaker 5: We're looking at young people having jobs that, in real 284 00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:26,960 Speaker 5: wages pay less than what their parents earned. We're looking 285 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:31,680 Speaker 5: at a generation that cannot afford to buy a home. 286 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:37,040 Speaker 3: We talked about keeping jobs in America. Revitalizing manufacturing, not 287 00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:41,200 Speaker 3: funding foreign wars. Investing That sounds like Donald Trump. The 288 00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:44,480 Speaker 3: point I'm making here is that we've let and allowed 289 00:14:44,600 --> 00:14:47,760 Speaker 3: a carnival Barker and a Shastra to steal our verbiage 290 00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:51,160 Speaker 3: to full enough mainly men. You add in that he's saying, 291 00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:53,440 Speaker 3: I want to drain the swamp. The system is corrupt, 292 00:14:53,520 --> 00:14:56,000 Speaker 3: it's not working for you man. To a Latino man, 293 00:14:56,200 --> 00:14:57,080 Speaker 3: that is cat neep. 294 00:14:57,240 --> 00:14:57,840 Speaker 1: What do you mean? 295 00:14:58,280 --> 00:15:01,360 Speaker 3: Men bust their ass every day, and that in most 296 00:15:01,480 --> 00:15:04,200 Speaker 3: cultures to be the provider. You're supposed to be taking 297 00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:06,000 Speaker 3: care of your wife and these kids, and you're supposed 298 00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:08,080 Speaker 3: to be out there working. Donald Trump saying the system's 299 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 3: rigged against you. No matter how hard you work, you 300 00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:13,280 Speaker 3: can't get ahead. That's what I said with Bernie Sanders. 301 00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:16,120 Speaker 3: I was making ads with that four years before he 302 00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:19,360 Speaker 3: ever got there. It's the same thing that these men 303 00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:22,400 Speaker 3: wanted to hear, is that nobody understands what I'm having 304 00:15:22,440 --> 00:15:25,720 Speaker 3: to go through. These are the underlying anxieties that are 305 00:15:25,720 --> 00:15:29,400 Speaker 3: a little more fairly or unfairly put on men, because 306 00:15:29,400 --> 00:15:32,560 Speaker 3: in certain cultures, especially Latinos, even though the women run 307 00:15:32,600 --> 00:15:34,720 Speaker 3: the households and we all defer to our grandmothers and 308 00:15:34,760 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 3: our mothers. It's this piece about nobody cares about the 309 00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:40,720 Speaker 3: shit I'm having to go through every day to provide 310 00:15:40,720 --> 00:15:43,480 Speaker 3: for my family. And at least this guy seemed like 311 00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:44,920 Speaker 3: he's a little crazy, but he's not part of this 312 00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:47,040 Speaker 3: system that I've not been able to break into for 313 00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:47,760 Speaker 3: a long time. 314 00:15:51,720 --> 00:15:54,200 Speaker 1: Coming up on l you know usay, I continue my 315 00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:56,680 Speaker 1: conversation with Chuck Rochak. We're going to get into the 316 00:15:56,800 --> 00:16:00,840 Speaker 1: strategies that the Republican Party used to app into the 317 00:16:00,920 --> 00:16:18,400 Speaker 1: Latino male voter. That's when Ombre continues. Stay with us DIVI. Yes, Hey, 318 00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:22,720 Speaker 1: we're back for our new series, Ombre Understanding Latino Men. 319 00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:26,280 Speaker 1: Let's get back to my conversation now with political strategist 320 00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:29,560 Speaker 1: Chuck Rocha. I think what you're saying is what I've 321 00:16:30,080 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 1: in my decades of reporting, right, I'm not gonna name 322 00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:41,440 Speaker 1: how many, but several, is that Latino men are American men. Sure, 323 00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:44,800 Speaker 1: I mean there is an element of race. Obviously, for 324 00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:48,480 Speaker 1: white men, it is the system is against you because 325 00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:51,880 Speaker 1: you are white men. For Latino men, this system is 326 00:16:51,920 --> 00:16:55,920 Speaker 1: against you because you're quote unquote a minority. 327 00:16:56,760 --> 00:16:59,080 Speaker 3: This has more to do with class that most of 328 00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:01,080 Speaker 3: the men I'm talking about I ever went to college. 329 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:04,199 Speaker 3: Latino men who go to college perform like night and 330 00:17:04,359 --> 00:17:06,200 Speaker 3: day with a Latino man who did not. 331 00:17:06,520 --> 00:17:07,240 Speaker 4: In elections. 332 00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:10,040 Speaker 3: I've run races this year from California to New York, 333 00:17:10,280 --> 00:17:12,520 Speaker 3: and the one thing that really stands out was if 334 00:17:12,560 --> 00:17:14,480 Speaker 3: you went to college and you were a Latino man, 335 00:17:14,520 --> 00:17:17,080 Speaker 3: even a young Latino man in your thirties, you voted 336 00:17:17,119 --> 00:17:20,480 Speaker 3: twenty percent more democratic than the non college educated Latino men. 337 00:17:20,960 --> 00:17:23,159 Speaker 3: You're consuming information a little differently, you're looking at the 338 00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:25,600 Speaker 3: world differently, and at least the guy who's got the 339 00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:29,720 Speaker 3: degree sees a pathway out, a pathway to aspire to 340 00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:32,000 Speaker 3: be as good as his parents, or to make money 341 00:17:32,119 --> 00:17:34,920 Speaker 3: or do whatever he wants to do. One in four 342 00:17:35,000 --> 00:17:37,720 Speaker 3: Latino men are connected to the construction trade. They're in lumber, 343 00:17:37,840 --> 00:17:40,760 Speaker 3: they're in concrete, they're in plumbing, they're in ditch digging. 344 00:17:41,280 --> 00:17:44,600 Speaker 3: So when you start seeing things like the pandemic happening, 345 00:17:44,720 --> 00:17:47,680 Speaker 3: downturns in the economy, lumber going up, all of those 346 00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:51,000 Speaker 3: things over indexed hurt Latino men and their work, so 347 00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:54,480 Speaker 3: there's even more anxiety. So we were fighting an uphill 348 00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:57,520 Speaker 3: battle and you couple that with a party who says, 349 00:17:57,560 --> 00:17:59,960 Speaker 3: if you haven't voted in the last two or three cycles, 350 00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:02,720 Speaker 3: you're an infrequent voter and you're not worth the dollar 351 00:18:02,760 --> 00:18:04,560 Speaker 3: to spend to talk to you. And that in itself 352 00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:06,880 Speaker 3: is part of the biggest problem. So you couple all 353 00:18:06,880 --> 00:18:09,200 Speaker 3: those things together. There's not one answer to your question. 354 00:18:09,480 --> 00:18:11,920 Speaker 3: But I've done this long enough not that they're all interconnected, 355 00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:15,520 Speaker 3: and that's where you start losing ten percent as we go. 356 00:18:16,240 --> 00:18:17,720 Speaker 1: So I'm going to give you this other thing that 357 00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:20,480 Speaker 1: happened here in New York. At my deli, there's a 358 00:18:21,160 --> 00:18:23,560 Speaker 1: I thought he was Mexican. Turns out he's Guatemalan. But 359 00:18:23,600 --> 00:18:25,960 Speaker 1: you know, he makes the sandwiches like in every pillar 360 00:18:26,040 --> 00:18:29,360 Speaker 1: across New York City. And after the election, I asked him, 361 00:18:29,359 --> 00:18:31,040 Speaker 1: you know, what's up, and he was not happy that 362 00:18:31,080 --> 00:18:35,920 Speaker 1: Trump won, But very quickly he was like, yes, but 363 00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:39,720 Speaker 1: why did they give all those immigrants people here in 364 00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:41,680 Speaker 1: New York City? Why did they get a check? Why 365 00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:43,840 Speaker 1: did they get a hotel room? These immigrants who are 366 00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:45,840 Speaker 1: arriving here, why are they getting the foot up when 367 00:18:45,920 --> 00:18:47,320 Speaker 1: you know, I came this way and I had to 368 00:18:47,320 --> 00:18:49,159 Speaker 1: work my way up, and I was like whoa hold 369 00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:53,640 Speaker 1: on talk to me about that in terms of Latino men, 370 00:18:54,080 --> 00:18:56,960 Speaker 1: to just be like, I'm now prissed off about other 371 00:18:57,040 --> 00:18:59,720 Speaker 1: people who i think are getting one over on us, 372 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:01,280 Speaker 1: that whole messaging there. 373 00:19:01,680 --> 00:19:04,480 Speaker 3: I think that we've allowed the Republicans to become more 374 00:19:04,520 --> 00:19:07,560 Speaker 3: than a party, and they're kind of a social brand now, 375 00:19:07,920 --> 00:19:10,600 Speaker 3: a social brand of what it is to call out 376 00:19:10,680 --> 00:19:12,760 Speaker 3: what we used to do, which is call out power, 377 00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:14,879 Speaker 3: call out people that are trying to rig the system. 378 00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:17,400 Speaker 3: And if you are younger than most white or black 379 00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:20,080 Speaker 3: men in this country, if you're tied to construction or 380 00:19:20,160 --> 00:19:24,080 Speaker 3: jobs that really suck, then you see an immigrant, documented 381 00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:27,119 Speaker 3: undocumented immigrants like my grandparents, like all of the beautiful 382 00:19:27,119 --> 00:19:29,520 Speaker 3: immigrants who've come here to make this country better. Then 383 00:19:29,560 --> 00:19:32,200 Speaker 3: you can play on people's worst fears because they see 384 00:19:32,200 --> 00:19:34,880 Speaker 3: it in their social circles. This is the biggest difference 385 00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:37,439 Speaker 3: than when I ran campaigns in the nineties is that 386 00:19:37,480 --> 00:19:42,480 Speaker 3: the social influence of social media, Fox News, this bromosphere 387 00:19:42,680 --> 00:19:47,280 Speaker 3: of podcasts and information makes it okay socially to be 388 00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:50,200 Speaker 3: like those bad people there are trying to take something 389 00:19:50,200 --> 00:19:52,800 Speaker 3: that I'm working hard for. My mother was on food stamps. 390 00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:55,159 Speaker 3: I ate government cheese, and I make more money in 391 00:19:55,160 --> 00:19:57,880 Speaker 3: a congressman. Now I've lived the dream, and thank god 392 00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:00,440 Speaker 3: my government was there to give my mama, who didn't 393 00:20:00,440 --> 00:20:02,520 Speaker 3: have a high school diploma, a little help when we 394 00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:04,640 Speaker 3: wanted some cheese. I ate a lot of grilled cheese sandwiches. 395 00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:06,920 Speaker 3: They were awesome. But I'll have to know more. 396 00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:20,479 Speaker 1: So the way we were talked about before the election 397 00:20:21,560 --> 00:20:23,919 Speaker 1: and the way we've been talked about now post election, 398 00:20:24,320 --> 00:20:27,480 Speaker 1: and there was that immediate it's all the Latino's fault 399 00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:30,480 Speaker 1: and in particular Latino men. What do we need to 400 00:20:30,560 --> 00:20:31,880 Speaker 1: understand about that? 401 00:20:32,280 --> 00:20:34,720 Speaker 3: First of all, folks should know that if Latino's performed 402 00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:36,719 Speaker 3: at the same level they always have for Democrats, at 403 00:20:36,760 --> 00:20:40,480 Speaker 3: like sixty five percent support in every battleground state, there's 404 00:20:40,480 --> 00:20:42,639 Speaker 3: not enough of us in those battleground states would have mattered. 405 00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:45,840 Speaker 3: White people elected Donald Trump in all of those states 406 00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:48,960 Speaker 3: and overperformed for him. We talk about Latino man. Latino 407 00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:51,400 Speaker 3: men are three percent of the electorate in America. We've 408 00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:53,840 Speaker 3: always been the scapegoat and it's just so unfair. 409 00:20:54,000 --> 00:20:56,520 Speaker 1: What did you hear that made your blood boil? 410 00:20:56,680 --> 00:20:59,600 Speaker 3: MSNBC commentators in the evening saying that you're going to 411 00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:02,840 Speaker 3: get what you deserve when you haven't taken any time 412 00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:04,520 Speaker 3: to come talk to us about what you stand for. 413 00:21:05,359 --> 00:21:07,520 Speaker 3: And as a Latino man, and this may shock you, 414 00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:10,240 Speaker 3: but there's not a doubt in my mind that twenty 415 00:21:10,320 --> 00:21:12,919 Speaker 3: years ago, in the same position I was in and 416 00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:15,040 Speaker 3: Donald Trump using the same message, I'd have voted for 417 00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:18,080 Speaker 3: Donald Trump. And it makes me cringe to say that, 418 00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:19,199 Speaker 3: but I just know that I would have. 419 00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:20,159 Speaker 4: I was a rebel. 420 00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:23,920 Speaker 3: I was long haired, riding a motorcycle. I was boxing, 421 00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:24,800 Speaker 3: I was fighting, I. 422 00:21:24,800 --> 00:21:25,760 Speaker 4: Was going to rodeos. 423 00:21:26,119 --> 00:21:28,399 Speaker 3: But the reason I joined the party, it was in 424 00:21:28,480 --> 00:21:31,600 Speaker 3: nineteen ninety two or whatever it was, and I joined 425 00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:33,159 Speaker 3: the union. When I got into the factory, I was 426 00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:35,560 Speaker 3: not an activist, but we were fighting this thing that 427 00:21:35,640 --> 00:21:39,840 Speaker 3: George Bush had negotiated called NAFTA. And my plant made 428 00:21:39,920 --> 00:21:43,400 Speaker 3: radio pasture tires for cars. Twelve hundred men in Roule, 429 00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:46,000 Speaker 3: East Texas. It was the heart of the community and 430 00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:46,840 Speaker 3: we were like, oh. 431 00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:47,639 Speaker 4: This is going to be bad. 432 00:21:48,119 --> 00:21:49,919 Speaker 3: The second thing is is once I got involved a 433 00:21:49,920 --> 00:21:51,919 Speaker 3: little bit, I was like, why does all these people 434 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:54,040 Speaker 3: with the power and money think they're better than me. 435 00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:57,840 Speaker 3: I'm paying all the taxes, so that makes me know, Maria, 436 00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:00,240 Speaker 3: that I would have fallen right in line with Donald Trump. 437 00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:02,359 Speaker 3: And I don't think there's that much difference in these 438 00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:06,479 Speaker 3: non college educated, working class Latino men that I was 439 00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:09,200 Speaker 3: who loved that same language. And I know that as 440 00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:12,240 Speaker 3: a fact because they loved it. When even an old 441 00:22:12,280 --> 00:22:14,600 Speaker 3: white guy from Vermont with a Brooklyn accent. 442 00:22:14,320 --> 00:22:16,200 Speaker 4: Set it, they were like, oh, that sounds pretty cool. 443 00:22:16,359 --> 00:22:18,159 Speaker 4: Like he's white and he seems kind of cookie. 444 00:22:18,359 --> 00:22:20,520 Speaker 3: But at least he wants to give everybody health care 445 00:22:20,640 --> 00:22:21,760 Speaker 3: and raise the minimum wage. 446 00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:26,320 Speaker 1: But the thing that Donald Trump was saying was build 447 00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:31,320 Speaker 1: the wall, and the wall was to keep Latino men out. 448 00:22:32,359 --> 00:22:35,520 Speaker 1: Talk to me about that messaging where they were like, yeah, no, 449 00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:36,080 Speaker 1: I don't care. 450 00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:38,560 Speaker 4: It's not me, it's not my family. I can't hear 451 00:22:38,600 --> 00:22:39,120 Speaker 4: the right way. 452 00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:41,240 Speaker 1: Well what about that? Because many of them did not 453 00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:43,960 Speaker 1: come quote unquote the right way. Maybe some of them did. 454 00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:48,120 Speaker 3: It's easy to demogogue somebody. The difference today than when 455 00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:50,800 Speaker 3: I was working on campaigns off of a pager and 456 00:22:50,840 --> 00:22:54,760 Speaker 3: out of a world book is that information now flows 457 00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:57,960 Speaker 3: crazy fast over the Internet. You have the guy who 458 00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:00,879 Speaker 3: owns Tesla owning Twitter now, so then everything in your 459 00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:03,840 Speaker 3: algorithm's built against the things that you stand for. 460 00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:05,560 Speaker 4: That really demagogues folks to wear. 461 00:23:05,920 --> 00:23:08,040 Speaker 3: Not all the men and not all the Latino men, 462 00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:11,199 Speaker 3: but they have the highest propensity to fall for that 463 00:23:11,240 --> 00:23:13,720 Speaker 3: stuff because they're not Nobody else is talking to them. 464 00:23:13,880 --> 00:23:17,159 Speaker 3: They can't see an alternative message. So folks like me, 465 00:23:17,320 --> 00:23:19,760 Speaker 3: working class kid in somewhere in New Jersey. He's just 466 00:23:19,800 --> 00:23:21,840 Speaker 3: seeing what his buddies are saying. And it ain't cool 467 00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:23,080 Speaker 3: to be a Democrat. 468 00:23:22,640 --> 00:23:26,200 Speaker 1: No more so, Chuck, I know you're an optimist. I mean, also, 469 00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:27,919 Speaker 1: congratulations on your recent wedding. 470 00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:31,080 Speaker 4: Oh my god. Yeah, that woman literally saved my life. 471 00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:33,400 Speaker 3: The best thing that happened to me with ebony pain 472 00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:36,080 Speaker 3: is that she was like, you don't have to fight 473 00:23:36,119 --> 00:23:38,800 Speaker 3: every fight, and every fight ain't your fight, and you 474 00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:40,520 Speaker 3: should fight as much as you want to fight, but 475 00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:43,240 Speaker 3: you should take a day and just be thankful for 476 00:23:43,280 --> 00:23:45,720 Speaker 3: what you got and be happy. Because I thought if 477 00:23:45,720 --> 00:23:48,840 Speaker 3: I wasn't fighting, I didn't feel anything, and there's no 478 00:23:48,880 --> 00:23:52,000 Speaker 3: way I could feel happy. So that's like getting deep emotional. 479 00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:54,840 Speaker 3: But I'm just saying for men who don't want to 480 00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:57,680 Speaker 3: talk about their emotion, and I was that man, and. 481 00:23:57,600 --> 00:23:59,480 Speaker 4: I feel like it's my job now to. 482 00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:01,480 Speaker 3: Tell other young men that you can do all of 483 00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:03,800 Speaker 3: these things, but show due respect to every woman in 484 00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:06,760 Speaker 3: your life. You can be a man's man, ride all 485 00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:08,280 Speaker 3: the bulls you want to ride. 486 00:24:08,440 --> 00:24:10,120 Speaker 4: But you don't have to be a sexist asshole. 487 00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:13,399 Speaker 1: Now you know that. The other thing that happened in 488 00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:18,200 Speaker 1: twenty twenty four, Chuck, is that, well, Mexican men voted 489 00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:22,040 Speaker 1: in a woman president. Boom okay, yes, and so help 490 00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:26,720 Speaker 1: us to understand that Mexican men willingly voting for Claudia 491 00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:31,040 Speaker 1: Schembam and yet Latino men here in the United States 492 00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:33,760 Speaker 1: having a problem voting for a woman or was it 493 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:36,359 Speaker 1: just voting for Democrats that was the problem? 494 00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:36,879 Speaker 4: Bingo. 495 00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:38,840 Speaker 3: Not all of it, but a big bunch of it 496 00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:41,760 Speaker 3: is that the brand is broken. We have to figure 497 00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:44,760 Speaker 3: out how to reimagine this party in talking to workers. 498 00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:47,240 Speaker 3: And it don't have as much to do for your 499 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:50,080 Speaker 3: listeners about being a man or a brown man or 500 00:24:50,119 --> 00:24:52,520 Speaker 3: in some cases a black man. It has to do 501 00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:54,520 Speaker 3: with the way that we talk about work, and we've 502 00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:58,920 Speaker 3: forgotten how to talk about work with people. Republicans figured 503 00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:00,879 Speaker 3: out about ten years ago that there was only so 504 00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:02,840 Speaker 3: many old, rich white men that they could get, and 505 00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:05,439 Speaker 3: they top out. They had to grow their numbers. Then 506 00:25:05,480 --> 00:25:07,520 Speaker 3: Donald Trump comes along with Steve Bannon and some other 507 00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:10,560 Speaker 3: crazy idits. You're like, if we sound like democrats and populists, 508 00:25:10,560 --> 00:25:12,359 Speaker 3: we probably can get some of these other folks. And 509 00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:14,159 Speaker 3: I think this goes back to your point about the 510 00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:17,280 Speaker 3: President of Mexico is that she's a populist because she 511 00:25:17,359 --> 00:25:20,200 Speaker 3: leaned into what workers and folks in that country wanted 512 00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:23,320 Speaker 3: and men at their core. Now they won't always admit this, 513 00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:25,800 Speaker 3: but I'll pull back the man curtain for all of y'all. 514 00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:29,160 Speaker 3: There's nobody they live more than their mothers and their grandmothers, 515 00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:32,560 Speaker 3: and everybody knows in these households that they really run everything. 516 00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:35,639 Speaker 3: They run the bills, they run the social schedules, they 517 00:25:35,680 --> 00:25:38,600 Speaker 3: run all the things, and men defer to them, just 518 00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:39,960 Speaker 3: like they would defer to this wom who's going to 519 00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:42,760 Speaker 3: run for president of Mexico. In America, it was the 520 00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:45,520 Speaker 3: brand of the party being quote unquote week when I 521 00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:48,880 Speaker 3: would ask Latinos in focus groups, tell me something about 522 00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:54,560 Speaker 3: Republicans crazy, strong, Donald Trump's crazy, but they're strong. Democrats weak. 523 00:25:55,119 --> 00:25:57,320 Speaker 3: I mean with Bill Biden, it was old, old and weak. 524 00:25:57,520 --> 00:26:00,919 Speaker 3: If Democrats wanted to do one thing to start rebuilding. 525 00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:04,640 Speaker 3: What they've done is they would start leaning into work, 526 00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:07,080 Speaker 3: sanctity of work, and how that connects to a family, 527 00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:11,240 Speaker 3: because the Latinos were still more connected to our families 528 00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:14,720 Speaker 3: because we lean on them for support around all the 529 00:26:14,760 --> 00:26:17,040 Speaker 3: things in our lives. So when you talk about the 530 00:26:17,080 --> 00:26:19,400 Speaker 3: sanctity of work and providing, that's a way to win 531 00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:23,440 Speaker 3: back men. But we don't talk enough about jobs, work, family. 532 00:26:23,640 --> 00:26:25,240 Speaker 3: We've given that to the Republicans. 533 00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:27,480 Speaker 1: Chuck, are you thinking four years out or are you 534 00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:28,880 Speaker 1: thinking two years. 535 00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:30,440 Speaker 3: Out and two years we can win back the House 536 00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:32,840 Speaker 3: and stop some of this bleeding. I want to immediately 537 00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:35,120 Speaker 3: start trying to figure out how to start having conversations 538 00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:37,800 Speaker 3: with men and middle class workers, no matter if their 539 00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:40,440 Speaker 3: men are not in certain states now, and go start 540 00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:42,800 Speaker 3: talking to folks really early about things that they care 541 00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:45,879 Speaker 3: about and using the boogeyman of what Republicans won't do 542 00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:48,000 Speaker 3: in Congress to actually help people because they won't be 543 00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:51,240 Speaker 3: able to deliver. But my eyes really on twenty twenty eight, 544 00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:54,439 Speaker 3: and if I get a chance to work for somebody 545 00:26:54,440 --> 00:26:56,560 Speaker 3: who really has my vision of trying to return this 546 00:26:56,640 --> 00:26:58,720 Speaker 3: country back to a place that I wanted it to 547 00:26:58,760 --> 00:27:00,640 Speaker 3: be when I joined the party thirty five years ago. 548 00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:03,040 Speaker 4: Rooted in workers' rights, rooted. 549 00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:04,800 Speaker 3: In fairness for everybody in the community, no matter the 550 00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:07,280 Speaker 3: color of your skin or what hunger. Don't have a 551 00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:10,000 Speaker 3: party or a skin tone, right, They're hungry, They're hungry. 552 00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:12,200 Speaker 3: This go back to talking to people, and I think 553 00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:13,399 Speaker 3: that's where we really have to get to. 554 00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:17,879 Speaker 1: So you end up running somebody's great campaign in twenty 555 00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:22,480 Speaker 1: twenty eight, your messaging, specifically to Latino men, would be what. 556 00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:26,440 Speaker 3: So what can I do to help that Latino man 557 00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:29,080 Speaker 3: be able to afford to send their kids to college? 558 00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:32,040 Speaker 3: Do we force university to make that more affordable? Do 559 00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:33,479 Speaker 3: we do free college for all? 560 00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:34,080 Speaker 4: Whatever it is. 561 00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:36,880 Speaker 3: The second is housing, because folks can't afford to buy 562 00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:40,600 Speaker 3: a home and they've lost hope. So education and housing 563 00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:43,040 Speaker 3: are two things Democrats have quit talking about. And then 564 00:27:43,320 --> 00:27:46,159 Speaker 3: don't be scared to talk about immigration. We are so 565 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:50,680 Speaker 3: scared of Republicans and immigration. Stand up for something, be something, 566 00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:51,800 Speaker 3: and folks will respect that. 567 00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:52,840 Speaker 4: Own who you are. 568 00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:55,600 Speaker 3: Ruben Gego, he's my brother, he's my best friend, and 569 00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:57,680 Speaker 3: he let me work on this campaign from day one. 570 00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:00,800 Speaker 3: He really believed in this and people reacted to it 571 00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:04,639 Speaker 3: in a red state because he personally connected to everybody 572 00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:06,720 Speaker 3: and talked about coming from an immigrant family. He still 573 00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:09,080 Speaker 3: talked about the border and talked about the border in 574 00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:11,119 Speaker 3: a way that didn't demigogu immigrants. But sure, we can 575 00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:13,280 Speaker 3: have a safe border. Nobody does not want a safe border. 576 00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:17,400 Speaker 3: White Republican independent men in the suburbs who you think 577 00:28:17,400 --> 00:28:20,320 Speaker 3: would hate Ruben Gyego because they watched so much Fox News, 578 00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:22,840 Speaker 3: respected Ruben. They're like, look, we're not going to agree 579 00:28:22,840 --> 00:28:25,560 Speaker 3: on everything, but I like that he served his country. 580 00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:27,399 Speaker 3: I like that he used to flip burgers and he 581 00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:29,840 Speaker 3: came from nothing. I liked that he never got to 582 00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:31,600 Speaker 3: bed till he went to college because he had three 583 00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:34,040 Speaker 3: sisters and they got the bedroom. Like those kind of 584 00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:36,760 Speaker 3: things you can't make up for people. And if you 585 00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:39,000 Speaker 3: started a position where they're believing your message, then you 586 00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:41,080 Speaker 3: can get there. And that was the Democrats' problem at 587 00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:42,560 Speaker 3: the end, is no way believed the message. 588 00:28:43,080 --> 00:28:47,040 Speaker 1: So Gyego is your kind of shining example of what's 589 00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:51,400 Speaker 1: possible if you actually own Latino manhood. 590 00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:54,440 Speaker 3: Sure, absolutely, he wanted to have a boxing viewing match 591 00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:56,720 Speaker 3: when Canelo was going to fight and he told the 592 00:28:56,760 --> 00:29:00,760 Speaker 3: consultants every Mexican man in Arizona is to be watching 593 00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:03,840 Speaker 3: this fight. I want to have big viewing parties that 594 00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:07,800 Speaker 3: I sponsor to bring families together, set up big screens 595 00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:09,800 Speaker 3: in the park that show people beating each other up 596 00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:14,040 Speaker 3: on the screen, which we love, Maria. The DC and 597 00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:16,800 Speaker 3: New York consultants lost their mind. They were like, we 598 00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:20,560 Speaker 3: cannot do this. What if somebody gets hurt, what if 599 00:29:20,600 --> 00:29:23,320 Speaker 3: somebody gets drunk? And I'm like, yes, all of those things. 600 00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:27,360 Speaker 3: But Ruben made sure it happened and the party they 601 00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:29,480 Speaker 3: didn't want to have it. Ruber was like, no, let's 602 00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:31,760 Speaker 3: take this opportunity to go talk to these men who 603 00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:34,520 Speaker 3: nobody will talk to. I think we have forgotten how 604 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:36,360 Speaker 3: to do that in many, many campaigns. 605 00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:45,280 Speaker 1: At Futuro Media, when we've been talking and covering politics 606 00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:49,080 Speaker 1: for years now, we were talking about joy. It is 607 00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:54,040 Speaker 1: in fact important in our lives, in our politics. Simple question, 608 00:29:54,520 --> 00:29:57,520 Speaker 1: what is something that brings you joy when you need it? 609 00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:00,320 Speaker 3: It's always reflecting almost two little twin boys. 610 00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:01,440 Speaker 4: Or my wife. 611 00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:03,600 Speaker 3: My wife brings me lots of joy, like she puts 612 00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:06,440 Speaker 3: up with me, but she also keeps me grounded. So 613 00:30:06,560 --> 00:30:09,560 Speaker 3: my wife and my son and my grandsons are always 614 00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:11,480 Speaker 3: going to be on the top. But a close second 615 00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:13,840 Speaker 3: is I'm still a man's man at heart, and I 616 00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:17,840 Speaker 3: love hunting and fishing and being outside and getting scuffed up. 617 00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:19,320 Speaker 4: So what I do is. 618 00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:21,720 Speaker 3: I go fishing all over the world all the time. 619 00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:24,200 Speaker 3: I'm always looking for the next fishing trip to turn 620 00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:26,440 Speaker 3: my phone off to get out there one on one the. 621 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:29,680 Speaker 1: Old man of the sea. That's right, Chuck, thank you 622 00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:32,640 Speaker 1: so much for speaking with us on our new series 623 00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:37,400 Speaker 1: on its premiere right here on Latino USA, Ombre Understanding 624 00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:39,000 Speaker 1: Latino Man, which I was gonna. 625 00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:40,280 Speaker 4: Say, yes, that's my honor. Thank you so much. 626 00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:48,160 Speaker 1: So as we move forward with our series, Ombren, we're 627 00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:51,400 Speaker 1: gonna leave you with a couple of takeaways after each conversation. 628 00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:54,080 Speaker 1: And in terms of this conversation, here's some things that 629 00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:57,080 Speaker 1: I found most revealing and that I think can broaden 630 00:30:57,160 --> 00:31:02,680 Speaker 1: our understanding of our OMBRIS. So first, Chuck Rochat reminded 631 00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:06,080 Speaker 1: us that Latino men are still more working class than 632 00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:09,560 Speaker 1: other groups. Right. One in four Latino men work in 633 00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:14,840 Speaker 1: the construction business, so pandemic related economic shifts have hurt 634 00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:19,680 Speaker 1: Latino men particularly hard. On top of that they carry 635 00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:23,160 Speaker 1: cultural expectations about being a man and being able to 636 00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:26,880 Speaker 1: provide for his family, and that can create the perfect 637 00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:30,680 Speaker 1: storm for feeling isolated in the United States, like no 638 00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:35,560 Speaker 1: one understands the pressure that you're under. And if there's 639 00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:39,560 Speaker 1: a politician who can tap into that anxiety, from Donald 640 00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:43,480 Speaker 1: Trump to Bernie Sanders, then they can get the attention 641 00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:48,600 Speaker 1: of Latino men. Another salient point, remember that even if 642 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:52,120 Speaker 1: all Latinos who had ever supported the Democratic Party voted 643 00:31:52,160 --> 00:31:56,680 Speaker 1: for Kamala Harris in every battleground state, Donald Trump still 644 00:31:56,800 --> 00:32:01,040 Speaker 1: would have won the election because of his loyal base 645 00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:07,160 Speaker 1: of white voters. So be clear about who really delivered 646 00:32:07,160 --> 00:32:12,280 Speaker 1: this election to Donald Trump. And one last takeaway, Young 647 00:32:12,640 --> 00:32:17,360 Speaker 1: male Latino voters have a limited connection with the Democratic Party, 648 00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:22,600 Speaker 1: and frankly, that's not their fault. So try not to 649 00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:25,000 Speaker 1: fall for all the anger of the pundits or all 650 00:32:25,040 --> 00:32:29,120 Speaker 1: of the hopelessness. Instead, let's try to stay curious, let's 651 00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:33,360 Speaker 1: try to dig deeper, let's try to embrace complexity. And 652 00:32:33,720 --> 00:32:35,760 Speaker 1: we're going to do that and we hope that you'll 653 00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:40,440 Speaker 1: join us on this journey of understanding Latino men on Ombre. 654 00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:53,160 Speaker 1: This episode was produced by nor Saudi and edited by 655 00:32:53,280 --> 00:32:57,600 Speaker 1: Andrea Lopez Grusavo. It was mixed by Mark Yoshizumi with 656 00:32:57,680 --> 00:33:01,840 Speaker 1: engineering support from JJ Krubin. The Latino USA team also 657 00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:08,080 Speaker 1: includes Julia Caruso, Jessica Elis, Victoria Estrada, Dominiquinestrosas, Renaldolanos Junior, 658 00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:14,360 Speaker 1: Stephanie Lebau, Luis Luna, Marta Martinez and Nancy Trujillo, Benni Leiramidez, 659 00:33:14,400 --> 00:33:18,320 Speaker 1: Marlon Bishop, Maria Garcia and myself are your co executive 660 00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:21,920 Speaker 1: producers and I'm your host, Mariano Jossa join us again 661 00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:23,960 Speaker 1: on our next episode. In the meantime, look for us 662 00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:25,840 Speaker 1: on social media. Let us know what you think about 663 00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:30,360 Speaker 1: our new series. Ombre and Jadu Savestebayes. 664 00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:40,440 Speaker 6: Latino USA is made possible in part by the Ford Foundation, 665 00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:45,160 Speaker 6: working with visionaries on the front lines of social change worldwide, 666 00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:50,120 Speaker 6: the John D. And Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation, and the 667 00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:56,640 Speaker 6: Heising Simons Foundation unlocking knowledge, opportunity and possibilities more at 668 00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:58,560 Speaker 6: hsfoundation dot org. 669 00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:04,040 Speaker 4: I have not missed a workout in thirty eight years. 670 00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:07,480 Speaker 3: I'm going to start today right because I'm pretty like 671 00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:08,680 Speaker 3: I'm one hundred and five. 672 00:34:08,719 --> 00:34:10,080 Speaker 4: I don't know if you know, but yeah. 673 00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:17,120 Speaker 1: No, oh yeah, mad Chuck. You know, I'm a beast 674 00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:20,520 Speaker 1: in terms of washing, but when it's twenty seven degrees 675 00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:24,280 Speaker 1: then I can't breathe. But is seriously every single day. 676 00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:27,560 Speaker 4: Chuck forever, Oh my lavel. Pretty much you are one 677 00:34:27,640 --> 00:34:28,440 Speaker 1: Hundred and five then