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Speaker 1: Hey, welcome, and I'm Doug Gottlieban. You are listening to

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Speaker 1: the All Ball podcasts, All Basketball all the time. We

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Speaker 1: can get into summer recruiting in the summer circuit, we

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Speaker 1: can get into the NBA. As free agency has died down,

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Speaker 1: I continue to point out that these small market teams

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Speaker 1: are going to be ticked right when Michael Jordan's so funny,

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Speaker 1: Like all these players who say Durant said it, Lebron

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Speaker 1: said that they want to be owners, Michael Jordan actually

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Speaker 1: is an owner, and he's ticked about how some of

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Speaker 1: this free agency stuff went down. And wait, Kemba agreed

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Speaker 1: to a deal right after the deadline. How did that

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Speaker 1: happen if you're not supposed to talk to each other,

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Speaker 1: you know, And he's a guy that didn't want to

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Speaker 1: pay Kemba the supermax because he didn't think it was

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Speaker 1: worth it. Here's the problem with owning a team in

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Speaker 1: a small market. If yet you you draft the right guy,

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Speaker 1: you nurture his growth, he plays for you, you you have

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Speaker 1: to give him a max or a super max contract.

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Speaker 1: If you do that, you are not going to make

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Speaker 1: money one and like, unless you put a team around

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Speaker 1: him and put a team around him really good one

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Speaker 1: you're gonna go into luxury tax. You go into luxury tax,

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Speaker 1: or even if you're paying the top end of the

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Speaker 1: salary scale before luxury tex, you're not making money on

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Speaker 1: a daily basis. You're just not. Now you can tell me, well, Doug,

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Speaker 1: these owners make money and the value the franchise, that's great,

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Speaker 1: But you know when you reap the benefits and the

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Speaker 1: value of the franchise when you sell the franchise. And

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Speaker 1: most people don't buy an NBA franchise thinking, man, I

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Speaker 1: can't wait till I sell this thing. That's not the

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Speaker 1: idea you want to see it through, So you can't.

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Speaker 1: You don't have the non basketball generated income the way

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Speaker 1: that the Lakers do, or the Knicks do, or the

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Speaker 1: Nets may or the Rockets may being a bigger market

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Speaker 1: and bigger local TV stuff and and be able to

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Speaker 1: withstand or just you have to have ridiculously deep pockets

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Speaker 1: in order to go into luxury tax and pay these salaries.

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Speaker 1: So you damn if you're doing if damn don't you

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Speaker 1: either you either overpay for guys and lose money hoping

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Speaker 1: to gamble and win a championship one year, or you

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Speaker 1: try to maintain your books road organically, knowing that you're

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Speaker 1: gonna make some money, but you're not gonna win championships.

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Speaker 1: It's a really hard thing. I don't know how to

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Speaker 1: fix it, but I do know that eventually this is

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Speaker 1: This is one of the reasons that college athletics it

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Speaker 1: takes time to change because you have half of the

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Speaker 1: programs aren't making money on their college sports teams, and uh,

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Speaker 1: they have to be more self sufficient than they ever

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Speaker 1: used to be. And so while Alabama in Texas and

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Speaker 1: Ohio State and l s U they're killing it in football,

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Speaker 1: lots of other programs like Yukon or not. When you

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Speaker 1: have one league in the NBA where it's it's there's

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Speaker 1: a there's almost bipolar in terms of the revenues the values.

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Speaker 1: You have the same thing in college sports. Let me

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Speaker 1: go back to college sports as well. I know many

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Speaker 1: of you are brought up under the belief that somehow

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Speaker 1: the n c A and college athletics are the bad

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Speaker 1: guys because they make some money on athletes, their name

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Speaker 1: and image and likeness. The whole thing is bullshit. You've

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Speaker 1: been fed bullshit by people in the media. Yeah, if

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Speaker 1: you don't believe me. If you don't believe me, I'll

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Speaker 1: give you Zion Williamson. Okay, Now, Zion Williamson ingesting to

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Speaker 1: deal with Jordan Brand for what's supposedly more than ten

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Speaker 1: million dollars a year for five years. Let's say it's

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Speaker 1: fifty million dollars. Last year Zion Williamson left high school,

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Speaker 1: he could have gone straight to the G League and

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Speaker 1: even as a YouTube sensation. Maybe he signs for a

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Speaker 1: million dollars with Nike here or under Armour Deader. So

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Speaker 1: maybe he drives it up to two two million dollars.

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Speaker 1: So if you think for one second that playing half

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Speaker 1: a season he really put half year half a year

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Speaker 1: at Duke didn't grow his brand exponentially to where he

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Speaker 1: just signed the biggest deal a a one and done

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Speaker 1: guy has ever signed. You're either an idiot or you

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Speaker 1: just are so rife with anger and hatred of any

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Speaker 1: sort of leadership that you can't see the forest because

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Speaker 1: you're too close to the trees. Yes, Duke benefited some

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Speaker 1: financially from Zion Willimson, some, not a lot. Their games

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Speaker 1: were gonna be on TV, their arena was gonna be packed,

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Speaker 1: They were gonna get the n c A tournament. Their

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Speaker 1: radio and TV rights were gonna be the same whether

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Speaker 1: he came or he didn't count. But Zion Williamson playing

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Speaker 1: half a year at Duke benefited to the tune of

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Speaker 1: what forty million dollars at addition to where he moved

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Speaker 1: up in the draft board. And he's a household name,

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Speaker 1: not because he's a Williamson, because he's Ian Williamson who

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Speaker 1: played at Duke. All right, enough of destroying the whole

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Speaker 1: argument that college sports don't bring value to players. Only

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Speaker 1: players bring value to college sports. I love j Bill

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Speaker 1: as he came on the pod last year. You should

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Speaker 1: download that one. Maybe we'll get him on again this

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Speaker 1: year just to talk about the freak athlete that is

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Speaker 1: is uh is Zion. But I actually thinks the whole

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Speaker 1: Zion thing helps kind of make the argument. Right. He

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Speaker 1: improved as a player, improved as a person, improved his

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Speaker 1: draft stock, and his value on Madison Avenue went up

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Speaker 1: exponentially because he linked into Duke's brand. Duke's brand is

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Speaker 1: more is more powerful than anything, even even Kentucky's Brandon

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Speaker 1: college basketball. It helped him and I have the hard

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Speaker 1: numbers to show you how Now let's get to our

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Speaker 1: interview of the week. Brian Barroni is the new head

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Speaker 1: coach at s i U Edwardsville Division One program that

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Speaker 1: Marty Simmons had as a twenty win program going back

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Speaker 1: I don't know fifteen twenty years ago. Uh. Bryan's lived

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Speaker 1: in County. Incredible life, son of Tony and BARRONI the

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Speaker 1: now late great coach of places like Creighton, like like Creighton,

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Speaker 1: like Texas, A and M. Just kind of a beloved

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Speaker 1: figure in the basketball world because he was colorful, in

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Speaker 1: a great name, and he was hilarious and it's good

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Speaker 1: about ball. Coach. Brian and I were I wouldn't say rivals.

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Speaker 1: Contemporaries at some level played against him when he was

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Speaker 1: at A and M. And then he end up transferring

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Speaker 1: to Marquette where which was one of the schools that

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Speaker 1: I I was down to before I chose Oaklhom State

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Speaker 1: for transferring from Notre Dame. There's a lot of ties

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Speaker 1: that bind. His father passed away not long ago, about

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Speaker 1: a month ago, and so this is his first interview

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Speaker 1: in discussing his life and his life with his dad.

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Speaker 1: I hope you enjoy it. Be sure to catch live

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Speaker 1: editions of the Doug got Leap Show week days at

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Speaker 1: noon eastern three pm Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and

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Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app. Let's start at the beginning. Okay,

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Speaker 1: your dad's a longtime coach. Where were you actually born?

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Speaker 1: Where was he coaching when you were born? I was

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Speaker 1: born in Chicago, Illinois. I was there until about six

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Speaker 1: months old, and then he went down to Bradley and

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Speaker 1: that's where I kind of that's where I grew up

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Speaker 1: or first remember growing up obviously, What do you remember

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Speaker 1: about it? I just remember, um, you know, I just

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Speaker 1: remember being around the gym a lot. And I also

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Speaker 1: remember being um around a lot of family cousins, ace

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Speaker 1: and arncles from my mom's side especially. I would come

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Speaker 1: visit a lot from Chicago. And that was really probably

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Speaker 1: my my upbringing for the most part, in those first

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Speaker 1: seven eight years of my life. Your your brother's older

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Speaker 1: than you. How much older than you? Uh? Tony six

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Speaker 1: years older? So he um, he and I are, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: are close. But he's always been a mentor to me

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Speaker 1: because of that age difference. But was he always a mentor?

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Speaker 1: Like my brother was four years older than me, and

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Speaker 1: I mean there were times when he was kind of

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Speaker 1: a dick. I mean, like, you know, just and maybe

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Speaker 1: not it wasn't. Yeah, what he kind of was like

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Speaker 1: he his favorite story is, um our buddy are his

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Speaker 1: his buddy's house. They were like, we never had a pool.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. My dad's a New Yorker and he

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Speaker 1: was definitely afraid of us having a pool, and so

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Speaker 1: we had to always go over somebody else's house, which

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Speaker 1: is to me, is actually counter to what you should

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Speaker 1: do as a parent. Like my whole thing, we don't

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Speaker 1: have a pool in this house, and I'm just like

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Speaker 1: my last summer without a pool. And because if you want,

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Speaker 1: like you want to watch your be there, watch your

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Speaker 1: own kids swim. On the other hand, there is the

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Speaker 1: liability that's assume when somebody else from your house. So

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Speaker 1: we're at a friend's pool and um he panted, is

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Speaker 1: me throws my shorts up on the roof and then

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Speaker 1: like a bunch of other of his friends come over

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Speaker 1: and they're like inside the house and I'm like swimming

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Speaker 1: in the pool naked, and I have to go get

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Speaker 1: my final way to get my shorts. You know, I'm like,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, ten years old or something, swimming in

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Speaker 1: the pool. He used to lock me out of the

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Speaker 1: house because we were My mom my dad was an

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Speaker 1: assistant longby State and my mom got a job there's

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Speaker 1: like a secretary, and so we were like latch key

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Speaker 1: kids and we get home and sometimes just to be

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Speaker 1: a jerky, tell me to go outside and get something,

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Speaker 1: and then he locked me out. And then the his

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Speaker 1: favorite move was, Hey, meet us at the school. We're

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Speaker 1: gonna play some basketball. We need another guy. And then

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Speaker 1: no one would show up and I'd be sitting there, yeah,

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Speaker 1: which would actually help me work on my game. I'd

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Speaker 1: play imaginary games. So, like I said, and I love

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Speaker 1: my brother, but he wasn't always a mentor. Was he

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Speaker 1: always a mentor? He was. He was always a mentor

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Speaker 1: with things like that because he taught me. He taught

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Speaker 1: me how to be like that a little bit. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: I guess I guess I had the politically correct way

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Speaker 1: of being positive about him is Yeah, he did that

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Speaker 1: kind of stuff to me too. There was one time

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Speaker 1: I I did open hand flapped him for uh, you know, uh,

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Speaker 1: my mom and dad were on the road. I think

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Speaker 1: you're over in Korea. Actually, was Steth Screenberg doing one

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Speaker 1: of those trips those foreign tours and my cousin was

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Speaker 1: watching me and he was trying to be my dad

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Speaker 1: for lack of a better term, And I was younger,

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Speaker 1: and I hit him and his coke, you know as

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Speaker 1: those cokeroom glasses or bottled glasses that he had grown

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Speaker 1: up and and he got me and uh, he let

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Speaker 1: me know that he was six years older than So, yeah,

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Speaker 1: we had some incidents like that as well. Okay, so

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Speaker 1: from Bradley, where did he go? He went from Bradley

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Speaker 1: to Creighton. So he's at Creighton for seven eight years.

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Speaker 1: I think. Okay, do you like now I look back?

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Speaker 1: They were both in the valley, weren't they? Yeah, he

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Speaker 1: won't He was in uh you know, from what I remember,

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Speaker 1: he was one of the first kind of associate head

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Speaker 1: coaches at Bradley. It was a title that you know,

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Speaker 1: it wasn't quite as common um. And he went from

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Speaker 1: Bradley to Creighton and he was there. Dick for Says

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Speaker 1: was there at Bradley. He went over to Creton and

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Speaker 1: then Um and then Dick Says left too, I think

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Speaker 1: the Pacers and then that's staying out. Black came in

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Speaker 1: and my dad was built the creating at the time

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Speaker 1: for about seven or I think seven years, seven or

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Speaker 1: eight years, Dick for says had amazing hair. Yeah, he uh,

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Speaker 1: he did. It was pictures he did. He did it

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Speaker 1: was I had a little frize to it, had a

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Speaker 1: little uh had a little texture. You know, I have

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Speaker 1: seen it. I've seen a lot of pictures in these

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Speaker 1: last couple of weeks. And he he had it going on. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I think I think that was what's

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Speaker 1: called a permanent right like yeah, yeah, because coach Setton.

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Speaker 1: Coach Setton had a perm gun. Yeah, they you know,

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Speaker 1: they had to spend some time in the Kalan and

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Speaker 1: my dad had a feathery his feathery locks going on too.

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Speaker 1: There was a lot of there was a lot of style.

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Speaker 1: There was actually there was a lot of style back

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Speaker 1: in the into that. You know, there was a there

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Speaker 1: were some some showmanship back there in those days. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: My my dad when he was at you Milwaukee had

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Speaker 1: some of those same like sports coats whatever. Like they

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Speaker 1: all kind of had a little flamboyance going late. I

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Speaker 1: was like we're doing in late seventies in early eighties, right,

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Speaker 1: they all they all wanted those like uh, plaid sports coats.

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Speaker 1: Or whatever. The problem was that my dad still one

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Speaker 1: of those sports coats into the nineties and it didn't

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Speaker 1: didn't translate as much. What do you what do you

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Speaker 1: remember about Omaha? I remember a lot about Omaha. I

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Speaker 1: really I really do. I had some you know, really

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Speaker 1: close friends whose I was there seventh seconds through seventh grade. Um,

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Speaker 1: and I really remember from a basketball perspective the change. Um.

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Speaker 1: You know I I talked about. You know, I got

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Speaker 1: into coaching because of that. Creighton was my good golf shot,

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Speaker 1: you know that one swing that bad golfers have. They

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Speaker 1: were like, you know what, I'm gonna try this again

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Speaker 1: because I just hit the ball right down the middle

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Speaker 1: of the fairway. And Creighton was that. That team at

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Speaker 1: Creighton that my dad built was something that I mean,

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Speaker 1: it was. It was more than basketball. It was one

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Speaker 1: of the it was. It was a great memory. And

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Speaker 1: I just remember that Gallagher, the Harstad porter, Moser was

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Speaker 1: on that Chief todd Eisener, Duan Cole. I mean, it

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Speaker 1: was Patroll right. So all those guys, we're just the way,

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Speaker 1: don't bloss over. The names go through it. So Harstad

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Speaker 1: Harstad used to play it used to hang out at

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Speaker 1: Oklahoma State in the off season when he's playing professionally overseas. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I forgot about that. Yeah he was. He's down in

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Speaker 1: Oklahoma City now. He was about of six five six six.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know how well he could dribble, pass or shoot,

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Speaker 1: but I want to say he was the all time

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Speaker 1: leading score up until Corver at Creighton. I'm pretty sure.

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Speaker 1: I mean, he just meanest, meanest dude, minhas dude I

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Speaker 1: remember growing up and just got it done. And then

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Speaker 1: there was Gallagher six ten, guy from Rockford. You know,

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Speaker 1: he got some you a couple of stints in the

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Speaker 1: league and ten days and things like that. Was they

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Speaker 1: were the dynamic duo, you know, the um even though

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Speaker 1: I never understood. They were both addressed as Batman in

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Speaker 1: all the promos, so I didn't know the dynamic duel.

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Speaker 1: Nobody wants to know what he wants to be Robbin,

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Speaker 1: right like rob Robin's like Robin's like, hey might be gay.

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Speaker 1: We don't know that there's anything wrong with that, right

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Speaker 1: He's you know, he's he's a little brother. Nobody wants

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Speaker 1: to be Robbin, even if there is a Robin. I

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Speaker 1: think that's that's kind of the thing. I remember. This

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Speaker 1: is back in the This is back in the late

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Speaker 1: eighties early nineties when you know, mascul masculinity was the thing.

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Speaker 1: So both they both had their their their capes on

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Speaker 1: in the in the in the bat, in the bat

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Speaker 1: hats Loveland, Colorado. Bob harstads from Loveland, Colorado. Yes, he scored. Uh,

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Speaker 1: he scored points and grabbed eleven d twenty six rebounds.

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Speaker 1: He was three time All All Valley and he was

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Speaker 1: and Valley Player of the Year in and he was

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Speaker 1: a Tournament Player of the Year ninety one. What a stud.

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Speaker 1: And he was the beast. He was a beast. He

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Speaker 1: was playing him and a guy by the name of

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Speaker 1: Dick Fick was my dad's assistant. They found him and

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Speaker 1: his name was his name was Le Dick. How do

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Speaker 1: you suppose last name f I C K. We have

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Speaker 1: Tony Perroni and Dick Fick on the same step. That's unbelieved.

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Speaker 1: That's amazing. That's the name. Hall of Personality. Yeah, he

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Speaker 1: was Dick Fick and and him and they found him

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Speaker 1: Harst that had a mohawk playing soccer um out in

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Speaker 1: Colorado and he was playing into some of these camps

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Speaker 1: on the back and the black Hawk black Top, And

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Speaker 1: as the story goes, they found him out there kind

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Speaker 1: of just playing extremely hard and uh and uh, and

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Speaker 1: they went with him and that's when he ended up.

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Speaker 1: He had a heck of a careers, all beligal career.

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Speaker 1: That that is okay. So, um, what was your dad

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Speaker 1: like as a coach? What do you remember? Because you

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Speaker 1: know your your second grades through seventh grade and you're

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Speaker 1: a super high basketball like you guy, and so you're perceptive,

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Speaker 1: perceptive enough to know what he was like. Like? What

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Speaker 1: was he like? He was a ball of energy and passionate.

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Speaker 1: I mean he really was. I mean they had they

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Speaker 1: had things growing up where I just remember going going

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Speaker 1: to the practices and I'll tell you right now, if

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Speaker 1: I was dribbling in the whistle blew, he was making

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Speaker 1: his if he was making his point as he would

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Speaker 1: like to say, through the words that he decided to

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Speaker 1: choose from his dictionary, and I dropped the ball, or

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Speaker 1: I was in the middle of a shot, I was

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Speaker 1: diving for that ball before it hit the ground because

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Speaker 1: I was not letting the drouble. He was an intense,

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Speaker 1: intense person um, you know, very loving and you know

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Speaker 1: it was always around me, but like the reality of

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Speaker 1: it was he he was a ball of fire and

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Speaker 1: um you know, he was five nine and and can

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Speaker 1: control a lot of odd grown, grown men and in arena,

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Speaker 1: so he was very intense. I do remember that in Passionate.

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Speaker 1: I was doing a I did a coaching clinic today

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Speaker 1: in Oklahoma, and I told the story that, Um, I

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Speaker 1: was sitting around and I had an Arizona guy and

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Speaker 1: a Duke guy with me, and we were talking about

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Speaker 1: lud Olson, Eddie Sutton and Mischevski and so I just

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Speaker 1: so so one of them asked me, like, did Eddie

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Speaker 1: sut never draw a play up? And I was like,

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Speaker 1: not one time, not one time. And I was like,

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Speaker 1: what about lud Olsen. He's like not one time? He's

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Speaker 1: like what about is like nope, not even a little bit,

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Speaker 1: like never literally never, like the whole And I'm not

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Speaker 1: I'm not in any way trying to diminish who they were.

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Speaker 1: Like my dad used to he get the white board

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Speaker 1: and he draw things and there would be no x's

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Speaker 1: and ohs. There would just be lines and arrows and stuff.

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Speaker 1: And I was like, what the fuck, I can't And

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Speaker 1: whereas nowadays, like guys are like, it's like a work

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Speaker 1: of art with an a t oh. Now granted sometimes

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Speaker 1: they still have assistance to it, but it's it's much

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Speaker 1: more so. I'm so your was your dad a an

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Speaker 1: X and O drawed up on on a chot board

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Speaker 1: or was he you know, just coloss here and played

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Speaker 1: fucking hard and and played together and and show that

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Speaker 1: you're tougher than the other team guy. I think he

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Speaker 1: was more of a tougher than the other team guy,

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Speaker 1: like I do. I do think, Um, you know, he

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Speaker 1: definitely was about spacing and like preparation prize, so like

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Speaker 1: you knew what plays you were going to go into

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Speaker 1: the game with. You know, probably you're you had two

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Speaker 1: or three late game plays, so you know that and

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Speaker 1: that's what you're gonna do and you're gonna do it

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Speaker 1: well and you're going to do it better than the

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Speaker 1: other team and if not, then you lost. And well,

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Speaker 1: you know when he uh, I I would say his

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Speaker 1: biggest strength was getting the most out of somebody on

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Speaker 1: a day to day There's no doubt about that. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: did he motherfuckt he did? He did. He was good

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Speaker 1: at it. It was almost he was graceful. He had

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Speaker 1: an art he was like a ballerina through his work,

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Speaker 1: choice of words, time and and at times at I

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Speaker 1: was I was fortunately the recipient of it. Well I'll

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Speaker 1: get I'll get to you playing for him, because that's

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Speaker 1: just a fact. It's a fascinating dynamic that I got

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Speaker 1: a chance to see twice. Um. But okay, so you're

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Speaker 1: so I had I had a There's a guy named

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Speaker 1: Kirk Tagi who was my one of my dad's favorite players.

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Speaker 1: That's why one of the reasons I wore forty four.

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Speaker 1: So i'm and he was might He played for my daddy.

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Speaker 1: You have Milwaukee, and I just wondered if there was

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Speaker 1: a guy like hit. My dad's favorite player was Dave Webber.

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Speaker 1: Bruce Webber's brother. Dave was my dad's best player, and

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Speaker 1: Bruce was my dad's manager and UM at the time,

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Speaker 1: and then he got the job at My dad helped

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Speaker 1: him get a job at Western Kentucky UM with UM

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Speaker 1: with Gene Katie and kind of the rest is history,

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Speaker 1: if you will. So, but I used to love Kirk

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Speaker 1: Taggi and my dad. I think Kirk, I believe had

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Speaker 1: like long blonde hair. He's like good looking dude, And

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Speaker 1: I don't think he gave a ship about him. I like,

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Speaker 1: I just remember like sometimes he would, you know, kind

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Speaker 1: of blow off my dad a little bit. Anyway, my

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Speaker 1: point is that every when you're a son of a

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Speaker 1: coach and you're around a team, a lot of times

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Speaker 1: you have a favorite guy for whatever reason. Who is

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Speaker 1: your favorite guy? You know? I thought Willie Scott, I

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Speaker 1: mean as you're sitting there saying that back at Bradley, Uh,

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Speaker 1: he was just a jet and and he was he

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Speaker 1: was someone that I just remember when I was I

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Speaker 1: don't know, six seven, eight years old. I just remember

383
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Speaker 1: those teams back at Bradley. Jim Less who jim Less?

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Speaker 1: He was my guy. Yeah, and he actually played with

385
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Speaker 1: Omahall Racers when I wear at Creighton, so I was

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00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:43,919
Speaker 1: able to see him. And then the other guys is

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Speaker 1: Bob Harstad. I mean that's the guy. I mean, that's

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Speaker 1: who you because you you saw Hope, You're like, have

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00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:52,679
Speaker 1: you just played as hard as you can, You're going

390
00:20:52,720 --> 00:20:55,000
Speaker 1: to be on a team and that and that was Bob.

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00:20:55,119 --> 00:20:58,639
Speaker 1: So I those three guys just kind of stick out, Um,

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Speaker 1: you know, kind of in in the years that I

393
00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:06,800
Speaker 1: that I kind of grew up for sure. Um, Okay,

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Speaker 1: so why why do you leave? Why do you go

395
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Speaker 1: to a and m was just money? Yeah, you know

396
00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:16,159
Speaker 1: he's that. He actually said it um in some in

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Speaker 1: some clinics. Uh you know, he said, you know, never

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00:21:19,880 --> 00:21:21,879
Speaker 1: I think you know, we were going in the morning,

399
00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:25,639
Speaker 1: uh to Colorado State. I thought, I mean, not that

400
00:21:25,680 --> 00:21:28,359
Speaker 1: he was gonna he was gonna make any decision based

401
00:21:28,400 --> 00:21:30,119
Speaker 1: on you know, I don't know. It was twelve eleven

402
00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:32,240
Speaker 1: years old and we all thought we were going to

403
00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:34,360
Speaker 1: Colorado State. I remember they took him in the hot

404
00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:37,119
Speaker 1: air balloon and they blinded dined him and he was

405
00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:40,239
Speaker 1: kind of a hot air balloon. Yeah, they took him

406
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Speaker 1: in a hot air balloon. I still to this day.

407
00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:44,399
Speaker 1: I just I just remember always talking to him about it,

408
00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:46,919
Speaker 1: like that was their selling point. And I don't know

409
00:21:46,920 --> 00:21:48,639
Speaker 1: if they showed him the campus, I don't, you know.

410
00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:51,680
Speaker 1: I just that was that was one of his kind

411
00:21:51,680 --> 00:21:53,720
Speaker 1: of recruiting. That was his recruiting visit. It's probably an

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00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:56,240
Speaker 1: NH double A violation now if if we were ever

413
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Speaker 1: to do that. But uh so he was going to

414
00:21:58,680 --> 00:22:02,080
Speaker 1: Colorado State. To my understanding, we were that was where

415
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Speaker 1: we were going in the morning, and then that night

416
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Speaker 1: he came in and he said, hey, how about Texas

417
00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:08,359
Speaker 1: And he said, we're moving to A and M. And

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00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:10,960
Speaker 1: it was financially, I think they picked it up a

419
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Speaker 1: little bit. And you know, he had mentioned that in

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Speaker 1: in some clinics in the in the past. He's like,

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Speaker 1: you know, always always take the place that has your passion.

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Speaker 1: And you know, not that he didn't experience have great

423
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Speaker 1: experience in Texas, A and M, but I think it

424
00:22:24,280 --> 00:22:26,320
Speaker 1: was a little bit out of his wheelhouse in terms

425
00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:29,240
Speaker 1: of location and and you know, a part the country.

426
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Speaker 1: Things like that. Well, also he never he got you know,

427
00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:36,200
Speaker 1: when we par for year last year there coaching Gee

428
00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:40,040
Speaker 1: Rowley White, which I mean it was which honestly, like

429
00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:42,240
Speaker 1: I kind of think Gee that probably White could have

430
00:22:42,240 --> 00:22:44,399
Speaker 1: been super cool if they just redid it instead of

431
00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:47,040
Speaker 1: building a new place, you know, because it's like all

432
00:22:47,080 --> 00:22:49,200
Speaker 1: these places, you know, it's like just redo it. I

433
00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:52,080
Speaker 1: mean they had poles where people couldn't see, but it

434
00:22:52,119 --> 00:22:55,280
Speaker 1: was on campus and if you guys were good. But

435
00:22:55,280 --> 00:22:58,359
Speaker 1: but anytime you're building a new arena and you know,

436
00:22:58,400 --> 00:23:00,879
Speaker 1: the coach becomes kind of like lame coach. It sucks.

437
00:23:00,880 --> 00:23:03,080
Speaker 1: And it didn't have for Tech sam As much as

438
00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:08,920
Speaker 1: their facilities now are amazing, like amazing, like ridiculous compared

439
00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:11,320
Speaker 1: to the tech SA and M. You went to where

440
00:23:11,920 --> 00:23:13,640
Speaker 1: you didn't have I don't think you had a practice, Jim,

441
00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:16,960
Speaker 1: did you? No? Oh no, it's g Raleigh came down

442
00:23:17,119 --> 00:23:19,240
Speaker 1: and it was it was chipping, it was all that.

443
00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:22,000
Speaker 1: It was no, no, you're not even closed the right

444
00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:24,760
Speaker 1: and then you know, it broke in front of me.

445
00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:28,160
Speaker 1: We were conditioning and I was like, oh, that's not good.

446
00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:32,600
Speaker 1: That is the ceiling crashed and it deleted another year.

447
00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:36,440
Speaker 1: So I forgot about this year. Two or three were

448
00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:40,040
Speaker 1: off conditioning on the football field right outside of Eden

449
00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:43,560
Speaker 1: Steed and it broke and I was like, that's that's

450
00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:46,879
Speaker 1: that's not good for the Brook and Christmas Present president

451
00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:49,919
Speaker 1: for Christmas Present fund right now. So you would have

452
00:23:50,119 --> 00:23:51,880
Speaker 1: you would have you would have played in that your

453
00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:54,919
Speaker 1: sophomore year. Yeah, I was supposed to play in it.

454
00:23:55,000 --> 00:23:57,080
Speaker 1: I believe it was my soft I think yeah, that

455
00:23:57,160 --> 00:23:59,159
Speaker 1: was my sophomore years. Yeah, I'm pretty sure that was

456
00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:01,760
Speaker 1: going into myself or year. It was supposed to be um,

457
00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:03,560
Speaker 1: it was supposed to be done prior to it, and

458
00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:06,680
Speaker 1: then it just kept getting delayed, delayed, delayed, and then

459
00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:10,920
Speaker 1: and then it broke and then it was a year later. Wow. Um, okay,

460
00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:13,760
Speaker 1: So let's let's go back. You moved to College Station.

461
00:24:14,800 --> 00:24:20,280
Speaker 1: You're in eighth grade, right, what was your first College

462
00:24:20,280 --> 00:24:25,560
Speaker 1: Station Texas experience? Like this is, so I go down there,

463
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:29,200
Speaker 1: and we go down It's me, my mom, and my dad,

464
00:24:30,080 --> 00:24:32,520
Speaker 1: and we're there in the summer and doing some things.

465
00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:35,440
Speaker 1: But my first thing that really sticks out was we

466
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:38,439
Speaker 1: go down to midnight yell practice, you know, and whenever

467
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:40,359
Speaker 1: it was late August or you know, right before the

468
00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:43,840
Speaker 1: right the football season, you know, preseason, exhibition game, whatever

469
00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:46,760
Speaker 1: they're doing, and they shut off the lights in the

470
00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:49,399
Speaker 1: arena in the in the stadium Kyle Field, and everyone

471
00:24:49,440 --> 00:24:52,160
Speaker 1: holds up a lighter and then people walk to each

472
00:24:52,200 --> 00:24:56,119
Speaker 1: other and start kissing and it's called mugging. And me

473
00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:58,000
Speaker 1: and my mom and dad are sitting in the crowd

474
00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:00,600
Speaker 1: and all these people are making out around us, and

475
00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:02,920
Speaker 1: I'm sitting there going, you know, with my mom and dad.

476
00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:04,439
Speaker 1: I'm like, what the heck is going on? It was.

477
00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:07,040
Speaker 1: It was a heck of an experience. It's pretty darn funny,

478
00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:10,160
Speaker 1: but it was. It opened my eyes to the tradition

479
00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:13,360
Speaker 1: of Texas A and M football, for sure. I remember

480
00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:15,960
Speaker 1: that being a little unique, awkward moment with my parents.

481
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:19,320
Speaker 1: What was it like to play high school basketball? Your

482
00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:22,920
Speaker 1: dad is a college coach down the street. It was awesome,

483
00:25:23,119 --> 00:25:26,879
Speaker 1: It really was. My first year, UM was a little

484
00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:31,159
Speaker 1: difficult because um I was I was bumped up to

485
00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:34,040
Speaker 1: varsity as a freshman and I started every game until

486
00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:37,159
Speaker 1: I tore my knee my senior year. But that first

487
00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:40,199
Speaker 1: year was a little bit you're the coach's son, and

488
00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:45,000
Speaker 1: um I was introverted. Um I have you know, you know,

489
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:46,719
Speaker 1: without getting into all of it, but there's a you know,

490
00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:50,760
Speaker 1: one of my friends really who since passed away. It

491
00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:52,960
Speaker 1: brought me into his room. We're like thirteen years old

492
00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:55,000
Speaker 1: and John Madden football and he's like Brian. I mean,

493
00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:57,320
Speaker 1: it's weird. It was like a mature behind his years

494
00:25:57,359 --> 00:25:59,880
Speaker 1: and we weren't the most mature event by any means,

495
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:02,560
Speaker 1: and just said, hey man, just you're good enough to play,

496
00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:04,399
Speaker 1: You're good enough to start. You gotta you gotta you

497
00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:06,160
Speaker 1: gotta be on that team. That's gotta be your goal.

498
00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:08,680
Speaker 1: And I mean it was kind of like that direct

499
00:26:09,119 --> 00:26:11,359
Speaker 1: And if you knew what I'm talking about, you've not

500
00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:14,600
Speaker 1: got a odd coming from him, and so he gave

501
00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:17,320
Speaker 1: me a good supporter of friends and and kind of

502
00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:18,720
Speaker 1: believes in me. And then but you know, you have

503
00:26:18,840 --> 00:26:21,280
Speaker 1: to step up, you know. I think anytime you're a

504
00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:24,880
Speaker 1: local kid, even in college of basketball right now, if

505
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:28,280
Speaker 1: you can control the intangibles, you know, your effort basically,

506
00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:30,680
Speaker 1: if you can be an effort kid, you can just

507
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:33,800
Speaker 1: you know, you can handle being being locally the coach

508
00:26:33,880 --> 00:26:37,080
Speaker 1: his son or the local kid on the college team.

509
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:40,360
Speaker 1: It's it's interesting about being the local kid and being

510
00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:42,760
Speaker 1: a local kid in the high school. So my high

511
00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:46,199
Speaker 1: school experience, I grew up in an Orange and in

512
00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:49,160
Speaker 1: the El Medina district, and my brother went to Almadina

513
00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:52,080
Speaker 1: High School. And my brother is a little smaller than me.

514
00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:54,959
Speaker 1: He's more of a he's more of a two guard

515
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:58,000
Speaker 1: or whatever. And he could have gone low D one

516
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:00,679
Speaker 1: and instead he wanted to walk on in u c

517
00:27:00,840 --> 00:27:05,399
Speaker 1: l A. He ended up actually getting beat out um

518
00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:09,720
Speaker 1: by um what's his name, lou? Shoot, he's the coach

519
00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:14,760
Speaker 1: that I think Bishop O'Dowd um lou Uh. He went

520
00:27:14,760 --> 00:27:16,800
Speaker 1: and he started. He kid actually walked down as a

521
00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:19,240
Speaker 1: freshman U c l A. Then transferred started at Clemson

522
00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:21,080
Speaker 1: for three years like that's he got beat out by

523
00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:22,960
Speaker 1: a good player. So he was just like a student

524
00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 1: and then he went and decided he wanted to play.

525
00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:27,560
Speaker 1: And my brother played for a year and a half

526
00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:31,520
Speaker 1: a Drake. But but my point was because my brother's

527
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:36,919
Speaker 1: high school experience was just okay. Um, my dad was

528
00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:39,280
Speaker 1: like I stayed back a year in eighth grade because

529
00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:42,119
Speaker 1: I was I was a late bloomer. And then I

530
00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:46,040
Speaker 1: was going to find like the best high school program

531
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:48,199
Speaker 1: to go to. And I didn't want to go to

532
00:27:48,200 --> 00:27:50,320
Speaker 1: motter Day because monter Day is like you don't play

533
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:54,160
Speaker 1: varsity until maybe your junior year. Jeremy Knight's son, Clay,

534
00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:56,040
Speaker 1: was a friend of mine. He's not a point guard,

535
00:27:56,119 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 1: but like Clay was gonna play. I mean, that's just

536
00:27:59,160 --> 00:28:02,240
Speaker 1: he's gonna play. And I means his one son who

537
00:28:02,240 --> 00:28:04,600
Speaker 1: could really really play, could really shoot. I just I don't.

538
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:06,160
Speaker 1: I just wasn't into the modern day thing I want

539
00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:07,919
Speaker 1: to play, and I kind of I'm a more of

540
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:10,800
Speaker 1: a public school kid. So I went to Tustin High School,

541
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:13,960
Speaker 1: which is I mean, it's the town directly south and

542
00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:15,520
Speaker 1: they had won the state championship and had a good

543
00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:18,240
Speaker 1: coach named Tom McCluskey, who had played at Penn State

544
00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:22,720
Speaker 1: for Dick Harter, and I just the one and this

545
00:28:22,800 --> 00:28:24,520
Speaker 1: is like, I'm trying to figure this out from my

546
00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:28,600
Speaker 1: own kid, and you experienced. This is the only thing

547
00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:32,680
Speaker 1: that sucked about my high school experiences because I didn't

548
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:36,840
Speaker 1: outside of basketball, and even in basketball, like no one

549
00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:40,120
Speaker 1: knew me until I showed up for summer basketball with

550
00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:43,560
Speaker 1: the JV and the varsity before my freshman year. Like

551
00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:49,000
Speaker 1: because of that, I didn't have like I wasn't. I

552
00:28:49,280 --> 00:28:51,720
Speaker 1: didn't have not just a friend group, but there wasn't

553
00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:54,760
Speaker 1: people are like, oh, he's awesome, he's good at basketball,

554
00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:57,440
Speaker 1: or he's I just I didn't have any sort of

555
00:28:57,520 --> 00:29:00,160
Speaker 1: I had. I had no sweat equity with anybody. And

556
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:02,480
Speaker 1: when I went to Oklahoma State, I also felt kind

557
00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 1: of the Saint More Notre Dame. Notre Dame, it's a

558
00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:06,600
Speaker 1: national school. It's a little different. But when I went

559
00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:09,240
Speaker 1: to Oklahoma State, like I always felt like had I

560
00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:13,160
Speaker 1: gone to high school in Oklahoma, people would have known

561
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:15,960
Speaker 1: me better and know like, well, obviously I could shoot

562
00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:18,400
Speaker 1: in high school, otherwise I wouldn't have been as highly recruited.

563
00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:21,200
Speaker 1: It's more of a mental right. You want, you want

564
00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:23,360
Speaker 1: people to believe in you, not because they believe in you,

565
00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:25,400
Speaker 1: but believing you because they've actually seen you do it.

566
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:28,719
Speaker 1: So I actually think there is like there's we're creating

567
00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:31,000
Speaker 1: this culture of guys of high school kids that will

568
00:29:31,040 --> 00:29:33,040
Speaker 1: go to whatever high school. And I did it myself,

569
00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:35,080
Speaker 1: but I did it you know one town over of

570
00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:38,040
Speaker 1: college kids that will transfer whenever pros it, will do whatever.

571
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:42,400
Speaker 1: And I, having experienced bouncing around a little bit, I

572
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:45,800
Speaker 1: do think I missed out on the sweat equity portion

573
00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:49,640
Speaker 1: of it, and I'm not sure my experience would have

574
00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:52,479
Speaker 1: been better. In addition to there is something cool, and

575
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:54,600
Speaker 1: we both went to the same high school for four years,

576
00:29:54,600 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 1: you and I. There is something cool about going to

577
00:29:57,120 --> 00:29:59,240
Speaker 1: the same high school and trying to win a state

578
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:03,560
Speaker 1: championship with your guys instead of recruiting off the top

579
00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:06,600
Speaker 1: and having guys transfer in. So that's I just wondered

580
00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:09,480
Speaker 1: if you experienced that because even though you were a

581
00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:12,680
Speaker 1: coach's son, he came in from Omaha right before a

582
00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:15,280
Speaker 1: year before high school, and then I didn't know if

583
00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:17,440
Speaker 1: you had the sweat equity with everybody in high school.

584
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:20,680
Speaker 1: Well in high school by the time I got to

585
00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:23,520
Speaker 1: high school, I was solid in eighth grade and it

586
00:30:23,600 --> 00:30:26,120
Speaker 1: was you know, it's college station is one team, one school,

587
00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:27,920
Speaker 1: you kind of you know, everyone goes from A to B.

588
00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:30,880
Speaker 1: There wasn't multiple school but there are now actually there.

589
00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:33,560
Speaker 1: But when I got there in eighth grade, they tried

590
00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:37,160
Speaker 1: making me play football. I was about five nine in

591
00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:39,200
Speaker 1: day one. I was coming from a Catholic school and

592
00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:41,440
Speaker 1: over my first public school. I don't know, I'm walking

593
00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:44,480
Speaker 1: around the hallways with like some freedom. And you know,

594
00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:47,000
Speaker 1: I was in the St. Pious attend St. Leo, and

595
00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:50,440
Speaker 1: I'm sitting in one classroom, you know, all day. And

596
00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:52,400
Speaker 1: uh So I get there at the athletics period at

597
00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:53,920
Speaker 1: the end of the day and they in, uh in

598
00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:56,840
Speaker 1: eighth grade and said everyone, they asked that that everyone

599
00:30:56,960 --> 00:30:59,760
Speaker 1: not playing football stand up. And it was me and

600
00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:02,520
Speaker 1: I mean honestly, out of a hundred and fifty something

601
00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:04,920
Speaker 1: kids or whatever, it was me and probably four or

602
00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:07,600
Speaker 1: five play eight kids play eight or ninth piss one

603
00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:09,080
Speaker 1: of which is one of my best friends who was

604
00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:12,400
Speaker 1: significantly shorter than me. And uh, coach said, well, why

605
00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:15,440
Speaker 1: aren't you playing And I said, uh, I'm playing basketball.

606
00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:17,720
Speaker 1: He said, no, you know, you're playing football. Sit out.

607
00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:19,840
Speaker 1: So I sat down and I was like, oh, this

608
00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:21,800
Speaker 1: is gonna be a problem. So I went home that

609
00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 1: day and I I said, they're making me play football

610
00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:26,720
Speaker 1: to my mom and dad, and my mom was kind

611
00:31:26,760 --> 00:31:29,080
Speaker 1: to look at Mike, you don't have to play football.

612
00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:32,240
Speaker 1: And my dad's like, well, do you have some cleats? Um,

613
00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:35,360
Speaker 1: get get ready, And I was just kind like, I

614
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,680
Speaker 1: don't know. I want to want to play football. And

615
00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:40,760
Speaker 1: so about three or four days, I was a football

616
00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:44,200
Speaker 1: and what I had to do was my coach actually,

617
00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:46,880
Speaker 1: but he kind of figured out who I was and

618
00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:49,479
Speaker 1: he said, all right, we're gonna play open gym after school.

619
00:31:50,040 --> 00:31:52,360
Speaker 1: If you're good enough to play basketball, we won't make

620
00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:54,800
Speaker 1: you play football. And that's how I that's how I

621
00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:56,719
Speaker 1: didn't have to play football, because I went out there

622
00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:59,080
Speaker 1: talking about a game of pressure. And I went out

623
00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:01,360
Speaker 1: there and I was pretty good and they grade and uh,

624
00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:03,880
Speaker 1: coach walked out and said, okay, you can play basketball.

625
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:06,320
Speaker 1: And so that was a little bit of my first experience.

626
00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:08,520
Speaker 1: And then after I got the you know, once I

627
00:32:08,560 --> 00:32:11,200
Speaker 1: got to high school, I had that sweat I could

628
00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 1: be equity and then a little bit and um, a

629
00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:16,480
Speaker 1: little bit in college. To be honest with you too,

630
00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:18,040
Speaker 1: I mean people, I was a little bit more of

631
00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:20,280
Speaker 1: a shooter and a scorer in the high school. And

632
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:22,480
Speaker 1: when I when I went to Texas and m I

633
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:24,520
Speaker 1: lost my mind. I came off a tour and town

634
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:27,240
Speaker 1: at l and I didn't make it three my first year.

635
00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:31,080
Speaker 1: And but I did have that which you didn't have,

636
00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:34,200
Speaker 1: what you're saying. I had that sweat equity where people

637
00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:36,760
Speaker 1: like man, come on, shoot it we've seen because they

638
00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:39,800
Speaker 1: knew you could shoot, and your dad knew you could shoot.

639
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:44,640
Speaker 1: I just didn't know I could shoot, which is the problem.

640
00:32:44,760 --> 00:32:48,800
Speaker 1: Did you have any choice or any desire to look

641
00:32:48,840 --> 00:32:51,800
Speaker 1: elsewhere to go to college? I did you know? I

642
00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 1: was looking at East Carolina UM. That was one of

643
00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:59,880
Speaker 1: the main ones. And then I remember specifically them recruiting

644
00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:03,360
Speaker 1: and uh it was coach Dooley as a matter of fact,

645
00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:08,160
Speaker 1: And they were the only school that recruited me that

646
00:33:08,280 --> 00:33:11,600
Speaker 1: didn't say, if you don't go play for your dad,

647
00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:15,560
Speaker 1: we'd like to talk to you. And UM. The one

648
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:18,200
Speaker 1: other school came in was NABE. Doug Woker came in

649
00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:21,320
Speaker 1: and do home visit and I was fired up. And

650
00:33:21,360 --> 00:33:22,920
Speaker 1: then by the end of it. I was like, yeah,

651
00:33:22,960 --> 00:33:26,200
Speaker 1: I still got to go to the Navy and uh yeah,

652
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 1: and I was like, yeah, no thanks, But those are

653
00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:31,200
Speaker 1: the two schools that actively recruited me that didn't give

654
00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:33,840
Speaker 1: me as that if you don't go with your dad,

655
00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:36,840
Speaker 1: And you know, I mean I think I probably I

656
00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:40,120
Speaker 1: probably knew it all along. Um, but yeah, that's kind

657
00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:42,240
Speaker 1: of how it all played out. And then I committed

658
00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:44,080
Speaker 1: to him, and then the rest was kind of history.

659
00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:47,040
Speaker 1: And as you said, you gotta hurt your senior year, Um,

660
00:33:47,120 --> 00:33:50,160
Speaker 1: your sophomore year was your your dad's last year, I

661
00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:52,280
Speaker 1: believe correct. Yet we were both sophomores at the time.

662
00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:57,840
Speaker 1: And what what was that experience like to to like,

663
00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:02,760
Speaker 1: I can't imagine, you know, when you play in college

664
00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:06,560
Speaker 1: and I think people understand this, but maybe they don't.

665
00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:10,040
Speaker 1: You get you're so wrapped up in yourself, right, You're

666
00:34:10,080 --> 00:34:12,960
Speaker 1: so in your own feelings about your own game, and

667
00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:15,920
Speaker 1: then you want your team to win. So you have

668
00:34:15,960 --> 00:34:20,000
Speaker 1: these two things. Then fact you're in like your dad's

669
00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:25,279
Speaker 1: under a tremendous amount of pressure to win. I can't

670
00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:29,000
Speaker 1: like I struggled enough with worrying about myself and worrying

671
00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:32,120
Speaker 1: about my team, and you know, Mike, we were just

672
00:34:32,680 --> 00:34:35,200
Speaker 1: I was so competitive and I'm you're you're built the

673
00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:37,839
Speaker 1: same way too. How did you process all those things

674
00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 1: going on at once? You know, I don't know if

675
00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:42,840
Speaker 1: I processed it. You know you are looking back on

676
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:46,360
Speaker 1: and I probably didn't handle it great or I internalized everything.

677
00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:49,200
Speaker 1: Um And I was protected by my dad. I mean

678
00:34:49,280 --> 00:34:52,000
Speaker 1: he he did a great job every day. This is

679
00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:54,600
Speaker 1: what we do in practice. We were prepared, and we

680
00:34:54,680 --> 00:34:56,879
Speaker 1: had some guys that I, you know, I think could

681
00:34:56,920 --> 00:34:59,319
Speaker 1: have played harder. I think some guys didn't achieve what

682
00:34:59,360 --> 00:35:01,680
Speaker 1: they know with they getting the best out of themselves.

683
00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:04,479
Speaker 1: So that my struggle was a little bit more within

684
00:35:04,560 --> 00:35:07,240
Speaker 1: the team, not so much the pressure of the winds

685
00:35:07,239 --> 00:35:10,920
Speaker 1: and losses. It was you know, listen, guys, I'm fighting

686
00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:13,560
Speaker 1: for my family right now. I was very aware of

687
00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:17,680
Speaker 1: that and and they weren't. And that was that was

688
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:20,600
Speaker 1: where I struggled with it, and that that was tough.

689
00:35:20,719 --> 00:35:22,919
Speaker 1: That was well, I guess maybe maybe here's a better

690
00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:25,880
Speaker 1: way of articulating it, like, look, yeah, I think you

691
00:35:25,880 --> 00:35:27,600
Speaker 1: and I are probably built the same. Like if guys

692
00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:29,880
Speaker 1: aren't giving the right amount of effort near the point guard,

693
00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:31,880
Speaker 1: you know, you have to find there are guys in

694
00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:34,680
Speaker 1: which you're gonna jump, but when you're the coach's son

695
00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:38,080
Speaker 1: and and you're emotional about the possibility of your dad

696
00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:40,920
Speaker 1: losing his job, like I just how did you did you?

697
00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:42,759
Speaker 1: Did you go at guys? Were you the north the

698
00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:47,080
Speaker 1: leader you wanted? Yeah? Yeah, I I remember specifically we

699
00:35:47,120 --> 00:35:49,440
Speaker 1: got beat by Nebraska. I mean you probably look it

700
00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:52,160
Speaker 1: up the day in time or whatever. And Tyron Louprow,

701
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:54,480
Speaker 1: I mean, I mean he kicked my ask too, don't

702
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:57,719
Speaker 1: worry about it. He got me, but it took a

703
00:35:57,760 --> 00:36:00,319
Speaker 1: couple of charges early, and we just it was one

704
00:36:00,360 --> 00:36:03,760
Speaker 1: of there was two games that I was really disappointed

705
00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:07,640
Speaker 1: and being a teammate Um and specifically remember I wasn't

706
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:09,600
Speaker 1: you know, I wasn't the best player, but my effort

707
00:36:09,640 --> 00:36:12,400
Speaker 1: was always there. It was at Oklahoma State, which I

708
00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:15,840
Speaker 1: had a career high eight eight turnovers, so thank you

709
00:36:15,920 --> 00:36:20,080
Speaker 1: very much. And then the other one was Nebraska at home.

710
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:24,160
Speaker 1: And after that Nebraska game at home, I remember Um

711
00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:27,280
Speaker 1: stepping up and and really being very emotional and getting

712
00:36:27,280 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 1: into guys and their response was, you know, someone could

713
00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:35,520
Speaker 1: have very easily with my size and demeanor and strength,

714
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:37,640
Speaker 1: could have could have put me in my place, and

715
00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:39,960
Speaker 1: no one did. And that was obviously a problem because

716
00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:42,480
Speaker 1: we knew, you know, what I was saying was it

717
00:36:42,600 --> 00:36:45,600
Speaker 1: was probably more true than not. And uh, and that

718
00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:47,680
Speaker 1: was tough. That was That was one game where I

719
00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:52,719
Speaker 1: really really remember after after the game going like, we

720
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:55,560
Speaker 1: can't do this, this this ain't right. And I handled

721
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:58,600
Speaker 1: it in a yelling kind of way. Yeah, you guys

722
00:36:58,640 --> 00:37:02,760
Speaker 1: lost fifty eight at home. You did win your last game,

723
00:37:03,160 --> 00:37:07,400
Speaker 1: in the last game in Gee Raleigh, you won against Baylor. Yeah,

724
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:10,440
Speaker 1: one of the best moments of my basketball life. I

725
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:13,879
Speaker 1: don't think to win, but because my mom, my dad

726
00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:16,680
Speaker 1: and I, after knowing that we were done and that

727
00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:19,000
Speaker 1: was the last game I was gonna, you know, be

728
00:37:19,080 --> 00:37:22,759
Speaker 1: at home against with him, we walked up that tunnel together. Um,

729
00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:27,480
Speaker 1: I can close by. Someone just referenced it at the

730
00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:29,719
Speaker 1: funeral um and in an email to me as a

731
00:37:29,719 --> 00:37:32,040
Speaker 1: matter of fact, and I said that that was that

732
00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:34,360
Speaker 1: they remember seeing my mom, dad and I walked up

733
00:37:34,400 --> 00:37:36,240
Speaker 1: that tunnel for the last time in the rally white,

734
00:37:36,320 --> 00:37:39,000
Speaker 1: which is still gets you a little emotional at that time,

735
00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:42,359
Speaker 1: but we want it was a big win win. Here's

736
00:37:42,360 --> 00:37:44,399
Speaker 1: a big win. I told this story on Twitter about

737
00:37:44,440 --> 00:37:47,040
Speaker 1: your dad. So here's here's the story. So we're at

738
00:37:47,080 --> 00:37:51,759
Speaker 1: the We're at the Herford House and and like you know,

739
00:37:51,880 --> 00:37:53,640
Speaker 1: like still at Oklahom. There's not a lot of nice

740
00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:55,920
Speaker 1: restaurants and I don't leave the Herford House. Is there anymore?

741
00:37:55,920 --> 00:37:59,080
Speaker 1: By the way, And um, so you know we have

742
00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:01,719
Speaker 1: you know, big thing is I hate coat and tie.

743
00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:04,160
Speaker 1: And we're going to Hertford House and we had we

744
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:07,520
Speaker 1: finished and we won the South that year, and we

745
00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:09,879
Speaker 1: actually lost the first game we played to Texas by

746
00:38:09,880 --> 00:38:14,000
Speaker 1: the way, who sucked um, but they played super smart

747
00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:16,319
Speaker 1: for the first time and they slowed us down and

748
00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:20,200
Speaker 1: it was crazy. Um. But I remember we're at We're

749
00:38:20,239 --> 00:38:22,280
Speaker 1: at the dinner table and I'm sitting with Coach Sutton

750
00:38:22,520 --> 00:38:27,040
Speaker 1: and Patsy Sutton and in walks your dad with his

751
00:38:27,160 --> 00:38:29,600
Speaker 1: like staff and you know, your dad kind of like

752
00:38:29,680 --> 00:38:32,000
Speaker 1: my dad, like he had that strut. He had a

753
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:35,040
Speaker 1: really good strut, you know, like you might just lost

754
00:38:35,040 --> 00:38:37,799
Speaker 1: his job. But yeah, I mean like he you know,

755
00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:41,080
Speaker 1: So he walks in and he comes over and he

756
00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:46,080
Speaker 1: shakes coach his hand, Coach, how are you doing, Tony?

757
00:38:46,239 --> 00:38:50,239
Speaker 1: Where's your deed? He's like those fucking guys McDonald's. They

758
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:54,680
Speaker 1: gotta be fired, Eddie, spend another penny on them. Amazing,

759
00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:58,920
Speaker 1: we're dying die. He just had a great he just

760
00:38:58,960 --> 00:39:01,719
Speaker 1: had a great Uh get a great way And here's

761
00:39:01,719 --> 00:39:04,239
Speaker 1: the here's one other one. So we play you guys

762
00:39:04,280 --> 00:39:07,480
Speaker 1: at g Rolly White. I can remember it. We were

763
00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:11,200
Speaker 1: no no, we and we had a bunch of smart

764
00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:13,560
Speaker 1: asses on our team. And the lead smart ass was

765
00:39:13,600 --> 00:39:16,719
Speaker 1: actually not me, was Brett Robish, whose dad Dave of

766
00:39:16,719 --> 00:39:20,480
Speaker 1: course your dad news played in the NBA. And Brett

767
00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:22,920
Speaker 1: is just he's just he's just an asshole. He's the

768
00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:25,680
Speaker 1: good kind of asshole, but he's he's the best. So

769
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:30,480
Speaker 1: we're in the locker room and he's like, twenty dollars

770
00:39:30,520 --> 00:39:33,279
Speaker 1: to anybody who who anyone who barks at at that

771
00:39:33,360 --> 00:39:35,960
Speaker 1: damn dog? So what you what you didn't know about

772
00:39:36,000 --> 00:39:40,040
Speaker 1: it was his Brett's wife actually transferred to Oaklahoma State

773
00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:43,680
Speaker 1: from Texas A and M. So and and this is

774
00:39:43,800 --> 00:39:45,680
Speaker 1: this is the this is the story that Shanna tells

775
00:39:46,239 --> 00:39:49,960
Speaker 1: is that she the first time he had the year

776
00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:51,360
Speaker 1: before first time he was going to play on the

777
00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:53,640
Speaker 1: road at Texas A and M. She's like, where are you?

778
00:39:53,640 --> 00:39:56,319
Speaker 1: Who you guys plays like Texas A and M and she,

779
00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:58,880
Speaker 1: honest to god, she said that she's like, we had

780
00:39:58,880 --> 00:40:03,400
Speaker 1: a basketball team. I had no idea. She's like, I

781
00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:08,680
Speaker 1: had no idea anyway, So he put down twenty dollars,

782
00:40:08,680 --> 00:40:11,080
Speaker 1: which in college is a lot of money to anybody

783
00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:16,440
Speaker 1: would bark at REBELI um. And so if you go back,

784
00:40:16,560 --> 00:40:18,959
Speaker 1: like we were all trying to, we're like, the ball

785
00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:20,920
Speaker 1: went out of bounds a couple of times, and guys

786
00:40:20,960 --> 00:40:23,200
Speaker 1: like and I actually growled at the dog and the

787
00:40:23,239 --> 00:40:25,879
Speaker 1: dog barked at me. I took all the money, So

788
00:40:26,080 --> 00:40:28,760
Speaker 1: I think, I don't know if you took a charge

789
00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:31,160
Speaker 1: on him or if he just fouled you super hard.

790
00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:34,560
Speaker 1: And we were up like twenty, and your dad got

791
00:40:35,920 --> 00:40:39,840
Speaker 1: and your dad got piste piste, and he's like that

792
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:42,920
Speaker 1: fucking that's ballshot, that's bullshot, that's sucking. Throw him out,

793
00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:47,720
Speaker 1: he fucking and he goes and Brett robis just calm days, like, hey, Tony,

794
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:51,080
Speaker 1: calmed down, don't have a heart attack or something. We're

795
00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:54,480
Speaker 1: kicking your ass anyway, and your dad lost his mind.

796
00:40:55,040 --> 00:40:57,759
Speaker 1: He's just you know, I mean, it was, it was,

797
00:40:57,960 --> 00:41:02,640
Speaker 1: it was, it was. It was great. So Okay, so

798
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:06,600
Speaker 1: he loses his job. Then how did you decide? Marquette?

799
00:41:08,040 --> 00:41:10,239
Speaker 1: You know, it's it's funny because I was going I

800
00:41:10,360 --> 00:41:12,399
Speaker 1: had a little I had a little anger. We can

801
00:41:12,440 --> 00:41:14,680
Speaker 1: go anger, I can be honest about it. So I was,

802
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:18,759
Speaker 1: I got a waiver to transfer within the conference and

803
00:41:18,840 --> 00:41:22,000
Speaker 1: not lose a year, so I could transfer anywhere city

804
00:41:22,080 --> 00:41:24,320
Speaker 1: here and still have the two years instead of doing

805
00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:28,920
Speaker 1: like Luke axtell a lukew. He kind of comes into play.

806
00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:31,680
Speaker 1: So what happened was, I was I was narrowed down

807
00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:36,840
Speaker 1: to coach Sampson at Oklahoma and Tom Penders coach Penders

808
00:41:36,840 --> 00:41:41,080
Speaker 1: at Texas and um I actually I played good at

809
00:41:41,080 --> 00:41:43,040
Speaker 1: both of those teams, so I had them correct into

810
00:41:43,080 --> 00:41:47,759
Speaker 1: considering me, and uh, coach Sampson was. They ended up

811
00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:49,399
Speaker 1: going with a seventh book guy. I want to say

812
00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:52,160
Speaker 1: his name was a Via, but I went up Victor,

813
00:41:52,360 --> 00:41:55,360
Speaker 1: Victor dr Avila. He was supposed to be like the

814
00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:59,239
Speaker 1: next Nahara, Yes exactly, That's exactly what he was saying

815
00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:01,719
Speaker 1: to me. And he don't know if he yeah, I

816
00:42:01,719 --> 00:42:04,840
Speaker 1: mean he was fun or something. I don't think he

817
00:42:04,840 --> 00:42:07,759
Speaker 1: ever fanned out. Okay, So I visited there because I

818
00:42:07,800 --> 00:42:09,839
Speaker 1: was friends with m I had a guy named Aaron

819
00:42:09,920 --> 00:42:12,359
Speaker 1: Jack on my team was from tuls friends with rains

820
00:42:12,360 --> 00:42:14,680
Speaker 1: Ey Stone, another guy named Sai Basket. So we're up there.

821
00:42:15,360 --> 00:42:18,640
Speaker 1: Um had a good weekend. I visited and then I

822
00:42:18,640 --> 00:42:20,960
Speaker 1: I was gonna visit Texas and I don't know if

823
00:42:20,960 --> 00:42:25,319
Speaker 1: you remember during that time Tom Tenders got fired and

824
00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:27,239
Speaker 1: it was kind of like he was released some I

825
00:42:27,239 --> 00:42:29,799
Speaker 1: think Luca Axtell's great. There was something like that. I

826
00:42:29,840 --> 00:42:33,080
Speaker 1: can't remember the whole deal and the visit. The weekend

827
00:42:33,080 --> 00:42:36,680
Speaker 1: I was supposed to visit was the weekend that all broke.

828
00:42:37,480 --> 00:42:39,839
Speaker 1: So then I was UM. The other guy was Mike

829
00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:42,719
Speaker 1: Dean at Marquette, and he had known my dad. We've

830
00:42:42,760 --> 00:42:49,279
Speaker 1: played Sienna at you know I almost I know, well

831
00:42:49,680 --> 00:42:52,279
Speaker 1: we that's why our past. You know, if you had

832
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:54,000
Speaker 1: gone there, I would not have because you would have

833
00:42:54,000 --> 00:42:55,440
Speaker 1: been you know, there wouldn't have been a plot for

834
00:42:55,560 --> 00:43:00,399
Speaker 1: me before. So UM, I had Mike Bargain, all these guys,

835
00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:02,400
Speaker 1: they all they all knew you and all that kind

836
00:43:02,440 --> 00:43:04,719
Speaker 1: of stuff. So that's what ended up happening. So I

837
00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:08,360
Speaker 1: was kind of waivering on or waiting on Oklahoma and Texas.

838
00:43:08,360 --> 00:43:10,960
Speaker 1: They both really weren't working out and then Mike phone

839
00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:13,000
Speaker 1: me up and said he did a home visit. The

840
00:43:13,000 --> 00:43:15,719
Speaker 1: Final four was in San Antonio that that year, so

841
00:43:15,760 --> 00:43:17,480
Speaker 1: I got I, you know, had a lot of interests.

842
00:43:17,560 --> 00:43:19,400
Speaker 1: Just coaches were you know, kind of talking and I

843
00:43:19,440 --> 00:43:20,640
Speaker 1: was right around that area and I want to tour

844
00:43:20,680 --> 00:43:22,160
Speaker 1: and visited and he actually sent me down in the

845
00:43:22,200 --> 00:43:23,719
Speaker 1: locker room and said, Brian, if you commit to me

846
00:43:23,760 --> 00:43:26,400
Speaker 1: now if your dad gets another job, I don't care

847
00:43:26,400 --> 00:43:29,240
Speaker 1: if you know, August, I'm gonna you can go, no

848
00:43:29,239 --> 00:43:31,080
Speaker 1: no hard feelings. You go play for him if he

849
00:43:31,120 --> 00:43:32,600
Speaker 1: wants to. Because my dad was in the mix for

850
00:43:32,680 --> 00:43:35,560
Speaker 1: like Loyola and a couple of other jobs. And I

851
00:43:35,640 --> 00:43:38,400
Speaker 1: was like, you know what this reminds me Craighton, I

852
00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:40,960
Speaker 1: want to go to a basketball school. It was I

853
00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:43,520
Speaker 1: had a lot of family in Chicago, and Mike gave

854
00:43:43,560 --> 00:43:45,520
Speaker 1: me that opportunity in case my dad was going to

855
00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:48,120
Speaker 1: get another job and I and I pulled the trigger him.

856
00:43:48,200 --> 00:43:50,720
Speaker 1: That's how that's how that all went out. Mike Dean's

857
00:43:50,719 --> 00:43:58,799
Speaker 1: favorite word is what. Oh, here's there's a compound word

858
00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:01,000
Speaker 1: that he was that the word it starts with the

859
00:44:01,080 --> 00:44:06,440
Speaker 1: sea and ends with the sucker. Correct. So so the year.

860
00:44:06,719 --> 00:44:10,000
Speaker 1: So then the year you're sitting out here, you're sitting

861
00:44:10,000 --> 00:44:17,759
Speaker 1: out we play Marquette in Hawaii and it's like the opening, right,

862
00:44:18,080 --> 00:44:22,120
Speaker 1: and so um, we play Marquette in Hawaii and I'll

863
00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:24,080
Speaker 1: never forget this. So he comes out and he was

864
00:44:24,600 --> 00:44:27,520
Speaker 1: like the kind of guy Dino is is, I chose

865
00:44:27,560 --> 00:44:29,600
Speaker 1: Oklahoma State. He wrote me this like four page. I

866
00:44:29,600 --> 00:44:32,120
Speaker 1: still have it, like love letter of how bad he

867
00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:33,759
Speaker 1: wanted me to come play for him and how you

868
00:44:33,800 --> 00:44:36,640
Speaker 1: know he needs you know, tough son bitches and I'm

869
00:44:36,680 --> 00:44:40,480
Speaker 1: a tough son of a bitch or whatever and and um,

870
00:44:40,560 --> 00:44:43,160
Speaker 1: and so I was like devastated when I had to

871
00:44:43,200 --> 00:44:44,759
Speaker 1: call him and tell him. And part of it you

872
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:47,200
Speaker 1: talked about being mad, like, look, I got in trouble

873
00:44:47,239 --> 00:44:48,759
Speaker 1: with my fault Notre Dame, but I still want to

874
00:44:48,800 --> 00:44:50,359
Speaker 1: kick Notre Dame's asked. One of the reason I want

875
00:44:50,360 --> 00:44:52,319
Speaker 1: to go to Marquette was they played Notre Dame every year, right,

876
00:44:53,040 --> 00:44:55,800
Speaker 1: So I just I wanted to go to college town.

877
00:44:56,520 --> 00:44:58,960
Speaker 1: I want to play with a little bitter athletes. I

878
00:44:59,080 --> 00:45:01,720
Speaker 1: might could say he want play fast, but he played slow,

879
00:45:02,320 --> 00:45:04,640
Speaker 1: and I just I couldn't do it. I don't know,

880
00:45:04,719 --> 00:45:07,719
Speaker 1: I just I couldn't do the the Upper Midwest again.

881
00:45:07,760 --> 00:45:11,400
Speaker 1: I just I needed something different. So I actually worked

882
00:45:11,400 --> 00:45:14,440
Speaker 1: camp for him after I had already signed to go

883
00:45:14,440 --> 00:45:18,040
Speaker 1: to Oklahoma State, worked his camp and had turned him down.

884
00:45:18,440 --> 00:45:21,400
Speaker 1: And his camp, as you know, was awesome because he

885
00:45:21,440 --> 00:45:23,440
Speaker 1: had a keg in the locker room. He had to

886
00:45:23,440 --> 00:45:26,040
Speaker 1: float the keg by I think Wednesday, and then on

887
00:45:26,080 --> 00:45:29,319
Speaker 1: Thursday he like, you'd go to the bar. There's a

888
00:45:29,320 --> 00:45:31,959
Speaker 1: bar on campus at Marquette. Everybody come in and eat,

889
00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:34,200
Speaker 1: and then he'd leave his leave his tab open and

890
00:45:34,200 --> 00:45:37,359
Speaker 1: then he'd leave and everybody could get plowed. Whatever it was,

891
00:45:37,360 --> 00:45:41,360
Speaker 1: just to use the anyway. So we're in Honolulu. We

892
00:45:41,520 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 1: come on the court with warming up and Coach Sutton

893
00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:48,879
Speaker 1: comes out in a suit and tie in Hawaii, and

894
00:45:48,920 --> 00:45:51,440
Speaker 1: so Dino goes up do he goes eddie a sudden,

895
00:45:51,600 --> 00:45:54,120
Speaker 1: how are you doing? Only fucking guy in America? Were

896
00:45:56,120 --> 00:45:59,440
Speaker 1: soon Ti in Hawaii? You look great and and like

897
00:45:59,440 --> 00:46:01,480
Speaker 1: like you know, Coach sent is like the class he

898
00:46:01,640 --> 00:46:04,640
Speaker 1: is like, what is the what is going on with

899
00:46:04,680 --> 00:46:11,120
Speaker 1: that guy? So um, end of half we come down

900
00:46:11,400 --> 00:46:13,880
Speaker 1: and you know we would run like the same we

901
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:16,840
Speaker 1: we we ran like we called it Hoosier or I

902
00:46:17,040 --> 00:46:19,480
Speaker 1: you where you run a guy off a triple screen

903
00:46:19,600 --> 00:46:21,600
Speaker 1: and then the last screener comes back off the double

904
00:46:21,640 --> 00:46:24,520
Speaker 1: stagger and you either get that shot or the last

905
00:46:24,560 --> 00:46:26,239
Speaker 1: screener steps in and get a slip. And we got

906
00:46:26,280 --> 00:46:28,920
Speaker 1: a wide open shot. And I'm sure they had scouted it,

907
00:46:29,640 --> 00:46:32,040
Speaker 1: and you know, I think he was what's what was

908
00:46:32,080 --> 00:46:37,640
Speaker 1: Bart's last name? Uh, point guard Bart? Yeah? Yeah, And

909
00:46:37,680 --> 00:46:40,120
Speaker 1: all of a sudden and you're like, we're in We're

910
00:46:40,120 --> 00:46:43,320
Speaker 1: in Hawaii u H Arena, which is like a thirteen

911
00:46:43,320 --> 00:46:46,640
Speaker 1: thousand see place, right, but it's empty because it's Marquette

912
00:46:46,680 --> 00:46:49,600
Speaker 1: Okloma State, and you can hear him go bark dude,

913
00:46:49,760 --> 00:46:53,000
Speaker 1: cut sucker, and he goes chasing him into the locker room.

914
00:46:53,640 --> 00:46:56,399
Speaker 1: So our locker rooms are next to each other. And

915
00:46:56,600 --> 00:46:58,680
Speaker 1: keep in mind that because I had worked camp and

916
00:46:58,719 --> 00:47:01,520
Speaker 1: I knew all of the guy, I actually did the

917
00:47:01,560 --> 00:47:04,319
Speaker 1: personnel skyder report for the game, like I stood up

918
00:47:04,360 --> 00:47:06,799
Speaker 1: for the team. I had the manager work with me.

919
00:47:06,840 --> 00:47:08,719
Speaker 1: We did the right out. I handed up like I

920
00:47:08,760 --> 00:47:12,319
Speaker 1: was like an assistant coach for it. So so I

921
00:47:12,640 --> 00:47:15,319
Speaker 1: uh so, meanwhile, their locker rooms next to ours, and

922
00:47:15,400 --> 00:47:17,759
Speaker 1: he's m F and UM and C S and um

923
00:47:17,800 --> 00:47:21,960
Speaker 1: and everything, and coach Sutton comes in and he's he's

924
00:47:21,960 --> 00:47:23,439
Speaker 1: looking at me shaking and says, he's like, you want

925
00:47:23,520 --> 00:47:26,120
Speaker 1: to play for him? He's like, you couldn't play for him?

926
00:47:26,160 --> 00:47:27,680
Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, I could. I could play for him.

927
00:47:27,840 --> 00:47:30,719
Speaker 1: And like that was our halftime discussion was could Gottlieb

928
00:47:30,800 --> 00:47:34,040
Speaker 1: have played for Mike Dean? Right? It was? It was?

929
00:47:34,200 --> 00:47:38,080
Speaker 1: It was amazing. Um, so what was that experience like

930
00:47:38,560 --> 00:47:43,120
Speaker 1: of I've always interested the second time around, now you're

931
00:47:43,120 --> 00:47:46,759
Speaker 1: playing at Marquette, what was your experience like there? You know,

932
00:47:47,080 --> 00:47:49,480
Speaker 1: it was great? I mean it really was, you know,

933
00:47:49,520 --> 00:47:52,399
Speaker 1: because Mike was, um, you know, you called him Mike

934
00:47:52,440 --> 00:47:54,680
Speaker 1: on my recruiting visit, I was coached Dean coach Dean

935
00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:57,040
Speaker 1: coach Dean and he call me fucking Mike, call me Mike?

936
00:47:57,080 --> 00:47:59,560
Speaker 1: Who the fund is? Did Mike call me? Mike? What

937
00:47:59,600 --> 00:48:01,520
Speaker 1: do I call you? Do I call you player? And

938
00:48:01,520 --> 00:48:04,759
Speaker 1: I'm like no, and he goes, they don't call me,

939
00:48:04,840 --> 00:48:07,200
Speaker 1: don't call me coach? You know. So then from that

940
00:48:07,239 --> 00:48:10,000
Speaker 1: point I was like, Okay, between the lines, it was

941
00:48:10,080 --> 00:48:13,239
Speaker 1: game on. I mean, anything goes. He got India, he

942
00:48:13,360 --> 00:48:16,439
Speaker 1: coached you, and then you walk off the lines and

943
00:48:16,440 --> 00:48:18,799
Speaker 1: and to me, I just always thought he was just Mike.

944
00:48:19,120 --> 00:48:22,000
Speaker 1: He was Mike and um. So the experience was was

945
00:48:22,040 --> 00:48:25,120
Speaker 1: a nice one. It was it was it was well

946
00:48:25,200 --> 00:48:27,960
Speaker 1: needed from my from my experience in Texas A and

947
00:48:28,160 --> 00:48:31,960
Speaker 1: m um, because it was I needed I needed that

948
00:48:32,080 --> 00:48:34,120
Speaker 1: Midwest I can't you know, That's what I grew up.

949
00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:35,560
Speaker 1: So it was kind of almost the opposite of what

950
00:48:35,600 --> 00:48:37,360
Speaker 1: you were just saying. I grew up in that craton

951
00:48:37,440 --> 00:48:40,880
Speaker 1: and that Jesuit atmosphere and um, you know the school

952
00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:43,759
Speaker 1: like that, uh and just in the city and things

953
00:48:43,760 --> 00:48:46,040
Speaker 1: like that. So it was a great experience. And then

954
00:48:46,120 --> 00:48:48,680
Speaker 1: you know, we had we had some talent. We had

955
00:48:48,719 --> 00:48:51,239
Speaker 1: a kid that ended up having to leave the team,

956
00:48:51,239 --> 00:48:53,799
Speaker 1: our best player, Jared Levette, like halfway through the year.

957
00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:56,239
Speaker 1: So then our our wins and losses where I think

958
00:48:56,239 --> 00:48:58,480
Speaker 1: we ended up being fifteen fifteen and they fired him

959
00:48:58,520 --> 00:49:00,799
Speaker 1: and and I'm like, some of a time, this is

960
00:49:00,840 --> 00:49:03,160
Speaker 1: now I'm two coaches and two you know, three coaches

961
00:49:03,160 --> 00:49:05,840
Speaker 1: and three years I'll have. I'm I'm sitting there and

962
00:49:06,120 --> 00:49:08,279
Speaker 1: the A D comes in Bill Cords and tells us

963
00:49:08,320 --> 00:49:10,600
Speaker 1: and I'm like, well, who we canna hire? And he

964
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:14,120
Speaker 1: looks at me like who are you like? Who is

965
00:49:14,160 --> 00:49:16,680
Speaker 1: this red shirt little guy? Walk on? Are you even

966
00:49:16,719 --> 00:49:19,040
Speaker 1: any good? And I was kind of like, Okay, I'll

967
00:49:19,040 --> 00:49:21,839
Speaker 1: sit here and be quiet now and uh. And then

968
00:49:21,880 --> 00:49:24,160
Speaker 1: that's when a few months later, a few weeks later

969
00:49:24,239 --> 00:49:27,000
Speaker 1: or whatever, coach Ring got hired. So it was a whirlwind.

970
00:49:27,040 --> 00:49:30,320
Speaker 1: Those nine eleven months to eleven months were crazy. What

971
00:49:30,320 --> 00:49:33,400
Speaker 1: what was Crean like? And I know you worked for

972
00:49:33,440 --> 00:49:35,640
Speaker 1: him later, but but as a as a player, what

973
00:49:35,680 --> 00:49:38,920
Speaker 1: was it like? It was intense? I mean he brought it.

974
00:49:39,719 --> 00:49:43,720
Speaker 1: He brought it every day, and he set the tone

975
00:49:44,160 --> 00:49:47,360
Speaker 1: in the way that we were gonna we were going

976
00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:51,440
Speaker 1: to practice. Um. It was just different. It wasn't like

977
00:49:51,480 --> 00:49:56,879
Speaker 1: it was so the demand and the intensity and at

978
00:49:56,920 --> 00:49:59,640
Speaker 1: the pace of which you did it was different. You know,

979
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:03,000
Speaker 1: my and my dad both could coach. They both get

980
00:50:03,120 --> 00:50:06,000
Speaker 1: you know, they were intense, but the the intensity and

981
00:50:06,080 --> 00:50:10,960
Speaker 1: the pace that first year was really something that that

982
00:50:11,040 --> 00:50:14,440
Speaker 1: we all were like, Okay, this is different and uh,

983
00:50:14,719 --> 00:50:16,719
Speaker 1: and we he brought it every single day and he

984
00:50:16,760 --> 00:50:19,600
Speaker 1: really did. I mean he was the same level of

985
00:50:19,640 --> 00:50:22,520
Speaker 1: intensity every day and and and I do think our

986
00:50:22,600 --> 00:50:27,120
Speaker 1: team was well coached to prior and during UM, which

987
00:50:27,200 --> 00:50:30,000
Speaker 1: was nice for that transition because we you know, he

988
00:50:30,080 --> 00:50:33,360
Speaker 1: upgraded some talent obviously, brought in Wade and Merit and

989
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:35,640
Speaker 1: Deaner and Novak, and you know that was better. You

990
00:50:35,960 --> 00:50:38,719
Speaker 1: got rid of me and they added Diner and that's

991
00:50:38,719 --> 00:50:42,240
Speaker 1: a good come up right there. But it was intense.

992
00:50:42,280 --> 00:50:44,400
Speaker 1: It was intense and and and and he got better.

993
00:50:44,480 --> 00:50:47,160
Speaker 1: I mean there was different work level and workload for sure.

994
00:50:48,640 --> 00:50:52,960
Speaker 1: Um did did Wade set out that he was a Protafouria,

995
00:50:53,120 --> 00:50:56,000
Speaker 1: wasn't he? Yeah? So he sat out my what was

996
00:50:56,040 --> 00:50:59,320
Speaker 1: my fifth year? And uh in his freshman year he

997
00:50:59,360 --> 00:51:00,960
Speaker 1: sat out. So you know, we had a very good

998
00:51:01,000 --> 00:51:05,440
Speaker 1: We had me, DJ Stephens, Darren Horne and d Wade

999
00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:10,440
Speaker 1: were four of the second stringers. So our first our

1000
00:51:10,719 --> 00:51:13,680
Speaker 1: practices were pretty good. And coach was the best thing

1001
00:51:13,760 --> 00:51:16,279
Speaker 1: about Coach was he treated Wade like he was he

1002
00:51:16,320 --> 00:51:18,520
Speaker 1: was playing the next day and he didn't let him

1003
00:51:18,560 --> 00:51:20,759
Speaker 1: take a day off. He's all of us. But you know,

1004
00:51:20,760 --> 00:51:24,319
Speaker 1: even though Ray Wade was sitting out, I've I've I

1005
00:51:24,360 --> 00:51:26,279
Speaker 1: find Tom Crane to be an amazing guy, to be

1006
00:51:26,320 --> 00:51:30,239
Speaker 1: a really really good human being that I had no

1007
00:51:30,239 --> 00:51:33,080
Speaker 1: no idea until I've gotten to know him. Some how

1008
00:51:33,120 --> 00:51:36,560
Speaker 1: thoughtful and and and and earnest he he can he

1009
00:51:36,600 --> 00:51:40,200
Speaker 1: can be. Um, did this is you? And you you?

1010
00:51:40,239 --> 00:51:43,160
Speaker 1: Obviously it's hard now to say it and it not

1011
00:51:43,320 --> 00:51:45,680
Speaker 1: sound honest. But did you know that Dwyane Wade would

1012
00:51:45,680 --> 00:51:47,560
Speaker 1: be a Hall of Fame player when you played with

1013
00:51:47,600 --> 00:51:51,240
Speaker 1: him on the second team? No? I no, No, I

1014
00:51:51,400 --> 00:51:54,439
Speaker 1: knew by the end. Um. I remember coach one time

1015
00:51:54,520 --> 00:51:56,359
Speaker 1: turning snap into me. He's like, you better tell your

1016
00:51:56,360 --> 00:51:58,920
Speaker 1: brother and dad to get into practice. We got a

1017
00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:00,800
Speaker 1: pro on our hands because they were both with the

1018
00:52:00,840 --> 00:52:04,239
Speaker 1: Grizzlies at the time. And that was towards the end

1019
00:52:04,320 --> 00:52:06,239
Speaker 1: of this season. I had no idea he was going

1020
00:52:06,320 --> 00:52:08,359
Speaker 1: to be as good as he was. I did by

1021
00:52:08,400 --> 00:52:10,640
Speaker 1: the end, you knew he was a pro. Um, But

1022
00:52:10,719 --> 00:52:12,440
Speaker 1: I didn't. I had no idea who was gonna be

1023
00:52:12,480 --> 00:52:13,839
Speaker 1: what he was. I would hung out with him more.

1024
00:52:13,960 --> 00:52:17,440
Speaker 1: Come on, do you okay? So you get you get done?

1025
00:52:18,280 --> 00:52:20,400
Speaker 1: You get done? And didn't you go like Garden City

1026
00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:23,719
Speaker 1: is an assistant At first? My first year was Okalla,

1027
00:52:23,760 --> 00:52:26,759
Speaker 1: Florida UM down in Central Florida Community College. Then I

1028
00:52:26,760 --> 00:52:29,440
Speaker 1: went to Garden City Community College out in Kansas. Yeah,

1029
00:52:29,480 --> 00:52:32,920
Speaker 1: who was it? Who is it? Ocalla o'calla was Jane

1030
00:52:32,960 --> 00:52:36,320
Speaker 1: Smithson who was at Wichita State, my dad and Dick Persay,

1031
00:52:36,360 --> 00:52:39,800
Speaker 1: squear Bradley and then Earl Diddle was at Garden City,

1032
00:52:39,800 --> 00:52:43,600
Speaker 1: who was at Indiana State coach Larry bird Um. So

1033
00:52:43,680 --> 00:52:47,279
Speaker 1: I had some mentors. I was really I was. I

1034
00:52:47,320 --> 00:52:49,920
Speaker 1: was fortunate. I didn't realize I had the mentors at

1035
00:52:49,920 --> 00:52:53,040
Speaker 1: the time, but I really did. So was was that was?

1036
00:52:52,880 --> 00:52:54,520
Speaker 1: That was the plan? Hey, let's go work for a

1037
00:52:54,560 --> 00:52:58,919
Speaker 1: couple of of old heads and and then eventually get

1038
00:52:58,960 --> 00:53:01,479
Speaker 1: to be in a then get a job or was it?

1039
00:53:01,600 --> 00:53:04,560
Speaker 1: Well you just I mean again, I'm I'm just interested

1040
00:53:04,680 --> 00:53:08,640
Speaker 1: in how you decided to go to Californida, Garden City, Kansas.

1041
00:53:09,680 --> 00:53:12,680
Speaker 1: My my options were Bruce Pearl had just gotten hired

1042
00:53:12,880 --> 00:53:15,480
Speaker 1: at u W Milwaukee. I was in Milwaukee, and I

1043
00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:18,120
Speaker 1: was finishing my masters because I had read shirted and

1044
00:53:18,120 --> 00:53:20,480
Speaker 1: so my fifth year of playing, all I had to

1045
00:53:20,480 --> 00:53:22,680
Speaker 1: do was finish my thesis. So I got my masters

1046
00:53:22,719 --> 00:53:27,120
Speaker 1: that last year, and Bruce Pearl had offered me to

1047
00:53:27,200 --> 00:53:29,719
Speaker 1: be a video guy. And back then the video I mean,

1048
00:53:29,719 --> 00:53:31,760
Speaker 1: it was like I want to say, it was fifts.

1049
00:53:31,800 --> 00:53:33,040
Speaker 1: I was going to maybe be able to live in

1050
00:53:33,080 --> 00:53:35,680
Speaker 1: the dorm, and I was gonna like bartend or something.

1051
00:53:35,719 --> 00:53:38,799
Speaker 1: I mean that that's what the discussion was. And that

1052
00:53:38,880 --> 00:53:40,680
Speaker 1: was going to be comfortable for me though, because I

1053
00:53:40,719 --> 00:53:42,880
Speaker 1: mean I was sitting there right down the street and Marquette.

1054
00:53:42,880 --> 00:53:44,640
Speaker 1: I mean, I was probably gonna still just be like,

1055
00:53:45,160 --> 00:53:48,480
Speaker 1: you know, a player. And my my dad said, if

1056
00:53:48,480 --> 00:53:50,080
Speaker 1: you really want to get into coaching, you need to

1057
00:53:50,080 --> 00:53:53,520
Speaker 1: look into junior college. And two guys offered me jobs.

1058
00:53:53,560 --> 00:53:56,960
Speaker 1: Gene Smithson through Tim Buckley had an assistant who worked

1059
00:53:57,000 --> 00:53:59,200
Speaker 1: for Gene Smithson, and Buckley was at Ball State at

1060
00:53:59,200 --> 00:54:02,319
Speaker 1: the time who coached me at Marquette. And then another guy,

1061
00:54:02,400 --> 00:54:04,960
Speaker 1: Chris James, who I worked with at Illinois State and

1062
00:54:04,960 --> 00:54:07,720
Speaker 1: now was obviously in Mexico State. He was at Howard

1063
00:54:08,320 --> 00:54:10,840
Speaker 1: down in Big Spring, Texas. And I visited both of

1064
00:54:10,840 --> 00:54:13,240
Speaker 1: those schools to decide, and they both offered me a position,

1065
00:54:13,920 --> 00:54:17,200
Speaker 1: and I ultimately decided to go to Central Florida because um,

1066
00:54:17,239 --> 00:54:20,000
Speaker 1: I was going to be the only assistant there and

1067
00:54:20,120 --> 00:54:22,040
Speaker 1: at at Howard, I was going to be like the

1068
00:54:22,080 --> 00:54:25,759
Speaker 1: second assistant. UM And then my dad told me, he said,

1069
00:54:25,760 --> 00:54:26,960
Speaker 1: I you really want to get into coaching, and you

1070
00:54:27,120 --> 00:54:28,680
Speaker 1: learned the other side of it you need to learn.

1071
00:54:28,800 --> 00:54:30,839
Speaker 1: Junior college. You needed because I was always a head

1072
00:54:30,840 --> 00:54:34,040
Speaker 1: coach's son, you know, I was always I mean all

1073
00:54:34,080 --> 00:54:36,360
Speaker 1: my memory was great in Texas and m and you

1074
00:54:36,400 --> 00:54:38,440
Speaker 1: know he was the Grizzlies. I hadn't seen that that

1075
00:54:38,600 --> 00:54:42,759
Speaker 1: other tier of basketball, and he do it. Okay. The

1076
00:54:42,800 --> 00:54:45,360
Speaker 1: one thing about Smithson that that you still take with

1077
00:54:45,400 --> 00:54:48,040
Speaker 1: you to this day. Uh, you don't want to think.

1078
00:54:48,040 --> 00:54:51,319
Speaker 1: He was very routine, very routine. He had. It was

1079
00:54:51,360 --> 00:54:54,320
Speaker 1: like a menu. Is so if you if you printed

1080
00:54:54,360 --> 00:54:56,880
Speaker 1: your practice plan, it was quite literally a menu and

1081
00:54:56,920 --> 00:55:00,080
Speaker 1: he would check like you would have shooting drills and

1082
00:55:00,080 --> 00:55:02,719
Speaker 1: he would you it would say pick two. I mean

1083
00:55:02,719 --> 00:55:05,799
Speaker 1: it's literally what it was. And uh so his organization

1084
00:55:05,840 --> 00:55:09,239
Speaker 1: to routine, I've never I you know, I haven't done

1085
00:55:09,239 --> 00:55:12,600
Speaker 1: it to that detail, but it's said a lot in

1086
00:55:12,640 --> 00:55:15,399
Speaker 1: the routine. Um and then Earl Diddle. I still take

1087
00:55:15,440 --> 00:55:19,080
Speaker 1: the Earl Diddle. It protect the house and uh he

1088
00:55:19,120 --> 00:55:21,640
Speaker 1: would you build a house, you know, like just around

1089
00:55:21,680 --> 00:55:25,560
Speaker 1: the lane essentially, and uh it was just simple, just

1090
00:55:25,600 --> 00:55:27,400
Speaker 1: get your heels on the house. And it was just

1091
00:55:27,480 --> 00:55:29,439
Speaker 1: you know, instead of force and baseline force and side

1092
00:55:29,440 --> 00:55:30,800
Speaker 1: and all that kind of stuff. I just remember the

1093
00:55:30,880 --> 00:55:34,480
Speaker 1: simplicity that he he taught that defense with Those are

1094
00:55:34,520 --> 00:55:37,040
Speaker 1: two things that just stood out right away. And then

1095
00:55:37,520 --> 00:55:39,200
Speaker 1: did war will get the job? Then? Were you into

1096
00:55:39,239 --> 00:55:44,800
Speaker 1: Green Bay after that? Right? Oh? With with Porter? With Porter,

1097
00:55:44,880 --> 00:55:47,600
Speaker 1: I forgot Porter. So I got the head coaching job

1098
00:55:47,640 --> 00:55:49,759
Speaker 1: at Garden City because the earl decided to go to

1099
00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:52,839
Speaker 1: the women's side. And that was the year Marquette went

1100
00:55:52,880 --> 00:55:56,280
Speaker 1: to the Final four. So I was kind of somehow

1101
00:55:56,760 --> 00:55:59,600
Speaker 1: they thought I was, you know, pretty hot stuff. And

1102
00:55:59,640 --> 00:56:03,880
Speaker 1: Garden City m vic Trilli was an assistant at Texas

1103
00:56:04,040 --> 00:56:06,000
Speaker 1: at the time when you and I played, and he

1104
00:56:06,040 --> 00:56:08,880
Speaker 1: was in He was associate a d at Garden City

1105
00:56:08,920 --> 00:56:12,200
Speaker 1: with Dennis Perryman, who was Brandy Perriman's father at Garden City.

1106
00:56:12,239 --> 00:56:14,440
Speaker 1: So they gave me the head coaching job and I

1107
00:56:14,480 --> 00:56:16,520
Speaker 1: had it for about three days and then Porter had

1108
00:56:16,560 --> 00:56:19,200
Speaker 1: got in Illinois State and decided to offer me a job,

1109
00:56:19,200 --> 00:56:21,080
Speaker 1: and I decided to go to Illinois State. Instead of

1110
00:56:21,120 --> 00:56:25,279
Speaker 1: saying it's at a Garden City. Give me something about Porter?

1111
00:56:25,400 --> 00:56:30,120
Speaker 1: What what about Porter? Uh? Makes him special? His energy

1112
00:56:30,120 --> 00:56:33,040
Speaker 1: and enthusiasm, it's contagious. I'm not think we can see

1113
00:56:33,040 --> 00:56:36,680
Speaker 1: on TV and his I mean it is I means energy, enthusiasm.

1114
00:56:36,800 --> 00:56:39,759
Speaker 1: It's just every day he's walking in on his with

1115
00:56:39,840 --> 00:56:42,200
Speaker 1: a with a quite literally a bounce in his stuff.

1116
00:56:42,480 --> 00:56:44,400
Speaker 1: Isn't it crazy? Though, Like a guy like that, you

1117
00:56:44,440 --> 00:56:46,120
Speaker 1: look at his career records, You're like, well, he had

1118
00:56:46,120 --> 00:56:47,839
Speaker 1: that one year where he went to the Final four.

1119
00:56:47,880 --> 00:56:50,760
Speaker 1: But the truth is that that I've seen his teams

1120
00:56:50,760 --> 00:56:53,160
Speaker 1: play at several different places. You know, when he said Arkansas,

1121
00:56:53,239 --> 00:56:55,960
Speaker 1: Little Rock, he's a hell of a coach. But it's

1122
00:56:55,960 --> 00:56:59,560
Speaker 1: like you, it's it's hard to relate to people, like

1123
00:56:59,600 --> 00:57:02,520
Speaker 1: you said, different levels of basketball, the different things you inherit,

1124
00:57:02,600 --> 00:57:06,040
Speaker 1: the luck you have to have. Like it's he's not

1125
00:57:06,120 --> 00:57:08,359
Speaker 1: any better a coach because they went to the final four.

1126
00:57:08,760 --> 00:57:12,120
Speaker 1: He's just finally recognized as being a tremendous coach because

1127
00:57:12,120 --> 00:57:13,960
Speaker 1: they went to the final four. That's that's a Is

1128
00:57:13,960 --> 00:57:17,000
Speaker 1: that a fair perspective? Yeah, I mean we were calling

1129
00:57:17,040 --> 00:57:18,800
Speaker 1: a five eight rule two a little bit where you

1130
00:57:18,800 --> 00:57:21,040
Speaker 1: could sign five guys in one year, eight and two

1131
00:57:21,120 --> 00:57:23,600
Speaker 1: years otherwise you lost the scholarship. So when we want

1132
00:57:23,600 --> 00:57:25,680
Speaker 1: to Illinois State, there was a certain amount of roster

1133
00:57:25,840 --> 00:57:29,000
Speaker 1: kids that we were they were probably better for the

1134
00:57:29,040 --> 00:57:31,360
Speaker 1: other staff a nice way to say it. So, but

1135
00:57:31,400 --> 00:57:33,200
Speaker 1: you had to keep him in a year like give

1136
00:57:33,240 --> 00:57:34,600
Speaker 1: me that, give me the best, give me the best

1137
00:57:34,600 --> 00:57:38,200
Speaker 1: story you can share. You don't have today names at

1138
00:57:38,240 --> 00:57:48,000
Speaker 1: where Juco or Illinois State Oh um best story, best story?

1139
00:57:48,240 --> 00:57:52,440
Speaker 1: Uh man man I got well, I mean at an

1140
00:57:52,480 --> 00:57:55,760
Speaker 1: Ocala Juco, I had to break out a fight between

1141
00:57:56,600 --> 00:58:01,360
Speaker 1: another guy that was working in the athletic department and um,

1142
00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:03,880
Speaker 1: my roommate who I was living with, which was a student.

1143
00:58:04,000 --> 00:58:06,920
Speaker 1: I walked in and they were throwing salt shakers at

1144
00:58:06,920 --> 00:58:09,720
Speaker 1: each other, and then by the time I got up

1145
00:58:10,280 --> 00:58:12,480
Speaker 1: closer to them, they were throwing fists at each other.

1146
00:58:12,640 --> 00:58:14,600
Speaker 1: And there was like a he was like a nineteen

1147
00:58:14,680 --> 00:58:19,480
Speaker 1: year old um uh. He was folded on computers and

1148
00:58:19,520 --> 00:58:23,680
Speaker 1: electronics and then a former former athletic coach and getting

1149
00:58:23,680 --> 00:58:26,200
Speaker 1: into it. And that was my That was my waking up.

1150
00:58:26,240 --> 00:58:27,560
Speaker 1: And I had a torn an c L because I

1151
00:58:27,600 --> 00:58:29,480
Speaker 1: tore my a c L the first in the day

1152
00:58:29,480 --> 00:58:31,480
Speaker 1: on the job at o'calla. So that was what I

1153
00:58:31,520 --> 00:58:33,160
Speaker 1: was doing my first probably a month and a half

1154
00:58:33,200 --> 00:58:36,680
Speaker 1: in Okalla. When'd you meet your wife? I met her

1155
00:58:36,680 --> 00:58:40,000
Speaker 1: at Marquette. She was a trainer at Marquette with the

1156
00:58:40,200 --> 00:58:44,440
Speaker 1: women's volleyball and basketball team. And UM, so when I

1157
00:58:44,520 --> 00:58:47,800
Speaker 1: met her, probably the second year I was at Market

1158
00:58:48,200 --> 00:58:52,320
Speaker 1: and we started dating, UM, I knew that I knew

1159
00:58:52,320 --> 00:58:56,160
Speaker 1: any any stead at any any any status of mine

1160
00:58:56,240 --> 00:58:58,840
Speaker 1: was going to go down the drain quickly once I

1161
00:58:58,960 --> 00:59:01,840
Speaker 1: was no longer a basketball player. And I was smart

1162
00:59:01,960 --> 00:59:05,240
Speaker 1: enough to find a gold a gold piece of goals

1163
00:59:05,480 --> 00:59:07,760
Speaker 1: in her. Yeah, and I'm sure I'm sure she was

1164
00:59:07,840 --> 00:59:11,040
Speaker 1: really impressed by, Hey, listen, I can make bucks at

1165
00:59:11,080 --> 00:59:13,800
Speaker 1: u w M. Or I go to Ocala, Florida. I

1166
00:59:13,880 --> 00:59:16,720
Speaker 1: got big, I got big plans, big, big, big place

1167
00:59:16,800 --> 00:59:19,640
Speaker 1: she go? Did she go with you? And the city

1168
00:59:19,720 --> 00:59:22,120
Speaker 1: actually went to She's a physical therapist, So she went

1169
00:59:22,160 --> 00:59:24,480
Speaker 1: and did her residency in Sacramento the year I was

1170
00:59:24,520 --> 00:59:27,680
Speaker 1: in Okalla. So the first year kind of we were

1171
00:59:27,720 --> 00:59:30,080
Speaker 1: doing our own thing and making nothing. And then the

1172
00:59:30,120 --> 00:59:34,760
Speaker 1: second year in Garden City, UM, she visited a lot,

1173
00:59:34,760 --> 00:59:36,480
Speaker 1: and then I went to Illinois State, so I kind

1174
00:59:36,520 --> 00:59:40,440
Speaker 1: of fortunately I I bridged that gap of Garden City

1175
00:59:40,440 --> 00:59:42,480
Speaker 1: for a nine month period before I got closer to

1176
00:59:42,480 --> 00:59:44,560
Speaker 1: Illinois State while she finished at Marquette, so we were

1177
00:59:44,600 --> 00:59:48,360
Speaker 1: only about four hours away. UM and then did you

1178
00:59:48,400 --> 00:59:50,560
Speaker 1: guys get fired it at Ellinois State and that's why

1179
00:59:50,560 --> 00:59:53,520
Speaker 1: you went to Crean Bay. Uh No, I went to

1180
00:59:53,520 --> 00:59:55,360
Speaker 1: Marquette then, so I went to market. So I got

1181
00:59:55,360 --> 00:59:57,080
Speaker 1: fired and then we I went to Marquette as a

1182
00:59:57,160 --> 01:00:00,160
Speaker 1: video coordinator Crane. Uh you know, I created in a

1183
01:00:00,200 --> 01:00:02,960
Speaker 1: position for me. I didn't know anything about video and

1184
01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:05,919
Speaker 1: uh he he allowed me to learn it and uh

1185
01:00:06,000 --> 01:00:08,320
Speaker 1: and he gave me that gave me some time to

1186
01:00:08,520 --> 01:00:09,720
Speaker 1: learn it. And I spent a lot of time in

1187
01:00:09,760 --> 01:00:12,160
Speaker 1: the office doing it, and and I saw I was

1188
01:00:12,200 --> 01:00:13,880
Speaker 1: there for a year and then we went down to

1189
01:00:14,000 --> 01:00:17,000
Speaker 1: uh down down to Indiana. So I was there. Yeah,

1190
01:00:17,040 --> 01:00:20,160
Speaker 1: and then that's when we went to Indiana. What was that? Like,

1191
01:00:20,680 --> 01:00:21,920
Speaker 1: you guys took over it in the end. It was

1192
01:00:21,960 --> 01:00:24,280
Speaker 1: a mess. Like people forget how big a mess it was.

1193
01:00:25,080 --> 01:00:28,120
Speaker 1: It was, I mean coach, you know the coach coach

1194
01:00:29,120 --> 01:00:32,240
Speaker 1: with Tim Buckley, Benny seltzer Um and we ended up

1195
01:00:32,280 --> 01:00:35,880
Speaker 1: having Roshan McLoud ended up coming on board, Jake Grossman,

1196
01:00:35,880 --> 01:00:38,480
Speaker 1: and we had we had a great staff um that

1197
01:00:38,480 --> 01:00:43,440
Speaker 1: that came with us and really really kind of navigated

1198
01:00:43,520 --> 01:00:46,120
Speaker 1: We didn't have any scholarship players, you know, that was

1199
01:00:46,200 --> 01:00:50,080
Speaker 1: part of the potted plant incident where Eli Holman was

1200
01:00:50,160 --> 01:00:52,440
Speaker 1: throwing the plant that was on the bottom line of

1201
01:00:52,520 --> 01:00:55,640
Speaker 1: the ESPN all day that Um, there was an incident

1202
01:00:55,640 --> 01:00:59,480
Speaker 1: in now you basketball office and uh and you. I

1203
01:00:59,600 --> 01:01:01,760
Speaker 1: ended up going tryansfer into Detroit and I had to

1204
01:01:01,760 --> 01:01:03,560
Speaker 1: deal with him for another two years playing him on

1205
01:01:03,560 --> 01:01:04,880
Speaker 1: the court. And he was a good player. And we

1206
01:01:04,960 --> 01:01:08,160
Speaker 1: actually halfway joked about it in the next few years.

1207
01:01:08,200 --> 01:01:11,280
Speaker 1: But yeah, I mean coaches energy and and just kind

1208
01:01:11,280 --> 01:01:16,200
Speaker 1: of relentlessness to get that thing going to where they did.

1209
01:01:16,240 --> 01:01:18,000
Speaker 1: I think they were number one in the country and

1210
01:01:18,240 --> 01:01:21,120
Speaker 1: within four or five years. And and we didn't have

1211
01:01:21,160 --> 01:01:23,200
Speaker 1: a whole lot to work with. We we we didn't

1212
01:01:23,240 --> 01:01:27,640
Speaker 1: have a whole lot to work with it all. Um,

1213
01:01:27,680 --> 01:01:31,520
Speaker 1: what was Brian Whorl like to work with? Yeah? That

1214
01:01:31,600 --> 01:01:34,040
Speaker 1: was that was unique. I great, he was great to

1215
01:01:34,080 --> 01:01:35,760
Speaker 1: work with. But it was unique because we were such

1216
01:01:35,800 --> 01:01:39,360
Speaker 1: good friends, right, I mean, like your former teammates together

1217
01:01:39,520 --> 01:01:42,800
Speaker 1: at Marquette. Brian was a tremendous player at Marquette. Yes,

1218
01:01:43,080 --> 01:01:46,240
Speaker 1: very good. Every pass I had was drawn in designed

1219
01:01:46,280 --> 01:01:48,120
Speaker 1: to throw to him, and then I was going on

1220
01:01:48,160 --> 01:01:50,520
Speaker 1: the other end to play defense. Sometimes I gart his

1221
01:01:50,560 --> 01:01:52,880
Speaker 1: guys along with my own. But we won't tell him that.

1222
01:01:53,480 --> 01:01:56,160
Speaker 1: But the he was great, you know he what he

1223
01:01:56,200 --> 01:02:00,439
Speaker 1: did was he he really he didn't hide the fact

1224
01:02:00,560 --> 01:02:03,120
Speaker 1: that this was he was young, he was getting he

1225
01:02:03,200 --> 01:02:06,640
Speaker 1: got a job, um, and was trying to learn it.

1226
01:02:06,800 --> 01:02:09,560
Speaker 1: And he put people in place that he had trusted

1227
01:02:09,600 --> 01:02:12,040
Speaker 1: and and we just had a lot of fun. We

1228
01:02:12,120 --> 01:02:14,360
Speaker 1: had a lot of fun just trying to find players.

1229
01:02:14,440 --> 01:02:17,000
Speaker 1: And I mean it was like putting a team together

1230
01:02:17,000 --> 01:02:18,760
Speaker 1: that if we were sitting there in the dorm saying

1231
01:02:18,800 --> 01:02:21,240
Speaker 1: like pick your top five, I mean that's kind of

1232
01:02:21,240 --> 01:02:23,120
Speaker 1: what I mean it was. It was a great experience,

1233
01:02:23,240 --> 01:02:25,240
Speaker 1: it really was. And we when we had some success,

1234
01:02:25,360 --> 01:02:29,320
Speaker 1: it was pretty cool. Um, you left there to go,

1235
01:02:30,640 --> 01:02:34,200
Speaker 1: Uh didn't you go to Iowa to jr College? I

1236
01:02:34,240 --> 01:02:37,880
Speaker 1: went to a junior college in Kansas, Junior college in Kansas,

1237
01:02:38,080 --> 01:02:40,800
Speaker 1: UM from Green Bay. Yeah, I was there for I

1238
01:02:40,880 --> 01:02:43,560
Speaker 1: ended up living in Kansas for two years. I stayed

1239
01:02:43,560 --> 01:02:48,560
Speaker 1: in Witshaw, Kansas for two years. Yeah. What happened I

1240
01:02:48,720 --> 01:02:53,040
Speaker 1: had gotten after about Um, I don't know when it was.

1241
01:02:53,160 --> 01:02:54,880
Speaker 1: It was. I was the head coach for a little

1242
01:02:54,920 --> 01:02:59,880
Speaker 1: bit and then had gotten uh pulled over and accused

1243
01:03:00,080 --> 01:03:04,680
Speaker 1: of a d U I. And fortunately, um, you know

1244
01:03:04,840 --> 01:03:07,800
Speaker 1: you you you move forward on on mistakes that were

1245
01:03:07,800 --> 01:03:10,960
Speaker 1: made and you make four and uh, you know without

1246
01:03:10,960 --> 01:03:14,320
Speaker 1: getting into all the details that you know, it's not

1247
01:03:14,440 --> 01:03:18,479
Speaker 1: something that um you know the situation I I really

1248
01:03:18,520 --> 01:03:23,280
Speaker 1: grew from and uh you know, fortunately it wasn't. Um,

1249
01:03:23,320 --> 01:03:27,280
Speaker 1: it wasn't asked for trade necessarily, but still uh you

1250
01:03:27,320 --> 01:03:31,680
Speaker 1: know for me, uh, for publicly it wasn't. It wasn't.

1251
01:03:31,160 --> 01:03:35,320
Speaker 1: So it's rights. It sucks. So I guess here's here's

1252
01:03:35,320 --> 01:03:43,200
Speaker 1: the question. Harder to call your wife or you're dead? Um,

1253
01:03:43,480 --> 01:03:50,200
Speaker 1: probably my wife because then it was just probably my wife. Yeah,

1254
01:03:50,240 --> 01:03:54,080
Speaker 1: that conversation and uh, and you have support. You have

1255
01:03:54,160 --> 01:03:57,480
Speaker 1: support through um, you know, trying to figure out everything

1256
01:03:57,560 --> 01:04:01,360
Speaker 1: and and and uh and really you know the support

1257
01:04:01,400 --> 01:04:03,840
Speaker 1: of knowing, Okay, we got you and let's figure out

1258
01:04:03,880 --> 01:04:06,160
Speaker 1: what the next step is and what happened and things

1259
01:04:06,200 --> 01:04:09,880
Speaker 1: like that. How do you get how do you so

1260
01:04:10,000 --> 01:04:12,280
Speaker 1: what was the process of getting back to where you

1261
01:04:12,320 --> 01:04:15,760
Speaker 1: now are? The head coach at s i U Edwards Hill,

1262
01:04:16,080 --> 01:04:18,280
Speaker 1: like from from that point because you're you're going through

1263
01:04:18,280 --> 01:04:20,959
Speaker 1: all these things and your dad is sick, get sick,

1264
01:04:21,400 --> 01:04:24,439
Speaker 1: right like this is this is a this is a lot.

1265
01:04:25,560 --> 01:04:28,120
Speaker 1: This is a lot. How do you go from the

1266
01:04:28,400 --> 01:04:34,560
Speaker 1: how do you go from there to here? Support? First

1267
01:04:34,560 --> 01:04:37,400
Speaker 1: of all, um, you know and you and I have

1268
01:04:37,400 --> 01:04:40,760
Speaker 1: have had conversations and um, some people such as you

1269
01:04:40,880 --> 01:04:46,200
Speaker 1: obviously family, UM, and then simply putting your head down

1270
01:04:47,120 --> 01:04:51,240
Speaker 1: and and saying, Okay, this is what ultimately matters. And

1271
01:04:51,720 --> 01:04:54,280
Speaker 1: I got to figure it out. And it's our mentality

1272
01:04:54,400 --> 01:04:58,080
Speaker 1: right now. It's our mentality right now. Where it's I

1273
01:04:58,160 --> 01:05:00,480
Speaker 1: call it or find a way and thing you do,

1274
01:05:00,520 --> 01:05:02,520
Speaker 1: You've got to find a way to just figure it out.

1275
01:05:02,600 --> 01:05:04,840
Speaker 1: It's the best way to say it. And there's no

1276
01:05:05,080 --> 01:05:07,200
Speaker 1: rocket science to it. But I put my head down,

1277
01:05:07,240 --> 01:05:12,200
Speaker 1: I I UM, I re established trying to who I

1278
01:05:12,240 --> 01:05:15,480
Speaker 1: wanted to be defined as. Uh. You didn't get worried

1279
01:05:15,520 --> 01:05:19,320
Speaker 1: about trying to explain yourself, trying to tell your side

1280
01:05:19,320 --> 01:05:22,000
Speaker 1: of the story and just simply being who you are

1281
01:05:22,040 --> 01:05:25,360
Speaker 1: and and um, you know you're defined sometimes in this

1282
01:05:25,720 --> 01:05:31,320
Speaker 1: in this business as uh as a coach, as a player,

1283
01:05:32,200 --> 01:05:34,800
Speaker 1: and what what you want to be defined of is

1284
01:05:34,880 --> 01:05:36,600
Speaker 1: more a little bit of who you are. And so

1285
01:05:36,640 --> 01:05:38,440
Speaker 1: when I didn't have a locker room for the first time,

1286
01:05:38,520 --> 01:05:42,360
Speaker 1: quite frankly in my entire life. I didn't necessarily know

1287
01:05:42,920 --> 01:05:48,440
Speaker 1: how to define myself. And um, ultimately, you just you

1288
01:05:49,040 --> 01:05:52,160
Speaker 1: are who you are and and you just started I

1289
01:05:52,160 --> 01:05:55,480
Speaker 1: started thinking, I started being a parent in a way

1290
01:05:55,520 --> 01:05:59,200
Speaker 1: that I looked at it in such a great way.

1291
01:05:59,280 --> 01:06:03,720
Speaker 1: And I started writing, I started talking, and uh, and

1292
01:06:03,800 --> 01:06:06,920
Speaker 1: Coach Greene hired me on at Indiana. Um, you know,

1293
01:06:07,000 --> 01:06:10,200
Speaker 1: people who really wanted to know the truth on a

1294
01:06:10,320 --> 01:06:15,280
Speaker 1: new me understood and gave me an opportunity. And and

1295
01:06:15,320 --> 01:06:16,680
Speaker 1: that's what I did. I had a lot of people

1296
01:06:16,720 --> 01:06:19,080
Speaker 1: give me an opportunity because they took the time to

1297
01:06:19,160 --> 01:06:22,600
Speaker 1: understand what what had gone on and who I am

1298
01:06:22,640 --> 01:06:30,120
Speaker 1: as a person. Um, your your your dad is sick,

1299
01:06:30,960 --> 01:06:34,440
Speaker 1: and you get the job at average though you versus

1300
01:06:34,480 --> 01:06:38,680
Speaker 1: the interim and then you get that you actually named

1301
01:06:38,680 --> 01:06:44,080
Speaker 1: the head coach. Yeah, what was that like? It was?

1302
01:06:44,720 --> 01:06:48,400
Speaker 1: It was a crazy two days, um, because you saw

1303
01:06:48,440 --> 01:06:51,160
Speaker 1: where it was trending on on how things were going on,

1304
01:06:51,480 --> 01:06:56,200
Speaker 1: and UM with him and with you with everything to

1305
01:06:56,240 --> 01:06:59,400
Speaker 1: be honest with you, with me and him, and um,

1306
01:06:59,440 --> 01:07:03,720
Speaker 1: he was he was talking less, he was moving last,

1307
01:07:03,760 --> 01:07:08,120
Speaker 1: he wasn't walking anymore. He's living in a nursing home. Um.

1308
01:07:08,160 --> 01:07:09,800
Speaker 1: You know, we didn't know what the next step for

1309
01:07:09,840 --> 01:07:11,640
Speaker 1: me was going to be because you know the way

1310
01:07:11,680 --> 01:07:14,840
Speaker 1: that the team was and and you know just numbers alone.

1311
01:07:14,880 --> 01:07:18,680
Speaker 1: I mean, we're all aware of this business. So when

1312
01:07:18,720 --> 01:07:21,520
Speaker 1: you go from walking into a meeting going in thinking, Okay,

1313
01:07:21,560 --> 01:07:23,560
Speaker 1: I'm gonna ask to find my next job elsewhere, and

1314
01:07:23,560 --> 01:07:24,960
Speaker 1: I'm also going to have to figure out how I'm

1315
01:07:25,000 --> 01:07:27,360
Speaker 1: gonna be able to spend time while doing that with

1316
01:07:27,360 --> 01:07:31,000
Speaker 1: with someone that I'm close to losing. Two Then within

1317
01:07:31,040 --> 01:07:35,280
Speaker 1: about twenty four hour period um being named head coach

1318
01:07:36,120 --> 01:07:38,680
Speaker 1: and driving to a couple of recruits and then one

1319
01:07:38,720 --> 01:07:41,000
Speaker 1: of which was in Chicago, and I go over three

1320
01:07:41,080 --> 01:07:44,280
Speaker 1: days or two days later and walking in with with

1321
01:07:44,360 --> 01:07:46,480
Speaker 1: a shirt that one of our administrators said, hey, give

1322
01:07:46,520 --> 01:07:49,880
Speaker 1: this to your dad right before I left, and uh,

1323
01:07:50,040 --> 01:07:51,560
Speaker 1: I drive up there and I give it to him

1324
01:07:51,600 --> 01:07:53,800
Speaker 1: and his smile and his his hug and we have

1325
01:07:53,800 --> 01:07:58,080
Speaker 1: an unbelievable picture. It was I've experienced moments of power

1326
01:07:58,440 --> 01:08:02,120
Speaker 1: these last um these last few months, and that was

1327
01:08:02,160 --> 01:08:03,919
Speaker 1: one of the most powerful moments of my life where

1328
01:08:03,920 --> 01:08:07,120
Speaker 1: I walked in and saw I saw my dad realize

1329
01:08:07,160 --> 01:08:09,520
Speaker 1: that you know you did it, you you you worked,

1330
01:08:09,560 --> 01:08:14,000
Speaker 1: you earned it, you overcame and uh, and there's nothing

1331
01:08:14,040 --> 01:08:16,760
Speaker 1: like that, man, there's nothing like seeing that in your

1332
01:08:16,800 --> 01:08:21,360
Speaker 1: father's eyes. Who. I know a lot of people reached

1333
01:08:21,360 --> 01:08:24,200
Speaker 1: out to you, and it's your your dad was a

1334
01:08:24,240 --> 01:08:29,240
Speaker 1: beloved figure. Who's the person who like blew you away

1335
01:08:29,960 --> 01:08:34,680
Speaker 1: with something they said after he passed? Man, you know, Uh,

1336
01:08:34,920 --> 01:08:37,960
Speaker 1: there's a guy named Reggie Morris. Um, you know Porter

1337
01:08:38,040 --> 01:08:40,479
Speaker 1: Moser might here here. The most powerful moment was I

1338
01:08:40,520 --> 01:08:43,360
Speaker 1: come around the corner. We're following the hearse in the limo,

1339
01:08:44,200 --> 01:08:47,080
Speaker 1: and it's my wife, my meeting, my family, my meeting family,

1340
01:08:47,120 --> 01:08:50,320
Speaker 1: my wife, my brothers, sister, UM, my cousin who's like

1341
01:08:50,360 --> 01:08:52,599
Speaker 1: a sister to me, and my mom and my dad's brother.

1342
01:08:52,760 --> 01:08:56,120
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, sister and her brother and her his brother

1343
01:08:56,120 --> 01:08:59,000
Speaker 1: in law. And I come around the corner and s

1344
01:08:59,040 --> 01:09:04,479
Speaker 1: I ue had sent our team, and wow, seeing that

1345
01:09:04,560 --> 01:09:07,000
Speaker 1: cougar bus in front of my dad's funeral, in front

1346
01:09:07,000 --> 01:09:09,760
Speaker 1: of the hearse never and I like, I can't, I

1347
01:09:09,800 --> 01:09:12,759
Speaker 1: can't even explain it. I'm getting joked up now. And

1348
01:09:13,040 --> 01:09:18,919
Speaker 1: um walking in there and seeing my team, there's no words,

1349
01:09:18,960 --> 01:09:24,679
Speaker 1: there's no words, and um. And then from there there

1350
01:09:24,800 --> 01:09:27,479
Speaker 1: was stories and a guy named Reggie Morris stood up

1351
01:09:27,560 --> 01:09:29,360
Speaker 1: and he played for my dad. He's a two time

1352
01:09:29,400 --> 01:09:34,240
Speaker 1: state championship I believe Grandfrew Grandview, Missouri now and he

1353
01:09:34,280 --> 01:09:36,280
Speaker 1: played for my dad. Coach with my dad, and he said,

1354
01:09:36,320 --> 01:09:38,559
Speaker 1: you know, one thing that Coach Brownie always did a

1355
01:09:38,560 --> 01:09:41,439
Speaker 1: great job of, was he Basketball takes so much away

1356
01:09:41,439 --> 01:09:43,240
Speaker 1: from you, takes your time as a coach, and it

1357
01:09:43,280 --> 01:09:46,120
Speaker 1: takes takes your time as a player, takes your time

1358
01:09:46,160 --> 01:09:48,080
Speaker 1: all the time. But one thing he always did a

1359
01:09:48,080 --> 01:09:50,000
Speaker 1: great job, and I instill it on my team and

1360
01:09:50,040 --> 01:09:52,679
Speaker 1: with my within my own family, is that he always

1361
01:09:52,720 --> 01:09:56,360
Speaker 1: puts family into basketball. He didn't let basketball take away

1362
01:09:56,400 --> 01:09:58,960
Speaker 1: from family. And that was a moment where I just

1363
01:09:59,040 --> 01:10:01,240
Speaker 1: kind of sat back on my heels. And then Porter

1364
01:10:01,320 --> 01:10:03,960
Speaker 1: stood up there, and Porter Moser stood up there and

1365
01:10:03,960 --> 01:10:06,080
Speaker 1: and set in front of everybody. He was blind, doesn't

1366
01:10:06,120 --> 01:10:10,320
Speaker 1: even know this, but what he did, what that team did,

1367
01:10:11,400 --> 01:10:15,120
Speaker 1: was what Coach BARRONI was for them to support somebody

1368
01:10:15,680 --> 01:10:17,720
Speaker 1: like they did getting up at four fifteen in the

1369
01:10:17,720 --> 01:10:20,280
Speaker 1: morning driving from the St. Louis area to a funeral

1370
01:10:20,360 --> 01:10:23,400
Speaker 1: up in Chicago. So he he and I didn't know it,

1371
01:10:23,479 --> 01:10:25,400
Speaker 1: and those things, you know, he talked to my team

1372
01:10:25,400 --> 01:10:28,880
Speaker 1: and you know Porter, that's family and those are the

1373
01:10:28,920 --> 01:10:32,200
Speaker 1: things that those two things, three things took my breath away.

1374
01:10:32,280 --> 01:10:33,960
Speaker 1: I say, they still do you want to talk to

1375
01:10:34,000 --> 01:10:39,439
Speaker 1: you now? It's it's it's it's it's unbelievable. Last thing, Um, Yeah,

1376
01:10:39,760 --> 01:10:42,439
Speaker 1: s I Edwardsville. And then back when you're they were good.

1377
01:10:42,520 --> 01:10:45,240
Speaker 1: Was Marty Simmons was there. It was a Division two program,

1378
01:10:45,880 --> 01:10:50,160
Speaker 1: very good. D D one is hard, and it's hard

1379
01:10:50,200 --> 01:10:52,680
Speaker 1: when you're you know, whether you're a direction school or not.

1380
01:10:53,000 --> 01:10:55,160
Speaker 1: Even s i U has has had its problems, let

1381
01:10:55,200 --> 01:10:59,120
Speaker 1: alone s i U Edwardsville. What's what's the process, what's

1382
01:10:59,160 --> 01:11:01,840
Speaker 1: the process intend to take year one in building this thing?

1383
01:11:03,800 --> 01:11:07,280
Speaker 1: I think it's about relationships. I really do. I think,

1384
01:11:07,439 --> 01:11:10,640
Speaker 1: you know, and it couldn't have been if you're going

1385
01:11:10,720 --> 01:11:13,840
Speaker 1: to take something out of the passing of my dad

1386
01:11:13,920 --> 01:11:15,800
Speaker 1: and in the in the things that I've heard and

1387
01:11:15,880 --> 01:11:18,360
Speaker 1: it was like he was talking to me, um and

1388
01:11:18,439 --> 01:11:21,240
Speaker 1: not trying to be kind of you know, it's weird

1389
01:11:21,280 --> 01:11:24,280
Speaker 1: about it or anything. But I think with the they

1390
01:11:24,320 --> 01:11:27,240
Speaker 1: everyone who stood up his creating team biparts that those

1391
01:11:27,240 --> 01:11:29,880
Speaker 1: guys I talked about earlier, when they stand up and

1392
01:11:29,920 --> 01:11:32,920
Speaker 1: they were talking it was about the relationship that he had,

1393
01:11:33,439 --> 01:11:35,880
Speaker 1: and I think it totally starts with the relationship. It

1394
01:11:35,960 --> 01:11:40,280
Speaker 1: wasn't always you know, cozy, and it wasn't always you know, flowery,

1395
01:11:40,320 --> 01:11:43,559
Speaker 1: and he wasn't always being the nicest guy, but there

1396
01:11:43,600 --> 01:11:46,920
Speaker 1: was a genuine relationship. And I have to start with

1397
01:11:47,000 --> 01:11:49,840
Speaker 1: the genuine relationship. I gotta walk into every day with

1398
01:11:49,920 --> 01:11:54,639
Speaker 1: an energy and enthusiasm every single day to demand effort,

1399
01:11:55,200 --> 01:11:57,400
Speaker 1: and I have to have the relationship to demand it

1400
01:11:57,479 --> 01:11:59,840
Speaker 1: and to push these guys from being, you know, something

1401
01:11:59,880 --> 01:12:02,839
Speaker 1: that day have never been just something that we were

1402
01:12:02,920 --> 01:12:07,719
Speaker 1: going to be. And that's that's the that's the base.

1403
01:12:07,880 --> 01:12:09,960
Speaker 1: That's the thing that I think is gonna that was

1404
01:12:10,080 --> 01:12:12,640
Speaker 1: lacking here and that will not be lacking I know

1405
01:12:12,760 --> 01:12:17,080
Speaker 1: under my watch. That is for sure. Awesome. Well, you

1406
01:12:17,120 --> 01:12:19,519
Speaker 1: have a fan and a friend in me, and of

1407
01:12:19,560 --> 01:12:21,280
Speaker 1: course you have all those you have all those kids

1408
01:12:21,280 --> 01:12:23,200
Speaker 1: that you have and you got a gaggle of kids.

1409
01:12:24,120 --> 01:12:26,360
Speaker 1: Stop having kids. But it is does provide a good

1410
01:12:26,400 --> 01:12:31,120
Speaker 1: cheering section. I love that you had let I love

1411
01:12:31,160 --> 01:12:33,920
Speaker 1: that you let let uh let me help tell your

1412
01:12:33,920 --> 01:12:36,639
Speaker 1: story and I want to I want to recap it

1413
01:12:36,880 --> 01:12:38,720
Speaker 1: as you get to year one. But you gotta we

1414
01:12:38,760 --> 01:12:41,960
Speaker 1: gotta go through all the different tribulations, the ups and downs,

1415
01:12:41,960 --> 01:12:44,720
Speaker 1: and what's this is? Actually like how you say the

1416
01:12:44,760 --> 01:12:46,880
Speaker 1: word and you know I I you said it to me,

1417
01:12:46,920 --> 01:12:48,800
Speaker 1: and you helped me with a friend. But a namigrade

1418
01:12:48,800 --> 01:12:51,519
Speaker 1: Closton has that passed away? Who you're at those camps

1419
01:12:51,600 --> 01:12:54,880
Speaker 1: probably floating that keg with back a marquette and had

1420
01:12:54,920 --> 01:12:56,920
Speaker 1: that passed away. And you gave me advice about six

1421
01:12:57,000 --> 01:12:58,680
Speaker 1: years ago. And I don't care if I've told you,

1422
01:12:58,960 --> 01:13:00,600
Speaker 1: I can't tell you enough. Told me to tell my

1423
01:13:00,720 --> 01:13:03,080
Speaker 1: dad why I love them, not not that I love him,

1424
01:13:03,080 --> 01:13:05,000
Speaker 1: And I'll tell you right now that day I whispered

1425
01:13:05,040 --> 01:13:07,080
Speaker 1: in his ear. I've said it several times that I

1426
01:13:07,200 --> 01:13:10,000
Speaker 1: leaned down right before he passed away, and I told

1427
01:13:10,080 --> 01:13:11,680
Speaker 1: him all the reasons I loved him. And I will

1428
01:13:11,800 --> 01:13:15,000
Speaker 1: never ever remember that. I forget that advice. And it's

1429
01:13:15,040 --> 01:13:17,439
Speaker 1: the best advice that I've gotten, and it's the best

1430
01:13:17,479 --> 01:13:20,360
Speaker 1: advice that you should continue to share. Well, I'm jealous

1431
01:13:20,400 --> 01:13:22,200
Speaker 1: of you because I didn't didn't get to tell my

1432
01:13:22,240 --> 01:13:25,760
Speaker 1: old man. It's something you learned from experience, just like

1433
01:13:25,880 --> 01:13:28,680
Speaker 1: we learned from experience in this game. Hey, I'm I'm

1434
01:13:28,760 --> 01:13:30,559
Speaker 1: so happy for you and your family. I know you've

1435
01:13:30,600 --> 01:13:32,760
Speaker 1: you've earned this. It's been a long time coming and

1436
01:13:33,160 --> 01:13:36,560
Speaker 1: look forward to catching up soon. Thanks for everything. Be

1437
01:13:36,720 --> 01:13:39,040
Speaker 1: sure to catch live editions. So the Doug Got Leaps

1438
01:13:39,040 --> 01:13:43,439
Speaker 1: show week days at noon eastern three pm Pacific. Alright,

1439
01:13:43,520 --> 01:13:47,160
Speaker 1: so some pretty emotional moments there at the end. Obviously,

1440
01:13:47,920 --> 01:13:50,120
Speaker 1: um that that is the advice that I would give

1441
01:13:50,160 --> 01:13:54,200
Speaker 1: to any of you about how you should interact with

1442
01:13:54,479 --> 01:13:58,040
Speaker 1: your dad with your mom, especially if they were a coach,

1443
01:13:58,120 --> 01:14:02,960
Speaker 1: but even if they're not. And uh, that was that's

1444
01:14:02,960 --> 01:14:06,640
Speaker 1: pretty awesome, you know for for a guy who was

1445
01:14:07,040 --> 01:14:10,439
Speaker 1: you know, coach his son to kind of scrapper as

1446
01:14:10,479 --> 01:14:14,439
Speaker 1: a ball player, to scrapper as I'll do anything to

1447
01:14:14,560 --> 01:14:18,040
Speaker 1: be on a bench as a juco assistant and then

1448
01:14:18,080 --> 01:14:21,280
Speaker 1: a head ju COO coach and then you know assistant

1449
01:14:21,280 --> 01:14:23,800
Speaker 1: in college and you see all the jobs that they

1450
01:14:23,920 --> 01:14:26,920
Speaker 1: lost into a video guy to to now becoming a

1451
01:14:27,000 --> 01:14:29,280
Speaker 1: head coach at Division one level and got that job

1452
01:14:29,320 --> 01:14:31,840
Speaker 1: before his father passed away, so was dad knew they'd

1453
01:14:31,880 --> 01:14:36,120
Speaker 1: finally done it. It's a pretty special journey. I hope

1454
01:14:36,160 --> 01:14:39,760
Speaker 1: you enjoyed. Joined joining me on and listen to Brian

1455
01:14:39,800 --> 01:14:42,080
Speaker 1: and what he's accomplished, and we'll see what he does

1456
01:14:42,160 --> 01:14:44,360
Speaker 1: accomplished there at a place that it's hard to win,

1457
01:14:44,439 --> 01:14:47,439
Speaker 1: the Vision one level. A reminder, you can listen to

1458
01:14:47,439 --> 01:14:49,960
Speaker 1: The Doug Gotlib Show every afternoon three to six Eastern

1459
01:14:50,080 --> 01:14:52,400
Speaker 1: time on Fox Sports Radio, the I Heart Radio app.

1460
01:14:52,680 --> 01:14:56,040
Speaker 1: We're also on Sirius xm Um one of them two

1461
01:14:56,080 --> 01:14:59,719
Speaker 1: oh three once to seventeen, basically the Dan Patrick Channel.

1462
01:15:00,479 --> 01:15:02,680
Speaker 1: My thanks for listening. We'll continue with some of these

1463
01:15:02,760 --> 01:15:06,120
Speaker 1: great stories and great basketball people. Tell a friend about it,

1464
01:15:06,479 --> 01:15:10,080
Speaker 1: Tweet it out, put it on your Facebook page, download, subscribe,

1465
01:15:10,120 --> 01:15:14,840
Speaker 1: and write and remember enjoy hoops. I'm Doug Gottlieb, and

1466
01:15:14,960 --> 01:15:16,519
Speaker 1: you have been listening to All Ball