1 00:00:01,120 --> 00:00:04,080 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class from how 2 00:00:04,120 --> 00:00:13,520 Speaker 1: Stuff Works dot com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. 3 00:00:13,640 --> 00:00:16,919 Speaker 1: I'm Tracy V. Wilson and I'm Holly Frying. Folks that 4 00:00:17,120 --> 00:00:20,239 Speaker 1: have seen the movie Hidden Figures or read Margot Lee 5 00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:23,919 Speaker 1: Shutterley's book by the same title will probably recognize the 6 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 1: name Mary Jackson. She was the first black woman to 7 00:00:26,560 --> 00:00:29,560 Speaker 1: become an engineer at NASA, and she's been on my 8 00:00:29,640 --> 00:00:31,920 Speaker 1: list for an episode for a while. We have a 9 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:36,120 Speaker 1: collection about women in stem fields, but we haven't talked 10 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:40,360 Speaker 1: specifically about a woman engineer, and she really hasn't gotten 11 00:00:40,360 --> 00:00:42,839 Speaker 1: as much recognition as some of the other women who 12 00:00:42,880 --> 00:00:46,200 Speaker 1: are featured in Hidden Figures, such as Catherine Johnson, who 13 00:00:46,240 --> 00:00:49,560 Speaker 1: calculated the trajectory for the United States first human space 14 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:54,840 Speaker 1: flight and celebrated her hundredth birthday in August. But I 15 00:00:54,880 --> 00:00:58,360 Speaker 1: didn't realize until I got into this episode just how 16 00:00:58,440 --> 00:01:01,520 Speaker 1: much Mary Jackson also to clear the way for other 17 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:05,400 Speaker 1: underrepresented people at NASA. I mean, she changed the too right, 18 00:01:05,480 --> 00:01:08,280 Speaker 1: the whole direction of her career to do this, and 19 00:01:08,360 --> 00:01:10,560 Speaker 1: in particular, she did a lot to try to make 20 00:01:10,840 --> 00:01:13,880 Speaker 1: more room for black women in the ranks of NASA. Engineers. 21 00:01:14,240 --> 00:01:17,280 Speaker 1: That made me even more excited to talk about her today. Yes, 22 00:01:17,400 --> 00:01:20,520 Speaker 1: she's pretty great. Uh. And Mary Jackson started working as 23 00:01:20,520 --> 00:01:23,840 Speaker 1: a computer at the National Advisory Committee for Aeronautics or 24 00:01:23,880 --> 00:01:26,759 Speaker 1: the n a C a years before it was absorbed 25 00:01:26,800 --> 00:01:30,120 Speaker 1: into NASA. So before we get to her specifically, we 26 00:01:30,240 --> 00:01:32,240 Speaker 1: have to back up and talk a little bit about 27 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:34,960 Speaker 1: human computers. If it sounds weird for you to say 28 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:37,200 Speaker 1: someone worked as a computer, that is what they were 29 00:01:37,240 --> 00:01:42,360 Speaker 1: called human computers, and how Langley Memorial Aeronautical Laboratory now 30 00:01:42,360 --> 00:01:45,600 Speaker 1: known as Langley Research Center came to have a segregated 31 00:01:45,640 --> 00:01:49,240 Speaker 1: pool of human computers in the nineteen forties. There were 32 00:01:49,320 --> 00:01:52,720 Speaker 1: surely people doing this kind of work in other parts 33 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:55,040 Speaker 1: of the world as well, but our focus today is 34 00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:58,960 Speaker 1: really on Europe and North America. In English, the word 35 00:01:59,000 --> 00:02:02,800 Speaker 1: computer to being a person who makes calculations or computation, 36 00:02:02,880 --> 00:02:05,600 Speaker 1: goes all the way back to the early seventeenth century. 37 00:02:06,160 --> 00:02:09,519 Speaker 1: Many of these early computers were men. They were apprentices 38 00:02:09,560 --> 00:02:11,840 Speaker 1: and assistants who were doing this work as part of 39 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:15,280 Speaker 1: their education and training to become say an astronomer or 40 00:02:15,280 --> 00:02:19,679 Speaker 1: an engineer. But women have played a really important part two, 41 00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:24,440 Speaker 1: especially the wives and sisters and daughters of astronomers and 42 00:02:24,520 --> 00:02:28,120 Speaker 1: physicists and other scientists, some of whom were scientists in 43 00:02:28,200 --> 00:02:31,880 Speaker 1: their own right. These women did calculations to support the 44 00:02:31,919 --> 00:02:35,600 Speaker 1: research of their male family members, often without ever getting 45 00:02:35,639 --> 00:02:39,440 Speaker 1: the credit for it. One example is mathematician and astronomer 46 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:44,360 Speaker 1: Nicole Rain Lepote, whose husband Jean Andre, was France's royal clockmaker. 47 00:02:45,040 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 1: She worked with astronomer Joseph Leland and mathematician Alexei Clarroux 48 00:02:49,639 --> 00:02:53,320 Speaker 1: to calculate the return of Halley's comment in seventeen fifty eight. 49 00:02:54,080 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 1: Leland later said, quote, for six months, we made calculations 50 00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:02,080 Speaker 1: from dawn to dusk, sometimes even during the meals. The 51 00:03:02,120 --> 00:03:04,760 Speaker 1: help given by Madam Napote was such that without her 52 00:03:04,840 --> 00:03:06,760 Speaker 1: I would not have been able to complete such a 53 00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:11,359 Speaker 1: colossal enterprise. But when Clara published their findings, which were 54 00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:14,919 Speaker 1: far more accurate than previous predictions had been, he did 55 00:03:14,919 --> 00:03:19,120 Speaker 1: not acknowledge Lepote's work at all. The Harvard College Observatory 56 00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:21,840 Speaker 1: started hiring women as assistants towards the end of the 57 00:03:21,919 --> 00:03:25,280 Speaker 1: nineteenth century. They cared for glass plates that were used 58 00:03:25,280 --> 00:03:28,520 Speaker 1: to record images of the night sky, and they analyzed 59 00:03:28,560 --> 00:03:32,280 Speaker 1: and recorded the images from those plates, classifying the stars, 60 00:03:32,400 --> 00:03:38,920 Speaker 1: and compiling the data. Observatory director Edward Charles Pickering, in particular, 61 00:03:39,080 --> 00:03:42,880 Speaker 1: started hiring a whole group of women computers in eighty one. 62 00:03:43,160 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 1: They were nicknamed Pickering's Harem, which was not a particularly 63 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:52,040 Speaker 1: nice nickname, and nods too. Sort of a perception that 64 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:54,760 Speaker 1: one of the reasons that some of these departments where 65 00:03:54,800 --> 00:03:58,040 Speaker 1: all women was because the men in charge wanted to 66 00:03:58,080 --> 00:04:01,360 Speaker 1: be surrounded by young women. You don't talk about that 67 00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:04,520 Speaker 1: as much, and other reasons why there were women's staff 68 00:04:04,920 --> 00:04:08,720 Speaker 1: of computers, but that was a thing that there was, 69 00:04:08,760 --> 00:04:11,360 Speaker 1: at least the perception was going on. One of the 70 00:04:11,360 --> 00:04:15,400 Speaker 1: computers at the Harvard College Observatory was Anti Jump Cannon, 71 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:18,840 Speaker 1: who developed the method for classifying stars that is still 72 00:04:18,960 --> 00:04:22,640 Speaker 1: used today. During World War Two, hundreds of women worked 73 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:26,080 Speaker 1: as computers at the U. S. Army's Ballistic Research Laboratory, 74 00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:29,440 Speaker 1: doing the math for the firing tables for rockets and artillery. 75 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:33,480 Speaker 1: This included civilian women with degrees in math or science, 76 00:04:33,560 --> 00:04:36,719 Speaker 1: as well as women from the Women's Army Corps. Women 77 00:04:36,800 --> 00:04:40,040 Speaker 1: worked as computers at the Manhattan Project that Los Alamos 78 00:04:40,120 --> 00:04:43,520 Speaker 1: National Laboratory as well. Some more women with math or 79 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:46,040 Speaker 1: physics degrees who had been recruited for that work, and 80 00:04:46,160 --> 00:04:49,800 Speaker 1: others were the wives of other Los Alamos employees thanks 81 00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 1: to hidden figures. Today the idea of a whole department 82 00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:56,520 Speaker 1: of human computers is heavily associated with Langley and the 83 00:04:56,560 --> 00:04:59,920 Speaker 1: Space race, but within the n a c A. Computing 84 00:05:00,040 --> 00:05:03,599 Speaker 1: departments weren't unique to Langley. Other n a c A 85 00:05:03,680 --> 00:05:07,839 Speaker 1: facilities had them as well. They also significantly predate the 86 00:05:07,880 --> 00:05:13,120 Speaker 1: Space program. Langley created its first computing pool in ve 87 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:17,719 Speaker 1: hiring five women as computers. These women did their calculations 88 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:21,280 Speaker 1: by hand, with the help of slide rules, mathematical tables, 89 00:05:21,400 --> 00:05:26,520 Speaker 1: and mechanical calculators. Before the computing pool was established, Langley's 90 00:05:26,600 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 1: engineers and scientists had been performing all of their calculations themselves, 91 00:05:31,480 --> 00:05:34,680 Speaker 1: and the idea was that moving the calculating work over 92 00:05:34,760 --> 00:05:38,000 Speaker 1: to a dedicated department could free up those men to 93 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:41,480 Speaker 1: focus on the science and the engineering, while also making 94 00:05:41,520 --> 00:05:45,000 Speaker 1: the process of computing faster and more accurate. That's also 95 00:05:45,040 --> 00:05:47,960 Speaker 1: why all of those wartime departments were women, because the 96 00:05:48,080 --> 00:05:51,279 Speaker 1: men were needed to go to combat roles. At first, 97 00:05:51,600 --> 00:05:53,800 Speaker 1: many of the men who had previously done their own 98 00:05:53,839 --> 00:05:58,359 Speaker 1: calculations resisted this idea and doubted whether women could do 99 00:05:58,440 --> 00:06:02,119 Speaker 1: the necessary mass. But the creation of the Computing Group 100 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:05,240 Speaker 1: had exactly the outcome the organization had been looking for. 101 00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:09,360 Speaker 1: It was faster and more accurate. Plus, since women were 102 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:11,960 Speaker 1: being hired for the positions, they could be paid much 103 00:06:12,040 --> 00:06:15,760 Speaker 1: less than the engineers and scientists whose work they were absorbing. 104 00:06:17,000 --> 00:06:20,000 Speaker 1: Of course, we are not endorsing that fact that the 105 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:24,080 Speaker 1: administrators liked it. There's a lot to unpack. It's unfortunate, 106 00:06:24,400 --> 00:06:27,600 Speaker 1: but that was part of the logic train. Yeah, computing 107 00:06:27,800 --> 00:06:32,080 Speaker 1: was also considered a sub professional position, while engineering was 108 00:06:32,120 --> 00:06:35,159 Speaker 1: a professional one. So the top of the ranks for 109 00:06:35,200 --> 00:06:38,440 Speaker 1: a computer was mathematician, and that was equivalent to an 110 00:06:38,600 --> 00:06:42,000 Speaker 1: entry level position for a male engineer. So, in other words, 111 00:06:42,320 --> 00:06:44,800 Speaker 1: the top of the computing ranks lined up with the 112 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:48,159 Speaker 1: bottom of the engineering ranks. And that brings us to 113 00:06:48,240 --> 00:06:51,719 Speaker 1: how this job occupied a complicated spot in the grand 114 00:06:51,760 --> 00:06:56,440 Speaker 1: scheme of things. Often women computers were paid significantly more 115 00:06:56,520 --> 00:06:58,599 Speaker 1: than they might have been in other work that was 116 00:06:58,640 --> 00:07:02,120 Speaker 1: open to them because things like teaching school. But at 117 00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:04,479 Speaker 1: the same time, many of the women who were hired 118 00:07:04,520 --> 00:07:07,760 Speaker 1: to be computers were overqualified for the job, and as 119 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:09,960 Speaker 1: we just talked about, they were handling work that had 120 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:13,000 Speaker 1: previously been done by men who were higher up in 121 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:16,520 Speaker 1: the org chart. Because the computers were women and their 122 00:07:16,600 --> 00:07:19,800 Speaker 1: jobs were seen as subordinate to those of male engineers, 123 00:07:19,840 --> 00:07:22,240 Speaker 1: they also faced sexism in a way that they might 124 00:07:22,280 --> 00:07:26,680 Speaker 1: not have in other industries. These disparities became even more 125 00:07:26,840 --> 00:07:30,760 Speaker 1: pronounced when Langley started recruiting black women to work as computers. 126 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:35,360 Speaker 1: In July of ninety one, Franklin D. Roosevelt signed Executive 127 00:07:35,440 --> 00:07:38,920 Speaker 1: Order eight o two, which said, in part quote, there 128 00:07:38,920 --> 00:07:42,560 Speaker 1: shall be no discrimination in the employment of workers in 129 00:07:42,640 --> 00:07:46,400 Speaker 1: defense industries and in government because of race, creed, color, 130 00:07:46,600 --> 00:07:51,760 Speaker 1: or national origin. This executive order followed extensive advocacy by A. 131 00:07:51,800 --> 00:07:54,880 Speaker 1: Philip Randolph and other black labor and civil rights leaders, 132 00:07:55,240 --> 00:07:58,720 Speaker 1: and it also established the Fair Employment Practices Committee to 133 00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:02,160 Speaker 1: make sure that order was in forced. This executive order 134 00:08:02,200 --> 00:08:05,800 Speaker 1: came as the United States was preparing for war. The 135 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:08,400 Speaker 1: previous May, the President had called for the US to 136 00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:12,440 Speaker 1: build fifty tho aircraft. This was a dramatic increase in 137 00:08:12,480 --> 00:08:16,160 Speaker 1: aircraft production, up from fewer than one airplanes a month. 138 00:08:16,840 --> 00:08:21,040 Speaker 1: Langley was where aircraft manufacturers were having their high performance 139 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 1: aircraft tested and improved. Langley engineers would put aircraft through 140 00:08:26,000 --> 00:08:29,960 Speaker 1: test flights and wind tunnels and evaluate their performance and 141 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:33,880 Speaker 1: suggest improvements and refinements on the design. The goal was 142 00:08:33,920 --> 00:08:37,600 Speaker 1: to make aircraft safer, faster, and more effective. So when 143 00:08:37,600 --> 00:08:40,560 Speaker 1: the President made this call for more aircraft, that gave 144 00:08:40,679 --> 00:08:43,720 Speaker 1: Langley a lot more work to do, and the n 145 00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:46,360 Speaker 1: a c A had to hire a lot more people 146 00:08:46,440 --> 00:08:49,600 Speaker 1: across the facility to do it. The expansion was so 147 00:08:49,760 --> 00:08:52,600 Speaker 1: huge and dramatic that it led to a housing crisis 148 00:08:52,679 --> 00:08:56,200 Speaker 1: in the area around Langley, addressed in part by building 149 00:08:56,200 --> 00:08:59,160 Speaker 1: a dormitory to house some of the women. A three 150 00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:02,079 Speaker 1: hundred seventy two unit dorm opened in the summer of 151 00:09:02,160 --> 00:09:05,520 Speaker 1: nineteen forty three with a house mother who locked everything 152 00:09:05,640 --> 00:09:08,560 Speaker 1: up at eleven PM. At first, a lot of these 153 00:09:08,640 --> 00:09:11,920 Speaker 1: new hires were white candidates, but before long there just 154 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:15,360 Speaker 1: weren't enough white candidates to fill all the jobs, many 155 00:09:15,440 --> 00:09:19,120 Speaker 1: of which were intended to be temporary, wartime positions and 156 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:22,800 Speaker 1: not long term careers. So after Executive Order A D 157 00:09:22,920 --> 00:09:25,120 Speaker 1: eight oh to the administration at the n a c 158 00:09:25,280 --> 00:09:29,040 Speaker 1: A started actively recruiting black candidates to phill these jobs. 159 00:09:29,679 --> 00:09:33,680 Speaker 1: Langley had black employees before this point, but mostly doing 160 00:09:33,720 --> 00:09:37,719 Speaker 1: things like janitorial work and groundskeeping in food service. This 161 00:09:37,840 --> 00:09:40,760 Speaker 1: was the first time that Langley had recruited black employees 162 00:09:40,840 --> 00:09:45,120 Speaker 1: for professional and sub professional roles. Although the executive order 163 00:09:45,200 --> 00:09:49,960 Speaker 1: barred discrimination in hiring, Virginia, where Langley is located, was 164 00:09:50,040 --> 00:09:54,160 Speaker 1: still racially segregated by law, so this newly hired group 165 00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:58,040 Speaker 1: of black computers who started work in Ninette were placed 166 00:09:58,120 --> 00:10:01,400 Speaker 1: in a segregated section known a the West Computing Group 167 00:10:01,600 --> 00:10:04,720 Speaker 1: or just the West Group, in which black women reported 168 00:10:04,720 --> 00:10:09,280 Speaker 1: to white supervisors. This also meant adding segregated restrooms in 169 00:10:09,280 --> 00:10:13,160 Speaker 1: a segregated area of the lunch room. Segregation was so 170 00:10:13,240 --> 00:10:16,280 Speaker 1: strictly maintained that many of the white computers and lab 171 00:10:16,320 --> 00:10:20,480 Speaker 1: employees didn't realize that the West Group even existed. There 172 00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:23,880 Speaker 1: was one computer named Miriam Man who made it a 173 00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:28,200 Speaker 1: point of repeatedly removing the colored computer sign that was 174 00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:32,000 Speaker 1: used to mark the blacks only part of the cafeteria. 175 00:10:32,280 --> 00:10:34,040 Speaker 1: She would just basically take it and put it in 176 00:10:34,080 --> 00:10:36,280 Speaker 1: her purse and leave, and a few days later it 177 00:10:36,280 --> 00:10:38,400 Speaker 1: would show back up on the table again, and all 178 00:10:38,440 --> 00:10:40,640 Speaker 1: the computers were like, we know, we know, this is 179 00:10:40,679 --> 00:10:42,480 Speaker 1: where you want us to sit. We know this is 180 00:10:42,480 --> 00:10:45,160 Speaker 1: our designated area. You don't have to keep pointing it 181 00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:47,720 Speaker 1: out to us. And her husband was like, Miriam, they're 182 00:10:47,720 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 1: gonna fire you. Miriam was kind of like, what they're 183 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:55,120 Speaker 1: gonna have to to kept doing it until they finally 184 00:10:55,160 --> 00:10:57,560 Speaker 1: stopped putting the sign there. I'm like, that would be 185 00:10:57,559 --> 00:11:00,800 Speaker 1: a firing well earned. In my opinion. We mentioned a 186 00:11:00,880 --> 00:11:03,240 Speaker 1: few minutes ago how a woman might be better paid 187 00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:05,240 Speaker 1: as a computer than she had been while working at 188 00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:09,319 Speaker 1: another job, while still being overqualified for that computing job. 189 00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:13,920 Speaker 1: This was particularly true for black women. Many had done 190 00:11:13,960 --> 00:11:17,720 Speaker 1: exceptionally well in their study of math and had advanced degrees, 191 00:11:18,240 --> 00:11:22,240 Speaker 1: years of experience teaching math and science, or both. Many, 192 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:24,720 Speaker 1: but certainly not all, of the white computers did not. 193 00:11:25,160 --> 00:11:27,839 Speaker 1: They might have a math degree but little to no 194 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:32,440 Speaker 1: experience beyond college. Additionally, teaching was really one of the 195 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:35,400 Speaker 1: most prestigious jobs that was available to black women in 196 00:11:35,440 --> 00:11:39,040 Speaker 1: the nineteen forties. Within their communities, black teachers were really 197 00:11:39,080 --> 00:11:42,040 Speaker 1: regarded with a lot of respect and admiration, and the 198 00:11:42,160 --> 00:11:46,120 Speaker 1: increase in pay between working as a teacher and working 199 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:49,720 Speaker 1: as a computer could be even more dramatic for black computers. 200 00:11:49,760 --> 00:11:53,839 Speaker 1: Than it was for white ones. Black teachers overwhelmingly taught 201 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:56,680 Speaker 1: in segregated schools for black children, and they tended to 202 00:11:56,720 --> 00:12:00,200 Speaker 1: have poorer facilities and much lower pay than the schools 203 00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:03,520 Speaker 1: for white children. But once they got to Langley, these 204 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:06,680 Speaker 1: women were just a computer. They were often looked down 205 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:10,280 Speaker 1: on by the engineers whose calculations they were carrying out. 206 00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:14,600 Speaker 1: Although the women hired as computers typically enjoyed and excelled 207 00:12:14,640 --> 00:12:18,800 Speaker 1: at math, other people perceived that work as tedious drudgery. 208 00:12:19,120 --> 00:12:22,320 Speaker 1: It could almost feel like a simultaneous step up and 209 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:24,880 Speaker 1: a step down, And for many of the women, the 210 00:12:24,920 --> 00:12:27,680 Speaker 1: fact that they were doing critical wartime work at a 211 00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:31,720 Speaker 1: facility as prestigious as Langley, but still being segregated by 212 00:12:31,760 --> 00:12:35,280 Speaker 1: their race was even more galling. It was a little 213 00:12:35,320 --> 00:12:38,240 Speaker 1: bit later, but still into this same world that Mary 214 00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:41,120 Speaker 1: Jackson stepped when she got hired to work at Langley, 215 00:12:41,160 --> 00:12:50,000 Speaker 1: and we will get to her after a sponsor break. 216 00:12:51,240 --> 00:12:56,320 Speaker 1: Mary Jackson was born Mary Winston on April in Hampton, Virginia, 217 00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:59,280 Speaker 1: not far away from Langley. She was from a large 218 00:12:59,360 --> 00:13:03,199 Speaker 1: family and her parents, Ella and Frank Winston, were extremely 219 00:13:03,200 --> 00:13:05,439 Speaker 1: focused on making sure all of their children got a 220 00:13:05,440 --> 00:13:08,600 Speaker 1: good education. And we're really good citizens and role models. 221 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:12,720 Speaker 1: Mary attended high school at George P. Phoenix Training School, 222 00:13:13,040 --> 00:13:15,640 Speaker 1: which was on the campus of Hampton Institute, which is 223 00:13:15,679 --> 00:13:19,840 Speaker 1: now Hampton University. Hampton Institute has actually come up on 224 00:13:19,880 --> 00:13:22,600 Speaker 1: the show before, most recently. It is where Susan La 225 00:13:22,640 --> 00:13:26,240 Speaker 1: Flesh Picott continued her studies before going to medical school 226 00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:28,960 Speaker 1: and becoming the first Native American woman in the US 227 00:13:29,280 --> 00:13:32,960 Speaker 1: to earn an m. D. Hampton Institute was founded in 228 00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:36,000 Speaker 1: eighteen sixty eight to teach trade and industrial skills to 229 00:13:36,160 --> 00:13:39,000 Speaker 1: freed people, as well as to train them to become teachers. 230 00:13:39,440 --> 00:13:41,800 Speaker 1: By the nineteen twenties that had become a college with 231 00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:46,040 Speaker 1: numerous courses of study. The city of Hampton didn't provide 232 00:13:46,160 --> 00:13:50,360 Speaker 1: education for Black children beyond elementary school, so the Hampton 233 00:13:50,520 --> 00:13:55,319 Speaker 1: Institute had established Phoenix Training School for that purpose. Mary 234 00:13:55,400 --> 00:13:58,480 Speaker 1: graduated from Phoenix with highest honors and went on to 235 00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:01,800 Speaker 1: college at the Hampton Instant too. She expected that she 236 00:14:01,800 --> 00:14:04,560 Speaker 1: would become a teacher, but she pushed herself to finish 237 00:14:04,600 --> 00:14:08,280 Speaker 1: a double major in mathematics and physical science, even though 238 00:14:08,360 --> 00:14:10,880 Speaker 1: that was a far more strenuous course of study than 239 00:14:10,960 --> 00:14:14,680 Speaker 1: she would need to teach. She graduated in nineteen two 240 00:14:14,720 --> 00:14:17,080 Speaker 1: and was soon hired as a teacher at a segregated 241 00:14:17,120 --> 00:14:21,000 Speaker 1: school for black students in Maryland. About a year later, 242 00:14:21,160 --> 00:14:24,080 Speaker 1: Mary moved back home. Her father had become ill and 243 00:14:24,200 --> 00:14:26,880 Speaker 1: she came back to help look after him, but she 244 00:14:26,920 --> 00:14:29,600 Speaker 1: found that she couldn't get a teaching job back in Hampton. 245 00:14:29,880 --> 00:14:32,920 Speaker 1: Two of her sisters were already teaching in Hampton, and 246 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:35,520 Speaker 1: there were nepotism rules that kept her from being able 247 00:14:35,560 --> 00:14:37,920 Speaker 1: to join them, so she had to find a job 248 00:14:37,960 --> 00:14:41,240 Speaker 1: somewhere else. She started out as the secretary at the 249 00:14:41,320 --> 00:14:44,520 Speaker 1: King Street USO, doing everything from keeping the books to 250 00:14:44,680 --> 00:14:47,960 Speaker 1: acting as a hostess. The King Street USO was one 251 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:51,120 Speaker 1: of the many USO centers established to serve black members 252 00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:54,600 Speaker 1: of the military. The USO had a policy of serving 253 00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:57,720 Speaker 1: the entire military regardless of race, but a lot of 254 00:14:57,720 --> 00:15:01,560 Speaker 1: places had segregated USO center for reasons ranging from black 255 00:15:01,600 --> 00:15:06,200 Speaker 1: service members requesting them to Jim Crow laws requiring them. 256 00:15:06,200 --> 00:15:08,480 Speaker 1: Mary worked at the King Street USO until the end 257 00:15:08,520 --> 00:15:10,480 Speaker 1: of World War Two, and it was there that she 258 00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:13,880 Speaker 1: met her husband, Levi Jackson, who was a serviceman from Alabama. 259 00:15:14,440 --> 00:15:16,960 Speaker 1: They got married in nineteen forty four and in nineteen 260 00:15:17,040 --> 00:15:19,840 Speaker 1: forty six, they had their first child together, a son 261 00:15:19,880 --> 00:15:23,240 Speaker 1: who was also named Levy. Throughout all this Jackson was 262 00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:25,760 Speaker 1: active with the Bethel A. M. E. Church, where she 263 00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:29,160 Speaker 1: and her family had long been members. She also started 264 00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 1: serving as a leader for the church's Girl Scout troop, 265 00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:34,760 Speaker 1: which she would do for about thirty years. She did 266 00:15:34,760 --> 00:15:37,280 Speaker 1: not yet have a daughter. Her daughter, Caroline, was born 267 00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:40,720 Speaker 1: several years later, but she loved the Girl Scouts. She 268 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:43,080 Speaker 1: was a teacher, a mentor, and a big sister for 269 00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:45,480 Speaker 1: the girls in the troop, many of whom were from 270 00:15:45,480 --> 00:15:49,280 Speaker 1: working class and poor families with parents who did agricultural 271 00:15:49,400 --> 00:15:51,880 Speaker 1: or domestic work. While she was working as the Girl 272 00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:55,000 Speaker 1: Scout leader, Jackson started doing something that would also be 273 00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:57,760 Speaker 1: a hallmark of her time at NASA and before that, 274 00:15:57,880 --> 00:16:00,560 Speaker 1: the n a c. A. She really that the girls 275 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:03,440 Speaker 1: that she worked with to see what was possible beyond 276 00:16:03,520 --> 00:16:06,920 Speaker 1: what was familiar to or expected of them, and she 277 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:09,480 Speaker 1: wanted to open as many doors for them as she could. 278 00:16:09,600 --> 00:16:12,720 Speaker 1: So she arranged all kinds of field trips and projects 279 00:16:12,720 --> 00:16:15,800 Speaker 1: aligned with all the various merit badges to really try 280 00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:18,840 Speaker 1: to broaden their experience of the world and encourage them 281 00:16:18,840 --> 00:16:22,400 Speaker 1: to set really ambitious goals for themselves. Later on, Jackson 282 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:25,320 Speaker 1: would also play a key role in integrating the Black 283 00:16:25,320 --> 00:16:27,960 Speaker 1: and White Girl Scout councils in the area into one 284 00:16:28,120 --> 00:16:32,040 Speaker 1: integrated council in her part of Virginia. Jackson returned to 285 00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:35,520 Speaker 1: work when Levi Jr. Turned four. She applied for a 286 00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:39,640 Speaker 1: clerical position with the Army and a computing position at Langley. 287 00:16:39,720 --> 00:16:42,240 Speaker 1: The offer from the Army came first, and she worked 288 00:16:42,280 --> 00:16:44,640 Speaker 1: there for a few months before being offered the computer 289 00:16:44,760 --> 00:16:48,080 Speaker 1: job at Langley, where the Army agreed her skills would 290 00:16:48,080 --> 00:16:51,280 Speaker 1: be of better use. She started her job as one 291 00:16:51,280 --> 00:16:54,680 Speaker 1: of the West Area Computers on April five, n one, 292 00:16:54,920 --> 00:16:57,600 Speaker 1: at the age of six. That was just a few 293 00:16:57,640 --> 00:17:00,640 Speaker 1: months after Dorothy Vaughan became the head of the West 294 00:17:00,680 --> 00:17:03,440 Speaker 1: Area Computers, having started out as one of the West 295 00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:08,600 Speaker 1: Area's mathematicians. This made Vaughan the first black supervisor at Langley. 296 00:17:08,680 --> 00:17:12,000 Speaker 1: This was almost three years after President Harry Truman had 297 00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:19,199 Speaker 1: signed executive orders and one that happened in July and 298 00:17:19,320 --> 00:17:22,560 Speaker 1: ordered the desegregation of the federal workforce and the US 299 00:17:22,680 --> 00:17:27,600 Speaker 1: Armed Forces, but segregation was still required by law in Virginia. 300 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:31,600 Speaker 1: That had not changed, so when Jackson started work at Langley, 301 00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:34,399 Speaker 1: the West Area computers were still, in the words of 302 00:17:34,400 --> 00:17:39,200 Speaker 1: administrative officer Kemball Johnson quote, composed entirely of Negro women. 303 00:17:39,880 --> 00:17:45,240 Speaker 1: The restroom and cafeteria facilities were also still segregated. It had, however, 304 00:17:45,280 --> 00:17:48,000 Speaker 1: become a lot more common for the West Area computers 305 00:17:48,040 --> 00:17:51,080 Speaker 1: to be assigned out to other departments at Langley for 306 00:17:51,200 --> 00:17:54,640 Speaker 1: periods of days two months to work on specific projects. 307 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:58,000 Speaker 1: This became more and more common as the white East 308 00:17:58,040 --> 00:18:02,400 Speaker 1: Area computers shrank in number as their members were promoted 309 00:18:02,560 --> 00:18:07,280 Speaker 1: or permanently transferred into other departments. In nineteen fifty three, 310 00:18:07,480 --> 00:18:10,920 Speaker 1: after two years in the West Computing Group, Mary Jackson 311 00:18:10,960 --> 00:18:13,920 Speaker 1: was assigned to a project on Langley's East Side along 312 00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:17,639 Speaker 1: with several white computers. Jackson didn't know the layout of 313 00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:19,800 Speaker 1: the buildings on the East side at all, and when 314 00:18:19,800 --> 00:18:22,000 Speaker 1: she asked her coworkers from that side of the campus 315 00:18:22,000 --> 00:18:25,639 Speaker 1: for directions to the restroom, they pointedly told her that 316 00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:28,919 Speaker 1: they did not know where her restroom was. Jackson was 317 00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:32,640 Speaker 1: frustrated and angry, not just about the insult of her 318 00:18:32,920 --> 00:18:35,920 Speaker 1: bathroom and the dismissive way that her colleagues had talked 319 00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:38,879 Speaker 1: to her, but also about being a second class citizen 320 00:18:38,920 --> 00:18:41,520 Speaker 1: at Langley because of her race, even though she was 321 00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:43,879 Speaker 1: a computer and she had more experience than some of 322 00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:48,440 Speaker 1: her colleagues did. Later that day, she ran into Kashmirez Zarnecki, 323 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:52,640 Speaker 1: who worked at Langley's supersonic pressure tunnel. He asked how 324 00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:56,200 Speaker 1: she was doing, and she answered him honestly. From a 325 00:18:56,320 --> 00:18:59,520 Speaker 1: number of angles, it was socially unacceptable for a black 326 00:18:59,560 --> 00:19:02,840 Speaker 1: person to unload their feelings on a white person, especially 327 00:19:03,160 --> 00:19:06,560 Speaker 1: when it came to racism and discrimination. And it's not 328 00:19:06,720 --> 00:19:10,040 Speaker 1: entirely clear whether Jackson had just gotten so fed up 329 00:19:10,040 --> 00:19:13,240 Speaker 1: that she lost her temper or whether she had perceived Zarnecki, 330 00:19:13,440 --> 00:19:16,399 Speaker 1: who had immigrated from Poland, as someone it was safe 331 00:19:16,440 --> 00:19:20,000 Speaker 1: to be candid with, but either way, Zarnicki asked her 332 00:19:20,040 --> 00:19:23,040 Speaker 1: why she didn't come work for him, and she agreed to, 333 00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:25,720 Speaker 1: and this was before he learned that she had majored 334 00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:28,639 Speaker 1: in both math and science. We don't want to apply 335 00:19:28,760 --> 00:19:32,879 Speaker 1: that these racial disparities and who it's okay to like 336 00:19:33,119 --> 00:19:35,520 Speaker 1: vent feelings too, were like, we don't want to imply 337 00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:39,159 Speaker 1: that those disparities are gone. But that was what was 338 00:19:39,200 --> 00:19:43,120 Speaker 1: happening at the time, so Jackson really made a name 339 00:19:43,119 --> 00:19:46,720 Speaker 1: for herself almost immediately in this in this new department, 340 00:19:46,720 --> 00:19:50,280 Speaker 1: when she completed some calculations for John Becker, who was 341 00:19:50,359 --> 00:19:54,000 Speaker 1: the chief of the Compressibility Division and was multiple rungs 342 00:19:54,080 --> 00:19:59,200 Speaker 1: up the ladder above Zarnicki, Jackson's final numbers didn't look 343 00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:02,439 Speaker 1: quite right, and Becker insisted that they were wrong, but 344 00:20:02,600 --> 00:20:05,720 Speaker 1: Jackson insisted that they were right. It turned out that 345 00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:09,080 Speaker 1: Jackson had done all the calculations flawlessly, but the data 346 00:20:09,119 --> 00:20:11,399 Speaker 1: that Becker had given her to start with was wrong. 347 00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:14,679 Speaker 1: This earned her an apology and praise not only for 348 00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:18,000 Speaker 1: her skill, but also her confidence and her insight. Serniki 349 00:20:18,119 --> 00:20:22,280 Speaker 1: soon suggested Jackson joined the Engineer Training program. The n 350 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:24,800 Speaker 1: a c A had very few women engineers at all, 351 00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:29,080 Speaker 1: and no black women engineers. The engineer training program required 352 00:20:29,160 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 1: after work classes from the University of Virginia, which were 353 00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:35,600 Speaker 1: held at Hampton High School, which was still whites only, 354 00:20:36,160 --> 00:20:38,840 Speaker 1: so to take the needed courses to become an engineer, 355 00:20:39,160 --> 00:20:42,000 Speaker 1: Jackson had to get a special dispensation from the city 356 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:44,919 Speaker 1: of Hampton to allow her to take the classes that 357 00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:48,240 Speaker 1: she needed. She did, and in nineteen fifty eight, after 358 00:20:48,320 --> 00:20:51,480 Speaker 1: she finished her courses, Mary Jackson was promoted to engineer. 359 00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:55,159 Speaker 1: This made her the n a c as first black 360 00:20:55,200 --> 00:20:58,720 Speaker 1: woman engineer and possibly the first black woman working as 361 00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:03,399 Speaker 1: an aeronautical engine near anywhere in the United States. Was 362 00:21:03,440 --> 00:21:05,879 Speaker 1: a year of big changes at Langley, and we're going 363 00:21:05,920 --> 00:21:08,200 Speaker 1: to get to those after we first paused for another 364 00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:20,080 Speaker 1: sponsor break in. The n a c A and other 365 00:21:20,160 --> 00:21:24,240 Speaker 1: similar organizations were merged together into the National Aeronautics and 366 00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:28,200 Speaker 1: Space Administration, or NASA. As part of that whole process, 367 00:21:28,280 --> 00:21:30,960 Speaker 1: the West Area Computing Group, which at that point was 368 00:21:31,040 --> 00:21:35,720 Speaker 1: the last segregated department in the organization, was finally formally disbanded. 369 00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:39,280 Speaker 1: There were only nine employees of the West Computers by then, 370 00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:42,760 Speaker 1: including Dorothy Vaughn, who had been running it for seven years. 371 00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:46,360 Speaker 1: At that point, those remaining computers were moved to various 372 00:21:46,359 --> 00:21:49,280 Speaker 1: engineering groups around Langley, and Vaughan was one of the 373 00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:52,000 Speaker 1: ones who started working with the IBM computers that were 374 00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:56,560 Speaker 1: gradually making human computers obsolete. Women who had been working 375 00:21:56,600 --> 00:22:00,320 Speaker 1: with mathematical tables and mechanical calculators began working with punch 376 00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:05,760 Speaker 1: cards instead. Mathematicians were gradually replaced by data analysts, and 377 00:22:05,800 --> 00:22:08,639 Speaker 1: the teams working with the IBM computers were integrated in 378 00:22:08,760 --> 00:22:11,920 Speaker 1: terms of both race and gender, although over time more 379 00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:15,280 Speaker 1: and more of the data analysts were young men. Mary 380 00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:19,359 Speaker 1: Jackson co authored her first paper in Night as Well, 381 00:22:19,880 --> 00:22:23,600 Speaker 1: effects of nose angle and mock number on transition on 382 00:22:23,720 --> 00:22:28,120 Speaker 1: cones at supersonic speeds. She continued to work with Zarnecki 383 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:31,200 Speaker 1: at the Supersonic Pressure Tunnel. In addition to her work 384 00:22:31,240 --> 00:22:35,800 Speaker 1: as an engineer, Jackson informally mentored women and minorities, especially 385 00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:39,240 Speaker 1: the ones who were hoping to get promoted into engineering roles. 386 00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:42,280 Speaker 1: In a way, she was replicating and building on something 387 00:22:42,320 --> 00:22:45,960 Speaker 1: that had always existed at the West Computing Group. Because 388 00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:48,920 Speaker 1: they were segregated from the white staff, the West Computing 389 00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:52,280 Speaker 1: Group had developed a deep network of support and resources 390 00:22:52,320 --> 00:22:55,199 Speaker 1: among themselves. This gave them the tools to try to 391 00:22:55,280 --> 00:22:57,800 Speaker 1: mitigate some of the racial discrimination that they faced on 392 00:22:57,840 --> 00:23:00,959 Speaker 1: the job, something that black men, who were scattered across 393 00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:04,800 Speaker 1: the organization could struggle with. So as Jackson mentored people, 394 00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:08,639 Speaker 1: she tried to maintain that support network, including connecting to 395 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:11,679 Speaker 1: the former West Group computers who were now working in 396 00:23:11,720 --> 00:23:15,280 Speaker 1: other parts of the organization. As the Space race wound 397 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:19,000 Speaker 1: down and the US Aeronautics industry became less focused on 398 00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:23,240 Speaker 1: the idea of supersonic transport. Langley went through numerous re 399 00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:27,119 Speaker 1: ords and reductions in force. Jackson continued to work in 400 00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:31,000 Speaker 1: the supersonic pressure tunnel, specializing in how air behaves in 401 00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:35,520 Speaker 1: proximity to supersonic aircraft. She took classes in the programming 402 00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:37,560 Speaker 1: language for tran to be able to work with the 403 00:23:37,560 --> 00:23:41,320 Speaker 1: IBM computers as well, but eventually her career hit a 404 00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:44,840 Speaker 1: glass ceiling. Staff at Langley were paid according to the 405 00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:47,960 Speaker 1: civil service pay scale known as the GS scale, which 406 00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:51,720 Speaker 1: ranks people in pay grades from one to fifteen. Jackson 407 00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:54,080 Speaker 1: got up to GS twelve, which was the top of 408 00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:57,320 Speaker 1: the non management scale for her role. There were very 409 00:23:57,359 --> 00:24:00,840 Speaker 1: few women at Langley in grade GS thir teen or above, 410 00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:03,800 Speaker 1: and Jackson found that no matter how hard she worked, 411 00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:06,879 Speaker 1: she just could not get to that next level. In 412 00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:11,200 Speaker 1: nineteen seventy nine, Casimirez Zarnecki retired, and by that point 413 00:24:11,320 --> 00:24:14,840 Speaker 1: Jackson had written or co written twelve technical publications for 414 00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:19,200 Speaker 1: NASA and its predecessor. But rather than continuing to struggle 415 00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:22,120 Speaker 1: for another promotion that seemed like it would just never come, 416 00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:26,120 Speaker 1: she decided to change directions. A position had opened up 417 00:24:26,160 --> 00:24:29,840 Speaker 1: as Langley's Federal Women's Program Manager. This was a role 418 00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:32,160 Speaker 1: that would let Jackson focus on what she had been 419 00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:35,199 Speaker 1: doing informally as well as through the committees that she 420 00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:37,280 Speaker 1: had been on at work, and it was also a 421 00:24:37,359 --> 00:24:41,439 Speaker 1: demotion down to GS eleven, which she willingly accepted for 422 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:44,639 Speaker 1: the sake of helping other people. In one she was 423 00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:47,640 Speaker 1: offered the role of Equal Opportunity Specialist, and she went 424 00:24:47,680 --> 00:24:50,760 Speaker 1: to Washington, d C. To train for it. She spent 425 00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:53,240 Speaker 1: the last years of her career at NASA focused on 426 00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:57,680 Speaker 1: making sure women and minorities had equal opportunities. At Langley 427 00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:00,600 Speaker 1: and these roles, Jackson took a more form all approach 428 00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:02,480 Speaker 1: to the mentoring that she had been doing while she 429 00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:05,679 Speaker 1: was still an engineer. She realized that a lot of 430 00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:08,600 Speaker 1: the people who seemed like they were being overlooked for 431 00:25:08,680 --> 00:25:12,880 Speaker 1: promotions had basically the same degree and experience as their peers, 432 00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:15,840 Speaker 1: but they might be missing one particular course or one 433 00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:20,880 Speaker 1: specific skill. She started intentionally seeking out people who fit 434 00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:23,640 Speaker 1: this pattern to encourage them to go take that one 435 00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:26,359 Speaker 1: class they needed to close the gap that She paid 436 00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:28,840 Speaker 1: particular attention to women in the lower ranks of the 437 00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:32,199 Speaker 1: organization who had the right skills and background otherwise to 438 00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:35,760 Speaker 1: become an engineer. She also kept this focus outside of work, 439 00:25:35,920 --> 00:25:39,120 Speaker 1: working as a Girl Scout leader and doing extensive lecturing 440 00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:42,840 Speaker 1: and workshops at high schools in her area, demonstrating for 441 00:25:42,920 --> 00:25:46,520 Speaker 1: students that neither engineering nor Langley was a world reserved 442 00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:49,280 Speaker 1: only for white men. She said of this work quote, 443 00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:51,920 Speaker 1: sometimes they are not aware of the number of black 444 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:55,600 Speaker 1: scientists and don't even know of the career opportunities until 445 00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:59,760 Speaker 1: it is too late. Jackson retired from Langley in She 446 00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:03,480 Speaker 1: aped up her volunteer community and church work after retiring, 447 00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:06,639 Speaker 1: and she died on February eleventh, two thousand five, at 448 00:26:06,640 --> 00:26:09,680 Speaker 1: the age of eighty three. She died in a retirement 449 00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:12,800 Speaker 1: home in Hampton, Virginia, and was survived by her children, 450 00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:16,560 Speaker 1: as well as grandchildren and great grandchildren. In the Salt 451 00:26:16,640 --> 00:26:20,600 Speaker 1: Lake City Board of Education unanimously voted that Jackson Elementary 452 00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:24,480 Speaker 1: School in Salt Lake City, previously named for President Andrew Jackson, 453 00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:29,080 Speaker 1: would be renamed Mary W. Jackson Elementary School. That same year, 454 00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:32,280 Speaker 1: the U. S. Senate passed the Hidden Figures Congressional Gold 455 00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:35,600 Speaker 1: Medal Act, which would award the Congressional Gold Medal to 456 00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:39,639 Speaker 1: Katherine Johnson, Dorothy Vaughn Mary Jackson, and Dr Christine Darden. 457 00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:42,639 Speaker 1: Darden was the first black person of any gender to 458 00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:46,439 Speaker 1: be promoted to the senior executive service at Langley. The 459 00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:49,960 Speaker 1: House referred the bill to a committee in November of eighteen. 460 00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:52,200 Speaker 1: As of when we are recording this, which is the 461 00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:55,520 Speaker 1: end of January nineteen, there have not been further updates 462 00:26:55,760 --> 00:27:01,280 Speaker 1: on it, perhaps unsurprisingly given what January was like in 463 00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:06,960 Speaker 1: the government. That is true. Uh, oh, Mary, I love 464 00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:09,480 Speaker 1: her so much. I do too. If you want to 465 00:27:09,560 --> 00:27:13,200 Speaker 1: learn um more about the computers and more about like 466 00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:15,800 Speaker 1: life at Langley during all this time, really do go 467 00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:20,000 Speaker 1: read Hidden Figures. You can also, if you like, go 468 00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:23,800 Speaker 1: amuse yourself by reading the one star reviews of the 469 00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:27,400 Speaker 1: book Hidden Figures by people who clearly thought they were 470 00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:36,160 Speaker 1: signing up to read a novel. Oh well, yeah, these 471 00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:39,720 Speaker 1: things like this book introduces ten new characters in a 472 00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:42,280 Speaker 1: paragraph and then just never follows up on them. Agin, 473 00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:47,399 Speaker 1: I was weren't characters, honey, they were people, people with 474 00:27:47,560 --> 00:27:52,680 Speaker 1: their hearts. Um, do you have listener mail for us? 475 00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:56,160 Speaker 1: But do I have a couple of pieces of listener mail? Uh? 476 00:27:56,359 --> 00:28:00,960 Speaker 1: They are about um sa shrewda So just a heads up, 477 00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:03,000 Speaker 1: we're gonna talk a little bit about surgery. We heard 478 00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,040 Speaker 1: from a couple of people that they did not enjoy 479 00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:08,760 Speaker 1: hearing the descriptions of surgery in that episode. The first 480 00:28:08,800 --> 00:28:11,359 Speaker 1: thing is a quick correction that came in from Dave. 481 00:28:11,840 --> 00:28:13,840 Speaker 1: Dave pointed out that we talked about one of the 482 00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:17,360 Speaker 1: reasons people might have needed a nose reconstruction was because 483 00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:21,760 Speaker 1: of late stage syphilis, and how as he understood it, 484 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,320 Speaker 1: when Sashruda was doing his writing and teaching, that would 485 00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:28,200 Speaker 1: not have been an issue in India. It is true 486 00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:31,439 Speaker 1: that the most mainstream idea about how syphilis spread to 487 00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:34,520 Speaker 1: Europe and then beyond is that it came back from 488 00:28:34,520 --> 00:28:39,280 Speaker 1: the America's with Christopher Columbus's expeditions, after there was, you know, 489 00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:44,200 Speaker 1: transit between Europe and North America. That has been the 490 00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:48,560 Speaker 1: very long standing um assumption we've I think we've had 491 00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:51,480 Speaker 1: a couple things on Unearthed that suggests it might not 492 00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:56,040 Speaker 1: have worked quite that way. But yes, I conflated two 493 00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:58,840 Speaker 1: different pieces of material to get something that did not 494 00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:02,959 Speaker 1: make a lot of ants um. By the time the 495 00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:07,040 Speaker 1: British were writing down things about this whole nose reconstruction, 496 00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:09,880 Speaker 1: they were witnessing. At that point, there would have been 497 00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:12,920 Speaker 1: people that might have tried to have their nose reconstructed 498 00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:17,080 Speaker 1: because of having late stage syphilis, but um that would 499 00:29:17,120 --> 00:29:20,440 Speaker 1: not likely have been the case based on when Sastruda 500 00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:24,520 Speaker 1: was writing. We also have something from Marcelo. I hope 501 00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:28,000 Speaker 1: I am pronouncing your name correctly. This email says, dear 502 00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:31,880 Speaker 1: esteemed s y M Historians. I am a longtime fan, 503 00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:35,080 Speaker 1: first time caller who happens to be a facial plastic 504 00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:39,800 Speaker 1: surgeon in Brazil specialized in nasal reconstruction. I loved your 505 00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:42,800 Speaker 1: most recent episode on Struda and i ur Veda, which 506 00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:45,560 Speaker 1: most of us read at some point during our residency training, 507 00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:47,800 Speaker 1: as I usually love all your episodes. Here are a 508 00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:51,040 Speaker 1: few answers to your questions. We still use the so 509 00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:55,120 Speaker 1: called Indian forehead flap as what can be easily called 510 00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:59,360 Speaker 1: the workhorse of our nasal reconstructions, except as a bit 511 00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:03,480 Speaker 1: modified from its original central position into what's more scientifically 512 00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:08,240 Speaker 1: termed a Paramedian forehead flap. It's most important advantage over 513 00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:11,920 Speaker 1: the cheek advancement flap allegedly practiced by Shahruda, or even 514 00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:16,080 Speaker 1: the forearm peticled flap practiced by the bolognaise is that 515 00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:20,080 Speaker 1: it's petticle is based on an arterial blood supply i e. 516 00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:24,640 Speaker 1: The supertri clear artery, which ensures a markedly diminished chance 517 00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:28,320 Speaker 1: of tissue necrosis of the most distal portion of the flap. Furthermore, 518 00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:31,080 Speaker 1: that bears the advantage of being more versatile, allowing for 519 00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:34,040 Speaker 1: much better contouring of finer structures of the nasal tip 520 00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:37,520 Speaker 1: that allows for the semblance of a natural nose, mostly 521 00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:40,240 Speaker 1: because of the availability of more tissue from the forehead 522 00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:42,880 Speaker 1: and or scalp that can be harvested without performing the 523 00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:46,280 Speaker 1: nearby facial structures like the eye, and because of that 524 00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:50,280 Speaker 1: arterially based guaranteed of blood supply. As a rule of thumb, 525 00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:52,760 Speaker 1: the longer a flap is, the less blood is supplied 526 00:30:52,760 --> 00:30:55,800 Speaker 1: to its most distal regions. With an arterial blood supply 527 00:30:55,840 --> 00:30:58,320 Speaker 1: embedded into the peticle flap, there is much more range 528 00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:01,200 Speaker 1: of blood supply to these distal read However, we do 529 00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:04,240 Speaker 1: still use cheek advancement flaps for certain defects in the nose, 530 00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:07,560 Speaker 1: mostly to the nasal side walls, and some smaller defects 531 00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:11,120 Speaker 1: on the nasal dorsom. The Italian flap obviously offers the 532 00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:14,280 Speaker 1: advantage of less scars on the face, but because such 533 00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:17,120 Speaker 1: scars can be so well managed, it offers no extra 534 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:20,720 Speaker 1: advantage over locally based pedicled flaps, so you'd be hard 535 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:24,640 Speaker 1: pressed to find any surgeon using that technique today. There 536 00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:27,680 Speaker 1: are other flaps as well, none is frequently used, the 537 00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:31,000 Speaker 1: more more dependable than the modified Indian forehead flap. Keep 538 00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:33,040 Speaker 1: up the great work and thanks for all historical knowledge. 539 00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:35,560 Speaker 1: I hope you two have a great trip. Cheers. Thank 540 00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:37,880 Speaker 1: you so much for this email. We have gotten several 541 00:31:37,960 --> 00:31:41,640 Speaker 1: emails answering a number of questions from the Sashruda episode, 542 00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:44,320 Speaker 1: and this one is a little longer, so we might 543 00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:46,640 Speaker 1: read other ones in a future episode. I had to say, 544 00:31:46,680 --> 00:31:48,840 Speaker 1: I was very delighted at how many surgeons were like, 545 00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:51,120 Speaker 1: I can help you with this. We did. We have 546 00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:54,560 Speaker 1: gotten a lot of emails from surgeons. I'm glad so 547 00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:58,360 Speaker 1: many surgeons are listening to and enjoying the show. I'm 548 00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:02,520 Speaker 1: glad I remember pretty much all of that medical terminology 549 00:32:02,600 --> 00:32:05,560 Speaker 1: that I just read from the time I took anatomy 550 00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:08,600 Speaker 1: and physiology, which just feels like a feat giving how 551 00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:12,440 Speaker 1: much knowledge my brain just Jettison's in our work podcast 552 00:32:12,520 --> 00:32:14,960 Speaker 1: on the daily I lose. I always feel bad when 553 00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:17,240 Speaker 1: someone asked me something about a show and I don't 554 00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:20,280 Speaker 1: even remember doing the show at all. Yeah, they'll be like, oh, 555 00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:22,600 Speaker 1: did you ever think about And I'm like, I know, 556 00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:25,760 Speaker 1: I don't even know. I did I ever think about that? Ever? 557 00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:27,200 Speaker 1: I don't know. I'll be like, yes, you did it, 558 00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:30,080 Speaker 1: and I feel very bad. My apologies if you ever 559 00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:34,480 Speaker 1: talk to me and I don't know what. I don't 560 00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:37,560 Speaker 1: remember which topic it was. But as I was wrapping 561 00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:40,760 Speaker 1: up my time hosting This Day in History Class, I 562 00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:44,240 Speaker 1: was looking for the outline for a stuff you missed 563 00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:47,719 Speaker 1: in History Class episode that like that thing was that 564 00:32:47,840 --> 00:32:50,000 Speaker 1: day in History and I couldn't find it on my 565 00:32:50,040 --> 00:32:52,280 Speaker 1: computer and I couldn't figure out why. And I was like, 566 00:32:52,280 --> 00:32:54,640 Speaker 1: but I wrote this, why don't I have it? I 567 00:32:54,680 --> 00:33:00,440 Speaker 1: didn't write it, You wrote it. I got it fused 568 00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:03,200 Speaker 1: with a totally different topic that I did, right, been 569 00:33:03,280 --> 00:33:06,440 Speaker 1: there anyway, That's how our brains work. Everyone, after years 570 00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:12,040 Speaker 1: and years, you can't remember all the details of every show. Nope, nope. 571 00:33:12,800 --> 00:33:15,000 Speaker 1: But if you remember details of shows, if you would 572 00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:16,800 Speaker 1: like to write us an email about them, We're at 573 00:33:16,920 --> 00:33:19,760 Speaker 1: History Podcast how stuff Works dot com. And then we're 574 00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:22,600 Speaker 1: all over social media at missed in History. That's where 575 00:33:22,600 --> 00:33:24,960 Speaker 1: you'll find our Facebook and our Pinterest, in our Instagram 576 00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:27,560 Speaker 1: and our Twitter. You can come to our website, which 577 00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:29,680 Speaker 1: is missed in History dot com. You can find the 578 00:33:29,680 --> 00:33:31,560 Speaker 1: show notes for all the episodes Holly and I haven't 579 00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:36,280 Speaker 1: worked on. You can find uh searchable archive every episode ever, 580 00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:38,880 Speaker 1: and you can find information about our trip to Paris 581 00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:41,840 Speaker 1: coming up in June. And you can subscribe to our 582 00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:45,360 Speaker 1: show on Apple podcast, the I Heart Radio app in 583 00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:53,040 Speaker 1: anywhere else you get your podcasts. For more on this 584 00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:55,720 Speaker 1: and thousands of other topics, is it how stuff Works 585 00:33:55,720 --> 00:34:02,080 Speaker 1: dot com