WEBVTT - Listener Questions 0:00:03.920 --> 0:00:07.480 Every bit of evidence has been gathered, what on the 0:00:07.560 --> 0:00:10.280 off chance that it has not, and that could be 0:00:10.320 --> 0:00:13.880 the one piece that seals the fate of the case. 0:00:14.000 --> 0:00:18.880 Either way, the big stunner of this case is that 0:00:19.079 --> 0:00:22.960 these weren't people that necessarily even interface, not even once. 0:00:29.840 --> 0:00:33.360 This is the Idaho Massacre, a production of KAT Studios 0:00:33.520 --> 0:00:43.640 and iHeartRadio, Season two, Episode twelve, Listener Questions. I'm Courtney Armstrong, 0:00:43.680 --> 0:00:47.960 a producer at KAT Studios with Stephanie Leidecker and Gabe Castillo, 0:00:48.000 --> 0:00:52.279 who you'll hear reading the questions. We wanted to take 0:00:52.280 --> 0:00:55.280 this opportunity to answer some of the listener questions that 0:00:55.320 --> 0:00:57.400 have come in over the course of the season, and 0:00:57.440 --> 0:00:59.560 also to have a couple of listeners who were able 0:00:59.600 --> 0:01:01.560 to make the time on the show so we can 0:01:01.600 --> 0:01:04.680 speak with them. We're starting it off. 0:01:04.560 --> 0:01:05.959 With page from Hobooken. 0:01:09.920 --> 0:01:12.640 First, Stephanie high paid. 0:01:13.200 --> 0:01:16.360 Hi. So my question is why you think the nine 0:01:16.400 --> 0:01:18.360 one one call hasn't been released yet. 0:01:19.040 --> 0:01:22.959 There can be a multitude of things at play, for example, 0:01:23.000 --> 0:01:25.400 and Stephanie and I were talking about just this very 0:01:25.440 --> 0:01:29.480 thing recently. And in another case we covered, which is 0:01:29.480 --> 0:01:33.240 another high profile mass murder, the Pike did Masaker, which 0:01:33.280 --> 0:01:36.160 is our other podcast. The nine one one call was 0:01:36.240 --> 0:01:41.440 indeed released well before trial, well before the accused were known, 0:01:41.680 --> 0:01:44.600 so that's something that can happen in this case. Obviously, 0:01:44.640 --> 0:01:47.080 the nine on one call has not been released. There 0:01:47.120 --> 0:01:50.680 have been articles people quoting that the prosecution will release 0:01:50.680 --> 0:01:53.520 it quote when it's time, which means we may need 0:01:53.560 --> 0:01:56.480 to wait until the actual trial to hear the nine 0:01:56.480 --> 0:01:57.240 on one call. 0:01:57.480 --> 0:02:00.680 Which is also interesting because I think this particular gular call, 0:02:01.080 --> 0:02:05.240 maybe unlike other calls from other cases, does speak a 0:02:05.280 --> 0:02:08.720 lot to the circumstances of how the bodies were found 0:02:08.760 --> 0:02:11.440 and discovered. You know, there's been a couple of very 0:02:11.440 --> 0:02:17.359 big questions about this timeline. One exactly who discovered the bodies. 0:02:17.840 --> 0:02:21.600 We know that the bodies were discovered hours later, and 0:02:22.440 --> 0:02:24.400 who that person was. All we know it to be 0:02:24.520 --> 0:02:27.880 is a friend of Ethan's. From my understanding, I would 0:02:27.880 --> 0:02:30.000 imagine if we hear their voice on the nine to 0:02:30.000 --> 0:02:32.960 one one call, that would no longer be anonymous. And 0:02:33.000 --> 0:02:36.639 they've been very tight lipped about releasing the information of 0:02:36.840 --> 0:02:40.320 the nine one one call and also the surrounding roommates, right, 0:02:40.440 --> 0:02:43.639 you could imagine that it must have been Mayhem when 0:02:43.760 --> 0:02:47.880 they make this grizzly discovery. We've heard nine one one calls, 0:02:48.000 --> 0:02:52.680 then there's nothing more harrowing or horrifying than hearing that 0:02:52.760 --> 0:02:55.080 guttural sound. But we don't know. 0:02:55.560 --> 0:02:58.200 Yeah, And just to add to that, within the cloud 0:02:58.240 --> 0:03:01.440 of sort of confusion that Stephanie was speaking about, should 0:03:01.480 --> 0:03:03.560 we believe and there's no reason not to. The timeline 0:03:03.600 --> 0:03:07.679 of the murders, which places that happening between approximately four 0:03:07.680 --> 0:03:10.480 am and four twenty am. The nine to one one 0:03:10.480 --> 0:03:14.200 call was not placed until just a few moments before noon, 0:03:14.560 --> 0:03:17.720 so that's eight hours later. And as Stephanie said, it's 0:03:17.760 --> 0:03:22.520 not clear precisely who necessarily made the call, but we 0:03:22.560 --> 0:03:26.200 know the call came from one of the surviving roommate's 0:03:26.280 --> 0:03:29.480 cell phones, but it was not them who was initially 0:03:29.960 --> 0:03:34.000 making connection with nine one one. It was initially reported 0:03:34.240 --> 0:03:39.920 as an unconscious person or person's which seemed ought for 0:03:40.120 --> 0:03:43.400 what was ultimately found. And it turns out that that 0:03:43.600 --> 0:03:47.280 was actually the categorization that that nine one one call 0:03:47.400 --> 0:03:51.760 center used to let police know this is in the 0:03:51.800 --> 0:03:56.880 realm of someone unconscious versus say a fire or something else. 0:03:56.920 --> 0:03:59.160 So it was a nine one one designation. 0:03:59.360 --> 0:04:01.840 Which is such a really interesting point and page. It's 0:04:01.840 --> 0:04:04.840 such a good question because it's such an unknowable thing, right, 0:04:04.880 --> 0:04:07.320 But that particular nine to one one call would answer 0:04:07.400 --> 0:04:11.119 so many questions. It would answer the who, the how, 0:04:11.600 --> 0:04:14.119 the state of affairs at that time. 0:04:14.560 --> 0:04:17.119 Anything else you want to say, ask or wonder about. 0:04:17.880 --> 0:04:21.440 There was speculation that the fraternity across the street, the 0:04:21.520 --> 0:04:24.440 two roommates went there and had some of the guys 0:04:24.680 --> 0:04:27.160 go around the house to make sure that no one 0:04:27.240 --> 0:04:29.440 was there, which I think might be another thing, Like 0:04:29.480 --> 0:04:31.480 I think there was a lot of foot traffic in 0:04:31.520 --> 0:04:33.080 the house before they called the police. 0:04:33.600 --> 0:04:34.640 That's really interesting. 0:04:34.800 --> 0:04:37.120 I have seen that as well, and I think it's 0:04:37.160 --> 0:04:40.120 another thing that will come to bear. One thing that's 0:04:40.160 --> 0:04:43.400 been reported is that there will quote multiple voices on 0:04:43.440 --> 0:04:48.000 the nine one one call. So who exactly all of 0:04:48.080 --> 0:04:51.000 those voices are we don't yet know, but soon to 0:04:51.040 --> 0:04:51.479 find out. 0:04:51.960 --> 0:04:55.560 Thank you, Thank you for coming on, of course, have 0:04:55.720 --> 0:04:57.800 a good night, guys, Bye bye. 0:05:05.279 --> 0:05:08.520 In a previous episode, it was mentioned that one of 0:05:08.560 --> 0:05:12.279 the journalists had gone down to Moscow, Idaho, and noted 0:05:12.320 --> 0:05:14.640 that in and around the area they noticed a lot 0:05:14.680 --> 0:05:17.520 of ring cameras in the neighborhood and from what we 0:05:17.640 --> 0:05:20.359 know there has been footage that was released from a 0:05:20.440 --> 0:05:23.599 ring camera, So my question is, do you think police 0:05:23.680 --> 0:05:26.720 have a lot more information than what has been released? 0:05:27.240 --> 0:05:29.240 Is this why we have yet to see the first 0:05:29.320 --> 0:05:30.280 day of trial? 0:05:30.839 --> 0:05:34.719 Multilayered question, Do I think there's more we haven't seen? 0:05:35.640 --> 0:05:39.200 I would bet any amount of money in the world 0:05:39.240 --> 0:05:43.559 that there is. Do I bet that investigators on every 0:05:43.640 --> 0:05:49.359 level canvassed the neighborhood and procured every piece of evidence 0:05:49.520 --> 0:05:53.480 possible at the time. Absolutely, I do. Is that part 0:05:53.720 --> 0:05:56.719 of the delay and trial? I mean, it's interesting and 0:05:56.760 --> 0:05:59.040 I don't have this stat at the tip of my tongue, 0:05:59.040 --> 0:06:02.880 but I know we have to it before the enormity 0:06:03.560 --> 0:06:08.480 of digital and other evidence that has been gathered that 0:06:08.720 --> 0:06:13.520 has to be gone through by the prosecution, by investigators, 0:06:13.720 --> 0:06:16.719 and then when hands it over by the defense as well. 0:06:17.040 --> 0:06:19.799 So I think that's part of it. Also, of course, 0:06:19.839 --> 0:06:23.840 being a death penalty case that, as we've discussed, you know, 0:06:23.960 --> 0:06:26.840 exacerbates a timeline because there's so many things that need 0:06:26.880 --> 0:06:30.600 to be done correctly. But my knee jerk too, is 0:06:30.600 --> 0:06:33.159 there more evidence from ring cameras we don't know about? 0:06:33.440 --> 0:06:34.080 Absolutely? 0:06:34.960 --> 0:06:38.400 I would really really hope so, because so much of 0:06:38.440 --> 0:06:41.479 the evidence that we've been unpacking and has been set 0:06:41.480 --> 0:06:45.280 into the public or the media, you know, really has 0:06:45.360 --> 0:06:48.200 some circumstantial sides to it. So I would have to 0:06:48.240 --> 0:06:51.640 imagine that there is a larger footprint from a technology 0:06:51.880 --> 0:06:55.600 standpoint that frankly, we're just not aware of. It's amazing 0:06:55.640 --> 0:06:58.480 that you can get away with any crime in today's 0:06:58.520 --> 0:07:01.040 day and age, with the level of cameras and cell 0:07:01.080 --> 0:07:04.400 phones and things that are tracking us real time. It's 0:07:04.440 --> 0:07:07.320 actually pretty astounding that there was such a blind spot 0:07:07.440 --> 0:07:09.840 if in fact there was, so I would assume that 0:07:09.880 --> 0:07:12.240 we don't know this. But on the other side of that, 0:07:12.440 --> 0:07:15.960 we have interviewed defense attorneys that would say, look, if 0:07:16.000 --> 0:07:19.320 there was a ton of great information, they would be 0:07:19.400 --> 0:07:22.400 yelling that from the rooftops and that would be front 0:07:22.400 --> 0:07:25.120 page news, and we would be unpacking the fact that 0:07:25.160 --> 0:07:28.440 there's a ring camera that has footage of someone else 0:07:28.560 --> 0:07:32.640 other than the accused, Brian Coburger, walking into this murder house. 0:07:33.040 --> 0:07:35.280 If that was the case, I think we would really 0:07:35.320 --> 0:07:38.200 know about it. So, on the one hand, I completely 0:07:38.200 --> 0:07:41.480 agree with you, Courtney, and on the other no, no, 0:07:41.760 --> 0:07:43.440 some of this feels like a little bit of a 0:07:43.480 --> 0:07:44.160 house of cards. 0:07:44.840 --> 0:07:47.560 That's a fair point because now that you say that, 0:07:47.880 --> 0:07:51.360 thinking about the fact that even the identification of the 0:07:51.520 --> 0:07:55.440 car took three times for the FBI, and this is 0:07:55.440 --> 0:07:57.160 no dig on them, but it took three times to 0:07:57.720 --> 0:08:02.680 publicly get it correct what the carr was, assuming, of course, 0:08:03.160 --> 0:08:05.920 the accused is whose car that we should. 0:08:05.640 --> 0:08:06.160 Be looking for. 0:08:06.560 --> 0:08:08.720 And by the way, we don't even have an actual 0:08:08.800 --> 0:08:13.160 idea of the person driving that car. So yes, he 0:08:13.320 --> 0:08:15.680 was driving a white Lantra, and yes it was in 0:08:15.720 --> 0:08:18.280 and around the area, and yes that is wildly suspicious, 0:08:18.280 --> 0:08:21.960 no question. But where's the visual of him actually behind 0:08:21.960 --> 0:08:24.720 the wheel? I have to assume that exists, or that 0:08:24.800 --> 0:08:27.800 there is some way to get around the fact that 0:08:28.240 --> 0:08:29.160 it doesn't appear that we. 0:08:29.200 --> 0:08:30.840 Have that it doesn't. 0:08:30.880 --> 0:08:34.280 I mean, it certainly hasn't been public that or any 0:08:34.440 --> 0:08:38.440 glimpse to the public's knowledge of a license plate. 0:08:38.640 --> 0:08:42.400 So I don't know. Maybe my bet all the money 0:08:42.440 --> 0:08:45.280 in the world was a little a little quick on 0:08:45.320 --> 0:08:47.040 the trigger to that end. 0:08:47.880 --> 0:08:50.800 So let's unpack a little of that, because there do 0:08:51.000 --> 0:08:53.960 seem to be these big ticket items that gets discussed 0:08:53.960 --> 0:08:56.240 in the press, and we certainly have discussed this here 0:08:56.320 --> 0:08:58.960 as well, Like these big items that make. 0:08:58.840 --> 0:09:03.240 It this no question, This is the guy, there's DNA, 0:09:03.760 --> 0:09:07.600 and there's this car, and he was acting fishy and 0:09:07.800 --> 0:09:11.680 bushy eyebrows and and and by the way, it does 0:09:11.920 --> 0:09:15.200 all sort of seem like a pretty bad day and 0:09:15.280 --> 0:09:18.800 a pretty bad morning and a pretty bad stretch frankly 0:09:19.240 --> 0:09:22.160 of a lot of terrible things that had to happen 0:09:22.320 --> 0:09:26.040 in the worst of timing for this accused Brian Coburger 0:09:26.160 --> 0:09:29.600 to ultimately be accused of this crime. And then when 0:09:29.679 --> 0:09:32.080 you take a step back, there are a lot of 0:09:32.120 --> 0:09:34.840 these touch points that are like, what are the odds 0:09:34.880 --> 0:09:35.640 of that happening? 0:09:35.840 --> 0:09:39.040 Number one? Having all of these images of this car 0:09:39.120 --> 0:09:41.679 in and around the area, but no actual idea of 0:09:41.679 --> 0:09:44.240 who's driving it or the license plate. I feel like 0:09:44.320 --> 0:09:46.560 if I roll through a red light, not that I 0:09:46.600 --> 0:09:49.080 ever have, I guarantee you that there's a ticket in 0:09:49.120 --> 0:09:52.559 my mailbox waiting for me somehow. So big brother is 0:09:52.640 --> 0:09:56.240 watching just not that morning, and then we talk about 0:09:56.400 --> 0:10:00.280 this bushy eyebrow id but like, really, is is that. 0:10:00.280 --> 0:10:00.880 The big thing? 0:10:09.720 --> 0:10:13.160 So a question we did get speaking of all the 0:10:13.320 --> 0:10:18.520 quote coincidences had to do with a shooting that happened 0:10:18.559 --> 0:10:23.400 on the morning that Brian Coberger and his father departed 0:10:23.559 --> 0:10:27.600 Washington to head on their cross country drive to Pennsylvania. 0:10:27.920 --> 0:10:32.000 And the question comes from Amy from Warwick, Rhode Island. 0:10:32.520 --> 0:10:35.480 Is there a connection between the swat shooting of Brent 0:10:35.600 --> 0:10:39.000 Kopaka related to the Idaho massacre. 0:10:40.000 --> 0:10:43.360 I mean, it doesn't appear that there is, and we 0:10:43.480 --> 0:10:46.800 have gone down this rabbit hole. It is shocking to 0:10:46.840 --> 0:10:51.079 me that something that is violent, like holding somebody hostage, 0:10:51.600 --> 0:10:55.600 let alone holding your roommate hostage, happening in and around 0:10:55.640 --> 0:10:58.720 the time of these violent murders. But again, it does 0:10:58.760 --> 0:11:01.240 seem as though that may have just been a coincidence. 0:11:01.760 --> 0:11:06.320 It does, and for listeners who aren't aware, this incident 0:11:06.400 --> 0:11:09.800 happened on December fifteenth, twenty twenty two, so it was 0:11:09.840 --> 0:11:14.240 about one month after the November thirteenth murders. A man 0:11:14.360 --> 0:11:20.120 named Brent Kopaka was ultimately shot by Washington State Police 0:11:20.360 --> 0:11:25.120 in Pullman, Washington, where the accused Brian Coburger lived, and 0:11:25.120 --> 0:11:28.800 that's where people burned up the connection. Officers were alerted 0:11:28.800 --> 0:11:31.880 that Kopaka was allegedly threatening the lives of his roommates. 0:11:32.320 --> 0:11:36.280 There was a standoff, and according to reports, there were 0:11:36.360 --> 0:11:42.600 unsuccessful negotiations, there was escalating behavior that ultimately ended in 0:11:43.000 --> 0:11:50.120 the swat team killing Kopaka. This happened to happen on 0:11:50.240 --> 0:11:54.040 that same morning of the drive, and in fact, when 0:11:54.040 --> 0:11:58.960 the Coburger men were pulled over, Brian Coberger's father mentioned 0:11:59.000 --> 0:12:01.520 the incident. Can hear it on the audio to one 0:12:01.600 --> 0:12:03.800 of the officers. 0:12:03.840 --> 0:12:07.880 Can you imagine? I can't. Can you imagine that you're 0:12:07.960 --> 0:12:11.080 this father, You're getting pulled over and you're basically saying, wow, 0:12:11.440 --> 0:12:14.040 I feel for you. Officers. A lot going on back there. 0:12:14.280 --> 0:12:17.640 You're in a white a Landra and you're allegedly driving 0:12:17.679 --> 0:12:22.080 the accused to be. But the police just happened to 0:12:22.120 --> 0:12:26.800 pull the Coburger father son duo in this white car 0:12:27.000 --> 0:12:29.880 driving across country. What are the odds that they get 0:12:29.880 --> 0:12:33.720 pulled over two different times? That's been reported about so 0:12:33.800 --> 0:12:37.959 many different ways here included. We were under the impression 0:12:38.000 --> 0:12:41.280 because that's what we were told. We had early reported 0:12:41.320 --> 0:12:45.280 that that was a very choreographed event that Brian Coberg 0:12:45.720 --> 0:12:48.400 was being pulled over because the police were looking to 0:12:48.440 --> 0:12:51.640 see if he had slashes on his hand, And now 0:12:51.679 --> 0:12:53.480 we're hearing that that might not have been the case, 0:12:53.520 --> 0:12:57.160 that it was just a really bad day behind the wheel. 0:12:57.920 --> 0:13:00.720 It seems like it really was artis this is to 0:13:00.760 --> 0:13:06.160 swallow coincidence. It has since come to bear and hold on. 0:13:06.480 --> 0:13:11.400 I have actually from the report here. The FBI has 0:13:11.520 --> 0:13:15.360 maintained its agents were not involved in the stops, and 0:13:15.840 --> 0:13:21.040 also the Sheriff's office in Indiana, who actually did the stops, 0:13:21.520 --> 0:13:24.640 also have said publicly that this had nothing to do 0:13:24.720 --> 0:13:29.680 with the murders whatsoever. It was a separate drug interdiction check. Yes, 0:13:29.760 --> 0:13:32.520 it's been confirmed by both the agencies that the FBI 0:13:33.080 --> 0:13:34.920 did not call for those stops. 0:13:35.280 --> 0:13:37.480 They did not know what was going to happen. It 0:13:37.559 --> 0:13:40.559 was literally coincidence. 0:13:40.800 --> 0:13:43.920 And it was coincidence that on the same day that 0:13:44.480 --> 0:13:49.040 Dad and son depart on their cross country escapade of 0:13:49.080 --> 0:13:52.160 a trip, that there is also a hostage situation that 0:13:52.280 --> 0:13:58.440 a nearby neighbor is shot down by authorities because he's 0:13:58.480 --> 0:14:02.920 holding his roommate hostage, was suffering from mental illness, and 0:14:03.480 --> 0:14:05.960 has many many layers to this story. 0:14:06.000 --> 0:14:09.920 All officials have said there is no connection, and in fact, 0:14:10.400 --> 0:14:13.800 this is a really it's a good example of a 0:14:13.920 --> 0:14:19.240 horrible thing which is when people do make connections because 0:14:19.280 --> 0:14:24.040 of circumstance or because of coincidence when indeed there isn't 0:14:24.720 --> 0:14:28.560 And actually Coopaka's family has spoken out, as have his 0:14:28.800 --> 0:14:32.480 good friends, you know, saying that the speculation of his 0:14:32.560 --> 0:14:36.440 involvement with the murders has marred his name. 0:14:37.160 --> 0:14:40.200 And he was a vet, he earned a purple heart. 0:14:40.560 --> 0:14:43.640 And it's just a tragedy in and of itself, and 0:14:43.800 --> 0:14:46.640 it's a further tragedy of what can happen when people 0:14:46.680 --> 0:14:49.920 are linked, whether in the news or via social media, 0:14:50.120 --> 0:14:51.960 without factual merit. 0:14:54.200 --> 0:14:56.800 Let's stop here for a break. We'll be back in 0:14:56.840 --> 0:14:57.200 a moment. 0:15:05.160 --> 0:15:09.200 This is from Marcella via Instagram. Do you think if 0:15:09.240 --> 0:15:11.680 Brian had left his phone at home he would have 0:15:11.720 --> 0:15:15.400 been arrested? Could the DNA and surveillance of his vehicle 0:15:15.560 --> 0:15:16.320 have been enough? 0:15:17.040 --> 0:15:18.840 Court, you got to take this one. This is a 0:15:18.880 --> 0:15:21.560 rabbit hole that I may never get out of. It's 0:15:21.640 --> 0:15:23.760 an excellent question, and it's. 0:15:23.640 --> 0:15:27.560 A much debated question, and it's ultimately an opinion. Right, 0:15:27.800 --> 0:15:31.280 So the DNA, and this is just my opinion. The 0:15:31.400 --> 0:15:36.080 DNA is what tied Coberger to this investigation by his 0:15:36.200 --> 0:15:40.000 name through his father. Once the DNA on the knife 0:15:40.000 --> 0:15:45.240 sheath was found, and according to court documents, Coburger's DNA 0:15:45.400 --> 0:15:49.360 is at least five point three seven octillion times more 0:15:49.440 --> 0:15:52.080 likely to match DNA found at the scene than a 0:15:52.120 --> 0:15:56.000 person unrelated to Coburger's father. So those are pretty strong 0:15:56.040 --> 0:15:57.720 odds to overcome. 0:15:58.440 --> 0:16:00.520 Those numbers are shocking, of course, and we read that 0:16:00.600 --> 0:16:02.440 for the first time it was like, Oh, I guess 0:16:02.440 --> 0:16:06.640 this guy did it. However, listen, some of this stuff 0:16:06.640 --> 0:16:08.880 can be explained away. I know we covered this at 0:16:08.880 --> 0:16:13.000 some point this season, But imagine that you're a knife 0:16:13.120 --> 0:16:15.840 enthusiast when you go to these like a convention for 0:16:16.880 --> 0:16:21.080 people who are fishermen and hunters, and there's a lot 0:16:21.080 --> 0:16:24.040 of knives for sale there, and they're on display, and 0:16:24.200 --> 0:16:27.920 you might be looking at the various knives for purchase, 0:16:28.000 --> 0:16:30.000 and yeah, you want to pick it up, maybe handle 0:16:30.040 --> 0:16:33.440 it a little bit, and in doing so, hey, guess what, 0:16:33.680 --> 0:16:36.360 It's possible that a droplet of your DNA is now 0:16:36.640 --> 0:16:39.840 under the sheath of that knife. And now you put 0:16:39.840 --> 0:16:43.480 it back down, and this person goes about their merry way, 0:16:43.600 --> 0:16:48.240 and that knife eventually gets sold to someone and it 0:16:48.720 --> 0:16:53.000 winds up at a murder scene. That could be the connection. 0:16:53.160 --> 0:16:56.520 It's such a small amount on the other side of it. 0:16:56.640 --> 0:16:59.600 That is no question that the DNA that is found 0:16:59.760 --> 0:17:03.880 on that she is connected to the accused Brian Coburger. 0:17:04.000 --> 0:17:04.960 That's pretty damning. 0:17:05.640 --> 0:17:07.840 I mean, listen, I think these are all points that 0:17:08.000 --> 0:17:10.680 will be brought up by the defense if I had 0:17:10.720 --> 0:17:12.360 to guess, because you. 0:17:12.320 --> 0:17:13.359 Know they are valid. 0:17:13.520 --> 0:17:17.960 But yeah, just to simply answer your question, Marcella, yeah, 0:17:17.960 --> 0:17:21.359 I do. I do think that and the surveillance of 0:17:21.400 --> 0:17:24.520 his vehicle would have been enough. Because the last thing 0:17:24.560 --> 0:17:26.920 I will say on this, because you said, you know 0:17:26.960 --> 0:17:29.920 what if we took the cell phone pings out of it, 0:17:30.400 --> 0:17:34.280 keep in mind that during the time of the murders, 0:17:34.320 --> 0:17:39.359 as we understand it, there was no reporting to the 0:17:39.400 --> 0:17:43.640 network from Coburger's phone. His phone was turned off or 0:17:44.040 --> 0:17:49.280 was somehow unavailable, whether it was under a rock or somehow. 0:17:49.359 --> 0:17:52.720 It stopped pinging off of any cell phone towers at 0:17:52.720 --> 0:17:57.800 two forty seven am, and then it did not go 0:17:58.000 --> 0:18:00.920 back to being received by cell phone towers until four 0:18:01.080 --> 0:18:05.280 forty eight. So in a way, there are no pings 0:18:05.520 --> 0:18:06.479 at that time. 0:18:07.080 --> 0:18:11.240 What a coincidence, right, That would be hard to throw 0:18:11.320 --> 0:18:13.840 under the coincidence box. I mean, I guess that's what 0:18:14.040 --> 0:18:17.399 is so interesting about this case. Yes, while some of 0:18:17.440 --> 0:18:20.480 these pieces of the puzzle do in fact seem circumstantial 0:18:20.560 --> 0:18:24.080 when when looked at individually, I guess that's the whole point, 0:18:24.200 --> 0:18:26.520 right You dump them all in a bag and you're like, 0:18:26.600 --> 0:18:30.160 that's a lot of circumstantial evidence in one bag. 0:18:31.200 --> 0:18:33.560 We do have a follow up question from Marcella. She 0:18:33.640 --> 0:18:36.800 unfortunately couldn't join us today, but her follow up question is, 0:18:37.800 --> 0:18:40.440 I believe the killer was watching the house before he entered. 0:18:40.840 --> 0:18:43.160 Do you think he entered the house after the food 0:18:43.200 --> 0:18:45.320 was delivered in hopes that they would pin it on 0:18:45.440 --> 0:18:46.600 the food delivery driver. 0:18:47.880 --> 0:18:50.880 Great question, by the way, I mean we have discussed this, 0:18:51.080 --> 0:18:54.399 we really have. The difference is though here you would 0:18:54.440 --> 0:18:58.399 have to be predicting that food would be ordered and 0:18:58.480 --> 0:19:01.560 therefore delivered at a certain time to ping it on 0:19:01.600 --> 0:19:05.879 the guy, unless they always received food at the same time, 0:19:06.119 --> 0:19:08.680 which is not untotally unheard of. I would imagine in 0:19:08.720 --> 0:19:11.160 a college party house when you're out kind of late, 0:19:11.280 --> 0:19:13.520 but it's sort of a leap. That would be a 0:19:13.560 --> 0:19:16.840 lot of premeditation. Or maybe the person who committed this 0:19:16.920 --> 0:19:20.640 crime just went forward after they saw there was somebody 0:19:20.720 --> 0:19:22.399 exiting and entering the house. 0:19:26.520 --> 0:19:30.159 And next up is another listener question. Here's Maya from Colorado. 0:19:31.280 --> 0:19:34.119 So my question is, like, let's say they ordered it 0:19:34.160 --> 0:19:36.920 from Uber Eats. If he is an Uber Eats driver, 0:19:37.000 --> 0:19:39.000 which I don't know what if he is, he would 0:19:39.080 --> 0:19:41.879 get a notification that at that address they ordered food, 0:19:42.520 --> 0:19:44.800 so he could be aware that they ordered food and 0:19:44.800 --> 0:19:46.520 that it was going to be arriving at so and 0:19:46.560 --> 0:19:47.000 so time. 0:19:47.400 --> 0:19:49.800 It seems like for that to be the case, then 0:19:50.359 --> 0:19:53.359 the murderer is would then have to themselves be a driver. 0:19:53.480 --> 0:19:53.840 Correct. 0:19:54.400 --> 0:19:57.080 I love that question, but I think that actually goes 0:19:57.119 --> 0:20:01.399 back to the fact that there was in Coberger's case, 0:20:01.640 --> 0:20:06.119 his phone was unresponsive to any cell phone towers. So 0:20:06.280 --> 0:20:09.119 actually I think that because of that reason that that 0:20:09.160 --> 0:20:10.119 couldn't be the case. 0:20:13.600 --> 0:20:17.960 David from Massachusetts asks via email, do you think the 0:20:18.000 --> 0:20:20.800 accused committed the murders that night knowing that he was 0:20:20.840 --> 0:20:23.200 going home for Thanksgiving and had a reason to make 0:20:23.280 --> 0:20:26.080 a cross country road trip, thinking that might be enough 0:20:26.119 --> 0:20:28.160 to make the police look a different direction. 0:20:29.359 --> 0:20:33.679 This goes to knowing what's in someone's mind, which I 0:20:33.800 --> 0:20:38.240 do not, but the thought of knowing that fairly soon 0:20:38.600 --> 0:20:43.160 after a crime is committed, you will have three thousand 0:20:43.520 --> 0:20:46.879 miles worth of distance between yourself and the crime scene. 0:20:47.040 --> 0:20:50.159 That certainly could be something that comes into play, especially 0:20:50.760 --> 0:20:53.440 the alleged is a criminology student. 0:20:53.920 --> 0:20:56.159 Yeah, I'm going out on a limb here, so to 0:20:56.320 --> 0:20:59.520 take this with a grain of nothingness, But yes, of 0:20:59.560 --> 0:21:01.919 course he was going home for the holidays, and that 0:21:01.960 --> 0:21:04.600 there would be a break, and that that was a 0:21:04.800 --> 0:21:08.000 kind of a nice way to exit the worst situation ever. 0:21:08.600 --> 0:21:10.960 I always thought it was slightly interesting that his birthday 0:21:11.240 --> 0:21:13.760 is a week later than the murders, so he would 0:21:13.760 --> 0:21:17.240 be turning twenty nine in one week. So you commit 0:21:17.359 --> 0:21:20.080 a murder of four, hop in a car with your dad, 0:21:20.240 --> 0:21:23.840 drive across country, get pulled over twice, and then go 0:21:23.920 --> 0:21:27.440 home to your mom, who's cooking for you and maybe 0:21:27.440 --> 0:21:32.679 preparing for your birthday celebration as you're oddly unpacking any 0:21:33.000 --> 0:21:37.240 evidence from your car allegedly and putting things into baggies 0:21:37.240 --> 0:21:40.560 because you're wearing plastic gloves. I don't know. It's just 0:21:40.600 --> 0:21:47.640 so wild it seems impossible, but or does it. 0:21:47.640 --> 0:21:51.360 It's a follow up question, why did he coburger let 0:21:51.400 --> 0:21:53.960 one roommate live after she had seen him? And the 0:21:54.040 --> 0:21:56.680 murders were so violent and seemed so personal that the 0:21:56.720 --> 0:22:00.200 accused doesn't really have any connection to the victims. Why 0:22:00.200 --> 0:22:02.320 do you think that he made them look so violent? 0:22:03.280 --> 0:22:05.000 Well, I think I'm going to jump in real quickly 0:22:05.040 --> 0:22:07.320 here because I think this is the cross section of 0:22:07.359 --> 0:22:11.560 this entire case, and what is so compelling and maddening 0:22:11.600 --> 0:22:15.400 about it is, yes, it feels so intimate, but yes, 0:22:15.480 --> 0:22:18.160 there's no connection. And I guess that's the real look 0:22:18.200 --> 0:22:21.000 at where we live today with social media is making 0:22:21.080 --> 0:22:24.520 us feel so connected, not just social media. That's not 0:22:24.560 --> 0:22:28.640 an attack on all things media obviously, but just we're 0:22:28.680 --> 0:22:31.360 all really connected to people that we actually don't really 0:22:31.440 --> 0:22:34.080 have access to. And you know, we can look at 0:22:34.080 --> 0:22:35.840 that till we're blue in the face. But I think 0:22:35.920 --> 0:22:41.359 that's probably what's the big stunner of this case is that, yeah, 0:22:41.440 --> 0:22:45.960 these weren't people that necessarily even interface, not even once necessarily, 0:22:46.400 --> 0:22:49.800 but probably had some cross section on their phones. 0:22:50.560 --> 0:22:55.200 It's staggering, And I think you're right, Stephanie, so David 0:22:55.240 --> 0:22:57.640 from a situate, you have your finger on the pulse 0:22:57.960 --> 0:23:01.600 of what is so compelled at the center of this case. 0:23:02.080 --> 0:23:07.760 And it's so hard to imagine why whomever committed these 0:23:07.840 --> 0:23:14.080 murders allowed an eyewitness and an ear witness to remain. 0:23:14.720 --> 0:23:15.399 I don't know. 0:23:15.920 --> 0:23:20.840 Thank god they did right, Thank god they did underscore 0:23:21.040 --> 0:23:25.200 exclamation point in bold letters, shout it from the rooftop. 0:23:25.359 --> 0:23:30.080 Thank goodness, the remaining roommates were spared. It's a stunner, 0:23:30.280 --> 0:23:31.440 right to. 0:23:31.359 --> 0:23:36.120