1 00:00:01,800 --> 00:00:04,440 Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Business Week. I'm Karl Masser and I'm 2 00:00:04,480 --> 00:00:07,280 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stanovk. We're here every day bringing 3 00:00:07,320 --> 00:00:09,840 Speaker 1: you the latest news from the world to business and finance, 4 00:00:09,840 --> 00:00:13,640 Speaker 1: plus technology, politics, economics, all purtnising the power of Business 5 00:00:13,680 --> 00:00:17,160 Speaker 1: Week reporters and editors, not to mention our journalists and 6 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:20,000 Speaker 1: analysts in more than one twenty countries. You can download 7 00:00:20,000 --> 00:00:23,479 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Business Weekend iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg dot Com. You 8 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:25,439 Speaker 1: can also listen to our radio show at two pm 9 00:00:25,480 --> 00:00:27,880 Speaker 1: Eastern Time on the Bloomberg Radio or watch us on 10 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:31,960 Speaker 1: YouTube search Bloomberg clovel News shutting down again. I do 11 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:34,440 Speaker 1: feel like that's our theme right now. More companies and 12 00:00:34,520 --> 00:00:36,760 Speaker 1: even cities telling workers in an individuals to stay home 13 00:00:36,800 --> 00:00:39,479 Speaker 1: city group we mentioned telling staffers here in the New 14 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:41,680 Speaker 1: York City metro area to work from home again through 15 00:00:41,720 --> 00:00:44,000 Speaker 1: the holidays if they can. Starting the recent rise in 16 00:00:44,040 --> 00:00:47,040 Speaker 1: COVID nineteen cases in the region, and then we saw 17 00:00:47,120 --> 00:00:48,840 Speaker 1: what I think, almost half of workers in the city 18 00:00:48,840 --> 00:00:51,440 Speaker 1: of London not going to the office on Monday. What 19 00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:53,560 Speaker 1: does it mean for for here? Well? In New York City. 20 00:00:53,560 --> 00:00:55,680 Speaker 1: The Health Commissioner said that COVID nineteen data show a 21 00:00:55,760 --> 00:00:58,560 Speaker 1: quote alarming trend and predicted a further increase in the 22 00:00:58,640 --> 00:01:01,160 Speaker 1: case curve. Yeah, it's it's just kind of where we are. 23 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:04,920 Speaker 1: That's the snapshot. Hey, let's get some thoughts on the 24 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:07,959 Speaker 1: current headlines and where we are as well. Ruth Aaden 25 00:01:08,080 --> 00:01:10,960 Speaker 1: is a founder of the Johns Hopkins Berman Institute of Bioethics, 26 00:01:10,959 --> 00:01:14,040 Speaker 1: Professor of Biomedical Ethics at Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of 27 00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:16,800 Speaker 1: Public Health, which is supported by Michael R. Bloomberg, Founder, 28 00:01:16,840 --> 00:01:19,960 Speaker 1: Bloomberg LP, and Bloomberg Philanthropies. She joins us on this 29 00:01:20,040 --> 00:01:23,720 Speaker 1: Thursday from Martha's vineyard. Um, Dr Payden, nice to have 30 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:27,040 Speaker 1: you here back with us. How are you? I'm buying 31 00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:29,160 Speaker 1: Carol and nice to be with you and Kim again. 32 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:32,240 Speaker 1: So you do look at what's going on the pandemic, 33 00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:37,479 Speaker 1: um through an you know, ethics or bioethics lens. Having 34 00:01:37,520 --> 00:01:40,280 Speaker 1: said that, Um, what does that say to you right 35 00:01:40,319 --> 00:01:43,000 Speaker 1: now in terms of rolling out the vaccine? Where we 36 00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:48,160 Speaker 1: are in the pandemic seeing you know, another rise in cases? Yes? Well, 37 00:01:48,160 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 1: what it takes to me? I think three chief things. 38 00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:54,280 Speaker 1: The first is that we should not panic. We have 39 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:57,720 Speaker 1: the tools in the toolbox and we know what to do. 40 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:01,920 Speaker 1: So from the stample in each of these individuals, it's 41 00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:05,000 Speaker 1: the same message, the same message to the same message, 42 00:02:05,040 --> 00:02:09,200 Speaker 1: and get vaccinated, encourage other people to be vaccinated, get 43 00:02:09,240 --> 00:02:11,840 Speaker 1: boosters if you're eligible and live in the United States, 44 00:02:11,919 --> 00:02:16,000 Speaker 1: be more broadly eligible, and wear masks and indoor spaces 45 00:02:16,080 --> 00:02:20,000 Speaker 1: whether they're required or not. So that's the messaging. Now, 46 00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:27,080 Speaker 1: that's number one. Number two, remember that we are concerned 47 00:02:27,639 --> 00:02:32,520 Speaker 1: not about everyone equally, but about some people, especially so 48 00:02:32,720 --> 00:02:37,760 Speaker 1: for those of us who are under sixty five, who 49 00:02:37,840 --> 00:02:43,720 Speaker 1: are otherwise healthy, who's been fully vaccinated. This, especially if 50 00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:47,600 Speaker 1: we get our boosters, this should not be a particularly 51 00:02:47,600 --> 00:02:52,760 Speaker 1: difficult way. But but for people who don't hit that description, 52 00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:56,520 Speaker 1: this is not a nothing and we've been talking about 53 00:02:56,520 --> 00:03:00,639 Speaker 1: how it produces mild disease, but it probably produces so spectrum. 54 00:03:00,720 --> 00:03:04,240 Speaker 1: We're just adar to be. We're older Americans and people 55 00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:09,120 Speaker 1: at high risk an ethics matter, Get vascinated and protect 56 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:12,800 Speaker 1: yourself again around higher risk people. What's interesting because yesterday 57 00:03:12,919 --> 00:03:15,600 Speaker 1: Drew Armstrong, senior editor for US Healthcare here at Bloomberg News, 58 00:03:15,639 --> 00:03:17,960 Speaker 1: had the big take talking about hospitals in Kentucky that 59 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:20,160 Speaker 1: I have been under strained in the idea that when 60 00:03:20,160 --> 00:03:22,919 Speaker 1: a hospital does go under strain, that other people are affected, 61 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:25,480 Speaker 1: even if they are irrespective of COVID. Right, if you 62 00:03:25,520 --> 00:03:28,000 Speaker 1: have a car accident, you can't get care. So that's 63 00:03:28,000 --> 00:03:29,760 Speaker 1: from an ethical perspective too, So we've been thinking a 64 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:31,760 Speaker 1: lot about that. What about from the perspective of the 65 00:03:31,840 --> 00:03:34,920 Speaker 1: United States having access to boosters when many people around 66 00:03:34,920 --> 00:03:36,840 Speaker 1: the world don't even have access to that first shot? 67 00:03:37,360 --> 00:03:39,200 Speaker 1: And I got a lot of flak when I when 68 00:03:39,240 --> 00:03:40,800 Speaker 1: I sat on Twitter that I was that I was 69 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:43,280 Speaker 1: boosted because somebody who listens to the show a lot 70 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:45,440 Speaker 1: got in touch and and essentially tweeted at me and said, 71 00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:47,040 Speaker 1: how did it feel to get a booster when people 72 00:03:47,040 --> 00:03:49,480 Speaker 1: are in the world haven't gotten their first shot? What 73 00:03:49,520 --> 00:03:52,480 Speaker 1: are the ethics all right? So, Tim, that feels awful. 74 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:55,240 Speaker 1: So when answer to the person who went back at you, 75 00:03:55,360 --> 00:03:57,360 Speaker 1: of course it feels awful. And I have for a 76 00:03:57,360 --> 00:04:00,480 Speaker 1: long time been in the camp saying we need to 77 00:04:00,600 --> 00:04:04,280 Speaker 1: concentrate on making sure that we have an equitable global 78 00:04:04,440 --> 00:04:07,880 Speaker 1: distribution of vaccine, and we are so far from that 79 00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:11,920 Speaker 1: it isn't even funny. We are now in a kind 80 00:04:11,920 --> 00:04:15,160 Speaker 1: of ethics tragedy of our own making. If we had 81 00:04:15,200 --> 00:04:20,599 Speaker 1: been more committed to global equity from the beginning, we 82 00:04:20,640 --> 00:04:24,000 Speaker 1: would not be in the terrible situation of being faced 83 00:04:24,040 --> 00:04:28,920 Speaker 1: with a strain that really does appear to require a 84 00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:31,920 Speaker 1: third dose to get back to the kinds of protection 85 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:35,960 Speaker 1: we have had previously, when, as it's just rightly said, 86 00:04:36,080 --> 00:04:40,080 Speaker 1: there are large plots of the world's population who have 87 00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:45,120 Speaker 1: the ac their first dose. This is an unconscionable situation. Yeah, 88 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:48,760 Speaker 1: I feel like there's no easy answer, no right answer, um, 89 00:04:48,920 --> 00:04:51,159 Speaker 1: or maybe no wrong. I don't know. I just I 90 00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:53,600 Speaker 1: think most people would say right, if you can get it. 91 00:04:53,760 --> 00:04:55,760 Speaker 1: I mean I felt that way in the early on 92 00:04:56,000 --> 00:04:58,920 Speaker 1: getting the booster. I wasn't I was able to get it, 93 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:01,640 Speaker 1: but I've felt like I wasn't the most vulnerable, and 94 00:05:01,680 --> 00:05:04,040 Speaker 1: so I backed off and canceled an appointment, and then 95 00:05:04,520 --> 00:05:06,359 Speaker 1: you know, a couple of weeks later, it was like, 96 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:08,920 Speaker 1: go get it if you can. And so I think 97 00:05:08,960 --> 00:05:11,440 Speaker 1: we're all finding our way through it, um, and we 98 00:05:11,480 --> 00:05:15,280 Speaker 1: know the arguments about getting political. Uh, what's your visibility 99 00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:19,039 Speaker 1: about maybe where we are six months from now, I'm curious. 100 00:05:19,240 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 1: It does feel like we're better than where we were 101 00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:24,320 Speaker 1: one year ago. I'm unclear about where we will be 102 00:05:24,480 --> 00:05:27,520 Speaker 1: one year from now. Um, how do you see it? All? Right? 103 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:29,440 Speaker 1: Don't we say two things social on the point you 104 00:05:29,520 --> 00:05:31,560 Speaker 1: just raised, it all from the from the standpoint of 105 00:05:31,640 --> 00:05:36,320 Speaker 1: some individual ethics. Right now, it just is the fact 106 00:05:36,760 --> 00:05:39,800 Speaker 1: that vaccine that is being offered as muster doses to 107 00:05:39,880 --> 00:05:44,840 Speaker 1: Americans will not be sent to people outside of this country, right, 108 00:05:45,360 --> 00:05:49,160 Speaker 1: they will not, Right, So go ahead and get your 109 00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:54,000 Speaker 1: booster shot. At the same time, advocate advocate advocate well, 110 00:05:54,320 --> 00:05:59,480 Speaker 1: greater involvement, greater investment on the part of our government 111 00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:02,880 Speaker 1: in meeting the goal of global equity. So do both. 112 00:06:03,680 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 1: That's on that first point. Anybody who tells you where 113 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:10,520 Speaker 1: we are going to be six months from now, good 114 00:06:10,600 --> 00:06:15,400 Speaker 1: luck to them, my cology. Your second point, But there 115 00:06:15,440 --> 00:06:21,080 Speaker 1: are some sitelines. I mean, with all humidity, humility, I mean, 116 00:06:21,160 --> 00:06:24,120 Speaker 1: like everybody be humble here, right right. I listened a 117 00:06:24,120 --> 00:06:27,200 Speaker 1: lot and work a lot with colleagueses, wh show and 118 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:32,359 Speaker 1: US policy levels. With any luck, with any luck, we 119 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:35,240 Speaker 1: will be in a much better situation which respect to 120 00:06:35,720 --> 00:06:39,480 Speaker 1: global vaccine and supply by first and second quarters of 121 00:06:39,560 --> 00:06:42,720 Speaker 1: two fingers crossed. Dr Ruth Faden have a safe and 122 00:06:42,760 --> 00:06:45,600 Speaker 1: happy holiday season, founder of the Bourbon Institute of Bioethics 123 00:06:45,640 --> 00:06:48,520 Speaker 1: at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health. You're 124 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:52,560 Speaker 1: listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg 125 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:56,600 Speaker 1: Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. Remember Tim, we 126 00:06:56,640 --> 00:06:58,479 Speaker 1: talked about this story this week about how colleges are 127 00:06:58,520 --> 00:07:01,839 Speaker 1: embracing a post pandemic future that increasingly does not include 128 00:07:01,839 --> 00:07:04,360 Speaker 1: those standardized tests like the S A T. Yeah, where 129 00:07:04,400 --> 00:07:07,000 Speaker 1: was this twenty years ago? That's what I'm wondering. Oh, yeah, really, 130 00:07:07,279 --> 00:07:10,400 Speaker 1: we'll do like guys, anyway, let's get to it. Um, 131 00:07:10,560 --> 00:07:13,119 Speaker 1: she's got this story. More Bloomberg News Higher Education finance 132 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:15,360 Speaker 1: reporter Janet Lauren on the phone in New York City. Janet, 133 00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:18,040 Speaker 1: good to have you here. So our S A T 134 00:07:18,280 --> 00:07:21,040 Speaker 1: standardized testing, I mean, are we looking at a world 135 00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:25,040 Speaker 1: where they may just go away completely? Well, we've been 136 00:07:25,080 --> 00:07:28,600 Speaker 1: seeing announcements in the last couple of months that, um, 137 00:07:28,640 --> 00:07:32,680 Speaker 1: you know, are continuing these trends of S A T optional. Uh. 138 00:07:32,680 --> 00:07:35,240 Speaker 1: It started, of course during the pandemic when kids could 139 00:07:35,280 --> 00:07:38,120 Speaker 1: not get to test centers to take the test. UM 140 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:42,240 Speaker 1: Stanford announced the last month that current juniors wouldn't have 141 00:07:42,320 --> 00:07:45,840 Speaker 1: to submit them. And also some of the some of 142 00:07:45,840 --> 00:07:51,240 Speaker 1: the optional um requirements have gone to sophomores like Columbia 143 00:07:51,360 --> 00:07:55,640 Speaker 1: and Cornell, and Amer said current sophomores don't have to 144 00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:58,560 Speaker 1: submit them. And also several graduate schools are saying, you know, 145 00:07:58,600 --> 00:08:01,560 Speaker 1: you don't have to submit testing as well. So, you know, 146 00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:05,239 Speaker 1: once you've had these optional requirements for years and years 147 00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:07,720 Speaker 1: and years in the University of Chicago has been test 148 00:08:07,760 --> 00:08:11,720 Speaker 1: options kind of hard to go back for these schools. 149 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:15,200 Speaker 1: And really the biggest influence is the University of California 150 00:08:15,240 --> 00:08:18,520 Speaker 1: system with in those three hundred thousand students and if 151 00:08:18,880 --> 00:08:21,200 Speaker 1: a large number of kids who live in California not 152 00:08:21,280 --> 00:08:23,960 Speaker 1: taking them, you know, how do you say, well, just 153 00:08:24,080 --> 00:08:28,040 Speaker 1: for us take the test? Huh? Well, okay, So what 154 00:08:28,080 --> 00:08:30,560 Speaker 1: does this mean for how college is sort? And I 155 00:08:30,560 --> 00:08:33,240 Speaker 1: think of the sorting hat and Harry Potter, because that's 156 00:08:33,280 --> 00:08:35,560 Speaker 1: not something that these colleges have, right, you don't find 157 00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:38,960 Speaker 1: out where you're going. And one way that colleges did 158 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:42,319 Speaker 1: that traditionally was through different metrics, including standardized tests. So 159 00:08:42,320 --> 00:08:44,600 Speaker 1: what are they doing now, especially you sees that are 160 00:08:44,640 --> 00:08:48,240 Speaker 1: you know, with so many applicants. Right, Well, they've always 161 00:08:48,360 --> 00:08:51,120 Speaker 1: used said they've always said grades are going to be 162 00:08:51,160 --> 00:08:54,840 Speaker 1: the most important. So they want to see what you've 163 00:08:54,880 --> 00:08:57,680 Speaker 1: done in your classes, How have you performed? Are you 164 00:08:57,720 --> 00:09:01,200 Speaker 1: taking the most rigorous and um, you know, some schools 165 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:03,280 Speaker 1: have been sa T optional for a very long time, 166 00:09:03,320 --> 00:09:06,600 Speaker 1: like Bowden College in Maine has been sa T optional 167 00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:10,079 Speaker 1: for over fifty years. Um, there's a lot of other 168 00:09:10,120 --> 00:09:13,440 Speaker 1: ways to look at an applicant. Um, if you want 169 00:09:13,480 --> 00:09:16,079 Speaker 1: a test proxy, you could still take some AP test, 170 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:18,560 Speaker 1: which I'm sure the college board would would like because 171 00:09:21,320 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: the exactly Um, however, UM, you know it'll be interesting. 172 00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:28,160 Speaker 1: You know, how are school is going to look at 173 00:09:28,280 --> 00:09:31,400 Speaker 1: you know, how how are kids using their time? Because 174 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:34,199 Speaker 1: now suddenly if they're not studying for these tests, things 175 00:09:34,480 --> 00:09:37,240 Speaker 1: have a lot more time. And we um, we had 176 00:09:37,600 --> 00:09:39,440 Speaker 1: a young woman in our story saying, you know, she 177 00:09:39,520 --> 00:09:42,800 Speaker 1: took it. She did, Okay, it wasn't worth it to 178 00:09:42,920 --> 00:09:45,320 Speaker 1: admit it, so she you know, she took more hours 179 00:09:45,320 --> 00:09:48,959 Speaker 1: in her job scooping ice creams. I think colleges will 180 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:51,079 Speaker 1: be interested to see what kids do with all this 181 00:09:51,280 --> 00:09:53,760 Speaker 1: extra time and you know they still have to get 182 00:09:53,800 --> 00:09:57,280 Speaker 1: good grades. I thought, Um, the last line in the 183 00:09:57,360 --> 00:10:00,840 Speaker 1: story was very instructive from the dean of admissions at 184 00:10:00,840 --> 00:10:03,679 Speaker 1: the University of Chicagogan, which hasn't required them for years. 185 00:10:04,160 --> 00:10:08,120 Speaker 1: You know, it's you know, by not submitting a test score, um, 186 00:10:08,160 --> 00:10:10,280 Speaker 1: you know, you can't hide your grades. And if you 187 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:12,920 Speaker 1: have a lot of seeds that's not you know, that 188 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:15,439 Speaker 1: doesn't give you a proxy for thinking you're going to 189 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:18,520 Speaker 1: get into one of those pots. Janet, is it is 190 00:10:18,520 --> 00:10:21,800 Speaker 1: it optional? Is it optional? Or is it don't submit it? 191 00:10:21,800 --> 00:10:23,880 Speaker 1: Because I do wonder about when it's optional and if 192 00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:27,000 Speaker 1: somebody does submit it, does it give them potentially an edge? 193 00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:30,120 Speaker 1: And just got about thirty seconds. I think if your 194 00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:32,920 Speaker 1: grades are are very strong and your test score is 195 00:10:33,040 --> 00:10:35,640 Speaker 1: very strong, it's not really telling the schools anything different, 196 00:10:37,080 --> 00:10:40,120 Speaker 1: all right. It's an interesting trend, right, It's one of 197 00:10:40,120 --> 00:10:42,040 Speaker 1: those things that's certainly to coming out of the pandemic 198 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:44,800 Speaker 1: that has been a much more active and aggressive conversation 199 00:10:44,840 --> 00:10:47,040 Speaker 1: than before. Jannet Lauren, get to hear your voice. I 200 00:10:47,120 --> 00:10:49,599 Speaker 1: ran into her up on the link yesterday. It was 201 00:10:49,640 --> 00:10:51,600 Speaker 1: so nice to see her. Next time we'll get her 202 00:10:51,640 --> 00:10:54,600 Speaker 1: in the studio. Yeah, exactly, Jennet Lauren, Higher Education, Financial 203 00:10:54,600 --> 00:10:56,880 Speaker 1: port up Bloomberg News on the phone from New York City. 204 00:10:57,679 --> 00:10:59,640 Speaker 1: By the time Lag goes to college, I welcome this 205 00:10:59,760 --> 00:11:02,880 Speaker 1: to That's all I'm saying. It will be the we'll 206 00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:05,760 Speaker 1: think about all the stress, the sorting hat, the sorting hat. Yeah, 207 00:11:06,840 --> 00:11:08,720 Speaker 1: he'll be picked by a robot to go to robots 208 00:11:08,720 --> 00:11:11,480 Speaker 1: school to learn how to program robots fingerprint and somehow 209 00:11:11,520 --> 00:11:14,760 Speaker 1: they'll know exactly, like the perfect fit form exactly retinal 210 00:11:14,840 --> 00:11:18,240 Speaker 1: retinal like stan something weird. Look, I think that you know, 211 00:11:18,240 --> 00:11:20,240 Speaker 1: this is a source of anxiety for so many people, 212 00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:22,360 Speaker 1: and they're also like all the all the big studies 213 00:11:22,360 --> 00:11:25,120 Speaker 1: about bias, right, you know, who can afford to actually 214 00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:27,120 Speaker 1: prep for these things? But as you and I said, okay, 215 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:30,040 Speaker 1: so what if it's more important the essay wealth Your 216 00:11:30,080 --> 00:11:32,679 Speaker 1: kids can maybe afford somebody to help them write it. 217 00:11:32,640 --> 00:11:38,240 Speaker 1: It's just a weird process. Great, This is Bloomberg. This 218 00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:42,600 Speaker 1: is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes. 219 00:11:42,679 --> 00:11:46,319 Speaker 1: Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. How many times have you 220 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:48,320 Speaker 1: talked to this dude today? This is my third time, 221 00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:50,640 Speaker 1: that's only going to be my second. I mean I 222 00:11:50,679 --> 00:11:53,800 Speaker 1: could go all day with Mike Reagan. I agree, I agree, 223 00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:56,400 Speaker 1: all right, folks. The cover story of business Week magazine, 224 00:11:56,440 --> 00:11:59,720 Speaker 1: it's a takeover the finance section, actually really taking over, 225 00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:02,800 Speaker 1: uh this particular coverage. It's a detail look at a 226 00:12:02,880 --> 00:12:05,880 Speaker 1: year that's our market headlines dominated by retail traders, meme stocks, 227 00:12:05,880 --> 00:12:09,680 Speaker 1: cryptocurrency SPACs. It was crazy writing about it for Bloomberg 228 00:12:09,679 --> 00:12:12,280 Speaker 1: business Week. Is Mike Reagan, senior editor for Bloomberg Markets. 229 00:12:12,280 --> 00:12:14,800 Speaker 1: He's with us in the Bloomberg Interactive Broker Studio. Mike 230 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:17,000 Speaker 1: story is the cover of the brand new issue of 231 00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:19,400 Speaker 1: Bloomberg business Week magazine. I just got my hands on it. 232 00:12:19,440 --> 00:12:21,480 Speaker 1: You can get your hands on it at newsstands and 233 00:12:21,600 --> 00:12:24,480 Speaker 1: online at Bloomberg dot com, slash business Week. That this 234 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:26,320 Speaker 1: is great because it's so overarching, and if we think 235 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:29,800 Speaker 1: about where we were in the rise of the retail trader, 236 00:12:29,960 --> 00:12:33,000 Speaker 1: meme stocks, n f T s, crypto Milania, Trump just 237 00:12:33,040 --> 00:12:35,080 Speaker 1: coming out with an n f T earlier today, we 238 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:36,599 Speaker 1: were just talking about it. How are we going to 239 00:12:36,640 --> 00:12:39,240 Speaker 1: look back on this year? Yeah, definitely a crazy er. 240 00:12:39,280 --> 00:12:41,360 Speaker 1: I mean, I think what's really interesting is just this 241 00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:44,880 Speaker 1: confluence of events that you know, we've never seen before 242 00:12:44,880 --> 00:12:47,440 Speaker 1: in history. Knock on would we never see again, but 243 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:50,280 Speaker 1: you know, sort of the seeds being planted. I think 244 00:12:50,320 --> 00:12:53,000 Speaker 1: even before the virus, you know that this move to 245 00:12:53,240 --> 00:12:56,440 Speaker 1: commission free trading, for example, I think is something I 246 00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:58,880 Speaker 1: didn't get into detailing in the story, but I think 247 00:12:58,880 --> 00:13:02,319 Speaker 1: it's part of it. And sort crypto reaching its adolescence, 248 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:05,920 Speaker 1: and all this happening right at a time where suddenly 249 00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:09,679 Speaker 1: we all found ourselves locked at home, um with some 250 00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:11,880 Speaker 1: extra money, you know, whether it be from the government 251 00:13:12,280 --> 00:13:15,840 Speaker 1: stimulus payments, just from not being able to to go 252 00:13:15,880 --> 00:13:18,360 Speaker 1: out and spend it on other things, and you know, 253 00:13:18,440 --> 00:13:22,080 Speaker 1: everyone kind of turned to their computer screens for I think, 254 00:13:22,120 --> 00:13:24,640 Speaker 1: you know, not only entertainment, but also the sense of community, 255 00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:27,440 Speaker 1: the sense of you know, the need to interact with 256 00:13:27,480 --> 00:13:32,120 Speaker 1: other people, and people stumbled into these social media rabbit holes, 257 00:13:32,160 --> 00:13:35,200 Speaker 1: whether it be Wall Street bets on Reddit or you know, 258 00:13:35,480 --> 00:13:38,600 Speaker 1: the the discord chats where all the crypto people hang out, 259 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:41,920 Speaker 1: UM to Twitter and even you know, just text messages 260 00:13:42,160 --> 00:13:44,480 Speaker 1: among friends. And you know, I talk about the notion 261 00:13:44,480 --> 00:13:48,040 Speaker 1: of identity investing, the notion that you know, these communities 262 00:13:48,080 --> 00:13:52,000 Speaker 1: are formed and people sort of gravitate to them, and 263 00:13:52,160 --> 00:13:55,720 Speaker 1: suddenly you have a new fundamental driver of of asset prices. 264 00:13:55,760 --> 00:13:58,400 Speaker 1: I think, you know, it's not necessarily the cash flow 265 00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:01,680 Speaker 1: that the company's spinning off that is the important driver 266 00:14:01,880 --> 00:14:04,720 Speaker 1: of the stock. It's doesn't have a community of people 267 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:08,320 Speaker 1: that have invested interest in it UM that's even goes 268 00:14:08,360 --> 00:14:11,120 Speaker 1: beyond their investments. You know, I clearly I think game 269 00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:14,440 Speaker 1: Stop comes from people who were gamers, who shopped at 270 00:14:14,440 --> 00:14:17,400 Speaker 1: that store as a kid, AMC movie lovers, and then 271 00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:20,520 Speaker 1: cryptic just poking the bear which is known as traditional 272 00:14:20,560 --> 00:14:23,880 Speaker 1: Wall Street just say, absolutely, it's pretty remarkable how it 273 00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:26,560 Speaker 1: really caught a lot of traditional investors, you know or 274 00:14:26,680 --> 00:14:30,760 Speaker 1: big you know, institutional firms off. God. Absolutely, and then 275 00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:34,120 Speaker 1: you know this kind of this overarching sense that the 276 00:14:34,160 --> 00:14:37,320 Speaker 1: market was this plaything of the big money institutions and 277 00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:40,880 Speaker 1: hedge funds and kind of very much a rebellion of that. 278 00:14:40,920 --> 00:14:43,120 Speaker 1: And that's a theme that goes through both the you know, 279 00:14:43,160 --> 00:14:46,200 Speaker 1: the crypto boom. I think it is similar, you know, 280 00:14:46,320 --> 00:14:50,360 Speaker 1: people trying to sort of recreate a new financial system 281 00:14:50,440 --> 00:14:54,200 Speaker 1: outside of the traditional system UM and for some of 282 00:14:54,200 --> 00:14:57,040 Speaker 1: the meme stock traders trying to really knock out, uh, 283 00:14:57,080 --> 00:14:58,880 Speaker 1: some of the big players in it who were short 284 00:14:59,000 --> 00:15:02,760 Speaker 1: these stocks. So you use the term identity investing, what 285 00:15:02,800 --> 00:15:04,760 Speaker 1: does that mean? It kind of means, you know what 286 00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:07,080 Speaker 1: I'm talking about with these communities, that you you have 287 00:15:07,200 --> 00:15:11,400 Speaker 1: sort of an affinity to an investment um based on 288 00:15:11,560 --> 00:15:13,560 Speaker 1: you know, whether it be you're an old video game 289 00:15:13,560 --> 00:15:15,880 Speaker 1: player who shot the game Stop as a kid, or 290 00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:19,120 Speaker 1: or someone who just got a laugh out of dogecoin 291 00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:22,880 Speaker 1: and Sheba, you know, you know the knockoff of dogecoin. 292 00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:27,000 Speaker 1: Carol's laughing because knockoff of dogecoin, right, it's a joke 293 00:15:27,080 --> 00:15:30,160 Speaker 1: of a joke, right, right, and you know it's easy 294 00:15:30,200 --> 00:15:31,960 Speaker 1: to roll your eyes and laugh at it, but it 295 00:15:32,080 --> 00:15:35,480 Speaker 1: really happened. And I think it's you know, it's something 296 00:15:36,400 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 1: in a way. I feel like, you know, the horses 297 00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:40,800 Speaker 1: out of the barn now on this type of activity, 298 00:15:41,000 --> 00:15:43,240 Speaker 1: and you know, it's hard to believe we'll see another 299 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:45,360 Speaker 1: year's wild, but I think that you know, you have 300 00:15:45,440 --> 00:15:47,760 Speaker 1: to sort of take this trend seriously. Well, let's talk 301 00:15:47,800 --> 00:15:49,480 Speaker 1: about that, because if the if the horses out of 302 00:15:49,480 --> 00:15:51,480 Speaker 1: the barn, and perhaps we won't see another year as 303 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:54,160 Speaker 1: wild as we saw in one. For a handful of factors, 304 00:15:55,160 --> 00:15:58,680 Speaker 1: what do we see in two? Because commission free trading 305 00:15:59,040 --> 00:16:02,160 Speaker 1: unless something happens payment for order flow that's not going anywhere. 306 00:16:02,200 --> 00:16:05,160 Speaker 1: That's not that's not going anywhere. So there's certainly there 307 00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:07,960 Speaker 1: will always be the ingredients the recipe in place. I 308 00:16:07,960 --> 00:16:11,680 Speaker 1: think what will be different about this upcoming years? We 309 00:16:12,640 --> 00:16:15,600 Speaker 1: people had these swollen savings accounts. Um. You know, even 310 00:16:15,600 --> 00:16:17,960 Speaker 1: if you were unemployed and you collected unemployment, you were 311 00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:20,160 Speaker 1: getting more than a lot more than you would have 312 00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:21,880 Speaker 1: otherwise a lot of people getting more than what they 313 00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:24,720 Speaker 1: made at their jobs. So you know, it almost I 314 00:16:24,760 --> 00:16:26,560 Speaker 1: think for a lot of people felt like betting with 315 00:16:26,600 --> 00:16:29,280 Speaker 1: house money. Right. It didn't feel like you're really putting 316 00:16:29,320 --> 00:16:31,800 Speaker 1: your own savings at risk because this was sort of 317 00:16:31,880 --> 00:16:35,000 Speaker 1: surplus newfound cash. So I think that pile of money, 318 00:16:35,280 --> 00:16:38,920 Speaker 1: that excess savings is going to get drawn down in 319 00:16:38,960 --> 00:16:41,400 Speaker 1: a couple of ways, you know, either deflation of these 320 00:16:41,400 --> 00:16:44,320 Speaker 1: asset prices as one or just people spending it out. Well, 321 00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:46,360 Speaker 1: that's point I said to you earlier when we were 322 00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:50,200 Speaker 1: taping for our weekend show, this this story in there. Um, 323 00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:52,800 Speaker 1: I love your last line. You know, remember the reality 324 00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:55,440 Speaker 1: maybe virtual the money you're investing eight and it's it's 325 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:57,320 Speaker 1: one thing when everything's going up and it can feel 326 00:16:57,320 --> 00:17:00,360 Speaker 1: like wow, I'm really onto something. But let's remember something 327 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:04,240 Speaker 1: like cryptocurrencies, bitcoin, you know, these things are really volatile. 328 00:17:04,359 --> 00:17:06,880 Speaker 1: They are and you know, and you don't even really 329 00:17:06,920 --> 00:17:09,359 Speaker 1: have to tell crypto investor that they're glue. They have 330 00:17:09,400 --> 00:17:12,800 Speaker 1: their their quota and they understand it, and it's it's 331 00:17:12,840 --> 00:17:15,000 Speaker 1: part of the I think, appeal of it. If you 332 00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:18,040 Speaker 1: wake up on a Saturday morning and ethereum or bitcoin 333 00:17:18,160 --> 00:17:21,200 Speaker 1: is down, it's you know, all of a sudden you 334 00:17:21,240 --> 00:17:22,800 Speaker 1: have a chance to get it at a discount. But 335 00:17:22,840 --> 00:17:25,119 Speaker 1: you're right that, you know, if the tide you know, 336 00:17:25,480 --> 00:17:27,800 Speaker 1: to use the famous word buffet thing, if the tide 337 00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 1: goes out permanently um, it certainly could be come as 338 00:17:31,520 --> 00:17:34,480 Speaker 1: a surprise to many investors. I do think a lot 339 00:17:34,520 --> 00:17:38,240 Speaker 1: of this is people's not necessarily their main nest eggs, 340 00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:41,320 Speaker 1: their retirement money. It's kind of, you know, a smaller 341 00:17:41,520 --> 00:17:43,359 Speaker 1: budget that they have set aside for you know, I 342 00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:46,840 Speaker 1: can talk talk about it like lottery ticket money. You know, what, 343 00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:49,119 Speaker 1: what's your budget for lottery tickets? And I think for 344 00:17:49,200 --> 00:17:52,159 Speaker 1: some people it's that granted, a bigger budget on lottery 345 00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:54,679 Speaker 1: tickets than you probably want, want, or should have, But 346 00:17:54,840 --> 00:17:57,480 Speaker 1: you say it's changed investing forever. So what's the lasting 347 00:17:57,520 --> 00:18:00,360 Speaker 1: part of this? I think it's these communities and this 348 00:18:00,520 --> 00:18:02,879 Speaker 1: this herd behavior. You know, I always think back to 349 00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:05,000 Speaker 1: the old investing clubs. You know, you get a bunch 350 00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:07,639 Speaker 1: of little ladies in a room together and have tea 351 00:18:07,840 --> 00:18:09,640 Speaker 1: and you all and they'd all invest the same way. 352 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:13,520 Speaker 1: Peter right right, This is that times a gazillion, I think, 353 00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:15,280 Speaker 1: And I think that's what's here to stay. Is this 354 00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:20,000 Speaker 1: this herd tribal uh investing that we've seen. And you know, 355 00:18:20,800 --> 00:18:22,800 Speaker 1: you don't have to join a tribe permanently. You could 356 00:18:22,840 --> 00:18:25,040 Speaker 1: be in the dose coin tribe one day and then 357 00:18:25,040 --> 00:18:26,880 Speaker 1: go back to the games Stop tribe. And I think, 358 00:18:26,920 --> 00:18:28,399 Speaker 1: you know, there's gonna be a lot of sort of 359 00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:31,000 Speaker 1: chasing the next where the next crowd is going, okay 360 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:32,720 Speaker 1: before we let you go just in forty seconds. N 361 00:18:32,760 --> 00:18:35,479 Speaker 1: f T s here to stay, I think absolutely, And 362 00:18:35,520 --> 00:18:38,000 Speaker 1: I think but not in the way we think of them. 363 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:39,960 Speaker 1: I don't think it's just gonna be j PEG's. I 364 00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:43,440 Speaker 1: think they're there. There's a lot more potential and sophisticated 365 00:18:43,480 --> 00:18:46,240 Speaker 1: smart contracts as they call it um going forward, and 366 00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:48,320 Speaker 1: n f T s are are sort of the you know, 367 00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:52,840 Speaker 1: the poster child for that. It's not buying Milan's eyes. Well, 368 00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:55,359 Speaker 1: you think of these word ape yacht clubs. You know, 369 00:18:56,119 --> 00:18:57,840 Speaker 1: it's a it's a picture of a funny ape. But 370 00:18:57,880 --> 00:18:59,720 Speaker 1: there's more to it than that. You you get a 371 00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:03,040 Speaker 1: member ship in this online community. So if this metaverse 372 00:19:03,080 --> 00:19:06,600 Speaker 1: thing really takes off, um, I think there's gonna be 373 00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:09,520 Speaker 1: more to it than just the pictures are buying. Well, 374 00:19:09,800 --> 00:19:14,119 Speaker 1: you know, with Bloomberg's restrictions, I without it for good 375 00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:18,919 Speaker 1: or bad. That's a policy that's good all of us 376 00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:22,080 Speaker 1: from a lot of a lot of foolish moves. It's 377 00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:25,440 Speaker 1: great coverage in the magazine. Check it out the cover story. 378 00:19:25,640 --> 00:19:28,600 Speaker 1: There's moving, different moving parts to it, but a great story. 379 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:31,080 Speaker 1: Mike Rere again, Senior editor, Bloomberg Markets in our interactive 380 00:19:31,080 --> 00:19:35,520 Speaker 1: broker's story. Uh that new issue on newstands, online at 381 00:19:35,840 --> 00:19:37,680 Speaker 1: business week dot com and of course always on the 382 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:41,600 Speaker 1: Bloomberg terminal. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol 383 00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:46,119 Speaker 1: Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes. Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. 384 00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:49,159 Speaker 1: This is among I believe you're most right on the 385 00:19:49,160 --> 00:19:51,879 Speaker 1: Bloomberg It is indeed, in fact, it is the number 386 00:19:51,920 --> 00:19:54,560 Speaker 1: one most read story in the past eight hours on 387 00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:57,000 Speaker 1: the Bloomberg. Doesn't seem like corporate Americas on a path 388 00:19:57,000 --> 00:19:59,960 Speaker 1: toward normalcy. A new wave of COVID uncertainty upending business 389 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:02,159 Speaker 1: plans from Wall Street to Silicon Valley. We've seen a 390 00:20:02,160 --> 00:20:03,800 Speaker 1: plan out in real time. Especially, I feel like in 391 00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:07,720 Speaker 1: the lasts we have Jenny Serina's finance reporter for Bloomberg 392 00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:10,040 Speaker 1: new she's with us in the Bloomberg Interactive Broker Studio. 393 00:20:10,280 --> 00:20:12,439 Speaker 1: I mean, I hope you're with us for a while, 394 00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:13,880 Speaker 1: and like we don't have to all go and work 395 00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:17,760 Speaker 1: different places because wherever. Well, look, we were joking and 396 00:20:17,760 --> 00:20:19,760 Speaker 1: not really even joking, but we were talking during the 397 00:20:19,840 --> 00:20:23,240 Speaker 1: break that this really feels like, you know, it feels 398 00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:26,280 Speaker 1: like yesterday, yesterday with the cancelation of the JP Morgan conference, 399 00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:28,879 Speaker 1: the health conference right that to me, it feels like 400 00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:30,919 Speaker 1: it's set off some sort of wave where we're just 401 00:20:30,960 --> 00:20:35,600 Speaker 1: seeing banks say and companies say, okay, work from home, 402 00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:38,359 Speaker 1: we're canceling holiday parties. Was that some sort of turning 403 00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:39,760 Speaker 1: point and give us bring us up to speed on 404 00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:42,720 Speaker 1: what's happened since then? Yeah, I think it definitely felt 405 00:20:42,760 --> 00:20:45,360 Speaker 1: like that was one of the many kind of cracks 406 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:50,439 Speaker 1: in the industry's efforts to keep offices restocked through the holidays. Um. 407 00:20:50,480 --> 00:20:52,200 Speaker 1: So yeah, I think banks are in a different position 408 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:54,000 Speaker 1: than a lot of other companies because they were pretty 409 00:20:54,000 --> 00:20:56,640 Speaker 1: aggressive and bringing folks back, So that means they've had 410 00:20:56,640 --> 00:20:59,120 Speaker 1: folks there these past few weeks. People came back from 411 00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:02,320 Speaker 1: the Thanksgiving holiday. Cases have shot up across the street, 412 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:05,640 Speaker 1: and now everyone's pretty much saying, Okay, you guys can 413 00:21:05,640 --> 00:21:08,720 Speaker 1: work from home. Um, you know, stay safe, enjoy your holidays. 414 00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:11,199 Speaker 1: So that's kind of the state of plan banking. I 415 00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:13,480 Speaker 1: think Tech they haven't actually brought their people back yet, 416 00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:15,879 Speaker 1: so their big Dave is just once again delaying a 417 00:21:15,960 --> 00:21:18,280 Speaker 1: return to office. And I think we're seeing over there 418 00:21:18,280 --> 00:21:19,920 Speaker 1: a lot of those folks are just saying, you know what, 419 00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:22,680 Speaker 1: we're sick of setting a date just and definitely you're 420 00:21:22,680 --> 00:21:24,840 Speaker 1: working from home and we'll figure it out when things 421 00:21:25,440 --> 00:21:34,920 Speaker 1: It was summer January through the dates out the window. Yes. Yeah. 422 00:21:34,960 --> 00:21:37,080 Speaker 1: And then someone was saying it feels like groundhog Day, 423 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:39,360 Speaker 1: and it definitely does. Um, it definitely feels like we're 424 00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:41,119 Speaker 1: just kind of going through the same motions over and 425 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:43,359 Speaker 1: over again. But what's the psyche that's going on? I 426 00:21:43,359 --> 00:21:45,600 Speaker 1: think within the Wall Street community. And I do wonder 427 00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:48,359 Speaker 1: about the significance of Jamie Diamond coming out and doing something. 428 00:21:48,400 --> 00:21:51,800 Speaker 1: He really is looked too as a barometer in terms 429 00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:54,119 Speaker 1: of what can we do, what's okay to do? I 430 00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:57,280 Speaker 1: feel like I mean, and so Diamond has been probably 431 00:21:57,320 --> 00:21:59,520 Speaker 1: the most vocal about the importance of offices and how 432 00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:02,240 Speaker 1: much you it's those, um, you know, folks be back 433 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:04,400 Speaker 1: and bankers on the road and people meeting with clients 434 00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:07,080 Speaker 1: and and so that was a big turning point. Um. 435 00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:10,320 Speaker 1: But I think honestly it's almost you know, he had 436 00:22:10,359 --> 00:22:12,199 Speaker 1: companies pulling out left and right, So I don't know 437 00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:15,040 Speaker 1: that he had that much of a choice in the end. Um. 438 00:22:15,080 --> 00:22:17,000 Speaker 1: But it's definitely a disappointment I think for all these 439 00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:19,560 Speaker 1: CEOs who just feel really strongly that FaceTime is the 440 00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:23,160 Speaker 1: way forward. UM. But I also think, you know, it's 441 00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:25,159 Speaker 1: it's a very odd discord because I think a lot 442 00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:27,360 Speaker 1: of folks are still doing kind of what they want 443 00:22:27,400 --> 00:22:29,000 Speaker 1: to in their normal lives. You know, people are going 444 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:32,000 Speaker 1: on to dinners, um. Broadway is still happening, lots of 445 00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:35,280 Speaker 1: different cultural stuff, football stadiums are full, like the whole 446 00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:37,840 Speaker 1: nine yards, and then in the office you just have 447 00:22:37,920 --> 00:22:43,040 Speaker 1: this very different, um, you know, approach. It's interesting the 448 00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:45,280 Speaker 1: conversations we have in and around, certainly the news room 449 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:47,760 Speaker 1: and I know certainly in my personal life, of of 450 00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:50,480 Speaker 1: people saying I keep hearing people are like, I'm tired 451 00:22:50,520 --> 00:22:53,440 Speaker 1: of commuting. I'm happy to work, I will do whatever 452 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:56,280 Speaker 1: I need to, but I'm tired. Like the pandemic showed me, 453 00:22:56,560 --> 00:22:58,560 Speaker 1: I could work at a lot of stuff done still 454 00:22:58,640 --> 00:23:01,040 Speaker 1: do everything by I had a little bit more balanced. 455 00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:03,280 Speaker 1: And I do wonder if whether it's the Wall Street 456 00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:05,639 Speaker 1: community or CEO's overall, are just kind of missing a 457 00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:08,320 Speaker 1: really big message that's going on and maybe not want 458 00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:10,879 Speaker 1: to be, especially in a tight labor force. Yeah. I 459 00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:12,720 Speaker 1: think that's definitely right, and I think, you know, the 460 00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:15,679 Speaker 1: tech people probably feel it a little bit more acutely, 461 00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:18,000 Speaker 1: just because those folks, I mean so many engineers and 462 00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:20,920 Speaker 1: data scientists really can do it all from home, right. UM. 463 00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:22,840 Speaker 1: I think in Wall Street a lot of times you 464 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:25,159 Speaker 1: think about those like the investment bankers, the folks that 465 00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:27,840 Speaker 1: get on the plane and pitch CEOs on big deals, 466 00:23:27,880 --> 00:23:30,280 Speaker 1: and it's a very um I mean, it's a very 467 00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:33,119 Speaker 1: FaceTime friendly industry, and so I think it's just an 468 00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:36,160 Speaker 1: adjustment period and we'll see if you know, Wall Street 469 00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:38,880 Speaker 1: comes around to the UH the new way of working, 470 00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:40,880 Speaker 1: or if Wall Street kind of forces its way forward 471 00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:43,240 Speaker 1: and says we're tired of you resisting. You need to listen. 472 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:45,400 Speaker 1: We're talking about Wall Street, We're talking about the big banks. 473 00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:46,960 Speaker 1: But as you write in your peace, Jenny, this goes 474 00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:48,440 Speaker 1: beyond the big banks. I mean, think about what the 475 00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:50,840 Speaker 1: headlines we've seen from colleges where a high proportion of 476 00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:53,520 Speaker 1: students are vaccinated. You did right that Hans Vestberg, the 477 00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:56,560 Speaker 1: CEO of Verizon, just closed yesterday that he tested positive 478 00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:59,120 Speaker 1: recently for the virus. He's been quarantine at home with 479 00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:02,120 Speaker 1: mild symptoms. What does it all mean post holidays for 480 00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:04,120 Speaker 1: especially when it comes to the banks, Do they get 481 00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:07,400 Speaker 1: people back there? I think, I mean, if we learned 482 00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:10,840 Speaker 1: anything from post Thanksgiving holiday, as soon as folks got 483 00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:13,080 Speaker 1: back a few weeks in, we've seen a real rising 484 00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:15,560 Speaker 1: cases across the street, and so I think that is 485 00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:17,720 Speaker 1: going to probably stay with these banks for a while. 486 00:24:17,760 --> 00:24:20,240 Speaker 1: I mean, nobody likes to do the contact tracing and 487 00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:23,199 Speaker 1: inform their employee. It scares people. So I think, you know, 488 00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:25,520 Speaker 1: I think they'll probably take it slow in January, um 489 00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:28,040 Speaker 1: and we'll probably start to heal feel that same kind 490 00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:30,200 Speaker 1: of drumbeat, like let's get back in, let's get back 491 00:24:30,200 --> 00:24:32,639 Speaker 1: to work, you know, come February or maybe later in 492 00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:35,800 Speaker 1: the month in January. But I think for now everything 493 00:24:35,880 --> 00:24:37,720 Speaker 1: is pretty much on its back foot and kind of 494 00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:40,520 Speaker 1: realizing the situation that we're in and having said that, 495 00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:42,480 Speaker 1: you know, we do know how this plays out. We 496 00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:44,760 Speaker 1: know what happens in cases spike, and so we also 497 00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:46,879 Speaker 1: know how to quickly kind of clamp down on it. 498 00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:49,240 Speaker 1: And it is I feel like a little bit refreshing 499 00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:51,600 Speaker 1: for these CEOs to say, Okay, let's just let's just 500 00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:53,160 Speaker 1: shut it down. We know what to do here. Yeah. 501 00:24:53,280 --> 00:24:55,080 Speaker 1: I mean, I think that it helps that this time 502 00:24:55,119 --> 00:24:57,920 Speaker 1: they know that there's a playbook that they know people 503 00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:00,240 Speaker 1: can do it. It's not like March and that sense 504 00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:02,359 Speaker 1: where they're kind of sending folks often to the ether 505 00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:04,359 Speaker 1: with no idea what was going to happen. You know, 506 00:25:04,680 --> 00:25:07,400 Speaker 1: everyone's pretty adapted at moving to the whole work from 507 00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:09,800 Speaker 1: home set up Brown hog Day all over again, or 508 00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:12,840 Speaker 1: Deja Vu all over again a little bit of that. Um, Jenny, 509 00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:14,480 Speaker 1: thank you so much. And I've been really busy some 510 00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:17,320 Speaker 1: great reporting all over the place from you when it 511 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:19,800 Speaker 1: comes to all things Wall Street. Jenny Serene, Finance reporter 512 00:25:19,800 --> 00:25:22,320 Speaker 1: at Bloomberg News in our Interactive Broker studio. But this 513 00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:25,600 Speaker 1: really does feel like her story, and just the headline 514 00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:29,359 Speaker 1: after headline of shutdowns rolling back is our big story 515 00:25:29,560 --> 00:25:32,280 Speaker 1: it is. I'm curious to see what happens after the holidays. 516 00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:34,480 Speaker 1: As I mentioned, the anecdotal data that I see with 517 00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:36,879 Speaker 1: people just lined up outside of urgent care facilities to 518 00:25:36,920 --> 00:25:39,000 Speaker 1: get tested. Right now, we've all seen it if you 519 00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:40,600 Speaker 1: live in New York City. To what extent are those 520 00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:42,840 Speaker 1: people being tested so they can travel and be with 521 00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:45,200 Speaker 1: family during the holidays or are they feeling symptoms? We 522 00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:46,679 Speaker 1: don't know. We do know that the curve though here 523 00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:49,520 Speaker 1: in New York City is rising. Um and Health Commissioner 524 00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:51,280 Speaker 1: is not happy about it. And what happens with schools 525 00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:53,840 Speaker 1: and especially kids that are in grade school, middle school, 526 00:25:54,080 --> 00:26:00,159 Speaker 1: younger if they start to shut down the impact of that. Now, 527 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:02,280 Speaker 1: but you let me drive, Oh no, no, no, no, 528 00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:11,280 Speaker 1: this is all right, Please, I'll go. I want to drive. 529 00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:18,000 Speaker 1: It's a good question. Good drive. This is the Drive 530 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:24,320 Speaker 1: to the Globe on Bluebird Radio. Alright, just got about 531 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:27,960 Speaker 1: ten minutes left into today's trading session. We are getting 532 00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:30,680 Speaker 1: ready to wrap up the Thursday trade. A very different 533 00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:33,840 Speaker 1: tone from what we saw posts that fed decision yesterday. 534 00:26:33,840 --> 00:26:35,840 Speaker 1: We are bouncing off our loads of the session, but 535 00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:38,720 Speaker 1: big tech tech in particular. If I take a look 536 00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:40,960 Speaker 1: at the NASAC, it is down about two point six percent, 537 00:26:41,080 --> 00:26:44,520 Speaker 1: down three hundred ninety three points in today's session. So 538 00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:46,879 Speaker 1: if you're looking for where investors are kind of running 539 00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:49,120 Speaker 1: for the exit, it is certainly among those big tech. 540 00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:51,720 Speaker 1: Having said that big tech, still, if you want to 541 00:26:51,720 --> 00:26:54,960 Speaker 1: look at out performance for the year one, it's big tech. Yeah, 542 00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:56,520 Speaker 1: it really is. But if you look at the NASTAC 543 00:26:56,560 --> 00:26:59,760 Speaker 1: on Carol thirty, only thirty of the one stocks in 544 00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:02,160 Speaker 1: the n S actually in the green. Let's talk about 545 00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:05,080 Speaker 1: this in more with Gary Black, portfolio manager at Future 546 00:27:05,119 --> 00:27:07,080 Speaker 1: Fund Active E TF. He joins us on the phone 547 00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:11,040 Speaker 1: from Chicago. Gary, how are you great? Thanks for having 548 00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:12,879 Speaker 1: me join you. Well, let's talk a little bit about 549 00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:15,760 Speaker 1: about tech and big tech today. Um, what was the 550 00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:18,120 Speaker 1: big change between yesterday and today when we saw tech 551 00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:20,320 Speaker 1: rally after we heard from Fed church er own Powell 552 00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:24,240 Speaker 1: versus today, what changed. Well, I think you're seeing a 553 00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:27,639 Speaker 1: little bit that the market is suddenly worrying about a 554 00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:32,320 Speaker 1: Fed policy mistake because you know, you see, obviously you heard, 555 00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:34,800 Speaker 1: you know, the tapering will be accelerated. People are starting 556 00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:37,000 Speaker 1: to think, okay, that there's gonna be three interest rate 557 00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:40,080 Speaker 1: hikes next year. Um. But then when you look at 558 00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:43,400 Speaker 1: the tenure treasury, you know, um tenure treasury is continuing 559 00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:45,439 Speaker 1: to follow the yield, so you got the yield down 560 00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:48,680 Speaker 1: to one four three. So while the Fed is saying, look, 561 00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:50,680 Speaker 1: we're gonna take three hikes next year, at least the 562 00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:52,880 Speaker 1: dot plot implies are gonna take three hikes next year, 563 00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:56,719 Speaker 1: three hikes in three And you know that, as they 564 00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:58,440 Speaker 1: call it, the so called term will, it'll be about 565 00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:01,200 Speaker 1: too one. The tenure isn't moving up the ten years 566 00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:03,560 Speaker 1: at one fourth thrace. So the bond market is I guess, 567 00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:06,040 Speaker 1: you know, a little skeptical of that. So then you 568 00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:09,520 Speaker 1: think about technology. Usually when rates go down, um, you know, 569 00:28:09,640 --> 00:28:14,000 Speaker 1: longer duration assets such as technology, technology get hurt. But 570 00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:16,200 Speaker 1: I don't think it's that so much as people are saying, well, 571 00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:19,560 Speaker 1: maybe there's a mistake on the horizon, they're um, you 572 00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:23,680 Speaker 1: know forward, Well, if you start moving rates up, let's 573 00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:25,880 Speaker 1: suppose that you know, the tapering is not a big deal. 574 00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:28,320 Speaker 1: That's just qui qui is going to continue it. You know, 575 00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:30,720 Speaker 1: it'll be sixty billion next month and thirty billion the 576 00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:33,639 Speaker 1: following month and it will disappear March. So it's just 577 00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:36,080 Speaker 1: you know, no more funds being added to the system, 578 00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:39,120 Speaker 1: and that's q E. And you're seeing the ECB announced 579 00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:42,640 Speaker 1: the same thing that they're tapering wind in March. But 580 00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:45,360 Speaker 1: if rates start moving up, which is what you saw 581 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:48,280 Speaker 1: last night, the Bank of England surprisingly raised it's it's 582 00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:51,840 Speaker 1: you know, minor amount fifteen BIPs to forty BIPs. If 583 00:28:51,840 --> 00:28:54,200 Speaker 1: you start seeing raids move up three times next year, 584 00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:56,520 Speaker 1: you know there's always a risk that the FED is 585 00:28:56,600 --> 00:29:00,640 Speaker 1: tightening while demand um is starting to fall. And you know, 586 00:29:00,640 --> 00:29:03,160 Speaker 1: the big wild card here is COVID and if COVID 587 00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:06,840 Speaker 1: you know, continues to spread and and and you know 588 00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:10,800 Speaker 1: close and this is a big worry, um cancelations of shows, 589 00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:14,640 Speaker 1: restaurant closings, UM, school closings, and then you're going to 590 00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:16,440 Speaker 1: see a hit to GDP, which is what you saw 591 00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:19,920 Speaker 1: back last March, you know, two thousand twenty when COVID hits, 592 00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:22,480 Speaker 1: So you could have the same time as growth slowing dramatically, 593 00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:25,440 Speaker 1: you could have the FED tightening. Now. I don't worry 594 00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:27,320 Speaker 1: too much about that because I think the Fed is smart. 595 00:29:27,400 --> 00:29:29,480 Speaker 1: J Pal you know, in the past, has has talked 596 00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:32,120 Speaker 1: about transitory inflation, and we can get in you know, 597 00:29:32,120 --> 00:29:33,960 Speaker 1: whether inflation is transit or not. You have to define 598 00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:36,560 Speaker 1: what's transitory. But I do believe that if you see 599 00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:40,600 Speaker 1: COVID continue to um, you know, be more rampant, and 600 00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:43,360 Speaker 1: if you see economic roaths start to slow, um, they'll 601 00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:45,720 Speaker 1: they'll quickly reverse course if they have to. It's great, 602 00:29:46,080 --> 00:29:47,720 Speaker 1: that's what you're seeing. To the markets afraid of this 603 00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:50,880 Speaker 1: our New Economy Daily on newsletter that came out this morning, 604 00:29:50,920 --> 00:29:53,240 Speaker 1: and they set a big threat the Lady economist Rudiger 605 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:56,080 Speaker 1: jorn Bush once saying that the most that most US 606 00:29:56,120 --> 00:29:58,400 Speaker 1: expansions are murdered by the Federal Reserve. I mean it's 607 00:29:58,400 --> 00:30:01,200 Speaker 1: a policy misstep. Having said that, you've got a fun 608 00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:04,400 Speaker 1: you've got the future fun active ETF. I think it's 609 00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:07,440 Speaker 1: off about seven percent since its inception. I guess it 610 00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:10,440 Speaker 1: began trading late August August this year. Now as that 611 00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:12,680 Speaker 1: one hundred up about four percent in the same time frame, 612 00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:16,280 Speaker 1: you are still though deciding whether to add positions or 613 00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:19,200 Speaker 1: sell positions. What have you done in this environment? What 614 00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:21,760 Speaker 1: changes have you made to that portfolio? And your top 615 00:30:21,800 --> 00:30:25,240 Speaker 1: holdings include names like Tesla, Alphabet tenst and Harley Davidson 616 00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:29,520 Speaker 1: correct and so you know the stuff that is getting hurt. 617 00:30:30,120 --> 00:30:32,600 Speaker 1: Uh and as market it takes something like Tesla. You know, 618 00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:36,160 Speaker 1: it's it's what we call longer duration equity. You know, 619 00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:38,560 Speaker 1: most of the cash flows come towards the end. You know, 620 00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:41,600 Speaker 1: they make money, but you know as the growth accelerates 621 00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:43,400 Speaker 1: over the next three or four years, where they really 622 00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:46,000 Speaker 1: start making my where the value is is more in 623 00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:49,880 Speaker 1: the you know, five or six years out um. And 624 00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:53,400 Speaker 1: so those longer duration assets as people worry about inflation, 625 00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:56,640 Speaker 1: as interest rates rise and then they were talking about 626 00:30:56,680 --> 00:30:59,680 Speaker 1: the ten year treasury. If the tenure treasury starts rising, 627 00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:02,520 Speaker 1: you're to see the longer duration assets get hurt. And 628 00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:04,880 Speaker 1: so you know, names like a Tesla are not going 629 00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:07,040 Speaker 1: to do well in theory in that environment. So do 630 00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:11,160 Speaker 1: you sell? Do you buy into that more? It's down 631 00:31:12,200 --> 00:31:15,520 Speaker 1: Since early November, you've been buying yes. And the reason 632 00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:18,200 Speaker 1: is because there's nothing, no change of fundamentals. When you 633 00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:21,160 Speaker 1: look at earnings revisions, which is you know it's the 634 00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:25,160 Speaker 1: it's the Cell Sides estimates of volumes and earnings forward, 635 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:27,920 Speaker 1: they've actually gone up. The only reason Tesla is down 636 00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:31,600 Speaker 1: twenty only reason is because Elon Musk. Because you know, 637 00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:34,360 Speaker 1: he's in a very convoluted way. He's been selling shares 638 00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:37,520 Speaker 1: and when you know, you when when normally want a 639 00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:39,760 Speaker 1: CEO cells, let's call it two percent of the the flow, 640 00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:41,720 Speaker 1: which is what he wants selling. You know, they would 641 00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:43,800 Speaker 1: just call up Goldmen or Morgan Stanley and they would say, 642 00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:45,760 Speaker 1: do a secondary and let's get it done. It would 643 00:31:45,760 --> 00:31:48,000 Speaker 1: be a three or four percent haircut. Here he's been 644 00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:50,920 Speaker 1: selling shares now for six weeks. And you know, if 645 00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:54,000 Speaker 1: you're a long only portfolio manager or if you you 646 00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:56,240 Speaker 1: know you want to add to the position, you're gonna 647 00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:58,800 Speaker 1: wait until after the selling is done to do that. 648 00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:01,600 Speaker 1: So this is a very different situation. And I think, 649 00:32:01,640 --> 00:32:03,800 Speaker 1: you know, like something like Google, which is not down 650 00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:06,800 Speaker 1: that much. Google is you know, very cheap stock relative 651 00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:09,280 Speaker 1: to its growth. Um, you know it's going to do 652 00:32:09,320 --> 00:32:11,240 Speaker 1: fine in its firement. But but Tesla will do fine 653 00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:14,760 Speaker 1: once Elon stops selling. Okay, let's go from from teslata Google. 654 00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:19,800 Speaker 1: What you just mentioned six so far this year, it's 655 00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:22,600 Speaker 1: been an incredible run. Um are you adding to your 656 00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:24,600 Speaker 1: position right now? And you still you said it's actually 657 00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:27,280 Speaker 1: still a good value. How do you see it? We've 658 00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:29,840 Speaker 1: we've added to Google. It's about nine percent of the portfolio. 659 00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:33,160 Speaker 1: Test is about ten UM. You know, YouTube is on fire. 660 00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 1: YouTube is about twelve percent of the revenue ad AD 661 00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:40,160 Speaker 1: revenue we have UM next few years growing about a 662 00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:43,200 Speaker 1: year for YouTube. You know, their basic search business is 663 00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:46,719 Speaker 1: about sixty of the business UM. That's still even though 664 00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:49,080 Speaker 1: it's a cash it's growing in about fifteen percent a year. 665 00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:51,960 Speaker 1: And it fits with one of the big measured friends. 666 00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:53,920 Speaker 1: And we can talk about our fund the way it works, 667 00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:56,400 Speaker 1: but we try to exploit about ten mega friends that 668 00:32:56,400 --> 00:32:59,600 Speaker 1: we see out changing the world. And the social media 669 00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:02,760 Speaker 1: replaced in traditional media is one of those trends. UM 670 00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:08,520 Speaker 1: search spending about fift The cloud is another business. It's 671 00:33:08,560 --> 00:33:10,480 Speaker 1: a little bit less than ten percent of the revenue 672 00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:14,240 Speaker 1: that's growing the year. And the other thing about Google 673 00:33:14,320 --> 00:33:17,080 Speaker 1: is it's gonna be if if the metaverse actually ever 674 00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:19,920 Speaker 1: you know it takes hold, it will be a big 675 00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:23,920 Speaker 1: beneficiary of the metaverse. So um, you get all that 676 00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:27,320 Speaker 1: for about twenty six times twenty two earnings. That's very cheap. 677 00:33:27,920 --> 00:33:31,600 Speaker 1: Um the average called Russell all cap coats stock do 678 00:33:31,600 --> 00:33:34,080 Speaker 1: we look at trades about thirty eight times, so it's cheaper. 679 00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:37,120 Speaker 1: But yet it's growing its revenue seventeen eighteen percent a year. 680 00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:40,480 Speaker 1: It's growing it's earnings here, so from a like price 681 00:33:40,520 --> 00:33:42,880 Speaker 1: earnings to growth basis, it's a very cheap stock the 682 00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:44,640 Speaker 1: way we look at it. All right, well, listen, great 683 00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:46,280 Speaker 1: to spend some time with you, Gary. Thank you so 684 00:33:46,360 --> 00:33:49,080 Speaker 1: much of a good and safe holiday season. Gary Black, 685 00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:52,400 Speaker 1: He's portfolio manager of the Future Fun Active e TF, 686 00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:56,400 Speaker 1: joining us on the phone from Chicago. Thanks for listening 687 00:33:56,440 --> 00:33:59,840 Speaker 1: to Bloomberg Business Week. Download the podcast on iTunes, SoundCloud, 688 00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:02,120 Speaker 1: or Bloomberg dot com. And you can also listen to 689 00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:04,760 Speaker 1: our radio show at two pm Eastern on Bloomberg Radio 690 00:34:04,880 --> 00:34:07,640 Speaker 1: or watch us on YouTube search Bloomberg Global News