Speaker 1: I guess what, mango, what's that? Well, it is officially
Speaker 1: Charlie Brown season. I know, I am so excited. You know,
Speaker 1: right between Thanksgiving and Christmas is when my family buckles
Speaker 1: down and we watch all those specials, and it is wild.
Speaker 1: That's been over fifty years since some of the big
Speaker 1: ones actually came out. But what is weirdest to me
Speaker 1: is that my kids are so into Charlie Brown, like
Speaker 1: it's almost quaint. Ruby had a Peppermint Patty birthday party
Speaker 1: when she turned three because she assumed everyone was into
Speaker 1: Peppermint Patty too, uh, And so we just hand out
Speaker 1: headbands and did at the gym. I love this fact,
Speaker 1: and the fact that probably more than half the kids
Speaker 1: had no idea who Peppermint Patty was, at least going
Speaker 1: into the party. I'm sure Ruby told him all about her.
Speaker 1: But anyway, So, so, why are they so into the specials?
Speaker 1: You know, I have no idea of something just clicked
Speaker 1: with them. But like Henry actually based his Thanksgiving speech
Speaker 1: a few years ago completely on the one that I
Speaker 1: think Charlie Brown gives and Thanksgiving special and and we've
Speaker 1: definitely watched It's a great pumpkin Charlie Brown and Charlie
Speaker 1: Brown Christmas a whole bunch of times. But you know,
Speaker 1: they're even into some of the oddball ones like Race
Speaker 1: for Your Life Charlie Brown, which is about the gang
Speaker 1: going to camp. That's very good. I mean, you did
Speaker 1: hit on some of the big ones there, but I
Speaker 1: do think you forgot one of the most important of
Speaker 1: them all. Really. Oh yeah, of course, It's Arbor Day
Speaker 1: Charlie Brown. I do not think we watched that one.
Speaker 1: Is that a real thing? We're just making that up? Oh,
Speaker 1: it's absolutely a real thing. It was just one of
Speaker 1: the forty five Charlie Brown specials out there, forty five.
Speaker 1: I had no idea that that many. Oh man, I'm surprised,
Speaker 1: Like you don't watch It's the Easter Beagle Charlie Brown
Speaker 1: every single east. I don't know how could be Easter
Speaker 1: without that special. And actually there's also It's Your First
Speaker 1: Kiss Charlie Brown, which is another classic and also I
Speaker 1: guess kind of weird. But we've got a lot of
Speaker 1: catching up to do here, and with the holiday season
Speaker 1: upon us, what we thought now would be the perfect
Speaker 1: time to look into the history of our favorite melon
Speaker 1: colleague Grade schoolers. So we'll talk about the origin of
Speaker 1: the comics trip, including the real life inspiration behind some
Speaker 1: of the characters, the story of how the beloved Christmas
Speaker 1: Special came to be, and how it was very nearly
Speaker 1: canceled in production. Now, of course, we'll also talk a
Speaker 1: little bit about the reason why creator Charles Schultz hated
Speaker 1: the name Peanuts and why some fans can't stand Snoopy.
Speaker 1: There's a lot to cover, so let's dive in. Hey there,
Speaker 1: podcast listeners, Welcome to Part Time Genius. I'm Will Pearson,
Speaker 1: and as always I'm joined by my good friend Man
Speaker 1: gues Ticketer and on the other side of the soundproof
Speaker 1: glass just shuffling a stack of buttered to It's kind
Speaker 1: of like it's a deck of cars. It's our friends
Speaker 1: and producer Tristan McNeil, and I do have to admit
Speaker 1: when Tristan said he wanted to recreate the famous meal
Speaker 1: from the Peanuts Thanksgiving Special, I really never dreamed it
Speaker 1: would be this theatrical. But it's really quite a show.
Speaker 1: Don't you think you didn't think Tristan would be theatrical?
Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't know. It's just surprised me. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I mean, I have no idea how he's doing this.
Speaker 1: He's wearing those slices like he's a black jack dealer
Speaker 1: or something. But I like that he's giving the Thanksgiving
Speaker 1: Special a little love, and I feel like it's always
Speaker 1: the one that gets overshadowed by both, like the Hallyween
Speaker 1: Special and the Christmas Special. But you know, we've had
Speaker 1: a saft spot for Charlie Brown Thanksgiving at my house,
Speaker 1: especially where um Snoopy puts together that last minute feast
Speaker 1: for Charlie Brown and he's got all that popcorn and pretzels.
Speaker 1: But when the kids are gone, Snoopy and Woodstock are
Speaker 1: just back of their doghouse and they've got a lavish
Speaker 1: spread for themselves with like pumpkin pie, roast and vegetables,
Speaker 1: even this giant cooked turkey, and they're basically living it
Speaker 1: off while the kids are just eating you know, snack food.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's kind of a jerk move, but when
Speaker 1: you think about that, it's it's that mix of whimsy
Speaker 1: and low key meanness that are sort of par for
Speaker 1: the course for peanuts that actually, for instance, did never
Speaker 1: strike you as just a little bit weird that Woodstock
Speaker 1: would help Snoopy carve and eat the turkey. I mean,
Speaker 1: Woodstock is a bird if you haven't noticed. You know
Speaker 1: what's funny about it is that I never actually gave
Speaker 1: it much thought. But it turns out you're not alone
Speaker 1: in this. Lee Mendelssohn, who was the executive producer on
Speaker 1: the Peanuts specials, he actually objected to that scene because
Speaker 1: he was so weird it out by it, But because
Speaker 1: the idea had comes straight from Charles Schultz, the Peanuts creator,
Speaker 1: he was just overruled and the scene aireds planned. But uh,
Speaker 1: you know what was funny is that Mendelssohn did eventually
Speaker 1: get his way. So all these years later, CBS asked
Speaker 1: Mendelssohn to cut three minutes from the special so they
Speaker 1: could fit in, you know, more commercials, and Mendelssohn sees
Speaker 1: the chance and he removed that scene of Woodstock eating turkey,
Speaker 1: so you can only see him eating pie instead. But
Speaker 1: then a few years later, the rights of the special
Speaker 1: move to ABC and the network decided to air it
Speaker 1: on cut, meaning Woodstock is once again accountable. It feels
Speaker 1: a little bit odd to be kicking off our Peanuts
Speaker 1: show with a fact about bird cannibalism, but it also
Speaker 1: kind of feels appropriate, you know, given how dark Charlie
Speaker 1: Brown and his chums could often be. Actually, in fact,
Speaker 1: have you ever seen the very first Peanuts trip? I have,
Speaker 1: and I don't remember it. Yeah, So it shows a
Speaker 1: boy and a girl just sitting on the sidewalk and
Speaker 1: this boy, Scheremy is his name. He says, well, here
Speaker 1: comes good old Charlie Brown. Good old Charlie Brown. Yes, sir,
Speaker 1: good old Charlie Brown. And then when Charlie Brown is
Speaker 1: out of sight, Cheremy adds, how I hate him, you know,
Speaker 1: and that's the punch line. So yeah, there's there's definitely
Speaker 1: some darkness to the world of Peanuts, no matter how
Speaker 1: cute or simplistic the characters might look. But there's also
Speaker 1: incredible warmth and humor there as well, and it feels
Speaker 1: like it's that unique mix that really made Peanuts this
Speaker 1: enduring part of pop culture, not only in the US
Speaker 1: but all around the world. So we've definitely got a
Speaker 1: lot to go through today. But where do you think
Speaker 1: you want to start? Why don't we spend a few
Speaker 1: minutes on the man behind the Peanuts himself, Charles M. Schultz.
Speaker 1: So This name sounds familiar enough because we've all seen
Speaker 1: his name a million times. It's signed at the bottom
Speaker 1: of each and every Peanuts strip, all seventeen thousand eight
Speaker 1: of them. But despite the constant exposure, lots of people
Speaker 1: still misname him as Schultz with the T. It's actually
Speaker 1: s C h U l z. And according to Medium,
Speaker 1: the misspelling is so common that's actually appeared wrong in
Speaker 1: more than thirty thousand articles to Day, as well as
Speaker 1: the original opening to the Peanuts Christmas Special. I guess
Speaker 1: someone caught it at the very last minute, but there
Speaker 1: was an error that was gonna be aired in the
Speaker 1: premier You know, I guess I've actually never thought about this,
Speaker 1: and I'm sure that I'm guilty of making the same mistake.
Speaker 1: But what kind of name is Schultz? Like it is?
Speaker 1: Is it German? Yeah? His dad, Carl Schultz, immigrated from
Speaker 1: Germany to Minnesota, which is where he met charles mom Dina,
Speaker 1: and Charles was this only child. He was born in too.
Speaker 1: He grew up in St. Paul. But what's interesting is
Speaker 1: that St. Paul is one of the few places in
Speaker 1: the country that has both super hot summers and freezing
Speaker 1: cold winters, and It's the same for the Peanuts Kids, right, Like,
Speaker 1: there's so many strips that are centered on these summer
Speaker 1: activities like playing baseball, flying kites, selling lemonade on hot days.
Speaker 1: But then you have a ton of strips where there's
Speaker 1: like a foot of snow on the ground and everyone's
Speaker 1: playing ice hockey. So then it is Peanuts actually set
Speaker 1: in St. Paul. I mean, there's some debate about that.
Speaker 1: Some fans think the strip is set near Santa Rosa, California,
Speaker 1: which is where Schultz lived once the Peanuts became a hit.
Speaker 1: But you know, that doesn't make much sense when you
Speaker 1: look at all all the strips set in the winter.
Speaker 1: But what little evidence there is in the strips does
Speaker 1: kind of point to either St. Paul or Minneapolis as
Speaker 1: their hometown. For instance, there's a strip in nine seven
Speaker 1: that implied that the character has lived in Hennepin County,
Speaker 1: which is in Minnesota, and two years before that there
Speaker 1: was one where Schroeder confesses he always thought his hero
Speaker 1: Beethoven was a native in Minnesota, which you know is
Speaker 1: presumably just like him. All right, Well, although that makes sense,
Speaker 1: and you'd actually expect the cartoonists to set the strip
Speaker 1: about childhood in their hometown. That wouldn't be that surprising,
Speaker 1: and it would be pretty on theme for Schultz, because
Speaker 1: when you look at the comics, so many elements of
Speaker 1: the Peanuts strip turn out to be somewhat biographical. I mean,
Speaker 1: just listen to this breakdown. Shuremy was a childhood friend.
Speaker 1: Schroeder was a caddy at the golf course Schultz worked
Speaker 1: at as a teenager. Linus and Lucy van Pelt got
Speaker 1: their last name from a man's Schultz served in the
Speaker 1: army with. Meanwhile, Lucy's character was inspired by Schultz's first
Speaker 1: wife and his mother. I guess there's a lot to
Speaker 1: unpack there, but that does seem to be the case. Actually,
Speaker 1: I was reading this tribute to Charles Schultz from Bill Waterson,
Speaker 1: who is my hero and uh who did the Colvinant
Speaker 1: Hobbs strips, and he thought of Peanuts as the gold
Speaker 1: standard of comic strips, and this is his take on
Speaker 1: Lucy quote. I was struck less by the fact that
Speaker 1: Schultz drew on his troubled marriage for material than by
Speaker 1: the sympathy that he shows for his torment, and by
Speaker 1: his ability to poke fun at himself, which is actually
Speaker 1: pretty interesting, like, like, you know, Lucy is annoying and
Speaker 1: mean spirited, but you don't ever really hate her for it. Now,
Speaker 1: that's true. And you know he was looking for inspiration everywhere.
Speaker 1: Even line is his famous blue blanket came straight from
Speaker 1: Schultz's life when his daughter was younger, she was obsessed
Speaker 1: with her own security blanket. Yeah. I mean, of course
Speaker 1: you're gonna be stealing from life when you've got like
Speaker 1: a daily deadline and and working at that sort of volume.
Speaker 1: But I think the one character I always think about
Speaker 1: is the little red haired girl who goes unnamed, And uh,
Speaker 1: you know, that's the one that Charlie Brown always had
Speaker 1: that huge crush on. She was apparently based on Schultz's
Speaker 1: girlfriend in the late forties, this redhead named Donna May Johnson,
Speaker 1: and after the war, the two of them worked together
Speaker 1: at this correspondent school in Minneapolis, and after a few
Speaker 1: years of dating, Shells finally worked at the Nerve to
Speaker 1: propose to her, But then Donna May turned him down
Speaker 1: and married a different guy a few months later, and
Speaker 1: it was obviously this huge blow to his pride, but
Speaker 1: in end, the ordeal actually inspired one of Schultz's most
Speaker 1: famous characters, and supposedly he and Donna May remained friends
Speaker 1: for years later. I mean, there are some definite shades
Speaker 1: of Charlie Brown to that story, and you can see
Speaker 1: that throughout his work. Yeah, definitely, And it makes sense
Speaker 1: because both Charlie Brown and Snoopy they're often considered stand
Speaker 1: ins for Schultz himself. In fact, Charles's son, Craig Schultz
Speaker 1: once said about him, each of the characters represents a
Speaker 1: piece of our dad. Charlie Brown was his real self
Speaker 1: and Snoopy was what he wanted to be, which is
Speaker 1: kind of funny to think about, but it makes sense
Speaker 1: and it's both characters also had real world counterparts too.
Speaker 1: Charlie Brown was actually the name of a friend that
Speaker 1: Charles worked with prior to creating Peanuts, and Snoopy was
Speaker 1: based on charles His own childhood dog, this English Pointer,
Speaker 1: not a Beagle who was named Spike and whose name
Speaker 1: would later be used for one of Snoopy's brothers. So
Speaker 1: if Schultz had a dog named Spike, then where's the
Speaker 1: name Snoopy come from? Well, apparently Charles had originally planned
Speaker 1: to call his dog Sniffy, but then he found out
Speaker 1: that another comic featured a dog with the same name,
Speaker 1: so he had to change it to something else. But
Speaker 1: luckily he had this backup. You know, when he was
Speaker 1: a kid, his mother suggested if they ever got another dog,
Speaker 1: they should name him Snoopy, and so that's where the
Speaker 1: name came from. Anyway, back back to the real world
Speaker 1: Snoopy for a second. It's pretty striking how devoted to
Speaker 1: his dog. Charles was, just like Charlie Brown would later
Speaker 1: be with Snoopy. So how how do you mean? Well,
Speaker 1: the very first drawing that Charles ever published was of
Speaker 1: his dog Spike. So Charles was just fifteen years old
Speaker 1: at the time when he submitted this drawing and actually
Speaker 1: a fact along with it to Ripley's Believe it or Not,
Speaker 1: and it got published nationally. I mean, that's pretty cool.
Speaker 1: But what was so unbolouivable about Spike that got him
Speaker 1: published in Ripley's. Well, the drawings caption said that Spike
Speaker 1: was quote a hunting dog that eats pins, tax and
Speaker 1: razor blades, so he didn't exactly have Snoopy's refined palette.
Speaker 1: But it does sound like Spike shared his taste for adventure.
Speaker 1: That was this article and mental flaws about this that
Speaker 1: was talking about. You know, the dog would make a
Speaker 1: break for freedom anytime the door was open and only
Speaker 1: come back because he loved going on car rides. So
Speaker 1: whenever Spike got loose, Charles would run to his dad's
Speaker 1: car and basically just honked the horn as a way
Speaker 1: to lure the dog back. I mean, we we actually
Speaker 1: had a dog like that growing up. She'd run off
Speaker 1: for the only way to get her back was to
Speaker 1: unwrap a slice of American exactly. That's what always works. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean it's so weird that, like that plastic peel
Speaker 1: sound like when it was coming off the craft slices,
Speaker 1: that's what would make her race back to the house.
Speaker 1: But you know, having a dog you keep losing sounds
Speaker 1: very Charlie Brown to me as well. And and uh
Speaker 1: speaking which, some of my favorite Peanuts facts are the
Speaker 1: ones that overlap between Charlie Brown's childhood and Charles Schultz.
Speaker 1: Is like, there's a surface level stuff, but both of
Speaker 1: them had fathers who were barbers. But but then they're
Speaker 1: also those like wonderfully tragic tidbits from Schultz's life that
Speaker 1: feels so Charlie Brown, Like his dad used to give
Speaker 1: him haircuts but when customers came in, he'd have to
Speaker 1: hop out of the chair. So you just have to
Speaker 1: grump around and wander about with half a haircut until
Speaker 1: that finished it up. I which does sound so very
Speaker 1: Charlie Brown. It's pretty great, yeah, I know. And there
Speaker 1: was actually one time when Shultston line at a movie
Speaker 1: theater because they were handing out candy bars to the
Speaker 1: first kids to buy tickets that day, and of course
Speaker 1: Schultz was the hundred first kid in line. You know.
Speaker 1: When when he was in high school, Schultz's teacher convince
Speaker 1: him to draw some comics for a senior year book.
Speaker 1: And so Schultz, of course, being super timid and socially awkward,
Speaker 1: he's a little nervous, but he desperately wants to be
Speaker 1: a cartoonist, so he overcomes a shyness he submits artwork,
Speaker 1: and then when the yearbook comes out, of course everyone
Speaker 1: had forgotten to include his work, Like, not a single
Speaker 1: one of his cartoons got used. That's a tough break,
Speaker 1: but you know, it is interesting to see that that
Speaker 1: not every aspect of Peanuts is drawn from Schultza's own experience.
Speaker 1: You know, if you take the character Franklin, for instance,
Speaker 1: he was introduced as the comic strips first black character.
Speaker 1: And now this was in July of nineteen sixty eight,
Speaker 1: and this was just a few months after the assassination
Speaker 1: of M. L. K Jr. Yeah, it's amazing that that's
Speaker 1: fifty years ago this year. And and uh and this
Speaker 1: was based on a reader's suggestion, right, yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1: The reader was a mother of three named Harriett Glickman,
Speaker 1: and she wrote to Schultz just a few days after
Speaker 1: the death of Martin Luther King. And now in that note,
Speaker 1: the Glickman noted the power that mass media has to
Speaker 1: shape what she called the unconscious attitudes of our kids.
Speaker 1: So she has Schultz to add one or more black
Speaker 1: characters to his trips. And this was so that children
Speaker 1: could see that respect and friendship was possible between people
Speaker 1: of all races. And Schultz was pretty moved by the idea,
Speaker 1: but he didn't add the character immediately. He was actually
Speaker 1: a little bit nervous that the move might seem to
Speaker 1: be patronizing to black readers. But as Glickman continued to
Speaker 1: correspond with him over the course of several months, you know,
Speaker 1: he decided to change his mind on this and on
Speaker 1: July one, he wrote to say that Glickman should watch
Speaker 1: for the new character to appear by the end of
Speaker 1: the month, which of course he did. And so does
Speaker 1: show suffer any blowback from from this when when when
Speaker 1: the strip comes out, Well, you know, you had some
Speaker 1: black readers that did argue that Franklin was a bland
Speaker 1: character and therefore somewhat patronizing, but in general readers appreciated
Speaker 1: the added representation as well as you know how kind
Speaker 1: and worry free Franklin was compared with other Peanuts kids.
Speaker 1: But it still it was undoubtedly a tense time for
Speaker 1: America for an artist to debut what was essentially the
Speaker 1: first minority character in a mainstream comic strip. But other
Speaker 1: than this brief exchange where Franklin mentions that his father
Speaker 1: was a soldier in Vietnam, there's really nothing overtly political
Speaker 1: about his inclusion. Like Charlie Brown loses his beach ball,
Speaker 1: only to have it found and returned to him by
Speaker 1: a boy named Franklin, and then the boys decided to
Speaker 1: build a sandcastle together, which is of course very sweet. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but they're definitely a bit of backlash from this. You
Speaker 1: had several newspaper editors from southern states that wrote to
Speaker 1: Schultz demanding that he stopped using the character, or at
Speaker 1: the very least that he Alwaids showing Franklin in school
Speaker 1: with the other white characters, which is just mind boggling
Speaker 1: to think about. But his response was pretty straightforward. So
Speaker 1: here's what he told an interviewer years later about the incident.
Speaker 1: I never paid any attention to those things. And I
Speaker 1: remember telling United Features President Larry Rutman at the time
Speaker 1: about Franklin. He wanted me to change it, and we
Speaker 1: talked about it for a long while on the phone,
Speaker 1: and I finally sighed, and I said, well, Larry, let's
Speaker 1: put it this way. Either you print it just the
Speaker 1: way I draw it, or I quit. How's that? So
Speaker 1: that's the way it ended. I mean, that is so awesome,
Speaker 1: and it's nice to hear that, like, despite whatever reservations
Speaker 1: he might have had at the beginning, she ultimately went
Speaker 1: to bat for Franklin in this really big way. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you know, I know we wanted to talk about
Speaker 1: an earlier occasion when Schultz butted heads with upper management,
Speaker 1: and this time about what the strip should be called.
Speaker 1: But before we get into that, let's take a quick break.
Speaker 1: You're listening to Part Time Genius, and we're talking about
Speaker 1: cartoonists Charles Schultz and his beloved Peanuts comic strips. So,
Speaker 1: you know, to be clear, there was one thing that
Speaker 1: she definitely did not love about his own strip, and
Speaker 1: that was the title. So back in n when he
Speaker 1: first pitched the strip to be carried by the United
Speaker 1: Feature Syndicate, Schultz insisted the title should be Little Folks,
Speaker 1: which maybe wasn't the most creative title, but it does seem,
Speaker 1: i don't know, somewhat fitting if you think about how
Speaker 1: so many of his characters they read like these little
Speaker 1: kids with grown up type worries, and like they're plagued
Speaker 1: by this level of anxiety and almost neurosis that's typically reserved,
Speaker 1: you know, for adults. Yeah, but whether it's fitting or not,
Speaker 1: the executives had this different problem with it. So there
Speaker 1: was already a strip called Little Folks, except with the
Speaker 1: word little all spelled out instead of little like it,
Speaker 1: and then there was also a little abner the comic strip.
Speaker 1: So they're worried that readers might confuse the titles, or
Speaker 1: worse that the creators of the rival strips might sue
Speaker 1: them for copyright infringement. So instead, the production manager at
Speaker 1: the syndicate decided to call the strip Peanuts. And I
Speaker 1: guess this was a reference to the Howdy Duty show
Speaker 1: that was pretty popular at the time. When kids came
Speaker 1: to tapings, they sat in the Peanut Gallery. So the
Speaker 1: production manager thought, you know, like he'd rip off that
Speaker 1: idea and just called the small Kids Peanuts. I do
Speaker 1: like that their solution to not being sued was to
Speaker 1: rip off a TV show instead, but either, I know,
Speaker 1: I mean, the other theory is that they just thought
Speaker 1: Little Folks was a weak title, but they didn't want
Speaker 1: to upset Shultz. Um not that he wasn't upset anyway.
Speaker 1: In the interview, he was still angry about the Peanuts title,
Speaker 1: and he said, quote, it's totally ridiculous, has no meaning,
Speaker 1: is simply confusing, and has no dignity. And I think
Speaker 1: my humor has dignity, which is sad that you never
Speaker 1: got to change the name. But you know, of course,
Speaker 1: once this strip took off, he was kind of stuck
Speaker 1: with the title. And uh, what's funny to me is
Speaker 1: that schill Is actually avoided using the title himself, like
Speaker 1: he claimed that whenever someone asked him what he did
Speaker 1: for a living, you just tell them I draw that
Speaker 1: comic strip with Snoopy in it, Charlie Brown and his Daughter. Well,
Speaker 1: whatever you call it, there's no question that Schultz's comic
Speaker 1: was a runaway hit once the strip gained a little
Speaker 1: bit of steam. So it was published in just seven
Speaker 1: US newspapers when it debuted back in October of nineteen.
Speaker 1: Well by the end of its fifty year run and
Speaker 1: two thousand, the comic was being translated in over twenty
Speaker 1: different languages, published in seventy five different countries, and had
Speaker 1: grown its global readership to his staggering three hundred and
Speaker 1: fifty five million people. So in total, over fifteen thousand
Speaker 1: daily strips and Sunday strips were produced, all written, inked,
Speaker 1: and lettered by Charles Schultz himself. I mean, it was
Speaker 1: this unprecedented run, and actually so unprecedented that the media
Speaker 1: scholar Robert Thompson once called the fifty year story of
Speaker 1: Charlie Brown and his Pals arguably the longest told story
Speaker 1: by a single artist in human history. I mean, that's
Speaker 1: really incredible to think about. So what do you think
Speaker 1: made it click with people? For such a long time. Well,
Speaker 1: I think a big part of it goes back to
Speaker 1: something that we mentioned at the top of the show,
Speaker 1: which is the way the strip really found this middle
Speaker 1: ground in terms of tone. I mean, it was funny
Speaker 1: and sometimes sweet, but there was always kind of this prickly,
Speaker 1: world weary feeling underlying the humor there. And you know,
Speaker 1: as it turns out, this was all by design. So
Speaker 1: Schultz believed that happiness and humor didn't really mix, which
Speaker 1: is of course why Charlie Brown never does get to
Speaker 1: kick that football. And he know. Shultz also dealt with
Speaker 1: bounts of depression in his own life, and one way
Speaker 1: he found relief was by channeling his anxieties directly into
Speaker 1: his art, which makes a lot of sense, And the
Speaker 1: result is a strip with a somewhat despairing worldview and
Speaker 1: and one where as Schultz once explained, here's what he
Speaker 1: said about He said, all the loves are unrequited, all
Speaker 1: the baseball games were lost, all the test scores or
Speaker 1: d minuses, the great Pumpkin never comes, and the football
Speaker 1: is always pulled away like when you described so hopefully
Speaker 1: it really does. Yeah, it's funny that Sills like completely
Speaker 1: stuck to that formula for the strip's entire run. Uh so,
Speaker 1: I guess things did get a little cheerier in the
Speaker 1: mid to late sixties once the TV special started like
Speaker 1: and and uh, well, that merchandizing really kicked into high gear.
Speaker 1: I've actually heard that most fans use the rise of
Speaker 1: Snoopy and pop culture is kind of a turning point
Speaker 1: in the strips run. And uh, you know, there's this
Speaker 1: first decade or so where Snoopy is more or less
Speaker 1: this normal dog in the strip. He he walks on
Speaker 1: four legs, He he doesn't communicate through toop balloons, and
Speaker 1: he doesn't even have a clear owner in the strips
Speaker 1: like much less this tricked out doghouse. And weirdly, this
Speaker 1: is also the period where the human characters were what
Speaker 1: the creator of Little Abner called good, mean little bastards
Speaker 1: eager to hurt one another. But as the sixties donned,
Speaker 1: Shills began to capitalize in his creation with licensing deals
Speaker 1: and product tie ins, which caused that public perception of
Speaker 1: Peanuts to shift, and suddenly the characters were seen as
Speaker 1: much sweeter and kinder than the strips had ever really been.
Speaker 1: And while the newer strips never really lost their edge completely,
Speaker 1: and Charlie Brown remained the world's you know, punching bag.
Speaker 1: Snoopy did begin to take on more and more of
Speaker 1: the limelight, and as this happened, the character became less
Speaker 1: and less like a real dog. By the late sixties,
Speaker 1: Snoopy was walking on two legs, He was composing love
Speaker 1: letters with a typewriter in his doghouse. He was also
Speaker 1: spending a lot less time around the human characters, and
Speaker 1: instead he was either hanging out with his new animal
Speaker 1: friends like Woodstock, or he was off by himself, sort
Speaker 1: of waging these imaginary wars against the villainous Red Baron.
Speaker 1: But you know, in other words, things took a much
Speaker 1: zanier turn, and lots of Peanuts fans kind of think
Speaker 1: of that as when the strip kind of jumped the shark.
Speaker 1: I don't know. Some people must have liked these changes, though,
Speaker 1: right because Snoopy never became a normal dog again, So
Speaker 1: it feels like something must have been working. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean so, some readers thought the new Snoopy was the
Speaker 1: breath of fresh air, especially in contrast to how bleak
Speaker 1: the kids could be sometimes, And and that really does
Speaker 1: make sense when you think about how the other character
Speaker 1: has never really react to Snoopy's changes. Um, you know,
Speaker 1: he suddenly has this whole inner world that's generally much
Speaker 1: more positive and upbeat than that of the kids, but
Speaker 1: they still kind of just treating him like a regular dog.
Speaker 1: Which is interesting because I wonder what such a sharp
Speaker 1: turn and characterization says about what was going on, you know,
Speaker 1: for Schultz at the time, like in his own life.
Speaker 1: And you know, I got this new freewheeling Snoopy who
Speaker 1: was supposedly the person or the character. I guess that
Speaker 1: Schultz always wanted to be, you know, somebody who was
Speaker 1: adventurous and care free instead of being bogged down by
Speaker 1: doubt and worry all the time. And so, you know,
Speaker 1: you think about this time in his life, and maybe
Speaker 1: by the sixties and seventies, you know, all this fame
Speaker 1: and fortune that Schultz finally made made him feel like
Speaker 1: that kind of person. I guess if he was happier
Speaker 1: in his personal life, it would make sense to he
Speaker 1: might want to revel in that feeling and focus more
Speaker 1: on Snoopy. Yeah. I think there's probably some truth to that,
Speaker 1: but from many fans perspectives, the new Snoopy, and by extension,
Speaker 1: the new Schultz were nothing to celebrate. They saw the slicker,
Speaker 1: flashy air Snoopy as kind of like hard proof that Schultz,
Speaker 1: who is now this millionaire cartoonist, had kind of lost
Speaker 1: touch with those insecurities that had made Charlie Brown so
Speaker 1: relatable in the first place. So The Atlantic actually did
Speaker 1: an article on this, and they subbed up the feeling
Speaker 1: this way quote. There was something fundamentally rotten about the
Speaker 1: new Snoopy, whose charm was based on his total lack
Speaker 1: of concern about what others thought of him. His confidence,
Speaker 1: his breezy sense that the world may be falling apart,
Speaker 1: but one can still dance on was worse than irritating.
Speaker 1: It was morally bankrupt. Two legged Snoopy with his airs
Speaker 1: and fantasies, peerless Snoopy, rich Snoopy, popular Snoopy, world famous Snoopy,
Speaker 1: contented Snoopy that spoiled everything good Lord, I mean, like
Speaker 1: so overthought on the one hand, but I mean, I
Speaker 1: guess I get what they're saying, but it still feels
Speaker 1: pretty harsh to pin all of that on Snoopy. And
Speaker 1: when you think about the strips where Snoopy's imagining all
Speaker 1: of these wild and kind of high flying adventures. They
Speaker 1: usually end with a reality bursting his bubble in some way,
Speaker 1: and like all of a sudden, Snoopy feels cold, so
Speaker 1: we're back on top of his doghouse and sharing the
Speaker 1: desert or wherever. But I don't know, things like that
Speaker 1: always made me feel like Snoopy's flights of fancy were
Speaker 1: there were really just another coping mechanism for how tough
Speaker 1: life can be. Where that was like Linus's blanket or
Speaker 1: Lucy's hot temper. But I don't know, that just seems
Speaker 1: like such a harsh reaction, And you think about this.
Speaker 1: Snoopy would talk a good game, but at the end
Speaker 1: of the day, he's just a pop So I don't know.
Speaker 1: To me, there's something endearing about that. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: I agree with that, and I think Schultz would as well.
Speaker 1: In was being interviewed on the Tonight Show just as
Speaker 1: he was announcing his retirement, and he observed that quote.
Speaker 1: Snoopy likes to think that he's this independent dog who
Speaker 1: does all these things and leads his own life, but
Speaker 1: he always makes sure that he never gets too far
Speaker 1: from the suffer dish. All right, Well, now that we've
Speaker 1: talked a little more about the unique tone and mood
Speaker 1: of the Peanuts strips, what do you say we take
Speaker 1: a look at how that translated into all those TV
Speaker 1: specials and definitely, but first let's take a quick break, Okay, mangoes.
Speaker 1: So we established earlier that you didn't exactly do your
Speaker 1: homework by watching n is It's Arbor Day Charlie Brown.
Speaker 1: So I guess we'll have to talk about that in
Speaker 1: a later episode, maybe a dedicated episode just to that.
Speaker 1: But it's actually not the only unusual title. I mean,
Speaker 1: there's some other chestnuts in the mix, like Someday You'll
Speaker 1: find her Charlie Brown, which sounds a little bleak, and
Speaker 1: my personal favorite, why Charlie Brown? Why? Why? Indeed? That's
Speaker 1: that's a crazy title. Well, I think because money Mango.
Speaker 1: I mean, the first Peanuts special was such a giant
Speaker 1: ratings hit for CBS that the network immediately commissioned four
Speaker 1: more specials and obviously many more to follow that, which
Speaker 1: is fair enough, but I think for everyone's sake, whould
Speaker 1: probably just stick to a special that people have actually seen. So,
Speaker 1: but why don't we talk a little bit about the
Speaker 1: one that people will be watching for the million time
Speaker 1: in the next few weeks, which is to Charlie Brown Christmas.
Speaker 1: That makes sense. So what do you want to say
Speaker 1: first about it? Well, how about the fact that nobody
Speaker 1: involved in the special thought it was actually going to work.
Speaker 1: And it's actually hard to imagine this now, but you know, um,
Speaker 1: there were a lot of factors working against it while
Speaker 1: it was in production, and a lot of those actually
Speaker 1: stemmed from controversial choices that Schultz himself insisted on, like
Speaker 1: what so for starters, Schultz insisted that the Peanuts kids
Speaker 1: be voiced by real children, and this meant the crew
Speaker 1: would be working with mostly non professionals, many of whom
Speaker 1: were too young memorize their lines or even to read
Speaker 1: in some cases, so most of the child actors had
Speaker 1: to have their lines fed to them a few words
Speaker 1: at a time. It was all done by that long
Speaker 1: suffering director and the voice of Snoopy, Bill Melendez. I mean,
Speaker 1: just hearing that it does make me realize that in
Speaker 1: the specials the voices do sound a little choppy, like
Speaker 1: the way kids talk isn't exactly seamless. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: there's not a lot of rhythm to the senses, and
Speaker 1: if you listen close enough, you can actually hear the
Speaker 1: scenes between the words, where like different parts of the
Speaker 1: line were stitched together and post But these untrained actors
Speaker 1: were just the first of many notes that ended up
Speaker 1: jeopardizing the project, and these were all coming from Schultz.
Speaker 1: So another shake up came when Schultz refused to let
Speaker 1: the network use the laugh track to I guess kind
Speaker 1: of cue the viewers on the jokes, which is so
Speaker 1: strange because it is hard to imagine it now with
Speaker 1: a laugh track. Yeah, but I guess laugh tracks were
Speaker 1: common practice at the time, even in cartoons like uh
Speaker 1: you know, the Flintstones obviously relied on rue and I
Speaker 1: think the Jetsons to. But but when uh Lee Mendelssohn
Speaker 1: mentioned the idea to Schultz, the artist simply got up
Speaker 1: and left the room, And then a few minutes later
Speaker 1: Schultz came back and carried on the conversation as if
Speaker 1: nothing had happened, which does sound a little bit like
Speaker 1: a George Costanza tactic. You know, it's pretty funny, Yeah, totally,
Speaker 1: And I guess Mendelssohn read between the lines on that
Speaker 1: and never brought up the laugh track again. Wow, what
Speaker 1: about some of the heavier stuff in the special, like
Speaker 1: the commercialization of Christmas? And that's see where Linus reads
Speaker 1: from the Bible, like with Shultz behind those kinds of
Speaker 1: decisions too. Yeah, definitely, it was really important to him
Speaker 1: that the special explore what he called the true meaning
Speaker 1: of Christmas, which is why Linus reads the story of
Speaker 1: Jesus's birth straight from the Gospel of Luke. And this
Speaker 1: was a super risky move at the time because, according
Speaker 1: to The Atlantic, less than nine percent of Christmas episodes
Speaker 1: and specials from the era contained any religious references of
Speaker 1: any kind, much less direct quotes from scripture. So surprisingly,
Speaker 1: CBS didn't object to this inclusion, and not that it.
Speaker 1: Coca Cola, who was the special sponsor um the producer, though,
Speaker 1: was super nervous, and he told shots that no animated
Speaker 1: character had ever read from the Bible before, which was
Speaker 1: all the more reason to Schultz, and he told Mendelssohn, well,
Speaker 1: if we don't do it, who will. I mean, I
Speaker 1: guess that's true, but that was still a pretty big
Speaker 1: gamble at the time. I mean, CBS and Coke must
Speaker 1: have really liked what they saw if they let the
Speaker 1: reference pass without you know, much more scrutiny. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean you think so. But this executive from Coke's ad
Speaker 1: agency actually visited the crew halfway through production and he
Speaker 1: said the special was shaping up to be a total disaster.
Speaker 1: And and CBS thought the same thing when they screened
Speaker 1: like this early cut of it just a few weeks
Speaker 1: before the premiere. They said there was two little action
Speaker 1: that the whole thing moved way too slowly, and not
Speaker 1: to mention the low energy voice acting and the jazzy soundtrack,
Speaker 1: which they just found grading for some reason. But Bill
Speaker 1: Melendez later said that the network would have scrapped the
Speaker 1: entire special except that they had made this commitment to
Speaker 1: Coke and it was kind of too late to back out.
Speaker 1: So the show went on as scheduled, and to everyone's shock,
Speaker 1: viewers just tuned in and droves. Like I want to say, um,
Speaker 1: half of all American households with the TV tuned in
Speaker 1: to watch the special that night, which was apparently fifteen
Speaker 1: million people at the time. And a few months later,
Speaker 1: Charles Schultz and Lee Mendelssohn were on stage at the
Speaker 1: Emmy's actually accepting the award for Outstanding children's program. It
Speaker 1: was the surprise hit that no one had seen coming,
Speaker 1: and that included Charles Schultz himself. He later told TV
Speaker 1: Guide in the continued success of the special has surprised
Speaker 1: me as much as anyone. A lot of the drawings
Speaker 1: are terrible, and of course those terrible drawings are based
Speaker 1: on his own designs. Yeah, I guess we shouldn't be
Speaker 1: too surprised that Schultz would, you know, take this class
Speaker 1: half empty approach when judging oone work. But uh, you know,
Speaker 1: for all the fanciful touches in his stories, like kite
Speaker 1: eating trees and Canaan fighter pilots, you know, Peanuts is
Speaker 1: really a strip about simple truths. It's characters are vulnerable,
Speaker 1: just like the creator and all of us, really and
Speaker 1: and there's no grand finale or cathartic resolution to the stories,
Speaker 1: and that's probably what makes the strips, you know, ring
Speaker 1: so true to us. Yeah, you know, I've actually been
Speaker 1: thinking a lot this week about a quote that Schultz
Speaker 1: gave in an interview, and it was actually with Penthouse,
Speaker 1: of all places, but he was talking about how much
Speaker 1: of his own life is wrapped up in the strip
Speaker 1: and what he hoped to accomplish with it, and and
Speaker 1: here's what he had to say about it. Of course
Speaker 1: I could grind out daily gags, but I'm not interested
Speaker 1: in simply doing gags. I'm interested in doing a strip
Speaker 1: that says something and make some comment on the important
Speaker 1: things of life. And I really think that Mantra bleeds
Speaker 1: through in every single one of his strips, and they
Speaker 1: show us that life is made up of both small,
Speaker 1: hard one triumphs and these bitterly felt disappointments, and not
Speaker 1: always an equal measure either. But you know the important
Speaker 1: thing is to pick yourself up and never stop trying.
Speaker 1: And you know Charles Schultz understood that, and I feel like,
Speaker 1: thanks to his work, lots of other people, including us,
Speaker 1: do too. Definitely. But you know, before we dive into
Speaker 1: this delicious feast of buttered toast and jelly beans that
Speaker 1: Tristan has prepared for us, but what do you say
Speaker 1: we sneak in a quick fact off. I don't know
Speaker 1: if I can hold off, but let's try. M So,
Speaker 1: did you know that NASA gives out an award every
Speaker 1: year called the Silver Snoopy. It's actually a silver pin,
Speaker 1: and instead of going to astronauts, it actually is the
Speaker 1: astronauts who give the awards to the staff and the
Speaker 1: researchers that helped support them. So this program started in
Speaker 1: the sixties, and you're probably wondering why Snoopy. Well, at
Speaker 1: the time, NASA had just suffered the disaster with the
Speaker 1: Apollo one mission and they were looking for something uplifting
Speaker 1: that people could really get behind, and there was nothing
Speaker 1: bigger than Snoopy at the time. So today the pins
Speaker 1: go for about a thousand dollars on eBay and now
Speaker 1: claims every pen goes to space and comes back before
Speaker 1: it's handed out. Oh, I really like that. So you know,
Speaker 1: when when Charles Schultz moved away from Minnesota as an adult,
Speaker 1: he he never actually gave up his love of ice hockey,
Speaker 1: So when one ice skating rink that was close to
Speaker 1: his home in California closed in the sixties, he actually
Speaker 1: had one built and according to mental Flass, he loved
Speaker 1: the Swiss alpine themed arena so much that he ate
Speaker 1: both breakfast and lunch there every day at its warm
Speaker 1: puppy snack bar. And he also used to play pickup
Speaker 1: games every week with his son's I Guess on Tuesday nights,
Speaker 1: which is kind of fun. Well, apparently that Charlie Brown
Speaker 1: Halloween Special had a huge impact on kids, and particularly
Speaker 1: the scene where Charlie Brown opens his Halloween bag and
Speaker 1: finds that he's just got a bunch of rocks instead
Speaker 1: of candy. So kids thought this was so unfair that
Speaker 1: for years they would try to share their treats with him,
Speaker 1: and so they would send bags of candy to Charles
Speaker 1: Schultz's office care of Charlie Brown. So here's the super
Speaker 1: weird one about musician Vince Coralty, who did all that
Speaker 1: jazzy music for the specials. Apparently, one night, while he
Speaker 1: was composing music for the Halloween Special, he decided to
Speaker 1: take a shower, but when he heard a noise outside,
Speaker 1: he ran down to see what it was, and somehow
Speaker 1: he locked himself out of his house in the process,
Speaker 1: completely naked. I don't know why he didn't have a
Speaker 1: towel with him, but the only way to get back
Speaker 1: into his house was to climb and break into his
Speaker 1: own house, and of course the neighbors called the cops
Speaker 1: on him. So apparently, when the police came up to
Speaker 1: this naked man breaking into his own house and asked
Speaker 1: him to identify himself, he did keep his sense of
Speaker 1: humor and he said, don't shoot, I'm the great pumpkin
Speaker 1: of course. All right, well, here's a super quick fact
Speaker 1: about the trouble with working with kid actors. So during
Speaker 1: the taping of the Christmas Special, there was a child
Speaker 1: actress who portrayed both Violet and Freedom, and she would
Speaker 1: get so nervous before reading each time that after she
Speaker 1: was done recording every all time, she would throw up. Now,
Speaker 1: luckily she didn't have that big of a role kid actors. Yeah, well,
Speaker 1: here's the one that's kind of heartwarming. Uh So, so
Speaker 1: we all know that Lucy loves to pull that football
Speaker 1: away from Charlie Brown just as he's about to kick it,
Speaker 1: and often she says mean things right before or after,
Speaker 1: like uh apparently she'll ask him don't you trust anyone anymore?
Speaker 1: Or putting the football out, or she'll let him know
Speaker 1: after she's pulled it away that don't you know a
Speaker 1: woman's handshake isn't binding, which is a strange bit of
Speaker 1: legally is there. But you know that there was one
Speaker 1: moment where she let him kick the ball, and this
Speaker 1: was in nineteen seventy As Slate reports, um there was
Speaker 1: actually a sequence where Charlie Brown gets very ill and
Speaker 1: when Lucy Here's that he's sick and might not come
Speaker 1: back from the hospital, she says how much he means
Speaker 1: to her and and then promises to let him kick
Speaker 1: the football if he gets better. And then when he
Speaker 1: does recover, she lives up to her promise and holds
Speaker 1: that ball out for him, but of course he slips
Speaker 1: and misses it. Anyway, Well, it is nice to know
Speaker 1: that for once she gave him a chance and I
Speaker 1: like that factor. So I think you get to take
Speaker 1: home today's trophy. Thank you, Will, and thanks for all
Speaker 1: of you out there for tuning into another part time Genius.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm sure you have wonderful Snoopy and Charlie
Speaker 1: Brown memories. So if you've got facts of stories, we
Speaker 1: definitely want to hear them. Or if you've got topics
Speaker 1: you want us to cover, we're actually looking for those two.
Speaker 1: So it just emails as part Time Genius at how
Speaker 1: stuff Works dot com or hit us up on the socials.
Speaker 1: But from gave Tristan, Will and me thank you so
Speaker 1: much for listening. Thanks again for listening. Part Time Genius
Speaker 1: is a production of How Stuff Works and wouldn't be
Speaker 1: possible without several brilliant people who do the important things
Speaker 1: we couldn't even begin to understand. Tristan McNeil does the
Speaker 1: editing thing. Noel Brown made the theme song and does
Speaker 1: the mixy mixy sound thing. Jerry Rowland does the exact
Speaker 1: for user thing. Gabe blues Yer is our lead researcher,
Speaker 1: with support from the Research Army including Austin Thompson, Nolan
Speaker 1: Brown and Lucas Adams and Eve. Jeff Cook gets the
Speaker 1: show to your ears. Good job, Eves. If you like
Speaker 1: what you heard, we hope you'll subscribe, And if you
Speaker 1: really really like what you've heard, maybe you could leave
Speaker 1: a good review for us. Did we did we forget Jason?
Speaker 1: Jason who