1
00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:05,360
Speaker 1: Hey guys, I'm Jackie Goldschneiner, I'm Essler, and we are

2
00:00:05,480 --> 00:00:09,880
Speaker 1: two Jersey Jays and we have pretty juicy so for

3
00:00:09,920 --> 00:00:10,479
Speaker 1: you today.

4
00:00:10,920 --> 00:00:14,080
Speaker 2: I think that it's like the episode, in my mind

5
00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:15,880
Speaker 2: is like one that I would want to talk about

6
00:00:15,960 --> 00:00:17,680
Speaker 2: or hear about. I want to listen to this episode

7
00:00:17,720 --> 00:00:21,279
Speaker 2: because I think it's there's so much to say about it.

8
00:00:21,320 --> 00:00:22,799
Speaker 2: We're talking about money.

9
00:00:22,960 --> 00:00:25,560
Speaker 1: Yes, we're talking about money, and since we are in

10
00:00:25,600 --> 00:00:26,920
Speaker 1: the Housewives world, we're going.

11
00:00:26,840 --> 00:00:27,360
Speaker 2: To start there.

12
00:00:27,520 --> 00:00:33,080
Speaker 1: Yeah. So I think that the Housewives have become synonymous

13
00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:35,440
Speaker 1: with having a lot of money, but I don't think

14
00:00:35,479 --> 00:00:38,560
Speaker 1: that that's actually so true.

15
00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:42,080
Speaker 2: I think that part of the appeal of the Housewives,

16
00:00:42,080 --> 00:00:43,720
Speaker 2: and as of viewer, I think I felt this way too,

17
00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:47,040
Speaker 2: is watching women who you know, supposedly had it all

18
00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:48,920
Speaker 2: a lot of that had to do with money, but

19
00:00:48,960 --> 00:00:51,840
Speaker 2: also looks and you know, the perfect husbands and children

20
00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:53,880
Speaker 2: blah blah blah, and then sort of watching their demise

21
00:00:53,960 --> 00:00:58,040
Speaker 2: because I think we are so caught up in as

22
00:00:58,040 --> 00:01:02,240
Speaker 2: a culture money and there's so much that affects us

23
00:01:02,520 --> 00:01:04,800
Speaker 2: in terms of like our own self worth in terms

24
00:01:04,800 --> 00:01:08,199
Speaker 2: of money. So I almost feel like the Housewives show

25
00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:10,640
Speaker 2: that money doesn't buy happiness.

26
00:01:11,080 --> 00:01:14,360
Speaker 1: Yes, but I originally thought that like all the housewives

27
00:01:14,360 --> 00:01:16,600
Speaker 1: had a lot of money, and that is just absolutely

28
00:01:16,680 --> 00:01:19,520
Speaker 1: not the case. And what I have found in recent

29
00:01:19,640 --> 00:01:22,480
Speaker 1: years is that people who look like they have a

30
00:01:22,520 --> 00:01:25,959
Speaker 1: ton of money a lot of times it's it's just

31
00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:30,360
Speaker 1: a lot of spending of money that people don't necessarily have. Now, Listen,

32
00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:33,120
Speaker 1: there are people on these shows that legit have a

33
00:01:33,160 --> 00:01:35,760
Speaker 1: ton of money, and I have no I have no

34
00:01:35,840 --> 00:01:38,760
Speaker 1: privy to anyone's bank accounts, so I'm just guessing. But

35
00:01:38,800 --> 00:01:40,840
Speaker 1: if I had to guess, I would say that it's

36
00:01:40,880 --> 00:01:48,040
Speaker 1: definitely like Lisa Vanderpom definitely rich, Kyle Rich right, Suntrack rich.

37
00:01:48,000 --> 00:01:52,120
Speaker 2: Right, Candy, Yes, of course, yes. And then there are

38
00:01:52,160 --> 00:01:55,320
Speaker 2: those of us who are not, you know, flying our

39
00:01:55,360 --> 00:01:58,600
Speaker 2: own private jets and are I think comfortable with that

40
00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:01,120
Speaker 2: and represent ourselves accurate? And I think there are those

41
00:02:01,160 --> 00:02:04,000
Speaker 2: that cry to fake it and.

42
00:02:04,320 --> 00:02:08,519
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, well for documented news stories about many people.

43
00:02:08,280 --> 00:02:09,079
Speaker 3: And I'll tell you who.

44
00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:13,000
Speaker 1: I just in my head, it's so crazy to me

45
00:02:13,040 --> 00:02:15,519
Speaker 1: that they don't have much money. Was this whole thing

46
00:02:15,919 --> 00:02:19,760
Speaker 1: with cry and Kim. Now I didn't watch Atlanta when

47
00:02:19,760 --> 00:02:22,880
Speaker 1: she was on it. I actually there's a few housewild shows.

48
00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:23,280
Speaker 3: I don't watch.

49
00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:25,040
Speaker 1: Atlanta's one of them, so I don't really know the

50
00:02:25,080 --> 00:02:28,800
Speaker 1: people on there, but I know that Kim was on

51
00:02:28,880 --> 00:02:32,200
Speaker 1: Atlanta Housewives for what five seasons, and then she had

52
00:02:32,240 --> 00:02:34,960
Speaker 1: her own show for I think eight seasons.

53
00:02:35,080 --> 00:02:38,080
Speaker 2: He wasn't party for the party, yes to watch that.

54
00:02:38,440 --> 00:02:40,000
Speaker 2: I watched a little bit of it, and I definitely

55
00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:42,359
Speaker 2: watched when Kim was on it and she was involved

56
00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:45,239
Speaker 2: with that older guy. They called him back a daddy,

57
00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:47,880
Speaker 2: big daddy daddy or something. And I mean, that's an

58
00:02:47,919 --> 00:02:49,160
Speaker 2: interesting study right there.

59
00:02:49,120 --> 00:02:52,000
Speaker 1: Right, I mean, she had an NFL contract where I

60
00:02:52,040 --> 00:02:58,040
Speaker 1: date him billions of dollars also, and I mean they're broke.

61
00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:00,880
Speaker 1: She's selling her wigs on eBay, So how do you

62
00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:03,920
Speaker 1: go from all that income?

63
00:03:04,200 --> 00:03:06,800
Speaker 2: Isn't it interesting? It's the thing, potentially I don't know,

64
00:03:06,960 --> 00:03:10,560
Speaker 2: that brought her so much money, was representing herself as

65
00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:13,080
Speaker 2: a rich woman, right, And that's the thing that is

66
00:03:14,360 --> 00:03:16,600
Speaker 2: part of what made her so interesting, watching her in

67
00:03:16,639 --> 00:03:20,920
Speaker 2: the biggest state, watching her dripping in diamonds, and so

68
00:03:21,040 --> 00:03:24,960
Speaker 2: to keep that up. I'm not their financial advisor, but

69
00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:28,440
Speaker 2: I guess she put forth too much effort in terms

70
00:03:28,440 --> 00:03:32,240
Speaker 2: of like showing and being showy, and then she didn't

71
00:03:32,280 --> 00:03:34,280
Speaker 2: have anything to back it up, or it all went

72
00:03:34,320 --> 00:03:36,680
Speaker 2: away because she was so busy showing off her wealth.

73
00:03:37,040 --> 00:03:37,360
Speaker 2: I don't know.

74
00:03:37,400 --> 00:03:38,960
Speaker 4: I think a lot of people think that being on

75
00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:42,840
Speaker 4: the show itself is going to bring you the kind

76
00:03:42,840 --> 00:03:46,920
Speaker 4: of money that you're presenting, which you don't really have, right,

77
00:03:47,480 --> 00:03:49,200
Speaker 4: But that really doesn't happen.

78
00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:53,520
Speaker 1: It's very rare. I think to make enough money on

79
00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:55,680
Speaker 1: this show that you can catch up to what you're presenting.

80
00:03:55,800 --> 00:03:57,080
Speaker 1: You get what I'm saying and why and.

81
00:03:57,120 --> 00:03:59,480
Speaker 2: The bigger picture, right, like why does it matter so much?

82
00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:02,240
Speaker 1: Why does it matter? Well, I think it used to

83
00:04:02,280 --> 00:04:04,120
Speaker 1: matter a lot more than it does now. I think

84
00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:06,360
Speaker 1: it used to be that house I was were synonymous

85
00:04:06,360 --> 00:04:09,000
Speaker 1: with having a lot of money, maybe not like billion,

86
00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:11,960
Speaker 1: like not sudden money, but like living in a really

87
00:04:11,960 --> 00:04:15,080
Speaker 1: big house, driving your range Rover, you know, occasionally flying

88
00:04:15,080 --> 00:04:16,320
Speaker 1: out a private jet.

89
00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:19,479
Speaker 2: Now I think it's different. It is different now, It

90
00:04:19,560 --> 00:04:23,080
Speaker 2: definitely has changed. Having said that, I also see a

91
00:04:23,120 --> 00:04:27,720
Speaker 2: lot of the housewives representing themselves as down to earth relatable.

92
00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:29,840
Speaker 2: I don't have as much money as you guys do,

93
00:04:30,360 --> 00:04:34,720
Speaker 2: and the women that are doing that have still beautiful lives.

94
00:04:34,760 --> 00:04:37,440
Speaker 2: They may not live in a states with yachts and

95
00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:41,080
Speaker 2: private jets, but they live in beautiful homes. They have enough,

96
00:04:41,400 --> 00:04:44,520
Speaker 2: they have enough to you know, dress themselves up. And

97
00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:47,680
Speaker 2: yet there's this whole I feel like, even just recently

98
00:04:47,839 --> 00:04:51,400
Speaker 2: with Salt Lake City, that whole piece of it that

99
00:04:51,880 --> 00:04:55,560
Speaker 2: you know, Monica didn't like whatever was happening with the

100
00:04:55,640 --> 00:04:59,320
Speaker 2: ring you saw, Yeah, yeah, right, melt it she was

101
00:04:59,360 --> 00:05:01,200
Speaker 2: that rubbed her the wrong way and she had to

102
00:05:01,200 --> 00:05:02,960
Speaker 2: buy a Louis bag or something so that she didn't

103
00:05:02,960 --> 00:05:06,960
Speaker 2: feel inferior when they all went on trip. But this

104
00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:09,920
Speaker 2: whole sort of and that people could relate to that, right,

105
00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:11,960
Speaker 2: But Monica is still I don't know Monica. I don't

106
00:05:11,960 --> 00:05:13,560
Speaker 2: know what she has in her bank, but she still lives.

107
00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:15,640
Speaker 2: It looks to me like a really nice life. She

108
00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:18,680
Speaker 2: has four kids, there's food on the table, she seems

109
00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:21,040
Speaker 2: to take very good care of herself. She's driving around

110
00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:25,680
Speaker 2: in a Range Rover. So you know that sort of

111
00:05:25,680 --> 00:05:28,080
Speaker 2: feeling that maybe if I have less, that makes me

112
00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:31,119
Speaker 2: more authentic and relatable. And I don't think that's true either.

113
00:05:31,480 --> 00:05:33,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't think it's true either, But I will

114
00:05:33,160 --> 00:05:35,640
Speaker 1: tell you I think that people love seeing a downfall.

115
00:05:36,080 --> 00:05:38,320
Speaker 1: It's part of the whole I cancel culture. But like

116
00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:42,320
Speaker 1: when Erin got sued, I have no I'm not taking

117
00:05:42,400 --> 00:05:44,880
Speaker 1: a side on who's telling the truth in this one.

118
00:05:44,960 --> 00:05:48,320
Speaker 1: But when Erin got sued Erin from New York by

119
00:05:48,360 --> 00:05:52,040
Speaker 1: her landlord for unpaid rent and it was all over

120
00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:55,080
Speaker 1: the news, I think people love that kind of stuff,

121
00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:57,120
Speaker 1: that kind of ooh, maybe she's not who she says

122
00:05:57,160 --> 00:05:59,680
Speaker 1: she is. Whenever there's a story about Durie in the news,

123
00:05:59,680 --> 00:06:03,279
Speaker 1: whenever there's a story about Erika Jean in the news.

124
00:06:03,040 --> 00:06:07,000
Speaker 2: Well that's because I think that it's natural for us. Unfortunately,

125
00:06:07,080 --> 00:06:10,760
Speaker 2: part of what makes a human human is sometimes feelings

126
00:06:10,839 --> 00:06:16,480
Speaker 2: of jealousy, feelings of wanting more, not being content, comparing

127
00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:19,760
Speaker 2: yourself to others. I think that is, you know something

128
00:06:19,800 --> 00:06:21,960
Speaker 2: I try to fight against it, but it's also I

129
00:06:22,040 --> 00:06:24,360
Speaker 2: do the same thing right, Like I can look at

130
00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:27,360
Speaker 2: a woman who is so uberwealthy, like a door Rate

131
00:06:28,240 --> 00:06:31,520
Speaker 2: or a Kyle Richards, and say to myself, you know, wow,

132
00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:33,800
Speaker 2: you know I like my own jet, I like my

133
00:06:33,839 --> 00:06:37,400
Speaker 2: own yacht. And the truth is I am blessed above

134
00:06:37,400 --> 00:06:39,640
Speaker 2: and beyond. I have everything I need. My kids have

135
00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:43,680
Speaker 2: food on the table. You know, God forbids someone get

136
00:06:43,800 --> 00:06:45,640
Speaker 2: sick in my family, I'll have enough money to fly

137
00:06:45,800 --> 00:06:49,520
Speaker 2: them to wherever the hospital, the best hospital is. That's

138
00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:52,080
Speaker 2: what counts, right. Money doesn't buy happiness, But yet still

139
00:06:52,080 --> 00:06:56,000
Speaker 2: we covet these things, and whether it's right or wrong,

140
00:06:56,040 --> 00:06:58,720
Speaker 2: I think everyone has like a certain degree of that right,

141
00:06:58,760 --> 00:07:01,760
Speaker 2: and it's it's hard to fight against it. But specifically

142
00:07:01,760 --> 00:07:05,200
Speaker 2: with the Housewives, it's so showy. Everybody is trying so

143
00:07:05,320 --> 00:07:07,039
Speaker 2: hard to show so much.

144
00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:09,800
Speaker 1: Yes on our cast included, but we won't go into

145
00:07:09,800 --> 00:07:14,680
Speaker 1: detail on that. So I think that also, you know,

146
00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:20,520
Speaker 1: we live in towns where money is everywhere. People like

147
00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:24,000
Speaker 1: to show off. I mean New Jersey. People like their

148
00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:27,840
Speaker 1: big cars and their big lives, and they like to

149
00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:31,520
Speaker 1: live large, and so it's hard to separate yourself from it.

150
00:07:31,520 --> 00:07:35,520
Speaker 1: It's not just Housewives world. It's suburbs, it's in the cities,

151
00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:36,520
Speaker 1: it's everywhere.

152
00:07:36,640 --> 00:07:39,360
Speaker 2: I grew up in sort of a unique financial situation.

153
00:07:39,680 --> 00:07:41,600
Speaker 2: My parents were divorced when I was like three, and

154
00:07:41,680 --> 00:07:45,520
Speaker 2: I moved with my mom and my sister to Sugarland, Texas.

155
00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:48,440
Speaker 2: My mother was a secretary now we would say assistant,

156
00:07:48,920 --> 00:07:51,120
Speaker 2: and we just didn't have a lot. We lived in

157
00:07:51,160 --> 00:07:55,680
Speaker 2: a very small house. I remember, you know, kids in

158
00:07:55,760 --> 00:07:59,160
Speaker 2: junior high lived in Sugar Creek, and I would go

159
00:07:59,280 --> 00:08:01,680
Speaker 2: through these gates and see these homes and I would just,

160
00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:06,000
Speaker 2: you know, feel less than And my dad at the

161
00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:08,840
Speaker 2: time in the eighties was very, very wealthy, so I

162
00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:15,000
Speaker 2: would fly to see him and he was literally his

163
00:08:15,080 --> 00:08:17,400
Speaker 2: apartment was across from the met ten ten fifth Avenue

164
00:08:17,440 --> 00:08:19,320
Speaker 2: in the city, and then he had a an estate

165
00:08:19,360 --> 00:08:22,480
Speaker 2: in Bedford and eventually he ended up living in Trump

166
00:08:22,520 --> 00:08:26,000
Speaker 2: Tower for a while. And when I was about nineteen,

167
00:08:27,400 --> 00:08:30,360
Speaker 2: we had been named Mitzvah, so I hadn't been bought Mitzvoot.

168
00:08:30,360 --> 00:08:34,199
Speaker 2: It was myself and my sister and my half brother. Anyway,

169
00:08:34,240 --> 00:08:36,400
Speaker 2: it was on the Queen Elizabeth. It was like on

170
00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:40,280
Speaker 2: the front page of the Metropolitan Section and Ivan Boski

171
00:08:40,360 --> 00:08:43,280
Speaker 2: like flew brivate jet onto the ship. It was over

172
00:08:43,320 --> 00:08:47,160
Speaker 2: the top, right. And then my father didn't have money.

173
00:08:47,160 --> 00:08:48,880
Speaker 2: But my point is it was always sort of that

174
00:08:49,080 --> 00:08:51,160
Speaker 2: back and forth and that sort of I don't know,

175
00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:54,880
Speaker 2: I used to have so much financial insecurity, Like you know,

176
00:08:54,880 --> 00:08:58,200
Speaker 2: I'd wake up sometimes in my twenties and be afraid,

177
00:08:58,440 --> 00:09:00,520
Speaker 2: like I have these nightmares about like being under the

178
00:09:00,520 --> 00:09:04,600
Speaker 2: bridge with nowhere to live, and you know, being or

179
00:09:04,640 --> 00:09:09,360
Speaker 2: being being homeless or just struggling, and I don't know,

180
00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:13,520
Speaker 2: I am part of why. I think I'm so grateful

181
00:09:13,559 --> 00:09:15,160
Speaker 2: that we have what we have now. And again we're

182
00:09:15,160 --> 00:09:17,400
Speaker 2: not bazillionaires, but it's just the safety that comes with

183
00:09:17,440 --> 00:09:18,040
Speaker 2: having money.

184
00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:22,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have a weird relationship with money. I've always

185
00:09:22,400 --> 00:09:24,240
Speaker 1: had a weird relationship with money, and I think it

186
00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:26,760
Speaker 1: also stems from my childhood. So when I first got

187
00:09:26,760 --> 00:09:31,240
Speaker 1: on the show, I was really uncomfortable showing off my wealth.

188
00:09:31,400 --> 00:09:34,360
Speaker 1: I didn't want the producers to know that I had money.

189
00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:38,040
Speaker 1: I just wanted to seem like I was like regular

190
00:09:38,160 --> 00:09:42,199
Speaker 1: suburban well off, right. I drove a minivan at the time.

191
00:09:42,320 --> 00:09:44,720
Speaker 1: It wasn't even a new minivan, and it was like

192
00:09:45,520 --> 00:09:48,720
Speaker 1: very stereotypical, like oldfish on the floor, shit everywhere, bird

193
00:09:48,720 --> 00:09:52,760
Speaker 1: poop in the windows, and you know, my house is beautiful,

194
00:09:52,760 --> 00:09:57,080
Speaker 1: but it's not mine no day and it's my house

195
00:09:57,160 --> 00:10:03,320
Speaker 1: is beautiful, but it's not like you knowlous house at right.

196
00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:07,920
Speaker 1: So I think that my second season, when I took

197
00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:13,080
Speaker 1: the ladies to my Hampton's house, which is quite a

198
00:10:13,080 --> 00:10:17,400
Speaker 1: beach house. They were like, wait what because everyone assumed

199
00:10:17,400 --> 00:10:19,480
Speaker 1: that I was like the poor one on the cast,

200
00:10:19,800 --> 00:10:23,960
Speaker 1: and they were like, does Jackie have money? I remember

201
00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:26,800
Speaker 1: I was listening to another podcast and they said that

202
00:10:26,840 --> 00:10:28,360
Speaker 1: they think that I was like the first house I

203
00:10:28,440 --> 00:10:31,280
Speaker 1: was ever to pretend that I had less money than

204
00:10:31,320 --> 00:10:34,160
Speaker 1: I actually, which was really funny. But I grew up

205
00:10:34,559 --> 00:10:38,240
Speaker 1: with a really weird relationship with money because I grew

206
00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:40,160
Speaker 1: up the first part of my childhood it was in

207
00:10:40,200 --> 00:10:43,320
Speaker 1: Staten Island, New York, which was very very We were

208
00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:48,760
Speaker 1: very middle class. We had like a small home and

209
00:10:49,840 --> 00:10:51,840
Speaker 1: you know, like we just didn't have a ton of money,

210
00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:54,120
Speaker 1: like me and my friends, like we would play in

211
00:10:54,120 --> 00:10:59,000
Speaker 1: our garages. And then my parents their businesses really took

212
00:10:59,000 --> 00:11:03,080
Speaker 1: off and they wanted to move out of Staten Island,

213
00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:06,679
Speaker 1: so they bought a McMansion in New Jersey and it

214
00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:10,520
Speaker 1: was one of the first homes on in the new

215
00:11:10,559 --> 00:11:13,760
Speaker 1: development in this new area of the town, and we

216
00:11:13,760 --> 00:11:16,000
Speaker 1: were like the only house on the block, and I

217
00:11:16,040 --> 00:11:19,520
Speaker 1: was really isolated. My parents, who are wonderful people, but

218
00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:24,320
Speaker 1: they dropped me off at this house and they were like, Okay,

219
00:11:24,400 --> 00:11:27,480
Speaker 1: we're going to work full time. And I had no friends,

220
00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:31,319
Speaker 1: I had no rides to go anywhere, and I moved

221
00:11:31,320 --> 00:11:34,880
Speaker 1: to this mcmahonsion and I was very isolated. I was

222
00:11:35,040 --> 00:11:37,240
Speaker 1: very lonely. I had no friends. I would at a

223
00:11:37,280 --> 00:11:44,800
Speaker 1: new school, and I money. Essentially, suddenly we were wealthy,

224
00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:48,520
Speaker 1: and I was so miserable, whereas I was so happy

225
00:11:48,559 --> 00:11:53,079
Speaker 1: in Staten Island, and I was so miserable as friends

226
00:11:53,120 --> 00:11:57,800
Speaker 1: and laughing and yes as a kid everything, and I

227
00:11:57,840 --> 00:12:02,240
Speaker 1: think I resented all the money. And then to pile

228
00:12:02,400 --> 00:12:06,360
Speaker 1: on top of that, my parents continued to make a

229
00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:09,640
Speaker 1: lot of money. And when I was in college, one

230
00:12:09,720 --> 00:12:13,480
Speaker 1: day the IRS came in and raided my mother's business

231
00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:16,920
Speaker 1: and shut everything down. And then I had to watch

232
00:12:16,960 --> 00:12:22,280
Speaker 1: my parents go to trial for tax evasion and wonder

233
00:12:22,360 --> 00:12:24,719
Speaker 1: how much jail time they were going to get, and

234
00:12:25,080 --> 00:12:30,080
Speaker 1: watch them get sentenced, and it was horrific. So I

235
00:12:30,120 --> 00:12:34,960
Speaker 1: think that I've felt like when I didn't have the money,

236
00:12:35,280 --> 00:12:39,160
Speaker 1: I was so much happier. I was just happier. And

237
00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:42,120
Speaker 1: then when I had all the money, nothing about it

238
00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:45,440
Speaker 1: brought me happiness. So I was always very very scared.

239
00:12:54,559 --> 00:12:57,520
Speaker 1: I want to tell you something really really interesting, So

240
00:12:58,240 --> 00:13:01,520
Speaker 1: I never would spend money, right, and I had this

241
00:13:01,600 --> 00:13:04,800
Speaker 1: thing where I would always hold onto money and I

242
00:13:04,880 --> 00:13:08,360
Speaker 1: never wanted to spend it on anything. And so when

243
00:13:08,400 --> 00:13:10,080
Speaker 1: I a few years ago. I don't know if you

244
00:13:10,080 --> 00:13:14,960
Speaker 1: guys followed my story, my personal story, or read my

245
00:13:15,040 --> 00:13:17,800
Speaker 1: book The Way to Beautiful, but I recovered from a

246
00:13:17,840 --> 00:13:24,040
Speaker 1: twenty year really severe anorexia. I recovered about two and

247
00:13:24,040 --> 00:13:26,240
Speaker 1: a half years ago. I chose to recover, and when

248
00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:30,559
Speaker 1: I first went into therapy my therapist, I didn't want

249
00:13:30,600 --> 00:13:32,839
Speaker 1: to do so many sessions because I didn't want to

250
00:13:32,880 --> 00:13:35,680
Speaker 1: spend all that money on therapy. It was all part

251
00:13:35,720 --> 00:13:38,040
Speaker 1: of me hanging on to all my money. So she

252
00:13:38,160 --> 00:13:40,240
Speaker 1: said to me, you know, if you can't afford it,

253
00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:42,120
Speaker 1: we can, you know, work out a payment plan. And

254
00:13:42,160 --> 00:13:44,520
Speaker 1: I said, no, I can. I can afford it.

255
00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:45,760
Speaker 2: I just don't want to.

256
00:13:45,920 --> 00:13:48,080
Speaker 1: I just didn't want to spend the money. And she

257
00:13:49,000 --> 00:13:52,280
Speaker 1: opened my eyes to the most interesting fucking thing. It's called,

258
00:13:52,360 --> 00:13:56,559
Speaker 1: and it's a legit thing. It's called financial anorexia. And

259
00:13:56,920 --> 00:13:59,800
Speaker 1: it's the same way that you think about food like

260
00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:02,640
Speaker 1: and you're anorexic, or any kind of dieting like you.

261
00:14:03,200 --> 00:14:06,319
Speaker 1: I was hoarding my calories so like I wouldn't eat

262
00:14:06,360 --> 00:14:09,000
Speaker 1: all day and then at night I would have enough

263
00:14:09,040 --> 00:14:13,320
Speaker 1: to make me not feel super hungry anymore. And I

264
00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:16,600
Speaker 1: was always like saving calories and I wouldn't eat, and

265
00:14:16,640 --> 00:14:19,840
Speaker 1: like I was just afraid to eat because I was

266
00:14:19,880 --> 00:14:22,280
Speaker 1: afraid it would spiral. And I was the same way

267
00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:25,600
Speaker 1: with money. I was afraid to let go of any

268
00:14:25,640 --> 00:14:28,360
Speaker 1: of my money because I was so afraid that something

269
00:14:28,440 --> 00:14:29,240
Speaker 1: bad would happen.

270
00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:32,520
Speaker 2: And that's how. I don't know that he has financial

271
00:14:32,520 --> 00:14:34,560
Speaker 2: anorex yet, but I think for a lot of people

272
00:14:34,640 --> 00:14:38,680
Speaker 2: like my husband, like Jeff, he works so hard and

273
00:14:38,920 --> 00:14:42,240
Speaker 2: he is successful, and yet I if it were up

274
00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:44,840
Speaker 2: to him, we would spend nothing because and I don't

275
00:14:44,840 --> 00:14:47,520
Speaker 2: think it's about I really sort of hate this part

276
00:14:47,520 --> 00:14:50,440
Speaker 2: because it's I feel like Jews are always labeled when

277
00:14:50,440 --> 00:14:52,920
Speaker 2: it comes to money, right, and Jeff Sessler's not cheap.

278
00:14:52,960 --> 00:14:55,440
Speaker 2: He would spend everything on his kids in two seconds,

279
00:14:55,440 --> 00:14:57,320
Speaker 2: but like the little things he gets concerned about, and

280
00:14:57,360 --> 00:15:02,080
Speaker 2: I think that's about financial insecurity. It's you know, I

281
00:15:02,120 --> 00:15:05,560
Speaker 2: think that he's for whatever reason, whatever background he comes from,

282
00:15:05,640 --> 00:15:08,560
Speaker 2: he's always scared of running out right or like, what's

283
00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:10,480
Speaker 2: going to happen if I don't have enough? Especially as

284
00:15:10,480 --> 00:15:13,440
Speaker 2: the primary breadwinner. I think a lot of men, you know,

285
00:15:13,520 --> 00:15:16,240
Speaker 2: identify also with how much money that they make. That's

286
00:15:16,280 --> 00:15:18,680
Speaker 2: maybe for another day. Yeah, but I think a lot

287
00:15:18,680 --> 00:15:21,320
Speaker 2: of people have fear when it comes to money. And

288
00:15:21,320 --> 00:15:24,840
Speaker 2: then there are those, by the way, who I think,

289
00:15:25,640 --> 00:15:29,400
Speaker 2: you know, have so much, there's so much excess, and

290
00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:34,200
Speaker 2: feel good. The more they have, the better they feel

291
00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:36,600
Speaker 2: about themselves. Right, I don't think you were justing that.

292
00:15:36,640 --> 00:15:37,040
Speaker 3: I don't know.

293
00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:39,200
Speaker 1: Do you think that's true? Like there are people in

294
00:15:39,240 --> 00:15:42,480
Speaker 1: the housewives world that definitely keep accumulating and accumulating. There

295
00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:44,680
Speaker 1: are people on our cast that have fifteen cars lined

296
00:15:44,720 --> 00:15:45,680
Speaker 1: up in front of their house.

297
00:15:46,160 --> 00:15:46,520
Speaker 5: I don't.

298
00:15:46,680 --> 00:15:49,760
Speaker 1: I don't know. Does that could that possibly make someone happy?

299
00:15:49,960 --> 00:15:50,040
Speaker 6: No?

300
00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:52,680
Speaker 2: Wait, I didn't. That is not believe me. I don't.

301
00:15:52,720 --> 00:15:55,080
Speaker 2: I think that everything that people say, right, it's so

302
00:15:55,160 --> 00:15:58,000
Speaker 2: cliche that money doesn't buy happiness one hundred percent. I

303
00:15:58,040 --> 00:16:00,240
Speaker 2: don't not think it buys happiness. I think that though

304
00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:04,240
Speaker 2: people are sometimes their esteem is fed by things, yes,

305
00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:08,120
Speaker 2: and it's never lasting. It can't last. Like when I

306
00:16:08,240 --> 00:16:11,680
Speaker 2: moved into this house. We were bidding on this house

307
00:16:11,760 --> 00:16:14,040
Speaker 2: and I walked into it and I thought, if we

308
00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:17,240
Speaker 2: get this house for whatever reason, I just loved it.

309
00:16:17,280 --> 00:16:20,680
Speaker 2: I still do. I will never have an unhappy day. Well,

310
00:16:20,680 --> 00:16:23,800
Speaker 2: about three days into owning this house, something came up.

311
00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:25,520
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't even remember what it was, but

312
00:16:25,560 --> 00:16:28,560
Speaker 2: I'm just saying it's not that's not realistic. Things of course,

313
00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:31,680
Speaker 2: and we know this, right, things don't make us happy.

314
00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:35,440
Speaker 2: But having said that, things, especially in today's day, and

315
00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:38,640
Speaker 2: especially yes in the world of housewives, have become so important.

316
00:16:38,680 --> 00:16:41,840
Speaker 2: I always say to myself when I'm watching Beverly Hills,

317
00:16:41,960 --> 00:16:45,440
Speaker 2: there's like, like, the birken Bag is like the eighth housewife.

318
00:16:45,440 --> 00:16:46,760
Speaker 2: I don't know how many housewives there are, right, it

319
00:16:46,800 --> 00:16:48,760
Speaker 2: should happen, right, It's like, well, it's like a friend

320
00:16:48,760 --> 00:16:51,400
Speaker 2: of a housewife. It it shouldn't hold a diamond, but

321
00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:53,280
Speaker 2: it has like its own importance.

322
00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:53,560
Speaker 4: Right.

323
00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:55,560
Speaker 1: I may argue that the friends of the housewives are

324
00:16:55,600 --> 00:16:56,760
Speaker 1: the most important.

325
00:16:56,320 --> 00:16:59,360
Speaker 2: Part, fair enough, but like I'd feel like the birken

326
00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:01,960
Speaker 2: Bag is real, like the eighth Beverly Hills housewife, and

327
00:17:02,040 --> 00:17:05,439
Speaker 2: like you know who has one? You know, like they'll

328
00:17:05,520 --> 00:17:07,480
Speaker 2: they'll do a shot of one, then they'll put one

329
00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:11,879
Speaker 2: hundred thousand dollars underneath. Or Garcel got one, but she

330
00:17:11,960 --> 00:17:14,040
Speaker 2: got maybe a used one and we know how much

331
00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:16,679
Speaker 2: of that cost. And it's all about, you know, when

332
00:17:16,680 --> 00:17:19,720
Speaker 2: the new ones come in, and it's an interesting thing, right,

333
00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:23,160
Speaker 2: Like Burke and bag can cost one hundred thousand dollars?

334
00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:25,199
Speaker 2: Is that okay? I don't know. You could feed a

335
00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:27,800
Speaker 2: small country with that. But guess what, I have excess.

336
00:17:28,080 --> 00:17:31,400
Speaker 2: There's somebody else who I'm I listened to on TikTok

337
00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:35,840
Speaker 2: Who TikTok who talks about like the Kardashians and how

338
00:17:35,880 --> 00:17:39,679
Speaker 2: bad it is for girls today to watch their lives

339
00:17:39,760 --> 00:17:43,359
Speaker 2: because they live with so much excess and it's so obnoxious.

340
00:17:43,359 --> 00:17:46,000
Speaker 2: This it's so bad. They're such a bad example. But

341
00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:49,160
Speaker 2: yet that person has so much, there's so much excess

342
00:17:49,200 --> 00:17:51,119
Speaker 2: in her own life, right.

343
00:17:51,240 --> 00:17:54,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, so you're talking about you guys remain.

344
00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:56,399
Speaker 2: Nameless, but I like to say her name. No, I

345
00:17:56,400 --> 00:17:58,399
Speaker 2: don't say anyone's name. I really don't. It's not and

346
00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:00,440
Speaker 2: you guys know what I'm talking about. You don't have

347
00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:03,479
Speaker 2: to name people. But the point is that, like you know,

348
00:18:04,359 --> 00:18:07,960
Speaker 2: some when is excess okay and when is it not.

349
00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:11,080
Speaker 1: I don't like to be okay with the ship we

350
00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:13,080
Speaker 1: see on social media because nobody has to live their

351
00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:14,800
Speaker 1: lives for our approval, so we all have to be

352
00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:17,600
Speaker 1: okay with it. I just, you know, I think that

353
00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:20,480
Speaker 1: there's a lot of smoke and mirrors. There's a lot

354
00:18:20,520 --> 00:18:24,560
Speaker 1: of people who are presenting a life that they don't

355
00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:25,120
Speaker 1: really live.

356
00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:28,160
Speaker 2: I think that some of my happiest friends, and who knows,

357
00:18:28,160 --> 00:18:29,439
Speaker 2: I don't know how to measure that. But like some

358
00:18:29,480 --> 00:18:31,000
Speaker 2: of my friends that seem at least to me so

359
00:18:31,160 --> 00:18:34,399
Speaker 2: content are the ones who maybe could live larger, but

360
00:18:34,440 --> 00:18:37,560
Speaker 2: they live smaller lives by choice, right, Like they don't

361
00:18:37,680 --> 00:18:42,440
Speaker 2: have anything to prove, and they they have other whatever

362
00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:46,600
Speaker 2: it is that brings them happiness. You know, it's not

363
00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:51,919
Speaker 2: about their money, and that's what I strive for. I

364
00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:54,760
Speaker 2: get caught up in also, this world of trying to

365
00:18:54,840 --> 00:18:58,800
Speaker 2: prove that yeah you know, I'm glamorous too, Yeah, and

366
00:18:59,200 --> 00:18:59,800
Speaker 2: it doesn't work.

367
00:18:59,840 --> 00:19:02,040
Speaker 1: It's I mean, my town's a tough town. How is

368
00:19:02,080 --> 00:19:04,639
Speaker 1: your town like my town? The people are great, but

369
00:19:04,720 --> 00:19:07,720
Speaker 1: they live very large. Like in the summer when everyone's

370
00:19:07,800 --> 00:19:10,520
Speaker 1: kids go off to sleep boy camp, they are on

371
00:19:11,160 --> 00:19:16,560
Speaker 1: yachts in Capri. They are at their like a massive

372
00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:20,120
Speaker 1: Southampton homes. They are just living in my town.

373
00:19:20,200 --> 00:19:23,159
Speaker 2: But my friends, now, my friend camp. We were in

374
00:19:23,160 --> 00:19:24,440
Speaker 2: my backyard getting wasted.

375
00:19:24,840 --> 00:19:29,879
Speaker 1: Yeah later Yeah, so you know what else? Also, like

376
00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:33,760
Speaker 1: I grew up, this is I guess tied to like finances.

377
00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:38,600
Speaker 1: I grew up my dad gambled a lot, So every

378
00:19:38,720 --> 00:19:43,240
Speaker 1: single weekend we'd be at a casino. So I lived

379
00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:46,320
Speaker 1: at casinos, and very curiously, my dad taught me how

380
00:19:46,359 --> 00:19:49,240
Speaker 1: to gamble, Like he taught me every single detail about

381
00:19:49,880 --> 00:19:53,479
Speaker 1: craps when I was probably like twelve years old, so

382
00:19:53,520 --> 00:19:55,560
Speaker 1: I knew craps inside and album by the time I

383
00:19:55,600 --> 00:19:57,440
Speaker 1: was eighteen. We used to go to the Islands and

384
00:19:57,880 --> 00:20:00,320
Speaker 1: I would be gambling. I was gambling when I was

385
00:20:00,320 --> 00:20:04,320
Speaker 1: like fifteen. I had fake ID and so I think

386
00:20:04,320 --> 00:20:07,560
Speaker 1: that I developed this relationship with casinos. You saw me

387
00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:10,080
Speaker 1: even during BRAVOCM Like, I do not want to gamble

388
00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:13,720
Speaker 1: because there was so much, like always tension between my

389
00:20:13,880 --> 00:20:17,080
Speaker 1: parents when my dad would lose, and it's so funny

390
00:20:17,119 --> 00:20:19,040
Speaker 1: he would bet on sports also, And when I was

391
00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:22,879
Speaker 1: a kid my dad. I always thought if there was

392
00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:26,800
Speaker 1: a broom outside my parents' room, it meant they were

393
00:20:26,840 --> 00:20:30,840
Speaker 1: getting along, and I never understood what it meant. But

394
00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:34,360
Speaker 1: my dad would put a broom outside their bedroom when

395
00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:37,560
Speaker 1: he swept his games, and I only knew that it

396
00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:40,040
Speaker 1: meant that my parents were getting along. Wow, yeah, they

397
00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:44,040
Speaker 1: were like like the money took over everything. It was crazy.

398
00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:47,800
Speaker 2: I love gambling. I love playing and not like blackjack,

399
00:20:47,840 --> 00:20:49,439
Speaker 2: I'm not. I can't keep up with that shit. But

400
00:20:49,520 --> 00:20:52,199
Speaker 2: like wheel a fortune, like sitting there because there's this

401
00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:55,800
Speaker 2: feeling right that, like this quarter it changed my life,

402
00:20:55,920 --> 00:20:57,600
Speaker 2: and I mean, why do I want to change my

403
00:20:57,640 --> 00:21:02,159
Speaker 2: life again? I have healthy children and I have food

404
00:21:02,200 --> 00:21:04,239
Speaker 2: on the table, but it's that sort of feeling. And then,

405
00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:08,320
Speaker 2: of course when I always do lose my money, and

406
00:21:08,359 --> 00:21:10,960
Speaker 2: then it's like the depression of that, right, But it's

407
00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:14,000
Speaker 2: like such a high to like, yeah, put the quarter

408
00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:17,880
Speaker 2: in that little slot and think what I write all

409
00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:20,240
Speaker 2: of a sudden, now like what if, yes, be.

410
00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:22,040
Speaker 1: Rich, I'm going to be rich.

411
00:21:22,680 --> 00:21:23,560
Speaker 3: Oh my god.

412
00:21:32,720 --> 00:21:35,040
Speaker 1: We have a very interesting guest today.

413
00:21:35,240 --> 00:21:38,120
Speaker 2: Yes, I'm so excited to talk to this person. Need

414
00:21:38,160 --> 00:21:38,560
Speaker 2: too so.

415
00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:41,200
Speaker 1: Her name is Nadine Macaluso.

416
00:21:41,280 --> 00:21:44,080
Speaker 2: And you all may know her as the Duchess from

417
00:21:44,240 --> 00:21:46,560
Speaker 2: a movie called The Wolf of Wall Street. Yeah.

418
00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:50,800
Speaker 1: She was married to Jordan Felferd, who was the infamous

419
00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:54,080
Speaker 1: stockbroker who was immortalized in the Wolf of Wall Streets,

420
00:21:55,720 --> 00:22:00,320
Speaker 1: and Nadine met and married him and suddenly he was

421
00:22:00,359 --> 00:22:04,320
Speaker 1: thrust into this like unbelievably wealthy life.

422
00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:08,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I love that movie. So, uh, I

423
00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:11,119
Speaker 2: guess she met him at least in the movie on

424
00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:14,600
Speaker 2: a yacht and then they bought this state and he

425
00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:17,080
Speaker 2: bought her yacht. It was called the Duchess and it

426
00:22:17,160 --> 00:22:21,280
Speaker 2: was like so glamorous, and then the movie is about

427
00:22:21,560 --> 00:22:22,240
Speaker 2: the downfall.

428
00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:25,920
Speaker 1: So let's talk to her. Who played her in the movie,

429
00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:30,000
Speaker 1: the one that just played Barbie mart So gorgeous.

430
00:22:29,560 --> 00:22:33,000
Speaker 2: I mean, just like Nadine. Actually, yeah, she's gorgeous, stunning.

431
00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:34,160
Speaker 1: And she has a new book out, so we'll hear

432
00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:37,840
Speaker 1: about everything. So hang on, we're gonna get Nadine on.

433
00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:39,280
Speaker 2: Hi.

434
00:22:39,359 --> 00:22:44,000
Speaker 1: God, it's Nadine. It's so nice to meet you.

435
00:22:44,720 --> 00:22:48,360
Speaker 3: So nice to meet too, my favorite new Jersey Housewives.

436
00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:54,160
Speaker 2: Oh thank you for saying that. While Nadine, we are

437
00:22:54,200 --> 00:22:57,760
Speaker 2: so excited to have you on this show. And uh,

438
00:22:58,040 --> 00:23:01,160
Speaker 2: first and foremost, we know that you have a new

439
00:23:01,280 --> 00:23:04,919
Speaker 2: book that's out and we've been doing our research and

440
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:07,359
Speaker 2: it looks I have not read it yet, but it

441
00:23:07,359 --> 00:23:08,440
Speaker 2: looks amazing.

442
00:23:08,960 --> 00:23:10,160
Speaker 3: It's very exciting.

443
00:23:10,440 --> 00:23:13,000
Speaker 7: I'm actually in Los Angeles right now, so part in

444
00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:16,760
Speaker 7: my background because I had my book launch party last round.

445
00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:22,320
Speaker 3: So congratulations, so called run like hell, what is it

446
00:23:22,359 --> 00:23:23,320
Speaker 3: about here?

447
00:23:23,359 --> 00:23:27,840
Speaker 2: It goes ooh pretty about trauma bonds.

448
00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:30,879
Speaker 1: It's all about dysfunctional relations that what is trauma bonds.

449
00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:34,920
Speaker 7: Trauma bonds is a dysfunctional relationship between two people who

450
00:23:34,920 --> 00:23:38,480
Speaker 7: are emotionally connected. And so one of the people is

451
00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:41,160
Speaker 7: usually the abuse or a perpetrator or a gas slider,

452
00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:43,560
Speaker 7: and then the other one is victim to that and

453
00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:45,600
Speaker 7: doesn't know that they're in it and things, they're just

454
00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:46,440
Speaker 7: madly in love.

455
00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:50,560
Speaker 2: Basically sort of relationship also with like I'm malignant narcissist

456
00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:52,280
Speaker 2: exactly exactly.

457
00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:52,760
Speaker 3: Yeah.

458
00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:57,520
Speaker 7: Yeah, So I lived to that myself.

459
00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:01,800
Speaker 2: I'm guessing you're talking about Georgie Belfort. It's just a guess, Yeah,

460
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:03,720
Speaker 2: just a guess. Yeah.

461
00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:08,040
Speaker 7: Yeah, So I looked through that myself. And you know,

462
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:10,720
Speaker 7: at thirty nine, I went back to school to become

463
00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:14,320
Speaker 7: married doctor, right sarahs got my PhD. And I never

464
00:24:14,359 --> 00:24:18,439
Speaker 7: thought I would go into that sort of expertise around

465
00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:21,200
Speaker 7: that subject. But I saw so many bright, smart, beautiful

466
00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:24,679
Speaker 7: women coming into my office and I was like we

467
00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:28,119
Speaker 7: have a problem, and so I just went to research

468
00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:29,560
Speaker 7: and wrote the book.

469
00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:34,679
Speaker 2: Do you think so are? We're talking right now about money?

470
00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:38,440
Speaker 2: Which is reely relevant and one of the reasons that

471
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:40,280
Speaker 2: we wanted to have you on because clearly you lived

472
00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:42,919
Speaker 2: with crazy amounts of money. I don't know what happened

473
00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:46,040
Speaker 2: after you and Jordan separated, but the women that come

474
00:24:46,080 --> 00:24:48,119
Speaker 2: to you and experience that kind of trauma, Bonnie, do

475
00:24:48,119 --> 00:24:50,679
Speaker 2: you think that what draws them in a lot of

476
00:24:50,680 --> 00:24:55,520
Speaker 2: times and what maybe the men us is the money

477
00:24:55,800 --> 00:24:58,720
Speaker 2: in terms of like, yeah, so yeah, and I guess

478
00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:02,199
Speaker 2: that happened to you. Yeah, tells me all about experience.

479
00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:04,480
Speaker 7: Yeah, so you know, I mean I was twenty two

480
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:07,159
Speaker 7: years old, I was modeling in the city, and my

481
00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:12,240
Speaker 7: ex husband was twenty eight and uberly successful, right, a

482
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:16,080
Speaker 7: self made guy. So I really respected that. And I

483
00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:19,520
Speaker 7: grew poor in Brooklyn with a single mom, and so

484
00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:23,280
Speaker 7: you know, I wanted to have the nicer things in life.

485
00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:29,720
Speaker 7: And also money represents power, right, and so it just does,

486
00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:33,320
Speaker 7: especially in our society. And so we did fall madly

487
00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:37,320
Speaker 7: in love, for sure, I mean, and yet of course

488
00:25:37,359 --> 00:25:38,520
Speaker 7: the money was alluring.

489
00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:43,879
Speaker 2: So we were discussing, you know, having all of that

490
00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:46,040
Speaker 2: money and I've never had that kind of.

491
00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:48,280
Speaker 1: Well any kind of money did you have? Like, what

492
00:25:48,280 --> 00:25:49,159
Speaker 1: what did you guys do?

493
00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:49,440
Speaker 4: Yeah?

494
00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:51,760
Speaker 7: So, I mean so when I first met him, you know,

495
00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:53,720
Speaker 7: this is how crazy he was. Like he would send

496
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:56,200
Speaker 7: his driver to my house with a Bulgari watch in

497
00:25:56,280 --> 00:25:59,639
Speaker 7: fifteen thousand dollars in cash when you were first dating.

498
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:04,119
Speaker 3: Yeah, twenty to cash. Yeah, you have to think just cash,

499
00:26:04,520 --> 00:26:06,600
Speaker 3: just for the fuck of it. I couldn't even spend it.

500
00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:11,560
Speaker 7: I'd be running around shopping buying my mother like h stereo,

501
00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:12,800
Speaker 7: you know back then.

502
00:26:13,359 --> 00:26:17,840
Speaker 1: And stereo, find mom Stereo.

503
00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:18,960
Speaker 2: It was like that.

504
00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:21,320
Speaker 1: Movie Brewsters Millions. Do you remember that where he had

505
00:26:21,359 --> 00:26:22,400
Speaker 1: to spend all the money?

506
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:27,480
Speaker 3: Yes, right, So I didn't even know or you know,

507
00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:28,359
Speaker 3: he would.

508
00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:31,200
Speaker 7: He was so over the top with the love bombing,

509
00:26:31,280 --> 00:26:33,399
Speaker 7: Like that's a big part of the love bombing is

510
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:38,080
Speaker 7: just spending and spending and you know, getting me crazy jewelry,

511
00:26:38,119 --> 00:26:41,040
Speaker 7: taking me to Cardier for a watch, and just just

512
00:26:41,080 --> 00:26:42,960
Speaker 7: the money just seemed endless.

513
00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:44,879
Speaker 2: And isn't do you think that that was? I know

514
00:26:45,040 --> 00:26:47,639
Speaker 2: you you've said you guys were madly in love, but

515
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:50,480
Speaker 2: experiencing that from where you had come from and all

516
00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:54,639
Speaker 2: of a sudden to be you know, put to have

517
00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:57,040
Speaker 2: this glamorous world surrounding you.

518
00:26:57,520 --> 00:26:58,600
Speaker 3: It was it must have.

519
00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:01,720
Speaker 7: Yeah, And that's one of the reasons why I put

520
00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:04,639
Speaker 7: myself in therapy right away at twenty two twenty three,

521
00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:07,280
Speaker 7: because I was like, I don't know how to manage

522
00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:10,399
Speaker 7: a staff, you know, I mean I had Then we

523
00:27:10,440 --> 00:27:13,200
Speaker 7: moved to Long Island and at twenty four I think

524
00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:16,040
Speaker 7: I lived in a ten thousand square foot house. Had

525
00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:18,400
Speaker 7: to learn how to decorate it, right, So I went

526
00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:21,240
Speaker 7: to interior design school because I'm always trying to learn,

527
00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:25,119
Speaker 7: and you know, I didn't know how to deal really

528
00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:26,880
Speaker 7: with any of it. So so that's why I went

529
00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:29,280
Speaker 7: to school and learned. I went to like wine class,

530
00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:31,360
Speaker 7: interior design school, I went to therapy.

531
00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:33,400
Speaker 2: Do you have that imposter syndrome?

532
00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:34,120
Speaker 5: Yeah?

533
00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:37,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. I remember like going on vacation sometimes, even

534
00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:40,920
Speaker 2: when I was younger, places like I don't know, Saint Arts,

535
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:43,720
Speaker 2: and I would look around and see these all of

536
00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:46,840
Speaker 2: these beautiful people in their white linen, and you know,

537
00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:48,840
Speaker 2: they would have all the yachts and I was there,

538
00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:50,800
Speaker 2: I was looking at the same ocean, I was eating

539
00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:53,560
Speaker 2: the same food. But I would feel like this is

540
00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:55,520
Speaker 2: realy not me, This is not I.

541
00:27:56,160 --> 00:28:02,400
Speaker 7: Just feeling super insecure, right, not experienced that before, and

542
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:05,239
Speaker 7: me being a type a personality, you know, wanting to

543
00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:05,560
Speaker 7: do it.

544
00:28:05,600 --> 00:28:07,840
Speaker 3: Right whatever that meant, right, you know.

545
00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:10,520
Speaker 7: And then of course, you know, he put it over

546
00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:12,879
Speaker 7: the edge when he bought one hundred and eighty foot yacht.

547
00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:16,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh my god, so you were you were vacationing

548
00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:21,240
Speaker 1: on yachts, You lived in a in a massive mansion,

549
00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:22,720
Speaker 1: you had tons of jewelry.

550
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:25,840
Speaker 2: Were you happy?

551
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:28,159
Speaker 1: Was he good to you?

552
00:28:28,160 --> 00:28:28,359
Speaker 5: You know?

553
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:30,399
Speaker 3: Well, that's the thing about a trauma bond.

554
00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:34,000
Speaker 7: Is there something called intermittent abuse or intimate and reinforcement,

555
00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:37,720
Speaker 7: meaning that you have these extreme experiences of love and

556
00:28:37,760 --> 00:28:41,720
Speaker 7: love bombing and gifts and adoration, but then you also

557
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:46,160
Speaker 7: have extreme experiences of abuse and cruelty and control.

558
00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:50,720
Speaker 3: So it's the two. It's the too.

559
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:54,280
Speaker 7: It's the extremity of those two experiences that actually causes

560
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:54,800
Speaker 7: the bond.

561
00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:58,640
Speaker 1: And did you feel like you had to stay married

562
00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:01,200
Speaker 1: to him so that you can this lifestyle. Were you

563
00:29:01,400 --> 00:29:05,000
Speaker 1: terrorized by the thought of going back to not having money.

564
00:29:05,400 --> 00:29:06,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure.

565
00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:09,760
Speaker 7: And also I loved him and we had children right away,

566
00:29:10,080 --> 00:29:14,480
Speaker 7: and so I really wanted to make it work. But yeah,

567
00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:17,479
Speaker 7: I mean that that was a big piece of it

568
00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:20,440
Speaker 7: for sure. For sure, and the fear of can I

569
00:29:20,480 --> 00:29:21,320
Speaker 7: make it on my own?

570
00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:22,600
Speaker 5: Yeah?

571
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:26,000
Speaker 2: Did you feel when you were surrounded by so much?

572
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:29,600
Speaker 2: Because this is sort of what we've been talking about today,

573
00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:34,840
Speaker 2: But did you feel happier? Did you feel No? No, well,

574
00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 2: that's right, we'll talk about that a little bit.

575
00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:37,600
Speaker 5: Yeah.

576
00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:40,240
Speaker 3: No, I don't think that money makes you happier.

577
00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:43,880
Speaker 7: I think that, you know, coming from not having money

578
00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:46,640
Speaker 7: and then going into money, I think we've been fed

579
00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:50,160
Speaker 7: this American dream or this American myth that money is

580
00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:52,560
Speaker 7: going to make you happier. Now, yes, does it allow

581
00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:56,120
Speaker 7: us certain freedoms and does it give us certain comforts

582
00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:56,640
Speaker 7: for sure?

583
00:29:56,840 --> 00:29:58,480
Speaker 3: And access any things?

584
00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:01,480
Speaker 7: So I would never deny that, But I don't think

585
00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:05,000
Speaker 7: I think happiness is an inside job as a therapist especially,

586
00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:07,760
Speaker 7: and I don't think it made me happier. I think

587
00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:09,640
Speaker 7: actually what it did is it became a trap.

588
00:30:10,280 --> 00:30:13,440
Speaker 2: Right. I think that's so interesting. When you and Jordan

589
00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:17,560
Speaker 2: broke up, were you still wealthy? Did you? Or or

590
00:30:17,560 --> 00:30:18,640
Speaker 2: your whole lifestyle change?

591
00:30:18,680 --> 00:30:20,360
Speaker 3: I walked, I walked away with nothing.

592
00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:23,320
Speaker 1: What happened? So he got he got. You know, I

593
00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:25,080
Speaker 1: saw the movie a very long time ago, so I

594
00:30:25,120 --> 00:30:28,360
Speaker 1: don't really remember. But he got, he got arrested, he

595
00:30:28,360 --> 00:30:30,280
Speaker 1: went to jail, he got arrested, he got he went

596
00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:32,280
Speaker 1: to jail. But you didn't file for divorce for.

597
00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:35,360
Speaker 7: A little while after that, right, No, So what happened

598
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:39,320
Speaker 7: was that he got arrested for eleven counts of money laundering, and.

599
00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:41,520
Speaker 1: You were completely blindsided.

600
00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:46,280
Speaker 3: Completely blindsided. And then like that week, I filed for divorce.

601
00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:48,440
Speaker 7: I told him we get divorced because he had an

602
00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:51,480
Speaker 7: ankle bracelet on, and I knew I was safe because

603
00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:54,520
Speaker 7: he was very scary person. So I knew, like, no,

604
00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:59,400
Speaker 7: he's the government's problem, and so the government had a skill.

605
00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:01,720
Speaker 7: I gave a ten million dollars of all of our

606
00:31:01,720 --> 00:31:04,800
Speaker 7: homes and everything we owned for his bail. I drove

607
00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:07,640
Speaker 7: a million dollars worth of jewelry to the courthouse and

608
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 7: said take it all because I didn't want anything, because

609
00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:13,280
Speaker 7: it was all blood money.

610
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 2: How I think that is, first of all, so admirable.

611
00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:19,840
Speaker 2: I think that, you know, we can talk about a

612
00:31:19,840 --> 00:31:21,640
Speaker 2: lot of examples of women that would not want to

613
00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:24,920
Speaker 2: drive their jewelry to the courthouse, right.

614
00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:27,719
Speaker 1: I mean, if you watched The Housewives there, right, yeah, right,

615
00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:29,800
Speaker 1: right about Beverly Hillsman.

616
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:33,200
Speaker 3: Yes, but that actually gets me very angry.

617
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:36,000
Speaker 1: But the Erika Jane Earings situation.

618
00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:38,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, because I have a direct experience.

619
00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:43,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, But the blessing that you had enough wherewithal to

620
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:48,200
Speaker 2: know that that stuff wasn't treating you happiness, right, I

621
00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:50,920
Speaker 2: mean I think that that's how how blessed are you?

622
00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:53,080
Speaker 2: And I'm curious as to when you did get rid

623
00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:55,080
Speaker 2: of all of that, and you couldn't have been It

624
00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:56,840
Speaker 2: could have been a hard time. You were divorcing your

625
00:31:56,920 --> 00:32:00,120
Speaker 2: husband and your whole life was changing, But how how

626
00:32:00,200 --> 00:32:02,760
Speaker 2: much of you was affected by the fact that you

627
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:06,320
Speaker 2: were no longer a millionaire, a billionaire whatever.

628
00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:09,400
Speaker 7: Yeah, you know, just like everything, it was a paradox,

629
00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:11,280
Speaker 7: you know, I find that in life as I get older.

630
00:32:12,080 --> 00:32:15,840
Speaker 7: I was it felt freeing to give it up because

631
00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:19,520
Speaker 7: it was such a trap, and then it it actually

632
00:32:19,520 --> 00:32:21,880
Speaker 7: began to mean something terrible to me.

633
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,520
Speaker 5: Jackie, you were just yeah, I had this say, very

634
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 5: not to your degree, but I grew up, like the

635
00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:33,880
Speaker 5: first half of my childhood, very middle class, and then

636
00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:35,680
Speaker 5: my parents made a lot of money and those were

637
00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:38,560
Speaker 5: the worst years They were the worst years because I was.

638
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:42,720
Speaker 1: Lonely, I was isolated. My parents were fighting over the money.

639
00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:44,880
Speaker 1: Then they ended up, you know, getting shut down by

640
00:32:44,880 --> 00:32:48,640
Speaker 1: the irs and they went to they had their own issues.

641
00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:50,400
Speaker 3: So you had your own trauma around that. Yeah.

642
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:54,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, So after you got divorced, did you have the

643
00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:56,720
Speaker 1: option of fighting for money or was there nothing left?

644
00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:00,320
Speaker 7: I you know, I know many people that were in

645
00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:03,120
Speaker 7: that same case that did go and fight for money.

646
00:33:03,920 --> 00:33:04,479
Speaker 3: I didn't.

647
00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:07,560
Speaker 7: I didn't want that to be my plight in life.

648
00:33:07,560 --> 00:33:09,920
Speaker 7: I was thirty one, two little kids, and I had

649
00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:12,560
Speaker 7: a maternity company at the time, so I had my

650
00:33:12,600 --> 00:33:16,680
Speaker 7: own little business that I was kind of relying on,

651
00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:21,120
Speaker 7: and it just yeah, no, I was happy to give

652
00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:21,480
Speaker 7: it up.

653
00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:27,080
Speaker 2: And wow, I'm falling in love as we as we know,

654
00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:31,200
Speaker 2: I really am. Forget about that you're gorgeous, but also.

655
00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:32,160
Speaker 3: Which is that great?

656
00:33:32,360 --> 00:33:37,800
Speaker 2: I know what? But anyway, also just hearing this kind

657
00:33:37,800 --> 00:33:45,280
Speaker 2: of knowledge and this kind of uh, I don't know, fortitude,

658
00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:47,520
Speaker 2: and I love that hearing that with women. And I

659
00:33:47,560 --> 00:33:49,800
Speaker 2: love that you were, even back then when you were

660
00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:54,320
Speaker 2: so young, not as swayed by you know, the money.

661
00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:54,920
Speaker 2: I love that.

662
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:58,120
Speaker 1: So it's like going from how quickly did you go

663
00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:02,120
Speaker 1: from everything to You didn't go to nothing, right, but

664
00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:03,840
Speaker 1: you went to it like a very.

665
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:05,560
Speaker 3: I went to very low. Yeah.

666
00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:07,960
Speaker 7: Yeah, I went to like where I was really worrying

667
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:10,400
Speaker 7: about money and how I was going to make money.

668
00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:12,800
Speaker 3: And I did, oh wow, And then.

669
00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:14,319
Speaker 1: What was that? Like? What was that? Like?

670
00:34:14,440 --> 00:34:15,600
Speaker 3: That's super scary.

671
00:34:15,800 --> 00:34:19,319
Speaker 7: It was super scary because you know when you're when

672
00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:20,360
Speaker 7: I was that wealthy.

673
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:22,280
Speaker 3: Also, I was supporting my whole family.

674
00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:25,760
Speaker 7: That's like another one of those traps that you get into.

675
00:34:25,800 --> 00:34:27,399
Speaker 3: And so it wasn't even just.

676
00:34:27,320 --> 00:34:30,200
Speaker 1: Wait, tell us about that because they asked you to

677
00:34:30,440 --> 00:34:32,399
Speaker 1: or you felt like that's what you should do.

678
00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:35,080
Speaker 7: I think it was a bit of a combination of both.

679
00:34:36,080 --> 00:34:40,400
Speaker 7: And so I so that was like another piece of

680
00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:42,840
Speaker 7: it too, Like it was a lot. It wasn't just

681
00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:45,399
Speaker 7: giving up for me. It was like, Okay, now I'm

682
00:34:45,400 --> 00:34:48,640
Speaker 7: not taking care of my parents anymore. And so and

683
00:34:48,680 --> 00:34:50,480
Speaker 7: then I had two little kids, so then I was like, okay,

684
00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:51,880
Speaker 7: I can't take care of my parents. I got to

685
00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:54,480
Speaker 7: worry about my two little kids because they're three and five.

686
00:34:54,640 --> 00:34:57,680
Speaker 7: And so for about a year, I, like I said,

687
00:34:57,719 --> 00:35:00,479
Speaker 7: I was I had a maternity store in Roslyn, New York,

688
00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:03,400
Speaker 7: and I had a catalog and a website, so I

689
00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:06,279
Speaker 7: was working at that and then, as fate would have it,

690
00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:09,640
Speaker 7: I fell in love on a blind date with a

691
00:35:09,640 --> 00:35:11,319
Speaker 7: guy like a year and a half later who lives

692
00:35:11,360 --> 00:35:12,120
Speaker 7: in California.

693
00:35:13,040 --> 00:35:15,200
Speaker 3: And so then I picked my kids up and I.

694
00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:18,279
Speaker 7: Moved to LA to just have let us all have

695
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:20,359
Speaker 7: a fresh start, because I just didn't want them to

696
00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:23,200
Speaker 7: live with the legacy. Now, little did I know my

697
00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:26,080
Speaker 7: ex was going to write a book and make a movie, right, all.

698
00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:28,200
Speaker 1: Right, so tell us about that. So he was in

699
00:35:28,280 --> 00:35:30,239
Speaker 1: jail for how long? Because I know that there are

700
00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:33,160
Speaker 1: laws around, like moving your kids across the country when

701
00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:34,400
Speaker 1: the father is in one place.

702
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:35,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, so you know.

703
00:35:35,680 --> 00:35:39,440
Speaker 7: But luckily what happens is when your ex is a criminal.

704
00:35:40,160 --> 00:35:42,439
Speaker 2: The judge a little more leeway. Yeah yeah.

705
00:35:42,520 --> 00:35:44,840
Speaker 7: The judge was like, listen, your homes are getting taken

706
00:35:44,880 --> 00:35:48,520
Speaker 7: from you, your right, your husband's a felon, Like, you

707
00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:51,160
Speaker 7: can move. Actually just saw the new water in five minutes,

708
00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:52,959
Speaker 7: and so I was about to move.

709
00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:55,600
Speaker 2: But now in this day and age, and I know,

710
00:35:55,719 --> 00:35:57,840
Speaker 2: obviously you're a doctor and you take care of yourself,

711
00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:00,000
Speaker 2: and you're also married, I don't know anything about you husband,

712
00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:04,120
Speaker 2: How attached are you now the things to money, to wealth?

713
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:08,040
Speaker 7: Well, you know, listen, I still like my nice things.

714
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:11,719
Speaker 7: I won't say, I won't deny that, but as a

715
00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:16,080
Speaker 7: fifty six year old woman, I'm not that attached to it.

716
00:36:16,080 --> 00:36:18,720
Speaker 7: I'm much more attached to wisdom and knowledge and having

717
00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:23,799
Speaker 7: a moral compass and values and health. Again, that meat

718
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:27,400
Speaker 7: that I don't appreciate money now, But you have to remember,

719
00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:28,480
Speaker 7: like when I grew up.

720
00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:31,080
Speaker 3: Maybe I'm a little older than you guys.

721
00:36:31,080 --> 00:36:33,240
Speaker 2: You know, it was pretty five.

722
00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:37,040
Speaker 7: Okay, so it was pretty woman, right, it was greed

723
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:39,719
Speaker 7: is good. I mean, we were fed these.

724
00:36:39,640 --> 00:36:41,720
Speaker 3: Messages about us.

725
00:36:41,719 --> 00:36:45,919
Speaker 7: Right, we are got an older and wiser to know

726
00:36:46,040 --> 00:36:48,440
Speaker 7: about them. And I'm married for twenty four years now.

727
00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:51,520
Speaker 7: My husband and I he had three children, I had two.

728
00:36:51,560 --> 00:36:54,920
Speaker 7: We blended a family, and we had a modern day

729
00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:57,560
Speaker 7: Brady bunch. And so I picked up and moved to

730
00:36:57,680 --> 00:36:59,759
Speaker 7: La to start over.

731
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:03,280
Speaker 1: Right, I have a whole bunch of questions. Go ahead,

732
00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:03,880
Speaker 1: what was your.

733
00:37:03,800 --> 00:37:05,680
Speaker 2: We're just all over the place because we have so

734
00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:06,400
Speaker 2: much to ask you.

735
00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:10,239
Speaker 1: Okay, So from you, first question before we get into

736
00:37:10,239 --> 00:37:12,879
Speaker 1: anything else, is do you have any contact with Jordan today?

737
00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:13,960
Speaker 1: How are the kids with him?

738
00:37:14,160 --> 00:37:15,480
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, I do.

739
00:37:15,600 --> 00:37:19,560
Speaker 7: I do have contact with him. My children are thirty

740
00:37:19,560 --> 00:37:23,839
Speaker 7: and twenty eight. My daughter's a therapist, and you know,

741
00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:26,840
Speaker 7: she just got married, she had a baby. So Jordan

742
00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:32,080
Speaker 7: and I ironically actually got along pretty well afterwards. Oh,

743
00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:35,879
Speaker 7: you wrote this book, you know, he Listen, my book

744
00:37:35,920 --> 00:37:39,040
Speaker 7: isn't about him, but he certainly is the inspiration for it.

745
00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:40,720
Speaker 3: And we've had our.

746
00:37:41,120 --> 00:37:44,800
Speaker 7: Struggles a little bit with you know, me coming a

747
00:37:44,840 --> 00:37:47,000
Speaker 7: lot on social media and telling my story.

748
00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:48,759
Speaker 3: But you know, like I.

749
00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:51,399
Speaker 7: Said to him, you hed a book, you made a movie.

750
00:37:51,719 --> 00:37:53,360
Speaker 7: I also get to tell my narrative.

751
00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:04,400
Speaker 1: So I have a question. So, for a very brief

752
00:38:04,440 --> 00:38:06,640
Speaker 1: period of time in my twenties, I was a divorce

753
00:38:06,719 --> 00:38:08,759
Speaker 1: lawyer and one of the things that really I was

754
00:38:08,840 --> 00:38:12,520
Speaker 1: at a very high end Park Avenue divorce firm, and

755
00:38:13,480 --> 00:38:18,000
Speaker 1: I would have a lot of we were very female heavy,

756
00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:21,800
Speaker 1: so a lot of wives coming in and it would

757
00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:24,239
Speaker 1: break my heart because you would have these women whose

758
00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:28,719
Speaker 1: husbands were going on their third or fourth marriage divorcing

759
00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:31,520
Speaker 1: them as like their second or third wife, and they

760
00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:33,239
Speaker 1: were just lost. They didn't know what to do with

761
00:38:33,280 --> 00:38:35,719
Speaker 1: themselves now, and they were all kind of young and beautiful,

762
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:38,399
Speaker 1: but they gave up. They stopped working because they thought

763
00:38:38,440 --> 00:38:41,279
Speaker 1: this was forever and now they had no career and

764
00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:44,920
Speaker 1: they had kids, and now they had no money anymore,

765
00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:47,480
Speaker 1: and they didn't and you know, like the partners would

766
00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:49,080
Speaker 1: be like, you should look at, you know, getting a

767
00:38:49,120 --> 00:38:51,080
Speaker 1: new job and getting your resume in order, and they

768
00:38:51,080 --> 00:38:53,279
Speaker 1: were like resume, Like, I haven't worked in ten years

769
00:38:53,280 --> 00:38:56,000
Speaker 1: and I have little kids. So what's your advice to

770
00:38:56,120 --> 00:38:58,840
Speaker 1: any woman? I mean, because I know at my age

771
00:38:58,960 --> 00:39:02,200
Speaker 1: I see some of my friends' marriages drop in like flies,

772
00:39:02,360 --> 00:39:05,000
Speaker 1: So like, what's your advice to a woman who gives

773
00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:10,040
Speaker 1: up her career to basically marry and raise kids and

774
00:39:10,080 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 1: stay home and then suddenly they don't want to be broke?

775
00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:14,120
Speaker 3: Yeah?

776
00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:17,319
Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean that is so common, and thank you

777
00:39:17,440 --> 00:39:19,360
Speaker 7: for bringing that up. Well, first of all, in a

778
00:39:19,400 --> 00:39:21,120
Speaker 7: trauma bond, the number one thing that happens is you

779
00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:24,800
Speaker 7: lose yourself. That is the number one symptom that happens.

780
00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:29,280
Speaker 7: And so that comes along with a career, even hobbies,

781
00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:32,399
Speaker 7: even like what do you authentically want to do? So

782
00:39:32,760 --> 00:39:35,399
Speaker 7: what I always say, and you're facing your biggest fear.

783
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:36,680
Speaker 7: For a lot of them, a lot of them will

784
00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:39,799
Speaker 7: say that's my cancer innatine to me when I work

785
00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:42,919
Speaker 7: with them about it, And the only thing you can

786
00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:46,120
Speaker 7: do is to you've always been so focused on this

787
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:49,040
Speaker 7: other person, is turn the mirror back on you, get

788
00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:53,759
Speaker 7: really curious about you and really finds out authentically what

789
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:55,719
Speaker 7: you want to do. I mean, I went back to

790
00:39:55,760 --> 00:39:58,640
Speaker 7: school at thirty nine to become a therapist, So it

791
00:39:58,719 --> 00:40:02,600
Speaker 7: is never too late to restart your life. That doesn't

792
00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:06,319
Speaker 7: mean it's not scary, and that doesn't mean that it's

793
00:40:06,360 --> 00:40:09,200
Speaker 7: not hard, but you certainly.

794
00:40:08,840 --> 00:40:09,440
Speaker 3: Can do it.

795
00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:14,640
Speaker 2: Dean, Uh, here's a question. Do you watch the Housewives?

796
00:40:14,680 --> 00:40:18,960
Speaker 3: Oh my god, I'm obsessed. Really, I watch every single

797
00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:22,960
Speaker 3: one I do, deep dead out really Oh yeah, really,

798
00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:26,480
Speaker 3: it's my good pleasure. I love it.

799
00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:29,880
Speaker 1: You feeling about the trend of like some new housewives

800
00:40:29,880 --> 00:40:32,120
Speaker 1: coming in with like who are not wealthy, like the

801
00:40:32,200 --> 00:40:35,040
Speaker 1: Monica on Salt Lake City, or like even some recent

802
00:40:35,440 --> 00:40:39,560
Speaker 1: New Jersey housewives, or like some I think, like Gina

803
00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:41,960
Speaker 1: on the OC who I have? But like, how do

804
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:43,920
Speaker 1: you feel about that? Do you think that the Housewives

805
00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:46,200
Speaker 1: should be this fairy tale about money or should it

806
00:40:46,320 --> 00:40:47,160
Speaker 1: might like have on.

807
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:49,800
Speaker 7: Just like everything in life, it's good to have socioeconomic

808
00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:54,040
Speaker 7: diversity because women can relate to different types of women.

809
00:40:54,560 --> 00:40:57,120
Speaker 2: Well, I want to ask you how you think, and

810
00:40:57,239 --> 00:40:59,719
Speaker 2: this is obviously there are a lot of housewives, but

811
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:04,200
Speaker 2: how do you think watching all of the different franchises

812
00:41:04,600 --> 00:41:08,759
Speaker 2: these how do you think money affects the women? Some

813
00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:10,799
Speaker 2: of them have more, some of them have less. Do

814
00:41:10,840 --> 00:41:14,520
Speaker 2: you feel like there is so much buying for attention

815
00:41:14,719 --> 00:41:16,800
Speaker 2: and I have this and I have that and every

816
00:41:17,200 --> 00:41:19,480
Speaker 2: you know, it's a The house is a microcosm of

817
00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:22,200
Speaker 2: the of I feel like, you know the world we

818
00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:25,680
Speaker 2: live in. But what do you think is really driving

819
00:41:25,719 --> 00:41:27,120
Speaker 2: these women when it comes to money?

820
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:30,680
Speaker 7: You mean, like their desire to be on the show

821
00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:33,520
Speaker 7: or and like become famab what do you think.

822
00:41:33,440 --> 00:41:37,799
Speaker 1: Is behind this? Like showing off things that you very

823
00:41:37,840 --> 00:41:41,000
Speaker 1: often don't have, oh yeah, or even that you.

824
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:43,960
Speaker 2: Do have the showing off period, like watching it do that?

825
00:41:44,520 --> 00:41:49,640
Speaker 7: I mean I never understood that really, but I get

826
00:41:49,760 --> 00:41:52,719
Speaker 7: you know, I mean, listen, I can only think that

827
00:41:53,160 --> 00:41:56,680
Speaker 7: a lot of people place their personal value on the

828
00:41:56,719 --> 00:42:00,239
Speaker 7: things that they have. So if there were in a

829
00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:07,240
Speaker 7: Gucci belt, that means they're of value, right, true?

830
00:42:07,360 --> 00:42:10,240
Speaker 3: Because everybody's worth love just for being born.

831
00:42:10,960 --> 00:42:14,399
Speaker 2: I discuss that in therapy all the time, and not

832
00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:16,480
Speaker 2: just when it comes to money, right, when it comes

833
00:42:16,520 --> 00:42:18,960
Speaker 2: to fame. I think a lot of housewives feel like

834
00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:22,040
Speaker 2: they are when they are at the top of their game.

835
00:42:22,480 --> 00:42:25,160
Speaker 2: They're always afraid of losing it, and that causes misery.

836
00:42:25,200 --> 00:42:27,080
Speaker 2: And then if they're at the bottom of their game

837
00:42:27,120 --> 00:42:31,319
Speaker 2: and they've been demoted or you know, even help put

838
00:42:31,360 --> 00:42:34,600
Speaker 2: on pause, is that affects them. And the truth is,

839
00:42:34,640 --> 00:42:37,719
Speaker 2: of course that we're enough when we are at the

840
00:42:37,719 --> 00:42:39,520
Speaker 2: top of our game and we are on it and

841
00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:42,040
Speaker 2: we are the most popular housewife, or when we are

842
00:42:42,520 --> 00:42:45,560
Speaker 2: you know, the one that's been recently fired, none of

843
00:42:45,600 --> 00:42:50,360
Speaker 2: it really matters, right. It's living in dignity and living

844
00:42:50,360 --> 00:42:51,960
Speaker 2: in a place where you know you're enough.

845
00:42:52,040 --> 00:42:54,000
Speaker 3: And you can't you know this what I work with

846
00:42:54,040 --> 00:42:56,960
Speaker 3: all my patients on. You can't get your sense of

847
00:42:57,040 --> 00:42:59,799
Speaker 3: worth totally from external validation.

848
00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:01,920
Speaker 2: Right, And I think so much of that happens on

849
00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:02,719
Speaker 2: the housewife.

850
00:43:02,920 --> 00:43:04,960
Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean it's a hard job to be a housewife.

851
00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:07,440
Speaker 7: My hat's off to you, guys. I mean I couldnot

852
00:43:07,520 --> 00:43:09,640
Speaker 7: do that. It says, yeah, well, I'll tell you.

853
00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:13,560
Speaker 1: I have these moments of real clarity especially in the

854
00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:18,279
Speaker 1: past few months where ever since everything that happened in Israel,

855
00:43:18,440 --> 00:43:21,239
Speaker 1: and I'm Israel, my mother's from Israel, so I will

856
00:43:21,239 --> 00:43:23,520
Speaker 1: have these moments where I'm like and nothing matters to

857
00:43:23,520 --> 00:43:25,600
Speaker 1: me except being with my children right now, Like you

858
00:43:25,640 --> 00:43:27,400
Speaker 1: could take everything from me. The fact that I can

859
00:43:27,440 --> 00:43:29,560
Speaker 1: sit next to my children while there are you know,

860
00:43:29,560 --> 00:43:32,240
Speaker 1: one hundred and thirty plus people still being held hostage,

861
00:43:32,520 --> 00:43:34,880
Speaker 1: is like, nothing else matters.

862
00:43:34,960 --> 00:43:38,680
Speaker 2: Get perspective, I think. Unfortunately, sometimes also when bad things happen, right,

863
00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:42,280
Speaker 2: like God forbid, someone gets sick, the only thing I saved.

864
00:43:42,280 --> 00:43:45,440
Speaker 2: Michael Strahan say that, yeah, his daughter has brain cancer,

865
00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:49,960
Speaker 2: and he said everything stopped. Of course, everything stopped when

866
00:43:50,200 --> 00:43:54,440
Speaker 2: somebody you love gets sick. But I guess that comes

867
00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:58,319
Speaker 2: with perspective, right, So all of this stuff at the.

868
00:43:58,360 --> 00:44:01,000
Speaker 1: End of the day doesn't matter, means very little.

869
00:44:01,160 --> 00:44:01,840
Speaker 3: It doesn't matter.

870
00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:04,360
Speaker 7: And that's why I became a therapist because therapy saved

871
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:06,920
Speaker 7: my life. And what I love about therapy is you

872
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:10,799
Speaker 7: can't really get perspective unless you're reflective, right, if you

873
00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:14,719
Speaker 7: don't pause and think about, like, really, what is important,

874
00:44:14,760 --> 00:44:16,080
Speaker 7: what is making me happy?

875
00:44:16,760 --> 00:44:19,120
Speaker 3: And taking that time to do that is what gives

876
00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:21,080
Speaker 3: us perspective and.

877
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:24,360
Speaker 2: It's the only thing, right, like all this other stuff, right,

878
00:44:24,400 --> 00:44:28,040
Speaker 2: and all this other these feelings of grandiosity that I

879
00:44:28,080 --> 00:44:32,120
Speaker 2: think we fallen intimto as people that have been on TV.

880
00:44:32,640 --> 00:44:36,080
Speaker 2: It always fads and you're always left with you know

881
00:44:37,040 --> 00:44:42,240
Speaker 2: you and being happy with who you are outside of money.

882
00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:45,080
Speaker 2: That's a side of any kind of theme.

883
00:44:45,920 --> 00:44:49,440
Speaker 1: So how are you now? Are you comfortable again?

884
00:44:49,560 --> 00:44:51,920
Speaker 6: Are you Do you ever wish that you could go

885
00:44:52,040 --> 00:44:56,799
Speaker 6: back to some of that grand lifestyle or are you

886
00:44:56,840 --> 00:44:57,720
Speaker 6: completely content?

887
00:44:58,520 --> 00:45:01,120
Speaker 3: I'm content? I mean, so would it be fun to

888
00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:03,399
Speaker 3: go on a yacht maybe for a weekends.

889
00:45:03,400 --> 00:45:08,480
Speaker 7: Sure, But and you know I my daughters escaped birth

890
00:45:08,600 --> 00:45:12,200
Speaker 7: and we have a six month congratulation. Yeah, and we

891
00:45:12,440 --> 00:45:16,640
Speaker 7: just spent like a quiet, simple Christmas in Boca with

892
00:45:16,840 --> 00:45:21,480
Speaker 7: family and it's calm and there's no drama. And you

893
00:45:21,520 --> 00:45:25,319
Speaker 7: know I worked hard to have that life. Yeah, that

894
00:45:25,480 --> 00:45:30,040
Speaker 7: emotional richness, right, that emotional intelligence.

895
00:45:29,800 --> 00:45:32,319
Speaker 2: And all of that. I know I'm repeating myself, but

896
00:45:32,440 --> 00:45:36,240
Speaker 2: all of that stuff that you had and it didn't

897
00:45:36,280 --> 00:45:40,919
Speaker 2: fill you up, And like right, it's just I wish

898
00:45:41,040 --> 00:45:45,120
Speaker 2: that you know, everybody, we could all agree that all

899
00:45:45,160 --> 00:45:47,399
Speaker 2: this stuff is so unnecessary, but I used to work

900
00:45:47,440 --> 00:45:48,320
Speaker 2: on my own desire.

901
00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:51,160
Speaker 6: Can I ask you another question, just you your thoughts

902
00:45:51,160 --> 00:45:52,880
Speaker 6: on this. I read an article in the New York

903
00:45:52,920 --> 00:45:55,759
Speaker 6: Post last week about this new trend of the stay

904
00:45:55,800 --> 00:45:56,560
Speaker 6: at home girlfriend.

905
00:45:56,600 --> 00:45:57,360
Speaker 3: Have you heard about this?

906
00:45:58,000 --> 00:45:58,800
Speaker 2: No? Please?

907
00:45:58,880 --> 00:46:03,520
Speaker 6: It's about women choosing to slow down.

908
00:46:04,000 --> 00:46:04,200
Speaker 3: There.

909
00:46:04,239 --> 00:46:07,000
Speaker 6: What was the exact words they used was they're choosing

910
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:10,840
Speaker 6: a softer life than the go getter, girl boss life.

911
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:13,640
Speaker 6: It's like they're they're getting rid of the girl boss

912
00:46:13,640 --> 00:46:14,160
Speaker 6: and they just.

913
00:46:14,120 --> 00:46:18,799
Speaker 8: Want to go stay home, take care of their boyfriend,

914
00:46:19,800 --> 00:46:22,640
Speaker 8: and take care of themselves so they could be their

915
00:46:22,680 --> 00:46:24,640
Speaker 8: best self for their boyfriend.

916
00:46:25,200 --> 00:46:27,080
Speaker 1: But in the meantime, they are not.

917
00:46:27,760 --> 00:46:28,120
Speaker 2: They don't.

918
00:46:28,360 --> 00:46:34,120
Speaker 6: There's no emphasis on marriage, so there's there's no promise

919
00:46:34,160 --> 00:46:38,160
Speaker 6: of financial security for you. Treating your career and your

920
00:46:38,680 --> 00:46:41,600
Speaker 6: you know, your future for the comfort of this person.

921
00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:46,880
Speaker 3: What do you think of that? Well, I mean the

922
00:46:47,000 --> 00:46:49,360
Speaker 3: purse of who you are. So yeah, I mean.

923
00:46:50,719 --> 00:46:50,919
Speaker 6: Good.

924
00:46:51,200 --> 00:46:52,560
Speaker 3: They want to slow down and not.

925
00:46:53,040 --> 00:46:55,640
Speaker 6: Buy into the whole girl bloss thing, which I can

926
00:46:56,280 --> 00:46:57,600
Speaker 6: see that guns committed to that.

927
00:46:59,520 --> 00:47:04,240
Speaker 7: I can stand that wanting a slower, softer, easier life. However,

928
00:47:04,440 --> 00:47:08,319
Speaker 7: I do think you run into trouble when you get

929
00:47:08,440 --> 00:47:12,359
Speaker 7: very focused on just your partner, and again you can

930
00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:15,240
Speaker 7: lose yourself in them. I think it's very important, especially

931
00:47:15,239 --> 00:47:18,719
Speaker 7: as a woman, because we've been taught to be so relational,

932
00:47:18,760 --> 00:47:22,799
Speaker 7: which is beautiful, but it's very important to still stay

933
00:47:22,920 --> 00:47:25,520
Speaker 7: very connected to yourself. Like that's what I work on

934
00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:29,359
Speaker 7: with my women. How do you stay connected in your

935
00:47:29,400 --> 00:47:32,719
Speaker 7: own power, in your own authenticity to yourself and still

936
00:47:32,760 --> 00:47:34,000
Speaker 7: stay connected to another.

937
00:47:34,400 --> 00:47:36,960
Speaker 3: Right, that's the valle and you know when there's I

938
00:47:36,960 --> 00:47:39,120
Speaker 3: don't think that it's black or white.

939
00:47:39,120 --> 00:47:41,920
Speaker 2: You don't have to be a girl boss, no to yea,

940
00:47:42,320 --> 00:47:45,560
Speaker 2: but saying that, you know, the new way is to

941
00:47:45,640 --> 00:47:49,600
Speaker 2: simply take care of someone else, and again without marriage

942
00:47:49,680 --> 00:47:51,640
Speaker 2: or any kind of if you're going to give up

943
00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:54,560
Speaker 2: everything and that's the way you want to live is

944
00:47:54,600 --> 00:47:57,200
Speaker 2: just to you know, make someone else happy that makes

945
00:47:57,239 --> 00:48:01,080
Speaker 2: you happy. Well, you better be careful because because it's

946
00:48:01,280 --> 00:48:03,160
Speaker 2: maybe there's potentially that it might.

947
00:48:03,080 --> 00:48:05,000
Speaker 3: Not work out. And then what.

948
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:09,520
Speaker 6: Why do you think I personally signed a pren up

949
00:48:09,560 --> 00:48:12,120
Speaker 6: with Evan because I came into the marriage with a

950
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:16,440
Speaker 6: lot of my parents' money, which I don't spend my parents'

951
00:48:16,480 --> 00:48:19,640
Speaker 6: money at all, but I had to protect that out

952
00:48:19,680 --> 00:48:23,040
Speaker 6: of respect for them. He had absolutely no issues signed

953
00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:25,640
Speaker 6: your prenup. He's in finance, he's made his own money.

954
00:48:27,040 --> 00:48:30,480
Speaker 6: But I feel like prenups get such a bad rap,

955
00:48:30,520 --> 00:48:33,799
Speaker 6: and I think that they're so like, there's nothing wrong

956
00:48:33,840 --> 00:48:35,360
Speaker 6: with them.

957
00:48:35,600 --> 00:48:37,800
Speaker 7: I agree with you. I think they're so important because

958
00:48:38,040 --> 00:48:39,480
Speaker 7: marriage is a legal commitment.

959
00:48:39,600 --> 00:48:42,480
Speaker 3: As we know, people so against them. What is the

960
00:48:42,520 --> 00:48:43,319
Speaker 3: bad rap with them?

961
00:48:43,719 --> 00:48:46,520
Speaker 7: Because it's like that fairy tale love thing, you know,

962
00:48:46,600 --> 00:48:48,279
Speaker 7: but we know people fall out of love.

963
00:48:48,560 --> 00:48:52,200
Speaker 3: We know we're living much longer, we know change is inevitable.

964
00:48:54,040 --> 00:48:57,920
Speaker 2: I would not have signed when I don't think and

965
00:48:58,760 --> 00:49:01,480
Speaker 2: I'll tell you because is it' kind of about the

966
00:49:01,800 --> 00:49:03,640
Speaker 2: it's about romanticizing marriage.

967
00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:06,280
Speaker 3: How many what percentages? There are more than half marriages

968
00:49:06,400 --> 00:49:07,160
Speaker 3: and and divorce?

969
00:49:07,760 --> 00:49:07,920
Speaker 2: Right?

970
00:49:08,440 --> 00:49:13,000
Speaker 3: But I think, honestly because of my own security and

971
00:49:13,120 --> 00:49:15,480
Speaker 3: knowing that, you know, we were going to enter into

972
00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:17,040
Speaker 3: this partnership and.

973
00:49:17,480 --> 00:49:20,800
Speaker 2: I was going to be home taking care of the

974
00:49:20,880 --> 00:49:24,439
Speaker 2: kids and raising them, and Jeff was going to be

975
00:49:24,680 --> 00:49:27,920
Speaker 2: bringing in, you know, the money, and.

976
00:49:27,560 --> 00:49:29,680
Speaker 3: So what did that what would that look like at

977
00:49:29,680 --> 00:49:30,879
Speaker 3: the end of the marriage.

978
00:49:31,120 --> 00:49:32,839
Speaker 9: And this is the point I think that people think

979
00:49:32,880 --> 00:49:35,680
Speaker 9: that a seen is going to automatically work against the woman.

980
00:49:35,840 --> 00:49:37,640
Speaker 3: But I think that you can actually make it work

981
00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:40,080
Speaker 3: in your favor. You can set up because if you

982
00:49:40,160 --> 00:49:42,000
Speaker 3: leave it to the court, it's different. States have different

983
00:49:42,040 --> 00:49:43,839
Speaker 3: rules on how what you're going to get, but you're

984
00:49:43,840 --> 00:49:46,200
Speaker 3: going to do Yes, that's true. And have you ever

985
00:49:46,239 --> 00:49:46,840
Speaker 3: known a woman?

986
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:49,719
Speaker 6: Have you ever known a woman to sign a prenup

987
00:49:50,080 --> 00:49:51,760
Speaker 6: because she thought it would help her out.

988
00:49:51,640 --> 00:49:52,040
Speaker 1: In the end.

989
00:49:52,160 --> 00:49:54,520
Speaker 6: I only know women whould sign if the man would

990
00:49:54,520 --> 00:49:58,120
Speaker 6: demand that she signed a prenup. I think that, do

991
00:49:58,160 --> 00:50:01,080
Speaker 6: you do you you know women that signed prenups because

992
00:50:01,080 --> 00:50:01,680
Speaker 6: they wanted to.

993
00:50:02,320 --> 00:50:02,400
Speaker 2: No.

994
00:50:02,520 --> 00:50:05,520
Speaker 7: But I think what Jackie's talking about is I think

995
00:50:05,600 --> 00:50:08,359
Speaker 7: actually an interesting new way to look at prenups where

996
00:50:08,400 --> 00:50:10,120
Speaker 7: it can protect both parties.

997
00:50:10,640 --> 00:50:10,759
Speaker 6: You know.

998
00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:14,719
Speaker 7: I love that parties came in and like really decided,

999
00:50:14,920 --> 00:50:18,239
Speaker 7: like mine intentionally, this is if we did break up,

1000
00:50:18,280 --> 00:50:20,920
Speaker 7: this is how we would do it. So I think traditionally,

1001
00:50:20,960 --> 00:50:23,480
Speaker 7: I don't think that's been Additionally it has not been

1002
00:50:23,560 --> 00:50:27,040
Speaker 7: like that. Like in my second I don't have pree up, right,

1003
00:50:27,400 --> 00:50:30,839
Speaker 7: I came with nothing, so worry about.

1004
00:50:30,520 --> 00:50:32,400
Speaker 3: That, right, you know.

1005
00:50:32,719 --> 00:50:35,400
Speaker 7: But the thing about one of the reasons why I

1006
00:50:35,400 --> 00:50:37,759
Speaker 7: wrote my book too is that I love this conversation.

1007
00:50:38,000 --> 00:50:42,239
Speaker 7: Is that education is what empowers us. So having these

1008
00:50:42,280 --> 00:50:46,800
Speaker 7: conversations and talking about different concepts, right, and then we get.

1009
00:50:46,719 --> 00:50:50,480
Speaker 3: Then we get to choose. Yeah, that's right, and we

1010
00:50:50,520 --> 00:50:51,200
Speaker 3: get to choose.

1011
00:50:52,080 --> 00:50:52,600
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1012
00:50:52,719 --> 00:50:56,600
Speaker 2: Well, listen, after the show is overall, meet you for

1013
00:50:56,640 --> 00:50:58,120
Speaker 2: dinner at what time?

1014
00:50:58,200 --> 00:51:02,359
Speaker 3: Because I'm obsessed so going to New York next week.

1015
00:51:03,360 --> 00:51:06,680
Speaker 6: Please let's get together. Really we would love to say

1016
00:51:07,160 --> 00:51:08,000
Speaker 6: you're amazing.

1017
00:51:08,320 --> 00:51:11,520
Speaker 7: Yeah, I'm going to to Good Morning America and NBC

1018
00:51:11,840 --> 00:51:13,120
Speaker 7: so to promote my boss.

1019
00:51:13,560 --> 00:51:14,040
Speaker 3: Amazing.

1020
00:51:14,280 --> 00:51:16,600
Speaker 6: It was such a pleasure of meeting you, and honestly,

1021
00:51:16,600 --> 00:51:18,239
Speaker 6: I love your perspective.

1022
00:51:19,400 --> 00:51:22,719
Speaker 3: So much. I love you so watching you. Thank you

1023
00:51:22,760 --> 00:51:23,759
Speaker 3: for entertaining me.

1024
00:51:24,360 --> 00:51:24,719
Speaker 2: Thank you.

1025
00:51:24,760 --> 00:51:28,160
Speaker 3: Need to go on. She was amazing, amazing.

1026
00:51:28,200 --> 00:51:30,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, I loved her, and I was so taken with

1027
00:51:30,680 --> 00:51:33,400
Speaker 2: the fact that she was not so taken with the money.

1028
00:51:33,520 --> 00:51:36,759
Speaker 2: I mean, to go from you know, being poor and

1029
00:51:36,800 --> 00:51:40,600
Speaker 2: then thrust into a world of glamour and luxury and

1030
00:51:40,680 --> 00:51:43,320
Speaker 2: still drive all your stuff right to the courthouse.

1031
00:51:43,480 --> 00:51:46,600
Speaker 3: Good for her. I don't think it sounds like it

1032
00:51:46,640 --> 00:51:48,360
Speaker 3: was that hard. I think she's very grounded.

1033
00:51:48,520 --> 00:51:50,680
Speaker 2: I mean, she and I think that a lot of

1034
00:51:50,680 --> 00:51:52,799
Speaker 2: people are not when you get you know, when you

1035
00:51:52,840 --> 00:51:56,000
Speaker 2: become that wealthy, you lose perspective. That's why I think

1036
00:51:56,040 --> 00:51:57,319
Speaker 2: I really just liked her.

1037
00:51:57,440 --> 00:52:00,000
Speaker 9: Well, I think that the money didn't bring her happiness,

1038
00:52:00,040 --> 00:52:02,560
Speaker 9: and when she saw that or made it easier because

1039
00:52:02,840 --> 00:52:04,759
Speaker 9: a lot of unhappy people that have money, they'll still

1040
00:52:04,760 --> 00:52:05,359
Speaker 9: cling to it.

1041
00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:08,839
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, right, listen, here's the truth of it. I'm

1042
00:52:08,840 --> 00:52:11,400
Speaker 2: not above any of that. I don't have what some

1043
00:52:11,400 --> 00:52:13,160
Speaker 2: people have, and I have more than other people have.

1044
00:52:13,280 --> 00:52:13,799
Speaker 3: But guess what.

1045
00:52:14,280 --> 00:52:17,399
Speaker 2: I think that if I my lifestyle was about to change,

1046
00:52:17,400 --> 00:52:20,000
Speaker 2: I hope that I would be okay with that and

1047
00:52:20,040 --> 00:52:22,600
Speaker 2: be strong enough and say I'm not getting I'm not

1048
00:52:22,719 --> 00:52:27,120
Speaker 2: happy because I have a five bedroom colonial in Versaddle River.

1049
00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:30,560
Speaker 2: I could be happy and you know, with much less.

1050
00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:35,000
Speaker 9: Yeah. Well, you know what, Margaret Robby played her in

1051
00:52:35,040 --> 00:52:36,840
Speaker 9: a movie, a.

1052
00:52:36,880 --> 00:52:39,279
Speaker 3: Movie about me, and Marco Rockie played me. I could

1053
00:52:39,280 --> 00:52:43,080
Speaker 3: do that. Yeah, well that means that I'm pretty fucking gorgeous.

1054
00:52:44,000 --> 00:52:44,400
Speaker 1: Gorgeous.

1055
00:52:46,440 --> 00:52:49,279
Speaker 3: This was so good, it was it was really I

1056
00:52:49,360 --> 00:52:52,040
Speaker 3: loved hearing your upbringing story. I didn't know that about

1057
00:52:52,040 --> 00:52:52,480
Speaker 3: your dad.

1058
00:52:52,840 --> 00:52:55,560
Speaker 6: Really, that's well, Yeah, one of the divorce clients that

1059
00:52:55,640 --> 00:52:58,640
Speaker 6: I had lived in that same Trump Edding Tower.

1060
00:52:58,760 --> 00:53:01,200
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, Hi, I was in.

1061
00:53:01,360 --> 00:53:03,640
Speaker 2: I moved to New York City after college and I

1062
00:53:03,680 --> 00:53:05,520
Speaker 2: was in acting school and at that time he had

1063
00:53:05,520 --> 00:53:07,680
Speaker 2: moved to Dallas, so he had like six months left

1064
00:53:07,680 --> 00:53:11,920
Speaker 2: on his lease. So I moved in. I lived in

1065
00:53:12,120 --> 00:53:15,319
Speaker 2: a power and I would have these like parties, and

1066
00:53:15,400 --> 00:53:18,200
Speaker 2: the doormen were like, what the fuck it would be like,

1067
00:53:18,640 --> 00:53:21,040
Speaker 2: you know, kids coming in driving their bikes the goals,

1068
00:53:21,080 --> 00:53:23,920
Speaker 2: barking their bikes and bringing up like whatever, booze and

1069
00:53:23,960 --> 00:53:24,760
Speaker 2: paper bags.

1070
00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:26,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's another great.

1071
00:53:26,800 --> 00:53:30,000
Speaker 2: Example of like being there at that time, I think

1072
00:53:30,080 --> 00:53:32,600
Speaker 2: made me feel fed into this feeling that I was

1073
00:53:32,640 --> 00:53:36,359
Speaker 2: somehow special. You know. Meanwhile, I was at that time

1074
00:53:36,360 --> 00:53:38,719
Speaker 2: in my life like it fed into that, and yet

1075
00:53:38,719 --> 00:53:40,440
Speaker 2: at the same time, I was not happy.

1076
00:53:40,239 --> 00:53:41,200
Speaker 3: At that point in my life.

1077
00:53:41,239 --> 00:53:45,080
Speaker 2: I was I was struggling with an eating disorder and

1078
00:53:45,440 --> 00:53:47,960
Speaker 2: feeling less than in so many different areas in my life,

1079
00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:52,279
Speaker 2: you know, and not feeling good about myself, not feeling attractive,

1080
00:53:52,360 --> 00:53:53,960
Speaker 2: not feeling like I really knew what I wanted to

1081
00:53:54,000 --> 00:53:57,200
Speaker 2: do with my life. But that fed into that part

1082
00:53:57,239 --> 00:54:01,920
Speaker 2: of me, you know, is attack to money. I have

1083
00:54:02,120 --> 00:54:06,880
Speaker 2: this apartment, I'm just as good as I'm better than

1084
00:54:06,880 --> 00:54:07,720
Speaker 2: while I was miserable.

1085
00:54:08,680 --> 00:54:11,200
Speaker 3: I'm so glad that you found yourself. Thank you. Not

1086
00:54:11,239 --> 00:54:14,240
Speaker 3: complete late act saying happy and briving.

1087
00:54:14,680 --> 00:54:18,000
Speaker 6: Do wait all right, guys, well, we are so happy

1088
00:54:18,040 --> 00:54:22,000
Speaker 6: that you tuned in and leave us five stars if

1089
00:54:22,080 --> 00:54:25,440
Speaker 6: you love us, we don't. No, don't tell them not

1090
00:54:25,520 --> 00:54:29,799
Speaker 6: to be. We're fucking five stars. Do it easy, all right?

1091
00:54:29,840 --> 00:54:32,360
Speaker 6: So until next time, guys, thank you so much. We

1092
00:54:32,440 --> 00:54:35,480
Speaker 6: are two Jersey days and we will see you next time.

1093
00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:35,680
Speaker 5: We b