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Speaker 1: It's Robert Evans behind the Bastards podcast. This is introduction,

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Speaker 1: not very good. I like it. Thank you, Sophie, thank

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Speaker 1: you for lying about it being a good introduction. But

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Speaker 1: you know it is good, certainly better than my introduction.

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Speaker 1: Is our guest for today, Mr Andrew T. Fuck yeah,

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Speaker 1: what's up? I'm alive. Can't kill me yet? Nope, nope, can't.

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Speaker 1: So you have made it through the rona so far, Andrew? Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I have to say your hair looks as badly in

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Speaker 1: need of a cut as mine does. Yeah. I can't decide,

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Speaker 1: are you. I'm like debating whether to just shoot the

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Speaker 1: moon and grow it to like donatable lengths. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: shave my head. I don't know. It's it's unpleasant. It's

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Speaker 1: it's at the very unpleasant point of the growth. Like it.

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Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, I hate it back in my neck.

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Speaker 1: It's fucking discussed. It's terrible. But we could do what

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Speaker 1: if we did like a locks of love things, But

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Speaker 1: instead of for people who need hair, it's for like

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Speaker 1: weird horny people on the internet. Yeah yeah, oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: yeah yeah. We raise money for some charity. I don't

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Speaker 1: know what kind of charity, Like, uh, bomb's not food.

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Speaker 1: Maybe that sounds like a charity. I mean, it could

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Speaker 1: be like sort of an only fan situation. Yeah, the

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Speaker 1: recording of cutting it will be will be useful to somebody. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that'll be a SMR for some very weird person. And yeah,

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Speaker 1: so Andrew Andrew Andrew. As a general rule, when you

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Speaker 1: and I get together, we talk about a horrific story

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Speaker 1: of colonial genocide, um, which is what our friendship has

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Speaker 1: been based on up until this point, even before the podcast.

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Speaker 1: That's the hard Yeah, I would just call you randomly

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Speaker 1: in the middle of the night and be like, if

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Speaker 1: you heard about what they did to Haiti, I'd be like, Nope,

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Speaker 1: let's hear it today. Though, Today we have a story

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Speaker 1: that's horrible, really really horrible. But it's actually a little

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Speaker 1: bit of a reverse though, because it's like, in part

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Speaker 1: the story of this weird belief system from Europe being adopted,

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Speaker 1: uh honestly by people in a colonized nation and then

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Speaker 1: used to justify horrific misbehavior on behalf of quote leaders.

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Speaker 1: So that's kind of cool. Yeah, yeah, cool. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: guess you could call it a type of I don't know,

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Speaker 1: I don't even know what to call this. It's a

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Speaker 1: real motherfucker of a story though. Um, this is the

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Speaker 1: tale of John of God. Have you ever heard of

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Speaker 1: John of God? I've heard of neither John nor God,

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Speaker 1: So okay, no John of God. Now people might be confused.

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Speaker 1: There's an actual like Jesus E guy, like a Catholic

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Speaker 1: person called John of God. I think he's a saint

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Speaker 1: or some ship. This is not that guy. Uh, this

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Speaker 1: is a modern uh spiritual medical grifter repeatedly endorsed by

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Speaker 1: Oprah Winfrey, who turned out to be a mass rapist

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Speaker 1: and possibly a baby farmer. So that is, uh, that's

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Speaker 1: what we're getting into today. You're welcome and yeah, thanks

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Speaker 1: for having me Jesus Christ. Yeah, yep, it's it's gonna

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Speaker 1: be an interesting tale today. Um. But before we get

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Speaker 1: into John of God's story, we have to go back

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Speaker 1: in history to the mid eighteen hundreds and to a

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Speaker 1: man with what I would have to say is one

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Speaker 1: of the most unreasonably cool names I've ever come across

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Speaker 1: in my research. Are you ready for this name? You're

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Speaker 1: not run his name? Nobody's ready for this fucking name.

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Speaker 1: Hippo light Leon Dennis Ard Reveil. That is a fucking

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Speaker 1: name Hippo light Leon Dennis Ard Reveil. That is a

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Speaker 1: fucking name. Like it's like, so what I like like

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Speaker 1: going like subtle on the on the final landing. It's

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Speaker 1: just like, yeah, we could do it normal. I like this.

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Speaker 1: Fully fifty percent of his four names sound like Pokemon.

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Speaker 1: I've got a Hippolyte, I've got a Denizards so Hippolte

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Speaker 1: Leon Denizard Revel was a French educator and he wrote

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Speaker 1: under the markedly less cool pin name Alan Cardek, which

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Speaker 1: I don't understand. If you're Hippo lightly on Dennizard Revel,

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Speaker 1: you lean into that ship like this guy did not

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Speaker 1: know what was clickable. Very frustrating. That's wild. Yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: giving up speaking as a guy who's named after fucking

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Speaker 1: the Godfather. Guy, Like like that's that you don't give

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Speaker 1: up the gift of a name that cool. Very frustrated.

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Speaker 1: So anyway, under the boring name Alan Cardeck, he wrote

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Speaker 1: a series of books about spirits and and cardex core

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Speaker 1: contention was that all living animals were inhabited by immortal

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Speaker 1: spirits that bounced around from body to body over the

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Speaker 1: ceaseless AONs uh. Cardek also believed that spirits could become

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Speaker 1: disembodied through a variety of causes, and that these free

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Speaker 1: spirits could impact the world in positive and negative ways.

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Speaker 1: Cardex theories became the religion of Spiritism, which is still

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Speaker 1: practiced around the world today. Uh, and it is particularly

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Speaker 1: popular for reasons I don't really understand. In Brazil it

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Speaker 1: has something like three million adherents there. Damn, yeah, that is,

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Speaker 1: I guess it. It's it's sort of like, uh, French

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Speaker 1: version of sort of like an animistic type religion, right

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Speaker 1: there's yeah. I think I think you're you're you're very

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Speaker 1: keen to recognize that, because I suspect it has a

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Speaker 1: lot to do with that, and usually spirit is m

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Speaker 1: winds up being kind of like a Spiritist Christian hybrid um,

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Speaker 1: and it does. You're right, it kind of does, because

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Speaker 1: a lot of these places had sort of animus traditions

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Speaker 1: prior to Europeans coming in and fucking ship up, and

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Speaker 1: so Spiritism felt like this kind of genuine synthesis of

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Speaker 1: these old traditions with you know, the new Christianity. I

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Speaker 1: think you're probably onto something there. I guess that's kind

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Speaker 1: of the ship that happened with like Catholicism in South America,

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Speaker 1: where it basically became Saints became a pantheon, yeah, or

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Speaker 1: the Polytheism. It's like, yeah, it's fine, just a slight

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Speaker 1: emotion and there everyone's the same. Yeah, it's whatever. So

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Speaker 1: we don't hear a lot about spiritism today in the

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Speaker 1: United States, and probably the reason why is that, um,

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Speaker 1: a sizeable number of what we're originally the religion's chief

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Speaker 1: pillars have just become normal facets of like fringe spirituality.

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Speaker 1: Like a lot of stuff that was originally part of

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Speaker 1: this spiritualism religion that Cardik cooked up just kind of

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Speaker 1: became things that like people who like crystals all believe

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Speaker 1: yeah yeah yeah yeah um yeah. And even Christianity kind

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Speaker 1: of like mainstream evangelical Christianity and the United States has

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Speaker 1: even absorbed a number of spiritist beliefs, or at least

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Speaker 1: different Christian cults around the world have done that. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And in a number of places, including Brazil, this has

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Speaker 1: led to spiritual healers becoming a very big deal. Spiritual

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Speaker 1: healers are individuals who claim to be able to carry

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Speaker 1: out magical healing sessions because their bodies act as conduits

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Speaker 1: for dead medical doctors, saints, and sometimes just God himself.

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Speaker 1: Now in the United States, this is often seen in

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Speaker 1: Pentecostal communities, who I talk about a lot because people

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Speaker 1: need to know more about them they do. Have you

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Speaker 1: ever seen like spiritual surgery sessions? Oh shit, Um, I

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Speaker 1: feel like I I can imagine it, but I can't

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Speaker 1: think of one. But yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's kind

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Speaker 1: of like like laying on of hands type ship and

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Speaker 1: laying on of hands. But then they'll like pull their

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Speaker 1: hands away. They'll be like, oh, there's a tuba inside,

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Speaker 1: you know, the god the Devil's put a tumb around

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Speaker 1: ya hot And they'll pull their hands away and they'll

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Speaker 1: have like a bunch of bloody pieces of meat in

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Speaker 1: their hands, and it's almost it's it's always like chicken

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Speaker 1: or something like they get guts from like an animal

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Speaker 1: and they do sleight of hand like magicians ship to

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Speaker 1: make it look like they're kind of like that guy

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Speaker 1: in Temple of Doom pulling out you know, right right oregon. Um. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Like that's that's a big thing in the United States. Um.

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Speaker 1: And it's it's it's cool. It's a big thing in

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Speaker 1: the parts of the United States that I'm gonna guess

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Speaker 1: most people don't know anything about. Like most Americans would

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Speaker 1: be like, this isn't a big thing in the United States,

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Speaker 1: but you're wrong, I mean it is. It is like

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Speaker 1: nice how the state of the art of like sixteenth

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Speaker 1: century magic has kind of remained the same. Yeah. If

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Speaker 1: you can palm a chicken heart, you can get away

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Speaker 1: with a lot. Yeah. The most important thing to realize

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Speaker 1: about just the world is that people have never been

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Speaker 1: dumber than they are now, and they have never been

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Speaker 1: smarter than they are now. Human intelligence, regardless of the

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Speaker 1: actual amount of knowledge that exists, is a flat plane.

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Speaker 1: Um yeah, yeah, yeah, so yeah. Spiritual surgery is a

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Speaker 1: thing that happens here in the United States, and it's

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Speaker 1: a thing that happens all over the world. Various kinds

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Speaker 1: of spiritual healing traditions have existed since time immemorial. There's

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Speaker 1: like a whole tradition of it over in India that

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Speaker 1: has nothing to do with Christianity. It's like ship like

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Speaker 1: this has been happening for thousands of years, right, Um,

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Speaker 1: But over in Brazil, a combination of Spiritism and Christianity

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Speaker 1: has created a thoroughly unique tradition of what is generally

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Speaker 1: called psychic surgery. Now. Unlike most similar traditions around the world,

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Speaker 1: in Brazil, this psychic surgery often includes real cutting, with

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Speaker 1: surgeons using actual knives on the eyes and bodies of

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Speaker 1: their patients. So that's a cool that's fucking crazy. Oh god,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I guess it's like on some level, it's

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Speaker 1: got to be a little bit similar to like, you know, um,

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Speaker 1: an alchemy thing, where it's like, you know, sometimes the

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Speaker 1: problem is just a little blood letting is needed or

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Speaker 1: like she's building up and like that will work occasionally. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and it's kind of like you know, um, people who

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Speaker 1: for like whatever reason, because of like a depressive disorder,

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Speaker 1: cut themselves. Um, like they feel they like they tend

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Speaker 1: to feel relief for one reason or another. And it's

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Speaker 1: like because it releases endorphins and stuff. So like you

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Speaker 1: do that in the context of a powerful religious experience

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Speaker 1: and it can feel really good to people. Um yeah,

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Speaker 1: So anyway, Yeah, the Brazilian to first pioneer this technique

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Speaker 1: was Jose Pedro di Feritas or ze Rigo. According to

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Speaker 1: his autobiography and obviously problematic source, he started working at

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Speaker 1: a mine until age fourteen. Uh in nineteen fifty at

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Speaker 1: age twenty nine. Um Or he started working in on

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Speaker 1: mine at age fourteen, and in nineteen fifty, when he

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Speaker 1: was twenty nine, he began to suffer a series of

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Speaker 1: blinding headaches followed by hallucinatory trances. Uh. This all culminated

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Speaker 1: in his body being taken over by the spirit of

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Speaker 1: a bald German Man in a white apron with a

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Speaker 1: massive team of spectral doctors and nurses at his beck

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Speaker 1: and call. He was getting like a whole German surgery

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Speaker 1: team in his head. Uh. Christ, Now, this this man

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Speaker 1: jical dead German was Dr Adolf Fritz, a field medic

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Speaker 1: in the German Army who died in the trenches in

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Speaker 1: nineteen eighteen. UM, which is cool. So it's it's it's

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Speaker 1: bizarre that like this Brazilian mine worker would choose like,

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Speaker 1: it's got to be a German field medic. That's that.

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Speaker 1: But that's that's what he picks. Um. And I guess

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Speaker 1: we all considered Germans trustworthy. I can't think of anything

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Speaker 1: in history that would make me not trust German doctors. Um.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, that's scans. So together, Dr Fritz and zi

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Speaker 1: Rigo had a wildly successful twenty year career performing surgery

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Speaker 1: to adoring audiences of as many as eight hundred followers.

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Speaker 1: At one time, za Rigo would go into trances and

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Speaker 1: become so taken with the spirit of door Fritz that

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Speaker 1: he would grab random kitchen knives and use them to

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Speaker 1: cut out tumors and the like from his patients. He

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Speaker 1: became known as the Surgeon of the Rusty Knife. And

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Speaker 1: this was not like nobody was like talking shit at

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Speaker 1: him by calling if this that's a that's like that's

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Speaker 1: some ship. That's like a prison nickname. Yeah, that is

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Speaker 1: like a prison nickname. Yeah, like if you're if you

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Speaker 1: get like locked up, and they're like, oh man, that's

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Speaker 1: the knife. That's the rusty knife surgeon, Like that's the

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Speaker 1: dude you don't want to funk with. That's like the

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Speaker 1: butcher bill motherfucker, right, Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, that's incredible. That's

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Speaker 1: that was a compliment. Yes, that was a compliment. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: because like that's that's part of the evidence to these

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Speaker 1: people that he's like so clearly holy and sacred, is

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Speaker 1: that it doesn't even matter that he's using a rusty

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Speaker 1: knife because and again you'll see this throughout the whole

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Speaker 1: episode and all these guys we talk about. Like part

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Speaker 1: of the thing everybody focuses on is that, like none

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Speaker 1: of his patients feel any pain, none of them get infections,

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Speaker 1: even though you know, he's just cutting them with a

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Speaker 1: dirty knife. Like that's how holy this is. Yeah, so

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Speaker 1: that's cool and yeah, you know, yeah, you know, blood

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Speaker 1: of Jesus that works. It's fine. Antiseptic largely. Yeah, the

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Speaker 1: blood of Jesus is profoundly antiseptic. Um. Yeah. So he

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Speaker 1: prescribed various medications, generally a mix of herbal remedies and

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Speaker 1: complete nonsense. His patients could redeem their prescriptions at a

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Speaker 1: local pharmacy run by his brother. The height of zia

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Speaker 1: Rigo's career came when he removed a tumor from a

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Speaker 1: popular senator. He was arrested in nineteen fifty six and

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Speaker 1: convicted of practicing medicine without a license, but he was

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Speaker 1: pardoned by the president of Brazil. In nineteen sixty two,

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Speaker 1: he was arrested and jailed again for the same thing,

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Speaker 1: but the police allowed him to continue healing from his cell.

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Speaker 1: He died wealthy and beloved in nineteen seventy one due

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Speaker 1: to an auto accident that his spirits failed to warn

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Speaker 1: him about. So this guy would be like an amazing

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Speaker 1: character in like a Batman video game. I feel like

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Speaker 1: he feels like real final Boss energy. Yeah yeah yeah,

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Speaker 1: but he's We're just getting started with za Rigo. So

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Speaker 1: za Rigo dies in nineteen ninety. This guy, Rubens Feria,

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Speaker 1: who's a forty four year old jineer and software salesman.

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Speaker 1: UM kind of looks back in history nineteen years and

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Speaker 1: it's like, this guy made a funkload of money. What

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Speaker 1: if I start claiming to channel the spirit of the

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Speaker 1: same dead German guy? Next up? Ruben's Ferry is like

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Speaker 1: Dr Fritz is in my head and he starts like

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Speaker 1: pretty soon, he's attracting crowds of a thousand people every

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Speaker 1: day to this giant hangar style building he buys and

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Speaker 1: Rio de Janeiro. His patients were renowned to feel no

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Speaker 1: pain even when he cut into them, and they reportedly

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Speaker 1: never gotten infections from all of his eyeball scraping and

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Speaker 1: body gouging. Christopher Reeves is reported to have visited Mr

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Speaker 1: Ferrier for healing. Um it didn't work. Boom too soon,

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Speaker 1: but boom yeah, I mean just I'm not making a joke.

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Speaker 1: It's just it clearly didn't do the trick. Yeah, seriously, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean that's a bummer. He seemed like a nice guy,

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Speaker 1: but yeah, this was not the not the treatment. So

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Speaker 1: uh in Mr fer Area married Rita Costa at age

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Speaker 1: thirty four. He dumped her a few years later for

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Speaker 1: a nineteen year old friend of his daughter's. Mrs Coasta,

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Speaker 1: reported her former husband to the police for nonpayment of taxes.

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Speaker 1: The police confronted him during a surgery in Rio and

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Speaker 1: arrested his bodyguard for possession of an illegal weapon. That

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Speaker 1: bodyguard then testified that he'd been secretly helping his boss

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Speaker 1: dispose of the corpses of a number of patients who

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Speaker 1: died as a result of Mr ferry Is hacking on

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Speaker 1: their bodies. So it turned out like a bunch of

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Speaker 1: people were dying and getting infected in his body guard

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Speaker 1: was just throwing them in a hole. I guess I

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Speaker 1: was gonna say, like, what does it take to have

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Speaker 1: the confidence to just cut people with the fucking rusty knife?

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Speaker 1: And I guess it is. You just have to You

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Speaker 1: have to break a few eggs to make it. You know,

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Speaker 1: I've always said there's no nothing builds confidence. Like having

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Speaker 1: a large, heavily armed man willing to dispose of corpses

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Speaker 1: for you. That really, that's all any of us really needs.

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Speaker 1: That's I guess that's you. For most people that I know,

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Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, I'll do a little bit of corpse disposal,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's like a yeah. So a raid on

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Speaker 1: Ruben's Ferries compound revealed more than a thousand boxes of

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Speaker 1: conventional prescription medications, suggesting that the spiritual healer was actually

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Speaker 1: practicing traditional medicine, just without a license. He was arrested

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Speaker 1: in jail, but while his district police chief agreed that

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Speaker 1: Farius needed to be locked up, he still professed a

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Speaker 1: strong belief in the myth of Dr Fritz, telling the Guardian,

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Speaker 1: in my opinion, I think that Dr Fritz does exist,

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Speaker 1: but that Rubens Feria is doing things that he shouldn't,

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Speaker 1: so I think he's really channeling this German guy. But

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Speaker 1: that doesn't mean he's not permitted crimes too. Oh my God,

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Speaker 1: really threatened the needle. Thanks. Yeah. My favorite is that

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Speaker 1: that reminds me a little bit of um. I've known

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Speaker 1: various people that have gotten out of scientology, and the

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Speaker 1: worst of them sometimes say should That is basically akin

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Speaker 1: to like, well, I don't agree with all the homophobia

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Speaker 1: and all the cult stuff, but obviously Zeno is real

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Speaker 1: and you know, controls our lives through us here you

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Speaker 1: know ship like that where I'm like, you know, it's

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Speaker 1: it's like it's just about the practice of it, not

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Speaker 1: like the underlying like yeah, it's amazing. Hey, I mean

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Speaker 1: you know, I I I worship l. Ron Hubbard not

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Speaker 1: for his spiritual teachings or or any of the things

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Speaker 1: he wrote about space aliens, but for his ability to

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Speaker 1: get boats full of young people to search for gold

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Speaker 1: that his past life buried. That's exactly that's what I

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Speaker 1: celebrate about L. R. H um. Yeah. So yeah, this

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Speaker 1: all is the background I think that's necessary to understand

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Speaker 1: John of God. So November seventeen, Oprah magazine writer Susan

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Speaker 1: Casey published an article about her visit to Brazil, where

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Speaker 1: she met with the country's new hottest psychic surgeon, Oh

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Speaker 1: Boy Joo Txra DeFaria, better known as John of God.

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Speaker 1: This sparked a visit by Oprah herself and an avalanche

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Speaker 1: of uncritical positive stories about how cool this new John

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Speaker 1: of God guy was. For the first time, a Brazilian

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Speaker 1: psychic surgeon attracted mass interest outside of Brazil, but foreigners

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Speaker 1: had been trickling into the country for years before that,

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Speaker 1: and one of them, an American named Heather Cumming, wrote

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Speaker 1: a book about John of God, the man who became

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Speaker 1: her guru. It is a thoroughly uncritical work of puffery

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Speaker 1: from a woman who clearly worships her subject. But it's

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Speaker 1: also our best real source or best source on the

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Speaker 1: early life of John of God. So I'm gonna start

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Speaker 1: by reading from that, uh, and I'm gonna give the

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Speaker 1: caveat that this information, this is all information that a

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Speaker 1: mass rapist cult leader wanted to convey about his early life.

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Speaker 1: So you know, noted a little bit of salt here

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Speaker 1: here and there. So uh jual Tick. Sara DeFaria was

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Speaker 1: born on June twenty, nineteen forty two, in the poor

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Speaker 1: village of oh Boy Cachoeira di Fumacha in the state

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Speaker 1: of Goyas in central Brazil. His mother, Donna Luca, was

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Speaker 1: a popular member of the community and a dedicated housewife. Uh.

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Speaker 1: John of God would later speak highly of his mother,

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Speaker 1: and I have no reason to suspect she wasn't a

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Speaker 1: nice person. Other than perhaps the fact that her boy

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Speaker 1: grew up to a mass raping cult leader. The biography

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Speaker 1: of John of God continues quote in the nineteen forties

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Speaker 1: and fifties, there were no paved roads or infrastructure in

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Speaker 1: this part of Brazil. The roads connecting the towns were

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Speaker 1: dirt studded with cattle grids and wound their way through

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Speaker 1: farms and villages. When construction of paved roads began in

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Speaker 1: the late nineteen fifties, Joel's mother ran a small hotel

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Speaker 1: and cooked for the road workers to augment the family's

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Speaker 1: meager income. Joel often says that his mother became famous

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Speaker 1: for her delicious cooking. His father was less successful. He

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Speaker 1: was a tailor and known to laundry business, but money

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Speaker 1: was not great, and young Joel and his four brothers

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Speaker 1: and one sister lived in constant economic anxiety. Young John

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Speaker 1: had to work from an early age, starting as a

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Speaker 1: cloth cutter in his father's shop at age six. He

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Speaker 1: only attended two years of primary school before economic necessity

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Speaker 1: forced him to end his formal education and take up

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Speaker 1: a series of increasingly brutal jobs. Now, that's what his

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Speaker 1: biography says. That's not the only version of that. We

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Speaker 1: have a two thousand five ABC News profile on him.

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Speaker 1: Uh notes that, based on interviews with people from his

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Speaker 1: hometown uh quote, he is said to have been so

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Speaker 1: rebellious that he was thrown out of school after the

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Speaker 1: second grade and could not keep a job. So that's

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Speaker 1: a different version of his background. But probably either way.

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Speaker 1: Ship ship was Yeah, he had to he had to

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Speaker 1: do some ship. He got off to some ship and

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Speaker 1: did some ship. Yeah. And the age of seven. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and he had basically no school. And he never learns

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Speaker 1: to read or write. That's that's that's the important thing here. Um. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: never not a not a reader, this guy so um.

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Speaker 1: His biographers, though, claimed that he worked many jobs as

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Speaker 1: a well digger, as a bricklayer, and you know, generally

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Speaker 1: they say that he spent his late childhood and early

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Speaker 1: adolescence in hard manual labor. Uh. He learned how he

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Speaker 1: never learned to read a write, but he did learn

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Speaker 1: how to play pool, and this fided him with something

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Speaker 1: of an escape from the dreary existence poverty had forced

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Speaker 1: upon him. John's biographer claims that he was a brilliant

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Speaker 1: natural clear voyant who earned pocket money by actively prophesizing

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Speaker 1: events at the pool hall. Yeah, this is very funny

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Speaker 1: because she notes that quote after being given money, he

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Speaker 1: would return to the pool hall. He is an excellent

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Speaker 1: pool player to this day. And I can't prove what

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Speaker 1: I'm going to say next to in any way, but

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Speaker 1: my suspicion is that there is a germ of truth

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Speaker 1: to this, but that he's not clear voyant John just

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Speaker 1: discovered he had a knack for pool hustling and various

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Speaker 1: forms of cheating that required quick hands and charm. This

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Speaker 1: is a guy who would go up to spend his

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Speaker 1: life doing sleight of hand stuff to giant crowds. The

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Speaker 1: fact that he's he's a pool hustler as a kid

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Speaker 1: makes total sense. So I think that's what's actually going

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Speaker 1: on here, is he's like, yeah, he learns how to

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Speaker 1: hustle at a pool hall. Oh, it's also like you

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Speaker 1: can the range of predictable items of things that could

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Speaker 1: happen in a pool hall is like, yeah, finite and

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Speaker 1: like less than thirty. I would say, I feel like

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Speaker 1: you could just shoot shoot a lot of shots in

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Speaker 1: the dark, and that ship is going to come true

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Speaker 1: eventually pretty quickly. Yeah, yeah, so yeah, he he spends

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Speaker 1: a lot of time as a kid in the pool hall,

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Speaker 1: he learned sleight of hand. He learns how to had

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Speaker 1: a grift. Um and yeah the yeah. So So far

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Speaker 1: the biographical information that we've got from his his biography

398
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Speaker 1: by his follower, Heather Coummings has been broadly reasonable. Um.

399
00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:35,280
Speaker 1: This changes with this next paragraph quote. He also remembers

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Speaker 1: walking into the fields with the villagers and pointing to

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00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:39,800
Speaker 1: roots and plants that would heal their ailments. The first

402
00:22:39,800 --> 00:22:43,040
Speaker 1: recorded occasion of Joel's paranormal abilities took place when he

403
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Speaker 1: was nine years old, while he was visiting family in

404
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Speaker 1: the town of Nova Ponte with his mother. It was

405
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Speaker 1: a beautiful, cloudless day, but Joel had a premonition that

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Speaker 1: a huge storm was coming. He began pointing out houses,

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Speaker 1: including the houses of his brother, and saying that they

408
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Speaker 1: would be blown down or lose their roofs. He urged

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Speaker 1: his mother to leave before the storm. Although she was

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Speaker 1: not convinced, she humored her son and they sought refuge

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Speaker 1: in a friends home nearby. Exactly as he had predicted,

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Speaker 1: the thunderstorm appeared seemingly out of nowhere and badly damaged

413
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Speaker 1: or destroyed about forty houses in a small town, and

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Speaker 1: depending on where you find this story, he always claims

415
00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:16,960
Speaker 1: a different number of houses were destroyed, So I don't know. Yeah,

416
00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:20,320
Speaker 1: so he he predicts a storm. This is his first,

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Speaker 1: his first case of of clairvoyance um. But despite being

418
00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:29,040
Speaker 1: clairvoyance and able to read storms in the sky, he

419
00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:31,840
Speaker 1: found himself still forced to labor in order to get by.

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Speaker 1: At age sixteen, he moved to a city, Campo Grande,

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Speaker 1: and to try and make a living. He was only

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Speaker 1: successful and fits and starts, and before long he found

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Speaker 1: himself unemployed and living under a bridge at the edge

424
00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:44,359
Speaker 1: of town. One day, he headed to the water to bathe,

425
00:23:44,440 --> 00:23:47,280
Speaker 1: and John claims as he approached the water, a beautiful

426
00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:50,119
Speaker 1: woman called to him and invited him closer. They talked

427
00:23:50,119 --> 00:23:52,200
Speaker 1: for hours. The next day he returned to the water

428
00:23:52,280 --> 00:23:54,360
Speaker 1: to speak with her again, but he found a brilliant

429
00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:57,280
Speaker 1: shaft of light in her place. He heard her calling

430
00:23:57,320 --> 00:23:59,399
Speaker 1: his name, and so he approached. She told him to

431
00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:02,640
Speaker 1: visit the speed Rotists Center in Campo Grande, which he did.

432
00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:07,000
Speaker 1: So that's that's that's that's his version of events. The

433
00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:09,440
Speaker 1: spirit meets him and they talk for hours, and then

434
00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:12,639
Speaker 1: she sends him to the spirited center in town. Um,

435
00:24:14,119 --> 00:24:17,199
Speaker 1: so like, yeah, he arrives in the director of the

436
00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:20,240
Speaker 1: center like knows his name already and uh says they've

437
00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:23,080
Speaker 1: been waiting for him. And then John immediately like collapses,

438
00:24:23,119 --> 00:24:26,360
Speaker 1: he like passes out. And when he returns to consciousness, Um,

439
00:24:26,359 --> 00:24:28,520
Speaker 1: there's this huge group of people standing around him and

440
00:24:28,520 --> 00:24:31,000
Speaker 1: they tell him that he has incorporated, which is the

441
00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:33,160
Speaker 1: term they use for when you're you're taken over by

442
00:24:33,240 --> 00:24:37,080
Speaker 1: a spirit, the entity King Solomon. Uh. And he cured

443
00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:41,760
Speaker 1: fifty people while possessed by King Solomon, which I remember

444
00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:43,879
Speaker 1: King Solomon as the guy who cuts up babies. But

445
00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:47,160
Speaker 1: I don't know. And as far as like the luck

446
00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:50,280
Speaker 1: of the draw goes, Hey, that's a good get good

447
00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:57,640
Speaker 1: get k s. That's a big one. Yeah, he could

448
00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:01,080
Speaker 1: have happened. Anyone could have happened, anyone, amazed could have

449
00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:03,840
Speaker 1: happened to anyone. I mean, I would love to I

450
00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:05,920
Speaker 1: don't know, not King Solomon. Which king would I want

451
00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:10,920
Speaker 1: to Henry the Eighth, Henry the eight, that's a good

452
00:25:11,040 --> 00:25:13,360
Speaker 1: that's a I mean, that's a bad king, but that's

453
00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:21,399
Speaker 1: a fun king to or I could write a tricycle. Yeah,

454
00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:25,840
Speaker 1: I guess uh, I guess uh. The old dude, the

455
00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:28,159
Speaker 1: old old dude from the Bible. He probably got up

456
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:34,720
Speaker 1: to some ship. You mean, like the Babylonian emperor. Yeah,

457
00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:39,280
Speaker 1: that's a good one, right, those guys, those guys, yeah, man,

458
00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:42,280
Speaker 1: And it's so much more impressive to take on Nebuchadnezzar.

459
00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:48,600
Speaker 1: That guy's gets a way better named than Solomon. Yeah.

460
00:25:48,760 --> 00:25:51,280
Speaker 1: So yeah, obviously this is all lies. The only truth

461
00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:55,439
Speaker 1: here is probably that John's age sixteen is about when

462
00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:58,880
Speaker 1: John started fooling around with spirit is Um. Unfortunately, I'm

463
00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:02,080
Speaker 1: unaware of any serious journalism that exists to actually document

464
00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:04,600
Speaker 1: what down what went down with John's early years in

465
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:07,399
Speaker 1: the religion. But he claims that the director of the

466
00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:09,600
Speaker 1: center had to take him aside and explained to him

467
00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:11,560
Speaker 1: that he had been chosen by an entity of light

468
00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:14,399
Speaker 1: known as King Solomon. Uh. This director told him to

469
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:16,440
Speaker 1: leave and come back at two pm the next day

470
00:26:16,480 --> 00:26:19,160
Speaker 1: to keep healing people. Since John was homeless, this guy

471
00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:21,440
Speaker 1: invited him to stay the night at his house. John

472
00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:24,199
Speaker 1: claims that this man's humble home and food were unthinkable

473
00:26:24,280 --> 00:26:26,480
Speaker 1: luxuries for him, given the poverty he lived with his

474
00:26:26,640 --> 00:26:28,800
Speaker 1: entire life. He was given his own room with an

475
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:32,480
Speaker 1: electric fan, so that's a big deal. Nice electric fan.

476
00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:35,760
Speaker 1: It is like so weird to think about, like the

477
00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:38,399
Speaker 1: band of Grifters welcoming in and you, I mean this

478
00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:41,840
Speaker 1: is in the retelling welcoming in Grifter, Like, what the

479
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:47,800
Speaker 1: fuck was actually happening? Yeah, and it's one of those things. Yeah,

480
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,120
Speaker 1: it's convenient that you know out in the at this

481
00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:54,320
Speaker 1: period of time, out in the middle of nowhere, Brazil. Um.

482
00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:58,280
Speaker 1: You know, lifespans aren't enormous. Uh so you're you're really

483
00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:00,400
Speaker 1: if you make it old enough, you could just about

484
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:05,240
Speaker 1: what happened to you when you were a kid, because right, yeah, right,

485
00:27:05,359 --> 00:27:08,359
Speaker 1: right right, that makes sense that. Yeah, the the earlier

486
00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:12,600
Speaker 1: most people die, the easier it is to be a grifter. Yes,

487
00:27:13,240 --> 00:27:15,080
Speaker 1: when everyone I go to went to high school with

488
00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:17,400
Speaker 1: his dead, I'm going to have some stories I started telling.

489
00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:20,240
Speaker 1: I'll tell you that much. Yeah, I was healing the

490
00:27:20,280 --> 00:27:25,480
Speaker 1: ship out of people in eleventh grade. You want to

491
00:27:25,480 --> 00:27:28,480
Speaker 1: take an ad buddy, Yep, you know who else was

492
00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:30,040
Speaker 1: healing a lot of people when I was in the

493
00:27:30,040 --> 00:27:44,760
Speaker 1: eleventh grade. Okay, so uh now let's talk about um products.

494
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:48,280
Speaker 1: Note we did that. Now we're back, okay, So johnnah,

495
00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:51,280
Speaker 1: God he meets this Spirited Church, and they tell him

496
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:54,439
Speaker 1: that King Solomon's taken over his brain. Um, and he's like,

497
00:27:55,000 --> 00:27:58,800
Speaker 1: that's that's good and normal, um and yeah. So he

498
00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 1: winds up staying the night with like the leader of

499
00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:05,119
Speaker 1: the center. Uh. And he tries to explain to him

500
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:07,040
Speaker 1: that he's not a practicing medium and he doesn't know

501
00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:09,080
Speaker 1: anything about medicine, and he doesn't understand how he was

502
00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:11,600
Speaker 1: healing all these people. He was actually terrified because he

503
00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:13,760
Speaker 1: didn't know like how to he was expected to come

504
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:15,399
Speaker 1: back the next day, and he didn't know how to

505
00:28:15,480 --> 00:28:17,919
Speaker 1: do what was expected of him. Um. But as soon

506
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:20,320
Speaker 1: as he gathered at the spirit to Center the next day, uh,

507
00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:23,000
Speaker 1: King Solomon took him over again and he kept healing

508
00:28:23,000 --> 00:28:25,760
Speaker 1: more sick people. John claims this went on for months

509
00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:28,800
Speaker 1: while the more experienced spirits practitioners educated him on the

510
00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:31,399
Speaker 1: nature of the entities that increasingly took over his body.

511
00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:35,000
Speaker 1: He became known as Medium John and his new teachers

512
00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:39,080
Speaker 1: it is kind of funny, Medium John. It's like the

513
00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:42,960
Speaker 1: sequel to Big John. That's not as as good or rhythmic. Me.

514
00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:50,400
Speaker 1: Just me. Every morning at the mind you could see

515
00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:53,120
Speaker 1: him arrive. He stood five ft eight and Wade one

516
00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:56,640
Speaker 1: thirty five kind of medium at the shoulders and medium

517
00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:58,880
Speaker 1: at the hips, and everyone knew it was okay to

518
00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:03,720
Speaker 1: give some lip to medium. Him John, It's so it

519
00:29:03,880 --> 00:29:08,040
Speaker 1: is like so juvenile to find confusing medium with medium.

520
00:29:08,040 --> 00:29:14,720
Speaker 1: But I know it's funny. It's very funny. So his

521
00:29:14,720 --> 00:29:16,840
Speaker 1: his new teachers told him he needed to devote his

522
00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:20,080
Speaker 1: whole life to healing other people. Um, and this is biographer.

523
00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:23,360
Speaker 1: His biographer's claim started a five or six year period

524
00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:26,120
Speaker 1: of traveling throughout Brazil healing the sick and the suffering.

525
00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:30,080
Speaker 1: He became known as Joel Curador or John the Healer.

526
00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:33,200
Speaker 1: Through his biographers and in interviews, John always make sure

527
00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:34,840
Speaker 1: that people know that he is a healer. But he

528
00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:37,480
Speaker 1: also at the same time all always firmly rejects being

529
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:39,800
Speaker 1: called a healer. Um. So he makes sure that people

530
00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:42,680
Speaker 1: knows that, like everyone started calling me John the Healer,

531
00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:45,560
Speaker 1: but I'm not a healer. The entities that channel through

532
00:29:45,560 --> 00:29:47,400
Speaker 1: my body are the ones doing the healing. I'm just

533
00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:50,040
Speaker 1: a conduit. It's very important to him that you believe

534
00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:55,080
Speaker 1: both things. Um. Yeah. So this has a nice side

535
00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:57,440
Speaker 1: benefit of allowing him to argue that he isn't practicing

536
00:29:57,440 --> 00:29:59,800
Speaker 1: medicine without a license, which is is handy when you're

537
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:01,600
Speaker 1: act to saying medicine without a license. I don't know

538
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:04,840
Speaker 1: if you've ever practiced medicine without a license, but you

539
00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:08,240
Speaker 1: gotta be careful with it. That is, so he's shifting

540
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:12,760
Speaker 1: the blame to literal King Solomon essentially. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

541
00:30:12,840 --> 00:30:16,440
Speaker 1: If somebody dies while he's performing psychic surgery, it's the

542
00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:19,760
Speaker 1: dead King's fault. M hm. That's a that's a hell

543
00:30:19,840 --> 00:30:23,160
Speaker 1: of a loophole. That's genius. I mean, I am going

544
00:30:23,240 --> 00:30:25,840
Speaker 1: to start blaming all of my many crimes on King Solomon.

545
00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:28,080
Speaker 1: I'm I'm not I'm not gonna I'm not even gonna

546
00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:30,880
Speaker 1: lie to you about that. Like I that seems like

547
00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:34,640
Speaker 1: a very good idea, especially the baby chopping thing, because

548
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:37,560
Speaker 1: that's he's got the baby chopping, he's got the previous

549
00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:40,320
Speaker 1: on that. Yeah, I mean, yes, officer, I was going

550
00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:42,280
Speaker 1: a hundred and thirty five miles an hour in a

551
00:30:42,360 --> 00:30:45,760
Speaker 1: fifty five. But if I didn't, this fucking king ghost

552
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:47,560
Speaker 1: in my head was going to chop up some babies.

553
00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:49,920
Speaker 1: Like do you want me to go a little faster?

554
00:30:50,040 --> 00:30:51,760
Speaker 1: You want some chopped up babies? That's all I gotta

555
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:56,200
Speaker 1: ask you, yeah, yeah, to you, up to you cop

556
00:30:57,400 --> 00:30:59,640
Speaker 1: to me. You want me to heal you, let me

557
00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:01,920
Speaker 1: pull out some chicken gizzards and pretend to rip them

558
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:06,560
Speaker 1: from your chest. So his biographer's next note that he

559
00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:09,920
Speaker 1: did that. While he did his extraordinary work of healing.

560
00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:13,880
Speaker 1: Medium John was persecuted by members of the medical and

561
00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:17,520
Speaker 1: religious establishments UH. He claims that they were threatened by

562
00:31:17,560 --> 00:31:19,880
Speaker 1: his presence and that he lost count of the number

563
00:31:19,880 --> 00:31:22,760
Speaker 1: of times he was arrested for practicing medicine without a license.

564
00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:25,920
Speaker 1: John traveled constantly, never more than a few steps ahead

565
00:31:25,920 --> 00:31:28,440
Speaker 1: of the law. He finally got a break in nineteen

566
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:31,720
Speaker 1: sixty two when Brazil was thrown into turmoil via violand coup.

567
00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:35,040
Speaker 1: His biography says the country suffered a revolution and a

568
00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:38,680
Speaker 1: military government came into power. The reality is that Brazil's

569
00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:42,840
Speaker 1: democratically elected socialist president, Joel Guler, was overthrown by a

570
00:31:42,880 --> 00:31:46,000
Speaker 1: military coup backed by the U. S Government. A conservative

571
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:49,080
Speaker 1: military dictatorship but rule Brazil for the next twenty years.

572
00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:52,160
Speaker 1: John's biography glosses all over over all of that, because

573
00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:54,920
Speaker 1: the advent of a military dictatorship worked out really well

574
00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 1: for him. Medium John traveled to the capital Brazilia and

575
00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:01,719
Speaker 1: offered his services as a tailor to the military quote

576
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:04,880
Speaker 1: from his biography. Because he was so young, he was

577
00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:07,560
Speaker 1: not commissioned to create uniforms, but was given an opportunity

578
00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:10,400
Speaker 1: to so a consignment of work pants. His expertise to

579
00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:12,720
Speaker 1: impressed his new employers, and he was soon promoted to

580
00:32:12,800 --> 00:32:15,440
Speaker 1: full time tailor and assigned to make uniforms for the army.

581
00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:19,120
Speaker 1: Medium Joel continued his healing work quietly on the side,

582
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 1: but word of his gifts soon spread throughout the barracks.

583
00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:24,400
Speaker 1: One day, he incorporated an entity who operated on the

584
00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:27,480
Speaker 1: wounded leg of a doctor, which healed immediately. The doctor

585
00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 1: was enthralled with Medium Joel's gift, and from that day

586
00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:32,120
Speaker 1: on he became the spiritual healer for the military and

587
00:32:32,160 --> 00:32:35,040
Speaker 1: civil authorities. He was promoted a master tailor and became

588
00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:38,560
Speaker 1: their protege for nearly nine years. Consequently, he was protected

589
00:32:38,600 --> 00:32:41,720
Speaker 1: from persecution during that time and traveled extensively throughout Brazil

590
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:44,760
Speaker 1: with the army. There's a lot that's interesting there. The

591
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:47,080
Speaker 1: most fascinating thing to me is that so the army

592
00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:49,360
Speaker 1: comes to believe that this is a magical healer and

593
00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:52,200
Speaker 1: As a result, they promote him to Master Taylor, which

594
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:56,239
Speaker 1: is this is an interesting choice. I mean it's just

595
00:32:56,280 --> 00:32:58,880
Speaker 1: like keep him in the ranks, I guess, yeah, keeping

596
00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:01,240
Speaker 1: the ranks, keep a page going to the guy. Well

597
00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:06,440
Speaker 1: you dictatorship, Brazil. Look, I'm not gonna backseat dictatorship. You

598
00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:10,720
Speaker 1: know what, there's a lot of bureaucracy. You can't just

599
00:33:11,120 --> 00:33:16,000
Speaker 1: insert like witch doctor surgeon general. Yeah you get that's

600
00:33:16,040 --> 00:33:18,800
Speaker 1: like a year eight of the dictatorship thing at best.

601
00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:21,320
Speaker 1: You know, you gotta oh my god, I want to

602
00:33:21,320 --> 00:33:24,400
Speaker 1: be witch doctor surgeon General so bad. That's just that

603
00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:27,400
Speaker 1: sounds even better than reverend Doctor. To be honest, you

604
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:29,080
Speaker 1: just have to. Yeah, you have to work within the

605
00:33:29,080 --> 00:33:35,880
Speaker 1: available structures and tell until such time as you don't. Yeah. Yeah,

606
00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 1: I got really fucked up fighting those partisans the other night.

607
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:39,960
Speaker 1: I got a bullet my arm. I gotta go to

608
00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:46,760
Speaker 1: the Master Taylor to deal with this. Yeah. So, John

609
00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:50,479
Speaker 1: claims that the experience of working as a protege healer

610
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:53,800
Speaker 1: slash tailor with the Dictatorship instilled in him a deep

611
00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:57,680
Speaker 1: desire to become a successful businessman. His fonding biographers explained

612
00:33:57,680 --> 00:34:00,720
Speaker 1: that he quote needed money making expertise, to support his

613
00:34:00,760 --> 00:34:04,920
Speaker 1: spiritual purpose. This is so he doesn't sound greedy. Um. Wonderfully,

614
00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:06,720
Speaker 1: they claimed John just happened to have a great head

615
00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:08,800
Speaker 1: for business and his financial success has allowed him to

616
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:11,800
Speaker 1: fund his healing mission all without charging patients and dime.

617
00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:15,719
Speaker 1: This is absolutely a lie, but incredulous white Americans bought

618
00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:18,640
Speaker 1: it for years. So basically, he like, he claims that

619
00:34:18,680 --> 00:34:20,799
Speaker 1: he became a great businessman and that's how he's able

620
00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:23,759
Speaker 1: to fund his his free healing hospital. The reality is

621
00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:25,959
Speaker 1: like literally the opposite. He makes a bunch of money

622
00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:28,120
Speaker 1: healing people and he used it to buy like ranches

623
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:32,560
Speaker 1: full of cattle and stuff. Um whatever. Yeah. Now, from

624
00:34:32,560 --> 00:34:34,759
Speaker 1: this point on, the story of Medium John has a

625
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:37,200
Speaker 1: decent amount of documentation, So we're going to depart from

626
00:34:37,239 --> 00:34:40,080
Speaker 1: his terrible, terrible biography. But before we do, I want

627
00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:42,560
Speaker 1: to turn to his biographers for an explanation of exactly

628
00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:46,000
Speaker 1: who these entities that take over John are. Uh. They

629
00:34:46,040 --> 00:34:49,359
Speaker 1: describe the entities as transcendent spirits who are who are

630
00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:52,520
Speaker 1: quote able to use Medium Joyl's body to produce cures

631
00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:57,280
Speaker 1: by performing visible and invisible spiritual surgeries. Quote. Medium Joel

632
00:34:57,320 --> 00:35:00,600
Speaker 1: can incorporate a approximately thirty seven entities, but only one

633
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:03,920
Speaker 1: entity can be incorporated at a time. The specific entity

634
00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:06,920
Speaker 1: may change, however, depending on the needs of an individual patient.

635
00:35:07,239 --> 00:35:09,879
Speaker 1: In addition to the entity incorporated at any given time,

636
00:35:10,040 --> 00:35:12,680
Speaker 1: there is a highly evolved group of thousands of spirits

637
00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:15,360
Speaker 1: who actually work on a person while the incorporated entity

638
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:18,640
Speaker 1: overseas healing. This group is referred to as his falange.

639
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:22,400
Speaker 1: One spirit might specialize in diabetes or heart problems, another

640
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:25,759
Speaker 1: in emotional afflictions. These entities serve humanity in the hopes

641
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:28,680
Speaker 1: of alleviating pain and suffering on the earthly plane. This

642
00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:31,840
Speaker 1: service is part of their evolutionary process. So he's a

643
00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:37,440
Speaker 1: whole hospital of ghosts. Jesus Christ. That's having having like

644
00:35:37,600 --> 00:35:42,640
Speaker 1: support staff in this like fake like spirits the best

645
00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:46,640
Speaker 1: part system. It's like, I mean, I guess it makes

646
00:35:46,680 --> 00:35:50,000
Speaker 1: it sound more plausible on some level, Like how could

647
00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 1: you possibly do this? No, we need, you know, the

648
00:35:52,719 --> 00:35:57,759
Speaker 1: help of thousands to cure your fucking whatever. Yeah, No,

649
00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:00,440
Speaker 1: I got nurses. Yeah is it ever? Like? Sorry, No,

650
00:36:00,520 --> 00:36:02,680
Speaker 1: the guy who could help you, he's out on vacation.

651
00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:04,719
Speaker 1: We just have like the dude who helps me cut

652
00:36:04,760 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 1: people's eyes. Do you need an eye cut? Yeah? Oh,

653
00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:11,359
Speaker 1: that's the other side of it is if you were, like,

654
00:36:11,640 --> 00:36:15,040
Speaker 1: if I were designing my own version of some cockamamie bullshit,

655
00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:17,879
Speaker 1: I feel like it would be it would involve as

656
00:36:17,920 --> 00:36:21,799
Speaker 1: little true body horror as possible. Like no, no, they

657
00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:25,480
Speaker 1: let people love that ship. People love getting fucking cut

658
00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:27,719
Speaker 1: into and blood and ship. Like, if you really want to,

659
00:36:28,040 --> 00:36:29,680
Speaker 1: if you want to, like, if you want to get

660
00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:33,040
Speaker 1: some cult ship going on, you gotta get gross with it. Man. Yeah,

661
00:36:33,080 --> 00:36:38,520
Speaker 1: it's part of it. It's part of it. But physicality, yeah, yeah, yeah,

662
00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:40,360
Speaker 1: that's why, you know, not everyone's made to be a

663
00:36:40,360 --> 00:36:42,880
Speaker 1: cult leader. Andrew, I don't think I got what it

664
00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:47,040
Speaker 1: takes anymore. I I believe you could be a cult leader,

665
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:51,560
Speaker 1: but you know, it takes some sacrifice. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah,

666
00:36:51,560 --> 00:36:53,600
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't have the willingness to put in

667
00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:56,400
Speaker 1: the reps to really get good. Yeah. Yeah, there's a

668
00:36:56,400 --> 00:36:58,719
Speaker 1: lot in common. Being a cult leader has a lot

669
00:36:58,760 --> 00:37:01,719
Speaker 1: in common with having great abs, right, they both they

670
00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:03,480
Speaker 1: both take you either have to be born with the

671
00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:05,319
Speaker 1: right jeans or you have to put in a lot

672
00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:09,399
Speaker 1: of time on the bench. And it's not happening for me. Yeah,

673
00:37:09,520 --> 00:37:13,279
Speaker 1: well that's that's Yeah. Well, making choices. Yeah, there's not

674
00:37:13,360 --> 00:37:15,600
Speaker 1: happening yet. I'll see, We'll see what I wish. It

675
00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:18,840
Speaker 1: would be cool to be able to incorporate the spirit

676
00:37:18,920 --> 00:37:21,960
Speaker 1: that could just give you incredible abs, like one of

677
00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:25,640
Speaker 1: them has to know how to do abs. But okay. So.

678
00:37:25,960 --> 00:37:28,399
Speaker 1: John claims that after a few years of making money

679
00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:30,920
Speaker 1: and getting in good with the brutal dictatorship, his entities

680
00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 1: told him it was crucial he expand his work and

681
00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:35,960
Speaker 1: heal more people. He wound up being guided to the

682
00:37:35,960 --> 00:37:39,160
Speaker 1: town of Abadyanya and Goyas. He first arrived there in

683
00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:42,080
Speaker 1: nine and began his practice by sitting in a chair

684
00:37:42,120 --> 00:37:44,280
Speaker 1: outside in the middle of the main road in greeting

685
00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:47,360
Speaker 1: travelers who showed signs of illnesses Through him. The entities

686
00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:49,920
Speaker 1: would heal these people, and over time the numbers increased

687
00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:53,759
Speaker 1: from dozens to hundreds to thousands per day. John's incredible

688
00:37:53,760 --> 00:37:56,960
Speaker 1: healings eventually earned him the loyalty of a mysterious benefactor,

689
00:37:57,120 --> 00:37:59,160
Speaker 1: who purchased him a plot of land and paid to

690
00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:03,160
Speaker 1: build a healing enter, Casa di dom Ignacio de Loyola,

691
00:38:03,560 --> 00:38:06,520
Speaker 1: the Spiritual Hospital is his followers would come to describe It.

692
00:38:06,560 --> 00:38:09,799
Speaker 1: Eventually received more than ten thousand visitors per month. Since

693
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:13,560
Speaker 1: Abbadiana has only about nineteen thousand residents, the huge streams

694
00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:16,120
Speaker 1: of sick and dying people represented a big infusion into

695
00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:19,680
Speaker 1: the local economy. So like half the population of the

696
00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:22,920
Speaker 1: city is coming in every week just to see this guy.

697
00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:27,160
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that's I mean, I guess you need like

698
00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:33,560
Speaker 1: desperation tourism sometimes, but Jesus Christ, that's that is actually

699
00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:36,400
Speaker 1: Jesus Christ's business model also, so you know what, maybe

700
00:38:36,520 --> 00:38:38,960
Speaker 1: maybe it's just a good one. Yeah. If Jesus Christ

701
00:38:38,960 --> 00:38:41,560
Speaker 1: had benefited from like roadside billboards, I don't think they

702
00:38:41,600 --> 00:38:42,880
Speaker 1: ever would have gotten to kill him. He would have

703
00:38:42,920 --> 00:38:47,800
Speaker 1: made too much money. But yeah, render and a caesar

704
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:54,560
Speaker 1: about and you're fine, honestly. Yeah. So uh. This was

705
00:38:54,640 --> 00:38:57,239
Speaker 1: often glossed over by the positive coverage of John of God,

706
00:38:57,239 --> 00:38:59,040
Speaker 1: but the extent to which you became an industry for

707
00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:01,399
Speaker 1: the people who lived around on him can't be exaggerated.

708
00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:04,319
Speaker 1: I'm gonna quote now from an OH magazine profile by

709
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:07,680
Speaker 1: Susan Casey. Uh, just a terrible article from two thousand

710
00:39:07,719 --> 00:39:09,920
Speaker 1: ten that none of the less revealed some important details

711
00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:12,479
Speaker 1: about the economic impact of this guru on the small

712
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:16,480
Speaker 1: town of Abbadi Anya quote. Several businesses had displays of

713
00:39:16,480 --> 00:39:19,200
Speaker 1: white clothing. The castAR request that only white be worn.

714
00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:21,680
Speaker 1: This makes it easier, apparently, for a person's alora to

715
00:39:21,719 --> 00:39:24,360
Speaker 1: be seen. There were a number of vividly painted small

716
00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:28,120
Speaker 1: hotels lined up side by side, lilac, purple, canary, yellow,

717
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:31,360
Speaker 1: lime green. One of them, a coral colored one story building,

718
00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:33,520
Speaker 1: opened up to the street, and inside I could see

719
00:39:33,520 --> 00:39:35,720
Speaker 1: a John of God video playing on a large screen.

720
00:39:36,000 --> 00:39:38,359
Speaker 1: An audience of about twenty people sat in straight back

721
00:39:38,440 --> 00:39:40,759
Speaker 1: chairs and watched him cut into a man's chest with

722
00:39:40,760 --> 00:39:43,399
Speaker 1: what looked like a rusty pairing knife. The man's eyes

723
00:39:43,400 --> 00:39:45,760
Speaker 1: were closed and he was peaceful and still, as rivulets

724
00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:50,880
Speaker 1: of blood ran down his white shirt. Yeah that's awesome.

725
00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:54,960
Speaker 1: That sounds like the kind of charming small Brazilian town.

726
00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:57,120
Speaker 1: I want a vacation and just have a couple of

727
00:39:57,120 --> 00:40:02,400
Speaker 1: fucking mohitos and watched some guy commits sur jury on people. Hell, yeah,

728
00:40:02,480 --> 00:40:06,919
Speaker 1: this is like some midsummer ship. This is like yeah insanity. Yeah,

729
00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:09,759
Speaker 1: imagine like you're just backpacking through Brazil and wind up

730
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:12,920
Speaker 1: here on accident and it's like, oh no, I have

731
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:15,839
Speaker 1: I have aired. I did not want to be here.

732
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:21,680
Speaker 1: Yeah sh it. So John established a cattle ranch nearby,

733
00:40:21,760 --> 00:40:23,400
Speaker 1: and by the early two thousands he was known to

734
00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:26,120
Speaker 1: spend most of his week they're running his various businesses.

735
00:40:26,400 --> 00:40:28,840
Speaker 1: He was able to do this because increasingly throughout the

736
00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:31,680
Speaker 1: nineties and early two thousand's, a string of foreigners, generally

737
00:40:31,680 --> 00:40:35,120
Speaker 1: American women, moved in and dedicated themselves to helping his mission.

738
00:40:35,440 --> 00:40:38,600
Speaker 1: This includes the Americans who wrote his biography, John of

739
00:40:38,640 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 1: God's Practice and involved a series of mass meetings where

740
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:43,840
Speaker 1: sick folks would basically phillip rooms and wait to be

741
00:40:43,840 --> 00:40:46,440
Speaker 1: seen by the medium. He'd consult with his entities and

742
00:40:46,440 --> 00:40:48,880
Speaker 1: then diagnosed their problem. I'm gonna quote now from a

743
00:40:48,920 --> 00:40:52,600
Speaker 1: write up in the Montreal Gazette. Quote. Once the diagnosis

744
00:40:52,640 --> 00:40:54,719
Speaker 1: has been made, the healing procedure begins. It may be

745
00:40:54,880 --> 00:40:58,680
Speaker 1: visible or invisible spiritual surgery. If the patient chooses invisible,

746
00:40:58,719 --> 00:41:00,600
Speaker 1: they are directed to a room to editate well the

747
00:41:00,600 --> 00:41:03,719
Speaker 1: spirits do their work. Visible surgery can involve sticking a

748
00:41:03,760 --> 00:41:07,040
Speaker 1: surgical clamp up the patient's nose. It looks very impressive,

749
00:41:07,080 --> 00:41:09,440
Speaker 1: but it is nothing but an old Carney trick, usually

750
00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:12,480
Speaker 1: performed with a long nail and a hammer. Any anatomical

751
00:41:12,520 --> 00:41:14,520
Speaker 1: text will reveal that there is a roughly four inch

752
00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:16,879
Speaker 1: long passage up the nasal cavity that is quite ready

753
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:22,560
Speaker 1: to accommodate a foreign object without any harm. John maintains that, yeah,

754
00:41:22,920 --> 00:41:25,680
Speaker 1: that's that's a good trick. Yeah, he's doing the nails

755
00:41:25,719 --> 00:41:31,400
Speaker 1: up the nose thing. He's calling a brain surgery. Classic. Yeah. Classic.

756
00:41:31,719 --> 00:41:33,840
Speaker 1: John maintains that the success of his treatment hinges on

757
00:41:33,840 --> 00:41:36,680
Speaker 1: the patient abstaining from drinking alcohol, eating pork, and having

758
00:41:36,680 --> 00:41:39,240
Speaker 1: sex for forty days after the treatment. This can provide

759
00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:42,320
Speaker 1: for a convenient out in case no miracle occurs. Patients

760
00:41:42,360 --> 00:41:44,200
Speaker 1: can be healed even if they are unable to travel

761
00:41:44,239 --> 00:41:46,359
Speaker 1: to Brazil. All that is needed is a surrogate willing

762
00:41:46,400 --> 00:41:50,360
Speaker 1: to undergo the spiritual surgery. So that's awesome. That's a

763
00:41:50,360 --> 00:41:55,879
Speaker 1: good grift. God. Yeah, well, I mean I guess it's like,

764
00:41:56,200 --> 00:41:58,600
Speaker 1: if you're gonna be a main grifter, at least bring

765
00:41:58,719 --> 00:42:02,000
Speaker 1: up your little grifty town and around you. Yeah. Yeah,

766
00:42:02,200 --> 00:42:05,520
Speaker 1: I guess, yeah, I mean that's that's obviously the safest thing, right,

767
00:42:05,560 --> 00:42:08,600
Speaker 1: because then they'll have a vested financial interest in protecting you.

768
00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:12,799
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, I guess that is what a cult is. Yeah,

769
00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:14,800
Speaker 1: that's basically I mean, yeah, more, I mean this is

770
00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:16,920
Speaker 1: a little more complicated than just a cult, because there's

771
00:42:16,920 --> 00:42:18,839
Speaker 1: a cult, but then there's also the town who, like

772
00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:22,040
Speaker 1: probably a lot of the townsfolk knew that this was bullshit,

773
00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:24,200
Speaker 1: but they also know there's a funkload of money in

774
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:29,400
Speaker 1: this ship. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, make everyone invested in you,

775
00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:33,000
Speaker 1: and yeah, one way or the other, it's got leverage.

776
00:42:33,239 --> 00:42:36,360
Speaker 1: It's essentially the same way that like the pot industry

777
00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:40,600
Speaker 1: works and large amounts of the United States um or yeah,

778
00:42:40,719 --> 00:42:45,120
Speaker 1: like any drug business works, where it's like, well, this

779
00:42:45,200 --> 00:42:48,400
Speaker 1: is where the money is here, so nobody's nobody's going

780
00:42:48,440 --> 00:42:52,600
Speaker 1: to start ship. Yeah, don't don't snitch. This is this

781
00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:55,640
Speaker 1: is the don't snitch. This is good for all of us.

782
00:42:55,719 --> 00:42:58,719
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, that's kind of what's going on here.

783
00:42:58,920 --> 00:43:02,160
Speaker 1: Um except for instead of good honest marijuana, it's a

784
00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:05,400
Speaker 1: guy cutting people's faces and shoving things up their noses,

785
00:43:05,440 --> 00:43:08,880
Speaker 1: and he actually hates marijuana. He was he was famous

786
00:43:08,920 --> 00:43:10,600
Speaker 1: for saying that like, if you smoked pot, you had

787
00:43:10,640 --> 00:43:12,719
Speaker 1: to like detox for a whole year before he could

788
00:43:12,719 --> 00:43:20,480
Speaker 1: heal you. The entities don't like weed. Yeah, that's can't

789
00:43:20,560 --> 00:43:23,879
Speaker 1: be true, but fair enough entities. Yeah, if there are,

790
00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:26,799
Speaker 1: if there are ghostly entities flying around, there's no way

791
00:43:26,840 --> 00:43:30,480
Speaker 1: those ghostly entities don't like some fucking dank like come on,

792
00:43:31,080 --> 00:43:34,040
Speaker 1: they love they love weed. So that that last right up,

793
00:43:34,040 --> 00:43:36,320
Speaker 1: I read you from the Montreal Gazette was obviously written

794
00:43:36,320 --> 00:43:38,680
Speaker 1: by a credible journalist who was his critical of who

795
00:43:38,680 --> 00:43:41,000
Speaker 1: was very critical of John of God. Um. But I

796
00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:44,720
Speaker 1: want to read another example another another person writing about

797
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:47,640
Speaker 1: what his healing sessions look like, who actually like believed

798
00:43:47,640 --> 00:43:49,480
Speaker 1: in him and was a member of his cult. So

799
00:43:49,520 --> 00:43:53,680
Speaker 1: here's his biographer, Heather Cummings, recalling one of his healing sessions. Quote,

800
00:43:55,360 --> 00:43:58,719
Speaker 1: the entity Dr Jose Valdevino called for his and that's

801
00:43:58,760 --> 00:44:02,279
Speaker 1: the guy he's channeling. Is this Doctor Jose Voldavino called

802
00:44:02,280 --> 00:44:04,640
Speaker 1: for his instruments again. I opened the special drawer and

803
00:44:04,640 --> 00:44:07,040
Speaker 1: carefully removed the tray and took the instrument tray to him.

804
00:44:07,160 --> 00:44:10,320
Speaker 1: He chose a pairing knife, a regular kitchen serrated edge knife.

805
00:44:10,360 --> 00:44:12,120
Speaker 1: He passed his hand over the man's eye and told

806
00:44:12,160 --> 00:44:14,480
Speaker 1: him to relax. He opened the eye wide and pressed

807
00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:17,319
Speaker 1: down hard and scraped. See here it is, he said,

808
00:44:17,680 --> 00:44:19,960
Speaker 1: as he wiped the knife on the man's shirt. I

809
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:22,520
Speaker 1: could see a minute, dark sliver. I know, beyond a doubt,

810
00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:24,760
Speaker 1: after seeing so many of these operations, that the sliver

811
00:44:24,920 --> 00:44:27,680
Speaker 1: was not a topical foreign object being removed, but rather

812
00:44:27,840 --> 00:44:30,800
Speaker 1: something from deep inside that only the entities can see.

813
00:44:31,120 --> 00:44:33,360
Speaker 1: The eye looks the entity looks into the eye as

814
00:44:33,400 --> 00:44:35,960
Speaker 1: a representation of the whole body system, not limited to

815
00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:39,160
Speaker 1: the physical eye. I understand this is a symbolic removal

816
00:44:39,160 --> 00:44:41,520
Speaker 1: on the physical level, but originating from many levels and

817
00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:45,400
Speaker 1: involving many different or organs. The sun is healed, you

818
00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:47,400
Speaker 1: can take him to the infirmary, he said, as he

819
00:44:47,440 --> 00:44:53,040
Speaker 1: wrote the post op prescription. So that's cool, ship, that's

820
00:44:53,080 --> 00:44:57,480
Speaker 1: an awesome gig, man. That is I mean, I don't

821
00:44:57,640 --> 00:45:00,120
Speaker 1: I like, I don't wear contacts because I can't it

822
00:45:00,520 --> 00:45:04,520
Speaker 1: touch my eye. I think, oh, hell you man. Yeah,

823
00:45:05,160 --> 00:45:07,319
Speaker 1: over to my house. I'll whip out a big old

824
00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:10,279
Speaker 1: rusty machette and I'll carve the ghost steadier eye. Man.

825
00:45:10,440 --> 00:45:12,760
Speaker 1: It's it's fine, this is this is where I'm taking

826
00:45:12,800 --> 00:45:18,600
Speaker 1: machettison next. Damn, that's that's an easy grist. Just start

827
00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:23,759
Speaker 1: slashing people's fucking faces. It's fine, Holy sh it, man.

828
00:45:23,840 --> 00:45:27,360
Speaker 1: And then Yeah. Can you imagine the first time you

829
00:45:27,440 --> 00:45:30,359
Speaker 1: try this ship like this will work. There's a lot

830
00:45:30,360 --> 00:45:32,680
Speaker 1: of blind people who were like before he learned how

831
00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:36,560
Speaker 1: to scrape people's eyes without blinding them, like he. Uh,

832
00:45:36,600 --> 00:45:39,480
Speaker 1: there's like a whole village full of his his his

833
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:44,480
Speaker 1: first draft healings. Yeah, Jesus Christ, I guess all of

834
00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:47,400
Speaker 1: those people are dead. Huh yeah. I mean, you know.

835
00:45:47,640 --> 00:45:49,560
Speaker 1: The good thing is if you're actually like, if you're

836
00:45:49,600 --> 00:45:51,640
Speaker 1: doing this kind of grift, I think you definitely want

837
00:45:51,640 --> 00:45:54,520
Speaker 1: to start out only trying to heal people with serious

838
00:45:54,840 --> 00:45:57,880
Speaker 1: terminal illnesses like cancer, because then once you funk up,

839
00:45:57,880 --> 00:46:03,920
Speaker 1: they're not around very long. Right, Yeah, that's really key. Um. Yeah,

840
00:46:03,960 --> 00:46:05,640
Speaker 1: a lot of good advice on how to start a

841
00:46:05,680 --> 00:46:10,360
Speaker 1: medical grift in this episode, So take notes. When society collapses,

842
00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:12,640
Speaker 1: some of you are going to do very well remembering

843
00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:17,240
Speaker 1: this stuff. So um yeah. Like, as that story noted,

844
00:46:17,320 --> 00:46:19,759
Speaker 1: John of God would write prescriptions to his patients, and

845
00:46:19,800 --> 00:46:22,359
Speaker 1: all of these prescriptions were for a specific herbal pill

846
00:46:22,440 --> 00:46:25,720
Speaker 1: mixture sold in John of God's own pharmacy. The pills

847
00:46:25,719 --> 00:46:28,480
Speaker 1: were mostly Passion Flower, and by some accounts, they've netted

848
00:46:28,520 --> 00:46:31,480
Speaker 1: John more than ten million dollars a year. Uh he

849
00:46:31,560 --> 00:46:33,880
Speaker 1: also gets a cut of the sales of the white clothes,

850
00:46:33,920 --> 00:46:36,120
Speaker 1: the hotel fees, the sales of blessed water, and the

851
00:46:36,160 --> 00:46:38,759
Speaker 1: sales of healing crystals which he prescribes to his followers.

852
00:46:39,120 --> 00:46:41,000
Speaker 1: So you can see why no one in Abbadi Agna

853
00:46:41,080 --> 00:46:43,239
Speaker 1: had any interest in question whether or not John of

854
00:46:43,280 --> 00:46:46,640
Speaker 1: God was legit. He did face occasional challenges from members

855
00:46:46,640 --> 00:46:50,000
Speaker 1: of the Brazilian government, particularly folks in the medical establishment

856
00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:52,960
Speaker 1: who were leary of his psychic surgery, but this sort

857
00:46:52,960 --> 00:46:56,840
Speaker 1: of wou is extremely popular in Brazil, particularly among rural voters,

858
00:46:56,880 --> 00:46:59,400
Speaker 1: and John of God was both rich and connected, so

859
00:46:59,440 --> 00:47:02,480
Speaker 1: it is not surprising that very little was ever done.

860
00:47:03,120 --> 00:47:06,040
Speaker 1: What's more surprising is the degree to which foreign journalists

861
00:47:06,080 --> 00:47:09,440
Speaker 1: bought into his stick. In two thousand five, ABC News

862
00:47:09,440 --> 00:47:11,799
Speaker 1: sent a small team to Abadi Anya to meet John

863
00:47:11,800 --> 00:47:15,000
Speaker 1: of God. They put together a documentary basically posing the

864
00:47:15,080 --> 00:47:16,799
Speaker 1: question of whether or not he was a healer or

865
00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:20,880
Speaker 1: a bullshit artist, and they kind of landed on healer.

866
00:47:20,960 --> 00:47:24,600
Speaker 1: Like ABC News did a pretty shitty job of journalism

867
00:47:24,640 --> 00:47:26,719
Speaker 1: here and I'm gonna quote from this right up in

868
00:47:26,719 --> 00:47:29,759
Speaker 1: the Montreal Gazette quote and an attempt to provide a

869
00:47:29,800 --> 00:47:32,680
Speaker 1: critical review a view of John's antics. The producers invited

870
00:47:32,719 --> 00:47:37,240
Speaker 1: two experts, cardiac surgeon Mement Oz and James Randy, the

871
00:47:37,280 --> 00:47:41,440
Speaker 1: world's leading investigator of paranormal phenomenon. Oz was probably chosen

872
00:47:41,440 --> 00:47:44,239
Speaker 1: because he was a proponent of various alternative therapies such

873
00:47:44,239 --> 00:47:47,400
Speaker 1: as therapeutic touch and reflexology, and would be likely to

874
00:47:47,400 --> 00:47:49,719
Speaker 1: be somewhat sympathetic to faith healing and perhaps at an

875
00:47:49,719 --> 00:47:52,960
Speaker 1: air of legitimacy. Randy was invited as the token skeptic.

876
00:47:53,280 --> 00:47:56,320
Speaker 1: Oz appeared repeatedly in the hour long show, basically echoing

877
00:47:56,320 --> 00:47:58,480
Speaker 1: the refrain that science doesn't have all the answers, and

878
00:47:58,560 --> 00:48:01,640
Speaker 1: not all other forms of healing knee consideration. Science, of

879
00:48:01,680 --> 00:48:03,400
Speaker 1: course doesn't claim to have all the answers, but it

880
00:48:03,400 --> 00:48:06,520
Speaker 1: does look for evidence before jumping on a bandwagon. Randy,

881
00:48:06,560 --> 00:48:08,840
Speaker 1: who could have provided evidence for methods of trickery and

882
00:48:08,880 --> 00:48:12,440
Speaker 1: for psychological manipulation, was given a total of nineteen seconds

883
00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:15,600
Speaker 1: on the show after being interviewed for hours. Why because

884
00:48:15,640 --> 00:48:18,160
Speaker 1: the possibility that cancer can be healed by penetrating the

885
00:48:18,160 --> 00:48:20,879
Speaker 1: nose with surgical forces by healer chosen by God makes

886
00:48:20,920 --> 00:48:22,919
Speaker 1: for better television than declaring him to be a self

887
00:48:22,960 --> 00:48:29,680
Speaker 1: delusional simpleton or calculating fraud artist. So I mean this

888
00:48:29,680 --> 00:48:32,799
Speaker 1: this has to also be like something like the underlying

889
00:48:33,719 --> 00:48:39,160
Speaker 1: like you know, uh, faith in Christianity, Like you know,

890
00:48:39,239 --> 00:48:41,600
Speaker 1: it's like, oh you gotta you know, can't question religion,

891
00:48:41,640 --> 00:48:45,480
Speaker 1: can't question religion takes you all the way to wealth.

892
00:48:45,719 --> 00:48:49,200
Speaker 1: This could be real. This clearly fake ship could be real.

893
00:48:49,440 --> 00:48:52,120
Speaker 1: It's gotta be real. What else could it be? It's

894
00:48:52,120 --> 00:48:56,560
Speaker 1: it's it's wild man um and Dr Oz is a

895
00:48:56,560 --> 00:48:59,799
Speaker 1: big part of justifying this guy. Like you can't over

896
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:03,600
Speaker 1: date how much doctor Oz played a role in giving

897
00:49:03,640 --> 00:49:07,320
Speaker 1: this guy legitimacy because his job for his whole career

898
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:09,640
Speaker 1: pretty much has been to be a real doctor who

899
00:49:09,680 --> 00:49:12,840
Speaker 1: will get up and say that nonsense makes sense, that

900
00:49:12,960 --> 00:49:15,400
Speaker 1: nonsense medical treatments are good for you. I mean, I

901
00:49:15,440 --> 00:49:18,319
Speaker 1: think I think it's like critical to point out that like,

902
00:49:18,920 --> 00:49:22,319
Speaker 1: physicians are not fucking scientists, like you can be a

903
00:49:22,400 --> 00:49:25,800
Speaker 1: doctor Ben Carson believes in fucking you know, doesn't believe

904
00:49:25,800 --> 00:49:31,880
Speaker 1: in evolution, Like doctors are just like high stakes technicians. Yeah,

905
00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:37,400
Speaker 1: and and there engineers are regularly uh engineers, and doctors

906
00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:40,640
Speaker 1: actually are are not irregularly like part of like terrorist moves,

907
00:49:40,640 --> 00:49:42,640
Speaker 1: like how Kaita had a bunch of engineers and doctors

908
00:49:42,640 --> 00:49:46,799
Speaker 1: and because like uh they you know, if you've got

909
00:49:46,800 --> 00:49:48,480
Speaker 1: that kind of intelligent like Ben Carson is a great

910
00:49:48,480 --> 00:49:51,239
Speaker 1: brain surgeon and is also able to convince himself that

911
00:49:51,320 --> 00:49:54,120
Speaker 1: the world is six thousand years old, like the kind

912
00:49:54,160 --> 00:49:56,799
Speaker 1: of brains that these people have, don't you know. There's

913
00:49:56,800 --> 00:49:59,480
Speaker 1: a lot of very smart doctors obviously too. But you

914
00:49:59,520 --> 00:50:03,239
Speaker 1: can be a doctor and very dumb. Um, yeah, and

915
00:50:03,320 --> 00:50:05,359
Speaker 1: you can be a But I don't think Dr Oz

916
00:50:05,440 --> 00:50:07,640
Speaker 1: is dumb. I actually don't think that's I think Doctor

917
00:50:07,719 --> 00:50:10,239
Speaker 1: Oz is a very intelligent grifter who's made millions of

918
00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:14,080
Speaker 1: dollars causing untold harm to the world into our shared

919
00:50:14,200 --> 00:50:18,399
Speaker 1: understanding of science. The doctor oz ad comes on during

920
00:50:18,440 --> 00:50:21,200
Speaker 1: this episode. He's a piece of ship and a monster.

921
00:50:22,400 --> 00:50:24,640
Speaker 1: But I hope an ad for Dr oz comes on

922
00:50:24,760 --> 00:50:26,960
Speaker 1: right now. Yeah, I think. I think it's just like

923
00:50:26,960 --> 00:50:31,480
Speaker 1: worth pointing out that the T, E, M and stem um,

924
00:50:31,520 --> 00:50:36,920
Speaker 1: none of those things are indicative of actual knowledge necessarily. No,

925
00:50:37,239 --> 00:50:40,920
Speaker 1: And this is part of why like this is people

926
00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:43,880
Speaker 1: talk about like conservatives in particularly like talk a lot

927
00:50:43,880 --> 00:50:46,040
Speaker 1: of shit about the liberal arts and like philosophy and

928
00:50:46,040 --> 00:50:47,560
Speaker 1: all this stuff, and it's like, no, no, no, The

929
00:50:47,600 --> 00:50:50,640
Speaker 1: reason why engineers and doctors should have some grounding and

930
00:50:50,640 --> 00:50:53,759
Speaker 1: all that education is to stop doctor oz Is from

931
00:50:53,800 --> 00:50:57,680
Speaker 1: coming about, Like like, it's to give people like a

932
00:50:58,160 --> 00:51:01,040
Speaker 1: broader understanding than just like, if you get really good

933
00:51:01,080 --> 00:51:05,280
Speaker 1: at one incredibly narrow technical thing, yeah, you can convince

934
00:51:05,280 --> 00:51:08,399
Speaker 1: yourself to believe all sorts of of stupid bullshit because

935
00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:10,880
Speaker 1: you're a very smart person who doesn't have a wide

936
00:51:10,960 --> 00:51:13,560
Speaker 1: ranging education. And it's very easy for those sorts of

937
00:51:13,600 --> 00:51:16,239
Speaker 1: people to convince themselves of the dumbest things in the world,

938
00:51:16,880 --> 00:51:20,160
Speaker 1: and who have like who are highly rewarded for it.

939
00:51:20,360 --> 00:51:23,880
Speaker 1: So like, yeah, you watch like any Silicon Valley person

940
00:51:24,200 --> 00:51:28,920
Speaker 1: make a pronunciation on anything outside of business, and it's like, oh,

941
00:51:29,080 --> 00:51:32,480
Speaker 1: you are You are less educated than the average person.

942
00:51:32,600 --> 00:51:36,960
Speaker 1: You are bad at reasoning. Yeah, and when a bunch

943
00:51:37,040 --> 00:51:39,360
Speaker 1: of these people who are really good at one incredibly

944
00:51:39,440 --> 00:51:42,680
Speaker 1: narrow task wind up responsible for a wide range of things,

945
00:51:43,000 --> 00:51:46,399
Speaker 1: you have stuff like a viral epidemic get wildly out

946
00:51:46,400 --> 00:51:50,680
Speaker 1: of hand and kill tens of thousands of people. But yeah, yeah,

947
00:51:51,400 --> 00:51:54,399
Speaker 1: hypothetically yeah, and dr oz is of course a part

948
00:51:54,440 --> 00:51:56,880
Speaker 1: of that, and was like urging people to take bullshit

949
00:51:56,960 --> 00:52:00,399
Speaker 1: medical treatments during the coronavirus epidemic because he's he's he's

950
00:52:00,480 --> 00:52:03,520
Speaker 1: he's history's greatest monster. Um. You know. He was also

951
00:52:03,640 --> 00:52:07,080
Speaker 1: cited repeatedly in that two thousand ten OH Magazine article

952
00:52:07,080 --> 00:52:10,359
Speaker 1: because of course oprah Um gave mement Oz life and

953
00:52:10,480 --> 00:52:14,719
Speaker 1: nursed him at her metaphorical breast of publicity. Um. And

954
00:52:14,719 --> 00:52:16,719
Speaker 1: I'm gonna quote from that next. So this is the

955
00:52:16,800 --> 00:52:18,880
Speaker 1: right up and OH magazine that really put John of

956
00:52:18,960 --> 00:52:22,279
Speaker 1: God on the map. Quote. Five years ago, Oz had

957
00:52:22,280 --> 00:52:25,560
Speaker 1: participated in a primetime live segment focusing on John of God.

958
00:52:25,800 --> 00:52:28,400
Speaker 1: He examined hours of film footage from the entities healings.

959
00:52:28,480 --> 00:52:30,360
Speaker 1: He looked at scans and biopsy reports, and there were

960
00:52:30,400 --> 00:52:33,280
Speaker 1: results he couldn't explain the shrinkage of an aggressive tumor.

961
00:52:33,320 --> 00:52:36,040
Speaker 1: For instance, this guy has a glioblastoma, which is a

962
00:52:36,120 --> 00:52:39,000
Speaker 1: very deadly brain tumor. Oz recalled it was grade for

963
00:52:39,280 --> 00:52:41,880
Speaker 1: the biopsy didn't improved it as an added credential. The

964
00:52:41,880 --> 00:52:45,120
Speaker 1: biopsy was done at Dartmouth Hitchcock Medical Center, a prominent hospital.

965
00:52:45,320 --> 00:52:47,440
Speaker 1: I took those films down to my radiologist along with

966
00:52:47,440 --> 00:52:49,319
Speaker 1: a new set of films that patient had taken after

967
00:52:49,360 --> 00:52:51,400
Speaker 1: his visit to John of God, which showed the tumor

968
00:52:51,440 --> 00:52:55,279
Speaker 1: had calcified and essentially died. Now I don't know Dr

969
00:52:55,320 --> 00:52:57,319
Speaker 1: Oz is radiologist, but I do know that Dr Oz

970
00:52:57,400 --> 00:53:00,000
Speaker 1: himself is a fameless charlatan and a liar. I can't

971
00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:02,359
Speaker 1: speak to the specific case, but it's worth noting that

972
00:53:02,400 --> 00:53:05,440
Speaker 1: no other doctors got to look at this information. Um.

973
00:53:05,480 --> 00:53:08,239
Speaker 1: I can, however, speak about other cancers that John of

974
00:53:08,280 --> 00:53:11,359
Speaker 1: God claimed falsely to have cured. In two thousand five,

975
00:53:11,440 --> 00:53:14,840
Speaker 1: South African singer Leah Melman refused breast cancer surgery to

976
00:53:14,880 --> 00:53:17,000
Speaker 1: be treated by John of God. She claimed to have

977
00:53:17,040 --> 00:53:19,160
Speaker 1: been cured by him, and showed up on Oprah Winfrey

978
00:53:19,239 --> 00:53:21,520
Speaker 1: Show to tell everyone the good news about how Brazil's

979
00:53:21,560 --> 00:53:25,320
Speaker 1: miracle healer had had cured her untreatable cancer, which actually

980
00:53:25,360 --> 00:53:27,280
Speaker 1: was treatable that she just chose not to get treated.

981
00:53:27,560 --> 00:53:29,960
Speaker 1: She died of her untreated cancer two years after her

982
00:53:30,120 --> 00:53:33,200
Speaker 1: Oprah appearance in two thousand twelve. Oprah did not post

983
00:53:33,200 --> 00:53:35,480
Speaker 1: a retraction based on any of this. Of course, some

984
00:53:35,520 --> 00:53:37,080
Speaker 1: of this is probably due to the fact that there

985
00:53:37,120 --> 00:53:40,000
Speaker 1: were many, many other grateful patients all too eager to

986
00:53:40,040 --> 00:53:42,600
Speaker 1: come forward and share their own stories of miraculous healing.

987
00:53:43,000 --> 00:53:45,759
Speaker 1: That two thousand ten article by Susan Casey included the

988
00:53:45,800 --> 00:53:48,359
Speaker 1: stories of several charismatic foreigners who claimed to have been

989
00:53:48,400 --> 00:53:50,600
Speaker 1: cured by John and now worked for him or made

990
00:53:50,640 --> 00:53:53,759
Speaker 1: money taking groups to be healed by him. Um, I'm

991
00:53:53,760 --> 00:53:55,839
Speaker 1: gonna read one example. This is a quote from that

992
00:53:55,920 --> 00:53:59,120
Speaker 1: Oh magazine article which you can only find it on

993
00:53:59,160 --> 00:54:02,040
Speaker 1: the way back machine because once this guy got accused

994
00:54:02,040 --> 00:54:05,920
Speaker 1: by of rape by literally hundreds of people. Um opropole

995
00:54:06,000 --> 00:54:08,799
Speaker 1: the article, But uh, I found it on the way

996
00:54:08,800 --> 00:54:11,480
Speaker 1: back machine. And if you want to be really angry

997
00:54:11,480 --> 00:54:15,600
Speaker 1: at an unspeakably shitty journalist, and and Susan Casey is

998
00:54:15,640 --> 00:54:18,200
Speaker 1: one of the very worst who's ever ever done the job,

999
00:54:18,800 --> 00:54:21,279
Speaker 1: UH read that article because it will make you want

1000
00:54:21,280 --> 00:54:23,080
Speaker 1: to punch holes in your wall. So I'm gonna read

1001
00:54:23,080 --> 00:54:25,120
Speaker 1: a quote from it now, So get your whole punch

1002
00:54:25,160 --> 00:54:29,000
Speaker 1: and hands ready over a good Chilean red Edwen, an

1003
00:54:29,160 --> 00:54:32,520
Speaker 1: ordained minister, motivational speaker and author of the Four Spiritual

1004
00:54:32,560 --> 00:54:35,520
Speaker 1: Laws of Prosperity, recounted the story of her brain aneurysm,

1005
00:54:35,600 --> 00:54:39,319
Speaker 1: deemed inoperable by five neurosurgeons, get your affairs in order,

1006
00:54:39,360 --> 00:54:42,040
Speaker 1: she remembers being told, and try not to sneeze. That's

1007
00:54:42,040 --> 00:54:44,400
Speaker 1: how fragile I was, she said. So I did it.

1008
00:54:44,600 --> 00:54:46,600
Speaker 1: I went out and got my living will, my durable

1009
00:54:46,640 --> 00:54:49,560
Speaker 1: power of attorney. But then I realized I'm not ready

1010
00:54:49,600 --> 00:54:52,279
Speaker 1: to go just yet, she laughed at the memory. That's

1011
00:54:52,280 --> 00:54:55,239
Speaker 1: all it is. Now. After her dire diagnosis, at the

1012
00:54:55,320 --> 00:54:57,279
Speaker 1: urging of her prayer group, all of whom say they

1013
00:54:57,280 --> 00:54:59,600
Speaker 1: received the same vision of John of God curing her,

1014
00:55:00,120 --> 00:55:02,480
Speaker 1: Ween traveled to the CASA. I was nervous and I

1015
00:55:02,520 --> 00:55:05,160
Speaker 1: was skeptical, she said, but what did I have to lose?

1016
00:55:05,640 --> 00:55:08,840
Speaker 1: Almost immediately, the entity performed invisible surgery on her, a

1017
00:55:08,920 --> 00:55:11,719
Speaker 1: forty minute process that involves sitting in a group meditation

1018
00:55:11,719 --> 00:55:14,279
Speaker 1: with her right hand over her heart. Nobody touched her,

1019
00:55:14,400 --> 00:55:16,959
Speaker 1: but it. Ween remembers, I could feel things moving around

1020
00:55:17,000 --> 00:55:20,759
Speaker 1: in my head. It didn't hurt, but it was different. Afterwards,

1021
00:55:20,760 --> 00:55:23,839
Speaker 1: she collapsed in exhaustion for twenty four hours. Days later,

1022
00:55:23,920 --> 00:55:25,920
Speaker 1: she was told by her guide the stitches would be

1023
00:55:26,000 --> 00:55:29,840
Speaker 1: could would be removed. That night. I could feel ping, ping, ping,

1024
00:55:29,960 --> 00:55:33,400
Speaker 1: like stitches being pulled out. Eventually, a CT scan revealed

1025
00:55:33,440 --> 00:55:37,520
Speaker 1: the truth. Her aneurysm was gone. I'm so grateful, she said,

1026
00:55:37,760 --> 00:55:40,360
Speaker 1: nodding towards the heavens. Since then, she's been back to

1027
00:55:40,400 --> 00:55:42,520
Speaker 1: the Casa once at Christmas, and now she was headed

1028
00:55:42,560 --> 00:55:44,760
Speaker 1: there for a third time, bringing a group of twenty

1029
00:55:44,760 --> 00:55:47,600
Speaker 1: people who also saw at healing. So this is the

1030
00:55:47,680 --> 00:55:50,520
Speaker 1: level of journalistic rigor that we're getting in this article.

1031
00:55:51,120 --> 00:55:59,880
Speaker 1: M magazine, everybody, the mention of the wine is particularly choice. Yeah,

1032
00:56:00,120 --> 00:56:04,759
Speaker 1: Oprah magazine was definitely like it was. Yeah, it was,

1033
00:56:04,800 --> 00:56:07,880
Speaker 1: it was. It was entirely geared getting wine moms to

1034
00:56:07,960 --> 00:56:13,720
Speaker 1: believe spiritual nonsense and not get their cancer treated. Jesus Christ.

1035
00:56:14,080 --> 00:56:15,640
Speaker 1: I mean, Robert, you want to take an ad break

1036
00:56:15,640 --> 00:56:18,400
Speaker 1: real quick? Yeah? You know what? Else doesn't care if

1037
00:56:18,440 --> 00:56:24,560
Speaker 1: wine moms get cancer treatment. The products and services that

1038
00:56:24,600 --> 00:56:27,319
Speaker 1: support this podcast, they don't. They don't give a good

1039
00:56:27,360 --> 00:56:30,000
Speaker 1: God damn. And that's the Garrett, that's the behind the

1040
00:56:30,000 --> 00:56:40,760
Speaker 1: bastards guarantee we're back. Oh my gosh, what a great

1041
00:56:42,080 --> 00:56:48,319
Speaker 1: I don't know whatever this is. God John have got

1042
00:56:48,400 --> 00:56:50,719
Speaker 1: is a monster and a rapist, and we will only

1043
00:56:50,760 --> 00:56:53,880
Speaker 1: hear more about the horrible things that he's done. Um,

1044
00:56:53,920 --> 00:56:56,400
Speaker 1: but I can't have the same kind of hatred for

1045
00:56:56,520 --> 00:56:59,240
Speaker 1: him that I can for these fucking Oh Magazine grifters

1046
00:56:59,239 --> 00:57:01,080
Speaker 1: and dr ah. And I don't know why. I think

1047
00:57:01,120 --> 00:57:03,279
Speaker 1: it's because on like a on like a global level,

1048
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:05,120
Speaker 1: the amount of harm that these people do is so

1049
00:57:05,200 --> 00:57:08,840
Speaker 1: much higher. And it's also so much like this is

1050
00:57:08,880 --> 00:57:11,560
Speaker 1: gonna sound weird, but like the horrible physical crimes that

1051
00:57:11,640 --> 00:57:13,799
Speaker 1: John of God committed, like he just went out there

1052
00:57:13,800 --> 00:57:17,480
Speaker 1: and committed with his own body. Um, And there's a

1053
00:57:17,560 --> 00:57:21,360
Speaker 1: level of like commitment to evil that's necessary, whereas doctor

1054
00:57:21,400 --> 00:57:23,360
Speaker 1: as an Oprah just like sit in front of a

1055
00:57:23,400 --> 00:57:26,720
Speaker 1: camera and say bullshit that harms so many more people. Well,

1056
00:57:26,800 --> 00:57:30,400
Speaker 1: at the same time, they're perfectly friendly and nice people

1057
00:57:30,520 --> 00:57:32,840
Speaker 1: and so like nobody hates them and they never go

1058
00:57:32,920 --> 00:57:36,320
Speaker 1: to prison and like I'm not gonna say the worse

1059
00:57:36,400 --> 00:57:39,480
Speaker 1: than a rapist, but yeah, you know, they do more

1060
00:57:39,560 --> 00:57:44,880
Speaker 1: damage on a on a broad scale, right, Like yeah,

1061
00:57:45,160 --> 00:57:47,840
Speaker 1: it's not good. Well, it's like it's like sort of

1062
00:57:47,880 --> 00:57:53,160
Speaker 1: like it's like, um, it's like whatever the pr version

1063
00:57:53,160 --> 00:57:58,800
Speaker 1: of money laundering is, they they clean it clean. Yeah, yeah, exactly,

1064
00:57:59,120 --> 00:58:01,840
Speaker 1: that's exactly right there. They're like money launderers for like

1065
00:58:01,960 --> 00:58:05,320
Speaker 1: dangerous bullshit that gets people killed and molested in stuff.

1066
00:58:05,800 --> 00:58:09,680
Speaker 1: And they are responsible in this case for sending thousands

1067
00:58:09,680 --> 00:58:12,320
Speaker 1: of potential victims to this guy who again turns out

1068
00:58:12,320 --> 00:58:14,840
Speaker 1: to rape hundreds of people and like they're being sent

1069
00:58:14,880 --> 00:58:17,600
Speaker 1: there by Oprah. But all she gets is traffic for

1070
00:58:17,640 --> 00:58:19,960
Speaker 1: it and more money. And everybody loves Oprah And if

1071
00:58:20,000 --> 00:58:23,640
Speaker 1: she ran for president, she would absolutely win. Um. And

1072
00:58:23,720 --> 00:58:26,920
Speaker 1: it's fine, And it's just fine because she's a friendly,

1073
00:58:27,040 --> 00:58:28,800
Speaker 1: nice person. I'm sure. I'm sure if I got to

1074
00:58:28,800 --> 00:58:31,760
Speaker 1: hang out with Oprah, I would enjoy her company. Um,

1075
00:58:31,800 --> 00:58:35,640
Speaker 1: and I would forget momentarily the horrors that her brand

1076
00:58:35,720 --> 00:58:38,240
Speaker 1: has brought into the world. And that's very frustrating to

1077
00:58:38,280 --> 00:58:40,880
Speaker 1: think about. Although to be fair, actually, if she were

1078
00:58:40,960 --> 00:58:45,400
Speaker 1: to graduate to the level of American president, yeah, um,

1079
00:58:45,440 --> 00:58:49,400
Speaker 1: she would once again be in company where probably, relatively speaking,

1080
00:58:49,440 --> 00:58:52,960
Speaker 1: her hands are relatively clean. I and and like, I hate,

1081
00:58:53,000 --> 00:58:54,919
Speaker 1: I hate to say it, but I suspect she would

1082
00:58:54,920 --> 00:58:58,040
Speaker 1: not be the worst president of my lifetime. Oh my god,

1083
00:58:58,160 --> 00:59:01,640
Speaker 1: she might be the best. Yeah. It's it's entirely possible.

1084
00:59:03,400 --> 00:59:06,160
Speaker 1: Both things are true. You can be the friendly face

1085
00:59:06,280 --> 00:59:10,640
Speaker 1: of a lot of horror still be the best president. Yeah.

1086
00:59:10,680 --> 00:59:13,479
Speaker 1: I would still vote for her over the current guy

1087
00:59:13,600 --> 00:59:19,040
Speaker 1: or even Joe Biden, to be honest. So here we go, like,

1088
00:59:19,160 --> 00:59:21,800
Speaker 1: it's fucking wild. This is so dumb. We shouldn't have

1089
00:59:21,840 --> 00:59:27,280
Speaker 1: presidents um or billionaires like Oprah. But whatever. Anyway, that

1090
00:59:27,360 --> 00:59:30,120
Speaker 1: Oh Magazine article has been scrubbed from the Internet because

1091
00:59:30,120 --> 00:59:33,320
Speaker 1: of all the rapes and stuff. Um, but uh yeah,

1092
00:59:33,520 --> 00:59:36,640
Speaker 1: it's I almost recommend finding it and reading it just

1093
00:59:36,680 --> 00:59:38,640
Speaker 1: to get a crash course and how to write a

1094
00:59:38,720 --> 00:59:42,280
Speaker 1: really irresponsible article about a cult leader. Susan Casey should

1095
00:59:42,280 --> 00:59:44,360
Speaker 1: be in some sort of journalist prison, but instead she

1096
00:59:44,400 --> 00:59:46,680
Speaker 1: went from being Oprah's editor in chief to working as

1097
00:59:46,680 --> 00:59:50,080
Speaker 1: the creative director for Outside Magazine, the editor of Sports

1098
00:59:50,080 --> 00:59:53,200
Speaker 1: Illustrated Women, and the author of a ridiculous sounding book

1099
00:59:53,240 --> 00:59:55,200
Speaker 1: on dolphins. And I am sure that I have ruined

1100
00:59:55,200 --> 00:59:57,960
Speaker 1: any chance of publishing an Outside magazine now, which bums

1101
00:59:58,000 --> 01:00:01,680
Speaker 1: me out. I would much rather do that than write

1102
01:00:01,720 --> 01:00:04,760
Speaker 1: about Nazis. But I don't like Susan Casey, and I

1103
01:00:04,760 --> 01:00:09,240
Speaker 1: think she's very irresponsible. Yeah, she's the journalistic equivalent of

1104
01:00:09,280 --> 01:00:12,520
Speaker 1: like like taking your nine year old out shooting for

1105
01:00:12,560 --> 01:00:15,960
Speaker 1: the first time and just getting blackout drunk first. I

1106
01:00:16,000 --> 01:00:20,760
Speaker 1: mean is it, Like because it's like, so they generally

1107
01:00:20,800 --> 01:00:25,360
Speaker 1: there's this like a vested interest in promoting like spirituality

1108
01:00:25,800 --> 01:00:30,920
Speaker 1: and Christianity on some level. And like because it's like

1109
01:00:30,960 --> 01:00:33,520
Speaker 1: when you when you encounter these people, are you are

1110
01:00:33,600 --> 01:00:37,320
Speaker 1: not at any point like, hey, this seems fucked up.

1111
01:00:38,080 --> 01:00:40,160
Speaker 1: I it's so wild to me that you don't that

1112
01:00:40,200 --> 01:00:42,640
Speaker 1: they don't have that instant you know. The key is

1113
01:00:42,680 --> 01:00:45,080
Speaker 1: that all of the people surrounding John of God, because

1114
01:00:45,080 --> 01:00:46,520
Speaker 1: you don't spend much time with him, he spent a

1115
01:00:46,560 --> 01:00:48,400
Speaker 1: lot of time around these like and they're mostly like

1116
01:00:48,440 --> 01:00:51,800
Speaker 1: white American ladies who like love his ship. And they're

1117
01:00:51,840 --> 01:00:55,040
Speaker 1: all the same kind of they're all Gwyneth Paltrow kind

1118
01:00:55,040 --> 01:00:59,360
Speaker 1: of people. And they're all like like well healed and

1119
01:00:59,480 --> 01:01:03,400
Speaker 1: friendly and and charming. Uh and and they know how

1120
01:01:03,480 --> 01:01:06,760
Speaker 1: to speak to a specific segment of the population and

1121
01:01:06,800 --> 01:01:12,880
Speaker 1: those people find them trustworthy. Um. Yeah, So Susan felt

1122
01:01:12,880 --> 01:01:14,640
Speaker 1: the need to visit John of God, the author that

1123
01:01:14,640 --> 01:01:17,320
Speaker 1: Oh Magazine article. Um so she could write a terrible article.

1124
01:01:17,440 --> 01:01:20,280
Speaker 1: But the the the ailment that sent her there was

1125
01:01:20,320 --> 01:01:23,360
Speaker 1: the fact that her father had tragically died very young. Um.

1126
01:01:23,400 --> 01:01:26,120
Speaker 1: And the resultant grief had nearly broken her um. She

1127
01:01:26,200 --> 01:01:28,480
Speaker 1: went to Brazil for healing, and she basically claims that

1128
01:01:28,560 --> 01:01:30,440
Speaker 1: John of God put her into a trance during one

1129
01:01:30,480 --> 01:01:32,480
Speaker 1: of his mass healing sessions, and she was able to

1130
01:01:32,560 --> 01:01:35,480
Speaker 1: visualize her father in paradise, knowing that he was happy

1131
01:01:35,480 --> 01:01:37,439
Speaker 1: and off living his eternal life allowed her to move

1132
01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:40,440
Speaker 1: on and that's all fine. Like, Seriously, grief is the

1133
01:01:40,480 --> 01:01:42,320
Speaker 1: worst thing ever, and there are way worse ways of

1134
01:01:42,360 --> 01:01:43,960
Speaker 1: coping with it than paying a guru to help you

1135
01:01:44,000 --> 01:01:46,400
Speaker 1: to hallucinate heaven or whatever. Do what you gotta do

1136
01:01:46,440 --> 01:01:48,440
Speaker 1: to get by. I'm not gonna blame her for that.

1137
01:01:48,680 --> 01:01:50,920
Speaker 1: What I will blame her for is the utterly uncritical

1138
01:01:50,960 --> 01:01:53,320
Speaker 1: way that she wrote about John of God's bullshit, like

1139
01:01:53,400 --> 01:01:55,560
Speaker 1: his claims of being able to perform surgery without even

1140
01:01:55,600 --> 01:01:58,760
Speaker 1: touching people. So here's another quote. When you consider the

1141
01:01:58,800 --> 01:02:03,520
Speaker 1: countless unseen things of undeniable power, sound waves, microwaves, radio waves,

1142
01:02:03,520 --> 01:02:06,320
Speaker 1: emotions like anger or envy, wind, and of course the

1143
01:02:06,360 --> 01:02:09,320
Speaker 1: awesome universal power of love, it seems silly to rely

1144
01:02:09,360 --> 01:02:11,440
Speaker 1: on the naked eye for proof of anything, Yet that

1145
01:02:11,520 --> 01:02:14,000
Speaker 1: is what we do. Numbers on charts and graphs, X

1146
01:02:14,120 --> 01:02:16,640
Speaker 1: rays those we believe in, but we lieve without documentation.

1147
01:02:16,720 --> 01:02:18,920
Speaker 1: Something we perceive with one of our five senses is

1148
01:02:18,960 --> 01:02:21,440
Speaker 1: considered without with one of our five senses is considered

1149
01:02:21,440 --> 01:02:25,240
Speaker 1: blind faith sweet, but we don't really trust it. So

1150
01:02:25,280 --> 01:02:27,600
Speaker 1: she's saying that, like it's it's silly to believe in

1151
01:02:27,720 --> 01:02:31,640
Speaker 1: radio waves but not the power of ghosts to heal

1152
01:02:31,720 --> 01:02:36,560
Speaker 1: people's cancer. That the hand waving of naked eye into

1153
01:02:36,600 --> 01:02:41,280
Speaker 1: evidence is fucking revolting. She is handwaving so hard it

1154
01:02:41,320 --> 01:02:46,400
Speaker 1: could power a fucking wind bill farm, like Jesus. So

1155
01:02:46,440 --> 01:02:48,960
Speaker 1: she actually makes the argument in that article that it's

1156
01:02:49,000 --> 01:02:51,240
Speaker 1: unreasonable for us to reject the reality of John of

1157
01:02:51,280 --> 01:02:53,760
Speaker 1: God's powers just because there's no proof behind them. This

1158
01:02:53,840 --> 01:02:56,440
Speaker 1: is reinforced by something something she writes about her arrival

1159
01:02:56,480 --> 01:02:59,000
Speaker 1: in the hotel at Abadyanya quote, as I hoisted my

1160
01:02:59,080 --> 01:03:01,080
Speaker 1: luggage up to the second floor, a small sign of

1161
01:03:01,120 --> 01:03:04,200
Speaker 1: the wall caught my attention. Don't believe everything you think

1162
01:03:04,400 --> 01:03:08,200
Speaker 1: it advised, which is like that's kind of gaslighting, right,

1163
01:03:08,240 --> 01:03:13,160
Speaker 1: Like it's like it's like gaslighting via decorations. Yeah, that

1164
01:03:13,320 --> 01:03:18,400
Speaker 1: is exactly that is just what abusers say. That's insane. Yeah.

1165
01:03:19,560 --> 01:03:23,240
Speaker 1: In this same incredulous way, she writes about the entities

1166
01:03:23,280 --> 01:03:25,240
Speaker 1: that John of God channels quote. If you spend time

1167
01:03:25,240 --> 01:03:27,560
Speaker 1: at Abadyanna, you will hear the phrase the entities over

1168
01:03:27,600 --> 01:03:30,360
Speaker 1: and over again, sometimes plural and sometimes singular, and you

1169
01:03:30,360 --> 01:03:31,960
Speaker 1: will come to use it yourself as if it were

1170
01:03:31,960 --> 01:03:34,920
Speaker 1: a completely ordinary thing, to say what it actually means. However,

1171
01:03:34,960 --> 01:03:37,120
Speaker 1: it is so extraordinary that it defies our sense of

1172
01:03:37,120 --> 01:03:39,720
Speaker 1: what is logical or even possible in this world. The

1173
01:03:39,760 --> 01:03:41,720
Speaker 1: healing entities who work through John of God are the

1174
01:03:41,760 --> 01:03:45,520
Speaker 1: spirits of deceased doctors, surgeons, masters, and saints. Heather's website

1175
01:03:45,520 --> 01:03:48,760
Speaker 1: explains matter of factly, they use Medium Joao's body, channeling

1176
01:03:48,760 --> 01:03:51,520
Speaker 1: their power through him. Sometimes the spirits show up anonymously,

1177
01:03:51,560 --> 01:03:54,520
Speaker 1: but there are several who make regular appearances. They include

1178
01:03:54,600 --> 01:03:57,680
Speaker 1: Dr Augusto Dalmata, a surgeon and army man with a

1179
01:03:57,680 --> 01:04:01,080
Speaker 1: serious and efficient manner. Dr Oswaldo Rus, whose specialties were

1180
01:04:01,080 --> 01:04:05,880
Speaker 1: infectious diseases and bacteriology. St. Francis Xavier, co founder of

1181
01:04:05,880 --> 01:04:09,440
Speaker 1: the Jesuit Order, along with CASA's patron, Saint Ignatious of Loyola,

1182
01:04:09,600 --> 01:04:12,440
Speaker 1: a priest and nobleman from the sixteenth century. Despite the

1183
01:04:12,480 --> 01:04:15,280
Speaker 1: presence of saints, Medium Joel Born, a Catholic, makes it

1184
01:04:15,280 --> 01:04:17,000
Speaker 1: clear that the CASA is not a church but rather

1185
01:04:17,040 --> 01:04:20,160
Speaker 1: a spiritual hospital. My mission has nothing to do with religion,

1186
01:04:20,200 --> 01:04:26,880
Speaker 1: he says, So have the has have these guys ever

1187
01:04:26,920 --> 01:04:29,400
Speaker 1: been like sued by the estates of these This feels

1188
01:04:29,400 --> 01:04:33,600
Speaker 1: a little bit like Mormons, like nope, baptizing people in

1189
01:04:33,600 --> 01:04:39,160
Speaker 1: in uh like postmortem. Most of the poor people who

1190
01:04:39,200 --> 01:04:41,160
Speaker 1: come to John of God are too poor to sue

1191
01:04:41,400 --> 01:04:43,760
Speaker 1: if they're serious diseases don't get cured. And most of

1192
01:04:43,760 --> 01:04:46,560
Speaker 1: the rich people aren't actually coming there for serious diseases.

1193
01:04:46,560 --> 01:04:48,720
Speaker 1: They're coming there for things like like susan as. We're like,

1194
01:04:48,800 --> 01:04:52,280
Speaker 1: they're sad. You know, that's a lot of patients. Sorry

1195
01:04:52,280 --> 01:04:55,840
Speaker 1: I meant, I meant the estates of these spirits of

1196
01:04:55,880 --> 01:05:00,200
Speaker 1: the um Man. Yeah, that that would be fun to

1197
01:05:00,240 --> 01:05:02,080
Speaker 1: try to sue someone for that. I don't know that

1198
01:05:02,120 --> 01:05:06,160
Speaker 1: there's any legal precedent. I think it's really funny that

1199
01:05:06,240 --> 01:05:08,080
Speaker 1: you're like talking about like, Okay, well we've got this

1200
01:05:08,120 --> 01:05:11,240
Speaker 1: infectious disease doctor, but actually he's calling it a second

1201
01:05:11,240 --> 01:05:16,880
Speaker 1: opinion from the sixteenth century noble. Yeah, exactly. It's like, hey,

1202
01:05:17,040 --> 01:05:22,280
Speaker 1: my grandpa, you know, admittedly, my my Nazi grandpa probably

1203
01:05:22,280 --> 01:05:24,479
Speaker 1: wouldn't have supported this, I guess is not the best

1204
01:05:24,520 --> 01:05:32,120
Speaker 1: court case, but yeah, you know, yeah boy um. Susan

1205
01:05:32,120 --> 01:05:34,400
Speaker 1: goes on to write quote at the cosas skeptics or

1206
01:05:34,480 --> 01:05:37,240
Speaker 1: is welcome as believers. I had already noticed that skeptics

1207
01:05:37,240 --> 01:05:40,080
Speaker 1: didn't tend to stay that way. Many her rumping empirical

1208
01:05:40,120 --> 01:05:43,160
Speaker 1: scientists had become impassioned John have got advocates after visiting

1209
01:05:43,160 --> 01:05:45,320
Speaker 1: and witnessing him in action. She doesn't go on to

1210
01:05:45,400 --> 01:05:48,040
Speaker 1: quote any of these scientists um or or give any

1211
01:05:48,040 --> 01:05:51,040
Speaker 1: evidence of this. She just like says it um because

1212
01:05:51,040 --> 01:05:54,680
Speaker 1: this is again a perfect piece of journalism. At one point,

1213
01:05:54,800 --> 01:05:57,080
Speaker 1: Susan attends a healing and says that John of God

1214
01:05:57,120 --> 01:05:59,240
Speaker 1: called for doctors in the audience to come forward. In

1215
01:05:59,320 --> 01:06:02,400
Speaker 1: her recitation events, these learned men were all bowled over

1216
01:06:02,440 --> 01:06:05,680
Speaker 1: by John's inexplicable healing abilities. As far as I can tell,

1217
01:06:05,720 --> 01:06:08,040
Speaker 1: Susan took no action to determine if any of these

1218
01:06:08,080 --> 01:06:12,160
Speaker 1: men were actual doctors. A real journalist, Michael Usher did

1219
01:06:12,160 --> 01:06:14,560
Speaker 1: report critically on John of Gotten two thousand and fourteen

1220
01:06:14,600 --> 01:06:16,720
Speaker 1: for sixty minutes, and I wanted to compare how she

1221
01:06:16,880 --> 01:06:20,000
Speaker 1: and Michael both wrote about the medium's ice scraping surgery.

1222
01:06:21,160 --> 01:06:24,000
Speaker 1: Quote from my vantage point only ten and this is

1223
01:06:24,040 --> 01:06:26,480
Speaker 1: Susan from my vantage point only ten feet away. The

1224
01:06:26,600 --> 01:06:29,160
Speaker 1: change in his body and demeanor was easily visible. Now

1225
01:06:29,200 --> 01:06:31,840
Speaker 1: his eyes were more intense, and they flashed noticeably darker.

1226
01:06:32,080 --> 01:06:34,919
Speaker 1: His gait became stiffer, his movements more deliberate. He turned

1227
01:06:34,960 --> 01:06:36,960
Speaker 1: to the three women standing against the wall, took the

1228
01:06:36,960 --> 01:06:38,960
Speaker 1: one closest to him by the hand, and gently sat

1229
01:06:38,960 --> 01:06:41,880
Speaker 1: her in a wheelchair. Her eyes fluttered wide as she meditated.

1230
01:06:42,080 --> 01:06:44,040
Speaker 1: Reaching to the tray, he selected a short knife with

1231
01:06:44,080 --> 01:06:46,040
Speaker 1: a wooden handle, a cheap looking type that you might

1232
01:06:46,120 --> 01:06:47,760
Speaker 1: used to pair and apple, and he held it up

1233
01:06:47,800 --> 01:06:50,240
Speaker 1: to the room, making sure that everyone saw it sharp blade.

1234
01:06:50,320 --> 01:06:52,840
Speaker 1: He tipped her head backward, running his hand across her face,

1235
01:06:52,880 --> 01:06:55,160
Speaker 1: and he opened her left eye, holding the eyelid wide.

1236
01:06:55,320 --> 01:06:58,120
Speaker 1: Then he began to skate scrape the knife across her eyeball,

1237
01:06:58,160 --> 01:07:01,200
Speaker 1: back and forth with visible pressure. Unbelievably, the woman said

1238
01:07:01,240 --> 01:07:04,160
Speaker 1: absolutely still, without flinching or recoiling. I had a hard

1239
01:07:04,160 --> 01:07:06,080
Speaker 1: time watching this, believing as I do, that the words

1240
01:07:06,120 --> 01:07:08,440
Speaker 1: knife and eyeball should never appear in the same sentence.

1241
01:07:08,680 --> 01:07:10,880
Speaker 1: After what seemed like an eternity devoid of trauma. He

1242
01:07:10,880 --> 01:07:13,280
Speaker 1: put down the knife. The orderly took the wheelchair and

1243
01:07:13,320 --> 01:07:15,960
Speaker 1: steered it into the infirmary as she had the entire time,

1244
01:07:15,960 --> 01:07:18,040
Speaker 1: the woman appeared to be napping. How on earth could

1245
01:07:18,040 --> 01:07:20,360
Speaker 1: a knife cross your eyeball and not hurt? Later I

1246
01:07:20,360 --> 01:07:23,200
Speaker 1: would interview another recipient of this treatment, Conny Price sixty

1247
01:07:23,200 --> 01:07:25,560
Speaker 1: two from Jackson, Michigan. There was no pain whatsoever, she

1248
01:07:25,560 --> 01:07:27,840
Speaker 1: said of the five minutes scraping, I could feel the

1249
01:07:27,920 --> 01:07:30,080
Speaker 1: energy coming through him. I remember the heat pouring through

1250
01:07:30,080 --> 01:07:32,840
Speaker 1: that man's body. Price found the treatment beneficial. I can

1251
01:07:32,880 --> 01:07:35,360
Speaker 1: see a lot better now. So you'll notice the only

1252
01:07:35,400 --> 01:07:38,240
Speaker 1: evidence of efficacy of healing is they didn't look to

1253
01:07:38,240 --> 01:07:41,120
Speaker 1: be in pain when this guy was rubbing a knife

1254
01:07:41,200 --> 01:07:44,320
Speaker 1: on their eye, and they said, one of them said, afterwards,

1255
01:07:44,360 --> 01:07:47,800
Speaker 1: I can see better now. There's no Again, that's not evidence.

1256
01:07:47,920 --> 01:07:50,880
Speaker 1: That's an anecdote, And that's not an anecdote based on

1257
01:07:50,960 --> 01:07:54,600
Speaker 1: like actually testing her eyesight. Is that And also it's like,

1258
01:07:55,280 --> 01:07:58,160
Speaker 1: aren't there isn't the whole thing that's like, there aren't

1259
01:07:58,280 --> 01:08:00,600
Speaker 1: are there nerves on your eyeball? Because that's how they do.

1260
01:08:00,720 --> 01:08:04,240
Speaker 1: Like ye, it's actually really easy to write. It's the

1261
01:08:04,280 --> 01:08:06,320
Speaker 1: same thing with like shot. It's actually very easy to

1262
01:08:06,880 --> 01:08:08,640
Speaker 1: rub a knife and even cut a little bit on

1263
01:08:08,680 --> 01:08:13,320
Speaker 1: an eyeball without somebody being in a horrible pain. And

1264
01:08:13,520 --> 01:08:16,720
Speaker 1: you know, even when you actually are cutting into people's chest, like,

1265
01:08:16,800 --> 01:08:19,120
Speaker 1: it's easy for people to not feel pain. Like again,

1266
01:08:19,720 --> 01:08:22,320
Speaker 1: people who like there there are people who like do

1267
01:08:22,600 --> 01:08:24,400
Speaker 1: cutting and stuff or who will like like I I

1268
01:08:24,439 --> 01:08:27,559
Speaker 1: have friends who like will suspend themselves from the fucking

1269
01:08:28,360 --> 01:08:30,759
Speaker 1: things in the roof of a building with like hooks

1270
01:08:30,800 --> 01:08:34,559
Speaker 1: in their back and like it feels good to them,

1271
01:08:34,600 --> 01:08:37,360
Speaker 1: like there's like a release of endorphins. Like there's pain too,

1272
01:08:37,400 --> 01:08:39,880
Speaker 1: but like they they're not like screaming in agony the

1273
01:08:39,920 --> 01:08:43,000
Speaker 1: whole time, even though you would think they would be. Um,

1274
01:08:43,600 --> 01:08:49,160
Speaker 1: like there's yeah exactly. The fact that these people don't

1275
01:08:49,240 --> 01:08:52,000
Speaker 1: report pain or anything isn't weird and is part of

1276
01:08:52,040 --> 01:08:55,360
Speaker 1: like a long documented history of people experiencing temporary relief

1277
01:08:55,360 --> 01:08:57,759
Speaker 1: from faith, heaving and stuff like that. There's nothing mysterious

1278
01:08:57,800 --> 01:09:01,720
Speaker 1: about it. Um For decade, it's Pentecostal revivalist preachers have

1279
01:09:01,800 --> 01:09:04,000
Speaker 1: done things like prey over people with injured legs and

1280
01:09:04,000 --> 01:09:06,720
Speaker 1: then have them discard their crutches and dance around and

1281
01:09:06,760 --> 01:09:08,760
Speaker 1: The explanation for how this works is the same as

1282
01:09:08,760 --> 01:09:10,960
Speaker 1: the explanation for why if you throw your back out

1283
01:09:11,240 --> 01:09:13,599
Speaker 1: you might find yourself forgetting the pain during a moment

1284
01:09:13,640 --> 01:09:18,000
Speaker 1: of extreme danger or extreme excitement. Like, it's just sometimes

1285
01:09:18,400 --> 01:09:21,559
Speaker 1: our brains override our experience of pain. It happens. It's

1286
01:09:21,560 --> 01:09:24,599
Speaker 1: a thing that people do. Um, it's like those stories

1287
01:09:24,600 --> 01:09:28,040
Speaker 1: of women lifting cars off their babies. So, uh yeah,

1288
01:09:28,120 --> 01:09:31,280
Speaker 1: that's how Susan Casey uncritically reports on a healing session.

1289
01:09:31,320 --> 01:09:34,400
Speaker 1: Here's how a real journalist, Michael Usher, reports on a

1290
01:09:34,400 --> 01:09:37,479
Speaker 1: pretty much identical healing session. John of God is not

1291
01:09:37,560 --> 01:09:39,560
Speaker 1: a surgeon. He is not a trained doctor. Yet he

1292
01:09:39,640 --> 01:09:42,000
Speaker 1: is presented with a tray of medical instruments, scalpels, and

1293
01:09:42,040 --> 01:09:44,479
Speaker 1: all sorts of scissors. He takes a scalpel in scrapes eyes.

1294
01:09:44,520 --> 01:09:46,840
Speaker 1: He sticks knives and scalpels of some story sort down

1295
01:09:46,920 --> 01:09:48,880
Speaker 1: the back of people's throats, and he claims he is

1296
01:09:48,880 --> 01:09:51,000
Speaker 1: getting to tumors. He claims he's getting to the root

1297
01:09:51,000 --> 01:09:53,280
Speaker 1: of people's illnesses. He claims he is getting to what

1298
01:09:53,360 --> 01:09:55,479
Speaker 1: makes people iller sick. None of it has done with

1299
01:09:55,479 --> 01:09:57,400
Speaker 1: an anesthetic, and you don't even know if what he's

1300
01:09:57,439 --> 01:10:05,519
Speaker 1: using as sterile. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that feels about right.

1301
01:10:06,120 --> 01:10:08,839
Speaker 1: A large part of why John of God's magic seems

1302
01:10:08,880 --> 01:10:10,639
Speaker 1: to work is the fact that he performs it all

1303
01:10:10,640 --> 01:10:12,760
Speaker 1: in public, among and in front of a large and

1304
01:10:12,840 --> 01:10:15,719
Speaker 1: enthusiastic crowd of true believers, many of whom also happened

1305
01:10:15,760 --> 01:10:18,080
Speaker 1: to be desperately ill. John tells them that they can

1306
01:10:18,120 --> 01:10:20,759
Speaker 1: all help fuel his work and heal themselves by sitting

1307
01:10:20,760 --> 01:10:23,439
Speaker 1: in the current and basically meditating for hours while he

1308
01:10:23,479 --> 01:10:26,360
Speaker 1: does his thing. As Susan Casey writes, on any given day,

1309
01:10:26,400 --> 01:10:29,519
Speaker 1: maybe four people form the current, spelunking so deeply into

1310
01:10:29,560 --> 01:10:31,639
Speaker 1: their interior realms that they might well be a sleeper

1311
01:10:31,640 --> 01:10:34,120
Speaker 1: and esthetized. While doing so. They were framed from opening

1312
01:10:34,120 --> 01:10:36,240
Speaker 1: their eyes or crossing their arms or legs. These things,

1313
01:10:36,240 --> 01:10:37,920
Speaker 1: they are told, cut off the flow of energy as

1314
01:10:37,960 --> 01:10:46,960
Speaker 1: surely as would kinking a hose. So that way. Yeah,

1315
01:10:47,080 --> 01:10:49,920
Speaker 1: I'm if I'm throwing a lot of shade on Susan

1316
01:10:50,000 --> 01:10:52,880
Speaker 1: Casey for her bad article here, it's because her choice

1317
01:10:52,920 --> 01:10:55,200
Speaker 1: to platform John of God with no critical thinking or

1318
01:10:55,200 --> 01:10:58,120
Speaker 1: even an attempted examination, brought his line of bullshit to

1319
01:10:58,160 --> 01:11:00,719
Speaker 1: the eyes and ears of millions of vulnerable be Oprah

1320
01:11:00,760 --> 01:11:03,599
Speaker 1: Winfrey had her on her show in two thousand ten UM,

1321
01:11:03,640 --> 01:11:05,840
Speaker 1: and one of the millions of women who watched that

1322
01:11:05,880 --> 01:11:09,880
Speaker 1: episode was a Dutch choreographer named Zahira Lenik Line Key

1323
01:11:10,280 --> 01:11:14,400
Speaker 1: mouse Um. She suffered from sexual trauma, and Winfrey's episode

1324
01:11:14,439 --> 01:11:17,000
Speaker 1: Do You Believe In Miracles convinced her that medium John

1325
01:11:17,000 --> 01:11:19,719
Speaker 1: could heal her. She waited in line twice to receive

1326
01:11:19,760 --> 01:11:22,439
Speaker 1: his healing after traveling to Brazil. On her first visit,

1327
01:11:22,479 --> 01:11:24,559
Speaker 1: he prescribed to some of his HERB pills. When those

1328
01:11:24,560 --> 01:11:26,599
Speaker 1: didn't do the trick, she went back and he offered

1329
01:11:26,600 --> 01:11:30,280
Speaker 1: her a spiritual cleansing and a rare private session. From

1330
01:11:30,320 --> 01:11:33,120
Speaker 1: the Washington Post quote, She waited until everyone in line

1331
01:11:33,120 --> 01:11:35,559
Speaker 1: had their turns until finally she was alone and John

1332
01:11:35,560 --> 01:11:37,840
Speaker 1: of God invited her into his office and then into

1333
01:11:37,960 --> 01:11:40,559
Speaker 1: his bathroom. That's where Mos says he raped her, all

1334
01:11:40,600 --> 01:11:43,880
Speaker 1: while leading her to believe it was part of her healing. Now,

1335
01:11:44,080 --> 01:11:47,120
Speaker 1: Mos was one of hundreds and perhaps thousands of rape

1336
01:11:47,160 --> 01:11:50,559
Speaker 1: victims of John of God. And I want to end

1337
01:11:50,560 --> 01:11:52,080
Speaker 1: on this note to to get to the the point of,

1338
01:11:52,120 --> 01:11:54,880
Speaker 1: like what's really happened here, which is that an American

1339
01:11:55,040 --> 01:12:00,639
Speaker 1: industry based on uncritically looking at spiritual healer's funneled victims

1340
01:12:00,680 --> 01:12:03,680
Speaker 1: into this guy's hands and allowed him to achieve a

1341
01:12:03,760 --> 01:12:07,439
Speaker 1: level of influence and and basically like built a spider

1342
01:12:07,439 --> 01:12:11,200
Speaker 1: web for this fucking spider of a man. Um. So

1343
01:12:11,760 --> 01:12:13,840
Speaker 1: we're gonna continue the story of John of God in

1344
01:12:13,880 --> 01:12:16,519
Speaker 1: part two, but right now we're going to continue the

1345
01:12:16,520 --> 01:12:24,000
Speaker 1: story of uh Andrew T of God's uh plug doubles.

1346
01:12:24,200 --> 01:12:28,080
Speaker 1: Oh ship, Uh you know, just go to the yours

1347
01:12:28,160 --> 01:12:32,479
Speaker 1: this racist podcast. Um, I meant andrew T. Last name

1348
01:12:32,520 --> 01:12:37,800
Speaker 1: is spelled t I everywhere. Uh yeah, that's it. That

1349
01:12:38,160 --> 01:12:41,559
Speaker 1: is it. Well, I'm Robert Evans. You can find me

1350
01:12:41,600 --> 01:12:44,200
Speaker 1: on the internet. Find the Bastards dot com. You can

1351
01:12:44,200 --> 01:12:46,920
Speaker 1: find me on Twitter at I right, okay, uh and

1352
01:12:47,040 --> 01:12:49,640
Speaker 1: if you want, I will just sort of rub a

1353
01:12:49,680 --> 01:12:52,479
Speaker 1: machette all over your eyes. It's gonna cost you, I

1354
01:12:52,479 --> 01:12:55,360
Speaker 1: don't know. Let's say I don't take any money, but

1355
01:12:55,520 --> 01:12:59,439
Speaker 1: we do ask for three thousand dollar donations to our

1356
01:12:59,520 --> 01:13:03,719
Speaker 1: our our medical center. So give me three thousand bucks

1357
01:13:03,720 --> 01:13:05,800
Speaker 1: and I'll fucking I'll rub a machete on whatever part

1358
01:13:05,840 --> 01:13:12,719
Speaker 1: of your body you want. That is a guarantee, absolute guarantee. Um,

1359
01:13:12,760 --> 01:13:14,720
Speaker 1: and I also have a podcast called The Women's War.

1360
01:13:15,160 --> 01:13:18,439
Speaker 1: It's upbeat. It tells you about how to how to

1361
01:13:20,439 --> 01:13:23,160
Speaker 1: make things that don't suck out of your society when

1362
01:13:23,240 --> 01:13:26,400
Speaker 1: it sucks, So maybe listen to that too. And um,

1363
01:13:26,439 --> 01:13:29,719
Speaker 1: I don't know, go in Christ and cut up people's eyes.

1364
01:13:30,479 --> 01:13:36,360
Speaker 1: Mm hmm yep, that's the podcast. Yeah, it is part

1365
01:13:36,479 --> 01:13:37,920
Speaker 1: part one of the podcasts.