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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Tutor Dixon Podcast. Today, we are going

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Speaker 1: to be talking about a really hard subject. I know

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Speaker 1: we've had some conversations about SSRIs and I think, you know,

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Speaker 1: we've gotten a massive amount of feedback on that. I

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Speaker 1: think that some people feel like they don't want to

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Speaker 1: hear this story about medications, and then there's other groups

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Speaker 1: that are wanting to say, my goodness, this happened to me.

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Speaker 1: It's really hard to talk about, and I'm so glad

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Speaker 1: I'm hearing it about someone else, so I know I'm

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Speaker 1: not alone in this fight. And I've had a lot

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Speaker 1: of people reach out to me and kind of say

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Speaker 1: I've experienced this. I've experienced this, and for me as

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Speaker 1: a mom, I want to continue talking about this subject

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Speaker 1: because I think so many people have made the decision

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Speaker 1: to either be on these medications or put their children

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Speaker 1: on these medications and not understanding the real outcome that

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Speaker 1: it can have the side effects that we can be

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Speaker 1: dealing with. And I've actually had other parents to reach

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Speaker 1: out to me and say, I listen to what you

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Speaker 1: said and what your guests were saying, and I've decided

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Speaker 1: to either come off of these medications myself or take

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Speaker 1: my children off of these medications. Our guest today approached

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Speaker 1: me and we kind of I think I told a

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Speaker 1: story about her because I had heard her story through

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Speaker 1: another doctor, and so graciously she agreed to come on.

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Speaker 1: I'm so glad today because we have Rosie Tilly with us.

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Speaker 1: She is not only someone who has suffered some of

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Speaker 1: these side effects, but she also formed her own network

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Speaker 1: of PSSD survivors, I guess I would say, and sufferers.

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Speaker 1: So thank you so much for coming on today to

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Speaker 1: talk about this.

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Speaker 2: Well, thanks so much for having me.

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Speaker 1: I really appreciate it, absolutely absolutely, So tell us a

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Speaker 1: little bit about your experience, because if I remember correctly,

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Speaker 1: it was doctor Joseph who was talking about your story

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Speaker 1: and saying, you know, there was you were a young woman.

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Speaker 1: You're obviously still a young woman when this happened, and

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Speaker 1: it was kind of stunning to you, and there was

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Speaker 1: sort of this uprising around you, people that were like,

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Speaker 1: this isn't happening.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I will try and keep my story as

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Speaker 2: brief as I can, But basically, in twenty twenty, when

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Speaker 2: all the COVID lockdowns and everything were happening, I went

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Speaker 2: through a really bad period just mentally. I went through

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Speaker 2: what I would kind of describe as like a depression

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Speaker 2: and anxiety, just a really really rough period mentally, and

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Speaker 2: I did what everyone is encouraged to do, which is

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Speaker 2: reach out or see your doctor all of that, and

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Speaker 2: I ended up getting put on lexapro. I was sent

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Speaker 2: to a psychiatrist and then he prescribed me lexapro. I

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Speaker 2: took the drug for four and a half months. Horrible

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Speaker 2: side effects on the drug, and to this day I

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Speaker 2: have had permanence, actual dysfunction, emotional blunting, just complete changes

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Speaker 2: to like my perception sensory experiences I've had. Thankfully, my

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Speaker 2: cognitive issues have improved a little bit over the years,

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Speaker 2: but for the last five years, I have, yeah, effectively

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Speaker 2: been chemically corustrated by this drug, which was something that

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Speaker 2: I was told would happen while you're on the drug,

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Speaker 2: but don't worry because once you stop taking it, everything

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Speaker 2: will go away, everything will go back to normal. But

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Speaker 2: that's not true. I stopped taking the drug on this

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Speaker 2: I remember the last pill I took was like half

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Speaker 2: tiny tablet on December seventh of twenty twenty, and it's

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Speaker 2: now we're in October of twenty twenty five and I

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Speaker 2: almost feel as if I've taken the drug this morning,

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Speaker 2: that's how strongly I'm still affected by these adverse effects.

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Speaker 2: It something I was never warned about. I would never

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Speaker 2: have taken it if I knew that it would persist

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Speaker 2: for half a decade, if not more, or even you know,

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Speaker 2: if people say it takes that long to come back. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I would never have gone down this about But yeah,

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Speaker 2: here I am.

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Speaker 1: So when you say they said it would happen only

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Speaker 1: while you were on the medication, did you think when

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Speaker 1: they said that they actually said you'll feel nothing, you'll

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Speaker 1: have these terrible sexual side effects, or was it like

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Speaker 1: you might have this, you might have this. Did they

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Speaker 1: explain what that could be or did they just say

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Speaker 1: sexual side effects?

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Speaker 2: I had to kind of it was quite strangely, when

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Speaker 2: I was first put on the medication, I was I

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Speaker 2: was given a very brief, one sentence warning about it.

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Speaker 2: So I guess it kind of like, you know, relieved

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Speaker 2: any anxiety I had about taking the medication. But it

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Speaker 2: was only after maybe a month of being on it

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Speaker 2: and I came back to the psychiatrist and I literally

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Speaker 2: said to him, these side effects are out of control,

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Speaker 2: Like I can't like this is not help me, essentially,

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Speaker 2: and that's when he was like, oh no, you know

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Speaker 2: all of these these effects is usually. He tried to

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Speaker 2: convince me that if I stay on the medication long enough,

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Speaker 2: my body will adjust to the medication and the side

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Speaker 2: effects will go away. And he even up to the

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Speaker 2: dose and I just was completely you know, I was

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Speaker 2: sitting there in his office. He had all his like

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Speaker 2: academic accolades on his walls. I was just like, this

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Speaker 2: guy is the guru, Like he obviously knows what he's doing.

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Speaker 2: But I later found out he clearly didn't, because I'm

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Speaker 2: here with all these art effects years later. But I

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Speaker 2: was I was never really told how severe this could be.

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Speaker 2: It's not just like a normal it's not like a

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Speaker 2: normal sexual dysfunction. It's like a complete chemical castration. And

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Speaker 2: I was never warned in any capacity that that's what

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Speaker 2: this would be. And you say it persist.

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Speaker 1: When you say chemical castration, what is that? YEA, what

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Speaker 1: does that mean to us? Does that mean that you

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Speaker 1: just it's almost a said that you have no desire

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Speaker 1: at all, you cannot have a relationship.

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Speaker 2: It's so much more than that. It's my body physiologically

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Speaker 2: is no longer able to be sexually aroused in any form. Literally,

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Speaker 2: the way I describe it is like if you consider

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Speaker 2: your own libido and sexual arousal like a light switch

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Speaker 2: going on. It's almost like someone's pulled the plug out

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Speaker 2: of the wall and you turn the switch on at

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Speaker 2: the wall and nothing happens to the light. So that's

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Speaker 2: essentially what's happened to my body. It's like my entire

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Speaker 2: nervous system has been I don't know, like someone stuck

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Speaker 2: a fork in a PowerPoint and it's just completely broken.

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Speaker 2: I'm unable to feel anything like what I used to

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Speaker 2: be able to feel prior to taking this medication. And obviously,

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Speaker 2: like this is how ongoing affects to me, like mentally, physically, personally. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: it's so much more severe than not having a libido.

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Speaker 2: But I know for some people with PSSD, they might

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Speaker 2: their most severe symptom is they might have a missing libido.

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Speaker 2: But it's not just like, oh, I don't feel like

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Speaker 2: having sex right now, it's I am unable to feel

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Speaker 2: like even if I try, and if I don't feel

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Speaker 2: like this and I'm trying to feel something, I literally

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Speaker 2: am unable to feel anything. So it's a lot more

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Speaker 2: severe than just a lowered libido. I would almost argue

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Speaker 2: that it would be no libido whatsoever. You essentially become

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Speaker 2: completely asexual.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to insult you, but it almost sounds

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Speaker 1: like brain damage, Like it's like your brain doesn't function

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Speaker 1: in that area.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, I've thought long and hard about what this

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Speaker 2: could be. I'm like, is this some form of brain damage?

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Speaker 2: Is there something that, like my neurons in my spine

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Speaker 2: no longer connect to my brain, Like what is going on?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: They don't know.

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Speaker 1: Essentially, I can't even I can't fathom that you have

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Speaker 1: a drug like this that goes to so many people,

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Speaker 1: and I would argue that SSRIs are probably some of

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Speaker 1: the most prescribed medications out there that it could chemically

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Speaker 1: castrate a person, and a young person, I mean any

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Speaker 1: age person that it could chemically castrate you, and they

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Speaker 1: have no responsibility to even look into how it's happening

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Speaker 1: or have an explanation.

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Speaker 2: I think that's one of my biggest learnings from this

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Speaker 2: entire experience is realizing that the studies for these drugs

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Speaker 2: only ran for a maximum of up to twelve weeks

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Speaker 2: most of them, and once the study is finished, these

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Speaker 2: companies are not required by law at all to evaluate

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Speaker 2: what side effects did you experience during having the medication

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Speaker 2: during the treatment, and they're not required to follow you

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Speaker 2: up six months later to months later. Hey, Rosie, I

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Speaker 2: saw during this clinical trial that you experience sexual dysfunction.

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Speaker 2: It's been six months since you've stopped it, do you

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Speaker 2: still have these effects? And I feel like, because there's

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Speaker 2: all these little loopholes where they don't have to do this,

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Speaker 2: they're not going to do it. So when you actually

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Speaker 2: look at the research, the sexual side effects of SSRIs

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Speaker 2: have not been studied in any capacity in the long term.

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Speaker 2: The only people that have studied this. It seems kind

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Speaker 2: of bizarre, right, because you've got so many people that

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Speaker 2: take these drugs for so long, we put children on them.

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Speaker 2: You know, I was twenty when this happened to me.

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Speaker 2: I was an adult. I essentially consented to this. It

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Speaker 2: was uninformed consent, but I consented. Like there are a

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Speaker 2: lot of people putting their kids on these medications as

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Speaker 2: young as I've seen as young as eight years old

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Speaker 2: in the US. I'm not sure about it Australia, but

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Speaker 2: they genuinely don't realize that we have no idea if

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Speaker 2: these drugs are well, they are obviously affecting people long

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Speaker 2: term sexually, Like yeah, exactly, but we just there's never

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Speaker 2: I remember Audrey that is a she's a long time

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Speaker 2: sufferer of PSC. I think she got this in the

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Speaker 2: nineties and she's yeah, she's now in the latest stage

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Speaker 2: of her life and it's just affected her for years.

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Speaker 2: But she said this quote and it was something to

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Speaker 2: the effective. You know, no study has ever followed the

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Speaker 2: course of ssri I induced sexual dysfunction after a patient

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Speaker 2: has stopped taking the medication to evaluate when and to

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Speaker 2: what degree the side effects actually resolve. So we know

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Speaker 2: that people get the side effects whilst taking the drug,

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Speaker 2: and the pharmaceutical companies list that, but they do not

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Speaker 2: tell you how long it could last for a how

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Speaker 2: severe it could be. I mean, this is in the

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Speaker 2: this is in the DSM, Like this isn't the Diagnostic

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Speaker 2: and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders. It says that ssri

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Speaker 2: I induced sexual dysfunction may persist after stopping in the agent.

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Speaker 2: They just don't tell you.

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Speaker 1: That's insane. That's so insane to think that you could

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Speaker 1: put your own child, you could castrate your own child

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Speaker 1: and not know. And I don't you know when when

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Speaker 1: my daughter went into we took her to a therapist

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Speaker 1: and they immediately, well i would say within a month,

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Speaker 1: said that she has to be on one of these medications.

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Speaker 1: And I said, absolutely not, no way, there's no way.

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Speaker 1: And the pediatrician was like, oh, You've got to see

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Speaker 1: a psychiatrist. There's really no reason not to. And there

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Speaker 1: was no way. I was not going to put my

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Speaker 1: kid on a medication because she was anxious about washing

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Speaker 1: her hands at school. I'm like, but that was it.

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Speaker 1: I mean, that's to me, that's the crazy part about it.

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Speaker 1: This was a temporary phase that she had to get through.

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Speaker 1: But we put these we just immediately say we're going

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Speaker 1: to medicate. We're going to medicate, We're going to medicate

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Speaker 1: on so many things and that. And now, you know,

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Speaker 1: as I've grown as a parent, as I've got and

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Speaker 1: older as a parent, and I've seen my four kids

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Speaker 1: go through these different phases, I've seen that there are

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Speaker 1: there are hills and valleys like anything else, and there

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Speaker 1: are phases that we grow out of, and there are

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Speaker 1: phases that last longer than others. And I've seen this

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Speaker 1: with you know, I have girls, but I've seen this

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Speaker 1: with families that have boys. You know, boys are very rambunctious.

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Speaker 1: They're different than my girls. I can tell you They're

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Speaker 1: different and they don't pay attention to class, and it's

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Speaker 1: like we've got to I've even had friends that have

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Speaker 1: had teachers beg the parents, please medicate your kid. This

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Speaker 1: is like, too many people think this is normal today

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Speaker 1: to just take a medication. Your situation was you said

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Speaker 1: during COVID Yeah, yeah, And I think that was just

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Speaker 1: a dark period for so many people. And that was

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Speaker 1: kind of a time when we heard that women in

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Speaker 1: general were I think three times more likely than a

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Speaker 1: man to be put on an antidepressant during that time.

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Speaker 1: So I wonder how many of the people that were

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Speaker 1: in high school and in college at that age. Those

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Speaker 1: are hard ages for women in general. I think they're

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Speaker 1: just you know, we're very nasty to one another. It's

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Speaker 1: hard times to get through. And I wonder how many

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Speaker 1: women during that period were put on these And I

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Speaker 1: have to say that my little experience with it has

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Speaker 1: been only for the doctor to say there could be

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Speaker 1: a sexual side effect, and you know, no explanation of

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Speaker 1: what a sexual side effect is.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I guess there's been a lot of research

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Speaker 2: into psc the last well, not a lot of research

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Speaker 2: at all, but there was a study that was done

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Speaker 2: by doctor Goldstein and his team, which is still yet

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Speaker 2: to be published. We have a couple of clips on

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Speaker 2: our Twitter, some of the one of the doctors, one

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Speaker 2: of the interventional radiologists who's done kind of high powered

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Speaker 2: ultrasounds on like pen le tissue of men that have

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Speaker 2: PSSD and have discovered severe fibrosis in their entire penis

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Speaker 2: from taking those drugs. Yes, and they have no other

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Speaker 2: variable that could have possibly caused this. Like these are young,

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Speaker 2: healthy men under the age of I think it was

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Speaker 2: either thirty five or under the age of thirty. They

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Speaker 2: have no past history of you know, any kind of

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Speaker 2: periphile vascular disease, diabetes, smoking, nothing, they have nothing. They

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Speaker 2: just all simultaneously reported having severe sexual symptoms. And also,

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Speaker 2: as we're finding, as more researchers discovering, there's actual damage

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Speaker 2: that has been done to their physical body, to their

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Speaker 2: physical structures, which is something that's quite alarming because I

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Speaker 2: guess no, the thing that irks me is that no

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Speaker 2: one's being told this. Yes, like That's what I just

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Speaker 2: can't understand. You know, they might some people that would

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Speaker 2: still agree to take the medication if they were told

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Speaker 2: I don't know who would, to be honest with, Maybe

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Speaker 2: there might be some, but I think it's really wrong

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Speaker 2: when you have like young people and teenagers like we have.

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Speaker 2: I just want to say, like in the PSST community,

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Speaker 2: it is literally hell on earth. Like if you wanted

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Speaker 2: to describe how you would see what some people go

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Speaker 2: through on there. They lose everything, Like people lose their family,

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Speaker 2: they lose their marriage, they lose their jobs, and eventually

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Speaker 2: a lot of people lose their lives.

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Speaker 1: And the family around them is also losing. I mean

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Speaker 1: this is to me. I think this is the destruction

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Speaker 1: of interpersonal relationships, and I think it has caused so

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Speaker 1: much more damage than we even know. I mean, I'm

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Speaker 1: so glad that you've I'm not glad that you've gone

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Speaker 1: through this. I'm so glad that you are fighting this

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Speaker 1: and you've created this site for people to go to,

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Speaker 1: because it's kind of like a suffer and shame kind

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Speaker 1: of thing because we're not allowed, I think we're not

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Speaker 1: allowed to ever question mental health help. If you come

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Speaker 1: out and you say I don't. I don't think these

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Speaker 1: medications work. It's like, oh, you don't deal with this,

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Speaker 1: you don't know, you don't get to say this. And

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Speaker 1: I think that for those of us who have been

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Speaker 1: on the outside and maybe seeing relatives who have gone

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Speaker 1: through this and your you know, I can tell you

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Speaker 1: my experience is to look at someone and go, I

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Speaker 1: don't I don't even know who you are anymore, because

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Speaker 1: I think there is that emotional blunting that's there's that

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Speaker 1: inability to feel like, Oh, they need a hug right now,

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Speaker 1: I should hug them. There's like there, it's like there's

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Speaker 1: a like you said, the switch is off. There's something missing.

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Speaker 1: So when you talk about the sexual side effects, there

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Speaker 1: are other side effects as well, where you feel like

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Speaker 1: if you're on the if you're the person who loves

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Speaker 1: that person, you feel shut out. What is it like

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Speaker 1: to be the person in that position? What are some

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Speaker 1: of the stories you've heard of that emotional blunting and

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Speaker 1: an inability to connect?

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Speaker 2: Well when I hear like, I think a lot of

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Speaker 2: people from the community try and also let people know

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Speaker 2: that it's not just the sexual symptoms that maybe would

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Speaker 2: drive from to a point of suicide. Like it seems

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Speaker 2: insane to me to even say this, but I actually

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Speaker 2: have spoken with maybe six people over the course of

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Speaker 2: the last couple of years in the community. Six people

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Speaker 2: that I have like messaged online and had multiple conversations

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Speaker 2: with that I know that have gone on to commit

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Speaker 2: suicide because of this, Like they're gone now, and like

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Speaker 2: it's it's insane to me that this problem is still

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Speaker 2: so downplate, like you're you know, if you've removed, if

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Speaker 2: you remove like you know, happiness and pleasure and sex

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Speaker 2: and love and joy and excitement, Like what what is left?

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Speaker 2: Like what? Like these are not trivial things, like this

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Speaker 2: is what we are alive for. And I just feel

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Speaker 2: like human experience exactly. And if it's if it's completely

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Speaker 2: ruined for someone permanently, well they feel like, you know,

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Speaker 2: that they've got nothing to live for a lot of

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Speaker 2: people feel like so betrayed by the wholecare system. That also,

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Speaker 2: the fact that if this problem is not being taken

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Speaker 2: seriously sends a message to all these people that your

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Speaker 2: lives are really not of any value. And I think

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Speaker 2: that's what kind of drives people over the edge in

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Speaker 2: the end. And I've seen this happen like to people.

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Speaker 2: I know a couple of people I was friends with

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Speaker 2: multiple times, and I do want to say as well,

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Speaker 2: I know this is like quite haunting, but one of

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Speaker 2: the guys that I was really good friends with, he

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Speaker 2: was living in Switzerland at the time, but I have

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Speaker 2: messages on my phone from him of him messaging me saying,

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Speaker 2: if I killed myself because of this, sorry, I notice

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Speaker 2: is like really graphic, but no ill if I need

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Speaker 2: to hear, Yeah, I think so too. He said, if

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Speaker 2: I killed myself because of this, people are going to

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Speaker 2: say he had mental health issues, he was depressed, blah

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Speaker 2: blah blah. I couldn't even kill myself because of this.

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Speaker 2: And he has now committed suicide because of this. And

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Speaker 2: I have all these messages from him, like I could.

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Speaker 2: I wouldn't show everyone, but I could if I needed to.

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Speaker 2: And you know, when I went on his like Instagram

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Speaker 2: page and I saw his family and friends posting stuff

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Speaker 2: like one of his friends said, oh, you know, he

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Speaker 2: always struggled with his mental health. And I just want

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Speaker 2: to say, I really feel like a lot of these

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Speaker 2: long term side effects from the drugs are being misattributed

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Speaker 2: as mental health conditions when a lot of it might

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Speaker 2: actually be long term harm that's come from the drug.

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Speaker 1: Hey stick around. We have more coming up with Rosy Tilly.

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Speaker 3: It's veteran owned and proudly made in the USA. Now

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Speaker 3: stick around. We've got more these doctors that have come

370
00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:53,919
Speaker 3: out and spoken against this. They've said, look, we have

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Speaker 3: the highest number of antidepressants that we've ever prescribed. We

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Speaker 3: are the most medicated society that we have ever been,

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Speaker 3: and we still have one of the highest suicide rates.

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Speaker 3: Why would that be if these are antidepressants.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think the word antidepressant is also you know,

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Speaker 2: like it's a really deceiving marketing tool to call this

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Speaker 2: particular drug an antidepressant. I'm pretty sure the sexual like

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Speaker 2: actually erasing someone's sexuality or causing anti libedianal effects is

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Speaker 2: the most what's the word I'm looking for, like common.

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Speaker 1: Depressant, I mean it's a depressant.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's it's like basically, yeah, the anti libedial

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Speaker 2: effects are the most common reaction to these medications. So

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Speaker 2: I think if these weren't called antidepressants and they were

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Speaker 2: called libido blocking drugs, I don't think people would have

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Speaker 2: the same kind of response to them.

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Speaker 1: You No, definitely not if that were because who are

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Speaker 1: I mean? That to me is so this is the crisis.

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Speaker 1: And I talk about this because I really do believe

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Speaker 1: that to have that human experience and to be able

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Speaker 1: to have a partner that is a true partner. Your

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Speaker 1: partner needs that and you need that. That is a

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Speaker 1: part of a healthy relationship is to be able to

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Speaker 1: have sex. And it is to me a absolute crisis

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Speaker 1: that nobody wants because it's taboo. Right, we don't talk

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Speaker 1: about sex. I mean, we don't talk about the fact

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Speaker 1: that we think it's important in marriages. Too often it

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Speaker 1: becomes goes by the wayside and you see the marriage

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Speaker 1: break up, and we don't talk about that either. It's like,

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Speaker 1: this is a subject that is hard to talk about.

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Speaker 1: It is hard to talk about the fact that people

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Speaker 1: want to have sex, they should be able to have sex.

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Speaker 1: And you question, so you've brought up so many good

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Speaker 1: points because here where you're telling me, you know, you

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Speaker 1: get to this point where you're completely a sexual and

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Speaker 1: that is absolutely heartbreaking. And you were twenty you knew

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Speaker 1: the difference between having a desire for sex and now

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Speaker 1: what you are dealing with today, these horrible side effects.

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Speaker 1: What about these young kids who are now getting to

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Speaker 1: their teenage years where their friends are all hyper sexual.

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Speaker 1: You know, you're in there. You got your hormones going,

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Speaker 1: You're interested in boys and girls and they don't feel anything.

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Speaker 1: I mean, this could really be causing a massive collision

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Speaker 1: in culture, in life, in the human experience.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm fully of the assumption that I really do

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Speaker 2: believe that a lot of people that report being asexual

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Speaker 2: or having sexuality that differs from the norm might actually

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Speaker 2: just be suffering from a long term side effect from

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Speaker 2: a drug and have no idea about it because they're

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Speaker 2: not being told like if you. There's so many people

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Speaker 2: that have reached out to us personally saying, oh my god,

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Speaker 2: I have struggled with this for the most part of

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Speaker 2: my life and I never realized that it came from

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Speaker 2: the drug. And there's just a year's worth of suffering,

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Speaker 2: and I've only just pieced together that I never actually

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Speaker 2: regained my sexuality after taking that SSRI. I thought that

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Speaker 2: it kind of just went away on its own during

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Speaker 2: you know, some random stage of puberty. So it is

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Speaker 2: it is really insane to me that this isn't being

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Speaker 2: further investigated. And I see so many posts on Twitter

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Speaker 2: of you know, millennials and gen z having less sex

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Speaker 2: than ever, but they're not realizing that, like the downfall

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Speaker 2: in sexual behavior with millennials and gen Z basically mirrors

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Speaker 2: the explosion of SSRI prescriptions. So like these drugs are

434
00:24:42,760 --> 00:24:47,040
Speaker 2: literally used for chemical carscetration. In some jurisdictions they give

435
00:24:47,080 --> 00:24:51,440
Speaker 2: them two pedophiles to block their libido. There are articles

436
00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:54,119
Speaker 2: everywhere about this like this is it's just that the

437
00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:56,520
Speaker 2: public don't know actually know about it. And we give

438
00:24:56,560 --> 00:24:59,959
Speaker 2: these drugs to children and in the same breath, like

439
00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:02,600
Speaker 2: you know, these are all of these effects that I've

440
00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:05,080
Speaker 2: just talked about. Partly the reason why pubity block is

441
00:25:05,080 --> 00:25:10,000
Speaker 2: a banned in the UK, the exact same justification, and

442
00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:12,000
Speaker 2: and you know, we just give it out with like

443
00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:12,520
Speaker 2: it's nothing.

444
00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:15,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it seems so. I mean, now there's I

445
00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:19,040
Speaker 1: feel like there's actually been serious research on that because

446
00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:21,600
Speaker 1: there's been so much drama about it. That's why I

447
00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:24,199
Speaker 1: want to talk about this because I think that the

448
00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:26,040
Speaker 1: more you talk about it, the more you kind of

449
00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:28,840
Speaker 1: force those pharmaceutical companies and what you were saying about

450
00:25:28,880 --> 00:25:32,480
Speaker 1: them testing them for twelve weeks. They're testing while you're

451
00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:34,800
Speaker 1: on the drug. Okay, this is what's happening in these

452
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:38,320
Speaker 1: twelve weeks. They're not following up afterward to say, wow,

453
00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:40,719
Speaker 1: those side effects that they had during the twelve weeks,

454
00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:44,480
Speaker 1: they stayed, these stayed, these went away. There's no there

455
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:47,639
Speaker 1: doesn't seem to be any research on that. To me,

456
00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:53,000
Speaker 1: that's devastating. I look at life as the experience of life.

457
00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:56,119
Speaker 1: I have that from the standpoint of being a mom,

458
00:25:56,880 --> 00:25:59,600
Speaker 1: being married, having kids, all of these things. And I

459
00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:04,440
Speaker 1: think in life we have some really critical needs. Obviously,

460
00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:06,280
Speaker 1: we have to have food, we have to have water.

461
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:10,080
Speaker 1: But I think that you absolutely have to have affection.

462
00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:13,520
Speaker 1: You have to have hugs. You know, as kids, you

463
00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:15,560
Speaker 1: have to know that your mom and dad love you.

464
00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:19,200
Speaker 1: There has to be affection there. And in a marriage.

465
00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:21,600
Speaker 1: I know, I just keep beating this drum, but I

466
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:26,760
Speaker 1: cannot accept the fact that you can as a pharmaceutical company.

467
00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:29,160
Speaker 1: I think this is as big as the opioid crisis.

468
00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:32,159
Speaker 1: To say that you have castrated people and you have

469
00:26:32,280 --> 00:26:36,000
Speaker 1: taken away their ability to feel their sexual partner, to

470
00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:40,480
Speaker 1: feel that amazing connection between you and another person. That

471
00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:41,439
Speaker 1: is criminal.

472
00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:45,880
Speaker 2: But it's the thing that it is criminal because there

473
00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:49,000
Speaker 2: was no warning, Like telling someone that you're going to

474
00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:53,239
Speaker 2: have a temporary effect is very different to having this

475
00:26:53,320 --> 00:26:55,280
Speaker 2: for the rest of your life. You know, when women

476
00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:57,040
Speaker 2: going to have a baby, you might have a spinal

477
00:26:57,080 --> 00:27:00,879
Speaker 2: block if you have like a say section baby, and

478
00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:03,480
Speaker 2: they'll put an anesthetic into your spine and you'll be

479
00:27:03,560 --> 00:27:05,359
Speaker 2: numb and you won't be able to walk for four hours.

480
00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:07,199
Speaker 2: And you just be like, oh, that's fine, you know

481
00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:11,199
Speaker 2: I need this. But if they turned around and said, oh,

482
00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:13,119
Speaker 2: by the way, you won't be able to walk ever again.

483
00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:17,359
Speaker 2: It's very different to having like a temporary effect, like

484
00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:23,080
Speaker 2: once it transitions into a permanent change, it's completely life changing.

485
00:27:23,119 --> 00:27:26,640
Speaker 2: Like this has been completely life changing for me. And

486
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:29,880
Speaker 2: you know there's people just not even being told. I mean,

487
00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:33,119
Speaker 2: there's no warnings for this. The FDA have not released

488
00:27:33,119 --> 00:27:36,240
Speaker 2: any warnings despite being asked. I remember we found a document,

489
00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:40,639
Speaker 2: a random document in twenty eleven of Eli Lilly reaching

490
00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:43,600
Speaker 2: out to the FDA telling them that they need to

491
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:49,000
Speaker 2: update their warning leaflets, like for the FDA warning leaflets

492
00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:53,080
Speaker 2: for prozac, which is really a weird timing. Like myself

493
00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:55,000
Speaker 2: and the others we've kind of said why twenty eleven,

494
00:27:55,080 --> 00:27:57,400
Speaker 2: Like the drugs were released almost twenty years prior to that.

495
00:27:58,119 --> 00:28:00,919
Speaker 2: It's almost like they've known this and it's kept it

496
00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:02,840
Speaker 2: under wraps, and they're just like, hey, can you actually

497
00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:05,240
Speaker 2: have the warning, like, but they're not letting the public

498
00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:10,280
Speaker 2: know any of this information, which is really wrong. We found,

499
00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:14,600
Speaker 2: you know, there was testicular toxicity in rats when they

500
00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:17,760
Speaker 2: first on juvenile rats, when they first tested this in Europe,

501
00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:19,840
Speaker 2: which was there was a lot of ambivalence of whether

502
00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:25,600
Speaker 2: or not they actually wanted to accept SSRIs, you know,

503
00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:30,320
Speaker 2: as part of the EMA, the European Medicines Agency. They

504
00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:33,920
Speaker 2: weren't sure, if you know, using SSRIs for children was ethical.

505
00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:36,520
Speaker 2: Like we have found internal emails and stuff like this.

506
00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:40,640
Speaker 2: It's insane because now like there's I'm pretty sure twenty

507
00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:43,480
Speaker 2: percent of the female adult population is on these drugs.

508
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:46,320
Speaker 2: I don't know what percentages of children. But I think

509
00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:49,600
Speaker 2: if people knew that the side effects I hate calling

510
00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:52,120
Speaker 2: them side effects because that kind of almost makes people

511
00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:55,920
Speaker 2: think that it's going to go away. But the permanent effects, yeah,

512
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:58,600
Speaker 2: the adverse effects of these drugs could be permanent. I

513
00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:00,800
Speaker 2: don't think people would touch them or I think people

514
00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:02,440
Speaker 2: would be a lot more cautious.

515
00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:04,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't even think that a lot of doctors

516
00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:07,600
Speaker 1: believe that that's the case. I've heard people who have

517
00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:10,600
Speaker 1: gone to their doctor and said, I have these side effects,

518
00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:13,160
Speaker 1: and they say, oh, that's no, that's not that's not

519
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:15,400
Speaker 1: from the drug, that's not what the well, that's the

520
00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:17,880
Speaker 1: only change in my life. This is what I have,

521
00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:22,120
Speaker 1: these medications I'm taking, and this is happening on this medication.

522
00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:25,440
Speaker 1: And they have been adamant, No, it's no, you've got

523
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:27,560
Speaker 1: to stay on and even your experience. No, you've got

524
00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 1: to increase it. If you increase it, that'll be better.

525
00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:32,880
Speaker 1: I mean they almost treated you like you were nuts

526
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:34,280
Speaker 1: for seeing this was a problem.

527
00:29:34,440 --> 00:29:38,120
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. At one point, I was having so many

528
00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:42,000
Speaker 2: issues at home to the point that I couldn't even

529
00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:43,880
Speaker 2: live with my own family because I was just so

530
00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:47,400
Speaker 2: angry that this happened to me, and no one actually

531
00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:50,120
Speaker 2: knew what I was going through. Like everyone was just saying, like,

532
00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:53,040
Speaker 2: you're you need to get over this kind of because

533
00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:55,920
Speaker 2: they didn't know that I love my family, like I

534
00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:58,840
Speaker 2: just put that out there, but like they just literally

535
00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:02,920
Speaker 2: did not know that. It wasn't me that was insane.

536
00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:05,880
Speaker 2: It was these companies were basically gaslighting me and saying, oh, no,

537
00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:09,760
Speaker 2: our product doesn't do that, you know, So they made

538
00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:13,600
Speaker 2: me feel like I was all alone for the longest time. Anyway,

539
00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:16,640
Speaker 2: I ended up having to go to this like youth

540
00:30:16,720 --> 00:30:22,680
Speaker 2: mental health. It was like a youth mental health clinic organization.

541
00:30:22,680 --> 00:30:24,479
Speaker 2: I don't even know what you call it. We had

542
00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:28,280
Speaker 2: like a family intervention in twenty twenty one after this happened,

543
00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:29,800
Speaker 2: after like I had come off the job because it

544
00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:32,360
Speaker 2: was so bad. The side effects went going away, and

545
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:35,240
Speaker 2: I remember rationally presenting to him all this information, and

546
00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:39,520
Speaker 2: the psychiatrist like it's almost laughable to look back at now,

547
00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:44,000
Speaker 2: but literally sectioned me so that I was delusional and

548
00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:47,960
Speaker 2: basically put me involuntarily into mental health care. And on

549
00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:51,480
Speaker 2: all of my documents he wrote that I have firm

550
00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:53,640
Speaker 2: one of the quotes, it was one of my favorite ones.

551
00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:57,680
Speaker 2: He said that I have firm, fixed delusional beliefs that

552
00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:02,200
Speaker 2: the medication causes side effects, causing side effects. That's something

553
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:05,320
Speaker 2: like it just it's such an oxymoron because it's like

554
00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:08,640
Speaker 2: writing she has a firm, fixed delusional belief that the

555
00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:13,200
Speaker 2: pope is Catholic, Like the drugs do cause the side effects.

556
00:31:13,240 --> 00:31:16,240
Speaker 2: It's still a delusion, and who are these people to

557
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:20,520
Speaker 2: like to even say that, Like, it just became more

558
00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:22,680
Speaker 2: and more obvious and more time I spent around this.

559
00:31:23,120 --> 00:31:25,200
Speaker 2: Luckily I didn't have to take anything in the end,

560
00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:29,160
Speaker 2: and I actually managed to rationalize with a different doctor

561
00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:32,080
Speaker 2: and explain to her, this might sound insane, but this

562
00:31:32,160 --> 00:31:34,320
Speaker 2: is what I've been going through. It was partly because

563
00:31:34,360 --> 00:31:36,959
Speaker 2: I asked. At the time, I inquired about the possibility

564
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:39,160
Speaker 2: of taking what I was told would be a different

565
00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:43,120
Speaker 2: drug called be Appropriate that it supposedly reverses PSSC. I

566
00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:45,160
Speaker 2: never ended up taking it or anything, but I remember

567
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:47,959
Speaker 2: asking the psychiatrist about it and she had no idea.

568
00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:51,360
Speaker 2: But I think they just thought I was insane because

569
00:31:51,880 --> 00:31:54,760
Speaker 2: they were like, where is she getting this information from.

570
00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:57,920
Speaker 2: In the end, I managed I didn't have to take anything,

571
00:31:57,960 --> 00:31:59,800
Speaker 2: and I said, you know, can I go home? And

572
00:32:00,280 --> 00:32:03,160
Speaker 2: they said, yeah, that's okay. But like, what they did

573
00:32:03,280 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 2: was just so wrong, and you could just tell that

574
00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:08,800
Speaker 2: the people that had no idea what they were doing,

575
00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:13,040
Speaker 2: Like just it completely undermines my confidence in the system

576
00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:15,640
Speaker 2: because I'm just like, if you're the experts and you

577
00:32:15,680 --> 00:32:16,960
Speaker 2: don't know what you're doing.

578
00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:20,520
Speaker 1: What there's a radical defense of these pharmaceutical companies. That's

579
00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:25,600
Speaker 1: the creasy. There's a radical defense of them. Yeah, so

580
00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:28,360
Speaker 1: you you said that there was a drug that they

581
00:32:28,400 --> 00:32:30,880
Speaker 1: said could reverse have you heard of anybody trained to

582
00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:34,080
Speaker 1: work on something that could reverse these symptoms.

583
00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:38,160
Speaker 2: Unfortunately, we have no idea. I think this is another

584
00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:40,840
Speaker 2: point I want to make, is like we actually have

585
00:32:41,040 --> 00:32:44,440
Speaker 2: no idea what is causing this, Like we don't even

586
00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:47,880
Speaker 2: know why this change would even occur. I mean, with

587
00:32:48,040 --> 00:32:51,880
Speaker 2: other kind of risks that people need to be more

588
00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:54,760
Speaker 2: warned about in medicine, at least we kind of know

589
00:32:54,960 --> 00:32:57,120
Speaker 2: why they're happening and we could even find a way

590
00:32:57,160 --> 00:33:01,040
Speaker 2: to avoid them more minimize the risk I certain things occurring.

591
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:04,680
Speaker 2: But with Peers's Day, like you, genuinely we have absolutely

592
00:33:04,760 --> 00:33:07,040
Speaker 2: no idea why this is occurring. And it's I want

593
00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:10,320
Speaker 2: to make a point as well. It's not just antidepressants

594
00:33:10,360 --> 00:33:12,400
Speaker 2: that are doing this. There's another drug, like a hair

595
00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:16,960
Speaker 2: loss drug called finasteride or propecia that is causing virtually

596
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:21,760
Speaker 2: an identical syndrome in everyone. Not everyone, but in the

597
00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:25,000
Speaker 2: people that are developing it. All of the long term

598
00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:28,760
Speaker 2: adverse effects, like the clinical syndrome looks exactly the same

599
00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:30,480
Speaker 2: as people.

600
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:32,520
Speaker 1: As I say, as I got into this, I started

601
00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:35,760
Speaker 1: to see that too that propicia was having the same effect,

602
00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:38,880
Speaker 1: and I and people were pointing this out to me.

603
00:33:38,920 --> 00:33:41,080
Speaker 1: Once we started talking about this on the podcast, they

604
00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:46,000
Speaker 1: started getting messages saying, Propi, I don't have the SSRI problem.

605
00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:48,720
Speaker 1: This happened to me because I had hair loss. If

606
00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:51,240
Speaker 1: I had had a doctor tell me you can have

607
00:33:51,360 --> 00:33:53,440
Speaker 1: hair loss or you could never have sex again. What

608
00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:54,479
Speaker 1: do you think I'd choose?

609
00:33:55,160 --> 00:33:59,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, And even then, it's it's almost like there's you

610
00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:02,480
Speaker 2: know those there's a there's a company that I can't

611
00:34:02,560 --> 00:34:09,919
Speaker 2: stand called Hymns and Hers that aggressively markets SSRI's and

612
00:34:10,120 --> 00:34:12,680
Speaker 2: these kind of hair loss pills to young people using

613
00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:15,120
Speaker 2: like you know, there's that. I have my friends in

614
00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 2: the US have these ads pop up on the Instagram and.

615
00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:19,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, they see them all the time.

616
00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:22,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's insane to me because you know, we're not

617
00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:26,520
Speaker 2: in Australia not allowed to advertise these drugs, but they

618
00:34:26,600 --> 00:34:30,960
Speaker 2: advertise so much better. I know. It's it's we just

619
00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:38,040
Speaker 2: advertise the disease instead. So I just I just find like, yeah,

620
00:34:38,080 --> 00:34:42,120
Speaker 2: these all of these like aggressive marketing tools from these

621
00:34:42,160 --> 00:34:44,239
Speaker 2: companies to try and get as many people onto these

622
00:34:44,280 --> 00:34:48,960
Speaker 2: medications as possible without actually knowing that the effects can

623
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:51,480
Speaker 2: be permanent, let alone having to list it on their

624
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:54,800
Speaker 2: website at the very least is just I think it's criminal.

625
00:34:54,880 --> 00:34:56,680
Speaker 2: I think it should this this, this needs to be

626
00:34:56,760 --> 00:34:59,400
Speaker 2: a criminalized like offense. It's so bad.

627
00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:02,920
Speaker 1: It's so funny. We're so used to them, and I

628
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:05,640
Speaker 1: think that as adults, we've become so used to them

629
00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:09,200
Speaker 1: because we hear the commercials constantly. And a few weeks ago,

630
00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:10,600
Speaker 1: one of my twelve year olds was sitting in the

631
00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:12,719
Speaker 1: kitchen and one of those commercials played and she looked

632
00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:14,400
Speaker 1: at me and she goes, why would you ever take that?

633
00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:17,120
Speaker 1: And I said, and I was like, I mean, I've

634
00:35:17,120 --> 00:35:19,080
Speaker 1: become desensitized to it. I said, what do you mean?

635
00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:21,040
Speaker 1: And she was like, did you hear all of the

636
00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:25,360
Speaker 1: horrible things? It could prevent you from having nosebleeds, but

637
00:35:25,680 --> 00:35:27,560
Speaker 1: you're going to have all these other horrible things. And

638
00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:29,879
Speaker 1: I was like, I guess it's so obvious when you're

639
00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:32,600
Speaker 1: a little kid and you hear it. We are, so

640
00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:35,719
Speaker 1: I think what you said struck me. We walked in.

641
00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:38,920
Speaker 1: He had all the credentials, so he should have been

642
00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:42,320
Speaker 1: the expert. You felt comfortable, and I think too often

643
00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:45,879
Speaker 1: we feel comfortable with doctors because of that. So you

644
00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:51,240
Speaker 1: have the PSSD network, that's the post SSRI Sexual Dysfunction Network.

645
00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:53,759
Speaker 1: Tell us a little bit about that, because I think

646
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:56,000
Speaker 1: there's got to be people out there that are looking

647
00:35:56,040 --> 00:35:56,760
Speaker 1: for other people.

648
00:35:57,680 --> 00:36:01,200
Speaker 2: Yeah. Sorry. We just decided to create like a little

649
00:36:01,520 --> 00:36:06,200
Speaker 2: almost like an hub, like a network of every piece

650
00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:09,000
Speaker 2: of academic literature that we could find on the subject

651
00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:14,920
Speaker 2: and you know, try and connect with clinicians and researchers

652
00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:19,040
Speaker 2: and try and basically, this is another thing I want

653
00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:23,120
Speaker 2: to mention. We are not supported in any capacity by

654
00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:27,520
Speaker 2: any external you know, when there's certain diseases, they receive

655
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:30,279
Speaker 2: a lot of funding and grant funding and support and

656
00:36:30,360 --> 00:36:33,799
Speaker 2: things like that. It's been really hard for us. They're like,

657
00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:37,160
Speaker 2: we're all self funding this research. Like people are putting

658
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:40,160
Speaker 2: money into you know, like a small pool of money

659
00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:42,399
Speaker 2: to try and get researchers to actually look into this

660
00:36:42,480 --> 00:36:46,440
Speaker 2: because it costs an eye watering amount of money to

661
00:36:46,560 --> 00:36:49,600
Speaker 2: have to you know, fund these studies. The pharmaceutical companies

662
00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:52,520
Speaker 2: have like they just spend money on things like this

663
00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:54,279
Speaker 2: like it's going out of fashion. But for us, like

664
00:36:54,800 --> 00:36:57,320
Speaker 2: it just feels really wrong. You know, you've got people

665
00:36:57,320 --> 00:36:59,760
Speaker 2: that can't even work that are giving like one hundred

666
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:01,920
Speaker 2: dollars a month that there's like a lot of money

667
00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:04,640
Speaker 2: to those people, where like it would literally be not

668
00:37:04,719 --> 00:37:06,480
Speaker 2: even a drop in the ocean to these companies. It

669
00:37:06,520 --> 00:37:10,279
Speaker 2: should be the ones paying for it, essentially. But I

670
00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:13,120
Speaker 2: think that what we've tried to do is, yeah, work

671
00:37:13,160 --> 00:37:15,319
Speaker 2: together to create a network so that we can get

672
00:37:15,360 --> 00:37:18,840
Speaker 2: research into the condition, and like, more so, we just

673
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:21,640
Speaker 2: want to get it officially recognized. I mean, it's just

674
00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:24,359
Speaker 2: been so gas lit for so long, and it's just

675
00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:27,600
Speaker 2: been too easy for these doctors to say that's not

676
00:37:27,719 --> 00:37:31,560
Speaker 2: possible without actually having to do any further investigation, Like

677
00:37:31,719 --> 00:37:35,000
Speaker 2: they've just been given some sort of authority to say, no,

678
00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:40,359
Speaker 2: that's not true. Well, there's obviously a huge bias there

679
00:37:40,840 --> 00:37:42,800
Speaker 2: because a lot of these doctors are paid by the

680
00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:45,960
Speaker 2: pharmaceutical companies. They have every intention to promote the drug

681
00:37:46,400 --> 00:37:50,000
Speaker 2: and downplay our stories, yet they're the ones given authority

682
00:37:51,239 --> 00:37:53,400
Speaker 2: to do so. Like there's this woman, her name is

683
00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:58,120
Speaker 2: Anita Clayton, for example, and you know she's taken so

684
00:37:58,239 --> 00:38:02,440
Speaker 2: much money from these pharmaceutical companies. She's a psychiatry, she's

685
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:06,320
Speaker 2: a psychiatrist, but she has made so many comments about

686
00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:09,279
Speaker 2: how this isn't possible and all of this stuff when

687
00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:12,880
Speaker 2: she's simultaneously getting paid by the pharmaceutical company to promote

688
00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:15,280
Speaker 2: her drug. And she I remember once she even said

689
00:38:15,760 --> 00:38:19,799
Speaker 2: it's not possible for this drug to cause PSST and

690
00:38:19,880 --> 00:38:22,799
Speaker 2: in the same breath said, oh, our drug actually could

691
00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:27,240
Speaker 2: be really helpful for these conditions. So it's like her

692
00:38:27,320 --> 00:38:32,400
Speaker 2: lies aren't even making sense because there's just holes in

693
00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:35,200
Speaker 2: her story everywhere. But yeah, like there's so many people

694
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:38,359
Speaker 2: like that that you know they hold but that's what's

695
00:38:38,360 --> 00:38:40,759
Speaker 2: so wrong, is like they hold the position of authority

696
00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:46,720
Speaker 2: and you know, they make these massive decisions that because

697
00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:49,160
Speaker 2: they have all these letters ex to their name and

698
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:52,560
Speaker 2: their accolades, we get ignored when we're the ones tell

699
00:38:52,640 --> 00:38:55,439
Speaker 2: them the truth. But yeah, so I guess our work

700
00:38:55,440 --> 00:38:59,640
Speaker 2: has just kind of been to just raise awareness and

701
00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:03,040
Speaker 2: get peop people noticing this issue because it's and that's

702
00:39:03,080 --> 00:39:05,719
Speaker 2: another thing, like it's so hard to raise awareness for this.

703
00:39:05,800 --> 00:39:08,640
Speaker 2: I mean, coming on camera and like speaking about this

704
00:39:08,719 --> 00:39:10,839
Speaker 2: issue is not easy because in the back of your head,

705
00:39:10,840 --> 00:39:12,680
Speaker 2: you're always like, are my colleagues going to say this?

706
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:15,520
Speaker 2: Like I really don't want anyone from my work to

707
00:39:15,560 --> 00:39:17,799
Speaker 2: know about this, Like I kind of I'm a very

708
00:39:17,880 --> 00:39:21,360
Speaker 2: quiet person usually, and there's so many people that feel

709
00:39:21,400 --> 00:39:24,360
Speaker 2: like they just can't raise awareness, so we're just trying to.

710
00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:27,560
Speaker 1: Rest And it's a subject that has historically been so

711
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:31,439
Speaker 1: taboo to talk about sex and sexual desire, and it's

712
00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:33,680
Speaker 1: like you shouldn't talk about that, you know, you shouldn't

713
00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:37,239
Speaker 1: ever acknowledge that, and yet you have doctors who are

714
00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:40,200
Speaker 1: unwilling to acknowledge it. This is the problem that we have.

715
00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:43,000
Speaker 1: Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue next on

716
00:39:43,080 --> 00:39:49,799
Speaker 1: the Tutor Dixon Podcast. I've talked to several experts now

717
00:39:49,920 --> 00:39:53,040
Speaker 1: in the field, and I would argue, is there really

718
00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:57,440
Speaker 1: a benefit to these medications? Are they? I mean, we

719
00:39:57,880 --> 00:39:59,799
Speaker 1: you know, I've had some doctors who have been like well,

720
00:39:59,840 --> 00:40:02,480
Speaker 1: and certain situations when it's for a short period, I

721
00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:04,680
Speaker 1: can see how it could be helpful if someone's going

722
00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:09,040
Speaker 1: through something really hard. But then ultimately, if they happen

723
00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:12,279
Speaker 1: to be the you know, get the bad lottery where

724
00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:15,560
Speaker 1: they have these terrible side effects, was it worth it

725
00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:19,960
Speaker 1: to go through six week hardship and take these meds

726
00:40:20,080 --> 00:40:22,800
Speaker 1: and then find out that you've got a lifelong hardship.

727
00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:25,280
Speaker 1: It's just a new hardship and a different type of hardship,

728
00:40:25,560 --> 00:40:28,640
Speaker 1: and one that is much longer lasting. This is to me,

729
00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:31,560
Speaker 1: I just think it's criminal. I just think it's it's criminal,

730
00:40:31,560 --> 00:40:36,800
Speaker 1: and that we've had this like mafia of pharmaceutical pharmaceutical

731
00:40:36,840 --> 00:40:40,520
Speaker 1: companies that have had the government covering for them. And

732
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:43,080
Speaker 1: that's why may I talk about this because I just

733
00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:46,200
Speaker 1: can't believe the government hasn't had to come out and

734
00:40:46,280 --> 00:40:49,520
Speaker 1: say we want answers, we want answers as to how

735
00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:53,000
Speaker 1: these people's lives could be like this. So what is

736
00:40:53,040 --> 00:40:56,720
Speaker 1: the future for you? Do you see? Do you see

737
00:40:57,080 --> 00:41:00,200
Speaker 1: having relationships and children? And what do you do you

738
00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:01,480
Speaker 1: see free yourself?

739
00:41:02,040 --> 00:41:04,399
Speaker 2: Honestly, like, I think this has even the hardest part

740
00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:06,200
Speaker 2: is like I wake up every day and I just

741
00:41:06,320 --> 00:41:09,440
Speaker 2: feel like since the day I got this, every day

742
00:41:09,480 --> 00:41:11,719
Speaker 2: I'm like, I don't know what to do. I just

743
00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:14,160
Speaker 2: genuinely don't know what to do. I don't know what

744
00:41:14,640 --> 00:41:16,000
Speaker 2: is going to happen in the future. I try not

745
00:41:16,040 --> 00:41:18,839
Speaker 2: to think about it. I just try and live each

746
00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:22,480
Speaker 2: day and just focus on what I can control in

747
00:41:22,520 --> 00:41:25,200
Speaker 2: the immediate term. But like long term, I know this

748
00:41:25,239 --> 00:41:27,000
Speaker 2: has changed my life forever. I don't know where I'll

749
00:41:27,000 --> 00:41:28,400
Speaker 2: be in five years. I don't know where I'll be

750
00:41:28,440 --> 00:41:30,440
Speaker 2: in ten years. I try not to think about it

751
00:41:30,480 --> 00:41:32,719
Speaker 2: because it's just like I used to have like kind

752
00:41:32,719 --> 00:41:34,120
Speaker 2: of like a plan of what I would want for

753
00:41:34,200 --> 00:41:38,000
Speaker 2: my life, and now that's been completely changed, not just

754
00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:40,480
Speaker 2: because of my sexuality, but like the emotional blunting, Like

755
00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:44,080
Speaker 2: I just feel completely different. I'm just a different person now.

756
00:41:44,520 --> 00:41:47,200
Speaker 2: So I just try. I guess we just try and

757
00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:51,680
Speaker 2: raise as much awareness and we just really want research

758
00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:55,040
Speaker 2: to investigate this problem. I mean, I think one of

759
00:41:55,080 --> 00:41:57,359
Speaker 2: the hardest things is like this is something that might

760
00:41:57,400 --> 00:42:01,480
Speaker 2: be fixable, but no one's aiding any resources to actually

761
00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:03,720
Speaker 2: help us, because people are too busy trying to suppress

762
00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:06,799
Speaker 2: the problem and say that's not my fault, we didn't

763
00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:10,280
Speaker 2: cause that, we're not you know, they would rather defend

764
00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:12,200
Speaker 2: themselves rather than just look at us from like a

765
00:42:12,280 --> 00:42:15,880
Speaker 2: human standpoint and be like, Okay, this is a problem.

766
00:42:16,040 --> 00:42:19,960
Speaker 2: They need help. We just really need like yeah, sorry,

767
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:20,480
Speaker 2: that's why.

768
00:42:20,640 --> 00:42:23,680
Speaker 1: No, that's why we're doing this as hopefully someone sees

769
00:42:23,719 --> 00:42:26,400
Speaker 1: this and they say this is enough, is enough. We

770
00:42:26,400 --> 00:42:28,680
Speaker 1: don't want our loved ones to go through this, and

771
00:42:28,719 --> 00:42:30,360
Speaker 1: we don't want to go through this. I mean, this is,

772
00:42:31,560 --> 00:42:35,120
Speaker 1: like I said, I can think of nothing more cruel

773
00:42:35,760 --> 00:42:39,879
Speaker 1: that you would know. But it's not impossible because I mean,

774
00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:42,200
Speaker 1: we had the guy on here that he wrote the

775
00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:44,640
Speaker 1: book about Johnson and Johnson. I'm looking at Sarah because

776
00:42:44,680 --> 00:42:48,319
Speaker 1: she's got all of these. You know, she scheduled all

777
00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:50,080
Speaker 1: of these, and she knows who these people are, and

778
00:42:50,600 --> 00:42:54,120
Speaker 1: he exposed all these I mean, they knew for years

779
00:42:54,160 --> 00:42:57,279
Speaker 1: that they were hurting women with the devices they were

780
00:42:57,280 --> 00:43:00,920
Speaker 1: putting into them, with the medications, and yet we're suppressing that.

781
00:43:01,040 --> 00:43:04,799
Speaker 1: So you're not crazy. I mean, this does happen, and

782
00:43:04,840 --> 00:43:07,680
Speaker 1: that's why we want to get this out there, so

783
00:43:07,719 --> 00:43:09,960
Speaker 1: that people can hear this and there can be an

784
00:43:10,040 --> 00:43:12,719
Speaker 1: uprising against this and say, like, we can't let this

785
00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:16,200
Speaker 1: happen to our young people in this country and in

786
00:43:16,239 --> 00:43:19,759
Speaker 1: this world. I mean, you talk about six people you

787
00:43:19,840 --> 00:43:23,640
Speaker 1: know that have committed suicide. This suicide rate keeps climbing,

788
00:43:23,719 --> 00:43:27,280
Speaker 1: especially for women, and it is climbing in the category

789
00:43:27,360 --> 00:43:30,080
Speaker 1: of people who are on these medications. And that should

790
00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:33,080
Speaker 1: be enough. That should be enough. Just the idea that

791
00:43:33,120 --> 00:43:35,799
Speaker 1: people have said, I can't do it anymore, I can't

792
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:38,319
Speaker 1: live like this anymore. That should be enough that the

793
00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:41,440
Speaker 1: government or somebody should be stepping in and doing something

794
00:43:41,520 --> 00:43:44,680
Speaker 1: and so I commend you. I commend you for doing

795
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:48,520
Speaker 1: this because I am like, I don't know how you do.

796
00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:51,520
Speaker 1: I mean, you're amazing. I am so impressed with you.

797
00:43:52,560 --> 00:43:56,680
Speaker 2: Thank you. It's it's honestly being so hard, Like I'm

798
00:43:56,680 --> 00:44:00,680
Speaker 2: not just saying that, but it's just so it's such

799
00:44:00,719 --> 00:44:04,200
Speaker 2: a hard topic to talk about because at the end

800
00:44:04,239 --> 00:44:06,960
Speaker 2: of the day, this is I can't think of a

801
00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:11,720
Speaker 2: more deeply personal topic. So this is just not something

802
00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:16,440
Speaker 2: that or even not just personal, but something that could

803
00:44:16,480 --> 00:44:21,120
Speaker 2: be made fun of or you could be left feeling humiliated.

804
00:44:22,000 --> 00:44:25,160
Speaker 2: This has just been like so difficult. But I also

805
00:44:25,400 --> 00:44:29,839
Speaker 2: just feel like if we don't say anything, no one's

806
00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:32,400
Speaker 2: got to know about it. And I also feel like

807
00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:37,839
Speaker 2: sometimes it's it doesn't it's you know, we've had amazing

808
00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:41,759
Speaker 2: advocates speak up about this, like Joseph, We're doing and

809
00:44:41,880 --> 00:44:45,040
Speaker 2: you know a lot of others. But sometimes I feel

810
00:44:45,040 --> 00:44:48,799
Speaker 2: like it really it does have to come from the

811
00:44:48,840 --> 00:44:53,719
Speaker 2: person that's experiencing at firsthand to actually tell people what

812
00:44:53,840 --> 00:44:58,160
Speaker 2: this is like, because honestly, I remember hearing a PFS sufferer,

813
00:44:58,680 --> 00:45:01,440
Speaker 2: a person us steroid syndrome stuff explain this is a

814
00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:05,279
Speaker 2: complete biological paradigm shift, and that's how I feel. It's

815
00:45:05,320 --> 00:45:07,920
Speaker 2: just like I've just gone through this tunnel and come

816
00:45:07,960 --> 00:45:09,520
Speaker 2: out the other side, and right now I'm just like

817
00:45:09,680 --> 00:45:12,799
Speaker 2: living this weird existence.

818
00:45:13,840 --> 00:45:17,359
Speaker 1: But today we look back at the years of lobotomies

819
00:45:17,400 --> 00:45:20,239
Speaker 1: and we go how that have ever happened? And yet

820
00:45:20,280 --> 00:45:23,320
Speaker 1: this feels like a chemical lobotomy.

821
00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:26,440
Speaker 2: It absolutely does. Like even when I listen to music,

822
00:45:26,480 --> 00:45:29,600
Speaker 2: it doesn't sound the same. I still have ringing in

823
00:45:29,600 --> 00:45:33,040
Speaker 2: my ears, I still have, you know, visual Snow there's

824
00:45:33,080 --> 00:45:34,640
Speaker 2: a lot of other things that I have on top

825
00:45:34,680 --> 00:45:40,359
Speaker 2: of the sexual side effects and emotional blunting things. But yeah,

826
00:45:40,400 --> 00:45:44,879
Speaker 2: it's I just want people to be aware that these

827
00:45:44,960 --> 00:45:48,680
Speaker 2: drugs have not been studied in the long term and

828
00:45:48,719 --> 00:45:52,960
Speaker 2: we actually don't like Johannamon Creef talks about this a lot,

829
00:45:53,040 --> 00:45:56,120
Speaker 2: but this is basically a massive experiment. We don't know

830
00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:58,480
Speaker 2: what the effects that these drugs are over the long

831
00:45:58,560 --> 00:46:03,279
Speaker 2: term on you know, children or even adults. And yeah,

832
00:46:03,320 --> 00:46:06,000
Speaker 2: it's it's it's I don't even know what to say,

833
00:46:06,040 --> 00:46:08,520
Speaker 2: to be honest, It's just been so difficult because people

834
00:46:08,560 --> 00:46:10,480
Speaker 2: tell you that it's not real, when I'm like, no,

835
00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:14,000
Speaker 2: it's I'm definitely experiencing this like I don't have a choice.

836
00:46:15,400 --> 00:46:18,680
Speaker 1: No, I'm so I'm so impressed that you came on

837
00:46:18,760 --> 00:46:20,640
Speaker 1: to share it. I mean, honestly, I just think you're

838
00:46:20,680 --> 00:46:24,280
Speaker 1: so brave and keep going, keep doing this. There's anything

839
00:46:24,320 --> 00:46:26,719
Speaker 1: that I know my audience would feel the same way,

840
00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:28,560
Speaker 1: if there's anything that we can tell you. It is

841
00:46:28,600 --> 00:46:31,800
Speaker 1: like God has a plan for you. You are clearly

842
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:35,120
Speaker 1: doing You are a voice that most people couldn't be.

843
00:46:35,160 --> 00:46:38,600
Speaker 1: And I know, like I feel all those feelings for you,

844
00:46:38,600 --> 00:46:41,800
Speaker 1: you know, that concern of should I feel embarrassed, should

845
00:46:41,840 --> 00:46:44,200
Speaker 1: I feel like I can't discuss this, but I'm like,

846
00:46:44,520 --> 00:46:47,640
Speaker 1: you are so brave, Like what an amazing woman you

847
00:46:47,719 --> 00:46:49,560
Speaker 1: are that you can go out and do this.

848
00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:54,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it just came from a real oh

849
00:46:54,239 --> 00:46:56,440
Speaker 2: my god, I'm sorry, but yeah, it just came from

850
00:46:56,480 --> 00:46:59,800
Speaker 2: a real point of like there was literally nothing else

851
00:47:00,080 --> 00:47:02,760
Speaker 2: that we possibly could do than to just start telling

852
00:47:02,840 --> 00:47:07,319
Speaker 2: everyone what they've done to us, essentially until so much

853
00:47:07,360 --> 00:47:09,799
Speaker 2: is time that someone actually does something to try and

854
00:47:09,880 --> 00:47:13,440
Speaker 2: help us, because if we don't do this, nothing's going

855
00:47:13,480 --> 00:47:17,000
Speaker 2: to change and the'll just be yeah, we'll never kind

856
00:47:17,040 --> 00:47:19,560
Speaker 2: of get out of that little hole that Loure in

857
00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:22,000
Speaker 2: so thank you so much though, that's so pinn to you.

858
00:47:22,600 --> 00:47:25,480
Speaker 1: No, thank you, thank you for coming on today, Rosie Telly,

859
00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:28,960
Speaker 1: thank you. I appreciate you. I think you're amazing. Keep going.

860
00:47:29,040 --> 00:47:31,120
Speaker 1: Thank you for coming on, Thanks.

861
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Speaker 2: So much for having me.

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Speaker 1: Thank you absolutely, and as I always, thank you all

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Speaker 1: for listening to the Tutor Dixon Podcast. You can get

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Speaker 1: this podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever

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Speaker 1: you get your podcasts, and you can watch it on

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Speaker 1: YouTube or rumble at Tutor Dixon and join us next time.

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Speaker 1: Have a blessed day.