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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 2: D four VD aka David Burt goes radio silent as

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Speaker 2: the Celest murder investigation boils over. This as a Celeste

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Speaker 2: body double rocks the investigation.

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Speaker 1: I Nancy Grace, this is Crime Stories. I want to

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Speaker 1: thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 2: There is a dead body in there, one hundred and

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Speaker 2: fifty feet away from his house. Her body was an

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Speaker 2: advanced state of decomposure.

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Speaker 1: It's not just a car.

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Speaker 2: This is a car containing his girlfriends allegedly dead dismembered body.

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Speaker 2: As we go to air tonight, David Burke aka the

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Speaker 2: artist known as David but spelled D four VD okay,

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Speaker 2: whatever remains radio silent as the murder investigation into the

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Speaker 2: little teen girl found in his Tesla trunk boils over.

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Speaker 2: Joining me an all star panel to make sense of

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Speaker 2: what we are learning tonight. But first, a new theory

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Speaker 2: rocking online salute and beyond.

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Speaker 1: The theory that there is a.

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Speaker 2: Body double being is let me explain the theory.

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Speaker 1: Melissa McCarty joining us.

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Speaker 2: Investigative reporter, host of Killer Jeans and author of a book,

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Speaker 2: The Making of a Crime Reporter. Melissa, The working theory

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Speaker 2: is that don't pooh pooh it Melissa McCarty joining us.

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Speaker 2: What is the body double theory? What's the story? Melissa Nancy?

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Speaker 2: Definitely plausible.

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Speaker 3: I've seen similar elaborate cover ups in other cases. Now

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Speaker 3: the sleuthing is they are pretty much stripping everything he's

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Speaker 3: ever done online.

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Speaker 4: And one of the.

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Speaker 3: Things, not only the two Celeste theory, but is he

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Speaker 3: using a body double? Are there images of her surfer

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Speaker 3: seen online to make it seem as though she was

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Speaker 3: alive and messing up the timeline? You know, these are

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Speaker 3: conspiracy theories, but they are plausible at the same time.

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Speaker 3: So it's something that the LAPD is going to have

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Speaker 3: to continue to, you know, investigate, but it's confusing for

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Speaker 3: the mass to follow with all the new tidbits coming

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Speaker 3: about from the sleuthing.

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Speaker 2: By joining me now is Steve Fisher, missing person's private investigator,

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Speaker 2: search and riscue specialist and owner of Search Investigations, Steve,

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Speaker 2: thank you for being with us Number one. A lot

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Speaker 2: happening in the case the case boiling over. I wonder

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Speaker 2: why D four v D aka David Anthony Burke has

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Speaker 2: remained totally silent. He's on social don't worry about that.

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Speaker 2: He's busy deleting negative comments. So I know he's alive

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Speaker 2: and well, but he's saying nothing about the disappearance and

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Speaker 2: death of this little girl, Celeste.

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Speaker 1: Found in his trunk.

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Speaker 2: I wonder what his father, the lawyer, has to do

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Speaker 2: with that, if anything, his decision to remain silent as

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Speaker 2: it relates to Celeste. But this new theory, it has

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Speaker 2: uh spreading like wildfire, that there is a body double Celeste.

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Speaker 2: These many of these are posted by him. These are

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Speaker 2: not the same girl, it's not her, but yet it's

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Speaker 2: posted all over his internet social postings. She has been

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Speaker 2: spotted at various functions. What do you make of it?

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Speaker 5: Yeah?

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Speaker 6: Do they look remarkable?

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Speaker 2: You like?

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Speaker 7: And like you said, she has shown up, but you

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Speaker 7: know there's been backstage concert photos of her, and you know,

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Speaker 7: you just use being tagged as a Celeste. And I

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Speaker 7: believe that girl's twenty two years old. So whether it's

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Speaker 7: deliberate or not, I can't say, but it's definitely uh,

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Speaker 7: you know interesting that.

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Speaker 2: Place, Okay, Stave Fisher, I don't rely on crystal balls

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Speaker 2: to prove a case. I don't expect you to guess

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Speaker 2: or surmise read the tea leaves. What I'm saying, point blank,

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Speaker 2: is it's been done before, and before we discount anything,

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Speaker 2: it needs to be proven or disproven. The theory is

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Speaker 2: that knowing Celeste is God. She's dead and his tesla

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Speaker 2: she's not reported missing, the car is not reported stolen

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Speaker 2: or missing. Why and then a Celeste body double lookalike

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Speaker 2: starts appearing on his feed, on his social and even

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Speaker 2: at events. It's not Celeste, but it looks like Celeste

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Speaker 2: during this critical time period. It's not a leap of

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Speaker 2: faith to surmise it is intentional. Can you Can you

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Speaker 2: understand what I'm saying?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 7: No, I agree with you, Although I will say that

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Speaker 7: that girl did show up in some es, even you know,

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Speaker 7: back in twenty twenty four, but they were a lot

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Speaker 7: more prominent in twenty twenty five. And so yeah, I

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Speaker 7: think that this could be a reason to explain, you know,

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Speaker 7: or for people not to be looking for the other

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Speaker 7: you know, ce last but they look remarkably alike.

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Speaker 1: Is that what's happening here? We don't know?

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Speaker 2: And recall, David Anthony Burke aka David aka D four

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Speaker 2: VD is presumed innocent under the law.

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Speaker 1: He will be innocent.

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Speaker 2: He is innocent, right now until the presumption of innocence

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Speaker 2: is pierced and overcome by evidence that proves beyond a reasonable.

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Speaker 1: Doubt that he is in fact guilty. Now I want

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Speaker 1: to move on to this.

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Speaker 2: Take a look at Celeste little middle school boyfriend.

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Speaker 8: She said how her mom didn't treat her well or whatever,

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Speaker 8: and she didn't like where she was at.

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Speaker 1: We were at pe and she told me.

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Speaker 8: My friend that she was running away, and she said

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Speaker 8: it was kind of her parents, and she was like

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Speaker 8: joking about it, and she she was like happy, like

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Speaker 8: joking like she always was, and like it didn't seem

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Speaker 8: real because like she was like playing around, joking about it.

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Speaker 8: And the next day she wasn't at school, and like

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Speaker 8: that's the last time I saw her. My heart jobs.

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Speaker 8: I was like, I don't know. I just couldn't believe it.

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Speaker 8: I thought, I mean, I kind of had a feeling

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Speaker 8: when I saw, like the first thing, I was like,

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Speaker 8: what if it is her? I just like to brushed

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Speaker 8: it off. But when I saw it really was, I

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Speaker 8: was like, damn, I really knew that's right.

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Speaker 2: Friends of rich CMZ, that's Celeste three vas, little middle

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Speaker 2: school boyfriend, describing how years in the making she had

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Speaker 2: trouble at home, a very difficult home life. And it

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Speaker 2: brings to mind a beautiful little girl, Madeline Soto, Maddy Soto,

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Speaker 2: who had told friends as soon as she was thirteen,

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Speaker 2: she was running away from home and living in the woods.

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Speaker 2: And I couldn't help wonder why with a little girl

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Speaker 2: want to run away from home and live in the woods.

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Speaker 2: Then I found out mommy's boyfriend, Stefan Stearns, had been

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Speaker 2: molesting her and taking videos of the molestation for years

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Speaker 2: back as early as when she was nine years old,

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Speaker 2: and no wonder she wanted to.

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Speaker 1: Run away and live in the woods.

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Speaker 2: Why did Celeste Rivas continue to run away from home?

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Speaker 2: How did everybody know that there was trouble at home?

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Speaker 2: As a matter of fact, on this occasion that she

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Speaker 2: ran away from home, her sister went looking for her,

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Speaker 2: even poking her head. The sister into a liquor store

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Speaker 2: asking if they could look at the surveillance video and

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Speaker 2: see if Celeste had walked by, And sure enough, Celeste

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Speaker 2: was caught on video cam on the incident when she ran.

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Speaker 1: Away from home.

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Speaker 2: To Dave mac Crime Stories investigative reporter, what happened in

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Speaker 2: that instance, you know, in that.

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Speaker 9: Instance, Nancy, we actually can see that Celeste is kind

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Speaker 9: of doing a walk run.

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Speaker 1: Dave, look at your monitor.

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Speaker 2: We're showing the video the sister got from the store,

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Speaker 2: and there she is literally running away from home. Let

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Speaker 2: me be clear, Celeste was not in the liquor store.

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Speaker 2: The surveillance video showed her going by. This little girl

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Speaker 2: running away from home, And I got to ask why

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Speaker 2: in this video from our friend Harvey Levin at TMC. Now,

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Speaker 2: what were you saying, Dave, mac I just wanted you

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Speaker 2: to see the video.

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Speaker 9: I just wanted to point out that that video was

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Speaker 9: at seven am. That's when it was taken at a

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Speaker 9: time when he killed me, when darl was going to school.

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Speaker 9: But so instead, Celeste is clearly kind of in a

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Speaker 9: confused state. If you watch her stride, she's partially walking,

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Speaker 9: partially running. It's like she's not quite sure what she's

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Speaker 9: going to do. But that's the last they see ever.

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Speaker 9: She takes off, and it's a fascinating reading to the

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Speaker 9: thirteen year old that is trying to figure out what

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Speaker 9: to do. And as you just pointed out, Nancy, this

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Speaker 9: is a child who spoke about being unhappy at home,

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Speaker 9: not being treated well. At home and wanting.

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Speaker 1: To be away.

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Speaker 9: And when I see her walking and understopping kind of

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Speaker 9: and then running, it just breaks my heart to think

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Speaker 9: of that child not knowing where to go, who she is,

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Speaker 9: or what she should be doing.

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Speaker 1: She's been gone.

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Speaker 2: Over a year with him, she had been living with

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Speaker 2: this grown man, and now she's dead. Celeste is found

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Speaker 2: dead in the trunk of his tesla. We weren't just

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Speaker 2: showing you video obtained from a liquor store. Imagine this, Celeste,

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Speaker 2: a little girl sister, also a little girl goes looking

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Speaker 2: for her sister, king stores and homes along the way

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Speaker 2: if they had seen her sister, even a young girl

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Speaker 2: going in a liquor store asking if they had seen Celestia.

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Speaker 1: Because you look at the surveillance video.

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Speaker 2: This is from our friend Harvey leven Over at TMC,

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Speaker 2: and here is Celeste seven a m running away from home. Now,

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Speaker 2: I'm certainly not the church lady, but I can tell

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Speaker 2: you this. You need to know where your twelve year

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Speaker 2: old daughter is at seven am. I think we could

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Speaker 2: all agree with that. I'm very, very curious to Jeffrey

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Speaker 2: Gentry joining US crime scene analyst and death investigator.

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Speaker 1: Jeffrey how many little.

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Speaker 2: Girls are snatched up once they become runaways. Every year

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Speaker 2: it's you know, thousands and thousands and thousands.

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Speaker 1: Can you imagine parents.

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Speaker 2: Not knowing where their daughter is at seven am?

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Speaker 10: There is way too many and the stats on that

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Speaker 10: are very disturbing. But you know that doesn't happen in wellhomes.

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Speaker 10: So like, for example, I've got three teenagers at home

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Speaker 10: and I know exactly where they're at at all times.

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Speaker 11: I have apps in.

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Speaker 10: Them, I know about phones that I can contact them

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Speaker 10: on at all times. So that is very abnormal. And

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Speaker 10: you got to look into the home life as well

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Speaker 10: as the circumstances going around this case, just to figure

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Speaker 10: out why in the world is this girl out and

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Speaker 10: able to run away? How is this girl able to

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Speaker 10: establish a relationship with an older man. So those are

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Speaker 10: all very disturbing facts that need to be looked into.

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Speaker 2: Wilson McCarty joining us I investigative reporter and host Listen.

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Speaker 12: A friend of celestial mother, Mercedes Martinez, says the family

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Speaker 12: was aware of the relationship with Burke. She doesn't know

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Speaker 12: why they didn't ask where she had been staying. Celeste

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Speaker 12: left again and went back to him. Someone called Celeste's

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Speaker 12: mother and said stop looking for her. She's fine. Take

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Speaker 12: down social media post about Celeste being missing. She felt

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Speaker 12: scared and took down a social media post asking for

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Speaker 12: help finding Celest.

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Speaker 2: I mean, Melissa, somebody calls me and tells me, don't

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Speaker 2: look for Lucy, take down the social media post. The

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Speaker 2: first thing I would do would be star sixty nine

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Speaker 2: their bony rear end and find out who was calling

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Speaker 2: me threatening me to take down social postings about my missing.

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Speaker 1: Daughter number one.

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Speaker 2: But that person was never reported to police, and they

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Speaker 2: apparently took down the social media postings and quit looking.

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Speaker 1: What happened.

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Speaker 3: First of all, that's a very haunting culture receive, but

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Speaker 3: I think it really goes into the backstory of Celeste

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Speaker 3: in what was happening in her home. It's clear there

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Speaker 3: were a lot of issues either within the family dynamic

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Speaker 3: or even the environment where she was living for her

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Speaker 3: to come and go seemingly as she pleased at this point,

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Speaker 3: I think they were just used to her leaving. And

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Speaker 3: you know, they also do seem like a proactive family

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Speaker 3: trying to find her, where about her, But then they didn't.

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Speaker 2: Have any Lussa McCarney, I like you I really do.

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Speaker 1: Do you have children?

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Speaker 4: I do not.

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Speaker 1: Well you will one Daytunacy.

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Speaker 3: I will say this, those teen years twelve to fifteen,

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Speaker 3: they are rough. I think any parents and any teen

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Speaker 3: would admit to that. Those are rough years in the

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Speaker 3: home environment, the social environments.

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Speaker 2: What you're saying right now? And I don't care. Please

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Speaker 2: meet her. I don't care how rough they are. When

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Speaker 2: your daughter guy's missing, you find her.

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Speaker 1: You find her.

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Speaker 2: You do not allow your child to go as they please,

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Speaker 2: like you just said no, And oh well, I don't

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Speaker 2: even know what you're saying.

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Speaker 1: I'm concerned, are you?

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Speaker 3: Okay, here's the backstory of her leaving home for a

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Speaker 3: long year, a period of time work. At one point,

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Speaker 3: there's only so much a family can do. If they

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Speaker 3: made all of those calls to police and nothing came

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Speaker 3: of it, she would continue to run away.

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Speaker 2: All Okay, you know what, Melissa, I'm going to let

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Speaker 2: you rest for a few moments, and I'm going to

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Speaker 2: go to a specialist who finds missing people.

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Speaker 1: Okay, See Fisher, you.

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Speaker 2: Do not let a child go as they please. Now,

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Speaker 2: when they become eighteen or they move out of your

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Speaker 2: home as an adult, then you can't stop them they

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Speaker 2: will go and come as they please. And the same

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Speaker 2: reason that you have to watch over them is the

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Speaker 2: reason they can't buy liquor. They can't buy alcohol, They

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Speaker 2: can't enter into a contract. They can't go tell somebody, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I want to buy your car that miners cannot negotiate contracts.

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Speaker 2: Why because they don't have the wherewithal the maturity to

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Speaker 2: do that.

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Speaker 1: So even if I sell them mind my Lamborghini and then.

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Speaker 2: Guess what, they don't pay the car note and then

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Speaker 2: they wreck it, I can't sue them because I.

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Speaker 1: Entered a contract with a minor.

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Speaker 2: So when you hear Melissa McCarty state, well, you know

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Speaker 2: a lot of parents let their children come and go.

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Speaker 1: As they placed. No, they don't. And what mark could

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Speaker 1: they do?

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Speaker 2: Well, they could hire a PI, they could continue to

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Speaker 2: call police. They could put up the social media postings.

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Speaker 2: They could go out and look for her. The mom

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Speaker 2: knew she was dating a guy named David. She's all

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Speaker 2: over social media. I can see her, can't they can't

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Speaker 2: they see she is with d four VD aka Burke. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: that's what you do.

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Speaker 1: You don't give up play dead, roll over?

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Speaker 7: No?

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Speaker 2: I mean, could you school McCarty on what you do

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Speaker 2: when your child goes missing.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, so this solictior's just failed on so many levels

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Speaker 7: when it comes to this. And I'll tell you I

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Speaker 7: have talked directly with people that in that neighborhood that

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Speaker 7: were helping to search for celest and we're told by

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Speaker 7: family members to lay off because she was with a

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Speaker 7: quote unquote family member in Los Angeles and everything was.

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Speaker 2: Okay, Okay, this is bringing to mind other cases.

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Speaker 1: Let's talk about R Kelly.

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Speaker 2: R Kelly, who would gift his victims and their families

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Speaker 2: expensive gifts money so he could basically keep these young

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Speaker 2: girls as sex slaves.

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Speaker 1: Then we've got Michael Jackson.

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Speaker 2: Family after family after family thought it was just perfectly

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Speaker 2: fine for their child to go sleep with Michael Jackson. Okay,

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Speaker 2: Doctor Bethany Marshall, I know a lot of people think

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Speaker 2: Jackson's innocent.

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Speaker 1: I get that.

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Speaker 2: I don't want to believe he was a child luster either,

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Speaker 2: because he was the one of the most incredible music talents.

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Speaker 1: That ever lived. That said, he was a d lester there.

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Speaker 2: So how do families get hoodwinked into thinking it's okay

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Speaker 2: for their child to be with an adult male?

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Speaker 1: Nancy?

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Speaker 13: I think they get swayed by the celebrity. They're not protective.

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Speaker 13: They don't understand that.

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Speaker 6: They have a legal duty to their children.

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Speaker 13: Reminds me of a dad and my practice once got

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Speaker 13: into an argument with his sixteen year old.

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Speaker 6: Told the sixteen.

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Speaker 13: Year old in session, if you don't comply, I'm going

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Speaker 13: to kick you out of the house. And I said,

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Speaker 13: if you kicked him out of the house, I'm going

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Speaker 13: to call child protective Services.

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Speaker 6: Because you are his legal guardian.

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Speaker 13: You have a duty to put a roof over his head,

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Speaker 13: to nurture him, to make sure there's food.

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Speaker 6: In his belly, that he's going to school.

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Speaker 13: You do not let a sixteen year old, fifteen year old,

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Speaker 13: fourteen year old come and go as they please.

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Speaker 2: Always forgive him Melissa, but does fyi to the world

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Speaker 2: at large, No parenting advice from Melissa McCarty who thinks

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Speaker 2: children can come and go as they please.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, no, Nancy, but too, we really don't know what

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Speaker 3: was happening in her home life inside the home.

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Speaker 2: Okay, I need you to tell me things I don't

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Speaker 2: already know. That's why I have you. Okay, I know

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Speaker 2: something was wrong, even the little middle school boyfriend you

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Speaker 2: want me to play that again, said something was wrong

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Speaker 2: in the home.

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Speaker 1: She was very upset, She was very sad.

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Speaker 2: She thought her mother was very mean to her, and

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Speaker 2: she wanted to run away. So far, neither of my

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00:18:24,600 --> 00:18:28,600
Speaker 2: children have run away or even said the words run away.

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Speaker 1: Not yet.

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Speaker 2: Okay, now, I'm not giving myself a gold star, but

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Speaker 2: I can tell you this much.

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Speaker 1: If one of them disappeared.

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Speaker 2: All hal would break loose and I would not be

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Speaker 2: sitting on my rear end watching reruns on TV while my.

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Speaker 1: Son or daughter were unaccounted for. You dart right.

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Speaker 3: However, there were eleven calls to police. We don't know

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Speaker 3: the context of those calls or who were calling.

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Speaker 4: Was this Celeste? Was that the parents?

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Speaker 3: I think this is a family that was trying. They

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Speaker 3: were proactive at one point.

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Speaker 2: You don't know what the cuck calls were about, do you,

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Speaker 2: Because they took down the social media posts and they

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Speaker 2: quit looking.

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Speaker 1: According to neighbors.

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Speaker 2: And by the way, I've looked up and researched what

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Speaker 2: you said, And yes, police were at the home multiple times.

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Speaker 1: Deputies were there several times. The day that the.

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Speaker 2: Little sister got the video of Celeste running down the

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Speaker 2: street at seven a m Do.

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Speaker 1: You even have a pet? McCarty?

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Speaker 2: Do you have a cat or a dog or a snake,

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Speaker 2: a frog in anything, a lizard anything?

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Speaker 1: Do you have a pet?

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Speaker 4: I do two rescue dogs. So far, so good? Put

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Speaker 4: hersonal life.

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Speaker 2: Do you know where your rescue dogs are right now?

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Speaker 1: I bet you do? Don't you? Where are they? I do?

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Speaker 4: At all times? I do.

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Speaker 2: So you think it's okay to know where your dog is?

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Speaker 2: But that children?

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Speaker 1: You know?

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Speaker 2: So?

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Speaker 4: The human boy, the human Nancy?

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Speaker 1: I also coming as well.

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Speaker 3: No, no, however, I've worked with a lot of troubled teams,

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Speaker 3: not saying that she was. But there are some circumstances

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Speaker 3: where a family can try so hard to do everything

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Speaker 3: that they have the capacity and the tools to do,

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Speaker 3: and it's still not enough. There's overwriting factors such as

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Speaker 3: this wealthy one of those people bring her it.

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Speaker 1: They laid down, rolled over and played dead.

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Speaker 2: And I could put that in a lot of different ways,

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Speaker 2: but they wouldn't be fit for the air. You're seeing

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Speaker 2: that video of her running down the street at seven am.

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Speaker 2: I can tell you this much. I know where my

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Speaker 2: children are at seven am. You ever heard of life

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Speaker 2: three sixty? Even when I'm not with them. I know

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Speaker 2: where they are because there's no way they're going to

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Speaker 2: be separated from their cell phone.

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Speaker 1: That video from our friends at TMZ Crime Stories with

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Speaker 1: Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 2: Very expensive items were saying on Celeste that her parents

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Speaker 2: did not give her and she certainly did not buy herself,

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Speaker 2: for instance, a very expensive purse and a diamond ring.

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Speaker 2: Let's take a look now, what about it, doctor Bethney,

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Speaker 2: where does she get those?

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Speaker 13: Well, that's the Louis Vuitton purse that looks like a

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Speaker 13: one one and a half carot diamond. She certainly didn't

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Speaker 13: go get a job and buy them herself. What girl

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Speaker 13: is given gifts like that? If not that somebody's trying

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Speaker 13: to have power over her. And also we saw this

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Speaker 13: with Cassie Ventura. The gifts were given, taken away, given

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Speaker 13: taken away, so we don't know that those gifts were

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Speaker 13: permanently under her possession either. I've had a women in

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00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:53,000
Speaker 13: my practice who are abused whose husband buys husbands buy

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Speaker 13: them expensive purses but will not allow them access to cash.

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Speaker 13: And when I say to the husbands, you know she

403
00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:01,480
Speaker 13: she needs to go to the grocery store. She needs

404
00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:03,720
Speaker 13: the shop, he goes, well, he gave her purses. So

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00:22:03,800 --> 00:22:08,400
Speaker 13: persons here in southern California are a very common thing

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00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:12,440
Speaker 13: for men to give to women to have control over them.

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00:22:12,840 --> 00:22:20,159
Speaker 2: The conspiracy theorists online saluting has exploded, literally dozens and

408
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Speaker 2: dozens of theories.

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Speaker 1: How do you know that this is in somebody's setting

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Speaker 1: up David?

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Speaker 2: Why?

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00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:29,520
Speaker 1: Why would anyone want to frame him? That's crazy talking.

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00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:34,800
Speaker 12: This model sends a notification to cell phone whenever the

414
00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:38,320
Speaker 12: fronk the front trunk is open for more than ten minutes.

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00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:42,199
Speaker 12: If someone was loading Celeste's body into the car and

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00:22:42,280 --> 00:22:45,520
Speaker 12: it took more than ten minutes, Burke could have received

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00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:49,800
Speaker 12: a notification and this notification could be found on his

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Speaker 12: phone by law enforcement.

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Speaker 2: The tesla model y belonging to Burke, David Anthony Burke,

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00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:01,160
Speaker 2: the artist known as David. It looks like d Join

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Speaker 2: me now, Scott Iiker, who has actually performed experiments with

422
00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:11,600
Speaker 2: a tesla. Founding member FBI Cellular Analysis SERVE a team,

423
00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:19,520
Speaker 2: former police officer, homicide detective with Norfolk, Virginia, currently Precision

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Speaker 2: Cellular Analysis.

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Speaker 1: Scott, thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 2: Explain what you learned about this tesla other than the

427
00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:30,600
Speaker 2: fact that the trunk is open over ten minutes, an

428
00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:33,199
Speaker 2: alert is sent by text or email to the owner.

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Speaker 14: Yeah, and the tesla, as we have talked Abora before,

430
00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:40,640
Speaker 14: has numerous cameras on it so that you get these

431
00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:46,240
Speaker 14: alerts when the trunk is open, or the front trunk

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00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:50,439
Speaker 14: trunk they call it the fronk. And there's a small

433
00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:53,240
Speaker 14: area in front of in the front of the car

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00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:57,920
Speaker 14: there in the front that you can put baggages or groceries.

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00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:01,560
Speaker 14: That's what I use it for. But in this in

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00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:05,479
Speaker 14: this case, you know, her body was found inside the

437
00:24:05,480 --> 00:24:08,320
Speaker 14: front of this of the tesla. It's a very small

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00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:12,120
Speaker 14: area and you can see some of the pictures. Is

439
00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:12,840
Speaker 14: my daughter here?

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Speaker 1: Is that's your re enact?

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00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:21,439
Speaker 14: Okay, yes, yes, ma'am, that's my daughter. She's about one

442
00:24:21,480 --> 00:24:24,600
Speaker 14: hundred pounds, so it's pretty tight in there for her.

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Speaker 14: But as if you know, if the victim in this case,

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00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:35,280
Speaker 14: with Celeste, you know she's already deceased, they're more foldable

445
00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:37,320
Speaker 14: and bendable at that point in time.

446
00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:39,680
Speaker 1: Scott Iiker, how tall was your daughter?

447
00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:42,159
Speaker 14: Five pounds?

448
00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:47,720
Speaker 2: Okay, that's generally the same size as Celeste, generally speaking.

449
00:24:48,040 --> 00:24:49,160
Speaker 2: Let's see that shot again.

450
00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:51,160
Speaker 1: We also know.

451
00:24:51,440 --> 00:24:56,439
Speaker 2: That Celest's body was in a bag, which that's a

452
00:24:56,480 --> 00:25:00,000
Speaker 2: whole another can of worms for Jeffrey Gentry, our blood

453
00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:00,960
Speaker 2: pattern analyst.

454
00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 1: But back to Scott.

455
00:25:02,280 --> 00:25:12,120
Speaker 2: Iiker regarding the Tesla, Celeste was dismembered, okay, which means

456
00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:16,600
Speaker 2: that although we don't know the specifics of the dismemberment yet,

457
00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:20,480
Speaker 2: that could have made it much easy, made it much

458
00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:24,520
Speaker 2: easier to put her body in the trunk since she

459
00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:29,480
Speaker 2: was dismembered. What were you saying about the degree of

460
00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:31,520
Speaker 2: rigor or life or mortis?

461
00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:32,560
Speaker 1: What were you saying about that?

462
00:25:33,359 --> 00:25:36,960
Speaker 14: Yeah, as I said, she's as she's if she's dead,

463
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:41,840
Speaker 14: she's more foldable or manipulable in our body, so could

464
00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:45,760
Speaker 14: fit into that small area of the trunk of the Tesla.

465
00:25:46,480 --> 00:25:48,399
Speaker 14: And there's numerous cameras all around that.

466
00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:53,240
Speaker 2: Also, I'm curious about that on USB that goes into

467
00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:56,600
Speaker 2: the Tesla that does all the recording, and the recordings

468
00:25:56,600 --> 00:26:00,199
Speaker 2: are stored on the USB. Would the car star art

469
00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:02,399
Speaker 2: if someone had removed the USB.

470
00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:05,560
Speaker 14: Yes, it will, it will start, and it's just not

471
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:09,480
Speaker 14: going to save any data the recordings from the cameras.

472
00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:13,160
Speaker 14: The USB is really just there to save the pictures

473
00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:14,159
Speaker 14: and the recordings.

474
00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:18,560
Speaker 2: Also, Scott is almost a three hundred and sixty degree

475
00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:21,200
Speaker 2: video of the surroundings of the car.

476
00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:23,399
Speaker 1: What all would the cameras catch?

477
00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:28,639
Speaker 14: They catch numerous aspects the front, back, inside of views

478
00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:32,159
Speaker 14: of the camera. And this is me reenacting bringing a

479
00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:35,919
Speaker 14: bag to the front of the car, opening the hood,

480
00:26:36,359 --> 00:26:39,639
Speaker 14: placing that bag into that front area, that little space

481
00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:42,440
Speaker 14: that we saw earlier, and then showing as you can see,

482
00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:47,320
Speaker 14: that's the dash camera in front of the car and

483
00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:50,840
Speaker 14: right by the mirror, and it's facing right down the

484
00:26:50,840 --> 00:26:52,920
Speaker 14: front of the car, so anybody coming to the front

485
00:26:52,920 --> 00:26:57,399
Speaker 14: of that car will get viewed pretty clearly as you

486
00:26:57,440 --> 00:27:00,320
Speaker 14: can see. And then there's cameras on each side of

487
00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:02,359
Speaker 14: the car and the rear of the car too.

488
00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:07,879
Speaker 2: Melissa, how many days passed from let's just go with

489
00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:11,119
Speaker 2: the last time she was cited in August to the

490
00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:12,960
Speaker 2: day that her body was discovered.

491
00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:15,320
Speaker 4: I believe it was about eleven days.

492
00:27:16,359 --> 00:27:18,159
Speaker 1: Eleven days, Okay.

493
00:27:18,560 --> 00:27:22,760
Speaker 2: Doctor Kendall Crown's are joining me, Chief Medical Examiner, Terrance County.

494
00:27:22,840 --> 00:27:23,720
Speaker 1: That's fort Worth.

495
00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:28,520
Speaker 2: He is an esteemed lecturer at the Burnett School of

496
00:27:28,560 --> 00:27:32,879
Speaker 2: Medicine at TCU, and he is now the star of

497
00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:38,000
Speaker 2: a hit podcast Mayhem in the morgue, Doctor Crowns, how

498
00:27:38,040 --> 00:27:44,159
Speaker 2: would rigor mortis or lever mortis affect the foldability of

499
00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:48,640
Speaker 2: Celeste's body? And how can we tell by looking at

500
00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:52,320
Speaker 2: the body what instrument was used to dismember her?

501
00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:56,960
Speaker 11: All right, so let's start with rigamortis. Rigamortis is basically

502
00:27:57,040 --> 00:28:00,920
Speaker 11: the stiffening of the body after death that you sets

503
00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:04,280
Speaker 11: in within a couple of hours up to six hours

504
00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:08,800
Speaker 11: after death, lasts about a day or two before it disappears.

505
00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:12,440
Speaker 11: So when it initially sets in, the body is very

506
00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:15,400
Speaker 11: stiff and it can make it very hard to bend

507
00:28:15,400 --> 00:28:18,520
Speaker 11: the body. But if you force enough, you can still

508
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:21,080
Speaker 11: bend the arms and the legs and even fold the

509
00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:24,000
Speaker 11: person in half. Then once you break the riggor, it

510
00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:28,840
Speaker 11: can't set back in. So we'll make it difficult.

511
00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:32,720
Speaker 2: Sloot down, slow down, doctor Kennel, Crowns, you're speaking to

512
00:28:33,080 --> 00:28:39,120
Speaker 2: mere mortals like myself. We're not all medical geniuses. You

513
00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:43,760
Speaker 2: just said something about I can't even repeat what you said,

514
00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:46,720
Speaker 2: but I can ask a question. Isn't it true that

515
00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:50,440
Speaker 2: after a period of hours rigor where you stiffen like

516
00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:52,280
Speaker 2: a boor's like cracking it? Two by four and a

517
00:28:52,320 --> 00:28:55,280
Speaker 2: half to fold a body like the legs or the

518
00:28:55,400 --> 00:28:58,560
Speaker 2: arms that are in rigor. After a period of hours,

519
00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:03,440
Speaker 2: rigors and the body again becomes malleable, isn't it true?

520
00:29:03,760 --> 00:29:07,080
Speaker 11: Yeah, after about a day or two, the rigor will

521
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:11,160
Speaker 11: actually disappear. Starts in the small muscles first and goes

522
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:14,080
Speaker 11: to a larger one, So it only lasts about a

523
00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:17,320
Speaker 11: day or two before it's gone. But you can break

524
00:29:17,400 --> 00:29:21,360
Speaker 11: the rigor by pushing on the arms or the extremities

525
00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:24,080
Speaker 11: and folding them along the joint spaces. You're able to

526
00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:26,680
Speaker 11: still break the rigor, and you can fold the person

527
00:29:26,800 --> 00:29:30,400
Speaker 11: into a suitcase or a trunk or whatever if you

528
00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:30,720
Speaker 11: need to.

529
00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:34,360
Speaker 2: Kendall Crowns, how long does it take, what's the body,

530
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:36,200
Speaker 2: what's the person's kill for riger to set in?

531
00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 11: About two to six hours. It starts in these smaller

532
00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:44,040
Speaker 11: muscles first, like your jaw muscles, and then spreads to

533
00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:45,720
Speaker 11: the larger muscles at the end.

534
00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:48,160
Speaker 2: Okay, so you know what that says to me, Doctor

535
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:50,760
Speaker 2: Kendll Crowns. I think that who ever dismembered her did

536
00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:56,560
Speaker 2: it very quickly after she was killed, before rigor had

537
00:29:56,600 --> 00:30:01,120
Speaker 2: set in. And again, doctor Kendall Crowns, how can we

538
00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:03,840
Speaker 2: look at her body? Of course it will be microscopic

539
00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:09,320
Speaker 2: and a microscopic investigation to look at the actual tissue.

540
00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:14,800
Speaker 2: Let's just pretend that the body was severed at the knee.

541
00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:20,080
Speaker 2: Let's just pretend you take the severed limb and you

542
00:30:20,120 --> 00:30:23,080
Speaker 2: put it under a microscope at the point of severance,

543
00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:30,280
Speaker 2: and you look at those microscopic cells of the leg.

544
00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:33,400
Speaker 1: Then you look at the bone.

545
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:37,880
Speaker 2: How can you determine what type of tool was used

546
00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:41,040
Speaker 2: to sever this child's body?

547
00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:43,920
Speaker 11: So what you can do is if be used as

548
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:47,960
Speaker 11: saw or something along those lines. This song has the

549
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:51,080
Speaker 11: little teeth in it, they will actually leave kind of

550
00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:54,320
Speaker 11: hash marks in the bone as they're sawing through the

551
00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:57,120
Speaker 11: bone that can be looked at and then be used

552
00:30:57,120 --> 00:31:02,160
Speaker 11: as a comparison back to what is the alleged instrument

553
00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:05,360
Speaker 11: used to dismember the body. So you can do a

554
00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:10,000
Speaker 11: basically a comparison analysis of the marks on the bones

555
00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:13,880
Speaker 11: compared back to the instrument that was used to do

556
00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:17,480
Speaker 11: the dismembering. A tissue itself, the tissue tearing all that,

557
00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:19,640
Speaker 11: there is no way to really look at that and

558
00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:22,680
Speaker 11: know if it was a saw or not, but you

559
00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 11: can kind of get an idea of how rough the

560
00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:27,400
Speaker 11: tissue looks is did they use a knife, because the

561
00:31:27,440 --> 00:31:29,800
Speaker 11: wounds will be cleaner than if they used a saw,

562
00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:32,520
Speaker 11: which will be more ragged. But it is actually the

563
00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:34,920
Speaker 11: bones themselves. When you look at those, you can kind

564
00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:37,680
Speaker 11: of get an idea of the tool and actually do

565
00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:41,640
Speaker 11: a tool mark comparison with the bones to the actual tool.

566
00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:45,080
Speaker 12: Law enforcement saying it's very likely her body was in

567
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:49,680
Speaker 12: Bert's tesla for several weeks. The remains were severely decomposed, dismembered,

568
00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:52,280
Speaker 12: and found wrapped in a bag. There has been no

569
00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:55,400
Speaker 12: comment about how the body was dismembered, no indication if

570
00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:58,360
Speaker 12: a knife, saw, ax, or anything else was used, but

571
00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:01,640
Speaker 12: whatever was used to remember the team, there will be

572
00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:04,560
Speaker 12: tool marks left behind to provide a way to identify

573
00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:08,000
Speaker 12: what was used and possibly link them back to the killer.

574
00:32:13,840 --> 00:32:21,200
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace as we go to air tonight.

575
00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:26,360
Speaker 2: David Anthony Burke aka David aka D four VD, who

576
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:28,600
Speaker 2: by the way, his music is.

577
00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:31,520
Speaker 1: Through the Roof on Spotify.

578
00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:39,880
Speaker 2: Amazing the irony that said he is radio silent, although

579
00:32:39,920 --> 00:32:43,680
Speaker 2: we are learning he's going on social media and monitoring

580
00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:49,760
Speaker 2: Reddit users everybody posting about Celeste's murder, and.

581
00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:52,920
Speaker 1: He is trying to control the narrative as it relates

582
00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:55,000
Speaker 1: to him, So he's not totally quiet.

583
00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:58,080
Speaker 2: He can go online and do that, but not mention

584
00:32:58,280 --> 00:33:01,920
Speaker 2: a word of condolence. Speaking of remaining silent, did he

585
00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 2: not notice the list wasn't there? Did nobody say hey,

586
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:10,960
Speaker 2: we're the list? Apparently not because she was never reported

587
00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:17,520
Speaker 2: missing by either him or her parents. Yeah, digest that

588
00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:18,160
Speaker 2: for a minute.

589
00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:20,400
Speaker 1: Nor was his car reported stolen?

590
00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:28,040
Speaker 2: Interesting, right, That's called circumstantial evidence. And again Burke is innocent.

591
00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:30,520
Speaker 2: As we go to air tonight, but still no word

592
00:33:30,520 --> 00:33:33,520
Speaker 2: from Burke again, Radio silent. I want to circle back

593
00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 2: to Scott Aiker joining US a forensics expert. Iiker, I

594
00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 2: want to see the video of you again carrying the

595
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:48,040
Speaker 2: bag to the tesla in which you performed multiple experiments

596
00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:53,480
Speaker 2: the bag, the bag. I want to go to Jeffrey Gentry,

597
00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:59,320
Speaker 2: joining US Forensics. Certified bloodstained pattern Analysts, senior crime scene

598
00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:01,200
Speaker 2: analysts and death investigator.

599
00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:04,720
Speaker 1: Author of forensic science.

600
00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:08,680
Speaker 2: Applications to death and crime scene investigations, author of bloodstain

601
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:14,040
Speaker 2: pattern analysis, author of death investigations. Information to obtain during

602
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:18,920
Speaker 2: a forensic death investigation. Can we talk one moment gentry

603
00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:23,799
Speaker 2: about my beloved trash bags. Oh, how I love them?

604
00:34:24,520 --> 00:34:29,000
Speaker 2: Why because they're so easy to lift prints from.

605
00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:33,279
Speaker 10: Explain they are very easy to lift prints if you

606
00:34:33,320 --> 00:34:36,240
Speaker 10: know what you're doing. You can use superglue techniques where

607
00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:39,719
Speaker 10: you can put the bag in a controlled environment. There

608
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:42,600
Speaker 10: are multiple different enhancement techniques where you can actually get

609
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:46,160
Speaker 10: usable fingerprints from plastic bags. And you might even want

610
00:34:46,200 --> 00:34:49,880
Speaker 10: to consider obtaining DNA from these bags as well, so

611
00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:52,440
Speaker 10: you might be able to figure out who was handling

612
00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:56,800
Speaker 10: the bags either before they were filled with body parts

613
00:34:56,920 --> 00:34:59,399
Speaker 10: or during the process, or when they're being put inside

614
00:34:59,400 --> 00:34:59,880
Speaker 10: of the vehicle.

615
00:35:00,160 --> 00:35:02,680
Speaker 2: Veteran defense attorney Joanna and he of us joining us

616
00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:07,920
Speaker 2: from this jurisdiction. Joanna, I guess you would argue with

617
00:35:08,080 --> 00:35:11,000
Speaker 2: a straight face that, hey, if his fingerprints are on

618
00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:13,000
Speaker 2: that bag, that means nothing.

619
00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:14,960
Speaker 1: This bag was probably from his home.

620
00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:16,279
Speaker 4: Oh, it would be with.

621
00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:18,759
Speaker 5: A straight face, because I think we need a lot

622
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:21,480
Speaker 5: more before we can tie him to this app First

623
00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:23,880
Speaker 5: of all, we haven't even established the manner of death

624
00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:26,319
Speaker 5: or the time of death, and so we.

625
00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:28,840
Speaker 6: Don't know if an actual murder was committed.

626
00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:31,760
Speaker 5: This could this be a situation where there's this alternate

627
00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:36,080
Speaker 5: theory where maybe she's engaged in some drug activity.

628
00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:38,160
Speaker 6: Od's passes, you.

629
00:35:38,080 --> 00:35:41,960
Speaker 5: Know, fall dead in front of someone, maybe not even David,

630
00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:45,600
Speaker 5: and they panic, and of course and maybe they're stupor

631
00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:49,759
Speaker 5: they with lacking judgment decide to get rid of the

632
00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:52,359
Speaker 5: body and dismember it.

633
00:35:52,719 --> 00:35:55,040
Speaker 6: Not the best decision, but it could have been a

634
00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:55,560
Speaker 6: panic state.

635
00:35:55,600 --> 00:35:58,480
Speaker 5: And I think that's why right now nobody hasn't been

636
00:35:58,600 --> 00:36:02,640
Speaker 5: named yet as the primary suspect in this, because we

637
00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:06,600
Speaker 5: have to establish what actually happened to her first.

638
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:09,879
Speaker 6: And then we can get to not whose fingerprints were.

639
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:11,520
Speaker 1: On the back We don't. I don't know why you're

640
00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:12,719
Speaker 1: saying that put her up.

641
00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:18,080
Speaker 2: Let me jog your memory, refresh your recollection, as we

642
00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:23,080
Speaker 2: say in court, with a little photo. Do you recognize

643
00:36:23,440 --> 00:36:27,400
Speaker 2: this person? Do you recognize her? Joe Ananievis. That's Lacy Peterson.

644
00:36:28,080 --> 00:36:30,279
Speaker 2: Her body, along with the body of her little boy,

645
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:34,960
Speaker 2: her unborn child, Connor, washed up on the shore of

646
00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:38,359
Speaker 2: San Francisco Bay near the marina where her husband was

647
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:43,000
Speaker 2: fishing on Christmas Eve. We never got a cod on her,

648
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:47,480
Speaker 2: did we, But yet there was a murder conviction. Let's

649
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:51,920
Speaker 2: try another photo. Look at this person. Do you recognize her?

650
00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:55,680
Speaker 2: Her name is Suzanne Morphew Joe Annievius.

651
00:36:56,719 --> 00:36:58,320
Speaker 1: We don't have her cood either.

652
00:36:58,640 --> 00:37:01,720
Speaker 2: Her bones were buried my and miles and miles away

653
00:37:01,719 --> 00:37:06,480
Speaker 2: from home, but her bike was found not too far

654
00:37:06,520 --> 00:37:07,239
Speaker 2: from her home.

655
00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:08,600
Speaker 1: Her helmet in another area.

656
00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:13,760
Speaker 2: Her husband suggested a wild animal did at a mountain lion. Okay,

657
00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:19,359
Speaker 2: here's another photo. Do you recognize this woman? Her name

658
00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:20,720
Speaker 2: is Anna Walsh.

659
00:37:21,160 --> 00:37:23,280
Speaker 1: Her body's never been found, But all of those cases

660
00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:25,680
Speaker 1: are going forward. Joan, any of us just because you

661
00:37:25,680 --> 00:37:28,879
Speaker 1: can get rid of a cod cause of death. That's

662
00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:30,480
Speaker 1: not me. You're walking free.

663
00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:35,800
Speaker 2: Melissa McCarty joining us, investigative reporter, host of Killer Jeans

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Speaker 2: and author of the Making of a Crime reporter who

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Speaker 2: I can assure you knows where her dogs are at

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Speaker 2: this hour. Melissa, tell me about the search of D

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Speaker 2: fourvd's mansion.

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Speaker 4: Right, so, the house in the Hollywood Hills.

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Speaker 3: It was least under his manager's name, but we know

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Speaker 3: that LAPD during the investigation, they issued a search war

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Speaker 3: and they were taking out electronics in looking for blood traces,

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Speaker 3: anything that could piece together some kind of forensic connection

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Speaker 3: between the two of those.

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Speaker 4: Did a homicide take place? In the house.

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Speaker 3: Was it a location number one, location number two? But

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Speaker 3: they did go search the house. What they found, it's

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Speaker 3: not been revealed yet.

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Speaker 2: This is from our friend Harvey Levin at TMZEE. Jeffrey

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Speaker 2: Gentry following up on what Melissa McCarty just stated.

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Speaker 1: She said they were looking for blood evidence.

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Speaker 2: What specifically were they looking for and how would luminol

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Speaker 2: play into that.

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Speaker 10: Lumino is a chemical that can be used to detect

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Speaker 10: blood that's not visible with the naked eye. So I've

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Speaker 10: used in many cases, and it's on areas that are

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Speaker 10: either dark or areas that have been cleaned up. So

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Speaker 10: if I were in that home looking, I would search

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Speaker 10: in areas where I think a body has been dismembered.

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Speaker 10: And keep in mind that when you're dismembering a body,

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Speaker 10: if you don't know what you're doing, you're going to

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Speaker 10: make a mess for sure. So I would be looking

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Speaker 10: in areas like bathrooms. I would be looking outside like

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Speaker 10: on patios. I'd be looking in garages. You spray this

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Speaker 10: chemical and under dark conditions, it will light up, so

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Speaker 10: it's going to tell you where that dismemberment occurred, if

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Speaker 10: it was inside the house or on the back patio.

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Speaker 10: It's a very useful technique. And then after you've sprayed

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Speaker 10: this chemical, if you're using the right one, you can

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Speaker 10: actually swab it for DNA to confirm that there was

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Speaker 10: blood there at one point. Because keep in mind, after

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Speaker 10: several days weeks, that stuff is going to get cleaned up,

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Speaker 10: and this somebody does a good job. It's not going

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Speaker 10: to be really visible with the naked eye. But this

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Speaker 10: chemical is perfect for enhancing bloodstains so that you can

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Speaker 10: see them, document them, and.

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Speaker 1: Then collect DNA gentry.

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Speaker 2: You know what I love cast off And when I

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Speaker 2: say cast off, I mean, for instance, if you stab

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Speaker 2: someone and sling back blood minute particles are tasked off

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Speaker 2: of your weapon and we'll hit the wall or the ceiling,

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Speaker 2: or we don't know where. And when looking for blood

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Speaker 2: at a crime saying, not only do you use alumino,

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Speaker 2: as Jeffrey Jesuy accurately described, you look for blood in

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Speaker 2: very odd places, like on the ceiling, at the tops

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Speaker 2: of the walls, places where you would not find Celeste

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Speaker 2: blood normally, like if she cut her legs shaving in

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Speaker 2: the tub, you would expect to find blood there, but

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Speaker 2: not on the ceiling and not at.

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Speaker 1: The tops of the walls, not on.

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Speaker 2: The curtains, and the type of blood matters.

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Speaker 1: Is it a dot?

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Speaker 2: You look at the way it runs, is it running large?

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Speaker 1: Here?

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Speaker 2: The trails off here, which will tell you the direction

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Speaker 2: in which it was cast off. It's an art, It's

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Speaker 2: a science and an art. And I just pray they

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Speaker 2: get all that evidence, if there is any, before the

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Speaker 2: home is professionally cleaned or repainted. If you know or

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Speaker 2: you think you know anything about this case, have you

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Speaker 2: been called in as a professional clean Have you been

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Speaker 2: called into David Burke's mansion to repaint, to strip up carpet,

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Speaker 2: Please dial this number two one three four eight six six'

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Speaker 2: eight nine zero repeat two one three four eight.

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Speaker 1: Six six' eight. Nine zero we Remember an.

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Speaker 2: American Hero Detative, Isaiah Emonizer Northern York County, Regional, police

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Speaker 2: pennsylvania shot in the line of duty after twenty years,

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Speaker 2: of service leaving behind, grieving Wife a loona and two.

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Speaker 2: Beautiful children American Hero Detative Isaiah Emaniser nancy gray signing off,

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Speaker 2: goodbye friend