Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
Speaker 1: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A
Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2: Welcome back to the show.
Speaker 3: My name is Matt, my name is Nolan.
Speaker 1: They call me Ben. We're joined as always with our
Speaker 1: super producer Alexis, code named Doc Holliday Jackson. Most importantly,
Speaker 1: you are you. You are here, and that makes this
Speaker 1: the stuff they don't want you to know. Merry Christmas
Speaker 1: do those who celebrate and happy day off work to
Speaker 1: those who do not celebrate Christmas. It's kind of a
Speaker 1: win win for everybody in the gang. Here tuning in
Speaker 1: and we hope that you have had a lovely day.
Speaker 1: We hope that you are getting some R and R,
Speaker 1: some rest and relaxation, and we I hope that you
Speaker 1: are ready for some very very strange news. There's a
Speaker 1: lot of stuff afoot we're going to Hopefully we didn't
Speaker 1: talk about this before we record, but I'm thinking we
Speaker 1: can maybe end on a positive note in the spirit
Speaker 1: of getting so close to surviving twenty twenty three, which
Speaker 1: has been just like a constant Shyamalan plot twist after another.
Speaker 1: We're going to learn about the Red Sea in a
Speaker 1: weird way. We're going to learn about some sea animals
Speaker 1: in a pretty exciting way. But before we do any
Speaker 1: of that, we have to acknowledge something that is part
Speaker 1: of a continuing larger phenomenon, cyber attacks hacks. Shout out
Speaker 1: to anybody who's an Infinity customer or Comcast or whatever
Speaker 1: they're going as now, but some big news just broken.
Speaker 1: It affects a lot of people.
Speaker 2: Yeah, last time on the show, you may remember if
Speaker 2: you were twenty three and me customer, all your stuff
Speaker 2: got hacked. Remember that that just happened. Well, it turns
Speaker 2: out back in October, another pretty big institution got hacked.
Speaker 2: It's a thing called Nation Star Mortgage, which changed its
Speaker 2: name to mister Cooper a couple of years back. Really
Speaker 2: hanging with yeah yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: Because it's more innocious is one of those rebranding plays.
Speaker 2: I guess I got to tell you if they're they're
Speaker 2: a mortgage company, they are actually the people that I
Speaker 2: used to have a mortgage with when I owned a
Speaker 2: house previously. It's very weird to go to their website
Speaker 2: and pay mister Cooper all that money that you owe them.
Speaker 1: It's a charitable corporation. Now you got a name, you know,
Speaker 1: I hope Matt. Do They have like a logo, like
Speaker 1: a face logo, like some guy in a you know,
Speaker 1: Hona Civic version of a suit.
Speaker 2: I only ever saw their logo. That was just a
Speaker 2: very small Mr. Dot Cooper and it was all lowercase
Speaker 2: mister Cooper. He just wants all your money.
Speaker 1: Well he wants more of your money too, depending on
Speaker 1: the interest rate.
Speaker 2: Right, oh yeah, and more and more nowadays. Well, so
Speaker 2: back basically a right around Halloween, mister Cooper said that
Speaker 2: it had been attacked. They noticed some weird stuff on
Speaker 2: their servers and they're like, oh, what's going on with that?
Speaker 2: We don't know, but they had to do the same
Speaker 2: thing twenty three and me did, where they have to
Speaker 2: report it to the SEC. Hey, there may have been
Speaker 2: some kind of data breach. We're not really sure. We're
Speaker 2: assessing it. We'll see what's going on. So that made
Speaker 2: news in early November of this year that that had occurred.
Speaker 2: Right a regulatory filing that they had to put forward
Speaker 2: that kind of made the news. I mean it did.
Speaker 2: It showed up in places like the New York times
Speaker 2: that something occurred. Because again, like twenty three and me,
Speaker 2: this is a big company. There's lots of investors in
Speaker 2: this company. It's a big deal. When something like this occurs,
Speaker 2: it can affect share and how the company performs well.
Speaker 2: As of December eighteenth, the reporting has changed quite a bit.
Speaker 2: It wasn't just a few people got affected by this thing.
Speaker 2: It was around fourteen million users whoa got affected. And guys,
Speaker 2: let me just jump here to my notes from this
Speaker 2: ABC News article written by Luke Barr on December eighteenth,
Speaker 2: twenty twenty three. According to the official information coming from
Speaker 2: mister Cooper, now, this cyber breach involved quote substantially all
Speaker 2: of our current and former customers, and it was their
Speaker 2: sensitive personal information. Here we go. The personal information in
Speaker 2: the impacted files include your name, address, phone number, social
Speaker 2: Security number, date of birth, and bank account number unquote.
Speaker 3: Can I just say that the whole former thing, yes,
Speaker 3: really gives me because you think that you're out, you're out,
Speaker 3: but there's always stuff floating around.
Speaker 2: No, my name, all of my information's in there, guys.
Speaker 2: So I don't know about anyone else listening to this
Speaker 2: or finding out about this news, but I'm gonna have
Speaker 2: to take some steps just for my own, you know,
Speaker 2: sense of well being, whether or not this information is
Speaker 2: out there and being sold to somebody. That's that's also
Speaker 2: part of this story. So as a part of the
Speaker 2: steps that mister Cooper has to take now that they've
Speaker 2: realized how big this hack was, they are going to
Speaker 2: spend I think around twenty to twenty five million dollars
Speaker 2: to mitigate this stuff, to monitor the dark web and
Speaker 2: see if this information or you know, this batch of
Speaker 2: information is getting sold somewhere. They are also providing two
Speaker 2: years of that kind of monitoring that we've you know,
Speaker 2: had on this show before with like what's it called
Speaker 2: the Norton LifeLock or LifeLock by Norton. They're going to
Speaker 2: provide that for everybody affected for two years.
Speaker 3: At least. We can't protect all identity theft.
Speaker 1: We are required to point that out. But also twenty
Speaker 1: five million seems like a pretty a pretty low blood
Speaker 1: price to pay for this because what you've just described here, Matt,
Speaker 1: and there are other very similar cyber attacks we talked
Speaker 1: about too later.
Speaker 2: But what you've.
Speaker 1: Described is the dream ingredient list for identity theft. It's
Speaker 1: all the stuff you need, except like you don't need
Speaker 1: the routing number because bank routing numbers are public informations,
Speaker 1: So now you can do any number of things. I
Speaker 1: think you're right, man, I think it's time to freeze
Speaker 1: the credit. I think also any financial boffin will readily
Speaker 1: tell you, tell all of us that we are supposed
Speaker 1: to have our credit at a freeze and only unlock
Speaker 1: it when we're doing stuff and then lock it right
Speaker 1: back up, just like how you close the refrige when
Speaker 1: you take out the leftover case. Do you.
Speaker 2: I can't see a really good reason to not function
Speaker 2: that way, Ben, and I currently don't function that way
Speaker 2: all the time, and it's often one of those things
Speaker 2: I think meant for many of us. You're just not
Speaker 2: thinking about freezing your credit, right. It is like accidentally,
Speaker 2: You're right, Ben, It's like accidentally leaving the door open.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: We need to just do that. So let's let's all
Speaker 2: try it. Let's give it a try. I know it's
Speaker 2: one of the things that's on the top of my
Speaker 2: list to get done. Right now. Just freeze everything, make
Speaker 2: sure we're good, and honestly get a new account number,
Speaker 2: because if my bank account number is rolling around out there.
Speaker 2: I don't really like that. I don't like that at all.
Speaker 1: Actually, what no way?
Speaker 2: Yeah, So there's a lot more you can read about
Speaker 2: this from the Register. Some great writing by Jessica Hardcastle
Speaker 2: over there also came out on December eighteenth. It's discussing
Speaker 2: more of like basically, how they're responding to this. So
Speaker 2: I guess the other question is what do we do right.
Speaker 2: We've talked about maybe potential actions you can take independently.
Speaker 2: Can you reach out to mister Cooper directly? Well? According
Speaker 2: to some writing in The New York Times by Stacy
Speaker 2: Cowley cowl Y from November seventh, mister Cooper had set
Speaker 2: up a website to provide information to anybody who has
Speaker 2: been affected. It also says, at least according to Stacy,
Speaker 2: that they are quote truly sorry because there were actually
Speaker 2: network disruptions back in November guys, where people who are
Speaker 2: trying to pay their mortgage bills couldn't pay them because
Speaker 2: the website for mister Cooper, the portal I guess that
Speaker 2: you used to go in and pay, wasn't functioning because
Speaker 2: they were, at least according to mister Cooper, they shut
Speaker 2: down portions of their servers that were affected, right, and
Speaker 2: some of those portions also had to do with their
Speaker 2: website and how it functions, which is not great for users. Nope,
Speaker 2: But on this New York Times piece by Stacy Cowley,
Speaker 2: there's a link to a website. But I don't know
Speaker 2: about you guys. I would click in that website. It's
Speaker 2: incident dot mister cooperinfo dot com, and I'm not seeing
Speaker 2: anything pull up.
Speaker 3: It's like kind of logjamming.
Speaker 1: We were talking about this off air.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I tried to go to the website as well. By
Speaker 1: the way, that's Mr Cooper, so not mister spelled out. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and it's not loading for any of us. If you
Speaker 1: go to the mister Cooper website, that works.
Speaker 2: But that's good.
Speaker 1: They'll gladly sell you a home or help you refinance.
Speaker 1: But the and the help center appears to still be up.
Speaker 1: You can get their mailing address. Since no one sends
Speaker 1: letters anymore, those things do have an impact, I think.
Speaker 1: But but yeah, it's curious. It's the worst time for
Speaker 1: their website to go down. And I just got the
Speaker 1: right now we're cooking live. I just got the this
Speaker 1: site can't be reached message after try to go a
Speaker 1: couple of times. Okay, unanimous, then they must be tuning in.
Speaker 1: Nice to hear from you, mister C that this is
Speaker 1: this not indicative of Like I don't know if I
Speaker 1: have confirmation bias or if I'm just seeing the things
Speaker 1: I'm looking for. But doesn't it seem like there are
Speaker 1: more cyber attacks happening now? Like Sony just had that
Speaker 1: massive hack from GM MGM just had a massive hack. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and then there was there was another one. I can't remember.
Speaker 1: It's like it's getting tough to keep track of all
Speaker 1: of them. Oh, Exfinity we mentioned I'm beginning, Yeah, thirty
Speaker 1: six million people. This is a little bit different though,
Speaker 1: because of the degree of information that has been spilled,
Speaker 1: And for anybody who doesn't know, could you maybe walk
Speaker 1: us through like how these hackers rap fit from this,
Speaker 1: because these guys are selling it right or attemptation.
Speaker 2: If they were able to sell it to a third
Speaker 2: party or a third parties. Often this information gets stolen
Speaker 2: in bulk then basically packaged so that it can be
Speaker 2: sold to other countries. So probably non state actors in
Speaker 2: other countries. I would imagine just on again the dark
Speaker 2: web somewhere when those people have it. The most common
Speaker 2: thing for this type of identity theft information is for
Speaker 2: it to be used to open credit lines or lines
Speaker 2: of credit in other people's identities basically, And it's very
Speaker 2: weird because you can take those lines of credit and
Speaker 2: go to places like Vegas and then you can go
Speaker 2: gamble a bunch of money with somebody else's credit line
Speaker 2: that you've created, and then if you get any cash winnings,
Speaker 2: you just take it and run or you know, quietly,
Speaker 2: calmly exit the building as to not raise suspicion. It's
Speaker 2: really scary because you can also do things like go
Speaker 2: and buy a bunch of like AFT cards.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the oldest like grift in the book is like
Speaker 3: you know, return stealing things and then returning it to
Speaker 3: another store and getting you know, store credit because a
Speaker 3: lot of places are pretty lax about receipts. There's any
Speaker 3: number of ways to incorporate that sort of more old
Speaker 3: school grift into to what you're talking about here.
Speaker 1: You can also use this to secure a short term
Speaker 1: loan and then use that loan to make a purchase
Speaker 1: of a large thing like a house, and then sell
Speaker 1: the house very quickly for a profit. So there are
Speaker 1: multiple avenues of advantage here to this con and it's
Speaker 1: actually the thing that I think is likewise frightening is
Speaker 1: it's not tough to get away with this. It not
Speaker 1: like it's not like faking or death. Faking your death
Speaker 1: is very difficult, but doing a grift like this with
Speaker 1: someone else's identity, you can get away, and people do
Speaker 1: every year.
Speaker 2: Yeah, buying cars is another big thing. I've personally seen
Speaker 2: that happen in my life. It is really just a
Speaker 2: creepy thing. So just keep keep a lookout for more
Speaker 2: of these types of data breaches, make sure when your
Speaker 2: stuff is in one of them, as in I think
Speaker 2: a few of us might have gotten caught up in
Speaker 2: the Exfinity thing. Nothing, it's fine, just smile and move on,
Speaker 2: but take actions to protect yourself.
Speaker 3: I did have a fraud situation where I had like
Speaker 3: a very unusual charge on my bank account just fyi,
Speaker 3: and for a little bit of you know, protect yourself.
Speaker 3: It was tied to Apple Pay, which is, you know,
Speaker 3: obviously you can get Apple credit, but I have my
Speaker 3: debit card, you know, in my Apple wallet. And if
Speaker 3: you ever lazily sign up for a service using your
Speaker 3: Apple Pay or your Apple Wallet, they forever have that
Speaker 3: link to your card. And I don't know what this
Speaker 3: thing was, but I literally had to remove my card
Speaker 3: from my Apple Wallet and manually added back in and
Speaker 3: I reported the charge and I was able to get
Speaker 3: it reversed. But that was sort of an eye opener
Speaker 3: for me.
Speaker 1: I would strongly suggest I'm not a expert, thankfully in
Speaker 1: these sorts of shenanigans, but I would I would strongly
Speaker 1: suggest the following, which I have found to be advantageous.
Speaker 1: If you are interacting with one of those digital payment
Speaker 1: hubs like an Amazon a subscription service and Apple Pay, PlayStation,
Speaker 1: Xbox Store, et cetera, have have some kind of credit
Speaker 1: card if possible, if you have the wherewithal that you
Speaker 1: only use for that, do not attach it to your
Speaker 1: debit card because it's much easier to get things repaired
Speaker 1: when you have a credit card, So like Prince, and
Speaker 1: it will help your credit score too, that crazy byzantine,
Speaker 1: arbitrary bullshit that we all have to participate in in
Speaker 1: the United States right and many other countries. Obviously, to
Speaker 1: be FITIR got to.
Speaker 2: Get a good score or you're worthless to US Credits America, which.
Speaker 1: Is also on the way. I didn't tell you guys
Speaker 1: I hung out with On previous evening, I went and
Speaker 1: hung out with some pretty cool guys from the United Kingdom.
Speaker 1: They do a show called high on Homegrown. I've never
Speaker 1: learned their real names. I don't know what they look like.
Speaker 1: They are professional growers of things and they and they
Speaker 1: were talking about this exactly what we're talking about. They
Speaker 1: were talking about the tricky world of digital payments and
Speaker 1: a bit of the grifting that can occur. And they
Speaker 1: they're like us, they're very anti grifting. So just to
Speaker 1: be clear, they weren't like this is great.
Speaker 2: I got another random cash aff card in the mail,
Speaker 2: somebody named like Johnny Cash sixty nine. Why anyway, All right, y'all,
Speaker 2: we'll be right back with more strange news. But protect
Speaker 2: your wallet, protect your check, Yes, protect your check.
Speaker 3: And we're back with another piece of strange news. This
Speaker 3: is a fun one. We've talked a lot about the
Speaker 3: whole war against humans. It's happening seemingly in the animal kingdom.
Speaker 3: You know, you got your orcas trying to capsize boats,
Speaker 3: all of that good stuff. Well, now it seems that
Speaker 3: the war against humans has taken an interesting evolutionary turn.
Speaker 3: We always talk about how one of the superpowers of
Speaker 3: being a human is our opposable thumbs. It allows us
Speaker 3: to grip things in certain ways and also, you know,
Speaker 3: show that we're pleased or displeased with something. But it's
Speaker 3: something that typically most members of the cetacean kingdom or
Speaker 3: most cetaceans do not have. They have flippers. We know
Speaker 3: that dolphins are very, very intelligent. They've been studied in
Speaker 3: terms of their ability to communicate with each other, and
Speaker 3: they're vast intellect They've often been featured in science fiction.
Speaker 2: Of course.
Speaker 3: Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, you know, presents them as
Speaker 3: sort of the most intelligent creatures on Earth. Or actually
Speaker 3: I believe Ben maybe you know, aren't they like aliens
Speaker 3: kind of they're meant to be seen as aliens and
Speaker 3: they're the one guy. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.
Speaker 1: They're the benevolent, better life form. And they get word
Speaker 1: that Earth is going to be destroyed, and so they
Speaker 1: they big people, a very nice, very warm, but firm goodbye,
Speaker 1: thanks for all so long, all the fish.
Speaker 3: That's right. Well, it turns out whether this is an
Speaker 3: evolutionary thing that's going to take or not. Marine biologists
Speaker 3: studying the Gulf of Corinth, which is near Greece, recently
Speaker 3: discovered a dolphin, one in particular an individual that has
Speaker 3: you know, let's just call it developed thumbs. What it
Speaker 3: really looks a lot more like, which honestly is pretty
Speaker 3: awesome in and of itself, is both fins kind of
Speaker 3: resemble like a bottle opener, you know, where you have
Speaker 3: the little hook at the bottom and then the long
Speaker 3: piece and you use that to pop the cap off
Speaker 3: of your you know, tasty beverage. Well that's what they observed.
Speaker 3: Researchers spotted this very strange dolphin twice this past summer
Speaker 3: while doing some surveys near Greece. And there's a great
Speaker 3: article in All That's Interesting by Colleena Fraga that describes
Speaker 3: the whole thing, using some citations from USA Today as well.
Speaker 3: In fact, let's do a quote here. One of the
Speaker 3: researchers named Alexandro's Francis, who is the scientific coordinator and
Speaker 3: president of the Polagos Cetacean Research Institute, spoke to Live Science,
Speaker 3: and I believe maybe the Live Science quote was also
Speaker 3: reprinted in USA Today, saying that the dolphin was seen
Speaker 3: a swimming, leaping, bow riding, and playing, and seemed perfectly
Speaker 3: capable of keeping up with the pod despite this unusual adaptation.
Speaker 3: Now we've talked about this a lot. Sometimes, you know,
Speaker 3: a mutation can be not advantageous, but it's when it
Speaker 3: becomes advantageous that it may be, in a long enough timeline,
Speaker 3: becomes an evolution. It's way too early to discuss whether
Speaker 3: that's the case here or not. It does appear that
Speaker 3: this is what you might consider a deformity, you know,
Speaker 3: within this cetacean group. But if it proves to be
Speaker 3: advantageou you know, given conditions, perhaps it could become an evolution.
Speaker 3: You know. Let's see, there's another really good quote here
Speaker 3: from USA Today. Francis says, the fact that this irregularity
Speaker 3: is found in both flippers of the dolphin and no
Speaker 3: injuries or skin lesions are present explains why this could
Speaker 3: not be an illness but an expression of very rare genes.
Speaker 3: This is exciting, kind of exciting, slash terrifying.
Speaker 2: No, we need to make sure this dolphin, this particular dolphin,
Speaker 2: is out there breeding like crazy. We need more dolphins
Speaker 2: with thumbs. I'm into this.
Speaker 3: He says. Francis says that this could well be the
Speaker 3: result of constant inbreeding, which you know inherently is a
Speaker 3: good thing and usually does generate genetic irregularities that are
Speaker 3: not good. But in this case, it's kind of a
Speaker 3: It seems like it might be a leg up or
Speaker 3: a thumb up. I don't know, what do you guys think?
Speaker 3: Let me add one more little detail here. During a
Speaker 3: dolphin's development, the article says, in the womb, these fingers
Speaker 3: I guess, are surrounded by cells, and these cells merge
Speaker 3: together to create this contiguous flipper or paddle like appendage.
Speaker 3: The space or the cells between the fingers, which I
Speaker 3: guess is what it looks like as they're developing die
Speaker 3: off prior to birth. But in this situation, that doesn't
Speaker 3: seem to have happened. And another researcher, Lisa Noel Cooper,
Speaker 3: told Life Science and she is from the Northwest Ohio
Speaker 3: Medical University, it looks to me like the cells that
Speaker 3: normally would have formed the equivalent of our index and
Speaker 3: middle fingers died off in a strange event when the
Speaker 3: flipper was forming while the calf was still in the womb.
Speaker 3: It's pretty wild, man. This dolphin was one of thirteen
Speaker 3: hundred striped dolphins known as Stenella coraloelba and they exist,
Speaker 3: you know, there in the Gulf of Corinth, and they
Speaker 3: are in fact isolated from a lot of other dolphins
Speaker 3: in the Mediterranean, So they are the subject of a
Speaker 3: lot of observation from that Pelagos Cetacean Research Institute since
Speaker 3: as far back as nineteen ninety five.
Speaker 1: We don't know if it's environmentally dependent operation or whether
Speaker 1: it is to your point, in genetic or inbreeding. But
Speaker 1: it could also be atavism, you know, because the ancestors
Speaker 1: of dolphins were four legged land mammals and they eventually
Speaker 1: returned to the ocean, right, So there's a number of
Speaker 1: factors that it could be. And if I'm aware, correct
Speaker 1: me if I'm wrong on this, snol, I don't. I
Speaker 1: think the dolphin has been sighted but has not been
Speaker 1: like it's weird to say it this way apprehended a
Speaker 1: studied Like, No, there's no DNA test, And until there
Speaker 1: is further investigation, the humans aren't going to know whether
Speaker 1: this is a one off thing that was due to
Speaker 1: environmental factors. The way that other maritime life might be
Speaker 1: exposed to human created contaminants that mess up their development.
Speaker 1: We don't know whether the dolphin has tried to grab anything.
Speaker 1: We don't know whether it's a a genetic precedent that
Speaker 1: could lead to more breeding. But usually in these cases,
Speaker 1: quite often those sorts of mutations will tend to be
Speaker 1: one off or recessive traits. So you got to find
Speaker 1: the other thumbed dolphin, bro if you're tuning in, if
Speaker 1: you're listening.
Speaker 3: Well, and again, I think it would require some conditional
Speaker 3: situation that would make such a mutation super advantageous to
Speaker 3: the point where it would kill off other individuals, you know,
Speaker 3: in the group that don't have that. That's to my understanding,
Speaker 3: my very rough understanding of evolution. That's kind of how
Speaker 3: it works. You know, on a long timeline, like a
Speaker 3: mutation happens, it's kind of random. But then the ones
Speaker 3: that sort of you know, rise to the top are
Speaker 3: because all of a sudden, not all of a sudden,
Speaker 3: are over time conditions make that a really good trait
Speaker 3: to have, and the ones that don't have that trait
Speaker 3: are at a disadvantage. Therefore, the ones that have it
Speaker 3: are the ones that carry on and continue to breed.
Speaker 3: And you know, therefore the evolutionary trait kicks in. There
Speaker 3: is one last quote I want to read from Cooper,
Speaker 3: the Ohio researcher. I believe the hook to your point
Speaker 3: about grabbing things, Ben, the hook shaped thumb may have
Speaker 3: some bone inside it, but it certainly isn't mobile. No
Speaker 3: cetaceans have mobile thumbs. So so, while it's a very
Speaker 3: interesting kind of buzzy thing to talk about, we don't
Speaker 3: have dolphins yet that can like operate a doorknob.
Speaker 1: Do we talk about I mean, why would that's that's
Speaker 1: a dolphin steeze, right, But Joe, dolphins are able to
Speaker 1: improvise tools, right, they are sure they have that level
Speaker 1: of intelligence. And did we mentioned mentioned there's stripe dolphins
Speaker 1: did we talk about? Like you said they're isolated. There's
Speaker 1: there's a line of one of the articles you shared
Speaker 1: with a snool that says you have to put these
Speaker 1: dolphins in perspective to the larger dolphin population. And the
Speaker 1: book goes to put this pod in perspective the genetic
Speaker 1: distance between these dolphins and other like quote unquote common dolphins.
Speaker 1: Dolphins don't get offended. If you're listening, you're all amazing,
Speaker 1: they say they are. The genetic distance is like if
Speaker 1: humans lived in a mixed species society with chimpanzees and gorillas. WHOA, yeah,
Speaker 1: so that's that's a big deal. That's further. That's more
Speaker 1: of a distance than I had imagined. I am outside
Speaker 1: of like the Yangze dolphins in China. I had always
Speaker 1: just thought, yeah, dolphins, you know, they might have some differences,
Speaker 1: but they're more or less on the same vibe. And
Speaker 1: this appears not to be the case.
Speaker 3: Does I don't know, Matt any any final thoughts here.
Speaker 3: I think I've said all I have to say about
Speaker 3: this one. It's super interesting.
Speaker 2: Well, I just wonder if it's a toy story situation dolphins.
Speaker 2: Dolphins won't let us observe them when they're using their thumbs,
Speaker 2: you know, they know when we're watching, but they're down there. Look,
Speaker 2: it's a water planet, guys, and these dolphins are pretty
Speaker 2: dang smart.
Speaker 3: They sure know well, like I said, at the very least,
Speaker 3: even if they're not a prehensile, I guess they could
Speaker 3: serve as sort of a bottle opener type fulcrum, you know,
Speaker 3: if there are bones and they're rigid enough. They speaking
Speaker 3: of improvising tools, this would be another type of tool
Speaker 3: that could be used, I guess in theory, but I'm
Speaker 3: no dolphin scientist here, but yeah.
Speaker 2: Well, just weirdly enough, I noticed from the pictures the
Speaker 2: hook part is I would categorize it as the hook
Speaker 2: is facing backwards.
Speaker 3: That's true, so it wouldn't be as useful as a
Speaker 3: bottle opener.
Speaker 1: You're totally right, all right, but we're thinking in terms
Speaker 1: of human tools. Let's keep that right.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, well, I'm thinking in terms of being able
Speaker 2: to hook something on to the dolphin as it travels forward,
Speaker 2: which is generally the way the dolphin travels, right, because
Speaker 2: that could be extremely helpful in some instances, right, to
Speaker 2: see what you're saying, imagine to clear away some netting
Speaker 2: or something that's in the way that's blocking other dolphins
Speaker 2: in their pod.
Speaker 3: Wow, you're really thinking big on this one, Matt. That's
Speaker 3: a good point because we know that dolphins are often,
Speaker 3: you know, the victim of getting tangled up in here
Speaker 3: garbage like what do you call those these plastic rings
Speaker 3: that cans come in and things like that, or netting
Speaker 3: designed for tuna or other fish. This could potentially allow
Speaker 3: these dolphins to like rescue others or like free themselves.
Speaker 3: That's a really good point.
Speaker 2: Theoretically, but not in this particular dolphin. I don't. Well,
Speaker 2: maybe maybe I'm just.
Speaker 3: How rigid it is, right, I guess.
Speaker 2: But the hook is kind of backwards for those purposes, right,
Speaker 2: I mean, just at least what I'm seeing here, it
Speaker 2: would be difficult unless it moved in a different way.
Speaker 3: It is really interestingly hooked though, the little like it
Speaker 3: is a perfect little lip, this thing that we're looking at.
Speaker 3: It's very interesting.
Speaker 1: And it was just cited twice last summer. So I
Speaker 1: don't know the whereabouts of this current dolphin. Now, we
Speaker 1: don't know how these formations occurred. It reminds me the
Speaker 1: conversation about mutation. Additionally, in the world of evolution, if
Speaker 1: a mutation does not it doesn't have to help the
Speaker 1: creature to continue. It just has to not harm the
Speaker 1: creature in a relative way and not impede reproduction. So
Speaker 1: it kind of reminds me about how humans developed a
Speaker 1: blue eye. So you trace it back and there's like
Speaker 1: one person in the ancient days of modern day Estonia
Speaker 1: blue eyes. They were probably advantageous because you know, they
Speaker 1: were pretty or whatever. It managed not to be burned
Speaker 1: for witchcraft, but that mutation successfully spread and then occurred
Speaker 1: in other parts of the world. I would be very
Speaker 1: interested in just learning more about this dolphin, because we
Speaker 1: have to realize all of the maritime all maritime floor
Speaker 1: in fauna is under intense danger right now, right from
Speaker 1: a number of reasons, including ocean acidification and so on.
Speaker 1: These dolphins were apparently stranded along the coast of Greece
Speaker 1: for like thirty years, according to Alexandros Francis.
Speaker 3: Jeez, yeah, I didn't catch that part. And no, and
Speaker 3: that's also kind of therein lies the I guess, sort
Speaker 3: of gallows humory joke about the idea that the animal
Speaker 3: kingdom is coming for us, in particular the maritime ones.
Speaker 3: I think that's what's made most of the headlines, is
Speaker 3: like these orcas trying to you know, capsize fishing vessels,
Speaker 3: and that's you know, even the film Orca, you know,
Speaker 3: which is sort of a ripoff of Jaws, is very
Speaker 3: much about that, or the idea of Moby Dick, you know,
Speaker 3: targeting and coming after Captain Ahab. So, yeah, you're absolutely right.
Speaker 3: They really are under serious threat, and perhaps that serious
Speaker 3: threat could be enough of an environmental threat that could
Speaker 3: cause evolutionary traits, you know, to accelerate. Perhaps, I don't know,
Speaker 3: what do you say we take a quick break here,
Speaker 3: a word from our sponsor, and then come back with
Speaker 3: one more piece of strange news.
Speaker 1: And we have returned. Let's stay in the world of
Speaker 1: all things osceotic, and let's let's let's get into it
Speaker 1: this way with the talk of a continual hobby horse
Speaker 1: of mine. I think all of us who gets to
Speaker 1: name military operations? Who is the person who has the
Speaker 1: job where they say, you know what, let's call it Mockingbird,
Speaker 1: and someone's like, oh, let's call it operation Red Beam,
Speaker 1: and someone goes, no Blue Beam and they're like, damn,
Speaker 1: you're good at this.
Speaker 3: Or if it's outsourced, it ends up being called body
Speaker 3: macboat face. Right, Wasn't that a military vessel that.
Speaker 1: Was crowdsourcing the name of military vessel. I'd like to
Speaker 1: introduce all of us to one of the hottest new
Speaker 1: things in the Red Sea, Operation Prosperity Guardian. Your old
Speaker 1: pal uncle Sam and allies are officially protecting ships in
Speaker 1: the Red Sea from Huti cough cough Iranian attacks. This
Speaker 1: is something that is going to be incredibly important later
Speaker 1: and indeed it's going to lead to some dangerous outcomes.
Speaker 1: Here's what happened. This happened quite recently December twenty twenty
Speaker 1: three as we are recording this. The Huthi Group or
Speaker 1: a Uti group is a proxy military of Raan and
Speaker 1: they are fighting in Yemen. Are They have been launching
Speaker 1: drone attacks and firing things at private shipping vessels going
Speaker 1: through the Strait of Hormuz, in the Red Sea, the
Speaker 1: Gulf of Aden, and so on. The United States reacted
Speaker 1: to this. Finally, the Secretary of Defense, as we record,
Speaker 1: Lloyd Austin, said, We're forming an international maritime security force.
Speaker 1: Who's in this weird justice league the United Kingdom, Bahrain, Canada, France, Italy, Netherlands, Norway,
Speaker 1: s Chel and Spain and then also some partners who
Speaker 1: asked not to be named, which, yeah, a bit of
Speaker 1: a flag there, my favorite flag. And so this has
Speaker 1: set the world, the international relations world a buzz. This
Speaker 1: also comes on the heels of the newly revealed information
Speaker 1: of the conversation between everybody's favorite uncle Uncle GI and
Speaker 1: US President Biden, wherein g basically told Joe, look, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna get Taiwan. Dude, I'm gonna get Taiwan. I don't
Speaker 1: have a timeline on it. I'm a busy guy, but
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get it.
Speaker 3: It will be fine. Oh yes, it will be mine.
Speaker 3: Like like Wayne's thrilled with the guitar.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Gi, probably, I mean obviously heard our episode on
Speaker 1: semiconductors and chips, So I guess he needed to needed
Speaker 1: to make that statement of what we're saying is things
Speaker 1: are becoming increasingly instable the or unstable. The Hooti forces
Speaker 1: have been launching these attacks for quite some time. This
Speaker 1: is not new beans weird time to make a community quote.
Speaker 1: But shout out to anybody who got that reference.
Speaker 3: Well, old beans is your thing, so new means yeah.
Speaker 1: New beans is the is the social approval app episode
Speaker 1: of communities with a nice appearance from Tim and Eric.
Speaker 1: So the Houtis have been fighting the Kingdom of Saudi
Speaker 1: Arabia in Yemen since twenty fifteen, and because of the
Speaker 1: complex web of relationships between Saudi Arabia and the West,
Speaker 1: vivisected journalists, notwithstanding the US and Europe typically are going
Speaker 1: to side with Saudi Arabia in these things and supply
Speaker 1: them with infrastructure, military training, all the evil toys of war.
Speaker 1: This is an escalation. This means that the US is
Speaker 1: now verging closer and closer to what we would call
Speaker 1: a hot war, an active conflict. And if this depending
Speaker 1: on how Operation Prosperity Guardian goes, great name, guys, Depending
Speaker 1: on how this goes, we may be looking at a
Speaker 1: situation that escalates quite quickly. It's dangerous stuff and it's
Speaker 1: dangerous water. We don't know what the consequences will be,
Speaker 1: but we know the West needs to do a better
Speaker 1: job reported on it well.
Speaker 3: Whose prosperity is being guarded is the question.
Speaker 1: The prosperity being guarded would be that of private and
Speaker 1: state sponsored shipping vessels and the companies that own those
Speaker 1: or the companies that profit from the resources those things transport.
Speaker 2: I'm reading through the AP News article you shared with
Speaker 2: this Ben, just trying to like understand it as much
Speaker 2: as I can. The pushback is pretty intense from other countries.
Speaker 2: Who are, you know, support in support of countries in
Speaker 2: the area other than Israel.
Speaker 1: I mean, this is a global choke point. It doesn't
Speaker 1: matter where you live, the economic activity in the Red
Speaker 1: Sea affects you. Kind of like the Strait of Malacca, right,
Speaker 1: which is the reason Singapore has encountered such prosperity. Right now,
Speaker 1: at any point in time, there are somewhere around four
Speaker 1: hundred commercial vessels going through this tie little part of
Speaker 1: the Red Sea. You want to shout out Tara Copp
Speaker 1: and Lolita c. Baldor over AP News for the information here.
Speaker 1: Like you said, they're catching heat because of the US's
Speaker 1: relationship with Israel, and indeed it's quite possible that they
Speaker 1: have more Middle Eastern partners than just Bahrain. But those
Speaker 1: Middle Eastern states want to stay anonymous because they can't
Speaker 1: take the heat of being affiliated with something that might
Speaker 1: be in support of Israel. It's a weird game where
Speaker 1: everybody has these contradictory interest these unrelated interests, and everybody
Speaker 1: has agreed, at least in Operation Prosperity Guardian, everyone is
Speaker 1: agreed that their interest aligned on one goal, which is
Speaker 1: to keep the fossil fuel resources flowing through the Red Sea.
Speaker 1: And as we know, when wars actually happen, it's not
Speaker 1: a matter of ideology. It might be dressed up as
Speaker 1: that it might sound good in political speeches and in
Speaker 1: military monologues, but wars are always about resources. So if
Speaker 1: you want to see where a war might start, you
Speaker 1: have to look at stuff like this. And I'm I'm
Speaker 1: just baffled that so much stuff goes through this. Fifteen
Speaker 1: percent of the goods that go into Europe, in the
Speaker 1: Middle East and North Africa go from the Gulf and
Speaker 1: from Asia via sea, and then that's like more than
Speaker 1: twenty percent of refined oil, et cetera, et cetera. There's
Speaker 1: a lot on the line. I don't know. I wanted
Speaker 1: to ask you guys in terms of this kind of stuff.
Speaker 1: Am I crazy for thinking of things like how Operation
Speaker 1: Desert Fox turned into Desert Shield and then escalated into
Speaker 1: the Iraq War? Like? Is that a lot?
Speaker 3: I don't think so at all. Oh, I don't think
Speaker 3: you're far off the mark at all.
Speaker 2: It's just so it's just so weird because it when
Speaker 2: we have when we can look back at something like that, right,
Speaker 2: it does appear that there are direct American interests at play.
Speaker 2: I wonder, I just wonder if you could point to
Speaker 2: them directly right now in this you know, what are
Speaker 2: the American interests outside of just protecting Israel as one
Speaker 2: of the primary goals right as a primary ally, Are
Speaker 2: there any other interests that America is playing here besides
Speaker 2: just securing trade.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the domestic economy. Securing trade is one of the
Speaker 1: big things, because it's like picture of the United in
Speaker 1: the world overall. We we've got to picture the United
Speaker 1: States somewhat like rust goal in true detective bad men
Speaker 1: who keep the other bad men from the door. Very
Speaker 1: as as the world's current hedgemond, the US has projection
Speaker 1: that no other countries are capable of or willing to match,
Speaker 1: and a great deal of US activity abroad, in theory,
Speaker 1: is meant to ensure global trade stability. That's like all
Speaker 1: they're saying they're doing, even when they get up to
Speaker 1: some shenanigans, which we hear about pretty often from our
Speaker 1: fellow conspiracy realists. There are big international companies that have
Speaker 1: a lot of a lot of heft in the United States,
Speaker 1: like BP British Petroleum, but they're super deep in the States.
Speaker 1: They said they're going to pause all oil shipments through
Speaker 1: the Red Sea due to the deteriorating security in the region,
Speaker 1: and that is huge, not just for the US, not
Speaker 1: just for the United Kingdom, but you know, countries that
Speaker 1: use fossil fuels, which is all of them, Yeah, pretty
Speaker 1: much most of you know.
Speaker 3: I can't help but hear the name of this opera
Speaker 3: and think about the idea of prosperity theology or prosperity gospel.
Speaker 3: It's sort of almost like a buzz term that usually
Speaker 3: doesn't mean what you think it means, or it's sort
Speaker 3: of like inherent inherently a bit of a grift. I
Speaker 3: don't know, maybe I'm just like getting triggered by that term.
Speaker 3: But do you have any thoughts around that? The meaning
Speaker 3: behind the name?
Speaker 1: You know, I've got some speculation. I want to say,
Speaker 1: they're just guarding prosperity. Right, the name at least we're
Speaker 1: talking about the spitoff Ara. The name at least feels
Speaker 1: a little more transparent than names of operations in the past.
Speaker 1: But it's also clearly marketed to be a name that
Speaker 1: everyone can agree with, right, Like, you're not going to
Speaker 1: sign up what you don't guard prosperity?
Speaker 3: What do you It seems like a like a like
Speaker 3: a no, duh kind of course we should do that.
Speaker 3: Everyone needs to prosper right, Why would we not want
Speaker 3: to protect that?
Speaker 1: China said, good luck, they're not participating by the way, ahh,
Speaker 1: I just had to add that part of there.
Speaker 3: That's very telling, isn't it.
Speaker 1: I mean it feels like it, but we also have
Speaker 1: to be careful not to you know, read tea leaves
Speaker 1: or make connections that we cannot prove.
Speaker 3: But yeah, it.
Speaker 1: Does feel indicative of a larger process or phenomenon. Also
Speaker 1: for the Hooty side, they issued a statement and they said, look,
Speaker 1: we'll destroy the coalition fleet. You guys love this quote.
Speaker 1: They said the Red Sea will be your graveyard. So
Speaker 1: they're super not chill about this.
Speaker 3: I mean, the Red Sea I've always found to already
Speaker 3: have a pretty ominous name, you know, like Sea of Blood.
Speaker 2: But we know that won't be true.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 2: The navel might that we're talking about here is intense.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, the I think it's often easy for people
Speaker 1: who live in the US have not seen the exercise
Speaker 1: of US military acumen. It's easy to forget that they
Speaker 1: can and will reign fire, right, yeah, just the only
Speaker 1: thing stopping them is international norms, sure, right, international norms
Speaker 1: and then consequences with your neighbors. Right, So you've got
Speaker 1: to you've got to be you've got to attempt to
Speaker 1: go through institutions like the UN. The Biden administration already
Speaker 1: wrote to the UN Security Council and said, hey, can
Speaker 1: the UN send somebody in to stop these attacks? And
Speaker 1: the UN said, hey, maybe we'll form a committee to
Speaker 1: see about setting up a meeting or something. And then
Speaker 1: the United States said, yeah, hold my beer. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: think it is I think it is worrying though, because
Speaker 1: we're talking about air land and sea force projection, and
Speaker 1: what gets lost in these conversations about business, about global stability,
Speaker 1: about the status quo, is that the people of Yemen
Speaker 1: have been faking massacred for years and it didn't matter
Speaker 1: who was president in the US. And it didn't matter, Honestly,
Speaker 1: when it sound cynical, it didn't matter who you voted for.
Speaker 1: Those bombs kept falling.
Speaker 3: We don't really do humanitarian stuff unless it benefits us financially,
Speaker 3: you know. I mean, I'm sorry, that's just the truth,
Speaker 3: you know. I mean, even even intervention, you know, against
Speaker 3: the Nazis took ages, and it wasn't until it was
Speaker 3: like we couldn't not do it, Like public opinion would
Speaker 3: not allow us to not intervene. We would have been
Speaker 3: on the wrong side of history. These conversations were had.
Speaker 3: You know, it's like, I guess we gotta do it,
Speaker 3: you know, or it's going to create this problem that
Speaker 3: we will have to deal with down the line. You know.
Speaker 1: It's it's all very self serving.
Speaker 3: Man, it's so self serving.
Speaker 1: It took a Pearl Harbor to galvanize the isolationist American
Speaker 1: public into World War Two. It took a nine to
Speaker 1: eleven to gather public support of interventions continuing escalating interventions
Speaker 1: in a rock. I mean, I don't know, and that was.
Speaker 3: The meal ticket nine eleven, you know, just to like, Okay,
Speaker 3: now we will be interventionists, but behind the guys of
Speaker 3: this world police situation, we're the good guys. Because that
Speaker 3: sort of like created that persona, but that's not really
Speaker 3: what we're doing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and tune in. We've got some episodes about stuff
Speaker 1: like that on the wave, folks. It's deep water. Also,
Speaker 1: I guess, in defense of the Chinese government's calculus, what
Speaker 1: would China gain from becoming a vault in this If
Speaker 1: you already have a group of people who say we'll
Speaker 1: do these dirty dishes, do you need to go to
Speaker 1: the sink too? Or you just like what to the
Speaker 1: question about cost benefit, What is to be gained from this?
Speaker 1: I don't know. It's tricky.
Speaker 3: It is super tricky. Yeah, and Dicky, yeah yeah.
Speaker 1: I want us to hear from a fellow conspiracy realist
Speaker 1: who have experience in the Red Sea. You want to
Speaker 1: hear your thoughts on Operation Prosperity Guardian like it in general,
Speaker 1: the idea that the like these ships should not be
Speaker 1: fired upon. That makes sense. Sure, people working there aren't
Speaker 1: trying to overthrow a government. They're just trying to like
Speaker 1: finish out their tour and then maybe get home and
Speaker 1: eat somewhere that isn't a boat. You know what I mean.
Speaker 1: I get that the people, the civilian population of Yemen
Speaker 1: is just saying, hey, don't you know, please stop dropping
Speaker 1: bombs on us. You know, like this kind of stuff
Speaker 1: happens increasingly, just like the cyber attacks we talked about
Speaker 1: at the top of this show, like the ecoming normalized,
Speaker 1: and that normalization is dangerous. So tell us what you think,
Speaker 1: tell us what you think is next. Tell us whether
Speaker 1: you think there is a hidden hand or some other
Speaker 1: calculus that's not making the news. We did say we
Speaker 1: would try to end on one positive thing, and.
Speaker 3: I have another positive thing if I could.
Speaker 1: But yeah, yeah, yeah, ahead, you all go, you go.
Speaker 3: First, Okay, it is really quickly. I didn't want to
Speaker 3: do this as an entire story because we already covered
Speaker 3: this and it was just too distressing on so many levels.
Speaker 3: And honestly, this story is just it would be a
Speaker 3: retreading of that. But one of the main organizers behind
Speaker 3: the neo Nazi Satanic sect, Order of Nine Angles, was apprehended,
Speaker 3: the alleged mastermind behind the whole thing, and listeners will
Speaker 3: probably remember how affecting that was to all of us.
Speaker 3: It involved coercion of young people on the Internet into
Speaker 3: videos of self harm, rape, fantasy type stuff, just absolutely
Speaker 3: abominable things on discord and telegram. And I believe officers
Speaker 3: in Hawaii and Honolulu served a warrant to raid the
Speaker 3: home of an individual that is thought to be the
Speaker 3: leader of that group, so that person is now in custody.
Speaker 1: Check out our episode several years old now on the
Speaker 1: Order of the Nine Angles. It does hold up. You
Speaker 1: can hear us mention them a couple of different times
Speaker 1: throughout the life of the show. I like that. I'm
Speaker 1: glad to hear. Hopefully justice will be done. Also, AI
Speaker 1: has a gift for you for the holidays, folks. AI
Speaker 1: may just save humanity from superbugs.
Speaker 3: That's right, that makes sense modeling type stuff.
Speaker 1: That's right. Scientists are discovering the first new antibiotics in
Speaker 1: apparently over sixty years through partnership with AI. This means
Speaker 1: that one of the ways the world could end. Shout
Speaker 1: out to our buddy Josh Clark our earlier episode on superbugs,
Speaker 1: which is weird post pandemic. This means that there may
Speaker 1: be hope, there may be a way to fight these
Speaker 1: things that are statistically inevitable. And speaking of statistically inevitable,
Speaker 1: we hope it is statistically inevitable. That you write in
Speaker 1: with your thoughts, folks, what do you think about the
Speaker 1: rise of cyber attacks? Are there more happening more frequently
Speaker 1: or we just more attuned and more likely to pay
Speaker 1: attention to them? What other animals may evolve, how do
Speaker 1: these environmental pressures work and how they drive evolution? And
Speaker 1: then of course tell us about Operation Prosperity Guardian. You're
Speaker 1: very curious. We're easy to find online as well.
Speaker 3: That's right. You can find us that the handle conspiracy
Speaker 3: stuff on x YouTube and Facebook, where we have our
Speaker 3: Facebook group. Here is where it gets crazy on Instagram
Speaker 3: and TikTok. We are conspiracy stuff show.
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