1 00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:09,160 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace unbelievable. 2 00:00:10,680 --> 00:00:18,480 Speaker 2: Brian Coburger, the four time convicted killer who sliced four 3 00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:26,319 Speaker 2: beautiful University IDO students dead. Brian Coburger has filed a 4 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:32,760 Speaker 2: sexual harassment claim. 5 00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:40,280 Speaker 1: From behind bars over a but f threat. He is 6 00:00:40,360 --> 00:00:41,440 Speaker 1: also after. 7 00:00:41,400 --> 00:00:45,360 Speaker 2: One day on the j block, demanding a transfer and 8 00:00:45,400 --> 00:00:46,200 Speaker 2: of course. 9 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:47,760 Speaker 1: Whining about the food. 10 00:00:48,200 --> 00:00:55,960 Speaker 2: Yes, Brian Coburger, four time convicted killer, has filed a 11 00:00:56,120 --> 00:01:01,080 Speaker 2: sex harassment claim. I'm Nancy Grace, this is Crime Stories. 12 00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:03,120 Speaker 2: I want to thank you for being with us. 13 00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:04,959 Speaker 3: And then let me ask you. 14 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:10,880 Speaker 4: Did you on November thirteenth, twenty twenty two enter the 15 00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:14,440 Speaker 4: residents at one one two two King Road in Moscow, 16 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:16,760 Speaker 4: Idaho if you attempt to commit the developing crime with. 17 00:01:19,000 --> 00:01:25,680 Speaker 5: And I don't know a location, emergency, no way. 18 00:01:26,480 --> 00:01:29,039 Speaker 2: I rarely say this, and I would never ever say 19 00:01:29,080 --> 00:01:30,560 Speaker 2: it in front of a judge or a journey. But 20 00:01:30,600 --> 00:01:32,840 Speaker 2: I really don't even know where to start. Should I 21 00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:36,440 Speaker 2: start with this complaint? For Coburger says I have on 22 00:01:36,520 --> 00:01:39,640 Speaker 2: several occasions and not received all the items of food 23 00:01:39,680 --> 00:01:44,080 Speaker 2: on my tray. I address this during service. I guess 24 00:01:44,440 --> 00:01:47,400 Speaker 2: food service like he's have got a butler and have 25 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:50,920 Speaker 2: yet to receive any placements. In fact, the kitchen is 26 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:56,000 Speaker 2: not even called. Okay, yeah, I'm not starting with that. 27 00:01:56,320 --> 00:01:59,320 Speaker 2: I'm not starting with complaining to the butler. 28 00:01:59,560 --> 00:02:00,280 Speaker 1: I'm going to. 29 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:04,160 Speaker 2: Start and not with the sex harassment claims with the 30 00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:13,520 Speaker 2: butt f compliant. I'm gonna start with the victims. Take 31 00:02:13,560 --> 00:02:15,920 Speaker 2: a listen to this nine one. 32 00:02:15,880 --> 00:02:23,320 Speaker 5: One call can on one location of your emergency. You 33 00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:32,680 Speaker 5: don't know what what is the address of the emergency. 34 00:02:34,280 --> 00:02:39,359 Speaker 5: What is the rest of the address? Oh, King two Roads, Okay, 35 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:42,840 Speaker 5: And there's not a house or an apartment, it's the house. 36 00:02:43,639 --> 00:02:45,360 Speaker 5: Can you repeat the adress to make sure that I 37 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:45,880 Speaker 5: have it right. 38 00:02:47,360 --> 00:02:48,239 Speaker 1: I'll talk to you guys. 39 00:02:48,280 --> 00:02:51,240 Speaker 6: We're you live the lights, so we're next to them. 40 00:02:52,520 --> 00:02:54,680 Speaker 5: I need someone to repeat the address for ramification. 41 00:02:55,120 --> 00:03:00,680 Speaker 1: The address one one to two key drugs. And you hear. 42 00:03:02,240 --> 00:03:04,600 Speaker 2: The victim that lived, one of the two victims that lived, 43 00:03:04,680 --> 00:03:09,920 Speaker 2: screaming and sobbing, and she's screaming. 44 00:03:09,440 --> 00:03:11,200 Speaker 1: Out the name Xana Ethan. 45 00:03:12,120 --> 00:03:17,760 Speaker 2: And we know that Xana was attacked on the steps. 46 00:03:18,200 --> 00:03:23,440 Speaker 2: We know that Killie Gonsolvis was unrecognizable. 47 00:03:24,040 --> 00:03:27,320 Speaker 1: She was stabbed so many times in the face. 48 00:03:28,840 --> 00:03:47,520 Speaker 7: Listen she's not waking up. 49 00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:53,120 Speaker 5: Okay, one moment, I'm going to help her. 50 00:03:53,160 --> 00:04:10,240 Speaker 2: That way, before I get to Brian Cooberger's complaints that 51 00:04:10,320 --> 00:04:16,040 Speaker 2: he is being sexually harassed through the air vents and 52 00:04:16,120 --> 00:04:22,600 Speaker 2: that his food is not up to par. To Joseph 53 00:04:22,640 --> 00:04:27,960 Speaker 2: Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics, Jacksonville State University, author of Blood 54 00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:31,120 Speaker 2: Beneath My Feet on Amazon, and star of a hit 55 00:04:31,440 --> 00:04:37,440 Speaker 2: podcast Body Bags with Joe Scott Morgan, these complaints are 56 00:04:37,560 --> 00:04:43,640 Speaker 2: almost laughable if it weren't for the knowledge of what 57 00:04:43,960 --> 00:04:47,600 Speaker 2: happened to those four students. 58 00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:49,799 Speaker 1: Lay it out, We's. 59 00:04:49,600 --> 00:04:52,679 Speaker 8: Start with a number seven inches seven inches of steel 60 00:04:53,400 --> 00:04:58,599 Speaker 8: being slice, used to slice, and used to stab over 61 00:04:58,839 --> 00:05:03,680 Speaker 8: and over and over again, systematically, one by one as 62 00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:08,479 Speaker 8: he makes his way through this home. This reptile went 63 00:05:08,520 --> 00:05:12,480 Speaker 8: from the top floor to the second floor, ending lives 64 00:05:12,520 --> 00:05:16,400 Speaker 8: all along the way, leaving a trail of horror that 65 00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:20,160 Speaker 8: the police came upon that morning. And I don't think 66 00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:23,000 Speaker 8: they could actually take the measure of it, Nancy. And 67 00:05:23,040 --> 00:05:27,599 Speaker 8: then again, like more like a rat, he sneaks out 68 00:05:27,680 --> 00:05:31,080 Speaker 8: through that back door and exits and vanishes into the night. 69 00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:35,080 Speaker 8: After he's done this, and you want to complain, you 70 00:05:35,120 --> 00:05:39,159 Speaker 8: want to complain about what faces you right now, Tell 71 00:05:39,160 --> 00:05:41,039 Speaker 8: it somewhere else. Tell your story food. 72 00:05:41,080 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 1: He's actually complaining about the food. I want to get 73 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:43,880 Speaker 1: back to. 74 00:05:43,960 --> 00:05:49,640 Speaker 2: What was done, was physically done to these four students, 75 00:05:49,839 --> 00:05:53,359 Speaker 2: Joe Scott Morgan, You know, my little babies are about 76 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:55,640 Speaker 2: to go off to college, and all I can think 77 00:05:55,640 --> 00:06:03,880 Speaker 2: about is Brian fing Kobe. What was done to these students? 78 00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:06,880 Speaker 2: What did he do to them? And all you trolls 79 00:06:06,920 --> 00:06:10,080 Speaker 2: online that keep telling me he was set up, he 80 00:06:10,120 --> 00:06:13,960 Speaker 2: pled guilty to this, tell them, Joe Scott. 81 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:17,080 Speaker 8: Yeah, just starting off with Kaylee in the top room 82 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:21,000 Speaker 8: up there. You had mentioned earlier that she was unrecognizable. 83 00:06:21,520 --> 00:06:25,560 Speaker 8: The bony structures in her face are disrupted to the 84 00:06:25,600 --> 00:06:28,760 Speaker 8: point where they couldn't make a physical ID on her 85 00:06:28,960 --> 00:06:31,920 Speaker 8: just by doing the visual ID because she had been 86 00:06:31,960 --> 00:06:35,359 Speaker 8: so traumatized in addition to the other stab wounds that 87 00:06:35,440 --> 00:06:39,920 Speaker 8: she had received to her Torso you think about Xana, 88 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 8: who you know, we've heard stories about Kaylee where you 89 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:46,960 Speaker 8: know from twenty four to thirty, mister Gonzalez was saying 90 00:06:47,000 --> 00:06:53,440 Speaker 8: thirty thirty injuries with her nancy with Xana, we're talking 91 00:06:53,880 --> 00:06:58,560 Speaker 8: fifty plus over and over and over again. She was 92 00:06:58,600 --> 00:07:01,920 Speaker 8: cut so bad that she had grabbed hold of this blade. 93 00:07:01,960 --> 00:07:04,840 Speaker 8: It had cut into her tendons of her hand so 94 00:07:04,880 --> 00:07:08,120 Speaker 8: that they would literally be non operational if she's trying 95 00:07:08,160 --> 00:07:11,440 Speaker 8: to defend herself. She's got blocking injuries on both of 96 00:07:11,440 --> 00:07:15,560 Speaker 8: her forearms where her arms have been sliced repeatedly. You've 97 00:07:15,560 --> 00:07:19,720 Speaker 8: got Ethan laying in the bed. He's got a horrible 98 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:24,480 Speaker 8: gash approximating his collarbone and his neck where he bleeds 99 00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:28,760 Speaker 8: out in that spot. And you know, we can't forget 100 00:07:28,800 --> 00:07:33,760 Speaker 8: about Maddie. You know she's brutalized there in bed, adjacent 101 00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:37,440 Speaker 8: to her best friend. They've grown up together, Nancy, they 102 00:07:37,440 --> 00:07:40,200 Speaker 8: have lived life together, they've gone off to college together, 103 00:07:40,760 --> 00:07:43,960 Speaker 8: and their lives both ended in that small space together 104 00:07:44,360 --> 00:07:47,840 Speaker 8: because this animal comes into the house and shreds them. 105 00:07:47,960 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 9: You know, Scott, when you put it that way. 106 00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:56,120 Speaker 2: As you know we've discussed many times for years and 107 00:07:56,280 --> 00:07:59,920 Speaker 2: years after my fiancees murder, I would have night terrors. 108 00:08:00,200 --> 00:08:05,960 Speaker 2: Not just nightmares, it's where you wake up terrorized, screaming, running. 109 00:08:07,400 --> 00:08:13,480 Speaker 2: If that's just a dream, imagine, just imagine what these 110 00:08:14,120 --> 00:08:19,080 Speaker 2: four beautiful that I keep using that we're beautiful students 111 00:08:20,200 --> 00:08:25,080 Speaker 2: went through the night. They were slaughred by Coburger and 112 00:08:25,120 --> 00:08:28,760 Speaker 2: now he's claiming somebody sex harassing him through the air vent. 113 00:08:29,120 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 1: Hey, you know another thing. 114 00:08:30,960 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 2: I want to go straight out to a special guest. 115 00:08:33,040 --> 00:08:40,640 Speaker 2: Heather Barnhardt. She's Institute Fellow at CIS Admin Audit Network Security, 116 00:08:40,760 --> 00:08:45,479 Speaker 2: Senior Director forens at Research at Celebrate, which is amazing. 117 00:08:46,360 --> 00:08:49,959 Speaker 1: Either to top it all off, after he. 118 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:58,000 Speaker 2: Literally slaughters these four students, he gets on the phone 119 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:02,000 Speaker 2: and you can prove this and call his mommy. He 120 00:09:03,160 --> 00:09:06,840 Speaker 2: gets comforted by his mommy. And you, Heather, have been 121 00:09:06,880 --> 00:09:14,240 Speaker 2: able to analyze hours and hours of him calling mommy, 122 00:09:15,160 --> 00:09:18,520 Speaker 2: explain how you found it and what you found. 123 00:09:18,320 --> 00:09:19,440 Speaker 1: On his Android device. 124 00:09:19,520 --> 00:09:23,720 Speaker 10: We used Celebrate Physical Analyzer software to just parse the information. 125 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:26,800 Speaker 10: And one of the things that's rate in the forefront 126 00:09:27,360 --> 00:09:30,959 Speaker 10: is that Brian Koberger started calling his mom as early 127 00:09:30,960 --> 00:09:33,840 Speaker 10: as six thirteen in the morning, right after the murders 128 00:09:33,880 --> 00:09:36,319 Speaker 10: and was on the phone with her apparently when he 129 00:09:36,559 --> 00:09:37,760 Speaker 10: returned to the scene of the crime. 130 00:09:37,880 --> 00:09:42,000 Speaker 2: You mean, when he goes back that morning to just see, yes, 131 00:09:42,120 --> 00:09:47,280 Speaker 2: anyone has discovered his handiwork, his masterpiece of murder. He's 132 00:09:47,280 --> 00:09:50,680 Speaker 2: on the phone with his mother Oh, oh, my stars, 133 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:55,840 Speaker 2: I didn't get that timing from reading your analysis. Wait 134 00:09:55,880 --> 00:09:57,839 Speaker 2: a minute, I gotta let this sink in for a moment. 135 00:09:58,120 --> 00:10:03,600 Speaker 2: It's like, mommy, look, look at me. And he's on 136 00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:07,280 Speaker 2: the phone with his mommy while he's driving back to 137 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:08,800 Speaker 2: the scene of the crime that. 138 00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:10,680 Speaker 3: Morning for fifty four minutes. 139 00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:12,640 Speaker 2: Oh okay, I'm gonna have to go to a shrink, 140 00:10:12,679 --> 00:10:16,800 Speaker 2: but first I want to follow up with Heather Barnhart. Guys, 141 00:10:18,120 --> 00:10:25,000 Speaker 2: looks and brains amazing. Heather Barnhart, one of the digital 142 00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:30,400 Speaker 2: forensic investigators on the Brian Coberger quadruple murder case. 143 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:32,439 Speaker 1: And it wasn't just then. 144 00:10:32,920 --> 00:10:36,160 Speaker 2: As he's going back to survey his handiwork, he's on 145 00:10:36,240 --> 00:10:39,240 Speaker 2: the phone with mommy. He calls her first thing in 146 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:42,360 Speaker 2: the morning and they talk for an hour, then he 147 00:10:42,400 --> 00:10:45,200 Speaker 2: calls her at lunchtime. Then he has to call her 148 00:10:45,640 --> 00:10:48,880 Speaker 2: before he goes to bed at night. I mean, describe 149 00:10:49,200 --> 00:10:54,480 Speaker 2: these lengthy conversations with his mother that you uncovered. 150 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:56,520 Speaker 10: Day in and day out to go to bed, as 151 00:10:56,520 --> 00:10:58,400 Speaker 10: you just said, first thing in the morning and the 152 00:10:58,400 --> 00:11:01,960 Speaker 10: wake up texting and immediate called linked to mother every 153 00:11:02,000 --> 00:11:05,320 Speaker 10: single day. She was a huge security blanket, almost a 154 00:11:05,400 --> 00:11:06,640 Speaker 10: necessity in his. 155 00:11:06,520 --> 00:11:10,640 Speaker 2: Life, and then when he leaves home and moves to Pullman, 156 00:11:11,360 --> 00:11:18,400 Speaker 2: this happens. What else did you uncover in your digital investigation, Heather, lots. 157 00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:21,839 Speaker 10: Of browser searching for serial killers, as I mentioned with 158 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:27,560 Speaker 10: you previously, an obsession with himself, so researching serial killers 159 00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:30,680 Speaker 10: and then immediately taking selfies to replicate what he had read. 160 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:33,760 Speaker 10: So that picture of him in the black hoodie was 161 00:11:34,080 --> 00:11:37,600 Speaker 10: taken after researching Ted Bundy, and in that research it 162 00:11:37,679 --> 00:11:40,400 Speaker 10: was Ted Bundy in that black hoodie, and he replicated 163 00:11:40,440 --> 00:11:40,840 Speaker 10: the photo. 164 00:11:40,960 --> 00:11:44,880 Speaker 2: And of course there are all the American psycho selfies 165 00:11:44,920 --> 00:11:48,040 Speaker 2: he took where he replicated Christian mail. And of course, Heather, 166 00:11:48,080 --> 00:11:50,480 Speaker 2: our kids can't thank you enough. You were the first 167 00:11:50,520 --> 00:11:54,720 Speaker 2: person to tell me that he was a fan of 168 00:11:54,800 --> 00:11:59,760 Speaker 2: crime stories. And had you found photos screen grabs? I 169 00:11:59,800 --> 00:12:01,240 Speaker 2: guess of that on his phone? 170 00:12:01,400 --> 00:12:03,679 Speaker 10: Yes, a screen grab very similar to this right here, 171 00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:07,199 Speaker 10: of you with crime written under the headline. 172 00:12:07,280 --> 00:12:10,079 Speaker 2: Okay, I'll just keep that right up here forever. Okay, 173 00:12:10,120 --> 00:12:12,880 Speaker 2: I want to go back to what's happening right now. 174 00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:14,760 Speaker 2: Take a listen to this. 175 00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:17,600 Speaker 11: After sending his first note of complaint after his first 176 00:12:17,679 --> 00:12:20,320 Speaker 11: night in prison, Coberger follows it up a few days 177 00:12:20,400 --> 00:12:23,640 Speaker 11: later with another note, this one given to a guard 178 00:12:23,720 --> 00:12:27,320 Speaker 11: and claiming he's the victim of sexual harassment. In the note, 179 00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:30,880 Speaker 11: Coberger claims one inmate is threatening to rape him, while 180 00:12:30,880 --> 00:12:34,719 Speaker 11: another inmate says, the only ass we'll be eating is coburger's. 181 00:12:35,000 --> 00:12:37,679 Speaker 11: Coburger offers up the name of a guard he says 182 00:12:37,760 --> 00:12:40,920 Speaker 11: heard the threats and harassment, so his claims can be verified. 183 00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:44,760 Speaker 2: Okay, the only ass we'll be eating is coburgers, and 184 00:12:44,840 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 2: he was also threatened and this is all through the 185 00:12:46,920 --> 00:12:52,520 Speaker 2: air vents that he would be quote but ft Okay, 186 00:12:53,200 --> 00:12:56,600 Speaker 2: joining me right now, Annie Elise. She is creator and 187 00:12:56,760 --> 00:13:00,240 Speaker 2: CEO of ten to Life and she is as a 188 00:13:00,280 --> 00:13:03,119 Speaker 2: star of Serealously podcast. 189 00:13:03,280 --> 00:13:03,800 Speaker 1: Annie. 190 00:13:03,880 --> 00:13:12,720 Speaker 2: Okay, This guy, Brian Koberger, who admits he murdered four people, 191 00:13:13,480 --> 00:13:16,199 Speaker 2: is now filing a sex harassment complaint. 192 00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:19,120 Speaker 1: He is very careful to say I'm not part of 193 00:13:19,160 --> 00:13:20,720 Speaker 1: the flooding of the cells. 194 00:13:20,840 --> 00:13:24,840 Speaker 2: I didn't do that, and complaints about the food being 195 00:13:24,880 --> 00:13:26,000 Speaker 2: placed on his trade. 196 00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:29,240 Speaker 1: Let's start with the sex harassment complaints. 197 00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:31,400 Speaker 2: And I'm sure it's not lost on doctor Bethany Marshall, 198 00:13:31,400 --> 00:13:34,480 Speaker 2: who I'm going to in one moment that he is 199 00:13:34,520 --> 00:13:39,000 Speaker 2: the one that conducted all of the searches about raping 200 00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:43,920 Speaker 2: women when they are comatose, drunk on drugs, passed out, 201 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:49,600 Speaker 2: or worse. Before he goes and tries to murder three 202 00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:54,319 Speaker 2: sleeping girls. Well, they were not asleep when he murdered them, 203 00:13:54,320 --> 00:13:56,760 Speaker 2: but that was his intent. Okay, tell me about the 204 00:13:56,800 --> 00:13:58,240 Speaker 2: complaints Annie exactly. 205 00:13:58,320 --> 00:14:01,640 Speaker 12: Not only did he have this higher search history of 206 00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:04,920 Speaker 12: him wanting to do this exact thing to other victims, 207 00:14:05,360 --> 00:14:08,439 Speaker 12: but he's kind of in a roundabout way getting his wish. 208 00:14:08,440 --> 00:14:10,800 Speaker 12: He always wanted to be the most important guy in 209 00:14:10,840 --> 00:14:12,439 Speaker 12: the room, and. 210 00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:12,640 Speaker 1: Now he is. 211 00:14:12,720 --> 00:14:15,000 Speaker 12: It's just in the wrong setting, and it's just the 212 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:17,920 Speaker 12: consequences of your own actions. Not only are you in 213 00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:21,000 Speaker 12: prison for what you did to these poor victims, but. 214 00:14:20,960 --> 00:14:22,480 Speaker 1: You didn't want the death penalty. 215 00:14:22,720 --> 00:14:25,680 Speaker 12: You wanted the plea deal so that you wouldn't have 216 00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:28,560 Speaker 12: to face that, and this is now the consequences of that. 217 00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:32,160 Speaker 12: He just strikes me as somebody who always, of course 218 00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:35,160 Speaker 12: thinks he's the smartest, that he should be treated special, 219 00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:37,040 Speaker 12: that he should be different, and we're saying that that 220 00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:40,400 Speaker 12: is no different now that he is incarcerated. He still 221 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 12: thinks he deserves that special important treatment. 222 00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:48,720 Speaker 2: Okay, what exactly does he claim in his sex harassment file. 223 00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:51,520 Speaker 12: So he's claiming that they are saying that they are 224 00:14:51,560 --> 00:14:56,480 Speaker 12: going to but f him. Also those the words of 225 00:14:56,800 --> 00:14:59,520 Speaker 12: the only ass that we're going to be eating is coburger. 226 00:15:00,600 --> 00:15:01,800 Speaker 1: Annie, Annie. 227 00:15:02,040 --> 00:15:06,160 Speaker 2: Before you go any further, the first time I had 228 00:15:06,200 --> 00:15:10,280 Speaker 2: to curse in front of a jury, I paused. 229 00:15:10,320 --> 00:15:11,440 Speaker 1: It was like a dirt sandwich. 230 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:16,920 Speaker 2: But in about two months I was saying every word 231 00:15:17,320 --> 00:15:19,640 Speaker 2: imaginable because it's what defenant said. 232 00:15:20,160 --> 00:15:22,320 Speaker 1: And I would have to quote them, what. 233 00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:25,520 Speaker 2: They stated, what they wrote, what they threatened, the P word, 234 00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:27,440 Speaker 2: the F word, the C word, that you name it. 235 00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:30,400 Speaker 2: Word all came out of this mouth. As I would 236 00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:33,680 Speaker 2: explain things to jury's. They didn't like it, but by 237 00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:35,760 Speaker 2: the time the trial would be over it, they were 238 00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:40,360 Speaker 2: numb to it as well. So the word but okay, 239 00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:42,400 Speaker 2: I don't let my children say it, but you can 240 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:45,800 Speaker 2: say it. I want to hear what Coburger is saying 241 00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:50,600 Speaker 2: in his sex harassment complaint verbatim. 242 00:15:51,080 --> 00:15:52,080 Speaker 1: All right, here we go. 243 00:15:52,400 --> 00:15:55,240 Speaker 12: He is saying that they are going to butt him. 244 00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:58,280 Speaker 12: He is hearing them say the only ass that will 245 00:15:58,320 --> 00:16:00,960 Speaker 12: be eating is Coburger's, which by the way, those are 246 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:05,080 Speaker 12: obviously awful things, but those pale in comparison to the 247 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:08,280 Speaker 12: searches that were on his devices of what he wanted 248 00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:11,600 Speaker 12: to do to his victims and what he turned him 249 00:16:11,600 --> 00:16:14,360 Speaker 12: on and what he was interested in. So the fact 250 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:17,200 Speaker 12: that he wants any sort of empathy now and special treatment, 251 00:16:17,600 --> 00:16:19,000 Speaker 12: nobody feels bad for this guy. 252 00:16:19,160 --> 00:16:23,040 Speaker 2: Straight out to Troy Slayton, veteran defense attorney, joining us 253 00:16:23,120 --> 00:16:27,800 Speaker 2: out of La Troy, Mommy. 254 00:16:28,560 --> 00:16:31,040 Speaker 1: They threatened to hurt me through the air vent. 255 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:36,400 Speaker 2: Really, and they follow a sex harassment complaint to the jail. 256 00:16:37,520 --> 00:16:40,560 Speaker 1: You know what that's called, right, A rat? A snitch? 257 00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:44,480 Speaker 13: That's true, Nancy, And you know the old saying snitches 258 00:16:44,560 --> 00:16:48,800 Speaker 13: get stitches or end up in ditches. But what's important 259 00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:51,840 Speaker 13: here is that we don't forget a little thing called 260 00:16:52,000 --> 00:16:52,960 Speaker 13: the Constitution. 261 00:16:53,480 --> 00:16:56,920 Speaker 3: I carried it around in my pocket. There's the eighth. 262 00:16:56,760 --> 00:16:58,000 Speaker 1: Amendment of the Constitution. 263 00:16:58,240 --> 00:17:02,560 Speaker 13: Now we all did it prohibits, as you know, cruel 264 00:17:02,640 --> 00:17:06,679 Speaker 13: and unusual punishment. And if he is being subjected to 265 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:12,359 Speaker 13: physical violence, to some sort of starvation, or if the 266 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:16,400 Speaker 13: prison is not meeting its own nutritional standards, then. 267 00:17:16,760 --> 00:17:24,720 Speaker 2: Slayton, has anybody said that anybody touched a hair on Coburger's. 268 00:17:24,160 --> 00:17:25,320 Speaker 1: Head, that's a yes. 269 00:17:25,400 --> 00:17:30,040 Speaker 2: No, that has not been a leg Has anyone said 270 00:17:31,240 --> 00:17:34,720 Speaker 2: that Coburger has not been given enough food? 271 00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:36,399 Speaker 1: That's a yes. No. 272 00:17:36,720 --> 00:17:40,439 Speaker 13: Well, he's claiming that in one of his complaints. 273 00:17:40,440 --> 00:17:41,359 Speaker 1: That's not what he claimed. 274 00:17:41,640 --> 00:17:43,639 Speaker 13: He's saying that the prison. 275 00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:46,520 Speaker 1: Sid all items are seed on my tray. 276 00:17:47,400 --> 00:17:51,720 Speaker 2: I address this during service, his butler, I guess, and 277 00:17:51,880 --> 00:17:58,520 Speaker 2: have yet to receive replacements. Replacement means he just doesn't like. 278 00:17:58,840 --> 00:18:02,840 Speaker 2: Oh he doesn't like. Get used to it. No one 279 00:18:02,880 --> 00:18:05,919 Speaker 2: has starved him, no one has touched him. He's complaining 280 00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:09,680 Speaker 2: because the inmates are whispering at him through the airvent 281 00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:14,399 Speaker 2: are you serious? Just put the constitution away. Don't degrade 282 00:18:14,520 --> 00:18:17,120 Speaker 2: the constitution like that, please. 283 00:18:17,600 --> 00:18:21,359 Speaker 13: One of the guards corroborated the threats that he's receiving 284 00:18:21,720 --> 00:18:24,879 Speaker 13: and just said that they weren't able to discern which 285 00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:27,560 Speaker 13: one of the inmates, because of course a prison guard 286 00:18:27,640 --> 00:18:30,000 Speaker 13: doesn't want to exactly what they does. 287 00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:31,920 Speaker 3: Between. 288 00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:34,240 Speaker 13: The prison guard is smart enough to know not to 289 00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:38,400 Speaker 13: get involved in the confrontations between inmates because that can only. 290 00:18:38,240 --> 00:18:38,879 Speaker 3: Go bad for that. 291 00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:41,520 Speaker 13: Okay, be clear, we have to live with those people 292 00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:42,040 Speaker 13: every day. 293 00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:42,680 Speaker 14: Right. 294 00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:45,760 Speaker 2: Okay, so you're claiming the guard is in on it 295 00:18:45,840 --> 00:18:47,120 Speaker 2: and doesn't want to tell the truth. 296 00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:49,880 Speaker 1: Actually, that's not what the guard said. 297 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:55,399 Speaker 2: He did not corroborate threats of but effing or as aiding, 298 00:18:55,960 --> 00:18:57,240 Speaker 2: this is what he said. 299 00:18:57,359 --> 00:19:00,159 Speaker 11: An incident notification report is filled out by the guardard 300 00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:03,400 Speaker 11: who received the second Coburger note, and the guard named 301 00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:06,159 Speaker 11: by Coberger, is questioned about the claims made by the 302 00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:09,760 Speaker 11: admitted quadruple murderer, and a report filed three days later. 303 00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:13,480 Speaker 11: The guard says he recalls vulgar language being used and 304 00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:17,160 Speaker 11: directed towards Coburger, but he doesn't know which inmates made 305 00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:17,800 Speaker 11: the threats. 306 00:19:18,080 --> 00:19:22,600 Speaker 2: So actually, the guard says, he recalls vulgar language directed 307 00:19:22,680 --> 00:19:24,760 Speaker 2: towards Coburger. 308 00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:28,879 Speaker 1: Through the air van. Really, but no one. 309 00:19:28,760 --> 00:19:31,160 Speaker 2: Has touched Coburger, no one has hurt Coburger. 310 00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:32,200 Speaker 1: And he's getting. 311 00:19:31,880 --> 00:19:36,520 Speaker 2: Food he wants so replacement. He doesn't like his block. Awey, Okay, 312 00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 2: let's get real. This is what. 313 00:19:38,640 --> 00:19:39,240 Speaker 14: Happened to me. 314 00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:42,399 Speaker 5: At what's going on? 315 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:45,080 Speaker 15: One of our one of the roommates has passed out 316 00:19:45,640 --> 00:19:47,639 Speaker 15: and she's drunk last night and short like up. 317 00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:51,760 Speaker 1: Oh and they saw some man in their house as night. 318 00:19:52,119 --> 00:19:55,800 Speaker 7: Yeah, Hian, are you in the patient? 319 00:19:55,880 --> 00:19:56,120 Speaker 4: Okay? 320 00:19:56,119 --> 00:19:59,119 Speaker 5: I need someone who keeps the phone, stop tossing it around. 321 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:01,680 Speaker 6: Can I just tell you what happened? Very much? 322 00:20:02,160 --> 00:20:05,119 Speaker 5: What is going on currently if someone passed out right now? 323 00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:08,400 Speaker 6: I don't really know what pretty much victorium. 324 00:20:08,880 --> 00:20:10,520 Speaker 5: Okay, so I need to know what's going on right 325 00:20:10,520 --> 00:20:11,760 Speaker 5: now if someone is passed out. 326 00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:12,760 Speaker 3: Can you find that out? 327 00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:15,320 Speaker 6: Yeah, I'll come to check. 328 00:20:17,400 --> 00:20:18,040 Speaker 14: We have to. 329 00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:25,840 Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Gray. 330 00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:33,240 Speaker 14: Are one of the roommates has passed out and she's 331 00:20:33,320 --> 00:20:34,879 Speaker 14: drown class and shall not wake you up? 332 00:20:35,440 --> 00:20:35,720 Speaker 15: Did you? 333 00:20:36,480 --> 00:20:41,640 Speaker 4: On November thirteenth, twenty twenty two in Leayta County, State 334 00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:46,840 Speaker 4: of Idaho, kill and murder Madison Mogan, Kaylee Gonzalves, Xana Kernole, 335 00:20:46,920 --> 00:20:47,639 Speaker 4: Ethan Chapman. 336 00:20:47,920 --> 00:20:50,640 Speaker 14: Yes, oh, and they saw some man of their house out. 337 00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:55,520 Speaker 2: Professor Jays Scott Morgan, what exactly is arterial spray? 338 00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:57,240 Speaker 6: So you have my. 339 00:20:57,359 --> 00:21:00,879 Speaker 8: Vessels that are directing off of the heart, and so 340 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:04,800 Speaker 8: every time the heart contracts, okay, it pumps, right, we're 341 00:21:04,840 --> 00:21:08,880 Speaker 8: thinking about pumping. You hit the artery and as opposed 342 00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:11,680 Speaker 8: to say a vein veins kind of ooze if you 343 00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:16,120 Speaker 8: will artery spray. So when this pipped, this is going 344 00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:18,960 Speaker 8: to transport the blood through the air and it turns 345 00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:22,879 Speaker 8: out in a very specific pattern. It'll have almost if 346 00:21:22,920 --> 00:21:24,800 Speaker 8: you think about this is why I kind of always 347 00:21:24,840 --> 00:21:28,080 Speaker 8: describe it. If you think about, say, for instance, taking 348 00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:31,480 Speaker 8: a can of aerosolt hair spray and spraying it on 349 00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:33,440 Speaker 8: a mirror, and you see that kind of fine miss 350 00:21:33,520 --> 00:21:36,200 Speaker 8: that comes up on the mirror. That's kind of the 351 00:21:36,280 --> 00:21:40,960 Speaker 8: way the deposition of this is. It's very fine, tiny 352 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:45,000 Speaker 8: little particulates, and sometimes you'll see these long ranging streaks 353 00:21:45,080 --> 00:21:48,719 Speaker 8: as well, dependent upon the position. Of course, position changes 354 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:53,600 Speaker 8: because you've got an individual that is so incredibly butchered, 355 00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:57,040 Speaker 8: they're trying to relieve the pain. They'll twist and they'll turn, 356 00:21:57,119 --> 00:22:00,320 Speaker 8: and so you'll get this kind of overlapping depth. Asian. 357 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:03,600 Speaker 8: It's a horrible thing to witness because when you're at 358 00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:07,159 Speaker 8: the scene, Nancy, it's almost like death has painted on 359 00:22:07,280 --> 00:22:11,040 Speaker 8: the wall in those last moments of their lives, and 360 00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:13,080 Speaker 8: you can see it kind of laid out before you. 361 00:22:13,280 --> 00:22:18,320 Speaker 8: If you understand blood blood pattern deposition, it's really quite 362 00:22:18,359 --> 00:22:19,040 Speaker 8: the horror show. 363 00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:25,080 Speaker 9: Doctor Bethany Marshall, renowned psychoanalyst, author of Deal breakers you 364 00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:28,800 Speaker 9: can see her on peacock. She's at doctor Bethanymarshall dot com. 365 00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:36,920 Speaker 9: Doctor Bethany Ethan's jugular vein. 366 00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:45,920 Speaker 2: Was slashed, and now Brian Hoberger, who admits to doing 367 00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:53,639 Speaker 2: that to Ethan, admits to disfiguring Keilly Goel's office's face. 368 00:22:54,400 --> 00:23:01,879 Speaker 2: Maddie just stabbed what thirty forty times brutalized. 369 00:23:03,720 --> 00:23:09,320 Speaker 1: Now he is whining that someone is sex harassing. 370 00:23:08,960 --> 00:23:11,440 Speaker 6: Him through the air of it, you know, Nancy, It 371 00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:14,760 Speaker 6: makes sense to me because I also recalled it. One 372 00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:19,399 Speaker 6: of his professors predicted that once he got his PhD, 373 00:23:19,680 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 6: he would have more access to potentially assaulting and harassing women. 374 00:23:25,359 --> 00:23:29,200 Speaker 6: He loved to predate. He had a pattern of predating. 375 00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:32,600 Speaker 6: So I think the problem in the prison for him 376 00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:36,879 Speaker 6: is he would like to anally rape others, but he 377 00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:39,640 Speaker 6: doesn't like it so much when somebody wants to anally 378 00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:43,560 Speaker 6: rape him, see, because then the powershifts. As long as 379 00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:48,200 Speaker 6: he's doing what he did when he was a student assistant, 380 00:23:48,960 --> 00:23:54,000 Speaker 6: cornering women, cornering people into conversations, towering over them, stalking them, 381 00:23:54,119 --> 00:23:59,440 Speaker 6: harassing them, slitting someone's throat, you know, stabbing a woman 382 00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:02,960 Speaker 6: multiple times in the face. As long as he is 383 00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:08,440 Speaker 6: in charge, he loves it. That's why he's imitating serial killers. 384 00:24:08,800 --> 00:24:14,159 Speaker 6: It reminds me of like bt K, who really he 385 00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:17,600 Speaker 6: wanted so much power, not only over one victim or 386 00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:22,200 Speaker 6: two victims, but over entire families all at once. But 387 00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:27,119 Speaker 6: now now that Brian Koberger cannot engage in that reign 388 00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:31,560 Speaker 6: of terror, people are doing it to him and he 389 00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:35,840 Speaker 6: does not like the reversal. Now, this thing about talking 390 00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:38,880 Speaker 6: to mommy all the time, I really hate to say 391 00:24:38,920 --> 00:24:41,320 Speaker 6: this on the air, but I wouldn't be surprised to 392 00:24:41,520 --> 00:24:44,560 Speaker 6: discover that he was sexually attracted to his mother. That 393 00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:48,320 Speaker 6: this wasn't just you know, bragging to mommy or mommy 394 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:50,879 Speaker 6: making him feel secure and safe in the world. 395 00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:52,800 Speaker 16: But I think Brian. 396 00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:57,920 Speaker 6: Koberger eroticized and sexualized everybody. I'm not saying the mother 397 00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:01,280 Speaker 6: participated in it necessarily. It could have all been just 398 00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:04,800 Speaker 6: in Brian Coworker's own head. But I think he is 399 00:25:05,080 --> 00:25:09,000 Speaker 6: constantly constantly sexualizing. He just doesn't like it when other 400 00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:11,879 Speaker 6: people do it to him. And one other small point, 401 00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:14,680 Speaker 6: Nancy is we have a term in my field called 402 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:19,639 Speaker 6: auto erotic honor. Erotic is when a person sexual energy 403 00:25:19,880 --> 00:25:23,400 Speaker 6: is directed back against the self, like they're in love 404 00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:27,960 Speaker 6: with themselves, They're excited by themselves, like maybe they might masturbate, 405 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:32,600 Speaker 6: masturbate while looking in a mirror because the thought of 406 00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:38,600 Speaker 6: their own body is more exciting than anything else. So 407 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:42,520 Speaker 6: he's also stuck in that position where somebody else intrudes, 408 00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:45,240 Speaker 6: like another prisoner or inmate. He's not going to like 409 00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:47,840 Speaker 6: that because it's not all about him and him being. 410 00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:49,160 Speaker 1: In charge, DoD to Bethany. 411 00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:55,119 Speaker 2: Another irony here is that he is the one that 412 00:25:55,280 --> 00:26:02,520 Speaker 2: did all of those damning digital source about raping women 413 00:26:03,480 --> 00:26:06,240 Speaker 2: when they are passed out, when they are drawnk when 414 00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:11,320 Speaker 2: they're on drugs, when they're comatose, and that is what 415 00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:14,680 Speaker 2: he was expecting to find when he went into the 416 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:15,840 Speaker 2: King wrote address. 417 00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:20,840 Speaker 1: That is what he wanted because he loves. 418 00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:23,440 Speaker 6: Being in a position of power. I mean it's like 419 00:26:23,600 --> 00:26:25,840 Speaker 6: it was at the max Factor heir who would drug 420 00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:29,119 Speaker 6: women and then he would actually film himself, you know, 421 00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:32,200 Speaker 6: having sex with them. The idea of the woman being 422 00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:38,480 Speaker 6: comatose is the ultimate ultimate power play, that's all it is. 423 00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:41,640 Speaker 6: So when you think about somebody who needs that kind 424 00:26:41,680 --> 00:26:45,720 Speaker 6: of power all of a sudden, being behind bars, he 425 00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:48,720 Speaker 6: doesn't get all of his goodies on his tray. The 426 00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:50,840 Speaker 6: other prisoners are mocking him. 427 00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:54,760 Speaker 16: That is just the opposite of how he's lived his 428 00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:59,560 Speaker 16: entire life, which is with the illusion of being in 429 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:01,639 Speaker 16: control of the entire world. 430 00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:11,840 Speaker 2: All of this a sexual harassment complaint, whining about his food, claiming, 431 00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:16,359 Speaker 2: I wish for the items to be called for and 432 00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:26,160 Speaker 2: items replaced, when this something something the nutritional standards are 433 00:27:26,280 --> 00:27:32,400 Speaker 2: not being upheld. Really, he wants to receive quote replacements. Again, 434 00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:35,640 Speaker 2: he doesn't like his wlok we okay, that's the whole 435 00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:38,720 Speaker 2: food issue that we've been hearing about since day one. 436 00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:43,800 Speaker 2: If you will recall his relatives, he wanted them to 437 00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:48,720 Speaker 2: buy all new cook wear and cook not he cooked, 438 00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:53,359 Speaker 2: but he wanted them the service to prepare his meals 439 00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:58,480 Speaker 2: on plates and in dishes, in pots and pans that 440 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:03,000 Speaker 2: had never touched meat before. Or this is a continuing 441 00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:07,240 Speaker 2: thing with him. But about the complaints, about the complaints, 442 00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:12,520 Speaker 2: let me understand. Chris McDonough joining me, director Cole Case Foundation, 443 00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:17,119 Speaker 2: former homicide detective. I found him on YouTube at the 444 00:28:17,359 --> 00:28:23,120 Speaker 2: interview room. What a turn of events. Chris McDonough. 445 00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:28,600 Speaker 1: Maybe these words are ringing in his ears listen put 446 00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:30,000 Speaker 1: message from our youngest daughter. 447 00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:36,119 Speaker 15: However, we wanted to say, you may received a's in 448 00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:39,240 Speaker 15: high school and college, but you're going to begin big 449 00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:40,520 Speaker 15: d's in prison. 450 00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:43,719 Speaker 1: That was it sentencing, and I had to think Ken 451 00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:44,440 Speaker 1: somewhere in here. 452 00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:49,640 Speaker 2: Really, he's complaining about people whispering to him through the event. 453 00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:51,520 Speaker 1: That's what we're talking about. 454 00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 2: This guy who slaughtered, who ripped apart four beautiful co eds, 455 00:28:59,360 --> 00:29:04,640 Speaker 2: ripped them apart with a military k bart knife. That 456 00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:10,440 Speaker 2: guy is whining about his broccoli and the other inmates 457 00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:13,240 Speaker 2: taunting him through the heating vent. 458 00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:16,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, Nancy, and let's remind the world we broke that 459 00:29:16,600 --> 00:29:19,680 Speaker 3: here on your show. And at this point, if we 460 00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:25,479 Speaker 3: look on the Department Corrections website, they call their inmates residents. Okay, well, 461 00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:28,680 Speaker 3: here's a call coming in, Brian. This is not a hotel. 462 00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:33,000 Speaker 3: And what Brian's about to understand is that his virginity 463 00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:36,720 Speaker 3: as we speak, is being traded for half a cigarette, 464 00:29:37,440 --> 00:29:41,440 Speaker 3: and that his mother had better pack some commissary orders 465 00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:44,840 Speaker 3: so that he has items to trade. I mean, when 466 00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:47,760 Speaker 3: we talk about the kitchen sending in food, just wait 467 00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:51,560 Speaker 3: till he gets the special. Okay. He wanted to cosplay 468 00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:54,200 Speaker 3: a killer. Now he's going to hang out with them, 469 00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:56,320 Speaker 3: They will show him no mercy. 470 00:29:56,560 --> 00:30:00,480 Speaker 2: Guys, you're seeing a leaked video, still trying to author indicated. 471 00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:02,920 Speaker 2: All the jails are going, hey, it's not us. But 472 00:30:04,240 --> 00:30:07,400 Speaker 2: McDonough pointed out, as did a lot of people online 473 00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:10,240 Speaker 2: after you spoke McDonough, that this is in a medical 474 00:30:10,360 --> 00:30:15,280 Speaker 2: unit somewhere and we think it was videoed by someone 475 00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:20,480 Speaker 2: on their cell phone of a security video, much like 476 00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:25,000 Speaker 2: the Casaventuria beat down in the Seawan Combs prosecution, that 477 00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:25,520 Speaker 2: was a. 478 00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:30,160 Speaker 1: Cell phone video of a CCTV feed. 479 00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:35,840 Speaker 2: Okay, now I want to address the actual complaints, the complaints. 480 00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:39,720 Speaker 2: But Chris McDonough, when you said this ain't the Ritz 481 00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:43,040 Speaker 2: Coburg or what did you mean by that? Actually I paraphrase, 482 00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:44,719 Speaker 2: but what do you mean this ain't a hotel? 483 00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:48,360 Speaker 3: Well, I think Brian, you know, he did not anticipate, 484 00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:53,080 Speaker 3: you know what the totality of his behavior was going 485 00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:58,200 Speaker 3: to be, just like he didn't anticipate the victims in 486 00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:02,400 Speaker 3: that in those rooms that evening. And for some reason, 487 00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:05,640 Speaker 3: and it's obviously a book pay grade, it's it's for 488 00:31:05,760 --> 00:31:08,600 Speaker 3: the docs, uh to tell us. But you know, here's 489 00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:11,520 Speaker 3: a guy that caused place just what we heard Ted 490 00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:15,880 Speaker 3: Bundy in that boat in that footy picture, and he 491 00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:19,320 Speaker 3: doesn't realize or maybe he does it. I don't know. 492 00:31:19,360 --> 00:31:22,920 Speaker 3: If he's not the sharpest tool in the shed, but 493 00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:23,640 Speaker 3: at some. 494 00:31:23,880 --> 00:31:28,400 Speaker 2: Point he's got a pH d in criminology. 495 00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:34,080 Speaker 3: It's well, that's piled higher and deeper and stupid. That's 496 00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:37,400 Speaker 3: what that comes down to. I mean, I don't I 497 00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:41,200 Speaker 3: think he's you know, just not the sharpest tool and 498 00:31:41,320 --> 00:31:44,240 Speaker 3: evident of the fact that you know everything he does. 499 00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:45,040 Speaker 2: Uh. 500 00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:48,720 Speaker 3: Look, look in those complaints where he talks about reciting 501 00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:52,720 Speaker 3: back the policies to the to the agency. Are you 502 00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:55,440 Speaker 3: kidding me? You know this guy has already read the 503 00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:59,080 Speaker 3: policy book. Uh, and so he's going to be a 504 00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:02,040 Speaker 3: real treat for them and for the wardens. 505 00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:04,600 Speaker 2: Hey, doctor Bethany Marshall, did you hear what McDonough said 506 00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:08,360 Speaker 2: that he is not crediting Coburger with being too smart. 507 00:32:08,400 --> 00:32:15,680 Speaker 2: I disagree. I think Coburger is smart wildly. Also, you 508 00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:19,280 Speaker 2: don't just have a pH d fall in your lap. 509 00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:23,040 Speaker 2: But I wonder if he has been so causeted and 510 00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,160 Speaker 2: so protected my mommy and daddy, I mean, growing up 511 00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:28,880 Speaker 2: on the mean streets of the Poconos, please right. 512 00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:31,360 Speaker 6: You know, Anthony, you can be smart, but you can 513 00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:36,520 Speaker 6: also be disturbed, pathological, have poor logic. I think everything 514 00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:40,600 Speaker 6: refers back to yourself. Have a poor ability to track 515 00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:43,000 Speaker 6: with what goes on in the minds of people around you. 516 00:32:43,280 --> 00:32:48,000 Speaker 6: So he may have a high IQ in terms of learning, 517 00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:52,040 Speaker 6: but I'm a very low emotional equ You know this 518 00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:54,400 Speaker 6: whole thing about the food and the new. 519 00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:59,840 Speaker 2: Pand to Bethany, what are you talking about a low emotion? 520 00:33:00,200 --> 00:33:00,760 Speaker 7: What did you say? 521 00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:01,280 Speaker 1: EQ? 522 00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:01,600 Speaker 2: What? 523 00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:02,120 Speaker 7: EQ? 524 00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:03,120 Speaker 14: I don't care. 525 00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:04,600 Speaker 1: I don't care. 526 00:33:05,640 --> 00:33:11,280 Speaker 2: It's like, don't care his emotional what? The guy murdered 527 00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:16,680 Speaker 2: four children. They were babies, They hadn't even held him 528 00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:20,600 Speaker 2: full time jobs yet they were living the life in college. 529 00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:23,320 Speaker 1: Look at them. He slaughtered them. 530 00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:29,160 Speaker 2: Don't give me anything about his emotional what IQ? Whatever 531 00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:32,640 Speaker 2: you said, it doesn't matter. He slaughtered them. I don't 532 00:33:32,720 --> 00:33:33,920 Speaker 2: care why he did it. 533 00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:36,440 Speaker 1: I don't care about his motive. He turned them. 534 00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:39,520 Speaker 2: They're never coming home and they died a horrible death. 535 00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:42,800 Speaker 2: And you're telling me about Coburger's emotional IQ. 536 00:33:43,200 --> 00:33:46,480 Speaker 6: What Hey, But Nancy, it takes a lot of intelligence 537 00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:49,440 Speaker 6: to pull something like that off, to get through a 538 00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:53,680 Speaker 6: PhD program to get away with everything he did. You know, 539 00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:58,000 Speaker 6: it takes planning, It takes driving by, it takes you know, rendering. 540 00:33:58,360 --> 00:34:01,920 Speaker 6: You know, four people, hopeless killing four people. I mean, 541 00:34:02,040 --> 00:34:07,120 Speaker 6: you really have to have thought something through to do that. 542 00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:10,080 Speaker 6: I'm not trying to give him credit, but I'm saying 543 00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:14,719 Speaker 6: he's got a whole degree to prepare, to prepare for 544 00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:16,680 Speaker 6: this crime. I mean, think about it. 545 00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:18,399 Speaker 5: Crime. 546 00:34:18,640 --> 00:34:22,200 Speaker 1: I need you to look at your monitor. He is proud. 547 00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:28,640 Speaker 2: This is right after the murders, thumbs up, self aggrandizing smile, 548 00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:30,440 Speaker 2: all cleaned up. 549 00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:32,760 Speaker 1: He probably boiled himself in the shower. 550 00:34:33,719 --> 00:34:37,040 Speaker 2: All the bloody clothes, the bloody evans is all gone, 551 00:34:37,640 --> 00:34:38,239 Speaker 2: and here he. 552 00:34:38,640 --> 00:34:43,279 Speaker 1: Is thumbs up, guys, I did it. I now know 553 00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:46,440 Speaker 1: what it feels like, the murder for innocent people. And 554 00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:49,280 Speaker 1: you're talking about an emotional I can I've never heard anything. 555 00:34:49,160 --> 00:34:52,640 Speaker 6: Like it in my life, Nancy. This is his doctoral dissertation. 556 00:34:53,080 --> 00:34:55,160 Speaker 6: You know how when you get through a PhD program, 557 00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:57,360 Speaker 6: you have to write a seat piece of paper and 558 00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:00,120 Speaker 6: then amalgamates everything that you've learned and you have to 559 00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:03,759 Speaker 6: make a unique contribution to a body of literature. This 560 00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:06,960 Speaker 6: is his dissertation. This is what he was preparing for 561 00:35:07,719 --> 00:35:09,880 Speaker 6: the whole time. This is why he was able to 562 00:35:09,920 --> 00:35:10,480 Speaker 6: pull it off. 563 00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:12,479 Speaker 1: Quick message from our youngest daughter. 564 00:35:14,120 --> 00:35:18,600 Speaker 15: Everyon wanted to say, you may have received a's in 565 00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:21,480 Speaker 15: high school and college, but you're going to be getting 566 00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:22,560 Speaker 15: big d's in. 567 00:35:22,640 --> 00:35:31,360 Speaker 1: Prison crime stories with Nancy Grace. 568 00:35:36,200 --> 00:35:39,680 Speaker 3: He has access to all of those digital photographs. 569 00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:44,200 Speaker 17: These photos are like a serial killer's pornography. It's quite chilling, 570 00:35:44,520 --> 00:35:48,520 Speaker 17: living salaciously off of the details of the crime. He's 571 00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:52,439 Speaker 17: going to sit in jail and all day long because 572 00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:54,520 Speaker 17: I don't think he feels much at all. 573 00:35:55,320 --> 00:36:02,560 Speaker 2: Right, Brian Coburger, who confessed he shredded with a kbar 574 00:36:02,600 --> 00:36:10,080 Speaker 2: and knife for innocent quasi sleeping Idaho students, Now he 575 00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:16,040 Speaker 2: has filed a sexual harassment claim that he's being threatened 576 00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:19,400 Speaker 2: behind bars through the air vents. Okay if that's a threat, 577 00:36:19,760 --> 00:36:24,840 Speaker 2: and that he doesn't like his food to any elae 578 00:36:25,080 --> 00:36:30,560 Speaker 2: joining us. She is a star podcast Serialously Annie. Isn't 579 00:36:30,560 --> 00:36:33,719 Speaker 2: it true that after one night on J block he 580 00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:37,800 Speaker 2: demands a transfer? You think those victims can get a 581 00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:39,000 Speaker 2: transfer out of those coffins. 582 00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:41,839 Speaker 1: That's not happening. But he wants off the j block. 583 00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:45,000 Speaker 12: Annie and what's so interesting too, is we talked earlier 584 00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:47,239 Speaker 12: about his searches and what he's wanted to do to 585 00:36:47,320 --> 00:36:50,080 Speaker 12: victims and what he was interested in. There were so 586 00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:52,960 Speaker 12: many reports from people that he went to school with 587 00:36:53,200 --> 00:36:56,440 Speaker 12: and other professors about how he was very domineering. He 588 00:36:56,440 --> 00:36:59,920 Speaker 12: would block the hallways, he would stand over people watching them. 589 00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:02,719 Speaker 12: I'm just in their face all the time. He's now 590 00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:05,399 Speaker 12: complaining over something where they're not even in his face, 591 00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:08,279 Speaker 12: they're not blocking him, they're not touching him. It's through 592 00:37:08,600 --> 00:37:11,640 Speaker 12: the events and he can't even take which look at 593 00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:14,560 Speaker 12: your past behavior. It's just, in my opinions, you reap 594 00:37:14,640 --> 00:37:17,480 Speaker 12: what you saw. It could not be happening to a nicer. 595 00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:19,320 Speaker 1: Person, Doctor Dwayne Hendrix. 596 00:37:19,360 --> 00:37:21,680 Speaker 2: I'd like to follow up on what Annie Elise from 597 00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:26,440 Speaker 2: Seriously just said, guys, doctor Hendricks. Former warden and one 598 00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:30,400 Speaker 2: of the toughest CI correctional institutes in the country MDC 599 00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:35,400 Speaker 2: and Brooklyn also Warden and Sheridan, Oregon, former senior warden. 600 00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:39,959 Speaker 1: Usd oj author of who Are You See It? Say 601 00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:43,880 Speaker 1: It Sees It? And he's at the New Daylightfoundation dot com. 602 00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:48,720 Speaker 2: Doctor Dwayne Hendricks, Really he wants off the j block 603 00:37:48,920 --> 00:37:50,960 Speaker 2: after one night. 604 00:37:52,360 --> 00:37:52,720 Speaker 1: Thoughts. 605 00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:57,080 Speaker 14: You know, Nasci, I'm going to take a page out 606 00:37:57,120 --> 00:38:00,560 Speaker 14: of Chris statement about the hotel. You just can't walk 607 00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:03,560 Speaker 14: in a room, don't like the atmosphere and go down 608 00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:05,440 Speaker 14: to the lobby and say, hey, give me another room 609 00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:08,399 Speaker 14: because I just don't I'm not feeling the king size bed. 610 00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:10,440 Speaker 14: I want to double or and I want a swede 611 00:38:10,600 --> 00:38:11,160 Speaker 14: or something like that. 612 00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:12,080 Speaker 5: You know. 613 00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:15,759 Speaker 14: As the bureaucrat on the line, Unfortunately, we have to 614 00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:21,400 Speaker 14: take his claim seriously about being potentially butts, and it 615 00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:24,080 Speaker 14: doesn't make any sense because this is the weakest and 616 00:38:24,600 --> 00:38:28,840 Speaker 14: most meritless Prison Rate FORMAC Elimination Act claim in the 617 00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:33,200 Speaker 14: history of prison or corrections. I mean, he is in 618 00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:36,719 Speaker 14: a cell, a single cell by himself. Every inmate that 619 00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:41,000 Speaker 14: moves on that j block has to be restrained and 620 00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:43,800 Speaker 14: wherever they move, whether it's to the shower or wherever 621 00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:47,880 Speaker 14: they're going. So I think, and to take a page 622 00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:50,719 Speaker 14: out of doctor Bethanye's comments about playing the long game. 623 00:38:51,280 --> 00:38:53,600 Speaker 14: What I think he's trying to do is he's trying 624 00:38:53,640 --> 00:38:56,480 Speaker 14: to set a scene to where if they ever put 625 00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:59,000 Speaker 14: him in a cell with someone else and he is assaulted, 626 00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:01,520 Speaker 14: he wants to go on record to say, hey, there 627 00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:04,440 Speaker 14: put me in a position to be harmed so that 628 00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:08,280 Speaker 14: he can possibly be moved to a different facility. Unlike 629 00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:11,040 Speaker 14: the FEDS, where we try to trade our bad inmates 630 00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:13,000 Speaker 14: all the time when we're dealing with inmates that we 631 00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:16,320 Speaker 14: really don't want it our facilities. He is at the 632 00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:20,040 Speaker 14: one maximum prison in the state of Idaho. So the 633 00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:23,040 Speaker 14: only way he can leave that facility is if he 634 00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:27,440 Speaker 14: becomes a state boarder with another state correctional agency or 635 00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:30,160 Speaker 14: the FEDS pick him up. And nobody's going to pick 636 00:39:30,239 --> 00:39:33,560 Speaker 14: this guy up. So you know, three things I always 637 00:39:33,600 --> 00:39:36,040 Speaker 14: talk about, you don't want to be in prison a snitch, 638 00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:39,800 Speaker 14: which he's now because now he's rating on inmates number 639 00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:45,480 Speaker 14: two harming women, you know. And also now and the 640 00:39:45,600 --> 00:39:48,719 Speaker 14: other thing is he's a malingerer, you know. So now 641 00:39:48,840 --> 00:39:52,799 Speaker 14: inmates don't like other inmates that bring attention to these 642 00:39:52,880 --> 00:39:55,400 Speaker 14: housing units and where they live. So it's going to 643 00:39:55,440 --> 00:39:58,400 Speaker 14: be a long road for the inmates population because of 644 00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:00,880 Speaker 14: him being a rat now. But it's also going to 645 00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:04,440 Speaker 14: be a lot of paperwork, a lot of following up 646 00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:07,239 Speaker 14: because they have to respond to every claim that he 647 00:40:07,400 --> 00:40:10,600 Speaker 14: has because if something happens to him, then he may 648 00:40:10,719 --> 00:40:14,120 Speaker 14: have merit to whatever habeas petitions that he may have 649 00:40:14,360 --> 00:40:15,520 Speaker 14: based on his conditions. 650 00:40:15,719 --> 00:40:18,160 Speaker 2: Dodter Henry's you just told me so much. I try 651 00:40:18,280 --> 00:40:20,680 Speaker 2: to write it all down, I'm having to dissect it now. 652 00:40:20,719 --> 00:40:21,680 Speaker 2: That was a lot of information. 653 00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:25,600 Speaker 1: Are you telling me that he's in the only MAX 654 00:40:26,120 --> 00:40:26,840 Speaker 1: in that area? 655 00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:31,880 Speaker 2: So if he is transferred, he's transferred to a local 656 00:40:32,080 --> 00:40:33,840 Speaker 2: jail like in Mayberry. 657 00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:36,800 Speaker 14: No, he's not going to Maybury. And I'm going to 658 00:40:36,840 --> 00:40:39,359 Speaker 14: tell you right now, the only way he would ever 659 00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:42,920 Speaker 14: leave Idaho is if there's an inmate and another jurisdiction 660 00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:45,600 Speaker 14: has given that juristick is so many problems. They say, 661 00:40:45,680 --> 00:40:47,480 Speaker 14: you know what, we need a break from this person 662 00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:50,840 Speaker 14: will take him on. But I just don't see that happening. 663 00:40:50,960 --> 00:40:53,719 Speaker 14: But I believe he's playing the long game with his 664 00:40:53,960 --> 00:40:56,439 Speaker 14: incarceration and he's trying to set it up to where 665 00:40:56,800 --> 00:40:59,919 Speaker 14: if he does get harmed, then he can say, look, 666 00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:03,600 Speaker 14: I was complaining from day one, and this happened to 667 00:41:03,719 --> 00:41:06,640 Speaker 14: me a year from now, even three four years from now, 668 00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:10,840 Speaker 14: if he's assaulted. So I feel sorry for those folks 669 00:41:11,320 --> 00:41:13,360 Speaker 14: in the state of Idaho because they're going to have 670 00:41:13,400 --> 00:41:14,920 Speaker 14: a long road dealing. 671 00:41:14,680 --> 00:41:18,160 Speaker 2: With this guy, what about the food compliance? And he put, hey, 672 00:41:18,200 --> 00:41:21,479 Speaker 2: let's see the compliants, guys, the handwritten complaints. I wish 673 00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:26,000 Speaker 2: to speak with you. I wish to speak with you. 674 00:41:27,160 --> 00:41:30,440 Speaker 2: I want to be transferred immediately to the B block. 675 00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:37,520 Speaker 1: Be as in brother the food whining? What about that? Hendrix? 676 00:41:37,840 --> 00:41:42,239 Speaker 14: Look again, like Chris said earlier, he's going to get 677 00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:46,080 Speaker 14: the special because the inmates prepare the food. The inmates 678 00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:48,560 Speaker 14: are the ones to make sure the portion sizes are right, 679 00:41:48,880 --> 00:41:51,760 Speaker 14: and they also try to have diversity in the kitchen 680 00:41:51,840 --> 00:41:55,120 Speaker 14: so that some inmates don't get smaller portions and other 681 00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:58,560 Speaker 14: gets larger based on their gang affiliation or race affiliation. 682 00:41:59,400 --> 00:42:02,080 Speaker 14: He is a I don't care what color he is. 683 00:42:02,160 --> 00:42:03,960 Speaker 14: I don't care what game he think he might be. 684 00:42:04,120 --> 00:42:07,040 Speaker 14: He's going to be a guy at Every inmate hates 685 00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:11,320 Speaker 14: in that facility. So he needs to shut up, be quiet, 686 00:42:11,760 --> 00:42:14,680 Speaker 14: and hope that he doesn't get the special every time 687 00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:18,320 Speaker 14: his tray comes down the range because the inmates in 688 00:42:18,520 --> 00:42:20,520 Speaker 14: special housing helps the officer. 689 00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:22,840 Speaker 1: What do you mean by this special? 690 00:42:23,080 --> 00:42:25,799 Speaker 14: He could be could be some body fluid. There are 691 00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:29,080 Speaker 14: some other things in that in his tray. That's what 692 00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:33,319 Speaker 14: I mean by the special, So you know I hate 693 00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:36,720 Speaker 14: for somebody to urine in it, maybe put some poop 694 00:42:36,800 --> 00:42:40,760 Speaker 14: in it. Maybe you know, there it's not or whatever, 695 00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:44,120 Speaker 14: whatever special they want to come up with, that's the special. 696 00:42:44,320 --> 00:42:46,440 Speaker 1: Okay, Chris mcdonna jump in. 697 00:42:47,360 --> 00:42:52,359 Speaker 3: I love Warden Henders, That's exactly what's going to happen. 698 00:42:52,520 --> 00:42:55,040 Speaker 1: Wait so much, just love him so much. 699 00:42:55,880 --> 00:43:00,680 Speaker 3: Just just wait until the inmates figure out that this guy, 700 00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:06,680 Speaker 3: Brian Koger, sees them as bugs. He this guy thinks 701 00:43:06,719 --> 00:43:11,640 Speaker 3: he's above everybody, above every consequence. But the inmates have 702 00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:14,400 Speaker 3: already figured him out. And what you know we talked 703 00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:17,200 Speaker 3: about a couple of weeks ago, Nancy on your show, 704 00:43:18,040 --> 00:43:22,000 Speaker 3: is they were waiting for him because somehow they had 705 00:43:22,120 --> 00:43:26,680 Speaker 3: figured him out. And now he's just digging a ditch 706 00:43:27,400 --> 00:43:32,200 Speaker 3: worse and worse. And you know, Doc is right this 707 00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:35,560 Speaker 3: he's just going to be an absolute disaster to manage. 708 00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:38,279 Speaker 2: You know what, doctor Bethany Marshall, it's not going to 709 00:43:38,320 --> 00:43:43,399 Speaker 2: get He's never going to stop. Yeah, And I say 710 00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:46,160 Speaker 2: that because you know, my theory is when you don't 711 00:43:46,200 --> 00:43:46,640 Speaker 2: know a horse. 712 00:43:46,680 --> 00:43:47,560 Speaker 7: Look at his track record. 713 00:43:48,160 --> 00:43:50,839 Speaker 2: Even though he was told to stop, he never quit 714 00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:55,000 Speaker 2: bullying women that he taught. Remember he was a teaching assistant. 715 00:43:55,600 --> 00:43:59,080 Speaker 2: I mean, his bad behavior happened over and over and 716 00:43:59,320 --> 00:44:03,840 Speaker 2: over again. And he says himself now as the victim, 717 00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:05,080 Speaker 2: Doctor Bethany. 718 00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:07,160 Speaker 7: Yes he does. 719 00:44:07,440 --> 00:44:08,480 Speaker 1: And so you're right. 720 00:44:08,680 --> 00:44:12,239 Speaker 6: Past behavior is a predictor of future behavior. So some 721 00:44:12,400 --> 00:44:15,320 Speaker 6: of the complaints lodged against him. When he was a student, 722 00:44:15,480 --> 00:44:20,040 Speaker 6: he cornered one guy into a three hour conversation, and 723 00:44:20,320 --> 00:44:25,280 Speaker 6: this fellow student wanted to report Coburger as having verbally 724 00:44:25,560 --> 00:44:29,480 Speaker 6: kidnapped him, which I think is fascinating. He would have 725 00:44:29,600 --> 00:44:32,879 Speaker 6: no body space between him and other women. He would 726 00:44:33,000 --> 00:44:38,040 Speaker 6: use ablest sexist, misogynist language. He would power over women, 727 00:44:38,719 --> 00:44:43,239 Speaker 6: he would try to intimidate them. He can't do that 728 00:44:43,360 --> 00:44:46,160 Speaker 6: with the other inmates, Nancy, So now he's trying to 729 00:44:46,239 --> 00:44:49,320 Speaker 6: do it with the prison guards and the staff. And 730 00:44:49,560 --> 00:44:52,480 Speaker 6: I think what doctor Hendrick said so beautifully is that 731 00:44:53,320 --> 00:44:56,239 Speaker 6: he is going to try to threaten and undermine and 732 00:44:56,360 --> 00:45:01,760 Speaker 6: manipulate the authority of the bureaucus bureaucracy of the prison. 733 00:45:02,400 --> 00:45:05,240 Speaker 6: But all he's doing is creating a nightmare for other people. 734 00:45:05,360 --> 00:45:07,480 Speaker 6: He's not going to be able to get traction. You know, 735 00:45:08,080 --> 00:45:11,479 Speaker 6: the serial killer that Coburger reminds me of, the most 736 00:45:11,680 --> 00:45:15,239 Speaker 6: in BTK. And I'll tell you why bt K was 737 00:45:15,360 --> 00:45:18,920 Speaker 6: such a messy killer. But he was so rigid. He 738 00:45:19,120 --> 00:45:22,360 Speaker 6: would he was the dog catcher in the neighborhood. He 739 00:45:22,560 --> 00:45:26,760 Speaker 6: was the local deacon. He would complain if people's grasp 740 00:45:27,080 --> 00:45:29,279 Speaker 6: was too long. I mean he sort of it was 741 00:45:29,360 --> 00:45:33,080 Speaker 6: his own little mini rain of terror over his neighborhood. 742 00:45:33,560 --> 00:45:36,360 Speaker 6: And now Coburger's doing the exact same thing with the 743 00:45:36,480 --> 00:45:39,279 Speaker 6: dishes and the pans and the what's coming through the 744 00:45:39,440 --> 00:45:43,160 Speaker 6: air vents. It's like he still believes he's in charge 745 00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:47,200 Speaker 6: even though he's behind bars. And I like the doctor 746 00:45:47,440 --> 00:45:51,200 Speaker 6: Hendrix pointed out sort of how conniving it is that 747 00:45:51,320 --> 00:45:54,160 Speaker 6: he's actually trying to get himself transferred. That is not 748 00:45:54,440 --> 00:45:58,120 Speaker 6: just arrogance on a small scale. But this guy has 749 00:45:58,440 --> 00:46:02,399 Speaker 6: all day long to sit around and plot and plan 750 00:46:02,640 --> 00:46:04,560 Speaker 6: and try to think about how to get himself out 751 00:46:04,640 --> 00:46:06,840 Speaker 6: of there, and people are going to have to respond. 752 00:46:07,239 --> 00:46:08,920 Speaker 6: In a sense, he's harassing the prison. 753 00:46:09,239 --> 00:46:11,320 Speaker 1: You know what, Dr Bethany, let me give you my 754 00:46:11,440 --> 00:46:12,879 Speaker 1: expert legal analysis. 755 00:46:13,239 --> 00:46:21,520 Speaker 2: Okay, boo efing who? And the reason I say boo 756 00:46:21,760 --> 00:46:27,319 Speaker 2: effing who Coburger is because of this Joe Scott reality check. 757 00:46:27,840 --> 00:46:29,880 Speaker 1: What was done to the. 758 00:46:30,000 --> 00:46:37,600 Speaker 8: Victims, pure unadulterated slaughter, over and over and over again. 759 00:46:38,360 --> 00:46:40,640 Speaker 8: Blood soaked is the way I would describe it. 760 00:46:41,320 --> 00:46:43,239 Speaker 3: And let me want it. 761 00:46:43,280 --> 00:46:45,200 Speaker 8: If you like that, let me give you one more piece. 762 00:46:45,560 --> 00:46:47,880 Speaker 8: He might be sentenced to prison for the rest of 763 00:46:47,960 --> 00:46:52,320 Speaker 8: his life, but these kids paid with their lives and 764 00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:56,359 Speaker 8: guess who else is paying their families. Their families will 765 00:46:56,400 --> 00:46:59,000 Speaker 8: be in a prison for the rest of their days 766 00:46:59,360 --> 00:47:02,120 Speaker 8: because of what this guy has done. Nancy. 767 00:47:02,920 --> 00:47:08,400 Speaker 2: Now we remember an American hero Officer Matthew Baxter, Casimi 768 00:47:08,719 --> 00:47:14,400 Speaker 2: Police Department, Florida, just twenty seven, shot down in the 769 00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:20,200 Speaker 2: line of duty, leaving behind a grieving wife, Sadia, and 770 00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:27,680 Speaker 2: three children. American hero Officer Matthew Baxter. Nancy Gray signing 771 00:47:27,760 --> 00:47:29,640 Speaker 2: off goodbye friend.