WEBVTT - Are You There God? It's Me, Margaret with Kate Helen Downey 0:00:00.960 --> 0:00:04.560 On the Bechdelcast, the questions asked if movies have women 0:00:04.680 --> 0:00:07.960 and them, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands, 0:00:08.000 --> 0:00:12.400 or do they have individualism? The patriarchy zeph and Beast 0:00:12.800 --> 0:00:16.079 start changing with the Bechdel Cast. 0:00:16.400 --> 0:00:22.840 We must, we must, we must record. The Bechdel cost. 0:00:22.400 --> 0:00:27.120 Cost the Bechtel costs. Okay, so you just get you 0:00:27.280 --> 0:00:29.760 become British at the end. The Bechtel costs. 0:00:29.800 --> 0:00:30.920 The Bechtel costs. 0:00:31.000 --> 0:00:34.000 Yes, and if you say that thirty five times a 0:00:34.080 --> 0:00:38.240 day with your best friends, your podcast will get wig. 0:00:38.280 --> 0:00:40.479 Gets so freaking huge. 0:00:40.440 --> 0:00:43.400 It'll get so busty. 0:00:42.840 --> 0:00:44.000 So many listeners. 0:00:44.159 --> 0:00:48.800 I like to think spiritually, our podcast has big old titties. 0:00:49.280 --> 0:00:53.120 Oh yeah, yeah, even though I haven't been blessed, I 0:00:53.200 --> 0:00:56.840 like to think my podcasts are have. 0:00:56.320 --> 0:00:58.720 Have big titty energy. 0:00:58.800 --> 0:01:03.480 Yeah yes. Well, well, now that we've started by objectifying 0:01:03.520 --> 0:01:08.160 our own podcast, which if you're a listener you can agree, 0:01:08.720 --> 0:01:14.520 just huge, just huge, huge naturals on this podcast. My 0:01:14.640 --> 0:01:18.600 name is Jamie Loftus parentheses, small naturals. 0:01:20.360 --> 0:01:24.200 My name is Caitlin Dronte parentheses medium naturals. 0:01:24.840 --> 0:01:28.400 I mean you you you've got great bobs. Kalen thank you. 0:01:28.480 --> 0:01:30.240 I just posted I know a picture. 0:01:30.400 --> 0:01:32.760 I know I like them because I was like, thank you. 0:01:33.000 --> 0:01:38.280 It's just some some are blessed anyway. So this is 0:01:38.319 --> 0:01:40.920 the Bechdel Cast, the podcast where we take a look 0:01:40.959 --> 0:01:45.480 at your favorite movies using the Bechdel Test as a 0:01:45.560 --> 0:01:48.040 jumping off point for discussion. But Kitlin, what the hell 0:01:48.280 --> 0:01:48.640 is that? 0:01:49.120 --> 0:01:51.680 Oh my gosh. It is a media metric created by 0:01:51.800 --> 0:01:55.600 queer cartoonist Alison Bechdel, sometimes called the Bechdel Wallace Test. 0:01:55.800 --> 0:01:58.680 There are many versions of it. The one that we 0:01:58.800 --> 0:02:03.880 use is do two characters of a marginalized gender have names? 0:02:04.160 --> 0:02:06.440 Do they speak to each other? And is there conversation 0:02:06.520 --> 0:02:09.880 about something other than a man? And a little kind 0:02:09.919 --> 0:02:13.519 of like caveat that we have is that it's a 0:02:13.639 --> 0:02:20.040 narratively meaningful, substantial conversation and not just throw away dialogue. 0:02:19.520 --> 0:02:22.240 And that actually I do there are some episodes where 0:02:22.320 --> 0:02:24.560 it feels like the Bechdel Test is a very sort 0:02:24.600 --> 0:02:26.880 of like tangential part of the show. This episode, I 0:02:26.919 --> 0:02:29.040 think is actually a great time to talk about it, 0:02:29.560 --> 0:02:32.520 because of you know, Alison Bechdel, and I mean, Judy 0:02:32.560 --> 0:02:34.760 Bloom is older than Alice A. Bechtel, But you know, 0:02:35.600 --> 0:02:39.120 they both have a huge sort of hand and forwarding 0:02:39.280 --> 0:02:41.799 feminist discourse of the twentieth century. So I feel like 0:02:41.800 --> 0:02:46.240 they're in conversation with each other. And today we are 0:02:46.280 --> 0:02:48.720 covering the twenty twenty three movie Are You there? 0:02:48.800 --> 0:02:49.000 God? 0:02:49.160 --> 0:02:52.560 Question Mark is me and Margaret period? An emphasis on 0:02:52.600 --> 0:02:56.639 the period, because that's going to come up a lot. Yeah, 0:02:56.720 --> 0:02:59.320 we have an amazing guest, So let's get her in here. 0:02:59.400 --> 0:03:02.160 We absolutely, I do. She's a podcast producer. She's host 0:03:02.240 --> 0:03:05.200 of the podcast Cramped, as well as co founder of 0:03:05.240 --> 0:03:07.720 Caveat in New York City. Ever heard of it. It's 0:03:07.720 --> 0:03:11.280 a great comedy venue. It's Kate Helen Downey. Welcome. 0:03:11.919 --> 0:03:13.640 Hello, thank you for having me. 0:03:13.880 --> 0:03:15.960 Oh my gosh, thanks for being here, and thank you 0:03:16.000 --> 0:03:21.520 for bringing us this movie. So I with your permission, Caitlin, 0:03:21.560 --> 0:03:23.160 I would love to know. I mean, normally this is 0:03:23.160 --> 0:03:25.200 where we talk about our history with this movie, but 0:03:25.240 --> 0:03:28.919 I would also love to know everyone's history with Mss 0:03:29.040 --> 0:03:31.680 Judy Bloom and her Ouvra. 0:03:32.240 --> 0:03:35.240 Indeed, Kate, let's start with you and also tell us 0:03:35.280 --> 0:03:38.920 about Cramped and kind of how all of this ties together. 0:03:39.000 --> 0:03:41.280 It's all connected. It's inception style. 0:03:41.920 --> 0:03:42.119 Yeah. 0:03:42.520 --> 0:03:46.400 Yeah, So I have had horrible, horrible period pain since 0:03:46.400 --> 0:03:49.120 I was fourteen, since basically the first time I got 0:03:49.160 --> 0:03:52.280 my period, I throw up, I pass out. Not every 0:03:52.360 --> 0:03:57.240 time I get my period, but sometimes, And I have 0:03:57.440 --> 0:04:01.400 never in twenty two years gotten a a diagnosis from 0:04:01.400 --> 0:04:06.520 a doctor or like useful treatment or anything really helpful. 0:04:07.200 --> 0:04:10.320 I have been told everything from your period pain will 0:04:10.360 --> 0:04:12.560 get better when you have your first baby, which is 0:04:12.600 --> 0:04:15.440 what I was told when I was fourteen, all the 0:04:15.480 --> 0:04:18.800 way to just yeah, your period. You're in a lot 0:04:18.800 --> 0:04:20.760 of pain. It's so weird, like we don't know what 0:04:20.800 --> 0:04:23.240 could be causing it. Have you tried ibuprofen? 0:04:24.480 --> 0:04:25.000 Yeah? 0:04:25.040 --> 0:04:27.920 And I changed insurances a lot in my twenties, so 0:04:28.040 --> 0:04:30.680 I saw a lot of different gynecologists and asked them 0:04:30.720 --> 0:04:34.520 all this question and never got a satisfactory answer. And 0:04:34.560 --> 0:04:36.800 then the more people that I would talk to about, 0:04:36.920 --> 0:04:38.760 you know, the more I opened up about my period pain, 0:04:38.800 --> 0:04:41.200 the more comfortable I got talking about it, the more 0:04:41.240 --> 0:04:45.760 people I found who also got very similar symptoms during 0:04:45.760 --> 0:04:50.040 their periods, and the more I kept going, like maybe naively, 0:04:50.120 --> 0:04:54.200 but going like, if this many people have this much pain, 0:04:54.920 --> 0:04:58.359 how are we all being told that were like medical freaks, 0:04:58.720 --> 0:04:59.080 you know. 0:04:59.120 --> 0:05:00.800 Like it just doesn't right. 0:05:01.120 --> 0:05:04.359 And so I had this idea years ago to do 0:05:04.400 --> 0:05:08.760 a podcast about just searching for answers for myself, just 0:05:08.800 --> 0:05:12.000 trying to finally get some like real information that I 0:05:12.000 --> 0:05:14.480 could then share with all the other people out there 0:05:14.680 --> 0:05:19.560 who feel totally dismissed and like neglected by medicine and 0:05:19.600 --> 0:05:21.880 are experiencing this kind of pain. And so I ended 0:05:21.960 --> 0:05:24.440 up getting a grant to do ten episodes and the 0:05:24.520 --> 0:05:27.320 last one comes out as we're recording this. The last 0:05:27.320 --> 0:05:28.360 one is coming out next week. 0:05:28.400 --> 0:05:29.520 So yeah, we did it. 0:05:29.600 --> 0:05:34.080 Congratulations, that's amazing. I'm I'm so excited to listen to it. 0:05:34.120 --> 0:05:36.240 And I mean, I don't know, I don't want you 0:05:36.360 --> 0:05:40.160 to like force spoilers, but is there anything that like 0:05:40.200 --> 0:05:42.800 really stuck out in terms of your like your takeaways 0:05:42.800 --> 0:05:44.160 from having produced the show? 0:05:44.800 --> 0:05:47.479 Yeah, well, I mean I got into it like with 0:05:47.640 --> 0:05:49.720 very simple questions where I was like, each episode, I'm 0:05:49.720 --> 0:05:51.960 just gonna like ask this question that like seems like 0:05:52.000 --> 0:05:54.479 a dumb question, but I don't know the answer, and 0:05:54.520 --> 0:05:56.839 so we're gonna like talk to whatever experts we need, 0:05:57.200 --> 0:05:59.200 and I'm gonna do the research and like we're gonna 0:05:59.240 --> 0:06:01.360 just try to answer this question that I've never been 0:06:01.400 --> 0:06:03.600 able to get answered, and so like the first one 0:06:03.640 --> 0:06:06.320 is just like literally, what's happening inside my body? Like 0:06:06.800 --> 0:06:09.560 why am I in pain? What is causing it? And 0:06:09.600 --> 0:06:11.960 it's like, yeah, that's a really complicated question to answer. 0:06:12.440 --> 0:06:15.960 And sometimes the questions are complicated and difficult to answer 0:06:16.640 --> 0:06:19.640 because bodies are complicated, and just like it could be 0:06:19.640 --> 0:06:22.120 a simple question and it's not a simple answer. And 0:06:22.160 --> 0:06:25.240 sometimes the questions are hard to answer because we have 0:06:25.320 --> 0:06:29.520 not studied it. We just haven't, like no one else 0:06:29.560 --> 0:06:32.960 has been curious about this or been funded to do this. 0:06:33.720 --> 0:06:35.239 And so very. 0:06:35.080 --> 0:06:38.360 Quickly I got into what you guys talk about a lot, 0:06:38.360 --> 0:06:42.840 which is the systemic sexism, racism, and misogyny that is 0:06:43.680 --> 0:06:48.040 present underneath all of the structures, underlies all of our structures, 0:06:48.080 --> 0:06:51.679 but especially the medical structures. And so we really get 0:06:52.320 --> 0:06:56.800 detailed and specific about like you know, it's it's is 0:06:56.880 --> 0:07:00.520 are the doctor's sexist? Maybe sometimes, but it's actually that's 0:07:00.560 --> 0:07:02.760 not the biggest problem. Like the biggest problem is like 0:07:03.160 --> 0:07:05.760 we don't study it, Like why don't we study it totally? 0:07:05.800 --> 0:07:07.560 Because we don't think it's important. We don't think it's 0:07:07.560 --> 0:07:10.680 important that millions and millions of people with uteruses are 0:07:10.720 --> 0:07:13.520 in pain. We just don't think that's really important as 0:07:13.560 --> 0:07:14.840 a culture, as a society. 0:07:15.200 --> 0:07:18.600 Yeah, And then so when we were talking about, you know, 0:07:18.640 --> 0:07:22.040 having you come on the podcast and what movie to examine, 0:07:22.760 --> 0:07:25.640 you were interested in talking about a movie that like 0:07:25.960 --> 0:07:30.520 directly and explicitly addresses the fact that people have periods. 0:07:31.000 --> 0:07:34.360 And there were so few movies and the movie we're 0:07:34.360 --> 0:07:36.160 talking about today is one of. 0:07:36.080 --> 0:07:40.400 The few, and it's recent and like recent, it's I'm 0:07:40.440 --> 0:07:43.080 so excited to get into like the history of like 0:07:43.320 --> 0:07:46.200 how long it took this movie to be made, because 0:07:46.200 --> 0:07:50.000 it took literally fifty years. Like if it was made 0:07:50.080 --> 0:07:53.000 after it was published, it wouldn't be a period piece 0:07:53.040 --> 0:07:55.080 from a like it's a period piece and a period 0:07:55.280 --> 0:07:59.640 period okay, from half a century ago though, like it 0:07:59.720 --> 0:08:02.320 is just I'm just like glad Judy Bloom got to 0:08:02.320 --> 0:08:06.600 see it made cause I know, jeez, Louise. 0:08:06.480 --> 0:08:07.920 It's wild. 0:08:08.120 --> 0:08:10.760 Yeah, there are I actually just I did a whole 0:08:10.760 --> 0:08:15.720 episode on why there aren't more period mentions in any 0:08:15.880 --> 0:08:18.280 kind of media, like we think of film and TV, 0:08:18.400 --> 0:08:22.520 but also like podcasts, like there's actually not for a 0:08:22.600 --> 0:08:25.840 medium that like talks about personal experience constantly like there's 0:08:25.880 --> 0:08:29.480 not much out there about periods, and then even social media, 0:08:29.520 --> 0:08:32.640 you search for like period cramps on TikTok and you 0:08:32.720 --> 0:08:36.400 get very little. And it's like why there are different 0:08:36.440 --> 0:08:39.600 reasons that there are different obstacles in each of these 0:08:39.640 --> 0:08:40.960 forms of media, but like. 0:08:41.679 --> 0:08:42.800 Why if it. 0:08:43.320 --> 0:08:46.640 I'll throw some stats out there to like show why 0:08:46.679 --> 0:08:51.040 it's so crazy. Ninety percent of menstruating people experience period 0:08:51.080 --> 0:08:54.040 pain some kind of period pain, which the medical term 0:08:54.080 --> 0:08:58.000 for that is dysmenteria. And thirty percent of menstruating people 0:08:58.160 --> 0:09:02.400 experience severe period pain, meaning pain that is bad enough 0:09:02.720 --> 0:09:05.680 that you cannot go about your daily routine like what 0:09:05.720 --> 0:09:08.920 you would normally be doing. And so thirty percent of 0:09:08.960 --> 0:09:12.480 menstruating people's that millions of people's that's. 0:09:12.320 --> 0:09:13.800 Like in the world. 0:09:13.920 --> 0:09:16.319 That's like back of the Napkin math that I did 0:09:16.360 --> 0:09:19.280 by myself. So it's not you know, don't don't quote 0:09:19.320 --> 0:09:19.719 me on it, but. 0:09:19.760 --> 0:09:21.080 This isn't a math show. 0:09:21.160 --> 0:09:26.800 That's fine, Yeah, but thirty percent of menstruating people worldwide 0:09:26.840 --> 0:09:27.600 is about five. 0:09:27.480 --> 0:09:30.120 Hundred and twenty two million people, So that's like over 0:09:30.240 --> 0:09:31.520 half a billion people. 0:09:31.760 --> 0:09:36.640 Third in severe pain multiple times a year, like not 0:09:36.840 --> 0:09:37.920 just once in a while. 0:09:37.679 --> 0:09:39.839 But like a lot frequently. 0:09:40.000 --> 0:09:43.199 Yeah, and yet we don't like it is not talk 0:09:43.240 --> 0:09:44.280 about Yeah no. 0:09:44.720 --> 0:09:46.840 And it still feels like I mean, I and this 0:09:46.960 --> 0:09:49.520 like extends to so many areas of medical study, but 0:09:49.720 --> 0:09:52.880 because it's still so dominated by men. There are so 0:09:53.000 --> 0:09:56.440 many areas of medicine I mean very often with I mean, 0:09:56.520 --> 0:09:59.120 you could extend it to trans people, you could extend 0:09:59.120 --> 0:10:02.320 it to I mean people with wombs. Definitely. It's just 0:10:02.360 --> 0:10:07.240 like the studies won't exist unless you can monetize them 0:10:07.360 --> 0:10:10.960 in a way that like satisfies that machine. I like, 0:10:11.120 --> 0:10:14.319 this is sort of a tangent, but I recently talks 0:10:14.400 --> 0:10:19.160 to someone who had their doctorate in smell studies, like 0:10:19.280 --> 0:10:23.800 old factory studies. She's really cool, and she is talking 0:10:23.800 --> 0:10:26.680 about how like she was like publicly mocked on the 0:10:26.679 --> 0:10:32.680 internet for having this PhD because no one cares about funding. 0:10:33.360 --> 0:10:36.760 A sense that the vast majority of people deal with 0:10:36.880 --> 0:10:39.559 every single day, that there are all these misunderstandings about 0:10:39.800 --> 0:10:44.000 literally affects everyone, but no one cares unless the only 0:10:44.040 --> 0:10:45.559 way you can get funding is if it's going to 0:10:45.640 --> 0:10:49.280 sell perfumer candles. And I feel like with menstruating people, 0:10:49.280 --> 0:10:51.400 it's like, well, can it sell a product and if not, 0:10:52.160 --> 0:10:56.199 we don't care. And suffering is an assumed part of 0:10:56.400 --> 0:10:58.160 having a uterus. 0:10:58.160 --> 0:11:00.520 You're like, oh, but it goes so much deeper than that, 0:11:00.520 --> 0:11:03.120 because like, Okay, there's five hundred and twenty two people 0:11:03.120 --> 0:11:07.920 worldwide in severe pain like multiple times a year, up 0:11:07.920 --> 0:11:12.400 to twelve times a year, and like, my take is 0:11:13.000 --> 0:11:15.920 I would pay any amount of money for a medication 0:11:16.559 --> 0:11:19.280 that would help me not be in pain that would 0:11:19.280 --> 0:11:23.120 actually work, and so would probably most of those five 0:11:23.160 --> 0:11:26.400 hundred and twenty two million people. And yet why is 0:11:26.400 --> 0:11:29.880 the pharmaceutic There's like, no, there's no markets that are 0:11:29.880 --> 0:11:33.760 that big in the pharmaceutical industry anymore. Like this is 0:11:33.800 --> 0:11:37.920 like cure the common cold kind of like opportunity and. 0:11:37.880 --> 0:11:40.720 They're just like, oh no, thank you, Like might all exists? 0:11:40.800 --> 0:11:41.199 Yucky? 0:11:41.559 --> 0:11:46.600 Yeah, yeah, but it's it isn't really about that, like it, yes, 0:11:46.679 --> 0:11:50.319 there's the profit motive, but there's also just like do 0:11:50.360 --> 0:11:52.640 we give a shit about that? Are there women in 0:11:52.679 --> 0:11:55.960 these pharmaceutical companies like making the decisions about where the 0:11:56.000 --> 0:11:59.000 research funding is going to go? Is there knowledge that 0:11:59.040 --> 0:12:01.960 this many people are in this much pain and desperate 0:12:01.960 --> 0:12:02.560 for a solution? 0:12:03.160 --> 0:12:06.520 I don't know, probably not I'm not a pharmaceutical person, right. 0:12:06.800 --> 0:12:10.400 Well, another little kind of tangent is that we recently 0:12:10.520 --> 0:12:13.960 on an episode, talked about how I was about to 0:12:13.960 --> 0:12:20.080 have a hysterectomy. I since had that hysterectomy, and so 0:12:20.200 --> 0:12:23.240 far it's only been about two months, but I haven't 0:12:23.240 --> 0:12:26.040 had period pain since, so it seems to be doing 0:12:26.040 --> 0:12:30.800 the trick. But I paid out of pocket nearly six 0:12:30.840 --> 0:12:35.800 thousand dollars for the surgery the hospital build my insurance. 0:12:36.160 --> 0:12:41.160 Guess how much money for the hysterectomy. One hundred thirty 0:12:41.200 --> 0:12:43.000 seven thousand dollars. 0:12:43.000 --> 0:12:44.600 Oh my god. 0:12:45.040 --> 0:12:47.000 Yeah, So I was like, what the fuck I have 0:12:47.040 --> 0:12:48.480 to pay six thousand dollars. I was like, well, I 0:12:48.480 --> 0:12:50.040 guess I don't have to pay one hundred and thirty 0:12:50.080 --> 0:12:51.120 seven thousand dollars. 0:12:51.200 --> 0:12:51.400 Yeah. 0:12:51.400 --> 0:12:56.640 But yeah, it's like it's obscene, and it's the only 0:12:57.640 --> 0:13:02.480 thing that I've found be like a satisfactory resolution to 0:13:02.559 --> 0:13:05.480 my horrible period pain. Yeah, because I was on birth 0:13:05.520 --> 0:13:09.400 control for many, many years and it did do a 0:13:09.400 --> 0:13:14.280 lot to reduce or eliminate my pain, but I had 0:13:14.360 --> 0:13:16.719 side effects from the birth control, so I was like, 0:13:16.720 --> 0:13:19.920 I don't want that. So, you know, I already talked 0:13:19.960 --> 0:13:22.800 at length about it on that other episode, But yeah, 0:13:22.880 --> 0:13:26.760 it is. It's just such a fucking nightmare for so 0:13:26.840 --> 0:13:27.440 many people. 0:13:27.800 --> 0:13:29.880 I know you talked on that other episode because I 0:13:29.960 --> 0:13:34.839 just listened to it about this and about like suspected endometriosis, 0:13:35.160 --> 0:13:38.640 and so I I, over the last year have paid 0:13:38.679 --> 0:13:42.120 over ten thousand dollars out of pocket just to get 0:13:42.160 --> 0:13:45.840 a diagnosis, not even an official diagnosis, but like a 0:13:45.920 --> 0:13:51.360 diagnosis of suspected endometriosis. After twenty two years of having 0:13:51.559 --> 0:13:56.280 exactly the symptoms of endometriosis and asking dozens of doctors 0:13:56.320 --> 0:13:59.080 about it, I had to pay out of pocket so 0:13:59.240 --> 0:14:03.800 much money to see a specialist because edometriosis specialists don't 0:14:03.800 --> 0:14:09.560 take insurance generally, because insurance doesn't reimburse properly for that treatment. 0:14:09.600 --> 0:14:11.319 And I wonder why that might be. 0:14:12.000 --> 0:14:13.920 Almost like they don't give it. 0:14:14.440 --> 0:14:17.880 Yeah there, but my question is so like and then 0:14:18.000 --> 0:14:19.800 the other part of the ten thousand dollars was on 0:14:19.840 --> 0:14:23.960 like pelvic floor physical therapy and all the other things 0:14:24.000 --> 0:14:26.600 that you know, like a nutritionist that is supposed to 0:14:26.640 --> 0:14:29.640 help you be able to like eat more, anti inflammatory 0:14:29.720 --> 0:14:31.960 and like all these things that your insurance doesn't cover. 0:14:32.480 --> 0:14:34.280 Who knows if they help or not. You know, it's 0:14:34.280 --> 0:14:34.840 not linear. 0:14:35.080 --> 0:14:38.440 But like my question is, did they end up finding 0:14:38.520 --> 0:14:41.880 endometriosis when they did your hysterectomy or adnomiosis? 0:14:42.000 --> 0:14:42.920 Yes? Both? 0:14:43.200 --> 0:14:44.520 Okay, so that explains it. 0:14:44.680 --> 0:14:47.720 Yeah. So I also didn't have an official diagnosis of 0:14:47.880 --> 0:14:51.880 endometriosis because they have to do a whole other surgery 0:14:51.960 --> 0:14:54.960 to even officially diagnose it. But they just took my 0:14:55.000 --> 0:14:57.200 word for it. They're like, oh, you've had this horrible 0:14:57.240 --> 0:15:00.880 pain for your entire like adolescent and adult life, and 0:15:00.960 --> 0:15:02.920 you don't want to have children. Great, we believe you 0:15:03.000 --> 0:15:06.520 about both things. Here's your surgery. That'll be one hundred 0:15:06.520 --> 0:15:08.320 bazillion dollars case. Yeah, but like I. 0:15:08.360 --> 0:15:10.840 Meant, that was the best case scenario after years of 0:15:10.840 --> 0:15:11.600 fighting for. 0:15:11.480 --> 0:15:15.440 It, right exactly. But yeah, they discovered not as much 0:15:15.560 --> 0:15:19.040 endometrisis as I thought I might have, but they did 0:15:19.120 --> 0:15:23.120 find some lesions. And then they also did they like, 0:15:23.320 --> 0:15:26.000 you know, I don't know, cut my uterus open. 0:15:25.840 --> 0:15:28.360 Right right, they did an autopsy on your uterus? 0:15:28.400 --> 0:15:32.640 Yeah? Yeah, basically, Also, okay, this might just be the 0:15:32.640 --> 0:15:37.040 most like tangenty episode ever. But so Jamie, you were 0:15:37.080 --> 0:15:39.000 kind enough to pick me up from the hospital after 0:15:39.040 --> 0:15:41.760 my surgery, and I was like so loopy and in 0:15:41.840 --> 0:15:44.560 so much pain. They like definitely did not keep me 0:15:44.560 --> 0:15:46.680 at the hospital long enough. No, they didn't. 0:15:46.720 --> 0:15:50.240 They literally like catapulted you into into our back seat. 0:15:50.400 --> 0:15:53.080 And then I was like ah, and. 0:15:53.040 --> 0:15:55.040 I was like crying in the backseat because I was 0:15:55.080 --> 0:15:57.960 in so much pain. They didn't give me adequate pain killers. 0:15:58.000 --> 0:15:59.880 Like it was it was a nightmare. But I knew. 0:15:59.920 --> 0:16:01.840 I knew that you weren't doing well because you asked 0:16:01.880 --> 0:16:06.280 me to turn down the Moon and Roots soundtrack, which 0:16:06.400 --> 0:16:07.800 has never happened before. 0:16:08.560 --> 0:16:11.600 I only have the vaguest memory of that. I do 0:16:11.680 --> 0:16:17.320 have a clearer memory of you phrasing an aspect of 0:16:17.320 --> 0:16:20.880 my surgery as I gave birth to my own uterus, 0:16:21.440 --> 0:16:25.720 because so they they removed my cervix, they pulled my 0:16:26.400 --> 0:16:30.760 uterus out through my vagina, and so I gave birth 0:16:30.880 --> 0:16:34.160 to my own uterus, and then they sewed the top 0:16:34.200 --> 0:16:38.360 of my vagina shut. Just awesome stuff happening all around. 0:16:39.040 --> 0:16:41.000 But anyway, that all hurt a lot, and so I 0:16:41.000 --> 0:16:41.400 was crying. 0:16:41.440 --> 0:16:44.520 But that's like the way, that's like the easiest recovery. 0:16:44.560 --> 0:16:46.800 That's what I've heard. Is that like because they don't. 0:16:46.840 --> 0:16:48.760 They don't have to cut you open. So you're like 0:16:48.880 --> 0:16:50.440 not healing from all that, you're just. 0:16:50.440 --> 0:16:54.920 I mean have I did have some like laparoscopically done 0:16:55.120 --> 0:16:58.440 tiny little incisions on my abdomen. They're already like healed. 0:16:58.600 --> 0:17:03.320 Everything's good there. But yeah, anyway, so they did an 0:17:03.360 --> 0:17:06.960 autopsy on the uterus that I gave birth to, and 0:17:07.359 --> 0:17:10.400 it was discovered that I have what's it called adenomiosis. 0:17:10.400 --> 0:17:13.520 Atomiosis is where which where that well, you say, you're 0:17:13.520 --> 0:17:17.720 the one that I just had you, but it's. 0:17:17.600 --> 0:17:22.119 Basically where your uterine lining that should be, you know, 0:17:22.400 --> 0:17:26.320 inside the you know, empty part of your uterus that 0:17:26.400 --> 0:17:30.479 it grows and then it sheds during menstruation. That uterine 0:17:30.480 --> 0:17:34.160 lining grows within the walls, like it's kind of embedded 0:17:34.200 --> 0:17:35.560 within the walls. 0:17:35.119 --> 0:17:35.800 In the muscle. 0:17:36.119 --> 0:17:39.320 Yeah, and I suspect that's what was probably causing me 0:17:39.400 --> 0:17:44.159 so much pain all those years. Yeah, because again they 0:17:44.160 --> 0:17:47.960 found endometriosis, but it wasn't super severe. But yeah, the 0:17:48.000 --> 0:17:51.600 I don'tomiosis, it's a bitch. I'll tell you what. 0:17:52.000 --> 0:17:56.040 I've had A don'tomiosis described to me as Endo's nasty sister. 0:17:56.840 --> 0:18:01.760 Oh okay, but also described to me as fudge ripple 0:18:01.800 --> 0:18:05.480 ice cream, where the fudge is the because they're trying 0:18:05.480 --> 0:18:09.680 to describe like how the endometrial tissue is like inside 0:18:09.680 --> 0:18:12.240 the muscle, and they're like, it looks like fudge ripple 0:18:12.280 --> 0:18:15.560 ice cream, like, but the fudge is the end because 0:18:15.600 --> 0:18:18.119 it bleeds inside and so it leaves these like stripes 0:18:18.200 --> 0:18:20.359 and like swollen parts of the muscle. 0:18:20.760 --> 0:18:22.959 And it's like, yeah, that sounds like it fucking hurts. 0:18:23.160 --> 0:18:25.400 Like I will never look at fudge ripple the same 0:18:25.400 --> 0:18:25.879 way again. 0:18:26.040 --> 0:18:31.600 I know that doctor did ruin that for me. Yeah. 0:18:31.720 --> 0:18:35.000 Okay, So back to Judy bloom Slash. 0:18:35.040 --> 0:18:37.440 Are you there so interesting? I'm like, okay, fine, I 0:18:37.440 --> 0:18:39.119 guess I'll talk about that. It's a good movie. 0:18:39.320 --> 0:18:41.040 Oh but also the one thing it is a good 0:18:41.040 --> 0:18:44.359 thing to talk about because the WHO estimates that one 0:18:44.480 --> 0:18:47.880 in ten people with uteruses has endometriosis. 0:18:48.280 --> 0:18:49.920 Huge number of people, yes. 0:18:49.840 --> 0:18:52.119 Huge number of people, and it is there is a 0:18:52.119 --> 0:18:55.919 an average delay in diagnosis of seven to ten years 0:18:55.920 --> 0:18:59.000 between the onset of symptoms and actually getting a diagnosis 0:18:59.040 --> 0:19:02.560 when it is diagnosed at all. So this is extremely 0:19:02.600 --> 0:19:05.560 important to talk about because if someone has severe period 0:19:05.640 --> 0:19:08.240 pain and has had it most of their life. They 0:19:08.280 --> 0:19:11.560 probably have endometriosis, but it's probably going to take them 0:19:11.640 --> 0:19:14.679 years to get it diagnosed and treated because also the 0:19:14.720 --> 0:19:16.840 treatment that we have for it is surgery, which is 0:19:17.000 --> 0:19:20.560 expensive and often not covered or reimbursed by surgery. And 0:19:20.720 --> 0:19:23.359 also that surgery guess what it's really good at, and 0:19:23.359 --> 0:19:25.879 guess what it's really not good at? Tell us really 0:19:25.880 --> 0:19:30.000 good at restoring fertility, really bad at taking away pain? 0:19:30.680 --> 0:19:34.399 Oh, I wonder why you have again, o, people of 0:19:34.520 --> 0:19:37.800 viewters is only valued for their ability to reproduce and 0:19:38.000 --> 0:19:40.800 bear children. And do we not give a shit about 0:19:40.840 --> 0:19:42.560 their pain at all? Hmmm? 0:19:42.800 --> 0:19:45.000 Well, and also I mean not for nothing, even if 0:19:45.000 --> 0:19:47.480 you do want kids, that doesn't mean that you, like 0:19:48.040 --> 0:19:50.920 you shouldn't be in constant pain. Like it's like it's 0:19:51.000 --> 0:19:54.360 not even it's it just drives me. And like speaking 0:19:54.400 --> 0:19:56.480 to your point, Kate, like two of my closest friends 0:19:56.480 --> 0:19:59.520 of and Caitlin you are one of them, has been 0:19:59.560 --> 0:20:03.320 like stuff tremendously with endo for years. And Caitlin, it 0:20:03.359 --> 0:20:07.520 took you years to be able to get the hysterectomy done. 0:20:08.240 --> 0:20:10.680 And then my other friend, you know, she was only 0:20:10.760 --> 0:20:13.240 able to find out that she had ended up metriosis 0:20:13.800 --> 0:20:16.800 because she had to have a different procedure done. And 0:20:16.800 --> 0:20:19.480 they're like, oh, also we found this, and she was like, well, 0:20:19.560 --> 0:20:23.840 at least something like I know, but thanks for the confirmation, 0:20:23.920 --> 0:20:26.199 and that's the only way that she's gotten, you know, 0:20:26.280 --> 0:20:27.320 any treatment cleared. 0:20:27.760 --> 0:20:31.480 I also feel like there's so little validation given. Like 0:20:32.119 --> 0:20:34.359 one thing I learned doing the podcast talking to a 0:20:34.400 --> 0:20:37.600 pain scientist, like like a pain specialist who is a 0:20:37.640 --> 0:20:41.720 psychologist who specializes in like how the brain processes and 0:20:42.160 --> 0:20:46.800 like feels pain. Did this incredible study where there were 0:20:46.800 --> 0:20:50.199 these young women who experienced all experienced period pain, severe 0:20:50.240 --> 0:20:52.679 period pain. She brought them together in a group and 0:20:52.720 --> 0:20:55.320 did basically like group therapy where they all like shared 0:20:55.480 --> 0:20:59.080 about their experiences. They gave them some education and some 0:20:59.160 --> 0:21:02.120 like coping strategy jeez, but it was all like basically 0:21:02.160 --> 0:21:04.359 just them talking to each other, and they found that 0:21:04.359 --> 0:21:07.240 their pain level when they self reported their pain levels 0:21:07.320 --> 0:21:10.919 after these sessions for up to a year afterwards, they 0:21:10.960 --> 0:21:12.080