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Speaker 1: On the Bechdelcast, the questions asked if movies have women

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Speaker 1: and them, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands,

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Speaker 1: or do they have individualism? The patriarchy zeph and Beast

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Speaker 1: start changing with the Bechdel Cast.

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Speaker 2: We must, we must, we must record. The Bechdel cost.

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Speaker 3: Cost the Bechtel costs. Okay, so you just get you

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Speaker 3: become British at the end. The Bechtel costs.

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Speaker 2: The Bechtel costs.

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Speaker 3: Yes, and if you say that thirty five times a

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Speaker 3: day with your best friends, your podcast will get wig.

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Speaker 2: Gets so freaking huge.

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Speaker 3: It'll get so busty.

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Speaker 2: So many listeners.

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Speaker 3: I like to think spiritually, our podcast has big old titties.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, even though I haven't been blessed, I

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Speaker 3: like to think my podcasts are have.

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Speaker 2: Have big titty energy.

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Speaker 3: Yeah yes. Well, well, now that we've started by objectifying

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Speaker 3: our own podcast, which if you're a listener you can agree,

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Speaker 3: just huge, just huge, huge naturals on this podcast. My

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Speaker 3: name is Jamie Loftus parentheses, small naturals.

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Speaker 2: My name is Caitlin Dronte parentheses medium naturals.

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Speaker 3: I mean you you you've got great bobs. Kalen thank you.

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Speaker 2: I just posted I know a picture.

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Speaker 3: I know I like them because I was like, thank you.

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Speaker 3: It's just some some are blessed anyway. So this is

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Speaker 3: the Bechdel Cast, the podcast where we take a look

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Speaker 3: at your favorite movies using the Bechdel Test as a

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Speaker 3: jumping off point for discussion. But Kitlin, what the hell

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Speaker 3: is that?

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Speaker 2: Oh my gosh. It is a media metric created by

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Speaker 2: queer cartoonist Alison Bechdel, sometimes called the Bechdel Wallace Test.

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Speaker 2: There are many versions of it. The one that we

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Speaker 2: use is do two characters of a marginalized gender have names?

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Speaker 2: Do they speak to each other? And is there conversation

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Speaker 2: about something other than a man? And a little kind

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Speaker 2: of like caveat that we have is that it's a

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Speaker 2: narratively meaningful, substantial conversation and not just throw away dialogue.

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Speaker 3: And that actually I do there are some episodes where

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Speaker 3: it feels like the Bechdel Test is a very sort

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Speaker 3: of like tangential part of the show. This episode, I

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Speaker 3: think is actually a great time to talk about it,

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Speaker 3: because of you know, Alison Bechdel, and I mean, Judy

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Speaker 3: Bloom is older than Alice A. Bechtel, But you know,

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Speaker 3: they both have a huge sort of hand and forwarding

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Speaker 3: feminist discourse of the twentieth century. So I feel like

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Speaker 3: they're in conversation with each other. And today we are

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Speaker 3: covering the twenty twenty three movie Are You there?

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Speaker 2: God?

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Speaker 3: Question Mark is me and Margaret period? An emphasis on

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Speaker 3: the period, because that's going to come up a lot. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: we have an amazing guest, So let's get her in here.

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Speaker 2: We absolutely, I do. She's a podcast producer. She's host

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Speaker 2: of the podcast Cramped, as well as co founder of

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Speaker 2: Caveat in New York City. Ever heard of it. It's

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Speaker 2: a great comedy venue. It's Kate Helen Downey. Welcome.

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Speaker 4: Hello, thank you for having me.

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Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, thanks for being here, and thank you

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Speaker 3: for bringing us this movie. So I with your permission, Caitlin,

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Speaker 3: I would love to know. I mean, normally this is

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Speaker 3: where we talk about our history with this movie, but

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Speaker 3: I would also love to know everyone's history with Mss

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Speaker 3: Judy Bloom and her Ouvra.

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Speaker 2: Indeed, Kate, let's start with you and also tell us

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Speaker 2: about Cramped and kind of how all of this ties together.

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Speaker 3: It's all connected. It's inception style.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, So I have had horrible, horrible period pain since

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Speaker 5: I was fourteen, since basically the first time I got

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Speaker 5: my period, I throw up, I pass out. Not every

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Speaker 5: time I get my period, but sometimes, And I have

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Speaker 5: never in twenty two years gotten a a diagnosis from

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Speaker 5: a doctor or like useful treatment or anything really helpful.

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Speaker 5: I have been told everything from your period pain will

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Speaker 5: get better when you have your first baby, which is

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Speaker 5: what I was told when I was fourteen, all the

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Speaker 5: way to just yeah, your period. You're in a lot

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Speaker 5: of pain. It's so weird, like we don't know what

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Speaker 5: could be causing it. Have you tried ibuprofen?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 5: And I changed insurances a lot in my twenties, so

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Speaker 5: I saw a lot of different gynecologists and asked them

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Speaker 5: all this question and never got a satisfactory answer. And

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Speaker 5: then the more people that I would talk to about,

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Speaker 5: you know, the more I opened up about my period pain,

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Speaker 5: the more comfortable I got talking about it, the more

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Speaker 5: people I found who also got very similar symptoms during

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Speaker 5: their periods, and the more I kept going, like maybe naively,

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Speaker 5: but going like, if this many people have this much pain,

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Speaker 5: how are we all being told that were like medical freaks,

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Speaker 5: you know.

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Speaker 4: Like it just doesn't right.

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Speaker 5: And so I had this idea years ago to do

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Speaker 5: a podcast about just searching for answers for myself, just

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Speaker 5: trying to finally get some like real information that I

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Speaker 5: could then share with all the other people out there

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Speaker 5: who feel totally dismissed and like neglected by medicine and

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Speaker 5: are experiencing this kind of pain. And so I ended

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Speaker 5: up getting a grant to do ten episodes and the

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Speaker 5: last one comes out as we're recording this. The last

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Speaker 5: one is coming out next week.

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Speaker 4: So yeah, we did it.

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Speaker 3: Congratulations, that's amazing. I'm I'm so excited to listen to it.

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Speaker 3: And I mean, I don't know, I don't want you

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Speaker 3: to like force spoilers, but is there anything that like

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Speaker 3: really stuck out in terms of your like your takeaways

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Speaker 3: from having produced the show?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, well, I mean I got into it like with

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Speaker 5: very simple questions where I was like, each episode, I'm

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Speaker 5: just gonna like ask this question that like seems like

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Speaker 5: a dumb question, but I don't know the answer, and

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Speaker 5: so we're gonna like talk to whatever experts we need,

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Speaker 5: and I'm gonna do the research and like we're gonna

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Speaker 5: just try to answer this question that I've never been

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Speaker 5: able to get answered, and so like the first one

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Speaker 5: is just like literally, what's happening inside my body? Like

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Speaker 5: why am I in pain? What is causing it? And

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Speaker 5: it's like, yeah, that's a really complicated question to answer.

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Speaker 5: And sometimes the questions are complicated and difficult to answer

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Speaker 5: because bodies are complicated, and just like it could be

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Speaker 5: a simple question and it's not a simple answer. And

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Speaker 5: sometimes the questions are hard to answer because we have

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Speaker 5: not studied it. We just haven't, like no one else

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Speaker 5: has been curious about this or been funded to do this.

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Speaker 4: And so very.

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Speaker 5: Quickly I got into what you guys talk about a lot,

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Speaker 5: which is the systemic sexism, racism, and misogyny that is

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Speaker 5: present underneath all of the structures, underlies all of our structures,

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Speaker 5: but especially the medical structures. And so we really get

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Speaker 5: detailed and specific about like you know, it's it's is

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Speaker 5: are the doctor's sexist? Maybe sometimes, but it's actually that's

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Speaker 5: not the biggest problem. Like the biggest problem is like

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Speaker 5: we don't study it, Like why don't we study it totally?

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Speaker 5: Because we don't think it's important. We don't think it's

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Speaker 5: important that millions and millions of people with uteruses are

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Speaker 5: in pain. We just don't think that's really important as

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Speaker 5: a culture, as a society.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And then so when we were talking about, you know,

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Speaker 2: having you come on the podcast and what movie to examine,

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Speaker 2: you were interested in talking about a movie that like

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Speaker 2: directly and explicitly addresses the fact that people have periods.

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Speaker 2: And there were so few movies and the movie we're

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Speaker 2: talking about today is one of.

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Speaker 3: The few, and it's recent and like recent, it's I'm

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Speaker 3: so excited to get into like the history of like

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Speaker 3: how long it took this movie to be made, because

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Speaker 3: it took literally fifty years. Like if it was made

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Speaker 3: after it was published, it wouldn't be a period piece

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Speaker 3: from a like it's a period piece and a period

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Speaker 3: period okay, from half a century ago though, like it

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Speaker 3: is just I'm just like glad Judy Bloom got to

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Speaker 3: see it made cause I know, jeez, Louise.

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Speaker 4: It's wild.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, there are I actually just I did a whole

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Speaker 5: episode on why there aren't more period mentions in any

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Speaker 5: kind of media, like we think of film and TV,

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Speaker 5: but also like podcasts, like there's actually not for a

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Speaker 5: medium that like talks about personal experience constantly like there's

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Speaker 5: not much out there about periods, and then even social media,

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Speaker 5: you search for like period cramps on TikTok and you

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Speaker 5: get very little. And it's like why there are different

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Speaker 5: reasons that there are different obstacles in each of these

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Speaker 5: forms of media, but like.

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Speaker 4: Why if it.

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Speaker 5: I'll throw some stats out there to like show why

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Speaker 5: it's so crazy. Ninety percent of menstruating people experience period

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Speaker 5: pain some kind of period pain, which the medical term

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Speaker 5: for that is dysmenteria. And thirty percent of menstruating people

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Speaker 5: experience severe period pain, meaning pain that is bad enough

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Speaker 5: that you cannot go about your daily routine like what

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Speaker 5: you would normally be doing. And so thirty percent of

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Speaker 5: menstruating people's that millions of people's that's.

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Speaker 4: Like in the world.

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Speaker 5: That's like back of the Napkin math that I did

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Speaker 5: by myself. So it's not you know, don't don't quote

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Speaker 5: me on it, but.

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Speaker 3: This isn't a math show.

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Speaker 5: That's fine, Yeah, but thirty percent of menstruating people worldwide

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Speaker 5: is about five.

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Speaker 4: Hundred and twenty two million people, So that's like over

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Speaker 4: half a billion people.

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Speaker 5: Third in severe pain multiple times a year, like not

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Speaker 5: just once in a while.

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Speaker 2: But like a lot frequently.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, and yet we don't like it is not talk

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Speaker 5: about Yeah no.

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Speaker 3: And it still feels like I mean, I and this

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Speaker 3: like extends to so many areas of medical study, but

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Speaker 3: because it's still so dominated by men. There are so

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Speaker 3: many areas of medicine I mean very often with I mean,

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Speaker 3: you could extend it to trans people, you could extend

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Speaker 3: it to I mean people with wombs. Definitely. It's just

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Speaker 3: like the studies won't exist unless you can monetize them

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Speaker 3: in a way that like satisfies that machine. I like,

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Speaker 3: this is sort of a tangent, but I recently talks

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Speaker 3: to someone who had their doctorate in smell studies, like

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Speaker 3: old factory studies. She's really cool, and she is talking

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Speaker 3: about how like she was like publicly mocked on the

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Speaker 3: internet for having this PhD because no one cares about funding.

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Speaker 3: A sense that the vast majority of people deal with

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Speaker 3: every single day, that there are all these misunderstandings about

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Speaker 3: literally affects everyone, but no one cares unless the only

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Speaker 3: way you can get funding is if it's going to

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Speaker 3: sell perfumer candles. And I feel like with menstruating people,

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Speaker 3: it's like, well, can it sell a product and if not,

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Speaker 3: we don't care. And suffering is an assumed part of

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Speaker 3: having a uterus.

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Speaker 5: You're like, oh, but it goes so much deeper than that,

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Speaker 5: because like, Okay, there's five hundred and twenty two people

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Speaker 5: worldwide in severe pain like multiple times a year, up

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Speaker 5: to twelve times a year, and like, my take is

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Speaker 5: I would pay any amount of money for a medication

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Speaker 5: that would help me not be in pain that would

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Speaker 5: actually work, and so would probably most of those five

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Speaker 5: hundred and twenty two million people. And yet why is

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Speaker 5: the pharmaceutic There's like, no, there's no markets that are

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Speaker 5: that big in the pharmaceutical industry anymore. Like this is

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Speaker 5: like cure the common cold kind of like opportunity and.

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Speaker 4: They're just like, oh no, thank you, Like might all exists?

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Speaker 3: Yucky?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, but it's it isn't really about that, like it, yes,

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Speaker 5: there's the profit motive, but there's also just like do

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Speaker 5: we give a shit about that? Are there women in

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Speaker 5: these pharmaceutical companies like making the decisions about where the

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Speaker 5: research funding is going to go? Is there knowledge that

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Speaker 5: this many people are in this much pain and desperate

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Speaker 5: for a solution?

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Speaker 4: I don't know, probably not I'm not a pharmaceutical person, right.

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Speaker 2: Well, another little kind of tangent is that we recently

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Speaker 2: on an episode, talked about how I was about to

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Speaker 2: have a hysterectomy. I since had that hysterectomy, and so

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Speaker 2: far it's only been about two months, but I haven't

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Speaker 2: had period pain since, so it seems to be doing

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Speaker 2: the trick. But I paid out of pocket nearly six

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Speaker 2: thousand dollars for the surgery the hospital build my insurance.

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Speaker 2: Guess how much money for the hysterectomy. One hundred thirty

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Speaker 2: seven thousand dollars.

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Speaker 3: Oh my god.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So I was like, what the fuck I have

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Speaker 2: to pay six thousand dollars. I was like, well, I

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Speaker 2: guess I don't have to pay one hundred and thirty

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Speaker 2: seven thousand dollars.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, it's like it's obscene, and it's the only

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Speaker 2: thing that I've found be like a satisfactory resolution to

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Speaker 2: my horrible period pain. Yeah, because I was on birth

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Speaker 2: control for many, many years and it did do a

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Speaker 2: lot to reduce or eliminate my pain, but I had

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Speaker 2: side effects from the birth control, so I was like,

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Speaker 2: I don't want that. So, you know, I already talked

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Speaker 2: at length about it on that other episode, But yeah,

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Speaker 2: it is. It's just such a fucking nightmare for so

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Speaker 2: many people.

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Speaker 5: I know you talked on that other episode because I

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Speaker 5: just listened to it about this and about like suspected endometriosis,

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Speaker 5: and so I I, over the last year have paid

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Speaker 5: over ten thousand dollars out of pocket just to get

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Speaker 5: a diagnosis, not even an official diagnosis, but like a

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Speaker 5: diagnosis of suspected endometriosis. After twenty two years of having

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Speaker 5: exactly the symptoms of endometriosis and asking dozens of doctors

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Speaker 5: about it, I had to pay out of pocket so

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Speaker 5: much money to see a specialist because edometriosis specialists don't

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Speaker 5: take insurance generally, because insurance doesn't reimburse properly for that treatment.

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Speaker 2: And I wonder why that might be.

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Speaker 3: Almost like they don't give it.

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Speaker 5: Yeah there, but my question is so like and then

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Speaker 5: the other part of the ten thousand dollars was on

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Speaker 5: like pelvic floor physical therapy and all the other things

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Speaker 5: that you know, like a nutritionist that is supposed to

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Speaker 5: help you be able to like eat more, anti inflammatory

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Speaker 5: and like all these things that your insurance doesn't cover.

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Speaker 4: Who knows if they help or not. You know, it's

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Speaker 4: not linear.

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Speaker 5: But like my question is, did they end up finding

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Speaker 5: endometriosis when they did your hysterectomy or adnomiosis?

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Speaker 2: Yes? Both?

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Speaker 4: Okay, so that explains it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. So I also didn't have an official diagnosis of

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Speaker 2: endometriosis because they have to do a whole other surgery

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Speaker 2: to even officially diagnose it. But they just took my

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Speaker 2: word for it. They're like, oh, you've had this horrible

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Speaker 2: pain for your entire like adolescent and adult life, and

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Speaker 2: you don't want to have children. Great, we believe you

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Speaker 2: about both things. Here's your surgery. That'll be one hundred

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Speaker 2: bazillion dollars case. Yeah, but like I.

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Speaker 3: Meant, that was the best case scenario after years of

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Speaker 3: fighting for.

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Speaker 2: It, right exactly. But yeah, they discovered not as much

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Speaker 2: endometrisis as I thought I might have, but they did

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Speaker 2: find some lesions. And then they also did they like,

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Speaker 2: you know, I don't know, cut my uterus open.

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Speaker 4: Right right, they did an autopsy on your uterus?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, basically, Also, okay, this might just be the

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Speaker 2: most like tangenty episode ever. But so Jamie, you were

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Speaker 2: kind enough to pick me up from the hospital after

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Speaker 2: my surgery, and I was like so loopy and in

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Speaker 2: so much pain. They like definitely did not keep me

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Speaker 2: at the hospital long enough. No, they didn't.

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Speaker 3: They literally like catapulted you into into our back seat.

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Speaker 3: And then I was like ah, and.

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Speaker 2: I was like crying in the backseat because I was

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Speaker 2: in so much pain. They didn't give me adequate pain killers.

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Speaker 2: Like it was it was a nightmare. But I knew.

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Speaker 3: I knew that you weren't doing well because you asked

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Speaker 3: me to turn down the Moon and Roots soundtrack, which

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Speaker 3: has never happened before.

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Speaker 2: I only have the vaguest memory of that. I do

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Speaker 2: have a clearer memory of you phrasing an aspect of

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Speaker 2: my surgery as I gave birth to my own uterus,

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Speaker 2: because so they they removed my cervix, they pulled my

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Speaker 2: uterus out through my vagina, and so I gave birth

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Speaker 2: to my own uterus, and then they sewed the top

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Speaker 2: of my vagina shut. Just awesome stuff happening all around.

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Speaker 2: But anyway, that all hurt a lot, and so I

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Speaker 2: was crying.

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Speaker 4: But that's like the way, that's like the easiest recovery.

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Speaker 5: That's what I've heard. Is that like because they don't.

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Speaker 5: They don't have to cut you open. So you're like

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Speaker 5: not healing from all that, you're just.

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Speaker 2: I mean have I did have some like laparoscopically done

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Speaker 2: tiny little incisions on my abdomen. They're already like healed.

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Speaker 2: Everything's good there. But yeah, anyway, so they did an

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Speaker 2: autopsy on the uterus that I gave birth to, and

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Speaker 2: it was discovered that I have what's it called adenomiosis.

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Speaker 5: Atomiosis is where which where that well, you say, you're

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Speaker 5: the one that I just had you, but it's.

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Speaker 2: Basically where your uterine lining that should be, you know,

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Speaker 2: inside the you know, empty part of your uterus that

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Speaker 2: it grows and then it sheds during menstruation. That uterine

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Speaker 2: lining grows within the walls, like it's kind of embedded

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Speaker 2: within the walls.

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Speaker 4: In the muscle.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I suspect that's what was probably causing me

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Speaker 2: so much pain all those years. Yeah, because again they

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Speaker 2: found endometriosis, but it wasn't super severe. But yeah, the

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Speaker 2: I don'tomiosis, it's a bitch. I'll tell you what.

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Speaker 5: I've had A don'tomiosis described to me as Endo's nasty sister.

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Speaker 5: Oh okay, but also described to me as fudge ripple

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Speaker 5: ice cream, where the fudge is the because they're trying

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Speaker 5: to describe like how the endometrial tissue is like inside

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Speaker 5: the muscle, and they're like, it looks like fudge ripple

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Speaker 5: ice cream, like, but the fudge is the end because

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Speaker 5: it bleeds inside and so it leaves these like stripes

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Speaker 5: and like swollen parts of the muscle.

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Speaker 4: And it's like, yeah, that sounds like it fucking hurts.

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Speaker 3: Like I will never look at fudge ripple the same

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Speaker 3: way again.

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Speaker 4: I know that doctor did ruin that for me. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Okay, So back to Judy bloom Slash.

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Speaker 3: Are you there so interesting? I'm like, okay, fine, I

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Speaker 3: guess I'll talk about that. It's a good movie.

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Speaker 5: Oh but also the one thing it is a good

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Speaker 5: thing to talk about because the WHO estimates that one

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Speaker 5: in ten people with uteruses has endometriosis.

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Speaker 2: Huge number of people, yes.

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Speaker 5: Huge number of people, and it is there is a

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Speaker 5: an average delay in diagnosis of seven to ten years

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Speaker 5: between the onset of symptoms and actually getting a diagnosis

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Speaker 5: when it is diagnosed at all. So this is extremely

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Speaker 5: important to talk about because if someone has severe period

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Speaker 5: pain and has had it most of their life. They

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Speaker 5: probably have endometriosis, but it's probably going to take them

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Speaker 5: years to get it diagnosed and treated because also the

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Speaker 5: treatment that we have for it is surgery, which is

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Speaker 5: expensive and often not covered or reimbursed by surgery. And

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Speaker 5: also that surgery guess what it's really good at, and

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Speaker 5: guess what it's really not good at? Tell us really

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Speaker 5: good at restoring fertility, really bad at taking away pain?

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Speaker 2: Oh, I wonder why you have again, o, people of

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Speaker 2: viewters is only valued for their ability to reproduce and

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Speaker 2: bear children. And do we not give a shit about

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Speaker 2: their pain at all? Hmmm?

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Speaker 3: Well, and also I mean not for nothing, even if

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Speaker 3: you do want kids, that doesn't mean that you, like

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Speaker 3: you shouldn't be in constant pain. Like it's like it's

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Speaker 3: not even it's it just drives me. And like speaking

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Speaker 3: to your point, Kate, like two of my closest friends

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Speaker 3: of and Caitlin you are one of them, has been

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Speaker 3: like stuff tremendously with endo for years. And Caitlin, it

380
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Speaker 3: took you years to be able to get the hysterectomy done.

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Speaker 3: And then my other friend, you know, she was only

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Speaker 3: able to find out that she had ended up metriosis

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Speaker 3: because she had to have a different procedure done. And

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Speaker 3: they're like, oh, also we found this, and she was like, well,

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Speaker 3: at least something like I know, but thanks for the confirmation,

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Speaker 3: and that's the only way that she's gotten, you know,

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Speaker 3: any treatment cleared.

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Speaker 5: I also feel like there's so little validation given. Like

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Speaker 5: one thing I learned doing the podcast talking to a

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Speaker 5: pain scientist, like like a pain specialist who is a

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Speaker 5: psychologist who specializes in like how the brain processes and

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Speaker 5: like feels pain. Did this incredible study where there were

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Speaker 5: these young women who experienced all experienced period pain, severe

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Speaker 5: period pain. She brought them together in a group and

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Speaker 5: did basically like group therapy where they all like shared

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Speaker 5: about their experiences. They gave them some education and some

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Speaker 5: like coping strategy jeez, but it was all like basically

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Speaker 5: just them talking to each other, and they found that

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Speaker 5: their pain level when they self reported their pain levels

400
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Speaker 5: after these sessions for up to a year afterwards, they

401
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Speaker 5: reported lower pain.

402
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Speaker 2: Wow.

403
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Speaker 5: So literally our brain And it makes sense if you

404
00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:18,480
Speaker 5: think about like our brains, if we feel like we

405
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Speaker 5: are alone in our pain, like there is no one

406
00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:24,919
Speaker 5: there to support us, like no one believes us like

407
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Speaker 5: we're in pain and we don't know why, and that's scary.

408
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Speaker 5: Our brains are going to escalate those pain signals. Our

409
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Speaker 5: brains don't like that experience. They're going to be like,

410
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Speaker 5: something's really wrong. You're feeling all these negative emotions as well.

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Speaker 5: That hurts more. And so like the fact that we

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Speaker 5: are not taken seriously at the doctor when we are

413
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Speaker 5: talking about our period pain, the fact that we're not

414
00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:50,640
Speaker 5: given explanations that it doesn't seem important to say like, hey,

415
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Speaker 5: here's why you're in pain, here's what is hurting, and

416
00:21:54,200 --> 00:21:57,120
Speaker 5: here are some things you can do. Those all actually

417
00:21:57,160 --> 00:22:00,200
Speaker 5: make our pain worse. And the taboo against talking about

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00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:03,359
Speaker 5: our periods, the way we are trained to not talk

419
00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:06,639
Speaker 5: even to each other about our periods, actually makes us

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Speaker 5: be in more pain.

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Speaker 2: And a lot a big part of all of this

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00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:17,600
Speaker 2: is the lack of media representation and the lack of

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Speaker 2: just normalization of menstruating and the side effects that come

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Speaker 2: along with it, including pain. Because again, like we were like,

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Speaker 2: which movies could we do? Well, there's Carrie and we've

426
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Speaker 2: already done it, but.

427
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:34,520
Speaker 3: It's like we've done it, and also what can we

428
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Speaker 3: take away? It was like.

429
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Speaker 2: Horrible scary trauma associated with periods. There's a couple movies

430
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Speaker 2: that kind of half explicitly acknowledged periods, but also they're

431
00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:51,280
Speaker 2: sort of metaphorical as far as turning red and ginger

432
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Speaker 2: snaps where it's like puberty turns you into.

433
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Speaker 3: An animal, which and also we've also already covered those too,

434
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Speaker 3: and we have all to cover those. There's only so

435
00:23:01,320 --> 00:23:04,159
Speaker 3: many like that's it, right, wild.

436
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Speaker 5: And I feel like, I like, I feel like those

437
00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:08,520
Speaker 5: metaphoric things are like they're so great and I love

438
00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:09,720
Speaker 5: them and I'm glad that they're out there.

439
00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:11,800
Speaker 4: But I'm also like I want to talk.

440
00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:16,040
Speaker 5: Literally, like I want to speak very specifically about this.

441
00:23:16,520 --> 00:23:18,720
Speaker 3: I really love. I mean, this is like I guess

442
00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:20,640
Speaker 3: starting to get into the movie, but I really love.

443
00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:23,800
Speaker 3: I don't even remember ever really being like this. I

444
00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:26,720
Speaker 3: mean I remember being like when, well, we'll talk about it,

445
00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:31,520
Speaker 3: but like, I do like that these these young girls

446
00:23:31,560 --> 00:23:35,159
Speaker 3: are very charmingly obsessed with their periods and they're like

447
00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:36,080
Speaker 3: where is it?

448
00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:37,800
Speaker 2: Like there would not relate.

449
00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:41,480
Speaker 3: I love the intensity. The intensity of a twelve year

450
00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:45,000
Speaker 3: old is just like unmatched, unmatched.

451
00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:48,520
Speaker 5: This captured it so well, that intensity, and like both

452
00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:51,640
Speaker 5: being terrified of it and being like, but I wanted

453
00:23:51,680 --> 00:23:53,399
Speaker 5: to have in right now, but I need it.

454
00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:55,840
Speaker 3: And then yeah, and then like you know, you're whoever

455
00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:57,800
Speaker 3: in your life is like helping you through that, you're

456
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:01,320
Speaker 3: or you're like your mom being like no rush, Yeah,

457
00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:05,920
Speaker 3: it kinda sucks so bad forever. But anyways, anyways, should

458
00:24:05,920 --> 00:24:08,600
Speaker 3: we should we get into our history with the movie.

459
00:24:09,240 --> 00:24:12,680
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, so' so Kate, tell us about your yeah,

460
00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:17,119
Speaker 2: relationship with the source material if any the movie, et cetera.

461
00:24:17,320 --> 00:24:20,960
Speaker 5: Yeah, So I definitely had Judy Blue. I know that

462
00:24:21,000 --> 00:24:23,560
Speaker 5: I like read Judy Blue books. I was a big reader,

463
00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:25,520
Speaker 5: Like when I was a kid, I lived on top

464
00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:27,719
Speaker 5: of a mountain in May. No, it was for it

465
00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:31,040
Speaker 5: was for sad reasons. Nothing. It was because we didn't

466
00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:34,359
Speaker 5: have cable and I was only allowed one hour of

467
00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:36,879
Speaker 5: TV or no, I was allowed half an hour of

468
00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:39,800
Speaker 5: TV a day and mostly we just got PBS.

469
00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:42,840
Speaker 4: And so it was like, Kaitlin, you're similar similar.

470
00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:45,000
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, so we got two channel, we got three channels.

471
00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:47,359
Speaker 5: One of them came in clearly and it was BBS.

472
00:24:47,359 --> 00:24:50,399
Speaker 5: And so it was just like me and so I

473
00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:52,280
Speaker 5: read a lot, but I was more of like a

474
00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:57,399
Speaker 5: red wall Narnia kid like more on the fantasy side,

475
00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:00,880
Speaker 5: and so these like the Judy Bloom I read them

476
00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:04,320
Speaker 5: because I read everything, but I was just kind of like, okay,

477
00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:06,960
Speaker 5: like there's not a lot of talking mice in this,

478
00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:11,120
Speaker 5: so I'm not really into it. But I do think

479
00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:14,080
Speaker 5: that was partly because my parents are hippies and were

480
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:17,560
Speaker 5: very like upfront with me and like straight shooters when

481
00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:20,920
Speaker 5: it came to like, oh, here's what's gonna happen when

482
00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:23,359
Speaker 5: you get your period. Oh here's why this happens. Like

483
00:25:23,680 --> 00:25:26,000
Speaker 5: my parents would like walk around naked after showers like

484
00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:28,400
Speaker 5: air drying, and it was just sort of like that

485
00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:31,840
Speaker 5: was not something that I was like curious about in

486
00:25:31,880 --> 00:25:34,080
Speaker 5: that way where I was just like, I think for

487
00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:36,520
Speaker 5: people who didn't have that kind of like openness in

488
00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:39,080
Speaker 5: their family, I think Judy Bloom books were like way

489
00:25:39,119 --> 00:25:39,720
Speaker 5: more important.

490
00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:41,200
Speaker 4: And then the movie.

491
00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:42,800
Speaker 5: I'd never seen it before, but I knew that it

492
00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:45,720
Speaker 5: had come out, and when I was researching for Cramped,

493
00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:48,120
Speaker 5: I didn't.

494
00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:49,480
Speaker 4: Know this, but are you there, God, it's me.

495
00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:53,600
Speaker 5: Margaret is one of the most banned books just because

496
00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:58,360
Speaker 5: it talks openly about periods and the people getting their

497
00:25:58,400 --> 00:26:01,160
Speaker 5: periods are not like traumatized.

498
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:05,160
Speaker 4: They're they're like, it's like positive, like to this day.

499
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:06,840
Speaker 3: I mean, I think we're going to see another round

500
00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:10,159
Speaker 3: of this book being banned or an escalation on bands

501
00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:13,720
Speaker 3: that already exist. It's just like ridiculous.

502
00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:16,280
Speaker 5: Well, they're trying to pass bills in Florida that are

503
00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:20,560
Speaker 5: like you can't say the word period in school, like shit.

504
00:26:20,480 --> 00:26:22,720
Speaker 3: Like but what if you're what if you need to

505
00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:25,800
Speaker 3: write a sentence? We don't know, we don't know.

506
00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:30,679
Speaker 2: Just said, yeah, Jamie, how about you? What's your situation.

507
00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:36,359
Speaker 3: I a very specific relationship with Judy Bloom books. I

508
00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:39,440
Speaker 3: was also a huge reader as a kid. I'm bragging.

509
00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:42,200
Speaker 3: I'm I'm a big reader to this day. I love

510
00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:50,479
Speaker 3: reading books and I reread anti intellectual Uh there. I

511
00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:54,320
Speaker 3: reread because it's a quick read when you're an adult woman.

512
00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:58,280
Speaker 3: But I reread are you there? God it to me

513
00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:01,800
Speaker 3: Margaret yesterday because I remember, I don't like specific. I

514
00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:03,080
Speaker 3: know that I read it. I think I read like

515
00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:07,200
Speaker 3: every Judy Bloom book that was available, including her book

516
00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:08,960
Speaker 3: for adults Summer Sisters.

517
00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:11,520
Speaker 2: And we just talked about this on another episode.

518
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:14,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, because we've both read it and I was like, oh,

519
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:17,320
Speaker 3: this is for me, but then it was juicy, so

520
00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:19,760
Speaker 3: I kept going. And then also, there's another Judy Bloom

521
00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:22,400
Speaker 3: adult book that I learned about yesterday that I was like, well,

522
00:27:22,760 --> 00:27:25,240
Speaker 3: why haven't I Maybe it was banned at my library,

523
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 3: but she wrote another her first Anyway, I read the book,

524
00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:31,800
Speaker 3: and I watched a documentary that came out a couple

525
00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:33,639
Speaker 3: of years ago about Judy Bloom. So I'm just like

526
00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:36,160
Speaker 3: riding high on Judy Fumes.

527
00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:40,639
Speaker 2: But her first, Wow, Judy Flume.

528
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:44,919
Speaker 3: I've just I've just like mainlined Judy all yesterday to

529
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:46,280
Speaker 3: the point where I was like, oh, yeah, I have

530
00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:49,639
Speaker 3: to watch the movie we're talking about. But yeah, so

531
00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:53,280
Speaker 3: she her first like novel for adults was called Wifey

532
00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:57,240
Speaker 3: and it was about like she wrote it suspiciously right

533
00:27:57,240 --> 00:27:59,800
Speaker 3: before she left her husband, and it was about like

534
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:02,960
Speaker 3: cheating on your husband. And everyone was so scandalized and

535
00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,160
Speaker 3: they're like, Judy Bloom's career is over and then guess

536
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:08,320
Speaker 3: what she It wasn't like it was a super bestseller,

537
00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:12,240
Speaker 3: and everyone was like more horny adult Judy Bloom. But

538
00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:16,120
Speaker 3: my Judy Bloom book. And I literally had I think

539
00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:18,640
Speaker 3: at one point, and I hated her for a while,

540
00:28:18,680 --> 00:28:20,479
Speaker 3: even though I'd read so many of her books. I

541
00:28:20,560 --> 00:28:23,280
Speaker 3: liked her books for kids. The Fudge books are super fun.

542
00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:24,359
Speaker 4: Yes, I loved her.

543
00:28:24,640 --> 00:28:28,200
Speaker 3: Yes, like her. She writes for literally every age level,

544
00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:32,399
Speaker 3: so well, it's like amazing. But I loved the Fudge books.

545
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:34,080
Speaker 3: And then I read are You There Got It's Me Margaret.

546
00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:37,840
Speaker 3: And then when I was Margaret's age, like eleven twelve,

547
00:28:37,920 --> 00:28:42,920
Speaker 3: I got diagnosed I don't even know, with scoliosis. And

548
00:28:42,960 --> 00:28:46,760
Speaker 3: then I received five trillion copies of the book DEENI,

549
00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:49,720
Speaker 3: and it made me want to fucking rip my head.

550
00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:51,680
Speaker 3: For a while, I was a Judy Bloom fan, and

551
00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:53,280
Speaker 3: then I was a Judy Bloom hater because I'm like,

552
00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:56,600
Speaker 3: if another aunt gives me a copy of fucking Demie,

553
00:28:57,360 --> 00:28:59,880
Speaker 3: I'm gonna suffocate myself with my own back price. Like

554
00:28:59,880 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 3: I just really hated And I mean I read it

555
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:05,160
Speaker 3: the first time. I was but then I still like

556
00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:07,440
Speaker 3: in the I kept them all out of sight. I

557
00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:10,120
Speaker 3: have so many different additions, Like my aunt was like,

558
00:29:10,160 --> 00:29:12,000
Speaker 3: I have the first edition and then they're like, here's

559
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:13,720
Speaker 3: the one with a new cover, and I'm like, well,

560
00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:16,600
Speaker 3: someone fucking talk to me about the fact that it

561
00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:18,160
Speaker 3: sucks to wear a back brace. But they're like, no,

562
00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:21,320
Speaker 3: here's Deanie. But that is the beauty and the function

563
00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:24,320
Speaker 3: of Judy Blue, I think for a lot of young

564
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:27,360
Speaker 3: people of all genders, is like and I remember another

565
00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:30,560
Speaker 3: Judy Blue book that really stuck with me was Blubber,

566
00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:35,440
Speaker 3: which was about I mean not I mean, you know,

567
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:37,560
Speaker 3: you could hope for a different title, but it was

568
00:29:37,640 --> 00:29:41,560
Speaker 3: about a girl being bullied for her weight in the seventies.

569
00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:44,680
Speaker 3: But it's told from the perspective of someone who's friends

570
00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:47,560
Speaker 3: with the bullies but is afraid to stand up to them.

571
00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:50,240
Speaker 3: And like, I remember being really impacted by that because

572
00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:52,640
Speaker 3: you're like, oh my god, the protagonist of this book

573
00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 3: is like kind of evil, but also it could so

574
00:29:55,680 --> 00:29:58,080
Speaker 3: easily be me to be afraid to stand up to

575
00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:03,920
Speaker 3: people like I. Her books are amazing. Deanie can suck

576
00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:05,880
Speaker 3: it because also the thing with Danie, you know that

577
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:08,960
Speaker 3: was a book. Yeah, well, because you didn't have scoliosis, Caitlin.

578
00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:12,680
Speaker 3: Every person with scoliosis knows who fucking Deanie is and

579
00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:15,320
Speaker 3: the problem with Deanie and it's not you know, I'm

580
00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:18,160
Speaker 3: sure that I hope that there's other books about young

581
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:22,040
Speaker 3: girls with scoliosis now, because it you know, disproportionately affects,

582
00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:25,959
Speaker 3: says girls because they grow fast. Whatever. But it just

583
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:28,560
Speaker 3: I hated that bitch so much because the thing with

584
00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:32,360
Speaker 3: Deanie was her character was like, she was so beautiful

585
00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:34,200
Speaker 3: and she was going to be a model, but then

586
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:36,479
Speaker 3: she got a back brace and she had to like

587
00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:39,600
Speaker 3: develop a personality. And my take on Deani at the

588
00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:43,360
Speaker 3: time was like, oh, congratulations on being so fucking hot, Deani,

589
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:46,640
Speaker 3: because some of us didn't start that far ahead. Some

590
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:49,760
Speaker 3: of us looked weird and then they got a back brace. Anyways,

591
00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:51,680
Speaker 3: I had a real bone to pick with Deani for

592
00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:55,920
Speaker 3: many years. I should go back and reread it, but whatever,

593
00:30:56,760 --> 00:30:59,120
Speaker 3: did I have something else to yell about it with

594
00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:02,680
Speaker 3: regards to Deanie? Uh oh oh, yes, that the thing

595
00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:05,720
Speaker 3: that actually stuck with me with Deanie. That turns out

596
00:31:05,760 --> 00:31:07,280
Speaker 3: and I want to talk a bit more about Judy

597
00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:09,160
Speaker 3: Bloom Loore because I learned all about I mean, the

598
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:13,440
Speaker 3: entire Reagan administration was like, we've got to kill Judy Bloom.

599
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:16,960
Speaker 3: We're gonna kill her, and meanwhile, she's like the sweetest

600
00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:20,520
Speaker 3: person in the whole world. The documentary was myth But

601
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:23,520
Speaker 3: something that I thought was really beautiful about it was

602
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:26,880
Speaker 3: that kids would write to her that felt like they

603
00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:29,000
Speaker 3: couldn't talk to their own parents or the adults in

604
00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:33,080
Speaker 3: their lives, and she would respond, and like she became

605
00:31:33,280 --> 00:31:35,360
Speaker 3: a pen pal for some of her young readers, for

606
00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:38,800
Speaker 3: like I'm Gonna Cry for like twenty years, and she

607
00:31:38,920 --> 00:31:42,920
Speaker 3: like went to there was this girl, Laurie Kim, and

608
00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:46,160
Speaker 3: she like had all of these like you know, very

609
00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:48,480
Speaker 3: normal problems growing up. But then she had a bad

610
00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:51,080
Speaker 3: relationship with her parents. And she wrote Judy bloom when

611
00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:53,040
Speaker 3: she was going to graduate from college and she was like,

612
00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:58,160
Speaker 3: will you come instead? And Judy bloom went, It's like, oh,

613
00:31:58,200 --> 00:32:02,880
Speaker 3: like she's just so great. Anyways, the scene that about

614
00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:05,920
Speaker 3: Deanie that was the reason the book was banned Hot

615
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:10,240
Speaker 3: Girls with Scoliosis is that's okay, we're not going to

616
00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:11,920
Speaker 3: ban that from the library. But there's a scene in

617
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:15,480
Speaker 3: Deanie I remember so specifically where Deanie masturbates and she

618
00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:19,080
Speaker 3: like figures out what masturbation is. It's literally a page,

619
00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:22,040
Speaker 3: but it's the book was banned for the entire Reakud

620
00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:28,600
Speaker 3: administration because they're like, Deanie cannot be masturbating anyways, Big

621
00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:33,640
Speaker 3: Judy Bloomhead fucked Deanie. But I'm glad that she she

622
00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:37,200
Speaker 3: Deani literally taught me how to masturbate. How embarrassing is that?

623
00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:39,480
Speaker 4: What a like? What a perfect?

624
00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:39,719
Speaker 2: Like?

625
00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:43,040
Speaker 5: Your aunts are giving you this like scoliosis book and

626
00:32:43,080 --> 00:32:45,040
Speaker 5: you're like, fuck you, I'm gonna learn masturbation.

627
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:49,320
Speaker 3: Uh it was I'm trying to remember how I want to.

628
00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:51,680
Speaker 3: I should reread Deanie, but it just stills me with

629
00:32:52,080 --> 00:32:57,680
Speaker 3: like twelve year old rage. But it like described masturbation

630
00:32:57,800 --> 00:32:59,760
Speaker 3: in a way that like actually made sense to me.

631
00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:02,200
Speaker 3: It wasn't like I am Deani and I am going

632
00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:04,520
Speaker 3: to masturbate. It was like I have this feeling and

633
00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:06,200
Speaker 3: then I do this. I was like, I do that

634
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:10,560
Speaker 3: and you're like, wait, there's a name for it. So

635
00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:13,480
Speaker 3: Judy Blum is awesome. And if your family is afraid

636
00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:15,480
Speaker 3: to talk to you about your own body, I feel

637
00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:22,760
Speaker 3: like she to this day is a very useful source. Caitlin,

638
00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:25,920
Speaker 3: what's your history with this book and with Judy Bloom?

639
00:33:26,520 --> 00:33:29,400
Speaker 2: I was also a big reader as a youth.

640
00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 3: Look at us, look at us?

641
00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:39,680
Speaker 5: Shocking that three reader girls became podcaster? Wow shocking, no one?

642
00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 2: But yeah, I loved Judy bloom books. I also really

643
00:33:45,280 --> 00:33:49,560
Speaker 2: enjoyed the Fudge books and then I'm guessing my mom

644
00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:53,240
Speaker 2: put are you there? God is me? Margaret in my hands,

645
00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:55,720
Speaker 2: and she's like, read this because it.

646
00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:58,080
Speaker 3: Was like books of our mom's generation.

647
00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:02,560
Speaker 2: Right right right. And I read it, And obviously this

648
00:34:02,680 --> 00:34:04,600
Speaker 2: was like thirty years ago, so I barely remember it.

649
00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:07,880
Speaker 2: But the one thing I do remember is not being

650
00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:12,600
Speaker 2: able to relate at all to Margaret being excited about

651
00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:15,400
Speaker 2: the prospect of having her period. Okay, because I think

652
00:34:15,400 --> 00:34:17,319
Speaker 2: I read this, Yeah, I definitely read this before I

653
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:20,279
Speaker 2: got my period, and I was I was dreading it

654
00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:22,560
Speaker 2: like I knew what a period was. It did not

655
00:34:22,680 --> 00:34:26,040
Speaker 2: seem pleasant. I was not interested in getting it, and

656
00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:29,800
Speaker 2: you're right, and I think I just like instinctively knew

657
00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:32,440
Speaker 2: how bad my periods were going to be. I don't know,

658
00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:36,160
Speaker 2: but I had my period for like six months before

659
00:34:36,200 --> 00:34:39,920
Speaker 2: I admitted to anyone, like my friends at least, that

660
00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:42,359
Speaker 2: I had it. I was like in denial. I was like, no,

661
00:34:42,520 --> 00:34:45,000
Speaker 2: that's just blood that comes out of my body every month.

662
00:34:45,040 --> 00:34:49,719
Speaker 2: There's not my period. I could not handle the fact

663
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:52,000
Speaker 2: that I got my period. I did not want it

664
00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:55,320
Speaker 2: at all. And now I don't have it anymore, yay.

665
00:34:55,520 --> 00:34:58,799
Speaker 2: But anyway, but otherwise I think I really enjoyed the book,

666
00:34:58,920 --> 00:35:03,880
Speaker 2: and I am that I related to Margaret's, you know,

667
00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:09,399
Speaker 2: journey around figuring out her religious identity or perhaps lack

668
00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:12,239
Speaker 2: thereof that kind of like spiritual journey, because I was

669
00:35:12,320 --> 00:35:16,560
Speaker 2: raised without religion as well, and I got like bullied

670
00:35:16,600 --> 00:35:21,600
Speaker 2: for it in my like conservative small town, and so

671
00:35:22,239 --> 00:35:25,680
Speaker 2: I imagine that was something that I connected with. But yeah,

672
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:28,880
Speaker 2: Judy Bloom Rocks we talked about this recently, Jamie, but

673
00:35:29,080 --> 00:35:33,200
Speaker 2: we I read Forever, and that book taught me about sex,

674
00:35:33,400 --> 00:35:35,880
Speaker 2: and then Somemer sisters taught me even more about sex.

675
00:35:36,080 --> 00:35:41,360
Speaker 3: I never read Forever, but when they were recapping it, and

676
00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:47,359
Speaker 3: the documentary is on Prime unfortunately, but it's there, and yeah,

677
00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:50,200
Speaker 3: I was like, oh, Forever's dirty. And they were like

678
00:35:50,239 --> 00:35:53,040
Speaker 3: these like when Judy Bloom was doing signings, and it's

679
00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:54,839
Speaker 3: like all these young people who were like, I want

680
00:35:54,880 --> 00:35:57,560
Speaker 3: to know how sex works. She would tak she would

681
00:35:57,560 --> 00:35:59,439
Speaker 3: have like a little conversations with them at the front

682
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:01,600
Speaker 3: where she's like, how does your family feel about you

683
00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:04,440
Speaker 3: buying this book? And they would either be like they

684
00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:06,840
Speaker 3: have no idea or like they feel okay because they

685
00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:08,319
Speaker 3: don't want to tell me what sex is. And she's

686
00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:12,520
Speaker 3: like okay, but like its just she just seems like

687
00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:14,960
Speaker 3: the coolest person in the world.

688
00:36:15,080 --> 00:36:18,200
Speaker 5: She seems like she genuinely cares that like right, but

689
00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:21,600
Speaker 5: like young girls know something about something, you know.

690
00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:27,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, and like never wavered on that, and I just

691
00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:29,320
Speaker 3: think that that's so cool.

692
00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:30,840
Speaker 1: Yeah. I like that.

693
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:33,000
Speaker 5: She doesn't seem like she has an agenda. She's not

694
00:36:33,080 --> 00:36:37,560
Speaker 5: trying to like push any specific like way of thinking

695
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:41,279
Speaker 5: about things other than just like here's information and like

696
00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:43,560
Speaker 5: here's how this girl feels about it, and here's how

697
00:36:43,560 --> 00:36:46,399
Speaker 5: this girl feels about it, and that's okay, like right.

698
00:36:46,360 --> 00:36:49,799
Speaker 2: Which has a very normalizing effect, and that's what we

699
00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:54,400
Speaker 2: need from media. The other thing. So this movie, I

700
00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:57,200
Speaker 2: didn't see it right when it came out, but I actually,

701
00:36:57,280 --> 00:37:02,000
Speaker 2: funny story, I had plans to see it with two

702
00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:04,360
Speaker 2: of my friends. Let's put a pin in that I

703
00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:07,000
Speaker 2: had to bail at the last minute because I had

704
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:09,560
Speaker 2: such bad period cramps. The three of us went to

705
00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:13,399
Speaker 2: Denny's together and I started feeling really really horrible, and

706
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:16,000
Speaker 2: I like had I went to the bathroom did my

707
00:37:16,520 --> 00:37:18,560
Speaker 2: business there, but I was like, guys, I have to

708
00:37:18,600 --> 00:37:20,879
Speaker 2: bail on the movie. I'm so sorry. So they took

709
00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:25,160
Speaker 2: me home and I missed the movie. But the reason

710
00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:27,760
Speaker 2: me and these two friends we're gonna go is that, Okay,

711
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:30,359
Speaker 2: you know when you're in a little group chat, and

712
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:33,719
Speaker 2: the group chat has a funny little name. My group

713
00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:37,040
Speaker 2: chat with these two friends is called the Margarets. Oh,

714
00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:41,279
Speaker 2: named after the book because this was before the movie

715
00:37:41,280 --> 00:37:45,840
Speaker 2: came out. But the reason we're called the Margarets is

716
00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:49,880
Speaker 2: because we So it's my friend Sammy friend of the show,

717
00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:52,760
Speaker 2: and my friend Nicki and I was at Sammy's house

718
00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:56,080
Speaker 2: and we were like text pestering Nicky because she was

719
00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:59,200
Speaker 2: supposed to arrive at Sammy's as well. She was late,

720
00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:02,040
Speaker 2: and so we we're just like text bombing her, being

721
00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:04,200
Speaker 2: like Nikki, where are you are you here? Yet? Where

722
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:07,640
Speaker 2: are you are you there? Nikki? It's us Margaret And

723
00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:10,360
Speaker 2: then it just stuck and then we like renamed the

724
00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:14,520
Speaker 2: group chat the Margarets, and that has been our name

725
00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:17,760
Speaker 2: of our friendship for the past like eight years or something.

726
00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:18,560
Speaker 4: That's so cool.

727
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:20,399
Speaker 3: I did not know. Yeah, it was like the new

728
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:23,040
Speaker 3: Lord just dropped. I did not I know of that

729
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:24,359
Speaker 3: group text, but I didn't know the lore.

730
00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:28,440
Speaker 2: Wow, yeah, this is the Lord. So so this this uh,

731
00:38:29,160 --> 00:38:32,560
Speaker 2: Margaret and the Margarets has a special place in my heart.

732
00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:38,080
Speaker 2: But anyway, so yeah, I guess let's take a quick

733
00:38:38,120 --> 00:38:38,680
Speaker 2: break and then.

734
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:41,880
Speaker 3: We'll We've been recording for forty minutes, so we'll if

735
00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:42,959
Speaker 3: you read that, and.

736
00:38:42,880 --> 00:38:46,520
Speaker 2: We haven't even started the recap. But here we are

737
00:38:46,600 --> 00:38:50,879
Speaker 2: normalizing periods, so we're doing good work. But yeah, let's

738
00:38:50,920 --> 00:38:52,959
Speaker 2: take a quick break and then we'll come right back.

739
00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:08,040
Speaker 3: And we're back now that we're talking about periods. I

740
00:39:08,040 --> 00:39:10,120
Speaker 3: know we have to recap the movie, but I was thinking,

741
00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:12,680
Speaker 3: did I. I'm sure I've mentioned it on the show

742
00:39:12,719 --> 00:39:14,960
Speaker 3: at some point in the last like almost ten years,

743
00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:18,000
Speaker 3: but I got my period when I was in eighth grade.

744
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:20,319
Speaker 3: I think I was kind of ambivalent towards it, like

745
00:39:20,400 --> 00:39:23,440
Speaker 3: I didn't feel one way or another. I was just

746
00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:25,520
Speaker 3: wearing a back brace and trying to be invisible, and

747
00:39:25,520 --> 00:39:28,719
Speaker 3: that was my job, so no one cared if I

748
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:31,960
Speaker 3: was bleeding. I was invisible. But I, because I was

749
00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:34,520
Speaker 3: like kind of a little bit behind most of my friends,

750
00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:38,480
Speaker 3: I kind of decided that I was never going to

751
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:40,400
Speaker 3: get my period and that I was going to be

752
00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:44,600
Speaker 3: like married Magdalen, and I thought that like it, I

753
00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:47,000
Speaker 3: was like a supernatural being who is never going to

754
00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:50,320
Speaker 3: get their period, and like and that made me really powerful.

755
00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:51,839
Speaker 3: And then I got it. And then I was like,

756
00:39:51,920 --> 00:39:54,120
Speaker 3: did I just shit myself? And my mom was like no,

757
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:56,040
Speaker 3: and I was like, oh.

758
00:39:55,640 --> 00:39:57,399
Speaker 2: I know that part of the story that you thought

759
00:39:57,960 --> 00:39:59,600
Speaker 2: you getting your period was you shitting yourself.

760
00:40:00,040 --> 00:40:01,520
Speaker 4: People think that that's the same thing.

761
00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:05,040
Speaker 5: I had Wendy Zuckerman from Science Versus on and that

762
00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:07,680
Speaker 5: is exactly what she said. Is she the first time

763
00:40:07,719 --> 00:40:10,719
Speaker 5: she got her period? She thought she shot herself and

764
00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:13,319
Speaker 5: the word shart in an Australian accent over and over

765
00:40:13,360 --> 00:40:13,799
Speaker 5: and over again.

766
00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:18,960
Speaker 3: That so funny, good, that is, I mean, I and

767
00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:22,839
Speaker 3: it also I mean but like period commercialism, like you know,

768
00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:24,840
Speaker 3: I'm sure that some people still are like is my

769
00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:27,279
Speaker 3: period blue? Like what is this? But even though but

770
00:40:27,320 --> 00:40:32,200
Speaker 3: I was expecting, like, you know, beautiful, like perfect primary

771
00:40:32,200 --> 00:40:35,919
Speaker 3: color red and it so it makes sense that people

772
00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 3: think they shit themselves. It's yeah, it's just not everyone's experience. Yeah. Anyways,

773
00:40:41,600 --> 00:40:43,720
Speaker 3: what happens in Are you there God to meet market

774
00:40:44,239 --> 00:40:45,600
Speaker 3: all tell you?

775
00:40:46,200 --> 00:40:49,600
Speaker 2: Okay, So it's nineteen seventy and eleven year old girl

776
00:40:49,680 --> 00:40:53,960
Speaker 2: named Margaret played by Abby Ryder Forston comes home from

777
00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:57,040
Speaker 2: summer camp back to her family in New York City

778
00:40:57,120 --> 00:41:01,040
Speaker 2: ever heard of it? We meet Margaret's mom, Barbara played

779
00:41:01,040 --> 00:41:05,400
Speaker 2: by Rachel McAdams, her dad herb played by Benny Saftie,

780
00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 2: as well as her paternal grandmother Sylvia. It's like by

781
00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:16,160
Speaker 2: Kathy Bade's question mark of Unsinkable Molly Brown fame. Margaret

782
00:41:16,200 --> 00:41:18,840
Speaker 2: soon learns that she and her parents will be moving

783
00:41:18,880 --> 00:41:23,719
Speaker 2: to New Jersey, something that Margaret deeply resents, so she

784
00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:27,040
Speaker 2: prays to God, seemingly for the first time, because we'll

785
00:41:27,120 --> 00:41:31,040
Speaker 2: learn that she was not raised with any religion, and

786
00:41:31,160 --> 00:41:34,560
Speaker 2: she says, are you there, God, it's me Margaret. Hey,

787
00:41:34,640 --> 00:41:37,920
Speaker 2: that's the name of the movie. And she says, please

788
00:41:38,000 --> 00:41:41,200
Speaker 2: stop this move to New Jersey from happening, or at

789
00:41:41,239 --> 00:41:44,000
Speaker 2: the very least, please make it so that New Jersey

790
00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:49,319
Speaker 2: doesn't suck too bad. God does not stop the move,

791
00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:53,719
Speaker 2: so Margaret and her family arrive in Jersey. A girl

792
00:41:53,719 --> 00:41:58,479
Speaker 2: from the neighborhood named Nancy invites Margaret over, so they're

793
00:41:58,480 --> 00:42:02,880
Speaker 2: hanging out. Nancy common on Margaret's flat chest and she

794
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:09,239
Speaker 2: boasts that she's already started growing bosoms. Nancy also asks

795
00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:13,120
Speaker 2: if Margaret has ever kissed a boy. She admits that

796
00:42:13,200 --> 00:42:17,120
Speaker 2: she hasn't either, but she practices a lot on her bedpost.

797
00:42:18,040 --> 00:42:23,399
Speaker 2: Then Nancy's older brother, Evan, and his friend Moose show up.

798
00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:26,600
Speaker 3: We just never in neither the book nor the movie,

799
00:42:26,640 --> 00:42:29,279
Speaker 3: we never question the name Moose.

800
00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:33,839
Speaker 5: It's literally it's like Margaret, Nancy, Evan Moose, Like they

801
00:42:33,920 --> 00:42:36,879
Speaker 5: call him that at school, Like I guess we don't

802
00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:38,960
Speaker 5: see his teachers call him that, but that's the.

803
00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:42,280
Speaker 3: Feeling you get that they also call him Moose. Yeah,

804
00:42:42,320 --> 00:42:44,879
Speaker 3: it's very seventies in a way where it's very how

805
00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:47,279
Speaker 3: I imagine the seventies, Like, yeah, they were just kids

806
00:42:47,400 --> 00:42:49,279
Speaker 3: named Moose. They would mow your lawn.

807
00:42:50,120 --> 00:42:56,080
Speaker 2: I don't know, Yeah, certainly, And so Margaret seems to

808
00:42:56,120 --> 00:43:01,440
Speaker 2: take a liking to Moose. Nancy then invites Margaret to

809
00:43:01,560 --> 00:43:04,640
Speaker 2: join her secret club, in which they cannot wear socks.

810
00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:06,920
Speaker 3: Nancy's a freak the no socks thing.

811
00:43:06,960 --> 00:43:10,000
Speaker 5: Did Like, I loved that because it was I remember

812
00:43:10,160 --> 00:43:12,080
Speaker 5: in seventh grade, I like had a new group of

813
00:43:12,080 --> 00:43:15,640
Speaker 5: friends and they all wore like the Adidas with the

814
00:43:15,680 --> 00:43:18,759
Speaker 5: three stripes, and I was like, I have to get

815
00:43:18,800 --> 00:43:20,680
Speaker 5: these shoes, mom, And then my mom bought me like

816
00:43:20,680 --> 00:43:22,879
Speaker 5: the knockoffs with four stripes, and I was like.

817
00:43:23,600 --> 00:43:27,080
Speaker 3: No, that was I think. My thing in middle school

818
00:43:27,440 --> 00:43:31,440
Speaker 3: was live strong bracelets. You had to have a live

819
00:43:31,560 --> 00:43:34,320
Speaker 3: strong bracelet or you were not living strong.

820
00:43:35,440 --> 00:43:39,640
Speaker 2: So true, so true. Anyway, Margaret complies to the no

821
00:43:39,800 --> 00:43:44,960
Speaker 2: sock rule and she lives to regret it. But Margaret

822
00:43:44,960 --> 00:43:50,280
Speaker 2: returns home and she talks slash praise to God again

823
00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:56,680
Speaker 2: and asks God to make her boobs grow. Then it's

824
00:43:56,719 --> 00:43:59,120
Speaker 2: the first day of sixth grade at her new school.

825
00:43:59,680 --> 00:44:03,960
Speaker 2: Margaret meets the other girls in the Secret Club, Jane

826
00:44:04,320 --> 00:44:08,399
Speaker 2: and Gretchen. Also in their class is a boy who

827
00:44:08,560 --> 00:44:11,759
Speaker 2: all the girls think is cute named Philip Lee Roy.

828
00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:16,600
Speaker 2: There's another boy who they all think is like dweeby

829
00:44:17,560 --> 00:44:21,400
Speaker 2: Norman Fisher. And then there's also a girl who is

830
00:44:21,520 --> 00:44:26,400
Speaker 2: far taller and more developed than mostly everyone else, and

831
00:44:26,440 --> 00:44:31,080
Speaker 2: her name is Laura Danker, who has a reputation because

832
00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:34,239
Speaker 2: she lets boys feel her up behind the A and

833
00:44:34,320 --> 00:44:40,280
Speaker 2: P supermarket, or at least that's the rumor that Nancy spreads.

834
00:44:40,640 --> 00:44:45,800
Speaker 2: Laura innocence truly yes, And they also meet their teacher,

835
00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:50,040
Speaker 2: mister Benedict, and it's his first year teaching and he's

836
00:44:50,600 --> 00:44:55,480
Speaker 2: nervous and he's nice and he's a good teacher. Anyway,

837
00:44:55,880 --> 00:45:00,520
Speaker 2: after school is the first secret club meeting at Nancy House.

838
00:45:01,400 --> 00:45:05,319
Speaker 2: Nancy establishes more rules in addition to the no sock rule,

839
00:45:06,040 --> 00:45:09,440
Speaker 2: such as you have to wear a bra. If anyone

840
00:45:09,440 --> 00:45:11,960
Speaker 2: gets their period, they have to tell the others about it.

841
00:45:12,760 --> 00:45:15,360
Speaker 2: They have to make boy books and write about the

842
00:45:15,360 --> 00:45:18,319
Speaker 2: boys that they like, which they have to show each other,

843
00:45:18,560 --> 00:45:21,360
Speaker 2: and they can never lie about them, a rule that

844
00:45:21,680 --> 00:45:26,160
Speaker 2: Margaret immediately breaks because she denies her crush on Moose.

845
00:45:26,560 --> 00:45:31,040
Speaker 3: Well, I mean, admitting that you're lusting after someone named

846
00:45:31,040 --> 00:45:32,640
Speaker 3: Moose can't be an easy journey.

847
00:45:33,320 --> 00:45:37,760
Speaker 2: This is true. Yes, that night, Margaret tells her mom

848
00:45:37,880 --> 00:45:40,200
Speaker 2: that she wants to get a bra, and what I

849
00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:44,239
Speaker 2: thought was a very cute scene where Margaret is super embarrassed.

850
00:45:44,760 --> 00:45:48,440
Speaker 2: Barbara is like, are you sure you need one? Bras

851
00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:54,480
Speaker 2: suck shit. It's like okay, mom, there, yeah, but she's like, yes,

852
00:45:54,560 --> 00:45:57,480
Speaker 2: of course, we'll get you a bra. Because Barbara is

853
00:45:57,960 --> 00:46:01,319
Speaker 2: a very sweet, tender, supportive mother, and.

854
00:46:01,360 --> 00:46:04,560
Speaker 3: Rachel McAdams is so good in this part. I know that,

855
00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:06,640
Speaker 3: Like when this movie came out, people were like she

856
00:46:06,760 --> 00:46:09,040
Speaker 3: was snubbed for I was like, I agree. She was

857
00:46:09,120 --> 00:46:10,919
Speaker 3: like I thought she did such a great job.

858
00:46:11,760 --> 00:46:15,840
Speaker 5: Also, the costume designer was her enemy in this, like

859
00:46:16,560 --> 00:46:19,120
Speaker 5: the clothes they put her in and the clothes they

860
00:46:19,120 --> 00:46:22,000
Speaker 5: put Kathy Bates in. I was like, all the favors

861
00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:24,040
Speaker 5: that they could have been doing for Rachel McAdams they

862
00:46:24,040 --> 00:46:25,480
Speaker 5: were doing for Kathy Baits.

863
00:46:25,239 --> 00:46:28,759
Speaker 3: And Kathy Bates was really turning some interesting looks in

864
00:46:28,800 --> 00:46:33,319
Speaker 3: this movie. There's yeah, at very least I had my notes.

865
00:46:33,320 --> 00:46:35,680
Speaker 3: I was like, at least they let Rachel McAdams have

866
00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:39,279
Speaker 3: the coolest hairstyle available. Yes, like she did have the

867
00:46:39,280 --> 00:46:43,600
Speaker 3: coolest seventies hair out of all of the mom's. Just

868
00:46:43,600 --> 00:46:45,719
Speaker 3: like so many of these scenes, even though it's like,

869
00:46:46,080 --> 00:46:48,279
Speaker 3: you know, we went through this decade later, I was like,

870
00:46:48,320 --> 00:46:51,560
Speaker 3: oh my god, I never had that first bra shopping experience.

871
00:46:51,640 --> 00:46:54,200
Speaker 3: My aunt just slipped me. I had, like I remember

872
00:46:54,239 --> 00:46:56,080
Speaker 3: my first bra had Winnie the Pooh on it, and

873
00:46:56,080 --> 00:46:59,680
Speaker 3: I was like, I felt so infantilized. Wow, But I'm

874
00:46:59,680 --> 00:47:01,279
Speaker 3: like better, why or that nothing? We'll take it.

875
00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:06,360
Speaker 2: That's amazing, Okay. And then so speaking of Margaret's mom, Barbara,

876
00:47:06,719 --> 00:47:11,879
Speaker 2: she's adjusting to being a stay at home mom. She's

877
00:47:11,960 --> 00:47:15,040
Speaker 2: learning how to cook. She goes to a PTA meeting

878
00:47:15,280 --> 00:47:18,759
Speaker 2: in volunteers to be a part of every school committee

879
00:47:18,760 --> 00:47:21,040
Speaker 2: because she really wants to be like super involved with

880
00:47:21,880 --> 00:47:27,880
Speaker 2: Margaret's life and everything. Then Margaret's teacher, mister Benedict, announces

881
00:47:27,920 --> 00:47:31,320
Speaker 2: that they have to do this like year long research project,

882
00:47:31,880 --> 00:47:35,120
Speaker 2: and he suggests to Margaret that she does hers on

883
00:47:35,640 --> 00:47:39,360
Speaker 2: religion because she had said that she hates religious holidays

884
00:47:39,880 --> 00:47:42,960
Speaker 2: and does not consider herself to be religious because even

885
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:46,399
Speaker 2: though her dad is Jewish and her mom is Christian again,

886
00:47:46,440 --> 00:47:49,080
Speaker 2: they raised her without religion and they're letting her choose

887
00:47:49,120 --> 00:47:51,480
Speaker 2: what religion she wants to be when she grows up.

888
00:47:51,920 --> 00:47:55,239
Speaker 2: She also mentions that she has never met her maternal grandparents,

889
00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:59,880
Speaker 2: so Margaret asks her mom about this, and Barbara reveals

890
00:48:00,120 --> 00:48:04,799
Speaker 2: that her super Christian parents more or less disowned her

891
00:48:05,160 --> 00:48:09,360
Speaker 2: when she married a Jewish man. And Margaret is appalled

892
00:48:09,400 --> 00:48:12,040
Speaker 2: by this and wonders, like, what kind of awful people

893
00:48:12,080 --> 00:48:14,919
Speaker 2: would do something like that, especially to someone as nice

894
00:48:14,960 --> 00:48:18,600
Speaker 2: as her mom. And then Barbara's like, enough of that,

895
00:48:18,680 --> 00:48:23,040
Speaker 2: Let's go bra shopping. Let's go Bra bra shopping. Barbara

896
00:48:23,200 --> 00:48:29,000
Speaker 2: says that get it, whoa yeah, yeah, yeah, yeahs. And

897
00:48:29,320 --> 00:48:32,160
Speaker 2: so Margaret gets her first bra, this little training bra,

898
00:48:32,360 --> 00:48:35,560
Speaker 2: which is super uncomfortable, and Margaret cannot wait to take

899
00:48:35,600 --> 00:48:37,920
Speaker 2: it off. But then there's a scene where she she

900
00:48:38,080 --> 00:48:41,799
Speaker 2: like stuffs it with socks and dances around her room.

901
00:48:42,280 --> 00:48:43,000
Speaker 2: It's very fun.

902
00:48:43,080 --> 00:48:46,000
Speaker 4: Although I will say you're not allowed Matilda owns that song.

903
00:48:46,320 --> 00:48:47,400
Speaker 4: Sorry you can't.

904
00:48:47,440 --> 00:48:50,000
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I.

905
00:48:49,960 --> 00:48:53,040
Speaker 3: Will say one of my one of my few criticisms

906
00:48:53,040 --> 00:48:58,240
Speaker 3: of this movie, pretty uncreative needle drops. I was underwhelmed

907
00:48:58,280 --> 00:48:59,840
Speaker 3: by the seventies needle drops.

908
00:49:00,239 --> 00:49:04,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, could have been a better soundtrack. Maybe they didn't

909
00:49:04,160 --> 00:49:04,920
Speaker 2: have the budget.

910
00:49:05,040 --> 00:49:08,000
Speaker 3: It's a I mean, that's an expensive song to get true.

911
00:49:08,360 --> 00:49:10,840
Speaker 3: Yeah that Mattel the I agree, mauntil the perfected.

912
00:49:11,200 --> 00:49:16,160
Speaker 2: Yeah. Okay. So at the next secret Club meeting, the

913
00:49:16,239 --> 00:49:20,800
Speaker 2: girls share their boy books and the three others, Nancy, Janey,

914
00:49:20,800 --> 00:49:24,799
Speaker 2: and Gretchen all put Philip Leroy in their book. This

915
00:49:24,840 --> 00:49:27,360
Speaker 2: is where like Margaret puts Moose, but she lies and

916
00:49:27,640 --> 00:49:31,000
Speaker 2: she says she also put Philip le Roy. Then they

917
00:49:31,040 --> 00:49:34,800
Speaker 2: compare brass sizes. Everyone has a training bra, except for Nancy,

918
00:49:35,120 --> 00:49:40,200
Speaker 2: who says that she does an exercise to grow her boobs.

919
00:49:40,719 --> 00:49:42,480
Speaker 2: So they all do the exercise together.

920
00:49:43,520 --> 00:49:46,160
Speaker 4: For some reason, it involves screaming you.

921
00:49:46,160 --> 00:49:50,120
Speaker 2: Have to chant, and the chant goes, I must, I must,

922
00:49:50,400 --> 00:49:54,840
Speaker 2: I must increase my bust and we're like, exactly.

923
00:49:54,840 --> 00:49:59,080
Speaker 3: Totally Nancy. I do feel like everyone knew a kid

924
00:49:59,239 --> 00:50:02,960
Speaker 3: sort of like Nancy. It's just like she doesn't know

925
00:50:03,000 --> 00:50:05,080
Speaker 3: what she's talking about, but she is always speaking the

926
00:50:05,120 --> 00:50:08,080
Speaker 3: loudest and so like, I definitely like as a quiet kid,

927
00:50:08,239 --> 00:50:10,760
Speaker 3: was like, yeah, I guess she she must.

928
00:50:10,719 --> 00:50:14,840
Speaker 2: Must be right, Yeah, yeah, she's saying it loudly, yeah,

929
00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:20,440
Speaker 2: so confidently. Yeah. So then Margaret goes to visit grandma

930
00:50:20,520 --> 00:50:23,960
Speaker 2: Kathy Bates in the city. Margaret talks to God again

931
00:50:24,080 --> 00:50:27,440
Speaker 2: and says that maybe she'll try to decide what religion

932
00:50:27,480 --> 00:50:30,399
Speaker 2: she wants to be, so she asks her grandma if

933
00:50:30,400 --> 00:50:33,440
Speaker 2: she can go to temple with her. So they go,

934
00:50:34,200 --> 00:50:38,200
Speaker 2: but Margaret is pretty underwhelmed and she doesn't really feel

935
00:50:38,239 --> 00:50:40,719
Speaker 2: the presence of God. She also intends to go to

936
00:50:40,920 --> 00:50:43,399
Speaker 2: a Christian service to see what that's like. A couple

937
00:50:43,480 --> 00:50:46,400
Speaker 2: scenes later, she goes with Janie and her family to

938
00:50:46,640 --> 00:50:47,680
Speaker 2: their church.

939
00:50:47,920 --> 00:50:53,080
Speaker 3: I appreciate representation of kids being like church regardless of religion,

940
00:50:53,360 --> 00:50:58,800
Speaker 3: Like our religious services are boring when you're twelve. Yeah,

941
00:50:59,200 --> 00:51:02,239
Speaker 3: like they're che there's just nothing to love.

942
00:51:03,160 --> 00:51:05,640
Speaker 5: I had such a weird I like was watching her

943
00:51:05,680 --> 00:51:08,000
Speaker 5: go to these to like services with friends and like

944
00:51:08,040 --> 00:51:09,040
Speaker 5: try out different things.

945
00:51:09,400 --> 00:51:11,480
Speaker 4: I like did that when I was a kid.

946
00:51:11,560 --> 00:51:12,640
Speaker 3: I really well.

947
00:51:12,680 --> 00:51:14,200
Speaker 4: It was mostly because I lived.

948
00:51:13,960 --> 00:51:15,960
Speaker 5: Pretty far away from a lot of my friends and

949
00:51:16,000 --> 00:51:18,239
Speaker 5: so if we did a sleepover on Saturday, it was like, well,

950
00:51:18,280 --> 00:51:20,799
Speaker 5: you're going to church with us in the morning. And

951
00:51:20,960 --> 00:51:24,120
Speaker 5: I remember like going to a Catholic. I was raised Quaker,

952
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:28,560
Speaker 5: which is also kind of nothing like it's mostly just

953
00:51:28,560 --> 00:51:30,799
Speaker 5: being quiet and so like I didn't really have any

954
00:51:30,920 --> 00:51:34,240
Speaker 5: like solid beliefs or anything. So I actually like related

955
00:51:34,280 --> 00:51:36,040
Speaker 5: to this part a lot, and I would go to

956
00:51:36,080 --> 00:51:38,440
Speaker 5: other services and just be like, I mean this is

957
00:51:38,480 --> 00:51:40,239
Speaker 5: so cool, and like going to a Catholic one and

958
00:51:40,320 --> 00:51:42,920
Speaker 5: like they were like you can't have a cracker and

959
00:51:42,960 --> 00:51:45,600
Speaker 5: I was like why and they were like, you're not

960
00:51:45,840 --> 00:51:46,680
Speaker 5: Gatholic and I was.

961
00:51:46,680 --> 00:51:50,000
Speaker 3: Like, okay, Yeah. I grew up between a couple different

962
00:51:50,040 --> 00:51:52,799
Speaker 3: faiths too, and never got to the finish line with

963
00:51:52,880 --> 00:51:57,160
Speaker 3: any of them, and so whatever the snack was, I

964
00:51:57,239 --> 00:51:59,520
Speaker 3: couldn't have it. You're like fuck.

965
00:52:00,600 --> 00:52:02,719
Speaker 5: And it was always like it was always really interesting

966
00:52:02,760 --> 00:52:06,399
Speaker 5: to like, go see how other people spend the time

967
00:52:06,400 --> 00:52:09,200
Speaker 5: they don't want to spend a church in on a

968
00:52:09,239 --> 00:52:11,879
Speaker 5: Sunday morning, But it was always like, well, I'd rather

969
00:52:11,960 --> 00:52:12,880
Speaker 5: not do any of that.

970
00:52:13,719 --> 00:52:16,640
Speaker 2: Actually, a very formative memory for me was going to

971
00:52:16,719 --> 00:52:21,040
Speaker 2: a sleepover. The girl whose house it was stole the

972
00:52:21,120 --> 00:52:24,440
Speaker 2: VHS of the porn movie that her parents had rented,

973
00:52:25,000 --> 00:52:28,480
Speaker 2: so we watched it and we were like, oh my god.

974
00:52:28,520 --> 00:52:29,960
Speaker 2: And it was the first time I ever saw like

975
00:52:30,040 --> 00:52:31,839
Speaker 2: I didn't know what oral sex was, but I saw

976
00:52:31,880 --> 00:52:36,319
Speaker 2: a blowjob being performed, and I was like, what's that? Yeah,

977
00:52:36,360 --> 00:52:40,000
Speaker 2: I was like ten, I think. And then the next day,

978
00:52:40,040 --> 00:52:42,360
Speaker 2: like they took all the people to sleep over to

979
00:52:43,200 --> 00:52:47,120
Speaker 2: church and they like handed out bibles, and again, because

980
00:52:47,160 --> 00:52:50,640
Speaker 2: I was raised not in religion at all, they hand

981
00:52:50,640 --> 00:52:53,640
Speaker 2: me a Bible and they're like, okay, Caitlin turned to whatever,

982
00:52:53,719 --> 00:52:57,879
Speaker 2: fucking Matthew whatever. And I didn't know how to cause

983
00:52:57,880 --> 00:52:59,120
Speaker 2: it wasn't just like a page.

984
00:52:58,920 --> 00:53:03,120
Speaker 3: Number, No, it's not an intuitive system, not fucking at all.

985
00:53:03,280 --> 00:53:05,719
Speaker 2: So I had no idea how to find what page

986
00:53:05,800 --> 00:53:07,239
Speaker 2: we were supposed to be on. And so I'm just

987
00:53:07,239 --> 00:53:10,680
Speaker 2: sitting there for like what felt like hours just sort

988
00:53:10,680 --> 00:53:13,160
Speaker 2: of like scrambling through the book, flipping through the pages,

989
00:53:13,200 --> 00:53:14,759
Speaker 2: and then like my friend next to me had to

990
00:53:14,800 --> 00:53:16,800
Speaker 2: like do it for me. But I like remember feeling

991
00:53:16,840 --> 00:53:20,759
Speaker 2: so humiliated, and then I was like, fuck this religion

992
00:53:20,920 --> 00:53:24,080
Speaker 2: for making me feel embarrassed. I'll never even consider it.

993
00:53:24,120 --> 00:53:26,040
Speaker 3: God humiliated me today.

994
00:53:26,760 --> 00:53:28,759
Speaker 4: What an educational twenty four hours for you?

995
00:53:29,200 --> 00:53:33,719
Speaker 3: Truly, That's why it's such a formative memory for me. Yeah, yeah,

996
00:53:33,760 --> 00:53:38,200
Speaker 3: that is so that God thinking about like weird sort

997
00:53:38,239 --> 00:53:40,480
Speaker 3: of dirty stuff that you would do at sleepovers as

998
00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:43,680
Speaker 3: a kid was so like, do you guys remember on

999
00:53:43,760 --> 00:53:47,319
Speaker 3: like aim Smarter Child where it was literally a like

1000
00:53:47,440 --> 00:53:51,800
Speaker 3: proto AI, yes and you if you typed to it,

1001
00:53:51,800 --> 00:53:55,400
Speaker 3: it would type back. That was how I learned so

1002
00:53:55,600 --> 00:53:59,160
Speaker 3: many sexual words because I would go to my friend

1003
00:53:59,760 --> 00:54:02,640
Speaker 3: Rhyme's house. We would go to her house for sleepovers

1004
00:54:03,080 --> 00:54:05,120
Speaker 3: and she I think she was like, and I say

1005
00:54:05,160 --> 00:54:07,200
Speaker 3: this with love. She's kind of the nancy of our

1006
00:54:07,280 --> 00:54:09,319
Speaker 3: friend group, where she talked a lot.

1007
00:54:09,440 --> 00:54:11,799
Speaker 5: Every friend group needs a Nancy because otherwise nothing gets

1008
00:54:11,840 --> 00:54:13,240
Speaker 5: done exactly exactly.

1009
00:54:13,800 --> 00:54:15,759
Speaker 3: She talked a lot, but did she know what she

1010
00:54:15,840 --> 00:54:17,960
Speaker 3: was saying. But she would she would like make us

1011
00:54:17,960 --> 00:54:22,040
Speaker 3: gather around her like family's desktop computer after her parents

1012
00:54:22,040 --> 00:54:25,280
Speaker 3: went to sleep, and then would like send smarter child

1013
00:54:25,440 --> 00:54:28,640
Speaker 3: dirty messages and we'd be like whoa, and because smarter

1014
00:54:28,719 --> 00:54:31,759
Speaker 3: child will always respond like I cannot reply to that,

1015
00:54:31,840 --> 00:54:35,600
Speaker 3: and we're like oh. And then there was also a

1016
00:54:35,600 --> 00:54:39,840
Speaker 3: smarter child that was specifically Austin Powers three themed that

1017
00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:43,360
Speaker 3: would say that would say like, yeah, baby, I can't

1018
00:54:43,400 --> 00:54:46,080
Speaker 3: respond to that.

1019
00:54:46,080 --> 00:54:54,520
Speaker 2: That questions too randy. Well, speaking of kids getting into

1020
00:54:54,719 --> 00:54:58,920
Speaker 2: dirty little hijinks, Margaret and her friends look at a

1021
00:54:59,000 --> 00:55:03,560
Speaker 2: diagram of a penis in an anatomy textbook and they're like,

1022
00:55:03,640 --> 00:55:06,520
Speaker 2: oh my god, why does it look like that? And

1023
00:55:06,560 --> 00:55:08,840
Speaker 2: then they also look at a Playboy magazine that belongs

1024
00:55:08,880 --> 00:55:12,719
Speaker 2: to Margaret's dad and they wonder if their boobs will

1025
00:55:12,760 --> 00:55:18,400
Speaker 2: ever look like they do in the Playboy magazine. Meanwhile,

1026
00:55:19,400 --> 00:55:23,080
Speaker 2: Margaret and everyone in her class get invited to a

1027
00:55:23,320 --> 00:55:29,040
Speaker 2: party thrown by Norman Fisher that like, quote unquote, doeebye kid.

1028
00:55:29,760 --> 00:55:32,200
Speaker 2: They all go to the party. They play Spin the Bottle,

1029
00:55:32,280 --> 00:55:35,320
Speaker 2: they play two Minutes in the Closet, which is basically

1030
00:55:35,600 --> 00:55:40,919
Speaker 2: seven minutes in Heaven. Margaret and Philip Leroy, the boy

1031
00:55:40,960 --> 00:55:43,920
Speaker 2: that everyone has a crush on, get matched up, and

1032
00:55:44,239 --> 00:55:47,879
Speaker 2: they go in the bathroom and he surprise kisses her.

1033
00:55:47,960 --> 00:55:50,560
Speaker 3: It's true, which is sort of what that whole game

1034
00:55:50,640 --> 00:55:51,560
Speaker 3: is predicated on.

1035
00:55:52,040 --> 00:55:56,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, it is very yucky, but like what eleven year

1036
00:55:56,880 --> 00:55:59,880
Speaker 2: olds were able to have conversations about consent in the

1037
00:56:00,120 --> 00:56:01,280
Speaker 2: in nineteen seventy.

1038
00:56:01,600 --> 00:56:04,160
Speaker 5: Yeah, that moment was the one where I was like,

1039
00:56:04,200 --> 00:56:07,720
Speaker 5: oh my god, I'm so embarrassed for the actor playing

1040
00:56:07,800 --> 00:56:11,760
Speaker 5: Philip leaving because it's just like a like a kid

1041
00:56:11,880 --> 00:56:14,080
Speaker 5: trying to be cool and.

1042
00:56:14,000 --> 00:56:16,000
Speaker 4: You're like stop.

1043
00:56:16,440 --> 00:56:19,160
Speaker 3: That's actually one of the moments that I think that

1044
00:56:19,239 --> 00:56:23,560
Speaker 3: the book out does the movie in where the book,

1045
00:56:23,600 --> 00:56:26,920
Speaker 3: I think, far better, is actually like more sort of

1046
00:56:27,239 --> 00:56:31,080
Speaker 3: thoughtful in its depiction of that, where like Margaret goes

1047
00:56:31,120 --> 00:56:33,279
Speaker 3: through this like she was like, well that was uncomfortable.

1048
00:56:33,280 --> 00:56:34,759
Speaker 3: I didn't love that, but I need to tell my

1049
00:56:34,800 --> 00:56:38,600
Speaker 3: friends that I loved that, which so I thought that, Yeah,

1050
00:56:38,600 --> 00:56:40,920
Speaker 3: the book was like a little more insightful because I

1051
00:56:40,920 --> 00:56:43,200
Speaker 3: feel like the movie just presents it as like, Wow,

1052
00:56:43,280 --> 00:56:45,600
Speaker 3: that was awesome, where like she actually has more of

1053
00:56:45,600 --> 00:56:46,840
Speaker 3: an internal dialogue.

1054
00:56:47,000 --> 00:56:50,000
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, the movie, it seems in the movie that

1055
00:56:50,080 --> 00:56:55,200
Speaker 2: she's like swooning over this kiss and her friends are jealous.

1056
00:56:56,160 --> 00:56:58,920
Speaker 2: So now Margaret has had her first kiss, but she

1057
00:56:59,360 --> 00:57:04,960
Speaker 2: still hasn't started growing boobs or gotten her period. Gretchen

1058
00:57:05,680 --> 00:57:07,600
Speaker 2: is the first of the group to get her period,

1059
00:57:07,800 --> 00:57:10,520
Speaker 2: and Margaret is so jealous. All she wants is to

1060
00:57:10,520 --> 00:57:12,640
Speaker 2: get her period so that she can be quote unquote

1061
00:57:12,680 --> 00:57:15,960
Speaker 2: normal like everybody else, and she's super worried that she

1062
00:57:16,040 --> 00:57:17,360
Speaker 2: will be a late bloomer.

1063
00:57:17,520 --> 00:57:21,200
Speaker 3: I like when Gretchen's like, everything's different, you wouldn't.

1064
00:57:24,880 --> 00:57:28,120
Speaker 2: So then Margaret and Janie go to a pharmacy and

1065
00:57:28,160 --> 00:57:31,400
Speaker 2: buy pads so that they can practice using them so

1066
00:57:31,440 --> 00:57:35,920
Speaker 2: they can be ready when the time comes. Then Nancy

1067
00:57:36,040 --> 00:57:39,000
Speaker 2: sends a postcard to Margaret saying that she got her period,

1068
00:57:39,640 --> 00:57:42,880
Speaker 2: but we find out that she was lying because she

1069
00:57:43,040 --> 00:57:45,960
Speaker 2: actually gets her period for the first time when she

1070
00:57:46,080 --> 00:57:49,360
Speaker 2: and Margaret are in the city seeing the rockets together.

1071
00:57:49,640 --> 00:57:53,080
Speaker 5: This is where I get very confused, because like timeline wise,

1072
00:57:53,240 --> 00:57:55,760
Speaker 5: there's this was like a montage of scenes and that

1073
00:57:56,480 --> 00:58:00,200
Speaker 5: it was like Christmas time when the right and she

1074
00:58:00,240 --> 00:58:03,520
Speaker 5: got this postcard from Nancy and she was like, oh,

1075
00:58:03,560 --> 00:58:06,320
Speaker 5: they went to DC for President's Day weekend, which is

1076
00:58:06,360 --> 00:58:07,320
Speaker 5: like when's that?

1077
00:58:07,720 --> 00:58:11,120
Speaker 2: And then January it's right.

1078
00:58:11,280 --> 00:58:13,240
Speaker 4: But then they go see the Rockets, and isn't that

1079
00:58:13,480 --> 00:58:14,959
Speaker 4: just on during Christmas?

1080
00:58:15,800 --> 00:58:17,640
Speaker 3: I think they do it other times of the year,

1081
00:58:17,960 --> 00:58:21,640
Speaker 3: or maybe they did it in the seventies, I don't know, But.

1082
00:58:21,720 --> 00:58:24,080
Speaker 4: Yet I thought the Rockets was like just a Christmas

1083
00:58:24,080 --> 00:58:25,919
Speaker 4: time thing. Oh maybe I'm wrong.

1084
00:58:26,040 --> 00:58:28,200
Speaker 3: No, I'm pretty sure they do other times of year,

1085
00:58:28,200 --> 00:58:31,560
Speaker 3: but I think that Christmas it's like they're nutcracker Okay.

1086
00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:35,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I'm guessing. Like a couple months past when

1087
00:58:35,480 --> 00:58:38,920
Speaker 2: they go into the city together, yeah, and Nancy gets

1088
00:58:38,960 --> 00:58:44,320
Speaker 2: her period and Margaret feels betrayed that Nancy lied to her.

1089
00:58:45,200 --> 00:58:50,360
Speaker 2: Then at school, Margaret gets grouped with Norman Fisher, Philip Leroy,

1090
00:58:50,520 --> 00:58:55,960
Speaker 2: and Laura Danker for a project. Laura confronts Margaret about

1091
00:58:56,200 --> 00:58:59,400
Speaker 2: her friend group being so cruel to Laura just because

1092
00:58:59,440 --> 00:59:02,000
Speaker 2: of how she looks and like spreading rumors about her.

1093
00:59:02,200 --> 00:59:06,720
Speaker 2: Oh Laura, Margaret realizes that she's been like a judge,

1094
00:59:07,320 --> 00:59:13,000
Speaker 2: bad person. Meanwhile, Philip makes a mean comment about Margaret's

1095
00:59:13,200 --> 00:59:17,400
Speaker 2: flat chest. Other things happen where like Margaret's parents cancel

1096
00:59:17,480 --> 00:59:21,520
Speaker 2: her upcoming trip to Florida to visit Grandma Kathy Bates

1097
00:59:21,640 --> 00:59:26,240
Speaker 2: because Barbara's parents are coming to visit because Barbara had

1098
00:59:26,280 --> 00:59:29,760
Speaker 2: sent them a card and like they're trying to kind

1099
00:59:29,760 --> 00:59:32,040
Speaker 2: of rekindle their estrange relationship.

1100
00:59:32,200 --> 00:59:35,040
Speaker 3: It's so hard to not feel for like literally everyone

1101
00:59:35,240 --> 00:59:40,400
Speaker 3: in this setup. It's such a like beautiful, painful sequence

1102
00:59:40,480 --> 00:59:43,280
Speaker 3: to watch because everyone's mad at Rachel mcadam's which makes

1103
00:59:43,320 --> 00:59:47,480
Speaker 3: sense because her parents are anti Semitic weird us. But

1104
00:59:47,520 --> 00:59:49,840
Speaker 3: you can also see that she like has this like

1105
00:59:49,920 --> 00:59:51,920
Speaker 3: little girl part of her that just wants to like

1106
00:59:52,280 --> 00:59:55,480
Speaker 3: believe that her parents don't suck. It's just so painful

1107
00:59:55,600 --> 00:59:57,160
Speaker 3: to watch, Yeah, I know.

1108
00:59:57,720 --> 01:00:00,480
Speaker 2: And then on top of all that, Margaret is still

1109
01:00:00,520 --> 01:00:06,800
Speaker 2: mad at Nancy for lying. Margaret's confused spiritually because she's

1110
01:00:07,280 --> 01:00:09,880
Speaker 2: talking and praying to God and looking for him but

1111
01:00:10,000 --> 01:00:14,400
Speaker 2: she can't seem to find him, so things are bad.

1112
01:00:14,600 --> 01:00:19,640
Speaker 2: It is the low point of the movie. Then Barbara's

1113
01:00:20,120 --> 01:00:26,080
Speaker 2: parents aka Margaret's maternal grandparents arrive. It's awkward, and it's

1114
01:00:26,120 --> 01:00:30,240
Speaker 2: even more awkward when Grandma Kathy Bates shows up unexpectedly

1115
01:00:30,360 --> 01:00:31,439
Speaker 2: with her new fuck body.

1116
01:00:34,720 --> 01:00:38,000
Speaker 5: Just like what amo again, Kathy Bates in this movie

1117
01:00:38,040 --> 01:00:41,280
Speaker 5: is like, that's aspirational for me, and I'm like, I

1118
01:00:41,400 --> 01:00:44,760
Speaker 5: want to be the New York City Jewish grandma wearing

1119
01:00:44,800 --> 01:00:47,600
Speaker 5: these clothes going to Florida to like get laid.

1120
01:00:48,160 --> 01:00:53,240
Speaker 3: She's down there fun fucking oh God, making sexy little

1121
01:00:53,280 --> 01:00:56,480
Speaker 3: comments about cholesterol. You're like, yes, sure, why not?

1122
01:00:57,200 --> 01:00:57,439
Speaker 1: Yup?

1123
01:00:57,600 --> 01:01:02,800
Speaker 2: Yup? So then mark Its maternal grandparents are asking if

1124
01:01:02,840 --> 01:01:05,600
Speaker 2: she's ever been to Sunday School, and Kathy Bates is

1125
01:01:05,640 --> 01:01:09,400
Speaker 2: like no, because Margaret is Jewish, and Margaret is like, no,

1126
01:01:09,960 --> 01:01:12,439
Speaker 2: I'm neither. I'm nothing. I don't even believe in God.

1127
01:01:12,520 --> 01:01:16,280
Speaker 3: Benny Saftie and Rachel McAdams are freaking out. They're like, God,

1128
01:01:17,200 --> 01:01:18,160
Speaker 3: it's drama.

1129
01:01:18,800 --> 01:01:22,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, Barbara feels horrible. Margaret storms out of the room,

1130
01:01:22,880 --> 01:01:28,400
Speaker 2: and Margaret starts writing her research project on religion, where

1131
01:01:28,440 --> 01:01:30,400
Speaker 2: she says, like, I thought you were supposed to be

1132
01:01:30,440 --> 01:01:34,160
Speaker 2: able to pray to God and he would answer your prayers.

1133
01:01:34,520 --> 01:01:37,800
Speaker 2: But I've prayed and prayed and things just keep getting worse.

1134
01:01:38,080 --> 01:01:41,000
Speaker 2: No one seems to be listening to me, and it

1135
01:01:41,120 --> 01:01:46,160
Speaker 2: just makes her feel very lust and alone. But her

1136
01:01:46,200 --> 01:01:50,200
Speaker 2: mom comforts her and apologizes for how messy things got.

1137
01:01:51,200 --> 01:01:53,280
Speaker 2: And then it's the last day of school. There's like

1138
01:01:53,320 --> 01:01:58,600
Speaker 2: this carnival thing and Margaret approaches Laura Danker and basically

1139
01:01:58,640 --> 01:02:01,160
Speaker 2: like extends and Olive brand and she's like, hey, want

1140
01:02:01,160 --> 01:02:03,880
Speaker 2: to be friends? Want to come dance with me? And

1141
01:02:04,280 --> 01:02:06,840
Speaker 2: Jane joins them as well. It feels like it's kind

1142
01:02:06,840 --> 01:02:10,960
Speaker 2: of implied that Margaret either like won't be friends with

1143
01:02:11,280 --> 01:02:14,560
Speaker 2: or won't be as close to Nancy and maybe Gretchen

1144
01:02:15,320 --> 01:02:19,680
Speaker 2: much after this, and then in the denu Mall, we

1145
01:02:19,760 --> 01:02:24,440
Speaker 2: see that Barbara has returned to teaching art. She's like

1146
01:02:24,720 --> 01:02:28,960
Speaker 2: gotten a little better about like establishing boundaries and saying

1147
01:02:29,240 --> 01:02:31,160
Speaker 2: no to being on all the school committees.

1148
01:02:31,240 --> 01:02:32,080
Speaker 4: I love that scene.

1149
01:02:32,200 --> 01:02:32,560
Speaker 3: I love it.

1150
01:02:32,640 --> 01:02:35,120
Speaker 4: It's really much where she's just like, oh, I don't

1151
01:02:35,520 --> 01:02:35,880
Speaker 4: want to.

1152
01:02:35,960 --> 01:02:39,520
Speaker 2: I don't want to, so no, thank you. Meanwhile, Margaret

1153
01:02:39,720 --> 01:02:42,880
Speaker 2: is gearing up to go back to summer camp, but

1154
01:02:42,960 --> 01:02:45,520
Speaker 2: before she does, she has a little chat with Moose,

1155
01:02:46,160 --> 01:02:49,160
Speaker 2: who suggests that they hang out when she gets back

1156
01:02:49,200 --> 01:02:53,880
Speaker 2: from camp, and she's giddy about it. And guess what

1157
01:02:54,040 --> 01:02:58,720
Speaker 2: else makes her giddy? She gets her period right after this.

1158
01:02:58,880 --> 01:03:01,200
Speaker 3: He guys, yeah, right, God is real.

1159
01:03:02,000 --> 01:03:06,080
Speaker 2: God is real, and God gave Margaret her period or whatever.

1160
01:03:06,200 --> 01:03:08,760
Speaker 3: She's technically what God is like, I did. God is

1161
01:03:08,840 --> 01:03:13,040
Speaker 3: literally just like Santa, like it's the same We're taught

1162
01:03:13,040 --> 01:03:17,760
Speaker 3: the same thing, except God is like meaner Santa. Santa's

1163
01:03:17,800 --> 01:03:19,920
Speaker 3: like very hands off when it comes to like the

1164
01:03:19,960 --> 01:03:22,360
Speaker 3: pain of living well.

1165
01:03:22,200 --> 01:03:24,320
Speaker 2: Except he has this whole naughty list and he's like,

1166
01:03:24,360 --> 01:03:25,280
Speaker 2: I'll give you cold.

1167
01:03:26,120 --> 01:03:30,120
Speaker 4: It really depends. It depends on what sect of santa

1168
01:03:30,240 --> 01:03:30,800
Speaker 4: Ism you are.

1169
01:03:31,480 --> 01:03:36,720
Speaker 3: God gives you kind of like spiritual coal. Yeah.

1170
01:03:36,800 --> 01:03:38,240
Speaker 2: Anyway, that's the end of the movie.

1171
01:03:39,320 --> 01:03:41,600
Speaker 4: So let's take another break.

1172
01:03:42,280 --> 01:03:43,520
Speaker 2: I will come right back.

1173
01:03:53,080 --> 01:03:57,480
Speaker 3: And we're back. I would love to start. I wanted

1174
01:03:57,520 --> 01:03:59,960
Speaker 3: to just talk a little bit about book to screen

1175
01:04:00,760 --> 01:04:06,640
Speaker 3: before we jump into the conversation. So we're all book

1176
01:04:06,640 --> 01:04:08,439
Speaker 3: heads here. I know we joke about on the show

1177
01:04:08,440 --> 01:04:10,760
Speaker 3: this being an anti book podcast, but it's just not true.

1178
01:04:11,120 --> 01:04:11,320
Speaker 2: True.

1179
01:04:11,400 --> 01:04:14,600
Speaker 3: Yeah. I blew through the book yesterday before watching the

1180
01:04:14,760 --> 01:04:18,040
Speaker 3: documentary and then eventually watching the movie. I will say

1181
01:04:18,040 --> 01:04:21,520
Speaker 3: that I feel like the third act of this movie,

1182
01:04:21,720 --> 01:04:25,400
Speaker 3: after revisiting the book, I found kind of underwhelming, and

1183
01:04:25,440 --> 01:04:28,600
Speaker 3: it felt like they were movie flying and making sure

1184
01:04:28,680 --> 01:04:32,440
Speaker 3: that everything was resolved and that everything is going to

1185
01:04:32,520 --> 01:04:35,840
Speaker 3: be okay from now on, with the exception of it

1186
01:04:35,960 --> 01:04:38,160
Speaker 3: being clear that the maternal grandparents are not going to

1187
01:04:38,200 --> 01:04:40,120
Speaker 3: be in their lives, like that is sort of the

1188
01:04:40,200 --> 01:04:44,320
Speaker 3: only the one thing that's left unsatisfactory. And I mean,

1189
01:04:44,600 --> 01:04:46,480
Speaker 3: I don't know. Judy Bloom says to that she likes

1190
01:04:46,720 --> 01:04:48,480
Speaker 3: she thinks the movie is better than the book, so

1191
01:04:48,560 --> 01:04:49,240
Speaker 3: who the fucking what?

1192
01:04:49,800 --> 01:04:50,080
Speaker 2: Wow?

1193
01:04:50,200 --> 01:04:53,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, And she said that, and I was also like

1194
01:04:53,680 --> 01:04:56,320
Speaker 3: some wrong but whatever, Like.

1195
01:04:56,280 --> 01:04:57,840
Speaker 4: How long has it been since she read the book?

1196
01:04:58,920 --> 01:05:02,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, let's egg Judy Bloom? But I did. I mean

1197
01:05:02,840 --> 01:05:05,960
Speaker 3: I part of what I as I was like rereading it,

1198
01:05:06,000 --> 01:05:08,520
Speaker 3: part of what I was remembering, Like that I really

1199
01:05:08,600 --> 01:05:11,360
Speaker 3: like about Judy Bloom books is that there aren't these

1200
01:05:11,480 --> 01:05:14,400
Speaker 3: neat conclusions that I sort of felt happened at the

1201
01:05:14,480 --> 01:05:17,960
Speaker 3: end of this movie. One difference is that, you know,

1202
01:05:18,400 --> 01:05:21,720
Speaker 3: Margaret has that same interaction with Moose the day she

1203
01:05:21,720 --> 01:05:25,160
Speaker 3: gets her period, but Moose is I think more of

1204
01:05:25,320 --> 01:05:28,440
Speaker 3: like typical pubescent boy and is like get out of

1205
01:05:28,440 --> 01:05:30,640
Speaker 3: my way, see you later. Like it's just a more

1206
01:05:30,680 --> 01:05:33,760
Speaker 3: authentic reaction than like, I'm the nice boy and I

1207
01:05:33,800 --> 01:05:35,960
Speaker 3: hope you have an epic summer at camp. Should be

1208
01:05:36,040 --> 01:05:40,240
Speaker 3: chill soon, which just doesn't feel as real, you know.

1209
01:05:40,360 --> 01:05:43,120
Speaker 3: And Moose in general, I think like was portrayed a

1210
01:05:43,120 --> 01:05:46,440
Speaker 3: little more realistically as like he clearly has a crush

1211
01:05:46,480 --> 01:05:49,440
Speaker 3: on her but has been socialized to be like that.

1212
01:05:49,520 --> 01:05:53,560
Speaker 3: It's gross other things, where with the issue between Laura

1213
01:05:53,680 --> 01:05:57,919
Speaker 3: and Margaret is intentionally left unresolved in the book, which

1214
01:05:57,960 --> 01:06:02,000
Speaker 3: I think is actually really because I as a kid,

1215
01:06:02,040 --> 01:06:03,840
Speaker 3: I feel like that forces you to put yourself in

1216
01:06:03,920 --> 01:06:07,200
Speaker 3: Margaret's position more. And the interaction between them at the

1217
01:06:07,240 --> 01:06:09,919
Speaker 3: library and following her into the church is the same

1218
01:06:09,960 --> 01:06:13,040
Speaker 3: where she's like, I'm so I feel so horrible and

1219
01:06:13,120 --> 01:06:16,040
Speaker 3: I don't know. But in the book, like Margaret isn't

1220
01:06:16,120 --> 01:06:19,760
Speaker 3: quite able to get the courage up to actually apologize.

1221
01:06:19,800 --> 01:06:22,480
Speaker 3: She doesn't really stand up to Nancy, and she's just

1222
01:06:22,520 --> 01:06:25,280
Speaker 3: sort of hoping that after summer she won't be as

1223
01:06:25,320 --> 01:06:27,760
Speaker 3: close with Nancy. But there's no confrontation, there's no like

1224
01:06:27,800 --> 01:06:32,600
Speaker 3: big moment of victory, which again just feels more realistic. Right.

1225
01:06:32,680 --> 01:06:35,080
Speaker 2: Imagine how hard it is as a twelve year old

1226
01:06:35,080 --> 01:06:38,920
Speaker 2: to stand up to your domineering friend. It's like nearly

1227
01:06:38,920 --> 01:06:40,960
Speaker 2: impossible for almost every kid.

1228
01:06:40,840 --> 01:06:41,720
Speaker 3: Would not have been me.

1229
01:06:42,240 --> 01:06:45,400
Speaker 5: No, There's also that the fact that like, you're gonna

1230
01:06:45,480 --> 01:06:47,920
Speaker 5: keep going to school with these kids, like, yeah, this

1231
01:06:48,080 --> 01:06:50,200
Speaker 5: is the end of the school year, but like you're

1232
01:06:50,200 --> 01:06:52,600
Speaker 5: gonna be with them for the next like six years.

1233
01:06:52,640 --> 01:06:55,400
Speaker 5: Like it's not like, oh, everything has to be resolved

1234
01:06:55,400 --> 01:06:57,040
Speaker 5: at the end of the year. It's like I'll see

1235
01:06:57,080 --> 01:06:59,120
Speaker 5: them next year and things will be the same and

1236
01:06:59,320 --> 01:07:00,240
Speaker 5: or different.

1237
01:07:00,560 --> 01:07:03,200
Speaker 3: Right, I mean, And yeah again, I was thinking about

1238
01:07:03,520 --> 01:07:05,640
Speaker 3: Blubber where I don't I mean, I don't remember the

1239
01:07:05,640 --> 01:07:08,080
Speaker 3: beat for beat of that book. But it more puts

1240
01:07:08,120 --> 01:07:09,680
Speaker 3: you in the position of like, what if you were

1241
01:07:09,720 --> 01:07:12,400
Speaker 3: a bystander to bullying and what if you weren't able

1242
01:07:12,440 --> 01:07:16,240
Speaker 3: to get the courage up versus this character has does

1243
01:07:16,320 --> 01:07:19,680
Speaker 3: the quote unquote right thing to do? Which isn't I mean,

1244
01:07:19,760 --> 01:07:22,640
Speaker 3: that's not like a story told that way is bad

1245
01:07:22,720 --> 01:07:25,960
Speaker 3: or less valuable. It just feels not Judy Bloom to me,

1246
01:07:26,480 --> 01:07:28,680
Speaker 3: because it's supposed to like force you to sit in

1247
01:07:28,720 --> 01:07:30,520
Speaker 3: that and be like what would I do? And then

1248
01:07:30,560 --> 01:07:33,440
Speaker 3: the final thing was the way that her mom's story

1249
01:07:33,720 --> 01:07:37,560
Speaker 3: resolves where and this feels more of maybe a thing

1250
01:07:37,640 --> 01:07:40,480
Speaker 3: of the times, but it's also something that's like very

1251
01:07:40,520 --> 01:07:44,320
Speaker 3: tied to Judy Bloom's life of like she didn't start

1252
01:07:44,360 --> 01:07:47,880
Speaker 3: writing until she was staying at home alone with her

1253
01:07:47,920 --> 01:07:52,080
Speaker 3: two kids while her first husband, who she would like

1254
01:07:52,120 --> 01:07:55,200
Speaker 3: later write best selling fiction about fantasizing about cheating on

1255
01:07:56,800 --> 01:07:59,480
Speaker 3: like when to work in the city, Like you know,

1256
01:07:59,560 --> 01:08:02,960
Speaker 3: I think they there's like there's to some extent, Margaret's

1257
01:08:02,960 --> 01:08:05,400
Speaker 3: mom is like a self insert character for her. But

1258
01:08:05,480 --> 01:08:08,280
Speaker 3: at the end of the book, she doesn't get that

1259
01:08:08,400 --> 01:08:13,200
Speaker 3: satisfying conclusion of like she's balancing being a housewife and

1260
01:08:13,520 --> 01:08:16,080
Speaker 3: still fulfilling her passion. Like in the book, it's sort

1261
01:08:16,120 --> 01:08:19,840
Speaker 3: of left as like, a this sucks for her mom,

1262
01:08:19,840 --> 01:08:21,760
Speaker 3: but she's going to try to make the best of it.

1263
01:08:21,880 --> 01:08:24,920
Speaker 3: And I don't know, like I not that I wanted

1264
01:08:24,920 --> 01:08:27,519
Speaker 3: the movie. I think I think I get what the

1265
01:08:27,560 --> 01:08:31,360
Speaker 3: movie is doing. It's very movie and if I hadn't

1266
01:08:31,400 --> 01:08:32,720
Speaker 3: read the book, I don't think it would have like

1267
01:08:32,760 --> 01:08:35,200
Speaker 3: registered for me at all. But I just I do

1268
01:08:35,320 --> 01:08:40,320
Speaker 3: kind of like when movies for kids don't end quite

1269
01:08:40,439 --> 01:08:44,639
Speaker 3: so neatly. But that's really my only problem with the movie.

1270
01:08:45,320 --> 01:08:48,599
Speaker 2: Yeah, the other thing that I read because I didn't

1271
01:08:48,680 --> 01:08:52,760
Speaker 2: reread the book, but I read listicals of what the

1272
01:08:52,800 --> 01:08:55,040
Speaker 2: difference is between the book and the movie.

1273
01:08:55,200 --> 01:08:57,360
Speaker 3: The movie adaptations the same thing.

1274
01:08:57,560 --> 01:09:02,799
Speaker 2: And one thing that I saw was that the movie

1275
01:09:03,760 --> 01:09:08,479
Speaker 2: omits so with the Laura Danker character. I think it's

1276
01:09:08,600 --> 01:09:13,520
Speaker 2: present in the book that Nancy makes up rumors about

1277
01:09:13,560 --> 01:09:15,880
Speaker 2: her that she like lets boys.

1278
01:09:15,800 --> 01:09:17,480
Speaker 3: Yes, but that there's a confrontation.

1279
01:09:17,800 --> 01:09:22,719
Speaker 2: Well, there's also a component of the book that their teacher,

1280
01:09:23,080 --> 01:09:28,599
Speaker 2: mister Benedict leers at Laura Danker and like chooses her

1281
01:09:28,720 --> 01:09:32,559
Speaker 2: to be like his partner, where he's like demonstrating them

1282
01:09:32,560 --> 01:09:34,160
Speaker 2: how to do a square dance or whatever.

1283
01:09:34,320 --> 01:09:37,080
Speaker 5: Yeah, so I wonder if they recorded that but cut

1284
01:09:37,080 --> 01:09:39,519
Speaker 5: it out, because there was the square dancing scene that

1285
01:09:39,640 --> 01:09:42,920
Speaker 5: like had nothing to do with anything, right, And I

1286
01:09:42,960 --> 01:09:45,080
Speaker 5: wonder if they like filmed it and then like cut

1287
01:09:45,120 --> 01:09:46,200
Speaker 5: that storyline out.

1288
01:09:46,280 --> 01:09:49,080
Speaker 3: I alsought this was just my read on it. It

1289
01:09:49,160 --> 01:09:52,040
Speaker 3: was also unclear to me that when Nancy was insisting

1290
01:09:52,080 --> 01:09:55,639
Speaker 3: that the teacher was doing this not to not believe women,

1291
01:09:56,560 --> 01:10:00,240
Speaker 3: but Nancy is known to telefib and make shit up,

1292
01:10:00,560 --> 01:10:02,519
Speaker 3: and so to me, at least in the book, it

1293
01:10:02,560 --> 01:10:04,720
Speaker 3: was unclear if that was actually happening or if it

1294
01:10:04,760 --> 01:10:08,240
Speaker 3: was Nancy projecting. But that definitely is like they don't

1295
01:10:08,280 --> 01:10:10,800
Speaker 3: even get close to touching it because again they need

1296
01:10:10,840 --> 01:10:13,320
Speaker 3: to movie by the movie and be like, mister Benedict

1297
01:10:13,360 --> 01:10:15,680
Speaker 3: is a great teacher, no notes, not weird at all?

1298
01:10:16,000 --> 01:10:22,640
Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, which, I you know, for this movie, I

1299
01:10:22,840 --> 01:10:24,000
Speaker 2: was okay with.

1300
01:10:24,400 --> 01:10:26,600
Speaker 3: Yeah. I mean I don't think that the tone of

1301
01:10:26,600 --> 01:10:29,000
Speaker 3: this movie that that really fit, And at least in

1302
01:10:29,000 --> 01:10:31,840
Speaker 3: my opinion, it was kind of unclear in the book

1303
01:10:31,880 --> 01:10:34,320
Speaker 3: whether that was Nancy Nancy ing or if that was

1304
01:10:34,680 --> 01:10:38,120
Speaker 3: something that was actually taking place, right, Yeah.

1305
01:10:37,840 --> 01:10:43,040
Speaker 2: Right, because obviously there are many cases of grown adult men, yeah,

1306
01:10:43,120 --> 01:10:47,920
Speaker 2: being really gross toward underage girls. But yeah, I'm like,

1307
01:10:48,280 --> 01:10:51,160
Speaker 2: does this movie have the space or the tone to

1308
01:10:51,400 --> 01:10:52,519
Speaker 2: address something like that?

1309
01:10:53,160 --> 01:10:53,280
Speaker 4: Right?

1310
01:10:53,400 --> 01:10:54,479
Speaker 2: I think maybe not? So.

1311
01:10:54,560 --> 01:10:56,920
Speaker 3: My tenth grade art teacher was like, Jamie, you know,

1312
01:10:56,920 --> 01:10:58,680
Speaker 3: it would be really cool if you went to the

1313
01:10:58,720 --> 01:11:01,519
Speaker 3: park and drank a whole of cough syrup and then

1314
01:11:01,560 --> 01:11:04,000
Speaker 3: took pictures and then showed me the picture You're just

1315
01:11:04,040 --> 01:11:06,800
Speaker 3: like And I was like, yeah, I.

1316
01:11:06,720 --> 01:11:09,559
Speaker 2: Remember you telling me this story for it, and it's

1317
01:11:09,640 --> 01:11:15,000
Speaker 2: ro so frightening. But yeah, I think otherwise, the movie

1318
01:11:15,120 --> 01:11:20,640
Speaker 2: is a pretty faithful adaptation of the book, and I

1319
01:11:20,680 --> 01:11:22,960
Speaker 2: mean both of them both. Obviously we're going to focus

1320
01:11:23,040 --> 01:11:25,240
Speaker 2: on the movie here, but I love that it is

1321
01:11:26,360 --> 01:11:30,240
Speaker 2: one of the few movies about young girls. We've talked

1322
01:11:30,240 --> 01:11:32,320
Speaker 2: about this a lot on the podcast, where there's just

1323
01:11:32,400 --> 01:11:35,400
Speaker 2: so few of them, at least as far as like

1324
01:11:35,439 --> 01:11:38,599
Speaker 2: mainstream movies go. And it's a movie that just has

1325
01:11:38,600 --> 01:11:43,920
Speaker 2: a lot of compelling themes and subplots between friendship among

1326
01:11:44,040 --> 01:11:48,599
Speaker 2: girls and like figuring out who your friends are and

1327
01:11:48,720 --> 01:11:52,120
Speaker 2: like the kind of person you want to be. Along

1328
01:11:52,160 --> 01:11:56,920
Speaker 2: the way, there's you know, just the exploration of going

1329
01:11:56,960 --> 01:12:00,880
Speaker 2: through puberty and trying to feel quote unquote and fit

1330
01:12:01,000 --> 01:12:04,479
Speaker 2: in during like one of the most confusing times in

1331
01:12:04,520 --> 01:12:09,519
Speaker 2: your life, and like being hyper aware of your body

1332
01:12:09,640 --> 01:12:13,120
Speaker 2: and other people's bodies and how they're all developing, and

1333
01:12:13,160 --> 01:12:18,320
Speaker 2: then like a byproduct of that being body shaming yourself.

1334
01:12:18,479 --> 01:12:22,040
Speaker 2: So you have like kind of internalized like hatred of

1335
01:12:22,080 --> 01:12:24,080
Speaker 2: your body because you feel like you're not normal or

1336
01:12:24,080 --> 01:12:27,560
Speaker 2: you feel like what's happening to you is you know, freakish.

1337
01:12:28,080 --> 01:12:31,360
Speaker 2: And then you're also fixating on other people's bodies and

1338
01:12:31,479 --> 01:12:34,639
Speaker 2: noticing that, oh, they're different from yours, so they must

1339
01:12:34,720 --> 01:12:38,400
Speaker 2: be quote unquote weirdo. And we see that with the

1340
01:12:38,479 --> 01:12:44,080
Speaker 2: Laura Danker character. You've got the exploration of sexuality and

1341
01:12:44,160 --> 01:12:47,920
Speaker 2: you know, the girls developing crushes and obviously everything we

1342
01:12:47,960 --> 01:12:51,080
Speaker 2: see in this movie is like very hetero. Because this

1343
01:12:51,200 --> 01:12:55,320
Speaker 2: is adapted from a book from the seventies, it would

1344
01:12:55,320 --> 01:12:58,559
Speaker 2: be nice to see, you know, more inclusive coming of

1345
01:12:58,600 --> 01:13:03,040
Speaker 2: age stories about queer kids exploring their sexuality and their gender.

1346
01:13:03,120 --> 01:13:06,519
Speaker 5: But I do love how it's portrayed as like most

1347
01:13:06,520 --> 01:13:09,720
Speaker 5: of the feelings about the crushes are like about what

1348
01:13:09,760 --> 01:13:11,960
Speaker 5: your friends will think of them, Like it's yeah, the

1349
01:13:11,960 --> 01:13:14,880
Speaker 5: person you have a crush on is is sort of tangential,

1350
01:13:15,120 --> 01:13:18,360
Speaker 5: like because it's really about the feelings you're having and

1351
01:13:18,400 --> 01:13:22,720
Speaker 5: what that means with the relationships that are actually in

1352
01:13:22,760 --> 01:13:25,720
Speaker 5: your life, like your relationships to your friends, and like

1353
01:13:25,800 --> 01:13:27,960
Speaker 5: what will they think of you because of this feeling

1354
01:13:28,040 --> 01:13:30,840
Speaker 5: you have? What will they like, is it acceptable?

1355
01:13:31,000 --> 01:13:31,280
Speaker 2: Is it?

1356
01:13:31,479 --> 01:13:33,920
Speaker 5: Will they think you're weird and laugh at you? Like yeah,

1357
01:13:33,960 --> 01:13:36,160
Speaker 5: that's like where most of the anxiety is. It's not

1358
01:13:36,240 --> 01:13:39,200
Speaker 5: actually from like having a crush. It's like all this

1359
01:13:39,360 --> 01:13:40,320
Speaker 5: other stuff.

1360
01:13:40,280 --> 01:13:43,400
Speaker 3: That's I feel like And because the I feel like

1361
01:13:43,439 --> 01:13:46,400
Speaker 3: the two minutes in bathroom or whatever the fuck they

1362
01:13:46,439 --> 01:13:49,559
Speaker 3: were calling it, because that was like portrayed a little

1363
01:13:49,560 --> 01:13:51,160
Speaker 3: differently in the movie to the book, I feel like

1364
01:13:51,160 --> 01:13:53,800
Speaker 3: it lost that a little bit. But it's like, yeah,

1365
01:13:53,960 --> 01:13:57,040
Speaker 3: Margaret doesn't really have a crush on Philip. She just

1366
01:13:57,240 --> 01:14:00,600
Speaker 3: knows that she's supposed to. Yeah, and like it's so

1367
01:14:01,360 --> 01:14:04,120
Speaker 3: I mean, this is true across the gender spectrum, but

1368
01:14:04,240 --> 01:14:07,960
Speaker 3: like this felt like closer to my own experience of

1369
01:14:08,040 --> 01:14:10,400
Speaker 3: like so much of being these social groups, especially at

1370
01:14:10,400 --> 01:14:13,120
Speaker 3: this age, is like you're performing for the others.

1371
01:14:13,200 --> 01:14:15,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and it's.

1372
01:14:14,960 --> 01:14:18,880
Speaker 3: We don't even really we know that Margaret wants boobs

1373
01:14:18,880 --> 01:14:22,479
Speaker 3: in her period, but it's mainly because she wants to,

1374
01:14:23,120 --> 01:14:26,519
Speaker 3: you know, prove herself to her friend group. And like

1375
01:14:26,760 --> 01:14:29,240
Speaker 3: she doesn't get a bra because she's like, it's time

1376
01:14:29,280 --> 01:14:30,639
Speaker 3: for me to have a bra. She gets a broad

1377
01:14:30,680 --> 01:14:32,960
Speaker 3: because it's one of the weird rules of the weird

1378
01:14:33,000 --> 01:14:33,679
Speaker 3: group and.

1379
01:14:33,920 --> 01:14:35,360
Speaker 2: The fight club or whatever.

1380
01:14:36,720 --> 01:14:38,719
Speaker 3: And she has she has a crush on Philip because

1381
01:14:38,720 --> 01:14:41,000
Speaker 3: she's supposed to, but she doesn't actually, but she knows

1382
01:14:41,040 --> 01:14:43,920
Speaker 3: that if she she says she has a crush on Moose,

1383
01:14:43,960 --> 01:14:46,320
Speaker 3: well Nancy doesn't like Moose and so it's not allowed.

1384
01:14:46,360 --> 01:14:49,280
Speaker 3: So it's like, you know, in a in the way

1385
01:14:49,280 --> 01:14:51,280
Speaker 3: that like a lot of these i mean just friend

1386
01:14:51,320 --> 01:14:53,479
Speaker 3: groups at all, but you know, especially the younger you are,

1387
01:14:53,520 --> 01:14:57,960
Speaker 3: it's just a fundamentally dishonest endeavor, Like they're all like

1388
01:14:58,120 --> 01:15:00,560
Speaker 3: lying out of their asses to each other. I wish,

1389
01:15:00,640 --> 01:15:02,160
Speaker 3: I wish in the book and in the movie we

1390
01:15:02,200 --> 01:15:04,240
Speaker 3: got a little more focus on, Like it seems like

1391
01:15:04,880 --> 01:15:08,320
Speaker 3: Margaret and Janey sort of connects the closest, and I

1392
01:15:08,320 --> 01:15:10,800
Speaker 3: wish we got a little bit more on that. I mean,

1393
01:15:10,840 --> 01:15:13,080
Speaker 3: it's very much Margaret's story and that's fine, but I

1394
01:15:13,080 --> 01:15:16,719
Speaker 3: felt like Janie's sort of who's also the only black

1395
01:15:16,800 --> 01:15:21,400
Speaker 3: girl that we really get any insight into in the movie.

1396
01:15:21,880 --> 01:15:23,920
Speaker 3: I just feel like we got less of her than

1397
01:15:24,000 --> 01:15:27,880
Speaker 3: the other girls in the group, and that is a

1398
01:15:27,880 --> 01:15:31,720
Speaker 3: shame because she's such a sweetie and it would be

1399
01:15:31,840 --> 01:15:35,800
Speaker 3: nice to see Margaret actually sort of connect with her more.

1400
01:15:35,960 --> 01:15:37,840
Speaker 3: There's a really sweet I forget if this happens in

1401
01:15:37,840 --> 01:15:39,800
Speaker 3: the movie. In the book, there is a scene where

1402
01:15:40,680 --> 01:15:44,160
Speaker 3: when Margaret is getting her bra, they run into Janie

1403
01:15:44,200 --> 01:15:47,080
Speaker 3: and her mom on their way to do the same thing,

1404
01:15:47,360 --> 01:15:49,600
Speaker 3: but they lie to each other about it, where Janie's like,

1405
01:15:49,680 --> 01:15:53,880
Speaker 3: I'm getting new pajamas and Margaret's like I am too, goodbye,

1406
01:15:54,240 --> 01:15:58,280
Speaker 3: but they're both clearly getting the growbra or whatever. I

1407
01:15:58,360 --> 01:15:59,640
Speaker 3: was like, Oh, it would have been cool to have

1408
01:15:59,760 --> 01:16:00,800
Speaker 3: more moments like that.

1409
01:16:01,200 --> 01:16:04,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, that is not in the movie. The scene that

1410
01:16:04,720 --> 01:16:06,479
Speaker 2: really stood out to me that is in the movie

1411
01:16:07,040 --> 01:16:09,479
Speaker 2: is the one where Margaret and Jane go into the

1412
01:16:09,560 --> 01:16:13,240
Speaker 2: drug store to buy pads and they're like so apprehensive

1413
01:16:13,240 --> 01:16:15,120
Speaker 2: about it and then they like whip.

1414
01:16:14,920 --> 01:16:15,759
Speaker 3: The tick tags.

1415
01:16:16,200 --> 01:16:19,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're like, this is not about us buying pads.

1416
01:16:19,400 --> 01:16:22,439
Speaker 2: This is about us buying tic TACs, and the pads

1417
01:16:22,479 --> 01:16:23,840
Speaker 2: just happened to be there. Uh.

1418
01:16:24,280 --> 01:16:26,920
Speaker 5: Really cute, And I love the giddiness that they get

1419
01:16:26,960 --> 01:16:29,679
Speaker 5: after they like and it's just like the most normal

1420
01:16:29,720 --> 01:16:33,120
Speaker 5: interaction of like, yeah, the checker is just like going

1421
01:16:33,240 --> 01:16:36,240
Speaker 5: very you know, but it's just completely like they're having

1422
01:16:36,280 --> 01:16:40,200
Speaker 5: an experience that is totally like, oh my god, it's

1423
01:16:40,200 --> 01:16:41,400
Speaker 5: so crazy we're doing this.

1424
01:16:42,080 --> 01:16:44,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is the most important thing they've ever done.

1425
01:16:45,479 --> 01:16:49,160
Speaker 2: And then I like the scene where when Margaret does

1426
01:16:49,280 --> 01:16:53,599
Speaker 2: go to like explore Christian church, she goes with Janey

1427
01:16:53,880 --> 01:16:58,280
Speaker 2: and it's to this predominantly black congregation. They're singing like

1428
01:16:58,400 --> 01:17:02,840
Speaker 2: lively gospel music. Then you also see that there's like

1429
01:17:02,880 --> 01:17:05,160
Speaker 2: a montage where all the girls are getting ready for

1430
01:17:05,479 --> 01:17:08,439
Speaker 2: the dinner party. Yeah, I appreciate that we do see

1431
01:17:08,840 --> 01:17:12,200
Speaker 2: Jannie's home life. There's a moment where like her mom

1432
01:17:12,280 --> 01:17:14,760
Speaker 2: is helping her get ready and like doing her hair.

1433
01:17:15,479 --> 01:17:18,800
Speaker 2: But it does feel like because one thing I do

1434
01:17:18,840 --> 01:17:21,559
Speaker 2: appreciate about the movie is that there's like there's a

1435
01:17:21,640 --> 01:17:25,120
Speaker 2: variety of opinions or kind of feelings about what does

1436
01:17:25,160 --> 01:17:27,800
Speaker 2: it mean to get your period or like how are

1437
01:17:27,840 --> 01:17:30,920
Speaker 2: we feeling about the prospect of getting our periods? And

1438
01:17:31,760 --> 01:17:35,160
Speaker 2: we have Like Gretchen, she gets hers first, she's pretty

1439
01:17:35,240 --> 01:17:39,519
Speaker 2: nonchalant about it. She's like, yeah, just freaking kind of happens, dude. Meanwhile,

1440
01:17:39,680 --> 01:17:43,519
Speaker 2: Nancy's lying about getting hers, and then when she actually

1441
01:17:43,560 --> 01:17:46,680
Speaker 2: does get it, she's like so scared and upset.

1442
01:17:46,400 --> 01:17:49,240
Speaker 5: And her mom is so like that broke my heart

1443
01:17:49,439 --> 01:17:52,800
Speaker 5: so much. That scene, yeah, where her mom is just like,

1444
01:17:52,920 --> 01:17:57,320
Speaker 5: what's up? Oh okay, Like here's say too long. Yeah,

1445
01:17:57,400 --> 01:18:01,160
Speaker 5: She's like, don't make us like take too long at

1446
01:18:01,200 --> 01:18:03,160
Speaker 5: dinner because you've got your period or whatever.

1447
01:18:03,360 --> 01:18:03,799
Speaker 4: Bite.

1448
01:18:03,960 --> 01:18:07,120
Speaker 3: Yeah. I was also like, how does she not into it?

1449
01:18:07,200 --> 01:18:09,800
Speaker 3: What's happened here? She's there? She asks what's up?

1450
01:18:09,920 --> 01:18:10,400
Speaker 4: What's up?

1451
01:18:10,479 --> 01:18:13,519
Speaker 3: So many times I'm like, look at your kid, think

1452
01:18:13,560 --> 01:18:15,360
Speaker 3: of how old they are, What the fuck do you

1453
01:18:15,439 --> 01:18:18,639
Speaker 3: think is up? Like take a guess?

1454
01:18:19,800 --> 01:18:22,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, she does not handle that well. But yeah, that's

1455
01:18:23,000 --> 01:18:26,960
Speaker 2: like the Nancy situation. Margaret is desperate to get her

1456
01:18:27,040 --> 01:18:31,439
Speaker 2: period because again, she wants to be normal, and then

1457
01:18:31,479 --> 01:18:34,640
Speaker 2: she's super excited when it does happen. We don't know

1458
01:18:34,680 --> 01:18:37,679
Speaker 2: how Janie feels about the prospect of getting her period

1459
01:18:37,800 --> 01:18:41,360
Speaker 2: at all, and it feels very pointed that the only

1460
01:18:41,439 --> 01:18:45,680
Speaker 2: black girl gets overlooked in this matter. It's not as

1461
01:18:45,680 --> 01:18:50,280
Speaker 2: though Janie is overlooked constantly about everything, but it does

1462
01:18:50,280 --> 01:18:52,479
Speaker 2: feel weird because so much of this story is about like,

1463
01:18:53,000 --> 01:18:56,439
Speaker 2: oh no, we're going through puberty and this is how

1464
01:18:56,479 --> 01:18:59,559
Speaker 2: we feel about it. And then Jane feels we do

1465
01:18:59,600 --> 01:19:02,720
Speaker 2: get that where she's like, ooh, sex is gross. I

1466
01:19:02,760 --> 01:19:04,920
Speaker 2: never want to be naked in front of anyone, and

1467
01:19:04,960 --> 01:19:07,519
Speaker 2: I don't want to see anyone naked, and like I

1468
01:19:07,560 --> 01:19:09,960
Speaker 2: remember thinking that when I was eleven. I was like,

1469
01:19:10,680 --> 01:19:13,519
Speaker 2: I'm never gonna have sex. Sex is for is gross.

1470
01:19:13,640 --> 01:19:16,759
Speaker 3: But that's all you really get, I mean, and especially because,

1471
01:19:16,800 --> 01:19:19,360
Speaker 3: at least from what I can tell, like Jane's race

1472
01:19:19,520 --> 01:19:22,880
Speaker 3: was changed for the movie, which is like, that's good,

1473
01:19:22,920 --> 01:19:25,880
Speaker 3: but also it's like, but then also be aware of

1474
01:19:25,920 --> 01:19:28,360
Speaker 3: how you have cast the movie and adjust the script

1475
01:19:28,600 --> 01:19:31,759
Speaker 3: accordingly to make sure that characters are getting equal focused.

1476
01:19:31,800 --> 01:19:34,800
Speaker 3: Otherwise it just seems like you cast the only black

1477
01:19:34,800 --> 01:19:36,920
Speaker 3: girl we really get to focus on in this movie

1478
01:19:36,960 --> 01:19:40,160
Speaker 3: in the quote unquote smallest part. So it's like flesh

1479
01:19:40,240 --> 01:19:42,160
Speaker 3: the part out a little bit. It's not that hard,

1480
01:19:42,160 --> 01:19:43,760
Speaker 3: but I mean this is also while there are a

1481
01:19:43,800 --> 01:19:47,599
Speaker 3: lot of women involved, and also James L. Brooks because

1482
01:19:47,840 --> 01:19:51,479
Speaker 3: his career is interesting, but there's a lot of women involved,

1483
01:19:51,640 --> 01:19:54,040
Speaker 3: at the highest places in production, they are majority of

1484
01:19:54,040 --> 01:19:54,519
Speaker 3: white women.

1485
01:19:55,560 --> 01:19:59,200
Speaker 2: And you can tell because the movie feels like it

1486
01:19:59,360 --> 01:20:03,760
Speaker 2: just ignored race, and it ignores any racial tension in

1487
01:20:03,840 --> 01:20:07,679
Speaker 2: nineteen seventies would have existed in this predominantly white suburb

1488
01:20:07,800 --> 01:20:09,360
Speaker 2: in nineteen seventy.

1489
01:20:09,439 --> 01:20:11,840
Speaker 5: Yes, because it's you think, like I wrote this down

1490
01:20:11,840 --> 01:20:14,280
Speaker 5: where I was like, yeah, they're moving out of New

1491
01:20:14,360 --> 01:20:18,439
Speaker 5: York City in nineteen seventy, which is like the early

1492
01:20:18,479 --> 01:20:21,280
Speaker 5: seventies were like pretty like New York City that was

1493
01:20:21,320 --> 01:20:22,920
Speaker 5: white flight basically.

1494
01:20:22,800 --> 01:20:26,040
Speaker 3: Like so they may in fact be white flighting.

1495
01:20:26,400 --> 01:20:28,920
Speaker 5: They might be white flighting because he gets I love

1496
01:20:29,000 --> 01:20:31,479
Speaker 5: also that they're like, oh dad got a promotion. We

1497
01:20:31,600 --> 01:20:33,559
Speaker 5: never know what his job is. We know it's like,

1498
01:20:33,560 --> 01:20:35,880
Speaker 5: don't clime of it whatever. No, no, I don't care,

1499
01:20:36,360 --> 01:20:39,280
Speaker 5: but I do love that that like his job doesn't matter,

1500
01:20:39,360 --> 01:20:41,320
Speaker 5: but it is the reason we have to change all

1501
01:20:41,320 --> 01:20:44,720
Speaker 5: our lives around and like that was interesting to me.

1502
01:20:44,800 --> 01:20:47,000
Speaker 5: But yeah, they moved to the suburb, and like one

1503
01:20:47,160 --> 01:20:51,519
Speaker 5: New Jersey suburb being this racially integrated doesn't feel that

1504
01:20:51,960 --> 01:20:54,960
Speaker 5: realistic in the nineteen in nineteen seventy.

1505
01:20:54,680 --> 01:20:58,280
Speaker 4: And then two there is just no mention.

1506
01:20:58,640 --> 01:21:00,920
Speaker 5: And like, again, this is on a book, so like

1507
01:21:01,120 --> 01:21:03,280
Speaker 5: we can't really be mad that they didn't like invent

1508
01:21:03,680 --> 01:21:06,400
Speaker 5: things that weren't in the book. But like, but I

1509
01:21:06,439 --> 01:21:09,080
Speaker 5: would have loved to see, yeah, like what you were

1510
01:21:09,080 --> 01:21:12,639
Speaker 5: saying about Janie, I would love to see Margaret having

1511
01:21:12,680 --> 01:21:15,280
Speaker 5: like a little bit of a realization that, like Jane's

1512
01:21:15,320 --> 01:21:19,439
Speaker 5: experience is different than her experience, and that would have

1513
01:21:19,479 --> 01:21:22,880
Speaker 5: been an interesting way for her to like wake up

1514
01:21:22,920 --> 01:21:24,120
Speaker 5: to the world a little bit.

1515
01:21:24,240 --> 01:21:28,080
Speaker 3: You know, as well as mister Benedict too. The book

1516
01:21:28,120 --> 01:21:31,559
Speaker 3: makes no mention to race whatsoever. So I'm not saying

1517
01:21:31,560 --> 01:21:33,800
Speaker 3: that like in the book, everyone is what, it just

1518
01:21:33,920 --> 01:21:36,719
Speaker 3: isn't brought up, Like race is just not a component

1519
01:21:36,760 --> 01:21:39,000
Speaker 3: of the book, which is a level of privilege in

1520
01:21:39,000 --> 01:21:42,200
Speaker 3: and of itself, but like, I don't even think it's

1521
01:21:42,200 --> 01:21:44,880
Speaker 3: like an effective argument if someone were to be like, well,

1522
01:21:45,000 --> 01:21:47,479
Speaker 3: it's the Bridgerton approach to casting, and we're just sort

1523
01:21:47,520 --> 01:21:51,320
Speaker 3: of because other social issues are very present in here,

1524
01:21:51,520 --> 01:21:54,800
Speaker 3: like the issue between inter Like this movie is a

1525
01:21:54,840 --> 01:21:59,479
Speaker 3: lot about interfaith marriage and the prejudice that existed around

1526
01:21:59,560 --> 01:22:02,519
Speaker 3: interfaith marriage at this time. So it's like they live

1527
01:22:02,560 --> 01:22:03,719
Speaker 3: in a society, but.

1528
01:22:03,640 --> 01:22:07,240
Speaker 2: The one that doesn't acknowledge racism at all.

1529
01:22:06,880 --> 01:22:12,120
Speaker 3: In nineteen seventy, Like it's just weird. Yeah, I just

1530
01:22:12,240 --> 01:22:14,840
Speaker 3: I don't know. Again, it's like I'm glad that the

1531
01:22:14,920 --> 01:22:18,640
Speaker 3: cast is more diverse than ostensibly the book appeared to be.

1532
01:22:19,200 --> 01:22:21,360
Speaker 3: But if you're going to do that, it's a period

1533
01:22:21,400 --> 01:22:24,960
Speaker 3: piece and like you do have to make you know,

1534
01:22:25,040 --> 01:22:29,000
Speaker 3: I think if you're making these adjustments, a completely straightforward

1535
01:22:29,200 --> 01:22:33,080
Speaker 3: adaptation of the original book no longer makes total sense,

1536
01:22:33,160 --> 01:22:35,799
Speaker 3: Like you can't just go and it's not like the

1537
01:22:35,840 --> 01:22:38,960
Speaker 3: movie has to pivot and be entirely about race. But again,

1538
01:22:39,000 --> 01:22:42,000
Speaker 3: it's like Janey, like you do get the feeling that

1539
01:22:42,040 --> 01:22:44,720
Speaker 3: they sort of added in a majority of black congregation

1540
01:22:44,800 --> 01:22:48,200
Speaker 3: and kind of called it a day, and that is.

1541
01:22:49,720 --> 01:22:52,880
Speaker 2: Lazy, right, I mean, it's like I just kept thinking,

1542
01:22:52,920 --> 01:22:57,479
Speaker 2: like you're telling me that this predominantly white, middle to

1543
01:22:57,560 --> 01:23:02,800
Speaker 2: upper middle class suburb of again mostly white kids has

1544
01:23:02,840 --> 01:23:04,559
Speaker 2: a black teacher and.

1545
01:23:05,000 --> 01:23:06,840
Speaker 3: No one said anything about it, and.

1546
01:23:06,800 --> 01:23:10,719
Speaker 4: The shitty little teenage kids are not are like racist

1547
01:23:10,760 --> 01:23:11,080
Speaker 4: about it.

1548
01:23:11,200 --> 01:23:14,320
Speaker 5: Nancy's not being shitty and racist about it, Like yeah, right.

1549
01:23:14,560 --> 01:23:17,160
Speaker 3: The tricky thing too, is like it's not like you

1550
01:23:17,439 --> 01:23:19,479
Speaker 3: want to be like, Okay, the only black characters in

1551
01:23:19,479 --> 01:23:21,679
Speaker 3: this movie, we're gonna we're gonna actually make a point

1552
01:23:21,680 --> 01:23:24,280
Speaker 3: of how terribly they're treated by the other characters. But

1553
01:23:24,320 --> 01:23:28,200
Speaker 3: it just it felt like it overcorrected that so far

1554
01:23:28,439 --> 01:23:32,800
Speaker 3: that racism mysteriously didn't exist in this society where interfaith

1555
01:23:32,840 --> 01:23:35,360
Speaker 3: marriage is still a big issue, and it's like that

1556
01:23:35,479 --> 01:23:37,320
Speaker 3: just didn't it just didn't happen.

1557
01:23:37,960 --> 01:23:42,240
Speaker 4: Yeah, one bone I have to pick with this movie.

1558
01:23:42,320 --> 01:23:45,880
Speaker 5: But also, like pretty much all media like there is

1559
01:23:46,080 --> 01:23:49,880
Speaker 5: no there's essentially no representation of period pain.

1560
01:23:50,640 --> 01:23:50,960
Speaker 2: True.

1561
01:23:51,040 --> 01:23:54,280
Speaker 5: So even we're we're just talking about how hard it

1562
01:23:54,320 --> 01:23:58,280
Speaker 5: is to find a movie that portrays or discusses periods,

1563
01:23:59,000 --> 01:24:01,879
Speaker 5: there is ten times less media out there that portrays

1564
01:24:01,920 --> 01:24:04,840
Speaker 5: period pain. Yeah, where these it's all about like they're

1565
01:24:04,880 --> 01:24:07,840
Speaker 5: getting their periods. She gets her period and it's just

1566
01:24:07,960 --> 01:24:12,160
Speaker 5: like blood. Like it's just like, oh, periods are just blood.

1567
01:24:12,400 --> 01:24:14,320
Speaker 5: You know, it's the end. You know you have your

1568
01:24:14,320 --> 01:24:16,960
Speaker 5: period because you're bleeding. But it's like, at no point

1569
01:24:17,040 --> 01:24:21,040
Speaker 5: it does she feel sick or uncomfortable, Like nobody is

1570
01:24:21,080 --> 01:24:22,680
Speaker 5: talking about like cramps.

1571
01:24:23,040 --> 01:24:23,360
Speaker 4: Nothing.

1572
01:24:23,640 --> 01:24:25,000
Speaker 2: She's one mention of cramping.

1573
01:24:25,200 --> 01:24:27,519
Speaker 5: Her mom asks her like, oh, do you have cramping?

1574
01:24:27,600 --> 01:24:29,000
Speaker 5: And she's like, no, not at all.

1575
01:24:28,800 --> 01:24:31,880
Speaker 3: And it's like I just it's again, it's like you

1576
01:24:31,960 --> 01:24:36,200
Speaker 3: have if you're having like four young girls who are

1577
01:24:36,200 --> 01:24:40,040
Speaker 3: starting to menstrate, give them a variety of experience exactly,

1578
01:24:40,360 --> 01:24:42,360
Speaker 3: because it's like, sure, that's not gonna happen to everyone,

1579
01:24:42,400 --> 01:24:44,760
Speaker 3: but that does happen to a lot of kids, and

1580
01:24:44,800 --> 01:24:45,599
Speaker 3: it is scary.

1581
01:24:45,760 --> 01:24:48,120
Speaker 5: How interesting would it be if like Gretchen got her

1582
01:24:48,120 --> 01:24:51,240
Speaker 5: period first and was like everything's fine, but everything's different now.

1583
01:24:51,280 --> 01:24:53,840
Speaker 4: You wouldn't understand. And then Nancy got her period and

1584
01:24:53,840 --> 01:24:56,880
Speaker 4: she was like, actually, I'm in so much pain and

1585
01:24:56,960 --> 01:25:00,880
Speaker 4: like this like wait, why is this than my friend?

1586
01:25:00,920 --> 01:25:03,599
Speaker 4: You know, like that would be so and it would be.

1587
01:25:03,520 --> 01:25:06,120
Speaker 5: I just like if I had seen any movies or

1588
01:25:06,160 --> 01:25:09,400
Speaker 5: TV shows growing up where that had been portrayed at all.

1589
01:25:09,960 --> 01:25:12,360
Speaker 5: I would not have felt like such a freak that

1590
01:25:12,600 --> 01:25:14,559
Speaker 5: my period made me throw up, Like I would at

1591
01:25:14,640 --> 01:25:17,839
Speaker 5: least know that somewhere else out there that was happening

1592
01:25:17,840 --> 01:25:21,479
Speaker 5: to other people. Yeah, and other people would know that's

1593
01:25:21,520 --> 01:25:24,280
Speaker 5: a possibility, right, because when I was when I was

1594
01:25:24,280 --> 01:25:27,040
Speaker 5: fourteen and was throwing up on my period, people were like,

1595
01:25:27,520 --> 01:25:30,080
Speaker 5: that doesn't happen like, and It's like, no, it does.

1596
01:25:30,280 --> 01:25:30,839
Speaker 4: It's same.

1597
01:25:31,320 --> 01:25:34,200
Speaker 2: I had to leave school one day because I I

1598
01:25:34,280 --> 01:25:37,519
Speaker 2: got my period. I was feeling horrible. I like went

1599
01:25:37,560 --> 01:25:41,000
Speaker 2: to the nurse's office to lie down. I was like, I,

1600
01:25:41,120 --> 01:25:43,040
Speaker 2: this is horrible. I need to just go home. And

1601
01:25:43,120 --> 01:25:46,680
Speaker 2: so I went to like collect my belongings while the

1602
01:25:46,760 --> 01:25:48,920
Speaker 2: nurse called my mom. And as I was doing that,

1603
01:25:48,960 --> 01:25:52,360
Speaker 2: I puked all over the floor of the school. And

1604
01:25:52,400 --> 01:25:55,280
Speaker 2: then I heard someone come into the hallway and be like,

1605
01:25:55,720 --> 01:25:59,280
Speaker 2: oh my god, and I just run away. Sorry I

1606
01:25:59,400 --> 01:25:59,960
Speaker 2: never heard to this.

1607
01:26:00,120 --> 01:26:00,320
Speaker 1: I know.

1608
01:26:00,520 --> 01:26:03,240
Speaker 2: It was really funny though, But I feel like the

1609
01:26:03,280 --> 01:26:07,880
Speaker 2: only movie I've seen that acknowledges period cramps is that

1610
01:26:08,000 --> 01:26:12,000
Speaker 2: Natalie Portman movie No Strings Attached, Yes, Yes, where they're

1611
01:26:12,000 --> 01:26:14,360
Speaker 2: like kind of lying around and they're like, ah, we

1612
01:26:14,720 --> 01:26:15,720
Speaker 2: all have cramps.

1613
01:26:16,840 --> 01:26:19,760
Speaker 5: But that's like that is basically just scene setting for

1614
01:26:19,960 --> 01:26:22,920
Speaker 5: Ashton Kutcher to come in and be like I brought

1615
01:26:22,960 --> 01:26:26,719
Speaker 5: cupcakes and I google periods and then they're like, great,

1616
01:26:26,760 --> 01:26:29,679
Speaker 5: everything's fine now, heroic if we did it.

1617
01:26:29,840 --> 01:26:34,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, there needs to be more just understanding and media

1618
01:26:34,880 --> 01:26:41,200
Speaker 2: representation of side effects, symptoms totally of menstruation.

1619
01:26:40,840 --> 01:26:43,559
Speaker 4: Well and just the range like this is actually like

1620
01:26:43,720 --> 01:26:45,200
Speaker 4: what I'm I'm obsessed.

1621
01:26:45,280 --> 01:26:47,280
Speaker 5: This is my white whale now, this is my Roman empire.

1622
01:26:47,439 --> 01:26:52,639
Speaker 5: Is that we have one word for pain with periods, right,

1623
01:26:52,680 --> 01:26:57,519
Speaker 5: we have cramps. But that experience can be like ooh ow,

1624
01:26:57,760 --> 01:26:59,560
Speaker 5: like I'm a little uncomfortable, I'm going to take some

1625
01:26:59,600 --> 01:27:01,840
Speaker 5: ypipro and and then I'll be fine all the way

1626
01:27:01,880 --> 01:27:05,639
Speaker 5: to like I'm throwing up for seven hours, I'm passing

1627
01:27:05,640 --> 01:27:08,719
Speaker 5: out from the pain. And we don't have a different

1628
01:27:08,760 --> 01:27:09,320
Speaker 5: word for that.

1629
01:27:09,520 --> 01:27:12,320
Speaker 4: We don't have right, we just have cramps.

1630
01:27:12,400 --> 01:27:14,720
Speaker 5: So no wonder it's really hard for me to like

1631
01:27:15,439 --> 01:27:19,000
Speaker 5: describe my pain to a doctor or to my boss

1632
01:27:19,040 --> 01:27:21,040
Speaker 5: when I have to call out of work or like,

1633
01:27:21,320 --> 01:27:23,920
Speaker 5: because if I just say cramps, nobody knows what the

1634
01:27:23,920 --> 01:27:24,599
Speaker 5: fuck that means.

1635
01:27:24,640 --> 01:27:25,920
Speaker 3: There's no language for it.

1636
01:27:26,080 --> 01:27:29,639
Speaker 5: Yeah, yes, and so like it literally, unless you are

1637
01:27:29,680 --> 01:27:33,360
Speaker 5: my parent or my like romantic partner and you have

1638
01:27:33,520 --> 01:27:36,800
Speaker 5: seen with your own eyes what that pain does to me,

1639
01:27:37,560 --> 01:27:40,920
Speaker 5: I basically can't tell you what this pain is or

1640
01:27:41,000 --> 01:27:43,920
Speaker 5: like what's happening to me. And that's partly because we

1641
01:27:43,920 --> 01:27:44,799
Speaker 5: don't talk about.

1642
01:27:44,600 --> 01:27:45,600
Speaker 2: It in media.

1643
01:27:45,680 --> 01:27:47,680
Speaker 5: Like how many different words do we have for like

1644
01:27:47,840 --> 01:27:51,240
Speaker 5: situationships and like all these different things so that we

1645
01:27:51,280 --> 01:27:53,600
Speaker 5: can understand what we're talking about when we talk to

1646
01:27:53,600 --> 01:27:56,960
Speaker 5: each other about romantic relationships, But we don't even stomach

1647
01:27:57,000 --> 01:28:00,320
Speaker 5: aches we have like bloated, we have heartburn, you know,

1648
01:28:00,360 --> 01:28:03,479
Speaker 5: we have all these different words that mean slightly different

1649
01:28:03,680 --> 01:28:08,360
Speaker 5: versions of my stomach hurts right right, But like we

1650
01:28:08,439 --> 01:28:10,679
Speaker 5: don't have that for cramps And if we talked about

1651
01:28:10,680 --> 01:28:13,160
Speaker 5: it in the media more, we would have to have

1652
01:28:13,280 --> 01:28:18,240
Speaker 5: better phrases and better more specific words, and we then

1653
01:28:18,280 --> 01:28:20,639
Speaker 5: we could use those in other situations and people would

1654
01:28:20,640 --> 01:28:22,360
Speaker 5: know what the fuck we were talking about and how

1655
01:28:22,439 --> 01:28:23,240
Speaker 5: serious it was.

1656
01:28:23,520 --> 01:28:24,640
Speaker 4: It's why I started.

1657
01:28:24,320 --> 01:28:27,040
Speaker 5: Calling my really bad cramp like when I throw up

1658
01:28:27,080 --> 01:28:30,880
Speaker 5: and pass out, those are death cramps. And I have

1659
01:28:30,960 --> 01:28:33,519
Speaker 5: to differentiate it because sometimes I just have cramps and

1660
01:28:33,560 --> 01:28:36,519
Speaker 5: it sucks like it always sucks, but like sometimes it's

1661
01:28:36,520 --> 01:28:38,000
Speaker 5: a medical emergency, you know.

1662
01:28:38,520 --> 01:28:42,880
Speaker 3: Right, God, And it's like, in terms of the movie,

1663
01:28:42,960 --> 01:28:45,280
Speaker 3: it's like this is I just think it's like frustrating

1664
01:28:45,320 --> 01:28:49,160
Speaker 3: what they chose to change versus what remained unaltered, because

1665
01:28:49,360 --> 01:28:52,120
Speaker 3: it just feels like the easiest, you know, the easiest

1666
01:28:52,120 --> 01:28:54,240
Speaker 3: cop out for that is like, well, we wanted to

1667
01:28:54,240 --> 01:28:55,800
Speaker 3: be true to the book, and it's like, well, but

1668
01:28:55,880 --> 01:28:58,519
Speaker 3: you actually kind of made the ending very neat and

1669
01:28:58,600 --> 01:29:01,400
Speaker 3: clean in the way that is not true to the book.

1670
01:29:01,720 --> 01:29:06,120
Speaker 3: So why wouldn't you update elements like acknowledging racism because

1671
01:29:06,160 --> 01:29:08,720
Speaker 3: you have a more diverse cast, why would you not

1672
01:29:09,040 --> 01:29:12,240
Speaker 3: update giving I mean, it wouldn't have changed anything about

1673
01:29:12,240 --> 01:29:16,920
Speaker 3: the story, accept better representation of what experiencing a period

1674
01:29:17,000 --> 01:29:20,040
Speaker 3: is like for different people if they had different like

1675
01:29:20,200 --> 01:29:23,520
Speaker 3: the plot changes, not at all. It's just better representation.

1676
01:29:24,439 --> 01:29:24,679
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1677
01:29:24,920 --> 01:29:28,840
Speaker 3: Right, So that said, I mean, I felt that it

1678
01:29:28,920 --> 01:29:32,240
Speaker 3: is a really good movie, Like I enjoy it.

1679
01:29:32,600 --> 01:29:34,200
Speaker 4: I also like, we haven't even been able.

1680
01:29:34,520 --> 01:29:36,000
Speaker 5: One of the things I loved about it was like

1681
01:29:36,080 --> 01:29:40,719
Speaker 5: Rachel mcadam's like her character where she's that she gets

1682
01:29:40,720 --> 01:29:43,839
Speaker 5: a journey and Sylvia gets a journey of like, yeah,

1683
01:29:43,880 --> 01:29:47,320
Speaker 5: my family left and I'm lonely, but like, then I'm

1684
01:29:47,360 --> 01:29:50,479
Speaker 5: going to go to Florida and like make friends and

1685
01:29:50,600 --> 01:29:54,200
Speaker 5: fuck buddies and like, and they all kind of end

1686
01:29:54,280 --> 01:29:56,840
Speaker 5: up in different places, you know, they all have journeys, Yeah,

1687
01:29:56,920 --> 01:29:59,439
Speaker 5: that you follow throughout the movie, and it's like, oh,

1688
01:29:59,479 --> 01:30:02,040
Speaker 5: I that I love that, Like we're following these three

1689
01:30:02,080 --> 01:30:05,000
Speaker 5: generations dealing with very different things.

1690
01:30:05,240 --> 01:30:08,200
Speaker 4: But they actually all get like a journey totally.

1691
01:30:08,280 --> 01:30:08,559
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1692
01:30:08,920 --> 01:30:12,599
Speaker 2: I wrote down for Grandma Kathy Bates that she says

1693
01:30:12,600 --> 01:30:15,839
Speaker 2: that one line of like after they have moved to Jersey,

1694
01:30:15,920 --> 01:30:17,760
Speaker 2: she says, like I read that if you don't have

1695
01:30:17,840 --> 01:30:22,240
Speaker 2: any loved ones around your life, expectancy drops drastically, And

1696
01:30:22,280 --> 01:30:24,920
Speaker 2: I was like, parentheses, this is why people need to

1697
01:30:25,080 --> 01:30:28,880
Speaker 2: make and maintain friendships outside of their nuclear family. But

1698
01:30:28,920 --> 01:30:31,559
Speaker 2: then she does that and exactly she does it.

1699
01:30:31,680 --> 01:30:33,360
Speaker 3: I also got the feeling that she was being over

1700
01:30:33,439 --> 01:30:35,360
Speaker 3: dramatic in that I'm like, there's no way this lady

1701
01:30:35,360 --> 01:30:36,599
Speaker 3: doesn't have a shitload of friends.

1702
01:30:36,720 --> 01:30:39,679
Speaker 2: Like, she goes to Temple, She's got friends at Temple.

1703
01:30:39,760 --> 01:30:42,439
Speaker 3: Surely she's talking to Like I think she was just

1704
01:30:42,479 --> 01:30:46,439
Speaker 3: saying that to make her son feel guilty. Yeah, but yeah,

1705
01:30:46,600 --> 01:30:48,960
Speaker 3: I love that there's like these and that, as with

1706
01:30:49,360 --> 01:30:53,400
Speaker 3: most Judy bloom books like that, the women get the focus.

1707
01:30:53,520 --> 01:30:56,479
Speaker 3: But that doesn't mean that the you know, I think

1708
01:30:56,520 --> 01:30:59,240
Speaker 3: with like with Herb, I kept calling him Benny Safti,

1709
01:30:59,400 --> 01:31:03,479
Speaker 3: but it is in fact Herb. But that Herb does

1710
01:31:03,640 --> 01:31:06,840
Speaker 3: have a few you know, solid moments, especially in that

1711
01:31:06,920 --> 01:31:10,320
Speaker 3: sort of climactic scene with all the grandparents. Oh, that's

1712
01:31:10,360 --> 01:31:11,720
Speaker 3: also a little bit different in the book, but I

1713
01:31:11,760 --> 01:31:14,280
Speaker 3: think the movie did do it better. Where in the

1714
01:31:14,280 --> 01:31:18,160
Speaker 3: book the Christian grandparents have already left by the time

1715
01:31:18,240 --> 01:31:20,040
Speaker 3: Kathy Bates gets there. I think it was better that

1716
01:31:20,080 --> 01:31:22,840
Speaker 3: they were all there at once. Yeah, but in any

1717
01:31:22,880 --> 01:31:26,840
Speaker 3: case that like that scene, it's very short, but I

1718
01:31:26,840 --> 01:31:29,960
Speaker 3: thought they did really well with it. With Herb and

1719
01:31:30,640 --> 01:31:36,200
Speaker 3: Rachel mcadam's on Barbara Barbara, remember brab Bra have this

1720
01:31:36,360 --> 01:31:39,600
Speaker 3: really painful conversation where you know, you can tell that

1721
01:31:39,680 --> 01:31:41,960
Speaker 3: like Herb is like, well, what the fuck your parents

1722
01:31:41,960 --> 01:31:45,000
Speaker 3: are bigots? Why are you inviting them over? And not

1723
01:31:45,080 --> 01:31:49,280
Speaker 3: only are they bigots, they treated you like garbage and

1724
01:31:49,320 --> 01:31:52,000
Speaker 3: so like he hates them on so many levels, all

1725
01:31:52,040 --> 01:31:55,800
Speaker 3: of which are completely valid and and just like I

1726
01:31:55,800 --> 01:31:58,519
Speaker 3: mean again, it makes it stick out even more that

1727
01:31:58,600 --> 01:32:01,439
Speaker 3: the racism of this time isn't but just how prevalent

1728
01:32:01,960 --> 01:32:06,520
Speaker 3: anti Semitism still was in the seventies, and how discouraged

1729
01:32:07,120 --> 01:32:11,760
Speaker 3: interfaith marriages were. And also I'm not I mean, I'm

1730
01:32:11,760 --> 01:32:14,040
Speaker 3: not Jewish. I can't speak to this. I did want

1731
01:32:14,080 --> 01:32:16,400
Speaker 3: to just mention because I know that there is a

1732
01:32:16,439 --> 01:32:19,360
Speaker 3: lot of like there's been a lot of discussion in

1733
01:32:19,400 --> 01:32:23,000
Speaker 3: the past, however many years about Jewish characters being played

1734
01:32:23,000 --> 01:32:26,000
Speaker 3: by non Jewish actors. I think it most most often

1735
01:32:26,040 --> 01:32:30,720
Speaker 3: comes up in like marvelous Missus Masel conversations. But the

1736
01:32:30,840 --> 01:32:34,000
Speaker 3: Kathy Bates is Christian, and I you know, I can't

1737
01:32:34,000 --> 01:32:37,439
Speaker 3: speak to whether that was a sticking point for anybody,

1738
01:32:37,479 --> 01:32:39,200
Speaker 3: but I did just want to acknowledge it.

1739
01:32:39,439 --> 01:32:41,160
Speaker 2: Sure, But something that.

1740
01:32:41,160 --> 01:32:45,519
Speaker 3: Was very sweet. There's a little bts is that the

1741
01:32:45,680 --> 01:32:51,120
Speaker 3: actor who plays Margaret, who is just the cutest kid

1742
01:32:51,800 --> 01:32:54,280
Speaker 3: and does such a great job, Kelly Freeman Craig.

1743
01:32:55,320 --> 01:32:58,040
Speaker 2: Wait, no, that's the that's the director, writer, director.

1744
01:32:57,720 --> 01:33:01,000
Speaker 3: Oh my god, I'm so sorry. Okay, take it again,

1745
01:33:01,880 --> 01:33:04,960
Speaker 3: Abby writer forced in. Sorry, three names trippy up, like

1746
01:33:05,360 --> 01:33:10,080
Speaker 3: three names are in entertainment or serial killers? Like that's it.

1747
01:33:10,840 --> 01:33:12,840
Speaker 3: But you know, in spite of being a three names,

1748
01:33:12,840 --> 01:33:17,599
Speaker 3: she's great. Abby writer Fortson wanted this part so badly

1749
01:33:17,840 --> 01:33:21,559
Speaker 3: that she wrote this really sweet letter that kind of

1750
01:33:21,640 --> 01:33:24,240
Speaker 3: feels like a letter a kid would write to Judy

1751
01:33:24,240 --> 01:33:27,559
Speaker 3: Bloom about how she felt so connected. She like wrote

1752
01:33:27,560 --> 01:33:30,120
Speaker 3: this long letter to the producers of the movie, including

1753
01:33:30,800 --> 01:33:34,120
Speaker 3: James Brooks, which was wild, but I just wanted to

1754
01:33:34,320 --> 01:33:37,080
Speaker 3: and they published it in Variety as well. As she

1755
01:33:37,160 --> 01:33:39,080
Speaker 3: and Kathy Bates, I guess had like a really great

1756
01:33:39,080 --> 01:33:42,679
Speaker 3: working relationship and that two. I was like, oh, kids

1757
01:33:43,040 --> 01:33:47,760
Speaker 3: are so cool. That Abby, in order to get into

1758
01:33:47,800 --> 01:33:49,479
Speaker 3: her part. I don't know if she was told to

1759
01:33:49,479 --> 01:33:51,160
Speaker 3: do this or if she just took it upon herself,

1760
01:33:51,640 --> 01:33:55,439
Speaker 3: wrote letters in character as Margaret to Kathy Bates as

1761
01:33:55,439 --> 01:33:57,960
Speaker 3: if she were at camp and was like, hi, Grandma,

1762
01:33:58,000 --> 01:34:00,519
Speaker 3: and Kathy Bates wrote back, and they like shared some

1763
01:34:00,560 --> 01:34:02,519
Speaker 3: of those two, and I was like, that's so sweet,

1764
01:34:03,680 --> 01:34:05,200
Speaker 3: but I did want to share just like a little

1765
01:34:05,200 --> 01:34:09,559
Speaker 3: bit of her letter about why she connected with Margaret.

1766
01:34:10,240 --> 01:34:13,439
Speaker 3: So this is from Abby, Dear Kelly, Julia, and mister Brooks.

1767
01:34:13,479 --> 01:34:15,400
Speaker 3: It was really nice to meet you all. I really

1768
01:34:15,439 --> 01:34:17,599
Speaker 3: like Margaret a lot and feel really connected to her

1769
01:34:17,640 --> 01:34:19,760
Speaker 3: as we are both really insecure about growing up but

1770
01:34:19,800 --> 01:34:21,920
Speaker 3: still try to hide it. We are both not the

1771
01:34:21,960 --> 01:34:24,240
Speaker 3: popular kids at school and both just want to have friends.

1772
01:34:24,479 --> 01:34:26,439
Speaker 3: I very much enjoyed both the book and the script

1773
01:34:26,520 --> 01:34:28,599
Speaker 3: of Margaret, and feel like this would be an inspiring

1774
01:34:28,640 --> 01:34:30,639
Speaker 3: story for young girls to know that they are enough

1775
01:34:30,640 --> 01:34:34,200
Speaker 3: in their own bodies. Everybody is changing, some faster than others,

1776
01:34:34,240 --> 01:34:37,320
Speaker 3: but eventually it doesn't matter. What matters is what's inside,

1777
01:34:37,400 --> 01:34:41,040
Speaker 3: not how big your boobs are. Margaret has her body

1778
01:34:41,120 --> 01:34:44,040
Speaker 3: changing and it is having her quest for religion. I

1779
01:34:44,080 --> 01:34:46,200
Speaker 3: feel like she has a lot to be uncomfortable about,

1780
01:34:46,240 --> 01:34:48,040
Speaker 3: and she is also just starting at a new school

1781
01:34:48,080 --> 01:34:51,360
Speaker 3: and doesn't have any friends. I have always wanted to

1782
01:34:51,360 --> 01:34:53,479
Speaker 3: play a character like Margaret, a part that will help

1783
01:34:53,520 --> 01:34:56,080
Speaker 3: other people be confident in their own skins. When I

1784
01:34:56,120 --> 01:34:57,800
Speaker 3: read the script, I said to my mom, this is

1785
01:34:57,880 --> 01:35:02,280
Speaker 3: my life. I am Margaret. I get made fun of.

1786
01:35:02,439 --> 01:35:04,360
Speaker 3: I don't have a ton of good friends, I don't

1787
01:35:04,400 --> 01:35:06,559
Speaker 3: really have her religion, and I feel out of place

1788
01:35:06,600 --> 01:35:08,519
Speaker 3: most of the time because none of my friends are

1789
01:35:08,520 --> 01:35:10,920
Speaker 3: in any of my classes. Even though I'm a good

1790
01:35:11,000 --> 01:35:13,839
Speaker 3: kid in class. I feel the school is like, Okay,

1791
01:35:14,200 --> 01:35:16,479
Speaker 3: let's take all of Abby's friends away and see how

1792
01:35:16,479 --> 01:35:18,400
Speaker 3: well she does in school sitting next to a bunch

1793
01:35:18,400 --> 01:35:23,920
Speaker 3: of jerks. It goes on from there, but I just like,

1794
01:35:24,000 --> 01:35:27,040
Speaker 3: I thought it was so sweet and you can feel

1795
01:35:27,040 --> 01:35:29,439
Speaker 3: that in her performance too, that it's like even though

1796
01:35:29,439 --> 01:35:33,360
Speaker 3: she's playing a kid fifty years earlier that you know.

1797
01:35:33,800 --> 01:35:37,360
Speaker 5: I also love this that it starts with Hi, Julie,

1798
01:35:37,479 --> 01:35:40,240
Speaker 5: Kelly and miss like.

1799
01:35:41,720 --> 01:35:45,759
Speaker 2: You she should have just wrote a letter to God.

1800
01:35:46,360 --> 01:35:49,120
Speaker 2: Are you there? God? Yeah, it's me Abby.

1801
01:35:49,840 --> 01:35:54,040
Speaker 3: James Brook is like so fascinating anyways, And also just

1802
01:35:54,080 --> 01:35:57,040
Speaker 3: to shout out, this was written and directed by Kelly

1803
01:35:57,080 --> 01:36:01,639
Speaker 3: Freeman Craig, who had previously written and directed The Edge

1804
01:36:01,640 --> 01:36:05,000
Speaker 3: of seventeen, which I haven't seen, but there you go.

1805
01:36:05,120 --> 01:36:05,839
Speaker 3: It's true.

1806
01:36:06,200 --> 01:36:08,559
Speaker 2: It's true. We shall cover that on the show at

1807
01:36:08,560 --> 01:36:12,360
Speaker 2: some point. Yeah, the movie does pass the Bechdel test

1808
01:36:12,479 --> 01:36:17,599
Speaker 2: obviously so many times. But our nipple scale, the scale

1809
01:36:17,640 --> 01:36:21,000
Speaker 2: where we rate the movie zero to five nipples based

1810
01:36:21,000 --> 01:36:24,439
Speaker 2: on examining it through an intersectional feminist lens, I think

1811
01:36:24,439 --> 01:36:28,920
Speaker 2: I'd give this like I think of four. You know,

1812
01:36:29,000 --> 01:36:32,559
Speaker 2: there's areas for improvement as far as like, obviously they

1813
01:36:32,600 --> 01:36:36,400
Speaker 2: wanted to be more inclusive in their casting, but at

1814
01:36:36,400 --> 01:36:39,519
Speaker 2: the expense of like pretending like racism isn't a thing,

1815
01:36:40,000 --> 01:36:45,679
Speaker 2: which felt quite glaring. And again, it's all very cis

1816
01:36:45,680 --> 01:36:50,600
Speaker 2: had characters. It is adapted from source material from the seventies,

1817
01:36:50,640 --> 01:36:53,040
Speaker 2: so it's not necessarily surprising, but it just means that

1818
01:36:53,080 --> 01:36:56,400
Speaker 2: we need more stories, similar stories, but that are more

1819
01:36:56,880 --> 01:37:01,360
Speaker 2: stories inclusive and more representative of yeah, everyone that we

1820
01:37:01,439 --> 01:37:03,080
Speaker 2: have living in society today.

1821
01:37:03,520 --> 01:37:06,040
Speaker 5: And ultimately, if they if they had to make a

1822
01:37:06,080 --> 01:37:09,200
Speaker 5: choice between like doing an all white cast and sticking

1823
01:37:09,240 --> 01:37:13,440
Speaker 5: completely like to the source material and for sure imperfectly

1824
01:37:13,479 --> 01:37:17,040
Speaker 5: having a more diverse cast, but like not telling what

1825
01:37:17,120 --> 01:37:20,040
Speaker 5: that story, how the story changes, I'm I'm glad that

1826
01:37:20,120 --> 01:37:23,360
Speaker 5: they did. I'm glad they did what they did. I

1827
01:37:23,400 --> 01:37:25,519
Speaker 5: wish they could they could have gone further, but like

1828
01:37:26,439 --> 01:37:29,320
Speaker 5: they were still in the right direction for me anyway.

1829
01:37:29,120 --> 01:37:33,000
Speaker 2: Right right direction for improvement. But yeah, I think I'll

1830
01:37:33,040 --> 01:37:33,919
Speaker 2: have it four nipples.

1831
01:37:34,160 --> 01:37:34,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, I agree with that.

1832
01:37:34,960 --> 01:37:37,080
Speaker 5: I think four nipples is perfect, like in terms of

1833
01:37:37,280 --> 01:37:40,240
Speaker 5: content and storytelling, Like I just loved the focus on

1834
01:37:40,280 --> 01:37:45,879
Speaker 5: the three women and their journeys and Margaret's like genuine struggle.

1835
01:37:46,960 --> 01:37:49,679
Speaker 5: I would maybe go three and a half just because

1836
01:37:49,720 --> 01:37:54,040
Speaker 5: of my personal frustration with like no representation of period pain,

1837
01:37:54,600 --> 01:37:56,160
Speaker 5: but they're certainly not alone in that.

1838
01:37:57,200 --> 01:38:01,479
Speaker 3: True, I'm gonna go and be a coward and go

1839
01:38:01,560 --> 01:38:04,280
Speaker 3: three point seventy five and say, hey, I'm right between

1840
01:38:04,280 --> 01:38:07,640
Speaker 3: the two of you. Yeah, I agree, I have I

1841
01:38:07,760 --> 01:38:13,160
Speaker 3: have like my gripes with this movie. But again, it's

1842
01:38:13,160 --> 01:38:17,160
Speaker 3: definitely and almost unfortunately a huge step forward for portraying

1843
01:38:17,920 --> 01:38:21,479
Speaker 3: a version of puberty in a way that like most

1844
01:38:21,520 --> 01:38:24,040
Speaker 3: movies just like don't have the stones to make I

1845
01:38:24,080 --> 01:38:27,320
Speaker 3: have issues with and I'm with Kate on you know,

1846
01:38:27,360 --> 01:38:31,080
Speaker 3: I would rather imperfect and have a more diverse cast.

1847
01:38:31,280 --> 01:38:33,360
Speaker 3: And it's I mean, I know it's messy, but also

1848
01:38:33,720 --> 01:38:38,400
Speaker 3: maybe having more black producers and creatives on your project

1849
01:38:38,560 --> 01:38:42,080
Speaker 3: could help that. But all said and done, I think,

1850
01:38:42,200 --> 01:38:45,600
Speaker 3: like I'm just really glad that this movie exists. I

1851
01:38:45,600 --> 01:38:48,559
Speaker 3: would recommend you know, if you have, you know, a

1852
01:38:48,680 --> 01:38:50,680
Speaker 3: kid in your life that is coming of age and

1853
01:38:50,800 --> 01:38:54,160
Speaker 3: is going to men straight, this is a cool movie

1854
01:38:54,320 --> 01:38:56,439
Speaker 3: to show to them. I agree with Kate that you

1855
01:38:56,439 --> 01:38:59,439
Speaker 3: know that the spectrum of experience isn't shown, but this

1856
01:38:59,560 --> 01:39:01,680
Speaker 3: is a I think it's also like it speaks to

1857
01:39:02,600 --> 01:39:07,000
Speaker 3: the culture. Dare I say that it took fifty years

1858
01:39:07,400 --> 01:39:12,160
Speaker 3: to get this far, like it should not be taking

1859
01:39:12,200 --> 01:39:14,479
Speaker 3: place so far in the past. This movie should have

1860
01:39:14,479 --> 01:39:17,599
Speaker 3: come out in nineteen seventy four, but because it didn't,

1861
01:39:17,920 --> 01:39:21,000
Speaker 3: I think that, you know, this is certainly a step

1862
01:39:21,000 --> 01:39:24,320
Speaker 3: in the right direction, and I feel like it was

1863
01:39:24,400 --> 01:39:27,760
Speaker 3: kind of overlooked in this Oscar season. I know most

1864
01:39:27,760 --> 01:39:32,240
Speaker 3: people bring up Rachel mcadam's performance as the standout, but

1865
01:39:32,360 --> 01:39:35,799
Speaker 3: I just think that in general, movies that are about,

1866
01:39:35,920 --> 01:39:39,960
Speaker 3: you know, young women coming of age are generally over overlooked,

1867
01:39:40,000 --> 01:39:44,960
Speaker 3: overlooked and viewed as you know, kind of frivolous in

1868
01:39:44,960 --> 01:39:46,920
Speaker 3: a way that isn't fair. This is a great movie.

1869
01:39:47,120 --> 01:39:50,960
Speaker 3: I really enjoyed it. Three point seven five nipples, and

1870
01:39:51,000 --> 01:39:53,040
Speaker 3: I'm not giving any away to anyone because this is

1871
01:39:53,080 --> 01:39:54,000
Speaker 3: a movie for children.

1872
01:39:54,880 --> 01:39:59,960
Speaker 2: Yes fair ninety nine percent fresh on Rotten Tomatoes critics score.

1873
01:40:00,120 --> 01:40:02,360
Speaker 2: By the way, this was this is a beloved movie.

1874
01:40:02,520 --> 01:40:06,639
Speaker 2: It's beloved, but also thirty million dollar budget and only

1875
01:40:06,760 --> 01:40:09,760
Speaker 2: twenty one point five million dollar box office.

1876
01:40:09,400 --> 01:40:11,800
Speaker 3: So I think that that has to do with promotion too.

1877
01:40:11,920 --> 01:40:15,080
Speaker 3: I did not see this movie promoted really at all.

1878
01:40:15,439 --> 01:40:17,559
Speaker 3: Same and to be fair, part of the reason this

1879
01:40:17,600 --> 01:40:21,400
Speaker 3: movie didn't exist earlier is because Judy Bloom turned down.

1880
01:40:21,840 --> 01:40:22,000
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1881
01:40:22,080 --> 01:40:24,439
Speaker 3: Yeah, a lot of opportunities to have it adapted, but

1882
01:40:24,600 --> 01:40:26,640
Speaker 3: her reasoning was that she didn't think it would be

1883
01:40:26,640 --> 01:40:33,280
Speaker 3: adapted responsibly. So it's just it's complicated. It's complicated. Also,

1884
01:40:33,400 --> 01:40:36,839
Speaker 3: Hans Zimmer composed the score, which I did not resonate

1885
01:40:36,880 --> 01:40:40,160
Speaker 3: for me at all, but noted. There you go. No,

1886
01:40:40,240 --> 01:40:41,719
Speaker 3: it just sounded sort of generic.

1887
01:40:41,760 --> 01:40:45,800
Speaker 2: Anyways, Yeah, for sure, Thank you so much for coming

1888
01:40:45,800 --> 01:40:47,680
Speaker 2: on the show. Kate, come back anytime.

1889
01:40:48,160 --> 01:40:49,360
Speaker 4: Yeah, thank you for having me.

1890
01:40:49,560 --> 01:40:52,160
Speaker 2: Tell us where we can find you online plug away.

1891
01:40:52,280 --> 01:40:54,879
Speaker 5: Oh my gosh, okay, well, Cramped is a ten episode

1892
01:40:54,880 --> 01:40:59,240
Speaker 5: limited series that's cr amped the last episode. It will

1893
01:40:59,240 --> 01:41:00,960
Speaker 5: be out by the time this episode comes out, so

1894
01:41:01,120 --> 01:41:03,880
Speaker 5: go listen, go binge all ten episodes anywhere you get

1895
01:41:03,920 --> 01:41:07,000
Speaker 5: your podcasts. You can find me on Instagram at Kate

1896
01:41:07,040 --> 01:41:09,479
Speaker 5: Helen Downey full government name, three names.

1897
01:41:10,479 --> 01:41:12,800
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, you're a three name on a three name?

1898
01:41:12,840 --> 01:41:14,920
Speaker 3: Are you a serial killer? Or are you a name name?

1899
01:41:17,080 --> 01:41:19,240
Speaker 5: So far just entertainment, but who knows. I could be

1900
01:41:19,280 --> 01:41:20,200
Speaker 5: a double threat someday.

1901
01:41:20,280 --> 01:41:20,920
Speaker 3: Life is long.

1902
01:41:22,320 --> 01:41:22,800
Speaker 4: And then on.

1903
01:41:22,720 --> 01:41:25,360
Speaker 5: TikTok you can find me at Kate is cramped, and

1904
01:41:25,400 --> 01:41:27,799
Speaker 5: I do a lot more like educational period pain content

1905
01:41:27,840 --> 01:41:28,200
Speaker 5: on there.

1906
01:41:28,479 --> 01:41:32,439
Speaker 2: Nice. You can follow us in all the normal places,

1907
01:41:32,760 --> 01:41:35,639
Speaker 2: on the normal places, especially the best place, I would

1908
01:41:35,640 --> 01:41:39,840
Speaker 2: say is our Matreon mm hmmm, okay, Patreon dot com,

1909
01:41:39,840 --> 01:41:42,320
Speaker 2: slash spectal cast and well, what do we have there,

1910
01:41:42,400 --> 01:41:45,400
Speaker 2: Jamie is it two bonus episodes every month.

1911
01:41:45,400 --> 01:41:47,280
Speaker 3: For the low price of five dollars, as well as

1912
01:41:47,280 --> 01:41:50,519
Speaker 3: access to our back catalog of nearly two hundred episodes

1913
01:41:50,520 --> 01:41:53,280
Speaker 3: at this point, as well as you're joining a community

1914
01:41:53,320 --> 01:41:56,200
Speaker 3: where you get to vote on the movies we cover,

1915
01:41:56,400 --> 01:41:59,880
Speaker 3: and usually we listen, but sometimes we don't.

1916
01:42:00,040 --> 01:42:00,439
Speaker 2: We don't.

1917
01:42:00,560 --> 01:42:02,439
Speaker 3: It's the best way to directly support the show if

1918
01:42:02,479 --> 01:42:04,680
Speaker 3: you're a fan. And if you're out of main feet episodes,

1919
01:42:05,720 --> 01:42:08,559
Speaker 3: it's a little lucy goosey over on the Matreon.

1920
01:42:08,720 --> 01:42:12,840
Speaker 2: It's a fun little lucy moosy.

1921
01:42:12,840 --> 01:42:18,960
Speaker 3: It's yung. Yeah, So you could go and find us there,

1922
01:42:19,240 --> 01:42:22,680
Speaker 3: and that's where we cover a lot of your popular requests.

1923
01:42:23,520 --> 01:42:26,000
Speaker 3: And yeah, the other place to really follow us right

1924
01:42:26,000 --> 01:42:32,000
Speaker 3: now is on Instagram. And with that, shall we we must,

1925
01:42:32,240 --> 01:42:34,600
Speaker 3: we must, we must increase.

1926
01:42:34,360 --> 01:42:39,040
Speaker 2: We must increase our listenership. So tell your friends about us.

1927
01:42:39,080 --> 01:42:41,160
Speaker 3: Perfect ending Bye Bye.

1928
01:42:44,600 --> 01:42:47,880
Speaker 2: The Bechdel Cast is a production of iHeartMedia, hosted by

1929
01:42:47,960 --> 01:42:51,839
Speaker 2: Caitlin Derante and Jamie Loftus, produced by Sophie Lichterman, edited

1930
01:42:51,920 --> 01:42:55,120
Speaker 2: by Mola Board. Our theme song was composed by Mike

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Speaker 2: Kaplan with vocals by Catherine Voss Krassensky. Our logo and

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Speaker 2: merch is just designed by Jamie Loftus and a special

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Speaker 2: thanks to Aristotle Acevedo. For more information about the podcast,

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Speaker 2: please visit linktree slash Bechtelcast