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Speaker 1: But since Lindor, there's like no big hitting prospects of

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Speaker 1: this organization that ever pan out. If they do it

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Speaker 1: somewhere else, here we go.

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Speaker 2: Adam the Bull is back on FT. Host of the

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Speaker 2: Ultimate Cleveland Sports Show. It's a great show. You can

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Speaker 2: find it on YouTube. Host of the Ultimate Cleveland Guardian

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Speaker 2: Show and of the Bullpen podcast Do Noseball. Adam, Good

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Speaker 2: to see you man.

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Speaker 1: How's everything. Good to see you guys, And thank you Scott.

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Speaker 1: And I heard what you just said about the Guardians.

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Speaker 1: You know how they don't spend and we get pissed

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Speaker 1: off about it. I mean I've been getting angry about

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Speaker 1: that for the fifteen years I've been covering this team.

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Speaker 1: But they do have success. They have a really good

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Speaker 1: front office. But the only similarity though with the White Sox,

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Speaker 1: which is really interesting, is that you know David Blitzer,

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Speaker 1: who's much richer than the owner, current owner Paul Dolan.

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Speaker 1: He bought a minority stake in the team a few

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Speaker 1: years back and is supposed to eventually be the majority owner.

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Speaker 1: And even though the Guardians have had a good level

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Speaker 1: of success with Paul Dolan, most of the fans want

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Speaker 1: him out and we want some I know sometimes be

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Speaker 1: careful what you wish for, but we assume that the

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Speaker 1: payroll will go up with Blitzer. But it's been years now,

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Speaker 1: and you just talked about how the White Sox is

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Speaker 1: gonna have this new owner. But it may be a decade. Well,

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Speaker 1: it's been a number of years for the Guardians. We

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Speaker 1: still don't know when Blitzer is gonna be the majority stakeholder.

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Speaker 1: But we all want it to happen because the Guardian's

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Speaker 1: payroll needs to be significantly high, and if it was, man,

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Speaker 1: what a difference it would make With the talent they

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Speaker 1: have in the front office.

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Speaker 2: I agree, the front office talent is exceptional. They have

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Speaker 2: done an incredible job. I know we talked about this

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Speaker 2: over the last few years, and I will say to

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Speaker 2: Cleveland fans, you're not really in the conversation right now.

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Speaker 2: For ownership complaints. You can do it within the city,

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Speaker 2: but when it comes to the national perspective, we can

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Speaker 2: come up with a long list of names to complain

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Speaker 2: about before we get to Cleveland. So they have to

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Speaker 2: deal with what they've got right now. That's all I'm saying.

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Speaker 2: That it is what it is, so I can't add

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Speaker 2: on it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know.

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Speaker 2: I mean, hey, I'm here for it, right. I agree.

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Speaker 2: I'm just saying that I get life perspective. When we

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Speaker 2: talk about the White Sox and the A's and the

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Speaker 2: Pragates and the Rockies, like right, we're easily rattling off

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Speaker 2: named before we even can consider Cleveland's situation. But it

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Speaker 2: is good to hear that maybe eventually they'll be a

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Speaker 2: transition and they can spend a little because Adam, last year,

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Speaker 2: this team goes to the ALCS. This year, I don't

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Speaker 2: give a crap about run differential. The results on the

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Speaker 2: field right now have been good enough to be a

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Speaker 2: playoff contender. So what are you seeing from the Guardians

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Speaker 2: this year? And do you think they can replicate what

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Speaker 2: they did last year? I don't care if it is

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Speaker 2: a different route to get them there. You know, if

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Speaker 2: it's a wild card team and eventually we're seeing them

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Speaker 2: play in an ALDS or an ALCS, do you think

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Speaker 2: that this team's capable of that?

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Speaker 1: I do, and I you know, it's a very different

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Speaker 1: team than last year, even though it's a lot of

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Speaker 1: the same faces. The lineup was surprisingly good last year

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Speaker 1: and they ended up middle of the pack at home runs,

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Speaker 1: which was a shocker, and they haven't hit for as

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Speaker 1: much power this year. The bullpen hasn't been quite as good.

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Speaker 1: It's still really good, but it hasn't been quite as good.

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Speaker 1: Although Classe, who got off to a terrible start, as

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Speaker 1: you know, has been much much better after that really

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Speaker 1: bad start. But I think the difference this year could

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Speaker 1: be the starting pitching. We're used to the Guardians consistently

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Speaker 1: having good starting pitching. They did not have good starting

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Speaker 1: pitching last year. For the most part, I think Tanner Bibey,

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Speaker 1: you know, I've been talking about obviously Tanner Biby and

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Speaker 1: Gavin Williams in the last few years, and I see

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Speaker 1: these guys pitch and the stuff they have, and it's

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Speaker 1: I just think there's no limit to how good those

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Speaker 1: two guys can be. I especially am a huge Gavin

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Speaker 1: Williams guy, and I just think, you know, Biby's kind

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Speaker 1: of really putting it together now, even though he's had

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Speaker 1: a few bad starts here and there. Like you know,

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Speaker 1: with Gavin Williams, he I feel like sometimes he tinkers

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Speaker 1: too much. I didn't play in the big leagues. He does.

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Speaker 1: Two of you three guys played the Big league, so

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Speaker 1: you know, better than me, but he's got such great

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Speaker 1: stuff and I just feel like there are times in

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Speaker 1: games where he's afraid the challenge hitters and he shouldn't

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Speaker 1: be because he's he's so good. It's like he doesn't

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Speaker 1: trust his stuff enough at times, and that has led

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Speaker 1: to his inconsistency and that has led to him not

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Speaker 1: being able to go and deepest into deep, as deep

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Speaker 1: into games as I would like. But I still think,

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Speaker 1: you know, he's a really good at worse number three.

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Speaker 1: And with Shane Bieber making his second rehab start tomorrow

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Speaker 1: in Akron, I mean it's it's trending towards him being

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Speaker 1: back in a month. We know how great this guy

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Speaker 1: is when he's healthy. So maybe unfairly or unfairly, I'm

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Speaker 1: expecting Shane Bieber to be an ACE for the final

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Speaker 1: three months or at least the final two months of

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Speaker 1: the season. Luis Artiz, for all the complaints we made

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Speaker 1: about that trade, he's been very good. Seconi has shown

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Speaker 1: signs of good stuff and Logan Allen is a fifth

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Speaker 1: starter is you know, I don't love him, but he's

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Speaker 1: but he's adequate enough. And I just think the Guardian's

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Speaker 1: pitching they're starting pitching, and ultimately their entire pitching staff

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Speaker 1: can can play with any team in the league. Now,

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Speaker 1: they've got to get better on offense that they're gonna

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Speaker 1: have to make some trades. There's too many holes in

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Speaker 1: the lineup. But I think their pitching staff will give

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Speaker 1: them a chance in the postseason to compete with the

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Speaker 1: Yankees and compete with the Tigers. Everybody else's, you know,

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Speaker 1: kind of mediocre, and the Tigers are playing over their

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Speaker 1: skis a little bit, don't we think.

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Speaker 3: I don't know about that. The American League in general

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Speaker 3: is just kind of meant compared to the National League.

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Speaker 3: So that's not gonna change the Cleveland's not going to

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Speaker 3: the National League until they switched from a two division

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Speaker 3: two division set and no more American League, National League,

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Speaker 3: but that's years down the road.

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Speaker 1: Do you feel like when you.

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Speaker 3: Watch this team day in and day out, you talked

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Speaker 3: about this starting rotation being better.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Do you feel like they need to throw longer into games?

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Speaker 3: And Steven Vote has to stop having such a hook

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Speaker 3: or are you gonna keep rolling the dice that in

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Speaker 3: July and August. This epic bullpen that was epic last

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Speaker 3: year pitched all the way in October is really tired,

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Speaker 3: and it's hired again already this year. They need to

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Speaker 3: step up. Do you think voter will allow that or

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Speaker 3: do you think they're just gonna keep rolling the dice unfortunately?

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Speaker 1: Well, I think I agree with everything you said. They

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Speaker 1: killed the bullpen. Those guys were completely overworked and they

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Speaker 1: were shot by the end of the season, and I

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Speaker 1: am certainly concerned about it. I think the guys will

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Speaker 1: go a little longer as the season goes because they

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Speaker 1: are more capable. But I totally agree that he's had

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Speaker 1: a way too quick a hook. Like last night. Let's

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Speaker 1: say Luis Ortiz get out of that sixth inning. I

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Speaker 1: know he gave up a two out hit, I know

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Speaker 1: Bellinger's coming up. Let him get out of that. I

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Speaker 1: feel like too often he doesn't. And maybe that's the

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Speaker 1: old school mentality that I'm sure you guys have for

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Speaker 1: playing back in the day, But like I want to

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Speaker 1: see these starters getting let him get the third out.

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Speaker 1: When I see a picture end with two thirds of

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Speaker 1: an inning, it drives me nuts. Let him get that

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Speaker 1: third out. I think a lot of the new schools thinking,

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Speaker 1: and I'm all about analytics. I get it. I'm not

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Speaker 1: some idiot who's gonna come on here and say analytics

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Speaker 1: are stupid. No, that would be stupid. But sometimes you

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Speaker 1: got to just let a pitcher grind through and that

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Speaker 1: helps him, you know, in those situations when it matters

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Speaker 1: later in the season and and he's got to learn

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Speaker 1: how to get out of these innings. In terms of

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Speaker 1: Gavin Williams and By and Byby to some degree, although

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Speaker 1: he's getting better, they uh, it's they become too obsessed

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Speaker 1: with the strikeout, I think so much. And the Guardians,

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Speaker 1: even though they got off to a little bit of

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Speaker 1: a slow start this year, are generally a very strong

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Speaker 1: defensive team, and sometimes there's too much you know, uh,

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Speaker 1: not enough challenging it with two outs to try to

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Speaker 1: get that strikeout instead of having that quick getting. That's

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Speaker 1: one of the things that makes class A so great

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Speaker 1: outside of the playoffs last year, in the first few

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Speaker 1: weeks of this year, is that he doesn't get a

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Speaker 1: million strikeouts even with his stuff. He plays, he put

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Speaker 1: they put the ball in play, they get make weak contact,

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Speaker 1: and that's why he has ten pitch innings. So we

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Speaker 1: need more of that. So some of it's on the pitchers.

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Speaker 1: But I think vote yes. I'm with you, Eric. I

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Speaker 1: think he's got to give him a chance to go

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Speaker 1: longer because you can't wear these guys out. And it

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Speaker 1: is happening again this year, and it's gonna kill him

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Speaker 1: at the end of the year again if they if

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Speaker 1: they continue to do this the whole season. I'm hoping

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Speaker 1: with Shane Bieber coming back, you know, obviously, you know

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Speaker 1: at first they're gonna be very careful, but by you know,

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Speaker 1: August September, hopefully he's going seven to seven plus innings

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Speaker 1: and that that'll really help. It will trickle down the

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Speaker 1: line and help them with saving the bullpen a bit.

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Speaker 3: It's not gonna happen as much as you wanted to.

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Speaker 1: It's not gonna happen. No team is doing this. No

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Speaker 1: team they'll do it. No team does this. I'm sorry. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: well I do it. I do it. I got my

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Speaker 1: kids pitching one hundred and fifty down kidding, I don't,

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Speaker 1: I don't know.

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Speaker 4: I don't know. You sound like krust You sound like

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Speaker 4: Krusts and his high school team, all right, throwing us

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Speaker 4: kids one hundred and fifty pitches in three innings.

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Speaker 1: I don't understand, but I'm want to get the beatings.

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Speaker 1: I'm going against the undefeated Teah and we got to

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Speaker 1: hand them their first loss of the year. It's a

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Speaker 1: big game.

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Speaker 4: Oh boy, go get them.

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Speaker 1: Good luck, good luck.

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Speaker 4: But my question is, you can have all the pitching

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Speaker 4: you want, how's this team gonna score runs? I mean,

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Speaker 4: Jose Ramirez, I mean, I know they're doing a little better.

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Speaker 1: Some guys have been better.

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Speaker 4: But can this team score enough runs offensively to win

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Speaker 4: the pitching? The pitching is great, it's been the pitcher

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Speaker 4: has been great for the Guardians forever.

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Speaker 1: But you can't score. How do they score runs? Can

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Speaker 1: we get the nineties lineups to join this team? They'll

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Speaker 1: never look. I was just watching a video, guys. It

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Speaker 1: was like it was like the lineup from like May

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Speaker 1: of I want to say ninety six, might have been

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Speaker 1: ninety seven, and I'm seeing like Manny Ramirez hitting seventh.

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Speaker 1: Jim told me hitting eighth. I'm like, what is going

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Speaker 1: Sandy Alomore hitting ninth. This is crazy that they never

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Speaker 1: won a World Series, But no, they're not gonna hit.

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Speaker 1: First of all, the Guardians drive me crazy. As much

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Speaker 1: as I respect Antonetti and Suurnoff, the Guardian his front office.

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Speaker 1: They're great. I know him. You know, for the most part,

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Speaker 1: they do an excellent job with the prospects. It drives

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Speaker 1: you nuts, like C. J. Kaphis, is there one of

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Speaker 1: their better prospects. He's a first baseman. DH Okay, you

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Speaker 1: got Santana, you got Manzarto. I get it. But they've

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Speaker 1: been playing him in the outfield now for a month.

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Speaker 1: He's he killed it Nakarn at Double A, he killed

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Speaker 1: it Columbus and Triple A. It's a big dude. He's

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Speaker 1: got power. Okay, maybe he's not that good a fielder.

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Speaker 1: I don't care. You you got John Kenzie, Noel's Batten

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Speaker 1: one hundred. He's like the worst player in baseball right now.

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Speaker 1: Do you guys know, Do you guys know the last

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Speaker 1: Guardians outfielder to hit twenty home runs? Not thirty, not forty?

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Speaker 1: Do you know who the last Guardian's outfielder was to

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Speaker 1: hit twenty home runs in a season? Any any guys

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Speaker 1: know that?

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Speaker 3: Benny Rami, tylern Aqlin.

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Speaker 1: Not Tyler Aklin. It's not quite quite as crazy as

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Speaker 1: Manny Ramirez, but it was Michael Brantlee eleven years ago.

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Speaker 1: Give it a single he was an astro or maybe

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Speaker 1: he was twenty twelve. I can't remembers twenty twelve or

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Speaker 1: twenty fourteen now at the top of my head. Whatever.

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Speaker 1: That one year with the Guardians. I mean he played

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Speaker 1: for the for the Indians obviously for a number of years.

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Speaker 1: But they haven't had a guy, one guy, not one

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Speaker 1: hit twenty home runs. This team. Guys do that every year.

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Speaker 1: They haven't had one. Bring up Capus. Let's see what

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Speaker 1: he's got, Chase the laughter's healthy? Can I see him

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Speaker 1: in the big leagues? These are your best prospects. They

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Speaker 1: don't want to call him up and they don't want

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Speaker 1: to trade him either to get veterans. So what the

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Speaker 1: hell are we doing? So that's why I'm roustrating. The

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Speaker 1: fans are frustrated, just letting them marin it.

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Speaker 3: You brought up Ji Kenzie? No, well, big Christmas?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 3: Is he a product of and obviously he's not having

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Speaker 3: a good year. But they try to. They try to

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Speaker 3: get the most value out of out of platoons that

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Speaker 3: they can. You think they're trying to get more value

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Speaker 3: out of something. It's like squeezing water out of a

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Speaker 3: like do they see what they have I mean they

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Speaker 3: had Nolan Jones and they were like, Wow, this Nolan

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Speaker 3: Jones guy outfielder goes off to play for Colorado, hits

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Speaker 3: some banga rangs, then he gets traded back. It's almost

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Speaker 3: like they're not seeing what they've developed starting pitching very

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Speaker 3: well historically in the organization. Do they not see what

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Speaker 3: they have when they have it in a power hitting outfielder,

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Speaker 3: because we're specifically talking about.

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Speaker 1: That, Yeah, I think so. I think they're like a

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Speaker 1: ten of evaluating pitching and developing pitching, and there is

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Speaker 1: zero at developing. It seems like the only hitters that

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Speaker 1: ever pan out with the Guardians, like homegrown, are guys

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Speaker 1: that came out of nowhere. I mean, think about it.

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Speaker 1: Jose Ramirez was not a big prospect that Lindor was.

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Speaker 1: Obviously Lindor was a huge prospect, but since Lindoor, there's

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Speaker 1: like no big hitting prospects in this organization that ever

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Speaker 1: pan out if they do it somewhere else, you know.

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Speaker 1: And yes, they have had real trouble trying to figure

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Speaker 1: out whose power is real who's not. And I feel

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Speaker 1: like often they don't give guys enough of an opportunity.

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Speaker 1: Nolan Jones was a top prospect. They never really gave

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Speaker 1: him a chance. Then they shipped them off. He has

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Speaker 1: the great year in twenty three, struggles last year and

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Speaker 1: he's obviously he has struggled here again Will Benson. You know,

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Speaker 1: it's been up and down obviously with him in Cincinnati,

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Speaker 1: but they didn't give him all that much of a chance. Meanwhile,

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Speaker 1: they they've tried Will Brennan like fifty two times. The

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Speaker 1: guy can't hit. I don't know what they're seeing here.

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Speaker 1: And John Kenzie. I feel bad for the guy. We

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Speaker 1: all love him, we love the nickname. He had a

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Speaker 1: clutch home run in the playoffs last year. I mean,

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Speaker 1: he's a very popular here. But I can't understand why

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Speaker 1: he's still in the big leagues and yet and he's

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Speaker 1: not gonna get better in a platoon like once. You

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Speaker 1: guys know this way better than I do. If you're

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Speaker 1: in a platoon situation and you're playing twice a week

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Speaker 1: and you're in a massive slump, like you're not getting

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Speaker 1: out of that, it's just not happening. He needs to

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Speaker 1: get at bat's regular at bats at Triple A. I

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Speaker 1: just don't get what they're doing.

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Speaker 4: All right, enough fun that the Guardians. I know we're

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Speaker 4: a baseball show, but let me ask you this question.

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Speaker 4: Who's gonna have a higher payroll this year? Your Ohio

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Speaker 4: State team or the Cleveland Browns.

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Speaker 1: It's a good question. I'm trying to think. Uh, I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna say the Browns because the Browns, it's funny, Jawn.

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Speaker 4: They still have the Shawn who's making like forty million

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Speaker 4: by the way they're.

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Speaker 1: Paying, and Miles Garrett. No, Deshawn's making like fifty five million,

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Speaker 1: and Miles Garrett's making forty million, so you're paying roughly

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Speaker 1: ninety ninety five million between those two guys. The Browns

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Speaker 1: for all their failures, and they are an absolute I

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Speaker 1: was gonna be curse, but I can't curse here, so

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Speaker 1: I won't say it. They are just a pathetic organization,

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Speaker 1: just the worst. But their owner the only thing I'll

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Speaker 1: give him credit for because he's a terrible owner, but

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Speaker 1: he does spend The Browns have spent more money, believe

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Speaker 1: it or not, in the last five years than any

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Speaker 1: team in the entire NFL. He doesn't care, he keeps

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Speaker 1: I mean, not doing him any good. They don't win

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Speaker 1: any games, but he spends money, So I will say,

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Speaker 1: the Browns will spend more, but obviously, uh, just because

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Speaker 1: you're not. There's nobody paying fifty and forty million to

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Speaker 1: But yeah, the buck guys are gonna be loaded again

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Speaker 1: and they have obviously a great chance even with a

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Speaker 1: new quarterback, new running backs knew all this stuff. They're loaded.

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Speaker 1: I mean even before Nil, the buck guys were one

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Speaker 1: of the best teams in college football, probably the best

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Speaker 1: team in the country consistently outside of the you know

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Speaker 1: Alabama and then maybe LSU. And now with nil, you know,

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Speaker 1: Alabama and LSU don't have the alum with the deep

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Speaker 1: pockets that Ohio State does rounds.

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Speaker 4: My buddy, my buddy, So thanks, I'm gonna telling me

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Speaker 4: you said that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, who is the buddy? I don't hear that the owner?

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Speaker 1: He said, are your friends with Jimmy?

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Speaker 4: Well, his son in law is a really good buddy,

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Speaker 4: married his daughter. He's the one that when they he's

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Speaker 4: the one that when they go and they do all

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Speaker 4: the stuff. He's the face. It's not Jimmy anymore. It's

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Speaker 4: his son in law that does all the stuff with

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Speaker 4: goel so good.

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Speaker 1: By the way, I'll tell you that when I talk

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Speaker 1: about him and I do talk about him on the air.

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Speaker 1: He your but he probably hates me because I refer

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Speaker 1: to him as the son in law I call him

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Speaker 1: then and uh he he and I he when they

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Speaker 1: first don't bought the team. I'll tell you guys this

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Speaker 1: quick story. When he first bought the team, Jimmy I met.

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Speaker 1: I've drawn a blank on what is his name? Your

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Speaker 1: friend the brother J W Right? So I met with he.

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Speaker 1: We met up at a bar. He and I. It

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Speaker 1: was like an event going or something. He said he

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Speaker 1: wanted to talk business with me. At the time, I

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Speaker 1: was doing a radio show for uh you know radio

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Speaker 1: station called the Fan that we we carried. We had

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Speaker 1: we had the Browns games on the radio, so I

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Speaker 1: thought he wanted to talk to me about he wanted

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Speaker 1: me to do something with the Browns, do whatever. I

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Speaker 1: don't know what he wanted. And he brought up because

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Speaker 1: he's in TV, he brought up something. I can't remember

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Speaker 1: the details that so many years ago, but he brought

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Speaker 1: up me being a player, if you will, I guess

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Speaker 1: on a reality show like Naked and Afraid or something

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Speaker 1: of that. And I'm like, are you out of your mind?

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna put my fat body on naked and afraid

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Speaker 1: nobody needs to see my naked body. I talked on

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Speaker 1: the radio generally now I'm doing TV, which is crazy

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Speaker 1: because I got a face for radio. But I was

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Speaker 1: like apoplectic that he wanted me to be on some

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Speaker 1: stupid I'm like a sports broadcaster. From crying out loud,

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Speaker 1: I'm a professional. You want me to take off my

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Speaker 1: clothes and look like a lunatic on a reality show.

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Speaker 1: I guess if he would have made me enough money,

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Speaker 1: I mean, if there were millions involved, if I was

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Speaker 1: getting that kind of money, I probably would have sold

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Speaker 1: out and did it. But at the time I was

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Speaker 1: offended by it, and again, nobody needed to see me naked.

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Speaker 1: So I turned down that opportunity, but he was pushing

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Speaker 1: for it.

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Speaker 2: There is a show naked coming out.

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Speaker 1: I will I will pass that along.

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Speaker 4: I'm gonna pass that story along.

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Speaker 1: I mean, but that could be a good show potentially,

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Speaker 1: like a bunch of fat sports broadcasters, not naked, but

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Speaker 1: on on a desert island, like you could have, you

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Speaker 1: know me, Jason whitlock in there, let's get you know,

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Speaker 1: you know whatever. I'm not going to name the other names.

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Speaker 1: I don't need to have. Everybody in the business, ain't me.

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Speaker 1: So get us all out there. We'll like, we'll like

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Speaker 1: beat each other up on a desert island. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I love that.

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Speaker 2: I would be I would take the Jeff prost Roll,

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Speaker 2: the Survivor host, I would I would eat that up

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Speaker 2: and big marathons with everyone all day long. I'm all

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Speaker 2: for it. Adam, this was enjoyable, always entertaining. Appreciate the

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Speaker 2: time and good to catch up with you and everyone.

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Speaker 2: Check out Adam on Ultimate Cleveland Sportshow, Ultimate Cleveland Guardian Show,

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Speaker 2: and Best in the Bullpen Pod. Give him a follow

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Speaker 2: at Adam the Bull and you can see where to

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Speaker 2: catch all of that. Thanks man, appreciate you.

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Speaker 1: Thanks guys. Take care,