Speaker 1: Well, Jake Valachi, we are the authority R and ladies
Speaker 1: and gentlemen, what's going on? I am Tank, I'm Ja Valentine,
Speaker 1: and this is the R and B Money Podcast, the
Speaker 1: authority on all things are and being thank God. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't do my bird man hands too often.
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't. I don't run them together too often,
Speaker 1: you know, because you know, I'm kind of legendary. But
Speaker 1: when the legend, the legendary gets deeper than my legendary,
Speaker 1: who get different? You just don't listen to what people
Speaker 1: say they don't know about about you and may get
Speaker 1: it out your mandus, y'allless see they don't know about
Speaker 1: this here this man said that you make some noise
Speaker 1: for Mr John Fildon. First of all, thank you, thank you,
Speaker 1: thank you. You know what I mean, thank you so much.
Speaker 1: I remember I remember back in the day listening to
Speaker 1: um one of my favorite artists of all time, baby Face,
Speaker 1: and I remember a record coming on and I'm like, man,
Speaker 1: baby facing, add a little yeah, add a little thank
Speaker 1: to his vocal and they're like, that's not baby Face. Yes, yeah,
Speaker 1: that first nome we wanted, we wanted to you know,
Speaker 1: kind of play with him, play with him. And when
Speaker 1: we saw they saw you that video, that video, the
Speaker 1: girls was like, yes he is. All black women said,
Speaker 1: yes he is, Yes he is. Um, you've been killing
Speaker 1: for a long time. Man. Like what we like to
Speaker 1: do is we like to start at the very beginning,
Speaker 1: like you know, from the first time you felt like
Speaker 1: or somebody told you that you had something. You know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying, because these gifts for us start earlier.
Speaker 1: They started church and they started all these other places.
Speaker 1: And so we want to we want to go down
Speaker 1: memory lane, get get some real history on you, and
Speaker 1: then we want to get into the nuances of the
Speaker 1: winds and the losses. You know what I'm saying, as
Speaker 1: you as you continue to take this journey the shore.
Speaker 1: So at the beginning, when did when did you know? Well,
Speaker 1: when did somebody tell you? I think it was the
Speaker 1: eighth grade Talent show, talk about it, eighth grade Talent
Speaker 1: Show and Elliot Junior High. You know, I'm performing, you know,
Speaker 1: first of all, to be able to make it into
Speaker 1: the talent show, to audition, and you know, to to
Speaker 1: get chosen to be Okay, you're good. Let's we want
Speaker 1: to see you made it. So now here's your chance. Boom,
Speaker 1: You're on stage, You're performing in from your friends for
Speaker 1: the first time. All your friends are kind of okay,
Speaker 1: that's what's up. John kind of can sing all right,
Speaker 1: you know. So it was the first time that I
Speaker 1: ever really had that that sense of fearlessness on stage
Speaker 1: that this is what I do and I'm happy to
Speaker 1: share it with you guys. But it's really not about
Speaker 1: what you think, because I'm up here because I love this,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. It's the first time I
Speaker 1: ever getting the flex really, you know. But you have
Speaker 1: been singing though, I have been singing and playing. So
Speaker 1: I was programming all my songs on this you know,
Speaker 1: this keyboard that basically was like a workstation, you know,
Speaker 1: and I could just record everything. I had like a
Speaker 1: little four track. So I was making demos fully like
Speaker 1: you know, by the time it was middle school, high school,
Speaker 1: well at the end of uh my eighth grade years
Speaker 1: when I started really really produced. Yeah, I was basically
Speaker 1: my my eighth grade year was when I started making
Speaker 1: my first demos. So by ninth grade, I was fully
Speaker 1: and so who gets you the studio? So my my
Speaker 1: pops loaned me the money to do it. Yeah, he loaned.
Speaker 1: He told me, you're gonna pay me every single okay,
Speaker 1: okay at what age? Now, So this was probably around well,
Speaker 1: I was basically like every see I come from a
Speaker 1: family musician's okay, so for like gifts, you know, every
Speaker 1: maybe three or four years, they would say, what do
Speaker 1: you you know? What do you what are you into now?
Speaker 1: As far as your music? What do you what are
Speaker 1: you trying to do? And I would say, I don't
Speaker 1: really want to do the drum set, you know, like
Speaker 1: that it's too loud. No, you can't have a drum
Speaker 1: set in the house. But he thought, you know, let
Speaker 1: me go ahead and take one step. I hear, you know,
Speaker 1: he sees me trying to sound the chords out on
Speaker 1: the piano and trying to you know, because my mom's
Speaker 1: a piano teacher, so as I was always like watching
Speaker 1: her and just kind of I wanted to teach myself though.
Speaker 1: So I was playing by and he saw that he said,
Speaker 1: let me bind him his keyboard. So he got me
Speaker 1: my first little cassio guy, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: And that was how I kind of cut my teeth
Speaker 1: with playing. You know, you're in the house with a
Speaker 1: piano teacher. But you don't want lessons. Didn't want lessons.
Speaker 1: I wanted to kid, you know, I wanted to hear
Speaker 1: what I wanted to play, because it wasn't I wasn't
Speaker 1: being taught, Like if I was going to study with somebody,
Speaker 1: they weren't teaching me how to play the way I
Speaker 1: wanted to. So I was learning by listening to like,
Speaker 1: you know, Jimmy jam Terry Lewis and baby Face and
Speaker 1: know what I mean, and the songs that they were
Speaker 1: right when new addition, Bobby Brown and all this. I
Speaker 1: was sort of playing these chords trying to figure out
Speaker 1: how to play them at least. So yeah, but um,
Speaker 1: the you know, the eighth grade, you know, making all
Speaker 1: those demos and playing it from my friends and getting
Speaker 1: their approval. I think that was really what made me
Speaker 1: kind of go all out. You know, by the ninth grade,
Speaker 1: I really didn't want to do it on my own.
Speaker 1: So I started forming these groups, these R and B groups.
Speaker 1: I was like, I swear we were coming me bad.
Speaker 1: Before coming, we had a black guy, Filipino guy, the
Speaker 1: United Nations, and it was it was it was, it was.
Speaker 1: It was a less situation where harmony. You know, it
Speaker 1: was um my first time really even having like a
Speaker 1: group of guys I went to church with, you know,
Speaker 1: you know found you know what the church vibes wasn't
Speaker 1: the gospel choir and getting into gospel choir and um
Speaker 1: in high school joining the gospel choir. I think that's
Speaker 1: really what pushed me vocally forward. Was they were like,
Speaker 1: all right, you know, John, come out, you know, come
Speaker 1: out that throat, get get into that chest. You know
Speaker 1: what I mean. You showed me a lot about that.
Speaker 1: When you know that I told you that. You know,
Speaker 1: it's it's so much influence in this game. You know
Speaker 1: that has taught me so much. I'm a I'm a
Speaker 1: fan of this music. I'm a study you know, I
Speaker 1: study this music um with with a passion and uh
Speaker 1: and a love for it. You know. It's a true
Speaker 1: love for for what I do and for what other
Speaker 1: others do. It's it's no really getting it wrong. It's
Speaker 1: just like certain stuff you love a little bit more
Speaker 1: than others, you know. And I want to go back
Speaker 1: and touch on stuff you said when you said, you know,
Speaker 1: as we as Jay jumped into not having the lessons
Speaker 1: and because they weren't teaching you, you know, the music
Speaker 1: in a way that made you feel like you were
Speaker 1: learning the things you were here, right, And so you know,
Speaker 1: I was. I was in the same vote where you know,
Speaker 1: they would try to send me to this music teacher
Speaker 1: who was trying to have my hands resting on middle
Speaker 1: C and I'm like, I'm like, but you don't hear
Speaker 1: what Chucky Booker is doing. You uh, you know, you
Speaker 1: don't hear what the Mississippi mass quire I just did
Speaker 1: with like that's that's not in here, right. And and
Speaker 1: so with with teaching music at that point, still being
Speaker 1: so structured and you having to come from a classical foundation,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying, Like, I love what's happening today,
Speaker 1: like we have. I'm actually teaching my son and my daughter.
Speaker 1: They learned at piano, but they're learning things that they
Speaker 1: want to learn, right, And so they're learning theory from
Speaker 1: you know, the Harry Potter song or you know, from
Speaker 1: the Spider Man something or in the there. That's how
Speaker 1: they're learning their theory, you know what I'm saying. And
Speaker 1: so but when we were growing up, nobody was teaching
Speaker 1: theory like that. The songs that you heard nobody was saying,
Speaker 1: well let me show you what that looks like on here,
Speaker 1: because that would have been a that approach right there
Speaker 1: would have sent us into a completely different space, you
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, and understanding how to really like
Speaker 1: we can play you know what I'm saying. We have
Speaker 1: our ear and we can feel in all of those things,
Speaker 1: but if we could score it, oh yeah, right, like
Speaker 1: you know, Tim Carmon, I've heard of that. Tim Carmen
Speaker 1: is uh to Karman is nothing short of amazing. He
Speaker 1: was Eric Clapton's empty for the longest. Probably steal this,
Speaker 1: but Tim Carmen can feel it, he can read it,
Speaker 1: and he can write it. Yeah, it's amazing man, He's
Speaker 1: I mean, and it's very it's rare that guys can
Speaker 1: do both. Yeah, right now. I I kind of straight
Speaker 1: away from being taught stuff because I kind of I was.
Speaker 1: I had a really short attention span for for um
Speaker 1: for learning things that it was much more of a
Speaker 1: hands on type of person. And let me you know,
Speaker 1: I started my first core was a fifth um and
Speaker 1: so I'll probably like middle C or something like that,
Speaker 1: you know, and the G and just kind of combined
Speaker 1: those and kind of go all up and down. You know,
Speaker 1: I was five or six years old when I was
Speaker 1: doing this, and so combinations of different you know, fifth
Speaker 1: and so and you know, and these were my first
Speaker 1: ways of being I was five years old man. So
Speaker 1: they watched me and he said, we can't show you
Speaker 1: how to do that. That's something that we can't show
Speaker 1: you how to do. Improvisation is not something that you
Speaker 1: can really teach somebody. It's like it's it's just it's
Speaker 1: like having the charisma as an actor as well, you know,
Speaker 1: like you can't be shown that. I mean, you can
Speaker 1: see somebody act and do a really great job and
Speaker 1: say yeah, like that, but in terms of being shown okay,
Speaker 1: this is how you show charisma. It's like when you
Speaker 1: kind of comes from inside, see will, it just looks
Speaker 1: Brad Pitt. It just I'm just saying, you know, it's
Speaker 1: a trip. Because no one showed me how to how
Speaker 1: to come from inside like that. It was more I
Speaker 1: feel like, if that was a secret, how did they
Speaker 1: do that? I wanted to reverse the engineer how they
Speaker 1: did it. So my my whole thing was having templates
Speaker 1: for songs that were my favorite songs and trying to
Speaker 1: approach the music the same way, like how did that? Okay,
Speaker 1: let me find that chord. Now that I got that chord,
Speaker 1: where does that sound come from? I out of sound
Speaker 1: is similar. Now where's that bass sound? What's the snare?
Speaker 1: That's the snare sound? Let me let me sample that snare.
Speaker 1: You know, it's just you just kind of like you
Speaker 1: learn to. I learned to try to really personify the
Speaker 1: people that I admired so much. And that's kind of
Speaker 1: the reason why we, you know, we went so hard
Speaker 1: while I went so hard with them showing the influence
Speaker 1: the baby face had for me on it, because don't
Speaker 1: go don't go there yet. I mean that's what you
Speaker 1: you know, you brought that up originally with me sounding
Speaker 1: just liking on that that that's someone to love record.
Speaker 1: So that's that's really the main thing, is to be
Speaker 1: able to come so far having so much admiration for
Speaker 1: the art, but not only the art, the people who
Speaker 1: are the best at doing it at at the time creating.
Speaker 1: You're paying the most attention to them. It's like that's
Speaker 1: your dream list of people that you want to get
Speaker 1: to and then you you make that move and it's
Speaker 1: not even that you think that it's not gonna happen.
Speaker 1: It's just some more like I gotta make that happen.
Speaker 1: That's somebody I have to So was that before you
Speaker 1: get to that? Did you win the contest? Yeah? I know,
Speaker 1: it's so crazy. This was so crazy about when you
Speaker 1: said Chucky Booker. Guess who was the Talent show judges
Speaker 1: Pasadena's own troop the group Truth by Chucky Booker not Yea. Yeah, man,
Speaker 1: So you know they were there. They were I remember
Speaker 1: they all had white on and they're all sitting there
Speaker 1: and like I'm I'm performing in front of them, just
Speaker 1: like okay, I'm feeling good, right, and it's like, all right.
Speaker 1: The winner of Best Vocal Performance is John that's so
Speaker 1: your first contest middle school? Yeah, judged by the legendary
Speaker 1: the legendary Trip Polished and we're from the same town. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. It was really special to
Speaker 1: have that in, you know, in my archive of reason,
Speaker 1: you know, as far as just something I can pull
Speaker 1: back every time I see Steve Russell. You know, I'm
Speaker 1: just like, man, come on, you were the first one
Speaker 1: to really believe in me. Man, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: So even before baby Face I appreciate you, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean. So so now you have now you're
Speaker 1: making demos, Now you've got groups, championships, you got a championship.
Speaker 1: Like you're shaking the moving in terms of your development. Now,
Speaker 1: when do you get that first look, for that first
Speaker 1: call from you know this this place that's getting ready
Speaker 1: to become a major. How do you get to baby? Like?
Speaker 1: What are these steps? I was, I was my senior year.
Speaker 1: Well you know, I hadn't really I was recording and
Speaker 1: producing and building up my um my you know, my
Speaker 1: my archives are all my music um and I was
Speaker 1: also producing local talent around the area. So I had
Speaker 1: kind of built my name up in the industry in
Speaker 1: terms of being somebody who was you know, up and
Speaker 1: coming and you know you should got here. This guy's
Speaker 1: got tracks, you know what I mean, writes and produces
Speaker 1: on stuff and these things. And so you know, I was,
Speaker 1: I was dropping my my you know, CD and cassette
Speaker 1: at the time off at Motown, m c A at
Speaker 1: Warrener Brothers, and I had some interests ruined. So you know,
Speaker 1: you kind of get that buzz and our get to
Speaker 1: talking and different people start getting talking, so you kind
Speaker 1: of you hear from people. Um, I had a guy
Speaker 1: who was helping me kind of walking my music around.
Speaker 1: And I remember I was still in high school. I
Speaker 1: was still in my senior year of high school, and
Speaker 1: I was checking myself out of class because I was eighteen.
Speaker 1: So I was like, all right, I gotta go. You know,
Speaker 1: I'm officially, you know, an adult now. So so I
Speaker 1: sign myself out of class and I go straight down
Speaker 1: to Hollywood and I'm like, I walked into this little
Speaker 1: hole in the wall office because they told me, you know,
Speaker 1: they wanted to hear my music. And it was baby Face,
Speaker 1: but it wasn't the Face. It is actually his his
Speaker 1: new label that he was gonna try to do with
Speaker 1: his wife, called Evan's Record Group. So yeah, so they
Speaker 1: they heard it and it was it was a rap.
Speaker 1: I mean it was like as soon as he heard
Speaker 1: the music, he was like, is that you? And I
Speaker 1: was like, yeah, that's that's my voice, you know, that's
Speaker 1: that's I did all the music. I will, you know,
Speaker 1: you know, program the drums, played, the chords, did the
Speaker 1: baseline arrange, the backgrounds, The whole thing is on me.
Speaker 1: And he was just like he's like, you're trying to
Speaker 1: be an artist. And I was like, no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: you didn't go in there will be an artist, I said,
Speaker 1: I said, not necessarily. I was like, I'm not trying
Speaker 1: to be famous. I was like, I just want to
Speaker 1: be a part of what you do. Can I be on?
Speaker 1: You just want to go on the staff? Could not
Speaker 1: be your Darryl Simmons, Yeah, yeah, yeah, I saw these names,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean on the credits. I was like,
Speaker 1: I just want to be one of the team. You know, listen, kids,
Speaker 1: they used to be this thing. It's called credits. I know.
Speaker 1: You guys just download things now you don't know who
Speaker 1: the broke, but we used to actually buy the c
Speaker 1: ds and open them up. You look at the pictures
Speaker 1: with a who who whoever. They were thinking like, oh,
Speaker 1: that's probably his girlfriend. The way he said that he
Speaker 1: wrote the songs, yea, And that's for you to go
Speaker 1: in there and mention other amazing writers to him, like
Speaker 1: that doesn't even really happen that. I was so excited
Speaker 1: to meet like people that I had had so much
Speaker 1: admiration for. I met Dwayne Riggins from Tony Tony, Tony
Speaker 1: and Low Town. He was working as an n R
Speaker 1: at the time, and I dropped my CD and stuff.
Speaker 1: He was really into it. I met Benny Medina, you know,
Speaker 1: interess in the industry, um, and he was really trying
Speaker 1: to sign me. I mean he was meaning all the legends.
Speaker 1: So it was crazy, it was. It ended up being
Speaker 1: a bitty war between Bennie and and Sony Epic and
Speaker 1: baby Face. You know it's his his label over Epic.
Speaker 1: But I knew, you know, my heart was with working
Speaker 1: with the people that I wanted I had always wanted
Speaker 1: to get with, you know, as far as not only
Speaker 1: just baby Face, but everyone that he has worked with,
Speaker 1: like Tony Braxton. What I mean, the list goes on.
Speaker 1: So yeah, my one of my first things he said,
Speaker 1: put a list together, everybody that you want to produce,
Speaker 1: and I want to see all this suside like after
Speaker 1: seven New Edition coming back, all these people, Tony Braxton.
Speaker 1: He literally put me in the studio within you know,
Speaker 1: a year or two, um, with every single one of
Speaker 1: those groups, and I was able to produce records for
Speaker 1: all those people. Yeah, man, TLC, I mean that's incredible. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it was really really uh, I mean the first year
Speaker 1: of my of my career. N I had tour of
Speaker 1: the entire world. I went on a world tour. I
Speaker 1: wanted to all the way Southeast Asian went down to
Speaker 1: you know, you're up all of you know. I didn't
Speaker 1: go with Face. I went as a sony Epic Artists,
Speaker 1: and they wanted me to be internationally before the record
Speaker 1: after this, right after Um some of those love had
Speaker 1: come out and Pretty Girls the single yeah right. What's
Speaker 1: the first record that you in Face did together? Was
Speaker 1: that somewe That was the first one. Actually, the first
Speaker 1: song I believe was um, pretty Girl. We recorded that first,
Speaker 1: but but it was it was just recorded first UM,
Speaker 1: and I couldn't believe when you know, I called him,
Speaker 1: It's like I got something, I got mine for you,
Speaker 1: check it out, And so he played over the phone
Speaker 1: and then he just started to sing the melody for me,
Speaker 1: and he the lyrics he had the first verse, and
Speaker 1: I was just like, oh my god, that's my song,
Speaker 1: Like it's the keyboard that I'm used to hearing, you know,
Speaker 1: on all of his and so I'm just so hype.
Speaker 1: I'm like, are you kidding me? This is for me?
Speaker 1: You know. I was a big fan of Tevin Campbell too,
Speaker 1: you know, so like production. Yeah, you know, so his
Speaker 1: production was was all baby Face at that time that
Speaker 1: can we talk big record, I'm ready. All that was
Speaker 1: was Kenny. So this kind of had that same, that
Speaker 1: same swag to it, you know. Um For me, it
Speaker 1: was a really romantic, sexy record, but it was minimal.
Speaker 1: There wasn't a lot to the track. It was. I
Speaker 1: was really surprised on how simple the track was, you know,
Speaker 1: almost reminded me of like Prince. The way the drums had.
Speaker 1: The drums was like like some Prince type ship. But
Speaker 1: if anybody knows Face or Kenny, my baby Face, you know,
Speaker 1: all of those, all those things. He's very heavily influenced
Speaker 1: by Prince. He loves Prince. Oh yeah, red Light specially.
Speaker 1: He loves he like he loved Prince record Red Light Special.
Speaker 1: That's what I was waiting when I was you know,
Speaker 1: I watched Kenny work with Michael Jackson, so I've seen
Speaker 1: that happen, but I really and I was incredible and
Speaker 1: we're not We're not just gonna be but he would
Speaker 1: not just gonna jump over that. I never saw Princeton
Speaker 1: and baby Face work together. Okay, okay, wait, wait, you
Speaker 1: were there during the Michael Jackson Baby Face sessions. Um. Actually,
Speaker 1: I was living with Kenny at at his house. He
Speaker 1: had me move into his house when I first signed
Speaker 1: to him. He's, yeah, I'm gonna show you the power
Speaker 1: of Sony epic. And you know, we fly on the
Speaker 1: lead Jett out to New York and meet Tommy Matola. Okay,
Speaker 1: and you know, I'm I'm out there. I'm just like
Speaker 1: why He's like, when we get when we get back home,
Speaker 1: you're gonna move in. And and so I was able
Speaker 1: to work with him on Madonna. I was working with
Speaker 1: him on Michael Jackson. I mean, it was crazy. And
Speaker 1: then he's like, and then you're gonna work with my brothers.
Speaker 1: After seven, He's like, there's like five or six I
Speaker 1: want to use the yours for them. I was like
Speaker 1: five or six songs. I was like, are you kidding me? Yeah,
Speaker 1: we all became like brothers. And Kevon and yeah, my god,
Speaker 1: shout out to Cavon. Kevin did me too, greatest favor
Speaker 1: of all time. When I first moved to l A,
Speaker 1: I was working with Face as well early on and
Speaker 1: through Damon Thomas and you know what I mean, and
Speaker 1: met Kevan and Kevin was one of my mother's favorite singers. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: he could see Kevan sang Happy Birthday for my mother. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I will never ever ever forget that that range and
Speaker 1: you don't miss up there, don't miss you stopped it
Speaker 1: with the range. Now huh oh man, you can go
Speaker 1: you can go there. I can cheat, I can stretch.
Speaker 1: You're like trying to touch the rim, Like, yeah, I
Speaker 1: know how to cheat my rage. So all of this
Speaker 1: is in your first year, the couple of years. It's crazy.
Speaker 1: It was so crazy to experience so much Grammy nomination,
Speaker 1: off someone to love and everything. It was I'm a
Speaker 1: baby and I don't I don't know that this isn't
Speaker 1: it's not normal, but it's like I didn't know how
Speaker 1: to process it all because it was all happening so fast.
Speaker 1: So the main thing that I really knew that I
Speaker 1: wasn't gonna do was become Hollywood and fake and be,
Speaker 1: you know, worried about fame and letting that control what
Speaker 1: I wanted my goal to be because I was still
Speaker 1: the musicians, still into the craft of songwriting and producing.
Speaker 1: So even though they wanted me to be an artist,
Speaker 1: now okay, now we got we got this. Look I
Speaker 1: want you to put this on. We want you to
Speaker 1: talk like you know, we want you to not talk
Speaker 1: like this, but we want you to speak with these people.
Speaker 1: We want you to have this type of They put
Speaker 1: me with an interview coach and all this, and you know, yeah,
Speaker 1: you have a whole thing, and yeah, yeah, you learned
Speaker 1: it all very fast and quickly, you know, and it's
Speaker 1: just a lot to do at eighteen. You know, I
Speaker 1: was only eighteen, And so did you even finish your
Speaker 1: year at school or did you were you? I was,
Speaker 1: so did you get on the road? So actually I
Speaker 1: was probably nineteen to come to think of it, because
Speaker 1: you're right, I was, because this happened, um the summer
Speaker 1: of after I graduated high school. This is when it happened. Summer.
Speaker 1: It was crazy because my my pops told me. He
Speaker 1: was like, you know, you know, um, what college is
Speaker 1: you been thinking about? I was like, oh, no, I'm
Speaker 1: getting a record deal, you know, I'm not going to college.
Speaker 1: And he's like, I hope so, because if if you're
Speaker 1: living here, you're going to college if you don't get
Speaker 1: a record deal. And I was like, oh no, don't worry.
Speaker 1: So I came home after meeting Kenny and Tracy, and
Speaker 1: I was like, I got a record deal, Dad, I'm
Speaker 1: not going to college. And that was wasn't an easier
Speaker 1: conversation because you came from a family of musicians, you mean,
Speaker 1: because that's a tough conversation for some Yeah. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: because I mean honestly that it's sort of like the
Speaker 1: NBA for for musicians. You know what I mean. You
Speaker 1: just got drafted in the NBA basically, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean, signed to Sony Epic through Baby Facing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it was. It was a real deal, and I mean
Speaker 1: it was an interesting thing because I did it on
Speaker 1: my own, which felt really really good. It felt very
Speaker 1: which is really rare. Yeah, it was. I mean, it
Speaker 1: wasn't a high power manager. I mean, you're talking about
Speaker 1: the homie who just was with me for moral support,
Speaker 1: walking in there with me, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: We were working together, but it wasn't like a you know,
Speaker 1: he was still cutting his teeth in the business. So
Speaker 1: I was like, you know, we're both trying to get
Speaker 1: on you mean, so yeah, it's a beautiful, beautiful time
Speaker 1: and I gotta get to this. I want to get
Speaker 1: to this nuance and there's someone to love record, such
Speaker 1: an important record because you know, listening to this record
Speaker 1: as a baby Face fanatic, yeah, you know, as this
Speaker 1: song is happening, I'm like, man, it sounds like sound
Speaker 1: like baby Face guessing even I just took all the
Speaker 1: base out, my boys, my baby Face got some new Hi.
Speaker 1: What's you know? What he would do with me? He
Speaker 1: would say whenever I tried to thick him up, because
Speaker 1: I have a bunch of different tonalities I do with
Speaker 1: my voice, and when I would try to go thicker
Speaker 1: with the scene, he said, no, no, no no, no, just
Speaker 1: make it like make it real sweet, like just make
Speaker 1: it sweeter, you know what I mean. I'd be like, okay,
Speaker 1: you know, like easy, and I'm just like okay, So
Speaker 1: he left you to interpret what that man, what that
Speaker 1: did for me was baking. Okay, I'm gonna do show
Speaker 1: him how I do him because it's like I was
Speaker 1: impressing the girls and that school. So so you know,
Speaker 1: here's my chance now to show that, you know, I've
Speaker 1: retained some of that sauce that you you know, you
Speaker 1: showed me how to make, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: and so like, yeah, that's just show him a little
Speaker 1: bit of what what he already you know is about
Speaker 1: and I think that all of the great, the great
Speaker 1: artists that have worked with baby Face, they all did
Speaker 1: that baby you know, Johnny Gil was able to do
Speaker 1: that um. And so to me, I picked up on
Speaker 1: the theme behind so that his his swag was baby
Speaker 1: Face has a certain box. Since it's it's abo, it's
Speaker 1: a certain box to baby Face. Yeah, well I what
Speaker 1: I got. What I got very similar thing that Print
Speaker 1: had um In terms of his he um, he almost
Speaker 1: spoke his his words before he sang them. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: what you know what it was like the beginning of
Speaker 1: yeah you you know what I mean? Sn yeah, and
Speaker 1: and it brings you, it brings you in. So what
Speaker 1: he did with me was when we did pretty Girl,
Speaker 1: he was like your lips, you know what I mean, Like,
Speaker 1: let's make that first line the line that makes people
Speaker 1: want to listen to the song. And yeah, he taught
Speaker 1: me so much. Man. It was like little things that
Speaker 1: I I didn't know that would be so affective that
Speaker 1: ended up being like defining factors and how I produced
Speaker 1: and from the way I stacked my vocals and things
Speaker 1: like that too, you know, harmony and melodies and yeah,
Speaker 1: it's just it's weird, like I feel like we're related
Speaker 1: in some sense because I'm I've we both got you know, sprinkled.
Speaker 1: That's that that similar thing. Yeah, yeah, it's called not
Speaker 1: many of you guys out there. Yeah you know what
Speaker 1: I can. You know, I'm gonna let y'all toasted a man. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know you you wait till we get to what
Speaker 1: you have done for me man influence wise, my gosh.
Speaker 1: So the first album, first album, first album, Bro, what
Speaker 1: a kicking in the door. And what's crazy is that,
Speaker 1: you know, black people are really protective of R and
Speaker 1: B music, or of soul music culture, of the culture
Speaker 1: culture for sure. And it felt like to me, at
Speaker 1: least from my standpoint, you were welcomed with open arms
Speaker 1: because from work at one I was like, he got it.
Speaker 1: Oh man, thank you, And that's just not me, Like
Speaker 1: that's that's the culture. It wasn't interesting time, wasn't it,
Speaker 1: Because there wasn't a lot of of my template as
Speaker 1: an artist, you know what I mean, There wasn't a
Speaker 1: lot of that going at the time. I mean, we
Speaker 1: had George Michaels, and we had pop popular versions of
Speaker 1: soulful esque kind of guys. I think that the one
Speaker 1: person that makes me think so R and B who
Speaker 1: wasn't black was Team Marie. Of course, you know she was.
Speaker 1: She's staple in R and B music, and growing up
Speaker 1: hearing her really kind of sealed the deal for me
Speaker 1: in terms of like really realizing that music is music
Speaker 1: and if we love it, we love it. It It doesn't matter.
Speaker 1: You know, you can love it and be whoever you are.
Speaker 1: And but it's about like how much do you love it?
Speaker 1: You know, I can't fully get the work my knowledge
Speaker 1: about To my knowledge, you are the only R and
Speaker 1: B artist with a Tupac feature. Yeah, I don't know,
Speaker 1: Like he may have actually done some other stuff that
Speaker 1: may have never come out. Maybe something that's gonna say something.
Speaker 1: I was on death row shout out to Danny Boy.
Speaker 1: Amazing artist, amazing singer. You had a Tupac feature, bro,
Speaker 1: and so you got you got. It's my badge of honor.
Speaker 1: Really is man, it's something to feature. It's it's it's
Speaker 1: it's something that is so so you know, amazing in
Speaker 1: my heart, but it's at the same time it was
Speaker 1: it was a very sad thing to experience to know
Speaker 1: him as a person, you know, and to shake his
Speaker 1: hand and to be in the studio and have the
Speaker 1: comaraderie that we did and smoke together and drink together,
Speaker 1: and and and talk about our relationships in our life,
Speaker 1: you know, and put that in the record because how
Speaker 1: old are you at this point? And I'm you know,
Speaker 1: probably one at that point, two maybe, so, Yeah, he
Speaker 1: was really putting the once again. Someone was sprinkling that
Speaker 1: that magic on me and I was just like, wow,
Speaker 1: I can't believe this. This is amazing, you know, because uh,
Speaker 1: I was already a fan and I met him. How
Speaker 1: do you want a video? Shoot? He did, invited me
Speaker 1: down to that. How do you want how you want
Speaker 1: a video? How do you want it? How does it
Speaker 1: fit Joe to see? Yeah? What is Johnny? J Casey
Speaker 1: and Joe? Joe? I remember it was swaying Tech from
Speaker 1: you know, yeah for the you don't for the bed. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Tech was on the bus and the two parks on
Speaker 1: there and he wild and he had the Hunters. There's
Speaker 1: this Python stakes. It's all kinds of work for y'all
Speaker 1: who don't do this? Boy, don't you don't know? Don't
Speaker 1: you act like that, I don't know, shout out to
Speaker 1: have the hunter? Yeah, matter when I was eighteen and beyond.
Speaker 1: You know it was. It was very interesting here in
Speaker 1: l A. And you know, you could talk for a
Speaker 1: little bit because I've never gotten that car service she
Speaker 1: tried to send me. But you know what it was.
Speaker 1: But it's a crazy It's a crazy day, man, it's
Speaker 1: a crazy day. I met him. I met him. We
Speaker 1: played him some bets freestyle right there in front of me,
Speaker 1: and I knew we was going to do something. I
Speaker 1: was like, we just if I get in studio with him, man.
Speaker 1: So two weeks later he hit me up and it
Speaker 1: was at Canam Studios. He always worked at this one studio. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and we actually had a room there years after only
Speaker 1: Studimarion album there. Yeah, only studio I've ever seen who
Speaker 1: They had metal detectives before you got in and a
Speaker 1: security guard at the thing need the guns at the
Speaker 1: front and the safe. I was just like, okay, like
Speaker 1: it's still blass and there. Yeah, I mean place I've
Speaker 1: ever seen. Did you Did you produce that one? No?
Speaker 1: That was Johnny J god rest his soul. Man, he's
Speaker 1: amazing producer, producer. She doesn't really get his props like
Speaker 1: he should, you know what I mean. So That's why
Speaker 1: I make sure to always mention Johnny j Man, you
Speaker 1: know he's and also Ronnie King is part of that too.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of great players on that that song.
Speaker 1: Johnny Taylor. To me, it reminded me of Marvin Gay record.
Speaker 1: When I heard the track, it reminded me of like
Speaker 1: the Midnight Love era when he was doing sexual healing,
Speaker 1: and it was like it had that you know, you
Speaker 1: know that that the rim coming back at you like
Speaker 1: get like reminded me of shot there or something that's
Speaker 1: you know. It was. It just it was so smooth
Speaker 1: to me. It was interesting because I was so you know,
Speaker 1: um amped to work with him. I wanted him to
Speaker 1: to you know, I wanted to blast off on one
Speaker 1: of my songs, on one of my tracks. So I
Speaker 1: played him some songs and you know, it was like,
Speaker 1: all right, cool, then let me see what you have,
Speaker 1: you know, and then he played me that track and
Speaker 1: it was, let damn what I was talking about. I mean,
Speaker 1: I had all the gear ready to produce and NPC
Speaker 1: and then and all the you know raps and all that.
Speaker 1: Damn all this equipment. The track is ready, let's go.
Speaker 1: So we put that down on the reel from the Dad,
Speaker 1: just the two tracks, and I started just bobbing behind
Speaker 1: the board and all that, and I'm just like, like
Speaker 1: I started immediately going with that melody. He was the
Speaker 1: one to fill in the words it's all right baby,
Speaker 1: because because it's there in your eyes, like he was like,
Speaker 1: he went full RB. He went full on it. And
Speaker 1: then when I forgot how the melody went because I
Speaker 1: was kind of going doing other things, how'd I go? How? Then?
Speaker 1: How the help go again? I was like, I don't know, man,
Speaker 1: how did it go again? He's like, girl, list all right?
Speaker 1: I was like, okay, that's going to booth lay the hook?
Speaker 1: Forget how the hook? This? How goes? Man? Now? That
Speaker 1: ain't right? Girl? And something right? I'm like, So he
Speaker 1: produced the box and then when I started doing too
Speaker 1: much now, I'm hey, hey, hey, hey, I need you
Speaker 1: to feel this. John Man like go back to the
Speaker 1: top and I just want you to feel it. And
Speaker 1: then some podople walk in the room and disturb the
Speaker 1: energy or something like that. He would be like, yo, man,
Speaker 1: sit down, man, you know that's it that that that
Speaker 1: isn't there and that's y'all being there. And like I
Speaker 1: just was like are you kidding me? Like he showed
Speaker 1: me like so much love y'all, Like it was man
Speaker 1: on time one time for two time, Yes, yes, yes,
Speaker 1: producing vocals, remembering the hook, singing the hook and believe
Speaker 1: it though, he was because he was that kind of passionate.
Speaker 1: It was passionate he was. He's like, you want to
Speaker 1: hear after we got our song done, he was like,
Speaker 1: you want to hear something else I'm working on. I
Speaker 1: was like, oh, let's let me check it out. He
Speaker 1: takes me right over. He's got the other room book
Speaker 1: right next door, and he's in there and he already
Speaker 1: laid one verse of California to live and die in
Speaker 1: l A. And then he's gonna just take his lyrics
Speaker 1: and he goes in there and he p's the second
Speaker 1: verse on on me and I'm like, right in front
Speaker 1: of me, he just does it, And I was like,
Speaker 1: did that just happened that you just did that right now?
Speaker 1: And he's like yeah, man. I was like. Then he
Speaker 1: goes he does another track and does it exactly the
Speaker 1: same tour. It was like, you know how when you
Speaker 1: double your vocals and you you just stick it, it's
Speaker 1: just exactly. It sounds like one vocal. That's how he
Speaker 1: doubles his vocals, bro the pitch. Everything that was perfect.
Speaker 1: So yeah, he there's nobody like Tupac. I still believe
Speaker 1: if he was alive today, the industry would be different
Speaker 1: like it would there would be a lit There was
Speaker 1: a lot of soul that he brought, a lot of
Speaker 1: um spirituality that he brought. It didn't have to have
Speaker 1: a religion connected to it for it to be spiritual.
Speaker 1: It was it was about a human thing. And he's
Speaker 1: gonna test you to the core who you are as
Speaker 1: a human by the things he says and the things
Speaker 1: that he stands for. So if you don't like it,
Speaker 1: that's okay. But this is where he stands and this
Speaker 1: is where he's at. So meet him over where he's at,
Speaker 1: and you're gonna be transformed. Because ever since I met Tupac,
Speaker 1: I was transformed. I was. I think he puts he
Speaker 1: put some stripes on on the side of me, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean, And he fully decorated like soldier
Speaker 1: ready to go into the world and represent the culture
Speaker 1: and do everything. I'm I've been doing that for twenty
Speaker 1: seven years, you know what I'm saying. Um, So I'm
Speaker 1: just I'm so blessed man to have had that experience. Real,
Speaker 1: I don't ever take it for granted that yeah, that's crazy,
Speaker 1: but we got the we got the Devil, Yeah yeah
Speaker 1: we did. Man. Let me tell you this guy, how
Speaker 1: influential you are. Let me give you your flowers more
Speaker 1: than because I'm telling you. When I first smit you,
Speaker 1: I just thought, what an incredibly humble guy who's a
Speaker 1: one stop shop, you know. And I relate to that,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. I relate to someone who
Speaker 1: has a personal feeling that they can express themselves, whether
Speaker 1: it be a beat maker or a lyricist or but
Speaker 1: you do it all, you know. So it was really
Speaker 1: it was really humbling for me to have you like
Speaker 1: what I was bringing to the tables, dig the track
Speaker 1: and dig the everything. You were like, yo, let me
Speaker 1: get on that. And I was like, bro, like this
Speaker 1: is crazy. So we did. The song Stronger, Stronger every
Speaker 1: Day back in two thousand four ended up being the
Speaker 1: title track of my album. Um. Basically that that that
Speaker 1: that was like represented the strength that I was trying
Speaker 1: to show at that time as an artist to be
Speaker 1: resilient through whatever the industry was gonna tell me. What
Speaker 1: is it? Whatever, don't kill you, make you stronger, right,
Speaker 1: you know, so to have you assist me on that
Speaker 1: like that Lately the first single from the album Lately.
Speaker 1: Everybody heard that and it was so hip hop and
Speaker 1: it was so that that was done by Brains the
Speaker 1: building all the time building. He used to see you
Speaker 1: all the time up there with the damon and then
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. So I was like, all right, Tank,
Speaker 1: you know, all right, I'm gonna see you. And then
Speaker 1: Jeromee you you you actually sold your truck to my
Speaker 1: manager at the time. Um, you actually you let him
Speaker 1: take over the least or something like that. You remember
Speaker 1: that when you said it was crazy, It wasn't you.
Speaker 1: It was a dope ass Burgundy that it was a
Speaker 1: street truck for sure. Yeah it was. It was like
Speaker 1: you have to call somebody, they come pick up. He
Speaker 1: had the Burgundy. John. I was like, I got that
Speaker 1: custom pain. Yeah, that's nobody had that. It was a
Speaker 1: street truck. I said, my cousin, he's gonna bring the
Speaker 1: car to you and then you just get him the payments.
Speaker 1: I was like, okay, I don't ask no questions. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this guy is cool, you know, what I mean, so,
Speaker 1: because you know, that was my family and everything. He
Speaker 1: was helping him out. So that was dopen and I
Speaker 1: hadn't even met you yet. And then we did. We
Speaker 1: did uh Lately, and I heard, you know, the vocal
Speaker 1: you stacked the vocals and you I mean, you're that's
Speaker 1: his voice voice on the whole hook of Lately. I
Speaker 1: didn't even want to stack over him because they didn't
Speaker 1: want to. I didn't want. I wanted people to know,
Speaker 1: like this is the background, like he's featuring on here
Speaker 1: with me basically, you know, and it was it just
Speaker 1: worked so well. And then when baby Face hurt it,
Speaker 1: He's like, I gotta get on there. I gotta help
Speaker 1: right the bridge. Let me get the bridge, and so
Speaker 1: he put his backgrounds on the bridge. So I got
Speaker 1: baby Face, come on, man, if you and loving you
Speaker 1: can't I been you gotta understand what that means, Like
Speaker 1: that is that's a that's a heavyweight moment for me. Um. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So you're on two songs on that. Where did you
Speaker 1: where was it was? Was it an album release you
Speaker 1: had in Hollywood? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, yeah, remember that that
Speaker 1: was a good time. I mean, you were just you know,
Speaker 1: it was it was it was easy, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying. It's like when you tap in with like
Speaker 1: minded people, it's just it's just easy. He was like,
Speaker 1: he's like my cousin, you know what I'm saying. Like
Speaker 1: like we had like we had been doing it spiritually.
Speaker 1: We had probably already been connected, you know what I'm
Speaker 1: saying in an alternate universe, just already prepping us for
Speaker 1: the moment, you know, in this phase. Like it's the
Speaker 1: same way with me and Jay, Like it was just easy.
Speaker 1: Like but the vo first song we wrote together was
Speaker 1: a hit your your voice. There's no one like you, man.
Speaker 1: And I've heard people try to sign don't like you,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying, And right away I'm going down.
Speaker 1: He's trying to sound like Tank, you know. And that's
Speaker 1: something when you have your own thing that you've put
Speaker 1: your stamp on, you know, singing. Baby Face has got
Speaker 1: his own thing. So when I started to sound like him,
Speaker 1: you knew I was trying to sound like baby Face, right,
Speaker 1: I had to form my own style and and and
Speaker 1: really you have a yeah, time you got to that
Speaker 1: second album. By the time you got to that second album,
Speaker 1: That's why I asked about the first one. Yeah, the
Speaker 1: second album, I really found my legs. But it's interesting
Speaker 1: because this is how it ties into tank. Is that
Speaker 1: moving on past the second album, in the third album,
Speaker 1: still singing in that kind of thinner texture quality. I
Speaker 1: hadn't really filled my voice out or played with the
Speaker 1: whole idea of taking it deeper into my um, sticking
Speaker 1: out the tone a little bit instead of being so
Speaker 1: then and breathy when h h and then put vibrato
Speaker 1: behind it. This is a whole another voice, and I
Speaker 1: found that voice in my live show by singing out.
Speaker 1: But when I heard him singing, I said, this guy
Speaker 1: he's because when I heard Johnny gil for the first time,
Speaker 1: it was a thick tone, right, and he's one of
Speaker 1: my favorite all time singers of all time. But when
Speaker 1: I heard your voice, I was like, here's a thicker tone.
Speaker 1: But this guy could really sing. This guy can really
Speaker 1: like I mean, he could sing Mary had a little
Speaker 1: and it'll be like he just you know, his tonality
Speaker 1: is just so I know that you are the catalyst
Speaker 1: for artists like you are the number one influence for
Speaker 1: Sam Smith. I mean number one influence for I mean
Speaker 1: for me. I You're up there in my top five
Speaker 1: all time favorite singers. Bro Like, honestly, um, when I
Speaker 1: when I heard you, I started to try to play
Speaker 1: with that little it, you know, in terms of like
Speaker 1: let me because when we did um, we did lately, Um.
Speaker 1: I don't think I approached that with the same tonality
Speaker 1: that I did the other records. I was like a
Speaker 1: pitty young thing, sexy younger. I mean, you know, it's
Speaker 1: a little bit more in there. And then started playing
Speaker 1: playing with it even more. And then you know, you
Speaker 1: hear that album and you're like, okay, John, John's growing
Speaker 1: up a little bit. You know. Yeah, But I think
Speaker 1: that that's really cool when you and you can find
Speaker 1: yourself and others or something that you relate to and
Speaker 1: others and then that ends up being a strong point
Speaker 1: for you. That's that's always been the gift of music. Really.
Speaker 1: It's like, you know, knowing that we have other things
Speaker 1: to do, other things to learn. There's more to it
Speaker 1: than just where we're at right now. Like somebody, you know,
Speaker 1: I'm still learning today, like the young kids are teaching
Speaker 1: me too. Sure the tracks, how we can innovate still
Speaker 1: single page is a lot of the you know, the
Speaker 1: cultures that have always sort of done this kind of
Speaker 1: these kind of rhythms are now like the African and
Speaker 1: the Latin and all that is aging now it's like
Speaker 1: it's all. It's all like if if you had to
Speaker 1: have a proudest moment in R and B, if you
Speaker 1: have to just pick one, like let's I'm sure you
Speaker 1: have many, but if you just had to pick one
Speaker 1: just for just for the sake of the show, I
Speaker 1: will say, you know, the moment that I was performing
Speaker 1: very recently, I think it was two thousand eighteen m
Speaker 1: at the Soul Train Awards when they allowed me to
Speaker 1: play someone to Love and they don't know, back to
Speaker 1: back and then I brought out Donald Jones and he
Speaker 1: did his thing, killed it and um but that Foremans
Speaker 1: particularly was I just saw something in myself that had
Speaker 1: never really seen a maturity, a seasoned kind of veteran
Speaker 1: that had really kind of been waiting for that moment.
Speaker 1: And here's the moment. And there's so many artists I
Speaker 1: know that have so many of those moments. They can
Speaker 1: look back, look at this award show, look at this award,
Speaker 1: so look at it. I don't have that, you know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. My award shows have been very you know, minimal,
Speaker 1: So it's like when I got my my shot like that.
Speaker 1: The other one was in two thousand thirteen. I did
Speaker 1: it with Bobby Caldwell. That was an you know, to
Speaker 1: be on the stage with him someone it shares the
Speaker 1: same walk, but very earlier, you know, a lot a
Speaker 1: lot earlier. And I think that was even it was
Speaker 1: very telling. Like getting back to what I said about
Speaker 1: white artists doing R and B music, it wasn't really
Speaker 1: accepted yet. So do you feel like do you do
Speaker 1: you feel like to a certain degree your music was
Speaker 1: to R and B to be fully like, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe moved into a pop space cross stole like which
Speaker 1: is the reason why I was no longer on Epic Records,
Speaker 1: because they tried to put me with David Foster and
Speaker 1: Diane Warren and do the song there was a bilingual song.
Speaker 1: Maybe we could get an international kind of more of
Speaker 1: an appeal type of things. A song called to a
Speaker 1: more you know what I mean. It was beautiful record,
Speaker 1: but it's not my wasn't one of my choices for
Speaker 1: the album. That was I was we here doing records
Speaker 1: with nas and you know, producing records with with with
Speaker 1: with with you know, O dB and just blaze and stuff.
Speaker 1: So I was in a totally different energy, you know,
Speaker 1: than than than than that. So they tried to cross
Speaker 1: when they when they tried, I said, okay, I'll go
Speaker 1: to the studio with David Foster and Diane Warren. But
Speaker 1: you know, it's the kind of hangar it's like, oh gosh,
Speaker 1: you're so black, you know, it's just like it's like
Speaker 1: that I thought you were like a black guy. First.
Speaker 1: I was like, you work with earth Wind and fire
Speaker 1: work with did not expect you to be on that
Speaker 1: Like honestly, that was a disappointment when I when I
Speaker 1: when I met Dan Dyane Warren and she said that
Speaker 1: to me, I was like, that's not that's not soulful
Speaker 1: like for to say that to someone, it's just not.
Speaker 1: So next time Dyane Warren, I see you, you're probably
Speaker 1: gonna be like, yo, I don't like that. You told
Speaker 1: people about that about it, that was that was what
Speaker 1: you said on Twitter. I'm on the wall. It's like
Speaker 1: a quote of she's a soulful but you know you
Speaker 1: said that, you know, you know you said and I
Speaker 1: kind of I was just kind of like, okay, but
Speaker 1: you just want to stay stay true. You wanted to
Speaker 1: stay true with just the music you love. That's it.
Speaker 1: And I don't want people to like really bring that
Speaker 1: up anymore. Like the fact that I'm like like I
Speaker 1: I that's something that actually is a very annoying thing.
Speaker 1: Was something makes that seem like that has anything to
Speaker 1: do with anything. It's like, let that go, because now
Speaker 1: it's be twenty seven years of doing this, Like, let's
Speaker 1: make music. I have nothing to prove anymore. I already
Speaker 1: proved it, so there's nothing to do anymore excepted show
Speaker 1: people I still got it and I still make music.
Speaker 1: My music now if you give it a chance, it's
Speaker 1: just as good as it was back then. If anything,
Speaker 1: I think I'm doing it better just because I've learned
Speaker 1: so much and there's so much more to me as
Speaker 1: a as a as a as a man. Knowing what
Speaker 1: I want to say and how I want to say it.
Speaker 1: Now I can kind of like really lean into the
Speaker 1: curves and really, you know, I'm I'm I'm you know,
Speaker 1: controlling the narrative, you know, and I always have been.
Speaker 1: But I think that for a lot a lot of times,
Speaker 1: it was a lot of pressure just stay within this
Speaker 1: perimeter of what we felt was what they felt was
Speaker 1: you know, appropriate for someone of my my racial background,
Speaker 1: and ultimately, did you lose your deal off of that?
Speaker 1: I went. I went against the grain working with Tupap.
Speaker 1: I went against the grain working with Guru, and I
Speaker 1: work with the people that I had admiration for. I
Speaker 1: was like, I knew who to go to. Whether it
Speaker 1: was a successful move, They're like, that's not commercial rap.
Speaker 1: That's like, why don't you get with l L or
Speaker 1: something like that'd be cool too if L else down,
Speaker 1: I do it, But right now gurgles down. And I'm
Speaker 1: a big Gang Star fan, So you know, I know
Speaker 1: it doesn't mean anything for you for me to work
Speaker 1: with Just Blaze, But Just Blaze is a hot producer
Speaker 1: right now making all the you know, the Rocket Feller
Speaker 1: stuff and and everything else. So why not work with Juice?
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying. The Joe Budden record, with
Speaker 1: the jump Off record, I was like all all over that.
Speaker 1: So I wanted to be in the studio with those guys.
Speaker 1: And so if I had a budget, I was gonna
Speaker 1: spend the money the way I wanted to. I wasn't
Speaker 1: working with the people that they they didn't see the
Speaker 1: vision of me working with tripal requests. You know, I'm cool, relaxed.
Speaker 1: I had to show them this is this is how
Speaker 1: we're gonna move at least head mohammed about powers like
Speaker 1: these guys they this is real hip hop. They if
Speaker 1: people see that this is authentic, they're not gonna question it.
Speaker 1: It's not gonna be about my race. I'm not gonna
Speaker 1: be about all that. It's gonna be about the music.
Speaker 1: So let's make good music man. You know. But I
Speaker 1: kind of had to show him because when I first
Speaker 1: turned in the you know, they are you still down
Speaker 1: with Tupac and all that? How are you gonna? Oh
Speaker 1: my god? They fought They don't know. Huh. You see,
Speaker 1: they're they're getting mad at me now and they try
Speaker 1: to like tweet and be like on something like John,
Speaker 1: that's not true. We loved. They don't know we loved.
Speaker 1: Are you still down there? Became you loved it with
Speaker 1: no shade throne. Honestly, this is just the way it happened.
Speaker 1: When we turned that record in. It wasn't nobody calling
Speaker 1: me talking about this is a hit. When he died
Speaker 1: two weeks later, God rest his soul. He passed two
Speaker 1: weeks later after the record comes out there two weeks later. Bro,
Speaker 1: the last thing my man said to me when I
Speaker 1: was leaving was he's like, all right, brother, don't waste
Speaker 1: your time. Don't don't waste your talent. Now, if you're
Speaker 1: not doing three songs a day, you ain't really doing it.
Speaker 1: So because I watched him literally get down like that
Speaker 1: and just like, okay, man, all right, bro, love you man.
Speaker 1: And it was like three in the morning, I'm driving
Speaker 1: from Tarzana back to Pasadena after drinking and smoking by myself.
Speaker 1: I'm sitting there crying with the window down, like because
Speaker 1: I'm so happy, you know, and so like to to
Speaker 1: get that news when I was in the studio two
Speaker 1: weeks later that he had got shot again. I was like, well,
Speaker 1: he's gonna make it because he's Tupac, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean. And so he wasn't here and he was
Speaker 1: still on life support, and uh yeah, we just we
Speaker 1: just we had just such a all the air of
Speaker 1: wind just taking all out of everything that was doing,
Speaker 1: sucked out of me, you know what I mean. So
Speaker 1: it was like now, what so now the labels like, oh,
Speaker 1: let's put the Tupac song out and I'm like no,
Speaker 1: and so you know what I mean, and then all
Speaker 1: of a sudden, no, we believe in this party. We
Speaker 1: think this is gonna be a record. So it was
Speaker 1: almost like a cool yet year of having that like
Speaker 1: and so it had to get leaked. It was it
Speaker 1: was a DJ who out of Atlanta, I remember who
Speaker 1: played it without asking No, He's like now they got
Speaker 1: to hear it, and as soon as they got leaked,
Speaker 1: it was just like it was all and they had
Speaker 1: to put it out. But ship wasn't giving up the
Speaker 1: rights to Tucacs, so I had to go to a
Speaker 1: phoene and uh, Phenie stuck up for me. She's like, no,
Speaker 1: my son played me Are You Still Down? He loved
Speaker 1: that song, and you know it was it was one
Speaker 1: of his favorite songs that he did because he didn't
Speaker 1: play me a lot of his music and he played
Speaker 1: me that song. He was proud of that. So she
Speaker 1: named his first album that she put out after his death,
Speaker 1: are You Still Down? It was like a compilation of
Speaker 1: a lot of records because that was the last song
Speaker 1: that he did. So yeah, man, that was to have
Speaker 1: that kind of like hit me like that. It was
Speaker 1: a lot to inherit that, you know, in terms of
Speaker 1: the burden that that would represent. He wasn't there to
Speaker 1: vouch for me anymore. It's like putting out a song
Speaker 1: with you really record with it studio, right, you know
Speaker 1: where's Tupac John? You know it's like what I mean,
Speaker 1: So it's it's been a lot, but it's nothing better
Speaker 1: on the great moments. We've got some rm B questions
Speaker 1: for you, Jim. You're thinking, I think I need a refill.
Speaker 1: You like it. I think I've never had that before.
Speaker 1: That's like vanilla. So I've always want to notice before,
Speaker 1: you know, before we can get to that. What's the
Speaker 1: b oh Man make me go country y? Yeah? Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: never another reason why somebody knows what the V stays for.
Speaker 1: My last name is Buck, like the dollar bill. Okay, yeah, okay, Bucks,
Speaker 1: that's that's yeah. I could have been that Johnny Bucky.
Speaker 1: You need something you need? You would have definitely been
Speaker 1: a country singer. If you're da Johnny Buck, John Buck.
Speaker 1: My real name is Johnny. Your real name is yeah right, yeah, Jonathan,
Speaker 1: are you john? I'm Johnny Johnny, Yeah, I'm Johnny Jonathan,
Speaker 1: I'm Jonathan H. J O n Ah, Yeah, makes sense,
Speaker 1: makes sense. Okay, Now I'm back man, so good to
Speaker 1: see you. Yeah, the big man. HM. So come on, chief.
Speaker 1: What you got for questions? Questions for it? Looks for
Speaker 1: this R and B. I'm in the zone. R and
Speaker 1: big guy right here. He's a guy. Guy, he's a guy. Um.
Speaker 1: Top five favorite R and B artists all time, all times. Well,
Speaker 1: I mean, here you go, okay, um, okay. Well let's
Speaker 1: say Marvin Gaye, Stevie Wonder, you know, Michael Jackson. That's
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. And I gotta I gotta mention Stokely.
Speaker 1: I gotta say Tank you know what I'm saying. I
Speaker 1: gotta say that's that's, that's that's you made John B
Speaker 1: stop five B. Yeah, he's been cooking. I mean, I mean,
Speaker 1: and the reason why I say top five is because
Speaker 1: if this is sort of the order that I discovered, well,
Speaker 1: you know what I will say, even before Stokely though,
Speaker 1: it is Johnny Gil. I mean, it's it's a hard
Speaker 1: toss up between Stokely and Johnny Gil because Johnny Gils
Speaker 1: had to discover very legendary career Johnny Girl discovered first.
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna lie before breaking my heart. It was
Speaker 1: my mind. What I'm saying, put on that red dress,
Speaker 1: some on, put on that race. I still I still
Speaker 1: do that both of those songs in my set, like
Speaker 1: I have to show to show the the lineage and
Speaker 1: where you know where it comes. Yeah, okay, alright, that's
Speaker 1: a that's a great list I appreciate. And that's where,
Speaker 1: like I said, when I found my tone, that's when
Speaker 1: I when I heard your voice. Brother, That's what I mean.
Speaker 1: So I gotta give you a flowers were not uh
Speaker 1: top five R and B songs? Oh okay, Well, that's
Speaker 1: always been a hard question from me because there's a
Speaker 1: lot of eras of R and B. So I have
Speaker 1: to go back to my favorite era, which is which
Speaker 1: is the the eighties and nineties era, but like mid
Speaker 1: mid eighties and um, I would say Kenny Stand the
Speaker 1: Rain is probably my number one of my favorite R
Speaker 1: and B song. Um and Never Keeping Secrets by baby
Speaker 1: Face is one of the best written songs and produced
Speaker 1: songs like it's it's just such a great it's just
Speaker 1: the one he wrote. That's when I basically came into dude.
Speaker 1: Do you know that that was my entrance to the
Speaker 1: music industry. I got to play that little part dude,
Speaker 1: no face, but that was my first job for him,
Speaker 1: was to play behind him in his band. Okay, so
Speaker 1: like what dude, but he got the Soul Train Award
Speaker 1: that year for that song and you and he allowed
Speaker 1: me to play that that said. Uh so you know
Speaker 1: there was a there was a whole year of being
Speaker 1: part of his squad that I didn't wasn't you know,
Speaker 1: it wasn't even John B. I had Jonathan B was
Speaker 1: my name at that point on my on my demos,
Speaker 1: Jonathan I still hadn't dropped the the you know, the
Speaker 1: half of my name. But yeah, okay, so let's get
Speaker 1: back to the rain. Never keeping secret And this is
Speaker 1: just kind of off the head of I said, never
Speaker 1: keep it secrets because, like I said, that's the whole story.
Speaker 1: Me cut my teeth in the industry, um um breaking
Speaker 1: my Heart uh in condition absolutely one of the greatest
Speaker 1: songs from the arrangement the music never going Away live
Speaker 1: band music And when was that ever, like other than
Speaker 1: Earth Went in Fire and and and stuff like that
Speaker 1: in terms of ballads. But it just like you know,
Speaker 1: how reasons It's like, yeah, it's just just got that
Speaker 1: horn thing and it's very memorable. Yeah, I mean, everybody
Speaker 1: start going crazy. You're spilling drinks. I mean exactly as
Speaker 1: soon as I do that, they know right away, Oh
Speaker 1: that's pretty brown. Yeah, that's up there a big time.
Speaker 1: I mean, why not say my my mind because it
Speaker 1: is one of the like, it is one of the
Speaker 1: greatest written songs, and talk about uh person to find
Speaker 1: what it feels like to be grown even though I
Speaker 1: was so young. That's a very grown up, very grown
Speaker 1: up of that. The way that it sounds, it's very direct.
Speaker 1: The drums track on that is so I mean, it's
Speaker 1: so just the m is that ken, it's so classics,
Speaker 1: like you know, and it was and it was I
Speaker 1: won't say a life saver, but it was the defining
Speaker 1: moment for Anny Gil coming out of new edition because
Speaker 1: rub you the right way. We were gonna we were
Speaker 1: going to accept it because it was Johnny Gil. It wasn't,
Speaker 1: but it wasn't. That was a hell of a stroke.
Speaker 1: What would you say, stroke? You have the dad Rod
Speaker 1: the man. It was like, I was like, we'll accept it.
Speaker 1: But then when that I want to be your fan friend. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you do this to me when time aging yeah, Okay,
Speaker 1: that was hot. Okay, I got I got one for you, Okay, Alexander, Ohneil,
Speaker 1: don't you do it? Sun Show, Sunshine, sun Touch, be
Speaker 1: with Day with Sunshine. They knew had them things, man
Speaker 1: knew had them things. Man, I can never give myself away.
Speaker 1: Who's with him next to her? Those movies beaching now
Speaker 1: for my love? When that's why, that's why. Okay, So
Speaker 1: let's do this. Let's make up, let's make up. Let's
Speaker 1: make an R and B voltron. We just we just
Speaker 1: got a new nuance added to the to the arm voltron.
Speaker 1: So this is what we're gonna do. It's it's vocals,
Speaker 1: it's styling, it's it's what do we call it? Emotion?
Speaker 1: We got emotion now and performance. We're gonna take these
Speaker 1: four things and build an artist. We're gonna start with
Speaker 1: the vocals. Who are you taking the vocals from? Oh
Speaker 1: my god, that's so hard. Um, Marvin Gaye, Marvin Gaye's vocals,
Speaker 1: Marvin Is it can be someone that's that's not Marvin's. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think that's honestly my favorite vocalist because I think
Speaker 1: it was the subtleties of his swag. It's just like
Speaker 1: Michael Jackson was a very rhythmic person. All that stuff
Speaker 1: along with all that the smoothest girl, closure run very
Speaker 1: just He's got so much texture to his voice. But
Speaker 1: I think what made him so amazing was the rhythm
Speaker 1: behind it, what made Marvin so its a very similar thing,
Speaker 1: but he was not as not as much of an
Speaker 1: aggressive rhythm person as much as almost accompanying himself like
Speaker 1: an instrument. There were multiple songs the guitar. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like like like a part do the horns and
Speaker 1: oh you know, just be like he's doing the horn
Speaker 1: parts and he's doing so you'd hear a vocal on
Speaker 1: the left side. It's almost like that. He was the
Speaker 1: first one to do that, right, I mean, and now
Speaker 1: that's all over our music now. Yea, So those equivalents,
Speaker 1: that's one of my favorite things that you do. I
Speaker 1: love your answer tracks. I love your main vocal that
Speaker 1: you're doing, but all these these answer things flying, yes,
Speaker 1: the flying just the compliment. Nobody sings like that, telling
Speaker 1: you man, Nobody sings like that. Bro. When I first
Speaker 1: heard Sam Smith that, I thought, there's a tank fan.
Speaker 1: There's a thing you know, spit me. Come on, man,
Speaker 1: you don't even sing like that no more. I got
Speaker 1: so many calls and tweets he doesn't. He kind of
Speaker 1: went away from a female now you know. They thought
Speaker 1: that that was my record. Everybody thought that, oh, Tank
Speaker 1: out a new record. That. Oh. I was like, I
Speaker 1: do oh a couple of and then when I heard
Speaker 1: the record, I was like this, yeah, yeah, you say that.
Speaker 1: He sent you a text. It was like we talked.
Speaker 1: We talked on man and man. Do you know who
Speaker 1: I recently made a mean acquaintance too? That was just
Speaker 1: a huge I should have mentioned him because he's a
Speaker 1: huge influence as well as Maxwell I met. I met
Speaker 1: him very researchly at the Diddy party in Vegas, and uh, man,
Speaker 1: it was a really special moment to just shake a
Speaker 1: hand and look a person in the eye and be
Speaker 1: like yo, man, you thank you. And likewise it was similar.
Speaker 1: He's a fan of music. He knows like as much
Speaker 1: as you, as much as Maxwell looks kind of like
Speaker 1: he's in his own world and kind of separated me
Speaker 1: because I mean, I think for for me growing up,
Speaker 1: Maxwell was always like this mystical character, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying, Like he had our brushed. He just brushed
Speaker 1: his tea. He was just set that all he was
Speaker 1: just in a difference. You know, I'm gonna brush my
Speaker 1: teeth beautiful song. Was you think that like he's just
Speaker 1: offen to his own thing and doesn't need to worry
Speaker 1: about the rest of the world. But he knows he's
Speaker 1: paying attention. He's paying attention. He's a fan of music,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. That's what I appreciate producers.
Speaker 1: I mean, come on, that shows a lot of tastes
Speaker 1: and a lot of Already. Okay, so we got the
Speaker 1: vocals from Marvin. Now we need to get the styling.
Speaker 1: What do you want your artists? Who do you want
Speaker 1: your artists to look? It's time to get fly. It's
Speaker 1: time to get fly. Oh, I mean it's who I mean? Wow.
Speaker 1: Let's let's say just because for me, it's kind of
Speaker 1: like I kind of uh, I stole a lot from
Speaker 1: what was baby Face and a hit, you know, the
Speaker 1: door kind of a little bit of that vibe, and
Speaker 1: then the clean essence of like wearing kind of like
Speaker 1: cleaner kind of upscale clothing. Back then, I loved I
Speaker 1: loved the deal style. I love baby and I was
Speaker 1: very GQ, very g Q and It wasn't what we
Speaker 1: were afraid when I saw him live. It was he
Speaker 1: did three suit changes in his show, and I thought
Speaker 1: it was very fitting. It just it just worked how
Speaker 1: he hit it with swag. I was like, that's how
Speaker 1: your voice. And they faced Tony Braxton show. You know
Speaker 1: what I mean. I'm sitting here, I'm watching Tomorrow Braxton,
Speaker 1: little baby, sixteen year old Tomorrow Braxton singing backgrounds for
Speaker 1: you know, and I'm going, wow, okay, this is I'm
Speaker 1: then I see her grow up to be this artist,
Speaker 1: you know. But I watched them. That whole thing happened
Speaker 1: like from the very beginning. I caught the end of
Speaker 1: I caught I caught the riding, the way of breathe,
Speaker 1: breathe again. He was writing his I watched him make
Speaker 1: waiting to exit. Come on, man, champagne. And here in
Speaker 1: the next two year or has he poured it off?
Speaker 1: Poured all the champagne first? Mike Jackson, Madonna has watched
Speaker 1: him and watched him. Do I mean you know I
Speaker 1: could watch him more With Elder barn Did you ask
Speaker 1: him what secretary was, because that's not an actual sec occupation.
Speaker 1: I know a secretary is, but I don't know if
Speaker 1: a secretary secret is an actual occupation. Of course I
Speaker 1: would ask this secretary what the fund is a secretary?
Speaker 1: And then you just you just gotta make a few words, man,
Speaker 1: you know face like, yeah, styling's very very early R
Speaker 1: and B g Q from Baby Face, vocals from Marvin Gaye.
Speaker 1: Who are you gonna get your emotion from? When you
Speaker 1: get your heart from? Well, that's oh man, I wish
Speaker 1: I would because I'm gonna get baby dropping down to
Speaker 1: their knee. Come on, man, that's no. But I mean,
Speaker 1: Kenny is the greatest songwriter ever bro Like, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: give him all the props right now, just because there's
Speaker 1: nobody else who can make you believe them with a
Speaker 1: love song sad happy. I mean that I'm talking about
Speaker 1: in the nineties like there was in the late eighties.
Speaker 1: I mean, when you think about tender Roni, you think
Speaker 1: about On our Own, Bobby Brown, you think about can
Speaker 1: we talk? My mind? Can't we talk? It's having Campbell
Speaker 1: the man. I mean, was it uh the end of
Speaker 1: the road? Um? Like defining moments in my life growing
Speaker 1: up and having you know, uh girlfriends and breaking up
Speaker 1: and having songs that were reconciliation songs getting back together
Speaker 1: to you know, songs that were kind of you just
Speaker 1: have playing in the background when all that debate, it was,
Speaker 1: it was how I cut my tail, Like as an
Speaker 1: R and B guy, there's nobody that I would want
Speaker 1: a song from emotion written. Write to your point, bro.
Speaker 1: I remember being at the Underdogs and and baby Face
Speaker 1: having this song that he recorded on this group. We
Speaker 1: had a hell of Phi singer in the group. No,
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna say a group hell of Phi singer
Speaker 1: in the group who sang the hell out of the song.
Speaker 1: Baby Face song sang the hell out of it. And
Speaker 1: I was like, mm hmm. It was, you know, trick tricking,
Speaker 1: a bunch of twists and turns and athletics. See what
Speaker 1: I'm saying in the vocals, right, And he's like baby
Speaker 1: Face like and then baby Face sang the song, not
Speaker 1: all the acrobatics, not all the twist and turn, all
Speaker 1: the fields, all all the fields. It was like, it's
Speaker 1: a great artist to pick from. Oh my god. It's
Speaker 1: like the way that you express yourself even when you speak, bro,
Speaker 1: It's like you you're a very charismatic person. So it's
Speaker 1: like there's there's a lot of um emotion behind what
Speaker 1: you say because you're not afraid to say how you feel.
Speaker 1: Because you're able to express how you feel, people get
Speaker 1: where you're coming from and they received that. And that's
Speaker 1: that's a gift man, because um, that means anything that
Speaker 1: you say, you know it's going to turn that statement
Speaker 1: into something else. It could be something the smallest little statement,
Speaker 1: but um, the way that you say it now all
Speaker 1: of a sudden is is what makes it so special,
Speaker 1: you know. So I feel like we all have our
Speaker 1: own little fingerprint. We could put on those those statements,
Speaker 1: our own way. We should have that, you know. But
Speaker 1: just there's certain ones that just stick around, like you
Speaker 1: can't get that. You can't even wash that off the wall.
Speaker 1: I think you know what I'm saying, just because it's
Speaker 1: so it's just he just put the stuff. He just
Speaker 1: puts the stuff on it. Fourth piece of the four
Speaker 1: pieces performance, who are you taking the performance? Well, I
Speaker 1: mean Chris Brown's me. You can do all that and
Speaker 1: then you can back and that you can temple people
Speaker 1: who can fly across the stage not be winded. And
Speaker 1: I mean the most I think if there's gonna be
Speaker 1: a Michael Jackson of our you know, of our in
Speaker 1: this era, he is our Michael Jackson. You know, I
Speaker 1: would give it to Usher because he's been just as
Speaker 1: resilient of an artist to be withstand all of the
Speaker 1: just all the things that the times and how everything's changed,
Speaker 1: and he's changed with it and he's involved another incredible
Speaker 1: influence on me as a singer. So yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: your yeah, baby Face, Kenny and Chris Bryant, Lord Jaysus.
Speaker 1: I don't know, I just can't think the look thing
Speaker 1: kind of shoot me because I don't really know what
Speaker 1: an artist should look like. But I just remember when
Speaker 1: I first started as as an artist, I was paying
Speaker 1: attention to the slickness of what was happening at the time.
Speaker 1: And I think it's really okay to get back to that, y'all, Like,
Speaker 1: let's get back to because in the nineties we will slick.
Speaker 1: He was not afraid to put on you know what
Speaker 1: I mean, fabric field. That's what bad Boy was. The
Speaker 1: party shirts party because you put on a nice shirt
Speaker 1: to go. You can't get in the club with just anything.
Speaker 1: Oh you couldn't get no T shirts allowed. Put Yeah,
Speaker 1: but don't your ship. Sure a b will say put
Speaker 1: that ship. Yeah, so I got I got a special segment.
Speaker 1: It's called I Ain't saying no names? Will you tell
Speaker 1: us a story? Funny? Are fucked up? Are both? Okay?
Speaker 1: But the only rule you just don't say their name? Okay? Oh,
Speaker 1: I could have done that with the Diane War. I
Speaker 1: mean to put you out there. Um, all right, mm hmm.
Speaker 1: Who do I want to expose? Right, it's your segment,
Speaker 1: my brother? Oh man? Um, you know it's it's always
Speaker 1: crazy because you go through the business and would learn
Speaker 1: one definitely things that I learned in the business. It's
Speaker 1: one thing to be in the corporates side of the industry.
Speaker 1: And so I grew up kind of backwards where it's
Speaker 1: like I got the most credible, powerful manager from the
Speaker 1: very beginning. As soon as I signed to baby Face,
Speaker 1: all assigned to Gallen and Morey, which was Matt Michael
Speaker 1: Jackson's management firms. You know what I'm saying. So I
Speaker 1: got Michael Jackson on the same you know management firm,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, managed by his manager. It's
Speaker 1: like insane to start from that. You know the names already, right,
Speaker 1: and then go that's fine because I'm I'm a traverse.
Speaker 1: That's not that's not who I'm but but one thing
Speaker 1: is for sure. It's like you know, when you experience
Speaker 1: that first and then you no longer have that management
Speaker 1: and you move on to other managers and managers are
Speaker 1: they come in all kinds of different statuses. They got
Speaker 1: the super powerful, high end managers who every label would
Speaker 1: answer their phone call, and then you've got guys who
Speaker 1: are on the come up. Growing up in the music industry,
Speaker 1: I didn't know who to be loyal to in terms of, like,
Speaker 1: you know, do you stay corporate or do you just
Speaker 1: take people at face value and trust energies and vibes
Speaker 1: from people. So I was much more of a truster
Speaker 1: rather than a person that was just take your word,
Speaker 1: Oh this is who you need to corporate blah blah blah.
Speaker 1: It was much more of like industries like Biden with guys.
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying. So if I if I
Speaker 1: like your energy, I might work with you, and you
Speaker 1: might not even have on your anybody on your roster.
Speaker 1: You might just be a totally independent manager. Anyway, I
Speaker 1: ended up working with some some guys during the time
Speaker 1: that I met you um for that project, and it's
Speaker 1: really was not the move to make because what happens
Speaker 1: when you sometimes when you work with people who aren't established,
Speaker 1: they use you as like like almost like the main
Speaker 1: thing to base off everything. I mean, I had light
Speaker 1: bills put in my name and in cars and things.
Speaker 1: You what I'm saying I found out about later on
Speaker 1: like dollar like being why what is this I'm paying
Speaker 1: for this over here and this and that. It's basically
Speaker 1: just a reason a check. They're just getting a way
Speaker 1: to be able to make money and just living off
Speaker 1: you and not not really bringing anything to the table.
Speaker 1: They'll be like, oh, such such wants to get at you.
Speaker 1: It's like, all right, cool, do I need to pay
Speaker 1: you for that? Like you know what I mean? Like
Speaker 1: it's literally you just told me now I have to
Speaker 1: go do the work, right, so I have to pay
Speaker 1: you for that, right? All right? So that's right there,
Speaker 1: you know, off of whatever check that was to you
Speaker 1: for just giving me that phone call, which is I
Speaker 1: guess it's it's it's fair, but it's not to me.
Speaker 1: It's like what what constitutes management? What is management? You
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying in terms of like what's the
Speaker 1: work that you're gonna actually do to bring to the table?
Speaker 1: What isn't already there? Because this is my table. It's
Speaker 1: not our table. This is my table. You're person sitting
Speaker 1: at my table, So what are you going to put
Speaker 1: on that? We're eating food right now, right this is
Speaker 1: my table. We're eating dinner. I'm having some food prepared.
Speaker 1: What are you going to bring to the table? That's
Speaker 1: the main thing, because at the end of the day,
Speaker 1: I paid for this meal to even happen. We're sitting
Speaker 1: at this table with a reservation because we had reservation,
Speaker 1: and I have to pay for the bill at the
Speaker 1: end of the night. So that's the thing when you
Speaker 1: learn all this backwards like I did with all the
Speaker 1: glitz and the glamour. I mean, I'm going I'm sitting
Speaker 1: right next to Whitney Houston at the Grammys my first
Speaker 1: year with baby Face, you know, for someone to love
Speaker 1: because we got nominated. That's not a regular situation. I
Speaker 1: learned backwards, Like so I had to go from that
Speaker 1: to being like okay, you know, you know, not being
Speaker 1: invited to a lot of different awards shows and wondering
Speaker 1: why and being like okay, you know, and just kind
Speaker 1: of playing the you know, the back of the scenes
Speaker 1: a little bit more, you know, and just kind of
Speaker 1: appreciate it. But it was because of of guys like that.
Speaker 1: The guy I'm describing was just not in the industry
Speaker 1: but wanted to be, but was willing to just live
Speaker 1: off of me and take what was coming to me,
Speaker 1: you know, to kind of keep me at bay. And
Speaker 1: if you spend enough time dealing with people like that,
Speaker 1: you're you're gonna fall off. Like you, there's something that's
Speaker 1: gonna happen within you that will be not conducive for
Speaker 1: the industry. The industry is gonna start saying stuff about
Speaker 1: either gonna talk about either, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: And so two thousand four, as I'm saying, I'm stronger
Speaker 1: every day, ironically enough, was the beginning of an era
Speaker 1: that the industry for some reason wasn't feeling me. They
Speaker 1: were like, well, that's cool, where's the baby? You know.
Speaker 1: I don't know what they were thinking, but it definitely
Speaker 1: wasn't like our our song, Our song Lately went Hard. Um.
Speaker 1: I had other records on that album that We're Dope
Speaker 1: as well. I worked with Kenny on that album, but
Speaker 1: for some reason, that album wasn't as welcomed as other
Speaker 1: as other albums of mine. And I didn't know if
Speaker 1: it was the promotion. I didn't know what it was.
Speaker 1: I just but I really now know that it was
Speaker 1: the management that I had in all the people that
Speaker 1: I had closest to me around me that were the
Speaker 1: made that whole. So I don't almost lost my house. Um,
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's the management. It's tough, it's a
Speaker 1: it's a real miracle that I still live where I
Speaker 1: live because of the fact that we were able to
Speaker 1: work everything out with with my my current business managers
Speaker 1: and stuff like that. But it's it was a lot
Speaker 1: to have to to to to bail myself out or
Speaker 1: you know, first, I was the divorce of a high
Speaker 1: school sweetheart that I'm married, you know, like straight out
Speaker 1: of high school, trying to didn't want my life to change,
Speaker 1: so I tried to marry her and that was a
Speaker 1: bad deal. So we you know, we got divorced. And
Speaker 1: right after that, you know, it was like three years
Speaker 1: of being sort of in this limbo place where it
Speaker 1: was like because of these managers, and I was just
Speaker 1: really I was mad at the music industry. I was like,
Speaker 1: I've already done. I've already sold platinums. What why do
Speaker 1: I have to keep proving myself like this. I just
Speaker 1: want to celebrate the music now and and do me,
Speaker 1: you know. But it was there was a lot of
Speaker 1: a lot of voices around me at that time that
Speaker 1: kind of being like, well, they're just I don't know,
Speaker 1: I can't really get people to fight on this. I
Speaker 1: can't you know, I don't know if they're feeling it.
Speaker 1: Promoters don't really you know, it's like, what hold on, man,
Speaker 1: back off. Maybe it's as soon as I moved those
Speaker 1: people out of the way and I will I will
Speaker 1: say the defining moment was when I met my wife, Um.
Speaker 1: I had already known her for like ten years before
Speaker 1: we were more romantically involved, but basically she was started
Speaker 1: off as a friend of mine and we kind of
Speaker 1: established ourselves and you know, more than that after after
Speaker 1: knowing each other, like even liking each other and flirting
Speaker 1: and all that. But it was it was the one
Speaker 1: thing that kind of I related to her so much.
Speaker 1: I was like, why don't you just try to get
Speaker 1: me some gigs? Like you try? You know. She was
Speaker 1: like all right, well cool, and so we It was
Speaker 1: that kind of out of necessity because we were both
Speaker 1: so disenfranchised with management. The whole idea of giving so
Speaker 1: much power to someone and then they could take it
Speaker 1: for grant to do whatever steer you into essentially where
Speaker 1: you don't want to be. Um. Yeah, So I was like, man, like,
Speaker 1: let's just try this. And we've been rocking together ever since.
Speaker 1: And I mean we turned my brand around. Man, we
Speaker 1: we turned everything around. And I mean everything that we've
Speaker 1: done has been independent for the last fifteen years. It's
Speaker 1: been crazy that I've been a was stay, a float
Speaker 1: and more than a float. I mean, I'm one of
Speaker 1: the hardest working men. And the beautiful, beautiful tour we
Speaker 1: did at the City one around was telling you love
Speaker 1: that venue and the fans just it's just such an
Speaker 1: incredible opportunity to reconnect with my fans. You know, the
Speaker 1: COVID took us out for eighteen months man, when he
Speaker 1: wasn't gigging. So it's just such a blessing. We know,
Speaker 1: we know he was like, yeah, you know what hey man.
Speaker 1: You know, I was like, I gotta get on the road.
Speaker 1: I was like, come on, I gotta get on this road, man.
Speaker 1: This is I was just I was really disappointing because
Speaker 1: I had just done a record with my man, don
Speaker 1: El Jones. We got in the studio and we did
Speaker 1: it song. I played the record on the road. We
Speaker 1: were on the road and I played it to him.
Speaker 1: He's like, man, I like that, and I was like
Speaker 1: you do. I was like, let's cut this, let's let's
Speaker 1: get it. So he was so cool about it. Man.
Speaker 1: He sent me the file right back. I was like,
Speaker 1: let's do this video. He came to shot the video
Speaker 1: with me. Man. I was like, honored, man, And it
Speaker 1: was really h uh, you know, an honor for me
Speaker 1: to work with a legend like that shout out, we
Speaker 1: need the that's this is where you want to be,
Speaker 1: this is this is where you want to mar you money.
Speaker 1: This is what he He's one of us, that's what
Speaker 1: he does. So that's why it was that. It was
Speaker 1: a huge blessing to haven't come blessed me on that
Speaker 1: that track. Understands the name of the record. I wrote
Speaker 1: and produced it myself and shot that video. Man, it
Speaker 1: was like it felt real good, like all right, this
Speaker 1: is something new. Put this out and then COVID HiT's
Speaker 1: like you know. We had another song we put out
Speaker 1: called Priceless as well. We did a video for that
Speaker 1: as well, so check them out, man, if you haven't
Speaker 1: checked it out, understand and Priceless are available now. But
Speaker 1: that kind of the whole COVID then kind of shut
Speaker 1: the album process down because it's like, all right, what
Speaker 1: do we do now? You know? Um? What I ended
Speaker 1: up during doing during the the the whole the Anoramic, yeah,
Speaker 1: was I did these online performances man, which was was
Speaker 1: really cool. I found a really cool venue downtown. It
Speaker 1: was like a loft kind of energy with like dim lights.
Speaker 1: We brought the you know, we brought the crew with
Speaker 1: the cameras and we just it was a multi camera
Speaker 1: set up so it was like it was it was
Speaker 1: shot well, you know, like moving cameras, a little movement,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, a little panty and we
Speaker 1: had a little you know, mark audience kind of just
Speaker 1: maybe ten fifteen people showing um and uh. We put
Speaker 1: that on and every every month I got in touch
Speaker 1: with my fans. I was like, what do you want
Speaker 1: to hear this one? You know? And he was going
Speaker 1: direct to consumer, so it was it was a great
Speaker 1: way to kind of test myself too, Like all right,
Speaker 1: I haven't done this one a long time. Let's break
Speaker 1: this went out from the first album or whatever. So yeah,
Speaker 1: it was really really fun. And some of those songs
Speaker 1: that I actually dusted off, you know, dusted brought out
Speaker 1: of crazy. I was like, uh, I was like, man,
Speaker 1: I'm scared to sing this one because the range was
Speaker 1: when but boys like, it's good to sing those songs man,
Speaker 1: you know, and and bring those back and now some
Speaker 1: of them actually made it into my current set now.
Speaker 1: So it's a fun time. Brother John B Dam Mr
Speaker 1: bucks Man big Bucks Big that was like a game
Speaker 1: back in the day. No ways big Bucks, no Wammy,
Speaker 1: big R and b Bucks Um. One thing that you know,
Speaker 1: one thing that I've always been impressed about you is,
Speaker 1: you know, along with your humility, you're just extremely gracious
Speaker 1: cheers bro, You're just extremely like you know, it's always
Speaker 1: a smile and it's always like, well at least we've
Speaker 1: got water, Like you're oh, I'm I'm definitely the glasses
Speaker 1: have full. Like I'm definitely that. But you're like you're
Speaker 1: like my mirror image and you're probably step further. I
Speaker 1: wish you could hear the news I haven't about to
Speaker 1: put out it's called waiting on you. Right, man, You're
Speaker 1: like the number one influence for the song, and you
Speaker 1: are the person that is the reason why I felt
Speaker 1: like that. There's there's only so many people I can
Speaker 1: say can reflect an emotion that's similar like this, and
Speaker 1: I hope that's a It says how much you've affected
Speaker 1: me as an artist. You know, when when you can
Speaker 1: relate to someone so much that it's like you don't
Speaker 1: have to try. The grown man John By has has
Speaker 1: been around the tanks, you know what I'm saying and
Speaker 1: taking some notes and be like, nah, you know when
Speaker 1: you when you crow the way and you you could
Speaker 1: be like bent over and kind of like no, but
Speaker 1: you yeah, back lifted and you just know you're gonna
Speaker 1: get that weight up right. That's the way I'm approaching
Speaker 1: what I'm doing now. This is a different confidence. Has
Speaker 1: a grown man the muscle developed muscles well without being
Speaker 1: physically you can't really compare that, no, you know, but
Speaker 1: I will say I'm working on those things, preserving those
Speaker 1: you know here part time trying to man, I just
Speaker 1: randomly got I'm trying to John today. If it's a
Speaker 1: rap job to get a sixth bag I'm not doing
Speaker 1: We're not doing that. No. If I take my shirt
Speaker 1: off on stage, who never, you never ever see that.
Speaker 1: I think it's only you probably weren't that twite one
Speaker 1: or two times you got the voice music? Yeah, you
Speaker 1: got you got it all. Man. We have been honored, Um,
Speaker 1: we have been honored to spend a lot of time
Speaker 1: with Man. We just we I don't even I don't
Speaker 1: even been counting how long to talk vibe and to
Speaker 1: hear your story and you know, and to tap into
Speaker 1: you know, just hear about all of these awesome legendary
Speaker 1: artists that you just came in the game and just
Speaker 1: tackled like that's just that's not normal, man, It's not normal. Man.
Speaker 1: Salute to you and you're you're still your your ever
Speaker 1: growing career. Man. We always see each other on the
Speaker 1: road and it's always love. It's always a beverage always
Speaker 1: and and I promise you, man, that is never going
Speaker 1: to change from you. Don't even know what that means
Speaker 1: to me, Bro, to run into you like this and
Speaker 1: had this opportunity to reconnect with you, bro, because I mean,
Speaker 1: we we got history. We've been rocking together for some
Speaker 1: years now. I remember when you first came out. I
Speaker 1: was in London talking on radio like I got this
Speaker 1: new single I'm about to you know, because we had
Speaker 1: just worked. It was right not too long after your
Speaker 1: first first couple of singles worked and so you know,
Speaker 1: they hadn't really gotten you yet over in London yet.
Speaker 1: They were on their way, but it was just just
Speaker 1: starting the bubble and I was like, no, Tank is
Speaker 1: the future. Tank is the future. You know, Lately is
Speaker 1: about to be. And you know we made it to
Speaker 1: the top top. It was a top five record in London.
Speaker 1: A lot of people that don't know that that was
Speaker 1: Lately made it. I went to t rl MTV in England, yeah,
Speaker 1: to go talk about the video on the song and
Speaker 1: working with you and so yeah, ladies and gentlemen, I
Speaker 1: don't know who you get to hang out with, you
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, you know, doing your afternoons and
Speaker 1: just kick it with and get good information from there.
Speaker 1: But if the Rmy Money podcast, me and my brother
Speaker 1: Day Bound the time we got the kicks, Mr John Man,
Speaker 1: please make some Lloyd's for my brothers, then R and
Speaker 1: B Money. R and B Money is the production of
Speaker 1: the Black Effect podcast network. For more podcasts from I
Speaker 1: Heart Radio, visit the irheart Radio app, Apple podcast, or
Speaker 1: wherever you're listen to your favorite shows. Don't forget to
Speaker 1: subscribe to and rate our show, and you can connect
Speaker 1: with us on social media via at R and B
Speaker 1: Money podcast or at The Real Tank or at j
Speaker 1: Valentine