WEBVTT - SEC Chairman Paul Atkins Talks Stablecoins, 401(k) Plans 0:00:02.520 --> 0:00:07.040 Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. 0:00:07.840 --> 0:00:12.240 Congress passing the first federal legislation to regulate stable coins 0:00:12.240 --> 0:00:14.680 in a major win for the crypto market. Joining us now, 0:00:14.680 --> 0:00:16.440 I'm really pleased to say, for a first time here 0:00:16.440 --> 0:00:20.120 on Bloomberg TV on Blomback surveyment's the SEC Chairman, Paul Adkins. 0:00:20.160 --> 0:00:22.200 Chair Atkins, Welcome to the program, sir. It's good to 0:00:22.239 --> 0:00:23.599 see it, good to see you. 0:00:23.640 --> 0:00:24.680 Thank you very much for having me. 0:00:24.760 --> 0:00:26.520 Well, thank you for being here. Before we get into it, 0:00:26.560 --> 0:00:28.480 I wanted to offer you the opportunity, sir, to talk 0:00:28.480 --> 0:00:32.000 about your philosophy in this seed versus what came before you, 0:00:32.040 --> 0:00:35.720 in the difference maybe between deregulation and just innovation. 0:00:36.800 --> 0:00:38.040 Well, well, thank you very much. 0:00:38.320 --> 0:00:42.919 We are out to, you know, obviously, change direction at 0:00:42.920 --> 0:00:44.800 the SEC, and I think we've already done that here 0:00:44.840 --> 0:00:46.920 in my first two and a half or so. 0:00:47.320 --> 0:00:50.479 Months at the agency. But we're moving away from. 0:00:51.920 --> 0:00:56.080 Regulation through enforcement and uncertainty in the markets, especially with 0:00:56.240 --> 0:00:59.120 respect to cryptocurrencies. 0:00:58.120 --> 0:01:01.280 And digital assets in general. We're looking to set. 0:01:01.560 --> 0:01:05.880 Firm, clear rules of the road for people who are 0:01:06.040 --> 0:01:10.600 operating in that environment so that innovators can innovate, they 0:01:10.640 --> 0:01:13.800 can rely on their advisors to tell them, you know, 0:01:13.840 --> 0:01:16.400 which is the right direction and how they can build 0:01:16.400 --> 0:01:17.279 on solid ground. 0:01:17.720 --> 0:01:23.280 Regulators, though, can step in without explicit action from Congress. 0:01:23.280 --> 0:01:25.840 So when it comes to cryptocurrencies in the SEC, what 0:01:25.959 --> 0:01:27.679 actually comes next? What are your plans? 0:01:29.319 --> 0:01:33.919 Well, so even before I got to the SEC, Hester Purse, 0:01:33.920 --> 0:01:37.319 who's one of the commissioners and she used to be 0:01:37.480 --> 0:01:41.240 my counsel when I was a commissioner back in to. 0:01:41.400 --> 0:01:44.839 One thousand and two to two thousand and eight, was in. 0:01:44.800 --> 0:01:48.000 Charge of a crypto task force that we're calling it, 0:01:48.360 --> 0:01:49.760 and they are focusing on. 0:01:51.320 --> 0:01:53.680 Making clear rules for the industry. 0:01:53.760 --> 0:01:58.040 So for example, things like mean coins and stable coins 0:01:58.120 --> 0:02:01.440 that was just the subject of the bill that was 0:02:01.960 --> 0:02:07.400 passed yesterday are not securities, and before that was not 0:02:07.640 --> 0:02:11.280 necessarily clear. And so that's an example of how we're 0:02:11.320 --> 0:02:14.560 trying to put people at ease in the marketplace so 0:02:14.600 --> 0:02:17.800 that they can innovate and they can move forward with 0:02:17.880 --> 0:02:21.080 their plans and not have to look over their shoulder. 0:02:21.280 --> 0:02:23.959 When you were talking to reporters yesterday after the passing 0:02:24.040 --> 0:02:25.919 of this legislation, I believe you'll be at the White 0:02:25.919 --> 0:02:28.080 House today with the President when he signs it. You 0:02:28.120 --> 0:02:31.880 said the SEC is considering a quote innovative exemption from 0:02:31.960 --> 0:02:37.200 regulations to incentifize tokenization. What does that exactly mean innovated 0:02:37.320 --> 0:02:40.280 exemption and how long does this process take? 0:02:42.120 --> 0:02:45.520 Well, it'll be an inerative process. And right now we 0:02:45.560 --> 0:02:53.120 are working on setting forth different things that can again 0:02:53.480 --> 0:02:58.040 make it clear for people in the marketplace, you know 0:02:58.080 --> 0:03:01.440 which way is the is the true north for them. 0:03:01.520 --> 0:03:03.920 Let's just say so that they don't have to worry 0:03:04.000 --> 0:03:07.840 about falling off the ditch and falling onto the ditch 0:03:08.320 --> 0:03:11.040 and getting in trouble with the regulators. 0:03:11.080 --> 0:03:13.000 And so part of that will be working. 0:03:12.760 --> 0:03:16.840 With our colleagues of the other regulators and especially the 0:03:17.280 --> 0:03:21.239 Commodity Futures Training Commission. But let's just say that as 0:03:21.240 --> 0:03:24.359 we go forth and as we interact with the marketplace, 0:03:24.480 --> 0:03:29.480 we've had five roundtables now looking at various aspects of 0:03:29.680 --> 0:03:33.640 the digital asset space. So we are working hard at 0:03:34.080 --> 0:03:38.240 coming up with guidance and rules and we'll use every 0:03:38.720 --> 0:03:43.520 tool in our toolbox to help people understand what is 0:03:44.520 --> 0:03:45.560 how to stay out of trouble. 0:03:45.600 --> 0:03:48.200 Basically, Jaacken's one of the big concern is that a 0:03:48.280 --> 0:03:51.160 number of the stable coin issuers are not going to 0:03:51.160 --> 0:03:54.280 have the sufficient number of hard currency reserves on hand 0:03:54.640 --> 0:03:57.960 to really back those notes in a way that is 0:03:58.040 --> 0:04:01.480 as advertised. How are you to really counter that? Is 0:04:01.480 --> 0:04:04.160 that something that's in your list of concerns If the 0:04:04.200 --> 0:04:06.200 sec is going to be monitoring. 0:04:07.360 --> 0:04:12.560 Well, one thing that I think the new to be signed. 0:04:12.680 --> 0:04:16.039 A bill into law makes clear is that these are 0:04:16.080 --> 0:04:20.080 not securities and the whole it's the banking regulators who 0:04:20.120 --> 0:04:21.600 are going to be looking after them. 0:04:21.600 --> 0:04:24.280 And I think that's appropriate because of the role that. 0:04:24.200 --> 0:04:28.080 Stable coins play and I think will play in the future. 0:04:28.120 --> 0:04:32.760 Because part of the role promise I think digital of 0:04:33.040 --> 0:04:40.279 distributed ledger technology is immediate payment as part of the 0:04:40.320 --> 0:04:45.000 process of transactions, so settlement coming down to in effect 0:04:45.120 --> 0:04:49.960 almost heapless zero and to do it on the trade date, 0:04:50.040 --> 0:04:53.320 and that will make things much more efficient in the marketplace, 0:04:53.600 --> 0:04:58.359 save money, reduced risk in our financial system. So this 0:04:58.800 --> 0:05:02.360 stable coins are in the realm of the bank regulators 0:05:02.400 --> 0:05:05.520 and they will look after to make sure that there 0:05:05.640 --> 0:05:12.000 is adequate and as advertise, adequate backing to the stable coins. 0:05:12.200 --> 0:05:15.240 Jakins just sort of switching gears a little bit. There's 0:05:15.240 --> 0:05:18.880 been a lot of discussion around Congress and the President 0:05:19.000 --> 0:05:22.839 passing legislation that would open the door for people to 0:05:22.880 --> 0:05:25.160 take their money from the four to one case and 0:05:25.200 --> 0:05:28.800 put it into private assets, in particular private equity. How 0:05:28.839 --> 0:05:31.080 do you plan to oversee and make sure that that's 0:05:31.080 --> 0:05:34.080 done in a way that isn't potentially punitive for people 0:05:34.480 --> 0:05:37.040 who are retiring at ages where they need a lot 0:05:37.080 --> 0:05:38.240 more money for a lot longer. 0:05:40.200 --> 0:05:44.760 Well, on that issue, we've heard a lot of input 0:05:44.880 --> 0:05:50.240 from both the investors who want access to the private 0:05:50.279 --> 0:05:53.720 markets and to those sorts of products, and obviously from 0:05:53.839 --> 0:05:58.680 the people who are producing the products who are about 0:05:58.720 --> 0:06:01.240 to meet that demand. So but we have to do 0:06:01.279 --> 0:06:04.320 it carefully, I think, because of course the private markets 0:06:04.360 --> 0:06:08.040 are a lot different than the public markets. Their liquidity 0:06:08.160 --> 0:06:11.320 is not the same. There are all sorts of things 0:06:11.680 --> 0:06:14.120 for people who are not aware of the rules of 0:06:14.160 --> 0:06:18.240 the road where they could get hurt, and so we 0:06:18.279 --> 0:06:22.200 will work very closely with our counterparts at the Department 0:06:22.200 --> 0:06:26.520 of Labor who have oversight Ovarissa accounts to make sure 0:06:26.600 --> 0:06:32.760 that we have appropriate guidelines around these various products. And 0:06:33.080 --> 0:06:36.919 they're really for of course long term investment, especially private 0:06:36.960 --> 0:06:39.600 equity and things like that. So we have to do 0:06:39.680 --> 0:06:44.280 this in a smart way so that individual investors are 0:06:44.320 --> 0:06:48.840 not inadvertently into something that they didn't realize what they 0:06:48.839 --> 0:06:49.559 were getting into. 0:06:49.680 --> 0:06:53.919 Well, speaking of, for one, retirement plans, would you allow 0:06:53.960 --> 0:06:56.599 crypto into retirement plans? Because the Financial Time is reporting 0:06:56.640 --> 0:06:58.719 that we could see an executive order from the administration 0:06:58.800 --> 0:07:03.680 as soon as today allowing alternative investments into retirement plans. 0:07:05.560 --> 0:07:08.919 Well, again, you know, I think that you know, disclosure 0:07:09.040 --> 0:07:11.600 is key and that people need to know what they're 0:07:11.600 --> 0:07:15.640 getting into. So things like that are not for everybody, 0:07:15.800 --> 0:07:20.560 and and so especially in retirement plans. So we are 0:07:21.320 --> 0:07:24.520 I look forward to whatever may come out from the 0:07:24.520 --> 0:07:27.640 President as far as direction goes, but we are we 0:07:28.040 --> 0:07:31.040 need to address it because there is a demand out 0:07:31.080 --> 0:07:36.480 there for these sorts of products, and the government should 0:07:36.480 --> 0:07:41.720 not stand as a blocking agent for those sorts of things, 0:07:41.760 --> 0:07:44.120 but we need to enable it in the proper way, 0:07:44.360 --> 0:07:47.200 with proper guidelines and in proper disclosures. 0:07:47.320 --> 0:07:50.120 Sir Atkins, you run an independent agency, so does J. 0:07:50.280 --> 0:07:50.720 Powell. 0:07:51.080 --> 0:07:53.120 I would love to know are you under any pressure 0:07:53.200 --> 0:07:55.640 from this White House? And what would be your advice 0:07:55.680 --> 0:07:57.240 to J. Powell because it seems like you have a 0:07:57.280 --> 0:07:59.120 better relationship with President Trump. 0:08:00.960 --> 0:08:02.040 Well, I think. 0:08:02.280 --> 0:08:04.360 So I've been at the SEC now this is a 0:08:04.400 --> 0:08:07.200 third time. I was there in the early nineties and 0:08:07.280 --> 0:08:10.280 the Richard Breeden and Arthur Levitt, and then again from 0:08:10.480 --> 0:08:14.200 two to eight and now here in two thousand and 0:08:14.520 --> 0:08:18.600 twenty five. So frankly, I don't see really any difference 0:08:18.960 --> 0:08:21.120 in operation from back then to now. 0:08:21.400 --> 0:08:22.120 I know there's been a. 0:08:22.120 --> 0:08:24.720 Lot of coverage of that, but you know, we are 0:08:24.880 --> 0:08:28.840 working hand in glove with our counterparts in the administration 0:08:29.160 --> 0:08:33.760 and at the Office of Management and Budget and OIRA, 0:08:34.520 --> 0:08:39.080 as far as talking to them about rules and other 0:08:39.120 --> 0:08:41.360 things that we are going to be publishing, so you know, 0:08:41.480 --> 0:08:43.640 keeping them up to date, taking their comments, which are 0:08:43.679 --> 0:08:46.680 all very good. So I don't see any real difference 0:08:46.800 --> 0:08:52.079 frankly in the ambit of maneuver that we have at 0:08:52.080 --> 0:08:55.160 the agency. So I look forward to achieving a lot 0:08:56.600 --> 0:08:58.720 in the time that we have and because there is 0:08:58.760 --> 0:09:01.520 so much to do, this is what I like to 0:09:01.679 --> 0:09:04.760 call deferred maintenance that we have to address and so 0:09:04.880 --> 0:09:08.520 we are moving I think, at very quick pace, and 0:09:08.800 --> 0:09:10.440 so the rest of this year I think will be 0:09:11.080 --> 0:09:13.640 churning things out and moving in a different direction. 0:09:13.840 --> 0:09:17.120 Hopefully this is a start of an ongoing conversation. Appreciate 0:09:17.160 --> 0:09:19.800 your time, Chair Radkins. Thank you, sir, the SEC Chair 0:09:19.880 --> 0:09:22.079 Paul Atkins there down in Washington, d C.