1
00:00:01,560 --> 00:00:02,600
Speaker 1: I'm Hillary Clinton.

2
00:00:02,880 --> 00:00:07,080
Speaker 2: Welcome to a very special episode of You and Me Both.

3
00:00:07,920 --> 00:00:09,959
Speaker 2: You know, just about a week ago, I had the

4
00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:14,880
Speaker 2: pleasure of taping our first ever live show in front

5
00:00:14,880 --> 00:00:18,560
Speaker 2: of a standing room only audience at Symphony Space in

6
00:00:18,640 --> 00:00:23,000
Speaker 2: New York City. Joining me was my very special guest,

7
00:00:23,160 --> 00:00:27,840
Speaker 2: Patty Lapone, with some help from one of my favorite comedians,

8
00:00:28,240 --> 00:00:32,440
Speaker 2: Amber Ruffin, who served as our MC. So buckle up

9
00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:37,159
Speaker 2: and enjoy the show. First you'll hear from Amber Ruffin.

10
00:00:39,240 --> 00:00:43,880
Speaker 3: It is my pleasure to introduce a bona fide Broadway legend,

11
00:00:44,240 --> 00:00:48,120
Speaker 3: the three time Tony Award winning actress singer Patty Lapone

12
00:00:48,120 --> 00:00:52,720
Speaker 3: and former Secretary of State and podcast host Hillary Rodham Clinton.

13
00:00:54,080 --> 00:01:04,080
Speaker 2: Whoa, whoa, this is so excited everybody. I want to

14
00:01:04,080 --> 00:01:09,080
Speaker 2: thank my friend and one of the most genuinely funny

15
00:01:09,160 --> 00:01:14,880
Speaker 2: and wonderful human beings, Amber Ruffin for being with us,

16
00:01:14,959 --> 00:01:18,640
Speaker 2: and Amber will be back out later. But I have

17
00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:20,880
Speaker 2: to tell you this is like a dream come true

18
00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:25,600
Speaker 2: for me. Number one, we are doing the very first

19
00:01:26,520 --> 00:01:34,080
Speaker 2: live version of my podcast, You and Me Both, and

20
00:01:34,240 --> 00:01:38,200
Speaker 2: I could not think of a better person to do

21
00:01:38,280 --> 00:01:48,240
Speaker 2: that with than the one and only Patty LuPone. So

22
00:01:48,520 --> 00:01:53,320
Speaker 2: Patty welcome to this sold out audience here at Symphony Space.

23
00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:58,360
Speaker 2: And when I was thinking, you heard Amber talking about

24
00:01:58,360 --> 00:02:01,960
Speaker 2: how when Chelsea and I did uh gutsy and we

25
00:02:02,040 --> 00:02:06,400
Speaker 2: interviewed a lot of gutsy women who embodies gutsy more

26
00:02:06,480 --> 00:02:13,200
Speaker 2: than Patty and her spunk, her heart, her talent.

27
00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:16,720
Speaker 1: I mean, it is just an amazing combination.

28
00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:20,840
Speaker 2: So I'm going to dive right in and I actually

29
00:02:21,280 --> 00:02:26,440
Speaker 2: read your autobiography. You certainly have a lot of experience

30
00:02:27,080 --> 00:02:32,080
Speaker 2: on stages literally all over. You know, I'm happy to

31
00:02:32,120 --> 00:02:36,400
Speaker 2: be here interviewing you, but honestly, it's always been my

32
00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:37,359
Speaker 2: dream to sing.

33
00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:40,120
Speaker 1: Really yes, well, then.

34
00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:42,680
Speaker 4: You should sing tonight. I an'll have to sing. You

35
00:02:42,720 --> 00:02:46,720
Speaker 4: should sing tonight. You should sing tonight. Oh no, Hilary,

36
00:02:46,800 --> 00:02:47,800
Speaker 4: you should say Now, I.

37
00:02:48,160 --> 00:02:50,760
Speaker 2: Had to make the confession because it would end the

38
00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:54,560
Speaker 2: show early, and so we can't do that. But later

39
00:02:54,680 --> 00:02:57,720
Speaker 2: you're gonna have the real treat of hearing her saying.

40
00:03:01,120 --> 00:03:01,360
Speaker 5: You know.

41
00:03:01,800 --> 00:03:06,400
Speaker 2: I looked at the pictures in your wonderful autobiography I

42
00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:10,840
Speaker 2: read about your life, and I'm so pleased that the

43
00:03:11,600 --> 00:03:19,160
Speaker 2: sag after an actors strike has finished so that you

44
00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:21,839
Speaker 2: could actually talk about a lot of the things You've done.

45
00:03:21,960 --> 00:03:25,000
Speaker 2: It's perfect. Last Frand Dresser. That's all I've got to say.

46
00:03:25,160 --> 00:03:30,000
Speaker 2: God bless Frand Dresser. So let's start at the very beginning.

47
00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:34,280
Speaker 2: You were born on Long Island, Northport.

48
00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:34,320
Speaker 4: Right, Northport.

49
00:03:34,560 --> 00:03:38,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, So tell us a little bit about your family,

50
00:03:38,200 --> 00:03:41,320
Speaker 2: because it turns out that you had a kind of

51
00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:43,800
Speaker 2: pool of talent inside your own family.

52
00:03:43,880 --> 00:03:47,160
Speaker 4: Well, my mother and my father were not at all

53
00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:49,760
Speaker 4: in show business. In fact, my father expected us all

54
00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:52,320
Speaker 4: to be teachers, and my mother was just a Long

55
00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:57,720
Speaker 4: Island housewife. I'm of Italian descent, and when my parents

56
00:03:57,720 --> 00:03:59,560
Speaker 4: were growing up, there was a great deal of prejudice.

57
00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:03,400
Speaker 4: My grandparents wanted their kids, both sides, the Patties and

58
00:04:03,440 --> 00:04:08,320
Speaker 4: the Loupons, to be American. My name is made up

59
00:04:08,360 --> 00:04:10,960
Speaker 4: of my parents' last name. My dad's LuPone, my mother's

60
00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:14,559
Speaker 4: a Patsy, so they wanted their kids to be American.

61
00:04:14,920 --> 00:04:18,480
Speaker 4: So my mother really showed business was the farthest thing

62
00:04:19,200 --> 00:04:21,839
Speaker 4: from her mind for her kids. But she was the

63
00:04:21,839 --> 00:04:24,440
Speaker 4: one that actually started it by enrolling me in a

64
00:04:24,520 --> 00:04:26,520
Speaker 4: dance class. And my brother Bobby saw me in a

65
00:04:26,560 --> 00:04:28,960
Speaker 4: huli skirt and fell in love with the hula skirt,

66
00:04:28,960 --> 00:04:31,960
Speaker 4: and he started dancing. That's the truth.

67
00:04:32,960 --> 00:04:35,760
Speaker 1: Well, but in fact, didn't you form a group later?

68
00:04:36,240 --> 00:04:38,600
Speaker 4: Yes, we did, because we had we had first it

69
00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:41,880
Speaker 4: was Miss Marguerite Dance Studio. Then it was Donald and

70
00:04:41,960 --> 00:04:44,880
Speaker 4: Rosalie Grant Dance Studio. Then it was the Andrea and

71
00:04:44,920 --> 00:04:48,760
Speaker 4: Bonnie and their friend Betty Dance Studio and Andre and Bonnie.

72
00:04:48,880 --> 00:04:51,960
Speaker 4: Andre was it was French. It was so kind of

73
00:04:52,000 --> 00:04:55,080
Speaker 4: exotic and wonderful, and he's a French accent, and he

74
00:04:55,200 --> 00:04:57,960
Speaker 4: put my brothers and I did an adagio waltz. My

75
00:04:58,000 --> 00:05:00,760
Speaker 4: brother Bobby and I did a tango. We actually competed

76
00:05:00,800 --> 00:05:05,960
Speaker 4: at Jones's speech. We won third prize. I still have

77
00:05:06,120 --> 00:05:11,880
Speaker 4: the trophy. So it was sort of even though my

78
00:05:11,960 --> 00:05:14,839
Speaker 4: mother never she actually was famous as saying to my

79
00:05:14,880 --> 00:05:17,640
Speaker 4: brother and I, it upsets me that you flip from

80
00:05:17,720 --> 00:05:22,400
Speaker 4: job to job. Yuh mau. Yeah, that's the way it goes.

81
00:05:22,440 --> 00:05:25,520
Speaker 4: But because she had no clue about about show business.

82
00:05:25,640 --> 00:05:28,320
Speaker 4: But she was the one that introduced us, and Bobby

83
00:05:28,320 --> 00:05:33,159
Speaker 4: and I both found our place. Yeah, it was a calling.

84
00:05:33,440 --> 00:05:37,000
Speaker 2: But you know, I actually love that story because it's

85
00:05:37,000 --> 00:05:39,800
Speaker 2: a story of a certain time and a certain place

86
00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:45,239
Speaker 2: and going from those dance studios and those other opportunities.

87
00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:49,880
Speaker 1: And I love the story that stories you.

88
00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:55,040
Speaker 2: Tell about your rather unusual audition for Juilliard. I mean,

89
00:05:55,440 --> 00:05:58,440
Speaker 2: here is this young girl, you were still a young girl,

90
00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:02,560
Speaker 2: and let it be said you hated school except for music.

91
00:06:02,920 --> 00:06:05,520
Speaker 4: Right, No, it's not in hate school. I was lucky

92
00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:08,720
Speaker 4: to go to a high school, an elementary, a junior high,

93
00:06:08,800 --> 00:06:11,440
Speaker 4: and a high school where music was an integral part

94
00:06:11,480 --> 00:06:15,040
Speaker 4: of our education as important as English, math and science.

95
00:06:16,520 --> 00:06:19,000
Speaker 4: We all studied and we also with the third grade

96
00:06:19,080 --> 00:06:21,360
Speaker 4: was marched into the Ocean Avenue Elementary School. There were

97
00:06:21,400 --> 00:06:25,080
Speaker 4: two posters on the wall band instruments orchestra instruments, and

98
00:06:25,200 --> 00:06:28,720
Speaker 4: our music teachers said pick an instrument, and we learned

99
00:06:28,760 --> 00:06:31,200
Speaker 4: started to learn how to read music in the third

100
00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:34,000
Speaker 4: grade and we carry that all the way through high school.

101
00:06:34,200 --> 00:06:39,440
Speaker 4: So kudos to the Northport school system for instilling music

102
00:06:39,880 --> 00:06:44,599
Speaker 4: into our lives. It breaks my heart that there isn't music.

103
00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:46,599
Speaker 1: It breaks my heart in school.

104
00:06:46,640 --> 00:06:49,280
Speaker 2: And you know, when you think about it, because that

105
00:06:49,440 --> 00:06:53,080
Speaker 2: used to be the norm, you would have, you know, music,

106
00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:57,560
Speaker 2: you might even have music appreciation because I can remember

107
00:06:57,640 --> 00:07:00,719
Speaker 2: in third grade we had a music teacher who would

108
00:07:00,720 --> 00:07:03,560
Speaker 2: come in and she would introduce us to things we would.

109
00:07:03,360 --> 00:07:04,200
Speaker 1: Never have known about.

110
00:07:04,279 --> 00:07:08,040
Speaker 2: I remember having her tell us about Aida and playing

111
00:07:08,160 --> 00:07:09,120
Speaker 2: from the score.

112
00:07:09,279 --> 00:07:10,720
Speaker 1: I'm in third grade. What do I know?

113
00:07:10,800 --> 00:07:13,560
Speaker 2: I know nothing about opera, nothing at all.

114
00:07:13,600 --> 00:07:16,760
Speaker 1: But now so many kids don't have that opportunity.

115
00:07:16,920 --> 00:07:20,720
Speaker 2: So it's really important to, you know, remind everybody that

116
00:07:20,760 --> 00:07:23,280
Speaker 2: it used to be much more common, and it gave

117
00:07:23,480 --> 00:07:26,800
Speaker 2: so many kids a chance to find themselves, find their

118
00:07:26,840 --> 00:07:28,760
Speaker 2: talents or enhance what they need.

119
00:07:29,080 --> 00:07:31,280
Speaker 4: And the arts are the soul of a nation.

120
00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:32,040
Speaker 1: Amen.

121
00:07:32,200 --> 00:07:34,440
Speaker 2: Well, you've done your part to try to, you know,

122
00:07:34,560 --> 00:07:38,120
Speaker 2: deliver a lot to a lot of happy people. And

123
00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:40,640
Speaker 2: I want to go back to this audition at Juilliard

124
00:07:40,680 --> 00:07:43,120
Speaker 2: because here you are in high school and you do

125
00:07:43,240 --> 00:07:48,400
Speaker 2: have support from some teachers and some other adults in

126
00:07:48,440 --> 00:07:49,000
Speaker 2: your life.

127
00:07:49,440 --> 00:07:50,920
Speaker 1: And what did you decide to do?

128
00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:53,360
Speaker 4: I knew what I was going to do. I actually

129
00:07:53,400 --> 00:07:55,560
Speaker 4: I wanted to be a rock and roller because I

130
00:07:55,560 --> 00:07:58,360
Speaker 4: grew up in the age of rock and roll. But

131
00:07:58,400 --> 00:08:00,920
Speaker 4: whenever I opened my mouths to sing a rock and

132
00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:03,840
Speaker 4: roll so I sounded like ethel Mermons, so that wasn't

133
00:08:03,840 --> 00:08:09,040
Speaker 4: going to work. But still I'm a closet rocker, so

134
00:08:09,080 --> 00:08:11,480
Speaker 4: I knew that my I knew at a very young age.

135
00:08:11,520 --> 00:08:13,920
Speaker 4: First of all, I remember when I was sixteen saying,

136
00:08:14,160 --> 00:08:17,880
Speaker 4: my career is in Europe, and of course it hasn't been.

137
00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:21,400
Speaker 4: But I've always felt more European than American, and I

138
00:08:21,400 --> 00:08:23,560
Speaker 4: always wanted my career to be I wanted to sing

139
00:08:23,600 --> 00:08:25,800
Speaker 4: in Europe, and I knew what I was going to do.

140
00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:27,520
Speaker 4: I knew that I wouldn't end up on the Broadway

141
00:08:27,600 --> 00:08:29,960
Speaker 4: musical stage. I just knew that. So it's not that

142
00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:31,760
Speaker 4: I hated school. It's just that I knew where my

143
00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:35,960
Speaker 4: focus was. And when my junior high school guidance counselor

144
00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:38,520
Speaker 4: asked me what I wanted to major in in high school,

145
00:08:38,679 --> 00:08:41,560
Speaker 4: I said music. He said, you can't. Why did you

146
00:08:41,720 --> 00:08:44,800
Speaker 4: ask me then? And ultimately what I did do was

147
00:08:44,840 --> 00:08:47,640
Speaker 4: skip every other class and just went to the music classes.

148
00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:49,960
Speaker 4: I don't know how I graduated. They wanted me out,

149
00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:53,160
Speaker 4: so that's how I got out, and then Julliard, and

150
00:08:53,160 --> 00:08:55,360
Speaker 4: then my mother wanted me to go to a college,

151
00:08:55,400 --> 00:09:01,040
Speaker 4: and I went n and I moved to New York City,

152
00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:04,920
Speaker 4: found one hundred dollars a month, five floor walk up

153
00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:07,440
Speaker 4: railroad flat on East nineteenth and Second Avenue, and got

154
00:09:07,440 --> 00:09:12,920
Speaker 4: a job at the Ginza at waitress, and I auditioned

155
00:09:12,960 --> 00:09:16,360
Speaker 4: for Broadway musicals. My brother Bobby was attending the dance

156
00:09:16,400 --> 00:09:19,520
Speaker 4: division of Juilliard. He said they were starting a drama division,

157
00:09:19,559 --> 00:09:21,679
Speaker 4: and I only auditioned for my mother and my brother.

158
00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:23,760
Speaker 4: I did not want to go to college, and my

159
00:09:23,880 --> 00:09:27,200
Speaker 4: audition was I didn't even care. I picked the most

160
00:09:27,200 --> 00:09:30,520
Speaker 4: obvious classical speech, the most obvious contemporary speech. I went

161
00:09:30,880 --> 00:09:32,880
Speaker 4: at the time, we were hippie, so I was in

162
00:09:32,920 --> 00:09:36,679
Speaker 4: a granny dress with granny shoes and granny glasses. And

163
00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:40,520
Speaker 4: when I did my it was Kate's epulogue from Taming

164
00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:43,200
Speaker 4: of the Shrew five fi on that threatening on Kim Brown,

165
00:09:43,360 --> 00:09:52,079
Speaker 4: dark knot scornful glances at thy lord, thy Master. When

166
00:09:52,120 --> 00:09:54,400
Speaker 4: I finished the speech, John Hausman came to the foot

167
00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:56,079
Speaker 4: of the stage and said, I don't think that's what

168
00:09:56,280 --> 00:10:02,360
Speaker 4: Shakespeare had in mind. And I frankly couldn't care less.

169
00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:06,080
Speaker 4: So I did that, and I did Dolly Levi's money

170
00:10:06,120 --> 00:10:09,880
Speaker 4: speech from the Matchmaker, and then there was a lot

171
00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:12,040
Speaker 4: of silence out there, and of course I couldn't see them.

172
00:10:12,520 --> 00:10:15,640
Speaker 4: Then somebody shouted out an improv, which is I got

173
00:10:15,679 --> 00:10:18,360
Speaker 4: a rejection letter from the drama division of the Juilliard School.

174
00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:21,720
Speaker 4: So I went over to opened up a mailbox, pulled

175
00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:23,640
Speaker 4: out the letter, opened it up, read it, throw it

176
00:10:23,640 --> 00:10:24,360
Speaker 4: over my shoulder.

177
00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:25,360
Speaker 1: That's what got me in.

178
00:10:26,920 --> 00:10:27,599
Speaker 4: That's what got me in.

179
00:10:27,800 --> 00:10:31,320
Speaker 1: And didn't you say John Houseman? Did you say John Houseman?

180
00:10:31,440 --> 00:10:36,320
Speaker 4: Yeah? Okay, mister Housman, mister Houseman to me, yeah?

181
00:10:37,120 --> 00:10:40,480
Speaker 1: For people, who was John Houseman? Because not everybody remembers well.

182
00:10:40,559 --> 00:10:44,280
Speaker 4: John Housman was a very powerful producer in the Mercury Theater.

183
00:10:45,080 --> 00:10:50,319
Speaker 4: He worked with Orson Wells. He was a frightening man

184
00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:55,560
Speaker 4: when I met him, and he was the co artistic

185
00:10:55,679 --> 00:10:58,720
Speaker 4: director of the initial drama division of the Juilliard School.

186
00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:00,720
Speaker 4: The Julliard School used to the Julliard School of Music,

187
00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:03,440
Speaker 4: but in order for them to move down to Lincoln Center,

188
00:11:03,480 --> 00:11:05,679
Speaker 4: they had to become a complete performing arts swing, so

189
00:11:05,760 --> 00:11:08,280
Speaker 4: they had to add a drama division. And Peter Mennon,

190
00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:11,240
Speaker 4: who was the president of the Juilliard School of Music,

191
00:11:11,679 --> 00:11:15,280
Speaker 4: was not happy that we would now have actors in

192
00:11:15,640 --> 00:11:20,400
Speaker 4: the building, and John Housman and Peter Manon did not

193
00:11:20,520 --> 00:11:25,360
Speaker 4: get along at all. But John was also frightening to me.

194
00:11:25,640 --> 00:11:29,439
Speaker 4: I mean, he was a very imposing man, and he

195
00:11:30,559 --> 00:11:33,760
Speaker 4: it was difficult, It was scary to be in that school.

196
00:11:34,280 --> 00:11:35,880
Speaker 4: It was a brutal education.

197
00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:39,319
Speaker 2: And one of the people who you were in that

198
00:11:39,480 --> 00:11:42,840
Speaker 2: school with was someone who I think became your boyfriend

199
00:11:42,880 --> 00:11:45,240
Speaker 2: for a number of years, right, Kevin Klein.

200
00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:49,280
Speaker 4: Yes, yeah, he was my boyfriend.

201
00:11:54,120 --> 00:11:55,120
Speaker 1: And that's all we'll.

202
00:11:55,040 --> 00:11:55,599
Speaker 4: Hear about that.

203
00:11:55,840 --> 00:11:59,440
Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen, moving right along.

204
00:12:01,080 --> 00:12:05,000
Speaker 2: So you get out of Juilliard, but you're still part

205
00:12:05,040 --> 00:12:08,599
Speaker 2: of a almost a kind of acting company, right, And

206
00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:15,040
Speaker 2: you performed nearly anywhere, anytime anybody asked, and it was

207
00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:19,280
Speaker 2: apparently an amazing, full immersion experience for you.

208
00:12:19,480 --> 00:12:23,240
Speaker 4: It was you know, acting as a craft, and a

209
00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:30,040
Speaker 4: craft takes training, and we were given the golden opportunity

210
00:12:30,600 --> 00:12:35,040
Speaker 4: to hone our craft. We learned what we could at Juilliard,

211
00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:38,160
Speaker 4: and Juilliard was our class was sort of the guinea

212
00:12:38,200 --> 00:12:42,280
Speaker 4: pigs of the entire acting experience. What they wanted was

213
00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:45,000
Speaker 4: to break the psyche down of an American actor and

214
00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:48,760
Speaker 4: form the Juilliard actor that could be a classical actor,

215
00:12:48,840 --> 00:12:53,719
Speaker 4: a contemporary actor, act in every particular styles, restoration, Jacko Beean,

216
00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:58,720
Speaker 4: Elizabethan modern, and be able to work with Russian directors,

217
00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:04,520
Speaker 4: French directors, American directors. So in school we were inundated

218
00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:07,480
Speaker 4: with technique, not so much acting classes, but a lot

219
00:13:07,520 --> 00:13:11,040
Speaker 4: of technique. When John put us on display on our

220
00:13:11,160 --> 00:13:13,440
Speaker 4: third year, mal Guso, who was a critic, second string

221
00:13:13,480 --> 00:13:15,800
Speaker 4: critic for the New York Times, said, keep this company together,

222
00:13:15,960 --> 00:13:18,559
Speaker 4: don't break them up, which was John's q. To keep

223
00:13:18,640 --> 00:13:21,240
Speaker 4: this company together. So when we graduated from Juilliard, he

224
00:13:21,360 --> 00:13:23,800
Speaker 4: handed us an equity card and a seat on a

225
00:13:23,840 --> 00:13:27,480
Speaker 4: dominical bus and we toured the shows that we had

226
00:13:27,520 --> 00:13:31,679
Speaker 4: been performing in our third and fourth years with sets

227
00:13:31,720 --> 00:13:34,960
Speaker 4: that weren't built to tour. That was the first problem,

228
00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:39,199
Speaker 4: and we had been trained to do three shows and

229
00:13:39,360 --> 00:13:42,800
Speaker 4: on the fourth the performance fell apart. We didn't know

230
00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:48,400
Speaker 4: how to maintain and so we got lessons that no

231
00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:51,959
Speaker 4: actors get any more, which is a pity because we

232
00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:56,360
Speaker 4: were armed to the teeth with technique, so that when

233
00:13:56,400 --> 00:13:58,760
Speaker 4: somebody says something to me, I don't go no, I

234
00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:02,760
Speaker 4: can't do that. At a fear, I say, yeah, I

235
00:14:02,840 --> 00:14:05,439
Speaker 4: can do that because I want to. Whether I know

236
00:14:05,559 --> 00:14:08,040
Speaker 4: how to do it or not, I have the technique

237
00:14:08,840 --> 00:14:11,440
Speaker 4: to figure it out. And if I fail, that's okay.

238
00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:14,319
Speaker 4: That was the other thing that techniques allows. The technique

239
00:14:14,360 --> 00:14:17,480
Speaker 4: allows you to fail because you know, you can figure

240
00:14:17,520 --> 00:14:18,040
Speaker 4: something out.

241
00:14:18,679 --> 00:14:21,760
Speaker 2: I think that's incredible for people to hear, because it's

242
00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:25,440
Speaker 2: not just about acting, it's about life. Yeah, and you know,

243
00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:33,240
Speaker 2: being equipped, you know, having skills putting yourself in new situations,

244
00:14:33,520 --> 00:14:39,720
Speaker 2: oftentimes difficult ones. You're constantly learning, You're constantly honing who

245
00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:42,480
Speaker 2: you are, and for that, you were honing who you

246
00:14:42,920 --> 00:14:48,880
Speaker 2: became as an actor. And I read with just almost

247
00:14:49,040 --> 00:14:52,840
Speaker 2: open mouthed wonder at how you all were willing to

248
00:14:53,000 --> 00:14:55,960
Speaker 2: do anything, take on any challenge, you know, just to

249
00:14:56,400 --> 00:14:58,600
Speaker 2: fulfill that craft of being an actor.

250
00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:01,640
Speaker 4: I think it has to be a passion. That's it,

251
00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:06,320
Speaker 4: you know. I have tremendous problems with the younger performers

252
00:15:06,440 --> 00:15:11,880
Speaker 4: today that say I can't basically or it's too hard.

253
00:15:12,400 --> 00:15:14,320
Speaker 4: You have to love it and you have to want

254
00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:17,560
Speaker 4: to be challenged in anything. I'm not just talking about theater.

255
00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:20,040
Speaker 4: You have to want to be challenged in order to

256
00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:24,240
Speaker 4: grow because you love what you're doing and you want

257
00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:26,600
Speaker 4: to learn. That's the other thing you want to learn.

258
00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:28,480
Speaker 4: And I have to I have to say in many

259
00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:31,320
Speaker 4: of these cases, I think maybe that the younger generation

260
00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:36,200
Speaker 4: is fearful, and fear is a crippler. And if you

261
00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:39,960
Speaker 4: don't admit your fear, embrace your fear, then you will

262
00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:43,240
Speaker 4: put up blocks. I can't do that. I won't do that.

263
00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:48,880
Speaker 4: My character wouldn't let me do that. What the fuck? Sorry,

264
00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:53,400
Speaker 4: my character, you know what I'm saying. So, but and

265
00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:56,240
Speaker 4: I think that I think fear. I think we don't

266
00:15:56,240 --> 00:15:58,760
Speaker 4: acknowledge fear enough in our own lives or in our

267
00:15:59,040 --> 00:16:01,240
Speaker 4: whatever it is we do. And if if we David

268
00:16:01,240 --> 00:16:04,240
Speaker 4: Mammott said this, dare to live in the area where

269
00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:08,440
Speaker 4: you do not know what's going on. That's the area

270
00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:11,560
Speaker 4: you learn. That's the area where things start to pop,

271
00:16:11,840 --> 00:16:14,120
Speaker 4: things start to blossom. When you admit you are not

272
00:16:14,320 --> 00:16:15,000
Speaker 4: in control.

273
00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:22,200
Speaker 2: Then you learn you make yourself vulnerable and you kind

274
00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:24,800
Speaker 2: of take a leap of faith, almost, don't you.

275
00:16:29,000 --> 00:16:31,080
Speaker 1: We're taking a quick break. Stay with us.

276
00:16:39,960 --> 00:16:42,480
Speaker 2: Well, the first time I ever saw you on a

277
00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:51,120
Speaker 2: stage was in your breakthrough role in Avida. Okay, that

278
00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:58,520
Speaker 2: was back in nineteen seventy nine when you played Ava perone. Now,

279
00:16:58,680 --> 00:17:02,040
Speaker 2: you were cast over a lot of really big names,

280
00:17:02,240 --> 00:17:03,680
Speaker 2: famous names, people.

281
00:17:03,640 --> 00:17:06,600
Speaker 1: Who were vying for that role, but they picked you.

282
00:17:06,720 --> 00:17:07,720
Speaker 1: Why do you think they picked you?

283
00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:14,080
Speaker 4: I I don't know. Actually, I know that Joanna Merlin

284
00:17:14,119 --> 00:17:18,959
Speaker 4: got rest her soul was house casting director. Joanna had

285
00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:22,440
Speaker 4: seen us in the acting company, and she knew I

286
00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:26,920
Speaker 4: could act. She didn't know whether I could sing, and

287
00:17:28,359 --> 00:17:32,600
Speaker 4: so my auditions were primarily whether I could sing. And

288
00:17:32,760 --> 00:17:37,360
Speaker 4: I think that Hal would have preferred someone that was unknown.

289
00:17:37,920 --> 00:17:40,639
Speaker 4: Prince help Prince would have preferred someone that was unknown

290
00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:44,800
Speaker 4: to have the control that he needed for this particular piece.

291
00:17:45,160 --> 00:17:47,920
Speaker 4: I mean, I'm just speculating that if there was a

292
00:17:47,960 --> 00:17:50,800
Speaker 4: bigger name, there might have been ego clashes. I don't know.

293
00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:54,480
Speaker 4: It's a very difficult part. Mandy and I actually because

294
00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:57,359
Speaker 4: Mandy went to Juliet as well Patinkin. Mandy and I

295
00:17:57,400 --> 00:18:00,639
Speaker 4: were able to connect the dots in because it's only exposition,

296
00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:02,000
Speaker 4: and then she did this, and then she did that,

297
00:18:02,119 --> 00:18:03,560
Speaker 4: and then she did this, and then she did that

298
00:18:03,640 --> 00:18:08,200
Speaker 4: and then she died. You know, It's like, but it's exposition.

299
00:18:08,680 --> 00:18:11,480
Speaker 4: There's very little conflict. There's very little drama in that.

300
00:18:11,640 --> 00:18:13,119
Speaker 4: So Mandy and I were able to figure out how

301
00:18:13,160 --> 00:18:15,639
Speaker 4: to connect the dots and make it dramatic because we

302
00:18:15,760 --> 00:18:19,520
Speaker 4: had training as actors and the singing was the thing

303
00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:20,480
Speaker 4: that killed me.

304
00:18:20,720 --> 00:18:21,080
Speaker 6: And I.

305
00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:25,080
Speaker 4: Said it afterwards, and how I was very upset with

306
00:18:25,119 --> 00:18:27,240
Speaker 4: me for saying it. But it was a terrible experience

307
00:18:27,359 --> 00:18:33,159
Speaker 4: because I couldn't sing it, and it took such willpower.

308
00:18:33,920 --> 00:18:37,520
Speaker 4: I willed my voice every single night, and I couldn't fail.

309
00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:40,720
Speaker 4: I would not allow myself to fail. I would figure

310
00:18:41,240 --> 00:18:45,280
Speaker 4: this out. This is where I belonged on the Broadway

311
00:18:45,359 --> 00:18:49,440
Speaker 4: musical stage. This is a role you can play. You

312
00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:51,680
Speaker 4: just have to figure it out.

313
00:18:52,240 --> 00:18:55,120
Speaker 2: And when you're talking about how difficult it was, it's

314
00:18:55,200 --> 00:18:59,480
Speaker 2: because of the scoring. It's because of the saying, oh,

315
00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:02,119
Speaker 2: you have to hit. It's because of the breathing that

316
00:19:02,400 --> 00:19:04,440
Speaker 2: is so hard in between those notes.

317
00:19:04,560 --> 00:19:07,199
Speaker 4: Right, it sits, and I'm sure there's singers out there.

318
00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:10,200
Speaker 4: It sings in a sopranos passagio. And the passaggio is

319
00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:12,480
Speaker 4: if if there's a rubber band and you stretch the

320
00:19:12,560 --> 00:19:15,840
Speaker 4: rubber band, the weakest part of the rubber band is

321
00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:19,640
Speaker 4: the passaggio in a voice. It goes from chest to head.

322
00:19:19,760 --> 00:19:21,920
Speaker 4: It's just the weakest part. That's where all the money

323
00:19:21,960 --> 00:19:24,399
Speaker 4: notes were, right in the place where you hit it

324
00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:27,639
Speaker 4: wrong one night, it's going to affect your voice for

325
00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:29,560
Speaker 4: the rest of there's somebody in the audience now that

326
00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:33,160
Speaker 4: was in my castmatee in Ivita, and he can tell

327
00:19:33,160 --> 00:19:36,399
Speaker 4: you every story because one of my closest friends in Ivita,

328
00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:39,920
Speaker 4: Peter Marinos, who was my support backstage, who was my

329
00:19:40,040 --> 00:19:44,520
Speaker 4: support in life with Salma Stretta, because he saw what

330
00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:47,680
Speaker 4: I was going through and it was the singing. The

331
00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:50,399
Speaker 4: singing is so well. The first time I heard the

332
00:19:50,520 --> 00:19:53,880
Speaker 4: concept score with Julie Comington, David Essex and Colin Wilkinson,

333
00:19:54,480 --> 00:19:58,320
Speaker 4: this guy hates women. It was, it was, It was

334
00:19:58,400 --> 00:20:01,520
Speaker 4: so difficult, and Well gave me a tape with four

335
00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:06,600
Speaker 4: speeches from the Casa Rozata and the first two the

336
00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:10,720
Speaker 4: voice and this is the comparison. Is only the tone,

337
00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:14,000
Speaker 4: you guys, It's only the tone. You know, that pin

338
00:20:14,240 --> 00:20:18,280
Speaker 4: that that that Sarah Palin has and Marjorie Taylor Green

339
00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:26,480
Speaker 4: has that wason, she had that ping and so you

340
00:20:26,840 --> 00:20:37,480
Speaker 4: have to pu you have to imbue the music with

341
00:20:37,800 --> 00:20:41,159
Speaker 4: that quality in order to get across. He supports you,

342
00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:43,320
Speaker 4: for he loves you, understands you, is one of you,

343
00:20:43,720 --> 00:20:47,800
Speaker 4: you know, and those notes the d's, d's, e's, f's,

344
00:20:47,880 --> 00:20:51,399
Speaker 4: and g's, and you have to in order to convince

345
00:20:51,440 --> 00:20:55,960
Speaker 4: an audience. The death Camisado's an audience. Why she's such

346
00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:58,720
Speaker 4: a cult figure, you cannot sing it lyrically. And that

347
00:20:58,880 --> 00:21:02,280
Speaker 4: was the thing that was killing me, frankly. And what

348
00:21:02,440 --> 00:21:05,639
Speaker 4: happened and I got through New York, Mandy left and

349
00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:08,640
Speaker 4: I went, oh. And it was very difficult when Mandy

350
00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:11,960
Speaker 4: left because he was my rock. But when I left,

351
00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:14,760
Speaker 4: Tyler Gatchell, the general manager, came he said, why are

352
00:21:14,800 --> 00:21:16,879
Speaker 4: you leaving? It said, because I've lost my sense of humor.

353
00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:21,800
Speaker 4: The role was so controversial. My applause used to dip

354
00:21:21,880 --> 00:21:24,439
Speaker 4: after Mandy's and I would go down going it's because

355
00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:28,920
Speaker 4: I'm so good in the part. Literally it would dip

356
00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:32,360
Speaker 4: out because they were so ambiguous on what they felt

357
00:21:32,400 --> 00:21:35,480
Speaker 4: about Ivita Parron. So I had lost my sense of humor.

358
00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:37,639
Speaker 4: I got to get out of here. Then the woman

359
00:21:38,080 --> 00:21:42,639
Speaker 4: that played Ivita and Australia, and she was talking the

360
00:21:42,760 --> 00:21:48,080
Speaker 4: part it knocked every Evita out. It's such a brutal score.

361
00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:50,160
Speaker 4: So they called me and they said would you come down?

362
00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:52,600
Speaker 4: And I thought, well, I'm never going to get asked

363
00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:56,240
Speaker 4: to sing in Australia again? Why not? And then I

364
00:21:56,320 --> 00:21:59,040
Speaker 4: said to my general manager Howard Haynes, Are you buying

365
00:21:59,119 --> 00:22:02,560
Speaker 4: my performance? I don't know where that came from, and

366
00:22:02,680 --> 00:22:04,919
Speaker 4: he said yes. And when I got to Australia, they

367
00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:08,680
Speaker 4: were doing everything on the opposite foot, and I went,

368
00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:10,680
Speaker 4: I'm not learning what you're doing. You're going to learn

369
00:22:10,720 --> 00:22:16,320
Speaker 4: what I'm doing. I didn't have that much time to

370
00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:19,560
Speaker 4: go back into a part and a part that scared

371
00:22:19,920 --> 00:22:23,359
Speaker 4: me to death, and now I'm in the part with

372
00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:26,480
Speaker 4: a brilliant company of just the most wonderful people in

373
00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:30,080
Speaker 4: the world, and there was no pressure to prove myself.

374
00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:33,760
Speaker 4: I wasn't in New York, one of the cruelest environments

375
00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:36,880
Speaker 4: if you were a performer. I wasn't in New York.

376
00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:41,800
Speaker 4: I didn't have to deal with critics that were cruel.

377
00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:44,440
Speaker 4: David Mammmett said this as well, he doesn't care what

378
00:22:44,560 --> 00:22:46,320
Speaker 4: the critics say as long as he knows they love

379
00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:49,119
Speaker 4: the theater. I'm not sure our critics have ever loved

380
00:22:49,240 --> 00:22:49,640
Speaker 4: the theater.

381
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:57,119
Speaker 2: Well, this was really revelatory to me because watching you

382
00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:01,120
Speaker 2: do this performance, which you know I have vivid memories

383
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:04,800
Speaker 2: of all those years ago, there was no sense at

384
00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:07,159
Speaker 2: all how difficult it was.

385
00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:07,679
Speaker 4: I mean, you.

386
00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:11,320
Speaker 2: Inhabited that role, your arms up in that big v

387
00:23:11,800 --> 00:23:16,840
Speaker 2: that you know, just was thrilling. I was not, frankly,

388
00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:19,600
Speaker 2: you know, taken by the controversy over her, but I

389
00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:22,200
Speaker 2: know that there was a lot of controversy there. And

390
00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:25,600
Speaker 2: so you won a Tony Award, how difficult it was,

391
00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:29,880
Speaker 2: and you won a Tony Award and you entered Broadway

392
00:23:30,040 --> 00:23:34,440
Speaker 2: history and you were literally on your way because people

393
00:23:34,600 --> 00:23:38,000
Speaker 2: were just knocked out by your performance and you were too,

394
00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:40,080
Speaker 2: but they gave you a Tony for it.

395
00:23:41,400 --> 00:23:44,440
Speaker 4: But it's interesting because you know, there was a time

396
00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:51,240
Speaker 4: in our Broadway legacy where leading ladies were celebrated and

397
00:23:51,359 --> 00:23:53,840
Speaker 4: then leading men were celebrated, and I was in the

398
00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:57,679
Speaker 4: period where leading men were celebrated. Mikael Barishnikov and Gregory

399
00:23:57,760 --> 00:24:01,760
Speaker 4: Hines and Mandy and David Agdenstein all went off to Hollywood.

400
00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:07,000
Speaker 4: That did not happen for me. It was a controversial character.

401
00:24:07,520 --> 00:24:10,120
Speaker 4: It was a character that people were upset was being

402
00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:13,200
Speaker 4: glorified on stage because she harbored the Nazis. The Patanistas

403
00:24:13,480 --> 00:24:16,360
Speaker 4: harbored the Nazis. And so I had a very difficult

404
00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:18,560
Speaker 4: time after I left Dvita getting work.

405
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:22,920
Speaker 2: I wanted people to hear that, because that is not

406
00:24:23,119 --> 00:24:26,679
Speaker 2: what anyone would think who loves the theater loves you.

407
00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:29,080
Speaker 4: That it was.

408
00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:30,359
Speaker 1: It was kind of a shock.

409
00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:33,440
Speaker 2: I mean, there you were with this Tony Award and

410
00:24:34,080 --> 00:24:37,720
Speaker 2: you didn't have the kind of offers that shot to

411
00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:38,199
Speaker 2: come now.

412
00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:42,000
Speaker 4: And the thing. The other thing was, I remember, so

413
00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:45,520
Speaker 4: leave you Chule as a god Risisol He's a Romanian director,

414
00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:49,800
Speaker 4: and I find that I prefer European directors to American

415
00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:53,600
Speaker 4: directors because of their concepts, because they come in with

416
00:24:54,240 --> 00:24:58,000
Speaker 4: these fantastic ideas that you have to fulfill and leave

417
00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:01,159
Speaker 4: you was doing his world famous As You Like It

418
00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:04,480
Speaker 4: at the Guthrie and he wanted me to play Rosalind.

419
00:25:04,680 --> 00:25:07,520
Speaker 4: And he came to the dressing room with Margot Harley,

420
00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:10,479
Speaker 4: who is now one of the producers of the Acting Company,

421
00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:13,040
Speaker 4: and he said, will you play Rosalind and As You

422
00:25:13,240 --> 00:25:18,320
Speaker 4: Like It? And I said yes. And when I left Ivita,

423
00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:21,680
Speaker 4: that was my next role. And I was sort of

424
00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:26,200
Speaker 4: admonished by my agents by taking a role at the Guthrie.

425
00:25:27,160 --> 00:25:29,280
Speaker 4: What are you doing? And I said, I'm going back

426
00:25:29,359 --> 00:25:32,560
Speaker 4: to my roots. I'm going back to what I was

427
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:36,600
Speaker 4: trained for theater. And so I went back to my

428
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:38,080
Speaker 4: roots and it.

429
00:25:38,119 --> 00:25:44,560
Speaker 2: To feel that really, you know, rejuvenated you totally totally yeah.

430
00:25:44,600 --> 00:25:47,520
Speaker 4: I mean it's it's it's something that I would I

431
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:49,920
Speaker 4: would do today. Well, for instance, I don't think I'll

432
00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:52,639
Speaker 4: ever go back to Broadway because I don't know what

433
00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:55,200
Speaker 4: Broadway is anymore. That doesn't mean I won't be on

434
00:25:55,280 --> 00:25:58,120
Speaker 4: the stage in New York, but i'll be downtown. I'll

435
00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:00,600
Speaker 4: be east of Broadway, I'll be west of Bay, I'll

436
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:03,720
Speaker 4: be north of Broadway, I'll be south of Broadway. But

437
00:26:03,840 --> 00:26:07,960
Speaker 4: I don't think Broadway is sustainable anymore. I don't know

438
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:12,480
Speaker 4: where Broadway is. I think it's the circus Las Vegas

439
00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:17,120
Speaker 4: and Disneyland, I and nobody. You can't have a show

440
00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:18,879
Speaker 4: that runs. I was talking to Amber. You heard me

441
00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:22,280
Speaker 4: talking to Amber. Some like it hot closing with those reviews,

442
00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:27,359
Speaker 4: What is going on? I don't understand it. So you

443
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:30,719
Speaker 4: can't sustain anything. You cannot sustain something, so it breaks

444
00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:35,080
Speaker 4: your heart. And my heart will continue to be broken

445
00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:37,960
Speaker 4: because I'll probably be in more bombs, you know, on

446
00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:40,800
Speaker 4: more flops whatever, but at least I will be doing something.

447
00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:47,040
Speaker 4: I'm here to recommend ja Ja's African hair bray and

448
00:26:47,280 --> 00:26:53,840
Speaker 4: Stereophonic to non for profit productions that are what theater

449
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:55,120
Speaker 4: should be in this city.

450
00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:57,040
Speaker 1: Oh, you've got a great response to that.

451
00:26:57,320 --> 00:26:57,600
Speaker 4: Patty.

452
00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:01,880
Speaker 1: So you were talking about how you like European directors.

453
00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:06,359
Speaker 2: You've obviously been on Broadway, you've also been in the

454
00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:09,080
Speaker 2: West End in London. What's the difference and and and

455
00:27:09,240 --> 00:27:12,399
Speaker 2: tell us a little bit about how you compare the experiences.

456
00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:14,000
Speaker 4: Well, I don't think there's any difference. I think if

457
00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:16,520
Speaker 4: you put on something good, audiences will react the same

458
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:19,399
Speaker 4: way because we're really the same person, you know what

459
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:23,080
Speaker 4: I mean, it's it's and so the Well, I'll tell

460
00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:27,200
Speaker 4: you a story when I did lems in London, and

461
00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:30,960
Speaker 4: this was Royal Shakespeare Company actors who were doing Shakespeare,

462
00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:34,639
Speaker 4: not musicals, and I was the only musical person. I'm

463
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:36,639
Speaker 4: one of my favorite two stories, one of my favorite

464
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:40,040
Speaker 4: John Carrod and Trevor Nunn. We're telling me Nopati when

465
00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:43,359
Speaker 4: you sing I dreamed a dream, you tell it to

466
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:45,760
Speaker 4: the audience. I looked at them, What did they think

467
00:27:45,840 --> 00:27:51,320
Speaker 4: they brought over here? They said, yeah, I know, yeah,

468
00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:52,879
Speaker 4: I know what you're supposed to do. You brought me

469
00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:56,320
Speaker 4: over here. But but so Trevor Nunn, it's the first

470
00:27:56,400 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 4: preview and Trevor Nunn calls us all to the stage

471
00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:02,680
Speaker 4: and he goes. You know that the Royal Shakespeare audience

472
00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:06,720
Speaker 4: will not be used to a musical, and do not

473
00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:10,600
Speaker 4: expect the kind of response you get when you do

474
00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:18,000
Speaker 4: Shakespeare at the end of the show, literally, And so

475
00:28:18,920 --> 00:28:22,520
Speaker 4: I think, if you give people what they want, or

476
00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:26,800
Speaker 4: you move an audience, the audience is transcended. Everybody will

477
00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:29,920
Speaker 4: respond the same way. So I find no difference in

478
00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:33,520
Speaker 4: London audiences and New York audiences. It's you go to

479
00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:36,240
Speaker 4: the theater for a reason and if you are more

480
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:39,840
Speaker 4: than satisfied you you react that way.

481
00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:42,920
Speaker 1: Well, you've also done a lot of work in TV

482
00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 1: and film.

483
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:49,600
Speaker 2: You know, you had these hilarious cameos in Lena Dunham's

484
00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:53,520
Speaker 2: TV series Girls, you were a four hundred and fifty

485
00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:58,680
Speaker 2: year old witch in the upcoming Marvel mini series Agatha

486
00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:05,040
Speaker 2: Coven of Chaos, and then there's this part as Mona,

487
00:29:05,480 --> 00:29:08,520
Speaker 2: a pretty cruel and manipulative mother in the film bo

488
00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:11,400
Speaker 2: Is Afraid, which came out this past spring.

489
00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:14,840
Speaker 1: So what would it like being in a Marvel mini series?

490
00:29:15,080 --> 00:29:17,600
Speaker 4: Well, okay, I have to talk about First of all,

491
00:29:18,760 --> 00:29:20,920
Speaker 4: I give up my equity card and I think I'm

492
00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:23,880
Speaker 4: sitting in my apartment in at the kitchen table going

493
00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:26,480
Speaker 4: I wonder what dire action my career is going to

494
00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:33,840
Speaker 4: go in ring Hello, Marvel calling Marvel, called am my agents.

495
00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:37,240
Speaker 4: I said, well, she said, talk to these people. Jack

496
00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:44,360
Speaker 4: Schaefer created wand Division? Did anybody see WandaVision? Jack is brilliant.

497
00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:46,840
Speaker 4: She is the creator of one Division. She has a

498
00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:50,440
Speaker 4: three picture deal with Marvel. She spun off Catherine Hahn's

499
00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:56,360
Speaker 4: character Agatha. So we are the second installment of this triad,

500
00:29:56,840 --> 00:30:01,400
Speaker 4: and we are a coven of witches. And is Catherine

501
00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:07,840
Speaker 4: Aubrey Plaza shares Amida Ali on me and Joe Locke

502
00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:12,840
Speaker 4: from heart Stoppers. And it was one of the best

503
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:17,440
Speaker 4: experiences I have ever had in my career because of

504
00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:22,760
Speaker 4: Jack and Catherine, who were our leaders. It was a

505
00:30:23,560 --> 00:30:29,040
Speaker 4: set filled with respect, support, love and trust and we

506
00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:34,360
Speaker 4: as women and poor Joe, we as women bonded and

507
00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:37,280
Speaker 4: we still are bonded, and we are a coven and

508
00:30:38,920 --> 00:30:42,360
Speaker 4: it's coming out next Halloween. We we finished you and

509
00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:46,560
Speaker 4: we finished right under the strike. And Jack came into

510
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:49,760
Speaker 4: my trailer and well, basically, when is this coming out?

511
00:30:49,800 --> 00:30:52,360
Speaker 4: She said, A year from now? I'm reserving my walker,

512
00:30:54,760 --> 00:30:57,520
Speaker 4: but it was an incredible experience, and she's an incredible writer.

513
00:30:57,680 --> 00:31:00,000
Speaker 4: So I don't know whether I've had a Marvel experience.

514
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:03,760
Speaker 4: I've had a Jack Schaeffer experience, which is incredible.

515
00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:09,680
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, I have a couple of lightning round questions here.

516
00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:13,760
Speaker 2: All right, what is the favorite role you've ever played?

517
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:16,640
Speaker 4: I don't have one. It's too limiting.

518
00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:18,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's that's that's a fair thing.

519
00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:19,840
Speaker 4: Yeas too limiting.

520
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:20,200
Speaker 1: Yeah.

521
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:25,720
Speaker 2: Are there roles that you've had that you thought should

522
00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:27,120
Speaker 2: have won an award that didn't?

523
00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:31,640
Speaker 4: Oh? Yeah, every single one of them.

524
00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:38,560
Speaker 2: So so just just just tell us all okay, you've

525
00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:43,200
Speaker 2: got what three Tony's? Yeah, okay, what are the other two?

526
00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:43,640
Speaker 4: For one?

527
00:31:43,760 --> 00:31:45,800
Speaker 1: We know it's a Vita, but Madame Rose in.

528
00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:51,200
Speaker 4: Gypsy and Evita and Joanne and company jo in a company?

529
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:54,600
Speaker 1: D Do you have any interest ever directing?

530
00:31:56,880 --> 00:31:59,560
Speaker 4: I don't think I'm smart enough to direct, I don't

531
00:31:59,600 --> 00:32:01,400
Speaker 4: think i'm fond enough to direct, and I don't think

532
00:32:01,440 --> 00:32:05,200
Speaker 4: I have the patience to direct. But I do give

533
00:32:05,640 --> 00:32:09,360
Speaker 4: what are quote unquote master classes to singers when I'm

534
00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:11,560
Speaker 4: on the road, and they're not master classes. I am

535
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:14,800
Speaker 4: a master of nothing because I am still learning. But

536
00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:19,000
Speaker 4: I am an audience member and I have experience, and

537
00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:23,080
Speaker 4: so I'm able to tell young kids what they're doing

538
00:32:24,360 --> 00:32:27,880
Speaker 4: that isn't engaging an audience, it's not engaging me. And

539
00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:32,000
Speaker 4: I'm your audience, and I can see them transforming to

540
00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:34,800
Speaker 4: I can see them learning when I tell them. And

541
00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:37,640
Speaker 4: it's the simplest stand still. And it's as simple as

542
00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:41,400
Speaker 4: change the key. Where's your power? And your power is

543
00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:45,280
Speaker 4: stillness and the right key boom, nothing else. You're free.

544
00:32:46,080 --> 00:32:49,080
Speaker 4: You're free when your voice is free. You don't have

545
00:32:49,240 --> 00:32:53,120
Speaker 4: to do this. And it's the hardest thing to stand still.

546
00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:55,560
Speaker 4: But where do we all look when we're on stage.

547
00:32:56,200 --> 00:32:59,960
Speaker 4: We're looking at the stillest person on stage, wondering why

548
00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:04,160
Speaker 4: they're thinking. We're not looking everybody that's moving around. We're

549
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:07,920
Speaker 4: wondering what he's doing, which is nothing, which is everything?

550
00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:10,080
Speaker 1: Oh wow, I love that.

551
00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:16,080
Speaker 2: Well, if not directing, you know, coaching, teaching, you know,

552
00:33:16,200 --> 00:33:20,520
Speaker 2: something that really gives you a chance to, you know,

553
00:33:21,360 --> 00:33:24,520
Speaker 2: talk about all these experiences and all these skills and

554
00:33:24,760 --> 00:33:26,520
Speaker 2: everything that you've learned.

555
00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:29,520
Speaker 4: And I love to give it back because I have

556
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:32,240
Speaker 4: to say, there's so much talent on the stage I

557
00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:35,880
Speaker 4: love going to the theater, and I'm seeing not great

558
00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 4: stuff except for the two that I've mentioned, But what's

559
00:33:40,040 --> 00:33:42,920
Speaker 4: on the stage, the actors and the singers and the

560
00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:49,080
Speaker 4: dancers on the stage are extraordinary and they deserve better material.

561
00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:54,640
Speaker 2: Well, before we get to the great treat of you

562
00:33:54,840 --> 00:33:58,800
Speaker 2: singing for us, I want to just also mention that,

563
00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:02,440
Speaker 2: you know, during this amazing career.

564
00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:04,440
Speaker 1: Of yours, you're also a mom.

565
00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:09,920
Speaker 2: How I've always wondered, because it is such a demanding

566
00:34:10,640 --> 00:34:14,040
Speaker 2: work schedule when you're in a in a play, how

567
00:34:14,080 --> 00:34:17,320
Speaker 2: did you balance, you know, raising your son Josh with

568
00:34:17,640 --> 00:34:18,680
Speaker 2: everything else you had to do?

569
00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:19,719
Speaker 4: How did you do it?

570
00:34:21,520 --> 00:34:22,359
Speaker 1: Same way you did?

571
00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:23,520
Speaker 2: Yeah?

572
00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:28,439
Speaker 4: It your job was so much tougher than mine. Every

573
00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:35,200
Speaker 4: single job you've had is so much tougher than mine. Well,

574
00:34:36,400 --> 00:34:37,440
Speaker 4: you know, right back at you.

575
00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:42,200
Speaker 2: But I did learn that Josh also sings an X

576
00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:44,800
Speaker 2: and you've had a chance to perform together.

577
00:34:44,960 --> 00:34:47,880
Speaker 4: What was that like? Well, it sees my son, and

578
00:34:47,960 --> 00:34:51,080
Speaker 4: I'm worried for him, you know what I mean? You know,

579
00:34:51,160 --> 00:34:53,759
Speaker 4: and I don't know what Chelsea wanted to do, But

580
00:34:54,200 --> 00:34:56,600
Speaker 4: Josh grew up in a star dressing room and he

581
00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:58,959
Speaker 4: wanted to be on the stage. He wants to work

582
00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:01,719
Speaker 4: in the theater, he wants to work in film. That's

583
00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:04,160
Speaker 4: where he grew up. That's what he wants to do.

584
00:35:04,719 --> 00:35:07,520
Speaker 4: And if you say no, they're gonna do it anyway.

585
00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:11,680
Speaker 4: And so I worry for him in today's world period,

586
00:35:12,239 --> 00:35:14,480
Speaker 4: whether it's show business or just walking down the street.

587
00:35:15,600 --> 00:35:19,040
Speaker 4: You know, to be with him on stage is so sweet.

588
00:35:19,239 --> 00:35:22,560
Speaker 4: It's so sweet. And I just hope all of you

589
00:35:22,719 --> 00:35:26,320
Speaker 4: out there that are of that age, in your thirties

590
00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:28,160
Speaker 4: and trying to make it in this business, I wish

591
00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 4: you all the best of luck and courage, courage, courage.

592
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:36,120
Speaker 4: Something will happen, something will change. We will make it. Oh,

593
00:35:36,200 --> 00:35:36,800
Speaker 4: I could cry.

594
00:35:39,160 --> 00:35:43,319
Speaker 2: I also, really I want to thank you for your

595
00:35:43,600 --> 00:35:48,720
Speaker 2: activism and how outspoken you are in case you haven't noticed,

596
00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:59,560
Speaker 2: especially you're being outspoken against the anti LGBTQ legislation and

597
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:05,040
Speaker 2: because you know that's something that you chose to do

598
00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:08,120
Speaker 2: and you've been a really necessary voice.

599
00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:10,759
Speaker 4: Well, thank you, you know. And I don't think I'm

600
00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:14,800
Speaker 4: doing anything extraordinary. It's just that I have family and

601
00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:22,160
Speaker 4: friends in the LGBTQ community and I love them, and

602
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:28,560
Speaker 4: I am protecting my friends and my family, and this

603
00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:32,960
Speaker 4: is this is insanity. We're in insane times right now,

604
00:36:33,400 --> 00:36:35,240
Speaker 4: and this is insanity.

605
00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:39,359
Speaker 7: I don't know what this is about, but it's it's

606
00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:43,800
Speaker 7: so distressed, so much cruelty, oh and so much you know,

607
00:36:44,239 --> 00:36:49,560
Speaker 7: fear and hatred and anger and insecurity, and it really

608
00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:53,520
Speaker 7: is almost hard to understand how we got to where

609
00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:53,759
Speaker 7: we are.

610
00:36:53,960 --> 00:36:56,839
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't. I mean, I keep wondering. I mean,

611
00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:58,759
Speaker 4: I'm seventy four years old, and I don't know what

612
00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:01,440
Speaker 4: I expected when I was forty what I would be

613
00:37:01,560 --> 00:37:04,480
Speaker 4: like when I was seventy four. But I never expected this.

614
00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:08,920
Speaker 4: I never expected the PTSD that I live with daily

615
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:12,320
Speaker 4: to be as extreme. I never expected that I'm on

616
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:16,600
Speaker 4: the verge of tears all the time. I never expected

617
00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:20,279
Speaker 4: that I would be as terrorized as I am. I

618
00:37:20,480 --> 00:37:23,239
Speaker 4: didn't expect to live out the rest of my life

619
00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:26,920
Speaker 4: in this kind of life fear. I don't, And so

620
00:37:27,360 --> 00:37:30,840
Speaker 4: I will speak up. I will because it's an injustice

621
00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:34,480
Speaker 4: to us. All I don't. I can't make cancer tails

622
00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:40,800
Speaker 4: of anything. Why is love such a underestimated word, a

623
00:37:40,960 --> 00:37:45,879
Speaker 4: dirty word, and hate such a powerful word? Why isn't

624
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:49,839
Speaker 4: love a more powerful word than hate? And why are

625
00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:56,480
Speaker 4: people that just love each other being tormented. You're all closeted.

626
00:37:56,560 --> 00:37:57,279
Speaker 4: That's what I think.

627
00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:05,720
Speaker 1: We'll be right back.

628
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:20,640
Speaker 2: And talking about, you know, plays, musicals, history, things that

629
00:38:20,680 --> 00:38:23,239
Speaker 2: can break your heart, try to give you hope afterwards.

630
00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:29,680
Speaker 2: You know, I've recently signed on to help this incredible

631
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:32,440
Speaker 2: musical about the American suffrage movement.

632
00:38:32,880 --> 00:38:37,080
Speaker 1: Sucks, and you know, it's a part of our history

633
00:38:37,160 --> 00:38:37,960
Speaker 1: that people don't know.

634
00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:41,640
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, women were thrown in jail for

635
00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:44,560
Speaker 2: wanting to vote, they were force fed when they went

636
00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:47,600
Speaker 2: on hunger strikes. And when people try to, you know,

637
00:38:47,760 --> 00:38:51,920
Speaker 2: literally eliminate huge chunks of our history, I just get

638
00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:53,840
Speaker 2: more determined we're going to tell the story.

639
00:38:54,040 --> 00:38:58,360
Speaker 4: Well, I don't understand, in the richest and most progressive

640
00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:03,040
Speaker 4: country in the world, why we are so adamant of suppressing.

641
00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:07,320
Speaker 4: I don't understand that why we don't keep moving forward.

642
00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:10,040
Speaker 1: I don't understand that people want to pull us back.

643
00:39:10,080 --> 00:39:11,759
Speaker 1: I don't get absolutely get it.

644
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:16,080
Speaker 2: Well, you know, I know you are currently preparing a

645
00:39:16,200 --> 00:39:19,680
Speaker 2: new concert, Patty Lapone, A Life in Notes, that will

646
00:39:19,719 --> 00:39:21,360
Speaker 2: be at Carnegie Hall in April.

647
00:39:21,400 --> 00:39:22,239
Speaker 1: Can you tell us about that?

648
00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:25,680
Speaker 4: Well, I mean, I'm sure a lot of you know that.

649
00:39:25,719 --> 00:39:27,600
Speaker 4: I just I do a lot of concert work, which

650
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:30,000
Speaker 4: was always you know, we do, those of us that

651
00:39:30,080 --> 00:39:33,880
Speaker 4: go unemployed to supplement our income with concert work, cabaret

652
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:36,399
Speaker 4: and concert work. And I love doing the concert work.

653
00:39:36,440 --> 00:39:40,320
Speaker 4: And Joseph Fulk and my musical director is right there, Hello, darling.

654
00:39:40,480 --> 00:39:44,160
Speaker 4: He's getting to play. But Joe, Josephin and Scott Whitman

655
00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 4: and I and Jeffrey Richmond have done these shows for

656
00:39:49,760 --> 00:39:52,440
Speaker 4: several years, and this one I didn't want it to

657
00:39:52,520 --> 00:39:56,000
Speaker 4: be about Broadway. I wanted to be about the touchstones,

658
00:39:56,160 --> 00:39:58,880
Speaker 4: musical touchstones in my life growing up on Long Island.

659
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:01,279
Speaker 4: You know, we all have a song. We all have

660
00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:04,239
Speaker 4: several songs in our lives that we know where we

661
00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:07,480
Speaker 4: were when we heard that song and what we felt.

662
00:40:07,880 --> 00:40:11,799
Speaker 4: And so I'm looking to create a show. We're all

663
00:40:11,840 --> 00:40:15,000
Speaker 4: looking to create a show where the songs are the

664
00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:18,360
Speaker 4: stuff that I grew up with and that meant something

665
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:20,680
Speaker 4: to me. We're struggling right now. I grew up in

666
00:40:20,719 --> 00:40:23,960
Speaker 4: the fifties in America. We had won a war, the

667
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:26,680
Speaker 4: middle class was thriving, but all the music were about

668
00:40:26,719 --> 00:40:34,280
Speaker 4: teenage car crashes. Teen Angel patches, she dies, she drowns herself,

669
00:40:34,680 --> 00:40:37,120
Speaker 4: Teen Angel goes running back to the room. The ring

670
00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:40,440
Speaker 4: is she gets hit by a train. It's like everybody's

671
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:44,800
Speaker 4: dying in cars in the fifties. So I you know

672
00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:47,879
Speaker 4: that we're looking at those songs from my past. Also,

673
00:40:48,719 --> 00:40:50,400
Speaker 4: when I moved to New York City and you know,

674
00:40:50,600 --> 00:40:54,360
Speaker 4: was a pothead and a hippie and heard Lilac Wine

675
00:40:54,440 --> 00:40:58,680
Speaker 4: for the first time. Lilac Wine written in nineteen forty nine,

676
00:40:59,680 --> 00:41:03,840
Speaker 4: but Nina Simons singing Lilac Wine, I will never forget

677
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:06,319
Speaker 4: hearing that song for the first time in my life.

678
00:41:06,520 --> 00:41:09,959
Speaker 4: I think I was eighteen, free in New York City

679
00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:12,600
Speaker 4: and I heard Lilac Wine and I can see the

680
00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:16,399
Speaker 4: smoke haze, I can see that, you know. But it's

681
00:41:16,440 --> 00:41:20,400
Speaker 4: those kind of songs that meant something to me growing up.

682
00:41:21,120 --> 00:41:22,560
Speaker 1: But everybody can relate to that.

683
00:41:22,719 --> 00:41:26,040
Speaker 2: And as a special trait for our audience, I believe

684
00:41:26,080 --> 00:41:28,600
Speaker 2: you've got a song that you will sing.

685
00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:30,359
Speaker 1: Can you set it up?

686
00:41:30,480 --> 00:41:36,160
Speaker 4: And yeah, it's been cut from the show. But also

687
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:38,600
Speaker 4: you guys, I was nervous to do this. I have

688
00:41:38,680 --> 00:41:40,239
Speaker 4: to tell you, Hillary, I was nervous to do this.

689
00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:46,400
Speaker 4: I feel like I feel very emotional lately, and I

690
00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:48,920
Speaker 4: you know, I think the world is deeply affecting me,

691
00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:52,680
Speaker 4: So forgive me. But I am tearful when I sing

692
00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:54,279
Speaker 4: this song, and I'm going to try not to cry.

693
00:41:54,719 --> 00:41:55,520
Speaker 4: Am I supposed to God?

694
00:41:55,520 --> 00:41:56,160
Speaker 1: Any sing any.

695
00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:00,680
Speaker 4: Just ah?

696
00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:15,360
Speaker 8: Falcon ladies and tell men, the sound of applause is delicious.

697
00:42:16,440 --> 00:42:19,280
Speaker 9: It's a thrill to have the world at your feet.

698
00:42:20,719 --> 00:42:25,240
Speaker 9: The praise of the crowd is exciting. But I've learned

699
00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:29,879
Speaker 9: that is not what makes our life complete. There's one

700
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:33,080
Speaker 9: thing you can do for the rest of your days

701
00:42:33,560 --> 00:42:34,360
Speaker 9: that's worth.

702
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:47,120
Speaker 5: More than applause, the screaming crowd, the bookcase. Make someone happy,

703
00:42:48,320 --> 00:42:53,759
Speaker 5: make just wan someone happy, Make just one.

704
00:42:54,080 --> 00:43:02,680
Speaker 4: Heart the heart you say to wah, a smither cheers you.

705
00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:06,480
Speaker 1: One face that lies when it nears.

706
00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:11,440
Speaker 4: You once saw your reading.

707
00:43:12,560 --> 00:43:15,400
Speaker 3: To fin.

708
00:43:17,320 --> 00:43:22,400
Speaker 4: If you win, it comes and goals in a minute.

709
00:43:23,280 --> 00:43:30,600
Speaker 4: Where's the real stuff in life? To clean to lorne

710
00:43:32,640 --> 00:43:33,560
Speaker 4: is the answer?

711
00:43:34,440 --> 00:43:37,520
Speaker 8: Someone to lie is the answer.

712
00:43:38,040 --> 00:43:49,000
Speaker 6: Wants you fall the build a world around them, someone happy,

713
00:43:50,200 --> 00:43:57,520
Speaker 6: Make just one someone happy, and you who we'll be happy?

714
00:43:57,840 --> 00:44:17,440
Speaker 4: To hon is the answer.

715
00:44:18,320 --> 00:44:26,719
Speaker 1: Someone to love is the answer. What to fall that build.

716
00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:30,280
Speaker 6: Your world around them by.

717
00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:41,000
Speaker 4: Somewhat happy, Make just what somewhat happy, and you will

718
00:44:41,160 --> 00:44:42,840
Speaker 4: be happy to.

719
00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:52,120
Speaker 1: Lethb.

720
00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:01,200
Speaker 4: Wow.

721
00:45:01,880 --> 00:45:07,840
Speaker 2: Wow, well you made a lot of someone's happy Amber.

722
00:45:08,080 --> 00:45:11,040
Speaker 1: I'm so glad you're Backy.

723
00:45:11,960 --> 00:45:16,200
Speaker 2: And you know, Amber is a glass is half full

724
00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:18,720
Speaker 2: to a glasses overflowing kind of person.

725
00:45:19,600 --> 00:45:23,879
Speaker 1: And you're a Broadway uh, you know, star in your

726
00:45:23,920 --> 00:45:24,439
Speaker 1: own right.

727
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:28,239
Speaker 2: You co wrote the script to Some Like It Hot,

728
00:45:32,960 --> 00:45:38,800
Speaker 2: and now you're updating the script for the Broadway revival.

729
00:45:38,520 --> 00:45:39,320
Speaker 4: Of The Wiz.

730
00:45:43,680 --> 00:45:45,640
Speaker 1: Tell us what that's like. Do you remember seeing the

731
00:45:45,680 --> 00:45:46,480
Speaker 1: Wiz as a kid?

732
00:45:47,360 --> 00:45:47,560
Speaker 4: Yes.

733
00:45:47,840 --> 00:45:52,800
Speaker 3: I was talking to someone and I realized that I

734
00:45:52,880 --> 00:45:56,480
Speaker 3: could say this. I've never known life without the Wiz.

735
00:45:57,080 --> 00:46:00,759
Speaker 3: Someone was asking me, Yeah, you remember your first experience? No,

736
00:46:02,160 --> 00:46:04,840
Speaker 3: do you remember the first time you watched the news?

737
00:46:05,680 --> 00:46:07,200
Speaker 4: No? So I don't.

738
00:46:07,320 --> 00:46:09,879
Speaker 3: I've just always known life with the Whiz and it's

739
00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:13,280
Speaker 3: always been a huge part of I mean, I feel

740
00:46:13,400 --> 00:46:15,480
Speaker 3: like it. I feel like I'm not making this up.

741
00:46:15,520 --> 00:46:18,800
Speaker 3: And that it came on NBC's on Sundays when I

742
00:46:18,920 --> 00:46:23,400
Speaker 3: was little, I think, I think that's true. But I

743
00:46:23,640 --> 00:46:26,440
Speaker 3: know what's true is when you're sick and staying home

744
00:46:26,480 --> 00:46:29,759
Speaker 3: from school after you watch The Price is Right, you

745
00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:33,400
Speaker 3: would get the the VCR tape of The Wiz and

746
00:46:33,480 --> 00:46:34,120
Speaker 3: you would watch that.

747
00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:42,200
Speaker 2: You know. Amber also has a podcast. She hosts The

748
00:46:42,480 --> 00:46:47,359
Speaker 2: Amber and Lacey Lacy and Amber Show. Lacey is your

749
00:46:47,520 --> 00:46:48,400
Speaker 2: sister Lacy?

750
00:46:48,400 --> 00:46:48,880
Speaker 1: Where you at?

751
00:46:49,040 --> 00:46:49,160
Speaker 3: Hey?

752
00:46:49,239 --> 00:46:49,399
Speaker 4: Man?

753
00:46:49,719 --> 00:46:51,520
Speaker 1: Is Lacy here today? Okay?

754
00:46:52,320 --> 00:46:54,879
Speaker 2: Also, you know you guys have written books together. You've

755
00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:57,879
Speaker 2: been you've been talking. I guess since you could both talk?

756
00:46:58,200 --> 00:47:00,759
Speaker 2: And was it like doing that with your sister?

757
00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:05,920
Speaker 3: Lacey is horrible? So everybody who's sitting by her, I am.

758
00:47:06,120 --> 00:47:11,040
Speaker 3: So we have so much fun. We wrote a book

759
00:47:11,480 --> 00:47:14,400
Speaker 3: called You'll Never Believe It Happened to Lacey Crazy Stories

760
00:47:14,400 --> 00:47:18,400
Speaker 3: about racism? And she yeah, yeah, that person's like, oh,

761
00:47:18,440 --> 00:47:23,480
Speaker 3: no versism, they know, but we The book is just

762
00:47:23,719 --> 00:47:27,400
Speaker 3: all the unbelievable stories that are crazy and racists that

763
00:47:27,480 --> 00:47:29,320
Speaker 3: have happened to Lacey that are funny.

764
00:47:29,640 --> 00:47:31,040
Speaker 4: And it's just the funny.

765
00:47:31,360 --> 00:47:36,239
Speaker 3: One example, one quick example, so man, Lacey was she added,

766
00:47:36,360 --> 00:47:39,080
Speaker 3: this was a while ago, and she was paying with

767
00:47:39,360 --> 00:47:43,080
Speaker 3: a check someplace. Now a million years ago, you could

768
00:47:43,120 --> 00:47:47,040
Speaker 3: get black history checks and they had like Malcolm ex and.

769
00:47:47,480 --> 00:47:47,840
Speaker 4: And so.

770
00:47:49,400 --> 00:47:53,360
Speaker 1: She pays for this check, she gives into the catcher.

771
00:47:53,480 --> 00:47:56,040
Speaker 3: The casher goes, I didn't know you could get your

772
00:47:56,239 --> 00:48:02,880
Speaker 3: picture on checks. And the person on the check is

773
00:48:03,160 --> 00:48:09,480
Speaker 3: Harriet Tubman. It's not like a rendition of it.

774
00:48:09,840 --> 00:48:13,319
Speaker 4: It's the picture you're thinking of. There's the only one.

775
00:48:16,880 --> 00:48:18,680
Speaker 4: There's just like a million stories like that.

776
00:48:19,080 --> 00:48:19,520
Speaker 9: A lot.

777
00:48:21,360 --> 00:48:26,319
Speaker 2: Better to laugh, I guess right. So, Amber, I think

778
00:48:26,320 --> 00:48:29,160
Speaker 2: you've got some questions for us from the audience.

779
00:48:29,360 --> 00:48:32,200
Speaker 3: Okay, so the audience asked a lot of thoughtful questions.

780
00:48:32,719 --> 00:48:35,479
Speaker 3: Derek asked a question. I'm very interested in the answer

781
00:48:35,760 --> 00:48:39,800
Speaker 3: for Patty. We hear that Aubrey Plaza is your roommate.

782
00:48:41,560 --> 00:48:43,160
Speaker 3: How has that been working out?

783
00:48:45,719 --> 00:48:51,879
Speaker 4: It's been great. Aubrey and I, you know, were part

784
00:48:51,880 --> 00:48:57,440
Speaker 4: of the Covin rebonded. Aubrey's making her theatrical debut downtown

785
00:48:57,520 --> 00:48:59,920
Speaker 4: at the Lucia Ortel and Danny and the Deep Lucy

786
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:03,280
Speaker 4: with Christopher Abbott. Aubrey has never been on stage before,

787
00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:07,040
Speaker 4: and I felt her responsibility for taking care of her.

788
00:49:08,760 --> 00:49:14,320
Speaker 4: She had no idea what rehearsal technicals, rehearsal en previews

789
00:49:15,040 --> 00:49:22,080
Speaker 4: was about. And I have loved watching her explore and

790
00:49:22,280 --> 00:49:26,200
Speaker 4: discover what it is to be a stage actor. And

791
00:49:26,600 --> 00:49:28,759
Speaker 4: I have in fact taken care of her. I have

792
00:49:28,920 --> 00:49:30,560
Speaker 4: in fact done her laundry.

793
00:49:34,120 --> 00:49:35,200
Speaker 1: And made her soup.

794
00:49:36,880 --> 00:49:40,279
Speaker 4: And I have a funny picture of us brushing our teeth.

795
00:49:43,480 --> 00:49:46,479
Speaker 3: That is its own TV show and I cannot wait

796
00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:51,120
Speaker 3: to watch it. And then a question from Jeff, Hillary

797
00:49:51,320 --> 00:49:55,040
Speaker 3: and Patty. You've both been passed over for roles where

798
00:49:55,080 --> 00:50:02,800
Speaker 3: you were hands down, where you were hands down the

799
00:50:02,880 --> 00:50:10,719
Speaker 3: most qualified, slashed talented candidates. Jeff's question is how do

800
00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:14,439
Speaker 3: you maintain grounded and motivated to stay in the game

801
00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:16,920
Speaker 3: and not give up in the face of defeat.

802
00:50:18,320 --> 00:50:19,640
Speaker 1: That's heavy, heavy duty.

803
00:50:21,280 --> 00:50:24,920
Speaker 2: You look for ways to kind of keep going that

804
00:50:25,120 --> 00:50:29,640
Speaker 2: you enjoy, that give you satisfaction. It's kind of like

805
00:50:29,680 --> 00:50:32,160
Speaker 2: what Patty was talking about at the beginning of her

806
00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:36,680
Speaker 2: acting career. You keep moving forward, you keep looking for

807
00:50:36,840 --> 00:50:41,200
Speaker 2: new opportunities, you learn from you know, the defeats, the mistakes,

808
00:50:41,280 --> 00:50:42,359
Speaker 2: You pick yourself.

809
00:50:42,120 --> 00:50:45,879
Speaker 1: Up and it is just a part of life.

810
00:50:46,880 --> 00:50:53,160
Speaker 2: Maybe you don't fail on the global stage, but you know,

811
00:50:53,800 --> 00:50:58,279
Speaker 2: everybody fails. Everybody falls. Everybody has to decide whether to

812
00:50:58,360 --> 00:51:01,919
Speaker 2: get back up. And I can highly recommend get back up.

813
00:51:02,000 --> 00:51:02,719
Speaker 1: And keep going.

814
00:51:03,640 --> 00:51:10,320
Speaker 2: And it is not only better for you, it really

815
00:51:10,480 --> 00:51:12,040
Speaker 2: annoys your adversaries.

816
00:51:23,440 --> 00:51:31,360
Speaker 4: Who says I've maintained All I'll say is it hurts

817
00:51:32,480 --> 00:51:34,479
Speaker 4: and you gotta go work through the pain. You gotta

818
00:51:34,520 --> 00:51:37,120
Speaker 4: find the you know, the reason to keep going and

819
00:51:38,000 --> 00:51:40,360
Speaker 4: learn the lesson. And if there is a lesson to

820
00:51:40,480 --> 00:51:44,520
Speaker 4: learn and tell them they made a big mistake. Every

821
00:51:44,760 --> 00:51:56,240
Speaker 4: fucking day, you just keep getting better. That's the mistake

822
00:51:56,719 --> 00:52:00,320
Speaker 4: they made. But you just keep getting better. Hllary.

823
00:52:00,360 --> 00:52:02,680
Speaker 3: A lot of people are wondering who would play you

824
00:52:02,880 --> 00:52:04,880
Speaker 3: in the musical version of your life.

825
00:52:06,640 --> 00:52:07,000
Speaker 4: I don't know.

826
00:52:07,120 --> 00:52:08,480
Speaker 1: You're ready. You want to, I mean, you want to

827
00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:09,279
Speaker 1: get your card back.

828
00:52:11,160 --> 00:52:13,560
Speaker 4: I don't need my card to be on Broadway. That

829
00:52:13,800 --> 00:52:17,160
Speaker 4: is the best kept secret on Broadway. You can work

830
00:52:17,239 --> 00:52:19,080
Speaker 4: on Broadway without being a member of equity.

831
00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:22,520
Speaker 2: Then I have a lot of possibilities. Yeah, yeah, First

832
00:52:22,520 --> 00:52:23,360
Speaker 2: somebody has to write it.

833
00:52:24,440 --> 00:52:24,960
Speaker 1: I'll write it.

834
00:52:26,120 --> 00:52:31,439
Speaker 4: You play Hillary with pleasure and I'd be honored. Okay,

835
00:52:31,520 --> 00:52:32,719
Speaker 4: it's gonna be great. It's a hit.

836
00:52:34,360 --> 00:52:35,280
Speaker 1: From Christy.

837
00:52:35,400 --> 00:52:37,240
Speaker 3: And this is our last question we have today.

838
00:52:38,080 --> 00:52:41,000
Speaker 4: It's for both of you. What is the one thing

839
00:52:41,320 --> 00:52:47,360
Speaker 4: you most admire in each other? May I say Hilary's

840
00:52:47,640 --> 00:52:57,520
Speaker 4: uncompromising resilience? Yeah, well.

841
00:52:59,280 --> 00:53:03,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, I like both those words. I like both those words.

842
00:53:03,600 --> 00:53:07,920
Speaker 2: And for me, looking at Patty and looking at her

843
00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:13,360
Speaker 2: life and looking at her incredible passion and energy.

844
00:53:13,920 --> 00:53:16,080
Speaker 1: It really is that that gutsiness.

845
00:53:16,320 --> 00:53:20,320
Speaker 2: It's that sense that I am here, whether you like

846
00:53:20,400 --> 00:53:23,320
Speaker 2: it or not, as somebody who has seen her on

847
00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:29,640
Speaker 2: the stage, somebody who admires her outspokenness, somebody who also

848
00:53:29,760 --> 00:53:32,120
Speaker 2: hates cell phones interrupting.

849
00:53:33,440 --> 00:53:37,240
Speaker 1: When you're trying to talk to people. For all those reasons.

850
00:53:37,360 --> 00:53:40,160
Speaker 2: Gutsiness I mean, and that to me is a really

851
00:53:40,840 --> 00:53:44,080
Speaker 2: high form of life accomplishment.

852
00:53:44,280 --> 00:53:45,520
Speaker 4: Thank you, Thank.

853
00:53:48,239 --> 00:53:48,479
Speaker 3: Well.

854
00:53:49,920 --> 00:53:52,960
Speaker 2: I honestly I think we could go on and on,

855
00:53:53,160 --> 00:53:57,520
Speaker 2: but you know, we got to, unfortunately bring it to

856
00:53:57,640 --> 00:54:00,440
Speaker 2: a close. And yeah, I know that's why I feel,

857
00:54:00,960 --> 00:54:04,480
Speaker 2: but I want to thank everybody for coming tonight. It

858
00:54:04,680 --> 00:54:07,839
Speaker 2: means the world to us to be able to talk

859
00:54:08,040 --> 00:54:13,200
Speaker 2: and have such an incredibly responsive audience out there. Thank

860
00:54:14,040 --> 00:54:17,839
Speaker 2: both Patty and Amber for who they are and how

861
00:54:18,600 --> 00:54:24,120
Speaker 2: exciting it is to talk to them. Thank Joseph Falcon.

862
00:54:23,840 --> 00:54:25,560
Speaker 1: Who played the piano.

863
00:54:25,800 --> 00:54:31,880
Speaker 2: Thanks to Symphony Space and iHeart Podcasts, but mostly thanks

864
00:54:31,920 --> 00:54:35,239
Speaker 2: to all of you for turning out tonight to see

865
00:54:35,320 --> 00:54:39,600
Speaker 2: this remarkable woman and to give us a chance to

866
00:54:39,760 --> 00:54:45,960
Speaker 2: learn more about her and her extraordinary career. And keep

867
00:54:46,000 --> 00:54:49,800
Speaker 2: in mind next April, Carnegie Hall and then for Amber.

868
00:54:50,000 --> 00:54:52,960
Speaker 2: Keep in mind Amber's Whiz is coming back.

869
00:54:53,120 --> 00:54:54,600
Speaker 1: Thank you all very much.

870
00:54:58,640 --> 00:55:02,600
Speaker 2: You and Me Both is brought to you by iHeart Podcasts.

871
00:55:03,360 --> 00:55:08,000
Speaker 2: We're produced by Julie Subren, Kathleen Russo and Rob Russo,

872
00:55:08,600 --> 00:55:14,839
Speaker 2: with help from Kuma Abadeen, Oscar Flores, Lindsey Hoffman, Sarah Horowitz,

873
00:55:15,160 --> 00:55:18,120
Speaker 2: Laura Olin, Lona Valmorro.

874
00:55:18,000 --> 00:55:19,200
Speaker 1: And Lily Weber.

875
00:55:19,960 --> 00:55:24,160
Speaker 2: Our engineer is Zach McNeice, and the original music is

876
00:55:24,239 --> 00:55:27,719
Speaker 2: by Forrest Gray. If you like You and Me Both,

877
00:55:28,080 --> 00:55:30,880
Speaker 2: tell someone else about it. And if you're not already

878
00:55:30,920 --> 00:55:34,640
Speaker 2: a subscriber, what are you waiting for? You can subscribe

879
00:55:34,719 --> 00:55:38,200
Speaker 2: to You and Me Both on the iHeartRadio app, Apple

880
00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:41,239
Speaker 2: Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

881
00:55:41,800 --> 00:55:44,160
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening and I'll see you next week