WEBVTT - STBYM: Biophilia and Pokémon 0:00:03.000 --> 0:00:06.760 Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, production of iHeartRadio. 0:00:12.400 --> 0:00:14.239 Hey, you welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. My 0:00:14.360 --> 0:00:15.480 name is Robert, ma'am. 0:00:15.680 --> 0:00:19.040 And I am Joe McCormick. And Rob you wanted to 0:00:19.079 --> 0:00:22.680 talk about Pokemon today, So you are going to have 0:00:22.760 --> 0:00:26.320 to be my Virgil leading me through the pokey hell 0:00:26.400 --> 0:00:30.120 and all the way to the Pokey Paradise. Because, as 0:00:30.240 --> 0:00:33.000 longtime listeners will know, every time this comes up on 0:00:33.040 --> 0:00:36.280 the show, I am lost in a dark wood when 0:00:36.280 --> 0:00:39.440 it comes to Pokemon. I do not have the Pokemon 0:00:39.560 --> 0:00:40.640 knowledge of my peers. 0:00:40.960 --> 0:00:44.280 Well, maybe I am the Virgil of Pokemon because I 0:00:44.600 --> 0:00:47.840 cannot enter paradise. I can only take you so far 0:00:47.920 --> 0:00:50.720 because I came into it really late as well. We 0:00:50.720 --> 0:00:55.080 were actually chatting off Mike with our producer JJ earlier, 0:00:55.280 --> 0:00:58.920 and JJ is of the right age to have been 0:00:59.000 --> 0:01:03.320 properly brought up in the Pokemon world, and so we 0:01:03.120 --> 0:01:05.800 were we were chatting just a little bit about knowing 0:01:05.800 --> 0:01:09.279 your way around Pokemon and just the the enormous pop 0:01:09.319 --> 0:01:15.480 culture shadow that Pokemon casts for, particularly for millennials in 0:01:15.560 --> 0:01:18.720 gen Z, with strong signs that it's going to continue 0:01:18.720 --> 0:01:21.280 to play this role for younger generations as well, like 0:01:21.319 --> 0:01:24.000 you can people who grew up with Pokemon can did 0:01:24.000 --> 0:01:25.440 they just talk about it? They can use it as 0:01:25.520 --> 0:01:28.880 reference points. It's it's like a language undo itself. 0:01:29.120 --> 0:01:31.399 Yeah. By the way, JJ, if we if we make 0:01:31.440 --> 0:01:34.320 a big poke blunder in this episode, please do interrupt 0:01:34.360 --> 0:01:36.440 us and we can fill the listeners in with your 0:01:36.520 --> 0:01:40.119 with your insights. Yeah, so I'm not like somebody who 0:01:40.160 --> 0:01:45.119 has never encountered Pokemon before. My personal experience with it 0:01:45.240 --> 0:01:48.920 was basically at the same time as every other kid 0:01:48.960 --> 0:01:52.960 in America. I played the original Pokemon game Boy game. 0:01:53.160 --> 0:01:56.320 I never finished it, but I played that when it 0:01:56.360 --> 0:01:58.200 came out when I was in like sixth grades. I 0:01:58.240 --> 0:02:01.360 think this would be like, okay, nineteen ninety eight. So yeah, so. 0:02:01.320 --> 0:02:04.760 You were exposed to pokemona but I never finished. The 0:02:05.040 --> 0:02:07.920 body like built up a resistance to the infection and 0:02:07.920 --> 0:02:09.359 then you were immune to it. 0:02:09.639 --> 0:02:13.280 I yeah, so I played part of the original game 0:02:13.280 --> 0:02:16.720 Boy game, never finished it. I remember the one I picked. 0:02:16.760 --> 0:02:21.400 It was the green one Bulbosar, because he's it seemed 0:02:21.520 --> 0:02:25.480 more threatening than the other two, Okay, at least more 0:02:25.520 --> 0:02:28.359 than the water the water turtle squirrel. 0:02:27.919 --> 0:02:30.080 Thing, because it needed to fight for you. You wanted 0:02:30.080 --> 0:02:31.520 a fierce Pokemon. 0:02:31.240 --> 0:02:33.480 Right, and it looked more. Yeah, it was like a 0:02:33.600 --> 0:02:36.840 little cute but angry little turtle with plants coming off 0:02:36.880 --> 0:02:39.679 of it. So I picked that thing. I played part 0:02:39.680 --> 0:02:43.080 of the game, and then I basically never interacted with 0:02:43.120 --> 0:02:45.960 Pokemon again, except sort of secondhand. I had, like, you know, 0:02:46.080 --> 0:02:49.720 friends in college who were playing Pokemon Nintendo sixty four games, 0:02:50.080 --> 0:02:52.280 so I got a little bit of that by osmosis, 0:02:52.320 --> 0:02:55.440 but otherwise I'm like not plugged in. I get it 0:02:55.480 --> 0:02:56.400 all secondhand. 0:02:56.800 --> 0:02:59.320 All right, Well, just a reminder for folks out there, 0:02:59.360 --> 0:03:01.280 and I realized most of you do not need to 0:03:01.280 --> 0:03:04.240 be reminded what a Pokemon is. I mean, Pokemon are everywhere. 0:03:04.280 --> 0:03:07.320 It's again, it's it's enormous. We're, of course talking about 0:03:07.360 --> 0:03:10.880 the Japanese Pocket Monster media empire that began as a 0:03:11.000 --> 0:03:15.000 nineteen ninety six Nintendo video game for the old game Boy, 0:03:15.040 --> 0:03:19.440 the original game Boy, and then shortly thereafter became a 0:03:19.480 --> 0:03:22.359 collectible card game as well, and since then it has 0:03:22.400 --> 0:03:27.440 grown to encompass television shows, movies, toys, even more video games, 0:03:27.560 --> 0:03:30.920 more collectible card games. There's a mobile game now and 0:03:30.960 --> 0:03:34.240 it's just generally secured, you know, its place as a 0:03:34.280 --> 0:03:37.840 major generational touchstone, as we've been saying, So what's the 0:03:37.840 --> 0:03:40.680 basic idea here, Well, it's a fantastic world much like 0:03:40.760 --> 0:03:43.520 our own, but populated by a vast array of creatures 0:03:43.520 --> 0:03:46.920 called Pokemon or pokemons. I'm not sure the plural is 0:03:47.200 --> 0:03:49.920 fan and they often just Pokemon. 0:03:50.040 --> 0:03:51.720 Isn't it just pokemon right? 0:03:52.360 --> 0:03:56.360 At any rate? The pokemon or multi pokemons or POKEMONA 0:03:56.440 --> 0:04:00.000 I don't know. They often resemble real and folkloreic creatures. 0:04:00.560 --> 0:04:05.280 Not every Pokemon is based on an actual animal or plant, 0:04:06.200 --> 0:04:08.760 but a huge amount of them are. You also have 0:04:08.840 --> 0:04:10.920 ones that are you know, we were talking about one 0:04:10.920 --> 0:04:14.480 off Mike with JJ that looks like keys, obviously not 0:04:15.160 --> 0:04:18.719 biological in origin. And then there are ghost types that 0:04:18.839 --> 0:04:21.400 may or may not match up with animals. But for 0:04:21.440 --> 0:04:24.400 the most part you're dealing with a vast ecosystem of 0:04:25.080 --> 0:04:27.839 fanciful creatures and or plants. 0:04:28.240 --> 0:04:31.120 Yeah, and Rob, I don't know if this has changed 0:04:31.160 --> 0:04:33.240 it all over the history of Pokemon, because I know 0:04:33.279 --> 0:04:36.919 we were now like many generations in but what I 0:04:36.920 --> 0:04:39.919 remember from the original game Boy game was you would 0:04:40.040 --> 0:04:43.640 collect these monsters from the environment and then you would 0:04:43.720 --> 0:04:46.560 make them fight each other, so there is in one 0:04:46.560 --> 0:04:49.839 sense kind of a almost a darwin Esque you know, 0:04:49.920 --> 0:04:53.160 collecting beetles from the forest sort of thing where you're 0:04:53.200 --> 0:04:56.359 looking for specimens. But then there's another element, which is 0:04:56.440 --> 0:04:57.520 just you're making them fight. 0:04:58.160 --> 0:05:01.240 Yes, yeah, yeah, And this my understanding is this is 0:05:01.279 --> 0:05:02.960 still very key to the whole thing. I mean, it's 0:05:02.960 --> 0:05:06.080 still the one of the main things that you do 0:05:06.120 --> 0:05:08.680 in the video games. It is central to the collectible 0:05:08.720 --> 0:05:14.080 card game. Not all media, though perhaps there's a Pokemon 0:05:14.120 --> 0:05:17.359 media like depends heavily on it. There was like a 0:05:17.400 --> 0:05:20.839 really cute kind of oh, what's the word kind of 0:05:20.839 --> 0:05:23.440 a comfort show that I believe it was. That it's 0:05:23.440 --> 0:05:28.839 actually on Netflix called Let's See Pokemon Concierge, where it's 0:05:28.839 --> 0:05:34.000 Pokemon's on vacation and you're just looking after them and 0:05:34.040 --> 0:05:36.200 you were trying to prevent them from fighting, or the 0:05:36.240 --> 0:05:38.320 main character is trying to prevent them from fighting. It's 0:05:38.400 --> 0:05:39.680 very sweet, very relaxing. 0:05:40.160 --> 0:05:42.480 You bring them champagne and an ice bucket. 0:05:42.880 --> 0:05:46.279 Maybe not shampa, but whatever champagne would be to a bulbasar, 0:05:46.400 --> 0:05:50.240 you might bring it to them. Okay, but yeah, I 0:05:50.240 --> 0:05:52.760 guess the other key things to mention are that most 0:05:53.160 --> 0:05:57.680 Pokemon go through a series of evolutions, typically but not always, 0:05:57.680 --> 0:06:01.920 consisting of three phases, and then humans use poke balls 0:06:01.960 --> 0:06:03.599 to capture them and make them. 0:06:03.440 --> 0:06:05.080 Fight each other. Yeah. 0:06:05.160 --> 0:06:08.320 So, as for myself, and I think I may have 0:06:08.320 --> 0:06:10.719 mentioned this on the show before I missed out on 0:06:10.760 --> 0:06:14.000 Pokemon as a younger person. I think I theoretically could 0:06:14.040 --> 0:06:16.520 have caught the bug, but it didn't officially make its 0:06:16.520 --> 0:06:19.240 way over to the US until ninety eight. I would 0:06:19.279 --> 0:06:21.240 have been twenty at the time, and I guess it 0:06:21.360 --> 0:06:23.560 just I wasn't in the place for it, and I 0:06:23.600 --> 0:06:27.320 don't think I had any friends that had been infected 0:06:27.320 --> 0:06:30.480 with Pokemon, So for the most part, I would hear 0:06:30.520 --> 0:06:32.000 about it, but I'm like, oh, I guess that's something 0:06:32.120 --> 0:06:35.360 kids are doing, and I'm not a kid right now. 0:06:36.000 --> 0:06:38.640 But I of course eventually became a parent, and my 0:06:38.800 --> 0:06:43.000 kid certainly got into Pokemon in a major way, and 0:06:43.200 --> 0:06:46.520 as a teen, they still seem to really enjoy the franchise. 0:06:46.680 --> 0:06:50.360 They're playing the current video game. I think they occasionally 0:06:50.400 --> 0:06:53.000 watched some of the media, and they still know their 0:06:53.000 --> 0:06:55.960 way around all of the Pokemon lore and classifications. So 0:06:56.040 --> 0:06:58.960 if Pokemon business comes up on the podcast, I've covered 0:06:58.960 --> 0:07:02.000 them on the Monster Fact episodes before. I will generally 0:07:03.120 --> 0:07:04.840 ask them about it and say like, hey, do I 0:07:04.839 --> 0:07:06.960 have this ride? Is this Pokemon an example of such 0:07:06.960 --> 0:07:08.720 and such? And they'll be able to throw in on 0:07:08.760 --> 0:07:13.960 that also alongside them. I have watched the occasional episode 0:07:14.160 --> 0:07:17.320 of the Pokemon TV show or one of the TV 0:07:17.400 --> 0:07:21.120 shows and found it, you know, engaging and weird. I 0:07:21.200 --> 0:07:24.880 watched twenty nineteen's Pokemon Detective Pikachu with them, and I 0:07:25.000 --> 0:07:28.160 was actually really impressed with that one. I've considered doing 0:07:28.160 --> 0:07:31.120 that one for Weird House at some point. And a 0:07:31.160 --> 0:07:33.800 real highlight was we got to visit the Pokemon store 0:07:33.800 --> 0:07:37.240 in Tokyo a couple of years back, and that was 0:07:37.680 --> 0:07:41.800 overwhelming and super cool. I ended up picking up a 0:07:41.840 --> 0:07:43.680 few of the stickers that they have there. I got 0:07:43.720 --> 0:07:46.360 one of the Pokemon Ditto and I have Diddos stuck 0:07:46.360 --> 0:07:48.440 to my work laptop right now. I have it covering 0:07:48.480 --> 0:07:51.000 the Apple logo so that it glows a little bit. 0:07:51.280 --> 0:07:51.920 Oh nice. 0:07:52.520 --> 0:07:54.720 Ditto is a shape shifting blob by. 0:07:54.520 --> 0:07:58.520 The way, like the thing, Yeah but. 0:07:58.640 --> 0:08:01.480 Cute, you know, the more like the blob If the 0:08:01.480 --> 0:08:06.400 blob could could form a human form, Yeah, but you know. 0:08:06.440 --> 0:08:09.360 The thing could be cute, if it copied a cute thing. 0:08:09.280 --> 0:08:12.640 If it wanted to. It never seemed particularly interesting, but 0:08:12.760 --> 0:08:13.160 it could. 0:08:13.200 --> 0:08:15.640 I guess that would have been a better strategy. 0:08:15.720 --> 0:08:20.600 Yeah, so today's episode is going to be less hyper 0:08:20.600 --> 0:08:23.360 focused on Pokemon lore, and certainly, you know, we're not 0:08:23.480 --> 0:08:27.520 the individuals could really steer that ship. I'm sure there 0:08:27.520 --> 0:08:29.960 are any number of podcasts out there that are that 0:08:30.000 --> 0:08:32.880 are more capable of that. But instead, we're going to 0:08:32.960 --> 0:08:35.880 be talking more about interesting connections to be made between 0:08:35.920 --> 0:08:43.000 the Pokemon franchises, core elements, and sometimes specific species, its 0:08:43.040 --> 0:08:48.000 popularity with our innate fascination with the natural world. We're 0:08:48.000 --> 0:08:52.680 gonna be talking about its connection to biophilia. Now, to 0:08:52.720 --> 0:08:54.680 really get into this, I think it's illuminating to go 0:08:54.760 --> 0:08:57.320 back to the origins of Pokemon itself. I'm not going 0:08:57.360 --> 0:09:00.200 to go through, you know, the full origin story, but 0:09:00.400 --> 0:09:03.680 essentially I'm going to touch on a couple of individuals. 0:09:04.520 --> 0:09:08.080 There's Junichi Masuda born nineteen sixty eight. He was one 0:09:08.120 --> 0:09:10.120 of the key individuals in the creation of the initial 0:09:10.200 --> 0:09:13.400 video game, and I believe still serves as chief creative 0:09:13.440 --> 0:09:19.280 fellow at the Pokemon Company. I was looking at a 0:09:19.360 --> 0:09:23.439 sighted interview that's from him. I was looking at Pokemon 0:09:23.480 --> 0:09:26.800 from Bugs to Blockbuster by Simon Parkin from The Guardian 0:09:26.840 --> 0:09:31.840 back in twenty thirteen, and in that in the quotations, 0:09:32.000 --> 0:09:34.920 Masuda mentions that as a kid in Osaka, he spent 0:09:35.000 --> 0:09:38.280 most of his time outside, riding around on his bicycle 0:09:38.520 --> 0:09:41.440 and catching insects. Now, I don't know that he was 0:09:41.440 --> 0:09:43.520 making the insects fight, but of course we also know 0:09:43.559 --> 0:09:47.760 we've discussed before there is the sort of the beatles 0:09:47.800 --> 0:09:51.959 sparring that also takes place in Japan, or he used 0:09:51.960 --> 0:09:53.880 to take place in Japan. I'm not sure what the 0:09:53.880 --> 0:09:56.640 hobby's current status is, but that is probably in the 0:09:56.679 --> 0:09:57.760 zeitgeist as well here. 0:09:58.559 --> 0:10:01.199 Yeah, I guess I was wondering about that because I 0:10:01.520 --> 0:10:05.480 could have imagined that even if the initial impulse to 0:10:05.559 --> 0:10:08.679 create the game was just being inspired by the kind 0:10:08.720 --> 0:10:12.560 of naturalists instinct or the collector instinct, you know, like 0:10:12.640 --> 0:10:15.680 going out and finding beatles in the woods, that you 0:10:15.760 --> 0:10:18.679 might end up wanting to add fighting because it's a 0:10:18.760 --> 0:10:21.360 video game and you need like a conflict mechanic and. 0:10:21.400 --> 0:10:24.520 A gangame conflict. I mean, nowadays we can point to 0:10:24.600 --> 0:10:28.000 examples of video games that are may be less dependent 0:10:28.040 --> 0:10:30.120 on conflict, but certainly at the time, like, can you 0:10:30.120 --> 0:10:31.920 imagine a game that didn't have some sort of a 0:10:31.920 --> 0:10:36.040 battle or fight central to it. Yeah, yeah, let's see 0:10:36.040 --> 0:10:40.160 Another individual, Satoshi Tajiri born nineteen sixty five, also one 0:10:40.200 --> 0:10:42.760 of the founding partners, apparently had similar experiences on the 0:10:42.760 --> 0:10:47.400 outskirts of Tokyo, cataloging various creatures he found, writing them 0:10:47.400 --> 0:10:50.440 all down in a notepad that his parents had given him. 0:10:51.000 --> 0:10:53.760 And Parkin also shares in this article that when the 0:10:53.800 --> 0:10:57.560 original Red and Blue Pokemon game was released on game Boy, 0:10:57.800 --> 0:10:59.840 I didn't really think about this connection, but the plat 0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:02.840 form was towards the end of its life cycle, so 0:11:03.000 --> 0:11:05.400 there were still plenty of game Boy games coming out 0:11:05.440 --> 0:11:07.640 because there were all these game Boys out in the world, 0:11:08.200 --> 0:11:10.839 but it made getting coverage for the game a lot 0:11:10.880 --> 0:11:13.760 more difficult. The industry was moving on to newer technology, 0:11:13.880 --> 0:11:17.480 So it's it's interesting to just imagine, you know, any 0:11:17.559 --> 0:11:21.559 kind of property or franchise in its early goings potentially 0:11:21.600 --> 0:11:25.160 having a challenge to establish itself because it's such a 0:11:25.240 --> 0:11:26.120 juggernaut today. 0:11:27.080 --> 0:11:29.440 That is weird to imagine there was a time when 0:11:29.920 --> 0:11:32.960 like new games were still coming out for the game Boy, 0:11:33.320 --> 0:11:36.720 and yet there were PlayStations, you know, you were getting 0:11:36.720 --> 0:11:40.319 these three dimensional games. Yeah, yeah, and that was happening 0:11:40.400 --> 0:11:42.240 at the same time. That is strange. 0:11:42.520 --> 0:11:45.920 Yeah, So Masuda and Tegery, of course had a great 0:11:45.920 --> 0:11:48.160 deal of passion for video games in general as well 0:11:48.200 --> 0:11:51.520 as electronics. But it is such an interesting detail that 0:11:51.640 --> 0:11:56.320 part of the franchise's genesis was in the collection, cataloging, 0:11:56.360 --> 0:12:01.040 and experience of the natural world, and through the Pokemon gains, 0:12:01.240 --> 0:12:04.319 they to a large extent, attempted to pass that experience 0:12:04.400 --> 0:12:07.920 on to children who in many cases, certainly in Japan, 0:12:08.559 --> 0:12:10.760 but then in other markets as well, you know, certainly 0:12:10.800 --> 0:12:14.720 as supplies to the US in the following years, you know, 0:12:15.120 --> 0:12:18.800 a lot of children just had decreasing ability to experience 0:12:19.120 --> 0:12:22.760 the natural world, to experience the organisms of the natural 0:12:22.800 --> 0:12:25.680 world and chronicle them in a way that we would 0:12:25.760 --> 0:12:30.160 seem almost hired, hardwired to do. And this is where 0:12:30.200 --> 0:12:34.800 things tie back into the biophilia hypothesis. We've talked about 0:12:34.800 --> 0:12:38.400 this numerous times in the show before. This was a 0:12:38.600 --> 0:12:42.040 hypothesis that was concocted by the late EO. Wilson, who 0:12:42.080 --> 0:12:44.760 lived nineteen twenty nine through twenty twenty one. 0:12:44.800 --> 0:12:48.640 Wilson was an entomologist who is famous for studying ants, 0:12:48.720 --> 0:12:51.160 especially Yeah. 0:12:50.480 --> 0:12:53.640 It is essentially, in Wilson's words, the innate tendency to 0:12:53.679 --> 0:12:58.120 focus on life and lifelike processes, and as related in 0:12:58.400 --> 0:13:03.120 Why Conservationists Should Heed Pokemon by Boumford, Clegg, Coulson, and Taylor, 0:13:03.520 --> 0:13:06.400 this is published in Science Back in two thousand and two. 0:13:07.080 --> 0:13:10.280 It can also be thought of as humanity's innate desire 0:13:10.360 --> 0:13:14.400 to catalog, understand, and spend time with other life forms. 0:13:15.200 --> 0:13:19.800 So, of course there is an irony in that Pokemon 0:13:19.840 --> 0:13:22.560 originally was a video game, so when you're playing it, 0:13:22.640 --> 0:13:26.440 you are interacting with an electronic device that is about 0:13:26.440 --> 0:13:29.679 as synthetic as objects get. But it would be that 0:13:29.840 --> 0:13:33.240 within that realm, within the video game realm of this handheld, 0:13:33.280 --> 0:13:37.559 plastic and glass thing you are playing with, you are 0:13:37.600 --> 0:13:41.439 getting a simulation of cataloging the diversity of the natural 0:13:41.480 --> 0:13:44.240 world instead of just like you know, having Mario run 0:13:44.280 --> 0:13:46.480 and jump on things. Yeah. 0:13:46.520 --> 0:13:50.920 I don't know enough about any precursors to this in 0:13:51.040 --> 0:13:54.400 video games, but certainly in the wake of the first 0:13:54.400 --> 0:13:57.760 Pokemon game, we can point to any number of games 0:13:57.800 --> 0:14:00.679 where you're doing some sort of collecting and logging of 0:14:00.760 --> 0:14:04.000 natural organisms. Like just thinking of two games offhand that 0:14:04.000 --> 0:14:05.960 I spend a fair amount of time with in the past, 0:14:06.440 --> 0:14:09.719 the Fallout games or say Red Dead Redemption. These are 0:14:09.720 --> 0:14:12.280 both games where you spend a lot of time wandering 0:14:12.280 --> 0:14:15.640 around collecting things. Maybe you're collecting things to make I 0:14:15.640 --> 0:14:18.600 don't know, to make something essentially make a potion. But 0:14:18.679 --> 0:14:21.000 other times it's just about checking off a list. 0:14:21.560 --> 0:14:24.280 You're finding out what's in the world and then figuring 0:14:24.280 --> 0:14:25.520 out what you can do with it. 0:14:26.040 --> 0:14:28.520 Yeah, and so that is really interesting. I guess one 0:14:28.560 --> 0:14:31.080 of the big questions is, ye do this is there 0:14:31.320 --> 0:14:34.640 is there something innate in us? Indeed, is the biophilia 0:14:34.720 --> 0:14:37.800 hypothesis correct? And we really need to do this? And 0:14:37.840 --> 0:14:40.000 we can trace it back to the fact that we 0:14:40.120 --> 0:14:44.560 are organisms in the natural world, and we have had 0:14:44.600 --> 0:14:48.480 to make our way through that world, understand how each 0:14:48.560 --> 0:14:53.360 of these organisms affects us in positive, neutral, or negative fashions, 0:14:53.880 --> 0:14:57.000 and then on top of that, with our human ingenuity, 0:14:57.280 --> 0:15:01.840 how to augment those parameters and turn a potentially harmful 0:15:02.080 --> 0:15:07.880 organism into a helpful one and maybe vice versa. So 0:15:08.680 --> 0:15:11.560 the two thousand and two piece in question, it raises 0:15:11.560 --> 0:15:16.240 some interesting questions about this supposed relationship between Pokemon fandom 0:15:16.360 --> 0:15:20.560 and biophilia. They conduct a study in this, and this 0:15:20.600 --> 0:15:23.160 is one of those studies we have to point out 0:15:23.160 --> 0:15:26.080 this is a small study. This doesn't concern a tremendous 0:15:26.200 --> 0:15:30.160 number of individuals, and certainly we're dealing with like a 0:15:30.160 --> 0:15:33.840 a one particular part of the world, and there you know, 0:15:33.880 --> 0:15:35.840 all sorts of limitations you would have to take into 0:15:35.880 --> 0:15:38.840 into account here. But in it the author has carried 0:15:38.840 --> 0:15:41.320 out a study one hundred and nine UK school children 0:15:41.400 --> 0:15:44.560 ages four through eleven, and they quiz different age groups 0:15:44.600 --> 0:15:48.680 about both real life UK organisms, organisms that you know 0:15:48.720 --> 0:15:52.440 would have been more or less in their natural habitat, 0:15:53.040 --> 0:15:58.480 and fictional Pokemon organisms. And what they generally observed in 0:15:58.520 --> 0:16:01.200 their findings is that the kids started off with a 0:16:01.280 --> 0:16:06.000 stronger understanding of natural world organisms around them and less 0:16:06.040 --> 0:16:08.760 knowledge of Pokemon. But as they got older, the Pokemon 0:16:08.840 --> 0:16:11.920 knowledge kind of took over and took the place of 0:16:11.960 --> 0:16:14.680 the natural world wisdom. And there were some other like 0:16:15.240 --> 0:16:17.160 you know they were talking about okay, well, you know, 0:16:17.200 --> 0:16:19.000 we divided them up into boys and girls, and then 0:16:19.000 --> 0:16:21.800 the boys tended to know more about Pokemon and so forth. 0:16:21.880 --> 0:16:23.880 So you have to factor all of that into it 0:16:23.920 --> 0:16:24.280 as well. 0:16:24.960 --> 0:16:25.560 Interesting. 0:16:26.480 --> 0:16:29.360 So the researchers here argue that, on one hand, the 0:16:29.400 --> 0:16:32.240 findings demonstrate the young children in general just have a 0:16:32.280 --> 0:16:36.960 tremendous capacity for learning about creatures, real or fictional, and 0:16:37.080 --> 0:16:40.480 at age eight, the typical child could identify eighty percent 0:16:40.600 --> 0:16:43.479 of a sample drawn from one hundred and fifty synthetic 0:16:43.560 --> 0:16:48.160 species aka Pokemon, which you know we've all encountered this 0:16:48.240 --> 0:16:50.520 with kids. Kids will come up maybe maybe it is 0:16:50.520 --> 0:16:52.720 Pokemon specific. A kid will come up to you and 0:16:52.760 --> 0:16:56.680 start talking at you about Pokemon, and it can be overwhelming, 0:16:56.800 --> 0:16:59.360 and you're like, no, thank you, I really don't need 0:16:59.400 --> 0:17:02.400 to hear all of this, But you have to admit, like, 0:17:02.480 --> 0:17:04.639 it's amazing that they have all of these facts in 0:17:04.680 --> 0:17:06.639 their head. Granted there's all sorts of stuff they don't 0:17:06.640 --> 0:17:10.199 have to remember yet, but they have tremendous capacity for 0:17:10.359 --> 0:17:13.639 memorizing all this stuff. I certainly see that with my 0:17:13.680 --> 0:17:16.800 own kiddo. I mean, granted, you know there's the Pokemon example, 0:17:16.880 --> 0:17:21.800 but you know we also share a love for dungeons 0:17:21.840 --> 0:17:25.320 and dragons, so you know, both of us can rattle 0:17:25.320 --> 0:17:30.800 off some stats about the various monsters and with my kid. 0:17:30.840 --> 0:17:34.879 They also got super into herpetology years back, and so 0:17:35.040 --> 0:17:37.080 they you know, this does have at least in their 0:17:37.200 --> 0:17:39.440 their case, and I think in many kids cases, there's 0:17:39.440 --> 0:17:42.000 also the real world component, like learning about the animals 0:17:42.440 --> 0:17:47.080 in your natural environment and then potentially other environments, like 0:17:47.480 --> 0:17:49.480 we don't live by the ocean, but we know a 0:17:49.560 --> 0:17:52.439 number of foceanic creatures and it As a kid, I 0:17:52.480 --> 0:17:54.880 remember being really into that, like, oh, sharks are neat. 0:17:54.920 --> 0:17:56.440 I want to see a chart of all the different 0:17:56.480 --> 0:17:59.359 types of sharks so that I can memorize them for 0:17:59.400 --> 0:18:02.640 some reason. Yeah, and it can even spill over, I think, 0:18:02.680 --> 0:18:05.200 into things that are not animals, but maybe a little 0:18:05.880 --> 0:18:09.639 that you can certainly anthropomorphize to some degree, you know, 0:18:09.800 --> 0:18:13.680 like airplanes. Like when I was growing up, my dad 0:18:13.760 --> 0:18:16.920 was a big World War Two buff and was often 0:18:16.960 --> 0:18:19.280 working on, say, a model of the World War two aircraft, 0:18:19.640 --> 0:18:21.919 and so for a while there I could really rattle 0:18:21.920 --> 0:18:24.200 off a number of different makes and models of World 0:18:24.200 --> 0:18:26.679 War two planes, you know, which are kind of like 0:18:26.920 --> 0:18:27.879 sharks of the sky. 0:18:28.720 --> 0:18:32.200 Well, Rob, if I can observe something about your personality, 0:18:32.240 --> 0:18:34.399 I mean, you seem to me to be a person 0:18:34.440 --> 0:18:40.119 who has a very an encyclopedist's kind of framing. I 0:18:40.119 --> 0:18:43.720 think you like to have You like to have lists 0:18:43.720 --> 0:18:46.280 and catalogs of things to like learn all of the 0:18:46.280 --> 0:18:48.959 items in the list and know all of the you know, 0:18:49.000 --> 0:18:51.960 the names of the things on that list, which I 0:18:52.000 --> 0:18:53.720 don't know. Knowing that about you, I can see how 0:18:53.720 --> 0:18:58.240 that that also transcends just the biological realm. I mean, 0:18:58.320 --> 0:19:01.679 like that's a general impulse about like organizing knowledge, but 0:19:01.760 --> 0:19:04.399 then when you bring it to the natural world, it 0:19:04.480 --> 0:19:10.840 has this particular kind of taxonomy or creature understanding principle 0:19:10.880 --> 0:19:12.000 behind it. Yeah. 0:19:12.119 --> 0:19:14.399 Yeah, And whether we're thinking about it or not, we 0:19:15.760 --> 0:19:20.360 are learning like the map of the ecosystem and ecosystems 0:19:20.359 --> 0:19:32.399 that we are a part of. Yah. Now, coming back 0:19:32.400 --> 0:19:35.080 to that two thousand and two paper, the authors here 0:19:35.600 --> 0:19:38.879 argue that based on the children that they quipped in 0:19:38.920 --> 0:19:43.560 their study, they made an argument that quote conservationists are 0:19:43.560 --> 0:19:46.879 doing less well than the creators of Pokemon inspiring interest 0:19:46.960 --> 0:19:50.720 in their subjects. Now, granted, we've had quite a while 0:19:50.720 --> 0:19:52.359 since two thousand and two, and I think there have 0:19:52.440 --> 0:19:56.000 been efforts to sort of capitalize in the Pokemon fandom 0:19:56.040 --> 0:19:58.600 to figure out new ways to get people excited about 0:19:58.640 --> 0:20:01.800 the natural World. Yeah, and I've done just a little 0:20:01.840 --> 0:20:03.720 bit of that on the show before, doing like Monster 0:20:03.800 --> 0:20:05.919 Fact episodes, like here's this Pokemon, but it's you know, 0:20:05.960 --> 0:20:08.480 it's clearly based on this organism, and there's there's a 0:20:08.520 --> 0:20:10.159 lot of fun to be had with that kind of 0:20:10.440 --> 0:20:11.240 connection making. 0:20:12.080 --> 0:20:14.080 Well, I mean, in the case of Pokemon, you can 0:20:14.160 --> 0:20:17.679 have the interest in the subject matter organized by the 0:20:18.440 --> 0:20:20.960 medium itself. So it's like the fact that it's a 0:20:21.080 --> 0:20:23.760 game that's fun to play, or a TV show that 0:20:23.840 --> 0:20:28.000 all your friends are watching, like drives interest in the 0:20:28.040 --> 0:20:31.000 subject matter that's being featured there. So I wonder if 0:20:31.040 --> 0:20:34.600 there was a similarly engaging game or TV show that 0:20:34.720 --> 0:20:38.960 just had the actual world creatures instead of the Pokemon, 0:20:39.000 --> 0:20:42.560 if you would not see a similar increase in knowledge. 0:20:42.200 --> 0:20:44.359 Right right, Like, for instance, nobody out there is just 0:20:45.080 --> 0:20:46.760 for the most part, I think learning a list of 0:20:46.840 --> 0:20:50.000 all the X Men characters, we learn them also because 0:20:50.040 --> 0:20:52.680 they have stories and they have connections to each other, 0:20:53.119 --> 0:20:55.919 and all of this makes you know, becomes a cat's 0:20:55.960 --> 0:20:59.560 cradle of fascination. Yeah, and the same, of course can 0:20:59.600 --> 0:21:04.160 be said natural World. So the authors here stress something 0:21:04.160 --> 0:21:07.000 we already mentioned before that a lot of this might 0:21:07.040 --> 0:21:10.280 have to do with an increased distance between individuals in 0:21:10.320 --> 0:21:13.720 the natural world. As we live our lives more removed 0:21:13.720 --> 0:21:16.880 from nature, our knowledge of it falls away, And then 0:21:16.920 --> 0:21:20.399 presumably that's when something like Pokemon comes into play, giving 0:21:20.440 --> 0:21:22.919 us a whole host of imaginary creatures to throw our 0:21:23.200 --> 0:21:27.639 cataloging mental faculties at you. After all, we've arrived in 0:21:27.640 --> 0:21:31.120 a cultural place, particularly in large urban settings, where knowledge 0:21:31.119 --> 0:21:34.960 of natural world organisms doesn't highly illuminate the world that 0:21:35.000 --> 0:21:39.680 we're interacting with. We're not id in creatures. We see creatures, 0:21:39.680 --> 0:21:42.719 we avoid creatures, we eat, creatures, we utilize in other ways. 0:21:43.160 --> 0:21:46.119 So there's an argument to be made that instead we 0:21:46.240 --> 0:21:49.440 end up cataloging the fictional creatures that we engage with 0:21:49.520 --> 0:21:53.639 in our entertainment, which live within a pervasive or array 0:21:53.800 --> 0:21:59.720 of captivating video games, card games, media, and shared imaginary worlds. 0:22:00.520 --> 0:22:02.400 This is I think worth stressing as well. We talked 0:22:02.400 --> 0:22:07.280 about Pokemon ever so briefly in our episodes about imaginary 0:22:07.320 --> 0:22:12.199 friends and imaginary worlds, and I would I would observe 0:22:12.240 --> 0:22:15.520 this between my kid and one of their friends, where 0:22:15.560 --> 0:22:17.919 when they were hanging out, they would just make up 0:22:17.920 --> 0:22:20.600 a whole bunch of stories about Pokemon and like tell 0:22:20.600 --> 0:22:22.520 them to each other like they had a whole and 0:22:22.560 --> 0:22:27.320 it was largely divorced from the actual Pokemon fandom world. 0:22:27.320 --> 0:22:31.160 This was about like armies of Pokemon marching against each 0:22:31.200 --> 0:22:31.959 other as something. 0:22:32.080 --> 0:22:34.280 Wow, what were the big rivalries? 0:22:35.640 --> 0:22:39.440 Oh, it had to do with with Pikachu. They they 0:22:39.480 --> 0:22:42.080 decided that they didn't like Pikachu, and Pikachu was like 0:22:42.119 --> 0:22:45.639 the ultimate enemy. It's kind of like, you know, Pikachu 0:22:45.760 --> 0:22:50.200 was the the superstar of of Pokemon, and I guess 0:22:50.200 --> 0:22:52.840 still is. You know, he's the poster child and I 0:22:52.920 --> 0:22:54.359 Pikachu backlash. 0:22:54.440 --> 0:22:54.640 Yeah. 0:22:54.760 --> 0:22:56.400 Yeah, And I think they were like, you know, Pikachu 0:22:56.480 --> 0:23:00.600 is not the best. Clearly, these other ones are the best. Ironically, 0:23:00.640 --> 0:23:02.160 one of the ones they thought was actually the best 0:23:02.200 --> 0:23:08.720 was Piachu, which is a lower, less evolved version of Pikachu. 0:23:08.800 --> 0:23:11.640 But yeah, they were big about championing these other creatures 0:23:11.680 --> 0:23:12.480 over Pikachu. 0:23:12.720 --> 0:23:15.080 Yeah, this is the one I've heard described as there's 0:23:15.119 --> 0:23:16.360 a Pikachu baby. 0:23:16.119 --> 0:23:19.359 Now, Yes, Yeah, essentially a Pikachu baby that is cuter, 0:23:19.520 --> 0:23:22.040 has everything Pikachu brings to the table, except even cuter. 0:23:22.440 --> 0:23:26.640 It's like Pikachu crack. Really, it's just super refined it's. 0:23:26.440 --> 0:23:28.119 The baby Yoda of Pikachu. 0:23:28.280 --> 0:23:29.240 Yeah, exactly. 0:23:29.320 --> 0:23:30.800 We live in an era where you've got to have 0:23:30.880 --> 0:23:32.280 a baby version of everything. 0:23:32.640 --> 0:23:35.560 Mm hmm. But I in general, though, I think this 0:23:35.760 --> 0:23:39.480 is an interesting way to sort of self analyze some 0:23:39.600 --> 0:23:44.400 of the at times useless seeming trivia that we can accumulate. 0:23:45.280 --> 0:23:47.200 I don't know about you, Joe, but I will occasionally 0:23:47.200 --> 0:23:49.840 find myself in this situation where hopefully I'm not called 0:23:49.840 --> 0:23:52.120 out on it, though that has occurred as well, where 0:23:52.720 --> 0:23:56.679 I'll at least realize, oh, I have a fairly expansive 0:23:56.760 --> 0:23:59.520 catalog of say B movie actors in my head. But 0:23:59.560 --> 0:24:02.160 then I may still struggle to remember some vital piece 0:24:02.160 --> 0:24:06.479 of information about my actual life. Yeah, oh yeah, and 0:24:06.520 --> 0:24:09.040 you're like, why does that happen? Like why? You know? 0:24:09.920 --> 0:24:12.960 People may encounter that with Pokemon and specifically, like maybe 0:24:12.960 --> 0:24:15.360 you forget your anniversary, but you remember all the Pokemon 0:24:15.359 --> 0:24:17.600 ghost type evolutions, Like what's going on there? 0:24:17.760 --> 0:24:21.119 I think this is an extremely common experience that people find, 0:24:21.280 --> 0:24:25.240 for whatever reason, they have an easy time remembering information 0:24:25.440 --> 0:24:28.480 that is not as important and a harder time remembering 0:24:28.520 --> 0:24:32.760 things that are more meaningful and more important. Ye. I 0:24:32.840 --> 0:24:35.400 don't think I don't have an overarching theory of why 0:24:35.440 --> 0:24:39.160 that is. But maybe it's just I don't know. Some 0:24:39.240 --> 0:24:42.880 types of information are easier to dwell on. I mean, 0:24:42.920 --> 0:24:46.200 I do think that information is easier to retrieve when 0:24:46.200 --> 0:24:50.200 you retrieve it often, So you know, if you find yourself, 0:24:51.160 --> 0:24:54.000 I don't know, if something is less stressful to think 0:24:54.040 --> 0:24:58.040 about or I don't know, easier to think about, maybe 0:24:58.040 --> 0:25:01.920 more entertaining, you will will keep going back there, whether 0:25:01.960 --> 0:25:05.520 for you know, with external stimulation, like you're watching a 0:25:05.560 --> 0:25:08.760 movie again or reading about something again, or you're just 0:25:08.800 --> 0:25:11.800 thinking about it again. But I've had the same experience, 0:25:11.880 --> 0:25:13.480 not so much with I don't know if I know 0:25:13.600 --> 0:25:19.119 catalogs of Pokemon really, but I, you know, find myself like, wow, 0:25:19.160 --> 0:25:23.200 I have a really good memory for quoting dialogue from 0:25:23.240 --> 0:25:26.879 movies verbatim, And I don't know why that is. And 0:25:26.960 --> 0:25:30.320 I wish that memory were better deployed to things that 0:25:30.359 --> 0:25:33.280 matter more in like my social and human life, or 0:25:33.640 --> 0:25:36.480 in you know, remembering things that are actually useful. 0:25:37.000 --> 0:25:39.720 Yeah, I mean, obviously we have to remind everyone. Memory 0:25:39.800 --> 0:25:42.119 is complex and there's so many different factors going on, like, 0:25:42.160 --> 0:25:45.520 for instance, sometimes you are less likely to remember a 0:25:45.640 --> 0:25:48.640 vital piece of information. If you know that, say your 0:25:48.680 --> 0:25:52.000 significant other is remembering that for you, or you suspect 0:25:52.040 --> 0:25:55.359 that they are, your brain like makes choices like this, like, well, 0:25:55.400 --> 0:25:57.600 we don't need to hold onto that as tightly because 0:25:57.640 --> 0:26:00.960 that is held by someone else. Yeah, and you know, 0:26:01.040 --> 0:26:04.320 and perhaps in any given relationship, someone's brain is like, 0:26:04.600 --> 0:26:06.879 you need to be the keeper of the pokemon lord. 0:26:06.920 --> 0:26:09.920 This is more important than remembering when the water bells do. 0:26:10.280 --> 0:26:13.399 That's your job. Yeah, remember remember snorlax. 0:26:13.920 --> 0:26:16.240 But if we were to connect this to some sort 0:26:16.240 --> 0:26:20.520 of like you know, important knowledge about the natural world, 0:26:20.520 --> 0:26:21.480 then it would be important. 0:26:21.520 --> 0:26:21.679 You know. 0:26:21.720 --> 0:26:24.520 It's like, okay, well maybe this other person maybe they 0:26:24.560 --> 0:26:26.920 know how to cook, or they know how to hunt, 0:26:26.920 --> 0:26:30.520 whatever the case may be. But clearly it's important for 0:26:30.600 --> 0:26:33.000 me to know what all the creatures are out there, 0:26:33.040 --> 0:26:35.360 what all the plants are, and what their roles are 0:26:36.000 --> 0:26:38.200 in our use of the natural world. 0:26:38.480 --> 0:26:38.720 Yeah. 0:26:39.640 --> 0:26:43.080 So so yeah, we might think about pokemon fandom is 0:26:43.119 --> 0:26:45.639 something that kind of co ops a natural inclination that 0:26:45.800 --> 0:26:51.439 might be better harnessed for naturalists and conservationist causes. But 0:26:51.520 --> 0:26:53.960 another way of loosely interpreting all of this is that 0:26:54.000 --> 0:26:59.560 perhaps pokemon fandom lives comfortably alongside interest in the natural world, 0:26:59.600 --> 0:27:04.920 and maybe can even inspire it, because on one hand, like, yeah, 0:27:04.920 --> 0:27:06.679 there are more than I think more than a thousand 0:27:06.680 --> 0:27:10.120 Pokemon species easy at this point, and a lot of them, 0:27:10.200 --> 0:27:13.000 if not most of them, and I think it is 0:27:13.080 --> 0:27:17.320 most of them by a pretty significant degree are based 0:27:17.320 --> 0:27:20.679 on real creatures living or extinct, or they're based on 0:27:20.760 --> 0:27:25.879 folkloric or mythological entities that themselves are based to some 0:27:26.040 --> 0:27:31.720 degree on a combination of actual real world organisms. Given 0:27:31.760 --> 0:27:35.520 the franchises Japanese roots, you do seem more likely to 0:27:35.560 --> 0:27:39.919 see local creatures, creatures that people of Japan would come 0:27:39.960 --> 0:27:43.240 into contact with and have knowledge of, And the same 0:27:43.280 --> 0:27:47.240 can also be said for mythological and folkloric references. So 0:27:47.480 --> 0:27:50.880 there are various Pokemon that are clearly based on Yokai, 0:27:51.600 --> 0:27:53.880 but then you can expand that regionally. They are also 0:27:53.920 --> 0:27:56.920 Pokemon that are based on Chinese mythological figures as well, 0:27:57.359 --> 0:28:00.919 And you know, I think it's perfectly reasonable to say that. Okay, 0:28:00.920 --> 0:28:03.680 if you have this game that is making kids think 0:28:03.720 --> 0:28:08.199 about these various bioforms, it could inspire interest in the 0:28:08.240 --> 0:28:12.320 things they're based upon, be they folklore, mythology or biology. 0:28:13.640 --> 0:28:16.359 I asked my kid about this, because again, they're super 0:28:16.400 --> 0:28:19.520 into reptile and amphibian classifications and they can rattle a 0:28:19.560 --> 0:28:21.560 lot of that off, you know, certainly as well as 0:28:21.560 --> 0:28:25.520 they could rattle off Pokemon classifications, and I don't know. 0:28:25.520 --> 0:28:28.280 They seem to consider these to be two separate things, 0:28:28.320 --> 0:28:32.920 but acknowledged that there were some similarities in like the databases. 0:28:32.960 --> 0:28:37.840 I guess now in terms of to what extent like 0:28:37.920 --> 0:28:42.920 the diversity of the Pokemon world matches up with real 0:28:43.520 --> 0:28:47.880 ecosystem diversity, I found a couple of interesting papers, both 0:28:47.920 --> 0:28:52.640 from the Journal of Geek Studies, both Brazilian in origin, 0:28:52.720 --> 0:28:55.600 and both published in twenty seventeen, but by different authors. 0:28:56.040 --> 0:29:00.240 There's one titled the Theological Diversity of Pokemon, and this 0:29:00.320 --> 0:29:02.760 one was by Mendes at All, and the other one 0:29:02.880 --> 0:29:07.600 is Arthropod Diversity in Pokemon by Preto and Almida. So 0:29:07.760 --> 0:29:10.680 in general, I'm not going to go through all the 0:29:10.680 --> 0:29:13.680 points in these papers, but in general, the findings seem 0:29:13.760 --> 0:29:17.400 to indicate that, first of all, arthropod representation in Pokemon 0:29:17.520 --> 0:29:20.600 is high and in general is in keeping with the 0:29:20.680 --> 0:29:23.760 vast array of arthropod diversity that we find in the 0:29:23.840 --> 0:29:26.600 natural world, where they account for something like eighty percent 0:29:26.640 --> 0:29:29.720 of all known living animal species and a sizable portion 0:29:29.800 --> 0:29:30.600 of the biomass. 0:29:31.160 --> 0:29:33.240 Yeah, I would think a huge portion of that would 0:29:33.240 --> 0:29:35.640 just be accounted for by insects alone. 0:29:36.920 --> 0:29:40.400 However, they note that the high number of crustacean based 0:29:40.440 --> 0:29:44.800 pokemons compared to calliserate based pokemons does seem to be 0:29:44.840 --> 0:29:47.640 at odds with the natural world, and probably has more 0:29:47.680 --> 0:29:50.720 to do with the quote very frequent contact that Japanese 0:29:50.720 --> 0:29:55.960 people have with aquatic animals. Okay, So in general, and 0:29:55.960 --> 0:29:58.360 I'm not sure if this my version of this actually 0:29:58.440 --> 0:30:01.440 matches up with the Pokemon database info, but it would 0:30:01.440 --> 0:30:04.560 seem to mean you're going to encounter more crab based 0:30:04.600 --> 0:30:07.560 Pokemon than there are shrimp based Pokemon and so forth. 0:30:07.720 --> 0:30:10.960 Then you would encounter spider based Pokemon I see. 0:30:10.800 --> 0:30:15.520 Okay, and hard to complain about that, like, oh, they're 0:30:15.520 --> 0:30:17.920 giving us too many crabs, I can't see. Yes. 0:30:19.560 --> 0:30:22.560 Meanwhile, in the other paper concerning the fish fish being 0:30:22.560 --> 0:30:26.160 the largest vertebrate animal group, they are also well represented. 0:30:26.640 --> 0:30:29.840 They say, quote fish pokemon are very diverse creatures both 0:30:30.040 --> 0:30:33.800 taxonomic and ecologically. Despite being a small group within the 0:30:33.800 --> 0:30:38.840 Pokemon universe with eight hundred and one species. They speculate 0:30:38.880 --> 0:30:41.880 that the diversity of habitat types and real life fish 0:30:41.920 --> 0:30:44.800 analogs is only going to increase as more Pokemon are 0:30:44.880 --> 0:30:47.120 rolled out, and they would have been since this paper 0:30:47.160 --> 0:30:50.920 came out. But they argue that it already constituted a 0:30:51.000 --> 0:30:54.720 kind of quote biological pocket world that matches up with 0:30:54.760 --> 0:30:57.720 the actual biological world in key way, so kind of 0:30:57.760 --> 0:31:02.760 a fictional reflection of now diversity. And so I mean, 0:31:02.800 --> 0:31:05.239 you can you can base that in. You can look 0:31:05.280 --> 0:31:06.640 at that in a number of ways. You know. It's 0:31:06.640 --> 0:31:09.760 like if you're creating a fantasy world, it's generally to 0:31:09.800 --> 0:31:13.160 some degree mirroring a real world. Like you can look 0:31:13.200 --> 0:31:16.600 at Middle Earth or West Euros and yeah, those are 0:31:16.640 --> 0:31:19.320 there's there are a lot of clear analogs going on there, 0:31:19.800 --> 0:31:22.960 And the same would be expected of some sort of 0:31:23.040 --> 0:31:26.960 an imagined ecology, especially one that's not on an alien 0:31:26.960 --> 0:31:30.760 world but a fictional version of our own world. But 0:31:31.320 --> 0:31:35.600 if the biophilia connection is certainly in play here, it 0:31:35.640 --> 0:31:40.480 makes even more sense that your imagined ecosystem would would 0:31:40.480 --> 0:31:43.560 so closely match up, at least in broad strokes, with 0:31:43.600 --> 0:31:47.000 what is actually out there. So anyway, for my part, anyway, 0:31:47.040 --> 0:31:49.840 I find all this this interesting, this way that this 0:31:49.920 --> 0:31:52.640 big franchise, this thing that many people may just think 0:31:52.680 --> 0:31:56.480 of is pure fun, pure entertainment, and that's perfectly fine. 0:31:56.560 --> 0:31:59.760 But what if it does say something really essential about 0:31:59.760 --> 0:32:03.680 who we are and how we react and and and 0:32:03.760 --> 0:32:05.080 experience the natural world? 0:32:05.440 --> 0:32:07.400 That is interesting? I don't know if I'd ever thought 0:32:07.440 --> 0:32:11.080 of it that way? Can I? Can I shift to 0:32:11.160 --> 0:32:14.000 the more specific and ask you a question about fish pokemon? 0:32:14.440 --> 0:32:15.080 Sure? Sure? 0:32:15.440 --> 0:32:17.840 How do they fight? Do they fight on land? How 0:32:17.840 --> 0:32:20.080 does that work? I see, like, you know, so you 0:32:20.120 --> 0:32:22.240 throw out your poke balls and they fight, and it's 0:32:22.280 --> 0:32:24.800 like in an arena or on grass. What if it's 0:32:24.800 --> 0:32:26.400 a fish flop? 0:32:26.960 --> 0:32:29.520 I think sometimes they do flop for comedic purposes. But 0:32:30.040 --> 0:32:32.800 I think also these battles tend to be kind of 0:32:32.840 --> 0:32:37.480 like big anime battles. Right, So it's again, they're not 0:32:37.520 --> 0:32:40.880 necessarily necessarily fighting each other with like mouth and talon. 0:32:41.720 --> 0:32:45.360 It's more like energy balls and stuff and lightning bolts 0:32:45.400 --> 0:32:46.160 and so forth. 0:32:47.160 --> 0:32:49.680 Does the fight take place within a kind of second 0:32:49.760 --> 0:32:51.360 psychic realm? 0:32:51.480 --> 0:32:51.959 Kind of? 0:32:52.160 --> 0:32:52.440 Yeah? 0:32:52.560 --> 0:32:55.720 I mean it's it's it's kind of it's you know, 0:32:55.760 --> 0:32:58.000 it's sort of like that moment in Big Trouble and 0:32:58.040 --> 0:33:01.760 Little China where low Pa and Annection are battling and 0:33:01.800 --> 0:33:04.560 they kind of do this video game thing where each 0:33:04.600 --> 0:33:08.360 one is controlling some sort of a force different, you know, 0:33:09.160 --> 0:33:14.840 light warriors battling each other. It's essentially what's going on here. So, 0:33:15.000 --> 0:33:16.920 you know, no matter how I guess, it is a 0:33:16.920 --> 0:33:20.920 good reminder, yeat, no matter how interesting the natural connections 0:33:21.000 --> 0:33:24.800 might be in some of the the cataloging and the diversity, 0:33:24.840 --> 0:33:27.600 when it comes down to the fighting, yeah, it's I 0:33:27.600 --> 0:33:31.400 don't think there's there's much that really closely mirrors what 0:33:31.560 --> 0:33:33.040 actual organisms are doing. 0:33:33.200 --> 0:33:35.120 No, I get you. So even a fish out of 0:33:35.160 --> 0:33:37.040 water can emit rays. 0:33:37.520 --> 0:33:41.480 Yes, yes, but like you said earlier though, you know, 0:33:41.520 --> 0:33:46.160 sometimes sleeping is the attack, Sometimes flopping is probably the attack. 0:33:55.840 --> 0:33:58.280 All right. Do you want to get into these species 0:33:58.360 --> 0:34:00.760 named after Pokemon? Yeah? 0:34:00.840 --> 0:34:03.920 Yeah, because I think this is another interesting area to 0:34:03.960 --> 0:34:06.720 get into because it does kind of support this idea 0:34:06.920 --> 0:34:09.560 that hey, you can you know, you can certainly be 0:34:09.600 --> 0:34:12.480 into Pokemon and then you can actually you can actually 0:34:12.800 --> 0:34:14.799 become a scientist. You know. We again, it's been a 0:34:14.920 --> 0:34:18.360 huge generational touchstone, and so we have various examples of 0:34:18.360 --> 0:34:22.080 people with varying degrees of Pokemon knowledge who then go 0:34:22.160 --> 0:34:25.839 out into the world as scientists discover new organisms, name 0:34:25.920 --> 0:34:28.640 new organisms, and name them after Pokemon. 0:34:28.880 --> 0:34:31.440 Mm hmm h. Yeah. So Rob, when you asked me 0:34:31.480 --> 0:34:34.000 to look into this, you referred me to a list 0:34:34.120 --> 0:34:37.239 maintained on the bulb Apedia, which is great. This is 0:34:37.280 --> 0:34:41.120 sort of like the Wookipedia of the Pokemon universe. I 0:34:41.200 --> 0:34:43.440 like that, and I wish I could have helped them 0:34:43.520 --> 0:34:45.279 name it, because I feel like you've got a lot 0:34:45.280 --> 0:34:47.960 of potential there to call it like the Codex Pokemonicus 0:34:48.080 --> 0:34:48.480 or something. 0:34:49.960 --> 0:34:53.000 Yeah, yeah, I think it's This is like the sort 0:34:53.000 --> 0:34:55.000 of like fan generated version. Could be wrong on this, 0:34:55.120 --> 0:34:57.800 and then the poke des is like the official listing 0:34:57.840 --> 0:35:00.960 and is also like the in game cattle of Pokemon. 0:35:01.080 --> 0:35:04.759 That's the one maintained by the Empire. But yes, but yeah, 0:35:04.960 --> 0:35:08.319 so you've got people adding these things. So anyway, I 0:35:08.320 --> 0:35:10.000 did look some of these up, and I've got some 0:35:10.080 --> 0:35:14.600 thoughts in general about how these naming conventions work out. 0:35:15.400 --> 0:35:17.759 Yeah, and this is going to be really fun. But first, 0:35:17.840 --> 0:35:19.239 first of all, I do want to make a quick 0:35:19.280 --> 0:35:22.640 note here about Pokemon creature names. This is not going 0:35:22.680 --> 0:35:24.480 to be new information for a lot of you out there. 0:35:24.520 --> 0:35:29.359 But some Pokemon retain or largely retain their original Japanese names, 0:35:29.400 --> 0:35:34.080 so like Pikachu, mewtwo, Pichu, while others are changed at 0:35:34.120 --> 0:35:36.200 least a little and sometimes quite a bit for the 0:35:36.239 --> 0:35:44.000 English language market. So for instance, Lizardon became Charizard, Kabigan 0:35:44.120 --> 0:35:48.080 became snorlax Puran became jigly Puff, and one of my 0:35:48.160 --> 0:35:51.759 favorites yad On. I think that's that I may be 0:35:51.840 --> 0:35:56.080 mispronouncing the Japanese name, but he becomes slow Poke. Slow 0:35:56.080 --> 0:35:59.000 Poke has an amazing life cycle, and my kids showed 0:35:59.040 --> 0:36:01.880 me a slow Poke episode of the cartoon once that 0:36:02.360 --> 0:36:05.080 I thought was just super weird. It was like a 0:36:05.120 --> 0:36:09.360 stoner animation, so I was really impressed by that. But anyway, 0:36:09.360 --> 0:36:11.320 one of the main reasons for all of this is 0:36:11.360 --> 0:36:15.520 that sometimes the wordplay in Japanese just doesn't translate, or 0:36:15.680 --> 0:36:18.960 they feel like, well, let's try a name that accomplishes 0:36:19.000 --> 0:36:20.360 the same thing but in English. 0:36:20.640 --> 0:36:24.200 Yeah. Now, before we get into some of these species 0:36:24.200 --> 0:36:27.319 that have been named after Pokemon, I do have to 0:36:27.520 --> 0:36:31.160 take a little digression here to talk about the law. 0:36:31.680 --> 0:36:35.640 Many scientists have tried to name things after Pokemon, and 0:36:35.719 --> 0:36:40.120 the company that owns the Pokemon trademark has not always 0:36:40.160 --> 0:36:43.040 taken kindly to this. It is with a heavy heart 0:36:43.040 --> 0:36:45.640 that I must report that sometimes the lawyers are brought 0:36:45.640 --> 0:36:50.560 in about Pokemon naming. One example that I came across 0:36:51.120 --> 0:36:54.160 is described in a two thousand and five news article 0:36:54.320 --> 0:36:59.680 in Nature by Tom Simonite called Pokemon block's gene name. 0:37:00.440 --> 0:37:03.680 The lead of this article reads, quote, A cancer research 0:37:03.800 --> 0:37:06.840 institute has been threatened with legal action by the US 0:37:06.840 --> 0:37:10.520 branch of Japanese video game franchise Pokemon after one of 0:37:10.520 --> 0:37:14.800 its researchers borrowed the company's trademark to name an oncogene. 0:37:15.200 --> 0:37:17.759 An onco gene is a gene that has the potential 0:37:17.800 --> 0:37:20.719 to cause cancer. I've also seen the gene in this 0:37:20.800 --> 0:37:24.359 story referred to as a proto onco gene. So the 0:37:24.360 --> 0:37:27.680 origin of this conflict is that a group of cancer 0:37:27.719 --> 0:37:32.240 researchers led by Pierre Paolo Pandulfi of Memorial Sloan Kettering 0:37:32.280 --> 0:37:36.279 Cancer Center in New York. I think they first talked 0:37:36.320 --> 0:37:39.560 about this in a conference presentation in two thousand and one. 0:37:40.440 --> 0:37:44.200 They were introducing the discovery or naming of a cancer 0:37:44.280 --> 0:37:48.600 gene that they called the Pokemon gene, so named because 0:37:48.680 --> 0:37:53.040 it came from a family already known as the Pok 0:37:53.719 --> 0:37:59.759 genes pok letters pok and then this particular gene was 0:37:59.800 --> 0:38:05.920 the pok erythroid myeloid ontogenic, which acronymed out pretty nicely 0:38:06.000 --> 0:38:10.920 to Pokemon. And so when this group published their findings 0:38:10.920 --> 0:38:13.960 and nomenclature in the journal Nature in two thousand and five, 0:38:14.480 --> 0:38:19.640 some subsequent reporting I think seized on this delicious opportunity 0:38:20.000 --> 0:38:24.440 to run headlines like scientists discover Pokemon causes cancer. 0:38:24.920 --> 0:38:26.960 Oh well, that was bound to happen, wasn't it. 0:38:27.520 --> 0:38:31.040 Pokemon USA did not like this. They got involved and 0:38:31.120 --> 0:38:34.239 threatened to sue the scientists unless they changed the name 0:38:34.280 --> 0:38:38.960 of the gene. The scientists involved protested that the name 0:38:39.040 --> 0:38:41.279 of the gene didn't have anything to do with the 0:38:41.320 --> 0:38:44.399 game or the cartoon. It was just an acronym. It 0:38:44.440 --> 0:38:48.279 was like the pok emont a. You know, I guess 0:38:48.280 --> 0:38:50.880 it's questionable. You can think they knew what they were doing, 0:38:51.040 --> 0:38:53.600 or maybe you can think they didn't. I don't really know. 0:38:53.719 --> 0:38:57.279 But their claim was it's just an acronym from what 0:38:57.480 --> 0:39:00.440 this gene is. But in response to that, I'm going 0:39:00.520 --> 0:39:02.719 to read from this two thousand and five article quote 0:39:02.880 --> 0:39:06.400 a spokeswoman for Pokemon USA told Nature that its image 0:39:06.440 --> 0:39:10.040 was at risk. Quote. We don't want our image undermined 0:39:10.040 --> 0:39:15.080 by associating Pokemon with cancer, she said. So. This article 0:39:15.160 --> 0:39:18.239 notes that it is not the only time a researcher 0:39:18.280 --> 0:39:20.799 has been threatened with legal action over the name of 0:39:20.840 --> 0:39:25.400 a gene. For example, in nineteen ninety three, the Velcro 0:39:25.640 --> 0:39:30.440 Corporation threatened to sue a scientist named Alfonso Martinez Arius 0:39:30.640 --> 0:39:34.280 of the University of Cambridge because he named a fruit 0:39:34.320 --> 0:39:38.160 fly gene the velcrow gene. I want to note that 0:39:38.320 --> 0:39:40.120 in looking this up, it seems to me like the 0:39:40.200 --> 0:39:45.120 Velcrow Corporation is especially sensitive about use of the word velcrow. 0:39:45.880 --> 0:39:48.600 Like they've got this whole ad campaign about trying to 0:39:48.680 --> 0:39:51.480 get people to not use that word as a verb 0:39:51.800 --> 0:39:53.839 or as a generic now and they're like, no, it's 0:39:53.840 --> 0:39:56.680 called hook and loop. Velcrow is the name of the company. 0:39:58.360 --> 0:40:00.920 Yeah. I mean, there's a an amount of drift like 0:40:00.960 --> 0:40:04.560 that that is unavoidable. You know, it's gonna you're going 0:40:04.600 --> 0:40:08.600 to call you know, whatever the most prominent brand name is. 0:40:08.640 --> 0:40:10.319 You're just going to call it that. You know, it's 0:40:10.360 --> 0:40:12.760 like people asking for a coke when they're not really 0:40:12.760 --> 0:40:15.040 talking about a Coca Cola. It's just that, you know, 0:40:15.120 --> 0:40:17.840 this is what comes with having a successful franchise. 0:40:18.080 --> 0:40:20.239 I don't know, but I wonder if this is one 0:40:20.280 --> 0:40:24.759 of those cases of extremely aggressive intellectual property claims that 0:40:24.880 --> 0:40:29.440 are based on like lawyers telling a company that they 0:40:29.520 --> 0:40:32.160 cannot allow a certain kind of precedent to be set, 0:40:32.320 --> 0:40:35.400 like you always have to pursue this aggressively, or in 0:40:35.440 --> 0:40:37.920 the future you may not be able to make claims 0:40:37.960 --> 0:40:41.600 that you want to. Yeah, but anyway, there it hasn't 0:40:41.640 --> 0:40:46.160 always happened with genes named after named after protected properties. 0:40:46.200 --> 0:40:49.240 There is a gene known as the sonic hedgehogs gene 0:40:49.440 --> 0:40:52.120 that has escaped this fate. So hats off to Sega 0:40:52.280 --> 0:40:56.280 for being cool about that. But the the legal threats 0:40:56.320 --> 0:40:58.799 worked in the case of the Pokemon gene, which is 0:40:58.840 --> 0:41:02.160 now known by the some would say equally catchy name 0:41:02.920 --> 0:41:04.360 z bTB seven. 0:41:05.840 --> 0:41:07.840 I mean, I don't want to get into the legal 0:41:07.880 --> 0:41:09.719 ins and outs here is, but I mean I can 0:41:09.840 --> 0:41:12.480 I can kind of see where the Pokemon lawyers are 0:41:12.480 --> 0:41:14.480 coming from here, right, I mean, if you're talking about 0:41:15.000 --> 0:41:16.960 something that is linked to cancer. 0:41:18.320 --> 0:41:22.160 Well, yeah, I certainly understand their perspective, though I think 0:41:22.160 --> 0:41:25.960 I just generally have an orientation that it's a bummer 0:41:26.000 --> 0:41:27.960 to be suing scientists about Yeah. 0:41:28.000 --> 0:41:31.920 Yeah, absolutely yeah. And I mean, would it really have 0:41:32.160 --> 0:41:36.040 reflected poorly on on the Pokemon brand? 0:41:36.800 --> 0:41:41.279 I doubt it. But anyway, there was another thing, So 0:41:41.480 --> 0:41:43.160 this one. I want to be careful in how I 0:41:43.200 --> 0:41:46.200 couch this because I did not find this verified by 0:41:46.200 --> 0:41:49.760 any reporting, So nobody, as far as I know, nobody 0:41:49.800 --> 0:41:51.560 tracked this down to the source to make one hundred 0:41:51.560 --> 0:41:54.279 percent sure this is true. But I found a seven 0:41:54.360 --> 0:41:58.560 year old Reddit post that claimed to be an entomologist 0:41:58.800 --> 0:42:02.520 trying to hold a contest to name some new ant 0:42:02.600 --> 0:42:08.360 species after Pokemon. And this post claims that they started 0:42:08.400 --> 0:42:11.480 to do this contest thing, and then they contacted the 0:42:11.480 --> 0:42:14.440 Pokemon company to get their blessing to go through with this, 0:42:14.560 --> 0:42:17.959 you know, naming these species after Pokemon, and instead got 0:42:18.000 --> 0:42:20.600 some legal threats. That is what the post claims they 0:42:20.640 --> 0:42:23.279 were told not to use any names. Again, don't have 0:42:23.360 --> 0:42:25.480 total confidence in the story because it's just a Reddit 0:42:25.520 --> 0:42:28.680 post like this could be anybody, But if true, that 0:42:28.760 --> 0:42:32.000 would be somewhat consistent with this other story. Yeah. 0:42:32.080 --> 0:42:34.719 Yeah, And certainly when you're dealing with big companies like 0:42:34.719 --> 0:42:36.880 this is probably what somebody's job to go around and 0:42:36.920 --> 0:42:42.000 like make sure that the certain names and certain ideas 0:42:42.000 --> 0:42:44.879 are not being used by other people, even if it's 0:42:44.920 --> 0:42:47.200 a case where if you went down like to the 0:42:47.239 --> 0:42:50.200 creative levels, they would be like, oh, that's why are 0:42:50.239 --> 0:42:52.160 you causing a stir over this? 0:42:52.280 --> 0:42:56.920 You know, right exactly. But it's weird because for some reason, 0:42:57.719 --> 0:43:01.960 this has not been the universal fame of biological entities 0:43:02.000 --> 0:43:05.839 named after pokemon. Quite a number of them exist, and 0:43:05.920 --> 0:43:10.239 I truly don't know if it's because these other things 0:43:10.480 --> 0:43:13.440 like slipped under the company's radar and then it was 0:43:13.480 --> 0:43:15.920 too late for them to do anything about it, or 0:43:15.960 --> 0:43:19.000 if it's because the company is cool with some associations 0:43:19.040 --> 0:43:21.080 and not others. I don't know why they'd be okay 0:43:21.160 --> 0:43:25.240 with a bee but not an aunt. Yeah, but anyway, 0:43:25.640 --> 0:43:27.480 are you ready to talk about a few of these. 0:43:27.360 --> 0:43:29.560 Yeah, let's talk about some specific pokemon. 0:43:30.760 --> 0:43:35.200 The first example is a species of wasp named after 0:43:35.320 --> 0:43:38.759 the pokemon known as Wheedle. And I was looking at 0:43:38.800 --> 0:43:41.920 these images, I was like, I remember this guy, so okay, 0:43:41.960 --> 0:43:43.799 so I at least made it far enough in the 0:43:43.840 --> 0:43:47.040 original game Boy game to meet a Wheedle. Here's a 0:43:47.080 --> 0:43:51.560 little curious little caterpillar with like a purple clown nose, 0:43:52.160 --> 0:43:56.520 very adorable eyes, little baby dough eyes, looking up at you. 0:43:56.600 --> 0:43:58.719 It's got a posture that's kind of like, you know, 0:43:58.760 --> 0:44:01.960 a kitten raising up on its back legs at you, like, 0:44:02.000 --> 0:44:04.120 oh please, you know, can I please have a treat? 0:44:04.800 --> 0:44:07.760 But then it all it's very cute in that respect. 0:44:08.719 --> 0:44:11.400 But then this cute little caterpillar has what looks like 0:44:11.480 --> 0:44:14.880 a knife blade for a tail and a metal spike 0:44:15.080 --> 0:44:17.360 on its head, a kind of conical spike like a 0:44:17.400 --> 0:44:22.400 party hat. So Wheedle is viciously cute, but does have weapons. 0:44:22.960 --> 0:44:24.279 Yeah, I had to look this one up. This is 0:44:24.280 --> 0:44:28.600 not what I was familiar with. Apparently, Wheedle evolves into Cocuna, 0:44:28.719 --> 0:44:31.960 which is a kind of crystalis or a cocoon. Now 0:44:32.000 --> 0:44:35.239 I realize that's that's what the name means. And then 0:44:35.320 --> 0:44:39.560 this evolves into b Drill. This is a bee or 0:44:39.800 --> 0:44:43.680 wasp like creature that seems to have spikes or drills 0:44:43.760 --> 0:44:46.120 for hands, and also a stinger so it can like 0:44:46.200 --> 0:44:47.640 poke you numerous ways. 0:44:47.640 --> 0:44:50.520 I guess, right, So the conical spike that's on this 0:44:50.640 --> 0:44:53.680 caterpillar's head in the evolved form, those are its hands, 0:44:53.800 --> 0:44:57.799 So it's like Edward's spike hands. Yeah. Yeah. So the 0:44:57.800 --> 0:45:01.359 species named after this pokemon is a type of parasitoid 0:45:01.560 --> 0:45:05.560 wasp from Eastern Africa, described in a paper by Nielsen 0:45:05.640 --> 0:45:09.520 and Buffington in the Journal African Entomology in twenty eleven. 0:45:09.960 --> 0:45:14.839 This paper describes five new species of the genus stint Torsps. 0:45:15.160 --> 0:45:19.120 This one is called stin Torsps wheed alee or I 0:45:19.120 --> 0:45:21.040 don't know. If I didn't know it is named after 0:45:21.080 --> 0:45:23.640 the pokemon, I might have thought that was like weed late. Yeah, 0:45:23.719 --> 0:45:28.520 we'd lay I or we'd lay em. Anyway, why is 0:45:28.520 --> 0:45:32.279 it named after wheedl Because like Wheedle, this wasp has 0:45:32.320 --> 0:45:35.600 a spine jutting out of the middle of its head. Rob, 0:45:35.640 --> 0:45:37.239 I've got some images for you to look at in 0:45:37.280 --> 0:45:39.160 the outline here you might be able to say. It's 0:45:39.200 --> 0:45:41.200 kind of hard to see, but there's a little I 0:45:41.239 --> 0:45:43.320 think you can see a little spine sticking out of 0:45:43.360 --> 0:45:45.759 its head between the antennae here, Yeah, I see it. 0:45:46.680 --> 0:45:50.319 This species was found in Madagascar. I couldn't get a 0:45:50.360 --> 0:45:54.600 lot more information about its behavior or morphology. But this 0:45:54.680 --> 0:45:56.719 is what it looks like. It's got a horn and 0:45:57.120 --> 0:45:58.799 as far as I can tell, no knife tail. 0:45:59.480 --> 0:46:01.960 Yeah, no drills for arms on this guy. 0:46:02.360 --> 0:46:04.960 Okay, how about some Pikachu's you ready, There are quite 0:46:05.000 --> 0:46:05.760 a few of these. 0:46:06.239 --> 0:46:08.680 I guess that would make sense given Pikachu's popularity. 0:46:08.880 --> 0:46:11.399 I found at least four. I'm gonna do these kind 0:46:11.400 --> 0:46:15.880 of rapid fire. One is called Dicranocentris Pikachu. This is 0:46:15.880 --> 0:46:20.160 a species of springtail found in Brazil. Springtails are a 0:46:20.560 --> 0:46:24.600 large class of six legged arthropods, not insects, but they 0:46:24.640 --> 0:46:29.520 are hexapods. This species was named and described by Zisto 0:46:29.680 --> 0:46:32.719 and Mendonsa, and I couldn't find a lot of info 0:46:32.760 --> 0:46:35.279 on it, no picture that I could verify, but it 0:46:35.360 --> 0:46:40.120 is a type of springtail named after Pikachu. The next species, 0:46:40.600 --> 0:46:42.319 this one has a little bit more to look at. 0:46:42.400 --> 0:46:46.200 This is called Hyperantha Pikachu. It is a species of 0:46:46.400 --> 0:46:50.480 jewel beetle from Brazil, described in an article in Zootaxa 0:46:50.719 --> 0:46:55.480 by Pineda and Barros in twenty twenty one. And here 0:46:55.600 --> 0:46:59.239 the authors have an etymology note in their paper They say, 0:46:59.320 --> 0:47:02.879 quote the pacific name is an homage to Pikachu, a 0:47:02.960 --> 0:47:07.160 fictional monster which this species resembles in its yellow elytra 0:47:07.400 --> 0:47:10.759 with a black apical band like the ears of Pikachu. 0:47:11.360 --> 0:47:13.799 And so rob I've attached some pictures for you to 0:47:13.800 --> 0:47:16.000 look at in the outline here. It is a beetle, 0:47:16.400 --> 0:47:20.719 and the elytra refers to the hard coverings of the 0:47:20.880 --> 0:47:22.800 hard coverings on the outside of the wings, so you 0:47:22.880 --> 0:47:26.000 might it's kind of a shell that closes over the wings, 0:47:27.320 --> 0:47:29.480 and you can see there it is very yellow. So 0:47:29.520 --> 0:47:32.120 it's a yellow and black beetle. And I don't know, 0:47:32.160 --> 0:47:34.520 do you see Pikachu. I see the Pikachu colors. 0:47:34.800 --> 0:47:37.080 I think this is Pikachu. I see Pikachu. One out 0:47:37.120 --> 0:47:41.400 of percent. Okay, yeah, yeah, this is Pikachu as a 0:47:41.440 --> 0:47:42.320 flying insect. 0:47:42.920 --> 0:47:46.440 Next one is Alistra pikachu. This is described by linn 0:47:46.600 --> 0:47:50.320 at All in a twenty twenty one paper in Zoological Systematics. 0:47:50.880 --> 0:47:54.239 This paper reports on twenty three new spider species discovered 0:47:54.280 --> 0:47:59.040 from various places in China and India. Elistra Pikachu is 0:47:59.120 --> 0:48:03.320 a little tiny spider measuring less than two millimeters at most, 0:48:03.680 --> 0:48:07.560 discovered in a cave in Guangdong Province in Southeast China. 0:48:08.080 --> 0:48:10.720 The authors say that it was named after Pikachu because 0:48:10.760 --> 0:48:14.880 it is yellow. And also in the same paper, the 0:48:14.920 --> 0:48:20.640 authors describe a pale cave spider that they name sinopesa 0:48:20.800 --> 0:48:24.160 Gollum and they acknowledge, yes, this is a pale cave 0:48:24.200 --> 0:48:27.000 spider named after Gollum from Lord of the Rings. 0:48:27.280 --> 0:48:29.960 Hmmm, okay, I couldn't find a picture of the Gollum 0:48:30.040 --> 0:48:35.320 spider the Pikachu spider, and I don't feel as strongly 0:48:36.400 --> 0:48:38.319 about this one. It's like, okay, I guess it's it 0:48:38.400 --> 0:48:40.400 is kind of yellow. I guess you could call it 0:48:40.400 --> 0:48:44.440 a Pikachu spider, but not as strong a case to 0:48:44.480 --> 0:48:45.520 be made here in my opinion. 0:48:45.880 --> 0:48:49.480 So the next one is Epicritinus Pikachu, named in a 0:48:49.520 --> 0:48:55.080 twenty twenty paper by Goncalvas and Breaskovit. This describes eleven 0:48:55.120 --> 0:48:59.879 new species of spider from the genus Epicritinus, all found 0:49:00.040 --> 0:49:04.840 in Brazil. The authors here were going wild with video 0:49:04.960 --> 0:49:08.560 game names and other nerd references in naming these spiders. 0:49:08.680 --> 0:49:11.759 So it's naming eleven spider species. One of them is 0:49:11.840 --> 0:49:18.480 Epicritinus Zengi for Zengi street Fighter. There's also an Epicritinus 0:49:18.480 --> 0:49:25.680 e Honda. There's there's an Epcritinus Anakin, and an Epicatrinus Vader. 0:49:26.520 --> 0:49:31.480 Oh wow, there's an Epicritinas Pikachu. Of course, there's an 0:49:31.480 --> 0:49:37.320 Epicritinus Pegasus, and Epicatinus Zelda, and then some other things 0:49:37.480 --> 0:49:41.160 I don't know. I don't recognize, but maybe they're from something. 0:49:41.200 --> 0:49:48.040 Epicritinus Omegaarugal, Epicritinus dou Can. I don't know what those are. 0:49:48.320 --> 0:49:50.840 Yeah, the listeners write in, if you know what a 0:49:50.920 --> 0:49:51.560 duke can is. 0:49:51.920 --> 0:49:55.120 Oh, and there's one Epocritinus Stitch. Is that Leelo and Stitch, 0:49:55.880 --> 0:49:56.520 it would have to be. 0:49:56.600 --> 0:49:59.560 That's Maybe it's something more obscure from anime as well, 0:49:59.600 --> 0:50:01.760 But that's that's the connection I'm making. 0:50:01.960 --> 0:50:04.680 Okay, here's where this one gets good. About the Pikachu one. 0:50:04.800 --> 0:50:07.799 In this case, the name Pikachu was not chosen just 0:50:07.920 --> 0:50:10.919 because the spider is yellow or yellow and black. They 0:50:10.920 --> 0:50:14.719 claim the inspiration is about a specific part of an 0:50:14.760 --> 0:50:19.400 at of the anatomy quote etymology. The specific epithet is 0:50:19.440 --> 0:50:22.920 a noun taken in apposition and is in reference to Pikachu, 0:50:23.000 --> 0:50:27.120 a fictional rodent and electrical creature that's a great description. 0:50:27.760 --> 0:50:31.520 I Love Love a fictional rodent and electrical creature that 0:50:31.600 --> 0:50:34.880 appears in an assortment of video games, anime, et cetera, 0:50:35.080 --> 0:50:38.440 licensed by the Pokemon Company. And then now they're speaking 0:50:38.480 --> 0:50:43.440 of the spider. The female epigonum resembles the face of Pikachu. 0:50:43.880 --> 0:50:48.360 Now what does that mean? Well, the epiginum of a 0:50:48.400 --> 0:50:53.440 spider is the external genital organ of a female spider. 0:50:53.920 --> 0:50:56.440 It is a hardened plate on the underside of the 0:50:56.480 --> 0:51:01.160 female spider's abdomen, which has these openings that receive sperm 0:51:01.239 --> 0:51:05.759 from the male's petipalps during mating. The epigonum often has 0:51:06.000 --> 0:51:09.960 distinctive markings that can help with species identification, and in 0:51:10.000 --> 0:51:14.160 this case, the authors think that this spider's genitals look 0:51:14.280 --> 0:51:17.280 like Pikachu's face. Rob, I'll let you be the judge. 0:51:17.280 --> 0:51:20.080 I've attached a view in right below this in the 0:51:20.080 --> 0:51:22.960 outline here, I've got a ventral view of the female 0:51:22.960 --> 0:51:25.480 spider on the right, so you can see down on 0:51:25.520 --> 0:51:27.919 the abdomen. The genital plate is going to be near 0:51:28.040 --> 0:51:31.120 the top of the underside of the abdomen. Do you 0:51:31.200 --> 0:51:33.480 see Pikachu in this spider crotch? 0:51:33.880 --> 0:51:36.360 Who I want to see Pikachu in this spider crotch. 0:51:36.400 --> 0:51:38.760 I feel like I'm looking at a like a magic 0:51:38.800 --> 0:51:41.600 eye puzzle here, and I want to be a part 0:51:41.640 --> 0:51:44.799 of the magic but I'm having trouble seeing it. I'm 0:51:45.040 --> 0:51:48.840 flipping back and forth between this and some pictures of Pikachu. 0:51:49.440 --> 0:51:51.200 I want to believe, but I'm having trouble. 0:51:51.239 --> 0:51:53.600 Shoe, Well, I thought maybe you would see Okay, maybe, 0:51:53.920 --> 0:51:55.200 I just want to make sure you're looking at the 0:51:55.239 --> 0:51:57.600 right place. So you're looking on the underside view of 0:51:57.600 --> 0:51:59.839 the spider, near the top of the abdomen, you don't 0:51:59.840 --> 0:52:01.520 see a little thing that looks kind of like it 0:52:01.600 --> 0:52:04.560 has It's like a yellow face with black bunny ears 0:52:04.600 --> 0:52:06.600 and black spots that could be eyes. 0:52:07.800 --> 0:52:13.240 Okay, Okay, now that I'm looking more specifically, yeah, yeah, okay, 0:52:13.239 --> 0:52:16.520 I can see it. I can see it. It's yeah, 0:52:16.920 --> 0:52:19.359 that that could be a Pikachu, all right, Okay. 0:52:19.600 --> 0:52:23.719 I think probably, though I'm not an expert on this, obviously, 0:52:23.760 --> 0:52:27.200 but I believe the things that we're interpreting as Pikachu's 0:52:27.239 --> 0:52:30.080 eyes here would be the holes that receive the sperm 0:52:30.239 --> 0:52:30.920 during mating. 0:52:31.280 --> 0:52:34.640 Yeah, and the things that we're seeing are that are 0:52:34.680 --> 0:52:36.600 the ears of the Pikachu. These are part of the 0:52:37.200 --> 0:52:39.360 coloration that we see on the rest of the abdomen 0:52:39.520 --> 0:52:39.920 the plate. 0:52:40.000 --> 0:52:42.080 Yeah, I think the ears are just part of the 0:52:42.480 --> 0:52:43.360 epigonum plate. 0:52:43.719 --> 0:52:48.319 Okay, all right, okay, I've I've come around to this one. Yeah, 0:52:48.360 --> 0:52:50.040 I do believe now, Okay. 0:52:49.800 --> 0:53:04.640 Pikachu face genitals confirmed. All right. Next one is the 0:53:04.760 --> 0:53:10.279 charizard bee. In twenty sixteen, a researcher named Spencer K. 0:53:10.680 --> 0:53:14.680 Monkton published a paper in the journal Zoo Keys describing 0:53:14.760 --> 0:53:18.240 eight new species of bee in the subgenus chili Cola 0:53:18.320 --> 0:53:21.440 living in Chile. One of these species was given the 0:53:21.520 --> 0:53:23.279 name Chilicola charizard. 0:53:23.640 --> 0:53:27.120 Charizard's the little dragon with the tail on fire. 0:53:27.320 --> 0:53:31.919 Yes, pretty iconic. So the paper itself doesn't say why 0:53:31.960 --> 0:53:34.759 he chose to name this bee after a pokemon, but 0:53:34.800 --> 0:53:36.640 I found a bit more detail in a press release 0:53:36.680 --> 0:53:39.600 from twenty sixteen, so I looked this up on Eurek Alert. 0:53:40.560 --> 0:53:43.319 The species is part of a family known sometimes as 0:53:43.360 --> 0:53:49.240 the polyester bees or as cellophane bees. These bees secrete 0:53:49.360 --> 0:53:53.040 a substance that they used to line the walls of 0:53:53.120 --> 0:53:56.960 their nest cells. I think they're primarily ground burrowing bees, 0:53:57.040 --> 0:54:00.600 or sometimes they might be stem burrowing, but they create 0:54:00.640 --> 0:54:03.640 these nest cells and they line them with this secretion that, 0:54:03.719 --> 0:54:07.640 once it hardens, forms a smooth lining that people compare 0:54:07.719 --> 0:54:12.520 to clear plastic film or cellophane. So what's the similarity 0:54:12.560 --> 0:54:17.799 with Charizard. Like Charizard, the stem nesting Charizard bee is 0:54:17.920 --> 0:54:21.960 usually found around mountains, in this case the andes. So 0:54:22.000 --> 0:54:24.680 I had to get the detail that Charizar the pokemon 0:54:24.760 --> 0:54:27.080 is found around mountains from his article. I didn't know 0:54:27.200 --> 0:54:29.680 that because again I thought you get Charizard at the 0:54:29.680 --> 0:54:31.959 beginning of the game. But maybe it's in the wild too. 0:54:33.280 --> 0:54:37.200 I don't know. Yeah, I know in the Detective Pikachu 0:54:37.280 --> 0:54:40.719 movie it's like an urban in an urban environment, but 0:54:40.800 --> 0:54:42.440 I guess that's not its natural habitat. 0:54:42.520 --> 0:54:46.440 Okay, but it has some so the author claims it 0:54:46.440 --> 0:54:50.480 has some visual features in common. Rob I've got pictures 0:54:50.480 --> 0:54:51.840 of this bee for you to look at in the 0:54:51.840 --> 0:54:54.359 outline down below. You can compare this as I as 0:54:54.360 --> 0:54:58.360 I read through the features quote, long snout like face, 0:54:58.920 --> 0:55:03.400 broad hind limbs. So Charizard, I guess has like big legs, 0:55:03.440 --> 0:55:07.279 thick thighs and yeah, big legs, so long snout like 0:55:07.320 --> 0:55:11.480 face and broad hind limbs with antennae in place of horns. 0:55:11.960 --> 0:55:15.640 So charizard has horns, the charizard bee has antenna. Of course, 0:55:16.200 --> 0:55:16.840 what do you think? 0:55:17.960 --> 0:55:21.360 Hmm? I mean, I'll take it. I'll take it, but 0:55:21.360 --> 0:55:23.000 but it does seem like maybe a little bit more 0:55:23.040 --> 0:55:23.880 of a stretch. 0:55:24.800 --> 0:55:27.759 This bee is very small, between four and seven millimeters 0:55:27.760 --> 0:55:30.800 in length. In life. It is not red or orange 0:55:30.880 --> 0:55:34.000 like charizard. It's mostly dark brown, black and yellow. But 0:55:34.680 --> 0:55:38.480 apparently when you preserve specimens of this bee in the lab, 0:55:38.840 --> 0:55:42.719 its yellow markings tend to turn orange, which Monkton said 0:55:42.800 --> 0:55:47.000 quote cemented the comparison. Okay, I feel like maybe he 0:55:47.040 --> 0:55:49.120 was trying to get there, but I don't know. 0:55:49.920 --> 0:55:51.600 I guess One of the things to keep in mind 0:55:51.640 --> 0:55:53.920 in all of these examples is like, otherwise, what are 0:55:54.000 --> 0:55:56.040 you naming these species after? You have to name them 0:55:56.040 --> 0:55:59.040 after something, and you know a lot of species end 0:55:59.120 --> 0:56:03.200 up being big be named after individuals or after say 0:56:03.200 --> 0:56:05.279 mythological figures and something like. 0:56:05.200 --> 0:56:06.960 Those tem physical traits or if you. 0:56:06.960 --> 0:56:08.839 Have physical traits. But you know, there are also plenty 0:56:08.880 --> 0:56:12.080 of examples that are named after mythological figures, and you 0:56:12.120 --> 0:56:14.160 know these this is the new mythology, These are the 0:56:14.200 --> 0:56:18.080 new things that we can name creatures after and then 0:56:18.239 --> 0:56:21.000 I don't know, it's also probably in some cases a 0:56:21.000 --> 0:56:23.080 little bit of the Hey, if I name this after 0:56:23.320 --> 0:56:26.480 a certain Pokemon, maybe more people will pay attention to 0:56:26.960 --> 0:56:30.040 my findings in the study. And you know, you could 0:56:30.080 --> 0:56:32.880 maybe spend that and say, well that maybe you're exploiting 0:56:32.880 --> 0:56:34.680 the Pokemon. But I mean, it's also coming back to 0:56:34.680 --> 0:56:38.040 what we were talking about earlier, like people take people's 0:56:38.239 --> 0:56:41.759 that take the take the fascination people have with Pokemon, 0:56:42.200 --> 0:56:45.040 and that certainly the children have with Pokemon, and if 0:56:45.040 --> 0:56:48.560 you can get them a little more interested in the 0:56:48.600 --> 0:56:51.200 actual science it's going out there in the actual, actual 0:56:51.320 --> 0:56:54.160 natural world. Not only is that great, like that's in 0:56:54.239 --> 0:56:58.160 the original spirit of the generation of Pokemon. 0:56:58.320 --> 0:57:00.920 So I'm all for it. Yeah, Oh yeah, I was 0:57:00.960 --> 0:57:03.040 going to say the same thing. I can't prove this, 0:57:03.120 --> 0:57:06.800 and I'm certainly not saying this with any negative implications, 0:57:06.880 --> 0:57:12.239 but my guess is that sometimes naming species after Pokemon 0:57:12.360 --> 0:57:16.560 could be a bid to get some attention to the research. Yeah, 0:57:16.840 --> 0:57:21.480 because you know, of course, if you are just documenting 0:57:21.560 --> 0:57:23.919 in a kind of dry and standard way, if you're 0:57:23.920 --> 0:57:28.040 documenting fourteen new species of bee or spider, somewhere that 0:57:28.160 --> 0:57:31.080 is useful information to the field, but it's probably not 0:57:31.120 --> 0:57:33.400 going to get noticed at all in the mainstream press 0:57:33.520 --> 0:57:35.960 or you know, not a lot of people outside of 0:57:35.960 --> 0:57:38.000 the field are going to pay attention to it. But 0:57:38.080 --> 0:57:40.920 if you name something after a Pokemon, you instantly tap 0:57:41.040 --> 0:57:44.080 into a large fan base of people who are like, oh, 0:57:44.160 --> 0:57:45.760 I want to read about this. Yeah. 0:57:45.880 --> 0:57:48.200 Yeah, And then of course, as we've been discussing, it's 0:57:48.240 --> 0:57:50.640 just fine, So why in the name of fine, let's 0:57:50.680 --> 0:57:50.840 do it. 0:57:51.480 --> 0:57:56.480 Yeah, one more example, And this is not an exhaustive exploration, 0:57:56.560 --> 0:57:58.880 So if you want to find all of these species 0:57:58.880 --> 0:58:00.560 that are named after Pokemon, you can go to the 0:58:00.560 --> 0:58:04.280 Bulbipedia or I think there's a mainstream Wikipedia list where 0:58:04.280 --> 0:58:05.680 people have compiled these as well. 0:58:05.840 --> 0:58:08.919 Yeah, and there will be more after this publication, for sure, 0:58:08.960 --> 0:58:11.680 there will be more creatures discovered and named after Pokemon. 0:58:12.000 --> 0:58:13.880 But the last one we're going to talk about today 0:58:14.080 --> 0:58:20.760 is the Bulbosaurus genus. So this is a long extinct 0:58:20.800 --> 0:58:25.400 genus of quadrupedal vertebrate called Bulbasaurus. It obviously shares a 0:58:25.480 --> 0:58:29.320 name with the pokemon bulbasur Robigin. This is a I 0:58:29.320 --> 0:58:31.600 don't know exactly what all of its qualities are. But 0:58:31.640 --> 0:58:35.720 it's a little cute, four legged, cute but aggressive, little 0:58:35.720 --> 0:58:38.680 four legged turtle type thing that is sort of a 0:58:38.720 --> 0:58:41.560 plant type Pokemon has got like vines coming out of it. 0:58:42.040 --> 0:58:44.520 Yeah yeah yeah, And he has like a what like 0:58:44.560 --> 0:58:45.720 a flower on his back? 0:58:46.000 --> 0:58:50.120 Yeah yeah. I have read conflicting statements in different sources 0:58:50.160 --> 0:58:54.040 about whether or not this actual extinct animal is named 0:58:54.040 --> 0:58:57.919 after the Pokemon. Some sources say it's just a coincidence. 0:58:58.080 --> 0:59:01.400 Others say it might not be a coincidence. I don't 0:59:01.400 --> 0:59:04.280 know if the researchers are being cute about this, but 0:59:04.520 --> 0:59:10.479 Bulbosaurus is a genus of the thrapsid clade Designodontia, which 0:59:10.520 --> 0:59:14.720 means two dog tooth, named after the fact that Desygnodonts 0:59:14.800 --> 0:59:19.160 typically had two tusks or large protruding teeth, which looked 0:59:19.200 --> 0:59:22.880 kind of like goofy vampire fangs from an old movie, 0:59:22.960 --> 0:59:26.840 you know, either like big overbite tusks or fang teeth. 0:59:27.720 --> 0:59:31.960 Desynodonts were a widespread, successful taxon that thrived during the 0:59:31.960 --> 0:59:37.480 Permian era. The key species reported in this Pokemon genus 0:59:37.600 --> 0:59:42.000 is Bulbosaurus phyloxeron. I was reading about this in a 0:59:42.040 --> 0:59:45.760 short twenty seventeen discover article by Ian graber Steel called 0:59:45.880 --> 0:59:51.360 part turtle, part pig, Bulbosaurus was a stout survivor. So 0:59:51.520 --> 0:59:54.720 I'll cover a few facts from this article. The Bulbosaurus 0:59:54.720 --> 0:59:59.680 phyloxeron comes the name there comes from two features. Bulbosaurus 0:59:59.720 --> 1:00:03.320 means bulbous lizard. This comes from the fact that these 1:00:03.360 --> 1:00:09.800 species had a large, you know, kind of domed nasal protuberants, 1:00:09.880 --> 1:00:12.200 kind of a big old turtally beak with a raised 1:00:12.240 --> 1:00:16.040 area at the top. And then phloxeron means leaf cutter, 1:00:16.120 --> 1:00:18.560 presumably what it did with its beak, because these were 1:00:18.640 --> 1:00:25.560 primarily herbivorous animals. The discoverers were German and South African researchers, 1:00:25.720 --> 1:00:28.800 and the first big fossil find was in South Africa. 1:00:29.400 --> 1:00:32.160 The article describes work by one of the researchers on 1:00:32.200 --> 1:00:37.360 the team named Christian Camerer, who was comparing the fossils 1:00:37.440 --> 1:00:42.280 and decided that Bulbosaurus was an ancestor of a family 1:00:42.320 --> 1:00:46.680 of designodonts called gayekiids. I'm not sure if I'm saying 1:00:46.720 --> 1:00:49.880 that right is spelled g E I K I d s. 1:00:50.680 --> 1:00:55.720 And these were also creatures that had these big keratenized noses, 1:00:55.800 --> 1:00:59.120 So like large honken noses up on the top of 1:00:59.160 --> 1:01:04.320 their snout. What were these big bulbous noses for. Obviously 1:01:04.360 --> 1:01:08.000 this involves some inference, but a leading theory cited in 1:01:08.040 --> 1:01:11.800 this article is that they were kind of like antlers 1:01:11.840 --> 1:01:13.480 in a way in some animals. That they may have 1:01:13.480 --> 1:01:16.560 been a display that was used for species recognition and 1:01:16.600 --> 1:01:21.240 sexual appeal. So it is thought likely by many researchers 1:01:21.240 --> 1:01:24.360 looking at this that the big bulbous sore turtle beak 1:01:24.720 --> 1:01:27.800 may have been hot. It may have been for attracting maids. 1:01:27.840 --> 1:01:28.680 Like all looks good? 1:01:28.800 --> 1:01:33.520 Yeah, well, just looking at this artist interpretation of what 1:01:33.560 --> 1:01:35.600 they may have looked like, I mean, it's not you know, 1:01:35.640 --> 1:01:38.160 it's not one to one with the Pokemon, but I 1:01:38.200 --> 1:01:41.240 can I can see some possible connections, no matter how 1:01:41.280 --> 1:01:45.880 those connections ended up being stitched together. All right, Well, 1:01:45.920 --> 1:01:49.000 that's I think all we have to say about Pokemon today. 1:01:49.880 --> 1:01:51.600 But we'd love to hear from everyone out there, because 1:01:51.600 --> 1:01:53.880 obviously we have a lot of a lot of listeners 1:01:53.960 --> 1:01:57.040 who have grown up with with Pokemon or they've been 1:01:57.080 --> 1:02:00.000 exposed to Pokemon, certainly at different points in their lives. 1:02:00.640 --> 1:02:03.400 You may have some feelings you may have some thoughts 1:02:03.920 --> 1:02:06.640 right in with those thoughts and feelings. Also, if there 1:02:06.640 --> 1:02:09.560 are other species, even newly discovered, maybe it'll be a 1:02:09.600 --> 1:02:13.480 headline tomorrow about a new species that is now named 1:02:13.480 --> 1:02:16.120 after a pokemon. Right in with that, let's talk about it. 1:02:16.120 --> 1:02:18.600 We can bring it up on a future listener mail episode. 1:02:19.120 --> 1:02:21.439 Just a reminder for everyone out there, Stuff to Blow 1:02:21.480 --> 1:02:24.720 your Mind is a podcast. We've been an audio podcast 1:02:24.760 --> 1:02:27.720 for quite a while, so you can find a vast 1:02:27.840 --> 1:02:31.120 archive of past episodes wherever you get your audio podcasts. 1:02:31.640 --> 1:02:35.920 Our current rhythm is basically we do two core episodes 1:02:35.960 --> 1:02:38.760 per week on Tuesdays and Thursdays, a short form episode 1:02:38.800 --> 1:02:41.720 on Wednesdays and on Fridays. We set aside most serious concerns, 1:02:41.760 --> 1:02:44.360 so just talk about a weird film on Weird House Cinema. 1:02:44.680 --> 1:02:47.240 And hey, if you are listening to us in audio 1:02:47.240 --> 1:02:50.280 form right now, of course, please subscribe wherever you get 1:02:50.320 --> 1:02:52.840 your podcasts. 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Is that everything? 1:03:27.600 --> 1:03:28.000 I believe? 1:03:28.040 --> 1:03:31.280 That's it. Okay, so huge, Thanks as always to our 1:03:31.320 --> 1:03:34.680 excellent audio producer JJ Posway. If you would like to 1:03:34.680 --> 1:03:37.000 get in touch with us with feedback on this episode 1:03:37.080 --> 1:03:39.680 or any other, to suggest a topic for the future, 1:03:39.880 --> 1:03:41.840 or just to say hello, you can email us at 1:03:41.920 --> 1:03:51.560 contact at stuff to Blow your Mind dot com. 1:03:51.880 --> 1:03:54.800 Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For 1:03:54.880 --> 1:03:58.720 more podcasts my Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 1:03:58.800 --> 1:04:14.280 or wherever you listen to your face Rick shows