1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:03,720 Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, Holly, here a little heads up before we 2 00:00:03,760 --> 00:00:07,680 Speaker 1: get into this week's behind the scenes. This episode is 3 00:00:07,720 --> 00:00:11,360 Speaker 1: one in which Tracy and I talk about TSA screening 4 00:00:11,440 --> 00:00:15,240 Speaker 1: at the Atlanta Airport, and this was recorded before the 5 00:00:15,320 --> 00:00:19,480 Speaker 1: current DHS shutdown, which has of course led to drastically 6 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:23,360 Speaker 1: prolonged security wait times at airports around the country. So 7 00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:25,520 Speaker 1: just keep that in mind as you listen to us 8 00:00:25,560 --> 00:00:28,319 Speaker 1: talk about how easy breezy it can sometimes be to 9 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:32,120 Speaker 1: go through security right now, obviously it is much harder 10 00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:34,760 Speaker 1: for everyone. I hope you're all taking care of yourselves. 11 00:00:37,120 --> 00:00:40,040 Speaker 1: Welcome to stuff you missed in History Class A production 12 00:00:40,200 --> 00:00:50,319 Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio. Hello and Happy Friday and Holly Frye and 13 00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:54,520 Speaker 1: I'm Tracy V. Wilson. We talked about Richard Peters this week, Yes, 14 00:00:55,520 --> 00:00:58,400 Speaker 1: and I said that I would talk about the thing 15 00:00:58,440 --> 00:01:01,600 Speaker 1: I understand I think about Richard Peters. All right, you 16 00:01:01,600 --> 00:01:04,800 Speaker 1: were going to psychoanalyze him, a thing we don't normally 17 00:01:04,840 --> 00:01:07,319 Speaker 1: do a lot of, No, but I have a kinship 18 00:01:07,360 --> 00:01:12,440 Speaker 1: here because all of the things that any write up 19 00:01:12,480 --> 00:01:15,800 Speaker 1: about him, and especially if you've ever seen the Oakland 20 00:01:16,680 --> 00:01:19,160 Speaker 1: presentations about him, where a character comes out as him 21 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:22,920 Speaker 1: and talks about him. They're all very focused on how 22 00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:26,920 Speaker 1: driven he was as a businessman and how like he 23 00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:30,200 Speaker 1: was always chasing money, which can make him sound like 24 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:35,160 Speaker 1: shallow and greedy. But I know exactly what's going on 25 00:01:35,240 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 1: in his head. Yeah, he is rebelling against his dad. Yeah, 26 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:44,600 Speaker 1: his entire life, his entire approach to everything is about 27 00:01:44,600 --> 00:01:48,960 Speaker 1: saying never me. When he thinks about the way his 28 00:01:49,000 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 1: father operated and how many times he missed up financially, 29 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:55,800 Speaker 1: I guarantee that was what he was driving, right, that's 30 00:01:55,880 --> 00:01:59,360 Speaker 1: like a hundred percent. I understand this rebellious life very 31 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:03,080 Speaker 1: deeply because I'm the same way. I'm always like happen. 32 00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:06,800 Speaker 1: Ninety percent of my personality is about rejecting, you know, 33 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:10,760 Speaker 1: things I grew up with. So ure, I one hundred 34 00:02:10,760 --> 00:02:16,680 Speaker 1: percent understand exactly. I had this thing that was making 35 00:02:16,760 --> 00:02:22,920 Speaker 1: me very frustrated because it was so hard to pin 36 00:02:23,120 --> 00:02:31,320 Speaker 1: down his thoughts regarding the institution of slavery, because he 37 00:02:31,400 --> 00:02:35,720 Speaker 1: never says anything about it openly. There are times when he, 38 00:02:36,680 --> 00:02:41,280 Speaker 1: you know, engages slave labor, right, although he is not 39 00:02:41,360 --> 00:02:44,040 Speaker 1: the only person like that's like a company standard that 40 00:02:44,200 --> 00:02:47,720 Speaker 1: was going on during some of these things, and certainly 41 00:02:47,760 --> 00:02:52,320 Speaker 1: his grandfather we mentioned, you know, had indentured servants, so 42 00:02:52,600 --> 00:02:54,120 Speaker 1: there had to have been part of him that was 43 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:59,480 Speaker 1: just accustomed to similar concepts. But I was literally like, 44 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 1: this can't be that. There is literally nothing solid about 45 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:08,560 Speaker 1: his position on this issue other than YO, my fellow Southerners, 46 00:03:08,600 --> 00:03:10,880 Speaker 1: don't do this. Don't go into this war. If you 47 00:03:10,919 --> 00:03:13,160 Speaker 1: love slavery, you're gonna lose it anyway, so don't do this. 48 00:03:13,639 --> 00:03:17,799 Speaker 1: There's nothing about him that ever comments on the morality 49 00:03:17,800 --> 00:03:19,280 Speaker 1: of it other than saying the rest of the world 50 00:03:19,360 --> 00:03:23,400 Speaker 1: already thinks this is absolutely wrong. And I thought I 51 00:03:23,440 --> 00:03:25,000 Speaker 1: was going nuts. I was like, what am I missing? 52 00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:30,360 Speaker 1: And then I was looking at another biography about him 53 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:33,239 Speaker 1: that was like similarly frustrated, and I was like, Okay, 54 00:03:33,840 --> 00:03:38,000 Speaker 1: the time researching and writing this and you couldn't find anything. 55 00:03:38,800 --> 00:03:41,800 Speaker 1: I think I have turned over all the rocks and 56 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:44,960 Speaker 1: there's not some secret rsive somewhere that I would have 57 00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:49,320 Speaker 1: access to. So that is frustrating about him. He certainly 58 00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:53,360 Speaker 1: benefited from it in some ways, Like I said, was 59 00:03:53,480 --> 00:03:56,480 Speaker 1: very open that he knew that it was wrong. The 60 00:03:56,520 --> 00:03:59,120 Speaker 1: world thought it was wrong, but not like his personal 61 00:04:00,800 --> 00:04:04,480 Speaker 1: and I think sometimes he gets very kind of whitewashed 62 00:04:04,520 --> 00:04:08,360 Speaker 1: in tellings about Atlanta history because they're like he didn't 63 00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:11,600 Speaker 1: want and it's like, well, I mean the scales, dude 64 00:04:11,680 --> 00:04:14,040 Speaker 1: seemed to lean that way in some ways, but also 65 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:17,400 Speaker 1: like you cannot forget this other stuff that went on, right, 66 00:04:19,240 --> 00:04:23,920 Speaker 1: So he's a little tricky in that regard. His thing 67 00:04:23,960 --> 00:04:25,680 Speaker 1: that we referred to a couple times as his memoir, 68 00:04:25,680 --> 00:04:28,400 Speaker 1: which is really a biography of him written by a 69 00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:32,200 Speaker 1: relative when he was in his seventies, that starts out 70 00:04:32,240 --> 00:04:35,240 Speaker 1: with a very long I mean, it's basically like an 71 00:04:35,279 --> 00:04:38,400 Speaker 1: interview with him. It's just him telling, like talking through 72 00:04:38,440 --> 00:04:43,919 Speaker 1: his life story, which ends very abruptly at leaving Atlanta 73 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:47,320 Speaker 1: during the Civil War, Like I didn't even find anything 74 00:04:47,320 --> 00:04:50,120 Speaker 1: that was specific about how he got out. Oh yeah, 75 00:04:50,320 --> 00:04:52,600 Speaker 1: just like I was running all over the city trying 76 00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 1: to check on all the railroads. You know, people kept 77 00:04:56,320 --> 00:04:58,919 Speaker 1: telling me to leave or that there were Yankees coming 78 00:04:58,960 --> 00:05:01,160 Speaker 1: and that it was not going to be you know, 79 00:05:01,200 --> 00:05:04,800 Speaker 1: we knew that fires had started. Boy, I barely made 80 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 1: it out of there. And then it's like the relative 81 00:05:07,480 --> 00:05:09,560 Speaker 1: that's writing it kind of picks up there and is 82 00:05:09,600 --> 00:05:12,640 Speaker 1: like and then he was really tired. And then they 83 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:14,960 Speaker 1: tell the rest of his story through letters, and it's 84 00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:19,320 Speaker 1: kind of funny his correspondence back and forth with people. 85 00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:21,839 Speaker 1: It is kind of funny in that regard. But I 86 00:05:22,080 --> 00:05:26,200 Speaker 1: like having his point of view because he was very 87 00:05:26,200 --> 00:05:28,599 Speaker 1: funny and telling his stories. And like I said, it's 88 00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:33,359 Speaker 1: very obvious that he had disdain for his father. He 89 00:05:33,400 --> 00:05:36,840 Speaker 1: would never say anything like my father was really stupid 90 00:05:36,960 --> 00:05:39,000 Speaker 1: or blah blah blah. But he would be like, well, 91 00:05:39,720 --> 00:05:42,320 Speaker 1: we lost everything and then we got it again, and 92 00:05:42,360 --> 00:05:44,799 Speaker 1: then we lost it again and we got it again. 93 00:05:44,839 --> 00:05:47,039 Speaker 1: And then at one point my dad mailed me ten 94 00:05:47,120 --> 00:05:49,560 Speaker 1: dollars and I mailed it back to him because he 95 00:05:49,600 --> 00:05:51,400 Speaker 1: told me he was super flush. And then the next 96 00:05:51,400 --> 00:05:53,000 Speaker 1: time I saw him, he was talking about how he 97 00:05:53,040 --> 00:05:58,479 Speaker 1: had nothing. So that kept happening, Like it's just yeah, 98 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:04,120 Speaker 1: it's just very interesting. He, like I said, had many 99 00:06:04,200 --> 00:06:06,680 Speaker 1: witty anecdotes, but one of them that I liked was 100 00:06:06,760 --> 00:06:10,080 Speaker 1: him talking about the first time he went to Atlanta, 101 00:06:10,120 --> 00:06:14,080 Speaker 1: which was in eighteen forty four. And the thing that 102 00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:16,360 Speaker 1: I love is actually what he says about somebody else 103 00:06:16,360 --> 00:06:19,159 Speaker 1: that was on the trip with him. He says, quote, 104 00:06:19,160 --> 00:06:21,400 Speaker 1: it was after dark when we arrived and Judge King 105 00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:24,560 Speaker 1: unfortunately fell in a well which was being dug. What 106 00:06:24,760 --> 00:06:26,960 Speaker 1: it was only ten feet deep, and we soon pulled 107 00:06:27,000 --> 00:06:29,920 Speaker 1: him out, but he was highly disgusted and for years 108 00:06:29,960 --> 00:06:36,360 Speaker 1: would not buy Atlanta real estate. That's amazing. I love 109 00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:38,599 Speaker 1: that this person was just mad at all of Atlanta 110 00:06:38,600 --> 00:06:41,159 Speaker 1: because he sell it a well. It's reminding me of 111 00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:48,920 Speaker 1: how decades ago I had a boyfriend who broke up 112 00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:52,560 Speaker 1: with me, and my impression of what had happened was 113 00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:54,760 Speaker 1: that he had left me for somebody he was hanging 114 00:06:54,800 --> 00:06:57,040 Speaker 1: out with in Charlotte, and then I just had a 115 00:06:57,160 --> 00:07:00,919 Speaker 1: vendetta against the whole city of Charlotte for years. Afterward. 116 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:03,400 Speaker 1: I was like, nope, I'm not going there, not going 117 00:07:03,440 --> 00:07:06,000 Speaker 1: to visit there. I hate it, not anybody from there. 118 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:09,800 Speaker 1: Uh uh yeah, that's fair similar except you fell in 119 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:15,800 Speaker 1: a well. I just love that, love it. He also 120 00:07:15,920 --> 00:07:19,760 Speaker 1: apparently had all of these maxims he would tell his 121 00:07:19,840 --> 00:07:24,120 Speaker 1: children and his grandchildren. Okay, and some of them are 122 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:27,600 Speaker 1: very like obvious things you know about just like you know, 123 00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:31,640 Speaker 1: being smart and you know, treating people fairly blah blah 124 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:35,120 Speaker 1: blahh okay. I loved this one that was included in 125 00:07:35,160 --> 00:07:39,040 Speaker 1: that account, which was if the weather be wet, don't fret. 126 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:42,080 Speaker 1: If the weather be cold, don't scold. But with the 127 00:07:42,080 --> 00:07:45,840 Speaker 1: weather that's sent learned to be content. Ohkay. And I'm 128 00:07:45,840 --> 00:07:48,200 Speaker 1: like that's actually that's actually pretty good advice, just like 129 00:07:49,000 --> 00:07:50,640 Speaker 1: it's like, you get what you get and don't be 130 00:07:50,760 --> 00:07:55,200 Speaker 1: upset it is. It's great, which I feel like he 131 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:57,200 Speaker 1: was very good at and I think that's part of 132 00:07:57,240 --> 00:08:02,720 Speaker 1: why he was so good business because he can see like, Okay, 133 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:05,560 Speaker 1: this is a mess. How can we deal with this 134 00:08:05,680 --> 00:08:07,600 Speaker 1: in a way that will ultimately not be a mess 135 00:08:07,640 --> 00:08:09,480 Speaker 1: for me and make me a ton of money? Like 136 00:08:09,560 --> 00:08:12,720 Speaker 1: that flower mill where he's like, well, flower mill is 137 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:15,600 Speaker 1: not gonna go. I can't keep I cannot keep trying 138 00:08:15,600 --> 00:08:20,480 Speaker 1: to make this happen because it's right. And his explanation 139 00:08:20,680 --> 00:08:23,440 Speaker 1: for that other mill that was selling flour below cost 140 00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:26,160 Speaker 1: was that the person that owned it had an iron 141 00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:30,040 Speaker 1: works that needed fast cash. Oh so he was willing Yeah, 142 00:08:30,080 --> 00:08:32,320 Speaker 1: it's like the lost leader for the iron works. He 143 00:08:32,440 --> 00:08:35,000 Speaker 1: was willing to lose out over here so that he 144 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:37,600 Speaker 1: could actually keep this other thing going, which is interesting, 145 00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 1: but yeah, where he's like what can I do here? 146 00:08:39,760 --> 00:08:41,760 Speaker 1: I know I'll just sell these things and make a 147 00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:47,320 Speaker 1: huge profitence, and he did astonishing. There are many other 148 00:08:47,360 --> 00:08:50,680 Speaker 1: things about the city that are attributed to him and 149 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:53,680 Speaker 1: his family, like Ivy Hall, which is now owned by 150 00:08:53,720 --> 00:08:56,080 Speaker 1: the Savannah College of Art and Design, was built by 151 00:08:56,080 --> 00:08:58,520 Speaker 1: his son Edward in eighteen eighty three, when Richard was 152 00:08:58,559 --> 00:09:02,600 Speaker 1: still alive. You know, they're just like a kajillion little 153 00:09:02,600 --> 00:09:05,480 Speaker 1: things like that. I still just like, looking at a 154 00:09:05,480 --> 00:09:08,920 Speaker 1: map of downtown Atlanta, I'm like, in midtown, I'm like, 155 00:09:08,960 --> 00:09:13,080 Speaker 1: he owned all of this. It reminds me a little 156 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:15,760 Speaker 1: bit of when we talked about Levi Strauss and oh yeah, 157 00:09:15,920 --> 00:09:19,200 Speaker 1: bought so much real estate in San Francisco, right, and 158 00:09:19,720 --> 00:09:22,960 Speaker 1: the prices went way up, and I can do that. 159 00:09:23,559 --> 00:09:25,600 Speaker 1: I also want to talk about Oakland Cemetery because I 160 00:09:25,640 --> 00:09:29,440 Speaker 1: love it. Yeah, Oakland is unique because it's one of 161 00:09:29,440 --> 00:09:34,320 Speaker 1: the few places in Atlanta that was not destroyed in 162 00:09:34,360 --> 00:09:37,960 Speaker 1: the Civil War, right, and it was founded before that, 163 00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:41,240 Speaker 1: of course, so it offers, you know, a lot of 164 00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:44,160 Speaker 1: history that would have would have been lost. One of 165 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:46,320 Speaker 1: the things that I read while I was prepping this, 166 00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:50,440 Speaker 1: and I think I knew this from before, was that 167 00:09:50,520 --> 00:09:54,880 Speaker 1: the last lots that were sold at Oakland were sold 168 00:09:54,920 --> 00:10:01,680 Speaker 1: in eighteen eighty eight, but they were sold old and 169 00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:06,480 Speaker 1: purchased by families in large numbers, so they are still doing. Yeah, 170 00:10:06,920 --> 00:10:11,040 Speaker 1: active burials of family members descended from those people who 171 00:10:11,080 --> 00:10:16,520 Speaker 1: purchased those lots. Yeah, one hundred and fifty years almost later, right, 172 00:10:17,320 --> 00:10:23,520 Speaker 1: wild Yeah, many years ago, we were talking about Oakland 173 00:10:23,520 --> 00:10:26,280 Speaker 1: Cemetery and an event of some sort that had happened 174 00:10:27,160 --> 00:10:29,600 Speaker 1: had been that we had gone to one or both 175 00:10:29,640 --> 00:10:31,200 Speaker 1: of us had gone to it. Oh, I know exactly 176 00:10:31,240 --> 00:10:32,600 Speaker 1: what you were much talking about, because I was going 177 00:10:32,640 --> 00:10:35,679 Speaker 1: to talk about it too, and someone in the comments 178 00:10:36,200 --> 00:10:41,559 Speaker 1: was so upset, Yes, at the idea of a cemetery 179 00:10:42,559 --> 00:10:47,440 Speaker 1: being used as a public green space when that was 180 00:10:47,760 --> 00:10:53,640 Speaker 1: what cemeteries like this were created to do, to be 181 00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:56,400 Speaker 1: both a place for the burial of the dead but 182 00:10:56,559 --> 00:11:00,480 Speaker 1: also a public green space. Yes, I can tell you 183 00:11:00,520 --> 00:11:03,320 Speaker 1: exactly the specifics of what they were mad about, Okay, 184 00:11:03,720 --> 00:11:06,480 Speaker 1: because I don't remember that detail. It was a five K. 185 00:11:07,240 --> 00:11:10,160 Speaker 1: It was a five K called run like Hell. So 186 00:11:10,480 --> 00:11:13,280 Speaker 1: when Atlanta had tornadoes, I don't remember what year that was, 187 00:11:14,880 --> 00:11:17,800 Speaker 1: there was a lot of damage at Oakland. And Oakland 188 00:11:18,080 --> 00:11:23,360 Speaker 1: is a cemetery that does not have its own like 189 00:11:23,720 --> 00:11:30,080 Speaker 1: internal upkeep maintenance, fun so that group that we mentioned 190 00:11:30,120 --> 00:11:33,640 Speaker 1: at the end of the episode, the Historic Oakland Foundation, 191 00:11:34,280 --> 00:11:36,400 Speaker 1: basically does a variety of things so that they can 192 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:39,600 Speaker 1: raise money to do this. And after that tornado, someone 193 00:11:39,760 --> 00:11:42,720 Speaker 1: on in the foundation came up with this idea of 194 00:11:43,240 --> 00:11:45,120 Speaker 1: what if we had a five K that goes through 195 00:11:45,120 --> 00:11:48,200 Speaker 1: the cemetery and in the surrounding neighborhoods. And I was like, 196 00:11:48,600 --> 00:11:50,559 Speaker 1: I'm all in. This is exactly my flavor of five 197 00:11:50,640 --> 00:11:52,599 Speaker 1: K and I ran it for several years, and we 198 00:11:52,640 --> 00:11:55,400 Speaker 1: had posted a picture of me from that race on 199 00:11:55,440 --> 00:11:57,920 Speaker 1: our Facebook page, and that's what somebody got really irate about. 200 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:00,320 Speaker 1: And I think they had it in their heads that 201 00:12:00,360 --> 00:12:04,280 Speaker 1: we were just like racing over graves, when in fact, 202 00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:07,640 Speaker 1: there's like a whole paved path area through that that's 203 00:12:07,720 --> 00:12:11,880 Speaker 1: quite wide and easily traversible. But also like, if they 204 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:15,440 Speaker 1: don't do things like that, that cemetery falls apart right 205 00:12:15,760 --> 00:12:18,520 Speaker 1: right like, and they do lots of great stuff there. 206 00:12:18,559 --> 00:12:21,520 Speaker 1: They do like a big picnic there every year where 207 00:12:21,520 --> 00:12:24,640 Speaker 1: people show up an amazing historical costume. I went to 208 00:12:24,679 --> 00:12:28,400 Speaker 1: that a number of times. They do I forget the 209 00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:30,960 Speaker 1: name of it. They do like a bruise in the 210 00:12:30,960 --> 00:12:33,120 Speaker 1: tombs thing, which you're not actually in the tombs, but 211 00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:35,400 Speaker 1: like they'll do like a beer night there where they 212 00:12:35,400 --> 00:12:38,679 Speaker 1: have local vendors come out and do crawdouts and stuff. 213 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:40,720 Speaker 1: They do so many great things, and a lot of 214 00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:43,840 Speaker 1: it is great for the community. It keeps the history 215 00:12:43,880 --> 00:12:45,960 Speaker 1: of the space alive because they do have people that 216 00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:49,079 Speaker 1: come out and talk about the people who are buried 217 00:12:49,120 --> 00:12:52,319 Speaker 1: there and the important history of it. And also you know, 218 00:12:52,480 --> 00:12:54,679 Speaker 1: just all of these pieces of Atlanta history in the 219 00:12:54,720 --> 00:12:57,679 Speaker 1: community history that I always think about that person that 220 00:12:57,720 --> 00:12:59,320 Speaker 1: got really mad, and I'm like, I'm sorry you got mad, 221 00:12:59,360 --> 00:13:01,880 Speaker 1: but I think you've missed understood. Yeah. Well, and I 222 00:13:01,880 --> 00:13:03,800 Speaker 1: think they were upset because they were like if my 223 00:13:03,880 --> 00:13:06,120 Speaker 1: family member was being buried and there was a road 224 00:13:06,200 --> 00:13:10,040 Speaker 1: race going by, I would be really upset. Yeah, I 225 00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:15,679 Speaker 1: see that point of view. Ideally, a family would not 226 00:13:15,760 --> 00:13:20,360 Speaker 1: plan their loved ones burial during the five K like 227 00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:24,520 Speaker 1: there would be some communication there exactly. There is you know, 228 00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:34,400 Speaker 1: cross comparison of calendars. And I know you can't always plan. 229 00:13:34,600 --> 00:13:36,079 Speaker 1: You know, you can't plan when a loved one is 230 00:13:36,120 --> 00:13:39,200 Speaker 1: going to die, right you will need funeral services, but 231 00:13:39,280 --> 00:13:41,960 Speaker 1: you could still you know, work with the schedule to 232 00:13:41,960 --> 00:13:44,360 Speaker 1: make it all happen. Yeah, well, and it happens all 233 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:47,880 Speaker 1: the time. People whose family members are being buried at 234 00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:53,360 Speaker 1: Oakland know that that that it is both a burial 235 00:13:53,400 --> 00:13:57,079 Speaker 1: space and a green space where things like this happen. Like, yeah, 236 00:13:57,520 --> 00:14:00,480 Speaker 1: just a community space part of it. Yeah. Yeah, it's beautiful. 237 00:14:00,480 --> 00:14:02,800 Speaker 1: I feel like so many people I know love Oakland. 238 00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:05,400 Speaker 1: It's one of their favorite places in Atlanta. Yeah. I 239 00:14:05,440 --> 00:14:08,200 Speaker 1: remember when that tornado happened. I don't remember if I 240 00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:12,720 Speaker 1: was still living there, That's my memory on the timeline 241 00:14:12,760 --> 00:14:15,040 Speaker 1: is vague, but I remember when that happened and how 242 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:17,120 Speaker 1: there were a lot of like monuments that had been 243 00:14:17,120 --> 00:14:20,400 Speaker 1: toppled and had to be repaired. You absolutely were, yeah, 244 00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:26,080 Speaker 1: absolutely were still living here. Yes, because that was before 245 00:14:26,560 --> 00:14:29,680 Speaker 1: I think you and I were doing this podcast, oh 246 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:36,960 Speaker 1: so long ago. I'm pretty sure I could be wrong, 247 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:42,960 Speaker 1: but I think I think, yeah, that was rough, if 248 00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:47,840 Speaker 1: I'm remembering correctly. At one of the events that I 249 00:14:47,920 --> 00:14:50,040 Speaker 1: went to at Oakland, there was somebody who did a 250 00:14:50,080 --> 00:14:53,880 Speaker 1: one person show, I've Gone with the Wind. Yeah, yeah, 251 00:14:53,880 --> 00:14:58,560 Speaker 1: I think it was so funny. Yeah, just great, just great. 252 00:14:58,600 --> 00:15:02,320 Speaker 1: I yeah it I love it. Listen, we don't talk 253 00:15:02,320 --> 00:15:05,640 Speaker 1: about Atlanta history very much. No, we have a lot 254 00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:09,720 Speaker 1: more Massachusetts crap from me, and it does tickle me 255 00:15:09,760 --> 00:15:11,600 Speaker 1: to no end that all of the things that people 256 00:15:11,640 --> 00:15:15,160 Speaker 1: talk about is quintessential Atlanta. Many of them were instituted 257 00:15:15,160 --> 00:15:17,640 Speaker 1: by a dude from Philadelphia. Yeah, I did not know 258 00:15:17,680 --> 00:15:20,960 Speaker 1: that at all. That does tickle me a little, like, yeah, 259 00:15:21,280 --> 00:15:38,160 Speaker 1: guess what I did. Also want to mention, I like 260 00:15:38,200 --> 00:15:40,800 Speaker 1: how tickled you are by whatever it is? Well, because 261 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:42,680 Speaker 1: I don't even know how to talk about it without 262 00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:47,600 Speaker 1: it's so absurd that it's funny to me and I 263 00:15:47,680 --> 00:15:54,000 Speaker 1: have to air quotes this. The grid of it, it's 264 00:15:54,040 --> 00:15:57,280 Speaker 1: a mess, right. There are parts of downtown and Midtown 265 00:15:57,280 --> 00:16:00,160 Speaker 1: that have some grid to them, but there's also some 266 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:03,560 Speaker 1: cockamamy stuff going on just goes through randomly. Part of 267 00:16:03,560 --> 00:16:06,600 Speaker 1: that is my understanding I have a fact checked this 268 00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:09,000 Speaker 1: is that some of it was like this was a 269 00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:10,760 Speaker 1: cowpath and then we paved it and now it is 270 00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:14,400 Speaker 1: a road, right, which is not all that unusual in 271 00:16:14,760 --> 00:16:17,200 Speaker 1: various places, But in a city that grew as big 272 00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:19,720 Speaker 1: as Atlanta did, it's kind of unusual that they would 273 00:16:19,760 --> 00:16:23,880 Speaker 1: be retained as roads and not restructured to make the 274 00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:28,360 Speaker 1: infrastructure more square. But that just like every time I 275 00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:30,440 Speaker 1: was reading something that said he named the north to 276 00:16:30,520 --> 00:16:33,760 Speaker 1: South roads this, and I'm like, well, they're kind of north. 277 00:16:35,360 --> 00:16:39,400 Speaker 1: They're all meandery at times. Yeah, And I didn't even 278 00:16:39,480 --> 00:16:43,200 Speaker 1: delve into because does this get you When people talk 279 00:16:43,280 --> 00:16:47,960 Speaker 1: about Peachtree h and they go which one? There are 280 00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:50,720 Speaker 1: so many and there are so many, But if you 281 00:16:50,800 --> 00:16:53,640 Speaker 1: live in Atlanta and someone says it's on Peachtree, you 282 00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:57,120 Speaker 1: know which one they mean. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So for 283 00:16:57,160 --> 00:16:59,880 Speaker 1: anybody that's outside the city, I understand that when you 284 00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:05,760 Speaker 1: encounter in your directions in your GPS Peachtree Place, Peachtree Circle, 285 00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:11,720 Speaker 1: Patree Terraces, et cetera. It's all frustrating and confusing. But 286 00:17:11,840 --> 00:17:14,720 Speaker 1: if you say Peachtree Road, there's the one road that 287 00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:20,600 Speaker 1: they mean. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I also just want to 288 00:17:20,640 --> 00:17:24,159 Speaker 1: have a little bit of love for Hartsfield Jacks at 289 00:17:24,160 --> 00:17:28,359 Speaker 1: the International Airport. I love that airport because I feel 290 00:17:28,359 --> 00:17:32,280 Speaker 1: like the Atlanta Airport gets a lot of grief from travelers, 291 00:17:32,359 --> 00:17:35,720 Speaker 1: and I understand it. It is a delta hub. It 292 00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:38,680 Speaker 1: is very big, so if you have to go from 293 00:17:38,760 --> 00:17:42,200 Speaker 1: one terminal to another, it might be a long way. 294 00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:45,800 Speaker 1: If you have a connection, Yes, it is very busy. 295 00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:50,080 Speaker 1: The security lines can be very long. I've just said 296 00:17:50,119 --> 00:17:54,480 Speaker 1: a lot of downsides to the Atlanta Airport, But I 297 00:17:54,560 --> 00:17:58,399 Speaker 1: love how big it is. I love how spacious a 298 00:17:58,440 --> 00:18:01,560 Speaker 1: lot of it is. I love the plane train that 299 00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:04,200 Speaker 1: takes you to all the different terminals, or you can 300 00:18:04,320 --> 00:18:06,880 Speaker 1: walk through the tunnel and look at all the beautiful 301 00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:09,199 Speaker 1: art that's down there if you have time, and all 302 00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:12,320 Speaker 1: the historical displays. If you have time, if you want 303 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:15,560 Speaker 1: something to eat and it's not in the terminal that 304 00:18:15,600 --> 00:18:18,119 Speaker 1: you're in, and you have a lot of time, you 305 00:18:18,160 --> 00:18:20,439 Speaker 1: can go to the other terminal and get back. It 306 00:18:20,520 --> 00:18:22,840 Speaker 1: is not a problem. I used to go to the 307 00:18:22,920 --> 00:18:27,280 Speaker 1: International terminal routinely and have my dinner there because it 308 00:18:27,400 --> 00:18:30,920 Speaker 1: was bright and pretty and brand new, and then I 309 00:18:30,920 --> 00:18:35,160 Speaker 1: would go to wherever my actual airplane was taking off. Yeah. 310 00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:39,119 Speaker 1: It also has like full size stores, yeah, yeah, like 311 00:18:39,119 --> 00:18:42,879 Speaker 1: that are not the little Kiosky style or even like 312 00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:45,919 Speaker 1: I call them pocket stores, like those little, you know, 313 00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:48,439 Speaker 1: mini ones that are like a tiny bodega of makeup, 314 00:18:48,480 --> 00:18:52,000 Speaker 1: but like full size. Yeah. I used to use a 315 00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:54,520 Speaker 1: lot of products from the body Shop, and there was 316 00:18:54,600 --> 00:18:57,760 Speaker 1: a full sized body shop store in the International terminal, 317 00:18:57,800 --> 00:19:01,199 Speaker 1: and I would go when I was traveling somewhere I 318 00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:03,000 Speaker 1: would go. I would go through security. I would go 319 00:19:03,000 --> 00:19:06,440 Speaker 1: on my little shopping trip, the body shop, buy all 320 00:19:06,440 --> 00:19:08,200 Speaker 1: my stuff. I've told a friend of mine the story, 321 00:19:08,240 --> 00:19:10,120 Speaker 1: and she was like, can we discuss how you're traveling 322 00:19:10,160 --> 00:19:12,160 Speaker 1: for work so much that you are buying your personal 323 00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:15,920 Speaker 1: care products at the airport. Yeah, but that way you 324 00:19:15,960 --> 00:19:19,440 Speaker 1: don't have to pack stuff. Yeah, it's already through security. 325 00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:22,800 Speaker 1: You could just have it. It's the best, the best, 326 00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:26,119 Speaker 1: the best. Yeah. I mean I listen, I'm at the 327 00:19:26,160 --> 00:19:30,720 Speaker 1: airport all the time. M hm. So I'm very familiar 328 00:19:30,720 --> 00:19:33,280 Speaker 1: with and comfortable with it. I am like that almost 329 00:19:33,280 --> 00:19:36,840 Speaker 1: obnoxious person that will help confuse travelers. Sure where, I'm like, 330 00:19:36,920 --> 00:19:38,520 Speaker 1: where do you actually need to go? Because I can 331 00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:42,280 Speaker 1: see on your face that you are befuddled and overwhelmed. Huh. Listen. 332 00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:46,200 Speaker 1: Have I snuck some people through the sky priority security 333 00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:49,320 Speaker 1: lane when they look desperate? Yes? I have, Yes, I have. 334 00:19:49,920 --> 00:19:52,560 Speaker 1: Because you know, like it it can be it can 335 00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:55,520 Speaker 1: be a little dicey. Yeah. When Patrick and I were 336 00:19:55,600 --> 00:19:57,920 Speaker 1: dating one time, I dropped him off at the Atlanta 337 00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:01,880 Speaker 1: Airport and the security line had wound all the way 338 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:04,960 Speaker 1: through the windy path. Yeah, and all the way out 339 00:20:04,960 --> 00:20:07,280 Speaker 1: through the atrium and all the way out farther out. 340 00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:09,080 Speaker 1: It was the longest I've ever seen it, and I 341 00:20:09,119 --> 00:20:12,800 Speaker 1: was like, I don't love this, but I still love 342 00:20:12,840 --> 00:20:18,440 Speaker 1: that airport. It has, in my opinion, gotten better because 343 00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:21,840 Speaker 1: they have multiple security checkpoints now correct, so it's not 344 00:20:21,960 --> 00:20:25,399 Speaker 1: all wadding up in one place. And I just feel 345 00:20:25,400 --> 00:20:30,159 Speaker 1: like they're doing a better job of flow management for 346 00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:32,280 Speaker 1: the most part. If you're there at a peak time 347 00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:34,200 Speaker 1: when it's busy, you're still going to wait for a bit. 348 00:20:34,680 --> 00:20:37,520 Speaker 1: But also, again, I fly a lot, so I'm met 349 00:20:37,560 --> 00:20:41,560 Speaker 1: a lot of airports, and I know that there are 350 00:20:42,760 --> 00:20:45,760 Speaker 1: security people that can be brusket every airport, but I 351 00:20:45,800 --> 00:20:47,960 Speaker 1: also feel like in Atlanta, I have a lot of 352 00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:51,720 Speaker 1: great experiences with security in Atlanta where they've been extraordinarily 353 00:20:51,800 --> 00:20:55,600 Speaker 1: nice to me, you know, super cool. Yeah. I have 354 00:20:55,720 --> 00:20:58,320 Speaker 1: done whatever they could to make something easier. I've seen 355 00:20:58,320 --> 00:21:02,919 Speaker 1: them helping other travelers that are super were confused. Yeah. Yeah. 356 00:21:02,960 --> 00:21:05,640 Speaker 1: Also when those people were not getting paid and were 357 00:21:05,680 --> 00:21:10,840 Speaker 1: still doing their job, they were so nice. I would 358 00:21:10,840 --> 00:21:14,520 Speaker 1: have been biting every person that walked through and they 359 00:21:14,520 --> 00:21:18,400 Speaker 1: were lovely. Yeah. And if you thank them, one guy 360 00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:21,280 Speaker 1: thought was gonna cry because he just was like clearly 361 00:21:21,359 --> 00:21:26,560 Speaker 1: so overwhelmed and stressed. Yeah. Anyway, when I moved to Massachusetts, 362 00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:30,000 Speaker 1: I did so via the Atlanta airport, and I had 363 00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:34,119 Speaker 1: to go through airport security with two laptops and a 364 00:21:34,160 --> 00:21:39,159 Speaker 1: cat and my rollerboard, and because of how everything was packed, 365 00:21:39,160 --> 00:21:42,600 Speaker 1: I had to take both laptops out of the roller board. 366 00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:45,600 Speaker 1: And then when you are traveling with an animal, you 367 00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:47,320 Speaker 1: have to take the animal out and you have to 368 00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:50,399 Speaker 1: walk through the thing. So I'm walking with this cat, 369 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:54,800 Speaker 1: and two things happened. One is a random other passenger 370 00:21:55,240 --> 00:21:57,639 Speaker 1: corralled all of my stuff for me while I was 371 00:21:57,680 --> 00:22:01,880 Speaker 1: being swabbed for explosive resident on my cat. And then 372 00:22:01,960 --> 00:22:05,800 Speaker 1: also there was another TSA agent beyond the one who 373 00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:09,000 Speaker 1: was like, I'm holding my cat and like getting my 374 00:22:09,119 --> 00:22:12,600 Speaker 1: hands swabbed for explosive residue in this other TSA agent 375 00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:16,600 Speaker 1: was like, please let that woman go. That cat is terrified. 376 00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:20,560 Speaker 1: And I think had I been at a different airport, 377 00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:23,679 Speaker 1: I would have had a way harder time. Yeah, my understanding, 378 00:22:23,720 --> 00:22:26,320 Speaker 1: And I haven't tested this and I haven't double checked it, 379 00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:30,360 Speaker 1: but I saw someone talking about it recently that if 380 00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:33,960 Speaker 1: you are traveling with a pet in Atlanta and possibly 381 00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:36,160 Speaker 1: other airports, you can say, I have a pet, can 382 00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:38,879 Speaker 1: we do a private screening ring? Oh? Nice? This was 383 00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:43,840 Speaker 1: also that way, yeah right right, years before this would 384 00:22:43,840 --> 00:22:45,600 Speaker 1: have been an option where they will take you to 385 00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:47,920 Speaker 1: a different room that is closed off so you don't 386 00:22:47,920 --> 00:22:50,280 Speaker 1: have to worry about how nice my cat freaked out 387 00:22:50,280 --> 00:22:51,840 Speaker 1: and jumped out of my arms and now I don't 388 00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:53,320 Speaker 1: know where it is in the airport. They might have 389 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:57,520 Speaker 1: instituted that after some pets got lost in Atlanta, right, 390 00:22:57,960 --> 00:23:00,159 Speaker 1: So I know there are some options like that. You 391 00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:02,600 Speaker 1: just had to talk to a security supervisor, usually an 392 00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:05,800 Speaker 1: ask nice, but yeah there. I love the Atlanta Airport. 393 00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:07,600 Speaker 1: If you're going to the Atlanta Airport and you want 394 00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:09,240 Speaker 1: to know where the best place is to eat our man, 395 00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:11,480 Speaker 1: hit me up. I know, I'm all mm hmm. Cat 396 00:23:11,520 --> 00:23:14,280 Speaker 1: Corus got a great, great restaurant there on the on 397 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:16,960 Speaker 1: the a con course, some good shrimp and grits and 398 00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:22,440 Speaker 1: a great cocktail program. Love it in any case, listen, 399 00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:30,440 Speaker 1: I love my city. I love Atlanta. We talked about 400 00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:35,800 Speaker 1: Elizabeth Bulhame in chemistry this week. Yes, uh, I enjoy 401 00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:42,400 Speaker 1: finding random name mentions and books and going and figuring 402 00:23:42,400 --> 00:23:44,840 Speaker 1: out if that was the real person. If I'm reading 403 00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:48,399 Speaker 1: a work of fiction. Yeah, what happens in nonfiction too, obviously, 404 00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:51,080 Speaker 1: Like I'll be reading a book about something and a 405 00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:55,159 Speaker 1: random historical person will be named as having been connected somehow. 406 00:23:55,520 --> 00:23:58,560 Speaker 1: There were other folks, and these last couple of books 407 00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:02,160 Speaker 1: in the Edinburgh Night series I noted as potential topics 408 00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:06,080 Speaker 1: who were just mentioned as side mentions at one point 409 00:24:06,119 --> 00:24:07,800 Speaker 1: in the book. We may come to those at some 410 00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:15,080 Speaker 1: point later. Elizabeth Fulham, though, I found her fascinating. Yeah, 411 00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:19,600 Speaker 1: even though we know basically nothing. Yeah, I have so 412 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:23,640 Speaker 1: many questions. Yeah, tell me some of your questions. Did 413 00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:25,879 Speaker 1: any of this I mean, because you know, I'm a 414 00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:29,159 Speaker 1: textile girly. Yeah, and I die a lot of my 415 00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:32,480 Speaker 1: own fabric because I like customized stuff. Did she use 416 00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:36,120 Speaker 1: any of it for anything? Yeah? I don't know. So 417 00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:38,639 Speaker 1: I wear the clothes made of the purple fabric with 418 00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:42,600 Speaker 1: goldflets in it. Where are they? Yeah? So I read 419 00:24:43,280 --> 00:24:47,359 Speaker 1: the whole her preface, her introduction, and then I sort 420 00:24:47,359 --> 00:24:51,399 Speaker 1: of read parts of the experimental sections because it is 421 00:24:51,440 --> 00:24:54,080 Speaker 1: a fairly long book. And it reached a point where 422 00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:56,640 Speaker 1: I was like, reading every single one of these experiments 423 00:24:56,720 --> 00:24:59,399 Speaker 1: is not going to add more to the episode. Yeah, 424 00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:04,040 Speaker 1: so it's possible that she talked about using fabric for 425 00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:06,720 Speaker 1: something at some point and that I just didn't read 426 00:25:06,760 --> 00:25:08,680 Speaker 1: it in the parts of the book that I read. 427 00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:11,639 Speaker 1: Because it's also very interesting to me that she was 428 00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:16,720 Speaker 1: working mostly with silk because silk is, Yeah, this sounds 429 00:25:16,720 --> 00:25:19,399 Speaker 1: a little counterintuitive for people that have not worked with it. 430 00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:23,040 Speaker 1: Silk is a little easier to die than most other 431 00:25:23,119 --> 00:25:27,520 Speaker 1: fabrics because it just like slorps up pigment really fast. 432 00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:31,600 Speaker 1: So it's interesting that she was working mostly with that. 433 00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:35,399 Speaker 1: And I am I would be curious if there were 434 00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:38,440 Speaker 1: any like if she ever did a comparison of like 435 00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:40,800 Speaker 1: I did the exact same thing with a linen and 436 00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:43,000 Speaker 1: with a silk and here, because I mean, if you 437 00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:45,320 Speaker 1: do the same die bath with those two fabrics, they're 438 00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:47,719 Speaker 1: going to look quite different, right, even if you have, like, 439 00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:52,320 Speaker 1: you know, a really incredible high quality pigment. So that's 440 00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:55,440 Speaker 1: all fascinating to me. I also couldn't help but think 441 00:25:55,600 --> 00:26:00,880 Speaker 1: the whole time that if she lived today, she would 442 00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:04,119 Speaker 1: feel like a kid in a candy store, because you 443 00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:08,399 Speaker 1: can go to your local craft store and they're just 444 00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:12,119 Speaker 1: aisles of dying options. You can get fabric die in 445 00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:15,080 Speaker 1: the grocery store. Yeah, for heaven's sakes, there are entire 446 00:26:15,200 --> 00:26:19,640 Speaker 1: online forums of people just sharing tips about die, how 447 00:26:19,680 --> 00:26:22,479 Speaker 1: do you die, how to achieve a particular die if 448 00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:25,639 Speaker 1: you're trying to replicate one specific garment and people have 449 00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:29,240 Speaker 1: formulas that they share, And I'm like, she would she 450 00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:34,439 Speaker 1: would cry with joy. She would cry with joy, or 451 00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:36,400 Speaker 1: she would be like, you're all doing it wrong, you lazy, 452 00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:39,080 Speaker 1: lazy prop Other people did all the work. I don't know. 453 00:26:39,960 --> 00:26:45,040 Speaker 1: I also think she really would have enjoyed like today's 454 00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:50,399 Speaker 1: world of science communication that's really accessible to the general public. 455 00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:53,000 Speaker 1: Ye Like, like we said, we don't really know if 456 00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:55,560 Speaker 1: she went to any of the public lectures you didn't 457 00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:58,560 Speaker 1: have to be enrolled as a student. She may have, 458 00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:01,720 Speaker 1: she may not have. Those sorts of things definitely would 459 00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:05,600 Speaker 1: have been less accessible for women, even if they were 460 00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:08,679 Speaker 1: open to the public at the time. But if she 461 00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:10,960 Speaker 1: were living today in a world where you can go 462 00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:14,479 Speaker 1: to YouTube and there are a ton of different people 463 00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:18,920 Speaker 1: like explaining things or showing, you know, showing their process 464 00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:22,919 Speaker 1: for doing an experiment or for dyeing something or for 465 00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:25,600 Speaker 1: doing a craft, like all of that stuff. There's just 466 00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:31,320 Speaker 1: a much broader world of information access. Yeah that, you know, 467 00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:34,920 Speaker 1: as long as she had access to a computer and 468 00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:39,280 Speaker 1: an Internet connection, she would be able to get to Yeah. 469 00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:42,520 Speaker 1: I think she would have been very into. Imagine how 470 00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:46,320 Speaker 1: wowed she would be just studying the ways different cultures 471 00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:51,960 Speaker 1: have used dye and pigment textiles, you know, like techniques 472 00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:54,680 Speaker 1: like batique would just blow her mind, like, no, we're 473 00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:58,280 Speaker 1: gonna put a wax resist on this first, and then right, 474 00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:01,720 Speaker 1: we're going to do that whole process been working on Like, yeah, 475 00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:07,520 Speaker 1: I just think she would be wowed by it. Yeah, yeah, Yeah, 476 00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:12,199 Speaker 1: I wonder what she was like as a person. I 477 00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:17,879 Speaker 1: also wonder what her relationship with her husband was like, 478 00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:21,080 Speaker 1: because there's that part in the preface that makes it 479 00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:23,280 Speaker 1: sound like when she was like I have this idea 480 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:27,199 Speaker 1: that he was dismissive. Was he dismissive because he was 481 00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:30,560 Speaker 1: underestimating her? Was he dismissive because of what he had 482 00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:33,440 Speaker 1: learned about chemistry that just made him think it wouldn't work? 483 00:28:33,760 --> 00:28:37,320 Speaker 1: Like which, right? But exactly was like how much was 484 00:28:37,359 --> 00:28:41,200 Speaker 1: he encouraging her and how much was he more tolerating her? 485 00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:44,200 Speaker 1: Don't really know, right? Or did he just lack the 486 00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:48,000 Speaker 1: imagination to envision what she was talking about. Yeah, which 487 00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:50,480 Speaker 1: is not that sounds like a criticism of him, but 488 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:52,880 Speaker 1: like that's a thing that people come up against all 489 00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:54,719 Speaker 1: the time when they're like, I have an idea and 490 00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:59,720 Speaker 1: it's just so unique that people cannot cannot really perceive 491 00:28:59,880 --> 00:29:03,520 Speaker 1: or see or imagine what that would look like. So 492 00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:06,240 Speaker 1: they're like, I don't think so, I don't think that's possible. Yeah. 493 00:29:06,800 --> 00:29:11,280 Speaker 1: I imagine that her maps with gold cities and silver 494 00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:17,240 Speaker 1: rivers must have been really beautiful. Yeah, yeah, yeah, she 495 00:29:17,280 --> 00:29:20,560 Speaker 1: would put those maps on a fabric and then use 496 00:29:20,600 --> 00:29:25,160 Speaker 1: that fabric for a gown. I love it. I love it, 497 00:29:26,360 --> 00:29:29,080 Speaker 1: Like I literally my brain just keeps clicking through all 498 00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:32,680 Speaker 1: the things that she would be wowed by, like textile 499 00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:36,479 Speaker 1: medium that you can mix with paints so that you 500 00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:39,920 Speaker 1: can paint directly on fabric and it won't get crispy, 501 00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:42,160 Speaker 1: it will still have the flow of fabric. That would 502 00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:48,800 Speaker 1: blow her mind. No, you can just use gold paint, babe. 503 00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:50,160 Speaker 1: It's easy it so you don't have to do any 504 00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:55,760 Speaker 1: chemical processing. Yeah. Yeah. One of the things that was 505 00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:59,160 Speaker 1: kind of amused by and also annoyed by was the 506 00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:03,800 Speaker 1: review of her book in the Gentleman's magazine because of 507 00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:07,600 Speaker 1: its being like, wow, we really thought this must be 508 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:13,600 Speaker 1: a disguised feminist screed, clearly written by Mary Wolstoncraft or somebody, 509 00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:17,320 Speaker 1: and wow, it turns out to me about science. And 510 00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:19,240 Speaker 1: I was like, did somebody send you a copy of 511 00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:22,360 Speaker 1: the book that didn't have the preface in it? Because 512 00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:26,400 Speaker 1: some of her preface? I feel like, would annoy whoever 513 00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:31,400 Speaker 1: wrote this review? Right? Yeah? No? Or did you just 514 00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:35,240 Speaker 1: skip over the preface and go write people? Do some 515 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:38,560 Speaker 1: people do do that? Yeah? Yeah? How many prefaces have 516 00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:41,120 Speaker 1: we read on the show that start out with the 517 00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:45,720 Speaker 1: like some variation of the phrase no one reads prefaces. 518 00:30:46,240 --> 00:30:48,800 Speaker 1: But it's important to me to say this. I mean 519 00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:52,680 Speaker 1: I can think of several. So yeah. I'm also thinking 520 00:30:52,680 --> 00:30:55,880 Speaker 1: about the acknowledgments at the end of books, where it 521 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:58,160 Speaker 1: seems like the author is just taking for granted that 522 00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:04,080 Speaker 1: nobody's going to read that part. Yeah. Yeah, Anyway, I 523 00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:10,640 Speaker 1: am very curious if in some you know, church parish 524 00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:15,720 Speaker 1: records somewhere we know more about her, or some very 525 00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:21,000 Speaker 1: local source of information, if there's more details that we 526 00:31:21,040 --> 00:31:23,720 Speaker 1: could find. I think a lot of other people that 527 00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:26,760 Speaker 1: we have been talking about on the show before from 528 00:31:27,440 --> 00:31:31,200 Speaker 1: you know, somewhere in the British and Irish Isles. The 529 00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:35,520 Speaker 1: fact that we don't that there wasn't a civil registration 530 00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:37,520 Speaker 1: when they were living was not as big of a 531 00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:39,800 Speaker 1: deal because they were a more prominent person and they 532 00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:42,400 Speaker 1: had families that were keeping up with that information or 533 00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:46,440 Speaker 1: other people writing about them is shortly after or during 534 00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:48,640 Speaker 1: their lives that like recorded a lot of that information. 535 00:31:48,680 --> 00:31:51,280 Speaker 1: We just don't have that for her, and so it's 536 00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:55,520 Speaker 1: a person with basically no biography for us to talk 537 00:31:55,520 --> 00:32:00,400 Speaker 1: about on the show. Oh Elizabeth, I love her. Next 538 00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:04,040 Speaker 1: episode is not about anyone named Elizabeth. I don't believe you. 539 00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:08,880 Speaker 1: I don't know what's happening after that may may not 540 00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:13,479 Speaker 1: be an Elizabeth, but after that is Unearthed, so at 541 00:32:13,560 --> 00:32:17,000 Speaker 1: least it will not be named Elizabeth, though there could 542 00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:20,760 Speaker 1: be an Elizabeth within it. I would say there are 543 00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:25,040 Speaker 1: good odds of someone named Elizabeth in some way coming 544 00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:29,040 Speaker 1: up during Unearthed, either as a subject or a researcher. 545 00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:33,880 Speaker 1: Great totally possible, Great totally possible. This edition of on 546 00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:37,480 Speaker 1: Earthed is all about Elizabeth. The first. We're only going 547 00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:45,320 Speaker 1: to have Queen Elizabeth unearthings, nothing else, So whatever's happening 548 00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:47,640 Speaker 1: on your weekend, I hope it is great. If there 549 00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:52,080 Speaker 1: is something that has sparked your curiosity, I hope so 550 00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:55,960 Speaker 1: much that you get to indulge that curiosity over the weekend, 551 00:32:56,200 --> 00:33:01,160 Speaker 1: because that can bring so much joy and fulfillment into life. 552 00:33:02,520 --> 00:33:04,640 Speaker 1: If you are just having to keep your head down 553 00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:07,600 Speaker 1: and keep going this weekend, I hope that is going 554 00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:11,320 Speaker 1: as well as possible. We will be back on Monday 555 00:33:11,640 --> 00:33:15,720 Speaker 1: with something brand new, and tomorrow we'll have a Saturday classic. 556 00:33:21,040 --> 00:33:24,160 Speaker 1: Stuff you Missed in History Class is a production of iHeartRadio. 557 00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:29,120 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 558 00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:33,320 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.