1 00:00:02,960 --> 00:00:06,200 Speaker 1: I'm Alec Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the Thing. 2 00:00:07,240 --> 00:00:11,080 Speaker 1: Angelica Houston is a remarkable actress who has lived a 3 00:00:11,160 --> 00:00:15,920 Speaker 1: remarkable life. She has an Oscar for her emotionally complex 4 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:19,800 Speaker 1: and very funny performance and Prese's honor as the Black 5 00:00:19,880 --> 00:00:24,800 Speaker 1: Sheep mob daughter may Rose pretty Man and a Maya. 6 00:00:25,200 --> 00:00:28,680 Speaker 1: I've got a reputation to live up, and the family 7 00:00:28,800 --> 00:00:34,320 Speaker 1: skin everybody be disappointed if I stopped her. Pitched perfect 8 00:00:34,400 --> 00:00:38,720 Speaker 1: mor Tsia in the Adams family will be loved for generations. 9 00:00:40,720 --> 00:00:43,040 Speaker 1: I'm just like any modern woman trying to have it all, 10 00:00:43,600 --> 00:00:47,760 Speaker 1: loving husband, family. It's just I wish I had more 11 00:00:47,800 --> 00:00:51,440 Speaker 1: time to seek out the dark forces and join their 12 00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:56,120 Speaker 1: hellish crusade. But to fully understand the context of our 13 00:00:56,280 --> 00:00:59,800 Speaker 1: conversation today, you'll also need a line from a movie 14 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:04,360 Speaker 1: Houston had nothing to do with. We're gonna meet Jack 15 00:01:04,400 --> 00:01:07,039 Speaker 1: and Angelican have a drink there, and if you'd like 16 00:01:07,120 --> 00:01:10,000 Speaker 1: to come, we'd love to have you and we can 17 00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:12,959 Speaker 1: just sit and talk. Nothing. That was Paul Simon ad 18 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:17,640 Speaker 1: libbing to Diane Keaton in six trying to conjure the 19 00:01:17,720 --> 00:01:22,280 Speaker 1: most unpretentious but exclusive party in all the world. Jack 20 00:01:22,319 --> 00:01:26,720 Speaker 1: and Angelica will be there, no last names needed. Jack 21 00:01:26,959 --> 00:01:31,319 Speaker 1: is Jack Nicholson, of course, Houston's boyfriend for almost twenty years, 22 00:01:31,480 --> 00:01:34,400 Speaker 1: starting in the early seventies, and for all that time, 23 00:01:34,600 --> 00:01:38,639 Speaker 1: nobody embodied the nonchalant glamor of the Hollywood New Wave 24 00:01:38,800 --> 00:01:43,840 Speaker 1: more than they did. Angelica Houston is the daughter of 25 00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:48,600 Speaker 1: Prima Ballerina and Rica Soma and John Houston, one of 26 00:01:48,600 --> 00:01:52,120 Speaker 1: the greatest filmmakers who's ever lived, the director of The 27 00:01:52,200 --> 00:01:55,880 Speaker 1: Maltese Falcon, The Treasure of the Sierra Madre, the African 28 00:01:55,960 --> 00:02:00,600 Speaker 1: Queen and Prese's Honor, for which his daughter one that Oscar. 29 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:04,240 Speaker 1: Angelica didn't spend a lot of time on set with 30 00:02:04,320 --> 00:02:07,880 Speaker 1: her dad growing up, but she does remember being with 31 00:02:07,960 --> 00:02:12,360 Speaker 1: him in the studios smoky Darkwood offices in the final 32 00:02:12,520 --> 00:02:16,560 Speaker 1: days of a Hollywood inhabited by the fast talking, sharply 33 00:02:16,639 --> 00:02:21,120 Speaker 1: dressed producers and agents of the Golden Age. They were 34 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:25,519 Speaker 1: the remnants of the old School. They were serious. There 35 00:02:25,600 --> 00:02:30,760 Speaker 1: was a definite regard for the autour. The agents worked 36 00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:36,000 Speaker 1: for the auteurs, and these guys commanded respect. Even Irving Lazar, 37 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:39,560 Speaker 1: who was the book agent who was commonly known as 38 00:02:39,600 --> 00:02:43,880 Speaker 1: Swifty and Swift, was about four ft tall and looked 39 00:02:43,880 --> 00:02:47,200 Speaker 1: like a gnome. Yeah, but there was there was a 40 00:02:47,280 --> 00:02:52,760 Speaker 1: kind of grandeur to it. Um. I remember being around them, 41 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:56,000 Speaker 1: and they were affectionate towards me. I was, I was 42 00:02:56,080 --> 00:03:00,480 Speaker 1: my dad's daughter, so I was. I was sort of tolerated, well, 43 00:03:00,520 --> 00:03:04,960 Speaker 1: maybe more than tolerated. Well tolerated. Well, you did the 44 00:03:04,960 --> 00:03:07,320 Speaker 1: one film with your dad first, which was what year 45 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:09,760 Speaker 1: was that? That was called A Walk with Love and 46 00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:14,120 Speaker 1: Death and that was in nine. I was sixteen years old. 47 00:03:14,360 --> 00:03:17,040 Speaker 1: I knew nothing except that I wanted to be a 48 00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:23,840 Speaker 1: movie actress and why movie actresses were beautiful? They and 49 00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:25,959 Speaker 1: they got the attention of the men in Hollywood, well 50 00:03:26,040 --> 00:03:28,680 Speaker 1: even before the men in Hollywood, you know, because I 51 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:30,960 Speaker 1: didn't grow up in Hollywood. I grew up in Ireland 52 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:34,760 Speaker 1: and I went to school in England. And um, I 53 00:03:34,880 --> 00:03:39,760 Speaker 1: had a really fantastic mother who who showed me not 54 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:42,920 Speaker 1: just movies, but showed me theater and took me to 55 00:03:43,720 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 1: plays and operas. And where was she from? She was Italian, 56 00:03:47,560 --> 00:03:50,080 Speaker 1: but she was raised in New York and she had 57 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:55,400 Speaker 1: been a balanchine dancer. And um, she had a very eccentric, 58 00:03:55,480 --> 00:03:58,640 Speaker 1: wonderful father. What do you do? He was a restaurantur 59 00:03:58,840 --> 00:04:01,680 Speaker 1: called Tony Sulma, and he used to stand on his 60 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:06,240 Speaker 1: head and sing opera for his clientele. Restaurant it was 61 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:13,160 Speaker 1: called Tony's Wife, and the Rockefellers went there, and people 62 00:04:13,200 --> 00:04:16,040 Speaker 1: loved him a lot. He was like no one I've 63 00:04:16,080 --> 00:04:20,159 Speaker 1: ever met. He was an eccentric but wonderful. But my 64 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:24,599 Speaker 1: mother took me everywhere. I saw not only Maria Callis 65 00:04:24,680 --> 00:04:27,920 Speaker 1: singing Tosca, but I also saw I con Tina Turner 66 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:32,000 Speaker 1: when I was like fifteen years old at the Revolution. Yeah, 67 00:04:32,279 --> 00:04:35,279 Speaker 1: I saw it all. I saw Sir John Gielgud, I 68 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:39,800 Speaker 1: saw Dame Margaret Rutherford, I saw Laurence Olivier, I saw 69 00:04:39,880 --> 00:04:44,400 Speaker 1: Daddy LaRue. I saw the best that England had to offer. Um, 70 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:49,000 Speaker 1: your parents met where they met in Los Angeles many 71 00:04:49,080 --> 00:04:51,760 Speaker 1: years before she'd come out here for what to work. 72 00:04:51,839 --> 00:04:55,279 Speaker 1: She'd been offered a contract by Selznick because she was 73 00:04:55,400 --> 00:04:57,719 Speaker 1: very beautiful in her face, was on the cover of 74 00:04:57,760 --> 00:05:00,760 Speaker 1: Life magazine as a as a young bell or Arena, 75 00:05:00,960 --> 00:05:03,920 Speaker 1: she roomed with Audrey Hepburn. She was part of that 76 00:05:03,960 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 1: whole movement of young women, very beautiful, who are being 77 00:05:07,400 --> 00:05:11,080 Speaker 1: groomed for stardom. Um, and then she met my father. 78 00:05:11,520 --> 00:05:14,919 Speaker 1: She had actually met him at Tony's restaurant. My grandfather 79 00:05:14,960 --> 00:05:17,680 Speaker 1: always insisted she write an essay if she was allowed 80 00:05:17,720 --> 00:05:20,000 Speaker 1: to go to the theater or to see a ballet. 81 00:05:20,480 --> 00:05:23,960 Speaker 1: So um, some years before my father was about to 82 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:27,119 Speaker 1: go off to war, and he'd promised her that, um, 83 00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:29,200 Speaker 1: he would take her to the ballet and she wouldn't 84 00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:31,560 Speaker 1: have to write an essay about it. Um. But then 85 00:05:31,600 --> 00:05:34,800 Speaker 1: he'd he'd renequed on his promise because he was sent 86 00:05:34,880 --> 00:05:38,320 Speaker 1: off to war. So at least that's how he did. 87 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:41,640 Speaker 1: He was a director already and um, they sent him 88 00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:45,000 Speaker 1: there to film, and that's right. He did several movies. Um, 89 00:05:45,040 --> 00:05:47,359 Speaker 1: he did Let There Be Light in the Battle of 90 00:05:47,400 --> 00:05:52,000 Speaker 1: San Pietro, seminal documentaries for that time. He had a 91 00:05:52,000 --> 00:05:54,200 Speaker 1: bit of a fight with the War Department later on 92 00:05:54,400 --> 00:05:58,279 Speaker 1: because they considered them a bit too graphic, a bit 93 00:05:58,320 --> 00:06:02,080 Speaker 1: too honest, we say. And when he came back from 94 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:05,279 Speaker 1: the war, because when I'm trying to track here is 95 00:06:05,839 --> 00:06:09,279 Speaker 1: Ireland England, l A, why did you grow up in Ireland? 96 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:11,159 Speaker 1: Was that his idea? He wanted you guys to live 97 00:06:11,160 --> 00:06:13,560 Speaker 1: over there. Well, he was part of the committee for 98 00:06:13,600 --> 00:06:18,240 Speaker 1: the first Amendment. McCarthy was hard at it, beating all 99 00:06:18,360 --> 00:06:22,720 Speaker 1: the writers out of Hollywood. My father and Humphrey Bogart, 100 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:27,279 Speaker 1: Gary Cooper, Lauren Bacall, a bunch of them formed a 101 00:06:27,279 --> 00:06:31,560 Speaker 1: committee for the First Amendment, which was basically that you know, 102 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:34,120 Speaker 1: you could stand on your on your rights as an 103 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:37,280 Speaker 1: individual as a citizen not have to answer questions from 104 00:06:37,320 --> 00:06:41,119 Speaker 1: the committee. And I think the whole thing left Dad 105 00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:43,800 Speaker 1: with a really bad taste in his mouth. He was 106 00:06:43,880 --> 00:06:46,479 Speaker 1: making a movie called African Queen when I was born. 107 00:06:47,080 --> 00:06:49,839 Speaker 1: And then afterwards, when where did your mother deliver you 108 00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:53,640 Speaker 1: cedars of Lebanon in Santa Monica? Where did they shoot 109 00:06:53,640 --> 00:06:57,719 Speaker 1: in Africa? Yes, in the Belgian Congo. Hepburn and Bogart 110 00:06:57,760 --> 00:07:00,160 Speaker 1: and your father went to the Belgian Congo. And is 111 00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:02,320 Speaker 1: back in the day when women would deliver babies and 112 00:07:02,360 --> 00:07:04,680 Speaker 1: the father was on the road. That's right. Your dad 113 00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:07,760 Speaker 1: was making African Queen when you were delivered. Yes, he was, 114 00:07:08,480 --> 00:07:11,640 Speaker 1: and the call was making meals from you know, I 115 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 1: think cooking up bugs for dinner and stuff um. When 116 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:19,520 Speaker 1: he returned. He then went practically immediately into Moulin Rouge 117 00:07:19,760 --> 00:07:24,920 Speaker 1: in Paris, and my mother was sort of chasing him 118 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:28,920 Speaker 1: across the continent and left me behind. I was like 119 00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:33,680 Speaker 1: three months old, and finally came back and collected my 120 00:07:33,760 --> 00:07:36,200 Speaker 1: brother and I and brought us to France where we 121 00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:38,960 Speaker 1: lived in Dauville for a while and Saint Jean leus 122 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:43,040 Speaker 1: to a base for you or European base exactly. But 123 00:07:43,080 --> 00:07:46,000 Speaker 1: when you say she was chasing him around, was he? 124 00:07:46,080 --> 00:07:47,880 Speaker 1: I mean, listen, I'm gonna I'll get this out of 125 00:07:47,880 --> 00:07:49,920 Speaker 1: the way up front, Okay, I want to. He was 126 00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:52,720 Speaker 1: such a great director, One of the greatest directors that 127 00:07:52,840 --> 00:07:56,360 Speaker 1: ever lived was John Houston. Incorporated a tough thing. To 128 00:07:56,440 --> 00:07:59,360 Speaker 1: keep God those fires going? Did he always have to 129 00:07:59,400 --> 00:08:02,239 Speaker 1: be shooting and going and working? He was on Yeah, 130 00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:06,440 Speaker 1: he was on the march my father. He was working 131 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:10,120 Speaker 1: on the next picture while shooting the last Pig. He 132 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:13,040 Speaker 1: loved to shoot, and he loved locations, and he loved 133 00:08:13,400 --> 00:08:21,960 Speaker 1: um hotels, hotels, challenges, women, consequent cigars, a certain amount 134 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:25,560 Speaker 1: of liquor. He liked the chase. Uh. He was a sportsman, 135 00:08:26,080 --> 00:08:31,800 Speaker 1: a daredevil, and I think extremely enticing to women in general. 136 00:08:31,920 --> 00:08:34,960 Speaker 1: So I think my mother was attempting to keep up, 137 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 1: which of course was hopeless. It was hard to tame him. Yes, indeed, 138 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:43,360 Speaker 1: I think she tried well. I don't know that she 139 00:08:43,480 --> 00:08:45,520 Speaker 1: tried to tame him, but I think she tried to 140 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:47,400 Speaker 1: keep up, to keep up with him. Your parents get 141 00:08:47,440 --> 00:08:50,480 Speaker 1: divorced when you're high old. My mother died when I 142 00:08:50,559 --> 00:08:54,240 Speaker 1: was sixteen years old in a car crash, and Um, 143 00:08:54,280 --> 00:08:57,360 Speaker 1: they hadn't divorced. Where did this happen the accident? Um, 144 00:08:57,480 --> 00:09:00,760 Speaker 1: she was killed traveling to Venice where were I was 145 00:09:00,800 --> 00:09:04,840 Speaker 1: in London at school? What was she like? What was 146 00:09:04,880 --> 00:09:09,600 Speaker 1: your mom like? Um? My mother was incredibly beautiful. She 147 00:09:09,720 --> 00:09:13,800 Speaker 1: was very sensitive. She had an Italian background, even though 148 00:09:13,840 --> 00:09:17,599 Speaker 1: she was a New York Italian. Um. She she was 149 00:09:17,640 --> 00:09:21,920 Speaker 1: a good girl. Um. She pleased her father. She wrote 150 00:09:22,000 --> 00:09:24,920 Speaker 1: him long letters when she was on the road in 151 00:09:24,960 --> 00:09:28,079 Speaker 1: the ballet Um. She was still in the court of 152 00:09:28,160 --> 00:09:32,360 Speaker 1: ballet Um when she was in her teens and almost 153 00:09:32,440 --> 00:09:36,079 Speaker 1: until she married my father. She'd come to Los Angeles 154 00:09:36,200 --> 00:09:38,320 Speaker 1: just in the previous couple of years, and she had 155 00:09:38,320 --> 00:09:42,640 Speaker 1: gotten immediately pregnant with my brother. She had incredible taste. 156 00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:45,400 Speaker 1: I don't know where she got it from, but she 157 00:09:45,559 --> 00:09:50,880 Speaker 1: knew about things. Yeah, she was a great decorator. She 158 00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:55,560 Speaker 1: was a wonderful hostess. But She was earthy as well 159 00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:59,360 Speaker 1: as just beautiful and erudite. She had a full laugh 160 00:09:59,520 --> 00:10:05,160 Speaker 1: and she had great wit. And I think it was 161 00:10:05,240 --> 00:10:08,640 Speaker 1: hard for her because in a way, you know, she 162 00:10:08,800 --> 00:10:13,200 Speaker 1: wasn't like those beautiful adjuncts to the gentleman. She was 163 00:10:14,120 --> 00:10:19,559 Speaker 1: very specifically herself. But when your mom dies in your sixteen, 164 00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:25,280 Speaker 1: which is a very significant age, what happens to you 165 00:10:25,360 --> 00:10:28,400 Speaker 1: in terms of your mom, I'm assuming it was around 166 00:10:28,520 --> 00:10:31,520 Speaker 1: more yeah, and I was living with my mother. I 167 00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:34,880 Speaker 1: may have been seventeen, actually going to school in London. 168 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:38,400 Speaker 1: I'd done this movie with my dad where we were 169 00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:44,400 Speaker 1: very very bad relationship. Point during that movie, I said, 170 00:10:44,440 --> 00:10:46,240 Speaker 1: all my life, I want to be an actress. I 171 00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:49,880 Speaker 1: want to be an actress. And finally he'd launched me. 172 00:10:50,200 --> 00:10:53,800 Speaker 1: This was, you know, a huge thing that he'd done 173 00:10:53,840 --> 00:10:59,040 Speaker 1: for me. I think, against everyone's better judgment. And to 174 00:10:59,160 --> 00:11:01,440 Speaker 1: tell you the truth, I never liked the part. I 175 00:11:01,520 --> 00:11:07,080 Speaker 1: never liked the film. I didn't really have any regard 176 00:11:07,240 --> 00:11:11,080 Speaker 1: for it. And who was I to feel that way? 177 00:11:11,120 --> 00:11:14,760 Speaker 1: And who was I not to be grateful? So this 178 00:11:14,880 --> 00:11:17,840 Speaker 1: was a really bad moment between my father and I. 179 00:11:18,320 --> 00:11:21,160 Speaker 1: And it was after I came back from making that movie. 180 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:25,880 Speaker 1: Um barely speaking to him, which it's not a good 181 00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:32,760 Speaker 1: relationship for a director actress. It's an ugly thing. But anyway, 182 00:11:32,920 --> 00:11:37,800 Speaker 1: I then took a job understudying Marianne Faithful in Tony 183 00:11:37,920 --> 00:11:43,040 Speaker 1: Richardson's Hamlet, which yeah at the Roundhouse, Nicol Williamson was 184 00:11:43,080 --> 00:11:47,800 Speaker 1: playing Hamlet. I rather enjoyed that because, um, Marianne was 185 00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:51,960 Speaker 1: in delicate health and she often didn't go on, so 186 00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:54,960 Speaker 1: I had I had some good opportunities to go on. 187 00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:59,160 Speaker 1: And Shakespeare is like a protective shield. He's like a 188 00:11:59,160 --> 00:12:03,360 Speaker 1: hazmat suit. You can't be bad. I don't think with 189 00:12:03,360 --> 00:12:07,000 Speaker 1: with lines. Shakespeare a lot a lot better, you know. 190 00:12:07,040 --> 00:12:09,520 Speaker 1: And I remember lines in A Walk with Love and 191 00:12:09,600 --> 00:12:13,480 Speaker 1: Death like go shoot a cow. And I reacted so 192 00:12:13,559 --> 00:12:17,280 Speaker 1: badly to the script. I was barely able to do it, 193 00:12:17,400 --> 00:12:20,679 Speaker 1: you know. But now having been given a little bit 194 00:12:20,679 --> 00:12:24,319 Speaker 1: of a chance to go on and flex my muscles, um, 195 00:12:24,360 --> 00:12:28,840 Speaker 1: I was really liking, you know, treading the boards. It 196 00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:32,160 Speaker 1: was at that time that my mother died doing that show. 197 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:36,840 Speaker 1: I was doing that show, and and when she died, 198 00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:41,000 Speaker 1: the show was on its way to New York, and 199 00:12:41,559 --> 00:12:46,200 Speaker 1: I grabbed a seat on board and went to New York, 200 00:12:46,640 --> 00:12:51,720 Speaker 1: and I don't even remember my father's having an objection. 201 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:55,200 Speaker 1: I think he was those sort of bewildered by by 202 00:12:55,280 --> 00:13:01,240 Speaker 1: my powers of escape. And by the time he caught 203 00:13:01,280 --> 00:13:03,680 Speaker 1: up with me in New York, I was already modeling. 204 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:08,360 Speaker 1: I had started a career for myself, and I was 205 00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:13,560 Speaker 1: pretty determined to lead life my way. New York was 206 00:13:13,600 --> 00:13:17,960 Speaker 1: never home for you, no, UM. I stayed initially with 207 00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:20,720 Speaker 1: my best friend at the time, who I had met 208 00:13:20,760 --> 00:13:24,680 Speaker 1: when I was like seven and she was ten. UM. 209 00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:28,319 Speaker 1: Her name is Joan Buck. She was the daughter of 210 00:13:28,440 --> 00:13:32,920 Speaker 1: my father's producer on those war movies, UM and cameraman, 211 00:13:33,080 --> 00:13:37,400 Speaker 1: Jules Buck. And I stayed with Joan and she was 212 00:13:37,440 --> 00:13:40,600 Speaker 1: working for Mademoiselle at the time, so I met a 213 00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:45,280 Speaker 1: lot of people through her. UM I met very good photographers, 214 00:13:45,320 --> 00:13:50,000 Speaker 1: like people dan't Helmett Newton and David Bailey who had 215 00:13:50,040 --> 00:13:53,480 Speaker 1: actually met in in London, and Dick Avedon who I 216 00:13:53,480 --> 00:13:56,319 Speaker 1: had met in London, who was a friend of my mother's, 217 00:13:56,400 --> 00:14:02,840 Speaker 1: and so UM I started to model. UM At first, 218 00:14:02,920 --> 00:14:05,920 Speaker 1: it was kind of difficult because I didn't have a 219 00:14:05,920 --> 00:14:09,480 Speaker 1: lot of self confidence. I knew what I wanted to do, 220 00:14:10,280 --> 00:14:14,760 Speaker 1: but UM, it wasn't a natural fit. I remember going 221 00:14:14,760 --> 00:14:17,959 Speaker 1: into Eileen Ford and she said, well, obviously you need 222 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:21,320 Speaker 1: a nose job, and then she asked to look at 223 00:14:21,320 --> 00:14:25,200 Speaker 1: my legs and it was it was not that comfortable, 224 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:32,840 Speaker 1: but yes, yeah, yeah. But on the other hand, I 225 00:14:32,920 --> 00:14:36,520 Speaker 1: had a few um champions, Dick Avadan being one of them, 226 00:14:36,520 --> 00:14:39,360 Speaker 1: and we did a really nice layout in Vogue, like 227 00:14:39,440 --> 00:14:43,320 Speaker 1: a lot of pages in Ireland, and so I kind 228 00:14:43,320 --> 00:14:48,400 Speaker 1: of gained a reputation as an editorial model, not an 229 00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:53,120 Speaker 1: advertising model. So it was considered very grand to be 230 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:57,120 Speaker 1: an editorial model, except that one didn't make money, you know, 231 00:14:57,360 --> 00:15:01,920 Speaker 1: for editorial you made a few hundred dollars a day, yes, 232 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 1: as opposed to the girls who were out there for 233 00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:06,880 Speaker 1: Claire All or whatever. And I was never going to 234 00:15:06,960 --> 00:15:12,400 Speaker 1: be a Claire All girl. So um. After about four 235 00:15:12,480 --> 00:15:15,840 Speaker 1: years where I was in a relationship with a much 236 00:15:15,880 --> 00:15:20,360 Speaker 1: older photographer called Bob Richardson and he was great to 237 00:15:20,400 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 1: work for a lot less nice to live with, but 238 00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:29,400 Speaker 1: went home. That's right. Yeah, you met him shoot for 239 00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:32,280 Speaker 1: Harper's Bazaar. He was the photographer. He was the photographer 240 00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:37,800 Speaker 1: editorial and you were how old I was and was, 241 00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:43,040 Speaker 1: but he was an artist and he was a magician. 242 00:15:43,640 --> 00:15:45,800 Speaker 1: He'd look at you through the lens and then he'd 243 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:48,480 Speaker 1: just take the camera down and place it in his 244 00:15:48,600 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 1: lap for a minute and stare at you. And you 245 00:15:50,800 --> 00:15:55,160 Speaker 1: felt like you could really provide the goods. Sometimes after 246 00:15:55,240 --> 00:15:58,200 Speaker 1: we worked together, I'd be trembling, I'd be shaking, um 247 00:15:58,440 --> 00:16:02,160 Speaker 1: from the impact. Um, there's something about working with people 248 00:16:02,200 --> 00:16:06,280 Speaker 1: who are very, very good. It's the biggest turn on 249 00:16:06,400 --> 00:16:09,480 Speaker 1: in the world. Talent is the greatest effdaisac it is 250 00:16:10,200 --> 00:16:14,000 Speaker 1: And I'd have to say that, you know, our relationship 251 00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:17,600 Speaker 1: was very much guided by that. Was that was central 252 00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:22,360 Speaker 1: to our relationship. I don't really want to remember how 253 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:26,640 Speaker 1: we were um as a man and a woman. I 254 00:16:26,800 --> 00:16:31,200 Speaker 1: much prefer to remember as as as photographer and molleagues. Yes, 255 00:16:31,520 --> 00:16:35,280 Speaker 1: as colleagues, and as two people who went after something 256 00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:38,080 Speaker 1: is a period that ends New York. Well, my father, 257 00:16:38,160 --> 00:16:41,120 Speaker 1: of course, was horrified by the fact that I was 258 00:16:41,160 --> 00:16:43,520 Speaker 1: going out with a forty two year old man, and 259 00:16:43,640 --> 00:16:46,880 Speaker 1: not just any forty two year old man. Bob had 260 00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:52,040 Speaker 1: a history of of drugs, and Um, where's your father 261 00:16:52,080 --> 00:17:00,000 Speaker 1: anti drug? Oh? Seriously, yes, extremely extremely anti drug. Um, 262 00:17:00,040 --> 00:17:03,240 Speaker 1: and I don't think any fathers all that much in 263 00:17:03,320 --> 00:17:06,120 Speaker 1: love with the idea of his seventeen year old girl 264 00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:09,840 Speaker 1: getting involved with a drug addict. But the fact about 265 00:17:09,960 --> 00:17:13,639 Speaker 1: Bob was that he was um one of of a 266 00:17:13,720 --> 00:17:18,320 Speaker 1: group of rather important and interesting and famous people who 267 00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:22,320 Speaker 1: went to see a doctor called Dr Max Jacobson. He 268 00:17:22,440 --> 00:17:26,880 Speaker 1: had people like Margot Fontaine and Jack Kennedy and Truman, Capodi, 269 00:17:27,160 --> 00:17:31,680 Speaker 1: Tennessee Williams, a lot of very interesting people, and um, 270 00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:35,679 Speaker 1: he gave them the combination of of drugs, some I 271 00:17:35,720 --> 00:17:40,000 Speaker 1: think very pleasant and mind expanding, and then he'd hit 272 00:17:40,040 --> 00:17:43,080 Speaker 1: them with something not quite so good. He was manipulative. 273 00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:47,919 Speaker 1: And there was an article written about Bob Richardson in 274 00:17:47,960 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 1: the New York Times. It talked about his experience with 275 00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:54,800 Speaker 1: Dr Max Jacobson. And my father read this article and 276 00:17:54,880 --> 00:17:59,280 Speaker 1: his consequence thought, well, maybe this is not a common 277 00:17:59,359 --> 00:18:03,520 Speaker 1: street my daughter's chosen to be with, but someone of 278 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:07,080 Speaker 1: deeper interest. So he invited Bob and I to go 279 00:18:07,119 --> 00:18:10,440 Speaker 1: on a trip to Mexico. It was an ill fated 280 00:18:10,520 --> 00:18:14,600 Speaker 1: excursion in that um, straight out I got the worst 281 00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:18,600 Speaker 1: sunburned in my entire life. They thought about you know 282 00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:23,600 Speaker 1: what I wanted to drink, They fought about, you know 283 00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:26,359 Speaker 1: where we should eat. They fought about a lot of things. 284 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:29,359 Speaker 1: At the end of the that trip, my father went 285 00:18:29,640 --> 00:18:33,320 Speaker 1: on an excursion solo to LAPAs to find me a 286 00:18:33,359 --> 00:18:37,399 Speaker 1: black pearl and came back empty handed except for a 287 00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:42,520 Speaker 1: pair of straw hats. Despondent um. If I remember correctly 288 00:18:42,520 --> 00:18:44,000 Speaker 1: from the book, this was the period of lots of 289 00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:50,000 Speaker 1: jewels and furs. Lutely just a cascade. Yes. And then 290 00:18:50,080 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 1: we were leaving to go back to Los Angeles, and 291 00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:58,120 Speaker 1: Bob and I had an epic fight, and um, we 292 00:18:58,200 --> 00:19:03,800 Speaker 1: parted at Los Angeles Airport. It and I'd separated our 293 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:07,080 Speaker 1: clothes from our bags the night before, and down to 294 00:19:07,119 --> 00:19:10,600 Speaker 1: the last minute, I wasn't sure if I could actually 295 00:19:12,359 --> 00:19:15,960 Speaker 1: make the cut. Yeah, but I did, and I didn't 296 00:19:15,960 --> 00:19:19,120 Speaker 1: look back. I went to live with my dad for 297 00:19:19,160 --> 00:19:24,480 Speaker 1: the next four or five months where in the Palisades 298 00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:26,760 Speaker 1: is he in l a as a function purely of 299 00:19:26,760 --> 00:19:30,919 Speaker 1: the business. And this is where did he love Southern California, 300 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:36,679 Speaker 1: actually loathed it like it had had, you know, a 301 00:19:36,720 --> 00:19:41,000 Speaker 1: certain sort of despisal for it. They couldn't decide on 302 00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:44,399 Speaker 1: a on a particular style of house, and how you know. 303 00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:48,520 Speaker 1: Tutor was followed by Regency was followed by George and 304 00:19:48,880 --> 00:19:52,399 Speaker 1: aesthetically it didn't please him. He felt that it was 305 00:19:52,480 --> 00:20:00,080 Speaker 1: all too safe, um, predictable bourgeois, um no man and 306 00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:03,040 Speaker 1: had a great line, there's no place on earth where 307 00:20:03,040 --> 00:20:06,280 Speaker 1: the homes are more finely appointed than in bel Air. 308 00:20:06,359 --> 00:20:09,400 Speaker 1: And these and the artwork and the tapestries. He said, 309 00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:12,480 Speaker 1: these moguls who control these media companies, and they have 310 00:20:12,560 --> 00:20:16,080 Speaker 1: the most elegant taste. And he wondered what happened to 311 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:19,040 Speaker 1: that taste from when they left their driveway and drove 312 00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:22,160 Speaker 1: through the gates of the studio. Where did that taste go? Well, 313 00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:25,159 Speaker 1: sometimes they took it to their offices some day, and 314 00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:29,120 Speaker 1: then others not so much. Yes, and it has been 315 00:20:29,160 --> 00:20:33,880 Speaker 1: for a long time. And something about it said home 316 00:20:34,000 --> 00:20:37,200 Speaker 1: to me. When I began to live here, the Palisades 317 00:20:37,320 --> 00:20:40,920 Speaker 1: was very beautiful. It was sort of semi rural. Um. 318 00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:47,399 Speaker 1: My father had just gotten remarried to a woman called C. C. Shane. Um. 319 00:20:47,440 --> 00:20:51,000 Speaker 1: I could ride horses with C. C. Up in will Rogers. 320 00:20:51,040 --> 00:20:55,200 Speaker 1: I really liked Will Rogers a lot. Um. Something about 321 00:20:55,400 --> 00:20:59,000 Speaker 1: being in this city that wasn't concrete, being in place 322 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:02,440 Speaker 1: where you could go out to restaurants and shops, and 323 00:21:02,440 --> 00:21:06,160 Speaker 1: and eli was great in the day. I mean it 324 00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:09,680 Speaker 1: was fun. There was the Luau, there were there were 325 00:21:09,720 --> 00:21:15,240 Speaker 1: about seven great restaurants. Uhcan. Yeah, there were some really 326 00:21:15,280 --> 00:21:18,520 Speaker 1: wonderful places to go and be. And I think in 327 00:21:18,560 --> 00:21:25,200 Speaker 1: the day it was very fun place to change. Ah, 328 00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:28,680 Speaker 1: the eighties probably just gets too built up. It got 329 00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:32,520 Speaker 1: too built up, and Rodeo Drive became very glitzy. Up 330 00:21:32,600 --> 00:21:35,919 Speaker 1: until that point, there was a kind of comfort to 331 00:21:35,960 --> 00:21:40,560 Speaker 1: the place. And and I longed for beautiful weather and 332 00:21:40,640 --> 00:21:43,320 Speaker 1: brown skin. I mean, that was the thing that you 333 00:21:43,400 --> 00:21:46,800 Speaker 1: really wished for in school when I was growing and Nicholson, 334 00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:48,560 Speaker 1: of all people, I said to him, I said, you 335 00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:50,439 Speaker 1: could have any home anywhere, and you live here. And 336 00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:52,040 Speaker 1: he said, and he I can't do my bad Jack, 337 00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:54,199 Speaker 1: But he was like, he said, yeah, he said, this 338 00:21:54,280 --> 00:21:57,520 Speaker 1: is my town. Oh he loves this is my town. Said, 339 00:21:57,640 --> 00:21:59,920 Speaker 1: he just loves it. He loves it. He doesn't have 340 00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 1: to leave home. He's completely happy, has his pictures, he's 341 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:09,800 Speaker 1: got his books, his teeth, and his Lakers. I was 342 00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:14,000 Speaker 1: so sad about Kobe. I was as sad for Jack 343 00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:17,720 Speaker 1: about Kobe as I was for Kobe. Frankly, the Lakers 344 00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:23,160 Speaker 1: are almost part of Jack, like an extra limb. But 345 00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:26,359 Speaker 1: but yes, it was truly his town, and I fell 346 00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:28,280 Speaker 1: in love with it as I fell in love with 347 00:22:28,359 --> 00:22:32,880 Speaker 1: jack Um. There was a kind of freedom. You could 348 00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:38,119 Speaker 1: be completely um under the radar here New York. Every 349 00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:41,960 Speaker 1: time you go outside, people see you, people recognize you 350 00:22:42,560 --> 00:22:46,240 Speaker 1: for some reason. I was recognizable quite early, and I 351 00:22:46,320 --> 00:22:49,240 Speaker 1: never really liked it, you know, unless I was ready 352 00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:52,040 Speaker 1: for it. I'm fine if I put on the dog 353 00:22:52,080 --> 00:22:55,200 Speaker 1: and go out, but I'm not fine if I'm taken unawares. 354 00:22:55,440 --> 00:23:00,119 Speaker 1: And something about um feeling exposed like you did on 355 00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:03,600 Speaker 1: the streets of New York. It's still it still takes 356 00:23:03,600 --> 00:23:06,760 Speaker 1: me by surprise. And there's a look people give you 357 00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:09,280 Speaker 1: in the streets sometimes I'm sure you know it, which 358 00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:13,520 Speaker 1: is like it's a look of appreciation, and it's almost 359 00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:15,440 Speaker 1: a wink. And they don't want to bother you, but 360 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:18,800 Speaker 1: still you feel like they know me. They know me 361 00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:21,840 Speaker 1: too much. They signal it, especially when you think you 362 00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:26,159 Speaker 1: look shitty. But everyone's got a camera in their pocket 363 00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:28,320 Speaker 1: twenty four hours a day, and they take pictures of 364 00:23:28,359 --> 00:23:31,000 Speaker 1: you eating, and they take pictures of me with my children, 365 00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:35,119 Speaker 1: and they make your life miserable, miserable, and it's a 366 00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:38,919 Speaker 1: very different thing for me, having been a model. I 367 00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:45,280 Speaker 1: loved having my picture taken, I really did. Yeah, it's 368 00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:48,520 Speaker 1: a form of addiction and also the way of a 369 00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:52,480 Speaker 1: good photographer takes your picture. I'm reminded briefly of Bill Cunningham, 370 00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:57,359 Speaker 1: who was essentially a street photographer. But he would say 371 00:23:57,400 --> 00:24:00,360 Speaker 1: do you mind, and then and you go no, no, 372 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:03,960 Speaker 1: go ahead. But there was a kind of decorum about it. Now, 373 00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:06,560 Speaker 1: not at all. And when did you decided to get 374 00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:09,479 Speaker 1: back on the horse acting? Was when I split with 375 00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:12,679 Speaker 1: Bob at l a X. And what's the next project 376 00:24:12,720 --> 00:24:16,600 Speaker 1: to take on as an actress? The last Tycoon with 377 00:24:16,680 --> 00:24:20,879 Speaker 1: Elia Kazan DeNiro with Bob de Niro, But Jack was 378 00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:27,960 Speaker 1: maybe going to do that and then decide um, Actually, yes, 379 00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:31,080 Speaker 1: just just where did you meet? I met him at 380 00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:34,520 Speaker 1: his house at his birthday party? I went with Cecy. 381 00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:37,760 Speaker 1: She said, oh, there's a party of Jack Nichols. I mean, 382 00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:40,439 Speaker 1: that's how loose things were those days. And all of 383 00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:44,840 Speaker 1: his nicknames, what did he call you? SUTs? And then 384 00:24:44,880 --> 00:24:48,600 Speaker 1: it's the Big which came from the Big the Big 385 00:24:48,640 --> 00:24:51,560 Speaker 1: Fabulous because I used to say fabulous all the time, 386 00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:53,800 Speaker 1: so it was the Big Fabulous. And then it became 387 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:56,879 Speaker 1: the big What did he call the car? The Mercedes 388 00:24:56,920 --> 00:25:00,680 Speaker 1: was the what bing bing bing cherry. He doesn't still 389 00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:04,199 Speaker 1: have that card, as he was a car. I have 390 00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:07,680 Speaker 1: a six Mercedes the last year they made the old model, 391 00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:10,560 Speaker 1: such a beautiful car. What do you do you call 392 00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:13,600 Speaker 1: your car name? No, but I'm going to now mine 393 00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:19,359 Speaker 1: call it. That was another nickname Jack had for me, mine, 394 00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:24,080 Speaker 1: which became minal. When we were skiing, I'd be swallowing 395 00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:26,560 Speaker 1: down the slope and he'd be up on a on 396 00:25:26,600 --> 00:25:34,640 Speaker 1: a chair lift, and I'd heard Angelica Houston. Another seminal 397 00:25:34,760 --> 00:25:38,280 Speaker 1: figure of the seventies and eighties his poet and punk 398 00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:42,159 Speaker 1: rocker Patti Smith. Like Houston, Smith is a great artist 399 00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:46,520 Speaker 1: who had to navigate a complex relationship with another great artist, 400 00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:50,840 Speaker 1: in Smith's case, photographer Robert Maplethorpe, who died of complications 401 00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:55,320 Speaker 1: from AIDS in nine. You know, I'm still connected with him. 402 00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:58,240 Speaker 1: I still think about him every day. And I mean, 403 00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:01,040 Speaker 1: of course, you know we were boyfriend and girlfriend. We 404 00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:05,639 Speaker 1: did all the things young people do. But as he 405 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:09,119 Speaker 1: felt freer as an artist in a human being, the 406 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:13,439 Speaker 1: next thing that happened is he blossomed and felt his 407 00:26:14,040 --> 00:26:18,680 Speaker 1: sexual nature. We had to weather that. It was difficult 408 00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:21,480 Speaker 1: and it took a few years because neither one of 409 00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 1: us wanted to part. You can get a link to 410 00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:28,600 Speaker 1: my full conversation with Patti Smith by texting Smith to 411 00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:33,000 Speaker 1: seven zero zero one. That's s M. I T H 412 00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:50,439 Speaker 1: two seven zero one zero one. I'm Alec Baldwin and 413 00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:55,720 Speaker 1: this is here's the thing. When Angelica Houston's stepmother, Ccy 414 00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:59,720 Speaker 1: brought her to Jack Nicholson's birthday party in n she 415 00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:03,560 Speaker 1: didn't have imagined what she was setting in motion. Houston 416 00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:07,000 Speaker 1: was smitten and spent the night. He made me laugh, 417 00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:09,879 Speaker 1: but he sent me home in a cab. I showed 418 00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:12,600 Speaker 1: up the next day in my evening dress from the 419 00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:16,280 Speaker 1: night before, and Cecy said, what are you thinking? I 420 00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:20,560 Speaker 1: had no idea how I should be treated. Basically, I 421 00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:26,760 Speaker 1: was about nineteen or twenty. I was still a baby kid. Yeah, 422 00:27:27,040 --> 00:27:30,119 Speaker 1: without any idea how I should be treated or you know, 423 00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:35,800 Speaker 1: sense of decor. No none. And I remember desperately hoping 424 00:27:35,840 --> 00:27:38,879 Speaker 1: he'd call me, and when he did, I said, immediately, 425 00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:41,680 Speaker 1: but if you take me out, you have to pick 426 00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:43,840 Speaker 1: me up and you have to drive me home. And 427 00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:47,919 Speaker 1: I remember this long pause on the other end of 428 00:27:47,960 --> 00:27:50,320 Speaker 1: the phone. But he did just that. Once he was 429 00:27:50,760 --> 00:27:54,000 Speaker 1: kind of once he signed on, yes, once he signed 430 00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:56,040 Speaker 1: on her, he was pointed in the right direction. He 431 00:27:56,440 --> 00:28:00,520 Speaker 1: could be very gallant. Um. Jack was a wonderful boyfriend, 432 00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:05,760 Speaker 1: too easily distracted. UM do you find that getting married 433 00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:08,359 Speaker 1: and settling down, It's just like there's no time for that. 434 00:28:08,440 --> 00:28:11,400 Speaker 1: You're too busy enjoying this life. Well, I can't say 435 00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:15,119 Speaker 1: that I really enjoyed it all that much. I spent um. 436 00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:18,280 Speaker 1: I spent a lot of time and tears, a lot 437 00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:21,400 Speaker 1: of time crying when I was with Jack a lot 438 00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:26,400 Speaker 1: of the time, feeling slighted a lot of the time, UM, 439 00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:31,360 Speaker 1: feeling like he didn't get me enough, or that I 440 00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:36,119 Speaker 1: wasn't getting enough attention from him. His attention was very splintered. 441 00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:40,760 Speaker 1: He he reminded me sometimes of UM. A wonderful dog 442 00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:43,400 Speaker 1: we used to have called Big Boy together, who's a 443 00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:48,040 Speaker 1: He was half Labrador, half Golden Retriever, big black dog, 444 00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:50,480 Speaker 1: wonderful dog. But he'd got a look in his eye 445 00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:53,960 Speaker 1: and that was it. He was off. And I always 446 00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:57,240 Speaker 1: knew that I really wasn't the most important thing in 447 00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:01,040 Speaker 1: Jack's life. I was your dad all over again. Um, yeah, 448 00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:04,600 Speaker 1: and and Jack got a tremendous amount of attention, and 449 00:29:04,760 --> 00:29:07,720 Speaker 1: that was hard for me, you know, because also I 450 00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:11,360 Speaker 1: knew what it was to get my own kind of attention. Um, 451 00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:15,000 Speaker 1: and so it turns into a kind of competition. When 452 00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:17,720 Speaker 1: did that begin? Meaning when did you start to say? 453 00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,040 Speaker 1: What am I going to make me and my work 454 00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:22,840 Speaker 1: the most important thing? When does that start? It started 455 00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:28,040 Speaker 1: pretty early on, and I think, oh, it was difficult 456 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:32,600 Speaker 1: because I didn't really have any background in acting. I've 457 00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:35,280 Speaker 1: been around these guys all my life, but I had 458 00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:40,600 Speaker 1: never studied. And I remember going to a class A 459 00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:45,400 Speaker 1: good friend of Jack's called Harry Giddis, wonderful guy, took 460 00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:49,080 Speaker 1: me to a class at Eric Morris's studio, and I 461 00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:53,320 Speaker 1: was just sort of appalled. Um, there was Linda Crystal 462 00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:56,920 Speaker 1: on the floor begging for a dime. That was you know, 463 00:29:56,960 --> 00:29:59,239 Speaker 1: it was a whole kind of scene in there, and 464 00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:03,480 Speaker 1: I'm We're coming out and being just indignant and outraged. 465 00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:07,120 Speaker 1: And I knew nothing except that I had an instinct. 466 00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:11,680 Speaker 1: So shortly thereafter, I was speaking to a friend of 467 00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:14,840 Speaker 1: mine and she said, I'd like to introduce you to 468 00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:20,400 Speaker 1: someone that I think you might like. She's a teacher um, 469 00:30:20,400 --> 00:30:23,960 Speaker 1: and her name is Peggy Fury. And I walked into 470 00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:30,560 Speaker 1: Peggy's studio and I audited maybe for three classes before 471 00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:34,160 Speaker 1: she said, all right, you know, let's see what you 472 00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:40,760 Speaker 1: do in this exercise. And God, I fell in love. 473 00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:43,240 Speaker 1: I fell in love with acting. I fell in love 474 00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:47,160 Speaker 1: with her. I fell in love with that class. And 475 00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:50,760 Speaker 1: I was in that class for about three or four years, 476 00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:56,680 Speaker 1: just doing scenes. She turned on all the lights in me, 477 00:30:56,920 --> 00:31:00,520 Speaker 1: you know, and around that. What about her? How how 478 00:31:00,560 --> 00:31:03,800 Speaker 1: did she succeed in doing that? First of all, she 479 00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:08,960 Speaker 1: really listened and she really watched you, and she built 480 00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:12,640 Speaker 1: up a complicity with me. So someone was really bad, 481 00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:16,240 Speaker 1: So it's Bob over again, but a different medium. Yeah. 482 00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:18,960 Speaker 1: And if someone was really bad in the class or 483 00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:22,760 Speaker 1: was sort of hashing it up in a scene or something, 484 00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:25,120 Speaker 1: she would kind of sneak a look at me, like 485 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:27,840 Speaker 1: give me a wink or something. She made me feel 486 00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:32,240 Speaker 1: like I knew what I was doing. And sometimes she'd 487 00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:38,120 Speaker 1: she'd criticize me outright, but she never embarrassed me. She 488 00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:42,400 Speaker 1: she loved props. Peggy would love it, like if you 489 00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:46,000 Speaker 1: brought food into class, because then you know, you'd eat 490 00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:49,760 Speaker 1: the food after the scene. There was something so motherly 491 00:31:49,920 --> 00:31:54,640 Speaker 1: and so um warm about her. She reminded me of 492 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:58,240 Speaker 1: the way I was with my mother, and I think 493 00:31:58,280 --> 00:32:01,560 Speaker 1: that was something that I really needed at the time. 494 00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:09,880 Speaker 1: And then women helped you. Yeah, women always. Actually, it's true, 495 00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:15,920 Speaker 1: it's true. Although they challenge you, women, it's as gentler approach. 496 00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:19,840 Speaker 1: And I think men challenge you. It's it's not because 497 00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:22,520 Speaker 1: they love you less. It's because they want you to 498 00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:25,320 Speaker 1: prove yourself somehow or or at least the men in 499 00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:28,880 Speaker 1: my life kind of were more attracted to what was 500 00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:34,320 Speaker 1: independent in me. So the first film you do that 501 00:32:35,200 --> 00:32:38,000 Speaker 1: is a real movie that you get some attention for 502 00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:41,560 Speaker 1: is Preature's honor. He was, and you were with Jack. 503 00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:44,520 Speaker 1: Then I was with Jack. So when you're on the 504 00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:48,880 Speaker 1: set of the film and it's Jack, it's your boyfriend 505 00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:51,960 Speaker 1: and your dad, and you're back on a set with 506 00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:54,440 Speaker 1: your dad after the last go round, wasn't it was 507 00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:58,840 Speaker 1: not a party? And I always remember Jack said to me, 508 00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:01,400 Speaker 1: I said, what was it like on the set of 509 00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:05,800 Speaker 1: Chinatown where it's this iconic director and you have great 510 00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:09,160 Speaker 1: movie star and Polanski is about to become an iconic director. 511 00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:10,920 Speaker 1: He's on his way to that and I said, what 512 00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:12,719 Speaker 1: was it like with the three of them together? And 513 00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:15,200 Speaker 1: I'll do my bad imitation of your dad to Jack 514 00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:19,160 Speaker 1: said that, Uh, he said that Houston called him Roman, 515 00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:24,440 Speaker 1: You call him Roman, and and he said Polanski would 516 00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:27,160 Speaker 1: hold forth with all this kind of direction, and and 517 00:33:27,240 --> 00:33:29,600 Speaker 1: Houston would turn him and say, now, Roman, there are 518 00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:33,520 Speaker 1: really only two directions, a little more or a little 519 00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:36,960 Speaker 1: less and really and and I thought, what a what 520 00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:39,680 Speaker 1: a world to be with these three like titans wherever 521 00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:41,400 Speaker 1: you want to call them. On the set of the film. Well, 522 00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:45,200 Speaker 1: so I remember on Chinatown Jack going like, Roman wants 523 00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:48,560 Speaker 1: me to wear this fucking package on my nose. He 524 00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:51,440 Speaker 1: doesn't want to shoot my face. He wants this bandage 525 00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:54,240 Speaker 1: on my face. But of course it's the most iconic 526 00:33:54,440 --> 00:33:58,360 Speaker 1: still still in movies practically. What was it like for 527 00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:02,360 Speaker 1: you when you were doing Pretzy? Um? I felt like, 528 00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:05,920 Speaker 1: oh when I when I first of all, the part 529 00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:08,799 Speaker 1: didn't come to me through either of them. It came 530 00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:11,560 Speaker 1: to me from John Foreman, who put me in a 531 00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:15,400 Speaker 1: movie called The Ice Pirates, which was we used to 532 00:34:15,440 --> 00:34:20,279 Speaker 1: call them be movies, but um it was. It was 533 00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:24,800 Speaker 1: a pretty pretty tragic movie UM in which I played 534 00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:29,800 Speaker 1: UM made of the most powerful swordswoman in the universe. 535 00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:32,440 Speaker 1: But I liked it a lot because I got to 536 00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:36,840 Speaker 1: play more type. I wasn't playing a wilting flower. I 537 00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:39,239 Speaker 1: like that a lot. And I got to decapitate men 538 00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:42,600 Speaker 1: and stuff. So that was that worked for me pretty 539 00:34:42,640 --> 00:34:45,080 Speaker 1: well in that movie. And as I left the set 540 00:34:45,120 --> 00:34:47,400 Speaker 1: one night, Oh and my love my love interest was 541 00:34:47,480 --> 00:34:50,160 Speaker 1: John Mattuzac. I used to climb in like a tree. 542 00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:54,840 Speaker 1: He was fund football player, the two's um. But anyways, 543 00:34:54,920 --> 00:34:58,560 Speaker 1: I was leaving the set one night, John gave me 544 00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:01,759 Speaker 1: a book Preaches Honor and said, I'd like you to 545 00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:04,520 Speaker 1: read this, tell me what you think. So I read 546 00:35:04,560 --> 00:35:07,960 Speaker 1: it overnight. I said to him the next day it's wonderful, 547 00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:11,360 Speaker 1: such a good book. And he said, um, so what 548 00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:14,760 Speaker 1: do you think of may Rose? And I said, wow, 549 00:35:15,600 --> 00:35:18,279 Speaker 1: that's a great part. He said, yeah, what do you 550 00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:23,160 Speaker 1: think about you playing may Rose and Jack to play 551 00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:27,359 Speaker 1: Charlie Partana and your father to direct. And I went, no, 552 00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:32,840 Speaker 1: don't do that to me, John, God, that's terrible. Don't 553 00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:36,680 Speaker 1: do that to me. Tonightmare a nightmare. And then he said, well, 554 00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:39,040 Speaker 1: we have to go and recruit them, and I went, 555 00:35:39,200 --> 00:35:42,680 Speaker 1: you can recruit them I'm not going to recruit them. 556 00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:48,040 Speaker 1: Finger nothing, not a finger, And then cut to a 557 00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:51,440 Speaker 1: couple of weeks later, John is on my doorstep to 558 00:35:51,520 --> 00:35:54,200 Speaker 1: pick me up to go to Mexico to talk to 559 00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:57,919 Speaker 1: my dad about doing preseas Honor, and I said, I'm 560 00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:01,520 Speaker 1: not going with you. How's yes? You are? I want no, 561 00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:06,520 Speaker 1: I'm not. He left alone, furious with me, came back. 562 00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:11,120 Speaker 1: He'd been to Mexico. Jack was already in Mexico visiting 563 00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:14,920 Speaker 1: with Dad. He'd somehow gotten Jack out there. They've been 564 00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:18,680 Speaker 1: watching the female gymnasts in the Olympics for the better 565 00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:22,200 Speaker 1: part of the weekend, and Jack had misunderstood. He thought 566 00:36:22,239 --> 00:36:25,080 Speaker 1: the movie was a straight movie. He hadn't read it 567 00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:27,960 Speaker 1: as a comedy. But as soon as Dad had explained 568 00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:30,680 Speaker 1: to him that it was a comedy, he felt good 569 00:36:30,719 --> 00:36:33,280 Speaker 1: about it, and that was it. He was on board. 570 00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:37,960 Speaker 1: When did they find out you run? I'm not sure 571 00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:41,520 Speaker 1: that they knew quite yet. They might not have. How 572 00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:43,759 Speaker 1: was your father different when he directed you in that 573 00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:45,440 Speaker 1: film than when he directed you in the first Did 574 00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:48,000 Speaker 1: he treat you differently? Well, yeah, because he saw that 575 00:36:48,040 --> 00:36:52,440 Speaker 1: I knew I'm happy. He saw that I was happy 576 00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:57,040 Speaker 1: in my part There's there's nothing worse than a disgruntled actress, 577 00:36:57,400 --> 00:36:59,399 Speaker 1: as I'm sure you know. And then the film comes 578 00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:05,280 Speaker 1: out end and good time for you, very good time, 579 00:37:05,560 --> 00:37:08,480 Speaker 1: very good you feel I felt? Honestly, how did you 580 00:37:08,480 --> 00:37:15,000 Speaker 1: feel vindicated? Did I felt? Um? First of all, it 581 00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:18,960 Speaker 1: was great playing the Wrong Girl, Um, because it was 582 00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:22,960 Speaker 1: a movie about or at least my movie, because it 583 00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:26,520 Speaker 1: was the movie within The movie for me, was about 584 00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:29,680 Speaker 1: being the wrong girl, and so I got to play 585 00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:36,600 Speaker 1: all of my insecurities. I got to demonstrate every single 586 00:37:36,719 --> 00:37:41,080 Speaker 1: insecurity that I had in a in a totally confident way. 587 00:37:41,239 --> 00:37:45,359 Speaker 1: So it was fantastic for me. Um, Just do things 588 00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:48,799 Speaker 1: change in terms of what you're gonna do, who you're 589 00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:50,840 Speaker 1: going to work with, the script of the usual bullshit, 590 00:37:51,080 --> 00:37:52,880 Speaker 1: the scripts that are sent to you, the directors that 591 00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:55,399 Speaker 1: are bringing up the changes. After that, it changes. Nothing 592 00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:58,160 Speaker 1: changes your life like an oscar. Nothing changes here. And 593 00:37:58,200 --> 00:38:00,480 Speaker 1: also you get offered a bunch of stuff that you're 594 00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:04,920 Speaker 1: really wrong for. He want you to play Superwoman exactly, 595 00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:10,480 Speaker 1: Superman and Supergirl. We want you to be the blonde part. Yeah, 596 00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:13,120 Speaker 1: but I got to play another great part. I got 597 00:38:13,160 --> 00:38:17,399 Speaker 1: to be Lily Dylan and the Grifters a real blonde part. 598 00:38:17,520 --> 00:38:19,759 Speaker 1: How did Jack and your father react when you want? 599 00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:25,560 Speaker 1: I think they were a bit flabbergasted. Actually, I remember 600 00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:29,359 Speaker 1: I didn't go backstage because I was in such a delirium. 601 00:38:29,400 --> 00:38:32,560 Speaker 1: I ran back into the audience and you didn't go 602 00:38:32,680 --> 00:38:35,880 Speaker 1: do the press lap back. I ran off stage before 603 00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:39,040 Speaker 1: anyone could steer me in the right direction, and I 604 00:38:39,120 --> 00:38:41,840 Speaker 1: went back to my seat and Jack was crying, and 605 00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:44,120 Speaker 1: I thought, what's he crying about? And then I said, 606 00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:47,560 Speaker 1: my dad was crying. Foreman was crying. He was probably 607 00:38:47,600 --> 00:38:51,120 Speaker 1: crying because I forgot to thank him. But I couldn't 608 00:38:51,120 --> 00:38:54,640 Speaker 1: believe it. It's like, how come they're all and done? 609 00:38:54,960 --> 00:38:59,360 Speaker 1: Who's another director that you worked with who you felt 610 00:38:59,360 --> 00:39:05,400 Speaker 1: that really tense? The wonderful Nick Rogue. I loved working 611 00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:09,959 Speaker 1: with Nick. He was so subversive and so fun and 612 00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:15,320 Speaker 1: naughty and smart. I did a movie with him called 613 00:39:15,320 --> 00:39:20,840 Speaker 1: The Witches, and it's ostensibly for children, it's actually a 614 00:39:20,920 --> 00:39:25,560 Speaker 1: very sophisticated movie. It's about Hitler. It's this strange group 615 00:39:25,560 --> 00:39:29,920 Speaker 1: of women who come together in a hotel in Cornwall 616 00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:33,399 Speaker 1: and they all turned into witches and they turned little 617 00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:38,120 Speaker 1: boys into mice, and it's it's really a very good movie. 618 00:39:38,160 --> 00:39:41,040 Speaker 1: I have to say it was certainly one of my 619 00:39:41,080 --> 00:39:44,120 Speaker 1: best experiences. I grew up and watched a lot of 620 00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:47,880 Speaker 1: television for a very specific period of my life. I 621 00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:51,560 Speaker 1: watched f Troope and Gilligan's Island and The Munsters and 622 00:39:51,600 --> 00:39:54,880 Speaker 1: The Adams Family and Candid Camera, and I watched and 623 00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:58,200 Speaker 1: when as soon as the Errand Spelling era was launched, 624 00:39:58,239 --> 00:40:00,600 Speaker 1: I never turned on the last brook As TV show 625 00:40:00,600 --> 00:40:02,799 Speaker 1: I watched with any regularity as I used to watch 626 00:40:02,880 --> 00:40:06,040 Speaker 1: Mary Hartman. Mary Hartman was the last show I watched. 627 00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:08,200 Speaker 1: So if you told me that someone was going to 628 00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:11,360 Speaker 1: take the Adams Family and make it into a film 629 00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:13,040 Speaker 1: that I thought was really really funny, I say, you're 630 00:40:13,080 --> 00:40:15,080 Speaker 1: out of your mind. And yet it's it's two of 631 00:40:15,120 --> 00:40:17,319 Speaker 1: the funniest movies I've ever seen in my life. How 632 00:40:17,320 --> 00:40:21,480 Speaker 1: did that happen? Um? Well, I'd have to say Barry 633 00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:25,960 Speaker 1: was fabulous, But there was the genius Scott Ruden. And 634 00:40:26,800 --> 00:40:33,880 Speaker 1: I think Scott. Scott is so passionate about the work. 635 00:40:34,800 --> 00:40:41,480 Speaker 1: He's an amazing producer and he he I remember him 636 00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:45,640 Speaker 1: being there day and night. He for for every scene. 637 00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:47,480 Speaker 1: For people who don't know, Son and Philip was a 638 00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:51,440 Speaker 1: great cinematographer before he directed directed films. I needed a 639 00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:57,880 Speaker 1: good producer, probably unbelievable, and and I think occasionally they fought, 640 00:40:58,080 --> 00:41:03,799 Speaker 1: but we never knew about it. Yeah, they were absolutely unified. 641 00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:06,560 Speaker 1: And I'd get into a really bad mood because I 642 00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:09,840 Speaker 1: had I had lifts on my eyes and lifts on 643 00:41:09,920 --> 00:41:14,160 Speaker 1: my neck and corsets and nails, and you know, it 644 00:41:14,239 --> 00:41:18,040 Speaker 1: was the most job four our makeup job, and it 645 00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:21,200 Speaker 1: took another two hours to prep me before I went 646 00:41:21,239 --> 00:41:23,640 Speaker 1: on set, and that it was just brutal. You couldn't 647 00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:27,520 Speaker 1: sit down in the dress. It was a nightmare. Um. 648 00:41:27,640 --> 00:41:29,880 Speaker 1: And every once in a while you'd have to wait 649 00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:33,000 Speaker 1: for things to work, you know, and we're like, come 650 00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:37,359 Speaker 1: on six hours later. You guys have to be kidding me. 651 00:41:37,960 --> 00:41:41,640 Speaker 1: And they become and apologized in the sweetest way. Yeah, 652 00:41:41,960 --> 00:41:44,640 Speaker 1: I did Cat in the Hat with Mike Myers. And 653 00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:47,920 Speaker 1: they said, now remember that Mike comes in and we 654 00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:50,600 Speaker 1: get him in makeup, and once he's done in makeup, 655 00:41:50,600 --> 00:41:53,360 Speaker 1: and we have we've prelit his sets and we've rehearsed 656 00:41:53,360 --> 00:41:55,080 Speaker 1: the scenes. And they got and they they said, were 657 00:41:55,120 --> 00:41:57,879 Speaker 1: so frantic about the time we have Mike available because 658 00:41:57,880 --> 00:42:00,000 Speaker 1: he's only going to work so many hours in his country, 659 00:42:00,360 --> 00:42:02,040 Speaker 1: then we're gonna take all the ship off of him. 660 00:42:02,200 --> 00:42:05,000 Speaker 1: They said, please don't be offended. But whatever scene you're 661 00:42:05,040 --> 00:42:07,640 Speaker 1: in the middle of, and you're going to be in 662 00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:11,439 Speaker 1: mice and when we they walking talking us that Mike 663 00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:14,879 Speaker 1: is ready, we're gonna just stop everything and leave you dead, 664 00:42:14,920 --> 00:42:16,600 Speaker 1: because we'll leave you by the side of the road. 665 00:42:16,840 --> 00:42:19,640 Speaker 1: Well that's what it was like, except in this occasion 666 00:42:19,719 --> 00:42:23,640 Speaker 1: was thing Harry Thing when I came to New York 667 00:42:23,760 --> 00:42:27,720 Speaker 1: in seventy nine. I came to New York and somebody 668 00:42:27,719 --> 00:42:30,040 Speaker 1: who I admired him to the ends of the earth, 669 00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:38,799 Speaker 1: Prince loveliest, sweetest talesman, talented, used to sing opera to 670 00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:43,040 Speaker 1: the children between takes. I mean, he'd do anything. He 671 00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:46,160 Speaker 1: was special with some of the other leading men that 672 00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:49,760 Speaker 1: you really really thought that this was really a great battery. 673 00:42:53,040 --> 00:42:55,920 Speaker 1: That's a difficult question. I have to go to Jack, 674 00:42:56,040 --> 00:43:02,560 Speaker 1: you know, just because the great ones provide, and it's 675 00:43:02,600 --> 00:43:06,520 Speaker 1: not necessarily because you notice how great they're being. It's 676 00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:09,120 Speaker 1: just that they're there for you. Jack did a thing 677 00:43:09,160 --> 00:43:12,680 Speaker 1: in preseas where I come out of the wedding scene 678 00:43:12,719 --> 00:43:15,120 Speaker 1: and my father has been a real asshole to me 679 00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:20,440 Speaker 1: and and I'm crying and Jack offers me his handkerchief. Now, 680 00:43:21,200 --> 00:43:24,240 Speaker 1: you know, an audience doesn't really know what that means 681 00:43:24,320 --> 00:43:27,400 Speaker 1: at that time, but he gave me the opportunity to 682 00:43:27,480 --> 00:43:31,439 Speaker 1: blow my nose really loud. You know. It's a comedy, 683 00:43:32,040 --> 00:43:35,319 Speaker 1: that's what it is. It's somebody who who you can 684 00:43:35,400 --> 00:43:38,959 Speaker 1: work off with, who you have that kind of repartee. 685 00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:43,480 Speaker 1: I had it with Cusack and the Grifters. Um it's 686 00:43:43,520 --> 00:43:45,480 Speaker 1: it's it's nice when you play, when you play with 687 00:43:45,520 --> 00:43:51,239 Speaker 1: someone that hits the ball back. Oh, absolutely, pung and Cusack, 688 00:43:52,440 --> 00:43:55,360 Speaker 1: who is kind of an enigma to me. He falls 689 00:43:55,400 --> 00:44:00,520 Speaker 1: into that category of these predator naturally talented men, young 690 00:44:00,600 --> 00:44:04,319 Speaker 1: leading man, brilliant actor while he was young. You know, 691 00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:05,840 Speaker 1: it's a great thing to be able to put the 692 00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:08,319 Speaker 1: Rubricks cube together while you still have the shine on 693 00:44:08,400 --> 00:44:10,960 Speaker 1: you of the youth and beauty. And he's a very 694 00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:13,200 Speaker 1: very talented guy who then all of a sudden he 695 00:44:13,239 --> 00:44:15,120 Speaker 1: doesn't look like he really wants to work very much. 696 00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:18,440 Speaker 1: I don't know. I think it's interesting to me how 697 00:44:18,480 --> 00:44:21,520 Speaker 1: he did a row of great films and then it's 698 00:44:21,560 --> 00:44:22,840 Speaker 1: kind of like he couldn't. It was almost like he 699 00:44:22,840 --> 00:44:26,080 Speaker 1: couldn't find anything he likes. Yeah, he burned out a bit. 700 00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:28,880 Speaker 1: I mean, he was amazing in that movie. I was 701 00:44:28,960 --> 00:44:32,239 Speaker 1: completely mesmerized by him. I was mesmerized by a Nette 702 00:44:32,280 --> 00:44:34,799 Speaker 1: Benning too. I have to say when I went in 703 00:44:35,200 --> 00:44:39,960 Speaker 1: UM to read, Martin Scorsese and Stephen were producing the 704 00:44:40,000 --> 00:44:42,680 Speaker 1: film as well as as Stephen was directing it, and 705 00:44:43,280 --> 00:44:46,880 Speaker 1: it was my instinct that I should be a blonde. 706 00:44:47,520 --> 00:44:49,279 Speaker 1: But I didn't put on a wig to go for 707 00:44:49,320 --> 00:44:51,480 Speaker 1: the meeting. I thought that was a bit on the nose. 708 00:44:51,600 --> 00:44:55,520 Speaker 1: So I just wore a very suggestive dress and you know, 709 00:44:55,640 --> 00:44:59,080 Speaker 1: went in and within the first ten minutes Stephen said, 710 00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:04,279 Speaker 1: what if? What if you were a blonde? He gets it, 711 00:45:04,360 --> 00:45:08,800 Speaker 1: He gets it, He gets me cool. Did your dad 712 00:45:08,920 --> 00:45:12,280 Speaker 1: because of his great, great career, did he have films 713 00:45:12,280 --> 00:45:14,080 Speaker 1: that he was really the most proud of, Like what 714 00:45:14,120 --> 00:45:17,839 Speaker 1: did he feel was his best work? Well? I think 715 00:45:17,840 --> 00:45:20,560 Speaker 1: he had a special regard for Treasure of Sarah Andre 716 00:45:20,719 --> 00:45:25,640 Speaker 1: because of his dad, because he brought his dad to 717 00:45:25,719 --> 00:45:29,480 Speaker 1: an Academy Award, And I think it's like the best 718 00:45:29,560 --> 00:45:33,480 Speaker 1: performance in movies. Frankly, if you haven't seen that movie 719 00:45:33,520 --> 00:45:36,600 Speaker 1: in a while and you you really look at that movie. 720 00:45:37,280 --> 00:45:43,400 Speaker 1: It's magical of that performance. Like and I think his 721 00:45:43,480 --> 00:45:49,720 Speaker 1: direction to his father was speak fast, honest, men, speak fast. 722 00:45:51,320 --> 00:45:53,960 Speaker 1: I'd sit there with my friends whenever we were huddled 723 00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:56,080 Speaker 1: around in the wee hours, and we since the party 724 00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:58,080 Speaker 1: was over, and you knew that men were going to 725 00:45:58,160 --> 00:46:01,120 Speaker 1: fall asleep, I turned them might say, what's three times 726 00:46:01,120 --> 00:46:04,640 Speaker 1: thirty five dollars? But hundred and five thousand dollars? You 727 00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:09,080 Speaker 1: fall asleep before I do, I'd say, Oh, guard around 728 00:46:10,440 --> 00:46:14,400 Speaker 1: one of the greatest movies ever made. You directed one movie? Correct? Three? 729 00:46:15,000 --> 00:46:17,000 Speaker 1: What was the first one you directed? It was called 730 00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:19,480 Speaker 1: Bastard out of Carolina. What was it that propelled you 731 00:46:19,520 --> 00:46:22,680 Speaker 1: to want to get behind the camera take on that job? Um? Well, 732 00:46:22,719 --> 00:46:26,160 Speaker 1: I had always wanted to direct um and it so 733 00:46:26,239 --> 00:46:29,359 Speaker 1: happened that the director fell out of the movie and 734 00:46:29,400 --> 00:46:33,400 Speaker 1: I was offered it over a weekend literally, and my 735 00:46:33,520 --> 00:46:38,000 Speaker 1: agent knew that I was interested in in directing something. 736 00:46:38,680 --> 00:46:41,319 Speaker 1: We didn't quite know what it would be. And I've 737 00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:43,640 Speaker 1: read the script and I really liked it. Did you 738 00:46:43,719 --> 00:46:49,080 Speaker 1: enjoy the process? I loved it? You did? What about it? Um? 739 00:46:49,400 --> 00:46:52,120 Speaker 1: For the first morning I went to my trailer and 740 00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:55,400 Speaker 1: my heart was beating, and I was waiting and waiting 741 00:46:55,480 --> 00:46:57,960 Speaker 1: and waiting for the knock on my door to call 742 00:46:58,040 --> 00:47:03,080 Speaker 1: me to set. I didn't even understand that. Director, Director, 743 00:47:05,280 --> 00:47:07,759 Speaker 1: you think that I have known a little better with 744 00:47:07,880 --> 00:47:10,840 Speaker 1: John Houston as a father. But that's how excited and 745 00:47:10,920 --> 00:47:14,160 Speaker 1: out of my mind I was. Um. The part I 746 00:47:14,200 --> 00:47:17,920 Speaker 1: love best was working with the kids. Jena Malone was 747 00:47:18,120 --> 00:47:20,879 Speaker 1: brilliant little actress and fun. Are you going to direct 748 00:47:20,920 --> 00:47:23,319 Speaker 1: another movie? You think? You know if I found the 749 00:47:23,440 --> 00:47:27,640 Speaker 1: right thing. Um, in a way, you know I'm lazy 750 00:47:27,680 --> 00:47:31,360 Speaker 1: and that I wanted to find me. But things do. 751 00:47:31,600 --> 00:47:34,560 Speaker 1: I think when synergy works, that's right, It's right, That's 752 00:47:34,560 --> 00:47:37,880 Speaker 1: how it works. Thanks for doing this, Oh God, bless you, 753 00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:46,200 Speaker 1: Thank you, actress icon Angelica Houston. She has written a 754 00:47:46,320 --> 00:47:51,000 Speaker 1: captivating memoir in two parts, A Story Lately Told and 755 00:47:51,280 --> 00:47:55,160 Speaker 1: Watched Me. The first half covers her childhood and teenage 756 00:47:55,239 --> 00:47:58,719 Speaker 1: years in Ireland and England, while the second half is 757 00:47:58,760 --> 00:48:01,280 Speaker 1: a romp through her day is on the modeling circuit 758 00:48:01,400 --> 00:48:05,960 Speaker 1: and in Hollywood. Both are told with emotional depth and 759 00:48:06,040 --> 00:48:10,960 Speaker 1: graceful humor, and I can't recommend them highly enough. I'm 760 00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:13,160 Speaker 1: Alec Baldwin and this is Here's the thing,