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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. Bloomberg Tech is alive

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Speaker 1: from coast to coast with Caroline Hyde and New York

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Speaker 1: and Vla Low in sent Francisco.

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Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Tech coming up.

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Speaker 3: Netflix reaches an amended all cash agreement to buy Warner

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Speaker 3: Brothers Discovery studio and streaming business, aiming to expedite the sale.

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Speaker 4: Plus, we bring you some of our top tech conversations

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Speaker 4: from the World Economic Forum, CEOs from G forty two, Athropic, DeepMind,

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Speaker 4: and many more.

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Speaker 3: And VC firms continue piling into defense tech. This is

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Speaker 3: geopolitical tensions escalate between the US and Greenland.

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Speaker 5: And that takes us to the market.

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Speaker 4: Said, because the tussle over Greenland, the concerns around further

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Speaker 4: tariffs on Europe and what Europe's reaction to the United

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Speaker 4: States might be has got volatility higher and risk assets lower.

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Speaker 4: We're selling America again. Now's that off by one point

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Speaker 4: two percent, having its worst day in in over a month.

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Speaker 4: The S and p F I've found and wipes out

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Speaker 4: it's gains for the year, and you're seeing money move

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Speaker 4: into the havens such as gold, and what are you

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Speaker 4: looking at underneath the hood?

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Speaker 3: I'm looking at Netflix reaching an a mended agreement with

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Speaker 3: Warner Brothers Discovery for an all cash offer to buy

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Speaker 3: the studios and streaming businesses. And remember the plan is

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Speaker 3: for them to then spin off the legacy networks, and

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Speaker 3: this was the overhang. Paramount's argument was that its bid

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Speaker 3: was superior because of the stock component that had been

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Speaker 3: in Netflix's initial offer. Bloomberg reported last week that this

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Speaker 3: was going to happen, So it's confirmation that's where the

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Speaker 3: names involved are trading. There's still a lot more to come.

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Speaker 3: Of course, let's get the reaction and analysis to the

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Speaker 3: new offer with Getha Rangonaprom from Bloomberg Intelligence, and you

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Speaker 3: write two things in your research. The first that this

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Speaker 3: ramps up the pressure on Paramount, Getha, but also it

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Speaker 3: raises the stakes for Netflix with why you think this

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Speaker 3: ramps up the pressure on Paramount.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, this really ramps up the pressure on Paramount because

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Speaker 6: really the ball is now in their court. They've been

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Speaker 6: arguing for the longest time that the Netflix offer obviously

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Speaker 6: is not that great because it had that stock component.

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Speaker 6: Now obviously Netflix making it an all cash deal, and

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Speaker 6: now really what this hinges on is the value of

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Speaker 6: the cable networks business. So remember Netflix is only buying

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Speaker 6: the studio and streaming assets. There is still that cable

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Speaker 6: networks business from Warner which they expect to spin out.

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Speaker 6: And if you read a filing that was put out

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Speaker 6: by Warner today, they have those cable networks valued anywhere

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Speaker 6: from about one and a half dollars depending on how

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Speaker 6: you value it per share, going up to as high

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Speaker 6: ed as about seven dollars a share. So again I

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Speaker 6: think they believe that they can actually extract more value

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Speaker 6: if they go ahead and they complete that spin out.

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Speaker 6: So now really all of the anti this is really

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Speaker 6: kind of up the anti for paramount. They have to

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Speaker 6: raise their bid significantly, I would think in order to

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Speaker 6: sway Warner's board.

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Speaker 5: He's a using thirty two dollars as the magic number.

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Speaker 6: Why I actually think so thirty two we think is

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Speaker 6: you know, a starting point to get Warner back to

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Speaker 6: the board, just kind of looking at the value of

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Speaker 6: the networks, looking at possible you know, termination fees, financing costs.

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Speaker 6: But really again we think that you know, Warner really

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Speaker 6: looks at its cable networks business. Yes, there is no

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Speaker 6: doubt that this is a declining business. It faces a

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Speaker 6: lot of secular pressure from cord cutting. But at the

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Speaker 6: same time, I mean, they do have some great assets.

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Speaker 6: They have international exposure. You know, they can spend, they

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Speaker 6: can possibly selsion, and so they think they can extract

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Speaker 6: a lot of value, which is why we think that

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Speaker 6: paramount might need to go up to about thirty four

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Speaker 6: dollars to fully kind of get on on board.

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Speaker 3: Keith Again, Netflix adjusting to an all cash offer in

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Speaker 3: part because its own stock that was part of its

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Speaker 3: initial offer has been under pressure since this all started.

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Speaker 3: We get earnings after the bell. What are you expecting

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Speaker 3: to hear from Netflix and what to invest need to

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Speaker 3: hear to give them confidence that this is the right

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Speaker 3: path forward.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, what really investors need to hear is, first of all,

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Speaker 6: I think everybody's looking for really good four Q numbers

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Speaker 6: and that should I think that you should. Absolutely. Netflix

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Speaker 6: would absolutely deliver on that. But I think the major

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Speaker 6: thing that investors are going to focus on ed is

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Speaker 6: going to be guidance for twenty twenty six. The magic

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Speaker 6: number that consensus is looking at as thirteen percent revenue growth.

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Speaker 6: Should Netflix guide to anything lower than that, I think

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Speaker 6: they are going to.

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Speaker 5: Be in trouble.

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Speaker 4: Keathan Rank and Athan is always great to get your

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Speaker 4: take and your analysis, which is so instant when we

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Speaker 4: have these breaking news. We appreciate it from Blueberg Intelligence.

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Speaker 4: Let's stay with the context of earnings, with where MAGS

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Speaker 4: seven names are. Whether they're set of course to begin

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Speaker 4: reporting next week. Is the big ones like Microsoft, Tesla,

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Speaker 4: Meta kicking things off on Wednesday, but of course Netflix

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Speaker 4: is tonight. Tiffany Way, Columbi, a thread Needle senior portfolio manager.

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Speaker 5: Joins us.

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Speaker 4: As we are on the cusp of earnings and as

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Speaker 4: geopolitical headwinds seem to just shift the narrative entirely. When

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Speaker 4: you see down days like today, should people making the

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Speaker 4: most of it, buying into weakness.

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Speaker 7: I think that's the case. The backdrop for stocks still

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Speaker 7: looks very good. Obviously, the headlines over the weekend are

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Speaker 7: creating some volatility, and I'm not surprised to see some

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Speaker 7: selling just given stocks have been very resilient. But the

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Speaker 7: backdrop for the economy and I think the market is

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Speaker 7: still very strong, So yeah, I think this should be

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Speaker 7: an opportunity and then you know, earnings coming up will

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Speaker 7: bring the focus back to fundamentals.

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Speaker 5: Of the fundamentals good.

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Speaker 7: I think they should be pretty good, you know, demand

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Speaker 7: especially you mentioned the MAG seven and the hyperskillers. I

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Speaker 7: think we're going to see great numbers out of those companies. Importantly,

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Speaker 7: I think we'll probably continue to see very strong capex numbers,

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Speaker 7: which is important for a lot of the tech sector.

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Speaker 7: So I think those should be good indicators for rest

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Speaker 7: of the market.

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Speaker 3: The reality right now, Tiffany, is that that texts a

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Speaker 3: big underperformer in the session. Right it's a moment in time,

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Speaker 3: but the S and B five hundreds wiped out its

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Speaker 3: gains from twenty twenty six. This is escalating, not de escalating.

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Speaker 3: Where do you expect markets go from here? Based on

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Speaker 3: the headlines that have come out from President Trump and

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Speaker 3: what's happening with Greenland.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, I think we could see some more consolidation, maybe

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Speaker 7: a few points lower in the market. You know, certainly

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Speaker 7: volatility might lead to additional selling, but again I think

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Speaker 7: this is a good opportunity, and as we get further

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Speaker 7: into earnings, I think things will stabilize.

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Speaker 3: The biggest declines are in the biggest name, some of

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Speaker 3: the MAG seven names. Is that just general sort of anxiety,

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Speaker 3: geopolitical anxiety as opposed to some direct read through where

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Speaker 3: if this tariff threat is enacted, it is those names

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Speaker 3: that are hardest hit.

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Speaker 7: I think that's I think that's fair for today. I

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Speaker 7: think it's just a general selling of the market. We're

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Speaker 7: not seeing additional selling in names and might be hardest

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Speaker 7: hit by the tariffs. We don't have a ton of

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Speaker 7: additional details and what these tariffs might look like, so

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Speaker 7: I think this is just a reflection of broader selling

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Speaker 7: in the market that's hitting the largest names the most today.

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Speaker 5: Some are getting love.

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Speaker 4: Intel is actually getting loved at the start of the year.

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Speaker 4: More broadly, we seem to be betting once again, not

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Speaker 4: just on the GP but also CPU for everything around

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Speaker 4: AI and they still going to be a winners. And

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Speaker 4: how nuanced you need to get on name.

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Speaker 7: By name, Yeah, I think we're definitely seeing people try

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Speaker 7: to pick spots outside of the main winners so far,

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Speaker 7: so outside of the net the videos and the broad cooms,

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Speaker 7: trying to look for other ways to play the AI trade.

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Speaker 7: Intel has been a case of that. We've seen the

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Speaker 7: semiconductor equipment stocks have done well so far to start

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Speaker 7: the year, and the memory stocks are also ways that

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Speaker 7: people have tried to play this sort of broadening AI exposure. Intel,

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Speaker 7: I think is a trickier one because they do still

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Speaker 7: have trouble with their foundry business. But I think there's

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Speaker 7: definitely some some other opportunities where investors are looking for

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Speaker 7: other ways to play the AI the AI trade.

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Speaker 5: Are you looking in other ways to play the AI trade?

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Speaker 4: In video is such an important part of some of

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Speaker 4: the portfolios you run. Should people be expanding or is

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Speaker 4: still previous winner is going to keep on giving in

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Speaker 4: twenty two to six.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, I think the fundamentals for video are still very good.

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Speaker 7: But I think it makes sense that people are looking

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Speaker 7: for what the next leg of the value trade may

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Speaker 7: be for AI. So we're certainly looking at other parts

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Speaker 7: of tech like the semi caap equipment company, but also

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Speaker 7: companies that are involved in the infrastructure build out for AI,

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Speaker 7: so things like electrical reatment.

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Speaker 3: Tying that all together please, Tiffany, then you know next

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Speaker 3: week is huge. What are the data points that you

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Speaker 3: look for when those biggest technology names have earnings? Of course,

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Speaker 3: we've studied capital expenditure closely, but we're trying to gage

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Speaker 3: this time, like when does it transition to you guys

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Speaker 3: saying we need to see really big top or bottom

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Speaker 3: line growth to feel confident that this AI thing is real.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 7: I think especially for the largest hyperscalar names, we need

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Speaker 7: to see continued acceleration and growth of the cloud businesses.

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Speaker 7: And then we also need to see the CAPEX numbers

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Speaker 7: remain stable or higher for the year. And I think

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Speaker 7: those are kind of the two large indicators that we'll

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Speaker 7: be looking at from those companies.

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Speaker 3: In particular, which of the world's technology companies are you

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Speaker 3: going to be paying most attention to, Tiffany?

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Speaker 7: I think in the near term it's you know, the

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Speaker 7: mag seven and especially Amazon, Microsoft, Google and then Meta

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Speaker 7: also which had a big capex announcement last quarter or so,

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Speaker 7: all of coursing.

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Speaker 5: To see what they have to say.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean we had nice tea leaves already. If

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Speaker 4: you're looking at earning some TSMC and that's something that

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Speaker 4: you've been looking at. Semi conductor equipment manufacturing, how much

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Speaker 4: resilience did you hear from that company and how much

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Speaker 4: do you just put AI bubble warries.

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Speaker 5: To one side.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean they commented that they don't think that

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Speaker 7: there's a bubble and AI that they're seeing a ton

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Speaker 7: of good demand from their customers, and I think that's

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Speaker 7: reflective of the entire ecosystem for AI right now, and

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Speaker 7: that's a great indicator for again, like you mentioned the

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Speaker 7: semiicap equipment names, and also a good indicator of demand

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Speaker 7: we're seeing from memory companies which are part of the

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Speaker 7: value chain as well, Tiffany.

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Speaker 3: One of the things that's come back out of Davos

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Speaker 3: is the idea of whether America should or should not

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Speaker 3: allow technology to be exported to China. You know, when

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Speaker 3: you're coming up through the ranks of Bloemberg Television, you

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Speaker 3: kind of learn about China as the engine room of

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Speaker 3: the world economy. And I've always been curious to ask

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Speaker 3: you how much you worry about that, the balance between

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Speaker 3: to accessing that market and the competitive risks in exporting

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Speaker 3: technology and national security risks to a market like China.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, I think this is a very tricky one, right

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Speaker 7: because we want to keep our dominance in AI and

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Speaker 7: technology and development of new technology, but we also don't

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Speaker 7: want to force China's hand to sort of replicate some

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Speaker 7: of our technologies or develop their own technologies. So keeping them,

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Speaker 7: you know, to some extent, dependent on our companies is

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Speaker 7: also an interesting balance to strike. So honestly, this is

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Speaker 7: a very tricky one to figure out.

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Speaker 3: Tiffany Wade of Columbia, Fred need or great to have

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Speaker 3: you on Bloomberg Tech.

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Speaker 2: Thank you very much.

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Speaker 8: Now.

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Speaker 2: Bloomberg is in Davos.

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Speaker 3: This week speaking to leaders across finance and tech at

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Speaker 3: the World Economic Forum. Coinbased CEO Brian Armstrong is speaking

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Speaker 3: with Bloomberg's Emily Chan.

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Speaker 5: Listen to this the flight risk concern.

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Speaker 9: Yeah, so that's certainly one of the core parts of

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Speaker 9: the debate. I think that some of the bank CEOs

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Speaker 9: I've spoken with have kind of said, hey, we have

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Speaker 9: this really high regulatory burden for being a bank, and

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Speaker 9: what you're doing kind of looks like a bank, and

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Speaker 9: so we think it's super unfair you should have to

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Speaker 9: have a bank license too. And what I tell them is, well,

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Speaker 9: we're not doing something very important that you do. We

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Speaker 9: do not do fractional reserve lending, which means, for those

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Speaker 9: who don't know, you know, at a bank you deposit

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Speaker 9: your funds, they're not keeping your money there, they're actually

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Speaker 9: lending it out and earning interest on that, and then

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Speaker 9: they pay you a very small percentage of that. Like

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Speaker 9: the average savings account makes like fourteen basis points or something,

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Speaker 9: and that's called net interest margin.

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Speaker 2: And that's the whole bank business model.

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Speaker 9: And so that's why they have such high regulatory burden,

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Speaker 9: because there can be a run on the bank, Like

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Speaker 9: your money is not all there in a crypto world,

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Speaker 9: there's a one hundred percent reserve, so all your money

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Speaker 9: is there.

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Speaker 2: It eliminates this entire category of risk around a bank run.

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Speaker 9: No such thing as possible if there's one hundred percent

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Speaker 9: of the money there. And so we don't need a

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Speaker 9: bank license. We're regulated by the SEC, the CFTC. We

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Speaker 9: you know, we have a National Trust Charter, like there's

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Speaker 9: different entities and stable cooin issuers can operate under these

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Speaker 9: models as well. And so we've kind of said, you know,

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Speaker 9: we don't need a bank license. That's what currently already

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Speaker 9: exists in the law. The Genius Act even enshrined that further.

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Speaker 9: And so there has to be some other solution here.

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Speaker 9: How do we flip the banks from thinking of this

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Speaker 9: as a threat to an opportunity where we can all

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Speaker 9: go win.

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Speaker 10: Let's talk about the opportunity. You know, we started off

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Speaker 10: talking about how crypto has had a lot of momentum lately.

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Speaker 10: A lot of that was when crypto was on a tear.

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Speaker 10: The markets have definitely pulled back over the last couple

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Speaker 10: of months. So here, I know this is always your

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Speaker 10: favorite question, but is winter coming?

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Speaker 9: Well, there's always short term fluctuations in crypto, but I

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Speaker 9: think you know, if you look over the last two years,

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Speaker 9: Bitcoin's up like one hundred percent, pretty great outcome for

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Speaker 9: anybody who invested. You know, I've said publicly I think

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Speaker 9: that bitcoin could hit a million dollars by twenty thirty.

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Speaker 2: I still think that's true.

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Speaker 9: So whatever happens in any given week or month, you know,

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Speaker 9: we try it to track it too much.

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Speaker 2: It's the longer term trend that I think is interesting.

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Speaker 10: So bitcoin hit an all time high last year one

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Speaker 10: twenty five, one hundred twenty five thous What about twenty

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Speaker 10: twenty six. Let's do a shorter term for horizon.

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Speaker 5: Where is it going in twenty twenty six?

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Speaker 9: Well, you know, I don't like to make short term

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Speaker 9: predictions because who knows it's it's the market, you know,

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Speaker 9: short term voting machine, long term wing machine, or whatever.

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Speaker 9: So I think if I don't think people should be

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Speaker 9: like day trading, you know, unless you really want to

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Speaker 9: do that. I'm more of a buy and hold kind

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Speaker 9: of guy for the long term, and I think that

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Speaker 9: the cool thing about bitcoin is that it doesn't unlike

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Speaker 9: fiat currency, there's no money printer, right, so the supply

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Speaker 9: of it is fixed.

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Speaker 2: It's fine.

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Speaker 4: Coinbay CEO Brown arms from there, along with Bloomberg Semoni Chang.

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Speaker 5: You can watch the full fast Side chat. Just go

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Speaker 5: to life, go on your Bloomberg terminal.

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Speaker 4: Meanwhile, coming up willing you are Exclusive Conversation and Peng Shao,

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Speaker 4: he's the CEO of G forty two.

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Speaker 5: We've got to discuss the UAE's role in global AI development.

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Speaker 5: That's next. It's a bloombag tech.

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Speaker 4: Back to Davos now where Blue most jamano Be said

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Speaker 4: she sat down with pengshaw Is the CEO G forty two.

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Speaker 4: They discussed building AI infrastructure and the UAE's role in

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Speaker 4: the global AI development. They spoke on the sidelines in

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Speaker 4: the World Economic Forum, of course, starting with the chip imports,

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Speaker 4: and made existing restrictions.

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Speaker 5: To take a listener.

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Speaker 11: In this complex world of AI, nothing is straightforward. But

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Speaker 11: I must say that through the past half year since

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Speaker 11: the May Summit in Aberdabi. We've made a tremendous progress.

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Speaker 11: I'm happy to share with you that the first batch

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Speaker 11: of the most advanced AI chips will be shipped the

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Speaker 11: UE probably in the next couple of months.

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Speaker 5: And those are mostly in video chips.

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Speaker 11: They are mostly in video. But we also received the

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Speaker 11: expert license for Cerebus Chip, which is a company way

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Speaker 11: back to start up in California, and also a MD.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, did you have to give security assurances to the US?

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Speaker 2: Absolutely?

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Speaker 11: In fact, was not just a theore the call pledge.

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Speaker 11: It's something we had to practice for the past three

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Speaker 11: years now to physically demonstrate we have the ability to

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Speaker 11: ensure the safety and security of the spense technologies from

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Speaker 11: the US.

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Speaker 2: I e.

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Speaker 12: That there's no possibility for that technology to be passed

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Speaker 12: on elsewhere.

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Speaker 11: Cannot be a trands shipt. Yeah, there's no backwork for

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Speaker 11: remote access by unapproved parties, so and so forth.

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Speaker 12: Yes, let me ask you a big picture question, which

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Speaker 12: is the fact that obviously twenty twenty six was twenty

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Speaker 12: twenty five was a big year for AI just in

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Speaker 12: terms of the mainstream discussion around it. And I think

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Speaker 12: there are pockets of the market where people started to

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Speaker 12: speak up and say, there's so much money going into

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Speaker 12: this space, especially on CAPEX investment, it's going to be

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Speaker 12: really difficult to generate a return on investment.

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Speaker 5: Where do you stand on that debate?

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Speaker 11: I think there are three proper major factors to cause concern,

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Speaker 11: for doubt or even fear in this below. A movement

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Speaker 11: one is that it's clear now as we discussed earlier,

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Speaker 11: AI has entered our societies. AI is demonstrating it potentially

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Speaker 11: can do many things humans are doing today. So job

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Speaker 11: security is one concern. That's number one. Number two, as

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Speaker 11: we have seen, AI does require so much electricity, especially

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Speaker 11: in the US, there are such debates already. Can the

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Speaker 11: city centers eventually take power away from people who need

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Speaker 11: it to be left in the code and have AI

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Speaker 11: consume all the power?

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Speaker 2: This is power.

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Speaker 11: Concern number number two. Number three really is a concern

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Speaker 11: about a global race. Can we be actually left behind?

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Speaker 11: And what this means for government for national security. I

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Speaker 11: think all these are factors to cause certain pockets in

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Speaker 11: the US and elsewhere people are confused, concerned and asking

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Speaker 11: for a pot. But I think it's a mystic because

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Speaker 11: if we pulse, say in a US or a US

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Speaker 11: ecosystem or US allies many other nations.

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Speaker 3: That was Pengshao, CEO of G forty two, along with

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Speaker 3: Bloomberg's Jamana Bassecchi, staying at Davos. Santhropic CEO Dario ama

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Speaker 3: day Is warning the Trump administration against exporting advanced chips

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Speaker 3: to China, calling it a mistake with serious national security risks.

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Speaker 3: He sat down with Bloomberg editor in chief John Mickelfwaite

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Speaker 3: at Bloomberg House where the discussion started on the state

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Speaker 3: of China's AI models.

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Speaker 2: Listen to this. I think they never really caught up

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Speaker 2: that much.

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Speaker 13: So you know, of course there was this huge excitement

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Speaker 13: around deep Seek, right, but you know, the truth was

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Speaker 13: a couple of things.

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Speaker 2: One, you know, those models were very optimized for the benchmarks.

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Speaker 13: It's actually very easy to optimize the model for a

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Speaker 13: finite list of benchmark. When we go out into the world,

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Speaker 13: right when we're when we're, when we're uh, you know,

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Speaker 13: competing against other companies for enterprise contracts. We see just

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Speaker 13: honestly and Kennedy, we see Google, and we see open Ai.

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Speaker 13: Every once in a while we see a couple other

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Speaker 13: US players. I have almost never lost a deal, lost

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Speaker 13: a contract to to a Chinese model.

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Speaker 2: But now you have the Trump administration, and I think

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Speaker 2: you've already protested about this giving high speed chips and

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Speaker 2: video chips to the Chinese. That's right, that's right, the

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Speaker 2: thing that is holding them back.

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Speaker 13: And they've said it themselves, the CEOs of these companies

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Speaker 13: say it's the embargo on chips that's holding us back.

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Speaker 2: They explicitly say this.

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Speaker 13: And and now indeed, you know, there are some policies

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Speaker 13: and I hope they change their mind to uh, you know,

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Speaker 13: to explicitly send not quite our latest generation of chips,

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Speaker 13: although it was reported that even that was being considered.

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Speaker 13: But you know, the generation of chips that's that's just

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Speaker 13: one back. That's still dreamly powerful. And we are many

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Speaker 13: years ahead of China in terms of our in terms

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Speaker 13: of our.

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Speaker 2: Ability to make chips.

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Speaker 13: So I think it would be a big mistake to

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Speaker 13: ship these chips. You know, the the the analogy I

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Speaker 13: thought of if you think about the incredible national security

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Speaker 13: implications of building model building models that are essentially cognition,

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Speaker 13: that are essentially intelligence. Right, I've called where we're going

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Speaker 13: with this a country of geniuses in the data center. Right,

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Speaker 13: So imagine one hundred thousand, one hundred million people smarter

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Speaker 13: than any Nobel Prize winner, and it's going to be

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Speaker 13: under the control of one one country or another.

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Speaker 2: So so I think this is crazy.

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Speaker 13: I think it's you know, it's a bit like you know,

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Speaker 13: I don't know, like selling selling you know, nuclear weapons

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Speaker 13: to North Korea.

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Speaker 4: Athrobic CEO Daria Amada. They're speaking with Bloomberg editor in

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Speaker 4: chief John Mickelthwaite coming up. Just check out this list

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Speaker 4: of investors backing the new startup Humans and We'll find

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Speaker 4: out o striving the excitement and the huge punting ground

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Speaker 4: for a company fresh off the blocks is a Bloomberg.

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Speaker 3: Tech Humans and and You start up building a frontier

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Speaker 3: AI Lab has raised a four hundred and eighty million

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Speaker 3: dollar seed funding ground at a four point four to

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Speaker 3: eight billion dollar valuation and unusually large hall for a

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Speaker 3: young startup.

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Speaker 2: Bloomberg's VC reporter.

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Speaker 3: Natasha Mascarinus joins us, Now, what is the news here?

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Speaker 2: I mean, is it the seed ground of the evaluation?

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Speaker 2: What do we need to know?

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Speaker 14: Yeah, I mean this is the one of the largest

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Speaker 14: seed rounds in private market history. I also like to

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Speaker 14: say this is the new normal. For a Frontier Labs.

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Speaker 14: This is five top researchers and technologists leaving Anthropic XAI,

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Speaker 14: Google coming together and launching honestly a competitive to their

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Speaker 14: previous employers in a new way. So to me, the

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Speaker 14: news is that the AI bubble talk is at least,

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Speaker 14: you know, a step back for now, because we are

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Speaker 14: seeing investors back these early companies at very high valuation,

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Speaker 14: and strategic investors.

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Speaker 4: I can video for example, what new do we need

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Speaker 4: in a frontier lab right now?

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Speaker 14: Yeah, So the real question that we have is what

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Speaker 14: does Humans and really going to launch with. We don't

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Speaker 14: have a really strong idea of what their first product

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Speaker 14: is going to look like. But to me, it's really

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Speaker 14: being set up as the opposite of the set it

443
00:21:35,320 --> 00:21:39,159
Speaker 14: and forget it agents. It's going to be more collaborative.

444
00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:41,200
Speaker 14: When I spoke to the company, they said that it's

445
00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:44,240
Speaker 14: going to be more focused on long term outcomes for

446
00:21:44,280 --> 00:21:47,960
Speaker 14: communities and individuals. And to me, that says, you know,

447
00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:50,240
Speaker 14: maybe there will be a chat interface down the road,

448
00:21:50,240 --> 00:21:52,400
Speaker 14: but it won't be instant. It might be more focused

449
00:21:52,400 --> 00:21:56,080
Speaker 14: on memory or collaboration. So what I'm watching is really

450
00:21:56,080 --> 00:21:58,080
Speaker 14: to see if that's going to be the follow on.

451
00:21:58,119 --> 00:21:58,679
Speaker 5: That they've promised.

452
00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:00,560
Speaker 3: We just have twenty seconds, but I guess it is

453
00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:02,440
Speaker 3: the clue in the investors themselves.

454
00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:04,680
Speaker 14: I would say in video coming out as an early

455
00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:07,639
Speaker 14: investor is all you need to know about how serious

456
00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:09,880
Speaker 14: they're taking the compute needs of what they're going to do.

457
00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:11,119
Speaker 5: So that's what I would watch.

458
00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:14,640
Speaker 4: Bloomegs, Natasha and Mascarenas. It's a great write up. Thanks

459
00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:17,120
Speaker 4: for coming and explaining it today. You are coming up

460
00:22:17,359 --> 00:22:19,920
Speaker 4: report investor. What we known about their funding round of

461
00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:23,760
Speaker 4: late Georgian is the key investor in now. Margaret Wu

462
00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:26,720
Speaker 4: joins us now to talk about her new portfolio company

463
00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:29,560
Speaker 4: that's the Minion Dynamics and why she's getting into defense tech.

464
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:55,320
Speaker 5: This is bluegg Tech. Welcome back to bluemeg Tech.

465
00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:58,320
Speaker 4: Checking on these markets that are under pressure, worst day

466
00:22:58,359 --> 00:23:00,720
Speaker 4: that we've seen in well at least a month, and

467
00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:02,240
Speaker 4: then as that one hundred are off by a percentage

468
00:23:02,280 --> 00:23:04,240
Speaker 4: point s and P five hundred raises all of its

469
00:23:04,280 --> 00:23:06,919
Speaker 4: annual gains. We are selling off risk assets, whether it's bonds,

470
00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:09,280
Speaker 4: whether it's the dollar, whether it's bitcoin as well or

471
00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:10,920
Speaker 4: off by more than two point six percent. Your flight

472
00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:14,520
Speaker 4: to safety is in gold and metals. Why because of geopolitics,

473
00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:17,479
Speaker 4: worries about Greenland, worries about a dial up in tariff

474
00:23:17,480 --> 00:23:20,199
Speaker 4: threats going towards Europe, and what their response might be.

475
00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:23,760
Speaker 4: You keep your eyes peeled what's happening from the focus

476
00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:25,919
Speaker 4: of geopolitics and President Trump. But move on to some

477
00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:28,359
Speaker 4: of the individual names that are underneath the hood. Look,

478
00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:30,760
Speaker 4: it doesn't help the nasat one hundred if you're wiping

479
00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:32,960
Speaker 4: out one hundred and fifty million dollars in market capitalization

480
00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:35,639
Speaker 4: of Nvidia having its worst day again in more than

481
00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:37,800
Speaker 4: a month. But I'm also looking at some companies that

482
00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:40,399
Speaker 4: still see love Intel. Webersh says, we think that and

483
00:23:40,840 --> 00:23:43,200
Speaker 4: overall we're going to see earnings better than expected. We're

484
00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:47,160
Speaker 4: seeing HSBC Seaport both saying the CPU side of the equation,

485
00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:50,359
Speaker 4: the ideas of PCs also the ramp up and foundry

486
00:23:50,359 --> 00:23:52,840
Speaker 4: are looking good. We are up on the thirty percent

487
00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:55,040
Speaker 4: here to date for Intel. But I'm looking also at

488
00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:56,960
Speaker 4: strategy that sells off the worst in a month because

489
00:23:56,960 --> 00:23:59,919
Speaker 4: Bitcoin's down, cryptos lower, and we're worried about the Banking

490
00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:04,240
Speaker 4: Senate Committee looking at that market structured deal at the moment, ed,

491
00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:05,679
Speaker 4: what do you keep an eye.

492
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:08,160
Speaker 2: On Well, there's a lot of action in private markets

493
00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:08,440
Speaker 2: as well.

494
00:24:08,480 --> 00:24:11,879
Speaker 3: Toronto based venture firm Georgian has led a fifteen million

495
00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:15,800
Speaker 3: US dollar funding round in Dominion Dynamics, the firm's first

496
00:24:15,880 --> 00:24:19,040
Speaker 3: defense tech investment. It comes, as you just said, as

497
00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:22,000
Speaker 3: interest in Arctic security picks up, joining us to discuss.

498
00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:26,760
Speaker 3: Margaret wo, lead investor at Georgian, Dominion Dynamics is about

499
00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:29,399
Speaker 3: for both military and civilian use case, but it's about

500
00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:33,080
Speaker 3: a sensing network in the Arctic. You have focused as

501
00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:35,040
Speaker 3: an investor largely on AI.

502
00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:36,240
Speaker 2: This happens to be.

503
00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:40,760
Speaker 3: Your first defense play timely, But what's your thesis here

504
00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:41,680
Speaker 3: in making the play?

505
00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:45,480
Speaker 15: Well, you're right, Dominion Dynamics is a company with a

506
00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:49,120
Speaker 15: vision to become Canada's first defense neo prime and they're

507
00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:52,840
Speaker 15: starting by building an Arctic sensing and intelligence network for

508
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:56,920
Speaker 15: dual use purposes. Now, our investment in this company really

509
00:24:56,960 --> 00:24:59,560
Speaker 15: began with a first meeting with the CEO and founder,

510
00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:02,679
Speaker 15: Elliot Pence, And what really struck me in that meeting

511
00:25:02,960 --> 00:25:06,359
Speaker 15: was not only the scale and the strategic importance of

512
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:10,320
Speaker 15: this market, but the uniquely relevant background that Elliott has

513
00:25:10,359 --> 00:25:12,560
Speaker 15: to lead in this space, having been an early and

514
00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:15,760
Speaker 15: roll employee that helps lead the company's go to market

515
00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:17,440
Speaker 15: expansion into multiple geography.

516
00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:21,679
Speaker 3: We see that alumni effect, that network effect, SpaceX alumni

517
00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:25,400
Speaker 3: and ro alumni new companies. But in the here and now,

518
00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:27,800
Speaker 3: when you see the news headlines such that they are

519
00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:31,240
Speaker 3: about Greenland, I guess that must give you more confidence

520
00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:32,880
Speaker 3: that this is the right strategy right now.

521
00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:37,080
Speaker 15: Oh absolutely, At Jordan, we see several very strong tailwinds

522
00:25:37,119 --> 00:25:40,000
Speaker 15: for a company like Dominion. First is that the Canadian

523
00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:42,439
Speaker 15: government has made it very clear that they have a

524
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:45,679
Speaker 15: commitment to increased defense spending from two percent of GDP

525
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:48,560
Speaker 15: to five percent over the next ten years. The Arctic,

526
00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:52,000
Speaker 15: as you just mentioned, has become an increasingly strategic and

527
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:56,240
Speaker 15: critical geography in the geopolitical landscape. And what's interesting is

528
00:25:56,280 --> 00:25:59,919
Speaker 15: that there are very few technology options for operating in

529
00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:04,520
Speaker 15: the extreme conditions of the Arctic environment, and Dominion is

530
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:09,720
Speaker 15: developing ruggedized devices and equipment to solve this non trivial problem.

531
00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 15: And the last thing I'll say is that with the

532
00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:16,840
Speaker 15: rise of companies like Andral and Helsing, we're really watching

533
00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:20,760
Speaker 15: a battle between legacy defense primes and neoprimes play out

534
00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:22,679
Speaker 15: in the US and Europe. But it's a little bit

535
00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:26,439
Speaker 15: different in Canada and that we don't have any real

536
00:26:26,640 --> 00:26:29,600
Speaker 15: legacy defense primes, so there's a white space and at

537
00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:32,320
Speaker 15: Georgia we believe that Dominion is poised to go capture

538
00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:33,439
Speaker 15: that Margaret.

539
00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:37,000
Speaker 4: There aren't many investors that also have an AI lab.

540
00:26:37,440 --> 00:26:39,520
Speaker 5: So where would you help a Dominion in that case?

541
00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:41,840
Speaker 4: Where are you helping your put photio companies with your

542
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:42,840
Speaker 4: own talent that you have.

543
00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:44,360
Speaker 2: Right.

544
00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:47,240
Speaker 15: What makes Georgian different, and we've been investing in AI

545
00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:49,960
Speaker 15: since twenty sixteen, is that we actually have our own

546
00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:54,480
Speaker 15: internal AI lab of about twenty plus data scientists, mL engineers,

547
00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:59,200
Speaker 15: DevOps engineers and cybersecurity professionals that work with our portfolio

548
00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:03,720
Speaker 15: companies after we invest to accelerate their own product roadmaps.

549
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:05,200
Speaker 5: So, as AI.

550
00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:07,840
Speaker 15: Investors, when we're looking at defense tech and a company

551
00:27:08,040 --> 00:27:12,840
Speaker 15: like Dominion Dynamics, we really see an industry that is

552
00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:17,840
Speaker 15: undergoing digital transformation and disruption from AI. Like many other

553
00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:24,119
Speaker 15: hardware and labor intensive industries, defense is essentially becoming software

554
00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:27,199
Speaker 15: defined and there's an increasing emphasis on the concept of

555
00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:30,280
Speaker 15: connected mass, meaning how do you quickly produce a lot

556
00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:32,359
Speaker 15: of things, but how do you make sure those things

557
00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:35,480
Speaker 15: can speak to each other, and that really intersects with

558
00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:38,280
Speaker 15: what we do at Georgian every day looking at areas

559
00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:44,560
Speaker 15: of technology like multimodal AI, physical AI, cybersecurity, and edge computing.

560
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:47,560
Speaker 15: So our companies are working on these types of companies,

561
00:27:47,720 --> 00:27:50,680
Speaker 15: tracking where we believe there are headed and going and

562
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:52,920
Speaker 15: we believe in that sense we're going to be a

563
00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:56,360
Speaker 15: great partner for a platform like Dominion, along with our

564
00:27:56,400 --> 00:27:58,720
Speaker 15: Canadian presence and connectivity.

565
00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:02,320
Speaker 4: If you're thinking of you really inherently an AI investor,

566
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:04,320
Speaker 4: but now it's focused on defense.

567
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:07,119
Speaker 5: Look, defense is a hot space and we know valuations

568
00:28:07,119 --> 00:28:09,280
Speaker 5: have been high. Another big bet.

569
00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:11,640
Speaker 4: Of yours has been Replet and boys that paying off

570
00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:13,760
Speaker 4: with its scale of its valuation. In the latest as

571
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:16,200
Speaker 4: we understand, they're trippling its valuation to nine billion dollars.

572
00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:19,359
Speaker 4: We understand you and Georgian are helping lead that funding round.

573
00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:22,119
Speaker 5: When is it the right stage to invest? How are

574
00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:24,120
Speaker 5: you getting comfortable with these valuations?

575
00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:29,879
Speaker 15: Well, I can't really comment on a potential transaction, but

576
00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:33,080
Speaker 15: you're right, we are an existing investor in Replet, and

577
00:28:33,359 --> 00:28:36,399
Speaker 15: I believe this is a category defining company at the

578
00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:39,840
Speaker 15: app generation layer of vibe coding. When you think about

579
00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:42,920
Speaker 15: some of the lofty valuations that you're seeing. It's really

580
00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:47,720
Speaker 15: the potential of the market size behind something like Replet

581
00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:52,440
Speaker 15: and app generation. If software is eating the world, then

582
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:55,280
Speaker 15: you should know that vibe coding is eating software and

583
00:28:55,320 --> 00:28:58,600
Speaker 15: that process is only accelerating. So we believe this has

584
00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:00,800
Speaker 15: the potential to be one of the law just markets

585
00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:04,640
Speaker 15: we've ever seen. And what I find particularly notable about

586
00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:08,960
Speaker 15: a company like Replet is that its product, with the

587
00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:12,440
Speaker 15: exceptional growth and millions of users, is still the worst

588
00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:15,240
Speaker 15: version of itself every single day. Because the company is

589
00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:18,400
Speaker 15: moving with such velocity that new incremental features are coming

590
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:21,120
Speaker 15: out almost on a weekly basis, and with every new

591
00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:24,640
Speaker 15: coding agent launch, the company is making leaps forward towards

592
00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:30,280
Speaker 15: creating a one shot full stack engineering team and infrastructure.

593
00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:32,560
Speaker 3: To boot Margaret, our next guest is a pure play

594
00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:35,040
Speaker 3: software name in the defense space.

595
00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:36,720
Speaker 2: But I want to go back to what you just said.

596
00:29:36,840 --> 00:29:40,280
Speaker 3: You know the software being of value here and also

597
00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:43,160
Speaker 3: Dominion wanted to be a neo prime. Now we know

598
00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:46,400
Speaker 3: that also software is capital intensive. I just wondered if

599
00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:48,800
Speaker 3: you could reflect on that the need to fund growth

600
00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:51,960
Speaker 3: for these companies would be it talent access to compute

601
00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:53,920
Speaker 3: and software competence.

602
00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 2: It's still an expensive gig absolutely.

603
00:29:57,160 --> 00:30:01,080
Speaker 15: I think historically there has been defense tech has been

604
00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:05,760
Speaker 15: a harder sector to invest into because of the startup

605
00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:08,840
Speaker 15: value of death and the amount of capital required. But

606
00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:12,760
Speaker 15: with the speed and the productivity that we are seeing

607
00:30:12,840 --> 00:30:16,080
Speaker 15: with things like Vibe coding, we believe companies can move

608
00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:18,200
Speaker 15: a lot faster in a much more cost effective way,

609
00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:20,280
Speaker 15: and that's how you've seen the rise of the New

610
00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:21,000
Speaker 15: York Primes.

611
00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:23,640
Speaker 4: Margarel Woo, what a joy to have you on the show.

612
00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:26,320
Speaker 4: Thank you very much, Adeve for joining today. Need Investor

613
00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:29,760
Speaker 4: at Georgian. Let's stick as Ed says, with the topic

614
00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:33,760
Speaker 4: of defense military software startup defense Unicorns has become a

615
00:30:33,880 --> 00:30:36,520
Speaker 4: unicorn itself, following says, one hundred and thirty six million

616
00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:37,600
Speaker 4: dollar funding around defense.

617
00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:39,520
Speaker 5: Unicorn CEO Rob Slaughter joins us.

618
00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:42,520
Speaker 4: To talk about the company's plans and how you're able

619
00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:44,160
Speaker 4: to get the cap table. I mean, you've got Bains

620
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:46,520
Speaker 4: Capital Tech Opportunities Fund there, but you've also got ads,

621
00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:49,200
Speaker 4: a capital staffare ventures. I'm looking at Valor Equity Partners.

622
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:51,640
Speaker 4: What is it that you tell them you're doing differently?

623
00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:53,880
Speaker 2: Well, really, it.

624
00:30:53,840 --> 00:30:57,440
Speaker 16: Just starts with the problem. I think obviously people know

625
00:30:58,520 --> 00:31:01,000
Speaker 16: and follow the news. Everybody I think in this country

626
00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:05,320
Speaker 16: believes and understands how lethal and effective the US military is.

627
00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:07,360
Speaker 16: But a lot of that lethality, a lot of that

628
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:11,760
Speaker 16: capability was developed over the series of many decades. Meanwhile,

629
00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:15,120
Speaker 16: the software world has completely reinvented itself over the last

630
00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:17,680
Speaker 16: couple of years. So really, I think what investors or

631
00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:20,600
Speaker 16: company realize is not only is there a massive need,

632
00:31:20,960 --> 00:31:24,960
Speaker 16: but there's a massive market. In addition to that, there's

633
00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:29,320
Speaker 16: this massive change around how the Department of War is

634
00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:33,080
Speaker 16: open to contracting. So specifically, the Department of warf really

635
00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:36,200
Speaker 16: focuses on cost plus fees. I think the entire Department

636
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:39,960
Speaker 16: of War has reinvented itself allowed for more fixed price contracting.

637
00:31:40,640 --> 00:31:45,320
Speaker 4: You called yourself the air Gap software company, So does

638
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:47,560
Speaker 4: that get rid of Microsoft entirely? Do you come on

639
00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:50,320
Speaker 4: and help sure that the Department of War or any

640
00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:54,560
Speaker 4: of these other military focused areas of government are able

641
00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:56,680
Speaker 4: to still use the software providers they do, but you're

642
00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:58,600
Speaker 4: able to put this layer on top that makes it safe.

643
00:31:58,640 --> 00:31:59,680
Speaker 5: Where are you solving for?

644
00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:04,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, you absolutely nailed it. Most the entire world is

645
00:32:04,360 --> 00:32:04,880
Speaker 2: cloud based.

646
00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:07,760
Speaker 16: It's all centralized compute the Department of War, and we

647
00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:11,920
Speaker 16: believe many companies, many individuals, over the next decade or

648
00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:15,040
Speaker 16: two will actually find the value of these air gapped systems.

649
00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:17,400
Speaker 16: And let me define air gap for you. Air gap

650
00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:20,120
Speaker 16: is fully disconnected. That means it really doesn't touch anything.

651
00:32:20,120 --> 00:32:22,800
Speaker 16: It's semi disconnected, which means it might touch a few

652
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:26,600
Speaker 16: things or even extremely high firewalls to where you know,

653
00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:29,600
Speaker 16: you might have access to the Internet to certain domains,

654
00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:31,360
Speaker 16: but you certainly can't go out and reach out.

655
00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:32,400
Speaker 2: You reach out to Docker.

656
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:35,000
Speaker 16: You currently can't reach out to things like it hub.

657
00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:36,520
Speaker 2: Rob.

658
00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:39,560
Speaker 3: You had a career in the Air Force focused on technology.

659
00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:42,920
Speaker 3: Ten years ago, you tried to work with the DoD

660
00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:48,440
Speaker 3: to change how they approach software. Fast forward to present day,

661
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:52,800
Speaker 3: clearly you see an opportunity. Has that changed how the

662
00:32:52,840 --> 00:32:56,920
Speaker 3: military apparatus views its procurement of software and how fast

663
00:32:56,960 --> 00:33:00,800
Speaker 3: you able to grow your contracts with the Defense Industrial Base?

664
00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:03,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it goes back to the need. I

665
00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:05,080
Speaker 2: think ten years ago I didn't think.

666
00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:08,880
Speaker 16: I don't think people really understood what our adversaries were

667
00:33:08,920 --> 00:33:12,000
Speaker 16: capable of. I think there was a certain level of

668
00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:15,280
Speaker 16: you know, we have this superior tech advantage and I

669
00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:18,760
Speaker 16: think objectively speaking, that that's changed and with that need

670
00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:20,360
Speaker 16: comes a real desire to move quickly.

671
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:21,200
Speaker 17: You know.

672
00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:23,760
Speaker 16: Previously, you know, there was some talk about the value

673
00:33:23,760 --> 00:33:25,960
Speaker 16: of death. One way to look at it is there's

674
00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:28,440
Speaker 16: several values of death. You have the value of death

675
00:33:28,440 --> 00:33:31,240
Speaker 16: of that first contract. But for a startup like us,

676
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:34,440
Speaker 16: you have this value of death around software integration and

677
00:33:34,480 --> 00:33:37,000
Speaker 16: specifically as a company. That's the problem that we solve.

678
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:41,880
Speaker 3: Rob sort A, CEO of Defense Unicorns reaching Unicorn status

679
00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:42,920
Speaker 3: as funning around.

680
00:33:42,920 --> 00:33:43,760
Speaker 2: Thank you very much.

681
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:45,720
Speaker 3: Now, coming up, we're going to go live to Davos

682
00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:48,960
Speaker 3: for a conversation with UBS CEO Sergio A.

683
00:33:49,040 --> 00:34:03,800
Speaker 2: Mossi. That's next. This is being by Tech. Let's get

684
00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:04,680
Speaker 2: out to Davos.

685
00:34:04,360 --> 00:34:07,280
Speaker 3: Where Bloomberg Surveillance anchor John Ferrer is standing by.

686
00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:10,680
Speaker 8: John take it away, Hey, guys, live from Davos, Switzerland

687
00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:13,239
Speaker 8: at the World Economic Forum, standing by the King of

688
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:15,799
Speaker 8: Swiss Banking. He might not like that introduction. It's Sergio

689
00:34:15,800 --> 00:34:19,840
Speaker 8: al Malti, the ubsc EO. Surge I, good to see you, hey,

690
00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:22,719
Speaker 8: thanks for braving the code. I appreciate it. Before we

691
00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:24,200
Speaker 8: get into the bank, we're going to ease into this

692
00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 8: and start with financial markets.

693
00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:27,040
Speaker 2: What a start to the training week.

694
00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:31,360
Speaker 8: State side equities, open up, gap lower bonyard Hire dollar week.

695
00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:34,400
Speaker 8: We've seen this movie before. Last April got over it

696
00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:36,480
Speaker 8: pretty quickly. We've thrown a lot of this market in

697
00:34:36,520 --> 00:34:39,359
Speaker 8: the last twelve months. It hasn't stuck. Is there something

698
00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:41,520
Speaker 8: different about the way we're set up for twenty twenty six?

699
00:34:42,680 --> 00:34:46,000
Speaker 18: Well, I would say that it's probably the accumulation of

700
00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:49,080
Speaker 18: issues that are now out there and not resolved that

701
00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:52,759
Speaker 18: is becoming a little bit troubling in my point of view.

702
00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:55,800
Speaker 18: So I think that this is the only major change,

703
00:34:56,000 --> 00:34:59,799
Speaker 18: But we have to stay tuned for more relativity going

704
00:34:59,800 --> 00:35:04,480
Speaker 18: forwar and predictability and rapid changes. So I think that

705
00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:09,080
Speaker 18: staying diversified in financial markets nowadays is pretty important.

706
00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:11,920
Speaker 8: Let's get to what that word means, diversify. It feels

707
00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:14,480
Speaker 8: like that's a diplomatic way of saying South America sometimes,

708
00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:15,839
Speaker 8: and I'm not going to put words in your mouth.

709
00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:17,120
Speaker 2: I'll tell you what others are saying.

710
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:20,480
Speaker 8: Pinco is talking about a multi year period of diversification

711
00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:24,000
Speaker 8: away from US assets. We've seen from others moving out

712
00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:26,400
Speaker 8: of US treasuries. There was a headline earlier on this

713
00:35:26,440 --> 00:35:29,839
Speaker 8: morning about a very small Danish pension fund, and they've

714
00:35:29,840 --> 00:35:31,799
Speaker 8: got their own issues in Denmark right now. Given their

715
00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:34,120
Speaker 8: relationship with America, what are you seeing development?

716
00:35:34,120 --> 00:35:37,880
Speaker 18: Well, Diversifying away from America is impossible. I think that

717
00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:42,760
Speaker 18: in any major asset allocation, one could probably think about

718
00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:47,000
Speaker 18: having an overweight or underweight, But diversifying away from the

719
00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:51,600
Speaker 18: US and also from the dollar is a quite dangerous beat.

720
00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:56,319
Speaker 18: You know, things can change rapidly, and US this is

721
00:35:56,320 --> 00:35:58,719
Speaker 18: the strongest economy in the world. The one was the

722
00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:01,840
Speaker 18: highest level of nail right now is a little bit bumpy,

723
00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:05,560
Speaker 18: but I would say that I wouldn't really bet against

724
00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:06,280
Speaker 18: the US.

725
00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:09,080
Speaker 8: There seems to be a difference between how the politicians

726
00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:11,720
Speaker 8: and the policymakers talk about America right now the backdrop

727
00:36:11,719 --> 00:36:14,440
Speaker 8: for international relations, and how a business person thinks of

728
00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:17,560
Speaker 8: America the economy and the opportunity. I've mentioned this nowt

729
00:36:17,600 --> 00:36:20,640
Speaker 8: a number of times already today about the survey the

730
00:36:20,680 --> 00:36:23,520
Speaker 8: PwC put out. They surveyed four and a half thousand

731
00:36:23,560 --> 00:36:27,719
Speaker 8: CEOs and the top destination for capital for investment America

732
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:30,520
Speaker 8: and it was up on last year. As a bank

733
00:36:30,719 --> 00:36:33,960
Speaker 8: boss right now, a CEO who's thinking about expanding around

734
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:34,360
Speaker 8: the world.

735
00:36:34,760 --> 00:36:36,400
Speaker 2: Why is US still top of mind for you?

736
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:40,200
Speaker 18: Well, because from our center pint of view, we see

737
00:36:40,239 --> 00:36:45,120
Speaker 18: two big levers. First of all, wealth creation GDP growth innovations,

738
00:36:45,239 --> 00:36:49,239
Speaker 18: and also more indiosyncratic to UBS is that we see

739
00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:54,920
Speaker 18: potential for us to become more present increase our market share.

740
00:36:55,040 --> 00:36:57,839
Speaker 18: So that's one place. On the other end, we are

741
00:36:57,880 --> 00:37:00,960
Speaker 18: also very big in Asia. I mean we manage one

742
00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:03,279
Speaker 18: trillion of assets there. We are growing very fast, the

743
00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:07,600
Speaker 18: economy is growing. Half of the population in the world

744
00:37:07,800 --> 00:37:10,920
Speaker 18: is living there and is creating new wealth. But you

745
00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:13,879
Speaker 18: know in the America, in the US, by the way,

746
00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:19,400
Speaker 18: last year the US created twenty five millions of new millionaires,

747
00:37:19,520 --> 00:37:22,719
Speaker 18: so basically one thousand millionaires a day.

748
00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:25,239
Speaker 2: So it's a place.

749
00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:27,920
Speaker 18: For a financial institution, a wealth manager like UBS is

750
00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:28,480
Speaker 18: a place to be.

751
00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:30,120
Speaker 8: Let's talk about that. Is that something you want to

752
00:37:30,160 --> 00:37:31,920
Speaker 8: do organically or through an acquisition?

753
00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:34,000
Speaker 2: I think that we have enough to do.

754
00:37:35,960 --> 00:37:39,400
Speaker 18: Organically. By doing better what we can do, we are

755
00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:45,840
Speaker 18: enhancing our product capabilities. We just got a national charter

756
00:37:46,800 --> 00:37:51,759
Speaker 18: application being approved by the OCC. We are expanding our

757
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:56,200
Speaker 18: interaction between the investment bank and our wealth management people

758
00:37:56,280 --> 00:37:59,480
Speaker 18: so I think that more things we can do to

759
00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:00,920
Speaker 18: get better and stronger.

760
00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:02,799
Speaker 8: It sounds like you're on the front foot at the

761
00:38:02,840 --> 00:38:04,800
Speaker 8: same time as the bousering behind me. I'm reminded of

762
00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:07,640
Speaker 8: where we are Switzerland and the issues on the horizon

763
00:38:07,640 --> 00:38:10,920
Speaker 8: potentially for the bank, and that's capital requirements. That feels

764
00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:12,839
Speaker 8: like a cloud that's hanging over this bank right now.

765
00:38:12,840 --> 00:38:14,440
Speaker 8: How quickly do you think we can resolve it?

766
00:38:16,239 --> 00:38:20,000
Speaker 18: Not quickly. I think it's a political process. Most likely

767
00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:22,520
Speaker 18: we're going to find out the direction of travel that

768
00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:26,160
Speaker 18: you know, in the middle of the second quarter, and

769
00:38:26,200 --> 00:38:29,360
Speaker 18: then it's still a political process. But you're right that

770
00:38:29,480 --> 00:38:34,319
Speaker 18: this is something that has been quite distracting for us.

771
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:37,400
Speaker 18: Although we have been quite successful in managing the integration

772
00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:41,239
Speaker 18: of Predy. Swiss is almost completed. We are almost you know,

773
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:45,600
Speaker 18: three months ago, and then the vast majority of the

774
00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:48,640
Speaker 18: job is done. So but we look forward for our

775
00:38:48,640 --> 00:38:50,160
Speaker 18: resolution also, I'm.

776
00:38:50,040 --> 00:38:50,440
Speaker 2: Sure you do.

777
00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:53,120
Speaker 8: From the strategic standpoint, How is it holding you back?

778
00:38:53,160 --> 00:38:55,160
Speaker 8: How is it distracting you? What are you prevented from

779
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:57,080
Speaker 8: doing that you would like to do right now.

780
00:38:57,000 --> 00:38:59,520
Speaker 18: At this point in time, To be sure, nothing, because

781
00:38:59,600 --> 00:39:03,480
Speaker 18: you know, executing the integration is the top priority. We

782
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:06,920
Speaker 18: cannot be complacent. Although ninety eighty five percent is done,

783
00:39:07,800 --> 00:39:11,799
Speaker 18: the last fifteen percent is as important. We still need

784
00:39:11,840 --> 00:39:16,279
Speaker 18: to take out three billion of costs and finalize the

785
00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:20,440
Speaker 18: restructuring and then we can we are prepared for growth,

786
00:39:20,640 --> 00:39:23,040
Speaker 18: and that's the reason why we are investing top line

787
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:27,520
Speaker 18: but also in efficiencies AI and how we can become

788
00:39:27,920 --> 00:39:28,840
Speaker 18: better and stronger.

789
00:39:28,960 --> 00:39:31,480
Speaker 8: Where did the cost come out? You satisfied with the

790
00:39:31,520 --> 00:39:33,400
Speaker 8: size of the workforce. There's money to be done on

791
00:39:33,400 --> 00:39:33,920
Speaker 8: that side of.

792
00:39:33,840 --> 00:39:37,200
Speaker 18: Well, there is still unfortunately that's the more. You know,

793
00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:39,480
Speaker 18: a big chunk of the savings are going to come

794
00:39:39,520 --> 00:39:45,840
Speaker 18: by disconnecting all the A systems, data centers, and but

795
00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:48,319
Speaker 18: also there is a you know also a painful still

796
00:39:48,440 --> 00:39:52,040
Speaker 18: part on the account. But it's within what we always announced.

797
00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:56,520
Speaker 18: So you know, I think the direction of travel is said.

798
00:39:56,680 --> 00:39:58,640
Speaker 8: This is the top of the to do list for you,

799
00:39:58,840 --> 00:40:00,640
Speaker 8: and then someone else is going to step in.

800
00:40:00,760 --> 00:40:01,280
Speaker 2: Eventually.

801
00:40:01,520 --> 00:40:04,000
Speaker 8: You've offered your thought about where that someone might come from,

802
00:40:04,239 --> 00:40:06,640
Speaker 8: that you'd like to see them come from internally, from

803
00:40:06,680 --> 00:40:09,800
Speaker 8: within the bank, you open to someone coming from the outside.

804
00:40:10,120 --> 00:40:11,800
Speaker 18: Well, we always need to be open. I think that

805
00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:14,680
Speaker 18: the board is not you know, my job is to

806
00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:19,600
Speaker 18: is to prepare and to present to the board as

807
00:40:19,680 --> 00:40:23,600
Speaker 18: many candidate possible for internally, and the role of the

808
00:40:23,640 --> 00:40:26,880
Speaker 18: board is to also evaluate external candidates and find the

809
00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:29,799
Speaker 18: best solution for the future. But I would say the

810
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:32,239
Speaker 18: bank is very strong, My team is very strong, and

811
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:36,680
Speaker 18: I do believe that you know, an evolution is what

812
00:40:36,760 --> 00:40:39,279
Speaker 18: we need. Is probably not a revolution, but you know,

813
00:40:39,440 --> 00:40:40,640
Speaker 18: it all depends.

814
00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:41,760
Speaker 2: What's the timeline for that process.

815
00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:43,359
Speaker 8: Now, can you give us an idea or what point

816
00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:46,719
Speaker 8: do you present your ideas about who might succeed you?

817
00:40:47,080 --> 00:40:50,359
Speaker 18: Well, we always every year I present ideas, and you

818
00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:54,920
Speaker 18: know a succession. Succession is not a process that you do,

819
00:40:55,320 --> 00:41:00,719
Speaker 18: you know, only a few months or years before somebody leaves.

820
00:41:00,760 --> 00:41:04,399
Speaker 18: A succession is somebody that we manage every year. And

821
00:41:05,360 --> 00:41:07,560
Speaker 18: from my Iceland point of view, we need to be just

822
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:10,600
Speaker 18: prepared to have the best person for that moment.

823
00:41:10,719 --> 00:41:13,239
Speaker 8: When that person is selected, there is another seat that

824
00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:14,120
Speaker 8: might open.

825
00:41:14,320 --> 00:41:16,000
Speaker 2: And it's the chairperson's seat.

826
00:41:16,040 --> 00:41:18,440
Speaker 8: And I just wonder when you step aside a CEO,

827
00:41:18,520 --> 00:41:20,960
Speaker 8: as the chapter truly closed for you and the bank.

828
00:41:21,600 --> 00:41:23,640
Speaker 18: Well, look, you know, right now I am very focused

829
00:41:23,680 --> 00:41:26,680
Speaker 18: on finishing my job honestly, I think this is still

830
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:32,239
Speaker 18: very intense activity and then it's going to be you know,

831
00:41:32,280 --> 00:41:33,000
Speaker 18: I need to reflect.

832
00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:35,759
Speaker 8: You realize people watching this won't really believe that, well,

833
00:41:36,200 --> 00:41:39,120
Speaker 8: you are a human being. You were thinking about the

834
00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:40,680
Speaker 8: future and what comes next.

835
00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:43,600
Speaker 18: But people watching there are not expecting me to respond.

836
00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:46,359
Speaker 8: That is true as well, particularly this gentleman right here

837
00:41:47,040 --> 00:41:49,560
Speaker 8: who wants that response from you. Just a final question

838
00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:51,520
Speaker 8: from me. I believe you first took the job a

839
00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:54,279
Speaker 8: CEO back in twenty eleven. As you look back on things,

840
00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:55,759
Speaker 8: and I think this is the appropriate time to begin

841
00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:58,919
Speaker 8: to think about this. Your legacy at the bank. I'm

842
00:41:58,920 --> 00:42:00,680
Speaker 8: not sure you ever really thought that we'd end up

843
00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:04,680
Speaker 8: here integrating Credit Suite in the circumstances we did. But

844
00:42:04,760 --> 00:42:07,239
Speaker 8: how would you like your legacy to remembered as a

845
00:42:07,320 --> 00:42:08,880
Speaker 8: leader of UBS?

846
00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:13,320
Speaker 18: I was very proud. I mean, in a tragic moment

847
00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:15,759
Speaker 18: for Switzerland and for the banking industry, I was very

848
00:42:15,760 --> 00:42:18,479
Speaker 18: proud in twenty twenty three when I have two years

849
00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:21,120
Speaker 18: after I left that UBS was asked to step in

850
00:42:21,400 --> 00:42:25,479
Speaker 18: and stabilize and help stabilizing credit Swiss and being part

851
00:42:25,760 --> 00:42:28,400
Speaker 18: of the solution that was for me the you know,

852
00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:33,399
Speaker 18: almost reaching what I always thought I wanted to show

853
00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:37,520
Speaker 18: with our transformations in the first period. Right now, I

854
00:42:37,560 --> 00:42:40,359
Speaker 18: think that we have a solid bank, a stronger bank

855
00:42:40,400 --> 00:42:43,440
Speaker 18: than before, and I believe we are set for growth.

856
00:42:43,680 --> 00:42:46,440
Speaker 18: So the legacy is always to see that when you

857
00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:49,320
Speaker 18: leave after a couple of years, things are going even better.

858
00:42:49,719 --> 00:42:51,200
Speaker 8: So Jah, it's got to see it. Thanks for making

859
00:42:51,239 --> 00:42:52,919
Speaker 8: time for us. Thank you, We'll get you into the world.

860
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:56,960
Speaker 8: That was the UBS CEO Sergio Ramoti speaking with Bloomberg

861
00:42:57,040 --> 00:42:59,839
Speaker 8: Surveillance right here at the World Economic Forum.

862
00:43:00,280 --> 00:43:01,040
Speaker 2: I throw it back to you.

863
00:43:01,480 --> 00:43:02,560
Speaker 5: Extraordinary conversation.

864
00:43:02,880 --> 00:43:05,759
Speaker 4: As always, we thank you John Farrow there with Sergio al.

865
00:43:05,680 --> 00:43:07,000
Speaker 5: Marti of UBS.

866
00:43:07,239 --> 00:43:11,240
Speaker 4: Now sticking with Davos and Switzerland, we have Bloomberg's Emily Chang.

867
00:43:11,400 --> 00:43:14,040
Speaker 4: She sat down earlier with Demis hasarvis, A CEO of

868
00:43:14,040 --> 00:43:14,480
Speaker 4: Deep Mind.

869
00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:14,960
Speaker 5: Take listen.

870
00:43:16,320 --> 00:43:20,520
Speaker 17: It's been hard work, really hard work, getting our technology

871
00:43:20,719 --> 00:43:23,200
Speaker 17: and the models sort of to back to state of

872
00:43:23,239 --> 00:43:25,759
Speaker 17: the art. I think we did that with Gemini three

873
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:30,719
Speaker 17: especially and Nana Banana our imaging software, and then I

874
00:43:30,760 --> 00:43:33,319
Speaker 17: think we've also sort of adapted really to this new

875
00:43:33,360 --> 00:43:36,239
Speaker 17: world of shipping very fast, kind of bringing a kind

876
00:43:36,239 --> 00:43:37,960
Speaker 17: of startup energy to what we do.

877
00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:41,120
Speaker 10: Do you think people underestimated Google or got something wrong?

878
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:43,160
Speaker 17: Yes, maybe, I'm not sure. I mean I think we

879
00:43:43,200 --> 00:43:47,120
Speaker 17: always had the ingredients, you know, to be at the

880
00:43:47,120 --> 00:43:50,359
Speaker 17: forefront of this. Obviously, we've got the long history in it.

881
00:43:50,680 --> 00:43:53,319
Speaker 17: I think, you know, over the last decade, Google and

882
00:43:53,360 --> 00:43:56,319
Speaker 17: deep Mind, between us, we've invented most of the breakthroughs

883
00:43:56,360 --> 00:43:59,560
Speaker 17: that the modern AI industry relies on now. Obviously Transformers,

884
00:43:59,600 --> 00:44:02,680
Speaker 17: most Familee, but Alpha go deep reinforcement learning these things,

885
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:06,560
Speaker 17: and we have these incredible product surfaces, billions of users

886
00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:10,440
Speaker 17: services that are natural fits for AI actually, from search

887
00:44:10,560 --> 00:44:11,680
Speaker 17: to email to.

888
00:44:13,160 --> 00:44:13,480
Speaker 12: Chrome.

889
00:44:14,560 --> 00:44:18,400
Speaker 17: But it's just getting all of that together and organized

890
00:44:18,400 --> 00:44:19,880
Speaker 17: in the right way. And I think we've done that

891
00:44:19,920 --> 00:44:21,719
Speaker 17: in the last couple of years, and there's still a

892
00:44:21,760 --> 00:44:23,280
Speaker 17: lot more work to do, but I think we're starting

893
00:44:23,320 --> 00:44:24,120
Speaker 17: to see the fruits of that.

894
00:44:24,360 --> 00:44:28,320
Speaker 10: A year ago, Deep Sea seemed cataclysmic for the worst.

895
00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:33,200
Speaker 10: Now a year later it's quite China seems you have

896
00:44:33,239 --> 00:44:37,240
Speaker 10: been quieter. Yes, has your opinion on competition from China changed?

897
00:44:37,640 --> 00:44:38,160
Speaker 2: Not really.

898
00:44:38,520 --> 00:44:40,320
Speaker 17: I mean I didn't think it was cataclysmic in the

899
00:44:40,320 --> 00:44:42,319
Speaker 17: first place. I think it was a massive overreaction in

900
00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:45,480
Speaker 17: the West it was impressive, and I think it shows

901
00:44:45,520 --> 00:44:49,920
Speaker 17: that the Chinese are very capable that the deleting companies.

902
00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:53,359
Speaker 17: I think companies like Buy Dance actually, I would say

903
00:44:53,680 --> 00:44:57,239
Speaker 17: are the most capable, and there may be only six

904
00:44:57,280 --> 00:44:59,879
Speaker 17: months behind, not one or two years behind the front

905
00:45:00,480 --> 00:45:02,680
Speaker 17: So I think that's what Deepseak showed. Some of the

906
00:45:02,719 --> 00:45:05,440
Speaker 17: claims were over exaggerated about you know, the amount of

907
00:45:05,440 --> 00:45:07,600
Speaker 17: compute they used and being so minimal and so on,

908
00:45:07,640 --> 00:45:11,200
Speaker 17: because they relied on some Western models and also fine

909
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:14,240
Speaker 17: tuning on the outputs of some of the leading Western models.

910
00:45:14,560 --> 00:45:17,719
Speaker 17: So it wasn't sort of Denovo. And the other thing

911
00:45:17,760 --> 00:45:19,640
Speaker 17: I think so far as not you know, yet to

912
00:45:19,640 --> 00:45:23,520
Speaker 17: be seen, is can China actually the Chinese companies innovate

913
00:45:23,600 --> 00:45:25,120
Speaker 17: beyond the frontier themselves.

914
00:45:27,800 --> 00:45:30,840
Speaker 3: That was Deep Mind CEO Demis Hasavis there along with

915
00:45:30,880 --> 00:45:34,000
Speaker 3: Bloomberg's Emily Chang, and that does it for this edition

916
00:45:34,520 --> 00:45:37,200
Speaker 3: of Bloomberg Tech Netflix Reporting After the Bell.

917
00:45:37,320 --> 00:45:39,160
Speaker 2: That's kind of the big one we're looking.

918
00:45:38,960 --> 00:45:42,520
Speaker 3: For both because of what we're waiting on more information

919
00:45:42,680 --> 00:45:45,840
Speaker 3: about this amended offer Caro for Warner Brothers Discovery to

920
00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:48,359
Speaker 3: an all cash deal. But as Geta Rang and Nathan

921
00:45:48,400 --> 00:45:50,719
Speaker 3: of Bloomberg Intelligence put it to us, we want to

922
00:45:50,719 --> 00:45:52,359
Speaker 3: know what's going to happen in twenty twenty six.

923
00:45:52,480 --> 00:45:53,319
Speaker 5: Yeah, we want to know if.

924
00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:56,000
Speaker 4: It can deliver on thirteen percent growth in revenue, where

925
00:45:56,000 --> 00:45:58,720
Speaker 4: they can still hit the levels of fifty to fifty

926
00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:00,560
Speaker 4: one billion dollars in revenue per year.

927
00:46:00,880 --> 00:46:01,200
Speaker 2: Quiz.

928
00:46:01,200 --> 00:46:03,480
Speaker 4: Look, with this all cash bid doesn't drive up their

929
00:46:03,560 --> 00:46:07,080
Speaker 4: leverage much, but does sure put the pressure on paramounts

930
00:46:07,080 --> 00:46:09,600
Speaker 4: guidance as well. So all eyes on that deal, on

931
00:46:09,640 --> 00:46:11,640
Speaker 4: those earnings, and don't forget to check out our podcast

932
00:46:11,640 --> 00:46:13,040
Speaker 4: of course, find it on the terminal as well as

933
00:46:13,080 --> 00:46:16,160
Speaker 4: online on Apples, Spotify, and iHeart to just reimagine all

934
00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:17,920
Speaker 4: the conversations I've been having at Davos ed.

935
00:46:18,160 --> 00:46:19,480
Speaker 5: There's a lot going on this week.

936
00:46:20,280 --> 00:46:23,719
Speaker 3: There is an earning start in Earnest Netflix today, and

937
00:46:23,760 --> 00:46:26,239
Speaker 3: then we brace for what's to come over the next

938
00:46:26,320 --> 00:46:27,040
Speaker 3: couple of weeks.

939
00:46:27,600 --> 00:46:28,560
Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Tech