Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Law with June Grassoe from Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 1: The protests were allowed at an abortion rights rally outside
Speaker 1: the Supreme Court on Wednesday, as the Justice has heard
Speaker 1: arguments in the court's first abortion case in four years.
Speaker 1: Sin A minority leader, Chuck Schumer had these words for
Speaker 1: the two newest members of the Court. I want to
Speaker 1: tell you. I want to tell you, Kavanaugh, you have
Speaker 1: released the whirlwind and you will pay the price. You
Speaker 1: won't know what hit you if you go forward with
Speaker 1: these awful decisions. That led Chief Justice John Roberts to
Speaker 1: deliver an extraordinary rebuke of Schumer, chastising him from making
Speaker 1: threatening statements that quote are not only inappropriate, they are dangerous.
Speaker 1: Joining me is Carl Tobias, a professor at the University
Speaker 1: of Richmond Law School. Call first, let me get your
Speaker 1: take on whether Schumer's comments were inappropriate. Well, actually, there
Speaker 1: was an exchange this morning on the Senate floor and
Speaker 1: a senator Schumer apologized basically for his comments and saying
Speaker 1: he didn't intend to be threatening the justices in any way.
Speaker 1: But I think he was caught up in the rhetoric
Speaker 1: of the moment when it was highly charged and regretted it.
Speaker 1: He also said something about Brooklyn, and we talked tough
Speaker 1: in Brooklyn, and so I think he's tried to walk
Speaker 1: back and say he really wasn't in any way threatening justices,
Speaker 1: though Leader McConnell blasted him for fifteen minutes on the floor,
Speaker 1: apparently talking about Schumer and other Democrats undermining the institution
Speaker 1: of the Senate, which is ludicrous coming from the majority leader,
Speaker 1: given what he's done to the institutions of the Senate
Speaker 1: since he became the majority leader. So it just seems
Speaker 1: like there's a lot of rhetoric on all sides and
Speaker 1: they need to tone that down. But much of this
Speaker 1: has been triggered, of course, by the attacks on judicial
Speaker 1: independence by the President of the United States and the
Speaker 1: failure of judges to speak up about that since it
Speaker 1: started at the time of the campaign in twenty six
Speaker 1: and has continued, including I think last night he weighed
Speaker 1: in on Twitter, as you referred to. In the last
Speaker 1: year alone, Trump has attacked the integrity of the federal
Speaker 1: judiciary in general and targeted individual judges, including the judge
Speaker 1: and the Roger Stone case repeatedly criticized to liberal female
Speaker 1: Supreme Court Justice is last week one for a dissenting
Speaker 1: opinion which he misinterpreted. The Chief said nothing during all
Speaker 1: that time. So does this look to the general public
Speaker 1: like selective outrage. Well, that's a good question. And he
Speaker 1: did speak up if you remember Thanksgiving eighteen about the
Speaker 1: constant criticism from Trump about Obama judges and made a
Speaker 1: relatively strong statement at that time. But the attacks that
Speaker 1: have gone on from the President, but generally as to
Speaker 1: the courts and then more specifically as to judges like
Speaker 1: Amy Berman Jackson handling the Roger Stone case and many
Speaker 1: other judges, especially on the Ninth Circuit, and judges who
Speaker 1: rule against him, and the rhetoric all the way around
Speaker 1: on to be toned down. But it's important for the
Speaker 1: Chief Justice to speak out and defend judicial independence and
Speaker 1: an even handed, thoughtful and careful way. And I think
Speaker 1: people have been concerned that he hasn't spoken out enough
Speaker 1: about the president's attacks on the federal judiciary because that
Speaker 1: undermines respect for the judiciary and that absolutely needs to
Speaker 1: be protected. The courts don't have either sword or the purse,
Speaker 1: and they need to be sure that the public were
Speaker 1: respects their rulings, and so everybody needs to work on
Speaker 1: judicial independence and making sure that it's a paramount. It
Speaker 1: also seems stark because Trump just recently attacked Justice Ruth
Speaker 1: Bader Ginsburg and Justice Sonya so To Mayor and told
Speaker 1: them that they should recuse themselves in any case related
Speaker 1: to him. So I had expected the Chief to speak
Speaker 1: up then, Well, I think a lot of people did.
Speaker 1: It may be unfortunate that he didn't. Of course, the
Speaker 1: President didn't understand what he was saying about recusal or
Speaker 1: how that works, and there was no basis really for
Speaker 1: asking them to recuse. In fact, what Justice Soto Mayor
Speaker 1: said in her descent didn't speak in any way to
Speaker 1: the President. It spoke partly to the way the government
Speaker 1: has incessantly raced to the court to stay these lower
Speaker 1: court rulings. That the President doesn't lie and was just
Speaker 1: speaking to the court itself and how it should handle
Speaker 1: those emergency requests which are accelerating with ever more vehemence
Speaker 1: from the Solicitor General's Office, principally in the Justice Department.
Speaker 1: In this day of extremes, where is the line between
Speaker 1: correct criticism of opinions and attacks on the judiciary. Well,
Speaker 1: I think it's important to not have personal attacks on
Speaker 1: particular judges or even particular courts. But it's certainly appropriate
Speaker 1: to analyze and criticize the opinions that judges and justices
Speaker 1: right on their merits and show why you believe that
Speaker 1: they're inappropriate, incorrectly decided, or whatever your view is about that,
Speaker 1: but not to attack them personally or to suggest that
Speaker 1: they have some hidden agenda or our only politicians in
Speaker 1: robes those kinds of criticisms. But sometimes people are very
Speaker 1: exercised about particular issues and they say more than probably
Speaker 1: it is appropriate. Thanks Carl. That's Carl Tobias of the
Speaker 1: University of Richmond Law School. Thanks for listening to the
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Law Podcast. You can subscribe and listen to the
Speaker 1: show on Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud, and on Bloomberg dot com
Speaker 1: slash podcast. I'm June Brosso. This is Bloomberg