1 00:00:11,840 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and welcome to Okay f Daily with 2 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:18,640 Speaker 1: Meet your Girl Danielle Moody, recording once again from the Bunker. 3 00:00:19,560 --> 00:00:22,400 Speaker 1: You know, folks, I will say this that so far, 4 00:00:22,840 --> 00:00:27,240 Speaker 1: I believe that the j six Commission is doing an 5 00:00:27,240 --> 00:00:36,880 Speaker 1: incredible job. I think that they have compiled such a fascinating, layered, 6 00:00:37,320 --> 00:00:43,640 Speaker 1: eye opening, jaw dropping case that I've ever seen. The 7 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:49,560 Speaker 1: way in which this last hearing laid bare and shocked 8 00:00:49,600 --> 00:00:51,280 Speaker 1: the shit out of me, As you'll hear in my 9 00:00:51,520 --> 00:00:55,760 Speaker 1: upcoming interview with our friend Glenn Kirshner. You know, this 10 00:00:55,960 --> 00:00:59,880 Speaker 1: entire time that we've been talking about the insurrection, talk 11 00:01:00,120 --> 00:01:04,480 Speaker 1: about this white domestic terrorist mob that overtook our Capitol building, 12 00:01:04,520 --> 00:01:08,400 Speaker 1: that killed police officers, beat them, cursed them, you know, 13 00:01:08,600 --> 00:01:13,840 Speaker 1: destroyed property at the behest of Donald Trump. In my mind, 14 00:01:14,240 --> 00:01:17,480 Speaker 1: I'd been thinking that, you know, these people, they don't 15 00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:21,240 Speaker 1: believe in democracy. They just want authoritarianism and fascism, and 16 00:01:21,319 --> 00:01:24,480 Speaker 1: that's why they went to the Capitol building. But then 17 00:01:25,319 --> 00:01:31,039 Speaker 1: the third hearing and I had a lightbulb moment because 18 00:01:31,040 --> 00:01:34,560 Speaker 1: the third hearing was all about the fact that Donald 19 00:01:34,560 --> 00:01:40,240 Speaker 1: Trump wanted to cause harm to his vice president. Donald 20 00:01:40,240 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 1: Trump sent that mob to the Capitol Building not to 21 00:01:44,640 --> 00:01:50,640 Speaker 1: just disrupt quote unquote the vote count, No, the certification, 22 00:01:50,720 --> 00:01:55,760 Speaker 1: excuse me of the election. No, No, he sent them 23 00:01:55,760 --> 00:02:01,480 Speaker 1: to the Capitol Building to disrupt his vice president by 24 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:06,760 Speaker 1: any means necessary. When you hear that Donald Trump, as 25 00:02:06,840 --> 00:02:12,480 Speaker 1: his goons were saying, hang Mike Pence, that his reaction 26 00:02:12,560 --> 00:02:17,200 Speaker 1: to that was maybe they should. And hearing that, Mark 27 00:02:17,280 --> 00:02:20,800 Speaker 1: Meadows then walks out of the office all fucking shook, 28 00:02:20,880 --> 00:02:22,640 Speaker 1: as if he didn't know who the fuck he was 29 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:25,120 Speaker 1: dealing with, that he didn't know Donald Trump as a mobster, 30 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:28,200 Speaker 1: that he didn't know that he wants power for power's sake, 31 00:02:28,480 --> 00:02:32,200 Speaker 1: and that like the rule of law, murder, whatever it 32 00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:34,920 Speaker 1: is that you need to do in order to hold 33 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:37,560 Speaker 1: on to that power, this motherfucker was willing to do 34 00:02:37,919 --> 00:02:44,400 Speaker 1: so for me. I'm like, oh shit. This mob scene 35 00:02:45,160 --> 00:02:50,600 Speaker 1: outside and inside of the Capitol Building wasn't just about 36 00:02:52,360 --> 00:02:59,680 Speaker 1: stopping Congress from certification. It was particularly targeted at stopping 37 00:02:59,720 --> 00:03:05,000 Speaker 1: Mike Pence because Mike Pence had finally declared that one 38 00:03:05,160 --> 00:03:09,080 Speaker 1: person was not going to hand over the presidency to 39 00:03:09,200 --> 00:03:12,639 Speaker 1: another person, that that is not how America works, it's 40 00:03:12,680 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: not how democracy worked, and that he knew, much like 41 00:03:16,320 --> 00:03:19,360 Speaker 1: fucking Donald Trump knew and everybody around him knew that 42 00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:25,079 Speaker 1: this motherfucker lost the election. Right, so you lost the election. 43 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:29,880 Speaker 1: You've tried every which way until this moment in order 44 00:03:29,919 --> 00:03:33,560 Speaker 1: to get these votes thrown out. Do these motherfucking recounts? 45 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:35,920 Speaker 1: And what did everybody tell you that when we're talking 46 00:03:35,960 --> 00:03:39,960 Speaker 1: about recounts, you're talking about hundreds of votes, not making 47 00:03:40,080 --> 00:03:47,120 Speaker 1: up ten thousand plus. That just doesn't happen. So in hindsight, 48 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:50,400 Speaker 1: now I'm sitting back and I'm like, this motherfucker tried 49 00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:56,960 Speaker 1: to kill you, and you ain't say boo. The fact 50 00:03:57,320 --> 00:04:02,160 Speaker 1: that Mike Pence didn't want to get into the car 51 00:04:02,320 --> 00:04:04,440 Speaker 1: for a couple of reasons, and this is the thing 52 00:04:04,480 --> 00:04:08,320 Speaker 1: that I really hope gets unpacked at some point. Mike 53 00:04:08,360 --> 00:04:11,200 Speaker 1: Pence didn't want to get into the car to take 54 00:04:11,280 --> 00:04:15,840 Speaker 1: him and his staff away to safety because One, he 55 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:18,960 Speaker 1: didn't want to have that image of the vice President 56 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:21,880 Speaker 1: of the United States fleeing the Capitol Building. So I 57 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:24,840 Speaker 1: get that, right, because that message that would have been 58 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:30,800 Speaker 1: sent there not great, not great. Two, he told his 59 00:04:30,839 --> 00:04:34,920 Speaker 1: own secret service person, I don't know who's driving that car, 60 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:41,360 Speaker 1: now what Glenn and I surmise and this conversation is 61 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:44,440 Speaker 1: that he knew exactly who was driving that car, right, 62 00:04:44,520 --> 00:04:46,440 Speaker 1: it's the same person that brought him there, and it's 63 00:04:46,440 --> 00:04:49,279 Speaker 1: probably the same person that drives him around all the time. 64 00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:52,599 Speaker 1: But what can be inferred from that statement is that 65 00:04:52,839 --> 00:04:55,760 Speaker 1: I don't know who's in charge. Am I going to 66 00:04:55,960 --> 00:04:58,840 Speaker 1: end up in somebody's alasco or am I going to 67 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:02,000 Speaker 1: end up, as Glenn will say later, in somebody's cement boots. 68 00:05:03,720 --> 00:05:08,719 Speaker 1: The fact of the matter is that the reality that 69 00:05:08,760 --> 00:05:12,680 Speaker 1: we're even having this conversation isn't just about how far 70 00:05:12,839 --> 00:05:16,440 Speaker 1: off the rails Donald Trump had gone. It's how far 71 00:05:16,520 --> 00:05:20,040 Speaker 1: off the rails Donald Trump has always been. And so 72 00:05:20,080 --> 00:05:22,680 Speaker 1: when these people had the audacity to say, well I 73 00:05:22,720 --> 00:05:25,760 Speaker 1: was on team normal and they were on team crazy, 74 00:05:26,160 --> 00:05:30,320 Speaker 1: We're like the rest of us are like, so, wait, 75 00:05:30,400 --> 00:05:33,159 Speaker 1: were you not around the entire four years? Because the 76 00:05:33,240 --> 00:05:37,960 Speaker 1: ship that you all were doing purposefully blowing up political 77 00:05:38,040 --> 00:05:42,880 Speaker 1: norms right like the way in which Donald Trump was 78 00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:48,520 Speaker 1: governing and admonishing staff via tweet, threatening nuclear war via tweet, 79 00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:53,320 Speaker 1: like talking about alternative facts? What part of fucking normal 80 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:56,760 Speaker 1: did you think that this was? You don't get to 81 00:05:56,920 --> 00:06:02,120 Speaker 1: rebrand yourself in the aftermath that we're still all fucking 82 00:06:02,200 --> 00:06:05,599 Speaker 1: spinning from talking about you were the grown up in 83 00:06:05,640 --> 00:06:11,320 Speaker 1: the room, bitch, when right, you'all were crazy. You got 84 00:06:11,360 --> 00:06:18,520 Speaker 1: behind a fucking TV reality host who everybody in New 85 00:06:18,600 --> 00:06:22,080 Speaker 1: York has known, has been a motherfucking drifter, right, A 86 00:06:22,160 --> 00:06:26,400 Speaker 1: liar and a cheat and a tax evader, a cheater 87 00:06:26,720 --> 00:06:33,280 Speaker 1: in multiple ways, right, a sexual assaulter, and just an 88 00:06:33,279 --> 00:06:37,160 Speaker 1: all around piece of shit human. You knew this and 89 00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:40,440 Speaker 1: you got on the Trump train because y'all want power, 90 00:06:40,520 --> 00:06:43,480 Speaker 1: and you believe in power for power's sake, not power 91 00:06:43,560 --> 00:06:46,719 Speaker 1: to do good, not power to do right, just power 92 00:06:46,760 --> 00:06:49,239 Speaker 1: to oppress and power to do harm. So don't talk 93 00:06:49,279 --> 00:06:53,320 Speaker 1: to us now after the fact, when you realize just 94 00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:55,880 Speaker 1: how far Donald Trump and company were willing to go 95 00:06:56,160 --> 00:06:58,720 Speaker 1: that now you want to catch yourself in the eleventh 96 00:06:58,760 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 1: hour talking about, oh, we were on team normal, bitch 97 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:05,880 Speaker 1: missed me with it, right, No one should be falling 98 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:08,479 Speaker 1: for that bullshit, just like the tap dance that William 99 00:07:08,520 --> 00:07:11,120 Speaker 1: Barr was doing in all of his interviews, talking about, 100 00:07:11,160 --> 00:07:13,920 Speaker 1: Oh this is bullshit and these people crazy. You got 101 00:07:13,960 --> 00:07:16,440 Speaker 1: on CBS Bill Barr and you said you didn't give 102 00:07:16,440 --> 00:07:19,960 Speaker 1: a fuck about your legacy. Right, you did all of 103 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:23,320 Speaker 1: Donald Trump's bidding, particularly what you should be going down 104 00:07:23,320 --> 00:07:26,080 Speaker 1: for what you won't because this Department of Justice just 105 00:07:26,080 --> 00:07:29,000 Speaker 1: don't got that teeth and that backbone and that swagger 106 00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:31,679 Speaker 1: to actually get shit done. But when Bill Barr stood 107 00:07:31,720 --> 00:07:34,120 Speaker 1: up before the American people and lied about the contents 108 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:36,880 Speaker 1: of the Malla Report, you showed us just how far 109 00:07:37,040 --> 00:07:39,360 Speaker 1: you were willing to go for trump Ism and the 110 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:41,760 Speaker 1: Trump train. So you don't get to turn around in 111 00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:44,560 Speaker 1: the eleventh that we're talking about. Oh that's why I left, bitch, 112 00:07:44,560 --> 00:07:46,760 Speaker 1: You left two weeks before the next president came in. 113 00:07:46,840 --> 00:07:52,960 Speaker 1: Shut up. I just you know the audacity, right, the 114 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:57,160 Speaker 1: audacity of these people to try and recharacterize themselves as 115 00:07:57,160 --> 00:08:02,840 Speaker 1: somebody's patriot, as somebody is like believer right of democracy 116 00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:05,720 Speaker 1: and the rule of law. Like, oh, that line seems 117 00:08:05,760 --> 00:08:08,840 Speaker 1: too far for you to break, bitch. You crossed at 118 00:08:08,920 --> 00:08:12,119 Speaker 1: least a thousand before we got to the insurrection point, 119 00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:15,720 Speaker 1: and all along you kept saying, no, that's good, that's good. 120 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:23,280 Speaker 1: So here we are, folks, halfway through, halfway through these 121 00:08:23,320 --> 00:08:26,680 Speaker 1: public hearings. We now know that the Department of Justice 122 00:08:26,760 --> 00:08:30,800 Speaker 1: has signaled once again and this time even more with 123 00:08:30,960 --> 00:08:34,680 Speaker 1: firmness that they want all the documents, They want the 124 00:08:34,720 --> 00:08:38,880 Speaker 1: transcripts to all the over one thousand interviews that the 125 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:42,400 Speaker 1: Sixth Commission has done over the past twelve months. And 126 00:08:42,440 --> 00:08:45,719 Speaker 1: my question is, why did you all wait? What were 127 00:08:45,720 --> 00:08:48,800 Speaker 1: you waiting for? You knew that we were having public 128 00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:51,840 Speaker 1: hearings in June, So I'm confused about why you're asking 129 00:08:51,840 --> 00:08:53,960 Speaker 1: for the motherfucking transcripts. Now, you could have asked for 130 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:56,120 Speaker 1: that ship back in January when we had hit the 131 00:08:56,200 --> 00:08:59,760 Speaker 1: year anniversary of the insurrection and the Department of Justice 132 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:02,600 Speaker 1: show no signs of doing that a fucking thing. And 133 00:09:02,880 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 1: at that time this Commission had already been working, so 134 00:09:09,280 --> 00:09:11,559 Speaker 1: we can say, oh, well, they didn't want perception in 135 00:09:11,640 --> 00:09:14,760 Speaker 1: this that the other thing. Perception is bullshit. We all 136 00:09:14,760 --> 00:09:16,760 Speaker 1: know Donald Trump as a criminal, and he's still walking 137 00:09:16,760 --> 00:09:19,319 Speaker 1: around on the streets. So why is it that we, 138 00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:22,560 Speaker 1: when going after criminals, have to make sure that we 139 00:09:22,679 --> 00:09:24,560 Speaker 1: got all our eyes and cross all of our teas. 140 00:09:25,320 --> 00:09:28,520 Speaker 1: I'm just confused by the dumble standard that we're all 141 00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:34,240 Speaker 1: the only ones living under. Nonetheless, coming up next, my 142 00:09:34,400 --> 00:09:39,199 Speaker 1: conversation with our friend Glenn Kirshner to unpack the latest 143 00:09:39,280 --> 00:09:42,920 Speaker 1: one six Insurrection hearing to discuss John Eastman and the 144 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:46,080 Speaker 1: fact that that motherfucker is headed to federal prison, and 145 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:49,079 Speaker 1: wondering whether or not anyone is going to subpoena Jinny 146 00:09:49,120 --> 00:09:52,680 Speaker 1: Thompson instead of peacefully and nicely requesting her to come 147 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:57,040 Speaker 1: before the committee and lie straight to our faces. That 148 00:09:57,400 --> 00:10:01,000 Speaker 1: and much more is coming up next. Get a behind 149 00:10:01,040 --> 00:10:03,600 Speaker 1: the scenes look at Comedy Central's The Daily Show on 150 00:10:03,840 --> 00:10:06,600 Speaker 1: Beyond the Scenes, an original podcast from The Daily Show 151 00:10:06,600 --> 00:10:09,400 Speaker 1: with Trevor Noah. Every week, host Roy Wood Junior goes 152 00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:11,840 Speaker 1: deeper with the notable guests and experts from the Emmy 153 00:10:11,880 --> 00:10:15,040 Speaker 1: Award winning series. Together, they use comedy to tackle current 154 00:10:15,080 --> 00:10:17,920 Speaker 1: topics from gentrification to gun laws and take a closer 155 00:10:17,920 --> 00:10:20,360 Speaker 1: look at how and why these topics matter. Listen to 156 00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:22,920 Speaker 1: Beyond the Scenes from The Daily Show with Trevor Noah 157 00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:25,920 Speaker 1: on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get 158 00:10:25,960 --> 00:10:39,680 Speaker 1: your podcast. 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If you like what you hear, be sure 173 00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:34,120 Speaker 1: to subscribe so you never miss an episode. Folks, each week, 174 00:11:34,120 --> 00:11:36,680 Speaker 1: whenever I get the opportunity to be joined by our 175 00:11:36,800 --> 00:11:40,720 Speaker 1: friend Glenn Kirshner, MSNBC Legal Analyst and the host of 176 00:11:40,800 --> 00:11:47,000 Speaker 1: Justice Matters to discuss the latest in legal news, I'm excited. 177 00:11:47,200 --> 00:11:50,320 Speaker 1: I'm excited this week, Glenn, for a couple of reasons. 178 00:11:51,160 --> 00:11:55,000 Speaker 1: We are now at the third installment of the one 179 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:58,240 Speaker 1: six Committee hearings. So far, I think that they have 180 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:01,160 Speaker 1: been doing a good job of their roll out. What 181 00:12:01,400 --> 00:12:03,960 Speaker 1: do you what, I want to get a sense of 182 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:08,760 Speaker 1: your feelings around the bombshells before we go into specifics 183 00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:14,400 Speaker 1: that were dropped in in this week's third installment. You know, 184 00:12:14,440 --> 00:12:19,560 Speaker 1: they keep sort of tightening the investigative circle around Donald Trump. 185 00:12:19,960 --> 00:12:25,560 Speaker 1: He has committed criminal acts. He has absolutely no argument 186 00:12:25,960 --> 00:12:29,679 Speaker 1: that he didn't have criminal intent when he was committing 187 00:12:30,000 --> 00:12:34,040 Speaker 1: those acts. They have wiped all of that away, and 188 00:12:34,160 --> 00:12:38,600 Speaker 1: now they went after his co conspirator, Don Eastman. And 189 00:12:38,679 --> 00:12:40,760 Speaker 1: you don't have to take my word for it that 190 00:12:40,880 --> 00:12:44,840 Speaker 1: John Eastman is a co conspirator of Donald Trump's because 191 00:12:44,840 --> 00:12:49,240 Speaker 1: of federal judge in California, David Carter, has ruled that 192 00:12:49,280 --> 00:12:53,160 Speaker 1: they acted together in a conspiracy to commit crimes against 193 00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:57,360 Speaker 1: the United States and to obstruct an official proceeding the 194 00:12:57,400 --> 00:13:03,240 Speaker 1: certification of Joe Biden's win. So I was still surprised 195 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:08,400 Speaker 1: at the nature of the incriminating evidence that they presented 196 00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:12,000 Speaker 1: about John Eastman. I mean, it's mind blowing that a 197 00:13:12,120 --> 00:13:17,720 Speaker 1: lawyer not only put together a treasonous memo setting out 198 00:13:17,960 --> 00:13:23,480 Speaker 1: how to orchestrate a coup, but he acknowledged in some 199 00:13:23,600 --> 00:13:26,319 Speaker 1: of his emails that, look, I know this is kind 200 00:13:26,360 --> 00:13:31,280 Speaker 1: of against the law, but just a little bit against 201 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:34,840 Speaker 1: the law, the Electoral count Act. And then I mean, 202 00:13:35,280 --> 00:13:39,520 Speaker 1: as if you thought it couldn't get any crazier. After 203 00:13:39,640 --> 00:13:43,680 Speaker 1: the riot, he said, look, can we just break the 204 00:13:43,760 --> 00:13:46,680 Speaker 1: law a little bit more? Because we ought to be 205 00:13:46,840 --> 00:13:50,120 Speaker 1: all in to kill our democracy. At this point, he 206 00:13:50,240 --> 00:13:56,040 Speaker 1: was undeterred by the violence that had unfolded at the Capitol. 207 00:13:56,200 --> 00:14:01,319 Speaker 1: He was still pushing the coup. And then to top 208 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:04,080 Speaker 1: it all off, he said, oh, by the way, I'm 209 00:14:04,080 --> 00:14:08,760 Speaker 1: really going to need a pardon. So that just screams 210 00:14:08,760 --> 00:14:12,640 Speaker 1: consciousness of guilt. He knows he committed a crime and 211 00:14:12,720 --> 00:14:16,040 Speaker 1: the only way he could get away with it is 212 00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:20,200 Speaker 1: if his corrupt co conspirator, Donald Trump issued him a 213 00:14:20,280 --> 00:14:28,120 Speaker 1: presidential pardon. John Eastman, will, I mean, he must be tried, convicted, 214 00:14:28,440 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 1: and end up in the Federal Bureau of Prisons. There's 215 00:14:32,040 --> 00:14:35,240 Speaker 1: just no two ways about it, after everything we've learned 216 00:14:35,440 --> 00:14:40,640 Speaker 1: about his conduct. You know, let's just clear up the obvious, right, 217 00:14:41,560 --> 00:14:45,320 Speaker 1: if I'm innocent, if I'm a person that is above board, 218 00:14:45,920 --> 00:14:49,320 Speaker 1: do I casually send out emails? Would you send out 219 00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:53,040 Speaker 1: an email that says, hey, that pardon parade still happening, 220 00:14:53,320 --> 00:14:56,760 Speaker 1: because I'd like to jump in. Is that something, Glenn, 221 00:14:56,840 --> 00:15:01,200 Speaker 1: as a thirty year federal prosecutor, that you would ever 222 00:15:01,480 --> 00:15:05,160 Speaker 1: just happen in your breast pocket be walking around with 223 00:15:05,200 --> 00:15:10,560 Speaker 1: a presidential pardon just in case. No, only people who 224 00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:16,200 Speaker 1: believe they've committed crimes request pardons, And the Supreme Court 225 00:15:16,240 --> 00:15:21,800 Speaker 1: has said that offering a pardon is some indication that 226 00:15:21,880 --> 00:15:25,920 Speaker 1: the person committed a crime, and accepting a pardon is 227 00:15:26,080 --> 00:15:31,080 Speaker 1: some admission of guilt by the pardon recipient. Now, those 228 00:15:31,200 --> 00:15:34,800 Speaker 1: principles haven't been tested all that directly in court, but 229 00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:37,880 Speaker 1: let me tell you not to get sidetracked. If New 230 00:15:37,960 --> 00:15:43,040 Speaker 1: York State prosecutes Steve Bannon for the state crimes that 231 00:15:43,160 --> 00:15:47,080 Speaker 1: arose from his bogus we build the Wall scheme by 232 00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:50,240 Speaker 1: which he stole money from Donald Trump supporters, Donald Trump 233 00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:54,720 Speaker 1: pardoned him federally. If I were the prosecutor, you bet 234 00:15:54,800 --> 00:15:58,560 Speaker 1: I would introduce that pardon as evidence that Steve Bannon 235 00:15:59,040 --> 00:16:02,960 Speaker 1: knew he committed and because he accepted that pardon, that 236 00:16:03,160 --> 00:16:06,560 Speaker 1: equals an admission of guilt, and let the judges sort 237 00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:10,400 Speaker 1: that out. But you absolutely have to start making these 238 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:13,200 Speaker 1: arguments in the court. So let me tell you what 239 00:16:13,240 --> 00:16:15,840 Speaker 1: I thought was the most interesting thing that came out 240 00:16:15,920 --> 00:16:20,480 Speaker 1: of the third hearing. It hadn't occurred to me, Glenn, 241 00:16:20,560 --> 00:16:23,040 Speaker 1: and you and I've been talking now for god like 242 00:16:23,080 --> 00:16:26,680 Speaker 1: two years, right like every week, and it had really 243 00:16:26,720 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 1: hadn't occurred to me until it was laid out by 244 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:33,520 Speaker 1: the Committee that Donald Trump really did send that mob 245 00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:38,160 Speaker 1: to attack his vice president. It wasn't in my mind. 246 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:41,080 Speaker 1: And tell me if it was illuminated for you, But 247 00:16:41,160 --> 00:16:44,080 Speaker 1: in my mind, I was just like, Oh, these people, 248 00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:49,360 Speaker 1: these mobsters, these terrorists, they're breaking in to our capital building. 249 00:16:49,520 --> 00:16:52,800 Speaker 1: They just want to ransack democracy. They want to you know, 250 00:16:53,200 --> 00:16:57,840 Speaker 1: they want to upset this election. But this is not 251 00:16:58,080 --> 00:17:02,520 Speaker 1: what the Committee drove home on with the third hearing. 252 00:17:03,240 --> 00:17:08,280 Speaker 1: It was really about expressly painting the picture that it 253 00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:13,080 Speaker 1: was Donald Trump who sent his legions of folks, including 254 00:17:13,080 --> 00:17:16,640 Speaker 1: the oath Keeper and Proud Boy militia, to go get 255 00:17:16,680 --> 00:17:21,680 Speaker 1: his vice president. That as the vice president was evacuated 256 00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:27,040 Speaker 1: into that bunker, Donald Trump was still tweeting that he 257 00:17:27,160 --> 00:17:30,640 Speaker 1: was weak, that he needed to stand up for his country. 258 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:34,800 Speaker 1: So it was that always illuminated for you? Or do you? 259 00:17:35,200 --> 00:17:40,400 Speaker 1: Was that brought to clearer a clearer picture after listening 260 00:17:40,400 --> 00:17:44,000 Speaker 1: to this hearing. I think it comes into sharper and 261 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:48,919 Speaker 1: sharper focus as we continue to learn more. You know, 262 00:17:48,960 --> 00:17:51,720 Speaker 1: I think one of the tipping points for me, Danielle 263 00:17:51,760 --> 00:17:55,320 Speaker 1: was when we heard the reporting as maybe some weeks ago, 264 00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:59,960 Speaker 1: that Mark Meadows came out of an Oval Office meeting 265 00:18:00,200 --> 00:18:03,240 Speaker 1: during the attack on the Capitol and he appeared to 266 00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:06,879 Speaker 1: be shaken and he said, you know, Trump just said 267 00:18:07,400 --> 00:18:10,760 Speaker 1: maybe Mike Pence should be hanged. And we're going to 268 00:18:10,840 --> 00:18:15,440 Speaker 1: hear more evidency. I think the investigative circle and the 269 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:19,199 Speaker 1: presentation of evidence continues to tighten around Trump because I 270 00:18:19,240 --> 00:18:21,639 Speaker 1: think what We're going to begin to hear are some 271 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:25,520 Speaker 1: of Trump's direct communications to his DOJ officials when he 272 00:18:25,560 --> 00:18:29,080 Speaker 1: tried to get them to weaponize the Department of Justice 273 00:18:29,119 --> 00:18:33,719 Speaker 1: to do his nefarious bidding. Then we're gonna hear about 274 00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:37,919 Speaker 1: statements he was making, an acts he was taking during 275 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:42,160 Speaker 1: the insurrection itself. We're going to see photographs, maybe even 276 00:18:42,200 --> 00:18:44,760 Speaker 1: here some recordings. I don't know, but I think the 277 00:18:44,840 --> 00:18:48,199 Speaker 1: circle tightens more and more and more and more. But 278 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:51,760 Speaker 1: when we heard that reporting that Donald Trump was angry, 279 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:54,680 Speaker 1: he was upset because Mike Pence was being whisked too 280 00:18:54,800 --> 00:18:58,479 Speaker 1: safety and then he said maybe Mike Pence should be hanged. 281 00:18:59,080 --> 00:19:01,000 Speaker 1: I also think we're going to get more about the 282 00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:05,520 Speaker 1: direct connection between the Proud Boys Oathkeepers, and the White 283 00:19:05,520 --> 00:19:09,360 Speaker 1: House and Trump. And I think those are still some 284 00:19:09,480 --> 00:19:13,479 Speaker 1: blockbuster revelations that are going to come, and you know, 285 00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:16,880 Speaker 1: there will be nothing left for the Department of Justice 286 00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:21,480 Speaker 1: to do but indict Eastman, Trump and the others. You know, 287 00:19:21,520 --> 00:19:23,320 Speaker 1: I got to tell the other thing that came up, 288 00:19:23,320 --> 00:19:28,240 Speaker 1: and I was watching the MSNBC kind of reflection, the 289 00:19:28,280 --> 00:19:31,639 Speaker 1: special reporting there after what you know, they're the big panel, 290 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:37,480 Speaker 1: and Nicole Wallace said something too that took me, took 291 00:19:37,520 --> 00:19:41,440 Speaker 1: me aback, and she said, Mike Pence told his secret 292 00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:45,560 Speaker 1: service person I believe his name is Tim, that he 293 00:19:45,640 --> 00:19:49,719 Speaker 1: wasn't getting in the car because he trusted that secret 294 00:19:49,800 --> 00:19:52,960 Speaker 1: service person. But he said, you're not driving the car. 295 00:19:54,119 --> 00:19:59,840 Speaker 1: We don't know if Mike Pence was afraid to being 296 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:06,520 Speaker 1: whisked away to Mars right, or something else a lot 297 00:20:06,560 --> 00:20:13,000 Speaker 1: more nefarious. What did you interpret from that as well? 298 00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:17,320 Speaker 1: So there are two ways we can interpret the statement 299 00:20:17,800 --> 00:20:21,840 Speaker 1: I don't know who's driving the car, because think about this, 300 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:27,520 Speaker 1: he actually probably did know was physically driving the car 301 00:20:27,720 --> 00:20:30,920 Speaker 1: in which he was transported to the Capitol and would 302 00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:34,080 Speaker 1: have been transported from the Capitol. I assume it would 303 00:20:34,119 --> 00:20:37,480 Speaker 1: have been part of his usual security detail. So when 304 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:41,119 Speaker 1: he said, look, I'm not leaving because I don't know 305 00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:43,359 Speaker 1: I don't know who's driving the car to me, that 306 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:46,520 Speaker 1: could also mean I don't know who's in control of 307 00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:50,399 Speaker 1: everything right now. And you know what, Trump may have 308 00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:53,760 Speaker 1: arranged to take me somewhere out in the meadowlands and 309 00:20:53,880 --> 00:20:56,919 Speaker 1: fit me for some cement shoes. I mean, yes, that 310 00:20:57,040 --> 00:21:02,359 Speaker 1: sounds hyperbolic, does it. But when the president says maybe 311 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:04,960 Speaker 1: he should be hanged, maybe my supporters got it right. 312 00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:08,240 Speaker 1: You know, he could have ended up in the metal lands. 313 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:13,760 Speaker 1: I you know, it is the picture that has painted 314 00:21:13,800 --> 00:21:18,919 Speaker 1: for me is just what a mobster Donald Trump is, 315 00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:23,840 Speaker 1: and that he was looking for anybody right that was 316 00:21:23,880 --> 00:21:27,199 Speaker 1: going to answer the call to how to get this 317 00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:31,399 Speaker 1: done by any means necessary. So you had this group 318 00:21:31,680 --> 00:21:35,919 Speaker 1: that wanted to dub themselves Team Normal, which there was 319 00:21:35,960 --> 00:21:40,280 Speaker 1: no actions that this administration took from the beginning until 320 00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:43,920 Speaker 1: the end that should have ever been deemed as normal. Right. 321 00:21:44,080 --> 00:21:47,080 Speaker 1: They broke every political norm that you could possibly ever 322 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:52,159 Speaker 1: think of. But then you had Team Coup, right, who 323 00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:57,359 Speaker 1: believed in their minds that they are somehow somebody's patriot, 324 00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:01,840 Speaker 1: that they're willing to take whatever is given so long 325 00:22:01,880 --> 00:22:05,639 Speaker 1: as they keep their person in power. And so what 326 00:22:05,800 --> 00:22:10,920 Speaker 1: does that say, Glenn about now? They're only halfway done. 327 00:22:10,960 --> 00:22:13,720 Speaker 1: The House Commission is only halfway done in terms of 328 00:22:13,760 --> 00:22:18,440 Speaker 1: the public hearings. The Department of Justice now has said, 329 00:22:18,480 --> 00:22:21,520 Speaker 1: in no uncertain terms, give us all of your documents 330 00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:27,119 Speaker 1: otherwise you're impeding. And a criminal investigation that was released 331 00:22:27,440 --> 00:22:30,359 Speaker 1: you know as well, what are these things add up 332 00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:34,680 Speaker 1: for you? And what should we be extracting from this 333 00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:37,760 Speaker 1: back and forth that we are seeing. So yeah, I've 334 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:41,960 Speaker 1: got the letter here from the Department of Justice to 335 00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:47,359 Speaker 1: Tim Heafy, one of my former RICO co council from 336 00:22:47,680 --> 00:22:51,040 Speaker 1: the US Attorney in DC, Matt Graves and Matt Olson, 337 00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:54,840 Speaker 1: who was also on the same RICO cases with Tim 338 00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:59,320 Speaker 1: and I. What I take away from this is a 339 00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:03,239 Speaker 1: couple of things. I think most importantly, The Department of 340 00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:07,080 Speaker 1: Justice is in the grand jury investigating the insurrection, and 341 00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:09,800 Speaker 1: they have been for a very long time. They make 342 00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:13,160 Speaker 1: clear in this letter something we all know, at least 343 00:23:13,160 --> 00:23:15,600 Speaker 1: those of us who come from the Department of Justice. 344 00:23:16,000 --> 00:23:19,600 Speaker 1: That because the grand jury proceedings are secret by law, 345 00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:23,919 Speaker 1: nobody knows what witnesses have gone into the grand jury. 346 00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:27,159 Speaker 1: But as the letter makes clear, there's obviously lots of 347 00:23:27,280 --> 00:23:32,040 Speaker 1: overlap between what DJ is investigating and what J six 348 00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:35,720 Speaker 1: is investigating and what THEOJ is saying. I actually see 349 00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:39,719 Speaker 1: this as a healthy back and forth between two coequal 350 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:45,520 Speaker 1: branches of government with both with both branches flexing their 351 00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:48,920 Speaker 1: coequal muscle. And I can tell you how I think 352 00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:51,080 Speaker 1: it ought to play out. But if I were in 353 00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:54,080 Speaker 1: the DJUL, I would be making this request too. I 354 00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:59,120 Speaker 1: would say, Look, we're gonna we're preparing to bring indictments, 355 00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:03,960 Speaker 1: but we can't really fully vet the information and the 356 00:24:04,119 --> 00:24:07,720 Speaker 1: testimony we're presenting to the grand jury from witnesses. If 357 00:24:07,760 --> 00:24:12,720 Speaker 1: those witnesses also gave sworn testimony to you J six committee, 358 00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:17,480 Speaker 1: we need it all before we're comfortable telling the grand jurors, okay, 359 00:24:17,760 --> 00:24:21,200 Speaker 1: indict these people. And that's what they're trying to do. 360 00:24:21,240 --> 00:24:24,800 Speaker 1: They want to collect up all of the sworn testimony 361 00:24:25,119 --> 00:24:29,119 Speaker 1: of relevant witnesses so they can have complete confidence in 362 00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:32,359 Speaker 1: their work product and what they're requesting the grand jury 363 00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:35,160 Speaker 1: to do. Think about it. If a witness went into 364 00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:37,680 Speaker 1: the grand jury and said one thing, but then there's 365 00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:42,280 Speaker 1: an inconsistent transcript over in the J six Committee that 366 00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:47,240 Speaker 1: could blow up a future prosecution. DJ is trying to 367 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:50,120 Speaker 1: do everything right and cross all its teas and dot 368 00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:52,560 Speaker 1: all its eyes. I will continue to complain that they've 369 00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:55,920 Speaker 1: taken far too long in my estimation seven time they're 370 00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:59,240 Speaker 1: doing they say, look, we have prosecutions up and running 371 00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:03,639 Speaker 1: that are being impacted by the very evidence we see 372 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:08,760 Speaker 1: unfolding in the public hearings. And the Department of Justice 373 00:25:08,840 --> 00:25:14,160 Speaker 1: also takes seriously its responsibility to collect up any information 374 00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:18,240 Speaker 1: that could be exculpatory to defendants, that could be helpful 375 00:25:18,280 --> 00:25:21,400 Speaker 1: to defendants. That's called the Brady doctrine. The Supreme Court 376 00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:24,120 Speaker 1: has said, if the government has evidence that could help 377 00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:30,680 Speaker 1: a defendant, exonerated defendant, impact a defendant sentence, then constitutionally 378 00:25:30,800 --> 00:25:33,959 Speaker 1: it must be given over. So I think they're also 379 00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:37,840 Speaker 1: trying to collect up what they can from Congress and 380 00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:41,680 Speaker 1: make sure that they satisfy their Brady obligations to all 381 00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:44,680 Speaker 1: of the defendants that they're prosecuting. Let me just add, 382 00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:46,600 Speaker 1: I don't want to make this a law school class 383 00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:50,600 Speaker 1: that the Brady doctrine generally only applies to the executive 384 00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:55,119 Speaker 1: branch because that's where the prosecutors and where law enforcement resides. 385 00:25:55,400 --> 00:25:59,560 Speaker 1: There are cases that say, well, if there's exculpatory evidence, 386 00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:02,280 Speaker 1: evidence that would help a defendant over there in the 387 00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:07,760 Speaker 1: legislative branch, the executive branch doesn't really possess it. So 388 00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:12,240 Speaker 1: Brady strictly speaking might not apply in full force, which 389 00:26:12,240 --> 00:26:14,119 Speaker 1: doesn't matter. I can tell you I come from a 390 00:26:14,119 --> 00:26:18,199 Speaker 1: culture of federal prosecutors where if we knew there was 391 00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:21,160 Speaker 1: something that could help a defendant, we're giving it over 392 00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:22,840 Speaker 1: because we don't want to. I don't want to be 393 00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:26,520 Speaker 1: involved in convicting somebody like Senator Ted Stevens, only to 394 00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:31,520 Speaker 1: have the appellate court overturn that conviction because prosecutors didn't 395 00:26:31,520 --> 00:26:34,640 Speaker 1: give over the Brady evidence. So I think that's another 396 00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:37,639 Speaker 1: piece of what's going on here. Why do you think, though, 397 00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:41,920 Speaker 1: that it took them so long? Glenn, the Department of Justice, 398 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:46,920 Speaker 1: So why did they wait until here? We are in June. 399 00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:49,520 Speaker 1: We knew, we all knew that the public hearings were 400 00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:52,880 Speaker 1: starting in June. Why would they wait until this time 401 00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:58,600 Speaker 1: to ask when this investigation by the Commission has been 402 00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:02,520 Speaker 1: going on for a year. I don't know the answer 403 00:27:02,560 --> 00:27:06,080 Speaker 1: to that, but here's one of my one of my 404 00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:10,520 Speaker 1: thoughts about it is the Department of Justice, the executive branch, 405 00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:14,480 Speaker 1: and the J six Committee the legislative branch. I don't 406 00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:21,240 Speaker 1: think they wanted to be perceived as working together, as colluding, right, 407 00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:25,080 Speaker 1: because you have different branches of government with very different 408 00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:30,639 Speaker 1: mandates about what they're there and different authorities. Yep. And 409 00:27:30,680 --> 00:27:32,840 Speaker 1: I don't think anybody wanted to make it seem like 410 00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:37,000 Speaker 1: they're in cahoots they're working together, because that has implications 411 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:42,120 Speaker 1: because then there's a whole series of cases that say, 412 00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:44,840 Speaker 1: if you're a prosecutor or you're an FBI agent, and 413 00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:48,400 Speaker 1: you co opt somebody else to help you, well, then 414 00:27:48,440 --> 00:27:52,919 Speaker 1: that person becomes your agent and they then have to 415 00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:55,479 Speaker 1: follow every rule that you have to follow with respect 416 00:27:55,480 --> 00:27:58,320 Speaker 1: to the Fourth Amendment, Fifth Amendment, and sixth Amendment. So 417 00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:02,800 Speaker 1: I think they've wanted to remain separate to the extent feasible. 418 00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:06,280 Speaker 1: And now I think it's all coming home to roost 419 00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:09,480 Speaker 1: and they're like, Okay, we need those transcripts. If I'm 420 00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:12,600 Speaker 1: Betty Thompson, who I think has been doing a brilliant 421 00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:16,280 Speaker 1: job with all of this, I love the tandem of 422 00:28:16,560 --> 00:28:19,520 Speaker 1: Thompson and Chaney. I just I love it. I love 423 00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:23,000 Speaker 1: watching it. You know, every time there's a hearing, I 424 00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:27,760 Speaker 1: would probably say, this is our work product. We understand 425 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:30,880 Speaker 1: your interest in it, we understand your need for it, 426 00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:34,919 Speaker 1: and I assume you'll be subpoenaing it if you really 427 00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:38,360 Speaker 1: need it, because that will give them some legal that 428 00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:41,280 Speaker 1: will give Congress some legal cover to say, Okay, we 429 00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:45,480 Speaker 1: received the lawful subpoena for these transcripts. We've assessed it. 430 00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:49,240 Speaker 1: We don't think there's a legal infirmity or a challenge 431 00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:52,480 Speaker 1: we need to launch against it. So here you go. 432 00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:58,000 Speaker 1: That's how I can see this potentially playing out. So 433 00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:02,400 Speaker 1: I want to talk quickly too, because I want to 434 00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:04,320 Speaker 1: get to Jenny Thomas, but I need to stay on 435 00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:07,880 Speaker 1: Eastman for a second. Eastman. They play his video. Eastman 436 00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:10,640 Speaker 1: doesn't even get to the point. He gets to the 437 00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:12,920 Speaker 1: point where he's not even saying I plead the fifth, 438 00:29:12,920 --> 00:29:17,200 Speaker 1: because that's how often he's saying it. He's just saying fifth, fifth, fifth, 439 00:29:17,320 --> 00:29:24,400 Speaker 1: every other word. He's a lawyer, So how how does 440 00:29:24,440 --> 00:29:27,360 Speaker 1: this look Glenn? And does he do you believe that 441 00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:31,200 Speaker 1: he knows how this looks. Yeah, he'll beat this bart 442 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:33,840 Speaker 1: eventually as well he should be, and he will also 443 00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:36,760 Speaker 1: be prosecuted. In my estimation, I don't think there's any 444 00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:41,640 Speaker 1: avoiding that. But here's here's I really am fixated. Some 445 00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:45,960 Speaker 1: could claim on the pardons, and especially the secret pardons, 446 00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:48,600 Speaker 1: the pocket pardons, because we have so many data points now, 447 00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:53,920 Speaker 1: Danielle that inform my opinion that Donald Trump gave lots 448 00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:56,480 Speaker 1: of folks pardons that we don't yet know about it. 449 00:29:56,600 --> 00:30:02,520 Speaker 1: Here here's those data points we now know that. Jared 450 00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:06,280 Speaker 1: Kushner said, I had my nose buried in a pile 451 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:09,239 Speaker 1: of pardons trying to get them all out before the 452 00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:13,080 Speaker 1: end of my daddy in law's term. So I didn't 453 00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:15,800 Speaker 1: really care that Pat Sippoloni, the White House counsel, was 454 00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:20,120 Speaker 1: threatening to resign because my father in law was trampling 455 00:30:20,120 --> 00:30:22,800 Speaker 1: the constitution. I don't really care about that. I was 456 00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:26,000 Speaker 1: busy getting all these pardons out. One data pointment another 457 00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:30,000 Speaker 1: data point. Kelly an Conway in her book said Donald 458 00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:32,200 Speaker 1: Trump sidled up to her at the end of his 459 00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:34,520 Speaker 1: term and said, and I'm going to use her word, 460 00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:38,040 Speaker 1: I'm not being disrespectful. Hey, honey, you want to pardon. 461 00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:42,920 Speaker 1: Everybody needs one, and she reportedly said, mister President, do 462 00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:44,760 Speaker 1: you know something I don't. I don't think I've committed 463 00:30:44,760 --> 00:30:46,640 Speaker 1: a crime, so I don't think I need a pardon. 464 00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:50,280 Speaker 1: He's like, no, everybody needs one. So if that's not 465 00:30:50,400 --> 00:30:52,800 Speaker 1: if those aren't alternative facts, if we can believe what 466 00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:56,960 Speaker 1: Kelly and Conway put in her book, Donald Trump offered 467 00:30:56,960 --> 00:31:02,320 Speaker 1: her an unsolicited blanket hardened Danielle, do you really think 468 00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:05,160 Speaker 1: he didn't offer his kids pardons if he's offering it 469 00:31:05,200 --> 00:31:08,400 Speaker 1: to the likes of Kelly Ann. Here is another really 470 00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:13,000 Speaker 1: important data pointment. John Eastman, in an email requested a pardon, 471 00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:16,760 Speaker 1: and what we learned yesterday from the J six Committee 472 00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:19,120 Speaker 1: is he did not receive one, and I want to 473 00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:22,240 Speaker 1: know why. Well, what are the implications of that? Though? 474 00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:24,600 Speaker 1: He went before the J six Committee and as you 475 00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:26,800 Speaker 1: just said, I plead the fifth. I plead the fifth 476 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:30,280 Speaker 1: fifth fifth five five five five? Are we done? He 477 00:31:30,320 --> 00:31:33,080 Speaker 1: didn't have a pardon to protect him, so he had 478 00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:36,400 Speaker 1: to plead the fifth because his statements could have been 479 00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:39,680 Speaker 1: used against him as incriminating evidence. Who else went into 480 00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:45,680 Speaker 1: the grand jury? Don Junior, Ivanka, Jared Rudy none of 481 00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:50,240 Speaker 1: them pled the fifth They all testified. What does that 482 00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:55,040 Speaker 1: tell us? Can't we infer that they had the protection 483 00:31:55,120 --> 00:31:59,000 Speaker 1: of a pardon so they could testify, they couldn't plead 484 00:31:59,080 --> 00:32:03,440 Speaker 1: the fifth These are all data points that inform my 485 00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:06,520 Speaker 1: belief that Donald Trump has given a whole bunch of 486 00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:09,920 Speaker 1: folk pardons, and we will have to challenge those what 487 00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:15,000 Speaker 1: I believe are largely corruptly delivered pardons in the court 488 00:32:15,040 --> 00:32:17,840 Speaker 1: in the future. If he had given Eastman a pardon, 489 00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:20,800 Speaker 1: it would have been one co conspirator trying to pardon 490 00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:23,800 Speaker 1: another co conspirator. There's not a court in the world. 491 00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:27,160 Speaker 1: I don't care if Trump did appoint the federal judge 492 00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:30,480 Speaker 1: who would say, yes, that's a valid exercise of the 493 00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:36,240 Speaker 1: pardon power. Do you think that they can get Eastman 494 00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:40,480 Speaker 1: to flip on Trump? Yes. The reason I think that 495 00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:47,240 Speaker 1: is because Eastman absolutely knows that he is going to prison, 496 00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:50,960 Speaker 1: because it's not stupid, and we've all seen the evidence, 497 00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:53,360 Speaker 1: and even he said I need a pardon to keep 498 00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:56,800 Speaker 1: myself out of prison, and he wasn't given one. The 499 00:32:56,840 --> 00:32:59,520 Speaker 1: only way out for him, and it shouldn't keep him 500 00:32:59,560 --> 00:33:02,120 Speaker 1: out of prison, and it should only reduce his sentence correct. 501 00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:05,360 Speaker 1: The only way out for him is to flip and cooperate. 502 00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:11,880 Speaker 1: If I'm Donald Trump, if you're Donald Trump, what's Donald 503 00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:16,000 Speaker 1: Trump doing right now? Still thinking that he has lived 504 00:33:16,040 --> 00:33:19,240 Speaker 1: such a charm life, He's committed crimes all his life 505 00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:23,920 Speaker 1: and never been held accountable. I think he thinks, yeah, 506 00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:26,040 Speaker 1: they're not going to touch me. I'm going to announce 507 00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:29,640 Speaker 1: very soon that I'm running for president, and the way 508 00:33:29,680 --> 00:33:31,960 Speaker 1: I read the system is that that's going to scare 509 00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:34,440 Speaker 1: everybody off, and they're going to continue to let me 510 00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:37,440 Speaker 1: run a muck. I think he's wrong about it, but 511 00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:41,200 Speaker 1: I have a feeling that's what's inside. That man's very 512 00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:51,280 Speaker 1: very sociopathic, narcissistic, you know, criminal mind. Yeah, last question, Glenn. 513 00:33:51,400 --> 00:33:56,640 Speaker 1: Jenny Thomas. Jenny Thomas is everyone's best supporting actress for 514 00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:59,800 Speaker 1: the Insurrection. Her name has come up just as much 515 00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:02,920 Speaker 1: as Mark Meadows, just as much as Eastman, just as 516 00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:06,360 Speaker 1: much as any of the cast of criminal characters in 517 00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:12,200 Speaker 1: this play. Jenny Thomas says that she's happy to sit 518 00:34:12,280 --> 00:34:16,600 Speaker 1: down with the J Six Commission so that she can 519 00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:24,440 Speaker 1: clear up quote unquote misconceptions thoughts. Jenny Thomas ain't testifying. 520 00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:31,880 Speaker 1: If you take one of the former career prosecutors on 521 00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:36,319 Speaker 1: the J six investigative team. We've been seeing them some 522 00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:39,480 Speaker 1: during the course of the hearings, and these are folks 523 00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:43,120 Speaker 1: who know how to cross examine a witness, and you 524 00:34:43,280 --> 00:34:48,319 Speaker 1: unleash them to cross examine Jinny Thomas under oath. Let 525 00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:51,960 Speaker 1: me just read one thing she said to Mark Meadows 526 00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:56,040 Speaker 1: from a tweet she sent on November fifth, right after 527 00:34:56,160 --> 00:35:01,240 Speaker 1: Donald Trump corruptly declared that, frankly, I won this election, 528 00:35:01,560 --> 00:35:04,080 Speaker 1: even though every adult in the room told him, you 529 00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:06,839 Speaker 1: can't do this because you didn't win the election, other 530 00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:10,160 Speaker 1: than drunken Rudy, who said, Dad, just do it. Here's 531 00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:15,520 Speaker 1: what Jenny Thomas sent to Mark Meadows quote Biden crime 532 00:35:15,560 --> 00:35:21,480 Speaker 1: family and ballot fraud co conspirators, elected officials, bureaucrats, social 533 00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:27,560 Speaker 1: media censorship mongers, fake stream media reporters, etc. Are being 534 00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:32,879 Speaker 1: arrested and detained for ballot fraud. Right now and over 535 00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:37,080 Speaker 1: the coming days, we'll be living in barges off GITMO 536 00:35:37,160 --> 00:35:45,080 Speaker 1: to face military tribunals for sedition. Miss Thomas, what did 537 00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:47,920 Speaker 1: you mean? Why did you send that to the chief 538 00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:52,880 Speaker 1: of staff urging him to help overturn the elections results? 539 00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:57,240 Speaker 1: Because Miss Thomas. Every word in there was flat out false. 540 00:35:57,480 --> 00:36:02,440 Speaker 1: And I mean that's one question of a thousand questions. 541 00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:07,360 Speaker 1: Jenny Thomas cannot survive cross examination on what she has done. 542 00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:10,759 Speaker 1: That doesn't even begin to talk about her interaction with 543 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:14,600 Speaker 1: the Arizona electors or or what she and her husband 544 00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:18,640 Speaker 1: were discussing. And not to go down a trim law 545 00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:22,120 Speaker 1: one oh one rabbit hole, but can we ask her 546 00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:27,520 Speaker 1: about what would otherwise be privileged spousal communications because the 547 00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:31,720 Speaker 1: crime fraud exception applies. I mean, this has so many 548 00:36:31,760 --> 00:36:35,200 Speaker 1: dimensions to it. I think what you're going to hear is, oh, 549 00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:38,440 Speaker 1: you know what, there were scheduling conflicts and we you know, 550 00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:40,960 Speaker 1: I just couldn't work it out to find time to 551 00:36:41,000 --> 00:36:44,879 Speaker 1: appear before the committee. I would bet a buck Jenny 552 00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:49,359 Speaker 1: Thomas will never hit the witness stand. Is she going 553 00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:52,720 Speaker 1: to hit be hit with an indictment? Is her husband 554 00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:56,560 Speaker 1: going to be investigated? Because there are two cases apparently 555 00:36:56,760 --> 00:36:59,719 Speaker 1: that he should have refused himself from that he did not. 556 00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:05,480 Speaker 1: You know what, I am always looking at the glasses 557 00:37:05,560 --> 00:37:09,640 Speaker 1: being half fulled. I don't think our federal government has 558 00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:16,000 Speaker 1: the appetite or the determination to investigate a Supreme Court 559 00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:20,320 Speaker 1: Justice and his wife. I think they should because there's 560 00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:25,359 Speaker 1: adequate predication, enough evidence to open an investigation. I also think, 561 00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:30,440 Speaker 1: and I'm more inclined to think this might happen, Congress 562 00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:34,320 Speaker 1: at some point should open an inquiry into Justice Thomas 563 00:37:34,360 --> 00:37:38,480 Speaker 1: to consider to investigate what happened when he unethically failed 564 00:37:38,520 --> 00:37:41,920 Speaker 1: to recuse himself, remove himself from a case that involved 565 00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:47,880 Speaker 1: his wife's treason, his text messages, and determine whether they 566 00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:52,360 Speaker 1: should consider drafting articles of impeachment. I think that should happen. 567 00:37:53,239 --> 00:37:56,520 Speaker 1: I don't know that that happens either, because our government 568 00:37:56,600 --> 00:37:59,560 Speaker 1: is not good at getting its arms around all of 569 00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:04,800 Speaker 1: the crime I'm in corruption. It needs to unbelievable. Well, Glenn, 570 00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:09,399 Speaker 1: this was a blockbuster hearing. Can't wait to discuss hearing 571 00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:12,400 Speaker 1: number four with you. What are you looking at? What 572 00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:15,680 Speaker 1: are you waiting on? That? We haven't seen Jesse yet? 573 00:38:16,560 --> 00:38:20,000 Speaker 1: So they're kind of teasing us a little bit because 574 00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:23,040 Speaker 1: I believe we're gonna begin to hear more evidence of 575 00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:26,960 Speaker 1: statements directly out of Donald Trump's mouth. Now we heard 576 00:38:26,960 --> 00:38:30,280 Speaker 1: some of that yesterday. Mike Pence is the P word 577 00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:34,480 Speaker 1: because he won't criminally overturn the results of the election, 578 00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:37,719 Speaker 1: and wouldn't it be cool if you could just do it? 579 00:38:38,040 --> 00:38:43,279 Speaker 1: You know this is it's just abject criminal conduct. I 580 00:38:43,320 --> 00:38:46,600 Speaker 1: think You're going to hear more about Trump's statements. You're 581 00:38:46,600 --> 00:38:49,440 Speaker 1: going to see pictures, photographs, I hope even video. But 582 00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:53,000 Speaker 1: at least we know we've been teased with the White 583 00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:56,160 Speaker 1: House photographer. Yeah, I captured a bunch of the stuff 584 00:38:56,160 --> 00:39:00,000 Speaker 1: in real time during the insurrection. Pictures worn't a thousand words. 585 00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:03,160 Speaker 1: So I think we get closer and closer and closer. 586 00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:06,280 Speaker 1: And I do think the bombs get bigger and bigger 587 00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:08,920 Speaker 1: and bigger, and they're going to end big. They're not 588 00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:13,200 Speaker 1: going to end on a fizzle. Well, fireworks and time 589 00:39:13,560 --> 00:39:17,560 Speaker 1: for the fourth of July. Glenn Kirshner, thank you so 590 00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:20,440 Speaker 1: much for always breaking down what seems to be the 591 00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:24,640 Speaker 1: breakdown of our democracy. We appreciate you, and we'll see 592 00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:33,000 Speaker 1: you next week. You next week. Danielle Indisputable with Doctor 593 00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:35,640 Speaker 1: Rashid Ricci is one of the latest shows on the 594 00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:39,800 Speaker 1: TYT network and also the fastest growing news show in America. 595 00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:44,000 Speaker 1: On his show, Doctor Ricci plays no games regarding policy, 596 00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:47,239 Speaker 1: delivering a heavy dose of fact based truth and penetrating 597 00:39:47,239 --> 00:39:50,760 Speaker 1: analysis on all the top news stories focusing on racism, 598 00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:55,719 Speaker 1: criminal and social justice, politics, police brutality, Karens, and much more. 599 00:39:56,040 --> 00:40:01,160 Speaker 1: Listeners can also expect interviews with fascinating guests, political lead commentators, 600 00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:04,760 Speaker 1: and even fiery debates with conservatives on a wide range 601 00:40:04,760 --> 00:40:08,920 Speaker 1: of policy topics. 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