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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha and welcome to Stephane.

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Speaker 1: Never told your protection to I Heart Radio. Okay, Annie,

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Speaker 1: we are doing something a little different for today's Monday Mini,

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Speaker 1: and I think it's appropriate because it is the new year,

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Speaker 1: and there are so many things that have happened in

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Speaker 1: our lives the last two years, our whole lifetime, and

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Speaker 1: a lot of changes that have happened. So you and

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Speaker 1: I are kind of just having a really open, candid,

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Speaker 1: kind of tearful, go ahead and put that out there

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Speaker 1: conversation about we're pretty much evaluating ourselves in this profession, right,

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Speaker 1: This is kind of the conversation we're having. So I

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Speaker 1: have a question and it has it's kind of do

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Speaker 1: an the leap because I found this fascinating. And if

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Speaker 1: you haven't listened to our our sponsored episode about and

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Speaker 1: just like that, the new Sex in the City series

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Speaker 1: like continuation, you should go listen to it because I

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Speaker 1: am One of the things that we were very amused

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Speaker 1: by was that Carrie's new job or career path is

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Speaker 1: now podcasting, right, and we both had a moment of

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Speaker 1: like what are we relevant or horovery out of out

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Speaker 1: of think like which one is it? And one of

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Speaker 1: the first critiques we have, like, why are they treating

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Speaker 1: this like it's a radio show? Ye, the way that

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Speaker 1: they were just having like it looks I don't know,

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Speaker 1: what did you think it did look like a radio show?

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Speaker 1: And I'm a terrible person who don't remember the third

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Speaker 1: because it's Carrie and Shane. The third person is an

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Speaker 1: actual person. I forgot his character name, yes, but he

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Speaker 1: to me feels like like a disc jockey, like the radio,

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Speaker 1: like whoa whoa of sound effect. Maybe he's supposed to

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Speaker 1: be Joe Rogan, that kind of what I'm getting. But

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Speaker 1: so I guess those kind of podcasts exist, but they're

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Speaker 1: so far away from what we do and what and

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Speaker 1: this is my personal taste what I would prefer to

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Speaker 1: listen to, and that's just not what I see very often.

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Speaker 1: And you know, to me, like, yeah, we come from

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Speaker 1: our closets to do this and we have been doing

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Speaker 1: it for years, so I it looks very different than

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Speaker 1: what I would associate how podcasting looks and sounds. Um,

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Speaker 1: but yeah, I get I definitely radio show vibe, but

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Speaker 1: I felt right the awkward like interview questions that just

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Speaker 1: sit and you I'm guessing like we are very heavily edited,

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Speaker 1: as we've spoken about previously, and if you've ever talked

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Speaker 1: to me in person, you know that I am awkward

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Speaker 1: as hell and I don't know what is happening. I'm

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Speaker 1: going to blame it on the pandemic and my aging.

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Speaker 1: I'm losing words left and right to the point that

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Speaker 1: I have to describe it to the point that any

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Speaker 1: will guess it like you've gotten really good at sam

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Speaker 1: speak as we say, because it's it's flying out of

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Speaker 1: my head all the time, to the point that I'm like,

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Speaker 1: this is my job. I'm concerned, and yeah, that's kind

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Speaker 1: of the thing is this is an interesting job. And

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Speaker 1: in comparison to when I used to do social work

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Speaker 1: UM and being a case worker, working on the grounds,

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Speaker 1: working one on one, doing case management, doing problem solving,

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Speaker 1: like I went to school for that, I was trained

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Speaker 1: for that. I came into a position I stepped away

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Speaker 1: because it got to triggering and traumatizing, and then came

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Speaker 1: back to it and loving working with the teens and

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Speaker 1: trying to have solutions. And of course there's a lot

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Speaker 1: about the system that I didn't like, but I knew

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Speaker 1: I was good at it. I knew was something that

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Speaker 1: I was ready for and I had his personal experiences

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Speaker 1: for it. So as you and I are talking, I

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Speaker 1: woke up yesterday and I do this back and forth,

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Speaker 1: through this back and forth, and people who follow my

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Speaker 1: Twitter probably think I'm the world's saddest sac human being,

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Speaker 1: and you're not too far off, because I am really

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Speaker 1: just racked with anxiety and self doubt. And when it

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Speaker 1: comes to this profession, I feel like it's so in

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Speaker 1: front of me that that all of my mistakes are

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Speaker 1: so right there that it's almost breathtaking in a in

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Speaker 1: a like, I just I just want to roll up

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Speaker 1: in a ball and step away, like it is alarmingly

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Speaker 1: shocking to me. How um, I have not only increased

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Speaker 1: in my criticisms of myself, but I feel like I

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Speaker 1: am so unqualified for this position. And at the beginning

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Speaker 1: I was so excited making jokes about how it's never

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Speaker 1: leaving and oh yeah, I get to be a part

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Speaker 1: of something different and changing. And now I'm here, going

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Speaker 1: why am I? Why am I here? And you have

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Speaker 1: been in this industry for a long time, this is

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Speaker 1: your industry, this is what you know, correct other than

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Speaker 1: teaching outside of the US, fleeing from government. Yes, yes,

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Speaker 1: I mean I didn't go to school for it, but

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Speaker 1: I have been doing I've been within this industry twelve

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Speaker 1: years now, hosting for I think three or four years now, right,

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Speaker 1: So this is your thing. This is you have been

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Speaker 1: at the beginnings, like when you were there before it

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Speaker 1: was popular, you were there before it was cool. You're

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Speaker 1: one of those in Congratulations and you were talking about

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Speaker 1: the fact that you also have these same doubts to

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Speaker 1: the point that anxiety it's almost anxiety inducing that you

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Speaker 1: panick before we record, right, Yes, um so even years

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Speaker 1: into this, and I know we actually discussed this recently

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Speaker 1: on an episode. Samantha and I handle stress very differently.

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Speaker 1: But one of my things is I still I think

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Speaker 1: when I first started hosting Savor, my co host Lawrence,

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Speaker 1: she made a joke and she was like, it looks

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Speaker 1: like you're riding a plane in turbulence, because I was

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Speaker 1: just gripping my chair so hard and I was so tense,

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Speaker 1: and like, going back and listening to those old episodes,

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Speaker 1: I'm like, thank you all for sticking around. It's clear

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Speaker 1: I was like one second away from panicking and clearly

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Speaker 1: also trying to get people to like me. In a

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Speaker 1: way that people can tell that you're trying to get

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Speaker 1: you know, like you. Um, but no, I do still

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Speaker 1: feel it. I still get nervous. I'll still like lie

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Speaker 1: awake at night and question every what if I didn't

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Speaker 1: say this, or what if I am passing along something

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Speaker 1: toxic and I don't know it? Like, I'll just get

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Speaker 1: so in my head that it prevents me from doing

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Speaker 1: the best that I can be, I think because I'm

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Speaker 1: just so like, yeah, anxious, anxious and full of self

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Speaker 1: doubts still right now, I guess for podcasters it's awards seasons,

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Speaker 1: listical season, um, so many things where we are being

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Speaker 1: compared to different people. And I've already talked about, you know,

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Speaker 1: looking stupidly at the reviews, but hey, I actually did.

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Speaker 1: Let's see one where one of our listeners and I

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Speaker 1: love you, uh defended me and thank you so much.

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Speaker 1: You have no idea to the person who did this

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Speaker 1: made me smile so big because I was like, oh,

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Speaker 1: someone truly than back and it was very good to

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Speaker 1: see and kind of see. But it is it. It's

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Speaker 1: a whole new world of being in public as this is.

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Speaker 1: And and on top of that, um, I have the

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Speaker 1: anxiety of if my family or if people I know

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Speaker 1: from past, here's this, He's gonna drive a bigger wedge

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Speaker 1: between us and I know the us um and fearing

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Speaker 1: that not not feeling the same. They were so proud

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Speaker 1: of me when they knew I was working to help children,

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Speaker 1: and they feel like, this is such a slap in

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Speaker 1: the face and this is not helping as much. They're

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Speaker 1: not necessarily shaving me for it, but they're definitely not

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Speaker 1: telling people what I'm doing as they used to. So

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Speaker 1: that on top of the fact that we are in

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Speaker 1: a field and our niche subject is so scrutinized that

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Speaker 1: I get to the point that I had come in

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Speaker 1: I was like, kay, I can do social media. Yeah no,

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Speaker 1: I'm done. I'm like, I am so scared of doing

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Speaker 1: saying the wrong things, taking uh someone's statement and uh

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Speaker 1: taking away someone's voice or missed misstepping into this because

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Speaker 1: it's not very forgiving. I will say that, like, unless

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Speaker 1: they truly listen, oftentimes they get a small snippet, it's

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Speaker 1: not forgiving and you just get raged on the coals.

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Speaker 1: And don't get me wrong, Accountability is necessary, and I'm

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Speaker 1: all all about accountay, But because of that, the fear

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Speaker 1: that I'm going to say something wrong, do something wrong, uh,

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Speaker 1: give information wrong, pronounced this wrong. There's so many anxieties

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Speaker 1: that me as a person who is super awkward, who

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Speaker 1: has an absolute fear orphan mentality is what I used

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Speaker 1: to call it, which is kind of degrading that the

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Speaker 1: fear of rejection and not being wanted is my primary

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Speaker 1: personality trait. Like I hate to be letting that focused

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Speaker 1: on it, but literally being in an orphanage or puts

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Speaker 1: me in that realm and so me hoping to have

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Speaker 1: changed and so excited by these opportunities. And please no,

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Speaker 1: I'm not complaining. I'm not complaining, and I know that

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Speaker 1: I am. I it should be grateful, and I am

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Speaker 1: grateful for being in this place. But I had never

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Speaker 1: recognized the true like I have never had to be

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Speaker 1: so as often as I am a self critical, the

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Speaker 1: true weight of being somewhat vulnerable in public like this

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Speaker 1: is such an overwhelming like to the point, like I

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Speaker 1: just said, I think you had five new host I

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Speaker 1: know you've done, You've We've been working so hard and

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Speaker 1: it was such a long journey and you and I

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Speaker 1: get alone so well, to the point that our coworkers

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Speaker 1: are laugh about the fact that we come in together

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Speaker 1: like we are come as a pair now, and I'm like, yes,

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Speaker 1: we do. I will never be without any thank you

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Speaker 1: for asking, but like that that that we are truly friends,

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Speaker 1: we are truly there for each other, but that this

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Speaker 1: level like I don't know, I don't think I'm good

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Speaker 1: at this, and please no, this is not me ex

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Speaker 1: fishing for compliments, but just having these moments waking up

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Speaker 1: going I, I'm not good at this. Why the did

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Speaker 1: I think I could be good at this? Yeah? And uh,

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Speaker 1: I'm most of you listeners, Yeah you're You're fantastic and

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Speaker 1: awesome and this is not Again, I always feel like

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Speaker 1: we're not when we make these like conversations. When we

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Speaker 1: have these conversations, it's not really we're not trying to

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Speaker 1: single out or have like, you know, conversation with you

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Speaker 1: through this podcast in that way. But yeah, I totally

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Speaker 1: hear you. And I remember when I was first approached

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Speaker 1: to be on this show. It took me like months

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Speaker 1: months of them trying to convince me to do it

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Speaker 1: because I was just like, I'm not going to be

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Speaker 1: good at it. I'm not going to be good at

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Speaker 1: it and and then having that doubt like every day,

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Speaker 1: and it is hard. We've discussed so many of these

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Speaker 1: issues before. What makes it complicated of being vulnerable in

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Speaker 1: that open space and having people comment on it, which is,

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Speaker 1: you know, fine, A lot of times those comments are great,

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Speaker 1: but it's so strange to me, Like, I'll get so

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Speaker 1: scared about sharing something that I think shouldn't be scary

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Speaker 1: at all, but but it's just so important to mean,

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Speaker 1: it's so personal to me, and to have someone come

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Speaker 1: in and be like, no, right, that's worthless. There has

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Speaker 1: no value, And that's one of my big That's one

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Speaker 1: of the things that I struggle with. And it's interesting

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Speaker 1: to me because I I've made comments about this and

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Speaker 1: I've sort of joked about this, but I always feel

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Speaker 1: like I'm one annoyance away from people being like, oh,

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Speaker 1: she's not worth being around. And so to do that

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Speaker 1: in a public space of when you're already pretty insecure

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Speaker 1: about that stuff, it is hard. And then there's so

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Speaker 1: many things and this is sort of technical, um, but

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Speaker 1: there's so many things that as someone who's worked here

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Speaker 1: for a while you can take for granted. So, for instance,

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Speaker 1: some of you have written in about this and asked me, like,

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Speaker 1: why is it you do, um, you introduce Christina in

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Speaker 1: this way versus how you introduced another podcast or or

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Speaker 1: something like that. And it's literally because I'm usually just

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Speaker 1: copying what the person did before me, right, and I'm not.

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Speaker 1: I've never been I was there right when Savor started,

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Speaker 1: but I was new, so I was taking my tips

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Speaker 1: from Lauren that was over there. So I've never been

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Speaker 1: the one that like started something totally from scratch. And

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Speaker 1: so it's kind of like then, you were trying to

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Speaker 1: fit yourself into how you think this works, and you

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Speaker 1: might be comparing yourself to other hosts or how they

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Speaker 1: did it, and maybe that's just not how you do it,

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Speaker 1: and so you constantly feel like a sense of failure,

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Speaker 1: which is what we talked about in our very first

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Speaker 1: episode together. And here we are, right, I mean and

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Speaker 1: and honestly we're coming background and we're wanting to give

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Speaker 1: you a peek behind the curtains a because people think

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Speaker 1: we do someone have it together, um, because we are

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Speaker 1: heavily edited. Christina is a magic maker, Andrew was a

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Speaker 1: magic maker. Andrew said me, you did send me a

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Speaker 1: short clip recently of me just loving and carsoning the

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Speaker 1: entire time. So I do love those alments too, but

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Speaker 1: it is as something like to see that we're having

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Speaker 1: moments of trying to figure it out ourselves. I'm coming

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Speaker 1: into a space that I know nothing about, so I

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Speaker 1: have tons of questions. The one thing you know about me,

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Speaker 1: I'm not gonna hold back when it when I'm confused,

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Speaker 1: like I need to know so I can unravel this.

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Speaker 1: But what does that look like? And even to the

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Speaker 1: fact that I'm having to analyze when people are critiquing

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Speaker 1: the way I speak my voice, I'm like, honestly, it's

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Speaker 1: because I spoke Korean till I was eight years old,

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Speaker 1: miscommunicated with my family because they could not speak Korean.

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Speaker 1: I then had an a North Georgia Mountain accent on

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Speaker 1: top of my Korean accent, which helped develop my pronunciation inabilities.

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Speaker 1: Especially if you listen to someone who was speace fluent

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Speaker 1: Korean come in and speak English, you know there's some

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Speaker 1: differences in the way things are pronounced. That's the act

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Speaker 1: scent when people talk, that's an accent. That's actually part

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Speaker 1: of the way I speak. But I did not realize

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Speaker 1: it until I was on a podcast and I was like,

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Speaker 1: why do I sound like that? Oh, And when, of

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Speaker 1: course my friends like you and people that I talked

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Speaker 1: to like you don't have an accent, I'm like, no,

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Speaker 1: that it's there. It just a part of my cadence

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Speaker 1: because it is a part of the accent and the

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Speaker 1: way I learned to speak and things develop, all of

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Speaker 1: these different things, and it's it is, It's partially there.

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Speaker 1: And I find that interesting that I'm even going that

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Speaker 1: far to again analyze it, for of course I'm very

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Speaker 1: analytical of everything anyway, of these things because I'm being criticized,

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Speaker 1: because I'm being told this is and because I hear

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Speaker 1: it too, I hear it too. I'm like, oh my god,

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Speaker 1: that's awful. I hate it. I hate doing our Q ways,

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Speaker 1: which is when we listen to ourselves by the way.

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Speaker 1: I hate it. This is been a nightmare for that

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Speaker 1: trying to figure that out. But I think one of

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Speaker 1: the biggest things that I am trying to figure out

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Speaker 1: for myself as a woman of a color, a person

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Speaker 1: of color in the space is I have done so

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Speaker 1: well at being invisible and trying to blend in into

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Speaker 1: a white space, into the space that was not seemingly

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Speaker 1: developed for me and then trying to be there and

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Speaker 1: if I don't do it to the best of my abilities,

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Speaker 1: I am shaming whatever whoever would claim me in that group.

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Speaker 1: Does that make sense? Which is rare for me in general,

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Speaker 1: and being ostracized and so therefore wanting to be small,

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Speaker 1: wanting to disappear, and then thinking, oh, I think I

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Speaker 1: do have something to say, and then feeling like I

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Speaker 1: didn't say it appropriately, right, Yeah, I mean, it's it's

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Speaker 1: one of those things that frustrates me a lot about

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Speaker 1: being any marginalized person. It's it feels like there's more responsibility,

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Speaker 1: and then every intersection there in there's more responsibility two

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Speaker 1: represent and of course you can never represent an entire

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Speaker 1: race or in time gener all that stuff, but you

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Speaker 1: feel that responsibility of like I've got to do it

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Speaker 1: well and do it right, and and so many of

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Speaker 1: these things that we're talking about. It's we have to

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Speaker 1: have these conversations, and we want to have these conversations,

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Speaker 1: but that kind of like fear and self doubt, which

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Speaker 1: can come from so many different avenues, and that fear

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Speaker 1: of like being wrong, can hold you back and so

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Speaker 1: you don't. It becomes like a cyclical situation. Where it's like, well,

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Speaker 1: I can't be perfect, so I might as well not

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Speaker 1: say anything at all, which is not true, but that

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Speaker 1: it gets in you of like, well, I'm not doing

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Speaker 1: this well, or I'm not doing this right, or what

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Speaker 1: if I misspoke or all of this, and it can

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Speaker 1: be pretty pretty exhausting. Oh I'm tired. I think you're

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Speaker 1: not both tired. Maybe it's the end of the year

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Speaker 1: trying to push and cram everything together so we can

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Speaker 1: get enough content out there that we don't feel like

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Speaker 1: we're slacking, which is not true. I do want to

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Speaker 1: in this wine session of mine UM with this that

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Speaker 1: I do really appreciate what you have done, and I

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Speaker 1: think you really laid out great foundation things that I

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Speaker 1: cannot keep up with your standards. Uh, I'm just playing,

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Speaker 1: not because you're putting it on me, more so that

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Speaker 1: I'm like, Okay, we are very different people when it

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Speaker 1: comes to UH working styles. You're on top of it

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Speaker 1: and I am ten days late UM typically. But I

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Speaker 1: really do appreciate that you have really done UM so

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Speaker 1: much for this podcast and you've had to rebrand it.

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Speaker 1: You've had to rebrand it for yourself because yeah, we

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Speaker 1: went through a whole influx of different hosts. We know this,

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Speaker 1: and we know that they are those hosts are amazing

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Speaker 1: and it's hard to like live up to. It's really

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Speaker 1: hard to live up to. But you've done a phenomenal

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Speaker 1: job in keeping it going, keeping it relevant, UM, teaching

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Speaker 1: me the ways in in podcasting, because like I said,

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Speaker 1: I have no idea what the hell I'm doing, still

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Speaker 1: trying to figure this out. And I really do appreciate that.

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Speaker 1: I love our friendship, and I really you are probably

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Speaker 1: one of my closest friends. I mean, for sure, in

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Speaker 1: the pandemic, you were the only other person I saw UM,

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Speaker 1: and it was genuinely loving. I loved UM being able

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Speaker 1: to share what you love because for me, I don't

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Speaker 1: have those connections and you do. And again we've talked

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Speaker 1: about the differences between you and I and how we

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Speaker 1: gravitate and really uh clean to things, and I am

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Speaker 1: less likely to be attached to things, and You're more

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Speaker 1: likely to be attached to things and passions. And it's

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Speaker 1: really beautiful to watch you love something. It is contagious,

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Speaker 1: It is a delight, and it does make you feel

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Speaker 1: a part of a community just to be able to

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Speaker 1: witness it. So all of that says I love you.

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Speaker 1: I really appreciate everything you've done. And even though I'm

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Speaker 1: like I want to quit, I know because you are

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Speaker 1: the partner in this that I I'm not failing because

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Speaker 1: you're you're part of this and you don't fail. So

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Speaker 1: I just want to say I love you and I

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Speaker 1: thank you for that. And I love our listeners who

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Speaker 1: have are die hard and supportive, and I know you are.

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Speaker 1: Please don't think I'm just negative Nelly all the time.

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Speaker 1: It's just trying to really get a grasp in this

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Speaker 1: world in general. And yeah, the listener base as one

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Speaker 1: of the strongest communities and really uplifting communities that I've

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Speaker 1: been a part of. So I really appreciate you all

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Speaker 1: as well. Yeah, yeah, Like you really have no idea

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Speaker 1: how much it means. When it's even if it's just

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Speaker 1: a note like hey, I really like that episode, it's

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Speaker 1: like it does yes, yes, And it's weird because podcasts

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Speaker 1: can be pretty isolating, so it's like you're doing this

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Speaker 1: and then you don't know what happens when it gets

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Speaker 1: out there, and you're always like, what if it's terrible?

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Speaker 1: So even just like a small note like that is

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Speaker 1: so nice. I love you too, Smith that I'm so

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Speaker 1: glad you're here. I think you bring such a great

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Speaker 1: perspective and a treasure our friendship so much. I feel

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Speaker 1: like I talk about you all the time. I talked

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Speaker 1: about you all the time to the point people like

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Speaker 1: does she live with you? People have thought that what's

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Speaker 1: going on here? Never you mind? Never you mind, and yeah,

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Speaker 1: always here to provide support. And I think there is

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Speaker 1: something to be said. I think even though we're talking

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Speaker 1: specifically about a very niche industry, um, apparently not that's true.

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Speaker 1: I do think a lot of people can relate to

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Speaker 1: this to just like not feeling like you're doing good

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Speaker 1: at your job or well at your job. And I

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Speaker 1: also I really think that there's something to be said

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Speaker 1: for systems that we come into that maybe aren't working

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Speaker 1: for you. Like I thought about this other day when

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Speaker 1: someone was just like I just worked so much better

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Speaker 1: at night. But the way we're set up like it's

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Speaker 1: not that's not gonna help you, and then you're gonna

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Speaker 1: feel like, well, I'm failing, and I'm failing and I'm failing.

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Speaker 1: So I'm always a big proponent of kind of thinking, well,

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Speaker 1: it doesn't have to be done this way. This is

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Speaker 1: not working for me. So yeah, we wanted to start

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Speaker 1: the new year because we're just not in a place

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Speaker 1: of like it's like resolutions, you know what, look behind

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Speaker 1: the cartons, see the reality. Yeah, yeah, we wanted to,

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Speaker 1: you know, just show you if you're struggling, if you're tired,

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Speaker 1: all of those things, we're right there with you. We are,

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Speaker 1: we are, and we are very very very very thankful

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Speaker 1: for you. So whatever you're celebrating, if you're not celebrating,

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Speaker 1: however that looks for you, whatever that looks like, we

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Speaker 1: hope that you're well. You are in our hearts and

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Speaker 1: we we do love hearing from you. So if you

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Speaker 1: would like to contact us, you can our emails Stephaneia

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Speaker 1: mom Stuff at I Heart media dot com. You can

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Speaker 1: find us on Instagram and Stuff I've Never Told You

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Speaker 1: or on Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast. Thanks as always

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Speaker 1: to our super producer Christina, Seriously, you are amazing. We

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Speaker 1: appreciate you as well. We do, and thanks to you

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Speaker 1: for listening stuff under to inspection of Hiart Radio for

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Speaker 1: more podcast My Heart Radio is if I heard you

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Speaker 1: app Apple podcast or wherever you listening to your favorite

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Speaker 1: shows