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Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera.

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Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you welcome to stuff Mom never told you?

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Speaker 1: From House Step works dot Com. Hello, and welcome to

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Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Caroline and I'm Kristin. There seems to

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Speaker 1: be a lot of questions floating around the Internet about

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Speaker 1: women and their doctors, and I'm just getting the impression

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Speaker 1: generally that women feel that doctors don't listen to them.

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Speaker 1: I came across two big questions on said Internet regarding

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Speaker 1: women and doctors. One is whether or not male doctors

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Speaker 1: come on to female patients and where the ethical lines are.

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Speaker 1: I did not investigate that one. That's the whole other podcast, yes,

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Speaker 1: and that we probably will never record. And also whether

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Speaker 1: or not doctors listen to female patients. Right, there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of interesting data out there about um just gender interactions,

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Speaker 1: both the gender of the patient and how that affects

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Speaker 1: the doctor patient relationship and and as you can imagine,

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Speaker 1: the gender of the physician, and I, for one, have

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Speaker 1: always thought out female doctors. I feel more comfortable with

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Speaker 1: a female gynecologist and a female internist, my chiropractor, and

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Speaker 1: my acupuncturist. I'm just going to tell you everything about

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Speaker 1: myself right now. Do you want to know my blood type?

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Speaker 1: I don't know it. Oh God, we should figure that out.

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Speaker 1: They're male. So the people, the people who are like

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Speaker 1: cracking my spine and sticking needles and mirror are guys.

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Speaker 1: But you know, I just feel like if I'm going

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Speaker 1: to be doing talking about really personal things and getting

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Speaker 1: medicine prescribed, I just I feel more comfortable with a

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Speaker 1: lady doctor. And this question of the doctor female patient

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Speaker 1: relationship has been snowballing in our minds as we've been

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Speaker 1: doing episodes on under diagnosed chronic conditions among women, such

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Speaker 1: as volvidenia, and it also stood out in our podcast

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Speaker 1: we did a while ago on gender differences in anxiety

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Speaker 1: because Taylor Clark over its Slate pointed to the American

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Speaker 1: Psychological Association's Stress in America survey in two thousand and eight,

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Speaker 1: which found that if a woman goes into a doctor's

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Speaker 1: office UH and complains of symptoms, they are more likely

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Speaker 1: to be dismissed as just the products of female stress,

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Speaker 1: just the product of being a woman, perhaps the change

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Speaker 1: of life, yes, the seasons turning uh, whereas male symptoms

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Speaker 1: the same symptoms presented by a male patient often taken

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Speaker 1: more seriously, and this is specifically in regard to cardiology,

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Speaker 1: and we'll get into that a little bit more. So,

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Speaker 1: we decided to look into whether or not that was true,

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Speaker 1: whether or not women are just complaining more loudly? Are

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Speaker 1: we just pickier about our doctors? Are we all hypochondriacs? What?

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Speaker 1: What is happening? Yeah? There was a May blog post

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Speaker 1: by Nancy kleimus On on the Miss magazine blog and

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Speaker 1: she posed the question that that we're going to get

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Speaker 1: into about why don't doctors listen to women? Or do

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Speaker 1: doctors listen to women? And she said, how do we

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Speaker 1: dispel the age old myths that women are emotional, overreactive

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Speaker 1: and generally unable to describe their own medical conditions? What

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Speaker 1: is up with doctors making up their minds about us

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Speaker 1: when we've uttered three words about what we're suffering? And

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Speaker 1: I believe Clemus also is a medical doctor, So this

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Speaker 1: is a doctor posing this question about other doctors now

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Speaker 1: across the board. Probably because of the limited amount of

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Speaker 1: time that doctors have to see patients in the exam room,

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Speaker 1: there is some mistrust that goes on between patients and physicians.

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Speaker 1: There was us a two thousand eight column in the

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Speaker 1: New York Times by Tara Parker Pope who was citing

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Speaker 1: a Johns Hopkins study finding that about one in four patients,

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Speaker 1: it's pretty high. One in four patients feel at their

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Speaker 1: physicians sometimes exposes them to unnecessary risk, and she quotes

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Speaker 1: a New York doctor saying that nobody's talking to patients.

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Speaker 1: Everyone is so rushed. I don't think doctors are bad.

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Speaker 1: People were just working in a broken system. And on

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Speaker 1: a side note, this is coming from a report in

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Speaker 1: the Wall Street Journal from to two thousand five, the

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Speaker 1: time of doctor spends with individual patients has actually increased

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Speaker 1: from a whopping eighteen minutes, which was high I thought,

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Speaker 1: to twenty one minutes um. As far as the environment

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Speaker 1: that these doctors are working in, Tara Parker Pope in

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Speaker 1: her post says that dealing with declining reimbursements and rising costs,

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Speaker 1: doctors have only a few minutes to spend with the patient,

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Speaker 1: and sometimes when I cut to the doctor, I feel

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Speaker 1: like it is literally just a few minutes. I'm really

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Speaker 1: surprised by that twenty one minute figure. Well, the that's

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Speaker 1: averaged out and the writers suggest that it might be

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Speaker 1: that high number might be due to an aging baby

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Speaker 1: boomer population sort of skew the skew the curve could

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Speaker 1: be could be um. Some things that influenced the trust

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Speaker 1: issues between doctors and patients are news reports about medical

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Speaker 1: mistakes and drug industry influence. So the more you hear

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Speaker 1: about malpractice suits and you know, people leaving medical instruments

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Speaker 1: and someone's spleen after a surgery, maybe you're more likely

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Speaker 1: to worry. Yeah, and because a lot of adults are

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Speaker 1: very attuned to what could possibly be wrong. I don't

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Speaker 1: know about you, Caroline, but I have inadvertently diagnosed myself

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Speaker 1: with a terrible cancer symptom checker have cancer. It's it's

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Speaker 1: pretty dangerous. This was according to a few Internet pro

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Speaker 1: ject survey uh sient of women and percent of men

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Speaker 1: will research what could be ailing them before the even

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Speaker 1: step foot in the doctor's office. Right, And that's actually

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Speaker 1: sort of a uh maybe not a dangerous mistake to make.

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Speaker 1: But if you've done all this research because you're worried

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Speaker 1: about your help, that mean it makes sense. But if

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Speaker 1: you take all of that into your doctor and say, okay, look,

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Speaker 1: here's what this website says, this is what I have. Well,

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Speaker 1: even though your doctor is a very smart individual, he

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Speaker 1: or she might sort of follow you down that path

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Speaker 1: and think, Okay, you're right. And this actually I say this.

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Speaker 1: I say this because it happened to me. I actually

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Speaker 1: had it. It was a minor and a brief dermatological issue,

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Speaker 1: and I looked it up online and I was like, okay, good, well,

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Speaker 1: hey I'm not dying, and be this sounds like what

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Speaker 1: it is. So well, you know, I went to the dermatologist.

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Speaker 1: Wasn't my normal doctor. I went to a new one

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Speaker 1: because I couldn't get in anyway. So I go in

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Speaker 1: with all this information and they're looking at me and

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Speaker 1: I'm thinking, okay, I'm not gonna say anything. I'm not

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Speaker 1: gonna say anything. I'm gonna let them decide what it is.

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Speaker 1: And finally, you know, they're poking at me and stuff,

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Speaker 1: and I'm like, you know what, I think it's this

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Speaker 1: and they look and they're like, yeah, here's some hydrocortisome cream.

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Speaker 1: Go home. Well then it wouldn't go away. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you know, it was nothing bad, but it kept like

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Speaker 1: it just kind of hung around. And so then I

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Speaker 1: went into my my normal dermatology. She's like, oh god,

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Speaker 1: how long have you been using this hydrocortisown cream And

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Speaker 1: I said, well, really not as much as they told

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Speaker 1: me too. She said good, because that's not what you have.

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Speaker 1: And if you had used hydrocortisome cream every day between

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Speaker 1: then and now, your skin might be falling off. Oh

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Speaker 1: my goodness. So yeah, it is dangerous to go in

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Speaker 1: with your mind made up already. Well. In addition to

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Speaker 1: women possibly over educating themselves about what could be going

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Speaker 1: on compared two, men were also more likely to like,

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Speaker 1: you did, take action and make that appointment and go in.

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Speaker 1: This is coming from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

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Speaker 1: This is excluding pregnancy related visits. Women are thirty three

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Speaker 1: percent more likely van men to visit a doctor. Now

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Speaker 1: that starts to close with age, as we all get

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Speaker 1: old and we're all equally sickly. Um, but doctors see

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Speaker 1: our faces more often, right, and according to a meta

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Speaker 1: analysis of data from nineteen sixty seven to two thousand one.

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Speaker 1: This appeared in the Journal of American Medical Association. It

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Speaker 1: found that visits with female doctors last two minutes longer

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Speaker 1: on average as far as gender goes, So as far

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Speaker 1: as women, women are in the doctor's office more, but

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Speaker 1: if you're seeing a woman doctor, you're also going to

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Speaker 1: be seeing her more, a little bit more, a little

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Speaker 1: bit more, twenty seconds more. I wonder if two minutes

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Speaker 1: makes that much of a difference, though, if you have

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Speaker 1: a question, yes, that's a brief question. And you mentioned

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Speaker 1: that the pattern is slightly different for UM O, B

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Speaker 1: G Y n's and this is true. It's interesting because

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Speaker 1: all these studies are saying that, you know, female patients

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Speaker 1: go to the doctor more, they spend more time at

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Speaker 1: the doctor or um female physicians are more likely to

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Speaker 1: spend more time with you. But all of that is

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Speaker 1: not the case for male O, B G I N.

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Speaker 1: They actually demonstrate a higher level of emotionally focused talk

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Speaker 1: with their patients. But maybe that has to do with

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Speaker 1: them tailoring communication styles to their patient population, because studies

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Speaker 1: have also demonstrated that female patients, unsurprisingly UM tend to

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Speaker 1: communicate more, want to do more of the the whole

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Speaker 1: person analysis how they're feeling um mentally, physically, emotionally, uh,

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Speaker 1: instead of just you know, be sticking more to what

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Speaker 1: is going on, what is my denvergure and my blood

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Speaker 1: pressure exactly like male robots. Yes, as you know, men

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Speaker 1: talk like robots. Um. The Journal of Patient Education and

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Speaker 1: Counseling in two thousands six published a study that found

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Speaker 1: that while men tend to be satis by regardless of

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Speaker 1: the doctor's gender and communication style, US ladies are more

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Speaker 1: particular and we tend to be happiest with female doctors

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Speaker 1: when those doctors expressed great concern, empathy, and reassurance. And

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Speaker 1: I mean, that makes sense to me. I want to

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Speaker 1: know that my doctor is listening to me and understands.

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Speaker 1: I don't I don't need her to be like, oh boo,

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Speaker 1: don't worry, but you know, I want to know she's

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Speaker 1: listening and understands. But actually, the whole the whole thing

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Speaker 1: flips on its ear. And if those doctors were male,

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Speaker 1: female patients were dissatisfied with overt displays of caring. Ah,

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Speaker 1: we can't be pleased, they just can't. But it makes

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Speaker 1: sense so that women might be more particular about the

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Speaker 1: kind of health care they are receiving. Because we are

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Speaker 1: spending more time in doctor's offices, we're probably seeing more doctors.

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Speaker 1: And again we go in statistically, we go in armed

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Speaker 1: with more knowledge. So maybe we set the bar a

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Speaker 1: little bit higher. And this is not to say by

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Speaker 1: any means that male doctors are somehow not doing their

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Speaker 1: job properly. They're simply a communication difference. Because there was

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Speaker 1: a journal I don't know, Carolina, did you reference as

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Speaker 1: the Journal of Women's Health study from two thousand nine

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Speaker 1: that found that male physicians had a higher component to score,

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Speaker 1: which was understanding the whole person, which is really what

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Speaker 1: it sounds like, more what female patients are interested in. Right.

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Speaker 1: It seems like we want to get the whole picture,

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Speaker 1: the whole health picture laid out, and from the same study,

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Speaker 1: female physicians had a greater component one score, in other words,

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Speaker 1: exploring both the disease and illness experience. But I'm wondering

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Speaker 1: if maybe this big dissatisfaction has much less to do

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Speaker 1: with the gender of the physician that we're talking to,

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Speaker 1: because again, um, I don't want to say that that

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Speaker 1: female or male physicians are one is superior to the other.

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Speaker 1: But maybe it's how when men present their symptoms and

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Speaker 1: whether or not the word stress comes. Because a Cornell

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Speaker 1: study presented at the two thousand eight Cardiovascular Research Foundation

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Speaker 1: found that mentioning stress affects a doctor's perception of a

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Speaker 1: woman's symptoms. These researchers examined how doctor's reaction reacted to

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Speaker 1: patient descriptions of cardiovascular problems for male patients versus female patients,

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Speaker 1: and they concluded that quote the inclusion of a stressor

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Speaker 1: precluded doctors from making a coronary heart disease diagnosis in

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Speaker 1: women but not in men. So there's something about women

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Speaker 1: saying stress that like sets off alarm bells in physicians

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Speaker 1: brains says oh you know what, Uh, it's probably just

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Speaker 1: your stress levels. Here is something that will take care

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Speaker 1: of that. Yeah, here's an anti anxiety or an antidepressant, right, right,

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Speaker 1: Maybe that's why. According to the CDC, the major classes

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Speaker 1: of drugs doled out to women are painkillers and adepressants

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Speaker 1: and estrogenda. Oh hey interesting, um yeah, as far as

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Speaker 1: as the mental health and anxiety goes, I mean, yeah,

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Speaker 1: we did reference that stuff in our anxiety podcast and

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Speaker 1: it was interesting to see how doctors perceive women so differently.

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Speaker 1: But according to the World Health Organization, doctors are more

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Speaker 1: likely to diagnose depression in women compared with men, which

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Speaker 1: we've talked about before, even when they have similar scores.

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Speaker 1: On standardized measures of depression or present with identical symptoms.

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Speaker 1: And this is a quote. Uh, you know you think

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Speaker 1: about predictors for for being diagnosed with a disease, you

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Speaker 1: don't think of your gender. I mean, I I don't know.

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Speaker 1: It's a female. Gender is a significant predictor of being

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Speaker 1: prescribed mood altering psychotropic drugs. So just being a lady,

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Speaker 1: you're more likely to get mood altering drugs. Women also

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Speaker 1: tend to seek more generalized medical assistance for mental health issues,

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Speaker 1: as again coming from the World Health Organization, compared to men,

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Speaker 1: who are a less likely to seek mental health but

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Speaker 1: when they do, they'll go more to specialists, right. And

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Speaker 1: and there's just there's something about gender stereotypes, not only

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Speaker 1: for women, not only doctors thinking oh she's just hysterical, um,

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Speaker 1: but for men as well. And uh, gender stereotypes regarding

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Speaker 1: proneness to emotional problems and women and alcohol problems and

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Speaker 1: men appear to reinforce social stigma and constrain help seeking

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Speaker 1: along stereotypical lines. That's also from the World Health Organization.

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Speaker 1: So these are barriers I think too, to getting quality care.

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Speaker 1: If you're if maybe if you assume something about your

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Speaker 1: own situation or if your doctor just assumes something because

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Speaker 1: of your gender, and the fact of the matter is, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, we're talking a lot about whether or not

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Speaker 1: women are satisfied with their patient care, but guys, you

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Speaker 1: you also are suffering from a healthcare gap as well.

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Speaker 1: Over the life term. Male healthcare costs far more than

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Speaker 1: women's because you're not investing as much in preventative care

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Speaker 1: and going to the doctor um as often as we are.

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Speaker 1: So it's kind of like, you know, maybe at some

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Speaker 1: point we need to meet in the middle where doctor's

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Speaker 1: quit dismissing women's complaints is just the byproduct of everyday stress,

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Speaker 1: and men stopped going in when it's a situation, so

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Speaker 1: that doctors take your you know, symptoms far more seriously, Right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I go for more more checkups along the line instead

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Speaker 1: of waiting until it's just at the tipping point. And

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Speaker 1: as far as identifying problems, especially mental health issues along

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Speaker 1: gender lines, UM, there was an interesting interview with Dr

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Speaker 1: Jerome Groupman by NPR. He read a book called How

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Speaker 1: Doctor Stink after he himself had a bad experience about

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Speaker 1: trying to get something die agnosed, and he went to

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Speaker 1: several different doctors, and um, finally I think it was

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Speaker 1: the fifth doctor. Someone finally listened to all of his

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Speaker 1: symptoms and he got the right diagnosis. But so he

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Speaker 1: wrote this book called How Doctors Think after his experience,

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Speaker 1: and he's talking about how doctors maybe have errors in thinking.

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Speaker 1: It's not that they're bad people, it's that, uh, we

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Speaker 1: use shortcuts. He says, most doctors within the first eighteen

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Speaker 1: seconds of seeing a patient will interrupt him telling his

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Speaker 1: story and also generate an idea in his mind of

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Speaker 1: what's wrong. So they're making this snap judgment. And he

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Speaker 1: calls it an anchoring mistake because once you utter a

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Speaker 1: couple of words about what you're experiencing, what hurts, or

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Speaker 1: what feels bad, Um, some doctors have already made a

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Speaker 1: decision about what you have based on your gender, age, race, whatever,

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Speaker 1: and they kind of stick with it and maybe, uh

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Speaker 1: use everything else you say to confirm what they already believe.

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Speaker 1: So as far as having an idea of what someone

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Speaker 1: is already suffering from or not suffering from, UM an

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Speaker 1: interesting study from the Cardiac and Vascular Institute at New

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Speaker 1: York University Langhorne Medical Center. This was published UH in September. UM.

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Speaker 1: Anywhere from forty thod to a hundred thousand women every

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Speaker 1: year with arteries that show up is clear on an

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Speaker 1: angiogram suffer from a heart attack. And thirty eight percent

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Speaker 1: of the time they have the kind of plaque that

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Speaker 1: doesn't show up on an angiogram. And so a lot

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Speaker 1: of these doctors are sending women home because they just

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Speaker 1: do this one test and they say, oh, you're fine,

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Speaker 1: it's probably indigestion. You know, here's here's a prolatack or whatever.

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Speaker 1: Go home, lie down, get some rest. But then when

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Speaker 1: the woman comes back and she's going, no, okay, for real,

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Speaker 1: I'm I'm having a heart attack. Um, that's when they

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Speaker 1: realize that something very serious is wrong and and women

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Speaker 1: are symptoms and and this says, I feel common knowledge.

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Speaker 1: I know that women present very different symptoms when they're

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Speaker 1: having a heart attack and men do. UM. And that

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Speaker 1: is something that really needs to be taken into account.

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Speaker 1: If a woman is suffering from the same thing a

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Speaker 1: man is, she just might not present the same symptom

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Speaker 1: in the same way. And so I think, UM, if

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Speaker 1: maybe if we get more time with our doctors, if

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Speaker 1: we go to them with enough time in advance of

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Speaker 1: any problems we have, then maybe we could um be

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Speaker 1: taken more seriously and get these things diagnosed as far

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Speaker 1: as and I mean, instead of waiting until it's almost

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Speaker 1: too late. Well, and if the standard tests for things

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Speaker 1: like heart disease and heart attack our tailored to what

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Speaker 1: more commonly manifests and meant, it would make sense that

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Speaker 1: within that eighteen second window that you mentioned from how

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Speaker 1: the book how Doctors Think? It makes sense that you know,

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Speaker 1: doctors would conclude that yea or nay, this is or

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Speaker 1: is not going on UM. So it sounds like there's

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Speaker 1: room for more nuanced in the exam room, but also

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Speaker 1: before that, taking more even in med school, training doctors

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Speaker 1: to look more closely for UM, for for the gender differences.

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Speaker 1: I have never been to med school. People who have

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Speaker 1: been let me know if that is happy. I'm sure

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Speaker 1: it's happening a lot more than it used to, because

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Speaker 1: we've talked about in the podcast before. How with for

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Speaker 1: a lot of prescription medications, for instance, it's only been

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Speaker 1: in recent years, in the past, like twenty years probably

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Speaker 1: that they have started using women in more test groups,

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Speaker 1: whereas everything was tailored to men because men are more

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Speaker 1: stable because they don't have menstrual cycles. And by stable,

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Speaker 1: and I'm not talking about like brain and mood stable,

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Speaker 1: I mean physiologically levels of hormones in their body fable.

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Speaker 1: But to cap things off, let us let us at

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Speaker 1: least verify that it is not just in our heads.

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Speaker 1: Even though women are going to the doctor more often

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Speaker 1: than men, a December two thousand eleven study published in

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Speaker 1: the European Journal of Public Health via the Public Health

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Speaker 1: Agency of Barcelona found that women did indeed report health

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Speaker 1: problems more often, but it's because we are actually suffering

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Speaker 1: from a higher rate of chronic disease, and the lead

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Speaker 1: researcher says these results suggest that the poor self rated

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Speaker 1: health of women is a reflection of the higher burden

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Speaker 1: of disease they suffer, and it should be the findings

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Speaker 1: should be offered up as support that women are not

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Speaker 1: just a bunch of raving hypochondriacts. And of speaking of hypochondria.

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Speaker 1: According to the National Institutes of Health, hypochondria presents itself

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Speaker 1: equally among men and women, especially with websites like WebM d.

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Speaker 1: Recall to do is click on that little body and

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Speaker 1: tell it what hurts. It's always cancer. There's always you

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Speaker 1: could scrape your knee and web m D symptom checker

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Speaker 1: would give you knee cancer. It's it's always going to

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Speaker 1: be cancer or foot fungus. Like it's something where you're like,

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Speaker 1: how do you how do I have prostate cancer? Web D?

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Speaker 1: I'm I'm a woman, Come on, um. But okay, so

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Speaker 1: we we've we've come back around to the whole self

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Speaker 1: diagnosis thing, and I think we should talk about some

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Speaker 1: of the mistakes that we do make when we go

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Speaker 1: to the doctor's office. I already told my long story

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Speaker 1: about my hydrocortisome cream. We don't need to revisit it. Um.

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Speaker 1: But Dr Christie Northrop was quoted in a two thousand

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Speaker 1: eight CNN column by medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen and actor.

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Speaker 1: Northrop said that women make a huge mistake by feeling

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Speaker 1: paralyzed and voiceless in a doctor's office. Although I'm not

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Speaker 1: sure how you can call and something like that a

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Speaker 1: mistake if you feel paralyzed, do you feel paralyzed? But anyway,

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Speaker 1: she says, you shouldn't feel paralyzed, and so so she

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Speaker 1: breaks down the five the five mistakes that we make,

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Speaker 1: and one is we don't question our doctors. She compares

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Speaker 1: it to a a child versus parent interaction that we're

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Speaker 1: just like, okay, whatever you say, you're smart. So we're

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Speaker 1: just passive sitting on the exam table waiting for the

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Speaker 1: terrible prognosis of knee cancer. Exactly, you're gonna get letters

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Speaker 1: from people with knee cancer. Um. She suggests taking someone

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Speaker 1: with you who will ask questions, who who maybe isn't

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Speaker 1: afraid to ask questions to the doctor, or just ask

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Speaker 1: the doctor to slow down and say, look, I don't

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Speaker 1: I didn't go to med school. Can you please help

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Speaker 1: me understand this? So that's that's what idea. And she

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Speaker 1: also says that instead of just seeing the two facts,

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Speaker 1: were offering interpretations which could lead the doctor down the

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Speaker 1: wrong path. In other words, what she's saying is you

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Speaker 1: go and prepared, know that you're going to have a

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Speaker 1: limited amount of time, and know what you want to

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Speaker 1: talk about. If there are you know, three things specifically

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Speaker 1: that are happening, be ready to cut to the chase,

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Speaker 1: right and yeah, cutting to the chase, which is what

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Speaker 1: I should have done earlier with my story. Um. She

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Speaker 1: says that you know, don't interpret your systems or your

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Speaker 1: symptoms in the doctor's office. Don't just state the facts,

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Speaker 1: state what you're offering from. Don't say like, oh, well,

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Speaker 1: so then I was reading that maybe it could be

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Speaker 1: foot fungus. Um. Just just let them let them exam,

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Speaker 1: you know, examine you. And I'm not gonna lie. I

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Speaker 1: am totally guilty of going into the doctor for something

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Speaker 1: and not wanting to reveal the fact that I had

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Speaker 1: done the research for fear of seeming like a crazy

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Speaker 1: internet hypochondriac. But so many of us are, and I

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Speaker 1: think they know that. I mean, I think if you're

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Speaker 1: a doctor here, an internist, probably I would say a

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Speaker 1: huge chunk to be very specific, come in every day

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Speaker 1: just being like, well I read this on the internet.

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Speaker 1: It sounds like we just need more honesty in the

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Speaker 1: in the exam room, and maybe several follow up appointments.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to prescribe our listeners more honesty and gumption

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Speaker 1: next time they go to the doctor. Put that on

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Speaker 1: a pillow. Um. And one one major issue that she

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Speaker 1: points out is that we don't as women, we don't

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Speaker 1: recognize gender bias. Apparently, she says that our issues are

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Speaker 1: more likely to be interpreted as emotional issues or complaining

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Speaker 1: like we've touched on and uh. Dr Nissa Goldberg, author

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Speaker 1: of the wonderfully titled women Are Not Small Men, um,

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Speaker 1: thank you, Dr Goldberg. She says, you don't want to

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Speaker 1: go to a doctor who says, now, honey, it's not

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Speaker 1: all that bad, which is true. I mean you want

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Speaker 1: to If you're taking the time to go to the doctor,

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Speaker 1: you're probably taking off work or school or whatever. You

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Speaker 1: want to be taken seriously, so listen to us. And

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Speaker 1: we're not small men, right, Like you said, we have

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Speaker 1: menstrual cycles. So we've been addressing a lot from the

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Speaker 1: patient end of things. What I'm also interested in two things.

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Speaker 1: A for people working in the medical field out there,

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Speaker 1: how do you I mean doctors and nurse practitioners and

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Speaker 1: everybody else cannot be blind to this communication barrier between

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Speaker 1: patients and the physician. So I'm wondering whether or not

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Speaker 1: this is something that is talked about, whether or not

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Speaker 1: it's something that is kind of dismissed. If you if

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Speaker 1: you have those certain patients who it's like, well they

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Speaker 1: stop talking about my mother and get ready for a

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Speaker 1: bunch of complaining um or you know, how how you

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Speaker 1: how you manage that Um and also men out there

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Speaker 1: doesn't Are are women just complaining more? Or is there

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Speaker 1: a similar disconnect between what you need when you go

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Speaker 1: into the doctor and the kind of care that you

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Speaker 1: are or are not getting. Is this something that we're

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Speaker 1: all experiencing? Because I feel like the um the issues

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Speaker 1: that we're talking about have as much to do with

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Speaker 1: with patient interaction as it does with how doctors are responding.

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Speaker 1: And I want to hear from from women. I know

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Speaker 1: we've heard from a couple already when we did our

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00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:52,920
Speaker 1: Valvedenio podcast about what symptoms have you had? What what

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00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:55,439
Speaker 1: health issues have you had? The doctors have dismissed and

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00:25:55,440 --> 00:25:58,360
Speaker 1: that you found out later it was actually something serious.

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00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:03,399
Speaker 1: So we just asked, are so much from everyone? But

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00:26:03,400 --> 00:26:06,720
Speaker 1: but really I'm very curious to hear from folks. Mom

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00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:13,960
Speaker 1: stuff at Discovery dot com is the addressed. Okay, I

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00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:17,480
Speaker 1: have a letter from Christina Um. She says, has anyone

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00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:20,040
Speaker 1: ever told you this? Before? The movie Whip? It encompasses

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00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:23,200
Speaker 1: at least six elements from stuff Mom Never Told You episodes.

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00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:28,080
Speaker 1: Let me explain. First, the Roller Derby show obviously what

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00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:30,919
Speaker 1: the movie was about slightly mentioned. Second, the women of

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00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:33,239
Speaker 1: the Oscar show. This movie was not up for an

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00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:35,160
Speaker 1: oscar as far as I know, but in mentioning general

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00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:39,200
Speaker 1: female directors, Drew Barrymore directed and start in it. Third

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00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:43,840
Speaker 1: is Miss America relevant That show? Ellen Page's character Bliss

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00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:45,640
Speaker 1: was being pressured by her mother to be a part

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00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:48,720
Speaker 1: of a beauty pageant show. Fourth feminism, as mentioned in

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00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:51,680
Speaker 1: most shows, Bliss lived happily ever after without Oliver, the

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00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:54,639
Speaker 1: cheating boyfriend decided not to buy his crap about a

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00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:57,440
Speaker 1: girl in a picture wearing a striper shirt she discovered

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00:26:57,480 --> 00:26:59,680
Speaker 1: on his band web page. Also, be your Own Hero

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00:26:59,840 --> 00:27:05,280
Speaker 1: was catchy empowering quote. Fifth bullying show. Maven Juliette Lewis's

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00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:07,679
Speaker 1: character was bullying Bliss, but earned her respect at the end.

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00:27:07,800 --> 00:27:11,040
Speaker 1: Sixth the Girl Scouts show herl Scouts was the team

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00:27:11,119 --> 00:27:13,960
Speaker 1: name that Bliss played on. Isn't this strange or is

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00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 1: this someone's favorite movie? The movie was cool, but I

456
00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:20,040
Speaker 1: love your show and wanted to point this out. So

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00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:23,080
Speaker 1: that's something I've never thought about. And I wrote back

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00:27:23,119 --> 00:27:25,320
Speaker 1: to tell her that I have never seen Whippet, but

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00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:29,280
Speaker 1: now obviously it's really cute. It's really cute, and I

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00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:31,440
Speaker 1: don't want to spoil anything for anyone who hasn't seen

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00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:34,880
Speaker 1: it kristin your mooths. But the part where you mentioned

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00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:39,600
Speaker 1: Christina the whole like living without Oliver the boyfriend. I

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00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:42,760
Speaker 1: love that theme. That's my favorite. I have no idea

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00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:44,760
Speaker 1: what you're talking about, So I'm going to talk about

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00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:48,560
Speaker 1: grammar just from Mary Ellen. She has a p sheet

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00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:51,800
Speaker 1: in linguistics and is writing in response to Grammar Girl,

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00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:54,920
Speaker 1: and she took some issue to some of the things

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00:27:55,480 --> 00:27:58,399
Speaker 1: she writes. When answering the question about whether men or

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00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:01,119
Speaker 1: women pay more attention to grammar, Grammar Girl mentions that

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00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:03,879
Speaker 1: older women tend to be bigger sticklers for grammar because

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00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:07,040
Speaker 1: all of the teachers way back when we're women. While

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00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:09,000
Speaker 1: this might be true, it's only part of the story.

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00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:12,080
Speaker 1: At least in Western culture, language has been a vehicle

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00:28:12,119 --> 00:28:15,920
Speaker 1: of upward mobility for women. Think my fair lady. If

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00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:19,520
Speaker 1: women speak properly, they can have white collar jobs such

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00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:22,960
Speaker 1: as teachers and secretaries and move out of the lower class. Men,

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00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:26,000
Speaker 1: on the other hand, benefit from speaking the vernacular and

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00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:29,399
Speaker 1: are mocked if they speak too proper, which brings to

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00:28:29,440 --> 00:28:33,399
Speaker 1: mind this the whole kind of elitism argument that crops

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00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:37,320
Speaker 1: up often in political seasons. As we are in. Finally,

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00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:39,560
Speaker 1: I want to comment on if you Will. I disagree

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00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:41,720
Speaker 1: with grammar girl. I don't think that it undercuts what

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00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:44,680
Speaker 1: you are saying. What if you Will does is ask

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00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:47,400
Speaker 1: your audience permission to use a word or phrase that

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00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:51,280
Speaker 1: you're acknowledging as inadequate but best fits because you can't

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00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:53,520
Speaker 1: think of a better word. I think it's a useful

487
00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:56,360
Speaker 1: phrase and don't see any reason that you shouldn't use it,

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00:28:56,560 --> 00:28:58,360
Speaker 1: you know what. Mary Ellen is one of many who

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00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:02,000
Speaker 1: has written in too in court of if you Will.

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00:29:02,760 --> 00:29:04,360
Speaker 1: But I don't know. I don't I don't know if

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00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:06,240
Speaker 1: I can do it. I feel like I've trained myself

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00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:11,200
Speaker 1: to weed it out so thoroughly as you wish, that

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00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:14,200
Speaker 1: as you wish will be the only thing that will

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00:29:14,240 --> 00:29:17,120
Speaker 1: suffice if you will. So, if you have any questions

495
00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:20,120
Speaker 1: to send our way. Mom Stuff at discovery dot com

496
00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:23,440
Speaker 1: is the email address, Facebook dot com, slash stuff mo

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00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:26,840
Speaker 1: I've Never Told You is the surprise Facebook place to go,

498
00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:29,760
Speaker 1: and then at mom Stuff Podcast is how you can

499
00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:32,239
Speaker 1: reach us on Twitter, and of course if you want

500
00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:34,360
Speaker 1: to find us during the week, we are over at

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00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:40,800
Speaker 1: how Stuff Works dot com. Be sure to check out

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00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:44,000
Speaker 1: our new video podcast stuff from the future. Join how

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00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:46,600
Speaker 1: Stuff Work staff as we explore the most promising and

504
00:29:46,640 --> 00:29:50,800
Speaker 1: perplexing possibilities of tomorrow. The house Stuff Works iPhone up

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00:29:50,840 --> 00:29:58,680
Speaker 1: has a ride. Download it today on iTunes, brought to

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00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:01,800
Speaker 1: you by the reinvented tooth thousand and twelve Camry. It's ready,

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00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:02,320
Speaker 1: are you