WEBVTT - Where are the Next Pandemics? 0:00:00.200 --> 0:00:04.680 From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 0:00:04.760 --> 0:00:09.080 riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 0:00:09.160 --> 0:00:12.119 learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 0:00:12.200 --> 0:00:13.920 production of iHeartRadio. 0:00:26.400 --> 0:00:29.040 Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, 0:00:29.200 --> 0:00:30.120 my name is Nol. 0:00:30.480 --> 0:00:33.320 They called me Ben and you can too. We're joined 0:00:33.360 --> 0:00:37.000 as always with our super producer Dylan the Tennessee pal Fagan. 0:00:37.320 --> 0:00:41.200 Most importantly, you are you. You are here. That makes 0:00:41.280 --> 0:00:44.519 this the stuff they don't want you to know? And 0:00:44.720 --> 0:00:49.479 we are recording on Monday, July sixth. Guys, here in 0:00:49.600 --> 0:00:53.040 our episode doc we usually have like some kind of 0:00:53.520 --> 0:00:57.880 inspirational pull quote or something apropos, but now we have 0:00:58.440 --> 0:01:04.840 a surprise. It is a strange confluence of events that 0:01:04.880 --> 0:01:10.280 we would be recording today's episode on July sixth, because 0:01:10.800 --> 0:01:14.520 get this, folks, it is World Zoonosis Day. 0:01:15.200 --> 0:01:17.880 Dude, tell what is zonosis? Is this like a utopia? 0:01:18.080 --> 0:01:23.240 I think it is like zoonotics, like not good, not 0:01:23.560 --> 0:01:28.319 casered infection that passes from a non human animal to 0:01:28.400 --> 0:01:33.280 a human animal. World Zoonosis Day commemorates the very first 0:01:33.440 --> 0:01:37.759 rabies vaccine, which was given on July sixth, eighteen eighty 0:01:37.920 --> 0:01:43.360 five and is commemorated to serve as a reminder of 0:01:43.440 --> 0:01:49.120 the ongoing threat posed by zoonotic diseases. It's a holiday 0:01:49.400 --> 0:01:53.400 that a lot of us haven't heard about, including yours. 0:01:53.400 --> 0:01:56.400 Truly, well, we are so glad to be here celebrating 0:01:56.480 --> 0:02:01.760 with you in this moment from the past. While you're 0:02:01.800 --> 0:02:06.240 listening to this episode WASHERR Gosh, speaking of anniversaries, guys, 0:02:06.240 --> 0:02:08.320 we should at least mention it here at the top 0:02:08.360 --> 0:02:12.040 of the show. The United States recently two days ago 0:02:12.400 --> 0:02:18.359 turned two hundred and fifty years. That's uh, it's pretty great, huh. 0:02:18.440 --> 0:02:21.880 Freedom to fifty baby, or America two. 0:02:21.800 --> 0:02:24.840 Fifty right, Well, that's the one as intended. Yes, maybe 0:02:24.880 --> 0:02:26.440 we walked through that just briefly. With the deal was 0:02:26.440 --> 0:02:29.520 that that was a taxpayer funded initiative to do some 0:02:29.680 --> 0:02:33.919 festivities for the anniversary of America the two hundred and 0:02:33.919 --> 0:02:37.240 fiftieth birthday, and then Trump sort of did a little 0:02:37.240 --> 0:02:40.960 bit of a switcherroony on that and target started his 0:02:41.000 --> 0:02:44.040 own pack that was called Freedom to fifty that essentially 0:02:44.080 --> 0:02:49.840 subsumed the original much more bipartisan initiative and basically made 0:02:49.880 --> 0:02:53.600 it where all of the activities and festivities were kind 0:02:53.639 --> 0:02:56.720 of enriching him and his Yeah. 0:02:56.880 --> 0:03:01.680 Yes with Sessquininnial. I want to say, is the word 0:03:02.320 --> 0:03:05.400 that's probably the best thing to come from that celebration. 0:03:05.600 --> 0:03:07.240 Let me make sure I get the word right. 0:03:07.080 --> 0:03:11.560 Here, Okay, I would just say the one the one 0:03:11.600 --> 0:03:13.320 thing that really stood out to me, And there are a 0:03:13.320 --> 0:03:18.040 lot of things that stood out there we go they're 0:03:18.040 --> 0:03:21.440 worth mentioning. Just when it comes to that celebration, you 0:03:21.600 --> 0:03:25.519 talk about the weather, how you know nature itself didn't 0:03:25.520 --> 0:03:31.359 want the festivities to contult it. But just there was 0:03:31.400 --> 0:03:35.960 a singer on stage before Greenwood or you know that 0:03:36.040 --> 0:03:38.040 guy that sings that one song that he wrote that 0:03:38.080 --> 0:03:42.360 one time, I'm proud to be in America. Least we 0:03:42.400 --> 0:03:46.360 can sing. Before all that occurred, there's another singer out 0:03:46.360 --> 0:03:50.200 there just doing playing the hits, America's hits, and at 0:03:50.240 --> 0:03:55.680 one point he yelled to the audience mid song, let 0:03:55.720 --> 0:03:59.920 the President hear you, as though it was you know it. 0:04:00.000 --> 0:04:03.680 It reminded me a lot of this concept that there's 0:04:03.680 --> 0:04:07.040 some ruler behind the scenes that is listening and needs 0:04:07.080 --> 0:04:10.520 to hear your adorations or else, what are we doing this? 0:04:10.560 --> 0:04:11.360 For sure? 0:04:11.440 --> 0:04:15.480 Does one man needs to be built up so much 0:04:15.760 --> 0:04:18.440 because he can't handle not being built up. 0:04:18.680 --> 0:04:23.839 It reminded me very much of the Hunger Games young 0:04:23.880 --> 0:04:26.800 adult novels which were later adapted into a film series. 0:04:26.800 --> 0:04:30.680 And also Folks, just to beat the emails here, I 0:04:30.920 --> 0:04:36.640 was incorrect. Transparency is important. It is not the Sesquis centennial. 0:04:36.880 --> 0:04:41.680 It is the semi quin centennial. That's two hundred and 0:04:41.680 --> 0:04:44.960 fifty years. So that's the best. That's the best takeaway. 0:04:45.880 --> 0:04:49.880 It's yeah, the two hundred and fiftieth anniversary. Now, how 0:04:49.880 --> 0:04:55.279 did we go from Let's see, we started talking about 0:04:55.560 --> 0:04:59.720 zoonotic disease. We went to July fourth. 0:05:00.040 --> 0:05:04.120 About infectious things, right, yeah. 0:05:04.040 --> 0:05:08.840 Yeah, And remember years back before the outbreak of the 0:05:08.960 --> 0:05:12.560 COVID nineteen pandemic, we did a lot of research on 0:05:12.760 --> 0:05:16.800 things like the rise of the superbug, and all of 0:05:16.839 --> 0:05:21.640 the research we looked into indicated pre COVID that a 0:05:21.720 --> 0:05:26.960 global pandemic was on the horizon was statistically inevitable. Now, 0:05:27.000 --> 0:05:31.520 this prediction was not based on any kind of insider information, 0:05:31.920 --> 0:05:37.520 no strange powers of deduction or weird Edgar Casey style prophecies. 0:05:38.080 --> 0:05:43.240 We just acknowledged that rising pollution, rising population centers, and 0:05:43.360 --> 0:05:49.960 density of populations antibiotic mass dosinge of livestock, bioweapon experiments. 0:05:50.160 --> 0:05:53.520 All these factors indicated something was going to go wrong 0:05:54.080 --> 0:05:59.400 and soon. So now two hundred and fifty years, in 0:05:59.440 --> 0:06:02.719 a few days after the foundation of the United States, 0:06:03.120 --> 0:06:05.839 we are called back to this line of inquiry. Folks. 0:06:06.200 --> 0:06:10.920 Those same experts are increasingly skittish. The people who tried 0:06:10.920 --> 0:06:14.919 to warn the world before COVID are now raising the 0:06:15.000 --> 0:06:19.200 same flags, making the same clarion calls because some of 0:06:19.200 --> 0:06:23.320 the warning signs that they clocked earlier long ago are 0:06:23.400 --> 0:06:26.680 back in play or were never resolved in the first place. 0:06:27.120 --> 0:06:32.560 So we're returning to doozy tonight, folks. What are the 0:06:32.600 --> 0:06:36.960 next pandemics and what do they mean for the future. 0:06:42.960 --> 0:06:48.039 Here are the facts, all right, just a brief thing, 0:06:48.080 --> 0:06:53.480 because we know this can be confusing. You have endemic diseases, 0:06:53.880 --> 0:06:57.720 you have disease epidemics, and then you have pandemics. So 0:06:57.800 --> 0:07:01.359 to understand pandemics, we have to understand and what we 0:07:01.400 --> 0:07:04.080 could call their little brother, the epidemic. 0:07:04.520 --> 0:07:05.560 What is an epidemic? 0:07:07.600 --> 0:07:11.400 Indeed, yes, it's wait a minute, so a pandemic. 0:07:11.960 --> 0:07:14.360 It crosses international. 0:07:13.600 --> 0:07:18.000 Borders, right, it's more of a worldwide concern. An epidemic 0:07:18.000 --> 0:07:21.040 maybe is just a little more not micro, but it's 0:07:21.040 --> 0:07:22.400 a little more contained than that. 0:07:22.680 --> 0:07:23.000 Yeah. 0:07:23.160 --> 0:07:27.600 Yeah. An epidemic is an outbreak of disease that's generally, 0:07:27.680 --> 0:07:30.640 as you said, going to be confined to a single 0:07:30.720 --> 0:07:34.360 part of an area, like a single country or maybe 0:07:34.360 --> 0:07:38.920 even a single population, and it spreads rapidly within a 0:07:39.000 --> 0:07:43.080 short period of time. So an endemic is a disease 0:07:43.560 --> 0:07:48.880 that is historically consistently present, but it's linked to a 0:07:48.920 --> 0:07:52.760 particular region like malaria is the most famous example of 0:07:52.800 --> 0:07:58.600 an endemic disease, right, And epidemic is when a disease 0:07:58.760 --> 0:08:03.760 has a rapid increase in infection in that specific area. 0:08:03.920 --> 0:08:06.800 And like you were saying, a pandemic is sort of 0:08:06.880 --> 0:08:11.120 our final boss. It is a disease with exponential growth. 0:08:11.760 --> 0:08:15.160 The difference all comes down to the rate of spread 0:08:15.680 --> 0:08:20.680 rather than to the severity of the specific disease. And 0:08:20.760 --> 0:08:23.640 so if it goes on a J curve and all 0:08:23.640 --> 0:08:26.000 of a sudden, this thing that used to only happen 0:08:26.040 --> 0:08:30.160 in a specific part of Eastern Europe or Southeast Asia 0:08:30.320 --> 0:08:33.000 or South America, all of a sudden it becomes an 0:08:33.040 --> 0:08:37.439 international lethal superstar, and a J curve that's a pandemic. 0:08:38.000 --> 0:08:42.760 Yeah, it's particularly troubling when one of these begins to 0:08:42.880 --> 0:08:44.960 rise in a place that has a lot of transportation, 0:08:45.320 --> 0:08:50.280 specifically air and ship like boat transportation, where you've got 0:08:50.640 --> 0:08:55.640 folks lots and lots of folks traveling internationally. And then 0:08:56.679 --> 0:09:00.000 I mean, that's exactly what happened with the COVID outbreak. 0:09:00.880 --> 0:09:04.559 Yeah, and epidemics, by the way, you'll hear that phrase 0:09:04.600 --> 0:09:08.959 thrown around a lot in popular news. It can take 0:09:09.000 --> 0:09:12.200 all kinds of forms an epidemic. It occurs through a 0:09:12.320 --> 0:09:15.240 variety of factors. They don't always have to be this 0:09:15.440 --> 0:09:18.839 interesting because an epidemic doesn't always have to describe an 0:09:18.840 --> 0:09:22.600 infectious disease. That's why you read about stuff like a 0:09:22.679 --> 0:09:27.839 heart disease epidemic, right, or an obesity epidemic. All that 0:09:27.920 --> 0:09:31.640 means in that usage is that more people than the 0:09:32.000 --> 0:09:36.560 historical average are contracting a condition at a faster rate 0:09:37.880 --> 0:09:41.640 than expected, and we got to keep an eye on it. 0:09:41.720 --> 0:09:46.160 Health experts take epidemics so seriously because it's like, you know, 0:09:46.240 --> 0:09:49.600 it's like if you have a problem in your car 0:09:50.040 --> 0:09:53.240 and you don't address it, it becomes a bigger problem 0:09:53.559 --> 0:09:57.280 down the road. That's why you know. That's why Stephen 0:09:57.360 --> 0:10:01.120 King wrote an awesome novel about a news reign of influenza. 0:10:01.440 --> 0:10:04.520 That's an that was an epidemic that became a pandemic. 0:10:04.600 --> 0:10:07.200 It's interesting how that word gets thrown around in pop culture, 0:10:07.360 --> 0:10:10.480 specifically with comedians. I like, do a quick Google search 0:10:10.520 --> 0:10:12.720 for Bill Burr epidemic and just see what you come 0:10:12.800 --> 0:10:15.200 up with. It's interesting how that term is used to 0:10:15.240 --> 0:10:20.160 describe the quick transmission of something that has nothing to 0:10:20.200 --> 0:10:25.040 do with being sick or you know, microbes or viruses. 0:10:24.520 --> 0:10:27.280 And it's never it's actually, maybe we can flip the 0:10:27.320 --> 0:10:31.160 script here. Epidemic is is always going to have an 0:10:31.200 --> 0:10:36.040 English and negative common connotation. Nobody is like, oh my gosh, 0:10:36.120 --> 0:10:38.000 we had an epidemic of fun. 0:10:40.360 --> 0:10:43.959 Maybe you know it's I don't mind that turn of phrase, though, 0:10:44.000 --> 0:10:46.920 I would appreciate that as someone word to trot that out. Guys, 0:10:47.440 --> 0:10:50.080 this is an epidemic of fun. 0:10:50.720 --> 0:10:53.600 Reclaim the word, guys, reclaim epidemic script. 0:10:54.160 --> 0:10:58.960 We have an epidemic of red cards being overturned by administration. Yo. 0:11:01.120 --> 0:11:04.080 That's something maybe we reserve for strange news. 0:11:03.800 --> 0:11:08.960 But when does it end, guys in the influence. 0:11:08.720 --> 0:11:10.160 An epidemic of corruption. 0:11:10.360 --> 0:11:11.240 That's what we can say. 0:11:11.280 --> 0:11:15.920 It's not even controversial, not even I'm sorry, it's just 0:11:16.400 --> 0:11:17.800 it's a great pandemic now. 0:11:17.920 --> 0:11:21.040 Yeah, and we also know pandemics. Once you get to 0:11:21.080 --> 0:11:25.120 that final boss level, a pandemic is often not going 0:11:25.160 --> 0:11:27.960 to be just one big push like the end of 0:11:28.000 --> 0:11:31.760 a Dragon Ball Z episode. It's going to be something 0:11:31.800 --> 0:11:36.040 that occurs with frequency in ways. Pandemics have a very 0:11:36.120 --> 0:11:41.319 nasty habit of spreading. Like all of us who are 0:11:41.480 --> 0:11:45.600 live post COVID nineteen lockdown, Congratulations, We're glad you're here, 0:11:45.600 --> 0:11:48.800 Thanks for tuning in. You know full well that the 0:11:48.880 --> 0:11:54.240 spread of a disease can appear to temporarily EBB, right, 0:11:54.559 --> 0:11:58.360 and then it's followed by another period of high infection, 0:11:58.920 --> 0:12:04.040 often driven by by people relaxing too much, or by god, 0:12:04.440 --> 0:12:06.559 infection mutating and evolving. 0:12:06.720 --> 0:12:08.400 I'm sorry the way you put that then has made 0:12:08.440 --> 0:12:11.800 me chuckle. A epidemic of relaxation. 0:12:11.640 --> 0:12:12.040 We had a. 0:12:14.360 --> 0:12:17.600 But Ben, you're still right. I'm just on that thinking 0:12:17.600 --> 0:12:21.559 about the mutation of something like a virus, and how 0:12:21.640 --> 0:12:25.720 many times through that, you know, from twenty nineteen all 0:12:25.720 --> 0:12:27.520 the way up until today when we see all the 0:12:27.559 --> 0:12:31.760 different variations, right, the news often talks about a variant. 0:12:32.240 --> 0:12:36.240 Sometimes you'll hear subclade as a word that gets thrown around, 0:12:36.800 --> 0:12:40.040 just a highly mutated version of the same thing. It's 0:12:40.120 --> 0:12:42.560 just now got different parts of it that infect people 0:12:42.800 --> 0:12:46.480 more effectively often or are more severe in the symptoms 0:12:46.559 --> 0:12:50.280 that they cause. And you, guys, remember earlier this year 0:12:50.400 --> 0:12:52.640 we heard a lot on the news about super flu. 0:12:53.040 --> 0:12:57.400 Remember this, yes, and just how that was so not 0:12:57.440 --> 0:13:00.120 played up. It was still dangerous, right, dangerous because it 0:13:00.160 --> 0:13:03.160 was infecting people more quickly and more effectively than other 0:13:03.240 --> 0:13:07.880 strains of the same flu with H three and two 0:13:08.520 --> 0:13:12.760 one of the flus, but it was talked about. My 0:13:12.800 --> 0:13:14.600 point I'm getting to here when we're talking about these 0:13:14.679 --> 0:13:17.600 mutations and how dangerous that little thing can be as 0:13:17.640 --> 0:13:19.880 it's going from host to host to host and changing 0:13:20.840 --> 0:13:26.040 the news often, I would say, plays on people's fear. 0:13:26.640 --> 0:13:28.920 And I wonder how much of that is just the 0:13:28.960 --> 0:13:30.880 need for clicks, the need to be the first to 0:13:30.960 --> 0:13:33.400 the post, the need you know, is it all of that? 0:13:33.480 --> 0:13:36.959 Do you think, guys, or are we just are we 0:13:37.080 --> 0:13:40.320 relaxed as you're saying, Ben, are we in that that 0:13:40.480 --> 0:13:43.280 downturn of just being and feeling relaxed. 0:13:43.760 --> 0:13:47.840 Yeah, it's too quiet. Eye of the storm to changes. 0:13:48.520 --> 0:13:50.800 We create a strain. 0:13:52.600 --> 0:13:53.360 Accepted. 0:13:55.840 --> 0:13:59.480 I mean it's true, right, the avenue flow, and people 0:13:59.679 --> 0:14:04.360 are losing lives, they're losing their jobs when stuff like 0:14:04.400 --> 0:14:08.600 this happens. Check out our earlier episode about mirror Life 0:14:08.640 --> 0:14:13.440 where we talk about the quick pace of evolution, the 0:14:13.640 --> 0:14:19.040 very very tiny things, and that's I do agree with. 0:14:18.880 --> 0:14:19.360 You, Matt. 0:14:19.400 --> 0:14:21.200 I think we can all agree that there is a 0:14:21.240 --> 0:14:29.120 lot of fear mongering, especially as legitimate journalism erodes, continues 0:14:29.160 --> 0:14:33.040 to decay and be targeted, and the journalism we're left 0:14:33.080 --> 0:14:39.200 with often becomes increasingly performative, increasingly bred in circuses. So maybe, yeah, 0:14:39.480 --> 0:14:42.280 maybe they do want to be Promethean, be first to 0:14:42.320 --> 0:14:47.440 the post. At least we can tell you a little trick. 0:14:48.720 --> 0:14:52.360 Always check out the news articles, past the headlines and 0:14:52.480 --> 0:14:57.360 look for people who are specifically citing public health experts, 0:14:57.600 --> 0:15:02.000 not necessarily political higher right, which is fine, We're not 0:15:02.240 --> 0:15:05.880 casting inspersion on them. But if you have problems with 0:15:06.240 --> 0:15:10.120 like a government person say warning you about a disease, 0:15:10.600 --> 0:15:13.480 go check out the nerds in the ivy leagues. Go 0:15:13.600 --> 0:15:17.720 find out what this guy from Harvard is saying. About hauntavirus. Right, 0:15:17.880 --> 0:15:21.280 those are the people who should be headlined in the news. 0:15:21.360 --> 0:15:22.840 Well, and this came up in a recent I think 0:15:22.840 --> 0:15:24.560 it was Strange News or maybe it was a listener mail, 0:15:24.560 --> 0:15:27.480 because we had somebody write in about a particular news 0:15:27.480 --> 0:15:31.040 aggregating app and we got into our particular methods for 0:15:31.120 --> 0:15:34.680 finding the heart of stories. And at time that's increasingly 0:15:34.920 --> 0:15:39.720 kind of muddied by you know, negative rhetoric around the press, 0:15:39.760 --> 0:15:41.640 and also the fact there are some real problems with 0:15:41.720 --> 0:15:43.560 the press in terms of like trying to be the 0:15:43.640 --> 0:15:46.160 quickest to market with a story and and doing so 0:15:46.200 --> 0:15:48.680 sort of cutting corners and not having the same level 0:15:48.680 --> 0:15:51.560 of journalistic ethics that maybe once apply when things were 0:15:51.600 --> 0:15:54.680 more print driven. So you really do just have to 0:15:54.680 --> 0:15:56.360 to your point. But I think the thing that you 0:15:56.400 --> 0:16:00.080 brought to that conversation was read a study. Even if 0:16:00.120 --> 0:16:01.880 you can't get the whole thing, you can get so 0:16:02.040 --> 0:16:05.360 much information just by reading the abstract, the little you know, 0:16:05.520 --> 0:16:09.400 the before the fold kind of summary of an academic 0:16:09.760 --> 0:16:12.320 or scientific study, and those things are out there and 0:16:12.360 --> 0:16:15.040 to your point as well, you can even email researchers 0:16:15.080 --> 0:16:16.960 and they love to hear from you to get the 0:16:17.000 --> 0:16:20.720 full text, but more important now than ever to not 0:16:20.920 --> 0:16:23.200 just you know, believe what's what's put in front of you. 0:16:23.440 --> 0:16:27.640 Yeah, triangulate your sources always. This is also folks, This 0:16:27.800 --> 0:16:31.640 is part of this approach, is part of how we 0:16:31.760 --> 0:16:36.040 ended up befriending the world's foremost expert on underwater explosions. 0:16:36.240 --> 0:16:38.840 That is a true story, Doctor Rachel Big Spinach Lance. 0:16:39.080 --> 0:16:41.720 Yes, yeah, but a big Spinach. 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:43.920 Herself dubbed nickname. 0:16:44.000 --> 0:16:47.600 Yes, yes, Well, it's just such a good point, Ben 0:16:47.680 --> 0:16:52.080 talking about the politicization of science and institutions that represent 0:16:52.280 --> 0:16:54.640 science that's supposed to be at the cutting edge and 0:16:55.000 --> 0:16:57.280 supposed to be on the front lines of protecting people, 0:16:57.680 --> 0:17:00.680 like at the Centers for Disease Control, the Institute of 0:17:00.680 --> 0:17:04.240 Allergy and Infectious Diseases, and National Institutes of Health. How 0:17:04.320 --> 0:17:07.879 often and a new administration can come in in the 0:17:07.960 --> 0:17:11.480 US and put a figurehead of sorts at the at 0:17:11.480 --> 0:17:14.120 the top of one of these organizations that is really 0:17:14.160 --> 0:17:17.320 more of a liaison between that organization and the administration. 0:17:17.560 --> 0:17:21.360 Often not always. Sometimes they're the best at the game 0:17:21.400 --> 0:17:23.960 and they're there, they're doing their thing. Sometimes it's both. 0:17:24.520 --> 0:17:28.520 Sometimes it's just somebody who's kind of putting you know, 0:17:28.560 --> 0:17:32.879 some policies forward and using these organizations to do it. 0:17:32.880 --> 0:17:35.439 It's tough to know where you are right in that 0:17:35.640 --> 0:17:39.159 in that spectrum of are we actually getting the best 0:17:39.320 --> 0:17:42.600 information here or are we being told things that somebody 0:17:42.640 --> 0:17:45.359 wants us to hear. It's a scary position to be 0:17:45.480 --> 0:17:49.320 in as a passive interpreter of the news, Like we 0:17:49.400 --> 0:17:52.440 all are right, we're all just doing that thing, trying 0:17:52.480 --> 0:17:56.359 to figure out and triangulate. I would just say, right now, 0:17:57.240 --> 0:17:59.480 when we look out as we're going to do as 0:17:59.480 --> 0:18:01.560 we're doing right now in this episode, looking out at 0:18:01.560 --> 0:18:05.159 the potentials that are coming our way, the viruses, the 0:18:07.080 --> 0:18:11.280 iicky things that might get inside our bodies, it is 0:18:11.359 --> 0:18:13.720 tough to trust anybody right now. 0:18:14.400 --> 0:18:18.880 Yeah, because it's tough to verify in a lot of ways, 0:18:18.960 --> 0:18:23.320 right I mean, Reagan was not the best actor, not 0:18:23.400 --> 0:18:27.840 the best president. But trust but verify is is a 0:18:27.920 --> 0:18:30.560 pretty interesting philosophical perspective. 0:18:30.640 --> 0:18:32.840 I think we dropped that all the time, and Matt 0:18:33.119 --> 0:18:37.119 dare we say difficult but also unwise. 0:18:37.320 --> 0:18:38.280 To trust anyone? 0:18:38.359 --> 0:18:40.520 And I hate to be that guy or that that's 0:18:40.560 --> 0:18:42.119 like sort of our mantra here on the show is 0:18:42.119 --> 0:18:45.199 trust no one. But I mean people are there are 0:18:45.240 --> 0:18:48.000 some bad actors out there that are trying to, you know, 0:18:48.880 --> 0:18:51.920 take control of the narrative. And it's really really important 0:18:51.920 --> 0:18:54.320 now more than ever to be wise to that. So 0:18:54.400 --> 0:18:57.680 don't go living your life in fear thinking everyone's trying 0:18:57.720 --> 0:19:00.720 to do you harm. But just keep your eyes open. 0:19:00.760 --> 0:19:02.840 Trust but verify, I think is the way, right. 0:19:02.920 --> 0:19:06.120 And remember, no one thinks they're the bad guy, which. 0:19:05.920 --> 0:19:09.280 Makes it even more dangerous, right because they're doing God's 0:19:09.320 --> 0:19:11.880 work right, right, especially. 0:19:11.440 --> 0:19:14.600 The guy that's got the you know, the microphone connected 0:19:14.680 --> 0:19:17.640 up to to your thing, going oh what did they say? 0:19:17.880 --> 0:19:19.960 What are they saying? Oh God, what did they say? 0:19:21.000 --> 0:19:23.240 Everybody? 0:19:23.240 --> 0:19:27.000 But what I'm saying is that the person, the perhaps 0:19:27.119 --> 0:19:29.640 like creepiest person in all of this is the one 0:19:29.640 --> 0:19:33.200 that's listening and trying to verify, right, Which is scary 0:19:33.359 --> 0:19:36.960 because that that ends up being the person that we 0:19:37.119 --> 0:19:40.040 have to trust, is the person that is checking on 0:19:40.119 --> 0:19:43.560 everybody else because they're terrified of what everybody else might 0:19:43.560 --> 0:19:48.119 be doing. It's it's a messed up situation. It feels 0:19:48.240 --> 0:19:50.560 very similar to me, guys, when I'm looking out of 0:19:50.600 --> 0:19:55.080 the landscape of all of these things, like having a 0:19:55.240 --> 0:19:59.040 parental guardian or someone in your family that is supposed 0:19:59.080 --> 0:20:01.040 to be looking out for you right as a child 0:20:01.200 --> 0:20:05.600 or something, but they've got maybe a medical condition or 0:20:06.240 --> 0:20:10.080 I'm imagining bipolar or a substance abuse problem, where you 0:20:10.160 --> 0:20:12.679 never know if you're going to get the good version 0:20:12.720 --> 0:20:17.040 of dad or mom or like the really really bad version. 0:20:17.240 --> 0:20:18.600 Yeah, the shadow version. 0:20:19.400 --> 0:20:21.560 They look the same, they sound the same. When we're 0:20:21.600 --> 0:20:23.800 talking about looking at a news article, right, or something 0:20:23.840 --> 0:20:26.680 coming from one of these official organizations. It looks the same, 0:20:26.760 --> 0:20:29.000 it sounds the same, but you have no idea if 0:20:29.040 --> 0:20:31.000 it's going to be the good or the bad version. 0:20:32.000 --> 0:20:36.800 And we also know that a lot of people didn't 0:20:37.080 --> 0:20:40.000 listen to the experts historically. I don't know if it's 0:20:40.040 --> 0:20:44.040 specifically a US thing. I think now it's more revalent 0:20:45.119 --> 0:20:49.760 across the world. But we know that until COVID nineteen 0:20:49.880 --> 0:20:54.640 hit in twenty eighteen twenty nineteen, right until COVID nineteen hit, 0:20:55.200 --> 0:20:59.440 a lot of people were not listening to the boffins right. 0:20:59.480 --> 0:21:03.560 They were to breathless headlines, and they were listening to 0:21:04.160 --> 0:21:09.320 what told them their identity and pre existing beliefs were correct. 0:21:09.400 --> 0:21:13.000 So in the years that followed, pretty much every aspect 0:21:13.280 --> 0:21:17.320 of the outbreak was heavily weaponized, like you were saying earlier, Matt, 0:21:17.400 --> 0:21:22.440 for one reason or another, it absolutely made the situation worse. 0:21:22.640 --> 0:21:26.919 People were looking for trusted sources, right, but their framework 0:21:27.000 --> 0:21:30.159 had been so warped and messed with, so fuxed with 0:21:30.760 --> 0:21:34.800 that it was difficult for them to find those sources. 0:21:34.800 --> 0:21:39.040 And countries then already were not booed up with each other, China, Russia, 0:21:39.080 --> 0:21:42.640 and the US in particular, they went crazy blaming each other. 0:21:42.680 --> 0:21:46.679 And even now we're recording again on July sixth, twenty 0:21:46.800 --> 0:21:50.960 twenty six, a lot of scientists are still debating the 0:21:51.000 --> 0:21:54.280 origin story of COVID, and a lot of the politicians 0:21:54.680 --> 0:21:59.120 are expressly not helping solve the mystery because they're trying 0:21:59.119 --> 0:22:01.160 to score points with their constituents. 0:22:01.280 --> 0:22:03.840 Oh yeah, and as we learned earlier on this show, 0:22:03.960 --> 0:22:06.600 the folks at the Nai D sure don't want you 0:22:06.640 --> 0:22:09.879 to know they were sponsoring gain of function research in 0:22:09.880 --> 0:22:13.960 a little city called Wuhan in China, specifically about coronaviruses. 0:22:14.480 --> 0:22:16.280 They do not want you to know that or think 0:22:16.320 --> 0:22:18.440 about that, right, But. 0:22:18.440 --> 0:22:22.960 We do check out our multiple episodes on that. So 0:22:23.440 --> 0:22:26.280 it's funny because we often when we're doing this as 0:22:26.280 --> 0:22:29.200 a peep behind the curtain. I'm looking over here at 0:22:29.200 --> 0:22:32.920 our research. We often put in our related episodes from 0:22:32.920 --> 0:22:35.240 the past in case we need to refer back to them. 0:22:35.600 --> 0:22:40.800 And guys, did you know that we have seven coronavirus episodes? 0:22:40.960 --> 0:22:45.200 Unfortunately a bit of a hot topic. 0:22:45.720 --> 0:22:47.640 It was a bit of a It was a bit 0:22:47.680 --> 0:22:50.080 of a time, and we know that we were recording 0:22:50.080 --> 0:22:53.560 a lot of those during the height of the COVID lockdowns. 0:22:53.880 --> 0:22:57.200 The same first time we did this, right, yeah, crap 0:22:57.680 --> 0:23:00.640 the city. Yep, the first time we went into remote recording, 0:23:00.720 --> 0:23:04.840 which has normalized for us today. While we were recording 0:23:04.880 --> 0:23:08.800 these things, while everybody was dealing with the COVID lockdowns 0:23:08.800 --> 0:23:12.360 and all the fallout, those same scientists that have been 0:23:12.359 --> 0:23:15.120 telling the world to watch out for something like COVID, 0:23:15.880 --> 0:23:20.560 they said, Okay, maybe now you'll take us seriously and 0:23:20.600 --> 0:23:23.960 know that we're not the kids who cried wolf. There 0:23:24.080 --> 0:23:29.719 is another pandemic or series of pandemics inevitably on the horizon. 0:23:30.600 --> 0:23:33.520 Everybody is hoping that we could take the lessons learned 0:23:33.560 --> 0:23:38.280 from COVID nineteen and apply them towards monitoring these things. 0:23:38.280 --> 0:23:42.080 We will call emergent threats and there are a lot 0:23:42.119 --> 0:23:44.560 of them. It was funny. I think a lot of 0:23:44.640 --> 0:23:49.680 us saw this. About six months ago, the founder of Microsoft, 0:23:49.760 --> 0:23:53.960 Bill Gates, had an in depth interview where he estimated 0:23:54.080 --> 0:23:58.679 there's a ten to fifteen percent chance of a natural 0:23:58.800 --> 0:24:03.600 pandemic urging within the next four years. A lot of 0:24:03.680 --> 0:24:06.680 us are going to say, Bill Gates, Yeah. 0:24:06.400 --> 0:24:08.000 Yeah, well but you know ebstin files. 0:24:08.040 --> 0:24:11.159 But also Bill Gates got to give him maybe a 0:24:11.160 --> 0:24:13.240 little credit where credit is due of some of the 0:24:13.359 --> 0:24:17.080 billionaire gazillionaires. The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation has done 0:24:17.320 --> 0:24:21.399 good work with you know, doing research into infectious diseases. 0:24:20.960 --> 0:24:22.600 In other countries and other parts. 0:24:22.440 --> 0:24:24.560 Of the world. So he definitely was coming at that 0:24:24.720 --> 0:24:29.720 information from a place of you know, of research, like 0:24:29.760 --> 0:24:31.400 a research place, you know. 0:24:31.800 --> 0:24:34.440 Because he doesn't he's not an expert himself. 0:24:34.240 --> 0:24:36.520 No, but he's surrounded by them and they've been doing 0:24:36.600 --> 0:24:38.440 this work. I'm not trying to say he's one of 0:24:38.520 --> 0:24:40.440 the guys, but I'm just saying it was. 0:24:40.560 --> 0:24:43.880 Accurate the information in this particular discussion. 0:24:43.920 --> 0:24:45.840 I agree with you, Yes, yeah, I agree with you. There. 0:24:45.880 --> 0:24:48.520 He hired some of the best and brightest on earth 0:24:49.040 --> 0:24:49.680 to fight. 0:24:49.480 --> 0:24:51.840 This, but wasn't there even an argument too that him 0:24:51.880 --> 0:24:53.760