1 00:00:05,360 --> 00:00:09,120 Speaker 1: My name's Rain Wilson, and I played Dwight Kurt Shrewd. 2 00:00:15,440 --> 00:00:20,880 Speaker 1: Hello everybody, Welcome to the office Deep Dive. I am 3 00:00:20,920 --> 00:00:24,400 Speaker 1: your host Brian baum Gartner. Today you will be listening 4 00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:29,680 Speaker 1: to my conversation with Rain Wilson. Now, when we started 5 00:00:29,680 --> 00:00:33,200 Speaker 1: shooting the show, um, Rain, he was the only person 6 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:38,440 Speaker 1: that I knew. I met Rain back in circa nineteen 7 00:00:39,920 --> 00:00:43,720 Speaker 1: all right. I was living in Minneapolis and I went 8 00:00:43,760 --> 00:00:47,520 Speaker 1: to see a production at the Guthrie Theater in Minneapolis. 9 00:00:47,560 --> 00:00:50,480 Speaker 1: Now you should know this. The Guthrie is a very, 10 00:00:50,640 --> 00:00:54,000 Speaker 1: very big deal. It is the largest regional theater in 11 00:00:54,040 --> 00:00:59,440 Speaker 1: the country. It puts on incredible shows, world renowned, etcetera, etcetera. Well, 12 00:00:59,640 --> 00:01:04,520 Speaker 1: Rain was starring uh in a production of Philadelphia. Here 13 00:01:04,560 --> 00:01:09,080 Speaker 1: I come. And I went to the show. And I 14 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:13,800 Speaker 1: have said this many times. Rain's performance in that show 15 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:19,360 Speaker 1: it was the greatest performance that I ever saw on 16 00:01:19,400 --> 00:01:23,080 Speaker 1: the Guthrie stage. It was brilliant. And so the show 17 00:01:23,200 --> 00:01:25,360 Speaker 1: was over and I was like, I've got to meet 18 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:29,920 Speaker 1: this guy, Rain. This guy is brilliant, and so we 19 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:35,000 Speaker 1: got introduced, we met and we became friends. And when 20 00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:36,959 Speaker 1: I showed up to work on the first day of 21 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:40,399 Speaker 1: the office. There was Rain, and I could not have 22 00:01:40,600 --> 00:01:47,080 Speaker 1: been more delighted to see him. He is He's a 23 00:01:47,120 --> 00:01:50,640 Speaker 1: special one, that's for sure. I am so excited for 24 00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:52,920 Speaker 1: you to hear this interview. You're going to hear Rain 25 00:01:53,040 --> 00:01:56,400 Speaker 1: in a way you have never heard him before. I 26 00:01:56,480 --> 00:01:59,960 Speaker 1: love talking to him. You are going to love. Let's 27 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:05,640 Speaker 1: sending to him. So, without further ado, here is Rain Wilson. 28 00:02:09,639 --> 00:02:14,320 Speaker 1: Bubble and squeak. I love it. Bubble and squeak on, 29 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:21,080 Speaker 1: Bubble and squeaker cookie every moment, lift over from the 30 00:02:21,240 --> 00:02:39,160 Speaker 1: nut before. Oh, there he is him. Buddy, Hey man, 31 00:02:39,240 --> 00:02:43,680 Speaker 1: how are you? I'm good? God see you? Yeah? Yeah? 32 00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:50,080 Speaker 1: Are you? We? Um? That felt really inappropriate? Why? Um, 33 00:02:50,240 --> 00:02:52,639 Speaker 1: we have some salty nuts for you. I saw just 34 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:56,080 Speaker 1: a giant, like five pounds of salty I was requested, 35 00:02:56,680 --> 00:03:00,959 Speaker 1: what salty nuts? Nothing is requested? What does that mean? 36 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:05,600 Speaker 1: I don't know? Um, all right, let's do this. Let's 37 00:03:05,600 --> 00:03:11,000 Speaker 1: do it. I'm all yours for two hours. Really so exciting? 38 00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:17,120 Speaker 1: Are you excited? No? Why not? It's fun to see me. 39 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:23,200 Speaker 1: I'm excited to see you. Yes, that's that's what. That's 40 00:03:23,919 --> 00:03:26,600 Speaker 1: that's where would Yeah. Yeah, we're gonna talk about a 41 00:03:26,639 --> 00:03:30,520 Speaker 1: lot of things. I also am excited about talking about 42 00:03:30,520 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 1: the office in terms of like some stuff that you 43 00:03:33,200 --> 00:03:37,480 Speaker 1: don't normally here. Yeah, like the the longer, more detailed 44 00:03:37,560 --> 00:03:40,280 Speaker 1: stories of some of the intricacies of how stuff was 45 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:42,920 Speaker 1: arrived at and some of the choices that were made 46 00:03:42,920 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 1: along the way and stuff like. Well, that's what my 47 00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:48,440 Speaker 1: goal is with you, because you're a thoughtful person. I'm 48 00:03:48,440 --> 00:03:50,160 Speaker 1: gonna try to do that. You're not gonna get that 49 00:03:50,200 --> 00:03:53,640 Speaker 1: from Creed. No, I know. Well I think we've scheduled 50 00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:57,920 Speaker 1: him for twenty two minutes. Okay, so that's fine. Um No, 51 00:03:58,000 --> 00:04:00,400 Speaker 1: but yeah, I'm excited to talk to you. What. So 52 00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:04,000 Speaker 1: we're starting, we're rolling. Yeah, we're just we're just chatting. Good. 53 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:11,360 Speaker 1: What were you doing before the office? Um? Before the Office? Well, 54 00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:14,720 Speaker 1: going way way back before. So I did theater for 55 00:04:14,760 --> 00:04:16,960 Speaker 1: about ten years in New York before I did any 56 00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:20,200 Speaker 1: TV or film, so early was a theater actor. Some 57 00:04:20,240 --> 00:04:22,400 Speaker 1: A lot of people ask like, how were you an 58 00:04:22,400 --> 00:04:25,640 Speaker 1: improv or were you and stand up or something like that, 59 00:04:25,640 --> 00:04:28,680 Speaker 1: But I didn't do anything. I'm similar to you. Yeah, 60 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:32,560 Speaker 1: theater theater person that kind of found that we were 61 00:04:32,600 --> 00:04:36,239 Speaker 1: well suited to kind of comic character guys. Despite our 62 00:04:36,800 --> 00:04:40,480 Speaker 1: ravishingly good looks. So yeah, So I came out to 63 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:45,640 Speaker 1: l A and and then started doing commercial auditions and 64 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:49,240 Speaker 1: voiceover auditions and little guest spots on TV shows. I 65 00:04:49,320 --> 00:04:54,159 Speaker 1: was unlike Charmed and yeah and C S I and 66 00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:56,159 Speaker 1: I did c S I. You did see s I too? 67 00:04:56,480 --> 00:04:59,000 Speaker 1: Or you I was a furry you're a guy who 68 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:03,279 Speaker 1: gets sexualification out of wearing a big furry suit. I 69 00:05:03,400 --> 00:05:06,360 Speaker 1: was creepy guy in Supermarket. I'm not getting creepy guy 70 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:10,680 Speaker 1: in Supermarket. I think I was dog. I think literally 71 00:05:10,720 --> 00:05:13,360 Speaker 1: that perfect. I think that was my role that was perfect. Yes, 72 00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:15,560 Speaker 1: so I did a lot of that stuff and some pilots, 73 00:05:15,600 --> 00:05:18,080 Speaker 1: and I did some decent movie roles here and there, 74 00:05:18,279 --> 00:05:22,760 Speaker 1: and um, what happened for me that really led to 75 00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:25,520 Speaker 1: the office is a lot of people think I kind 76 00:05:25,520 --> 00:05:29,280 Speaker 1: of waltzt into Dwight. But the big role that put 77 00:05:29,320 --> 00:05:31,560 Speaker 1: me on the map was in six ft Under. So 78 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:37,440 Speaker 1: after a lot of slogging around the casting people Libby Goldstein, um, 79 00:05:37,520 --> 00:05:40,880 Speaker 1: they brought me in multiple times to six ft Under, 80 00:05:40,920 --> 00:05:43,440 Speaker 1: and finally I got the role of Arthur and I 81 00:05:43,480 --> 00:05:46,479 Speaker 1: did ended up doing thirteen episodes on that right when 82 00:05:46,880 --> 00:05:50,960 Speaker 1: HBO was heating up, and that was kind of revolutionizing 83 00:05:51,000 --> 00:05:54,279 Speaker 1: what we think of as television. You know, Sopranos the 84 00:05:54,320 --> 00:05:57,680 Speaker 1: Wire were on at the same time. It was Entourage 85 00:05:57,960 --> 00:06:01,480 Speaker 1: and a lot of really amazing shows, including six ft 86 00:06:01,560 --> 00:06:04,800 Speaker 1: Under and Uh. All of a sudden, I popped onto 87 00:06:04,800 --> 00:06:09,360 Speaker 1: people's radar. Um. It was really incredible how that happened, 88 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:11,919 Speaker 1: because that was one of those shows that everyone in 89 00:06:12,040 --> 00:06:14,960 Speaker 1: l A watches. There are the shows that people watch 90 00:06:14,960 --> 00:06:17,000 Speaker 1: all across the country. They watch n c I, s 91 00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:20,000 Speaker 1: l A or something like that, and it's fifty million 92 00:06:20,040 --> 00:06:23,159 Speaker 1: people will watch it, but no one in l A 93 00:06:23,320 --> 00:06:27,760 Speaker 1: who are like taste makers watch it. So this six 94 00:06:27,760 --> 00:06:29,560 Speaker 1: ft Under was one of those kind of shows, and 95 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:31,480 Speaker 1: that's what put me on the map. And all of 96 00:06:31,520 --> 00:06:34,599 Speaker 1: a sudden, I was in kind of pretty high demand 97 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:36,960 Speaker 1: for movies and stuff. I know, you want a SAG 98 00:06:37,040 --> 00:06:40,800 Speaker 1: Award for that, the Ensemble Ensemble SAG Award. Yeah. I 99 00:06:41,120 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 1: might be the only person who has been part of 100 00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:45,960 Speaker 1: winning an Ensemble SAG Award for both drama and comedy 101 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:49,720 Speaker 1: because I did it for six ft Under and then 102 00:06:49,839 --> 00:06:53,200 Speaker 1: twice we won I think twice we won UH for 103 00:06:53,279 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 1: the Office and now so so you're in high demand, yeah, 104 00:06:57,640 --> 00:07:00,800 Speaker 1: and were you aware of the British version of The Office? 105 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:03,920 Speaker 1: I was. I was so my friend Sam Catlin, he 106 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:06,240 Speaker 1: had heard about it, and he had seen a couple 107 00:07:06,320 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 1: episodes and somehow gotten some like British DVD or something 108 00:07:09,520 --> 00:07:12,200 Speaker 1: like that and had like even like an English DVD 109 00:07:12,280 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 1: player or something somehow had advanced copies, and like, you've 110 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:19,400 Speaker 1: got to see it. Groundbreaking, amazing, And so we went 111 00:07:19,520 --> 00:07:21,840 Speaker 1: over like on a special occasional We've got to watch 112 00:07:21,920 --> 00:07:25,840 Speaker 1: The Office, and we were blown away. So I was 113 00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:29,520 Speaker 1: really truly one of the first people to see it 114 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:31,240 Speaker 1: in the United States. It might have been one of 115 00:07:31,240 --> 00:07:33,280 Speaker 1: the first couple of thousand people to see it in 116 00:07:33,320 --> 00:07:35,760 Speaker 1: the United States, and just we loved it. And then 117 00:07:35,760 --> 00:07:37,640 Speaker 1: he would get his hands on a couple more episodes 118 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:39,360 Speaker 1: and we'd go back and have dinner and watched like 119 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:43,000 Speaker 1: two or three more episodes. So I loved it. And 120 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:46,040 Speaker 1: what happened was I got cast in a pilot with 121 00:07:46,120 --> 00:07:50,600 Speaker 1: Janine Garoffalo for ABC. Mark Marrin was in it and 122 00:07:51,360 --> 00:07:54,520 Speaker 1: Bob oden Kirk was in it. And this was this 123 00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:57,760 Speaker 1: infamous pilot that we did the table read and they 124 00:07:57,800 --> 00:08:00,960 Speaker 1: pulled the plug after the table read. So they had 125 00:08:00,960 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 1: sets built, we had locations, we had cast, we had 126 00:08:04,520 --> 00:08:07,560 Speaker 1: plane tickets. We were flying out the next day, literally 127 00:08:07,640 --> 00:08:10,640 Speaker 1: the next morning after the table read, start shooting and 128 00:08:10,960 --> 00:08:13,640 Speaker 1: uh did the table read? It went terribly, but I 129 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:16,040 Speaker 1: guess what, I still got paid. And that was the 130 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:19,200 Speaker 1: same pilot season as The Office, kind of the Office 131 00:08:19,200 --> 00:08:22,400 Speaker 1: didn't really follow a pilot season when it was first casting, right, 132 00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:28,480 Speaker 1: So what happened was Vernon Sanders, who's one of the 133 00:08:28,520 --> 00:08:31,760 Speaker 1: executives and executives right, And I ran into him in 134 00:08:31,800 --> 00:08:34,080 Speaker 1: the parking lot on the way to this infamous table read, 135 00:08:34,360 --> 00:08:36,360 Speaker 1: and He's like, hey, we got good news and I 136 00:08:36,400 --> 00:08:37,920 Speaker 1: was like, what's that is? Like, we got the rights 137 00:08:37,960 --> 00:08:40,640 Speaker 1: to make the American version of the Office. And I 138 00:08:40,720 --> 00:08:43,120 Speaker 1: was like, outside, I was like, oh great, And inside 139 00:08:43,160 --> 00:08:47,960 Speaker 1: I was like, motherfucker, goddamn it, that's fucking sucked. Because 140 00:08:48,040 --> 00:08:51,080 Speaker 1: I love the British Office so much. I didn't have 141 00:08:51,440 --> 00:08:54,280 Speaker 1: an idea of like even what the American Office would be, 142 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:56,920 Speaker 1: or what role I would play or anything like that. 143 00:08:57,000 --> 00:09:00,200 Speaker 1: But I was just like inside, I was just kicking myself. 144 00:09:00,600 --> 00:09:03,240 Speaker 1: And then the plug gets pulled on that and then 145 00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:05,400 Speaker 1: I called my people and I'm like, hey, I hear 146 00:09:05,400 --> 00:09:07,360 Speaker 1: about this office, and they're like, yeah, well it was 147 00:09:07,360 --> 00:09:10,319 Speaker 1: a few months to go on that. So fortunately that 148 00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:13,440 Speaker 1: the space was opened and the door was opened. The 149 00:09:13,559 --> 00:09:17,040 Speaker 1: universe works in mysterious ways, Brian, That's right, it does, 150 00:09:17,360 --> 00:09:20,840 Speaker 1: and so you eventually get a call to go in 151 00:09:20,920 --> 00:09:25,400 Speaker 1: and meet correct. I was the first audition for the office. 152 00:09:25,640 --> 00:09:31,040 Speaker 1: I have in my office at home, framed the audition 153 00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:35,240 Speaker 1: sheet of Alison Jones the first day of the auditions 154 00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:39,120 Speaker 1: for the office, and I was number one on that list. 155 00:09:39,679 --> 00:09:43,000 Speaker 1: So other people on the list, or Jenna Fisher, you 156 00:09:43,040 --> 00:09:45,520 Speaker 1: can find. It's on my Instagram somewhere. It might even 157 00:09:45,559 --> 00:09:48,160 Speaker 1: be in my book in the in the photos included 158 00:09:48,160 --> 00:09:50,600 Speaker 1: in my books, you guys can find it. But uh, 159 00:09:50,640 --> 00:09:54,320 Speaker 1: I think Adam Scott audition. I think there were, um, 160 00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:57,320 Speaker 1: there was a lot of great talent that auditions. My 161 00:09:57,400 --> 00:09:59,480 Speaker 1: story about that I'll share with you really quick was 162 00:09:59,480 --> 00:10:02,920 Speaker 1: when Steve left, Alison Jones came to me. He had 163 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:05,559 Speaker 1: a little party, a little reception. She came and she goes, 164 00:10:05,760 --> 00:10:07,840 Speaker 1: I was looking for stuff for Steve that I thought 165 00:10:07,840 --> 00:10:09,920 Speaker 1: it might be cool. She probably gave that to you, 166 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:12,800 Speaker 1: Like when she was searching around and she hands me 167 00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:17,200 Speaker 1: a sheet and it says Kevin and it says Brian Baumgartner, 168 00:10:18,320 --> 00:10:22,760 Speaker 1: Eric stone Street and Jorge Garcia. No kidding. So that 169 00:10:22,880 --> 00:10:27,680 Speaker 1: was like the final three. But oh fantastic. So you 170 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:30,600 Speaker 1: and Helo. Eric stone Street is way richer than you. 171 00:10:31,800 --> 00:10:36,800 Speaker 1: He is now he sorry shoot sorry. So yeah, So 172 00:10:36,840 --> 00:10:40,319 Speaker 1: on that first audition, I auditioned for both Michael and Dwight, 173 00:10:41,000 --> 00:10:44,000 Speaker 1: and my Michael was just terrible. It was just simply 174 00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:46,600 Speaker 1: a Ricky Gervais impersonation. And I knew that I had 175 00:10:46,640 --> 00:10:49,120 Speaker 1: more of an affinity for the Dwight role. Uh, And 176 00:10:49,520 --> 00:10:52,160 Speaker 1: I knew that I could really deliver on that. I 177 00:10:52,280 --> 00:10:54,040 Speaker 1: just felt it in my bones. I'm like, oh, this 178 00:10:54,080 --> 00:10:57,520 Speaker 1: is me, this is that is exactly my kind of weird. Yeah, 179 00:10:57,559 --> 00:11:01,080 Speaker 1: well that I mean, you're but you were so different 180 00:11:01,520 --> 00:11:04,200 Speaker 1: also than Gareth in the British version. I mean he 181 00:11:04,240 --> 00:11:11,000 Speaker 1: was much yeah weasily and and Dwight way more authoritarian 182 00:11:11,280 --> 00:11:16,680 Speaker 1: and trying to derive power, whereas Gareth seemed more backstabby. Yeah, 183 00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:19,400 Speaker 1: we're different in a lot of ways and similar in 184 00:11:19,400 --> 00:11:23,640 Speaker 1: a lot of ways. And it was this incredible luxury 185 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:28,520 Speaker 1: to go, Okay, here's Mackenzie Crook, brilliant actor, really strange 186 00:11:28,520 --> 00:11:33,520 Speaker 1: looking dude, and he killed as Gareth and was so interesting, 187 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:36,840 Speaker 1: and I get to steal all of his best stuff, 188 00:11:37,360 --> 00:11:40,160 Speaker 1: and then there's maybe stuff that I can add that's 189 00:11:40,200 --> 00:11:42,679 Speaker 1: more of my own, so it's win win all around. 190 00:11:42,720 --> 00:11:45,920 Speaker 1: So one of the things that Dwight is most known 191 00:11:45,960 --> 00:11:52,280 Speaker 1: for is saying absolutely ludicrous, preposterous stuff with a total 192 00:11:52,480 --> 00:11:54,880 Speaker 1: straight face and a dead pan, without any knowledge that 193 00:11:55,000 --> 00:11:58,920 Speaker 1: what he's saying is ridiculous. And really, Mackenzie did that 194 00:11:59,280 --> 00:12:02,520 Speaker 1: so be to flee, and I I really just frankly 195 00:12:02,640 --> 00:12:04,760 Speaker 1: stole that from him. Another thing I stole from him 196 00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:07,640 Speaker 1: was the haircut um. I read an interview with him 197 00:12:07,679 --> 00:12:10,040 Speaker 1: where he said he went to like just a local 198 00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:13,240 Speaker 1: barber shop out in like Slough or some you know, 199 00:12:13,360 --> 00:12:16,440 Speaker 1: suburb of London, and he kind of got the haircut 200 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:19,080 Speaker 1: that would be the least flattering for his head and 201 00:12:19,120 --> 00:12:22,080 Speaker 1: the most ridiculous haircut. And I read that I was like, oh, 202 00:12:22,160 --> 00:12:24,320 Speaker 1: I want to do that. So I spent time in 203 00:12:24,360 --> 00:12:27,440 Speaker 1: the mirror figuring out what the haircut that is going 204 00:12:27,520 --> 00:12:30,160 Speaker 1: to make me look the most ridiculous. I have a 205 00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:33,280 Speaker 1: huge forehead and I was like, I'm going to frame 206 00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:37,960 Speaker 1: my forehead perfectly with these little draperies of hair that 207 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:42,040 Speaker 1: will highlight the enormity of my carapace. Is that a word? 208 00:12:42,080 --> 00:12:44,040 Speaker 1: I think it is a word. I think these guys 209 00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:47,000 Speaker 1: aren't even listening. Um and then like really short on 210 00:12:47,040 --> 00:12:49,679 Speaker 1: the sides, and then intense, and then it evolved over time. 211 00:12:49,679 --> 00:12:52,320 Speaker 1: But interesting now, so we're not going to talk too 212 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:54,680 Speaker 1: much more about the audition process. But at what point 213 00:12:54,760 --> 00:12:57,440 Speaker 1: did you meet John and Jenna and Steve in the 214 00:12:57,520 --> 00:13:02,520 Speaker 1: callback sessions? Yeah? So the callback sessions were months later, 215 00:13:03,040 --> 00:13:05,760 Speaker 1: mostly for for those listeners who don't know the way 216 00:13:05,760 --> 00:13:08,520 Speaker 1: pilot season used to work, at least less and less so. 217 00:13:08,600 --> 00:13:12,320 Speaker 1: But all the scripts would start getting released in December January, 218 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:14,680 Speaker 1: and then all the auditions where this is called pilot 219 00:13:14,720 --> 00:13:17,920 Speaker 1: season January February. They'd shoot in like March, early April. 220 00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:21,280 Speaker 1: Decisions would be made in late April or May about 221 00:13:21,360 --> 00:13:23,440 Speaker 1: staffing up for the summer and if something was going 222 00:13:23,480 --> 00:13:24,719 Speaker 1: to be on the air in September. So it so 223 00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:27,199 Speaker 1: always a very narrow kind of window. It's like this, 224 00:13:27,200 --> 00:13:29,200 Speaker 1: this is how this nine month window worked. So the 225 00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:31,840 Speaker 1: office was outside of those bounds a little bit. I 226 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:35,760 Speaker 1: think my first audition was like in September October, and 227 00:13:35,800 --> 00:13:38,600 Speaker 1: then the callback was like December, and then we shot 228 00:13:38,640 --> 00:13:41,760 Speaker 1: in like February or something like that. So I had 229 00:13:41,760 --> 00:13:44,960 Speaker 1: to wait months after that first audition, and they had 230 00:13:45,040 --> 00:13:49,480 Speaker 1: a callback situation where they brought everyone and their mother 231 00:13:49,559 --> 00:13:52,240 Speaker 1: and anyone they were considering for the role over a weekend, 232 00:13:52,840 --> 00:13:57,480 Speaker 1: and Greg was incredibly thorough and I spent maybe I 233 00:13:57,520 --> 00:13:59,760 Speaker 1: spent seven or eight hours on one of the first 234 00:13:59,840 --> 00:14:04,199 Speaker 1: day there, and I met Jenna, I met John um 235 00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:06,400 Speaker 1: Steve was shooting some other stuff, but he had a 236 00:14:06,400 --> 00:14:08,480 Speaker 1: little bit of time, and we improvised together and did 237 00:14:08,520 --> 00:14:11,400 Speaker 1: a couple of scenes together. We were given scene, oh here, 238 00:14:11,400 --> 00:14:14,640 Speaker 1: tried this scene, tried this scene, not much time to prepare, 239 00:14:14,920 --> 00:14:17,360 Speaker 1: stuff we've never seen, and just like just just shoot it, 240 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:20,560 Speaker 1: you know, and then we'd improvise, you know, like Jim 241 00:14:20,600 --> 00:14:23,400 Speaker 1: brings Dwight a glass of water, and it's like just 242 00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:25,880 Speaker 1: improvised Jim bringing you a glass of water, and Dwight 243 00:14:25,920 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 1: as immediately distrustful, like as he poisoned it or something 244 00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:31,240 Speaker 1: like that. And and that was not really my gig. 245 00:14:31,280 --> 00:14:34,280 Speaker 1: I didn't do, you know, upright citizens Brigade or Groundlings. 246 00:14:34,280 --> 00:14:37,400 Speaker 1: I wasn't really an improv guy. But I'm good at 247 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:40,800 Speaker 1: improving kind of in character. In fact, later after I 248 00:14:40,840 --> 00:14:44,200 Speaker 1: was cast, Greg came to me and we had a 249 00:14:44,200 --> 00:14:46,800 Speaker 1: coffee and he gave me kind of a little bit 250 00:14:46,840 --> 00:14:51,440 Speaker 1: of a warning talk, and it kind of scared me. Essentially, 251 00:14:51,480 --> 00:14:54,360 Speaker 1: he said, in a very diplomatic way, you improvised better 252 00:14:54,440 --> 00:14:57,480 Speaker 1: than you act when you're on the script. And I 253 00:14:57,520 --> 00:15:01,200 Speaker 1: was like why, He's like, yeah, more, it's more natural. 254 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 1: It's more when you're doing scripted stuff, it feels a 255 00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:07,880 Speaker 1: little heavy and a little forced. And I was like, oh, 256 00:15:08,080 --> 00:15:11,280 Speaker 1: and this was before we were going to shoot the pilot. 257 00:15:11,640 --> 00:15:16,280 Speaker 1: So I begged my manager. I was like, I want 258 00:15:16,320 --> 00:15:18,320 Speaker 1: to see the audition tapes. I want to see my 259 00:15:18,360 --> 00:15:22,720 Speaker 1: audition tapes. And sure enough, he was right, because somehow, 260 00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:26,080 Speaker 1: when I improvised, it was just a little looser. It's 261 00:15:26,080 --> 00:15:28,080 Speaker 1: a little more off the cough. It was a little weirder. 262 00:15:28,400 --> 00:15:30,840 Speaker 1: When I was doing scripted stuff. It's I don't want 263 00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:32,640 Speaker 1: to say it sounded like a theater actor or something 264 00:15:32,640 --> 00:15:34,960 Speaker 1: like that, but it sounded a little more scripted. It 265 00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:40,400 Speaker 1: didn't have that kind of documentary feel that the office 266 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:43,560 Speaker 1: had to have. And it was a really great learning experience, like, oh, 267 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:45,920 Speaker 1: I need to just kind of let the script, let 268 00:15:45,920 --> 00:15:48,640 Speaker 1: the script go, improvise around the script, let it be 269 00:15:48,760 --> 00:15:52,120 Speaker 1: much lighter. That is fascinating. I did not know that story, 270 00:15:52,360 --> 00:15:53,800 Speaker 1: but it kept me up at night. I was like, 271 00:15:53,880 --> 00:15:56,280 Speaker 1: oh shit, what does that mean? I improvised a good 272 00:15:56,280 --> 00:16:19,720 Speaker 1: improviser and a terrible, terrible regular actor. So I want 273 00:16:19,760 --> 00:16:24,160 Speaker 1: to talk about, Um, you creating the character of Dwight, 274 00:16:24,440 --> 00:16:27,880 Speaker 1: how you went about that? Like what elements you chose 275 00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:31,800 Speaker 1: that that you brought into Dwight? How did you approach that? 276 00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:35,280 Speaker 1: So um, I always say that in terms of like 277 00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:38,600 Speaker 1: when people ask me about playing Dwight, I always say 278 00:16:38,640 --> 00:16:42,360 Speaker 1: that I think my goal was to make Dwight very specific, 279 00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:46,080 Speaker 1: you know, having you know, Dwight have a pager, stand 280 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:49,560 Speaker 1: a certain way, like drive a certain way, sitting in 281 00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:52,640 Speaker 1: his chair a certain way, have certain attitudes about certain 282 00:16:52,640 --> 00:16:55,720 Speaker 1: things that are very specified because no one had done 283 00:16:55,720 --> 00:16:59,040 Speaker 1: like combination muscle car nerd. You know, when you think 284 00:16:59,080 --> 00:17:01,400 Speaker 1: about it, there's a lot of disparate elements that go 285 00:17:01,440 --> 00:17:05,520 Speaker 1: into the creation of Dwight, like heavy metal muscle car 286 00:17:05,640 --> 00:17:09,159 Speaker 1: rarely equals Battlestar Galactica fan, And I do think this 287 00:17:09,240 --> 00:17:11,200 Speaker 1: is true. As an actor, the more specific you make 288 00:17:11,240 --> 00:17:15,560 Speaker 1: your character. That made him more human and then more relatable. 289 00:17:15,960 --> 00:17:23,639 Speaker 1: Um so muscle car nerd um heavy metal, you know, amish. 290 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:26,520 Speaker 1: Of course, Greg Daniels always said that the beat farmer 291 00:17:27,080 --> 00:17:29,920 Speaker 1: thing was his grandparents. I think we're beat literally beat 292 00:17:29,920 --> 00:17:33,960 Speaker 1: farmers in Poland and they grew beats. Um, I think 293 00:17:34,000 --> 00:17:38,000 Speaker 1: like before the Holocaust, and uh so he put that 294 00:17:38,080 --> 00:17:40,399 Speaker 1: in from that. I did not know that. So the 295 00:17:40,440 --> 00:17:45,080 Speaker 1: beat farm was from yes. And then the glasses, which, 296 00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:47,320 Speaker 1: by the way, I really do think that Dwight has 297 00:17:47,440 --> 00:17:49,600 Speaker 1: influenced popular culture because now all the hipsters were the 298 00:17:49,680 --> 00:17:52,639 Speaker 1: Dwight classes. You were the first hipster. Yeah, I really was. 299 00:17:52,960 --> 00:17:55,320 Speaker 1: I was like the hipster nerd who took those glasses. 300 00:17:55,320 --> 00:17:58,720 Speaker 1: And and now everyone who goes to Intelligencia Coffee and 301 00:17:59,119 --> 00:18:04,360 Speaker 1: silver Lake or Brooklyn or wearing those same glasses. Um. 302 00:18:04,560 --> 00:18:07,399 Speaker 1: Free commercial for Intelligencia Coffee. Thank you, I'll take my 303 00:18:07,440 --> 00:18:13,000 Speaker 1: gift card please. Um. Was there anything for you as 304 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:15,920 Speaker 1: a theater actor like myself, It's a loaded question. Was 305 00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:21,680 Speaker 1: there anything physically, any physical manifestation of Dwight within Rain. 306 00:18:22,520 --> 00:18:25,440 Speaker 1: That's a great question, and yes there was. And I've 307 00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:28,359 Speaker 1: never really talked about this before, but I went to 308 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:31,440 Speaker 1: theater school. I was an n y U grad program, 309 00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:34,560 Speaker 1: did a lot of like clowning, and did a lot 310 00:18:34,600 --> 00:18:37,960 Speaker 1: of a lot of physical work and physical theater. You 311 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:41,800 Speaker 1: were involved in physical theater in Minneapolis, And I'm not 312 00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:44,480 Speaker 1: trying to sound pretentious at all, like mr Theater, but 313 00:18:44,840 --> 00:18:46,480 Speaker 1: when you get that kind of training, a lot of 314 00:18:46,520 --> 00:18:48,399 Speaker 1: it is physical, Like how do you find a character 315 00:18:48,480 --> 00:18:51,320 Speaker 1: in your body? You know, that's part of clown work 316 00:18:51,359 --> 00:18:54,240 Speaker 1: as well. But there were certain elements of Dwight that 317 00:18:54,320 --> 00:18:56,959 Speaker 1: if I needed to kind of get into character, I 318 00:18:57,000 --> 00:19:00,000 Speaker 1: could just put my attention, put my focus in certain 319 00:19:00,119 --> 00:19:03,240 Speaker 1: parts of my body, and I would immediately be Dwight, 320 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:06,960 Speaker 1: like a really like a straight neck, you know, and 321 00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:11,119 Speaker 1: uh kind of hips forward and kind of thinking about 322 00:19:11,160 --> 00:19:13,520 Speaker 1: like like big hips Like I don't know if you 323 00:19:13,600 --> 00:19:17,159 Speaker 1: noticed that Dwight always stands too close to people. If 324 00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:19,159 Speaker 1: someone's sitting down and he's standing next to him, like 325 00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:21,720 Speaker 1: his hips are like really like big next to their 326 00:19:21,760 --> 00:19:25,640 Speaker 1: face kind of and there's kind of a ramrod neck, 327 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,800 Speaker 1: a little bit of a swagger and the shoulders thrown back. 328 00:19:29,119 --> 00:19:31,560 Speaker 1: Those were some of the elements of Dwight that if 329 00:19:31,600 --> 00:19:33,760 Speaker 1: I was ever feeling like do I really have him 330 00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:36,639 Speaker 1: early on. You know, after you do two seasons, you 331 00:19:36,680 --> 00:19:38,760 Speaker 1: can just do the character in your sleep. But but 332 00:19:38,840 --> 00:19:42,119 Speaker 1: early on, there were some of those physical choices that 333 00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:45,920 Speaker 1: really were like clown kind of choices that I could 334 00:19:45,920 --> 00:19:48,080 Speaker 1: go to to just help me get into the world. 335 00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:50,560 Speaker 1: What about you for Kevin? Did you have something for 336 00:19:50,640 --> 00:19:53,680 Speaker 1: Kevin too? I mean too that I can articulate. I'm 337 00:19:53,680 --> 00:19:55,720 Speaker 1: sure there were more. For me, it was my jaw. 338 00:19:56,320 --> 00:19:58,120 Speaker 1: I knew there was a specific place that I could 339 00:19:58,119 --> 00:20:01,920 Speaker 1: put my jaw that was him. And also I imagined 340 00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:05,080 Speaker 1: him for the jaw thing. You had a weird mouth. 341 00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:08,600 Speaker 1: You would make like a little mouth like this, so 342 00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:11,800 Speaker 1: it's like a little jutting it for your lips should 343 00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:14,800 Speaker 1: be a little a little like pursed, Yeah, exactly. And 344 00:20:14,840 --> 00:20:17,840 Speaker 1: also I had the ideas as he moved through the space. 345 00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:20,680 Speaker 1: There were two things. One is he wasn't aware of 346 00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:23,760 Speaker 1: his size within the space right, which to me was 347 00:20:23,840 --> 00:20:26,880 Speaker 1: always hilarious when I would come against Angela right because 348 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:29,879 Speaker 1: I just wouldn't see her there and knock her around. 349 00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:33,199 Speaker 1: And the other was that there was something about my 350 00:20:33,359 --> 00:20:37,160 Speaker 1: torso that it doesn't move agilely from side to side. 351 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:41,639 Speaker 1: It's all sort of just all connected down at my 352 00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:44,400 Speaker 1: hips and that there's yeah, yeah, yeah, so the whole 353 00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:49,520 Speaker 1: body turns at the same whole and maybe even shuffle 354 00:20:49,600 --> 00:20:54,919 Speaker 1: my feet to turn to one. Um, hold on one second, 355 00:20:56,960 --> 00:21:00,000 Speaker 1: that is not your ine, that is water speak for yourself. 356 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:06,240 Speaker 1: Of Um, why do people love Dwight? Well, we talked 357 00:21:06,280 --> 00:21:09,240 Speaker 1: earlier about the specificity of Dwight, and I think that 358 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:12,959 Speaker 1: how his glasses are and how his beeper is, and 359 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:15,640 Speaker 1: that the certain colors that he wears in the car 360 00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:19,800 Speaker 1: he drives, and how he sees the world. Um. But 361 00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:24,080 Speaker 1: you know, the thing I hate the most about comedy, 362 00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:27,000 Speaker 1: and I have been known to tiptoe into this land, 363 00:21:27,040 --> 00:21:28,720 Speaker 1: but the thing I hate them most about it is 364 00:21:28,760 --> 00:21:33,080 Speaker 1: that when someone knows that they're being funny. And that's 365 00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:35,040 Speaker 1: one of the I think keys to the comedy the 366 00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:37,840 Speaker 1: Office is that none of the characters thought of themselves 367 00:21:37,880 --> 00:21:42,280 Speaker 1: as being funny. I think the documentary element helped with 368 00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:48,280 Speaker 1: that tremendously, And I tried to play Dwight as outrageously 369 00:21:48,359 --> 00:21:51,359 Speaker 1: as possible and as grounded and realistic as possible at 370 00:21:51,359 --> 00:21:54,560 Speaker 1: the same time. So look at any scene and what's happening, 371 00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:58,240 Speaker 1: as matter how ridiculous it is you can always tell 372 00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:01,440 Speaker 1: there's a child, there's a big hid in there. Yeah, 373 00:22:01,520 --> 00:22:04,880 Speaker 1: he could do just preposterous things, but I always tried 374 00:22:04,920 --> 00:22:09,120 Speaker 1: to motivate them internally with some internal drive, like this 375 00:22:09,200 --> 00:22:11,879 Speaker 1: is how Dwight saw the world, This is how you 376 00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:14,480 Speaker 1: always knew how Dwight felt. I guess that would be 377 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:17,320 Speaker 1: my number one answer is like you can always tell 378 00:22:18,080 --> 00:22:20,320 Speaker 1: what Dwight is feeling and what he's going through on 379 00:22:20,400 --> 00:22:24,480 Speaker 1: the inside. And he thinks he's hiding, you know, people think, oh, 380 00:22:24,600 --> 00:22:27,040 Speaker 1: is he you know, is he is he on the spectrum? 381 00:22:27,119 --> 00:22:29,439 Speaker 1: Does he have autism or something like that? But his 382 00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:31,359 Speaker 1: heart is on his sleeve. You can always see what 383 00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:33,919 Speaker 1: he's feeling, you know, is even if he's being haughty 384 00:22:34,000 --> 00:22:36,840 Speaker 1: or even if he's being arrogant, like, you always see 385 00:22:36,840 --> 00:22:38,640 Speaker 1: what's going on in the inside. And I think that 386 00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:41,400 Speaker 1: that allowed people to relate to him. So in those 387 00:22:41,440 --> 00:22:45,000 Speaker 1: moments when Dwight was sad or hurt, or or put 388 00:22:45,040 --> 00:23:07,199 Speaker 1: off or disappointed, like, people really felt for him. What 389 00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:09,600 Speaker 1: were your initial thoughts of the Pilot when you first 390 00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:13,520 Speaker 1: saw it? Um? Are you proud of it? I thought 391 00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:15,960 Speaker 1: the pilot. I think if you look at all of 392 00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:19,560 Speaker 1: our episodes, the pilots one of the weakest. I think 393 00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:23,880 Speaker 1: it feels a little labored. It's not as funny as 394 00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:26,320 Speaker 1: when we find our own voice in a few episodes, 395 00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:31,359 Speaker 1: the healthcare and basketball episodes a few ones later on. Um, 396 00:23:31,400 --> 00:23:34,080 Speaker 1: I liked it a lot, but because I knew the 397 00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:37,160 Speaker 1: British Office so well, I just felt like, oh, this 398 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:40,880 Speaker 1: is this is feeling a little bit like a Paler 399 00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:44,680 Speaker 1: imitation of the British Office. So I wasn't the hugest fan, 400 00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:47,600 Speaker 1: But at the same time, I really knew the potential 401 00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:52,760 Speaker 1: of the show that we had right um So going 402 00:23:52,800 --> 00:23:54,520 Speaker 1: back and watching some of the stuff that I want 403 00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:56,760 Speaker 1: to say too, and this story has been told before, 404 00:23:56,840 --> 00:24:00,600 Speaker 1: but that first season, for you listener is out there 405 00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:04,280 Speaker 1: who don't understand this, Like we did six episodes. That's 406 00:24:04,359 --> 00:24:07,639 Speaker 1: never done. No one does six episodes of the first season, 407 00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:12,680 Speaker 1: especially back in those days of network television. Network television 408 00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:15,760 Speaker 1: only makes money when they hit syndications and they have 409 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:18,720 Speaker 1: to have over a hundred episodes and they want to 410 00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:21,399 Speaker 1: shoot as many as possible. So it was really weird 411 00:24:21,440 --> 00:24:23,919 Speaker 1: that they like found some money in the budget to 412 00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:28,200 Speaker 1: kind of shoot six under the radar episodes of the Office. 413 00:24:28,240 --> 00:24:31,040 Speaker 1: But I mean, we barely hung on for the first 414 00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:34,199 Speaker 1: year and a half, and and then we were you know, 415 00:24:34,240 --> 00:24:36,040 Speaker 1: a moderate hit for a while, and then we were 416 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:40,880 Speaker 1: kind of fading. You're so fired. Whoever, that was so 417 00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:47,240 Speaker 1: fund I hit you with my five pounds and mixed nuts. 418 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:51,399 Speaker 1: So who would have ever thunk that fifteen years after 419 00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:54,160 Speaker 1: shooting the pilot, this is when we're having this conversation. 420 00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:58,200 Speaker 1: The office would be bigger than ever, two hundred episodes, 421 00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:01,639 Speaker 1: you know, defining roles for for all of us. Do 422 00:25:01,680 --> 00:25:05,960 Speaker 1: you remember after we shot the first six episodes of 423 00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:11,919 Speaker 1: season two, you and Steve and I We're sitting in 424 00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:15,680 Speaker 1: Steve's trailer and Steve said, well, at least we got 425 00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:20,080 Speaker 1: to do twelve mm hmm, and we thought we were done. Yeah, 426 00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:23,760 Speaker 1: And wasn't the next order for like four? Two? Yeah? 427 00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:26,680 Speaker 1: And then there was four and then like one, like hey, 428 00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:29,520 Speaker 1: we're doing four? How they ordered one more like it? 429 00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:32,359 Speaker 1: It's like it's just like just dribs and drafts and 430 00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:37,400 Speaker 1: this is just not done in that world of network television. Exactly. Yes, 431 00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:43,520 Speaker 1: what I remember is six, four, two, one, seven, and 432 00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:47,000 Speaker 1: then they said, okay, you can do twenty two. And 433 00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:50,960 Speaker 1: then a week later we got a third season m 434 00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:54,320 Speaker 1: and it was like, oh we're rolling, Yeah, we're off 435 00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:57,800 Speaker 1: to the races. An NBC hung that big bulletin board 436 00:25:57,880 --> 00:26:00,520 Speaker 1: up No excuse me, what's it called? A billboard word 437 00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:03,119 Speaker 1: over by its offices with the Office on it, like 438 00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:05,840 Speaker 1: from out of nowhere, all of a sudden, we were 439 00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:08,240 Speaker 1: like their prize new show, and we were going from 440 00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:12,200 Speaker 1: like almost canceled too, because the numbers just started to 441 00:26:12,240 --> 00:26:15,159 Speaker 1: shoot up dramatically and the interest in the show started 442 00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:19,239 Speaker 1: to shoot up dramatically. I mean there was forty year 443 00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:23,880 Speaker 1: old Virgin, Yes, that certainly contributed to it. My Name 444 00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:26,520 Speaker 1: is Earl. We followed My Name Is Earl, which had 445 00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:29,000 Speaker 1: much stronger numbers right out of the gate and really 446 00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:32,440 Speaker 1: helped us. And I talked about this in my book, 447 00:26:32,520 --> 00:26:36,639 Speaker 1: But what happened around that Christmas time was that the 448 00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:42,080 Speaker 1: first video iPods came out and they were preloaded with 449 00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:46,480 Speaker 1: the Office Christmas episode on it. So basically all of 450 00:26:46,520 --> 00:26:49,879 Speaker 1: the you talk about like influencers, like I view it 451 00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:52,880 Speaker 1: as like who got video iPods for Christmas? The first 452 00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:55,160 Speaker 1: year they came out, rich kids, So all the rich 453 00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:58,639 Speaker 1: kids around America all of a sudden had an Office 454 00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:01,919 Speaker 1: episode and it was young people with their iPods who 455 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:04,000 Speaker 1: knew how to set up an iTunes account because their 456 00:27:04,040 --> 00:27:07,320 Speaker 1: parents didn't. And that was the amazing thing. And I 457 00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:10,359 Speaker 1: don't think I think that blindsided everybody, including NBC, that 458 00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:15,320 Speaker 1: we would be so popular with young people, right, um, iTunes, 459 00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:20,439 Speaker 1: the video iPod technology. I mean the show were you 460 00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:24,679 Speaker 1: on my Space very briefly, like for like two and 461 00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:29,480 Speaker 1: a half months, because that was Jenna and myself and 462 00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:33,920 Speaker 1: Angela and b J really used my Space in that 463 00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:36,320 Speaker 1: first season season and a half when we were trying 464 00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:39,800 Speaker 1: to cultivate viewers. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, I hadn't thought 465 00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:41,720 Speaker 1: about that. So we were the kind of the first 466 00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:45,240 Speaker 1: show that went hand in hand with technology and social media. Yes, 467 00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:49,119 Speaker 1: and then you became kind of king of Twitter. That 468 00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:53,200 Speaker 1: was later, but yeah, two thousand nine. Early on in Twitter, 469 00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:56,760 Speaker 1: I joined early because I was founding the company sol 470 00:27:56,840 --> 00:27:59,720 Speaker 1: Pancake and they kind of insisted that I do it. 471 00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:04,000 Speaker 1: And young people, young nerdy people that were starting out 472 00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:08,240 Speaker 1: on Twitter and comedy people. Um, I was like the 473 00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:10,600 Speaker 1: big cheese for the first like nine months of Twitter 474 00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:13,199 Speaker 1: that were hardly any bigger celebrities than me. So I 475 00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:18,040 Speaker 1: immediately like had a million followers on Twitter early on, Yeah, 476 00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:22,560 Speaker 1: what um so the cold opens the show kind of 477 00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:27,000 Speaker 1: started finding itself and also finding its form, right, Like 478 00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:32,520 Speaker 1: having the cold opens that we're separate from the regular episodes, right, 479 00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:36,879 Speaker 1: what do you feel like those allowed us to do well? 480 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:41,400 Speaker 1: I think they discovered early on. Greg is one of 481 00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:45,160 Speaker 1: the people I've worked with the most who has this 482 00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:48,440 Speaker 1: ability to ride this line of like real instinct, like 483 00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:51,040 Speaker 1: he'll just throw something out like try this, I think 484 00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:53,200 Speaker 1: that will be really funny and it's weird and it's 485 00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:55,720 Speaker 1: out there and it's not related to anything, but also 486 00:28:55,800 --> 00:29:00,440 Speaker 1: like really almost spocklike precision about like what works about 487 00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:02,880 Speaker 1: characters and what works about storylines. And one of the 488 00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:06,120 Speaker 1: things they realized early on is that like you know, 489 00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:11,640 Speaker 1: Jim pranking Dwight, which the British show started obviously, but 490 00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:15,000 Speaker 1: audiences loved that, so that was a really great way 491 00:29:15,360 --> 00:29:19,200 Speaker 1: to have cold opens. They weren't all pranks, but a 492 00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:23,160 Speaker 1: lot of them were pranks, and the audience just love them. 493 00:29:23,200 --> 00:29:25,160 Speaker 1: I still to this day and people like, what's your 494 00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:27,640 Speaker 1: favorite prank? When he did this prank, when he did 495 00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:29,840 Speaker 1: that prank? Do you guys prank each other? I always 496 00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:31,600 Speaker 1: get that, like do you prank each other back say 497 00:29:31,600 --> 00:29:33,760 Speaker 1: she's like, no, we don't. It takes too much work 498 00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:36,600 Speaker 1: and effort to prank someone. You have to plan it 499 00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:39,040 Speaker 1: and think it through. We were just they're shooting a 500 00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:41,800 Speaker 1: TV show, like you know. The only thing that I 501 00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:45,000 Speaker 1: could think was and it happened like eight times. I 502 00:29:45,080 --> 00:29:49,560 Speaker 1: remember there was a period probably when the computer started working, 503 00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:52,120 Speaker 1: where we had we could send I M s to 504 00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:54,560 Speaker 1: each other, so it would be like what are you doing, 505 00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:56,560 Speaker 1: like what while someone was doing a scene like that's 506 00:29:56,600 --> 00:30:01,320 Speaker 1: kind of the only like yeah, But so I think 507 00:30:01,320 --> 00:30:05,960 Speaker 1: the cold opens really helped hook an audience in. Remember 508 00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:09,600 Speaker 1: this was not streaming. You're gonna have a commercial between 509 00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:11,400 Speaker 1: my name is Earl and then the office is going 510 00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:15,120 Speaker 1: to start. You gotta hook him. You got that ninety seconds, 511 00:30:15,320 --> 00:30:18,640 Speaker 1: two minutes. You want them to sit through the commercials 512 00:30:18,640 --> 00:30:20,800 Speaker 1: that come right after that and stick with the show. 513 00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:24,000 Speaker 1: So I think Greg was really canny about that too, 514 00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:26,240 Speaker 1: kind of like we got to hook him in and 515 00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:29,840 Speaker 1: those things became swiftly kind of one of the strongest 516 00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:32,240 Speaker 1: aspects of the show. Well, and one of the other 517 00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:35,480 Speaker 1: things that happened, which was a purely business decision, right. 518 00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:37,560 Speaker 1: I don't know if you remember this. This was when 519 00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:40,760 Speaker 1: the DVR. You would set the DVR to record from 520 00:30:40,840 --> 00:30:43,880 Speaker 1: nine to nine thirty right, and then we started showing 521 00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:46,680 Speaker 1: up at eight fifty nine. So if you had not 522 00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:49,440 Speaker 1: set it to start earlier, right, you would miss it. 523 00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:51,640 Speaker 1: So you would need to tune in earlier, which means 524 00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:54,000 Speaker 1: if you were watching another channel, you'd have to turn 525 00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:56,880 Speaker 1: over to NBC before nine o'clock. And that changed the 526 00:30:56,880 --> 00:31:00,200 Speaker 1: whole ratings things, and then the supersized episodes and all 527 00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:02,840 Speaker 1: of those things. I I you know, speaking of the 528 00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:04,800 Speaker 1: length of the episodes, we did a lot of episodes 529 00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:06,600 Speaker 1: that were double episodes, and we did a lot of 530 00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:11,200 Speaker 1: episodes that were just longer episodes. Yes, but I always 531 00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:13,680 Speaker 1: felt and I wonder if Greg would do this at 532 00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:15,120 Speaker 1: some point in time. I don't know if there's some 533 00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:18,520 Speaker 1: vault that has all of the office material. Is that 534 00:31:19,320 --> 00:31:23,440 Speaker 1: the first not the first cut, but the rough cut 535 00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:25,880 Speaker 1: that would get passed around for like notes that was 536 00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:33,160 Speaker 1: too long. The six minute cuts of episodes were always 537 00:31:33,280 --> 00:31:37,080 Speaker 1: way better, and I wonder if they'll ever be. In fact, 538 00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:39,080 Speaker 1: I think there would be a really smart money making 539 00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:43,120 Speaker 1: scheme is to re release kind of directors cuts of 540 00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:48,040 Speaker 1: all the episodes and let them be to nine minutes long. 541 00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:51,440 Speaker 1: But it was always just such a pain to like 542 00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:54,760 Speaker 1: cut them down from like that twenty five minutes sweet 543 00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:58,320 Speaker 1: Spot to that twenty one minute forty twond mark that 544 00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:01,400 Speaker 1: they would have to be to air with the commercials. 545 00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:05,880 Speaker 1: Was there any story or anything that got cut out 546 00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:09,000 Speaker 1: that you specifically remember regretting. I have one that I 547 00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:12,440 Speaker 1: yelled at the editors about. I think there was a 548 00:32:12,520 --> 00:32:17,160 Speaker 1: lot more with me and Ellie doing death RACKI early 549 00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:19,720 Speaker 1: on for Game of Thrones, that was they cut that 550 00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:22,840 Speaker 1: almost down to almost nothing, and I remember being pistols 551 00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,280 Speaker 1: like that was so funny, and they're like, we gotta 552 00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:28,600 Speaker 1: lose stuff, Sorry, we gotta cut stuff. And because it 553 00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:30,480 Speaker 1: was like the C story, so they're always going to 554 00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:32,960 Speaker 1: cut the C story. The A story is always going 555 00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:36,360 Speaker 1: to be like Michael and jan and something, and then 556 00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:38,680 Speaker 1: B stories like Dwight and Jim battling, and then the 557 00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:41,560 Speaker 1: C story is going to be like some smaller thing. 558 00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:43,320 Speaker 1: And sometimes Dwight is in the A story, but a 559 00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:45,360 Speaker 1: lot of times he's in the C story, and that's 560 00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:48,240 Speaker 1: always the one that gets kind of cut to the bone, right, 561 00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:53,560 Speaker 1: What was your one? Mine was um baby shower and 562 00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:59,040 Speaker 1: Jan is having the baby, and um, Kevin asks her 563 00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:03,600 Speaker 1: where she got her sperm donated from, and Jan says, 564 00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:06,360 Speaker 1: it's a it's a very very exclusive place. You wouldn't 565 00:33:06,360 --> 00:33:09,440 Speaker 1: know it. And Kevin says, the one behind the eye 566 00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:13,360 Speaker 1: hop and they'll look on Steve's face and her face, 567 00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:18,120 Speaker 1: and the idea that Jan's baby might have made was 568 00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:23,120 Speaker 1: just pure. And they were like, yeah, we're not doing 569 00:33:23,160 --> 00:33:25,840 Speaker 1: anything with that or like what if that. I was like, 570 00:33:25,920 --> 00:33:40,840 Speaker 1: oh my god, that's just so funny. All right, we're 571 00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:44,880 Speaker 1: gonna stop there for now. I'm so sorry we have 572 00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:48,680 Speaker 1: to stop right in the middle. That's what he said. 573 00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:51,520 Speaker 1: I guess, uh, don't freak out because you are going 574 00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:55,560 Speaker 1: to hear even more from Rain in a future episode. 575 00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:58,080 Speaker 1: But I just I had to leave you with that thought, 576 00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:02,600 Speaker 1: the idea that Kevin and may have been the father 577 00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:05,840 Speaker 1: of Jan's baby. In fact, I'm quite convinced that he 578 00:34:05,960 --> 00:34:10,160 Speaker 1: was that that that Kevin was the father of Astrid, 579 00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:13,160 Speaker 1: and he would have loved the name and giggled at it. 580 00:34:13,760 --> 00:34:17,759 Speaker 1: So think about that before we're back. Anyway, Thank you 581 00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:20,319 Speaker 1: for listening. You guys are the best. I am so 582 00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:24,080 Speaker 1: excited to have you with me. On this journey and 583 00:34:24,080 --> 00:34:27,680 Speaker 1: we'll see you next week for another episode of the 584 00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:37,800 Speaker 1: Office Deep Dive. The Office Deep Dive is hosted and 585 00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:43,360 Speaker 1: executive produced by me Brian Baumgartner, alongside our executive producer Langley. 586 00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:47,680 Speaker 1: Our senior producer is Tessa Kramer, Our associate producer is 587 00:34:47,719 --> 00:34:52,000 Speaker 1: Emily Carr, and our assistant editor is Diego Tapia. My 588 00:34:52,080 --> 00:34:55,319 Speaker 1: main man in the booth is Alec Moore. Our theme 589 00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:59,320 Speaker 1: song Bubble and Squeak, performed by my great friend Creed Bratton, 590 00:34:59,520 --> 00:35:03,120 Speaker 1: and the so it is mixed by seth Olandsky. Special 591 00:35:03,160 --> 00:35:06,160 Speaker 1: thanks to the amazing production crew who recorded these interviews 592 00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:11,320 Speaker 1: with us Joanna Sakalowski, Julia Smith, Benny Spiwack Russell with Jaya, 593 00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:18,000 Speaker 1: Margaret Borchard, Christian Bonaventura, Matthew Rosenfield, Alex Mobison, Lucy Savage, 594 00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:23,840 Speaker 1: Judson Pickwork, Jack Walden, Jonathan Mayer, Andrew Stephen, David Lincoln, 595 00:35:24,040 --> 00:35:34,080 Speaker 1: and said A Lee