Speaker 1: LinkedIn News.
Speaker 2: Not even like five minutes into this conversation with him,
Speaker 2: I start just pulling my eyes out, like full meant
Speaker 2: to be, Like I was not okay. I was really
Speaker 2: just overwhelmed and it all had come to a breaking point.
Speaker 2: And I realized through the tears that I was just overworked.
Speaker 2: I was saying yes to everything. I really wanted to
Speaker 2: prove myself and I had too much on my plate
Speaker 2: that I was gonna let things slip. And it happened.
Speaker 2: From LinkedIn News and iHeart podcasts. This is Let's Talk Offline,
Speaker 2: a show about what it takes to thrive in the
Speaker 2: early years of your career without sacrificing your values, sanity
Speaker 2: or sleep. I'm Gianna Prudenti.
Speaker 1: And I'm Jamaie Jackson Gadston. You guys know a word
Speaker 1: people do not like to hear, but it is extremely important. No.
Speaker 1: It's really hard for a lot of us to say no,
Speaker 1: because whether you are just starting out in your or
Speaker 1: you've been in your job for a while but you're
Speaker 1: trying to get promoted, we all have struggled with saying no.
Speaker 1: Trust me, I have certainly been there. You really want
Speaker 1: to make a great impression and most importantly, you want
Speaker 1: people to know that they can rely on you. But honestly,
Speaker 1: saying yes to everything can be super detrimental and at
Speaker 1: what cost.
Speaker 2: Boundaries are something all of us have, whether that's the
Speaker 2: number of tasks we're willing to take on at work
Speaker 2: or the conversations we're willing to participate in. You know,
Speaker 2: got to protect that social battery. But where a lot
Speaker 2: of us trip up is actually enforcing those boundaries. It's
Speaker 2: not easy putting your foot down, especially to the boss,
Speaker 2: but we're going to show you that there's so much
Speaker 2: power in saying no.
Speaker 1: So today, you guys, gian and I are going to
Speaker 1: talk about workplace boundaries, what stops us from making them,
Speaker 1: and how to communicate them with your coworkers. Gianna, boundaries
Speaker 1: are super important because they just have so many benefits.
Speaker 1: First of all, they help with our overall wellbeing. They
Speaker 1: helped protect our mental health, maybe even our physical, emotional,
Speaker 1: spiritual health, all the healths is. It also increases our
Speaker 1: productivity and contributes to our own personal growth. So I'm
Speaker 1: super excited to talk about this because I have a
Speaker 1: lot to say. But Jianna, let's start with you. Have
Speaker 1: you struggled to set boundaries for yourself.
Speaker 2: Yeah, how much time do we have? One of my
Speaker 2: earliest memories of corporate America, this beautiful world where we work,
Speaker 2: was a mistake that I made, my first ever mistake,
Speaker 2: which still gives me anxiety to think about. And that
Speaker 2: was a result of not enforcing any boundaries. So basically
Speaker 2: what happened was when I started my job at LinkedIn,
Speaker 2: I desperately wanted to prove myself and I wanted to
Speaker 2: build a reputation as somebody who could do multiple things,
Speaker 2: like I could wear multiple hats, and I thought that's
Speaker 2: how you would be rewarded, right as somebody who can
Speaker 2: do a bunch of things. So I thought the more
Speaker 2: I took on, the more I would be seen as
Speaker 2: a high performer, and really got caught up in the
Speaker 2: quantity of my work rather than the quality. And also
Speaker 2: at the time, I was on a contract trying to
Speaker 2: go full time, so I really was like, I will
Speaker 2: do anything to get that offer and make that transition.
Speaker 2: So naturally I said yes to every single task that
Speaker 2: came my way, and of course the quality of my
Speaker 2: work suffered, so that all came to a head when
Speaker 2: this one day I made a decision, a very rash decision,
Speaker 2: and it was a little bit of a cutting corner
Speaker 2: to be totally transparent. I was like, I have so
Speaker 2: much on my plate, so like I'm just going to
Speaker 2: do this really quickly and move on. And I thought,
Speaker 2: you know, this decision was going to be fine. Yeah
Speaker 2: it was not. It was not.
Speaker 1: It was not fine.
Speaker 2: So yeah, all of a sudden, like slacks were going off,
Speaker 2: like I had made this big mistake. All these like
Speaker 2: higher ups were getting involved. My manager wasn't even online
Speaker 2: at the time, like it was like too earlier today,
Speaker 2: like it was the start of the day. So I
Speaker 2: was hyperventilating, started immediately freaking out and quickly tried to resolve,
Speaker 2: you know, the issue at hand. But I realized like, okay,
Speaker 2: I had made this really rash decision and this was
Speaker 2: a kind of mistake where like they have a post
Speaker 2: mortem about it.
Speaker 1: You really.
Speaker 2: Really bad.
Speaker 1: Can just imagine like Gianna's face on a poster guy
Speaker 1: and a meeting in a boardroom in and I.
Speaker 2: Wasn't even in the most mortal like I was really scared.
Speaker 2: But anyway, a post mortem is like when something goes wrong,
Speaker 2: you have a meeting to discuss what happened and how
Speaker 2: you can you know, do better next time that I
Speaker 2: didn't even know those existed. All of a sudden I
Speaker 2: saw that get thrown on the calendar for other people.
Speaker 2: I was like, oh shoot, what did I do? So
Speaker 2: I literally called my mom. I was like, I'm getting fired.
Speaker 2: This is the end. But anyway, so that happened, and
Speaker 2: then I had a conversation with my manager. I messaged
Speaker 2: him and I was like, here's what just happened. Here's
Speaker 2: how I helped resolve it, but obviously we need to talk.
Speaker 2: So not even like five minutes into this conversation with him,
Speaker 2: I start just pulling my eyes out, like full meant
Speaker 2: to be, Like I was not okay. I was really
Speaker 2: just overwhelmed and it all had come to a breaking point.
Speaker 2: And in that conversation with him, I realized through the
Speaker 2: tears that I was just overworked. I was saying yes
Speaker 2: to everything. I really wanted to prove myself and I
Speaker 2: had too much on my plate that I was gonna
Speaker 2: let things slip. And it happened, right, So, yeah, that
Speaker 2: was my first lesson in the importance of having boundaries.
Speaker 2: But let me just say it has not gotten easier
Speaker 2: saying no. It's something that I think most people struggle with,
Speaker 2: especially when you're early in your career. But that was
Speaker 2: my first time realizing like, Okay, I not only have
Speaker 2: the power to say no, but I need to write
Speaker 2: I can't be saying yes to everything.
Speaker 1: HM question, though, why do you think it has not
Speaker 1: gotten easier?
Speaker 2: I feel like when you're starting out, there's still that
Speaker 2: pressure to prove yourself, especially in certain workplaces, like I'm
Speaker 2: very fortunate that nobody's like, oh, Gianna's like the young
Speaker 2: person and she doesn't know how it is, and she's,
Speaker 2: you know, she has to work her way up and
Speaker 2: build her reputation. Everyone's very open to ideas here, which
Speaker 2: I think is really refreshing. But I think in general,
Speaker 2: we feel like, Okay, we're coming in. We don't have experience, right,
Speaker 2: we need to show that we're able to do the job,
Speaker 2: so that means like not turning things down. It almost
Speaker 2: feels like you don't have permission to say no. And
Speaker 2: I think once you start doing it, you feel more
Speaker 2: comfortable with it. But in the beginning it feels like
Speaker 2: it's not even possible, and then yes, you start doing
Speaker 2: it and you get more comfortable but it's still nerve
Speaker 2: wracking being like, hey, I'm not able to take this
Speaker 2: on because you think like they're gonna be like, oh,
Speaker 2: she can't handle it, right, Like, oh, Gianna, she's so stressed,
Speaker 2: she's so overwork, she can't handle it. Where really, you're
Speaker 2: just protecting your mental health.
Speaker 1: Yeah. No, everything you said makes a lot of sense.
Speaker 1: And I think that when I think about my life,
Speaker 1: a lot of the things that you said are reflected
Speaker 1: in that. First of all, the idea that you can't
Speaker 1: even say no. So when I was thinking about setting
Speaker 1: boundaries for myself, I often go back to the first
Speaker 1: memory of what my life in corporate America was gonna
Speaker 1: look like, and that was me being a young child
Speaker 1: and my mother telling me, you are black, you are
Speaker 1: a woman, and you might be curvy when you grow up. Okay.
Speaker 1: I was a little skinny girl when I was younger
Speaker 1: because I was playing athletics. But baby, I got hips now, Okay.
Speaker 1: She was like, you are going to show up in
Speaker 1: the world and just by the natural order of who
Speaker 1: you are, you will have to work two, three, four
Speaker 1: times harder than other counterparts of yours. And that stuck
Speaker 1: with me because I think from that moment on every
Speaker 1: time I got into a work situation, whether it was creative,
Speaker 1: whether it was me touring with the dance companies, or
Speaker 1: coming to college, or even the jobs I took after school,
Speaker 1: I always knew Jamay does not get the privilege of
Speaker 1: doing the bare minimum. And it's a sad reality that unfortunately,
Speaker 1: a lot of professionals of color in particular or marginalized
Speaker 1: communities have to face. But I went into every situation knowing,
Speaker 1: you work as hard as you have to because you
Speaker 1: have to prove to people that you deserve to be here,
Speaker 1: because unfortunately, there are just gonna be people who look
Speaker 1: at you and don't believe that you belong here. I mean, heck,
Speaker 1: I've been doing this now for however many years, and
Speaker 1: I still get certain side eyes when people find out
Speaker 1: that I work in tech, because what a girl with
Speaker 1: blonde hair and big lashes and long nails can't be here,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean? There is still a stigma
Speaker 1: around people who look like me, So it kind of
Speaker 1: becomes a thing where I have to show up not
Speaker 1: just because of me, but because the next little black
Speaker 1: girl who you want to hire as your intern, You're
Speaker 1: gonna be like oh, if I had a bad experience
Speaker 1: with Ja May, I don't want to do it. It's
Speaker 1: sad that we have to have these conversations, but it's true.
Speaker 1: And the reason why I'm laying all of this out
Speaker 1: there is because I know that there is someone listening
Speaker 1: who is like, yeah, I have to sometimes feel the
Speaker 1: weight of the world on my shoulders, even though that
Speaker 1: is not fair. The reason why that's important for us
Speaker 1: to discuss is because I had no work boundaries. As
Speaker 1: a result, I can't say no to the boss because
Speaker 1: if I say no, like you said, she or here
Speaker 1: is gonna think, oh, she can't do it, or see
Speaker 1: this is why we shouldn't have hired her, or see
Speaker 1: this is why we can't promote her. You saying no
Speaker 1: feels so scary because you think what is on the
Speaker 1: other side of that no. And throughout my career I
Speaker 1: always worked multiple jobs where I just did not have
Speaker 1: a work life boundary. There was no such things as
Speaker 1: a work life balance. Like balance was not in my
Speaker 1: curriculum of knowledge throughout my twenties, and so it wasn't
Speaker 1: until I got older, and I would say older, like
Speaker 1: into like my late twenties, where all of the long
Speaker 1: nights in the early mornings had started to take a
Speaker 1: toll on me physically. I got really, really sick my
Speaker 1: senior year in college. That put me on a lot
Speaker 1: of medications that, honestly, even ten plus years later, where
Speaker 1: you are still solving for with doctors. And I say
Speaker 1: that because stress will do so much to your body.
Speaker 1: And I often think had I established stronger work boundaries
Speaker 1: earlier in my career, how much would I have saved
Speaker 1: myself the heartache of the stress later. So this is
Speaker 1: why this conversation is really important to me, because now
Speaker 1: is the time for you to set the boundary and
Speaker 1: to hold yourself to it, but more importantly, hold others
Speaker 1: to it. Because one thing I have learned is that
Speaker 1: people will test that boundary. They will dip their toe
Speaker 1: in that pool to see if it is a kiddie
Speaker 1: pool or if it is a deep tank for a shark.
Speaker 1: And the thing is the only person who can purn
Speaker 1: c meate that boundary is you. So if other people
Speaker 1: are violating that boundary, it's because you're not enforcing it enough.
Speaker 2: So we know boundaries at work are important, But what
Speaker 2: kind of boundaries can we set and how do we
Speaker 2: go about doing that.
Speaker 1: That's next.
Speaker 2: After the break, we're back and talking even more about boundaries,
Speaker 2: which can be so hard to set, especially when you're
Speaker 2: just starting out, whether you're a new grad or you're
Speaker 2: changing jobs. Early on, you feel this need just to
Speaker 2: prove yourself to everyone, so you take on more and
Speaker 2: more responsibilities and sometimes it just comes to a head,
Speaker 2: like it did in my situation. But setting boundaries at work,
Speaker 2: it's not even important. It is absolutely crucial, it.
Speaker 1: Is super crucial. It is the most crucialists of the crucialsts.
Speaker 1: So I want us to bring in our listener question
Speaker 1: for the week. This is Dear Work Bestie, where we
Speaker 1: answer the questions that you all send us. This week's
Speaker 1: question comes from Carly in New Jersey, who asks.
Speaker 3: So, I've been at my new job a little over
Speaker 3: a year, and when I left my old job, I
Speaker 3: made a goal for myself that when I started this
Speaker 3: new position, I was going to start setting more boundaries
Speaker 3: for myself to create a better work life balance. But
Speaker 3: I'm still struggling with saying no when I don't have
Speaker 3: the bandwidth and I don't have the capacity to take
Speaker 3: on any more deliverables. How do you decide when something
Speaker 3: is worth saying no to, and how do you professionally
Speaker 3: communicate that.
Speaker 2: I love that Carly started this new job with the
Speaker 2: goal of setting better boundaries, because I think the first
Speaker 2: step is recognizing that's something you need to address. And
Speaker 2: she mentions deliverables, which I just want to clarify in
Speaker 2: case you're not familiar with the term. A deliverable is
Speaker 2: something that you're handing in or providing, maybe to your
Speaker 2: manager or team. So a deliverable could be like a
Speaker 2: slide deck, which is basically a fancy term for like
Speaker 2: a power point presentation.
Speaker 1: A report, right presentation, Yeah, just something that you actually
Speaker 1: have to turn in, right, Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think that's so important is first understanding what can
Speaker 2: I even set a boundary around. And I think it's
Speaker 2: also really important to understand the effects of taking on
Speaker 2: too much, which in Carly's situation, she's saying, you know,
Speaker 2: I don't have the bandwidth and capacity to take on
Speaker 2: more deliverables. And you know, I remember this conversation I
Speaker 2: once had with an organizational psychologist for a newsletter article
Speaker 2: I was writing, and she was sharing the negative effects
Speaker 2: of overworking, which I think so many of us experience
Speaker 2: and don't even recognize while it's happening, And she said,
Speaker 2: you know, it's trouble concentrating, poor quality of sleep, You're
Speaker 2: more irritable, you have less patience, you have headaches, and
Speaker 2: all these symptoms then impact our performance. And I totally
Speaker 2: relate to this because at one point where I was
Speaker 2: really stressed at work, I had a lot on my plate.
Speaker 2: I remember I would I talk to my mom every day.
Speaker 2: I love you, Mom, and she would call me and
Speaker 2: I would be so irritable on the phone and I
Speaker 2: would always have to text her after and be like, hey,
Speaker 2: I'm so sorry, like it was just a busy day,
Speaker 2: and I really like probably shouldn't have taken the phone
Speaker 2: call because I was just like so mentally tapped out.
Speaker 2: So it actually impacts your personal life. Oh absolutely, That's
Speaker 2: the reason why these boundaries are so important. I'm wondering,
Speaker 2: from your own experience, what kind of boundaries have you sat? Like,
Speaker 2: what's even possible?
Speaker 3: Ooh?
Speaker 1: I love this because everyone's situation is so different, right,
Speaker 1: So I like to think of boundaries well, one as expectations, Right,
Speaker 1: what are people's expectations of how you're going to show up?
Speaker 1: So I really want everyone to first of all, remember
Speaker 1: that there are different types of boundaries that you can enforce.
Speaker 1: So I like to break this down into two different
Speaker 1: big buckets. The first one is physical, and yes I
Speaker 1: am actually speaking both physically, like back up, get why
Speaker 1: are you so close to me? Like you are? Okay?
Speaker 1: To enforce that hand holding, touching, you know, high fiving, hugging.
Speaker 1: You know, some people like to greet people in the
Speaker 1: morning with a hug. Some people don't want to be
Speaker 1: touched and maybe you don't want to be touched hers.
Speaker 1: Just so I know, it really depends on the day.
Speaker 1: You'll see it in my eyes what I'm feeling. But
Speaker 1: like you know, there's the physical. But also when I
Speaker 1: say physical, I mean other technical things of the job.
Speaker 1: So for instance, sometimes you can determine what your hours
Speaker 1: are working, right, maybe you are a nine to five
Speaker 1: corporate baddy, maybe you might be a ten to six.
Speaker 1: Maybe you might you know, be taking a class in
Speaker 1: the middle of the day so you make up those
Speaker 1: hours later on. Those are conversations that you would want
Speaker 1: to have with your manager. Another thing that I think
Speaker 1: is really important are things like calendars. Right, I am
Speaker 1: a girl, it has to be on the calendar, A
Speaker 1: minimum of twenty four hours in advance. If you throw
Speaker 1: something on my unless it's like an emergency, please do
Speaker 1: not do same day things on my calendar, because by
Speaker 1: then I have already mapped out my day and I
Speaker 1: already know how my day is gonna flow, and throwing
Speaker 1: on a fifteen twenty thirty minute out of nowhere, first
Speaker 1: of all, can be varying anxiety inducing.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 1: So you also can control your calendar and enforcing how
Speaker 1: people work with that, keeping it up to date, and
Speaker 1: making sure that people put it on the calendar. Another
Speaker 1: thing that I think is really important, especially now that
Speaker 1: a lot of people are working remotely, is camera on
Speaker 1: and off. Baby, Like if there there might be a
Speaker 1: day of the week you just don't want to have
Speaker 1: your camera on, you know, or maybe after a certain
Speaker 1: time or before a certain time. So those are a
Speaker 1: couple of examples of physical boundaries, right, But then you
Speaker 1: also have mental boundaries, and I think these are the
Speaker 1: ones that people really think about when we talk about
Speaker 1: enforcing them. These are different things like choosing not to
Speaker 1: be part of certain discussions. Right. It can be as
Speaker 1: lighthearted as not wanting to gossip about fellow people in
Speaker 1: the office and you don't want to be involved in
Speaker 1: that all the way to the most hearty conversations that
Speaker 1: talk about race. You know, I will never forget when
Speaker 1: I was working in media a couple of years ago
Speaker 1: when George Floyd was murdered and a lot of people
Speaker 1: wanted to have a lot of discussions on email and
Speaker 1: slack and make it and bring what was happening in
Speaker 1: our personal lives to work, and I said, there has
Speaker 1: to be an escape for me because I feel this
Speaker 1: very very deeply. So no, I do not want to
Speaker 1: be added to the slack thread. No, I am not
Speaker 1: about to educate other people on what books they need
Speaker 1: to read to learn more about the black experience. I
Speaker 1: had a right then to step away from that discussion,
Speaker 1: and you have the right to to step away from
Speaker 1: certain discussions that trigger you that you don't feel comfortable with.
Speaker 1: And here's the thing that I want to emphasize. It
Speaker 1: does not matter why you say no to that. You
Speaker 1: do not have to justify nor explain to people. It
Speaker 1: could just be something that you just really don't want
Speaker 1: to be a part of it. I don't want to
Speaker 1: be part of this mess, you know, So you are
Speaker 1: okay to say no other things, is like understanding what
Speaker 1: your own capabilities are. There are sometimes, Gianna, where the
Speaker 1: anxiety wins for me and Sam, the anxiety wins, And
Speaker 1: those are the days I have to have a real
Speaker 1: heart tart conversation with my manager or with my team
Speaker 1: or with the people who I'm working on projects with,
Speaker 1: and I'm just being like, look, guys, I'm not operating
Speaker 1: at one hundred today. This is what I can give.
Speaker 1: How can we pivot and navigate? And those are conversations
Speaker 1: that you have to have, right And so I definitely
Speaker 1: think that when we think about boundaries, think about the
Speaker 1: physical boundaries that you would want to enforce, but really
Speaker 1: take a step and think about those mental boundaries.
Speaker 2: But then, of course it comes to communicating it. And
Speaker 2: you mentioned this before, when it comes to having that
Speaker 2: conversation with your manager. And when I was speaking to
Speaker 2: this organizational psychologist, she said to me, Jianna, no is
Speaker 2: a complete sentence, and I was like, You're so right
Speaker 2: about that. But in the workplace where there are power dynamics,
Speaker 2: especially when you're early in your career, I think giving
Speaker 2: context can be really helpful and I think it makes
Speaker 2: you feel more comfortable saying no. Ultimately, though, and she
Speaker 2: mentioned this, it comes down to the psychological safety you
Speaker 2: feel with your colleagues or your manager. So do you
Speaker 2: feel comfortable sharing with your new manager that you're overloaded?
Speaker 2: Let's say you did that was my experience, you know,
Speaker 2: when I made that early mistake at work.
Speaker 1: You can say.
Speaker 2: Something like, Hey, I'm trying to maintain the quality of
Speaker 2: my work. Here's what I've done to already organize myself. Together,
Speaker 2: can we decide the best way to handle my workload?
Speaker 2: If this new task you're giving me is a top priority,
Speaker 2: you are able to then prioritize your tasks and come
Speaker 2: together to make a plan moving forward. The reality is,
Speaker 2: though everyone might not feel comfortable with their manager or
Speaker 2: might think, you know, I can't say no to this person.
Speaker 2: So I think it can be helpful in those situations
Speaker 2: to find allies. Right, So you and I are working
Speaker 2: on a podcast right now together. Let's say I'm totally
Speaker 2: work with something outside of this, and we have a task,
Speaker 2: we have a deadline for the podcast. Maybe I come
Speaker 2: to you and I'm like, hey, Jamay, can I pass
Speaker 2: this off to you? I know I said I would
Speaker 2: do it, but I'm just totally overworked right now, and
Speaker 2: you're like, oh, gee, totally got you. I'll take it.
Speaker 2: So then I could go to my manager and be like, hey,
Speaker 2: for that project I'm working on with Jamay, she mentioned
Speaker 2: she has the bandwidth to actually take on that task,
Speaker 2: so I'm going to pass, you know, some of those
Speaker 2: duties off to her so I can prioritize what you're
Speaker 2: now giving me. Right, So you're coming in already with
Speaker 2: an action plan and being like they can say you know, okay,
Speaker 2: that sounds great, or you can end that with like,
Speaker 2: what do you think about this? Right, so they could
Speaker 2: be like, oh, that sounds great, or you know, maybe
Speaker 2: we could do X, Y and Z. But it opens
Speaker 2: that conversation with somebody who you might not feel comfortable
Speaker 2: having that conversation with in the first place. But ultimately,
Speaker 2: it's about, you know, identifying what is the must have
Speaker 2: work I need to get done and what is the
Speaker 2: nice to have stuff that I can maybe move further
Speaker 2: down my to do list. And this is literally why
Speaker 2: I started using Google doc with my to do list,
Speaker 2: so I could physically move around my tasks into later
Speaker 2: in the week. Because my physical planner, like I love
Speaker 2: to write down I have like a thousand notebooks was
Speaker 2: getting so messy for me scribbling out things I didn't
Speaker 2: get to But now because it's digital, I get to
Speaker 2: just move things around and it's so beautiful and organized.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna need a copy yea with template with.
Speaker 2: Little like checkboxes that cross it out. Oh, it's so satisfying.
Speaker 2: But you have to build a boundary system that has
Speaker 2: some flex in it.
Speaker 1: Yeah. And I really love the verbiage that you provided
Speaker 1: that people can use, mostly because I think for a
Speaker 1: lot of people, when we say no, we're terrified about
Speaker 1: the assumption that we just cannot physically do it, like
Speaker 1: that there's something incompetent about us that is the reason
Speaker 1: why we are not able to achieve whatever. And that
Speaker 1: can be very terrifying when you're trying to talk to
Speaker 1: a manager because you don't want them to get that
Speaker 1: as the perception of you. So I like the verbage
Speaker 1: you use because it's actually saying, invite your manager to
Speaker 1: be a partner with you in this. And then lastly,
Speaker 1: I think it's really important here for you to be
Speaker 1: compassionate towards yourself. Right, you got to give yourself grease
Speaker 1: because you are going to beat yourself up trying to
Speaker 1: live up to this unrealistic standard of work excellence that
Speaker 1: you have in your mind. And I get it. You
Speaker 1: are starting out in your career. You are just starting out.
Speaker 1: You really want to prove yourself. But baby, I promise you,
Speaker 1: in five ten years, you will not care that one
Speaker 1: extra assignment that you stayed up all night working on
Speaker 1: is not gonna get you the promotion more than likely not.
Speaker 1: And I guarantee you when you are in your late
Speaker 1: twenties early thirties, you were gonna look back. You're not
Speaker 1: even gonna remember all the stuff that you did. So
Speaker 1: I always like to say, like, is this going to
Speaker 1: matter in a year from now? The reality is most
Speaker 1: things don't. So set the boundary. Stand for a minute
Speaker 1: and be compassionate towards yourself.
Speaker 2: I love that.
Speaker 1: We're gonna take a short break. We've still got a
Speaker 1: lot more to say about boundaries. And also we're gonna
Speaker 1: talk about why you should maybe think twice about wearing
Speaker 1: white shorts in the office. That's next. Okay, guys, So
Speaker 1: you guys have heard us talk to Carly about her situation.
Speaker 1: But hopefully you all are walking away with actionable, tangible
Speaker 1: feelings about how to enforce your boundaries. A couple of
Speaker 1: things that I am taking away from this conversation is
Speaker 1: that as hard as boundaries are, they are absolutely necessary.
Speaker 1: And the beautiful thing about a boundary is that you
Speaker 1: can determine today what your boundary is, and it can
Speaker 1: shift and pivot and move, and it's flexible and you
Speaker 1: always have the right to change that boundary. Another thing
Speaker 1: that I think is really important is that it's okay
Speaker 1: to start small, right Like your work boundary doesn't have
Speaker 1: to be this big ginormous thing, like I'm only gonna
Speaker 1: work here and I need a trailer and a diva,
Speaker 1: and like you don't have to do all that. You
Speaker 1: can start even something as small as just like when
Speaker 1: you're gonna respond to emails or navigating when deadlines are
Speaker 1: going to hit, or what you need to do during
Speaker 1: your day. And the beautiful thing about a boundaries that
Speaker 1: it doesn't just apply to your work life. You can
Speaker 1: do it with family, you can do it with friends.
Speaker 1: I encourage you to do it with them and practice
Speaker 1: with people who you love. Gianna, what do you think?
Speaker 2: I love that. I love that you mentioned small boundaries
Speaker 2: to start. I think that's so important. A few things
Speaker 2: I'm taking away are from what you said, which is
Speaker 2: the more upfront you are about your boundaries and the
Speaker 2: earlier on you set them, the better off you'll be
Speaker 2: in the long run, because your career is long. It's
Speaker 2: a long time, so you will truly burn out multiple
Speaker 2: times if you don't set those boundaries. I think what
Speaker 2: I'm still learning, which I'm hoping to improve, is when
Speaker 2: you set a boundary, you gotta stick to it for yourself.
Speaker 2: Like I have a lot of flex in my own
Speaker 2: boundaries now, and you were saying, you know, when you
Speaker 2: set them, enforce them and communicate them. So I think
Speaker 2: that's something I'm taking away is that you have the
Speaker 2: power one to say no, but also to enforce those
Speaker 2: boundaries after the fact.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I hate to be that person, but I'm
Speaker 1: gonna be honest with you all besties, people will try
Speaker 1: to play you, and it's just human nature, but people
Speaker 1: will try to play you. So if you have a boundary,
Speaker 1: Let's say your boundary is I don't respond to emails
Speaker 1: after five pm. Someone is gonna send you that six
Speaker 1: pm email and if you respond, you have just showed them.
Speaker 1: Oh I will actually respond, So now your boundary is
Speaker 1: not enforceable. So the day that you really need it
Speaker 1: to be five, nobody is gonna respect you. You gotta
Speaker 1: have respect in these streets, stand up, talk, straightening it back.
Speaker 1: That's me, Yeah, that's me.
Speaker 2: But I'm working on it, I promise. Okay, jam I
Speaker 2: think it's time we switch it up. Oh, we are
Speaker 2: going to move into our next segment, which is called
Speaker 2: miss Understood the assignment. This is where we talk about
Speaker 2: some of our biggest work fails, through all of them,
Speaker 2: from those embarrassing cringe moments to our most humbling moments
Speaker 2: at work, and what we've learned from those experiences. Jamay,
Speaker 2: I think you've got a story for us this week.
Speaker 1: Oh, I absolutely do. I'm ready, and honestly, the story
Speaker 1: is top of mind because it is warm right now,
Speaker 1: and it's hot. It is hot, hot, hot, and I
Speaker 1: have been outside and I've been seeing a lot of
Speaker 1: people and really nice summer outfits, and it reminded me
Speaker 1: of the trauma that I faced. So let me tell you,
Speaker 1: Giana of the time, Jamay war White.
Speaker 2: Short no office.
Speaker 1: So years ago I started working on a fashion magazine,
Speaker 1: which makes it all the worse. Right like this, is
Speaker 1: like a high profile women's lifestyle magazine still in its
Speaker 1: very print and digital era. I was working in the
Speaker 1: fashion department and so I remember wearing this outfit to work.
Speaker 1: I was probably like on my it was like week
Speaker 1: one and a half, right, so like long enough that
Speaker 1: the girls knew who I was, but not long enough
Speaker 1: that they knew I was to that girl, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean. So I wore this blue and white
Speaker 1: striped shirt and these white linen shorts. I thought I
Speaker 1: was the cutest thing since slice bread Baby. Okay, the
Speaker 1: waist he probably were okay, yeah, the booty was sitting
Speaker 1: like everything was good. Okay. So we were at lunch
Speaker 1: and essentially there was like a outdoor area because it
Speaker 1: sat over the what is the Hudson that you can
Speaker 1: see across and look to Jersey. I don't know you're
Speaker 1: a Jersey in Yeah, yeah, because the Hudson.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 1: So I went and got my lunch and then I
Speaker 1: went and sat outside, and outside seating was like wood.
Speaker 1: So I sat down and I immediately felt something wet
Speaker 1: underneath me. So I stood up and I looked, and
Speaker 1: I didn't see anything. So I was like, okay, that's
Speaker 1: kind of weird. Maybe you know, I just imagined it
Speaker 1: in my head.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Go Throughout the rest of the day, I'm walking the hallways,
Speaker 1: I'm switching. I'm feeling like fraying fine up in here, okay,
Speaker 1: And people are like looking at me, and I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 1: because I'm that girl. I'm that girl. I'm that girl.
Speaker 1: Sleigh slay Sleigh like vote vote vote, Gianna. It was
Speaker 1: the end of the day. Oh, it was like after
Speaker 1: six pm, and I was like, okay, I gotta go
Speaker 1: to the bathroom. For whatever reason that day, I just,
Speaker 1: oh my God, to use the bathroom. I don't know,
Speaker 1: I don't know what was going on. I went to
Speaker 1: the bathroom and I did like last looks. As I
Speaker 1: was leaving out, I turned around and on the back
Speaker 1: of these white linen shorts was a reddish brown liquid
Speaker 1: stain that made it look like period blood. I don't
Speaker 1: know what I sat on in the wood. I don't
Speaker 1: know if it was the water in the wood combined
Speaker 1: and made like a wood baby, cor, I don't know
Speaker 1: what it was.
Speaker 2: How did you not see that when he stood up,
Speaker 2: there's nothing on the bend. There was nothing on the
Speaker 2: pen they played you. I was traumatized and guys, Oh my.
Speaker 1: God, I'm emotional, guys, because it was summertime, so I
Speaker 1: don't have a jacket or a sweater or anything to
Speaker 1: put around me. I am just here in my white
Speaker 1: shorts at a fashion magazine with what looks like period blood.
Speaker 1: And oh god, I was so trying to have a question.
Speaker 2: Have you ever worn white shorts?
Speaker 1: Never? Never? And anyone who wears them, I look at
Speaker 1: you with contempt in my heart. I am so sorry.
Speaker 1: I can't wear white anything anymore. I just like white shirts,
Speaker 1: white pants, the only thing white sneakers, that is it?
Speaker 1: Anything else? I am too traumatized by it. It Oh
Speaker 1: my gosh. But okay, I think what hurt me the worst,
Speaker 1: because obviously I want to give you guys a lesson
Speaker 1: here in my lesson can't be don't wear white shirts.
Speaker 1: I can't be that petty. But what hurt me the
Speaker 1: worst was that there were a lot of women right
Speaker 1: on the floor working there, whether it was the fashion
Speaker 1: director or the interns or the editors, and not a
Speaker 1: single person just pulled me aside and said, hey, check
Speaker 1: your shorts. And I have been in situations where I've
Speaker 1: looked out for other women because you know, it's naturally,
Speaker 1: you know, it's natural, you know, and they're always.
Speaker 2: So grateful, and no one's like, why are you looking
Speaker 2: at me?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 1: No one's being like, oh well, no, let me rock,
Speaker 1: Like no, that way right, you know, a fashion statement
Speaker 1: like no please, Like I was so hurt that nobody
Speaker 1: looked out for me. And then naturally I had to
Speaker 1: do the walk of shame home because I had to
Speaker 1: ride the train home because I was going back to Brooklyn.
Speaker 1: And here I am in these pants that I am
Speaker 1: just terrified that everyone in the world is seeing. So
Speaker 1: a couple of lessons here, like in truth once now
Speaker 1: that my blood is kind of cooling down, a couple
Speaker 1: of lessons here is, First of all, if you were
Speaker 1: the person who sees something say something, you don't know
Speaker 1: what's going on. And I know, sometimes like we have
Speaker 1: bystander mentality, which is a really scary thing, right where
Speaker 1: we see things and we don't say things, but you
Speaker 1: really don't know how. Maybe someone just doesn't have the
Speaker 1: awareness or in a situation like mine, it was just
Speaker 1: a genuine accident, just an evil fate of the gods
Speaker 1: that just did this to me. But like, either way, sorry,
Speaker 1: getting off my eyes twitching again, like just say something right,
Speaker 1: because you really will help someone out. Also, a lesson
Speaker 1: that I learned then is to always carry something with you,
Speaker 1: whether either that or be within close proximity to a
Speaker 1: store that you can go out and run out and
Speaker 1: buy something. I mean, at that time, I didn't have
Speaker 1: the funds to do it, so I would definitely say
Speaker 1: carrying a blazer or a jacket, a card again, something
Speaker 1: that you can wrap around your waist in case you
Speaker 1: have an accident down there. I know people are gonna
Speaker 1: think this is controversial, but I really do believe in
Speaker 1: also bringing extra undergarments and storing them somewhere because you
Speaker 1: just never know, Like we never know what's going to happen,
Speaker 1: but you always want to have something in case you
Speaker 1: have to pivot or navigate. Imagine if I had to
Speaker 1: report to the CEO that day I had to do
Speaker 1: a presentation.
Speaker 2: Gianna, No, I can't. If you haven't been there already,
Speaker 2: it probably will happen at some point. I was there
Speaker 2: a few weeks ago, running out on my lunch hour
Speaker 2: to the nearest store to buy something, like its naturally happens,
Speaker 2: it's it's it's.
Speaker 1: Natural and it happens. And I mean, obviously I felt
Speaker 1: a lot of shame in that moment, which you know
Speaker 1: I should not have. But I mean, naturally, it's it's
Speaker 1: normal to feel guilty. But what I will say is
Speaker 1: that if you all plan in advance, don't be like
Speaker 1: you may. If you want to wear white or any
Speaker 1: other color in the office, just make sure you always
Speaker 1: have a backup outfit. Okay, I certainly misunderstood the assignment.
Speaker 2: Thank you for reliving that trauma. I know that was hard.
Speaker 1: I'm going to talk to my therapist now.
Speaker 2: All right, guys, that's all from us to speak. Thanks
Speaker 2: so much. Thank for listening.
Speaker 1: Yes, thank you. And look, you guys are listening to us,
Speaker 1: which clearly means that you like me and Gianna. So
Speaker 1: we might as well make this thing official. Okay, make
Speaker 1: sure that you give us a five star rating and
Speaker 1: review wherever you are listening to this podcast, but also
Speaker 1: don't forget to follow the podcast so that you don't
Speaker 1: miss a future episode.
Speaker 2: And don't forget we also have a newsletter that you
Speaker 2: can subscribe to for even more content, all those exclusive
Speaker 2: behind the scenes cuts. You can find the link to
Speaker 2: that in the show description and on my LinkedIn profile.
Speaker 2: It's called you Guessed it, Let's Talk Offline.
Speaker 1: And while you're on LinkedIn, you might as well go
Speaker 1: on and get connected with me and g and send
Speaker 1: us your question. We want to hear them, the burning,
Speaker 1: the itchy, the weird stream I mean, oh goay, my
Speaker 1: itch depending on. But we'll see information on how you
Speaker 1: can do that is in the show description. Listen to me.
Speaker 1: It is in the show description. Because y'all gonna be like,
Speaker 1: we couldn't find you. Look in the show description.
Speaker 2: All right, we'll see you back here next week. Remember
Speaker 2: we have always got your back, so if something comes
Speaker 2: up in the meantime, Let's Talk offline. I'm Gianna Prudenti.
Speaker 1: And I'm Jamaie Jackson Gadsden, Stay driving.
Speaker 2: Let's Talk Offline is a production of LinkedIn News and
Speaker 2: iHeart Podcasts. The show is produced by Western Sound. Our
Speaker 2: producer is Sabrina Fang. The show is edited by Savannah Wright.
Speaker 2: Our associate producer is Sarah Dilley. Alex mckinness is our engineer,
Speaker 2: and Ben Adair is the executive producer.
Speaker 1: Executive producers at iHeart Podcasts are Katrina Norvel and Nikki
Speaker 1: Etore We got support from LinkedIn's Jesse Humple, Sarah Storm,
Speaker 1: and Ayana Angel. Maya Pope Chappelle is director of Content,
Speaker 1: Dave Pond is head of news Production, Courtney Cook is
Speaker 1: Head of Original Programming, and Dan Roth is the editor
Speaker 1: in chief of LinkedIn.