1 00:00:01,600 --> 00:00:05,560 Speaker 1: Hi. 2 00:00:05,559 --> 00:00:08,320 Speaker 2: I am Kate Hudson and my name is Oliver Hudson. 3 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:11,160 Speaker 3: We wanted to do something that highlighted our. 4 00:00:11,080 --> 00:00:13,360 Speaker 2: Relationship and what it's like to be siblings. 5 00:00:19,079 --> 00:00:25,400 Speaker 4: We are a sibling, Railvalry, No, no, sibling. You don't 6 00:00:25,480 --> 00:00:33,000 Speaker 4: do that with your mouth, Vely. 7 00:00:33,640 --> 00:00:42,240 Speaker 3: That's good. Oh well, I'll never get in that water again. 8 00:00:43,120 --> 00:00:43,880 Speaker 2: Oliver Hudson. 9 00:00:44,080 --> 00:00:47,800 Speaker 4: And I'm actually live with an incredible guest, Mel. 10 00:00:47,720 --> 00:00:51,960 Speaker 2: Robbins, and my mother. I'm speaking quietly now. 11 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:55,480 Speaker 3: I've read her book let The Theory, and it's incredible. 12 00:00:56,160 --> 00:00:58,520 Speaker 4: But I am speaking quietly because my mom and Mel, 13 00:00:58,640 --> 00:01:00,560 Speaker 4: they have really created hit it off. 14 00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:03,160 Speaker 2: They're crally right to. 15 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:05,720 Speaker 3: My left, feels like they know but before. 16 00:01:05,440 --> 00:01:07,759 Speaker 4: We even got the mic set up, they are give 17 00:01:07,880 --> 00:01:12,080 Speaker 4: them up and away. They're excluding me right now, which 18 00:01:12,120 --> 00:01:14,080 Speaker 4: is what I will work my way in. 19 00:01:14,200 --> 00:01:14,920 Speaker 3: You know what. 20 00:01:15,080 --> 00:01:18,160 Speaker 4: Right now, I'm just commentating on their conversation. 21 00:01:18,319 --> 00:01:21,760 Speaker 3: These two beautiful blogs are just going at it breakdown. 22 00:01:21,840 --> 00:01:25,720 Speaker 2: Let's join their conversation now, see how already in progress. 23 00:01:26,240 --> 00:01:29,000 Speaker 3: But you know what you have done, which is so 24 00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:31,840 Speaker 3: interesting and I've got so many We've got so many questions. 25 00:01:32,120 --> 00:01:35,880 Speaker 3: But you're also looking at human behavior. You're also looking 26 00:01:35,959 --> 00:01:40,160 Speaker 3: at where we can go to actually heal. How are 27 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 3: we going to be able to understand, like you did, 28 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:45,360 Speaker 3: you know, the five second rule or whatever, which was 29 00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:49,480 Speaker 3: amazing and get people off, you know, off because they're 30 00:01:49,480 --> 00:01:51,200 Speaker 3: they're thinking of all kinds of reasons why not to 31 00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:54,480 Speaker 3: do something? Yes, get them going. But you really have 32 00:01:54,880 --> 00:02:00,600 Speaker 3: met sort of the the culture. People aren't need this, 33 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:04,880 Speaker 3: they want this so much. And I have this question 34 00:02:05,320 --> 00:02:07,400 Speaker 3: because some of us are driven. Some of us are 35 00:02:07,440 --> 00:02:10,760 Speaker 3: driven to help, some of us are driven to make change. 36 00:02:11,240 --> 00:02:13,560 Speaker 3: Some of us have a lot of empathy to be 37 00:02:13,680 --> 00:02:17,960 Speaker 3: able to take your time and your interest to help 38 00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:22,679 Speaker 3: and change and shift other people's mindset and thinking what 39 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:27,080 Speaker 3: made you as a human being going through all the 40 00:02:27,120 --> 00:02:30,200 Speaker 3: things you went through? Were you an empathetic child? 41 00:02:31,320 --> 00:02:33,680 Speaker 1: Oh that's an interesting I think so highly. 42 00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:33,840 Speaker 4: So. 43 00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:38,640 Speaker 1: I think I absorbed everybody's feelings. I absorbed everything that 44 00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:42,080 Speaker 1: was going on around me. I feel like sometimes being 45 00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:46,040 Speaker 1: deeply empathetic is both a gift and a curse. It 46 00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:51,120 Speaker 1: is because you can feel everything, and the problem is 47 00:02:51,120 --> 00:02:59,520 Speaker 1: is assuming responsibility for either creating equilibrium if what you're 48 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:03,720 Speaker 1: feeling is chaos or anger or hurt or sadness or 49 00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:09,440 Speaker 1: hostility and assuming that it's your job when you feel 50 00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:13,399 Speaker 1: something to do something to fix it exactly. 51 00:03:13,880 --> 00:03:16,080 Speaker 3: And there's things you talked about also in a book 52 00:03:16,080 --> 00:03:19,320 Speaker 3: which I've been reading I'm loving it was was an 53 00:03:19,320 --> 00:03:22,400 Speaker 3: idea that you can't fix things, and there are things 54 00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:26,680 Speaker 3: you can't fix and and with that is an important 55 00:03:27,480 --> 00:03:30,440 Speaker 3: a place in your life to have that mindset to 56 00:03:30,440 --> 00:03:34,800 Speaker 3: say I can't fix you. And I did laugh because 57 00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:36,840 Speaker 3: there was something in there with the Oliver it. I 58 00:03:36,840 --> 00:03:40,960 Speaker 3: know I've told this story before. Was my child right? 59 00:03:41,320 --> 00:03:43,280 Speaker 3: And you know your kids never end up there's always 60 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:45,440 Speaker 3: your kids right, no matter how old they are, they're 61 00:03:45,480 --> 00:03:56,480 Speaker 3: always your children. So like you're the best you're about? 62 00:03:56,480 --> 00:03:59,480 Speaker 2: This isn't about my circumcision? Is it? No? What can 63 00:03:59,560 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 2: we have? 64 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:00,960 Speaker 1: Let's talk about that story. 65 00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:04,760 Speaker 2: She told that she told this story on a talk show. 66 00:04:04,600 --> 00:04:06,680 Speaker 1: And okay, what is the story? I don't know, see. 67 00:04:08,840 --> 00:04:09,720 Speaker 3: Decision story. 68 00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:11,960 Speaker 4: Yes, tell the circumcision story and then we'll get into 69 00:04:12,000 --> 00:04:13,600 Speaker 4: more a little deeper stuff. 70 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:18,200 Speaker 3: Well, the circumcision story was he was a month old, 71 00:04:19,120 --> 00:04:22,800 Speaker 3: and I was really really upset. I wanted to be 72 00:04:22,839 --> 00:04:25,760 Speaker 3: in there because I felt I could make him feel good, 73 00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:28,200 Speaker 3: and but I was waiting and then the doctor. I 74 00:04:28,240 --> 00:04:29,920 Speaker 3: was so upset, and the doctor came out and said, 75 00:04:30,960 --> 00:04:33,200 Speaker 3: you'll be happy to know I need a bigger clamp. 76 00:04:34,760 --> 00:04:38,320 Speaker 2: Said, oh my god. Now on a talk show. 77 00:04:38,680 --> 00:04:42,039 Speaker 4: And then of course, yeah kind of you know, it's 78 00:04:42,080 --> 00:04:43,680 Speaker 4: like bigger, a bigger clamp. 79 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:44,359 Speaker 2: I'm like, what. 80 00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:46,400 Speaker 1: Her saying. 81 00:04:46,920 --> 00:04:49,159 Speaker 2: We can't find something smaller, right exactly? 82 00:04:49,160 --> 00:04:53,200 Speaker 3: But but but the story about being servile, Okay, someone 83 00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:54,760 Speaker 3: who wants to take care of your children, make sure 84 00:04:54,760 --> 00:04:57,440 Speaker 3: they don't fall like today. You know, they're putting you know, 85 00:04:57,480 --> 00:05:00,960 Speaker 3: all kinds of like rubber matts or things under playgrounds. 86 00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:04,840 Speaker 3: They shouldn't hurt themselves. They were always helping them not 87 00:05:04,920 --> 00:05:06,840 Speaker 3: have to go through a problem, or more yes, fixing 88 00:05:06,880 --> 00:05:09,720 Speaker 3: it for them. And she wrote about this so beautifully 89 00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:13,160 Speaker 3: and even I must say I be related to it. 90 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:16,279 Speaker 3: And it brought me up to a point. Well, Oliver 91 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:19,760 Speaker 3: went to college and I was worried about him, you know, eating, 92 00:05:20,400 --> 00:05:23,560 Speaker 3: and he was in this you know, apartment or whatever 93 00:05:23,560 --> 00:05:27,320 Speaker 3: they had, and I was concerned. So I got a chef. Yeah, well, 94 00:05:27,400 --> 00:05:29,680 Speaker 3: so well I can't say she was a chef. 95 00:05:29,760 --> 00:05:32,240 Speaker 4: Well it was a chef, but but I she didn't 96 00:05:32,240 --> 00:05:33,800 Speaker 4: even tell me what was happening. There was a knock 97 00:05:33,800 --> 00:05:37,880 Speaker 4: on my door in college. It's my sophomore year. I'm 98 00:05:37,920 --> 00:05:38,680 Speaker 4: living in a house. 99 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:39,800 Speaker 3: It was your freshman year. 100 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:42,279 Speaker 4: It was my sophomore year. It was a disgusting house 101 00:05:42,279 --> 00:05:46,159 Speaker 4: with six dudes and the there's a knock at the 102 00:05:46,240 --> 00:05:49,080 Speaker 4: door and I open it up and there's this woman with. 103 00:05:49,040 --> 00:05:49,920 Speaker 2: A casse role. 104 00:05:50,200 --> 00:05:54,000 Speaker 4: I'm like yes, and she's like, your mom has hired 105 00:05:54,040 --> 00:05:59,680 Speaker 4: me to bring you food. And I'm like, oh my lord, okay. 106 00:06:02,480 --> 00:06:05,840 Speaker 2: No, I mean yes and no. It was a bit of. 107 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:10,359 Speaker 4: A shock, but but you know, she was afraid I 108 00:06:10,440 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 4: wasn't eating. 109 00:06:11,440 --> 00:06:13,200 Speaker 3: You know, well, I was afraid you wouldn't need to 110 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:16,760 Speaker 3: know if it was whatever, and it was. It's very funny. 111 00:06:16,800 --> 00:06:19,160 Speaker 3: So you want to make everything nice for your children, 112 00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:22,480 Speaker 3: but you can't do everything for them, right You don't 113 00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:25,800 Speaker 3: want to You shouldn't. Yes, you know that's the problem. 114 00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:26,799 Speaker 2: But do you think that's. 115 00:06:26,760 --> 00:06:30,760 Speaker 4: Changed though, because well, when we were kids, uh, you know, 116 00:06:31,480 --> 00:06:33,840 Speaker 4: it was like take whatever rolls on a wheel and 117 00:06:34,240 --> 00:06:37,360 Speaker 4: get the fuck out of here. Go, you know, go 118 00:06:37,360 --> 00:06:40,359 Speaker 4: go to your friend's house. There's no phones, there's no connection, 119 00:06:40,440 --> 00:06:43,599 Speaker 4: there's no GPS locating, there's no find you know, find 120 00:06:43,600 --> 00:06:44,240 Speaker 4: my friends or. 121 00:06:44,320 --> 00:06:45,200 Speaker 2: Life three sixty. 122 00:06:45,440 --> 00:06:49,200 Speaker 4: Yes, and there was just more There was more freedom then, 123 00:06:49,480 --> 00:06:53,000 Speaker 4: you know, we could make more mistakes, yes, just by 124 00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:58,039 Speaker 4: just by just even not technologically. So have you seen 125 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:01,320 Speaker 4: that shift where you were you brought up, the way 126 00:07:01,320 --> 00:07:02,880 Speaker 4: that you brought your kids up? 127 00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:05,800 Speaker 1: Well, I think I was a little bit looser than 128 00:07:06,240 --> 00:07:10,320 Speaker 1: you see a lot of parents now. I always had 129 00:07:10,440 --> 00:07:13,000 Speaker 1: this point of view that my job was not to 130 00:07:13,480 --> 00:07:16,360 Speaker 1: turn them into me, but to try to help them, 131 00:07:16,840 --> 00:07:18,880 Speaker 1: try to guide my kids as best as I could 132 00:07:19,360 --> 00:07:22,440 Speaker 1: in them becoming who they were supposed to be. I 133 00:07:22,480 --> 00:07:27,520 Speaker 1: think a lot of that overparenting comes from this fundamental 134 00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:30,720 Speaker 1: need to be in control. And there's a lot of 135 00:07:30,760 --> 00:07:32,920 Speaker 1: research is not research that I've done, but there's a 136 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:38,440 Speaker 1: lot of research around how the milk carton missing children 137 00:07:39,360 --> 00:07:46,000 Speaker 1: created a false concern in parents' minds that your child 138 00:07:46,080 --> 00:07:48,800 Speaker 1: could be snatched from the front yard at any moment. 139 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:52,120 Speaker 1: And there's lots of great researchers that have sort of 140 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:57,640 Speaker 1: connected the dots going backwards to that moment where all 141 00:07:57,680 --> 00:08:02,880 Speaker 1: of a sudden parents started to feed like childhood wasn't safe. 142 00:08:03,360 --> 00:08:06,360 Speaker 1: And then it starts to compound and compound and compound, 143 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:10,200 Speaker 1: and when you look at parents that are overparenting, and 144 00:08:10,360 --> 00:08:12,320 Speaker 1: you know, on one hand, sending a cast rule is 145 00:08:12,360 --> 00:08:14,600 Speaker 1: a wonderful thing to do, and it's a way to 146 00:08:14,680 --> 00:08:17,280 Speaker 1: kind of be there when you can't be there. And 147 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:21,280 Speaker 1: then there's the stepping in and solving problems. There's the 148 00:08:21,320 --> 00:08:24,640 Speaker 1: bulldozing other people so your kids don't have to ever 149 00:08:24,760 --> 00:08:25,960 Speaker 1: experience disappointment. 150 00:08:26,080 --> 00:08:29,160 Speaker 2: Well, it's the helicopter parent. Then there's the bulldozer parent. 151 00:08:28,920 --> 00:08:31,800 Speaker 1: Right, And what's very clear is that's coming from a 152 00:08:31,960 --> 00:08:36,760 Speaker 1: parent's own anxiety and a parent's feeling that the world 153 00:08:36,800 --> 00:08:39,880 Speaker 1: is out of control. Therefore, I have to control the 154 00:08:39,920 --> 00:08:42,560 Speaker 1: experience of my child. And here's the sad part. The 155 00:08:42,600 --> 00:08:46,439 Speaker 1: sad part is your kid is probably more resilient and 156 00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:51,400 Speaker 1: smarter and more capable than you are treating them. And 157 00:08:51,480 --> 00:08:54,040 Speaker 1: I made this huge mistake. So I made this huge mistake, 158 00:08:54,760 --> 00:08:57,839 Speaker 1: and that's how I learn almost everything every book you'll see, 159 00:08:57,880 --> 00:09:01,280 Speaker 1: I'm the villain, and the let them theory is no different. 160 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:05,160 Speaker 1: The reason why I know that this theory works is 161 00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:08,440 Speaker 1: because I used to be a complete control freak that 162 00:09:08,679 --> 00:09:12,720 Speaker 1: was doing things the exact opposite in terms of the 163 00:09:12,760 --> 00:09:16,200 Speaker 1: way that human beings work and the way that relationships work. 164 00:09:16,320 --> 00:09:19,199 Speaker 1: I thought that love meant control and change. I thought 165 00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:22,920 Speaker 1: that I knew best. I thought judging people and trying 166 00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:24,880 Speaker 1: to motivate them was the way that you get them 167 00:09:24,880 --> 00:09:27,680 Speaker 1: to change, And the fact is it has the exact 168 00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:30,760 Speaker 1: opposite effect. And so I made this huge mistake when 169 00:09:30,800 --> 00:09:35,000 Speaker 1: I was a parent. We went to Cambodia when our 170 00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:38,720 Speaker 1: kids were really little, and we were there visiting my 171 00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:42,640 Speaker 1: husband's mom, who was a recent widow, and she had 172 00:09:42,679 --> 00:09:45,400 Speaker 1: gone over to Cambodia to do some volunteer work and 173 00:09:45,440 --> 00:09:47,199 Speaker 1: had really found her calling. So we go over to 174 00:09:47,280 --> 00:09:50,600 Speaker 1: visit her, and there's this thing that happens where we 175 00:09:50,720 --> 00:09:55,040 Speaker 1: go visit a museum that was all about the Khmer Rouge. 176 00:09:55,559 --> 00:09:58,840 Speaker 1: And I don't know what I was thinking, taking a 177 00:09:58,880 --> 00:10:03,320 Speaker 1: bunch of elementary age kids to an old elementary school 178 00:10:03,800 --> 00:10:07,040 Speaker 1: where the Khmer Rouge had held prisoners and they've turned 179 00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:10,920 Speaker 1: it into this really important museum. We walk into the 180 00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:14,720 Speaker 1: first classroom and our daughter, Kendall, who was maybe I 181 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:19,080 Speaker 1: don't know, fourth or fifth grade, takes one look at 182 00:10:19,080 --> 00:10:21,880 Speaker 1: this room where they have a bed and they have 183 00:10:22,080 --> 00:10:24,280 Speaker 1: handcuffs to it and there's like a stand. You know 184 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:26,840 Speaker 1: that they had just killed people in this room. She 185 00:10:26,880 --> 00:10:30,840 Speaker 1: goes running out. I go running out after her. She 186 00:10:31,080 --> 00:10:34,280 Speaker 1: was hysterical, Something's going to happen to you in dead, 187 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:37,080 Speaker 1: Something's going to happen to you in dead. We get 188 00:10:37,120 --> 00:10:40,280 Speaker 1: home from the trip and she could not sleep through 189 00:10:40,320 --> 00:10:40,600 Speaker 1: the night. 190 00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:41,040 Speaker 3: Yeah. 191 00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:41,520 Speaker 2: Wow. 192 00:10:41,600 --> 00:10:44,280 Speaker 1: And so she came downstairs every night, and for the 193 00:10:44,360 --> 00:10:47,880 Speaker 1: first couple nights, I would walk her back upstairs, and 194 00:10:47,920 --> 00:10:50,679 Speaker 1: then she would come back down. And everybody who's ever 195 00:10:50,720 --> 00:10:53,040 Speaker 1: been a parent has had that experience where you're just 196 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:56,320 Speaker 1: so exhausted that they wear you down. Next thing you know, 197 00:10:56,360 --> 00:11:00,560 Speaker 1: I'm lifting up the blanket she's crawling in. And finally 198 00:11:00,600 --> 00:11:02,840 Speaker 1: it just got to the point, you guys, where she 199 00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:05,840 Speaker 1: would sleep on our floor. She did this for almost 200 00:11:05,880 --> 00:11:09,560 Speaker 1: six months. I made a bed on the floor. I 201 00:11:09,720 --> 00:11:13,840 Speaker 1: thought I was doing the right thing. I thought that 202 00:11:14,080 --> 00:11:18,559 Speaker 1: I was really just nurturing her and helping her. And 203 00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:23,440 Speaker 1: what I realize now is that I royally compounded the 204 00:11:23,480 --> 00:11:30,040 Speaker 1: anxiety because I was allowing her anxiety to win. I 205 00:11:30,160 --> 00:11:34,040 Speaker 1: was basically by allowing her to avoid being up in 206 00:11:34,120 --> 00:11:37,760 Speaker 1: her room. What it confirmed to her is that she's 207 00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:40,680 Speaker 1: not capable of being up there, that this feel, that 208 00:11:40,800 --> 00:11:43,120 Speaker 1: this fear is real, and then it turned into you 209 00:11:43,160 --> 00:11:44,920 Speaker 1: can't do a sleepover, you got to have a sleep 210 00:11:45,000 --> 00:11:46,960 Speaker 1: under where you pick the kid up. And then it 211 00:11:47,000 --> 00:11:49,480 Speaker 1: turns into you can't travel, and so it got bigger 212 00:11:49,520 --> 00:11:53,520 Speaker 1: and bigger and bigger, and I was just trying to help. 213 00:11:54,200 --> 00:11:57,720 Speaker 1: And what I can see now is that by not 214 00:11:58,880 --> 00:12:02,680 Speaker 1: following the advice of all the pediatricians who were like, 215 00:12:02,720 --> 00:12:04,800 Speaker 1: you need to take her upstairs, you need to sit 216 00:12:04,840 --> 00:12:06,520 Speaker 1: with her, you need to let her go back to sleep, 217 00:12:06,640 --> 00:12:09,800 Speaker 1: You need to model for her that she is capable 218 00:12:10,440 --> 00:12:13,880 Speaker 1: of facing this fear. By allowing her to opt out, 219 00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:16,439 Speaker 1: I actually made the fear way worse, Like it became 220 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:19,400 Speaker 1: an issue for years and years and years that were 221 00:12:19,440 --> 00:12:21,840 Speaker 1: only now kind of fully unwinding and understanding. 222 00:12:21,840 --> 00:12:25,880 Speaker 4: That funny because you're also dealing with a different sect 223 00:12:25,960 --> 00:12:29,320 Speaker 4: of parenting as well, which is attachment parenting, where these 224 00:12:29,400 --> 00:12:32,199 Speaker 4: kids will sleep in the room from the very beginning 225 00:12:32,720 --> 00:12:35,600 Speaker 4: and feeding on demand, and it's like, there, you cater 226 00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:38,280 Speaker 4: to your child. It's that attachment parenting thing. 227 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:38,640 Speaker 2: You know. 228 00:12:38,840 --> 00:12:41,120 Speaker 1: I don't know anything about that. Here's what I know. 229 00:12:41,200 --> 00:12:42,840 Speaker 1: If it works for you, do it. But what I 230 00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:46,440 Speaker 1: found is that I took the easy route, and it 231 00:12:46,520 --> 00:12:49,880 Speaker 1: made things way harder, Yeah, way harder. 232 00:12:49,960 --> 00:12:52,240 Speaker 3: Yeah. 233 00:12:52,440 --> 00:13:03,319 Speaker 4: Ah, so I take lexapro. Anxiety has been a part 234 00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:07,440 Speaker 4: of my life. Mom had anxiety in her twenties. There 235 00:13:07,520 --> 00:13:09,680 Speaker 4: has to be some sort of genetic component to that, yeah, 236 00:13:09,679 --> 00:13:13,280 Speaker 4: for sure. So it's something I've dealt with, deal with 237 00:13:14,200 --> 00:13:16,000 Speaker 4: even in the last like ten days. 238 00:13:16,200 --> 00:13:17,600 Speaker 1: When's the last time you had anxiety? 239 00:13:18,080 --> 00:13:23,000 Speaker 4: Oh, I mean six hours ago. But it's different. I 240 00:13:23,080 --> 00:13:25,760 Speaker 4: just am so I know how to deal with it. 241 00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:28,000 Speaker 4: I know what it is. I've made I have a 242 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:32,160 Speaker 4: relationship with my anxiety, so it doesn't take me over anymore. 243 00:13:32,520 --> 00:13:35,280 Speaker 2: I understand it. Whereas before I thought I was. 244 00:13:35,320 --> 00:13:38,120 Speaker 4: Dying, you know what I mean, And I was able 245 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:41,120 Speaker 4: to sort of meditate through it, journal through it, and 246 00:13:41,240 --> 00:13:45,840 Speaker 4: eventually had to get on medication for it. And now 247 00:13:45,920 --> 00:13:48,520 Speaker 4: every once in a while it will pop up. It's 248 00:13:48,559 --> 00:13:51,640 Speaker 4: these sort of irrational thoughts, but I understand that I'm 249 00:13:51,679 --> 00:13:54,400 Speaker 4: not going to die. I'm okay, is it really what? 250 00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:56,600 Speaker 1: That's the way it manifests itself, Like you literally will 251 00:13:56,600 --> 00:13:59,000 Speaker 1: start You'll like have a stomach pain and then escalate. 252 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:02,080 Speaker 4: It's in my stuff. It manifests in my stomach for 253 00:14:02,120 --> 00:14:02,760 Speaker 4: the most part. 254 00:14:02,920 --> 00:14:05,959 Speaker 1: Really, Yeah, Well, I'm interested in this because my son 255 00:14:06,600 --> 00:14:08,880 Speaker 1: as a stomach triggered anxiety spiral. 256 00:14:09,040 --> 00:14:09,439 Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean. 257 00:14:11,920 --> 00:14:14,160 Speaker 4: So my twenties, thirties, and forties is when I've had 258 00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:16,880 Speaker 4: my big bouts of it. My twenties, it was all stomach. 259 00:14:16,920 --> 00:14:19,200 Speaker 4: I mean I couldn't leave the house without throwing up. 260 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:20,320 Speaker 2: Wow. 261 00:14:20,560 --> 00:14:22,240 Speaker 1: It was also a fear of it. 262 00:14:22,760 --> 00:14:26,120 Speaker 4: Yeah, see mine, it was a fear of looking stupid. 263 00:14:26,800 --> 00:14:28,840 Speaker 4: I don't I didn't want to look stupid in front 264 00:14:28,880 --> 00:14:31,600 Speaker 4: of people, and throwing up like that would make me 265 00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:35,080 Speaker 4: look like an asshole and people would judge me. And 266 00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:37,080 Speaker 4: you know, so the minute I would get out of 267 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:39,120 Speaker 4: the house, I'd feel nauseous, I'd want to throw up. 268 00:14:39,200 --> 00:14:39,440 Speaker 1: Wow. 269 00:14:39,440 --> 00:14:43,280 Speaker 4: I was trying to be an actor. My sister was. 270 00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:45,680 Speaker 4: He was, you know, famous, My parents were famous. I'm 271 00:14:45,760 --> 00:14:48,840 Speaker 4: just starting. There was a lot of sort of unconscious 272 00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:52,680 Speaker 4: pressure that I was sort of putting on myself expectations, 273 00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:57,280 Speaker 4: and I was going to auditions throwing up outside of 274 00:14:57,280 --> 00:15:00,920 Speaker 4: the audition space. Remember when I was in New York. Yeah, 275 00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:02,880 Speaker 4: I had to fly to New York because I had 276 00:15:02,880 --> 00:15:06,120 Speaker 4: to read with Laura Lenny for this movie. And I 277 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:08,680 Speaker 4: said to my manager, I'm like, I can't get on 278 00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:11,080 Speaker 4: a fucking airplane. I mean, I'm like, I can barely 279 00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:14,040 Speaker 4: get step out of my home. But I fought through it. 280 00:15:14,080 --> 00:15:16,680 Speaker 4: I get on the airplane and now I'm driving down 281 00:15:16,680 --> 00:15:19,080 Speaker 4: like fifth Avenue. The cave has to pull over multiple 282 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:21,440 Speaker 4: times because I'm throwing up. I'm throwing up before the audition. 283 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:23,920 Speaker 4: I call mom in the waiting room like I can't 284 00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:26,520 Speaker 4: do like holy shit, Like I'm just a complete wreck. 285 00:15:27,160 --> 00:15:28,880 Speaker 4: But I fought through it. I was always trying to. 286 00:15:28,880 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 4: I didn't want it to do it for to debilitate me. 287 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:33,040 Speaker 1: It sounded pretty debilitating. 288 00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:33,920 Speaker 2: Oh it was awful. 289 00:15:34,440 --> 00:15:36,640 Speaker 3: I have that too, So that was happened to me, 290 00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:40,880 Speaker 3: and it was all stomach It was my panic attacks 291 00:15:42,040 --> 00:15:43,960 Speaker 3: and I couldn't go into public without throwing up. 292 00:15:44,640 --> 00:15:46,720 Speaker 1: Really, So, can I ask you guys a question about this, 293 00:15:46,760 --> 00:15:50,440 Speaker 1: because I find this fascinating because a number of pediatricians 294 00:15:50,440 --> 00:15:53,640 Speaker 1: that I've spoken to have said that, other than the 295 00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:55,880 Speaker 1: fear of your parents dying, the fear of throwing up 296 00:15:56,080 --> 00:16:00,480 Speaker 1: is the number one fear the kids have because it's 297 00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:04,400 Speaker 1: this moment of a complete loss of control. So do 298 00:16:04,440 --> 00:16:10,200 Speaker 1: you remember the first time you connected like stomach tension 299 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:13,440 Speaker 1: with this fear that you're going to throw up, so 300 00:16:13,720 --> 00:16:15,960 Speaker 1: I better, like, I got to make it happen now 301 00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:18,520 Speaker 1: so that I'm in control of it. Yeah, when was 302 00:16:18,520 --> 00:16:19,320 Speaker 1: the first time that happened? 303 00:16:19,640 --> 00:16:22,720 Speaker 2: The first time, I'm honestly not sure. I mean the. 304 00:16:22,760 --> 00:16:26,040 Speaker 4: First time that I had my it was a panic attack. 305 00:16:26,240 --> 00:16:29,840 Speaker 4: My heart felt like it exploded, yep. And I was 306 00:16:29,880 --> 00:16:31,840 Speaker 4: going to like a club, was going to into a 307 00:16:31,920 --> 00:16:35,480 Speaker 4: club in my mid twenties, and I was like boom. 308 00:16:35,480 --> 00:16:37,000 Speaker 4: I thought I was going to die on the sidewalk. 309 00:16:37,080 --> 00:16:39,960 Speaker 4: I mean, it was just horrible. And then after that 310 00:16:40,400 --> 00:16:43,200 Speaker 4: it started to sort of manifest in my stomach. But yes, 311 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:46,320 Speaker 4: it's interesting that you say you almost want to expel it. 312 00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:49,640 Speaker 4: You want to throw up in your space first and 313 00:16:49,760 --> 00:16:54,080 Speaker 4: then move to the public area because you just don't 314 00:16:54,120 --> 00:16:55,920 Speaker 4: want to look stupid. 315 00:16:56,200 --> 00:16:57,600 Speaker 1: Well, there's two things I want to share with you 316 00:16:57,640 --> 00:17:01,280 Speaker 1: guys that I that have been life changing for me. 317 00:17:02,160 --> 00:17:06,639 Speaker 1: And one of them is something that I researched and 318 00:17:06,720 --> 00:17:12,960 Speaker 1: studied that fundamentally changed the way that I experience any 319 00:17:13,080 --> 00:17:17,560 Speaker 1: nerves or anxiety and it stopped the escalation. And then 320 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:19,359 Speaker 1: the second thing I want to share with you is 321 00:17:19,720 --> 00:17:23,240 Speaker 1: something from I think his name is Steve Magnus who 322 00:17:23,359 --> 00:17:26,399 Speaker 1: was who's been an Olympic track coach and is like 323 00:17:26,400 --> 00:17:30,240 Speaker 1: a big mindset guy. That's a trick that he used 324 00:17:30,400 --> 00:17:34,080 Speaker 1: with athletes that had this particular issue that stops it. 325 00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:36,320 Speaker 1: And so the first thing I want to explain that 326 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:38,680 Speaker 1: has been very life changing for me is that I 327 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:41,560 Speaker 1: never realized that when you're about to go do something 328 00:17:42,000 --> 00:17:44,040 Speaker 1: that you're nervous about, it could be an audition, it 329 00:17:44,040 --> 00:17:45,880 Speaker 1: could be a date, it could be just going out 330 00:17:45,920 --> 00:17:50,200 Speaker 1: in public. Because you are about to go do something 331 00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:52,119 Speaker 1: that you kind of care about and you have a 332 00:17:52,119 --> 00:17:53,800 Speaker 1: little bit of a how is this going to go, 333 00:17:54,760 --> 00:18:00,919 Speaker 1: you immediately switch into a preparation mode that's sort of 334 00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:04,439 Speaker 1: like fight or flight. And when you go into so 335 00:18:04,520 --> 00:18:07,320 Speaker 1: like before an audition, before a speech, before a date, 336 00:18:07,400 --> 00:18:11,560 Speaker 1: before an interview, we all get nervous. And when you're 337 00:18:11,600 --> 00:18:18,600 Speaker 1: getting nervous, there are physiological and medical symptoms that happen. 338 00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:21,879 Speaker 1: Your heart starts to race, your throat starts skill a 339 00:18:21,920 --> 00:18:24,640 Speaker 1: little tight, your hands can get your armpits can be. 340 00:18:24,640 --> 00:18:28,280 Speaker 3: Like between the brain, the image lan in particular, Yes 341 00:18:28,600 --> 00:18:31,639 Speaker 3: that really has a complete connection to the body. 342 00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:36,320 Speaker 1: Yes, and your stomach. People start to say you have butterflies. 343 00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:42,080 Speaker 1: Here's why. Here's why from an evolutionary standpoint, if you 344 00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:45,520 Speaker 1: are about to prepare to do something, whether it's hunt 345 00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:49,280 Speaker 1: or it's run from something or fight, your body goes 346 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:53,000 Speaker 1: into a let's get ready mode. The chemistry in your 347 00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:55,159 Speaker 1: body changes. All the blood goes to your heart and 348 00:18:55,200 --> 00:18:56,800 Speaker 1: your brain so you can think and so you can 349 00:18:56,840 --> 00:19:00,800 Speaker 1: move faster, which means it leaves your die jestive trek, 350 00:19:01,240 --> 00:19:05,760 Speaker 1: which means the chemistry in your stomach is changing. Those 351 00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:09,720 Speaker 1: butterflies are not actually a sign that you're about to 352 00:19:09,720 --> 00:19:12,359 Speaker 1: screw up. They're not a sign that you're about to 353 00:19:12,359 --> 00:19:15,199 Speaker 1: throw up. They're not a sign that anything's about to 354 00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:18,320 Speaker 1: go wrong. It's a sign that your chemistry and your 355 00:19:18,320 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 1: body is changing to help you be able to focus 356 00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:24,800 Speaker 1: or run or do the thing you need to do. 357 00:19:25,480 --> 00:19:30,800 Speaker 1: And for years I mistook, like everybody does, those butterflies 358 00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:34,719 Speaker 1: as a sign of impending doom versus just your body 359 00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:36,439 Speaker 1: getting ready for you to get out the door and 360 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:38,879 Speaker 1: go do the audition. If you then go up in 361 00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:43,879 Speaker 1: your head and are like fuck, you now escalate the 362 00:19:44,119 --> 00:19:46,679 Speaker 1: alarm state in your body and you make it worse. 363 00:19:46,720 --> 00:19:47,760 Speaker 1: They've actually studied this. 364 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:50,040 Speaker 3: And however it happens, your executive function. 365 00:19:49,880 --> 00:19:52,159 Speaker 1: Out the window. Because the second that and you know 366 00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:54,359 Speaker 1: this with all your work, the second that you switch 367 00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:57,440 Speaker 1: gears from the prefrontal cortex being engaged to now the 368 00:19:57,480 --> 00:20:02,840 Speaker 1: amigdalas trigger executive functioning out the window, your critical voice 369 00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:06,879 Speaker 1: gets louder. Your ability to recall the preparation that you 370 00:20:07,040 --> 00:20:10,040 Speaker 1: had and to be able to talk yourself down out 371 00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:12,920 Speaker 1: the window. And so they studied this at Harvard Business School. 372 00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:16,160 Speaker 1: There's this really interesting study where they taught people in 373 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:19,159 Speaker 1: high performance situations, whether you're going to go into a 374 00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:22,560 Speaker 1: track meet or a debate competition or something that we 375 00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:26,119 Speaker 1: can measure. They taught them in states where you're about 376 00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:28,359 Speaker 1: to do something and you're nervous and your stomach is 377 00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:33,000 Speaker 1: like twirling around with butterflies, to say, I'm so excited 378 00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:35,720 Speaker 1: to do this thing. I'm so excited. I'm excited to 379 00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:37,679 Speaker 1: run this thing, I'm excited to do the debate, I'm 380 00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:39,399 Speaker 1: excited to go on the interview, I'm excited to get 381 00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:41,080 Speaker 1: on the plane, even though you may not feel that. 382 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:46,439 Speaker 1: Simply queuing your brain to say I'm excited calms the 383 00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:47,679 Speaker 1: stress response, right. 384 00:20:47,720 --> 00:20:50,520 Speaker 2: I mean, how different though, is excitement from nerves. 385 00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:52,000 Speaker 1: It's the exact same thing, right. 386 00:20:51,840 --> 00:20:55,360 Speaker 4: Because because there's certain people where the nerves become debilitating, 387 00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:58,240 Speaker 4: and then there are others where it can be empowering. 388 00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:02,359 Speaker 2: You know, where you use that that's fuel to just what. 389 00:21:02,560 --> 00:21:05,359 Speaker 3: You're saying too. In terms of that is the brain 390 00:21:05,440 --> 00:21:09,000 Speaker 3: is basically a muscle. So once you start feeding it 391 00:21:09,160 --> 00:21:11,679 Speaker 3: all of this thing. For instance, if you if you 392 00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:14,320 Speaker 3: smile and you don't feel like it, your brain thinks 393 00:21:14,359 --> 00:21:17,320 Speaker 3: you're happier. It goes right into your brain, your activity, 394 00:21:17,359 --> 00:21:20,359 Speaker 3: your connections, all of it. It's just an act, a 395 00:21:20,400 --> 00:21:25,480 Speaker 3: physical act, a choice that I choose to smile. Interesting 396 00:21:25,640 --> 00:21:28,520 Speaker 3: how it helps the brain to be able to actually 397 00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:32,159 Speaker 3: feel happier. It's a signal. So the same thing is 398 00:21:32,160 --> 00:21:35,080 Speaker 3: when you repeat over and over again, I'm really excited 399 00:21:35,119 --> 00:21:37,800 Speaker 3: to do this. And I have something to share with 400 00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:40,680 Speaker 3: that on that because being self aware as we are, 401 00:21:40,960 --> 00:21:43,639 Speaker 3: you try to be. I noticed that there's, you know, 402 00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:46,480 Speaker 3: going through some things, stuff that we deal all every day. 403 00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:49,320 Speaker 3: It's always stuff. It's a leak here, you know, there's 404 00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:51,760 Speaker 3: all thing here, there's a bill there, there's a I 405 00:21:51,760 --> 00:21:54,359 Speaker 3: don't know there. And then with my foundation, it's always something. 406 00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:57,560 Speaker 3: And I ended up looking at this because you know, 407 00:21:57,600 --> 00:22:01,040 Speaker 3: you talk to yourself, you go, I don't know. I 408 00:22:01,119 --> 00:22:03,560 Speaker 3: made myself aware of that, said, what do you mean 409 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:07,080 Speaker 3: you don't know? You do know? And every time I 410 00:22:07,119 --> 00:22:10,000 Speaker 3: would say, I would say it to myself, I don't know, 411 00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:12,840 Speaker 3: even out loud, I would laugh and I would say, no, 412 00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:16,239 Speaker 3: I do know. I do know. Why am I doing this? 413 00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:20,199 Speaker 3: And I've stopped saying it because I do know. So 414 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:24,800 Speaker 3: you're already signaling your negative thought, which is, I don't 415 00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:26,879 Speaker 3: know what's going to happen. I'm feeling anxious about it. 416 00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:28,520 Speaker 3: I mean, what am I going to do? Am I 417 00:22:28,560 --> 00:22:30,680 Speaker 3: going to solve this problem? I don't know? I don't know. 418 00:22:30,920 --> 00:22:31,359 Speaker 3: I don't know. 419 00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:33,119 Speaker 1: Well, even if you look at your face as you're 420 00:22:33,160 --> 00:22:35,800 Speaker 1: talking like that, like if you think about the experience 421 00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:38,840 Speaker 1: of waking up in the morning, if your first thought 422 00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:42,400 Speaker 1: is how am I going to get through the day, 423 00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:46,560 Speaker 1: your face changes, your energy changes. If your first thought is, 424 00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:49,719 Speaker 1: I'm going to make today a good day, even though 425 00:22:49,760 --> 00:22:51,600 Speaker 1: there's a lot, I gotta make today a good day. 426 00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:54,280 Speaker 1: Like that's just a simple example. 427 00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:56,520 Speaker 3: And it's also an intention, isn't correct? 428 00:22:57,119 --> 00:22:59,320 Speaker 1: Yes, So the second piece of advice though on this, 429 00:22:59,400 --> 00:23:02,520 Speaker 1: because I have a hunch that what started to happen 430 00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:05,520 Speaker 1: for you is similar to what I think happened with 431 00:23:05,600 --> 00:23:11,439 Speaker 1: our son, where the link between the physical sensation of 432 00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:15,760 Speaker 1: this so the brain thought, I'm in big trouble now, 433 00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:18,000 Speaker 1: and the only way to solve it is to get 434 00:23:18,119 --> 00:23:20,840 Speaker 1: rid of this by throwing up. I think that got 435 00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:25,399 Speaker 1: so well worn that it became automatic and one of 436 00:23:25,440 --> 00:23:27,160 Speaker 1: the things. And that brings me to this advice from 437 00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:31,879 Speaker 1: coach Steve Magnus, which is he had a high performing 438 00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:35,000 Speaker 1: athlete that he was coaching who would always get sick 439 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:39,160 Speaker 1: before a race and it was really really bothering her, 440 00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:43,280 Speaker 1: very distracting. She could not hit the mark in terms 441 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:46,280 Speaker 1: of her ability to get better and to make nationals. 442 00:23:46,560 --> 00:23:48,280 Speaker 1: And so we came up with a strategy where he'd 443 00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:50,639 Speaker 1: be like, all right, we got an hour before the race, 444 00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:54,359 Speaker 1: what time are you going to throw up? And she'd 445 00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:55,800 Speaker 1: be like, what do you maan? No, name the time 446 00:23:55,840 --> 00:24:00,560 Speaker 1: you're going to throw up, And it removed the urge 447 00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:05,040 Speaker 1: to throw up. Interesting because by naming the time, she 448 00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:08,040 Speaker 1: all of a sudden felt in control of when it 449 00:24:08,080 --> 00:24:11,560 Speaker 1: would happen and then suddenly didn't need to do it. 450 00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:13,800 Speaker 3: I could get the act remind though you know when 451 00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:16,679 Speaker 3: the kids had hiccups and stuff, we used to we 452 00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:21,480 Speaker 3: used to say, Okay, now hit up again, let's go right, okay, 453 00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:24,240 Speaker 3: go ahead, hiccup, hickup on it, come on, hiccup. And 454 00:24:24,280 --> 00:24:27,359 Speaker 3: you know what, they couldn't hit up because the brain 455 00:24:27,520 --> 00:24:28,639 Speaker 3: made them hic up. 456 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:30,720 Speaker 1: I'm gonna try that. I've only ever used a scoop 457 00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:32,080 Speaker 1: of peanut butter like. 458 00:24:32,040 --> 00:24:35,160 Speaker 4: That, But I think I could get the actor wrong. 459 00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:38,000 Speaker 4: But I think it was Peter Fonda who threw up 460 00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:39,600 Speaker 4: before every play performance. 461 00:24:39,640 --> 00:24:41,879 Speaker 2: For every performance. There are actors who will throw up. 462 00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:45,239 Speaker 4: And there's actors, by the way, who use beta blockers, right, 463 00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:47,920 Speaker 4: which is going to block all of that. You don't 464 00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:50,119 Speaker 4: have to feel it anymore because it's a drug that 465 00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:53,600 Speaker 4: has literally stopped from the mouth, getting dry, from the stomach, 466 00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:54,600 Speaker 4: going from all of it. 467 00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:57,600 Speaker 1: But if you simply understand the chemistry of it, you 468 00:24:57,680 --> 00:25:00,320 Speaker 1: now have the ability to find the switches and the 469 00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:03,399 Speaker 1: drivers your body to start to understand and not be 470 00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:04,080 Speaker 1: afraid of it. 471 00:25:13,320 --> 00:25:17,240 Speaker 4: Even with what you write, the let me stuff and 472 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:20,000 Speaker 4: even what we're talking about right now, there's so much 473 00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:24,159 Speaker 4: deeper psychology that has been imprinted in ingrained in us 474 00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:28,040 Speaker 4: through traumas and all that. So it's so much easier 475 00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:31,080 Speaker 4: said than done there because I've been through that, been 476 00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:33,840 Speaker 4: through therapy for twenty five years, wich of the Hoffmann process, 477 00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:34,600 Speaker 4: Like i am. 478 00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:38,800 Speaker 2: Like always yeah, no, but I am, but I'm not. 479 00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:40,919 Speaker 2: I mean, I'm all all. I love it, you know. 480 00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:44,439 Speaker 4: And now through my through reading even just fiction, you know, 481 00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:47,720 Speaker 4: I learned so much about myself through different characters. 482 00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:49,320 Speaker 2: I'm always trying to be better. 483 00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:52,119 Speaker 3: You know, you're curious, right, I'm curious. 484 00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:55,880 Speaker 4: And sometimes it's like there's those moments where you can 485 00:25:55,920 --> 00:25:57,920 Speaker 4: just let it, let it all go, and you feel 486 00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:01,000 Speaker 4: at peace. But there's also so a lot of muck 487 00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:03,720 Speaker 4: and tar to have to wade through to be able 488 00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:06,359 Speaker 4: to sort of put a lot of these practices into 489 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:10,120 Speaker 4: true practice and have and rebnefit from it, because there's 490 00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:11,600 Speaker 4: a lot to wade. 491 00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:15,120 Speaker 1: Through that is true. And here's a simple truth. If 492 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:17,119 Speaker 1: I were to ask you, can you list five ways 493 00:26:17,119 --> 00:26:18,160 Speaker 1: you could make your life worse? 494 00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:19,480 Speaker 2: Yes? 495 00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:21,919 Speaker 1: Yeah, and my list would be pretty dark, Like I 496 00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:24,560 Speaker 1: can go like, really, let's just destroy everything. 497 00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:25,080 Speaker 2: Yeah. 498 00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:28,880 Speaker 1: If that's true, then you can also list five things 499 00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:30,040 Speaker 1: that would make your life better. 500 00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:30,760 Speaker 3: Yeah. 501 00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:35,680 Speaker 1: And while it is true that trauma does get ingrained 502 00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:40,960 Speaker 1: as patterns and things that your body remembers and repeats. 503 00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:44,720 Speaker 1: It's also true that it can be healed, sure. And 504 00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:49,280 Speaker 1: what I have found personally is that the thing that 505 00:26:49,400 --> 00:26:53,639 Speaker 1: stands in our way oftentimes is that it's not that 506 00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:57,000 Speaker 1: we don't know what we could be doing, it's that 507 00:26:57,119 --> 00:27:01,960 Speaker 1: we wait until we feel like doing it. And the 508 00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:06,080 Speaker 1: fact is, when you want your life to get better, 509 00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:09,560 Speaker 1: it begins with you deciding that how your life feels, 510 00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:12,320 Speaker 1: how it's going right now just no longer works for you. 511 00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:14,919 Speaker 1: Maybe it did work for you a decade ago to 512 00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:18,280 Speaker 1: throw up before everything. You can make a decision to 513 00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:20,800 Speaker 1: say to yourself, this just no longer works for my 514 00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:24,119 Speaker 1: life to work to feel like this, and that decision 515 00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:25,480 Speaker 1: is what begins. 516 00:27:25,119 --> 00:27:28,639 Speaker 2: The change, right, It begins the journey correct. 517 00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:32,320 Speaker 1: But once you can identify that I just don't want 518 00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:35,240 Speaker 1: my life to feel like this, there's thousands of things 519 00:27:35,280 --> 00:27:37,880 Speaker 1: you can do and it's going to be And so 520 00:27:38,040 --> 00:27:42,160 Speaker 1: I don't believe that you have to stay stuck and 521 00:27:42,320 --> 00:27:44,320 Speaker 1: wading through the muck for the rest of your life. 522 00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:47,280 Speaker 1: I do not believe that. I don't believe that if 523 00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:50,439 Speaker 1: something took ten years in terms of how long you 524 00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:54,680 Speaker 1: were experiencing something that you need ten years to actually 525 00:27:55,000 --> 00:27:55,639 Speaker 1: heal yourself. 526 00:27:55,800 --> 00:27:57,280 Speaker 2: You do have to put the work in. 527 00:27:57,960 --> 00:28:02,360 Speaker 3: Yes, that's where grit and how much grit people do 528 00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:05,720 Speaker 3: have to be able to face, like you say, our 529 00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:09,359 Speaker 3: failures are where we learn well you and to know 530 00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:13,640 Speaker 3: and adopt a philosophy that this is this is real, 531 00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:16,800 Speaker 3: this is not We know this. We know because we 532 00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:20,480 Speaker 3: understand how sorry to go back into my world, but 533 00:28:20,560 --> 00:28:24,000 Speaker 3: feed the part. So when we go into understanding that 534 00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:26,520 Speaker 3: we are in control of our own brain, our brain 535 00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:29,040 Speaker 3: does not control thos. We have to have the intention 536 00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:32,879 Speaker 3: and the grit and the awareness that it's okay to fail. 537 00:28:33,320 --> 00:28:36,679 Speaker 3: But ultimately it's the only way we learn yes and this, 538 00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:40,160 Speaker 3: this is what you have done is opened up a 539 00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:43,640 Speaker 3: lot of windows in people's brains, a lot of areas 540 00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:46,000 Speaker 3: where they don't talk about a lot of things where 541 00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:49,160 Speaker 3: they have no roadmap to be able to say, I'm 542 00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:51,680 Speaker 3: going to do it, follow this stepping stone, you know, 543 00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:54,440 Speaker 3: you know the five four three two one, I'm going 544 00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:58,160 Speaker 3: to do it this way. There's tools, So you're really 545 00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:02,400 Speaker 3: giving tools to people who don't have them or that 546 00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:06,160 Speaker 3: would like to get better, and you're inspiring them to 547 00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:10,560 Speaker 3: know that there is a possibility of cure. They're not sick. 548 00:29:11,000 --> 00:29:14,760 Speaker 3: You're just thinking in the wrong way. Let's think differently. 549 00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:20,040 Speaker 3: Let's put ourselves in a position of positive negatives. Like 550 00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:22,120 Speaker 3: you said, we can think of a million negatives. But 551 00:29:22,160 --> 00:29:25,320 Speaker 3: when you look at optimism and pessimism, right, and you 552 00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:27,720 Speaker 3: sort of look at these two things, so you can 553 00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:31,720 Speaker 3: look something simple like a rainy day, what's bad about it? 554 00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:37,640 Speaker 3: What's negative? What's pessimistic? Exactly? So you know we have 555 00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:40,360 Speaker 3: the capacity. If we can look at a rainy day 556 00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:42,400 Speaker 3: and think of what's good and what's not good about it, 557 00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:44,000 Speaker 3: we could do the same thing. 558 00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:49,480 Speaker 4: With us, both of you a question, Yes, and I don't. 559 00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:53,040 Speaker 2: I don't know this is true. But do you think primarily. 560 00:29:52,920 --> 00:29:58,000 Speaker 4: Our default is fear because this is how we survive. 561 00:29:58,720 --> 00:30:01,280 Speaker 4: You know, when we default to a feeling, is it 562 00:30:01,320 --> 00:30:04,720 Speaker 4: optimistic or is it more fear based? Brain is negative 563 00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:07,080 Speaker 4: bio it it feels like it's negative bias, right, it 564 00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:08,840 Speaker 4: feels like and it's. 565 00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:12,080 Speaker 3: There, and it's there, it's it's primal, it's a reptilian, 566 00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:17,280 Speaker 3: but it's definitely there to protect us. So there's all 567 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:21,520 Speaker 3: these amazing feelings that we think you're helping so many, 568 00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:27,040 Speaker 3: so many, so many people how to enjoy the possibilities 569 00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:31,760 Speaker 3: of a happier life, a calmer life, and some some 570 00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:35,200 Speaker 3: ways to make people actually deal better. Like you said, 571 00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:39,040 Speaker 3: let them, you know, and let me and let me. 572 00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:44,000 Speaker 4: In your book, I read the story of the prom story, 573 00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:49,040 Speaker 4: which is just intensely relatable as well myself, my wife 574 00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:52,720 Speaker 4: and I I feel like I live let me like, 575 00:30:52,880 --> 00:30:54,880 Speaker 4: I feel like that's kind of who I am, because 576 00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:57,960 Speaker 4: on my headstone will be we'll figure it out. 577 00:30:58,080 --> 00:30:59,920 Speaker 2: I'm just like, eh, I'll figure it out. 578 00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:03,120 Speaker 4: And we have teenagers now, and you know, with the 579 00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:04,920 Speaker 4: corsage and the thing, what you can do in the rain. 580 00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:05,479 Speaker 2: And I mean this. 581 00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:10,680 Speaker 4: I was literally reading my wife and then I forget the. 582 00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:13,400 Speaker 2: I forget exactly, I forget the exact villain. But when your. 583 00:31:13,320 --> 00:31:16,280 Speaker 4: Husband were like, what you know, there's only four tables 584 00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:18,600 Speaker 4: in this restaurant, I forget the exact line of your 585 00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:23,160 Speaker 4: husband's like, okay, and that's Buddhists. 586 00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:28,080 Speaker 1: That's why nothing bothers you. Really, my husband is Buddhists, 587 00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:32,200 Speaker 1: and so you know. I And in case you don't 588 00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:34,640 Speaker 1: know what the let them theory is, it's very very simple. 589 00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:38,160 Speaker 1: It is the fastest way to feel less stressed, to 590 00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:40,240 Speaker 1: be more in control, to have more peace in your 591 00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:44,760 Speaker 1: life is to stop trying to control what other people think, say, do, believe, 592 00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:48,600 Speaker 1: and let them be and then take your power back 593 00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:52,240 Speaker 1: and focus on yourself. I mean, this is Victor Frankel's 594 00:31:52,240 --> 00:31:58,480 Speaker 1: man search for meaning. But this is a tool that 595 00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:03,600 Speaker 1: I've leveraged all this ancient wisdom and these therapeutic practices 596 00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:08,160 Speaker 1: and spiritual philosophies into a tool that's just four words. 597 00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:12,560 Speaker 1: To your point though about the healing. I do believe 598 00:32:12,600 --> 00:32:16,040 Speaker 1: that if you didn't talk yourself into the trauma, you 599 00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:17,800 Speaker 1: can't talk yourself out of it. And I'll give you 600 00:32:17,840 --> 00:32:20,680 Speaker 1: an example. So when I was younger like you, I 601 00:32:20,760 --> 00:32:25,000 Speaker 1: was in a car accident where the car that I 602 00:32:25,040 --> 00:32:28,960 Speaker 1: was enrolled and my mom was driving, and we were 603 00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:33,120 Speaker 1: up in northern Michigan and we were near Kalkaska, and 604 00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 1: the radio announcer came on and said something about the 605 00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:39,120 Speaker 1: effect of black ice and be careful out there, and 606 00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:41,200 Speaker 1: all of a sudden, a guy went to pass us, 607 00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:43,560 Speaker 1: and then a semi truck was coming and he cut 608 00:32:43,600 --> 00:32:46,120 Speaker 1: in front of us, and my mom went off the 609 00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:50,160 Speaker 1: side of the road. The car rolled and we ended 610 00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:53,280 Speaker 1: up with her up and me down, and thankfully we 611 00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:55,800 Speaker 1: had our seat belts on, but the dog went from 612 00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:59,840 Speaker 1: the front to the back. We were okay. And the 613 00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:04,240 Speaker 1: thing that's interesting about that experience is that my mom 614 00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:07,080 Speaker 1: and I were both in the car. It certainly was 615 00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:10,720 Speaker 1: a traumatic experience in terms of the trauma response of 616 00:33:10,760 --> 00:33:15,760 Speaker 1: all five senses coming online and capturing everything that happens, 617 00:33:15,760 --> 00:33:19,280 Speaker 1: because in a traumatic experience it can go into slow motion. 618 00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:24,800 Speaker 1: But what's interesting is that to this day, if my 619 00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:28,960 Speaker 1: mom hears the words black ice, she feels like she's 620 00:33:28,960 --> 00:33:31,000 Speaker 1: back in the car. If I hear the words black ice, 621 00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:34,200 Speaker 1: I feel nothing. But if I walk to my mailbox 622 00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:37,800 Speaker 1: on a snowy day and it's that kind of mail 623 00:33:37,840 --> 00:33:42,800 Speaker 1: box kind of snow, it's like I am back in 624 00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:48,160 Speaker 1: that car. I feel like I'm sitting in the dryer 625 00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:51,760 Speaker 1: as things are flying around me, And there is no 626 00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:56,240 Speaker 1: amount of talking that will get rid of the connection 627 00:33:56,440 --> 00:34:02,480 Speaker 1: between that sound and the association with that memory. However, 628 00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:05,120 Speaker 1: there are lots of things you can do, whether it's 629 00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:09,360 Speaker 1: EMDR or it's some of the new psychedelic guided modalities 630 00:34:09,920 --> 00:34:15,279 Speaker 1: that get into your body with the amygdala suspended, and 631 00:34:15,400 --> 00:34:18,400 Speaker 1: allow you to revisit those things in a calm state, 632 00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:21,839 Speaker 1: which allows your brain to file those memories in long 633 00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:26,520 Speaker 1: term storage. And so I believe what's very exciting is 634 00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:29,120 Speaker 1: that just because you endured something for a very long 635 00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:31,360 Speaker 1: period of time doesn't mean it has to take you 636 00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:34,960 Speaker 1: that long to heal it. And to your point, Goldie, 637 00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:40,319 Speaker 1: it is so true that your brain is extraordinary in 638 00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:43,719 Speaker 1: that it's not a storage unit. It's a processor that 639 00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:47,560 Speaker 1: you can encode and anytime that you decide, you know what. 640 00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:50,560 Speaker 1: I'm tired of beating myself up. I'm tired of feeling 641 00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:53,600 Speaker 1: like the victim. I'm tired of telling myself that success 642 00:34:53,680 --> 00:34:56,440 Speaker 1: happens for other people, but it never happens for somebody 643 00:34:56,520 --> 00:34:59,080 Speaker 1: like me. I want to change the settings in my 644 00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:03,200 Speaker 1: mind and I want to learn how to encode my 645 00:35:03,400 --> 00:35:07,799 Speaker 1: mind with the kind of thoughts that help me take 646 00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:10,879 Speaker 1: the steps that help me believe, because I actually think 647 00:35:10,920 --> 00:35:14,040 Speaker 1: the biggest thing that people struggle with it's not a 648 00:35:14,120 --> 00:35:16,520 Speaker 1: lack of information. Because if you're stuck and you don't 649 00:35:16,600 --> 00:35:19,719 Speaker 1: like your life, go to AI, go to Microsoft Copilot 650 00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:22,959 Speaker 1: and type in what's wrong and ask it for ten suggestions. 651 00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:23,840 Speaker 3: It'll work. 652 00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:27,759 Speaker 1: The problem's going to be that if you're at a 653 00:35:27,800 --> 00:35:29,719 Speaker 1: point in your life, and I have certainly been there 654 00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:33,680 Speaker 1: where you are so discouraged and you don't have hope, 655 00:35:34,760 --> 00:35:39,200 Speaker 1: you will tell yourself it doesn't matter, and you won't 656 00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:43,320 Speaker 1: take the steps to either change the way you think, 657 00:35:44,120 --> 00:35:47,600 Speaker 1: or change the way you start your day, or change 658 00:35:47,640 --> 00:35:50,600 Speaker 1: the things you eat, or change the people that you 659 00:35:50,640 --> 00:35:54,319 Speaker 1: hang out with that actually do change everything at times. 660 00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:55,920 Speaker 3: Is that they say, well, that's the way I am. 661 00:35:56,200 --> 00:35:57,279 Speaker 2: Yes, no it's not. 662 00:35:58,320 --> 00:36:00,759 Speaker 3: It's the way you think you are, but it's not 663 00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:04,080 Speaker 3: the way you are. And there is definitely fluidity of 664 00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:06,960 Speaker 3: understanding that you don't have to stay with who you 665 00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:08,000 Speaker 3: perceive yourself to be. 666 00:36:08,239 --> 00:36:08,720 Speaker 1: That's true. 667 00:36:08,840 --> 00:36:12,320 Speaker 3: So it's really it's a it's a beautiful message. 668 00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:16,120 Speaker 4: Well, once again, we have to make a part two 669 00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:19,520 Speaker 4: because this is just too good. This is just it's 670 00:36:19,560 --> 00:36:21,799 Speaker 4: too fascinating. There's too much to talk about. So we 671 00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:25,319 Speaker 4: are we're doing a part two of mel It's it's 672 00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:26,680 Speaker 4: an impossibility not to