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Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, welcome to another episode of I Saw What

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Speaker 1: You Did. My name is Millie to.

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Speaker 2: Jericho, I'm Daniel Henderson and.

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Speaker 1: We're here to talk about film with y'all. What's happening

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Speaker 1: to Daniel And not much.

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Speaker 2: I'm just deep in my autumn my autumnal sweater fees.

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Speaker 2: Just sweating in some sweaters.

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Speaker 1: Sweating in sweaters, Baby, I've been there.

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Speaker 2: There's nothing like I wear a roomy So every once

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Speaker 2: in a while I'll just feel like a trickle at

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Speaker 2: sweat running down my arm and I just lift up

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Speaker 2: my arm and let the knit pattern do what it

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Speaker 2: will to catch it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, not to always bring conversation back to

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Speaker 1: vander Pump rules, but there. I've been rewatching the entire

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Speaker 1: series basically, and I noticed that Jack's wears a lot

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Speaker 1: of sweaters in the summertime in La Yeah, And I

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Speaker 1: was always like, that's a weird choice for him. But

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Speaker 1: then I was like, I feel you, because I love

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Speaker 1: a sweater. And sometimes it's like not cold enough necessarily

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Speaker 1: to wear a sweater, but you just you feel a

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Speaker 1: little bit of it in the air.

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Speaker 2: You're like, bring it right exactly as soon as there's

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Speaker 2: a little Christmas. I'm like, all right, sweaters on, I know.

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Speaker 1: And so I would be watching these episodes where'd be

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Speaker 1: wearing these like chunky knit cardigans, and then you could

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Speaker 1: just see that kind of condensation around his forehead and cheeks,

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Speaker 1: and I'm like, I feel you, dude, like I feel you.

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Speaker 2: I watched all of Vanderpup a couple of months ago,

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Speaker 2: and he he had that sheen of sweat that wasn't

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Speaker 2: helped by the sweaters, but I think was probably caused

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Speaker 2: by cocaine or something or all of his fucking pills

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Speaker 2: and potions and muscle shit. Like he his body is

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Speaker 2: not right. Let's just say that his body, the chemistry

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Speaker 2: of his body is struggling to function.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Oh but yeah, I'm sure the sweater did not

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Speaker 1: help his coke sweats whatsoever.

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Speaker 2: But I just have normal people's sweats. I don't have

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Speaker 2: coke sweats. I just have dirt bag sweats.

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Speaker 1: That's good. Well it's yeah, it's addum around here too,

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Speaker 1: and the leaves are falling. And because of this, I

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Speaker 1: wanted to dip into the mail bag this week because

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Speaker 1: we got this incredible FMK that I just have to

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Speaker 1: share with you. Go for it. Okay, so this is

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Speaker 1: an email that we got from Heather from Texas. She

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Speaker 1: her pronouns here it goes, love the pod. Thank you

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Speaker 1: for reigniting my love of film. The recent Roommate from

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Speaker 1: Hell episode got me thinking about how much I loved

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Speaker 1: the Shallow Grave soundtrack, which led me down an nostalgia

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Speaker 1: rabbit hole of nineties soundtracks that featured die from their movie,

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Speaker 1: and then nineties soundtracks in general. Naturally, this spawned FMK

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Speaker 1: MILLI and Danielle I challenge you to an FMK of

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Speaker 1: nineties movie soundtracks, and there's three rounds and then a

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Speaker 1: bonus round, so technically four rounds of the FMK, and

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Speaker 1: I gotta say this is gonna be fun. I can't

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Speaker 1: wait to hear your choices.

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Speaker 2: You ready, I'm ready?

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Speaker 1: Okay, Round one, Round one dialogue mashups. You've got FMK

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Speaker 1: the Lost Highway soundtrack, the Pulp Fiction soundtrack, and the

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Speaker 1: Shallow Grave soundtrack.

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Speaker 2: Okay, I'm going to fuck the Shallow Grave soundtrack. Ooh,

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Speaker 2: because it's very rave culture nineties mix with some weird

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Speaker 2: old fifties songs like it's just it's perfectly nineties in

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Speaker 2: a way that really hits me. In my heart, so

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Speaker 2: I will fuck it. I'll marry the Lost Highway soundtrack

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Speaker 2: because it could possibly be something I could occasionally write to,

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Speaker 2: Like I can keep it in the background, Okay, but

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Speaker 2: I don't want to do I don't want to engage

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Speaker 2: with it directly too much, So I will marry it

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Speaker 2: so I could just kind of keep it in the

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Speaker 2: background and not creep myself out NonStop.

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Speaker 1: Okay, we know.

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Speaker 2: That about you.

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Speaker 1: You don't want any any drama, no drama, no dramas.

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Speaker 2: But also like I can't, I can't engage with it directly.

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Speaker 2: But it's like, I keep your enemies closer kind of

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Speaker 2: feeling with the Lost Highway soundtrack.

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Speaker 1: Got it.

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Speaker 2: And I'm killing pulp fiction because it was just ubiquitous

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Speaker 2: in the nineties in a way that ruined my appreciation

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Speaker 2: for any music that happened in that film. Uh huh,

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Speaker 2: So it's got to fucking go. If I never hear

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Speaker 2: the Pulp Fiction soundtrack again, I'm fine with it. So

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Speaker 2: that's why I'm killing it.

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Speaker 1: A total hard fall from the from the grace of

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Speaker 1: when it first came out. I totally understand. Okay, my

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Speaker 1: answers are, this is the way that I'm gonna play

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Speaker 1: it this time and for this for this episode, I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna imagine the soundtracks are a person especially and I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna cast my judgment from there. So here we go.

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Speaker 1: For me, I am going to definitely fuck the Lost

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Speaker 1: Highway soundtrack just because I mean there's like Trent Rezdor

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Speaker 1: on that thing, like it's it seems very industrial, and

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Speaker 1: I mean you either have to fuck or kill that soundtrack.

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Speaker 2: Or marry it. Eh, well you marrying it.

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Speaker 1: It's very interesting to me as I just as I

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Speaker 1: just said, because I'm just like, wow, marrying the Lost

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Speaker 1: Highway soundtrack would be I don't even know what that

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Speaker 1: would be like. Maybe I would feel like the only

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Speaker 1: lovers left alive, like you and the soundtrack are like

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Speaker 1: old vampires living in a warehouse or something else.

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Speaker 2: Just walking around shuffling past each other with our robes

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Speaker 2: fucking brushing once in a while.

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Speaker 1: It's like when you see those like old goth couples

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Speaker 1: that are like still goth in their sixties, and you're

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Speaker 1: just like, damn, that's fucking that's you and the Lost

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Speaker 1: Highway soundtrack.

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Speaker 2: So you're in a fucking so you're gonna have a

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Speaker 2: much better experience or worse, but you won't have to

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Speaker 2: hang around and with it forever.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that's a great fucking time, maybe a great weekend.

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Speaker 1: Let's just say that I will marry the Shallow Grave

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Speaker 1: soundtrack because I do love Nina Simone. I love that

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Speaker 1: Nina Smone song. Shallow Grave seems like a kind of

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Speaker 1: intellectual choice out of the three, and I don't know,

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Speaker 1: I can imagine living with the Shallow Grave soundtrack forever.

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Speaker 2: A professorial soundtrack.

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Speaker 1: Yes, And then of course we're killing pulp fiction because

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Speaker 1: of everything you just said. Just ah, it is worn out,

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Speaker 1: It's welcome in my house. I mean, what is that

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Speaker 1: chuck Berry song that like they used to play. They

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Speaker 1: used to actually play that when I would go out

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Speaker 1: to nightclubs during the in the nineties, they would play

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Speaker 1: that fucking say Love say they folks. It goes. I

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Speaker 1: was like, why are we doing this? This is.

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Speaker 2: My Grandma wouldn't even dance to that shit.

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Speaker 1: Like what. I'm like, Okay, we were just listening to

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Speaker 1: New Order and then all of a sudden, we're dancing

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Speaker 1: to this old fucking song because of pulp fiction, and

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Speaker 1: I'm like, this is too jarring. I can't. I can't

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Speaker 1: handle it.

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Speaker 2: We finally get the origin story of how you became

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Speaker 2: a DJ, though, where you were like fuck this and

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Speaker 2: you just take one arm and wipe every record off

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Speaker 2: of the table and just take over. Yo.

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Speaker 1: I was never pulling those kind of tricks. Yes, I

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Speaker 1: was never. I would never stoop that low, is all

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Speaker 1: I'm saying.

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Speaker 2: So I'm glad we're both killing the pulp fiction soundtrack

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Speaker 2: because if that was not the case, I would have

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Speaker 2: to do some real soul searching.

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Speaker 1: I know, I feel very connected to you in this moment. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So that's round one. Round two. You know it's getting dirty.

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Speaker 1: Round two nine. These bangers, fuck Mary, kill the single soundtrack,

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Speaker 1: the Romeo plus Juliet soundtrack, and the Waiting to Exhale soundtrack.

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Speaker 2: Heather, you are demented in the best way. I fucking

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Speaker 2: love these rounds so much. I have a question for

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Speaker 2: you before we even answer, and you can just say

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Speaker 2: yes or no, doesn't have to But have you even

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Speaker 2: heard the Romeo and Juliet soundtrack? As we know you

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Speaker 2: haven't seen it.

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Speaker 1: Uh, I feel like I have probably just riding around

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Speaker 1: in other people's fucking cars.

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Speaker 2: Okay, solid, Yeah, Solid, I mean.

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Speaker 1: I definitely know at least one song on it write

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Speaker 1: that Cardigan.

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Speaker 2: Song, Yeah, which is why I am killing Romeo and Juliet. Yes, yes, listen,

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Speaker 2: this is gonna be real easy. I'm fucking singles. I'm

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Speaker 2: marrying Waiting to Exhale, I'm killing Romeo and Juliet. Singles

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Speaker 2: was like my fucking lifeblood for so long, all these

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Speaker 2: bands that I fucking loved. Don't fuck with Mother love Bone,

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Speaker 2: don't fuck with Mother love Bone, don't fuck with it,

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Speaker 2: Early Sound Garden.

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Speaker 1: You can't fuck with it.

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Speaker 2: That was like the corner soon of my goddamn personality

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Speaker 2: in life when that movie came out. I'm gonna marry

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Speaker 2: Waiting to Exhale because I love jamming to those songs

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Speaker 2: in the grocery store. Yeah, it's just like a comfort.

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Speaker 2: Listen every song, you're just like, yep, Whitney shoop shoop shoopin',

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Speaker 2: oh shoot shoot shoop shoop bop, Like fine, it's in

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Speaker 2: my heart. It's like again, part of the scaffolding. So

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Speaker 2: I will marry Waiting the ex sale and Romeo and

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Speaker 2: Juliet that Cardigan song alone good Bye, And I don't

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Speaker 2: even hate the movie. And I don't even hate the soundtrack.

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Speaker 2: I just in this vein of pulp fiction. If I

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Speaker 2: never hear it again, I'm fine. Yeah, y'all play that

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Speaker 2: played it out too much, wore up the welcome.

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Speaker 1: Listen. I'm gonna tell you right now, we have the

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Speaker 1: exact same answers. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, exact

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Speaker 1: same answers, pretty much the same reasons I have to say.

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Speaker 1: I mean, here's here's something I want to drop to

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Speaker 1: you right now, Danielle about killing the Romeo plus Juliet soundtrack.

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Speaker 1: Do you remember the every Buddy's Free to Wear Sunscreen song?

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Speaker 2: Unfortunately? Yes, it's like unfortunately, yes they did dirty with

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Speaker 2: that soundtrack, because the movie is actually better than the

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Speaker 2: soundtrack indicates.

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Speaker 1: Well, and before all of y'all get crazy, I think

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Speaker 1: that that track particularly was on like the re release

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Speaker 1: of the soundtrack, because at something they re released it

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Speaker 1: and they added a few They add like a few tracks,

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Speaker 1: and one of them was that fucking Boz Luerman Everybody's

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Speaker 1: Free to Were Sunscreen, which I don't understand. That song

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Speaker 1: was so popular, like it they used to play it

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Speaker 1: on the radio, and I'm like, what is this.

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Speaker 2: Song? A song with a message? About Sunscreen. Like the

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Speaker 2: nineties we had shit going on. The Ozone layer was depleted,

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Speaker 2: like there was shit going on. I understand the Sunscreen bent,

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Speaker 2: but like politically we had some like it was just

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Speaker 2: it was a very strange song.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I was not a fan, I have to say,

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Speaker 1: but so that's why I'm killing And then the single

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Speaker 1: soundtrack as the f I mean absolutely one hundred percent.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you gotta just based on the Alison Chane

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Speaker 1: song alone is a good Time.

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Speaker 2: That is my go That is one of my go

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Speaker 2: to bring the house down karaoke songs because absolutely nobody

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Speaker 2: expects a six foot tall black woman to have the

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Speaker 2: same vocal range as Lane Staley.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I'm just gonna say it right now,

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Speaker 1: that night would be filled with like that kind of

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Speaker 1: wild at heart esque love making with like the hard pumps,

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Speaker 1: the passionate hard pumps. That's like you and the single

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Speaker 1: soundtrack what.

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Speaker 2: Percent, whereas I feel like you'd be romancing the single soundtrack,

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Speaker 2: It would be like love making.

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Speaker 1: Love making, true love making.

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Speaker 2: This fucking state of love and trust would come on

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Speaker 2: and you'd be like in.

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Speaker 1: Your reverie, Well listen, I'm so glad that we're perfectly

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Speaker 1: aligne on that round because again, I would question a

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Speaker 1: lot about our friendship if that were the case. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so you've got round three. This is actually great. Round

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Speaker 1: three mix tape masters, fuck Mary, kill, the Rushmore soundtrack,

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Speaker 1: the Reservoir Dog soundtrack, and the train Spotting soundtrack.

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Speaker 2: Okay, this this is actually I thought it was going

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Speaker 2: to be difficult, but it's probably easier than I thought

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Speaker 2: it would be. I am going to fuck the Rushmore soundtrack.

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Speaker 2: We got a lot of Cat Stevens, we have a

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Speaker 2: lot of autumnal vibes. Ah, I could get down with that.

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Speaker 2: That would be my love making fuck. Not the helicopter

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Speaker 2: in a well fuck or the like fucking thrown up

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Speaker 2: in there like a pizza fuck. That'd be my like

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Speaker 2: love making. Fuck. I'm gonna marry Trainspotting because I got

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Speaker 2: down to that soundtrack so fucking hard in the nineties.

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Speaker 2: It's not even funny. Yes, Like again, every song, every beat,

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Speaker 2: every note, I know what's coming next from song to song.

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Speaker 2: I just I loved that soundtrack so much. Haven't listened

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Speaker 2: to it a long time, but I would. I would

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Speaker 2: marry it. That would marry it. I could live with

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Speaker 2: it forever. Put it that way, and look Tarantino's fucking

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Speaker 2: oh for two, I'm killing reservoir dogs because again, y'all

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Speaker 2: got two into this like fifties updated hipster shit, and

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Speaker 2: you took some really good songs and drove them into

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Speaker 2: the ground. For me, I know, like some fucking great

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Speaker 2: It's not the fault of the soundtrack. It's the fault

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Speaker 2: of the culture. Like there are some great songs on there,

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Speaker 2: some real like dirty seventies like I really love, but

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Speaker 2: y'all culture killed it. I can't if I never hear

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Speaker 2: it again. It's fine because now every time I hear

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Speaker 2: songs from that soundtrack, I think of the movie. It's

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Speaker 2: no longer tied to the experience of music.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that is absolutely true. I actually I blame myself

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Speaker 1: for that, for for that, because I'm like, I was

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Speaker 1: too eager of a young person that wanted to be

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Speaker 1: around old music that I allowed myself to get over

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Speaker 1: enchanted by that soundtrack and by all of his soundtracks,

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Speaker 1: to be honest. Yeah, so I think now you may

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Speaker 1: know at least one of mine. So I I am

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Speaker 1: going to fuck the Train Spotting soundtrack because coming on

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Speaker 1: like lust for Life, by Iggy Pop is such a

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Speaker 1: fucking banger. I don't even know what else to say.

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Speaker 2: Like it starts, it doesn't stop, it just keeps fucking

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Speaker 2: building out.

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Speaker 1: Oh. It is so such a great song. It puts

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Speaker 1: me in this incredible mood every time I hear it.

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Speaker 1: Best song to play as a DJ, by the way,

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Speaker 1: I mean, if you want to get back down to that.

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Speaker 1: It's a great club song. And also the other one

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Speaker 1: of the other songs on the soundtrack that I think

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Speaker 1: is really great is that sleeper cover of Blondie is Atomic.

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Speaker 1: I mean that great.

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Speaker 2: Oh my god, they did such a good job with

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Speaker 2: that song.

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Speaker 1: Also even just the.

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Speaker 2: What's that like? Like that club banger? It's like, d.

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Speaker 1: Look at my face. I'm like, just look up the

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Speaker 1: name of it.

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Speaker 2: Jesus Christ. That made no sense. That was just a

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Speaker 2: series of fucking sounds.

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Speaker 1: I was like, is that Gary Glitter? What what are

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Speaker 1: you singing? Ah?

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Speaker 2: It's all the fucking It's like the main song in

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Speaker 2: Train's Body. They use it behind like they play it

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Speaker 2: when he's walking away with the bag of money.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, spoiler. Oh it's that fucking.

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Speaker 2: Movie man Born Slippy by Underworld.

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Speaker 1: Yes, that's that song. You know what I'm Yeah, that

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Speaker 1: song is fucking tight. Yeah, yeah, that is possible to

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Speaker 1: recreate clearly but tight. Yes, yes, so that's what I mean.

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Speaker 1: That soundtrack is a thrilling role in the hay I

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Speaker 1: will I will always call it late at night when

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Speaker 1: I'm feeling frisky. Okay, I'm going to marry the Rushmore soundtrack.

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Speaker 1: I'm I love the Rushmore soundtrack. It is perfect again,

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Speaker 1: like you said, perfect for the fall. It's like this

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Speaker 1: kind of back to school feeling of the like the

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Speaker 1: Blazers and the you know, private school vibes. I love

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Speaker 1: it so much and I just love like I listened

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Speaker 1: to that soundtrack still to this day. So it is

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Speaker 1: we are bonded for life, we will be together forever.

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Speaker 1: And then yes, definitely fucking murdering the Reservoir.

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Speaker 2: Dog soundtrack, like, raise your hand if you've been personally

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Speaker 2: victimized by Quentin Tarantino soundtracks in the night.

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Speaker 1: And again, I blame myself. I was too eager. I

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Speaker 1: was like, and I think about it, like, had I

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Speaker 1: had been a fully grown when I heard that Little

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00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:04,040
Speaker 1: Green Bag song, maybe I would have played it so

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Speaker 1: much and maybe I wouldn't have burnt myself out on

308
00:19:06,080 --> 00:19:11,520
Speaker 1: that shit. But it's just the way the cookie crumbled, unfortunately.

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Speaker 1: So we're killing the fuck out of this soundtrack, both

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Speaker 1: you and I.

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Speaker 2: I'm so glad that we are mostly even keeled on that,

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Speaker 2: and definitely that we agree on killing killing Tarantino soundtracks.

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Speaker 2: He just ain't got it. He ain't got it for

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Speaker 2: that shit. He goes too much.

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Speaker 1: Yes, I totally agree. So now we have the bonus round.

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Speaker 1: This one. I don't even know what to say because

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Speaker 1: this is fucking personal. The bonus round is called Millie's Nightmares,

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Speaker 1: and we.

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Speaker 2: Got Heather fucking great. I love you for this, I

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Speaker 2: love you for this. Ye know.

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Speaker 1: She put me on the barbecue with this one, for sure.

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Speaker 1: So fuck Mary. Kill the Titanic soundtrack, the Empire Records soundtrack,

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Speaker 1: and the Forest Gump soundtrack.

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Speaker 2: It's so gross, it's so gross.

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, Oh my god, it's so gross.

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Speaker 2: I absolutely love this. Hi, Hi, I out the gate.

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Speaker 2: I'm gonna shock all you fucking Empire Records.

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Speaker 1: Ooh, it's okay.

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Speaker 2: It's a we work at a coffee shop and we're

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00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:40,080
Speaker 2: getting down on some bags of beans. It's a mistake

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Speaker 2: that you will regret for months or years after, but

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Speaker 2: it's fun. It's okay. I'll okay, I'll fuck it because

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Speaker 2: I don't want to marry it, and I definitely have

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Speaker 2: a better kill. I'm marrying Titanic.

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Speaker 1: Wow.

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00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:02,520
Speaker 2: Wow, i will marry Titanic. No, you've never seen the film.

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00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:07,000
Speaker 2: It's a little schmaltzy. But I'm not killing Celine Dion.

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00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:10,480
Speaker 2: I'm not going to do the one to drop that

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00:21:10,520 --> 00:21:16,880
Speaker 2: bitch in the ocean like a diamond. Sure, sure, I'll

340
00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:19,240
Speaker 2: marry it. I'm not going to be nice to it.

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Speaker 2: It'll be a horrible relationship that I will only pay

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00:21:23,920 --> 00:21:27,640
Speaker 2: attention to once every decade. But I ain't killing Celine Dion.

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Speaker 2: I'm gonna marry it. I am killing Forrest Gump because

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00:21:32,400 --> 00:21:36,040
Speaker 2: I kind of have to. Everyone's parents ruined that soundtrack

345
00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:40,720
Speaker 2: like that Boomer that Boomers soundtrack, and no matter how

346
00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:44,359
Speaker 2: many great songs are on it, it conjures up images

347
00:21:44,560 --> 00:21:48,200
Speaker 2: of entire families on a beach with a white shirt

348
00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:53,480
Speaker 2: and a khaki Yeah, it's conjuring up my dad thinks

349
00:21:53,520 --> 00:22:00,439
Speaker 2: this is cool in a car ride. It's conjuring a

350
00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:03,720
Speaker 2: lot of polo shirts on a golf course. I'm killing

351
00:22:03,760 --> 00:22:04,680
Speaker 2: Forrest Gum soundtrack.

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00:22:05,480 --> 00:22:09,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, like the Forrest Gum soundtrack is like the extremely

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00:22:09,359 --> 00:22:12,800
Speaker 1: corny version of a Tarantino soundtrack. It's like the absolutely

354
00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:20,600
Speaker 1: time life hits of the sixties. Shit, it's pretty bad.

355
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Speaker 1: And I say this having seen the movie about twenty

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Speaker 1: five times.

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Speaker 2: So no, it's it's now here. This for oldies. We

358
00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:32,960
Speaker 2: can't like what's that? What's that? That series where a

359
00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:37,119
Speaker 2: bunch of kids record popular.

360
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Speaker 1: Kids bop is up?

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Speaker 2: You're killing me. It's like a kid's bop oh ond

362
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Speaker 2: percent it's a.

363
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Speaker 1: Kid's pop for adults.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, oh my god, I just broke my brain with that.

365
00:22:56,880 --> 00:22:59,359
Speaker 2: I cannot wait for your fucking answers because this is

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Speaker 2: your nightmare around.

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00:23:00,960 --> 00:23:05,280
Speaker 1: Well guess what, bitch, we got the same exact and yes,

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00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:13,520
Speaker 1: ah okay. I first of all, the thing about the

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00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:19,000
Speaker 1: Empire Records soundtrack, Yes, it has my least favorite gin

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00:23:19,160 --> 00:23:23,159
Speaker 1: Blossom song on it. Oh, but it has probably one

371
00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:28,359
Speaker 1: of the greatest songs, the Edwin Collins tune a Girl

372
00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:28,800
Speaker 1: Like You.

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Speaker 2: I never met a girl like you, befoh.

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Speaker 1: Which is kind of I have to say. I know,

375
00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:37,919
Speaker 1: I get raked over the fucking Colls every time I

376
00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:40,119
Speaker 1: talk about Empire Records. But I have to say that

377
00:23:40,359 --> 00:23:44,240
Speaker 1: song is too good for that movie. I'm just saying absolutely,

378
00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:47,720
Speaker 1: like that should have been in a fucking James Bond

379
00:23:47,800 --> 00:23:49,720
Speaker 1: movie or something. I don't know if it actually was,

380
00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:50,280
Speaker 1: but it should.

381
00:23:50,359 --> 00:23:52,879
Speaker 2: I agree so emphatically that it turned me into a

382
00:23:52,920 --> 00:24:00,560
Speaker 2: monster for a second. There, that's our good.

383
00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:10,520
Speaker 1: You're like toxic avengering of So that's that's a fun

384
00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:13,960
Speaker 1: a fun night, a fun a fun little Netflix and

385
00:24:14,040 --> 00:24:17,280
Speaker 1: chill hang with the Empire Record soundtrack, and then of

386
00:24:17,359 --> 00:24:20,960
Speaker 1: course I will marry the Titanic soundtrack for the exact

387
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:21,600
Speaker 1: same reason.

388
00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:22,560
Speaker 2: Thank you.

389
00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:28,280
Speaker 1: You don't want to kill Celine Dion, Absolutely not. I'm

390
00:24:28,320 --> 00:24:31,120
Speaker 1: one of these people that likes her sort of irony

391
00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:35,880
Speaker 1: free by the like. I pretty much like her earnestly.

392
00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:39,199
Speaker 1: I think she's very talented. I think she's got like

393
00:24:39,800 --> 00:24:44,800
Speaker 1: great hand gestures and and as of this recording, I

394
00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:48,960
Speaker 1: think she's unblemished in terms of her politics or whatever.

395
00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:52,400
Speaker 2: But I'm just saying she makes she's she has fun

396
00:24:52,440 --> 00:24:56,520
Speaker 2: with herself, yes, and she without denigrating her talent, she

397
00:24:56,560 --> 00:24:59,520
Speaker 2: absolutely will make fun of herself in pop culture. I

398
00:24:59,560 --> 00:24:59,879
Speaker 2: love it.

399
00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:04,480
Speaker 1: And she's got that like unbridled passion about things that

400
00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:08,280
Speaker 1: is like, yes, you know, like a very earnest passion

401
00:25:08,560 --> 00:25:11,560
Speaker 1: about her life that I'm just like, yes, we should

402
00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:15,360
Speaker 1: all strive to be that earnestly passionate. So we are

403
00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:18,199
Speaker 1: marrying the Titanic's attract and then of course we are

404
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:26,240
Speaker 1: point blank shooting the Forrest Gump double fucking CDs. By

405
00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:31,120
Speaker 1: the way, did you remember that, yes, to this what's

406
00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:34,040
Speaker 1: filled with adults kids?

407
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:38,679
Speaker 2: Boss, we are taking this double CD out to a

408
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:42,320
Speaker 2: panic like the peaky fucking blinders and shooting in the

409
00:25:42,320 --> 00:25:42,920
Speaker 2: back of the head.

410
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:51,080
Speaker 1: Oh my god. And yeah, I'm with you. I just couldn't.

411
00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:56,000
Speaker 1: It's just too boomer nostalgia for me. I mean, you know,

412
00:25:56,320 --> 00:26:00,919
Speaker 1: like it was. It's a Time Life commercial in a

413
00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:05,639
Speaker 1: nutshell and they gotta die. So that is it. Heather

414
00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:09,440
Speaker 1: nailed it, She really nailed it.

415
00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:11,560
Speaker 2: She knocked this out of the park. That was so

416
00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:12,240
Speaker 2: much fun.

417
00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:14,439
Speaker 1: Thank you, Heather, Yes, thank you.

418
00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:27,159
Speaker 2: Okay, speaking of knocking it out of the park, you

419
00:26:27,280 --> 00:26:30,760
Speaker 2: came up with this week's theme, and you gotta tell

420
00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:31,919
Speaker 2: the people what's going on.

421
00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:36,119
Speaker 1: Okay, So we might have to go back into the

422
00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:42,280
Speaker 1: vaults for this one, because the name of This theme

423
00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:48,760
Speaker 1: is called runners, jumpers, and amblers. And this was something

424
00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:51,440
Speaker 1: that I feel like we came up with, Like last year,

425
00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:59,040
Speaker 1: we had this discussion about horror movie villains and they're

426
00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:05,080
Speaker 1: gate if you will, or they're like their body, their

427
00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:07,440
Speaker 1: choreography or something like.

428
00:27:08,160 --> 00:27:10,560
Speaker 2: And I think it was like, could we get away

429
00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:15,480
Speaker 2: from them or in what situation would you be able

430
00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:16,400
Speaker 2: to get away from them?

431
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:20,480
Speaker 1: Yes, exactly, And we kind of hired out a few,

432
00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:23,480
Speaker 1: Like we figured that I think Freddy Krueger was a

433
00:27:23,560 --> 00:27:30,040
Speaker 1: runner because he seemed fast. Maybe jumpers would be like

434
00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:37,680
Speaker 1: a kind of lipcun maybe Blall from basket Case.

435
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:41,840
Speaker 2: It's a jumper, Yeah, drop it out of that basket

436
00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:43,920
Speaker 2: with a ferocity that is unparalleled.

437
00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:46,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, one of the like a whole like any kind

438
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:50,520
Speaker 1: of horror movie villain that just like surprises you, comes

439
00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:54,040
Speaker 1: out of a place, you know. And then amblers are

440
00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:59,800
Speaker 1: like the kind of cumbersome large like leather Face from

441
00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:05,560
Speaker 1: Exis Chainsaw types, like not exactly a runner, kind of

442
00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:09,520
Speaker 1: just an ambler. They didn't yell came up with an ambler.

443
00:28:09,760 --> 00:28:12,720
Speaker 2: They just kind of appear where they're like they are

444
00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 2: not in a rush to kill you because they know

445
00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:18,560
Speaker 2: they're going to get you, so they just kind of mosy.

446
00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:22,040
Speaker 2: They're mosiers. I actually I dated a guy named Ambler

447
00:28:22,080 --> 00:28:23,919
Speaker 2: when I lived in Alaska.

448
00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:28,399
Speaker 1: What Alaska? First of all, that tracks.

449
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:31,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's also the name of a town in Alaska.

450
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:35,880
Speaker 1: So a M B L E R. Wow, that's fascinating.

451
00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:40,400
Speaker 2: He was a gorgeous Was he an actual ambler?

452
00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:43,600
Speaker 1: Who would he be in this specially?

453
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:45,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, he was kind of an ambler, like a hippie type.

454
00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:49,360
Speaker 2: I really he was cute. I should look him up.

455
00:28:49,520 --> 00:28:51,680
Speaker 2: He's probably married with nineteen kids by now. But like,

456
00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 2: he was very a very nice man who I was

457
00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:58,479
Speaker 2: too young to see the virtues of. But I always

458
00:28:58,480 --> 00:29:02,680
Speaker 2: loved his name. An Ambler always cracks me up as emotion.

459
00:29:03,760 --> 00:29:07,440
Speaker 1: Listen Ambler, if you're out there ambling around the dog

460
00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:10,440
Speaker 1: park or wherever, listen to podcasts and you're hearing this

461
00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:14,280
Speaker 1: right now, I saw what you did pot atmail dot com.

462
00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:16,640
Speaker 2: Leave us a voice memo, Leave us a voice memo,

463
00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:19,760
Speaker 2: Leave voice voice memo. We worked at a bookstore together.

464
00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:24,000
Speaker 2: He was so cute. But yeah, amblers. And look, we

465
00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:27,080
Speaker 2: both chose amblers this week, or I think I think

466
00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:28,200
Speaker 2: we both chose amblers.

467
00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:33,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, a little ambler. Maybe maybe a sixty forty split

468
00:29:33,280 --> 00:29:36,600
Speaker 1: between jumper and ambler for me, we'll see.

469
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:37,080
Speaker 2: I don't know.

470
00:29:37,560 --> 00:29:39,720
Speaker 1: We'll have to work out that math when the time comes.

471
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:44,480
Speaker 2: Yours spends ninety percent of the movie standing up. That's

472
00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:45,200
Speaker 2: an ambler.

473
00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:48,440
Speaker 1: But there is a moment of my film where it's

474
00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:51,200
Speaker 1: like a ha.

475
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:54,680
Speaker 2: So this is an important distinction. Are we talking about

476
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:59,160
Speaker 2: are the general movements of the character or the action

477
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:01,680
Speaker 2: that they take and they're killing same?

478
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:04,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's hard to say. I mean, I feel like

479
00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:10,240
Speaker 1: we should be speaking of them cumulatively, perhaps killing and

480
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:13,520
Speaker 1: not killing. Where does that line get drawn though?

481
00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:17,760
Speaker 2: Well, because also in both of our cases, and in

482
00:30:17,800 --> 00:30:21,320
Speaker 2: a lot of horror films, they source out the killing

483
00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:22,280
Speaker 2: to other entities.

484
00:30:22,800 --> 00:30:23,440
Speaker 1: That's true.

485
00:30:23,920 --> 00:30:25,880
Speaker 2: So we can get into it when we talk, because

486
00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:26,880
Speaker 2: I'm wait first, we want.

487
00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:28,600
Speaker 1: To definitely get into it. We thought that this would

488
00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:31,960
Speaker 1: be a great theme for Halloween. Obviously, Halloween is running

489
00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:35,360
Speaker 1: right around the corner, so enjoy. I think we're gonna

490
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:39,400
Speaker 1: have a good time, and you're going first this week.

491
00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:41,560
Speaker 2: Oh, we have such a good double feature right now.

492
00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:48,000
Speaker 2: So this my pick for runners, Jumpers and Amblers was

493
00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:52,400
Speaker 2: released in nineteen ninety two. It was written and directed

494
00:30:52,440 --> 00:30:55,920
Speaker 2: by Bernard Rose, based on a short story called The

495
00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:59,560
Speaker 2: Forbidden by Clive Barker. My movie is.

496
00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:04,120
Speaker 1: Who is that.

497
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:08,000
Speaker 2: By? For you?

498
00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:09,600
Speaker 1: Do I know you?

499
00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:10,440
Speaker 4: Yes?

500
00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:23,840
Speaker 2: Condomern sweet talking canned man, candmur. I think that would

501
00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:25,640
Speaker 2: be so much better if he appeared and just started

502
00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:30,600
Speaker 2: singing in like some Louis Armstrong style pop, like swinging

503
00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:33,000
Speaker 2: a cane around in a circle, Candom.

504
00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:41,600
Speaker 1: I know you're, as of this recording, still technically striking,

505
00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:43,400
Speaker 1: but for a minute it's over.

506
00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:50,640
Speaker 2: You have to write that sequel, the upbeat candy Man.

507
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:53,720
Speaker 1: Upbeat candy Man. That's in the name of the episode.

508
00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:57,959
Speaker 2: He kills you, kills you when kills you with kindness

509
00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:01,760
Speaker 2: and canes like he's swinging the cane around, singing, and

510
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:05,280
Speaker 2: he just stabs you in the fucking heart kinda murdered.

511
00:32:08,800 --> 00:32:10,000
Speaker 1: God, gotcha.

512
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:12,560
Speaker 2: Also, I have to I'd be remiss if I didn't

513
00:32:12,600 --> 00:32:15,640
Speaker 2: mention that the actress Casey Lemons is in both of

514
00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:21,120
Speaker 2: our fucking movies, completely unprecedented. We didn't choose it that way.

515
00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:22,640
Speaker 2: We didn't choose it because of her, but I was

516
00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:23,800
Speaker 2: so happy to see her in both.

517
00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:27,160
Speaker 1: There's actually two connection points between our movies that we

518
00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:30,320
Speaker 1: both didn't realize, at least I didn't A that Casey

519
00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:33,720
Speaker 1: Lemons is in both and B that these are both

520
00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:42,720
Speaker 1: movies about female students who are solving murders. Essentially solve murders.

521
00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:44,320
Speaker 2: Oh shit.

522
00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:46,000
Speaker 1: Crazy.

523
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:50,080
Speaker 2: Sometimes we surprise ourselves. Sometimes we're subconsciously smarter than we

524
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:53,120
Speaker 2: are ye out in outward fashion.

525
00:32:53,280 --> 00:32:54,360
Speaker 1: Agreed, I love that.

526
00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:58,840
Speaker 2: I love that about us, got secret knowledge. I fucking

527
00:32:58,880 --> 00:33:00,480
Speaker 2: love this movie. And I'm just to give you my

528
00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:02,840
Speaker 2: one sentence synops so we can just get right into it.

529
00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:08,640
Speaker 2: An exhausted academic has her life rocked while studying a

530
00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:10,080
Speaker 2: Chicago urban legend.

531
00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:14,120
Speaker 1: Definitely rocked. You did a great job rocked.

532
00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:18,560
Speaker 2: The music is by our boy Philip Glass PG, so

533
00:33:18,600 --> 00:33:21,120
Speaker 2: it ads an eerie lens to it. I kind of

534
00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:23,320
Speaker 2: love the way the movie. The movie uses a lot

535
00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:26,840
Speaker 2: of overhead shots, which back in the nineties meant helicopters,

536
00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 2: but they're so fluid and beautiful that you would think

537
00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:32,320
Speaker 2: they were made by a drone, by a modern day drone.

538
00:33:33,280 --> 00:33:33,840
Speaker 2: So yeah, I.

539
00:33:33,840 --> 00:33:37,000
Speaker 1: Love the candy Man soundtrack. It's so both as fuck.

540
00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:41,480
Speaker 2: Yes, love, true God, true God. Now, first of all,

541
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:44,720
Speaker 2: this cast is great you've got Virginia Mattson playing our

542
00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:47,760
Speaker 2: primary character, Helen Lyle. She is the student that I

543
00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:51,560
Speaker 2: was just discussing, and Tony Todd plays the candy Man.

544
00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:53,840
Speaker 2: When I tell you, this man came out of nowhere

545
00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:56,480
Speaker 2: to scare the shit out of us. I had never

546
00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:58,360
Speaker 2: heard of Tony Todd before. When I saw this movie

547
00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 2: in nineteen ninety two, I was like, I don't ever

548
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:03,120
Speaker 2: want to see him again. I don't want to see

549
00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:06,560
Speaker 2: him as in a fucking Anni reboot, Like this man

550
00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:07,800
Speaker 2: is terrifying.

551
00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:16,879
Speaker 1: Yo. I had an absolute, like core memory scarer when

552
00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:19,440
Speaker 1: he started talking, because that was the one thing that

553
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:21,920
Speaker 1: I remembered about Candy Man so much that scared the

554
00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:23,680
Speaker 1: fucking shit out of me when I was a kid,

555
00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:26,000
Speaker 1: was that, like they must have turned up the low

556
00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:28,800
Speaker 1: end or something on the voice. They made it extra

557
00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:32,839
Speaker 1: deep and rumbling, and I was like, why are they

558
00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:33,640
Speaker 1: doing that?

559
00:34:33,640 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 2: That's so criefy that voice. And again, he's a beautiful actor,

560
00:34:38,680 --> 00:34:41,920
Speaker 2: beautiful person, but he that is the The way to

561
00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:44,440
Speaker 2: cast a horror film is to make sure your your

562
00:34:44,480 --> 00:34:48,439
Speaker 2: titular character is an unknown, so the terror is real

563
00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:50,279
Speaker 2: because you don't have any you don't have any kind

564
00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:52,600
Speaker 2: memories to go back on and be like, oh, I

565
00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:54,799
Speaker 2: remember him when he was in Puss in Boots, Like

566
00:34:54,800 --> 00:34:58,439
Speaker 2: you don't have that. So if he appears scary, he's

567
00:34:58,440 --> 00:35:01,239
Speaker 2: just going to be They're just gonna be scary. You're like,

568
00:35:01,239 --> 00:35:03,239
Speaker 2: I don't know where this motherfucker comes from. You could

569
00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:08,520
Speaker 2: be a real life killer, like we don't know. And

570
00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:12,400
Speaker 2: then you've got some other like Xander Berkeley plays Helen's husband, Trevor.

571
00:35:13,160 --> 00:35:16,480
Speaker 2: Our girl, Casey Lemons plays her sidekick in this movie,

572
00:35:16,520 --> 00:35:18,320
Speaker 2: just like she plays the sidekick in the second movie.

573
00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:21,920
Speaker 2: She's the number two. She's also a student that is

574
00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:27,200
Speaker 2: working on this project with Helen Lyle and Vanessa Williams.

575
00:35:28,280 --> 00:35:31,600
Speaker 2: The actor Vanessa Williams who plays Anne Marie McCoy, who's

576
00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:33,200
Speaker 2: somebody who lists in this building that they go to.

577
00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:38,600
Speaker 2: Ted Raymie makes a fucking guest appearance. It's just a

578
00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:42,000
Speaker 2: really great cast and I just need you. I just

579
00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:47,600
Speaker 2: need to say right off the bat that the I

580
00:35:47,640 --> 00:35:50,040
Speaker 2: cannot get past this point and I didn't remember it

581
00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:54,680
Speaker 2: from watching the movie. This bitch is a doctoral student

582
00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:59,560
Speaker 2: who was studying superstitions and urban legends. And she's not

583
00:35:59,640 --> 00:36:02,839
Speaker 2: the only one because again, Bernadette is right there with her,

584
00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:06,960
Speaker 2: and that says all you need to say know about academics.

585
00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:10,799
Speaker 2: You can go to school for twelve years and pay

586
00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:17,480
Speaker 2: one hundred thousand dollars to study urban legends, and there's

587
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:19,680
Speaker 2: something I love about it, and there's something I hate

588
00:36:19,719 --> 00:36:20,120
Speaker 2: about it.

589
00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:24,840
Speaker 1: Oh. And also, by the way, the thing that really

590
00:36:25,000 --> 00:36:29,480
Speaker 1: struck me this time was how much she smoked. Oh

591
00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:34,360
Speaker 1: in they smoked in school, which I was like, couldches

592
00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:36,680
Speaker 1: smoke in college in the nineties.

593
00:36:37,360 --> 00:36:40,200
Speaker 2: I do not recall that. I do not recall I

594
00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:42,239
Speaker 2: visited lots of people in college, and then I went

595
00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:44,120
Speaker 2: to college, and I do not recall being able to

596
00:36:44,120 --> 00:36:45,560
Speaker 2: smoke anywhere on a campus.

597
00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:53,239
Speaker 1: Yeah, she was straight up smoking in a classroom, interviewing students.

598
00:36:53,840 --> 00:37:00,480
Speaker 2: Yeah freshman, oh smoking and flirting with college freshmen. Like

599
00:37:00,560 --> 00:37:02,000
Speaker 2: in the first five minutes of the film.

600
00:37:04,080 --> 00:37:06,600
Speaker 1: That's a higher ed shit. I'm like, what in the world.

601
00:37:06,680 --> 00:37:10,040
Speaker 1: This is another planet, like all of.

602
00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:15,600
Speaker 2: It absolutely not planet Earth. And my second question, or

603
00:37:15,640 --> 00:37:19,200
Speaker 2: my second point is that we do eventually find out

604
00:37:19,200 --> 00:37:24,080
Speaker 2: the answer. But I can't stand the fact that candy

605
00:37:24,200 --> 00:37:30,920
Speaker 2: Man is filled with bees and not candy. I can't

606
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:34,879
Speaker 2: take it. They give us a reason. They do give

607
00:37:34,960 --> 00:37:39,960
Speaker 2: us a reason, But the candy Man name doesn't make

608
00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:42,840
Speaker 2: any fucking sense. He could be like he could have

609
00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:45,279
Speaker 2: been the original slender Man, he could have been like

610
00:37:45,440 --> 00:37:48,600
Speaker 2: the Tall Terror. There are so many other names he

611
00:37:48,600 --> 00:37:52,120
Speaker 2: could have been given. And candy Man also indicates that

612
00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:54,880
Speaker 2: he only targets children, which is not true. Like there's

613
00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:57,840
Speaker 2: just something real fucked up about the moniker to me.

614
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:01,319
Speaker 1: Well, okay, yeah, actly right about that. Well, first of all,

615
00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:06,560
Speaker 1: I have a few questions for you. Number one, what

616
00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:09,080
Speaker 1: kind of candy would come out in his body?

617
00:38:10,239 --> 00:38:14,000
Speaker 2: I feel like the candy Man would be filled with

618
00:38:15,320 --> 00:38:19,000
Speaker 2: Oh god, what are those old black and yellow honey candies?

619
00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:20,160
Speaker 1: Bido honey?

620
00:38:20,239 --> 00:38:23,440
Speaker 2: Is that it's co The fucking would be filled with

621
00:38:23,440 --> 00:38:27,000
Speaker 2: Biddo honey? Or candy necklaces?

622
00:38:27,760 --> 00:38:30,400
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, like actual necklaces.

623
00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:32,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, I can't like those candy necklaces that you can

624
00:38:32,680 --> 00:38:35,160
Speaker 2: chew on all day. Like he opens up his chest

625
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:37,680
Speaker 2: and it's just like ew, candy necklaces explode out of

626
00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:41,080
Speaker 2: him like fireworks. Because I feel like a candy necklace

627
00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:44,280
Speaker 2: wouldn't stick to his blood and guts and yaps.

628
00:38:46,040 --> 00:38:48,600
Speaker 1: I gotta be honest, I was thinking historically, I was thinking,

629
00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:52,000
Speaker 1: he's a historical character, he's got to have like a like,

630
00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:54,800
Speaker 1: maybe there's Werther's Original coming out of his mouth.

631
00:38:55,040 --> 00:38:56,799
Speaker 2: Oh, that would track, you.

632
00:38:56,760 --> 00:39:00,160
Speaker 1: Know, something like something old school. And then my their

633
00:39:00,239 --> 00:39:02,560
Speaker 1: choice was maybe blow pops, just because I love blow

634
00:39:02,600 --> 00:39:04,960
Speaker 1: pops so much. I love blow pops.

635
00:39:04,960 --> 00:39:06,919
Speaker 2: Oh. But now now that I'm thinking about it, where

636
00:39:06,920 --> 00:39:09,839
Speaker 2: there's original is perfect because they're gold. So when they

637
00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:11,560
Speaker 2: fly out of his mouth, it would just be like

638
00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:16,239
Speaker 2: a waterfall of gold and you'd be so mesmerized you'd

639
00:39:16,239 --> 00:39:18,040
Speaker 2: forget to be scared for a second, and then he'd

640
00:39:18,040 --> 00:39:20,560
Speaker 2: fucking rip your life apart with his hook hand.

641
00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:23,239
Speaker 1: Oh it would be I would be underneath his mouth.

642
00:39:23,480 --> 00:39:26,160
Speaker 1: I love Wheler's Original, by the way. That fucking shit

643
00:39:26,360 --> 00:39:29,880
Speaker 1: is delicious. I'd be under his mouth like I'm I

644
00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:33,080
Speaker 1: just won the jackpot in Vegas and I'm collecting coins.

645
00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:38,440
Speaker 1: I'd be like, hook those wheelers right here, baby, But

646
00:39:39,320 --> 00:39:44,920
Speaker 1: mouth so fair. I can't. But to your original point,

647
00:39:45,320 --> 00:39:49,279
Speaker 1: I totally agree. I don't understand the candy man name.

648
00:39:49,360 --> 00:39:51,440
Speaker 1: And everyone's gonna come after us because they're gonna point

649
00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:54,600
Speaker 1: out something obvious that we're not understanding about it. But

650
00:39:56,120 --> 00:39:58,920
Speaker 1: just on the surface, if there's bees coming out of

651
00:39:58,920 --> 00:40:02,200
Speaker 1: his mouth, call him the Honeyman or the bee guy.

652
00:40:02,680 --> 00:40:05,240
Speaker 2: Call him the fucking stinger, call him the stinger.

653
00:40:05,440 --> 00:40:09,920
Speaker 1: The stigger. Yeah, seeming like a wrestler, oh eighties wrestler.

654
00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:12,279
Speaker 2: Uh. Also that that I'm thinking about it, I would

655
00:40:12,280 --> 00:40:15,280
Speaker 2: also settle for lemonheads shooting out of him. Oh, because

656
00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:18,680
Speaker 2: if lemonhead's not in the package, just loose lemon heads

657
00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:20,680
Speaker 2: are rolling out of him. That's a two for one.

658
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:24,160
Speaker 2: You get candy. He gets to dismantle you and disassemble

659
00:40:24,200 --> 00:40:26,640
Speaker 2: your whole approach because you'll be slipping on lemonheads like

660
00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:28,440
Speaker 2: fucking ball.

661
00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:31,920
Speaker 1: Bearings exactly exactly. But I don't like it.

662
00:40:32,560 --> 00:40:35,600
Speaker 2: I don't like this candy Man name. He is way

663
00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:37,920
Speaker 2: too scary. He could have a much scarier name. It

664
00:40:37,960 --> 00:40:40,400
Speaker 2: doesn't fit with his killing. It doesn't fit with anything.

665
00:40:40,480 --> 00:40:44,640
Speaker 2: So basically we start the movie with the Candyman talking,

666
00:40:44,719 --> 00:40:47,880
Speaker 2: and he talks in a low whisper that is terrifying,

667
00:40:47,920 --> 00:40:48,400
Speaker 2: and he's.

668
00:40:48,239 --> 00:40:51,720
Speaker 4: Like, I'm a disblief from your grinder your gun.

669
00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:56,080
Speaker 2: You're like, yo, can you pick up the pace or

670
00:40:56,280 --> 00:41:00,440
Speaker 2: increase the volume, like what is happening? So you just

671
00:41:00,480 --> 00:41:02,520
Speaker 2: come into this movie confused because he's.

672
00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:07,600
Speaker 4: Like, I'm gonna split you from your grindy.

673
00:41:07,120 --> 00:41:09,839
Speaker 2: You gut it, And you're like, that is scary. Yes,

674
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:12,760
Speaker 2: that is a scary sentence. But I'm passing out already.

675
00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:16,400
Speaker 2: I'm tired. Yeah, he's he could be called the Sleeper.

676
00:41:16,440 --> 00:41:18,080
Speaker 2: He puts you to fucking sleep with us talking.

677
00:41:18,560 --> 00:41:21,160
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, there's some I'm telling you, there's some low

678
00:41:21,400 --> 00:41:26,720
Speaker 1: end rumbly ASMR thing happening with the candy Man voice.

679
00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:29,920
Speaker 2: I guarantee somebody has made a YouTube video with the

680
00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:33,360
Speaker 2: Candyman voice and like an ASMR. They're like rubbing a

681
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:36,319
Speaker 2: fucking coconut or something with the Candy Man lay in

682
00:41:36,360 --> 00:41:37,160
Speaker 2: the background.

683
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:40,440
Speaker 1: Let's get down to brass tacks. If there's not a

684
00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:45,640
Speaker 1: candy Man sleep story on the Calm app preach in

685
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:47,880
Speaker 1: two weeks, i'm gonna be protesting.

686
00:41:48,320 --> 00:41:51,160
Speaker 2: So I'll give it my Killian Murphy Calm for that.

687
00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:53,759
Speaker 2: I'll listen to it one night, see see what it

688
00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:58,080
Speaker 2: does to the dreams and the sleep pattern they'll be

689
00:41:58,680 --> 00:42:00,840
Speaker 2: I'll check my fucking app watch it. It'll be like,

690
00:42:01,400 --> 00:42:03,879
Speaker 2: technically you are asleep, but you did not rest at all.

691
00:42:04,640 --> 00:42:07,840
Speaker 2: There was no periods of rest because the fucking candyman

692
00:42:07,960 --> 00:42:08,279
Speaker 2: was like.

693
00:42:08,680 --> 00:42:13,240
Speaker 4: And then in nineteen twenty one I saw a motor

694
00:42:13,360 --> 00:42:15,080
Speaker 4: vehicle for the first time.

695
00:42:20,800 --> 00:42:24,600
Speaker 2: So this man we jump into the movie with the superstition,

696
00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:27,399
Speaker 2: but the way that superstition, like the way that urban

697
00:42:27,480 --> 00:42:31,120
Speaker 2: legends work, the first story we hear is not the

698
00:42:31,160 --> 00:42:33,520
Speaker 2: full story, and it's not the right story. So we're

699
00:42:33,520 --> 00:42:35,440
Speaker 2: hearing it from the perspective of one of the students,

700
00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:37,880
Speaker 2: and they're explaining what the candyman is, and it's basically

701
00:42:37,960 --> 00:42:41,319
Speaker 2: a guy with a hook jammed in the stump of

702
00:42:41,400 --> 00:42:45,880
Speaker 2: his son off right hand. You say his name five

703
00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:48,799
Speaker 2: times in the mirror, and he appears behind you. And

704
00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:52,080
Speaker 2: here's my other primary question, why would you want him

705
00:42:52,080 --> 00:42:55,160
Speaker 2: to He's got a hook for a hand and a stump.

706
00:42:55,520 --> 00:42:57,680
Speaker 2: If he appears behind you, he's not gonna like sing

707
00:42:57,680 --> 00:42:59,719
Speaker 2: you a lullaby? Why would you want to say his

708
00:42:59,800 --> 00:43:02,120
Speaker 2: name five times and be killed potentially?

709
00:43:03,239 --> 00:43:05,839
Speaker 1: Well, and this is a question I have for you,

710
00:43:06,280 --> 00:43:08,880
Speaker 1: I have perhaps for the writers of the film. I

711
00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:13,439
Speaker 1: don't know. So my thing about saying his name five

712
00:43:13,520 --> 00:43:17,040
Speaker 1: times is that if you say it the fifth time,

713
00:43:17,560 --> 00:43:19,640
Speaker 1: I just assumed. I mean a lot of it was

714
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:22,319
Speaker 1: that he pops up like Beetlejuice, you say the name

715
00:43:22,480 --> 00:43:26,680
Speaker 1: and then here comes the jumper. He comes jumping out

716
00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:30,120
Speaker 1: of his dimension or wherever he comes from. But then

717
00:43:30,200 --> 00:43:33,279
Speaker 1: there were times in the movie where you would say it,

718
00:43:33,360 --> 00:43:36,320
Speaker 1: but then there would be like a long time before

719
00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:40,160
Speaker 1: he showed up. So I'm like, exactly, how does that work?

720
00:43:40,239 --> 00:43:42,840
Speaker 1: So if you're like at a sleepover, you say the

721
00:43:42,920 --> 00:43:45,320
Speaker 1: name Candyman five times and then like two and a

722
00:43:45,360 --> 00:43:50,120
Speaker 1: half three weeks later he shows up, that's just unreasonable

723
00:43:50,160 --> 00:43:53,759
Speaker 1: to me, like you need to show him instantly or

724
00:43:53,840 --> 00:43:54,480
Speaker 1: not at all.

725
00:43:55,160 --> 00:43:57,640
Speaker 2: I fully agree, I can't be in the grocery store.

726
00:43:57,680 --> 00:44:00,239
Speaker 2: Then the candy man is just like hey, bitch, like.

727
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:04,600
Speaker 1: River a couple months ago, when you said my name

728
00:44:04,920 --> 00:44:07,759
Speaker 1: five times, like.

729
00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:10,799
Speaker 2: Where have you been though, You're like, candy Man, I'm

730
00:44:10,840 --> 00:44:15,000
Speaker 2: at work, can you come back? Like fuck, that was

731
00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:19,040
Speaker 2: ages ago. I'm taking out my gar like what I'm

732
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:23,040
Speaker 2: mowing the lawn, Like don't because he also comes. He'll

733
00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:25,839
Speaker 2: come at daytime, nighttime, there's no particular time a day

734
00:44:25,840 --> 00:44:27,799
Speaker 2: then he'll show up. I don't like the fact that

735
00:44:27,840 --> 00:44:29,480
Speaker 2: he could just be like popping up a month or

736
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:32,080
Speaker 2: two later and you're like, I am on vacation. Can

737
00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:34,160
Speaker 2: you go away? Can you imagine just like lounge it

738
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:36,840
Speaker 2: out like you're on a fucking beach in a chair,

739
00:44:37,239 --> 00:44:38,920
Speaker 2: reading a book. And then he's like pops out of

740
00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:39,799
Speaker 2: the sand and he's like.

741
00:44:40,360 --> 00:44:44,600
Speaker 4: I heard you wanted to speak to me, and.

742
00:44:44,560 --> 00:44:47,240
Speaker 2: You're like, yeah, fucking three months ago. Now I'm relaxed.

743
00:44:47,320 --> 00:44:51,399
Speaker 1: It's shorting, which is the least scary time of day.

744
00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:53,640
Speaker 1: Why are you here this morning?

745
00:44:54,200 --> 00:45:01,719
Speaker 2: I'm not even scared. I'm annoyed. Get out of here,

746
00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:07,600
Speaker 2: candy Man, come back in a reasonable haunting hour. Fucking weirdo.

747
00:45:08,480 --> 00:45:11,440
Speaker 2: So we find out some of the superstitions from this

748
00:45:11,560 --> 00:45:14,040
Speaker 2: urban legend just from talking to the students. And you know,

749
00:45:14,120 --> 00:45:17,720
Speaker 2: he killed a babysitter and there was someone who got away,

750
00:45:17,840 --> 00:45:19,960
Speaker 2: but his hair turned white, and that's how we know

751
00:45:20,040 --> 00:45:22,880
Speaker 2: the story. So as Bernadette and Helen are smoking and

752
00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:25,239
Speaker 2: talking to these students, they decide to you know, we

753
00:45:25,320 --> 00:45:27,360
Speaker 2: kind of learn about them and what they're doing and

754
00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:31,120
Speaker 2: their project. And you know, Helen goes to this class

755
00:45:31,160 --> 00:45:34,160
Speaker 2: where her husband is also a professor and he's kind

756
00:45:34,160 --> 00:45:35,880
Speaker 2: of taking her shine, which is how you know that

757
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:39,000
Speaker 2: Trevor ain't shit right away, because she wanted him to

758
00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:42,040
Speaker 2: wait until he finished her, until she finished her thesis

759
00:45:42,120 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 2: about urban legends before teaching about it. But he's teaching

760
00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:47,480
Speaker 2: about it right now. So I hate him right away

761
00:45:47,680 --> 00:45:50,799
Speaker 2: from an academic standpoint because he's a fucking thief. But

762
00:45:50,880 --> 00:45:56,200
Speaker 2: he's also clearly flirting with this student of his and

763
00:45:56,239 --> 00:45:57,920
Speaker 2: she picks up on it right away, and she's like, Yo,

764
00:45:57,960 --> 00:46:00,359
Speaker 2: what the fuck's that all about? And he's like, oh huh,

765
00:46:00,360 --> 00:46:02,680
Speaker 2: and I'm like no, no, no, He's like, oh, she

766
00:46:02,760 --> 00:46:04,920
Speaker 2: must be in love with me. And I'm like, you

767
00:46:04,920 --> 00:46:07,080
Speaker 2: don't get to joke about that as the person of

768
00:46:07,120 --> 00:46:11,320
Speaker 2: power in that room, and your wife is Virginia Manson,

769
00:46:11,400 --> 00:46:12,320
Speaker 2: so get a fucking grip.

770
00:46:12,480 --> 00:46:15,160
Speaker 1: I know. I was like, Helen is too hot for you, Trevor,

771
00:46:15,880 --> 00:46:19,440
Speaker 1: Like she's too smart and too hot and you're a

772
00:46:19,560 --> 00:46:20,680
Speaker 1: gross professor.

773
00:46:21,000 --> 00:46:24,680
Speaker 2: Like speaking of Werther's originals, he's wearing some high waisted

774
00:46:24,719 --> 00:46:30,560
Speaker 2: corduroy belted pants, Like, are you fucking serious, dude, some

775
00:46:30,760 --> 00:46:34,160
Speaker 2: high water corduroy pants you're coming out with, Like, oh,

776
00:46:34,200 --> 00:46:39,040
Speaker 2: don't be worried. Oh god, he's disgusting. We hate Trevor

777
00:46:39,080 --> 00:46:42,479
Speaker 2: throughout the film, but then we also get to see

778
00:46:42,520 --> 00:46:44,839
Speaker 2: Helen working late into the night, and this is where

779
00:46:44,840 --> 00:46:47,919
Speaker 2: we get a little more a little more information about

780
00:46:48,000 --> 00:46:52,040
Speaker 2: candy Man because she meets this Jantriss, who also knows

781
00:46:52,040 --> 00:46:54,120
Speaker 2: the candy Man tail. We get a little bit more

782
00:46:54,160 --> 00:46:58,600
Speaker 2: of the background because she, you know, was talking about

783
00:46:58,600 --> 00:47:01,200
Speaker 2: how this woman got killed and Brianie Green, because again

784
00:47:01,239 --> 00:47:04,080
Speaker 2: this takes place in Chicago, and she's like, I've got

785
00:47:04,080 --> 00:47:05,759
Speaker 2: a friend who knows a little bit more about it,

786
00:47:05,840 --> 00:47:08,000
Speaker 2: and Helen says, oh, can I talk to her? And

787
00:47:08,040 --> 00:47:09,960
Speaker 2: she says yeah, and then she goes out into the

788
00:47:10,000 --> 00:47:13,160
Speaker 2: hallway and it's like yo, I'm like, oh, I didn't

789
00:47:13,200 --> 00:47:15,960
Speaker 2: expect your friend to be like right there. But this

790
00:47:16,080 --> 00:47:18,719
Speaker 2: other woman comes in and she's like, yeah, like he

791
00:47:18,800 --> 00:47:23,040
Speaker 2: killed some lady in a fucking tub, and I don't

792
00:47:23,040 --> 00:47:24,960
Speaker 2: know anything about that. But Ruthie Green was killed in

793
00:47:25,000 --> 00:47:27,319
Speaker 2: Kabrini Green, which I think is one of just a

794
00:47:27,320 --> 00:47:31,960
Speaker 2: great rhyme. And now it's time for the microfiche, which

795
00:47:32,000 --> 00:47:35,240
Speaker 2: is my favorite aspect of any nineties film. So Helen's

796
00:47:35,239 --> 00:47:38,279
Speaker 2: looking it up and she's looking at Ruthie's death. So

797
00:47:38,360 --> 00:47:42,520
Speaker 2: Ruthie lived in the projects, and Helen realizes that her

798
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:46,879
Speaker 2: building has the same layout as Ruthie's building and her

799
00:47:46,960 --> 00:47:50,680
Speaker 2: bathroom mirror. You can push out the back of it,

800
00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:53,520
Speaker 2: take it off the hinges, push out the back of it,

801
00:47:53,600 --> 00:47:55,360
Speaker 2: and you're in somebody else's apartment.

802
00:47:55,960 --> 00:47:56,360
Speaker 1: Wow.

803
00:47:56,520 --> 00:47:59,160
Speaker 2: So she comes over and shows Bernadette and she's like, look,

804
00:48:00,719 --> 00:48:02,839
Speaker 2: Ruthy was probably killed by someone who came in through

805
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:06,880
Speaker 2: her mirror from this other apartment. So they're kind of

806
00:48:06,880 --> 00:48:10,440
Speaker 2: trying to debunk the urban legend as they're investigating it.

807
00:48:10,640 --> 00:48:14,240
Speaker 2: They also dare themselves to say Candy Man five times

808
00:48:14,239 --> 00:48:18,200
Speaker 2: in the mirror, and Helen doesn't give a shit. She's like,

809
00:48:18,239 --> 00:48:20,880
Speaker 2: I'll say it, but Bernadad's like, I ain't saying that

810
00:48:20,960 --> 00:48:24,160
Speaker 2: last one. I don't think so. But this is where

811
00:48:24,200 --> 00:48:26,359
Speaker 2: Millie's point comes in, because they say it and then

812
00:48:26,360 --> 00:48:28,879
Speaker 2: we don't actually see Candy Man till like forty minutes later,

813
00:48:29,280 --> 00:48:31,640
Speaker 2: which is the timing of this film is like a

814
00:48:31,640 --> 00:48:36,480
Speaker 2: month later. And when he shows up, he doesn't kill her.

815
00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:39,759
Speaker 2: He's like, you're supposed to be with me, and she's

816
00:48:39,800 --> 00:48:43,279
Speaker 2: like what, Like so we'll get to that, but she

817
00:48:43,360 --> 00:48:46,239
Speaker 2: says it five times in the mirror, and then as

818
00:48:46,239 --> 00:48:49,759
Speaker 2: she's sleeping at night, Trevor comes home blasted and like

819
00:48:49,920 --> 00:48:53,960
Speaker 2: leaps on her like a fucking freak dot. This scene

820
00:48:54,040 --> 00:48:56,239
Speaker 2: was so weird, Like he doesn't just stumble into bed

821
00:48:56,280 --> 00:49:01,240
Speaker 2: and like pass out, he literally jumps on her like gollum.

822
00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:03,920
Speaker 2: I don't get it, but Trevor, Trevor is a jumper.

823
00:49:04,120 --> 00:49:08,279
Speaker 2: I think Trevor is a jumper. He's a jump He's

824
00:49:09,000 --> 00:49:11,360
Speaker 2: a jumper in the body of an ambler.

825
00:49:12,000 --> 00:49:15,560
Speaker 1: Yes, he's got the pants of an ambler.

826
00:49:16,719 --> 00:49:17,760
Speaker 2: Those ambling pants.

827
00:49:17,760 --> 00:49:18,200
Speaker 1: I can't.

828
00:49:19,440 --> 00:49:23,719
Speaker 2: So Bernadette and Helen go to Cabrini Green. They want

829
00:49:23,719 --> 00:49:28,880
Speaker 2: to see Ruthie's apartment up close and personal, and Bernadette

830
00:49:28,920 --> 00:49:31,880
Speaker 2: is fucking strapped. She's got a stun gun, she's got mace,

831
00:49:32,080 --> 00:49:34,920
Speaker 2: she's got everything. There's a line in this scene that

832
00:49:34,960 --> 00:49:39,400
Speaker 2: I really love those when Helen says, we're going to

833
00:49:39,760 --> 00:49:44,160
Speaker 2: examine how an entire community attributes the daily horrors of

834
00:49:44,200 --> 00:49:48,040
Speaker 2: their lives to an urban legend. So, from her academic standpoint,

835
00:49:48,480 --> 00:49:51,320
Speaker 2: a lot of urban legends are stemmed from the fact

836
00:49:51,320 --> 00:49:54,279
Speaker 2: that there's just too much pain in some people's day

837
00:49:54,320 --> 00:49:56,799
Speaker 2: to day life, and this is a way of explaining it.

838
00:49:57,080 --> 00:49:59,000
Speaker 2: So she goes in there acting like a hard ass

839
00:49:59,080 --> 00:50:01,520
Speaker 2: for no fucking reason. She's like walking past all these

840
00:50:01,600 --> 00:50:04,840
Speaker 2: dudes and she's like, I'm not the cops. I'm just

841
00:50:04,880 --> 00:50:07,200
Speaker 2: here to do And I'm like, you are a student,

842
00:50:07,200 --> 00:50:09,840
Speaker 2: like you're an academic, you're a researcher. Calm down, Just

843
00:50:09,880 --> 00:50:11,880
Speaker 2: calm down. But also I think it's cool that the

844
00:50:11,920 --> 00:50:14,479
Speaker 2: ethics of field research are really on display here because

845
00:50:14,480 --> 00:50:17,200
Speaker 2: she's taking picture of graffiti and like just flat out

846
00:50:17,239 --> 00:50:20,400
Speaker 2: going into Ruthie's apartment, which is open and unlocked and abandoned,

847
00:50:21,000 --> 00:50:23,319
Speaker 2: but the layout is the same as her apartment. So

848
00:50:23,400 --> 00:50:27,120
Speaker 2: she's like, all right, I'm going through this mirror, and

849
00:50:28,000 --> 00:50:32,200
Speaker 2: she goes through the mirror and into this apartment, and

850
00:50:32,280 --> 00:50:36,280
Speaker 2: as she's crawling through a hole in one of the walls,

851
00:50:36,400 --> 00:50:39,920
Speaker 2: the camera pulls back and there is a terrifying image

852
00:50:39,920 --> 00:50:42,200
Speaker 2: of graffiti of the candy Man, and she's like crawling

853
00:50:42,280 --> 00:50:45,600
Speaker 2: through his open mouth, and then she sees a pile

854
00:50:45,640 --> 00:50:48,160
Speaker 2: of candy with razors inside, which I'm like, let's not

855
00:50:48,239 --> 00:50:52,759
Speaker 2: mix up the urban legends. Let's not just conflate the

856
00:50:52,840 --> 00:50:53,600
Speaker 2: urban legends.

857
00:50:55,680 --> 00:50:58,080
Speaker 1: Very very confused by that part.

858
00:50:58,280 --> 00:51:01,680
Speaker 2: I have to a fit, good lord, because he doesn't

859
00:51:01,680 --> 00:51:04,640
Speaker 2: have candy coming out of him anywhere. If he based

860
00:51:04,640 --> 00:51:07,840
Speaker 2: on what we're going to eventually learn about him next,

861
00:51:08,120 --> 00:51:09,880
Speaker 2: he wasn't even alive at a point where this kind

862
00:51:09,920 --> 00:51:13,120
Speaker 2: of candy existed, like wrapped up candy. They used to

863
00:51:13,120 --> 00:51:16,319
Speaker 2: have candy and like open barrels and penny candy and shit,

864
00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:18,440
Speaker 2: he never even saw candy in a wrapper.

865
00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:22,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, he was probably eating divinity or whatever the fuck,

866
00:51:22,520 --> 00:51:26,240
Speaker 1: like merangue soft rings.

867
00:51:27,239 --> 00:51:28,600
Speaker 2: He was. He's like, let me have one of them

868
00:51:28,680 --> 00:51:33,080
Speaker 2: lime whippets, like it was back in the day when

869
00:51:33,120 --> 00:51:35,520
Speaker 2: candy was just a stick. It's like, we figured out

870
00:51:35,520 --> 00:51:40,200
Speaker 2: a way to put sugar into stick form. Here you go,

871
00:51:40,280 --> 00:51:43,239
Speaker 2: even before Lollipop, before they even started rolling the stick up.

872
00:51:43,680 --> 00:51:45,239
Speaker 1: Yeah.

873
00:51:45,280 --> 00:51:47,360
Speaker 2: So yeah, there's a potly of candy with razors inside,

874
00:51:47,400 --> 00:51:51,680
Speaker 2: which I don't love. But this is also how we

875
00:51:51,800 --> 00:51:54,279
Speaker 2: get to meet Anne Marie. And Anne Marie comes out

876
00:51:54,320 --> 00:51:57,200
Speaker 2: with her dog, this ferocious dog, and she's in the

877
00:51:57,200 --> 00:52:00,680
Speaker 2: hallway and she starts talking to them, and Vanessa Williams

878
00:52:00,760 --> 00:52:03,080
Speaker 2: is a wonderful actor, but I have to say she's

879
00:52:03,160 --> 00:52:06,600
Speaker 2: doing the craziest fucking accent I've ever heard in this film.

880
00:52:07,280 --> 00:52:11,960
Speaker 2: It's a mix between like southern urban like Gone with

881
00:52:12,040 --> 00:52:14,400
Speaker 2: the Wind, like I don't know what this accent is,

882
00:52:14,440 --> 00:52:18,520
Speaker 2: but it does not read to me as Chicago Yeah

883
00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:21,400
Speaker 2: at all. But she's telling the story of Ruthie and

884
00:52:21,440 --> 00:52:24,359
Speaker 2: how she heard Ruthie being killed and she called nine

885
00:52:24,360 --> 00:52:29,080
Speaker 2: one one and nobody came to her rescue. And then

886
00:52:29,080 --> 00:52:30,920
Speaker 2: we get a little bit more of the legend because

887
00:52:30,920 --> 00:52:33,200
Speaker 2: we meet this little kid and like, this little kid

888
00:52:33,280 --> 00:52:37,000
Speaker 2: named Jake. But Anne Marie has a baby. She's a

889
00:52:37,040 --> 00:52:39,680
Speaker 2: single mom. She's living here, she's just trying to live

890
00:52:39,719 --> 00:52:44,560
Speaker 2: her life. And her baby's name is Anthony, and he's

891
00:52:44,640 --> 00:52:47,320
Speaker 2: very cute, and she's just like, I'm just trying to

892
00:52:47,320 --> 00:52:51,919
Speaker 2: get by, so peace out. So what we eventually learn

893
00:52:52,080 --> 00:52:57,440
Speaker 2: at this weird dinner with Helen, Bernadette Trevor and a

894
00:52:57,520 --> 00:53:01,160
Speaker 2: couple of other academics, like an academic who who looks

895
00:53:01,160 --> 00:53:07,600
Speaker 2: like a thumb. Essentially, she's sitting next to penguin, Yes, batman,

896
00:53:07,840 --> 00:53:13,680
Speaker 2: it's Danny DeVito's penguin, who's like in competition with Helen.

897
00:53:13,719 --> 00:53:15,800
Speaker 2: So Helen's a student, he's like a tenured professor, and

898
00:53:15,840 --> 00:53:17,440
Speaker 2: he's like, Ah, you're not going to beat me on

899
00:53:17,480 --> 00:53:19,480
Speaker 2: the candyman front. Let me tell you what I know

900
00:53:19,520 --> 00:53:23,640
Speaker 2: about this motherfucker. Basically, the real story of candy Man

901
00:53:23,719 --> 00:53:25,480
Speaker 2: is that he was the son of a slave. He

902
00:53:25,520 --> 00:53:28,480
Speaker 2: grew up with polite society because his dad made up

903
00:53:28,560 --> 00:53:31,520
Speaker 2: some invention that made them rich. He was an artist,

904
00:53:31,640 --> 00:53:34,520
Speaker 2: and he first appeared in the late eighteen hundreds, but

905
00:53:34,600 --> 00:53:37,040
Speaker 2: he made the fatal mistake of getting a white girl pregnant,

906
00:53:37,560 --> 00:53:42,040
Speaker 2: and in retribution, they sawed off his right hand, I'm guessing,

907
00:53:42,080 --> 00:53:44,839
Speaker 2: so that he couldn't do art anymore. They covered him

908
00:53:44,880 --> 00:53:48,680
Speaker 2: in honey and let be sting him to death, and

909
00:53:48,719 --> 00:53:52,400
Speaker 2: then they burned his body. So again, if we're approaching

910
00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:56,440
Speaker 2: the origin story of candy Man, we've got fire They

911
00:53:56,480 --> 00:53:58,839
Speaker 2: burnt him up. Why couldn't he have been Fireman? Why

912
00:53:58,840 --> 00:54:04,719
Speaker 2: couldn't he have been fuck skin man or something. If

913
00:54:04,719 --> 00:54:06,759
Speaker 2: we're going to put the bees in there, why aren't

914
00:54:06,760 --> 00:54:09,279
Speaker 2: the bees on him all the time, and he could

915
00:54:09,320 --> 00:54:13,680
Speaker 2: be the stinger and he's just constantly crawling with bees. Like,

916
00:54:13,719 --> 00:54:15,520
Speaker 2: there's just so many things here that I felt like

917
00:54:15,560 --> 00:54:18,120
Speaker 2: they could have gone to, and candy Man just doesn't

918
00:54:18,360 --> 00:54:21,279
Speaker 2: ring true to me. With all this other shit going up.

919
00:54:21,320 --> 00:54:23,480
Speaker 2: There's all this other horror about the way he died,

920
00:54:23,520 --> 00:54:27,080
Speaker 2: which is usually the origin story of most villains in

921
00:54:27,120 --> 00:54:29,880
Speaker 2: a horror movie. The way you die is kind of

922
00:54:29,880 --> 00:54:35,800
Speaker 2: how you get your name or how you I don't know. Yeah, anyway,

923
00:54:35,960 --> 00:54:38,280
Speaker 2: I didn't. I don't love the story, but it's better

924
00:54:38,320 --> 00:54:39,920
Speaker 2: than like, oh yeah, this guy just shows up with

925
00:54:39,960 --> 00:54:41,359
Speaker 2: a fucking hook for a hand.

926
00:54:42,680 --> 00:54:44,760
Speaker 1: So it's seems to be a lot of different ideas

927
00:54:44,800 --> 00:54:47,560
Speaker 1: going on. Is what I feel like is we.

928
00:54:47,480 --> 00:54:51,359
Speaker 2: Need we need some cohesion. And also, do not write

929
00:54:51,360 --> 00:54:53,239
Speaker 2: to me about the updated candy Man. I have not

930
00:54:53,320 --> 00:54:57,480
Speaker 2: seen it, and if they explain it better in that film, great,

931
00:54:58,040 --> 00:55:01,680
Speaker 2: but I don't need We're talking about og right now.

932
00:55:02,000 --> 00:55:07,200
Speaker 2: So eventually, I guess in death he becomes this fucking

933
00:55:08,000 --> 00:55:11,600
Speaker 2: horror villain who grabs the nearest thing, which is a hook,

934
00:55:11,920 --> 00:55:14,400
Speaker 2: and he like hammers it into his hand because there

935
00:55:14,400 --> 00:55:17,479
Speaker 2: are all these nails sticking out, like these rusty nails

936
00:55:17,480 --> 00:55:20,360
Speaker 2: sticking out around the hook. So I also don't understand

937
00:55:20,400 --> 00:55:22,520
Speaker 2: the mechanics of like, well, if you're sticking it in

938
00:55:22,560 --> 00:55:26,040
Speaker 2: your stump, wouldn't your flesh just grow around it like

939
00:55:26,120 --> 00:55:29,360
Speaker 2: swamp thing style. You got to nail it into place,

940
00:55:30,320 --> 00:55:32,400
Speaker 2: which feels complicated.

941
00:55:32,600 --> 00:55:36,279
Speaker 1: It'd be like a dental implant like the bone just

942
00:55:36,360 --> 00:55:37,719
Speaker 1: forms around the hook.

943
00:55:38,080 --> 00:55:41,040
Speaker 2: Exactly like does it? Does your body not just naturally

944
00:55:41,040 --> 00:55:43,000
Speaker 2: do the work of forming I don't. I don't know.

945
00:55:43,239 --> 00:55:45,480
Speaker 2: There are people who've gotten shot with bebes and they

946
00:55:45,480 --> 00:55:49,240
Speaker 2: still have a BB in their hand because your body

947
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:51,160
Speaker 2: just forms around it. So I don't understand why his

948
00:55:51,200 --> 00:55:55,080
Speaker 2: body didn't form around this fucking hook. But anyway, so

949
00:55:55,120 --> 00:55:59,919
Speaker 2: he's wearing like these fucking gingham pants and a fuck

950
00:56:00,200 --> 00:56:05,560
Speaker 2: long ass coat with a fur collar. And when we

951
00:56:05,600 --> 00:56:08,160
Speaker 2: eventually see him, which is still not now, we're still

952
00:56:08,160 --> 00:56:10,759
Speaker 2: forty minutes into the film and haven't seen him. So

953
00:56:10,800 --> 00:56:13,360
Speaker 2: Helen meets this little kid named Jake, and he's like,

954
00:56:13,400 --> 00:56:15,160
Speaker 2: I'll show you where the fucking candy Man is. And

955
00:56:15,160 --> 00:56:17,759
Speaker 2: then he goes and tells her this story that when

956
00:56:17,800 --> 00:56:19,320
Speaker 2: I first saw this movie, this is the part of

957
00:56:19,360 --> 00:56:21,480
Speaker 2: the movie that I remembered the most, and it scared

958
00:56:21,480 --> 00:56:24,160
Speaker 2: the shit out of me. Jake tells her this story

959
00:56:24,239 --> 00:56:26,239
Speaker 2: of this little boy who went to go use this

960
00:56:26,239 --> 00:56:29,120
Speaker 2: public restroom across the tree from a grocery store and

961
00:56:29,400 --> 00:56:31,680
Speaker 2: basically had his dick ripped off and thrown in a toilet.

962
00:56:31,760 --> 00:56:34,080
Speaker 2: And they're like, the candy man did it. And again

963
00:56:34,120 --> 00:56:38,480
Speaker 2: I'm like the candy man doesn't have any cohesion? Why

964
00:56:38,520 --> 00:56:42,040
Speaker 2: is he ripping off dicks? Like how do you go

965
00:56:42,080 --> 00:56:44,480
Speaker 2: from bees and honey and candy and ripping off dicks?

966
00:56:44,600 --> 00:56:47,640
Speaker 2: And like his whole thing is that he will basically

967
00:56:47,640 --> 00:56:50,960
Speaker 2: put his hook in you and just I guess pull

968
00:56:51,080 --> 00:56:53,560
Speaker 2: up so he yeah, but he ripped off this little

969
00:56:53,600 --> 00:56:56,719
Speaker 2: kid's dick essentially, And it's a terrifying scene and I

970
00:56:56,719 --> 00:56:58,080
Speaker 2: hate it.

971
00:56:58,120 --> 00:57:06,880
Speaker 1: Oh so gross. This entire public restroom is covered in

972
00:57:07,440 --> 00:57:12,360
Speaker 1: like people were using poop to write on the walls

973
00:57:13,160 --> 00:57:16,960
Speaker 1: of this But this is how disgusting this place is.

974
00:57:17,280 --> 00:57:20,400
Speaker 2: Because Helen goes into the Bathroompo after she hears the story,

975
00:57:20,480 --> 00:57:23,160
Speaker 2: She's like, cool, I'll go in and it's literally like

976
00:57:23,280 --> 00:57:25,480
Speaker 2: I'm like how long how long did it take? Or

977
00:57:25,520 --> 00:57:29,520
Speaker 2: what kind of seismic bodily event had to happen for

978
00:57:29,600 --> 00:57:33,600
Speaker 2: someone to write out sweets for the sweet in actual

979
00:57:33,720 --> 00:57:38,080
Speaker 2: solid shit, Like the sweets is huge on a wall,

980
00:57:38,400 --> 00:57:40,760
Speaker 2: and then for the sweet it's tiny on a stall,

981
00:57:40,800 --> 00:57:43,360
Speaker 2: but it is all in solid shit. It looks like clay,

982
00:57:43,760 --> 00:57:46,600
Speaker 2: like clay in the wall? Rough Was it like a

983
00:57:46,640 --> 00:57:49,080
Speaker 2: community event where they're like I got the w today?

984
00:57:50,240 --> 00:57:55,760
Speaker 2: Like what is happening in this bathroom, good lord, is

985
00:57:55,800 --> 00:57:58,560
Speaker 2: a fucking disgusting bathroom, but she's in it. She's taking

986
00:57:58,600 --> 00:58:00,800
Speaker 2: pictures and doing her whole thing and like thinking she's

987
00:58:00,920 --> 00:58:02,920
Speaker 2: fucking hot shit, and there's a toilet full of bees

988
00:58:02,960 --> 00:58:06,040
Speaker 2: and like, basically, this guy comes in and he's kind

989
00:58:06,040 --> 00:58:08,840
Speaker 2: of dressed in the long coat with the hook and

990
00:58:08,880 --> 00:58:11,080
Speaker 2: he's carrying a hook. He's not jump jam in his hand,

991
00:58:11,080 --> 00:58:14,880
Speaker 2: he's just carrying a hook. And she gets beat up, basically,

992
00:58:14,920 --> 00:58:16,680
Speaker 2: and then she goes to the cops and they think

993
00:58:16,720 --> 00:58:19,480
Speaker 2: that the guy who beat her up also killed Ruthie

994
00:58:19,520 --> 00:58:21,600
Speaker 2: and the little boy in the bathroom who died because

995
00:58:21,600 --> 00:58:24,160
Speaker 2: he used to lead this gang. And Jake is like

996
00:58:24,520 --> 00:58:27,320
Speaker 2: at the station with no parents ps and he's just

997
00:58:27,360 --> 00:58:29,520
Speaker 2: freaked out. He's like, Yo, you just fucking brought the

998
00:58:29,520 --> 00:58:31,760
Speaker 2: candy Man into my life and I'm not happy about this.

999
00:58:33,120 --> 00:58:37,080
Speaker 2: So it's like a month later when we actually meet

1000
00:58:37,080 --> 00:58:42,120
Speaker 2: the Candyman, and I'm not even exaggerating because.

1001
00:58:41,880 --> 00:58:44,200
Speaker 1: He's like a book and situation. Why did he wait

1002
00:58:44,280 --> 00:58:44,720
Speaker 1: so long?

1003
00:58:44,960 --> 00:58:49,880
Speaker 2: Completely because she when she gets beat up, her eye

1004
00:58:49,960 --> 00:58:53,120
Speaker 2: is really like fucked up and swollen, and when we

1005
00:58:53,200 --> 00:58:56,320
Speaker 2: see her again, it's she's healed, and it's like a

1006
00:58:56,400 --> 00:59:02,760
Speaker 2: month later, the candy Man shows up in a parking garage,

1007
00:59:03,800 --> 00:59:06,640
Speaker 2: which is the least scary place in the middle of

1008
00:59:06,680 --> 00:59:12,480
Speaker 2: the day time, exactly exactly like I'm not scared, I'm annoyed.

1009
00:59:12,640 --> 00:59:14,560
Speaker 2: I'm like, I'm trying to get to my car. But

1010
00:59:14,600 --> 00:59:16,400
Speaker 2: he also does this thing with his voice where he

1011
00:59:16,480 --> 00:59:20,040
Speaker 2: like entrances her or mesmerizes her somehow. So he starts

1012
00:59:20,040 --> 00:59:22,640
Speaker 2: talking in her eyes start like flickering, and she's like

1013
00:59:22,720 --> 00:59:26,400
Speaker 2: having flashes and shit. But he basically is like, hey,

1014
00:59:26,520 --> 00:59:27,880
Speaker 2: it's me candy Man.

1015
00:59:27,960 --> 00:59:29,680
Speaker 1: You called, and.

1016
00:59:30,160 --> 00:59:34,240
Speaker 2: Here's some bees coming out of my mouth and you're

1017
00:59:34,240 --> 00:59:39,439
Speaker 2: gonna wake up in Anne Marie's apartment and and she's

1018
00:59:39,480 --> 00:59:42,280
Speaker 2: like what, And she's all flickering and freaking out. And

1019
00:59:42,320 --> 00:59:44,520
Speaker 2: that's basically it. Like he shows up and it's just

1020
00:59:44,600 --> 00:59:47,640
Speaker 2: like you're mine. I'm not going to explain what that means.

1021
00:59:47,840 --> 00:59:50,720
Speaker 2: Here's a mouthful of bees and let's go into a

1022
00:59:50,720 --> 00:59:53,720
Speaker 2: little trance. So when she wakes up in Anne Marie's apartment,

1023
00:59:54,160 --> 00:59:58,880
Speaker 2: she's covered in blood and the dog's head has been

1024
00:59:58,880 --> 01:00:03,520
Speaker 2: decapitated to her and Anthony the baby is gone. So

1025
01:00:03,560 --> 01:00:07,880
Speaker 2: she wakes up and Anne Marie is screaming and I'm like, okay.

1026
01:00:08,160 --> 01:00:10,160
Speaker 2: Anne Marie comes at her. She's like, you fucking took

1027
01:00:10,200 --> 01:00:14,760
Speaker 2: my baby and killed my dog. And they fight and

1028
01:00:15,040 --> 01:00:19,160
Speaker 2: the cops come and Helen gets arrested. And this is

1029
01:00:19,200 --> 01:00:22,520
Speaker 2: just the beginning of Helen's Helen's nightmare because this is

1030
01:00:22,520 --> 01:00:25,960
Speaker 2: what's also fucked up about the Candyman. The candy Man

1031
01:00:26,120 --> 01:00:31,480
Speaker 2: set her up for murder. Yep, Like, what is this

1032
01:00:31,560 --> 01:00:36,920
Speaker 2: man's ultimate goal? He's like, I'm not gonna appear behind

1033
01:00:36,920 --> 01:00:38,400
Speaker 2: you with a hook and just kill you. I'm gonna

1034
01:00:38,440 --> 01:00:42,080
Speaker 2: set you up for murder. Yeah, And that's not the

1035
01:00:42,120 --> 01:00:45,360
Speaker 2: first time he does it. For the last, that's about

1036
01:00:45,400 --> 01:00:48,480
Speaker 2: the last time he does it because she gets bailed

1037
01:00:48,520 --> 01:00:51,400
Speaker 2: out by Trevor, who was not home at three am,

1038
01:00:51,440 --> 01:00:54,040
Speaker 2: by the way, and she finally starts looking at the

1039
01:00:54,080 --> 01:00:55,959
Speaker 2: negatives of all the film she took, and she sees

1040
01:00:56,000 --> 01:00:57,880
Speaker 2: the candy Man stand and behind her at one point,

1041
01:00:57,880 --> 01:01:00,480
Speaker 2: and then his hook comes through the mirror and house

1042
01:01:00,600 --> 01:01:03,280
Speaker 2: and he's kind of asking he's kind of like asking

1043
01:01:03,280 --> 01:01:05,280
Speaker 2: her to be his victim, victim. He's like, do you

1044
01:01:05,360 --> 01:01:09,320
Speaker 2: believe in me? Can you be my victim? And I'm like,

1045
01:01:09,320 --> 01:01:11,800
Speaker 2: why is he asking this bitch for permission? Just what

1046
01:01:12,000 --> 01:01:12,640
Speaker 2: is happening?

1047
01:01:13,520 --> 01:01:15,200
Speaker 1: Yeah? Oh my gosh.

1048
01:01:15,240 --> 01:01:18,040
Speaker 2: And then he's then he finally is like, can you

1049
01:01:18,120 --> 01:01:19,760
Speaker 2: at least come and get this baby?

1050
01:01:21,480 --> 01:01:22,760
Speaker 1: Can you at least.

1051
01:01:24,160 --> 01:01:24,920
Speaker 2: Bear mens?

1052
01:01:25,040 --> 01:01:29,680
Speaker 1: Can you come get this baby.

1053
01:01:39,680 --> 01:01:44,720
Speaker 4: I don't know what to feed him.

1054
01:01:45,080 --> 01:01:49,720
Speaker 2: I only have bees. Yeah, He's like, bear Min's come

1055
01:01:49,760 --> 01:01:52,400
Speaker 2: get this baby, and he shows, he shows he where

1056
01:01:52,440 --> 01:01:56,160
Speaker 2: Anthony is. Anthony's still alive in some rubble somewhere. So

1057
01:01:56,280 --> 01:02:00,360
Speaker 2: basically there's more killing to come because Berna that comes

1058
01:02:00,400 --> 01:02:03,000
Speaker 2: by with some flowers and the candyman kills her and

1059
01:02:03,120 --> 01:02:06,480
Speaker 2: frames Helen again, and then she's arrested and he's like

1060
01:02:06,560 --> 01:02:09,080
Speaker 2: floating over her and whispering again. I don't even understand

1061
01:02:09,120 --> 01:02:11,760
Speaker 2: the dynamics of his body movements, Like how is he

1062
01:02:11,760 --> 01:02:15,120
Speaker 2: able to float? Nobody cares, Nobody explains. He's like in

1063
01:02:15,160 --> 01:02:17,760
Speaker 2: her mind, I guess, So he's like, she's I don't know,

1064
01:02:17,840 --> 01:02:21,040
Speaker 2: it's not explained. But he frames her for murder again,

1065
01:02:21,800 --> 01:02:24,640
Speaker 2: and then they keep knocking her out in this hospital

1066
01:02:24,680 --> 01:02:26,280
Speaker 2: like she's in this kind of psych bored version of

1067
01:02:26,320 --> 01:02:29,440
Speaker 2: the hospital. She wakes up again a month later and

1068
01:02:29,600 --> 01:02:33,840
Speaker 2: she's been charged with first degree murder, so she kills

1069
01:02:34,160 --> 01:02:36,960
Speaker 2: the doctor. She basically escapes like she kills a doctor.

1070
01:02:36,960 --> 01:02:38,880
Speaker 2: She knocks out a nurse, she climbs out a window.

1071
01:02:39,160 --> 01:02:42,880
Speaker 2: She fucking escapes and goes and I'm not going to

1072
01:02:43,120 --> 01:02:44,800
Speaker 2: ruin the end of the movie. But she does meet

1073
01:02:44,840 --> 01:02:47,720
Speaker 2: up with Candyman again. But basically he shows up like

1074
01:02:47,760 --> 01:02:51,560
Speaker 2: twice and he's standing still and ambling. He's an ambler

1075
01:02:51,600 --> 01:02:54,680
Speaker 2: for sure. He either is standing completely still or he

1076
01:02:54,760 --> 01:02:57,960
Speaker 2: just appears behind you, which I guess could be a

1077
01:02:58,040 --> 01:03:01,160
Speaker 2: jumper since he doesn't. He just doesn't make any sudden

1078
01:03:01,240 --> 01:03:04,960
Speaker 2: movements very often. He only makes a sudden movement like once.

1079
01:03:04,880 --> 01:03:09,040
Speaker 1: And he floats once, which is an option for this theme.

1080
01:03:09,800 --> 01:03:12,440
Speaker 2: Which we have to assume as part of the ambling

1081
01:03:13,160 --> 01:03:16,280
Speaker 2: because there's not even an option for a floater. A

1082
01:03:16,360 --> 01:03:19,480
Speaker 2: floater is usually a ghost. What the fuck is going on?

1083
01:03:20,840 --> 01:03:24,280
Speaker 2: Is he a ghost? And if you are a ghosts

1084
01:03:24,280 --> 01:03:27,600
Speaker 2: there are rules. You're not corporeal, you can't grab people,

1085
01:03:28,080 --> 01:03:30,040
Speaker 2: you can't you can't grab people. If you're a ghost,

1086
01:03:30,120 --> 01:03:34,240
Speaker 2: you're like an apparition. So yeah, end of the movie

1087
01:03:34,320 --> 01:03:37,760
Speaker 2: is fucking wild. It has one of the wildest scenes.

1088
01:03:37,800 --> 01:03:40,439
Speaker 2: I could I may, I wish I could tell you.

1089
01:03:40,880 --> 01:03:42,600
Speaker 2: But there are people who have not seen the original

1090
01:03:42,640 --> 01:03:44,640
Speaker 2: Canyon In and I want them to. But let's just

1091
01:03:44,680 --> 01:03:47,760
Speaker 2: say Virginia Madson is doing the most in one of

1092
01:03:47,800 --> 01:03:52,320
Speaker 2: her final scenes, and she ends up looking like that

1093
01:03:52,360 --> 01:03:58,040
Speaker 2: fucking doll from Rugrats. Cynthia was at its same.

1094
01:03:58,920 --> 01:04:00,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, she crawls is.

1095
01:04:00,320 --> 01:04:04,480
Speaker 2: Something looking like a Cynthia doll, and it's fucking wild.

1096
01:04:04,480 --> 01:04:07,240
Speaker 2: But for all that I've said, I actually love this movie.

1097
01:04:07,360 --> 01:04:11,240
Speaker 2: It's so creepy and weird and horrible and awful and

1098
01:04:11,280 --> 01:04:16,960
Speaker 2: scary and truly terrifying. And he's an ambler. He's one

1099
01:04:17,000 --> 01:04:18,200
Speaker 2: of my favorite amblers.

1100
01:04:18,640 --> 01:04:22,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, that is also my take. I've seen this again.

1101
01:04:22,840 --> 01:04:25,720
Speaker 1: I'm like, it doesn't make a lick of sense normally,

1102
01:04:25,800 --> 01:04:28,520
Speaker 1: but like, I still love it. I still think it's

1103
01:04:28,640 --> 01:04:31,040
Speaker 1: very enjoyable, and I don't I think it has a

1104
01:04:31,040 --> 01:04:34,080
Speaker 1: lot to do quite honestly with like the score. I

1105
01:04:34,080 --> 01:04:37,280
Speaker 1: think the score really it's like one of those scores

1106
01:04:37,320 --> 01:04:39,680
Speaker 1: that just really sets up everything in this dramatic way,

1107
01:04:39,720 --> 01:04:41,840
Speaker 1: and then at the end of it, you're like, I

1108
01:04:41,880 --> 01:04:45,280
Speaker 1: don't really know if I followed what happened just now,

1109
01:04:45,360 --> 01:04:47,840
Speaker 1: but damn was it creepy as shit.

1110
01:04:48,640 --> 01:04:51,440
Speaker 4: There men's come get this baby.

1111
01:04:51,440 --> 01:04:54,160
Speaker 1: Well and also too, like I could not help but

1112
01:04:54,200 --> 01:05:00,800
Speaker 1: think there are times where the dialogue was extremely Clive Barker, Yes,

1113
01:05:01,160 --> 01:05:05,680
Speaker 1: and I was like, is this is some Victorian goth vampire.

1114
01:05:05,440 --> 01:05:08,480
Speaker 2: Shit and this is based on a story that he wrote,

1115
01:05:08,520 --> 01:05:10,680
Speaker 2: and he was an executive producer on the film, so yeah,

1116
01:05:10,720 --> 01:05:12,080
Speaker 2: his handprints were all over it.

1117
01:05:12,560 --> 01:05:16,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, but confusing. I will say that this was a

1118
01:05:16,880 --> 01:05:23,560
Speaker 1: confusing mythology. But I'm glad that we established that candy

1119
01:05:23,640 --> 01:05:25,640
Speaker 1: Man is an ambler because I would agree with you.

1120
01:05:26,000 --> 01:05:28,800
Speaker 2: Absolutely with his words coming out of his mouth and

1121
01:05:28,840 --> 01:05:36,040
Speaker 2: his fucking strange outfit. Well, he's an ambler, and yours

1122
01:05:36,120 --> 01:05:39,160
Speaker 2: is also I can't wait to get into Yeah, because

1123
01:05:39,200 --> 01:05:41,040
Speaker 2: I'm so glad we watched these two back to back.

1124
01:05:41,080 --> 01:05:42,640
Speaker 2: I watched them as a true double feature, and I

1125
01:05:42,640 --> 01:05:43,360
Speaker 2: could not sleep.

1126
01:05:44,080 --> 01:05:48,000
Speaker 1: Oh I did it to myself again. I am to

1127
01:05:48,040 --> 01:05:51,880
Speaker 1: blame because I, first of all, I couldn't watch the

1128
01:05:51,960 --> 01:05:56,640
Speaker 1: movie or any of the supplements or documentaries that I

1129
01:05:56,680 --> 01:05:59,400
Speaker 1: watched at night. I had to watch them during the day,

1130
01:05:59,600 --> 01:06:04,120
Speaker 1: tenth in the morning, the least scary time of day. Absolutely,

1131
01:06:04,160 --> 01:06:06,600
Speaker 1: And I will say I did. I did a little

1132
01:06:06,600 --> 01:06:09,160
Speaker 1: bit extra research this time, just because I know that

1133
01:06:09,200 --> 01:06:11,040
Speaker 1: there's some a couple of things about this movie that

1134
01:06:11,040 --> 01:06:16,840
Speaker 1: we're gonna get into. But my film for the theme runners,

1135
01:06:16,920 --> 01:06:20,160
Speaker 1: Jumplers and Amblers is a movie from nineteen ninety one.

1136
01:06:21,120 --> 01:06:24,160
Speaker 1: The screenplay is by Ted Tally, based on the book

1137
01:06:24,320 --> 01:06:26,880
Speaker 1: The Silence of the Lambs by Thomas Harris. Directed by

1138
01:06:26,920 --> 01:06:29,760
Speaker 1: Jonathan Denny, it's called Silence of the Lambs.

1139
01:06:30,080 --> 01:06:32,400
Speaker 2: Oh, Clarice, you have probably making me to get.

1140
01:06:32,240 --> 01:06:36,000
Speaker 1: More fun out of fly Yeah boy, jd yeh, we're

1141
01:06:36,040 --> 01:06:40,280
Speaker 1: back with another jd so. We we have talked about

1142
01:06:40,400 --> 01:06:44,760
Speaker 1: this this now. It's a franchise really of films and

1143
01:06:44,800 --> 01:06:48,080
Speaker 1: TV shows. We know that you're very keen about one

1144
01:06:48,080 --> 01:06:50,400
Speaker 1: of the scenes in the television show Hannibal.

1145
01:06:54,360 --> 01:06:57,360
Speaker 2: It's pinned on my Instagram. Just go check it out.

1146
01:06:58,200 --> 01:07:01,680
Speaker 1: It makes me laugh that it makes you laugh so much?

1147
01:07:02,000 --> 01:07:07,000
Speaker 1: Does that make sense? Like, I think it's so funny

1148
01:07:07,000 --> 01:07:09,600
Speaker 1: that you are amused by that scene. It just says

1149
01:07:09,640 --> 01:07:11,120
Speaker 1: a lot about you and I love it.

1150
01:07:11,200 --> 01:07:11,480
Speaker 2: I ab.

1151
01:07:15,760 --> 01:07:18,240
Speaker 1: So I will say I've not seen the TV show Hannibal,

1152
01:07:19,120 --> 01:07:21,720
Speaker 1: I haven't seen Red Dragon in a long time. I

1153
01:07:21,920 --> 01:07:25,800
Speaker 1: just recently saw Manhunter not too long ago. But I've

1154
01:07:25,800 --> 01:07:28,320
Speaker 1: seen Silence of the Lambs a few times recently, so

1155
01:07:29,080 --> 01:07:31,360
Speaker 1: but now I'm going I think I'm going to go

1156
01:07:31,400 --> 01:07:34,360
Speaker 1: through it all like I'm going to do the whole set.

1157
01:07:34,680 --> 01:07:37,480
Speaker 2: I just did that last month and I highly recommend,

1158
01:07:37,760 --> 01:07:40,560
Speaker 2: highly recommend it. It's a great Saturday afternoon.

1159
01:07:41,120 --> 01:07:44,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I've never read the book The Silence of

1160
01:07:44,800 --> 01:07:47,040
Speaker 1: the Lambs, so I want to do that actually because

1161
01:07:47,600 --> 01:07:49,960
Speaker 1: just just because we're going to talk a little bit

1162
01:07:50,000 --> 01:07:52,640
Speaker 1: about the movie and I and I kind of would

1163
01:07:52,680 --> 01:07:55,840
Speaker 1: just like to compare it ultimately. But so, Silence of

1164
01:07:55,880 --> 01:07:59,479
Speaker 1: the Lambs was follow up to Thomas Harris's first book,

1165
01:07:59,480 --> 01:08:02,080
Speaker 1: Red Drag, and when they decided that they wanted to

1166
01:08:02,120 --> 01:08:06,320
Speaker 1: make the film adaptation of this, apparently Gene Hackman was

1167
01:08:06,360 --> 01:08:10,880
Speaker 1: first involved, and he was actually set up to both

1168
01:08:11,040 --> 01:08:15,520
Speaker 1: act and direct the film at one point. Wow, I

1169
01:08:15,520 --> 01:08:17,840
Speaker 1: think he was going to play I think I read

1170
01:08:17,840 --> 01:08:19,599
Speaker 1: that he was going to play the Jack Crawford character

1171
01:08:19,640 --> 01:08:22,160
Speaker 1: or something like that. But he was also going to

1172
01:08:22,240 --> 01:08:25,479
Speaker 1: direct this movie. But I think he eventually passed on it,

1173
01:08:25,560 --> 01:08:29,280
Speaker 1: and then obviously Jonathan Demi was brought in to direct it.

1174
01:08:29,760 --> 01:08:31,800
Speaker 1: And you know, I, of course, if you listen to

1175
01:08:31,840 --> 01:08:34,040
Speaker 1: a few episodes. Back when we talked about Caged Heat,

1176
01:08:34,200 --> 01:08:36,600
Speaker 1: I went on and on about him, So I'm not

1177
01:08:36,640 --> 01:08:40,040
Speaker 1: going to duplicate that info, but I would say that

1178
01:08:40,080 --> 01:08:43,200
Speaker 1: this is Jonathan Demi's most famous movie. It's probably the

1179
01:08:43,240 --> 01:08:45,960
Speaker 1: one that he's known for obviously the most. And I

1180
01:08:46,040 --> 01:08:49,479
Speaker 1: also feel like it's kind of hard to overstate how

1181
01:08:50,439 --> 01:08:55,280
Speaker 1: influential this movie is in our popular culture for various reasons.

1182
01:08:55,920 --> 01:08:57,280
Speaker 1: I mean, I bet a lot of people who are

1183
01:08:57,320 --> 01:09:00,000
Speaker 1: listening right now have either seen it at some point

1184
01:09:00,080 --> 01:09:02,519
Speaker 1: point in their life, especially if you're in a true

1185
01:09:02,520 --> 01:09:05,840
Speaker 1: crime I think it's like one of those films that

1186
01:09:05,960 --> 01:09:08,640
Speaker 1: I think a lot of true crime ficionados like, and

1187
01:09:08,680 --> 01:09:10,640
Speaker 1: it's definitely one of the most famous. It's kind of

1188
01:09:10,640 --> 01:09:13,720
Speaker 1: a hybrid movie, like a horror crime thriller type of thing.

1189
01:09:14,400 --> 01:09:17,280
Speaker 1: So a one sentence synopsis of Silence of the Lambs,

1190
01:09:17,760 --> 01:09:22,120
Speaker 1: a female FBI trainee who is tasked with tracking down

1191
01:09:22,280 --> 01:09:26,920
Speaker 1: a notorious murderer and mutilator of women, seeks the expertise

1192
01:09:27,000 --> 01:09:33,880
Speaker 1: of a famous psychologist turned cannibalistic serial killer. Damn, it's

1193
01:09:33,880 --> 01:09:34,280
Speaker 1: a lot.

1194
01:09:34,600 --> 01:09:35,080
Speaker 2: That's good.

1195
01:09:35,360 --> 01:09:37,760
Speaker 1: There's a lot going on. So I want to say this.

1196
01:09:37,920 --> 01:09:41,400
Speaker 1: I tracked down this really great making of documentary. It

1197
01:09:41,479 --> 01:09:45,400
Speaker 1: was called Inside the Labyrinth the Making of Silence of

1198
01:09:45,439 --> 01:09:48,479
Speaker 1: the Lambs. Oh, and it was made in two thousand

1199
01:09:48,479 --> 01:09:51,200
Speaker 1: and one by this filmmaker named Jeffrey Schwartz, who directed

1200
01:09:51,240 --> 01:09:54,719
Speaker 1: a lot of documentaries. He did the documentary on tab Hunter,

1201
01:09:54,960 --> 01:09:58,000
Speaker 1: on Divine and I want to say that this was

1202
01:09:58,080 --> 01:10:01,720
Speaker 1: I don't know where this initially aired. I don't know

1203
01:10:01,760 --> 01:10:04,920
Speaker 1: if this was a part of a supplement or something

1204
01:10:04,960 --> 01:10:07,960
Speaker 1: on a DVD or something, but I had I had

1205
01:10:07,960 --> 01:10:10,879
Speaker 1: to find it on YouTube. It's on It's on YouTube

1206
01:10:10,880 --> 01:10:13,880
Speaker 1: in three parts, so I think if you just look

1207
01:10:13,920 --> 01:10:15,280
Speaker 1: it up, you'll be able to find it if you

1208
01:10:15,320 --> 01:10:18,080
Speaker 1: want to check it out, because it's actually really informative,

1209
01:10:18,120 --> 01:10:21,519
Speaker 1: and there was a lot of interviews in that that

1210
01:10:21,880 --> 01:10:23,760
Speaker 1: were really interesting to me and kind of put the

1211
01:10:23,800 --> 01:10:26,640
Speaker 1: film in the more context for me. And one of

1212
01:10:26,680 --> 01:10:29,280
Speaker 1: the things that they talked about the very beginning is that,

1213
01:10:30,160 --> 01:10:34,639
Speaker 1: you know, this movie was part I think of this

1214
01:10:35,400 --> 01:10:42,280
Speaker 1: growing American fascination with serial killers that was sort of

1215
01:10:43,200 --> 01:10:46,120
Speaker 1: kicked off really in a major way in the sixties,

1216
01:10:47,120 --> 01:10:50,360
Speaker 1: which I think, of course now that has obviously continued

1217
01:10:50,439 --> 01:10:53,839
Speaker 1: so much and to this day. I think serial killers

1218
01:10:53,880 --> 01:10:58,400
Speaker 1: are still a fascination for people. And I think because

1219
01:10:58,400 --> 01:11:00,760
Speaker 1: Thomas Harris is a right, it was a writer, and

1220
01:11:00,800 --> 01:11:02,960
Speaker 1: it used to be a journalist. I mean, there's obvious

1221
01:11:03,040 --> 01:11:06,320
Speaker 1: ties to many actual serial killers in this film, you know,

1222
01:11:06,479 --> 01:11:11,599
Speaker 1: like Ed Gean and Ted Bundy and Gary Heidnick and

1223
01:11:11,640 --> 01:11:14,559
Speaker 1: those types of folks. But I feel like when this

1224
01:11:14,680 --> 01:11:18,439
Speaker 1: movie came out, I think it really did bring serial

1225
01:11:18,640 --> 01:11:25,200
Speaker 1: killers into the mainstream, into mainstream entertainment. Right, Because the

1226
01:11:25,240 --> 01:11:27,080
Speaker 1: thing about Silence of the Lambs is that it was

1227
01:11:27,160 --> 01:11:33,559
Speaker 1: both commercially successful and critically acclaimed. Right. It was the

1228
01:11:33,600 --> 01:11:38,800
Speaker 1: third film to win Oscars in all the major five categories,

1229
01:11:38,800 --> 01:11:43,160
Speaker 1: so Best Picture, Best Director, Best Actor Anthony Hopkins, Best

1230
01:11:43,160 --> 01:11:47,400
Speaker 1: Actress Jodie Foster, and then Best Adapted Screenplay. And I think,

1231
01:11:47,439 --> 01:11:51,960
Speaker 1: to this day is the only movie categorized as a

1232
01:11:52,000 --> 01:11:56,800
Speaker 1: horror film to win Best Picture. Oh wow, Yeah, because

1233
01:11:56,800 --> 01:12:00,439
Speaker 1: that doesn't happen very often in the Oscars obviously. Yeah.

1234
01:12:00,479 --> 01:12:02,400
Speaker 1: And I'll just say this, I think as a person

1235
01:12:02,640 --> 01:12:06,280
Speaker 1: who studies and thinks about film on a cultural level,

1236
01:12:06,800 --> 01:12:09,320
Speaker 1: I feel like Silence of the Lambs is just a

1237
01:12:09,400 --> 01:12:13,960
Speaker 1: really rich text. There's a lot of topics going on

1238
01:12:14,000 --> 01:12:18,400
Speaker 1: in this film. There's violence towards women, gender identity, class feminism,

1239
01:12:18,520 --> 01:12:24,120
Speaker 1: body image, policing, and there is definitely no shortage of

1240
01:12:24,160 --> 01:12:26,880
Speaker 1: analysis about all those things. So if you want to

1241
01:12:26,880 --> 01:12:29,960
Speaker 1: go down that road, it's very interesting stuff. But I

1242
01:12:29,960 --> 01:12:31,640
Speaker 1: will give you a basic outline of the story and

1243
01:12:31,680 --> 01:12:33,040
Speaker 1: then we can come back around and sort of talk

1244
01:12:33,040 --> 01:12:35,000
Speaker 1: about a couple of things that I find really fascinating

1245
01:12:35,439 --> 01:12:39,679
Speaker 1: about Silence of the Lambs. So the movie is essentially

1246
01:12:39,720 --> 01:12:43,080
Speaker 1: about a young woman named Clarice Starling, who is obviously

1247
01:12:43,160 --> 01:12:48,120
Speaker 1: played by Jodie Foster. She's originally from West Virginia. She

1248
01:12:49,600 --> 01:12:52,960
Speaker 1: as a child lost both of her parents. Her father

1249
01:12:53,200 --> 01:12:55,719
Speaker 1: was a police officer who died in the light of duty,

1250
01:12:55,760 --> 01:12:58,320
Speaker 1: and apparently this was a very formative moment for her

1251
01:12:58,320 --> 01:13:01,880
Speaker 1: as a child. In The movie begins with Clarice at

1252
01:13:01,920 --> 01:13:06,160
Speaker 1: the FBI Academy, where she is immediately given this unusual

1253
01:13:06,160 --> 01:13:10,000
Speaker 1: assignment by her superior, Jack Crawford, who is played by

1254
01:13:10,000 --> 01:13:14,880
Speaker 1: Scott Glenn from Urban Cowboy. The villain from Urban Cowboy is.

1255
01:13:14,840 --> 01:13:18,400
Speaker 2: You know who's so perfect in this role. He's like

1256
01:13:18,439 --> 01:13:22,960
Speaker 2: so gentle and yeah, I get a really good vibe

1257
01:13:22,960 --> 01:13:23,720
Speaker 2: from him in this role.

1258
01:13:24,160 --> 01:13:26,519
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's definitely the opposite of the role that he

1259
01:13:26,520 --> 01:13:28,400
Speaker 1: played Urban Cowboy, which is where he's sort of like

1260
01:13:28,439 --> 01:13:33,160
Speaker 1: a mess shirt and he was a psycho. Essentially, he's

1261
01:13:33,200 --> 01:13:37,280
Speaker 1: definitely not that. But he tells her that he need

1262
01:13:37,439 --> 01:13:39,479
Speaker 1: that she needs to go visit one of the most

1263
01:13:40,000 --> 01:13:46,840
Speaker 1: notorious criminals to ever live, and it's Hannibal the Cannibal Elector,

1264
01:13:48,720 --> 01:13:52,720
Speaker 1: and that is essentially the villain of the film. I

1265
01:13:52,720 --> 01:13:57,120
Speaker 1: would say, I think he's an ambler to be honest,

1266
01:13:57,720 --> 01:14:00,400
Speaker 1: like I think, and I think it's only because he's

1267
01:14:00,439 --> 01:14:04,240
Speaker 1: incarcerated that he's an ambler, and maybe at one point

1268
01:14:04,840 --> 01:14:07,760
Speaker 1: is a walker, but not a runner, I would say,

1269
01:14:10,320 --> 01:14:12,799
Speaker 1: and also maybe a jumper, like I think it's honestly,

1270
01:14:13,479 --> 01:14:16,879
Speaker 1: I think it's a you got a big one, God

1271
01:14:16,920 --> 01:14:22,000
Speaker 1: bless hey, when you tell me the rules. Okay, then

1272
01:14:22,040 --> 01:14:27,400
Speaker 1: he's an Then he's a majority ambler with like moments

1273
01:14:27,439 --> 01:14:31,679
Speaker 1: of jumping maybe once, uh like like in the Candyman

1274
01:14:31,760 --> 01:14:33,639
Speaker 1: float scenario, he is a jumper once.

1275
01:14:35,320 --> 01:14:37,719
Speaker 2: Okay, I'll take it. I'll take it. And there's also

1276
01:14:37,760 --> 01:14:42,599
Speaker 2: another villain in the film who I think is a runner.

1277
01:14:44,960 --> 01:14:45,839
Speaker 2: O Game Gum.

1278
01:14:46,320 --> 01:14:50,479
Speaker 1: Yes, well, we're gonna definitely talk about jam Gum for sure.

1279
01:14:51,120 --> 01:14:53,360
Speaker 1: I actually think there's probably a third villain, which is

1280
01:14:53,400 --> 01:14:58,880
Speaker 1: the the head of the hospital. Yes, that piece of shit.

1281
01:14:59,560 --> 01:15:02,479
Speaker 1: I would I think he is. Actually, yeah, I think

1282
01:15:02,479 --> 01:15:04,280
Speaker 1: he's a villain. I'm gonna call him a villain. And

1283
01:15:04,400 --> 01:15:09,440
Speaker 1: because of that, I would say he is a fucking ambler. Ah,

1284
01:15:11,479 --> 01:15:13,040
Speaker 1: who's the guy that plays him again?

1285
01:15:13,840 --> 01:15:16,200
Speaker 2: Oh? Healed with his name Anthony Healed?

1286
01:15:17,000 --> 01:15:23,879
Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, doctor Frederick Chilton a fucking ambler for life. Okay,

1287
01:15:24,520 --> 01:15:28,479
Speaker 1: So let's talk about Hannibal, right, because so he's a

1288
01:15:28,520 --> 01:15:33,000
Speaker 1: former psychiatrist. He is very smart, very cultured, and also

1289
01:15:33,920 --> 01:15:41,840
Speaker 1: incredibly dangerous, like even in maximum security. He is not

1290
01:15:41,960 --> 01:15:45,800
Speaker 1: to be fucked with, like Clarice is told. And this

1291
01:15:45,840 --> 01:15:47,760
Speaker 1: is what I think is so brilliant about this movie

1292
01:15:47,840 --> 01:15:51,360
Speaker 1: is that it builds all this tension by because you

1293
01:15:51,400 --> 01:15:56,640
Speaker 1: are in the Clarice mindset. You're You're like, what are

1294
01:15:56,680 --> 01:16:01,040
Speaker 1: we doing at this moment? I'm this like young FBI upstart,

1295
01:16:01,120 --> 01:16:03,439
Speaker 1: and now I'm being taken to like the bottom floor

1296
01:16:03,800 --> 01:16:12,800
Speaker 1: of this terrifying institution where it's like a jail under

1297
01:16:12,880 --> 01:16:18,960
Speaker 1: six feet of rock. Also, somebody like throws cum at her.

1298
01:16:20,000 --> 01:16:22,679
Speaker 2: Yes, it is not a pleasant place to visit.

1299
01:16:22,920 --> 01:16:26,519
Speaker 1: Yes, And you're and you're just going like, holy shit,

1300
01:16:26,640 --> 01:16:30,360
Speaker 1: can this be real? She's told pretty much straight up,

1301
01:16:30,439 --> 01:16:35,479
Speaker 1: like be careful because Hannibal is really cunning. He's a

1302
01:16:35,520 --> 01:16:37,920
Speaker 1: former psychiatrist, so he's gonna get in your head and

1303
01:16:37,960 --> 01:16:39,080
Speaker 1: he's gonna mind.

1304
01:16:38,960 --> 01:16:39,439
Speaker 2: Game you.

1305
01:16:40,960 --> 01:16:45,720
Speaker 1: To death, basically, And she thinks that she's there to

1306
01:16:45,840 --> 01:16:50,080
Speaker 1: drop off this questionnaire for him. That's like, I think

1307
01:16:50,080 --> 01:16:52,200
Speaker 1: it's so funny. Is this idea that she was like, Oh,

1308
01:16:52,240 --> 01:16:54,320
Speaker 1: this all this whole thing started because I was dropping

1309
01:16:54,360 --> 01:16:55,440
Speaker 1: off a questionnaire.

1310
01:16:57,120 --> 01:16:58,640
Speaker 2: There was no other way to get this to him.

1311
01:16:58,680 --> 01:17:02,720
Speaker 2: It had to be me in person. Then, yeah, I

1312
01:17:02,800 --> 01:17:03,200
Speaker 2: have to.

1313
01:17:03,120 --> 01:17:06,080
Speaker 1: Go down to you know, the middle of the earth,

1314
01:17:06,200 --> 01:17:10,000
Speaker 1: the Earth's core, to visit this guy that's literally behind

1315
01:17:10,080 --> 01:17:15,599
Speaker 1: like ten feet of plexiglass with like hamster holes drilled

1316
01:17:15,720 --> 01:17:19,040
Speaker 1: in it. And then everything that I give him is

1317
01:17:19,080 --> 01:17:26,400
Speaker 1: through a slot, like you give him a questionnaire. But

1318
01:17:26,479 --> 01:17:31,920
Speaker 1: that's the thing. So she's down there and at the

1319
01:17:31,960 --> 01:17:35,840
Speaker 1: same time, she's kind of assessing him, he's sizing her up.

1320
01:17:35,840 --> 01:17:40,040
Speaker 1: She's assessing him obviously, and realizes that she's able to

1321
01:17:40,160 --> 01:17:45,559
Speaker 1: maybe ask this guy some questions about this current serial

1322
01:17:45,640 --> 01:17:48,360
Speaker 1: killer that the FBI is trying to catch who is

1323
01:17:48,479 --> 01:17:55,479
Speaker 1: named James Gum nickname Buffalo Bill, and Bill has been

1324
01:17:55,560 --> 01:17:59,479
Speaker 1: ritually kidnapping young women who are plus sized, I have

1325
01:17:59,520 --> 01:18:06,040
Speaker 1: to say, killing them and using the skins, and has

1326
01:18:06,240 --> 01:18:12,519
Speaker 1: yet to be captured. Right. So Clarice, I think, at

1327
01:18:12,560 --> 01:18:16,000
Speaker 1: some point after subsequent visits with Hannibal, realizes that she

1328
01:18:16,040 --> 01:18:18,519
Speaker 1: can establish some level of trust with him, and then

1329
01:18:18,560 --> 01:18:21,280
Speaker 1: she sets up this kind of quid pro quo scenario

1330
01:18:21,479 --> 01:18:26,040
Speaker 1: where he asks her to tell him about her childhood

1331
01:18:26,120 --> 01:18:28,400
Speaker 1: and then in exchange, he's going to give her tips

1332
01:18:28,400 --> 01:18:31,280
Speaker 1: about how to capture Buffalo Bill. So that's the kind

1333
01:18:31,320 --> 01:18:34,080
Speaker 1: of dual storyline thing happening in the film, which is that,

1334
01:18:34,160 --> 01:18:36,800
Speaker 1: you know, there's Clarisa's relationship with Hannibal, and then there's

1335
01:18:36,840 --> 01:18:39,800
Speaker 1: the case work of trying to track down Buffalo Bill.

1336
01:18:40,120 --> 01:18:43,640
Speaker 1: And then the title of the film comes from this

1337
01:18:43,720 --> 01:18:47,559
Speaker 1: incident from Clarisa's childhood where after her parents died, she

1338
01:18:47,600 --> 01:18:50,320
Speaker 1: was sent to live on a farm in Montana or

1339
01:18:50,360 --> 01:18:55,559
Speaker 1: somewhere with some relatives, and she witnessed or heard these

1340
01:18:55,640 --> 01:18:58,960
Speaker 1: lambs screaming while they were being slaughtered on the farm,

1341
01:18:59,760 --> 01:19:03,360
Speaker 1: and it kicked in this instinct to save them, which

1342
01:19:03,400 --> 01:19:06,200
Speaker 1: I think becomes this metaphor for her mission of joining

1343
01:19:06,240 --> 01:19:10,040
Speaker 1: the FBI and trying to prevent this horrific violence happening

1344
01:19:10,080 --> 01:19:14,639
Speaker 1: to these young women. Right. So that's essentially the story

1345
01:19:15,479 --> 01:19:18,320
Speaker 1: and the thing that stands out to me. I think

1346
01:19:18,360 --> 01:19:21,519
Speaker 1: the most about Silence of the Lambs is this running

1347
01:19:21,520 --> 01:19:25,639
Speaker 1: theme about Clarice being a female in this very male

1348
01:19:25,840 --> 01:19:29,000
Speaker 1: world of the FBI, right, because all throughout the film

1349
01:19:29,040 --> 01:19:33,799
Speaker 1: there are instances where Clarice is being ignored or treated

1350
01:19:33,840 --> 01:19:37,280
Speaker 1: differently because she's a woman. And if you heard that

1351
01:19:37,360 --> 01:19:39,800
Speaker 1: episode that we did about Cage Tat, I talked about

1352
01:19:39,800 --> 01:19:43,639
Speaker 1: how the director Jonathan Demi has this you know, general

1353
01:19:43,760 --> 01:19:47,320
Speaker 1: interest and female protagonist in his films, and he is

1354
01:19:47,360 --> 01:19:50,320
Speaker 1: actually really good at getting us as viewers to sort

1355
01:19:50,360 --> 01:19:54,920
Speaker 1: of understand them deeply, which is I think why the

1356
01:19:55,000 --> 01:19:58,200
Speaker 1: Clorice character is obviously my favorite in this film. I

1357
01:19:58,240 --> 01:20:02,719
Speaker 1: think he does a really exceptional job at getting us

1358
01:20:02,800 --> 01:20:07,799
Speaker 1: to be in her shoes essentially. And then I started

1359
01:20:07,800 --> 01:20:09,600
Speaker 1: thinking about it because I was like, I mean, I

1360
01:20:09,600 --> 01:20:11,600
Speaker 1: saw this movie in the early nineties when I was

1361
01:20:11,680 --> 01:20:14,600
Speaker 1: very young. Don't ask me why that happened.

1362
01:20:15,800 --> 01:20:17,519
Speaker 2: Same, and it was just the way it was I

1363
01:20:17,560 --> 01:20:20,839
Speaker 2: saw it. It was like well, eleven twelve.

1364
01:20:21,600 --> 01:20:23,839
Speaker 1: You have a chronic excuse, which is that your family

1365
01:20:23,960 --> 01:20:29,639
Speaker 1: loves horror absolutely and what always put you in front

1366
01:20:29,640 --> 01:20:35,840
Speaker 1: of crazy ass, fucking horror movies, your grandma particularly. I

1367
01:20:35,880 --> 01:20:37,960
Speaker 1: don't know how I saw it, to be honest, I

1368
01:20:37,960 --> 01:20:43,200
Speaker 1: have no I think I was just ambling myself, ambling

1369
01:20:43,280 --> 01:20:45,320
Speaker 1: through the video store something. I don't know how I

1370
01:20:45,320 --> 01:20:45,720
Speaker 1: saw this.

1371
01:20:45,720 --> 01:20:48,360
Speaker 2: Movie so young, at a friend's house or something. Just

1372
01:20:48,439 --> 01:20:50,160
Speaker 2: ambling along through life.

1373
01:20:50,040 --> 01:20:53,479
Speaker 1: Might have been. But I would say that like at

1374
01:20:53,479 --> 01:20:55,280
Speaker 1: the time that I saw this movie, I don't think

1375
01:20:55,320 --> 01:20:58,840
Speaker 1: there was a lot of police or FBI stories from

1376
01:20:58,840 --> 01:21:02,880
Speaker 1: the female perspective before this film. Nope. I mean I

1377
01:21:03,360 --> 01:21:05,719
Speaker 1: always thinking about this movie and maybe The X Files

1378
01:21:06,080 --> 01:21:08,840
Speaker 1: as the first time that I even really understood that

1379
01:21:09,000 --> 01:21:13,599
Speaker 1: FBI agents could be female. Yeah, and it was kind

1380
01:21:13,640 --> 01:21:15,640
Speaker 1: of a revelation. I mean I kind of thought it was,

1381
01:21:16,760 --> 01:21:22,519
Speaker 1: you know, between Clarice Starling and Agent Dana Scully, I

1382
01:21:22,560 --> 01:21:25,559
Speaker 1: was like, this is great, Like these are good like

1383
01:21:26,000 --> 01:21:29,519
Speaker 1: characters that I can sink my teeth into. It's amazing, Yeah,

1384
01:21:29,640 --> 01:21:32,479
Speaker 1: sink my teeth into no pun intended. But anyway, there's

1385
01:21:32,600 --> 01:21:34,559
Speaker 1: one scene in this movie that I feel like is

1386
01:21:34,640 --> 01:21:38,800
Speaker 1: so indicative, right, of this sort of like gendered imbalance

1387
01:21:38,880 --> 01:21:42,320
Speaker 1: between Clarice and the rest of the agents, And it's

1388
01:21:42,360 --> 01:21:46,240
Speaker 1: that one in a funeral home where agent Crawford pulls

1389
01:21:46,280 --> 01:21:50,679
Speaker 1: the sheriff chief for whoever aside and is like, hey,

1390
01:21:50,840 --> 01:21:53,160
Speaker 1: we're not supposed to be talking about sexual matters in

1391
01:21:53,160 --> 01:21:55,160
Speaker 1: front of the ladies. So they end up going into

1392
01:21:55,240 --> 01:21:58,840
Speaker 1: another room without her. And then the shot of her

1393
01:21:59,080 --> 01:22:01,280
Speaker 1: standing in the middle of a circle with like all

1394
01:22:01,320 --> 01:22:06,000
Speaker 1: these like sheriff guys around her, and Jonathan Demi shoots

1395
01:22:06,000 --> 01:22:07,880
Speaker 1: it from this high angle, so it makes her look

1396
01:22:07,920 --> 01:22:09,840
Speaker 1: really small, and I just feel like that's such a

1397
01:22:09,880 --> 01:22:15,200
Speaker 1: great filmmaking choice, smart and just sort of like makes

1398
01:22:15,240 --> 01:22:21,720
Speaker 1: it clear that she like struggles for legitimacy in the agency, right.

1399
01:22:22,840 --> 01:22:25,280
Speaker 1: And he also does it pretty a pretty similar thing

1400
01:22:25,320 --> 01:22:28,200
Speaker 1: to at the beginning of the film, when she's you know, obviously,

1401
01:22:28,280 --> 01:22:31,120
Speaker 1: the opening sequences her running through the woods and then

1402
01:22:31,160 --> 01:22:32,760
Speaker 1: she runs to the office building and she gets in

1403
01:22:32,800 --> 01:22:34,719
Speaker 1: the elevator and then she you know, opens the elevator

1404
01:22:34,760 --> 01:22:36,559
Speaker 1: and then she stands there with like all these like

1405
01:22:36,920 --> 01:22:39,200
Speaker 1: bigger men sort of towering over her.

1406
01:22:39,760 --> 01:22:39,960
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1407
01:22:40,720 --> 01:22:42,880
Speaker 1: I just think that communicates so much about her character

1408
01:22:43,280 --> 01:22:47,200
Speaker 1: and how she feels, which I think is a great touch. Okay,

1409
01:22:47,320 --> 01:22:49,479
Speaker 1: So another aspect of the film that I feel like

1410
01:22:50,360 --> 01:22:56,160
Speaker 1: we've already alluded to it is the Jame Gum Buffalo

1411
01:22:56,200 --> 01:22:59,160
Speaker 1: Bill character. And I mean, even if you haven't seen

1412
01:22:59,160 --> 01:23:02,479
Speaker 1: this film, you probably know the scene where Buffalo Bill

1413
01:23:02,560 --> 01:23:08,320
Speaker 1: dances to Goodbye Horses. It's, you know, a pretty pivotal scene.

1414
01:23:08,439 --> 01:23:11,360
Speaker 1: A lot of people remember it. And when Silence and

1415
01:23:11,360 --> 01:23:15,320
Speaker 1: the Lambs came out in the early nineties, there were

1416
01:23:15,439 --> 01:23:19,519
Speaker 1: several protests from the LGBTQ community in the feminist community

1417
01:23:20,600 --> 01:23:22,679
Speaker 1: to be honest about a lot of aspects of the film,

1418
01:23:22,720 --> 01:23:27,599
Speaker 1: I mean, the violence towards women, obviously also feeling though

1419
01:23:27,760 --> 01:23:33,200
Speaker 1: very strongly, that the Buffalo Bill character was problematic, and

1420
01:23:33,479 --> 01:23:35,680
Speaker 1: especially when you think of the early nineties as being

1421
01:23:35,720 --> 01:23:38,959
Speaker 1: this really important era for gay rights and the AIDS crisis,

1422
01:23:39,840 --> 01:23:42,960
Speaker 1: they felt that this character was not helping to change

1423
01:23:43,040 --> 01:23:48,240
Speaker 1: these sort of negative stereotypes of that like gay trans

1424
01:23:48,400 --> 01:23:52,960
Speaker 1: villain trope that had been a crutch in Hollywood movies

1425
01:23:52,960 --> 01:23:59,559
Speaker 1: for a really long time. And it's interesting because I

1426
01:23:59,560 --> 01:24:01,599
Speaker 1: saw this movie as a child, and then I saw

1427
01:24:01,640 --> 01:24:04,920
Speaker 1: this movie many times as an adult, and from a

1428
01:24:05,000 --> 01:24:10,200
Speaker 1: modern lens, I feel like there might be some different

1429
01:24:10,280 --> 01:24:17,760
Speaker 1: messages about this Bill character right, certainly within the movie itself,

1430
01:24:18,920 --> 01:24:22,280
Speaker 1: but then also in reading and watching old interviews with

1431
01:24:22,400 --> 01:24:26,080
Speaker 1: people who were involved with making this film. So when

1432
01:24:26,120 --> 01:24:30,200
Speaker 1: I saw the Inside the Labyrinth documentary, the actor Ted Levine,

1433
01:24:30,240 --> 01:24:35,000
Speaker 1: who plays Buffalo Bill, said that he did not play

1434
01:24:35,800 --> 01:24:38,840
Speaker 1: that character as a gay man, and that he was

1435
01:24:38,880 --> 01:24:42,920
Speaker 1: actually very aware of the movie cliches when it came

1436
01:24:43,000 --> 01:24:48,520
Speaker 1: to the gay villain troupe, and he actually saw Buffalo

1437
01:24:48,560 --> 01:24:56,679
Speaker 1: Bill as a cisgendered straight homophobe, which is very interesting obviously.

1438
01:24:58,120 --> 01:25:00,880
Speaker 1: And there was an urrale that I read in The

1439
01:25:00,880 --> 01:25:05,719
Speaker 1: New York Times from February nineteen ninety three interviewing Jonathan Demi,

1440
01:25:05,800 --> 01:25:09,000
Speaker 1: the director, who also said that he believed that Buffalo

1441
01:25:09,000 --> 01:25:13,400
Speaker 1: Bill was essentially a self loathing straight man, that he

1442
01:25:13,479 --> 01:25:14,519
Speaker 1: was not gay or trance.

1443
01:25:15,200 --> 01:25:17,320
Speaker 2: Well, there's a line in the film too, where Hannibal

1444
01:25:17,360 --> 01:25:19,799
Speaker 2: says that where he's like, you know, he's he thinks

1445
01:25:19,840 --> 01:25:23,920
Speaker 2: he's he's trans, but he's not. He's just hates himself

1446
01:25:24,960 --> 01:25:28,240
Speaker 2: and doesn't know what to do with that energy, or

1447
01:25:28,240 --> 01:25:30,639
Speaker 2: something to that effect, where he does say I think

1448
01:25:30,680 --> 01:25:32,719
Speaker 2: Demi probably was smart to include that in the film

1449
01:25:32,760 --> 01:25:36,800
Speaker 2: to say, we're not going to diagnose him. He just

1450
01:25:37,400 --> 01:25:39,080
Speaker 2: he hates himself more than he hates women.

1451
01:25:40,320 --> 01:25:44,639
Speaker 1: Yeah, then so you have that in the film. Actually,

1452
01:25:45,960 --> 01:25:49,680
Speaker 1: you have sort of the perspectives, the later perspectives of

1453
01:25:49,760 --> 01:25:52,800
Speaker 1: Jonathan Demi and Ted Levie and the actor. But then

1454
01:25:52,840 --> 01:25:56,000
Speaker 1: there's all this coding in the film, you know that

1455
01:25:56,240 --> 01:26:01,080
Speaker 1: is in that's very interesting and maybe is it makes

1456
01:26:01,160 --> 01:26:04,880
Speaker 1: it kind of less clear about what's actually happening with

1457
01:26:04,920 --> 01:26:07,320
Speaker 1: this character. And I will say, I mean, as a

1458
01:26:07,360 --> 01:26:10,160
Speaker 1: straight cisgendered woman, I'm not gonna I'm gonna opt out

1459
01:26:10,200 --> 01:26:15,000
Speaker 1: of deciding who Buffalo Bill is ultimately, right, I don't

1460
01:26:15,040 --> 01:26:18,120
Speaker 1: want to take away any anyone's read of who this

1461
01:26:18,240 --> 01:26:21,559
Speaker 1: character is to them, But I just think generally, I

1462
01:26:21,560 --> 01:26:24,720
Speaker 1: feel like the film seems to not be thinking very

1463
01:26:24,760 --> 01:26:27,640
Speaker 1: deeply about how it presents Buffalo Bill. Right from the

1464
01:26:27,680 --> 01:26:31,240
Speaker 1: things that I've seen and the old interviews with Jonathan

1465
01:26:31,280 --> 01:26:35,240
Speaker 1: Demi and the crew, like the production designer on the film,

1466
01:26:35,640 --> 01:26:39,439
Speaker 1: they actually seem sincerely apologetic for people having such a

1467
01:26:39,479 --> 01:26:43,120
Speaker 1: strong negative reaction to the film, and they and they

1468
01:26:43,120 --> 01:26:45,640
Speaker 1: claim that they were not trying to vilify gay or

1469
01:26:45,680 --> 01:26:48,679
Speaker 1: trans people when they made it. And then I did

1470
01:26:48,960 --> 01:26:52,320
Speaker 1: see in the interviews in the documentary that you know,

1471
01:26:52,320 --> 01:26:55,120
Speaker 1: they protested the Oscars that year when the film was

1472
01:26:55,240 --> 01:26:59,439
Speaker 1: up for, you know, the Academy Awards, and Jonathan Demi

1473
01:26:59,479 --> 01:27:02,400
Speaker 1: apparently was very receptive to hearing that criticism and he

1474
01:27:02,479 --> 01:27:06,320
Speaker 1: understood the complaints and he sympathized. So it's very interesting,

1475
01:27:06,439 --> 01:27:09,000
Speaker 1: very complex obviously. I also think in ninety one I

1476
01:27:09,040 --> 01:27:12,320
Speaker 1: will say that I would say the mainstream movie going

1477
01:27:12,439 --> 01:27:17,400
Speaker 1: public who were seeing this film, they probably did not

1478
01:27:17,840 --> 01:27:20,840
Speaker 1: know much about gender identity and gender expression.

1479
01:27:20,920 --> 01:27:21,759
Speaker 2: I mean totally.

1480
01:27:22,120 --> 01:27:24,200
Speaker 1: You have to imagine. I mean, like these are like

1481
01:27:24,360 --> 01:27:27,479
Speaker 1: MULTIPLEX folks that are coming to see this movie. I mean,

1482
01:27:27,520 --> 01:27:30,240
Speaker 1: were they picking up these fine points about this Buffalo

1483
01:27:30,320 --> 01:27:31,679
Speaker 1: Bill character. I'm not sure.

1484
01:27:32,360 --> 01:27:35,000
Speaker 2: I don't think. Yeah, I can't say. I can't say

1485
01:27:35,120 --> 01:27:36,960
Speaker 2: I'm not sure either, but yeah, I think it's a

1486
01:27:37,000 --> 01:27:37,679
Speaker 2: good point to make.

1487
01:27:37,960 --> 01:27:41,200
Speaker 1: Well. And and again it's kind of that thing that

1488
01:27:41,280 --> 01:27:44,599
Speaker 1: we wrestle with doing this podcast about film of sort

1489
01:27:44,680 --> 01:27:48,799
Speaker 1: of you know, looking at older films from a modern

1490
01:27:48,840 --> 01:27:52,280
Speaker 1: lens and how you know, it's just a lot of

1491
01:27:52,320 --> 01:27:56,599
Speaker 1: times you will have different different opinions about seeing something

1492
01:27:56,680 --> 01:28:00,280
Speaker 1: later as an adult, you know it happened, and we

1493
01:28:00,320 --> 01:28:01,960
Speaker 1: wrestle with it all the time, so I don't know.

1494
01:28:02,000 --> 01:28:03,920
Speaker 1: I mean, actually, I look at it now when I

1495
01:28:03,960 --> 01:28:08,599
Speaker 1: see this character as being very complex, and I think

1496
01:28:08,840 --> 01:28:17,800
Speaker 1: Demi humanizes this character somewhat in the film, considering that

1497
01:28:17,800 --> 01:28:20,120
Speaker 1: that character is a serial killer and a killer of women.

1498
01:28:20,720 --> 01:28:23,679
Speaker 1: I will say that when I was a preteen seeing

1499
01:28:23,680 --> 01:28:25,680
Speaker 1: this movie in the early nineties, I was definitely not

1500
01:28:25,760 --> 01:28:28,200
Speaker 1: smart or sophisticated to think about this movie at all

1501
01:28:28,760 --> 01:28:31,240
Speaker 1: on any kind of deep level other than it being

1502
01:28:31,320 --> 01:28:34,080
Speaker 1: like a terrifying film about cannibals. Honestly, I think that

1503
01:28:34,080 --> 01:28:37,760
Speaker 1: that was the big message, was the cannibal thing. Yeah,

1504
01:28:38,040 --> 01:28:39,920
Speaker 1: I don't really think. I think that's kind of was

1505
01:28:39,960 --> 01:28:44,479
Speaker 1: the main focus for me, was the cannibal Lecter. I

1506
01:28:44,520 --> 01:28:48,720
Speaker 1: think Cannibal Lecter was terrifying to me as a.

1507
01:28:48,760 --> 01:28:52,760
Speaker 2: Child, absolutely, And it's there's something about his countenance, Like

1508
01:28:52,800 --> 01:28:55,679
Speaker 2: Anthony Hopkins was perfect to play this role. Like even

1509
01:28:55,720 --> 01:28:57,519
Speaker 2: when you first meet him and all he's doing is

1510
01:28:57,560 --> 01:29:00,559
Speaker 2: standing up, but he's so rigid, and he's wearing this

1511
01:29:00,640 --> 01:29:03,800
Speaker 2: like really high waisted jumpsuit that makes him look like

1512
01:29:03,840 --> 01:29:09,040
Speaker 2: a teddy bear almost like very like non threatening physical structure,

1513
01:29:09,160 --> 01:29:12,040
Speaker 2: but then he's the most terrifying person. It's just a

1514
01:29:12,080 --> 01:29:13,600
Speaker 2: really interesting juxtaposition.

1515
01:29:14,040 --> 01:29:20,040
Speaker 1: Well, and like Jonathan Demi uses these close ups constantly

1516
01:29:20,160 --> 01:29:23,240
Speaker 1: throughout the film, and it's of characters who are looking

1517
01:29:23,320 --> 01:29:28,880
Speaker 1: straight into the camera. It's so unsettling. And like I said,

1518
01:29:28,920 --> 01:29:34,320
Speaker 1: I was always very classically terrified by maximum security institution

1519
01:29:34,560 --> 01:29:40,880
Speaker 1: stuff like the idea that I mean, just the mask,

1520
01:29:41,280 --> 01:29:44,439
Speaker 1: which if you watch the documentary on YouTube, there's a

1521
01:29:44,479 --> 01:29:47,040
Speaker 1: really like they talk about the costume designer for the

1522
01:29:47,080 --> 01:29:49,959
Speaker 1: film and how they went through the process of choosing

1523
01:29:50,000 --> 01:29:52,880
Speaker 1: that mask, like at a certain point they were looking

1524
01:29:52,920 --> 01:29:56,080
Speaker 1: at fencing masks and they and you can actually see

1525
01:29:56,640 --> 01:29:59,880
Speaker 1: behind the scenes footage of the actor Anthony Hopkins trying

1526
01:30:00,160 --> 01:30:05,080
Speaker 1: these different masks before they settled on whatever the hockey

1527
01:30:05,120 --> 01:30:09,320
Speaker 1: mask thing. And then so the shot of him in

1528
01:30:09,360 --> 01:30:13,400
Speaker 1: the mask and then just being carted around on that

1529
01:30:13,560 --> 01:30:19,120
Speaker 1: hand cart, like Kurt Brawler talked about the hand cart

1530
01:30:19,360 --> 01:30:21,679
Speaker 1: like they were like, oh, we this guy cannot walk,

1531
01:30:22,280 --> 01:30:26,840
Speaker 1: he has to be carted around. I'm like, the ups

1532
01:30:26,880 --> 01:30:33,120
Speaker 1: hand cart scariest shit to me. It'stering and honestly, like

1533
01:30:33,160 --> 01:30:36,759
Speaker 1: Sir Anthony Hopkins talking about it in the documentary saying,

1534
01:30:36,920 --> 01:30:39,960
Speaker 1: you know, he was like, I'm going for a less's

1535
01:30:39,960 --> 01:30:42,920
Speaker 1: more approach when it comes to this character, like I

1536
01:30:42,960 --> 01:30:45,200
Speaker 1: don't need to do much to make this shit scary,

1537
01:30:46,439 --> 01:30:53,880
Speaker 1: and he did an amazing job, so good. But I

1538
01:30:53,880 --> 01:30:58,200
Speaker 1: want to say though, before before we end that, I

1539
01:30:58,240 --> 01:31:07,639
Speaker 1: read this amazing smart conversation between two people who I

1540
01:31:07,760 --> 01:31:12,559
Speaker 1: think are some of the best folks writing about film

1541
01:31:12,840 --> 01:31:17,360
Speaker 1: right now, Kit and Mark Gardner and Willow Caitlin maclay.

1542
01:31:18,600 --> 01:31:21,759
Speaker 1: They are about to publish a book called Corpses, Fools

1543
01:31:21,760 --> 01:31:26,200
Speaker 1: and Monsters, an examination of transgender cinema. Hasn't come out yet,

1544
01:31:26,240 --> 01:31:29,840
Speaker 1: it's about to be. And I'll just post the link

1545
01:31:30,479 --> 01:31:33,719
Speaker 1: to the transcript of their conversation on our Socials because

1546
01:31:33,960 --> 01:31:36,559
Speaker 1: I think it was really valuable for me as a

1547
01:31:36,760 --> 01:31:41,400
Speaker 1: cisgendered person to hear about this movie and their insights

1548
01:31:41,560 --> 01:31:43,920
Speaker 1: on the Buffalo Bill character from their perspective. I just

1549
01:31:43,920 --> 01:31:46,439
Speaker 1: have to say, I thought it was a really interesting,

1550
01:31:46,600 --> 01:31:49,960
Speaker 1: smart convo, So I'll post that.

1551
01:31:50,240 --> 01:31:52,840
Speaker 2: But great, Yeah, I'd love to read it.

1552
01:31:53,240 --> 01:31:55,320
Speaker 1: But yeah, this this, like I said, this film is

1553
01:31:55,360 --> 01:31:58,599
Speaker 1: such a rich text. I mean, it does the double

1554
01:31:58,680 --> 01:32:04,360
Speaker 1: duty of being a rich text while also being truly

1555
01:32:04,400 --> 01:32:08,880
Speaker 1: scary jump scares. I mean the scene towards the end

1556
01:32:09,040 --> 01:32:12,439
Speaker 1: with the like night vision goggles thing. I mean, I

1557
01:32:12,439 --> 01:32:16,160
Speaker 1: feel like that technique I think has probably been done

1558
01:32:16,200 --> 01:32:19,280
Speaker 1: to death at this point. But at the time that

1559
01:32:19,400 --> 01:32:22,439
Speaker 1: I saw it, I was like, wow, like this is

1560
01:32:23,560 --> 01:32:27,439
Speaker 1: new and creepy. But yeah, like I said, to go

1561
01:32:27,520 --> 01:32:31,960
Speaker 1: back to our theme, I feel like Hannibal is mostly

1562
01:32:32,000 --> 01:32:37,479
Speaker 1: an ambler, and so is Doctor Frederick Chilton, and so

1563
01:32:37,720 --> 01:32:40,000
Speaker 1: is Jane. Is that what you said earlier?

1564
01:32:40,320 --> 01:32:42,479
Speaker 2: Buffalo Bill? I think Buffalo Bill is a runner.

1565
01:32:42,560 --> 01:32:44,599
Speaker 1: A runner, Yep, that makes sense.

1566
01:32:45,640 --> 01:32:47,599
Speaker 2: I feel like he's a real runner.

1567
01:32:48,320 --> 01:32:53,080
Speaker 1: But listen, this movie. I think I have watched it

1568
01:32:53,120 --> 01:32:55,000
Speaker 1: several times. Like I said, I only watched it during

1569
01:32:55,040 --> 01:33:01,160
Speaker 1: the daytime. But is a fascinating film. Obviously Demi's most

1570
01:33:02,000 --> 01:33:06,000
Speaker 1: famous and just sort of a famous, you know, canon

1571
01:33:07,080 --> 01:33:08,240
Speaker 1: horror film.

1572
01:33:08,640 --> 01:33:10,600
Speaker 2: It's one of my favorites. I could keep it on

1573
01:33:10,640 --> 01:33:12,080
Speaker 2: in the background all day. I don't know what that

1574
01:33:12,080 --> 01:33:16,440
Speaker 2: says about me, but it's just it's so psychologically interesting,

1575
01:33:16,760 --> 01:33:21,680
Speaker 2: it's so scary, it's so fascinating. It's traverses all of

1576
01:33:21,720 --> 01:33:23,800
Speaker 2: these different like you said earlier, like all of these

1577
01:33:23,800 --> 01:33:28,000
Speaker 2: different topics of class and gender and identity and it's

1578
01:33:28,040 --> 01:33:32,880
Speaker 2: just there's always something new to discover in this film.

1579
01:33:33,040 --> 01:33:35,960
Speaker 2: But it's also just straight up scary, and I think

1580
01:33:35,960 --> 01:33:38,040
Speaker 2: Hannibal Lecter is probably the scariest ambler.

1581
01:33:38,680 --> 01:33:41,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely.

1582
01:33:41,840 --> 01:33:44,559
Speaker 2: There's only one scene where they actually show how he

1583
01:33:44,960 --> 01:33:47,840
Speaker 2: has killed possibly in the past, or how he has

1584
01:33:47,880 --> 01:33:54,920
Speaker 2: done it, and it's fucking shocking and really terrifying, unbelievable.

1585
01:33:56,120 --> 01:33:59,919
Speaker 1: All I have to say is I love you, Charles Napier.

1586
01:34:04,400 --> 01:34:09,880
Speaker 1: Jonathan Demi, standard actor in his in his kind of

1587
01:34:09,960 --> 01:34:13,920
Speaker 1: dream Landers like Jonathan Demi's version of the Dreamlanders Crew,

1588
01:34:14,960 --> 01:34:18,440
Speaker 1: absolutely terrifying. I gotta say, going back to this documentary

1589
01:34:18,439 --> 01:34:21,959
Speaker 1: I saw on three parts on YouTube, they have a

1590
01:34:22,000 --> 01:34:26,760
Speaker 1: really great discussion about creating that and I'll just leave

1591
01:34:26,800 --> 01:34:31,360
Speaker 1: it at that. But anyway, beautiful, Yeah a movie, And

1592
01:34:31,439 --> 01:34:34,479
Speaker 1: I gotta say, for you, it tracks that you would

1593
01:34:34,560 --> 01:34:36,559
Speaker 1: keep this on in the background because you you did

1594
01:34:36,920 --> 01:34:39,960
Speaker 1: say that Chernobyl. The television show was your comfort launch.

1595
01:34:40,080 --> 01:34:45,880
Speaker 1: So it's all it all comes together for me.

1596
01:34:46,520 --> 01:34:49,200
Speaker 2: I have to discuss so much in therapy what's wrong

1597
01:34:49,240 --> 01:34:52,439
Speaker 2: with my day to day actions that I don't ever

1598
01:34:52,439 --> 01:34:53,840
Speaker 2: get to a point where I can talk to her

1599
01:34:53,880 --> 01:34:56,200
Speaker 2: about what's actually wrong with me that I like to

1600
01:34:56,240 --> 01:34:57,720
Speaker 2: keep this kind of shit on in the background while

1601
01:34:57,760 --> 01:35:01,360
Speaker 2: I I'm gonna have to one day, but I haven't

1602
01:35:01,360 --> 01:35:03,200
Speaker 2: gotten to it yet because I'm like, well, I did

1603
01:35:03,240 --> 01:35:05,920
Speaker 2: this dumb thing or I think this dump shit, and

1604
01:35:05,960 --> 01:35:08,200
Speaker 2: she's like, well, fine, we have to spend a couple

1605
01:35:08,200 --> 01:35:10,559
Speaker 2: of weeks on that, and then I never get to

1606
01:35:10,600 --> 01:35:12,439
Speaker 2: the point where I'm like, also, I watched her Noble

1607
01:35:12,520 --> 01:35:17,519
Speaker 2: and Silence of the Lambs NonStop. Like the way that

1608
01:35:17,560 --> 01:35:19,679
Speaker 2: most people put on music to cook to I will

1609
01:35:19,680 --> 01:35:20,639
Speaker 2: put on one of those two.

1610
01:35:21,160 --> 01:35:25,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, hey, listen, I and to me, it's what I

1611
01:35:25,760 --> 01:35:28,720
Speaker 1: love about you. But you know what, maybe maybe a

1612
01:35:28,760 --> 01:35:32,360
Speaker 1: professional would think differently. Who knows you'll get there one day?

1613
01:35:32,680 --> 01:35:34,320
Speaker 1: Today is not the day today?

1614
01:35:34,479 --> 01:35:37,960
Speaker 2: The day today, I am all about this shit.

1615
01:35:38,720 --> 01:35:39,200
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1616
01:35:39,240 --> 01:35:41,519
Speaker 2: That was a fun episode and truly a great double

1617
01:35:41,560 --> 01:35:44,000
Speaker 2: feature for the upcoming holiday season.

1618
01:35:45,040 --> 01:35:51,599
Speaker 1: I absolutely agree. I immensely enjoyed watching both, so listen.

1619
01:35:51,640 --> 01:35:53,200
Speaker 1: If you want to email us, we are at I

1620
01:35:53,240 --> 01:35:56,720
Speaker 1: saw she did potatgmail dot com. Of course, send us

1621
01:35:56,760 --> 01:35:59,840
Speaker 1: questions for the bonus episodes. Obviously, they sometimes jump to

1622
01:36:00,400 --> 01:36:03,719
Speaker 1: a main feed episode. We also have a po box

1623
01:36:03,840 --> 01:36:07,679
Speaker 1: if you want to send us handwritten letters and things

1624
01:36:07,680 --> 01:36:08,240
Speaker 1: of that nature.

1625
01:36:08,320 --> 01:36:10,200
Speaker 2: And you can now leave us a voicemail to play

1626
01:36:10,240 --> 01:36:13,960
Speaker 2: on the show. Just record a sixty second voice memo

1627
01:36:14,080 --> 01:36:16,040
Speaker 2: and email it to I Saw what you did pod

1628
01:36:16,040 --> 01:36:19,400
Speaker 2: at gmail dot com again sixty seconds or less, and

1629
01:36:19,479 --> 01:36:22,240
Speaker 2: please record in a quiet space and know that we

1630
01:36:22,320 --> 01:36:23,160
Speaker 2: might play it on air.

1631
01:36:23,400 --> 01:36:25,920
Speaker 1: That's right. Also find us on our socials, so we

1632
01:36:26,000 --> 01:36:29,960
Speaker 1: are at I saw a pod on Instagram, Twitter and

1633
01:36:30,479 --> 01:36:33,759
Speaker 1: blue Sky. Oh, we now have a blue Sky account.

1634
01:36:34,400 --> 01:36:36,600
Speaker 1: Nice if you're on there and we are at I

1635
01:36:36,600 --> 01:36:39,720
Speaker 1: saw a Pod there. And also we have merch go

1636
01:36:39,840 --> 01:36:44,080
Speaker 1: to the exactly right shop to find it. And go

1637
01:36:44,080 --> 01:36:44,400
Speaker 1: ahead and.

1638
01:36:44,360 --> 01:36:46,840
Speaker 2: Get our bonus episodes too. They drop on The new

1639
01:36:46,840 --> 01:36:51,719
Speaker 2: episodes drop on the feed every third Thursday of the month,

1640
01:36:52,080 --> 01:36:54,800
Speaker 2: and our old bonus episodes come out every once in

1641
01:36:54,800 --> 01:36:56,559
Speaker 2: a while, every couple of weeks on a Wednesday.

1642
01:36:56,720 --> 01:36:59,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. Well, listen, we don't have an episode

1643
01:36:59,360 --> 01:37:03,479
Speaker 1: next week, but Danielle, you want to tell them the

1644
01:37:03,720 --> 01:37:05,080
Speaker 1: movies for the week after.

1645
01:37:05,920 --> 01:37:12,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, our movies for next week are Amaly from two

1646
01:37:12,439 --> 01:37:15,759
Speaker 2: thousand and one and Top Hat from nineteen thirty five.

1647
01:37:16,240 --> 01:37:20,040
Speaker 1: Guess the theme. I have a failing it will be impossibly.

1648
01:37:20,840 --> 01:37:23,080
Speaker 2: Somebody wrote us a review once that said they were

1649
01:37:23,240 --> 01:37:26,440
Speaker 2: oh for one hundred in guessing the theme.

1650
01:37:28,040 --> 01:37:30,679
Speaker 1: Because you created the rule that need to get every

1651
01:37:30,720 --> 01:37:31,519
Speaker 1: word right.

1652
01:37:33,160 --> 01:37:35,439
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, but you gotta get into this head and

1653
01:37:35,680 --> 01:37:39,559
Speaker 2: think about what would these two folks pick as a theme?

1654
01:37:39,680 --> 01:37:42,439
Speaker 2: And yeah, not general, not a general theme, like a

1655
01:37:42,479 --> 01:37:44,880
Speaker 2: specific theme. It's fun. I think it's fun, but most

1656
01:37:44,920 --> 01:37:46,519
Speaker 2: people are like, yeah, we're ain't getting any of these.

1657
01:37:48,800 --> 01:37:52,200
Speaker 1: Well, listen, Danielle. Always a fucking pleasure during this podcast

1658
01:37:52,200 --> 01:37:56,400
Speaker 1: with you. I have to say I love talking to

1659
01:37:56,439 --> 01:37:59,519
Speaker 1: you every week. I'm just extremely thankful for your friendship.

1660
01:37:59,720 --> 01:38:02,479
Speaker 2: Oh me too, It's my favorite time of the week.

1661
01:38:02,920 --> 01:38:11,839
Speaker 2: Hey nice. This has been an exactly right production. Produced

1662
01:38:11,840 --> 01:38:15,800
Speaker 2: by Casey O'Brien. Episode mixing and theme music by Tom Bryfogel,

1663
01:38:16,080 --> 01:38:19,839
Speaker 2: artwork by Garrett Ross. Our executive producers are Georgia Hartstart,

1664
01:38:19,880 --> 01:38:22,519
Speaker 2: Karen Kile Gareff, and Daniel Kramer. You can follow us

1665
01:38:22,560 --> 01:38:25,479
Speaker 2: on Instagram and Twitter at I Saw Pod, and you

1666
01:38:25,520 --> 01:38:27,719
Speaker 2: can email us at I Saw What You Did Pod

1667
01:38:27,800 --> 01:38:28,439
Speaker 2: at Gmail.