1 00:00:01,240 --> 00:00:03,680 Speaker 1: This is the Bloomberg Business of Sports show. Well, we 2 00:00:03,720 --> 00:00:06,640 Speaker 1: explore the big money issues in the world of sports. 3 00:00:06,720 --> 00:00:10,040 Speaker 2: I'm Michael Barr, I'm Scarlett fou and I'm Damian Sasauer. 4 00:00:10,360 --> 00:00:13,080 Speaker 1: And on the way today we got a chance to 5 00:00:13,119 --> 00:00:16,360 Speaker 1: catch up with an old friend of the show, Steve O. Lennok. 6 00:00:16,680 --> 00:00:20,160 Speaker 1: He's chair of the Sports and Entertainment practice at MINTZ. 7 00:00:20,360 --> 00:00:23,000 Speaker 3: I can tell you it's finding the right opportunities. Number 8 00:00:23,040 --> 00:00:26,280 Speaker 3: one too, there's always a cash plus an equity component, 9 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:29,360 Speaker 3: and two how they can actually monetize and activate those 10 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:32,720 Speaker 3: businesses based off the talent. So you have to fit 11 00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:35,200 Speaker 3: and match and this is where the truly the team 12 00:00:35,240 --> 00:00:38,559 Speaker 3: comes into place, where you can find the right opportunities 13 00:00:38,560 --> 00:00:39,879 Speaker 3: where they could help activate. 14 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:42,159 Speaker 2: We covered a lot of ground with Steve. As you know, 15 00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:45,440 Speaker 2: Steve covers endorsement deals, he covers the world's biggest superstars. 16 00:00:45,479 --> 00:00:48,440 Speaker 2: I mean, we talked Aaron Rodgers RX three, we talked 17 00:00:48,479 --> 00:00:50,680 Speaker 2: Kevin Durant thirty five Ventures. It was great getting his 18 00:00:50,720 --> 00:00:53,600 Speaker 2: thoughts on some of the latest gambling headlines in the NCAA. 19 00:00:53,680 --> 00:00:56,320 Speaker 4: We've also been focused on equity and sports for women. 20 00:00:56,680 --> 00:00:59,400 Speaker 4: We recently spoke with Karen Nortman, who is co founder 21 00:00:59,480 --> 00:01:02,480 Speaker 4: of a City FC and the National Women's Soccer League. 22 00:01:02,640 --> 00:01:05,240 Speaker 4: She co founded a one hundred million dollar fund pushing 23 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:07,960 Speaker 4: for equity in women's sports. Kara talked to us about 24 00:01:08,040 --> 00:01:10,039 Speaker 4: how excited she is for the future of female pro 25 00:01:10,080 --> 00:01:11,280 Speaker 4: athletes across the board. 26 00:01:11,400 --> 00:01:13,199 Speaker 5: I meet with people who get it, who are reaching 27 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:14,800 Speaker 5: out to me or calling me up. Some of the 28 00:01:14,880 --> 00:01:17,440 Speaker 5: most extraordinary people in the world who I would have 29 00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:19,640 Speaker 5: been dying to get meetings with ten years ago, who 30 00:01:19,680 --> 00:01:22,120 Speaker 5: were reading you know the why we're doing this post 31 00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:25,120 Speaker 5: on the Monarch website, which comes from the heart and 32 00:01:25,520 --> 00:01:27,440 Speaker 5: kind of makes the case from the head and the 33 00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:29,960 Speaker 5: heart as to why now is the time for women's sports. 34 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:32,640 Speaker 1: That's Karen Nortman on the show recently. You can hear 35 00:01:32,680 --> 00:01:36,400 Speaker 1: that entire conversation on demand. Now on the Bloomberg Business 36 00:01:36,440 --> 00:01:39,800 Speaker 1: of Sports podcast, we're going to talk more about equity 37 00:01:39,840 --> 00:01:44,200 Speaker 1: for women in sports. The WNBA season is right around 38 00:01:44,240 --> 00:01:47,680 Speaker 1: the corner and interest is growing, but player salaries don't 39 00:01:47,680 --> 00:01:51,080 Speaker 1: seem to be. We'll dive into that with Bloomberg's Jenna Hawk. 40 00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:52,400 Speaker 5: The numbers are abysmal. 41 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:58,120 Speaker 6: Basketball in the US ways claim professional basketball in particular 42 00:01:58,360 --> 00:02:01,600 Speaker 6: ways claim to one of the worst gender pay gaps 43 00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:04,160 Speaker 6: in sports and in the world. 44 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:06,840 Speaker 1: All that and more on the way in the Bloomberg 45 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:10,680 Speaker 1: Business of Sports, but we start with a company looking 46 00:02:10,720 --> 00:02:14,840 Speaker 1: to do more business with women. Under Armour's new CEO, 47 00:02:15,160 --> 00:02:20,040 Speaker 1: Stephanie Lennards, says targeting women is one of her top priorities. 48 00:02:20,480 --> 00:02:24,200 Speaker 1: For more on that, plus how the NBA is expanding 49 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:28,120 Speaker 1: its global footprint, we bring in Bloomberg's Kim Bessin, who 50 00:02:28,240 --> 00:02:32,639 Speaker 1: is just great in anything. He writes, he could put 51 00:02:32,680 --> 00:02:35,520 Speaker 1: a tic tac toe board up on the terminal and 52 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:38,320 Speaker 1: it would be very interesting. Kim Thagie man for joining 53 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:39,919 Speaker 1: us on the Bloomberg Business of Sports. 54 00:02:39,960 --> 00:02:42,000 Speaker 7: OHO, that was a great thank you for that. 55 00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:45,959 Speaker 1: I appreciate you. Well, let's start with something in a 56 00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:48,960 Speaker 1: positive This is something you wrote that under Armour is 57 00:02:49,000 --> 00:02:52,320 Speaker 1: trying to target women more than ever when it comes 58 00:02:52,360 --> 00:02:56,119 Speaker 1: to the athletes and going on down the line. Tell 59 00:02:56,200 --> 00:02:56,720 Speaker 1: us about that. 60 00:02:57,120 --> 00:03:01,639 Speaker 8: Yeah, so under Armour wants to target women shoppers more aggressively, 61 00:03:01,680 --> 00:03:04,960 Speaker 8: so they've made it one of their three big priorities. 62 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:09,280 Speaker 8: It's women, the women's business, footwear and sports style. What 63 00:03:09,320 --> 00:03:12,160 Speaker 8: is sports style that is like off the court, off 64 00:03:12,200 --> 00:03:16,919 Speaker 8: the field kind of sporty fashion, streetwear, that kind of thing. 65 00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:18,880 Speaker 8: So right right now, the women's business at under Armour 66 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:22,120 Speaker 8: only accounts for less than a quarter, so less than 67 00:03:22,120 --> 00:03:25,440 Speaker 8: twenty five percent of their total revenue. They have a 68 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:29,680 Speaker 8: new CEO who just came in and she she wants 69 00:03:29,720 --> 00:03:31,720 Speaker 8: to she wants to change that. I mean, it's such 70 00:03:31,760 --> 00:03:34,760 Speaker 8: a big opportunity for them that that it's you know, 71 00:03:34,880 --> 00:03:37,280 Speaker 8: why do it takes so long for them to to 72 00:03:37,360 --> 00:03:37,880 Speaker 8: realize it? 73 00:03:37,920 --> 00:03:40,720 Speaker 4: How are they going to differentiate themselves from a Lululemon 74 00:03:40,960 --> 00:03:43,160 Speaker 4: or an Athleta which is owned by Gap of course, 75 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:46,880 Speaker 4: or Nike, which has also put a big, big focus 76 00:03:46,880 --> 00:03:49,120 Speaker 4: on expanding its women's market. 77 00:03:48,920 --> 00:03:52,720 Speaker 8: Years ago, when Lululemon started getting real, real big, I 78 00:03:52,760 --> 00:03:56,640 Speaker 8: think the whole industry also contended with that question. 79 00:03:56,840 --> 00:03:57,600 Speaker 7: Like Nike. 80 00:03:58,840 --> 00:04:02,440 Speaker 8: And Adida, every one who was in the space, We're like, whoa, 81 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:05,360 Speaker 8: What's what's going on here? Like loul Lemon's selling more 82 00:04:06,240 --> 00:04:09,280 Speaker 8: leggings than all of us all of a sudden, how 83 00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:11,040 Speaker 8: are we gonna how are we gonna fight back? And 84 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:14,480 Speaker 8: you know, they they started to and and it's really coming. 85 00:04:15,280 --> 00:04:17,880 Speaker 8: What they have to do and what under Armour now 86 00:04:17,920 --> 00:04:20,839 Speaker 8: has to do and the CEO identify this is come 87 00:04:20,960 --> 00:04:25,000 Speaker 8: up with their own like go to product within this space, 88 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:28,440 Speaker 8: whatever that is. And with litul Lemon, it's their yoga pant, 89 00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:30,520 Speaker 8: it's the thing everyone goes there for and everything else 90 00:04:30,640 --> 00:04:32,760 Speaker 8: is built off of that. So what is under Armour 91 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:36,520 Speaker 8: going to do to get that one big item? 92 00:04:36,640 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 4: Yeah, not leggings, clearly, because that's that's taken right. 93 00:04:40,080 --> 00:04:42,520 Speaker 2: Well, Kim, I mean you mentioned it right, sports style, 94 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:45,800 Speaker 2: footwear and women. But you know, quite frankly, research shops 95 00:04:45,839 --> 00:04:48,159 Speaker 2: like Morgan Stanley, Cow and Deutsche Bank and City have 96 00:04:48,200 --> 00:04:51,640 Speaker 2: all lowered their price targets for under Armour after quarterly 97 00:04:51,640 --> 00:04:54,200 Speaker 2: results underperform just a few days back. So you know, 98 00:04:54,240 --> 00:04:58,120 Speaker 2: I'm wondering how much leash does new CEO Stephanie Linards 99 00:04:58,160 --> 00:05:00,760 Speaker 2: have When attempting to write the ship here, she. 100 00:05:00,880 --> 00:05:03,920 Speaker 7: Has said that this will be a year of building, so. 101 00:05:05,360 --> 00:05:10,279 Speaker 8: At least the year's yeah, she said that, uh, that 102 00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:14,479 Speaker 8: timeline already. So this first year will be you know, 103 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:17,920 Speaker 8: reconstructing what what under Armour does, embarking on this new 104 00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:19,520 Speaker 8: strategy and seeing what happens. 105 00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:21,840 Speaker 4: So let me ask you, does that when you say 106 00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:24,760 Speaker 4: style and everything that sounds like designers will be brought in, 107 00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:26,400 Speaker 4: there's gonna be collaborations all of that. 108 00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:30,960 Speaker 8: Yeah, they explicitly said that too. Uh, Sneakers especially, it's 109 00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:34,400 Speaker 8: such a collaboration driven industry, like to create hype for 110 00:05:34,440 --> 00:05:36,320 Speaker 8: the next shoe that comes out that everybody wants that's 111 00:05:36,360 --> 00:05:40,440 Speaker 8: limited edition, and and that builds uh everything else builds 112 00:05:40,480 --> 00:05:43,000 Speaker 8: off of that, builds off of all the marketing around 113 00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:46,320 Speaker 8: these shoes, so that they want to be uh less 114 00:05:46,640 --> 00:05:49,200 Speaker 8: Oh what they say, they said, less footwear culture and 115 00:05:49,320 --> 00:05:53,000 Speaker 8: more sneaker culture. Huh, get in, get in with those, 116 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:57,279 Speaker 8: get in with those hype beasts, you know, like. 117 00:05:57,320 --> 00:06:00,960 Speaker 2: That Cape Town Tiger minute edition. 118 00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:04,280 Speaker 4: Less footwear, more sneaker with. 119 00:06:04,400 --> 00:06:06,159 Speaker 7: Less footwear, more sneaker culture. 120 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:08,920 Speaker 8: So like sneaker heads, people who really covet these shoes 121 00:06:08,920 --> 00:06:10,520 Speaker 8: and want to resell them and want to take part 122 00:06:10,520 --> 00:06:13,599 Speaker 8: in the whole the whole economy right now, I don't 123 00:06:13,640 --> 00:06:17,440 Speaker 8: think any under armour shoes really play there. This is 124 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:19,400 Speaker 8: and there's a big hole that was just created by 125 00:06:19,440 --> 00:06:21,840 Speaker 8: the one point three billion dollars worth of easys that 126 00:06:21,880 --> 00:06:23,719 Speaker 8: are sitting around and warehouses around the world. 127 00:06:24,240 --> 00:06:25,080 Speaker 1: Uh. 128 00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:28,040 Speaker 8: So there's a there's a chance to get in here 129 00:06:28,080 --> 00:06:30,200 Speaker 8: that this is an area that's totally dominated about it. 130 00:06:30,920 --> 00:06:33,280 Speaker 8: Sneaker that you could do a Britney grinder sneaker. Of course, 131 00:06:33,680 --> 00:06:36,080 Speaker 8: Sabrina Yinescu just got a sneaker. 132 00:06:35,920 --> 00:06:39,120 Speaker 2: Or seconds left your screw a long three for the winner. 133 00:06:39,360 --> 00:06:44,799 Speaker 7: She gets it school at the buzzer. These are things 134 00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:45,560 Speaker 7: that that could happen. 135 00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:49,960 Speaker 1: That's like, you know, less hot dogs, more wieners. I'm 136 00:06:49,960 --> 00:06:51,080 Speaker 1: trying to figure that out. 137 00:06:51,120 --> 00:06:53,360 Speaker 7: But sneaker's not footwear man. 138 00:06:53,600 --> 00:06:58,440 Speaker 1: Well, okay, uh something else. NBA. They're saying, look, we're 139 00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:00,640 Speaker 1: gonna we want to open some more stock. We're not 140 00:07:00,720 --> 00:07:04,000 Speaker 1: just talking about in Michael Barr's backyard. We're talking about 141 00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:04,960 Speaker 1: around the world. 142 00:07:05,680 --> 00:07:08,360 Speaker 8: Yeah, they want to open more stores in so many 143 00:07:08,520 --> 00:07:11,840 Speaker 8: other markets. They wouldn't share exactly which ones they were. 144 00:07:12,400 --> 00:07:14,760 Speaker 8: They have thirty seven stores right now and told me 145 00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:17,360 Speaker 8: that they could end up with, you know, fifty one hundred. 146 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:20,120 Speaker 8: It all depends that they're just trying to be opportunistic 147 00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 8: with new locations. But in the last twelve months they've 148 00:07:23,880 --> 00:07:29,200 Speaker 8: been very busy opening these stores Paris, Melbourne, Johannesburg, Abu 149 00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:32,360 Speaker 8: Dhabi and then the latest one just opened in Manila 150 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:34,680 Speaker 8: in the in the Philippines. They said they want to 151 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:37,840 Speaker 8: do some catching up, is what they said. In Latin 152 00:07:37,880 --> 00:07:40,360 Speaker 8: America and especially in Mexico, so you should see more 153 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:41,840 Speaker 8: more stores opening there. 154 00:07:42,080 --> 00:07:44,480 Speaker 4: That just invites the question they're competing with. I mean, 155 00:07:44,520 --> 00:07:47,040 Speaker 4: there's a lot of NBA gear in those markets, just 156 00:07:47,040 --> 00:07:49,280 Speaker 4: just most of it happens to be pirated and counterfeit. 157 00:07:49,400 --> 00:07:52,080 Speaker 8: Yeah, they work with a bunch of a bunch of 158 00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 8: partners in these places for the real licensed product. There's 159 00:07:56,560 --> 00:08:00,920 Speaker 8: a ghost Sport in France, Zebio in Japan, Centaurroo and Brazil. 160 00:08:01,120 --> 00:08:04,080 Speaker 8: These are big chains that are local that they work 161 00:08:04,160 --> 00:08:07,800 Speaker 8: with and that's where most of this merchandise is is sold. 162 00:08:07,800 --> 00:08:11,040 Speaker 8: But like getting their presence in these international markets is 163 00:08:11,400 --> 00:08:14,280 Speaker 8: crucial for the NBA. These are people who don't will 164 00:08:14,400 --> 00:08:18,000 Speaker 8: never probably have a chance to go actually attend an 165 00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:20,560 Speaker 8: NBA game across the world, right, so you got to 166 00:08:20,600 --> 00:08:21,920 Speaker 8: go to them. 167 00:08:21,760 --> 00:08:24,000 Speaker 2: Well can you You're onto something that's really interesting and 168 00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:25,600 Speaker 2: to sort of compare and contrast with what we were 169 00:08:25,640 --> 00:08:27,800 Speaker 2: just talking about with under armour, right, just the fact 170 00:08:27,840 --> 00:08:31,040 Speaker 2: that the NBA has successfully partnered with these local retailers 171 00:08:31,040 --> 00:08:33,959 Speaker 2: Go Sport you mentioned, I mean El Corte, Ingles, in Spain, right, 172 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:36,440 Speaker 2: So you know, my question is is this the model 173 00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:38,400 Speaker 2: that the NBA is going to continue to pursue or 174 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:40,920 Speaker 2: do you see these partnerships evolving as the pie continues 175 00:08:40,960 --> 00:08:41,280 Speaker 2: to grow. 176 00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:44,640 Speaker 8: I think they'll both things. They'll evolve, and the NBA 177 00:08:44,679 --> 00:08:46,680 Speaker 8: is going to want more of its own stores that 178 00:08:46,679 --> 00:08:49,040 Speaker 8: it can fully control and really you know, build the 179 00:08:49,080 --> 00:08:52,520 Speaker 8: brand off of. They're opening these other types of attractions 180 00:08:52,559 --> 00:08:56,440 Speaker 8: as well. There's the NB a court side restaurant up 181 00:08:56,480 --> 00:08:59,959 Speaker 8: in Toronto, and in Brazil there's something called the NBA 182 00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:03,000 Speaker 8: a Park theme park. It's like a theme park. It's 183 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:05,760 Speaker 8: it's a it's a three story complex that's you know, 184 00:09:05,800 --> 00:09:10,200 Speaker 8: everything NBA. There's a basketball court inside, a restaurant, a 185 00:09:10,280 --> 00:09:13,880 Speaker 8: store to buy jerseys, and they want to open more 186 00:09:13,880 --> 00:09:16,120 Speaker 8: of these, you know, different kinds of attractions around the 187 00:09:16,120 --> 00:09:16,760 Speaker 8: world as well. 188 00:09:16,960 --> 00:09:20,120 Speaker 1: You know, that's a great idea because I can't think 189 00:09:20,200 --> 00:09:23,200 Speaker 1: of the other other three major food groups in the 190 00:09:23,200 --> 00:09:25,400 Speaker 1: sports that's doing something like this. 191 00:09:25,920 --> 00:09:27,440 Speaker 7: Yeah, I don't. I don't think so either. 192 00:09:27,600 --> 00:09:31,280 Speaker 8: International growth has been such a priority for Commissioner Adam Silver. 193 00:09:31,679 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 7: Yes. 194 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:36,120 Speaker 8: So, Joel mb just won the MVP. He's from Cameroon, 195 00:09:36,200 --> 00:09:40,199 Speaker 8: he's the first MVP since James Harden in twenty eighteen. 196 00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:42,760 Speaker 8: I think to have played in the NC DOUBLEA because 197 00:09:42,840 --> 00:09:46,800 Speaker 8: the previous four years it was Nikola Jokic and Jannis Attakumpo. 198 00:09:47,080 --> 00:09:49,520 Speaker 8: So like neither of those guys ever played college basketball. 199 00:09:49,559 --> 00:09:52,440 Speaker 8: You have to go out abroad to find these next 200 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:54,800 Speaker 8: big stars. You can't just scout the big schools anymore. 201 00:09:54,880 --> 00:09:57,160 Speaker 1: Aber thanks to Bloomberg's can be seen for Joining us 202 00:09:57,320 --> 00:10:00,680 Speaker 1: on the Bloomberg Business of Sports, Kim will be to 203 00:10:00,720 --> 00:10:05,520 Speaker 1: try to guess the number of the week. Up next 204 00:10:05,520 --> 00:10:07,840 Speaker 1: down the show, we take a look at the gender 205 00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 1: pay gap in basketball. That's straight ahead on the Bloomberg 206 00:10:11,280 --> 00:10:21,240 Speaker 1: Business of Sports Bloomberg Radio around the world. This is 207 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:24,080 Speaker 1: the Bloomberg Business of Sports show where we explore the 208 00:10:24,120 --> 00:10:26,959 Speaker 1: big money issues in the world of sports. Michael Levarr 209 00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:31,400 Speaker 1: along with Scarlett Fu and Damian Sassaur. The WNBA season 210 00:10:31,480 --> 00:10:35,079 Speaker 1: kicks off on Friday, May nineteenth, and there's reasona believe 211 00:10:35,360 --> 00:10:37,120 Speaker 1: the raw is pointing up. 212 00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:40,079 Speaker 4: Certainly when you look at the financials. Revenue is up 213 00:10:40,080 --> 00:10:42,640 Speaker 4: for the league. Last season was also its most watched 214 00:10:42,640 --> 00:10:45,760 Speaker 4: season since two thousand and six. But stay with the financials, 215 00:10:46,040 --> 00:10:48,640 Speaker 4: the athletes in the WNBA are not getting paid the 216 00:10:48,679 --> 00:10:51,840 Speaker 4: way their male counterparts are in the NBA, so that 217 00:10:51,920 --> 00:10:53,360 Speaker 4: raises a lot of questions. 218 00:10:53,760 --> 00:10:57,160 Speaker 1: In fact, Britney Griner, who of course dealt with being 219 00:10:57,200 --> 00:11:00,520 Speaker 1: detained in Russia, spoke about this at her first press 220 00:11:00,520 --> 00:11:04,160 Speaker 1: conference since coming home. She said she would not be 221 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:07,959 Speaker 1: playing overseas herself going forward, but does not blame women 222 00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:10,160 Speaker 1: who do because of the pay gat. 223 00:11:10,240 --> 00:11:12,200 Speaker 9: So I don't knock any player that wants to go 224 00:11:12,240 --> 00:11:15,920 Speaker 9: overseas and you know, make a little bit extra money. 225 00:11:16,960 --> 00:11:19,720 Speaker 9: I'm hoping that our league continues to grow, and with 226 00:11:20,080 --> 00:11:23,520 Speaker 9: as many people in here right now covering this, I 227 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:25,720 Speaker 9: hope you continue, like I said, to cover our league, 228 00:11:25,760 --> 00:11:28,520 Speaker 9: bring disposure to us. I hope a lot of these 229 00:11:29,000 --> 00:11:31,200 Speaker 9: companies start to invest in our. 230 00:11:31,080 --> 00:11:35,600 Speaker 1: Craft and we have Jenna Hawk, our own Bloomberg's Jenna 231 00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:39,400 Speaker 1: Hawk with us. What took so long for some of 232 00:11:39,440 --> 00:11:42,800 Speaker 1: these people out there to wake up and realize there's 233 00:11:42,840 --> 00:11:44,559 Speaker 1: a lot of money in the WNBA. 234 00:11:45,200 --> 00:11:49,040 Speaker 6: It's really hard to say exactly. I think the last 235 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:51,920 Speaker 6: couple of years have really been a real inflection point 236 00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:57,160 Speaker 6: for women's sports in general, and particularly women's basketball. Ratings 237 00:11:57,200 --> 00:11:59,400 Speaker 6: have been at an all time high over the last 238 00:11:59,400 --> 00:12:01,360 Speaker 6: couple of years, and so I think people are starting 239 00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:05,200 Speaker 6: to open their eyes and realize, like, hey, it's really 240 00:12:05,200 --> 00:12:09,320 Speaker 6: time to start investing in women's sports. Last year, they 241 00:12:09,360 --> 00:12:12,320 Speaker 6: had the largest capital raised in women's sports history. They 242 00:12:12,400 --> 00:12:15,560 Speaker 6: raised over seventy five million, and some economists even say 243 00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:17,559 Speaker 6: that that was probably too low and they should have 244 00:12:18,440 --> 00:12:19,160 Speaker 6: raised even more. 245 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:22,240 Speaker 4: Okay, so money is pouring into women's sports. It's pouring 246 00:12:22,240 --> 00:12:25,560 Speaker 4: into the WNBA. As you point out in your story, 247 00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:28,920 Speaker 4: the revenue for the league has doubled. How much of 248 00:12:28,920 --> 00:12:31,440 Speaker 4: that or how little of that, perhaps more accurately, is 249 00:12:31,480 --> 00:12:33,320 Speaker 4: making its way into player salaries. 250 00:12:33,400 --> 00:12:37,520 Speaker 6: A really small amount. It's actually shrinking too, so it's 251 00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:38,840 Speaker 6: less than ten percent. 252 00:12:38,920 --> 00:12:41,319 Speaker 4: Now, walk us through why that is. I know there's 253 00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:44,839 Speaker 4: a collective bargaining agreement there, but beyond that, where's the 254 00:12:44,880 --> 00:12:45,640 Speaker 4: money going towards? 255 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:45,880 Speaker 7: Then? 256 00:12:46,280 --> 00:12:49,040 Speaker 6: Yeah, so the league will say that they're investing it 257 00:12:49,120 --> 00:12:53,880 Speaker 6: back into the league to keep things growing. But yeah, 258 00:12:54,360 --> 00:12:56,880 Speaker 6: I think the problem really lies in this collective bargaining 259 00:12:56,960 --> 00:13:00,199 Speaker 6: agreement that sort of laid out these salary caps back 260 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:03,880 Speaker 6: in twenty nineteen. But that inflection point that I had 261 00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:06,600 Speaker 6: just mentioned sort of happened a little bit beyond that 262 00:13:06,679 --> 00:13:09,760 Speaker 6: in the last couple of two years or so, and 263 00:13:09,800 --> 00:13:12,319 Speaker 6: that just meant that players really sort of got the 264 00:13:12,360 --> 00:13:14,800 Speaker 6: short end of the stick and they were getting played, 265 00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:17,840 Speaker 6: they were getting paid in terms of twenty nineteen dollars. 266 00:13:18,280 --> 00:13:21,760 Speaker 6: But women's sports again has sort of massively grown since then. 267 00:13:22,120 --> 00:13:24,480 Speaker 2: Well we've seen Jenna how you know, Britney Griner was 268 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:27,800 Speaker 2: forced to, you know, find work in Russia, right, you know, 269 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:30,560 Speaker 2: when you know d WNBA wasn't able to pay her 270 00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:34,280 Speaker 2: enough money. Talk to us about the CBA, when's it up? 271 00:13:34,600 --> 00:13:37,200 Speaker 2: What can we expect? I mean, is it possible that 272 00:13:37,320 --> 00:13:39,120 Speaker 2: you know, we don't even make it to you know, 273 00:13:39,160 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 2: the end of the current CBA, like where there might 274 00:13:41,880 --> 00:13:44,720 Speaker 2: be actually a player strike. I mean, what's the risk here? 275 00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:48,800 Speaker 6: So the CBA technically doesn't end until after the twenty 276 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:52,840 Speaker 6: twenty seventh season, so there's still quite a bit of time. Luckily, 277 00:13:52,880 --> 00:13:56,120 Speaker 6: there's a clause in the contract that allows players or 278 00:13:56,160 --> 00:13:58,920 Speaker 6: the league to opt out early, so they could end 279 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:03,320 Speaker 6: the the contract after the twenty twenty five seasons. So 280 00:14:03,559 --> 00:14:08,840 Speaker 6: I think after this season, starting later this year, and 281 00:14:08,880 --> 00:14:12,560 Speaker 6: definitely the players in the Union and the league are 282 00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:15,320 Speaker 6: going to be spending lots of times in twenty twenty 283 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:17,840 Speaker 6: four and twenty twenty five talking about whether it makes 284 00:14:17,880 --> 00:14:21,080 Speaker 6: sense to abandon this contract, and I think from the 285 00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:24,640 Speaker 6: player's standpoint, almost all of them unanimously want to leave. 286 00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:28,920 Speaker 1: You have a chart in your story, and we're talking 287 00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:33,840 Speaker 1: about WNBA players compared to NBA players and their take 288 00:14:33,880 --> 00:14:39,440 Speaker 1: home salary. The minimum for WNBA player is sixty two thousand, 289 00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:44,600 Speaker 1: three hundred dollars. The minimum for the NBA is nine 290 00:14:44,720 --> 00:14:48,360 Speaker 1: hundred and fifty three thousand dollars. And I only want 291 00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:50,840 Speaker 1: to get into the highest paid. The highest paid in 292 00:14:50,880 --> 00:14:54,120 Speaker 1: the WNBA is two hundred and thirty four point nine 293 00:14:54,200 --> 00:14:59,320 Speaker 1: in the WNBA, the highest in the NBA forty eight 294 00:14:59,400 --> 00:15:02,840 Speaker 1: point one one million dollars. And someone's got to ask it, 295 00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:05,440 Speaker 1: so it might as well be me. What in the hell? 296 00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:10,600 Speaker 6: I agree? What in the hell? Yeah, it's the numbers 297 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:15,760 Speaker 6: are abysmal. The women, the women basketball in the US 298 00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:19,560 Speaker 6: lays claim professional basketball in particular ways claim to one 299 00:15:19,600 --> 00:15:23,560 Speaker 6: of the worst gender pay gaps in sports and just 300 00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:27,960 Speaker 6: in the world. Yeah, tons, tons of money and resources 301 00:15:28,360 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 6: is constantly being poorn into the NBA. The same can't 302 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:35,760 Speaker 6: be said for the WNBA. Both leagues like to say 303 00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:38,280 Speaker 6: it's not fair to compare one to the other because 304 00:15:38,680 --> 00:15:41,840 Speaker 6: the NBA is about fifty years older. But we crunched 305 00:15:41,840 --> 00:15:45,440 Speaker 6: the numbers, and even when the NBA was the same 306 00:15:45,480 --> 00:15:48,200 Speaker 6: age as the w NBA is currently, they were still 307 00:15:48,240 --> 00:15:51,280 Speaker 6: paying the players significantly more. So I don't know if 308 00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:52,880 Speaker 6: that argument really holds up. 309 00:15:52,960 --> 00:15:55,120 Speaker 4: There will always be people who say that if you're 310 00:15:55,160 --> 00:15:58,760 Speaker 4: going to compare men's pay to women's pay, that the 311 00:15:58,800 --> 00:16:02,600 Speaker 4: women will always it just becomes an exercise in futility 312 00:16:02,640 --> 00:16:05,120 Speaker 4: because the women will always be underpaid. Maybe the better 313 00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:07,240 Speaker 4: way to look at it is the trajectory of growth 314 00:16:07,280 --> 00:16:10,080 Speaker 4: in women's pay and how it's doing in the context 315 00:16:10,160 --> 00:16:14,040 Speaker 4: of the WNBA's revenue increase and as you point out 316 00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:16,280 Speaker 4: in your story, a doubling in revenue that comes I'm 317 00:16:16,320 --> 00:16:19,240 Speaker 4: sure a lot of it from media rights, and the 318 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:21,600 Speaker 4: media rights have gotten more expensive, they've gotten more attractive 319 00:16:21,640 --> 00:16:25,440 Speaker 4: to broadcasters. How much of that flows to. 320 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:30,800 Speaker 6: Players currently none of it, which is a bummer. Yeah, 321 00:16:30,840 --> 00:16:36,240 Speaker 6: So the accounting within the WNBA is very complicated there. 322 00:16:36,640 --> 00:16:39,920 Speaker 6: They sort of separate league revenue with team revenue, and 323 00:16:40,040 --> 00:16:45,120 Speaker 6: it's really very a convoluted accounting structure. But basically, all 324 00:16:45,200 --> 00:16:47,560 Speaker 6: the media rights and all the revenue from both media 325 00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:51,840 Speaker 6: rights and national corporate sponsorships stays solely within the league, 326 00:16:51,880 --> 00:16:53,880 Speaker 6: and the players don't get a sense of that. 327 00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:56,200 Speaker 2: Jen, I wonder you know. I mean, I'm just looking 328 00:16:56,280 --> 00:16:58,880 Speaker 2: quickly at, you know, some of the various different ownership 329 00:16:58,880 --> 00:17:00,920 Speaker 2: groups for the twelve w n the teams, and you know, 330 00:17:00,920 --> 00:17:03,800 Speaker 2: you have a lot of familiar faces, right, I mean, 331 00:17:03,880 --> 00:17:06,840 Speaker 2: you have Joe Tsi, you have you know, Monumental that 332 00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:09,080 Speaker 2: owns the Washington Mystics. You know, you have you know, 333 00:17:09,160 --> 00:17:11,399 Speaker 2: you know, a lot of the ownership groups are the 334 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:15,160 Speaker 2: same owners that own NBA or NFL or Major League 335 00:17:15,200 --> 00:17:17,520 Speaker 2: Baseball teams. Yet we all know the w n B 336 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:20,280 Speaker 2: A is just a you know, small relative to those 337 00:17:20,280 --> 00:17:22,239 Speaker 2: other you know, the revenues that are generated by those 338 00:17:22,280 --> 00:17:25,080 Speaker 2: other sports and those other and those other franchises. Is 339 00:17:25,119 --> 00:17:28,000 Speaker 2: there any willingness on the part of ownership groups to 340 00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:30,760 Speaker 2: change the game to to to sort of you know, 341 00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:32,879 Speaker 2: focus on the w n B A in lieu of 342 00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:35,320 Speaker 2: what happened to Brindey Griner and try to write the ship. 343 00:17:35,520 --> 00:17:37,960 Speaker 6: Yeah. I think there's a number of owners that are 344 00:17:38,359 --> 00:17:42,280 Speaker 6: really trying to change the narrative around the w n 345 00:17:42,320 --> 00:17:45,280 Speaker 6: b A and to also make sure that there's enough 346 00:17:45,280 --> 00:17:49,320 Speaker 6: eyes on the players as is deserved. I talked to 347 00:17:49,359 --> 00:17:51,400 Speaker 6: a few different owners for the story, and a lot 348 00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:53,760 Speaker 6: of them said they're they're really trying to make sure 349 00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:57,760 Speaker 6: that they can help with like media rights negotiations in 350 00:17:57,800 --> 00:18:01,119 Speaker 6: the coming in the coming years, and they're really hoping 351 00:18:01,160 --> 00:18:03,920 Speaker 6: to keep advocating on the player's behalf as well, which 352 00:18:04,040 --> 00:18:04,600 Speaker 6: was good to hear. 353 00:18:04,840 --> 00:18:07,760 Speaker 1: You wrote in your story. The WNBA is projected to 354 00:18:07,800 --> 00:18:10,280 Speaker 1: bring in between one hundred and eighty million and two 355 00:18:10,359 --> 00:18:14,960 Speaker 1: hundred million dollars in combined league and team revenue this year, 356 00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:17,399 Speaker 1: and that's up from about one hundred and two million 357 00:18:17,480 --> 00:18:21,960 Speaker 1: dollars just about four years ago. But the players won't 358 00:18:22,000 --> 00:18:23,800 Speaker 1: see any of that extra bounty. 359 00:18:23,880 --> 00:18:27,800 Speaker 6: Why this is coming back to that really strict collective 360 00:18:27,840 --> 00:18:32,280 Speaker 6: bargaining agreement that was struck back in twenty nineteen. There 361 00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:35,399 Speaker 6: there's a clause in the contract about revenue sharing, but 362 00:18:35,480 --> 00:18:38,960 Speaker 6: there's really really tight restrictions in order for that to 363 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:42,199 Speaker 6: actually be unlocked and for players to see any of 364 00:18:42,240 --> 00:18:47,040 Speaker 6: that extra bounty, and some complicated formulas and division of 365 00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:50,639 Speaker 6: funds makes it almost impossible for them to sort of 366 00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:52,600 Speaker 6: benefit from that revenue doubling. 367 00:18:52,840 --> 00:18:56,040 Speaker 1: Our thanks to Bloomberg's Jenna Hawk for taking time to 368 00:18:56,160 --> 00:18:59,160 Speaker 1: join us on the Bloomberg Business of Sports. That conversation 369 00:18:59,280 --> 00:19:01,480 Speaker 1: is on demand right now on the Bloomberg Business of 370 00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:05,760 Speaker 1: Sports podcast. Up next, we talk with Steve Olennock. He's 371 00:19:05,960 --> 00:19:09,960 Speaker 1: Chair of Sports and Entertainment at leading law firm Mints. 372 00:19:10,359 --> 00:19:12,720 Speaker 1: We'll get his take on some of the latest headlines 373 00:19:12,760 --> 00:19:16,600 Speaker 1: in sports, including some recent gambling incidents in the NC 374 00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:19,479 Speaker 1: Double A. Got is straight ahead on the Bloomberg Business 375 00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:30,000 Speaker 1: of Sports Bloomberg Radio around the world. Thanks for joining 376 00:19:30,040 --> 00:19:32,199 Speaker 1: us on the Bloomberg Business of Sports show, where we 377 00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:34,600 Speaker 1: explore the big money issues in the world of sports. 378 00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:38,280 Speaker 1: I'm Michael Barr, along with Scarlett fu and Damian Sas Hour. 379 00:19:38,720 --> 00:19:41,240 Speaker 1: Time now for us to check in with an old 380 00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:44,320 Speaker 1: friend of the show, Steve Olennock. He's chair of the 381 00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:48,760 Speaker 1: Sports and Entertainment practice at Mintz. He robs shoulders with 382 00:19:48,880 --> 00:19:51,199 Speaker 1: some of the big names in the business, so we 383 00:19:51,280 --> 00:19:54,359 Speaker 1: wanted to get his take on some stories that we 384 00:19:54,480 --> 00:19:57,920 Speaker 1: have been following, including with some problems with gambling in 385 00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:01,600 Speaker 1: the NC DOUBLEA. Steve, Welcome back to the Bloomberg Business 386 00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:04,280 Speaker 1: of Sports. Hey, you guys doing man, doing great man. 387 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:09,080 Speaker 1: You know, it's I'm looking at the sports landscape. And 388 00:20:09,119 --> 00:20:13,560 Speaker 1: then there are some dust ups in the gambling sports industry, 389 00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:18,720 Speaker 1: and that includes the let's say the Alabama baseball coach 390 00:20:20,359 --> 00:20:23,600 Speaker 1: with the NC DOUBLEA, and he got into some big 391 00:20:23,640 --> 00:20:26,440 Speaker 1: trouble because I guess he was gambling on some stuff 392 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:30,880 Speaker 1: that you don't do, especially in the NC DOUBLEA. Well, 393 00:20:31,200 --> 00:20:32,919 Speaker 1: first of all, let me get your thoughts about that. 394 00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:34,639 Speaker 1: What in the heck happened? 395 00:20:34,720 --> 00:20:38,960 Speaker 3: You know, it's one of those topics where everyone knows 396 00:20:39,000 --> 00:20:41,160 Speaker 3: you can't do it, but then you try to get 397 00:20:41,200 --> 00:20:43,720 Speaker 3: into that situation where it's like, oh, they won't catch me, 398 00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:48,240 Speaker 3: and you know that you can't do it. You cannot 399 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:53,960 Speaker 3: place bets whether you're an athlete, a student athlete, administrator, coach, 400 00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:57,679 Speaker 3: and so oftentimes you know what's going to happen, and 401 00:20:57,760 --> 00:21:02,240 Speaker 3: you know ultimately you're trying to preserve the integrity of 402 00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:05,840 Speaker 3: the game and that's what the NCAA is doing, and 403 00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:07,879 Speaker 3: you're bound to get caught. So at the end of 404 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:09,800 Speaker 3: the day, I mean, you know you can't do it, 405 00:21:10,200 --> 00:21:14,360 Speaker 3: and oftentimes people try or they think they're they're going 406 00:21:14,400 --> 00:21:18,600 Speaker 3: to be smart and tiptoe the line and try to 407 00:21:18,600 --> 00:21:22,000 Speaker 3: do things that wouldn't look like they're appearing to place 408 00:21:22,040 --> 00:21:24,439 Speaker 3: the bet. But you often see in a lot of 409 00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:28,040 Speaker 3: these situations it always comes back to you get caught. 410 00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:31,120 Speaker 1: Well, yes, that's like I were also doing seventy five 411 00:21:31,119 --> 00:21:32,879 Speaker 1: and a fifty five big court. 412 00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:37,560 Speaker 4: Well, in this case, Brad Bohannan was fired by Alabama 413 00:21:38,119 --> 00:21:41,480 Speaker 4: because of this investigation into his suspicious betting activity on 414 00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:44,120 Speaker 4: the Crimson Tide game against LSU on April twenty eighth. 415 00:21:44,520 --> 00:21:47,000 Speaker 4: What is the single most important legal issue that this 416 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:49,240 Speaker 4: violation opens up for Alabama. 417 00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:53,800 Speaker 3: Well, that's an interesting question. I mean, I think oftentimes 418 00:21:53,840 --> 00:21:57,679 Speaker 3: in these types of situations, the school is going to 419 00:21:57,680 --> 00:22:01,440 Speaker 3: open the investigation alongside the and they're going to do 420 00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 3: their due diligence and they're going to have to fully investigate. 421 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:06,240 Speaker 3: They're going to have to start doing some fact finding 422 00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:10,320 Speaker 3: in terms of questioning people, did you know anything, when 423 00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:12,919 Speaker 3: did you know? How did you know? And then you 424 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:15,640 Speaker 3: kind of shape that you know, the narrative and your 425 00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:20,880 Speaker 3: report and then provide it back to decide what exactly happened, right, 426 00:22:21,080 --> 00:22:24,200 Speaker 3: Because until then you're you're fact finding in terms of 427 00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:24,959 Speaker 3: a lot of this stuff. 428 00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:28,439 Speaker 2: Well, Steve, I mean let's take a step back. I 429 00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:31,560 Speaker 2: mean Alabama baseball, I mean Iowa State wrestling. I mean, 430 00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:33,560 Speaker 2: how much is really what's the handle? I mean, there's 431 00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:35,199 Speaker 2: not a whole heck of a lot being bet, So 432 00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:38,600 Speaker 2: it's pretty easy for I guess, you know, compliance engines 433 00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:41,919 Speaker 2: or sport books to kind of identify, you know, a 434 00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:44,520 Speaker 2: bet that might not look very kosher. So talk to 435 00:22:44,560 --> 00:22:46,480 Speaker 2: me about the technology that's out there. We've had on 436 00:22:46,600 --> 00:22:49,280 Speaker 2: a scenesbury on from Geocomply, We've had Carston Krahl from 437 00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:51,880 Speaker 2: sport Radar. I mean, is there any way to beat 438 00:22:51,920 --> 00:22:54,439 Speaker 2: the system? I mean, like, have people gotten away with, 439 00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:57,080 Speaker 2: you know, doing this for some period of time in 440 00:22:57,119 --> 00:22:59,040 Speaker 2: the modern era? I mean, talk to us about your thoughts. 441 00:22:59,040 --> 00:22:59,720 Speaker 2: What are you hearing there? 442 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:01,840 Speaker 3: I mean I think, like first and foremost, I mean, 443 00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:04,640 Speaker 3: if anyone has an iPhone, right, I mean they can 444 00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:07,280 Speaker 3: track it. And so if you're going to place the bet, 445 00:23:07,359 --> 00:23:10,600 Speaker 3: I mean, you know, if you're really thinking it through, 446 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:13,560 Speaker 3: I mean they're probably placing it on their phone or 447 00:23:13,720 --> 00:23:17,879 Speaker 3: something identified to themselves or their ID that they can track, 448 00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:21,800 Speaker 3: or any type of IP address that floats back to them, 449 00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:24,520 Speaker 3: and oftentimes that's what's going to happen. You know, they 450 00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:26,919 Speaker 3: think they're going to be able to like come up 451 00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:29,640 Speaker 3: with a creative way to get around the rules and regulations. 452 00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:33,760 Speaker 3: But like as I said before, it's like strict liability. 453 00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:35,240 Speaker 3: You know what's going to happen, and then if you 454 00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:37,560 Speaker 3: get caught, you know the outcome for the most part. Now, 455 00:23:37,560 --> 00:23:40,679 Speaker 3: with the NCAAA, due to the severities, they have a 456 00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:45,200 Speaker 3: committee on Infractions where you'll actually put forth the case 457 00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:47,159 Speaker 3: and then they'll kind of evaluate it based off of 458 00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:52,359 Speaker 3: a panel of people, some of which are lawyers, presidents, coaches, 459 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:56,679 Speaker 3: et cetera. And what the'll determine is how severe the 460 00:23:56,800 --> 00:23:59,040 Speaker 3: actual infraction was and then go from there. 461 00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:02,480 Speaker 1: And when we last left, Steve, we were talking about 462 00:24:02,560 --> 00:24:09,439 Speaker 1: the WWE and organizations like that getting into the online 463 00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:16,119 Speaker 1: sports betting now and when we said it back then, 464 00:24:16,320 --> 00:24:22,240 Speaker 1: is like, Okay, so I'm going to say it again. Okay, Steve, 465 00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:24,440 Speaker 1: what do we do about this now? 466 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:28,000 Speaker 3: I mean, I think, you know, I think with the NCAAA, 467 00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:31,040 Speaker 3: and in terms of how they're shaping it, they to 468 00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:33,920 Speaker 3: uphold the integrity of the game. They don't want anyone 469 00:24:34,080 --> 00:24:36,680 Speaker 3: to participate in any type of gambling, and I think 470 00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:39,199 Speaker 3: that's going to be their firm answer tied to this. 471 00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:42,720 Speaker 3: I think all these workarounds how people are going to 472 00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:45,480 Speaker 3: potentially get around this. I think if they find or 473 00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:50,639 Speaker 3: track anyone that participated in any type of gambling outside 474 00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:53,359 Speaker 3: of the scope of you probably saw the exceptions tied 475 00:24:53,400 --> 00:24:58,760 Speaker 3: to the UFC, NASCAR, or horse I think horse race, 476 00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:02,680 Speaker 3: anything tied not to directly to a specific sport, that's 477 00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:07,040 Speaker 3: like an exception. So that's where I think it's going 478 00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:09,320 Speaker 3: to be, and I think it's gonna continue to be 479 00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:11,400 Speaker 3: like that on an ongoing basis. I don't think they're 480 00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:13,680 Speaker 3: going to shape it anything more than that. I think 481 00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:16,639 Speaker 3: from in terms of my actual opinion in terms of 482 00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:20,760 Speaker 3: the uniformity across all the states and how gambling is 483 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:24,760 Speaker 3: set up between online lottery based I think there has 484 00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:28,080 Speaker 3: to be more consistency so that people, you know, they 485 00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:31,200 Speaker 3: don't just say, oh, well, I didn't know, because that's 486 00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:33,840 Speaker 3: what oftentimes someone's going to say, I didn't know. 487 00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:37,719 Speaker 1: That's what I always I didn't know. 488 00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:41,879 Speaker 4: So compare and contrast the legal implications of professional players 489 00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:46,399 Speaker 4: violating sports betting policies versus college athletes, where you could 490 00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:50,200 Speaker 4: more plausibly argue I don't know because the kid is eighteen. 491 00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:53,879 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean in terms of like say, like an 492 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:57,080 Speaker 3: NCAAA athlete, like you kind of know you can't do it. 493 00:25:57,240 --> 00:26:01,880 Speaker 3: In terms of professional sports, you know, still it's more 494 00:26:01,920 --> 00:26:04,040 Speaker 3: often than not strict libel you still can't do it, 495 00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:06,800 Speaker 3: But it's how they go about doing it. You probably 496 00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:10,160 Speaker 3: saw what the Lions. A couple of the players got convicted, 497 00:26:10,200 --> 00:26:12,639 Speaker 3: you know, not actually, I mean they got released, but 498 00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:16,960 Speaker 3: then you know, they got suspended. So you really have 499 00:26:17,040 --> 00:26:20,080 Speaker 3: to look at whether you're a student athlete versus professional. 500 00:26:20,119 --> 00:26:23,080 Speaker 3: But I think in terms of like the generalities, the 501 00:26:23,119 --> 00:26:26,040 Speaker 3: answer is strictly just don't do it. 502 00:26:26,040 --> 00:26:29,040 Speaker 2: Doesn't get any even vision that you know, I just 503 00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:30,719 Speaker 2: want to shit, I want to pivot here. I mean, 504 00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:32,880 Speaker 2: you've done a lot of work obviously on sports gambling 505 00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:35,159 Speaker 2: and all that, but you know, in addition to that, 506 00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:38,320 Speaker 2: you advise some of the world's biggest superstar athletes on 507 00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:41,840 Speaker 2: a broad range of complex issues, equity investments, branding, and 508 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:46,000 Speaker 2: IP endorsement deals, endorsement deals. Talk to us about the 509 00:26:46,040 --> 00:26:50,080 Speaker 2: impact of FTX and sports gambling for that matter, on 510 00:26:50,160 --> 00:26:53,560 Speaker 2: these endorsement deals are more importantly the willingness of superstar athletes. 511 00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:55,600 Speaker 2: You know who I'm thinking. I'm thinking of Tom Brady 512 00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:58,000 Speaker 2: here to get involved with some of these companies, and 513 00:26:58,040 --> 00:27:02,000 Speaker 2: what due diligence must the athletes now do superstar athletes 514 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:03,760 Speaker 2: I'm talking before they get involved. 515 00:27:04,480 --> 00:27:06,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, you obviously have to know who you're 516 00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:09,800 Speaker 3: getting into bed with, right in terms of doing the 517 00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:13,760 Speaker 3: due diligence and then associating what the actual obligations are 518 00:27:13,960 --> 00:27:16,159 Speaker 3: of what you have to do tied to those deals. 519 00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:24,199 Speaker 3: More specifically, it's finding the actual deliverables so that you 520 00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:27,920 Speaker 3: can shape those deliverables to ensure that in terms of 521 00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:31,960 Speaker 3: knowing what you're doing, how you're doing it, what was 522 00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:35,720 Speaker 3: being told to you, so you're actually doing that fact 523 00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:39,720 Speaker 3: finding and actually knowing what you're doing so that there's 524 00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:45,400 Speaker 3: no ambiguity in front of you. So it's really knowing 525 00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:47,000 Speaker 3: who you're contracting with as well. 526 00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:51,439 Speaker 1: It's one thing if someone comes to me and you know, 527 00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:55,399 Speaker 1: old stupid bar Hi, I'm Michael Barr for crack. Okay, No, 528 00:27:55,560 --> 00:28:00,440 Speaker 1: I know perfectly well that it's not up above board. 529 00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:05,760 Speaker 1: But what happens when some of these companies really fool 530 00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:11,520 Speaker 1: the athletes involved. I mean, now there becomes a grade line. Well, 531 00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:12,479 Speaker 1: how much did you know? 532 00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:16,880 Speaker 3: That's that's what oftentimes gets put forth in the court 533 00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:19,879 Speaker 3: of law in terms of looking at the fact finding, 534 00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:23,720 Speaker 3: seeing how it was gray, what was what was put forth? 535 00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:26,760 Speaker 3: What wasn't put forth? Right, because you won't know everything. 536 00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:29,560 Speaker 3: When you do, you know your diligence and you sign 537 00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:31,960 Speaker 3: your name to the agreement, so you really have to 538 00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:34,520 Speaker 3: know who you're going to be working with, and then 539 00:28:35,040 --> 00:28:38,200 Speaker 3: take that a step further knowing that if something does 540 00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:42,200 Speaker 3: go south, how do you resolve the situation and who 541 00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:43,280 Speaker 3: is actually on the hook. 542 00:28:43,520 --> 00:28:45,200 Speaker 2: Just to chime in here, I mean, do we really 543 00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:47,600 Speaker 2: believe that Tom Brady's going to have to fork over 544 00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:49,680 Speaker 2: a lot of money on the back of all this? 545 00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:51,920 Speaker 2: I mean, do you see that being a strong possibility. 546 00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:53,280 Speaker 1: I think it. 547 00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:55,800 Speaker 3: Always comes down to what was actually put in the agreement? 548 00:28:56,520 --> 00:29:00,760 Speaker 4: Yeah, the fine print. Okay, Steve, I got to pivot 549 00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:02,560 Speaker 4: a little bit here and get your thoughts on the 550 00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:05,040 Speaker 4: overall macro environment because we spend a lot of time 551 00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:07,920 Speaker 4: talking about the economy where it's headed, and things are 552 00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:12,080 Speaker 4: definitely slowing down. Interest rates have been rising, credit is tightening. 553 00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:14,760 Speaker 4: A lot of people warn that a credit crunch is coming. 554 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:18,240 Speaker 4: This obviously has a huge impact on the world of sports, 555 00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:22,600 Speaker 4: especially because valuations have gotten very high. Sports is seen 556 00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:27,120 Speaker 4: as an uncorrelated asset class compared to all the traditional 557 00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:30,280 Speaker 4: asset classes, and teams relying on a lot of debt 558 00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:34,760 Speaker 4: for everything financing their arenas or facilities. All the debt 559 00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:38,280 Speaker 4: is inevitably priced off of US treasuries. From where you sit, 560 00:29:38,320 --> 00:29:40,320 Speaker 4: and I know you're not a sports banker, but how 561 00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:44,280 Speaker 4: much more complicated is the environment right now given the 562 00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:48,400 Speaker 4: overall rise in bar and costs for anyone? 563 00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:52,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that's a great question. I mean, across 564 00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:56,960 Speaker 3: the league, there's various metrics in terms of debt limits 565 00:29:56,960 --> 00:29:58,920 Speaker 3: of what you can take on and how much of 566 00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:02,280 Speaker 3: that debt restrictions can actually in terms of a lot 567 00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:06,120 Speaker 3: of these deals like what actually is allowed right. So, 568 00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:09,160 Speaker 3: more often than not, to answer your question, it's you 569 00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:12,560 Speaker 3: have to really know that depending on the client, you 570 00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:15,240 Speaker 3: have to look at that good old fashioned financial statement 571 00:30:15,480 --> 00:30:17,400 Speaker 3: and see you if they actually have the money right, 572 00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:20,560 Speaker 3: because more often than not, a lot of these deals 573 00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:24,360 Speaker 3: there's a combination of debt plus cash that they're putting forth. 574 00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:28,080 Speaker 3: And then more importantly, when you start rounding out who's 575 00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:30,120 Speaker 3: going to be associated to a lot of these deals. 576 00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:34,840 Speaker 3: It's finding the strategic capital alongside that lead investor that's 577 00:30:34,880 --> 00:30:38,080 Speaker 3: going to put forth the money and then round it 578 00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:43,920 Speaker 3: out and shape that deal accordingly based off of who's involved, 579 00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:46,840 Speaker 3: how much money do they truly have, what are they 580 00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:50,600 Speaker 3: willing to put them forth? In terms of you know, 581 00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:53,680 Speaker 3: looking at the pie and kind of cutting the pie up. 582 00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:58,400 Speaker 4: So are you seeing any meaningful slowdown or even acceleration 583 00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:01,920 Speaker 4: in the pace of deals or wanting to get stuff 584 00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:05,680 Speaker 4: taken care of because there is this huge amount of 585 00:31:05,720 --> 00:31:07,080 Speaker 4: uncertainty ahead of us. 586 00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:09,880 Speaker 3: Well, a lot of these assets, I mean, and you 587 00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:12,200 Speaker 3: said it, they're uncorrelated to the market, so they are 588 00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:14,880 Speaker 3: nice and shiny assets. So I think what you have 589 00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:17,520 Speaker 3: to look at is like anytime there's a good asset 590 00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:20,240 Speaker 3: on the table and people are looking to buy it, 591 00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:23,640 Speaker 3: the question is is like can the deal actually be 592 00:31:24,280 --> 00:31:25,720 Speaker 3: done and at what price? 593 00:31:25,920 --> 00:31:26,080 Speaker 1: Right? 594 00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:29,120 Speaker 3: Because the valuation keeps going up and then you know, 595 00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:33,200 Speaker 3: do you have enough ready available, willing buyers to actually 596 00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:37,040 Speaker 3: buy that asset? And so I think it's finding out 597 00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:41,160 Speaker 3: who actually will take that step. Because if you think 598 00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:45,080 Speaker 3: about look at like the Carolina Panthers. Wow, we thought 599 00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:47,600 Speaker 3: this was like, oh my god, David Tepper paid so 600 00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:50,960 Speaker 3: much money for it. Then you see the Waltons right, 601 00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:52,520 Speaker 3: and it's like double So. 602 00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:54,160 Speaker 1: You always have. 603 00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:59,120 Speaker 3: Ready, available, willing buyers. The question is are you going 604 00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:01,320 Speaker 3: to have that person in that When you start looking 605 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:04,400 Speaker 3: at how many people can actually stroke the check of 606 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:08,600 Speaker 3: being able to just put forth a real bid, depending 607 00:32:08,800 --> 00:32:12,080 Speaker 3: at what level, I think it becomes complicated because think 608 00:32:12,080 --> 00:32:14,560 Speaker 3: about how many people are out there and in terms 609 00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:16,840 Speaker 3: of realistically that can just strike that check. 610 00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:19,400 Speaker 4: More than we realize I think is the answer. 611 00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:21,880 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, And then you know, a lot of it 612 00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:23,959 Speaker 3: just happens to how the leagues are going to open up, 613 00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:27,520 Speaker 3: whether they want sovereign wealth funds associated to league ownership. 614 00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:31,760 Speaker 1: Our Needo guy Tom Keane, and he brought this up 615 00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:34,400 Speaker 1: while we were talking earlier, and it's a very good 616 00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:37,880 Speaker 1: point because shifting a little bit here, because of the 617 00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:42,760 Speaker 1: rule changes in baseball, more people now are looking at 618 00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:47,640 Speaker 1: that as a bang zoom investment because more fans now 619 00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:52,000 Speaker 1: are getting engaged, the games are shorter, and more people 620 00:32:52,280 --> 00:32:53,440 Speaker 1: are starting to enjoy it. 621 00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:55,600 Speaker 4: There's a renaissance in baseball like a lot I. 622 00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:58,280 Speaker 1: Know, I know, I know it scared me too, But. 623 00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:02,280 Speaker 2: I mean, guys, we don't have Steve in the studio 624 00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:03,840 Speaker 2: very often. Can I ask him a real question? 625 00:33:03,880 --> 00:33:06,640 Speaker 7: Please? I mean, Steve, you know you get comfortable. 626 00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:07,320 Speaker 3: I'm starting to get the. 627 00:33:07,960 --> 00:33:11,200 Speaker 2: You're speaking to everyone out there. You know I'm hearing 628 00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:12,600 Speaker 2: and I take you know, I'm just going to go 629 00:33:12,600 --> 00:33:13,920 Speaker 2: out on a limb. I know your office is on 630 00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:16,080 Speaker 2: far from our own. That you might be a New 631 00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:18,480 Speaker 2: York chet fan, you might be an Aaron Rodgers fan, 632 00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:22,920 Speaker 2: potentially r X three, Kevin Durant thirty five ventures. What 633 00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:24,360 Speaker 2: are these guys investing in? 634 00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:24,600 Speaker 1: You know? 635 00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:26,280 Speaker 2: What are you hearing from these guys? I mean, how 636 00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:29,520 Speaker 2: are they lending their names, their brands and how are 637 00:33:29,520 --> 00:33:31,920 Speaker 2: they growing businesses? What are you seeing out there? 638 00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:34,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, so I do a lot of these deals. So 639 00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:38,360 Speaker 3: I can tell you with some of the most high profile, 640 00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:42,719 Speaker 3: most prolific talent, I have the pleasure to work with 641 00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:46,400 Speaker 3: some really big names. I could tell you it's finding 642 00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:49,640 Speaker 3: the right opportunities Number one too, there's always a cash 643 00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:52,720 Speaker 3: plus an equity component and to how they can actually 644 00:33:52,760 --> 00:33:56,280 Speaker 3: monetize and activate those businesses based off the talent. So 645 00:33:56,360 --> 00:33:58,920 Speaker 3: you have to fit and match and this is where 646 00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:01,640 Speaker 3: the truly the team comes into place, where you can 647 00:34:01,720 --> 00:34:05,240 Speaker 3: find the right opportunities where they could help activate. It's 648 00:34:05,240 --> 00:34:09,080 Speaker 3: not more so that you just either place an investment 649 00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:11,640 Speaker 3: in a company and hope that it pans out. I 650 00:34:11,680 --> 00:34:14,560 Speaker 3: think truly it's finding the right ones where you can 651 00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:21,120 Speaker 3: actually see the benefit of having that celebrity endorser. But 652 00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:23,080 Speaker 3: I see quite a bit. I mean you're starting to. 653 00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:25,919 Speaker 3: I mean in terms of you could probably see look 654 00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:31,280 Speaker 3: at what Ryan Reynolds and what he just was able 655 00:34:31,320 --> 00:34:34,640 Speaker 3: to do with MINT. I mean, every single day, I 656 00:34:34,680 --> 00:34:37,680 Speaker 3: feel like there's like a new celebrity endorser that is 657 00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:39,880 Speaker 3: coming out with something I. 658 00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:41,799 Speaker 1: Don't want to bring back what we're talking about with 659 00:34:41,880 --> 00:34:46,640 Speaker 1: the online gambling. Yes, on the other side, they're the 660 00:34:46,760 --> 00:34:51,080 Speaker 1: NCAA employees that can get in trouble. Can the online 661 00:34:51,239 --> 00:34:56,400 Speaker 1: gamblers and online sites get in trouble for all of 662 00:34:56,440 --> 00:34:57,440 Speaker 1: these controversies. 663 00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:03,960 Speaker 3: That's a great question. I mean, I think in theory, 664 00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:07,200 Speaker 3: depending on once once who it goes back to, right 665 00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:10,560 Speaker 3: and how they go about shaping that bet right. So, 666 00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:17,040 Speaker 3: if you're associated with a school or you're employed by 667 00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:20,600 Speaker 3: that specific entity, then you'd have to look to see 668 00:35:21,160 --> 00:35:25,240 Speaker 3: where the kind of where the trail is going, because 669 00:35:25,239 --> 00:35:28,840 Speaker 3: I think again it's it also comes down to, uh, 670 00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:30,080 Speaker 3: you can't do it right. 671 00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:33,319 Speaker 4: Some dummy is going to use their school email address. 672 00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:36,560 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, well, and that's where I think that's where 673 00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:39,279 Speaker 3: the investigation comes open. So right, if you use that 674 00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:42,320 Speaker 3: school email address and then they go do the fact 675 00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,239 Speaker 3: finding that they're associated with the school, that could be 676 00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:45,879 Speaker 3: the trip up. 677 00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:50,800 Speaker 1: I see, Dail, It's a lot. 678 00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:51,520 Speaker 3: It's a lot. 679 00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:56,360 Speaker 1: I'm dead serious. I know you love the Jets, Damien, 680 00:35:56,440 --> 00:36:00,680 Speaker 1: but I was dead serious man about sports in improving 681 00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:05,600 Speaker 1: their brand. Baseball did it. Football could do it well, 682 00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:08,400 Speaker 1: I guess, you know, because they are the you know, 683 00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:12,840 Speaker 1: the king. But do the other sports need the follow 684 00:36:12,920 --> 00:36:17,799 Speaker 1: suit so that there's more fan engagement and i e 685 00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:19,000 Speaker 1: more money involved. 686 00:36:19,960 --> 00:36:22,319 Speaker 2: I think the question though, Michael, there is you know, 687 00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:26,240 Speaker 2: at the risk of, you know, of undermining the game itself. 688 00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:28,080 Speaker 2: You know, I mean like sometimes when you try to 689 00:36:28,080 --> 00:36:30,360 Speaker 2: tweak the game too much and you make too many changes, 690 00:36:31,000 --> 00:36:33,040 Speaker 2: you know, you could lose audience that way. So I 691 00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:35,200 Speaker 2: get the tug of war there, I get the push 692 00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:37,520 Speaker 2: and pull. I think baseball was long overdue for an 693 00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:40,480 Speaker 2: overhaul in this case, I think we're just scratching the surface. 694 00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:45,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I agree, man, it's you know, trust me, 695 00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:50,080 Speaker 1: the baseball renaissance. I agree with you. Man, Steve, you 696 00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:50,720 Speaker 1: are the man. 697 00:36:50,840 --> 00:36:53,040 Speaker 3: I mean, I gotta say this. I think the Jets 698 00:36:53,040 --> 00:36:55,600 Speaker 3: are gonna be awesome. I mean, I mean, how does 699 00:36:55,719 --> 00:36:59,040 Speaker 3: anyone think that, like, oh, Aaron Rodgers, was it gonna 700 00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:01,120 Speaker 3: forget how to play? I mean, come on, I. 701 00:37:01,120 --> 00:37:03,160 Speaker 7: Mean, the guy's one of the greatest when to New York. 702 00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:07,520 Speaker 3: So I mean they are stacked. They are stacked. 703 00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:10,640 Speaker 2: Like, just keep talking, Steve, I keep going. 704 00:37:11,239 --> 00:37:13,879 Speaker 3: I mean if you're thinking about look at how they're 705 00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:16,799 Speaker 3: building and shaping that roster. It's fantastic. 706 00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:20,080 Speaker 2: I mean on the coaching staff, it's all coming together. 707 00:37:20,200 --> 00:37:22,680 Speaker 3: I mean like, I mean, it's gonna be was it? 708 00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:25,000 Speaker 3: What's that? J E T? 709 00:37:26,160 --> 00:37:28,680 Speaker 1: What is it? Any think, Damien? 710 00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:30,360 Speaker 3: Until I got help. 711 00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:32,640 Speaker 2: Us out here. 712 00:37:33,560 --> 00:37:34,920 Speaker 1: Well, we like to thank fireman. 713 00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:37,360 Speaker 2: It's gonna be a fun season. It's it's it's a 714 00:37:37,400 --> 00:37:39,360 Speaker 2: great time for New York sports, to say the least. 715 00:37:39,520 --> 00:37:43,440 Speaker 1: Oh Man. Steve Allen, a chair of Sports and Entertainment 716 00:37:43,480 --> 00:37:46,919 Speaker 1: practice at the law firm Mints. Ah, you are the man. 717 00:37:47,000 --> 00:37:48,839 Speaker 1: You see you see the way we are now, it's 718 00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:51,839 Speaker 1: like we're at the dinner table eating and you know, 719 00:37:52,040 --> 00:37:54,759 Speaker 1: it's like someone didn't pass the roles and now we're 720 00:37:54,800 --> 00:37:57,319 Speaker 1: trying to you know, have a moment, and it's you know, 721 00:37:57,520 --> 00:38:00,600 Speaker 1: we we enjoy having you in the studio so much. 722 00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:02,719 Speaker 1: Thank you man, Thank you very much for having me. 723 00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:06,360 Speaker 1: Thank you kindly, old friend. Steve Olenick, Chair of the 724 00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:10,560 Speaker 1: Sports and Entertainment practice at leading law firm Mints. My 725 00:38:10,680 --> 00:38:12,200 Speaker 1: goal is to be the Num one pick bus. I'm 726 00:38:12,239 --> 00:38:13,279 Speaker 1: not in dream news and the kids. 727 00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:15,200 Speaker 8: Feels better to be number one than number five. 728 00:38:15,239 --> 00:38:16,480 Speaker 1: I'll wear a number because of Mike. 729 00:38:16,560 --> 00:38:18,120 Speaker 2: We have a chance to go for three in a row, 730 00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:19,279 Speaker 2: good numbers at a good time. 731 00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:21,360 Speaker 3: When I first started wearing that number, how we just 732 00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:22,320 Speaker 3: have you in proud. 733 00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:26,800 Speaker 1: Plumberg Business of Sports, the number of the week. Time 734 00:38:26,960 --> 00:38:30,280 Speaker 1: now for the number of the week. And just because 735 00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:34,799 Speaker 1: he loves the challenge, our own Kimvassin is going to 736 00:38:34,840 --> 00:38:38,080 Speaker 1: try to figure out if he can solve the puzzle. 737 00:38:38,680 --> 00:38:41,000 Speaker 1: I'm sorry, folks, I was a little ill, and. 738 00:38:41,000 --> 00:38:43,719 Speaker 4: So I was out for a you're collecting facts. 739 00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:46,600 Speaker 1: But I was collecting facts. And now we're going to 740 00:38:46,680 --> 00:38:49,480 Speaker 1: talk about the number of the week, and it's going 741 00:38:49,520 --> 00:38:52,879 Speaker 1: to be a twist because we're into the middle now 742 00:38:52,920 --> 00:38:57,600 Speaker 1: of the Triple Crown horse racing Triple Crown in nineteen 743 00:38:57,719 --> 00:39:01,360 Speaker 1: seventy eight, Affirmed won all three to win the Triple Crown. 744 00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:06,359 Speaker 1: But there was another horse, AlIdar, to do something in 745 00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:09,640 Speaker 1: that year racing in those three races, the Kentucky Derby, 746 00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:13,040 Speaker 1: the Breakness and the Belmont. What I want to know 747 00:39:13,239 --> 00:39:17,040 Speaker 1: is what did Aladar do? And it is the only 748 00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:19,719 Speaker 1: horse to do this. 749 00:39:19,719 --> 00:39:20,680 Speaker 4: This is not a number. 750 00:39:21,080 --> 00:39:22,760 Speaker 1: This is a This has a number. 751 00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:23,560 Speaker 4: This has a number. 752 00:39:23,640 --> 00:39:24,279 Speaker 1: Yes, it does. 753 00:39:25,520 --> 00:39:28,040 Speaker 2: I mean, I'm gonna laugh, and I'm gonna I don't know. 754 00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:30,480 Speaker 2: He came in top three in all three races, my 755 00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:31,319 Speaker 2: guess yeah? 756 00:39:31,320 --> 00:39:32,840 Speaker 7: Did he get second all three times? 757 00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:35,360 Speaker 1: You know what? This is why we got kim here. 758 00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:37,640 Speaker 7: That's right, Oh my god. 759 00:39:38,160 --> 00:39:41,440 Speaker 1: Is the only horse in the history of the Triple 760 00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:45,760 Speaker 1: Crown to come in second in all three races. 761 00:39:45,840 --> 00:39:48,439 Speaker 10: The two are heads apart and Elidir's gotta lead. Eli 762 00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:50,120 Speaker 10: put it ahead in front right in the middle of 763 00:39:50,160 --> 00:39:53,080 Speaker 10: the stretch. It's Ali dar On Affirmed battling back along 764 00:39:53,120 --> 00:39:56,720 Speaker 10: the inside. We'll test these two to the wire, Affirmed under. 765 00:39:56,520 --> 00:39:57,400 Speaker 7: Our left hand whip. 766 00:39:57,520 --> 00:40:01,040 Speaker 10: ELI are on the outside driving affirmed our heads apart. 767 00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:02,759 Speaker 10: The firm's got a nose in front of it. 768 00:40:02,880 --> 00:40:05,080 Speaker 4: Come on the way, O fun. 769 00:40:05,560 --> 00:40:07,799 Speaker 1: I felt so bad for that horse. I felt so 770 00:40:07,880 --> 00:40:08,319 Speaker 1: bad for. 771 00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:13,040 Speaker 4: The owners when he came in second place, not even third. Wow, 772 00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:16,160 Speaker 4: when you come in second, there's no accolade for that, 773 00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:17,759 Speaker 4: right you lost. 774 00:40:17,600 --> 00:40:21,600 Speaker 8: If you lost, but like there's betting issues that happened. Yeah, 775 00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:24,120 Speaker 8: top three, right on the top three. 776 00:40:24,200 --> 00:40:27,080 Speaker 2: Okay, Plus you know, I'm sure I'm hungry right now. 777 00:40:27,080 --> 00:40:27,879 Speaker 2: I could eat a horse. 778 00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:33,640 Speaker 1: This is the Bloomberg Business of Sports Show, and we 779 00:40:33,719 --> 00:40:35,719 Speaker 1: are here each and every week at the same time, 780 00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:38,759 Speaker 1: plus online wherever you get your podcast. I'm Michael Barr 781 00:40:38,840 --> 00:40:40,640 Speaker 1: on Twitter at Big Bar Sports, and. 782 00:40:40,520 --> 00:40:43,000 Speaker 2: I'm on Twitter at Scarlett Foo and I'm on Twitter 783 00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:44,120 Speaker 2: at the Sas Hour. 784 00:40:44,480 --> 00:40:47,160 Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us. Tune in again next week for 785 00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:50,120 Speaker 1: the latest stories moving big money in the world of sports. 786 00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:53,880 Speaker 1: Stick around. We've got a special bonus conversation up next 787 00:40:54,160 --> 00:40:56,759 Speaker 1: with the co founders of a new basketball team in 788 00:40:56,800 --> 00:41:00,440 Speaker 1: South Africa. This is the Bloomberg Business of Sports Show 789 00:41:00,600 --> 00:41:09,200 Speaker 1: from Bloomberg Radio around the world. Thanks for joining us 790 00:41:09,280 --> 00:41:12,320 Speaker 1: for the Bloomberg Business of Sports show. I'm Michael Barr. 791 00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:15,600 Speaker 1: We talked about it earlier in the show. The NBA 792 00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:19,640 Speaker 1: is looking to expand more markets, especially in Africa. The 793 00:41:19,719 --> 00:41:22,919 Speaker 1: league is doubling down on investment in the region through 794 00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:28,160 Speaker 1: NBA Africa and more. In this special Bonus conversation, Bloomberg 795 00:41:28,239 --> 00:41:32,200 Speaker 1: Business of Sports contributor Don Kissy spoke with Chauntae Butler 796 00:41:32,600 --> 00:41:35,680 Speaker 1: and Dia Martin. They're part of a team of co 797 00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:38,880 Speaker 1: founding partners in the Cape Town Tigers, a new South 798 00:41:39,000 --> 00:41:43,759 Speaker 1: African pro team competing in the Basketball Africa League. They 799 00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:47,080 Speaker 1: spoke about the league, the positive impact beyond the court 800 00:41:47,200 --> 00:41:51,120 Speaker 1: that basketball is having in Africa, and why they chose 801 00:41:51,160 --> 00:41:53,440 Speaker 1: to dive into the project. Let's take a listen. 802 00:41:53,719 --> 00:41:56,719 Speaker 11: Well, I think the attraction in general to be a 803 00:41:56,760 --> 00:42:02,320 Speaker 11: part of the NBA basketball affcultly was just the opportunity 804 00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:06,319 Speaker 11: to build something from the ground up, be associated with 805 00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:11,279 Speaker 11: an organization like the NBA, and also to really be 806 00:42:12,520 --> 00:42:15,960 Speaker 11: in the continent in South Africa and really looking at 807 00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:18,600 Speaker 11: the impact that we can have on community, the impact 808 00:42:18,600 --> 00:42:21,880 Speaker 11: that we can have on women, and that really drew 809 00:42:22,200 --> 00:42:26,280 Speaker 11: me to the opportunity and with that I was able 810 00:42:26,360 --> 00:42:30,200 Speaker 11: to bring India and I think South Africa is just 811 00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:34,520 Speaker 11: where the opportunity presented itself. Our other business partner brought 812 00:42:34,560 --> 00:42:38,920 Speaker 11: the opportunity initially to me, and the opportunity South Africa 813 00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:42,480 Speaker 11: didn't have a national team, a club that was built 814 00:42:42,520 --> 00:42:45,480 Speaker 11: just to participate in the bal So we really just 815 00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:48,319 Speaker 11: took advantage of timing and being in the right place 816 00:42:48,320 --> 00:42:49,000 Speaker 11: at the right time. 817 00:42:49,760 --> 00:42:54,960 Speaker 12: Sounds good, talk about the bl no connection there, right, 818 00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:58,239 Speaker 12: Your business partner came to you with this opportunity and 819 00:42:58,920 --> 00:43:02,560 Speaker 12: what triggered you? So it sparked your interests? Okay, he's 820 00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:04,560 Speaker 12: a friend and a business partner, but there had to 821 00:43:04,600 --> 00:43:07,359 Speaker 12: have been something more. Yeah. 822 00:43:07,480 --> 00:43:11,880 Speaker 11: I think really for me, it was about the opportunity 823 00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:16,040 Speaker 11: to really build from the ground up, build a legacy 824 00:43:17,320 --> 00:43:22,360 Speaker 11: and really have direct impact on community, on young women. 825 00:43:23,920 --> 00:43:26,239 Speaker 11: The other part of that is that d and I 826 00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:28,440 Speaker 11: have known each other since I was a freshman in 827 00:43:28,480 --> 00:43:33,000 Speaker 11: college and we had talked about doing something together and 828 00:43:33,040 --> 00:43:35,960 Speaker 11: so this opportunity presented itself and so it is a 829 00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:38,560 Speaker 11: perfect time, perfect store for us to work together. 830 00:43:39,239 --> 00:43:42,840 Speaker 13: I think it's also important to look at the demographics. 831 00:43:43,120 --> 00:43:46,680 Speaker 13: This is part of an expansion of the NBA and 832 00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:50,280 Speaker 13: FIBA into Africa. And when you look at the demographics, 833 00:43:50,320 --> 00:43:52,680 Speaker 13: the high growth rate, the growth of the middle class 834 00:43:52,719 --> 00:43:57,480 Speaker 13: across the continent, it offers an exciting business opportunity that 835 00:43:57,560 --> 00:44:00,200 Speaker 13: in some ways is a once in a lifetime opportunity 836 00:44:00,600 --> 00:44:03,719 Speaker 13: to get in at the ground floor, working with an 837 00:44:03,880 --> 00:44:08,520 Speaker 13: established organization to build a high growth sport across the 838 00:44:08,560 --> 00:44:09,240 Speaker 13: New Continent. 839 00:44:09,400 --> 00:44:11,600 Speaker 12: Do you have any history on the Cape Town Tigers 840 00:44:12,280 --> 00:44:15,279 Speaker 12: and aside from this opportunity, what was the attraction. It's 841 00:44:15,320 --> 00:44:17,959 Speaker 12: a young team, it's a young league if anything, it's 842 00:44:18,000 --> 00:44:21,359 Speaker 12: all still in its infancy, and two American women with 843 00:44:21,680 --> 00:44:24,560 Speaker 12: no connection to the continent make an investment and have 844 00:44:24,880 --> 00:44:27,239 Speaker 12: essentially propelled this team to the top of its game 845 00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:29,000 Speaker 12: on the continent. Talk about that. 846 00:44:29,239 --> 00:44:32,360 Speaker 13: So I'd say one of the things is as African 847 00:44:32,480 --> 00:44:36,319 Speaker 13: American women, I think there is that diaspora connection and 848 00:44:36,360 --> 00:44:38,799 Speaker 13: that's part of the strong story that we have. So 849 00:44:38,840 --> 00:44:43,000 Speaker 13: we have a predominantly African American and African partnership, and 850 00:44:43,040 --> 00:44:45,920 Speaker 13: so there was that belief in the growth of Africa 851 00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:49,120 Speaker 13: and the opportunity to invest, so that there was that 852 00:44:49,280 --> 00:44:53,080 Speaker 13: very strong connection. I also think what's exciting for us 853 00:44:53,400 --> 00:44:55,840 Speaker 13: Cape Town Tigers is a new team that we started 854 00:44:55,880 --> 00:44:59,200 Speaker 13: that we found it, but we're also able to help 855 00:44:59,280 --> 00:45:03,440 Speaker 13: to spur develop and increase the attraction and the impact 856 00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:06,680 Speaker 13: of basketball within the country. So when we look at it, 857 00:45:06,719 --> 00:45:09,160 Speaker 13: we don't look at it as just basketball. We look 858 00:45:09,160 --> 00:45:13,080 Speaker 13: at it as basketball arts, fashion, culture. And when you 859 00:45:13,120 --> 00:45:18,319 Speaker 13: look at the dynamic I guess composition of our partner group, 860 00:45:18,360 --> 00:45:21,680 Speaker 13: we're able to take all of that into account, building 861 00:45:21,719 --> 00:45:25,560 Speaker 13: our team, our franchise, but also building the ecosystem for 862 00:45:25,640 --> 00:45:27,080 Speaker 13: basketball in the country. 863 00:45:27,600 --> 00:45:29,759 Speaker 12: You mentioned the word ecosystem, and we do hear that 864 00:45:29,840 --> 00:45:32,480 Speaker 12: a lot in business. People are always building an ecosystem, 865 00:45:32,600 --> 00:45:36,600 Speaker 12: navigating through one the ecosystem when you mention it, do 866 00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:39,960 Speaker 12: you refer to South Africa or the subcontinent as a whole? 867 00:45:40,040 --> 00:45:42,279 Speaker 12: Because it is a league and for example, this week, 868 00:45:42,320 --> 00:45:45,320 Speaker 12: we have games being played in Egypt, of all places, 869 00:45:45,760 --> 00:45:49,239 Speaker 12: and I don't know, the average NBA fan walking down 870 00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:53,360 Speaker 12: the street probably isn't thinking of basketball games being played 871 00:45:53,360 --> 00:45:55,600 Speaker 12: in Cairo right now, but they are and these are 872 00:45:55,600 --> 00:45:56,520 Speaker 12: professional players. 873 00:45:56,920 --> 00:46:01,120 Speaker 11: Yeah, I think when it's the global system, right, so 874 00:46:01,239 --> 00:46:05,239 Speaker 11: it's not just looking at South Africa, it really is 875 00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:08,400 Speaker 11: looking at one. How do you first build it in 876 00:46:08,520 --> 00:46:11,960 Speaker 11: Cape Town and spread that and build that grassroots following, 877 00:46:12,280 --> 00:46:14,520 Speaker 11: but then looking at South Africa and then looking at 878 00:46:14,520 --> 00:46:15,520 Speaker 11: the continent. 879 00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:15,600 Speaker 7: As a whole. 880 00:46:15,640 --> 00:46:18,480 Speaker 11: So how do all these clubs come together and support 881 00:46:18,560 --> 00:46:20,680 Speaker 11: what the bal is trying to do, which is to 882 00:46:20,840 --> 00:46:23,960 Speaker 11: use basketball not only from a development perspective, but from 883 00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:28,239 Speaker 11: an economic opportunity perspective for all these different countries, all 884 00:46:28,280 --> 00:46:33,120 Speaker 11: these different communities. And it really is the opportunity to 885 00:46:33,560 --> 00:46:37,120 Speaker 11: take that and take it globally and expand that and 886 00:46:37,239 --> 00:46:42,439 Speaker 11: leverage the diaspora. As Dia said, our partnership represents that, right, 887 00:46:42,560 --> 00:46:45,799 Speaker 11: represents that access to all these different avenues and just 888 00:46:45,880 --> 00:46:48,320 Speaker 11: one thing to add to that, we have that unique 889 00:46:48,360 --> 00:46:51,799 Speaker 11: perspective and being able to take our team globally. So 890 00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:54,359 Speaker 11: last year we had our New York City tour during 891 00:46:54,400 --> 00:46:57,120 Speaker 11: the off season and this year we'll do the same 892 00:46:57,160 --> 00:47:00,040 Speaker 11: as well. So we really see ourselves as building a 893 00:46:59,840 --> 00:47:02,200 Speaker 11: global team with the Caketown Tigers. 894 00:47:02,480 --> 00:47:06,759 Speaker 12: I like that word global. Basketball is if anything, it's universal. Yeah, 895 00:47:06,800 --> 00:47:09,600 Speaker 12: but that's one game. You know, Soccer is the beautiful game, 896 00:47:09,600 --> 00:47:13,480 Speaker 12: but basketball is its own thing all over the world. Right, 897 00:47:13,520 --> 00:47:15,759 Speaker 12: you need a net and a ball and you're good. 898 00:47:16,000 --> 00:47:18,080 Speaker 12: As with soccer, you need a net and a ball 899 00:47:18,320 --> 00:47:25,359 Speaker 12: and you're good. The diaspora effect, how has it helped you? 900 00:47:25,360 --> 00:47:28,439 Speaker 12: You mentioned diaspora. You've gone into a country that I'm 901 00:47:28,480 --> 00:47:30,759 Speaker 12: going to assume that you're not too familiar with. What 902 00:47:30,880 --> 00:47:33,840 Speaker 12: has the reception been in South Africa. 903 00:47:34,400 --> 00:47:39,200 Speaker 11: It's been really great, Like it's this organic development and 904 00:47:39,320 --> 00:47:43,440 Speaker 11: fanned fan base. And I will say we've been very 905 00:47:43,560 --> 00:47:47,520 Speaker 11: intentional about bringing the community along with us, and that 906 00:47:47,640 --> 00:47:51,880 Speaker 11: really has been a differentiator of spending time in the community. 907 00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:57,240 Speaker 11: We practice in the community, doing different events, different runs, 908 00:47:57,239 --> 00:48:01,040 Speaker 11: bringing the kids along, supporting junior team and a young 909 00:48:01,080 --> 00:48:05,319 Speaker 11: women's team. So that's been really important to us. And 910 00:48:05,360 --> 00:48:08,040 Speaker 11: as we continue to grow and build, we want to 911 00:48:08,040 --> 00:48:12,319 Speaker 11: do that more, like we're doing a kids camp this year, 912 00:48:12,440 --> 00:48:16,040 Speaker 11: so really trying to help build the infrastructure of basketball. 913 00:48:16,080 --> 00:48:18,799 Speaker 11: It is definitely a global sport, but still if you 914 00:48:18,840 --> 00:48:21,680 Speaker 11: look at Africa, there's still this infrastructure building that needs 915 00:48:21,680 --> 00:48:24,000 Speaker 11: to be done and so that's a big part of 916 00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:25,439 Speaker 11: our community part as well. 917 00:48:26,520 --> 00:48:28,399 Speaker 12: Can you talk a little bit about your quote, your 918 00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:31,600 Speaker 12: front office, the talent, the managers, through your development team 919 00:48:31,719 --> 00:48:37,239 Speaker 12: on the ground. You are both working professional American women, educated, connected, 920 00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:41,720 Speaker 12: well resourced. How are you dealing with this from across 921 00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:44,839 Speaker 12: the world. I don't know if you're in Cape Town 922 00:48:44,840 --> 00:48:48,279 Speaker 12: every week or every month, what's it like managing it 923 00:48:48,320 --> 00:48:48,760 Speaker 12: from afar. 924 00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:53,319 Speaker 11: Well, we're lucky that we have one investment partner who's 925 00:48:53,320 --> 00:48:58,640 Speaker 11: actually in Egypt. Our other investment partner, Raphael Edwards, is 926 00:48:58,680 --> 00:49:02,759 Speaker 11: basically in Cape Town, so he is the CEO of 927 00:49:02,840 --> 00:49:05,720 Speaker 11: the basketball club, so of the Cape Town Tigers Basketball Club, 928 00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:09,040 Speaker 11: and he is managing on the ground right so managing 929 00:49:09,120 --> 00:49:13,399 Speaker 11: the talent, securing the talent with our other partner, William McFarlane. 930 00:49:13,560 --> 00:49:16,440 Speaker 11: They both were former professional basketball players so played all 931 00:49:16,480 --> 00:49:19,520 Speaker 11: over the world. We've also been really lucky through them 932 00:49:19,640 --> 00:49:25,520 Speaker 11: to secure local basketball talent in Cape talent and management. 933 00:49:25,840 --> 00:49:29,640 Speaker 11: One of our coaches is the former national player. One 934 00:49:29,680 --> 00:49:32,920 Speaker 11: of our coaches is also a former national coach for 935 00:49:33,040 --> 00:49:36,680 Speaker 11: South Africa. So we've been really lucky to be able 936 00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:39,480 Speaker 11: to have support on the ground and leadership on the 937 00:49:39,480 --> 00:49:42,880 Speaker 11: ground while Dia and I have been here running the 938 00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:47,319 Speaker 11: back end and more of the operations from the service level, investment. 939 00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:49,719 Speaker 2: Engagement and that type of thing. 940 00:49:49,880 --> 00:49:55,280 Speaker 13: And it's very intentional and that we want to empower players. 941 00:49:55,320 --> 00:49:58,600 Speaker 13: We also want to empower staff and business professionals. Locally. 942 00:49:59,080 --> 00:50:01,280 Speaker 13: So we really plan and to build up the team 943 00:50:01,400 --> 00:50:04,279 Speaker 13: by hiring and working with local professionals and those in 944 00:50:04,320 --> 00:50:05,440 Speaker 13: the communities that we're in. 945 00:50:06,120 --> 00:50:11,919 Speaker 12: I like those words professionals, communities, intentional. You mentioned Severus, right, 946 00:50:12,200 --> 00:50:14,520 Speaker 12: all of this was not done on a whim. It 947 00:50:14,560 --> 00:50:16,719 Speaker 12: was planned. Can you talk a little bit about this 948 00:50:16,800 --> 00:50:19,680 Speaker 12: holding company because when you hear oh I invested in 949 00:50:19,719 --> 00:50:22,480 Speaker 12: this team, you didn't just write a check and say goodbye. 950 00:50:22,520 --> 00:50:25,760 Speaker 12: Now like you set up a corporation in the US 951 00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:29,960 Speaker 12: in deliver this is your operating vehicle to do things 952 00:50:30,080 --> 00:50:30,920 Speaker 12: in another country. 953 00:50:30,920 --> 00:50:32,120 Speaker 2: Correct, talk about that. 954 00:50:32,719 --> 00:50:39,480 Speaker 11: Yeah, I mean Severus was the brainchild of Dia, myself 955 00:50:39,560 --> 00:50:43,040 Speaker 11: and our partner Rafael, the three of us coming together. 956 00:50:43,120 --> 00:50:45,480 Speaker 11: Like I said, Rafael brought the opportunity to me and 957 00:50:45,760 --> 00:50:49,239 Speaker 11: we formed Severus. We really thought it was important to 958 00:50:49,560 --> 00:50:54,640 Speaker 11: have this US entity, right to be the owner of 959 00:50:54,800 --> 00:50:58,759 Speaker 11: the Cape Town Tigers one again, to leverage those connections, 960 00:50:58,960 --> 00:51:02,200 Speaker 11: to leverage the diet, to really be able to drive. 961 00:51:02,280 --> 00:51:04,480 Speaker 11: We're based out of Delaware, we're here in New York. 962 00:51:04,760 --> 00:51:09,520 Speaker 11: To have connections to media, marketing, NBA, all of those things. 963 00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:13,359 Speaker 11: It was really important to have that organization and it 964 00:51:13,360 --> 00:51:19,000 Speaker 11: also helps in terms of separation, delineation of operations in business. 965 00:51:19,680 --> 00:51:23,200 Speaker 11: And we're also able to be Americans investing, you know, 966 00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:26,080 Speaker 11: in the continent of Africa. 967 00:51:26,200 --> 00:51:29,359 Speaker 12: Can you talk about the BAL for our listeners and 968 00:51:29,440 --> 00:51:37,000 Speaker 12: potentially our viewers NBA National Basketball Association BAL Basketball Africa League, 969 00:51:37,280 --> 00:51:38,359 Speaker 12: any relation or no? 970 00:51:40,080 --> 00:51:40,360 Speaker 2: Sure? 971 00:51:40,719 --> 00:51:44,440 Speaker 13: Yes. So the NBA partnered with FIBA to create the 972 00:51:44,480 --> 00:51:49,000 Speaker 13: Basketball Africa League to set up and expand the sport 973 00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:52,799 Speaker 13: throughout Africa. And the idea is by a joint partnership 974 00:51:52,840 --> 00:51:56,160 Speaker 13: working with FIBA that has operations and offices on the 975 00:51:56,239 --> 00:51:59,600 Speaker 13: ground and in different countries to be able to develop 976 00:51:59,600 --> 00:52:03,279 Speaker 13: the league organically and build up the ecosystem again of 977 00:52:03,320 --> 00:52:07,680 Speaker 13: basketball in each country to build the sport across the continent. 978 00:52:07,760 --> 00:52:11,320 Speaker 13: So it's very intentional and thoughtful and it's an amazing 979 00:52:11,440 --> 00:52:15,839 Speaker 13: organization that includes a number of very prominent investors from 980 00:52:15,920 --> 00:52:17,359 Speaker 13: across the diaspora as well. 981 00:52:17,600 --> 00:52:19,759 Speaker 12: Okay, can you talk a little bit more about the 982 00:52:19,800 --> 00:52:22,440 Speaker 12: diaspora as well. I know we touched on it, but 983 00:52:23,360 --> 00:52:26,520 Speaker 12: in your private circles, what has the feedback been? 984 00:52:27,480 --> 00:52:28,160 Speaker 7: Excitement? 985 00:52:28,680 --> 00:52:29,040 Speaker 2: Okay? 986 00:52:29,160 --> 00:52:31,400 Speaker 7: Aw, you know exactly. 987 00:52:31,480 --> 00:52:34,680 Speaker 12: I mean you're doing what Yeah, your friends, your friends 988 00:52:34,680 --> 00:52:36,279 Speaker 12: are like what you just wrote a check. I mean, 989 00:52:36,480 --> 00:52:39,359 Speaker 12: talk about what got you to sign the check. Yes, 990 00:52:39,400 --> 00:52:42,600 Speaker 12: you're building community, you're building legacy, but I'm sure this 991 00:52:42,719 --> 00:52:43,959 Speaker 12: wasn't a ten dollars check. 992 00:52:44,239 --> 00:52:47,840 Speaker 11: No, you know, when you're in it, you're just in it, 993 00:52:47,920 --> 00:52:50,080 Speaker 11: and you're just writing checks, you know what I mean, 994 00:52:50,120 --> 00:52:54,359 Speaker 11: and you're just reacting. But I think it really goes 995 00:52:54,440 --> 00:53:01,000 Speaker 11: back to the legacy that we know we're building, the example, 996 00:53:01,080 --> 00:53:02,840 Speaker 11: the impact that we know we're going to have on 997 00:53:02,920 --> 00:53:07,680 Speaker 11: women and in particular young women. You know that anything 998 00:53:07,760 --> 00:53:12,160 Speaker 11: is possible, even surpassing your dreams as possible. And so 999 00:53:12,239 --> 00:53:14,960 Speaker 11: I think for me, it's that piece. It's the piece 1000 00:53:15,000 --> 00:53:18,840 Speaker 11: of you know, being my mom's wildest dream come true. 1001 00:53:19,440 --> 00:53:24,000 Speaker 11: It's all of those emotional familial things. And like I said, 1002 00:53:24,040 --> 00:53:25,640 Speaker 11: de and I have known each other since we were 1003 00:53:25,880 --> 00:53:29,759 Speaker 11: since I was nineteen and you were seventeen, and so 1004 00:53:30,360 --> 00:53:32,520 Speaker 11: we go back and to be able to do this together, 1005 00:53:33,080 --> 00:53:33,920 Speaker 11: it's pretty amazing. 1006 00:53:33,960 --> 00:53:36,640 Speaker 12: It's incredible. It's the beautiful story for the beautiful game, right, 1007 00:53:36,800 --> 00:53:39,839 Speaker 12: the other beautiful game. So can you tell us what's next? 1008 00:53:39,880 --> 00:53:42,840 Speaker 12: I mean, talk about your season and destructure, what's the 1009 00:53:42,880 --> 00:53:46,239 Speaker 12: scheduling and the season like for you guys, and as investors, 1010 00:53:46,960 --> 00:53:48,680 Speaker 12: do you want more? Do you want less? Do you 1011 00:53:48,680 --> 00:53:50,719 Speaker 12: think it's just right? Do you think they should be 1012 00:53:50,800 --> 00:53:51,440 Speaker 12: doing more? 1013 00:53:51,680 --> 00:53:55,160 Speaker 13: I definitely think we have a very long term perspective 1014 00:53:55,280 --> 00:53:59,120 Speaker 13: and vision for Severus LLC, the Katee Town Tigers and 1015 00:53:59,160 --> 00:54:02,719 Speaker 13: the organization entity that we want to create, and so yes, 1016 00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:05,360 Speaker 13: we definitely want to do more, but we want to 1017 00:54:05,400 --> 00:54:08,320 Speaker 13: do it in a different way. Whenever I talk about 1018 00:54:08,360 --> 00:54:11,359 Speaker 13: investment and investors, I think about us in a sense. 1019 00:54:11,360 --> 00:54:15,320 Speaker 13: I always like to think we're democratizing capital for investment 1020 00:54:15,400 --> 00:54:18,360 Speaker 13: in sports. So one of the really exciting things is 1021 00:54:18,480 --> 00:54:20,960 Speaker 13: our family and friends have been so excited that we've 1022 00:54:21,000 --> 00:54:25,239 Speaker 13: been able to attract investors that aren't typically able to 1023 00:54:25,360 --> 00:54:29,360 Speaker 13: invest in teams, sports teams, professional sports teams to invest 1024 00:54:29,400 --> 00:54:31,840 Speaker 13: in us. So we have a lot of women investors 1025 00:54:31,840 --> 00:54:34,880 Speaker 13: across the diaspora, We have a lot of family and friends, 1026 00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:37,560 Speaker 13: and to be able to open up that pool of 1027 00:54:37,600 --> 00:54:40,080 Speaker 13: potential for investment has been amazing for us, as well 1028 00:54:40,120 --> 00:54:42,440 Speaker 13: as the example that we've set for our nieces and 1029 00:54:42,480 --> 00:54:44,799 Speaker 13: our cousins and our community for. 1030 00:54:44,760 --> 00:54:47,359 Speaker 12: Sure, and it all goes back to the little girls too, right, 1031 00:54:47,520 --> 00:54:50,719 Speaker 12: Like they see these two women just doing it of 1032 00:54:50,760 --> 00:54:54,760 Speaker 12: course there's always risk involved with any investment, big or small, 1033 00:54:54,840 --> 00:54:57,800 Speaker 12: but it seems to be paying off in different ways. 1034 00:54:58,400 --> 00:55:01,080 Speaker 12: We won't go too much into the financial payoffs, but 1035 00:55:01,640 --> 00:55:05,120 Speaker 12: you mentioned words that are very important, particularly to people 1036 00:55:05,160 --> 00:55:08,839 Speaker 12: of color around the world. Legacy, right, and so much 1037 00:55:08,840 --> 00:55:12,360 Speaker 12: has been institutionalized, but we have to keep things in 1038 00:55:12,400 --> 00:55:15,160 Speaker 12: a certain circle to keep moving forward. And I think 1039 00:55:15,480 --> 00:55:19,560 Speaker 12: your story sports fan or not that is probably resonating 1040 00:55:19,600 --> 00:55:22,560 Speaker 12: a lot with a lot of people and making people 1041 00:55:22,560 --> 00:55:25,239 Speaker 12: feel seen frankly, making people think, Okay, I think I 1042 00:55:25,239 --> 00:55:27,680 Speaker 12: can do this too. Ten years from now, I want 1043 00:55:27,719 --> 00:55:29,640 Speaker 12: to write a check. I want to be part of this, 1044 00:55:29,760 --> 00:55:33,640 Speaker 12: and this is a roadmap. This could be the blueprint 1045 00:55:33,680 --> 00:55:34,799 Speaker 12: for much much more. 1046 00:55:35,360 --> 00:55:38,000 Speaker 11: Yeah, and we look at it like that, right. We 1047 00:55:38,080 --> 00:55:41,120 Speaker 11: want to be an example club of This is how 1048 00:55:41,160 --> 00:55:43,960 Speaker 11: you do this in the bal This is how you 1049 00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:46,960 Speaker 11: build a club from the ground up to be able 1050 00:55:47,040 --> 00:55:53,840 Speaker 11: to be competitive in the bal from their inception. And 1051 00:55:54,200 --> 00:55:58,600 Speaker 11: it is through a cross functional leadership. It is through 1052 00:55:58,640 --> 00:56:02,000 Speaker 11: having a common goal and right for what we want 1053 00:56:02,040 --> 00:56:05,080 Speaker 11: to do on the court outside of the court, in 1054 00:56:05,120 --> 00:56:11,440 Speaker 11: the community, and that really has been our driving you know, force, 1055 00:56:11,640 --> 00:56:16,680 Speaker 11: and our partnership and our leadership group. We're like brothers 1056 00:56:16,680 --> 00:56:19,600 Speaker 11: and sisters, so we celebrate like brothers and sisters, and 1057 00:56:19,719 --> 00:56:22,319 Speaker 11: we disagree like brothers and sisters. But that is the 1058 00:56:22,360 --> 00:56:26,520 Speaker 11: beauty of us and the camaraderie and the love to 1059 00:56:26,640 --> 00:56:30,080 Speaker 11: really bring all these different folks in different perspectives together 1060 00:56:30,400 --> 00:56:33,200 Speaker 11: to really build this amazing organization. 1061 00:56:33,520 --> 00:56:37,480 Speaker 1: That's Chante Butler and Dia Martin, co founding partners of 1062 00:56:37,560 --> 00:56:41,160 Speaker 1: the Cape Town Tigers, speaking with Bloomberg Business of Sports 1063 00:56:41,239 --> 00:56:44,640 Speaker 1: contributor Don Kissy. Thanks for listening to the Bloomberg Business 1064 00:56:44,640 --> 00:56:48,600 Speaker 1: of Sports Show for Scarlett Fu and Damien Sasaur. I'm 1065 00:56:48,600 --> 00:56:51,280 Speaker 1: Michael Barr. Join us again next week for the latest 1066 00:56:51,280 --> 00:56:54,240 Speaker 1: on the stories moving big money in the world of sports. 1067 00:56:54,600 --> 00:56:58,040 Speaker 1: This is the Bloomberg Business of Sports Show from Bloomberg 1068 00:56:58,160 --> 00:56:59,800 Speaker 1: Radio around the world. 1069 00:57:00,800 --> 00:57:02,919 Speaker 7: Two Foo