1 00:00:15,066 --> 00:00:21,996 Speaker 1: Pushkin. Hey Lost Hills listeners, it's Dana. I wanted to 2 00:00:22,036 --> 00:00:24,156 Speaker 1: let you know that you can hear the entire new 3 00:00:24,196 --> 00:00:27,936 Speaker 1: season of Lost Hills ad-free along with other great binge 4 00:00:27,986 --> 00:00:32,206 Speaker 1: listens by becoming a Pushkin Plus subscriber. Find Pushkin Plus 5 00:00:32,406 --> 00:00:35,406 Speaker 1: on the Lost Hills show page in Apple Podcasts or 6 00:00:35,446 --> 00:00:38,456 Speaker 1: at pushkin.fm slash plus. 7 00:00:49,286 --> 00:00:53,266 Speaker 2: Mickey was highly intelligent, well-read, and he didn't give a fuck. 8 00:00:53,366 --> 00:00:55,456 Speaker 2: And he saw what the future was going to bring 9 00:00:55,996 --> 00:01:01,256 Speaker 2: to surfing. And so he acted accordingly. And he wouldn't capitulate. 10 00:01:02,676 --> 00:01:06,376 Speaker 1: This is Chris Malloy. He's a documentary filmmaker who moved 11 00:01:06,396 --> 00:01:09,196 Speaker 1: to Hawaii to be a professional big wave surfer in 12 00:01:09,236 --> 00:01:12,756 Speaker 1: the 90s. Chris is a big fan of Mickey Dora. 13 00:01:13,776 --> 00:01:15,756 Speaker 2: He was like, you know what? I can get paid 14 00:01:16,446 --> 00:01:19,346 Speaker 2: to surf. But he said, I'm going to take credit 15 00:01:19,366 --> 00:01:24,026 Speaker 2: cards and checks and go around the world and surf 16 00:01:24,066 --> 00:01:28,156 Speaker 2: waves that nobody knows about. And he said, God damn it. 17 00:01:28,926 --> 00:01:31,886 Speaker 2: He goes, if they gave you this plastic card and 18 00:01:31,926 --> 00:01:34,506 Speaker 2: you could just go get stuff for free, what the 19 00:01:34,566 --> 00:01:35,286 Speaker 2: fuck would you do? 20 00:01:38,596 --> 00:01:42,696 Speaker 1: I'm visiting Chris at his sprawling ranch on California's Central Coast, 21 00:01:43,116 --> 00:01:45,576 Speaker 1: where he and his wife are raising three kids on 22 00:01:45,576 --> 00:01:49,536 Speaker 1: 100 Acres. He's part of that Kelly Slater generation of 23 00:01:49,596 --> 00:01:55,046 Speaker 1: surfers who grew up on Mickey Dora lore. Mickey's status 24 00:01:55,206 --> 00:01:57,186 Speaker 1: as an iconoclast spoke to them. 25 00:01:58,626 --> 00:02:03,186 Speaker 2: He was very aware of the big public and governmental 26 00:02:03,286 --> 00:02:07,686 Speaker 2: systems and was smart enough to go, hey, I'm going 27 00:02:07,706 --> 00:02:08,346 Speaker 2: to do it my way. 28 00:02:09,146 --> 00:02:12,286 Speaker 3: And you guys can pretty much fuck off. That was 29 00:02:12,786 --> 00:02:16,806 Speaker 3: Mickey Dora. You know what I mean? And he did 30 00:02:16,846 --> 00:02:17,386 Speaker 3: it with style. 31 00:02:18,866 --> 00:02:21,786 Speaker 1: Two years before Mickey died, Chris got to spend a 32 00:02:21,806 --> 00:02:24,436 Speaker 1: couple of weeks with him in Chile, surfing. 33 00:02:25,736 --> 00:02:29,076 Speaker 2: I was very, very focused when I was with him. 34 00:02:30,156 --> 00:02:34,256 Speaker 2: Just taking it in. Because I knew I was in 35 00:02:34,316 --> 00:02:35,296 Speaker 2: a special space. 36 00:02:37,436 --> 00:02:41,446 Speaker 1: Mickey talked a lot on the trip. And Chris was listening. 37 00:02:42,226 --> 00:02:47,206 Speaker 1: but he was also thinking about posterity. And so, secretly 38 00:02:47,266 --> 00:02:51,586 Speaker 1: at first, because Mickey was so paranoid, he started recording him. 39 00:02:52,806 --> 00:02:56,666 Speaker 1: As Chris is telling me this, he hands me a mini-disc. 40 00:02:57,626 --> 00:03:00,926 Speaker 2: So this is a recording that you guys can take 41 00:03:00,986 --> 00:03:06,066 Speaker 2: if you want that I did with him. So this 42 00:03:06,146 --> 00:03:10,066 Speaker 2: is very unjournalistic, but I'm not a journalist, so I 43 00:03:10,076 --> 00:03:13,616 Speaker 2: can do whatever the fuck I want. He didn't know 44 00:03:13,696 --> 00:03:17,116 Speaker 2: I was recording. And I don't think there's anything good 45 00:03:17,176 --> 00:03:19,296 Speaker 2: on there, honestly. Like, I listened to it once, and 46 00:03:19,316 --> 00:03:20,536 Speaker 2: it's a horrible sound. 47 00:03:22,816 --> 00:03:27,976 Speaker 3: Testing, testing, one, two, three. Avocado balloon. 48 00:03:30,336 --> 00:03:33,656 Speaker 1: There are very few recordings of Mickey Dora. He rarely 49 00:03:33,716 --> 00:03:36,616 Speaker 1: sat for interviews. And when he did, they tended to 50 00:03:36,676 --> 00:03:42,266 Speaker 1: be incredibly contrived. Not to mention full of lies. But 51 00:03:42,346 --> 00:03:46,986 Speaker 1: this tape is different. It captures the final chapter of 52 00:03:47,066 --> 00:03:51,456 Speaker 1: Mickey's life. He was 65, and he knew he was 53 00:03:51,536 --> 00:03:52,216 Speaker 1: falling apart. 54 00:03:54,676 --> 00:03:56,056 Speaker 3: People do what they want. They have to live with 55 00:03:56,076 --> 00:03:58,416 Speaker 3: their conscience. I want to live the way I want 56 00:03:58,436 --> 00:04:01,056 Speaker 3: to live. It's hard to do, and it's an experiment. 57 00:04:03,746 --> 00:04:06,306 Speaker 4: But I don't want anyone to live the way I do. 58 00:04:06,306 --> 00:04:11,156 Speaker 4: It's I don't want to serve like everybody else. I 59 00:04:11,156 --> 00:04:12,856 Speaker 4: don't want to do anything like everyone else. I just 60 00:04:12,876 --> 00:04:16,336 Speaker 4: try to live my life what's suitable for me. 61 00:04:17,856 --> 00:04:22,126 Speaker 1: After years of seemingly perpetual youth, Mickey looked his age. 62 00:04:23,106 --> 00:04:25,426 Speaker 1: A picture from around this time shows him with a 63 00:04:25,506 --> 00:04:29,866 Speaker 1: silvery goatee, wearing some kind of cravat, a soft twinkle 64 00:04:29,906 --> 00:04:33,366 Speaker 1: in his eye, like the most interesting man in the world, 65 00:04:33,926 --> 00:04:35,566 Speaker 1: if he was left on the beach for a week. 66 00:04:36,936 --> 00:04:40,616 Speaker 1: The cancer that would kill him was, most likely, already 67 00:04:40,756 --> 00:04:45,236 Speaker 1: eating him away. Mickey had been on the outside for 68 00:04:45,406 --> 00:04:48,866 Speaker 1: so long. In exile. In prison. 69 00:04:49,486 --> 00:04:50,166 Speaker 5: Forsaken. 70 00:04:50,186 --> 00:04:54,706 Speaker 1: And the surf world, the whole world, had moved on. 71 00:04:56,106 --> 00:04:59,466 Speaker 1: He'd lost his kingdom and most of his fawning fans. 72 00:05:00,486 --> 00:05:06,236 Speaker 1: His fame was underground. Deep underground. Did the new wild 73 00:05:06,296 --> 00:05:11,666 Speaker 1: kids of Surfrider even know who Mickey Dora was? Mickey 74 00:05:11,736 --> 00:05:17,246 Speaker 1: always said he hated attention, but he craved relevance. He 75 00:05:17,306 --> 00:05:22,126 Speaker 1: wanted to be wanted. The one thing Mickey hadn't lost 76 00:05:22,346 --> 00:05:26,866 Speaker 1: was his legendary charm. So when he met Chris Malloy 77 00:05:26,986 --> 00:05:30,886 Speaker 1: and Kelly Slater, two of the surf world's biggest celebrities, 78 00:05:31,796 --> 00:05:39,496 Speaker 1: he turned it on. Mickey was ready for his last act. 79 00:05:43,516 --> 00:06:15,026 Speaker 1: I'm Dana Goodyear, and this is Lost Hills. Episode 11, 80 00:06:15,026 --> 00:06:15,846 Speaker 1: Writing on the Wall. 81 00:06:21,066 --> 00:06:21,526 Speaker 4: Hi, Kelly. 82 00:06:21,546 --> 00:06:22,446 Speaker 3: All right, how are you? 83 00:06:22,676 --> 00:06:23,356 Speaker 1: Good, how are you doing? 84 00:06:24,576 --> 00:06:24,876 Speaker 6: Good. 85 00:06:26,116 --> 00:06:28,016 Speaker 1: I'm on a Zoom with Kelly Slater. 86 00:06:28,036 --> 00:06:29,636 Speaker 3: Do you guys see me? 87 00:06:29,656 --> 00:06:29,716 Speaker 7: No. 88 00:06:30,136 --> 00:06:31,676 Speaker 8: No, your camera's off. 89 00:06:32,116 --> 00:06:33,756 Speaker 5: Oh, I didn't realize I never had it on. 90 00:06:34,056 --> 00:06:36,186 Speaker 3: Cool. Okay, great. 91 00:06:37,626 --> 00:06:40,366 Speaker 1: He's at home on the north shore of Oahu, and 92 00:06:40,406 --> 00:06:43,686 Speaker 1: when the camera turns on, His Zoom backgrounds got real 93 00:06:43,766 --> 00:06:49,086 Speaker 1: Hawaii vibes. Whitewashed wooden walls, a ceiling fan, and surfboards 94 00:06:49,226 --> 00:06:52,806 Speaker 1: stashed in the roof beams. Cool. Well, I'm going to 95 00:06:52,826 --> 00:06:55,386 Speaker 1: start by asking you a question that you probably haven't 96 00:06:55,426 --> 00:07:00,186 Speaker 1: been asked in 25 years, which is, who are you 97 00:07:00,426 --> 00:07:01,236 Speaker 1: and what do you do? 98 00:07:01,246 --> 00:07:06,136 Speaker 5: Funny enough, I get asked that a lot to set 99 00:07:06,196 --> 00:07:10,296 Speaker 5: up interviews, but I'm Kelly Slater. I'm a professional surfer. 100 00:07:10,316 --> 00:07:14,926 Speaker 5: I have been for I've actually been professional for 33 101 00:07:14,926 --> 00:07:21,246 Speaker 5: years now and still competing full time. I'm a father. 102 00:07:21,266 --> 00:07:23,816 Speaker 5: I do a little bit of business here and there. 103 00:07:24,196 --> 00:07:25,716 Speaker 5: So that's kind of my thing. 104 00:07:27,096 --> 00:07:30,056 Speaker 1: It's taken a while to schedule this call because Kelly 105 00:07:30,216 --> 00:07:30,836 Speaker 1: is busy. 106 00:07:31,796 --> 00:07:34,176 Speaker 5: Right now, I'm actually just I'm in a process of 107 00:07:34,256 --> 00:07:36,286 Speaker 5: packing and kind of closing up my house for the 108 00:07:36,346 --> 00:07:40,266 Speaker 5: winter because I'm going to Portugal tomorrow for a competition event. 109 00:07:41,186 --> 00:07:43,946 Speaker 1: It's March, and Kelly's on the world tour, and he's 110 00:07:43,986 --> 00:07:45,906 Speaker 1: hoping to qualify for the Olympics. 111 00:07:46,866 --> 00:07:49,646 Speaker 5: The results from the world tour feed into the Olympics. 112 00:07:50,006 --> 00:07:54,906 Speaker 5: So it's really essentially like a year-long Olympic trials. And 113 00:07:55,626 --> 00:07:57,326 Speaker 5: I need to make the top two from the U.S. 114 00:07:57,366 --> 00:07:59,096 Speaker 5: and the men's in order to make the Olympics. 115 00:08:00,386 --> 00:08:03,976 Speaker 1: Kelly Slater is 52 years old and the winningest pro 116 00:08:04,016 --> 00:08:07,696 Speaker 1: surfer of all time. He just barely missed making the U.S. 117 00:08:07,736 --> 00:08:12,116 Speaker 1: team for surfing's first Olympics in Tokyo in 2021. He 118 00:08:12,236 --> 00:08:15,276 Speaker 1: really wants to make it in 2024. 119 00:08:15,276 --> 00:08:18,076 Speaker 5: This would be my one and probably only Olympics that 120 00:08:18,106 --> 00:08:18,666 Speaker 5: I would ever do. 121 00:08:21,206 --> 00:08:24,146 Speaker 1: Kelly Slater met Mickey in the late 90s, right in 122 00:08:24,166 --> 00:08:26,186 Speaker 1: the middle of a streak in which Kelly won the 123 00:08:26,226 --> 00:08:29,686 Speaker 1: world title five years in a row. Mickey was spending 124 00:08:29,726 --> 00:08:34,556 Speaker 1: time in Jeffries Bay, South Africa, another perfect right. another 125 00:08:34,636 --> 00:08:39,376 Speaker 1: stand-in for Malibu. After he was released from prison, Mickey 126 00:08:39,416 --> 00:08:42,896 Speaker 1: kind of alternated between Gittery, his spot in France, and 127 00:08:42,956 --> 00:08:46,876 Speaker 1: Jay Bay. His constant companion was a small King Charles 128 00:08:46,896 --> 00:08:52,036 Speaker 1: Spaniel named Scooter Boy after a hot-dogging Hawaiian surfer. Scooter 129 00:08:52,066 --> 00:08:56,926 Speaker 1: Boy ate at the table from a plate. Mickey was 130 00:08:56,966 --> 00:08:59,846 Speaker 1: surviving on the kindness of others and the fumes of 131 00:08:59,886 --> 00:09:04,056 Speaker 1: his legend. The surf apparel company Quicksilver had come to 132 00:09:04,096 --> 00:09:07,176 Speaker 1: Mickey's rescue when he got out of prison and appeared destitute. 133 00:09:07,856 --> 00:09:10,716 Speaker 1: They paid him a monthly stipend, got him a small apartment, 134 00:09:10,916 --> 00:09:14,206 Speaker 1: and gave him a tab at a local restaurant. In return, 135 00:09:14,486 --> 00:09:18,146 Speaker 1: he agreed to be, essentially, their mascot, showing up at 136 00:09:18,206 --> 00:09:22,026 Speaker 1: parties and attending surf events. It was more or less 137 00:09:22,086 --> 00:09:25,026 Speaker 1: the same gig Gidget has at Duke's in Malibu. 138 00:09:27,046 --> 00:09:28,546 Speaker 5: Over the years, I've told a few of the stories 139 00:09:28,576 --> 00:09:31,396 Speaker 5: that I know where Mickey did rip people off and 140 00:09:32,016 --> 00:09:34,896 Speaker 5: treated people kind of badly, you know? And I don't 141 00:09:35,226 --> 00:09:38,926 Speaker 5: say those stories to like tarnish his image or anything 142 00:09:38,946 --> 00:09:42,106 Speaker 5: like that. To me, it was a defining part of 143 00:09:42,186 --> 00:09:46,146 Speaker 5: his personality and who he was that he was so 144 00:09:46,206 --> 00:09:50,916 Speaker 5: paranoid and untrusting of other people that it was maybe 145 00:09:50,956 --> 00:09:54,456 Speaker 5: because of his own skeletons. But, you know, he had 146 00:09:54,476 --> 00:09:56,156 Speaker 5: all these tricks he would pull and people who knew 147 00:09:56,196 --> 00:09:58,496 Speaker 5: him well would get ahead of his tricks and. 148 00:09:59,656 --> 00:10:02,516 Speaker 1: Though Mickey was too scared after prison to pull any 149 00:10:02,616 --> 00:10:06,646 Speaker 1: serious scams, he was still seemingly incapable of paying for 150 00:10:06,686 --> 00:10:07,226 Speaker 1: his own meal. 151 00:10:08,556 --> 00:10:10,016 Speaker 5: One thing that comes to mind is he lived in 152 00:10:10,056 --> 00:10:11,396 Speaker 5: France for a long time, and he would go to 153 00:10:11,436 --> 00:10:13,956 Speaker 5: dinner with people there. And he always had this trick 154 00:10:13,976 --> 00:10:16,256 Speaker 5: where he'd show up at dinner with a $ 100 U.S. bill, 155 00:10:16,556 --> 00:10:20,056 Speaker 5: and at the time it was French francs. And you 156 00:10:20,076 --> 00:10:22,776 Speaker 5: couldn't just readily exchange a $ 100 bill at any restaurant. 157 00:10:23,576 --> 00:10:25,556 Speaker 5: And so when the bill would come, he'd go, oh, 158 00:10:25,796 --> 00:10:28,406 Speaker 5: all I have is a $ 100 bill. And so my 159 00:10:28,476 --> 00:10:30,416 Speaker 5: friend's wife caught on to it. She goes, oh, I 160 00:10:30,436 --> 00:10:31,956 Speaker 5: know he's going to pull that trick on us again 161 00:10:31,996 --> 00:10:35,216 Speaker 5: this dinner. So she brought enough money to exchange his 162 00:10:35,216 --> 00:10:38,116 Speaker 5: $ 100 bill in francs at dinner. And as soon as 163 00:10:38,136 --> 00:10:39,376 Speaker 5: he picked it up and went, oh, I have a 164 00:10:39,376 --> 00:10:40,656 Speaker 5: $ 100 bill, she grabbed it out of his hand and goes, 165 00:10:40,696 --> 00:10:41,476 Speaker 5: I got change for that. 166 00:10:44,416 --> 00:10:47,826 Speaker 1: Kelly was charmed by Mickey. It was incredible to meet 167 00:10:47,866 --> 00:10:50,676 Speaker 1: someone who had been there. back at the birth of 168 00:10:50,736 --> 00:10:54,976 Speaker 1: California surfing. His little brother was a big Mickey Dora fan, 169 00:10:55,296 --> 00:10:57,656 Speaker 1: so the first time he met Mickey, Kelly asked if 170 00:10:57,696 --> 00:10:59,236 Speaker 1: he would sign a picture for his brother. 171 00:10:59,256 --> 00:11:03,696 Speaker 5: And he just like went, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, no, Kelly, 172 00:11:04,876 --> 00:11:06,816 Speaker 5: I really like you. You seem like a great guy, 173 00:11:07,256 --> 00:11:09,816 Speaker 5: but I can't do that. And I said, why not? 174 00:11:09,856 --> 00:11:11,876 Speaker 5: You could just like personalize it to my little brother. 175 00:11:12,596 --> 00:11:14,756 Speaker 5: You know, I'd probably sign a thousand autographs at any 176 00:11:14,916 --> 00:11:19,696 Speaker 5: particular event. And Mickey just said, no, you know, these 177 00:11:19,746 --> 00:11:22,516 Speaker 5: Japanese think that my autograph's worth $ 5, 000 and I can't 178 00:11:22,556 --> 00:11:25,756 Speaker 5: change that. I can't let him down. And what he 179 00:11:25,796 --> 00:11:28,276 Speaker 5: meant by that was that every surfboard that he signed, 180 00:11:28,736 --> 00:11:30,986 Speaker 5: him and Greg Knoll had a surfboard deal together and 181 00:11:30,996 --> 00:11:33,346 Speaker 5: they would sell these boards in Japan and they would sell. 182 00:11:33,226 --> 00:11:34,486 Speaker 3: For about $ 5, 000. 183 00:11:33,806 --> 00:11:38,706 Speaker 5: So he equated his signature to being worth about $ 5, 000. 184 00:11:38,066 --> 00:11:38,346 Speaker 8: I guess. 185 00:11:39,626 --> 00:11:43,766 Speaker 1: Mickey's weirdness about signing, about giving any part of himself away, 186 00:11:44,096 --> 00:11:47,096 Speaker 1: was a motif Kelly noticed. It might have been the 187 00:11:47,136 --> 00:11:50,576 Speaker 1: fact that in the forged passport case, the FBI forced 188 00:11:50,676 --> 00:11:54,356 Speaker 1: Mickey to submit hundreds of handwriting samples. They were never 189 00:11:54,516 --> 00:11:58,036 Speaker 1: able to get a match. But maybe Mickey wasn't taking 190 00:11:58,096 --> 00:12:04,276 Speaker 1: any chances. Sometime later, Kelly ran into Mickey in France. 191 00:12:04,996 --> 00:12:08,226 Speaker 1: Kelly was sponsored by Quicksilver. He'd been invited to play 192 00:12:08,266 --> 00:12:11,486 Speaker 1: a round of golf with Mickey, the Quicksilver mascot, and 193 00:12:11,506 --> 00:12:14,326 Speaker 1: a couple of executives. At the end of the round, 194 00:12:14,526 --> 00:12:17,586 Speaker 1: Mickey and Kelly sat down for a drink. And Bruce Raymond, 195 00:12:17,726 --> 00:12:21,746 Speaker 1: who ran Quicksilver International, passed around the scorecard for everyone 196 00:12:21,766 --> 00:12:22,206 Speaker 1: to sign. 197 00:12:23,246 --> 00:12:25,386 Speaker 5: And Mickey gets up and goes to the bathroom. And 198 00:12:25,406 --> 00:12:28,366 Speaker 5: I've already told you the story about Mickey's autograph. But 199 00:12:28,386 --> 00:12:30,836 Speaker 5: the problem is that Bruce is basically his boss and 200 00:12:30,856 --> 00:12:32,956 Speaker 5: the one who determines whether he gets a paycheck every 201 00:12:32,996 --> 00:12:36,536 Speaker 5: month and gets his travel and all that stuff. So 202 00:12:37,436 --> 00:12:39,336 Speaker 5: I said, you know, Mickey's not going to sign this, Bruce. 203 00:12:40,096 --> 00:12:42,076 Speaker 5: And he goes, he'll sign it. And I said, no, 204 00:12:42,376 --> 00:12:44,216 Speaker 5: he won't sign it. I'm telling you, this will be 205 00:12:44,236 --> 00:12:46,346 Speaker 5: a fight. He goes, just put it in front of 206 00:12:46,386 --> 00:12:48,316 Speaker 5: his seat, and when he gets back, he'll sign the scorecard. 207 00:12:49,096 --> 00:12:51,116 Speaker 5: And so after about, he gets back, and he sits 208 00:12:51,136 --> 00:12:52,796 Speaker 5: there for about five or ten minutes, and he hasn't 209 00:12:52,836 --> 00:12:56,776 Speaker 5: signed it yet, and Bruce finally goes, hey, Mickey, sign 210 00:12:56,796 --> 00:13:01,436 Speaker 5: the scorecard. And Mickey goes, he just totally freaked out. 211 00:13:01,936 --> 00:13:04,946 Speaker 5: Who is this? Who's going to, where is this going? No, 212 00:13:05,016 --> 00:13:08,666 Speaker 5: I don't sign things. And Bruce real calmly goes, Mickey, 213 00:13:08,686 --> 00:13:11,966 Speaker 5: sign the scorecard. And he goes, well, where is this 214 00:13:11,986 --> 00:13:15,346 Speaker 5: going to go? Who's keeping this? And Bruce goes, don't worry, Mickey, 215 00:13:15,386 --> 00:13:18,906 Speaker 5: it's mine. I'll keep it. All gentlemen sign their scorecards. 216 00:13:19,606 --> 00:13:20,786 Speaker 5: You have to sign your scorecard. 217 00:13:21,856 --> 00:13:23,756 Speaker 1: Mickey agreed, reluctantly. 218 00:13:24,956 --> 00:13:27,716 Speaker 5: And Bruce, to this day, has that scorecard framed on 219 00:13:27,756 --> 00:13:29,696 Speaker 5: his wall at home. He put it in a box 220 00:13:29,736 --> 00:13:32,696 Speaker 5: frame behind glass. And I told him, I said, Bruce, 221 00:13:32,716 --> 00:13:34,356 Speaker 5: if you ever pass away before me, I want that 222 00:13:34,376 --> 00:13:35,156 Speaker 5: to go into my house. 223 00:13:37,676 --> 00:13:40,606 Speaker 1: During the golf game in France, Kelly had noticed that 224 00:13:40,686 --> 00:13:42,866 Speaker 1: Mickey's clubs were badly out of date. 225 00:13:43,936 --> 00:13:45,646 Speaker 5: After we had our drink and he signed the scorecard 226 00:13:45,666 --> 00:13:48,356 Speaker 5: and we're walking to our car. And I said, Mickey, 227 00:13:48,396 --> 00:13:51,876 Speaker 5: you know, you should probably get a new set of 228 00:13:51,916 --> 00:13:54,236 Speaker 5: golf clubs. I go, those things are like 30 years old. 229 00:13:54,256 --> 00:13:55,436 Speaker 5: You want to get a new set? 230 00:13:55,476 --> 00:13:56,976 Speaker 3: And he goes, what do you mean? 231 00:13:57,096 --> 00:13:58,236 Speaker 5: Like, how am I going to get a new set? 232 00:13:58,256 --> 00:13:59,476 Speaker 5: And I said, I'll get you a set of clubs. 233 00:13:59,536 --> 00:14:02,536 Speaker 5: And he goes, well, if you're not going to get 234 00:14:02,576 --> 00:14:03,976 Speaker 5: me a set of clubs, I need to make other plans. 235 00:14:03,996 --> 00:14:05,636 Speaker 5: You need to let me know right now because I 236 00:14:05,676 --> 00:14:07,416 Speaker 5: need to make some other plans. And I said, Mickey, 237 00:14:07,456 --> 00:14:09,896 Speaker 5: you haven't made plans in 25 years. I don't think 238 00:14:09,936 --> 00:14:11,736 Speaker 5: you're worried about how long this is going to take. 239 00:14:12,296 --> 00:14:13,476 Speaker 5: I said, don't worry, I'll send you a set of 240 00:14:13,516 --> 00:14:16,696 Speaker 5: golf clubs. And he goes, well, how long is it 241 00:14:16,716 --> 00:14:17,156 Speaker 5: going to take? 242 00:14:17,216 --> 00:14:18,116 Speaker 3: And I said, I don't know. 243 00:14:18,176 --> 00:14:19,956 Speaker 5: I got a friend at a golf company and I'll 244 00:14:20,036 --> 00:14:21,496 Speaker 5: order them and I'll send them over here to you. 245 00:14:21,556 --> 00:14:25,056 Speaker 5: And I think I flew to California. And within a 246 00:14:25,196 --> 00:14:27,236 Speaker 5: few days, I got a fax from him. That was 247 00:14:27,256 --> 00:14:30,016 Speaker 5: when we had faxes in the late 90s. And it said, 248 00:14:30,516 --> 00:14:32,536 Speaker 5: you know, same thing. Kelly, if you're not going to 249 00:14:32,576 --> 00:14:36,156 Speaker 5: be able to get this set of golf clubs, you're 250 00:14:36,176 --> 00:14:37,476 Speaker 5: going to have to let me know because I need 251 00:14:37,496 --> 00:14:39,866 Speaker 5: to make other plans. Same exact thing he had told me. 252 00:14:39,876 --> 00:14:41,686 Speaker 5: And I said, Mickey, I don't want to hear from 253 00:14:41,706 --> 00:14:45,846 Speaker 5: you again Until you get your golf clubs, okay? A 254 00:14:45,886 --> 00:14:47,466 Speaker 5: month or so later, I got the clubs and I 255 00:14:47,626 --> 00:14:49,246 Speaker 5: sent them to him. And then he sent me this 256 00:14:49,326 --> 00:14:52,786 Speaker 5: fax and it said, Kelly, thank you, thank you, thank you. 257 00:14:52,846 --> 00:14:56,316 Speaker 5: These King Cobra golf clubs have changed my life. Signed, 258 00:14:56,396 --> 00:14:58,856 Speaker 5: Mickey Dora. I had a really bad fax, but I 259 00:14:58,916 --> 00:15:00,876 Speaker 5: saved the fax and I have his signature and stuff. 260 00:15:00,896 --> 00:15:03,916 Speaker 5: But I'm almost positive that that fax has faded to 261 00:15:03,996 --> 00:15:04,416 Speaker 5: nothing now. 262 00:15:05,786 --> 00:15:08,486 Speaker 1: I was thinking that if you find your fax and 263 00:15:08,726 --> 00:15:12,146 Speaker 1: the signature has vanished, that would be like a perfect 264 00:15:12,266 --> 00:15:14,576 Speaker 1: Mickey from the grave moment. 265 00:15:14,596 --> 00:15:18,996 Speaker 5: Yeah, it really would. Yeah, he'd be like, I got you. 266 00:15:19,096 --> 00:15:19,616 Speaker 5: I got you. 267 00:15:25,546 --> 00:15:28,546 Speaker 1: Mickey's greatest accomplishment in the eyes of many of his 268 00:15:28,626 --> 00:15:32,326 Speaker 1: admirers is that he managed to orient his life entirely 269 00:15:32,466 --> 00:15:36,516 Speaker 1: around surfing. he was free of the obligations that anchor 270 00:15:36,576 --> 00:15:40,266 Speaker 1: most of us to the shore. He didn't let anything 271 00:15:40,646 --> 00:15:43,806 Speaker 1: or anyone get in the way of his wave. 272 00:15:44,966 --> 00:15:47,866 Speaker 5: He told me, he goes, Kelly, I've almost made it. 273 00:15:48,706 --> 00:15:50,886 Speaker 5: And I said, what? He goes, I'm going to be 274 00:15:51,906 --> 00:15:54,946 Speaker 5: whatever age, 62 years old, 63 years old next year, 275 00:15:55,306 --> 00:15:57,666 Speaker 5: and I've never worked a day in my life. And 276 00:15:57,716 --> 00:16:01,166 Speaker 5: that was success to him. It was never working. I 277 00:16:01,186 --> 00:16:03,346 Speaker 5: think that was very sincere, you know, like he felt 278 00:16:03,546 --> 00:16:06,426 Speaker 5: that was his accomplishment. That was his legacy. I got 279 00:16:06,466 --> 00:16:08,206 Speaker 5: all the way through life without ever having to work 280 00:16:08,246 --> 00:16:11,506 Speaker 5: a day in my life. He worked harder than he 281 00:16:11,546 --> 00:16:13,206 Speaker 5: probably would have had. He just had a job. 282 00:16:27,976 --> 00:16:32,896 Speaker 3: Oh, I'm in Chile. on the coastline in a little 283 00:16:32,946 --> 00:16:37,626 Speaker 3: town called Petit Limo. I'm in a little one-bedroom hotel 284 00:16:37,666 --> 00:16:39,866 Speaker 3: room with Mickey Dora. 285 00:16:41,926 --> 00:16:46,796 Speaker 1: That's Chris Malloy, the former pro surfer and documentarian. It's 286 00:16:46,896 --> 00:16:50,476 Speaker 1: the year 2000. Mickey has just left the room to 287 00:16:50,516 --> 00:16:53,796 Speaker 1: run an errand, and Chris has pulled out his mini-disc recorder. 288 00:16:56,616 --> 00:17:02,736 Speaker 2: It's been an interesting stay with Mick I feel like 289 00:17:02,836 --> 00:17:04,756 Speaker 2: after a few days now I can ask him anything 290 00:17:04,836 --> 00:17:06,376 Speaker 2: I want and he likes. 291 00:17:06,186 --> 00:17:06,926 Speaker 6: To talk about it. 292 00:17:06,926 --> 00:17:10,406 Speaker 2: If he's offended he just skips it and keeps going. 293 00:17:10,426 --> 00:17:16,306 Speaker 3: He doesn't get mad so far. We'll see. I set 294 00:17:16,346 --> 00:17:21,936 Speaker 3: the recorder up and he seems to ignore it. Enter. 295 00:17:24,376 --> 00:17:24,876 Speaker 3: Mickey Dora. 296 00:17:32,866 --> 00:17:35,726 Speaker 2: I was living in Hawaii at the time, and my 297 00:17:35,826 --> 00:17:40,986 Speaker 2: friend called me, and he said, hey, Mickey Dora's in town. 298 00:17:41,006 --> 00:17:43,476 Speaker 2: And I said, and he goes, I think, you know, 299 00:17:43,496 --> 00:17:45,736 Speaker 2: you two should get together. And I'm like, yeah, that'll 300 00:17:45,746 --> 00:17:46,286 Speaker 2: never happen. 301 00:17:47,396 --> 00:17:50,276 Speaker 1: At his ranch on the Central Coast, Chris is describing 302 00:17:50,356 --> 00:17:52,736 Speaker 1: how he ended up traveling to Chile with Mickey Dora. 303 00:17:53,356 --> 00:17:56,376 Speaker 1: It was one of the last great adventures of Mickey's life. 304 00:17:57,616 --> 00:18:00,136 Speaker 2: At the time, I was living with my two brothers 305 00:18:00,196 --> 00:18:02,216 Speaker 2: on the North Shore, right near Pipeline. 306 00:18:03,176 --> 00:18:03,856 Speaker 3: And I get a phone call. 307 00:18:04,776 --> 00:18:06,736 Speaker 2: And so this was when we just had a phone 308 00:18:06,776 --> 00:18:08,746 Speaker 2: on the wall, right? There's no cell phones and stuff 309 00:18:08,786 --> 00:18:09,166 Speaker 2: like that. 310 00:18:10,246 --> 00:18:12,246 Speaker 3: So I pick up the phone. 311 00:18:12,286 --> 00:18:12,646 Speaker 1: Hello? 312 00:18:13,466 --> 00:18:18,906 Speaker 3: He goes, who's this? That's rude. You just called me. 313 00:18:19,806 --> 00:18:22,786 Speaker 3: I didn't say that. And I'm like, this is Chris. 314 00:18:23,386 --> 00:18:30,456 Speaker 3: Who's this? And he goes, Mick. So I go, Mick who? 315 00:18:30,916 --> 00:18:34,016 Speaker 2: And he goes, it's Mick. And so now I don't 316 00:18:34,056 --> 00:18:36,276 Speaker 2: know who it is. And he goes, I heard you're 317 00:18:36,296 --> 00:18:36,926 Speaker 2: going south. 318 00:18:38,186 --> 00:18:41,906 Speaker 1: Chris was planning a trip to Antarctica to go surfing, 319 00:18:42,606 --> 00:18:45,786 Speaker 1: the kind of crazy surf odyssey that Mickey was famous for. 320 00:18:45,806 --> 00:18:51,346 Speaker 3: Anyway, so he goes, well, I'm going to Chile. And 321 00:18:51,366 --> 00:18:54,076 Speaker 3: I had never been to Chile. And he goes, do 322 00:18:54,236 --> 00:18:56,776 Speaker 3: you want to go? And I didn't. I was like, 323 00:18:56,836 --> 00:19:00,596 Speaker 3: I don't know who this is. And I'm like, yeah, no, 324 00:19:00,636 --> 00:19:02,636 Speaker 3: I'm not stopping in Chile, man. I'm going south. 325 00:19:02,986 --> 00:19:06,386 Speaker 2: From Lima to Ushuaia or wherever, you know, my flight 326 00:19:06,426 --> 00:19:06,826 Speaker 2: plan was. 327 00:19:07,346 --> 00:19:08,086 Speaker 7: He goes, okay, bye. 328 00:19:08,846 --> 00:19:12,026 Speaker 3: Click. And then I'm like, kind of like making dinner. 329 00:19:12,046 --> 00:19:13,566 Speaker 3: I go, that was fucking Mickey Dora. 330 00:19:13,666 --> 00:19:16,866 Speaker 2: Holy shit. And so back then you could do the 331 00:19:16,906 --> 00:19:22,666 Speaker 2: star 69. So I call, I go, Mickey. 332 00:19:23,446 --> 00:19:23,666 Speaker 3: Yeah. 333 00:19:24,646 --> 00:19:28,486 Speaker 2: Hey, when do you want to fly? And so I 334 00:19:28,526 --> 00:19:29,806 Speaker 2: changed my whole flight plan. 335 00:19:30,826 --> 00:19:35,116 Speaker 1: Chris was born in 1971. His generation of surfers grew 336 00:19:35,176 --> 00:19:39,196 Speaker 1: up in the era of established surf brands, competitions, and 337 00:19:39,256 --> 00:19:43,496 Speaker 1: an official professional surf league. He grew up and started 338 00:19:43,556 --> 00:19:47,406 Speaker 1: surfing in the Dora Lives era, when Mickey had vanished 339 00:19:47,446 --> 00:19:50,646 Speaker 1: from Malibu, but traces of him lingered in the writing 340 00:19:50,766 --> 00:19:56,306 Speaker 1: on the wall. Chris grew up on a farm in Ojai, California, 341 00:19:56,686 --> 00:20:01,036 Speaker 1: about an hour from Malibu. He'd heard the stories from 342 00:20:01,056 --> 00:20:03,826 Speaker 1: his dad, who knew Mickey back in the 50s. 343 00:20:04,836 --> 00:20:09,556 Speaker 2: My dad had served with them. I always loved surfing history, 344 00:20:09,616 --> 00:20:13,916 Speaker 2: so I was aware of the Dark Knight. And so, 345 00:20:13,936 --> 00:20:17,296 Speaker 2: it's somebody you thought you'd never meet because. 346 00:20:17,076 --> 00:20:20,196 Speaker 3: He was so elusive. You know, it was so elusive. 347 00:20:20,256 --> 00:20:23,336 Speaker 2: That was sort of, if there's an adjective that might 348 00:20:23,416 --> 00:20:29,496 Speaker 2: be the most appropriate for Miklos, Dora is how elusive 349 00:20:29,516 --> 00:20:29,976 Speaker 2: he was. 350 00:20:31,376 --> 00:20:33,886 Speaker 1: When Chris told his dad that he was going surfing 351 00:20:33,926 --> 00:20:37,566 Speaker 1: in Chile with Miki Dora, his dad was not too thrilled. 352 00:20:38,906 --> 00:20:40,586 Speaker 3: Anybody that knew him didn't miss him. 353 00:20:44,716 --> 00:20:47,466 Speaker 1: Chris and Mickey agreed to meet at LAX and head 354 00:20:47,486 --> 00:20:51,266 Speaker 1: south from there. But first, Mickey had a little job 355 00:20:51,306 --> 00:20:54,786 Speaker 1: for Chris. Mickey was going to send a surfboard to California. 356 00:20:55,386 --> 00:20:57,286 Speaker 1: He wanted Chris to pick it up and bring it 357 00:20:57,326 --> 00:20:57,926 Speaker 1: to the airport. 358 00:20:58,746 --> 00:21:00,266 Speaker 3: And I said, of course, you know, of course. 359 00:21:01,286 --> 00:21:05,716 Speaker 2: And my dad said, keep your fucking wallet in your 360 00:21:05,766 --> 00:21:08,416 Speaker 2: front pocket. Then he took the board out of the 361 00:21:08,456 --> 00:21:11,186 Speaker 2: box and he held it up. 362 00:21:11,376 --> 00:21:11,996 Speaker 3: It was nighttime. 363 00:21:12,156 --> 00:21:14,376 Speaker 2: He held it up to his headlights. because he was 364 00:21:14,436 --> 00:21:21,176 Speaker 2: convinced that Mickey had put contraband in the surfboard. He 365 00:21:21,216 --> 00:21:23,296 Speaker 2: was like, there's no way that this is on the. 366 00:21:23,276 --> 00:21:23,696 Speaker 3: Up and up. 367 00:21:25,656 --> 00:21:30,016 Speaker 1: Chris understood his role. Mickey had made it clear. Mickey 368 00:21:30,056 --> 00:21:33,856 Speaker 1: was 65 years old and getting weaker. Chris was there 369 00:21:33,906 --> 00:21:36,166 Speaker 1: to carry his stuff, like a caddy. 370 00:21:37,166 --> 00:21:41,786 Speaker 3: So we land in Santiago, and I'm like, okay, this 371 00:21:41,866 --> 00:21:42,726 Speaker 3: is your trip? 372 00:21:43,586 --> 00:21:46,206 Speaker 2: You know, and I'm coming at your behest, okay? 373 00:21:47,326 --> 00:21:49,586 Speaker 3: I've never been to Chubb. I don't even know if 374 00:21:49,606 --> 00:21:53,746 Speaker 3: there's waves here. I don't know anything. And we land. 375 00:21:53,946 --> 00:21:57,546 Speaker 3: I load all his shit while he's just standing there. 376 00:21:58,566 --> 00:22:02,606 Speaker 2: And the cab driver is like, okay, where are we going? 377 00:22:03,806 --> 00:22:09,906 Speaker 2: And he goes, well, take us to the beach. 378 00:22:10,926 --> 00:22:15,386 Speaker 3: And the guy's like... It's a big country, you know, 379 00:22:15,506 --> 00:22:18,906 Speaker 3: in Spanish. And he's like, just take us to the ocean. 380 00:22:19,806 --> 00:22:22,956 Speaker 3: And I'm like, I'm fucked. Like, I don't even know 381 00:22:23,036 --> 00:22:23,856 Speaker 3: where we're going. 382 00:22:24,936 --> 00:22:28,136 Speaker 1: The cab driver took them four hours to Pichalemu, a 383 00:22:28,176 --> 00:22:29,436 Speaker 1: surf spot on the coast. 384 00:22:30,436 --> 00:22:33,176 Speaker 2: Then we get to the first hotel, haul all of 385 00:22:33,236 --> 00:22:35,806 Speaker 2: my shit in there, haul all of his shit in there. 386 00:22:36,346 --> 00:22:40,046 Speaker 3: There's no hot water. He goes, we're not staying here. 387 00:22:40,506 --> 00:22:42,836 Speaker 3: And I'm like, yes, we are. I'm like, we just 388 00:22:42,856 --> 00:22:46,096 Speaker 3: flew all night. I'm not, no, we're moving. 389 00:22:46,836 --> 00:22:50,616 Speaker 2: So I got everything out, freaking dragged it through the streets, 390 00:22:50,736 --> 00:22:52,076 Speaker 2: found another hotel. 391 00:22:52,956 --> 00:22:56,256 Speaker 3: And yeah, he was a bit of a prince. 392 00:22:59,296 --> 00:23:02,846 Speaker 1: Mickey was high maintenance, but for Chris, it was worth it. 393 00:23:03,566 --> 00:23:07,026 Speaker 1: He couldn't believe he was traveling and surfing with the 394 00:23:07,246 --> 00:23:11,326 Speaker 1: Mickey Dora. Not just a prince, the Dark Prince. 395 00:23:12,426 --> 00:23:16,026 Speaker 2: We had so much like solitude, you know, I mean, 396 00:23:16,046 --> 00:23:18,156 Speaker 2: this is a short period of time, but I was 397 00:23:18,776 --> 00:23:20,076 Speaker 2: just locked. 398 00:23:19,916 --> 00:23:21,156 Speaker 3: On at all times. 399 00:23:22,216 --> 00:23:24,496 Speaker 2: We were in a hotel room and I had been, 400 00:23:25,336 --> 00:23:27,316 Speaker 2: I was tired of listening to him talk and I 401 00:23:27,356 --> 00:23:29,226 Speaker 2: wanted to go to sleep, but I don't want to 402 00:23:29,266 --> 00:23:33,866 Speaker 2: miss anything. So I put on my little mini disc. 403 00:23:43,776 --> 00:23:45,096 Speaker 3: It's hard to get vitamins in France. 404 00:23:45,466 --> 00:23:46,036 Speaker 8: Very difficult. 405 00:23:46,356 --> 00:23:46,606 Speaker 7: Is it? 406 00:23:46,726 --> 00:23:48,266 Speaker 3: I can't get anything like that. That's why. You must 407 00:23:48,286 --> 00:23:50,006 Speaker 3: think I'm a nutcase. No, I don't. I don't think 408 00:23:50,026 --> 00:23:50,806 Speaker 3: you're a nutcase at all. 409 00:23:50,826 --> 00:23:54,926 Speaker 8: But I'm just trying to ward off any type of flu, 410 00:23:54,966 --> 00:23:57,586 Speaker 8: which is the pollen you get from Europe over to Fiji. 411 00:23:57,666 --> 00:23:57,886 Speaker 6: Yeah. 412 00:23:59,346 --> 00:24:00,986 Speaker 3: And if I get sick, man, I'm screwed. 413 00:24:02,666 --> 00:24:06,816 Speaker 1: It was an intimate experience being with Mickey like that, one-on-one, 414 00:24:06,996 --> 00:24:07,856 Speaker 1: for two weeks. 415 00:24:09,656 --> 00:24:12,576 Speaker 3: Well, you're doing well. I can't believe you're 65 years old. 416 00:24:14,226 --> 00:24:16,566 Speaker 3: I can't believe it either. I don't know what happened. 417 00:24:16,606 --> 00:24:23,376 Speaker 3: It went like that. It was fun. See ya. It's 418 00:24:25,516 --> 00:24:29,646 Speaker 3: not the end, Mick. I'm afraid so. 419 00:24:34,466 --> 00:24:37,686 Speaker 1: In spite of his age and signs of infirmity, Mickey 420 00:24:37,726 --> 00:24:40,006 Speaker 1: was still an unbelievable surfer. 421 00:24:41,006 --> 00:24:45,736 Speaker 2: Yeah, we happened upon some incredible incredible surf there was 422 00:24:45,776 --> 00:24:50,036 Speaker 2: this left and um it went from here to that 423 00:24:50,096 --> 00:24:52,986 Speaker 2: ridgeline right there i'm not kidding he gets this way 424 00:24:53,026 --> 00:24:56,286 Speaker 2: from the top all the way through and it's a 425 00:24:56,326 --> 00:24:59,466 Speaker 2: left and i'm at the bottom because i got the 426 00:24:59,506 --> 00:25:02,706 Speaker 2: way before and uh he kicks out. 427 00:25:03,046 --> 00:25:07,716 Speaker 3: And i'm like mick we did it and he goes 428 00:25:08,006 --> 00:25:09,336 Speaker 3: i fucking hate lefts. 429 00:25:10,946 --> 00:25:14,846 Speaker 2: Like, you just got the most beautiful wave I've ever seen. 430 00:25:14,866 --> 00:25:17,326 Speaker 3: And he's like, we got to find a right. 431 00:25:18,746 --> 00:25:22,076 Speaker 2: And that sums Mickey Dora up. 432 00:25:23,396 --> 00:25:26,336 Speaker 1: The whole time they were together, Chris avoided talking about 433 00:25:26,376 --> 00:25:31,016 Speaker 1: his surf career. He'd read Mickey's rants about commercialization. He 434 00:25:31,056 --> 00:25:34,096 Speaker 1: didn't want Mickey to know he was a sellout, a pro. 435 00:25:35,276 --> 00:25:37,226 Speaker 3: So I hid the fact that I was a pro 436 00:25:37,246 --> 00:25:39,566 Speaker 3: surfer from him. Okay. 437 00:25:41,456 --> 00:25:43,336 Speaker 2: He didn't know that I was a pro surfer, and 438 00:25:43,376 --> 00:25:47,556 Speaker 2: he loathed pro surfers, even though he was the prototype 439 00:25:48,096 --> 00:25:49,976 Speaker 2: of the pro surfing, right? 440 00:25:51,196 --> 00:25:54,916 Speaker 1: But Chris delicately inquired about the surf industry and what 441 00:25:55,016 --> 00:25:56,716 Speaker 1: Mickey thought about other pros. 442 00:25:57,936 --> 00:26:03,746 Speaker 8: I play tennis and golf with these guys, Slater and Rabbit. 443 00:26:04,366 --> 00:26:07,446 Speaker 3: They play good tennis and real good golf, but I 444 00:26:07,466 --> 00:26:10,706 Speaker 3: don't get involved with their lives. I just exercise and 445 00:26:12,096 --> 00:26:13,996 Speaker 3: I mean, they're real decent to me, no problem. I mean, 446 00:26:14,056 --> 00:26:16,466 Speaker 3: I don't tell them how they should live their life. 447 00:26:16,486 --> 00:26:18,766 Speaker 3: They don't tell me, so I mean, let them live. 448 00:26:20,606 --> 00:26:21,306 Speaker 3: No big deal. 449 00:26:24,826 --> 00:26:30,256 Speaker 4: But, I mean, I wouldn't ever do what they do. 450 00:26:30,296 --> 00:26:34,596 Speaker 6: It's a whole different way of looking at it. 451 00:26:35,356 --> 00:26:36,886 Speaker 3: Who am I to say anything? 452 00:26:38,926 --> 00:26:41,906 Speaker 2: I think it's more like the industry, the businessmen that 453 00:26:41,946 --> 00:26:43,546 Speaker 2: have ruined the sport, not the surfers. 454 00:26:43,896 --> 00:26:46,456 Speaker 3: The surfers are just opportunists. They just take what's given 455 00:26:46,496 --> 00:26:46,736 Speaker 3: to them. 456 00:26:50,376 --> 00:26:54,656 Speaker 8: If you relax, how can you do anything with caravans 457 00:26:54,696 --> 00:26:57,176 Speaker 8: and camera people and going everywhere you go? You have 458 00:26:57,216 --> 00:27:01,996 Speaker 8: no privacy, nothing. I don't consider that a. 459 00:27:04,296 --> 00:27:04,736 Speaker 3: Lifestyle. 460 00:27:08,166 --> 00:27:11,106 Speaker 1: Chris kept his secret for two weeks, the whole time 461 00:27:11,136 --> 00:27:15,136 Speaker 1: they were together. But after Chris had left Chile, Mickey 462 00:27:15,176 --> 00:27:17,476 Speaker 1: discovered the truth at a local restaurant. 463 00:27:18,636 --> 00:27:23,116 Speaker 2: And there was, there's this poster of me surfing the pipeline. 464 00:27:24,836 --> 00:27:26,276 Speaker 3: And Mickey goes, what's that? 465 00:27:27,076 --> 00:27:29,736 Speaker 2: And apparently he tore it off the wall and threw it, like, 466 00:27:30,196 --> 00:27:33,476 Speaker 2: pretended like it was on fire and was like, I 467 00:27:33,536 --> 00:27:37,296 Speaker 2: thought I knew who that kid was. I felt so bad. 468 00:27:37,906 --> 00:27:41,026 Speaker 2: And I'm like, in the same breath, though, I'm like, 469 00:27:41,086 --> 00:27:44,026 Speaker 2: fuck you, Mickey. Like, you made money surfing. I made 470 00:27:44,086 --> 00:27:48,066 Speaker 2: money surfing. And you made money in chest-high Malibu. The 471 00:27:48,106 --> 00:27:51,526 Speaker 2: wave that you got pissed off was like 20-foot pipeline. 472 00:27:51,586 --> 00:27:54,726 Speaker 3: So what do you got? What shit are you talking? 473 00:27:55,846 --> 00:27:59,656 Speaker 1: Mickey, Chris said, was part of surfing's original sin. 474 00:28:00,836 --> 00:28:06,066 Speaker 2: He was complicit in what occurred at Malibu, hugely. I 475 00:28:06,106 --> 00:28:08,046 Speaker 2: was able to take money from the man. 476 00:28:08,546 --> 00:28:11,606 Speaker 3: No problem. I did the dance. I was a dancing bear. 477 00:28:12,426 --> 00:28:14,726 Speaker 3: I was, otherwise I was going to be driving a 478 00:28:14,786 --> 00:28:18,796 Speaker 3: bulldozer for my dad. So it was like, if I. 479 00:28:18,736 --> 00:28:23,396 Speaker 2: Can put on like a bright singlet and go, you know, 480 00:28:23,516 --> 00:28:25,476 Speaker 2: do the deal and I'll. 481 00:28:25,356 --> 00:28:28,396 Speaker 3: Get paid for it. Like I, I, I did what 482 00:28:28,416 --> 00:28:30,036 Speaker 3: I did. You know, I got work. 483 00:28:31,296 --> 00:28:34,316 Speaker 2: Um, and just like when I sort of, critique modern 484 00:28:34,376 --> 00:28:37,136 Speaker 2: surfing and what it's become I have to accept my 485 00:28:37,516 --> 00:28:41,036 Speaker 2: own complicity in it you know because we made surf 486 00:28:41,076 --> 00:28:42,576 Speaker 2: films and all. 487 00:28:42,376 --> 00:28:43,356 Speaker 3: That stuff you know. 488 00:28:47,756 --> 00:28:50,176 Speaker 2: There was a kind of an endearing moment where I 489 00:28:51,156 --> 00:28:57,216 Speaker 2: was leaving to head to Antarctica and I said alright 490 00:28:57,296 --> 00:28:59,996 Speaker 2: Mick you know it meant a lot to me you 491 00:29:00,036 --> 00:29:02,336 Speaker 2: know and I'm heading out. 492 00:29:03,956 --> 00:29:05,536 Speaker 3: And he goes, I'm going to go find that right. 493 00:29:05,556 --> 00:29:08,916 Speaker 3: All right, bye. And he just walks away. And I 494 00:29:08,936 --> 00:29:09,596 Speaker 3: was like.... 495 00:29:11,696 --> 00:29:16,076 Speaker 1: So that was it? No sentimental moment? No nothing? 496 00:29:17,596 --> 00:29:20,076 Speaker 2: And then we're getting the truck, and I'm going to 497 00:29:20,156 --> 00:29:25,316 Speaker 2: the bus station. And all of a sudden I hear this. 498 00:29:26,316 --> 00:29:26,976 Speaker 2: On the side of the. 499 00:29:26,926 --> 00:29:28,106 Speaker 3: Truck, I look over, it's Mick. 500 00:29:29,226 --> 00:29:31,846 Speaker 1: Mickey made up some excuse to join Chris on the drive, 501 00:29:32,526 --> 00:29:36,116 Speaker 1: but Chris didn't believe it. he could tell that Mickey 502 00:29:36,156 --> 00:29:37,836 Speaker 1: wasn't ready to say goodbye. 503 00:29:48,136 --> 00:29:53,106 Speaker 3: Might have to take these in case we lose each other. 504 00:29:56,226 --> 00:29:56,726 Speaker 7: Try it out. 505 00:29:56,966 --> 00:30:00,666 Speaker 3: Just press the side. Yeah, press the side and talk. 506 00:30:01,246 --> 00:30:04,636 Speaker 3: It's not working. Is yours on? Oh, you're not pushing it. 507 00:30:04,956 --> 00:30:08,436 Speaker 3: There you go. 508 00:30:09,156 --> 00:30:09,976 Speaker 1: Over and out. 509 00:30:14,686 --> 00:30:15,826 Speaker 6: Jerry's at 3 o'clock. 510 00:30:17,666 --> 00:30:19,706 Speaker 1: Am I coming in loud and clear? 511 00:30:21,666 --> 00:30:24,686 Speaker 3: Yes, you are, sir. I think I'm going to need backup. 512 00:30:25,346 --> 00:30:31,356 Speaker 3: Send backup at 5 o'clock. Can't do a thing for you. 513 00:30:31,896 --> 00:30:33,516 Speaker 3: I haven't got my welfare check yet. 514 00:30:34,436 --> 00:30:40,676 Speaker 2: How do you turn them off? 515 00:30:45,996 --> 00:30:48,896 Speaker 1: Chris and Mickey stayed in touch after the trip. They 516 00:30:48,976 --> 00:30:52,056 Speaker 1: even had dinner in Santa Barbara, near Mickey's dad's house. 517 00:30:53,036 --> 00:30:56,786 Speaker 1: This must have been pretty soon before Mickey died. Chris 518 00:30:56,806 --> 00:30:59,746 Speaker 1: has a story about the dinner. I've heard a lot 519 00:30:59,786 --> 00:31:02,686 Speaker 1: of Mickey Dora stories by now, but this one is 520 00:31:02,726 --> 00:31:03,306 Speaker 1: my favorite. 521 00:31:06,086 --> 00:31:08,306 Speaker 2: Mickey had told me, I'm going to find a right 522 00:31:09,476 --> 00:31:12,896 Speaker 2: in Chile when I left. But the way the Southern 523 00:31:12,956 --> 00:31:17,916 Speaker 2: Hemisphere works... All the swell comes, it's all lefts. There's 524 00:31:17,936 --> 00:31:20,116 Speaker 2: a couple rights, but it's all lefts. 525 00:31:21,856 --> 00:31:25,056 Speaker 1: Remember, Mickey had spurned that beautiful wave he and Chris 526 00:31:25,076 --> 00:31:28,046 Speaker 1: surfed in Chile because it was a left, and Mickey 527 00:31:28,086 --> 00:31:28,926 Speaker 1: preferred to go right. 528 00:31:29,446 --> 00:31:35,686 Speaker 3: So we go to dinner, and. 529 00:31:36,306 --> 00:31:39,726 Speaker 2: I took my brother Keith with me. And my brother, 530 00:31:39,826 --> 00:31:42,956 Speaker 2: we look like twins. So Keith has used the restroom. 531 00:31:43,856 --> 00:31:47,216 Speaker 3: And he goes, who is that? Who's that guy? My 532 00:31:47,276 --> 00:31:47,996 Speaker 3: fucking brother. 533 00:31:48,016 --> 00:31:50,716 Speaker 2: And then he pulls out a slide and he goes, 534 00:31:50,776 --> 00:31:51,596 Speaker 2: I found the right. 535 00:31:52,516 --> 00:31:53,436 Speaker 3: I found the right. 536 00:31:54,036 --> 00:31:57,256 Speaker 2: And he's making sure to do it before my brother 537 00:31:57,296 --> 00:32:01,786 Speaker 2: gets back. And he holds up this slide and it's 538 00:32:02,646 --> 00:32:05,406 Speaker 2: a left that he turned the slide backwards. 539 00:32:06,206 --> 00:32:08,166 Speaker 3: Like it's clearly backwards. 540 00:32:09,046 --> 00:32:11,486 Speaker 2: And he's like, I found it. Like kind of like 541 00:32:11,586 --> 00:32:13,996 Speaker 2: I missed out on it, you know? And then my 542 00:32:14,036 --> 00:32:16,536 Speaker 2: brother comes back and he's like, just stuffs it in 543 00:32:16,576 --> 00:32:17,156 Speaker 2: his pocket. 544 00:32:20,836 --> 00:32:24,466 Speaker 1: For Chris, Mickey's surfing style is seductive, but it's his 545 00:32:24,666 --> 00:32:29,306 Speaker 1: attitude towards surfing that he admires most. Mickey represented the 546 00:32:29,386 --> 00:32:32,846 Speaker 1: rebel soul of surfing. Of course he wanted to plug 547 00:32:32,886 --> 00:32:33,386 Speaker 1: into that. 548 00:32:34,486 --> 00:32:37,166 Speaker 2: My favorite surfers are the guys that are doing amazing 549 00:32:37,226 --> 00:32:38,266 Speaker 2: things in a subtle way. 550 00:32:39,986 --> 00:32:43,536 Speaker 3: But really, the thing.... 551 00:32:43,916 --> 00:32:48,496 Speaker 2: About Mick that is the most lasting was fuck society. 552 00:32:48,516 --> 00:32:51,276 Speaker 3: It was fuck everybody. 553 00:32:51,296 --> 00:32:54,756 Speaker 2: I'm going to do it whatever I want, whenever I want, 554 00:32:54,856 --> 00:33:00,386 Speaker 2: the way I want. And that, like, that really, you know, 555 00:33:00,586 --> 00:33:03,716 Speaker 2: if we go into the 60s, 70s, and even early 80s, 556 00:33:05,046 --> 00:33:08,146 Speaker 2: you know, and that carried on into punk rock and 557 00:33:08,286 --> 00:33:11,346 Speaker 2: skating and rock and roll and all that, you know, 558 00:33:11,386 --> 00:33:14,246 Speaker 2: it was fuck everybody. I'm not going to do it 559 00:33:14,286 --> 00:33:17,926 Speaker 2: your way. I'm going to do it my way. And 560 00:33:18,006 --> 00:33:19,106 Speaker 2: it's not just in the water. 561 00:33:19,466 --> 00:33:20,146 Speaker 3: It's on land. 562 00:33:21,206 --> 00:33:27,856 Speaker 2: That's the most lasting signature of Mickey Dora to me. 563 00:33:29,036 --> 00:33:29,616 Speaker 3: Do it my way. 564 00:33:33,276 --> 00:33:37,266 Speaker 1: Listening to Chris, I think he identifies with Mickey's disappointment, too. 565 00:33:37,946 --> 00:33:40,586 Speaker 1: That the California of old is disappearing. 566 00:33:41,776 --> 00:33:45,056 Speaker 2: The ocean was a gift to him as it is 567 00:33:45,096 --> 00:33:47,666 Speaker 2: for all of us. You know, I mean, he talked 568 00:33:47,686 --> 00:33:51,046 Speaker 2: to me about like riding horses up into the canyon 569 00:33:51,066 --> 00:33:56,106 Speaker 2: and catching trout to beach blanket bingo. And he watched 570 00:33:56,446 --> 00:34:00,486 Speaker 2: LA turn into an absolute shit show. And it pissed 571 00:34:00,506 --> 00:34:04,866 Speaker 2: him off to no end as it should have. He 572 00:34:04,906 --> 00:34:08,626 Speaker 2: watched the LA river turn into concrete. And he said, 573 00:34:08,766 --> 00:34:11,426 Speaker 2: fuck all y'all. I'm not cool with this. 574 00:34:14,656 --> 00:34:17,116 Speaker 1: There was one more story Chris wanted to tell me. 575 00:34:17,136 --> 00:34:20,176 Speaker 1: This one had stayed with him because it was so 576 00:34:20,216 --> 00:34:25,256 Speaker 1: mysterious and painful and unresolved. And it was about the 577 00:34:25,316 --> 00:34:30,046 Speaker 1: person in Mickey's family circle you almost never hear about. Ramona, 578 00:34:30,436 --> 00:34:33,746 Speaker 1: his mom, who Mickey seemed to worship as a little 579 00:34:33,806 --> 00:34:36,726 Speaker 1: boy and who had basically abandoned him. 580 00:34:38,486 --> 00:34:43,066 Speaker 2: One night we're in this cabin where we were gifted 581 00:34:43,146 --> 00:34:47,156 Speaker 2: a place to stay. staying on the couch, and he 582 00:34:47,396 --> 00:34:49,696 Speaker 2: got the bedroom. Like there was a little bedroom at 583 00:34:49,716 --> 00:34:52,956 Speaker 2: the top. 584 00:34:52,976 --> 00:34:55,056 Speaker 3: And he was. 585 00:34:57,256 --> 00:35:01,416 Speaker 2: Besmirching his mother pretty heavily and saying how he never 586 00:35:01,456 --> 00:35:04,496 Speaker 2: got anything from her and that she didn't take care 587 00:35:04,536 --> 00:35:13,616 Speaker 2: of him. And I just listened. And that next morning, 588 00:35:14,686 --> 00:35:19,506 Speaker 2: I wanted to go surfing and he wasn't up. And 589 00:35:19,526 --> 00:35:21,866 Speaker 2: I was like, oh, that's kind of curious. So I 590 00:35:21,926 --> 00:35:26,926 Speaker 2: went up and he was laying there awake and there 591 00:35:26,946 --> 00:35:32,466 Speaker 2: was a picture of his mother with two candles on 592 00:35:32,526 --> 00:35:32,886 Speaker 2: each side. 593 00:35:35,546 --> 00:35:38,746 Speaker 1: Did you know if she was already dead at that point? 594 00:35:38,826 --> 00:35:39,126 Speaker 3: Oh yeah. 595 00:35:39,146 --> 00:35:40,266 Speaker 1: She was long dead, right? 596 00:35:40,386 --> 00:35:40,666 Speaker 6: Yeah. 597 00:35:41,566 --> 00:35:45,836 Speaker 3: But it was like, that wasn't, For sure. He didn't 598 00:35:45,876 --> 00:35:48,366 Speaker 3: know I was going to climb the ladder up to 599 00:35:48,426 --> 00:35:49,186 Speaker 3: his little loft. 600 00:35:50,046 --> 00:35:53,806 Speaker 2: It showed me that like he truly was like when 601 00:35:53,846 --> 00:35:59,566 Speaker 2: he speaks in these sort of code and is here 602 00:36:00,206 --> 00:36:04,136 Speaker 2: nor there and then back again. Like he really that 603 00:36:04,176 --> 00:36:07,736 Speaker 2: really was him. It wasn't all show is my point. 604 00:36:10,016 --> 00:36:14,546 Speaker 2: I've been trying to figure that out since 2003. I 605 00:36:14,586 --> 00:36:17,866 Speaker 2: don't know how that worked out, you know? He didn't 606 00:36:17,886 --> 00:36:22,086 Speaker 2: say anything super mean-spirited, but it was like, my mom 607 00:36:22,106 --> 00:36:26,526 Speaker 2: didn't take care of me. You know, she basically, you know, didn't, 608 00:36:26,586 --> 00:36:29,776 Speaker 2: you know, just turn me out, really, you know? 609 00:36:32,416 --> 00:36:37,216 Speaker 3: Yeah. I've never, I really thought a lot about that. 610 00:36:37,236 --> 00:36:38,756 Speaker 3: And I'm like, why does it look like that? 611 00:36:39,236 --> 00:36:44,996 Speaker 2: Psychologically, like, what it meant is that he was... Maybe 612 00:36:46,496 --> 00:36:49,056 Speaker 2: venting because he was hurt by that, you know, and 613 00:36:50,876 --> 00:36:52,556 Speaker 2: wishes things would have been different. 614 00:36:54,976 --> 00:36:55,276 Speaker 3: Maybe. 615 00:37:00,486 --> 00:37:04,066 Speaker 1: After the Chile trip, Mickey's health declined. He got a 616 00:37:04,106 --> 00:37:09,146 Speaker 1: diagnosis of pancreatic cancer. In November 2001, his patrons at 617 00:37:09,186 --> 00:37:13,526 Speaker 1: Quicksilver bought him a round-trip ticket back to California, first class. 618 00:37:14,796 --> 00:37:19,356 Speaker 1: The return portion was just a kindness. Everyone knew Mickey 619 00:37:19,376 --> 00:37:24,336 Speaker 1: was leaving France for good. Miklos was still alive. He'd 620 00:37:24,376 --> 00:37:29,316 Speaker 1: live another 20 years, to the age of 107. So 621 00:37:29,356 --> 00:37:33,076 Speaker 1: from France, Mickey went to Montecito and spent his last 622 00:37:33,136 --> 00:37:36,896 Speaker 1: days at his father's house, lying naked in the sun. 623 00:37:38,516 --> 00:37:43,716 Speaker 1: He died in early January 2002. He never went back 624 00:37:43,776 --> 00:37:46,776 Speaker 1: to the beach that made him famous. But on the 625 00:37:46,816 --> 00:37:52,636 Speaker 1: day he died, someone painted the wall at Malibu. Dora lives. 626 00:38:00,186 --> 00:38:03,226 Speaker 1: But Mickey still had a few tricks up his sleeve. 627 00:38:05,226 --> 00:38:07,826 Speaker 7: We found out after he died that he had $ 400, 000 628 00:38:07,306 --> 00:38:11,506 Speaker 7: in a Swiss bank account, but he didn't go after it. 629 00:38:11,546 --> 00:38:13,666 Speaker 7: He He was living like a poor man, and he, 630 00:38:14,566 --> 00:38:17,806 Speaker 7: you know, went from hand to mouth and acted like 631 00:38:17,866 --> 00:38:18,506 Speaker 7: a poor person. 632 00:38:19,126 --> 00:38:21,806 Speaker 1: That's Bob Simpson, the lawyer who knew Mickey at the 633 00:38:21,846 --> 00:38:25,666 Speaker 1: end of his life. Mickey, for years, had pretended to 634 00:38:25,686 --> 00:38:29,986 Speaker 1: be destitute. That turned out to be another ruse in 635 00:38:30,026 --> 00:38:31,526 Speaker 1: a long line of ruses. 636 00:38:33,186 --> 00:38:35,786 Speaker 6: And the thing that's so strange about the whole Mickey thing, 637 00:38:35,826 --> 00:38:38,356 Speaker 6: he didn't have to do any of it. It was 638 00:38:38,476 --> 00:38:39,476 Speaker 6: all unnecessary. 639 00:38:40,616 --> 00:38:43,686 Speaker 1: This is Denny Auberg. the surfer who knew Mickey way 640 00:38:43,726 --> 00:38:45,406 Speaker 1: back in the 50s in Malibu. 641 00:38:46,606 --> 00:38:48,566 Speaker 6: Any dark thing that he did, he could have done 642 00:38:48,606 --> 00:38:55,546 Speaker 6: it another way. His dad had money. He didn't have 643 00:38:55,566 --> 00:38:57,506 Speaker 6: to do it, you know. But that's that thing, that 644 00:38:57,546 --> 00:39:01,696 Speaker 6: little quirk where he just kind of, like he just 645 00:39:01,756 --> 00:39:03,476 Speaker 6: wanted to see if he could get away with it. 646 00:39:03,536 --> 00:39:03,996 Speaker 3: I don't know. 647 00:39:04,176 --> 00:39:08,456 Speaker 6: I'm not a psychologist, but like a lot of people, 648 00:39:08,556 --> 00:39:09,716 Speaker 6: they self-destruct. 649 00:39:09,756 --> 00:39:09,996 Speaker 3: You know. 650 00:39:18,336 --> 00:39:25,816 Speaker 1: Next time on Lost Hills, what Mickey left behind. There 651 00:39:25,876 --> 00:39:32,626 Speaker 1: are 64 letters from all over the world with addresses 652 00:39:32,646 --> 00:39:33,586 Speaker 1: and stamps. 653 00:39:34,766 --> 00:39:35,966 Speaker 4: Wow, this is intense. 654 00:39:36,626 --> 00:39:38,396 Speaker 3: Yeah, I had to let them sit for a couple 655 00:39:38,416 --> 00:39:41,396 Speaker 3: of weeks before I actually would open them to get 656 00:39:41,416 --> 00:39:43,116 Speaker 3: my head right, you know, to be sure I was 657 00:39:43,176 --> 00:39:44,756 Speaker 3: ready to read some of this stuff. 658 00:39:47,356 --> 00:39:50,746 Speaker 1: That's next in the final episode of The Dark Prince, 659 00:39:51,426 --> 00:39:52,726 Speaker 1: a nasty piece of work. 660 00:39:55,356 --> 00:39:55,496 Speaker 6: Bye. 661 00:39:55,536 --> 00:39:55,796 Speaker 7: Bye. Bye.