WEBVTT - All Ball - Pt. 1: Marquette HC Shaka Smart on Hoops Background, Coaching Ladder Climb, Lebron Pre-Draft Workouts 0:00:06.960 --> 0:00:09.440 Hey, welcome in. I'm Doug Gottlie. This is All ball 0:00:09.640 --> 0:00:12.440 Um All Ball. If this is your first time downloading 0:00:12.480 --> 0:00:15.200 it and listened to this pod, we do some current 0:00:15.480 --> 0:00:19.320 state of college basketball stuff. I'll give you some analysis, 0:00:19.360 --> 0:00:21.320 I'll give you some thoughts, and i'll rant and no 0:00:21.440 --> 0:00:25.440 break but what I love and I'll just be honest. 0:00:25.480 --> 0:00:29.680 Like I I love conversations with basketball people. I feel 0:00:29.720 --> 0:00:32.559 like I feel like they're family. I feel like they're 0:00:32.600 --> 0:00:36.839 they speak my language. But I also love people's stories. 0:00:36.880 --> 0:00:41.320 Everyone has a story. And I was I was driving 0:00:41.960 --> 0:00:45.440 is actually a true story. I was driving to Bowling Green, 0:00:45.560 --> 0:00:50.559 Kentucky doing a game for Stadium Sports, and I had 0:00:50.600 --> 0:00:56.880 done one in uh Murphysboro, Tennessee like that night, and 0:00:56.920 --> 0:00:59.400 then I had one in Bowling Green, West Kentucky the 0:00:59.440 --> 0:01:03.760 next night. These are the glandless the glamorous life of 0:01:03.760 --> 0:01:06.560 of Doug gottlieb U a couple of years ago. Probably 0:01:06.959 --> 0:01:09.639 this is pretty pandemic, I think four years ago. And 0:01:10.319 --> 0:01:12.760 the rental car I have a I have a like 0:01:12.840 --> 0:01:16.240 my rental car hack is this I will go from 0:01:16.400 --> 0:01:19.680 because I have Emerald Isle. I'll go rental car to 0:01:19.760 --> 0:01:21.959 rental car to rental car with the one with the 0:01:22.040 --> 0:01:25.760 least possible marks. Who doesn't love a car with new 0:01:25.800 --> 0:01:29.280 car smell? You know one. I can't drive something that 0:01:29.319 --> 0:01:32.000 somebody smoked in and too if I can get one 0:01:32.040 --> 0:01:34.559 with a couple hundred miles or with that new car smell. 0:01:34.959 --> 0:01:38.240 And here's the other trick is often new cars they 0:01:38.280 --> 0:01:41.039 get free satellite radio. Now this was before my cheap 0:01:41.080 --> 0:01:44.000 ass ponied up, so I got the app whatever and 0:01:44.400 --> 0:01:47.920 the satellite radio. I hadn't listened to Stern in years. 0:01:49.120 --> 0:01:52.160 And I was driving, and I was a Megan Trainer. 0:01:53.280 --> 0:01:58.320 Megan Trainer was on was telling her story and it 0:01:58.440 --> 0:02:01.360 was about he went in to meet to l a read. 0:02:02.400 --> 0:02:05.640 She was a singer songwriter. She played the ukulele for 0:02:05.680 --> 0:02:09.520 her songs and she had to learn the entire song. Um. 0:02:09.560 --> 0:02:12.600 But it wasn't it's all about that base. It was 0:02:13.160 --> 0:02:16.160 I'm gonna like I'm Gonna lose you you know that song? 0:02:16.320 --> 0:02:20.359 Really cool bluesy tune. Anyway, it was her life story, 0:02:20.680 --> 0:02:23.120 and I thought, man, I think about so many my 0:02:23.200 --> 0:02:26.119 friends and their stories and the quirky things that led 0:02:26.160 --> 0:02:28.400 them to where they are and the lessons they learned 0:02:28.400 --> 0:02:30.400 along the way, and how great that would be to share, 0:02:30.440 --> 0:02:34.520 and I mean this is like an audio book. Well, 0:02:35.200 --> 0:02:38.360 I think we nailed it with this one. I really do, 0:02:38.880 --> 0:02:41.880 and I'm going to give most of the credit. Two 0:02:41.880 --> 0:02:45.600 Shaka Smart. Shaka is a really interesting human being. He's 0:02:45.639 --> 0:02:49.000 also a fantastic basketball coach and Marquette really really good. 0:02:49.520 --> 0:02:51.240 So I want you to picture this in your mind, like, 0:02:52.040 --> 0:02:54.960 what do you do that morning after maybe your biggest 0:02:54.960 --> 0:02:57.680 win the season? They just beat Yukon from the sixteen 0:02:57.720 --> 0:03:01.160 thou people, I played great. He's the toast of the town. 0:03:01.840 --> 0:03:05.840 We have a set up interview and um parts one 0:03:05.919 --> 0:03:11.720 and two are an hour, right, we're gonna we're gonna 0:03:11.720 --> 0:03:14.600 do part three and four, but we actually haven't gotten 0:03:14.639 --> 0:03:16.720 to it yet. I'm letting you weigh inside the belt 0:03:16.800 --> 0:03:22.280 right here. Okay, So part one? Who is Shakra Smart? 0:03:22.840 --> 0:03:26.160 You probably know parts of the story. You know he's 0:03:26.240 --> 0:03:29.400 maybe you know he's from the state of Wisconsin. But 0:03:29.480 --> 0:03:32.280 wait to hear what he does, what he's always done 0:03:33.080 --> 0:03:37.680 after he loses a game. How did he become a 0:03:37.760 --> 0:03:39.880 college coach? Wait, before college coach? Why do you go 0:03:39.920 --> 0:03:44.440 to Kenyon College in Ohio? If he's from Wisconsin, and 0:03:44.600 --> 0:03:47.000 you need to keep in mind that Wisconsin at the 0:03:47.080 --> 0:03:48.920 time in which he was coming out in high school. 0:03:49.600 --> 0:03:51.840 That was the premier they had, you know, Bo Ryan 0:03:51.920 --> 0:03:55.160 and all the Ryan you uh, this is you know 0:03:56.000 --> 0:03:58.160 right as in the era which he left and went 0:03:58.200 --> 0:04:03.200 to u W Milwaukee. But Division three basketball in Wisconsin 0:04:03.400 --> 0:04:07.600 is outstanding. Why would you go to Ohio? And then 0:04:08.080 --> 0:04:11.440 how did you get the coaching? And then what what 0:04:11.600 --> 0:04:15.440 allowed you to climb the ladder so quickly? All right? 0:04:15.560 --> 0:04:20.400 Part one? Who is Shaka? What's he? What? What? What 0:04:20.480 --> 0:04:25.040 does he do after losses? What was it like in 0:04:25.160 --> 0:04:29.120 high school? Why go to Kenyon College? Why get into coaching? 0:04:30.680 --> 0:04:34.240 It's all in here and in those personal stories where 0:04:34.279 --> 0:04:36.560 you drive from point A to point B, and so 0:04:36.600 --> 0:04:39.520 many of you have texted me this is great. It's 0:04:39.520 --> 0:04:41.840 a must listen for coaches, Teck. I think it's a 0:04:41.880 --> 0:04:45.520 must listen for people because it's about finding your passion 0:04:46.360 --> 0:04:49.440 and deciding that you want to do it and understanding 0:04:49.480 --> 0:04:52.640 how to climb the ladder. Also, his personal life isn't 0:04:52.640 --> 0:04:56.400 here as well. Here's part one my talk with Chaka Smart, 0:04:56.520 --> 0:05:02.360 head coach of Marquette. I'm sure you're gonna enjoy it. Yeah, Okay, 0:05:02.360 --> 0:05:04.880 So I want to kind of I like to do 0:05:04.960 --> 0:05:09.039 chronological order. I think the brain works best that way, right, 0:05:09.279 --> 0:05:13.440 But before we do, UM, you guys at the time 0:05:13.440 --> 0:05:17.600 of this recording, you guys just beat Yukon, and there's 0:05:17.600 --> 0:05:20.960 a lot to it. But for you, considering all you've 0:05:21.000 --> 0:05:24.760 accomplished in your career, right at a young age, taking 0:05:25.000 --> 0:05:28.320 a team to the final four, obviously the various stops 0:05:28.320 --> 0:05:33.000 along the way, But when the buzzer is at zero 0:05:33.560 --> 0:05:38.599 and your team, your style beats Yukon, is there any 0:05:38.640 --> 0:05:42.640 sort of different feeling now in winning these games at 0:05:42.720 --> 0:05:47.200 this stop as opposed to previous stops. Ah, that's a 0:05:47.240 --> 0:05:50.560 great question. I think the great thing about Marquette because 0:05:50.560 --> 0:05:54.840 there's been so much success here in the past, like um, 0:05:54.880 --> 0:05:57.920 you know, I'm talking about like the seventies UM, and 0:05:57.960 --> 0:06:02.040 then the weight ruh, and then the great things that 0:06:02.160 --> 0:06:06.320 Tom Crean and and Buzz Williams did here. There's uh, 0:06:06.360 --> 0:06:11.839 there's a real real hunger to win games like that. UM. 0:06:11.880 --> 0:06:14.600 But I think there's also an understanding that we still 0:06:14.680 --> 0:06:19.160 have some respect to go take. We're not we're not 0:06:19.240 --> 0:06:23.200 thought of um in the same way that a Yukon is, 0:06:23.240 --> 0:06:25.599 and and we don't deserve to be yet they've won, 0:06:26.440 --> 0:06:30.480 um a lot more championships in games in recent memory. 0:06:30.640 --> 0:06:34.560 But UM, I think the great thing about here is 0:06:34.640 --> 0:06:36.960 right when you win it just it makes people so 0:06:37.040 --> 0:06:40.080 happy and most importantly the guys on the team. So 0:06:41.000 --> 0:06:44.400 that's the best best feeling. I guess maybe that maybe 0:06:44.600 --> 0:06:47.279 what I was wondering is is there ever a crisis 0:06:47.279 --> 0:06:53.159 in competence when you're coaching you know? Um, because that's 0:06:53.200 --> 0:06:55.159 the big thing with with players, as you know, as 0:06:55.200 --> 0:06:58.240 a corner player, right, it's the it's the guys go 0:06:58.320 --> 0:07:00.280 through up and downs in confidence, and you gotta coach it. 0:07:00.320 --> 0:07:05.760 You got understanding everybody's everybody's different, you know, and college 0:07:05.760 --> 0:07:09.279 basketball has changed and evolved during your time playing it 0:07:09.440 --> 0:07:12.200 and coaching it. And I just wonder if there was ever, 0:07:12.720 --> 0:07:14.640 you know, that crisis and competence. Then last night and 0:07:14.720 --> 0:07:17.240 some of these gigantic wins you had at Marquette, I mean, 0:07:17.280 --> 0:07:20.520 you flipped this thing. How having a heartbeat? If there's 0:07:20.880 --> 0:07:22.920 kind of a reinvigoration of you know what I do, 0:07:23.040 --> 0:07:25.240 know what the hell I'm doing? This stuff does in 0:07:25.280 --> 0:07:27.960 fact work. It's a great point and it's something that 0:07:28.480 --> 0:07:32.320 I used to work with a coach veteran coach named 0:07:32.400 --> 0:07:34.800 Larry Shyatt. Well, I'm sure you crossed paths was at 0:07:34.840 --> 0:07:38.000 some point, and he would say all the time, you know, 0:07:38.360 --> 0:07:42.840 coaching confident coach. The confidence of a coach is literally 0:07:42.960 --> 0:07:45.760 day to day. And that was that was kind of 0:07:45.800 --> 0:07:49.520 shys perspective. But what he meant was, your confidence is 0:07:49.560 --> 0:07:53.000 based on the team that you have. I mean, you 0:07:53.000 --> 0:07:55.040 you can feel like you know the game, you can 0:07:55.080 --> 0:07:57.480 feel like you you know, you work your butt off 0:07:57.640 --> 0:07:59.880 or whatever it may be. But the guys that you 0:08:00.040 --> 0:08:02.760 have out there on the team, if they don't exhibit 0:08:02.840 --> 0:08:08.400 the qualities culturally, defensively, offensively that you want to be about, 0:08:08.520 --> 0:08:13.160 then you're not gonna be very confident. And so yeah, absolutely, 0:08:13.240 --> 0:08:16.400 you know, for me, this is one of my two 0:08:17.600 --> 0:08:21.640 most favorite teams that I've coached in fourteen years. My 0:08:21.760 --> 0:08:24.880 other one was two thousand eleven twelve, the year after 0:08:24.920 --> 0:08:28.360 we went to the final four at VCU. And what 0:08:28.520 --> 0:08:32.240 those these two teams have in common is the guys 0:08:32.440 --> 0:08:37.720 really really really love each other, like truly, and there's 0:08:37.800 --> 0:08:43.920 also a level of humility, probably for different reasons, um about, 0:08:44.200 --> 0:08:46.560 hey we better do X, Y and Z to win. 0:08:47.440 --> 0:08:50.079 And uh, I'll tell you when you don't have confidence 0:08:50.120 --> 0:08:53.000 as a coach is when you know your guys don't 0:08:53.040 --> 0:08:56.560 have that humility and you're struggling to put that into them, 0:08:57.280 --> 0:09:00.000 and you're gonna go into a game where they don't 0:09:00.080 --> 0:09:02.760 necessarily have a full respect for what it's gonna take. 0:09:04.679 --> 0:09:08.680 What were you like as a high school player? Ah, 0:09:08.920 --> 0:09:11.120 passer man, You and I, You and I would have 0:09:11.160 --> 0:09:15.520 got along great, um, because I love to pass my 0:09:15.960 --> 0:09:19.000 Probably my favorite game as a high school player was 0:09:19.040 --> 0:09:21.319 a game where I had twenty assists and I think 0:09:21.360 --> 0:09:24.280 I might have shot like three times. Um. So I 0:09:24.800 --> 0:09:27.440 love to pass the ball. I love to uh to guard, 0:09:27.480 --> 0:09:29.400 pick up full court. That's where I got the pressing 0:09:29.440 --> 0:09:32.480 stuff from my high school coach. Who who's your schol 0:09:32.480 --> 0:09:35.920 Who's guy named Kevin Baver? You're still coaching in this 0:09:36.000 --> 0:09:38.600 state of Wisconsin. He's at a different high school now. 0:09:38.600 --> 0:09:40.840 He's done a school called Middleton High School just outside 0:09:40.840 --> 0:09:44.760 of Madison, Wisconsin. Um. And he's the one Doug that 0:09:44.840 --> 0:09:47.480 got me into coaching. Him and my college coach. I 0:09:47.520 --> 0:09:51.520 never really thought about coaching, but he, uh, he would 0:09:51.520 --> 0:09:54.120 have me coach at his camps. He would have me coach, 0:09:54.360 --> 0:09:58.280 you know, youth teams and Uh, it really got me 0:09:58.320 --> 0:10:00.960 thinking along the lines of coaching. But I was a 0:10:01.040 --> 0:10:03.760 terrible loser. You probably were too. I know you didn't 0:10:03.800 --> 0:10:05.960 lose many games, but when I was in high school, 0:10:06.679 --> 0:10:09.800 if we lost, I didn't talk to anyone for forty 0:10:09.840 --> 0:10:13.960 eight hours. And I look back on it, like, it's 0:10:14.000 --> 0:10:16.920 probably not a very mature approach, but I just I 0:10:16.960 --> 0:10:20.360 didn't handle it very well. I gotta be honest with you. 0:10:20.400 --> 0:10:22.280 I love it. I mean, I just I it's like 0:10:22.280 --> 0:10:25.600 one of those things where like social media has when 0:10:25.600 --> 0:10:27.679 people cry when they lose made fun of them, and 0:10:27.679 --> 0:10:30.040 I'm like, dude, I love that. If you're so invested now, 0:10:30.480 --> 0:10:33.240 you can't you know now when I start, you know, 0:10:33.320 --> 0:10:35.360 coaching kids and coaching teams, Like, hey, you don't have 0:10:35.400 --> 0:10:37.200 the right to feel bad if you didn't do the 0:10:37.200 --> 0:10:39.720 work to impair yourself, right, Like, I don't feel bad. 0:10:39.960 --> 0:10:42.079 Have you missed shots and you didn't you didn't work 0:10:42.080 --> 0:10:43.559 on your shooting it up, Like, don't feel bad. There's 0:10:43.559 --> 0:10:45.240 no big deal. Now. If you worked on it, you 0:10:45.280 --> 0:10:47.199 did everything in your power and you still lost it 0:10:47.280 --> 0:10:49.000 still to make shots, well, then you can kind of 0:10:49.000 --> 0:10:52.040 feel bad. So Okay, how good was your high school 0:10:53.280 --> 0:10:57.319 We were pretty good. We Uh, my senior year, we 0:10:57.320 --> 0:11:00.960 were upset. Um, you know, we were we were on 0:11:01.040 --> 0:11:03.559 track to go to the state Final four, which is 0:11:03.600 --> 0:11:05.920 in Madison, which is really really close to where we 0:11:06.360 --> 0:11:10.240 lived in Um, that was devastating. That's probably if I 0:11:10.280 --> 0:11:12.160 could have any game back in my career as a 0:11:12.160 --> 0:11:15.440 coach or a player, it would probably be that game, 0:11:16.120 --> 0:11:19.160 or maybe the Butler game in the final four. Okay, wait, 0:11:19.600 --> 0:11:21.200 we'll get to the Butler game in a second. Okay. 0:11:21.200 --> 0:11:24.520 So your high school was what Oregon High School? Just 0:11:24.559 --> 0:11:30.200 outside of me. So how far from medicine is fifteen minutes? Okay? 0:11:30.240 --> 0:11:33.280 And who did you play? You played as a school 0:11:33.280 --> 0:11:37.280 called Fort Atkinson and we had beat them twice in 0:11:37.280 --> 0:11:39.280 the regular season that we're in our conference. It's one 0:11:39.280 --> 0:11:41.600 of those deals, you know, where you beat a team 0:11:41.640 --> 0:11:43.400 a couple of times, then you play them a third 0:11:43.400 --> 0:11:48.120 time in the playoffs and um, they just they outplayed us. 0:11:48.160 --> 0:11:50.520 We did not play very well. We were a little tight, 0:11:50.720 --> 0:11:54.400 big crowd. Um, where was the game? Where was the 0:11:54.440 --> 0:11:59.840 game played? Game was at University Wisconsin Whitewater. So for 0:12:00.120 --> 0:12:03.200 that time in my life, and uh, you know, for 0:12:03.280 --> 0:12:05.600 that area, there was a big game. It's probably four 0:12:05.600 --> 0:12:08.880 thousand people there, and uh, you know, it's it's funny 0:12:08.920 --> 0:12:12.120 now coaching in these Big East games, or you know, 0:12:12.160 --> 0:12:14.280 when I was a Texas in the Big twelve, you know, 0:12:14.360 --> 0:12:17.719 being an assistant in the A SEC, the SEC. It's 0:12:17.760 --> 0:12:20.319 one of the cool things is just the perspective of 0:12:21.080 --> 0:12:23.160 you know, you thought certain things were a big deal 0:12:23.160 --> 0:12:26.280 when you were younger, and now you know, there was 0:12:26.320 --> 0:12:28.920 sixteen thousand people at the game last night and we're 0:12:28.960 --> 0:12:32.240 playing Yukon on national TV. So I'll never lose an 0:12:32.280 --> 0:12:37.480 appreciation for that. You get done playing in high school 0:12:38.240 --> 0:12:41.440 and you play Kenyan D three, but some of the 0:12:41.480 --> 0:12:44.200 best D three basketball is in the state of Wisconsin. 0:12:44.679 --> 0:12:46.840 So why go to Ohio? What? What was it? I know, 0:12:46.960 --> 0:12:50.360 Kames a magnificent school. Was it the academics? Like? What 0:12:50.440 --> 0:12:55.240 drew you there? No? I mean I was unlike most 0:12:55.280 --> 0:12:58.760 Division three guys. I was like our guys and and 0:12:58.840 --> 0:13:02.640 most Division one guy in that I went to Kenyon. 0:13:02.720 --> 0:13:05.160 I went to the college I went to for one 0:13:05.200 --> 0:13:10.000 reason because of the coach. You know, I was raised 0:13:10.040 --> 0:13:14.160 by a single mom um. She raised four of us, 0:13:14.440 --> 0:13:18.880 and you know, we went through some challenging things during 0:13:19.000 --> 0:13:21.560 during my childhood so I really wanted to get away. 0:13:22.080 --> 0:13:23.440 There was no way I was going to go to 0:13:23.480 --> 0:13:27.440 school anywhere near where I grew up. I learned later 0:13:27.440 --> 0:13:31.640 in life that wherever you go, you know, there's no utopia, 0:13:31.679 --> 0:13:34.800 there's no perfect place. There's good people in every area, 0:13:34.840 --> 0:13:38.199 there's not so good people. UM So I learned that, 0:13:38.520 --> 0:13:40.480 you know, when I was young wanting to get away. 0:13:40.960 --> 0:13:44.640 You know, maybe um was was more about just needing 0:13:44.640 --> 0:13:47.719 to learn learn about other places. But yeah, I went 0:13:47.760 --> 0:13:50.040 to Kenyon because of a coach named Bill Brown. He 0:13:50.080 --> 0:13:55.000 recruited me, uh started my junior year and um, I 0:13:55.040 --> 0:14:00.040 actually I was accepted to Harvard, Yale, and Brown and 0:14:00.040 --> 0:14:02.520 and I was kind of lightly recruited by that. I was, 0:14:02.640 --> 0:14:04.360 you know, I could have gone there and and and 0:14:04.440 --> 0:14:05.840 been part of the team. As you know, in IVY 0:14:05.880 --> 0:14:12.640 League there's no scholarships, athletic scholarships. And um I I 0:14:12.720 --> 0:14:17.320 went and visited those schools, Doug and I was completely intimidated, 0:14:17.920 --> 0:14:22.960 not about basketball, but by the wealth and prestige and 0:14:23.840 --> 0:14:28.440 academic credentials of all the kids there. I was from 0:14:28.480 --> 0:14:32.440 such a kind of a sheltered background from the standpoint 0:14:32.480 --> 0:14:36.800 of exposure that particularly Harvard going and visiting Harvard, I 0:14:36.880 --> 0:14:40.320 was like overwhelmed, so I said, no, I'm gonna go 0:14:40.360 --> 0:14:43.920 to this little Division three school with coach Brown uh 0:14:43.960 --> 0:14:46.360 and had a good experience, but then he left after 0:14:46.400 --> 0:14:48.120 my freshman year, which is one of the worst days 0:14:48.120 --> 0:14:51.680 of my life. Okay, so, um, how much did you 0:14:51.680 --> 0:14:56.680 play as a freshman? I started about two thirds of 0:14:56.680 --> 0:15:01.400 the games, and UM, I we something here with our freshman. 0:15:01.520 --> 0:15:04.960 Have done it since VCU called Freshman Orientation, and it's 0:15:04.960 --> 0:15:07.600 a once a week meeting that I have with the 0:15:07.640 --> 0:15:10.840 freshman and we do it from the time they get 0:15:10.880 --> 0:15:13.000 here all the way through the end of the season. 0:15:13.880 --> 0:15:16.360 And the reason that I do it is because I 0:15:16.400 --> 0:15:19.240 think about how I was as a freshman and how 0:15:19.320 --> 0:15:25.400 much help I needed in the mental and emotional adjustment. Um. 0:15:25.440 --> 0:15:28.479 And I really feel like that adjustment is not complete 0:15:28.840 --> 0:15:33.160 until the season ends. Take a little a few days away, 0:15:33.200 --> 0:15:34.920 and then you walk back in the gym and you 0:15:35.000 --> 0:15:38.440 just have this clarity about you and the fog has 0:15:38.520 --> 0:15:42.120 cleared and you're like, Okay, I can do this. I 0:15:42.200 --> 0:15:46.280 understand it. Now, let's go. Um. But my freshman year, 0:15:46.320 --> 0:15:49.640 I played a lot, But looking back on it, man, 0:15:50.000 --> 0:15:55.760 my confidence level, my understanding of what I didn't know, 0:15:56.240 --> 0:16:00.800 very very low. Fox Sports Radio as the best sports 0:16:00.800 --> 0:16:03.600 talk lineup in the nation. Catch all of our shows 0:16:03.640 --> 0:16:06.880 at Fox sports Radio dot com and within the I 0:16:06.960 --> 0:16:09.920 Heart Radio app search f s R to listen live. 0:16:11.760 --> 0:16:14.280 All this stuff is is so relatable. I mean, like, look, 0:16:14.320 --> 0:16:19.400 I was different background obviously, right, I'm raising um, Orange, California. 0:16:19.680 --> 0:16:22.960 My parents were together, but I too wanted to get away. 0:16:23.120 --> 0:16:25.880 And I don't know if it was my my dad 0:16:26.000 --> 0:16:29.880 was a little much, right um, but also just the 0:16:30.200 --> 0:16:34.040 whole l A basketball scene, Like I like U c 0:16:34.200 --> 0:16:36.560 l A offered me and my brother and my sisters 0:16:36.560 --> 0:16:38.960 at cheerlier there. We had season tickets there, right, Like, 0:16:39.040 --> 0:16:41.480 I love U c l A basketball, but I truthfully 0:16:41.480 --> 0:16:44.040 like wanted nothing to do with playing at u c 0:16:44.160 --> 0:16:46.520 l A just because I just I just didn't feel 0:16:46.560 --> 0:16:48.920 like the college vibe. But then when I was at 0:16:48.920 --> 0:16:52.120 Notre Dame, truth be told, I think, you know, look, 0:16:52.160 --> 0:16:55.200 I got in trouble. But the things that you know 0:16:55.240 --> 0:16:56.560 when you look back and you get kind of get 0:16:56.640 --> 0:17:00.800 clarity on what went wrong, I too was was intimidated 0:17:00.800 --> 0:17:04.560 by the wealth and the the intelligence of everybody around me. 0:17:04.640 --> 0:17:07.040 Like I was sitting in this they have a they 0:17:07.040 --> 0:17:10.240 have one of course, taught by the president of the university, 0:17:10.320 --> 0:17:13.600 Monk Mallow's president time. And I got in the course 0:17:13.680 --> 0:17:16.600 and Sunday nights in the Golden Dome, like literally there's 0:17:16.640 --> 0:17:18.840 a boardroom in there, and I took a class in there, 0:17:19.320 --> 0:17:22.560 and there's twelve students because there's twelve councilors they recommend 0:17:22.600 --> 0:17:25.320 one person and there it's the most diverse group and 0:17:25.520 --> 0:17:28.359 interesting group of people. But like when you hear and 0:17:28.440 --> 0:17:30.479 the first class was just everybody kind of telling their 0:17:30.520 --> 0:17:33.960 story of how and why they got there. Just go 0:17:34.119 --> 0:17:37.480 like what am I doing here? I do not belong here? 0:17:37.880 --> 0:17:41.159 And then you factor in. I had a coach who 0:17:41.320 --> 0:17:44.080 God rest of soul. John McCloud is a magnificent man, 0:17:44.480 --> 0:17:47.720 right Like he never looked like there was never a 0:17:47.720 --> 0:17:51.240 wrinkle in his clothing, He was never unshaven, his hair 0:17:51.359 --> 0:17:54.679 was perfect. Every practice was was like a symphony in 0:17:54.760 --> 0:17:57.159 terms of like you had to practice plan and that 0:17:57.240 --> 0:17:59.200 was when we were doing it, and everything was done 0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:02.000 for a reason. But he didn't do We had one 0:18:02.040 --> 0:18:04.400 freshman meeting and it was a weird one. He called 0:18:04.480 --> 0:18:08.840 us in and he drew a he said he first 0:18:08.880 --> 0:18:13.720 he drew up like a classroom, and you know, he 0:18:13.760 --> 0:18:15.960 circled the first two rows and you know, this is 0:18:15.960 --> 0:18:17.840 where we're gonna sit. And then he said, Notre dame, 0:18:18.160 --> 0:18:20.080 We're gonna reel in the big fish. But there just 0:18:20.280 --> 0:18:24.720 wasn't a connectivity, you know, and what you're doing for 0:18:24.800 --> 0:18:28.160 your for your freshman, you're exactly right, because every kid 0:18:28.160 --> 0:18:29.800 thinks he's got the answers and they all think they're 0:18:29.800 --> 0:18:31.959 going the NBA. They think they're gonna come in and 0:18:32.000 --> 0:18:33.879 be one and done and started, if not, I'll just 0:18:33.880 --> 0:18:36.960 go find the next place. But he didn't. He didn't 0:18:36.960 --> 0:18:39.240 do it. Whereas coach Sutton, what he would do is 0:18:40.119 --> 0:18:42.600 you had if you were in still Water, you had 0:18:42.640 --> 0:18:46.320 to come into the office and see a coach every 0:18:46.359 --> 0:18:49.440 day and then sign in. If you didn't, there was 0:18:49.480 --> 0:18:51.800 hell up. It didn't matter like it could be any 0:18:51.840 --> 0:18:53.720 time during the year. If you're in still Water, that 0:18:53.800 --> 0:18:55.800 was the rule. You come in, just say hi, make 0:18:55.800 --> 0:18:59.480 eye contact with a coach. So it wasn't as developmental 0:18:59.520 --> 0:19:01.639 in terms of relationships is what you're building. But it's 0:19:01.640 --> 0:19:06.720 still the same idea and I think it's incredibly important. 0:19:06.800 --> 0:19:10.760 Regards you mentioned hard times. Okay, what's the when you 0:19:10.800 --> 0:19:13.480 think back, what what what was the most challenging thing 0:19:14.200 --> 0:19:17.520 you went through going up with with your mom and 0:19:17.560 --> 0:19:26.720 your siblings. Well, we went through some some different challenges financially, Um, 0:19:26.800 --> 0:19:29.840 when I was I think it was eight or nine, 0:19:30.600 --> 0:19:34.639 we moved about half a dozen times in the span 0:19:34.680 --> 0:19:38.680 of several months. UM, so there were some challenges there. 0:19:38.720 --> 0:19:42.040 My mom was always kind of struggling to make ends meet. 0:19:42.960 --> 0:19:47.320 I'll never forget as a young kid. Um, my mom 0:19:47.800 --> 0:19:51.160 would come home and she would make sure we were 0:19:51.200 --> 0:19:54.320 good with like something to eat, and then she would 0:19:54.400 --> 0:19:58.439 go leave again to go teach Lama's classes to you know, 0:19:58.520 --> 0:20:02.679 pregnant couples. And I remember like just begging her not 0:20:02.760 --> 0:20:05.000 to leave because I didn't know. I was a mama's 0:20:05.000 --> 0:20:07.960 boy for sure, and I just wanted to be around her. 0:20:08.600 --> 0:20:12.119 And I looked back on that and I just didn't 0:20:12.160 --> 0:20:16.760 have any understanding of probably how I was making her feel, 0:20:17.520 --> 0:20:20.040 um when I was begging her to stay. But well, 0:20:20.080 --> 0:20:21.800 you're when you're young, You're not going to have the 0:20:21.800 --> 0:20:27.760 empathy and understanding of that. And then you know, my 0:20:27.760 --> 0:20:31.959 my dad is black and my mom is white. Um, 0:20:32.000 --> 0:20:35.959 So one of the challenges for me was, you know, 0:20:36.080 --> 0:20:40.760 it's kind of surrounding identity. Um, you know, dealt with 0:20:40.880 --> 0:20:44.560 some different different issues with race growing up, like a 0:20:44.560 --> 0:20:48.200 lot of kids do. I'll tell you what was one 0:20:48.240 --> 0:20:51.000 of the best experiences I've ever had in my life 0:20:51.840 --> 0:20:55.240 is when I was in eighth grade. I played on 0:20:56.200 --> 0:20:59.920 my school team which was all white except for me, 0:21:00.840 --> 0:21:03.600 and then I played at the same time on kind 0:21:03.640 --> 0:21:06.360 of I guess what people would call now an au 0:21:06.440 --> 0:21:10.080 team or a club team that was all black at 0:21:10.119 --> 0:21:13.679 the same time. And and literally we would practice like 0:21:13.720 --> 0:21:18.399 in the afternoons on Tuesdays with the school team, and 0:21:18.440 --> 0:21:21.440 then that night I would have a practice with with 0:21:21.480 --> 0:21:23.960 my other team, the Spartans. And it was such an 0:21:24.080 --> 0:21:30.240 unbelievable cultural and basketball experience going back and forth from 0:21:30.240 --> 0:21:33.680 those two teams. How about this, how about this? It's 0:21:33.720 --> 0:21:37.600 just amazing. So I was one of the first like holdbacks, right, 0:21:38.240 --> 0:21:40.960 and I hauled back for a reason, like my son 0:21:41.160 --> 0:21:44.560 is on the same path growth wise like I was. 0:21:45.200 --> 0:21:47.679 End of eighth grade, I was five tall, I was 0:21:48.280 --> 0:21:51.919 ninety two pounds or something. And my dad had already 0:21:51.920 --> 0:21:54.600 had like he was. He graduated high school at seventeen 0:21:54.680 --> 0:21:57.639 and then grew late, you know, so he was thinking 0:21:57.640 --> 0:22:01.440 the exact same thing, um, but the year I held 0:22:01.480 --> 0:22:06.480 back back then AU basketball and everything was all age based, 0:22:06.520 --> 0:22:09.960 not grade based, and all the kids Miles Simon's with 0:22:10.040 --> 0:22:12.480 my best friend growing up, but he went to high school. 0:22:12.480 --> 0:22:14.119 All those kids went to high school. So I had 0:22:14.160 --> 0:22:17.320 to find a new team. So two days a week 0:22:18.000 --> 0:22:20.040 I would go and my dad would take me to 0:22:20.160 --> 0:22:25.600 Sam Miner's house. Sam lived in Compton, and I practiced 0:22:25.600 --> 0:22:28.240 with the ball that was his team, and then we 0:22:28.280 --> 0:22:30.919 would play in a league at Westchester High School. I 0:22:30.920 --> 0:22:33.560 was the only white kid in the gym, in the 0:22:33.640 --> 0:22:36.760 league whatever, And like I think my dad would like 0:22:36.920 --> 0:22:38.520 and he was, he was all about but he would 0:22:38.680 --> 0:22:41.080 maybe come to the games, but he basically had take 0:22:41.119 --> 0:22:43.880 me there and Mr Miner would make me do my homework. 0:22:44.119 --> 0:22:46.399 I'd have dinner with his family and then we go 0:22:46.480 --> 0:22:48.359 and we'd have practice and then my dad would come 0:22:48.400 --> 0:22:50.320 pick me up, and that that was that was how 0:22:50.320 --> 0:22:55.320 he did it. And so it was unbelievably I opening 0:22:55.359 --> 0:22:59.520 for me on how like here's a a family lived 0:22:59.520 --> 0:23:01.840 thirty min us from where I grew up, but just 0:23:01.880 --> 0:23:07.520 a completely different way of eating, talking, thinking and being. 0:23:07.960 --> 0:23:11.520