1 00:00:00,600 --> 00:00:04,400 Speaker 1: Dear listener, this episode includes some language that might be 2 00:00:04,440 --> 00:00:07,400 Speaker 1: offensive and a brief description of violence. 3 00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:13,080 Speaker 2: We obviously have a Latin actress playing once again like 4 00:00:13,160 --> 00:00:15,840 Speaker 2: a domestic worker. She works at a motel. You know, 5 00:00:15,960 --> 00:00:18,919 Speaker 2: anyone could obviously isolate that one scene and then you 6 00:00:18,960 --> 00:00:21,800 Speaker 2: could deconstruct it and talk about you know, are we 7 00:00:21,840 --> 00:00:25,079 Speaker 2: sort of continuing on with this same trope? And I'm 8 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:29,120 Speaker 2: curious if you and Marvin had this experience on hint 9 00:00:29,160 --> 00:00:31,520 Speaker 2: to fight of it, but for us on pose, like 10 00:00:32,040 --> 00:00:35,760 Speaker 2: I was hyper aware of the importance of casting black 11 00:00:35,760 --> 00:00:39,280 Speaker 2: and brown people in roles on our show, because especially 12 00:00:39,280 --> 00:00:41,839 Speaker 2: like if you're a working actor, like this could be 13 00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:46,360 Speaker 2: you know, a month's rent, this could be an important meal. 14 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:48,879 Speaker 3: Yeah, no, I mean I think we had a similar 15 00:00:49,440 --> 00:00:52,159 Speaker 3: We had one character in the series. He's like this 16 00:00:52,240 --> 00:00:54,680 Speaker 3: kind of cooky side character that if you saw him, 17 00:00:55,160 --> 00:00:58,080 Speaker 3: he would feel very stereotypical, like kind of the stereotypical 18 00:00:58,120 --> 00:00:59,040 Speaker 3: trope of a. 19 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:00,520 Speaker 4: Mexican like guy. 20 00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:03,320 Speaker 3: But we recognize that type of character in our own communities, 21 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:05,240 Speaker 3: like in our theos are pretty must and we wanted 22 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:07,160 Speaker 3: to have them be that character. But we definitely talked 23 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:10,000 Speaker 3: about ways that going to look good or is that 24 00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:13,000 Speaker 3: going to look bad? But we want people to have representation, 25 00:01:13,120 --> 00:01:19,600 Speaker 3: but also like is that the right way to do it? 26 00:01:19,680 --> 00:01:23,200 Speaker 1: From Futuro Media, It's Latino Usa. I'm Maria ino Josa. 27 00:01:23,440 --> 00:01:25,679 Speaker 1: Today we take you inside the writer's room with the 28 00:01:25,720 --> 00:01:29,760 Speaker 1: creators of Pose and Penttified and they dissect what Latino 29 00:01:29,840 --> 00:01:38,560 Speaker 1: representation looks like seen by scene. Latino and Latina representation 30 00:01:38,800 --> 00:01:42,160 Speaker 1: in film and television is an age old conversation topic, 31 00:01:42,600 --> 00:01:47,000 Speaker 1: and despite some recent milestones, the numbers are still pretty disappointing. 32 00:01:49,600 --> 00:01:52,720 Speaker 1: According to a recent study by the La Times, Latinos 33 00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:56,840 Speaker 1: and Latinas are underrepresented across all aspects of television and 34 00:01:56,880 --> 00:02:00,640 Speaker 1: film productions. Despite making up nearly twenty percent of the 35 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:05,960 Speaker 1: US population, Latinos and Latinas constitute only six percent of 36 00:02:06,040 --> 00:02:10,600 Speaker 1: main cast members, less than nine percent of writers, seven 37 00:02:10,720 --> 00:02:15,200 Speaker 1: percent of directors, and six percent of senior executives. The 38 00:02:15,240 --> 00:02:19,280 Speaker 1: presence of Afro and Indigenous Latinos in the industry is 39 00:02:19,320 --> 00:02:24,560 Speaker 1: even smaller, but statistics can only tell us so much. 40 00:02:25,120 --> 00:02:29,280 Speaker 1: How Latino individuals and communities are portrayed on screen is 41 00:02:29,320 --> 00:02:32,639 Speaker 1: another part of the conversation. That's why today we're taking 42 00:02:32,639 --> 00:02:35,920 Speaker 1: you behind the scenes with two Award winning Latino creators 43 00:02:36,160 --> 00:02:40,040 Speaker 1: who are breaking stereotypes about how our communities are depicted 44 00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:44,400 Speaker 1: on television, Stephen Canals and Linda Ivett Chavez. 45 00:02:46,480 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 2: My name is Stephen Canals. I am the co creator, 46 00:02:49,440 --> 00:02:54,400 Speaker 2: executive producer, writer, and director of the FX drama series Pose. 47 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:02,040 Speaker 4: The category is Pose. 48 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:08,760 Speaker 2: Centers the black and Latin queer and trans individuals who 49 00:03:09,240 --> 00:03:13,680 Speaker 2: are part of the New York City underground ballroom community 50 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:18,680 Speaker 2: as they are navigating the difficulties of the hiva's and 51 00:03:18,760 --> 00:03:21,640 Speaker 2: crack epidemic of the eighties and early nineties. 52 00:03:21,960 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 1: Stephen was born and raised in the Bronx to an 53 00:03:24,639 --> 00:03:27,920 Speaker 1: Afro Puerto Rican mother and an African American dad. He 54 00:03:28,000 --> 00:03:31,480 Speaker 1: made his history when Poe's premiered in twenty eighteen, featuring 55 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:37,040 Speaker 1: the largest cast of transgender actors in TV history. This year, 56 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:42,080 Speaker 1: the show snagged numerous Emmy nominations, including Outstanding Drama Series. 57 00:03:42,320 --> 00:03:46,040 Speaker 1: The show's star, MJ. Rodriguez became the first trans woman 58 00:03:46,440 --> 00:03:49,840 Speaker 1: to be nominated for an Emmy in a major acting category. 59 00:03:50,200 --> 00:03:55,000 Speaker 1: The award ceremony will take place on September nineteenth. 60 00:03:56,240 --> 00:03:57,520 Speaker 4: I'm Lyndaevit Chames. 61 00:03:57,560 --> 00:04:01,360 Speaker 3: I'm one of the co creators executive producers and writers 62 00:04:01,400 --> 00:04:09,440 Speaker 3: of Henphifide on Netflix. Henhified is the story of the 63 00:04:09,440 --> 00:04:13,360 Speaker 3: Morales family, who are from Boyle Heights in Los Angeles 64 00:04:13,360 --> 00:04:17,120 Speaker 3: and are fighting to keep their taco shop open in 65 00:04:17,160 --> 00:04:20,640 Speaker 3: the face of gentrifcation. But it's also a show about 66 00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:25,560 Speaker 3: this Mexican American family who are trying to pursue the 67 00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:28,720 Speaker 3: American dreaming, though that that dream is false and a 68 00:04:28,760 --> 00:04:29,520 Speaker 3: little bit broken. 69 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:35,760 Speaker 1: Linda, the first generation Chikhana raised in Norfolk, California, originally 70 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:40,080 Speaker 1: developed Hentified as an anthology style web series with co 71 00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:45,240 Speaker 1: creator Marvin Lemouse. After pitching the series around Hollywood, they 72 00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:49,240 Speaker 1: received offers from six different networks and ultimately chose to 73 00:04:49,279 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 1: sign on with Netflix. The show got nominated for several awards, 74 00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:57,520 Speaker 1: including the Peabody Award in twenty twenty. 75 00:04:58,520 --> 00:05:00,680 Speaker 2: I can't wait for season two pent their five. 76 00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:01,840 Speaker 4: Yeah it's coming out. 77 00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:05,719 Speaker 2: I had a friend tell me when hen the Five 78 00:05:05,760 --> 00:05:08,120 Speaker 2: first came out, like, Yo, did you know there's a 79 00:05:08,200 --> 00:05:11,000 Speaker 2: queer couple on the show. I was like, oh really, 80 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:12,400 Speaker 2: and they were like mm hm. And one of the 81 00:05:12,440 --> 00:05:15,760 Speaker 2: girls is black. It was really amazing to be able 82 00:05:15,800 --> 00:05:18,360 Speaker 2: to say, oh, there's a place that you can go 83 00:05:18,920 --> 00:05:23,000 Speaker 2: and you can now see a fully actualized Latin queer 84 00:05:23,160 --> 00:05:25,719 Speaker 2: black person. I just wanted you to know that that 85 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:28,880 Speaker 2: that was like what you did, which is really beautiful. 86 00:05:28,640 --> 00:05:31,800 Speaker 4: Oh Evehen, and just gave me chills. That means so 87 00:05:31,920 --> 00:05:32,359 Speaker 4: much to me. 88 00:05:32,839 --> 00:05:35,040 Speaker 3: I mean, first of all, Puppy and Angel, my goodness, 89 00:05:35,040 --> 00:05:38,480 Speaker 3: I love them, one of my favorite couples of folks. 90 00:05:38,920 --> 00:05:42,679 Speaker 3: So definitely such a beautiful representation. And I love seeing 91 00:05:42,720 --> 00:05:46,280 Speaker 3: this love story and seeing these two two folks. 92 00:05:46,040 --> 00:05:48,839 Speaker 4: Like fall in love, like that's not when do we 93 00:05:48,880 --> 00:05:49,479 Speaker 4: get to see that. 94 00:05:51,000 --> 00:05:55,080 Speaker 1: For this conversation, we wanted to try something a little different. 95 00:05:55,800 --> 00:05:58,280 Speaker 1: For those of you who are familiar with Inside the 96 00:05:58,320 --> 00:06:03,760 Speaker 1: actor's Studio, well consider this conversation and inside the Writer's Room. 97 00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:07,000 Speaker 1: Linda and Stephen will walk us through some of the 98 00:06:07,040 --> 00:06:10,640 Speaker 1: most representative scenes from their shows. They're going to talk 99 00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:14,760 Speaker 1: about the goals that motivated them, the fears they struggled with, 100 00:06:15,200 --> 00:06:18,640 Speaker 1: and ultimately how some of the most defining elements of 101 00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:24,240 Speaker 1: their series came to be. Linda and Stephen are the 102 00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:29,599 Speaker 1: protagonists from here on and here we go action when 103 00:06:29,640 --> 00:06:33,599 Speaker 1: you know, you know, not everybody knew. 104 00:06:33,440 --> 00:06:37,680 Speaker 3: And Yessica are our lesbian couple in the and the series, 105 00:06:42,360 --> 00:06:46,680 Speaker 3: played by Kerry Martin and Julissa, both women of color, 106 00:06:46,760 --> 00:06:50,640 Speaker 3: Julissa for Latina and Kerrie and duran Anna. She is 107 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:54,680 Speaker 3: this artist from Istile who is an activist and has 108 00:06:54,760 --> 00:06:58,600 Speaker 3: in the course of the series gone from her protests 109 00:06:58,600 --> 00:07:00,880 Speaker 3: st are to having opportunities open up for her and 110 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:04,840 Speaker 3: her whole world kind of open up through this local white, 111 00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:08,440 Speaker 3: essentially gentrifier who's coming to the community under the guise of. 112 00:07:08,520 --> 00:07:10,880 Speaker 4: Helping the community beautify. 113 00:07:11,640 --> 00:07:15,920 Speaker 3: Your little white savior is tearing up our neighborhood block 114 00:07:16,400 --> 00:07:17,120 Speaker 3: by block. 115 00:07:17,640 --> 00:07:18,360 Speaker 4: How many people in. 116 00:07:18,360 --> 00:07:21,200 Speaker 3: The homeless count were this place due to his beautifying projects. 117 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:22,680 Speaker 4: Hum, face it. 118 00:07:23,680 --> 00:07:27,440 Speaker 1: You are part of the problem, and you can separate 119 00:07:27,480 --> 00:07:27,760 Speaker 1: the two. 120 00:07:28,280 --> 00:07:31,000 Speaker 3: The character of Jesika, she's an activist. She has this 121 00:07:31,240 --> 00:07:34,200 Speaker 3: profound passion for community, like this love for her community 122 00:07:34,200 --> 00:07:36,040 Speaker 3: that's very deep, Which was also part of why we 123 00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:38,920 Speaker 3: wanted the original character to be La based, because we 124 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:42,040 Speaker 3: had envisioned her as someone who grew up from birth 125 00:07:42,200 --> 00:07:44,400 Speaker 3: to like this was where she was from and it 126 00:07:44,440 --> 00:07:46,480 Speaker 3: was her roots and she was protecting and defending it. 127 00:07:47,040 --> 00:07:51,120 Speaker 3: We really wanted to have Afro Latin X representation in 128 00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:53,200 Speaker 3: this series and there's a lot of black and Mexican 129 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:57,960 Speaker 3: like biracial folks in LA and there's also Afro Mexicans, 130 00:07:58,080 --> 00:08:00,560 Speaker 3: of course, and so we're trying to figure out who 131 00:08:00,640 --> 00:08:02,960 Speaker 3: would be the right presentment represent that. And Julisa is 132 00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:04,720 Speaker 3: actually one of the first people we saw on the tapes, 133 00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 3: and right away we were like, oh my god, she's 134 00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:06,920 Speaker 3: so good. 135 00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:08,920 Speaker 4: She's so good. She's so good. 136 00:08:08,960 --> 00:08:10,960 Speaker 3: And I immediately was like, damn it. She's from the 137 00:08:10,960 --> 00:08:13,080 Speaker 3: East Coast. She's got that East Coast accent. And she 138 00:08:13,200 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 3: came in and did a camera with Carrie and it 139 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:16,400 Speaker 3: was like. 140 00:08:16,400 --> 00:08:17,640 Speaker 4: Ooh, let's be real. 141 00:08:18,640 --> 00:08:20,680 Speaker 1: Your family has never accepted me. 142 00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:23,000 Speaker 5: Cica, it's just my mom. 143 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:26,920 Speaker 3: It's not no, it's not the scene that they autih 144 00:08:26,920 --> 00:08:31,400 Speaker 3: ined with because actually the breakup scene between Anna and Yessica, 145 00:08:31,560 --> 00:08:35,800 Speaker 3: Yessica calls Anna out not only on her buying into 146 00:08:36,120 --> 00:08:39,439 Speaker 3: capitalism in a sense, but also a lot of the colorism, 147 00:08:39,480 --> 00:08:42,640 Speaker 3: a lot of the austrasization that she's been feeling from 148 00:08:42,720 --> 00:08:46,000 Speaker 3: Anna's family, the emotion that came out between them, the 149 00:08:46,040 --> 00:08:48,199 Speaker 3: way that they really affected each other in that moment, 150 00:08:48,240 --> 00:08:51,080 Speaker 3: and just everything that Julisa brought. We said, like, this 151 00:08:51,320 --> 00:08:53,839 Speaker 3: is the right person, and what we have to do 152 00:08:54,520 --> 00:08:56,800 Speaker 3: is do our best to be authentic. And if this 153 00:08:57,000 --> 00:08:59,679 Speaker 3: person is Dominican from the East Coast, and this character 154 00:08:59,720 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 3: has to Dominican from the East Coast and from there, 155 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:07,760 Speaker 3: you know, I'm Mexican American from La like I don't 156 00:09:07,800 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 3: know fully the Afro Dominican experience. And sometimes it would 157 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:13,760 Speaker 3: be lines where we would write them in English for 158 00:09:13,760 --> 00:09:15,160 Speaker 3: her and she'd be like, yo, I would say. 159 00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 4: This in Spanish. 160 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:19,160 Speaker 3: It's important to have that openness to it because you 161 00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:22,080 Speaker 3: can't embody all of those things, and you have to 162 00:09:22,120 --> 00:09:27,520 Speaker 3: have the humility, I think, to allow others to contribute 163 00:09:27,559 --> 00:09:28,680 Speaker 3: and collaborate in that way. 164 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:31,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I completely agree. And you know, so much 165 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:34,960 Speaker 2: of pose is ad libbed. You know, I just have 166 00:09:35,040 --> 00:09:37,360 Speaker 2: to trust the actor. And you know, I've had a 167 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:40,120 Speaker 2: lot of experiences, most recently when I was directing the 168 00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:42,040 Speaker 2: series finale and then remember I walked in and I 169 00:09:42,080 --> 00:09:45,040 Speaker 2: gave MJ who plays Blanca, a note and it was 170 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:46,880 Speaker 2: like it was something really small, like I think it 171 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:49,280 Speaker 2: was like an eye roll and like a tongue pop. 172 00:09:49,320 --> 00:09:51,120 Speaker 2: But I could see her working through it and I 173 00:09:51,160 --> 00:09:52,640 Speaker 2: was like, tell me, what is it? And she was like, 174 00:09:53,240 --> 00:09:55,200 Speaker 2: I just dont thing Blanca would do that. I was 175 00:09:55,240 --> 00:09:56,920 Speaker 2: like no, I was like, oh, it would be like 176 00:09:57,040 --> 00:10:00,200 Speaker 2: really fun if in this moment that's your reaction. She's 177 00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:02,040 Speaker 2: like yeah, and I hear that. She's like, I just 178 00:10:02,400 --> 00:10:05,800 Speaker 2: that's not Blanca though, and I was like okay, and 179 00:10:05,840 --> 00:10:06,360 Speaker 2: I let it go. 180 00:10:06,920 --> 00:10:09,360 Speaker 3: Do you ever think you ever had that split second 181 00:10:09,360 --> 00:10:11,839 Speaker 3: of like, no, it's it's good. It's good the way 182 00:10:11,880 --> 00:10:13,240 Speaker 3: it is, and then you're like, ohait, hold on, let 183 00:10:13,320 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 3: me let me take a bread hold on, let me listen. 184 00:10:15,559 --> 00:10:18,080 Speaker 3: I have this now, and then where I'm like what 185 00:10:18,520 --> 00:10:21,320 Speaker 3: we spent months on this? Oh no, no, I think 186 00:10:21,360 --> 00:10:21,839 Speaker 3: you're okay. 187 00:10:21,840 --> 00:10:24,600 Speaker 2: You're right for them to ask one question that pulls 188 00:10:24,640 --> 00:10:27,920 Speaker 2: the whole thread and you're like, oh, okay. 189 00:10:30,640 --> 00:10:35,640 Speaker 3: I am so lucky to be part of this, sister. 190 00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:40,440 Speaker 2: All of the Latin women on Pose are Afro Latin, 191 00:10:40,840 --> 00:10:43,560 Speaker 2: you know. So we have Angel played by India Moore, 192 00:10:43,679 --> 00:10:47,280 Speaker 2: who is a black Dominican Puerto Rican woman, and then 193 00:10:47,320 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 2: we have MJ. Rodriguez who plays Blanca, who is a 194 00:10:52,160 --> 00:10:59,320 Speaker 2: Black Puerto Rican woman. The character Angel is a transgender 195 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:04,480 Speaker 2: Afro at survival sex worker and she works at the 196 00:11:04,520 --> 00:11:08,920 Speaker 2: Peers in New York City and the character Stan, played 197 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:13,040 Speaker 2: by Evan Peters, is one of her johns. He quickly 198 00:11:13,080 --> 00:11:18,559 Speaker 2: goes from being just a client to having a relationship 199 00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:20,720 Speaker 2: with Angel. You wanted to stay a. 200 00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:23,360 Speaker 5: Piece, you could have fucked the secretary like most guys do. 201 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:25,320 Speaker 4: And if you wanted to pay for how come. 202 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:27,480 Speaker 1: You chose to spend a week driving around those docs 203 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:31,000 Speaker 1: stand You were looking for me, but someone like me, 204 00:11:31,920 --> 00:11:33,160 Speaker 1: I was an experiment to you. 205 00:11:33,559 --> 00:11:41,280 Speaker 2: Angel is really confused why their sexual relationship seems to 206 00:11:41,320 --> 00:11:45,720 Speaker 2: be at the moment hyper centered on the fact that 207 00:11:45,840 --> 00:11:48,600 Speaker 2: she is a trans woman who still has a penis. 208 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:51,960 Speaker 1: I'm a pornographic magazine come to life. 209 00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:57,920 Speaker 2: She is confronting Stan about his sexual desires and his 210 00:11:57,960 --> 00:12:02,560 Speaker 2: proclivities and why it seems that he's attracted to just 211 00:12:02,720 --> 00:12:05,880 Speaker 2: one part of her and not everything else. 212 00:12:06,120 --> 00:12:07,400 Speaker 4: Get out of my apartment. 213 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:13,960 Speaker 2: Here you have this straight, white cisgendered man, and he 214 00:12:14,160 --> 00:12:17,199 Speaker 2: is in a relationship with an Afro Latin trans woman, 215 00:12:17,400 --> 00:12:21,080 Speaker 2: and he has all these complications around his own sexuality. 216 00:12:21,320 --> 00:12:23,680 Speaker 2: And I think that felt really important to us because 217 00:12:23,720 --> 00:12:27,160 Speaker 2: more often than not, queer and trans people we are 218 00:12:27,280 --> 00:12:30,840 Speaker 2: over sexualized. And I think in the case of thinking 219 00:12:30,920 --> 00:12:35,840 Speaker 2: about the character of Angel as a Latin woman. Latin 220 00:12:35,880 --> 00:12:40,120 Speaker 2: women are always over sexualized, you know, they're the fiery temptress, 221 00:12:40,280 --> 00:12:43,280 Speaker 2: and so it felt really important for us to rewrite 222 00:12:43,280 --> 00:12:43,920 Speaker 2: the narrative. 223 00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:46,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think, you know, for us, we had to. 224 00:12:46,559 --> 00:12:49,560 Speaker 3: We had obviously many female characters, and I remember when 225 00:12:49,559 --> 00:12:53,240 Speaker 3: we were kind of putting together that first episode in Posts, 226 00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:57,720 Speaker 3: there was a different opening scene for Anna's character and 227 00:12:57,920 --> 00:13:01,000 Speaker 3: the next scene was Anna and. 228 00:13:00,440 --> 00:13:04,800 Speaker 4: Yessica in bed together. I'm not dating of Indida boob. 229 00:13:05,160 --> 00:13:09,920 Speaker 1: No, because none of this is for sale, baby cakes, 230 00:13:09,960 --> 00:13:10,600 Speaker 1: only for you. 231 00:13:11,440 --> 00:13:13,720 Speaker 3: We had decided to cut the first scene with Anna 232 00:13:13,760 --> 00:13:15,200 Speaker 3: because it didn't feel like it was working well in 233 00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:17,719 Speaker 3: the beginning, and I was concerned about showing the two 234 00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:20,280 Speaker 3: of them, that being the first image of them together 235 00:13:20,480 --> 00:13:25,800 Speaker 3: because of historically how lesbian women queer women are like 236 00:13:25,880 --> 00:13:29,480 Speaker 3: shown together and are hyper sexualized, and especially these two 237 00:13:29,480 --> 00:13:32,360 Speaker 3: women of color being also fetishized in that way. 238 00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:36,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, for us, you know, And I think going back 239 00:13:36,640 --> 00:13:40,120 Speaker 2: again to thinking about Angel and maybe more specifically thinking 240 00:13:40,160 --> 00:13:42,880 Speaker 2: about her relationship in seasons two and three with the 241 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:43,960 Speaker 2: character Little Poppy. 242 00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:46,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, Angel, maybe Gool. 243 00:13:50,000 --> 00:13:52,199 Speaker 4: I'm sorry, Shaddy loving good today. 244 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:59,000 Speaker 2: Little Poppy is the young Dominican boy who is dealing 245 00:13:59,040 --> 00:14:01,760 Speaker 2: drugs and living out on the streets, and he gets 246 00:14:01,760 --> 00:14:05,680 Speaker 2: adopted by Blanca and joins the house of Evangelista. You know, 247 00:14:05,800 --> 00:14:08,920 Speaker 2: in that relationship, it's just ultra loving and they had 248 00:14:08,960 --> 00:14:12,000 Speaker 2: moments like we saw them make love, but it was 249 00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:14,840 Speaker 2: always coming from a real place, which is just what 250 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:18,800 Speaker 2: are the complications of being two human beings in a relationship. 251 00:14:19,440 --> 00:14:21,760 Speaker 3: Steven's right shows like Poe's and hint the fact like 252 00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:25,080 Speaker 3: we're trying to show the full dimension anality of who 253 00:14:25,080 --> 00:14:26,400 Speaker 3: we are. I mean, like one of the things that 254 00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:28,720 Speaker 3: we really worked on with the two of them was 255 00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:32,120 Speaker 3: making sure that their relationship was three dimensional and had 256 00:14:32,160 --> 00:14:32,680 Speaker 3: a history. 257 00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:35,120 Speaker 4: We see the two of them as little girls. 258 00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:36,800 Speaker 3: They met when they were like in their early in 259 00:14:36,840 --> 00:14:39,560 Speaker 3: their teens, and for me, it was exciting to see 260 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:41,480 Speaker 3: these two young girls falling in love because I feel 261 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:46,240 Speaker 3: like I don't often see that. There's a scene at 262 00:14:46,280 --> 00:14:51,160 Speaker 3: the end where Eric hugs Pop. Eric Morales, he's one 263 00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:52,440 Speaker 3: of our cousins in the series. 264 00:14:52,480 --> 00:14:53,760 Speaker 4: He plays hop. 265 00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:56,880 Speaker 3: Gasimito Monatus's grandson, and that was a moment that Marvin 266 00:14:56,880 --> 00:14:58,680 Speaker 3: and I had had in our head for such a 267 00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:01,320 Speaker 3: long time, We're just like, we want to see these 268 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:06,360 Speaker 3: human hug because I think machismo and Latino communities and 269 00:15:06,880 --> 00:15:11,160 Speaker 3: you know, Mexican machismo. We wanted to use Hop and 270 00:15:11,760 --> 00:15:15,000 Speaker 3: Eric is a way to kind of be an example 271 00:15:15,040 --> 00:15:18,040 Speaker 3: to those men in our community. Is like, you can't 272 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:20,080 Speaker 3: hug your grandson and let him cry in your arms, 273 00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:24,560 Speaker 3: like he can be emotionally heartbroken from love, Like that's okay, 274 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:25,760 Speaker 3: that's allowed. 275 00:15:27,640 --> 00:15:27,920 Speaker 4: Question. 276 00:15:36,880 --> 00:15:40,560 Speaker 2: This season, this final season of Pose, there is actually 277 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:44,840 Speaker 2: a scene where Angel and Little Papy are engaged and 278 00:15:44,880 --> 00:15:51,640 Speaker 2: they're having an argument about paying for their wedding. 279 00:15:50,240 --> 00:15:52,240 Speaker 3: And actually just going to pay for it, but what 280 00:15:52,240 --> 00:15:53,360 Speaker 3: does that make me look like? 281 00:15:53,920 --> 00:15:57,880 Speaker 2: And he's got all of this raggedocious like I'm going 282 00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:00,800 Speaker 2: to pay for it. I'm a man, and literally says 283 00:16:00,840 --> 00:16:05,240 Speaker 2: to him. And so we literally called it out. 284 00:16:05,440 --> 00:16:05,640 Speaker 4: You know. 285 00:16:06,040 --> 00:16:09,560 Speaker 2: We had conversations in the room about the character and 286 00:16:10,320 --> 00:16:14,080 Speaker 2: specifically the wedding and these choices, and that's where the 287 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:18,200 Speaker 2: conversation beard, which is I feel like she would call 288 00:16:18,240 --> 00:16:22,080 Speaker 2: out this behavior and be very specific about why it's 289 00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:26,040 Speaker 2: not okay. And it's great to be able to highlight it, 290 00:16:26,360 --> 00:16:29,800 Speaker 2: even if it's just breefe, you know, you get feedback 291 00:16:29,840 --> 00:16:31,760 Speaker 2: and you know that it resonates with the audience. 292 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:36,720 Speaker 1: Coming up on Latino USA, Stephen and Linda discussed their 293 00:16:36,760 --> 00:16:41,680 Speaker 1: experiences capturing difficult traumatic topics in their series and the 294 00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:45,000 Speaker 1: importance of who gets to tell the stories of Latinos 295 00:16:45,040 --> 00:17:28,440 Speaker 1: and Latinas on television. Stay with us, Hey, we're back. 296 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:37,240 Speaker 1: Stephen Ganals of Pose and Linda Yvette Chavis Oftentified continue 297 00:17:37,280 --> 00:17:41,000 Speaker 1: their conversation now about the challenges of representing Latino characters 298 00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:45,280 Speaker 1: and communities on the screen. Here are Stephen and Linda again. 299 00:17:52,640 --> 00:17:57,359 Speaker 2: When I sold Pose to Ryan Murphy, Ryan and I 300 00:17:57,359 --> 00:18:01,000 Speaker 2: spent a lot of time talking about Jenny Livingstone's landmark 301 00:18:01,040 --> 00:18:04,360 Speaker 2: documentary Paris Is Burning, which was released in nineteen ninety one. 302 00:18:04,840 --> 00:18:08,560 Speaker 2: And in that documentary there's a young trans woman of 303 00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:13,440 Speaker 2: Venus Extravaganza, who at the very end of the documentary 304 00:18:13,480 --> 00:18:17,640 Speaker 2: we find out is murdered. And so through those conversations 305 00:18:18,040 --> 00:18:21,720 Speaker 2: we wound up creating the character Angel, And so our 306 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:25,359 Speaker 2: intention was just to really honor Venus and her life, 307 00:18:25,640 --> 00:18:30,480 Speaker 2: but also for us to reimagine what this trans woman 308 00:18:30,560 --> 00:18:33,720 Speaker 2: would have been, what she would have become if she 309 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:37,600 Speaker 2: had lived, which I think is it felt subversive and 310 00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:41,359 Speaker 2: refreshing to me as a storyteller, because so often queer 311 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:44,920 Speaker 2: and trans people aren't represented that way, and specifically trans 312 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:47,639 Speaker 2: women more often than not are killed. 313 00:18:49,119 --> 00:18:51,200 Speaker 1: I need you didn't tell me what happened, please. 314 00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:55,920 Speaker 2: I got a call from the motel manager. 315 00:18:56,680 --> 00:18:58,760 Speaker 5: He said, after we Love, he was curious about what 316 00:18:58,840 --> 00:18:59,920 Speaker 5: was happening in those worlds. 317 00:19:01,960 --> 00:19:04,640 Speaker 4: So the man went into the room to clean it house. 318 00:19:07,560 --> 00:19:14,160 Speaker 2: The character Candy, who is played by Angelica love Ross, 319 00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:22,119 Speaker 2: goes missing and her best friend Lulu played by Hailey Sahar, 320 00:19:23,240 --> 00:19:26,320 Speaker 2: is searching for her, and all she knows is that 321 00:19:27,240 --> 00:19:31,440 Speaker 2: Candy has been working as a dancer at a nightclub 322 00:19:31,640 --> 00:19:33,720 Speaker 2: and has picked up a couple of New Johns, and 323 00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:37,960 Speaker 2: so she's worried about her. They found Kenny's body dead 324 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:41,720 Speaker 2: and clotton and then we find out that she's been murdered. 325 00:19:44,160 --> 00:19:47,960 Speaker 2: When we made the choice specifically for Candy to die, 326 00:19:48,160 --> 00:19:51,399 Speaker 2: it was in twenty nineteen. In a span of four days, 327 00:19:51,480 --> 00:19:54,359 Speaker 2: three black trans women were murdered, and we were like, 328 00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:57,480 Speaker 2: we can't ignore this, you know, And I think the 329 00:19:57,520 --> 00:20:00,720 Speaker 2: reaction at first was like we're going to be those people, 330 00:20:00,840 --> 00:20:03,760 Speaker 2: Like we're going to get dragged and you know ultimately 331 00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:07,440 Speaker 2: like we're duplicating past hurts and traumas. That's all we're doing. 332 00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:10,639 Speaker 2: And I think what really came through for me and 333 00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:13,040 Speaker 2: what having make the decision to say, no, we have 334 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:17,000 Speaker 2: to tell this story is knowing that these murders are 335 00:20:17,040 --> 00:20:18,800 Speaker 2: going to continue to happen, these deaths are going to 336 00:20:18,800 --> 00:20:22,080 Speaker 2: continue to happen, and here we have this incredible platform 337 00:20:22,119 --> 00:20:25,320 Speaker 2: where we have an opportunity to educate the audience, and 338 00:20:25,359 --> 00:20:30,600 Speaker 2: we're choosing to not make that choice because we're personally concerned. 339 00:20:30,640 --> 00:20:33,000 Speaker 2: And it was like I had to check my own 340 00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:35,359 Speaker 2: privilege in the moment, and it's like, you know, I 341 00:20:35,400 --> 00:20:39,480 Speaker 2: felt a responsibility to the women who are part of 342 00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:42,399 Speaker 2: my community and the women who aren't, to say we 343 00:20:42,480 --> 00:20:43,520 Speaker 2: have to tell the story. 344 00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:49,120 Speaker 3: Were you ever like fearful of like showing that pain 345 00:20:49,160 --> 00:20:51,119 Speaker 3: in that trauma, Because that moment when we see Candy, 346 00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:53,840 Speaker 3: it's like very vivid, We're seeing her body on the ground. 347 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:56,640 Speaker 3: And sometimes I feel like our communities are like we're 348 00:20:56,640 --> 00:20:58,399 Speaker 3: tired of seeing the trauma. We're tired of seeing the 349 00:20:58,400 --> 00:21:00,040 Speaker 3: pain and the violence. 350 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:02,760 Speaker 2: You know, I think, and the jury's out to be 351 00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:04,960 Speaker 2: honest when it comes to the reaction to it because 352 00:21:04,960 --> 00:21:08,200 Speaker 2: I know some specifically trans people, you know, I've heard 353 00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:11,359 Speaker 2: feedback from and they hated it, and then others felt 354 00:21:11,400 --> 00:21:15,520 Speaker 2: like it was important to see. I think the question 355 00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:18,560 Speaker 2: that kept coming up for me around how I mean 356 00:21:18,560 --> 00:21:20,439 Speaker 2: this was the question that always came up for me 357 00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:23,560 Speaker 2: when considering how to depict any moment on the show 358 00:21:24,160 --> 00:21:28,080 Speaker 2: was who is the audience? It felt important to show 359 00:21:28,119 --> 00:21:31,560 Speaker 2: it because I think the reality is the vast majority 360 00:21:31,760 --> 00:21:34,359 Speaker 2: of our audience was going to come in not knowing 361 00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:37,360 Speaker 2: that this is the reality, that this is what happens. 362 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:40,080 Speaker 2: And it just felt like if we really slap you 363 00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:42,919 Speaker 2: in the face with confronting it, what are you going 364 00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:45,119 Speaker 2: to do? You know, like you have to wrestle with it. 365 00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:48,280 Speaker 3: I often struggle with it because exactly what you're saying, 366 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:50,520 Speaker 3: like we at the same time there's this huge platform 367 00:21:50,560 --> 00:21:52,480 Speaker 3: and we get to talk about real things that are 368 00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:56,760 Speaker 3: really happening and influence folks, and they're thinking around it. 369 00:21:56,800 --> 00:21:59,679 Speaker 3: Because for us, like with Pop, like that moment at 370 00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:01,520 Speaker 3: the end of the season where he gets detained, that 371 00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:03,280 Speaker 3: was a big point of discussion of like do we 372 00:22:03,359 --> 00:22:04,760 Speaker 3: want to see that? Do we want to show him 373 00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:07,880 Speaker 3: being put into an ice truck and how painful that is. 374 00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:14,240 Speaker 4: It's your vehicle? 375 00:22:15,119 --> 00:22:20,359 Speaker 3: Yes, are you catching Miro Morales And the finale of 376 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:25,199 Speaker 3: the season one of hemphfied Pop. He is on his 377 00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:29,440 Speaker 3: way to the hospital because Lydia, Eric's girlfriend is having 378 00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:32,880 Speaker 3: their baby, and on the way he gets pulled over 379 00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:37,919 Speaker 3: by a police officer who then calls ICE and detains him, 380 00:22:37,920 --> 00:22:39,439 Speaker 3: and we discover at the end of the season that 381 00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:41,440 Speaker 3: Pop has been undocumented this whole time. 382 00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:50,960 Speaker 2: When your first season first came out, like that was 383 00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:53,280 Speaker 2: a moment that I remember, if it's fair to say, 384 00:22:53,320 --> 00:22:55,280 Speaker 2: went viral, but I just I know that I saw 385 00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:57,880 Speaker 2: that going around quite a bit, and like I saw 386 00:22:57,920 --> 00:22:59,560 Speaker 2: that there was a lot of discussion about it, and 387 00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:04,960 Speaker 2: if you know, we have to take those kinds of risks. Ultimately, 388 00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:08,520 Speaker 2: it's like that's kind of our responsibility. Right. 389 00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:12,960 Speaker 3: Often we'll find ourselves as artists because you know, myself 390 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:15,119 Speaker 3: and Marvin, we're artists like Steve and you're an artist. 391 00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:17,240 Speaker 3: Like we've been in these situations where we've had to 392 00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:19,959 Speaker 3: where we want to talk about our trauma, we want 393 00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:21,800 Speaker 3: to talk about what our families have gone through, where 394 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:24,159 Speaker 3: we want to create art out of them, and then 395 00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:26,600 Speaker 3: we have supporters come in to support us, and they. 396 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:28,720 Speaker 4: Don't realize that they're doing it, but they're doing it. 397 00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:32,880 Speaker 3: Where you know, we're being seen as only that trauma 398 00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:36,160 Speaker 3: versus seeing the full complexity of who we are as humans, 399 00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:38,920 Speaker 3: and I think often we all also end up being 400 00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:41,480 Speaker 3: infantilized or fetishized in that process. 401 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:50,720 Speaker 5: This is Anna Morales, an upcoming artist who will give 402 00:23:50,720 --> 00:23:51,520 Speaker 5: you something. 403 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:54,120 Speaker 4: To talk about. She's iconic, she's queer. 404 00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:58,440 Speaker 5: She has Latin X rose that grew from the concrete. 405 00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:01,240 Speaker 4: Her mother's a garment worker. Her grandfather immigrated here with 406 00:24:01,320 --> 00:24:04,320 Speaker 4: like five dollars in his pocket. Her cousins survived gang wife. 407 00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:06,520 Speaker 1: Oh did I mention her mom works in a sweatshep. 408 00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:08,200 Speaker 5: She raised her little sister. 409 00:24:08,320 --> 00:24:11,480 Speaker 4: She's basically a team mom. Anna. 410 00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:15,679 Speaker 3: She's challenged to understand what it means to do her 411 00:24:15,840 --> 00:24:18,120 Speaker 3: art in this community and what it means to try 412 00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:21,600 Speaker 3: to survive financially. And so they see is Tim the 413 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:24,480 Speaker 3: man that she has been working with, and kind of 414 00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:26,840 Speaker 3: this big moment of her having her art in. 415 00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:29,160 Speaker 4: This art gallery that he's put together for her. 416 00:24:29,600 --> 00:24:31,199 Speaker 3: And this whole time she's been kind of on the 417 00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:34,080 Speaker 3: fence about whether or not this man is a man 418 00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:36,600 Speaker 3: that she should be in I guess coalition with because 419 00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:39,520 Speaker 3: he is a rich white man that does not identify 420 00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:42,560 Speaker 3: with what she is, which is a brown, working class woman. 421 00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:44,840 Speaker 3: And I think in that saying with Tim, it's like 422 00:24:44,920 --> 00:24:48,200 Speaker 3: to him, perhaps he hasn't realized it yet, but he's 423 00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:52,399 Speaker 3: seeing only Anna as lucrative, as a commodity because of 424 00:24:52,400 --> 00:24:55,120 Speaker 3: her trauma, because her art is amazing, because she's been 425 00:24:55,119 --> 00:24:58,080 Speaker 3: in pain, versus saying like, okay, what's your pain? 426 00:24:58,119 --> 00:25:00,000 Speaker 4: But who else are you? Why don't I let you 427 00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:02,440 Speaker 4: speak to your story? Why don't I let you talk 428 00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:03,240 Speaker 4: to these people? 429 00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:06,280 Speaker 3: Why don't I give you agency and power versus being 430 00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:07,480 Speaker 3: the one to speak for you? 431 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:10,880 Speaker 2: And I'm thinking more specifically about you know, when we're 432 00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:16,119 Speaker 2: talking about Latin people and representation, sometimes it's not so 433 00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:18,320 Speaker 2: much a trope, it's a reality. It's just who is 434 00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:21,000 Speaker 2: the person at the center of telling it. If we're 435 00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:23,280 Speaker 2: telling a story about what it means to be Latin 436 00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:26,720 Speaker 2: and a domestic worker, it's like that's a familiar journey 437 00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:29,840 Speaker 2: for a lot of people in our community, Like that's 438 00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:33,240 Speaker 2: just the truth. And I think it's easy to sort 439 00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:35,800 Speaker 2: of identify it as a trope and television because it's 440 00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:40,000 Speaker 2: so overutilized. But the reality is like we haven't had 441 00:25:40,119 --> 00:25:43,520 Speaker 2: enough of us at the table, you know, either having 442 00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:45,760 Speaker 2: a seat at the table or being the person who 443 00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:49,119 Speaker 2: created the table to tell that story and do it 444 00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:52,240 Speaker 2: in a way where there's empathy and truth and authenticity 445 00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:52,960 Speaker 2: behind it. 446 00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:57,280 Speaker 3: Amen, And I feel like representations and working class communities 447 00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:00,520 Speaker 3: and communities of color and black communities and all our 448 00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:03,439 Speaker 3: communities are often we're not allowed to have the range 449 00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:06,159 Speaker 3: of experiences and emotions when we're being depicted. 450 00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:07,280 Speaker 4: It's usually like one. 451 00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:10,800 Speaker 3: Thing, often like one scene where we get depicted in 452 00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:12,960 Speaker 3: a certain way. And I think why so many folks 453 00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:16,760 Speaker 3: from our communities sometimes bristle at like, oh, I don't 454 00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:18,360 Speaker 3: want to see another trollo. I don't want to see 455 00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:20,680 Speaker 3: another gangster. I don't want to see another sex worker. 456 00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:23,240 Speaker 3: I don't want to see another x YZ whatever it 457 00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:27,159 Speaker 3: may be. But to me, I feel like that's very damaging. 458 00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:32,640 Speaker 3: You're wasting a whole part of our community. And that's 459 00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:36,560 Speaker 3: not that's oppressive, it's not okay. And for me, Eric, 460 00:26:36,640 --> 00:26:39,159 Speaker 3: you know I mentioned earlier, like he would have been 461 00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:42,119 Speaker 3: the trollo in a story in a show, but like 462 00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:44,640 Speaker 3: you get to see him be fully realized and have 463 00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:50,280 Speaker 3: dreams and aspirations and have complexity and become a real person. 464 00:26:50,359 --> 00:26:52,200 Speaker 3: If I had listened to people who said, like I 465 00:26:52,240 --> 00:26:55,400 Speaker 3: don't want to see any more Troto's or gardeners or maids, there. 466 00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:58,840 Speaker 4: Would be no Eric. But I've never seen Eric like 467 00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:00,960 Speaker 4: anything in Eric's my brother. 468 00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:04,680 Speaker 2: You know. I think it's it's the reason why shows 469 00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:06,600 Speaker 2: like Hand to Fight are so important and they need 470 00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:09,680 Speaker 2: to exist. It's the reason why it was critically important 471 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:13,240 Speaker 2: on posed for us to have our queer and trans 472 00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:18,080 Speaker 2: characters still be working class and still be dealing with 473 00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:24,560 Speaker 2: issues around housing and employment opportunities and you know, medical resources. 474 00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:26,720 Speaker 2: It's like, because that's the truth of what it means 475 00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:31,679 Speaker 2: to exist holding those identities, and we also have a 476 00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:33,760 Speaker 2: lot of love, and we also have a lot of support, 477 00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:35,680 Speaker 2: and we still know how to show up for each other. 478 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:36,080 Speaker 4: You know. 479 00:27:36,119 --> 00:27:38,240 Speaker 2: It's so it's it's all of it. I think, like, 480 00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:41,320 Speaker 2: we are complex beings, and I think the to me, 481 00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:45,840 Speaker 2: the trope is that we historically haven't been able to 482 00:27:45,880 --> 00:27:49,000 Speaker 2: tell our own narratives, and so it's always been through 483 00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:51,600 Speaker 2: the white gays and the white lens, and so the 484 00:27:51,600 --> 00:28:01,720 Speaker 2: story's been told incorrectly. There's one place where I think 485 00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:08,000 Speaker 2: pose Inhentified overlap quite beautifully, and that one place is 486 00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:12,080 Speaker 2: a love and a respect for food and the way 487 00:28:12,119 --> 00:28:15,159 Speaker 2: that food is love with the characters and throughout the 488 00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:19,560 Speaker 2: show and outside of just food that, you know, I 489 00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:25,320 Speaker 2: think more specifically how deeply that loss like Mayabulita, you know, 490 00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:28,600 Speaker 2: she just died in March, and you know, I know, 491 00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:32,399 Speaker 2: thank you, and like that was hard and that's a 492 00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:35,040 Speaker 2: hard loss, and you know, I think about you know, 493 00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:38,480 Speaker 2: she grew up in El Campos in Puerto Rico, and 494 00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:42,320 Speaker 2: so you know, like there's certain dishes that Malita made. 495 00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:45,440 Speaker 2: They're like, I'm like, it's heartbreaking to me that you'll 496 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:47,960 Speaker 2: never have it the way it tasted when she made it, 497 00:28:48,720 --> 00:28:50,280 Speaker 2: you know. And so I think that's one of the 498 00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:53,520 Speaker 2: things that came through for me. With the protection and 499 00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:55,560 Speaker 2: the it was so much bigger than just like, oh, 500 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:58,720 Speaker 2: the community is gentrifying and we're going to lose our space, 501 00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:03,360 Speaker 2: but it's like it's that deep heart string connection to 502 00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:06,560 Speaker 2: a particular family member, you know, and the place that 503 00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:07,840 Speaker 2: they spent so much time. 504 00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:10,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm a Fenex based on my actually my mam 505 00:29:10,280 --> 00:29:13,600 Speaker 3: A Feina, who was like an incredible cook, and that 506 00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:16,800 Speaker 3: that feeling of like losing. As you were talking, I 507 00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:18,880 Speaker 3: was like, yeah, I'm never going to have my Pinasmas. 508 00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:25,240 Speaker 4: Every Christmas. We try so hard to recapture that that flavor. 509 00:29:25,400 --> 00:29:27,360 Speaker 4: Like we try my mom likes a little candle with 510 00:29:27,400 --> 00:29:28,840 Speaker 4: her photo. We call her spirit. 511 00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:31,400 Speaker 3: We do the whole thing, and it's always like ninety 512 00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:34,000 Speaker 3: seven percent there, ninety five percent there, but it's never 513 00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:37,160 Speaker 3: like one hundred percent, you know, And it's just a 514 00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:39,760 Speaker 3: strange thing, but it is. It is this loss that 515 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:42,880 Speaker 3: feels so heavy and profound in so many ways. I'll 516 00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:44,120 Speaker 3: am so clad you brought that out that make me 517 00:29:44,200 --> 00:30:04,200 Speaker 3: so emotional. This was my first series that I created, 518 00:30:04,360 --> 00:30:09,080 Speaker 3: you know, and going into it, there was so much 519 00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:14,960 Speaker 3: pressure from myself, like to myself on making sure that 520 00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:19,640 Speaker 3: the community and the characters were representing my community in 521 00:30:19,680 --> 00:30:23,440 Speaker 3: a way that felt real and authentic and powerful the 522 00:30:23,520 --> 00:30:26,160 Speaker 3: point of sometimes even illness, you know. And I think 523 00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:29,240 Speaker 3: that the growth from that first season and understanding that 524 00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:34,600 Speaker 3: I'm a human like that I can do my best 525 00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:37,480 Speaker 3: to tell incredible stories and that there is also room 526 00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:39,440 Speaker 3: for mistakes and there is room for. 527 00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:43,120 Speaker 4: Learning for growth. 528 00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:47,760 Speaker 3: I think season two definitely held the bar high still, 529 00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:49,760 Speaker 3: but did it in a way that I think was 530 00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:53,040 Speaker 3: much more healthy and much more not only love for 531 00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:55,600 Speaker 3: the community and authenticity of the company, but also love 532 00:30:55,600 --> 00:31:00,160 Speaker 3: for myself and my process through creating to show that 533 00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:03,400 Speaker 3: I can be valuable without having to kill myself to 534 00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:08,280 Speaker 3: do something I think is an important thing to accomplishment, 535 00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:12,280 Speaker 3: is something that I want our communities, for working class 536 00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:14,480 Speaker 3: to know that we don't have to break ourselves in 537 00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:16,760 Speaker 3: order to be seen and valued. 538 00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:20,800 Speaker 2: I think that I have learned how to fully and 539 00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:27,760 Speaker 2: truly and authentically be myself through these characters, like spending 540 00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:36,160 Speaker 2: every single day with a fiercely loyal and incredibly open 541 00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:42,520 Speaker 2: hearted woman like Blanca and someone as romantic and just 542 00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:48,120 Speaker 2: loving as Angel. It's just it's impacted and moved me 543 00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:50,920 Speaker 2: as a human, as a person, Like I think it's 544 00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:54,800 Speaker 2: it's forced me to reevaluate my own relationships with people 545 00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:59,440 Speaker 2: and my relationship to myself. And I think even more 546 00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:03,120 Speaker 2: than like the the professional side of like spending time 547 00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:06,400 Speaker 2: you know, running a room and like, you know, creating 548 00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:09,840 Speaker 2: a show and editing episodes, like all of that aside, 549 00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:12,880 Speaker 2: I think the fact that I can walk away feeling 550 00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:16,240 Speaker 2: like a better person because I got to spend three 551 00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:18,560 Speaker 2: seasons with these characters like that to me. 552 00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:27,560 Speaker 1: Is Gold, Stephen Canals, co creator of Poe's, and Linda 553 00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:30,920 Speaker 1: Yvett Chavez, co creator of Tentified. Thank you so much 554 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:33,960 Speaker 1: for sharing some insights on your creative process with us. 555 00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:51,600 Speaker 1: This episode was produced by Samantha Friedman and Alejandra Salasad. 556 00:32:51,680 --> 00:32:54,880 Speaker 1: It was edited by Marta Martinez and mixed Rosa Kan. 557 00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:59,280 Speaker 1: The Latino USA team includes Andrell Lopez Grusado, Mike Sargent, 558 00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:05,240 Speaker 1: Quiet Dinelli Vitto, Riestrada, Patricia Sulbaran, Gini Montalbo, Renaldo Leanos Junior, 559 00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:08,880 Speaker 1: and Julia Rocha, with help from Judema Perez. Our editorial 560 00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:13,200 Speaker 1: director is Julio Ricardo Barela. Our supervising senior engineer is 561 00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:17,480 Speaker 1: Stephanie Lebau. Our Assistant senior Engineer is Julia Caruso. Additional 562 00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:20,120 Speaker 1: engineering by Leah Shaw with help from gabriel A Bias 563 00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:23,560 Speaker 1: and j J. Kerubin. Our digital editor is Luis Luna. 564 00:33:23,840 --> 00:33:26,840 Speaker 1: Our New York Women's Foundation Ignite fellow is Mari es Kinka. 565 00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:29,760 Speaker 1: Our intern is Oscar de Leon. Our theme music was 566 00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:32,360 Speaker 1: composed by Zenie Robinos. If you like the music you 567 00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:35,440 Speaker 1: heard on this episode. Stop by Latinousa dot org and 568 00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:38,520 Speaker 1: check out our weekly Spotify playlist. I'm your host and 569 00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:42,280 Speaker 1: executive producer Mariao Posa. Join us again on our next episode, 570 00:33:42,280 --> 00:33:45,040 Speaker 1: and in the meantime, look for us on social media 571 00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:48,040 Speaker 1: and Ai loos BeO pastela proxima Ciao. 572 00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:56,880 Speaker 5: Latino Usa is made possible in part by the Ford Foundation, 573 00:33:57,520 --> 00:34:01,440 Speaker 5: working with visionaries on the front lines of social change worldwide, 574 00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:05,400 Speaker 5: the John D. And Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation, and the 575 00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:06,440 Speaker 5: wind Coat Foundation. 576 00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:13,880 Speaker 1: In lacma rule I'm hungry, I'm my dia no hoosa, 577 00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:17,239 Speaker 1: Next time on Latino USA. How mis gayle got so 578 00:34:17,400 --> 00:34:22,320 Speaker 1: popular and the often harmful consequences that go unnoticed every 579 00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:25,520 Speaker 1: time you sip, every time you smell, and every time 580 00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:28,360 Speaker 1: you taste bescle has. 581 00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:29,640 Speaker 4: That in itself. 582 00:34:30,120 --> 00:34:33,080 Speaker 1: That's next time on Laculo USA.