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Speaker 1: Hi Catherine, Hi Chelsea.

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Speaker 2: Where have you been this week?

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Speaker 3: Well?

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Speaker 1: I have the first week off that I've had for

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Speaker 1: Thanksgiving week. Oh that's my first week off. I'm hanging

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Speaker 1: on by an actual threat of dental floss. I am

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Speaker 1: really really. My body is shutting down. The plane rides,

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Speaker 1: the partying, the more tired I get, the more I

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Speaker 1: drink just to get it up, like I need help.

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Speaker 1: So and that's backfiring. My voice is gone. I've been touring.

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Speaker 1: It's my favorite tour. I mean, I say it's my

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Speaker 1: favorite whenever I'm doing anything, because it is. Yeah, but

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Speaker 1: it's so much fun. I don't know if I mentioned

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Speaker 1: this last week, but Eddie Vedder came to my show

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Speaker 1: in Seattle. I Goss Jill and we had the best

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Speaker 1: fucking time.

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Speaker 2: That's so funny.

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Speaker 1: They were awesome. I mean that My tour managers like,

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Speaker 1: Eddie Vedder's coming to the show tonight. I'm like what?

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Speaker 1: And then we were in Seattle. I had two shows

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Speaker 1: in Seattle, fucking epic in Seattle. Oh did I announce

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Speaker 1: my Canadian dates? Oh? You know what shows I have

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Speaker 1: coming up? I still have tickets for these shows. My

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Speaker 1: second show in Cincinnati it's at five o'clock. I'm trying

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Speaker 1: one of those shows in CINCINNT. I have two shows

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Speaker 1: that day, one at five pm and one at eight pm,

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Speaker 1: And the one at eight pm is sold out, but

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Speaker 1: the one at five pm. I want to promote this

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Speaker 1: the Taft Theater, which is in Ohio, obviously, because we're

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Speaker 1: talking about Cincinnati. I also added a second show in Detroit.

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Speaker 1: So there's a Thursday and Friday show in Detroit, and

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Speaker 1: there are still tickets for the Thursday show November thirtieth,

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Speaker 1: and that's coming right up. Yeah. And then I'm coming

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Speaker 1: to Louisville, Kentucky. There's tickets for that. That's Sunday, December third.

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Speaker 1: And then I'm coming to Montreal and I have two

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Speaker 1: shows in Toronto. We're coming to Ottawa, We're coming to Edmonton, Saskatoon, Winnipeg, Calgary,

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Speaker 1: all of my Canadian lovers. I'm coming to Victoria, Kelowna, Vancouver,

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Speaker 1: and then Salt Lake City and Denver and Maricopa, Arizona

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Speaker 1: and Richmond, Virginia. It just goes on and on and on,

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Speaker 1: and that's my schedule like through May. But I didn't

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Speaker 1: say all of the dates. I was just telling you

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Speaker 1: the ones that have tickets. So if you want tickets,

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Speaker 1: go to Chelseahandler dot com and come to my shows

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Speaker 1: because they're so much fun and you my Yeah, we

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Speaker 1: had we had a little after party because some of

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Speaker 1: my friends, my sister's friends were there. My sister wasn't there,

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Speaker 1: but her friends came, and then we had I ran

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Speaker 1: into a girl that I hadn't seen since I waited

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Speaker 1: tables twenty five years ago. It was called Roasty. I

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Speaker 1: saw her Roberta.

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Speaker 2: She came.

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Speaker 1: Her husband's a doctor in Seattle, so my doctor in

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Speaker 1: Seattle because I had my cardio myopathy the last time

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Speaker 1: I was in Seattle. They're friends and they came together

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Speaker 1: to my show. So that's my friend from twenty five

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Speaker 1: years ago who was awesome, and I'm going to see

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Speaker 1: her again in Whistler this winter. And then I saw

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Speaker 1: some other blasts from the past and we had this

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Speaker 1: nice little after party in our green room, which was

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Speaker 1: so fun. And then at midnight, I was like, it

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Speaker 1: was Thursday night, our Friday night. I had a show

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Speaker 1: in Seattle on Friday and Saturday, and I left and

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Speaker 1: when I left at midnight, Eddie Vetter and his wife

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Speaker 1: were still partying in my green room.

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Speaker 2: That's your friend.

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Speaker 1: That's the kind of spirit I like.

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Speaker 2: I like it. That sounds great.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So I mean I have a lot of rock and

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Speaker 1: roll connections this year. People rot rot my tour. Dave

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Speaker 1: Grol Yeah, well, Dave Girl, I've known for years. I

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Speaker 1: love Dave Girl. But a lot of rock stars are

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Speaker 1: coming to my shows and I'm fucking down with it,

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Speaker 1: and now I need to start going to see their shows.

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Speaker 1: So I think I'm going to see I think I'm

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Speaker 1: going to get a list, and so I'm going to

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Speaker 1: be up in Canada and Whistler for a few months

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Speaker 1: doing all my Canadian dates after I'm done with my

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Speaker 1: American dates, and then I come back for my American dates.

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Speaker 1: I think I'm going to go see who the big

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Speaker 1: guys who are coming through Vancouver and go to shows

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Speaker 1: because I love shows. Now. I used to hate concerts, really,

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Speaker 1: I don't know why, just because of the sheer, massive

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Speaker 1: people like I'd rather be on the stage than in

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Speaker 1: the crowd.

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Speaker 2: That makes sense though, does it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, some people love concerts.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, it's different going from to like a little hole

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Speaker 4: in the wall concert versus like a big concert with

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Speaker 4: all this like spectacle and special effects and everything like

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Speaker 4: those are really fun.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean they're all fun.

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Speaker 4: But I told Brad like mid pandemic, when things were

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Speaker 4: really bleak, I was like, it's kind of random, but like,

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Speaker 4: let's go.

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Speaker 2: See Pearl Jam when this is all over.

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Speaker 4: Like for some reason, that to me was like this

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Speaker 4: that will mean this is all over, so it's still

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Speaker 4: on my list.

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Speaker 1: Listen to how cute he was who My manager goes, hey, okay,

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Speaker 1: you know they came early to be backstage, so they

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Speaker 1: weren't in the crowd, and they were like, he's like,

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Speaker 1: Eddie Vedder's here. I go bring him up and Jill

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Speaker 1: his wife, who's fucking awesome too, and she they came

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Speaker 1: up and he was like, oh, sorry, we didn't. We

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Speaker 1: didn't come in and have a drink. He goes, oh god,

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Speaker 1: we didn't want to bother you before you perform, like

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Speaker 1: we were just coming to the show. We didn't even

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Speaker 1: expect to meet you. I'm like, are already talking about better?

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Speaker 1: I know how it works when you go to a

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Speaker 1: show and they're your celebrity and that you get to

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Speaker 1: meet the person most most often, but it was just

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Speaker 1: so cute. He was like, so, it's so amazing when

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Speaker 1: you beat legends like that and they're so humble, so.

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Speaker 4: They're not He is not like a one thousand Brown

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Speaker 4: M and M's person or whatever that writer was.

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Speaker 1: No, he was drinking Corona and she drinks champagne, which

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Speaker 1: is why I guess we had it because my tour

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Speaker 1: managers hooked to their guy. But it was just so nice.

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Speaker 1: I just love when there's surprises like that in the audience,

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Speaker 1: and that keeps happening on this tour. So I love it.

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Speaker 1: Thank you.

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Speaker 2: I love it well, Chelsea.

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Speaker 4: Next week is Thanksgiving, and I wonder you know, I

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Speaker 4: know your sister in law kind of has.

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Speaker 1: She's I'm dealing with oga over Christmas. I see her

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Speaker 1: for Christmas and we are all going to We're going

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Speaker 1: skiing my whole family. And this is how nice I am.

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Speaker 1: I'm moving out of my own fucking house so and

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Speaker 1: renting my place so I can go be with my

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Speaker 1: family in a nice, bigger house because they really won't

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Speaker 1: settle for anything less, and we need a nice house

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Speaker 1: because there's so many of us. So I'm moving out

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Speaker 1: of my own house to move into this rental house

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Speaker 1: with my family for a week and then no Thanksgiving,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna spend with Connie Britain. I'm going to Connie's

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Speaker 1: so I'm going to be in La. I have a

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Speaker 1: week off, Chelsea.

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Speaker 4: Is there anybody in your life that you sort of

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Speaker 4: like don't align with politically and like how do you

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Speaker 4: deal with them at Thanksgiving?

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Speaker 1: Etc? Well? No, I mean not in my family. I

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Speaker 1: don't really have people like that where we don't align politically.

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Speaker 1: I mean, now, with this everything that's going on, that's

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Speaker 1: more of an issue, I would assume, because there's so

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Speaker 1: many people that are so upset for multiple reasons. You know,

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Speaker 1: it's horrifying what's happening on both sides, and the anti

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Speaker 1: Muslim behavior and the anti Semitic behavior. So but and

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Speaker 1: then that becomes an argument about Palestine versus and that's

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Speaker 1: not the that's not the fucking argument. So I'm not

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Speaker 1: willing to even have that discussion any there because it's

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Speaker 1: an unwinnable conversation. Everyone's going around in circles. You could

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Speaker 1: go around for seventy five years, you could go around

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Speaker 1: for a thousand years, and they would still be the issue. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So no, I don't have that in my family, and if.

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Speaker 1: I mean, my nephew can be a little bit conservative,

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Speaker 1: which is annoying, but we all really jump down his throat.

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Speaker 1: You know what.

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Speaker 4: I have a niece that's like kind of turning that

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Speaker 4: corner too, and I'm like a little concerned. I'm just

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Speaker 4: hoping that when she goes to college, like she's gonna

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Speaker 4: get some different opinions and some different you know, worldviews

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Speaker 4: and come back to like she used to be super

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Speaker 4: super liberal. And I'm like, please come back to the

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Speaker 4: please come back.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I know, I know. It's very hard.

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Speaker 1: It's hard when you have that in your family because

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Speaker 1: you're like, whoa, whoa, whoa, that's not how we are.

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Speaker 1: You can't hate people, you just can't. Like, that's not

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Speaker 1: I don't want to live in a world where there's

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Speaker 1: so much hatred. Like I don't want anyone to die

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Speaker 1: or be killed. I don't like that.

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Speaker 4: Guess what, Like the solution is not continuing to kill,

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Speaker 4: Like it's just not.

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Speaker 1: I know, we should just send four women in there.

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Speaker 1: We should just send you know, fucking Angela Merkel, Send

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Speaker 1: Christine A. Monpour, she read very good about the Middle East.

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Speaker 1: Send Hillary Clinton, and send Michelle Obama let them go in,

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Speaker 1: come up with their solution and then tell us what

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Speaker 1: it's going to be.

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Speaker 2: Send In grena Tuneberry just for you know.

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Speaker 1: I like Gretituneburg it is it is actually technical.

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Speaker 2: For now it's Tunberry, but everyone's a sun Berg.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, like, oh over there the corrected.

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Speaker 2: Like how cute is that? That's very cute? Well, Chelsea,

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Speaker 2: we have Shelley back.

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Speaker 1: On the Showy Gilskey, my dear friend and her friend

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Speaker 1: and her friend Justin wrote a book and guess what

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Speaker 1: the title is, How We Ended Racism. You know Shelley

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Speaker 1: from this podcast because she runs Pandemic of Love and

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Speaker 1: I've talked about her organization many times. And she also

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Speaker 1: had another book come out a few years ago that

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Speaker 1: we talked about called Sit Down to Rise Up. Shelley

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Speaker 1: and just welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Shelly, Welcome back to

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Speaker 1: the podcast, Justin. It's nice to finally meet you.

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Speaker 5: So nice to meet you, Chelsea.

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Speaker 1: I've heard a lot about you Visa VI Shelley, and

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Speaker 1: a lot about your experience writing this book together. And

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Speaker 1: the book is called How We Ended Racism, which is

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Speaker 1: in the past tense. We'll get to that and I

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Speaker 1: can't wait to dive into. First of all, the boldness

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Speaker 1: of this title, which I love, and we can talk

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Speaker 1: about how you guys came together first. Yeah, let's start there.

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Speaker 6: Well, when we first first first came together was actually

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Speaker 6: in the rodeo of our first books. And so I

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Speaker 6: was going on a book tour and somebody said, Hey,

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Speaker 6: you need to talk to this woman named Shelley because

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Speaker 6: she knows everybody in the whole world. Basically that helps

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Speaker 6: a lot of people in the world, and she'll help

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Speaker 6: you get to the right folks. And Shelley and I

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Speaker 6: ended up connecting so deeply, like on our first call,

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Speaker 6: which I think happens with Shelley when you know we're

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Speaker 6: with good people. And the rest was really history in

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Speaker 6: terms of how we started working together.

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Speaker 5: Yeah. Yeah.

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Speaker 7: So I was going to teach in Southside, Chicago. I

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Speaker 7: was invited through the Obama Foundation to teach there, and

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Speaker 7: I was going to walk into a room with a

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Speaker 7: bunch of mothers who lost their children to gun violence,

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Speaker 7: and most of them are women of color. And what

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Speaker 7: I recognized is that it would be really great to

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Speaker 7: have a person of color in the room with me,

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Speaker 7: so that it wouldn't because I only had a very

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Speaker 7: short time to be there, and I realized, usually it

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Speaker 7: takes me a good two to three hours to even

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Speaker 7: like get their trust, you know. And so I invited

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Speaker 7: Justin just on a whim. I said, Hey, what are

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Speaker 7: you doing on this date?

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Speaker 5: Can you can you.

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Speaker 7: Come out to Chicago? And he said, let me check. Sure,

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Speaker 7: absolutely I'm available, and.

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Speaker 5: So and we had never met, never met.

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Speaker 7: In person, we'd never taught together in person, and it

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Speaker 7: was a really rich and wonderful experience.

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Speaker 8: It was amazing.

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Speaker 7: We actually it felt like I had been teaching with

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Speaker 7: him for a really long time. And we actually created

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Speaker 7: bonds there that we still have now with that community,

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Speaker 7: which is incredible.

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Speaker 1: Wow wow. Because she I went to a gun violence

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Speaker 1: retreat with Shelley once too, and we made a lot

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Speaker 1: of food in the kitchen, organic food. I think we

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Speaker 1: made a beet soup, aborched. I was not what I

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Speaker 1: was expecting at all. I was like, oh, there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of team building here. But yes, I went to

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Speaker 1: and by the way, by the way, I haven't been

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Speaker 1: asked back, so Justin, I just want to let you

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Speaker 1: know you're obviously crushing it.

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Speaker 5: Oh my god, Well thank you.

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Speaker 1: And Shelley's been on this podcast before. I've talked about

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Speaker 1: her foundation, which is her Mutual Aid Foundation, which I've

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Speaker 1: mentioned on the show multiple times, and she's helped out

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Speaker 1: so many of our callers. It's called Pandemic of Love.

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Speaker 1: And so talk to us about justin your background, like

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Speaker 1: where are you from and where did you grow up

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Speaker 1: and give us all that stuff.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, totally.

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Speaker 6: I grew up in northern California, actually in a town

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Speaker 6: called Pittsburgh, California.

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Speaker 5: A lot of people don't know there's Pittsburgh in California.

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Speaker 1: No, my god, I didn't know. We needed two of them.

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Speaker 5: We don't.

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Speaker 6: But this one, this one is just like twenty minutes

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Speaker 6: east of Berkeley. And I grew up actually in the hood,

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Speaker 6: to be honest with you, I grew up in a

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Speaker 6: home with gunshottles on the outside of my house. And

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Speaker 6: so when speaking in these kind of communities that Shelley's

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Speaker 6: talking about, it's something that I've really lived. And you know,

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Speaker 6: one of the things that I talk about all the time,

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Speaker 6: which kind of led me into the work that I

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Speaker 6: do now, is I grew up kind of adapting to

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Speaker 6: all of my trauma, being what I call a chronic overachiever,

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Speaker 6: just feeling like if I do enough, accomplished, en I

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Speaker 6: succeed enough, if I'm always good, if I'm always perfect,

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Speaker 6: and I'll finally be out of here, I'll finally be enough.

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Speaker 6: And I overachieved my way to getting a full ride

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Speaker 6: scholarship to go to UCLA. I moved to LA, went

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Speaker 6: to LA and it wasn't until I actually got to UCLA,

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Speaker 6: came out of the closet, had extra money for the

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Speaker 6: first time, was living in a safe neighborhood, and exhaled

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Speaker 6: that I realized that I was absolutely depressed. And I

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Speaker 6: was asking this question of like, how is it that

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Speaker 6: I have everything that I've said I've ever wanted. I'm

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Speaker 6: and I'm depressed, and it's you know what sent me

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Speaker 6: to a therapist for the first time. I'm ever This

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Speaker 6: was almost twenty years ago now at this point, and

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Speaker 6: the therapist said to me, you should try meditation. And

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Speaker 6: I literally said to him, meta, what like this before

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Speaker 6: the iPhone?

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Speaker 5: Right?

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Speaker 6: I was like, I didn't know any black people meditating.

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Speaker 6: I was like, I don't even know what you're talking about.

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Speaker 6: And he said, it looks like you've been trying to

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Speaker 6: find your happiness outside of yourself, and you've missed the

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Speaker 6: only place you haven't looked within. And the thing is, Chelsea,

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Speaker 6: like I had. It's commonplace to say that now, like

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Speaker 6: find your happiness within, but I had never even heard

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Speaker 6: that phrase. So I like lift up my arms and

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Speaker 6: I'm like within what?

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Speaker 5: Like where what are you talking about?

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Speaker 1: You're like here under here, find exactly right?

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Speaker 5: Exactly?

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Speaker 6: I mean, I definitely was trying to find it in

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Speaker 6: places with my pants down. I'll tell you about that,

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Speaker 6: but that's another podcast.

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Speaker 5: Okay, that's another podcast.

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Speaker 6: But anyway, that all leads me to say that I

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Speaker 6: think so many of us we have this experience in

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Speaker 6: our lives where we're trying to change the outside, hoping

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Speaker 6: that it will change something within us, and we find

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Speaker 6: and learn it again and again and again that we

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Speaker 6: could change our relationships, but we're never going to be

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Speaker 6: in a good relationship if we haven't changed who we are.

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Speaker 6: We can change our job, but our job is always

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Speaker 6: going to feel like shit if we don't change who

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Speaker 6: we are inside of those jobs. And so all of

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Speaker 6: my work now that I've really dedicated my life too,

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Speaker 6: is helping people not just change what's on the outside.

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Speaker 6: But change what's within. So I do that in a

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Speaker 6: lot of different ways through music and writing and teaching,

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Speaker 6: meditation and books. But Shelley and I really came together

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Speaker 6: to write this book to help people understand the work

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Speaker 6: that it takes for us to actually change the world

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Speaker 6: in the way that we're all saying that we want

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Speaker 6: it to change, and who we have to become inside

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Speaker 6: to really be able to show.

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Speaker 5: Up for that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I like what you just said. I can relate

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Speaker 1: to that a lot, changing you know, not the outside.

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Speaker 1: I also think trying to control the outside, trying to

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Speaker 1: control the outcome of things right, is never the way forward,

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Speaker 1: you know, controlling something without looking within. You know, part

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Speaker 1: of looking with in is being able to understand that

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Speaker 1: the outcome and the outside are not things. You know,

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Speaker 1: you have to be able to go with the flow

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Speaker 1: and move like with the you know, with some would

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Speaker 1: say with the universe. I would say that now. I

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Speaker 1: used to I used to be like you. I'd be like,

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Speaker 1: oh god, all that language is so free frou. But

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Speaker 1: once you get clicked in and you're moving and everything's

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Speaker 1: in a flow state, you understand the power of that,

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Speaker 1: and then the kind of power that that attracts and

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Speaker 1: the kind of energy that that gives off and brings in.

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Speaker 1: You're bringing in so many more people when you embody that.

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Speaker 1: When you do look in, you understand yourself. You realize, oh,

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Speaker 1: I want to give out high vibes. I want to

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Speaker 1: spread good vibes. I don't want to do the negative stuff,

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Speaker 1: you know what I mean? My purpose here is joy's

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Speaker 1: sunshine and laughter. Whatever your purpose is. So I love

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Speaker 1: that I can relate this to that a lot.

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Speaker 6: I feel like people often ask me, you know, I'm

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Speaker 6: thirty five, I'm turning thirty six, and people often ask

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Speaker 6: me like, how are you teaching this stuff and doing

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Speaker 6: this at such a young age? And I just feel like, honestly,

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Speaker 6: I was just lucky enough to have hit rock bottom

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Speaker 6: at such a young age and had the resources at

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Speaker 6: UCLA to actually get help at that age that was

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Speaker 6: just younger that I just happened to be starting this

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Speaker 6: at a pathway that I think is before a lot

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Speaker 6: of people do. And so I just feel really lucky

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Speaker 6: that I get to be like a young queer black

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Speaker 6: man who has been able to teach this work in

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Speaker 6: these spaces. And that's why Shelley was talking about like

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Speaker 6: us coming together the diversity that is happening in the

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Speaker 6: world as it relates to wellness and well being. It

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Speaker 6: takes people being able to see people who look like them.

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Speaker 6: And it's just I feel grateful every day that I

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Speaker 6: get to be representative of a community that sometimes is

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Speaker 6: represented in this work in this world.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So let's talk about this book and what's inside

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Speaker 1: this book. Obviously it's a very bold title choice, and

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Speaker 1: explain to us how you got there and then what

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Speaker 1: people are going to be able to learn from reading this.

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Speaker 8: Yeah.

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Speaker 7: So Justin and I are both Garrison Fellows, the Garrison Institute, which.

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Speaker 1: Is in I'm also a fellow, Shelley. So just back

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Speaker 1: to fuck up? Okay. So okay, so yeah, welcome.

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Speaker 2: To the podcast.

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Speaker 5: Back up, Shelley.

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Speaker 8: Back it up? Where do you want me to back

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Speaker 8: it up?

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Speaker 3: Shelley.

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Speaker 1: That's very inappropriate. That's really not the kind of book

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Speaker 1: we're talking about.

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Speaker 5: Okay.

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Speaker 1: I can't believe you would reduce our podcast to this.

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Speaker 4: That's Justin's other book.

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Speaker 8: Back it Up? Okay.

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Speaker 7: So Justin and I are Garrison Institute fellows, and the

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Speaker 7: Garrison Institute Fellowship actually at the helm of the program

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Speaker 7: is doctor Dan Siegel, who you know really well and

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Speaker 7: who has been on the podcast. And the challenge that

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Speaker 7: the Garrison Institute Fellows had in this two year program

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Speaker 7: that we were in is to think about big questions,

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Speaker 7: like really big questions that almost seem like completely insurmountable

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Speaker 7: and unsolvable, et cetera. And Justin and I came together.

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Speaker 7: This was around the George Floyd murders the summer of

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Speaker 7: twenty twenty. We started thinking about what needs to change

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Speaker 7: in this world for this kind of bullshit to stop happening,

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Speaker 7: you know, what actually needs to change? What can change?

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Speaker 7: Why do we feel so helpless, why do we feel

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Speaker 7: so hopeless, and why do we feel so disempowered, like

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Speaker 7: we don't feel like we can actually change anything. And

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Speaker 7: what we started to do is we started to put

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Speaker 7: together a program. First and foremost, we were like, let's

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Speaker 7: bring together people to just have a conversation to really

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Speaker 7: start exploring the answer to that question what can we do?

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Speaker 7: And then what we started to find out as we

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Speaker 7: start as we dove sort of deeper into just the

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Speaker 7: rhetoric right around anti racism, and we read cast and

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Speaker 7: we read all of the books, all the things that

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Speaker 7: were coming out around that time. We recognize that in

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Speaker 7: none of those books, in none of the DII programs,

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Speaker 7: and none of the racial bias training programs, does anybody

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Speaker 7: ever say that racism can end. All we ever talk

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Speaker 7: about is that the work needs to continue.

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Speaker 8: Generation after generation after generation. So and I looked at

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Speaker 8: each other.

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Speaker 7: We asked each other, you know, what would it look

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Speaker 7: like if racism actually could end? What would it look

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Speaker 7: like if we stood in the future and looked backwards

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Speaker 7: and thought to ourselves, what do we need to do?

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Speaker 7: Who did we need to become back then today in

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Speaker 7: the present moment for racism to actually end.

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Speaker 6: And I think one thing, Chelsea that I'll add to

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Speaker 6: this is we thought it was crazy. So remember the

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Speaker 6: Fellowship asked us to ask these big questions, And we

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Speaker 6: looked at each other and.

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Speaker 5: Said, could racism end?

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Speaker 6: Like everything is saying this is going to be a

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Speaker 6: lifelong fight for generations and generations forever and ever and

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Speaker 6: ever and always and always and always. And we were like,

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Speaker 6: but for why we do so many things in the world,

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Speaker 6: Like we accomplish so many things, And right now everyone's

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Speaker 6: talking about getting to another planet, and we're like, if

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Speaker 6: we land on Mars. Without ending racism, we are fucked, Like,

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Speaker 6: we're totally screwed, you know, if we figure that out first.

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Speaker 6: And so we got what was so cool is we

439
00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:02,919
Speaker 6: were about it too. We went in with a genuine question.

440
00:19:03,040 --> 00:19:06,960
Speaker 6: We pulled hundreds of people together, We got anthropologists, sociologists,

441
00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:12,040
Speaker 6: neuroscientists to ask the question, is it actually possible for

442
00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:16,320
Speaker 6: this to end? And what we found actually against what

443
00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:19,359
Speaker 6: we thought was going to happen. The answer was yes,

444
00:19:20,080 --> 00:19:23,679
Speaker 6: it actually can, and for the first time in history

445
00:19:23,720 --> 00:19:26,000
Speaker 6: it can because of everything that's come before us, all

446
00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:26,760
Speaker 6: that we know now.

447
00:19:27,520 --> 00:19:28,680
Speaker 5: But it can't end.

448
00:19:28,760 --> 00:19:33,159
Speaker 6: That possibility doesn't exist without these eight specific pillars. And

449
00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:36,440
Speaker 6: so our book kind of lays out the eight pillars

450
00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:39,480
Speaker 6: that would have to exist for the idea of ending

451
00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:41,919
Speaker 6: racism to even be possible. And so it's not really

452
00:19:41,960 --> 00:19:44,640
Speaker 6: a book that like ten Steps to end racism. It's

453
00:19:44,640 --> 00:19:47,720
Speaker 6: not like that. It's like, stand in the future, racism

454
00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:49,480
Speaker 6: is over. What are the eight things that would have

455
00:19:49,520 --> 00:19:51,560
Speaker 6: had to happen now for this to actually go down?

456
00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:53,600
Speaker 5: And so that's what we write about, right.

457
00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:57,240
Speaker 7: What conditions needed to arise in humanity in order for us.

458
00:19:57,240 --> 00:19:59,560
Speaker 1: To get there? And can you talk about a couple

459
00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:01,400
Speaker 1: of the pillar before we go to callers.

460
00:20:01,760 --> 00:20:05,240
Speaker 6: Yeah, sure, so there's eight of them. I'll start with

461
00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:08,080
Speaker 6: the one that we normally don't start with because it's

462
00:20:08,119 --> 00:20:11,119
Speaker 6: the one that people often like to talk about, which

463
00:20:11,200 --> 00:20:15,679
Speaker 6: is we learn to have big conversations and how to

464
00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:19,840
Speaker 6: have conversations across divides, and one of the things that

465
00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:23,520
Speaker 6: we believe the world is ready to graduate from and

466
00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:27,960
Speaker 6: needs to evolve from, basically immediately, and it is time.

467
00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:31,080
Speaker 6: I think we all know this is from calling people

468
00:20:31,119 --> 00:20:35,000
Speaker 6: out to doing what we have called and coined in

469
00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:38,480
Speaker 6: our book Calling Forward. And the reason we talk about

470
00:20:38,560 --> 00:20:41,919
Speaker 6: this is what we know from all the science is

471
00:20:42,040 --> 00:20:45,760
Speaker 6: calling out which leads to cancel culture, which is shame

472
00:20:45,960 --> 00:20:50,639
Speaker 6: and blame and guilt, and it never ever leads to

473
00:20:50,760 --> 00:20:54,560
Speaker 6: the situation that we're actually trying to stop really changing

474
00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:58,440
Speaker 6: in the big picture. It leads to canceling people instead

475
00:20:58,480 --> 00:21:02,840
Speaker 6: of canceling a problem, which is a situation. And so

476
00:21:03,240 --> 00:21:05,840
Speaker 6: what we know from all the research that we looked

477
00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:09,040
Speaker 6: at is if you approach a situation with Shane blaming Gil,

478
00:21:09,160 --> 00:21:11,840
Speaker 6: I don't care how bad it was, it is a

479
00:21:11,880 --> 00:21:15,480
Speaker 6: thing that somebody did. Getting them to learn or grow

480
00:21:16,119 --> 00:21:20,400
Speaker 6: is basically virtually impossible, and so we want to get

481
00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:22,240
Speaker 6: people to learn and grow. What we have to understand

482
00:21:22,320 --> 00:21:24,879
Speaker 6: is our book is based upon why I'm starting here.

483
00:21:26,359 --> 00:21:31,480
Speaker 6: You can't be antie everything to get things to move forward.

484
00:21:32,080 --> 00:21:35,840
Speaker 6: Being anti does it tell us what we're walking towards.

485
00:21:35,880 --> 00:21:38,400
Speaker 6: It just tells us what we're fighting against. And if

486
00:21:38,400 --> 00:21:42,520
Speaker 6: you're going to be fighting against something, you're ultimately saying

487
00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:45,760
Speaker 6: that thing has to always exist so that I can

488
00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:49,880
Speaker 6: keep fighting it. And so we're looking at no, not

489
00:21:50,040 --> 00:21:52,280
Speaker 6: just what are we fighting against? What are we anti?

490
00:21:52,960 --> 00:21:56,840
Speaker 6: What are we walking toward? What are we going forward too?

491
00:21:57,520 --> 00:21:59,480
Speaker 6: And that's really what we're trying to do with the

492
00:21:59,480 --> 00:22:01,320
Speaker 6: work in this book is teach people how to have

493
00:22:01,359 --> 00:22:04,640
Speaker 6: the conversations, how to move forward to what we all

494
00:22:04,680 --> 00:22:05,960
Speaker 6: actually want and.

495
00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:06,840
Speaker 5: What I believe. Chelsea.

496
00:22:07,440 --> 00:22:09,040
Speaker 6: Let's say this is a black gay man who has been

497
00:22:09,040 --> 00:22:12,120
Speaker 6: all over this country. I'm half white. I have white

498
00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:15,360
Speaker 6: family who lives in Alabama who are Trump voters, and

499
00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:17,800
Speaker 6: they are the most I don't know if they'll vote

500
00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:20,760
Speaker 6: for him again, but they did, and they are the

501
00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:25,600
Speaker 6: most lovely, amazing people who I love with my whole heart.

502
00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:28,920
Speaker 6: And what I've learned all around this country, is that

503
00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:31,399
Speaker 6: what we're seeing in the news in the media is

504
00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:34,399
Speaker 6: not what I would say most the majority of people

505
00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:38,520
Speaker 6: are this extreme. I think many of us actually want

506
00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:41,000
Speaker 6: the same things. We want to walk in a similar direction.

507
00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:44,119
Speaker 6: But we're being torn apart by all this council culture

508
00:22:44,160 --> 00:22:46,320
Speaker 6: and this anti everything in this call out everything, and

509
00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:49,080
Speaker 6: we're trying to gather that group of people together so

510
00:22:49,119 --> 00:22:50,320
Speaker 6: we can walk forward together.

511
00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:54,199
Speaker 1: You know, it's so true, like the canceling and shunning people,

512
00:22:54,280 --> 00:22:58,040
Speaker 1: Like if that worked, police officers wouldn't be up to

513
00:22:58,040 --> 00:22:59,760
Speaker 1: the same business that they've been up to for the

514
00:22:59,800 --> 00:23:03,080
Speaker 1: life last fifty years. You know, like people get arrested,

515
00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:07,440
Speaker 1: they lose their jobs for assaulting and murdering innocent black

516
00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:09,680
Speaker 1: men who are just scared to be pulled over, who

517
00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:12,680
Speaker 1: run from them out of fear. And you would think

518
00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:15,439
Speaker 1: with social media it's all over the place. I'm always like,

519
00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:17,359
Speaker 1: how do these men still think they're going to get

520
00:23:17,359 --> 00:23:19,719
Speaker 1: away with it? And it's like it clearly doesn't make

521
00:23:19,760 --> 00:23:21,760
Speaker 1: an impact that some of these men have lost their

522
00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:24,040
Speaker 1: jobs and some of them are spending time in jail.

523
00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:26,879
Speaker 1: It doesn't have the impact. And so the canceling of

524
00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:29,360
Speaker 1: people and the calling out you're right. Isn't a way

525
00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:31,200
Speaker 1: to learn, It's a way to shame someone. I mean,

526
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:34,439
Speaker 1: it's a nice step, in my opinion, to as a

527
00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:36,920
Speaker 1: warning to people, but you know, it's not the most

528
00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:41,200
Speaker 1: effective way, and clearly obviously it's not. Well that's fascinating.

529
00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:43,560
Speaker 1: I love that, and I mean I love this book

530
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:46,480
Speaker 1: because I like anything that talks about ending racism. Obviously,

531
00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:48,679
Speaker 1: my hope for another planet is that when we do

532
00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:51,200
Speaker 1: make contact with another planet, all of those people will

533
00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:55,520
Speaker 1: be black. So that's my personal fantasy that we will

534
00:23:55,520 --> 00:23:59,120
Speaker 1: recontact with whomever they are living somewhere else, because there

535
00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:02,399
Speaker 1: are people out there, and I yeah, and then America's

536
00:24:02,440 --> 00:24:04,000
Speaker 1: gonna be like whoopsie doodle.

537
00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:05,280
Speaker 5: Yeah right.

538
00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:09,040
Speaker 1: I doubt I'll be around for that moment. But anyway, Okay,

539
00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:11,000
Speaker 1: so are you guys ready you want to take some

540
00:24:11,040 --> 00:24:13,159
Speaker 1: calls about on this topic. We're gonna have people call

541
00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:16,080
Speaker 1: some questions and that's the name of the game on

542
00:24:16,119 --> 00:24:18,439
Speaker 1: this podcast. So okay, Catherine, what do we what do

543
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:19,399
Speaker 1: we got going on today?

544
00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:21,080
Speaker 4: Well, first, I'm going to make us take a little

545
00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:22,720
Speaker 4: break and we will be.

546
00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:23,880
Speaker 2: Right back to take callers.

547
00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:30,240
Speaker 1: Okay, We're going to take a little break okay, and

548
00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:31,120
Speaker 1: we're back.

549
00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:31,840
Speaker 2: We're back.

550
00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:33,800
Speaker 1: Oh, I have a little frog in my throat. Excuse me.

551
00:24:34,359 --> 00:24:36,480
Speaker 1: I had a coffee this morning, and I'm fucking bouncing

552
00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:38,400
Speaker 1: off the walls. I don't normally drink coffee.

553
00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:39,480
Speaker 2: That's not your usual thing.

554
00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:42,760
Speaker 4: Well, we're actually going to start with a caller. Usually

555
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:44,679
Speaker 4: we start with an easy one. But I know you

556
00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:45,600
Speaker 4: guys can handle it.

557
00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:45,800
Speaker 5: So.

558
00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:48,000
Speaker 2: Abigail is in Colorado.

559
00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:51,760
Speaker 4: She is thirty five, and she says, my husband and

560
00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:54,240
Speaker 4: I have been together for six years. We have different

561
00:24:54,240 --> 00:24:57,720
Speaker 4: political views, and his friends share his views. My husband

562
00:24:57,720 --> 00:24:59,760
Speaker 4: and I have never had any major issues about our

563
00:24:59,760 --> 00:25:02,760
Speaker 4: con views, other than being annoyed from time to time,

564
00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:06,040
Speaker 4: most of the big issues we agree on. His close

565
00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:08,280
Speaker 4: friend comes over a couple times a month and spends

566
00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:11,880
Speaker 4: several hours drinking. Early in our relationship, I actually enjoyed

567
00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:14,800
Speaker 4: it and would even suggest it. The problem is his

568
00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:17,640
Speaker 4: friend loves to bring up topics that make me uncomfortable,

569
00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:20,560
Speaker 4: one being politics, but there are many, and they're offensive.

570
00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:23,399
Speaker 4: It's only after he gets drunk, and it always feels

571
00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:25,199
Speaker 4: like an attack because he knows where I stand on

572
00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:27,760
Speaker 4: most issues. I feel like he just wants a reaction

573
00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:30,960
Speaker 4: if I react. Then I get very defensive and never

574
00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:33,159
Speaker 4: say what I really want to because I'm afraid of

575
00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:36,280
Speaker 4: being so reactive. If I say nothing, I spin out

576
00:25:36,320 --> 00:25:39,440
Speaker 4: for weeks thinking about what I should have said. It's maddening.

577
00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:42,880
Speaker 4: My husband always gets pretty quiet when this behavior happens.

578
00:25:43,119 --> 00:25:45,040
Speaker 4: He knows I don't need anyone to defend me. I'm

579
00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:47,720
Speaker 4: a big girl, but I can't take it anymore. I

580
00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:49,879
Speaker 4: don't want my husband to not hang out with his friends,

581
00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:52,480
Speaker 4: and I appreciate that they always hang out here instead

582
00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:56,240
Speaker 4: of going to bars. I've been meditating, listening to podcasts,

583
00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:58,440
Speaker 4: and reading lots of books like Letting Go and The

584
00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:01,480
Speaker 4: Untethered Soul, trying to let go of my negative feelings

585
00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 4: towards him.

586
00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 2: What should I do?

587
00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:09,960
Speaker 1: Abigail Hi, Abigail Hi, Hi. This is Shelley and Justin.

588
00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:12,639
Speaker 1: There are guests today. They wrote a book that relates

589
00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:15,040
Speaker 1: to what you're talking about. I don't know how people

590
00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:18,040
Speaker 1: do it. I'm like you, listen, I'm like you, But

591
00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:20,600
Speaker 1: people like that, especially someone who's trying to get a

592
00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:24,360
Speaker 1: rise out of you, you better figure out the toolkit too.

593
00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:26,960
Speaker 1: As my friend would say, water Ski above it all.

594
00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:30,360
Speaker 1: You cannot engage with somebody who's trying to wind you up.

595
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:33,560
Speaker 1: I mean, if that's not the dynamic between men and women,

596
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:36,200
Speaker 1: that also needs to end. That is the most annoying

597
00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:38,119
Speaker 1: thing for a man to sit there and needle you

598
00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:41,439
Speaker 1: about something he knows you're passionate about. So I would

599
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:45,240
Speaker 1: just I would really try and use all of your

600
00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:48,760
Speaker 1: toolkit so that you can a either laugh at anything

601
00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:51,760
Speaker 1: he says and just belittle that, not in a belittling

602
00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:54,240
Speaker 1: way of him, but just belittling his behavior, like I'm

603
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:57,880
Speaker 1: not engaging with you. That's just too ridiculous. You're too ridiculous,

604
00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:00,240
Speaker 1: Like I'll talk to you about regular things, but just

605
00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:02,040
Speaker 1: trying to get me upset, and I'm like, it's just

606
00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:05,240
Speaker 1: too stupid. And also, do you need to be subjecting

607
00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:08,040
Speaker 1: yourself to him because what reason? Because you like your

608
00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:10,320
Speaker 1: husband to be home drinking rather than out drinking.

609
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 9: No, I mean that's nice, don't get me wrong, just

610
00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:16,919
Speaker 9: to not think about like drinking and driving and stuff

611
00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:20,120
Speaker 9: like that. But other than that, it's just his friend

612
00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:22,720
Speaker 9: that he's been best friends with for like I don't

613
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:26,040
Speaker 9: even know, like twenty years. So I definitely don't want

614
00:27:26,080 --> 00:27:29,160
Speaker 9: to try to like create any sort of wedge that's

615
00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:34,040
Speaker 9: not it. I just wish he would stop doing this because,

616
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:37,720
Speaker 9: like I said, like he doesn't even remember the conversations,

617
00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:39,320
Speaker 9: which is just crazy.

618
00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:42,080
Speaker 1: Well, which is even more ridiculous for you to be

619
00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:45,000
Speaker 1: upset about, you know what I mean, He's drunk and

620
00:27:45,119 --> 00:27:47,520
Speaker 1: just blah blah blah blah blah blah blah. You don't

621
00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:50,840
Speaker 1: even need to engage with that. And at a certain point,

622
00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:54,119
Speaker 1: when someone's that drunk, like you're totally able to have

623
00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:57,400
Speaker 1: them leave or remove yourself from the situation, like there's

624
00:27:57,400 --> 00:27:58,840
Speaker 1: no reason to subject yourself to that.

625
00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:02,080
Speaker 9: Yeah, because I know that this is like a me problem,

626
00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:05,680
Speaker 9: like I need to figure out my reaction. But also

627
00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:08,679
Speaker 9: down the road, my son is a toddler now, but

628
00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:11,600
Speaker 9: when he's older, I just feel like I'm going to

629
00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:16,760
Speaker 9: have this explosive reaction if he says something you know,

630
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:21,240
Speaker 9: racial or homophobic or anything like that in front of

631
00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:23,399
Speaker 9: my son, I think I'm going to lose it, and

632
00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:26,280
Speaker 9: I need to, Like, I just don't want him to

633
00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:30,080
Speaker 9: ever be exposed to hear someone that he's supposed to

634
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,240
Speaker 9: love and respect say terrible things, do you know what

635
00:28:33,240 --> 00:28:33,560
Speaker 9: I mean?

636
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:35,840
Speaker 1: Well, that's your job as a parent to not have

637
00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:39,200
Speaker 1: those people around your children voluntarily A I mean hot

638
00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:43,240
Speaker 1: parenting tips for me be anytime you lose your shit,

639
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:47,280
Speaker 1: you've lost the argument. So anytime you are up in

640
00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:50,680
Speaker 1: arms and screaming and yelling, it's nobody takes that seriously.

641
00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:54,480
Speaker 1: So it is a practice to control yourself. I used

642
00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:56,400
Speaker 1: to do that all the time. It's not effective, it

643
00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:59,920
Speaker 1: doesn't work. When you make a point quietly and directly,

644
00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:02,120
Speaker 1: it has much more of an impact than you jumping

645
00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:05,360
Speaker 1: around screaming and yelling and being defensive. Shelley and justin

646
00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:07,920
Speaker 1: over to you thoughts, feelings.

647
00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:14,480
Speaker 6: Oh yeah, Abigail, I feel so understanding of what you're

648
00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 6: dealing with. It reminds me of somebody that we wrote

649
00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:20,480
Speaker 6: about in our book named Joe, who dealt with this

650
00:29:20,600 --> 00:29:22,920
Speaker 6: with his coworkers. He was like going out to lunch

651
00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:24,800
Speaker 6: with his coworkers again and again, and there was a

652
00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:27,360
Speaker 6: few coworkers who just kept saying racist jokes, who kept

653
00:29:27,400 --> 00:29:29,480
Speaker 6: saying all these remarks, and he didn't know what to say.

654
00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:33,240
Speaker 5: And I want to just have There's a section.

655
00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:35,280
Speaker 6: In our book where we walk people step by step

656
00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:39,440
Speaker 6: through how to set boundaries and in a way that

657
00:29:39,560 --> 00:29:42,240
Speaker 6: actually works and is meaningful. And I want to honestly,

658
00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:43,840
Speaker 6: I just want to promise you that we're going to

659
00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:46,200
Speaker 6: give you a gift of our book ourselves. So we're

660
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:47,800
Speaker 6: going to send it to you so that you have

661
00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:50,600
Speaker 6: a copy of it to walk through this step by step.

662
00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:52,520
Speaker 6: But I want to give you a piece of this

663
00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 6: here that I think is really important to know, and

664
00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:58,440
Speaker 6: then I'll pass it to Shelley. A big part of

665
00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:01,920
Speaker 6: the reason why we don't set boundaries we lie to

666
00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:05,960
Speaker 6: ourselves and convince ourselves that we're not setting the boundary

667
00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:08,920
Speaker 6: because oh, I don't want to create a wedge between

668
00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:13,080
Speaker 6: my husband and his friend, or I don't want I

669
00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:15,200
Speaker 6: want to make sure that I don't ruffle any feathers,

670
00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:17,080
Speaker 6: or I want to make sure that I'm being nice,

671
00:30:17,120 --> 00:30:19,600
Speaker 6: and we kind of act like the reason we're not

672
00:30:19,640 --> 00:30:23,200
Speaker 6: setting boundaries is because we're so nice, But what we've

673
00:30:23,240 --> 00:30:26,040
Speaker 6: actually learned from all the studies around this is it's

674
00:30:26,040 --> 00:30:32,000
Speaker 6: actually the opposite. We're not setting boundaries because we don't

675
00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:37,000
Speaker 6: want to have to sit with having caused someone else disappointment.

676
00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:41,880
Speaker 6: So we will abandon our truth to make sure that

677
00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:45,280
Speaker 6: we don't have to sit with someone else being disappointed

678
00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:47,880
Speaker 6: with us, and so we'll let ourselves, continue to get

679
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:51,520
Speaker 6: run over, continue to be upset, continue to be angry,

680
00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:54,320
Speaker 6: continue to be in some cases this is not the

681
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:58,440
Speaker 6: situation that you're in, but like abused or bothered, also

682
00:30:58,520 --> 00:31:00,640
Speaker 6: that we don't have to have somebody go I'm a

683
00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:03,440
Speaker 6: little disappointed in you. And so if you could just

684
00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:06,400
Speaker 6: own that a part of the reason you're not saying

685
00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:09,520
Speaker 6: anything is not because you don't really feel strongly about this.

686
00:31:09,840 --> 00:31:11,800
Speaker 6: It is not because you maybe don't have the tools

687
00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:13,720
Speaker 6: to speak about it when you're all sober and bring

688
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:16,960
Speaker 6: it up in a meaningful way. But it's because you're

689
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:21,200
Speaker 6: afraid of you having to sit with the reaction of

690
00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:23,400
Speaker 6: if he gets upset, or if your husband gets upset

691
00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:26,480
Speaker 6: about it. And so this might be a starting point

692
00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:30,400
Speaker 6: for the conversation is share the dilemma instead of going

693
00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:33,880
Speaker 6: in with this anger and solution. Share the dilemma and

694
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:36,480
Speaker 6: start with your husband and say, hey, I want to

695
00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:39,000
Speaker 6: talk to you about something. Here's the dilemma. You're not

696
00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:41,120
Speaker 6: going in with this hard boundary answer. I need him

697
00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:45,160
Speaker 6: to stop. It's Hey, I really love your best friend

698
00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:46,720
Speaker 6: and I want us to all be able to stay

699
00:31:46,760 --> 00:31:49,480
Speaker 6: really close, and I care about him and I love

700
00:31:49,520 --> 00:31:53,280
Speaker 6: when he's over. And at the same time, it's really

701
00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:56,680
Speaker 6: important to me that we're creating an environment where we're

702
00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:58,920
Speaker 6: not talking about these things because it really bothers me.

703
00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:01,720
Speaker 6: What do you think we should do? How can we

704
00:32:01,800 --> 00:32:05,840
Speaker 6: handle this together? That's a whole different way of setting boundaries.

705
00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:07,960
Speaker 6: And now you're involving your husband and you're a team

706
00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:10,280
Speaker 6: actually wondering how to do this, and you have the

707
00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:12,760
Speaker 6: same conversation with him. Hey, he doesn't even realize this

708
00:32:12,800 --> 00:32:14,880
Speaker 6: is even happening, Shelley, I'll let you jump in. I

709
00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:16,320
Speaker 6: do I want to monopolize this. I know you have

710
00:32:16,400 --> 00:32:16,880
Speaker 6: something to say.

711
00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:19,480
Speaker 1: That's very good advice, very good advice. I love it.

712
00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:20,680
Speaker 5: That's super helpful.

713
00:32:20,800 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 7: No, I mean, yeah, there's not a lot to add here.

714
00:32:23,320 --> 00:32:26,280
Speaker 7: You know, what I will say is that I personally

715
00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 7: had this experience with my husband, Jason's friend, best friend,

716
00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:36,560
Speaker 7: and he would constantly say really sexist and aggressive things.

717
00:32:37,080 --> 00:32:39,760
Speaker 7: He would come over on Sundays, they would watch football games,

718
00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:42,080
Speaker 7: and it would just, you know, it would be fine

719
00:32:42,120 --> 00:32:44,600
Speaker 7: when he got there. And my son was always at

720
00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:48,960
Speaker 7: home as well and looked up to his quote unquote uncle,

721
00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:52,680
Speaker 7: and it became really challenging for me to be in

722
00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:56,360
Speaker 7: the same room as my husband and his friend when

723
00:32:56,400 --> 00:32:59,280
Speaker 7: he came over and they started drinking. So I made

724
00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:02,600
Speaker 7: a conscious decision definitely did what Justin said, you know,

725
00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:03,440
Speaker 7: raise the dilemma.

726
00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:06,160
Speaker 1: And then she also started drinking. That's how she happened.

727
00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:09,640
Speaker 1: You know what, can't beat them, join them, but.

728
00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:11,120
Speaker 8: Not with them, but not with them.

729
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:15,680
Speaker 7: Yeah, basically, you know, you have the choice. I feel

730
00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:17,880
Speaker 7: like you're kind of giving your power away in a sense,

731
00:33:17,920 --> 00:33:20,720
Speaker 7: and I recognize that, Like, the one thing that I

732
00:33:20,760 --> 00:33:25,520
Speaker 7: can control is where I am physically when this person

733
00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:29,320
Speaker 7: comes over, or whether or not, you know, if you're

734
00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:31,760
Speaker 7: concerned about you know, you said, you know, I don't

735
00:33:32,120 --> 00:33:35,000
Speaker 7: necessarily want them to it's nice that he's at home,

736
00:33:35,320 --> 00:33:37,720
Speaker 7: but I'm just thinking to myself, like, maybe it doesn't

737
00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:39,520
Speaker 7: always have to be at your home. You know, we

738
00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:42,720
Speaker 7: live in an uber world, Like, yes, they're drinking and driving,

739
00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:45,760
Speaker 7: so then you drive them to the bar and yeah,

740
00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 7: you know, and you can have your husband uber back,

741
00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:49,920
Speaker 7: or you can send him the uber, you can go

742
00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:52,560
Speaker 7: pick him up, or there's so many different options as well.

743
00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:55,120
Speaker 7: But the idea is like, don't give your power away,

744
00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:58,000
Speaker 7: don't put yourself in a situation I remove myself from

745
00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:02,960
Speaker 7: that situation, and eventually, I will tell you that became

746
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:05,760
Speaker 7: a little bit wiser about it and was like, why

747
00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:07,880
Speaker 7: doesn't Chillie ever want to hang out with us anymore?

748
00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:10,239
Speaker 7: And I finally, when he was sober and he was

749
00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:12,279
Speaker 7: willing to come to the table and have this conversation,

750
00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:14,960
Speaker 7: I had this conversation with him, and I will say

751
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:17,920
Speaker 7: that he actually apologized for his behavior and was a

752
00:34:17,960 --> 00:34:19,239
Speaker 7: little bit more conscious about it.

753
00:34:19,880 --> 00:34:22,200
Speaker 8: At that point. I still can't stand him, but still.

754
00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:26,480
Speaker 1: I mean, it's also it's just a nice test for you,

755
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:27,799
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, to see how you can

756
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:30,680
Speaker 1: handle a situation that is difficult, that is causing you

757
00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:34,200
Speaker 1: distress and handle this in a different way, Like you know,

758
00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:36,799
Speaker 1: you probably haven't had to deal with this specific, you know,

759
00:34:36,960 --> 00:34:40,160
Speaker 1: situation before, but handle it. And you're going to feel

760
00:34:40,200 --> 00:34:42,800
Speaker 1: so good after you do handle it. You know, obviously

761
00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:44,799
Speaker 1: when when he's not drinking. You can't talk to someone

762
00:34:44,800 --> 00:34:46,919
Speaker 1: when they're drunk or in a blackout for that matter.

763
00:34:47,360 --> 00:34:50,279
Speaker 1: But you know, there are many different avenues to like

764
00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:52,759
Speaker 1: address this at first with your husband and then you know,

765
00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:56,920
Speaker 1: in a very mature and affectionate ray even exactly.

766
00:34:56,680 --> 00:34:58,719
Speaker 4: Yeah, And I think Also, you know, of course you

767
00:34:58,760 --> 00:35:01,080
Speaker 4: want to keep your child away from this, but whether

768
00:35:01,120 --> 00:35:03,840
Speaker 4: it's from this guy or in seventh grade or in college,

769
00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:05,560
Speaker 4: he will be exposed to these.

770
00:35:05,400 --> 00:35:06,320
Speaker 2: Types of opinions.

771
00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:08,400
Speaker 4: Now, this is something I'm dealing with, like with my

772
00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:11,200
Speaker 4: nieces and nephews, and just to be there to have

773
00:35:11,280 --> 00:35:13,840
Speaker 4: those conversations from the other side, like well, this is

774
00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:16,799
Speaker 4: what I believe and this is how I feel about it.

775
00:35:16,960 --> 00:35:19,319
Speaker 4: I think is so important that they just hear that

776
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:20,840
Speaker 4: other side all along.

777
00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:24,600
Speaker 6: Yeah, I totally agree, honestly, Abigail, That's what I was

778
00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:26,279
Speaker 6: going to say, is the most important thing for your son.

779
00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:27,959
Speaker 6: You're not going to be able to protect him from

780
00:35:28,040 --> 00:35:30,399
Speaker 6: these conversations. I mean, maybe you can protect him from

781
00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:32,520
Speaker 6: a bit in your home. I'm not saying I'm say anything,

782
00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:35,319
Speaker 6: but what you can do is model for him how

783
00:35:35,320 --> 00:35:37,719
Speaker 6: he can show up inside of these conversations. And that's

784
00:35:37,719 --> 00:35:39,360
Speaker 6: where you get to really make a big difference.

785
00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:42,520
Speaker 1: Also, you have every right to tell him. I mean,

786
00:35:42,520 --> 00:35:44,879
Speaker 1: that's a perfect in It's like, I don't I don't

787
00:35:44,880 --> 00:35:47,239
Speaker 1: want my son hearing any of this stuff. Those are

788
00:35:47,280 --> 00:35:50,239
Speaker 1: your opinions, You're entitled to have them, but not when

789
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:52,200
Speaker 1: you're at my house as my guests, Like, I don't

790
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:54,680
Speaker 1: need my child hearing that, and it's under his own roof.

791
00:35:54,680 --> 00:35:56,839
Speaker 1: This is a safe place for him, and I'm his

792
00:35:56,920 --> 00:35:59,160
Speaker 1: mother and I have every right to protect him from that.

793
00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:01,160
Speaker 1: You know, he's going to hear that outside in the

794
00:36:01,160 --> 00:36:03,840
Speaker 1: outside world, but not under my house. Not in my house, Like,

795
00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:07,040
Speaker 1: come on, it's not your belief system. That's not part

796
00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:08,200
Speaker 1: of what you have to put up with.

797
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 9: So yeah, no, that's all super helpful. I think I

798
00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:15,160
Speaker 9: just needed to hear someone tell me, like, saying nothing

799
00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:18,400
Speaker 9: is so much more powerful than trying to engage, because

800
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:23,160
Speaker 9: anytime I've tried to educate or just try to listen

801
00:36:23,320 --> 00:36:27,000
Speaker 9: or try it just it never it always makes me

802
00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:29,840
Speaker 9: spiral later, and it always makes him feel like he

803
00:36:30,000 --> 00:36:33,319
Speaker 9: won or whatever, like and I just I need to

804
00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:34,360
Speaker 9: not engage.

805
00:36:35,080 --> 00:36:38,440
Speaker 4: Right, Yeah, Well, thank you so much, Abigail, and good luck.

806
00:36:38,680 --> 00:36:39,760
Speaker 4: It's a tricky situation.

807
00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:41,920
Speaker 1: Take care, Abigail, Thank you so much.

808
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:44,279
Speaker 5: Thank you, care dear, thank you.

809
00:36:48,880 --> 00:36:54,279
Speaker 4: Our next email comes from Margo. Margo says, Dear Chelsea.

810
00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:57,200
Speaker 4: After I graduated college in twenty twenty one, I went

811
00:36:57,239 --> 00:36:59,759
Speaker 4: abroad to solo travel for a while, but I ended

812
00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:02,800
Speaker 4: up never coming back. I've lived in three different countries

813
00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 4: since then, and have worked six different hospitality and retail jobs.

814
00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:09,640
Speaker 4: I'm currently living in Australia and I'm strongly considering moving

815
00:37:09,719 --> 00:37:12,480
Speaker 4: to Vietnam to teach English soon, but my dad thinks

816
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:14,480
Speaker 4: it's time for me to come home and start my career.

817
00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:18,200
Speaker 4: Since I'm almost twenty four, I understand where he's coming from,

818
00:37:18,239 --> 00:37:20,040
Speaker 4: but I'm worried that if I don't go now, I

819
00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:23,239
Speaker 4: never will. I really value the sense of autonomy and

820
00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:27,200
Speaker 4: fierce independence I've developed from not being committed to one home, base, job,

821
00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:29,799
Speaker 4: or partner. However, I do know that in the near

822
00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:32,120
Speaker 4: future I want to have children, a partner, and a

823
00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:35,880
Speaker 4: successful career. I feel at once too old to continue

824
00:37:35,880 --> 00:37:39,239
Speaker 4: my current unconventional lifestyle and too young to enter a

825
00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:43,120
Speaker 4: life back home where I could turn complacent doing the mundane.

826
00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:46,200
Speaker 4: Do you think I should get serious or stay adventurous

827
00:37:46,600 --> 00:37:48,120
Speaker 4: or is there a way I can keep the sense

828
00:37:48,120 --> 00:37:51,279
Speaker 4: of wonder and freedom even without traveling and while I'm

829
00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:54,160
Speaker 4: trying to join the corporate ladder, get married and have kids.

830
00:37:54,400 --> 00:37:57,799
Speaker 4: I don't know, girl, Margo, she's twenty four.

831
00:37:57,920 --> 00:37:59,879
Speaker 2: You say almost twenty four?

832
00:38:00,280 --> 00:38:02,440
Speaker 1: Shelley would you like to begin.

833
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:05,840
Speaker 7: Almost twenty she is, Yeah, Wow, I'm.

834
00:38:05,680 --> 00:38:07,520
Speaker 1: Gonna save my feedback for the very end.

835
00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:10,040
Speaker 5: Okay, Wow, I'm.

836
00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:12,360
Speaker 8: Just like, wow, I'm floored.

837
00:38:12,480 --> 00:38:16,719
Speaker 7: I mean, it's interesting because I spent the first you know,

838
00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:20,160
Speaker 7: twenty years of my life climbing the corporate ladder, doing

839
00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:23,160
Speaker 7: everything that people told me I should be doing, you know,

840
00:38:23,239 --> 00:38:26,680
Speaker 7: went to school, got a master's degree, did everything the

841
00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:29,920
Speaker 7: right way, got the corner office, you know, made a

842
00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:33,680
Speaker 7: great salary, and like Jessa was saying earlier about his life,

843
00:38:33,719 --> 00:38:35,680
Speaker 7: like it was the most miserable I'd ever been in

844
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:36,040
Speaker 7: my life.

845
00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:38,479
Speaker 8: And it finally at the age of like.

846
00:38:38,680 --> 00:38:42,120
Speaker 7: Forty, I was like, burn this all to the ground,

847
00:38:42,239 --> 00:38:44,200
Speaker 7: you know, through the match behind me, and was like,

848
00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:48,239
Speaker 7: let's go, Let's go live this wanderlust adventurous life that

849
00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:52,080
Speaker 7: I didn't really have an opportunity to do when I

850
00:38:52,120 --> 00:38:56,360
Speaker 7: was younger. And so I would say that, especially because

851
00:38:56,400 --> 00:39:00,120
Speaker 7: she's only it seems like twenty four. Wow, you know,

852
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:02,960
Speaker 7: you're a quarter of a century old almost. It's hard

853
00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:06,280
Speaker 7: to like imagine what life will be like at age fifty.

854
00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:09,480
Speaker 7: But if you know, you're thinking about what your parents

855
00:39:09,880 --> 00:39:12,440
Speaker 7: or your father is telling you, you should be doing,

856
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:16,279
Speaker 7: and I would say don't let people should or would you?

857
00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:21,320
Speaker 7: I would say, absolutely continue living this adventurous life because

858
00:39:21,320 --> 00:39:24,120
Speaker 7: you will not only when you travel far you find yourself,

859
00:39:24,160 --> 00:39:26,600
Speaker 7: that's first of all, and second of all, you will

860
00:39:26,640 --> 00:39:29,160
Speaker 7: find your tribe. You will find the people, and maybe

861
00:39:29,160 --> 00:39:32,439
Speaker 7: even find your husband. Maybe he's not back quote unquote home,

862
00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:35,480
Speaker 7: maybe he's in Australia, maybe he's in Vietnam, maybe he's

863
00:39:35,600 --> 00:39:37,520
Speaker 7: or your partner. I should say, because I don't want

864
00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:41,200
Speaker 7: to assume what your sexuality is, but I think you

865
00:39:41,239 --> 00:39:45,720
Speaker 7: should absolutely continue to live what feeds your soul, because

866
00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:49,480
Speaker 7: when you come back home, you will there's a very

867
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:52,279
Speaker 7: big possibility that you will live a life filled with

868
00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:56,720
Speaker 7: resentment and remorse and what ifs. And it's it's worse

869
00:39:56,960 --> 00:39:59,840
Speaker 7: to live a life of what ifs, a life laden

870
00:39:59,840 --> 00:40:02,160
Speaker 7: with regret, than it is to live a life that

871
00:40:02,200 --> 00:40:03,919
Speaker 7: feeds your soul every single day.

872
00:40:04,640 --> 00:40:10,440
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean ditto all along that pathway. I think

873
00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:14,520
Speaker 6: what I'll say is that Shelley and I you know,

874
00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:17,080
Speaker 6: have worked with hundreds of thousands of people all around

875
00:40:17,080 --> 00:40:18,960
Speaker 6: the world at this point. And what I will tell you,

876
00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:21,680
Speaker 6: my dear Margo, is we work with people at all

877
00:40:21,760 --> 00:40:26,839
Speaker 6: ages of their life who would just die to have

878
00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:29,160
Speaker 6: the chance to travel in the way and experience what

879
00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:30,640
Speaker 6: you're experiencing right now.

880
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:32,960
Speaker 5: Would just really want that.

881
00:40:33,680 --> 00:40:37,200
Speaker 6: And you are on a pathway that I think your

882
00:40:37,239 --> 00:40:40,040
Speaker 6: family and your parents it's not that they want there's

883
00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:42,080
Speaker 6: something that they're trying to create, something bad for you.

884
00:40:42,120 --> 00:40:44,600
Speaker 6: It's just there's a different life for them. There's something

885
00:40:44,600 --> 00:40:47,600
Speaker 6: different that they know and that they may have defined

886
00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:50,760
Speaker 6: as success. And what you have to do is really

887
00:40:50,800 --> 00:40:54,640
Speaker 6: ask yourself, what does success look like for me? What

888
00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:58,640
Speaker 6: does happiness look like for me? And follow that path

889
00:40:58,719 --> 00:41:01,160
Speaker 6: and if the pathway that you're on is it, do it,

890
00:41:01,200 --> 00:41:03,920
Speaker 6: Because girl, you are twenty four. I remember when I

891
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:06,399
Speaker 6: was twenty four thinking that I was old and had

892
00:41:06,400 --> 00:41:09,239
Speaker 6: to have all my shit together. Oh my god, if

893
00:41:09,280 --> 00:41:11,200
Speaker 6: I only knew how much life there, you know, is

894
00:41:11,200 --> 00:41:14,480
Speaker 6: hopefully still left to live and so enjoy, my dear.

895
00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:16,640
Speaker 5: Find the pathway and you'll find home.

896
00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:19,759
Speaker 6: But you know, having a house doesn't mean you have

897
00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:23,480
Speaker 6: a home, So don't make it like it's all about

898
00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:25,600
Speaker 6: moving and buying a house to you know, save your

899
00:41:25,600 --> 00:41:26,080
Speaker 6: life here.

900
00:41:26,320 --> 00:41:30,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, and don't listen to your father. Okay, like, don't

901
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:33,520
Speaker 1: listen to some man tell you what is best for you,

902
00:41:33,640 --> 00:41:36,920
Speaker 1: even if it is your father, because your life sounds incredible.

903
00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:38,640
Speaker 1: I'm like, what what I want to be?

904
00:41:38,719 --> 00:41:38,959
Speaker 5: You?

905
00:41:39,520 --> 00:41:41,640
Speaker 1: And you're twenty four years old. I didn't have a

906
00:41:41,640 --> 00:41:44,240
Speaker 1: career until I was thirty two years old. I didn't

907
00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:46,920
Speaker 1: make a living until I was thirty two doing what

908
00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:49,520
Speaker 1: I wanted to be doing. So I think you should

909
00:41:49,560 --> 00:41:52,440
Speaker 1: stay there, go to Vietnam, go then go go to Laos,

910
00:41:52,560 --> 00:41:55,080
Speaker 1: go wherever the fuck you feel like going. Do whatever

911
00:41:55,120 --> 00:41:57,800
Speaker 1: you want, and don't put a time limit on anything.

912
00:41:58,239 --> 00:42:00,960
Speaker 1: You know, time is like, this is the most important

913
00:42:00,960 --> 00:42:02,799
Speaker 1: thing you could possibly be doing with your life as

914
00:42:02,840 --> 00:42:05,640
Speaker 1: seeing the world. And you're right. If you go home

915
00:42:05,680 --> 00:42:07,840
Speaker 1: and you find some guy and you shack up and

916
00:42:07,880 --> 00:42:10,640
Speaker 1: start a family, you're never going to get these opportunities again.

917
00:42:10,960 --> 00:42:13,239
Speaker 1: So you know, I know your father probably wants the

918
00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:16,440
Speaker 1: best for what's best for you, but he's also referencing

919
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:19,400
Speaker 1: this constructed society that we're told what we have to

920
00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:21,200
Speaker 1: do and when we have to do it, And I

921
00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:23,120
Speaker 1: say fuck you to all of that. You know you

922
00:42:23,160 --> 00:42:25,000
Speaker 1: have to follow what you want to do and be

923
00:42:25,440 --> 00:42:28,440
Speaker 1: passionate about who you are and not listen to anybody

924
00:42:28,480 --> 00:42:30,560
Speaker 1: who's trying to explain to you what's best for you,

925
00:42:30,760 --> 00:42:33,040
Speaker 1: because only you know that, and that's what I have

926
00:42:33,080 --> 00:42:37,400
Speaker 1: to say about that. Hal Amen, Amen, there you go, Margo,

927
00:42:38,239 --> 00:42:40,440
Speaker 1: There you go, Margo. Okay, don't fuck this up.

928
00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:44,120
Speaker 2: Send as a post guard from Vietnam.

929
00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:46,520
Speaker 8: Yeah, we better not be seeing you in these parts

930
00:42:46,520 --> 00:42:46,960
Speaker 8: of the words.

931
00:42:47,320 --> 00:42:47,520
Speaker 3: Yes.

932
00:42:48,200 --> 00:42:52,200
Speaker 2: Our next call is from Laura. She is in Carasau

933
00:42:52,440 --> 00:42:53,560
Speaker 2: and is a nutritionist.

934
00:42:54,560 --> 00:42:58,040
Speaker 4: Dear Chelsea. After suffering four small strokes in a row

935
00:42:58,120 --> 00:43:01,520
Speaker 4: last December, my life has been really a roller coaster

936
00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:05,040
Speaker 4: ride through depression and back. Almost nine months later, I

937
00:43:05,080 --> 00:43:07,600
Speaker 4: can finally say I feel a bit like myself again.

938
00:43:08,120 --> 00:43:10,799
Speaker 4: Your special and podcast has been the first thing to

939
00:43:10,800 --> 00:43:13,440
Speaker 4: get me laughing again in months, so thanks for that.

940
00:43:14,040 --> 00:43:17,480
Speaker 4: Now here's my question. I have severe ADHD and have

941
00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:21,560
Speaker 4: tried and really want to meditate, but it's been absolute hell.

942
00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:24,200
Speaker 4: And I truly mean this with all the respect.

943
00:43:23,920 --> 00:43:24,480
Speaker 2: In the world.

944
00:43:24,560 --> 00:43:27,160
Speaker 4: But I figured, if you can meditate and actually enjoy it,

945
00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:30,560
Speaker 4: isn't it possible for everyone? I've tried every app there is.

946
00:43:30,640 --> 00:43:32,719
Speaker 4: I tried first thing in the morning, tried at night.

947
00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:35,120
Speaker 4: After eight weeks of hating it and not seeing even

948
00:43:35,160 --> 00:43:36,280
Speaker 4: the tiniest change.

949
00:43:36,360 --> 00:43:37,520
Speaker 2: I gave up again.

950
00:43:38,040 --> 00:43:40,160
Speaker 4: My mind doesn't want to deal with another thing to

951
00:43:40,239 --> 00:43:42,960
Speaker 4: check off my already never ending to do list. Would

952
00:43:43,000 --> 00:43:46,359
Speaker 4: love your advice on how to make meditation enjoyable. Much

953
00:43:46,360 --> 00:43:48,279
Speaker 4: love from the Caribbean, Laura.

954
00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:52,920
Speaker 1: Hi Laura, Hello, Hi Laura. Our special guests today are

955
00:43:53,080 --> 00:43:55,440
Speaker 1: Justin and Shelley. They wrote a book called How We

956
00:43:55,520 --> 00:43:58,680
Speaker 1: Ended Racism. So Shelley has a lot of experience, well

957
00:43:58,680 --> 00:44:01,439
Speaker 1: so does Justin with meta meditation. So Shelley, why don't

958
00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:04,799
Speaker 1: you start first about meditation and ADHD and how you

959
00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:05,440
Speaker 1: combine the two.

960
00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:09,000
Speaker 10: Absolutely, So, look, can I be an ADHD er and

961
00:44:09,040 --> 00:44:13,360
Speaker 10: say this is fucking awesome? Absolutely interrupt and interrupt you

962
00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:13,879
Speaker 10: right away.

963
00:44:14,120 --> 00:44:16,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just keep interrupting us, I mean, and then

964
00:44:16,239 --> 00:44:18,120
Speaker 1: we'll get the picture, no problem.

965
00:44:18,760 --> 00:44:21,120
Speaker 7: Yeah, And what's fucking awesome is the sunshine and your

966
00:44:21,120 --> 00:44:23,760
Speaker 7: sunglasses and you're sitting outside in a tank top somewhere

967
00:44:23,760 --> 00:44:27,920
Speaker 7: in the Caribbean. Let me say that I am married

968
00:44:28,120 --> 00:44:33,080
Speaker 7: to someone who also does not enjoy meditation in any way,

969
00:44:33,239 --> 00:44:38,080
Speaker 7: doesn't necessarily see the benefits if you will, And what

970
00:44:38,160 --> 00:44:41,480
Speaker 7: I will tell you is that there are many modalities

971
00:44:41,520 --> 00:44:45,919
Speaker 7: to meditation. I think there's this stigma that you have

972
00:44:46,040 --> 00:44:50,040
Speaker 7: to you know, sit down, cross legged, do an app

973
00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:54,560
Speaker 7: close your eyes, do breathing exercises. And that's actually not

974
00:44:54,600 --> 00:44:58,000
Speaker 7: true at all. When my husband, for example, plays guitar,

975
00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:02,560
Speaker 7: he's meditating or sure, he's lost in some other universe

976
00:45:02,680 --> 00:45:05,000
Speaker 7: and that is his way, that is his meditation.

977
00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:07,319
Speaker 8: When I have a friend.

978
00:45:07,040 --> 00:45:11,000
Speaker 7: Who's a runner, and when she runs and trains for marathons,

979
00:45:11,040 --> 00:45:14,400
Speaker 7: you know she runs long distances, she's completely.

980
00:45:14,120 --> 00:45:16,000
Speaker 3: I tried that now, Yeah.

981
00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:18,160
Speaker 7: Well, I mean, I think the idea is that there's

982
00:45:18,200 --> 00:45:21,960
Speaker 7: something that is there, whether it's when you're walking along

983
00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:24,480
Speaker 7: the beach because you're in the Caribbean, when you're swimming,

984
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:28,440
Speaker 7: when you're paddleboarding, when you're where do you find that

985
00:45:28,520 --> 00:45:33,160
Speaker 7: your mind is the quietest, you know, where there's got

986
00:45:33,200 --> 00:45:35,239
Speaker 7: to be something. There's got to be one thing. If

987
00:45:35,280 --> 00:45:37,640
Speaker 7: it's listening to music, if it's playing music, if it's

988
00:45:37,880 --> 00:45:41,680
Speaker 7: but the idea is that wherever you find that bliss,

989
00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:45,120
Speaker 7: wherever you find that moment, then I would say that's

990
00:45:45,200 --> 00:45:49,040
Speaker 7: where you should go to meditate, right that, Because I

991
00:45:49,080 --> 00:45:51,239
Speaker 7: think this stigma of like I have to do it

992
00:45:51,280 --> 00:45:53,960
Speaker 7: in a certain way or use a particular app or

993
00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:57,719
Speaker 7: something is not correct. It's not correct at all. And

994
00:45:57,760 --> 00:45:59,800
Speaker 7: the other thing I will tell you is that there's also,

995
00:46:00,360 --> 00:46:05,400
Speaker 7: you know, benefits to just mini meditations or microhabits. And

996
00:46:05,480 --> 00:46:07,640
Speaker 7: so what I will say to you is that even

997
00:46:07,680 --> 00:46:12,160
Speaker 7: if you're just doing breathing exercises throughout the day that

998
00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:16,320
Speaker 7: takes sixteen seconds ten seconds, you know, Chelsea, I remember

999
00:46:16,400 --> 00:46:19,600
Speaker 7: you and I were talking about the meditation exercise of

1000
00:46:19,960 --> 00:46:22,799
Speaker 7: six one eight or four seven eight, which is like

1001
00:46:22,880 --> 00:46:26,520
Speaker 7: breathing in for four, holding for seven, exhaling out for eight.

1002
00:46:26,800 --> 00:46:30,040
Speaker 7: What that does is it recalibrates your vagus nerve so

1003
00:46:30,080 --> 00:46:32,440
Speaker 7: that you can calm yourself, you can center yourself. Even

1004
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:34,560
Speaker 7: if you just do that every time you wash your

1005
00:46:34,600 --> 00:46:37,560
Speaker 7: hands right after you go to the bathroom or you're

1006
00:46:37,760 --> 00:46:40,759
Speaker 7: in the kitchen or whatever, and you start incorporating these

1007
00:46:40,800 --> 00:46:44,359
Speaker 7: mini habits in your life, that is meditation too. That's

1008
00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:46,319
Speaker 7: also a form of meditation, and you can get the

1009
00:46:46,320 --> 00:46:49,600
Speaker 7: benefits of it right because it recenters you. It brings

1010
00:46:49,640 --> 00:46:52,000
Speaker 7: you back to the present moment, and you're able to

1011
00:46:52,239 --> 00:46:55,920
Speaker 7: now not just necessarily react, or you're able to be

1012
00:46:56,000 --> 00:46:57,920
Speaker 7: self aware that your mind has wandered.

1013
00:46:58,200 --> 00:47:00,400
Speaker 8: Oh my mind wandered. Let me bring it back.

1014
00:47:00,920 --> 00:47:03,520
Speaker 7: And so in long forms that may not work for you,

1015
00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:06,080
Speaker 7: but in short forms that is maybe there's a way

1016
00:47:06,080 --> 00:47:08,600
Speaker 7: that it will give you a sense of self awareness.

1017
00:47:09,160 --> 00:47:11,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, and Laura, where is that place that you find bliss?

1018
00:47:12,719 --> 00:47:15,040
Speaker 10: It's difficult because I don't know, Like you always make

1019
00:47:15,120 --> 00:47:16,600
Speaker 10: jokes that you have ADHD, but if you.

1020
00:47:16,600 --> 00:47:20,120
Speaker 3: Have it, it's just it's not something that's that goes away.

1021
00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:22,080
Speaker 10: I have about eight hundred channels in my head that

1022
00:47:22,120 --> 00:47:26,080
Speaker 10: are constantly giving some kind of signals.

1023
00:47:25,400 --> 00:47:29,919
Speaker 3: And it's very rare that they're completely turned off.

1024
00:47:30,440 --> 00:47:32,439
Speaker 10: Some like if I'm caught in a really really really

1025
00:47:32,480 --> 00:47:34,799
Speaker 10: good show on Netflix, then that that sometimes you lose

1026
00:47:34,840 --> 00:47:37,680
Speaker 10: yourself in something like that. Mm hmm, if it's a

1027
00:47:37,680 --> 00:47:41,040
Speaker 10: really good book. But I'm not, Like I tried marathon running.

1028
00:47:41,120 --> 00:47:43,840
Speaker 10: I didn't all trust, It's just my brain doesn't fucking stop.

1029
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:44,640
Speaker 10: It doesn't stop.

1030
00:47:45,360 --> 00:47:47,839
Speaker 1: It doesn't stop. But what you can, I hear you,

1031
00:47:47,880 --> 00:47:50,000
Speaker 1: and you're right, I don't have ADHD properly, so I

1032
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:51,759
Speaker 1: don't know, you know, I'm always just joking about it.

1033
00:47:51,800 --> 00:47:53,160
Speaker 1: I think I have more add but no.

1034
00:47:53,239 --> 00:47:54,240
Speaker 8: But it's fine. It's funny.

1035
00:47:54,239 --> 00:47:57,480
Speaker 1: I left my ass off, But I think that whatever

1036
00:47:57,560 --> 00:48:00,760
Speaker 1: you can do to just relinquish all of the noise,

1037
00:48:00,880 --> 00:48:03,120
Speaker 1: like the added noise, since you already have so much

1038
00:48:03,160 --> 00:48:06,080
Speaker 1: noise in your head. Whatever activity can allow you to

1039
00:48:06,080 --> 00:48:09,040
Speaker 1: put your phone away for an hour, two hours, whatever

1040
00:48:09,080 --> 00:48:11,240
Speaker 1: the best challenge is for you. Maybe it's thirty minutes

1041
00:48:11,280 --> 00:48:13,600
Speaker 1: to begin with, maybe it's ten minutes. But put your

1042
00:48:13,640 --> 00:48:16,640
Speaker 1: phone away and get lost in the activity of what

1043
00:48:16,640 --> 00:48:19,280
Speaker 1: you're doing. And reading a book is a perfect example.

1044
00:48:19,320 --> 00:48:21,439
Speaker 1: If it's a really good book and you get lost

1045
00:48:21,480 --> 00:48:24,080
Speaker 1: in it, doesn't that feel so good when you realize, Oh,

1046
00:48:24,120 --> 00:48:26,000
Speaker 1: I've been reading for thirty minutes and I haven't even

1047
00:48:26,000 --> 00:48:26,840
Speaker 1: looked at my phone.

1048
00:48:27,360 --> 00:48:29,279
Speaker 10: Yeah, but I was going to suggest and this is

1049
00:48:29,320 --> 00:48:31,200
Speaker 10: the thing. I need my phone for it, because what

1050
00:48:31,280 --> 00:48:34,520
Speaker 10: I've noticed is that your podcast. That's how it started,

1051
00:48:34,520 --> 00:48:36,480
Speaker 10: because I don't listen much to podcast, but I was

1052
00:48:36,560 --> 00:48:38,920
Speaker 10: looking for something because my brain was going after I

1053
00:48:38,960 --> 00:48:39,520
Speaker 10: had the strokes.

1054
00:48:39,560 --> 00:48:41,319
Speaker 3: It was I had to go off all the meds

1055
00:48:41,360 --> 00:48:42,480
Speaker 3: and anyways.

1056
00:48:42,480 --> 00:48:44,680
Speaker 10: It was fucking horrible, and I was trying to find

1057
00:48:44,800 --> 00:48:45,720
Speaker 10: some way to focus.

1058
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:46,279
Speaker 3: I could do my.

1059
00:48:46,320 --> 00:48:48,800
Speaker 10: Job because I own my own company, I cook for people,

1060
00:48:49,680 --> 00:48:52,280
Speaker 10: and I was just putting so much pressure on myself

1061
00:48:52,440 --> 00:48:54,480
Speaker 10: and then the podcast is just like you have this

1062
00:48:54,600 --> 00:48:57,839
Speaker 10: noise in the background that keeps you just focused enough

1063
00:48:57,880 --> 00:48:59,960
Speaker 10: and it quiets down all the other trap that's going on,

1064
00:49:00,000 --> 00:49:01,800
Speaker 10: and I just keep going and going.

1065
00:49:02,360 --> 00:49:04,760
Speaker 3: So it would involve my phone, but it is like listening,

1066
00:49:04,880 --> 00:49:07,080
Speaker 3: it's very soothing. You wouldn't think it, but it is.

1067
00:49:07,360 --> 00:49:09,000
Speaker 1: That's okay that you're listening on your phone as long

1068
00:49:09,040 --> 00:49:12,080
Speaker 1: as you're not on your phone while you're enjoying the activity, Like,

1069
00:49:12,200 --> 00:49:16,120
Speaker 1: don't interrupt that activity with other activities. It doesn't matter

1070
00:49:16,120 --> 00:49:17,960
Speaker 1: how many things are going on in your head. You

1071
00:49:18,160 --> 00:49:20,560
Speaker 1: know what happens when you pick up your phone and

1072
00:49:20,600 --> 00:49:23,759
Speaker 1: interrupt something that you're doing, or you interrupt you know,

1073
00:49:23,800 --> 00:49:25,279
Speaker 1: you're in the middle of something and then you're like, oh,

1074
00:49:25,280 --> 00:49:26,480
Speaker 1: I'm going to go do this, I'm going to go

1075
00:49:26,520 --> 00:49:28,600
Speaker 1: do that. The point is it's to be as present

1076
00:49:28,640 --> 00:49:32,239
Speaker 1: as possible. Right, that's present minded awareness, Like that's it.

1077
00:49:32,320 --> 00:49:35,120
Speaker 1: You're paying attention to the activity that you're doing, and

1078
00:49:35,160 --> 00:49:38,520
Speaker 1: the goal is to find the activity that brings you

1079
00:49:38,640 --> 00:49:41,440
Speaker 1: to that so that the voices are a little bit

1080
00:49:41,520 --> 00:49:44,239
Speaker 1: duller and all of the traction that's going on in

1081
00:49:44,280 --> 00:49:48,960
Speaker 1: your head becomes a little bit less chaotic. And when

1082
00:49:48,960 --> 00:49:51,799
Speaker 1: you notice that you're feeling that way, then that's an

1083
00:49:51,840 --> 00:49:54,520
Speaker 1: activity that you should do again, you know, with the

1084
00:49:54,520 --> 00:49:57,319
Speaker 1: intention of Okay, I'm going to put my phone away

1085
00:49:57,320 --> 00:50:00,200
Speaker 1: for this amount of time whatever your big distractions are,

1086
00:50:00,360 --> 00:50:02,600
Speaker 1: to remove them from the thing that is going to

1087
00:50:02,680 --> 00:50:05,560
Speaker 1: make you just really be focused and pay attention. And

1088
00:50:05,600 --> 00:50:08,680
Speaker 1: I promise you that if you keep practicing this.

1089
00:50:09,280 --> 00:50:10,000
Speaker 3: I gave up.

1090
00:50:10,040 --> 00:50:11,360
Speaker 10: I have to be honest. I had a good, like

1091
00:50:11,400 --> 00:50:13,600
Speaker 10: eight week cycle going and then I gave up.

1092
00:50:13,840 --> 00:50:15,200
Speaker 1: I know, but you're not going to be able to

1093
00:50:15,239 --> 00:50:18,080
Speaker 1: meditate right now. So just what we're saying is find

1094
00:50:18,120 --> 00:50:21,200
Speaker 1: the show, find the book, find the podcast, whatever it is,

1095
00:50:21,560 --> 00:50:24,239
Speaker 1: and practice doing that for a certain amount of time

1096
00:50:24,320 --> 00:50:27,960
Speaker 1: every day, and I promise you will start to become

1097
00:50:28,040 --> 00:50:30,919
Speaker 1: more focused. You won't, you know, you don't believe that now,

1098
00:50:31,520 --> 00:50:34,000
Speaker 1: but it will. So that's a gift you're just going

1099
00:50:34,080 --> 00:50:37,799
Speaker 1: to give to yourself. All right, justin, did you want

1100
00:50:37,840 --> 00:50:38,399
Speaker 1: to chime in?

1101
00:50:38,800 --> 00:50:39,920
Speaker 5: Yeah? I would love to.

1102
00:50:40,040 --> 00:50:44,560
Speaker 6: Actually, Laura, So there's this really amazing book that I know.

1103
00:50:44,600 --> 00:50:46,680
Speaker 6: It's one of the best books that I've ever seen

1104
00:50:46,880 --> 00:50:51,719
Speaker 6: on meditation, and it's written specifically for meditation, like one

1105
00:50:51,719 --> 00:50:53,840
Speaker 6: of the titles originally was going to be Meditation for

1106
00:50:53,840 --> 00:50:57,200
Speaker 6: people who can who can't Stop thinking. That's not the

1107
00:50:57,239 --> 00:51:01,439
Speaker 6: actual title. The title is Stay Woke, A Meditation Guide

1108
00:51:01,440 --> 00:51:04,040
Speaker 6: for the rest of us. Happened to write I happen

1109
00:51:04,120 --> 00:51:07,359
Speaker 6: to write this book shameless plug just.

1110
00:51:07,400 --> 00:51:09,000
Speaker 3: Recently learned the word plug.

1111
00:51:09,120 --> 00:51:10,200
Speaker 5: I recently learned what.

1112
00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:14,120
Speaker 8: I have a different definition for plug.

1113
00:51:14,239 --> 00:51:17,320
Speaker 6: Yeah, I do too, Actually a few a few, but no,

1114
00:51:17,520 --> 00:51:19,560
Speaker 6: I'm actually sharing this with you because I'm one of

1115
00:51:19,560 --> 00:51:21,560
Speaker 6: these people who I don't have ADHD, but I can't

1116
00:51:21,600 --> 00:51:26,000
Speaker 6: stop thinking. And one of the biggest myths about meditating,

1117
00:51:26,040 --> 00:51:26,640
Speaker 6: it is a myth.

1118
00:51:26,760 --> 00:51:28,160
Speaker 5: It is a lie. It's bullshit.

1119
00:51:28,239 --> 00:51:30,080
Speaker 6: No one's ever done it ever in their life. And

1120
00:51:30,080 --> 00:51:32,920
Speaker 6: if they told you they've done it, they're alive. People

1121
00:51:33,000 --> 00:51:35,680
Speaker 6: say that they if they to meditate, I have to

1122
00:51:35,680 --> 00:51:37,600
Speaker 6: get my thoughts to stop or get my mind to

1123
00:51:37,600 --> 00:51:41,640
Speaker 6: stop thinking. That would literally be like saying, oh, I'm

1124
00:51:41,680 --> 00:51:43,360
Speaker 6: going to meditate, I need to get my heart to

1125
00:51:43,400 --> 00:51:47,799
Speaker 6: stop beating. If your mind stops thinking, you're dead. Like

1126
00:51:47,960 --> 00:51:51,000
Speaker 6: the mind thinks, that's what it does. That's literally what

1127
00:51:51,040 --> 00:51:53,120
Speaker 6: it does. Like the heart beats, that's what it does,

1128
00:51:53,200 --> 00:51:53,960
Speaker 6: whether we like.

1129
00:51:53,920 --> 00:51:54,279
Speaker 5: It or not.

1130
00:51:54,880 --> 00:51:57,319
Speaker 6: And what we have to learn how to do when

1131
00:51:57,360 --> 00:52:00,560
Speaker 6: we're meditating or anything that bringes into this state. Is

1132
00:52:00,600 --> 00:52:02,680
Speaker 6: what we're really hoping for is to get our thoughts

1133
00:52:02,719 --> 00:52:05,800
Speaker 6: to work for us instead of against us. The reason

1134
00:52:05,840 --> 00:52:08,000
Speaker 6: why there's a struggle is not because you have too

1135
00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:10,160
Speaker 6: many thoughts. It's because you feel like your thoughts are

1136
00:52:10,160 --> 00:52:11,880
Speaker 6: pulling you out of the moment that you want to

1137
00:52:11,920 --> 00:52:16,440
Speaker 6: be in. And so Chelsea's invitation and Shelley's invitation are amazing,

1138
00:52:16,920 --> 00:52:19,200
Speaker 6: but I really want to invite you into this nuance

1139
00:52:19,320 --> 00:52:19,719
Speaker 6: to think.

1140
00:52:19,800 --> 00:52:21,160
Speaker 5: I'm hearing you talk.

1141
00:52:21,000 --> 00:52:26,000
Speaker 6: About your thoughts like a problem, and I want you

1142
00:52:26,320 --> 00:52:30,439
Speaker 6: first to reorient yourself to say that you and your

1143
00:52:30,600 --> 00:52:35,200
Speaker 6: mind is not a problem. That's actually the thing. You've

1144
00:52:35,239 --> 00:52:38,080
Speaker 6: got a diagnosis that sometimes when we get these now,

1145
00:52:38,120 --> 00:52:39,840
Speaker 6: we run this story in our head that says, my

1146
00:52:39,880 --> 00:52:41,640
Speaker 6: brain's a problem, and.

1147
00:52:41,600 --> 00:52:43,080
Speaker 5: If you have a problem, you're.

1148
00:52:42,920 --> 00:52:46,480
Speaker 6: Going to be fixing it right instead of going, how

1149
00:52:46,520 --> 00:52:48,520
Speaker 6: do I use this that I have to work in

1150
00:52:49,120 --> 00:52:51,640
Speaker 6: favor of me? So I just want to reorient your

1151
00:52:51,680 --> 00:52:53,959
Speaker 6: language around that a little bit and help you see

1152
00:52:53,960 --> 00:52:56,759
Speaker 6: that there's no problem happening here. What there is is

1153
00:52:56,800 --> 00:53:00,080
Speaker 6: a desire for you to be more present in your life.

1154
00:53:00,239 --> 00:53:02,120
Speaker 6: And this is what I think all of us are

1155
00:53:02,120 --> 00:53:02,960
Speaker 6: inviting you into.

1156
00:53:03,320 --> 00:53:05,760
Speaker 10: You know, no, because I used to use the ADHD

1157
00:53:05,800 --> 00:53:09,200
Speaker 10: as my superpower, like you can do so much stuff.

1158
00:53:09,600 --> 00:53:11,680
Speaker 10: But after I got sick, my mind just kind of

1159
00:53:11,719 --> 00:53:12,440
Speaker 10: became my enemy.

1160
00:53:12,760 --> 00:53:15,799
Speaker 4: Well, and I think too, because you've had you know,

1161
00:53:15,880 --> 00:53:18,960
Speaker 4: some traumatic brain events. You may need some time to

1162
00:53:19,040 --> 00:53:20,080
Speaker 4: heal with that. You know.

1163
00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:23,239
Speaker 10: That's that, and that is everyone kept saying, give it time,

1164
00:53:23,280 --> 00:53:25,640
Speaker 10: give it time. And we're I think ten months in

1165
00:53:25,719 --> 00:53:29,000
Speaker 10: now and only now I'm starting to feel a bit

1166
00:53:29,080 --> 00:53:32,160
Speaker 10: like myself again. Yeah, and that's and I am. And

1167
00:53:32,320 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 10: I have like a journal. I listened to your shit.

1168
00:53:34,160 --> 00:53:37,239
Speaker 10: I tried the twenty one days a habit forming thing.

1169
00:53:37,400 --> 00:53:38,719
Speaker 3: I did it. I'm still doing it.

1170
00:53:38,760 --> 00:53:40,440
Speaker 10: I bought a special journal for it, to do it

1171
00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:43,480
Speaker 10: in the morning and the evening. And I noticed that

1172
00:53:43,520 --> 00:53:44,680
Speaker 10: with certain things.

1173
00:53:44,400 --> 00:53:46,680
Speaker 3: I really really do try to be grateful.

1174
00:53:46,280 --> 00:53:48,200
Speaker 10: Like certain things that I couldn't be grateful a few

1175
00:53:48,200 --> 00:53:50,480
Speaker 10: months ago, that I'm like, I'm sleeping again, you know

1176
00:53:50,520 --> 00:53:51,000
Speaker 10: shit like that.

1177
00:53:51,800 --> 00:53:53,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, love, So I.

1178
00:53:53,560 --> 00:53:56,360
Speaker 10: Do try to, like I really am applying more of

1179
00:53:56,400 --> 00:53:58,880
Speaker 10: the present stuff. But it's difficult if your brain is

1180
00:53:59,600 --> 00:54:03,000
Speaker 10: natural friend at the moment and it kind of messes

1181
00:54:03,000 --> 00:54:03,640
Speaker 10: with the system.

1182
00:54:04,040 --> 00:54:06,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I like what Justin said. I think that's

1183
00:54:06,360 --> 00:54:09,279
Speaker 1: really nice that, like, listen, you're recovering. Your brain is

1184
00:54:09,320 --> 00:54:12,440
Speaker 1: your friend, not your enemy, regardless of how crazy your

1185
00:54:12,440 --> 00:54:15,440
Speaker 1: thoughts are, how frenetic it may seem, it's your friend,

1186
00:54:15,800 --> 00:54:18,360
Speaker 1: and you can make friends with your brain, you know.

1187
00:54:19,000 --> 00:54:22,040
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, that's true, Laura. And I'm really serious.

1188
00:54:22,080 --> 00:54:24,200
Speaker 6: I'm not I'm honest to God, not just sharing this

1189
00:54:24,280 --> 00:54:26,759
Speaker 6: with you to promote my book at all. I'm sharing

1190
00:54:26,760 --> 00:54:28,279
Speaker 6: with you because I actually really think it would help.

1191
00:54:28,320 --> 00:54:31,560
Speaker 6: Like I really am a person who's with you, Like

1192
00:54:31,840 --> 00:54:34,000
Speaker 6: my mind is going all the time, and I thought

1193
00:54:34,040 --> 00:54:37,719
Speaker 6: I was somebody who could never meditate. And so that's

1194
00:54:37,800 --> 00:54:40,280
Speaker 6: literally why why I decided to write this is because

1195
00:54:40,320 --> 00:54:43,680
Speaker 6: people write these meditation books thinking that you know, everybody

1196
00:54:43,680 --> 00:54:46,160
Speaker 6: can just sit and cross their legs, and you know,

1197
00:54:46,200 --> 00:54:47,959
Speaker 6: like Shelley was talking about it, and we all can't

1198
00:54:48,040 --> 00:54:50,000
Speaker 6: do that, and so we need a space that we

1199
00:54:50,040 --> 00:54:53,120
Speaker 6: can be able to drop into ourselves. So just anyway,

1200
00:54:53,200 --> 00:54:55,000
Speaker 6: just check out my book. I promise it will help you.

1201
00:54:55,040 --> 00:54:56,719
Speaker 6: It's like the biggest gift to me when I hear

1202
00:54:56,760 --> 00:54:57,360
Speaker 6: somebody going.

1203
00:54:57,200 --> 00:54:58,840
Speaker 3: Through that what was the title again.

1204
00:54:58,960 --> 00:55:01,919
Speaker 6: It's called Stay whe A Meditation Guide for the rest

1205
00:55:01,960 --> 00:55:04,839
Speaker 6: of Us. Okay, all right, I know woke means all

1206
00:55:04,920 --> 00:55:06,920
Speaker 6: kinds of bullshit. Now, it didn't mean that when I

1207
00:55:07,040 --> 00:55:09,120
Speaker 6: put the book out. But it's not about that. It's

1208
00:55:09,160 --> 00:55:12,279
Speaker 6: about you know, helping us. A meditation guide for the

1209
00:55:12,320 --> 00:55:15,160
Speaker 6: rest of us, you know. So, yeah, you got it,

1210
00:55:15,239 --> 00:55:15,640
Speaker 6: all right.

1211
00:55:15,800 --> 00:55:18,080
Speaker 3: My elderly mother likes to say she's woke. She thinks

1212
00:55:18,080 --> 00:55:20,600
Speaker 3: it's the thing that you have to say to everyone.

1213
00:55:20,600 --> 00:55:22,240
Speaker 5: Now, I'm woke, go mama.

1214
00:55:22,719 --> 00:55:24,839
Speaker 1: Well I feel like this was a very productive phone call.

1215
00:55:24,960 --> 00:55:27,080
Speaker 5: Yeah, I hope it was helpful.

1216
00:55:27,320 --> 00:55:29,560
Speaker 3: This is very cool. You need to come perform here.

1217
00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:32,040
Speaker 3: This is I live on an island called Puasa. It's

1218
00:55:32,040 --> 00:55:33,680
Speaker 3: next to Aruba.

1219
00:55:33,920 --> 00:55:35,800
Speaker 1: Well, i'll be there. I'll be there this weekend.

1220
00:55:36,239 --> 00:55:37,319
Speaker 3: And it's gorgeous.

1221
00:55:37,400 --> 00:55:39,360
Speaker 10: It's like everything you can think of a of a

1222
00:55:39,440 --> 00:55:40,400
Speaker 10: Caribbean paradise.

1223
00:55:40,880 --> 00:55:44,120
Speaker 1: Oh well, yeah, the Caribbean is pretty gorgeous. So you're lucky. Well,

1224
00:55:44,160 --> 00:55:47,319
Speaker 1: I'm glad for you have and heal. Keep healing and

1225
00:55:47,440 --> 00:55:49,600
Speaker 1: keep doing the work. You're gonna you're gonna get to

1226
00:55:49,640 --> 00:55:51,560
Speaker 1: a better place. You're coming out of it.

1227
00:55:52,320 --> 00:55:54,359
Speaker 3: Well, I mean I meant that I watched your show

1228
00:55:54,400 --> 00:55:55,280
Speaker 3: and that was the first.

1229
00:55:55,040 --> 00:55:58,480
Speaker 10: Time in three months that I left.

1230
00:55:59,280 --> 00:56:01,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was I laughed so hard. I watched it

1231
00:56:01,719 --> 00:56:03,640
Speaker 3: twice and I laughed again the second time.

1232
00:56:04,560 --> 00:56:05,240
Speaker 5: That's amazing.

1233
00:56:05,680 --> 00:56:09,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, all right, thanks Laura, thank you so much.

1234
00:56:10,200 --> 00:56:13,720
Speaker 1: Okay, bye Laura, all right, bye, Shelley.

1235
00:56:13,840 --> 00:56:15,560
Speaker 4: I loved what you said about like the short little

1236
00:56:15,560 --> 00:56:17,920
Speaker 4: snippets do because I do have ADHD and that has

1237
00:56:17,920 --> 00:56:20,160
Speaker 4: been something that's like helped me so much, is to

1238
00:56:20,200 --> 00:56:21,640
Speaker 4: just sprinkle them through the day.

1239
00:56:22,360 --> 00:56:23,239
Speaker 8: Yeah, it's big.

1240
00:56:23,600 --> 00:56:25,799
Speaker 4: Yeah, let's take a quick break and move back to

1241
00:56:25,880 --> 00:56:32,800
Speaker 4: wrap up with Justin and Shelley, and we're back.

1242
00:56:33,840 --> 00:56:37,640
Speaker 1: That's my baby voice.

1243
00:56:38,040 --> 00:56:39,720
Speaker 8: That's also your doggie boys.

1244
00:56:40,480 --> 00:56:43,719
Speaker 1: Oh, I haven't seen Bernice in so long. I can't

1245
00:56:43,760 --> 00:56:46,720
Speaker 1: wait to embrace her and have her reject to be I'm.

1246
00:56:46,600 --> 00:56:50,480
Speaker 5: Allergic to dogs. It's the worst. Oh yeah, I know it.

1247
00:56:50,600 --> 00:56:52,360
Speaker 5: I hate it because dogs are so cute.

1248
00:56:52,840 --> 00:56:55,040
Speaker 1: I'm in the market for some new dogs anyway, since

1249
00:56:55,040 --> 00:56:58,399
Speaker 1: Bert fucking died and Bernice is here or she's no

1250
00:56:58,480 --> 00:57:01,400
Speaker 1: that it was months ago. Don't worry, but I'm in

1251
00:57:01,440 --> 00:57:03,480
Speaker 1: the market and I'm ready to rumble. I just need

1252
00:57:03,520 --> 00:57:06,840
Speaker 1: a full house and that's operational. And then I'm just

1253
00:57:06,840 --> 00:57:08,920
Speaker 1: going to add to my brood. Who knows what's going

1254
00:57:08,960 --> 00:57:10,800
Speaker 1: to happen next in the dog world with me.

1255
00:57:11,239 --> 00:57:11,960
Speaker 8: A whole pack.

1256
00:57:12,239 --> 00:57:14,759
Speaker 1: I love it, and probably I see these videos on

1257
00:57:14,800 --> 00:57:17,160
Speaker 1: Instagram where people have like eight or nine chowls, and

1258
00:57:17,200 --> 00:57:19,080
Speaker 1: I'm like, that's what I want. I want to come

1259
00:57:19,120 --> 00:57:21,760
Speaker 1: home and have eight different colored chowls running towards me

1260
00:57:22,080 --> 00:57:23,560
Speaker 1: like a like a kibble commercial.

1261
00:57:23,680 --> 00:57:30,720
Speaker 7: Oh, like a moving carpet. Yes, yes, you'll be like

1262
00:57:30,760 --> 00:57:32,080
Speaker 7: the Queen of England, like.

1263
00:57:33,040 --> 00:57:35,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. I bet people always are confusing me with

1264
00:57:35,640 --> 00:57:39,320
Speaker 1: her anyway. I mean, well, especially since she died. Oh no,

1265
00:57:39,320 --> 00:57:39,960
Speaker 1: there's a new queen.

1266
00:57:40,000 --> 00:57:40,400
Speaker 2: I forgot.

1267
00:57:40,760 --> 00:57:43,680
Speaker 1: I thought they all died anyway. Thank you guys for

1268
00:57:43,720 --> 00:57:46,440
Speaker 1: being on the show. I appreciate both of your advice.

1269
00:57:46,480 --> 00:57:48,600
Speaker 1: It was but very great. Actually, you guys both gave

1270
00:57:48,640 --> 00:57:50,760
Speaker 1: great advice. And the book is called How We Ended

1271
00:57:50,840 --> 00:57:55,960
Speaker 1: Racism by Shelly Tagilski and Justin Michael Williams, and it's

1272
00:57:56,000 --> 00:57:58,840
Speaker 1: available now, so please go get a copy, and get

1273
00:57:59,040 --> 00:58:01,160
Speaker 1: several copies actually and hand them out to all the

1274
00:58:01,160 --> 00:58:02,160
Speaker 1: fucking nsholes you know.

1275
00:58:03,160 --> 00:58:06,320
Speaker 8: Amen, Amen, let's do this together.

1276
00:58:06,480 --> 00:58:10,760
Speaker 1: Amen. Thank you guys. Thank you for having la Yeah,

1277
00:58:10,800 --> 00:58:13,000
Speaker 1: my pleasure. Thank you for coming on. Appreciate it.

1278
00:58:13,360 --> 00:58:15,040
Speaker 8: Bye, Chelsea.

1279
00:58:15,120 --> 00:58:17,200
Speaker 4: Do you have some new dates for us?

1280
00:58:17,400 --> 00:58:17,640
Speaker 9: Oh?

1281
00:58:17,720 --> 00:58:18,400
Speaker 1: You know, I do?

1282
00:58:18,760 --> 00:58:19,040
Speaker 8: You know?

1283
00:58:19,160 --> 00:58:19,520
Speaker 10: I do?

1284
00:58:19,840 --> 00:58:24,560
Speaker 1: I have a lot of We added lots of Canadian cities, Canadians,

1285
00:58:24,680 --> 00:58:31,320
Speaker 1: I'm coming. We added about fifteen new tour dates. I'm

1286
00:58:31,360 --> 00:58:36,360
Speaker 1: coming to Denver again, Salt Lake City, Vancouver, Richmond, Virginia,

1287
00:58:36,520 --> 00:58:41,600
Speaker 1: Santa Rosa, California, Gary and Deana, Baltimore, Verona, New York,

1288
00:58:42,360 --> 00:58:46,760
Speaker 1: and about seven dates in Canada. So go to Chelseahandler

1289
00:58:46,800 --> 00:58:49,680
Speaker 1: dot com. I am performing everywhere. I will be on

1290
00:58:49,720 --> 00:58:52,880
Speaker 1: tour all for the rest of the year and through December,

1291
00:58:53,480 --> 00:58:55,640
Speaker 1: and then next year I'm going to be touring all year.

1292
00:58:56,440 --> 00:58:59,160
Speaker 1: So come and get it, you guys. It's good times

1293
00:58:59,160 --> 00:59:01,880
Speaker 1: and it's a very very much needed reprieve from all

1294
00:59:01,880 --> 00:59:05,360
Speaker 1: the fucking madness that's going on in this world. So

1295
00:59:05,560 --> 00:59:08,680
Speaker 1: I'm here to bring joy and sunshine. Do you have a.

1296
00:59:08,640 --> 00:59:11,880
Speaker 4: Holiday themed question for Chelsea? Please send us all the

1297
00:59:11,960 --> 00:59:16,560
Speaker 4: questions you need answered about crazy family get togethers, arguing

1298
00:59:16,560 --> 00:59:20,000
Speaker 4: over which cranberry sauce recipe to use, and all your

1299
00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:23,720
Speaker 4: holiday drama. Just send your questions to Dear Chelsea podcast

1300
00:59:23,840 --> 00:59:27,280
Speaker 4: at gmail dot com. Dear Chelsea is edited and engineered

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Speaker 4: by Brad dickerd executive producer Catherine law And be sure

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Speaker 4: to check out our merch at Chelseahandler dot com