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Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hey there and welcome back to the Book of Joe

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Speaker 2: Podcasts with me, Tom Berducci and Joe Madden. And yes,

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Speaker 2: it is World Series time, the one hundred and twenty

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Speaker 2: first World Series the Toronto Blue Jays against the Los

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Speaker 2: Angeles Dodgers. Joe, the simple question for you is Dodgers

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Speaker 2: heavily favored, give me a path, somehow, some way where

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Speaker 2: the Toronto Blue Jays can win four times in seven

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Speaker 2: games against the Dodgers.

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Speaker 3: I think the only chance is I thought about this

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Speaker 3: is there. They have to get more of their starting pitching.

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Speaker 3: I know that's like a real reach. If they want

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Speaker 3: to go into a bullpen war with the starters of

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Speaker 3: the Dodgers, they're just going to fall over pass out

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Speaker 3: because there's too many innings to cover and they won't

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Speaker 3: be able to cover all the dynamic versions of the Dodgers' lineup.

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Speaker 4: So it's really a pitching thing.

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Speaker 3: I believe for them to win offensively w pesky in

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Speaker 3: spite of the really good Dodgers' staff, I think they'll

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Speaker 3: still be able to move the ball in situations being

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Speaker 3: the Blue Jays are still going to pop a home

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Speaker 3: run now and then that's gonna happen. But overall, I

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Speaker 3: mean to just think you're going to go to that

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Speaker 3: pen and that pen gosh. I mean, it's got to

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Speaker 3: be somewhat exhausted right now. So I believe they have

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Speaker 3: to be especially early on in this thing as it

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Speaker 3: goes on. If you get down, of course, all bets

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Speaker 3: are off. You have to do whatever it takes to win,

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Speaker 3: et cetera. But my point is earlier in the series,

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Speaker 3: just see if Gosma could go deeper or Savage can

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Speaker 3: go more deeply into the game permitted to happen, and

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Speaker 3: try to maintain the integrity of your bullpen somewhat Otherwise

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Speaker 3: I got no chance at all.

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Speaker 2: I would agree with you. I think that's a great take, Joe.

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Speaker 2: I mean, you're up against, you know, one of the

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Speaker 2: great pitching staffs at least rotations. We've seen it a

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Speaker 2: long time in the modern game, which has become such

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Speaker 2: a bullpen game. This is a rare case where you're

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Speaker 2: looking at four aces and they're all healthy. Shoe a

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Speaker 2: Otani is the number four starter for the Los Angeles Dodgers.

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Speaker 2: Need I say more about their pitching depth I mean,

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Speaker 2: it's just crazy. They held Milwaukee to a one eighteen

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Speaker 2: batting average in the NLCS, and Milwaukee, like Toronto, is

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Speaker 2: a team that puts the ball in play. I have

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Speaker 2: a hard time seeing where four wins are coming from.

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Speaker 2: You're right, They're going to have to hang with the

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Speaker 2: Dodgers starters, There's no question about it, starting with Trey

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Speaker 2: you Savage, the pride of potsdown Pa in game one,

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Speaker 2: Kevin Gosman two and likely Shane Bieber three. Max Sures

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Speaker 2: are four. Listen. It's I like the way they play

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Speaker 2: offensive baseball, but again you're up against the swing and

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Speaker 2: miss staff. Here's the other thing, Joe, let's rewind to

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Speaker 2: the ALCS and Seattle. I thought was a really good

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Speaker 2: matchup for Toronto because the theme for Seattle pitchers and

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Speaker 2: this is up and down there. They call it DTZ

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Speaker 2: dominate the zone and they flood the zone with fastballs.

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Speaker 2: They throw more fastballs than any team. They get more

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Speaker 2: pitches ahead of the count than any other team that

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Speaker 2: played right into the wheelhouse of the Toronto Blue Jays.

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Speaker 2: It's a very aggressive swinging team, highest contact team in

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Speaker 2: Major League Baseball. They slugged over seven hundred on first

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Speaker 2: and second pitches of at bats. It wasn't as if

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Speaker 2: they beat Seattle with two strike hitting. I know they're

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Speaker 2: a good two strike hitting team. To me, you're not

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Speaker 2: beating anybody living on two strikes, you know, you're just

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Speaker 2: scratching out a hit here and there. Where they won

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Speaker 2: the series was swinging early in the count. And that's

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Speaker 2: especially with George Springer's home run and Andreas Semnez's home run.

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Speaker 2: But they did a time and time again, that's not

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Speaker 2: happening against the Dodgers. Joe in the ALCS, Seattle threw

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Speaker 2: sixty one percent fastballs the season average about fifty five percent.

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Speaker 2: The LA Dodgers beat Milwaukee throwing forty percent fastballs. Blue

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Speaker 2: Jays are just going to see a ton of of

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Speaker 2: spin and change ups from that from that staff in

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Speaker 2: l A. And to me, now, it's going to be

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Speaker 2: about play discipline more than being aggressive early in the count.

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Speaker 2: They're gonna still hunt fastballs early, They're just not going

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Speaker 2: to get them from the Dodgers.

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Speaker 3: Isn't it amazing that one hundred mile an hour fastballs

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Speaker 3: are not good enough?

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Speaker 4: You know, we have to revert to other things so often.

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Speaker 3: I've always had that discussion, and that was a big

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Speaker 3: thing coming up to the to the ranks, the number

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Speaker 3: one pitch would be the fastball, but not just the fastball,

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Speaker 3: the command of your fastball, throwing it where you want to,

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Speaker 3: getting ahead of counts, inducing early count outs. That was

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Speaker 3: a real secret to having your starters pitch more deeply

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Speaker 3: into a game.

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Speaker 4: And that you know.

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Speaker 3: I still love that concept, and obviously it had worked

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Speaker 3: for Seattle during the season. In a short series, maybe

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Speaker 3: not so much, and again I'd have to go back,

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Speaker 3: and of course your research is always great, but it's

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Speaker 3: it's about one thing about throwing a fastball right down

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Speaker 3: the middle or being able to spot it up a

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Speaker 3: little bit, and maybe, like I said, inducing the contact,

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Speaker 3: not so good in getting a weaker outs and preserving

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Speaker 3: pitches for later in the game. However, obviously the Blue

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Speaker 3: Jays knew that, and that's part of analytics in today's world,

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Speaker 3: where you can more confidently go into a series or

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Speaker 3: a game strategically and have more confidence that the information

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Speaker 3: you have is correct. We used to rely on an

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Speaker 3: advanced scout, and an advanced scout would sit behind the play

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Speaker 3: for a series prior to you playing the next team.

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Speaker 3: And they would just jot down what they perceived to

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Speaker 3: see and difficult, it's difficult to really sit there and

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Speaker 3: ascertain that they threw sixty percent fastballs unless you just

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Speaker 3: charted every pitch. You just knew they threw a lot

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Speaker 3: of fastballs, and that would be the response. But when

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Speaker 3: you get exact information, and that's part of the analytical

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Speaker 3: world that I do like a lot and relied upon heavily.

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Speaker 3: So when you get a bite like that, when you

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Speaker 3: get a nugget like that, you can't walk away from it.

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Speaker 3: So when the hitters go up to the play confidently

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Speaker 3: they're looking for one thing, and who knows, I mean,

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Speaker 3: they could even have broken it down to in or away.

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Speaker 3: So if you're looking fastball away, elevated away, whatever, away

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Speaker 3: or in, which probably is not the case most of

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Speaker 3: the time, it's middle away. At least you go in

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Speaker 3: there and you're gonna let it, You're gonna turn it loose,

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Speaker 3: you're gonna let it fly. And that's that's the analytical

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Speaker 3: world that does that should that's the part that should

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Speaker 3: get the credit that does matter when you break it

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Speaker 3: down like that, and you could give your guy a

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Speaker 3: nugget that he leans on and commits to and of

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Speaker 3: course here it comes. Wow, what a difference that makes

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Speaker 3: as a hitter. So yeah, the breaking ball as rule.

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Speaker 3: We've talked about this. When I was with the Cubbies,

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Speaker 3: we got beat up by breaking ball in the postseason.

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Speaker 3: A lot of our hitters just didn't didn't react well

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Speaker 3: to it. So I would think that the Dodgers are

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Speaker 3: gonna obviously do the same with the Blue Jays. Now

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Speaker 3: you're absolutely right with that, it's not a big secret.

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Speaker 3: Then it's up to the Blue Jays. How do you

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Speaker 3: do that? You stick, you know, tried and true strength.

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Speaker 4: What am I? How am I going to approach this?

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Speaker 4: Am I going to.

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Speaker 3: Start hunting breaking ball over fastball? Which is always a

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Speaker 3: tough thing to do. But I'm sure they've they have

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Speaker 3: their staff together. They're going to go into it and

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Speaker 3: have this game plan derived from information most recently. But

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Speaker 3: then again, you have to remain flexible because teams.

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Speaker 4: Do it just well.

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Speaker 2: It sounds like, you know, to me, the Dodgers have

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Speaker 2: the breaking stuff, the secondary stuff to really stick with

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Speaker 2: that plan. I mean, you think about Blake Snell on

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Speaker 2: the postseason. He's throwing more changeups than he ever has

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Speaker 2: in his career. It's it's a beauty and he varies

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Speaker 2: the speed on that pitch from seventy nine to eighty nine.

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Speaker 2: He just has a terrific command of that. Right now,

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Speaker 2: we know about his curveball. I mean it's one of

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Speaker 2: the best in the business. He has not given up

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Speaker 2: a hit on his curveball this postseason. You've got Yamamoto

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Speaker 2: with the splitter and the slow breaking ball. You know,

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Speaker 2: show Hey with the splitter and the sweeper glass. Now

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Speaker 2: the big overhand curveball that's starting for Joe for the

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Speaker 2: Dodgers has given up one home run on a curveball

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Speaker 2: the entire season. I mean, they're going to have to

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Speaker 2: hit some off speed stuff at some point in this series.

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Speaker 2: You're talking about the Toronto Blue Jays, and I think

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Speaker 2: you're right. I think they did attack fastballs away early

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Speaker 2: in the series from Seattle. The only adjustment I saw

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Speaker 2: from Seattle. Then they went in on Vlad Guerrero later

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Speaker 2: in the series. He still got his hits, but I

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Speaker 2: didn't think they zagged enough. After digging throughout the first

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Speaker 2: part of that series, the Dodgers are just gonna see

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Speaker 2: different looks. So Joe, it sounds to me, like, you're

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Speaker 2: probably right about this. The pressure point for the managers

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Speaker 2: in this series is when they go get their starting pitcher.

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Speaker 2: And you could say that typical in a postseason environment, right,

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Speaker 2: but I think especially for John Schneider as well, what's

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Speaker 2: your take on that when he's got you know, let's

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Speaker 2: face it, you savage out there in game one his

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Speaker 2: first game this year, Joe was in Jupiter, Florida against

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Speaker 2: the Hammerheads in front of three hundred and twenty these

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Speaker 2: seven people. Now he's starting game one of the World Series.

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Speaker 2: You've seen him. How much rope you given him?

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Speaker 3: I've given him rope, I mean, especially in the first game.

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Speaker 3: I would I don't want to start blowing it up.

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Speaker 3: Now they get what two.

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Speaker 4: Days day off, three days day off? Is that all

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Speaker 4: this is gonna work?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so that there's a there is time for relief

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Speaker 3: pictures to regroup in a shorts in these these playoff series. However,

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Speaker 3: I'm just watching the body of work that they've gone through,

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Speaker 3: and uh, listen, these guys are all going to be

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Speaker 3: all hands on deck. They're gonna adrenaline's gonna flow, they're

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Speaker 3: gonna feel good, et cetera. But when you throw too much,

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Speaker 3: and there is some sort of fatigue sitting, and that's

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Speaker 3: where command kind of evade you. You might not still be

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Speaker 3: able to throw the ball hard, but not throw it

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Speaker 3: hard or well exactly where you want to throw it.

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Speaker 3: So again, like I said, with with the Savage and

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Speaker 3: glasnow especially not so much Bieber and Shures, I would

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Speaker 3: be a little bit more patient in these first two games.

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Speaker 4: I would.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, let's talk about the Dodgers, because you've seen enough

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Speaker 2: of Dodger baseball in the postseason that they love to

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Speaker 2: get their starters out after the eighteenth batter, right as

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Speaker 2: the lineup turns are over a third time. It's a

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Speaker 2: different way of running a game. Now for Dave Roberts

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Speaker 2: to me, the magic number now is twenty two. Giving

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Speaker 2: your starter the top of the lineup a third time.

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Speaker 2: They are doing They've done that this year nine times.

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Speaker 2: Joe in the postseason had ten games. They're nine to

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Speaker 2: zero in those games when the starter pitches to at

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Speaker 2: least twenty two batters. Now, Dodger starters had done that

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Speaker 2: only nine times in the past four seasons postseasons combined.

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Speaker 2: Dave is not quick on the hook. Now, he trust

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Speaker 2: these guys Blake Snell famously taking out twenty twenty game

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Speaker 2: six World Series by Kevin Cash with the one hit

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Speaker 2: shutout in the works. That ain't happening. I think he's

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Speaker 2: gonna ride these starters because they do have the stuff

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Speaker 2: and they are fresh to pitch a third time through

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Speaker 2: the lineup exactly.

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Speaker 4: That's it.

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Speaker 3: That's that's where the advantage really lies. They're good, they

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Speaker 3: got You're talking earlier about their usage of these other pitches,

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Speaker 3: whether it's a split curve, change up, there's still power pitches.

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Speaker 3: You know, you talk about Glasnow's curveball. My god, nobody

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Speaker 3: wants to swing at that. You look, talk about snalls break.

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Speaker 3: Nobody wants to swing at that. It's hard to square

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Speaker 3: that up. I mean, if you hit it, you're normally

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Speaker 3: gonna you know, you could hit it somewhat well, but

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Speaker 3: you're not going to just smoke it, like if you

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Speaker 3: just square up one of their fastballs. And that's part

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Speaker 3: of it. It's going to be a weaker contact. And

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Speaker 3: when there's weak contact, your defense gets bigger. That's always

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Speaker 3: been my thing. When you're with Kyle Hendrick, Kyle and

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Speaker 3: do such terribly weak contact all year, our defense got

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Speaker 3: huge meaning if the ball's not struck harder put in

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Speaker 3: the play hard, your defense plays bigger because they have

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Speaker 3: more they creates more range by the ball being hit

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Speaker 3: more softly. And that's what happens on these breaking balls.

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Speaker 3: With these Dodger pitchers, they're able to do that. You Savage,

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Speaker 3: same thing, I mean with his stuff and his splitter,

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Speaker 3: and I think the unique delivery and the same with Glassnow,

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Speaker 3: these are the two guys they have that I think

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Speaker 3: the best opportunity to produce less than strong contact versus

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Speaker 3: the Dodgers, whereas I think Bieber and sure, you've got

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Speaker 3: to be more careful with So, yeah, the Dodgers have

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Speaker 3: a distinct advantage. And beyond that, just what you just said,

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Speaker 3: their bullpen is way more rested. Obviously, Now you could

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Speaker 3: argue how much they love their bullpen, but overall, they

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Speaker 3: did a pretty nice job in the last series and

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Speaker 3: now they're, gosh, they're going into this thing like they're

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Speaker 3: almost breaking spring training.

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Speaker 4: They're in that good as shape.

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Speaker 3: So every arrow points in the direction of the Dodgers, obviously,

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Speaker 3: but this is a game, this is baseball, and it

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Speaker 3: doesn't always work out that way. However, it's hard to

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Speaker 3: run away from the distinct advantage they have with their

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Speaker 3: starting pitching going to this World Series.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm glad you brought up the defense because I

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Speaker 2: think that's one area Toronto actually does have the edge.

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Speaker 2: I mean, of the Dodger playoff teams I've seen in

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Speaker 2: the last decade, this is one of the lesser defensive

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Speaker 2: groups that I've seen out of them. They're good, don't

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Speaker 2: get me wrong, but this is a team that Annerley

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Speaker 2: has finished first or second and defensive efficiency, you know,

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Speaker 2: turning bat balls into outs. Part of that is because

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Speaker 2: their pitching does, as you said, induce weak contact. They're

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Speaker 2: not as good in that regard, and I like the

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Speaker 2: way that Toronto plays defense, so they have an edge there.

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Speaker 2: At Toronto, I think is an edge on running the bases,

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Speaker 2: they have an edge on making contact. I'm not sure

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Speaker 2: those little things are enough again to win four times.

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Speaker 2: Would you agree, Joe, that the Toronto Blue Jays must

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Speaker 2: win one of the first two games at home. Now,

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Speaker 2: the last round against Seattle, they lost the first two

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Speaker 2: at home and won the series. That's not easily done.

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Speaker 2: It's a different team, and you've got Savage with the

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Speaker 2: uniqueness of the way that he throws and Gosman your

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Speaker 2: ace in these first two games. I don't think that

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Speaker 2: Toronto Blue Jays can survive going to the Los Angeles

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Speaker 2: down two games to none.

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Speaker 3: I've already said that to one way golf partners. That

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Speaker 3: can't happen if they start out into it is. Basically,

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Speaker 3: I can't say any conceivable way they could come back

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Speaker 3: from that. Talking about the Blue Jays defense, all of

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Speaker 3: a sudden, I'm reading about Bobashett being possibly well again.

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Speaker 3: I can't see any way that would put him back

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Speaker 3: at shortstop. Has that been part of the discussion.

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Speaker 2: No, they actually this is interesting. They actually had him

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Speaker 2: taking ground balls at second base. Now, he has never

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Speaker 2: played second base in the major leagues. I'm not sure

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Speaker 2: if he's done so in the minor leagues as well,

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Speaker 2: but he took the ground balls. Obviously he doesn't have

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Speaker 2: the range to play shortstop. Jimenez is going to play shortstop.

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Speaker 2: The question is would you put him at second base,

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Speaker 2: a position he hasn't played before with a bad knee. Now, listen,

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Speaker 2: he's gonna have to play in Game one because you

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Speaker 2: got Blake Snell on the mount. They're gonna have run eight, right,

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Speaker 2: handed hitters out there at Jmenez. The question is, is

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Speaker 2: George Springer well enough to play the outfield so that

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Speaker 2: set can DH I'm really curious to see what the

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Speaker 2: alignment is Game one for Toronto.

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Speaker 3: I would bet yes. I would bet Springer does that.

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Speaker 3: I just watched them run out to the field after

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Speaker 3: they won. He was so excited. I would bet with

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Speaker 3: the way the training staffs are able to operate now,

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Speaker 3: how quickly with all the modalities they they can get

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Speaker 3: it back out there.

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Speaker 4: I'm betting that will occur.

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Speaker 3: Regarding Bashette playing second base, if in fact you wanted

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Speaker 3: to do that. I don't know the propensities of the

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Speaker 3: starting pitching of the Blue Jays, but and I know

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Speaker 3: this is available as flyball pitcher versus a ground ball pitcher.

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Speaker 3: If any of these starters are flyball starters, definitely you

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Speaker 3: could consider that. And even when I was with the Cubbies,

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Speaker 3: we had a chart that was I really liked a lot.

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Speaker 3: It helped me when I wanted to put Hobby at

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Speaker 3: third base or not where's the ground ball is going

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Speaker 3: to be hit? It was actually see that that's this

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Speaker 3: is the part of analytics. Nobody talks about regarding setting

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Speaker 3: up a defense, if in fact you have different versions

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Speaker 3: of your defense that you could have went out there,

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Speaker 3: but we had like Jake Arietta, the ground ball was

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Speaker 3: never hit the third base.

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Speaker 4: It was weird.

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Speaker 3: It was like nobody hit ground balls at the third

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Speaker 3: base when Jake pitched. Okay, So you could put less

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Speaker 3: emphasis on the third base defense on that particular day

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Speaker 3: if you chose to. So I liked that kind of stuff.

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Speaker 3: And so flyball pitcher Bashett go ahead plumbing second base

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Speaker 3: at least maybe for his first three at bats. And

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Speaker 3: if you grab a lead, then you get him out

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Speaker 3: and you put your stronger defense in. If you're behind,

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Speaker 3: then you just have to ride it and stay with

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Speaker 3: his offense until you know whatever happens. So these are

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Speaker 3: the kind of discussions I would have under these circumstances.

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Speaker 3: Identify you, you know who your pictures are, you know

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Speaker 3: you already know this stuff, and then you try to

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Speaker 3: place him accordingly. And then if you could just make

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Speaker 3: him somewhat solve it out there, if you believe he is,

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Speaker 3: if he's if he can't protect himself, don't do it.

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Speaker 3: Second base very difficult, however, in today's game rules and regulations.

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Speaker 3: Playing second isn't as dangerous as it had been, so

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Speaker 3: that has to be a part of the consideration too.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Y Savage is a more of a fly ball pitcher,

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Speaker 2: of course. Then he goes out the last game and

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Speaker 2: gets three round ball double plays. So the game will

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Speaker 2: find you. You know that either way they're gonna have

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Speaker 2: to put a compromised Springer in the outfield or compromise

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Speaker 2: Bashette at second base. Lesser are of those two evils

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Speaker 2: for me is Springer in the outfield and d H Ship.

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Speaker 2: We'll see what happens there. Hey, we also have to

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Speaker 2: talk about show hey Otani back in Toronto for the

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Speaker 2: team he spurned when he was a free agent. Get

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Speaker 2: ready for the booze, folks. We'll talk about the unicorn

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Speaker 2: right after this on the Book of Joe. Welcome back

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Speaker 2: to the Book of Joe. Joe Sho hey Otani is amazing.

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Speaker 2: We know that. But one of the most amazing things

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Speaker 2: is that he keeps surprising us in ways that he

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Speaker 2: amazes us. Right, Like we're used to people breaking records,

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Speaker 2: you know, cal Ralely the home run record for catchers,

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Speaker 2: for switch hitters, it's a game of leap frog where

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Speaker 2: you go a little bit farther beyond somebody else. Shoe

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Speaker 2: Otani keeps planting flags in unchartered land, like he's doing

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Speaker 2: things we never even thought were possible, never mind going

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Speaker 2: beyond what was possible. Of course, I'm talking about his

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Speaker 2: game in NLCS Game four, where he hit three home runs,

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Speaker 2: including one out of Dodger Stadium, and was the winning pitcher,

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Speaker 2: throwing shutout ball with ten strikeouts. I call him the

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Speaker 2: ultimate slice of e ven diagram. There have been more

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Speaker 2: than seven hundred three homer games in baseball history, there

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Speaker 2: have been ten ten strikeout games in baseball history. That

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Speaker 2: is the only one in which a player did both

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Speaker 2: three home runs and ten strikeouts. I keep saying, what

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Speaker 2: could he do next to Amazis? And he, somehow Joe

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Speaker 2: keeps finding answers. So this is his first World Series

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Speaker 2: being a two way player and by the way, being

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Speaker 2: fully healthy. Remember he basically blew out his shoulder last

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Speaker 2: year early in the World Series and played with one arm.

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Speaker 2: So we're seeing show Hey at his absolute world class

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Speaker 2: best now as a two way player in the World

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Speaker 2: Series for the first time. I hesitate to even ask this, Joe,

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Speaker 2: but what are we about to see.

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Speaker 3: Well, how did Larry Bird react to people booing him

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Speaker 3: under the foreign courts during an away game?

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Speaker 4: That will just serve to motivate him.

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Speaker 3: If in fact they are lining up and they bow him,

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Speaker 3: are you going to see that show? Hey smirk As

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Speaker 3: he's standing out there, he'll probably bout to the crowd

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Speaker 3: very respectfully, and then he'll just destroy them.

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Speaker 4: His confidence is going to be higher. Probably.

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Speaker 3: You started the series out, the last one against Milwaukee

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Speaker 3: struggling horribly at the plate, pulling off everything. Finally takes

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Speaker 3: VP on the field and kind of like I guess

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Speaker 3: figure things out based on the performance posts that so

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Speaker 3: we'll know early on.

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Speaker 4: Yes, savage over the top.

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Speaker 3: If he tries to ride that high fastball, that could

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Speaker 3: be absolutely destroyed. So yeah, I just think right now

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Speaker 3: to say the Choi's confidence is high?

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Speaker 4: When is it not? But this is like it.

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Speaker 3: Should be soaring right now, and go ahead and feel

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Speaker 3: him a little bit more and see what happens. But

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Speaker 3: we've talked about this several times before. None of this

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Speaker 3: surprises me. I watched it firsthand, spoke with him and

401
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Speaker 3: Epay a lot, and things don't face the Scott. He

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Speaker 3: he is the beatles, he's elbows, he's all those things,

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Speaker 3: and he handles it so well in such a real

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Speaker 3: calm and efficient, motivated way. It's like, can anybody be

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Speaker 3: more energized well looking so calm as he is.

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Speaker 4: He's just different, that's it. It's just different.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And just to fill people in the story, he

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Speaker 2: was a free agent of course, the winter of twenty

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Speaker 2: three twenty four. In December of twenty three, he takes

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Speaker 2: a trip to Dunedin, Florida, to the Blue Jays spring

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Speaker 2: training facility. They're trying to recruit him, get him to

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Speaker 2: sign there as a free agent, and he went with

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Speaker 2: Epay Mizujara, his interpreter, and Nes Bilello his agent, and Decoy,

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Speaker 2: his dog. The Blue Jays have an amazing spring training facility.

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Speaker 2: It might be number one in the business, renovated a

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Speaker 2: few years ago at quite a cost, so they were

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Speaker 2: proud to show that off. He shows up, walks into

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Speaker 2: the room and they have three lockers all festooned with

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Speaker 2: Blue Jays swag for both ipe Bolello and for show Hay,

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Speaker 2: and they give the dog Decoy a Blue Jays Canada

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Speaker 2: goose jacket dog jacket to wear. I mean it is

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Speaker 2: the whole nine yards. They even filled the locker with

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Speaker 2: the best Hugo Boss outfits, which is Sho Hay's favorite designer.

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Speaker 2: The meeting went really well. I mean the Blue Jays

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Speaker 2: left the meeting thinking we have a real shot at

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Speaker 2: signing this guy. They made an offer which turned out

427
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Speaker 2: to be almost identical to the one he signed with

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Speaker 2: the Dodgers for of course he did go to Los Angeles.

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Speaker 2: We thought that all along, but the Blue Jays were

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Speaker 2: left at the altar after thinking we had a shot

431
00:21:47,798 --> 00:21:50,838
Speaker 2: at signing him. And of course, a month into the

432
00:21:50,878 --> 00:21:55,758
Speaker 2: season April twenty four, show Hay the Dodgers play in Toronto.

433
00:21:56,318 --> 00:22:00,358
Speaker 2: First at bat, he gets loudly booed and on the

434
00:22:00,358 --> 00:22:02,798
Speaker 2: third pitch that he sees, he hits a home run.

435
00:22:04,158 --> 00:22:07,638
Speaker 2: That is sho hey Otani. And it's funny, Joe that

436
00:22:08,278 --> 00:22:10,318
Speaker 2: John Schneider, the manager was there. Of course, the whole

437
00:22:10,318 --> 00:22:12,798
Speaker 2: front office was there at the wine and Dine in

438
00:22:12,878 --> 00:22:17,918
Speaker 2: spring training, and when Schneider saw him before that game

439
00:22:17,958 --> 00:22:21,118
Speaker 2: in twenty four, he joked with him behind the plate, hey,

440
00:22:21,158 --> 00:22:26,358
Speaker 2: we want our hat back. And actually Schnider brought up

441
00:22:26,358 --> 00:22:29,678
Speaker 2: again Thursday in the press conference before the World series. Yeah,

442
00:22:29,918 --> 00:22:31,998
Speaker 2: we want our hat back and show he said, I

443
00:22:31,998 --> 00:22:34,758
Speaker 2: still have it. It's in my garage. It'll be a

444
00:22:34,798 --> 00:22:37,158
Speaker 2: talking point through this series. I think all along we

445
00:22:37,198 --> 00:22:39,918
Speaker 2: thought Shohey would be signed, sealed and delivered with the Dodgers,

446
00:22:39,958 --> 00:22:41,718
Speaker 2: just the way it turned out. But I'm telling you,

447
00:22:41,758 --> 00:22:44,678
Speaker 2: these Blue Jay fans, they'll be creative. They'll welcome him back.

448
00:22:44,958 --> 00:22:47,998
Speaker 2: And I agree with you, Joe, if it's possible for

449
00:22:48,038 --> 00:22:49,878
Speaker 2: show Hey to be any more motivated to be the

450
00:22:49,878 --> 00:22:51,798
Speaker 2: best player in the world, they're gonna give him a

451
00:22:51,838 --> 00:22:52,278
Speaker 2: little more.

452
00:22:52,638 --> 00:22:53,158
Speaker 4: Absolutely.

453
00:22:53,158 --> 00:22:55,238
Speaker 3: I mean the team that he kind of rejected, like

454
00:22:55,278 --> 00:22:57,678
Speaker 3: you said, left at the altar. I thought it would

455
00:22:57,678 --> 00:23:00,718
Speaker 3: be kind of interesting, you know, for the just for Canada,

456
00:23:00,838 --> 00:23:03,678
Speaker 3: not just beyond Toronto, that if he had signed there

457
00:23:04,078 --> 00:23:06,878
Speaker 3: the fact, how that would really energize the game even

458
00:23:06,918 --> 00:23:09,638
Speaker 3: more in the in that country. They've had such a

459
00:23:09,638 --> 00:23:12,278
Speaker 3: great history with Montreal in the past, and of course

460
00:23:13,358 --> 00:23:16,918
Speaker 3: the Blue Jays now, and I participated with the Edmonton

461
00:23:16,958 --> 00:23:19,798
Speaker 3: Trappers when I was at the Angels as a roving instructor,

462
00:23:19,838 --> 00:23:24,358
Speaker 3: and the Vancouver also Vancouver, British Columbia beautiful and I

463
00:23:24,518 --> 00:23:27,438
Speaker 3: really always enjoyed the Canadian baseball fan. I mean, there's

464
00:23:27,598 --> 00:23:29,918
Speaker 3: a lot going on there. They're they're very passionate about

465
00:23:29,958 --> 00:23:32,278
Speaker 3: their their their teams, and uh and the and the

466
00:23:32,358 --> 00:23:36,238
Speaker 3: cities themselves are fantastic. So I thought that would have

467
00:23:36,238 --> 00:23:39,078
Speaker 3: been an interesting take. However, like you're talking about, it

468
00:23:39,158 --> 00:23:41,838
Speaker 3: just seemed to be no way that Hollywood would not

469
00:23:42,438 --> 00:23:45,438
Speaker 3: land show Hay, and they did, of course, had.

470
00:23:45,318 --> 00:23:46,998
Speaker 4: He not, had they not, I mean, I don't know.

471
00:23:47,038 --> 00:23:48,998
Speaker 3: I mean, the Dodgers' success the last couple of years

472
00:23:48,998 --> 00:23:51,798
Speaker 3: has been quite amazing. I can't tell you for sure

473
00:23:51,838 --> 00:23:55,598
Speaker 3: they would be this amazing had show Ay not signed there.

474
00:23:55,638 --> 00:23:57,038
Speaker 3: They got a nice team, there's a lot of good

475
00:23:57,038 --> 00:23:59,318
Speaker 3: stuff going on. We're talking about their starting pitching, but

476
00:23:59,678 --> 00:24:03,478
Speaker 3: the dynamic component of show Hay being subtracted from that,

477
00:24:04,038 --> 00:24:05,998
Speaker 3: it would look differently. And so you look at the

478
00:24:06,038 --> 00:24:10,078
Speaker 3: contract he signed, pretty elaborate and pretty heavy, but something

479
00:24:10,118 --> 00:24:12,118
Speaker 3: that he kind of designed, meaning that he wanted to

480
00:24:12,118 --> 00:24:14,998
Speaker 3: be there. That would be a nice version of It's

481
00:24:14,998 --> 00:24:18,198
Speaker 3: a wonderful life. Let's go back to Potterville and see

482
00:24:18,198 --> 00:24:21,158
Speaker 3: what it would look like if George didn't really exist,

483
00:24:21,358 --> 00:24:24,278
Speaker 3: and if Showy never really existed in Los Angeles, all

484
00:24:24,278 --> 00:24:26,678
Speaker 3: this wonderful stuff good, but I can't tell you for

485
00:24:26,718 --> 00:24:28,638
Speaker 3: sure that they'd be in the same position without him.

486
00:24:28,998 --> 00:24:31,278
Speaker 2: I agree, he's at the heart of it, there's no question.

487
00:24:31,678 --> 00:24:34,038
Speaker 2: And in talking to Dave Roberts yesterday, you know there

488
00:24:34,038 --> 00:24:36,678
Speaker 2: have been times this postseason where he's hit Will Smith third,

489
00:24:37,118 --> 00:24:38,798
Speaker 2: But he said he's going to buy his three big

490
00:24:38,838 --> 00:24:40,798
Speaker 2: boys right at the top of the lineup, show Hey,

491
00:24:40,878 --> 00:24:44,198
Speaker 2: Mooky Betts, and Freddie Freeman. It's a no brainer for me.

492
00:24:44,318 --> 00:24:46,558
Speaker 2: I love it that way. The game is going to

493
00:24:46,638 --> 00:24:50,278
Speaker 2: funnel to Mooky Betts. I just think they don't have

494
00:24:50,318 --> 00:24:53,118
Speaker 2: this stuff to attack. Show Hey right now. It's an

495
00:24:53,158 --> 00:24:56,918
Speaker 2: all right handed starting rotation with the Blue Jays Bets

496
00:24:56,958 --> 00:24:59,638
Speaker 2: a swinging the bat really well right now. So the

497
00:24:59,678 --> 00:25:02,998
Speaker 2: Dodgers are perfectly fine with that. But I, Joe, I

498
00:25:02,998 --> 00:25:05,198
Speaker 2: have a hard time seeing that show Hey is going

499
00:25:05,278 --> 00:25:07,558
Speaker 2: to get anything to hit. I think he's especially going

500
00:25:07,598 --> 00:25:10,638
Speaker 2: to see a ton of splitters. You know, show Hey,

501
00:25:10,918 --> 00:25:15,478
Speaker 2: a fastballs up he absolutely destroys. If you dot the

502
00:25:15,518 --> 00:25:18,238
Speaker 2: bottom rail of the strike zone. I'm talking about the

503
00:25:18,358 --> 00:25:21,878
Speaker 2: lower quarter of the strike zone, so it's essentially two

504
00:25:21,878 --> 00:25:23,878
Speaker 2: feet off the ground. Oh Hey, is a one to

505
00:25:23,958 --> 00:25:26,958
Speaker 2: seventy five hitter. You get it up above that and

506
00:25:26,998 --> 00:25:30,838
Speaker 2: these slugs over seven hundred. So if I'm Toronto, the

507
00:25:30,878 --> 00:25:34,998
Speaker 2: game plan to me has got to be change up sliders,

508
00:25:35,238 --> 00:25:39,118
Speaker 2: splitters down, down, down, and don't try to surprise him

509
00:25:39,118 --> 00:25:39,918
Speaker 2: with a fastball up.

510
00:25:40,358 --> 00:25:41,078
Speaker 4: Well, that's the thing.

511
00:25:41,158 --> 00:25:44,318
Speaker 3: It's like the old Vladimir Gurero days worked with Laddie

512
00:25:44,798 --> 00:25:47,798
Speaker 3: Senior and then worked against him. And I would tell

513
00:25:47,838 --> 00:25:51,598
Speaker 3: my pitching coach and the pitchers, don't ever think he's

514
00:25:51,598 --> 00:25:54,918
Speaker 3: set up for anything. Don't ever think that. Don't ever.

515
00:25:55,118 --> 00:25:57,198
Speaker 3: Don't you think that you got him set up. You're

516
00:25:57,198 --> 00:26:00,758
Speaker 3: gonna sneak something by him. You've shown this, this and this,

517
00:26:01,518 --> 00:26:03,038
Speaker 3: and all of a sudden he set up for breaking

518
00:26:03,078 --> 00:26:05,598
Speaker 3: ball down in a win that dirt or an elevated fact.

519
00:26:05,598 --> 00:26:07,558
Speaker 3: Don't think he set up. Just get rid of that,

520
00:26:07,998 --> 00:26:10,798
Speaker 3: so would show Hey. My thought would be this, we

521
00:26:10,838 --> 00:26:13,478
Speaker 3: don't care if you walk them. You just keep making

522
00:26:13,558 --> 00:26:16,318
Speaker 3: your pitch. Whatever we perceive to be the right way

523
00:26:16,358 --> 00:26:18,918
Speaker 3: to attack him. You just continually make this pitch. And

524
00:26:18,918 --> 00:26:22,278
Speaker 3: that leads into your comment about Bets being very popular

525
00:26:22,318 --> 00:26:24,918
Speaker 3: in this series for the Dodgers, and I think he

526
00:26:24,958 --> 00:26:28,118
Speaker 3: can handle it actually, So that's it. I mean, you don't.

527
00:26:28,598 --> 00:26:32,358
Speaker 3: Don't think that you can when a guy's that good.

528
00:26:32,438 --> 00:26:35,118
Speaker 3: It's like when we Barry Bonds in the two thousand

529
00:26:35,158 --> 00:26:38,318
Speaker 3: and two World Series. We go into that and you know,

530
00:26:38,318 --> 00:26:40,358
Speaker 3: we didn't play them all that year, and we go

531
00:26:40,358 --> 00:26:42,678
Speaker 3: into that thing. Well, he hasn't seen our pitching yet,

532
00:26:42,718 --> 00:26:45,798
Speaker 3: he hasn't seen us yet, and the first pitch from

533
00:26:45,878 --> 00:26:50,078
Speaker 3: Jared Washburn is still going and we immediately, we immediately

534
00:26:51,398 --> 00:26:53,078
Speaker 3: changed course right there.

535
00:26:53,118 --> 00:26:54,478
Speaker 4: We did to our credit.

536
00:26:54,878 --> 00:26:59,158
Speaker 3: So guys like this, in situations like this, you just

537
00:26:59,278 --> 00:27:01,598
Speaker 3: have to keep your ego in the back pocket, realize

538
00:27:01,598 --> 00:27:04,638
Speaker 3: how good they are, and then develop your plan and accordingly.

539
00:27:04,718 --> 00:27:08,998
Speaker 3: So instead of saying don't do this or don't do that,

540
00:27:09,038 --> 00:27:12,358
Speaker 3: because that's the negative approach, listen, just attack to the

541
00:27:12,398 --> 00:27:15,798
Speaker 3: point where if he eventually does walk, it's okay. Keep

542
00:27:15,958 --> 00:27:18,518
Speaker 3: attempting to make the pitch that you want to and

543
00:27:18,598 --> 00:27:20,638
Speaker 3: don't ever think you have him set up for something else.

544
00:27:21,078 --> 00:27:22,558
Speaker 2: All right, let me flip it to you on the

545
00:27:22,558 --> 00:27:25,678
Speaker 2: other side, then on Vlad Gerrero Jr. As hot as

546
00:27:25,678 --> 00:27:28,598
Speaker 2: he is and he doesn't have Mooki Betts and Freddie

547
00:27:28,598 --> 00:27:33,078
Speaker 2: Freeman behind him. If you're the La Dodgers, do you

548
00:27:33,358 --> 00:27:36,678
Speaker 2: take your old Bryce Harper treatment and try to take

549
00:27:36,758 --> 00:27:39,038
Speaker 2: him off the board and frustrate him by just feeding

550
00:27:39,078 --> 00:27:40,998
Speaker 2: him pitches out of his own How do you pitch

551
00:27:41,118 --> 00:27:42,798
Speaker 2: lad if you're the Dodgers, yeah.

552
00:27:42,678 --> 00:27:46,358
Speaker 3: I mean they're the pitching there with Snow and the boys.

553
00:27:46,358 --> 00:27:48,398
Speaker 3: I would just I would attack him this first game.

554
00:27:48,558 --> 00:27:50,798
Speaker 3: I wouldn't just run away from it, because if you

555
00:27:50,798 --> 00:27:54,558
Speaker 3: could actually, in this first game, especially have your way

556
00:27:54,598 --> 00:27:57,238
Speaker 3: with him and get him off his game a little

557
00:27:57,238 --> 00:27:59,078
Speaker 3: bit or create some doubt in his mind, that might

558
00:27:59,078 --> 00:28:01,598
Speaker 3: benefit you the rest of the series. You know, I

559
00:28:01,638 --> 00:28:03,198
Speaker 3: know he's got a nice series, and I know what

560
00:28:03,238 --> 00:28:04,198
Speaker 3: he's doing at it.

561
00:28:04,238 --> 00:28:04,638
Speaker 4: I get it.

562
00:28:04,718 --> 00:28:07,758
Speaker 3: But he will accept his walks too, So that's another thing.

563
00:28:08,278 --> 00:28:10,838
Speaker 3: Keep it's almost like the show. I think, keep making

564
00:28:10,878 --> 00:28:13,238
Speaker 3: your pitch, but let's go and see if we could

565
00:28:13,278 --> 00:28:14,918
Speaker 3: get him to chase a little bit, get him out

566
00:28:14,918 --> 00:28:17,118
Speaker 3: of his game plan a little bit, create a little

567
00:28:17,118 --> 00:28:18,718
Speaker 3: bit of doubt in his mind, because if they do that,

568
00:28:18,758 --> 00:28:21,998
Speaker 3: then there's really probably zero chance for the Blue Jays

569
00:28:21,998 --> 00:28:25,638
Speaker 3: to really surface in this series. But early on, I

570
00:28:25,678 --> 00:28:28,558
Speaker 3: wouldn't I wouldn't putts around him. I think I would

571
00:28:28,598 --> 00:28:31,558
Speaker 3: attack him early on, making my pitch. According to what

572
00:28:31,598 --> 00:28:33,038
Speaker 3: we think is the right way to go about this.

573
00:28:33,438 --> 00:28:35,238
Speaker 3: But I would definitely go after him early.

574
00:28:35,478 --> 00:28:37,758
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you say go after him, would you attack

575
00:28:37,798 --> 00:28:39,558
Speaker 2: him with fastballs exactly?

576
00:28:40,718 --> 00:28:43,598
Speaker 3: Again, I don't know these specifics gotten report on him.

577
00:28:43,598 --> 00:28:45,798
Speaker 3: I would not run away from that, but yeah, I

578
00:28:45,838 --> 00:28:50,318
Speaker 3: mean I would think for me, I would absolutely, especially

579
00:28:50,358 --> 00:28:52,518
Speaker 3: with Snell, if he could get that fastball in on him.

580
00:28:52,558 --> 00:28:53,398
Speaker 4: It's a tough pitch.

581
00:28:53,638 --> 00:28:55,878
Speaker 3: When you're throwing that hard at that angle, coming at

582
00:28:55,878 --> 00:28:59,318
Speaker 3: your hands right handed from a lefty, that's problematic. It's

583
00:28:59,358 --> 00:29:01,678
Speaker 3: really hard to get your hands inside on the head

584
00:29:01,718 --> 00:29:02,758
Speaker 3: out on that pitch.

585
00:29:03,158 --> 00:29:04,718
Speaker 4: So I wouldn't be I would' run away from that.

586
00:29:04,798 --> 00:29:07,278
Speaker 3: I think the fastball he could be more, Lad could

587
00:29:07,278 --> 00:29:08,838
Speaker 3: do a better job with U was out over the plate,

588
00:29:08,878 --> 00:29:10,918
Speaker 3: all over the plate, elevated a little bit, that'd be

589
00:29:10,918 --> 00:29:12,278
Speaker 3: an easier pitch for him to attack.

590
00:29:12,638 --> 00:29:15,438
Speaker 4: Just anything out away from so fastball.

591
00:29:15,478 --> 00:29:17,558
Speaker 3: To me, i'd keep it tight and then after that

592
00:29:17,718 --> 00:29:19,158
Speaker 3: just go to work with that change up in that

593
00:29:19,198 --> 00:29:22,038
Speaker 3: breaking ball to the back foot. Listen, Snall's that good?

594
00:29:22,318 --> 00:29:24,438
Speaker 3: You know, I wouldn't have Bob Gibson pitch around Vlad.

595
00:29:24,478 --> 00:29:26,598
Speaker 3: I mean, it's like, go ahead and do this. I'm

596
00:29:26,598 --> 00:29:28,878
Speaker 3: not saying he's Bob Gibson, just saying this stuff is

597
00:29:28,878 --> 00:29:29,678
Speaker 3: pretty oppressive.

598
00:29:29,878 --> 00:29:32,398
Speaker 2: You'll love this story too. Remember if Ladd started out

599
00:29:32,398 --> 00:29:36,238
Speaker 2: the Alcs zero for seven, grounded out six times. And

600
00:29:36,318 --> 00:29:39,158
Speaker 2: I remember talking to Don Maddingly and he said that Ladd,

601
00:29:39,518 --> 00:29:43,078
Speaker 2: especially in big spots and especially at home where the

602
00:29:43,078 --> 00:29:45,518
Speaker 2: crowd is, you know, really on their feet wanting him

603
00:29:45,518 --> 00:29:48,798
Speaker 2: to do so well, just he wants to do so well,

604
00:29:48,918 --> 00:29:51,398
Speaker 2: he gets a little too quick and that's where the

605
00:29:51,518 --> 00:29:54,238
Speaker 2: rollover ground balls come from. He was hitting the ball well,

606
00:29:54,638 --> 00:29:56,478
Speaker 2: but the contact point was just a little too far

607
00:29:56,518 --> 00:29:57,958
Speaker 2: out in front for him to get the ball in

608
00:29:57,998 --> 00:30:01,038
Speaker 2: the air and drive it anywhere. So before Game three

609
00:30:01,438 --> 00:30:04,678
Speaker 2: in Seattle, the hitting coach, David Popkins, who by the way,

610
00:30:04,878 --> 00:30:06,758
Speaker 2: was a hitting coach in the Dodger system, knows a

611
00:30:06,758 --> 00:30:08,718
Speaker 2: lot of these hitters. I think he does a fabulous

612
00:30:08,798 --> 00:30:11,358
Speaker 2: job with this team. They've gone from twenty third and

613
00:30:11,398 --> 00:30:14,998
Speaker 2: run scored last year to fourth this year. He brings

614
00:30:15,078 --> 00:30:17,198
Speaker 2: Lad into the cage, he said, we're going to fix this,

615
00:30:17,838 --> 00:30:21,478
Speaker 2: and he got him up against the curveball machine. Why

616
00:30:21,558 --> 00:30:24,358
Speaker 2: it slows the guy down, keeps him back and just

617
00:30:24,558 --> 00:30:29,598
Speaker 2: moving the contact point back slightly, no swing change, no stands,

618
00:30:29,638 --> 00:30:31,918
Speaker 2: set up change, none of that, just getting him back

619
00:30:31,998 --> 00:30:34,878
Speaker 2: on time by staying back on the curveball. He's been

620
00:30:34,918 --> 00:30:38,398
Speaker 2: a monster since then, so listen. Maybe he gets a

621
00:30:38,438 --> 00:30:43,038
Speaker 2: little anxious again. World Series, your home again, Dodgers, all that,

622
00:30:43,518 --> 00:30:45,318
Speaker 2: but he's in a good place right now to give

623
00:30:45,318 --> 00:30:47,878
Speaker 2: the hitting coach a lot of props there for finding

624
00:30:47,918 --> 00:30:50,278
Speaker 2: the right fix in the course of a series.

625
00:30:50,758 --> 00:30:53,838
Speaker 3: Yeah, this is not time for mechanical changes at all.

626
00:30:54,358 --> 00:30:56,318
Speaker 3: More than anything, you would just talk about, you know,

627
00:30:56,358 --> 00:30:58,838
Speaker 3: seeing the ball, waiting on the ball, utilizing in the

628
00:30:58,878 --> 00:31:00,358
Speaker 3: middle of the field, waiting for the ball.

629
00:31:00,478 --> 00:31:01,958
Speaker 4: Let's describe it to right central.

630
00:31:02,358 --> 00:31:04,878
Speaker 3: Maybe if there's any change at all, maybe you got

631
00:31:04,918 --> 00:31:07,038
Speaker 3: your feet a little bit tangled up, maybe your feet

632
00:31:07,078 --> 00:31:10,558
Speaker 3: are set improperly. Maybe you're starting to close down. Let's

633
00:31:10,558 --> 00:31:14,438
Speaker 3: get our feet back right. But anything with the upper body, hands,

634
00:31:14,718 --> 00:31:17,198
Speaker 3: you know how you manipulate your hands, you're your first move,

635
00:31:17,558 --> 00:31:19,198
Speaker 3: all those kind of different things. I would stay away

636
00:31:19,238 --> 00:31:21,838
Speaker 3: from any kind of mechanical noise right now.

637
00:31:22,078 --> 00:31:24,278
Speaker 4: It's all about feel, like you said, a little bit quick.

638
00:31:24,158 --> 00:31:28,358
Speaker 3: Little bit anxious. All those things are really detrimental. You

639
00:31:28,398 --> 00:31:30,638
Speaker 3: want you want to. You know, it's an easy gas

640
00:31:30,718 --> 00:31:32,838
Speaker 3: kind of a thing over over swinging, swinging too hard.

641
00:31:32,838 --> 00:31:34,798
Speaker 4: It's rarely ever gets it done.

642
00:31:35,158 --> 00:31:36,638
Speaker 3: Whenever you hit a home run and hit the ball

643
00:31:36,678 --> 00:31:38,598
Speaker 3: really well, most of the time you come back and

644
00:31:38,638 --> 00:31:40,918
Speaker 3: think of met God, I did that so easily. I

645
00:31:40,998 --> 00:31:43,318
Speaker 3: just reacted to it. There it was, I saw it,

646
00:31:44,078 --> 00:31:46,918
Speaker 3: and everything just worked properly. So I totally agree with

647
00:31:46,958 --> 00:31:50,638
Speaker 3: that method right now. It's historically one of my as

648
00:31:50,638 --> 00:31:53,918
Speaker 3: a hitting coach. As a season progressed that I wanted

649
00:31:53,918 --> 00:31:57,558
Speaker 3: to talk less and less and less about mechanics. You

650
00:31:57,638 --> 00:31:59,838
Speaker 3: might have to go over that stuff more often in

651
00:31:59,878 --> 00:32:02,798
Speaker 3: spring training coming off a winner. Sometimes you get away

652
00:32:02,838 --> 00:32:04,838
Speaker 3: from certain things. You have to be minded about it.

653
00:32:05,078 --> 00:32:05,678
Speaker 3: But then when you.

654
00:32:05,598 --> 00:32:06,678
Speaker 4: Get back into that groove.

655
00:32:07,078 --> 00:32:12,278
Speaker 3: I prefer a stronger mental approach teaching wise, season is progress,

656
00:32:12,398 --> 00:32:16,478
Speaker 3: and less physical mechanical approach with the season in progress.

657
00:32:16,518 --> 00:32:18,318
Speaker 2: Hey, Joe, we're going to take a quick break here

658
00:32:18,318 --> 00:32:21,078
Speaker 2: on the Book of Joe. When we get back, in

659
00:32:21,118 --> 00:32:24,598
Speaker 2: the interest of full disclosure, I will disclose my conflict

660
00:32:24,598 --> 00:32:26,638
Speaker 2: of interest with the Blue Jays. We need to talk

661
00:32:26,678 --> 00:32:30,718
Speaker 2: about a fascinating managerial hiring, and of course we'll give

662
00:32:30,718 --> 00:32:32,918
Speaker 2: you our World Series pick. We'll do all of that

663
00:32:33,318 --> 00:32:48,638
Speaker 2: right after this on the Book of Joe. Welcome back

664
00:32:48,678 --> 00:32:51,758
Speaker 2: to the World Series edition of the Book of Joe.

665
00:32:52,238 --> 00:32:54,558
Speaker 2: Joe Carter, of course hit that home run off Mitch

666
00:32:54,598 --> 00:32:57,998
Speaker 2: Williams nineteen ninety three and the World Series. It was

667
00:32:58,038 --> 00:33:01,678
Speaker 2: fascinating Joe to see that George Springer's home run looked

668
00:33:01,958 --> 00:33:05,198
Speaker 2: almost identical, right, same inning rerun, Homer jumping up and

669
00:33:05,238 --> 00:33:07,358
Speaker 2: down the first baseline. Did that occur to you when

670
00:33:07,398 --> 00:33:09,118
Speaker 2: you saw Springer hit that home run?

671
00:33:09,358 --> 00:33:10,198
Speaker 4: Yeah? I mean JC.

672
00:33:10,398 --> 00:33:13,758
Speaker 3: I played with JC in Boulder, Colorado, played in the

673
00:33:13,798 --> 00:33:17,798
Speaker 3: Wichita Tournament with Joe. He is one of my favorite

674
00:33:17,838 --> 00:33:21,238
Speaker 3: teammates ever. This guy is absolutely the salt of the

675
00:33:21,238 --> 00:33:23,198
Speaker 3: earth when he hit that home and I could not

676
00:33:23,238 --> 00:33:25,318
Speaker 3: have been happier for him. I knew his brother Freddy too,

677
00:33:26,278 --> 00:33:29,158
Speaker 3: Devon White was within that group. A lot of invested

678
00:33:29,198 --> 00:33:33,278
Speaker 3: interest in that. But yeah, Joe Harder, gosh, that's what,

679
00:33:33,398 --> 00:33:34,798
Speaker 3: like I said, one of my faves of all time.

680
00:33:34,798 --> 00:33:37,158
Speaker 3: But yes, there was a flashback moment there.

681
00:33:37,358 --> 00:33:39,718
Speaker 2: Yeah, flashback for me too, because if you look at

682
00:33:39,758 --> 00:33:42,078
Speaker 2: the ball as it sails over the left field wall,

683
00:33:42,158 --> 00:33:45,798
Speaker 2: I was actually sitting in the auxiliary press box in

684
00:33:45,918 --> 00:33:49,998
Speaker 2: left field, and you can see me slightly standing up.

685
00:33:50,038 --> 00:33:51,718
Speaker 2: I thought the ball was going to land on my lap.

686
00:33:51,758 --> 00:33:53,478
Speaker 2: It mind up in the bullpen, but it was heading

687
00:33:53,598 --> 00:33:56,718
Speaker 2: right in my direction. On my birthday, I had a

688
00:33:56,758 --> 00:34:00,878
Speaker 2: great look at that ball. And then, of course, exactly

689
00:34:00,958 --> 00:34:03,798
Speaker 2: twenty years ago, now, I went to spring training with

690
00:34:03,998 --> 00:34:06,078
Speaker 2: Blue Jays and played a week with them, and I

691
00:34:06,278 --> 00:34:09,358
Speaker 2: just found out yesterday that one of the players in

692
00:34:09,358 --> 00:34:12,478
Speaker 2: the Blue Jays camp was John Schneider, their manager. Now

693
00:34:12,638 --> 00:34:15,358
Speaker 2: he was a non roster catcher at camp when I

694
00:34:15,438 --> 00:34:18,278
Speaker 2: was there with the Blue Jays, with Roy Halladay, Frank Catalinado,

695
00:34:18,398 --> 00:34:21,198
Speaker 2: Vernon Wells in the gang. So sort of my old teammate.

696
00:34:21,278 --> 00:34:25,638
Speaker 2: Then John Schneider, how about that? And how about good?

697
00:34:26,158 --> 00:34:28,758
Speaker 2: How about his story, Joe? I mean, he's only been

698
00:34:28,838 --> 00:34:32,638
Speaker 2: with one organization for twenty three years. That never happens.

699
00:34:32,638 --> 00:34:36,838
Speaker 2: He was drafted, developed, played in the minor leagues with Toronto,

700
00:34:36,918 --> 00:34:39,678
Speaker 2: became a coach with Toronto, major league coach, now major

701
00:34:39,758 --> 00:34:42,278
Speaker 2: league manager, all in one organization.

702
00:34:42,718 --> 00:34:45,118
Speaker 3: I love that I could identify with that. With the

703
00:34:45,158 --> 00:34:47,478
Speaker 3: Angels for a shoot, was it forty years?

704
00:34:47,838 --> 00:34:48,718
Speaker 4: Yeah? For a long time.

705
00:34:48,798 --> 00:34:50,958
Speaker 3: Was with the Angels so I know what that feels like.

706
00:34:51,438 --> 00:34:54,478
Speaker 3: And then what he's doing doesn't really happen often anymore.

707
00:34:54,518 --> 00:34:57,078
Speaker 3: To work your way all the way through it, you

708
00:34:57,158 --> 00:34:59,118
Speaker 3: mentioned be rewarded with that job, and then all of

709
00:34:59,118 --> 00:35:00,238
Speaker 3: a sudden you're in the World Series.

710
00:35:00,278 --> 00:35:03,358
Speaker 4: I'm happy for him. I mean, that's what his success

711
00:35:03,358 --> 00:35:03,798
Speaker 4: should look.

712
00:35:04,358 --> 00:35:06,598
Speaker 3: I watch when the player comes in off the field

713
00:35:06,718 --> 00:35:09,878
Speaker 3: or even after home run, this sincere exchange between them,

714
00:35:09,878 --> 00:35:12,718
Speaker 3: because he knows these guys so well. So I don't

715
00:35:12,798 --> 00:35:15,198
Speaker 3: know him, but I do enjoy when he speaks. I

716
00:35:15,238 --> 00:35:17,878
Speaker 3: think he has ah's. When he does talk, it's a

717
00:35:17,998 --> 00:35:20,478
Speaker 3: it's a good feel for the game. His explanations are lucid,

718
00:35:20,878 --> 00:35:22,838
Speaker 3: and so I'm really I'm really happy for all of that.

719
00:35:23,278 --> 00:35:26,678
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's a good dude, Joe, and it's it's fascinating

720
00:35:26,718 --> 00:35:28,878
Speaker 2: to see how he's grown as a manager. He admitted

721
00:35:28,958 --> 00:35:31,598
Speaker 2: to me that when he first took the job, he

722
00:35:31,638 --> 00:35:34,678
Speaker 2: wanted to please everybody above him. So with all the

723
00:35:34,678 --> 00:35:37,638
Speaker 2: information flowing down at the manager's office, he did not

724
00:35:37,798 --> 00:35:40,398
Speaker 2: want to contradict that, didn't want to even second guess

725
00:35:40,398 --> 00:35:43,718
Speaker 2: that again. Company guy. And I'm say I'm saying that

726
00:35:43,758 --> 00:35:46,558
Speaker 2: as a compliment, not as a knock on him first

727
00:35:46,558 --> 00:35:48,718
Speaker 2: major league job. That's kind of what you do, right.

728
00:35:49,038 --> 00:35:51,238
Speaker 2: You follow the instructions you're given by the people who

729
00:35:51,318 --> 00:35:54,518
Speaker 2: hired you. But he's grown in the job now and

730
00:35:54,558 --> 00:35:56,438
Speaker 2: he has told this to the front office and they're

731
00:35:56,438 --> 00:35:59,958
Speaker 2: not necessarily heavy hands on, but he has talked to

732
00:35:59,998 --> 00:36:02,998
Speaker 2: them about how the heartbeat and what he sees on

733
00:36:03,038 --> 00:36:07,518
Speaker 2: the field is. He's also information. It may not be analytical,

734
00:36:07,758 --> 00:36:11,118
Speaker 2: it may not be data, but it's part of the

735
00:36:11,158 --> 00:36:13,958
Speaker 2: information ball of string, if you will, that a manager

736
00:36:13,998 --> 00:36:17,318
Speaker 2: has at his disposal. So he now will go with

737
00:36:17,438 --> 00:36:20,278
Speaker 2: his gut in terms of when to put people out there,

738
00:36:20,318 --> 00:36:23,038
Speaker 2: when to take people out. It's not scripted at all.

739
00:36:23,118 --> 00:36:25,278
Speaker 2: I think they let him run his own game. I

740
00:36:25,318 --> 00:36:27,878
Speaker 2: think he's grown as a manager. I think one of

741
00:36:27,918 --> 00:36:30,318
Speaker 2: his best traits actually blew up on him in the

742
00:36:30,358 --> 00:36:32,638
Speaker 2: one game where he brought in Brendan Little, a lefty,

743
00:36:32,678 --> 00:36:34,958
Speaker 2: to pitch to cal Raley instead of his closer when

744
00:36:34,958 --> 00:36:36,478
Speaker 2: the game was on the line in the eighth inning,

745
00:36:36,558 --> 00:36:38,158
Speaker 2: and it blew up on him and he lost. He

746
00:36:38,198 --> 00:36:40,558
Speaker 2: didn't make that same mistake again, and he brought his

747
00:36:40,558 --> 00:36:42,918
Speaker 2: closer in in the eighth inning next time. But he

748
00:36:42,958 --> 00:36:45,478
Speaker 2: does as he said, has tremendous confidence in all of

749
00:36:45,478 --> 00:36:48,318
Speaker 2: his players. Little was not the right guy in that situation.

750
00:36:48,718 --> 00:36:50,998
Speaker 2: He was nervous, he hadn't pitched well down the stretch.

751
00:36:51,278 --> 00:36:53,158
Speaker 2: The manager to learn from it moved on. But his

752
00:36:53,238 --> 00:36:56,798
Speaker 2: confidence in his players is paramount, and I think sometimes

753
00:36:56,838 --> 00:36:58,998
Speaker 2: you know this, Joe can get you into trouble. You

754
00:36:59,118 --> 00:37:01,598
Speaker 2: use everybody on your roster to get to the World Series.

755
00:37:02,078 --> 00:37:03,438
Speaker 2: Doesn't mean you have to use them all to win

756
00:37:03,478 --> 00:37:06,078
Speaker 2: the World Series. But I like the way he runs

757
00:37:06,078 --> 00:37:08,558
Speaker 2: a game. I see him now as fearless and confident,

758
00:37:08,958 --> 00:37:10,758
Speaker 2: and as a young manager, I'm not sure he was

759
00:37:10,798 --> 00:37:11,158
Speaker 2: that way.

760
00:37:11,358 --> 00:37:13,478
Speaker 4: It's great. It's all great stuff to hear.

761
00:37:13,878 --> 00:37:16,678
Speaker 3: The prep going into a World Series or any series

762
00:37:16,758 --> 00:37:19,158
Speaker 3: during the course of this season that Pepper are talking

763
00:37:19,198 --> 00:37:22,078
Speaker 3: about from an analytical department is done in a lot

764
00:37:22,078 --> 00:37:24,478
Speaker 3: of It's done in a quiet room and not a

765
00:37:24,478 --> 00:37:25,238
Speaker 3: whole lot going on.

766
00:37:25,278 --> 00:37:27,398
Speaker 4: It's very sterile. It's hysterial information.

767
00:37:27,478 --> 00:37:31,638
Speaker 3: It's all data, it's all mechanical, it's supportive. Like I said,

768
00:37:31,838 --> 00:37:33,758
Speaker 3: there's a lot of this I really do like. But

769
00:37:33,838 --> 00:37:38,958
Speaker 3: it's all this large, sample sized stuff that you could do,

770
00:37:39,198 --> 00:37:40,998
Speaker 3: like I saider in a calm moment put it together.

771
00:37:41,078 --> 00:37:44,118
Speaker 3: It's theory, it's wonderful, it's great, and I want it. However,

772
00:37:44,358 --> 00:37:47,478
Speaker 3: the one thing I've always wanted from analyinical analytical departments

773
00:37:47,558 --> 00:37:50,678
Speaker 3: was the small sample sized trends. What's going on the

774
00:37:50,798 --> 00:37:53,598
Speaker 3: last two weeks of August, how's this guy performed compared

775
00:37:53,638 --> 00:37:55,678
Speaker 3: to this large sample sized number that you give me.

776
00:37:56,278 --> 00:37:58,238
Speaker 3: The point I'm trying to drive out at is that

777
00:37:58,318 --> 00:38:02,038
Speaker 3: you always want to start with this this overarching big picture,

778
00:38:02,078 --> 00:38:03,598
Speaker 3: Like I'm looking up my window right and I'm seeing

779
00:38:03,598 --> 00:38:07,078
Speaker 3: the val mountains, I'm seeing everything. But in the moment

780
00:38:07,118 --> 00:38:09,398
Speaker 3: when things start to change, when things start to get

781
00:38:09,478 --> 00:38:14,758
Speaker 3: quick and all of a sudden, this beautiful theoretical novella

782
00:38:14,838 --> 00:38:17,318
Speaker 3: that you've written starts falling apart because the other team's

783
00:38:17,358 --> 00:38:18,198
Speaker 3: not cooperating.

784
00:38:18,598 --> 00:38:19,398
Speaker 4: That's the moment.

785
00:38:19,878 --> 00:38:22,758
Speaker 3: That is the moment, that's the small sample size, and

786
00:38:22,758 --> 00:38:26,558
Speaker 3: that's where experience, intuition, gut feeling take over.

787
00:38:26,918 --> 00:38:27,878
Speaker 4: And that's the part that.

788
00:38:27,838 --> 00:38:31,718
Speaker 3: I've argued with the whole way through, and that is

789
00:38:31,758 --> 00:38:34,158
Speaker 3: the part that I love. I love hearing this from

790
00:38:34,238 --> 00:38:37,558
Speaker 3: you about John. That's great, and that's where I think

791
00:38:37,958 --> 00:38:41,318
Speaker 3: the nurturing components should happen, where front offices need to

792
00:38:41,398 --> 00:38:44,998
Speaker 3: understand this. Theory is beautiful, but reality is something completely different.

793
00:38:45,398 --> 00:38:46,918
Speaker 4: So if you were able.

794
00:38:46,678 --> 00:38:50,798
Speaker 3: To from a front office perspective analytical department, explain this

795
00:38:51,438 --> 00:38:54,598
Speaker 3: or have this be part of the conversation, we understand this,

796
00:38:54,598 --> 00:38:56,238
Speaker 3: this is what we think. But I know of course

797
00:38:56,238 --> 00:38:57,958
Speaker 3: it's going to go not going to go this way

798
00:38:58,518 --> 00:39:00,318
Speaker 3: all the time. And then this is where I want

799
00:39:00,358 --> 00:39:02,358
Speaker 3: you to be able to react based on what you're seeing,

800
00:39:02,678 --> 00:39:05,158
Speaker 3: what you're feeling. That's what I never sat in a dugout.

801
00:39:05,198 --> 00:39:07,798
Speaker 3: I had to feel the game and I stand on

802
00:39:07,798 --> 00:39:10,598
Speaker 3: the top step. So I love hearing all this. That

803
00:39:10,758 --> 00:39:14,038
Speaker 3: is the right way to do things. I'm very supportive

804
00:39:14,038 --> 00:39:16,598
Speaker 3: of this, and good for him man, Good for him

805
00:39:16,918 --> 00:39:20,118
Speaker 3: for being honest about that se you need. That's where

806
00:39:20,158 --> 00:39:23,198
Speaker 3: they're managing in the minor leagues for many years. Ermits

807
00:39:23,238 --> 00:39:25,358
Speaker 3: you to accelerate through that moment because you get your

808
00:39:25,358 --> 00:39:28,398
Speaker 3: butt kicked, you make stupid decisions. You go back to

809
00:39:28,398 --> 00:39:31,038
Speaker 3: your hotel room, drink a coke or beer whatever and

810
00:39:31,158 --> 00:39:33,598
Speaker 3: have a taco and you get just upset with yourself

811
00:39:33,678 --> 00:39:36,238
Speaker 3: because of the dumb thing you did tonight. But nobody

812
00:39:36,238 --> 00:39:39,038
Speaker 3: really got to see it except you. Your team, of course,

813
00:39:39,078 --> 00:39:40,958
Speaker 3: you're maybe a coach or somebody that might have been

814
00:39:40,958 --> 00:39:43,318
Speaker 3: in town, and then you reevaluate and you move on.

815
00:39:43,358 --> 00:39:45,438
Speaker 3: It's when you're able to make your mistakes away from

816
00:39:45,478 --> 00:39:48,238
Speaker 3: the maddening crowd a little bit easier to swallow.

817
00:39:48,718 --> 00:39:50,438
Speaker 4: But believe for him for admitting to this.

818
00:39:50,398 --> 00:39:53,158
Speaker 2: Stuff, and to me, he's got two pressure points in

819
00:39:53,198 --> 00:39:55,518
Speaker 2: these games. Number One, we talked about that. You brought

820
00:39:55,558 --> 00:39:57,398
Speaker 2: this up right at the top. When to take a

821
00:39:57,438 --> 00:39:59,558
Speaker 2: starting pitcher out of the game, when to ride with him.

822
00:39:59,958 --> 00:40:02,758
Speaker 2: It's easy for Dave Roberts, He's got basically nobody in

823
00:40:02,798 --> 00:40:05,838
Speaker 2: his bullpen. He's going to better his four aces. Easy

824
00:40:05,878 --> 00:40:08,678
Speaker 2: to stay with them. More difficult for John Schnider. And

825
00:40:08,718 --> 00:40:11,598
Speaker 2: the other thing is, I don't think Joe He's got

826
00:40:11,638 --> 00:40:14,038
Speaker 2: a good matchup for show hey O Tani in his bullpen.

827
00:40:14,438 --> 00:40:17,398
Speaker 2: I really don't. I don't see that left handed specialist.

828
00:40:17,718 --> 00:40:20,998
Speaker 2: The lefties for the Brewers and the Phillies gave show

829
00:40:21,038 --> 00:40:23,598
Speaker 2: Hay trouble. There's no question about it. You know, Christopher

830
00:40:23,598 --> 00:40:26,678
Speaker 2: Sanchez is just a nightmare matchup. Lizardo. Those lefties from

831
00:40:26,678 --> 00:40:29,358
Speaker 2: Philly were tough on him. I don't think John Schnyder's

832
00:40:29,398 --> 00:40:32,398
Speaker 2: got that, guys. That's why I think it's an avoidance procedure.

833
00:40:32,718 --> 00:40:35,358
Speaker 2: When it comes to what the Blue Jays do, it's

834
00:40:35,358 --> 00:40:37,718
Speaker 2: show hey, That's why I see this series funneling towards

835
00:40:37,798 --> 00:40:38,798
Speaker 2: Mookie Betts.

836
00:40:38,838 --> 00:40:39,398
Speaker 4: Great points.

837
00:40:39,478 --> 00:40:42,758
Speaker 3: I mean, for me, you you just have to continually

838
00:40:42,918 --> 00:40:45,478
Speaker 3: test show Hay's patience. He's going to show you very

839
00:40:45,478 --> 00:40:47,038
Speaker 3: early on if he's locked in. If he shows you

840
00:40:47,078 --> 00:40:48,878
Speaker 3: in this first game he's locked in. That's like the

841
00:40:48,878 --> 00:40:52,798
Speaker 3: Barry Bonds method. Just walk away, don't even think. Don't

842
00:40:52,798 --> 00:40:54,318
Speaker 3: think you got him set up for anything.

843
00:40:54,718 --> 00:40:55,478
Speaker 4: The Lefties.

844
00:40:55,678 --> 00:40:57,678
Speaker 3: The one thing that I did notice obviously and show

845
00:40:57,758 --> 00:40:58,678
Speaker 3: he's done in the past.

846
00:40:58,718 --> 00:40:59,918
Speaker 4: He will chase that down.

847
00:40:59,718 --> 00:41:01,558
Speaker 3: And away breaking ball, but you have to get it

848
00:41:01,598 --> 00:41:02,878
Speaker 3: down and the way if you leave it middle and

849
00:41:02,958 --> 00:41:05,038
Speaker 3: that's going to go far. So these are the kind

850
00:41:05,078 --> 00:41:07,678
Speaker 3: of things that need to be spoken about. But I

851
00:41:07,758 --> 00:41:10,758
Speaker 3: would test his patience and if you have to move

852
00:41:10,758 --> 00:41:12,758
Speaker 3: it along, move it along. Even though the other options

853
00:41:12,798 --> 00:41:15,638
Speaker 3: behind him are really good for the Dodgers. You have

854
00:41:15,678 --> 00:41:17,558
Speaker 3: to clarify this. That's the point of me. You don't

855
00:41:17,558 --> 00:41:19,598
Speaker 3: want to leave anything ambivalent. Which should we do, what

856
00:41:19,598 --> 00:41:22,078
Speaker 3: should we not do? We're doing this, and if you

857
00:41:22,158 --> 00:41:25,918
Speaker 3: come up with the definitive plan, everybody can follow that

858
00:41:25,958 --> 00:41:26,998
Speaker 3: and they're going to make a mistake.

859
00:41:27,438 --> 00:41:28,398
Speaker 4: Of course, you're going to try to.

860
00:41:28,398 --> 00:41:30,438
Speaker 3: Do this down in a way, slider into dirt, whatever,

861
00:41:30,638 --> 00:41:32,198
Speaker 3: get a little bit quick, and the ball kind of

862
00:41:32,278 --> 00:41:34,278
Speaker 3: rolls and hangs and the ball goes over the wall.

863
00:41:34,318 --> 00:41:37,158
Speaker 3: It's going to happen. Probably going to happen. But the

864
00:41:37,558 --> 00:41:40,958
Speaker 3: overarching point the plan was in place. This is what

865
00:41:40,958 --> 00:41:43,078
Speaker 3: we're trying to do. This is my intent, and it

866
00:41:43,198 --> 00:41:44,038
Speaker 3: just did not work.

867
00:41:43,838 --> 00:41:46,718
Speaker 2: Out, which brings us, in terms of running games to

868
00:41:47,278 --> 00:41:48,078
Speaker 2: our final point.

869
00:41:48,078 --> 00:41:48,358
Speaker 4: Here.

870
00:41:48,878 --> 00:41:52,958
Speaker 2: San Francisco Giants and their president of baseball Operations, Buster Posey,

871
00:41:53,158 --> 00:41:56,038
Speaker 2: with his first big hire in the dugout, chose a

872
00:41:56,038 --> 00:41:59,838
Speaker 2: guy who's never coached or managed in professional baseball, college

873
00:41:59,838 --> 00:42:04,358
Speaker 2: coach Tony Vtello, of course, wildly successful with Tennessee three

874
00:42:04,358 --> 00:42:06,358
Speaker 2: and a half million dollars a year, which you're gonna

875
00:42:06,358 --> 00:42:07,998
Speaker 2: have to pay him because he was making about three

876
00:42:07,998 --> 00:42:10,918
Speaker 2: million at Tennessee. Tell me what you think about this, Joe,

877
00:42:11,758 --> 00:42:15,638
Speaker 2: a guy who's obviously successful running game on the college level.

878
00:42:15,678 --> 00:42:17,718
Speaker 2: We really haven't seen this. We've seen it happen with

879
00:42:17,798 --> 00:42:21,318
Speaker 2: hitting coaches and pitching coaches. I can't recall the last

880
00:42:21,318 --> 00:42:24,838
Speaker 2: one to go directly and with no experience in professional

881
00:42:24,878 --> 00:42:27,718
Speaker 2: ball from college to the pros. What'd you think of

882
00:42:27,758 --> 00:42:28,238
Speaker 2: this higher?

883
00:42:28,638 --> 00:42:31,038
Speaker 3: I thought it was interesting, like everybody else did. I

884
00:42:31,038 --> 00:42:32,918
Speaker 3: don't know this guy, just hearing his name for the

885
00:42:32,958 --> 00:42:34,638
Speaker 3: first time. I don't even know his body of work.

886
00:42:34,678 --> 00:42:38,438
Speaker 3: But being successful collegiately and being successful major league wise

887
00:42:38,438 --> 00:42:41,758
Speaker 3: are two completely different things. And that's not to denigrate

888
00:42:41,838 --> 00:42:44,718
Speaker 3: anything about this. From my history and a lot of

889
00:42:44,718 --> 00:42:47,038
Speaker 3: the guys that have involved in Major league baseball for years,

890
00:42:47,038 --> 00:42:49,678
Speaker 3: it's kind of insulting in a sense to think that,

891
00:42:49,798 --> 00:42:52,118
Speaker 3: you know, it's almost like all the work we put

892
00:42:52,158 --> 00:42:54,478
Speaker 3: in really didn't matter kind of a thing, you know,

893
00:42:55,078 --> 00:42:58,278
Speaker 3: And from that perspective, it's insulting in a sense. It

894
00:42:58,318 --> 00:43:01,518
Speaker 3: really is, because we were bled to believe for years that,

895
00:43:01,638 --> 00:43:03,398
Speaker 3: you know, you have to work your way through the

896
00:43:03,438 --> 00:43:07,598
Speaker 3: minor league's a ball douaa manage. Then you become rowing instructor,

897
00:43:07,918 --> 00:43:09,638
Speaker 3: you actually become a bench coach. You do all these

898
00:43:09,638 --> 00:43:13,518
Speaker 3: different things in order to earn your right to be

899
00:43:13,558 --> 00:43:15,678
Speaker 3: a major league coach and then a major league manager.

900
00:43:16,078 --> 00:43:18,478
Speaker 3: So when guys are just thrust into this, it really

901
00:43:18,918 --> 00:43:22,358
Speaker 3: minimizes what this job is all about. Having said all

902
00:43:22,398 --> 00:43:25,038
Speaker 3: of that, in today's climate, we've talked about this that's

903
00:43:25,078 --> 00:43:28,158
Speaker 3: not really important anymore. It's been shifted even to the

904
00:43:28,158 --> 00:43:30,758
Speaker 3: point where John Snyder, who's like really has done it

905
00:43:30,798 --> 00:43:32,878
Speaker 3: the right way, admit it. The wan He's just thrust

906
00:43:32,878 --> 00:43:34,998
Speaker 3: into the dugout a little bit too quick. I didn't

907
00:43:34,998 --> 00:43:37,078
Speaker 3: really understand it. I was able to slow it down,

908
00:43:37,118 --> 00:43:40,598
Speaker 3: and now I'm able to watch the game, stay ahead

909
00:43:40,598 --> 00:43:42,838
Speaker 3: of the game, and be an effective major league manager.

910
00:43:43,278 --> 00:43:45,598
Speaker 3: So it's not to say that this guy cannot do that.

911
00:43:45,638 --> 00:43:50,158
Speaker 3: I'm just saying the path to get there is antithetical

912
00:43:50,198 --> 00:43:53,038
Speaker 3: to everything we ever believed in coming up to the ranks.

913
00:43:53,358 --> 00:43:56,878
Speaker 3: Now he could obviously could be very successful, and if

914
00:43:56,878 --> 00:43:58,998
Speaker 3: in fact he is, this is going to lead to

915
00:43:58,998 --> 00:44:02,358
Speaker 3: a lot more of this. If he is successful, and listen,

916
00:44:02,438 --> 00:44:04,718
Speaker 3: I'm wishing that he is. I again, I don't. I'm

917
00:44:04,758 --> 00:44:07,238
Speaker 3: just telling you what I think. If he is successful,

918
00:44:07,238 --> 00:44:09,278
Speaker 3: it's really going to lead to more of this, and

919
00:44:09,318 --> 00:44:12,438
Speaker 3: it's going to lead to more collision involvement in regards

920
00:44:12,438 --> 00:44:15,558
Speaker 3: to the minor leagues and more weight being distributed there

921
00:44:15,558 --> 00:44:19,038
Speaker 3: as a put and less to minor league development as

922
00:44:19,038 --> 00:44:21,518
Speaker 3: it traditional, as it's been done in the past. I

923
00:44:21,558 --> 00:44:24,638
Speaker 3: think all these things are interrelate it the search to

924
00:44:25,838 --> 00:44:28,038
Speaker 3: by the Major League Baseball the cut costs in a

925
00:44:28,118 --> 00:44:31,318
Speaker 3: sense and rely more on like the NFL does or

926
00:44:31,438 --> 00:44:36,478
Speaker 3: NBA whatever, this other method of development that they believe

927
00:44:36,798 --> 00:44:40,438
Speaker 3: is as equally effective. So that's where it's at. I think,

928
00:44:40,558 --> 00:44:42,998
Speaker 3: I swear I wish this guy's success. I think it's

929
00:44:43,038 --> 00:44:45,678
Speaker 3: really interesting. I'm looking forward to hear him speak because

930
00:44:45,678 --> 00:44:49,518
Speaker 3: I've heard he's really good at it. Gregario's personality, high energy,

931
00:44:49,558 --> 00:44:53,238
Speaker 3: all this stuff you're looking for, no question, But from

932
00:44:53,278 --> 00:44:56,758
Speaker 3: those that have done this before, that's where it's at.

933
00:44:56,798 --> 00:44:59,638
Speaker 3: I mean, that's just an honest reaction to it, and

934
00:45:00,358 --> 00:45:02,198
Speaker 3: to not just explain it that way would be I

935
00:45:02,198 --> 00:45:03,478
Speaker 3: would just be disingenuous.

936
00:45:04,118 --> 00:45:06,438
Speaker 2: And I get that. And obviously the world has changed

937
00:45:06,478 --> 00:45:08,318
Speaker 2: a lot. I mean, to me, it's no different than

938
00:45:08,358 --> 00:45:13,038
Speaker 2: the Angels hiring Kurtsuzuki former player. Where's his managery experience, right,

939
00:45:13,198 --> 00:45:15,318
Speaker 2: I'm exactly just betting on the fact that, oh he's

940
00:45:15,318 --> 00:45:17,438
Speaker 2: been around the game, he's a catcher, blah blah blah.

941
00:45:17,478 --> 00:45:19,518
Speaker 2: But as far as that paying of the dues. Those

942
00:45:19,598 --> 00:45:21,638
Speaker 2: days are over with, as you know, in terms of

943
00:45:21,678 --> 00:45:24,598
Speaker 2: who they're putting in the dugout to run things. I

944
00:45:24,758 --> 00:45:27,238
Speaker 2: like the fact that Buster's going outside the box here,

945
00:45:27,598 --> 00:45:30,198
Speaker 2: and I like the fact, as you mentioned, this guy's energetic.

946
00:45:30,918 --> 00:45:33,958
Speaker 2: If he's a good leader of people, of men, I

947
00:45:33,998 --> 00:45:36,438
Speaker 2: have no problem with the hire. I think that to me,

948
00:45:36,838 --> 00:45:39,758
Speaker 2: it's party one is to be a great leader. Question

949
00:45:39,918 --> 00:45:42,358
Speaker 2: is do they empower him to be his own leader.

950
00:45:42,598 --> 00:45:44,398
Speaker 2: Who does he have next to him in the dugout?

951
00:45:44,558 --> 00:45:47,958
Speaker 2: Who actually is familiar with the major league game. I mean,

952
00:45:48,038 --> 00:45:50,518
Speaker 2: his baseball still twenty seven ounce, I get it, but

953
00:45:50,678 --> 00:45:53,958
Speaker 2: it's not college baseball. There are differences even just knowing

954
00:45:53,998 --> 00:45:57,278
Speaker 2: the talent on the field. So put an experience bench

955
00:45:57,318 --> 00:45:59,758
Speaker 2: coach there next to him, I'm fine with it. But again,

956
00:45:59,798 --> 00:46:02,518
Speaker 2: I like the fact that Buster's going somewhere here that's different.

957
00:46:02,998 --> 00:46:07,358
Speaker 2: I know what he prioritizes, and it is leadership. There's

958
00:46:07,398 --> 00:46:10,558
Speaker 2: no question about that, and I'm interested to see how

959
00:46:10,598 --> 00:46:13,238
Speaker 2: it works out. I think, to me, if you're a

960
00:46:13,278 --> 00:46:15,278
Speaker 2: great college coach and you've done it for that long,

961
00:46:15,358 --> 00:46:17,758
Speaker 2: it's not like this guy just started out coaching. He's

962
00:46:17,798 --> 00:46:20,198
Speaker 2: been around two three decades. I have a good feeling

963
00:46:20,278 --> 00:46:22,278
Speaker 2: about this. I you know, it all depends on the

964
00:46:22,278 --> 00:46:23,958
Speaker 2: players in the field. Do you know that, Joe. But

965
00:46:24,718 --> 00:46:27,518
Speaker 2: as far as him running games, I wouldn't be worried

966
00:46:27,558 --> 00:46:30,358
Speaker 2: about that. I just think the college game has become

967
00:46:30,438 --> 00:46:32,358
Speaker 2: so much more like the pro game in terms of

968
00:46:32,398 --> 00:46:34,878
Speaker 2: what they have available to them, in terms of technologies.

969
00:46:34,918 --> 00:46:36,878
Speaker 2: A lot of that it bubbles up actually from college

970
00:46:36,918 --> 00:46:39,598
Speaker 2: into the pros. I think the leap is not as

971
00:46:39,598 --> 00:46:41,438
Speaker 2: big as it used to be. But again, I'll go

972
00:46:41,518 --> 00:46:42,998
Speaker 2: back to the fact that I got I got to

973
00:46:42,998 --> 00:46:45,278
Speaker 2: get buster credit here for going outside the box and

974
00:46:45,278 --> 00:46:46,118
Speaker 2: making a pick like this.

975
00:46:46,598 --> 00:46:47,878
Speaker 4: Yeah, agreed.

976
00:46:47,998 --> 00:46:50,358
Speaker 3: I mean again, I agree with everything you're saying right now,

977
00:46:50,358 --> 00:46:53,158
Speaker 3: but just turning back the clock to the phrase that

978
00:46:53,198 --> 00:46:55,478
Speaker 3: everything's different it's a different game today, which I really

979
00:46:55,798 --> 00:46:58,198
Speaker 3: I respect that thought, but I don't agree with it completely.

980
00:46:58,238 --> 00:47:01,678
Speaker 3: It's it's only it's administrated differently. It should be the

981
00:47:01,678 --> 00:47:04,878
Speaker 3: same game, but it's administrated differently. There's different methods involved.

982
00:47:05,158 --> 00:47:07,798
Speaker 3: Because when I came up, I'll give you names. Aggie Garrito,

983
00:47:08,038 --> 00:47:13,158
Speaker 3: Dave Snow, Chris Gus Gustafson, Jim Brock, Mike Martin, Jim Morris.

984
00:47:13,478 --> 00:47:17,558
Speaker 3: There was so many charismatic, outstanding collegiate baseball coaches back

985
00:47:17,598 --> 00:47:19,518
Speaker 3: in the day when I came up, I mean, and

986
00:47:19,718 --> 00:47:22,758
Speaker 3: very successful. Their records were stupid and constant trips of

987
00:47:22,798 --> 00:47:24,758
Speaker 3: the word. Jerry Kendall's another one. So I mean, this

988
00:47:24,838 --> 00:47:27,518
Speaker 3: has always been there. It's so I don't want people

989
00:47:27,558 --> 00:47:30,278
Speaker 3: to be misinterpreted. There's been a lot of great and

990
00:47:30,638 --> 00:47:33,038
Speaker 3: right now Murph with the Brewers. I knew Murph when

991
00:47:33,078 --> 00:47:35,838
Speaker 3: he was at Notre Dame and then ASU. I mean, yes,

992
00:47:36,198 --> 00:47:38,638
Speaker 3: it's all right there. It's just the fact that to

993
00:47:38,758 --> 00:47:40,598
Speaker 3: just never have had any experience at all in pro

994
00:47:40,678 --> 00:47:43,238
Speaker 3: ball and just to be given this opportunity. It also

995
00:47:43,878 --> 00:47:47,198
Speaker 3: speaks to the way that leadership is being doled out

996
00:47:47,238 --> 00:47:49,438
Speaker 3: right now. And I'm not saying this guy is going

997
00:47:49,518 --> 00:47:50,238
Speaker 3: to be controllable.

998
00:47:50,238 --> 00:47:50,518
Speaker 4: I don't.

999
00:47:50,558 --> 00:47:53,078
Speaker 3: I don't get that as opposed to being empowered. I

1000
00:47:53,118 --> 00:47:55,438
Speaker 3: think Buster is going to have to empower this fellow

1001
00:47:55,438 --> 00:47:59,358
Speaker 3: because he's been the CEO, he's been the he's been

1002
00:47:59,398 --> 00:48:03,038
Speaker 3: the everything at Tennessee. When you're a college baseball coach,

1003
00:48:03,038 --> 00:48:05,398
Speaker 3: you don't have to answer to any but yourself regarding

1004
00:48:05,878 --> 00:48:08,118
Speaker 3: who you're recruiting, how you're recruiting them, the game.

1005
00:48:07,958 --> 00:48:09,878
Speaker 4: Itself, the game plan that's you.

1006
00:48:10,038 --> 00:48:12,598
Speaker 3: It's it's kind of an interesting gig, and it's it

1007
00:48:12,718 --> 00:48:15,678
Speaker 3: sounds like kind of a fun gig completely, so he's

1008
00:48:15,718 --> 00:48:18,998
Speaker 3: gonna have to reassess how this is all done. There's

1009
00:48:19,038 --> 00:48:21,478
Speaker 3: no way for a major league manager to become part

1010
00:48:21,478 --> 00:48:23,918
Speaker 3: of the scouting department. You just don't have the time.

1011
00:48:23,958 --> 00:48:26,078
Speaker 3: You could maybe go out a little bit in January,

1012
00:48:26,118 --> 00:48:30,478
Speaker 3: maybe February and watch them games prior to spring training beginning,

1013
00:48:30,798 --> 00:48:33,118
Speaker 3: but once they begin you may be able to watch videos.

1014
00:48:33,638 --> 00:48:35,278
Speaker 3: I don't even know if they want to include them

1015
00:48:35,278 --> 00:48:38,398
Speaker 3: in that regard, but there's your time element is so

1016
00:48:39,118 --> 00:48:41,998
Speaker 3: scattered that it's not like the NFL coaches that that

1017
00:48:42,598 --> 00:48:45,838
Speaker 3: they can become involved in scouting or NBA coach they

1018
00:48:45,878 --> 00:48:49,198
Speaker 3: can become involved in scouting Baseball cannot You just don't

1019
00:48:49,238 --> 00:48:53,118
Speaker 3: have the time to do it. Regarding like recruiting, I

1020
00:48:53,118 --> 00:48:55,518
Speaker 3: think that was mentioned also like free agents. I don't

1021
00:48:55,878 --> 00:49:00,878
Speaker 3: really see the fact that if you have a wonderful

1022
00:49:00,878 --> 00:49:02,998
Speaker 3: personality that you're gonna be able to recruit guys there.

1023
00:49:03,558 --> 00:49:05,358
Speaker 3: We've all try to do that. I mean, when when

1024
00:49:05,398 --> 00:49:08,718
Speaker 3: somebody when we want somebody with show, hey, we all

1025
00:49:08,718 --> 00:49:11,078
Speaker 3: try to recruit show hated the Cubs back in the day,

1026
00:49:11,398 --> 00:49:12,638
Speaker 3: but at the end of the day, Show He's going

1027
00:49:12,678 --> 00:49:17,038
Speaker 3: to go based on what he wants, what he thinks

1028
00:49:17,078 --> 00:49:20,078
Speaker 3: he's most comfortable with, because everybody's going to present a

1029
00:49:20,118 --> 00:49:23,358
Speaker 3: good case, and everybody's going to have their version of

1030
00:49:23,398 --> 00:49:26,278
Speaker 3: the gregarious personality. And and like you talked about, show

1031
00:49:26,278 --> 00:49:29,038
Speaker 3: Hay winded nine by Toronto and then eventually goes to

1032
00:49:29,118 --> 00:49:31,878
Speaker 3: the Dodgers. So all of these things are going to

1033
00:49:31,918 --> 00:49:34,998
Speaker 3: be different there as opposed as what they were in Tennessee.

1034
00:49:35,718 --> 00:49:38,198
Speaker 3: But I'm curious because, like I said, I've been around

1035
00:49:38,238 --> 00:49:41,358
Speaker 3: a lot of great college coaches, great ones that never

1036
00:49:41,798 --> 00:49:44,398
Speaker 3: had that kind of opportunity, and even Bobby Winkles back

1037
00:49:44,398 --> 00:49:45,798
Speaker 3: in the day, tremendous dude.

1038
00:49:45,958 --> 00:49:47,118
Speaker 4: It's been out there before.

1039
00:49:47,158 --> 00:49:49,678
Speaker 3: This is just the first opportunity, not because the game

1040
00:49:49,718 --> 00:49:52,438
Speaker 3: is different, but because the administration of the game is different.

1041
00:49:52,798 --> 00:49:55,598
Speaker 2: And that brings us, Joe to a wrap up here.

1042
00:49:56,118 --> 00:49:59,358
Speaker 2: Before we get to your wisdom of the day, we

1043
00:49:59,438 --> 00:50:03,278
Speaker 2: need to drop our world series picks. Okay, I think

1044
00:50:03,318 --> 00:50:05,198
Speaker 2: this is going to be a longer series than a

1045
00:50:05,238 --> 00:50:08,478
Speaker 2: lot of people think. Yes, the Dodgers are on a roll,

1046
00:50:08,518 --> 00:50:11,878
Speaker 2: They're a juggernaut. I get all that, but I've got

1047
00:50:11,918 --> 00:50:14,958
Speaker 2: Toronto getting the series back to Toronto. So I do

1048
00:50:15,038 --> 00:50:17,238
Speaker 2: have the Dodgers winning the series, but I do have

1049
00:50:17,278 --> 00:50:19,438
Speaker 2: it in six games. I have a hard time finding

1050
00:50:19,518 --> 00:50:22,838
Speaker 2: four ways for the Blue Jays to win games, but

1051
00:50:23,398 --> 00:50:27,038
Speaker 2: I could definitely see two, maybe even three. So I'm

1052
00:50:27,078 --> 00:50:28,918
Speaker 2: going to call right now Dodgers and six.

1053
00:50:28,958 --> 00:50:31,438
Speaker 4: What do you got Dodgers in five? I just think

1054
00:50:31,478 --> 00:50:31,998
Speaker 4: they're pitching.

1055
00:50:32,038 --> 00:50:33,238
Speaker 2: Is that it is too good? Huh?

1056
00:50:33,318 --> 00:50:36,638
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I experienced it with the the Angels

1057
00:50:36,678 --> 00:50:40,238
Speaker 3: versus the White Sox. That wasn't the World Series, but god,

1058
00:50:40,278 --> 00:50:41,038
Speaker 3: we couldn't even get.

1059
00:50:40,958 --> 00:50:41,558
Speaker 4: In their bullpen.

1060
00:50:42,678 --> 00:50:45,438
Speaker 2: They were on a roll like White Sox staff and five.

1061
00:50:45,838 --> 00:50:48,278
Speaker 3: Yeah, when you got and they were all starters, And

1062
00:50:48,318 --> 00:50:50,158
Speaker 3: that's what I'm talking about with these guys. It would

1063
00:50:50,158 --> 00:50:53,358
Speaker 3: be the biggest thing would be to somehow get pitch

1064
00:50:53,438 --> 00:50:56,078
Speaker 3: counts up with these starters for the Dodgers. And that

1065
00:50:56,118 --> 00:50:58,598
Speaker 3: would be, you know, the the Blue Jays being pesky

1066
00:50:58,638 --> 00:51:01,598
Speaker 3: like they can be and they're just getting into the bullpen.

1067
00:51:01,678 --> 00:51:04,918
Speaker 3: But these Dodgers are arrested. They're really good. They got

1068
00:51:05,158 --> 00:51:07,478
Speaker 3: kind of on a roll right now, not that the

1069
00:51:07,478 --> 00:51:10,318
Speaker 3: Blue Jays aren't, but I think the Dodgers are even

1070
00:51:10,358 --> 00:51:12,398
Speaker 3: more so. And after all I thought, you know, I

1071
00:51:12,478 --> 00:51:14,158
Speaker 3: think we both thought the National League was a better

1072
00:51:14,238 --> 00:51:16,438
Speaker 3: league all year than the American League had been. So

1073
00:51:16,878 --> 00:51:18,998
Speaker 3: I'm saying five. I think they're gonna eak out one.

1074
00:51:19,198 --> 00:51:20,678
Speaker 3: They have to win one of these first tour. It

1075
00:51:20,678 --> 00:51:23,918
Speaker 3: could even just before zero to four. So we'll see

1076
00:51:23,918 --> 00:51:26,318
Speaker 3: how it plays up. But I got the Dodgers in five.

1077
00:51:26,518 --> 00:51:28,558
Speaker 2: All right, Joe? What else you got for us to

1078
00:51:28,638 --> 00:51:30,838
Speaker 2: take us home on this edition of the Book of Joe.

1079
00:51:31,318 --> 00:51:34,798
Speaker 3: Yeah, my take always was going into the playoffs. I

1080
00:51:34,838 --> 00:51:37,798
Speaker 3: always wanted to make sure in that meeting before the playoffs,

1081
00:51:37,998 --> 00:51:41,918
Speaker 3: I ran this by the guys because my first salvo

1082
00:51:42,038 --> 00:51:44,678
Speaker 3: went to playoff baseball was with the Angels and we

1083
00:51:44,718 --> 00:51:47,558
Speaker 3: were playing the Yankees and Anaheim. After we had a

1084
00:51:47,638 --> 00:51:51,198
Speaker 3: long game five al Ds. We'd played a long game

1085
00:51:51,238 --> 00:51:52,638
Speaker 3: the night before to get it to two to two.

1086
00:51:52,638 --> 00:51:56,078
Speaker 3: I had to go back to Anheim Stadium and I'm

1087
00:51:56,078 --> 00:51:58,678
Speaker 3: watching this game. It's kind of a twilight later in

1088
00:51:58,678 --> 00:52:01,238
Speaker 3: the day game and then we're leading. I'm looking out

1089
00:52:01,238 --> 00:52:03,438
Speaker 3: on the field and gosh, I'm looking at their players.

1090
00:52:03,998 --> 00:52:05,838
Speaker 3: There was a different look about and it was almost

1091
00:52:05,838 --> 00:52:08,398
Speaker 3: like a look of resignation, and I thought, whoa, I

1092
00:52:08,438 --> 00:52:10,878
Speaker 3: never want our guys to look like that, right down

1093
00:52:10,958 --> 00:52:13,478
Speaker 3: to the last out. So the one thing I always

1094
00:52:13,478 --> 00:52:15,918
Speaker 3: bring up to the guys is that, believe me, you

1095
00:52:15,958 --> 00:52:18,358
Speaker 3: have to know something is going to go wrong, So

1096
00:52:19,358 --> 00:52:21,758
Speaker 3: know that and react to So the thing that I

1097
00:52:21,758 --> 00:52:24,478
Speaker 3: found today, some things have to go wrong before they

1098
00:52:24,518 --> 00:52:27,678
Speaker 3: go right. So don't expect us to be to waltz

1099
00:52:27,678 --> 00:52:30,318
Speaker 3: through this whole thing. It's if, in fact, we're able

1100
00:52:30,358 --> 00:52:33,558
Speaker 3: to win this, which we expect to know, there's gonna

1101
00:52:33,558 --> 00:52:35,718
Speaker 3: be pitfalls. No, there's gonna be moments when this is

1102
00:52:35,758 --> 00:52:39,358
Speaker 3: not going right and it's gonna go sideways. And we

1103
00:52:39,438 --> 00:52:43,238
Speaker 3: cannot succumb to this this look and feel of resignation.

1104
00:52:43,318 --> 00:52:46,038
Speaker 3: You just cannot. We fought too hard to get here.

1105
00:52:46,438 --> 00:52:48,558
Speaker 3: So I love this, and you have to know this

1106
00:52:48,798 --> 00:52:51,158
Speaker 3: just probably a good life lesson. But some things have

1107
00:52:51,238 --> 00:52:52,878
Speaker 3: to go wrong before they go right.

1108
00:52:52,958 --> 00:52:53,158
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1109
00:52:53,158 --> 00:52:55,758
Speaker 2: I was gonna say that's great advice for everybody, right.

1110
00:52:55,798 --> 00:52:57,958
Speaker 2: I mean, if you think your world's going to be perfect,

1111
00:52:58,678 --> 00:53:00,318
Speaker 2: it's likely you're asleep and dreaming.

1112
00:53:01,118 --> 00:53:01,718
Speaker 4: Thank you, brother.

1113
00:53:01,838 --> 00:53:05,038
Speaker 2: Let it should be a good world series with plenty

1114
00:53:05,078 --> 00:53:07,238
Speaker 2: of great pitching, so looking forward to this one. A

1115
00:53:07,318 --> 00:53:11,158
Speaker 2: truly international world series. This series puts the world the

1116
00:53:11,318 --> 00:53:14,158
Speaker 2: world series. We'll see you next time. Next time we meet,

1117
00:53:14,198 --> 00:53:16,718
Speaker 2: we'll be talking about this world series right here on

1118
00:53:16,798 --> 00:53:17,438
Speaker 2: the Book of Joe.

1119
00:53:17,798 --> 00:53:18,518
Speaker 4: Thank you, Tommy.

1120
00:53:18,598 --> 00:53:20,158
Speaker 3: And I think I'm going to break out a bottle

1121
00:53:20,198 --> 00:53:23,998
Speaker 3: of my new favorite wine, Lion tamer Cab.

1122
00:53:24,158 --> 00:53:25,118
Speaker 4: It's outstanding.

1123
00:53:25,318 --> 00:53:26,678
Speaker 2: Oh, I'll have to check that out.

1124
00:53:28,678 --> 00:53:37,838
Speaker 1: And the Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

1125
00:53:38,038 --> 00:53:42,918
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

1126
00:53:43,158 --> 00:53:44,918
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts.