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Speaker 1: Hey, guys, ready or not, twenty twenty four is here

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Speaker 1: and we here at breaking points, are already thinking of

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Speaker 1: ways we can up our game for this critical election.

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Speaker 2: We rely on our premium subs to expand coverage, upgrade

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Speaker 2: the studio ad staff give you, guys, the best independent.

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Speaker 3: Coverage that is possible.

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Speaker 2: If you like what we're all about, it just means

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Speaker 2: the absolute world to have your support. But enough with that,

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Speaker 2: let's get to the show.

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Speaker 3: Good morning everybody, it is Monday. We have a great

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Speaker 3: show for everyone today.

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Speaker 4: What do we have, Prissel, Indeed we do.

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Speaker 1: There is a lot happening that we are tracking right now.

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Speaker 1: The two big stories are increasing strikes in Lebanon and Syria,

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Speaker 1: both from the US and from Israel. Break that down obviously,

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Speaker 1: concerns about a wider war developing, and actually concerns from

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Speaker 1: US official that Israel wants a wider war and is

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Speaker 1: pushing for that will break all of that down for you. Also,

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Speaker 1: all eyes on Alshifa Hospital in Gaza City. They have

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Speaker 1: run out of food, fuel, everything, patients are dying as

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Speaker 1: Israel is claiming that Hamas operates underneath of this hotel.

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Speaker 1: We have some really dramatic and very disturbing eyewitness testimony

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Speaker 1: from inside of that hospital, so we will tell you

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Speaker 1: everything that's going on there as well. Also bombshell new

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Speaker 1: report about what really happened with regards to nord Stream pipeline. Surprise, surprise,

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Speaker 1: Ukraine behind it. Jeez, did the US know anything despite

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Speaker 1: our insistent denials at the time.

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Speaker 4: We will tell you all about that.

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Speaker 1: This coming from the Washington Post, by the way, so

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Speaker 1: very interesting developments there. We also we have not covered

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Speaker 1: this yet, but this is a huge story unfolding in

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Speaker 1: New York City. Eric Adams, the mayor of New York,

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Speaker 1: had his phone seized by the FBI. One of his

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Speaker 1: top fundraisers had her house rated also.

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Speaker 3: By the FBI.

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Speaker 1: We have new details this morning about what exactly it

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Speaker 1: is that they are looking for and investigating, so that

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Speaker 1: is quite astonishing. We'll dig into that one. Also record

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Speaker 1: breaking fine levied against the National Association of Realtors that

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Speaker 1: could completely upend the real estate industry, so we'll tell

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Speaker 1: you about that. And a story that Sager has really

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Speaker 1: had his eye on high end brothel that was busted

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Speaker 1: up by the FEDS that says on their client list

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Speaker 1: they have military officials politicians, pharma.

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Speaker 4: Executives, politicians.

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Speaker 1: They aren't naming names yet, but we are keeping our

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Speaker 1: eyes on that one.

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Speaker 3: Yes, these geniuses, just to tease it. We're so smart.

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Speaker 2: They sent in their full names, their occupations, and full

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Speaker 2: id and the FEDS are sitting on that.

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Speaker 3: So I personally I'd like to see it, but we'll

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Speaker 3: save that.

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Speaker 2: It's going to be our fun story at the end.

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Speaker 2: Why don't we go to Israel and find out what's

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Speaker 2: going on there.

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Speaker 1: Indeed, so one of the big developments this morning, and

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Speaker 1: obviously something we've been watching very very closely, is the

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Speaker 1: risk of a wider war. And we had the Israeli

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Speaker 1: Defense minister. You have Galant warning Lebanon specifically and actually

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Speaker 1: threatening the civilians of Lebanon. Let's take listen to what

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Speaker 1: he had to say.

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Speaker 5: Well, Milican citizens of Lebanon, I can see the citizens

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Speaker 5: of Gaza waving white flags as they move south. Hesblar

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Speaker 5: is pushing Lebanon into a possible war. It is making mistakes.

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Speaker 5: It is the citizens of Lebanon that will pay the

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Speaker 5: price of these kinds of mistakes. What we are doing

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Speaker 5: in Gaza we can do in Beirut. I hope that

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Speaker 5: Hesbela will behave and that Nazaala will stop provoking us

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Speaker 5: because this aggression is unacceptable.

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Speaker 1: So a real threat being leveled here. He says, what

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Speaker 1: we are doing in Gaza, which we've all seen what

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Speaker 1: they're doing in Gaza, and how horrifying it is, we

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Speaker 1: can do in Beirut.

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Speaker 4: He goes on to say, the.

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Speaker 1: Citizens of Lebanon are the ones who will pay the price.

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Speaker 1: And as I said before, we can put this up

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Speaker 1: on the screen. This comes as there are increasing strikes

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Speaker 1: from the Israeli military firing on what they say are

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Speaker 1: Hesbel militant positions. Fighters fired rockets into israel injuring civilians

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Speaker 1: and again raising fears of an escalating conflict. This comes

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Speaker 1: as well as the Israeli military has been dropping flyers

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Speaker 1: to residents of Lebanon.

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Speaker 4: Let's put this up on the screen. This is southern Lebanon.

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Speaker 1: They've been dropping these flyers, encouraging residents to evacuate their

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Speaker 1: homes and relocate further north. So again the commentary from

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Speaker 1: this individual is breaking and pending Israeli planned attack on

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Speaker 1: Lebanon because of these Israeli army flyers and saber. We

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Speaker 1: are not the only ones apparently, who are concerned about

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Speaker 1: what these escalating attacks could mean.

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Speaker 4: Put this up on the screen from Axios.

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Speaker 1: This is really a pretty bombshell report from this news outlet, Scoop.

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Speaker 1: This is from Barack Revied, who's been doing some good reporting.

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Speaker 1: Austin warned Gallant about Israeli military actions in Lebanon. They

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Speaker 1: say that administration officials are concerned israel Is trying to

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Speaker 1: provoke Hezbola and create a pretext for a wider war

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Speaker 1: in Lebanon that could draw the US and other countries

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Speaker 1: further into the conflict. That is, according to sources briefed

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Speaker 1: on the issue, Israeli officials Flatley Tonight whatever. In one

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Speaker 1: incident that they were particularly concerned about, US officials and

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Speaker 1: Israeli airstrike hit a car in southern Lebanon. They killed

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Speaker 1: an elderly woman and three of her grandchildren. Took days

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Speaker 1: for the Israeli military to even acknowledge it. The second

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Speaker 1: incident that really concerned US officials happened on Saturday before

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Speaker 1: the call between Austin and his counterpart Galant, when the

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Speaker 1: Israeli military conducted a drone strike about twenty five miles

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Speaker 1: north of the border. Was the longest range strike in

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Speaker 1: Lebanon since the war started. And finally, Biden administration officials

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Speaker 1: are concerned by some of the video that we just

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Speaker 1: played you public threats from Galant against HESBLA, and they

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Speaker 1: think these threats only increase tensions.

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Speaker 4: According to an Israeli.

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Speaker 2: Source, what's really concerning Crystal is that as of this morning,

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Speaker 2: one hundred and twenty five thousand Israelis have been evacuated

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Speaker 2: from the northern border. It's the largest internal resettlement in

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Speaker 2: the history of the State of Israel, way specifically from

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Speaker 2: the northern border, where the Hezbola Front could open up,

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Speaker 2: and that's why we should be the most concerned. We've

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Speaker 2: also laid this out from a strategic perspective, the Gaza war,

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Speaker 2: it's not going to bleed out only because Humas for

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Speaker 2: all their capabilities we're talking about again Piddley rockets, Yes

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Speaker 2: they have tunnels, Yes they have lots of fighters, but

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Speaker 2: it's effectively impossible for it to really penetrate Israeli air

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Speaker 2: defense systems and to spiral out out of control and

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Speaker 2: to embroil the US. Hezbullah is an entirely different story.

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Speaker 2: I was just reading this morning. The attack yesterday penetrated

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Speaker 2: Israeli defense systems is actually injured several Israeli citizens. And

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Speaker 2: these are anti tank missiles as well as rockets and

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Speaker 2: missiles and others that the Israelis internally acknowledge will absolutely

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Speaker 2: penetrate their air defense systems. And it is why we

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Speaker 2: have so much US muscle that is in the region

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Speaker 2: right now. In fact, I was just reading patriot missile

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Speaker 2: defense systems probably the single most prize asset in the

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Speaker 2: US capabilit at least right now, when we're talking about

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Speaker 2: groups like you know, Hezbola Iran, and we have them

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Speaker 2: in Ukraine, we sent them over there. We also they're

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Speaker 2: very valuable toward the Taiwanese, the Japanese, the South Koreans,

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Speaker 2: and more. On top of the THAD missile defense system

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Speaker 2: which we've already sent, we are scrambling the most patriot

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Speaker 2: defense missile systems that we've ever had to to the

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Speaker 2: Middle East, basically drawing away assets that the Asian people

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Speaker 2: are allies in Asia and even the Ukrainians are scrambling for.

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Speaker 2: Also in highlighting there are always trade offs in conflict,

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Speaker 2: especially when you're talking about zero sum things like highly

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Speaker 2: valuable missile systems. The point is that with the immense

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Speaker 2: amount of US military assets now in the region, as

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Speaker 2: well as the missiles and more the evacuations, we also

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Speaker 2: see on top of these new flyers that have been dropped,

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Speaker 2: urging civilians to urge all the piece. The set pieces

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Speaker 2: are in place for one or two or three things

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Speaker 2: two go wrong and we are in a totally completely

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Speaker 2: different situation. The war right now is only a month

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Speaker 2: and a week old, five weeks or something old.

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Speaker 3: That there's almost nothing you know, in terms of conflict.

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Speaker 2: And you ask the Israelis and what do they say,

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Speaker 2: We're preparing for a year's long low intensity conflict.

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Speaker 3: You ask that Hesbola and all them like what, you know?

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Speaker 3: What's the situation? What can change? For now?

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Speaker 2: In nosraela has not escalated, but these crossfire border things,

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Speaker 2: it only takes one or two one anti tank missile

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Speaker 2: fired from Hezbolah. Let's say it kills fifty guys. It's

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Speaker 2: one wrong target, fifty sixty people. Israelis don't have no

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Speaker 2: choice to respond, and we're in it. The Trey yanst

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Speaker 2: Over at Fox News put it pretty succinctly. He was

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Speaker 2: like Hesbola's climbing the escalation ladder. And you know, based

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Speaker 2: on his reporting, he's very clear he's hearing from the Israelis.

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Speaker 2: They may not stay silent for much longer. This, this

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Speaker 2: could enter a new phase of quote unquote defense.

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Speaker 1: Well, and that report from Astios to me is chilling

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Speaker 1: that even administration officials here are worried that Israel actually

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Speaker 1: wants to provoke that broader war because you know, this

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Speaker 1: is something we talked about with regard to Ukraine that

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Speaker 1: I'm sure you guys heard us discussing at some point

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Speaker 1: in this show. The fact that yeah, a Lens he

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Speaker 1: has no problem, you know, really being incredibly provocative, striking

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Speaker 1: targets in Moscow, in Russia, including in Moscow, and you know,

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Speaker 1: we're going to talk about the North Stream pipeline.

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Speaker 4: Looks like they were behind it after all. Surprise, surprise.

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Speaker 1: He's not afraid of doing those things because he actually

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Speaker 1: wants the bigger war. He wants us to be drawn

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Speaker 1: in on his side, because frankly, that at this point especially,

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Speaker 1: is the only way they really have a shot to

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Speaker 1: actually win. There's some similar dynamics here with israel I

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Speaker 1: mean net Nyahu and the Israeli government overall has long

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Speaker 1: despised Ron, you know, been incredibly aggressive. They hated the

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Speaker 1: Iranian nuclear deal and the reduction and the intentions that

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Speaker 1: that represented. That's you'll recall during the Obama administration, net

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Speaker 1: Nyahu travels here gives the speech before Congress incredibly partisan.

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Speaker 1: That's when you start to see this partisan split with

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Speaker 1: regard to Israel. So when you even have Biden administration

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Speaker 1: officials who were very encouraged by the fact that in

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Speaker 1: that big speech that Soralla, the head of Hezbolah gave

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Speaker 1: that he you know, is the normal sort of like

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Speaker 1: threatening rhetoric but no actual concrete commitment to any specific actions.

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Speaker 4: They were encouraged by that.

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Speaker 1: They felt like that was partly the result of them

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Speaker 1: working their contacts in Lebanon and trying to diffuse things

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Speaker 1: on that side. They're actually really fearful that Israel is

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Speaker 1: going to force Hesbela's hand. Hesbel is kind of caught

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Speaker 1: between two places. I mean again, listen, remember, analysis is

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Speaker 1: not justification. It's just important to understand how, you know,

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Speaker 1: how people are thinking about things.

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Speaker 4: So they have Lebanon.

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Speaker 1: The domestic economy is a mess, it's sort of in

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Speaker 1: political freefall as well, so the general population there doesn't

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Speaker 1: necessarily want to be involved in war because they've got

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Speaker 1: enough going on and they've got enough suffering on their

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Speaker 1: hands as it is, which is why part of why

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Speaker 1: you've got Yuev Goalan directly speaking to the civilians of

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Speaker 1: Lebanon and threatening them directly. On the other hand, HESBLA

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Speaker 1: also has to keep their sort of like street cred

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Speaker 1: as you know, Islamic resistance fighters, and there's only so

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Speaker 1: much crap that they can take from Israel without getting

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Speaker 1: more involved and escalating again up the chain. So that's

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Speaker 1: part of why this is such an incredibly incredibly volatile situation.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's really well said. Let's go and put the

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Speaker 2: next one up there on the screen. I just wanted

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Speaker 2: to again highlight this. Seven Israeli troops wounded ten others

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Speaker 2: along the border. IDF has not released full casualty numbers,

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Speaker 2: but we know it's the number is less than at

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Speaker 2: least there is more than at least five of IDF

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Speaker 2: soldiers been killed by Hezbolah. I mean, just imagine that

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Speaker 2: a lot of this is not being escalated yet in

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Speaker 2: terms of the rhetoric and all of that, but you know,

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Speaker 2: the pieces are in place, as we showed you from

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Speaker 2: the Israeli Defense Minister and others, and things could pop

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Speaker 2: off really at any moment. Let's go and put this

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Speaker 2: one up there as well. There's also a tit for

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Speaker 2: tech game going on right now. US Air Force actually

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Speaker 2: carried out two new strikes just yesterday against Iranian proxy

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Speaker 2: targets in Eastern Syria. They bombed a weapons and AMMO

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Speaker 2: depot by Iranian backed militias, which largely have been responsible

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Speaker 2: for the continued attacks on US forces. I don't think

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Speaker 2: we can underscore how these low grade attacks and all

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Speaker 2: this is in nightmare and a disaster just waiting to happen.

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Speaker 2: I mean, you know, it's one rocket, one missile after another.

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Speaker 2: We have multiple troops with TBIs, these guys, some of

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Speaker 2: them even had to go back to Germany for healthcare.

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Speaker 2: Most have been returned. I believe all have been returned

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Speaker 2: at least to active duties.

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Speaker 3: So that's great.

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Speaker 2: Nobody's been killed or injured yet, but are seriously injured

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Speaker 2: or wounded yet. But you know, it's only a matter

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Speaker 2: of time when you have people sitting out there basically

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Speaker 2: in the middle of the Syrian desert. It's not like

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Speaker 2: we have a large force or any of them around them.

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Speaker 2: They've been vulnerable from the beginning. And the crazy part

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Speaker 2: to me, Crystal, is all these guys are there ostensibly

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Speaker 2: on an anti Isis mission. I think we won against

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Speaker 2: Isis last time I checked. And you know, it's just

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Speaker 2: a bit built under this ridiculous fallacy that just because

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Speaker 2: we're just we have to sit there for basically all

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Speaker 2: of eternity, just to make sure Isis doesn't come back.

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Speaker 3: Don't forget this.

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Speaker 2: Syria is ruled by Bush are all asade, okay, and

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Speaker 2: he doesn't want us there, So did anyone in Congress ever,

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Speaker 2: you know, authorize this. It's one of those that had happened,

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Speaker 2: and we just happened to stay there. And now these

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Speaker 2: guys are incredibly incredibly vulnerable, so the Biden administration not

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Speaker 2: pulling them back. We also have all these troops all

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Speaker 2: across Iraq, and it's just it's a disaster waiting to happen.

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Speaker 2: I guess I keep using that phrase, but it's just

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Speaker 2: because you can see the extraordinary vulnerability and then you know,

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Speaker 2: once a US soldier or US service member is killed,

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Speaker 2: it's game on. I mean, it's just one of those

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Speaker 2: where and why would we want that situation. We should

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Speaker 2: avoid that at all costs. But we're not doing anything

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Speaker 2: to do it because at this point the Republicans and

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Speaker 2: neocons and others are probably a lot of Democrats who

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Speaker 2: would be like, oh, it's surrender to pull our troops

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Speaker 2: out of Syria.

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Speaker 3: I'm like, well, it's not surrenders, like, it's just common sense.

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Speaker 2: At least pull them back to a rack where we've

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Speaker 2: got more military capabilities as opposed to sitting ducks in

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Speaker 2: the middle of the desert.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, that's right.

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Speaker 1: And at the same time, probably both because of this

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Speaker 1: risk of a broader conflagration and also because of the

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Speaker 1: you know, civilian just humanity in crisis that is unfolding

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Speaker 1: on the ground in Gaza at the hands of the

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Speaker 1: Israeli military. This was the first Western leader, Emmanuel Macron,

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Speaker 1: President of France, has come out and officially called for

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Speaker 1: a ceasefire and a direct cessation of hostilities in an

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Speaker 1: interview with the BBC.

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Speaker 4: Let's take a listen to what he had to say.

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Speaker 6: Day one.

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Speaker 7: We say that this reaction and the fight against rourism,

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Speaker 7: because it is led by a democracy, should be compliant

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Speaker 7: with international rules. All of war and imanity and international law,

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Speaker 7: and day after day what we saw is a permanent

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Speaker 7: bombing of civilians in Gether And I think it's it's

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Speaker 7: very important to say the whole story, but I think

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Speaker 7: this is the only solution we have. This is fire,

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Speaker 7: because it's impossible to explain. We want who fight against robism,

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Speaker 7: my coming innocent people. I'm not a judged, I'm a

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Speaker 7: head of state. I just remind everybody international law. I

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Speaker 7: call for this his fire.

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Speaker 1: That last response thereas I'm not a judge, I'm a

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Speaker 1: head of state and I'm calling for a ceasefire was

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Speaker 1: in response to a question where she asked him is

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Speaker 1: Israel committing war crimes? And sagara, I mean, the reality

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Speaker 1: of what Israel is doing on the ground is undeniable.

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Speaker 1: You know the number of international groups who have said

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Speaker 1: war crimes are being committed. These are blatant violations of

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Speaker 1: international law. You cannot target civilians. I mean the civilian

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Speaker 1: death toll is somewhere between eighty and ninety percent of

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Speaker 1: the casualties in Gaza. So for these heads of state

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Speaker 1: who have talked about you know, international rule based order

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Speaker 1: and their commitment to humanitarian causes, it becomes increasingly difficult

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Speaker 1: to stand by and watch what Israel is doing and

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Speaker 1: not come out with this position.

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Speaker 4: So the fact that you have, you know, the head.

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Speaker 1: Of France, the first country in the West, really coming

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Speaker 1: out and calling for a ceasefire is extraordinary. Bb reacted

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Speaker 1: to it very negatively and was you know, pushing back,

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Speaker 1: et cetera, et cetera. But I think it's an incredibly

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Speaker 1: noteworthy development.

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Speaker 3: Well, of course it's no worthy and people should remember

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Speaker 3: this too.

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Speaker 2: You know, despite what some of the rhetoric is, the

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Speaker 2: European populations have never been nearly as pro Israel as

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Speaker 2: the US, and in fact, in twenty fourteen was a

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Speaker 2: pretty big turning point against Israel in terms of the

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Speaker 2: people taking the steeds streets. BDS has actually been far

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Speaker 2: more widely accepted amongst a lot of their population. I'm

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Speaker 2: not just talking about Arabs and refugees who have been

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Speaker 2: let into Europe over the last twenty five years. The

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Speaker 2: Median European thinks about Israel far far differently than an

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Speaker 2: American citizen. The quote bond and all of that there,

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Speaker 2: politically is not the same. So their actual small d

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Speaker 2: democratic incentives are a lot different than our politicians in

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Speaker 2: terms of the organized like political efforts to make sure

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Speaker 2: that this stuff doesn't happen, but really in terms of

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Speaker 2: how they're own populations are going to respond. And of

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Speaker 2: course it's highly noteworthy because I think the Europeans in

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Speaker 2: particular are caught in the biggest bind. They have spent

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Speaker 2: the last two years screeching about Ukraine to try and

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Speaker 2: get us to pay all their bills, using all the

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Speaker 2: rhetoric of oh, Russia's destroying Ukraine and all of this.

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Speaker 2: Look it is true, certainly, but I'm saying they've been

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Speaker 2: using moralistic arguments in order to justify their extraordinary expense

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Speaker 2: and then also pressuring us. So they're actually caught in

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Speaker 2: the hardest place because Ukraine matters way more to them

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Speaker 2: than it does for us. We can turn our back

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Speaker 2: on it's going to have no impact, but you know,

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Speaker 2: the fate of Ukraine is far more important to France, Germany,

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Speaker 2: the UK and others. So they especially feel in a

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Speaker 2: very difficult position as to how they navigate this conflict,

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Speaker 2: especially whenever everything is relied upon the international rule of law,

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Speaker 2: about the laws of war, about the Dava Convention and

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Speaker 2: all of that, and so you know, Macron is going

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Speaker 2: in the more logical direction I think for a European

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Speaker 2: head of state, because I think he sees some of

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Speaker 2: the incongruity for that.

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Speaker 1: Right now, Yeah, I don't want to give them too

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Speaker 1: much credit because they're also the ones that outright banned

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Speaker 1: propels to be in protests, So don't want to go

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Speaker 1: too far. But yes, the fact that he called firsteas

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Speaker 1: fire is noteworthy, and you know, I think it also

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Speaker 1: sober to your point, like the hypocrisy between how they

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Speaker 1: talked about Russia and Ukraine versus what we're seeing unfolding

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Speaker 1: and what Israel is doing in Gaza is just it's

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Speaker 1: so naked. What Russia has done in Ukraine is horrific,

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Speaker 1: And none of these leaders had any trouble saying that,

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Speaker 1: you know, war crimes and let's let's file charges against

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Speaker 1: Putin and you know, bring them up on charges that

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Speaker 1: the Hey, they.

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Speaker 4: Didn't have any trouble with that.

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Speaker 1: But now what Israel's doing in Gaza, I mean, it

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Speaker 1: makes what Russia did in Ukraine pale in comparison, just

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Speaker 1: by the numbers, the number of kids killed, the number

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Speaker 1: of journalists killed, the number of un workers killed. The

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Speaker 1: short period of time, the amount of destruction on the ground.

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Speaker 1: I mean, there's no comparison here the attacks on infrastructure.

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Speaker 1: I mean, how much do we hear about like, oh,

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Speaker 1: it's you know, it's such a crime to attack civilian

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Speaker 1: infrastructure or electricity and mess with this. In Ukraine, they've

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Speaker 1: a complete siege on all of Gaza for the entirety

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Speaker 1: of this war. So at some point, if you have

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Speaker 1: even a modicum of self respect, you've got to acknowledge

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Speaker 1: some of what is going on. This is a good

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Speaker 1: place to transition to what is happening right now on

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Speaker 1: the ground in Gaza City. So Israel has made a

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Speaker 1: big show of trying to claim we'll get to those

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Speaker 1: claims a little bit more in a moment. That Hamas

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Speaker 1: is operating underneath of this hospital, Al Shifa Hospital. This

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Speaker 1: is the main hospital remaining operating in Gaza City. They

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Speaker 1: have hundreds of patients there at one point. How many

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Speaker 1: people have fled at this point, But at one point

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Speaker 1: they were sheltering tens of thousands of Palestinians who had

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Speaker 1: to flee their homes, who thought this would be a

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Speaker 1: safe place because it is a hospital, and hospitals are

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Speaker 1: supposed to be protected under international law. Let me go

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Speaker 1: ahead and play for you. So Israel now has based

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Speaker 1: surrounded this hospital. They are threatening it with destruction. Already

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Speaker 1: they have no fuel for the generators. So you have

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Speaker 1: horrific situations unfolding. Patients already dying from a lack of

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Speaker 1: care and lack of electricity. Let's go ahead and hear

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Speaker 1: what one doctor there in the hospital said is unfolding

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Speaker 1: right now.

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Speaker 8: Also there's a sniper attack for patients from the inside

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Speaker 8: the hospital. One of them have the dentual Diequinsnic and

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Speaker 8: the Evo Portovigia, and the other one he has a

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Speaker 8: denture in the atomats. Some of the people which actually

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Speaker 8: go outside the hospital, they want to go their sell.

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Speaker 8: They bumped them. Also, they bumped a family. There is

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Speaker 8: no water, there is no food, so our humaitic sustaine.

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Speaker 8: We have the two in unit, the patient by actually

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Speaker 8: because the incubator it's not working because there is no eclicity.

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Speaker 8: Also we have the adult patient and the U can

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Speaker 8: die because the ventilator is shut down because there is

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Speaker 8: no exlicity. We can see actually the smoking, the smoke

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Speaker 8: around the hospital. They hit everything around the hospital and

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Speaker 8: they have the hospital many times, but we want someone

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Speaker 8: to give us the guarantee that we can evacuate the

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Speaker 8: patient because we have about six hundred in patient person

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Speaker 8: we need a medical care and we need to evaculation.

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Speaker 8: The problem is to be sure that we can evacuate

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Speaker 8: the new need patient because we have about fifty seven

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Speaker 8: to forty kids of the new needs the premature baby,

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Speaker 8: we have about seventeen other patients in the ico, and

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Speaker 8: we have about six hundred admit the patient pretty operated,

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Speaker 8: which need a medical care.

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Speaker 1: Some of the images that are coming out of this

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Speaker 1: hospital are just like, I don't even know what to say.

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Speaker 1: One in particular put this up on the screen. So

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Speaker 1: they have a high number thirty seven babies who were

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Speaker 1: born premature, some of them because their mothers actually were

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Speaker 1: killed in Israeli air strikes and they had to be

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Speaker 1: cut out of their dead mother's bellies. Some of them,

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Speaker 1: you know, the stress of what's going on also can

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Speaker 1: trigger premature birth. So that's part of why they have

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Speaker 1: such a large number of premature babies in this hospital.

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Speaker 1: Thirty seven of them without electricity, had to be removed

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Speaker 1: from their incubators. This is a picture of them wrapped

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Speaker 1: in blankets I also read that doctors were trying to

436
00:22:18,240 --> 00:22:21,199
Speaker 1: put hot bottles of water around them to try to

437
00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:24,359
Speaker 1: keep them warm, because they can't regulate their own temperatures

438
00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:27,040
Speaker 1: when they're born at this early age. And at the

439
00:22:27,119 --> 00:22:31,080
Speaker 1: time of this this was as of yesterday, at least

440
00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:35,680
Speaker 1: three babies had already died because of the lack of electricity.

441
00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:42,080
Speaker 1: I mean, I saw doctors operating using iPhone flashlights because

442
00:22:42,080 --> 00:22:44,960
Speaker 1: there are no lights on. They don't have clean water

443
00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:48,520
Speaker 1: in terms of basic sanitation, also just in terms of

444
00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:52,440
Speaker 1: being able to drink, the amount of you know, diseases

445
00:22:52,520 --> 00:22:55,679
Speaker 1: and bugs and whoreror. There are dead bodies piled up

446
00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:58,200
Speaker 1: at the entrances because they can't do anything with them.

447
00:22:58,280 --> 00:23:01,320
Speaker 1: It's just you cannot imagine in the scenes of horror

448
00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:04,360
Speaker 1: that are unfolding at this hospital. And you know, truly,

449
00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:09,359
Speaker 1: like we talk about heroic human beings doing things that

450
00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:13,080
Speaker 1: are unimagined, Like these doctors know that their lives are

451
00:23:13,119 --> 00:23:16,040
Speaker 1: at risk, and they have been working round the clock

452
00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:19,800
Speaker 1: for weeks and weeks now in absolutely impossible conditions, and

453
00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:22,399
Speaker 1: yet many of them are still there doing whatever they

454
00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:24,359
Speaker 1: possibly can to try to keep these patients alive.

455
00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:27,399
Speaker 2: Yeah, so the Israelis are claiming that, and we've showed

456
00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:30,560
Speaker 2: this graphic before that the hospital itself covers some of

457
00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:33,600
Speaker 2: the biggest command and control facilities for Hamas, which is

458
00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:35,960
Speaker 2: built like an underground network beneath that.

459
00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:37,920
Speaker 3: There's no way to know whether it's true. Hamas says

460
00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:38,600
Speaker 3: it's not true.

461
00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:41,439
Speaker 2: The director of the hospital said that it's not true,

462
00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:43,919
Speaker 2: although I find it difficult to believe a director of

463
00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:46,119
Speaker 2: the hospital would be allowed to remain in place if

464
00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:47,919
Speaker 2: he wasn't also that so I have no idea.

465
00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:50,560
Speaker 1: We also have the lots of doctors, you know, if

466
00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:53,520
Speaker 1: people mistrust Palestinians because they might be Hamas, a lot

467
00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:55,840
Speaker 1: of the doctors here with doctors.

468
00:23:55,520 --> 00:23:57,159
Speaker 4: Without borders, they're international.

469
00:23:57,160 --> 00:23:59,280
Speaker 1: I mean we've seen you know, British doctors and other

470
00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:02,600
Speaker 1: for nationals who were talking about this. We're saying, you know,

471
00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:05,480
Speaker 1: I wouldn't be here if this was some Hamas headquarters.

472
00:24:06,320 --> 00:24:10,040
Speaker 1: So those Israeli claims I also just would put out there.

473
00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:13,560
Speaker 1: Israel at this point has claimed that like everything is Amas.

474
00:24:13,640 --> 00:24:16,000
Speaker 1: You know, all of these houses that they destroyed, all

475
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:19,280
Speaker 1: of the hospitals, they already attacked, all of the schools,

476
00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:21,919
Speaker 1: they already attacked. They came out recently and said the

477
00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:26,360
Speaker 1: un workers are actually Hamas, so you know, they anything

478
00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:28,920
Speaker 1: that they want to destroy, they just say, oh, it's Amas,

479
00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:31,040
Speaker 1: and you know, we can't really show you the proof,

480
00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:31,800
Speaker 1: but just trust us.

481
00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:33,800
Speaker 2: The only reason I'm inclined to believe it is because

482
00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:36,359
Speaker 2: the pr value of destroying a hospital is so bad

483
00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:38,280
Speaker 2: that there's basically no other reason to go in.

484
00:24:38,320 --> 00:24:40,240
Speaker 4: And they've already so many other arts.

485
00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:45,040
Speaker 2: But I mean, destroying a house in collateral damage because

486
00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:47,080
Speaker 2: you have it's on top of a tunnel, is different

487
00:24:47,119 --> 00:24:49,399
Speaker 2: than surrounding a hospital and trying to take it.

488
00:24:49,440 --> 00:24:50,720
Speaker 3: So look, I don't know if it's true.

489
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:54,000
Speaker 2: According to them, they claim that it's actually completely underneath

490
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:57,040
Speaker 2: the hospital complex. You knowed they have been proven in

491
00:24:57,080 --> 00:24:59,879
Speaker 2: the past Hamas to use the human shields. I'm not

492
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:02,840
Speaker 2: justifying necessarily, like the mass death or any of that.

493
00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:05,399
Speaker 2: I think the US, for example, if the United States

494
00:25:05,480 --> 00:25:08,120
Speaker 2: were to find a terrorist complex that was underneath the hospital.

495
00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:09,000
Speaker 3: I've gone back.

496
00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:11,320
Speaker 2: I've been reading a lot about the counter iis campaigns

497
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:12,359
Speaker 2: is actually very different.

498
00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:14,280
Speaker 3: So one of the rules of the United.

499
00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:16,840
Speaker 2: States always had for at or at least tried to

500
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:19,840
Speaker 2: have with drone warfare, and particularly with killing ISIS leaders

501
00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:21,920
Speaker 2: going after command subjects is that they would wait.

502
00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:23,040
Speaker 3: In some cases were almost a year.

503
00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 2: They would put a subject under surveillance and they would

504
00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:27,359
Speaker 2: wait for them to slip up for the one moment

505
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:29,399
Speaker 2: and they were away from their families so that they

506
00:25:29,400 --> 00:25:32,480
Speaker 2: could kill them. To deny ISIS the opportunity to claim

507
00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:33,480
Speaker 2: that they were killing civilians.

508
00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:35,359
Speaker 3: Obviously a lot of civilians were killed in the.

509
00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:38,320
Speaker 2: Drone campaign, but the counter ISIS campaign was reasonably well

510
00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:41,520
Speaker 2: conducted in terms of reducing civilian casualties, especially when you

511
00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:44,280
Speaker 2: compare it to the Israeli operations. So if it is

512
00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:46,879
Speaker 2: a command and control subject, I think some of the

513
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:49,160
Speaker 2: tactics should really come down or some of the questions

514
00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:51,080
Speaker 2: should come down to the tactics in the way this

515
00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:54,320
Speaker 2: is being subjected. As you said, the doctors claiming that

516
00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:57,080
Speaker 2: there were straight up firefights are going on inside of

517
00:25:57,119 --> 00:26:00,360
Speaker 2: the hospital, that snipers were targeting them. The Israeli say

518
00:26:00,359 --> 00:26:03,280
Speaker 2: that that's not true, that they haven't had any firefight.

519
00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:05,720
Speaker 2: I mean, clearly carnage and all of that is happening.

520
00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:09,120
Speaker 2: They've also claimed that they've delivered fuel to the hospital,

521
00:26:09,119 --> 00:26:12,960
Speaker 2: that the hospital itself or Hamas denied fuel for it,

522
00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:15,920
Speaker 2: so they're putting blame on Hamas for you know, doing it.

523
00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:18,679
Speaker 2: It's one of those where we have unreliable narrators in

524
00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:22,000
Speaker 2: these two situations. But it would make sense if you

525
00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:25,400
Speaker 2: are Hamas to embed yourself deeply in the civilian population

526
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:28,080
Speaker 2: and use the hospital, which is the most emotive place

527
00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:30,520
Speaker 2: that you can, knowing that you're gonna have tons of

528
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:33,040
Speaker 2: collateral damage if somebody tries to take you. I think

529
00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:35,480
Speaker 2: the issue for the Israelis is that they are basically

530
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:38,480
Speaker 2: not caring that much about collateral damage and they're going

531
00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:41,480
Speaker 2: through and practicing. So I think it's a GORDIANKNT situation.

532
00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:45,040
Speaker 2: I genuinely don't know how I genuinely don't know what

533
00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:48,800
Speaker 2: alternative is if you are committed also to destroying Hamas leadership,

534
00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:51,919
Speaker 2: which is is really military is. I think they definitely

535
00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:53,240
Speaker 2: should have made a different.

536
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:54,600
Speaker 4: To punishing the civilian population.

537
00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:56,680
Speaker 1: Sure, but that's what they're committed to, and that's why,

538
00:26:57,280 --> 00:26:59,280
Speaker 1: you know, listen, I don't know. I can't confirm the

539
00:26:59,280 --> 00:27:02,159
Speaker 1: intelligence and just tell you that israelis literally everyone is

540
00:27:02,280 --> 00:27:04,760
Speaker 1: moss that they have killed, and thousands of the people

541
00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:07,080
Speaker 1: they have killed are actually women, children.

542
00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:09,120
Speaker 4: I think seventy percent of.

543
00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:10,880
Speaker 1: The latest death toll, which by the way, the US

544
00:27:10,960 --> 00:27:14,880
Speaker 1: government is now saying is actually undercounted from the health ministry,

545
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:18,240
Speaker 1: I think seventy percent are women, children and the elderly.

546
00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:21,560
Speaker 1: They again said un workers are hamas. So they just

547
00:27:21,680 --> 00:27:24,440
Speaker 1: throw this out there with no proof, and they put

548
00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:27,960
Speaker 1: out these also like totally ridiculous audio recordings, like the

549
00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:30,080
Speaker 1: one that they put out from the hospital previously.

550
00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:30,880
Speaker 4: Which brings me to another point.

551
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:33,639
Speaker 1: Remember how just a few weeks ago, when there was

552
00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:35,680
Speaker 1: that strike in the hospital parking lot and all this

553
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:38,320
Speaker 1: debate about who was behind it, we still don't have

554
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:40,720
Speaker 1: definitive proof on either side.

555
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:44,000
Speaker 4: All of the language, Oh, we would never target a hospital,

556
00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:46,040
Speaker 4: We never target a hospital. Of course we wouldn't.

557
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:48,240
Speaker 1: And now they spent weeks and weeks and weeks and

558
00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:52,280
Speaker 1: weeks trying to develop the case to target this hospital.

559
00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:56,879
Speaker 1: We're already patients have died because of their actions and

560
00:27:56,920 --> 00:28:00,800
Speaker 1: because of the cruelty that they are exhibiting towards.

561
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:02,080
Speaker 4: All of the people of Gaza.

562
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:04,960
Speaker 1: So no, they on the content, they don't care about

563
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:08,320
Speaker 1: pr On the contrary, they actually want it to be.

564
00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:10,000
Speaker 4: As brutal as possible.

565
00:28:10,520 --> 00:28:13,520
Speaker 1: That is the whole objective of what they're doing militarily,

566
00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:17,359
Speaker 1: because otherwise the entirety of their campaign makes no sense.

567
00:28:17,400 --> 00:28:19,399
Speaker 1: And so you know, in addition, like you were pointing

568
00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:23,239
Speaker 1: to Stager, you have multiple doctors in the hospital. Snipers

569
00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:25,880
Speaker 1: are picking off patients inside.

570
00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:26,040
Speaker 4: Of the hospital.

571
00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:29,560
Speaker 1: Quadriplegia was shot in the neck through a window by

572
00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:32,960
Speaker 1: an Israeli sniper, according to the doctors who are there.

573
00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:35,240
Speaker 4: So yeah, I don't take I don't.

574
00:28:35,359 --> 00:28:38,240
Speaker 1: I don't believe a word that Israel says with regards

575
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:41,200
Speaker 1: to this particular hospital or any of the many other hospitals,

576
00:28:41,280 --> 00:28:42,200
Speaker 1: refugee camps.

577
00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:42,440
Speaker 4: Et cetera.

578
00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:44,440
Speaker 3: But they have a word Hamas says either.

579
00:28:44,440 --> 00:28:46,560
Speaker 2: And I am to see international in twenty fifteen, so

580
00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:49,240
Speaker 2: that the hospital was used, at least in some cases

581
00:28:49,280 --> 00:28:52,160
Speaker 2: by Hamas in order to torture people, in order to

582
00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:52,720
Speaker 2: house people.

583
00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 3: So it is a noble let me.

584
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:59,000
Speaker 1: Say, even let me let me say, even if there

585
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:02,840
Speaker 1: are under around Hamas layers under this hospital, which again

586
00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:06,640
Speaker 1: the doctors here say they have seen no sign of.

587
00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:09,680
Speaker 1: Even if that is the case, you can't bomb and

588
00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:14,400
Speaker 1: target these patients, innocent civilians. Babies thirty seven, you know,

589
00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:18,840
Speaker 1: premature babies that are at this hospital, so and your

590
00:29:18,840 --> 00:29:21,760
Speaker 1: words don't mean a lot when again you've already destroyed

591
00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:24,560
Speaker 1: and evacuated all the other hospital. What is every hospital

592
00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:26,840
Speaker 1: in all of Gaza? Are they all hamas?

593
00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:27,240
Speaker 8: Like?

594
00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:30,320
Speaker 1: At a certain point becomes preposterous.

595
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:33,400
Speaker 2: Well, I listen, I think we can come at this

596
00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:36,320
Speaker 2: from different angles. Is Israeli's done themselves any favors by

597
00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:38,959
Speaker 2: claiming everybody's basically declaring it a free fire zone no,

598
00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:41,200
Speaker 2: which makes it very difficult for anybody who doesn't trust

599
00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:42,880
Speaker 2: them to believe a word that they say.

600
00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:44,200
Speaker 3: Have Hamas made it?

601
00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:47,120
Speaker 2: Also so that we have proof that they've used hospitals, yes,

602
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:49,680
Speaker 2: So then it becomes a question of military tactics, and

603
00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:51,400
Speaker 2: I think that's where it's.

604
00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:52,320
Speaker 3: A difficult situation.

605
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:54,520
Speaker 2: As I said in that, I agree, I think the

606
00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:58,640
Speaker 2: US military, I think any other world, a Western style military,

607
00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:00,840
Speaker 2: would not have conducted themselves this way. They would have

608
00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:03,720
Speaker 2: conducted a totally different operation. And to be honest, really,

609
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:05,600
Speaker 2: what the Israelis have done, from what I can tell,

610
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:09,480
Speaker 2: is try to minimize their casualties to absolute zero, such

611
00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:12,200
Speaker 2: that they are willing to take as many civilian casualties

612
00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:15,160
Speaker 2: that there are. Now that might sound smart, and intuitive,

613
00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:19,120
Speaker 2: but actually the US military, specifically in the Point counterinsurgency

614
00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:22,160
Speaker 2: campaign and onward, made the explicit decision, if we're going

615
00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:24,400
Speaker 2: to operate in this type of environment, we're going to

616
00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:27,400
Speaker 2: take military casualties at the expense of trying to take

617
00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:30,040
Speaker 2: at the expense of trying to save civilians. So we

618
00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:32,440
Speaker 2: would have conducted this, I think, completely differently in terms

619
00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:34,840
Speaker 2: of surround, in terms of going in, in terms of

620
00:30:34,880 --> 00:30:37,760
Speaker 2: in some cases like actually just sending bodies in without

621
00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:40,200
Speaker 2: the bombs and trying to clear it out manually, which

622
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:43,800
Speaker 2: again you would take a lot of casualties in that scenario,

623
00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:46,000
Speaker 2: but they would do it just for the purpose of

624
00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:49,000
Speaker 2: trying to maintain as much civilian purpose as much of

625
00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:52,840
Speaker 2: the civilian reducing civilian casualties as much as possible. So

626
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:55,120
Speaker 2: I think we can criticize the tactics, but we do

627
00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:57,680
Speaker 2: have to accept, like there is a core of this,

628
00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:01,040
Speaker 2: there's a small part where there is a legitimate military objective,

629
00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:03,880
Speaker 2: which is destroying Hamasi A. Israelis have decided to do

630
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:05,840
Speaker 2: it in such a way that they just don't care

631
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:08,920
Speaker 2: at all about civilian casualties, or they can pay voice

632
00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:10,640
Speaker 2: to it. I disagree with that I think that's wrong,

633
00:31:10,800 --> 00:31:13,480
Speaker 2: but I do think the military objective itself is true.

634
00:31:13,520 --> 00:31:16,680
Speaker 3: And you know, I mean, we can't say that every place.

635
00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:20,120
Speaker 2: That has a Hamas command and control place is off limits, but.

636
00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:23,360
Speaker 4: They've destroyed like all of Gaza City.

637
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:28,320
Speaker 1: I mean, if this hospital they are arguing, they are arguing,

638
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:33,360
Speaker 1: this particular hospital is like the granddaddy command central of Hamas.

639
00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:36,680
Speaker 1: If that's the case, then why wasn't the focus on

640
00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:38,600
Speaker 1: this hospital to start with? Okay, then you can have

641
00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:41,880
Speaker 1: time to evacuate patients to the other hospitals. Those hospitals

642
00:31:41,920 --> 00:31:44,120
Speaker 1: aren't operating at this point. There is nowhere for these

643
00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:46,120
Speaker 1: patients to go. And by the way, they're being you know,

644
00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:49,120
Speaker 1: killed by sniper fire while they're in the building. And

645
00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:51,600
Speaker 1: also there are reports that the supposed you know, safe

646
00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:54,040
Speaker 1: passage to the south, that they've been bombed and fired

647
00:31:54,080 --> 00:31:58,440
Speaker 1: on there as well. So you know, that's why, listen,

648
00:31:58,640 --> 00:32:01,120
Speaker 1: I just cannot take what the Israelis are saying at

649
00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:01,920
Speaker 1: face value.

650
00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:03,080
Speaker 4: The animation thing.

651
00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:05,520
Speaker 1: That they released that they said was their proof was

652
00:32:05,680 --> 00:32:08,240
Speaker 1: preposterous and silly. We both mocked it at the time

653
00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:11,400
Speaker 1: as being ridiculous. They have offered no public evidence outside

654
00:32:11,400 --> 00:32:16,040
Speaker 1: of these laughable audio recordings. But to your point, even

655
00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:18,960
Speaker 1: if it is true, and this is hamas grand central

656
00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:22,360
Speaker 1: underneath of this thing, you cannot just go in and

657
00:32:22,440 --> 00:32:26,719
Speaker 1: starve and deny them fuel and bomb them and target

658
00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:30,440
Speaker 1: these civilians who have done nothing wrong and these doctors

659
00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:34,240
Speaker 1: who are genuine heroes who are doing their absolute best

660
00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:38,120
Speaker 1: to take care of patients and absolutely impossible circumstances. Even

661
00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:44,200
Speaker 1: the Biden administration is uncomfortable with this hospital being targeted

662
00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:47,680
Speaker 1: in this way. National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan was asked

663
00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:49,960
Speaker 1: about what was going on here at Al Shifa.

664
00:32:50,280 --> 00:32:51,160
Speaker 4: Listen to his response.

665
00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:53,640
Speaker 9: Well, Dan, I think your question just points out the

666
00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:57,120
Speaker 9: difficulty and complexity of this conflict. You've got a terrorist

667
00:32:57,200 --> 00:33:00,520
Speaker 9: group using civilians as human shields, even use sick and

668
00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:04,880
Speaker 9: injured civilians as human shields. And you've got, at the

669
00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:08,480
Speaker 9: same time an Israeli defense force that is seeking to

670
00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:11,920
Speaker 9: try to root out this terrorist group and to make

671
00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:14,840
Speaker 9: sure that it can no longer represent a threat to Israel.

672
00:33:15,240 --> 00:33:19,160
Speaker 9: And the hospital puts this question into stark relief. But

673
00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:21,360
Speaker 9: the bottom line for the United States is that we

674
00:33:21,440 --> 00:33:24,280
Speaker 9: do not want to see firefights in a hospital. We

675
00:33:24,360 --> 00:33:27,560
Speaker 9: do not want to see innocent patients who are sick

676
00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:31,600
Speaker 9: or wounded, be injured or killed in the crossfire.

677
00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:34,560
Speaker 1: Now, do I think that the Netan Yahoo government and

678
00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:37,320
Speaker 1: the IDF cares that Jake Sullivan is weekly out there.

679
00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:38,920
Speaker 4: Like, well, we don't want it to be a subject

680
00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:39,640
Speaker 4: of a firefight.

681
00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:43,600
Speaker 1: No, but you can see even they are very uncomfortable

682
00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:45,400
Speaker 1: with what is unfolding. And part of soccer of what

683
00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:49,880
Speaker 1: I think has happened is Israel's kind of tested the

684
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:51,760
Speaker 1: waters of what they could get away with, you know,

685
00:33:51,800 --> 00:33:54,680
Speaker 1: And that's why the conversation around that the first hospital,

686
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:59,040
Speaker 1: you know, disputed hospital parking lot bombing was so different

687
00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:03,040
Speaker 1: than now over weeks and weeks as they've gotten away

688
00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:05,080
Speaker 1: with Okay, we got away with the complete siege, we

689
00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:07,320
Speaker 1: got away with the bombing of all these civilian targets,

690
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:09,680
Speaker 1: we got away with the bombing of the refugee camp.

691
00:34:09,719 --> 00:34:12,439
Speaker 1: And the IDF dude going on CNN and being like, yeah,

692
00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:13,759
Speaker 1: we know there are civilians there, what are.

693
00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:15,560
Speaker 4: You going to do's? You know, it's war. It's just

694
00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:16,080
Speaker 4: what it is.

695
00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:20,280
Speaker 1: That's how you build the you know, build that ladder

696
00:34:20,680 --> 00:34:22,880
Speaker 1: to where they are now and they know they can

697
00:34:22,920 --> 00:34:25,080
Speaker 1: do whatever they want with impunity and get away.

698
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:27,439
Speaker 4: With it, no matter how brutal, no matter the civilian toll.

699
00:34:27,680 --> 00:34:29,680
Speaker 4: And you know, I think that's where we are.

700
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:32,200
Speaker 2: Well, it's part I mean, I think about it this way,

701
00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:34,680
Speaker 2: where with the hospital and with all of that, at

702
00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:37,440
Speaker 2: each one of these they are chipping away at the

703
00:34:37,480 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 2: ability for the Biden administration to withstand it. I actually

704
00:34:40,200 --> 00:34:42,600
Speaker 2: don't think that this is indefinite. And really what it

705
00:34:42,680 --> 00:34:45,239
Speaker 2: is is that there was an interesting excerpt from two

706
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:49,080
Speaker 2: thousand and twenty one where we had that Gaza operation

707
00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:52,719
Speaker 2: in Franklin Ford's book, and what he describes is how

708
00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:55,279
Speaker 2: at a certain point Biden called bb and he was like,

709
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:58,000
Speaker 2: all right, man, it's enough. And the operation actually ended

710
00:34:58,040 --> 00:35:00,239
Speaker 2: the next day. And so what it was is that,

711
00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:02,440
Speaker 2: you know, the US could take it. They could take it,

712
00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:04,000
Speaker 2: they could take it, but Biden got to a point

713
00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:06,359
Speaker 2: where he's like, I can't take the domestic pressure at

714
00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:07,200
Speaker 2: this point anymore.

715
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:08,359
Speaker 3: You've got to cut it off.

716
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:11,320
Speaker 2: And so I think that the Israelis also are playing

717
00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:13,319
Speaker 2: with fire a bit because at the same time, the

718
00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:16,480
Speaker 2: US administration can only hold really, I think, for so

719
00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:18,600
Speaker 2: long in terms of what the center is when you

720
00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:21,160
Speaker 2: have the massive protests since two thousand and three is

721
00:35:21,320 --> 00:35:24,600
Speaker 2: dominating the conversation. But more importantly, I actually think from

722
00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:27,520
Speaker 2: a big picture perspective, is that this is drawing so

723
00:35:27,680 --> 00:35:31,560
Speaker 2: many military assets that we are in such a point

724
00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:35,440
Speaker 2: of vulnerability where just like Israel drew from Ukraine, we

725
00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:38,959
Speaker 2: are one another Ukraine away from drawing away from Israel.

726
00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:40,560
Speaker 3: At the end of the day, none of this actually

727
00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:43,759
Speaker 3: matters to the US taxpayer. Yes, it may be emotional and.

728
00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:47,000
Speaker 2: All that, but Israel, you know, like Israel and what's

729
00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:49,640
Speaker 2: going on there, has zero impact on the US economy,

730
00:35:49,719 --> 00:35:52,280
Speaker 2: just like Ukraine did. And so for to have all

731
00:35:52,719 --> 00:35:55,239
Speaker 2: of the you know, concentration of these assets and all

732
00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:57,960
Speaker 2: this others, I think that's probably the most realistic scenario.

733
00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:00,200
Speaker 2: And more importantly, what I mean by that is it

734
00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:02,200
Speaker 2: by chipping away, it's going to make it easier to

735
00:36:02,239 --> 00:36:04,640
Speaker 2: walk away from should the time ever come, if it

736
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:07,680
Speaker 2: does come. In terms of political support. That said, I

737
00:36:07,719 --> 00:36:11,000
Speaker 2: don't know. We did watch those Prime Minister Netanyaho discussed

738
00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:12,359
Speaker 2: some of this. Let's take a lesson.

739
00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:16,760
Speaker 10: We offered actually last night to give them enough fuel

740
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:19,279
Speaker 10: to operate the hospital, operate the incubators and so on,

741
00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:22,279
Speaker 10: because we have obviously no battle with patients or with

742
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:26,799
Speaker 10: civilians at all, And I think every civilian death, dead

743
00:36:26,840 --> 00:36:29,800
Speaker 10: baby is a tragedy, but that tragedy should be placed

744
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:33,640
Speaker 10: squarely at the responsibility of Hamas, that is, keeping its

745
00:36:33,680 --> 00:36:39,040
Speaker 10: military installations inside hospitals, its command posts inside hospitals, inside schools,

746
00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:42,800
Speaker 10: inside unra UN facilities, and so on. So we obviously

747
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:44,880
Speaker 10: don't want to give them immunity, but at the same time,

748
00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:48,200
Speaker 10: we're sensitive to this issue. So we offered this help.

749
00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:51,200
Speaker 10: They refuse it, but they want to get fuel that

750
00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:54,160
Speaker 10: they'll take from the hospitals to their tunnels to their

751
00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:57,520
Speaker 10: war machine, the electricity they need to fire the rockets.

752
00:36:57,520 --> 00:37:01,240
Speaker 10: They fire ten thousand rockets as we speak against israel cities,

753
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:05,160
Speaker 10: and they continue to fight from those underground bunkers. So

754
00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:07,640
Speaker 10: what we have to do is separate the two. We'll

755
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:10,040
Speaker 10: try to help those who need it in the hospitals,

756
00:37:10,040 --> 00:37:12,520
Speaker 10: but not help the Hamas war machine.

757
00:37:12,560 --> 00:37:14,480
Speaker 1: So a bit of a contradiction what he's saying there.

758
00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:16,080
Speaker 1: On the one and he's like, yeah, we totally offered

759
00:37:16,120 --> 00:37:17,560
Speaker 1: them fuel, and on the other hand, it's like, well,

760
00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:19,480
Speaker 1: we can't really give them fuel because it's just Hamas

761
00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:21,120
Speaker 1: wants to take it and use it in their tunnels.

762
00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:24,280
Speaker 1: There's a lot of questions about this offer of fuel,

763
00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:26,880
Speaker 1: whether it even happened or not, the amount of fuel

764
00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:29,760
Speaker 1: that was offered. There was one person who saws the hospital,

765
00:37:29,880 --> 00:37:32,560
Speaker 1: you know, that directly rejected it, and another one said,

766
00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:34,000
Speaker 1: I no, Hamas wouldn't let them take it.

767
00:37:34,080 --> 00:37:37,000
Speaker 4: So anyway, this is there, this is his pr is.

768
00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:39,360
Speaker 1: We offered them fuel and you know, Hamas said they

769
00:37:39,400 --> 00:37:41,959
Speaker 1: can't have it. Whether it's true or not hard to say.

770
00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:43,640
Speaker 2: It is difficult to say. And I think it also

771
00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:46,759
Speaker 2: raises why the US, you know, is so skeptical in

772
00:37:46,800 --> 00:37:49,280
Speaker 2: some of these conversations, and more importantly behind the scenes,

773
00:37:49,640 --> 00:37:52,480
Speaker 2: is trying to pressure them. I do think the analysis

774
00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:54,359
Speaker 2: on your part is correct in that nothing is going

775
00:37:54,400 --> 00:37:56,799
Speaker 2: to change. They've chosen the way they want to conduct war.

776
00:37:56,960 --> 00:37:58,759
Speaker 2: It is what it is. Either swallow it or don't.

777
00:37:58,800 --> 00:38:01,279
Speaker 2: And it's actually interesting the support. If you talk to

778
00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:03,680
Speaker 2: people who support Israel and you're like, hey, what what

779
00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:04,279
Speaker 2: was going on there?

780
00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:05,719
Speaker 3: And they're like, yeah, I do. They got to do

781
00:38:05,760 --> 00:38:06,319
Speaker 3: what they got to do.

782
00:38:06,440 --> 00:38:08,080
Speaker 2: They're not trying to talk about it in terms of

783
00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:10,319
Speaker 2: like laws of war or any of that. They're like, yeah,

784
00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:12,480
Speaker 2: I just look, it's us to them, and I support it,

785
00:38:12,520 --> 00:38:14,080
Speaker 2: and you've got to kill a lot of them. And

786
00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:16,640
Speaker 2: I think, actually, here's the thing that's honest. At least

787
00:38:16,719 --> 00:38:18,719
Speaker 2: is honest in terms of what they are saying. I

788
00:38:18,760 --> 00:38:20,600
Speaker 2: also hear it in terms of the vice versa. Some

789
00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:22,080
Speaker 2: people are like, well it would help him us, and

790
00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:24,080
Speaker 2: they're like, yeah, well I care more about Palestinian life

791
00:38:24,080 --> 00:38:26,839
Speaker 2: than I do about degrading this terror organization. And it's

792
00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:28,920
Speaker 2: one of those balances that we just have to have. Again,

793
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:31,719
Speaker 2: I think that's a completely honest and legitimate take. It's

794
00:38:31,760 --> 00:38:35,280
Speaker 2: just those we're all trying to talk in fake language,

795
00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:37,920
Speaker 2: which personally always has driven me nuts.

796
00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:39,520
Speaker 1: But here's the other thing. We're going to talk a

797
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:43,760
Speaker 1: little bit more about this. If your goal is long

798
00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:49,839
Speaker 1: term security for the Israeli people, this is foolish think

799
00:38:49,840 --> 00:38:52,400
Speaker 1: of the radical I mean, this is like a super

800
00:38:52,560 --> 00:38:57,719
Speaker 1: radicalization event that is unfolding. This is not only am

801
00:38:57,760 --> 00:38:59,840
Speaker 1: I going to not going to learn the lessons of

802
00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:02,799
Speaker 1: nine to eleven, the war in Iraq and the war

803
00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:06,319
Speaker 1: on terror, et cetera, but I'm actually going to quadruple

804
00:39:06,400 --> 00:39:10,040
Speaker 1: down on the mistakes that were made that led to

805
00:39:10,080 --> 00:39:12,640
Speaker 1: the blow the development of ices and the blowback that

806
00:39:13,040 --> 00:39:16,000
Speaker 1: we saw in the complete destabilization of this whole reachion.

807
00:39:16,480 --> 00:39:19,759
Speaker 1: I mean, that's what's unfolding here. So even if you

808
00:39:19,800 --> 00:39:21,760
Speaker 1: are like, well, I don't really care about the palace

809
00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:24,279
Speaker 1: and civilians is too bad, whatever, But you know, I

810
00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:26,640
Speaker 1: got to look out for mine first. This is a

811
00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:31,360
Speaker 1: foolish course of action. And it's clear that you know this.

812
00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:34,200
Speaker 1: This goal of oh, we're going to eliminate Hamas number

813
00:39:34,239 --> 00:39:37,959
Speaker 1: one is probably not possible. And number two, they are

814
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:41,960
Speaker 1: not actually executing a military strategy that is targeted at

815
00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:46,399
Speaker 1: that goal. And they have burned any credibility, like all

816
00:39:46,440 --> 00:39:50,360
Speaker 1: of the justified global sympathy outpouring of support for Israel

817
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:53,040
Speaker 1: in the wake of the horrors of October seven. I mean,

818
00:39:53,080 --> 00:39:56,640
Speaker 1: they have burned through that, like there's no tomorrow, to

819
00:39:56,680 --> 00:39:59,759
Speaker 1: the point that even the Biden administration, which you know

820
00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:01,879
Speaker 1: by and showed up and gave Netna who the bear

821
00:40:01,960 --> 00:40:04,759
Speaker 1: hug and Blincoln came and said, hey, I'm here as

822
00:40:04,760 --> 00:40:07,799
Speaker 1: a Jewish person first, that's my primary goal, Like we

823
00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:10,360
Speaker 1: have no red lines for them, et cetera. Even the

824
00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:12,360
Speaker 1: US is starting to get a little nervous and a

825
00:40:12,400 --> 00:40:16,080
Speaker 1: little uncomfortable. Now again, I think that the situation, so

826
00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:19,359
Speaker 1: I wonder if you agree with this, is different than

827
00:40:19,560 --> 00:40:23,040
Speaker 1: the last time when Biden now apparently famously calls NETNA.

828
00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:24,360
Speaker 1: I was like, all right, we got to wrap it up.

829
00:40:24,400 --> 00:40:25,919
Speaker 1: First of all, do we know if that's really true?

830
00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:26,399
Speaker 4: Who knows?

831
00:40:26,440 --> 00:40:28,759
Speaker 1: But anyway, let's assume that it is okay. I think

832
00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:31,759
Speaker 1: the situation is very diff different now too, because the

833
00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:34,759
Speaker 1: emotions in Israel are so high, and because Biebie is

834
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:38,439
Speaker 1: on such political shaky ground that I think it would

835
00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:41,160
Speaker 1: take a lot more than Biden just calling and saying

836
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:43,399
Speaker 1: all right, buddy, wrap it up. I think it would

837
00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:46,560
Speaker 1: take actual like no, you're not going to get these weapons.

838
00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:49,200
Speaker 1: We are going to withhold aid, we are going to

839
00:40:49,320 --> 00:40:51,799
Speaker 1: let some of these un votes go through, like we're

840
00:40:51,800 --> 00:40:56,200
Speaker 1: going to publicly distance ourselves, condemn what you're doing, and

841
00:40:56,320 --> 00:40:59,960
Speaker 1: deny you the weapons that you need to continue these attacks.

842
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:03,080
Speaker 1: I think it would actually take something like that for

843
00:41:03,120 --> 00:41:05,680
Speaker 1: them to change course at this point, in part again

844
00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:08,719
Speaker 1: because of the you know, incredibly shaky ground than that

845
00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:10,400
Speaker 1: Nyahoo is on politically.

846
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:11,719
Speaker 2: It's possible because we also have to break up the

847
00:41:11,719 --> 00:41:14,520
Speaker 2: military operation into phases, so like right now, we're in

848
00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:17,440
Speaker 2: like the destruction and the fighting phase, but next comes

849
00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:19,560
Speaker 2: the security phase, and what does that phase look like?

850
00:41:19,560 --> 00:41:21,880
Speaker 3: We could move to more low intensity compuk.

851
00:41:21,520 --> 00:41:25,319
Speaker 2: That the analogy would be like that Phase two of

852
00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:28,320
Speaker 2: Iraq was after President Bush did mission accomplished. We defeated

853
00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:30,320
Speaker 2: the Iraqi army, we made it all the way to Bagdad,

854
00:41:30,560 --> 00:41:32,480
Speaker 2: we pulled down the thing. It's like, Oh, turns out

855
00:41:32,520 --> 00:41:34,640
Speaker 2: now is when the real war begins. So I think

856
00:41:34,680 --> 00:41:37,680
Speaker 2: that that phase could very much show things differently the

857
00:41:37,719 --> 00:41:39,560
Speaker 2: Israelis also, I mean, they could wrap up, you know,

858
00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:42,640
Speaker 2: conventional military operations pretty quickly, but then they'd have to

859
00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:44,359
Speaker 2: move to the security operations.

860
00:41:44,360 --> 00:41:47,080
Speaker 3: They could say, we cleared out northern Gaza, cleanse.

861
00:41:46,840 --> 00:41:50,120
Speaker 2: The tunnels, We've basically occupied it, and that leads to

862
00:41:50,160 --> 00:41:50,959
Speaker 2: the now what question.

863
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:52,760
Speaker 3: That's really why I always bring up Iraq.

864
00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:54,720
Speaker 2: So I actually think we probably have even more leverage

865
00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:57,040
Speaker 2: during that phase because then they're the ones who are

866
00:41:57,040 --> 00:41:59,719
Speaker 2: now responsible for security. Now there's a lot of diplomacy

867
00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:02,640
Speaker 2: because who's going to govern it not which we're going

868
00:42:02,719 --> 00:42:04,839
Speaker 2: to get to. So in the current phase, I don't

869
00:42:04,840 --> 00:42:07,120
Speaker 2: think anything's going to change. I also do think though

870
00:42:07,120 --> 00:42:09,800
Speaker 2: that it's possible. The Israelis are Look, they're not stupid.

871
00:42:09,920 --> 00:42:12,600
Speaker 2: They also know that a lot of international capital and

872
00:42:12,640 --> 00:42:15,160
Speaker 2: political capital is being burned and they probably want to

873
00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:17,279
Speaker 2: clean this up in the next month or so. They've

874
00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:20,520
Speaker 2: been pretty militaryly successful. I'm talking about the like matt

875
00:42:20,600 --> 00:42:23,759
Speaker 2: the bombing campaign, hospitals and all that. They have their

876
00:42:23,880 --> 00:42:26,200
Speaker 2: zone that they've declared, and they're just going to occupy,

877
00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:28,960
Speaker 2: cut off and level as much as they can and

878
00:42:29,000 --> 00:42:31,279
Speaker 2: they can try and have their mission accomplished moment. I

879
00:42:31,320 --> 00:42:35,040
Speaker 2: actually think what really awaits them for the danger that

880
00:42:35,080 --> 00:42:37,759
Speaker 2: awaits them is nothing that's happening right now, especially with

881
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:40,279
Speaker 2: the way they've chosen to conduct war. It's, you know,

882
00:42:40,400 --> 00:42:44,280
Speaker 2: day two after their mission accomplished, Now what security operations?

883
00:42:44,360 --> 00:42:45,200
Speaker 3: Who's going to govern this?

884
00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:49,319
Speaker 2: The PA Those are the big meta questions, and that's

885
00:42:49,320 --> 00:42:53,440
Speaker 2: what leads exactly what you've flagged and pointed out counterinsurgency,

886
00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:56,480
Speaker 2: a massive terror campaign. You know, in terms of the

887
00:42:56,480 --> 00:43:00,600
Speaker 2: big diplomatic questions between Iran, Saudi Arabia, what's politically acceptable

888
00:43:00,880 --> 00:43:03,799
Speaker 2: to the Arab world, who's going to fund this new organization,

889
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:05,000
Speaker 2: who's going to elect it?

890
00:43:05,560 --> 00:43:06,200
Speaker 3: The UN.

891
00:43:06,320 --> 00:43:09,320
Speaker 2: It's one of those where those questions actually become stickier,

892
00:43:09,360 --> 00:43:12,480
Speaker 2: in my opinion, would lead to much more prolonged and

893
00:43:12,800 --> 00:43:14,040
Speaker 2: dangerous conflict in the future.

894
00:43:14,160 --> 00:43:15,399
Speaker 4: Let's talk about that in one minute.

895
00:43:15,400 --> 00:43:17,800
Speaker 1: There's one more piece of Al Chifa that I just

896
00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:20,560
Speaker 1: want to get to before we move on to you

897
00:43:20,600 --> 00:43:23,080
Speaker 1: know what this Raelis are saying at this point about

898
00:43:23,120 --> 00:43:25,640
Speaker 1: the future of Gaza, which is again another like rebuke

899
00:43:25,680 --> 00:43:28,920
Speaker 1: and humiliation of the Biden administration. But just to keep

900
00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:31,640
Speaker 1: the focus on the human beings who are involved here,

901
00:43:32,200 --> 00:43:36,000
Speaker 1: there was a doctor who doctor Hammam Aloe, who was

902
00:43:36,040 --> 00:43:39,000
Speaker 1: a physician in aphrology at the hospital. He was one

903
00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:40,640
Speaker 1: of the people who was doing you know, his English

904
00:43:40,719 --> 00:43:43,279
Speaker 1: language speaker, was doing a lot of press interviews to

905
00:43:43,320 --> 00:43:47,160
Speaker 1: talk about the dire situation on the ground. He was, unfortunately,

906
00:43:47,200 --> 00:43:50,640
Speaker 1: just killed by an airstrike. I believe this was yesterday

907
00:43:50,680 --> 00:43:52,759
Speaker 1: morning with his father in their house which is right

908
00:43:52,800 --> 00:43:55,520
Speaker 1: next to Al Shifa Hospital. This is Ryan Grim actually

909
00:43:55,520 --> 00:43:57,120
Speaker 1: tweeted the sound. I'll read a little bit of this.

910
00:43:57,280 --> 00:44:00,440
Speaker 1: His mother is also a doctor. She is trapped with

911
00:44:00,480 --> 00:44:03,600
Speaker 1: other relatives including children, in the vicinity of the house.

912
00:44:03,840 --> 00:44:05,920
Speaker 1: This was again as of yesterday. They were unable to

913
00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:08,760
Speaker 1: move any attempt to move comes under heavy Israeli fire

914
00:44:09,680 --> 00:44:12,200
Speaker 1: people polled one of his last I think this may

915
00:44:12,239 --> 00:44:15,840
Speaker 1: have been his last interview that he gave with Amy

916
00:44:15,880 --> 00:44:20,600
Speaker 1: Goodman on Democracy Now, talking about why he decided to

917
00:44:20,680 --> 00:44:24,040
Speaker 1: stay at the hospital, knowing very well that it could

918
00:44:24,120 --> 00:44:25,120
Speaker 1: be a death sentence.

919
00:44:25,160 --> 00:44:26,680
Speaker 4: Le's take a listener to what he had to say.

920
00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:29,480
Speaker 3: Why don't you go with your family south?

921
00:44:30,320 --> 00:44:34,359
Speaker 6: And if I go, who treats my patients? They are

922
00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:39,320
Speaker 6: not animals? We have that I to receive proper health. Scared,

923
00:44:39,719 --> 00:44:41,719
Speaker 6: do you think I went to minician school and for

924
00:44:41,880 --> 00:44:46,280
Speaker 6: my postic graduate degrees for a total of fourteen years,

925
00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:49,920
Speaker 6: so I think only about my life and not my patience.

926
00:44:51,440 --> 00:44:54,920
Speaker 6: I'm asking you, ma'am, do you think this is the

927
00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:57,200
Speaker 6: reason why I went to midd school to think only

928
00:44:57,239 --> 00:45:02,920
Speaker 6: about my life? This is another reason why I became aductive.

929
00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:05,879
Speaker 1: Incredibly sad that he has now been killed in an

930
00:45:05,960 --> 00:45:09,319
Speaker 1: Israeli airstrike, and you know, just speaks to some of

931
00:45:09,360 --> 00:45:11,520
Speaker 1: the real heroism that is going on in the ground

932
00:45:11,520 --> 00:45:13,520
Speaker 1: and soccera. I feel like you're seeing like the best

933
00:45:13,520 --> 00:45:15,960
Speaker 1: in the worst of human nature right now brought out

934
00:45:16,040 --> 00:45:17,879
Speaker 1: in this conflict. I guess that's the way that war

935
00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:18,360
Speaker 1: always is.

936
00:45:18,440 --> 00:45:19,680
Speaker 3: That's the way war always is.

937
00:45:19,719 --> 00:45:22,279
Speaker 2: That's right, And yeah, I mean you can't forget any

938
00:45:22,320 --> 00:45:24,360
Speaker 2: of the innocents that were caught up in all this.

939
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:25,640
Speaker 3: In fact, you know, Biden.

940
00:45:25,400 --> 00:45:29,400
Speaker 2: Revealed yesterday there is a three year old American baby

941
00:45:29,600 --> 00:45:33,200
Speaker 2: citizen whose parents were killed on October seventh, who's currently

942
00:45:33,200 --> 00:45:34,560
Speaker 2: being held by Hamas.

943
00:45:34,600 --> 00:45:37,440
Speaker 3: Which is that poor child.

944
00:45:37,200 --> 00:45:39,680
Speaker 2: And there's I mean, she's one of I think we

945
00:45:39,719 --> 00:45:41,799
Speaker 2: don't know the gender of the child, but there are

946
00:45:42,160 --> 00:45:45,520
Speaker 2: multiple other children also were being held without their parents.

947
00:45:45,560 --> 00:45:47,480
Speaker 2: You can only hope they're being cared for too. It's

948
00:45:47,600 --> 00:45:48,600
Speaker 2: just a terrible situation.

949
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:54,360
Speaker 1: All right, Let's get on to what you were alluding to, Sagar,

950
00:45:54,480 --> 00:45:56,840
Speaker 1: which is this big question. All right, you bomb the

951
00:45:56,840 --> 00:46:00,560
Speaker 1: hell out of Gaza, You killed all these civilians, you know,

952
00:46:00,719 --> 00:46:03,399
Speaker 1: declared mission accomplished. What happens now?

953
00:46:03,840 --> 00:46:04,000
Speaker 4: Now?

954
00:46:04,000 --> 00:46:08,239
Speaker 1: The Biden administration has increasingly said two things. Number one,

955
00:46:09,080 --> 00:46:13,040
Speaker 1: it would be a big mistake for Israel to reoccupy Gaza.

956
00:46:13,480 --> 00:46:17,839
Speaker 1: And number two, they've recently been pushing this more aggressively.

957
00:46:18,280 --> 00:46:22,279
Speaker 1: We think the Palestinian authority should be the ones who

958
00:46:22,360 --> 00:46:25,200
Speaker 1: are tasked with some at least of the governance of

959
00:46:25,320 --> 00:46:28,960
Speaker 1: the Gaza strip In a new interview, BB go ahead

960
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:31,520
Speaker 1: and rejects both of those things. Will take a listen

961
00:46:31,520 --> 00:46:32,319
Speaker 1: to what he has to say.

962
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:35,799
Speaker 10: Gaza has to make sure that we it's not a

963
00:46:35,840 --> 00:46:40,160
Speaker 10: threat to Israel. We said destroy Hamas, and for that,

964
00:46:41,239 --> 00:46:44,000
Speaker 10: if we want to have peace, we have to destroy Hamas.

965
00:46:44,160 --> 00:46:46,759
Speaker 10: This is what Israel must do, and this is what

966
00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:47,480
Speaker 10: Israel will do.

967
00:46:47,600 --> 00:46:50,399
Speaker 7: Would you accept an international force, mister Prime minister, would

968
00:46:50,440 --> 00:46:52,520
Speaker 7: you accept?

969
00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:55,759
Speaker 10: I think that the only force right now that can

970
00:46:55,800 --> 00:47:00,879
Speaker 10: guarantee that Hamas, that terrorism is not not reappear and

971
00:47:01,200 --> 00:47:04,560
Speaker 10: take over Gaza again is the Israeli military. So overall

972
00:47:04,680 --> 00:47:07,719
Speaker 10: military responsibility will have to be in Israel. As far

973
00:47:07,760 --> 00:47:10,720
Speaker 10: as the civilian management of Gaza, we need to see

974
00:47:11,320 --> 00:47:14,840
Speaker 10: the following two things. Gaza has to be demilitarized and

975
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:18,200
Speaker 10: Gaza has to be deradicalized. And I think so far

976
00:47:18,640 --> 00:47:23,640
Speaker 10: we haven't seen any Palestinian force, including the Palestinian authority,

977
00:47:23,840 --> 00:47:27,080
Speaker 10: that is able to do it. They teach their children

978
00:47:27,080 --> 00:47:30,200
Speaker 10: to hate Israel. They're not fighting terrorists, they're paying for slag.

979
00:47:30,600 --> 00:47:34,239
Speaker 10: That is, the more terrorists, Palestinian terrorists murdered Jews, the

980
00:47:34,239 --> 00:47:36,799
Speaker 10: more they get paid. And to this Day, thirty six

981
00:47:36,920 --> 00:47:40,360
Speaker 10: days after the word savagery perpetrated on the Jewish people.

982
00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:44,839
Speaker 10: Since the Holocaust, the Palestinian Authority president has yet refuses

983
00:47:44,880 --> 00:47:48,520
Speaker 10: to condemn the savagery. So you know, we need a

984
00:47:48,640 --> 00:47:58,080
Speaker 10: different authority, we need a different administration, surely to say Chris,

985
00:47:58,200 --> 00:47:59,600
Speaker 10: and I think it's surely to say, but I could

986
00:47:59,600 --> 00:48:02,759
Speaker 10: say one the first task we have to achieve is

987
00:48:02,840 --> 00:48:05,480
Speaker 10: defeat Comas. The first task the Allies had to achieve

988
00:48:05,880 --> 00:48:09,920
Speaker 10: before they could reconstruct Germany was to defeat the Nazis.

989
00:48:09,560 --> 00:48:11,960
Speaker 1: So we get another World War I vio analogy there.

990
00:48:12,000 --> 00:48:14,680
Speaker 1: I mean, listen, there are a lot of practical reasons

991
00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:18,440
Speaker 1: why the Palestinian Authority is likely unable.

992
00:48:18,520 --> 00:48:21,360
Speaker 4: Like, it is very farcical.

993
00:48:20,880 --> 00:48:23,880
Speaker 1: To imagine that they could actually govern the Gaza strip

994
00:48:23,920 --> 00:48:26,200
Speaker 1: because they have no legitiacy in the West Bank, let

995
00:48:26,239 --> 00:48:29,120
Speaker 1: alone in Gaza. So you know, they are rightly seen

996
00:48:29,160 --> 00:48:32,960
Speaker 1: as like collaborators with the Israeli Security State and the

997
00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:36,319
Speaker 1: IDF directly, so again they have they're very weak. They

998
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:39,239
Speaker 1: have no legitimacy really in the West Bank, so imagining

999
00:48:39,239 --> 00:48:41,279
Speaker 1: them in control of Gaza is pretty preposterous.

1000
00:48:41,320 --> 00:48:43,560
Speaker 4: But this is what the US has been pushing. Of course,

1001
00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:45,319
Speaker 4: we know the real reason why nan Yah, who.

1002
00:48:45,280 --> 00:48:46,759
Speaker 1: Is totally opposed to it, is the same reason he's

1003
00:48:46,760 --> 00:48:49,560
Speaker 1: always been totally opposed to it, because he does not

1004
00:48:49,800 --> 00:48:55,080
Speaker 1: want some sort of unite of union between the Palestinians

1005
00:48:55,080 --> 00:48:58,040
Speaker 1: in West Bank and the Palestinians in Gaza, or any

1006
00:48:58,080 --> 00:49:02,080
Speaker 1: sort of a partner that you could reasonably negotiate with,

1007
00:49:02,520 --> 00:49:05,040
Speaker 1: because that would lead to questions, all right, well, let's

1008
00:49:05,040 --> 00:49:07,120
Speaker 1: move forward with maybe a two state solution, let's move

1009
00:49:07,160 --> 00:49:09,239
Speaker 1: forward with some sort of a peace process. And he

1010
00:49:09,320 --> 00:49:11,759
Speaker 1: does not want that and has been very overt about it.

1011
00:49:11,840 --> 00:49:14,400
Speaker 1: So that's why he has always worked to keep the

1012
00:49:14,440 --> 00:49:17,520
Speaker 1: Palestinians in the West Bank and the Gaza in Gaza

1013
00:49:17,600 --> 00:49:20,799
Speaker 1: separate and to prop up Humus so that he can

1014
00:49:20,840 --> 00:49:22,960
Speaker 1: have this talking one of like, eh, they're terrorists, Like

1015
00:49:23,040 --> 00:49:24,879
Speaker 1: you can't work with them, you can't negotia. Of course

1016
00:49:24,920 --> 00:49:26,920
Speaker 1: we want peace, but we can't negotiate with these people.

1017
00:49:27,080 --> 00:49:29,800
Speaker 2: Yeah. I think the biggest danger actually to the Israelis

1018
00:49:29,840 --> 00:49:33,839
Speaker 2: from the future perspective all lies within this. As I

1019
00:49:33,920 --> 00:49:36,120
Speaker 2: laid out, one of the big problems is going to

1020
00:49:36,160 --> 00:49:38,719
Speaker 2: be who is governing this and if they don't accept

1021
00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:41,839
Speaker 2: the PA or any other actor that could legitimately lead

1022
00:49:42,160 --> 00:49:44,200
Speaker 2: in the eyes of the West to a Palestinian state

1023
00:49:44,280 --> 00:49:47,520
Speaker 2: which they want to avoid. Then they're going to profine

1024
00:49:47,520 --> 00:49:51,440
Speaker 2: themselves almost perpetually in charge of the Gaza Strip. You

1025
00:49:51,480 --> 00:49:53,640
Speaker 2: found this quote, which I honestly find insane. Let's go

1026
00:49:53,719 --> 00:49:56,200
Speaker 2: and put this up there on the screen. Quote we

1027
00:49:56,239 --> 00:49:59,280
Speaker 2: are rolling out knock but twenty twenty three and Israeli

1028
00:49:59,360 --> 00:50:02,600
Speaker 2: minister says on the northern Gaza Strip evacuation. This is

1029
00:50:02,600 --> 00:50:05,640
Speaker 2: the Lacud minister avi dictor. He says that war is

1030
00:50:05,640 --> 00:50:07,840
Speaker 2: impossible to wage in their masses between the tanks and

1031
00:50:07,880 --> 00:50:10,959
Speaker 2: the soldiers Nantonia, who does not support resettling the Gaza Strip.

1032
00:50:11,000 --> 00:50:13,040
Speaker 2: He says he will not give up security control over

1033
00:50:13,080 --> 00:50:16,360
Speaker 2: it under any circumstances. And he is not only a

1034
00:50:16,360 --> 00:50:20,080
Speaker 2: member of the Israeli security Cabinet but also the Agricultural minister, a.

1035
00:50:20,040 --> 00:50:21,640
Speaker 3: Member of the Lacud party.

1036
00:50:21,960 --> 00:50:24,239
Speaker 2: You should probably know better than to use terms like

1037
00:50:24,320 --> 00:50:27,080
Speaker 2: Gaza Knakba twenty twenty three, saying that that's how it's

1038
00:50:27,120 --> 00:50:29,000
Speaker 2: going to end. He's also a former director of the

1039
00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:32,000
Speaker 2: shin Bet, which is I guess more analogous to our

1040
00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:36,600
Speaker 2: FBI here in the US. They are setting themselves up, really,

1041
00:50:36,640 --> 00:50:40,719
Speaker 2: I think for a disastrous future. If they're going to

1042
00:50:40,760 --> 00:50:46,560
Speaker 2: commit to any sort of occupation or any sort of resettlement,

1043
00:50:46,960 --> 00:50:51,480
Speaker 2: they will find even their most exuberant supporters here in

1044
00:50:51,480 --> 00:50:54,480
Speaker 2: the West on the democratic side are gone. And when

1045
00:50:54,480 --> 00:50:57,040
Speaker 2: you lose that and the support of the population. But

1046
00:50:57,120 --> 00:50:59,239
Speaker 2: even more importantly, I think once again they have still

1047
00:50:59,239 --> 00:51:02,920
Speaker 2: a tremendous amount of goodwill from what happened on October seventh,

1048
00:51:03,000 --> 00:51:05,840
Speaker 2: but this has become some sort of imperial and colonial project,

1049
00:51:06,120 --> 00:51:09,759
Speaker 2: then you really are going to completely lose any of

1050
00:51:09,800 --> 00:51:12,640
Speaker 2: that legitimacy in the eyes of even some of.

1051
00:51:12,600 --> 00:51:14,640
Speaker 3: Them, except your most art and supporters.

1052
00:51:14,920 --> 00:51:18,359
Speaker 2: And I think the problem strategically for them is increasingly

1053
00:51:18,560 --> 00:51:22,840
Speaker 2: their current government has no ability to rein in these forces.

1054
00:51:23,200 --> 00:51:25,880
Speaker 2: I think they would be so much better off with

1055
00:51:25,960 --> 00:51:29,680
Speaker 2: a better coalition type government which is entirely focused on

1056
00:51:29,719 --> 00:51:33,319
Speaker 2: the military strategic question of destruction of Hamas and not

1057
00:51:33,480 --> 00:51:37,840
Speaker 2: pairing it almost overwhelmingly with these colonial ambition, with the

1058
00:51:38,000 --> 00:51:41,799
Speaker 2: refusal to condemn settler violence in the West Bank, with

1059
00:51:41,920 --> 00:51:44,440
Speaker 2: the refusal to silence people like this.

1060
00:51:44,600 --> 00:51:45,839
Speaker 3: I mean, it's just one.

1061
00:51:45,800 --> 00:51:49,000
Speaker 2: Of those where we were very careful if Nettinel, who

1062
00:51:49,000 --> 00:51:52,399
Speaker 2: likes to talk about World War Two. We were extraordinarily

1063
00:51:52,480 --> 00:51:57,560
Speaker 2: careful to demand unconditional surrender, but also not to telegraph

1064
00:51:57,600 --> 00:52:01,640
Speaker 2: any sort of like inflammatory occupy. Now I'm saying the West,

1065
00:52:01,680 --> 00:52:04,080
Speaker 2: not not the Russians. They talked about things a little

1066
00:52:04,080 --> 00:52:06,800
Speaker 2: bit differently, but at least on our end, we wanted

1067
00:52:06,800 --> 00:52:10,520
Speaker 2: to minimize like civilian German resistance at the same time

1068
00:52:10,760 --> 00:52:13,160
Speaker 2: of making clear that we demand the unconditional surrender of

1069
00:52:13,200 --> 00:52:16,520
Speaker 2: the Nazi regime. And by separating those two questions actually

1070
00:52:16,560 --> 00:52:18,759
Speaker 2: I think a smarter play than the way that they

1071
00:52:18,760 --> 00:52:20,920
Speaker 2: are currently going about it. I also don't think it's

1072
00:52:20,960 --> 00:52:23,040
Speaker 2: a particularly useful one because it's like, well, you know,

1073
00:52:23,320 --> 00:52:25,880
Speaker 2: how did that end up? In terms of Germany, we

1074
00:52:25,960 --> 00:52:27,560
Speaker 2: ended up occupy. We still still have one of the

1075
00:52:27,640 --> 00:52:30,360
Speaker 2: largest bases in the world in Germany and in Japan.

1076
00:52:30,440 --> 00:52:32,200
Speaker 2: It's like, so is that we're committing to a seventy

1077
00:52:32,239 --> 00:52:35,359
Speaker 2: five year presence in the region, because that's insane. Any

1078
00:52:35,400 --> 00:52:38,000
Speaker 2: of these needs to end with some sort of political resolution,

1079
00:52:38,080 --> 00:52:39,680
Speaker 2: But again they don't. They don't really want to talk

1080
00:52:39,719 --> 00:52:43,160
Speaker 2: about the legitimacy of that. And if I think the

1081
00:52:43,200 --> 00:52:46,399
Speaker 2: single biggest threat to the Israel nation state. Right now

1082
00:52:46,760 --> 00:52:48,880
Speaker 2: is this faction of the party and the nets to

1083
00:52:48,920 --> 00:52:51,759
Speaker 2: Nahu government which finds itself in a position where the

1084
00:52:52,120 --> 00:52:54,360
Speaker 2: longer the war goes on, the better off it is

1085
00:52:54,400 --> 00:52:54,799
Speaker 2: for him.

1086
00:52:55,040 --> 00:52:56,800
Speaker 3: He every interview he gives.

1087
00:52:56,640 --> 00:52:59,319
Speaker 2: Including this one, they're like, hey, what about you did

1088
00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:01,399
Speaker 2: you fail? And he's we'll talk about that later. It's

1089
00:53:01,440 --> 00:53:04,880
Speaker 2: also historically ridiculous. I went back and was looking at this.

1090
00:53:04,920 --> 00:53:08,080
Speaker 2: In two thousand and six, Natanyahu demanded that the Prime

1091
00:53:08,120 --> 00:53:11,320
Speaker 2: Minister of Israel at that time take immediate responsibility for

1092
00:53:11,520 --> 00:53:13,759
Speaker 2: what happened in the two thousand and six Lebanon which

1093
00:53:13,800 --> 00:53:16,080
Speaker 2: was a disaster. So yeah, so a little bit of

1094
00:53:16,160 --> 00:53:17,839
Speaker 2: history of checking what he's doing.

1095
00:53:18,000 --> 00:53:23,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, Sontnahu's party is Lakud. This dude who

1096
00:53:23,480 --> 00:53:27,360
Speaker 1: said it, Yeah, but twenty twenty three, Gaza, but twenty

1097
00:53:27,400 --> 00:53:32,080
Speaker 1: twenty three, that's how it will end. Is a Lakud ministry,

1098
00:53:32,160 --> 00:53:34,560
Speaker 1: is the agriculture ministries also a member, as Soccer said,

1099
00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:38,080
Speaker 1: of the security Cabinet. So it's not like this is

1100
00:53:38,160 --> 00:53:42,000
Speaker 1: a fringe view. This is the view of the of

1101
00:53:42,080 --> 00:53:46,719
Speaker 1: Netnyahu's party. Of certainly they are very upfront about it

1102
00:53:47,200 --> 00:53:52,360
Speaker 1: that some of the extremist coalition partners who he insisted

1103
00:53:52,480 --> 00:53:58,440
Speaker 1: remain in the you know, Unity Security government during the

1104
00:53:58,440 --> 00:54:02,400
Speaker 1: war cabinet. So so, you know, this is the mainstream

1105
00:54:02,480 --> 00:54:05,120
Speaker 1: view of the people who are running the government, and

1106
00:54:05,239 --> 00:54:07,480
Speaker 1: let's be honest, it's the mainstream view of a lot

1107
00:54:07,520 --> 00:54:11,440
Speaker 1: of Israeli citizens as well. It's not like there's huge

1108
00:54:11,440 --> 00:54:14,800
Speaker 1: internal backlash to you know, this dude coming out and

1109
00:54:14,840 --> 00:54:17,359
Speaker 1: being like, yeah, god's a nakba. Which the other thing

1110
00:54:17,520 --> 00:54:20,839
Speaker 1: just historically that is worth noting here too, is that

1111
00:54:21,520 --> 00:54:25,280
Speaker 1: Israeli's long denied that there was even was an akpa.

1112
00:54:25,719 --> 00:54:26,600
Speaker 3: You know, their.

1113
00:54:26,560 --> 00:54:30,840
Speaker 1: Story for decades, which has become sort of impossible to

1114
00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:34,440
Speaker 1: maintain given the revelations of historical documents, but which nonetheless

1115
00:54:34,440 --> 00:54:36,359
Speaker 1: they've been sort of committed to, was like, no, no, no,

1116
00:54:36,640 --> 00:54:39,080
Speaker 1: we didn't push people out. They left, you know, their

1117
00:54:39,160 --> 00:54:41,080
Speaker 1: leaders told them to leave, and they just left. There

1118
00:54:41,080 --> 00:54:44,040
Speaker 1: was no violence, there was no you know, displacement. They

1119
00:54:44,120 --> 00:54:47,400
Speaker 1: just willingly went. And so they've always denied the idea

1120
00:54:47,440 --> 00:54:50,200
Speaker 1: that there even was an original nakba. So I guess

1121
00:54:50,239 --> 00:54:53,320
Speaker 1: we're now like openly admitting that as well. But again,

1122
00:54:54,000 --> 00:54:58,080
Speaker 1: this is very consistent with that Israeli Ministry report that

1123
00:54:58,160 --> 00:55:02,120
Speaker 1: came out and said, our ideal solution is ethnic cleansing,

1124
00:55:02,200 --> 00:55:06,640
Speaker 1: pushing all of these people out of Gaza and forcing Egypt,

1125
00:55:06,760 --> 00:55:11,600
Speaker 1: compelling Egypt to take them in and resettle them. And so,

1126
00:55:11,920 --> 00:55:13,960
Speaker 1: you know, when you've got a member of the Security

1127
00:55:14,000 --> 00:55:16,600
Speaker 1: Cabinet and former should Bet director saying these things.

1128
00:55:16,400 --> 00:55:18,040
Speaker 4: Openly, you should take note.

1129
00:55:18,040 --> 00:55:21,320
Speaker 1: You had another the Minister of National Security, Itamark ben Gavie,

1130
00:55:21,360 --> 00:55:24,680
Speaker 1: who is again one of the most extreme elements of

1131
00:55:24,760 --> 00:55:27,960
Speaker 1: the net Nahu government, saying, quote, to be clear, when

1132
00:55:28,000 --> 00:55:30,200
Speaker 1: we say that Hamas should be destroyed, it also means

1133
00:55:30,200 --> 00:55:32,399
Speaker 1: those who celebrate, those who support and those who hand

1134
00:55:32,440 --> 00:55:35,120
Speaker 1: out candy, they are all terrorists and they should also

1135
00:55:35,239 --> 00:55:39,359
Speaker 1: be destroyed. So again laying out that, you know, even

1136
00:55:39,400 --> 00:55:42,640
Speaker 1: people who weren't involved in October seventh, who just you know,

1137
00:55:42,880 --> 00:55:47,239
Speaker 1: maybe expressed some sort of support for Hamas or you know,

1138
00:55:47,400 --> 00:55:51,520
Speaker 1: just exist in Gaza and you know, are Palestinian, that

1139
00:55:51,600 --> 00:55:54,160
Speaker 1: they are also terrorists and they should be destroyed. Which

1140
00:55:54,200 --> 00:55:57,040
Speaker 1: is part of why there needs to be a lot

1141
00:55:57,040 --> 00:56:00,000
Speaker 1: of hard questions asked about when you say Hamas should

1142
00:56:00,120 --> 00:56:03,560
Speaker 1: be destroyed, what exactly do you mean by that, because

1143
00:56:03,560 --> 00:56:07,239
Speaker 1: that is actually in reality a very very squishy and

1144
00:56:07,440 --> 00:56:11,719
Speaker 1: very potentially you know, large scale concept who is hamas?

1145
00:56:11,760 --> 00:56:14,120
Speaker 1: And when you see the Israeli government going and being like,

1146
00:56:14,160 --> 00:56:17,160
Speaker 1: actually un workers are also habas, you can see how

1147
00:56:17,360 --> 00:56:20,400
Speaker 1: broad their definition of who qualifies as hamas actually is.

1148
00:56:20,480 --> 00:56:23,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right, let's go to the next part here,

1149
00:56:23,600 --> 00:56:26,839
Speaker 2: my bad, I meant the next element come upon me

1150
00:56:27,760 --> 00:56:28,520
Speaker 2: three two one.

1151
00:56:28,640 --> 00:56:30,120
Speaker 3: Let's go and put this up on the screen. It

1152
00:56:30,160 --> 00:56:31,240
Speaker 3: was making the rounds.

1153
00:56:31,239 --> 00:56:34,440
Speaker 2: It was actually a pretty interesting interview from The New

1154
00:56:34,520 --> 00:56:36,759
Speaker 2: Yorker by Isaac Choytner. He's kind of famous for doing

1155
00:56:36,760 --> 00:56:41,040
Speaker 2: these barbed interviews with unsuspecting victims, and this one it

1156
00:56:41,080 --> 00:56:43,840
Speaker 2: was the quote the extreme ambitions of West Bank settlers,

1157
00:56:43,840 --> 00:56:47,480
Speaker 2: and he interviews a woman who is a West Bank

1158
00:56:47,520 --> 00:56:51,239
Speaker 2: settler and activist and asked her about her vision for

1159
00:56:51,360 --> 00:56:54,440
Speaker 2: a Jewish state. This is Danielle Wise. She's one of

1160
00:56:54,480 --> 00:56:57,520
Speaker 2: the biggest leaders in the settlement community. Has been involved

1161
00:56:57,520 --> 00:57:00,520
Speaker 2: in settlement politics ever since the nineteen sixty seven war

1162
00:57:00,800 --> 00:57:04,040
Speaker 2: and has been living in the region since after that war.

1163
00:57:04,080 --> 00:57:06,240
Speaker 2: So it's been a long time. Suffice it to say,

1164
00:57:06,360 --> 00:57:10,319
Speaker 2: what exactly did she say? Which everyone found very noteworthy. Well,

1165
00:57:10,400 --> 00:57:14,120
Speaker 2: there's one particular quote, which I think really put everything

1166
00:57:14,120 --> 00:57:16,880
Speaker 2: into perspective, which was quote in Israel, there's a lot

1167
00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:18,600
Speaker 2: of support for settlements. This is why there's been right

1168
00:57:18,640 --> 00:57:21,040
Speaker 2: wing governments for so many years. The world, especially the

1169
00:57:21,160 --> 00:57:23,560
Speaker 2: United States, thinks there's an option for a Palestinian state.

1170
00:57:23,760 --> 00:57:25,800
Speaker 2: If we continue to build communities, then we will block

1171
00:57:25,840 --> 00:57:28,160
Speaker 2: the option for a Palestinian state. We want to close

1172
00:57:28,200 --> 00:57:30,439
Speaker 2: the option for a Palestinian state, and the world wants

1173
00:57:30,480 --> 00:57:32,720
Speaker 2: to leave that option open. It is a very simple

1174
00:57:32,760 --> 00:57:36,320
Speaker 2: thing to understand, which she says. Yes, she says quote

1175
00:57:36,320 --> 00:57:38,880
Speaker 2: settlement is the way to return to resion. She says, yes,

1176
00:57:38,880 --> 00:57:41,640
Speaker 2: there's the dispersion, the beginning of the revival of a

1177
00:57:41,680 --> 00:57:44,000
Speaker 2: Jewish nation. What are the borders of the Jewish nation?

1178
00:57:44,200 --> 00:57:46,240
Speaker 2: The borders of the homeland the Jews are the Euphrates

1179
00:57:46,280 --> 00:57:48,760
Speaker 2: in the east and the Nile in the southwest. Palestinians

1180
00:57:48,760 --> 00:57:51,320
Speaker 2: sometimes use that slogan they're talking about river to the sea.

1181
00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:54,160
Speaker 2: What you're saying is also about this in relation to

1182
00:57:54,160 --> 00:57:56,439
Speaker 2: a Jewish homeland, She says, quote. Of course, if someone

1183
00:57:56,480 --> 00:57:58,640
Speaker 2: wants to invent a new religion today, who will decide

1184
00:57:58,640 --> 00:57:59,040
Speaker 2: the rules?

1185
00:57:59,080 --> 00:57:59,880
Speaker 3: The first nation that got the.

1186
00:57:59,880 --> 00:58:02,120
Speaker 2: W or from God, the promise of God, the follow

1187
00:58:02,160 --> 00:58:04,640
Speaker 2: that others Christian on Islam with their demands and their perceptions.

1188
00:58:04,680 --> 00:58:07,360
Speaker 2: So they are just imitating what existed already already, So

1189
00:58:07,440 --> 00:58:09,680
Speaker 2: why in Israel they would be anywhere in the world

1190
00:58:09,680 --> 00:58:12,439
Speaker 2: that came after us in a double sense of the word.

1191
00:58:12,560 --> 00:58:15,760
Speaker 2: So anyway, I think she lays out pretty plainly what

1192
00:58:16,120 --> 00:58:20,120
Speaker 2: some of the what a pretty sizable coalition of people

1193
00:58:20,160 --> 00:58:23,000
Speaker 2: in Israel do believe in and support, and as I said,

1194
00:58:23,080 --> 00:58:25,040
Speaker 2: I think it is probably the single biggest threat to

1195
00:58:25,200 --> 00:58:29,120
Speaker 2: Israel in the future, just given the sensitive nature of that,

1196
00:58:29,160 --> 00:58:32,360
Speaker 2: and also really just where our interests in terms of

1197
00:58:32,440 --> 00:58:36,080
Speaker 2: diplomatic resolution and theirs diverged on an almost completely different

1198
00:58:36,080 --> 00:58:37,439
Speaker 2: plane and have been for a long time.

1199
00:58:37,520 --> 00:58:38,720
Speaker 3: We're also being honest.

1200
00:58:38,480 --> 00:58:42,840
Speaker 1: Well, and also how we have long of the politicians

1201
00:58:42,840 --> 00:58:45,920
Speaker 1: in this country of long time maintained this fiction of like, oh,

1202
00:58:46,080 --> 00:58:49,400
Speaker 1: working on the two state solution. You know, I actually

1203
00:58:49,560 --> 00:58:53,640
Speaker 1: appreciate and I'm horrified by, but appreciate the candor here

1204
00:58:53,800 --> 00:58:57,600
Speaker 1: of like, yeah, that is the settlement project. That's why

1205
00:58:57,640 --> 00:59:00,400
Speaker 1: it's popular in Israel. That's why it's been going on

1206
00:59:00,440 --> 00:59:02,760
Speaker 1: while all of these you know, potential peace deal negotiations

1207
00:59:02,760 --> 00:59:03,320
Speaker 1: et cetera, etc.

1208
00:59:03,520 --> 00:59:04,080
Speaker 4: Were going on.

1209
00:59:04,400 --> 00:59:07,680
Speaker 1: The settlement building never stopped, even though it's clear violation

1210
00:59:07,760 --> 00:59:11,000
Speaker 1: of international law. That's why you know, you've had this

1211
00:59:11,400 --> 00:59:15,240
Speaker 1: while this war is ongoing, You've had this incredible escalation

1212
00:59:15,520 --> 00:59:19,240
Speaker 1: in violence and pushing Palestinians off of their land in

1213
00:59:19,360 --> 00:59:21,240
Speaker 1: the West Bank. And it's not just that the government

1214
00:59:21,280 --> 00:59:23,760
Speaker 1: is silent about it. It's that the IDF is actually

1215
00:59:23,800 --> 00:59:27,600
Speaker 1: directly involved in more than half of these incidents of

1216
00:59:27,680 --> 00:59:31,240
Speaker 1: Jewish settler violence against Palestinians and efforts to push them

1217
00:59:31,240 --> 00:59:34,320
Speaker 1: off of their land. So this is an overt government project.

1218
00:59:34,360 --> 00:59:37,160
Speaker 1: It's really not a secret in Israel. Again, you could

1219
00:59:37,160 --> 00:59:39,320
Speaker 1: talk to people like Daniella Weiss and she'll tell you

1220
00:59:39,440 --> 00:59:42,400
Speaker 1: flat out what's going on here. But you know, you

1221
00:59:42,480 --> 00:59:44,440
Speaker 1: also when this is something we flagged from the beginning,

1222
00:59:44,880 --> 00:59:47,080
Speaker 1: Like you see the rhetoric when BB goes on with

1223
00:59:47,160 --> 00:59:50,000
Speaker 1: Kristen Welker very different, different than when you're speaking in

1224
00:59:50,000 --> 00:59:54,240
Speaker 1: Hebrew to israelis where these sorts of things are much

1225
00:59:54,400 --> 00:59:58,240
Speaker 1: clearer and much more naked, and you know, very widely

1226
00:59:58,280 --> 01:00:02,200
Speaker 1: supported by the public. Israel, interestingly, is one of the

1227
01:00:02,240 --> 01:00:06,320
Speaker 1: only countries, I think developed countries in the world where

1228
01:00:06,520 --> 01:00:10,760
Speaker 1: the younger population is actually more right wing and more

1229
01:00:10,840 --> 01:00:15,080
Speaker 1: radical than the older population that still has some connection

1230
01:00:15,240 --> 01:00:19,520
Speaker 1: to that previous like labor Zionism and social democratic state.

1231
01:00:19,960 --> 01:00:22,600
Speaker 1: And so this has been the trend in Israeli politics

1232
01:00:22,600 --> 01:00:24,760
Speaker 1: for a long time. And there are a lot of

1233
01:00:24,800 --> 01:00:27,280
Speaker 1: people who are looking at this moment and a lot

1234
01:00:27,320 --> 01:00:29,520
Speaker 1: of people with power in the government up to and

1235
01:00:29,640 --> 01:00:32,080
Speaker 1: likely including net Yahoo, who say this might be our

1236
01:00:32,160 --> 01:00:34,959
Speaker 1: chance to once and for all be able to quote

1237
01:00:35,000 --> 01:00:39,360
Speaker 1: unquote solve the Palestinian problem, especially in Gaza. And you know,

1238
01:00:39,440 --> 01:00:41,760
Speaker 1: they're coming out and saying it. So when you see

1239
01:00:42,040 --> 01:00:44,560
Speaker 1: American leaders being very precious about, you know, all their

1240
01:00:44,600 --> 01:00:47,280
Speaker 1: plans and ethnic cleansing and these sorts of things, like

1241
01:00:47,640 --> 01:00:49,240
Speaker 1: they just come out and say it, and then we're

1242
01:00:49,280 --> 01:00:51,600
Speaker 1: supposed to pretend like this isn't going on, and this

1243
01:00:51,720 --> 01:00:52,200
Speaker 1: isn't what.

1244
01:00:52,560 --> 01:00:53,640
Speaker 4: The goal ultimately is.

1245
01:00:53,760 --> 01:00:54,640
Speaker 3: It's a big problem.

1246
01:00:57,200 --> 01:00:59,120
Speaker 1: So one of the things we've been talking about here

1247
01:00:59,360 --> 01:01:03,240
Speaker 1: is what are this military operation, this war on Gaza

1248
01:01:03,320 --> 01:01:07,680
Speaker 1: actually even is going to increase Israeli security. Elon Musk,

1249
01:01:07,800 --> 01:01:10,440
Speaker 1: in an interview with Lex Friedman, sounding some concerns of

1250
01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:10,720
Speaker 1: his own.

1251
01:01:10,800 --> 01:01:12,080
Speaker 4: Let's say, to listen to what he had to say.

1252
01:01:12,200 --> 01:01:16,480
Speaker 11: If you're not going to just outright commit genocide like

1253
01:01:16,600 --> 01:01:19,000
Speaker 11: against an entire people, which obviously would not be acceptable

1254
01:01:19,000 --> 01:01:22,520
Speaker 11: to to to I really shouldn't be acceptable to anyone,

1255
01:01:22,920 --> 01:01:24,920
Speaker 11: then you you're going to leave basically a lot of

1256
01:01:24,920 --> 01:01:29,120
Speaker 11: people alive who subsequently, you know, hate Israel. So really

1257
01:01:29,200 --> 01:01:33,600
Speaker 11: the question is like, how for every Hummas member that

1258
01:01:33,640 --> 01:01:37,800
Speaker 11: you kill, how many did you create? And if you

1259
01:01:37,960 --> 01:01:41,320
Speaker 11: create more than you killed, you've not succeeded. That's the

1260
01:01:41,400 --> 01:01:44,200
Speaker 11: you know, the real situation there. And it's safe to

1261
01:01:44,200 --> 01:01:51,640
Speaker 11: say that if you know, if you know, if if

1262
01:01:51,680 --> 01:01:57,120
Speaker 11: you kill somebody's child in Gaza, if you've you've made

1263
01:01:57,120 --> 01:02:01,000
Speaker 11: at least a few uh HAS members.

1264
01:02:01,200 --> 01:02:03,200
Speaker 1: And I would add to that, Sagar, They're not just

1265
01:02:03,240 --> 01:02:05,400
Speaker 1: going to hate Israel, They're also going to hate us.

1266
01:02:05,520 --> 01:02:07,880
Speaker 4: They're also going to hate us because they know.

1267
01:02:07,760 --> 01:02:10,840
Speaker 1: That they know that the way that we have unequivocally

1268
01:02:11,040 --> 01:02:13,800
Speaker 1: supported Netanyahu, they know where those bombs are being made.

1269
01:02:13,880 --> 01:02:17,120
Speaker 1: So it's not only increasing the risk to Israel, but

1270
01:02:17,160 --> 01:02:18,640
Speaker 1: also the risk to the United States.

1271
01:02:18,800 --> 01:02:21,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, and the top US General actually speaking on this,

1272
01:02:21,640 --> 01:02:23,720
Speaker 2: let's put this up there on the screen. This is

1273
01:02:23,760 --> 01:02:26,160
Speaker 2: the new chairman of the Joint chiefs of Staff and

1274
01:02:26,400 --> 01:02:30,360
Speaker 2: actually says that the Israeli military stated aim in Gaza

1275
01:02:30,400 --> 01:02:33,400
Speaker 2: with the destruction of Hamas was quote a pretty large order.

1276
01:02:33,440 --> 01:02:36,280
Speaker 2: He also said Israel's focusing on the targeting of senior leadership.

1277
01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:38,880
Speaker 2: But I think that the longer this goes, the harder

1278
01:02:38,920 --> 01:02:41,520
Speaker 2: it can become. This is what he told reporters.

1279
01:02:41,600 --> 01:02:41,880
Speaker 3: Quote.

1280
01:02:41,920 --> 01:02:44,720
Speaker 2: That's why when we talk about time, the faster you

1281
01:02:44,760 --> 01:02:46,760
Speaker 2: can get to the point where you stop the hostilities,

1282
01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:49,600
Speaker 2: you have less strife for the civilian population that turns

1283
01:02:49,920 --> 01:02:53,080
Speaker 2: into someone who now wants to be the next member

1284
01:02:53,240 --> 01:02:56,120
Speaker 2: of Hamas. So one of the reasons why I think

1285
01:02:56,240 --> 01:02:59,800
Speaker 2: that this is important is that these people, all of

1286
01:02:59,840 --> 01:03:04,960
Speaker 2: our senior brass came up in a time of counterinsurgency

1287
01:03:05,240 --> 01:03:09,120
Speaker 2: in Iraq and have a deep and personal experience in

1288
01:03:09,120 --> 01:03:14,080
Speaker 2: Iraq and Afghanistan fighting exactly these types of conflicts, seeing

1289
01:03:14,200 --> 01:03:18,600
Speaker 2: their men die, being charged with similar missions, watching strategically

1290
01:03:18,680 --> 01:03:21,280
Speaker 2: the goals shift move out of you know, where they

1291
01:03:21,320 --> 01:03:25,080
Speaker 2: originally were, and their own soldiers and the civilian populations

1292
01:03:25,240 --> 01:03:27,560
Speaker 2: where they were also paying the price. That's why I

1293
01:03:27,560 --> 01:03:29,200
Speaker 2: would these are the first people I would listen to,

1294
01:03:29,600 --> 01:03:31,960
Speaker 2: people who are the most experienced fighting this type of war.

1295
01:03:32,120 --> 01:03:34,320
Speaker 1: You can bet this guy will probably never say anything

1296
01:03:34,360 --> 01:03:37,240
Speaker 1: that's honest. Again, he's new, so they'll probably get him

1297
01:03:37,240 --> 01:03:40,360
Speaker 1: on the talking points here pretty quickly. But just take

1298
01:03:40,400 --> 01:03:43,080
Speaker 1: in what he's saying. Okay, the chair of the Joint

1299
01:03:43,120 --> 01:03:47,360
Speaker 1: chiefs of Staff are in top general saying that basically

1300
01:03:47,800 --> 01:03:50,760
Speaker 1: this idea you're going to destroy himas is pretty preposterous,

1301
01:03:50,920 --> 01:03:53,400
Speaker 1: in his words, a pretty large order. Okay, So he's

1302
01:03:53,520 --> 01:03:56,560
Speaker 1: you know, diplomatically saying really, I don't really think you're

1303
01:03:56,560 --> 01:03:58,360
Speaker 1: going to be able to pull that off, and then

1304
01:03:58,400 --> 01:04:02,200
Speaker 1: also saying you are radically so many people right now

1305
01:04:02,960 --> 01:04:06,360
Speaker 1: that you know you have less strife for the civilian population.

1306
01:04:06,520 --> 01:04:08,320
Speaker 4: The faster you're able to wrap this up.

1307
01:04:08,360 --> 01:04:10,680
Speaker 1: That turns into someone who now wants to be the

1308
01:04:10,720 --> 01:04:13,720
Speaker 1: next member of AMAS, just coming out and outright saying it.

1309
01:04:14,240 --> 01:04:16,600
Speaker 1: And so you know, you had Biden who kind of

1310
01:04:16,640 --> 01:04:20,800
Speaker 1: weakly suggested when he was in Israel, like, let's remember

1311
01:04:21,080 --> 01:04:23,800
Speaker 1: after nine to eleven, our response wasn't so great. Let's

1312
01:04:23,880 --> 01:04:26,920
Speaker 1: keep that in mind, but not actually doing anything to

1313
01:04:27,000 --> 01:04:30,800
Speaker 1: make sure that those mistakes are prevented. And clearly at

1314
01:04:30,880 --> 01:04:33,760
Speaker 1: least some people, you know, in terms of our top

1315
01:04:33,800 --> 01:04:37,280
Speaker 1: brass know what a risk this is and what folly

1316
01:04:37,280 --> 01:04:39,680
Speaker 1: it is in terms of the long term security situation.

1317
01:04:39,880 --> 01:04:43,000
Speaker 1: But our government not willing to use any of our

1318
01:04:43,040 --> 01:04:46,840
Speaker 1: considerable leverage to try to prevent this outcome. So you

1319
01:04:46,840 --> 01:04:50,440
Speaker 1: know that's where we are. It's horrific toll for civilians

1320
01:04:50,440 --> 01:04:53,400
Speaker 1: on the ground. Risk of a broader war, I would say,

1321
01:04:53,520 --> 01:04:57,160
Speaker 1: escalating by the day, and then the long term possibility

1322
01:04:57,400 --> 01:05:03,920
Speaker 1: of blowback and increased radicalization and terrorism very much and ongoing.

1323
01:05:03,920 --> 01:05:06,040
Speaker 1: I wouldn't just say concerned. I mean, at this point,

1324
01:05:06,120 --> 01:05:09,080
Speaker 1: I can't imagine that there will be any other outcome

1325
01:05:09,120 --> 01:05:11,240
Speaker 1: coming out of the horrors that have been inflicted on

1326
01:05:11,240 --> 01:05:12,080
Speaker 1: the civilian population.

1327
01:05:12,240 --> 01:05:12,760
Speaker 3: Very possible.

1328
01:05:12,800 --> 01:05:14,440
Speaker 2: And at the same time, you know what he's probably

1329
01:05:14,520 --> 01:05:16,280
Speaker 2: the most worried about is that we've got all of

1330
01:05:16,280 --> 01:05:19,480
Speaker 2: these thy tens of thousands now service members in the region.

1331
01:05:19,640 --> 01:05:20,120
Speaker 3: Tragically.

1332
01:05:20,200 --> 01:05:22,440
Speaker 2: Yesterday, let's go and put this up there on the screen,

1333
01:05:22,560 --> 01:05:26,200
Speaker 2: five US Special Operators were killed in a weekend crash

1334
01:05:26,600 --> 01:05:30,160
Speaker 2: after a training mishap. It appears the circumstances of this

1335
01:05:30,560 --> 01:05:34,280
Speaker 2: were a mid air refueling that was gone wrong, and

1336
01:05:34,320 --> 01:05:37,080
Speaker 2: it was five members of the one hundred and sixty

1337
01:05:37,080 --> 01:05:40,520
Speaker 2: at Special Operations Aviation Regiment known as the knight Stalkers.

1338
01:05:40,560 --> 01:05:42,800
Speaker 2: So these are some of the most elite flyers and

1339
01:05:42,880 --> 01:05:46,160
Speaker 2: crew in the entire United States military. Often tasks which

1340
01:05:46,200 --> 01:05:48,920
Speaker 2: the most hairy missions getting in and out. We're all

1341
01:05:48,960 --> 01:05:51,560
Speaker 2: familiar with them over the years, and to lose five

1342
01:05:51,560 --> 01:05:54,760
Speaker 2: of them is absolutely devastating to the Special Operations community.

1343
01:05:54,800 --> 01:05:56,920
Speaker 2: It also raises a lot of questions about what they

1344
01:05:56,920 --> 01:06:00,520
Speaker 2: were training for. It appears Crystal they were training in

1345
01:06:00,640 --> 01:06:05,520
Speaker 2: nighttime night operations specifically for some sort of evacuation or

1346
01:06:05,560 --> 01:06:09,440
Speaker 2: hostage rescue situation whenever it comes to Lebanon and Tagazo.

1347
01:06:09,560 --> 01:06:12,440
Speaker 2: So this is a direct result of the forward deployed

1348
01:06:12,560 --> 01:06:14,880
Speaker 2: you know, of our troops who are involved now in

1349
01:06:14,920 --> 01:06:17,800
Speaker 2: this and obviously you know, training mistakes do happen, but

1350
01:06:17,920 --> 01:06:20,479
Speaker 2: it's really it's awful, you know, just to lose five

1351
01:06:20,720 --> 01:06:23,160
Speaker 2: service members in a situation like this, and it just

1352
01:06:23,240 --> 01:06:26,280
Speaker 2: highlights the fact like when you mobilize a lot of

1353
01:06:26,280 --> 01:06:28,320
Speaker 2: guys and you just send them and you start training

1354
01:06:28,360 --> 01:06:30,800
Speaker 2: and doing all this stuff, people are gonna die. People

1355
01:06:30,840 --> 01:06:32,800
Speaker 2: are gonna you know, there's going to be follow on

1356
01:06:32,880 --> 01:06:36,280
Speaker 2: twentieth and thirtieth order effects to all of that, and

1357
01:06:36,320 --> 01:06:39,000
Speaker 2: I think that that's something that we often don't think about.

1358
01:06:39,200 --> 01:06:41,560
Speaker 2: A statistic I learned recently which blew my mind is

1359
01:06:41,600 --> 01:06:44,280
Speaker 2: that we killed I believe, either more or nearly the

1360
01:06:44,320 --> 01:06:47,480
Speaker 2: same amount of pilots training for World War two than

1361
01:06:47,520 --> 01:06:49,280
Speaker 2: we did actually in World War two.

1362
01:06:49,360 --> 01:06:49,600
Speaker 8: Wow.

1363
01:06:49,680 --> 01:06:54,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, some twenty thousand were killed in training. And the

1364
01:06:54,560 --> 01:06:55,920
Speaker 2: reason why is that I were like, we need the

1365
01:06:55,920 --> 01:06:57,800
Speaker 2: pilots so bad that we got to subject them to

1366
01:06:57,800 --> 01:07:00,840
Speaker 2: so many real world conditions that we're willing to sacrifice

1367
01:07:00,960 --> 01:07:03,280
Speaker 2: I mean literally thousands of lives in order to make

1368
01:07:03,280 --> 01:07:05,640
Speaker 2: sure they have battle hard and well tested guys when

1369
01:07:05,640 --> 01:07:07,520
Speaker 2: they're sent out there. And then even then it was

1370
01:07:07,520 --> 01:07:10,360
Speaker 2: one of the most dangerous jobs in the entire US military.

1371
01:07:10,360 --> 01:07:11,840
Speaker 2: So anyway, history lesson for today.

1372
01:07:11,920 --> 01:07:12,400
Speaker 4: That's wild.

1373
01:07:12,440 --> 01:07:15,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, And last thing I'll say on that is, you know,

1374
01:07:15,160 --> 01:07:16,520
Speaker 1: obviously the risk.

1375
01:07:16,600 --> 01:07:19,560
Speaker 4: I think it just underscores the volatility.

1376
01:07:19,040 --> 01:07:22,080
Speaker 1: And the danger of having so many of our men

1377
01:07:22,120 --> 01:07:25,160
Speaker 1: and women in this region who then become targets for

1378
01:07:25,240 --> 01:07:29,200
Speaker 1: hostilities and potentially trigger that esculatory effect we've been warning about.

1379
01:07:29,360 --> 01:07:32,280
Speaker 2: Yes, all right, let's go to the next part. Nordstream,

1380
01:07:32,520 --> 01:07:36,880
Speaker 2: a story which has only gotten more interesting by the day.

1381
01:07:37,240 --> 01:07:38,960
Speaker 2: Let's go and put this up there on the screen

1382
01:07:39,160 --> 01:07:43,080
Speaker 2: in a snooze that will shock absolutely nobody. A Ukrainian

1383
01:07:43,160 --> 01:07:49,080
Speaker 2: military officer quote coordinated the Nordstream pipeline attack. Roman Chernivsky,

1384
01:07:49,200 --> 01:07:52,480
Speaker 2: who was a colonel in the Ukraine Special Operations Forces,

1385
01:07:52,680 --> 01:07:56,600
Speaker 2: was quote integral to the brazen sabotage operation, say people

1386
01:07:56,680 --> 01:07:58,480
Speaker 2: familiar with the planning.

1387
01:07:58,520 --> 01:07:59,760
Speaker 3: Now, all of this.

1388
01:08:00,320 --> 01:08:04,520
Speaker 2: Is one of the most arcane, bizarre ways that we've

1389
01:08:04,560 --> 01:08:10,680
Speaker 2: finally learned the truth, because Tirvinsky is now actually being

1390
01:08:11,200 --> 01:08:15,400
Speaker 2: prosecuted by the Zelensky government and he is speaking out

1391
01:08:15,920 --> 01:08:19,559
Speaker 2: into i guess a face saving operation to try and

1392
01:08:19,600 --> 01:08:22,920
Speaker 2: to save his own hide by finally telling us the truth.

1393
01:08:23,280 --> 01:08:26,960
Speaker 2: The details though themselves, according to both him and many

1394
01:08:27,000 --> 01:08:29,719
Speaker 2: of the other intel officials and others who are familiar

1395
01:08:29,720 --> 01:08:32,640
Speaker 2: with the plan, is that this went crystal all the

1396
01:08:32,680 --> 01:08:35,760
Speaker 2: way up to the very top of the Ukrainian military.

1397
01:08:36,040 --> 01:08:39,839
Speaker 2: It was overseen directly by the head of the Ukrainian

1398
01:08:39,920 --> 01:08:43,920
Speaker 2: Armed Forces, according to them, and as always they're like, well,

1399
01:08:44,160 --> 01:08:49,400
Speaker 2: Zelenski had no idea about the operation. But the reason

1400
01:08:49,439 --> 01:08:52,000
Speaker 2: why we should really pay attention here is that the

1401
01:08:52,080 --> 01:08:57,599
Speaker 2: details on this show a highly coordinated Special Operations mission

1402
01:08:58,000 --> 01:09:00,120
Speaker 2: led by the Ukrainians to blow up the no Or

1403
01:09:00,160 --> 01:09:03,960
Speaker 2: stream pipeline. Where when you start to pair that with

1404
01:09:04,080 --> 01:09:05,960
Speaker 2: the past reporting that we've done here on the show,

1405
01:09:05,960 --> 01:09:08,120
Speaker 2: I believe Ryan was in for you at the time,

1406
01:09:08,600 --> 01:09:13,160
Speaker 2: was the level of entanglement between the CIA and the Ukrainians.

1407
01:09:13,600 --> 01:09:15,200
Speaker 3: That story I now.

1408
01:09:15,120 --> 01:09:18,280
Speaker 2: Believe was probably a precursor to releasing the details on this,

1409
01:09:18,680 --> 01:09:22,320
Speaker 2: and it basically described how CIA operations in Ukraine, specifically

1410
01:09:22,360 --> 01:09:25,240
Speaker 2: with their special forces are unprecedented in the way that

1411
01:09:25,280 --> 01:09:28,240
Speaker 2: we have trained them, stood them up, basically running half

1412
01:09:28,240 --> 01:09:30,560
Speaker 2: of their operations for them, paying all of their salaries.

1413
01:09:30,880 --> 01:09:33,200
Speaker 2: We never even did anything like this like we did

1414
01:09:33,240 --> 01:09:34,960
Speaker 2: in Afghanistan or in Iraq.

1415
01:09:35,040 --> 01:09:36,439
Speaker 3: That level of support.

1416
01:09:36,800 --> 01:09:40,599
Speaker 2: Well, if you put that then together with this about

1417
01:09:40,600 --> 01:09:44,920
Speaker 2: these Ukrainian Special Operations forces, it's effectively impossible that the

1418
01:09:45,040 --> 01:09:48,040
Speaker 2: United States did not know now the cope from the

1419
01:09:48,080 --> 01:09:51,320
Speaker 2: media and from the people leaking this is the US

1420
01:09:51,720 --> 01:09:54,920
Speaker 2: intelligence community quote learned about it earlier and warned them

1421
01:09:54,960 --> 01:09:55,599
Speaker 2: not to do it.

1422
01:09:56,000 --> 01:09:58,000
Speaker 3: Well, that's one possibility.

1423
01:09:58,040 --> 01:10:01,280
Speaker 2: The other possibility is that that's all smokescreen for we

1424
01:10:01,320 --> 01:10:05,080
Speaker 2: were actually the ones who directed the operation. But nonetheless

1425
01:10:05,160 --> 01:10:09,160
Speaker 2: it raises several like crazy things. At the time, you

1426
01:10:09,320 --> 01:10:12,799
Speaker 2: had a lot of speculation that this was actually Russia. Obviously,

1427
01:10:12,840 --> 01:10:14,280
Speaker 2: there were tons of questions, who can just you know,

1428
01:10:14,360 --> 01:10:17,600
Speaker 2: unequivally come out with any evidence. The Biden quote was

1429
01:10:17,640 --> 01:10:20,240
Speaker 2: going around about, Oh, Joe Biden says, you know, we're

1430
01:10:20,240 --> 01:10:21,640
Speaker 2: going to make sure that would get rid of the

1431
01:10:21,840 --> 01:10:23,240
Speaker 2: nord Stream pipeline is not gonna be a problem.

1432
01:10:23,240 --> 01:10:24,720
Speaker 3: I forget the exact quote of what he.

1433
01:10:24,760 --> 01:10:27,320
Speaker 2: Said, but there was a plausible, I guess, you know,

1434
01:10:27,400 --> 01:10:30,160
Speaker 2: scenario where this had been some sort of Russian operation.

1435
01:10:30,520 --> 01:10:33,080
Speaker 2: But as more and more details have come out, and

1436
01:10:33,120 --> 01:10:36,080
Speaker 2: as the longer the investigations have come and basically been abandoned,

1437
01:10:36,120 --> 01:10:38,600
Speaker 2: now by the West and now Intel been eleaked, we

1438
01:10:38,680 --> 01:10:42,759
Speaker 2: have to grapple with this. Ukraine, at the very least

1439
01:10:43,040 --> 01:10:46,480
Speaker 2: with US support and possibly at US direction, is responsible

1440
01:10:46,520 --> 01:10:49,120
Speaker 2: for one of the greatest acts of industrial sabotage ever,

1441
01:10:49,800 --> 01:10:53,640
Speaker 2: a bombing of a multi billion dollar pipeline system that

1442
01:10:53,800 --> 01:10:57,000
Speaker 2: also was used directly at the time to try to

1443
01:10:57,120 --> 01:11:00,519
Speaker 2: draw the United States into war. And these people are

1444
01:11:00,560 --> 01:11:04,880
Speaker 2: our alleged allies. More so, they put our diplomats or

1445
01:11:05,160 --> 01:11:07,799
Speaker 2: maybe our domains report in this position again, we don't.

1446
01:11:07,680 --> 01:11:08,519
Speaker 3: Know who where.

1447
01:11:08,560 --> 01:11:12,519
Speaker 2: They blatantly lied to the American public and to the

1448
01:11:12,560 --> 01:11:14,519
Speaker 2: world about who was responsible for this.

1449
01:11:14,720 --> 01:11:16,360
Speaker 3: Here's a flashback. Let's take a listen.

1450
01:11:16,520 --> 01:11:20,240
Speaker 12: The United States was not involved in any way period.

1451
01:11:20,360 --> 01:11:25,639
Speaker 12: The United States categorically refutes Russia's unfounded allegations leveled against us.

1452
01:11:25,920 --> 01:11:28,559
Speaker 12: The charges that have been made by Russians are just

1453
01:11:28,600 --> 01:11:31,160
Speaker 12: flat out wrong, plain and simple.

1454
01:11:31,320 --> 01:11:33,920
Speaker 2: That is the Robert Wood, he was the alternate US

1455
01:11:33,960 --> 01:11:36,840
Speaker 2: Ambassador to the United Nations there at the time, responding

1456
01:11:36,880 --> 01:11:41,080
Speaker 2: there about our alleged involvement in the pipeline. President Biden

1457
01:11:41,120 --> 01:11:43,439
Speaker 2: also denied this from the White House podium. The highest

1458
01:11:43,479 --> 01:11:46,000
Speaker 2: levels of the Ukrainian government. So I don't know, I mean,

1459
01:11:46,040 --> 01:11:48,880
Speaker 2: to grapple with so many terrifying possibilities a that the

1460
01:11:48,920 --> 01:11:51,760
Speaker 2: Ukrainians clearly, I mean, we've always known this directly want

1461
01:11:51,800 --> 01:11:53,719
Speaker 2: to draw us into this war. But this was September

1462
01:11:53,720 --> 01:11:56,800
Speaker 2: two thousand and two, September of twenty twenty two. Think

1463
01:11:56,880 --> 01:11:59,919
Speaker 2: political conditions of that time were very different. This was extreme,

1464
01:12:00,080 --> 01:12:02,960
Speaker 2: ordinary event. Oh yeah, that happened, and it was clearly

1465
01:12:03,240 --> 01:12:05,559
Speaker 2: they really wanted us to get involved. And again, the

1466
01:12:05,560 --> 01:12:07,320
Speaker 2: only reason we're learning the truth is because the guy

1467
01:12:07,360 --> 01:12:10,000
Speaker 2: planning the operation is now being persecuted by the Zelenski government.

1468
01:12:10,000 --> 01:12:11,200
Speaker 2: You could almost not make that up.

1469
01:12:11,560 --> 01:12:14,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, And it's also important to keep in mind the

1470
01:12:15,000 --> 01:12:17,080
Speaker 1: context of like why they would want to do this,

1471
01:12:17,360 --> 01:12:20,120
Speaker 1: and it's not only to draw us into that wider war,

1472
01:12:20,200 --> 01:12:22,080
Speaker 1: but it was also to put a lot of pressure

1473
01:12:22,320 --> 01:12:27,160
Speaker 1: on the European populations, basically cut off the possibility that

1474
01:12:27,200 --> 01:12:31,559
Speaker 1: they could benefit from this pipeline. And so, I mean,

1475
01:12:31,760 --> 01:12:34,599
Speaker 1: it really was Remember all the talk that we heard

1476
01:12:34,680 --> 01:12:37,680
Speaker 1: so much about like attacks on civilian infrastructure and how

1477
01:12:37,720 --> 01:12:39,960
Speaker 1: horrific that was and how brutal it was and what

1478
01:12:40,000 --> 01:12:40,960
Speaker 1: a war crime, et cetera.

1479
01:12:41,560 --> 01:12:44,640
Speaker 4: Here's a Ukrainian attack on a large.

1480
01:12:44,280 --> 01:12:48,640
Speaker 1: Piece and critical piece of civilian infrastructure and we're just

1481
01:12:48,800 --> 01:12:51,400
Speaker 1: now learning, you know, more than a year later, what

1482
01:12:51,680 --> 01:12:54,880
Speaker 1: really sort of we're learning what really happened here. And

1483
01:12:54,960 --> 01:12:58,840
Speaker 1: remember also the way that this all unfolded. First they

1484
01:12:58,880 --> 01:13:02,040
Speaker 1: were very strong suggesting and the media basically ran with

1485
01:13:02,080 --> 01:13:03,400
Speaker 1: the assumption that I was Russia.

1486
01:13:03,439 --> 01:13:05,639
Speaker 4: Yes, Russia does terrible things. They did this thing.

1487
01:13:05,680 --> 01:13:08,160
Speaker 1: They blew up their own pipeline for reasons we don't

1488
01:13:08,160 --> 01:13:10,719
Speaker 1: really understand why, but they did it. It's definitely them,

1489
01:13:11,439 --> 01:13:13,120
Speaker 1: but we're not going to offer any evidence. And then

1490
01:13:13,160 --> 01:13:14,400
Speaker 1: it was like, and we don't really want to do

1491
01:13:14,400 --> 01:13:18,920
Speaker 1: an investigation either. This became increasingly untenable, and so then

1492
01:13:18,960 --> 01:13:21,760
Speaker 1: you had these suggestions of like, well, it might have

1493
01:13:21,840 --> 01:13:25,080
Speaker 1: been some Ukrainian partisans, but they definitely didn't have any

1494
01:13:25,120 --> 01:13:28,599
Speaker 1: canaan Lensky had no idea. Was the Ukrainian Rotary Club

1495
01:13:28,680 --> 01:13:30,920
Speaker 1: or remember we were talking about out there they were

1496
01:13:30,920 --> 01:13:34,920
Speaker 1: freelancing and he had no knowledge whatsoever. Now we get

1497
01:13:34,960 --> 01:13:37,040
Speaker 1: to and the way that this was framed also in

1498
01:13:37,040 --> 01:13:39,439
Speaker 1: this article I thought was very interesting because the headline

1499
01:13:39,479 --> 01:13:43,160
Speaker 1: is about this Ukrainian military officer coordinated the nord Stream

1500
01:13:43,200 --> 01:13:47,280
Speaker 1: pipeline attack, but really the headline here is that it

1501
01:13:47,479 --> 01:13:52,400
Speaker 1: was the top dude, the highest ranking military officer in Ukraine,

1502
01:13:52,760 --> 01:13:56,479
Speaker 1: who they're saying was in charge of the operation. So

1503
01:13:56,520 --> 01:13:59,320
Speaker 1: it went all the way up the chain as far

1504
01:13:59,360 --> 01:13:59,840
Speaker 1: as it could.

1505
01:13:59,880 --> 01:14:01,439
Speaker 4: But they go on to oh, but.

1506
01:14:01,439 --> 01:14:05,439
Speaker 1: Zelenski still had no idea, which, as you pointed out, Sager,

1507
01:14:05,640 --> 01:14:09,400
Speaker 1: either way is terrifying plausibility. Yes, so if you really

1508
01:14:09,680 --> 01:14:14,560
Speaker 1: have these people who are completely separate from Zelenski freelancing

1509
01:14:14,960 --> 01:14:18,400
Speaker 1: carrying out one of the most dramatic, you know, one

1510
01:14:18,400 --> 01:14:21,840
Speaker 1: of the most dramatic episodes of industrial sabotage in world history.

1511
01:14:21,840 --> 01:14:24,160
Speaker 1: They're just over there freelancing and he has no control

1512
01:14:24,200 --> 01:14:27,400
Speaker 1: over them. That's terrifying. And the possibility that he was

1513
01:14:27,479 --> 01:14:29,679
Speaker 1: directly involved in behind it, and that, by the way,

1514
01:14:29,720 --> 01:14:33,240
Speaker 1: we were as well is also quite something. So it

1515
01:14:33,320 --> 01:14:36,600
Speaker 1: is I mean, this is a bombshell astonishing report and

1516
01:14:36,600 --> 01:14:37,160
Speaker 1: I don't think it.

1517
01:14:37,280 --> 01:14:38,320
Speaker 4: I also don't think it's.

1518
01:14:38,240 --> 01:14:40,360
Speaker 1: An accent that comes so long after the fact, when

1519
01:14:40,360 --> 01:14:42,720
Speaker 1: people have moved on, and obviously attention is very much

1520
01:14:42,720 --> 01:14:43,599
Speaker 1: distracted right now.

1521
01:14:43,479 --> 01:14:44,599
Speaker 4: By what's going on in Israel.

1522
01:14:44,680 --> 01:14:47,920
Speaker 2: Yes, exactly, and I mean, look, it's convenient for them

1523
01:14:47,960 --> 01:14:50,880
Speaker 2: to forget, but it's one of those where we cannot forget,

1524
01:14:51,000 --> 01:14:54,400
Speaker 2: especially because we're watching in real time as everybody just

1525
01:14:54,560 --> 01:14:58,040
Speaker 2: like forgets that Ukraine ever happened about all these most

1526
01:14:58,120 --> 01:15:01,320
Speaker 2: brain dead takes that I've ever seen at the time, like, oh,

1527
01:15:01,360 --> 01:15:03,479
Speaker 2: the fate of democracy is at stake in Ukraine.

1528
01:15:03,520 --> 01:15:04,920
Speaker 3: Now they're like, well, maybe we have a.

1529
01:15:04,840 --> 01:15:06,639
Speaker 2: Piece deal, and it's like, oh, so is it real

1530
01:15:06,680 --> 01:15:09,160
Speaker 2: politic or is it not? Because which one? Those are

1531
01:15:09,200 --> 01:15:14,120
Speaker 2: totally incongruent. There's no actual there's no overlap between those.

1532
01:15:14,160 --> 01:15:18,360
Speaker 2: So overwhelmingly, we are also watching the Ukrainian state a

1533
01:15:18,439 --> 01:15:23,600
Speaker 2: month now, starved of its blank check from America, basically disintegrating.

1534
01:15:23,680 --> 01:15:27,200
Speaker 2: You have the top military commander who apparently was behind Nordstream,

1535
01:15:27,320 --> 01:15:30,840
Speaker 2: who's like, it's a stalemate, it's a technological problem. As

1536
01:15:30,880 --> 01:15:33,200
Speaker 2: things are right now, nobody's gonna win. Then you have

1537
01:15:33,280 --> 01:15:36,880
Speaker 2: Zelenski coming out literally begging for money, being like, listen,

1538
01:15:37,000 --> 01:15:39,120
Speaker 2: if you can't give us a check, like just we'll

1539
01:15:39,160 --> 01:15:39,519
Speaker 2: pay you.

1540
01:15:39,520 --> 01:15:40,920
Speaker 4: Back alone for it.

1541
01:15:41,080 --> 01:15:44,320
Speaker 3: He pay us back with what you know? What exactly

1542
01:15:44,360 --> 01:15:46,360
Speaker 3: do you make again? Nothing? Oh that's right.

1543
01:15:46,400 --> 01:15:49,360
Speaker 2: And especially now you lose twenty percent of your country,

1544
01:15:49,400 --> 01:15:51,080
Speaker 2: how exactly is that going to work?

1545
01:15:51,080 --> 01:15:53,040
Speaker 3: You can't even pay your own government salaries.

1546
01:15:53,080 --> 01:15:56,400
Speaker 2: So it's one of those where he's in desperate straits,

1547
01:15:56,680 --> 01:15:59,680
Speaker 2: he refuses to abandon it. People in his team are

1548
01:15:59,720 --> 01:16:04,000
Speaker 2: a straight up corruption. Now he's his own political opponents

1549
01:16:04,240 --> 01:16:08,080
Speaker 2: are running against him. He's canceling elections. You have all

1550
01:16:08,120 --> 01:16:11,680
Speaker 2: of this consternation with the Ukrainian Orthodox Church and all

1551
01:16:11,760 --> 01:16:15,000
Speaker 2: that that's not being scrutinized by America. I mean, it's

1552
01:16:15,040 --> 01:16:17,920
Speaker 2: a it's a chaotic situation, which, let's be clear, it's

1553
01:16:17,920 --> 01:16:19,760
Speaker 2: actually been like that from the beginning, it's now that

1554
01:16:19,800 --> 01:16:21,960
Speaker 2: you're allowed to talk about it. And in that we

1555
01:16:22,040 --> 01:16:25,200
Speaker 2: are again grappling with the fact that our supposed closest

1556
01:16:25,240 --> 01:16:28,720
Speaker 2: ally and all of that committed an insane act of

1557
01:16:29,040 --> 01:16:33,160
Speaker 2: industrial sabotage. Dare I say even international terrorism that would

1558
01:16:33,200 --> 01:16:37,240
Speaker 2: have had the biggest Like they they wanted to draw

1559
01:16:37,280 --> 01:16:40,160
Speaker 2: America into this war. They wanted to back the West up,

1560
01:16:40,240 --> 01:16:42,000
Speaker 2: you know, into a corner, to make sure they had

1561
01:16:42,040 --> 01:16:45,640
Speaker 2: no possibility of relying on you know, Russian energy and

1562
01:16:45,760 --> 01:16:47,879
Speaker 2: any of that in the future. And in my opinion,

1563
01:16:48,479 --> 01:16:51,839
Speaker 2: really what they did is that they just showed Western

1564
01:16:51,920 --> 01:16:54,640
Speaker 2: leaders and the population too that if for you know,

1565
01:16:54,680 --> 01:16:57,160
Speaker 2: in the clearest way, our interests are not the same,

1566
01:16:57,520 --> 01:17:00,680
Speaker 2: like at all, our interest is peace. They're interest is

1567
01:17:00,720 --> 01:17:03,040
Speaker 2: to draw us into this war. And let's just keep

1568
01:17:03,080 --> 01:17:04,120
Speaker 2: learning that lesson.

1569
01:17:03,880 --> 01:17:04,839
Speaker 3: Over and over again.

1570
01:17:04,920 --> 01:17:07,479
Speaker 1: The last thing I want to say about this is,

1571
01:17:07,720 --> 01:17:12,240
Speaker 1: I mean, we really are watching the utter destruction of

1572
01:17:12,360 --> 01:17:16,959
Speaker 1: even a semblance of commitment to the quote unquote international

1573
01:17:17,040 --> 01:17:20,920
Speaker 1: rules based order like this has collapsed completely in real time.

1574
01:17:21,080 --> 01:17:25,599
Speaker 1: And think about just do a little intellectual exercise if

1575
01:17:25,640 --> 01:17:29,000
Speaker 1: it was Russia that they could prove bomb the Nord

1576
01:17:29,000 --> 01:17:32,240
Speaker 1: Stream pipeline. Think about how different they talk about if

1577
01:17:32,280 --> 01:17:35,720
Speaker 1: it was Hamas who managed to pull off such an

1578
01:17:35,760 --> 01:17:40,320
Speaker 1: act of international terror and industrial sabotage. Think about the

1579
01:17:40,400 --> 01:17:43,160
Speaker 1: different way that they would talk about it. And so

1580
01:17:43,240 --> 01:17:46,880
Speaker 1: when you have the Russia War on Ukraine unfolding at

1581
01:17:46,880 --> 01:17:51,280
Speaker 1: the same time as the Israel War on Gaza, and

1582
01:17:51,360 --> 01:17:54,559
Speaker 1: you see so clearly that these rules.

1583
01:17:54,320 --> 01:17:55,120
Speaker 4: Are not rules.

1584
01:17:55,760 --> 01:18:00,240
Speaker 1: They're just applied selectively, weaponized against the countries that we

1585
01:18:00,320 --> 01:18:04,280
Speaker 1: don't happen to like. And it's so brazen, and it's

1586
01:18:04,320 --> 01:18:07,000
Speaker 1: so out in the open. I mean, this is the

1587
01:18:07,120 --> 01:18:10,679
Speaker 1: end of even being able to pretend that this country

1588
01:18:10,840 --> 01:18:13,800
Speaker 1: actually cares about such things. I just don't know how

1589
01:18:13,800 --> 01:18:17,040
Speaker 1: you even say it with a straight face going forward,

1590
01:18:17,240 --> 01:18:20,040
Speaker 1: And I really do think, I mean, you know, there's

1591
01:18:20,080 --> 01:18:22,640
Speaker 1: been lots of things you could point to, but in

1592
01:18:22,680 --> 01:18:25,280
Speaker 1: the modern era it really starts to come and glued

1593
01:18:25,360 --> 01:18:28,320
Speaker 1: with the Iraq War and the bullshit pretext we used

1594
01:18:28,640 --> 01:18:32,080
Speaker 1: to go in. And you know, that's it's no accident

1595
01:18:32,479 --> 01:18:35,680
Speaker 1: that Putin pointed to the Iraq War and what we

1596
01:18:35,720 --> 01:18:39,479
Speaker 1: did there as his excuse for why it's okay for him.

1597
01:18:39,400 --> 01:18:40,160
Speaker 4: To do what he does.

1598
01:18:40,600 --> 01:18:44,240
Speaker 1: Natan Yahoo uses the Iraq War and the toll that

1599
01:18:44,280 --> 01:18:47,920
Speaker 1: took on civilians as his excuse to do what he's

1600
01:18:47,960 --> 01:18:50,599
Speaker 1: doing in Gaza and Saga. I think you're absolutely right

1601
01:18:50,680 --> 01:18:53,080
Speaker 1: that while there, look, I'm not going to deny there

1602
01:18:53,080 --> 01:18:55,000
Speaker 1: were horrors that we commit it during the Iraq War.

1603
01:18:55,040 --> 01:18:57,679
Speaker 1: The number of civilians killed and the torture and Abu

1604
01:18:57,720 --> 01:19:01,000
Speaker 1: Grab and Guantanamo Bay, like it really does pale in

1605
01:19:01,000 --> 01:19:03,800
Speaker 1: comparison to what is unfolding in Gaza right now. But

1606
01:19:04,760 --> 01:19:09,360
Speaker 1: we started this unraveling in the modern era with the

1607
01:19:09,360 --> 01:19:13,800
Speaker 1: Iraq War, and now we've just seen a complete dissolution of,

1608
01:19:13,880 --> 01:19:16,840
Speaker 1: like I said, even the ability to have a pretext

1609
01:19:17,280 --> 01:19:20,640
Speaker 1: of commitment to the supposed higher values.

1610
01:19:20,720 --> 01:19:22,320
Speaker 4: And you know, it's.

1611
01:19:23,720 --> 01:19:26,599
Speaker 1: It's an extraordinary and horrifying thing to watch in real time.

1612
01:19:29,080 --> 01:19:31,759
Speaker 2: At the same time, turning our sites here, Eric Adams

1613
01:19:31,800 --> 01:19:33,720
Speaker 2: one of the luckiest people in the world that the

1614
01:19:33,800 --> 01:19:37,519
Speaker 2: everybody's attention is diverted because the details of what's happening

1615
01:19:37,520 --> 01:19:39,400
Speaker 2: to him right now are insane. Let's go and put

1616
01:19:39,400 --> 01:19:42,519
Speaker 2: this up there on the screen. Eric Adams is currently

1617
01:19:42,560 --> 01:19:45,960
Speaker 2: being investigated by the FBI as to whether he cleared

1618
01:19:46,040 --> 01:19:49,439
Speaker 2: red tape for the Turkish government. So the details here

1619
01:19:49,520 --> 01:19:53,200
Speaker 2: are that after winning the twenty twenty one Democratic mayoral primary,

1620
01:19:53,560 --> 01:19:57,320
Speaker 2: Eric Adams successfully pressed city officials to allow the opening

1621
01:19:57,400 --> 01:20:01,799
Speaker 2: of a Manhattan high rise housing the turn Turkish Consulate General.

1622
01:20:02,160 --> 01:20:06,559
Speaker 2: This alleges that Eric Adams, weeks before his election pressured

1623
01:20:06,600 --> 01:20:09,439
Speaker 2: the New York Fire Department to sign off on the

1624
01:20:09,479 --> 01:20:14,640
Speaker 2: Turkish government's new high rise consulate in Manhattan quote, despite

1625
01:20:14,760 --> 01:20:19,360
Speaker 2: safety concerns with the building. After winning the primary in July,

1626
01:20:19,760 --> 01:20:23,000
Speaker 2: Adams contacted then the Fire Commissioner in late summer of

1627
01:20:23,040 --> 01:20:25,800
Speaker 2: twenty twenty one and urged him to allow them to

1628
01:20:25,840 --> 01:20:29,400
Speaker 2: occupy the building, at least on a temporary basis.

1629
01:20:29,680 --> 01:20:29,960
Speaker 3: Quote.

1630
01:20:30,000 --> 01:20:33,840
Speaker 2: The unusual intervention by mister Adams is being examined as

1631
01:20:33,880 --> 01:20:37,280
Speaker 2: part of a broader public corruption investigation by the FBI

1632
01:20:38,040 --> 01:20:41,479
Speaker 2: and federal prosecutors in Manhattan that led to the seizure

1633
01:20:41,560 --> 01:20:46,799
Speaker 2: of the Mayor's electronic devices by federal agents earlier this week,

1634
01:20:46,920 --> 01:20:52,759
Speaker 2: and mister Adams' intervention paved the way for Erdowan quote,

1635
01:20:52,760 --> 01:20:56,679
Speaker 2: whose fondness for massive building projects is well known in Turkey,

1636
01:20:57,000 --> 01:21:00,479
Speaker 2: to then preside over the grand opening of a three

1637
01:21:00,640 --> 01:21:05,000
Speaker 2: hundred million dollar thirty five story tower on his September

1638
01:21:05,000 --> 01:21:08,200
Speaker 2: twenty twenty one visit to New York for the UN

1639
01:21:08,360 --> 01:21:09,280
Speaker 2: General Assembly.

1640
01:21:09,400 --> 01:21:11,160
Speaker 3: So let's again just lay it all out.

1641
01:21:11,720 --> 01:21:14,840
Speaker 2: Eric Adams, after he wins the primary, calls New York

1642
01:21:14,840 --> 01:21:18,200
Speaker 2: Fire Department. He tries to issue a temporary building permit

1643
01:21:18,280 --> 01:21:20,280
Speaker 2: to the Turks so the Turks can open up this

1644
01:21:20,360 --> 01:21:23,000
Speaker 2: building so that when Erdowan comes to New York he

1645
01:21:23,080 --> 01:21:25,360
Speaker 2: can stand in front of said building and be like, cool,

1646
01:21:25,439 --> 01:21:27,800
Speaker 2: look at this awesome new building that we have in

1647
01:21:27,840 --> 01:21:30,639
Speaker 2: New York City. I think those are the overall details now.

1648
01:21:30,680 --> 01:21:33,439
Speaker 2: To be clear, what they are investigating is did any

1649
01:21:33,479 --> 01:21:37,280
Speaker 2: money change hands? I personally just don't believe that Eric

1650
01:21:37,320 --> 01:21:40,360
Speaker 2: Adams is such a great friend of the Turkish people

1651
01:21:40,520 --> 01:21:41,719
Speaker 2: that he was doing this for free.

1652
01:21:41,880 --> 01:21:43,880
Speaker 3: But that's just me. What do you think, Crystal?

1653
01:21:44,040 --> 01:21:47,559
Speaker 1: So apparently the warrant so there were two rates. There

1654
01:21:47,600 --> 01:21:51,000
Speaker 1: was a search of his twenty five year old fundraiser,

1655
01:21:51,040 --> 01:21:55,200
Speaker 1: Brianna Suggs, and then there was the season of his phones.

1656
01:21:55,400 --> 01:21:58,280
Speaker 1: And apparently the warrant to search the home of the

1657
01:21:58,280 --> 01:22:02,680
Speaker 1: fundraiser focused on this fundraising event that they had on

1658
01:22:02,720 --> 01:22:06,960
Speaker 1: May seventh. On that day, forty eight donors, including the

1659
01:22:07,000 --> 01:22:11,439
Speaker 1: owners of this KSK Construction company, employees and their families,

1660
01:22:11,479 --> 01:22:14,919
Speaker 1: along with others in the industry, donated forty three thousand,

1661
01:22:15,240 --> 01:22:19,479
Speaker 1: six hundred dollars. And this fundraiser was organized by Turkish immigrants.

1662
01:22:19,479 --> 01:22:23,000
Speaker 1: I believe this KSK Construction company is owned by Turkish immigrants.

1663
01:22:23,160 --> 01:22:26,599
Speaker 1: So this fundraising event, everybody throws in a lot of money,

1664
01:22:26,640 --> 01:22:28,680
Speaker 1: forty eight different donors, and then when you get that

1665
01:22:28,760 --> 01:22:31,040
Speaker 1: money in New York, you get public matching funds, so

1666
01:22:31,080 --> 01:22:35,160
Speaker 1: it actually doubles the amount of money into Eric Adams campaign.

1667
01:22:35,320 --> 01:22:39,160
Speaker 1: So yeah, Basically the idea is that either the campaign

1668
01:22:39,160 --> 01:22:44,160
Speaker 1: contributions led to this treatment special treatment for this Turkish building,

1669
01:22:44,840 --> 01:22:47,840
Speaker 1: enabling Ertawan to come and do the grand opening, et cetera,

1670
01:22:47,880 --> 01:22:50,400
Speaker 1: et cetera. It's also worth noting like this is actually

1671
01:22:51,040 --> 01:22:55,040
Speaker 1: sadly consistent with Erdowan's record in Turkey as well, where

1672
01:22:55,040 --> 01:22:57,320
Speaker 1: you were called they had that horrific earthquake, and part

1673
01:22:57,360 --> 01:22:59,640
Speaker 1: of why they had such a high depth toll was

1674
01:22:59,680 --> 01:23:02,920
Speaker 1: because he had aggressively pushed a lot of shoddy construction

1675
01:23:03,320 --> 01:23:07,240
Speaker 1: that didn't wasn't up to code in that crumbled in

1676
01:23:07,240 --> 01:23:09,960
Speaker 1: the earthquake. So it is a little too on the

1677
01:23:10,000 --> 01:23:13,640
Speaker 1: nose for him as well. But apparently Adams, this is

1678
01:23:13,680 --> 01:23:16,880
Speaker 1: all just so classic New York. Apparently Adam's relationship with

1679
01:23:16,920 --> 01:23:18,280
Speaker 1: the Turkish immigrant.

1680
01:23:17,840 --> 01:23:19,759
Speaker 4: Community goes way back.

1681
01:23:20,320 --> 01:23:23,439
Speaker 1: As Brooklyn Borough President, he actively wooed wealthy members of

1682
01:23:23,479 --> 01:23:26,840
Speaker 1: the Turkish community in South Brooklyn. So apparently they were

1683
01:23:26,840 --> 01:23:28,640
Speaker 1: trying to return the favor, and he was trying to

1684
01:23:28,640 --> 01:23:30,439
Speaker 1: return the favor. Of course, he denies that there was

1685
01:23:30,439 --> 01:23:32,559
Speaker 1: any funny business here, et cetera, et cetera. But this

1686
01:23:32,600 --> 01:23:35,759
Speaker 1: is one of those stories that if it was another time,

1687
01:23:35,920 --> 01:23:39,000
Speaker 1: I mean, think of the headlines.

1688
01:23:39,160 --> 01:23:40,559
Speaker 4: Walldwall covers the.

1689
01:23:40,400 --> 01:23:43,400
Speaker 1: Mayor of New York, who was so celebrated by the

1690
01:23:43,400 --> 01:23:46,840
Speaker 1: media at the time when he was elected, having his

1691
01:23:46,960 --> 01:23:50,519
Speaker 1: phone seized by the Feds, and his top fundraiser having

1692
01:23:50,600 --> 01:23:52,960
Speaker 1: her house rated by the Feds.

1693
01:23:53,000 --> 01:23:54,599
Speaker 4: Pretty wild. What's going on here?

1694
01:23:54,720 --> 01:23:54,920
Speaker 10: Yeah?

1695
01:23:54,960 --> 01:23:59,120
Speaker 2: Apparently the Consular Building is the most expensive foreign mission

1696
01:23:59,200 --> 01:24:02,559
Speaker 2: in the history of turn It's curving facade inspired by

1697
01:24:02,560 --> 01:24:05,400
Speaker 2: the crescent on the Turkish flag, with its tulip shaped

1698
01:24:05,439 --> 01:24:09,120
Speaker 2: top a nod to the country's national flower. The building

1699
01:24:09,160 --> 01:24:12,639
Speaker 2: includes not only consular offices, but apartments, a prayer room,

1700
01:24:12,680 --> 01:24:16,680
Speaker 2: and exhibition space and auditorium according to its architects. And

1701
01:24:17,040 --> 01:24:19,320
Speaker 2: the reason again why he had to intervene is because

1702
01:24:19,360 --> 01:24:22,800
Speaker 2: it was July and Airdowan was coming in September. And

1703
01:24:22,920 --> 01:24:25,280
Speaker 2: I think if you trace it back to his ties

1704
01:24:25,320 --> 01:24:28,240
Speaker 2: to the wealthy Turks in New York City that are

1705
01:24:28,280 --> 01:24:31,439
Speaker 2: there already and apparently some previous trips that he's taken

1706
01:24:31,479 --> 01:24:33,559
Speaker 2: there over the time, he again is not just doing

1707
01:24:33,600 --> 01:24:35,720
Speaker 2: this out of the goodness of his heart. It was

1708
01:24:35,840 --> 01:24:39,880
Speaker 2: clearly at the very latest I think something was going on.

1709
01:24:39,960 --> 01:24:44,000
Speaker 2: It also calls into question, as you alluded to the

1710
01:24:44,120 --> 01:24:49,160
Speaker 2: investigation to one of Eric Adams's actual finan find fundraisers.

1711
01:24:49,280 --> 01:24:50,880
Speaker 2: Let's put this up there on the screen, because this

1712
01:24:50,920 --> 01:24:55,920
Speaker 2: is a really crazy story. The top fundraiser for Mayor Adams,

1713
01:24:55,960 --> 01:24:59,840
Speaker 2: as Breonna Suggs, was actually raided by the FBI day's

1714
01:25:00,160 --> 01:25:04,519
Speaker 2: for all of this happened, where again there were quote

1715
01:25:04,520 --> 01:25:09,080
Speaker 2: addressing a matter and that they were seizing some materials

1716
01:25:09,080 --> 01:25:13,200
Speaker 2: in investigation about the donation of this construction company.

1717
01:25:13,479 --> 01:25:15,320
Speaker 3: But what's really nuts.

1718
01:25:15,160 --> 01:25:19,000
Speaker 2: Is about Eric Adams's possible intervention and knowledge of this.

1719
01:25:19,320 --> 01:25:20,880
Speaker 3: Because let's put this up there please.

1720
01:25:21,120 --> 01:25:27,080
Speaker 2: The NYPD was actually sent to this woman's home hours

1721
01:25:27,240 --> 01:25:30,720
Speaker 2: ahead of the FBI raid in a probe of this

1722
01:25:30,840 --> 01:25:35,320
Speaker 2: campaign cash for Turkey investigation. For quote, a wellness check,

1723
01:25:35,600 --> 01:25:39,000
Speaker 2: a move that people say is very unusual. Obviously, you

1724
01:25:39,040 --> 01:25:41,240
Speaker 2: don't say a wellness check unless it's somebody who is

1725
01:25:41,320 --> 01:25:45,840
Speaker 2: like usually elderly. The NYPD then showing up giving a

1726
01:25:45,840 --> 01:25:49,200
Speaker 2: wellness check, possibly a tip off, possibly taking some stuff

1727
01:25:49,200 --> 01:25:53,160
Speaker 2: out of there, maybe or making it easier.

1728
01:25:52,640 --> 01:25:54,000
Speaker 3: In order to get rid of evidence.

1729
01:25:54,200 --> 01:25:57,160
Speaker 2: There's a lot of different possibilities that open up as

1730
01:25:57,160 --> 01:26:01,120
Speaker 2: to why the city controlled NYPD even be doing something

1731
01:26:01,200 --> 01:26:04,320
Speaker 2: like that hours before the FBI rolls into the house

1732
01:26:04,600 --> 01:26:09,400
Speaker 2: to try and seize campaign related documents and electronic records

1733
01:26:09,439 --> 01:26:12,639
Speaker 2: that are directly related then to this broader investigation which

1734
01:26:12,720 --> 01:26:15,960
Speaker 2: is tied to Eric Adams, now the freaking mayor of

1735
01:26:16,000 --> 01:26:16,439
Speaker 2: New York.

1736
01:26:16,640 --> 01:26:17,679
Speaker 3: Right, this is wild.

1737
01:26:17,800 --> 01:26:19,920
Speaker 1: And they have a quote from a former federal law

1738
01:26:19,960 --> 01:26:23,040
Speaker 1: enforcement official in that news piece that says a wellness

1739
01:26:23,120 --> 01:26:27,280
Speaker 1: check request at an address with unidentified occupants is highly

1740
01:26:27,360 --> 01:26:31,080
Speaker 1: unusual and that it suggests a leak about the investigation.

1741
01:26:31,720 --> 01:26:35,599
Speaker 1: So not only do you have the actual allegations here

1742
01:26:35,600 --> 01:26:38,360
Speaker 1: as reported by the New York Times about you know

1743
01:26:38,439 --> 01:26:41,040
Speaker 1: this whatever is going on with the Turkish government and

1744
01:26:41,040 --> 01:26:44,559
Speaker 1: this building and these fundraisers and looking into that. Again,

1745
01:26:44,600 --> 01:26:47,240
Speaker 1: no charges have been filed yet, they're just asking questions

1746
01:26:47,240 --> 01:26:48,679
Speaker 1: and seasoned phones and doing raids.

1747
01:26:48,720 --> 01:26:49,800
Speaker 4: You know, no biggie.

1748
01:26:50,320 --> 01:26:54,080
Speaker 1: But then you also have the whiff of a potential

1749
01:26:54,160 --> 01:26:56,479
Speaker 1: attempt to cover up here in terms of this quote

1750
01:26:56,520 --> 01:26:57,719
Speaker 1: unquote wellness check.

1751
01:26:57,800 --> 01:26:59,680
Speaker 4: So that's kind of the state of affairs.

1752
01:26:59,360 --> 01:27:02,840
Speaker 2: Yes, sir, certainly not looking good right now. I think

1753
01:27:02,880 --> 01:27:04,160
Speaker 2: for mister Adams.

1754
01:27:04,280 --> 01:27:06,080
Speaker 4: He was going to be the future of the Democratic Party.

1755
01:27:06,120 --> 01:27:09,000
Speaker 2: Well, I think he screwed himself on that one. This

1756
01:27:09,040 --> 01:27:11,840
Speaker 2: one is only the in the coffin. Okay, let's move

1757
01:27:11,880 --> 01:27:13,479
Speaker 2: on to the next one. This was a story. You know,

1758
01:27:13,640 --> 01:27:15,759
Speaker 2: we have all these things that are bubbling underneath the surface.

1759
01:27:15,760 --> 01:27:17,799
Speaker 2: It's not just Asrael Palestine. We want to give people

1760
01:27:18,080 --> 01:27:20,400
Speaker 2: an update and this one obviously. We know you guys

1761
01:27:20,479 --> 01:27:22,240
Speaker 2: care a lot about housing, and this is probably one

1762
01:27:22,240 --> 01:27:25,280
Speaker 2: of the most significant housing stories in decades. Let's go

1763
01:27:25,280 --> 01:27:27,479
Speaker 2: and put this up there on the screen. The real

1764
01:27:27,560 --> 01:27:30,200
Speaker 2: estate industry right now is in a state of complete

1765
01:27:30,240 --> 01:27:35,200
Speaker 2: turmoil after a federal investigation, or sorry, after a lawsuit

1766
01:27:35,240 --> 01:27:39,200
Speaker 2: in federal court found that the was a scheme by

1767
01:27:39,240 --> 01:27:43,879
Speaker 2: the National Realtors Association to inflate commissions. Now, the changes

1768
01:27:43,920 --> 01:27:47,000
Speaker 2: that could come to the business as a result of

1769
01:27:47,040 --> 01:27:51,280
Speaker 2: this lawsuit and of the successful verdict after a Kansas

1770
01:27:51,280 --> 01:27:55,200
Speaker 2: City jury found that these National Association of Realtors and

1771
01:27:55,360 --> 01:27:59,599
Speaker 2: major brokers quote conspired to keep commissions artificially high could

1772
01:27:59,680 --> 01:28:01,840
Speaker 2: lead to will complete change in the way that the

1773
01:28:01,880 --> 01:28:05,960
Speaker 2: realtor business itself works, could lower housing prices, but also

1774
01:28:06,160 --> 01:28:08,919
Speaker 2: could shake up a huge section of the US economy.

1775
01:28:08,960 --> 01:28:13,439
Speaker 2: So what this piece really gets into is that a

1776
01:28:13,560 --> 01:28:17,439
Speaker 2: settlement between the National Association of Realtors and these people

1777
01:28:17,479 --> 01:28:20,560
Speaker 2: who sued basically to say that their prices were artificially

1778
01:28:20,600 --> 01:28:25,120
Speaker 2: high means opens up oh case law and future lawsuits

1779
01:28:25,400 --> 01:28:27,880
Speaker 2: and changes to the real estate which means that they

1780
01:28:27,920 --> 01:28:31,120
Speaker 2: would have to change the way that the current commissions

1781
01:28:31,280 --> 01:28:34,000
Speaker 2: are split. And what it comes down to is the

1782
01:28:34,040 --> 01:28:36,880
Speaker 2: split of commission basically agrees that the buyer and the

1783
01:28:36,920 --> 01:28:39,280
Speaker 2: seller agent will have some sort of fee usually I

1784
01:28:39,280 --> 01:28:41,439
Speaker 2: think it's like three to six percent that they will

1785
01:28:41,479 --> 01:28:43,960
Speaker 2: then split upon the sale of the house. This pre

1786
01:28:44,080 --> 01:28:50,120
Speaker 2: negotiated fee between these two real estate these two realestate realtors.

1787
01:28:50,560 --> 01:28:54,439
Speaker 2: In addition to the MLS system, which is used in

1788
01:28:54,560 --> 01:28:57,200
Speaker 2: order to list a lot of these houses, which are

1789
01:28:57,240 --> 01:29:00,439
Speaker 2: then you know, I think data mind and placed on

1790
01:29:00,560 --> 01:29:04,240
Speaker 2: places like redfin and on Zillo is a huge source

1791
01:29:04,240 --> 01:29:07,560
Speaker 2: of revenue. That's why actually the lawsuit itself and the

1792
01:29:07,680 --> 01:29:12,120
Speaker 2: verdict actually plunges Zillo shares by seven percent, because that's

1793
01:29:12,160 --> 01:29:16,240
Speaker 2: where a huge portion of their realtor advertising dollars actually

1794
01:29:16,280 --> 01:29:16,639
Speaker 2: come from.

1795
01:29:16,680 --> 01:29:19,240
Speaker 3: So this is shaking things up on multiple levels.

1796
01:29:19,320 --> 01:29:21,519
Speaker 2: Number one is it could make being a realtor way

1797
01:29:21,600 --> 01:29:25,240
Speaker 2: less profitable, especially at the higher end of the business. Too,

1798
01:29:25,720 --> 01:29:29,280
Speaker 2: is that while it could lower prices for housing, it

1799
01:29:29,320 --> 01:29:32,120
Speaker 2: could change the way that all Americans, or at least

1800
01:29:32,160 --> 01:29:35,080
Speaker 2: most Americans, actually find real estate deals, which is in

1801
01:29:35,160 --> 01:29:38,800
Speaker 2: these websites. So the fee structure and the commissions and

1802
01:29:38,840 --> 01:29:41,400
Speaker 2: all that are likely to move to what they believe

1803
01:29:41,439 --> 01:29:44,000
Speaker 2: is going to be an a la carte model where

1804
01:29:44,080 --> 01:29:47,719
Speaker 2: maybe you pay one percent fee for this level of service,

1805
01:29:47,760 --> 01:29:50,320
Speaker 2: you'll pay the pre existing three percent fee for more

1806
01:29:50,320 --> 01:29:54,839
Speaker 2: of a boutique concierge service. But this still threatens obviously

1807
01:29:54,880 --> 01:29:58,880
Speaker 2: a massive monopoly of the MLS system, the National Association

1808
01:29:58,920 --> 01:30:01,800
Speaker 2: of Realtors, and just general fee cost structure that's been

1809
01:30:01,800 --> 01:30:04,800
Speaker 2: baked into real estate now for almost three decades from

1810
01:30:04,840 --> 01:30:06,400
Speaker 2: whatever is So if those who work in the industry,

1811
01:30:06,400 --> 01:30:09,680
Speaker 2: I apologism do my best to try and summarize what

1812
01:30:09,760 --> 01:30:12,919
Speaker 2: has always been the mystery of quote unquote closing costs,

1813
01:30:13,240 --> 01:30:15,280
Speaker 2: which no one is ever quite sure what it all means.

1814
01:30:15,439 --> 01:30:19,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, So the government has apparently long been kind of

1815
01:30:19,360 --> 01:30:24,559
Speaker 1: curious about whether this constituted anti competitive behavior, and this

1816
01:30:24,680 --> 01:30:28,320
Speaker 1: federal court which leve this massive fine and you know,

1817
01:30:28,439 --> 01:30:32,000
Speaker 1: found in favor of home sellers that these prices were

1818
01:30:32,200 --> 01:30:35,920
Speaker 1: artificially inflated and that this was basically.

1819
01:30:35,520 --> 01:30:37,120
Speaker 4: Like cartel like behavior.

1820
01:30:38,400 --> 01:30:42,240
Speaker 1: That's what has sent the whole industry into turmoil because

1821
01:30:42,280 --> 01:30:45,760
Speaker 1: the way that it works right now is technically it's

1822
01:30:45,800 --> 01:30:49,040
Speaker 1: the home sellers that pay all of these fees, and

1823
01:30:49,080 --> 01:30:51,559
Speaker 1: you really can't sell your house unless it's on MLS.

1824
01:30:52,040 --> 01:30:53,800
Speaker 1: So it's like, okay, well, if you're going to be

1825
01:30:53,840 --> 01:30:56,679
Speaker 1: on MLS, you're going to agree to this particular fee structure.

1826
01:30:56,880 --> 01:30:59,200
Speaker 1: That's why it's the home sellers who sued, because they

1827
01:30:59,200 --> 01:31:00,960
Speaker 1: technically are the ones who are on the hook, and

1828
01:31:01,000 --> 01:31:04,599
Speaker 1: then that fee gets split between both the buyer and

1829
01:31:04,840 --> 01:31:08,360
Speaker 1: the seller's real estate agents. But it's not like the

1830
01:31:08,400 --> 01:31:11,599
Speaker 1: buyers get off scott free either, because normally what happens

1831
01:31:11,680 --> 01:31:14,200
Speaker 1: is that cost is just added into the house of

1832
01:31:14,200 --> 01:31:17,320
Speaker 1: the price the price of the house, so you are hit,

1833
01:31:17,479 --> 01:31:20,320
Speaker 1: you know, with a higher mortgage cost and those costs

1834
01:31:20,320 --> 01:31:23,240
Speaker 1: are included ultimately for you as well, even though you're

1835
01:31:23,280 --> 01:31:26,080
Speaker 1: not the one who's paying it upfront. And so, I mean,

1836
01:31:26,120 --> 01:31:28,600
Speaker 1: it makes some logical sense that basically like, look, we

1837
01:31:28,680 --> 01:31:31,439
Speaker 1: have this one system. You're sort of forced into this

1838
01:31:31,600 --> 01:31:35,559
Speaker 1: free structure fee structure. There is no competition here, and

1839
01:31:35,760 --> 01:31:39,400
Speaker 1: other countries don't have this same system. So it's very

1840
01:31:39,439 --> 01:31:41,800
Speaker 1: easy as an American to just assume this is the

1841
01:31:41,800 --> 01:31:44,120
Speaker 1: way that things operate. But in other countries they do

1842
01:31:44,200 --> 01:31:46,519
Speaker 1: things differently, And you know, it could it could be

1843
01:31:46,600 --> 01:31:48,840
Speaker 1: that the buyer and the seller both pay those commissions

1844
01:31:48,920 --> 01:31:51,879
Speaker 1: upfront and there is some sort of a competitive system,

1845
01:31:52,080 --> 01:31:53,840
Speaker 1: and you know that you may have that a la

1846
01:31:53,880 --> 01:31:56,280
Speaker 1: carte model where if you're paying one percent, you're going

1847
01:31:56,360 --> 01:31:58,599
Speaker 1: to get a lower level of service than if you're

1848
01:31:58,600 --> 01:32:00,880
Speaker 1: paying three percent or if you're paying five percent, et cetera.

1849
01:32:01,280 --> 01:32:04,320
Speaker 1: But it could completely upend the way that all of

1850
01:32:04,360 --> 01:32:09,640
Speaker 1: this works, and really is a massive story within the industry,

1851
01:32:10,160 --> 01:32:13,639
Speaker 1: huge follow on effects for places like Zillo and Redfin, which, like,

1852
01:32:13,640 --> 01:32:14,280
Speaker 1: like you said, soccer.

1853
01:32:14,400 --> 01:32:16,799
Speaker 4: I never actually knew exactly how Zillo made.

1854
01:32:16,680 --> 01:32:18,400
Speaker 3: Money, but I apparently the same thing.

1855
01:32:18,479 --> 01:32:21,800
Speaker 1: Apparently it's because you And this makes sense now having

1856
01:32:21,840 --> 01:32:24,679
Speaker 1: spent some time on Zillo. They make their money from

1857
01:32:24,680 --> 01:32:28,160
Speaker 1: real estate agents who were advertising on Zillo. So if

1858
01:32:28,200 --> 01:32:31,519
Speaker 1: the real estate agents are getting hit, then Zillo gets hit,

1859
01:32:31,560 --> 01:32:33,799
Speaker 1: and presumably probably Redfin and these other services.

1860
01:32:33,960 --> 01:32:34,120
Speaker 8: Yeah.

1861
01:32:34,160 --> 01:32:36,160
Speaker 3: I don't know what's going on. I do wonder, though.

1862
01:32:36,200 --> 01:32:38,680
Speaker 2: This is a great disruption opportunity. I mean, something has

1863
01:32:38,680 --> 01:32:40,519
Speaker 2: got to change. So anybody out there who wants to

1864
01:32:40,560 --> 01:32:42,840
Speaker 2: change the real estate business, I didn't know this. One

1865
01:32:42,960 --> 01:32:46,599
Speaker 2: hundred billion dollars were paid by US consumers last year

1866
01:32:46,880 --> 01:32:50,880
Speaker 2: just in real estate commissions one hundred billion, which actually

1867
01:32:50,920 --> 01:32:53,559
Speaker 2: makes the settlement that we're about to get into, which

1868
01:32:53,600 --> 01:32:54,559
Speaker 2: kind of sparked all of this.

1869
01:32:54,880 --> 01:32:57,280
Speaker 3: Look paltry. Let's put that up there on the screen.

1870
01:32:57,600 --> 01:33:00,439
Speaker 2: All of this is after the home sellers won the

1871
01:33:00,840 --> 01:33:03,479
Speaker 2: one point eight billion dollars in damages for the quote

1872
01:33:03,520 --> 01:33:06,840
Speaker 2: unquote real estate conspiracy. That's one point eight billion for

1873
01:33:07,040 --> 01:33:09,400
Speaker 2: just a quarter of a million homes in the Midwest

1874
01:33:09,600 --> 01:33:12,920
Speaker 2: that said that the brokers forced them to pay oversized commissions,

1875
01:33:13,080 --> 01:33:16,600
Speaker 2: and under US antitrust law, that amount actually could be

1876
01:33:16,720 --> 01:33:20,200
Speaker 2: tripled to more than five point three billion. This is

1877
01:33:20,400 --> 01:33:24,439
Speaker 2: just Missouri, Kansas, and Illinois last I checked. None of

1878
01:33:24,439 --> 01:33:26,880
Speaker 2: those are the most prosperous states of the nation with

1879
01:33:27,000 --> 01:33:30,840
Speaker 2: crazy housing markets, except maybe Illinois and Chicago. Imagine what

1880
01:33:30,880 --> 01:33:36,440
Speaker 2: that's going to look like for Manhattan, Washington, DC, Los Angeles, Austin, Texas,

1881
01:33:36,640 --> 01:33:39,240
Speaker 2: any of these booming real estate markets where these real

1882
01:33:39,320 --> 01:33:41,840
Speaker 2: estate people are being clean and up on some of

1883
01:33:41,840 --> 01:33:44,599
Speaker 2: their commissions. I mean, these commissions that they're talking about

1884
01:33:45,160 --> 01:33:47,840
Speaker 2: were particularly egregious. It was five point five percent to

1885
01:33:47,880 --> 01:33:50,320
Speaker 2: list their homes, which I think is nuts. But the

1886
01:33:50,680 --> 01:33:55,040
Speaker 2: overall fee structure itself is being revealed to at least

1887
01:33:55,040 --> 01:33:58,240
Speaker 2: be anti competitive, possibly in nature, especially when you consider

1888
01:33:58,280 --> 01:34:00,960
Speaker 2: the MLS system and the way the entire new market works,

1889
01:34:01,280 --> 01:34:03,439
Speaker 2: and they're moved to then more of an a la

1890
01:34:03,520 --> 01:34:06,840
Speaker 2: carte which is dramatically reduce the amount of fees. It

1891
01:34:06,880 --> 01:34:09,960
Speaker 2: also does make sense why you know, you always hear

1892
01:34:10,040 --> 01:34:11,760
Speaker 2: it's like almost a joke. It's like, Oh, someone's got

1893
01:34:11,760 --> 01:34:13,880
Speaker 2: their real estate license and they're making like quarter million

1894
01:34:13,960 --> 01:34:14,679
Speaker 2: dollars next year.

1895
01:34:14,840 --> 01:34:16,920
Speaker 3: I did always wonder how does that work, Like, what

1896
01:34:17,080 --> 01:34:17,400
Speaker 3: is that?

1897
01:34:17,439 --> 01:34:20,240
Speaker 2: Well, this is apparently how it works, So I don't

1898
01:34:20,280 --> 01:34:22,599
Speaker 2: think it's going to be as lucrative then in the future.

1899
01:34:22,600 --> 01:34:25,200
Speaker 2: And then of course think about the lobbying and the

1900
01:34:25,240 --> 01:34:27,040
Speaker 2: interest groups that are going to be behind this. I mean,

1901
01:34:27,080 --> 01:34:29,280
Speaker 2: one hundred billion dollars in revenue a year is a

1902
01:34:29,360 --> 01:34:30,120
Speaker 2: crazy amount.

1903
01:34:30,520 --> 01:34:32,639
Speaker 1: So they're real, you know, and also those they're powerful

1904
01:34:32,640 --> 01:34:33,799
Speaker 1: ice here in Washington.

1905
01:34:33,920 --> 01:34:36,920
Speaker 2: God, yeah, realtors, And I mean think about this too.

1906
01:34:37,280 --> 01:34:40,479
Speaker 2: Every time. It's like a very local thing. Every town

1907
01:34:40,640 --> 01:34:44,040
Speaker 2: has a lot of people who are realtors. Realtors are smart,

1908
01:34:44,080 --> 01:34:48,000
Speaker 2: They ingratiate themselves with leaders in the community, and very often,

1909
01:34:48,080 --> 01:34:49,840
Speaker 2: I mean by definition, they just have to meet a

1910
01:34:49,840 --> 01:34:52,000
Speaker 2: ton of people and they have a lot of connections.

1911
01:34:52,040 --> 01:34:54,400
Speaker 2: And if you're going to threaten thirty something percent of

1912
01:34:54,400 --> 01:34:56,280
Speaker 2: their revenue, well they're probably.

1913
01:34:56,040 --> 01:34:56,720
Speaker 3: Going to fight back.

1914
01:34:56,800 --> 01:35:00,320
Speaker 2: So and I'm intrigued to see whether this could lead

1915
01:35:00,400 --> 01:35:03,519
Speaker 2: to at the very least a reduction in home price.

1916
01:35:03,680 --> 01:35:04,760
Speaker 3: That would be the best thing.

1917
01:35:05,080 --> 01:35:07,799
Speaker 2: From what we can tell, all of this has basically

1918
01:35:07,880 --> 01:35:11,439
Speaker 2: been tacked onto higher prices. I mean, you're talking six

1919
01:35:11,520 --> 01:35:14,519
Speaker 2: to eight percent at least in some cases, that's a

1920
01:35:14,560 --> 01:35:16,880
Speaker 2: lot of money when we're talking about a million dollar house,

1921
01:35:17,200 --> 01:35:19,320
Speaker 2: and that's exactly why they get paid so much. So

1922
01:35:19,560 --> 01:35:22,160
Speaker 2: it very much could change everything on that on the

1923
01:35:22,160 --> 01:35:29,080
Speaker 2: real estate system for sure. Last thing, here a very

1924
01:35:29,080 --> 01:35:32,599
Speaker 2: interesting story, one that I've personally been consumed by distracting

1925
01:35:32,600 --> 01:35:35,800
Speaker 2: myself from Israel Palestine, That's what I tell myself. The

1926
01:35:36,040 --> 01:35:40,360
Speaker 2: Department of Justice has announced the bust of a quote

1927
01:35:41,080 --> 01:35:44,960
Speaker 2: high end brothel network. This high end brothel network was

1928
01:35:45,040 --> 01:35:49,320
Speaker 2: operating in Boston and in Tyson's Corner, Virginia, outside of Washington,

1929
01:35:49,400 --> 01:35:52,120
Speaker 2: d C. Normally we would not carry about such a thing,

1930
01:35:52,320 --> 01:35:54,519
Speaker 2: but it turns out that this quote high end brothel

1931
01:35:54,600 --> 01:35:58,960
Speaker 2: network included a website where prospective clients were required to

1932
01:35:59,160 --> 01:36:04,160
Speaker 2: enter baron, name their occupation, exactly where they worked, provide

1933
01:36:04,240 --> 01:36:07,840
Speaker 2: proof of ID, and then became repeat customers after they

1934
01:36:08,120 --> 01:36:12,200
Speaker 2: quote cleared by whoever was running this brothel, who have

1935
01:36:12,320 --> 01:36:16,080
Speaker 2: now been arrested well. As part of the investigation, it

1936
01:36:16,120 --> 01:36:18,559
Speaker 2: appears federal investigators have gotten their hands on the client

1937
01:36:18,600 --> 01:36:22,879
Speaker 2: list and who they described, at least in terms of

1938
01:36:22,920 --> 01:36:25,519
Speaker 2: the types of positions that they held, are very interesting.

1939
01:36:25,560 --> 01:36:26,280
Speaker 3: Let's take a listen.

1940
01:36:26,400 --> 01:36:31,480
Speaker 13: They are doctors, they are lawyers, their accountants, they're elected officials,

1941
01:36:32,080 --> 01:36:35,360
Speaker 13: they are executives at high tech companies and pharmaceutical companies.

1942
01:36:36,200 --> 01:36:42,000
Speaker 13: They're military officers, government contractors, professors, scientists, pick a profession.

1943
01:36:42,280 --> 01:36:43,920
Speaker 13: They're probably represented in this case.

1944
01:36:44,040 --> 01:36:46,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, what he failed to mention there was elected officials

1945
01:36:47,000 --> 01:36:50,320
Speaker 2: as well, and the elected officials a lot of it

1946
01:36:50,400 --> 01:36:53,320
Speaker 2: traces back to this. It's in Tysons Corner, Virginia, which

1947
01:36:53,320 --> 01:36:56,040
Speaker 2: is outside of thirty minutes or so of Washington, DC.

1948
01:36:56,439 --> 01:36:59,000
Speaker 2: One of the things they also put in their press release,

1949
01:36:59,040 --> 01:37:01,080
Speaker 2: which is very important. We could put that police up

1950
01:37:01,120 --> 01:37:03,280
Speaker 2: there on the screen, is that many of the people

1951
01:37:03,320 --> 01:37:05,760
Speaker 2: who were being implicated in this apparently also had some

1952
01:37:05,800 --> 01:37:10,040
Speaker 2: of the highest levels of security clearance in the US government.

1953
01:37:10,360 --> 01:37:12,320
Speaker 2: And you know, that's part of the thing is people

1954
01:37:12,320 --> 01:37:14,120
Speaker 2: are like, why do you care somebody. I'm like, listen,

1955
01:37:14,160 --> 01:37:16,280
Speaker 2: it's not about what these people are choosing to do

1956
01:37:16,560 --> 01:37:19,320
Speaker 2: in their personal life. For me, it's like, you are

1957
01:37:19,360 --> 01:37:23,360
Speaker 2: putting yourself in the most blackmailable position possible. We have

1958
01:37:23,640 --> 01:37:27,760
Speaker 2: multiple actually foreign individuals here who apparently were running this

1959
01:37:28,040 --> 01:37:31,160
Speaker 2: entire high end broth on network. Either of Korean or

1960
01:37:31,200 --> 01:37:35,400
Speaker 2: Asian origin of some kind. And then these are scientists,

1961
01:37:35,600 --> 01:37:39,599
Speaker 2: high level pharmaceutical executives, technology executives, elected officials, and others

1962
01:37:39,800 --> 01:37:42,599
Speaker 2: that are all now embroiled in probably what the greatest

1963
01:37:42,640 --> 01:37:45,639
Speaker 2: blackmail scheme of all time. So then it comes into

1964
01:37:45,640 --> 01:37:48,080
Speaker 2: the question of like what kind of judgment do you

1965
01:37:48,120 --> 01:37:50,920
Speaker 2: have to have extremely high level security clearance to be

1966
01:37:50,960 --> 01:37:54,280
Speaker 2: a military officer, you know, possibly working at the Pentagon

1967
01:37:54,320 --> 01:37:56,920
Speaker 2: on who knows, God knows what, and then also be

1968
01:37:57,000 --> 01:38:00,799
Speaker 2: implicated in a crazy blackmail scheme that could be happening

1969
01:38:00,800 --> 01:38:03,720
Speaker 2: here possibly and at the very least we see that

1970
01:38:04,040 --> 01:38:05,599
Speaker 2: you don't have all the best judgment.

1971
01:38:05,720 --> 01:38:06,920
Speaker 3: I guess we could say a.

1972
01:38:07,040 --> 01:38:09,120
Speaker 4: Thing to be like, how do you not go?

1973
01:38:09,720 --> 01:38:12,479
Speaker 1: You know, I probably shouldn't be like entering my driver's

1974
01:38:12,520 --> 01:38:16,880
Speaker 1: license into this brothel website, like maybe that's not the

1975
01:38:16,920 --> 01:38:20,960
Speaker 1: best idea, and entering my occupation and you know, making

1976
01:38:21,000 --> 01:38:23,920
Speaker 1: sure I provide them proof of both the occupation and

1977
01:38:24,160 --> 01:38:26,559
Speaker 1: the that I am who I say I am. One

1978
01:38:26,560 --> 01:38:28,840
Speaker 1: thing people should know who don't live in this area

1979
01:38:28,840 --> 01:38:29,880
Speaker 1: about Tyson's Corner.

1980
01:38:30,280 --> 01:38:31,840
Speaker 4: It's literally minutes.

1981
01:38:31,600 --> 01:38:36,439
Speaker 1: Away from McClain, Virginia, which is sometimes the wealthiest zip

1982
01:38:36,520 --> 01:38:39,600
Speaker 1: code in the entire country, because you have this is

1983
01:38:39,640 --> 01:38:42,040
Speaker 1: where lots of lobbyists live, This is where lots of

1984
01:38:42,040 --> 01:38:43,360
Speaker 1: defense contractors live.

1985
01:38:43,600 --> 01:38:44,479
Speaker 4: This is where a.

1986
01:38:44,479 --> 01:38:49,519
Speaker 1: Lot of the wealthiest elite of the Washington, DC area,

1987
01:38:49,760 --> 01:38:52,400
Speaker 1: this is where they choose to make their homes. And

1988
01:38:52,479 --> 01:38:55,120
Speaker 1: so you know, when you're talking about this network right

1989
01:38:55,160 --> 01:38:57,920
Speaker 1: outside of McLean, right outside of DC, and you have

1990
01:38:57,960 --> 01:39:00,479
Speaker 1: the government actively saying you'll never believe who's on the

1991
01:39:00,479 --> 01:39:03,200
Speaker 1: client's list, Yeah, I'm sure a lot of people's ears

1992
01:39:03,200 --> 01:39:04,759
Speaker 1: perked up. I'm see there are a lot of people

1993
01:39:04,760 --> 01:39:08,360
Speaker 1: who are very panicked right now within this builtway radius

1994
01:39:08,400 --> 01:39:08,880
Speaker 1: at the moment.

1995
01:39:08,960 --> 01:39:11,360
Speaker 3: Here's the thing, we got to see the list. There's

1996
01:39:11,400 --> 01:39:12,840
Speaker 3: just we have to see it.

1997
01:39:13,000 --> 01:39:16,080
Speaker 2: If you're an elected official, like, it has got to

1998
01:39:16,080 --> 01:39:19,599
Speaker 2: come out. And also, like we said on the security

1999
01:39:19,640 --> 01:39:22,160
Speaker 2: clearance thing, there's got to be a legitimate investigation actually

2000
01:39:22,200 --> 01:39:23,759
Speaker 2: into this. And if you were one of those people,

2001
01:39:23,800 --> 01:39:25,559
Speaker 2: like honestly you got to lose your clearance, you should

2002
01:39:25,560 --> 01:39:27,920
Speaker 2: be fired because clearly you have awful judgment and your

2003
01:39:28,000 --> 01:39:30,760
Speaker 2: viable to blackmail. So it's one of those where the

2004
01:39:30,960 --> 01:39:34,600
Speaker 2: actual investigation into this could just tell us about the intelligence.

2005
01:39:34,800 --> 01:39:37,040
Speaker 2: I think of some of the highest level of people

2006
01:39:37,320 --> 01:39:39,760
Speaker 2: in the US government. And it's one of those where

2007
01:39:39,760 --> 01:39:41,920
Speaker 2: we've already learned over the years many of.

2008
01:39:41,960 --> 01:39:43,559
Speaker 3: These people lack horrible judgment.

2009
01:39:43,760 --> 01:39:47,519
Speaker 2: David Petraeus running this freaking CIA and then having an

2010
01:39:47,560 --> 01:39:50,720
Speaker 2: affair and trying to do some what was it, some

2011
01:39:50,800 --> 01:39:54,639
Speaker 2: scheme where they would log into a communal Gmail account

2012
01:39:54,880 --> 01:39:58,040
Speaker 2: and then write drafts of emails and save them in

2013
01:39:58,080 --> 01:40:01,679
Speaker 2: the drafts folders to each other. And this was actually

2014
01:40:01,720 --> 01:40:04,519
Speaker 2: something he picked up from watching terrorists operate, which I

2015
01:40:04,600 --> 01:40:08,360
Speaker 2: always thought was very interesting. But it goes very deep

2016
01:40:08,479 --> 01:40:11,120
Speaker 2: to the I think it goes very deep to the

2017
01:40:11,200 --> 01:40:13,840
Speaker 2: questions about like, who are these people who are supposedly

2018
01:40:13,880 --> 01:40:16,840
Speaker 2: so much better and running all of this. It's like, Oh,

2019
01:40:16,880 --> 01:40:19,960
Speaker 2: they're human beings, and the reminder of that is a

2020
01:40:20,000 --> 01:40:24,160
Speaker 2: potent thing that with this also, we should just see

2021
01:40:25,240 --> 01:40:27,599
Speaker 2: what the lengths that they go to Crystal to try

2022
01:40:27,600 --> 01:40:30,800
Speaker 2: and cover this up, because I actually think that, I mean,

2023
01:40:30,920 --> 01:40:33,160
Speaker 2: there's always a joke, you know, with the Epstein client list.

2024
01:40:33,200 --> 01:40:35,439
Speaker 2: The FBI has it, nobody even knows where it is.

2025
01:40:35,439 --> 01:40:38,000
Speaker 2: It's probably been long destroyed now at this point. But

2026
01:40:38,520 --> 01:40:41,360
Speaker 2: that's really I mean, that's the most extreme situation. How

2027
01:40:41,360 --> 01:40:43,800
Speaker 2: many of these happened that we have no idea about,

2028
01:40:43,880 --> 01:40:46,800
Speaker 2: Like it's possible even that the DOJ got over at

2029
01:40:46,840 --> 01:40:48,400
Speaker 2: SKIS on this one, because this came out of the

2030
01:40:48,439 --> 01:40:51,760
Speaker 2: district of Massachusetts. It didn't come out of Washington, DC.

2031
01:40:52,479 --> 01:40:55,639
Speaker 2: So it's like, now, what are they are? What pressure

2032
01:40:55,680 --> 01:40:58,280
Speaker 2: will be put from the top if the wrong people

2033
01:40:58,320 --> 01:41:00,000
Speaker 2: were implicated from the governments persons.

2034
01:41:00,320 --> 01:41:03,200
Speaker 1: Yet another reason why I think sex work should be decriminalized.

2035
01:41:03,200 --> 01:41:04,960
Speaker 1: I think it should come out from the shadows so

2036
01:41:05,000 --> 01:41:07,200
Speaker 1: you don't have this blackmail risk, and also so that

2037
01:41:07,280 --> 01:41:09,839
Speaker 1: the women who are involved can be producted.

2038
01:41:10,360 --> 01:41:12,840
Speaker 2: Even if decriminalized, though, do you really want high level

2039
01:41:12,840 --> 01:41:15,360
Speaker 2: security clearance guys who are putting themselves in that situation?

2040
01:41:15,479 --> 01:41:19,040
Speaker 2: I think that is a different conversation, Different conversation for

2041
01:41:19,120 --> 01:41:22,320
Speaker 2: another day, But anyway, we'll continue to track the story.

2042
01:41:22,400 --> 01:41:25,120
Speaker 2: I'm very interested in who the client list is. Thank

2043
01:41:25,120 --> 01:41:27,479
Speaker 2: you very much to all the premium subscribers who have

2044
01:41:27,520 --> 01:41:29,840
Speaker 2: been helping us out. We've been working over time here

2045
01:41:30,000 --> 01:41:32,799
Speaker 2: on Israel Palis and we appreciate you very much deeply,

2046
01:41:33,000 --> 01:41:34,559
Speaker 2: and we will see you all tomorrow.