WEBVTT - Short Stuff: Battle of Itter Castle

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<v Speaker 1>Hey, and welcome to the short Stuff. I'm Josh and

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<v Speaker 1>there's Chuck and Jerry sitting in for Dave, which makes

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<v Speaker 1>this an official short stuff. Don't accept substitutes.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right. And I'm only gonna say this at the beginning,

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<v Speaker 2>but boy, oh boy, this should be a movie, this episode.

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<v Speaker 1>It's insane that it's not.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, really great cinematic story in every way, the way it,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, is laid out there, you know.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, the Battle of Castle Itter would it be Ittter eid?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, here we go. We already don't know what to call.

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<v Speaker 1>It, so we're gonna call it Itter after John Ritter.

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<v Speaker 1>But it's also called Schlossitter, which is castle, and it's

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<v Speaker 1>located in Austria, the Tyrolean region of Austria. And the

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<v Speaker 1>reason why it's significant is too it's one of the

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<v Speaker 1>last battles of the European Theater of World War two,

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<v Speaker 1>Like I can't name any other battles after it, but

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<v Speaker 1>that doesn't really mean that much. And then the second

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<v Speaker 1>reason is because it is a really unusual battle in

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<v Speaker 1>that Germans got together with Americans and French and fought

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<v Speaker 1>the Nazis in this battle.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and other randos from different places like Czechoslovakia and Yugoslavia.

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<v Speaker 2>Like it was a like you mentioned a real Motley Crue,

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<v Speaker 2>real ragtag group. Yeah, but I didn't put both of them, Lounce.

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<v Speaker 2>You got to put it over the O two.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh I didn't. Oh, I'm sorry, man, I screwed up.

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<v Speaker 2>It was pretty great everyone Josh put this together and

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<v Speaker 2>he typed out Motley Crue and he put Umlas over

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<v Speaker 2>the U just clearly as a little, uh little love

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<v Speaker 2>letter to me.

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<v Speaker 1>It was Yeah, I got it, but I'm sorry, I

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<v Speaker 1>screwed up the love letter.

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<v Speaker 2>No, it's fine. It's the thought that counts, that's what

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<v Speaker 2>they say, right.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but that's really patronizing.

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<v Speaker 2>What if this was the very last battle? That makes

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<v Speaker 2>it even more cinematic.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean that's what I read. It was like one

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<v Speaker 1>of the last, and it could just pretty cobody hedging,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, it could have been the last one.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, all right. So this castle is sitting up there

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<v Speaker 2>since the thirteenth century. Since eighteen seventy eight, it's been

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<v Speaker 2>kind of in its present form, and it's been a

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<v Speaker 2>bunch of things. It was a private estate for a while,

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<v Speaker 2>as a hotel for a while, but notably for our story.

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<v Speaker 2>After the Nazis annex Austrian nineteen thirty eight, they took

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<v Speaker 2>it over and a few years later, in nineteen forty three,

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<v Speaker 2>it became part of Dacau, you know, the death camp,

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<v Speaker 2>and it served as a sort of a VIP prison

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<v Speaker 2>for some high value prisoners of war that they thought

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<v Speaker 2>could like we're not going to put these people to death.

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<v Speaker 2>We think we might be able to use them as hostages,

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<v Speaker 2>so we'll hold them up in this castle.

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<v Speaker 1>Right, And there were some like real VIPs in there.

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<v Speaker 1>There were two French generals, two former French prime ministers, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>Tennis Starr who'd become a politician, and one of the

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<v Speaker 1>sisters of Charles de Gaull, who was like, I guess

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<v Speaker 1>he was the head of the military in World War Two?

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<v Speaker 1>Correct or was he the No, he was the current

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<v Speaker 1>prime minister right in exile.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh I thought he just built the airport.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, hand by hand, but that was a side project

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<v Speaker 1>that he did on weekends.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>They were also, like you said, some Czech prisoners from

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<v Speaker 1>Yugoslavian prisoners, and they were there for a couple of years,

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<v Speaker 1>and in May of nineteen forty five, the beginning of

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<v Speaker 1>May nineteen forty five. The war was not just starting

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<v Speaker 1>to wind down, it was coming to like a like

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<v Speaker 1>a car smashing into a tree kind of stop. Because

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<v Speaker 1>Hitlary just killed himself in Berlin. Mussolini had been strung

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<v Speaker 1>up and hung out to dry literally by partisans in Italy,

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<v Speaker 1>and it was just very clear that that Germany had

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<v Speaker 1>lost World War Two and the European theater was coming

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<v Speaker 1>to an end.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's right. They were literally about to offer up

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<v Speaker 2>their formal surrender. But if you're in this castle, you're

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<v Speaker 2>a little worried because the SS at this point, there's

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<v Speaker 2>some SS that are like, hey, you know, we're going

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<v Speaker 2>to lay down our arms. The war is clearly over.

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<v Speaker 2>Let's just get this over with. There's other SS that

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<v Speaker 2>are like, nine, I'm going to go down in a

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<v Speaker 2>blaze of glory and kill everyone that I can before

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<v Speaker 2>they formally call this thing over. And so if you

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<v Speaker 2>were in this castle as a VIP prisoner, you were

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<v Speaker 2>worried that they were going to be coming for you.

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<v Speaker 2>And they found out that that was true.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So one of the things that really unsettled them

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<v Speaker 1>is on May Twid the Butcher of Dachau, the guy

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<v Speaker 1>who ran the prison camp, Edward Vitter. He showed up

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<v Speaker 1>at the castle because remember this was like an annex

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<v Speaker 1>of the Dachaut prison system, and he was on the

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<v Speaker 1>run from the Allies who had just liberated the camp

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<v Speaker 1>right after he'd escaped. But being a horrible, terrible Nazi,

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<v Speaker 1>as all Nazis are, he ordered the execution of two

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<v Speaker 1>thousand prisoners on his way out the door. The people

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<v Speaker 1>at Castle Edter had heard about this. I mean, that's

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<v Speaker 1>kind of a big deal, even in World War Two,

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<v Speaker 1>even in Germany, and they the fact that Vitterer showed up,

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<v Speaker 1>they're like, well, this is this is it for us?

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<v Speaker 1>But instead Vitder took his own life. He shot himself

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<v Speaker 1>in the heart. That didn't work, so then he shot

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<v Speaker 1>himself in the head. Well he had shot himself in

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<v Speaker 1>the heart.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so he really finished the job.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>A couple of days, I guess there were briefly relieved

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<v Speaker 2>and they're like, oh, well, thank god. But a couple

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<v Speaker 2>of days after that, the commandment of the castle and

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<v Speaker 2>all the guards they left, and so all of a sudden,

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<v Speaker 2>all these people are trapped in this castle, these prisoners.

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<v Speaker 2>There's no way to get out, even if they could

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<v Speaker 2>get out. They know that they're probably hostile Germans nearby,

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<v Speaker 2>and they don't want to meet up with them. So

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<v Speaker 2>a handyman, a Yugoslavian handyman in the castle said, you

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<v Speaker 2>know what, I'm gonna make a run for it, you guys,

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<v Speaker 2>and I'm gonna go and try and meet up with

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<v Speaker 2>the American troops that are coming our way and see

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<v Speaker 2>if I can get us some help and rescue. He

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<v Speaker 2>did make it to the Americans, which is again, if

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<v Speaker 2>this is a movie, it's like an amazing success story

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<v Speaker 2>that he found the Americans.

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<v Speaker 1>And didn't get shot.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and the Americans were like, hey, listen, man, we're

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<v Speaker 2>legally the war's not quite over. We're not allowed to

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<v Speaker 2>be in that area yet. But they were led by

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<v Speaker 2>Major John T. Kramer, and he said there will be

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<v Speaker 2>a podcaster one day that will coin the term nuts

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<v Speaker 2>to that, but I'm going to say it right now.

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<v Speaker 2>Let's send a small detachment of tanks that way and

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<v Speaker 2>see if we can help those guys out.

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<v Speaker 1>I can't take credit for that. I learned that from

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<v Speaker 1>Grandpa and Simpson's yeah, that's funny. So yeah, Major John

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<v Speaker 1>Kramer says, we're going to go help you guys, and

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<v Speaker 1>he leads a column of tanks over. He turns the

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<v Speaker 1>steering wheels and heads them toward castle. Itter and I say,

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<v Speaker 1>we take a break here because I think it's a

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<v Speaker 1>pretty good spot.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, let's do it.

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<v Speaker 3>That's why s K. You should know why SK definitely

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<v Speaker 3>should know. But Josh Clark.

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<v Speaker 2>All right. So meanwhile back at the castle, these prisoners,

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<v Speaker 2>they don't know what's happened to this Yugoslavian handyman that

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<v Speaker 2>went for help, because obviously it's you know, he can't

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<v Speaker 2>send word back. So another volunteer step forward. This is

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<v Speaker 2>the cook of the castle, and he said, all right,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm going to try and go get help. He finds,

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<v Speaker 2>oh god, this is such a movie. He finds a

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<v Speaker 2>German major, Sep Gongle, and this guy you said, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>all Nazis were terrible. I guess you would call him

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<v Speaker 2>almost a former Nazi because he was one of the

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<v Speaker 2>dudes that was like, no, this is what we're doing,

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<v Speaker 2>isn't right. So he broke with the SS. He was

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<v Speaker 2>leading a little group of Allied friendly troops, so he

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<v Speaker 2>was a complete turncoat, and he said, all right, let's

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<v Speaker 2>get together and go get these prisoners, like we finally

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<v Speaker 2>have a job to do, like you know, guns of

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<v Speaker 2>the Navarone style. Let's go, let's go save these prisoners.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So Gangle is on his way now to Castle Itter,

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<v Speaker 1>and on the way he runs into a tank commander

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<v Speaker 1>and his tank, the Bisottan Jenny is the name of

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<v Speaker 1>the tank, and the commander's name is jack C. Lee,

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<v Speaker 1>Junior Captain, and Gangle tells him what's going on, and

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<v Speaker 1>Jackson Lee says, you know, sir, I really like to

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<v Speaker 1>take part in that. Let's go. So he grabs a

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<v Speaker 1>few members of his company, a few members of a

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<v Speaker 1>nearby all black company d of the seventeenth Armored Infantry

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<v Speaker 1>Battalion and yeah, all played by Jim Brown in different disguises,

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<v Speaker 1>and then he puts them all together and he and

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<v Speaker 1>Gangle and their ragtag group of people start moving toward

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<v Speaker 1>Castle Itter. And this is not like some sort of

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<v Speaker 1>First of all, this isn't sanctioned. This is not like

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<v Speaker 1>some obvious platoon that's already been assembled, like, this is

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<v Speaker 1>just a group of people people who almost were like, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>I want to go get those people out of that castle.

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<v Speaker 1>And they said, come on, And this is the group

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<v Speaker 1>that's moving toward Castle ter and they finally get there,

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<v Speaker 1>I think about twelve hours before the siege finally began

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<v Speaker 1>on the castle.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so they suspected there were Germans coming their way,

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<v Speaker 2>and they were right. The Waffen SS. They were the

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<v Speaker 2>combat detachment of the SS. Really bad dudes, very elite fighters.

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<v Speaker 2>They arrived at the castle, like you said, about twelve

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<v Speaker 2>hours after. This ragtag group is there to defend them,

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<v Speaker 2>and they take out Basot and Jenny right away. They

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<v Speaker 2>take out that tank. It's a pretty smart move, I guess,

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<v Speaker 2>to go ahead and get the heavy artillery down. It

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<v Speaker 2>was parked in front of the main gate. So with

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<v Speaker 2>that tank gone, they were basically, you know, fully free

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<v Speaker 2>to just assault this castle outright, and a battle starts,

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<v Speaker 2>like a really gruesome battle. They inside the prison. They

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<v Speaker 2>had broken to the armory, so they had some stuff

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<v Speaker 2>to defend themselves with, like pistols, some rifles and machine guns.

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<v Speaker 2>But this was These are pistols and machine guns and rifles,

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<v Speaker 2>not heavy artillery, which is kind of what they needed

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<v Speaker 2>at that point.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I think the Nazis had some eighty millimeter gun

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<v Speaker 1>that they were using to pound the castle walls. This

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<v Speaker 1>is like a medieval siege that's going on, but with

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<v Speaker 1>modern armory, right yeah. And at first like it looked like, okay,

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<v Speaker 1>the people in the castle might be able to hold

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<v Speaker 1>this off. There's like one hundred waff in Ss attacking them.

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<v Speaker 1>But then they started to run low on ammunition. And

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<v Speaker 1>it doesn't really matter what kind of gun you have,

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<v Speaker 1>if you don't have bullets to shoot out of it,

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<v Speaker 1>you're in trouble if the people who are you're fighting

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<v Speaker 1>do still have bullets. And so by noon it was

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<v Speaker 1>starting to look really grim. And also by this time,

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<v Speaker 1>Gangle had been killed by a Nazi sniper, and I

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<v Speaker 1>saw that Jack Lee, Captain Lee was already the de

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<v Speaker 1>facto commander. Even the two French generals were deferring to

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<v Speaker 1>his command, but he was kind of co commanding with Gangle.

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<v Speaker 1>Now he was alone commanding this whole thing by himself,

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<v Speaker 1>and he came up with a plan basically to hide

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<v Speaker 1>everybody in the castle. Keep.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I really felt bad for a Gongle because he

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<v Speaker 2>turned coated against the Nazis. He's doing the right thing.

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<v Speaker 2>He brought them there and and just like a movie scene,

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<v Speaker 2>he's up on the on the top like trying to

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<v Speaker 2>get an assessment of the situation and gets taken out

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<v Speaker 2>by a sniper. It's like such a powerful movie scene,

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<v Speaker 2>you know.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, the only thing about it you would have to

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<v Speaker 1>change is that he was probably killed instantly. He would

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<v Speaker 1>have to have been shot somewhere where he could say, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>get him, get these people out of here alive.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, tells them, I said.

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<v Speaker 1>Tell the Nazis, I said.

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<v Speaker 2>Second, there's there's a really funny uh oh, yeah, who cares.

0:11:50.480 --> 0:11:53.679
<v Speaker 2>I'll go a little long. There's a really funny Dana

0:11:53.679 --> 0:11:57.520
<v Speaker 2>Gould comedy bit about his plan on his deathbed is

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<v Speaker 2>to say, you know, I've read a million dollars and

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<v Speaker 2>it's located at and that's kind of funny. But the

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<v Speaker 2>real punchline they sees like he got a time it

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<v Speaker 2>just right, he said, Otherwise you just have to lay

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<v Speaker 2>there and pretend you're dead for the remaining mints of

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<v Speaker 2>your life. That's pretty good stuff. Yeah, that's great stuff,

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<v Speaker 2>the great Dana Gold. All right, So Gongle is taken out,

0:12:24.400 --> 0:12:26.480
<v Speaker 2>Lee comes up with that plan to get hold up

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<v Speaker 2>in the keep, which is what a keep is for.

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<v Speaker 2>That's where you take your last stand in a castle.

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<v Speaker 2>So it's, you know, not a bad plan. He was like, Hey,

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<v Speaker 2>let's feed this SS into that narrow passage that leads

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<v Speaker 2>to the keep and just see if we can pick

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<v Speaker 2>them off one by one as they come in there.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and it's not a bad plan, but the chances

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<v Speaker 1>of anyone in the castle surviving during that plan is

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<v Speaker 1>pretty low. And then, just as things were at their

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<v Speaker 1>most hopeless. Seriously, this is how it happened. That column

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<v Speaker 1>of tanks that was originally contacted by the Yugoslavian handyman

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<v Speaker 1>who first made a run for it, led by Major Kramer,

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<v Speaker 1>show up and they flanked the Nazis, or attack the

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<v Speaker 1>Nazis from the rear and just immediately scatter the people

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<v Speaker 1>besieging this castle and the battle ends almost immediately.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and oh man, if this is true, then it

0:13:17.880 --> 0:13:22.000
<v Speaker 2>just rights itself, because supposedly Kramer got to the castle,

0:13:22.640 --> 0:13:25.600
<v Speaker 2>met up with Captain Lee, and Lee said, what kept you?

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<v Speaker 1>That was a quote from Lee later on recounting it.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I would punch that up to what took you

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<v Speaker 2>so long? Yeah, with it like a little wink or something.

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<v Speaker 2>But and then maybe they've fall.

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<v Speaker 1>In love, yeah, or and Kramer responds with the traffic.

0:13:39.120 --> 0:13:45.320
<v Speaker 2>Oh man, it's SuperFect, you know, very sadly well, I mean,

0:13:45.360 --> 0:13:48.000
<v Speaker 2>I guess it's good news that Gongo was the only casualty.

0:13:48.480 --> 0:13:51.080
<v Speaker 2>It's sad that that was him again because he was

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<v Speaker 2>pretty brave for going against his own kind. But he

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<v Speaker 2>was the only casualty out of all of that. And

0:13:57.120 --> 0:14:02.120
<v Speaker 2>this ragtag group held off this forest until the reinforcements arrived.

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<v Speaker 2>Like happy ending.

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<v Speaker 1>Major Lee lived to be an old man. I think

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<v Speaker 1>he died in the seventies and he was awarded the

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<v Speaker 1>Distinguished Service.

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<v Speaker 2>Cross for this amazing Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you're right. This is movie stuff like out the

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<v Speaker 1>Yin Yang right at the Yen Yang, which means, of

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<v Speaker 1>course short stuff is.

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<v Speaker 3>Out stuff you should know. Is a production of iHeartRadio.

0:14:26.760 --> 0:14:29.920
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0:14:30.120 --> 0:14:33.040
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