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Speaker 1: Oh, beat force. If it doesn't work, you're just not

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Speaker 1: using enough. You're listening to soft a Gradio Special Operations,

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Speaker 1: military news and straight talk with the guys and the community.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to Software at Radio, on Time, on Target. Yeah, yes,

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Speaker 1: stuck with me again. This week it's big Phil campaign

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Speaker 1: from across the Pond, and this week we're gonna be

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Speaker 1: taking a little adventure. We're going to talk about the

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Speaker 1: second part of selection, which is what I called Selection proper,

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Speaker 1: and then I'm gonna tell you a few tales from

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Speaker 1: my time on the anti piracy circuit, knocking about with

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Speaker 1: the pirates down in Somalia. So let's begin straight away.

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Speaker 1: We finished last time I was on talking about the

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Speaker 1: Hills phase of selection. But remember that's purely the Hill's phase.

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Speaker 1: It's called aptitude, and it's aptitude for a reason, because

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Speaker 1: it's only designed to test that you're good enough to

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Speaker 1: go on Selection proper. So selection proper then, as I

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Speaker 1: call it, what the selection proper consists of, Well, it's

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Speaker 1: the junk good face. Before you go there, you spend

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Speaker 1: a couple of weeks in Hereford preparing for it. You

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Speaker 1: learn new weapons, you learn a bit of communications, you

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Speaker 1: take some jabs. You do all your bits and pieces

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Speaker 1: you need to do for your preparation to go to

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Speaker 1: the jungle. The jungle is serious. It's proper soldiering. If

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Speaker 1: you can sold you in the jungle, you can soldier

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Speaker 1: absolutely anywhere. Is the theory behind this, So bearing your mind,

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Speaker 1: I joined the army to be a soldier. Although it

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Speaker 1: is an extremely an incredible hard phase of selection, it's

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Speaker 1: probably also one of the most enjoyable phases. And it

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Speaker 1: really was. And I want to tell I'm gonna tell

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Speaker 1: you now about what actually goes on when you go

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Speaker 1: to the jungle. So, like I said, you spend two

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Speaker 1: weeks preparation time and here, by the time you've finished

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Speaker 1: that preparation, you're more than ready and chomping at the bit. Remember,

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Speaker 1: we flew out from I think we flew from Bryans Norton,

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Speaker 1: and we flew out to Brunei, where I remember getting

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Speaker 1: off the plane and straight away as I got off

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Speaker 1: the plane, the heat absolutely smashed me in the head.

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Speaker 1: It really did. As I came down the steps of

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Speaker 1: the plane in Brunei, the heat took me straight away,

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Speaker 1: that sort of heat where it just knocks the breath

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Speaker 1: out of you, well it proper did. It was like

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Speaker 1: it was absolutely incredibly hot. So the first thing we

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Speaker 1: did when we got to Brunei, we traveled out to

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Speaker 1: the camp where we were going to be staying and

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Speaker 1: staging from. And in that camp, you've got a basher,

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Speaker 1: you've got your bed, you put your mossy net up,

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Speaker 1: and then he started your first round of briefings. Now,

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Speaker 1: for the first week or so in the jungle or

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Speaker 1: on the jungle phase of selection, it's spent actually acclimatizing.

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Speaker 1: Don't forget if you're can acclimatize when you're go into

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Speaker 1: any of these reasons where it's hot and different to

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Speaker 1: where you've just come from, it's always worth doing so.

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Speaker 1: And bearing in mind selection although it's tough is of course,

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Speaker 1: it's still worth spending the time to acclimatize because if

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Speaker 1: you don't acclimatize properly, you're gonna pick up heat injuries,

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Speaker 1: and people are going to go down really quickly, and

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Speaker 1: he's just gonna lose people for the sake of having

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Speaker 1: a bit of acclimatized some time. So how do we

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Speaker 1: spend that acclimatization. While we spent quite a bit of

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Speaker 1: it in the classroom and we were learning the stuff

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Speaker 1: that we needed to know once we got into the jungle.

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Speaker 1: Proper tactics, navigation, navigations huge in the jungle, as we're

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Speaker 1: gonna want to talk about in a bit. We also

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Speaker 1: took the opportunity to do some physical activities in the

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Speaker 1: sunshine and in the heat. Okay, it's just those incredible

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Speaker 1: beach runs where we used to leave camp first thing

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Speaker 1: in the morning for runs down these beaches, and I'm

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Speaker 1: telling you now it was tough, hard, horrible running. It

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Speaker 1: really was on sand and you know what it's like,

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Speaker 1: it's sand anyway, you know, your feet sink into it.

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Speaker 1: You can't get a proper purchase. You team to take

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Speaker 1: two steps forwards and five steps backwards in it. It

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Speaker 1: was absolutely honking and you can imagine there must have

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Speaker 1: been still ninety old blokes left on selection at this

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Speaker 1: stage of the campaign. So we're trying to run down

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Speaker 1: this beach that DS screaming at you. You're being yelled

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Speaker 1: at and all the time you've got to keep going.

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Speaker 1: You can't afford at any stage of selection to just

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Speaker 1: give up because you'll be got rid of straight away.

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Speaker 1: So no matter what they throw at you. You've got

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Speaker 1: to keep going. And remember the beach runs. And I

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Speaker 1: wasn't a very good runner, so I could go up

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Speaker 1: and down the hills okay with my pack on because

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Speaker 1: the back to the leveler. But you had these guys

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Speaker 1: who were like racing snakes, and they could let it

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Speaker 1: down the beach as quick as I could sprint, and

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Speaker 1: they could keep it up for hours and hours on end.

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Speaker 1: And I think to myself, am I ever going to

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Speaker 1: stick with this? Well, that's the thing you do. You

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Speaker 1: just stick with it. You can't be expected to catching

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Speaker 1: people up because they are just lungs on legs, you know.

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Speaker 1: But you just have to keep going. And I remember

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Speaker 1: one time coming in and I must have been near

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Speaker 1: the back of the pack. And I wasn't always near

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Speaker 1: the back of the pack when I had a burgen on,

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Speaker 1: but on this particular occasion, I was at the back

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Speaker 1: of the pack. And remember the ds hovering about, waiting

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Speaker 1: to see who was going to give up and who wasn't.

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Speaker 1: And I thought, there's no way am I gonna give up?

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Speaker 1: So we got in the camp. So that first week,

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Speaker 1: those beach runs actually did put a couple of guys

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Speaker 1: off and didn't want to go into the jungle proper. Now,

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Speaker 1: the other thing you do on that first week is

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Speaker 1: you have a look at your kit, your packet properly.

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Speaker 1: I think we looked at river crossings, We did some

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Speaker 1: of the drills you were going to be doing for real,

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Speaker 1: actually on the plains, because obviously once you get into

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Speaker 1: the jungle it's a tight environment. And it's done so

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Speaker 1: on purpose. But to learn the drills, to learn the

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Speaker 1: content drills, to learn how to fight forwards, backward, sideways,

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Speaker 1: to learn how to deal with ambushes and all that

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Speaker 1: sort of stuff, do it in the open first. We

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Speaker 1: did it all in the open first, so that we

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Speaker 1: could look around us and say, yeah, he's there, he's here,

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Speaker 1: I need to be here. This is what we do there.

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Speaker 1: You know. It was just such invaluable time spent training.

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Speaker 1: And remember training in that heat as well with all

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Speaker 1: your gear on is extremely intense. So we were we

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Speaker 1: were we were acclimatizing all the time in that first week,

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Speaker 1: first seven days, we just acclimatized, acclimatized, acclimatized, and like

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Speaker 1: they said, we covered a lot of the points that

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Speaker 1: we needed to cover once we got into the jungle proper.

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Speaker 1: So the jungle proper, and well, we were broken up

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Speaker 1: into patrols and you stay in those patrols of four

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Speaker 1: to six men until people start obviously failing, because people

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Speaker 1: do fail, in fact, they start dilapidating the minute you

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Speaker 1: get in there. You know, I remember guys went on

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Speaker 1: the first night. They really did. They just they just

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Speaker 1: didn't like it. So you're in your patrols and you

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Speaker 1: wait to be helicoptered, choppered into the jungle proper. You

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Speaker 1: have no idea what this and it was really tense

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Speaker 1: for me because you know, you have no idea what

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Speaker 1: to expect. I've not done a jungle trip proper. I've

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Speaker 1: been to Kenya before, and I've been in the trees

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Speaker 1: in Kenya, but it's not being in the woods and Kenya.

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Speaker 1: This is a jungle proper. Now, this is brune This

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Speaker 1: has got slippery, oirable snakes, it's got massive spiders. Everything

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Speaker 1: once you're dead, it's overgrown. It's secondary, it's primary, it's

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Speaker 1: there's ever anything there. Everything you expected to be the

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Speaker 1: jungle to be, it's there in Brunei. So you're waiting

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Speaker 1: to go. And remember we've we we we've finally got down.

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Speaker 1: We had all our kit packed on webbing on all

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Speaker 1: your gear. Okay, some of your gear went in in

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Speaker 1: front of you. So I was had already gone okay,

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Speaker 1: because I'll explain the set up when I get in there.

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Speaker 1: But you have stuck a base camp and you work

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Speaker 1: from the base camp, so it's a massive harbor area,

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Speaker 1: and so you're being flown into this and I remember,

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Speaker 1: but it's one of the most impressive things I've seen

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Speaker 1: in my Army career up to date. At that point

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Speaker 1: was when we lifted off and we flew low over

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Speaker 1: the treetops out to where we were going to be

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Speaker 1: dropped off, and I remember if we were sat on

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Speaker 1: the side of the chopper looking down and thinking to myself,

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Speaker 1: this is real. Now, this is proper, this is soldiering.

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Speaker 1: And I was really excited by it. And I knew

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Speaker 1: we was going to be in for an extremely hard time,

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Speaker 1: but I was massively excited by the fact that we

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Speaker 1: were actually now going to be doing some proper soldiering.

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Speaker 1: When you've been on the hills, you're just up and

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Speaker 1: down all day. It's just seeing, like I say, if

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Speaker 1: you're capable of carrying the weights to distance. You don't

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Speaker 1: do anything tactical. You don't raise your weapon, you don't

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Speaker 1: fire your weapon, you just go from eight to B.

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Speaker 1: Now we were going to be doing all these all

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Speaker 1: the all the staff proper. We're going to be soldiering

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Speaker 1: with proper soldiers. These guys who were on selection, the DS,

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Speaker 1: the staff, they were they were the top of the game.

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Speaker 1: These are the people you looked up to. And finally

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Speaker 1: you were going to be going into the air back

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Speaker 1: garden their environment and doing some soldier with them. And

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Speaker 1: I remember thinking all that sort of stuff as we

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Speaker 1: were flying across the tree tops in Bruno. Finally we

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Speaker 1: came down. You know what it's like on the l

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Speaker 1: Z massive whirling blades and dust and grit and all

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Speaker 1: sorts of stuff going all over the place. And finally

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Speaker 1: when the chopper lifts off, you're there. And I remember

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Speaker 1: we were on there sort of like they'd improvised a

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Speaker 1: helipad and they'd knocked down, you know, trees, and they

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Speaker 1: built this and built that, and you're on the helipad

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Speaker 1: or on the ELZ is as the choppler lifts off,

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Speaker 1: and when it's gone and the sound drops, all you

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Speaker 1: can hear is this mass jungle noise for the first

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Speaker 1: time you've ever heard it, You know, all the crickets

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Speaker 1: and the insects, and the screaming and the howling of

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Speaker 1: the odd monkey here and all these sounds hit it

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Speaker 1: straight away and it was just bizarre. You're like, wow,

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Speaker 1: this is incredible. But before you've even really got time

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Speaker 1: to take all that in, your burglon was on your

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Speaker 1: back and you were being told by yours you've got

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Speaker 1: to make it up to you to your harbor area. Now,

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Speaker 1: the harbor area proper wasn't anywhere near the el's it.

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Speaker 1: I can tell you that. Now right, we're geting to

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Speaker 1: basically pick up all our gear, and now we were

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Speaker 1: going up a hill and it was worse than anything

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Speaker 1: we've seen in Wales one selection, worse than anything. The

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Speaker 1: hills in this jungle were absolutely torrid. They were disgusting,

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Speaker 1: They were high, they were steep, and moreover, the weather

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Speaker 1: it was just so hot and humid and sticky. You

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Speaker 1: were sweating before you've even got off the chopper. And

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Speaker 1: now this heat had hit your proper and you were

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Speaker 1: walking into the canopy of the jungle with all your

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Speaker 1: gear on a massive amount of gear and you're walking

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Speaker 1: into the jungle proper to get into your harbor area.

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Speaker 1: And when we got to the harbor area, you were

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Speaker 1: giving your location and you started to set up. You

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Speaker 1: built your a frames where you were going to sleep,

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Speaker 1: which is like a basher arrangement, like a hammock type

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Speaker 1: thing with a canopy over the top of it. And

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Speaker 1: you started to build your little area, okay, and that

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Speaker 1: took some time, and it was nice to do that,

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Speaker 1: and the d s would come around and explain to

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Speaker 1: your how things were going to be and what your

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Speaker 1: arks of fire were. And once you're in the jungle proper,

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Speaker 1: everything is done tactically. Okay, there's no all right with

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Speaker 1: our terminuts offer this with our terminuts offer that we'll

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Speaker 1: go on tak will get a pizza, all that sort

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Speaker 1: of stuff. Everything is done tactically. So you go everywhere

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Speaker 1: and pairs, you take your were when your weapon everywhere.

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Speaker 1: The whole thing is done as if at any time

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Speaker 1: you could be attacked and you have to disappear, okay.

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Speaker 1: And to that end, you had drills, you know, you

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Speaker 1: had you knew where you are, your emergency wonder who

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Speaker 1: was and if you got double to go to the

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Speaker 1: egests you who you had to go to. The e

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Speaker 1: r V was ever present. So you in your harbor area.

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Speaker 1: Remember the first night of selection, the first night in

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Speaker 1: the jungle proper, you're like, you go to sleep because

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Speaker 1: you sleep under the canopy. Once it gets dark, you

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Speaker 1: can't go anywhere, you can't see anywhere. I remember the

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Speaker 1: first night, they're thinking, Wow, I wonder what this is

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Speaker 1: all going to be about. I was in my dry kit,

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Speaker 1: in my bash of sleeping, and I'm thinking to myself,

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Speaker 1: this is gonna be this is gonna be one of

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Speaker 1: the hardest things I've ever done in my life. The

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Speaker 1: next morning we got up and the first period of selection,

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Speaker 1: for about three weeks, is all lessons, but it's all

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Speaker 1: done tactically. There's a big schoolhouse in there that they've

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Speaker 1: built out of logs and an old canopy and all

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Speaker 1: that sort of stuff. And you every morning and you

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Speaker 1: wake up, you stand to okay, so you stand to

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Speaker 1: you by your basher. The DS come around they check

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Speaker 1: everybody's all right. Once you stood too, you get your

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Speaker 1: kid together and it disappeared up to the school else

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Speaker 1: and you start having the many many lessons. A lot

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Speaker 1: of lessons are basic, basic soldier, and I've always been

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Speaker 1: told to be a Special Forces soldier. It's just basic

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Speaker 1: soldiering done extremely well. Okay, So there's no there's no

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Speaker 1: swinging off ropes, dangling in the water and fighting underneath

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Speaker 1: the waves. Okay, it's just basic soldiering done well. And

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Speaker 1: to that end, you cover a lot of the lessons

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Speaker 1: you've covered before as a normal soldier. But the foundations

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Speaker 1: of a soldier are laid in those basic lessons, and

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Speaker 1: if you can't get them right, there's no point You

255
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Speaker 1: even cover things like marksmanship, the marksmanship principles and things

256
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Speaker 1: like that, just to make sure that everybody's got put

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Speaker 1: themselves completely wired tight. So it's first three weeks extremely

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Speaker 1: intense because not only having the lessons, it's like a

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Speaker 1: monkey see monkey, monkey siege monkey does they show you,

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Speaker 1: you go and they you, they demonstrate it, okay, and

261
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Speaker 1: then you go and do it too. So everything they

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Speaker 1: do you do. You did navigation exercises where we walked

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Speaker 1: for two or three days on end, sometimes into the jungle,

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Speaker 1: practicing all our drills, laying up at night and all

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Speaker 1: that sort of stuff. We practiced ambushes, We practice contact drills.

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Speaker 1: Do you name it all the skills required to become

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Speaker 1: a Special Forces soldier or a basic Special Forces operated

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Speaker 1: because like I said, you never stopped learning in the

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Speaker 1: regiment we're being instilled into in this first three weeks, okay,

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Speaker 1: and that was your time to practice everything. That was

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Speaker 1: the time to get everything right. So you would go,

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Speaker 1: you know, on extremely Some of the exercises would go

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Speaker 1: on for a couple of days, some would last for

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Speaker 1: half an hour, but you would cover everything you needed

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Speaker 1: to cover to become a Special Forces operator. Okay. At

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Speaker 1: the end of that three weeks, then it's then time

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Speaker 1: to be tested. It's then time to run like a

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Speaker 1: three or four week exercise where all the skills you've

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Speaker 1: learned are put into practice, okay, and you disappear out

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Speaker 1: onto the area. Okay. Now, Brunei is a huge area.

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Speaker 1: It's got massively dense jungle. So you disappear into the jungle.

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Speaker 1: And just like the old days in Borneo and Malaya

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Speaker 1: and places like that, where the regiment operated and conducted

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Speaker 1: some superb operations in the jungle, you were now doing

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Speaker 1: this sort of thing on an exercise and it was

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Speaker 1: absolutely superb. But like I said, what you gotta remember

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Speaker 1: is the whole time you are in the jungle. You

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Speaker 1: can be sacked absolutely any type. They can get rid

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Speaker 1: of you for anything at any time. Okay, it could

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Speaker 1: be you know, you haven't done something properly, you've skyped off,

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Speaker 1: you've smoked when you shouldn't have smoked. You've got to

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Speaker 1: accept that when you go into the jungle, Okay, you're

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Speaker 1: being watched seven and you might not see them watching you, okay,

294
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Speaker 1: but they are watching it. They are there somewhere, somebody

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Speaker 1: is having to look at you all the time. So

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Speaker 1: you can't afford the sky of off. And it goes

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Speaker 1: back to the EPOS where I spoke about that last

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Speaker 1: time I was on this show. The e FOS number

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Speaker 1: two Highest standards of self discipline. Okay, do you need

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Speaker 1: the highest standards of self discipline and jungle? There's no

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Speaker 1: point a soldier being in the jungle who's going to

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Speaker 1: do his own thing because in theory, when you're not

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Speaker 1: being watched b a DS and it's not a parcel

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Speaker 1: file on a course. Yeah, you probably could have a

305
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Speaker 1: slight cigarette. Yeah, you probably could have hot food when

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Speaker 1: you shouldn't be having hot food. But worse than the

307
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Speaker 1: d S when you do it for real. It is

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Speaker 1: the enemy that are coming after you. So that cigarette

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Speaker 1: or that smell of hot food is the thing that

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Speaker 1: compromises your whole patrol and gets you whacked. Okay. So

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Speaker 1: that's why they make it so intense in the jungle.

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Speaker 1: That's why they you under scrutiny the whole time, and

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Speaker 1: that's why you feel as if there is an enemy presence.

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Speaker 1: It's not enemy, it's a DS And you know, the

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Speaker 1: prize is not winning the operation or whatever it might be.

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Speaker 1: The prize is that sanbury at the end of it.

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Speaker 1: The prize is getting into that unit, you know, one

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Speaker 1: of the where I consider it the best unit in

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Speaker 1: the world, the S A S. Sure a few of

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Speaker 1: you over there would disagree with me or have your

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Speaker 1: arguments with me, but for me, the S A S

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Speaker 1: is the toughest regiment in the world. And the prize

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Speaker 1: at the end we're not at the end of the

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Speaker 1: jungle leaving, but the prize at the end of the

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Speaker 1: selection is that very Okay, he's wearing that wing dagger

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Speaker 1: on your head, and you've got to accept any time

327
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Speaker 1: that can be taken away from you in the jungle, okay,

328
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Speaker 1: And failure is probably fear by most people, you know,

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Speaker 1: more than anything else. You know, failure is it is

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Speaker 1: a feared thing, alright. So like I say that the

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Speaker 1: constraints that you operate under un selection are extremely real

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Speaker 1: because there is this fear all the time that you

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Speaker 1: could be you could be slung off and sent home,

334
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Speaker 1: just know what I mean, and you don't want that.

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Speaker 1: And obviously all the times is going on, some guys

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Speaker 1: have decided for themselves this ain't for me. Plenty of

337
00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:42,240
Speaker 1: guys turned around and just left the course, okay. And

338
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Speaker 1: by the time we were coming near to the final

339
00:16:44,080 --> 00:16:47,360
Speaker 1: exercises in the Trees, I don't know how many bloods

340
00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:51,640
Speaker 1: we had left. We must have been down if that.

341
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Speaker 1: So the numbers are depleted completely from when we started

342
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Speaker 1: off after the Trees or after the hills even you know,

343
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Speaker 1: and the three hundred started selection is now probably down

344
00:17:02,600 --> 00:17:05,360
Speaker 1: to about twenty or twenty five, okay. So the numbers

345
00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:08,520
Speaker 1: that the Trees claims is phenomenal, okay, and rightly so,

346
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Speaker 1: because it is a tough place, and like the same,

347
00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:13,520
Speaker 1: selection is designed to find out who is going to

348
00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:17,320
Speaker 1: be capable of operating within this to these these two

349
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Speaker 1: one units of the SBS and the s A s okay.

350
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Speaker 1: So it's an extremely tough test for a reason. So

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Speaker 1: I'm just I'm straying away from the trees at the

352
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Speaker 1: moment and just explaining to you about selection. But this

353
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Speaker 1: those finals, those those final days of the exercise, I

354
00:17:31,080 --> 00:17:33,640
Speaker 1: can tell you because you don't know either when it's

355
00:17:33,640 --> 00:17:35,280
Speaker 1: going to finish. They don't give you a date. They

356
00:17:35,280 --> 00:17:37,200
Speaker 1: don't go we'll be going home on the twenty two.

357
00:17:37,600 --> 00:17:39,520
Speaker 1: They just tell you you're on selection, okay, So you

358
00:17:39,560 --> 00:17:41,320
Speaker 1: don't know what day of the exercise is going to

359
00:17:41,400 --> 00:17:43,960
Speaker 1: finish proper. You get the old jungle drums, you get

360
00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:46,040
Speaker 1: the old rumors you might have had had an inkl

361
00:17:46,040 --> 00:17:48,159
Speaker 1: and how long selection goes on for, but you don't

362
00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:50,560
Speaker 1: know exactly when it's going to fish down. I remember,

363
00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:53,720
Speaker 1: you know, we we we attacked a jungle base camp

364
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Speaker 1: on one of the final attacks that we did, and

365
00:17:56,359 --> 00:17:59,480
Speaker 1: then we were switched to another camp, okay, which we

366
00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:01,800
Speaker 1: didn't know was there. And then we're thinking, and they're

367
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Speaker 1: gonna walk as a bit further, we're gonna go. You

368
00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:06,439
Speaker 1: just don't know. And the point of being there, and

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00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:09,720
Speaker 1: it goes back, it goes back to what Sterling said again,

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Speaker 1: and I keep referring back to the epos, but it's true,

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Speaker 1: an unrelented pursuit of excellence, Okay, And that's with any attack.

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Speaker 1: Don't just think because you've taken one position, that's it done,

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Speaker 1: it's over for the day, because there might be positions

374
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Speaker 1: in depth, you might have more enemy to go on after.

375
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Speaker 1: And so this thing is sort of like, right, I'm done,

376
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Speaker 1: Now I've done, I've achieved. That's not the thing you

377
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Speaker 1: want to be looking for in a person. You want

378
00:18:31,760 --> 00:18:33,600
Speaker 1: to be looking for the guy that wants the next challenge,

379
00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:35,360
Speaker 1: that wants to keep going, that wants the next thing

380
00:18:35,400 --> 00:18:38,240
Speaker 1: to come with him, and through the selection, that's exactly

381
00:18:38,280 --> 00:18:40,679
Speaker 1: how they run it. That's exactly what they do. They

382
00:18:40,760 --> 00:18:42,560
Speaker 1: keep you going all the time. I'm not to say

383
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Speaker 1: by the time we'd finished, we've probably had about three

384
00:18:45,320 --> 00:18:47,280
Speaker 1: or four false what we thought we're going to be

385
00:18:47,320 --> 00:18:49,399
Speaker 1: the end. We've had about three or four times it

386
00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:51,639
Speaker 1: had been, it hadn't been the end, and we carried on.

387
00:18:51,680 --> 00:18:53,119
Speaker 1: And you've just got to get your head around that

388
00:18:53,240 --> 00:18:55,040
Speaker 1: and not focus on what you think is the end,

389
00:18:55,080 --> 00:18:57,240
Speaker 1: but focus on what you think is coming next, or

390
00:18:57,280 --> 00:19:00,520
Speaker 1: what you want to come next. Might not happen. So yeah,

391
00:19:00,640 --> 00:19:02,359
Speaker 1: by the time they actually did say it was right,

392
00:19:02,400 --> 00:19:04,560
Speaker 1: this is the end of the exercise. I actually didn't

393
00:19:04,560 --> 00:19:06,880
Speaker 1: believe them. I'm not no, no, no, no, no, that's

394
00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:08,600
Speaker 1: not going to be the end of the exercise. But

395
00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:11,199
Speaker 1: sure enough it was. And I remember we did like

396
00:19:11,240 --> 00:19:14,080
Speaker 1: a reor the reorganization on the last position that we took,

397
00:19:14,359 --> 00:19:16,480
Speaker 1: and we sat down and the DS came around and said, look,

398
00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:18,320
Speaker 1: you know it's over. You know, that's the end of

399
00:19:18,359 --> 00:19:20,840
Speaker 1: the trees phase. And then we all pulled into the middle.

400
00:19:21,080 --> 00:19:24,199
Speaker 1: We weren't too far from a helipad obviously, you know,

401
00:19:24,320 --> 00:19:26,480
Speaker 1: most of the kit from the jungle camp had already gone,

402
00:19:26,480 --> 00:19:28,800
Speaker 1: that had been collapsed. We were now operating in the

403
00:19:28,800 --> 00:19:31,199
Speaker 1: middle of nowhere, so we were ready to go. We

404
00:19:31,320 --> 00:19:34,600
Speaker 1: literally we packed our kit and patrol at the time,

405
00:19:34,680 --> 00:19:37,040
Speaker 1: or what was left of your patrols. Most of the patrols,

406
00:19:37,080 --> 00:19:38,919
Speaker 1: that's all I had too from this patrol, one from

407
00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:41,119
Speaker 1: that patrol. We know, we've all been amalgamated by this

408
00:19:41,160 --> 00:19:43,359
Speaker 1: stage of the campaign because of the amount of numbers

409
00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:45,879
Speaker 1: that were leaving patrol at the time we disappeared back

410
00:19:45,920 --> 00:19:48,280
Speaker 1: up to the helipad, and the same helicopters that took

411
00:19:48,320 --> 00:19:50,600
Speaker 1: us into the trees took us back out again. And

412
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Speaker 1: I remember I was probably about the fourth or fifth

413
00:19:53,359 --> 00:19:56,520
Speaker 1: patrol to go, waiting to go, and I heard the

414
00:19:56,520 --> 00:19:59,560
Speaker 1: bird come in and it came bum bum bum bum

415
00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:01,800
Speaker 1: bum bum them and it landed in the thing you

416
00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:03,959
Speaker 1: hold the dust and confusion again. We got on this thing.

417
00:20:04,000 --> 00:20:06,440
Speaker 1: As it lifted up, the low master kicked me in

418
00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:08,800
Speaker 1: the back of the in in the lower of me

419
00:20:08,840 --> 00:20:11,040
Speaker 1: back because I was sat on the skids and pass

420
00:20:11,119 --> 00:20:13,160
Speaker 1: for a can of beer to pass to the next

421
00:20:13,160 --> 00:20:14,960
Speaker 1: man down. And we all sat there with a canno

422
00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:18,359
Speaker 1: beer on this helicopter flying out of the trees. Job done,

423
00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:20,240
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. And now but you don't

424
00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:23,200
Speaker 1: know if you've passed or failed. So it's job done.

425
00:20:23,359 --> 00:20:25,240
Speaker 1: You can't do anymore. There's no more you're gonna do

426
00:20:25,320 --> 00:20:26,760
Speaker 1: to prove yourself in the trees because you're not in

427
00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:28,880
Speaker 1: there anymore. It's all done. So now you've just got

428
00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:31,840
Speaker 1: to accept the decision of the DS, and you don't

429
00:20:31,840 --> 00:20:33,639
Speaker 1: know what that's going to be. And remember you go

430
00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:35,480
Speaker 1: back to camp and you have a wash and a

431
00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:38,200
Speaker 1: shave because obviously haven't had a proper a proper decent

432
00:20:38,240 --> 00:20:40,520
Speaker 1: washing a shave. All the time you're in there, and

433
00:20:40,560 --> 00:20:42,520
Speaker 1: all the time you're thinking, are they're gonna call me?

434
00:20:42,560 --> 00:20:44,359
Speaker 1: Are they're gonna get me? They're gonna say I failed,

435
00:20:44,440 --> 00:20:47,040
Speaker 1: They're gonna say I passed, And they don't tell you.

436
00:20:47,560 --> 00:20:49,960
Speaker 1: They don't tell you. We had a night where we

437
00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:52,480
Speaker 1: had quite a few beers on the first night we

438
00:20:52,520 --> 00:20:55,639
Speaker 1: come out, so everybody's drinking and they're probably in trove.

439
00:20:56,040 --> 00:20:58,119
Speaker 1: You know, they're looking at you now to see who

440
00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:00,399
Speaker 1: thinks it's over, to see who thinks they can have

441
00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:02,280
Speaker 1: that many piers and be stupid and all that sort

442
00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:04,320
Speaker 1: of things. So you're not you're not out of the woods.

443
00:21:04,520 --> 00:21:06,160
Speaker 1: You're not out, You're not there yet. So I remember

444
00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:07,720
Speaker 1: we had that night on the Pierson. It was quite

445
00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:10,320
Speaker 1: a strange night because there's still some guys knocking about

446
00:21:10,320 --> 00:21:11,760
Speaker 1: the camp who were failed. They were going back, and

447
00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:13,680
Speaker 1: we're not going to join the regiment. So you've got

448
00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:14,960
Speaker 1: to sort of like get your head around that a

449
00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:16,879
Speaker 1: little bit. And then we woke up the next morning

450
00:21:17,320 --> 00:21:20,639
Speaker 1: and I woke up and I remember they were sending

451
00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:22,879
Speaker 1: the company Clark round to go and get people that

452
00:21:22,960 --> 00:21:25,760
Speaker 1: have failed. So we'd come around. He'd knocked the glay

453
00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:27,600
Speaker 1: on the top of the head who was in his bed, right,

454
00:21:27,840 --> 00:21:30,639
Speaker 1: they want to see you. They're going down there and

455
00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:32,280
Speaker 1: they've been talented. They failed, and they come back and

456
00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:35,399
Speaker 1: go I failed, And he looked at me, and and

457
00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:38,360
Speaker 1: there's the Company Clarks walking into walking into the room.

458
00:21:38,400 --> 00:21:40,680
Speaker 1: He is the most feared man in the world because

459
00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:42,560
Speaker 1: you know if he gets you, you failed the course.

460
00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:45,840
Speaker 1: So this is, after you've completed this period of time

461
00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:48,040
Speaker 1: in the jungle, which has been probably the hardest thing

462
00:21:48,080 --> 00:21:50,440
Speaker 1: you've ever done in your life. You're now waiting for

463
00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:52,199
Speaker 1: the Company Clark to come around and give you a

464
00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:54,840
Speaker 1: tap on the shoulder, and if he does, the likelihood

465
00:21:54,880 --> 00:21:57,440
Speaker 1: is you've failed. So that morning was particularly hideous. And

466
00:21:57,480 --> 00:22:00,000
Speaker 1: I remember it got to about midday. He was still

467
00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:02,840
Speaker 1: going because each guy just doesn't get told they failed.

468
00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:05,439
Speaker 1: They'll they'll probably have an interview and told why as well.

469
00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:07,159
Speaker 1: As The process took quite a bit of time. But

470
00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:10,480
Speaker 1: by midday the clerk has stopped coming around and the

471
00:22:10,520 --> 00:22:15,080
Speaker 1: ones who passed were setting on scratches, thinking, yeah, we

472
00:22:15,080 --> 00:22:17,960
Speaker 1: we might that we might not have done. Eventually, the

473
00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:20,840
Speaker 1: clerk comes around for the final time and says that's it.

474
00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:23,480
Speaker 1: You know, the rest of you. You're going back to Hereford.

475
00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:26,040
Speaker 1: You don't forget you haven't passed an excellent at this stage.

476
00:22:26,240 --> 00:22:28,680
Speaker 1: You've just had, you know, a period in your life

477
00:22:28,680 --> 00:22:31,080
Speaker 1: which is probably the hardest you've ever had. You still

478
00:22:31,119 --> 00:22:35,280
Speaker 1: haven't passed at this stage, but you have passed what

479
00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:38,880
Speaker 1: I term as the probably the hardest past selection, which

480
00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:42,920
Speaker 1: is the Trees. Okay, So now, certainly in the eyes

481
00:22:42,960 --> 00:22:44,720
Speaker 1: of the DS, I think they gave you a bit

482
00:22:44,720 --> 00:22:46,919
Speaker 1: more respect at this stage of the campaign, you know.

483
00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:49,199
Speaker 1: And if I'd have been at d S myself, you know,

484
00:22:49,440 --> 00:22:52,160
Speaker 1: looking at soldiers that have come through this part of selection,

485
00:22:52,680 --> 00:22:55,000
Speaker 1: they'd be getting a bit more respect for yourself as

486
00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:57,560
Speaker 1: in terms of as in terms of you know, you're

487
00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:02,080
Speaker 1: closer to the door than what you were. So that said,

488
00:23:02,359 --> 00:23:04,800
Speaker 1: that was the Trees. You know. We we spent a

489
00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:06,919
Speaker 1: couple of more days kicking around while we waiting for

490
00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:09,639
Speaker 1: the flights. In that time, we cleaned no weapons, We've

491
00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:12,440
Speaker 1: got everything ship shape, and then we flew back to Hereford.

492
00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:15,359
Speaker 1: Do you know what. I can't remember where we flew into.

493
00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:17,480
Speaker 1: But we get back and like they say, it's straight

494
00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:19,840
Speaker 1: back up to Hereford onto the camp and then you're

495
00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:22,680
Speaker 1: going onto the next phase, which I'll cover at some

496
00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:26,480
Speaker 1: stage in the future. But yeah, they say the jungle

497
00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:29,080
Speaker 1: was the hardest thing I've ever done, but probably at

498
00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:30,880
Speaker 1: this stage one of the best things I've ever done.

499
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:34,400
Speaker 1: And don't forget this. If you find something you enjoy doing,

500
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:38,080
Speaker 1: it's not work. Okay, it's not work, it's enjoyment. It

501
00:23:38,119 --> 00:23:40,000
Speaker 1: was a pleasure to be there. And people do often

502
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:42,480
Speaker 1: ask me about selection and say, you know how I

503
00:23:42,720 --> 00:23:44,679
Speaker 1: was the trees where our trees was extremely hard, but

504
00:23:44,680 --> 00:23:48,600
Speaker 1: because I was enjoying it, it overweighed the extreme harshness

505
00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:51,280
Speaker 1: of the course, okay, and made it bearable. So there

506
00:23:51,280 --> 00:23:54,440
Speaker 1: you go. That was the trees. Okay, I'll continue. I've

507
00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:56,520
Speaker 1: done you in a little bit there because I've gone

508
00:23:56,560 --> 00:23:59,520
Speaker 1: so long into this show with the trees, although I

509
00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:01,480
Speaker 1: think it was worth it. We haven't got a lot

510
00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:03,439
Speaker 1: of time for antipiracy. What I will say is my

511
00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:07,000
Speaker 1: Taiwan anti piracy was a great time. I spent about

512
00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:10,000
Speaker 1: five years in the Gulf of Aden and around those areas,

513
00:24:10,040 --> 00:24:14,240
Speaker 1: transitting up and down protecting ships from the pirates from Somalia.

514
00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:16,120
Speaker 1: I haven't really got time to go into it that's

515
00:24:16,119 --> 00:24:18,120
Speaker 1: going to have to be one next My next show

516
00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:19,879
Speaker 1: is going to be on anti piracy because I have

517
00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:23,359
Speaker 1: probably got at least half an hour's worth of material

518
00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:25,800
Speaker 1: up and talk to you about with anti piracy, you know,

519
00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:28,760
Speaker 1: how it came about, where they came from, what they

520
00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:30,800
Speaker 1: were doing in the first place, because don't forget, you

521
00:24:30,800 --> 00:24:33,679
Speaker 1: don't just become a pirate overnight. Again, these people in

522
00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:37,080
Speaker 1: some respects were forced into piracy by client, by by

523
00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:39,840
Speaker 1: by by by the stuff that was going on around them.

524
00:24:40,160 --> 00:24:42,679
Speaker 1: I'll cover more of that. You know, how do they operate?

525
00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:44,680
Speaker 1: What was their motors up around on? How in there?

526
00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:47,320
Speaker 1: And it changed as well. So they started off, you know,

527
00:24:47,359 --> 00:24:50,159
Speaker 1: in these in these small skiffs, but they progressed and

528
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:52,560
Speaker 1: they grew and as we started going down there and

529
00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:55,359
Speaker 1: putting up these counter measures, they started getting bigger and

530
00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:57,600
Speaker 1: so the tactics changed. So we'll talk about that with

531
00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:00,359
Speaker 1: the antipiracy because that's very important to understand that. And

532
00:25:00,359 --> 00:25:02,159
Speaker 1: then look, I say, I'll give you a few of

533
00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:04,479
Speaker 1: the stories where actually came face to face for pirates,

534
00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:06,760
Speaker 1: so that would be interesting. We'll do it at least

535
00:25:06,760 --> 00:25:09,040
Speaker 1: time I'm on the show. As always, be sure to

536
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:12,159
Speaker 1: check out user dot com for the latest foreign policy,

537
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:16,080
Speaker 1: security and defense news, and also great Club dot com,

538
00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:20,040
Speaker 1: the spects, great gear, hand picked pub professionals. See you

539
00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:23,040
Speaker 1: all again soon, Big Phil signing off. Who dares with

540
00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:29,000
Speaker 1: us them? Listening to Self Rep Radio? New episodes up

541
00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:33,000
Speaker 1: every Wednesday and Friday. Follow the show on Instagram and

542
00:25:33,080 --> 00:25:35,080
Speaker 1: Twitter at self Rep Radio