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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live weekdays at ten am

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Speaker 1: or watch us live on YouTube.

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Speaker 2: All right, here we go. Here's the headline.

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Speaker 3: German Parliament clears the way for early election in February.

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Speaker 3: So then it does imply that Olaf Schultz did lose

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Speaker 3: the snap election and will excuse me, did lose the

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Speaker 3: vote of no confidence and then we'll have the snap

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Speaker 3: election in late February. So to that point, expenditures on machinery,

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Speaker 3: for example, are more than nine percent below pre pandemic levels.

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Speaker 3: And it's those family owned companies that's saying they're not

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Speaker 3: even planning to replace what breaks, and they're blaming breocracy

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Speaker 3: and unpredictable policies. I mean, yikes, that's a tough one.

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Speaker 4: It really is. And then again, and I'm just looking

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Speaker 4: at some reporting from Bloomberg and just you know, saying,

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Speaker 4: like Germany, in many parts of the world, Germany's politics

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Speaker 4: has shifted to the right and it is fragmented, so

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Speaker 4: making getting a coalition government together perhaps even more difficult

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Speaker 4: than in past times. And we're seeing something similar in

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Speaker 4: France as well, with their left and right. It kind

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Speaker 4: of makes what we do here seem a little bit

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Speaker 4: more a little better than maybe we sometimes think.

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Speaker 3: All right, Oliver Krook joins us now All Bloomberg europe

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Speaker 3: correspondent for more on this. I mean again that headline

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Speaker 3: is German parliament clears the way for the early.

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Speaker 2: Election in February. All right, Oliver, give us the details.

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Speaker 5: Quite a day for all Off Schultz before the parliament.

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Speaker 5: This all began basically a one pm local time here

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Speaker 5: with a twenty five minute speech by Olof Schultz where

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Speaker 5: he was really sort of putting out his sort of

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Speaker 5: stakes in terms of what he would like to have

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Speaker 5: to do with another term as chancellor. Then a two

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Speaker 5: hour debate by all the lawmakers in the Bundestag. This

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Speaker 5: is a pretty spirited, i would say, campaign event, in

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Speaker 5: a campaign generally speaking by German standards, it's been fairly personal.

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Speaker 5: It's been quite vicious at points. I mean, Olaf Schultz

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Speaker 5: was talking about the FDP, that is the party that

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Speaker 5: had the finance ministry. He fired as Finance minister because

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Speaker 5: of disagreement over the budget. He's saying that basically they're

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Speaker 5: morally unfit to govern. Mertz, for his part, the head

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Speaker 5: of the CDU, Angela Markles, Merkel's traditional party, so that

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Speaker 5: you know Schultz is a failed chancellor. And then on

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Speaker 5: the other side of things, on the far right, you

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Speaker 5: have the Alternative for Deutschland, the far right group that

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Speaker 5: has twenty percent of the vote going into this election,

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Speaker 5: saying that basically Germany is on the brink of collapse.

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Speaker 5: In a vote for Frederic Mertz and the CDU is

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Speaker 5: a vote for war with Russia. So that's some of

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Speaker 5: the flavor of what we had today. And after that,

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Speaker 5: we had these lawmakers going forward and putting forward and

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Speaker 5: voting against Ola Schultz government as it turns out of

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Speaker 5: the end, and this is the last step to basically

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Speaker 5: Ola Schultz to go to the President of Germany to

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Speaker 5: basically dissolve the government and basically pave the way for

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Speaker 5: that election that is slated for February the twenty third.

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Speaker 4: All right, feb s fast forward to February twenty third.

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Speaker 4: Is any expectation of how this may go. To talk

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Speaker 4: to us about what are some of the options for

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Speaker 4: the German people.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, so what you have right now is the CDU,

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Speaker 5: the again the conservative center right party of Germany that

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Speaker 5: is basically leading the polls really since the beginning and

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Speaker 5: for you know, a couple of years. Now I have

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Speaker 5: about thirty one percent of the vote. What is interesting,

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Speaker 5: what makes this election quite a bit different from ones

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Speaker 5: in the past, is that you have the Alternative for

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Speaker 5: Deutschland again, the really quite far right party in Germany

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Speaker 5: with number two spot with twenty percent, basically a fifth

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Speaker 5: of the German vote. That has not happened in really

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Speaker 5: post war Germany at all. So that is sort of

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Speaker 5: one of these sort of clear issues there. And the

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Speaker 5: thing is that nobody will work with them. Basically, no

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Speaker 5: coalition is possible with the AfD. This has been made

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Speaker 5: clear even by you know, the conservative parties within Germany.

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Speaker 5: They just won't basically touch it. Then Olaf Schultz has

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Speaker 5: been closing the gap a little bit on third place,

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Speaker 5: and that basically sets us off for a grand coalition

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Speaker 5: CDU SPD. This is something that has happened a lot

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Speaker 5: in history. Merkel, you know, had this this arrangement. In fact,

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Speaker 5: Olof Schultz was the finance minister under Merkel under that coalition.

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Speaker 5: The issue that that brings is that that may bring

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Speaker 5: some of the same problems that we had with this government,

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Speaker 5: which is massive disagreements on how to spend money at

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Speaker 5: a time when the German economy is really limping, there

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Speaker 5: is zero growth, and as a consequence, as we're learning

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Speaker 5: in France as well, when you have zero growth, you

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Speaker 5: don't have as much money to play with, you have

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Speaker 5: budgets that bring down the government.

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Speaker 3: Here's my totally unfair question to you, Oliver. I'm just

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Speaker 3: wondering in what capacity in Europe is snap elections ever worked.

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Speaker 3: I'm like genuinely trying to think back, and it seems

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Speaker 3: like a lot of times the individual and power things

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Speaker 3: that it will help cement a mandate at some point,

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Speaker 3: and that's why this sort of eventually evolves, but it

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Speaker 3: never seems to work well.

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Speaker 5: So listen, that's what makes it. That's the sort of

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Speaker 5: distinction between the German snap election and the French one.

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Speaker 4: Right.

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Speaker 5: The German one is basically forced because they basically fired

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Speaker 5: one part of their coalition government and basically kicked them

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Speaker 5: out of government and no longer had a mandate to govern,

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Speaker 5: so they just basically had to do it. This is

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Speaker 5: not going to go well for Olof Schultz, that is clear.

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Speaker 5: The mac Hoole one was a bit more of a

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Speaker 5: wild card, really a kind of you know, really a

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Speaker 5: skydive into sort of political uncertainty, and really I think

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Speaker 5: seen by most as a real miscalculation because it did

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Speaker 5: not go at all his way, and we're seeing the

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Speaker 5: sort of consequences of that. To say when it has worked,

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Speaker 5: I mean I only because I was reading about this today.

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Speaker 5: If we have to go back to the nineteen seventies,

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Speaker 5: I can give you an example of Willie Brandt in

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Speaker 5: the sort of west of Germany. So that was one

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Speaker 5: to sort of consolidate some power. But yeah, I have

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Speaker 5: to say the last few, certainly this year, have not

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Speaker 5: really gone that way for these leaders.

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Speaker 4: And Oliver, you're mentioning about the AfD, the far right

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Speaker 4: party now roughly twenty percent of the votes. I'm not

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Speaker 4: sure you can ignore them anymore. I mean, how can

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Speaker 4: a couplation go from ignore one in five voters.

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Speaker 5: Well, this is a very interesting part of the debate,

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Speaker 5: and I think it's something that we've seen across the

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Speaker 5: political spectrum in a number of different countries. I mean

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Speaker 5: you arguably, you know you've had this happen In Italy.

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Speaker 5: You have Georgia Maloney, who was once really considered a

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Speaker 5: sort of pariah, this sort of Brothers of Italy. She

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Speaker 5: is now Minister Vidley and in some ways the European

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Speaker 5: leader with the most powerful mandate in all of Europe.

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Speaker 5: You're seeing the same thing happening in France with Marine

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Speaker 5: Lepenn who you know, for a very long time was

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Speaker 5: basically totally ignored by the political establishment in France and

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Speaker 5: that is no longer an option. The question is when

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Speaker 5: does that come to Germany. Of course, the issue with

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Speaker 5: Germany that comes fraught in Leyden with much more political

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Speaker 5: charged issues from the past and basically with the far

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Speaker 5: right and the sort of history of fascism that has

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Speaker 5: occurred in Germany. This is a very sensitive topic for

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Speaker 5: the Germans and for many people in Germany, which is

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Speaker 5: why you see a lot of protesting in the streets

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Speaker 5: against this party. But again increasingly something that just cannot

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Speaker 5: be ignored.

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Speaker 3: And my real question is does any outcome lead the

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Speaker 3: German government to spend more money? Period, That's the only

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Speaker 3: thing that's going to make a big difference.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, and the answer no likely outcome will basically lead

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Speaker 5: to that. Because there was some debate about this going

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Speaker 5: into the election that we were seeing from the CDU,

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Speaker 5: the center right party, basically saying that they were, hey,

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Speaker 5: maybe going to think about, you know, releasing the debt break.

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Speaker 5: There would be some conditions. But we actually saw a

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Speaker 5: copy of their early draft of their platform which they

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Speaker 5: haven't yet released, that says that basically, you know, dead

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Speaker 5: of today is the tax of tomorrow. We are not

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Speaker 5: going to touch the debt break. And this is the

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Speaker 5: fundamental point here in Germany, right, what is the point

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Speaker 5: and this is what many critics think of having really

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Speaker 5: really low borrowing costs if you don't borrow any money

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Speaker 5: when you're in a crisis situation. And what is interesting

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Speaker 5: is that Angela Merkel has actually just released her memoir

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Speaker 5: and she is the one who actually brought in the

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Speaker 5: debt break in two thousand and nine. And just to

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Speaker 5: remind people, this is part of the constitution, This is

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Speaker 5: not just the law. This takes two thirds of the

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Speaker 5: parliament to change the debt break. She is advocating now

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Speaker 5: that they do something about the debt break and they

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Speaker 5: change it. So this is going to be at the

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Speaker 5: very center of things, but at the moment not looking

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Speaker 5: like it's going to change.

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Speaker 4: Is there any expectation that there could be a very

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Speaker 4: a challenge to this change in power, that there may

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Speaker 4: be some I don't know, just something around this election

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Speaker 4: that could get even worse here for the German people.

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Speaker 5: I mean, I think that the problem with this election

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Speaker 5: and this sort of again another coalition government and you

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Speaker 5: know a bit of disagreement, is that it's just basically

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Speaker 5: not going to solve Germany's fundamental problems. And I think

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Speaker 5: that even when you look at the platforms of what

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Speaker 5: a lot of these politicians are offering, the business community

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Speaker 5: that I speak to, the lobby groups that I speak to,

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Speaker 5: is basically, you know, everyone seems to be coming to

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Speaker 5: the sick man of Europe with cyclical medicines. What we

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Speaker 5: have is a structural illness.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 5: There are problems with the energy sector, there are problems

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Speaker 5: with labor costs, and there's a problem with a business

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Speaker 5: model that was basically very export oriented, where you have

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Speaker 5: all of your inputs that are much more expensive in journey.

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Speaker 5: Also at a time when you have just much less

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Speaker 5: globalization and everyone turning inwards and you're competing against the

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Speaker 5: United States with the Inflation Reduction Act, you're competing with

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Speaker 5: China with huge amounts of state support, and the Germans

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Speaker 5: are just not seemingly sort of realizing the situation. You

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Speaker 5: can cut tax, you can cut bureaucracy. That will help,

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Speaker 5: but the question will still remain, what is going to

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Speaker 5: drive growth in Germany. They don't have a sprawling tech sector.

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Speaker 5: They have huge amounts of engineering sort of prowess, but

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Speaker 5: they really need to get this economy moving, and that

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Speaker 5: is the sort of big problem for politicians here really

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Speaker 5: don't have an answer to that question.

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Speaker 2: I'm going to steal that from you.

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Speaker 3: So it's structural issues, but everything has a cyclical solution.

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Speaker 3: I'm going to totally paraphrase it and steal it. But

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Speaker 3: before I let you go, do we've the investors that

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Speaker 3: you speak to feel like this situation is adequately reflected

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Speaker 3: in the stock market and the bond market.

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Speaker 5: Well, this is what's interesting, right, The sort of guarantee

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Speaker 5: in the bond market is the fact that basically Germany

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Speaker 5: has very very little debt and they're not going to

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Speaker 5: that's not going to change any time anytime soon. Right,

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Speaker 5: So that is sort of puts a cap and that

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Speaker 5: sort of you know, keeps the vigilantes sort of away

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Speaker 5: from the bond market, and everything's sort of more or

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Speaker 5: less tidy there. Right In terms of the stock market,

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Speaker 5: I mean, we have been hitting sort of all time

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Speaker 5: highs on the decks, you know, this year periodically, which

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Speaker 5: again is a little bit confounding. I mean, part of

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Speaker 5: that story is that, you know, Ryan Mettal, the biggest

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Speaker 5: defense company in Europe, is listed in Germany, and you

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Speaker 5: know they've had like a you know, almost six hundred

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Speaker 5: percent rally since the war in Ukraine. So you do

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Speaker 5: have some bright spots. Actually, sort of interesting conversation I

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Speaker 5: had last week with the CEO of a defense company, Hensol.

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Speaker 5: So they make sort of satellites and sensors, sorry, not

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Speaker 5: satellite sensors and radars. They are actually taking a lot

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Speaker 5: of workers that are being laid off from the auto

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Speaker 5: sector and incorporating full teams from the auto sector moving

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Speaker 5: from auto to defense. So that is sort of an

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Speaker 5: interesting silver lining, though admittedly a very thin silver lining,

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Speaker 5: because the auto industry is worth just hundreds of thousands

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Speaker 5: of jobs in this country. But some of the way

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Speaker 5: that the sort of job market is evolving in Germany.

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Speaker 4: All right, Oliver, thank you so much. We really appreciate Oliver

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Speaker 4: Crook Bloomberg News giving us the latest on Germany again.

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Speaker 4: A no vote has taken place today and then they

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Speaker 4: are now setting elections for February. So we will stay

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Speaker 4: on top of that with continued reporting.

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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live

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Speaker 1: weekdays at ten am Eastern on applecar Play and Android

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Speaker 1: Auto with the Bloomberg Business app. You can also listen

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Speaker 1: live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station,

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Speaker 1: Hey Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty oh.

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Speaker 3: Alex Steel here alongside Paul Sweeney is a Bloomberg Intelligence Radio.

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Speaker 3: We bring you all the top news and business, economics

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Speaker 3: and finance. There are a lens of our Bloomberg Intelligence folks.

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Speaker 3: They cover two thousand companies in one hundred and thirty

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Speaker 3: industries worldwide.

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Speaker 2: What do you do if breadth is not great? We're

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Speaker 2: headed into the FED.

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Speaker 3: We should be in a Santa Claus rally, but it's

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Speaker 3: only being led by a handful of stocks.

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Speaker 2: What does that mean then for your portfolio for next year?

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Speaker 3: Phil Orlando one of the best out there, chief equity

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Speaker 3: market strategists and head of client portfolio management and federator

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Speaker 3: Armies is joining us.

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Speaker 2: Hey, Phil, what do you make of this?

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Speaker 3: Every day in December there's been a weak breath in

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Speaker 3: a month that's supposed to be relatively positive with the

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Speaker 3: Santa Claus rally for most assets.

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Speaker 2: What do you think of that?

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Speaker 6: First of all, good morning, Alex. Thank you very much

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Speaker 6: for having me back on the program. Let's not discount

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Speaker 6: the fact that since the first week or so in August,

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Speaker 6: the S and P five hundred and nineteen percent, so

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Speaker 6: what you would normally have expected, you know, during the

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Speaker 6: month of December Santa Claus rally, and on top of

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Speaker 6: that a post election rally. Normally the stock market November

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Speaker 6: and December post and election is up about five to

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Speaker 6: ten percent. We got a tremendous amount of that in

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Speaker 6: August and September and October, which historically are are you know,

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Speaker 6: sort of choppy months, so I wouldn't lose a lot

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Speaker 6: of sleep over it. Our full year target to this

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Speaker 6: year is sixty two hundred. We're at sixty one one

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Speaker 6: hundred change, so I think we've done okay. The market's

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Speaker 6: doing fine.

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Speaker 4: So twenty twenty five, Phil, what are the drivers of

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Speaker 4: this market? Is it the FED, is a good old

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Speaker 4: fashioned earnings What do you think is going to move

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Speaker 4: this market one way or the other in twenty five The.

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Speaker 6: Short answers yesah, okay. So our SMP five hundred target

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Speaker 6: for next year is seven thousand, So we're going to

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Speaker 6: go from sixty two hundred we think to seven thousand.

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Speaker 6: What will largely drive that is continued improvement in economic

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Speaker 6: growth and corporate earnings growth. The stock market will continue

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Speaker 6: to grind higher, and with the change in administration, we

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Speaker 6: believe that we are likely to see a reduction in regulations,

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Speaker 6: perhaps later in the year, an extension and a making

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Speaker 6: permanence of the corporate and individual tax rates. All of

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Speaker 6: that is boosting animal spirits. Right now. Business and consumer

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Speaker 6: confidence are soaring, and we think that's going to continue

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Speaker 6: to drive strong economic growth, strong corporate corporate earnings growth,

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Speaker 6: and ultimately the stock market is going to reflect that

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Speaker 6: improvement in earnings.

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Speaker 3: Many strategists are coming out and saying like something similar,

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Speaker 3: but that it's really going to be in the growth trade.

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Speaker 3: You really need to see stronger earnings and stronger economic

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Speaker 3: data for the value trade to take over.

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Speaker 2: What do you.

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Speaker 6: Think, Well, the growth trade has had a pretty good

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Speaker 6: couple of years, I mean, driven largely by the mag sevens.

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Speaker 6: You know, You've got some terrific companies there. I'm not

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Speaker 6: going to argue against that, but the reality is that

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Speaker 6: we do expect that this rally to broaden out the

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Speaker 6: valuation in balance, if you will. With the mag seven's,

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Speaker 6: we think there's going to be a reversion to the

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Speaker 6: mean that to some degree has started in the back

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Speaker 6: half of this year. We think that continues over the

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Speaker 6: course of next year, and we play significant catch up

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Speaker 6: with the small caps, both growth and value and the

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Speaker 6: large cap value. And we think that the large cap

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Speaker 6: growth you know, continues to do well because they're they're

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Speaker 6: growing fine. I'll throw one additional wrinkle into this. We

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Speaker 6: think that the surprise next year might be how well

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Speaker 6: emerging markets. Do you know? China has been you know,

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Speaker 6: flat on its back to the better part of the

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Speaker 6: last couple of years. We think that they're starting to

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Speaker 6: get the memo in terms of we need some aggressive

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Speaker 6: fiscal and monetary policy stimulus to get their economies and

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Speaker 6: their financial markets going. Valuations extraordinarily attractive, and from a

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Speaker 6: stock market standpoint, we think em ought to be a

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Speaker 6: pretty good performer next year as well.

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Speaker 4: Hey Phil, did your outlook and a look of your

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Speaker 4: colleagues at Federated? Did it change materially the day after

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Speaker 4: the presidential election?

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Speaker 6: The short answers know, because you know, we had forecasts

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Speaker 6: that that Trump would win, that that we would run

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Speaker 6: the table with the with the seven key swing states,

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Speaker 6: that the Senate would flip to Republican control regardless of

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Speaker 6: who won the election, and the down ballid impact on

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Speaker 6: the House. Whoever won the presidency was likely to win

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Speaker 6: the House. So that suggested that we thought that there

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Speaker 6: would be a red wave and we positioned for that

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Speaker 6: ahead of time. So, you know, we've we've had a

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Speaker 6: pretty good year in terms of performance and the confluence

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Speaker 6: of politics and economics and and you know, the financial

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Speaker 6: markets have all sort of come together beautifully for us

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Speaker 6: this year.

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Speaker 3: So when you look at your target for next year,

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Speaker 3: does the sequencing of Trump's agenda matter in terms of

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Speaker 3: how you position in terms of say, immigration, tax cuts, tariffs, deregulation.

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Speaker 6: Yeah. So, so our expectation is that we're likely to

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Speaker 6: get immigration and tariff stuff early, let's say the first

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Speaker 6: half of this year, we think that the tax stuff,

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Speaker 6: the extension of the individual and corporate rates, is likely

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Speaker 6: to be a post Labor Day kind of an event.

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Speaker 6: And then we think right at the back end of

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Speaker 6: the year, about this time next year, we're likely to

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Speaker 6: get some news on Trump's ideas about the transition of

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Speaker 6: the leadership of AT or reserve that Powell's term as

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Speaker 6: the Chairman of the FED will expire in May of

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Speaker 6: twenty six, so it would be completely appropriate for the

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Speaker 6: President to announce that he's either going to recommit for

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Speaker 6: a third term for Powell or go to another candidate,

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Speaker 6: such as Kevin Walsh, for example, right around Christmas of

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Speaker 6: twenty five.

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Speaker 4: All right, Phil, thank you so much for joining us.

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Speaker 4: Really appreciate it.

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Speaker 6: Phil Orlando.

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Speaker 4: He's a chief equity market strategist and head of the

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Speaker 4: client portfolio management team at Federator Hermes. Joining us from NYC.

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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live

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Speaker 1: weekdays at ten am Eastern on Apple Cardplay and Android

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Speaker 1: Auto with the Bloomberg Business app. Listen on demand wherever

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Speaker 1: you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube.

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Speaker 4: Alex Dean Paul Swiney live here in our Bloomberg Interactive

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Speaker 4: Broker Studio and streaming live on YouTube as well, So

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Speaker 4: head over to YouTube dot com and search Bloomberg a

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Speaker 4: podcast Susanne Willie joins us here. She's kind of starts

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Speaker 4: getting a lot of readership on the Bloomberg Terminal. Is

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Speaker 4: a personal finance reporter for Bloomberg News, joining us here

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Speaker 4: in our Bloomberg Interactive Brookers Studio. Need to grind retirement

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Speaker 4: crunch haunts Americans nearing sixty. So we get some of

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Speaker 4: these gen X folks starting to think about retirement and

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Speaker 4: they're looking at their four one K and they're like,

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Speaker 4: I'm not sure this is going to cover. So what's

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Speaker 4: your reporting find.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, there's a lot of stress about it because, you know,

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Speaker 7: as the oldest exers become sixty, I mean they were

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Speaker 7: sort of the guinea pigs for four one ks. The

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Speaker 7: boomers had pensions, you know, and the four one K

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Speaker 7: on top of that, and now the exers are sort

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Speaker 7: of looking at their balances and looking at the news

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Speaker 7: about maybe Social Security having to be reformed within the

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Speaker 7: next decade, and looking at the money that they're spending

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Speaker 7: supporting their adult children and possibly also their parents aging parents,

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Speaker 7: and it's just leading to a lot of concern about

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Speaker 7: how the heck are you going to be able to

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Speaker 7: retire in comfort anytime soon.

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Speaker 3: I was struck by it, was it forty three percent

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Speaker 3: say they can't afford to retire at sixty five.

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Speaker 2: That is staggering.

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Speaker 7: It is staggering, you know. It's it's just a combination

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Speaker 7: of a lot of things. I mean, housing affordability has

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Speaker 7: been an issue, you know, the high cost of living

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Speaker 7: is an issue. These are sort of the peak earning

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Speaker 7: years for a lot of exers, and they're hit with

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Speaker 7: the pandemic, which a lot of them say was a

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Speaker 7: big blow to their savings, you know, and then just

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Speaker 7: the cost of groceries, the cost of housing. Everything has

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Speaker 7: been going up and up and up, and it's harder

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Speaker 7: to save and it's harder to see, you know, how

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Speaker 7: you eke more out of an already stretched budget to

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Speaker 7: put away more for retirement.

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Speaker 4: So is the expectation that since we're living longer, we're

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Speaker 4: just going to have to work longer.

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Speaker 7: I think that's part of it, Yes, because exers are

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Speaker 7: obviously going to live longer, you know, the truth is

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Speaker 7: really that a lot of people, at least boomers, have

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Speaker 7: a lot of challenges when they retire.

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Speaker 8: You know, they feel sort of rootless.

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Speaker 7: So in a way, maybe it's not so bad if

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Speaker 7: we can work longer. There's this epidemic of loneliness in America.

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Speaker 7: It gives people a sense of purpose. But the fact is,

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Speaker 7: you want to have the option to retire when you

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Speaker 7: want to.

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Speaker 2: Or to work differently.

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Speaker 3: Right, so maybe you're working part time, or maybe you're

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Speaker 3: working at a job that you work maybe eight hours

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Speaker 3: a day versus like fourteen hours, you know, like it's

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Speaker 3: a different kind of environment and pace.

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Speaker 2: Like Paul wants to be a Walmart greeter in his

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Speaker 2: third career.

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Speaker 3: Like I'm not entirely kidding about that, but we don't

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Speaker 3: support that part.

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Speaker 7: No, no, I mean, but that is, you know, that

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Speaker 7: is sort of the reality. You know, in your later years,

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Speaker 7: you may not want to grind away at the same

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Speaker 7: job even doing for you know, the past couple of decades,

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Speaker 7: but you might do consulting in your area, or you know,

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Speaker 7: at least you'll make some money later in life. It's

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Speaker 7: not just like you'll turn the switch at sixty two

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Speaker 7: or sixty five. And then all income coming into you

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Speaker 7: is over. But I mean, social security makes people a

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Speaker 7: lot of nervous because that's something it's sort of the

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Speaker 7: one thing in our society we can sort of depend on,

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Speaker 7: and something's going to have to happen.

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Speaker 6: What is it?

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Speaker 4: What is the feeling in with your reporting here about

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00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:16,520
Speaker 4: social Security? I mean, do we I'm not.

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00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:19,600
Speaker 8: Yeah, it's not good. It's not good, Paul.

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00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:24,159
Speaker 7: People are really not feeling that social Security is going

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00:21:24,240 --> 00:21:27,240
Speaker 7: to be there for them in the way they need it,

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00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:29,640
Speaker 7: and you know, unsurprisingly they place a lot of flame

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00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:31,000
Speaker 7: on that in politicians.

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00:21:32,400 --> 00:21:34,679
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm gen X and I'm assuming I'm not

447
00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:38,400
Speaker 3: getting Social Security. If I do, that's super like benefit

448
00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:41,560
Speaker 3: go me. But that would be like extra stuff. So like,

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00:21:41,640 --> 00:21:43,760
Speaker 3: my whole life is revolved around how do I put

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00:21:43,760 --> 00:21:45,560
Speaker 3: my money in a way that will make me money

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00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:48,439
Speaker 3: later in in some kind of tax free way, because

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00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:51,320
Speaker 3: that I've seen with my parents how difficult it is

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00:21:51,359 --> 00:21:53,840
Speaker 3: to pay taxes when you don't have any income except

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00:21:53,880 --> 00:21:55,800
Speaker 3: for like atensional or Social Security.

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00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:58,840
Speaker 7: Yes, and for most people, you know, eighty five percent

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00:21:58,880 --> 00:22:01,680
Speaker 7: of the Social Security benefits are taxed, which.

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00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:05,840
Speaker 2: Is bananas exactly. Yeah, that's just my personal feeling. Yes, yes, I.

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00:22:05,840 --> 00:22:08,040
Speaker 8: Like that formal assessment that the bananas.

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00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:11,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, so what's a solution. We have about thirty seconds

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00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:12,560
Speaker 2: left for your solution?

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00:22:12,760 --> 00:22:14,240
Speaker 8: Oh my gosh, the solution.

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00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:15,920
Speaker 7: I mean, there are a lot of ways you can

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00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:19,960
Speaker 7: sort of, I mean, obviously you can if you're over fifty,

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00:22:20,240 --> 00:22:22,199
Speaker 7: you can contribute more to your four to one K.

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00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:24,639
Speaker 7: You can contribute next with seventy five hundred dollars a

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00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:28,359
Speaker 7: year if you have it this this coming year. There

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00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:32,040
Speaker 7: are ways to you know, increase your savings. There are

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00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:35,119
Speaker 7: you know, side hustles. It's really hard to come up

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00:22:35,160 --> 00:22:38,399
Speaker 7: with an answer to that question because it's different for

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Speaker 7: every person.

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00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:40,080
Speaker 8: You know, what they can do.

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00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:46,240
Speaker 7: I guess just like smarter savings and making sure you're

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00:22:46,280 --> 00:22:49,960
Speaker 7: doing everything you can to optimize your tax advantage savings

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00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:52,280
Speaker 7: with your four one K and maybe I mean roths

475
00:22:52,280 --> 00:22:55,400
Speaker 7: are something I think younger people should really look into. Yeah,

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00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:57,679
Speaker 7: because that's you put in the money after tax and

477
00:22:57,720 --> 00:22:59,119
Speaker 7: you don't want to pay taxes retirement.

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00:22:59,119 --> 00:23:00,639
Speaker 3: All right, Sam, I got to leave there. Thank you

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00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:04,240
Speaker 3: so much, really appreciated. Susannai Lee, Bloomberg Personal finance reporter.

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