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Speaker 1: Hey, guys, ready or not, twenty twenty four is here

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Speaker 1: and we here at breaking points, are already thinking of

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Speaker 1: ways we can up our game for this critical election.

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Speaker 2: We rely on our premium subs to expand coverage, upgrade

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Speaker 2: the studio ad staff give you, guys, the best independent.

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Speaker 1: Coverage that is possible.

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Speaker 2: If you like what we're all about, it just means

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Speaker 2: the absolute world to have your support. But enough with that,

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Speaker 2: let's get to the show.

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Speaker 3: Good morning, and welcome to Counterpoints. Secretary of Saint Anthony B.

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Speaker 3: Lincoln was in Israel yesterday. We're going to talk about

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Speaker 3: what he said publicly after meetings with leaders across the region.

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Speaker 3: We're also going to get into this insane bitcoin hack

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Speaker 3: of the sec emily.

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Speaker 4: What else we got today?

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Speaker 5: The White House faced some really tough questions in the

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Speaker 5: briefing yesterday over Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin's apparently unknown health

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Speaker 5: condition to the White House, so the President doesn't seem

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Speaker 5: to have been cueued in on what's going on with

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Speaker 5: the Secretary of Defense. We have some great clips from

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Speaker 5: the briefing yesterday. We're going to cover the most bizarre

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Speaker 5: story in recent memory, and that would be the Crown

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Speaker 5: Heights tunnels. We speaking of good video, We've got some

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Speaker 5: good video in that block.

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Speaker 3: What it's indescribable. You're just gonna have to sit around

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Speaker 3: and wait for that one.

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Speaker 6: And well, we tried to describe the indescribable.

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Speaker 4: You'll you'll have to just watch it.

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Speaker 3: If you're listening to this on the podcast, go find

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Speaker 3: some videos of what happened in Crown Heights.

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Speaker 4: It's going to blow your mind.

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Speaker 6: And in some great news, Don Lemon is back and

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Speaker 6: we're all over the story.

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Speaker 4: He never left my heart, not in your heart, right.

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Speaker 6: That's that's important.

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Speaker 5: We also finally got I think probably the best graphic

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Speaker 5: of all time because Ken Clippen seein this here and

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Speaker 5: we're just referring him.

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Speaker 6: Askenny Clipps clips.

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Speaker 4: He's Kenny Clips.

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Speaker 3: He He and a bunch of other lefty journalists were

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Speaker 3: suspended yesterday. He's going to talk about what his his

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Speaker 3: brief time kicked off of Twitter was like because there

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Speaker 3: was an outrage and he was He and a bunch

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Speaker 3: of the others were reinstated. He also has a big

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Speaker 3: scoop coming later today, probably won't be ready in time

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Speaker 3: for this show, but we'll post that once it's up.

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Speaker 4: That's going to be interesting. That's all I can say

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Speaker 4: at this point.

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Speaker 6: So Kenny clips is here.

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Speaker 4: Any clips will be here.

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Speaker 5: Before Kenny Clips, though, Ryan, can you tell us a

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Speaker 5: little bit about what's been swirling around the SEC just

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Speaker 5: in like the last twelve hours.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, so we can put up this first element here.

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Speaker 3: But basically what happened is somebody was able to hack

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Speaker 3: the SEC's Twitter account. And I'm calling it Twitter because

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Speaker 3: it's Twitter dot com and as long as he's using

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Speaker 3: Twitter dot com, it's Twitter, all right. So somebody hacked

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Speaker 3: the SEC's Twitter account and posted on it basically that

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Speaker 3: the SEC had approved e f T bitcoin products or

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Speaker 3: ef T crypto products. There was a lawsuit against the

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Speaker 3: SEC by crypto backers that said, you have to allow

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Speaker 3: e f ts, which are basically a way for institutional

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Speaker 3: and other kind of retail investors to get vested in

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Speaker 3: something without putting their actual money in it, so you

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Speaker 3: don't actually have to buy the bitcoin or if you

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Speaker 3: want to do you know, anything else the S and

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Speaker 3: P five hundred, you can buy an e f T

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Speaker 3: that kind of mirrors the performance of the S and P.

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Speaker 3: And what they're saying is there should be a there

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Speaker 3: should be an e f T that mirrors the performance

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Speaker 3: of say bitcoin. And so the lawsuit was successful, and

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Speaker 3: so there is an upcoming decision rule from the SEC

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Speaker 3: that the bitcoin world is eagerly anticipating. I think Bitcoin

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Speaker 3: is up like sixty percent over the last you know,

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Speaker 3: several months in anticipation of this ruling. So somebody got

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Speaker 3: a hold of the SEC's accountant jumped the gun. They first,

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Speaker 3: I don't know what's what's the next element that we have?

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Speaker 5: This is the Yeah, so let's put this up. This

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Speaker 5: is roughly two times as much market cap was destroyed

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Speaker 5: by the SEC's tweet as was lost in the.

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Speaker 1: Ft X blow up, right, because it.

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Speaker 3: Sent things on in a tail spend, and so people

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Speaker 3: are like making and losing money all over the place.

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Speaker 3: As some of the people in the crypto world accurately

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Speaker 3: said afterwards, if this happened, actually I think it was

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Speaker 3: a wink Levas twin. I saw quote when the Winklevi

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Speaker 3: said if this would happen at any publicly traded company,

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Speaker 3: the SEC would be demanding an investigation. So now Twitter

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Speaker 3: has posted this is from Twitter their safety. We can

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Speaker 3: confirm that the account SEC GOV was compromised and we

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Speaker 3: have completed a preliminary investigation. Based on our investigation, the

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Speaker 3: compromise was not due to any breach of X's systems

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Speaker 3: that's Twitter, but rather due to an unidentified individual obtaining

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Speaker 3: control over a phone number associated with the SEC account

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Speaker 3: through a third party. We can also confirm that the

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Speaker 3: account did not have two factor authentication enabled at the

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Speaker 3: time the account was compromised. We encourage all users to

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Speaker 3: enable this extra layer of security. More information and tips

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Speaker 3: on how to keep your account secure can be found

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Speaker 3: in our help center. For one of the scandals that

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Speaker 3: it Must first brought to Twitter was making people pay

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Speaker 3: for a two factor like this is like incredibly dangerous

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Speaker 3: because everybody should have two factor. Like, if you're watching

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Speaker 3: this and you don't have two factor, get it.

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Speaker 4: Basically that means.

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Speaker 6: If you work at the SEC, if you work.

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Speaker 3: At the SEC, do the authenticator app go beyond just

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Speaker 3: two factor with a phone number. Two factor means like

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Speaker 3: you just just having your password is a not is

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Speaker 3: not enough to hack into your phone or because if

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Speaker 3: you don't have two factor, you can also guess not

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Speaker 3: just guess at somebody's password, but you can do hit

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Speaker 3: the forgot password, and if they have the phone associated

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Speaker 3: with the account, then that request then goes to that phone,

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Speaker 3: and that seems to be what happens. So they basically

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Speaker 3: hit for god password on SEC's Twitter account. It sent

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Speaker 3: its sent something to a phone that they had gotten

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Speaker 3: now access to through some third party vendor, and then

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Speaker 3: they reset the password, went in there and made a

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Speaker 3: fake SEC announcement.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and billions of dollars changed hands.

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Speaker 5: Let's put the next elemen up on the screen. This

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Speaker 5: is delicious. Here's a tweet from the SEC from October.

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Speaker 6: Careful what you read on the internet.

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Speaker 5: The best source of information about the SEC is the SEC.

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Speaker 5: If that source of information actually ryan is that the

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Speaker 5: SEC is incapable of handling the most basic of tasks,

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Speaker 5: then indeed the best source of information about the SEC

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Speaker 5: is the SEC.

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Speaker 3: If what Twitter says is true. Twitter is a biased

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Speaker 3: source here because you know they're on the line. They're

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Speaker 3: on the hook here as well. But they're making very

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Speaker 3: definitive statements. And when when you make a clear statement

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Speaker 3: like that, I tend to give them like I tend

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Speaker 3: to assume they're probably telling the truth.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, they came out hard.

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Speaker 3: Because if it's if it's something that can be detected

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Speaker 3: as false, and you're dealing with the SEC, you're going

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Speaker 3: to get in a lot of trouble. Yeah, so I

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Speaker 3: just zoom that they're telling the truth here. And if

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Speaker 3: that's the case, what an extraordinary blunder from whoever was

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Speaker 3: running the SEC's Twitter account. Like, and if it turns

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Speaker 3: out that the SEC had some intern, they're like, yeah,

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Speaker 3: it's Twitter.

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Speaker 4: Let an intern run the run the account.

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Speaker 3: That's insane because tweets move markets, h as we as

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Speaker 3: we saw with some hilarious tweets about like insulin is free.

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Speaker 3: Like right after Elon Musk bought Twitter and allowed anybody

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Speaker 3: to be verified, people were buying, like, you know, the

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Speaker 3: names of fake companies and posting things and moving billions

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Speaker 3: of dollars around.

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Speaker 5: Right, And sometimes when people hack a government account, they

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Speaker 5: do something that is sort of a slapstick troll.

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Speaker 6: This was a much better troll than just saying except

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Speaker 6: this was.

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Speaker 3: And what's so funny And then we'll move on to

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Speaker 3: some more serious news is that bitcoin and crypto are

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Speaker 3: trying to show that they can be like responsible members

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Speaker 3: of the financial community, and they're days away from getting

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Speaker 3: this announcement CC and they somebody, some packer preempts it

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Speaker 3: by hacking the SEC as like all right, yeah, sure.

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Speaker 4: Bring them on in just what could go wrong? This

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Speaker 4: seems fine?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, what a crazy story and a reminder of how

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Speaker 5: of how vulnerable the markets are when and especially just

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Speaker 5: to a tweet is one thing, but it's you have

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Speaker 5: vulnerability in the market because a tweet can change the market.

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Speaker 5: But then also it's really easy for a tweet to

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Speaker 5: be posted like these two layers of security or these

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Speaker 5: layers of stability, I should say, are are always really.

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Speaker 3: Vulnerable, right, and their account is sec gov. The problem

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Speaker 3: hooter had earlier was they were verifying whatever and so

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Speaker 3: you could get you know, SEC above and post something

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Speaker 3: and like full of people for five minutes and that's

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Speaker 3: enough to move you know, hundreds of millions of dollars.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, absolutely.

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Speaker 5: Right. Secretary Blincoln was in Israel yesterday and address some

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Speaker 5: of the questions about the lawsuit that's been covered on

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Speaker 5: this show. Tell us a little bit about what Blincoln

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Speaker 5: had to say when he was in Israel yesterday facing

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Speaker 5: questions actually about the genocide claims.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, he actually so, here's from his opening remarks that

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Speaker 3: his press briefing yesterday where he brings up the genocide

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Speaker 3: charges that South Africa has filed. South Africa has been

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Speaker 3: joined by Malaysia and Turkey.

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Speaker 4: At this point.

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Speaker 3: France has said that they will respect the decision of

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Speaker 3: the International Court of Justice, though they have not joined

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Speaker 3: the prosecution yet. One as I think was discussed on

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Speaker 3: the show yesterday, one Israeli Kannesset member has said Oprah

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Speaker 3: Casiv has said that he has endorsed also those genocide charges,

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Speaker 3: which is fascinating development.

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Speaker 4: But let's play Blincoln yesterday.

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Speaker 7: We believe the submission against Israel to the International Court

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Speaker 7: of Justice distracts the world from all of these important efforts.

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Speaker 4: Over the charge of genocide is meritless.

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Speaker 7: It's particularly galling given that those who are attacking Israel

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Speaker 7: Hamas has Bolah, the Huthis, as well as their support

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Speaker 7: or Iran, continue to openly call for the annihilation of

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Speaker 7: Israel and.

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Speaker 4: The mass murder of Jews.

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Speaker 7: On this trip, I came to Israel after meeting with

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Speaker 7: the leaders of Turkey, Greece, Jordan, Cutter, the United Our

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Speaker 7: of Emorates, Saudi Arabia. All of those leaders share our

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Speaker 7: concern about the spread of the conflict. Nonetheless, ninety percent

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Speaker 7: of Gaza's population continues to face acute food and security

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Speaker 7: According to the United Nations, for children, the effects of

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Speaker 7: long periods without sufficient food can have life long consequences.

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Speaker 3: Within about a minute of saying that the charges of

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Speaker 3: genocide are meritless and baseless, he adds, oh, and by

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Speaker 3: the way, the United Nations, as the ninety percent of

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Speaker 3: Palestinians and guys are on the brink of starvation.

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Speaker 6: In the charge of generosiquare that?

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Speaker 5: So this is South Africa at the International Court of Justice,

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Speaker 5: and Ryan mentioned joined by these other countries. Now, so

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Speaker 5: one of the people who has actually argued successfully at

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Speaker 5: the International Court of Justice, Francis Boyle, went on Democracy

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Speaker 5: Now and had a really interesting perspective on what could

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Speaker 5: happen with this particular suit going forward to we have

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Speaker 5: a clip of that we can roll now.

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Speaker 8: I was the first lawyer ever to win anything under

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Speaker 8: the Genocide Convention from the International Court of Justice that

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Speaker 8: goes back to nineteen twenty one. I single handedly won

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Speaker 8: two World Court orders for the Republic of Bosnia Herzegovina

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Speaker 8: against Yugoslavia to cease and desistem committing all acts of genocide,

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Speaker 8: and based on my careful review of all the documents

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Speaker 8: so far as submitted by the Republic of South Africa,

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Speaker 8: I believe South Africa will win an order against Israel

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Speaker 8: to cease and desist from committing all acts of genocide

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Speaker 8: against the Palestinians. Under Article one of the Genocide Convention,

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Speaker 8: all contracting parties one hundred and fifty three states will

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Speaker 8: then be obliged quote to prevent unquote the genocide by

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Speaker 8: Israel against the Palestinians. Second, when the World Court gives

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Speaker 8: this cease and desist order against Israel, the Biden administration

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Speaker 8: will stand condemned under Article three, paragraph E of the

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Speaker 8: Genocide Convention that criminalizes complicity in genocide.

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Speaker 5: Ran I wonder actually if Blincoln is addressing that and

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Speaker 5: sort of preemptively in his scripted remarks, because as we

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Speaker 5: just heard Boyle say, at least from the perspective of

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Speaker 5: the ic J, there's a case that can actually it

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Speaker 5: actually might.

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Speaker 6: Have some lags.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that that, according to Boyle, wanted to you know

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Speaker 3: who won what maybe the most high profile case before

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Speaker 3: that court. They're gonna they have a good South Africa

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Speaker 3: has a good chance of winning this case, which then

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Speaker 3: which then creates legal obligations, you know, for the United States,

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Speaker 3: and which then puts the United States in an even.

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Speaker 4: Trickier position visa vi.

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Speaker 3: The Houthis who say that they are currently right now

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Speaker 3: basically enacting their responsibilities and obligations under Article one of

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Speaker 3: the Prevention of the Convention around the Prevention of Genocide,

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Speaker 3: that all states have a duty to intervene to stop genocide,

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Speaker 3: not just to not do genocide themselves, but if they

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Speaker 3: are aware of it happening.

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Speaker 4: It's there. It's their obligation to step in.

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Speaker 3: And that's that's related to the way that the world

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Speaker 3: did not step in during the Holocaust. In fact, the

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Speaker 3: United States famously kind of turning away Jewish refugees fleeing

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Speaker 3: the Holocaust and sending them back. So the result was

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Speaker 3: this law, this international law that says you're supposed to intervene.

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Speaker 3: The Huthies say that they're operating under that pretext. If

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Speaker 3: the International Court of Justice says, in fact, there is

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Speaker 3: an international obligation to stop this, that makes the US

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Speaker 3: threats against the Huthis that much harder.

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Speaker 4: I think to sustain morally.

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Speaker 6: Completely changes that.

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Speaker 5: But to sustain morally I feel like is we could

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Speaker 5: have a debate on that, but to sustain even just

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Speaker 5: as a member of the Security Council and a leading

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Speaker 5: nation in.

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Speaker 4: And hypocritical and all that.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, but also I would imagine they're further legal machinations

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Speaker 5: that would interfere, Yeah, going forward that you know, you

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Speaker 5: have to sort of from the US. I mean maybe

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Speaker 5: if you're blanking, you say, yeah, we can swat these down,

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Speaker 5: you know, like a fly swatter, like left and right

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Speaker 5: as like them up. I don't think that's sustainable at

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Speaker 5: all when you get into exactly what you're just saying,

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Speaker 5: how it affects other combatants in situations.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and not to tease the news that Kenklepenstein is

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Speaker 3: gonna have later today, but that it implicates that exact

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Speaker 3: question the US's role in this war and what it's

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Speaker 3: legal exposure is and related to that.

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Speaker 4: And we don't have this.

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Speaker 3: Clip enough of looking at Blincoln, we can just read

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Speaker 3: some of what he said at this press conference. This

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Speaker 3: is all related to the humanitarian crisis that the Israeli

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Speaker 3: blockade and bombardmen has created. And so at the center

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Speaker 3: of that, behind the scenes is this dispute between Israel

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Speaker 3: and the United Nations over how to get humanitarian aid in.

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Speaker 3: Israel does not want the UN involved at all. They

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Speaker 3: basically think the UN is like a cat's paw for Hamas.

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Speaker 3: And so you had recently had Senators Chris van holl

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Speaker 3: and Jeff Markley go over to rough A crossing, and

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Speaker 3: every aid worker that you talked to says there is

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Speaker 3: not enough aid getting in because of the logistical difficulties

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Speaker 3: thrown up by Israel around the idea. You know, they

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Speaker 3: say it's about, you know, making sure that no weapons

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Speaker 3: wind up in the hands of Hamas.

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Speaker 5: And Israel is responding to a real logistical challenge presented

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Speaker 5: by Hamas, which actually, you know, there is evidence and

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Speaker 5: there's a question of how widespread it is, but there

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Speaker 5: is evidence of for example, gunman taking over trucks, taking

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Speaker 5: the aid from the trucks and all of that.

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Speaker 6: That is a real problem for Israel.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, well, there's a huge breakdown.

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Speaker 3: You know, there's a coming social breakdown because of the

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Speaker 3: way that everything has collapsed, and you just have two

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Speaker 3: million people living in tight quarters and not nobody getting

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Speaker 3: enough food, water, or medicine. Although even if even if

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Speaker 3: you were able to smuggle in a couple weapons, like

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Speaker 3: let's let's imagine that you could, let's say, the UN

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Speaker 3: completely somehow failed to allow you know, a few boxes

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Speaker 3: of bullets or guns to go through. It's the most

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Speaker 3: kind of well equipped military in the world against.

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Speaker 4: Ten twenty thousand, how many are left?

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Speaker 3: People just hold up like, is that worth starving two

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Speaker 3: million people over?

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Speaker 4: And that's granting a one hundred percent.

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Speaker 3: Of the benefit of the doubt to the Israeli argument,

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Speaker 3: rather than taking a lot of the Israeli officials at

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Speaker 3: their word, which is that they actually believe that the

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Speaker 3: starvation policy is the goal itself, not an unfortunate byproduct,

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Speaker 3: not a bug, but a.

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Speaker 6: Feature, right right, No, absolutely, And.

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Speaker 3: So Blinkoln in his in his press briefing brought up

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Speaker 3: the UN he and he said, and you have kind

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Speaker 3: of this is diplomacy, so you have to kind of

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Speaker 3: read between the lines a little bit. But he says

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Speaker 3: the United Nations is playing an indispensable role in addressing

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Speaker 3: the immense humanitarian needs in Gaza. There is simply no alternative.

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Speaker 3: I spoke last night with the UN's new senior Humanitarian

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Speaker 3: reconstruction Coordinator for Gaza to Greed Cog about all these

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Speaker 3: efforts that are underway, and then he says to Greed,

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Speaker 3: Cog is someone I worked very closely with a few

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Speaker 3: years ago when she led the UN mission that destroyed

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Speaker 3: the Assad regimes chemical weapons and serious so I can

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Speaker 3: say from experience, she has what it takes to get

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Speaker 3: this job done.

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Speaker 4: She has America's full support. She must have Israel's as well.

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Speaker 3: So that Blincoln very clearly, but kind of going, how

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Speaker 3: would you describe that? Like kind of elliptical language, But

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Speaker 3: he's saying, we support the UN, and we want the

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Speaker 3: UN involved in this. UN has to be involved in this.

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Speaker 3: But then he says she must have Israel's as well,

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Speaker 3: meaning she doesn't yet have Israel's support, And it raises

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Speaker 3: a question of, like, what's the point of being a

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Speaker 3: superpower if you have to like beat around the bush

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Speaker 3: and like begging cajole to get your priorities enacted in

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Speaker 3: the face of the greatest humanitarian crisis that we've seen

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Speaker 3: on this planet in a very long time.

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Speaker 5: Else it'll be interesting to see how this transpires because

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Speaker 5: to your point earlier, and we've talked about this a lot,

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Speaker 5: there's the tug of war internally within the Knesset, within

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Speaker 5: Israel's own government about how to best prosecute this war.

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Speaker 5: You have some people talking about Dresden, you know, some

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Speaker 5: people talking about you know, the very real concerns of

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Speaker 5: the people in Gaza, and it's difficult to know. And

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Speaker 5: actually it's difficult to know because I think it's unclear

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Speaker 5: within the net Yahoo administration itself with the real policy.

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Speaker 5: Is this the real policy? That is the real end here?

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Speaker 5: That starvation is the way to prosecute the war? Is

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Speaker 5: the end here?

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Speaker 6: That you have to sort of keep the United States happy, keep.

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Speaker 5: Your sort of international partners happy, play nice with the UN,

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Speaker 5: and you also have to, you know, do what is

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Speaker 5: morally right and ensure that innocent civilians are able to

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Speaker 5: eat and drink clean water and have medical care. All

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Speaker 5: of that I think is genuinely unclear because Israel is

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Speaker 5: divided on how to how what what is the way

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Speaker 5: to go forward? And so that's where the US, uh,

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Speaker 5: what is the point of being a super superpower If

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Speaker 5: you have to kind of beat around.

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Speaker 4: The bush and you can't even get your client to

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Speaker 4: do what you need.

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Speaker 6: To do, it will they?

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Speaker 5: I mean, so what we just saw in the last

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Speaker 5: month is the US say, let's uh, draw this war back,

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Speaker 5: let's pull let's you know, let's let's uh sort of

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Speaker 5: do an indefinite pause on the parking lot uh dynamics

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Speaker 5: here in Gaza as the new year starts.

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Speaker 6: That's exactly what happened. And so I mean, we obviously

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Speaker 6: are pulling some serious strings.

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Speaker 3: Although you're still seeing air strikes, right, I guess, I

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Speaker 3: guess fewer.

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Speaker 5: They've they've shifted to what the what are they saying

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Speaker 5: precision operations even though they were.

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Speaker 4: Still hitting residential building and.

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Speaker 5: They also said they were doing precision too, And this

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Speaker 5: goes back to how unclear the strategy of the war is.

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Speaker 5: They were talking about how they were doing precision at

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Speaker 5: the same time they were talking about turning gods into

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Speaker 5: a parking derecision versus parking lot like this has been

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Speaker 5: the theme of their stated strategy, is that it's muddled.

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Speaker 3: And to see how muddled is elsewhere in the country

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Speaker 3: fascinating development reported by Axios.

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Speaker 4: Here you can put up this last element.

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Speaker 3: So basically NETNYA, who's on a call, And the element

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Speaker 3: we have up here is that ask zelenski ua rebuff's

403
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Speaker 3: bb request to pay.

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Speaker 4: Palestinian workers barred from Israel.

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Speaker 3: So Netna who right after October seventh basically told West

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Speaker 3: Bank Palestinian workers they could no longer travel into Israel

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Speaker 3: to work anymore. So now one hundred and fifty thousand

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Speaker 3: or so Palestinian workers are owed on unemployment benefits.

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Speaker 4: Meanwhile, the right wing.

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Speaker 3: Elements of Netnahu's government, well the furthest right wing elements,

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Speaker 3: smoke rich Ben Geber and others have insisted that no

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Speaker 3: money because I think, who's the finance minitors.

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Speaker 4: He's like, he's like, they're all Nazis.

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Speaker 3: Everyone in gaz is a Nazi, and they're terrorists in

415
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Speaker 3: the West Bank, and I'm not sending them their money.

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Speaker 3: So this is something that Blincoln was asked about at

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Speaker 3: the press briefing yesterday. This is Palestinian authority money that

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Speaker 3: is sitting in Israeli accounts that Israel has blocked from

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Speaker 3: getting to the Palestinian authority. Now, Shinbate and the military

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Speaker 3: establishment in Israel said, this is a horrible idea, like

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Speaker 3: set the ethics aside of whose money it is, Why

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Speaker 3: are you going to create enormous economic based instability in

423
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Speaker 3: the West Bank like at this very moment, like this

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Speaker 3: is this is not what we need. But Smo Church,

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Speaker 3: Benkivir and others have said, if you release that money

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Speaker 3: to them, we're quitting the government. We will leave. And

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Speaker 3: n Yaho apparently believes that he can't keep together a

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Speaker 3: coalition without the far right.

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Speaker 4: So what does he do.

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Speaker 3: He calls up Mohammed ben Zioned over at the UE.

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Speaker 3: It's like they've got money over it.

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Speaker 4: A Muradi got money and.

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Speaker 3: The Benzaia was so appalled by the request that they

434
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Speaker 3: leaked it to the press and said sont Ya who said, hey,

435
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Speaker 3: can you pay the unemployment benefits of these Palestinian workers

436
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Speaker 3: that I'm barring from Israel?

437
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Speaker 4: And he said are you joking right?

438
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Speaker 3: And to show how ridiculous he thought the request would,

439
00:23:21,760 --> 00:23:23,960
Speaker 3: he said, why don't you go ask? Zelenski asks, So

440
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Speaker 3: Lenzi's gotten a lot of money from your friends lately,

441
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Speaker 3: he's got a lot sitting around. Go ask him for

442
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Speaker 3: some money if you've got a problem, or give the

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00:23:31,040 --> 00:23:35,520
Speaker 3: Palestinians their money, or let them let them work, Like

444
00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:38,360
Speaker 3: what what's your long term what's your long term strategy here?

445
00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:41,000
Speaker 3: Like the way the way that Gaza turned into the

446
00:23:41,080 --> 00:23:43,320
Speaker 3: complete economic basket case that it's been for the last

447
00:23:43,359 --> 00:23:47,159
Speaker 3: two decades. Is not because of say, the Hamas decided

448
00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:49,880
Speaker 3: to turn it into some like uh, you know, terror Dan,

449
00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:53,000
Speaker 3: It's because Gosins were no longer allowed to leave and

450
00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:58,359
Speaker 3: the entire economy was based on interchange, exchange with the

451
00:23:58,400 --> 00:23:59,240
Speaker 3: rest of Israel.

452
00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:03,880
Speaker 4: And so what's left then, well, just guess we're gonna.

453
00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:10,000
Speaker 5: Fight negotiating with again. This is where Yahu is in

454
00:24:10,040 --> 00:24:11,680
Speaker 5: a serious jam when.

455
00:24:11,480 --> 00:24:13,680
Speaker 6: It comes to not an unpredictable one. And he knew

456
00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:14,320
Speaker 6: that all along.

457
00:24:14,359 --> 00:24:17,320
Speaker 5: I mean, if this ever happened, they understood exactly what

458
00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:19,359
Speaker 5: kind of problem, what kind of problems they would be facing.

459
00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:21,480
Speaker 6: This is obviously one of them. When you're looking at.

460
00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:24,840
Speaker 5: The same dynamics we just talked about with the UN

461
00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:26,760
Speaker 5: when it comes to this money that in order for

462
00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:30,080
Speaker 5: him to maintain his coalition, he has to keep Smetric

463
00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:34,800
Speaker 5: Benevier happy, and to keep them happy, you have to

464
00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:37,480
Speaker 5: piss a lot of other people off.

465
00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:39,440
Speaker 6: And you have to.

466
00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:41,240
Speaker 4: Including all these people you owe money too.

467
00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:45,399
Speaker 5: Including including that, and including the United States. And so again,

468
00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:51,479
Speaker 5: none of this is like simple, it's it's obviously extremely complicated. Uh,

469
00:24:51,680 --> 00:24:57,680
Speaker 5: both strategically and politically. Morally is the other question, and

470
00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:00,640
Speaker 5: you know, when you kind of are. I think there's

471
00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:03,399
Speaker 5: a benefit in some sense of being here in the

472
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:04,119
Speaker 5: United States.

473
00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:05,440
Speaker 6: You can sort of see.

474
00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:09,080
Speaker 5: Things in a way that's not even just the United States.

475
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:10,840
Speaker 5: I mean, if you're outside of the war zone, you

476
00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:16,080
Speaker 5: have the benefit of, for example, some clarity, additional clarity

477
00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:21,080
Speaker 5: that you don't necessarily always have. That doesn't mean we

478
00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:23,239
Speaker 5: know better, That's not what I'm saying at all. What

479
00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:25,760
Speaker 5: I'm saying is that you're at least able to take

480
00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:30,600
Speaker 5: a step back and emotionally see that there's a real

481
00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:33,440
Speaker 5: moral problem for everyone.

482
00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:35,760
Speaker 4: And to the extent it's complicated.

483
00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:38,959
Speaker 3: It's complicated from Netanyahuu's perspective of trying to stay in

484
00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:40,680
Speaker 3: power in an untenable situation.

485
00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:41,520
Speaker 6: I mean genuinely.

486
00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:42,640
Speaker 4: Also, he's got the.

487
00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:45,280
Speaker 3: World held hostage in a way because if he leaves

488
00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:48,000
Speaker 3: office he might go to jail because of these previous

489
00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:50,919
Speaker 3: corruption charges. So he's just doing any dance that he

490
00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:54,960
Speaker 3: can and doing anything to stay in power. And also,

491
00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:58,080
Speaker 3: I feel like the rest of the world should be like, Okay, fine,

492
00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:01,600
Speaker 3: we won't prosecute you for these corruption charges if you

493
00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:04,720
Speaker 3: will just rationally come to some end of this. Now,

494
00:26:05,160 --> 00:26:06,159
Speaker 3: I think a lot of the world would like to

495
00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:08,720
Speaker 3: see and prosecuted for war crimes, so that it's complicated.

496
00:26:10,119 --> 00:26:13,920
Speaker 3: But having all of this held hostage by his corruption

497
00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:17,439
Speaker 3: charges from the past, yeah, it just makes it that

498
00:26:17,520 --> 00:26:20,040
Speaker 3: much more difficult to then sort through the question of

499
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:23,640
Speaker 3: what is really what coalition ought to be running the government.

500
00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:25,800
Speaker 5: Also there, I mean, it is a complicated question when

501
00:26:25,840 --> 00:26:29,040
Speaker 5: it comes to whether or not you're by helping civilians

502
00:26:29,080 --> 00:26:32,440
Speaker 5: you're arming your enemy. And to some extent, you absolutely

503
00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:36,600
Speaker 5: are helping your enemy when you are taking care of civilians.

504
00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:39,560
Speaker 5: But that's something that after World War Two we kind

505
00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:42,040
Speaker 5: of came to the table and said, you know, there's

506
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:45,359
Speaker 5: there's a serious give and take here that needs that

507
00:26:45,359 --> 00:26:49,200
Speaker 5: there here's how we've sort of mapped this out morally legally,

508
00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:52,680
Speaker 5: and that's you know, nobody's I'm not saying that's easy

509
00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:58,600
Speaker 5: at least, that's genuinely a very complicated moral question. But again,

510
00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:01,800
Speaker 5: you know, we can see pretty clearly what's happened to

511
00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:03,360
Speaker 5: civilians in Gaza, but.

512
00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:05,719
Speaker 3: The dynamic can be the reverse in a way, and

513
00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:09,439
Speaker 3: that's why the National security establishment once these Palestinians to

514
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:13,760
Speaker 3: get paid, because actually, by not paying them, you're making

515
00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:19,280
Speaker 3: life much more difficult for the Israeli National security established,

516
00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:23,080
Speaker 3: which does not want a gigantic uprising in the West

517
00:27:23,119 --> 00:27:26,120
Speaker 3: Bank right now. They'll they'll take it some other times perhaps,

518
00:27:26,119 --> 00:27:28,040
Speaker 3: and when they can focus all of their energies on

519
00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:31,440
Speaker 3: suppressing it. But when when they're you know, trying to

520
00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:35,640
Speaker 3: pick a fight with Iran, with Hesbula and engaged, engaged

521
00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:40,280
Speaker 3: in this wholesale slaughter down in Gaza, to have millions

522
00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:46,760
Speaker 3: of Palestinians in the West Bank livid, it's just bad timing, absolutely,

523
00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:51,159
Speaker 3: But the ideologues in that government are like, we don't care,

524
00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:52,600
Speaker 3: like they're just going for it.

525
00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:55,600
Speaker 5: Right well, and their goals are different than certainly different

526
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:57,320
Speaker 5: than our goals. We talked about this last week and

527
00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:01,199
Speaker 5: Yahoo no two state solution, President Biden, who in the

528
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:03,520
Speaker 5: United States in general, who are a huge part of

529
00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:06,200
Speaker 5: this war in terms of munitions, about twenty percent of

530
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:09,120
Speaker 5: the Israeli military budget comes to the United States every year, say,

531
00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:12,960
Speaker 5: two state solution not a minor difference. It's a huge,

532
00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:16,760
Speaker 5: huge difference, and it's one that continues obviously to plague

533
00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:20,760
Speaker 5: the prosecution of the war from our perspective, from Israel's perspective.

534
00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:22,480
Speaker 5: If you're not on the same page about some of

535
00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:25,840
Speaker 5: these very basic end goals, like Netan Yahoo is not

536
00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:28,960
Speaker 5: with strict mendevir huge problems.

537
00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:34,920
Speaker 3: Anthony Fauci spent the last two days on Capitol Hill

538
00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:39,440
Speaker 3: and in giving closed door testimony to the Select Subcommittee

539
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:45,440
Speaker 3: investigating the coronavirus pandemic a lot. They talked about it,

540
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 3: an awful lot. But we're only hearing it, you know,

541
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:51,400
Speaker 3: from leaks so far from Republicans, basically mostly from Yeah,

542
00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:54,160
Speaker 3: I actually haven't seen any leaks coming from Democrats.

543
00:28:54,200 --> 00:28:55,400
Speaker 4: I don't even know if they were in the room.

544
00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:58,080
Speaker 5: Debbie Dingle talked to the press a little bit, so

545
00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:00,360
Speaker 5: obviously Democrat from Michigan talked to the press a little

546
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:02,480
Speaker 5: bit and said, you know, it's political that we're here

547
00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:07,400
Speaker 5: to begin with. But basically what we know is from Republicans.

548
00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:08,880
Speaker 5: I don't know about you, but I found actually the

549
00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:11,600
Speaker 5: lack of media coverage of this to be interesting because

550
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:13,640
Speaker 5: we have seen some heightened just in the last couple

551
00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:17,440
Speaker 5: of months criticism of Fauci from the press, nothing like

552
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:19,960
Speaker 5: I think he deserves, but there has been a little

553
00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:22,400
Speaker 5: bit more scrutiny, and it's at least an interesting story.

554
00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:24,200
Speaker 6: Pretty much crickets.

555
00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:27,240
Speaker 3: From the media, everything is kind of overshadowed by the war,

556
00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:32,760
Speaker 3: the war in Gaza, but yes, there does seem to

557
00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:36,640
Speaker 3: be a little bit of a moving on from the media. Also,

558
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:40,840
Speaker 3: without public testimony, without those sots to play it in

559
00:29:40,880 --> 00:29:44,360
Speaker 3: the clip and to circulate on Twitter and then also

560
00:29:44,400 --> 00:29:47,600
Speaker 3: wind up in the evening news cable news, you're less

561
00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:49,840
Speaker 3: likely to get that kind of coverage. That's what people

562
00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:52,200
Speaker 3: want from it. So we do have a cable news sot,

563
00:29:52,360 --> 00:29:52,840
Speaker 3: we do have.

564
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:55,160
Speaker 5: A cable news st Well, first let's put this. Let's

565
00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:57,240
Speaker 5: put this first element up on the screen because we have,

566
00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:00,760
Speaker 5: as Ryan said, we have gotten some stuff from these

567
00:30:00,800 --> 00:30:05,040
Speaker 5: meetings so far, mostly all from Republicans. So he's nine

568
00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:07,480
Speaker 5: hour closed door grilling and that was just day one.

569
00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:09,160
Speaker 5: This is the headline that we just put up on

570
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:14,840
Speaker 5: the screen. Day two happened yesterday. So this is from

571
00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:19,240
Speaker 5: the Republican Select Committee on the Coronavirus pandemic. They say

572
00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:24,080
Speaker 5: he's completed his two day, fourteen hour transcribed interview with

573
00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:27,080
Speaker 5: the COVID Select Committee, and the most important.

574
00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:28,720
Speaker 6: Highlights from day two, they said.

575
00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:31,840
Speaker 5: Fauci claimed that the quote six feet apart social distancing

576
00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:34,760
Speaker 5: recommendation promoted by federal health officials was likely not based

577
00:30:34,760 --> 00:30:35,520
Speaker 5: on any data.

578
00:30:35,640 --> 00:30:38,240
Speaker 6: Quote, it just sort of appeared that's a.

579
00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:42,000
Speaker 3: Which is like that part I kind of knew at

580
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:45,200
Speaker 3: the time, like it was a brand new virus. He

581
00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:47,040
Speaker 3: were like, you just stay six feet apart. It's like, well,

582
00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:49,600
Speaker 3: who said six feet, Like five feet you're in trouble.

583
00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:52,640
Speaker 3: Seven feet you're not. Like the common sense that they

584
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:53,720
Speaker 3: just kind of made that.

585
00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:57,040
Speaker 6: Up approximately two Fauci's apart. Two Yeah.

586
00:30:57,200 --> 00:31:00,480
Speaker 5: Fauchi acknowledged the Lavely hypothesis as not a conspiracy theory,

587
00:31:00,560 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 5: Republicans said. They also said he had admitted that America's

588
00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:08,120
Speaker 5: vaccine mandates during the COVID nineteen pandemic could increase vaccine

589
00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:10,400
Speaker 5: hesitancy in the future. And actually that's what the chairman,

590
00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:13,560
Speaker 5: brad Winstrip really focused on in his press release about

591
00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:16,640
Speaker 5: what happened yesterday. So in his press release, he said,

592
00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:18,920
Speaker 5: after two days of testimony, in fourteen hours of questioning,

593
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:20,520
Speaker 5: and by the way, this just came out as we

594
00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:23,520
Speaker 5: were starting taping. Many things became evident during his interview

595
00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:25,840
Speaker 5: to day, doctor Fauci claimed that the policies and mandates

596
00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:29,480
Speaker 5: he promoted man nfortunately increased vaccine hesitancy for years to come.

597
00:31:29,800 --> 00:31:33,640
Speaker 5: He testified that the Lably hypothesis, which was often suppressed,

598
00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:36,880
Speaker 5: was in fact not a conspiracy theory. Further, the social

599
00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:40,360
Speaker 5: distancing recommendations forced on Americans quote sort of appeared and

600
00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:44,680
Speaker 5: were likely not based on any scientific data. So Ryan,

601
00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:46,320
Speaker 5: that's what one strip chose to focus on.

602
00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 3: That's where I'm like, okay, but breathing right in somebody's

603
00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:54,880
Speaker 3: face when you're sick shouldn't do it? Is it's based

604
00:31:54,920 --> 00:32:01,720
Speaker 3: on some data, Like I mean during the plague throughout

605
00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:06,400
Speaker 3: you know, people's social distance, because if you're sick, you

606
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:08,720
Speaker 3: look stay away from other people, right, Like that's why

607
00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:09,880
Speaker 3: you don't go to work when you're sick.

608
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:11,120
Speaker 4: You don't go to school when you're sick.

609
00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:16,760
Speaker 3: Like, social distance has been understood.

610
00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:18,040
Speaker 4: By humans for thousands of years.

611
00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:20,400
Speaker 3: So like for him to come in and be like

612
00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:25,520
Speaker 3: they implemented this brand new thing called social distancing, it's like,

613
00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:28,480
Speaker 3: I don't want to be around him if he's got

614
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:28,880
Speaker 3: a cough.

615
00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:31,360
Speaker 6: Right, So we're we're coming on the heels of day.

616
00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:31,640
Speaker 5: Thing.

617
00:32:31,800 --> 00:32:33,800
Speaker 3: They tell you to cover your mouth now when you're cough,

618
00:32:34,360 --> 00:32:38,000
Speaker 3: Believe it or not, no scientific backup whatsoever.

619
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:40,960
Speaker 5: So we're coming down the end of day two here.

620
00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:44,080
Speaker 5: But the big takeaway from day one was that when

621
00:32:44,080 --> 00:32:45,880
Speaker 5: we can put this next element up on the screen

622
00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:50,520
Speaker 5: right now too, is that, as the committee said, Fauci

623
00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:53,680
Speaker 5: claimed he quote did not recall pertinent COVID nineteen information

624
00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:57,760
Speaker 5: or conversations more than one hundred times on day one.

625
00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:00,360
Speaker 5: So that's reporting from the New York Post who was

626
00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:05,280
Speaker 5: quoting Brad Runstrup, who sort of did his running play

627
00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:07,840
Speaker 5: by play of what happened in that room. Now, Fauci,

628
00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:10,880
Speaker 5: according to the committee, profusely defended his previous testimony where

629
00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:12,880
Speaker 5: he said that the NIH did not fund or does

630
00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:16,520
Speaker 5: not fund a gang gain a function research in Wuhan,

631
00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:19,720
Speaker 5: and today they said so Monday, he repeatedly played semantics

632
00:33:19,720 --> 00:33:22,680
Speaker 5: with the definition of gain and function in an attempt

633
00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:26,120
Speaker 5: to avoid conceding that NIH funded.

634
00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:26,720
Speaker 6: This dangerous research.

635
00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:29,480
Speaker 5: Right that is where the rubber is going to meet

636
00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:31,400
Speaker 5: the road, and that's exactly what the segment we have

637
00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:32,440
Speaker 5: is addressing.

638
00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:36,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, So Fauchi did an interview with Meddi Hassan back

639
00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:39,040
Speaker 3: in I think last summer or whatever, and I actually

640
00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:41,800
Speaker 3: talked to Metty ahead of the interview, you know, because

641
00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:43,800
Speaker 3: he knows. That's something I've been covering a lot, and

642
00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:48,040
Speaker 3: he was asking for you know, was just strategizing around

643
00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:50,760
Speaker 3: around the interview and pointed him to this.

644
00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:52,400
Speaker 4: Interview that Fauchi gave.

645
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:54,480
Speaker 3: I think back in either twenty twelve or twenty fourteen,

646
00:33:55,040 --> 00:33:57,680
Speaker 3: back when there was this debate over whether or not

647
00:33:57,760 --> 00:34:01,480
Speaker 3: to ban or pause gain a function search, and he

648
00:34:01,680 --> 00:34:07,200
Speaker 3: was a strong advocate of not banning, not pausing. Yeah,

649
00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:09,640
Speaker 3: and in his interview he said, in that interview back

650
00:34:09,680 --> 00:34:13,439
Speaker 3: ten years ago, he said, it's possible that there could

651
00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:16,080
Speaker 3: be a mistake in using gain of function research that

652
00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:16,839
Speaker 3: could lead to.

653
00:34:18,680 --> 00:34:22,120
Speaker 4: A global pandemic, and we have to acknowledge that.

654
00:34:22,640 --> 00:34:26,880
Speaker 3: However, I think the benefits of the research outweigh the costs.

655
00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:29,280
Speaker 4: That was his opinion at the time.

656
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:33,279
Speaker 3: Mehdi asked him if he still held that opinion, and

657
00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:36,840
Speaker 3: he ended up dancing around the definition of gain of

658
00:34:36,880 --> 00:34:41,040
Speaker 3: function a lot without really kind of answering the question directly,

659
00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:44,680
Speaker 3: because it's not you either have to disavow your previous

660
00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 3: comment or you have to sound like a maniac.

661
00:34:48,200 --> 00:34:49,759
Speaker 5: Yeah, And this is what he's been doing back and

662
00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:51,959
Speaker 5: forth with Paul too. And we've asked rand Paul about

663
00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:52,680
Speaker 5: this on that show too.

664
00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:55,160
Speaker 3: So here's some of the dancing that he did, which

665
00:34:55,200 --> 00:34:57,520
Speaker 3: is probably similar to what you're going to read in

666
00:34:57,560 --> 00:35:00,319
Speaker 3: the transcript when it eventually gets least.

667
00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:02,040
Speaker 4: Here's vouch you with Metty.

668
00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:04,640
Speaker 9: We put aside gain of function because that's so confusing.

669
00:35:04,719 --> 00:35:07,160
Speaker 6: Of what a gain of function is.

670
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:09,279
Speaker 9: Is that any research that needs to be brought up

671
00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:12,360
Speaker 9: to a greater degree of scrutiny how to be researched.

672
00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:17,880
Speaker 9: At that time, the operative definition that actually was making

673
00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:24,399
Speaker 9: an enhancement of the pathogenesis or the transmissibility of a

674
00:35:24,400 --> 00:35:30,440
Speaker 9: pathogen that is highly likely known to be very transmissible

675
00:35:31,120 --> 00:35:36,120
Speaker 9: giving morbidity and mortality in humans. And the fact the

676
00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:40,920
Speaker 9: studies that were done that were funded through a United

677
00:35:40,920 --> 00:35:45,200
Speaker 9: States organization with a sub award Security to Eco Health

678
00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:50,040
Speaker 9: Alliance was looking at bad viruses that have never been

679
00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:54,239
Speaker 9: shown to infect humans. So by definition the operative definition

680
00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:59,520
Speaker 9: of the gain of function of concern, the NIH was

681
00:35:59,600 --> 00:36:00,440
Speaker 9: not funding that.

682
00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:01,759
Speaker 4: And that's when I said.

683
00:36:01,800 --> 00:36:03,239
Speaker 9: So just to be careful of you is because if

684
00:36:03,239 --> 00:36:05,239
Speaker 9: you as at me not to this that you are

685
00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:09,400
Speaker 9: your position is. We did fund the Wuhan Institute of Virology.

686
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:11,600
Speaker 1: Yes, we didn't fund gain of function.

687
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:14,120
Speaker 9: Research at Therefore, you did not lie to Congress.

688
00:36:14,120 --> 00:36:14,960
Speaker 10: I just want to clarify.

689
00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:17,560
Speaker 9: I'm want to clarify, we did not fund gain of

690
00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:21,839
Speaker 9: function research according to the operative definition of what gain

691
00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:23,000
Speaker 9: function research was.

692
00:36:23,200 --> 00:36:25,640
Speaker 3: So the problem with his answer there he keeps going

693
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:32,480
Speaker 3: back to operative definition. EcoHealth lost its UH basically, you know,

694
00:36:32,560 --> 00:36:36,280
Speaker 3: lost its grant for doing gain of function research without

695
00:36:36,840 --> 00:36:41,319
Speaker 3: informing the NIH about it. They came, they came up

696
00:36:41,320 --> 00:36:43,640
Speaker 3: to they came up with an agreement with the NIH,

697
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:46,399
Speaker 3: which we know because the Intercept got these documents through

698
00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:50,120
Speaker 3: FOYA that said if there was a one log expansion

699
00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:53,640
Speaker 3: and pathogenicity, that would count as gain of function and

700
00:36:53,680 --> 00:36:54,960
Speaker 3: they would report back.

701
00:36:54,880 --> 00:36:57,319
Speaker 4: To the NIH. They never did that.

702
00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:00,920
Speaker 3: Ultimately, and for a variety of reasons, they had their

703
00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:06,360
Speaker 3: grant rescinded and in that recision and barred from future funding.

704
00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:10,840
Speaker 3: And in that letter from the NIH, it says that

705
00:37:10,880 --> 00:37:14,240
Speaker 3: they conducted gain of function research outside of the protocol.

706
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:19,520
Speaker 3: So that is what makes it impossible to square what

707
00:37:19,560 --> 00:37:22,239
Speaker 3: Fauci is saying when it comes to the operative definition. Well,

708
00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:28,440
Speaker 3: why was the NIH operating under a different operative definition

709
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:29,960
Speaker 3: than the one that you say was operative?

710
00:37:30,160 --> 00:37:30,359
Speaker 8: Right?

711
00:37:30,760 --> 00:37:34,040
Speaker 5: And so Emily Copp of us Right to Know had

712
00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:36,640
Speaker 5: a really good point on Twitter yesterday. She said, FOUC

713
00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:38,920
Speaker 5: she appears to be redefining gain of function research in

714
00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:39,960
Speaker 5: order to escape.

715
00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:40,800
Speaker 6: A perjury conviction.

716
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:43,520
Speaker 5: And so again that's why Republicans really want to get

717
00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:48,040
Speaker 5: him on the record, and he's transcribed this transcribed testimony,

718
00:37:48,719 --> 00:37:51,200
Speaker 5: because that's clearly what he's trying to do. And if

719
00:37:51,200 --> 00:37:53,880
Speaker 5: you listen to him in that conversation with Mehdi, if

720
00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:56,839
Speaker 5: you listen to him in any conversation now which he's

721
00:37:56,920 --> 00:37:59,520
Speaker 5: asked or if he's pressed on this question of gain

722
00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:02,440
Speaker 5: and function, he should have known when he was testifying

723
00:38:03,040 --> 00:38:05,040
Speaker 5: before Congress. And he did though actually when he was

724
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:07,279
Speaker 5: testifying before Congress that this was going to be an issue,

725
00:38:07,320 --> 00:38:09,360
Speaker 5: and that's why he's always been playing sort of fast

726
00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:11,879
Speaker 5: and loose with it. But even so, when you look

727
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:15,360
Speaker 5: back at how he was originally defining gain of function,

728
00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:19,520
Speaker 5: it's so so obvious what he's doing now. And nobody

729
00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:22,920
Speaker 5: wants to be convicted of perjury. So hey, man, you

730
00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:25,239
Speaker 5: gotta do what you gotta do. But you shouldn't have

731
00:38:25,280 --> 00:38:26,879
Speaker 5: lied in the first place, and you shouldn't have done

732
00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:28,080
Speaker 5: any of this in the first place.

733
00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:30,960
Speaker 6: And I mean good on the Republicans for pushing him on.

734
00:38:31,000 --> 00:38:31,040
Speaker 5: This.

735
00:38:31,560 --> 00:38:35,400
Speaker 3: Seems almost impossible to get convicted of perjury before Congress nowadays,

736
00:38:36,239 --> 00:38:38,840
Speaker 3: But he did seem to have a wilful intent to

737
00:38:39,160 --> 00:38:42,880
Speaker 3: mislead Congress about the research that he was funding.

738
00:38:43,239 --> 00:38:45,600
Speaker 4: Absolutely, which he now acknowledges.

739
00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:47,960
Speaker 3: Is it's not a conspiracy theory to say that it

740
00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:51,520
Speaker 3: may have emerged from the lab that he knew he

741
00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:53,200
Speaker 3: was financing through a sub award.

742
00:38:53,280 --> 00:38:54,120
Speaker 4: Yeah, he knew that.

743
00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:55,160
Speaker 1: Yeah.

744
00:38:55,280 --> 00:38:58,640
Speaker 3: You can imagine you're the guy who fought an internal

745
00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:02,480
Speaker 3: battle against people who were trying to stop gain a

746
00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:06,040
Speaker 3: function research and successfully stopped it in the Obama administration

747
00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:10,200
Speaker 3: because they thought it was so dangerous. He gets it restarted,

748
00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:13,600
Speaker 3: but only under these very strict conditions. He then goes

749
00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:14,759
Speaker 3: around those strict.

750
00:39:14,480 --> 00:39:16,439
Speaker 4: Conditions and funds the Wuhan lab.

751
00:39:16,920 --> 00:39:20,280
Speaker 3: A pandemic breaks out within, you know, pretty quickly after

752
00:39:20,360 --> 00:39:24,200
Speaker 3: this research starts to get funded. You can imagine he

753
00:39:24,239 --> 00:39:27,279
Speaker 3: doesn't know for certain exactly what happened. But what do

754
00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:30,319
Speaker 3: you if you're him, what are you gonna think? How's

755
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:32,680
Speaker 3: it gonna look even if it's even if you're innocent,

756
00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:35,520
Speaker 3: It's not gonna look good, right, you've seen the movie

757
00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:36,920
Speaker 3: where they like, all of a sudden, the guy has

758
00:39:36,960 --> 00:39:38,480
Speaker 3: a gun in his hand, but he didn't actually kill

759
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:41,640
Speaker 3: the person he's He then tries to figure out a

760
00:39:41,640 --> 00:39:42,920
Speaker 3: way that he's not gonna wipe up in.

761
00:39:42,840 --> 00:39:44,640
Speaker 4: Prison for the rest of his life, even if he

762
00:39:44,640 --> 00:39:45,320
Speaker 4: knows he's innocent.

763
00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:47,320
Speaker 3: So even if he thought he was innocent, he was

764
00:39:47,400 --> 00:39:49,439
Speaker 3: lying to try to get out of it, to try

765
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:53,120
Speaker 3: to say, well, it's the web market that's crazy, right,

766
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:55,080
Speaker 3: and we also we weren't funding what we were funding.

767
00:39:55,600 --> 00:39:57,600
Speaker 6: Yes, yeah, it's a web of lies.

768
00:39:57,600 --> 00:39:58,960
Speaker 5: I don't know if we have this next element, it's

769
00:39:58,960 --> 00:40:01,960
Speaker 5: a tweet from Justin good Men over at Yeah. So

770
00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:04,799
Speaker 5: Justin Goodman over at White Coat Waste. We've had him

771
00:40:04,840 --> 00:40:06,880
Speaker 5: on this show before too. He says that this is

772
00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:09,200
Speaker 5: another speaking of the web of lies. Fauci knows that

773
00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:12,080
Speaker 5: foreign animal labs he funded are exempt from oversight due

774
00:40:12,120 --> 00:40:13,520
Speaker 5: to an illegal loophole.

775
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:16,560
Speaker 6: Under Fauci NIAI.

776
00:40:15,880 --> 00:40:20,120
Speaker 5: D funded more foreign animal labs than any NIH organization

777
00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:25,799
Speaker 5: and admitted to Jo that it never inspected one. And

778
00:40:25,880 --> 00:40:30,120
Speaker 5: so this is in response to different things that Fauci

779
00:40:30,160 --> 00:40:32,640
Speaker 5: testified about. So this is not even just about gain

780
00:40:32,719 --> 00:40:35,800
Speaker 5: of function. This was the Select sub Commitee tweeted. Fauchi

781
00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:39,719
Speaker 5: was unable to confirm if NIAI D has any mechanisms

782
00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:44,000
Speaker 5: to conduct oversight of the foreign laboratories they fund, And

783
00:40:44,360 --> 00:40:47,120
Speaker 5: Goodman is saying, yet he knows that they're exempt from

784
00:40:47,120 --> 00:40:50,680
Speaker 5: oversight because of this illegal loophole, and they were funding

785
00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:53,720
Speaker 5: all kinds of foreign animal labs on a different scale

786
00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:57,120
Speaker 5: under Fauci than had been seen recently before that.

787
00:40:57,280 --> 00:40:59,240
Speaker 6: So he's in a world of trouble.

788
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:01,839
Speaker 5: Whether you know there's any consequences for him, I think

789
00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:03,120
Speaker 5: is the open question now.

790
00:41:05,719 --> 00:41:08,400
Speaker 3: All Right, So that's a story about public officials misleading

791
00:41:08,719 --> 00:41:11,400
Speaker 3: the public in a way I deeply care about. We

792
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:13,920
Speaker 3: now have a story about a public official misleading the

793
00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:16,120
Speaker 3: public in a way I kind of don't care about.

794
00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:20,040
Speaker 3: But it's really funny. Although I'm sad for Lloyd Austin.

795
00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:22,400
Speaker 3: It sounds like he's still in the hospital. Yeah, so

796
00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:25,000
Speaker 3: let's talk about the problems that the White House is facing,

797
00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:29,160
Speaker 3: because the White House Press Corps has found itself a

798
00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:32,480
Speaker 3: scandal and it's got questions that it once answered.

799
00:41:32,600 --> 00:41:35,200
Speaker 6: It is pretty absurd when you.

800
00:41:35,160 --> 00:41:38,319
Speaker 3: Think it's really crazy, like nobody would get away with

801
00:41:38,360 --> 00:41:41,120
Speaker 3: this in like this in like a six person office,

802
00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:43,719
Speaker 3: no let alone, or.

803
00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:45,600
Speaker 6: In nineteen ninety five, right like Bill Clinton.

804
00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:48,000
Speaker 5: If this happens under his watch, like this is the

805
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:50,200
Speaker 5: story that is leading all of the networks.

806
00:41:50,280 --> 00:41:51,480
Speaker 6: It is the headline.

807
00:41:51,640 --> 00:41:54,200
Speaker 5: And I mean, obviously there are two wars going on

808
00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:56,320
Speaker 5: right now, So in some ways that makes the story

809
00:41:56,320 --> 00:41:56,880
Speaker 5: more important.

810
00:41:56,880 --> 00:41:58,480
Speaker 6: In some ways it makes it less important.

811
00:41:58,719 --> 00:42:01,200
Speaker 5: But the president seemed, but it seems to have not

812
00:42:01,360 --> 00:42:05,560
Speaker 5: known that his Defense secretary was undergoing serious medical treatment

813
00:42:05,600 --> 00:42:06,760
Speaker 5: for a very serious condition.

814
00:42:07,000 --> 00:42:10,480
Speaker 3: Raises the question of whether it matters that anybody has

815
00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:12,680
Speaker 3: their hand on the wheel. So let's put up this

816
00:42:12,760 --> 00:42:17,520
Speaker 3: first element here as part of Secretary Austin's this is

817
00:42:17,520 --> 00:42:21,560
Speaker 3: a statement. As part of Secretary Austin's routinely recommended health screening,

818
00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:25,560
Speaker 3: he has undergone regular prostate surveillance. Changed in his lab

819
00:42:25,600 --> 00:42:30,160
Speaker 3: evaluation in early December twenty twenty three identified prostate cancer

820
00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:34,279
Speaker 3: which required treatment. December twenty second, he was admitted to

821
00:42:34,320 --> 00:42:38,560
Speaker 3: Walter Reed Walter Reid and underwent a minimally invasive surgical

822
00:42:38,560 --> 00:42:42,760
Speaker 3: procedure called a prostate ectomy to treat and cure prostate cancer.

823
00:42:43,440 --> 00:42:44,400
Speaker 4: It seemed to go fine.

824
00:42:44,440 --> 00:42:47,880
Speaker 3: He went home on January first, New Year's Day, he

825
00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:51,759
Speaker 3: was admitted back to Walter Reed with complications from the

826
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:56,040
Speaker 3: December twenty second procedure, including nausea, severe abdominal, hip and

827
00:42:56,120 --> 00:43:00,239
Speaker 3: leg pain, and initial evaluation revealed at urinate track infection.

828
00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:03,799
Speaker 3: January tewond the decision was made to transfer him to

829
00:43:03,880 --> 00:43:07,200
Speaker 3: the ICU for close monitoring any higher level of care.

830
00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:11,680
Speaker 3: Now they say that under no time during this was

831
00:43:11,760 --> 00:43:17,240
Speaker 3: he sedated. And so you hear ICU and you think,

832
00:43:18,200 --> 00:43:20,799
Speaker 3: all right, this guy's like in a coma, Like that's

833
00:43:20,880 --> 00:43:25,239
Speaker 3: just how the public hears it. He was getting intensive care,

834
00:43:26,600 --> 00:43:30,600
Speaker 3: but he was not sedated, which seems to be the

835
00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:34,920
Speaker 3: rationale that they would be relying on to say, well.

836
00:43:34,800 --> 00:43:37,760
Speaker 4: Okay, I was working from home. I was working from.

837
00:43:37,640 --> 00:43:42,000
Speaker 3: The ICU, managing two wars from the ICU. So the

838
00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:46,239
Speaker 3: White House Press Corps, you know, just battering the White

839
00:43:46,239 --> 00:43:46,799
Speaker 3: House over this.

840
00:43:46,840 --> 00:43:49,279
Speaker 4: I think we have John Kirby getting knocked around here.

841
00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:54,239
Speaker 11: We learn also today that Secretary Austin, when he went

842
00:43:54,239 --> 00:43:57,680
Speaker 11: into the hospital for the first time on December twenty second,

843
00:43:58,160 --> 00:43:59,920
Speaker 11: he knew he was going to be under General MSTA,

844
00:44:00,600 --> 00:44:02,560
Speaker 11: knew he was going to be spending the night and

845
00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:08,560
Speaker 11: transferred authority to his deputy Secretary. Was the White House

846
00:44:08,680 --> 00:44:12,920
Speaker 11: informed then that author that the authority.

847
00:44:12,520 --> 00:44:13,719
Speaker 1: Was going to be transferred.

848
00:44:13,800 --> 00:44:18,839
Speaker 11: No, So the President has known for I guess five

849
00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:22,759
Speaker 11: days now that Secretary Austin was in the hospital, but

850
00:44:22,920 --> 00:44:24,200
Speaker 11: he wasn't informed.

851
00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:31,440
Speaker 10: Why he was not informed until last Friday that Secretary

852
00:44:31,480 --> 00:44:34,320
Speaker 10: Austin was in the hospital. He was not informed until

853
00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:38,640
Speaker 10: this morning that the root cause of that hospitalization was

854
00:44:39,040 --> 00:44:39,840
Speaker 10: prostate cancer?

855
00:44:40,680 --> 00:44:43,280
Speaker 11: Is that because the White House knew and didn't inform

856
00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:46,879
Speaker 11: the President because Secretary Austin chose not to share that.

857
00:44:46,840 --> 00:44:47,400
Speaker 4: With the president.

858
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:52,239
Speaker 10: Nobody at the White House knew that Secretary Austin had

859
00:44:52,640 --> 00:44:55,800
Speaker 10: prostate cancer until this morning, and the President was informed

860
00:44:55,960 --> 00:44:56,800
Speaker 10: immediately after.

861
00:44:57,200 --> 00:45:02,240
Speaker 11: We were okay, last week, we learned that Jake Sullivan,

862
00:45:02,320 --> 00:45:06,680
Speaker 11: I believe, found out about the fact that Secretary Austin

863
00:45:06,880 --> 00:45:10,280
Speaker 11: was hospitalized on Thursday morning. So just want to clarify,

864
00:45:10,280 --> 00:45:13,080
Speaker 11: you're saying the President found out a day later than

865
00:45:13,520 --> 00:45:14,319
Speaker 11: the NSC did.

866
00:45:14,640 --> 00:45:16,160
Speaker 4: No, Jake was informed.

867
00:45:16,160 --> 00:45:20,400
Speaker 10: A National Security visor was informed that Secretary Austin was

868
00:45:20,440 --> 00:45:22,960
Speaker 10: in the hospital and had been for some time. He

869
00:45:23,080 --> 00:45:27,759
Speaker 10: found out late Thursday afternoon, and he informed he and

870
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:32,200
Speaker 10: the Chief staff. Mister Science informed the president later that evening,

871
00:45:32,200 --> 00:45:35,440
Speaker 10: early that evening, not long after they learned, they informed

872
00:45:35,440 --> 00:45:37,000
Speaker 10: the president directly Thursday.

873
00:45:37,560 --> 00:45:40,280
Speaker 5: So Ran, when you think about it, you say Friday first, yes,

874
00:45:40,360 --> 00:45:43,759
Speaker 5: And so when you think about all of the we

875
00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:46,400
Speaker 5: think about all of the operations that are happening every

876
00:45:46,520 --> 00:45:50,440
Speaker 5: single day, every single hour, really, both in Ukraine and

877
00:45:50,480 --> 00:45:53,520
Speaker 5: in Israel, I think this becomes less of a sort

878
00:45:53,520 --> 00:45:56,480
Speaker 5: of Washington intrigue scandal and more of a serious one.

879
00:45:56,680 --> 00:46:00,000
Speaker 6: That raises two another question, which is does.

880
00:46:00,040 --> 00:46:02,799
Speaker 5: Anybody even care if Biden is in the loop on

881
00:46:02,880 --> 00:46:07,440
Speaker 5: this is Austin actually saying, don't tell the guy because

882
00:46:07,440 --> 00:46:10,680
Speaker 5: he's not running this administration. That's the real That's the

883
00:46:10,719 --> 00:46:13,319
Speaker 5: biggest question for me, is that is this just that

884
00:46:13,840 --> 00:46:18,400
Speaker 5: people know that Biden isn't even doing anything that like if.

885
00:46:18,280 --> 00:46:20,520
Speaker 3: That was crazy, If that was the case, though, you'd

886
00:46:20,520 --> 00:46:22,839
Speaker 3: at least tell the chief of staff, right, the White

887
00:46:22,880 --> 00:46:24,759
Speaker 3: House chief of staff, they are doing it. You would

888
00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:27,719
Speaker 3: tell Jake Sullivan, You'd tell Tony Blinken, like if.

889
00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:30,680
Speaker 5: Jake Sullivan knew first. They did tell Jake Sullivan after

890
00:46:30,719 --> 00:46:31,680
Speaker 5: a long time, because.

891
00:46:31,480 --> 00:46:34,200
Speaker 3: Jake was like in a meeting and he's like Where's

892
00:46:34,320 --> 00:46:39,000
Speaker 3: where Lloyd? What's going on with Lloyd? And eventually somebody's like, oh, yeah,

893
00:46:39,040 --> 00:46:40,800
Speaker 3: by the way, I guess guess he's in the hospital.

894
00:46:40,920 --> 00:46:43,680
Speaker 3: I think it's his war crime alibi. So when he

895
00:46:43,800 --> 00:46:45,920
Speaker 3: had when he goes to the Hague, like I was

896
00:46:45,920 --> 00:46:48,440
Speaker 3: in the ICU, you can't blame me for any This

897
00:46:48,480 --> 00:46:50,479
Speaker 3: is not me. I don't think that's gonna fly because

898
00:46:50,520 --> 00:46:52,080
Speaker 3: it's only a couple of days.

899
00:46:52,160 --> 00:46:53,839
Speaker 4: He was doing war crimes before it.

900
00:46:54,280 --> 00:46:56,719
Speaker 3: He was supporting war crimes from the ICU, and he's

901
00:46:56,719 --> 00:46:57,840
Speaker 3: still supporting war crimes.

902
00:46:57,920 --> 00:47:00,160
Speaker 5: So but again, when you think about the decision is

903
00:47:00,200 --> 00:47:02,720
Speaker 5: that go are going through the Pentagon, high level life

904
00:47:02,800 --> 00:47:05,840
Speaker 5: and death decisions that are going through the Pentagon on

905
00:47:05,960 --> 00:47:09,080
Speaker 5: an hourly basis, because there are now two wars happening,

906
00:47:09,120 --> 00:47:11,200
Speaker 5: let alone all of the various conflicts around the war

907
00:47:11,480 --> 00:47:14,080
Speaker 5: around the world, but two hot conflicts right now that

908
00:47:14,120 --> 00:47:19,439
Speaker 5: we are funding to a serious degree. And you think

909
00:47:19,480 --> 00:47:22,239
Speaker 5: that you can just keep this quiet, keep this from

910
00:47:22,239 --> 00:47:26,080
Speaker 5: the president for as long as you did, something else

911
00:47:26,160 --> 00:47:30,440
Speaker 5: is going on. That's not just that Lloyd Austin was.

912
00:47:30,680 --> 00:47:33,120
Speaker 5: You know, he's very a private person. You know, he

913
00:47:33,160 --> 00:47:35,480
Speaker 5: just didn't want the public. He wanted to leak to

914
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:38,160
Speaker 5: the public. He didn't want the president to worry about him.

915
00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:39,759
Speaker 5: There's something else going on there.

916
00:47:40,120 --> 00:47:42,479
Speaker 3: But it's also a story that the White House Press

917
00:47:42,480 --> 00:47:46,200
Speaker 3: Corps loves because there are answers that they can get,

918
00:47:46,600 --> 00:47:49,160
Speaker 3: questions that they can ask, and it's short of any

919
00:47:49,239 --> 00:47:50,560
Speaker 3: kind of political valance.

920
00:47:50,680 --> 00:47:53,560
Speaker 4: There's no substance. I mean, okay, yeah, there should be

921
00:47:53,640 --> 00:47:54,520
Speaker 4: people running the show.

922
00:47:55,680 --> 00:47:59,520
Speaker 3: There's substance there, but it's short of ideological substance.

923
00:48:00,120 --> 00:48:04,440
Speaker 4: And they love the non ideological stories.

924
00:48:04,120 --> 00:48:07,400
Speaker 5: A great completely pass intrigue, right right, personnel questions.

925
00:48:07,560 --> 00:48:09,439
Speaker 6: There's nothing they love more than personnel.

926
00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:12,319
Speaker 3: Perfect personnel intery. You can say it matters because it does,

927
00:48:12,360 --> 00:48:13,480
Speaker 3: and you can look tough.

928
00:48:13,480 --> 00:48:14,919
Speaker 4: And you're going to you're going to challenge the White

929
00:48:14,920 --> 00:48:18,520
Speaker 4: House hard, right, Well, uh, Deucey's question was funny, like

930
00:48:18,560 --> 00:48:21,160
Speaker 4: what kind of president is this or something something like that.

931
00:48:21,200 --> 00:48:26,080
Speaker 6: It's like, I mean, it's pretty unusual.

932
00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:30,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, so I think if if, if this would have

933
00:48:30,239 --> 00:48:33,719
Speaker 3: happened under the Trump administration, Oh yeah, yeah, it would,

934
00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:37,960
Speaker 3: but he'd be so hypocritical from uh, Democrats in particular,

935
00:48:38,000 --> 00:48:40,560
Speaker 3: because they don't want Trump involved.

936
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:41,760
Speaker 4: Well, I don't want.

937
00:48:41,719 --> 00:48:44,080
Speaker 3: Trump talking to his cabinet secretaries. They just want some

938
00:48:44,160 --> 00:48:45,279
Speaker 3: deep state just running it.

939
00:48:45,440 --> 00:48:47,520
Speaker 5: Well, that's what it reminds me of, like when it's

940
00:48:47,520 --> 00:48:50,399
Speaker 5: actually kind of an interesting question because in the Trump

941
00:48:50,400 --> 00:48:53,920
Speaker 5: administration there were people who were wish they weren't operating

942
00:48:54,520 --> 00:48:57,080
Speaker 5: with the oversight of the president because you think.

943
00:48:56,960 --> 00:48:59,480
Speaker 4: Of like how Trump had tried to avoid him.

944
00:48:59,520 --> 00:49:02,160
Speaker 5: He put the like the CEO of Exon in charge

945
00:49:02,160 --> 00:49:05,000
Speaker 5: of the State Department, and then he had John Bolton

946
00:49:05,040 --> 00:49:05,680
Speaker 5: in the White House.

947
00:49:05,719 --> 00:49:08,960
Speaker 6: But he also had people who were way more.

948
00:49:08,800 --> 00:49:11,719
Speaker 5: I'm not saying they are isolationalists, but more isolationist, sort

949
00:49:11,719 --> 00:49:15,520
Speaker 5: of on the spectrum of you know, interventionists isolationists. And

950
00:49:15,560 --> 00:49:19,560
Speaker 5: so he constantly had this like pull tug of war

951
00:49:19,600 --> 00:49:22,880
Speaker 5: happening in his own administration ideologically, and people were playing

952
00:49:22,920 --> 00:49:25,520
Speaker 5: each other against each other as like little pawns to

953
00:49:25,520 --> 00:49:27,520
Speaker 5: see who could get to the president, to see, you know,

954
00:49:27,680 --> 00:49:29,879
Speaker 5: who could put a crazy article on the President's desk

955
00:49:29,920 --> 00:49:32,040
Speaker 5: and make John Bolton look bad or whatever it is.

956
00:49:32,520 --> 00:49:34,520
Speaker 5: And so absolutely it would have happened to the Trump

957
00:49:34,520 --> 00:49:39,160
Speaker 5: administration because there were people who didn't want Donald Trump

958
00:49:39,200 --> 00:49:42,560
Speaker 5: to be involved. They didn't want him to oversee what

959
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:46,640
Speaker 5: they were doing in foreign policy, because then maybe one

960
00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:50,600
Speaker 5: of the less interventionist people in his administration would try

961
00:49:50,640 --> 00:49:52,960
Speaker 5: to persuade him to take different steps.

962
00:49:53,200 --> 00:49:55,239
Speaker 3: Maybe if Biden takes his hand off the Gaza teller

963
00:49:55,239 --> 00:49:58,279
Speaker 3: a little bit, there would be less unconditional support for

964
00:49:58,320 --> 00:49:59,319
Speaker 3: what Israel's doing there.

965
00:49:59,400 --> 00:50:02,520
Speaker 5: That's why this is interesting because it does have that

966
00:50:02,600 --> 00:50:06,799
Speaker 5: sort of like Trumpian there's does the Pentagon want to

967
00:50:06,880 --> 00:50:11,040
Speaker 5: operate without oversight of the White House? And is this

968
00:50:11,280 --> 00:50:13,239
Speaker 5: part of sort of giving the White House the middle

969
00:50:13,239 --> 00:50:16,120
Speaker 5: finger and trying to operate more freely. I don't know,

970
00:50:16,719 --> 00:50:18,160
Speaker 5: but there's something interesting there.

971
00:50:18,480 --> 00:50:19,720
Speaker 4: Let's get to the important news.

972
00:50:19,840 --> 00:50:24,960
Speaker 3: Tunnels, all right, So in Crown Heights police somehow stumbled

973
00:50:25,040 --> 00:50:32,680
Speaker 3: on a network of tunnels built underneath a historic synagogue.

974
00:50:33,000 --> 00:50:37,000
Speaker 3: They're in the Orthodox community, and we can get there

975
00:50:37,000 --> 00:50:38,480
Speaker 3: are a couple of theories about.

976
00:50:38,200 --> 00:50:40,120
Speaker 4: What was going on here. If we have this first

977
00:50:40,400 --> 00:50:42,920
Speaker 4: element that we can that we can throw up.

978
00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:46,319
Speaker 3: Here this is this is footage of Mayhem that broke

979
00:50:46,360 --> 00:50:49,560
Speaker 3: out after the police were like, look this, you can't

980
00:50:49,600 --> 00:50:52,440
Speaker 3: just be digging massive tunnels underneath the synagogue.

981
00:50:52,520 --> 00:50:55,560
Speaker 4: We're going to have to clear this out. They refused

982
00:50:56,239 --> 00:50:57,319
Speaker 4: to clear out.

983
00:50:57,360 --> 00:50:59,839
Speaker 3: And so as you can see in the video they

984
00:51:00,640 --> 00:51:05,520
Speaker 3: they handcuffed using those little plastic cuffs the first person

985
00:51:05,560 --> 00:51:06,720
Speaker 3: that was stuck in the tunnel.

986
00:51:07,080 --> 00:51:08,480
Speaker 4: And that's when all hell broke.

987
00:51:08,320 --> 00:51:12,359
Speaker 3: Loose and the congregants started fighting back.

988
00:51:13,280 --> 00:51:14,879
Speaker 4: And you see a little bit of.

989
00:51:15,120 --> 00:51:18,560
Speaker 3: You know, pepper spray type stuff, you know, getting doused,

990
00:51:18,600 --> 00:51:22,280
Speaker 3: and then you see people start to rip the wooden

991
00:51:22,320 --> 00:51:24,439
Speaker 3: walls off off the side of the synagogue. And here's

992
00:51:24,520 --> 00:51:29,040
Speaker 3: here's footage of the tunnels, the tunnels themselves.

993
00:51:28,480 --> 00:51:32,399
Speaker 4: Which are you know, go down underneath. And then kind

994
00:51:32,400 --> 00:51:32,799
Speaker 4: of it.

995
00:51:34,719 --> 00:51:38,440
Speaker 3: Seems like, well, anyway, let's get into the theories about

996
00:51:38,840 --> 00:51:39,279
Speaker 3: what's going on.

997
00:51:39,400 --> 00:51:44,839
Speaker 4: There's two theories. One some kids run a muck. But

998
00:51:45,239 --> 00:51:47,840
Speaker 4: I'm gonna hear the kids run a muck theory is great.

999
00:51:48,080 --> 00:51:50,799
Speaker 3: It's like they some teenagers were told not to do this,

1000
00:51:52,320 --> 00:51:55,359
Speaker 3: and you know how kids today are these days, these days,

1001
00:51:55,360 --> 00:51:58,080
Speaker 3: and they just went ahead and dug these dug these tunnels.

1002
00:51:58,320 --> 00:52:01,520
Speaker 5: This is from limbs of Talk. This is a tweet

1003
00:52:02,120 --> 00:52:04,600
Speaker 5: sort of saying. Gen Z was taught that nothing is

1004
00:52:04,600 --> 00:52:06,600
Speaker 5: more important than their feelings, and now they're emboldened to

1005
00:52:06,680 --> 00:52:07,960
Speaker 5: act entitled and spoiled.

1006
00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:09,920
Speaker 6: Was zero regard or respect for.

1007
00:52:09,960 --> 00:52:11,600
Speaker 5: Others, we keep seeing this time and again in all

1008
00:52:11,600 --> 00:52:14,200
Speaker 5: our institutions. We must fix the broken education system. The

1009
00:52:14,200 --> 00:52:16,840
Speaker 5: future of our country depends on it. And this is

1010
00:52:17,120 --> 00:52:19,320
Speaker 5: her saying the disgraceful teams. This is how she starts.

1011
00:52:19,360 --> 00:52:21,920
Speaker 5: Wh dug underneath a well respected synagogue did so on

1012
00:52:21,960 --> 00:52:24,719
Speaker 5: their own after being explicitly told not to. They went

1013
00:52:24,800 --> 00:52:27,719
Speaker 5: against synagogue leadership. And so, yes, Ryan, that is one

1014
00:52:27,719 --> 00:52:28,600
Speaker 5: of the theories that.

1015
00:52:28,680 --> 00:52:29,600
Speaker 4: These are woke tunnels.

1016
00:52:30,160 --> 00:52:30,520
Speaker 6: I see.

1017
00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:34,799
Speaker 5: That's not so much wokeness as it is just generationally

1018
00:52:34,840 --> 00:52:37,920
Speaker 5: gen zer kids these days, their phones.

1019
00:52:37,480 --> 00:52:39,439
Speaker 4: And their and their tiktoks and there.

1020
00:52:39,719 --> 00:52:42,799
Speaker 5: So this went massively viral in TikTok, a lot of

1021
00:52:42,800 --> 00:52:47,600
Speaker 5: this when the tunnel videos first started cropping up, massive

1022
00:52:47,719 --> 00:52:50,440
Speaker 5: virality on social media, especially on TikTok.

1023
00:52:50,880 --> 00:52:53,520
Speaker 4: So the theory go ahead. Well, I was just going

1024
00:52:53,560 --> 00:52:55,520
Speaker 4: to say, so absurd, but let's address it first.

1025
00:52:55,600 --> 00:52:57,480
Speaker 5: So either way, one thing we do know is that

1026
00:52:57,480 --> 00:52:59,960
Speaker 5: the tunnels weren't just being dug by some bord hit

1027
00:53:00,160 --> 00:53:01,680
Speaker 5: for the hell of it, right, Like it wasn't just

1028
00:53:01,960 --> 00:53:05,120
Speaker 5: you know, screw huge to authorities. This is a fairly

1029
00:53:05,719 --> 00:53:11,480
Speaker 5: rolling Stone describes it as quotidian, but a fairly serious

1030
00:53:11,520 --> 00:53:18,040
Speaker 5: dispute internicene dispute among different sects in Crown Heights, So

1031
00:53:18,120 --> 00:53:20,239
Speaker 5: in reality, the explanation for the tunnels was at least

1032
00:53:20,280 --> 00:53:23,120
Speaker 5: somewhat more quid quotidian. Rolling Stone rights the tunnels were

1033
00:53:23,160 --> 00:53:25,920
Speaker 5: the result of an ongoing dispute between the Chabad Lubavic

1034
00:53:25,960 --> 00:53:29,600
Speaker 5: community and a more extremist splinter sect, which has long

1035
00:53:29,760 --> 00:53:32,880
Speaker 5: been embroiled in turmoil over ownership of the building that

1036
00:53:33,040 --> 00:53:36,400
Speaker 5: is housing the headquarters. Members of the splinter group believe

1037
00:53:36,480 --> 00:53:40,200
Speaker 5: that the Rabbi Menachem Schneerson, who led the Chabad Lubavic

1038
00:53:40,280 --> 00:53:42,560
Speaker 5: movement before his death at the age of ninety two

1039
00:53:42,840 --> 00:53:46,160
Speaker 5: aged death in nineteen ninety four, is the Messiah, and

1040
00:53:46,200 --> 00:53:49,560
Speaker 5: that is a claim that the mainstream Chabad movement rejects.

1041
00:53:49,680 --> 00:53:52,000
Speaker 6: And so this had started happening.

1042
00:53:52,160 --> 00:53:55,680
Speaker 3: The extremists believe that he's still alive, like and wants

1043
00:53:55,719 --> 00:53:57,640
Speaker 3: them to do this basically, right.

1044
00:53:57,560 --> 00:54:01,240
Speaker 5: It's crazy, I mean, it's just it's a crazy, crazy story.

1045
00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:03,440
Speaker 5: And so rolling Stone goes on to say, in two

1046
00:54:03,480 --> 00:54:05,840
Speaker 5: thousand and six, a court determined that the mainstream Chabad

1047
00:54:05,920 --> 00:54:09,840
Speaker 5: Lubovitch community had control over the building. So it's located

1048
00:54:09,880 --> 00:54:12,480
Speaker 5: on the Eastern Parkway in Brooklyn's heavily hasatic Crown Heights,

1049
00:54:12,480 --> 00:54:14,720
Speaker 5: as Rolling Stone says, yet there has still been tension

1050
00:54:14,800 --> 00:54:17,120
Speaker 5: between the two groups for all of this time, with

1051
00:54:17,200 --> 00:54:19,920
Speaker 5: the newspaper The Jewish Chronicle reporting today that about six

1052
00:54:19,960 --> 00:54:22,520
Speaker 5: months ago a small group of members from the Messianic

1053
00:54:22,600 --> 00:54:26,040
Speaker 5: Movement started construction on a network of underground tunnels in

1054
00:54:26,120 --> 00:54:27,960
Speaker 5: order to gain illegal access to the building.

1055
00:54:28,040 --> 00:54:29,160
Speaker 6: So six months.

1056
00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:32,640
Speaker 5: Ago, and this was there were some of his videos

1057
00:54:32,640 --> 00:54:36,120
Speaker 5: that were popping up about a month ago, maybe a

1058
00:54:36,120 --> 00:54:38,360
Speaker 5: little longer ago than that actually, and it sort of

1059
00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:39,440
Speaker 5: stayed a local.

1060
00:54:39,200 --> 00:54:42,560
Speaker 4: Story of people popping out of the street, just people

1061
00:54:42,800 --> 00:54:43,200
Speaker 4: like that.

1062
00:54:43,239 --> 00:54:43,439
Speaker 10: One.

1063
00:54:44,640 --> 00:54:46,600
Speaker 6: We do have more veo here that we can roll.

1064
00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:48,799
Speaker 5: This is the next element that we can put up

1065
00:54:48,840 --> 00:54:50,320
Speaker 5: on the screen, just so you can sort of start

1066
00:54:50,320 --> 00:54:54,200
Speaker 5: to see what this looked like. And I'll read more

1067
00:54:54,440 --> 00:54:57,759
Speaker 5: here from Rolling Stone, they say. At first, the intern

1068
00:54:57,920 --> 00:55:00,239
Speaker 5: icing dispute between what is essentially two small stacks of

1069
00:55:00,239 --> 00:55:03,560
Speaker 5: the already small Crown Heights Orthodox Jewish community primarily garnered

1070
00:55:03,600 --> 00:55:06,879
Speaker 5: only local media interests. The mainstream Chabad Lubovitch community also

1071
00:55:06,920 --> 00:55:09,800
Speaker 5: immediately made it clear that it did not endorse the tunnels,

1072
00:55:09,800 --> 00:55:12,400
Speaker 5: with chairman Rabbi j. Hudokrinsky issuing a statement saying that

1073
00:55:12,440 --> 00:55:15,759
Speaker 5: Chabad Lubovitch community is pained by the vandalism of a

1074
00:55:15,880 --> 00:55:21,400
Speaker 5: group of young agitators who damaged the synagogue below Chabad headquarters,

1075
00:55:21,400 --> 00:55:23,320
Speaker 5: and he called their actions odious.

1076
00:55:23,400 --> 00:55:23,520
Speaker 6: Now.

1077
00:55:23,600 --> 00:55:27,200
Speaker 5: Ryan Willistone also notes that this started taking off when

1078
00:55:27,280 --> 00:55:31,320
Speaker 5: conspiracy theories that are pretty obviously anti Semitic about Satanic

1079
00:55:31,400 --> 00:55:36,279
Speaker 5: ritualistic sex abuse from kind of cuan non adjacent accounts

1080
00:55:36,320 --> 00:55:40,160
Speaker 5: started to spread, and that was maybe the fuel that

1081
00:55:40,400 --> 00:55:42,560
Speaker 5: took this from a local news story to a national one.

1082
00:55:42,719 --> 00:55:44,440
Speaker 3: But also the image of the guy walking out of

1083
00:55:44,440 --> 00:55:46,640
Speaker 3: the sidewalk. If you're listening to this on the podcast,

1084
00:55:46,640 --> 00:55:49,680
Speaker 3: we're playing the clip of this guy that went viral,

1085
00:55:50,480 --> 00:55:54,040
Speaker 3: the big old hat climbing out of basically threw a

1086
00:55:54,120 --> 00:55:58,799
Speaker 3: grate out of the sidewalk onto the street and then

1087
00:55:58,840 --> 00:56:02,680
Speaker 3: walking off. And just imagine you're walking down the street

1088
00:56:02,719 --> 00:56:05,200
Speaker 3: and you see that and try to describe it later. Yeah,

1089
00:56:05,239 --> 00:56:07,200
Speaker 3: I don't have friends, listen, you won't believe what I

1090
00:56:07,239 --> 00:56:08,920
Speaker 3: saw today.

1091
00:56:09,040 --> 00:56:11,040
Speaker 5: Well, there was that guy on Twitter saying he heard

1092
00:56:11,520 --> 00:56:13,799
Speaker 5: he was hearing people speak Yiddish and.

1093
00:56:13,719 --> 00:56:15,160
Speaker 4: He under the sidewalk or something.

1094
00:56:15,200 --> 00:56:17,000
Speaker 5: Well, he said, I live in like a ground floor

1095
00:56:17,040 --> 00:56:18,560
Speaker 5: apartment building and there's nothing.

1096
00:56:18,640 --> 00:56:21,240
Speaker 6: He's like, I can't have no explanation for it.

1097
00:56:21,600 --> 00:56:24,399
Speaker 5: I lived in Crown Heights. But that tweet started going

1098
00:56:24,440 --> 00:56:27,120
Speaker 5: viral too. Again, I actually don't think the anti Semitic

1099
00:56:27,160 --> 00:56:29,600
Speaker 5: conspiracy theres are what made the story viral. I think

1100
00:56:29,600 --> 00:56:31,640
Speaker 5: the story went viral because it's absolutely.

1101
00:56:31,280 --> 00:56:32,040
Speaker 4: Because it's crazy.

1102
00:56:32,160 --> 00:56:35,400
Speaker 6: It's a crazy story. It's a crazy story.

1103
00:56:35,520 --> 00:56:36,719
Speaker 4: The people love New York too.

1104
00:56:37,080 --> 00:56:42,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, the Italian cop talking talking to the dudes before

1105
00:56:43,120 --> 00:56:44,200
Speaker 3: all help pops up.

1106
00:56:44,239 --> 00:56:47,120
Speaker 4: Maybe we have some at some of that in posts.

1107
00:56:47,120 --> 00:56:49,799
Speaker 3: It's just that was just a great classic New York

1108
00:56:49,840 --> 00:56:50,319
Speaker 3: clip too.

1109
00:56:50,480 --> 00:56:52,439
Speaker 4: He's like, he's like, what are you guys doing here?

1110
00:56:52,760 --> 00:56:53,640
Speaker 4: You can't just do.

1111
00:56:53,520 --> 00:56:55,080
Speaker 6: This, he said something like, this is America.

1112
00:56:55,120 --> 00:56:57,320
Speaker 3: I'm gonna have to clear the whole Showal Yeah, we

1113
00:56:57,400 --> 00:56:58,520
Speaker 3: got to fix this by tonight.

1114
00:56:58,600 --> 00:56:58,839
Speaker 6: Yeah.

1115
00:56:59,000 --> 00:57:01,560
Speaker 3: Because also there real concerns now that there are that

1116
00:57:01,640 --> 00:57:05,440
Speaker 3: there's significant structural damage, right, Like you can't like you

1117
00:57:05,480 --> 00:57:11,600
Speaker 3: can't just take sledgehammers to underneath historic buildings and not

1118
00:57:11,719 --> 00:57:17,480
Speaker 3: have some concern. No, not not to be like, you know,

1119
00:57:17,560 --> 00:57:20,680
Speaker 3: the structural engineer guy who's like insisting on everything being

1120
00:57:21,040 --> 00:57:21,800
Speaker 3: done by the book.

1121
00:57:21,840 --> 00:57:23,440
Speaker 4: But come on, guys, like gravity is.

1122
00:57:23,440 --> 00:57:26,160
Speaker 5: A thing, no, seriously, and like as often as I

1123
00:57:26,240 --> 00:57:29,800
Speaker 5: have some like libertarian impulses on these domestic questions. For example,

1124
00:57:29,800 --> 00:57:32,600
Speaker 5: there's a woman in Herndon who's gone viral on TikTok

1125
00:57:32,640 --> 00:57:36,200
Speaker 5: for digging a tunnel underneath her own house more for

1126
00:57:36,280 --> 00:57:38,120
Speaker 5: the hell of it. But she has some like sort

1127
00:57:38,160 --> 00:57:40,920
Speaker 5: of explanation that actually might be well described as quotidian

1128
00:57:40,960 --> 00:57:44,680
Speaker 5: probably a better description there. But she is like now

1129
00:57:44,720 --> 00:57:47,880
Speaker 5: being investigated by the city. And again even as somebody

1130
00:57:47,920 --> 00:57:50,200
Speaker 5: with libertarian impulses, it's like you can see in some

1131
00:57:50,240 --> 00:57:52,640
Speaker 5: of these videos, there's a house not far away from her.

1132
00:57:53,000 --> 00:57:55,480
Speaker 5: So if you don't know what you're doing, you can

1133
00:57:55,560 --> 00:57:57,760
Speaker 5: cause other people's property to collapse.

1134
00:57:57,760 --> 00:57:59,040
Speaker 6: Your freedom unsafe.

1135
00:57:59,160 --> 00:58:01,960
Speaker 3: Your freedom to dig a tunnel ends underneath my property,

1136
00:58:02,000 --> 00:58:05,240
Speaker 3: I think would be a fair libertarian or near enough.

1137
00:58:05,080 --> 00:58:08,120
Speaker 5: To my property that you're damaging my property.

1138
00:58:08,720 --> 00:58:11,880
Speaker 3: The libertarians are all about their own property rights too.

1139
00:58:12,720 --> 00:58:14,200
Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, to an extension.

1140
00:58:14,600 --> 00:58:16,520
Speaker 4: It just depends some of them to.

1141
00:58:16,440 --> 00:58:19,520
Speaker 5: Get into it, probably, But you know, again, at its

1142
00:58:19,560 --> 00:58:22,040
Speaker 5: at its heart, what is a crazy dispute comes down

1143
00:58:22,080 --> 00:58:26,480
Speaker 5: to a messianic act of Judaism, which again, those questions

1144
00:58:26,600 --> 00:58:30,840
Speaker 5: of the Jewish Messiah are loomed very heavily over the

1145
00:58:30,880 --> 00:58:36,040
Speaker 5: conflict over the West Bank and over that land in particular.

1146
00:58:36,600 --> 00:58:38,520
Speaker 5: So this stuff, you know, this is a sort of

1147
00:58:38,560 --> 00:58:42,600
Speaker 5: silly embodiment or manifestation of it. But these are these

1148
00:58:42,640 --> 00:58:46,560
Speaker 5: are ancient questions that mean a lot to people. Yeah,

1149
00:58:46,720 --> 00:58:49,200
Speaker 5: to the point where they will dig tunnels under Crown Heights.

1150
00:58:49,360 --> 00:58:51,200
Speaker 4: It popped, It popped onto the House floor.

1151
00:58:51,480 --> 00:58:56,320
Speaker 3: If you remember when Republicans tried to or did push

1152
00:58:56,320 --> 00:59:03,200
Speaker 3: a resolution that said specifically like anti Zionism is anti Semitism,

1153
00:59:03,280 --> 00:59:07,760
Speaker 3: and Jerry Nadler, who represents the Orthodox Communities in New York,

1154
00:59:08,600 --> 00:59:11,200
Speaker 3: went to the House floor and said, this is absurd

1155
00:59:11,280 --> 00:59:14,640
Speaker 3: for many, many reasons, but one particular reason it's absurd

1156
00:59:15,320 --> 00:59:20,640
Speaker 3: is that I have anti Zionist constituents who believe that

1157
00:59:20,720 --> 00:59:25,680
Speaker 3: you cannot bring Israel, that humans cannot bring Israel onto

1158
00:59:25,760 --> 00:59:26,200
Speaker 3: the earth.

1159
00:59:26,560 --> 00:59:29,000
Speaker 4: Only the Messiah can bring Israel onto their right and

1160
00:59:29,040 --> 00:59:30,120
Speaker 4: that is their interpretation.

1161
00:59:30,320 --> 00:59:33,640
Speaker 3: How dare you call them anti Semitic for that anti

1162
00:59:33,720 --> 00:59:34,800
Speaker 3: Zionist interpretation?

1163
00:59:35,160 --> 00:59:38,360
Speaker 6: Right? I mean I just celemated Christmas.

1164
00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:41,120
Speaker 3: The birth of the Messiah, this one particular sect not

1165
00:59:41,120 --> 00:59:44,840
Speaker 3: exactly covering itself in glory in this moment.

1166
00:59:45,080 --> 00:59:47,080
Speaker 5: Covering itself in a lot of dirt, a lot of dirt,

1167
00:59:47,200 --> 00:59:49,320
Speaker 5: a lot of dirt. But no, I mean the questions

1168
00:59:49,320 --> 00:59:52,960
Speaker 5: of the Messiah are so central too, what not just

1169
00:59:53,360 --> 00:59:58,000
Speaker 5: Israeli culture and politics, but Western culture. Again, like we

1170
00:59:58,120 --> 01:00:00,600
Speaker 5: just celebrated Christmas in this country. For Christians, that's about

1171
01:00:00,640 --> 01:00:03,520
Speaker 5: the Messiah again, ancient questions that mean a lot to

1172
01:00:03,600 --> 01:00:06,760
Speaker 5: people that they're willing to actually lay down their lives

1173
01:00:07,040 --> 01:00:09,680
Speaker 5: in the Middle East right now is what we're seeing

1174
01:00:09,720 --> 01:00:12,640
Speaker 5: and dig tunnels in other cases if they're in crowd nights.

1175
01:00:15,200 --> 01:00:17,840
Speaker 4: Well, speaking of the return, the return of.

1176
01:00:17,760 --> 01:00:19,760
Speaker 6: The Messiah, Don Lemon is back.

1177
01:00:20,560 --> 01:00:23,880
Speaker 5: If you were wondering if Don Lemon would return here,

1178
01:00:23,920 --> 01:00:27,400
Speaker 5: he is not three days, more like three months, but

1179
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:27,959
Speaker 5: he's back.

1180
01:00:28,480 --> 01:00:31,840
Speaker 3: So Don Lemon is announcing his new program, which will

1181
01:00:31,880 --> 01:00:36,120
Speaker 3: be airing on Twitter and elsewhere, I guess, but I

1182
01:00:36,160 --> 01:00:38,800
Speaker 3: think primarily he's saying it will premiere on Twitter.

1183
01:00:38,840 --> 01:00:40,600
Speaker 4: We can put up this first element.

1184
01:00:40,680 --> 01:00:44,600
Speaker 3: This is Don Lemon of CNN, employee of seventeen years.

1185
01:00:44,600 --> 01:00:47,560
Speaker 3: He said, I've heard you, and today I am back

1186
01:00:47,680 --> 01:00:52,040
Speaker 3: bigger Boulder freer. That's what was missing was Don Lemon.

1187
01:00:52,120 --> 01:00:55,880
Speaker 3: We need him unleashed. My new media company's first project

1188
01:00:55,960 --> 01:00:58,480
Speaker 3: is The Don Lemon Show. It will be available to

1189
01:00:58,640 --> 01:01:02,320
Speaker 3: everyone easily, whenever and wherever you want it, streaming on

1190
01:01:02,360 --> 01:01:05,240
Speaker 3: the platforms where the conversations are happening, and you'll find

1191
01:01:05,240 --> 01:01:08,280
Speaker 3: it first on Twitter, which he calls X for some reason,

1192
01:01:08,560 --> 01:01:11,640
Speaker 3: the biggest space for free speech in the world. I

1193
01:01:11,720 --> 01:01:14,120
Speaker 3: know now more than ever that we need a place

1194
01:01:14,160 --> 01:01:17,680
Speaker 3: for honest debate and discussion without the hall monitors.

1195
01:01:18,000 --> 01:01:21,320
Speaker 4: This is just the beginning, So stay tuned, Stay tuned.

1196
01:01:21,560 --> 01:01:23,720
Speaker 5: Okay, I just want to say my favorite part of

1197
01:01:23,760 --> 01:01:26,280
Speaker 5: his statement is where he starts with quote, I've heard you,

1198
01:01:26,760 --> 01:01:29,400
Speaker 5: which is just a brilliant pr move from someone who

1199
01:01:30,720 --> 01:01:34,920
Speaker 5: stumbles through life trying to orchestrate his own pr presumably

1200
01:01:34,960 --> 01:01:37,400
Speaker 5: because actually, the greatest bit of color in any profile

1201
01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:39,960
Speaker 5: I think written in modern history is when it's like GQ,

1202
01:01:40,080 --> 01:01:42,640
Speaker 5: where Esquire sat down in profile Don Lemon went to

1203
01:01:42,680 --> 01:01:43,560
Speaker 5: a restaurant with him.

1204
01:01:44,520 --> 01:01:47,360
Speaker 6: Someone ordered sorbet. The writer ordered sorbet.

1205
01:01:47,280 --> 01:01:50,400
Speaker 5: And Don Lemon corrected him and said, let's pronounced sor bet.

1206
01:01:51,360 --> 01:01:54,040
Speaker 6: That's so good, really, and that made it into the profile.

1207
01:01:54,720 --> 01:01:58,440
Speaker 5: So Don Lemon saying, I've heard you implying you're just

1208
01:01:58,560 --> 01:02:02,320
Speaker 5: letting the reader know that people are clamor.

1209
01:02:01,880 --> 01:02:04,920
Speaker 3: Ring for Are you suggesting that the volume from the

1210
01:02:05,320 --> 01:02:08,480
Speaker 3: Groundswell was not audible to your ears?

1211
01:02:08,600 --> 01:02:10,920
Speaker 5: I hadn't heard it, Ryan, but maybe that's because I

1212
01:02:10,960 --> 01:02:12,480
Speaker 5: was tuned into the fact that by the time he

1213
01:02:12,560 --> 01:02:15,640
Speaker 5: left CNN, he had horrible ratings both in primetime and

1214
01:02:15,680 --> 01:02:17,520
Speaker 5: then on the morning show that they tried to move

1215
01:02:17,640 --> 01:02:17,920
Speaker 5: him to.

1216
01:02:18,520 --> 01:02:19,640
Speaker 6: They used the Nicky.

1217
01:02:19,400 --> 01:02:21,520
Speaker 5: Haley thing about her being past her prime, sort of

1218
01:02:21,520 --> 01:02:23,880
Speaker 5: as the fig leaf to finally get rid of Don Lemon,

1219
01:02:23,920 --> 01:02:24,720
Speaker 5: it seemed like, but.

1220
01:02:25,120 --> 01:02:26,520
Speaker 6: His ratings were bad.

1221
01:02:26,600 --> 01:02:28,840
Speaker 5: People were not clamoring for Don Lemon even when he

1222
01:02:28,920 --> 01:02:32,560
Speaker 5: was on CNN. And to his point, he would say,

1223
01:02:32,800 --> 01:02:35,160
Speaker 5: that's why, because I was on CNN and I was

1224
01:02:35,240 --> 01:02:39,520
Speaker 5: just caged in. Tucker Carlson responded, we have this next element,

1225
01:02:39,800 --> 01:02:42,120
Speaker 5: Tucker also, who used to work at CNN. I believe

1226
01:02:42,160 --> 01:02:47,160
Speaker 5: they overlapped Ryan. Tucker responds, congratulations, it's a new world. Welcome,

1227
01:02:47,240 --> 01:02:52,440
Speaker 5: and Don replies, thanks, Tucker. Now it is to Tucker's

1228
01:02:52,440 --> 01:02:54,600
Speaker 5: benefit to have more people do their shows on X

1229
01:02:54,640 --> 01:02:57,000
Speaker 5: because it encourages Elon must to sort of build up

1230
01:02:57,040 --> 01:03:00,600
Speaker 5: the infrastructure for X as a video platform, creates the

1231
01:03:00,640 --> 01:03:05,600
Speaker 5: expectation that X is a political video platform. And so

1232
01:03:05,760 --> 01:03:08,760
Speaker 5: I understand why he's ushering Don Lemon into this new era.

1233
01:03:09,120 --> 01:03:10,000
Speaker 6: But the idea that.

1234
01:03:09,960 --> 01:03:15,320
Speaker 5: Don Lemon was shackled by CNN is outrageous. And we

1235
01:03:15,400 --> 01:03:19,080
Speaker 5: have some video actually that's just delightful that proves that

1236
01:03:19,160 --> 01:03:23,120
Speaker 5: he was never really just it was just it was

1237
01:03:23,120 --> 01:03:25,680
Speaker 5: too hard for Donna. He was suffocated by Jeff Zucker

1238
01:03:26,080 --> 01:03:28,400
Speaker 5: and Chris lichto Rizi, here's Don Lemon on a.

1239
01:03:28,360 --> 01:03:29,560
Speaker 4: Leash black people.

1240
01:03:29,960 --> 01:03:33,360
Speaker 3: If you really want to fix the problem, here's just

1241
01:03:33,480 --> 01:03:35,680
Speaker 3: five things that you should think about doing.

1242
01:03:35,920 --> 01:03:36,720
Speaker 4: Is it fair to say this.

1243
01:03:36,640 --> 01:03:38,400
Speaker 1: Because I'm out of mommy, but is it mommy bringing?

1244
01:03:38,560 --> 01:03:41,400
Speaker 9: Just because you can have a baby, it doesn't mean

1245
01:03:41,440 --> 01:03:41,920
Speaker 9: you should.

1246
01:03:41,960 --> 01:03:43,680
Speaker 4: I'm not sexist, by the way, I don't mean to

1247
01:03:43,680 --> 01:03:46,320
Speaker 4: be crude. Okay, yeah, there are ways not to perform

1248
01:03:46,400 --> 01:03:47,200
Speaker 4: oral sex if.

1249
01:03:47,120 --> 01:03:50,760
Speaker 1: You oh got to do I reased to day. I

1250
01:03:50,800 --> 01:03:52,920
Speaker 1: gotta say everywhere I go, and you know what I'm

1251
01:03:52,920 --> 01:03:53,520
Speaker 1: going to ask.

1252
01:03:53,360 --> 01:03:55,760
Speaker 7: You, and people say, hey, that guy's on your show,

1253
01:03:55,960 --> 01:03:57,480
Speaker 7: is he really running for president?

1254
01:03:57,640 --> 01:04:00,480
Speaker 4: But just because you have the right, Does it mean

1255
01:04:00,480 --> 01:04:01,400
Speaker 4: that you should.

1256
01:04:01,160 --> 01:04:03,560
Speaker 5: There are What did he say about oral sex?

1257
01:04:03,720 --> 01:04:04,520
Speaker 6: It's just amazing?

1258
01:04:04,880 --> 01:04:08,800
Speaker 5: Why Christian, It was like, what, go watch that on

1259
01:04:08,960 --> 01:04:11,240
Speaker 5: the Free Beacons YouTube channel because the whole thing is

1260
01:04:11,280 --> 01:04:13,560
Speaker 5: absolutely hilarious. There's more to it, I actually believe it

1261
01:04:13,600 --> 01:04:16,080
Speaker 5: or not. That goes on for like another minute of

1262
01:04:16,280 --> 01:04:21,880
Speaker 5: Don Lemon saying outrageously funny things, and it's it's funny Ryan.

1263
01:04:21,920 --> 01:04:24,920
Speaker 5: Because Chris Cuomo then went to News Nation. He mounted

1264
01:04:24,920 --> 01:04:27,600
Speaker 5: a comeback after he also left Cianna in disgrace with

1265
01:04:27,680 --> 01:04:30,800
Speaker 5: bad news ratings and a serious ethical scandal that would

1266
01:04:30,840 --> 01:04:34,680
Speaker 5: basically end the career of any journalist in the crib.

1267
01:04:34,840 --> 01:04:36,720
Speaker 4: Are we calling what Chris Cuomo did a comeback?

1268
01:04:37,240 --> 01:04:39,200
Speaker 6: No? Probably not, But he actually tried.

1269
01:04:39,200 --> 01:04:41,360
Speaker 5: He's trying to mount a comeback, right and he has

1270
01:04:41,440 --> 01:04:45,440
Speaker 5: been on you know, different people's shows, and you know

1271
01:04:45,480 --> 01:04:48,240
Speaker 5: he's he's trying to be taken seriously. Don Lemon is

1272
01:04:48,280 --> 01:04:51,080
Speaker 5: now trying to do the very same thing. They are

1273
01:04:51,120 --> 01:04:55,280
Speaker 5: two of the people who I think created so much

1274
01:04:55,400 --> 01:04:57,240
Speaker 5: distrust in media unnecessarily.

1275
01:04:57,280 --> 01:04:58,840
Speaker 6: They are two of the biggest people who.

1276
01:04:58,640 --> 01:05:02,360
Speaker 5: Did that from not just during the Trump administration, before

1277
01:05:02,360 --> 01:05:05,520
Speaker 5: the Trump administration during COVID, the way Chris Cuomo and

1278
01:05:05,560 --> 01:05:09,200
Speaker 5: Don Lemon both treated Andrew Cuomo, it was, I mean

1279
01:05:09,480 --> 01:05:12,240
Speaker 5: these things seriously so distrusted media. There are a lot

1280
01:05:12,280 --> 01:05:14,480
Speaker 5: of good reporters, believe it or not, who are over

1281
01:05:14,480 --> 01:05:17,520
Speaker 5: there in Ukraine who are doing reporting from Israel right now,

1282
01:05:17,560 --> 01:05:19,880
Speaker 5: putting their lives on the line to get into Gaza,

1283
01:05:19,920 --> 01:05:24,320
Speaker 5: some of them on CNN. And these two jokers just

1284
01:05:24,600 --> 01:05:27,520
Speaker 5: laughed their way through the last decade, saying the dumbest

1285
01:05:27,520 --> 01:05:30,960
Speaker 5: stuff possible, just making everybody.

1286
01:05:30,520 --> 01:05:31,200
Speaker 6: Hate the media.

1287
01:05:31,520 --> 01:05:35,600
Speaker 3: I never quite understood the Don Lemon phenomenon. I would

1288
01:05:35,680 --> 01:05:39,320
Speaker 3: see the right get lived at him as some kind

1289
01:05:39,360 --> 01:05:42,440
Speaker 3: of symbol of the left, but I never quite undernew

1290
01:05:42,600 --> 01:05:45,760
Speaker 3: from that series of clips. He certainly doesn't come off

1291
01:05:45,760 --> 01:05:49,160
Speaker 3: as somebody who's remotely associated with the left, Like what

1292
01:05:49,320 --> 01:05:53,120
Speaker 3: is how would you where would you put Don Lemon

1293
01:05:53,200 --> 01:05:55,920
Speaker 3: in our kind of ecosystem of politics.

1294
01:05:56,120 --> 01:06:00,920
Speaker 5: I think he's actually a perfect embodiment of the left.

1295
01:06:00,960 --> 01:06:04,160
Speaker 5: Hear me out in that he's not a leftist, but

1296
01:06:04,280 --> 01:06:06,840
Speaker 5: he is culturally left on the issues that get you

1297
01:06:06,880 --> 01:06:10,840
Speaker 5: into the Manhattan cocktail party circuit. So he's willing to,

1298
01:06:11,080 --> 01:06:15,080
Speaker 5: for example, on his Air one time he had Rick Wilson.

1299
01:06:14,880 --> 01:06:16,560
Speaker 6: And I think it was like wajaht a Lee.

1300
01:06:17,480 --> 01:06:23,880
Speaker 5: Laughing at Rick Wilson's just reprehensible and not funny. I mean,

1301
01:06:23,920 --> 01:06:25,960
Speaker 5: I'm willing to laugh at these things, but just not funny.

1302
01:06:25,960 --> 01:06:29,240
Speaker 5: Impression of Trump supporters as like toothless rubes or something.

1303
01:06:29,280 --> 01:06:32,240
Speaker 5: I think he said like that, and they're just wheezing

1304
01:06:33,080 --> 01:06:36,120
Speaker 5: through their laughs on the air. And so he's willing

1305
01:06:36,160 --> 01:06:38,920
Speaker 5: to be kind of culturally a signal that he is

1306
01:06:39,080 --> 01:06:42,320
Speaker 5: on the right. He agrees with you on all the

1307
01:06:42,400 --> 01:06:45,760
Speaker 5: right things, but there's no way that he supports, you know,

1308
01:06:45,800 --> 01:06:48,360
Speaker 5: Medicare for all or like any of these serious leftist

1309
01:06:48,440 --> 01:06:52,560
Speaker 5: policy proposals. Economically, he doesn't want to forfeit the power

1310
01:06:52,800 --> 01:06:57,200
Speaker 5: of the neoliberal sort of establishment. He doesn't want to

1311
01:06:57,240 --> 01:06:59,560
Speaker 5: eat into any of that. The dude just wants to

1312
01:06:59,600 --> 01:07:02,560
Speaker 5: make a ton of money, hang out in Martha's vineyard

1313
01:07:02,920 --> 01:07:06,440
Speaker 5: and wear super expensive suits like that's all he wants.

1314
01:07:06,560 --> 01:07:08,840
Speaker 4: Oh Martha's Vineyard beautiful, so I hear.

1315
01:07:09,360 --> 01:07:11,400
Speaker 5: And he wants to be taken seriously as like an intellect,

1316
01:07:11,400 --> 01:07:13,080
Speaker 5: which is why he wears his classes.

1317
01:07:13,120 --> 01:07:17,120
Speaker 4: I've been TODs kit CODs beautiful. I assume Martha's Vineyard.

1318
01:07:17,920 --> 01:07:18,200
Speaker 6: Nice.

1319
01:07:19,000 --> 01:07:21,880
Speaker 5: But anyway, that's that's sort of like the left has

1320
01:07:21,920 --> 01:07:27,400
Speaker 5: allowed itself to be because of those cultural issues publicly

1321
01:07:28,000 --> 01:07:30,840
Speaker 5: in the perception of a lot of people in Middle America,

1322
01:07:31,080 --> 01:07:32,920
Speaker 5: co opted by people liked on Lemon.

1323
01:07:33,080 --> 01:07:37,000
Speaker 3: So it's clear why that there's a platform on something

1324
01:07:37,240 --> 01:07:39,160
Speaker 3: like CNN for that, or why there was for a

1325
01:07:39,160 --> 01:07:42,360
Speaker 3: long time. But is there an audience for it that

1326
01:07:42,400 --> 01:07:47,200
Speaker 3: you have to build independently? I mean, I assume out

1327
01:07:47,200 --> 01:07:49,720
Speaker 3: of the gate Musk will juice his numbers just to

1328
01:07:49,760 --> 01:07:52,120
Speaker 3: try to encourage new people to come in so they're

1329
01:07:52,160 --> 01:07:55,360
Speaker 3: like wow, and also he'll do some ridiculous things that

1330
01:07:55,400 --> 01:07:57,920
Speaker 3: will get like people gawking.

1331
01:07:58,040 --> 01:07:59,480
Speaker 5: Yeah, he's going to do more of what he did

1332
01:07:59,520 --> 01:08:02,600
Speaker 5: during Trayvon Martin. You're telling people to pull up their pants.

1333
01:08:02,840 --> 01:08:04,800
Speaker 5: He's going to do more of that because it's always

1334
01:08:04,800 --> 01:08:05,680
Speaker 5: been a performance.

1335
01:08:06,120 --> 01:08:08,160
Speaker 6: You know, he knows that this does he fully believe

1336
01:08:08,160 --> 01:08:08,640
Speaker 6: what he's saying.

1337
01:08:08,680 --> 01:08:10,520
Speaker 4: Sometimes does draw an organic audience.

1338
01:08:10,720 --> 01:08:12,800
Speaker 5: Well, the thing is, you can do really well in

1339
01:08:12,920 --> 01:08:16,720
Speaker 5: niches now and it doesn't do well on CNN. I

1340
01:08:16,720 --> 01:08:19,679
Speaker 5: don't know if there's a niche audience for Warmed Over

1341
01:08:20,000 --> 01:08:24,120
Speaker 5: centrist performative sanctimony on Twitter.

1342
01:08:24,200 --> 01:08:25,240
Speaker 6: I kind of doubt it.

1343
01:08:25,320 --> 01:08:26,719
Speaker 4: Not on Twitter now that's gone.

1344
01:08:26,800 --> 01:08:27,559
Speaker 6: But you can do.

1345
01:08:27,520 --> 01:08:30,599
Speaker 5: Better because you have way less overhead and there's fewer

1346
01:08:30,640 --> 01:08:33,840
Speaker 5: expectations for you to be the voice of America on

1347
01:08:33,920 --> 01:08:36,719
Speaker 5: primetime on a cable news network every day. So he'll

1348
01:08:36,720 --> 01:08:39,599
Speaker 5: probably be able to at least seem like he's doing fine,

1349
01:08:40,120 --> 01:08:41,080
Speaker 5: at least at first.

1350
01:08:41,160 --> 01:08:43,400
Speaker 6: But by the way, Crystal was all over this yesterday.

1351
01:08:43,479 --> 01:08:45,840
Speaker 5: She was like, I have called Don Lemon's right wing

1352
01:08:45,960 --> 01:08:50,320
Speaker 5: turn from the beginning. So we'll see, because he will

1353
01:08:50,320 --> 01:08:52,920
Speaker 5: know that on X the best way to get attention

1354
01:08:53,040 --> 01:08:54,800
Speaker 5: is going to be a performative contrarian.

1355
01:08:55,680 --> 01:08:58,680
Speaker 4: At two, don I know this hit Ryan hard. We've

1356
01:08:58,760 --> 01:08:59,240
Speaker 4: lost Don.

1357
01:08:59,400 --> 01:09:02,320
Speaker 6: Don has as goes down, So goes the nation.

1358
01:09:03,000 --> 01:09:03,280
Speaker 1: All right?

1359
01:09:03,360 --> 01:09:07,440
Speaker 3: Up next Kenny Clips to talk about his brief suspension

1360
01:09:07,479 --> 01:09:09,320
Speaker 3: from Twitter and what it was like to see his

1361
01:09:09,400 --> 01:09:10,639
Speaker 3: life flashed before his eyes.

1362
01:09:10,800 --> 01:09:14,840
Speaker 4: Sticks around for that, all.

1363
01:09:14,760 --> 01:09:17,640
Speaker 5: Right, We're happy to be joined now by Kenny Clips,

1364
01:09:17,680 --> 01:09:21,200
Speaker 5: also known as Ken the White, not Ken the Gray anymore.

1365
01:09:21,200 --> 01:09:23,640
Speaker 5: He has defeated the ball rog and is here in

1366
01:09:23,720 --> 01:09:27,719
Speaker 5: studio with us Ken Clippenstein of the intercept Amazing story.

1367
01:09:27,760 --> 01:09:30,280
Speaker 6: We hope that you're doing okay after the trauma.

1368
01:09:29,960 --> 01:09:32,920
Speaker 5: You suffered yesterday, but we have a lot to dig into.

1369
01:09:33,439 --> 01:09:36,439
Speaker 3: So we're going to talk with Ken after we wrap

1370
01:09:36,479 --> 01:09:37,920
Speaker 3: this show about a story that it's going to be

1371
01:09:37,920 --> 01:09:40,600
Speaker 3: published at the Intercept later today. I don't want to

1372
01:09:40,640 --> 01:09:42,439
Speaker 3: teach too much about that, but for now we want

1373
01:09:42,479 --> 01:09:45,280
Speaker 3: to talk about deeply traumatic experience that he went through.

1374
01:09:46,280 --> 01:09:50,880
Speaker 3: I'm kidding, it's somewhat serious as well, though. So yesterday

1375
01:09:51,000 --> 01:09:53,600
Speaker 3: morning or late late last night yesterday morning year, a

1376
01:09:53,680 --> 01:09:57,920
Speaker 3: ton of accounts on Twitter got suspended. We can put

1377
01:09:57,920 --> 01:10:00,519
Speaker 3: this first element up. Here's a handful of the yours.

1378
01:10:00,560 --> 01:10:03,840
Speaker 3: Yours was among them, Truanon pod Rob Russo with a

1379
01:10:04,160 --> 01:10:07,840
Speaker 3: podcast with jordanil Alan McCloud. All these are critics of Israel,

1380
01:10:08,320 --> 01:10:10,360
Speaker 3: but many, many more than just this Z squirrel.

1381
01:10:11,240 --> 01:10:12,759
Speaker 4: It was kind of polarizing account.

1382
01:10:13,160 --> 01:10:17,960
Speaker 3: It was anti anti imperialist account and even so we're

1383
01:10:18,040 --> 01:10:18,360
Speaker 3: running a.

1384
01:10:18,360 --> 01:10:19,240
Speaker 4: Piece at the intercepted.

1385
01:10:19,360 --> 01:10:22,080
Speaker 3: I think we'll be up today by somebody who was

1386
01:10:22,120 --> 01:10:26,280
Speaker 3: resigning from the DNC and protest of what's happening in Gaza,

1387
01:10:27,000 --> 01:10:29,120
Speaker 3: and he emailed me that morning he was like, I

1388
01:10:29,160 --> 01:10:32,320
Speaker 3: was caught up in this perch. So it went beyond

1389
01:10:32,479 --> 01:10:35,960
Speaker 3: even kind of you know, higher visibility accounts and spread

1390
01:10:35,960 --> 01:10:40,759
Speaker 3: out into into some others. But it was fairly quickly

1391
01:10:41,320 --> 01:10:44,360
Speaker 3: undone after a lot of kind of public outrage. And

1392
01:10:44,640 --> 01:10:46,599
Speaker 3: Musk himself well before we get the camera. We can

1393
01:10:46,640 --> 01:10:49,639
Speaker 3: put Musk up himself if we have this next element,

1394
01:10:50,280 --> 01:10:53,160
Speaker 3: he said, I will investigate. Obviously, it is okay to

1395
01:10:53,160 --> 01:10:55,080
Speaker 3: be critical of anything, but it is not okay to

1396
01:10:55,080 --> 01:10:58,960
Speaker 3: call for extreme violence, as that is illegal apart from

1397
01:10:59,040 --> 01:11:02,680
Speaker 3: the UN exemption where officials from countries recognized by the

1398
01:11:02,800 --> 01:11:05,400
Speaker 3: UN can say what they say at the UN. For

1399
01:11:05,479 --> 01:11:07,639
Speaker 3: the record, I do not personally agree with your views.

1400
01:11:07,680 --> 01:11:10,240
Speaker 3: I forget he's responding to here. Nonetheless, maybe it was

1401
01:11:10,320 --> 01:11:13,120
Speaker 3: Jackson ankle. The point of freedom of speech is allowing

1402
01:11:13,160 --> 01:11:16,640
Speaker 3: those whose views you disagree with to express those views. So,

1403
01:11:16,720 --> 01:11:20,040
Speaker 3: first of all, do you have any idea what might

1404
01:11:20,080 --> 01:11:23,200
Speaker 3: have triggered this, Like when you went back through your

1405
01:11:23,400 --> 01:11:25,439
Speaker 3: posts from the last couple of weeks, was there anything

1406
01:11:25,479 --> 01:11:27,280
Speaker 3: where you're like, oh, I crossed the line there.

1407
01:11:27,400 --> 01:11:30,679
Speaker 12: I was uncharacteristically quiet over the last couple of weeks.

1408
01:11:30,720 --> 01:11:32,000
Speaker 12: I must have been one of the only people that

1409
01:11:32,000 --> 01:11:35,920
Speaker 12: didn't comment on the unfolding scandal with the professors torching

1410
01:11:35,960 --> 01:11:36,759
Speaker 12: each other, which.

1411
01:11:36,600 --> 01:11:38,799
Speaker 4: That's what was missing was, which I'm wholly in supportive.

1412
01:11:38,920 --> 01:11:42,599
Speaker 12: Anything that burns down these institution lead academic institutions, I'm

1413
01:11:42,640 --> 01:11:44,320
Speaker 12: fine with. But I didn't actually say anything about it.

1414
01:11:44,400 --> 01:11:46,040
Speaker 12: It was actually one of the only times that I

1415
01:11:46,080 --> 01:11:48,360
Speaker 12: couldn't go back and find stuff that I might have

1416
01:11:48,400 --> 01:11:49,639
Speaker 12: said that would have pissed people off.

1417
01:11:50,720 --> 01:11:52,000
Speaker 1: So I was a little bit surprised by it.

1418
01:11:52,040 --> 01:11:53,479
Speaker 12: But the serious point, I mean, there's a funny side

1419
01:11:53,479 --> 01:11:55,519
Speaker 12: of this, but the serious side is how little disclosure

1420
01:11:55,520 --> 01:11:57,679
Speaker 12: there is. I found out about the band the same

1421
01:11:57,680 --> 01:11:59,920
Speaker 12: way you guys did and everyone else, which was rolling

1422
01:12:00,080 --> 01:12:03,800
Speaker 12: over in bed seeing my phone, you know, getting blown

1423
01:12:03,880 --> 01:12:06,360
Speaker 12: up with text messages and calls asking what happened to

1424
01:12:06,520 --> 01:12:07,479
Speaker 12: know what they were talking about.

1425
01:12:07,640 --> 01:12:11,160
Speaker 6: Everyone is like, we've noticed that Ken is suspended. Ken

1426
01:12:11,520 --> 01:12:12,360
Speaker 6: you must return.

1427
01:12:12,479 --> 01:12:14,320
Speaker 12: That's how I found out. And I never got an

1428
01:12:14,320 --> 01:12:17,000
Speaker 12: email from Twitter. You know, in the past, it's been

1429
01:12:17,080 --> 01:12:18,559
Speaker 12: you get suspended, they send you a message.

1430
01:12:18,600 --> 01:12:18,760
Speaker 1: You know.

1431
01:12:18,800 --> 01:12:23,400
Speaker 12: People maybe complain that the appeal system doesn't work expeditiously

1432
01:12:23,520 --> 01:12:26,000
Speaker 12: enough or the way they wish, but there was at

1433
01:12:26,040 --> 01:12:28,599
Speaker 12: least some kind of a mechanism. Tell you, here's what happened,

1434
01:12:28,600 --> 01:12:31,080
Speaker 12: here's why we determine this nothing, And I still haven't

1435
01:12:31,120 --> 01:12:33,920
Speaker 12: gotten anything. Even subsequent to the reinstatement, I got an

1436
01:12:33,960 --> 01:12:37,360
Speaker 12: email saying, you've been reinstated, no explanation about what happened.

1437
01:12:37,479 --> 01:12:38,800
Speaker 12: So how are they going to prevent this from happening

1438
01:12:38,800 --> 01:12:41,040
Speaker 12: again if they don't even understand there's been no disclosure

1439
01:12:41,040 --> 01:12:43,240
Speaker 12: around how what exactly went wrong?

1440
01:12:43,479 --> 01:12:45,600
Speaker 5: Well, and that's interesting because Elon Musk seems to be

1441
01:12:45,640 --> 01:12:50,280
Speaker 5: implying there that to his knowledge, there was some algorithmic

1442
01:12:50,439 --> 01:12:53,679
Speaker 5: sweep of people who may have called for violence. And

1443
01:12:53,840 --> 01:12:56,960
Speaker 5: sometimes the algorithm everybody knows this. If you're trying to

1444
01:12:57,000 --> 01:12:59,719
Speaker 5: target people who have called for violence, you can sweep

1445
01:12:59,840 --> 01:13:02,960
Speaker 5: up all kinds of different mentions of one word that

1446
01:13:03,000 --> 01:13:05,840
Speaker 5: the algorithm is looking for and using as a target word.

1447
01:13:06,880 --> 01:13:09,080
Speaker 12: But that's you know, I'm not a call for violence

1448
01:13:09,120 --> 01:13:10,600
Speaker 12: kind of. I don't think it would go well from me.

1449
01:13:11,960 --> 01:13:14,880
Speaker 12: Not a very tough guy physically, so I'm not gonna

1450
01:13:15,320 --> 01:13:16,759
Speaker 12: push push or anything in that direction.

1451
01:13:17,040 --> 01:13:17,760
Speaker 6: But that's what like.

1452
01:13:17,880 --> 01:13:20,800
Speaker 5: So I'm again, like Ryan, trying to piece together what

1453
01:13:20,840 --> 01:13:24,519
Speaker 5: it sounds like is Elon Musk is saying Twitter has

1454
01:13:24,640 --> 01:13:29,280
Speaker 5: some sort of algorithmic sweep that was supposed to violence.

1455
01:13:29,320 --> 01:13:31,479
Speaker 12: And one of the ironies of all of this is

1456
01:13:31,520 --> 01:13:34,719
Speaker 12: that Lee Fong and I at the Intercept reported violent

1457
01:13:34,760 --> 01:13:38,360
Speaker 12: man exactly reported on the mechanism by which the federal

1458
01:13:38,360 --> 01:13:42,240
Speaker 12: government is communicating with the social media platforms to in

1459
01:13:42,280 --> 01:13:47,360
Speaker 12: the past takedown uh uh, you know, communicate to them

1460
01:13:47,360 --> 01:13:48,360
Speaker 12: what they perceived to.

1461
01:13:48,320 --> 01:13:49,160
Speaker 1: Be threats about.

1462
01:13:49,200 --> 01:13:53,320
Speaker 12: Yeah, COVID right, the lor in Afghanistan seemed to be expanding,

1463
01:13:54,439 --> 01:13:57,679
Speaker 12: and you know, I think that led to the Twitter

1464
01:13:57,760 --> 01:14:01,719
Speaker 12: files that Elon has it as you know, of historic

1465
01:14:01,760 --> 01:14:05,559
Speaker 12: importance and something we need to focus on. And the

1466
01:14:05,640 --> 01:14:07,839
Speaker 12: question now is what's going on with respect to Israel

1467
01:14:08,200 --> 01:14:10,080
Speaker 12: with these platforms. So when I see him say something

1468
01:14:10,120 --> 01:14:12,080
Speaker 12: like that, it makes me wonder if he and I'm

1469
01:14:12,120 --> 01:14:14,600
Speaker 12: not talking about the Israel government. I'm talking about the

1470
01:14:14,680 --> 01:14:17,000
Speaker 12: US intelligence community, which has its own set of interests

1471
01:14:17,040 --> 01:14:20,160
Speaker 12: around disinformation concerning the war.

1472
01:14:20,280 --> 01:14:23,000
Speaker 5: A moss And was regularly meeting, we know, with the

1473
01:14:23,000 --> 01:14:25,639
Speaker 5: intelligence community at least in the lead up to twenty

1474
01:14:26,160 --> 01:14:28,400
Speaker 5: the twenty twenty election, and I think Elon has said

1475
01:14:28,439 --> 01:14:30,920
Speaker 5: that that's not happening now, but we I mean, it's

1476
01:14:30,960 --> 01:14:31,880
Speaker 5: it's just really hard to know.

1477
01:14:32,120 --> 01:14:32,800
Speaker 4: Doing it on his own.

1478
01:14:33,520 --> 01:14:37,400
Speaker 3: So I'm just curious mechanically, so you hear, hey, Ken,

1479
01:14:37,560 --> 01:14:38,439
Speaker 3: how'd you get suspended?

1480
01:14:38,479 --> 01:14:41,040
Speaker 4: So what happened? When you go open up Twitter?

1481
01:14:41,400 --> 01:14:44,200
Speaker 12: It just wouldn't. I couldn't post, I couldn't do anything.

1482
01:14:44,200 --> 01:14:46,200
Speaker 12: It still let me you could look at things.

1483
01:14:46,240 --> 01:14:47,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, I could look at things, but it said you

1484
01:14:47,840 --> 01:14:49,400
Speaker 1: have been permanently.

1485
01:14:48,800 --> 01:14:51,120
Speaker 12: Suspended at the bottom, and so I couldn't message anyone

1486
01:14:51,240 --> 01:14:54,680
Speaker 12: permanals anything. Yeah, and with again with nothing. I don't

1487
01:14:54,720 --> 01:14:56,160
Speaker 12: know how it would have appealed it because there was

1488
01:14:56,200 --> 01:14:58,080
Speaker 12: no decision sentered. There was no saying like, if you

1489
01:14:58,120 --> 01:15:02,520
Speaker 12: want to hear Ra's decision, go here. The potential context

1490
01:15:02,680 --> 01:15:03,280
Speaker 12: for this.

1491
01:15:04,640 --> 01:15:09,479
Speaker 3: Is not just the Bill Ackman kind of which I've

1492
01:15:08,479 --> 01:15:10,840
Speaker 3: never com.

1493
01:15:10,280 --> 01:15:11,519
Speaker 1: By the way, I must be one of the few

1494
01:15:11,520 --> 01:15:12,200
Speaker 1: people that didn't.

1495
01:15:12,439 --> 01:15:14,200
Speaker 4: So the EU, congratulations.

1496
01:15:14,640 --> 01:15:17,680
Speaker 3: The EU is not interested in the First Amendment, and

1497
01:15:17,960 --> 01:15:19,720
Speaker 3: you know the way we are because we have not

1498
01:15:19,760 --> 01:15:22,599
Speaker 3: made them like official states. They don't have a First Amendment.

1499
01:15:23,120 --> 01:15:27,040
Speaker 3: And so they have a policy where they're pushing Twitter.

1500
01:15:27,120 --> 01:15:31,879
Speaker 3: They're telling Twitter that they have insufficiently censored pro.

1501
01:15:31,880 --> 01:15:35,960
Speaker 4: Hamas accounts, and.

1502
01:15:38,360 --> 01:15:41,800
Speaker 3: You can you can imagine how somehow an algorithm would

1503
01:15:41,880 --> 01:15:47,360
Speaker 3: lump pro Hamas and anti Israel or anti IF or

1504
01:15:47,400 --> 01:15:50,080
Speaker 3: anti Gaza war into the same thing.

1505
01:15:50,160 --> 01:15:51,559
Speaker 1: That is the operative question in all this.

1506
01:15:51,640 --> 01:15:54,160
Speaker 12: And unfortunately, the people with the political tendency most likely

1507
01:15:54,200 --> 01:15:57,799
Speaker 12: to care about that kind of chilling effect on speech

1508
01:15:58,720 --> 01:16:00,880
Speaker 12: are are the ones that have such strong views on

1509
01:16:00,920 --> 01:16:02,720
Speaker 12: Israel that they're not saying anything about this right now.

1510
01:16:02,760 --> 01:16:04,680
Speaker 12: So we find ourselves in a really difficult situation where

1511
01:16:04,720 --> 01:16:07,320
Speaker 12: I think there's a real risk of what you're describing happening,

1512
01:16:07,320 --> 01:16:10,680
Speaker 12: but the political factions that might have raised issue with

1513
01:16:10,760 --> 01:16:13,280
Speaker 12: that are inclined to say, well, you know, let's go

1514
01:16:13,320 --> 01:16:13,920
Speaker 12: after Hamas.

1515
01:16:14,000 --> 01:16:15,839
Speaker 1: Let's go after these anti Israel factions.

1516
01:16:16,080 --> 01:16:16,280
Speaker 4: Right.

1517
01:16:16,560 --> 01:16:19,839
Speaker 3: And you've seen Glenn are former colleague, Glenn Greenwall tangling

1518
01:16:20,000 --> 01:16:23,240
Speaker 3: a ton with the right because you know, he was

1519
01:16:24,000 --> 01:16:27,840
Speaker 3: in lockstep alliance with them, totally in support of free

1520
01:16:27,880 --> 01:16:32,400
Speaker 3: speech and especially speech that you find abhorrent. Right, and

1521
01:16:32,439 --> 01:16:36,200
Speaker 3: he's been shocked to see the right just turn on

1522
01:16:36,320 --> 01:16:40,320
Speaker 3: Israel on this question of Israel. Well, we you know,

1523
01:16:41,040 --> 01:16:44,320
Speaker 3: we don't we know, we don't actually mean we'll defend

1524
01:16:44,360 --> 01:16:47,040
Speaker 3: the speech rights of people who are critical of this

1525
01:16:47,200 --> 01:16:48,000
Speaker 3: Israeli assault.

1526
01:16:48,160 --> 01:16:50,479
Speaker 5: The right doesn't really say this is someone on the right.

1527
01:16:50,479 --> 01:16:52,400
Speaker 5: The right doesn't really have a clear idea of what

1528
01:16:52,439 --> 01:16:55,880
Speaker 5: it means by free speech, just that it means it's

1529
01:16:55,880 --> 01:16:57,000
Speaker 5: against political correctness.

1530
01:16:57,000 --> 01:17:00,960
Speaker 4: Everyone sort of agrees, right, this is a gun.

1531
01:17:00,920 --> 01:17:03,759
Speaker 12: Under my skin about all this. You know, I got banned, boohoo,

1532
01:17:03,800 --> 01:17:04,160
Speaker 12: poor me?

1533
01:17:04,200 --> 01:17:04,679
Speaker 1: Who cares?

1534
01:17:04,920 --> 01:17:09,040
Speaker 12: The important part in all this is the discourse around

1535
01:17:09,360 --> 01:17:12,600
Speaker 12: like speech and what kind of process we're gonna have

1536
01:17:12,640 --> 01:17:14,160
Speaker 12: in place for this guy that comes to be free speech.

1537
01:17:14,320 --> 01:17:16,720
Speaker 12: And something I saw people say again and again is haha,

1538
01:17:17,000 --> 01:17:20,080
Speaker 12: can you know cheered on people getting banned before and

1539
01:17:20,120 --> 01:17:22,240
Speaker 12: now it happened to him. I have never once cheered

1540
01:17:22,280 --> 01:17:24,360
Speaker 12: anyone getting banned, because I don't believe you know, if

1541
01:17:24,400 --> 01:17:26,479
Speaker 12: you're making calls to violence, yes, that's one thing. But

1542
01:17:26,520 --> 01:17:29,160
Speaker 12: anything that's constitutionally protected to the extent that we can,

1543
01:17:29,280 --> 01:17:31,400
Speaker 12: we should try to support that. I've always said that.

1544
01:17:31,760 --> 01:17:35,040
Speaker 12: So this kind of lazy dichotomy of you know, left

1545
01:17:35,120 --> 01:17:37,600
Speaker 12: doesn't care about this, right cares. It's like it just

1546
01:17:37,640 --> 01:17:40,280
Speaker 12: doesn't capture not only me, but I suspect a lot

1547
01:17:40,320 --> 01:17:43,120
Speaker 12: of people don't fit into these categories, you know.

1548
01:17:43,080 --> 01:17:44,880
Speaker 5: No, And I think that's what Twitter does to our brains.

1549
01:17:44,880 --> 01:17:47,519
Speaker 5: It gamifies things like free speech so that you can

1550
01:17:47,600 --> 01:17:49,960
Speaker 5: get a bunch of retweets by trying to dunk on

1551
01:17:50,040 --> 01:17:52,600
Speaker 5: can or whatever. It's just an easy it's a shortcut

1552
01:17:53,040 --> 01:17:57,240
Speaker 5: to virality, which is obviously very cheap. Do you think

1553
01:17:57,240 --> 01:17:59,800
Speaker 5: it's possible that this was a gift from Elon Musk

1554
01:17:59,840 --> 01:18:01,439
Speaker 5: to you, Ken for your mental health?

1555
01:18:02,800 --> 01:18:03,200
Speaker 6: I do think it.

1556
01:18:03,240 --> 01:18:03,360
Speaker 11: Edit.

1557
01:18:03,520 --> 01:18:04,599
Speaker 1: I did pretty well on subsec.

1558
01:18:04,640 --> 01:18:06,960
Speaker 12: I got a lot of newsletter subscribers, so a shout

1559
01:18:06,960 --> 01:18:09,439
Speaker 12: out if you could do that, if you could do

1560
01:18:09,479 --> 01:18:12,280
Speaker 12: this again at some point it's temporary.

1561
01:18:12,360 --> 01:18:13,559
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, yeah, I think I was.

1562
01:18:13,520 --> 01:18:14,200
Speaker 6: Gonna say it is.

1563
01:18:14,240 --> 01:18:15,960
Speaker 5: Elon Musk talks all the time that one of the

1564
01:18:16,000 --> 01:18:20,120
Speaker 5: big reasons he bought Twitter was to clip to.

1565
01:18:20,080 --> 01:18:22,679
Speaker 6: Ben take on Kenny clip my foiler.

1566
01:18:23,040 --> 01:18:25,200
Speaker 1: Beth Bordon had a really funny comparison.

1567
01:18:25,280 --> 01:18:28,160
Speaker 12: She she likes to call it like, uh, what was

1568
01:18:28,200 --> 01:18:31,000
Speaker 12: it when when Obama was roasting Trump and you can

1569
01:18:31,040 --> 01:18:32,800
Speaker 12: see the gears turning in Trump's head like I'm going

1570
01:18:32,880 --> 01:18:34,960
Speaker 12: to destroy this guy. She's like, Yep, that was you

1571
01:18:34,960 --> 01:18:36,760
Speaker 12: in twenty twenty and that's why we're all stuck with

1572
01:18:37,080 --> 01:18:39,760
Speaker 12: Thanks Ken, I'll president date Elon well.

1573
01:18:39,800 --> 01:18:42,559
Speaker 5: He talks about how important X is as a free

1574
01:18:42,560 --> 01:18:45,680
Speaker 5: speech platform. Don Lemon talks about how important access is

1575
01:18:45,680 --> 01:18:48,120
Speaker 5: a free speech platform and ally certainly to you and

1576
01:18:48,160 --> 01:18:51,920
Speaker 5: others in this difficult time. But if that is true,

1577
01:18:51,960 --> 01:18:54,320
Speaker 5: if Elon must really believes that this is such an

1578
01:18:54,320 --> 01:18:57,599
Speaker 5: important platform because it shapes the discourse, it shapes news coverage,

1579
01:18:57,640 --> 01:18:59,439
Speaker 5: and I agree all of that stuff is absolutely true,

1580
01:18:59,439 --> 01:19:02,080
Speaker 5: it does shape his coverage, then it should be a

1581
01:19:02,120 --> 01:19:07,080
Speaker 5: paramount priority for him to protect journalists because, for example,

1582
01:19:07,160 --> 01:19:08,240
Speaker 5: we're just we're going to talk to you in a

1583
01:19:08,280 --> 01:19:10,160
Speaker 5: little bit about a big scoopy of coming out today,

1584
01:19:10,200 --> 01:19:14,360
Speaker 5: and presumably if excess such a big and important part

1585
01:19:14,360 --> 01:19:18,200
Speaker 5: of journalism and discourse, that's I mean serious to protect

1586
01:19:18,320 --> 01:19:19,320
Speaker 5: your ability to communicate.

1587
01:19:19,520 --> 01:19:22,000
Speaker 12: I would love for him to live up to the

1588
01:19:22,040 --> 01:19:24,479
Speaker 12: precepts that he espouses. You know, I'm obviously someone who

1589
01:19:24,520 --> 01:19:26,400
Speaker 12: has a history with him, and I'm not a fan

1590
01:19:26,439 --> 01:19:28,840
Speaker 12: of his, but when he claimed to care about free speech,

1591
01:19:28,880 --> 01:19:30,720
Speaker 12: I was obviously skeptical. But I would have been the

1592
01:19:31,080 --> 01:19:33,240
Speaker 12: you know, first person to say, you know, a great

1593
01:19:33,320 --> 01:19:35,600
Speaker 12: job if he followed through on that, because that's the

1594
01:19:35,840 --> 01:19:36,400
Speaker 12: important thing.

1595
01:19:36,800 --> 01:19:38,880
Speaker 1: Hey, yeah, right back, I'm doing it now, good job,

1596
01:19:39,200 --> 01:19:39,519
Speaker 1: thank you.

1597
01:19:39,760 --> 01:19:41,200
Speaker 3: Before we wrap this, I do you want to talk

1598
01:19:41,240 --> 01:19:45,439
Speaker 3: about the logical extension of this argument around calls for

1599
01:19:45,560 --> 01:19:49,599
Speaker 3: violence came up when it came to the Hamas account

1600
01:19:49,720 --> 01:19:52,160
Speaker 3: or a Hamas account, I think it was Kassam twenty

1601
01:19:52,200 --> 01:19:55,360
Speaker 3: twenty four. Yes, that's connected to the Hamas military wing.

1602
01:19:55,880 --> 01:19:59,800
Speaker 3: So Musk did ban this account, and he was that

1603
01:20:00,120 --> 01:20:04,360
Speaker 3: pressed on it by Jackson Hinkel on Twitter and asking

1604
01:20:04,400 --> 01:20:07,960
Speaker 3: why ban this but not other accounts that call for violence.

1605
01:20:08,280 --> 01:20:11,799
Speaker 3: Musk said this was a tough call while many government leaders,

1606
01:20:11,840 --> 01:20:14,639
Speaker 3: including the USA, do call for killing people.

1607
01:20:14,960 --> 01:20:16,559
Speaker 4: We have a UN exemption rule.

1608
01:20:16,720 --> 01:20:19,280
Speaker 3: If a government is recognized by the UN, we will

1609
01:20:19,320 --> 01:20:22,800
Speaker 3: not suspend their accounts. Hamas is not recognized as a

1610
01:20:22,800 --> 01:20:27,479
Speaker 3: government by the UN, so was suspended. Jackson then responded,

1611
01:20:27,520 --> 01:20:29,320
Speaker 3: I understand the rule, but I don't understand why it's

1612
01:20:29,360 --> 01:20:32,400
Speaker 3: only being applied to Palestinian accounts. Here are a few

1613
01:20:32,400 --> 01:20:34,599
Speaker 3: examples of pro Israeli accounts that have not been held

1614
01:20:34,600 --> 01:20:38,880
Speaker 3: accountable for violating the same rule. He quotes Laura Lumer

1615
01:20:38,960 --> 01:20:42,320
Speaker 3: saying expel all Jahadis from Congress and turned Gaza into

1616
01:20:42,320 --> 01:20:46,799
Speaker 3: a parking lot. He quotes somebody else saying flatten everything,

1617
01:20:47,000 --> 01:20:50,120
Speaker 3: spare no school, no children's hospital, no old age home,

1618
01:20:50,400 --> 01:20:52,719
Speaker 3: delete their entire gene pool off.

1619
01:20:52,520 --> 01:20:53,599
Speaker 4: The face of the earth.

1620
01:20:54,000 --> 01:20:58,040
Speaker 3: He quotes Bethany Mandel saying, not nuking these effing animals

1621
01:20:58,120 --> 01:21:00,559
Speaker 3: is the only restraint I expect, and that's own because

1622
01:21:00,680 --> 01:21:05,280
Speaker 3: the cloud would hurt Israelis Laura Lumer again, I support

1623
01:21:05,360 --> 01:21:07,960
Speaker 3: the complete destruction of gods that they have had more

1624
01:21:07,960 --> 01:21:13,120
Speaker 3: than enough time to evacuate. A one percent support this.

1625
01:21:13,320 --> 01:21:15,679
Speaker 3: Just so we are clear, and you can find others.

1626
01:21:16,360 --> 01:21:18,680
Speaker 3: So he responds to this and general suspensions should be

1627
01:21:18,720 --> 01:21:21,520
Speaker 3: even handed. We are also very reluctant to have permanent suspensions,

1628
01:21:21,520 --> 01:21:24,080
Speaker 3: so people should expect these series of temporary suspensions that

1629
01:21:24,160 --> 01:21:29,040
Speaker 3: become longer rather than instant permanent suspensions. All of this

1630
01:21:29,479 --> 01:21:34,960
Speaker 3: suggests that the banning of Kassam twenty twenty four, then

1631
01:21:35,160 --> 01:21:37,160
Speaker 3: all of these other accounts getting caught up in this,

1632
01:21:37,360 --> 01:21:41,200
Speaker 3: in this ban that was then overturned because of the

1633
01:21:41,240 --> 01:21:46,160
Speaker 3: public reaction. Followed by him saying people should expect temporary

1634
01:21:46,200 --> 01:21:51,479
Speaker 3: suspensions rather than instant permanent suspensions suggest something was deliberate here, totally,

1635
01:21:51,560 --> 01:21:54,640
Speaker 3: like because you're you described an instant permanent suspension and

1636
01:21:54,640 --> 01:21:56,240
Speaker 3: now he's saying, well, okay, maybe that's not the way

1637
01:21:56,280 --> 01:21:57,840
Speaker 3: to do it. Well, what do he claim is he

1638
01:21:58,120 --> 01:21:59,639
Speaker 3: is he going to have to now ban like Laura

1639
01:21:59,720 --> 01:22:00,799
Speaker 3: Lumer for a few hours?

1640
01:22:01,360 --> 01:22:03,639
Speaker 12: Well, fly is in the face of his claim that

1641
01:22:03,800 --> 01:22:05,960
Speaker 12: you know, oh this was just a spam thing and

1642
01:22:06,000 --> 01:22:08,080
Speaker 12: a few people got caught up it. Then why is

1643
01:22:08,280 --> 01:22:11,080
Speaker 12: every single account they could find people that had voice

1644
01:22:11,080 --> 01:22:13,639
Speaker 12: criticisms of Israel? Literally I couldn't find a single example

1645
01:22:13,680 --> 01:22:14,320
Speaker 12: that didn't fit that.

1646
01:22:15,120 --> 01:22:17,759
Speaker 6: Hmmm, that is interesting. I mean, it's not surprising.

1647
01:22:17,800 --> 01:22:20,719
Speaker 3: And it seems like he's suggesting that he might actually

1648
01:22:20,760 --> 01:22:23,200
Speaker 3: now have to do a tit for tat thing, so

1649
01:22:23,280 --> 01:22:26,519
Speaker 3: he looks balanced Bethy Mandel, watch out.

1650
01:22:26,760 --> 01:22:29,000
Speaker 5: It's a problem when you start to play this game

1651
01:22:29,200 --> 01:22:31,160
Speaker 5: and then so you can't play the game to begin with.

1652
01:22:31,280 --> 01:22:34,240
Speaker 5: It's why as people were really pression about this, and

1653
01:22:34,280 --> 01:22:36,559
Speaker 5: I was questioning it at the time a little bit.

1654
01:22:37,080 --> 01:22:39,439
Speaker 5: When Alex Jones was first banned, that was sort of

1655
01:22:39,520 --> 01:22:42,000
Speaker 5: the what toppled twitters House of cards like when they

1656
01:22:42,000 --> 01:22:43,720
Speaker 5: got rid of Alex Jones was like, Okay, here we

1657
01:22:43,760 --> 01:22:45,920
Speaker 5: go careening down the slippery slope.

1658
01:22:45,960 --> 01:22:47,320
Speaker 6: And it didn't seem like it at the.

1659
01:22:47,280 --> 01:22:51,120
Speaker 5: Time, but everything after that proved it really was that

1660
01:22:51,240 --> 01:22:53,280
Speaker 5: if you're going to play the game at all, it's

1661
01:22:53,280 --> 01:22:56,479
Speaker 5: not going to work well ideological for ideologically for one size,

1662
01:22:56,560 --> 01:22:57,320
Speaker 5: unless it's free space.

1663
01:22:57,439 --> 01:23:01,240
Speaker 3: Unless you carve out a like convicted of found liable

1664
01:23:01,240 --> 01:23:05,519
Speaker 3: for defamation on the platform, which they could have said

1665
01:23:05,520 --> 01:23:07,479
Speaker 3: that with Alex Jones and then and then then at

1666
01:23:07,560 --> 01:23:09,559
Speaker 3: least you have a standard that you then universally apply,

1667
01:23:10,040 --> 01:23:12,960
Speaker 3: like if Ken is like found to have to feigned somebody.

1668
01:23:13,840 --> 01:23:15,720
Speaker 12: And in fact, there is what Elon pledged to do

1669
01:23:15,760 --> 01:23:17,679
Speaker 12: when he first he said he wants to bring things

1670
01:23:17,680 --> 01:23:23,080
Speaker 12: into accordance with the host nation laws around speech right.

1671
01:23:23,760 --> 01:23:25,040
Speaker 6: Make your Kenny clipped joke?

1672
01:23:25,320 --> 01:23:27,120
Speaker 4: What was it should have been? Kenny clipped?

1673
01:23:27,520 --> 01:23:30,519
Speaker 3: Yes, are little we have Kenny clips on there, but

1674
01:23:30,600 --> 01:23:32,640
Speaker 3: I guess.

1675
01:23:31,800 --> 01:23:34,560
Speaker 12: The elips he was using a safety scissors very it

1676
01:23:34,640 --> 01:23:38,680
Speaker 12: wasn't very sharp any clip anyway, Ken, thanks for joining us.

1677
01:23:39,120 --> 01:23:41,559
Speaker 3: Later today, I think we'll have up this next segment

1678
01:23:41,600 --> 01:23:44,840
Speaker 3: that we're going to pause now record, but I guess

1679
01:23:44,880 --> 01:23:47,360
Speaker 3: that's going to do it for us for this show.

1680
01:23:48,160 --> 01:23:50,800
Speaker 4: So thanks everybody for joining us. Do we have any plugs?

1681
01:23:51,160 --> 01:23:52,639
Speaker 4: We go to bring points.

1682
01:23:52,400 --> 01:23:54,360
Speaker 6: Dot com Breakingpoints dot com, get your.

1683
01:23:54,240 --> 01:23:57,600
Speaker 4: Get your premium subscription, No ads.

1684
01:23:57,560 --> 01:23:59,959
Speaker 5: No ads, and you can watch the video of counterpoints

1685
01:24:00,040 --> 01:24:01,599
Speaker 5: all the way through, so you don't have to worry

1686
01:24:01,600 --> 01:24:03,360
Speaker 5: about what clips get put up. You can you can

1687
01:24:03,400 --> 01:24:05,280
Speaker 5: watch the full thing with no ads, and it goes

1688
01:24:05,280 --> 01:24:06,519
Speaker 5: straight to your inbox every morning.

1689
01:24:06,880 --> 01:24:09,040
Speaker 6: Thank us. Thank you so much everyone for watching, for

1690
01:24:09,080 --> 01:24:11,280
Speaker 6: supporting the show. We appreciate it, and we'll be back

1691
01:24:11,320 --> 01:24:12,920
Speaker 6: here next Wednesday, all right, see you then,