1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:03,280 Speaker 1: I gotta say though, just to start to me when 2 00:00:03,320 --> 00:00:05,760 Speaker 1: you say the negatives and the positives of pregnancy, and 3 00:00:05,760 --> 00:00:07,240 Speaker 1: I'm just like, there's no negative for me. 4 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:08,320 Speaker 2: Yeah. 5 00:00:08,400 --> 00:00:13,480 Speaker 3: I think also our perspective of nanaks, yeah, you know, 6 00:00:13,520 --> 00:00:16,120 Speaker 3: related to pregnancy is negative, is definitely. 7 00:00:17,920 --> 00:00:18,080 Speaker 4: Right. 8 00:00:18,440 --> 00:00:21,040 Speaker 3: But if we talk about our feelings that are negative 9 00:00:21,160 --> 00:00:24,720 Speaker 3: and not so nice and colorful, no kidding, you know, 10 00:00:24,760 --> 00:00:29,880 Speaker 3: And so that doesn't allow us to completely exercise our 11 00:00:29,960 --> 00:00:34,560 Speaker 3: experience of becoming of transitioning. And obviously we're in a pandemic, 12 00:00:34,640 --> 00:00:37,720 Speaker 3: so that comes with its own, its own set of feelings. 13 00:00:37,760 --> 00:00:40,960 Speaker 3: I think for me, with my child, I didn't have 14 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:43,760 Speaker 3: you know him during a pandemic, but I felt like 15 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:45,800 Speaker 3: I was living in my own pandemic because I didn't 16 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:48,520 Speaker 3: like being pregnant at all. I was like, this is 17 00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:57,040 Speaker 3: really yes, I was. 18 00:00:53,800 --> 00:00:56,560 Speaker 1: Because the first three months you were sick a lot or. 19 00:00:56,560 --> 00:01:01,760 Speaker 2: What three months and the whole time, no, I was 20 00:01:01,880 --> 00:01:02,760 Speaker 2: not interested. 21 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:06,760 Speaker 3: Here's the thing, like, you can want to have a child, 22 00:01:06,880 --> 00:01:09,120 Speaker 3: and you can want this baby, and you can want 23 00:01:09,160 --> 00:01:12,880 Speaker 3: to be pregnant, but the experience might not necessarily reflect that, 24 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:17,480 Speaker 3: and people aren't interested in knowing those feelings. 25 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:23,680 Speaker 1: From futuro media it's Latino Usa. I'm Maria no Josa, 26 00:01:23,880 --> 00:01:33,399 Speaker 1: and today we're gonna get real about pregnancy. Today, dear listener, 27 00:01:33,560 --> 00:01:37,560 Speaker 1: We're gonna break down the pregnancy journey from the positive 28 00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:41,399 Speaker 1: to the negative, depending on how you view it. While 29 00:01:41,520 --> 00:01:44,520 Speaker 1: some of us tend to view everything surrounding pregnancy with 30 00:01:44,600 --> 00:01:47,640 Speaker 1: a glow of sunshine, there are very real issues that 31 00:01:47,680 --> 00:01:51,120 Speaker 1: can be cloaked in darkness. Within the Latino community. The 32 00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:55,280 Speaker 1: challenges people go through before, during, or after pregnancy are 33 00:01:55,320 --> 00:02:01,040 Speaker 1: often taboo. Miscarriages barely TH's, fertility struggle, and pre or 34 00:02:01,120 --> 00:02:04,800 Speaker 1: postpartum depression are rarely discussed when they're in fact very 35 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:09,720 Speaker 1: difficult to navigate. This leaves those dealing with these issues 36 00:02:09,760 --> 00:02:13,959 Speaker 1: in isolation, forced to keep secrets and left to figure 37 00:02:14,000 --> 00:02:16,680 Speaker 1: these challenges out on their own. So how do we 38 00:02:16,760 --> 00:02:19,440 Speaker 1: as a community better support women on the path to 39 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:24,519 Speaker 1: pregnancy and afterwards. The first step is having an open conversation, 40 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:29,200 Speaker 1: so no subject is off limits. In this roundtable with 41 00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:34,960 Speaker 1: producer Genie Montabo, certified birth doulah Elizabeth Bettis, and myself, 42 00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:38,880 Speaker 1: we're gonna jump right in to our pregnancy real talk. 43 00:02:39,720 --> 00:02:42,640 Speaker 5: Thanks for joining us, Elizabeth, Thank you for having me 44 00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:47,160 Speaker 5: so we're gonna talk about all things pregnancy today. 45 00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:52,840 Speaker 1: I loved being pregnant. I loved it. Maybe the last 46 00:02:52,880 --> 00:02:56,000 Speaker 1: two weeks were like yeah, But other than that, I 47 00:02:56,040 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 1: would give anything to be like five months pregnant, like forever. 48 00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:06,399 Speaker 2: Right, I'm good, I'm good. 49 00:03:06,960 --> 00:03:08,960 Speaker 5: No, I mean I have to know, like legit, I 50 00:03:09,000 --> 00:03:12,919 Speaker 5: actually really enjoyed being pregnant with my first and I mean, 51 00:03:13,160 --> 00:03:17,440 Speaker 5: you know, the second is fine, but other factors, But no, 52 00:03:17,560 --> 00:03:19,959 Speaker 5: I really did enjoy it. But I definitely don't. I mean, 53 00:03:20,440 --> 00:03:21,880 Speaker 5: first of all, we live in New York City, so 54 00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:24,520 Speaker 5: like more than two is a little bit insane, but like, 55 00:03:24,600 --> 00:03:25,960 Speaker 5: I don't think i'd do this again. 56 00:03:26,080 --> 00:03:30,880 Speaker 1: Like yeah, well, but also you're but you're pregnant. You're 57 00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 1: pregnant in the middle of a pandemic, and you've got 58 00:03:33,400 --> 00:03:37,160 Speaker 1: high hormones and you're inside the house, you know, so 59 00:03:37,360 --> 00:03:40,680 Speaker 1: oh my god, that's like a recipe forgetting my way. 60 00:03:40,920 --> 00:03:43,200 Speaker 5: Well, yeah, those would be one of the factors I 61 00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:45,800 Speaker 5: was talking about that are definitely making this pregnancy a 62 00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:48,880 Speaker 5: much different experience. But we're going to talk about that later. 63 00:03:49,120 --> 00:03:51,520 Speaker 5: I want to get started by first asking about what 64 00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:54,000 Speaker 5: you do, Elizabeth, Like, what is a doula? 65 00:03:54,800 --> 00:03:56,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 66 00:03:57,400 --> 00:04:01,240 Speaker 3: So Adula is a person that we work with families 67 00:04:01,280 --> 00:04:04,680 Speaker 3: that are expecting that are having a baby, and they're 68 00:04:04,720 --> 00:04:08,560 Speaker 3: there to guide the family, the pregnant couple, the pregnant 69 00:04:08,600 --> 00:04:11,960 Speaker 3: person through that experience. Right now, the caveat here is 70 00:04:12,000 --> 00:04:14,160 Speaker 3: that I'm not a medical professional, right, so I'm not 71 00:04:14,320 --> 00:04:17,279 Speaker 3: diagnosing you. What I can tell you is, oh, this 72 00:04:17,360 --> 00:04:20,640 Speaker 3: sounds like this, you might want to check this provider out. 73 00:04:21,080 --> 00:04:22,600 Speaker 2: And so we're a sounding board. Right. 74 00:04:22,640 --> 00:04:24,560 Speaker 3: The way that I like to think of myself and 75 00:04:24,600 --> 00:04:27,920 Speaker 3: other birth workers in general, is that we are the 76 00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:30,720 Speaker 3: water that's filling the cracks in the cement right when 77 00:04:30,760 --> 00:04:34,360 Speaker 3: it comes to your care. So your doctor, your midwife 78 00:04:34,440 --> 00:04:37,599 Speaker 3: might be fantastic, but they're not necessarily readily available, and 79 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:39,920 Speaker 3: they're not necessarily going to give you the attention you 80 00:04:40,040 --> 00:04:42,719 Speaker 3: might need in that moment at three in the morning 81 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:45,800 Speaker 3: or two in the afternoon where you're just like wondering 82 00:04:45,839 --> 00:04:49,520 Speaker 3: what's going on. I really love that work because it's 83 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:51,800 Speaker 3: like in the quiet and the intimate of the night 84 00:04:51,880 --> 00:04:52,520 Speaker 3: that you're kind of. 85 00:04:52,480 --> 00:04:54,080 Speaker 2: Like, what am I doing? Right? 86 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:56,240 Speaker 3: And you can't say that out loud, but you can't 87 00:04:56,279 --> 00:04:58,120 Speaker 3: say it to your doula and I'll tell you this. 88 00:04:58,160 --> 00:04:59,799 Speaker 2: Dula's love to doulah. 89 00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:03,080 Speaker 3: When someone says I am adulla, they're committed to doing 90 00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:06,120 Speaker 3: everything they can for you, even before themselves. 91 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:10,159 Speaker 1: My firstborn was a scheduled cesarean, so we really didn't 92 00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:13,560 Speaker 1: even contemplate a doula. But then I became friends with 93 00:05:13,560 --> 00:05:16,360 Speaker 1: somebody who also worked as a doula, and then when 94 00:05:16,440 --> 00:05:19,560 Speaker 1: it came time to go to the hospital, she was 95 00:05:19,600 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 1: there to advocate for me. I just loved having somebody 96 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:28,040 Speaker 1: who was a woman who I could turn to. Yeah, 97 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:30,200 Speaker 1: I want to tell you what happened with the birth 98 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:34,200 Speaker 1: of Judema. So basically, right after I had the cesarean, 99 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:37,080 Speaker 1: they had to knock me out, and so by the 100 00:05:37,120 --> 00:05:40,040 Speaker 1: time I came to it was a couple of hours later. 101 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:43,240 Speaker 1: I hadn't seen my little baby girl. I'm taken up 102 00:05:43,279 --> 00:05:48,039 Speaker 1: to my room and they brought Juju, who was teeny tiny, 103 00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:51,160 Speaker 1: and they began to say, oh, she looks a little 104 00:05:51,240 --> 00:05:55,320 Speaker 1: jaundice typical and if you know anything and you're prepared, 105 00:05:55,360 --> 00:05:56,880 Speaker 1: you actually know the best thing you can do for 106 00:05:56,880 --> 00:06:01,960 Speaker 1: a jaundice baby is to feed them them. So the 107 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:04,320 Speaker 1: first time the nurse said, we've got to take it. 108 00:06:04,400 --> 00:06:08,200 Speaker 1: The second time. By then my husband said, no, you're 109 00:06:08,240 --> 00:06:12,240 Speaker 1: not taking my baby again. You are not taking her 110 00:06:12,279 --> 00:06:15,520 Speaker 1: and sticking anything in her ankle or in the bottom 111 00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:17,880 Speaker 1: of her foot. Her heel is where they were sticking her. 112 00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:21,760 Speaker 1: My wife is the mother, You are not her pediatrician. 113 00:06:22,120 --> 00:06:28,119 Speaker 1: The baby stays with her mother, and you know, because 114 00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:30,520 Speaker 1: you don't want to mess with headman, you know. But 115 00:06:30,720 --> 00:06:34,760 Speaker 1: I just remember feeling like, think, thankfully he did that. 116 00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:37,039 Speaker 1: And so that is when you know the question why 117 00:06:37,040 --> 00:06:41,680 Speaker 1: do we need advocates. It's because there is a kind 118 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:45,400 Speaker 1: of system that doesn't really listen to the moms, don't 119 00:06:45,440 --> 00:06:48,000 Speaker 1: really listen to the women who are going through the process, 120 00:06:48,360 --> 00:06:51,600 Speaker 1: and so we have to be the ones to change 121 00:06:51,640 --> 00:06:53,600 Speaker 1: that dialogue in that area. 122 00:06:53,839 --> 00:06:56,040 Speaker 5: And when you hear the horror stories of the things 123 00:06:56,040 --> 00:06:58,880 Speaker 5: that have happened throughout history, and I'm like, if somebody 124 00:06:58,880 --> 00:07:00,960 Speaker 5: gave me a document to sign in the middle of labor, 125 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:02,720 Speaker 5: I'd be like, get it back my face, Like, but 126 00:07:02,880 --> 00:07:04,080 Speaker 5: I don't understand how those things. 127 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:06,520 Speaker 2: This is. Yeah, this is bringing up a lot. So 128 00:07:06,600 --> 00:07:07,960 Speaker 2: a couple of things. Marietta. 129 00:07:08,000 --> 00:07:11,440 Speaker 3: You mentioned you had a cesarean and then you had 130 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:14,400 Speaker 3: or under general anesthesia. So yes, you were knocked out, 131 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:17,640 Speaker 3: you were not awake, and then you hadn't been with 132 00:07:17,720 --> 00:07:21,760 Speaker 3: your baby, so that and of itself interrupted the physiological 133 00:07:21,800 --> 00:07:24,920 Speaker 3: process that is necessary to form a. 134 00:07:24,840 --> 00:07:26,200 Speaker 2: Bond between mother and baby. 135 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:29,560 Speaker 3: So in that moment, and also with Edman, right, he 136 00:07:29,640 --> 00:07:31,680 Speaker 3: might have not had the baby in his body, but 137 00:07:31,760 --> 00:07:34,000 Speaker 3: he was having some hormonal stuff going on. He was like, 138 00:07:34,040 --> 00:07:36,720 Speaker 3: hold dug, like, this is my woman, this is my baby, 139 00:07:37,280 --> 00:07:40,680 Speaker 3: like back you know, yeah, So I call it, you know, 140 00:07:40,960 --> 00:07:43,760 Speaker 3: super gendered in this sense in that moment, and mine 141 00:07:43,840 --> 00:07:46,440 Speaker 3: knew that right, the baby needed to be with you. 142 00:07:46,760 --> 00:07:49,280 Speaker 3: As you said, the most important thing is to feed. 143 00:07:49,520 --> 00:07:51,000 Speaker 3: And how do you get a baby to feed? You 144 00:07:51,080 --> 00:07:52,880 Speaker 3: keep the baby with their parents. You keep the baby 145 00:07:52,880 --> 00:07:55,680 Speaker 3: with the mom. So instead like if taking the baby 146 00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:58,760 Speaker 3: from you to go test their blood, we can keep 147 00:07:58,760 --> 00:08:00,440 Speaker 3: that baby on your chest and do the You'll still 148 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:02,480 Speaker 3: there and that would be much more comforting for you 149 00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:05,080 Speaker 3: to see what's going on, for the baby to have 150 00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:06,160 Speaker 3: the comfort of you. 151 00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 2: Right. 152 00:08:06,600 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 3: I don't think that anyone should ever walk into a 153 00:08:08,800 --> 00:08:11,720 Speaker 3: hospital room alone. Right, So either you go in with 154 00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:13,800 Speaker 3: a doula or you going with your partner. You're going 155 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:17,720 Speaker 3: with your sister and their role is to keep watch. Right, 156 00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:19,720 Speaker 3: It's not that we're going to assume that the doctor 157 00:08:19,800 --> 00:08:21,960 Speaker 3: or the nurse is doing something against us, but. 158 00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:24,000 Speaker 2: They're there to keep watch because you are busy. 159 00:08:24,120 --> 00:08:26,560 Speaker 3: You're busy giving birth, Like there's no way that you 160 00:08:26,600 --> 00:08:28,400 Speaker 3: can pay attention to all these things happening. 161 00:08:28,960 --> 00:08:29,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree. 162 00:08:29,880 --> 00:08:32,000 Speaker 5: I mean having somebody to advocate you for you is 163 00:08:32,120 --> 00:08:35,600 Speaker 5: super important, but it can be hard because culturally we 164 00:08:35,720 --> 00:08:38,200 Speaker 5: tend to trust doctors like they know best. 165 00:08:38,559 --> 00:08:40,199 Speaker 3: That's another thing in our culture that we have. But 166 00:08:40,320 --> 00:08:42,800 Speaker 3: as like, listen to the doctor, but the doctor doesn't 167 00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:44,680 Speaker 3: know you. The doctor dosn't even probably doesn't even know 168 00:08:44,720 --> 00:08:46,760 Speaker 3: your name. They have to read the file first to 169 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:49,320 Speaker 3: go to you, you know, And so a lot of 170 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:52,559 Speaker 3: these things they're really indoctrinated in us, and we have 171 00:08:52,679 --> 00:08:56,400 Speaker 3: a huge fear of telling someone, no, of telling someone. 172 00:08:56,440 --> 00:08:58,120 Speaker 3: Can you take a little bit more time and explain 173 00:08:58,160 --> 00:08:59,720 Speaker 3: that to me in a way that I understand? 174 00:09:00,320 --> 00:09:02,800 Speaker 2: Do I have other options? Can we wait? 175 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:06,079 Speaker 3: And so a lot of times, like becoming pregnant the 176 00:09:06,120 --> 00:09:09,800 Speaker 3: first time, where people realize that either a that they 177 00:09:09,880 --> 00:09:13,160 Speaker 3: can say any of those things, or b that they 178 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:15,640 Speaker 3: can just simply walk away and find another provider and 179 00:09:15,679 --> 00:09:17,120 Speaker 3: that's crazy for a lot of people. 180 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:18,680 Speaker 2: What I say to is like, we. 181 00:09:18,600 --> 00:09:21,960 Speaker 3: Spend ample time like searching something on Amazon, reading all 182 00:09:22,000 --> 00:09:24,160 Speaker 3: the reviews before we buy it, but we don't do 183 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:26,120 Speaker 3: that with our doctors or pediatricians. 184 00:09:26,600 --> 00:09:27,800 Speaker 2: It gets a little crazy. 185 00:09:28,320 --> 00:09:30,240 Speaker 5: It's a lot, I mean, and it's important to know 186 00:09:30,320 --> 00:09:32,839 Speaker 5: that you can actually question your doctors and you can 187 00:09:33,040 --> 00:09:34,520 Speaker 5: actually ask for things. 188 00:09:34,800 --> 00:09:36,199 Speaker 3: And it doesn't mean that you're going to kind of 189 00:09:36,200 --> 00:09:38,240 Speaker 3: a fly with them, right, you know. It just means 190 00:09:38,240 --> 00:09:40,439 Speaker 3: that you want more information to make a decision that's 191 00:09:40,480 --> 00:09:42,120 Speaker 3: going to affect you exactly. 192 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:46,840 Speaker 1: Mothering is nobody knows how to do it. Nobody knows 193 00:09:46,840 --> 00:09:48,920 Speaker 1: how to do it, but we've been doing it for 194 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:52,200 Speaker 1: millions of years, so we're we're gonna get it right. 195 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:55,720 Speaker 1: And in some ways this trusting to be able to 196 00:09:55,760 --> 00:09:57,880 Speaker 1: say to a nurse or to a doctor, no, no, no, no, no, 197 00:09:58,280 --> 00:10:01,000 Speaker 1: I need my baby, not your babyaby. It's my baby. 198 00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:04,000 Speaker 1: I'll listen to you. You can explain it, but it's 199 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:08,760 Speaker 1: our bodies, it's our baby, it's our experience. And I 200 00:10:08,800 --> 00:10:11,880 Speaker 1: do think that there's a powerful thing that happens when you, 201 00:10:12,480 --> 00:10:16,160 Speaker 1: as a mother or with your partner, know how to 202 00:10:16,720 --> 00:10:22,040 Speaker 1: question your medical professional. It doesn't have to be yelling 203 00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:26,120 Speaker 1: and angry now, of course, but bottom line, it is 204 00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:29,280 Speaker 1: your body and it is your child. 205 00:10:29,720 --> 00:10:32,520 Speaker 5: On that note, I actually because of the pandemic when 206 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:35,559 Speaker 5: I realized I was pregnant this time around. I liked 207 00:10:35,600 --> 00:10:38,199 Speaker 5: my obe from the last time, but I am man Queen's, 208 00:10:38,400 --> 00:10:39,880 Speaker 5: so I didn't want to go to the city, so 209 00:10:40,000 --> 00:10:42,720 Speaker 5: I went to an obede near my house. And because 210 00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:45,679 Speaker 5: I had a miscarriage last year and my first pregnancy, 211 00:10:45,760 --> 00:10:48,480 Speaker 5: I had low progesterone, and the second time around I 212 00:10:48,520 --> 00:10:51,720 Speaker 5: had low progesterone, and this time around I was like 213 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:55,719 Speaker 5: watching it. And finally when I got the numbers, they 214 00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:58,040 Speaker 5: were like, oh, you know, you don't need to go 215 00:10:58,080 --> 00:11:01,120 Speaker 5: on progesterone. It's not a big deal. Your numbers are fine. 216 00:11:01,559 --> 00:11:03,960 Speaker 5: I asked for them specifically, and they were the same 217 00:11:04,040 --> 00:11:08,160 Speaker 5: numbers as my first pregnancy. And like her, knowing that 218 00:11:08,240 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 5: I had had two pregnancies where I was on progesterone 219 00:11:11,120 --> 00:11:14,480 Speaker 5: and one that resulted in miscarriage, like why wouldn't you. 220 00:11:14,480 --> 00:11:14,960 Speaker 2: Listen to me? 221 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:16,559 Speaker 5: And she's like, you know, he'll send in a script 222 00:11:16,559 --> 00:11:17,880 Speaker 5: for you if you want it, But like I had 223 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:19,800 Speaker 5: to fight for it, and I didn't like that, right, 224 00:11:19,920 --> 00:11:22,640 Speaker 5: and I was like, nah, like, I'm not even right. 225 00:11:22,679 --> 00:11:26,240 Speaker 1: But that means that they're that you can actually eat 226 00:11:26,440 --> 00:11:30,680 Speaker 1: medical doctors. You don't have to just take the only one. 227 00:11:30,920 --> 00:11:33,360 Speaker 1: And that's a that's another part of the power experience 228 00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:35,800 Speaker 1: where you're just like, you know what, no, I'm not 229 00:11:35,800 --> 00:11:38,400 Speaker 1: feeling this person, right, I gotta be with this person. 230 00:11:38,480 --> 00:11:40,199 Speaker 1: And that is part of what I'm trying to say, 231 00:11:40,200 --> 00:11:43,680 Speaker 1: which is the beauty of the intuitive work that motherhood 232 00:11:43,679 --> 00:11:45,480 Speaker 1: does involve, and that womanhood involves. 233 00:11:45,880 --> 00:11:48,640 Speaker 3: Well, that's the thing, Like it happens a lot, and 234 00:11:48,679 --> 00:11:52,680 Speaker 3: it happens a lot more to Latina, to black women, 235 00:11:52,840 --> 00:11:56,160 Speaker 3: to anybody from a misrepresented group, especially if you are 236 00:11:56,280 --> 00:11:58,360 Speaker 3: queer and you have a queer partner that's present. 237 00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:02,240 Speaker 2: A lot of these things are We're like, oh, like, 238 00:12:02,320 --> 00:12:03,680 Speaker 2: that is such a horrible story. 239 00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:07,280 Speaker 3: It's happening to people of color, to people who are queer, 240 00:12:07,320 --> 00:12:10,400 Speaker 3: who are trans And the reality is is that the 241 00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:13,559 Speaker 3: medical system, as we know, the medical industrial complex of 242 00:12:13,640 --> 00:12:18,640 Speaker 3: statrics kinnecology, was founded on the experimentation of enslaved African women. 243 00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:21,680 Speaker 3: So off a basis of that, that is saying that 244 00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:23,840 Speaker 3: we don't trust your body. We don't trust that your 245 00:12:23,880 --> 00:12:25,560 Speaker 3: body can keep your baby safe. 246 00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:26,719 Speaker 2: We're in a. 247 00:12:26,640 --> 00:12:29,600 Speaker 3: Situation where like Jeanie, you had a miscarriage, Maria, you 248 00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:30,320 Speaker 3: had a Sinceriian, you. 249 00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:32,280 Speaker 2: Wanted the general anesthesia. I had a Sessians. 250 00:12:32,320 --> 00:12:35,080 Speaker 3: So we're like, we're like the stories that people don't 251 00:12:35,120 --> 00:12:37,400 Speaker 3: want to hear, but it does happen, you know, And 252 00:12:37,440 --> 00:12:39,600 Speaker 3: even then that doesn't mean that all of our pregnancies 253 00:12:39,640 --> 00:12:42,319 Speaker 3: are pathological, which just means that we needed some medical attention. 254 00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:46,520 Speaker 5: I'm just going to bridge us into talking about the 255 00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:51,920 Speaker 5: quote unquote often viewed as negative parts of pregnancy, because Maria, 256 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:53,920 Speaker 5: you mentioned you had miscarriages, and you and I have 257 00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 5: talked extensively about miscarriages and infertility. So I think the 258 00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:04,760 Speaker 5: hardest part for me within our culture is how isolating 259 00:13:05,400 --> 00:13:08,599 Speaker 5: all of those things feel, because I dealt with infertility 260 00:13:08,840 --> 00:13:11,080 Speaker 5: and I couldn't get pregnant for almost two years, and 261 00:13:11,120 --> 00:13:14,280 Speaker 5: we did everything, and my family didn't understand it. They 262 00:13:14,280 --> 00:13:17,320 Speaker 5: didn't get it. Like my Dominican parents were like, I, 263 00:13:17,600 --> 00:13:19,800 Speaker 5: but you know, why don't you go see this doctor 264 00:13:19,840 --> 00:13:22,120 Speaker 5: who can tell you about positions in la la la 265 00:13:22,160 --> 00:13:25,400 Speaker 5: and really not like really like that's not what you 266 00:13:25,440 --> 00:13:28,440 Speaker 5: say to somebody who is month after month after month, 267 00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:33,600 Speaker 5: like taking medications and you know, getting tests and like, 268 00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:36,680 Speaker 5: but like I ended up hiding all of like the 269 00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:38,760 Speaker 5: stuff that we did because it's just like it's not 270 00:13:38,880 --> 00:13:39,800 Speaker 5: something you talk about. 271 00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:44,880 Speaker 3: Yeah, when it comes to like miscarriage and infertility, we 272 00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:48,840 Speaker 3: have like adopted also the perspective that we're super fertile, 273 00:13:49,440 --> 00:13:52,200 Speaker 3: that we're see that we just are a family or 274 00:13:52,280 --> 00:13:55,600 Speaker 3: we all come from big family and we want big 275 00:13:55,880 --> 00:13:57,960 Speaker 3: you know, we want big babies and all of this, 276 00:13:58,040 --> 00:14:01,600 Speaker 3: and you're kind of just like, I don't know, right, 277 00:14:01,720 --> 00:14:04,120 Speaker 3: Like I don't know about this. The reality is all 278 00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:07,000 Speaker 3: a lot of us are also here in the United 279 00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:09,880 Speaker 3: States where the culture is shifting, so we have adopted 280 00:14:09,920 --> 00:14:14,280 Speaker 3: different perspectives around families, around children's around pregnancy that often 281 00:14:14,360 --> 00:14:16,600 Speaker 3: is in conflict with the culture that we were raised 282 00:14:16,600 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 3: in and the culture that we're from. 283 00:14:18,679 --> 00:14:20,640 Speaker 1: Oh my god, be okay. So I'm gonna be honest. 284 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:24,480 Speaker 1: I'm gonna be honest because I mean, at this point 285 00:14:24,520 --> 00:14:27,840 Speaker 1: in my life, I know many women who never could, 286 00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:32,640 Speaker 1: never were able to for whatever reason. And by the way, 287 00:14:32,800 --> 00:14:35,560 Speaker 1: I had two abortions. I do not hide that I 288 00:14:35,600 --> 00:14:38,480 Speaker 1: had two miscarriages. I don't hide any of the laws 289 00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:42,080 Speaker 1: that comes with it. But I guess what's happening for 290 00:14:42,160 --> 00:14:45,480 Speaker 1: me is because I had such a hard time trying 291 00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:48,600 Speaker 1: to get pregnant. It was so difficult. There is so 292 00:14:48,680 --> 00:14:51,600 Speaker 1: much loss around it that that's why I do. I'm like, 293 00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:54,080 Speaker 1: oh my god, it is, in fact a little bit 294 00:14:54,080 --> 00:15:00,200 Speaker 1: of a miracle when it happens. Coming up, I want 295 00:15:00,200 --> 00:15:02,840 Speaker 1: to let you know, USA, we continue our conversation about 296 00:15:02,880 --> 00:15:07,720 Speaker 1: the realities of pregnancy before and during the pandemic. Stay 297 00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:55,680 Speaker 1: with us, not by yes, Hey, we're back. And when 298 00:15:55,720 --> 00:15:58,360 Speaker 1: we left off, we were talking about all the positive 299 00:15:58,680 --> 00:16:02,400 Speaker 1: and not so positive aspects when it comes to pregnancy 300 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:06,120 Speaker 1: and the miracle that birth really is. We're gonna pick 301 00:16:06,160 --> 00:16:07,240 Speaker 1: up that conversation now. 302 00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 2: You know. 303 00:16:08,640 --> 00:16:12,960 Speaker 5: I never fully appreciated what a miracle birth was until 304 00:16:12,960 --> 00:16:16,200 Speaker 5: I struggled and we did end up getting pregnant naturally 305 00:16:16,200 --> 00:16:19,320 Speaker 5: on a break from treatments. But it's funny because while 306 00:16:19,360 --> 00:16:22,560 Speaker 5: on the inside you're quietly dealing with miscarriage or infertility, 307 00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:25,520 Speaker 5: people on the outside either don't know what to say 308 00:16:25,680 --> 00:16:31,360 Speaker 5: or they say all the wrong things. Everybody tells you relatusa, 309 00:16:31,720 --> 00:16:36,320 Speaker 5: you know, just relax. You're too stressed, and then you 310 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:38,560 Speaker 5: have to deal with the other side, where like when 311 00:16:38,560 --> 00:16:40,680 Speaker 5: are you gonna have kids? When are you gonna have kids? 312 00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:42,400 Speaker 5: And then when you do have the kid, it's like 313 00:16:42,520 --> 00:16:45,440 Speaker 5: il manito and like I mean, I had like my 314 00:16:45,560 --> 00:16:48,640 Speaker 5: aunt ask me right after I had the mischut. She 315 00:16:48,640 --> 00:16:50,480 Speaker 5: didn't know I had a miscarriage, but she was like, 316 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:55,160 Speaker 5: and I'm like, dude, I was like, actually I just 317 00:16:55,240 --> 00:16:59,320 Speaker 5: lost time last week, but yeah, yeah I did. I 318 00:16:59,320 --> 00:16:59,640 Speaker 5: told her. 319 00:16:59,640 --> 00:17:06,000 Speaker 3: I those are questions our people man, especially Dominicans. I'm like, yo, 320 00:17:06,080 --> 00:17:08,399 Speaker 3: like those are things you just don't ask people. You 321 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:10,679 Speaker 3: don't ask people when when are they gonna have a baby? 322 00:17:10,680 --> 00:17:13,320 Speaker 3: Like that's so personal, Like that's you ask me, when's 323 00:17:13,320 --> 00:17:14,760 Speaker 3: the next time I'm going to have sex? 324 00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:16,080 Speaker 2: Do I even want to have sex? 325 00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:16,480 Speaker 1: Right now? 326 00:17:17,040 --> 00:17:19,119 Speaker 3: That's none of your business, you know what I'm saying, 327 00:17:19,119 --> 00:17:22,119 Speaker 3: Like you don't know, it's so inappropriates, so inappropriate. So 328 00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:24,240 Speaker 3: I think again, I think a lot of this is 329 00:17:26,200 --> 00:17:28,040 Speaker 3: that we tend to have with one another that we're 330 00:17:28,040 --> 00:17:30,199 Speaker 3: gonna just like say whatever is at the top of 331 00:17:30,240 --> 00:17:33,359 Speaker 3: our mind, which sometimes is just like funny and jokey joking, 332 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:36,679 Speaker 3: but when it's regarding manners, like this when it's our bodies, Like, 333 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:39,520 Speaker 3: it's just we need to like completely shift that. What 334 00:17:39,560 --> 00:17:41,320 Speaker 3: do they tell you when you know. 335 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:52,400 Speaker 5: And you're like, God, bless you, thank God that you're 336 00:17:52,400 --> 00:17:52,720 Speaker 5: gonna be. 337 00:17:56,440 --> 00:17:59,280 Speaker 2: I like to think that, Yeah, I didn't like that. 338 00:17:59,320 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 2: I didn't like them. 339 00:18:00,119 --> 00:18:02,639 Speaker 3: My aunt asked me when's the next child? And I 340 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:06,160 Speaker 3: had a miscarriage last week. Right, We're and the more 341 00:18:06,200 --> 00:18:08,359 Speaker 3: that we say it out loud, the more that people, 342 00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:11,199 Speaker 3: I like to think are going to change, Right, Like, 343 00:18:11,640 --> 00:18:13,120 Speaker 3: maybe your aunt won't ask. 344 00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:14,200 Speaker 2: You that again after this one. 345 00:18:14,280 --> 00:18:15,920 Speaker 3: Right, she's like, yeah, they'll say it, or like maybe 346 00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:16,960 Speaker 3: that's not going to come. 347 00:18:16,840 --> 00:18:18,480 Speaker 2: Out of her mouth because she knows us. 348 00:18:19,440 --> 00:18:25,399 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's definitely coming from, unfortunately, stereotypes about our identity 349 00:18:25,520 --> 00:18:29,119 Speaker 3: as females and women, that we can have multiple children, 350 00:18:29,119 --> 00:18:32,399 Speaker 3: that we want multiple children, and that you know, we 351 00:18:32,480 --> 00:18:34,800 Speaker 3: don't talk about how hard. 352 00:18:34,560 --> 00:18:35,760 Speaker 2: It is to get it. We're just going to be 353 00:18:35,760 --> 00:18:37,080 Speaker 2: thankful when it happens. 354 00:18:37,080 --> 00:18:39,320 Speaker 3: When well, we can talk about how heart it is, 355 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:41,480 Speaker 3: and we also want to talk about that we're happy 356 00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:44,280 Speaker 3: that we got our baby. But it really does a 357 00:18:44,359 --> 00:18:48,960 Speaker 3: disservice to us when we shame ourselves into the isolation, right, 358 00:18:49,000 --> 00:18:51,879 Speaker 3: into like saying I can't talk about what happened to 359 00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:53,520 Speaker 3: me because it's not a good feeling. 360 00:18:54,080 --> 00:18:55,800 Speaker 2: We kind of like we don't allow. 361 00:18:55,520 --> 00:18:58,560 Speaker 3: Ourselves to be whole people, and we're neglecting our ability 362 00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:01,560 Speaker 3: to evidence and show that we have a full range 363 00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:04,880 Speaker 3: of emotions, you know that we can say we're happy, 364 00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:05,960 Speaker 3: that we're sad. 365 00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:08,160 Speaker 2: We're excited, or we're nervous, or we're anxious. 366 00:19:08,200 --> 00:19:12,960 Speaker 3: Like for me and Alan, that was like, I'm bringing 367 00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:14,880 Speaker 3: a baby into the world, my partner's back, I'm being 368 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:16,200 Speaker 3: a black child into this world. 369 00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:18,800 Speaker 2: Oh God, there's nobody around, Like what was going to 370 00:19:18,840 --> 00:19:20,360 Speaker 2: happen to my body? Oh? 371 00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:23,760 Speaker 3: You know, it was extremely overwhelming and there was I 372 00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:25,119 Speaker 3: have three older sisters. 373 00:19:25,359 --> 00:19:26,800 Speaker 2: Did I talk to them about it? 374 00:19:27,320 --> 00:19:27,600 Speaker 5: No? 375 00:19:27,960 --> 00:19:28,240 Speaker 2: You know. 376 00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:32,680 Speaker 5: Now, And you know, Marie, I wonder because like you've 377 00:19:32,680 --> 00:19:35,560 Speaker 5: been very open about your miscarriages and stuff. Like for me, 378 00:19:35,680 --> 00:19:39,240 Speaker 5: it took it took me a while to like process 379 00:19:39,280 --> 00:19:42,040 Speaker 5: everything because I didn't understand it, like especially since I'm 380 00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:44,359 Speaker 5: kind of like nerdily scientific, Like I couldn't wrap my 381 00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:47,040 Speaker 5: head around it. But somebody sent me a link for 382 00:19:47,160 --> 00:19:50,840 Speaker 5: like a free group group sessions for miscarriages, and you 383 00:19:50,840 --> 00:19:52,959 Speaker 5: can come with your partner, and so I brought her 384 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:56,280 Speaker 5: Nesto and I'm all like, you know, getting gah because 385 00:19:56,359 --> 00:19:59,480 Speaker 5: this is my like getting aside, showing up at like 386 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:03,840 Speaker 5: group there to talk about my miscarriage, and Ternessa like 387 00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:06,159 Speaker 5: like he went with me because he went for me 388 00:20:06,400 --> 00:20:09,280 Speaker 5: like the support men, but like he's proven, so like 389 00:20:09,359 --> 00:20:12,080 Speaker 5: that's not a thing really, So you know, I wonder 390 00:20:12,680 --> 00:20:16,560 Speaker 5: why those things aren't a thing in Latin America, Like 391 00:20:16,600 --> 00:20:19,399 Speaker 5: why aren't we are more open? Did you talk Maria? 392 00:20:19,440 --> 00:20:21,199 Speaker 1: Like, well, look at what what is the word for 393 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:28,000 Speaker 1: miscarriage in Spanish la perdida. It's the loss, And so 394 00:20:28,240 --> 00:20:30,720 Speaker 1: you have to talk about this loss and it is 395 00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:34,639 Speaker 1: a very sad thing. I mean, my closest family I 396 00:20:34,680 --> 00:20:37,959 Speaker 1: think knew, but it was and I had one right 397 00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:40,280 Speaker 1: after the other, so by then it was like, well 398 00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:44,359 Speaker 1: and you know, will will it ever be able to happen? 399 00:20:44,840 --> 00:20:47,240 Speaker 1: But I remember that I wrote about it in my 400 00:20:47,600 --> 00:20:51,120 Speaker 1: in my motherhood memoir raising it Roul, precisely because I've 401 00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:54,200 Speaker 1: always been about just removing the stigma from these things. 402 00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:58,160 Speaker 1: It's a loss, and so while we don't talk about it, 403 00:20:58,720 --> 00:21:00,399 Speaker 1: there is the way in which we do name it 404 00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:04,160 Speaker 1: for what it is, But I agree with Eugenie. I mean, 405 00:21:04,359 --> 00:21:07,720 Speaker 1: the thing about miscarriage is that when you realize it, 406 00:21:07,760 --> 00:21:09,600 Speaker 1: what is it, one out of every three women has 407 00:21:09,640 --> 00:21:10,880 Speaker 1: experienced at least. 408 00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:12,800 Speaker 5: One Hello women, So many people. 409 00:21:12,800 --> 00:21:16,040 Speaker 1: Hello women, Hello women have experienced miscarriage. So it's crazy 410 00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:17,520 Speaker 1: that we don't talk about it. 411 00:21:17,600 --> 00:21:18,280 Speaker 2: As we're talking. 412 00:21:18,320 --> 00:21:21,560 Speaker 3: My hunch also is that you know, given that in 413 00:21:21,640 --> 00:21:25,320 Speaker 3: Latin America, right, like where we're from, like whether you're. 414 00:21:27,520 --> 00:21:29,720 Speaker 2: Like, religion's a big thing. 415 00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:33,400 Speaker 3: And I think it has framed and shaped how we 416 00:21:34,359 --> 00:21:37,159 Speaker 3: express our guilt, our shame, all the negative feelings, like 417 00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:39,520 Speaker 3: you're supposed to go and like again ask God. 418 00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:41,040 Speaker 2: You're supposed to be the lavios. 419 00:21:41,200 --> 00:21:43,159 Speaker 3: You know, you're not supposed to like talk to your 420 00:21:43,359 --> 00:21:46,160 Speaker 3: friend about like and you might. But even still, even 421 00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:49,240 Speaker 3: especially with family though, it's like it's not welcome. And 422 00:21:49,320 --> 00:21:51,280 Speaker 3: I think it's again because we don't want to hold 423 00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:52,719 Speaker 3: those feelings. 424 00:21:52,640 --> 00:21:55,520 Speaker 1: And we need to hold those feelings. And like we've 425 00:21:55,560 --> 00:21:58,600 Speaker 1: been discussing in terms of family dynamics and how open 426 00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:02,280 Speaker 1: we are with these feelings that are super complicated. So 427 00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:06,200 Speaker 1: for example, in my own family, Prima in Mexico went 428 00:22:06,280 --> 00:22:11,960 Speaker 1: into deep postpartum depression and no one in Mexico knew 429 00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:14,960 Speaker 1: what to do, and she was very, very lonely. And 430 00:22:15,000 --> 00:22:17,600 Speaker 1: so I'm hyper sens appreciating. 431 00:22:17,040 --> 00:22:20,600 Speaker 5: You around depression and psychologists and therapy and all that. 432 00:22:22,080 --> 00:22:24,520 Speaker 2: Depression to like pregnancy. 433 00:22:24,960 --> 00:22:27,960 Speaker 3: And that's the thing that I struggle with in our community, 434 00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:32,960 Speaker 3: is that like, if you want to talk about the 435 00:22:33,000 --> 00:22:39,640 Speaker 3: feelings you have, God. 436 00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:40,280 Speaker 2: Will help you through. 437 00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:42,320 Speaker 3: And I'm like, well, God is testing me right now, 438 00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:45,840 Speaker 3: Like God is testing me right now, and I'm not 439 00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:48,959 Speaker 3: feeling it, you know, And so my thing an answer 440 00:22:49,040 --> 00:22:51,160 Speaker 3: here and now where's where is he at? 441 00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:51,439 Speaker 2: You know? 442 00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:54,200 Speaker 3: My thing also is is that it's not just depression, 443 00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:56,920 Speaker 3: and it's also not just postpartum. So for me at 444 00:22:56,960 --> 00:23:00,000 Speaker 3: this point, like had I been working with a professional 445 00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:02,760 Speaker 3: like a therapist, we would have made a plan for 446 00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:06,320 Speaker 3: postpartum because I was already experiencing depression prenatally. I was 447 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:10,080 Speaker 3: very real it was just like for me, the idea 448 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:12,400 Speaker 3: of bringing a child into this world. This is right 449 00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:15,520 Speaker 3: before Trump got elected too, So again I was like, 450 00:23:16,119 --> 00:23:18,600 Speaker 3: something just didn't feel right for me right And the 451 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:21,080 Speaker 3: entire time there was a lot of self doubt and 452 00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:24,800 Speaker 3: I thought I had the tools to cope with what 453 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:25,399 Speaker 3: was going on. 454 00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:27,159 Speaker 2: But honestly, I didn't know anything. 455 00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:29,480 Speaker 3: I didn't know anything because when you become a mother, 456 00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:31,600 Speaker 3: when you become a parent, you don't know anything. 457 00:23:31,680 --> 00:23:33,080 Speaker 2: This is an experience. 458 00:23:32,640 --> 00:23:35,720 Speaker 3: That's unique to you, to your body, to the little 459 00:23:35,720 --> 00:23:38,520 Speaker 3: family that you're forming, and so much of what we're 460 00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:41,040 Speaker 3: told is a generalized perspective. 461 00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:43,440 Speaker 5: I have to say one of the most important things 462 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:47,240 Speaker 5: I learned from a therapist. If it is not good 463 00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:49,760 Speaker 5: for me to speak to my mother this week, I 464 00:23:49,800 --> 00:23:55,840 Speaker 5: don't have to talk to her insect. And I was like, wow, yeah, really, 465 00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,639 Speaker 5: if it's bad for you, like if it causes you anxiety, 466 00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:02,440 Speaker 5: then you don't have to don't have to this week. 467 00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:04,040 Speaker 5: You don't have to do it this week and feel 468 00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:05,919 Speaker 5: bad about it. I think it's important for our culture 469 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:08,159 Speaker 5: to know because you assume you have to pick up 470 00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:11,240 Speaker 5: or call because I it's mommy. But it just goes 471 00:24:11,320 --> 00:24:13,840 Speaker 5: back to knowing what's good for you in terms of 472 00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:16,560 Speaker 5: your family, your doctors, and making sure you are your 473 00:24:16,640 --> 00:24:17,679 Speaker 5: number one priority. 474 00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:20,960 Speaker 3: My hope and goal is that you know, I hate 475 00:24:21,000 --> 00:24:22,200 Speaker 3: saying silver lining. 476 00:24:21,960 --> 00:24:25,000 Speaker 2: But I'm gonna use that right now. Anyway that with. 477 00:24:25,000 --> 00:24:28,800 Speaker 3: The pandemic, people are being called into some people not 478 00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:31,560 Speaker 3: all right, but being called to question how we are 479 00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:35,679 Speaker 3: receiving care, how we're going about forming our family, the 480 00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:38,560 Speaker 3: decisions we want to make in regards to that family. 481 00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:41,679 Speaker 3: So my hope is that we, you know, try to 482 00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:44,960 Speaker 3: do things different, and I think we have to, you know, 483 00:24:45,080 --> 00:24:47,919 Speaker 3: because how we've been doing it is clearly not working. 484 00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:51,080 Speaker 5: So, you know, it's interesting because people didn't obviously didn't 485 00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:54,879 Speaker 5: stop having babies. There's a lot of COVID babies. Everybody 486 00:24:54,880 --> 00:24:56,800 Speaker 5: feel like everybody I talk to is pregnant right now. 487 00:24:57,320 --> 00:24:59,840 Speaker 5: There's been a lot of articles too about the mental 488 00:24:59,880 --> 00:25:02,040 Speaker 5: health health of a lot of pregnant women during this time. 489 00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:05,320 Speaker 5: I feel like the mental aspect has been hard for 490 00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:08,520 Speaker 5: me because the timing is weird, like the world is 491 00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:12,120 Speaker 5: in chaos, there's so many external factors, and then I'm 492 00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:16,280 Speaker 5: navigating appointments alone with a ton of extra precautions and rules, 493 00:25:16,359 --> 00:25:19,760 Speaker 5: and worrying about getting COVID myself because I do, in 494 00:25:19,800 --> 00:25:22,119 Speaker 5: fact have to go to these appointments, and then you know, 495 00:25:22,240 --> 00:25:24,800 Speaker 5: my parents aren't going to be able to come, We're 496 00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:26,480 Speaker 5: not going to have any help, and all of that 497 00:25:26,600 --> 00:25:27,439 Speaker 5: is mentally draining. 498 00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:30,760 Speaker 1: I have seen women in the park next to where 499 00:25:30,800 --> 00:25:34,000 Speaker 1: I live, and I see them pregnant, and I see 500 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:37,400 Speaker 1: them wearing a mask, and I have to say, genies. 501 00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:39,560 Speaker 1: You know, On the one hand, I'm like, well, I'm 502 00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:42,240 Speaker 1: really happy that people are having sex during the pandemic. 503 00:25:42,320 --> 00:25:45,080 Speaker 1: So that's a good thing. Like, I'm really happy that 504 00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:46,639 Speaker 1: people were able to be getting it off. 505 00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:47,399 Speaker 2: It has something to do. 506 00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:47,720 Speaker 4: Yep. 507 00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:51,159 Speaker 1: I found something to do, you know, found passion. But 508 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:54,000 Speaker 1: there is a part of me that my heart does 509 00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:57,480 Speaker 1: sink when I see a pregnant woman with a mask, 510 00:25:57,520 --> 00:26:02,160 Speaker 1: because I'm just like God, that has to be so lonely. 511 00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:06,959 Speaker 1: But I also think you, Genie, are a part of history. 512 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:10,800 Speaker 1: You are a survivor of this pandemic in the sense 513 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:14,040 Speaker 1: that you're mothering and working and during a pandemic carrying 514 00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:17,080 Speaker 1: a child, and you will give birth during a pandemic. 515 00:26:17,560 --> 00:26:20,720 Speaker 1: Your child will be marked as a survivor in a 516 00:26:20,720 --> 00:26:23,600 Speaker 1: beautiful way. And so we're not going to live like 517 00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:25,760 Speaker 1: this forever, even though it feels that way right now. 518 00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:30,679 Speaker 1: But there is a very particular psychological, spiritual experience of 519 00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:34,399 Speaker 1: being pregnant in a pandemic that I cannot even imagine. 520 00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:36,480 Speaker 5: It's hard too, because if I mean, if you think 521 00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:38,199 Speaker 5: of all the things that I just told you, Like 522 00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:40,920 Speaker 5: I see people on these mom groups and I see 523 00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:43,960 Speaker 5: people posting like, you know, should we wait till after 524 00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:47,480 Speaker 5: the pandemic passes to try to get pregnant, And I'm 525 00:26:47,560 --> 00:26:50,119 Speaker 5: in my head, I'm like, you know, I don't have 526 00:26:50,160 --> 00:26:52,680 Speaker 5: that luxury, Like I didn't. I know what it took 527 00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:54,640 Speaker 5: to get my first I know I had a miscarriage 528 00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:57,960 Speaker 5: last year. I know that I'm approaching forty, Like, not 529 00:26:58,040 --> 00:27:01,160 Speaker 5: everybody has the luxury to wait. So there, it might 530 00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:03,159 Speaker 5: seem like there's a lot of COVID babies, but at 531 00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:05,399 Speaker 5: the same time, like you have to take into account 532 00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:08,360 Speaker 5: what every person has gone through, like their pregnanty journey. 533 00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:11,359 Speaker 5: So yeah, I think also right now, like my biggest 534 00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:14,359 Speaker 5: tip to people who are pregnant and are navigating having 535 00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:17,320 Speaker 5: a baby during the pandemic and having little to no 536 00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:20,960 Speaker 5: help after they have a baby, is that the it's 537 00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:22,960 Speaker 5: comparable like when you have a baby, you're going to 538 00:27:23,040 --> 00:27:26,199 Speaker 5: quarantine anyway, so you think of it that you've had 539 00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:29,640 Speaker 5: a lot of practice being alone, and so I think 540 00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:33,240 Speaker 5: that there the conversation then is like who is around 541 00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:37,160 Speaker 5: like within like walking driving distance that might not necessarily 542 00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:39,280 Speaker 5: enter your home, but still can show up for you, right. 543 00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:41,760 Speaker 2: Can they run certain errands? Can they drop off meals? 544 00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:43,160 Speaker 2: Can they organize the meal train? 545 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:46,200 Speaker 3: Can they do things that would take you outside of 546 00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:48,560 Speaker 3: the house you're not comfortable with. So if there's ways 547 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:51,040 Speaker 3: for people to get creative and figure out how to 548 00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:55,920 Speaker 3: still stay in community and form their own village like esingtante, 549 00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:58,639 Speaker 3: because to have a baby by yourself when no one around, 550 00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:01,760 Speaker 3: which is honestly what I expecience in many ways, and 551 00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:05,520 Speaker 3: it's been affected for us particularly, you know, like our 552 00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:09,000 Speaker 3: family just isn't here Capitalismo. People have to work right, 553 00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:11,800 Speaker 3: Like people are just aren't just available as we thought 554 00:28:11,840 --> 00:28:14,879 Speaker 3: they would to form a village. Our world is not 555 00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:17,840 Speaker 3: set up to support family units. And that's also why 556 00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:19,520 Speaker 3: people are like, well should I have a baby? 557 00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:21,240 Speaker 2: Because there's no way. 558 00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:24,520 Speaker 3: For me to still exist as a human being, exists 559 00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:27,800 Speaker 3: as a working person and have a child. It's very hard. 560 00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:30,920 Speaker 3: Now are people doing it? Absolutely, we're figuring it out, 561 00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:33,320 Speaker 3: and I'm one of them. It shouldn't have to be 562 00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:35,640 Speaker 3: this hard. Mothering shouldn't have to be this hard. 563 00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:37,920 Speaker 1: Can I just say, as the elder. 564 00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:44,800 Speaker 2: They know sport tells well that. 565 00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:48,120 Speaker 1: That also women have been doing this for millions of years. Yeah, 566 00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:52,960 Speaker 1: that we have. Actually that we do make it, that 567 00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:57,719 Speaker 1: we have the answers, that we are much stronger than 568 00:28:57,720 --> 00:28:59,800 Speaker 1: we could ever imagine. And I think that in some 569 00:28:59,840 --> 00:29:02,320 Speaker 1: way that's the essence of motherhood is to believe in 570 00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:05,360 Speaker 1: our strength and to be that pillar that you know, 571 00:29:05,400 --> 00:29:07,560 Speaker 1: for many of us, if we were lucky, our mothers were. 572 00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:10,480 Speaker 1: And I think that is like the essence of motherhood 573 00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:12,800 Speaker 1: is you are a lot stronger than you think, you 574 00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:16,520 Speaker 1: can handle, more than you think you can carry, more 575 00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:18,840 Speaker 1: on your shoulders than you think. Doesn't mean that you're 576 00:29:19,040 --> 00:29:22,680 Speaker 1: not exhausted, emotional, that you're gonna cry, that you're going 577 00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:26,200 Speaker 1: to feel overwhelmed. You have to acknowledge all of that. 578 00:29:26,360 --> 00:29:31,120 Speaker 1: But also moms are survivors. Moms are survivors. Power to 579 00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:34,400 Speaker 1: the both of you as the moms and working latinas. 580 00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:37,400 Speaker 5: I wonder, just on a final note, how can we 581 00:29:37,440 --> 00:29:40,560 Speaker 5: as a Latino community kind of like support pregnant women 582 00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:43,239 Speaker 5: better and support the mental part better and open up 583 00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:44,040 Speaker 5: and talk more. 584 00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:49,200 Speaker 3: Asking questions is nice, but listening is even better, you know, 585 00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:53,000 Speaker 3: Like if there's a way for us to enact a 586 00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:56,560 Speaker 3: kind of like a cultural shift in where we don't 587 00:29:56,600 --> 00:29:59,280 Speaker 3: just praise the pregnant body and shame the postpart and 588 00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:02,520 Speaker 3: body in a way that we are like, you know, 589 00:30:02,640 --> 00:30:05,960 Speaker 3: I'm so thankful for you for bringing us another human being. 590 00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:08,960 Speaker 3: What can I do for you? Right without giving you advice? 591 00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:10,719 Speaker 3: But like literally what can I do for you? Or 592 00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:15,160 Speaker 3: like just dropping off something without expecting anything, right. 593 00:30:15,560 --> 00:30:16,080 Speaker 2: I think for. 594 00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:18,360 Speaker 3: Us it's you know, it's a lot to unpack in 595 00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:21,760 Speaker 3: terms of like our cultural attitudes, but honestly, our round 596 00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:24,040 Speaker 3: table right now is something that we're doing right. Like 597 00:30:24,200 --> 00:30:26,800 Speaker 3: bringing it out loud, talking about it out loud and 598 00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:29,600 Speaker 3: not having private conversations is a big one, right, Like 599 00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:32,840 Speaker 3: losing that shame of like saying, uh, you know, I 600 00:30:32,880 --> 00:30:33,640 Speaker 3: had a miscarriage. 601 00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:34,920 Speaker 2: I can't tell no one is. 602 00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:37,760 Speaker 3: Huge, right, So even Maria and Eugenie talking about it 603 00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:39,080 Speaker 3: with me is a big things. 604 00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:40,680 Speaker 2: Like someone listening is like, yeah, I. 605 00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:42,760 Speaker 3: Actually just had a miscarriage too, and I haven't really 606 00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:44,840 Speaker 3: talked to anybody about it or people are too scared 607 00:30:44,840 --> 00:30:46,600 Speaker 3: to ask me how I'm feeling about. 608 00:30:46,360 --> 00:30:46,840 Speaker 2: It, you know. 609 00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:49,239 Speaker 3: So that's my hope and wish is that we just 610 00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:52,360 Speaker 3: like kind of shed those barriers that we've put on 611 00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:55,680 Speaker 3: ourselves to talk with our loved ones about what we're 612 00:30:55,680 --> 00:30:58,880 Speaker 3: feeling so that they know, oh a bit that they're like, 613 00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:01,600 Speaker 3: they're going going through something still, you know, And so 614 00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:05,840 Speaker 3: it doesn't necessarily have to stay in the negative emotions. 615 00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:07,720 Speaker 2: But we welcome them. We welcome all of them. 616 00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:11,960 Speaker 1: So what I think is that it's true these conversations 617 00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:16,120 Speaker 1: do help because we are unzipped. We are talking about 618 00:31:16,120 --> 00:31:20,040 Speaker 1: the things around pregnancy or miscarriage or loss, or depression 619 00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:24,880 Speaker 1: or postpartum that you know, a lot of people don't 620 00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:28,920 Speaker 1: want to talk about it, certainly not many Latinos and Latinas. 621 00:31:29,320 --> 00:31:34,160 Speaker 1: My message is, think before you speak as a Latino 622 00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:38,080 Speaker 1: or a Latina when approaching a woman who is pregnant 623 00:31:39,520 --> 00:31:42,000 Speaker 1: or who is in that just got married or whatever. 624 00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:44,800 Speaker 1: You don't need to add your two cents as to 625 00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:48,120 Speaker 1: when are you're getting pregnant? When's the next baby, because 626 00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:52,120 Speaker 1: you don't know. If you have nothing beautiful to say 627 00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:56,120 Speaker 1: to a Latina woman who is pregnant and or bothering, 628 00:31:57,080 --> 00:31:59,080 Speaker 1: don't say it at all. 629 00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:04,520 Speaker 2: Unless you're going to offer to cook dinner or to 630 00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:06,560 Speaker 2: base it. We know we're not interested. 631 00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:08,400 Speaker 1: Unless you're gonna offer than. 632 00:32:10,360 --> 00:32:13,080 Speaker 5: This has been really great, ladies. Thank you so much 633 00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:16,720 Speaker 5: for speaking candidly, and thank you Hugh. 634 00:32:16,760 --> 00:32:19,560 Speaker 1: I love this conversation. And congratulations to the both of 635 00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:24,400 Speaker 1: you for being working professional Latina mine in New York City. 636 00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:25,120 Speaker 1: You got this. 637 00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:33,680 Speaker 5: Thank you, Thank you. 638 00:32:41,720 --> 00:32:44,480 Speaker 1: This episode was produced by Gini Montalgo and edited by 639 00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:48,840 Speaker 1: Marta Martinez. The Latino USA team includes Niar Massis, Andrea 640 00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:54,360 Speaker 1: Lopes Grusado, Julieta Martinelli, Alises Carce, Alejandra Selsad and Rinaldo 641 00:32:54,560 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 1: Leanos Junior with help from Praes. Our engineers are Stephanie 642 00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:01,640 Speaker 1: the Boat, Julia Caruz and Liah Shaw with help from 643 00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:05,200 Speaker 1: Elishava YouTube. Our digital editor is Luis Luna. Our New 644 00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:09,480 Speaker 1: York Women's Foundation Ignite fellow is Rugia Rochak. Our interns 645 00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:12,760 Speaker 1: are jimeen A del Serro, emin Sekiros and Gabriela Bayez. 646 00:33:13,160 --> 00:33:16,320 Speaker 1: Our theme music was composed by Segher Robinos. If you 647 00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:18,760 Speaker 1: like the music you heard on this episode, stop by 648 00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:21,880 Speaker 1: Lettingo USA dot organ check out our weekly Spotify playlist. 649 00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:25,280 Speaker 1: I'm your host and executive producer Maria jo Josa join 650 00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:27,720 Speaker 1: us again on our next episode and in the meantime, 651 00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:30,280 Speaker 1: look for us on all of your social media. Iados 652 00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:32,280 Speaker 1: watch on a stella proxima Jao. 653 00:33:36,720 --> 00:33:40,880 Speaker 4: Latino USA is made possible in part by the Annie 654 00:33:41,240 --> 00:33:45,000 Speaker 4: Casey Foundation. Creates a brighter future for the nation's children 655 00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:50,400 Speaker 4: by strengthening families, building greater economic opportunity, and transforming communities 656 00:33:51,280 --> 00:33:55,720 Speaker 4: New York Women's Foundation. The New York Women's Foundation funding 657 00:33:55,760 --> 00:33:59,680 Speaker 4: women leaders that build solutions in their communities, and celebrating 658 00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:05,120 Speaker 4: through years of radical generosity and funding. For Latino USA 659 00:34:05,280 --> 00:34:08,279 Speaker 4: is coverage of a culture of health is made possible 660 00:34:08,320 --> 00:34:11,200 Speaker 4: in part by a grant from the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation. 661 00:34:15,880 --> 00:34:19,120 Speaker 1: I'm Marie noo Hosa. Next time on Latino USA. In 662 00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:22,760 Speaker 1: the heart of the Amazon, Brazil's indigenous communities are working 663 00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:26,400 Speaker 1: to preserve their cultures and languages, but it's an uphill battle, 664 00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:29,800 Speaker 1: and the steaks are even higher now with the deadly 665 00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:31,520 Speaker 1: spread of COVID nineteen. 666 00:34:31,719 --> 00:34:34,480 Speaker 5: The situation reminds a lot of indigenous folks of the 667 00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:37,680 Speaker 5: grises surrounding health that indigenous people have faced for a 668 00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:38,439 Speaker 5: very long time. 669 00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:40,520 Speaker 1: That's next time on Latino USA.