Speaker 1: The volume.
Speaker 2: This is Prime Cuts, the best of the Colin Coward Podcast.
Speaker 2: All right, Aaron Rodgers going to the New York Jets
Speaker 2: is official. The draft picks were around what most people speculated.
Speaker 2: Nobody won the trade. I mean you can argue the
Speaker 2: Jets won the trade because they get Aaron Rodgers. I
Speaker 2: think my takeaway is that I've always said that once
Speaker 2: a rookie quarterback comes in, I will give him a
Speaker 2: year and a half year. Two Thanksgiving. You will know
Speaker 2: what you have now. It used to be you gave
Speaker 2: a rookie quarterback two full years. Bill Pollian would say three.
Speaker 2: But with seven on seven summer camps, the personal quarterback coaching,
Speaker 2: I'll give you to Thanksgiving your second year in. But
Speaker 2: it is different with Jordan Love. Jordan Love has been
Speaker 2: in the building for three years. I will give Jordan
Speaker 2: Love until Thanksgiving. This year. You'll know. By getting another
Speaker 2: second round pick, the Packers can pick up a wide
Speaker 2: receiver in the first round, an edge rusher, and a
Speaker 2: tight end in the second. It's an incredibly deep edge
Speaker 2: rusher and tight end draft. So the Packers should be
Speaker 2: able to get three starters in their first three picks.
Speaker 2: And that's what they're going to go after in what order.
Speaker 2: I have no IDEA wide receiver, tight end, and edge rusher.
Speaker 2: It is not a deep wide receiver class. There is
Speaker 2: one receiver maybe two in the first round, and the
Speaker 2: Packers have the thirteenth pick. So my guess is they
Speaker 2: go for the best receiver out of Ohio State. Then
Speaker 2: they probably get a tight end in an edge rusher
Speaker 2: in round two. Those are all going to be high
Speaker 2: rotation or starting players. Then you draft and develop the
Speaker 2: rest of the draft. This is a team that is
Speaker 2: ready to win football games. Okay, we know Minnesota is
Speaker 2: not going eleven to zero in one score games. We
Speaker 2: don't know if Chicago's any good and Detroit, though improved,
Speaker 2: is Detroit with that gambling scandal. Who knows who's going
Speaker 2: to be available in September. But this team is ready
Speaker 2: to win or at least be competent. Jordan Love is
Speaker 2: inheriting a top ten offensive line, two more than capable
Speaker 2: running backs, one a borderline star Christian Watson is an
Speaker 2: emerging star at wide receiver, an offensive coach. They need
Speaker 2: an edge rusher. They have a Pro Bowl corner, good
Speaker 2: interior defensive linemen, excellent young safeties, you can't win nine
Speaker 2: or ten games, and we'll know by Thanksgiving in the
Speaker 2: weakest the NFC has been in twenty years, then you
Speaker 2: got the wrong guy. This is one of my favorite
Speaker 2: weeks of the year, as all of you know if
Speaker 2: you've listened to me for years. I love the NFL draft,
Speaker 2: the architecture of it. I mean, the Jets were a
Speaker 2: great example last year where they nailed their first four picks.
Speaker 2: The Seahawks nailed their first five, and it literally set
Speaker 2: the future up. I mean, if they get Aaron Rodgers,
Speaker 2: the Jets will be able to play with anybody. Probably
Speaker 2: have to get a left tackle and another receiver and
Speaker 2: the Jets will be able to play with anybody. They
Speaker 2: got two good receivers, they have a pass rush. They
Speaker 2: just need to upgrade at tight end, left tackle, wide receiver.
Speaker 2: Joe Douglas will do that in the draft. I mean, Seattle,
Speaker 2: we thought was a dying franchise. They hit on two tackles,
Speaker 2: a star running back and edge rusher and two corners.
Speaker 1: Boom.
Speaker 2: You know, now they just need another edge rusher. They
Speaker 2: got to get a couple of defensive linemen, maybe one
Speaker 2: more receiver, and the sky is the limit. So you know,
Speaker 2: other drafts are different. Even a great college baseball player,
Speaker 2: he's not going to make an impact the following year
Speaker 2: in the Major League Baseball playoffs. As great as these
Speaker 2: NBA players are, Daron Fox now is just starting to
Speaker 2: like turn a franchise around. What is he in year five?
Speaker 2: It takes a long time. These guys come out at
Speaker 2: nineteen years old. NFL is different for a lot of reasons.
Speaker 2: Number one is guys come out at twenty three and
Speaker 2: twenty four years old. They're real men. They're physically ready
Speaker 2: to play. So if you hit on your first four
Speaker 2: or five picks, you know people lament the LA Rams
Speaker 2: they have a second and two thirds. If they nail
Speaker 2: the right edge rusher, interior offensive lineman, and get a starbacker,
Speaker 2: another really high ended receiver in the third round. If
Speaker 2: they can get three starters, they turn around the franchise.
Speaker 2: They got McVeigh, they have Stafford, they have Aaron Donald.
Speaker 2: You're getting grown ups, men physically and emotionally ready to
Speaker 2: play and start. So the Jets and the Seahawks last
Speaker 2: year are great examples. You nail your verse four or
Speaker 2: five draft picks, you can in that moment you bring
Speaker 2: in five new starters that you don't have to pay
Speaker 2: for four to five years. It changes, shifts the paradigm
Speaker 2: of the entire franchise. I mean, look at how bad
Speaker 2: the Jets were, the mess Joe Douglas inherits, he even
Speaker 2: missed on a quarterback and a left tackle, two of
Speaker 2: the three most important positions in football. He missed on both.
Speaker 2: And if Aaron Rodgers signs and they hit on a
Speaker 2: left tackle and one other receiver, the Jets can play
Speaker 2: with anybody in this league, including the Chiefs, they can
Speaker 2: play with anybody in this league. So I love this week.
Speaker 2: I think the NFL is the League of hope more
Speaker 2: than any other league. I remember when Bill Parcells years
Speaker 2: ago took over the Miami Dolphins and they were one
Speaker 2: in fifteen. The next year they won eleven games, And
Speaker 2: I read an article Tony Sperano I think was Bill
Speaker 2: Parcell's choice as a coach, kind of a defensive guy.
Speaker 2: And I remember reading an article somebody wrote in the
Speaker 2: Miami Herald or a Fort Lauderdale paper about what Belichick
Speaker 2: really did was he took the middle of the roster
Speaker 2: to the end of it. It wasn't the top end
Speaker 2: of the roster. He made the locker room better, the
Speaker 2: weight room better. He went and got grinders and rotational
Speaker 2: players and backups and a handful of low level starters,
Speaker 2: and it changed the entire culture of the organization with
Speaker 2: like twenty new players, and they weren't stars. Most of
Speaker 2: them weren't stars. So no sport allows you to recreate
Speaker 2: your roster and your football identity like the NFL. It
Speaker 2: takes two to three free agent signings, four home runs
Speaker 2: in the draft, seven eight new players to start at energy,
Speaker 2: especially draft guys who are cheap, and you turn everything around.
Speaker 2: So I can't wait. Somebody is going to do a
Speaker 2: Jets or a Seahawks, and I can't wait to watch it.
Speaker 2: All right, Mike Silver, a valuable member of the volume.
Speaker 2: When breaking news happens, Mike Silver happens, I love that.
Speaker 2: That sounds like a billboard.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Colin, I know you remember a year ago, or
Speaker 3: a little more than a year ago, we were on
Speaker 3: together when the DeVante Adams trade happened to the Raiders
Speaker 3: and we were like, whoa, you know, because that was
Speaker 3: a little more sudden. But yeah, this is I think
Speaker 3: it's an exciting day and I don't want to gloss
Speaker 3: over this. For Jets fans, this is awesome. The Jets
Speaker 3: are getting one of the best quarterbacks of all time,
Speaker 3: possibly with years left. They have a team that was
Speaker 3: good enough to almost make the playoffs last year despite
Speaker 3: injuries and Zach Wilson being the quarterback for a lot
Speaker 3: of it. And Aaron knows this offense intimately because Nathaniel
Speaker 3: Hackett's now the coordinators. So people might say, oh, it's
Speaker 3: great for the Packers, it's win win that we could
Speaker 3: get into all that, but it's not win win.
Speaker 1: The Jets win the day today.
Speaker 2: In my opinion, this isn't perfectly analogous, but I've three
Speaker 2: times traveled cross country and took a new job. The
Speaker 2: first year, whether you're talented or not, with new environment
Speaker 2: is hard, it's choppy. I hope Aaron plays for a
Speaker 2: second year. First of all, new defensive coordinators, new conference,
Speaker 2: new environment, it's everything, new neighborhood. And if you go
Speaker 2: look at Aaron's history, first year starting the league, little bumpy,
Speaker 2: first year with Hackett, little bumpy. I think he's going
Speaker 2: to do really well. I kind of feel like it's
Speaker 2: a ten seven eleven six team. I think it's I
Speaker 2: think their schedule is not the easiest. No, But what's
Speaker 2: a realistic expectation to you?
Speaker 3: That's a great question because if you look at it
Speaker 3: on paper, you say, the AFC is a gauntlet, right,
Speaker 3: and the AFC certainly is not going to be easy.
Speaker 3: And they are the Jets. They do have some dudes.
Speaker 3: I mean both rookies of the year. Brice Hall was
Speaker 3: that good before he got hurt. Elijah er Tucker was
Speaker 3: hurt last year. You know, they've they've got some dudes,
Speaker 3: and I think they will play pretty good defense. You
Speaker 3: know you're right about year one because that was the
Speaker 3: case in Green Bay, which was year one in the
Speaker 3: laflor Hacket offense. And they did go thirteen and three
Speaker 3: and reach the NFC Championship Game with a very good team,
Speaker 3: but it was not humming offensively the way that you
Speaker 3: would expect an Aaron Rodgers team to.
Speaker 1: But I think, you.
Speaker 3: Know, I look at far his first year there, which
Speaker 3: everyone revisioned his history thinks sucked, and then he went
Speaker 3: to Minnesota and was really good. But Farv had those
Speaker 3: Jets eight and three right up in playoff contention. He
Speaker 3: was an MVP contention. He suffered an arm injury that essentially,
Speaker 3: you know, made him noodle arm the rest of that year,
Speaker 3: and it didn't go great. But this is going to
Speaker 3: give them a real jolt, and franchise quarterbacks affect teams
Speaker 3: in ways that go beyond what most of us see.
Speaker 3: It just changes the energy and the vibe of the organization.
Speaker 3: It lends a credibility to the the meetings, the practices internally,
Speaker 3: and you know, he's going to pull a game or
Speaker 3: two out that the Jets aren't used to pulling out,
Speaker 3: and that's gonna potentially snowball. So I think playoffs is
Speaker 3: a very realistic, you know possibility. I think once you're
Speaker 3: in the playoffs with Aaron Rodgers, if you're peaking at
Speaker 3: the right time, that.
Speaker 1: Could be really, really exciting.
Speaker 3: And I guess the other thing I want to say,
Speaker 3: because it's confusing, right, I would if you told me, hey,
Speaker 3: the Packers and Eric Rodgers have decided to come back
Speaker 3: for one more year, I wouldn't be as wildly upbeat
Speaker 3: about the Packers. And here's why. I just don't think
Speaker 3: you'd be getting the same guy in Green Trump. The
Speaker 3: guy they had last year I was, is not the
Speaker 3: guy that I expect the Jets to be getting today,
Speaker 3: and that's not fair necessarily to the Packers, but it
Speaker 3: is a reality, and that's why I think Jets fan
Speaker 3: should be fired.
Speaker 2: Well yeah, I think all relationships can run their course,
Speaker 2: and I think the Green Bay situation there was a
Speaker 2: lack of trust on both sides. There was a little
Speaker 2: bit of animosity for different reasons. I think you'll get
Speaker 2: I think you'll get a highly focused and energized Erran.
Speaker 2: I hope it's for two years, and I do think
Speaker 2: the Jets will be a viable team year ones are difficult,
Speaker 2: as I've said, for a lot of situations. You know,
Speaker 2: it's interesting with Jordan Love, I don't know what we have.
Speaker 2: Here's the good news. He's been there three years. The
Speaker 2: size is not an issue. He's a big kid that
Speaker 2: moves well. If he was in I mean, if you
Speaker 2: took Jordan Love today, even with what little we've seen
Speaker 2: after Bryce Young, he'd be the number two pick in
Speaker 2: the draft, right, Like, there's stuff there. I don't know
Speaker 2: if he can step to the line of scrimmage and
Speaker 2: audible in and out of stuff.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 2: Trailing late in the game, third and eleven, how is
Speaker 2: he equipped to do that. I have no idea, but
Speaker 2: I will say this, it's a good team that needs
Speaker 2: another receiver, another tight end, and an edge rusher. And
Speaker 2: I talked to two GMS last week that said it's
Speaker 2: the best tight end class in years and the best
Speaker 2: edge rusher class in years. So I do feel like this, Mike.
Speaker 2: I've always believed years ago you gave a quarterback three years,
Speaker 2: But now the seven on seven camps. In private coaching,
Speaker 2: I always say Thanksgiving of year two, you know what
Speaker 2: you have. But Jordan loves been there for three years.
Speaker 2: I feel like we'll know by Thanksgiving what kind of
Speaker 2: we have eight nine games in there'll be a set
Speaker 2: Because the NFC, Mike, it's not a gauntlet. There's a
Speaker 2: lot of wus in this conference. Yeah, I think that's realistic.
Speaker 3: You know, I came from a different era where quarterbacks
Speaker 3: almost always sat, and when they didn't, they took lumps
Speaker 3: as great as they.
Speaker 1: Were Aikman everyone but a Marino essentially.
Speaker 3: But you know that all changed with Matt Ryan and
Speaker 3: Joe Flacco and and you know, for a lot of
Speaker 3: reasons you stated it's a it's a different landscape. Now,
Speaker 3: I'd say the good on Jordan Love is. Yeah, there
Speaker 3: is some definite upside. I remember one offensive coach I
Speaker 3: really respect telling me before the draft where Jordan Love
Speaker 3: was drafted, I would take this guy first overall. So
Speaker 3: there is something special about the package. The early reviews
Speaker 3: were not good, and you know, he's it's not quite
Speaker 3: Trey Lance coming from North Dakota State or Carson Wentz,
Speaker 3: but it's a guy coming from a smaller program, more
Speaker 3: like Josh Allen right, And you know, early on I
Speaker 3: think Packer coaches and players were kind of like, ah, man,
Speaker 3: if this guy has to play, you know, we're in
Speaker 3: real trouble. And now again the standard is very high.
Speaker 3: So that's the good part. Maybe I think he from
Speaker 3: what I've heard, he has gotten a lot better. He
Speaker 3: has developed, he works at it, he's a good kid.
Speaker 3: There some definite upside. I think the hard news is
Speaker 3: this delusion that many Packer fans seem to have in
Speaker 3: others that well, Aron waited for three years and look
Speaker 3: what happened. Like this has happened twice in NFL history
Speaker 3: where a first ballot Hall of Fame quarterback was succeeded
Speaker 3: immediately by another future first ballot Hall of fame quarterback,
Speaker 3: and it was tumultuous both times. Montanaa young the Niners
Speaker 3: did not get nearly as many years out of that combined.
Speaker 3: The Packers somehow got fifteen to fifteen three decades of
Speaker 3: uninterrupted transcendent quarterback play that could cover up all ills
Speaker 3: and pull games out of nowhere. And I just, especially
Speaker 3: young Packer fans, I'm looking at you, guys, going you
Speaker 3: guys like it could work out well. They could be
Speaker 3: a well rounded team. Jordan Love could be good. The
Speaker 3: odds of having yet another transcendent quarterback just take the
Speaker 3: reins and keep it rolling are not good. And you're
Speaker 3: not going to notice that necessarily Week three, the third
Speaker 3: quarter against the Bears, when you're you know, marching down
Speaker 3: the field. But you're going to notice it in December
Speaker 3: on third and eighteen against a really good team at
Speaker 3: times where Aaron and far before we're able to just
Speaker 3: do insanely magical things. I just don't think that's going
Speaker 3: to be the case. And that's not a slight on
Speaker 3: Jordan Love. I'm just trying to be realistic.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Listen, if he was as good as a Burrow
Speaker 2: or a Mahomes, they would not have signed Aaron to
Speaker 2: an extension, right because there was drama three years ago.
Speaker 2: If he was as bad as Zach Wilson, they know
Speaker 2: it and I've kept so my takeaway, he's somewhere between
Speaker 2: twelve and twenty. He's probably in that mix, which I.
Speaker 1: Mean it goes well, if it goes well.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's somewhere between Kirk Cousins and Jimmy Garoppolo or
Speaker 2: you know, he's somewhere in. But it's also possible that
Speaker 2: he is Zach Wilson. It just hasn't played right. I mean,
Speaker 2: I think he's a more mature person and all that,
Speaker 2: but like, right, yeah, but I hear you.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like if it goes the way they are hoping
Speaker 3: it will go, and they've got good infrastructure around him,
Speaker 3: and Mountain Floor is a really, really good coach, I think.
Speaker 2: He has a chance. You know, Mike, I think they're
Speaker 2: going to look like last year. They're going to be
Speaker 2: the nine and eight sort of level, but it's going
Speaker 2: to be the opposite. So with Aaron, he didn't want
Speaker 2: to work with the young receivers. They start slow schedule weekends,
Speaker 2: they finished strong. I think because Jordan Love is going
Speaker 2: to be totally committed to the young guys, and nobody
Speaker 2: has film on him. They're actually be pretty good team
Speaker 2: until Thanksgiving. At Thanksgiving the break you get film. People
Speaker 2: now have had their buys, and now I think people
Speaker 2: take stuff away from Jordan love that he had in
Speaker 2: the first eight or nine weeks. I think they're going
Speaker 2: to end up the same place. Last year's team did
Speaker 2: a pretty a team that would be sub five hundred
Speaker 2: and the afcally above five hundred in the NFC. But
Speaker 2: it is his first year. The kid hasn't seen live
Speaker 2: bullets played from behind Sunday night games. I think a
Speaker 2: realistic expectation is Jets ten wins, Packers eight to nine.
Speaker 2: Feel about right to you.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And he's going to have to have a tough,
Speaker 3: tough makeup because I remember being out on Aaron Rodgers
Speaker 3: Island his first year as a starter in two thousand
Speaker 3: and eight, when there was a lot of skepticism and
Speaker 3: because of my cal ties and the fact that you
Speaker 3: know the blind scorel nut theory, I was right on
Speaker 3: this one and I had to weather that first year
Speaker 3: when he was six and ten. Now, he played really
Speaker 3: well a lot. There were a lot of close games.
Speaker 3: He couldn't pull out. He had some injury stuff, so
Speaker 3: a lot of people were still very very skeptical. After
Speaker 3: eight and nine, he was obviously much much better. And
Speaker 3: then we had that epic playoff game against the Cardinals
Speaker 3: at Curt Order, and you know, I covered that game
Speaker 3: and remember like being pretty sure that we were seeing
Speaker 3: a guy who was going to ascend.
Speaker 2: So I thought the compensation was reasonable. It was mostly
Speaker 2: what we thought, which is, the Packers are either going
Speaker 2: to get a couple of two's or a two and
Speaker 2: a one if Aaron plays. I don't think there's a
Speaker 2: real winner. I guess I guess the winner is the
Speaker 2: team that gets Aaron Rodgers. But I didn't think I
Speaker 2: didn't think the compensation it was sort of what we thought, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I liked it. I thought, you know, it was creative,
Speaker 3: there was some compromise. That swap of thirteen and fifteen
Speaker 3: was a good creative way to change the value. Both teams,
Speaker 3: you know, could have stared down longer, but there was
Speaker 3: good motivation to.
Speaker 1: Get it done.
Speaker 3: I thought, if you're the Packers, then you know you're
Speaker 3: getting rid of them. I thought Brian Gudacus did a
Speaker 3: really nice job. I liked his haul all things considered,
Speaker 3: And if you're Joe Douglass or Robert Salla a, you
Speaker 3: got to have them because you know you're coaching for
Speaker 3: your jobs presum and you know it's all set up
Speaker 3: for that. And b I, you know, I know the
Speaker 3: Jets just wanted some recognition that if he doesn't play
Speaker 3: that second year that they would have given up a lot,
Speaker 3: and now they have at least a little bit of
Speaker 3: protection that way. So I actually thought both gms did
Speaker 3: a really nice job of creatively splitting the difference and
Speaker 3: doing it in a timely manner.
Speaker 2: Give me your prediction on the New York media, which
Speaker 2: can lean ferocious and left. And Aaron Rodgers, who's now
Speaker 2: supporting Robert Kennedy. You know he's the anti vaccine candidate. Like, listen,
Speaker 2: say what you want. There's two different ways to write
Speaker 2: the same story. Do you think it'll be a rough
Speaker 2: first year? What do you think Aaron, who's had some
Speaker 2: rabbit ears? You got the Daily News, The Times, the
Speaker 2: Outspoken Post. There's sports talk radio in New York can
Speaker 2: be brutal, w fa N, wildly entertaining and outspoken. How
Speaker 2: do you think it goes your one.
Speaker 1: That's a great question.
Speaker 3: I would I look at it the same way I
Speaker 3: look at any coach going into that market or anyone
Speaker 3: who's kind of you know, thrown into it. If you win,
Speaker 3: it's gonna be awesome. You know, Eric Mangini was on
Speaker 3: The Sopranos as Mangenius. What he won early Rex Ryan
Speaker 3: was love, you know, through my foot fetish scandal at all,
Speaker 3: it was all good and a lot of ways you
Speaker 3: could keep living off that. If it goes batterly and
Speaker 3: you appear to be defensive or out on a fringe
Speaker 3: or you know, combative, then it's a tougher place to
Speaker 3: have thin skin about it. I don't know that Aaron
Speaker 3: will or whoa Derek has ways to communicate directly. It's
Speaker 3: a different era. But you know, I think if it
Speaker 3: goes well early he will be getting a lot of
Speaker 3: love from those back pages and a lot of the
Speaker 3: you know, potential trigger points will be ah, well, you
Speaker 3: know he's got a different view on the vaccines. But
Speaker 3: you see that pass on third to twelve, you know.
Speaker 3: But right if you know, if it's not going so well,
Speaker 3: then yeah, sure people are going to be looking for
Speaker 3: ways to poking proud and we'll be watching.
Speaker 2: All right, let's bring on John Middlcoff. You know him,
Speaker 2: you love him. He's part of the Volume Podcasting digital network.
Speaker 2: We love having him. Former NFL scout Okay, let's start.
Speaker 2: I thought the first thing that jumped out to me
Speaker 2: is good teams and good gms get value. The Belichick
Speaker 2: gets Christian Gonzales right middle of the first a very
Speaker 2: good corner, and the Eagles got, to me the best
Speaker 2: player I watched in college football at the number nine pick.
Speaker 2: They moved up a spot. I mean, to me, Philadelphia again,
Speaker 2: They've got the culture, they think they have, the coach,
Speaker 2: you know, Fletcher cox Age. I thought Philadelphia got the
Speaker 2: best player, you know, the organization. Well, what were your
Speaker 2: thoughts on that?
Speaker 4: Well, I think, first and foremost, if you remember, several
Speaker 4: years ago, they drafted Jalen Rager instead of Justin Jefferson,
Speaker 4: and it really kind of bit him in the ass, right,
Speaker 4: I mean, Justin Jefferson went on to be one of
Speaker 4: the best players in the league and Jalen Rager is
Speaker 4: not even on their team. I think, I mean, I
Speaker 4: know that they kind of got together as an organization
Speaker 4: and said, why are we out thinking the room. Here,
Speaker 4: take the best players from the best programs. What have
Speaker 4: they done the last couple of years? DeVante Smith Alabama
Speaker 4: Heisman Trophy, Jordan Davis starting defensive tackle at Georgia National Championship.
Speaker 4: Trade for aj Brown, an SEC blue chip guy who's
Speaker 4: dominating Nakobe Dean. They draft, you know, from Georgia in
Speaker 4: the second round. They also, I think one thing, Howie
Speaker 4: and obviously Jeffrey Lewie they know well from the Andy
Speaker 4: year and they've carried it over into their good teams
Speaker 4: with Doug Peterson in this last couple of years. As
Speaker 4: culture is really big, and when you have these veteran
Speaker 4: guys like why do you resign Fletcher Cox and Brandon Graham,
Speaker 4: they're done because they bring a lot to the table, yep.
Speaker 4: And then when you get a situation like this, what's
Speaker 4: this guy going to do? I act like an idiot
Speaker 4: around those two guys. I mean, Brandon Graham stripped Tom
Speaker 4: Brady to win a Super Bowl. He's been in the
Speaker 4: league for twelve thirteen years. Fletcher Cox, you know, is
Speaker 4: an all time great Eagle and while he's you know,
Speaker 4: on the other side of his career, is just an
Speaker 4: SEC guy. The other thing they have now to me
Speaker 4: and in football is different than like AAU. Right, if
Speaker 4: you meet a kid from LA or New York AAU.
Speaker 4: They all play together in basketball, they've all played in football.
Speaker 4: If I'm from LA, I don't know the guy from
Speaker 4: New York or Seattle or Florida.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 4: Besides in college if I play him, Well, the SEC
Speaker 4: guys all know each other, right, and they all kind
Speaker 4: of roll together.
Speaker 5: Well.
Speaker 4: Think about their team Colin DeVante Smith Alabama, Nakobe Dean,
Speaker 4: Jordan Davis, the new Georgia guys, Fletcher Cox SEC guy,
Speaker 4: A J. Brown SEC guy Jalen Hurts. Well, I think
Speaker 4: we think Oklahoma three years, Alabama SEC guy. So their core,
Speaker 4: they all kind of speak the same language in terms
Speaker 4: of that Southern football culture. Obviously they all come from
Speaker 4: elite program, especially the BAM and Georgia guys. It's a
Speaker 4: risky pick. I mean, this guy, I think scared a
Speaker 4: ton of teams as you could see him going to
Speaker 4: nine like that's pretty telling. But I think how he
Speaker 4: feels very good about their infrastructure now with their coaches,
Speaker 4: with their players to kind of operate a lot like
Speaker 4: Belichick used to do for years with Tom and some
Speaker 4: of their core guys where they as it went on,
Speaker 4: they started taking some flyers because they felt really good
Speaker 4: about their main guys. You can't act like an idiot
Speaker 4: when when the top guys you look up to and
Speaker 4: are kind of like, you know, you have a lot
Speaker 4: in common with.
Speaker 1: So I think that was I mean, an easy pick
Speaker 1: for them obviously.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and by the way, for those of you uninitiated,
Speaker 2: John's a former scout. This is the kind of insight
Speaker 2: you get, which I've never heard anybody talk about that.
Speaker 2: But I think you're right on the money. And the
Speaker 2: other thing that jumped out to me is I've said
Speaker 2: with CJ. Stroud, he is a first round quarterback. I
Speaker 2: don't see a ton of juice. He's accurate. Jared Goff
Speaker 2: is a very accurate comp I think he's a little
Speaker 2: better runner than Jared. But you know, there was a
Speaker 2: lot of speculation. I kind of fell for it that
Speaker 2: they would get Jalen Carter or Will Anderson. What did
Speaker 2: you make of the Texans getting Stroud? What did it
Speaker 2: tell you?
Speaker 4: One thing I was I was stunned in the sense
Speaker 4: that they just got a brand new coach who's young
Speaker 4: and I'm A big believer in Demiko. When I was
Speaker 4: with the Eagles, we traded for him as a player
Speaker 4: because of his character and I've you know, lived in
Speaker 4: the bear for a long time, went to the practices.
Speaker 4: Kyle Shanahan swears by the guy. I think he's going
Speaker 4: to be a stud head coach. I mean, he's just
Speaker 4: He's been good at everything he's ever done in his
Speaker 4: entire life. I don't know why it's going to stop little.
Speaker 4: I mean, obviously I understand why the GM in the
Speaker 4: front office and the owner and needs to get a quarterback.
Speaker 4: You look at there, But if you're Demiko, why rush
Speaker 4: into this? You know, I think a lot of people
Speaker 4: in the NFL. He throws a beautiful ball. But when
Speaker 4: you look at Ohio State these last couple of years,
Speaker 4: a lot like Tua when he was Alabama. I mean, Colin,
Speaker 4: you're talking about three or four top fifteen wide receivers
Speaker 4: on their team, not like a couple guys that play
Speaker 4: in the NFL. Right, these are top fifteen picks. Well
Speaker 4: technically in JIGBA twenty, but you know what I mean.
Speaker 4: I mean this is and the speed difference in the
Speaker 4: Big ten relative to even two in the sec that
Speaker 4: the advantage Ohio State has. I do think that Georgia
Speaker 4: game though, because the Jared gofkomp was definitely something that
Speaker 4: kind of kicks stay with it.
Speaker 1: That Georgia game.
Speaker 4: He was run around. He looked like kind of a
Speaker 4: different player. Now, I don't know what your take was,
Speaker 4: but the take of like when he responded to the test.
Speaker 4: I'm not a test taker. I'm a football player. I
Speaker 4: did love that quarterbacks get held to a higher standard. Man,
Speaker 4: you know, I mean you're not playing slot receiver dB
Speaker 4: so I mean Peyton Manning, Tom Brady Lamar He those
Speaker 4: guys don't they don't get defensive over stuff like that.
Speaker 4: But risky move. I actually thought they're moved trading back
Speaker 4: up to get will Anderson, who I liked a lot.
Speaker 4: But holy moly, they gave up a lot to go
Speaker 4: back from twelve to three. Especially, But I guess when
Speaker 4: you're in the court, when you've drafted the quarterback and
Speaker 4: they got all these picks coming from Deshaun Watson, maybe
Speaker 4: they're they're not thinking about Caleb Williams and Drake May anymore.
Speaker 1: Obviously.
Speaker 4: I mean I thought Seattle, you know, I just think Pete,
Speaker 4: you know, a lot of people thought Jalen Carter, he
Speaker 4: takes some swings. They did not mess around with that,
Speaker 4: which I understand everyone I know. And teams that had
Speaker 4: no shot of getting this guy, they loved Witherspoon kind
Speaker 4: of a throwback to you know, some of those teams
Speaker 4: they had with Russell Wilson, those LOB teams absolute just
Speaker 4: m effort stud I mean, big time tackler, can play inside, outside,
Speaker 4: you can move them around, can tackle.
Speaker 2: Seattle's got two two's, a three and two fours. So
Speaker 2: of their three needs, one was Locket Dk. They needed
Speaker 2: another receiver, they needed they wanted another, and they got one.
Speaker 2: I mean he's good, he's awesome when healthy, yep. And
Speaker 2: then they got a wide receiver and then they get
Speaker 2: you know, Jackson Smith Jigba. So they end up getting
Speaker 2: two of their three needs. I think they needed guard
Speaker 2: now and then a later an edge rusher. But I mean,
Speaker 2: if you look at last year's pick on ESPN, they
Speaker 2: put up the last six or seven like great young players.
Speaker 2: I mean they are. They had a run John where
Speaker 2: I think Pete Carroll and Paul Allen passed. They had
Speaker 2: a run where Pete had too much control in the draft,
Speaker 2: and it feels like they've given it back to John
Speaker 2: Snyder and the scouting department. They have not missed on
Speaker 2: a pick.
Speaker 4: With tackles. They got Kenneth Walker. I mean, they got
Speaker 4: a good young nucleus. I mean they they won nine
Speaker 4: games where I'm guilty. I thought they were going to
Speaker 4: be terrible and they were really good. And I think
Speaker 4: they're going to be even better. I mean because they
Speaker 4: got so many young pieces that they're building around.
Speaker 2: Okay, so I think we both agree Seattle did well,
Speaker 2: so Jamiir gives the running back, so people are to
Speaker 2: bang on Detroit's picks. Now. Gibbs is a very dynamic
Speaker 2: and again Alabama big school. You see them run over
Speaker 2: guys and run past guys in the SEC. So you know,
Speaker 2: my takeaway on Detroit is the last two drafts with
Speaker 2: his front office, John, I've really liked him, and so
Speaker 2: part of me thinks to myself with Swift and Gibbs
Speaker 2: as they're trying to take they love their O line. Okay,
Speaker 2: they solve their corner issue a little bit, right, are
Speaker 2: they basically saying is we want to take the pressure
Speaker 2: off Jared goff Or. I mean I was watching them
Speaker 2: high five in the room, like this was not a
Speaker 2: pick they had trepidation over. These guys were high five
Speaker 2: And what did it say to get a running back
Speaker 2: when they have swift because their O line can control
Speaker 2: I think can control a lot of the defensive fronts
Speaker 2: in that division. Is that what they're saying.
Speaker 4: I think in most most drafts, when you see a
Speaker 4: guy that you go, you know, I think it's fair
Speaker 4: to say going into the any draft, a guy like
Speaker 4: him is like an early second, you know, somewhere in
Speaker 4: like thirty two to forty pick. This draft was viewed
Speaker 4: as pretty terrible. Like the difference between pick eight and
Speaker 4: twenty five. You know, you might not be able to
Speaker 4: tell the difference, like Ken Kaid going twenty five to
Speaker 4: the Bills might be no different than the six pick.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 4: So it's just time will tell people were not that
Speaker 4: comp This was not Jamar Chase and the Waddles and
Speaker 4: the Pinasoles and the Michael Parsons. That wasn't this draft.
Speaker 4: So when you go, well, they got to a super
Speaker 4: Bowl with Jared Goff when he had a great running game,
Speaker 4: right with Sean McVay in with La and last year
Speaker 4: Jared Goff statistically was excellent. Well, they had another pick
Speaker 4: and they got a linebackers. Their defense, I mean, I
Speaker 4: think Aiden Hutchinson is going to be a really really
Speaker 4: good player. To me, he's got some whiffs of Joey Bosa.
Speaker 4: I mean, he's got a chance to be a twelve
Speaker 4: fifteen sack guy next year immediately. So if their defense
Speaker 4: is just incrementally better, their offense. I mean, the USC
Speaker 4: wide receiver they have as a stud, like you said,
Speaker 4: their offensive lines of stud. Their coach, while he's an
Speaker 4: offensive because he's a tight end, is really wired more
Speaker 4: like a defensive tackle. I mean, he wants to be
Speaker 4: a tough, physical guy. I'm with you if you love
Speaker 4: this guy, and I'm going to give them the benefit
Speaker 4: of doubt because I watched them last year and they
Speaker 4: were an expressive operation.
Speaker 1: So I think they know the wiring.
Speaker 4: The other thing is Dan Campbell came from Sean Payton,
Speaker 4: you know, over that five or six year run when
Speaker 4: he got fired from Miami and went there became an
Speaker 4: assistant head coach. They had really good drafts during that
Speaker 4: time when the Saints were really good at the end
Speaker 4: of the two thousand, you know, the teams right the
Speaker 4: seventeen eighteen nineteen, So I think he knows the wiring
Speaker 4: of the guys. I remember sometimes the Saints, you'd be like, wow,
Speaker 4: they did that, and then it would work out right.
Speaker 4: So I'm with you. It was a little eye opening
Speaker 4: because you see the second running back come off at twelve.
Speaker 4: But I'm going to give them the benefit of the
Speaker 4: doubt because I know their play style and I know
Speaker 4: what they want to do. The other thing is when's
Speaker 4: the last time a running back from Alabama beside Trent
Speaker 4: Richardson hasn't worked in the NFL. You watch them all
Speaker 4: over the league. They were all successful players well. And
Speaker 4: Jared Goff's history is when Gurley was he he's been
Speaker 4: a really good quarterback. When Jared gets in trouble is
Speaker 4: third and long. Okay, so is Detroit saying we love
Speaker 4: our oc we just don't want to get in third
Speaker 4: and long. You and I know I saw Goff out
Speaker 4: Duel Mahomes when they had Gurley and naked run. Jared
Speaker 4: was getting you to the super Bowl. It's when the
Speaker 4: O line aged and they didn't have a consistent run game.
Speaker 4: Now you leene on Jared Goff and it's not pretty right.
Speaker 4: So I look at Detroit and I think they love
Speaker 4: their OC. They have good young receivers, excellent O line,
Speaker 4: Swift got banged up, and maybe they're just saying, listen,
Speaker 4: we're just gonna do a one two punch and we're
Speaker 4: gonna go. And by the way, in that division, the
Speaker 4: D line for the Vikings, the D line for the Packers,
Speaker 4: the D line for the Bears, are you gonna pick
Speaker 4: them to win the division? You pick Minnesota last year?
Speaker 4: To me, obviously, injuries can happen, but Detroit would be
Speaker 4: my pick as of recording this today to win the North.
Speaker 2: And again, I think, is Detroit looking at that division
Speaker 2: and thinking our O line is significantly better in those
Speaker 2: six games against the D lines in our division? Can
Speaker 2: we go five and one in that division?
Speaker 1: For sure?
Speaker 4: And in a weird way because they haven't even made
Speaker 4: the playoffs, right, But if you assume that they're going
Speaker 4: to be in the mix, the three teams that are
Speaker 4: at the top of the conference, the Eagles, the Niners,
Speaker 4: and Cowboys are all physical teams. So you're getting this
Speaker 4: is not a lightweight fight. You're getting in the ring
Speaker 4: to fight heavyweights, So you have to be willing to
Speaker 4: play like that. And Dan Campbell is now building a
Speaker 4: team who they draft their second pick in the first round,
Speaker 4: a linebacker from Iowa. Right, I mean, they have a
Speaker 4: type of guy that they're looking for to build their team.
Speaker 4: And honestly, that should translate to playing the Cowboys the
Speaker 4: Eagles and just give them a chance. If not in
Speaker 4: twenty three, the next couple of years. Obviously, you know
Speaker 4: Jared Goff is going to be the guy we talk
Speaker 4: about the most, but he's proven if you can do
Speaker 4: it around him and their roster. I liked the lot
Speaker 4: with the Lions have going on a lot, so I
Speaker 4: mean the Will Levice situation. I talk to people that
Speaker 4: I really trust. Their big concern with him was, listen,
Speaker 4: the kid is smart. We know his mom went to
Speaker 4: an I League school Yale. We know he's a four
Speaker 4: point student. Why is his judgment so bad? And what
Speaker 4: I heard was Jay Cutler is that Jay Cutler was
Speaker 4: arrogant and obstinate, and if Jay had a rope, Jay
Speaker 4: had an arm, and if Jay wanted to sling it,
Speaker 4: he didn't give a shit what the coach said. And Jay,
Speaker 4: I'll argue it forever. Jay had one of the best
Speaker 4: arms in the league. When he played, he had an
Speaker 4: absolute host, but Jay was stubborn, rigid, difficult, and people
Speaker 4: worried Will Levi us with the selfies, the gun show,
Speaker 4: look at me the combine. He wore a muscle shirt.
Speaker 4: I had a head coach and a GM told me
Speaker 4: they hated that. I mean, I listen, Brady Quinn works
Speaker 4: at Fox, and I like Brady, but that was one
Speaker 4: of the knocks I heard is that an he can't
Speaker 4: be jacked as a quarterback. You have to be flu
Speaker 4: and you don't see biceps on Aaron Rodgers or Peyton Manning.
Speaker 4: Your take on Will levis dropping.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I mean I think that he was a fascinating player
Speaker 4: coming into the season, and then the season was a disaster,
Speaker 4: and I had people that really like him. They aren't
Speaker 4: necessarily quote unquote decision makers, but are you know, high
Speaker 4: in their organization said if coming out his junior season
Speaker 4: or whatever two years ago, when Liam Cohen, right, the
Speaker 4: Rams guy, was his offensive coordinator, he would have been
Speaker 4: a lock top five pick. Then he goes to Rich Skangarello,
Speaker 4: who a lot of people are down on disastrous season,
Speaker 4: and then, like you said, kind of has a bad offseason,
Speaker 4: the lifting things that you're not playing offensive tackle or lineback,
Speaker 4: No one cares. It's about pliability. It's about fluidity, and
Speaker 4: that's a big knock on his game is fluidity. Touch.
Speaker 4: And we've seen so many guys Brady Quinn Kaepernick got
Speaker 4: really big. Whether you can throw at one hundred and
Speaker 4: twenty miles an hour, If you can't throw a strike,
Speaker 4: who cares, You're not going to make the big leagues, right.
Speaker 4: Touch is a big issue with him. I also think that,
Speaker 4: like Anthony Richardson, who this raw guy was viewed as
Speaker 4: very mouldable. One thing I have heard like when he
Speaker 4: went and met with people, they were just like, you
Speaker 4: know what this guy means?
Speaker 1: Well, like I would love to be around this guy.
Speaker 4: There was a lot of positive vibes around him.
Speaker 2: Very grateful. Like Anthony Richardson wrote a Penda letter, he
Speaker 2: was like humble and grateful. And it's like, John, you
Speaker 2: look at that and you think, Okay, this kid wants
Speaker 2: to learn.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and whether it works out, only time will tell,
Speaker 4: and more than the history would show us it probably won't.
Speaker 4: But I know that a lot of people were down
Speaker 4: on him, and during the process came away the opposite,
Speaker 4: like I'm rooting for this guy. I think this guy
Speaker 4: not crazy to go in the top five. Is the
Speaker 4: ceiling is sky high, and I think will Levis started
Speaker 4: getting more negative and negative. Not like you said anything malicious, right,
Speaker 4: but the buff stuff to the lifting the pictures on
Speaker 4: Instagram within the last month, Like what are we doing?
Speaker 4: You know, it's just I mean, he didn't im he tumbled.
Speaker 4: I mean, this was a guy that I think after
Speaker 4: last season twenty one, when Kentucky had a really good year,
Speaker 4: I don't see how he wouldn't have been a top
Speaker 4: five pick, not with those measurables, right, But then yeah,
Speaker 4: I mean, I clearly the league is very I mean,
Speaker 4: this is a quarterback star of the leak. For no
Speaker 4: one to touch him, it's crazy.
Speaker 5: Colin, how you doing?
Speaker 4: Man?
Speaker 5: What a game? Harrison Barnes with the shot of his life.
Speaker 5: He had a chance to erase all the pain and
Speaker 5: suffering from the twenty sixteen finals that he left it long.
Speaker 2: Well, they needed that Draymond block, They needed the twenty
Speaker 2: two from Jordan Poole. I feel like I'm watching the
Speaker 2: younger Warriors take on the old Warriors. They Stephen Dearin
Speaker 2: get baskets, get great looks when they want, you have enforcers.
Speaker 2: You know what, I watched this tonight in the second half,
Speaker 2: and I'm like, outside of Denver, is this the Western
Speaker 2: Conference Final? Now that the Warriors are full strength, are
Speaker 2: we watching essentially the Western Conference Final? In round one?
Speaker 5: I remember I had a similar thought after the playing games,
Speaker 5: and everyone's like, oh man, the Wolves and the Lakers,
Speaker 5: they're both terrible. What an ugly basketball game. And I
Speaker 5: have like a completely different feeling about this. I think
Speaker 5: all of these teams are awesome. I think the Kings
Speaker 5: are awesome. I think the Warriors are awesome. I think
Speaker 5: the Lakers are awesome. I think the Suns are awesome.
Speaker 5: The Nuggets have been arguably the most impressive team in
Speaker 5: the first round here in the Western Conference, And like, again,
Speaker 5: like what you're seeing here is that it doesn't it's
Speaker 5: a two to seven matchup, and it's a first round matchup.
Speaker 5: But these are two teams from an overall talent standpoint
Speaker 5: that are typically the types of teams that you'd see
Speaker 5: in later playoff rounds. It's they're incredibly evenly matched. I
Speaker 5: want to I want to give a special shout out
Speaker 5: to Deer and Fox because there's this thing that happens.
Speaker 5: And I mean we've even seen the reverse side of
Speaker 5: this with Darius Garland on the Calves this year, as
Speaker 5: he's really really struggled to just be constantly effective throughout
Speaker 5: the series. Every time we see a young player kind
Speaker 5: of rise up the echelons of the NBA, there's always
Speaker 5: this question like is his game gonna work when they
Speaker 5: get to the playoffs, and some guys struggle to get separations,
Speaker 5: some guys struggle in the physicality, Like Trey Young had
Speaker 5: a really good game in Game three against Boston. That's
Speaker 5: the outlier. He's had like six straight playoff stinkers before that.
Speaker 5: You know what I mean. Darren Fox, his game translates
Speaker 5: so well to this level. And I actually think you'll
Speaker 5: find this interesting, Colin, because you've been super critical of
Speaker 5: this type of player, right, this ultra athletic point guard
Speaker 5: that is this unbelievable downhill force that plays with passion
Speaker 5: and energy. That player has failed time and time and
Speaker 5: time again in NBA history. And the thing that separates,
Speaker 5: in my opinion, Darren Fox from the others is he
Speaker 5: legitimately has outrageously good shooting touch from everywhere on the floor,
Speaker 5: and so whoever's guarding him like to give a certain
Speaker 5: amount of space, just just an attempt to contain the
Speaker 5: drives and so and when he and he's deadly on
Speaker 5: those shots.
Speaker 4: Well.
Speaker 2: And also Westbrook and Wall especially, they didn't play with
Speaker 2: a ton of self awareness in their prime. They were
Speaker 2: going a thousand miles an hour. Dearen pays with plays
Speaker 2: with really good pacing. He knows when to slow it up.
Speaker 2: I mean, you look like you're watching a twelve year
Speaker 2: veteran like he knows when to speed it up. Steph
Speaker 2: does this? You know when? When do you know he'll
Speaker 2: He'll go right through traffic. He's trying to speed the
Speaker 2: tempo up, and it's not really to get a shot.
Speaker 2: It's just kind of to see if he can find
Speaker 2: a little crevice and get to the basket. If he can't,
Speaker 2: then he pulls it up and waits for the bigs
Speaker 2: to come down. Dearan's got a real understanding of pace
Speaker 2: and tempo. He's not playing with his head down everything,
Speaker 2: you know. It's like Patrick Mahomes. He sees the field,
Speaker 2: he sees the court, he sees everybody. Darren Fox is
Speaker 2: really smart. And he plays like a really smart basketball player.
Speaker 2: Steph Curry's really smart. Some of this is just guys
Speaker 2: Deer and also not that he's not vertical, but he's
Speaker 2: kind of uh he's I would I would, you know,
Speaker 2: if I was a scout, I'd say smooth, smart, beautiful
Speaker 2: offensive game. It's gorgeous. I mean, mid range outside, everything
Speaker 2: is pretty. So I don't really put him in that
Speaker 2: I you know, and I feel like he's he's a
Speaker 2: little bit like Steph. Probably I trust Deer and Moore
Speaker 2: in a mid range Steph on a three, but I
Speaker 2: think their games are so much about manipulating pace and tempo.
Speaker 2: John Wall never did. John was just get me the
Speaker 2: ball and I'm gonna race everybody down the floor. And
Speaker 2: the wings are like, bro, hold up, I can't keep
Speaker 2: up with you. And Westbrook has a little bit of that.
Speaker 2: It's a one hundred mile an hour fastball. It's the
Speaker 2: quarterback that has a fastball.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 2: He throws it on the deep post, he throws it
Speaker 2: on the screen. It's it's a one tempo thrower. And
Speaker 2: so I dearon Is, I think he's an all timer.
Speaker 2: I think next year he'll be I think, right now
Speaker 2: he feels like a top ten player, maybe ten, But
Speaker 2: I think if they get past the Warriors, he's going
Speaker 2: to be a top ten player, because I feel like
Speaker 2: he's just twelve ish. And then you're watching them in
Speaker 2: this series, you're like, I mean, if I told you
Speaker 2: today John Morant or him, I'd take dearon Fox.
Speaker 5: He's been great in every game. This is an out
Speaker 5: every gaming defense in a high stakes playoff series where
Speaker 5: he came in as the underdog, and he's been great
Speaker 5: in every game like he I mean, look like people
Speaker 5: always get a little freaked out when we start to
Speaker 5: talk about lists because you feel bad about bumping guys.
Speaker 5: But I mean, here's the deal. Like he's he is
Speaker 5: performing at this level against this type of defense, at
Speaker 5: a higher level than most of the players around the league.
Speaker 5: I think that's completely reasonable. I think, you know, it's funny.
Speaker 5: Over the course of the series, I've been talking a
Speaker 5: lot about how the Kings have no answer for Steph Curry,
Speaker 5: and that's a big part of why I have it.
Speaker 5: I've been yet to relinquish my stance at the will
Speaker 5: win this series, and I still feel that way I
Speaker 5: picked them in six. I'm gonna stick with that for
Speaker 5: right now. But like the reality is is like the
Speaker 5: Kings should feel really good about their chances because the
Speaker 5: same thing is in reverse like they I did think
Speaker 5: it was interesting that we didn't see as much Gary
Speaker 5: Payton today. They spent a lot of time with Draymond
Speaker 5: Green on Deer and Fox today, which is a super
Speaker 5: interesting adjustment. Yes, oh yeah, so just what a again?
Speaker 5: What a what an amazing luxury as a coach to
Speaker 5: be able to do that, And they did a similar
Speaker 5: thing last year in the finals if you remember when
Speaker 5: they moved Draymond Green out onto Jlen Brown because he can.
Speaker 5: Just the thing with Draymond is he has these obnoxiously
Speaker 5: long alarms. First of all, his defensive performance down the
Speaker 5: stretch of this game was so ridiculous, And there was
Speaker 5: a lot of talk over the last couple of days, Oh,
Speaker 5: the Warriors better without Draymond, which everyone just gets dumber
Speaker 5: whenever that happens. They were eleven points better per one
Speaker 5: hundred possessions with him than without him in last year's postseason.
Speaker 5: They were fourteen points better with him than without him
Speaker 5: in this regular season. Like that, that argument is dead
Speaker 5: on arrival. I can't believe it ever even gets brought up.
Speaker 5: He blew up some plays around the rim. You're thinking
Speaker 5: of the block, Oh my god, Bonus, you get another play.
Speaker 5: So Bonus is coming down the floor in a short role.
Speaker 5: It's a two on one. Harrison Barnes is standing wide
Speaker 5: open in the dunker spot ready to go up and
Speaker 5: dunk it, and Sa Bonus goes to pass it to
Speaker 5: Harrison Barnes and Draymond just pokes it out of Sabonis's hands.
Speaker 5: He blew up a two on one that's a basket
Speaker 5: ninety five percent of the time in the NBA like
Speaker 5: he was. He was unbelievable defensively in this game. But
Speaker 5: even with him, he has to give a little bit
Speaker 5: of ground to de Aaron Fox to try to contain
Speaker 5: this drive in on that final shot, the one that
Speaker 5: d'eren made that brought it back to one, like you
Speaker 5: got a great contest on it. But that's what great
Speaker 5: players do, and Darreon Fox has done that this entire series.
Speaker 5: He can adjust his release based on where he is
Speaker 5: on the floor and he can knock these shots down well.
Speaker 2: And also Dramon's got really good hands. Klay Thompson's are Okay, Wiggins.
Speaker 2: I think I've really noticed it with Wiggins. He doesn't
Speaker 2: quite have his wind yet and his hands. Sometimes when
Speaker 2: you don't have your wind, you can lose your legs
Speaker 2: where you get sloppy. Wiggins today had four or five
Speaker 2: that he just couldn't secure. For a guy that's not
Speaker 2: a great shooter, Draymond's got strong hands and good hands.
Speaker 2: Like he touches it, he gets it his timing. There's
Speaker 2: certain players in the league that and because you know
Speaker 2: I employed Draymond one of his many employers, by the way,
Speaker 2: talented guy, you know people are going to, you know, say, Colin,
Speaker 2: you have a bias. First of all, I've said this
Speaker 2: a thousand times in my career. Every great team of
Speaker 2: my life has them for the heat, Rodman for the Bulls,
Speaker 2: Derek Rick Fox for the Lakers, Lambert for the Pistons,
Speaker 2: Draymond Green, all great dynasties, Bruce Bowen for the Spurs.
Speaker 2: Have a feisty, annoying, tough guy and his job. He's
Speaker 2: in the league because he's smart enough to know. I mean,
Speaker 2: Bruce Bowen scored, he could score twenty a game in
Speaker 2: the league. He's like not I knew on this team.
Speaker 2: My way in the league to rings was to play
Speaker 2: the way I had to play, do the stuff that
Speaker 2: nobody else wanted to do. If you don't get Draymond Green,
Speaker 2: like if you don't understand, have you ever noticed out
Speaker 2: around outside the arc they bring him up. They want
Speaker 2: him to have the ball in his hands, him to
Speaker 2: set the screen, him to make the pass. Like that
Speaker 2: organization puts him in the crosshairs. You make a mistake
Speaker 2: out there, it's a layuper a dunk the other way, like,
Speaker 2: this organization has so much trust for Draymon. With the
Speaker 2: basketball in his hands, we think of him defensively, but
Speaker 2: as you watch him Jason, he's such a catalyst, his passing,
Speaker 2: his screening, his hands. If you don't people that don't
Speaker 2: get him, you don't get the game. Like anybody know.
Speaker 2: Everybody knows that Darren Fox and stuff are great. That
Speaker 2: doesn't take you know you're watching Jalen Brunson, He's obviously
Speaker 2: it's such a unique fun player. Guys like Draymon like
Speaker 2: they just don't. Sometimes I watch Draymond and I think
Speaker 2: he should open a clinic on how to make the
Speaker 2: NBA as a star in average eight, a game like
Speaker 2: he does so many things that you don't think they
Speaker 2: like screening, passing, He does so many little things well
Speaker 2: that you don't necessarily like, you don't get points in
Speaker 2: a box score for screening or those little he'll screen
Speaker 2: those little touch passes that don't get the assist, but
Speaker 2: they're the pass before the assist, the incubator of it. Like,
Speaker 2: he doesn't get a lot of credit for that, but
Speaker 2: he was so big late today to your point.
Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, it's funny because a lot of people
Speaker 5: have been comparing him in Dylan Brooks, which drives me crazy.
Speaker 5: They'll be like, oh, they both make the Oh I've
Speaker 5: never seen Draymond Green shove a cameraman just to be
Speaker 5: a jerk. Okay, Like there's there's a different there's a
Speaker 5: difference between like like just being a jerk and being
Speaker 5: a guy who's kind of a physical instigator. There's no
Speaker 5: doubt that Draymond's a physical instigator and Dylan Boroks is
Speaker 5: that a and Moore And the other thing too, is
Speaker 5: like Dylan Brooks is a bad is a limited offensive
Speaker 5: player from a skill standpoint that doesn't get it. And
Speaker 5: we'll take eleven shots in a quarter and in a
Speaker 5: road playoff game in Los Angeles, and you're like, dude,
Speaker 5: what the hell are you doing? Like, Raymond has his
Speaker 5: offensive limitations, but he understands his role. And I love
Speaker 5: how you pointed out all those whole things because it's
Speaker 5: you're right. They love to have the ball in his hands.
Speaker 5: They've been running a ton of Steph high pick and
Speaker 5: roll as this series has progressed, Like there was a
Speaker 5: play at the end of this game where Andrew Wiggins
Speaker 5: made a floater. Steph runs the high pick and roll,
Speaker 5: they trap him, he makes the drop off pass to Draymond.
Speaker 5: He's rolling down the basket. Looney and Wiggins kind of
Speaker 5: mess up. They both cut, and you never want to
Speaker 5: both cut because now you're getting in each other's way.
Speaker 5: It's better for one guy to cut, one guy to
Speaker 5: stay at the three point line. And Draymond like hangs
Speaker 5: in the air and just waits barely for Wiggins to
Speaker 5: kind of break open and hits him in stride, and
Speaker 5: Wiggins makes the floater, and I'm like, man, that was
Speaker 5: kind of an impressive play in traffic in the short role.
Speaker 5: They like having the ball in his hands. He can
Speaker 5: disrupt guys below the rim. Defensively, he can disrupt guys
Speaker 5: above the rim. Defensively. Tap out rebounds is a big one.
Speaker 5: There'll be like a ball in the air and he
Speaker 5: knows he can't go get it, but he'll just run
Speaker 5: up and just tap at it and just keep it alive.
Speaker 2: So I kind of feel like Sacramento almost ended the Dynasty,
Speaker 2: and I think they're gonna look at that film on
Speaker 2: the way home and they're gonna think, we just gave
Speaker 2: one away. We just gave a game away. They outplayed
Speaker 2: Golden State early, too many turnovers. They're a tough out man.
Speaker 2: They are the Baby Warriors. They are a tough out
Speaker 2: and they're really smart. As I said at the start
Speaker 2: of this, I just feel like they need another shooter
Speaker 2: and they'll probably get that in the draft or you know,
Speaker 2: somewhere in free agency.
Speaker 5: I actually think if they upgrade the Sabonus position at
Speaker 5: any point, they could be super dangerous because like the
Speaker 5: unsung heroes of this series have been well, I say unsung,
Speaker 5: the real heroes of this series have been Malik, Bunk
Speaker 5: and Deer and Fox and the simple fact that nobody
Speaker 5: can played well. Malik's been good in this whole series.
Speaker 5: And it's funny because the Lakers couldn't afford to keep him.
Speaker 5: But that's the only reason he's not a Laker right now.
Speaker 5: He was one of the rare bright spots last year,
Speaker 5: just an excellent shot creator that can beat people off
Speaker 5: the dribble and knock down threes. He just played so
Speaker 5: well that the Lakers were financially incapable of retaining him.
Speaker 5: You know, it's funny. I actually think the Warrior are
Speaker 5: the Kings deserve to be slight favorites right now. They've
Speaker 5: played well enough, and they have two games at home.
Speaker 5: It's pretty simple that said. These games are going to
Speaker 5: reach a fever pitch of intensity and drama and stakes,
Speaker 5: and so I still lean I still lean Warriors just
Speaker 5: because they've There's look, if it's Game five and it's
Speaker 5: one hundred to one hundred with three minutes left, there's
Speaker 5: no doubt that the Warriors will be more comfortable in
Speaker 5: that situation, simply because they right in those situations before.
Speaker 5: The same goes for a game seven. Again, the Kings
Speaker 5: should I bet you they were positive in the locker room.
Speaker 5: I bet you they feel good in their film session.
Speaker 5: They should feel confident. But I think these games are
Speaker 5: going to get even more sweaty palms, even more high drama,
Speaker 5: and I just trust the.
Speaker 1: Warriors a little bit more.
Speaker 5: What was your take on that Lakers blowout of the
Speaker 5: Grizzlies yesterday. Do you think it's Do you think the
Speaker 5: real matchup is more like the first quarter or more
Speaker 5: like the last three quarters?
Speaker 2: Well, I think the Lakers. I think we both chose
Speaker 2: the Lakers. I think they're better. I always felt there
Speaker 2: was two things that were true about Memphis. They were
Speaker 2: they're deep, and they're inexperienced. And I'm not saying depth
Speaker 2: and experience are everything, but it's they feel like they
Speaker 2: need another score. To me, you know, jaw was sensational,
Speaker 2: but I just feel like they need another dependable score.
Speaker 2: I mean, you really don't want somebody scoring forty five
Speaker 2: points in a playoff game. You really don't. I mean
Speaker 2: that's just I mean, everybody's in awe of Jamran. It's like,
Speaker 2: you know, you can go back to the Kobe stats,
Speaker 2: like the Lakers were awful when he scored over thirty
Speaker 2: five points, right, and so you know, Jos starts playing well,
Speaker 2: he plays downhill and it's fun, it's magical. But I
Speaker 2: just I never I mean, listen, they were a two seed,
Speaker 2: the Lakers were seven, and I feel it was you know,
Speaker 2: I sit on the air, I said, if I say
Speaker 2: it on the air, I believe it. I'm like, I
Speaker 2: think the Lakers are gonna win the series. They were
Speaker 2: a forty three win team, right, one's the left to
Speaker 2: a forty three wins seven seed. You take them over
Speaker 2: a two seed confident, and Memphis is one of the Yeah,
Speaker 2: and Memphis is one of the best home teams in
Speaker 2: the league. So I just don't. I don't feel and
Speaker 2: we're seeing it with Cleveland, by the way, you know,
Speaker 2: you really young have some depth, but Garland and Mitchell.
Speaker 2: I mean, the Knicks aren't even getting a good series
Speaker 2: from Julius Randall. He's not playing well. And so I
Speaker 2: just don't feel like I think Sacramento regardless of I
Speaker 2: think Sacramento is really close to being a championship team,
Speaker 2: like a player away.
Speaker 1: I don't.
Speaker 2: With Memphis, I don't always love. I feel they're at
Speaker 2: a little less mature than Sacramento, a little chippier, a
Speaker 2: little less self awareness. Their stars had some problems. The
Speaker 2: King Star is like Steph mature. So it's not that
Speaker 2: I don't buying a Memphis, but I really never bought
Speaker 2: into them as a championship team. I really don't. In fact,
Speaker 2: if you told me the two really young teams in
Speaker 2: the NBA, I like I would say, it's Sacramento in Cleveland.
Speaker 2: Cleveland's been disappointing, like these playoffs, basically, Jason, nothing surprised
Speaker 2: us except Cleveland. I mean, that's the only series where
Speaker 2: if you'd have told anybody, yeah, Julius Randall, good game one,
Speaker 2: doesn't do anything and they lead three to one, that
Speaker 2: would be a surprise. I think almost everything we're seeing,
Speaker 2: including the Lakers Grizzlies, we all kind of expected. We
Speaker 2: trusted Lebron in ad over the last three weeks. They
Speaker 2: just won a lot of close games, and they won
Speaker 2: a lot of games against for the same reason they're
Speaker 2: winning this one.
Speaker 5: I'm glad you said that about Memphis because I actually agree.
Speaker 5: I don't think they're close either. A couple things, the
Speaker 5: only position I think that they have really the only
Speaker 5: spots that I feel really good about, like really good
Speaker 5: about our Jared Jackson in jaw Desmond Baine has been
Speaker 5: bad in almost every playoff game that he's played, especially
Speaker 5: over the last couple of years. He struggles mightily to
Speaker 5: create his own shot off the dribble, and guys are
Speaker 5: good at chasing him over those screens to lessen the
Speaker 5: quality of the shots, and he can't make it. Like
Speaker 5: Austin Reeves has soundly outplayed him in this series, you
Speaker 5: know what I mean. The Grizzlies have severe limitations in
Speaker 5: shot creation and off ball offensive skill. I was talking
Speaker 5: with a buddy yesterday about this, Like what scares me
Speaker 5: for the Lakers is they can get lazy. And you
Speaker 5: saw that, Like I tweeted right after the first quarter yesterday,
Speaker 5: I'm like, just get ready for them to do the
Speaker 5: bare minimum to try to win this game.
Speaker 1: You know, like the whole game.
Speaker 5: The whole game, it was like, oh, they got back
Speaker 5: to eleven, I guess we should start trying again. I
Speaker 5: get it up to sixteen, seventeen, and then they'd have
Speaker 5: three bad possessions in a row and to be a
Speaker 5: ten and we're like, all right, call time out. All right,
Speaker 5: let's go get control of this game again. Like I
Speaker 5: think the Lakers are so much better than the Grizzlies.
Speaker 5: I think that people are. But to your point about
Speaker 5: the arrogance, the way Jaw was acting in that fourth quarter, like, Oh,
Speaker 5: I've got these guys like I'm like, they're not even
Speaker 5: playing anymore. They're jogging back in transition. They're barely guarding you.
Speaker 5: In the first quarter, you couldn't even get a clean look.
Speaker 5: He shot two for ten on two point shots before
Speaker 5: the fourth quarter, like they they have figured out the
Speaker 5: job pick and roll because Jared Vanderbilt and Anthony Davis
Speaker 5: have taken away his floater and they've shut off the
Speaker 5: rig on him. They've they've they've kind of figured that out. Memphis,
Speaker 5: to me, so has so far to go. But with
Speaker 5: the Lakers in their lapses in execution and effort, what
Speaker 5: freaks me out for them? There is Sacramento in Golden
Speaker 5: State because Memphis is a young athletic team that loves
Speaker 5: to play fast, but they're unskilled, like remarkably unskilled compared
Speaker 5: to other NBA teams. Yep, Sacramento and Golden State love
Speaker 5: to play fast and they are super skilled like at
Speaker 5: every position. So like they will those teams if they
Speaker 5: have those same brief lapses in judgment and effort in execute,
Speaker 5: the Lakers will get run off the floor by the
Speaker 5: Warriors and Kings, so like it's good, it's weird. I
Speaker 5: feel so confident that the Lakers are going to beat
Speaker 5: the Grizzlies, but I am so hesitant to pick them
Speaker 5: as a team that can make a real run because
Speaker 5: they just had to. It is part of their identity.
Speaker 5: As soon as they start to feel even remotely comfortable,
Speaker 5: Lebron and Anthony Davis go, how can I start conserving energy?
Speaker 5: And it's going to be something that gets them beat?
Speaker 5: I think, yeah.
Speaker 2: I mean, I also think that the question we asked
Speaker 2: about Memphis all year because John is not a great shooter.
Speaker 2: He's a great athlete. He's got the floater, he finishes
Speaker 2: at the rim. If you take the rim away, you
Speaker 2: take a chunk of his field goal. I mean, it's
Speaker 2: it's the Westbrook. He's a better shooter than Westbrook. But
Speaker 2: if you took the rim away from Russell Westbrook, he
Speaker 2: can have really bad nights and it gets into his
Speaker 2: head really fast. Even great shooters. I mean, Lebron for
Speaker 2: a big chunk of his career, like didn't like bigs
Speaker 2: around the basket because if he lost confidence in his three,
Speaker 2: he could always beat guys off the dribble score and
Speaker 2: get back into it. Lebrono was like, liked his bosh
Speaker 2: and his Kevin loves you. Stay clear. I didn't get
Speaker 2: this point in his career. He shoots threes, makes the misses,
Speaker 2: nothing's in his head. He's kind of graduated last couple
Speaker 2: of years. But Jaw's not a great natural shooter. So
Speaker 2: if he's not hitting the three and the rims closed off,
Speaker 2: you're not beating people on floaters and mid range jumpers.
Speaker 2: And so I think when I look at this team
Speaker 2: all year, my takeaway was, well, if you shut Jaw
Speaker 2: down a little bit and make him shoot forty one percent,
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