1 00:00:04,840 --> 00:00:09,160 Speaker 1: Welcome to Possible Now Stories of Possibilities, the podcast where 2 00:00:09,160 --> 00:00:13,200 Speaker 1: we dive into the leadership frameworks, bold ideas and personal 3 00:00:13,240 --> 00:00:19,400 Speaker 1: stories shaping the future of marketing, technology and leadership. Welcome 4 00:00:19,400 --> 00:00:22,279 Speaker 1: back to Possible Now. I'm Christian Much and today we 5 00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:25,400 Speaker 1: are not just talking about marketing or music. We're also 6 00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:28,880 Speaker 1: talking about power, who holds it, who shares it, and 7 00:00:28,960 --> 00:00:32,920 Speaker 1: how culture decides where it flows. Next, my wonderful guest 8 00:00:32,920 --> 00:00:35,280 Speaker 1: today is someone who has built his career at the 9 00:00:35,320 --> 00:00:40,520 Speaker 1: intersection of creativity and accountability. Chose Bons is the chief 10 00:00:40,600 --> 00:00:44,920 Speaker 1: marketing officer of both Translation, the creative agency that taught 11 00:00:45,000 --> 00:00:48,599 Speaker 1: brands how to stop renting culture and start earning it, 12 00:00:49,040 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 1: and United Masters, the artist's platform redefining ownership in the 13 00:00:53,159 --> 00:00:57,800 Speaker 1: music industry. He's an architect of context strategy, a discipline 14 00:00:58,040 --> 00:01:01,080 Speaker 1: that forces brands to meet culture where it is not 15 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:05,080 Speaker 1: where it's convenient. He is a musician turned marketer, a 16 00:01:05,120 --> 00:01:09,080 Speaker 1: strategist turned activist, and a leader who says his mission 17 00:01:09,160 --> 00:01:12,560 Speaker 1: is to make strong morals the new normal. If you've 18 00:01:12,600 --> 00:01:16,120 Speaker 1: ever wondered what it takes to navigate cultural spaces without 19 00:01:16,240 --> 00:01:19,760 Speaker 1: exploring them, or how to build structural equity into the 20 00:01:19,840 --> 00:01:23,560 Speaker 1: DNA of business. This is your episode. Let's get into it. 21 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:27,520 Speaker 1: I'm super excited to welcome Chose Barns shall so welcome. 22 00:01:27,800 --> 00:01:31,440 Speaker 2: I'm flattered to be here, flatter to be here. Let's 23 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:31,800 Speaker 2: do it. 24 00:01:32,319 --> 00:01:35,560 Speaker 1: I'm really excited about our conversations. So let's kick off 25 00:01:35,600 --> 00:01:38,920 Speaker 1: with something. You know where you come from. Before you 26 00:01:39,000 --> 00:01:44,240 Speaker 1: were CMO across two worlds, the agency and the artist's platform, 27 00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:48,440 Speaker 1: you were a musician learning how culture actually moves right. Yeah, 28 00:01:48,560 --> 00:01:52,000 Speaker 1: tell us about your identity as a creator, how it 29 00:01:52,120 --> 00:01:55,160 Speaker 1: shaped your past so far, and how this ended up 30 00:01:55,200 --> 00:01:58,000 Speaker 1: to become the seamore of translation in the United Masters. 31 00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:00,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm happy to My journey began. Its actually where 32 00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:03,160 Speaker 2: I am right now, Greensboro, North Carolina. I'm and my 33 00:02:03,200 --> 00:02:05,240 Speaker 2: mom's house. You see all the books behind me here. 34 00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:09,799 Speaker 2: And I was raised in a family full of professors. 35 00:02:09,880 --> 00:02:13,800 Speaker 2: I went to college. I studied philosophy, and while in college, 36 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:18,160 Speaker 2: I started to MC with an existing jazz trio. And 37 00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:20,320 Speaker 2: so we put together this little songbook and we play 38 00:02:20,400 --> 00:02:24,240 Speaker 2: little dates and whatnot, a little tours around. We'd go 39 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:26,280 Speaker 2: play a jazz society and then we'd go play a 40 00:02:26,280 --> 00:02:29,160 Speaker 2: frat party afterward. We did that all around the Northeast, 41 00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 2: and then I graduated and it turns out there were 42 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:36,800 Speaker 2: no job openings for rapper or for philosopher. So I 43 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:38,880 Speaker 2: was like, all right, well, I guess I'll just stick 44 00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:42,000 Speaker 2: with the one I think is cool. And I decided 45 00:02:42,040 --> 00:02:45,440 Speaker 2: I wanted to just continue to use music to see 46 00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:48,000 Speaker 2: what else was out there. And luckily I had a 47 00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:51,560 Speaker 2: partner at that time, my music director. He basically wrote 48 00:02:51,600 --> 00:02:53,320 Speaker 2: all the music and I wrote all the words, and 49 00:02:53,440 --> 00:02:57,080 Speaker 2: he was in a similar position, and so we flipped 50 00:02:57,080 --> 00:03:00,960 Speaker 2: a coin between Portland, Oregon and Seattle, Washington and landed 51 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:02,760 Speaker 2: in Portland, and we got up and we moved to 52 00:03:02,800 --> 00:03:05,400 Speaker 2: Portland to just see what was out there. We were 53 00:03:05,440 --> 00:03:09,560 Speaker 2: both from the Bend Atlantic. When we got there, we 54 00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:11,720 Speaker 2: both got some day jobs and we rebuilt the band 55 00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:16,920 Speaker 2: and it was my very first truly entrepreneurial pursuit. Right. 56 00:03:17,000 --> 00:03:20,560 Speaker 2: You got to figure out, Okay, what is your duty 57 00:03:20,680 --> 00:03:22,639 Speaker 2: to pay for? What is my due you pay for? 58 00:03:22,840 --> 00:03:24,640 Speaker 2: How are we going to do these logistics when we 59 00:03:25,040 --> 00:03:26,720 Speaker 2: bring in a rhythm section, how are we going to 60 00:03:26,760 --> 00:03:29,040 Speaker 2: cut that in, how are we going to run these flyers? 61 00:03:29,040 --> 00:03:32,680 Speaker 2: What's more important? And so you know everything that goes 62 00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:35,040 Speaker 2: into making a marketing budget and making a product budget 63 00:03:35,160 --> 00:03:37,840 Speaker 2: and all of that. That was my kind of early 64 00:03:38,040 --> 00:03:42,760 Speaker 2: mister Miyagi style montage thereof. And the product got pretty good, 65 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:46,000 Speaker 2: and so at a certain point I wanted to record 66 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:48,880 Speaker 2: a music video. And I had found this interesting space, 67 00:03:48,960 --> 00:03:52,120 Speaker 2: kind of a gallery shaped space and the Pearl District 68 00:03:52,160 --> 00:03:55,440 Speaker 2: in Portland, and it turned out to be the global 69 00:03:55,480 --> 00:03:59,120 Speaker 2: headquarters of Widen and Kennedy. I don't know, huh, I 70 00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:01,040 Speaker 2: didn't know. I had big, cool doors and there was 71 00:04:01,080 --> 00:04:03,000 Speaker 2: somebody's name on the door, and I knew it was 72 00:04:03,040 --> 00:04:04,920 Speaker 2: some kind of business. But when you go inside and 73 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:07,480 Speaker 2: you don't you haven't been a part of big agency world. 74 00:04:07,600 --> 00:04:09,120 Speaker 2: You get inside and you're like, maybe this is a 75 00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:12,920 Speaker 2: craft mall, Like I don't know what this is. I 76 00:04:13,000 --> 00:04:14,960 Speaker 2: just know it would make a cool backdrop for a video. 77 00:04:16,200 --> 00:04:19,880 Speaker 2: And I met Dan Widen, and Dan Widen took an 78 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:23,360 Speaker 2: hour and some change meeting with me, in which we 79 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:26,800 Speaker 2: talked about the humanities, and we talked about boxing, we 80 00:04:26,839 --> 00:04:30,000 Speaker 2: talked about sport, and we talked about Naomi Klein, who 81 00:04:30,040 --> 00:04:31,960 Speaker 2: had written a book where she talked about him really 82 00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:34,159 Speaker 2: really poorly that I was a big fan of called 83 00:04:34,200 --> 00:04:37,240 Speaker 2: no Logo and at the end of it, I played 84 00:04:37,279 --> 00:04:39,359 Speaker 2: him a record and he listened to the record and 85 00:04:39,400 --> 00:04:41,279 Speaker 2: he said, well, hell kid, if you can do that, 86 00:04:41,320 --> 00:04:43,320 Speaker 2: you can write nike Y D. And he took me 87 00:04:43,360 --> 00:04:45,800 Speaker 2: outside and he introduced me to Mel Myers, who was 88 00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:50,080 Speaker 2: his head of creative recruitment at the time. And that's 89 00:04:50,080 --> 00:04:51,480 Speaker 2: how I wound up an agency land. 90 00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:54,520 Speaker 1: So he's saying, you never met him before, but in 91 00:04:54,560 --> 00:04:56,159 Speaker 1: the very first meeting he offered you a job. 92 00:04:56,960 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 2: It didn't offer me a job. He said I could 93 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:02,279 Speaker 2: and then he entered reduced me to somebody. It's actually 94 00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:06,360 Speaker 2: a labyrinthine journey for over five months to actually get 95 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:08,080 Speaker 2: a job. And by the way, I didn't start as 96 00:05:08,120 --> 00:05:10,919 Speaker 2: a copywriter. I started as a media planner and I 97 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:14,080 Speaker 2: was just around the building so much. And then once 98 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:15,960 Speaker 2: I was on the radar, they looked around and they 99 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:17,599 Speaker 2: were like, Oh, that's the kid that's opening for the 100 00:05:17,640 --> 00:05:20,200 Speaker 2: roots at the Crystal Ballroom. That's the kid I see 101 00:05:20,240 --> 00:05:23,440 Speaker 2: him on posters now. And so when Converts came into 102 00:05:23,480 --> 00:05:25,760 Speaker 2: building on the media side, on the media planning and 103 00:05:25,760 --> 00:05:29,000 Speaker 2: buying side, the media director called me up and said, hey, 104 00:05:29,200 --> 00:05:30,920 Speaker 2: I know you don't know anything about media, but I'm 105 00:05:30,920 --> 00:05:34,640 Speaker 2: willing to teach you because you're the target of this media, 106 00:05:35,279 --> 00:05:37,680 Speaker 2: and if I teach you the grammar of the business, 107 00:05:38,000 --> 00:05:40,280 Speaker 2: I'm confident that you'll be really good at this. Certainly 108 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:40,960 Speaker 2: on this account. 109 00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 1: The music you did was rep you said, right, yeah, 110 00:05:44,920 --> 00:05:47,200 Speaker 1: it was a band or it was a it was 111 00:05:47,240 --> 00:05:47,640 Speaker 1: a band. 112 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:51,080 Speaker 2: Organic hip hop project. So it was guitar led, guitar, drums, 113 00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:53,880 Speaker 2: bass keys as a full set, and then we would 114 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:57,039 Speaker 2: build up a horn section at certain points, but that 115 00:05:57,160 --> 00:05:59,760 Speaker 2: was the base set of five piece organic jazz. 116 00:06:02,760 --> 00:06:04,760 Speaker 1: That's a great story. I'm sure you're still into this, 117 00:06:05,320 --> 00:06:07,200 Speaker 1: so good to know. For the future. Maybe you can 118 00:06:07,279 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 1: do something together. 119 00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:11,760 Speaker 2: I don't perform anymore. I'm I'm forty five. I left 120 00:06:11,800 --> 00:06:14,240 Speaker 2: that to okay, okay, okay, but I know a guy 121 00:06:14,560 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 2: or two. Okay. 122 00:06:16,400 --> 00:06:19,200 Speaker 1: You mentioned Widen Kennedy and how you met. You said 123 00:06:19,320 --> 00:06:21,800 Speaker 1: in a recent interview article, your mission is to make 124 00:06:21,839 --> 00:06:25,120 Speaker 1: strong more than your normal. In your early years with 125 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:28,239 Speaker 1: these agencies Widen Kennedy and there was the Modern agency 126 00:06:28,240 --> 00:06:30,840 Speaker 1: as well. You saw that the machine from inside and 127 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:35,480 Speaker 1: what convinced you that marketing needed a new moral compass. 128 00:06:35,960 --> 00:06:39,200 Speaker 2: Well, I think it's less about a moral compass for 129 00:06:39,920 --> 00:06:42,520 Speaker 2: marketing per se. I think it's about leveraging the marketing 130 00:06:42,600 --> 00:06:47,920 Speaker 2: discipline because it drives cultural wake, it drives collective action, 131 00:06:48,880 --> 00:06:52,360 Speaker 2: and advertising as an industry is one of the final 132 00:06:52,440 --> 00:06:56,800 Speaker 2: bastions of non user initiated content. Right, it's the only 133 00:06:56,839 --> 00:06:59,680 Speaker 2: content that comes chasing after you. And whether it be 134 00:07:00,040 --> 00:07:03,200 Speaker 2: you know, environmental like big out a home or retail, 135 00:07:03,839 --> 00:07:09,000 Speaker 2: or it's targeted or whatever, what have you. The ambition 136 00:07:09,720 --> 00:07:13,119 Speaker 2: of all of these brands is to create an almost 137 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:17,119 Speaker 2: kind of rhapsodic irrational preference. Right, And just as easily 138 00:07:17,160 --> 00:07:19,400 Speaker 2: as you can make an irrational preference for a pair 139 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:21,840 Speaker 2: of khakis it was made in the exact same factory 140 00:07:21,840 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 2: as the Para khakis, it costs twelve dollars less that 141 00:07:23,880 --> 00:07:27,720 Speaker 2: you don't want, you can also create an interrational preference 142 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:33,880 Speaker 2: for values. You can also create a interrational preference for ideas, right, 143 00:07:33,960 --> 00:07:37,120 Speaker 2: ideas that need to happen. And so the same exact 144 00:07:37,120 --> 00:07:41,080 Speaker 2: mechanics that go into selling a car pair of khakis 145 00:07:41,320 --> 00:07:45,120 Speaker 2: a plastic disc would also be employed in selling the 146 00:07:45,240 --> 00:07:51,440 Speaker 2: idea of universal income or universal healthcare, or you can 147 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 2: pick the thing that you actually care about. But because 148 00:07:55,120 --> 00:07:57,760 Speaker 2: the mechanics are so similar and because we know that 149 00:07:57,840 --> 00:08:01,720 Speaker 2: cultural rewards brands that lead. I find it a great 150 00:08:02,120 --> 00:08:05,600 Speaker 2: industry to be in to leverage brand budgets and to 151 00:08:05,680 --> 00:08:09,560 Speaker 2: build a toolkit that can be applied to any idea. 152 00:08:10,040 --> 00:08:14,280 Speaker 1: So you pioneered the context strategy at Translation, I think 153 00:08:14,280 --> 00:08:16,920 Speaker 1: it was back in twenty twelve or at this time, 154 00:08:17,200 --> 00:08:21,600 Speaker 1: and you defined it as a unique discipline marrying creativity, strategy, data, 155 00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:26,880 Speaker 1: social intelligence. It aims to align brand behavior with authentic 156 00:08:26,920 --> 00:08:30,840 Speaker 1: consumer conversations to boost relevance and impact. Right, what moment 157 00:08:31,280 --> 00:08:35,200 Speaker 1: made you realize context strategy could be more than a discipline, 158 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:37,680 Speaker 1: it could be a lever to shift power. 159 00:08:38,440 --> 00:08:41,720 Speaker 2: Well, the first just the origin story of context was 160 00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:46,400 Speaker 2: very specific to Translations place in the ecosystem at that time. 161 00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:53,520 Speaker 2: So Translation had big, loud fortune fifty clients, and the 162 00:08:53,600 --> 00:08:56,679 Speaker 2: ideas that they were bringing in those clients, your state farms, McDonald's, 163 00:08:56,720 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 2: Anheuser Busch were very out of step with the way 164 00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:04,520 Speaker 2: those brands normally behaved. Right, And as a result of that, 165 00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:08,959 Speaker 2: because you have creative and media divorced from one another, 166 00:09:09,240 --> 00:09:11,320 Speaker 2: even if you win the creative assignment, you can hang 167 00:09:11,360 --> 00:09:14,120 Speaker 2: something on the wall. It's a brilliant idea. Everybody wants 168 00:09:14,160 --> 00:09:16,320 Speaker 2: to buy. But by the time it goes through the 169 00:09:16,360 --> 00:09:18,520 Speaker 2: system it comes out the other side it is not 170 00:09:18,679 --> 00:09:22,600 Speaker 2: sequenced correctly, it's not targeted correctly, it's not rolled out 171 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:25,440 Speaker 2: in such a way that it's going to attract the 172 00:09:25,480 --> 00:09:29,000 Speaker 2: original advocates who need to push it to its fullest 173 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:33,640 Speaker 2: kind of pop cultural potential. And there was no sliver 174 00:09:34,160 --> 00:09:37,280 Speaker 2: of an opportunity for a Translation like object to take 175 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:40,040 Speaker 2: on the media buying for companies of that magnitude. Right, 176 00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:42,120 Speaker 2: You're not going to all of a sudden take a 177 00:09:42,160 --> 00:09:44,240 Speaker 2: billion dollar media budget and know what to do with it. 178 00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:47,640 Speaker 2: And so there needed to be an adapter, right. And 179 00:09:48,200 --> 00:09:51,240 Speaker 2: what Translation had previously done was go get a media 180 00:09:51,280 --> 00:09:53,440 Speaker 2: guy who was kind of fluent and creative and he 181 00:09:53,480 --> 00:09:55,600 Speaker 2: would just like work with the media people over here. 182 00:09:55,640 --> 00:09:57,520 Speaker 2: And when it was State Farm, he'd worked with OMD 183 00:09:57,640 --> 00:09:59,000 Speaker 2: and when it was and as a Bush, you go 184 00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:02,400 Speaker 2: work with SMG. And what we decided to do, and 185 00:10:02,440 --> 00:10:05,800 Speaker 2: this was where the idea of the context discipline came from, 186 00:10:06,280 --> 00:10:10,280 Speaker 2: was actually build the work so that it prescribed its 187 00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:12,480 Speaker 2: own rollout, and build the work in such a way 188 00:10:12,480 --> 00:10:14,600 Speaker 2: that when the client approved the work, they were also 189 00:10:14,840 --> 00:10:17,000 Speaker 2: approving the first run of people who were going to 190 00:10:17,040 --> 00:10:19,520 Speaker 2: get it. They were also approving the surfaces it was 191 00:10:19,600 --> 00:10:21,640 Speaker 2: going to show up on. They were also approving the 192 00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:26,040 Speaker 2: kind of posture of that inventory. And once they said 193 00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:30,280 Speaker 2: yes to that, it became like a bispect for the 194 00:10:30,360 --> 00:10:33,960 Speaker 2: media shop. Does that make sense, Yeah, yeah, So when 195 00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:41,280 Speaker 2: that happened, there was an opportunity for me. I came 196 00:10:41,320 --> 00:10:45,400 Speaker 2: in to do that for translation clients. And what context 197 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:49,080 Speaker 2: strategy has become is there's a real industry opportunity. And 198 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:52,360 Speaker 2: so that has really bloomed under the leadership of Joel Rodriguez, 199 00:10:52,720 --> 00:10:55,200 Speaker 2: who leads that discipline today and has built it into 200 00:10:55,360 --> 00:10:59,120 Speaker 2: I think seventeen person squad, and they exist on all 201 00:10:59,160 --> 00:11:04,200 Speaker 2: sides of the business pre brief, biz DEV, prost brief 202 00:11:04,280 --> 00:11:08,520 Speaker 2: and form the brief activation. They're on set and they're 203 00:11:08,640 --> 00:11:12,280 Speaker 2: reporting and they're posting. They're doing kind of everything that 204 00:11:13,240 --> 00:11:17,640 Speaker 2: makes an idea actually come to life that I could 205 00:11:17,679 --> 00:11:19,600 Speaker 2: not have imagined. When I walked in the doors, I 206 00:11:19,640 --> 00:11:21,400 Speaker 2: thought I was coming to be a secret weapon, like 207 00:11:21,440 --> 00:11:24,280 Speaker 2: some kind of Swiss army knife. And what it has 208 00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:27,439 Speaker 2: bloomed into is really our signature sauce. And it's the 209 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:30,040 Speaker 2: distinction that we make, you know, a lot of people 210 00:11:30,080 --> 00:11:31,760 Speaker 2: can come to the same line, a lot of people 211 00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:33,520 Speaker 2: can come to the same celebrity, a lot of people 212 00:11:33,559 --> 00:11:38,040 Speaker 2: can come to the same framework. And you know, one 213 00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:40,640 Speaker 2: of our most famous pieces of film is Beats You 214 00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:45,480 Speaker 2: Love Me Want a Titanium Lion the year right before 215 00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:49,000 Speaker 2: they renamed the Titanium Lion for Dan Widen, And there's 216 00:11:49,040 --> 00:11:51,200 Speaker 2: a line. The whole thing pivots on this line, which 217 00:11:51,240 --> 00:11:56,000 Speaker 2: is you love black culture? Do you love black people? Right? 218 00:11:56,600 --> 00:11:58,520 Speaker 2: And of course I'm very proud of the film and 219 00:11:58,520 --> 00:12:01,360 Speaker 2: the film is amazing, etc. Etc. But there was also 220 00:12:01,400 --> 00:12:03,880 Speaker 2: a Dorito's add out that had that exact same line, 221 00:12:03,920 --> 00:12:07,040 Speaker 2: and that was the idea at the same time, and 222 00:12:07,080 --> 00:12:10,520 Speaker 2: the difference between what we were able to do and 223 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:14,360 Speaker 2: set that brand on a new trajectory with youth culture 224 00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:17,960 Speaker 2: writ large, not just with black kids with that piece 225 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:21,760 Speaker 2: of work is all about the contextual layer on top 226 00:12:21,840 --> 00:12:24,200 Speaker 2: of it that made it feel like it was from 227 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:28,520 Speaker 2: a community outward to the world as opposed to all 228 00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:33,079 Speaker 2: the other things. And that's not just tone, texture, title card, 229 00:12:33,520 --> 00:12:34,000 Speaker 2: sign off. 230 00:12:34,600 --> 00:12:36,760 Speaker 1: And obviously you built something at this time which is 231 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:40,559 Speaker 1: still the well, not just the foundation for today's work 232 00:12:40,640 --> 00:12:44,240 Speaker 1: and motivation, but I assume it's further developed over the time, 233 00:12:44,280 --> 00:12:46,640 Speaker 1: but you say it's more irrelevant than ever. Right, what 234 00:12:46,720 --> 00:12:50,440 Speaker 1: you developed now twelve thirteen years ago. Is this the 235 00:12:50,440 --> 00:12:55,280 Speaker 1: core of the agency's world today, of the agency's goals, etc. 236 00:12:55,760 --> 00:12:58,200 Speaker 2: Is this driving the whole business? I think it's one 237 00:12:58,240 --> 00:13:02,520 Speaker 2: of our most differentiateds, right, because look, you're gonna work 238 00:13:02,559 --> 00:13:06,679 Speaker 2: at this level of polish, You're gonna have brand, strategy, 239 00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:08,920 Speaker 2: creative production. They all have to be a one. And 240 00:13:08,960 --> 00:13:10,920 Speaker 2: we all know who a one people are, right, We've 241 00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:13,560 Speaker 2: worked together for years. We all know who the aces are. 242 00:13:14,040 --> 00:13:18,600 Speaker 2: And so context direction is further down into the kind 243 00:13:18,640 --> 00:13:23,120 Speaker 2: of special sauces and yeah, I mean you know it 244 00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:27,280 Speaker 2: came to possible two seasons ago and told the story 245 00:13:27,280 --> 00:13:31,440 Speaker 2: of the at and t helmet, and that obviously the 246 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:34,320 Speaker 2: piece of film and the engineering and everything had to 247 00:13:34,360 --> 00:13:40,360 Speaker 2: come together. But context is on a pedestal in that 248 00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:48,680 Speaker 2: scenario because it can observe right, observe who should be 249 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:53,480 Speaker 2: served by five G tech. It can identify, right, it 250 00:13:53,559 --> 00:13:58,160 Speaker 2: can find a perfect kind of avatar for that population. 251 00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:02,080 Speaker 2: It can scale so it can start to think about 252 00:14:02,160 --> 00:14:04,520 Speaker 2: who needs to be what kind of communities we need 253 00:14:04,559 --> 00:14:07,520 Speaker 2: to puncture. So that this doesn't just stay about deaf kids, 254 00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:11,360 Speaker 2: but it actually rises to the conversational kind of crest 255 00:14:11,480 --> 00:14:16,560 Speaker 2: of fairness in college sports, right, et cetera, et cetera, 256 00:14:16,559 --> 00:14:20,840 Speaker 2: et cetera. So it is indistinguishable from our practice and 257 00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:23,040 Speaker 2: I don't see it anywhere else. And yes, I feel 258 00:14:23,040 --> 00:14:25,560 Speaker 2: like it gives us quite a significant amount alpha. 259 00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:30,320 Speaker 1: So you guys are translation you'll help brands into cultural spaces. 260 00:14:31,320 --> 00:14:34,560 Speaker 1: And how do you make decisions when a brand is 261 00:14:34,640 --> 00:14:39,080 Speaker 1: earning the right to be there versus extracting from a culture? 262 00:14:40,000 --> 00:14:42,720 Speaker 1: Is it in your conversation with the client with a brand? 263 00:14:43,520 --> 00:14:46,600 Speaker 1: How can I imagine how your decisions made you know 264 00:14:46,640 --> 00:14:49,200 Speaker 1: when you say, okay, you belong to this culture as 265 00:14:49,240 --> 00:14:49,640 Speaker 1: a brand. 266 00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:55,480 Speaker 2: Sometimes our job is to turn what was rented into 267 00:14:55,560 --> 00:14:59,440 Speaker 2: a canvas for contribution. So our work early on at 268 00:14:59,520 --> 00:15:02,400 Speaker 2: Stay Farm in the NBA that led to like Chris 269 00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:05,720 Speaker 2: Paul and Cliff Paul and just successive seasons, that was 270 00:15:05,760 --> 00:15:10,640 Speaker 2: really about figuring out what state farms value equation, which 271 00:15:10,680 --> 00:15:15,760 Speaker 2: had service right as it's kind of apex thought meant 272 00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:17,840 Speaker 2: in the world of basketball. Right, So how do you 273 00:15:17,920 --> 00:15:20,640 Speaker 2: take the proposition of service that only a state farm 274 00:15:20,640 --> 00:15:23,440 Speaker 2: agent can offer and put it in basketball, and so 275 00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:28,360 Speaker 2: once all of the decisions are downstream of sticking to 276 00:15:28,440 --> 00:15:31,280 Speaker 2: that idea, Now you don't have the problem that many 277 00:15:31,280 --> 00:15:33,080 Speaker 2: brands have when they try to enter a theater like 278 00:15:33,080 --> 00:15:35,600 Speaker 2: sports and they're just buying people based on follower accounts 279 00:15:35,640 --> 00:15:39,840 Speaker 2: and Biscuit looks good in that and whatever. Now, because 280 00:15:39,880 --> 00:15:42,000 Speaker 2: you have this organizing principle, you go, okay, well, who's 281 00:15:42,040 --> 00:15:45,200 Speaker 2: the assist leader this year? Was this guy Cliff Paul? Okay, 282 00:15:45,240 --> 00:15:47,800 Speaker 2: if his name is Cliff Paul, so on and so forth. Right, 283 00:15:47,840 --> 00:15:52,800 Speaker 2: all the decisions flowed from our focus on that principle. 284 00:15:53,600 --> 00:15:56,360 Speaker 2: There are other times where that's not what you're doing 285 00:15:56,400 --> 00:15:59,680 Speaker 2: at all. Right, going back to the AT and T five, 286 00:15:59,720 --> 00:16:02,800 Speaker 2: g AT and T has been around college sports, and 287 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:05,480 Speaker 2: specifically college football for as long as anybody can remember. 288 00:16:06,080 --> 00:16:10,040 Speaker 2: But what was their contribution to the game? Right, they've 289 00:16:10,120 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 2: just been around it. And so though they didn't have 290 00:16:14,760 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 2: a pre existing relationship with Gallaudett University, though they didn't 291 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:23,200 Speaker 2: have a big brand reputation built around deaf and heart 292 00:16:23,240 --> 00:16:26,840 Speaker 2: of hearing communities, they did have a heritage factor. And 293 00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:29,920 Speaker 2: a heritage factor had everything to do with Alexander Graham 294 00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:34,800 Speaker 2: Bell okay and his deaf mother and sister. And so 295 00:16:34,840 --> 00:16:38,080 Speaker 2: when you can pull that heritage forward and find a 296 00:16:38,120 --> 00:16:41,080 Speaker 2: new way for them to behave now, all of a sudden, 297 00:16:41,120 --> 00:16:43,680 Speaker 2: it transforms the way that they use the canvas of 298 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:48,240 Speaker 2: college football. Both of those are equally actionable. Right I 299 00:16:48,320 --> 00:16:51,800 Speaker 2: bought something helped me integrate successfully. Right I bought it 300 00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:54,400 Speaker 2: a big entitlement, whether it be an F one thing 301 00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:57,720 Speaker 2: or a league deal or what have you help me 302 00:16:57,800 --> 00:17:00,680 Speaker 2: find out what my meaning in this world can be. 303 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:04,919 Speaker 2: And then also, hey, I already exist in this world, 304 00:17:05,280 --> 00:17:07,520 Speaker 2: but I haven't made a contribution. How do I find 305 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:10,000 Speaker 2: something that people will actually care about and that I 306 00:17:10,040 --> 00:17:15,360 Speaker 2: would measure in people's enthusiasm as opposed to people's exposure. 307 00:17:15,960 --> 00:17:19,560 Speaker 1: But I'm sure they're also boundaries or non negotiatables, you know, 308 00:17:19,680 --> 00:17:22,480 Speaker 1: for protecting communities. When brands want to go into this, 309 00:17:23,320 --> 00:17:25,240 Speaker 1: when was the time or can you share an example 310 00:17:25,280 --> 00:17:27,920 Speaker 1: when the community tells you no? Right, when you thought 311 00:17:27,920 --> 00:17:30,840 Speaker 1: about together with a brand, about a concept and idea, 312 00:17:31,119 --> 00:17:33,720 Speaker 1: and then you felt and you were back and said no, 313 00:17:33,840 --> 00:17:35,960 Speaker 1: that goes beyond that, it doesn't fit. 314 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:41,160 Speaker 2: We kill those in the crib at our shop. I've 315 00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:43,760 Speaker 2: seen things on our walls, and part of my job 316 00:17:43,840 --> 00:17:48,000 Speaker 2: and Joelle's job, and Albetto and Sanding all leadership translation, 317 00:17:48,080 --> 00:17:50,919 Speaker 2: our job is to make sure that nothing goes to 318 00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:55,920 Speaker 2: the client that is going to be out of hand rejected. 319 00:17:55,960 --> 00:18:00,680 Speaker 2: But of course we've had some moments where here's good example, 320 00:18:01,200 --> 00:18:04,760 Speaker 2: we did a campaign for AT and T. It was 321 00:18:04,760 --> 00:18:07,639 Speaker 2: our first relationship with AT and T built around area 322 00:18:07,720 --> 00:18:10,600 Speaker 2: codes and so it was a hyper local campaign and 323 00:18:10,800 --> 00:18:14,760 Speaker 2: one of the markets that we were penetrating was Atlanta. 324 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:19,800 Speaker 2: In Atlanta, there are bike clubs. It's a big part 325 00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:22,479 Speaker 2: of lifetime there. It's just like roller skating or waffle 326 00:18:22,480 --> 00:18:25,480 Speaker 2: house or whatever else. Right, And so we had done 327 00:18:25,520 --> 00:18:28,720 Speaker 2: a shoot where we had these guys on these bikes, right, 328 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:31,520 Speaker 2: and I think or maybe we had even taken user 329 00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:34,399 Speaker 2: generated content of these guys on these bikes. And basically 330 00:18:34,440 --> 00:18:36,280 Speaker 2: what we were doing is we were taking great photography 331 00:18:36,280 --> 00:18:39,240 Speaker 2: from the community and we were like putting AT and 332 00:18:39,240 --> 00:18:41,199 Speaker 2: T livery on it to say it's a four or 333 00:18:41,200 --> 00:18:44,280 Speaker 2: four thing, right, And we get a call, and the 334 00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:49,280 Speaker 2: call is that some Greater Atlanta Business Bureau or maybe 335 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:54,359 Speaker 2: some neighborhood watch was really upset about the fact that 336 00:18:54,440 --> 00:18:57,199 Speaker 2: apparently these bikes are illegal in Atlanta, and they were 337 00:18:57,240 --> 00:18:59,399 Speaker 2: really upset about the idea that AT and T was 338 00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:05,159 Speaker 2: promoting illegal activity in Atlanta. In a scenario like that, 339 00:19:06,080 --> 00:19:12,199 Speaker 2: the person you're after is definitely feeling seen and respected 340 00:19:12,280 --> 00:19:15,720 Speaker 2: and acknowledged by that poster and that bus shelter. Yeah, 341 00:19:16,520 --> 00:19:21,000 Speaker 2: but that doesn't mean that the person that call rang 342 00:19:21,080 --> 00:19:25,199 Speaker 2: that phone isn't meaningful in your orbit somewhere else. And 343 00:19:25,240 --> 00:19:28,800 Speaker 2: so you're often when you do work that is, you know, 344 00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:32,760 Speaker 2: culturally contributive, you're often going to wind up in a 345 00:19:32,800 --> 00:19:36,960 Speaker 2: position where somebody calls and gets really upset. And as 346 00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:39,800 Speaker 2: long as you're prepared for that, and as long as 347 00:19:39,800 --> 00:19:44,760 Speaker 2: you've predicted that, then it's a basic risk reward scenario. 348 00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:49,960 Speaker 2: It's not a panic moment. Yeah, And so tension is 349 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:55,920 Speaker 2: one of the outcomes. Reaction, even negative reaction, is one 350 00:19:55,960 --> 00:20:00,959 Speaker 2: of the outcomes. It's a question of can you shape 351 00:20:00,960 --> 00:20:04,760 Speaker 2: the advocacy to drive the business outcome that you're looking to. 352 00:20:05,840 --> 00:20:07,120 Speaker 2: That's the only question. Ever. 353 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:11,440 Speaker 1: Let's also talk about United masas so you have two 354 00:20:11,480 --> 00:20:15,440 Speaker 1: heads on all the time. United Masters treats a fan 355 00:20:15,480 --> 00:20:18,960 Speaker 1: base as an artist's second most valuable asset after the 356 00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:23,159 Speaker 1: artist's own creativity if I understand, right, So what protections 357 00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:27,000 Speaker 1: need to exist so that fan data isn't weaponized against 358 00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:28,760 Speaker 1: the varied creators it's supposed to serve. 359 00:20:30,040 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 2: Well, let's back up one step, because I don't know 360 00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:36,600 Speaker 2: how familiar everybody is with the music industry large. So 361 00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:41,120 Speaker 2: the first premise of United Masters is that historically, if 362 00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:43,560 Speaker 2: you put any money into an artist, you own their work. 363 00:20:43,760 --> 00:20:45,560 Speaker 2: And the only artists that we ever heard on the 364 00:20:45,640 --> 00:20:47,720 Speaker 2: radio or saw on the television or what have you, 365 00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:51,040 Speaker 2: were artists that somebody had put some money into so 366 00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:54,159 Speaker 2: that they would be there. And with the explosion of 367 00:20:54,160 --> 00:20:57,280 Speaker 2: social media, that stopped being the case. What stopped being 368 00:20:57,280 --> 00:20:59,960 Speaker 2: the case was people were fronting all of this money 369 00:21:00,119 --> 00:21:03,640 Speaker 2: to build these acts and then therefore reaping the reward. 370 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:06,919 Speaker 2: What was going on was these acts were popping on 371 00:21:06,960 --> 00:21:09,880 Speaker 2: their own, and they were giving them Usery Bank loans 372 00:21:10,359 --> 00:21:13,400 Speaker 2: in order to own their work forever. And so back 373 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:18,160 Speaker 2: to that idea of morals, right, like a new normal. Right, 374 00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:22,960 Speaker 2: that was an idea that we knew could stick. That 375 00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:27,080 Speaker 2: independence should be the default setting of the music industry 376 00:21:27,320 --> 00:21:31,440 Speaker 2: all across the world, meaning this work should be creator owned, 377 00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:36,200 Speaker 2: it should not be owned by someone who didn't participate 378 00:21:36,280 --> 00:21:39,480 Speaker 2: meaningfully in it. And if there aren't alternatives to get 379 00:21:39,480 --> 00:21:42,520 Speaker 2: that first amount of seed capital, we'll do it. But 380 00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:46,440 Speaker 2: you should own that work because you now own the work. 381 00:21:46,560 --> 00:21:50,520 Speaker 2: Now you have an entire generation of artists who are 382 00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:54,720 Speaker 2: owner operators themselves. They're CEOs, right, They're not just talent, 383 00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:58,000 Speaker 2: and so they're thinking about all the time, how do 384 00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:02,920 Speaker 2: I build a full business? And that's where they're fans, 385 00:22:03,359 --> 00:22:07,800 Speaker 2: and ideally and certainly in our ecosystem, other brands that 386 00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:09,360 Speaker 2: are trying to be built that are trying to earn 387 00:22:09,400 --> 00:22:14,000 Speaker 2: those same fans right start to come into focus together. 388 00:22:14,560 --> 00:22:16,560 Speaker 2: If you own the work, then you can build the 389 00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:20,679 Speaker 2: business on top of it. Right. Otherwise, the business on 390 00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:23,399 Speaker 2: top of it isn't yours because Instagram owns it or 391 00:22:23,560 --> 00:22:26,399 Speaker 2: somebody else owns it, and the thing underneath isn't yours 392 00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:28,639 Speaker 2: because Sony owns it or Universal owns it or what 393 00:22:28,680 --> 00:22:31,399 Speaker 2: have you. And so our idea was always to catch 394 00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:34,760 Speaker 2: this wave that we see in gen z across the globe, 395 00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:39,360 Speaker 2: which is entrepreneurial zeal first name, last name, LLC. We're 396 00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:40,880 Speaker 2: going to talk about this when we get to AI 397 00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:44,320 Speaker 2: as well. And we wanted to make sure that in music, 398 00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:46,000 Speaker 2: we had a way to do that. So you have 399 00:22:46,040 --> 00:22:48,960 Speaker 2: your core IP, you have the business that you can build, 400 00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:52,280 Speaker 2: even if that's just you know, influencer businesses as we 401 00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:55,000 Speaker 2: kind of currently think about it, and for some you 402 00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:59,919 Speaker 2: also have the ability to build products, services, and movements 403 00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:03,119 Speaker 2: that are going to have install bases because those install 404 00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:07,120 Speaker 2: bases are coming from your music. So everybody won't have 405 00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:12,680 Speaker 2: a finty like Rihanna does, but everybody should be thinking 406 00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:17,240 Speaker 2: that way. And so the data, specifically the fan relationship 407 00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:21,320 Speaker 2: being the second most important thing, because the biggest thing 408 00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 2: you can figure out as an artist is a distinction 409 00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:29,439 Speaker 2: between an enthusiastic fan who'd be willing to buy this 410 00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:33,560 Speaker 2: particular sweatshirt right well over market, and somebody who just 411 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:36,879 Speaker 2: happens to enjoy the music and who will help contribute 412 00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:40,000 Speaker 2: their point zero zero zero to percent penny to your 413 00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:40,639 Speaker 2: stream count. 414 00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:58,520 Speaker 1: You've mentioned something like AI, so obviously we have to 415 00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:00,600 Speaker 1: talk about AI as well and the influence into your 416 00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:03,359 Speaker 1: business and the Auntice business. But let's widen it up 417 00:24:03,359 --> 00:24:07,320 Speaker 1: a bit. It's AI, it's creativity, it's equity. So how 418 00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:10,560 Speaker 1: do you foresee this kind of collision and what's the 419 00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:12,960 Speaker 1: new outcome of it in the near future how is 420 00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:16,000 Speaker 1: AI specifically, but in the combination with creativity and equity 421 00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:19,120 Speaker 1: driving a whole industry here, we're. 422 00:24:18,920 --> 00:24:22,159 Speaker 2: Just seeing this rapid collapse of the price point of 423 00:24:22,160 --> 00:24:26,040 Speaker 2: great content, right, And it's not all just Jenai's. I 424 00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:29,000 Speaker 2: think it's a host of tools, and it's really an 425 00:24:29,000 --> 00:24:31,439 Speaker 2: install based and a bunch of creators who are fluent 426 00:24:31,520 --> 00:24:36,000 Speaker 2: with these tools that now have just precipitously dropped the 427 00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:39,520 Speaker 2: cost to make something great and intentional marthy. And so 428 00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:44,359 Speaker 2: as we look at that first and foremost for our artists, 429 00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:48,199 Speaker 2: great day, right, because now all of a sudden, you 430 00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:50,440 Speaker 2: don't need the kind of budget that you needed even 431 00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:54,119 Speaker 2: three years ago to be really really great. That's a 432 00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:58,560 Speaker 2: net plus in terms of yield and scale. Of course, 433 00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:01,679 Speaker 2: consequence of that is same consequence we know across the 434 00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:03,720 Speaker 2: media estate, which is like we're gonna get a lot 435 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:06,960 Speaker 2: of slop, We're gonna get overloaded. But within that, I 436 00:25:06,960 --> 00:25:10,719 Speaker 2: think artists are more empowered to build better and more 437 00:25:10,760 --> 00:25:15,280 Speaker 2: significant businesses and get to a cash register moment easier 438 00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:18,600 Speaker 2: than ever before. And we're just gonna see that accelerate 439 00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:21,120 Speaker 2: as we start to see them figure out really crack 440 00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:24,680 Speaker 2: agents especially. I think there are going to be some 441 00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:29,199 Speaker 2: really exciting companies that agentically solve, you know, into it 442 00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:34,280 Speaker 2: for creativity, if you will. That's definitely underway, and it's 443 00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:37,120 Speaker 2: going to be as hands off as putting a filter 444 00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:41,480 Speaker 2: on something is today. So the net for the artist 445 00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:46,560 Speaker 2: space is great if more competitive. Look, I think in 446 00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:50,720 Speaker 2: the agency world, a lot of people are going to 447 00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:56,080 Speaker 2: they're going to realize that the moat that we had 448 00:25:56,119 --> 00:25:59,480 Speaker 2: as an industry that we saw fall around you know, 449 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:02,919 Speaker 2: Hollywood content, we saw fall around video in particular, we 450 00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:06,320 Speaker 2: saw a fall around photography, and that we then saw 451 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:09,959 Speaker 2: fall around music has now come for us. You know, 452 00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:12,879 Speaker 2: there was a time where the movie industry was like 453 00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:16,119 Speaker 2: four companies, right, and that was just what it was. 454 00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:20,480 Speaker 2: And the archetype of that was Marty Scorsese, right, and 455 00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:23,960 Speaker 2: now mister beast, you name it. And there was a 456 00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:27,639 Speaker 2: time where I don't know name a great photographer was 457 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:29,880 Speaker 2: like that was the archetype of who got to get 458 00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:33,640 Speaker 2: paid for making pictures. And now Kendall Jenner gets paid 459 00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:36,960 Speaker 2: day morning, right. Sure, sure the same thing has happened 460 00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:38,280 Speaker 2: in music, and the same thing is going to happen 461 00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:41,760 Speaker 2: to us. So I think in agency land, we're going 462 00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:44,439 Speaker 2: to see, you know, four person teams be just as 463 00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:50,880 Speaker 2: dangerous as one hundred and fifty person shops today. Further out, 464 00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:57,720 Speaker 2: I hope that the creative class starts to recognize itself 465 00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:01,560 Speaker 2: as one body, because I think the new talent that's 466 00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:04,520 Speaker 2: coming into the creative class is going to be less 467 00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:07,120 Speaker 2: likely because they're going to have to learn these tools 468 00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:09,840 Speaker 2: as they're built, as opposed to be taught these tools 469 00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:14,200 Speaker 2: by some earlier pro I think that they are going 470 00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:21,119 Speaker 2: to vacillate between disciplines to a degree where you know, 471 00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:24,960 Speaker 2: the multi hyphen it degree, the hyphens will eventually just disappear. 472 00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:30,440 Speaker 2: And I think we're going to have a really great 473 00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:35,560 Speaker 2: opportunity to build a working middle class within a creative class. 474 00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:41,520 Speaker 2: And whether they use their own personalities, they use generated personalities, 475 00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:45,640 Speaker 2: whether they are behind the lens in front of it, 476 00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:49,480 Speaker 2: they're working for brands, they're making music videos, or they're 477 00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:54,320 Speaker 2: making whatever thought pieces. The hope for me would be 478 00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:59,480 Speaker 2: that we would create a scenario, and this is certainly 479 00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:02,679 Speaker 2: what we're trying to do it United Masters, where of 480 00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:06,000 Speaker 2: course we have those knockout over the fence. You know, 481 00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:08,320 Speaker 2: you're mister bash your big ex the plug right now. 482 00:28:08,840 --> 00:28:12,560 Speaker 2: But we also have this broad, stable, credit worthy middle 483 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:16,600 Speaker 2: class that are earning let's call it eighty thousand USD 484 00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:20,359 Speaker 2: a year as passively as possible. That's what I see, 485 00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:23,399 Speaker 2: That's what I want to engineer. Yeah, in the meantime, 486 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:26,760 Speaker 2: there's gonna be a lot of layoffs and new opportunities 487 00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:29,560 Speaker 2: for sure, alternity probleternities, is that right? 488 00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:32,399 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's fascinating and I would love to see you 489 00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:35,119 Speaker 1: also be back here but also on all stages talking 490 00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:37,760 Speaker 1: about these experiences you know in case studies, when we 491 00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:41,520 Speaker 1: see more and more realize and happening, and what the 492 00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:45,640 Speaker 1: new opportunities all look like. Because currently, yeah, it feels 493 00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:48,000 Speaker 1: for me, you know, more people are scared about this, 494 00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:49,680 Speaker 1: then see those opportunities in it. 495 00:28:50,160 --> 00:28:53,720 Speaker 2: Cumbents should be scared. That's how revolution goes. But it's 496 00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:57,400 Speaker 2: still well more exciting than it is scary. I agree. 497 00:28:57,720 --> 00:29:01,480 Speaker 1: She'll say, you've described yourself as someone who who makes conspirators. 498 00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:06,080 Speaker 1: A few musicians and marketeers what God wails, whether it's 499 00:29:06,120 --> 00:29:09,400 Speaker 1: contracts or in your ref share or creative councils, make 500 00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:11,400 Speaker 1: that conspiracy equitable. 501 00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:15,480 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, well, look, it starts with shared values and 502 00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:20,640 Speaker 2: then it should structure out to share, you know, returns. Right. 503 00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:24,000 Speaker 2: I think the origins of this company were always that. 504 00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:26,560 Speaker 2: I think I think people get us wrong because, you know, 505 00:29:26,560 --> 00:29:29,800 Speaker 2: Steve Stout and they see Beyonce singing Happy Birthday to him, 506 00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:32,960 Speaker 2: and they just think he's just everybody's buddy. No, Steve 507 00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:38,320 Speaker 2: is really really well known for creating scenarios that have 508 00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:43,640 Speaker 2: come multiplayer, multipayer scenarios. You look at jay Z right now, 509 00:29:43,680 --> 00:29:46,400 Speaker 2: and if you were paying attention to him in nineteen 510 00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:48,920 Speaker 2: ninety eight, he always saw his shoulders out. He was 511 00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:52,480 Speaker 2: wearing like a way oversized throwback every time you saw him. 512 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:56,360 Speaker 2: And it wasn't until Steve wound up putting him in 513 00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:58,760 Speaker 2: that hp ad where he's wearing the suit and he's 514 00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:00,840 Speaker 2: flipping through on the HPT tablet and showing you the 515 00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:04,720 Speaker 2: plant sort of Barclays like HP in a very real 516 00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:09,120 Speaker 2: way helped skuld the identity of jay Z as a mobile. 517 00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:11,280 Speaker 2: That's not to say it was happening. That's to say 518 00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:15,080 Speaker 2: they helped frame that in the popular imagination. Right. And 519 00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:18,040 Speaker 2: the s stock Carter, which was a sneaker that had 520 00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:20,840 Speaker 2: a really really tiny distribution that had a significant cultural 521 00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:24,920 Speaker 2: impact that really put him on the road to making 522 00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:29,880 Speaker 2: products improving to multiple categories. That music could sell the 523 00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:31,880 Speaker 2: way that sports could, even though they didn't want to 524 00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:35,520 Speaker 2: believe that. And so because that's the heritage of the shop, 525 00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:41,800 Speaker 2: when we see a scenario today, like you know, McDonald's 526 00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:47,040 Speaker 2: has recently hired us to help them really get closer 527 00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:52,760 Speaker 2: to the African American segment, and they're really trying to 528 00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:55,360 Speaker 2: create significant share for themselves in a chicken market where 529 00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:59,959 Speaker 2: they haven't historically been. And so if there's a scenario 530 00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:04,880 Speaker 2: that involves an artists, I know that that artist has 531 00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:09,160 Speaker 2: the potential to create significant wake for McDonald's and I 532 00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:12,240 Speaker 2: know McDonald's has an opportunity to create significant wake for 533 00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:15,640 Speaker 2: that artist. The thing that most people just leave out 534 00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:18,280 Speaker 2: and they let the money settle this, They let the 535 00:31:18,360 --> 00:31:22,680 Speaker 2: money cover the differential is does this benefit them both? 536 00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:25,200 Speaker 2: Can we look back at them both and go, oh, 537 00:31:25,280 --> 00:31:27,880 Speaker 2: you're better for that and you're better for that. Yeah, 538 00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:31,320 Speaker 2: And that's what we're trying to engineer. The money is important, 539 00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:34,400 Speaker 2: and most people will do a revshare deal, but they're 540 00:31:34,440 --> 00:31:36,200 Speaker 2: not going to give you a chunk of their company 541 00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:40,880 Speaker 2: just to be a celebrity endorser. Right, So it doesn't 542 00:31:40,880 --> 00:31:44,000 Speaker 2: have to go to that extreme, but a mutual benefit 543 00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:47,560 Speaker 2: off of those shared values. So the partners are getting 544 00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:49,360 Speaker 2: each other where they couldn't have got without the other. 545 00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:53,160 Speaker 2: That's just great business and it's one of our hallmarks 546 00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:55,000 Speaker 2: that's been with us for twenty years. It's going to 547 00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:57,240 Speaker 2: be something we keep doing. You're not going to see 548 00:31:57,320 --> 00:31:59,880 Speaker 2: us get people in business with one another and the 549 00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:01,400 Speaker 2: faces and names switch out. 550 00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:04,280 Speaker 1: Should say, should we talk about d I and Bravery? 551 00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:08,000 Speaker 1: Let me ask you, do you see people in power 552 00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:11,440 Speaker 1: resist some of those things you would like to see 553 00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:16,200 Speaker 1: happening independent from maybe our industry. Is there anything you 554 00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:18,720 Speaker 1: would say, I mean de I's and I would say 555 00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:21,760 Speaker 1: in the spotlight right for some time now, maybe in 556 00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:24,560 Speaker 1: recent months, more than ever before. Do you have a 557 00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:28,040 Speaker 1: wish list based on your own experiences and your perspective 558 00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:30,920 Speaker 1: into this where you would say, okay, especially also, our 559 00:32:30,920 --> 00:32:33,400 Speaker 1: industry needs to step up a bit more and should 560 00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:36,560 Speaker 1: do more, so that it's not just rhetoric, it's more 561 00:32:36,640 --> 00:32:38,720 Speaker 1: a real commitment that we can see. 562 00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:41,880 Speaker 2: The first thing I'll acknowledge is that when you're in 563 00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:44,560 Speaker 2: the business of mass persuasion, is everybody in marketing and 564 00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:48,400 Speaker 2: advertising should be you're hobbling yourself by not having a 565 00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:51,880 Speaker 2: diverse workforce, Like, I don't know. That seems to me 566 00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:56,560 Speaker 2: to be obvious. What is less obvious, though, is I 567 00:32:56,600 --> 00:33:00,680 Speaker 2: think the timeline. So you know, eighty eight percent of 568 00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:02,920 Speaker 2: people under twenty five live in what we call it 569 00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:06,800 Speaker 2: global style. Eighty eight percent of people human beings under 570 00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:09,080 Speaker 2: the age of twenty five. And that's to say, like, 571 00:33:10,280 --> 00:33:13,280 Speaker 2: if you plan to be in business in fifteen years 572 00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:19,680 Speaker 2: at all, if you haven't created some kind of relationship 573 00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:23,360 Speaker 2: with those young people, you're gonna have to buy them 574 00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:28,120 Speaker 2: at whatever market is. Then yeah, And I look at 575 00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:31,160 Speaker 2: it just as simply as this. In nineteen eighty six, 576 00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:33,680 Speaker 2: if you wanted to know where global youth culture was headed, 577 00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:36,640 Speaker 2: you would go to Hollis Queens and you would go 578 00:33:36,800 --> 00:33:39,120 Speaker 2: like the adida's executive, you'd go find run DMC and 579 00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:40,720 Speaker 2: be like, oh, this is the thing that has the 580 00:33:40,760 --> 00:33:44,479 Speaker 2: capacity to take over the world. Right. If in nineteen 581 00:33:44,520 --> 00:33:46,960 Speaker 2: ninety two you want to see where global pop culture 582 00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:49,400 Speaker 2: was going, you go to like Compton, California, maybe even 583 00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:55,680 Speaker 2: South London, and you would see the creative that was 584 00:33:55,760 --> 00:33:58,040 Speaker 2: being born there being able to ripple for the next 585 00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:06,800 Speaker 2: forty years right now. That is absolutely Legos, Metojine, Santiago, 586 00:34:07,800 --> 00:34:13,959 Speaker 2: San Paolo, Soweto. These are the Hollis Queens of right now. 587 00:34:15,120 --> 00:34:20,000 Speaker 2: And that means and remember what I said about this 588 00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:22,520 Speaker 2: like broad multi hyphen and then the hyphens are going 589 00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:26,360 Speaker 2: to disappear. The creative class, the people that will dictate 590 00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:30,719 Speaker 2: the cultural agenda are probably somewhere there. And if you 591 00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:34,120 Speaker 2: don't have any pipeline to bring them anywhere in your orbit, 592 00:34:34,640 --> 00:34:39,560 Speaker 2: you have no earthly idea what could possibly happen next. 593 00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:42,560 Speaker 2: The cultural trade deficit between the West and the rest 594 00:34:42,560 --> 00:34:44,320 Speaker 2: of the world, and America and the rest of the 595 00:34:44,320 --> 00:34:48,760 Speaker 2: world specifically is reversing. I can show you a poster 596 00:34:48,880 --> 00:34:51,480 Speaker 2: of like Coachella in twenty thirteen. You don't know any 597 00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:53,800 Speaker 2: of these acts, but they're all homegrown. And in twenty 598 00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:57,919 Speaker 2: twenty three, it's burna Boy from Nigeria, It's Black Pink 599 00:34:58,000 --> 00:35:03,279 Speaker 2: from Korea, It's Rosalia, it's Bad Bunny. And when you 600 00:35:03,320 --> 00:35:06,560 Speaker 2: go out there and you see eighty thousand young white 601 00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:11,880 Speaker 2: women from like eight hundred k plus households who don't 602 00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:15,240 Speaker 2: speak a lick of conversational Spanish singing everywhere to Bad Bunny, 603 00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:18,480 Speaker 2: it's like a light bulb comes on. You're like, oh, 604 00:35:18,920 --> 00:35:21,759 Speaker 2: this is exactly what run DMC was in nineteen eighty six. 605 00:35:23,200 --> 00:35:26,799 Speaker 2: Now I think about cultural currents in music, blah blah blah, 606 00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:29,560 Speaker 2: why I make those references. But when I circle all 607 00:35:29,600 --> 00:35:32,120 Speaker 2: this back and I think about the little tiny squabbles 608 00:35:32,120 --> 00:35:33,920 Speaker 2: that we have inside of our industry, like, well, how 609 00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:35,520 Speaker 2: many these people do you have? And how many of 610 00:35:35,520 --> 00:35:37,600 Speaker 2: those people do you have? I'm telling you, we're looking 611 00:35:37,600 --> 00:35:39,239 Speaker 2: through the microscope, and we need to be looking through 612 00:35:39,239 --> 00:35:42,080 Speaker 2: the telescope. Yeah, And in our organization, one of the 613 00:35:42,120 --> 00:35:43,960 Speaker 2: things we're thinking about is how do we connect with 614 00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:46,400 Speaker 2: the creative glass at scale in all of the places 615 00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:49,319 Speaker 2: where culture is being born, so that we are in 616 00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:53,040 Speaker 2: a position to help our brand partners contribute to it 617 00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:57,400 Speaker 2: meaningfully enough to lead it and to benefit handsomely there from. 618 00:35:58,239 --> 00:36:02,400 Speaker 2: And so look, I don't know when people start getting 619 00:36:02,440 --> 00:36:06,720 Speaker 2: rid of their heads of diversity at XYZ hold Code Shop, 620 00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:10,520 Speaker 2: I don't know what they're thinking, but I know it 621 00:36:10,520 --> 00:36:15,240 Speaker 2: creates opportunity for us. Yeah, right, And the more group 622 00:36:15,320 --> 00:36:18,000 Speaker 2: thing that you put in the room, the more opportunity 623 00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:19,840 Speaker 2: for us to come in later. I'm just waiting for 624 00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:22,799 Speaker 2: the pendulum to swing back, and then the politics of it, 625 00:36:23,120 --> 00:36:24,760 Speaker 2: you know, and the politics of it are momentary. 626 00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:28,480 Speaker 1: So the message, as I understand it, hopefully correct, is 627 00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:32,080 Speaker 1: it's less about especially when I think about our industries, 628 00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:36,400 Speaker 1: less about these campaigns and initiatives which are important to 629 00:36:36,520 --> 00:36:40,160 Speaker 1: bring attention to something and someone, But it's more that 630 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:43,120 Speaker 1: just to live it, because it's part of our daily 631 00:36:43,160 --> 00:36:46,960 Speaker 1: life around the globe, around our personal life, our business. 632 00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:49,799 Speaker 1: It's just really it's so simple, but just to live it. 633 00:36:49,920 --> 00:36:52,759 Speaker 2: All the growth is just no chart you can look at. 634 00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:55,279 Speaker 2: All the growth is coming from one place. And that 635 00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:58,440 Speaker 2: doesn't just mean the customer base. That also means the 636 00:36:58,480 --> 00:37:04,839 Speaker 2: cultural leadership, as we violently deport people, as we do 637 00:37:04,880 --> 00:37:07,239 Speaker 2: all the things that we're doing to kind of insulate. 638 00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:10,040 Speaker 2: Clock's gonna keep on ticking and these things are gonna 639 00:37:10,040 --> 00:37:10,880 Speaker 2: continue to be true. 640 00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:13,480 Speaker 1: Can you share or are you willing to share a 641 00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:16,799 Speaker 1: personal moment when taking a brief stand which didn't go 642 00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:21,160 Speaker 1: as planned? Can you share something from your personal. 643 00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:23,279 Speaker 2: Experience they're gonna brave stand did not. 644 00:37:24,600 --> 00:37:27,120 Speaker 1: Maybe just a baptize, you know, in terms of you know, 645 00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:28,880 Speaker 1: public reaction or anything like this. 646 00:37:29,640 --> 00:37:31,719 Speaker 2: No, I mean the closest one I would tell you, 647 00:37:31,880 --> 00:37:35,800 Speaker 2: is that that AT and T story about the bikers 648 00:37:35,800 --> 00:37:39,360 Speaker 2: on the poster, Yeah, you know, Beach You Loved Me 649 00:37:39,520 --> 00:37:42,200 Speaker 2: was released at a time we were all still in 650 00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:45,560 Speaker 2: quarantine and Tucker Carlston was still on the air, And 651 00:37:45,600 --> 00:37:47,319 Speaker 2: I gotta tell you, like I was a little let 652 00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:53,759 Speaker 2: down that I didn't make Tucker Carlson's show when that 653 00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:57,000 Speaker 2: work came out, because I really wanted to kind of 654 00:37:57,000 --> 00:38:01,000 Speaker 2: see his capillary burst at the idea that an Apple 655 00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:03,960 Speaker 2: owned company and would be doing any of this. And 656 00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:06,480 Speaker 2: now that the politics of the day are the politics 657 00:38:06,520 --> 00:38:09,000 Speaker 2: of the day, that becomes a little bit more challenging. 658 00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:12,040 Speaker 2: But at the time, you know, people want to root 659 00:38:12,120 --> 00:38:14,120 Speaker 2: for things, and one of the ways they discover what 660 00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:17,600 Speaker 2: the root for is who roots against them. And so 661 00:38:17,719 --> 00:38:21,760 Speaker 2: that backlash that everybody's always trying to avoid is actually 662 00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:24,640 Speaker 2: one of the most significant weapons that we have. And 663 00:38:24,680 --> 00:38:28,200 Speaker 2: I think there's really no better example of that going 664 00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:31,600 Speaker 2: on right now than this whole Sydney Sweeney thing with AEO. 665 00:38:32,239 --> 00:38:37,080 Speaker 2: Whatever you think of that, whatever you think of that. Mechanically, 666 00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:42,160 Speaker 2: the outrage is part of the advocacy, and the advocacy 667 00:38:42,200 --> 00:38:45,160 Speaker 2: would not be as strong without that outrage. And so 668 00:38:45,239 --> 00:38:47,480 Speaker 2: while I don't have any opinion I'm going to put 669 00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:52,040 Speaker 2: forth on that work. I know that there's more of 670 00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:56,000 Speaker 2: that to come, and I actually respect it mechanically, even 671 00:38:56,040 --> 00:38:58,000 Speaker 2: if I don't respect it topically. 672 00:38:59,200 --> 00:39:02,360 Speaker 1: Let's look a bit to the new future. Let's assume 673 00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:05,520 Speaker 1: five years from now, what story would you want a 674 00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:09,480 Speaker 1: young creator or brand manager to tell about how they 675 00:39:09,600 --> 00:39:14,280 Speaker 1: used their role to widen the circle rather than protect 676 00:39:14,280 --> 00:39:17,680 Speaker 1: the status quo as an outcome of all your work 677 00:39:17,719 --> 00:39:20,080 Speaker 1: you're doing and working with those people. 678 00:39:21,280 --> 00:39:25,640 Speaker 2: Another great question, Christian. Five years from today, I think 679 00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:31,240 Speaker 2: it would be great if you had a brand manager 680 00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:35,959 Speaker 2: or director from one of my partners is JP Morgan Chase, 681 00:39:36,760 --> 00:39:39,080 Speaker 2: And I remember it might have even been a conversation 682 00:39:39,160 --> 00:39:40,680 Speaker 2: with you, did you do want to use with Carla 683 00:39:40,960 --> 00:39:41,399 Speaker 2: and she was. 684 00:39:41,320 --> 00:39:42,959 Speaker 1: Talking about Yeah it was in the last season. 685 00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:44,799 Speaker 2: Yeah was that the episode I heard? And she was 686 00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:49,120 Speaker 2: talking about craft service? Yeah? Okay, yes, yeah. So five 687 00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:52,759 Speaker 2: years from today, I would love to have someone from 688 00:39:52,840 --> 00:39:55,040 Speaker 2: JP Morgan Chase be able to stand on our stage 689 00:39:55,080 --> 00:40:00,640 Speaker 2: and say, look at our economic impact. First, five years 690 00:40:00,680 --> 00:40:04,160 Speaker 2: ago today, we did a deal with United Masters whereby 691 00:40:04,760 --> 00:40:06,719 Speaker 2: a couple of things happened. Number one, all of our 692 00:40:06,840 --> 00:40:10,879 Speaker 2: music needs outside of a couple like prestige appointments were 693 00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:16,440 Speaker 2: met by independent Creator owned IP, and we started to 694 00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:22,480 Speaker 2: measure how much Creator owned IP we cleared globally, and 695 00:40:22,719 --> 00:40:26,319 Speaker 2: just by measuring that alone, we started to realize that 696 00:40:26,440 --> 00:40:29,319 Speaker 2: we were building these new small businesses that we could 697 00:40:29,360 --> 00:40:32,600 Speaker 2: equip in multiple other ways through this, that the other. 698 00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:36,440 Speaker 2: And then because of that, we started to realize that 699 00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:40,360 Speaker 2: we could play a significant role in making superstars just 700 00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:45,600 Speaker 2: by our sink strategy on our Sapphire commercials, but also 701 00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:49,080 Speaker 2: by ensuring that these artists got visibility around all of 702 00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:51,600 Speaker 2: the entitlements that we have sundance, this, this, that the other. 703 00:40:52,600 --> 00:40:55,359 Speaker 2: As we did that, we documented it all and we 704 00:40:55,400 --> 00:41:01,680 Speaker 2: really developed the signature expose on how the creative class 705 00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:04,600 Speaker 2: is built from the ground up right now and how 706 00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:09,600 Speaker 2: it's equipped by the products that we build. And so 707 00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:12,640 Speaker 2: in these five years, we've been able to really engineer 708 00:41:12,719 --> 00:41:17,439 Speaker 2: products that are expressly for this class of people all 709 00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:20,399 Speaker 2: around the world. And today I'm really proud to tell 710 00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:26,400 Speaker 2: you that because of this program, we wait our Creator 711 00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:28,640 Speaker 2: owned IP the same way we talk about our carbon 712 00:41:28,640 --> 00:41:33,560 Speaker 2: neutral travel and this is our score here. I'm really 713 00:41:33,560 --> 00:41:36,480 Speaker 2: proud to say that this is the most watched documentary 714 00:41:36,480 --> 00:41:40,040 Speaker 2: on Netflix and released in its year. I'm really proud 715 00:41:40,040 --> 00:41:45,359 Speaker 2: to say that we've identified one hundred thousand net new 716 00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:50,239 Speaker 2: prospects for Chase Private client who we wouldn't have known 717 00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:55,440 Speaker 2: were there. And I'm also happy to say that we've 718 00:41:55,920 --> 00:42:01,800 Speaker 2: paid out over sixty million dollars into the creative economy 719 00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:04,399 Speaker 2: just by changing things that we were already doing. 720 00:42:04,840 --> 00:42:07,040 Speaker 1: That's a great agenda being there in five years, and 721 00:42:07,040 --> 00:42:09,319 Speaker 1: we will look back by then, I will come back 722 00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:11,120 Speaker 1: to you and we we check it out. 723 00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:15,000 Speaker 2: It's the measurement that starts it all. We value what 724 00:42:15,040 --> 00:42:17,040 Speaker 2: we measure. In the moment you start to measure it, 725 00:42:17,680 --> 00:42:19,040 Speaker 2: everything can unlock them. 726 00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:21,120 Speaker 1: There, She'll say, I have a last one for today. 727 00:42:21,600 --> 00:42:24,600 Speaker 1: What's a conspiracy you're building right now? You're working on 728 00:42:24,640 --> 00:42:27,360 Speaker 1: it right now that no one's watching, but everyone should 729 00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:30,240 Speaker 1: know about it. In other words, what can we expect 730 00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:33,200 Speaker 1: very soon from you from your daily work coming out 731 00:42:33,239 --> 00:42:33,440 Speaker 1: of this. 732 00:42:34,320 --> 00:42:36,719 Speaker 2: One of the things I'm really paying attention to translation 733 00:42:37,520 --> 00:42:40,319 Speaker 2: is in the process of opening our first office in 734 00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:45,120 Speaker 2: the GCC, we're gonna be HQT in Dubai there and 735 00:42:45,280 --> 00:42:52,960 Speaker 2: the team in Dubai that we're building has really ratified 736 00:42:53,440 --> 00:42:55,480 Speaker 2: something that new for me. I don't think I had 737 00:42:55,480 --> 00:42:58,640 Speaker 2: ever seen Dubai locals like kids that were born in 738 00:42:58,719 --> 00:43:03,799 Speaker 2: expat rich communities that before. And it's just incredible how 739 00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:07,560 Speaker 2: culturally fluent they are all around the world, like the 740 00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:10,160 Speaker 2: things that they can plug into, and this idea of 741 00:43:10,239 --> 00:43:18,200 Speaker 2: third culture kids and the social and economic reward getting 742 00:43:18,200 --> 00:43:21,400 Speaker 2: further and further apart, by which I mean we are 743 00:43:21,480 --> 00:43:23,799 Speaker 2: clearly at a place where you have to kind of 744 00:43:24,320 --> 00:43:28,120 Speaker 2: question yourself before you go spend three hundred thousand dollars 745 00:43:28,160 --> 00:43:30,800 Speaker 2: on law school, right because you know, all those associated 746 00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:34,600 Speaker 2: jobs that existed since seventeen seventy six aren't going to 747 00:43:34,640 --> 00:43:37,319 Speaker 2: exist in the same way because of the pressures we've 748 00:43:37,320 --> 00:43:41,200 Speaker 2: talked about before. And so all these third culture kids, 749 00:43:41,200 --> 00:43:47,320 Speaker 2: and specifically first generation kids in the West are having 750 00:43:48,120 --> 00:43:55,960 Speaker 2: these moments of achievement that their families can't acknowledge. They 751 00:43:55,960 --> 00:44:03,600 Speaker 2: don't know how because there's this unspoken, infinitely translatable support 752 00:44:03,680 --> 00:44:09,400 Speaker 2: for doctor, lawyer, engineer, doctor lawyer, engineer, whether your mom's 753 00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:13,120 Speaker 2: Bamwadeshi Ukrainian Nigerian, those are the three things she'll brag 754 00:44:13,200 --> 00:44:16,640 Speaker 2: to her sisters about. And something about meeting these young 755 00:44:16,640 --> 00:44:20,919 Speaker 2: people and recognizing that for them, success will not fit 756 00:44:21,160 --> 00:44:24,919 Speaker 2: anything shaped like that. I think it's causing a very 757 00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:31,640 Speaker 2: real crisis, a crisis in the social reward getting further 758 00:44:31,680 --> 00:44:35,880 Speaker 2: apart from the economic reward. And I think in that crisis, 759 00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:40,520 Speaker 2: there's a huge opportunity for us to reevaluate what success 760 00:44:40,680 --> 00:44:46,960 Speaker 2: looks like as a civilization. And I'm excited about that. 761 00:44:47,239 --> 00:44:52,399 Speaker 2: I'm excited about a new definition of success because we're 762 00:44:52,480 --> 00:44:56,080 Speaker 2: all going to have to reform our existing ones. Anyway. 763 00:44:57,320 --> 00:45:00,080 Speaker 1: She'll say, that's a great ending, and I think every 764 00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:03,440 Speaker 1: body agrees listening to us today that you don't just 765 00:45:03,920 --> 00:45:07,839 Speaker 1: talk about culture obviously, you engineer the conditions for it 766 00:45:07,880 --> 00:45:11,799 Speaker 1: to thrive with guardrails, with governance, with a moral core. 767 00:45:12,840 --> 00:45:16,200 Speaker 1: Whether it's helping brands showing up with integrity or ensuring 768 00:45:16,360 --> 00:45:20,120 Speaker 1: artists keep the value they create. You're rewriting the rulds 769 00:45:20,280 --> 00:45:22,920 Speaker 1: of how marketing and music interact. And this is impressive 770 00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:27,400 Speaker 1: what you do at Translation and United Masters. Thank you 771 00:45:27,440 --> 00:45:30,320 Speaker 1: so much for your time with us today, for your openness, 772 00:45:30,600 --> 00:45:32,840 Speaker 1: and a personal note, also thank you for your support 773 00:45:32,920 --> 00:45:36,000 Speaker 1: as official advisor of Possible and being a great friend 774 00:45:36,040 --> 00:45:37,160 Speaker 1: in this industry. Thank you. 775 00:45:37,280 --> 00:45:41,280 Speaker 2: Shall say great my pleasure brother. Appreciate you and everybody listening. 776 00:45:41,719 --> 00:45:45,360 Speaker 1: If today's conversation spark new ideas or new questions, you 777 00:45:45,440 --> 00:45:49,080 Speaker 1: can find more Impossible Now follow us on iHeart or 778 00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:52,280 Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts. And if you like this episode, 779 00:45:52,320 --> 00:45:55,200 Speaker 1: shared with someone who still thinks culture is not just 780 00:45:55,280 --> 00:45:58,560 Speaker 1: a buzzword. I'm Christian Muveur and this is Possible Now. 781 00:45:58,560 --> 00:45:59,560 Speaker 2: And see you next time. 782 00:45:59,719 --> 00:46:03,040 Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you, thanks for tuning in everyone. Once again, 783 00:46:03,080 --> 00:46:05,920 Speaker 1: I'm your host, Christian Moher. If you have a question 784 00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:09,480 Speaker 1: or suggestion to me, reach out, send me DM on LinkedIn. 785 00:46:09,800 --> 00:46:12,600 Speaker 1: If you're curious to learn more about Possible, sign up 786 00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:14,759 Speaker 1: for our newsletter, or if you want to join us 787 00:46:14,760 --> 00:46:19,160 Speaker 1: at the Possible Show in Miami, visit Possible event dot com. 788 00:46:19,200 --> 00:46:22,440 Speaker 1: Possible Now is a co production of iHeartMedia and Possible. 789 00:46:22,880 --> 00:46:27,000 Speaker 1: Our executive producers are Ryan Martz and Yasmin Melendez. Our 790 00:46:27,120 --> 00:46:31,320 Speaker 1: supervising producer is Meredith Barnes. Special thanks to Colleen Lawrence 791 00:46:31,360 --> 00:46:35,160 Speaker 1: Mack from our programming team. Our theme music is composed 792 00:46:35,200 --> 00:46:39,200 Speaker 1: by Anthony Keatacoli. For more podcasts from iHeart, visit the 793 00:46:39,239 --> 00:46:42,799 Speaker 1: iHeart app Apple podcast or wherever you listen to your 794 00:46:42,800 --> 00:46:44,120 Speaker 1: favorite shows,