Speaker 1: If this is the meat Eater podcast coming at you shirtless, severely,
Speaker 1: bug bitten, and in my case, underwear.
Speaker 2: Listening toast, you can't predict anything.
Speaker 1: Presented by First Light creating proven versatile hunting apparel from
Speaker 1: Marino bass layers to technical outerwear. For every hunt, first Light,
Speaker 1: go farther, stay longer. You listeners are coming in late
Speaker 1: to a conversation. But I was just fixing to tell
Speaker 1: Chester here on the subject of finding arrowheads my kids
Speaker 1: had Did I tell you about this? They were a
Speaker 1: mess with the metal detector.
Speaker 3: No, you didn't.
Speaker 1: And they struck some metal with that metal detector, and
Speaker 1: on the way digging down to the metal found a
Speaker 1: piece of bit, big worked piece of black obsidian, and
Speaker 1: in their heads it detexts that. And I was trying
Speaker 1: to like, no, this is coincidence. We were something it
Speaker 1: want to be in an old hunk of barber wire fence.
Speaker 1: Was this in your yard? What's that? Where did this
Speaker 1: happen at?
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 1: No, no, no, open the mountains out. Yeah, I want to
Speaker 1: be an old But here's here's the weird deal. That
Speaker 1: fencing was lower than it.
Speaker 2: That's pretty wild.
Speaker 1: It got worked. I don't know. Yeah, beautiful piece of
Speaker 1: worked black obsidian. Like how big about like the size
Speaker 1: of your film.
Speaker 3: That little pocket. If I think it's the same place.
Speaker 1: It's not the same.
Speaker 3: Okay, well where we were it's loaded with flakes chips obviously,
Speaker 3: arrowheads stay out.
Speaker 1: Of there, we will real quick. Who are you guys
Speaker 1: rooting for? On the when? Who guys rooting for? Between
Speaker 1: Elon Musk and Mark Zuckerberg.
Speaker 5: Oh this is I've been talking about this a lot.
Speaker 5: I do a sports radio show and we talk about this.
Speaker 1: On not not who's gonna well, I want to know
Speaker 1: who's gonna win, but who you're rooting for?
Speaker 5: See, I'm rooting for Elon, but I think Zuck has
Speaker 5: just like a sociopath psychopath kind of So you know,
Speaker 5: he's one jiu jitsu tournaments already.
Speaker 1: So well, I don't know how how much does either
Speaker 1: of him?
Speaker 5: Way, Uh, well, Elon's definitely heavier than Zuck, so he's
Speaker 5: gonna have to cut if it's really gonna happen, I think.
Speaker 5: But you know, if you saw Elon's tweet, he said
Speaker 5: that his his main move is the walrus. He just
Speaker 5: lays on you See, I.
Speaker 1: Don't use I don't like I don't even know why
Speaker 1: I'm rock but I don't know why because there's nothing
Speaker 1: he's involved in the interest me. I don't use Twitter,
Speaker 1: I have zero interest in Mars. I will never buy
Speaker 1: a Teslatle electric car. I've bought like a thing on
Speaker 1: PayPal in the last ten years going on Starlink that
Speaker 1: I would get in. Yes, Starlink, I like him.
Speaker 2: Starlink is my favorite.
Speaker 1: I don't know why I'm rooting for him so bad.
Speaker 2: I just I just something about Facebook is just evil
Speaker 2: to me.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know Instagram, which I think you use daily.
Speaker 1: I do use that, but I don't think that my
Speaker 1: access to that if he gets whooped, it just that
Speaker 1: doesn't even matter that much to me, you know it is,
Speaker 1: I use one of his products. But you know what
Speaker 1: the problem my problem is is, uh remember that movie
Speaker 1: about Facebook Social painted like a very unflattering perspective. That
Speaker 1: that for me is that's that that's the story, Like yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: and so you know, and I just have I have
Speaker 1: a friendlier. I have a friendlier. Yeah, I just like
Speaker 1: Elon Musk. I don't know the guy at all. Joy
Speaker 1: to day by.
Speaker 2: That's so random.
Speaker 1: I'm not spent on my mind. Man, we're not about
Speaker 1: what gonna talk to you.
Speaker 6: I thought the I thought the fight was already called off.
Speaker 1: No, no, I know they're trying to make it. No,
Speaker 1: you're thinking of progos ands. Uh, there is, there is,
Speaker 1: there's something.
Speaker 2: There was something in the news about how Elon.
Speaker 6: Came out and said my mother asked me not to fight, and.
Speaker 1: So really yeah, see, I thought you were confused about
Speaker 1: the in.
Speaker 2: This fight get the group and.
Speaker 6: I've been I've been reading equal amounts about both.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I talk about short lived coop. Yeah that
Speaker 1: so fast.
Speaker 2: Nothing happened.
Speaker 1: I know I could. I could like woke up in
Speaker 1: the morning like expecting, you know, the Kremlin, you know,
Speaker 1: and he's like, we've justed to just go home. I
Speaker 1: was like, man, the guys, I like that works.
Speaker 6: He's a hot ruck, he's a hot tug vendor.
Speaker 1: Yeah it works that way. Well way you go. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I know. But you know. Humble Origins joined today by
Speaker 1: former Denver Broncos defensive end Derek Wolf, who sacked I mean,
Speaker 1: how times if people point this out that you sacked
Speaker 1: Tom Brady, Price sacked all kinds of I.
Speaker 5: Got Tom Brady. I sacked him the most though, he's
Speaker 5: the quarterback that I got to the most.
Speaker 1: Here's my here's my first question for you. We're gonna
Speaker 1: come back to this more when if you talk to
Speaker 1: I don't want to. I'm not trying to equate military service,
Speaker 1: which I have no experience into athletic which I have
Speaker 1: no experience in. But uhle say continue, okay, if you
Speaker 1: talk to him. To military uh professionals, you're striving toward
Speaker 1: a like a dispassionate approach, meaning if you're going to
Speaker 1: like raid bin Laden's compound, you take the same mental
Speaker 1: attitude is all of the other dozens or hundreds of
Speaker 1: rage you'd been on, right, do you know what I mean? Like, like, yeah,
Speaker 1: you're aware, but when it comes to doing it, it's
Speaker 1: just that's out of your head.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it doesn't matter who it is.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 2: It's like it's the guy with the ball, seatball, get ball.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 2: Like that's that's it's simple.
Speaker 1: So but in your mind, are you like I am
Speaker 1: gonna I have the potential right now to sack this
Speaker 1: guy that people.
Speaker 5: Say it's not how it doesn't You don't even care.
Speaker 5: You don't try harder because when you're out there, everybody's
Speaker 5: on an equal playing level, like everybody's on the same level.
Speaker 5: Like it just you don't think like that, You don't
Speaker 5: think like all is Tom Brady really just just you know,
Speaker 5: And I was maybe I'm different because when I first
Speaker 5: got drafted by Denver, Peyton Manning was my quarterback, so
Speaker 5: I had a relationship with Peyton Manning right away. So
Speaker 5: I wasn't like starstruck, you know what I mean. And
Speaker 5: then my first sack in the first game was against
Speaker 5: Ben Roethlisberg.
Speaker 2: You know, it's like.
Speaker 1: Guys you get nervous when you sack them.
Speaker 5: Well, guys get seriously guys kind of get like that
Speaker 5: sometimes where they're like.
Speaker 1: They get starstruck about a player.
Speaker 5: Well they as I got older, like in my fourth season,
Speaker 5: I'd seen the rookie rookies come in and they'd see
Speaker 5: Peyton and they'd be like and then not realize that
Speaker 5: he's just like a normal guy that you know, drinks
Speaker 5: bud heavy and plays football and you.
Speaker 2: Know, he's just a normal guy.
Speaker 5: He'll sit down at breakfast to have a conversation with
Speaker 5: you about whatever.
Speaker 2: He's just that kind of guy.
Speaker 5: And Tom Brady's the same way as a competitor, you know,
Speaker 5: what I mean out there on the field, Like if
Speaker 5: you get him and make a good play, he'll tell you,
Speaker 5: like a good play, you know, oh really yeah, he'd like,
Speaker 5: oh that was a good play. You got me on
Speaker 5: that one. You know that was like he bat one
Speaker 5: of his passes. He'll lose his mind.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 5: Quarterbacks hate that when he like bat passes, block balls
Speaker 5: and stuff like that. But you know, he's just a
Speaker 5: great competitor. Probably the best competitor I ever played against, honestly,
Speaker 5: because you could you know, AFC Championship game in twenty fifteen,
Speaker 5: the first series of the game, I buried him and
Speaker 5: this is when you can still land on the quarterback.
Speaker 5: And I buried him, like put all three hundred pounds
Speaker 5: on him and just buried him into the ground. And
Speaker 5: he just that's people forget how tough he really was.
Speaker 5: Like he jumped right back up like it was nothing,
Speaker 5: and I heard the wind leave him, you know, you know,
Speaker 5: And it was like the first like I think it
Speaker 5: was a third play of the game. And we ended
Speaker 5: up hitting him twenty seven times in that game. Oh
Speaker 5: so he got buried twenty seven times and he still
Speaker 5: almost came back and beat us.
Speaker 1: They made a rule that you're not supposed to land
Speaker 1: on the quarterback? Yeah, what are you supposed to land
Speaker 1: on your elbow?
Speaker 3: Oh?
Speaker 5: They want you to like do everything you can so
Speaker 5: you can't hit him below the knees, you can't touch
Speaker 5: his head at all, don't even like graze his head,
Speaker 5: and you can't hit him with your own head. You
Speaker 5: can't grab him and whip him to the ground, dude,
Speaker 5: So it's got to be So.
Speaker 1: It changed everything. It made it a lot harder to
Speaker 1: tackle him. So it's like you're like playing in the
Speaker 1: yard with your kids.
Speaker 5: Well you like it, Yeah, it's like pick him up, Like,
Speaker 5: I don't know. So the first year they implemented them
Speaker 5: set him down. The first year they implemented that role.
Speaker 5: This is little off. So the first year they implement that. Ever,
Speaker 5: I missed like seven opportunities to have a sack, right,
Speaker 5: and these are you know this we could talk about
Speaker 5: because you're nervous. Well it's not even that. It's just
Speaker 5: that like, yeah, you're nervous because the fine, So I'm saying,
Speaker 5: like you're nervous breaking it's a fifteen to twenty five
Speaker 5: thousand dollars fine when you get those rough in the
Speaker 5: passer calls.
Speaker 1: That comes out of whose pocket?
Speaker 2: Mine?
Speaker 4: Really?
Speaker 5: Yeah, a pre tax too, and they're already taxing you.
Speaker 5: I'm already paying fifty percent. You know, I'm already paying
Speaker 5: half of my money to the gut to Uncle Sam.
Speaker 5: And then the you know, the league is like, oh,
Speaker 5: by the way, you had a penalty. So here's a
Speaker 5: fifteen thousand dollars fine that just shows up in your
Speaker 5: locker and you never you don't even write to check.
Speaker 5: They just take it out of your paycheck. It's crazy.
Speaker 5: So the first year of the implementary.
Speaker 1: Watching football, they don't have the They don't like put
Speaker 1: that like.
Speaker 5: No, no, like you Oh how many fines is he paid?
Speaker 5: You can find for all kinds of stuff. We had
Speaker 5: a guy that you know, weight finds it's a thousand
Speaker 5: dollars a pound.
Speaker 1: What's that mean?
Speaker 5: When you're when you you have a you have a
Speaker 5: weight that you're supposed to be at, and if you're
Speaker 5: over or under that weight, it's a thousand bucks a pound.
Speaker 1: How precise is the weight?
Speaker 2: It depends?
Speaker 1: Oh why does the band so?
Speaker 5: Underweight is usually like forgivable. But when you're overweight, that's
Speaker 5: when they start hitting you. Like if you'd one to
Speaker 5: two pounds over, they.
Speaker 1: Might warn the band you're supposed to land in.
Speaker 5: So all right, So for example, we had a guy
Speaker 5: that his his report his report weight was three hundred
Speaker 5: and thirty pounds. He's showed up at four of like
Speaker 5: four fifteen at training camp, and over that season he
Speaker 5: got fined three hundred and seventy five thousand dollars.
Speaker 1: It takes body body shame into a whole new level.
Speaker 2: Right, yeah, yeah, so you gotta every Friday.
Speaker 3: Body shaming is that by the NFL or by the
Speaker 3: team that's by the team.
Speaker 7: Didn't Von Miller famously get fined for farting in like
Speaker 7: a film session too?
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, that was it. Yeah, So that's like a
Speaker 5: that it's like a position group thing. So every position
Speaker 5: group in their room. So we always had it was
Speaker 5: one hundred. It was a five hundred dollars fine for farting.
Speaker 5: We just the fun thing about those ones, are you
Speaker 5: guys self please?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, because.
Speaker 5: You wouldn't like, well, you're plus one hundred for snitching.
Speaker 5: So if I catch somebody far like hey it was him,
Speaker 5: it was I got a hard bucks.
Speaker 8: This right here is one of the many reasons I
Speaker 8: didn't become a professional football player.
Speaker 5: But it's simply just get up and walk out and fart,
Speaker 5: you know what I mean. So the funny thing about
Speaker 5: Vaughn is Vaughn ended up bringing you know that fart spray. Yeah,
Speaker 5: he'd bring that fart spray and spray and just everybody
Speaker 5: would lose. Like it just cleared the whole room out
Speaker 5: for a couple hours. But yeah, the fun thing about
Speaker 5: those finds, those room finds, like the position finds, we
Speaker 5: get to take that money at the end of the
Speaker 5: year and go do something for ourselves with it, like
Speaker 5: as a group, you know, go to like a big dinner,
Speaker 5: go like go to Vegas or something. Cheese, go to
Speaker 5: Chuck e Cheese, Urban Air, do some trampolines, you know,
Speaker 5: all kinds of cool stuff you could do with it.
Speaker 5: But yeah, but the landing on the quarterback thing, it
Speaker 5: made it. I remember when the referees come in, they
Speaker 5: come in during training camp and explain the new rules,
Speaker 5: and they started talking about this and we were like, well, then,
Speaker 5: how are we supposed to tackle him to the ground?
Speaker 5: And the refs were like, I don't know, that's what
Speaker 5: they said. They said, we don't know, figure it out.
Speaker 5: Just don't land on him. If you land on him,
Speaker 5: we will throw the flag, like no matter what if
Speaker 5: your body lands on top of his. And there we
Speaker 5: were like, well what if we like sprawl out like
Speaker 5: you know what I mean, it's like sprang and like
Speaker 5: you know, it doesn't matter if you land on him,
Speaker 5: it's over.
Speaker 1: And then so you're doing like a plank over him.
Speaker 5: Yeah, so basically what they want you to do is
Speaker 5: like pick him up and like fall on your back
Speaker 5: with him on top of you.
Speaker 2: That's kind of what they want.
Speaker 5: And what was happening is I get the guys wrapped
Speaker 5: up and the go to spin them and they just
Speaker 5: throw the ball away. So I'm like, I'm missing all
Speaker 5: these sacks because I can't like bury the guy. And
Speaker 5: then it then you that's the other thing. The more
Speaker 5: you have to think out there, the slower you are
Speaker 5: and you miss opportunities and stuff like that. So yeah,
Speaker 5: it's a stupid role that is changing games.
Speaker 2: And you see it.
Speaker 5: Now where guys are You're like, how is that a
Speaker 5: roughing the passers? Because you can't land on the guy
Speaker 5: and it's insane. And then you can't you can't touch
Speaker 5: his You can't graze his helmet, Like, don't even graze it.
Speaker 2: That's a fifteen yard flag.
Speaker 7: Peyton Manning strikes me as a millerte guy. You said
Speaker 7: he drinks Budweiser.
Speaker 1: Really he's what he's a hunter?
Speaker 7: Oh yeah, sure, but that that doesn't mean that he
Speaker 7: uh no, he's exclusive to Budweiser.
Speaker 1: He strikes you like a light beer if I had if.
Speaker 7: I looked at Peyton Manning, knowing what I know about
Speaker 7: Peyton Manning, but like he drinks Miller Light, not Budweiser,
Speaker 7: Bud heavies.
Speaker 1: Okay, Oh you don't mean because of I've had enough
Speaker 1: current events for.
Speaker 7: Today, not even not even related to that. Just he
Speaker 7: looks like he'd be in a Miller Light ad.
Speaker 1: Derrek Wolf came out just just for listeners. Uh, Derek
Speaker 1: Wolf was heavy duty on our radar and uh we
Speaker 1: even wrote a bottom, wrote a bottom at our website
Speaker 1: on the meter dot com because he got in one
Speaker 1: of those uh, one of those things that happens six
Speaker 1: times a year where a person well known in one
Speaker 1: sphere of the world goes hunting and then they uh
Speaker 1: and then they pay the price on social media with
Speaker 1: all the uproar and death threats. In your case, you
Speaker 1: did a mountain lion hunt, no.
Speaker 5: Poaching, no, everything was by the book. Man, I did
Speaker 5: everything by the book. It wasn't even a paid like
Speaker 5: outfitting hunt. It was like a buddy of mine that
Speaker 5: runs hounds and was like, I said, hey, if you
Speaker 5: ever have an opening and you want to go, hit
Speaker 5: me up, like I'm just we can go forty five
Speaker 5: minutes outside the city and chase lions.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 5: So this is actually my second time having PETA and
Speaker 5: TMC and all them guys on my butt, you know,
Speaker 5: over over hunting because I I went to New Mexico
Speaker 5: and did a bison hunt with my bow.
Speaker 2: Oh they got him riled up, and that got them
Speaker 2: all rolled up. And what riled them up really.
Speaker 5: Was the picture I posted because it was a perfect
Speaker 5: heart shot. So when we get when we opened that
Speaker 5: animal up, my ear was still buried in its heart.
Speaker 5: So I pulled the heart out, and I was.
Speaker 1: Like, they didn't like that.
Speaker 3: None.
Speaker 2: They didn't like that. They didn't like that at all.
Speaker 2: So they made a big deal.
Speaker 5: But they're like buffalo or they're going extinct. I'm like,
Speaker 5: they're not. Come on, no, they're not. They just people
Speaker 5: don't know.
Speaker 1: It's so beside the point, like any kind of reality,
Speaker 1: so beside the point. It was funny is we could
Speaker 1: do that kind of stuff. Well, in fact, do do
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff all day long. But it's just
Speaker 1: like people don't like being surprised. They know someone somewhere
Speaker 1: and they don't like seeing that that. They don't like
Speaker 1: seeing that raw edge in them. Yeah, surprises them. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like if you're like famous for something, if you're like
Speaker 1: an attractive young lady, they're just not gonna like it.
Speaker 5: Well, it's like, are you surprised I told Philip Rivers
Speaker 5: I was gonna eat his children? Like you're surprised that
Speaker 5: I'm out bow hunting?
Speaker 1: You'd have to be hungry, yes, yeah, but.
Speaker 5: That's I mean, that's another story that was That was
Speaker 5: That was hilarious when I said that to him, because
Speaker 5: he talked a lot of smack, you know, Phil did.
Speaker 5: But but with the lion hunt, the way it went down, man,
Speaker 5: it was. It was my buddy Alex Nessa, he runs hounds,
Speaker 5: and he was like, Hey, tomorrow we're getting in front,
Speaker 5: We're going to fresh now tonight.
Speaker 2: You know, be on call.
Speaker 5: I'll call you if we find When I said, listen,
Speaker 5: i'll be at your house at five thirty, we're gonna
Speaker 5: go out and do something regardless.
Speaker 2: So he's like, all right, cool.
Speaker 5: So I show up and we started, you know, trying
Speaker 5: to cut tracks, just driving back roads, and then found
Speaker 5: a couple of smaller tracks, nothing really worth chasing. A
Speaker 5: couple of females, a couple of cubs, a couple of
Speaker 5: smaller males, and which are really after is this big toms?
Speaker 5: Because the big toms are like, they're killing a lot
Speaker 5: of deer, they're killing a lot of elk, they're killing
Speaker 5: a lot of sheep, they're killing dogs, they're killing other
Speaker 5: cubs to get the females back in the heat, just
Speaker 5: like bears do, and bigger, and they're just bigger and
Speaker 5: cooler and harder to get.
Speaker 2: So we cut this.
Speaker 5: We come across this track and it was kind of
Speaker 5: going back and forth from up under the underneath this
Speaker 5: guy's cabin. It's going from from his cabin porch to
Speaker 5: under this tree. So we go over and look onder
Speaker 5: the tree. There's a half feet meal deer under there,
Speaker 5: big four by four, and we're like, oh, this is
Speaker 5: the one.
Speaker 2: You know, his track was huge. I couldn't believe. I
Speaker 2: was like, I was like, these.
Speaker 5: Things are out here roaming around just in you know,
Speaker 5: people's neighborhoods. Pretty it's not like a it's a mountain neighborhood,
Speaker 5: you know what those neighborhoods look like. But still it's
Speaker 5: a neighborhood. So so there's public land all around, but
Speaker 5: where the line had went.
Speaker 2: Through, it was private.
Speaker 5: So we had to get permis from this guy so
Speaker 5: we could go through there and and cut his tracks.
Speaker 5: So we're just like kind of hoping that this guy's
Speaker 5: not an anti hunter and is down for it.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 5: So we went up and kind of knocked. It was
Speaker 5: like six in the morning at this point, so I
Speaker 5: just kind of tapped on the door, and we're like, wow, hey,
Speaker 5: there's a line out here. You know, I don't want
Speaker 5: to do that, so I just kind of tapped on
Speaker 5: the door and he didn't answer. Nobody came to the door.
Speaker 5: I didn't see the lights on, so I was like,
Speaker 5: maybe he's just not a home. But there was a
Speaker 5: truck in the driveway, so I assumed somebody was home.
Speaker 5: So we left and we were trying to find a
Speaker 5: phone number to call this guy. On and with you know,
Speaker 5: with Google and with you know, all these online maps,
Speaker 5: now you can kind of figure out who owns what property.
Speaker 5: And we were able to get some of the neighbor's numbers,
Speaker 5: and we started hearing stories about how many lions are
Speaker 5: actually in this area causing wreaking havoc like this. One
Speaker 5: woman was talking about how last year a couple of
Speaker 5: dogs got eaten and her dog, her dogs are being
Speaker 5: harassed every night. She's afraid to leave her house at
Speaker 5: night because there's a line that comes up and looks
Speaker 5: in her window and just stares at stares in the
Speaker 5: window at her little dogs.
Speaker 1: Pervert.
Speaker 2: Yeah, like this little pervert lion, you know, yeah, peeping.
Speaker 1: That was good, doctor Randall. We need a little scorecard. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but I think this podcast Randall.
Speaker 5: But we turns out that that's like a dude ranch
Speaker 5: where this guy it's like the ranch manager. The guy
Speaker 5: lives there on this dude ranch. So, uh, we couldn't
Speaker 5: get a hold of anybody that owned the dude ranch.
Speaker 5: So finally we drive We just were like, let's drive
Speaker 5: down and see if we can get around his property
Speaker 5: and try to catch the tracks, which is gonna it's
Speaker 5: gonna suck because the hiking is like straight up and down.
Speaker 5: It's straight cliffs, two feet of fresh snow. It's going
Speaker 5: to be kind of miserable regardless. So we're like, well,
Speaker 5: you know, it's going to take us three miles out
Speaker 5: of our way, but you know, if we want to
Speaker 5: get him, we got to go now. So we started
Speaker 5: driving down and here comes the guy out of his
Speaker 5: out of his house, kind of waving at us. He's like, hey,
Speaker 5: you guys lying hunters and we're like yeah, and he
Speaker 5: was like, you see these tracks going across my Arner said, dude,
Speaker 5: we've been trying to get a hold of you for
Speaker 5: two hours.
Speaker 1: And he's like, oh, is that you guys on the porch?
Speaker 2: I said yeah. He's like, oh, I thought it was
Speaker 2: that lion.
Speaker 5: So he thought the lion because he said he's like,
Speaker 5: there's this big line that keeps coming up onto my
Speaker 5: porch and looking in my windows and so so the track,
Speaker 5: I mean, the tracks went right by his steps, you know,
Speaker 5: and he's like, did you see how big those tracks are.
Speaker 5: We're like, he's like, he's huge. And he's like we're like,
Speaker 5: you care if we go after him? He's like, please
Speaker 5: go get him, Please get him out of here. So we so,
Speaker 5: you know, we jump out, I grab my pack, grab
Speaker 5: my bow, we let the dogs out, and we just
Speaker 5: go straight up and we and on the way up,
Speaker 5: I'm like, I'm starting to slip and slide already, and
Speaker 5: I'm like, this ain't good. This is going to turn
Speaker 5: in and I already know what it. Hopefully he's treated at
Speaker 5: the top of this this mountain already, Like hopefully he
Speaker 5: was just up there and he's treed already. Well, we
Speaker 5: get up there, and he wasn't. He goes all the
Speaker 5: way back down the other the backside. So we started
Speaker 5: like nine thousand feet or like eighty nine hundred feet
Speaker 5: and go all the way up to like eleven two.
Speaker 2: Or something like that.
Speaker 5: Oh really, and then drop back down on the other side,
Speaker 5: down into a drainage. And then he runs up this drainage.
Speaker 5: So at this point, I'm you know, I'm almost three
Speaker 5: hundred pounds out there, and I'm in good shape, but
Speaker 5: getting through snow and stuff like that, it just takes
Speaker 5: twice as much energy to get anywhere. So I'm like
Speaker 5: falling behind already, you know, on the way up, let
Speaker 5: alone the way down, which was just like might as
Speaker 5: well just sled down.
Speaker 1: I was just going through snow and my skinny ass
Speaker 1: little body, you'd be loving it.
Speaker 2: Oh, I'd be awesome.
Speaker 1: I mean switch gears.
Speaker 3: I was.
Speaker 1: Cutting through that snow like you wouldn't believe.
Speaker 7: Man.
Speaker 5: By the time I got to the other side of
Speaker 5: that mountain and was like I gotta I was. I
Speaker 5: just was falling the tracks, following Alex and the dogs.
Speaker 5: I was just following their tracks. So by the time
Speaker 5: I get to to like halfway down that hill, I
Speaker 5: had to stop because I was like sweating already. I
Speaker 5: was like starting to like I don't know, I'm starting
Speaker 5: because I was like, this.
Speaker 2: Is gonna be a long day. I already know it.
Speaker 5: So I get down and I crawled up through all
Speaker 5: this dead fall and and uh and the snow at
Speaker 5: that down in that drain and you know, all rolls
Speaker 5: down there. It was up to my chest pretty much.
Speaker 5: So I just started crawling. I just crawled through, and
Speaker 5: he was like.
Speaker 1: And the Lion's cutting across the top of.
Speaker 5: It, yeah, so more or less floating on it. Yeah,
Speaker 5: he's just floating on and the dogs are floating on it.
Speaker 5: And then Alex is you know, he's not. He's like
Speaker 5: one hundred and sixty five hundred and sventy five pounds,
Speaker 5: so he's just kind of floating on it too. But me,
Speaker 5: every time I take a step, it's just like straight down.
Speaker 5: So I just started crawling. So I crawled and he keeps.
Speaker 5: He calls me. He goes, where are you at? And
Speaker 5: I said, dude, I'm I don't even know where. I
Speaker 5: can't hear the hounds anymore. I'm way behind you. And
Speaker 5: he was like, all right, We'll just keep following my tracks.
Speaker 5: He's like, I think they got him. I think they
Speaker 5: got him treated now about you know, two miles up here.
Speaker 5: And I was like, all right, cool, So I keep
Speaker 5: going and then he.
Speaker 2: Calls me again.
Speaker 5: He goes, hey, there's a spot where you're gonna see
Speaker 5: where I turned and went to go up the hill
Speaker 5: and came back down. Just keep going up the hill
Speaker 5: when you get there. And I'm like, okay. He calls
Speaker 5: it a hill. No, it's a it's a straight mountain.
Speaker 5: And so I just go straight up that mountain, crawl
Speaker 5: up there. I get to the top and start walking
Speaker 5: the ridge, following his tracks, and he calls me again.
Speaker 5: He's like, you gotta you know, he starts freaking out.
Speaker 5: I don't know if you've ever been onto these hound hunts. Oh,
Speaker 5: it's chaos. He's he's and in the background I can
Speaker 5: hear the hounds. He's like, we're gonna lose this line.
Speaker 5: Where are you at? He's huge, and I was like, dude,
Speaker 5: I'm coming, like, I'm doing everything I can. I'm going
Speaker 5: as fast as I can. At this point, I'm cramping.
Speaker 5: So I'm now my hamstrings, my quads and my forearms
Speaker 5: and my like rib cage is like starting to cramp
Speaker 5: up and I can't.
Speaker 1: Like your rib cage is cramped.
Speaker 5: Yeah, like all those like in here, like all those
Speaker 5: abdomen muscles are starting to lock up on me. And
Speaker 5: I'm like, oh, this ain't good. He goes, all right,
Speaker 5: I'm gonna drop you a pin. Come straight to the pin.
Speaker 5: I'm like all right, So he drops this pin and
Speaker 5: I just like hauled down. I just like roll down
Speaker 5: the mountain pretty much, just sliding and ripping my pants
Speaker 5: up and falling all over the place. And because I
Speaker 5: can't stand up and walk, because if I stand up
Speaker 5: a walk, I just cramp. I'm just like Charlie Horse
Speaker 5: Charlie Horse, Charlie Horse. And then like I'm like, oh, like,
Speaker 5: my whole body starts locking up. So I just like,
Speaker 5: I'm just gonna crawl. So I crawled down backwards down
Speaker 5: that thing and rolled down it and slid down it
Speaker 5: as much as I could get to the pen.
Speaker 2: It's on the road. I'm like, oh nah, and he
Speaker 2: I called him.
Speaker 5: I was like, dude, you drop me a pin on
Speaker 5: the road. Are you seriously goes Oh, you're you know,
Speaker 5: we're screwed now. You're never getting up here.
Speaker 8: Oh.
Speaker 5: And I was like, wait, He's like, you gotta come
Speaker 5: all the way back up. He's like, I told you
Speaker 5: to walk the ridge and drop down on the pin.
Speaker 5: I said, no, you didn't. You said come straight to
Speaker 5: the pin. I said, all right, I'm not arguing.
Speaker 2: I'm coming.
Speaker 5: And this is only like nine hundred yards that I
Speaker 5: had to go to get to him get or nine
Speaker 5: hundred feet to get to.
Speaker 2: Where he was.
Speaker 1: It's been like hours at this point.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, oh.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's yeah, we're four or five hours into this,
Speaker 5: like like it just took so long to get anywhere.
Speaker 5: And I look up and I still it's in this cut.
Speaker 5: So it's a big cut like this, and it's just
Speaker 5: deadfall everywhere and little cliffs and stuff, and I'm like,
Speaker 5: all right, here you go. So I just crawled my
Speaker 5: way up there. It took me about an hour and
Speaker 5: a half to get to get up there. And I
Speaker 5: get up there and I hear, you know right, he's
Speaker 5: got the hounds and he's like, you're almost every buddy,
Speaker 5: keep coming. Then I turn and look and I look
Speaker 5: up and there's a lion sitting right above me in
Speaker 5: a tree doing that.
Speaker 2: And I was like, oh man, he's huge.
Speaker 5: I was like, I can't believe how biggie is. And
Speaker 5: I was like, I just shoot him here, and he's like, no,
Speaker 5: he's gotta fall on you. I was like, I can't move, man,
Speaker 5: I'm done. And there's a video of me if you
Speaker 5: look on my Instagram or even on my YouTube channel.
Speaker 5: He took a veh had his phone out taking a
Speaker 5: video of me standing up in that moment, and you
Speaker 5: can see on my face I'm.
Speaker 2: Just pale white.
Speaker 5: I'm just look like defeated, right, And I'm like I
Speaker 5: just wouldn't give up, though, So I just kept going
Speaker 5: and I had to go like ten more yards to
Speaker 5: get to him, and I just got up and made
Speaker 5: my way up to him, and he was facing me.
Speaker 5: The lion was facing straight at me in that tree,
Speaker 5: so I had to do a frontel on him. And
Speaker 5: I was like, all right, it's time to send one.
Speaker 5: And he was like, put it right above this little
Speaker 5: white spot and I was like, all right, I put
Speaker 5: it right on that white spot. And he fell out
Speaker 5: of the tree and I just boom, fell to the
Speaker 5: ground and I was just like I'm done. I was like,
Speaker 5: I hope he doesn't come up here because I can't
Speaker 5: fight back right now. And he's like, all right, give
Speaker 5: him a minute. And we didn't hear any movement, so
Speaker 5: he's like, all right, I'm go down there and check it.
Speaker 5: So he goes down there, he's like, we got a
Speaker 5: dead lion, you know. He go starts freaking out and
Speaker 5: he's like, let the hounds come down. So I had
Speaker 5: to like unhook those and that took me forever because
Speaker 5: every movement was like and then I start thinking, how
Speaker 5: am I going to get him out of here? How
Speaker 5: manna get this line out of here? So I let
Speaker 5: the dogs go and go down there, and he's like, where,
Speaker 5: hurry up, get down here, and I'm just like trying
Speaker 5: to take my time, you know. So I crawl backwards
Speaker 5: down there. When I say backwards, I'm on my hands
Speaker 5: and knees, crawling backwards down the hill, slipping, sliding down,
Speaker 5: you know, and grabbing trees to hold me. And finally
Speaker 5: we get to it, and I couldn't believe how big
Speaker 5: he was. Could not believe. I was like, this thing
Speaker 5: could drag me by my neck up a tree if
Speaker 5: it wanted to. And he goes, we gotta get a
Speaker 5: picture of this thing. He's like, he's like, set your
Speaker 5: stuff over here, and let's take a picture of him.
Speaker 5: And I was like, dude, forget the picture. Man, let's
Speaker 5: get him out of here. And he's like, no, no, no,
Speaker 5: he's huge. He's one of the biggest lines I've ever seen.
Speaker 5: He's been hunting lines for, you know, fifteen years, so
Speaker 5: he's he knows what he's talking about.
Speaker 2: And so I'm like, all right, whatever.
Speaker 5: I go to pick this thing up and I grab
Speaker 5: it around a belly and I lift it up and
Speaker 5: I'm like, I'm like, dude, this thing is like two
Speaker 5: hundred pounds. He's like, nah, he's probably like one seventy
Speaker 5: one sixty five, and I'm like, dude, I know what
Speaker 5: two hundred pounds feels like. This thing's two hundred plus,
Speaker 5: telling you, and he's like, yeah, whatever, and I get
Speaker 5: him up and then he's in the head just like
Speaker 5: flops right onto my forehead and I'm like, che you know,
Speaker 5: you can't even see my face and he goes flop
Speaker 5: his head to the side, so I like like nudge
Speaker 5: his head over and boomy. That's the picture the famous
Speaker 5: bitch I snapped that he snapped of me right there,
Speaker 5: and then I just dropped him and he comes over.
Speaker 5: Let me feel this thing. He could hardly pick it up.
Speaker 5: He's like, oh man, he is heavy. So we gutted
Speaker 5: him out and I just laid him acry. I have
Speaker 5: a Kafaro Striker XL pack and has like a meat
Speaker 5: hanger on it, so I just like hung that line
Speaker 5: across that. So the tail it's eight and a half
Speaker 5: feet long, so the tail's hanging out one end and
Speaker 5: the head's hanging out the other end. And there's also
Speaker 5: a video of me doing that, trying to get over
Speaker 5: this dead fall, and you can see I'm just like wrecked.
Speaker 5: He goes heavy, huh, And I'm like yeah, it's heavy.
Speaker 5: I was like, I pack elk out and everything, you know,
Speaker 5: put one hundred and fifty hundred and sixty pounds of
Speaker 5: elk meat, you know, with a skull and antlers, and
Speaker 5: really don't have a problem. This is like I'm struggling
Speaker 5: with this. So I did the same thing. He's like,
Speaker 5: I'm gonna get the dogs down here because it wore out,
Speaker 5: you know. So he just takes off. He doesn't even
Speaker 5: help me, he just takes off. So I strapped my
Speaker 5: boat on my packs, you know, with the lion in there,
Speaker 5: and get in and I start crawling down backwards with
Speaker 5: this lion just like dragging on, you know, it's just
Speaker 5: dragging all over the place.
Speaker 2: And I get to this.
Speaker 5: I thought I was taking the same path that I
Speaker 5: took up, but I kind of went the wrong way,
Speaker 5: and I like I had to get across this little
Speaker 5: drop off. It was probably ten foot drop off, and
Speaker 5: I was like, I got to walk across this now.
Speaker 5: And when I say, I took one step and just
Speaker 5: foot feet came right out from under me shim. And
Speaker 5: I was like, I just put my arms across my
Speaker 5: body and accepted my fate. At that point, I was like,
Speaker 5: who knows what I'm gonna land on, And luckily I
Speaker 5: landed like right underneath this tree and it was just soft,
Speaker 5: and I was just super lucky that I landed right there,
Speaker 5: because like all around me is deadfall and I could
Speaker 5: have gotten paled or something.
Speaker 2: But I fell off that thing.
Speaker 5: And then I had to repack the lion on this slope,
Speaker 5: you know, I had to repack him in there because
Speaker 5: he was all it was all screwed up. So I
Speaker 5: repacked him and I come crawling down out of there.
Speaker 5: It took me like an hour and a half to
Speaker 5: get down out of that and finally got him to
Speaker 5: the truck, sat him on the truck, and was just like,
Speaker 5: oh god. I was like I can't I can't believe
Speaker 5: that took six It was like six and a half
Speaker 5: hours up there, just getting my just getting my butt kicker.
Speaker 3: You're like, next time, I'm going to bring some electrolyts, right, Yeah.
Speaker 2: Well I did. I mean I drank electrolytes and everything.
Speaker 1: But the problem.
Speaker 5: The thing is when you get to that altitude, yeah
Speaker 5: you know what I mean, it's like it just sucks
Speaker 5: it right out of you, you know. Plus you know
Speaker 5: it's cold, so you have to have, you know, some
Speaker 5: cold gear on. So I got a puffy on and
Speaker 5: and everything, but it wasn't like I couldn't really take
Speaker 5: it off because then I'm already sweating, so now I'm
Speaker 5: going to freeze if I take it off. So I
Speaker 5: just like accepted my fate at that point and we
Speaker 5: jumped in the truck. And the funny thing was is
Speaker 5: I I was I was like two hours late for
Speaker 5: my radio show that I did, sports radio show. I
Speaker 5: was like two hours late for my show, and They're like,
Speaker 5: where are you at? And I'm like, I sent him.
Speaker 1: A picture of me plug the sh tell people what
Speaker 1: you do. Yeah.
Speaker 5: So it's uh, it's a sports radio show. It's one
Speaker 5: of four three the Fan. We're the number one sports
Speaker 5: show in Denver. So we just talk at all things sports.
Speaker 5: I'm I'm doing that and I'm also doing a pod,
Speaker 5: my own podcast. I just launched my first episode. It's
Speaker 5: the Wolf Fun Tame Podcast. And then I'm doing a
Speaker 5: hunting show as well, and we just started launching episodes
Speaker 5: from my first fall out of football, you know, hunting,
Speaker 5: bow hunting and turkey hunting, stuff like that. That's called
Speaker 5: Wolf Untamed It's on YouTube as well, so you can
Speaker 5: check us out on Spotify. Then you can also on
Speaker 5: Denver sports dot com. You can watch you can watch
Speaker 5: the show. It's pretty funny, like we have a good time.
Speaker 5: It's really like a comedy show. We're just goofing around
Speaker 5: the whole time.
Speaker 1: Oh, I should point out? Can I point that out?
Speaker 2: Yes? Please?
Speaker 1: Who said that?
Speaker 2: That was Phil Man? I'll get a.
Speaker 1: Drive me crazy? Is that a genuine question about who
Speaker 1: said that?
Speaker 2: I could tell?
Speaker 1: I can't tell. I used to look Phil dead in
Speaker 1: the face, dead in the face. I can tell what
Speaker 1: he's thinking. Now I can't see this. I mean, I
Speaker 1: asked the guy cannot see Phil? Oh, there's his hands
Speaker 1: sticking up. Cal was thinking we'd put a little like
Speaker 1: a heart monitor up in the corner, so least tell
Speaker 1: like his vitals signs.
Speaker 8: Feel like a little live feed on the on the
Speaker 8: TV there speaking.
Speaker 1: Of Okay, that's great segue. You can watch what we're
Speaker 1: doing right now on YouTube. Phil's got it all rigged up.
Speaker 1: It's become Phil's like passion project. This is being filmed
Speaker 1: right now. I wish we could see Phil's face because
Speaker 1: you think a guy, If you think a guy that
Speaker 1: was that like to do that was a thespian.
Speaker 2: You know what that means, Phil, Yeah, an actor of
Speaker 2: stage and screen.
Speaker 1: You think a thespian like Phil would be like jumping
Speaker 1: up and down at his big chance to like be
Speaker 1: broadcast on yet another platform. That makes me a little uncomfortable,
Speaker 1: But I do have there as a film doesn't want
Speaker 1: to he doesn't want to be as.
Speaker 6: It's kind of fun to just imagine what.
Speaker 2: The viewers can see. I just cut to the film cam.
Speaker 1: It exists.
Speaker 2: You guys, can you're on the film camera, film cam
Speaker 2: right now, go camera.
Speaker 7: For You're actually wrong, Steve. He's he's the only one
Speaker 7: who has their own camera on him. So there is,
Speaker 7: and there is.
Speaker 1: He's hidden back. There is because he's probably like got
Speaker 1: like his face powder on and it's like he's got
Speaker 1: his makeup on a little eyeliner. He doesn't want everybody
Speaker 1: to tease him. Uh, we're gonna, we're gonna dig back
Speaker 1: into Uh we're gonna We're I want we're gonna dig
Speaker 1: back into more of the more because we gotta get
Speaker 1: that was a good part of the story. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: the other garbage is whatever part of the story. But
Speaker 1: that was that was the part? I like, yeah, well,
Speaker 1: you know, it just real funny. We just did a
Speaker 1: thing with the did you follow the blue marlin controversy?
Speaker 1: Those boys that caught that blue marlin down to North
Speaker 1: Carolina and won a big tournament.
Speaker 2: I didn't follow it. No, I heard about it, so
Speaker 2: he pay much attention to.
Speaker 1: Roughly, these dudes go out and they join a tournament
Speaker 1: and they're kind of like they're under underdogs in the
Speaker 1: blue Marlin tournament, but they win the blue Yeah, they
Speaker 1: don't win. They catch a big ass blue marlin. This
Speaker 1: episode's already out, people could check it out. Was that filmed?
Speaker 2: No, that's that's not gonna be a video.
Speaker 1: Uh, they catch a big blue marlin six hundred odd pounds,
Speaker 1: but it gets disqualified because it had a little bitte
Speaker 1: mark on it.
Speaker 2: Oh because the shark got gone on shark bit it.
Speaker 1: So they lost their three point five million bucks. We
Speaker 1: had them on and one of the things they were
Speaker 1: appreciative of this is like a little plug for our show,
Speaker 1: is they had done every interview in the world. Who
Speaker 1: are they interview with.
Speaker 4: Krinn, New York Times, CNN, Washington.
Speaker 9: Post, every local.
Speaker 2: NPR was n PR.
Speaker 1: New York Times is doing a piece on.
Speaker 10: Them, UK Daily Mail and all that website, all that,
Speaker 10: and he says he's never gotten to talk about what
Speaker 10: he imagines is the cool part is catching the fish.
Speaker 2: Yeah, talk about catching the fish.
Speaker 1: And it's a crazy story about catching the fish. No
Speaker 1: one cares about catching the fish because we've probably got
Speaker 1: to tell about catching the damn fish, which was amazing, Right,
Speaker 1: that's a huge fish.
Speaker 5: I actually now that you're telling me, I saw the
Speaker 5: picture of the fish, but I didn't see where that
Speaker 5: was like a superficial dude.
Speaker 2: Where I had a bite on it. I didn't even
Speaker 2: see it.
Speaker 1: You know what, if you go, folks can go back
Speaker 1: and listen to this. Uh, they didn't even know because
Speaker 1: when they pulled the they pulled the fishes. They when
Speaker 1: they pulled the fish up, I think they pulled up
Speaker 1: the the fish's starboard side and they couldn't see the
Speaker 1: port side of the fish. That's how it's like they
Speaker 1: didn't even know. Yeah, they've know, they pulled it up.
Speaker 1: You can't, like you said, you can't roll these things around.
Speaker 1: It wasn't even they weren't even then later that he
Speaker 1: was like aware of it, but didn't even give it
Speaker 1: any thought. It's just like a mark. Yeah, and he
Speaker 1: said about heartbreak it's great. Joined also by Bill vander Hayden.
Speaker 1: How's going man?
Speaker 4: Good?
Speaker 1: You missed a good transition there? Oh what should I
Speaker 1: have done? You should ask Derek will Broadhead. He used,
Speaker 1: I was gonna do that and I forgot about it.
Speaker 2: I was using an iron Will you were?
Speaker 1: Do you know Bill Pryor?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah, Oh so you guys have met? You guys are Yeah,
Speaker 1: I was.
Speaker 2: I've been shooting iron Wills for a while now.
Speaker 4: Really, so we met at the Colorado Bull Hunters Hey,
Speaker 4: Bill Stake, we met at the Colorado Bull Hunters Association.
Speaker 1: So how's thing's been going to Iron Will Man Good? Good?
Speaker 4: Been busy? Yeah, yeah, I appreciate you guys have me
Speaker 4: on last year doing that podcast on physics Fate and
Speaker 4: physics and fatality. I think it was called but yeah.
Speaker 4: I got a lot of interest in and us from that,
Speaker 4: So appreciate it.
Speaker 1: Oh that's good. You know, I wanted to ask you
Speaker 1: do you Uh? I guess you probably wouldn't know this
Speaker 1: because you can't tell that if people that listened to
Speaker 1: the show. This is like, I guess this is a
Speaker 1: marketing question. People that listened to the show and came
Speaker 1: to you from having heard the show, did they did
Speaker 1: they seem to be like mostly Western elk hunters or
Speaker 1: were you hearing from like white tail hunters and whatnot?
Speaker 4: Yeah, good question. I think a lot of the Western
Speaker 4: like elk hunters had kind of already heard of this,
Speaker 4: so I think a lot of the people were more
Speaker 4: Midwest or even Eastern white tail hunters. Like we went
Speaker 4: to Pennsylvania Total Archery Challenge event. I had a lot
Speaker 4: of people come up to the booth there say they
Speaker 4: heard the Meat Eater podcast and also a dent we
Speaker 4: were down in at a Dallas show and a lot
Speaker 4: of people there as well down in.
Speaker 1: Texas got it. Yeah, man, had I had an opportunity
Speaker 1: to use your broad heads hunting white tails last winter
Speaker 1: and phenomenal, and my my friend I was hunting with
Speaker 1: we were both using them and they work on EUT right.
Speaker 1: But what's cool about this is we're now you can
Speaker 1: now come and find in addition to coming to our
Speaker 1: store and finding first Light gear, finding FHF gear phelps,
Speaker 1: game calls soon to be DSD, you can also now
Speaker 1: come and find you know, those are those are like,
Speaker 1: those are our brands. This is not you. We were
Speaker 1: now able to carry iron Will broadheads on our website.
Speaker 1: Can you tell tell folks what they can find on
Speaker 1: our website.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we're gonna launch here with our S series broadheads
Speaker 4: or S one hundred, which is what you and and
Speaker 4: Jason used on your Elka in New Mexico, along with
Speaker 4: our S one twenty five to our very popular heads,
Speaker 4: and then our new our new head for the year,
Speaker 4: which is a wide single bevel one hundred and fifty
Speaker 4: grand head, which is our one new broadhead that we
Speaker 4: just launched. So those are gonna get the three options
Speaker 4: that Yeah, and yeah, you guys have been using our
Speaker 4: heads for a while and we appreciate all the help
Speaker 4: you've done, you know, helping spread the words. So I
Speaker 4: think it's yeah, great partnership.
Speaker 1: Oh it's great. Man, you got a big old bear
Speaker 1: to spring?
Speaker 4: I did, Yeah, I got a giant bear. Sketchewan, what
Speaker 4: was going on with that?
Speaker 1: You know?
Speaker 4: I've been going there for a few years and seeing
Speaker 4: big bears occasionally, and and man, each year I kind
Speaker 4: of see a bigger one. And this this guy when
Speaker 4: he was coming through, so he weighed four hundred and
Speaker 4: seventy three pounds. Oh really yeah, twenty one inch.
Speaker 1: Skull, just just a tank. And I see what's the
Speaker 1: boon and crocket cut off? Is it twenty one or
Speaker 1: twenty twenty for the yearly and twenty one for the
Speaker 1: all time? Has your has yours dried yet? No?
Speaker 4: So he might not make the all time?
Speaker 1: Might shrink? Just dry him in a bucket of water.
Speaker 1: That's trip Phelps, does it? I heard.
Speaker 4: I'm sitting in the stand.
Speaker 1: Films did not tell me that trick.
Speaker 2: You could do the The Felts told me that joke.
Speaker 1: Phelps told me that joke, not that trick.
Speaker 2: The Beatles too, I guess the beat like there's a
Speaker 2: beetle process.
Speaker 1: Yoh yeah, drifted. What's that beatle call? Dirmisted dirmistic beetle
Speaker 1: carrying beetle that shrinks it less?
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, he'll drink it last.
Speaker 4: Yeah. I used Beatles actually on this one.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Man, I used to hang out with the dude
Speaker 1: that had one of them. Beatleworks. This just the like
Speaker 1: the like, and there's the ways to control. But that
Speaker 1: is a smell that you can't find anywhere else. Man,
Speaker 1: If you bottle that smell and squirted out of a
Speaker 1: can clear room.
Speaker 4: That's funny.
Speaker 1: The outfitter up there had beetles, so we really much
Speaker 1: he had his own.
Speaker 4: He had his own, so we threw it in there
Speaker 4: right away, and then like a day or two later,
Speaker 4: we just went in there to check on it, and
Speaker 4: three of the guys that were there on the hunt
Speaker 4: started gagging just by going in that room.
Speaker 1: So sure, man, it's an insane smell in that room. Man. Yeah,
Speaker 1: uh so what's gonna happen with that?
Speaker 9: You know?
Speaker 1: What? Do you know? Get a big old rough made
Speaker 1: out of it.
Speaker 4: I think I'm gonna do a big bear rug, put
Speaker 4: it up in the in our shop there on the wall.
Speaker 1: How far aparty you guys, because you're in Colorado.
Speaker 4: Right, yeah, we're about an hour and a half. I'm
Speaker 4: I'm north. I'm near leveland up near Fort Collins esters
Speaker 4: Park area, and you're down a little south of Denver.
Speaker 1: Well, when I did my book event in Denver the
Speaker 1: other day, I sure didn't see you waiting in line.
Speaker 2: I didn't even know about it.
Speaker 1: So this is marketing people's fault.
Speaker 7: As an engineer, did you have extra interest in the
Speaker 7: submarine story or not?
Speaker 4: You know, I did. I wanted to hear the just
Speaker 4: review kind of what went wrong there? Huh and yeah,
Speaker 4: from an engineering standpoint, I mean the engineers were involved.
Speaker 4: If there were engineers involved, they should have known. No,
Speaker 4: you shouldn't do that, you know, it doesn't mean a
Speaker 4: factor safety.
Speaker 1: Well, he didn't want to He didn't want to hear
Speaker 1: about any of that.
Speaker 2: Hee did he fire the engineer.
Speaker 1: I get where he's coming from. Man, he was like
Speaker 1: an anti regulation guy, you know, which is one thing,
Speaker 1: but the minute you're el on the trip, it's a
Speaker 1: different thing.
Speaker 7: Well, and it worked like forty other times. It was
Speaker 7: like the forty first seven.
Speaker 1: You know how many times that Alvin you know, you
Speaker 1: know that Alvin submersible you know me trips the Alvin
Speaker 1: submersibles done four. It's a good track record. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: talking about how, oh we've done it times, it's like
Speaker 1: four and it can go deeper. Check me out, man,
Speaker 1: I'm like a sub expert.
Speaker 6: I think that I was really curious to see if
Speaker 6: you actually had a number in mind.
Speaker 1: The first thing, Like everybody else, like I was like
Speaker 1: the joke that like everybody Montana is a grizzy bear.
Speaker 1: Experts like everybody in America is a submersible.
Speaker 2: And then there were a Russian coup expert.
Speaker 1: Yeah right, oh no, but I am an expert on that. Okay,
Speaker 1: we're joined by two of them today. Great. You know
Speaker 1: there's that great quote that, uh.
Speaker 3: How war war?
Speaker 1: I don't know. I wish I remember how it went.
Speaker 1: War is how Americans learned geography. Yeah, tell me about
Speaker 1: the aeroflight deal you guys are working on, Bill.
Speaker 4: Yeah, So I sponsored a study with University of Colorado.
Speaker 4: I've worked with them for quite a few years. I've
Speaker 4: been adjunct instructor mechanical Engineering, helping out with the senior
Speaker 4: design class for mechanical engineering. And this year got to
Speaker 4: prove to this past year got to proved to sponsor
Speaker 4: a project and direct it where we had a team
Speaker 4: of seniors and mechanical engineering and the project was on
Speaker 4: improved aero vein design for bow hunting, you know, for
Speaker 4: arrows with broadheads on the front. So there's really a
Speaker 4: limited amount of scientific research on aeroflight when there's a
Speaker 4: broadhead on the front, and the aerodynamics are are much
Speaker 4: different there than let's say a field point because.
Speaker 1: It's cut in the air ahead of it.
Speaker 4: Different right, Yeah, it's cutting the air ahead of it
Speaker 4: different there's different pressure on the size of it when
Speaker 4: when there's some angle of attack and it tips a
Speaker 4: little bit off off of straightforward. So and you know,
Speaker 4: I feel pretty strongly that a durable fixed blade head,
Speaker 4: sharp with good edge retention is such a better option
Speaker 4: than a mechanical. But there's a couple couple problems people
Speaker 4: might have, as one might be aeroflight long range with that,
Speaker 4: you know, they're not as forgiving as a field point
Speaker 4: or a small mechanical. And my own testing I found out,
Speaker 4: but you could be very effective shooting fixed blade has
Speaker 4: long range with the right aerow set up and a
Speaker 4: tune bow and a couple other things. But I wanted
Speaker 4: to sponsor a kind of an independent industry test where
Speaker 4: these guys weren't even you know, they're not even bow hunters.
Speaker 4: They're just following the science and setting up experiments and
Speaker 4: running them to really show that you can be very
Speaker 4: effective in accuracy stability with fixed blade heads at distance
Speaker 4: with enough aero vein. And we studied like six of
Speaker 4: the veins top veins in the industry, along with some prototypes.
Speaker 4: You know, I had some great results there we looked
Speaker 4: at drag, stability, accuracy, spin up, wind, drift and sound.
Speaker 4: And we had a computation of fluidynamic modeling, you know,
Speaker 4: so a computer model modeling the flow over the broadhead
Speaker 4: and the full arrow there and then and we could
Speaker 4: study all these things.
Speaker 2: There.
Speaker 4: We could tip the arrow at say five degrees, let's
Speaker 4: say the bow is not tuned, or you torque a
Speaker 4: little bit, and look at how much restoring forces there,
Speaker 4: How well do these veins pull it back on quickly
Speaker 4: back on track? And then we used a shooting machine
Speaker 4: and a lot of equipment. So we had labradar looking
Speaker 4: at speed and drop, so drag we could get from that.
Speaker 4: We had a high speed camera looking at spin up
Speaker 4: and looking at how quickly arrows got stabilized. We had
Speaker 4: a sophisticated sound system where we recorded sound of the
Speaker 4: arrow coming at it, crossing over it, and then analyze
Speaker 4: the frequency content like would it be allowed to a person,
Speaker 4: would it be allowed to an animal? So, resulting from
Speaker 4: all that, we found a particular vein that performed the best.
Speaker 4: And then I worked with Easton to get these machine
Speaker 4: in flesh at three degree hehlicles. So now we sell
Speaker 4: these as well, so we get so many customers asking,
Speaker 4: you know, what's a good arrow for us to use
Speaker 4: that for good accuracy, you know with your broadheads. So
Speaker 4: I can say, you know, we have this scientific study
Speaker 4: now that shows these do a great job of quickly
Speaker 4: stabilizing an arrow and giving you a good accuracy, you
Speaker 4: know with fixed plate heads.
Speaker 1: That's a textured bank.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's like waves in it.
Speaker 1: See I hate kind of stuff like this because now
Speaker 1: I want to have this. It's like Calv's bringing up
Speaker 1: like how he used to just love ice fishing, always
Speaker 1: had a great time ice fishing, and then better electronics
Speaker 1: come out and some guy shows up with that and
Speaker 1: you're like, we're fucked now, you know, like you're like, no,
Speaker 1: it's not now we're not gonna do any good because
Speaker 1: he's got something better. That's pretty cool though, m let's
Speaker 1: see that.
Speaker 7: So was this study, did it like compare it against
Speaker 7: field points and mechanicals or what were the broadheads that
Speaker 7: were being used.
Speaker 4: We we used Ironwald broadheads in the study, but we
Speaker 4: can pared him to field points. So what we looked
Speaker 4: at was like for accuracy, we use a bow that's
Speaker 4: out of tune, so you know, a bow intune means basically,
Speaker 4: when it leaves, your bow is going in a straight line,
Speaker 4: you know, at the target, the knox pushing directly in
Speaker 4: line er comes off straight. That's really what a tune
Speaker 4: bow means. Untuned bow, like we would take it out
Speaker 4: of tune so that it would come out, say, tail
Speaker 4: left right out of the boat.
Speaker 9: Yu.
Speaker 1: When we were young, we just thought it was like
Speaker 1: just the how it was that your arrow fishtails. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that your arrow fishtail for fifteen yards. It's just the reality.
Speaker 1: It's like a comforting feeling to see it just kind
Speaker 1: of fishtail out eventually straight out.
Speaker 4: With like a long bow or something where you're not
Speaker 4: cut to center the bow is the arrow is going
Speaker 4: to have to you know, flex around the riser and
Speaker 4: there's a special Yeah, it'd be like a perfect stiffness
Speaker 4: to get that to go straight.
Speaker 1: Is that the archer's paradox?
Speaker 4: It is?
Speaker 1: Yeah, we named episode that one time, right, Yeah, I
Speaker 1: listened to that one. Yeah, you had a problem with
Speaker 1: that one.
Speaker 4: I did you wonder why whenever I hear things that
Speaker 4: defy the laws of physics, I got to speak up.
Speaker 1: Something deep in your brain goes off.
Speaker 3: A lot of a lot of those like modern recurves
Speaker 3: and stuff are cut like when I was building them,
Speaker 3: like an eighth past center or center cut. But then
Speaker 3: there's you know, problems with strong risers. You know, lot
Speaker 3: goes into it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, with with recurves and using fingers, there's just a
Speaker 4: lot more happening there. You know, in a compound, you
Speaker 4: can really adjust your rest and you know your bow
Speaker 4: set up so that you're knocks getting pushed your strengths
Speaker 4: pushing your knock in a straight line and the arrows
Speaker 4: coming straight off the bow. Some people, some people teach
Speaker 4: different ways of tone, but I mean that's really the best,
Speaker 4: having your air coming perfect straight and you know that's
Speaker 4: how you can achieve the best flight. But really this study,
Speaker 4: I know, nobody's perfect, and a lot of people aren't
Speaker 4: great at tuning their bow. So part of this study was, okay,
Speaker 4: if yourro's not coming straight off your bow, it's actually
Speaker 4: coming out tail left. One of the tests we do
Speaker 4: is we'll just shoot a fletch shaft versus a bear shaft.
Speaker 4: It's say thirty and forty yards because a bear shaft
Speaker 4: and we'll add some tape maybe to get the weight
Speaker 4: the same, but a bear shaft will come out tail
Speaker 4: left and then it'll just stay that angle and it'll
Speaker 4: end up hitting right.
Speaker 1: Oh, get out there, Yeah that's in yeah, of course, right,
Speaker 1: nothing's pulling it back.
Speaker 4: Yes, that's a great way to test is my bow
Speaker 4: really tuned or not. Take a bear shaft versus a
Speaker 4: flet shaft just to feel points. I'd say thirty yards.
Speaker 4: Thirty yards is pretty good. Forty yards and you do
Speaker 4: it a few times. If they're not hitting like the same,
Speaker 4: then it means you know your form or something else
Speaker 4: is wrong with your bow.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I don't know why it never occurred to me,
Speaker 1: but yeah, yeah, no, fletching is never going to recover,
Speaker 1: right right. Yeah.
Speaker 4: So in this stuff we had it so that a
Speaker 4: bear cheft was hitting a foot right of a flat
Speaker 4: shaft at forty So this is way out of tune
Speaker 4: really even with that one.
Speaker 1: In that case, is the knock on? Is the knock
Speaker 1: lined up? Or is the center of the arrow lined up? Like?
Speaker 1: What is on target? Mean? If you if you shot it,
Speaker 1: no fletching and it kicks left and it just says
Speaker 1: like that and goes in and then you're standing from
Speaker 1: your perspective, some part of your arrow is going to
Speaker 1: cross the bull's eye maybe like center when you're looking
Speaker 1: at it. Is that not true? Or is that true?
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's kind of. It's kind of difficult when it's
Speaker 4: tip when it's tipped in an angle to like basically
Speaker 4: the the wind direction. At that point it ends up
Speaker 4: with the veins. It will just quickly get get put
Speaker 4: straight back on, you know, without it, it's it's probably
Speaker 4: tipping back a little bit towards it. But yeah, what
Speaker 4: part I mean, the whole arrow was kind of getting
Speaker 4: thrown at the bull's eye, but it's gonna end up
Speaker 4: drifting right, just because the way the airflow is in the.
Speaker 1: Pressure, So the whole arrow drift right, not okay, I
Speaker 1: got you. That'll continue on that drifting path.
Speaker 4: So what you see is your fletch arrow might be
Speaker 4: in the bull's eye, but your your bear chaft will be.
Speaker 4: In this case, it was a foot right, and you
Speaker 4: can see the back of the arrow is tipped tail.
Speaker 1: I guess that's my question. The knock is right too,
Speaker 1: because it drifts because the arrow drifted. Yeah, I got you.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, you follow.
Speaker 1: That question, doctor Randall. No, I didn't teach you that
Speaker 1: that doctor.
Speaker 8: School archery is an area of profound ignorance in my world.
Speaker 7: So what vein setups were all testing? Did you have
Speaker 7: like four veins and did you have three inch? Did
Speaker 7: you test any like of the fobs that have become
Speaker 7: sexy in the last few years.
Speaker 4: We didn't test the fobs we had. Let's see, we
Speaker 4: had Blazers, Max Hunters, Max Stealth, Silent Nights feather into
Speaker 4: the mix just for fun. I've tested, uh feathers in
Speaker 4: the past, and they are so loud. I don't think
Speaker 4: people realize that it's funny. One, yeah, man, it's funny when.
Speaker 1: I've watched the movies.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's funny when people will say like, oh, that's
Speaker 4: you know, that's a loudhead or something, and then you
Speaker 4: shooting feathers. I'm like, I can show you the data
Speaker 4: that shows that those feathers are so much louder than
Speaker 4: anything else.
Speaker 1: Is that right?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 1: How did you?
Speaker 4: Uh?
Speaker 1: What's the reason for the the textured? When I say textured,
Speaker 1: the veins rippled it looks like a sting ray file
Speaker 1: a for you just to draw very vivid in its
Speaker 1: what that looks like?
Speaker 3: Would it be more drag?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 4: You know, we to be honest, I don't know why
Speaker 4: that made this a little better. We're just kind of
Speaker 4: within without, but we looked at all the results and
Speaker 4: we we you know, we looked at drag dragon sound
Speaker 4: were reduced with these ridges and this particular vein material.
Speaker 1: Are you guys selling just the veins? You gotta buy
Speaker 1: the whole Damn, we're selling the veins to like, bring
Speaker 1: a little pile of them.
Speaker 4: I didn't. I could ship you some.
Speaker 3: So it'd be it's less drag with the the little
Speaker 3: ripples in those veins.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, and you know, like I'm not sure if
Speaker 4: this is applicable, but you know a golf ball has
Speaker 4: little dimples in it, it'll change like the airflow over
Speaker 4: it and the turbulence, and that's an improvement.
Speaker 3: Sure.
Speaker 1: Oh they play golf with no dimples.
Speaker 4: Well, I don't know if they did, but I know
Speaker 4: dimples in the golf ball make it, you know, go further.
Speaker 4: It changes the airflow across it.
Speaker 7: They did play with the smooth ball. I think it
Speaker 7: was an accident when they stumbled on that. The like
Speaker 7: dimples made a difference.
Speaker 5: So we need those dimples to make it go straight. Now,
Speaker 5: if I can just keep the ball straight. I mean,
Speaker 5: I'll drive it four hundred every time.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Uh, that's interesting though. So but when you got
Speaker 1: here's my question about the researchers, you had to fund it.
Speaker 4: I did, yeah, but since i'm the directory, they pay
Speaker 4: me to to direct it. So it worked out pretty good.
Speaker 1: And then, uh, because you weren't previously made, you weren't
Speaker 1: previously making a fletching, so you didn't have you weren't
Speaker 1: in there with a bias.
Speaker 4: No, And I really just wanted to like be able
Speaker 4: to say to our customers, we get so many questions
Speaker 4: about what vein should I use and how will this
Speaker 4: vein work? And so I wanted to study them all
Speaker 4: in this testing And now I have all the data
Speaker 4: and I can say, yeah, this one man works pretty good.
Speaker 4: This one has a little more drag, but it's fine.
Speaker 4: So it was really that's that was the reason for
Speaker 4: the study. And then I worked with AAE that that
Speaker 4: made some of the veins that were in the study
Speaker 4: and just got ribbon material from them so that we
Speaker 4: could laser cut different shapes in them. And they sent
Speaker 4: me materials with different stiffnesses, different you know, with and
Speaker 4: without ribbing things like that. So we had a bunch
Speaker 4: of things a prototype and test as well, and we
Speaker 4: found this one that it did a great job with accuracy, stability,
Speaker 4: but then reduced drag and sound. And you know, I
Speaker 4: can have my bow out of tune. I currently have
Speaker 4: my bow out of tune. You know, it is hitting
Speaker 4: four inches right, fourty five inches you right at forty
Speaker 4: So just a little out of tune. Not terrible, But
Speaker 4: I can hit the same point of impact with broadheads
Speaker 4: and field points up to one hundred yards with a
Speaker 4: bow a little out of tune with this vein on it,
Speaker 4: you know, it just does a great job stabilize it.
Speaker 4: So when I was seeing that, I'm like, I just
Speaker 4: decided we're just gonna, you know, offer this vein as
Speaker 4: well as a fletched arrow to customers that want it.
Speaker 1: How much do you shoot? How much you shoot field points? Man?
Speaker 4: I shoot them. I shoot field points and broadheads typically,
Speaker 4: you know together like every day do.
Speaker 1: You just by mean, are you shooting them just to
Speaker 1: save on because you know, I got a feeling you
Speaker 1: got a good line on broadheads. Are you shooting them
Speaker 1: just to save on targets?
Speaker 4: It saves on targets. I don't shoot up targets as much. Yeah,
Speaker 4: and also I don't need to shoot well. If I'm
Speaker 4: shooting groups at distance, I still wreck I still wreck things.
Speaker 4: If I shoot three broad head, it's you know, some
Speaker 4: cut in veins. I'm hitting one broad hand to another
Speaker 4: part of it is if I'm going to shoot a
Speaker 4: group of eighty yards, I'll shoot one broadhad two field points.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know why I shoot them. I was just
Speaker 1: curious a fella in your position while you're shooting. But
Speaker 1: you still you stilln't like just destroy everything, you know,
Speaker 1: and all the time.
Speaker 4: Yeah, right, I mean I want to. I like to
Speaker 4: shoot a lot just to keep in practice and be
Speaker 4: able to you know, I find just shooting daily or
Speaker 4: maybe skip a day here and there, but just shooting
Speaker 4: a lot. I just keep my form consistent. But yeah,
Speaker 4: there's no need to shoot broadheads all the time.
Speaker 1: Did the college already have an arrow shooter?
Speaker 4: No, No, so I supplied like a it's a hooter.
Speaker 4: Shooter is the name of the machine, but it's a
Speaker 4: shooting machine. We got the labradar, and so we got
Speaker 4: some of the equipment they needed there for the test.
Speaker 7: You know Kent State University that we get the Yeah,
Speaker 7: we were talking to them about doing some other fun projects.
Speaker 7: They don't have one hooter shooter. They have two hooter
Speaker 7: shooters that they use for their experiments.
Speaker 1: I always thinks that would be like a shot that
Speaker 1: you'd get at Hooters. If I heard that it could
Speaker 1: be speaking of you know, he just sent me Met
Speaker 1: and Aaron just sent me a pretty interesting academic article
Speaker 1: that has to do with like, you know, how how
Speaker 1: Clovis points why they're so mesmerizing and why people are
Speaker 1: so fixated on them, and and like, you know, for
Speaker 1: a fellow such as yourself, not that you have one,
Speaker 1: but tattoos, paintings, people, you can lay out a bunch
Speaker 1: of uh, you can lay out a bunch of stone
Speaker 1: projectile points, and people are going to point to that one.
Speaker 1: And it's it's what is the art like what is
Speaker 1: the artistic merit? Right? So, so they talked all these
Speaker 1: art and design people to be and then some people
Speaker 1: say it's so beautiful that it must have been part
Speaker 1: of its design. Must have been its beauty, Like there's
Speaker 1: aspects of it that don't make sense from a functional standpoint,
Speaker 1: like why would you go through all the hassle? It
Speaker 1: must have been that they knew that it was beautiful,
Speaker 1: They knew that it was art. So his paper I
Speaker 1: read the what do you call it up top? I
Speaker 1: read the abs distract? Yeah, basically, yeah, basically why are
Speaker 1: Clovis points? So like, why do songwriters want to write
Speaker 1: songs about Clovis points and they're not writing songs about
Speaker 1: I don't know all the other ones? Do you do
Speaker 1: you share that same sentiment? I've never written song about those, No, like.
Speaker 7: Aesthetically, aesthetically the please I wrote a song about doctor Randall,
Speaker 7: Oh you did about Yanni.
Speaker 1: My song about Dr Ranadal's about how he can't actually
Speaker 1: prescribe drugs, So it doesn't really matter.
Speaker 8: Someone sent in another song based on your song to
Speaker 8: Roam and he shared it with me the other day.
Speaker 1: But do I share the idea that there's something about him?
Speaker 7: Like esthetically, they're the most pleasing absolute there's something there,
Speaker 7: there's something there, there's something that appeals to the modern
Speaker 7: there's something that appeals to the modern eye.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Bill Man, I'm glad we get I'm glad you're
Speaker 1: letting us uh be a I don't know you called
Speaker 1: a dealer to use that word. Yeah, you're letting us
Speaker 1: carry some of your products on her site.
Speaker 4: Man, yeah, you'll be the the one and only seriously,
Speaker 4: really that's selling them besides us, you know online? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Are we going to sell the veins do you? Guys?
Speaker 4: You can? Oh, I don't think it's set up to
Speaker 4: do it initially.
Speaker 1: But hustle now because you're gonna be wanting those veins,
Speaker 1: right and if you want.
Speaker 3: To, I'm gonna get some of those veins for sure.
Speaker 1: Huh. Well, thanks for coming out, man, as always, tell
Speaker 1: me about the new Tell me again about the new
Speaker 1: head you got.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so it's a wide, single bevel. We came out
Speaker 4: with single bevel broadhead.
Speaker 1: Yeah, sell me real quick on so I know we've
Speaker 1: talked about this, but tell me again on when people
Speaker 1: argue about single or double is just mental masturbation or what?
Speaker 1: What do you think on it? Well, they are different,
Speaker 1: but you both perform really well. But when you when
Speaker 1: you do because you're looking at things, You're looking at
Speaker 1: things empirically right, You're not just being like I got
Speaker 1: a nice I got a huge bowl with this, so
Speaker 1: it must be the best. I mean. Tell me, yeah,
Speaker 1: So from a from a sign, from a from an
Speaker 1: engineering perspective, what are you getting and not getting what
Speaker 1: are you sacrificing and not sacrificing?
Speaker 4: And also tell people what the hell single bevel means. Yeah,
Speaker 4: so a single bevel verus double bevel. The edge itself
Speaker 4: on a single bevel. It's all ground from one side
Speaker 4: of the blade, so the other side of the blade
Speaker 4: is just flat and all the grind is on one side.
Speaker 1: Like some super fine, high quality sushi knives are single bevel.
Speaker 1: But if you open your knife drawer, all your shit's
Speaker 1: double bevel.
Speaker 4: Pretty much, everything's double bebble and there's a Yeah, they
Speaker 4: grind from both sides of the blade to come together
Speaker 4: and make a sharp point.
Speaker 1: Oh you know what your ice augurs? Single bevel? Mm hmm, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's about it.
Speaker 4: Things that shave. I think there's like cheese shave, things
Speaker 4: that shave where they're just wanting to push.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, like your razor that you shave with in
Speaker 1: the morning, right, singler double?
Speaker 4: I think those are I think those are singles. Okay, yeah,
Speaker 4: But like if you take a double bubble and put
Speaker 4: it down through a block of cheese, it's going to
Speaker 4: go if you're gonna like cut in half, it'll go straight.
Speaker 4: But if you have a single bebbel knife and put
Speaker 4: it down through it like a block of cheese. It's
Speaker 4: going to push off to the side because that pressure
Speaker 4: will make it when I push on.
Speaker 1: When you get to the end of the block, you
Speaker 1: got a big old kurvy cheese. Right.
Speaker 4: So what happens when that goes through an animal is
Speaker 4: all that pressure on one side and and you what
Speaker 4: you do is you grind you know, say, the left
Speaker 4: side on the top and the right side on the
Speaker 4: bottom of the blade, so that when it goes through
Speaker 4: an animal and all the pressures on those bebbles, it
Speaker 4: creates a rotation of the broadhead true the animal. So
Speaker 4: and you think that that's true, that is true. It's
Speaker 4: not just in theory, No, that's that's true. I mean
Speaker 4: we've we've done it with high speed video. We've looked
Speaker 4: at it going through different mediums, going through animals as well,
Speaker 4: and we do see that it does rotate.
Speaker 7: There's some great YouTube videos where guys will shoot a
Speaker 7: single bevel versus a double bevel through like a shoulder
Speaker 7: blade of a critter. And when you see the maybe
Speaker 7: I'm understanding this wrong, but when you see this double
Speaker 7: bevel go through it looks like the footprint of the broadhead, Like,
Speaker 7: it looks like you could just shove that thing through there,
Speaker 7: and you know exactly what happened there. With a single bevel, though,
Speaker 7: it's like a hole. It's like a drill went through there,
Speaker 7: and you don't quite see the outline of the broadhead
Speaker 7: as much.
Speaker 1: Right, Let's say you're passing that arrow through one hundred
Speaker 1: and fifty pounds white tail. Yeah, okay, you hit it
Speaker 1: behind the shoulder or wherever the hell you hit it
Speaker 1: anywhere you want. How many rotations that is it actually
Speaker 1: going to get done? That's a good question.
Speaker 4: Much. Really, it's like maybe one. It depends a little
Speaker 4: bit what it goes.
Speaker 1: It's not like a drill, so it's.
Speaker 4: Not like a drill.
Speaker 7: But when you look at the shoulder blade, one looks
Speaker 7: like is like the size of a shot glass, right,
Speaker 7: and the other one, like I said, it is like
Speaker 7: the footprint of the broadhead. Is how they look?
Speaker 4: Well, we see this through the hide.
Speaker 1: Do you believe you're right? Do you agree with him?
Speaker 4: It does change the shape of the hole and we
Speaker 4: see this through hide. That with a single bevel or
Speaker 4: with a double bebbl you're pretty much getting a cross cut.
Speaker 4: Say you have bleeders, so you got a cross blade,
Speaker 4: you're pretty much just getting that that cross cut through
Speaker 4: the hide and through the tissue, organs, whatever with with
Speaker 4: a single bubbl with that rotation, and I like a
Speaker 4: single bebble with bleeders. And we also do that single
Speaker 4: belvel grind on the bleeders because I like a cross
Speaker 4: cut anyway to kind of open up holes. But if
Speaker 4: you do that and it rotates, now the entrance and
Speaker 4: exit holes through the high they're almost square. They are
Speaker 4: more rounded, even though as you mentioned, there's not a
Speaker 4: ton of rotation. It's not like a drill, but it
Speaker 4: seems like twisting the hide or tissue as it's cutting
Speaker 4: does change the whole shape like that God, and you
Speaker 4: can see it through through lungs, liver or whatever too.
Speaker 4: It's got a little different shape to it.
Speaker 3: Correct correct me if I'm wrong. When you're shooting a
Speaker 3: single bevel, it's pretty important to match up. Like let's
Speaker 3: say you got a left wing feather. You want a
Speaker 3: left bevel on your on your single bevel broadheads so
Speaker 3: it doesn't spin the opposite way you want to spin
Speaker 3: the same.
Speaker 4: That is very important.
Speaker 2: Yep.
Speaker 4: You want your arrow, well, you want it to be
Speaker 4: rotating to begin with, So you don't want straight fleshed.
Speaker 4: You want some I like two or three degrees offset
Speaker 4: or vehicle on your veins to create some rotation of
Speaker 4: the arrow.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 4: That kind of helps average out in any asymmetries in there,
Speaker 4: if you can get the thing to spin on the
Speaker 4: way there.
Speaker 1: When I'm throwing a big old spiral man on top
Speaker 1: right and then on spencer goes out for the bomb, and then.
Speaker 4: On impact, you want to just keep rotating the same
Speaker 4: way it was going, I'd have to like stop and
Speaker 4: rotate the direction. That would lose energy.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, we do have a video on our YouTube,
Speaker 1: so you got to be cognizant of that and line
Speaker 1: that up. Wait or is it always or is it
Speaker 1: always that same twist?
Speaker 4: Yeah, you don't have to really line anything up. It's
Speaker 4: just the way you fletch. If you're like there as
Speaker 4: we sell our right fletch.
Speaker 1: So I'm saying, but do you ever see a guy
Speaker 1: that has his deal rigged up where he's got a
Speaker 1: right spin on the fletching and a left spin on
Speaker 1: the bevel but doesn't realize it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, once in a while, and we have some We
Speaker 4: have like a YouTube video just explaining how to figure
Speaker 4: out if you've got a right or left fletch and
Speaker 4: a right left single bowbel, just so people can make
Speaker 4: sure they match the two.
Speaker 7: Yeah, was there a period in time, like the nineteen
Speaker 7: eighties when everything was double bevel? Did like single bevel
Speaker 7: become popular more recently?
Speaker 4: I think there has always been some very thin, you know,
Speaker 4: cheaply made blades that were single bubbel because it's cheaper
Speaker 4: to make them that win, And a lot of those
Speaker 4: are made on these like real to real metal stamping
Speaker 4: machines where a coil of there's a coil of steel
Speaker 4: on one end, a blaze are coming out the other,
Speaker 4: and they if they can just grind one side, it's
Speaker 4: a quick way to do it. So there are some.
Speaker 4: I think it's always been used kind of an industry
Speaker 4: in some products where it's a very thin blade and
Speaker 4: it's going to be really cheaply made. So I think
Speaker 4: it's always shown up somewhat because of that.
Speaker 1: Here's a dumb question. Could you have a three blade
Speaker 1: broadhead that's single bevel?
Speaker 4: You could? There are a few author really do that.
Speaker 1: Why why would you want to do that again.
Speaker 4: You could get a little rotation with it.
Speaker 1: That's it.
Speaker 4: It's if you're doing a real real it's probably cheaper
Speaker 4: to make the blade, So it might be I mean
Speaker 4: that's a driving That's a driving factor for a lot
Speaker 4: of broadheads out there is how cheap can I make
Speaker 4: this thing? You know, just to drive the margins higher?
Speaker 4: So a lot of decisions are based on that.
Speaker 1: Uh, speaking of blades, me and Randall are working on
Speaker 1: this project about the long hunters and then the beaver trappers.
Speaker 7: Hm.
Speaker 1: So it'll be like a book, but not a book.
Speaker 1: It'll be an audio imagine, like a matt like a lecture,
Speaker 1: like the world's greatest lecture, the world's greatest explaining everything
Speaker 1: about the long hunters, the deer hide hunters like Boone,
Speaker 1: you know, and in this work and I got to
Speaker 1: see in what they're what Boon's hatchet you'd hear like
Speaker 1: tomahawk and hatchet, tomahawk hatchet. The best guess at what
Speaker 1: his hatchet would have looked like. Yeah, And had that
Speaker 1: dude was a dude, people should check him out on Instagram.
Speaker 1: Riley Kirkpatrick Kirkpatrick Ford. Can you look what is he
Speaker 1: on Instagram. Can someone look Kirkpatrick Ford Forge. I sent
Speaker 1: him the pictures he made me one of those, the hatchet.
Speaker 1: So it's just like a like just what Boon's hatchet
Speaker 1: probably would have looked like?
Speaker 4: Is it a single buffler or don't know.
Speaker 1: That's why I'm bringing it up, double bubble.
Speaker 7: Is there a definition difference between a tomahawk and a hatchet?
Speaker 7: In my mind that tomahawk is thrown or is that
Speaker 7: not not that simple?
Speaker 1: No, it's just a head shape difference my understanding. It's
Speaker 1: got that straight shaft and a different kind of head.
Speaker 1: And they used to make it with what they call it, Randall,
Speaker 1: that whole tear drop. I don't know what they call it.
Speaker 8: I'm talking about like that, and you get a different Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 8: she get a different partner for this project.
Speaker 4: Huh.
Speaker 6: I can't tell you, Kirkpatrick Forge.
Speaker 1: It is that good research? So did you know put
Speaker 1: that in your little notepad there? Randall? What is the
Speaker 1: official difference? It's like, what's the diference between a prawn
Speaker 1: and a shrimp? Depends who you ask?
Speaker 9: What is the difference depending on.
Speaker 1: So there's like, yeah, I've never found a satisfactory answer.
Speaker 1: People generally call huge shrimp prawns, and there's some regional variations.
Speaker 1: But there's also some stuff that I'm not sure about,
Speaker 1: how the plates on its body, on its abdomen, how
Speaker 1: the plates overlap. But I don't know if that's horseshit
Speaker 1: or not.
Speaker 6: Another area of profound ignorance.
Speaker 1: You know, in my mind. But my hatchet is bad ass,
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna post a video. He makes these videos,
Speaker 1: how he makes the stuff. It's pretty cool man. He
Speaker 1: makes like it's amazing.
Speaker 4: So you know, Jordan Jonas, he won alone one of
Speaker 4: the alone seasons with them, he got a He shot
Speaker 4: a moose with a with his bow and then the
Speaker 4: wolverine was trying to get the meat and he killed
Speaker 4: it with a with an axe. Anyways, that's a single
Speaker 4: bubble axe. It's a traditional Siberian axe. And I got
Speaker 4: to be friends with him. He sent me, sent me
Speaker 4: the ax, so I had it for a while. It's
Speaker 4: got a notch in there for every day, I think
Speaker 4: seventy days he was there.
Speaker 1: But he gave you the axe.
Speaker 4: He sent it to me because I actually did a
Speaker 4: CAD model and we were thinking about get some made
Speaker 4: actually gotch But anyway, it's a single bubble. So they
Speaker 4: use that to like shave bark off of trees and
Speaker 4: things like that.
Speaker 1: But where are they filming that that they can they
Speaker 1: can buy animals without needing tags? Do they pulled all
Speaker 1: in Nunovac.
Speaker 3: Canada like Vancouver Islanders.
Speaker 6: In different I think they get different places.
Speaker 4: I think they get hunting licenses and they can just shoot, Like.
Speaker 1: There's no way that dude that there's a guy that
Speaker 1: killed the muskox. He didn't draw a muskox tag. I
Speaker 1: can tell you that. And he wasn't hunting with a
Speaker 1: guide or he was. But it's like, I'd love to
Speaker 1: know whether I think that some of that was Nunavak.
Speaker 1: So they're like, actually they're able to buy the animals
Speaker 1: from the from the from the what do they call
Speaker 1: First Nations person? They're able to buy animals from the
Speaker 1: First Nations people because you're not You can't hunt big
Speaker 1: game in Canada without a guide.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 3: Puzzled by that, I had a casting lady called me
Speaker 3: up about that show, remember.
Speaker 1: That Chester, because Chester makes bows well quit.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I recently got a message about out being on
Speaker 7: a dating show for rural folks.
Speaker 1: So if we have anyone in the office here. You
Speaker 1: can put them on that well, and they wanted you
Speaker 1: to date. They wanted you to date. Yep, tell you're married.
Speaker 2: I did like Farmers.
Speaker 1: You know, I don't know it was around the time
Speaker 1: because you're the host of the trivia show. No, I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't think so. I think it was.
Speaker 7: I would imagine a hundred folks on Instagram got this
Speaker 7: same canned message about being on this dating show for
Speaker 7: like hunters, anglers, farmers. Uh, just rural folks is how
Speaker 7: they described it.
Speaker 6: Man, I'm not getting awkward conversation with my wife.
Speaker 1: You do well on there.
Speaker 6: I'm not getting any casting queries. I can only.
Speaker 1: Hope I'd be like, you know, baby, we've had a
Speaker 1: good thing going. But I had an opportunities. Really all right, Darren,
Speaker 1: I want to jop Okay, So that was like that
Speaker 1: was we had, Like I want to get back to the.
Speaker 2: Story after the nerd session is over.
Speaker 1: Every time I talk to Bill, I feel stupid.
Speaker 2: It's just like, you know, this guy's a genius.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but that's why it's people. There's like people around
Speaker 1: and it makes it you don't have to think about stuff.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's perfect with me. Was like hey, he's like, hey,
Speaker 5: We're gonna make this arrow for you. I'm like, great,
Speaker 5: I have.
Speaker 1: It's like I got like a lot of opinions about
Speaker 1: a lot of kinds of uh. I have a lot
Speaker 1: of well earned opinions about rifles, ammunition, knives, apparel. But
Speaker 1: for whatever reason, I've just taken for whatever reason, when
Speaker 1: it comes to archery, I have a you tell me attitude.
Speaker 1: I just know who I'm going to ask exactly I know,
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna go because there's a thing that I'm
Speaker 1: guilty of it. Other people are guilty of it. You
Speaker 1: have a great experience, right, Like you do something and
Speaker 1: you hit a ball and the bull takes two steps
Speaker 1: of tips over or whatever, or it's a really big bowl,
Speaker 1: and then the rest of your you're like, by god,
Speaker 1: you know, I like a right hand twist. Did you
Speaker 1: see how big my bull was? And you're kind of
Speaker 1: like yeah, but you could have run eight arrow Like
Speaker 1: I don't know, could you have run eight different aerow
Speaker 1: configurations through that bowl and the same thing would have
Speaker 1: happened or not? Like it's so there's so much anecdotal
Speaker 1: right or some guys like I'll never use that broadhead
Speaker 1: again I lost a bull.
Speaker 2: Well maybe you should have put on me.
Speaker 1: Like I don't know, do you know what I'm saying, Like,
Speaker 1: I don't know. And so you can get drowned by
Speaker 1: the unless you have just like experience after experience after
Speaker 1: experience after experience, you can get drowned in the anecdotal.
Speaker 1: Oh absolutely, So I just like to have people, I know,
Speaker 1: I always talk to Phelips. I like hearing what Bill
Speaker 1: has to say.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was the same way.
Speaker 5: You know in football, everybody's got it, you know, there's
Speaker 5: always a different way to do something right, like especially
Speaker 5: past rushing, because it is ultimately football is a violent
Speaker 5: game of chess, is what it.
Speaker 1: Is all the show. I saw the episode that man, Yeah.
Speaker 5: It's it's just a violent game of chess. And it
Speaker 5: is like how you fail. It's that's why it's the
Speaker 5: relation between bow hunting and football to me is so
Speaker 5: it's so strong because, Hm, you fail so much, like
Speaker 5: you fail way more than you succeed on the football field.
Speaker 5: And in those failures you have to find like the
Speaker 5: weakness that like that you created. So I'm always like
Speaker 5: doing something to set something up later. Right, So when
Speaker 5: it comes to pass rushing, I'm gonna I'll bull rush
Speaker 5: a guy, right, So I'll just come off and just
Speaker 5: power him, just go put my head under his chin,
Speaker 5: put my hands in his chest and drive him back. Well,
Speaker 5: what's that gonna do the next time? Next time he's
Speaker 5: gonna be like, he's gonna probably bullrush me again. So
Speaker 5: I'm gonna still a little heavier. Then I try to
Speaker 5: get by him, swipe his hands, move, you know, do something,
Speaker 5: and then okay, that that that might have worked. So
Speaker 5: I kind of try to swipe his hands again, so
Speaker 5: he oversets. Then I spin off of that. So then
Speaker 5: you know, that's that's what it turns into. It turns
Speaker 5: into just like this dance. And for me it was
Speaker 5: the same way with you know, I grew up hunting
Speaker 5: white tail and in Turkey because Ohio northeast Ohio, so
Speaker 5: that's what I was primarily primarily hunting. So western hunting
Speaker 5: was so like I always wanted to do spot in
Speaker 5: stocks because you can't spot in stock whitetail in Ohio
Speaker 5: because it's good luck. You know, you're just like you're
Speaker 5: not going it's not gonna work.
Speaker 1: You start out young.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I killed my first white tail when I was thirteen,
Speaker 2: fourteen years old, and.
Speaker 1: That was back when you had to know. That was
Speaker 1: back when you had to wait a while, right, It's
Speaker 1: not like now you just like start your kid hunting
Speaker 1: whenever you feel like it.
Speaker 5: Well, I think, well I started. I started like pheasant
Speaker 5: hunting when I was like nine or ten. So you
Speaker 5: were like, I think it's like nine or ten is
Speaker 5: like the cut off that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, a lot of that, A lot of that's changed
Speaker 1: so much. But I'm quite a bit older than you are,
Speaker 1: and you had to be like you couldn't you couldn't
Speaker 1: hunt deer with a gun to you're fourteen?
Speaker 5: Oh wow, See I killed my first deer with the bow.
Speaker 5: Yeah that was a and it was I took a
Speaker 5: climber out and was on a buddy's farm, and yeah,
Speaker 5: I just like first buck that showed its fate, you know,
Speaker 5: showed its antler's This little four pointer just showed up
Speaker 5: and I just started losing my mind up there and yeah,
Speaker 5: put a good shot.
Speaker 2: On me, ran fourteen yards and died.
Speaker 1: But but you weren't hunting with your dad though.
Speaker 2: No, No, I don't know my dad. I was hunting
Speaker 2: with friends.
Speaker 1: Like, could you mind laying that out quick for me.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so so I grew up. My mom married a
Speaker 2: guy when I was three months old, got married. It
Speaker 2: wasn't my dad.
Speaker 1: Have you tracked your dad down though?
Speaker 2: No, tried. I can't find she's going, No, she doesn't.
Speaker 2: My mom doesn't know who it is.
Speaker 1: But have you gone done like the twenty three.
Speaker 5: And yeah, we've done all that stuff and I'm upset
Speaker 5: now and they have now they have my DNA and
Speaker 5: I don't like that.
Speaker 1: But they're not finding matches.
Speaker 2: Ain't not finding any matches.
Speaker 5: Cluster they found out like where I'm from, like the
Speaker 5: Scandinavian Fiking background and stuff, but it goes from Scandinavia
Speaker 5: to Ireland and straight to Appalasia.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because I gathered sometimes they'll be it'll be that,
Speaker 1: oh in some neighborhood in Cleveland, right, there's a bunch
Speaker 1: of Yeah, that seems like.
Speaker 2: You couldn't find anything.
Speaker 5: Had a lot of leads that could you know, people
Speaker 5: like oh he kind of looks like you, or he's
Speaker 5: big or this that, and it's like.
Speaker 1: You know, not Chester.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just we could find it.
Speaker 5: So so that's why you know, when I got intro
Speaker 5: I got introduced to hunting by my stepdad. But his
Speaker 5: idea of hunting was like he'd hand me it a
Speaker 5: four to ten and sit me under a tree and
Speaker 5: tell me not to move, and I'd sit there and
Speaker 5: freeze for four hours and then we'd leave.
Speaker 1: That's not bad advice. Yeah, he was better than giving
Speaker 1: you four to ten and telling you to move. Yeah, exactly,
Speaker 1: it was good.
Speaker 5: I mean he'd say, yeah, sit here, don't move, and
Speaker 5: then he'd go off and wander off somewhere and then
Speaker 5: tell me he'll be back to get me, and I'd
Speaker 5: be sitting in just shivering, like it didn't matter if
Speaker 5: a deer came, I couldn't move it anyways to shoot it.
Speaker 5: So that was my idea of hunting with him. So
Speaker 5: then I when I met a friend when I was
Speaker 5: in middle school who was really in a bow hunting and.
Speaker 2: His brother was a little bit a little bit taller.
Speaker 5: So when I was when I was like thirteen twelve
Speaker 5: thirteen fourteen, I was shooting like a probably like a
Speaker 5: twenty eight inch draw or something like that, so I
Speaker 5: could just pick up a grown man's bow and start
Speaker 5: shooting it. So I started shooting this old psc that
Speaker 5: he had. It was like his old bow, and I
Speaker 5: was just like it was just like a natural thing
Speaker 5: for me. It just had no problem put in the
Speaker 5: arrow where I wanted it to go.
Speaker 2: It just made sense.
Speaker 5: So I really like picked it up then and I
Speaker 5: was obsessed with it. The problem was is that football
Speaker 5: kind of got in the way of that because September
Speaker 5: and September, October, November is football season all the way
Speaker 5: into December, so you really you're getting like late season
Speaker 5: hunts or all that that are available. So once I
Speaker 5: got into the to college, I didn't get to hunt
Speaker 5: much at all. I was like every now and then
Speaker 5: type of thing.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 5: So it's like if I had a you only get
Speaker 5: two weeks off a year in college football, that's all
Speaker 5: you get. So if it was like, you know, we
Speaker 5: were playing in a BCS game in January or something,
Speaker 5: we'd get like a little four day weekend where we
Speaker 5: could I could dip off up to northeast Ohio and
Speaker 5: hit somebody's farm and I would just you know, shoot
Speaker 5: the first thing it came, so I guess it meat.
Speaker 5: And that's kind of how it went. So, and I
Speaker 5: never had my I didn't have my own bow anymore.
Speaker 5: I couldn't afford one. So I like when I got draft,
Speaker 5: I had seven dollars to my name, didn't have a
Speaker 5: bank account, huh, didn't have I didn't pay I paid
Speaker 5: everything in cash because I had a pel grant. I
Speaker 5: just cashed that check and pay on my rent and
Speaker 5: everything out of that. I was on scholarship, so they
Speaker 5: just paid for all the other stuff.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 5: So I didn't have any any concept of like, you know,
Speaker 5: buying like a fifteen hundred dollars matthews.
Speaker 1: Around any kind of money.
Speaker 2: No, No, there.
Speaker 5: Was everybody's pretty The averaging come in my hometown is
Speaker 5: like sixteen thousand a year, so it's it's a pretty
Speaker 5: poor area, but a lot of hunters. Everybody hunts, you know.
Speaker 5: It's like we get the first day, the first day
Speaker 5: of opening shotgun season, everybody's off from school. Nobody goes
Speaker 5: to school that day. It's they just call it off.
Speaker 5: So it's a big deal where I come from. But
Speaker 5: that's also another thing why I didn't really like gun hunting,
Speaker 5: because we'd go out and to public land and and
Speaker 5: gun hunting it was like you had to dodge bullets
Speaker 5: the whole time because if a deer jumped up and ran.
Speaker 5: It was like five or six you know, different groups
Speaker 5: of people shooting at the same deer running across the
Speaker 5: ridge and you're standing on that ridge and you just
Speaker 5: hear the bullets whizzing by, and it's like, you know,
Speaker 5: those are big slugs, you know, So they're really only
Speaker 5: one hundred yards away from you, so they're not far.
Speaker 2: They know that you're up there. What are you shooting
Speaker 2: up here for? So it was just dangerous.
Speaker 5: So I just enjoyed bow hunting better because you're sitting
Speaker 5: in a tree stand, you're kind of you know, there's
Speaker 5: a strategy involved. So that's why like when I started
Speaker 5: l hunting, when I was finally able to l hunt,
Speaker 5: which was you know, I waited ten years in the
Speaker 5: NFL to living in Denver and seeing all my buddies
Speaker 5: getting to go and this and that, and I was like, man,
Speaker 5: I would love to go, but I had no idea
Speaker 5: about the point draw and all this and that. So
Speaker 5: my first time getting to go elk hunt and really
Speaker 5: like seeing how it's the same type of chess match.
Speaker 2: It is.
Speaker 5: Everything can go right, but if that bull decides he
Speaker 5: doesn't want to just take another step out of now
Speaker 5: from behind that tree, it's kind of over for you.
Speaker 5: Or if the wind switches on you, like all these
Speaker 5: factors go in go into it, and everything has to
Speaker 5: happen for a reason, like you're making these moves prior, Like, Okay,
Speaker 5: I've spotted this bowl over on this ridge, so how
Speaker 5: do I get there? I have to make all these
Speaker 5: different moves over hours of like four or five hours
Speaker 5: to get myself in position with the wind being right,
Speaker 5: so I can make a move on this bowl. And
Speaker 5: there's something about that that I just I love it,
Speaker 5: like I love the planning of it, and I love
Speaker 5: the even the failure. I always learned something in that failure. Right,
Speaker 5: It's just the same way on a football field, if
Speaker 5: it didn't work, I learned something from it. I'm not
Speaker 5: going to go out there and try the same thing,
Speaker 5: you know, I'm gonna let's let's switch it up and
Speaker 5: try a different route. And that's something I loved. And
Speaker 5: then what I also loved is, you know, I said
Speaker 5: this on the Go Hunt podcast. I was talking about,
Speaker 5: you know, when I was finally able to release an
Speaker 5: arrow on a bull. I've won, I've sacked quarterbacks and
Speaker 5: Super bowls, I've sacked Tom Brady in AFC Championship Games.
Speaker 5: Eighty thousand people screaming, howling, you know, because my last
Speaker 5: thing is wolves, so they howled.
Speaker 2: So like that feeling is very surreal.
Speaker 5: Like when you sack somebody and jump up and howl
Speaker 5: and then the whole crowd does it with you. There's something
Speaker 5: that goes that. But I've never felt the kind of
Speaker 5: emotions I felt when I was finally able to put
Speaker 5: my first bull down. I mean I didn't, I just
Speaker 5: is screaming.
Speaker 2: I'm just like, just like you finally released it, you know.
Speaker 5: But but when I was finally able to put an
Speaker 5: arrow through through a bowl and put my hands on him,
Speaker 5: nothing is I'm telling When I was listening when I
Speaker 5: was seven years old, I was I was six years old,
Speaker 5: I White were Bill and I were talking about this.
Speaker 5: I watched Reggie White and the Green Bay Packers and
Speaker 5: Brett Favre win a Super Bowl go pack and I
Speaker 5: was a huge Packers fan, and I was like, I
Speaker 5: watched Reggie White grab that Lombardi Trophy and he put
Speaker 5: his Super Bowl Championship T shirt over his pads in
Speaker 5: Jersey and carried that thing around, and I was like
Speaker 5: I want to do that. That's like that was my vision, right,
Speaker 5: That's what I want to do. That's what like sparked
Speaker 5: it right away. And I started playing tackle football next year.
Speaker 5: So my dream was to do that. Well I got
Speaker 5: to do that, and I got to carry that Super
Speaker 5: Bowl trophy around and it was like I when you
Speaker 5: reached like a goal, it's like point zero zero one
Speaker 5: percent of people get to actually live out their childhood dream, right,
Speaker 5: Like It's such a small, small occasion. But I always
Speaker 5: dreamed of bell hunting. It seems so far out of
Speaker 5: touch for me, Like it seemed like something I would
Speaker 5: never be able to attain growing up in Ohio. Like I,
Speaker 5: like I said, it was poor. You know, how am
Speaker 5: I going to get to Colorado? How am I gonna
Speaker 5: get to Montana?
Speaker 2: Like that thing?
Speaker 5: These things seem so far out of touch. So when
Speaker 5: I was finally able to do that, it was a
Speaker 5: stronger emotion than I had ever felt in my life. Really,
Speaker 5: when I was finally able to connect with a bull
Speaker 5: and just like the whole the whole experience right here
Speaker 5: in a bull come in just screaming and just so
Speaker 5: you feel it rattling in your chest. It's an unexplainable
Speaker 5: feeling unless you've been around it, and you don't even
Speaker 5: have to hunt to do it. You just go out
Speaker 5: in the you know, take go middle of September, go
Speaker 5: down to New Mexico and see what that's like. It's
Speaker 5: like Jurassic Park out there, you know. So that was
Speaker 5: you know, my first my first bull was like the
Speaker 5: best feeling I've.
Speaker 2: Ever had in my life, you know.
Speaker 5: And I just feel bad saying, act I have a
Speaker 5: daughter and all this stuff, but like this, yeah, this
Speaker 5: is a different accomplishment, right. I didn't really do anything
Speaker 5: on that. On the child birthday, I just was there.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: I didn't have to do much, you know, but do.
Speaker 1: My When my first kid was born, I passed out,
Speaker 1: really because they got off that big ass spinal tap
Speaker 1: deal needle all for the epidural. Yeah, I passed out, man,
Speaker 1: That was I later told the nurse. I said, man,
Speaker 1: I could eat your arm and it wouldn't bother me,
Speaker 1: But you're getting ready to drive that needle in my
Speaker 1: wife's back.
Speaker 3: Have you ever passed out before?
Speaker 1: No, I don't run around pass No, I don't know.
Speaker 1: I kind of tried to spin it off and blame
Speaker 1: various things like I had sounds like your wife's fault,
Speaker 1: had nothing to eat, nothing like that, you know. But yeah,
Speaker 1: because they're.
Speaker 5: So bad for my wife when she was getting at there,
Speaker 5: because she was having contractions while they were putting that
Speaker 5: into her spine, and I was just like.
Speaker 2: I was, I was freaking out. I was so sketched out.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and there was like there's some little complication while
Speaker 1: they're trying to get everything hurried along, you know, yep,
Speaker 1: because well they they're monitoring the heart, you know whatever.
Speaker 1: I can't remember the details now, it was it got stressful,
Speaker 1: and it's so like we're gonna it can't be one way,
Speaker 1: We're gonna do it the other way. And and I
Speaker 1: woke up out in the hallway and heading his nurse's
Speaker 1: lap verybody else doing. Did you miss the just envisioned
Speaker 1: Hi dragging him out, so my vision.
Speaker 6: He wrapped up like a little baby, like.
Speaker 2: They brought me that little.
Speaker 1: Like this one's already circumcised.
Speaker 3: My gosh.
Speaker 1: Uh, when you got when you got blown up so
Speaker 1: bad about when you got so blown up so bad
Speaker 1: about the lion, did it change any thing about your
Speaker 1: behavior or anything?
Speaker 2: Yeah? It did. It changed a lot.
Speaker 5: I felt like a sense of responsibility, right, And the
Speaker 5: responsibility side of it was that, Okay, now I can
Speaker 5: see what kind of attack that we're really under as hunters. Yeah,
Speaker 5: is that what I saw? I could see it that
Speaker 5: it's a really planned out attack. And somebody, you know,
Speaker 5: a guy named Lou Webb, who's just an awesome guy,
Speaker 5: you know, he gave mid this analogy for me. He
Speaker 5: was like, look, he's like, as hunters, we have to
Speaker 5: be like an el curd.
Speaker 2: What are the wolves try to do? The el curd?
Speaker 5: They try to split them apart and pick out the
Speaker 5: week and kill the week. Right, They pick them out
Speaker 5: and they start and then that's how you kill them,
Speaker 5: as you you separate the herd, and then they follow
Speaker 5: one kill it and get another one kill it. So
Speaker 5: if we want to stay together and keep this lifestyle,
Speaker 5: we have to put aside all of our egotistical.
Speaker 2: You know, garbage.
Speaker 1: Really And it's like, Okay, who cares if.
Speaker 5: You're a gun hunter or you're a rifle hunter, or
Speaker 5: you're a crossbow hunter, or you're a long bow hunter,
Speaker 5: or you're a traditional bow hunter or you're a compound
Speaker 5: bow hunter. I don't care. I don't care what kind
Speaker 5: of broadhead you shoot. I don't care any of that stuff.
Speaker 5: That stuff does not matter, because at the end of
Speaker 5: the day, if we don't, if we keep infighting and
Speaker 5: arguing with each other and trying to like take each
Speaker 5: other down, they're gonna win because they have millions upon
Speaker 5: hundreds of millions.
Speaker 2: Of dollars back in them.
Speaker 5: You know, this industry doesn't have that kind of money.
Speaker 5: We have to spend that money just to keep the
Speaker 5: wildlife safe and ready to go for us.
Speaker 2: To hunt them.
Speaker 5: You know, the amount of money that we spend on
Speaker 5: gear and stuff, like, they are spending all that money
Speaker 5: just on ending it, ending it. They don't want us
Speaker 5: to do it, like something about it they hate. They
Speaker 5: don't care that you can't reason with them. And I
Speaker 5: feel a sense of responsibility to try to bring us
Speaker 5: together as hunters and try to keep us in that
Speaker 5: tight little group and like stick together.
Speaker 2: You know, so I did.
Speaker 5: I felt a big sense of responsibility, But I also
Speaker 5: I also had this sense of like, you know, I
Speaker 5: don't want to get too vulgar, but fuck them. You know.
Speaker 5: It's like I did everything by the book. I'm not poaching.
Speaker 5: The amount of money that our money, all the money
Speaker 5: that we spend on hunting, goes straight into the keeping
Speaker 5: their trails going.
Speaker 2: They don't. How do they not realize this?
Speaker 5: Yeah, that you want to you want you want your lakes,
Speaker 5: and you want your trails, and you want your bike paths,
Speaker 5: and you want all this stuff taken care of.
Speaker 2: Who do you think pays for that? Hunters pay for that.
Speaker 5: So as a conservationist and hunters are conservationist, you know,
Speaker 5: if you do it by the book, that's what you're doing, right,
Speaker 5: you're out. I'm not out just looking for any lion
Speaker 5: to kill, right, I'm not out just looking for any
Speaker 5: elk to kill, or any bear, any deer. I'm looking
Speaker 5: for a big mature animal that is, and I'm going
Speaker 5: to eat that animal. And it's everything is used, I
Speaker 5: use everything.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And you're you're in your opera. In your case,
Speaker 1: as we highlighted, you're operating within a very a very
Speaker 1: finely tuned state and federal sanctioned yeah activity.
Speaker 2: Yeah. The North American model is the gold standard.
Speaker 1: Yeah. And it's and it's and it's like this is
Speaker 1: how this elaborate team of biologists and land managers have
Speaker 1: decided to maintain and utilize a resource. I point out,
Speaker 1: like the wolf analogy is good, there's another one. People say,
Speaker 1: you know, we're all in this boat together, and I'll
Speaker 1: point out that now and then certain people will shoot
Speaker 1: we're in the boat together, and they'll shoot holes in
Speaker 1: the bottom of the boat, meaning people you know, you know,
Speaker 1: I'm talking about people who go and and not only
Speaker 1: operate outside of any kind of legal framework, but operate
Speaker 1: outside of any you know, they become unproductive, like they're
Speaker 1: not helpful, right, people who are you know, violating like
Speaker 1: like repeat violation of laws, willful violational laws give people
Speaker 1: a black eye. But I think that like you're saying, man,
Speaker 1: for someone to be operating in accordance with the law
Speaker 1: when we generally all agree on how these things are established,
Speaker 1: to then have that person be crucified, I think is
Speaker 1: also an attack on this very effective wild management system.
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, and they'll put false statements out there. You know,
Speaker 5: there's an organization. We won't say their name, but everybody
Speaker 5: can probably imagine who they were. Starts with a p
Speaker 5: they put out that I that I I I poached
Speaker 5: They've said that I poached it or did it illegally,
Speaker 5: or that these animals are are like mountain lions are
Speaker 5: hit the only big cat thriving in North America. Like
Speaker 5: they are thriving. Go to California. The deer population is
Speaker 5: like decimated.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're expanding, They're expanding numbers. They're colonizing new territory
Speaker 1: and expanding numbers.
Speaker 5: Because that's what they do, you know. And then they're like, well,
Speaker 5: why can't you just uh, you know, move it to
Speaker 5: another area? Well, where are we going to move it to?
Speaker 5: Because there's already lying in that area.
Speaker 1: You know what if you'd done that, you know what
Speaker 1: you've been doing, You've been breaking.
Speaker 2: Law, breaking law exactly. You know, you can't you just.
Speaker 1: There lying in the bag of your truck. I decided
Speaker 1: to take it upon myself and move it to a
Speaker 1: new area.
Speaker 5: I darted it, Yeah, darted like Ricky, Bobby.
Speaker 7: Were you surprised by any of your allies in the
Speaker 7: football community or otherwise when this went down?
Speaker 1: I was surprised by the lack of the allies.
Speaker 2: Oh really, yeah? But uh, you know, I dealt with
Speaker 2: this in multiple things, right, So I refuse to get vaccinated.
Speaker 1: And I uh a lot of trouble for that.
Speaker 5: I got fined a lot of money. But yeah, but
Speaker 5: I just the science. Well, they kept saying, believe in
Speaker 5: the science. I'm like, well, the science isn't there, so
Speaker 5: I'm not gonna believe anything that you tell me. I
Speaker 5: also wouldn't kneel during the anthem, so I lost a
Speaker 5: lot of friends over that.
Speaker 1: But I'm well, you lost friends for not kneeling.
Speaker 5: Yeah, they I was so the there was a the
Speaker 5: wash I think it was a Washington Post front page
Speaker 5: put Derek Wolf tells they asked me, why aren't you
Speaker 5: gonna kneel? And I was like, well, because you know,
Speaker 5: I have a lot of friends and family and people
Speaker 5: that have served. And I remember, I remember, if even
Speaker 5: one person says that it offends them or like kind
Speaker 5: of makes them feel weird about it and they don't
Speaker 5: like it, I'm not gonna to do it. If even
Speaker 5: one veteran says that, I'm still I'm not gonna kneel.
Speaker 1: And when I didn't know there was a pressure, I
Speaker 1: didn't know there was a I knew there was a
Speaker 1: normous there's.
Speaker 2: Big press pressure. The pressure, yeah, big time pressure being
Speaker 2: very pressure. They pressured us heavy to just kind of
Speaker 2: jump on board and do it.
Speaker 3: You didn't get fine for that.
Speaker 5: No, I didn't get fine for that, but I did
Speaker 5: get labeled as a racist. So the Washington Post put
Speaker 5: on Derek Wolf tell us his black teammates to go
Speaker 5: back to Africa. When all I said was if you
Speaker 5: don't love, if you don't love this country. I had
Speaker 5: just traveled to Thailand, so I saw what these people
Speaker 5: lived like on the Bangkok River. I saw what you know,
Speaker 5: these little mountain towns in chang Mai, how they lived
Speaker 5: and they're happy as could be. But I realized how
Speaker 5: privileged we are to live in America, Like even the
Speaker 5: poorest of the poor living better than how they're living
Speaker 5: over there, and.
Speaker 2: They're still happy.
Speaker 5: But to me, I said, if you don't love, if
Speaker 5: you don't love this country, we live in the best
Speaker 5: country in the world. If you don't love this country,
Speaker 5: then why do you live here?
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's all I said. It's just a simple question,
Speaker 2: like why.
Speaker 5: Do you stay like you're well, you're free to go
Speaker 5: and come and go as you please, you know. So
Speaker 5: that was they interpreted that as and they put it
Speaker 5: in quotes too, so I had to yeah. And when
Speaker 5: I finally got them to take it down, the damage
Speaker 5: was already done. So now I got teammates of mine
Speaker 5: who had won a Super Bowl with looking at me
Speaker 5: like dude, I thought like, are you like, is he
Speaker 5: a racist? They're like my family's calling me, asked me
Speaker 5: if you're a racist, if you're this, if you're.
Speaker 2: I'm like, dude, what are you kidding?
Speaker 1: Me? Like really?
Speaker 5: So, yeah, I had dealt with stuff like that before.
Speaker 5: So and then when this, when the lion thing came out,
Speaker 5: I noticed it even more. You know that people were
Speaker 5: like distancing themselves from me, and I was like whatever, man, Like,
Speaker 5: I'm gonna be who I am.
Speaker 2: I'm a stick to my belief.
Speaker 5: It's not going to change for for anybody, especially when
Speaker 5: I'm not hurting anybody just because somebody's offended, you know,
Speaker 5: by the lifestyle that I live, because I love this
Speaker 5: lifestyle and it's it brings me. You know, killing an animal,
Speaker 5: it's not the point. It's the journey. Like my favorite
Speaker 5: part of that hunt and and that story is the
Speaker 5: journey to get there. And you notice when I tell
Speaker 5: the story, it's a small, very small part of actually
Speaker 5: when I shot the animal. Most of the story is
Speaker 5: the grind to get there. It's the same with every animal,
Speaker 5: so they take they all, but all they want to
Speaker 5: see is that because because that's what happens is you
Speaker 5: post a picture, right, it's like, look, you know, check
Speaker 5: it out, you know. But the only reason I'm doing
Speaker 5: I'm not going to post a picture or something. I
Speaker 5: just walked up and was able to kill easy. I
Speaker 5: want to tell the story about how difficult it was
Speaker 5: and how much of a grind it was to get
Speaker 5: to that point. So so to me, if you if
Speaker 5: if you don't want to be friends with me because
Speaker 5: of that, then I don't really want to be friends
Speaker 5: with you anyways.
Speaker 2: So that's fine, you.
Speaker 5: Know, but even you know, people will still come up
Speaker 5: and be like, did you really have to kill that lion?
Speaker 2: It's like who cares? Who?
Speaker 5: What do you care? Why do you care? I did
Speaker 5: everything by the book. It wasn't like some somebody's pet.
Speaker 1: Like are you is that an actual question?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Like I really like why do you care?
Speaker 1: You know?
Speaker 5: But you try to educate it, educate them on it,
Speaker 5: you know. I did an interview on Tuck Carlson where
Speaker 5: I just started hitting with numbers because I knew I
Speaker 5: was gonna have a short segment, so I was like,
Speaker 5: I'm gonna take the opportunity to hit them with some
Speaker 5: conservation numbers about how many attacks on people happens once
Speaker 5: one a year every two years, somebody gets killed by
Speaker 5: a lion, and then what they do to the cubs
Speaker 5: and what that does to the population of the lions.
Speaker 5: So it's actually good for the population of lions to
Speaker 5: take out these big mature toms.
Speaker 1: If your goal is to have more lions.
Speaker 5: Right, if we were out there just wanting to kill lions,
Speaker 5: we've got there and just start shooting every line you.
Speaker 2: Saw, But you still you do you would like to
Speaker 2: have a.
Speaker 5: Healthy lion population because it's still cool to have those
Speaker 5: things around. But when it comes to like the wolves,
Speaker 5: that's what this actually segued me into this the whole
Speaker 5: wolf or you know, trying to keep the wolves out
Speaker 5: of different areas. Colorado's already kind of screwed on that one.
Speaker 5: But the least we can do is make it available
Speaker 5: to hunt them, which is still you're never gonna dent
Speaker 5: that population because it's important. I mean, look at the coyotes,
Speaker 5: you know, coyotes destroying.
Speaker 1: You can definitely it's a good man. I think it's
Speaker 1: a good management tool to have like a sort of
Speaker 1: controlled growth of you know, I mean we've been doing
Speaker 1: it here, like we've been doing it well here Idaho, Wyoming.
Speaker 1: I mean we've been hunting out we've been hunting wolves
Speaker 1: now for years and still seeing expansions of population, healthy numbers.
Speaker 1: It's not like it's the way it's positioned as an
Speaker 1: either or as ridiculous. It's like either either can have
Speaker 1: wolves or you can have wolf hunting, which will result
Speaker 1: in no wolves. And that argument has been thoroughly I
Speaker 1: mean no one would know it, no one from Peter
Speaker 1: would realize it now, but that argument has been thoroughly
Speaker 1: put the rest that you can you can very successfully,
Speaker 1: you can very successfully have healthy, stable wolf populations alongside
Speaker 1: state managed wolf hunting. Yeah, and it's been There is
Speaker 1: zero cases with mountain lion hunting. There is zero cases
Speaker 1: where modern like regulated hunting of mountain lions, talking about
Speaker 1: back in eighteen ninety when they were poisoning them with
Speaker 1: strict nine. Yeah, regulated hunting the mountain lions having any
Speaker 1: appreciable impact on mountain lion numbers. It's like it's just
Speaker 1: not a thing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not.
Speaker 1: You're gonna have roughly the same amount of lions, You're
Speaker 1: gonna have the same amount of lines, whether you know,
Speaker 1: if you're hunting them or not hunting, especially when you
Speaker 1: factor in that the line like you got would have statistically, however,
Speaker 1: it would have wound up being killed by a state agent.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because it was in California. It's too comfortable around people.
Speaker 1: California. As soon as they got rid of lion hunting.
Speaker 1: The number of lions they kill that state biologists kill
Speaker 1: goes through the roof. And now they're killing the same
Speaker 1: number of lions annually.
Speaker 5: Is they always work when they could be that they're
Speaker 5: missing out on opportunity for people to hunt them.
Speaker 1: People used to pay to go do it. Yeah, now
Speaker 1: you pay, you gotta go do it.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Do you think the lion you think when the lion
Speaker 1: gets killed, he's like, well, thank god it was a
Speaker 1: government agent exactly. It's like, of course not.
Speaker 2: It's silly. Honestly, it's silly, and it's you know what
Speaker 2: I think it is.
Speaker 1: I was just hoping.
Speaker 5: I was just hoping it wasn't some local. Yeah, I
Speaker 5: hope it wasn't some guy out here. Bet or not
Speaker 5: have been just some guy, some hunter.
Speaker 1: I'm glad he's got glad, he's got lights on it.
Speaker 5: I think this is all to do with it. It's
Speaker 5: because they're not thinking. They don't want to hear the
Speaker 5: science or the rationality behind it. They're just thinking emotionally,
Speaker 5: which I understand that they're emotional about it and they
Speaker 5: love cats or whatever, like, but you know, at the
Speaker 5: end of the day, man like, you have to manage
Speaker 5: if you're gonna live in within the nature. Like if
Speaker 5: you're gonna build houses up in the mountains and you're
Speaker 5: gonna live in the mountains, you have to manage that
Speaker 5: that population.
Speaker 1: It's Here's the other thing that frustrates me about this
Speaker 1: conversation is that at this point they're managed as a
Speaker 1: big game animal. The regulations are more strict. Yeah, h
Speaker 1: if you like, if anyone ever, if anyone who's like
Speaker 1: uneasy about mountain lion hunting from not in terms of
Speaker 1: that they feel bad for the mountain lion. If anyone's
Speaker 1: uneasy about mountain lion hunting in terms of that, it's
Speaker 1: like exercise in a reckless fashion. I would invite you
Speaker 1: to go and try. If you're not from a hunting background,
Speaker 1: I would invite you to go and try to understand
Speaker 1: mountain lion regulations. Yeah, in terms of how thinly sliced
Speaker 1: the map is and all the quota systems around males females,
Speaker 1: tiered season structures.
Speaker 2: You have to take a test, dude, before you get
Speaker 2: your license.
Speaker 1: It's like, you know, you get most places you get
Speaker 1: yourself deer license. It's like the most you gotta figure
Speaker 1: out is that you know, you get like whatever amount
Speaker 1: of time, and it's either got antlers or don't you know?
Speaker 1: You get into these twenty four hour forty eight hour
Speaker 1: reporting hotlines so that you have like a portion of
Speaker 1: a mountain range carved off and you're gonna allow one
Speaker 1: female and if that female gets killed, you have X
Speaker 1: hours to register it. The whole season shuts down within
Speaker 1: forty eight hours. There's like nothing like that now, I
Speaker 1: mean some big horn sheep stuff. There's really that level
Speaker 1: of detailed management. I shouldn't say nothing because there's a
Speaker 1: handful of fur bears that fall in that, but anyways,
Speaker 1: that's like that's a level of focus and precision that
Speaker 1: is not exercised elsewhere, now, not broadly exercised.
Speaker 8: Del I could explain Montana's hunting eggs to just about anybody,
Speaker 8: with the exception of mountain lions, I wouldn't know where
Speaker 8: to begin to start.
Speaker 6: Ye, Like, it's just inordinately complicated.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's they it's it's managed as like a
Speaker 1: long term renewable resource. Yeah, and very focused and like
Speaker 1: that has not like I won't be clear that has
Speaker 1: not always been the case, but that's the case now, right.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 5: Well, it's funny because you always, you know, you talk about,
Speaker 5: you know, what they used to do back in the day.
Speaker 5: When you see those old timey pictures of guys, you know,
Speaker 5: I'd hunt camp and it's like five guys and they
Speaker 5: got like ten deer hanging in the background. Sure, you know,
Speaker 5: a bunch of ten deer, a bear, a lion, they
Speaker 5: got all these different animals. Because there was the rules
Speaker 5: weren't there. They could just go out and do whatever
Speaker 5: they wanted.
Speaker 1: I'm going to post a picture from a guy gave
Speaker 1: me a picture from nineteen fifty four or of a
Speaker 1: bunch of dudes in Utah. I don't know what the
Speaker 1: rags there was rags in nineteen fifty four, but with
Speaker 1: a flatbed loaded with mule deer like you would not
Speaker 1: like bucks, like you would not just giant. You can't
Speaker 1: even tell how many you're in there. But it's just
Speaker 1: like some of the bucks in that truck are like
Speaker 1: what yeah, you know what I mean, daffy, Like there's
Speaker 1: like spreads in there. There's like a buccaneer that's got
Speaker 1: to have i don't know, thirty six inches, but they're
Speaker 1: just piled in there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, piled. It's insane.
Speaker 5: It blows my mind. You know, even these like old
Speaker 5: time duck hunters and stuff too. You see these piles
Speaker 5: of like no limits.
Speaker 3: You know, I've got an old photo from my grandpa
Speaker 3: that I need to get in like maybe the podcast room.
Speaker 3: Well it's pretty full for my office, but it's big
Speaker 3: blown up photo of like what you guys are talking about,
Speaker 3: a bunch of deer. There's a couple of frozen foxes, yeah,
Speaker 3: hanging out the back. It's pretty cool.
Speaker 2: It's pretty wild.
Speaker 1: La La Huffman was it this great photographer that he, uh,
Speaker 1: photography is just becoming a thing that you could, you know,
Speaker 1: move around with a camera. And this dude named La
Speaker 1: Huffman made it out to Miles City, Montana and the
Speaker 1: winner at eighteen eighty one, so he got to do
Speaker 1: photos of the So the last big buffalo slaughter was
Speaker 1: the winner at eighty one eighty two. It was when
Speaker 1: the railroad hit Miles City and kind of tapped into
Speaker 1: the core of the northern herd, and they killed a
Speaker 1: couple of million that winter. No, that was the last
Speaker 1: big shoot, and he got to go. He took photos
Speaker 1: of some of these hide hunters, and there's this one
Speaker 1: photo he has. They used to make these dugouts. They
Speaker 1: just dig into a cutbank, and the amount of like
Speaker 1: stuff that they got piled up around there, right down
Speaker 1: to frozen buffalo fetuses as decorations. And then some of
Speaker 1: those pictures he took too, of like the mule deer
Speaker 1: heads and even now the white tail heads where it'd
Speaker 1: be like just one dude standing air with like a
Speaker 1: dugout canoe and fifty bucks. I mean, you look at it.
Speaker 1: You gotta be like that'd have been a pretty good
Speaker 1: time check that out. But on the other hair, like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, man, well they probably were, Yeah, these
Speaker 1: guys are shooting for the mining they're shooting for the
Speaker 1: mining camps. Yeah, shooting meat for the mining camps. And
Speaker 1: and like even just what what was their awareness about
Speaker 1: were they were they you know, Colonel Dodge of Dodge City.
Speaker 1: Colonel Dodge talked about what he thought was just this
Speaker 1: extraordinary mealder that was lost in a fire, and you'd
Speaker 1: be like, I would love to see what that guy thought,
Speaker 1: what that guy in eighteen seventy thought was just an
Speaker 1: extraordinary mealder.
Speaker 2: It's probably just ridiculous. You'd love to know, right, Yeah.
Speaker 1: These pictures, these pictures, these guys like nah, you're like, dude,
Speaker 1: like said two hundred inch buck. Yeah, those bucks ain't around, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, and you got like six of them. It
Speaker 1: would have been great. It'd have been great to see
Speaker 1: some of that.
Speaker 9: Yeah.
Speaker 2: You know, it's funny you talk. I heard you say
Speaker 2: something I forget.
Speaker 5: I forget what episode you were talking about it, but
Speaker 5: talking about like a time machine, like where would you
Speaker 5: want to go?
Speaker 4: Mm hm.
Speaker 2: And I think you talked about Daniel Boone coming through
Speaker 2: the Cumberland Gap.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and uh that Like when you said that, that
Speaker 5: just stuck with me because I was like, man, I
Speaker 5: always thought that way too, Like I'd be walking, you know,
Speaker 5: walking in Appalachia and coming through these mountains and you know,
Speaker 5: what was it like out here before all these people
Speaker 5: came in here, Like, what was the wildlife like? Because
Speaker 5: I know how the I mean, there's deer everywhere.
Speaker 1: Well, you'll have to listen to I was gonna say this,
Speaker 1: you know, a project just for you.
Speaker 6: Stay tuned, stay tuned perfect.
Speaker 1: Because we're gonna we're gonna tackle that question.
Speaker 2: I just think that would be incredible.
Speaker 1: No, we're gonna We're gonna get into a lot of
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff. What what were those guys? How
Speaker 1: did they hunt? What were they doing? What were they seeing?
Speaker 1: What was it like? Why was that area soul full
Speaker 1: of game?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Probably not what you'd expect. Yeah, you like, you know,
Speaker 1: it's it's a it's a crazy story. Uh, you can
Speaker 1: stick around for trivia, Yeah, building and play trivia. Did
Speaker 1: you play tribune to before I did? Did you lose?
Speaker 1: I did not win? Did she beat the Shelby Index?
Speaker 1: We'll talk about it on the show. How about that?
Speaker 9: Oh?
Speaker 1: Hey, I got a thing for you. What's up a stat?
Speaker 1: A guy proposed a stat? Can I tell you that now?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: He thinks that you ought to do when I was
Speaker 1: doing the Oh you know it keeps. Here's the thing
Speaker 1: funny is I already told Krin this story. I got
Speaker 1: two things for you. Someone came up to me and
Speaker 1: said they couldn't figure out why Krinn did so bad
Speaker 1: at trivia. And I told Krinn that they said that
Speaker 1: they looked her up and she looks very smart.
Speaker 7: Okay, uh huh, Just they.
Speaker 1: Couldn't make any sense out of it. Yeah, can't you
Speaker 1: make any sense? I don't know what they're expecting. They're
Speaker 1: expecting to see someone that just looked like a poor
Speaker 1: performer at trivia. Here's the stat and it's a good one.
Speaker 1: Strong strong, strong closers and strong beginners like you know
Speaker 1: how people say you know that the right they start strong,
Speaker 1: they come back and finish strong. Is there anything to that? Well,
Speaker 1: we've seen with the overtime questions that Brody is by
Speaker 1: far our weakest performer. On the contrary, I think you're
Speaker 1: our strongest performer and overtime, Steve, does that make you
Speaker 1: feel good? Feel great? Yeah?
Speaker 7: So I don't know because the ten questions are kind
Speaker 7: of random about how they're organized, But I think you
Speaker 7: can pick up a lot of a lot of intel
Speaker 7: about how folks handle overtime.
Speaker 9: Uh.
Speaker 1: One thing I wanted to add. We work with a guy,
Speaker 1: Garrett Long. He's gonna hook you up with a bunch
Speaker 1: of first light stuff.
Speaker 2: Okay, cool, sweet, So.
Speaker 1: He's gonna get you squared away on that, and then
Speaker 1: you're gonna stick around for trivia. Bill's gonna play trivia.
Speaker 1: You didn't win last time. Do you feel like you're
Speaker 1: gonna win? No?
Speaker 2: Really, no, not a chance.
Speaker 1: Here's a quick question. You know how you throw a
Speaker 1: bone to guests? Is there gonna be like a double
Speaker 1: bone throw? We have one for each of them.
Speaker 2: What kind of categories are there?
Speaker 7: We will talk about.
Speaker 1: Play the drop phil.
Speaker 9: A Ride on a seal gray, shine like silver in
Speaker 9: the sun. Ride, Ride on along, sweet hot.
Speaker 1: We done beat this damp horse to death.
Speaker 3: Taking a new one.
Speaker 1: Ride We're done beat this damn horse today, So take
Speaker 1: a new one and ride on