WEBVTT - Thinking Sideways: The Jefferson Davis Eight 0:00:04.320 --> 0:00:17.000 Thinking Sideways. I don't know stories of things we simply 0:00:17.040 --> 0:00:23.079 don't know the answer too well. Hi, They're welcome to 0:00:23.160 --> 0:00:27.360 Thinking Sideways the podcast. I am Steve as always enjoying 0:00:27.400 --> 0:00:33.000 my co host Deven and today we we've got another 0:00:33.960 --> 0:00:37.200 Actually it's not another. This is actually a really complex 0:00:37.280 --> 0:00:39.600 mystery that we're going to go into. This is I 0:00:39.640 --> 0:00:41.839 would say, this is the first time we've done anything 0:00:41.880 --> 0:00:44.919 like this. Yeah, and this is I know, this is 0:00:45.560 --> 0:00:49.680 this is a tough case. I know it made Devon uncomfortable. 0:00:49.800 --> 0:00:53.080 Number of times you were not happy researching. I'm not 0:00:53.240 --> 0:00:56.920 and it usually liked the murder I usually I usually do. 0:00:57.080 --> 0:01:00.640 I just think there's something about this case as a 0:01:00.800 --> 0:01:05.760 young female that is, you know, and granted I am 0:01:05.840 --> 0:01:09.959 not of the similar situation of this case that we're 0:01:09.959 --> 0:01:12.680 going to talk about, but just there's something, you know, 0:01:12.760 --> 0:01:16.640 like I can totally do the like random unsolved kind 0:01:16.640 --> 0:01:20.920 of mysterious murders, but like when we're talking about something 0:01:20.959 --> 0:01:25.600 like this, yeah, you know, actually just makes me researching this. 0:01:26.080 --> 0:01:27.959 I don't know if you guys ever watched that show 0:01:28.080 --> 0:01:31.160 was on for two seasons years ago, twin Peaks, They 0:01:31.160 --> 0:01:33.800 ever watched that show? I did see some of it. Yeah, 0:01:33.920 --> 0:01:37.959 it's about this bucolic little town up in Washington, and 0:01:38.120 --> 0:01:40.440 uh and it's like, you know, a little small town. 0:01:40.600 --> 0:01:42.880 Everything's nice and everything, but then there's just all this 0:01:43.200 --> 0:01:45.839 stuff going on underneath the surface. I mean a lot 0:01:45.880 --> 0:01:49.800 of murder, a lot of just intrigue, all kinds of 0:01:49.800 --> 0:01:51.840 people who really surprise you. You know, you thought they 0:01:51.880 --> 0:01:55.920 were they were just regular folks. With what this of 0:01:56.120 --> 0:01:59.400 With with that very descriptive introduction, before we get into 0:01:59.440 --> 0:02:02.840 things I want to talking about, well, I want to 0:02:02.840 --> 0:02:04.760 tell everybody right now that the story that we're going 0:02:04.800 --> 0:02:12.519 to talk about involves multiple murders and some very graphic things. 0:02:12.720 --> 0:02:16.520 So if that's not your deal, if or if you've 0:02:16.560 --> 0:02:19.840 got kids around right now, you should probably either skip 0:02:19.919 --> 0:02:23.840 this one or listen to you know, listen to it later. Yeah, 0:02:24.040 --> 0:02:26.400 because it's this is this is a rough one. It 0:02:28.040 --> 0:02:30.880 has the potential to be a rough one. And and 0:02:30.919 --> 0:02:33.079 the story that we're going to talk about is the 0:02:33.160 --> 0:02:36.680 Jefferson Davis Sate or you've also also it's also referred 0:02:36.680 --> 0:02:39.080 to as the Jennings eight. Yeah, and and this was 0:02:39.200 --> 0:02:41.440 this is this is not a small story. So again, 0:02:41.480 --> 0:02:43.360 this is kind of one of those we've all taken 0:02:43.400 --> 0:02:45.880 it on together to try and work through this, and 0:02:48.280 --> 0:02:50.520 I've got to tell you right on the on the outset, Joiel, 0:02:50.520 --> 0:02:52.440 We're not going to solve this, this one, even more 0:02:52.480 --> 0:02:54.639 than any of the other times you ever say that, well, 0:02:54.680 --> 0:02:56.880 we can solve this. In high level terms, there were 0:02:56.919 --> 0:03:00.800 eight murders. Okay, well, don't don't. Don't get ahead of yourself. 0:03:00.800 --> 0:03:08.800 And if he okay, am I wrong? All right? So 0:03:09.120 --> 0:03:11.080 what we're gonna do here is is we're gonna do 0:03:11.120 --> 0:03:13.000 this in a couple of different parts. So this is 0:03:13.000 --> 0:03:14.720 gonna be set up a little bit differently than a 0:03:14.760 --> 0:03:18.560 normal episode is we're gonna kind of break down some 0:03:18.760 --> 0:03:21.880 of the players that are involved in some of the facts. 0:03:22.880 --> 0:03:26.680 The person that did the most investigation on this story 0:03:26.840 --> 0:03:29.480 is a man by the name of Ethan Brown. And 0:03:29.520 --> 0:03:33.120 Ethan Brown he wrote a great article about this and 0:03:33.160 --> 0:03:36.120 it was on me, it's on medium and were we 0:03:36.160 --> 0:03:38.640 actually were lucky enough to talk to him, and so 0:03:38.720 --> 0:03:41.840 we've got a pretty good, lengthy interview where he's gonna 0:03:41.880 --> 0:03:44.240 walk through a lot of this stuff with you and 0:03:44.280 --> 0:03:46.520 then we'll talk about some other stuff after that. But 0:03:46.600 --> 0:03:49.000 I just kind of wanna before we get to that interview. 0:03:49.400 --> 0:03:51.800 Let's lay down some groundwork. So by the way, he's 0:03:51.960 --> 0:03:54.440 Ethan Brown is writing a book about this very topic, 0:03:54.880 --> 0:03:57.080 which y'all are probably going to go out and get 0:03:57.080 --> 0:04:00.120 a copy of, probably are um and I think it 0:04:00.160 --> 0:04:03.560 would probably be helpful to mention on the outset. You 0:04:03.600 --> 0:04:06.280 may or may not know our website we always post stuff, 0:04:06.360 --> 0:04:11.160 but Steve has made this kind of flow chart graphic 0:04:11.280 --> 0:04:15.160 description of what's going on. So if you want to 0:04:15.240 --> 0:04:18.920 check out that document, it's a you can download it 0:04:18.920 --> 0:04:20.760 as a PDF. We're going to make it available to you, 0:04:21.120 --> 0:04:25.440 so right now go to Thinking Sideways podcast dot com. 0:04:25.520 --> 0:04:27.520 You can just you know, click on it, check the 0:04:27.560 --> 0:04:31.120 PDF or printed out whatever you want. It may actually 0:04:31.160 --> 0:04:33.839 help you track this if that's something a lot of 0:04:33.880 --> 0:04:36.400 you listen while you're at work, whatever, So don't worry 0:04:36.400 --> 0:04:37.880 about it. We're gonna do the best we can. But 0:04:38.120 --> 0:04:42.440 if you are interested, you should do that. Now. Print 0:04:42.480 --> 0:04:48.200 out your like little Annie Orphan Annie. Hopefully your printer 0:04:48.279 --> 0:04:52.800 can handle the leven by seventeen. View it online. It's easy, 0:04:52.839 --> 0:04:56.640 but no it I we made this knowing that this 0:04:56.720 --> 0:04:58.960 was a complicated case and this is the first time 0:04:59.000 --> 0:05:01.159 we've had to do is and I think it's going 0:05:01.200 --> 0:05:03.680 to really help. Okay, Okay, so now that you've downloaded 0:05:03.720 --> 0:05:06.919 the pdf, Okay, so here, let's let's start out and 0:05:06.960 --> 0:05:09.640 we'll just kind of take this in. Each person will 0:05:09.680 --> 0:05:11.479 kind of take a different piece. So I'll go ahead 0:05:11.480 --> 0:05:15.279 and I'll start off with our victims. And there are 0:05:15.520 --> 0:05:20.599 eight victims, primary victims. And these are eight different women, 0:05:20.760 --> 0:05:23.440 and those plus two other corpses. Well, yes, this is 0:05:23.440 --> 0:05:25.440 why we're just talking about right now. We're just gonna 0:05:25.520 --> 0:05:28.560 name off our primary victims, the eight and they were 0:05:28.640 --> 0:05:33.520 murdered between two thousand five to two thousand nine. And 0:05:33.520 --> 0:05:36.120 and on the outset. Again, if we haven't said this, 0:05:36.200 --> 0:05:38.479 these murders are unsolved. Yeah. And and by the way, 0:05:38.520 --> 0:05:41.320 this is this is in in Jennings, Louisiana, a little 0:05:41.320 --> 0:05:44.560 small town of about what ten thousand people. Now I'm 0:05:44.800 --> 0:05:47.080 thinking about this now we live in We live in 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:51.640 Portland's which average is about twenty murders a year. Portland 0:05:51.800 --> 0:05:56.160 is infinitely larger than Yeah. Yeah, that's the first town 0:05:56.200 --> 0:05:58.280 that size. That's a hell of a lot of murder. Yeah, 0:05:58.279 --> 0:06:00.520 and I guess that there's so they is the eight. 0:06:01.360 --> 0:06:03.400 This is getting ahead of ourselves talking about let's just 0:06:03.400 --> 0:06:06.640 talk about the eighth. So I'm gonna just list them 0:06:06.640 --> 0:06:11.039 off in chronological order. On May two thousand five, the 0:06:11.120 --> 0:06:15.400 body of Lynn Lewis was found. We're doing chronological of 0:06:15.480 --> 0:06:19.120 discovery of discovery, yes, yes, thank you for clarifying that, 0:06:19.240 --> 0:06:21.000 because we don't know the exact dates. So these are 0:06:21.000 --> 0:06:25.680 all discoveries of the body. And also they might have 0:06:25.680 --> 0:06:29.440 committed suicide. Just made it look like murderers, alright. So 0:06:29.520 --> 0:06:33.919 next we have Ernestine Patterson, whose body was discovered on 0:06:34.000 --> 0:06:38.360 June eighteenth of two thousand five. We have Kristen Lopez 0:06:38.400 --> 0:06:42.080 whose body was found on March eighteenth of two thousand seven, 0:06:43.040 --> 0:06:47.440 Whitney Dubois who was found on May seventeenth, two thousand seven. 0:06:48.160 --> 0:06:52.240 Laconia Brown was found on May twenty nine of two 0:06:52.240 --> 0:06:57.520 thousand eight. Crystal zen Zeno Rosino I think it's Zeno 0:06:58.960 --> 0:07:02.640 Zeno was set Timber eleven, two thousand eight, was found, 0:07:03.400 --> 0:07:08.040 Brittany Gary was found on November eleven of two thousand 0:07:08.120 --> 0:07:14.080 and eight, and then lastly, Nicole Guillory was found on 0:07:14.320 --> 0:07:18.640 August nineteen of two thousand nine. And they're all young women. 0:07:18.880 --> 0:07:22.240 The youngest I believe was seventeen and the oldest was 0:07:22.520 --> 0:07:26.000 thirty years old, so they're they're in a very very 0:07:26.080 --> 0:07:29.720 pretty tight age range. And we'll just talk a little 0:07:29.720 --> 0:07:34.120 bit about the murder victims themselves. In this town, it's 0:07:34.360 --> 0:07:38.720 rampant with drug use, each other, they all knew each other. 0:07:38.960 --> 0:07:42.880 There's prostitution is known to have taken place, and these 0:07:42.880 --> 0:07:46.840 girls were all prostitutes at one time. And I believe 0:07:46.880 --> 0:07:48.440 that they were all prostitutes. I'm not gonna I'm not 0:07:48.480 --> 0:07:51.480 gonnacent say, I'm not going to cast dispersions on the dead. 0:07:52.080 --> 0:07:57.440 But they were also all known to frequent the same place. 0:07:57.600 --> 0:08:02.400 Which is it the Joe helped with the pronunciation. Is 0:08:02.440 --> 0:08:05.240 it more though? I think, and I think it's Boudau. Boudreau, 0:08:07.160 --> 0:08:10.040 by the way, is closed down now, yes, And this 0:08:10.080 --> 0:08:12.720 will this will the Boudreau will and will come up 0:08:13.520 --> 0:08:16.720 in our interview with Ethan. So again we're just kind 0:08:16.720 --> 0:08:19.280 of laying these things out. But the end was it 0:08:19.320 --> 0:08:23.160 sounded like a tin building that operated as a hotel. 0:08:23.480 --> 0:08:28.600 Yeahs was a hotel eight yeah, not not even up 0:08:28.600 --> 0:08:30.920 to that high standard, yeah, I know. And and there 0:08:30.960 --> 0:08:32.400 was a lot of basically it was kind of a 0:08:32.480 --> 0:08:34.400 den of iniquity, a lot of drug use, a lot 0:08:34.440 --> 0:08:38.199 of prostitution, doing things like that. And Mr Brown will 0:08:38.200 --> 0:08:40.520 talk about this a little bit. But Jennings is a 0:08:40.520 --> 0:08:45.360 place that's very divided. There's the north side and the 0:08:45.400 --> 0:08:49.720 south side, which are divided by literal railroad track and 0:08:49.760 --> 0:08:52.360 the south side is apparently a den of kind of 0:08:52.679 --> 0:08:56.560 people who are on a much lower economic class. Lots 0:08:56.600 --> 0:09:00.720 of prostitution, drug use, crime. Doing what you think you 0:09:00.840 --> 0:09:03.640 have to do to get is the best way I 0:09:03.640 --> 0:09:06.320 can think of to say. I did a little street tour. 0:09:06.360 --> 0:09:09.400 Actually I got on Google Maps and did just gun 0:09:09.480 --> 0:09:11.160 on the street view and just buzzed around the streets 0:09:11.160 --> 0:09:12.880 a little bit of the north part of town. And 0:09:12.880 --> 0:09:15.560 it doesn't look that bad, you know. Um. And then 0:09:15.600 --> 0:09:17.400 I got to try to go to the south and 0:09:17.440 --> 0:09:20.720 apparently the Google car was afraid to go there. There's 0:09:20.760 --> 0:09:24.400 not even Google ste pictures. Actually there are a little 0:09:24.440 --> 0:09:28.760 bit there. But yeah, So there are also three cops 0:09:29.360 --> 0:09:33.280 that are closely tied to this case. Well I think 0:09:33.559 --> 0:09:36.040 I think I think it's three cops that that come 0:09:36.160 --> 0:09:38.760 up the most is And you might want to talk 0:09:38.800 --> 0:09:42.000 about the task force a little bit. There either is 0:09:42.000 --> 0:09:46.800 a task force. It's like local cops. It's local cops 0:09:47.000 --> 0:09:50.439 FBI and county coups and state cops and that b 0:09:50.559 --> 0:09:53.960 I on there. I wasn't clear on that theoretically there theoretically, 0:09:54.520 --> 0:09:58.800 but they're a local branch of the FBI, right, Yeah, 0:09:58.880 --> 0:10:02.760 so these people all know each other. Um, But the 0:10:02.960 --> 0:10:06.640 three main cop players that are kind of brought up 0:10:06.640 --> 0:10:09.720 that are really tied into the case, Um, the first 0:10:10.000 --> 0:10:13.160 I'm not tied into the sense we should stress that 0:10:13.160 --> 0:10:16.520 that there's there's any indication that they have any they've 0:10:16.520 --> 0:10:20.200 actually got involvement in the murders. Nefarious, but yeah, but 0:10:20.280 --> 0:10:24.120 there's there's questionable actions we'll talk about. That's a little bit. Well, 0:10:24.520 --> 0:10:27.200 let me let me preface what Joe said there. And 0:10:27.320 --> 0:10:30.040 I don't know, We're we're pretty deep in this, and 0:10:30.040 --> 0:10:31.560 that's why I want us to back up a little 0:10:31.559 --> 0:10:34.920 bit for our listeners. I don't know about YouTube, but 0:10:35.000 --> 0:10:38.240 I've had my head deep in this story for three weeks, 0:10:38.600 --> 0:10:41.240 to the point that I've been talking about this story 0:10:41.920 --> 0:10:44.760 to everybody I know, to the point that I know 0:10:44.880 --> 0:10:47.800 that my boss is tired of hearing about it, my 0:10:47.880 --> 0:10:50.480 fiance is tired of hearing about it, my friends are 0:10:50.480 --> 0:10:54.320 tired of here. But they want to talk. But we're 0:10:54.480 --> 0:10:57.760 so deep in this is that I think that what 0:10:57.800 --> 0:10:59.880 we need to get across before we get too much 0:10:59.880 --> 0:11:01.679 in of the cops is this is a very tiny 0:11:01.760 --> 0:11:05.880 a very small town, and everybody knows everybody. And so 0:11:06.000 --> 0:11:09.720 when we're talking about these people and we're gonna make connections, 0:11:10.120 --> 0:11:13.080 it's because if you've ever known anybody, or you've ever 0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:15.959 lived it, who's in a small town, everybody knows everybody, 0:11:15.960 --> 0:11:18.920 and everybody's connected. And that's that's the point of what 0:11:19.000 --> 0:11:20.920 I think is the reason that we're bringing up these 0:11:21.160 --> 0:11:23.800 these particulars and they have they have very defined actions 0:11:23.840 --> 0:11:26.160 that connects them to the case. It may not be murders, 0:11:26.200 --> 0:11:28.840 but I'm going to talk about that right now. So 0:11:29.360 --> 0:11:33.920 Paula Guillory, she was a deputy um in Jennings for 0:11:33.960 --> 0:11:36.800 a while. She has no longer a deputy. She has 0:11:36.840 --> 0:11:38.920 since been fired. She was part of the task force 0:11:39.679 --> 0:11:42.240 and she was charged with managing the evidence in a 0:11:42.280 --> 0:11:44.840 case against a guy named Frankie Richard, who we're going 0:11:44.880 --> 0:11:47.880 to talk about in a minute, because about four thousand 0:11:47.880 --> 0:11:50.720 dollars was missing after it was cataloged. It just went 0:11:50.800 --> 0:11:55.080 missing out of evidence. So she was excused of taking 0:11:55.080 --> 0:11:58.080 that money. Yeah, it was actually one. She was turning 0:11:58.080 --> 0:12:01.200 it into be catalog. That's when it came missing. Yeah. 0:12:01.240 --> 0:12:03.520 And then and I don't know that Ethan talked a 0:12:03.520 --> 0:12:05.679 little bit about this, so we'll get a little bit 0:12:05.679 --> 0:12:07.600 into the nitty gritty of that. Um. But she was 0:12:07.640 --> 0:12:11.120 fired for theft and um claims of tampering with the 0:12:11.120 --> 0:12:13.960 evidence or theft of evidence. And she was at one 0:12:13.960 --> 0:12:18.120 time married to a man named Terry Guillory as also 0:12:18.240 --> 0:12:20.839 a cop who was actually the warden at the local jail, 0:12:21.320 --> 0:12:26.640 who was cousins with one of the murder victims, the 0:12:26.679 --> 0:12:29.480 seventh murder victim. He was the warden at a local jail, 0:12:29.679 --> 0:12:34.720 and he was alleged to have tricked out female inmates, 0:12:34.840 --> 0:12:38.600 which I guess means that means you put really cool 0:12:38.640 --> 0:12:44.000 accessories on he was. It's essentially he was pimping them out, 0:12:44.679 --> 0:12:47.760 which is not a good thing to have somebody in 0:12:47.760 --> 0:12:51.480 a position of authority doing that kind of stuff. Happens though. 0:12:52.080 --> 0:12:55.640 And then Officer Warren Gary, who as far as we 0:12:55.679 --> 0:12:59.560 can tell, has no actual relation to Brittany Gary who 0:12:59.679 --> 0:13:05.760 was remember six if you're keeping track, and he I 0:13:05.760 --> 0:13:08.440 don't want to get too deep into it, but he 0:13:09.240 --> 0:13:14.520 purchased a truck that was probably evidence and then detailed it, 0:13:15.040 --> 0:13:19.400 thus negating any evidence that would be in said truck. 0:13:19.559 --> 0:13:24.400 And he purchased it from Warden Terry Guillory actually broker. 0:13:24.520 --> 0:13:28.960 This Guillory broker the sale. He actually bought it from somebody. 0:13:29.200 --> 0:13:32.640 Sorry for passing, and that that evidence. Just so we 0:13:32.679 --> 0:13:36.800 can tie back to our victims, would be it's related 0:13:36.880 --> 0:13:40.040 to the Lopez murder, which is victim number three. Yeah, 0:13:40.200 --> 0:13:45.000 so those are the three main police officers that were 0:13:45.360 --> 0:13:49.480 we'll talk about a little bit in regards to this case. Okay, 0:13:49.559 --> 0:13:56.600 Now we talked about the pulitzide, the Pope Poz. Let's 0:13:56.640 --> 0:14:00.160 talk about some of the other local characters. There's there's 0:14:00.160 --> 0:14:01.600 a guy that's kind of at the center of a 0:14:01.600 --> 0:14:04.920 lot of this stuff whose name is Frankie Richard. Frankie 0:14:04.960 --> 0:14:07.240 is an older guy and he's been around the block 0:14:07.320 --> 0:14:10.360 a few times. He is has got his fingers and 0:14:10.400 --> 0:14:14.800 a lot of pies in Jennings. He is rumored alleged 0:14:14.880 --> 0:14:18.760 to be a major pimp, and it's it's rumored that 0:14:18.800 --> 0:14:21.080 he actually pimped out all the women who were murdered, 0:14:21.320 --> 0:14:24.720 all but one actually Okay, yeah, it was he yeah, 0:14:24.760 --> 0:14:29.760 it was all but one of them he had pimped out. Yeah. Uh. 0:14:29.880 --> 0:14:32.480 He's involved in various other things like for example, um, 0:14:32.920 --> 0:14:36.480 the raid where Paula Guillory, the policewoman that we just 0:14:36.520 --> 0:14:38.480 talked about that got her in hot water, was a 0:14:38.560 --> 0:14:41.080 raid on his house. So he had a bunch of 0:14:41.120 --> 0:14:43.960 other people in this. In this particular instance, had been 0:14:44.600 --> 0:14:46.760 running this rain where they they broke into people's homes 0:14:46.760 --> 0:14:50.480 and stole stuff including cash and coins and jewelry and 0:14:50.520 --> 0:14:55.160 stuff like that. And so they rated, including including Paula 0:14:55.160 --> 0:14:56.920 Guillory and some other people. They rated his home and 0:14:57.960 --> 0:15:00.640 arrested a few people and confiscated a bunch of material, 0:15:01.240 --> 0:15:03.640 including the evidence that she was supposed to turn in 0:15:03.760 --> 0:15:06.000 four thousand dollars was turned in missing, So that was all. 0:15:06.280 --> 0:15:08.800 That was all Frankie ri Shard. So he's he's been 0:15:08.840 --> 0:15:10.320 involved in a lot of this. And if you talked 0:15:10.360 --> 0:15:13.600 to h if you talk to Ethan Brown, Ethan Brown 0:15:13.640 --> 0:15:15.560 actually spent a lot of time hanging out with Frankie 0:15:15.600 --> 0:15:17.480 ri Shard. He's kind of the he's kind of the 0:15:17.520 --> 0:15:20.000 crime kingpan of Jenny. Yeah, he doesn't he doesn't sound 0:15:20.080 --> 0:15:21.520 like the kind of guy I want to sit around 0:15:21.520 --> 0:15:25.600 and have a beer with I've watched interviews with him, 0:15:25.880 --> 0:15:29.320 and he is creepy. He's creepy. The word to use. 0:15:29.880 --> 0:15:32.680 Creepy is the word that I would use, but in 0:15:32.720 --> 0:15:37.000 the way that it's unsettling to talk to people who 0:15:37.560 --> 0:15:41.240 might not be all the way they're generally. Oh, you 0:15:41.280 --> 0:15:44.840 mean a long term drug users, somebody who's been using 0:15:44.880 --> 0:15:47.640 drugs for a long time, and they're talking, he's talking 0:15:47.800 --> 0:15:56.120 and stuff, but he's just not there's something there. It's 0:15:56.200 --> 0:15:58.280 just like, you know, like a there's a wire that's 0:15:58.280 --> 0:16:03.400 not totally connected. He's not in that weird it's hard 0:16:03.440 --> 0:16:08.480 to describe. He himself admitted to like decades of drug 0:16:08.960 --> 0:16:14.360 and alcohol abuse. Definitely. Yeah, And I unfortunately, just because 0:16:14.400 --> 0:16:16.200 of where I grew up, I know a lot of 0:16:16.240 --> 0:16:18.880 people like that, and so I can I totally understand 0:16:18.880 --> 0:16:22.120 what you're saying. There's something you talk to somebody like 0:16:22.800 --> 0:16:24.720 it's I guess it's that like there's like a bit 0:16:24.760 --> 0:16:29.680 of like emotional connection that seems to be missing. And 0:16:30.120 --> 0:16:32.880 I also think that it's the loose wire that you 0:16:32.920 --> 0:16:35.600 talked about. Yeah, I actually think it's not loose. It's 0:16:35.640 --> 0:16:38.120 connected to the wrong spot and they make a lot 0:16:38.240 --> 0:16:44.280 of weird rapid jumps and that's that's unsettling. A lot 0:16:44.360 --> 0:16:46.560 of heavy drug uses. And those are the people that 0:16:46.640 --> 0:16:49.480 I've always found were like that. They just they skip 0:16:49.600 --> 0:16:51.960 back and forth. It's it's like a needle on a 0:16:52.000 --> 0:16:54.520 record that is in a car driving down the road. 0:16:54.560 --> 0:16:57.400 It's just I've known people like that. And you know, again, 0:16:57.760 --> 0:17:01.200 we'll post a link to a video an interview with him, 0:17:01.200 --> 0:17:07.000 but it's uh, yeah, sorry, not until that's fine. But yeah, anyway, 0:17:07.040 --> 0:17:11.000 so we talked about Frankie Ushard. Just another side about Frankie. 0:17:11.080 --> 0:17:14.040 He was he was actually uh they actually tried to 0:17:14.200 --> 0:17:16.919 put him on trial for one of the murders because 0:17:17.000 --> 0:17:19.600 somebody named there's another character I'm going to produce you now, 0:17:19.640 --> 0:17:24.639 Tracy Chase Song is a person who a female person 0:17:25.200 --> 0:17:30.119 who claims that she saw Frankie and his god niece 0:17:30.119 --> 0:17:34.119 Hannah Connor murder Dubois. Which who was which one? She 0:17:34.320 --> 0:17:38.880 was the fourth victim? I believe? Yeah, Okay, so Tracy 0:17:38.920 --> 0:17:41.520 actually claimed to a scene Frankie Richard murder a couple 0:17:41.560 --> 0:17:44.320 of different people. And then of course I mentioned Hannah 0:17:44.560 --> 0:17:47.480 Hannah Connor that is again Richard's god niece, and they 0:17:47.480 --> 0:17:50.159 spent some time hanging out together. In terms of the 0:17:50.200 --> 0:17:53.040 Dubois murder, which of course Frankie didn't never actually got 0:17:53.080 --> 0:17:56.639 tried for because for lack of evidence. UM she claimed 0:17:56.640 --> 0:17:59.040 that she was sitting around getting high with du Bois, 0:17:59.320 --> 0:18:03.919 Hannah Connor, Frankie Rochard, and herself, and Frankie made a 0:18:03.920 --> 0:18:06.480 move on. Du Bois wanted to like have sex with her. 0:18:06.640 --> 0:18:09.800 She refused, so he got angry beat her up, and 0:18:09.800 --> 0:18:12.959 that supposedly Hanna Khan her and Hannah Connor held her 0:18:13.000 --> 0:18:15.720 down and they drowned her. I don't know how that works. 0:18:15.720 --> 0:18:17.920 Exactly four seven up down her throat until she can't 0:18:17.920 --> 0:18:21.000 breathe anymore. But yeah, well we won't go into the 0:18:21.040 --> 0:18:24.920 grizzly details, but let's just say that she was found 0:18:25.240 --> 0:18:29.360 next to um, what's it's canal because the area it's 0:18:29.400 --> 0:18:33.200 in Louisiana, so it's surrounded by canals, and they drowned her. 0:18:33.400 --> 0:18:36.560 She she was drowned. And and actually that brings up 0:18:36.640 --> 0:18:40.440 one thing that I did forget to mention when we 0:18:40.440 --> 0:18:44.720 were talking about her victims is that six of our 0:18:44.840 --> 0:18:48.200 eight victims we don't have a confirmed cause a death. 0:18:48.400 --> 0:18:52.800 They were two they were too decomposed. They believe it 0:18:52.880 --> 0:18:56.960 was aphyxia, but they can't confirm that. And then the 0:18:57.040 --> 0:19:00.320 other two, which this is terrible. With the other two, 0:19:00.400 --> 0:19:02.880 they know the cause of death because their throats were 0:19:03.000 --> 0:19:07.679 cut they slit. So so yeah, so I I just 0:19:07.800 --> 0:19:10.919 because that one, I know, they talked about drowning this 0:19:11.040 --> 0:19:15.199 particular individual. Okay, Now, speaking of speaking of some of 0:19:15.240 --> 0:19:19.080 the other characters involved, there's a couple of guys Byron 0:19:19.200 --> 0:19:24.199 Jones and Lawrence Nixon, who are just just general narrative 0:19:24.200 --> 0:19:27.720 wells who hung around Jennings. They were charged for Patterson's murder. 0:19:28.080 --> 0:19:31.720 Patterson was the second the second victim. She was discovered 0:19:31.720 --> 0:19:36.639 in two thousand six, two thousand seven five. Okay, so 0:19:36.680 --> 0:19:38.919 they were charged with her murder. About the charges were 0:19:38.960 --> 0:19:44.159 dropped due to lack of evidence. Yeah, just a reoccurring theme. 0:19:44.400 --> 0:19:46.359 They're just yeah, there's not a lot of evidence, and 0:19:46.440 --> 0:19:49.640 yeah and so and and either these guys are really 0:19:49.640 --> 0:19:52.639 good but or you know, covering up evidence or you know, 0:19:52.720 --> 0:19:54.400 I guess if you toss the body somewhere and it's 0:19:54.400 --> 0:19:55.919 not found for a long time, but by the time 0:19:55.960 --> 0:19:58.359 they find the body, all the evidence has sort of 0:19:58.400 --> 0:20:02.480 been washed away. You know. That's so Connie Siler. So 0:20:02.560 --> 0:20:05.720 she was the last one to see Lopez alive. Lopez 0:20:05.840 --> 0:20:09.000 was the third victim, and she was involved with this 0:20:09.040 --> 0:20:11.480 pickup truck that was broken by this one cop to 0:20:11.760 --> 0:20:14.240 another cop who bought it and the audio, yeah, which 0:20:14.280 --> 0:20:17.600 we talked about just do. But she was perfectly involved 0:20:17.640 --> 0:20:21.000 because of her pickout truck. Maybe she used the money 0:20:21.000 --> 0:20:22.360 from that sale to pay off a bunch of bad 0:20:22.400 --> 0:20:24.880 checks and get herself out of trouble. So those are 0:20:24.920 --> 0:20:27.880 just some of the other major players. Now let's let's 0:20:27.880 --> 0:20:29.879 talk about a couple of the because I know you 0:20:30.119 --> 0:20:32.600 in the beginning you mentioned that there's some other murders 0:20:33.440 --> 0:20:35.159 and when we talk to Ethan, and this will come 0:20:35.200 --> 0:20:37.640 up in the interview, is that there is a huge 0:20:37.720 --> 0:20:40.639 murder rate and there's a huge unsolved murder rate. But 0:20:41.240 --> 0:20:44.920 her number of murders. But there's a couple of clearance right, Yeah, 0:20:44.960 --> 0:20:46.600 low clearance rate is a good way to put it. 0:20:46.920 --> 0:20:50.400 There's a couple of other facts that you should probably 0:20:50.400 --> 0:20:53.240 know before we get too far along, although we're already 0:20:53.240 --> 0:20:57.679 pretty far along. Uh. There is a death of a 0:20:57.680 --> 0:21:04.000 local man who is let Crochet, and he died on 0:21:04.240 --> 0:21:09.520 in April of two thousand and five, Croche was was 0:21:09.800 --> 0:21:13.920 killed in the term is has been dubbed a botched 0:21:13.960 --> 0:21:16.800 police raids. So there was a bunch of people at 0:21:17.160 --> 0:21:20.320 the house. They were all doing drugs. The cops came 0:21:20.359 --> 0:21:24.360 in and the electricity had been cut off. There's no electricity, 0:21:24.400 --> 0:21:28.560 and and for reasons unknown, the cops opened fire in 0:21:28.600 --> 0:21:31.920 the middle of this what was otherwise a peaceful drug raid. Yes, 0:21:32.119 --> 0:21:34.560 and killed this man and killed this man. And there 0:21:34.640 --> 0:21:39.880 have been theories positive that these women we know for 0:21:39.920 --> 0:21:43.040 sure at least one of the victims was there, but 0:21:43.320 --> 0:21:47.400 it's been positive that they all knew something about that 0:21:47.440 --> 0:21:50.000 police shooting and that was the reason that they were 0:21:50.040 --> 0:21:55.159 all targeted. Yeah, and in a small town, everybody talks. 0:21:55.280 --> 0:21:57.199 They won't talk to the cops, but they'll talk to 0:21:57.200 --> 0:22:00.600 each other and they will share information and red rumors 0:22:00.640 --> 0:22:03.359 like wildfire. Yeah. Although I gotta tell you though, I 0:22:03.440 --> 0:22:07.800 am I really don't buy into that theory personally, No, 0:22:08.160 --> 0:22:10.720 I think I think that's weak sauce. But I want 0:22:10.720 --> 0:22:12.720 to put it out there. Some people are aware of 0:22:12.760 --> 0:22:17.240 that one. Yeah, there is. There's there's two other deaths 0:22:17.280 --> 0:22:20.760 that I want to talk about. One of them is 0:22:20.880 --> 0:22:24.960 in relation to the fourth victim, which is whitneyd Wi 0:22:25.720 --> 0:22:28.480 And there was a man by the name of Harvey 0:22:28.640 --> 0:22:32.520 bird Dog Burier. I believe I'm pronouncing that right. I 0:22:32.520 --> 0:22:37.560 think it's either yeah, Okay, we'll go with that. Everything 0:22:37.600 --> 0:22:39.720 is kind of French and yeah, and that's why I'm 0:22:39.760 --> 0:22:45.439 not good with friendships. Yeah. So bird Dog was was 0:22:45.840 --> 0:22:50.040 shot to death. You're right, he was stabbed to death. 0:22:50.040 --> 0:22:52.200 I don't know what I'm on a shooting thing. Evidently 0:22:52.800 --> 0:22:58.399 he was stabbed to death after telling people that he 0:22:58.720 --> 0:23:03.359 was close to figuring out who was responsible for the 0:23:03.440 --> 0:23:09.120 Dubois killing Whitney Dubois. So he died because of that, 0:23:09.200 --> 0:23:12.280 and his murder has never been solved, well not necessarily 0:23:12.359 --> 0:23:15.080 because of that, but it is a little suspicious. Well again, 0:23:15.440 --> 0:23:18.600 it's you draw one another. He's walking around town telling 0:23:18.640 --> 0:23:20.800 everybody he's working on the case and he's figuring out 0:23:20.800 --> 0:23:25.719 and then suddenly he's stabbed down. Yeah. And then another 0:23:25.800 --> 0:23:28.119 victim that's on the periphety that I want to talk 0:23:28.160 --> 0:23:34.240